[Music] [Music] all [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] Bernard Green chair of the Brookline select board and this is the meeting of the select board for May 5 uh no May 21st 2024 um I'm looking for my notes Here I move that we go into executive session uh for the purpose of uh approving executive session minutes and for the purpose of uh deliberating on two litigation matters um and we have to go on Executive session for those purposes because uh considering them in Open Session will compromise the position of the town and the chair so declares that that is important all in favor please indicate by saying I uh let's see John Van sco hi Michael Sandman hi Paul Warren hi David Perman hi and chair votes I thank you we will return after the executive session now you can [Music] oh [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] is [Music] in [Music] for [Music] [Music] [Music] all [Music] [Music] for [Music] [Music] is [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] for [Music] for [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Laughter] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Laughter] 24 uh let's start off with announc recing in progress dates from the select board I'd like to start off by um congratulating uh police chief Jen Pastor who received her master's degree in social work from Boston College on Monday uh the chief is uniquely trained and qualified the head of Department that for many years has had a community policing Focus which integrates crime prevention with working on the underlying factors that often times are the cause of crime her her her training also recognizes that uh most people are good and can be diverted from Criminal Acts or can be rehabilitated when they step out of line uh and the community policing focus of our Police Department allows the police to devel to develop relationships and empathy with especially youth during good times so that when the bad times occur as they undoubtedly will uh the police can uh have an understanding and and in appropriate circumstances take steps to divert uh them from the criminal justice system um so the fact that uh Jen Pastor is now um now has a masters in social work I think really enhances her ability to uh U develop or or or lead that aspect of the Brookline Police Department so congratulations to Jen Pastor for accomplishment as now a master in Social Work holder so any other that's great coms John um I I'm going to defer on mentioning mentioning a couple of extraordinary actions by the Brooklyn Police Department this week in hopes that maybe one of the colleagues here on the board would would like to um just do do that acknowledgement uh and if not you can come back to me and and I'll do it but um I had a few meetings I wanted to highlight uh and um here they are uh it just so happens that often um a whole bunch of kind of more important than usual meetings occur in a 24 or 48 hour period and we've got one of those situations so tomorrow night um at six o'clock there's going to be a very thorough review of the Washington Street complete streets plan there been a lot of Buzz about that plan in town and if you want to learn about it and if you want to speak um your mind about it that's going to be tomorrow night at 6 PM all of these are on the town calendar on the town website and that's where you can find information on how you can participate at the same time um the peer School building committee is having a major Community form to bring people up to date on the project design for peer school but also also the construction Logistics and schedule and and that's going to have a certain amount of impact um on people in the immediate neighborhood of the school um and so it seems like a good meeting for people to attend if they have questions about the peer school project and um the upcoming impacts um at 7 pm tomorrow night the um comprehensive plan steering committee um co-chaired by my colleague Paul Warren is meeting um at uh also at 7 pm this committee that was formed after the last town meeting called the moderators committee on forms of government is going to be meeting and as if that's not enough on Thursday um a very important meeting as part of the next um excuse me the the next open space plan for Brooklyn every seven years we update our open space plan and we are doing that right now through a series including a series of public forums and meetings one of those is happening tomorrow night at 7 That's Thursday at 7 so I just want to make sure people know about those meetings and if they want to attend they can find information on the town calendar any other updates or pieces of information yeah yeah before we get into that type of news let let me just say that uh on U Wednesday Mike and I attended the Brookline Asian-American family Network essay contest award ceremony and I'd just like to mention that there was a really very nice ceremony at the coolage corner theater and five very impressive students read their essays describing some of the experiences they have had as Asian and South Asian uh individuals identify identifying Americans uh the essays were insightful and in my opinion most importantly they were not relevant and interesting only to Asian and South Asian people but touched on the universal universality of their experiences that were also relevant and informative to those of us who are not Asian or South Asian so I found that very very interesting um informative um and uh relevant to to a lot of things the keynote speaker was Myra T Lee author of a book everything here is beautiful uh her presentation was very very interesting also so Paul did you wanna well I guess John had introduced the topic but he had a number of updates so I I guess I'll speak to it briefly um we did have a very serious um incident in Southbrook line um where um two individuals were uh entered a were attempting to enter a private residence um in in the evening um the the homeowner um and alerted the police the police were there very quickly um and they did catch the two suspects um one of the suspects was armed with a an automatic uh pistol um so first I want to thank our um amazing uh police department for uh responding quickly there have been some other incidents um of similar nature uh in South Brookline and they've been uh meeting with the community speaking with them um I attended a meeting with the police chief not long ago uh at a community member's house to discuss the issues um and they are bringing um a lot of focus to that area and um it's paid off because they were there in the area and responded very quickly so I just want to say thank you and acknowledge uh the the police department for their uh impressive work and also to to Residents you need to be vigilant um these incidents are occurring um they're they're occurring nationally um Folks at uh individuals are targeting um areas uh in communities that uh maybe have cover um uh in darkness um and they are approaching properties uh looking to enter in uh to steal uh valuables so um but again thank you to uh the Brookline Police Department for for their quick response and very effective thank you any otheres really quick sorry if that's right um just wanted to note um I received word um we had hoped to make this uh announcement um at the conclusion of the um Awards um but we wanted to be uh apparently some people have been receiving notification of uh arpa uh utility debt forgiveness uh and so we wanted to talk through just in case folks hadn't been following along with the conversation with the select board what's going on and what the timeline for that is uh so that folks are aware of what happening there and we will be putting out information to the public on this as soon as we finalize the deal with the other utility company eversource um we as you know for an uh the select board approved uh a utility debt forgiveness program right at the outset of arpa in 2021 I believe or early 2022 uh the aim of that program was to forgive debts incurred during the pandemic for anyone carrying a balance on their utility uh bills during the pandemic um that program was on hold R to roll out to figure out how to make sure that it would comply with the law particularly Massachusetts state law uh regarding public benefits uh creation of a public benefit uh and how it co how it uh uh coincided or overlap with the rules about arpa which talk about impact and disproportionate impact individuals impacted by the pandemic and disproportionately impacted