okay Bob we're recording please go ahead okay uh uh this is uh the finance committee meeting uh I'm calling it to order at 10:31 a.m. uh we're going to be reviewing of the fire department and the crest Department uh today uh as part of our review of the budget um as this meeting is remote uh for many um actions of the state legislature so I need to First go through our list of counselors and uh resident members to see whether they can still be be heard and uh I can hear them so I'll go through uh Bernie I'm present um councelor hanii present Kathy here Andy present Alicia here great and Matt said he was not going to be here so I think we have everyone so uh I'd like to start with public comments so if anyone in the audience wants to make a comment uh please do please raise your hand I see two hands raised so I think we'll give each person uh 3 minutes uh so Athena do you want to bring Martha in thank you I'm Martha Hanner from District Five speaking as an individual many of us are concerned about the future of Crest and the level of its financial support Crest began two years ago with a very dedicated director and eight responders then a year ago the director left and things kind of fell apart in hindsight one of the problems was the lack of a qualified assistant director too much burden was placed on one person and there was no backup now here we are with press Phase 2 and a new dedicated director but it's the same level of support to move forward in the future I think Crest needs an assistant director with the necessary qualifications to support and assist the Prest director coverage of the hours when urgent calls occur that's referenced to the leap report Crest needs to staff the evening shift seven days a week not just week day daytime hours and again that leads to the need for an assistant and Crest needs a physical space of their own available and accessible 24/7 the third floor of bangs Center is not very accessible and bangs as close to the public evenings and weekends it's unfortunate that the interim team did not report their recommendations publicly and to the council in public statements I've heard the interim team make they clearly identify the need for a professional assistant director separate from the current Administrative Assistant who does a great job with the day-to-day details I know the finance committee does not have the power to change the 2025 budget today and that's not what I'm asking for however I do request that you take some time today to discuss seriously what support does Crest need to succeed for the long term you know is there a long-term plan and make your recommendations to the council in that regard with the current budget I believe that Crest is stretched too thin for the job it's expected to do the town made a commitment two years ago and it's time for us all to really think seriously about that we owe it to the eight dedicated responders and their wonderful new director as well as to the community at large to keep this important program on track for the future and I hope that you as the finance committee can work for the long term to support that thank you thank you for your comment Athena can you bring Tony in please hi thank you Tony Cunningham district one um I'm speaking about the library project I want to plead with members of the finance committee to get up to speed if you're not already on the financials of the library project and please take action to get this item on Monday's Town Council agenda 2.3 million more than 2.3 million has been spent on this project today this money has come out of the mlc grant installment of 2.7 million this project is costing about $100,000 per month every month it continues I see in the library trustees packet for Monday a motion to send the EM mblc a letter requesting a six-month extension on the construction start date deadline of June 30th since the town is the grantee of the mblc Grant I would ask why the trustees would be sending such a letter shouldn't it be the town manager with direction from the borrowing Authority the Town Council if such an ask is to be made if an extension is approved you're acknowledging that we could be spending a half a million more on this project and still not getting anywhere um in addition to the 2.3 million spent already the capital campaign has spent over 400,000 in raising their fundraising this project needs to stop now it's not viable and any inaction on the part of the finance committee and the Town Council is approval to spend more than $3 million on this project that's going to have to be paid back to the mblc within 60 days of withdrawing from the grant we need to figure this out now and we need to stop the spending and and hemorrhaging of money thank you thank you for a comment does anyone else in the audience uh wish to make a public comment I don't see any other hands so I will close the public comment period um and now we can move forward with uh the fire department uh budget um I see Chief Nelson is here and uh Mr Olstead um I don't think we need any kind of introductory comments unless you wish to give them I think we can just yeah we can we can go right right right right into the questions uh Chiefs uh strong strong strongman took took ill so he's he's not not not here here today so but I mean you know I think we why why don't we just uh jump jump in to it all right so um I you guys did you did you yes yes we did you got the question so why don't you just go through the questions and you know yeah right we're gonna kind of you know tag tag team go go back back and forth build build off off each other uh your first qu question was about the haard been mitigation plan and that uh we're you know we re redo we're up updated dating that we were able to get a grant grant to uh uh to support support that so the p p Valley Planning Commission is going to take the lead as as he did the LA the last the last time and that uh that that whole thing uh takes it it'll take about six months to to a year to get get it finished but throughout out that there's a Ser series of me me meetings public me me meetings where uh where public is invited to make make comment and that type of thing and we'll re re we'll re review where where where we were where we are now and where we need need to be in in the in in the future we update it every five years I believe so one of the good thing of course is the fact that we we're able to secure a grant to pay for the whole the whole the whole whole thing we we're we're we're we're responsible also for uh 10 10 10 10 10 percent since so the grant which about amounts to about thir 32100 dollar the rest is being paid paid for by by the feds so and you you mentioned for instance uh folks on uh pomoy Court that's one of the things that we want to hear here here here he about because things things have changed in the last five years th those are the type and that and that's why we have have these public me me meetings so folks can uh come out and talk talk talk about what what they're what what their concern concerns are and and we're talking about uh man man man man man manmade have hazards and natural have have hazards as well and as I said things have changed in the last five five five five years so this this will be a good good chance for us to up to up up update the plant yeah and I have a personal interest in in in the plan Chief so okay just keep have yeah p p pvpc does a really good good job job job job job of this like as I said they kind of take take the the lead on on on this and guide guide us through through the pro process this is what they do great okay all right great uh let's see next one's about uh availability qualified per per per per Personnel uh and then then the call call force and student Force I guess uh that's that's a nationwide is issue trying to find qual Qualified per per per per person now people don't in the last few years folks have kind of shot away from getting getting involved in public say save save save save and we've had to kind of PIV pivot a bit on on how we we we recruit used used to be you put put put put put out an ad and we had folks bang bang bang banging down down down the door to come come and join join join join us and and we we hire uh param Medics that that that's our that that's our our stand stand standard but that's changed now what what what we've done is we will'll hire folks that are basic e EMTs but they have they have have to be enrolled in in par par medic school and once and and the C caveat there there is that we'll we'll bring bring them in but we'll keep keep them and send send them to to the academy once they complete medic school and and and and make make that that commitment and we'll commit to to keep keeping them so but that but that but that's that's an an issue that's that's n Nationwide you know and and we're competeing against every everybody in what western Mass you know for a very small pool and it's it's a small pool and it's a small call a small pool of qu qualified F folks as well that that's the tough tough part finding the qualified people and we we've we've been we've done pretty well uh this is a place that folks want to come come come to work they want want to come and work work work for the this depart part part department I like I like I like to say we are the gold gold gold stand standard for western Mass so Jeff do you want to jump to jump in here sure good morning everybody can you hear me okay I'm sort of doing two things at once I'm at the UMass graduation for graduates so I just make sure you can hear me we can hear you yeah okay um so the piggyback on the ch's uh comments uh yeah we've adjusted our hiring format over time to meet the times Co really had a lot to do with some of these changes you're seeing in the world of of Public Safety and uh Health Care in general um so regardless whether it's doctors nurses primary care I think we've all seen the effects of that in our own lives and that trickles down to the world of you know prehospital uh medicine as well so we've been very fortunate uh We've tapped into a Workforce a little bit some of those are student uh firefighters that graduated um that we've been familiar with a number of them work for us as Temporaries to help s fill some vacancies um and it's been a successful format I think that's one of the advantages we have over some other communities so we have a a Workforce that does work for us that we get to be introduced to and it's more than just somebody that you meet in an interview and a resume May so uh we're going to continue to kind of work through that as we go um the other thing too is that the workforce is Savvy they are able to rec contracts and they look at what they can make how they can support their family um you know what's the short term and the long term um so there's a lot of competition for the same people the chief mentioned so that's uh llo Long Meadow Ean Meadow chape uh Northampton Hadley um youque it across the western Mass those are people that we're competing with for the same high quality folks it's a little different than when I started in 1994 where there was 206 people that applied uh the last application po I think we're you know trying to get three people and we probably had about 10 maybe maybe it's a different world um we're trying to adapt to that world that's around us you also about the uh excuse me uh the call the call force and that and that's and that's another uh thing that's emblematic of what's what's going going on around around the country you know the call the call forces you know they're a part part-time uh force and they and they still work full full full full-time jobs and we've seen seen this trend for the last 10 10 12 years where you know the emplo employers are really reluctant to allow their PE people to leave to support support their communities and that and that and that type type of thing so it's it's it's it's it's it's hard to recruit or for for the call called for us it's it's it's been a CH chall a challenge for for us I mean the folks that we have are dedicated and and and they care they want to serve their Community but the thing is trying to find more more more folks like like like that and that's just the world we really live in and it and and it's hard it's it's is really tough but but we keep keep keep keep pushing to you know to bring those really good folks in so all right uh see number for uh uh okay y uh student stud student force and that's kind kind of the Flip Flip Side uh the student student Force has been in we've they've they've they they've been in Ser service here since 1950 five I think about in there and that we're we're you know uh recruit recruiting is good uh students want want want want to be be a part part part part part we're you know at times we turn folks away you know because they're they're really excited excited about being part of this and that and that type type of thing you know and they're young and and they're exuberant and you know they want to do they they want to save sa save the world so that so that's that's a good good thing and a lot of our per per permanent folks began with with the student force uh and that's that's something that that we're proud of assistant chief strong strong strong stronger was a St student force me me me member we got and as I said we've got a lot lot of folks here that that were members of of the student Force so they're they're they're they're one one of our Shin shiny shining lights here so and you know them and the call call Force they act as a supplementary Force to the to to to our U our per permanent force and to as the assistant chief said said you know it gives us a chance to to see see them to look to look at them and and and and and bring bring them along and a lot a lot of them and end up being uh join join joining us on on on a per per per per permanent Force so it's it's it's it's a really good good thing for for us so I think the next thing was uh L lost time in in injuries I believe um it's not it's not so much that the in injuries have been go go going up just that we're keeping better track uh some time back I I I I made it I put out a d directive you know uh we need we need to keep track track of all in in in in in injuries not just the big the big big ones but anything and part part of it was just to kind kind of keep track and see see where our Trend Trend trending was going see if there are some things we need to be be more moreare aware of and that type type of thing but all all also I wanted to to demonstrate that a this is a d d d d dangerous Prof profession folks get hurt and the other piece of this is that you know folks folks get hurt they they they they get get nicked and that type type of thing but they still come back to work they still come in and do the and do do and do the job so it's kind kind of two twofold um and and a lot a lot of our injuries are just just for rep reporting per per purposes and just to kind of keep keep keep track of Trends and see if we can is anything that we need to be you know Hy hyper f f focus on so that so that's why you've seen the in in the increas we're doing a better job at reporting them and keeping keep keeping track of our injuries Jeff you want to add add anything or Jeff no offense I I muted you because there was some noise coming through your mic so you're muted now there okay sorry about that that's the uh graduation so I think the other thing to point out is that we commonly think of these injuries as being physical in nature and many of them are But as time has gone on um it's become you know our awareness of mental health of our uh Workforce is increased and some of these injuries can be uh mental health related as well they're not exclusively physical um so there's a couple of these that are in there um that you might see long term that are reflective of that it's really just an acceptance an understanding of the other dangers that occur in the work that we do right and that's SS something that's come coming that's begun to grow in in the fire fire fire fire Serv Service uh we we we noted noted noticed it a while while ago we've been Ted taking steps to address address that and and it's it's a grow growing issue within within the fire fire fire fire fire service because you know you can't you can't see it you can't feel feel you can't smell smell smell smell it but it's there it's it's it's it's it's just just the same same as bra break bra break Brave breaking an arm it's an injury comes about from your Ser service so we've been paying very CL close ATT attention to to that type typ type of thing thing as well okay uh where are we number uh Jeff I think this is this is your this is this is your your bail bail bailway here to pay patient con contact piece um so I think when we're looking at that I think you see a lot of the input or impact of covid uh in that time frame and since Co has finished we had a lot of changes and there's a lot of people that had concerns about their conditions that led us to do a lot of um treat and then ultimately they decided not necessarily to go to the hospital it was a tough time there was a lot of new understandings of the world around us um so I think I can generally put most of that uh you know peak in FY 2122 back to the co times um and then we've gotten back to a a level that is more um consistent with how we operate in ammer and then type of patient loads and patient calls that we get I uh I understand your reluctance to transport people to hospitals during that time actually that's not that's actually not how um that would be an important thing so thanks for bring that up so when someone calls 911 we as the uh Ambulance Service do not select if they go to the hospital um if someone wants to go to the hospital we take from the hospital the decision making is ultimately up to the patient um so we do not subjectively tell someone they can't go to the hospital ever that is not how we operate so if you call 911 we're going to come we going to evaluate you we're going to try to give you our best uh options and for care and treatment and during Co there was a lot of times where people also reluctant to go to the hospital for a while if you remember back those that far um and sometimes they chose different Pathways to care for themselves or see their primary care or go to a health things that they were uh capable and competent to be able to do so it's just a different uh different way to look at it but I do want to make sure people understand that uh the ambulance service of Massachusetts we do not subjectively uh tell people they could go to the hospital we are happy to take you if you'd like to go thanks Bernie you have a comment or question sure along those lines um and we'll be talking to who where did I go we'll be we'll be talking to Crest later um the um um how within that group of of U patient contacts treat now transport are there a number of people who could benefit from a followup and assistance uh from from Crest and like a home visit kind of thing how many of these people are are are folks who uh uh are calling for reasons that are predominantly not MediCal is what I guess I'm getting it that's one question the other question is um um when would relate to to the EMS interactions with Crest and and the potential there to to assist uh assist Crest or be called by Crest when when certain situations arise I'm thinking of other community based responders where U they they work hand inand with the fire with with EMS more than any anybody else um so I'm want to try to Bernie answer your first question about the numbers so once so the answer to your question is I think the followup is actually one of the most valuable components of what Crest can can do the thing that EMS in general is good at is is taking care of people that are acutely ill um or injured or need transport to the hospital the thing that we don't have the capacity to do is to follow up with them tomorrow next week the week after for making sure they're complying with their medications and they're getting to their doctors they're caring for themselves well it's not how emergency you know ambulance services are set up so I think that's a valuable uh resource for job for press as far as numbers I don't have a hard set of numbers and I certainly wouldn't want to use covid time numbers to try to integrate that conversation I don't think it's it would be kind of an apples and oranges format we do do a fair amount of uh mental calls in our in our system they kind of come in two flavors because Amis is diverse in a way of um we have a lot of young people at college so we have uh mental health cases that we have on the campuses that might look slightly different than they do for the adult population often in the townside so uh we function in both of those spaces well and worked well with the uh University and uh folks in town yeah please we certainly want to wouldn't want to look at the pandemic numbers I mean that's a pretty dramatic bump up in in calls um and hopefully things will continue to calm down um those are and it your point is well taken that when you're called You're called you respond you don't get the opportunity to sort through and say Hey you know this person is called us just last week because they spray their ankle we're not going again you can't do that you gotta go sir so thank you uh and we do note that Chief Nelson is doing short time here so uh this is the last time you'll be going through this process and but he's still hanging in there he's still oh yeah oh yeah best best job best job in the world let me tell you um the other the other P piece you're talking about you know that's that's going down down down the road there's a you know there's a move coming from the West sort of for Community par par param medicine which would involve that type type of fall fall follow up you know and and you know and there's a fine line you know where you where you you know where you're on on the e e EMS side side side of the house and then the I for one of a better phrase the non EMS where where where Crest would would fit fit fit fit in to do those type type types of fall fall fall follow up those are things that we're working on and trying to figure out what is the best way to appro approach that again it's this this is all new so we're g to you know we're going to crawl walk run so but I think in in the end we end up with some some something really good where you know the collab collaboration between us and Crest is going to be great great uh Kathy and and Council man have questions Kathy um yeah this this actually was Jeff can can you okay there you go just yeah I muted you again Jee sorry about that so this is a followup because that was a great segue um Tim to um the community medicine or the param medicine that's listed here um to what extent is that a service I I've got a a several part question linked to that is that a service that one could bill um so if you think you know the the co numbers May men were an anomaly but one of one of the things we saw across the country not just in amorist is a decrease in emergency room use and Hospital use from people who could be treated um at the place they were living they didn't you know the super serious ones went um and some of that is this community medicine side um to what extent is some of that billable or potentially billable um you know working with primary care doctors that they know you're doing that and then with Crest and I'll just give you uh the one thing I know from a couple other countries um the Netherlands is the best example of it uh they they do Urgent calls that are like they look like a mini ambul ambulance but it's it's a a Prius or a small car but it's got oxygen in it and they go out and they assess and for the most part it's been able to treat someone in their home rather than and this is night in the evening you know so elderly um which we don't have anything like that you know we don't have anything but but you all are you there's some evidence in your call volume that there were patient contacts that didn't need to go to the hospital at least During the covid period and could we capture that um it's less wear and tear on piece so I don't you said it's starting to evolve but one of the big where it potentially goes is what I'm looking yeah well one you know one one of the big big p pushers of of this is is are the the insur insurance companies so they're trying to reduce hospital visits so that's and it's coming from the west and that's and it's going to it's going to evolve but that but you know essentially it would be a case where you work working with with insur insurance companies and that type type type of thing and build and they're there to be some kind kind of build building Str structure I'm sure where it you know because you're preting that that expensive H that hospital V visit there there be some sort of build building structure but that's you know this is this is Massachusetts and were a bunch of stubborn Yankees so that that will take take time uh to H happen uh Jeff you you're you're you're pretty well well vers in this so why you jump in there yeah thank you um first piece is by regulation uh from the state of Mass Metts ambulance services can only transport a patient to an