by the pandemic and how the general public is not typically viewed as disproportionately or or impacted by the pandemic relative to more discreet identified communities ultimately unfortunately we had to come to the conclusion that we were unable to make the kind of broad award uh that was uh envisioned uh of retiring all debt um because of those issues identified the general public not generally be considered impacted or disproportionately impacted because again relevant relative to whom um and the issue in Massachusetts law of a public benefits test where anything that the government does must have a benefit to the broader public and not just to specific individuals um there are obviously you know exceptions that have been carved out to that over the years particularly with regard to things like public housing with things like utilities that's a much more uphill battle as we have understood with things like the senior tax issues and the abatements and so forth so while unfortunately we were unable from a legal perspective to hire all debt we understood that the me the message of the select board was do as much good as possible with the funding that we had and so we were able to identify a subset of the utility outstanding utility debt from individuals who qualified for the utilities hardship programs here we eliminate that issue of Rel relative to whom the utilities already identified a clearly pandemic impacted population who qualified for this hardship program and were able to put their debts on hold but who were clearly a population that was impacted by the pandemic were hoping to bootstrap that arpa definition to satisfy the requirements of Massachusetts law therefore if you were part of the hardship program for either National Grid or eversource uh and incur debt during the pandemic which we are defining up until the end of the official pandemic declaration in 2023 or the Declaration of emergency in 2023 that debt will be eliminated from your bill um we have National Grid we understand has been moving forward on this without telling us they were doing it so we apologize that that uh just happened and people were starting to see it on their bills we had hoped to make an announcement and roll that out we hope to have the concurrent uh result with eversource and we will announce the total amount forgiv which is less than which was originally allocated and again we apologize but we are trying to do the do our best with the um the directive of the select board within the confines of the law uh and so that's where we are on that I just want to be sure the public is aware let's just make sure that Brookline gets some credit not just eversource and the other folks yes it is the town of brookline's money um that is causing this and we will be sure that everyone is aware and again it is while it is not everything it is really providing assistance to people who were qualified for this hardship program who really needed it so we are we're doing our best within the confines of the law to fulfill your direc on this so thank you excellent okay um next we have public comment now Tiffany usually you would uh introduce the public comment section uh SE section uh with some ground rules um I have the script for that Bernard it's Kate oh you do okay Kate actually if I could interrupt I think it's appropriate to introd introduce oh okay I'm sorry oh yes I'm very sorry I should I would you like me to or yeah um I would like to my my pleasure to introduce um our new assistant Town Administrator for operations timy Oliva um joining us from the City of Winston Salem um she is uh this is her second day on the job um 48 hours in and she is um just we are absolutely thrilled to have her here she was oversaw three different departments in Winston Salem uh coming up actually from arpa Administration she also has experience with the business Community uh devel vment in the city uh a city of over 200,000 people um so coming into this environment fast growing environment uh coming into this town which although has a smaller population also has both Urban and Suburban uh characteristics uh has a lot of the similar issues with regards to spending federal funds post pandemic um and is just really uh a unique environment to work in um we couldn't be happier to have you on board we're very grateful that you've uh made the decision to join us here in Brooklyn and we look forward to working together with you so great thank you all the select board shares those sentiments yeah so Kate Kate okay thank you for joining us for public comment this is an opportunity for us to hear your perspective on issues in Brookline that matter to you each person speaking tonight is limited to three minutes you don't need to use the entire time but you may if you like once 15 minutes has been met there is an opportunity at the conclusion of the select boards business for addition comments members of the public sometimes raise questions during public comment we may be able to provide a quick answer to a question but are more likely to work with staff to get a more thorough answer and respond over email we will let you know when you have 30 seconds remaining and when your time is up please conclude your remarks at that time if you have more to say you are welcome to send an email to board members expressing your thoughts in Greater detail and first person that signed up for public comment tonight is the py I'm just promoting Linda now thank you Linda you've been promoted to a panelist if you're comfortable you may uh unmute and uh show your video if you're comfortable and your three minutes will begin um I'm I'm trying to do the camera it's not working it keeps telling me unable to start video because the host has stopped it okay we start talking we can hear you okay all right yeah thank you for letting me um speak at public comment because technically I don't meet the definition because I am talking about a item on your agenda later but I do have to be at advisory so I really appreciate the um Indulgence uh my name is Linda Olsen pelky I Am a town meeting member in Precinct 17 and a member of the advisory committee on the land use subcommittee and I was a former Transportation board um member which I had to give up to be on the advisory committee but um I'm here to speak in favor of um at least being open-minded about the idea of perhaps not allowing the curb cut on Harvard Street for the new Pierce school um I had shown up at numerous meetings and flagged this as an issue um you may recall that when we um rezoned Harvard Street one of the clear stipulations in that new zoning was no new curb cuts on Harvard Street and I understand the Pierce school is not part of that zoning but the concept and the theory and the reason why this is important all remain um I have attended several Transportation board meetings on this and and the meeting when the decision was made to approve the curb cut um there were some team members from Left Field the um building project team and I asked a few questions about the parking and the garage and why the curb cut was needed Etc and it came to light that um apparently the reason is that there is a um split in the parking in the underground garage between the schools and the town and it is Manifest in the form of a fence cutting the uh parking garage in half and it was opined that the reason for this was that the town and school could not figure out how to appropriately manage the shared parking um which frankly was really a disappointing reason for this um eventual um result um you know there is going to be a loss of parking we you know the transportation board did hear from business people who are concerned about that and um also just the unsafety um aspect and the traffic um flow aspect of this is going to be extremely dangerous and negative because currently left turns would be allowed into the garage and it's really just going to be a congested mess so I would hope that you might see this as an opportunity to uh you know do a reset here and avoid a dangerous situation and improve The Pedestrian experience on Harvard Street I am sure you will probably hear grumbling 30 seconds thank you you will heal grumbling and fears of delays and I would just point out this is a townwide issue and it is also going to be with us the result of this for many many many decades into the future so please consider carefully thank you thank you p is there anyone else um raor could could you okay bnard online there were 11 attendees and nobody else