emergency department they are looking at alternative location for transport um that might be more applicable for certain people and certain conditions but currently we don't have an option um but we're hoping that they can change that we're starting to see some Community paramedicine programs start up out east and to answer your question Kathy payment is a struggle in pay one of the biggest things holding us back right because we just can't pay for the staff to come off the line to be a standalone Community paramedic and not have a way to build for some of those services and offset the costs and ultimately that's really what EMS billing is it's an offset of our overall budget not necessarily a replacement for so we're looking at hopefully changes to State Medicaid rules if you look at like Minnesota or some other places changed their rules there so they could actually build estate for some of those services and it made it a more viable uh Statewide option so I'm hoping that Massachusetts will follow some of those footsteps thank you councelor hanii thank you a a similar follow-up question on the the medical and sort of assistance pieces I noticed in the police call log medical assists and mental SL Medics were over a thousand calls in the year um are those all are those thousand times times where a police officer shows up to an EMS Ambulance call um and if so how do is there a possibility I I thought Crest was supposed to be responding to those um if Prest is available and it seems like they might not have been but is that a possibility where we can move those services away from police medical mental medical assists of you I assume it's for you you all but I don't know um to Crest and EMTs instead of police response well I think it's the other way around I mean police are go going and they in initiate it and then they're call call call calling us again C you know CR is new they they they have limited number of uh respon respon responses right right right now but that is going to grow uh and and I think you'll you'll see as time time goes on there's going to be more of these calls where Crest is going to be the one the one one that is going to be uh uh the fir the first due for first for first call but again I've said said it before before as part part of the interum Le leadership team it's it's going to be crawl walk run I mean every everyone wants this done yes yes today but this is but we have to do do do do do do it the correct correct way and one of the Prime mo mo movers are or are prime prime things that we're we're concern concerned about is say say safety of the respond respond resp responders uh and that and that's well and that's a big part part part part of this but it is going to grow it is going to get get get to the point where yeah it's going to shift from a uh primary poli police response to a Crest CR Crest response and then if if if they need us or or or or or the police it'll morph into into into that but I think it's it's a case where it's just it's just going to take take time and it's going to take as long as it takes manyy Joe I just want to jump on that a little bit so there's not necessarily a linear relationship between the number of mental health calls that the police go on and actual ambulance requests so they probably I think in my conversations with Captain young they probably call us for two to three out of every 10 mental health cases they go to so the ambulance is sort of the last at the very end at the point where you decided that whatever uh opportunities you have to sort of intercede or make things better didn't work out and then they call the AIL sort of as a last more of his last resort that's where we live more than um you'll see Crest in the Poli Department uh as more upfront in dealing with those cases and then they call us usually after they've been on scene for a while before they realize that you know we can't fix this today we're going to need a different option and unfortunately the Ed is not always the emergency part isn't always the best place in for somebody but it just happens to be the only place that we can take somebody and it might be the best result for that situation at that point in time okay all right uh implications of the growth of uh or elder population uh will we need to increase you know our our biggest growth is uh well we we we we F Focus here on 18 to 20 to 22 and above age 55 that's those are our big big mov here and you know uh the the 18 to 20 20 22 age age age age group our our our our response sponsors there are really based on uh just the the number of St students that that are here our calls go up just B based on those none of none of the numbers as as the school school as the school po population grows uh on the other the other end our El Elder po population is grow growing it's you living long longer folks come come come here to work they come come here to stay they come come here to retire and this because this is a great great place place to be there's great great health health Healthcare around there there's great emergency Serv services but there's a steep steeper growth growth line on our on on the l l Elder side because they they expect good good good good serice service as as they should and that and that's what what they get so we so yeah our Elder elder population is our biggest drive drive drive driver right right and has been over the last seven to 10 10 10 years and that's just a trend that's throughout throughout again we're em emblematic of a trend that's throughout throughout the country and and does that impact us sure sure sure sure it does impacts are into entire system uh and you know you talk talk about uh does it mean that that we need we need more more more PE people more more staff yes yes yes it does I've I've been a proponent since I got got got here of adding uh getting up to at least uh 52 folks on on on on the line up we're up to 47 45 now uh but but we you know I the for us for us to re to really to to Really Ser Ser serve the community well we we need we need at least 52 per per per Personnel on on on on a line that that would give us thir thir 13 per Personnel for each for each shift and that's and that's and that's Str that's and that's and that's that's just the way way way way way way it is I mean we we we picked up we add we added four per Personnel about three year year three three year year years ago that's a great F first first step you know and I said said that then and I say say now that was a great great great F first for first step we need we need to keep keep keep go going the problem Pro problem then was when we added the four that that was when we got hit with trying trying to find good good people we was like great you know we we have we have we have these positions now we can't find find find people it's a struggle so but you know that that that's that's kind kind of where we're we're we're where we are are with that I'm I've always been a opponent of adding more more more staff because we need we need more staff to do the job that the town deserves that that the town re requires and deserves Jeff Jeff yeah I'll make two points one is I think we're seeing a change in and how as we get older people are wanting to live independently they want to live in their homes uh they want to live with family so we're seeing it in things like additional Adu units that we're adding additional dwelling units we're adding space in our houses for the ability to care for our parents and that shows up that shows up even in fire prevention as we're seeing these plans and inspection services so as we have more people that are older they inherently are going to need more services and more care um and that's what we're going to try to do to the chief's point about adding more staff sometimes you look at that just in a numbers format 52 but I'll offer to you in a different way which is we really want to be at a point instead of having only three EMES available to the community right now we really are for ambulance Community all the time um and the only way to do that is to increase our minimum Staffing um from eight probably closer to 10 and when there's four shifts um that's you know we get to uh we can get to 52 pretty quickly trying to just maintain uh you know eight people that would cover the ambulances and another three that would cover an engine all the time that's 10 11 per shift and that's allowed even a separate supervisor for that group of 11 people so I I want to put it out there in an idea of of how services are affected by the numbers and not just the uh the overall number what it means we're trying to cover four shifts in in 8,000 hours of time every year so that's that's a lot where a lot of us come from 2,000 hour office formats um we're about an 8,000 hour office form that every year you know and and it can't it can't be lost on the fact that you know we are we're really a 4 ambulance service but at at the same time we still need to go go do fire fire fire fire fire fire alarms we need we still still still need need need to go go go all all those those those things that F folks call call us for which means we have we we still need need to St St staff of fire fire truck so you're talk Talking four am ambulances that's eight eight people right right right there you want you want to set St staff of fire fire truck with at least three a minimum of three so that so that's that's part of where where where that Staffing number come comes from we still have a lot of other things to do that that that we that we're requ required to do and that and that we should should do so Kathy question um yeah just in terms of um we you you verbally described some of this to you us last year and probably the year before I'm assuming you internally keep um a age distribution of services as they go out and something that tracks it over time and at one point when there was analysis of Hadley splitting off um I saw tables like this in including um we had an outside person look at it but I think it must be internal data it was looking at times of day days of the week and time of year so when the students aren't here the student volume goes down a lot so what I'm asking for is if you have that information it would be really useful to get it because well sure send send send me any any email with with the specifics and we we can get it get that out to you because I think I think the the Staffing model of thinking of ambulances and EMS when some of it is a need for home get based care uh uh a visit and treat may not be an ambulance but what you've just described is we don't have a different way of delivering the service so we've got the old way of delivering the service which is is really expensive because bringing them then to the hospital which is the worst place for an elderly person particularly if they're waiting if they're um uh disoriented by that visit and don't need to be there in the first place so I I just be curious on seeing it and and I know the UMass has these super Peaks for the big weekends and then I don't I'm not sure what the normal week so I will I will send it to you but I think it would be useful for not just the finance committee but the council to be able to see some of that so I I'll I'll send you that request thank you yeah and you know what you sure you know the you know spring spring weekends fall fall we we we week weekends yeah we're going to be a little little bit busier because Stu students make make uh bad bad choice Cho choices but we're we're a call college town we we expect that that that type type type type type of thing and I've been one to say that we can't make make make the Stu students out we can't make make you master or any of the call call colleges out to be the great the great say Satan this is this is just this is this this is the way way it is we're call call call call down you know uh we we we we we expect this type type of thing at a certain time time of the year and then we prepare prepare for it and and we and we find find a way to may make make it work with what we have on on on uh in in in our in our ba bail bail bail Bailey W thank you sure so I just want to point out before we go is that we're busy and active all 52 weeks of the year there's just some weeks and weekends that we're really busy and have some bad days and some bad nights um but activity wise the crews that work for us are active and busy really almost every day and people ask us like what's going on today why do you have so many station coverage why are all the emails is out and the answer might not be anything more than it's just Tuesday um and we don't really have an answer or why it's just that's it's just the way it is that's when they called yeah it's just the way it is you got a question just along the this discussion about Community param medicine and keeping and folks wanting to age in place at their in their homes it in in Massachusetts it costs more than $160,000 a year to keep someone in a nursing home and it would be it would would be very nice if on a Statewide basis we began to recognize that and the putting uh some resources at the local level to help people maintain the medications to help people age in place is far more respectful for those people and also less expensive so um you know there's if if you need if if the The Wider world needs an incentive to move towards Community param medicine look at the nursing home costs you know Bernie we we had a we had a taste of what it was like to do home visits during covid uh we were probably one of the only groups I know of that we're doing Co shots in people's houses for those who could make it to our vaccination sites and uh working with public health and working with other entities um and there's some examples out there to look at Across the Nation um in Oregon and some other places Denver Austin different places that have very successful uh programs co bingling uh paramedics and either nursing staff or even social workers so I'm hoping if you guys are interested we would like to be in that but we definitely need some support to make it get off the ground is as a potential customer I would appreciate having that service available I try to keep out of your way but you know thank you councelor hanii um as we talk about Staffing I noticed in your call volumes that Mutual Aid in ambulance call volumes for out of ammer is trending higher um and so do you know what the cause of that is and then on a staffing level does that put an undue burden on our own staff and how how does that all work all all start and I'll let je Jeff get get to the specifics I think again this m mathematical what's going on around around around the country calls or go go go go going up and folks aren't being uh depart depart Department orties aren't able to grow to grow grow their uh their EMS depart part department so they're looking for for help and that's Ana genda generally yet I mean and in under un undo do burden uh that's a I wouldn't call call it an undo burden but it's but but it's it's a stress stressor because because of our sta Staffing level levels you know we're uh we're we're going go go going to other Town towns a lot we're bringing in mutual Aid as as as as well so it's not just us it it affects the entire system all right so it's a systemwide is issue I mean for us we are going to do the calls I wouldn't say it's an un an undo as I said but but I it but it is it is a stress stressor it is it is you know because we're our our call when uh some some mentioned when when Hadley when went away we figured we' we'd be back to our Hadley level within I think about about five five years it took us I think two and a half to get back back to that that that level and and and and we're still still still grow growing so uh m m mutually is just an is just emblematic of what's going on throughout our throughout throughout throughout our system everybody every municipality is stressed and trying to do the the best they can to serve serve their citizens so Jeffrey so so I basically want to point out that Mutual Aid tends to be sort ofy cyclical in its nature right now we're sort of in an up Peak so as you guys have looked at statistics in the past I would ask you to look at the statistics of the number of ambulances we brought in over that same time frame especially on you know weekend nights and times that we were predicted bu busy and we took a lot of resources from other people at different times so it goes both ways and right now we're giving more than we're taking little less um specifically there are things like a private EMS service in Northampton that almost collapsed um and was a a mutual AG piece for Northampton for example that they could no longer rely on began to call us more that's starting too self-correct and hadly theyve moved from having just a single ambulance and eventually when they get their second truck second ambulance that's at the basic level up to the paramedic level they'll be you know a resource that they don't need our help quite as much because we're going there a little bit more in belra town they're getting ready to put a buy a new third ambulance and put gear on that and they're trying to get the Staffing to uh staff that because they're busy and we go there a bit and in South County which covers towns of Deerfield and weightly and Sunderland they have a new director there and and he's actively trying to get a second ambulance that's available for more of that you know 24 hours a day so those are our partners around us that we work with and sometimes they ask of us and sometimes we ask of them like I said right now we just are giving a little bit more than we're taking right and and and again uh as Jeff said it's cyclical I mean for many years we we were bring bring bringing in a Hell a lot more than than than we were send send send send sending out so it's kind of Switched now so and that's just the N the nature of the business let's see uh next one was uh H High H hybrid vehicles we we have we have to uh uh they seem they they're work working well I mean we we talked I think at oh shoot we talked at JCP PC about about about total total electric vehicles for us and you know the tech technology is not there for us right right right now for what our our our need needs are H High H Hybrid Works uh terms of fire fire trucks that's it's it's not not not there there yet uh and you know as as we said uh Jeff Jeff has has has a high high high hybrid response for your vehicle and that seem seems to be working out well so yeah the the the the question here was uh it really aimed at will these things last longer than the the diesel or gasoline powered uh do I mean we'll find out we'll find find out I guess you know but uh our our other high high Rd uh we've had that for gez gez Jeff that that was here before I I I got got out here so yeah that I mean that vehicle is not a highly used vehicle it is largely used by prior prevention um during you know Monday through Friday days but the battery life the battery is held up I think that's one of our bigger concerns is it you know the hybrid side how will that you know what happens when right um I will say that it's probably worth six or seven miles per gallon difference um you know and my basically it's an Explorer it's an Interceptor I think on an average I I probably had one of those vehicles to drive for the last 20 something years and I lived in the 16 17 M hour average range for a year and I think I'm at 23 as I drive currently um and so it's worked effectively um and I was grateful that they had the you know the vehicle on a lot of the time that we were looking so it's hard to find Days yeah well just as you know as we go forward it'd be helpful to to to see if they're they're actually lasting longer yeah yeah I mean this is uh Jeff Jeff is is is the first H hybrid that we had that is a response vle so we'll get we'll get some good good that data from from from that I would think the police department you know and the volume of driving miles and hours they put on their vehicles be a place to really get good same question for the police department but I mean it it's just it's if we can you know if we can if we don't have to replace Vehicles as often it'll save a lot of money and to do different things so sure all right uh you're talking then next was uh about the uh communication says says say system and that that's a piece where uh it was get getting to end and and end of life it's a a dual dual thing it's police and and and fire it'll it'll enh enhance our in operability which is which is which is is the the whole whole Grail and what the other P piece it's going to do is is fix some some of our uh the dead the dead spots that that we have have have in town so communicate k kation good clear Communications are are are are key in in for us and and the police police department so that's that's a great great thing again it uh the equ equipment is and and and end of life you can't get get parts and anyone in that type typ type thing we stretched as far as we can so it's it's a big big ticket but it's but it's but but it's going to be worth it well worth it in in the long the long the long run so y uh let's see so yes about the res res calls uh increase what that what that what that stem stems from is that we uh some some time time ago we uh we we elected to send uh a fire fire truck with with crew along with an AM certain High QQ Q cuity calls St Studies have been done that that that show the out the outcomes are better when when you got more more hand hands on site more more brain pop out power on site at a high high Q what you call and and what the the rest the rescue piece is simp simply how how how it's co coded in our in our in our L loggings is system so when when a fire truck goes on on a on an EMS call with an ambulance it's plac in the the rescue C category I think that is going to that made well we switched our our S S software so that might change a bit so uh Jeff you want to talk talk about about that I mean ideally we try to be as efficient as possible uh that being said there are certain call types that we have you know we believe that have a higher Acuity and have a higher need for resources right that minute to try to stabilize a patient and make sure that they are taken care of well um and it gives us a lot of different options um that we there have to manage but at the same time we're putting enough resources at that minute um and I know it it it strains a little bit of the there's some extra miles on a vehicle and there's some extra fuel but I will tell you that it's well worth it I think we've seen some really good uh responses um just Wednesday we had our annual uh EMS banquet for the U Hampshire County and I'm very proud to we had three really good save awards that we gave out uh to staff that uh they were able to care for somebody and they were in cardiac arest that they got back so in the end it's sometimes more important to put resources and not be as super efficient uh to take care of the patients when they need it and then break those Crews off uh as we go so a captain going to a call with an engine has between one and three people on the engine there's two people on the ambulance that's typically what this will look like and they're going to certain calls like a motor vehical accident with injuries they're going to chest pain or Cardiac Arrest resp arrest stroke um some kind of you know damaging trauma that with a lot of bleeding that is really the basis of most of the set of calls that they're going to and it does not necessarily generate a high percentage of calls that they're going to overall I think it's in the 9% range so everything has to have context it sounds really big um but when you put it down to its more practical format um it's a good use of the resource we have available and I'll I'll tell you Jeff is being polite but you know there have some some some count count count counselors have criticized us for send send sending a fire fire truck along to se certain calls because you know because of the expense because of the fuel and in it's in net and I've said again and again uh and Jeff makes a great great point we had three save Awards this this past P past week each one one one of those had an engine that went along on on on on that that call and the reason why that the pay pay pay pay patient is still alive and can spend time with their f f family is because we sent all the resources that we should uh i' I've said before uh I'm I'm not going to be the one to tell tell a family member well we we didn't did we didn't send what what what we should because we we we were concerned about the fuel fuel fuel fuel cost this this is about Tak taking care of people taking care of pay pay patients doing the most that that that we can in any e emergency situation and there are three people that are walking around now because of what what what what we chose chose CH chose to do Jeff Jeff je Jeff brought brought brought this to us about five five year year year year years ago he brought this study and said this this this works and so we change we change changed our pro pro protocol so but as I said Jeff was being polite I'm just gonna I'm just G to say this is this is you know this this works and all and and you know the fuel the fuel