has used a hand rais feature to speak at public comment uh Regina Regina Proby in the audience would like to speak thank you for doing the closed captions um couple of procedural kind of things that I would like to address um first of all when you do executive sessions based on uh former Town Council Jennifer taso's decision you should put in the name of the case so that the public at least knows we're not trying to interfere with your deliberation in private in order to affect the consequences but that we should the public has a right to know what cases you have in a similar Vein on your very disappointing it's been going on for a while and I just didn't get around to complaining about it you can't just have an Omnibus item for the same line of reasoning where you say well we're we might vote on certain warrant articles and not name what they are and you can't have an Omnibus addition that says and maybe some others and you really the has a right to see what items you are I hope you're still conforming with the agreement by two Town administrators as well as two advisory committees that you'll give any petitioners 48 hours notice if their articles being reconsidered not just considered so that they have a chance to be here and speak to any questions so those are the two procedural issues I think need to be addressed and ought to be addressed another is the question I'll use my last minute for the question one week a few weeks ago I listened to how wonderful it was that we had the electricity rate that the Town Administrator has just announced was announced the following week I believe it was the next week there was a shortage in the school electric thing and it made me wonder do we not also do the bidding approvals for the school side for their electricity or do we in fact have separate accounts delegated to each of the department heads so it's a question I legitimately have a quick answer sure uh we do we do we bid our sorry I'm sure you have we do in regards to your question yes we do bid we we bid for our energy on a block basis across town wise our energy rates are consistent across all of the buildings including the schools we just closed bids on um the rates that will be going on for for for residential you know consumers but for us uh we're on a slightly different schedule municipal buildings are on a different schedule uh those rates are set currently we are in the process of finalizing the rates for uh beginning in FY 27 so we're actually bidding out a fair distance um so once we have those finalized and can announce them we'll let you know but yes we standardize those across our buildings as well those rates are standard wherever possible so perhaps it was just something they wrote that said we're very much in in uh well it's not about the rates it's about the use um are high but the use is high too um thank you um in regards to the concern on the Omnibus we hear you um I will say that uh an amendment was received this morning uh and so the select board not having a chance to meet before town meeting begins next Tuesday it's important for the board to be able to consider things that come in that may otherwise be attempting to evade review uh and so for that for that reason that language is in there um I did give notice to the PTI to the proponents of that Amendment so they are available good so good are you planning to hold a select board meeting prior to town meeting I can't I don't want to get into a back and forth conversation but yes there's the select board will meet prior to town meeting on the day of okay um okay any other hands raised in on the zoom well there are 13 attendees and nobody is using the hand raised feature at this time okay let's move on to um miscellaneous items I'd like to vote items 7A to 7z in Omnibus fashion unless any selectboard member would like to take any particular item out for discussion um seeing none I also note that items 7K to 7z are items that were heard on Wednesday May 15 at our licensing hearing meeting uh and item 7h is the Arbor Day Proclamation which I'd like to read before we vote and which is uh from a memorandum to the select board from uh Tom Brady our conservation administrator not our quarterback um he he mentions that on June 1st we will incorporate both a tree identification educational walk and tree planting demonstration into the Springfest event at fiser Hill reservoir uh the Synergy of recognizing Arbor Day during Springfest a celebration focusing on Environmental Education and action has made for a more active and energetic Arbor Day celebration so uh that's something that he wouldd also like select board members to attend if we can it sounds like it's um something that we you know we would want to be at Bernard yes I do have I I don't want to pull an item out of the the the Omnibus agenda but uh the consent agenda I do want to add a comment though that was sent uh to Hamilton's okay let me Oh I thought you finished read oh I'm sorry okay the proclamation is whereas the town of Brooklyn the Department of Public Works and the tree planting committee are committed to planting and maintenance of all Town roadside shade trees and whereas Brookline has been recognized as Tree City USA by the National Arbor Day Foundation for its care and stewardship of the urban forest and desires to continue its tree planting programs and whereas the town of Brooklyn L has been a part of the Commonwealth of massachusetts's annual Tree City USA Awards Day program since 1988 and whereas the town of brookln encourages neighborhood organizations schools families and individuals to learn the importance of trees in observance of this tree Planter's holiday be it therefore resolved that the town of Brookline through its duly vested tree planning committee proclaims June 1st 2024 as Arbor Day in Brooklyn so uh I'd like to include that in the items 7A to 7z when when we vote uh Paul you have something to add yeah and thank you and I apologize for interrupting I thought you had read it I was distracted um this does not need to be pulled out of the agenda but um I did receive a request from uh Chuck Schwarz Tom meeting member from Precinct 9 UM he asked me to share with the board that um him and some of his neighbors are concerned about noise and trash coming from the back patio of Hamilton and they just asked that we you know remain focused on that not asking to not approve it but just to be aware of it okay great thank you okay with that I now move of approval of item 7A to 7 Z 26 all together all in favor please indicate by saying I John Van skak I Mike Sandman I Paul Warren I David prman I and chair votes I okay next down my boards and commissions uh we're going to approve uh the charge of the select board's comprehensive plan steering committee um Paul would you like to S introduce that or sure I this is um yep thank you this is an item that has been before us we've we've seen the charge or at least a draft version of it um and it was uh included in the uh distribution of the call for steering committee members um the the charge uh was emailed to you this afternoon I believe Kate uh sent it to you we had uh feedback from uh two members of the steering committee and they asked for uh some tweaks um and so those are in in front of you um the charge the changes include uh in paragraph one the first sentence um we are eliminating uh the word and implementation um the the sentence reads the comprehensive plan Steering group is established to oversee the development and implementation of brookland's comprehensive plan the Steering group is not going to oversee the implementation of the comprehensive plan it is going to oversee um and recommend the development of the comprehensive plan so that's the first change uh and that makes a lot of sense um the second is uh in paragraph two uh the charge reads in full the charge of the comprehens of plan steering committee is to facilitate the creation and recommendation so we're adding and recommendation of a comprehensive plan that reflects the values and needs of Brookline by engaging stakeholders fostering collaboration and aiding the consultant the steering committee will ensure that the comprehensive plan represents a collective vision for vibrant inclusive and resilient community so the amendment the changes and recommendation we wanted to make sure that the committee was aware Ware and that the board knew that this committee would be putting forward a recommendation uh to the planning board which ultimately by Master inal law