can be damned so Bob if I I may I'm just doing a time check it's 11:34 yeah I was I was thinking the same thing uh I think there was one more question from Kathy on uh the North Station maintenance and sustainability can you speak to that please and and just to be clear I just sat on jcpc and I saw the pieces that are being done and what I was asking about we heard about insulation in the roof repairing part of the roof new floor rug so is there more I mean is there a larger schedule of things that are not going to be taken care care of that are already on the capital plan list so that question was is there more that we haven't seen yet uh not not not large things but it's right right now we're at the point we've hit hit a a lot of the large large I I items that have that have kind of Gone Gone Gone by the way way side now it's pretty much just maintain maining the bill bill building and keep keep keep keeping it a good live live live live livable space you're muted that that answers my question Bob you know I didn't know whether there whether we it was now under control as opposed to a challenge so it's getting under control is I guess yes yes yeah y i me it's a 45 year old no it's it's a 49y old bu building so yeah we got to keep the North Station going absolutely so any other questions or comments from the committee um well thank you uh Chief Nelson and assistant chief olad uh thank you for not a problem and uh the chief Nelson uh I'm a retired person and I like to say to people that every day is a weekend but for you every day will not be a weekend there there you go thank you appreciate okay thanks very much gentlemen take care bye okay so Camille I if you're still can listen can hear me yes yes right I think you're on all right well Camille welcome I I haven't had a chance to meet you but um I'm Bob hegner I'm uh chair of the finance committee and a town counselor so I appreciate uh your the fact that we've gotten you and hopefully we'll see some good things I hope so uh Athena you're sharing we have a PowerPoint we just wanted to put up okay sure atha we're not seeing anything I'm sorry everything froze for a moment thank you thank you for your patience great hey uh Camille just let me know when you'd like me to move to the next slide okay this is p perfect um well so the first thing we want to talk about from the questions is about um which one this is this we want to just start with we we we sort of pre-answer a couple of the questions that we wanted to kind of just sort of frontload the conversation with and then we figured we could go through the other questions if that was helpful sure okay so um the first question was what service levels do you propose Crest as it increases response calls from dispatch and more direct calls for res services and are there any services on page 123 that you would prefer to be directed away from APD to press well the comment I have is about service and service levels we propose at Crest our current call types as well as the expanding call Types on 123 um of the AP report we would uh request to assist with missing persons medical assist and Community outrage we wouldn't take these over but we could assist also the mental and medical assist we could work on these it should be notice that service levels are impacted by many factors one of which is the duration of calls this is a metric we will be tracking tentatively as soon as summer of 2024 as we are working with qual Trex you can stay on the SL okay you can stay on this slide um so the second the question was about barriers existing and the service levels which we would prefer to be responsible to um one of the things that I've committed to during my first month is establishing Sops and written policy and this is this slide is a draft of the Sops we'll be meeting with the GPL that's the government performance lab on Monday and with dispatch and other Public Safety branches in the coming weeks it's an important note to note that this is a big change from previous director who had a different approach philos philosophically to this where Sops and policy were not prioritized and viewed as more restrictive and here are a couple of things that we had received from dispatch um as we were told by the town manager and the department head Crest has been approved to respond to certain type of calls and they will add that call to our triage and for some context when Tri triaging well-being checks if the check involves the possibility need to enter a premise they default to the PD response in part due to the fact that they can't send crest PD on a co-response if the well-being check involves someone in the road they default to PD due to the time sensitive nature of the call if the well-being check involves someone in a highly agitated State they currently send PD although this is the exact call they dispatch would like to be able to send a co-response if the well-being check involves any ongoing violence or crime we send PD so I'm G to go to the next yeah next slide next slide Athena next slide please I if it froze again yeah might have froze Athena doesn't seem to be hearing that request oh she hears from you to next slide please I don't know no I'm just seeing Bob that she's not looking up when we yeah Athena can you uh unmute so we can hear you I'm sorry I'm having some technical issues my computer is totally crash for a second so Athena is it helpful I don't know as um as like we're entered in are we able to screen share we might be able to pull it up and do that if that's easier yeah I'm sorry about this let me see if I can allow you to share okay I'm G steal this for one second no sorry we have it up if we are able uh should I try to screen share you can try I'm not sure if it'll allow you to do that at the same time that I'm sharing I'm I'm trying to yeah that's correct joined on my phone so that I can play with the controls while while my computer is doing what it's doing so I'm sorry for that delay technology issues happen no big deal I tell people all the time I'm convinced that like from the pandemic Zoom is just tired so every once in a while it's like we're going to break okay I'm gonna try and make you a co-host and maybe that'll let you share an override my frozen sharing okay this is from Camille's [Music] screen this will stop Yes okay so just give me one second sorry so now can folks see our screen uh I think it's it's not clear I mean I didn't see anything different mine still shows that it's a Thea screen that is being shared oh interesting okay okay want to try it again from this will stop Y how about now because on our end it shows that we are screen sharing there can can you see that now folks I can see it yeah and Athena is it like if I Advance is it yeah you should be all set okay all right yeah there you go okay great okay sorry folks thank you for your patience all right um uh another question was about the budget missions about our mission statement is to serve a community to serve as a community Builder connecting people to services and resource the original attention of Chris was to serve as an alternative to Armed response for non-violent police calls it seems the original Mission might be getting lost has it and I respond that no it hasn't um we still Ser serve our neighbors in a capacity that would tie up police or others for much of their time we are able to spend time with the neighbors reaching out to resources that we have partnered with and have gained valuable relationships with other departments within Town also we get direct calls from town hall the library and such rather than employees calling the police and I'm going to turn this over to Pat to um explain this slide yeah and so there's two pieces that I wanted to mention in relation to the mission statement so on September 19th when the interim leadership team um took over um the department um one of the first activities that they did was a mission and vision statement um because there was was some sort of lack of clarity on that and disagreement on that and so um the mission statement that you have in the um in the budget hearing is uh in the budget narrative is what was sort of landed on and one of the things that we're doing uh with the Harvard Kennedy foundation with the government performance lab so they embed a fellow into a department uh and we're working on um bolsom data as well as dispatch um related things and so one of the things that we did is we took the mission statement as you'll see on the left hand side here and then we kind of pulled out of that different very specific objectives which we really boiled down into four specific objectives and then from that we identified different uh key performance metrics that are tied into those major objectives and so right now we're in the process of sort of wrapping up uh working on the data piece we're going to talk a little bit more about some of the the internal data that we have for the last six months in the um but as you'll see on the the right hand side um so those are some of those performance metrics and so this sort of speaks to uh the question of is the mission statement being lost or not because what we're then doing is we'll have performance metrics that then tie back into that mission statement and it allow us to sort of guide and check the work a little um differently so and I'm going to progress to the next slide if it allows me to there we go okay so the next question is um have there have been issues without a second in command and if you look on the approved organizational chart on page 128 it has me as the Director eight Community responders and an administrative assistant um the proposed organizational chart would be uh Crest director an administrative assistant which we still currently do not have and a assistant director a clinician a shft supervisor or I was going to call them um lead responders and responders and each one of these would have a specific role um the assistant director would be able to take over some of the needs uh that have been going on now um as you know cat was the original program assistant and now is the implementation and cat is the fourth implementation uh manager uh for this department the first one lasted for less than a month the second one lasted uh less than a month or just shortly more than a month and the third one lasted about three months right now kad's been in this role since March of 2023 till current and as far as program assistance Pat um cat was the first one and then the second program assistant lasted approximately one month so due to the lack of administrative support for the Department uh I wanted to let you know that cat has been holding many roles of both implementation manager program assistant as well as serving on the interim leadership team from uh September of 2023 until the day I arrived so I wanted to get across that having additional support will greatly enhance our Department to be able to stand up we are Public Safety with 10 full-time staff two senior tax write off volunteers and having an administrative support an assistant director and shift supervisors will allow the department to support the work that is being asked of and expand on and expected of next one oh right so if you look at this this is an aggregate Crest Department from November 2023 until the current yeah so uh we had some questions uh the sixth question that y'all submitted to us was around looking at some of the cab calls and so there's a couple of different pieces that we just wanted to share with folks and we kind of anticipated that there'll be other um questions in this uh in our time together around this but um we're essentially uh right now we're sort of on a on a second version of our data set and so the data that you're seeing before us we launched November 6th um and it runs until current we run monthly reports so this um all of this data is through April 27th um because that's when we run our the end of the monthly reports um so as you can see this is based on our internal um sort of systems right so this is our number of reports that we have the total number of interactions that we have with individuals this includes both one-on-one interactions as well as some of our larger scale events and then also the number of resources that are distributed um I do want to draw folks attention to that in January we had um less um sort of activity if you will and that's due to a holiday due to different trainings that we were putting our responders through at the time we were also in the process of onboarding three new responders so that was um some of our original responders were being pulled off to help support