has to approve uh the uh the comprehensive plan but also the select board as well so those are the the two changes um and I guess I would uh offer it to you hey let me let me add one other thing sure um I thought we discussed uh last time uh changing this from Steering group to steering committee it is a steering committee okay there should not be in group anywhere within it we changed the name of it and there was I I cut this or I printed this out from the packet the packet actually had group there was a leftover group in there and we changed it the version that was emailed to you this afternoon which we will post on the website for everybody to be able to see has renamed everything so it's consist it's consistent it's the steering committee not the Steering group great and importantly uh because I think John uh raised this last week importantly um it's very valid this committee will be operating fully under open meeting law um you know all meetings will be published uh publicly noticed um they'll be recorded meeting minutes will be posted materials uh will be available great any uh further discussion John just one thing uh the the charge references uh carry out the U blah blah blah in the um RFP request for proposals would it make sense to attach the RFP to this so that there's no question as to what we are referring to um in that paragraph uh sure attach it for what purpose I mean it it's for references yes for reference on your on your website it should be right the the the RFP is up already on the steering committee website I believe but John makes a valid point we could you know we could mention as attached so that everybody knows that this is is here but this the charge will be on the website and the RFP will be on the website great but it's a good point yeah any other comments questions okay um seeing none I move of approval of the uh of the um um comprehensive Charing committee charge um all in favor please indicate by saying hi John vanak hi Michael Sandman hi Paul Warren hi David Perman I and chair votes I thank you thank you next boards and commissions approval of um the following candidates for appointment reappointment to boards and commissions uh indigenous people cele indigenous people's celebration committee uh and we are proposing David brick we interviewed last week um and I may I want to mention that I did talk to uh Felina um who's the chair of the uh committee and ask her you what what she thought of the appointment she was very enthusiastic about Mr uh brick uh joining the committee uh as you heard last week he's been very active in uh meeting in committee meetings and working with committee on a number of projects so uh she thinks it's a great choice and and we do I think we do too but we'll see when when we vote okay I move of approval of David brick to the um indigenous people's celebration committee as a member all in favor please indicate by saying I John Van skak I um Michael sanman I uh uh Paul Warren I David Perman I and chair votes I next uh summer workshop discussion of agenda for and potential scheduling of the select board summer workshop this is a workshop that we hold every summer to begin to pull together our goals and and objectives document which this year I want to more intentionally U incorporate into the budget process so that in September when uh departments began to uh look at the budget look at their budget and prepare a proposal for the Town Administrator they have that uh our document in front of them to know what our priorities are what our objectives are and to the extent that they can incorporate them they they they can of course if there's if if there's something that's not appropriate you know we can have that discussion once we have our budget here hearings and and other um uh meetings uh as we get into the budget process so um the other so so so in terms of an agenda for the summer workshop you know I I want people to think about you what are the things that they've been hearing from people in the community you know what are the things that you know they see as their priorities um and um you know what are the other things that we need to talk about in that type of setting in order order to um you know be better prepared for both the budget process as well as the other things that are going to be coming before the committee or the the board um so this is this is to discuss you know that and various other things um Mike you I don't want I don't want to step on chaz's toes here I think he's about to talk about one one of the things that um um I think is very important is yes certainly we have to discuss what we hear from the community um but there's a structured way of doing that as opposed to sort of a scattershot way uh and um chess and I have had a discussion about strategy map or some other kind of mechanism that will help us sort of pull all the stuff together and I'm interested to hear what what you've done with that yeah and so I've been working internally to think about how we can be most productive um in finding it uh taking a day you know and for David's benefit you know we we've been um meeting on a semi-regular basis uh during a day as a daytime meeting for a couple of hours down at the um at the golf course at the clubhouse um the select board has been meeting with staff to you know take time to think deliberately about you know long range or larger scale issues it started with the budget presentation uh in historically in December you taking that out and during doing it during the day and now it's really sort of morphed into a um quarterly as needed exercise if there's obviously not a need for it we wouldn't hold it but I think given the chair's you know desire and I think all the desires that staff have been hearing from all of you about wanting to be deliberate in setting goals early and often um that it would make sense to hold this meeting and to think about it in a more structured setting about you know to hear to develop um based on your prior goals and objectives document a more uh deliberate process for identifying those yearly goals and objectives the other two areas that I would I had thought based on our convers based on the conversations with you that you may want to consider for this agenda are long- range strategic planning with the goal of the conversation to have the direction necessary to develop if necessary a request for proposal for us to go out and engage a specialist in long-range strategic planning so that we could develop such a plan for Brookline which we don't not really done in the past and I think would be of benefit to the community and you in terms of identifying longer range goals and objectives um but ALS and then the other area uh that we uh had potentially discussed um in addition to uh the um the long range strategic plan and the um immediate budget goals um uh was Revenue um Revenue uh in particular um with a goal of potentially setting up uh at least a charge for a revenue working group um we are now in year two of the uh override process moving that was passed in 20 23 uh moving into year three and I think it's important uh to start early in thinking about um when that override cycle concludes uh what efforts can we be taking in the interim to demonstrate diversification of Revenue how can we demonstrate to the public that the current Revenue projections are accurate uh something to be discussed potentially in relation to the amendment that was offered to the budget today um and um what can be do what can be done to diversify those Revenue sources in the short medium and long term so that if there is a need to go back to the community for additional tax revenue uh that it be accompanied by a meaningful plan to demonstrate that we are not simply going had in hand to the taxpayers but are demonstrating a real diversification of Revenue uh and long range plans for financial stability so those would be the three areas uh based on my conversations with you that I would recommend potentially you discuss but I also it's it is your workshop and we want to on staff want to figure out what you want to do and how you want to conduct it right could could you just for um purpose of um people in the audience um tell tell us why U long range strategic planning differs from comprehensive plan sure uh the comprehensive plan is really about how the town looks uh what is the town and how the how the town's priorities are reflected in how the town looks and how it is what designs are done and there and that does touch on