that onboarding process as well as attend some of those trainings and then we were also in the process of doing meet and greets with um potential uh director candidates so that kind of speaks to that and then broken down also by months are the different um seven different call types that we are currently responding to so this is sort of looking at our CAD metrics if you will um so I wanted to just sort of share that and again this is sort of the internal um reporting that we're using now we're using Microsoft forms it's not ideal and so Camille had mentioned that we'll uh we procured fall TRS and we're in the process of actively onboarding that and so essentially with the GPL uh and I'm going to share a little bit more about this in a minute um we're going to be shifting what we're reporting which will sort of help capture the work much better and then that will then be on the the qual Trek system um these I just pulled out in terms of some some bar graphs so or some pipe charts excuse me so that folks can see by month um this is kind of where kind of that falls in terms of percentages um and I did we did also email over to dispatch and ask What's the total number of CAD calls that they have um so you'll note again if you were to add up the numbers on the previous slide um it's slightly lower than this because they their data they ran until um May 15 um but there's 356 different um CAD calls that they have in the system there um and then this is also our um aggregate call Source data um and so again an internal piece but looking and I just pulled sort of every other month for folks to look at um it's worth noting that self-initiated calls um fall into um the town Department sort of uh Crest category um and one of the things when Camille and I were working with the GPL Folks up in dispatch uh two weeks ago uh we also figured out that our internally we can also change the call source and so some of that was impacting our data um so my point is is that we're sort of getting smarter as we're doing this but it's we kind of have to crawl before we can walk before we can run um and then the last piece of data that data related and this relates both to kind of question six on some of the cad pieces as well as the last question um that was submitted to us around the Department's plan to assess the crest department and its emergency response capabilities and Effectiveness um and does the budget propose uh support this and so there's really two pieces to this um one of which is that um these are so as I shared with you kind of the work that we're doing with the GPL there's 30 different proposed measurable data metric so we identified key performance indicators I shared 13 of them or we shared 13 of them here on the screen there's an additional eight and then that are supplemental and nine excuse me eight that are essential and nine that are supplemental um but these are then going to be some of what we'll also see as some of our services and some of the um the other data that we'll be reporting likely in other years um and as I said we're actively building out that new reporting system so these are the types of things that will be incorporated into that new Reporting System um the other thing that we're also simultaneously doing is when we were awarded the equal approaches to Public Safety uh the Eeps Grant um and we'll talk a little bit about what that funds and things like that um they didn't really have any metrics that they were requiring of us and so we sort of when we went out of the gate we were like what should we be collecting we're actively meeting with evaluators at the state level now um to sort of see what they're collecting from funded minp alties that's the end of that that's the end of the slides um so uh question seven was speaking about the school lunch monitoring and if it fits into crest's purpose um does this prevent Crest responders from more fully being an unarmed emergency response Department uh first comment I have is that we are um civilian em um response Department not necessarily uh emergency as then that we do not respond with lights and sirens and in this case the schools have a dire need this year due to a number of different factors and this role was taken on after the interim superintendent spoke to the town manager and sought assistance um the agreement between the department and schools stated that we would be active when possible this week alone we have not been able to go for two days because we were short people were at um other obligations and trainings and you know speaking to the school they understood this um we have prioritized the work of the department and the thing about being in the schools this has led to other youth connection opportunities um we are able to talk to the students and bring them in and have them understand that we are a resource if they need us and also we had a call from the principal I had an email about Village Park about how situations at home and in Village Park were impacting the students there which then impacted them in school and having us at the school and able to talk to them and also being able to go to Village Park and talk to them has is making a difference and one of the things initiatives that we're working on is working with students over the summer and creating a program where we heard the leap report and was it the the community working group Community safety working group yeah the community safety working group um on Youth Empowerment so these are all things that are in the process um number eight was talking about my vision for the role in public safety and what services do I see us providing and what types of emergency dispatch do you see us responding to um and what percentage of time should be spent on each well right now uh we are going to um assists but going more to uh on 123 the mental medical assists that Chief Nelson also talked about how the fire was going to um assist citizens depending on the nature of the call once again if there's any kind of violence or weapons we're not going to go um we could be a resource for a missing person and um and some of the other calls that we're that I don't feel that we are um trained for is like the per the leap and the cswg the working group um in that report wanted us go to nonviolent domestic uh violence disturbances but by their very nature DV is violence and I don't feel that my responders would be safe in that kind of situation and I know speaking with police that those are one of the most um scary types that people can go to um let's see number nine is about the library diversion um the types of have called we're handling there are people that are sleeping in the entrances um and being able to go and help them and offer services um people having uh difficult mental health issues and being able to pick them up take them out of the situation and just be able to talk to them and ease their fears also we have a great working relationship with Craig doors the ammer survival center and we have a resource guide that we're working on with other people and it's all about the relationships being able to to call someone and be able to sit there and say I'm sending this neighbor to you who's having this kind of problem what kind of services can you offer and having them be able to just be able to have a warm hand off to say this is the person and they don't have to go in there cold uh with no information um the next one yours last one assessments yeah and the last question which I know we shared um a a slide on um but regarding the the Department's plan to assess the crest department and its emergency response capabilities and Effectiveness and does the budget as proposed support this assessment so one of the things that we requested was if we could also show this year um what our uh equal approaches to Public Safety grants support so right now um if you look on I forget the exact page number sorry but uh it is Page 130 you'll see that 96% of our our budget is really for personnel and so that public health that Department of Public Health Grant really supports a lot of our operations right now a lot of our um programming um and sort of other expenses so things you know we can we can mention what some of those are but that Grant um has been instrumental in allowing us to stand up in the ways that we've that we have and then the non-fiscal grants that we've been a part of and that we've received I know that was something that was mentioned in one of the earlier questions um has been really helpful so the Harvard Kennedy foundation for example has been really helpful in terms of their technical assistance as well as the council state government in terms of also understanding sort of on a national level um how other alternative response programs are navigating some of the same ISS issues um yeah okay and I just want to say day 29 I am happy to be here anyone have any other questions Bernie yeah thank you Bob um Camille welcome um hopefully uh there'll be a day 579 or something like uh we we like to keep you around uh let me just say I agree with you completely about domestic violence uh that approach uh you you know you're in a situation where at least one of the parties is is disinhibited if not by substance by blood pressure um you're in a situation where you're confined and you don't know what's around the next corner and you're also in a situation where there's plenty of weapons um don't have to be firearms can be any can of heavy object so or any object so that's that's a wise choice um I also agree with your uh your need for a clinical component um my question would be have you um what what at this point is crest's relationship with uh the dmh funded vendors where you might need to have someone be provided with some kind of uh emergency support or respit um have you encountered those kinds of cases and and are you know and you've got I was joking with you before about your 20 Page to-do list I think I probably underestimated the number of pages um have you had the opportunity to do that to uh to to begin to look at other uh emergency service providers in the area well one of the things we're doing is also is the all these acronyms the DCC the Division of Community Care it's the Northampton um alternative response that's in the public he and they're rooted in public health so some of the things that we've done is work with them um to because there was a neighbor who was having some difficulty who is actually was here yesterday and the day before and one of the things we were able to do was with our relationship with Craigs store was able to get them a bed um at the hotel in Hadley and uh provide them with some services and work with Craigs doors their Resource Center Etc to be able to help them also we are working or trying to develop relationships to get uh clinical support um and working with Louise who is the co-responder um for the police department on just other avenues that we could take I don't know how much your your former how much of a role your former employer would would play in this uh but uh you know to to have the ability to have a mental health Day program that somebody could get referred to or um again a rest program um would be would be valuable thank the other thing um that we've done is so uh one of the folks that we contract with is the Wildflower Alliance and so they run a series of different programs in the community that range from um bridging services so if somebody's coming out of a hospital stay and sort of reintegrating back into the community they work with folks in that capacity as well as different groups and one of the things um that we also did was we trained all of our responders to um kind of understand the process too for AIA which is a a very short term a three-day resfit um stay in um Northampton um but that's also one of the options and then one of the things that we're going to hopefully bring back online um in the next month or so is we hosted a it was originally bonly I think now it'll be moving to be monthly um for a Crest Social Service meeting and so that um brought together a lot of folks from dmh from Social Services as well as different um Town Department players um and now we're actually going to look to co-host that with um public health and that also um the resource guide that Camille had mentioned um we're actually going to be sharing that in that space so that we can see that we don't want to be doing this work in siloed Fashions right like that's where it can kind of be problematic or you're you're repeating the same thing and really when we're trying to serve folks right we want a a more holistic kind of expansive