a lot of the similar things that long-range strategic planning would touch on um but when you think of a comp plan it is the sort of the definition of the ideal of what the town looks like whereas long-range strategic planning is I think perhaps more focused on concrete goals and objectives on a shorter time Horizon um you know the general recommendation is you know more on like a five-year timeline whereas a comp plan is a document that really identifies the opportunities for the ideal uh function of various areas of town and goals on that front um to uh over a longer a broader time Horizon now we're behind on comp planning we you know a comp plan really should be done every 15 years or so um we're about 20 years out now um but strategic planning is more of a short-term goals and objectives based exercise as opposed to the sort of definition definitional structure of a comprehensive plan so um I'm I'm just going to list a few things that that U you know if if that's the idea here to just kind of open up as to what we would like to see on the agenda for that meeting um and I'll start with three uh divisions or departments that are relatively new or um in the case of sustainability have emerged you know from an early stage to um a middle stage of development so one of them is sustainability um one of them is the office of housing um and one of them is the language access um uh function and I think we should have um some discussion of what are the performance measures that would allow us to say yeah the these are performing as we expect you know what are the expectations how will we know if we're getting what we what we intended from the creation of those offices they do they do add Personnel to the budget they do come with a cost so how will we know if we're getting what we wanted from those um offices and um the other thing I want to just emphasize is it's kind of a hobby horse of mine um communication um we now have a communication person in place that we didn't have in place before um and I think we could have a very beneficial discussion about um what what is our I would suspect you'll get five different definitions from the five selectboard members is to what is our definition of good communication so I I think we need to sharpen our definition of of what um what are the examples of communication that uh meet our expectations as to how the town communicates with citizens and and um through what means um and and what is the overall message that we want to bring to our Communications um and how do we want to measure whether we are communicating effectively so there's there's my my contribution it is I guess if we're going through a list um if it's okay I'll add a few um I guess the this process I think I mentioned this earlier when we're developing the budget um it would be helpful to revisit the free cash waterfall hasn't been visited in quite some time um of course free cash help helps set up the CIP um among other things um so I do think it would be helpful to to revisit that as part of our Summit maybe there's some recommendations that the Town Administrator has or Deputy Town Administrator Finance um the the CIP uh comes to mind um you know we got uh uh quite a bit of feedback from advisory on the CIP um and I think that it would be helpful to have as part of the summit what are our goals and objectives for the CIP is there some prioritization there I think this year it kind of came a little bit late in the in the process and everybody was reacting to it uh which does uh raise another thing that I I don't know if it's during our Summit Perhaps it is I'd like to see us have more collaboration with advisory um through during the planning process so that they're not you know receiving something so late and then uh turning you know it would be better to collaborate I think same with the schools which we already do through the town School partnership but if we could bring in advisory I think we could get ahead of a lot of the problems that seem to uh creep up uh uh this past year um we had talked about quarterly budget Summits um I'm hoping that we can think about how we would Institute those um on on on a quarterly basis I know there was multiple parties that might be involved in that but I do I do hope that we can cover that as part of um the the summit and then and then the last thing this is a little bit of a different idea um it would be informative if we could do a I'm going to call it a budget Benchmark or a budget a comparative analysis of Brookline to some set of peers uh that we think are similar to us in growth and density and challenges that we face and just as a as a way to see I'm not picking any Department I'm not saying schools or town or DPW the whole thing uh ideally at the um probably at the kind of the department service level and see where do we stand are we ahead of uh way ahead on some things or behind um it might help inform a discussion um if we look at a peer group and see you know where we stand maybe we're way ahead on um on on climate and behind on some other things um not that we need to be like everybody else but it could be very informative I did quite a bit of this in business um and it was always helpful to uh compare your yourself to others as a way of informing the process might be helpful yeah M um uh actually I'm very familiar with benchmarking the kind of thing that we're talking about it can be very very useful you have to be very careful to Benchmark the right things you got to peer the you got to find the right peer group well you have to find the right peer group and ask the right questions about you know what is it trying trying to compare yourself to if it's just you know well what's the percentage of budget that's spent that doesn't really tell you how effective that money has been used it's a lot of qualitative I did I don't think you know I ran a bench I ran a benchmarking business back and forth um so uh right um we need to compare notes sometime uh one of the I I think listening to the to jonath to Paul and I would bet when when David chimes in as well um there are a number of very specific things that people are interested in doing I think that uh there is a mechanism I think Paul you're familiar with strategy map strategy map concept and I know I sent some stuff to Chaz to give him a uh a six week course in one email uh and um uh I think that that or some other relevant tool to pull all of this stuff together into an so that we have an integrated sense of what we need to be doing would be very useful for example if we need to be providing um uh better information in some uh some form uh what is the infrastructure that we need to provide in order to do that what's the what's the step below that what do we need in terms of Staff in order to manage uh or provide that uh manage that infrastructure uh and um it's uh conceptually it lets you help it it helps you figure out what you need to do first uh and uh I think that would be uh a useful thing to do and I'm hoping that we can uh we can pull all these various things together in that fashion David I like what's been brought up so far but a couple of other areas I'd like for us to look at Municipal Building Capital planning and also pilot renegotiation specifically around land use and Facilities access I had one I [Laughter] forgot uh well we are um we will soon find out the results of what was an initiative we haven't done in a couple of years and that is the community survey uh and I think we should clearly um try to be informed by the results of that survey and have a discussion of the implications of the results of that survey great I think this is enough for two Summits um yes but what we'll do is what I will try and do is I'll try and synthesize this into a proposed agenda I will send it to the board um you know obviously if there are things that are missed things that you wish to add you know we can talk about how to set that agenda and just bring it up the chair obviously sets the agenda so whatever we need we'll try and build out as effective a schedule as we can to give the amount of time necessary to these issues if there are things that might not make it into uh the kind of Workshop agenda the next item of business on this the calendar if you want to take it together is your summer schedule um and since summer is historically a less busy time for the board we can try and work specifically issues that may not make it onto the retreat agenda or the workshop agenda um into your select board schedules so that you always have work uh longer term work in the summer months uh to kind of consider um and um in terms of the date for the uh um Workshop um I had just been looking at town meeting schedule and your schedule and thinking the possibility of Tuesday June 18th uh during the day um we usually meet from 9: to 3 with a break for lunch um we could obviously meet 9 to 3:30 or 9: to 4: depending on how much you have how much work you have but we do tend to get less productive in the afternoon um what um is June 18th the possibility for the members of the board see it works for me we can obviously doesn't have to we don't you know sure but I would also I would be willing to uh stretch it out a little bit too if we if we think we need two sessions um I know we were we were running out of gas last time um and they are long exhausting days I think if if maybe you know we we did it over two days i' I'd be open to that as well sure yeah agree I think the the thought for your schedule for the summer um given the sort of people's holidays and so forth would be to meet if with the ret if the workshop is June 18th then to meet the following week on June 25th um as part of your regular meetings and then meet every other week um from there through the end of August so last year we had one meeting in August that was not enough um we got backed up with work for you uh and we would rather you meet on a regular basis I know that could be tough for folks who take vacation in August but if that's possible we'd love to have you but the thought would be June 25th July 9th July 23rd August 6th and August 20th and obviously if there's the need to meet more frequently we can do that as well so my uh you know my I may have a counterview on this um I was actually never a fan of a A reduced schedule for the select board um uh you know I think there's uh there's there's lots to do we have many issues to face uh the public um you know appreciates the access and and the update as to what the town is doing what we're doing um and I for one would um you know prefer not to have a summer schedule uh and and and stick with the similar schedule that would be my views I think if we're traveling in remote certainly we can maintain a quorum uh but that's um that's my my pref is to um stay with a a regular schedule that we have throughout the year and not you know kind of go into summer mode yeah let me just say that the purpose for you know this reduced schedule is to give us voluntary volunteer um you officials of the Town an opportunity to breathe uh and to give staff an opportunity to not have to be in you know the meeting room every single week um so I that that's my that's my view of this respect your view John I was gonna make a similar comment I I do think that think thinking about the flow of necessary work um if it slows down during the summer um that's that's a good time to be you know taking the occasional week off um and there is the staff to consider and um many of them are going to want to take their hard earned time off during the summer and so you know G given the flow of work presumably being uh less given the need to schedule staff vacations and the desire of members of the select board understandably to have their own uh vacation time you know I I do think a reduced schedule is appropriate the only thing I was going to suggest in response to what Chaz just laid out is if there could be one break that is two weeks between meetings um I I having recently had the experience of I thought I was being smart and had figured out how to do um a two-e vacation that only would miss one meeting and then there was a s a late scheduled meeting and having missed two meetings in a row um you know I wouldn't want to do that again frankly um and and if we can and yet summer vacations often tend to be you know you book a place wherever on the cape or wherever for a couple of weeks um so if there's any way to have at least one break that's two weeks that would be a good time for those of us who are kind of trying to figure out is there any possibility of doing a you know kind of a two-e trip or whatever we'd at least have the option of doing that without missing a meeting or maybe missing one meeting at most we we could do instead of the 20th of August the 27th you could do that I think that that's consistent with what we've done in the past yep you could also if you want to take it at the beginning of August you could do the 13th of August as opposed to the 6th and then you have that break from July to early August um I just thinking of people cuz that that's Memorial Day weekend or Labor Day weekend uh going into it and people tend to take that week off the prior week off of the subsequent week off um so maybe you do the um well now then you get kind of thrown and you're doing two days you're doing we'll take a look at this we'll poll MERS of the board but you we just wanted to put this in your head the idea of what your summer schedule what you'd like your summer schedule to look like so do you have any comments yeah Paul's comment was interesting I think that um they have sort of routine meetings all the way through the summer just not necessary yeah I don't think it well I think right now we're in a schedule of worth three weeks a month right right we take a we take a week off I would I'm saying to continue that through the summer but again I said I'm probably the anomaly on the board here well but what I was going to suggest is that if we have that third meeting uh during the the month that we take a topic uh or that we do do something that we don't normally have time to do in regular meetings I just comes to mind because the chair of the transportation board sitting out there um it would be very interesting to have the transportation board or the planning board to come and make a you know have a discussion with them about what they're doing and what you know what they see um as being issues for the community uh and how they're able to the resources that they need to respond to those issues uh and there are certainly half a dozen at least um uh boards and commissions that I I think would be very interesting to hear from and we don't have a chance to do that yeah we now that Tiffany's on board we can begin to continue the process we began earlier of setting up regular times for boards and commiss committees good uh that we appoint um to come in and basically report to us yeah in terms of those boards and commissions that we don't appoint you know we still can ask them to go give us a a briefing on what they're doing and you know what they see coming coming down the road so that's more work for you sorry so this is going to come back to us as a a suggested calendar you're gonna ask us I wanted I wanted to get right it's hard right it's hard to have you deliberate about things um without okay all right okay guess what s o'clock 7 o'clock and we have a meeting well do you want notice for 7 o' you do although I will say do you do you want to take the one amendment that you have out of order for town meeting um so that you can end with this issue as opposed to having to then at the end of a transportation hearing go back to the issue no this is G this is gonna take a little while well yeah that's what he's saying that's what I'm saying so take take your last let's take the budget amendment well the budget amendment is going to take budget have who and who has to join us for the budget amendment well the petitioner or or the petitioner is invited uh I believe they're present uh but they're on they're on now if you want to hear from the petitioner well I I truthfully I'd rather defer to the people who have a expectation of a s o'clock hearing yeah we we very seldom meet or or are able to hold the hearing the time it is noticed for and since we can do that today let's take advantage of that so unused to doing it flab hurry up don't ruin it it's now 7 okay okay so who's how we how we running this um we have you have two separate hearings noticed um for similar issues regarding decisions of the transportation board that were made um uh regarding uh the Pierce project one regarding a a left turn lane and one regarding the placement of a garage exit in a curb cut onto Harvard Street and so those are noticed um in and the um uh I believe uh we uh you had preed 10 minutes for each appeal to make their point total so you know there are multiple appellants but the thought was that each folk each group gets 10 minutes there will then be 15 minutes for the