approach um and so we're um you know actively working we had a meeting two weeks ago for example with Craigs doors and we said they also shared with us their resource guide so we can kind of incorporate it and have a really robust version and that does one of two things we've put that um we' put that in a QR code so it's listed on our website now but it's also on a QR code on the back of our general business cards and we've also um are in the process of printing up those cards to distribute both to PD and fire so that then when there's somebody that they might interact with right that's in those coming out of those kind of dmh systems or things like that if we're not available in the moment for a warm hand off or that type of thing they can actively also refer folks to us in that way and there's there's kind of more there or somebody could look at the resource guide themselves but also all of our responders are trained to really understand those resources really in depth as well and also some of the other things that we have is we also have printed out and put on the bus stops we've also giving them to all of our resources actual printed laminated versions there's some in town hall so that if people see them they can just take a picture or we can we have left uh brochures around town so at different businesses and that's the difference is that one of the things that we have that uh responders that emergency responders don't have is we have time police and fire go in mitigate a situation and get out we go in we are able to sit down with folks and find out what exactly their needs are and we can take the time to do this with them and I think that is an important part of what Crest is here for good thank you very much Kathy thank you um and thank you for agreeing to come to the district one meeting on on Sunday um I'm excited and uh M much of what you've just presented you could just have a few minutes and then take questions I mean I have a couple questions and this is looking forward I realize you're on day 29 and cat cat has been holding the show together for a while as the amount of turnover you just described is it maybe is not unexpected when you're starting up a brand new program and you're training people because they didn't necessarily know what they were getting into you you weren't bringing them from a job that was just like this one and now they're moving over they were experiencing so some of that is I think Growing Pains that are Maybe anticip ated but unavoidable so I have a a couple questions as you look forward um you mentioned we don't correspond at all you know with police on some of the mental health or community on occasion would it make any sense that the the team going out is One Police one Crest in an unmarked car and then a handoff could be that this is the type of medical mental that Crest could carry forward or does it need to be first police and Crest when you said trying to work and not duplicate so trying to think um and it's what's going on in Northampton what's going on in Greenfield you know there are other everyone's got their own unique model but trying to learn from each other saying we started out this way with minor changes we're staying the same route but we could inom adate so as you look forward because I think domestic violence is one issue but some of the men Al medical might be um we have a person living up here in North Amis that I'm sure the police department could tell you exactly who it is but the equivalent of a frequent flyer on an airplane it's a frequent flyer with cuse of distress um that are uh invasions of martians and other kinds of things you know and so they're regularly pulling in Social Services but it struck me that Crest would be the long-term relationship you could potentially have with a person like that rather than you're just coming in responding and then leaving and winning trust so it's trying to think of how do you pick up on some people that are already known to either fire or police um and then that person starts to be one of one of yours or mainly yours um the same way you're talking about survival center Craigs do um and that shift so it might not be dispatch am am I being clear it may not be that you can immediately I think I I think I understand what you're speaking of so one of the things that the um the community social working group Community safety working group Community safety working group was adamant about was not having a co-response of a police officer with Crest due to the fact of marginalized communities relationship with the police so the way that I have spoken to Chief Ting um and chief Nelson talking about things is what we would call a warm handoff um so if they were called to a situation and it was something that was better suited for Crest then we would get a call and we would get all the information and then go to this all right or else the other thing that again working with the Sops is determining what C we should go to first so that in this way if it is someone that is as you call it a frequent flyer we have the ability to get all the information from PD and then go out on this call and have a conversation with a person and see what their needs are and sometimes it's just being able to sit and listen and uh yesterday I had a person here a neighbor in here who had some long significant um issues and wanted us to intervene with them um and what I did was I spoke to them about what our role is and how we could help them in the form of mediation and what I think they really wanted was they wanted to be heard and I was able to provide that by just being able to sit there and listen thank you you know and I do understand you know the co two people in a car one in a uniform with a gun it doesn't doesn't work but New York there are a couple communities that are saying that they can have pling close you know the police are going out without that identification you know without a police car so I just was Raising it because I do understand the model is always been keep everything separate um but it's also new and learning well I think the idea of keep everything separate it's it's kind of how do I want to put it yes and okay yes we are separate part uh we are the third branch of Public Safety however we also work in conjunction with and building these relationships is what makes it so different is that if we're having a difficulty or something like that we know we can call APD or afd or if they're in a situation that they feel that they need Crest that they can call us and this is what's happening and as the relationships are building and people are getting to know each other it's happening more and more so as you're seeing these calls for service Etc that seem to be low comparative or dispatch calls especially most of the calls we're receiving are because we have our name and number out there they're calling us directly or walk or walking in or an email I had an email from the library about a a person that has been there before that we were dealing with and we were able to go out pick this person up take them out have some conversation and get them set up again for a night because it was raining and it wasn't safe I think it's also to steal from Chief Nelson it's about Fidelity to your role in order to be a force multiplier and I think there's also the piece and I think Camille hit on this earlier too right like it's also about time right like we're we're still really new and we have to like kind of to some degree let the model play out which can be uncomfortable I think but like we need to learn into lean into the discomfort counselor Walker um thank you um so first I wanted to thank uh Camille and Cat for the presentation it was really helpful to have the visuals up um I just have a few questions and comments um as uh an original member of the cswg prior coach chair of the cswg I do have some concerns that don't need to necessarily be discussed in this meeting but I just wanted to bring up um about the mission statement um just because and nothing not that there's much wrong with it but why um the unarmed Public Safety department rooted in trauma informed in anti-racist framework was listed last um and that is the main focus um and so I just wanted to bring us back to like the charge of the cswg when we were looking at this was to make recommendations on alternative ways to provide Public Safety Services to the community and make recommendations on reforms to the current organizational and oversight structures of the ammer police department and that is where this recommendation was borne from is like our Research into those two specific areas so there is a reason why this is being recommended as a public safety department as opposed to uh Public Health in Northampton because that was our specific charge and when we were looking at and you know doing um interviews with community members what we found is that the Gap in services that we're referring to was more often than not linked to experiences by bipo community members so I do really appreciate um camil's reinforcement of uh the marginalized communities experiencing these gaps and having those experiences and sometimes concerns with the PD um but I just want to bring up that like that was the purpose and I think there's an in sorry there one other thing in on this topic is there's an IND deniable link between providing these kinds of services and addressing mental health challenges so I'm not ignoring that and I'm really happy that those things are being included and also being addressed but I think that we are slightly losing the focus here because that was the focus and the purpose and so like basically overall I would just like to see that first so it's not a huge issue but like I just feel the need as an original cswg member to to bring that up um and yeah I would love to hear your response but I I don't want that to be necessarily the focus of my discussion no that's totally fine and I'm actually I really appreciate Alicia that you brought that up because so one of the things when we were working with the GPL folks and we were kind of going through these different objectives um that was something that um so I sat in on I brought um Josh and Rome two of our other responders into that meeting so that we're kind of looking at it from a higher level and then also from a boots on the ground the responders doing the work and when the GPL had mentioned that all three of us were like basically raised the exact same concern that you did and so we received these questions late on Thursday or late on uh Wednesday afternoon sorry and we are a small Department as Camille said with like not all the proper support so we're pulled into a thousand directions and so I was up very late last night putting this presentation together and I took a screenshot of that and we actually had them reword that because even on that where it said marginalize it said vulnerable communities and all of us were like this needs to be centering bipac folks um so I a and I as I took that screenshot I was like looking through all these emails being like is there another way that they moved this up and it's in an Excel document but it's like because we added to it because we were also saying essentially what you were um it just didn't get in that screenshot and so I'm happy to share those other presentations offline or things like that but I I just want to thank you for raising that and I also want you to know that that's something that we are thinking about and even when we're looking at sort of if we get renewed for our easts funding there are so many other ways that we want to think about really infusing and centering um bipac and a way that I think hasn't necessarily happened um as we'd like to see it happen so I just want to say that like I hear you and that is me editing things at two o'clock in the morning for this presentation so I apologize uh no no worries I really appreciate that response and clarification um and then that leads me into like I just have a couple of quick questions but one of them is you talked briefly about the you know proposed organizational chart versus like where we actually are um and maybe you can't answer both of these questions but one is that like do you feel that the budget that you're given for this upcoming fiscal year supports you all enough to continue this because we're you know building and growing and learning um through the next year um and is there a plan or a thought for expanding on that in the the Futures and has that been a part of the conversation like do we think what we have now is enough for this year do we think we'll need more