uh project team which brought the request to respond you would hear from the chair of the transportation board representing the board on their decision and recommendation to you and then you would be able to you would hear public um you would uh and then you would be able to make a determination and as always your determinations can be are very broad you can approve the decision you can remand the decision back to the transportation board you can reject the decision okay so we we we don't have a script for that so it's just going to be or yes can I just ask one question as I'm listening um of the three options is there a fourth one where we can also modify uh the the appeal and and and come up with a different decision or is it to be based on what the appeal is usually the best practice is you should remand to the board with instructions so that they can they can make the determination um okay thank you Mike you yeah um um my uh recollection of of the bylaw that um that created this process uh because it created a process when previously was no opportunity for appeal of Transportation board hearings is that it's only the first two options that we have that we we can't turn over we can't reject a decision we can only send it back if they if the transportation board then doesn't change its mind and we we can then overturn the decision there's an extra Loop thank you for that reminder I had actually that it escaped my memory but I will double check on that my recollection yeah either approve or remand right joh yeah and I asked this question because somebody raised this possibility um in a conversation with me today and I had not thought of this before I had heard of it before I is there at the end of the process if the appellants still have not achieved satisfaction uh with their appeal of the transportation board decision can they then take that to town meeting yes that is the final stage of any appeal if app are still dissatisfied at the end of it they can it will be placed on the warrant for the next town meeting which you set so you can call a special if you need to um and then the decision would need to be over if would in order to overturn the decision it needs a two-thirds vote of town meeting okay and the standard there is that it's arbitrary or dangerous it's it's a high standard for overturning not just we don't like it okay um okay so let's start off with um presentations uh by the uh appellants here um is it John Ebert gonna do the presentation well what's first on the agenda here believe item 10 is listed first on the agenda it's in reverse order the presentation we want to hear the translation boy that's it great should be able to scroll down through okay right so I I'll yep uh good evening good evening okay so you have 10 minutes and then um Brian is gonna have what 15 minutes well so no then that so the the this these group of petitioners has 10 minutes the group talking about item nine has 10 minutes and then we'll take them consecutively yes and then the uh Design Group which asked for these things has 15 minutes to respond and we're going to be asked to look at a number of things on the screen can the captions be moved so that we can see the things on the screen yeah great okay The Design Group uh has 15 minutes when is Brian gonna Brian speaks at the end of that okay good don't go anywhere all right okay good evening I'm uh uh to the select board and Mr Carrie um I'm John Hebert I am a resident at 21 Auburn Street and I'm also a town meeting member in Precinct 7 uh I am here to petition to appeal the decision of the transportation board uh that was made on April 10th uh one of the two decisions uh this particular one was made um to remove the left turn lane at the intersection of Harvard Street and skull Street northbound and more importantly it was to uh eliminate the ability to make a left turn from uh Harvard from the remaining single Lane of Harvard Street northbound um at certain times of day at Peak travel times the uh the reason for the decision uh my understanding is that it was made on the grounds of that drivers of vehicles wanting to proceed Northbound on Harvard Street uh would go around any stopped vehicle thereby posing safety and accident risks to cyclists and operators of micromobility vehicles Crossing Aspen Wall Avenue and otherwise if they didn't do that the Northbound traffic would be blocked behind the stopped uh left turning vehicle so let me just hit this think I can use help here how do I remove and Advance oh I just advance that way so the the appeal that I'm U making and I I have received um the petition that I wrote uh was supported by 36 residents of Auburn Street wasburn Place uh Park Street Harvard Avenue and Washington Street uh the reason for the appeal is that we feel that the decision was based on insufficient study data and that the decision unknowingly moves the dangers and safety risks to the from the intersection at Harvard and School Street two blocks north to the intersection of Auburn Street and Harvard Street which is the next available left turn from Harvard Street northbound we believe that the complexity of this intersection adds to both of those problems so there are two traffic analyses that were um that the transportation board referred to one of them is more recent it was made uh or was reported in April of 2024 both of them were made by the same firm called vassan Associates um and the the one in April of 2024 tabulated the straight through and turning traffic volumes at certain times of day Peak morning afternoon and so on the upshot of that study showed that there were between 45 and 49 vehicles per hour that would be turning left onto School Street at the peak uh travel times and so if there was no left lane available for them to make a dedicated left turn that those some portion some number of those Vehicles would be coursing two blocks up Harvard Street to make a left onto Auburn Street to go up Auburn make a left on Park out to out to Washington and continue North or Northwest on Washington Street right in there during the meeting the transportation board members referred to vaguely referred to a study that had been done some time ago that showed traffic patterns uh in the vicinity of peer School um and uh I was kindly sent this uh presentation uh it it came in late in the game but I I received it after I had submitted the uh my petition but it it tends to bolster the argument what that traffic impact assessment did which you can see just a cover of here it evaluated different traffic patterns for School Street and and assessed the impact it studied 21 intersections near P near Pierce Pierce school um it did not consider the impact of removing a left turn lane from Harvard Street northbound because this was it it it wasn't on the table at the time um however it did observe and comment on high pedestrian volumes and the fact that pierce the peer School study area is a walking Community as we'll see more of in a bit here so the actual um study area uh I almost have to point it out because it's a little murky here it runs from on the uh top left Auburn Street along Park Street going counterclockwise uh along Washington down Cyprus uh along Route nine to around the brook house comes back up and then courses up Harvard Street takes a jog to include Aspen Wall and a bit of of St Paul and then completes uh his circuit at um uh at Auburn Street again what is notable about this is that in this study as you can see in the circled area the uh there's something missing here it's it's not a straight line across for whatever reason and if I zero in on this you'll see that the thing that is omitted is the intersection of Harvard Street and Auburn Street it um it turns out that the that this intersection is extremely busy I uh there's coming well flanking it there are two daycare centers there's the Bright Horizons on the top left the Martin trust uh partnership for Early Education on the lower right there's a gas station there's a car wash behind the gas station and coming in and out of the uh preschool on the top left out of the Bright Horizons is in fact an egress from there short-term parking and one way forcing through that facility onto Auburn Street which is a two-way street at that point otherwise Auburn is a one-way 100 feet past the intersection I counted I I you have to pardon the the the crudeness of the drawing here because I didn't have a program to do it but I counted that there are 22 possible turns within 100 feet of this intersection