after that do we think we need more now um and just like what are your current thoughts on that in terms of the positions that you have and how functioning is looking for now well as it stands now um people are wearing manyi hats and that um responders and myself and Cat are being pulled in different directions trying to get get things done but I do know that the thing that we need most right now is an administrative assistant and I think the goal for us would be to have an assistant director and a clinician and I'd like to build towards that as well as expanding the hours so again this is a crawl walk run um and I mean I any Department would say we could always use some more money to make these things happen right um okay thank you that is helpful yeah and I think the crest department when we first started originally and I think this was part of the initial placement in the bang center with the renovations that happened that there was a bipoc mental health agency that was supposed to move in and start with Crest and I'm not sure exactly what happened with that but I think the idea is that there would be a clinician working with you all um so I would definitely support and love to see that happen in the future um and hopefully if not this year in the next coming budget years we'll be able to accommodate those things um I had one other question sorry I had so many notes yes um the other thing Alicia that I just want to add so one of the things um so in October we had to do um sort of a comprehensive update to our implementation plan for our equital approaches to Public Safety the Eeps um Department of Public Health Grant and um one of the things that if we're renewed the the sort of third bucket that we'd like to work on with the Harvard Kennedy Foundation is drafting rfps so that if we are funded we can sort of hit the ground running to put that out because now that we've done the work we're kind of seeing like what's missing or what what needs to be augmented and so one of the things that we um looked at is are there ways that we can kind of creatively potentially use that funding as a short-term Gap um to to maybe fund a clinician in some ways if that's PDM if that's um full-time or what that looks like um and so we're having kind of conversations around ways that we can can get creative around that um and then you know eventually right like that's the main thing is like while the operating budget supports 96% of our Personnel eventually as you stand up and as you expand right and as we want to be kind of co- equal branches and expand that will in hopefully adjust accordingly and so we would then need to also put in place if we're you know awarded a three-year Grant or something like that how we how we would be able to do that and I think also going back to some of the data and the metrics that's also the benefit of um why we're doing the stuff that we're doing now because right now we're not currently um eligible for doj Grants Department of Justice grants and so some of these other metrics that we're looking at hopefully we also later on right because this is now happening on a national level um that maybe other things will also open up so it's just again I just want to say I appreciate your point and it's something that we're not only that we are aware that we want but we're also trying to think of different solutions for how we can can do that okay great thank you and I have one last like comment slash question um and that was on the youth piece so like while I'm glad you know our town is limited for resources right now and so I do really appreciate sharing resources and the fact that you all are helping the school um because I know the school has some challenges so I do appreciate that um but I did also just want to identify that the you empowerment piece was separate to this like that recommendation was like a separate one in itself not Envision that Crest would be doing the youth engagement or the Youth Empowerment but that there would be a Youth Empowerment Center um and that mostly came out of noticing that there was a lot of profiling happening for youth who didn't have things to do and were wandering around town so like not directly related to what we would envisioned Crest would do but I think we thought more of Crest as like Camille said the mediation and case management type of thing so I was wondering if you could just mention quickly about if there's any case management happening and if there's like a system and funding to support the case management or like keeping track of those kinds of things can I'm sitting there thinking yeah so one of the things that we actually um did and again I maybe um we can have other conversations with you so one of the things we were doing when we first started out some case management type things but we actually realized that our responders are not really case managers um the way that the original Grant was was written was um a a biracial team of two with a clinician and a community responder with lived experience and what was hired for the Department um were not clinicians and so um one of how we kind of looked at it and this is when we kind of did that that um Mission exercise with the responders was they were sort of saying you know we can do some of these pieces but some of it is kind of beyond the scope of our of our role and our in our training and our skill set right and we're still constantly looking at training and things like that but they aren't necessarily case managers and because we were sort of studing standing up in a public safety Branch we were sort of trying to lean more in public safety and so that's where they kind of looked at themselves as Bridgers and connectors and so some of the work um you know is they will do case man like light case management like light touch and then putting them in touch with the folks that have other more robust Case Management Services so like a good example is our partnership with Craigs door they really revamped a lot of their um Services over the last year and so we sort of help with that warm handoff we're still doing some pieces but then if we can get folks as you know Camille said if we can get somebody over there to get a bed they can also get a better kind of wraparound service and so some of it was as we do this work and as we stand up it's also recognizing our our limitations I think a little bit um and because we're crawling before we're walking and running um that was one of the pieces that we kind of recognized our that we weren't necessarily the best suited as as this kind of configuration happened to to address I think and if we get a clinician in that will also help with that case management piece so it's it's it's a both and I guess right like it's this interesting kind of what feels like a jigsaw puzzle almost at times and we're still trying to really hold those pieces so I I do really want to acknowledge that I really appreciate your questions um especially because you are on the original group as a co-chair and so having those reminders of that is is is really invaluable thank you sorry I didn't get these questions in ahead of time but most of them came up as the visuals were available but I really appreciate um you taking the time to answer them and for all of the work that you are doing well and thank you for all your or grounding work to allow us to do this work like it's really it's a privilege and a blessing um to work with the folks in the capacity that we do so thank you thanks Andy yes um thank you uh and I'm very conscious of the time of day and the how long meeting has been going so uh I'll try and be brief and hope that you can too there are two questions that I had and they came from um public comment at the beginning of the meeting we I don't know if you heard public comment but there was one person who spoke and raised several Crest related issues one of which you touched on a little a little bit now I was wondering if you could say a little bit more and that is uh the coverage of hours um should be expanded from what it currently is and um I I guess and and she and the person who offered the comment was also recognizing the budget constraints on the town budget which the finance committee is ultimately grappling with as the time manager did but um from a programmatic standpoint um would you mentioned possibly expanding hours what are the hours that you would expand to if you had that option and what do you think the Staffing implication would be if uh you were able to do that so that's question number one okay so that one is something that when I came in along with the Sops talked about with the responders um of my my plans so currently at day 29 um being able to get our department grounded and everyone set after having Crest 1.0 Crest 2.0 which was the implementation team and now with myself as Crest 3.0 I feel that making sure that we have a solid base and again with the crawl walk run is that is of utmost importance and the plan is to expand our hours and what I'm doing is looking with uh dispatch to see when the times of calls are so currently we are 8 to 4: and the next step would be to move us from 8 to 4 to 8 to 8 now do realize that there are only eight responders who respond in teams of two um and so with time off holidays Etc that's going to take some figuring out of how to do this um as uh Chief Nelson spoke of with the amount of people that they have and the difficult they have Staffing 247 you know um Chief Olstead Chief CH old said talked about um not 2,000 hours that the normal person works but 8,000 hours so it would be impossible for us to virtually impossible for us to do to uh 24/7 with eight people and the other part of this is is also we need to have um leadership on those other ships so it would have to be we there's some staffing concerns uh but the goal is eventually to get as much coverage during the times that are needed so that is one of the things I'm working with with dispatch and APD to find out what time it is that Crest would most likely be utilized um I know for some it's in the morning when we have our unhoused population um and for others it would be early in the evening you know people getting home so we're trying to work that out and figure out what hours would be best served okay thank you that's helpful uh the other thing that uh uh the caller who offered public comment brought up was uh Wonder sort of saying that the accessibility of the office because of where you're located within the bang Center um means that people cannot easily um come to the office um in particularly it limits uh you very much to daytime hours um I was wondering if you had any thoughts about um responding to that question and again recognizing that a lot of work was put in getting you where you are and um getting the space ready for the Department uh and you know budg of constraints but was there any validity to the concern that she has uh brought up oh it's a very valid concern one of the things is is that we are open um Monday through Friday 8: to 4: and then on Saturday from 10: to 6: and most of the people people we see on Saturday are when we are out um in the community doing community engagement or else people will call us um we have the number here um also there is a space that is proposed for us in the library in the new Jones Library so these are all things that are in the process of um and this is still we're in Growing Pains you know there's a lot of work to be done and figuring out exactly where we could go good thank you okay thank you any other questions or comments I just go ahead Camille I just wanted to make a comment um we had also sent over to Thea um a bunch of narratives one a month uh that one of our responders Joshua Benson number 2213 put together together so that you could understand exactly what it is we do and who we're doing and it gives a better Bird's eyee view or actually a a pigeon view of what we're doing and how we're doing it and how we are affecting change in the community and um I want to thank cat for making so staying up late and making the PowerPoint and really being my right hand um thany you're welcome so I be with Bob I'm excited for day 500 something excited for day 500 something well thank you very much for uh spending the time to meet with us and uh I think our conversation was very helpful thank you so does anyone else have anything else then I will take a motion to adjourn I move to adjourn I second all right I have a motion in a second uh I'm on I Kathy yes Bernie oh reluctantly but yes uh councelor Walker yes Andy yes councelor hanii I then it's unanimous we're adjourned thanks everyone