um uh at in and out of all these places including uh cars that could go straight across from the car wash gas station into Bright Horizons or straight out of the P the trust partnership or the gas station and straight up Albert Street in the study that was done in May 2022 by vas Associates this is a stylized um drawing of the just the well the area of the intersection two minutes sorry thank you of uh of Harvard and Auburn you notice that it points it out as a one-way Street and that it is shown as being perpendicular Auburn is not perpendicular it's an oblique angle coming up from Harvard Street that may that encourages drivers to cut the corner and go more quickly onto Auburn Street um and there are almost always pedestrians Crossing that street at the time as is evidenced by here there's a car exiting Auburn Street uh we're looking up Auburn SW Park and um and you can't see the one way sign but it is 100 ft up uh complicating matters there's also cars that are often times parked there during no parking times this was taken at 88:18 a.m. last Friday morning during a No Parking time um and there is often micromobility as you can see from this uh example of very micr mobility and these These Little Things Are All the Rage uh and that's not the only thing that we see coming down Harvard Street there are skateboards motorized skateboards there are uh an amazing number of vehicles and as a driver making that left turn onto Auburn it is uh downright dangerous and extremely difficult to see everything all at the same time you do have 30 seconds the course the core peer School District extends far beyond the study area which is in Blue from that may 2022 study and a lot of that population comes down Harvard Street which is very much a part of a walk-in community that study pointed out that 81% of peer students walk to school that the area itself is a walking Community with hundreds of pedestrians per hour at the study area intersections and the presence of students was clear especially at Peak travel times and in conclusion thank you uh we believe it's um a very risky intersection much more so than the intersection of Harvard Street school and Aspen Mall which is much more predictable at is time thank you thank you uh next we're supposed to listen to the oh the other petitioner correct okay sorry my name is Barbara Hebert I live in the Pierce School neighborhood and I've lived there for many years and uh I'm a co-petitioner with Carol McBain about the curb cut decision and uh in in an effort to restore the three parking spaces on Harvard Street thank you for the opportunity to speak on this this issue Carol McBain and I along with 300 community members Brookline community members attended many of the meetings held by the Brookline Department of planning and Community Development last year to create the new Harvard Street zoning plan as part of the MBTA communities act the plan was overwhelmingly approved at special town meeting in November of 2023 one of the issues discussed and agreed upon by the community was the danger and negative consequences of curb cuts on a Main Street pedestrian and shopping experience as a result the new Z zoning law prohibits curb cuts on Harvard Street the transportation department brought to my attention that pierce school property is excluded from this zoning law but CB Cuts allowing vehicle traffic to to cross the sidewalk on a pedestrian oriented Main Street create a real danger especially to children people with disabilities seniors cyclists and uh and 81% of the students walked peer school as John pointed out as far as we know no study was conducted to gauge the impact of 70 Vehicles entering a parking garage at 72 Harvard Street turning left from a northbound lane on Harvard Street involves crossing a travel Lane a bike lane and a busy sidewalk in this walking community and I think they did look at the exiting and they recommended that cars only turn right as they exit but still it's a very busy area brookline's desire is to create the new pier school to be accessible to all and to be a welcoming environment to 800 students and their families and we're asking that you please take a second look at the entrance to the staff parking garage could the current Washington Street entrance to the town and library parking be used to access the parking for the new Pierce school if it is possible we could avoid a potentially dangerous situation while retaining three parking spaces for visitors to access the Harvard Street shops and the pier school thank you and please uh could Carol McBain speak on Zoom sure um Kate can you we'll pause time and promote her Carol has been promoted okay I'm Carol McBain also a neighbor of the pier school and a co-sponsor of this particular so thank you for the opportunity to speak tonight we only had a short time to get feedback after learning of the transportation board's decision and dreaded knocking on hundreds of doors to find supporters beyond all expectations everyone answered their door and our neighbors in the Auburn and Greeno Street areas overwhelmingly supported keeping these spaces for the community they are needed both by business patrons and school visitors who can't use the garage an even more important issue is pedestrian safety a curb cut in this location particularly if the sidewalk is widened and the left turn lane is eliminated as planned would negate all efforts to enhance The Pedestrian experience a wide sidewalk allows people to walk side by side at different speeds so the flow of foot traffic could be constant at busy times often pedestrians do not even notice turning cars much less stop for them cars entering the G garage from Harvard Street from either direction could hold up traffic to try to Dart through the crowd walking to school fortunately the traffic study data prepared by MDS supports this this lived experience according to the study and I quote any option for school street that increases vehicle delay at these intersections meaning Harvard and Cyprus has the potential to increase crash frequencies as motorists become impatient and distracted which is not a desirable outcome unquote on that basis the firm's recommendation was to not Implement any of the Restriction scenarios that limited traffic on School Street however allowing a curb cut which will introduce more left turns as well as right turns a short distance from that intersection would add to delays for cars and increase danger for pedestrians it's understood that having a single garage entrance would cause some delay for staff but the current Washington Street entrance has less foot traffic during busy morning hours is set back from the street and has greater visibility we feel that maintaining a Washington Street only entrance will be the best solution for both pedestrian safety and unimpeded traffic flow on Harvard Street in addition to saving three parking spaces for the neighborhood a Washington Street only entrance would bring the project into compliance with Town meeting's recently enacted mvta communities plan which recommends restricting curb cuts at the recent Transportation board meeting on um May 15th board members said the cut was approved because they thought a second garage entrance was required so I think we need clarification on this point Thank you thank you anything further from the petitioners no okay okay so the Design Group is on what on Zoom believe so yes um we have our the representative who's going to speak from the design team uh I believe it's Margaret Clark and lapan you can promote them any other members of the team Daniel Martin Adam I think Adam [Music] Keane oh boy and tetto Hagen okay um members of the design team uh you have uh 15 minutes to present to the select board um Margaret do we need an introduction to this or should we get right to Ted um well yeah Ted and I are going to do the presentation for you all tonight um and I I have the slides I'll be sharing so I'll do that if you I'm uh can someone enable participant sharing we typically well this is a hearing this is different all right you we'll try and enable that sharing for you I believe it's enabled you go ahead and try to share it's not letting me that's correct I I can't share my screen also okay we can try taking a look can you share it now with Margaret yes thank you so Ted's going to start and then I will uh speak and then he'll finish it out um good evening uh my name is tto Hagen I'm a senior Highway engineer at Vasan Associates we're the transportation Engineers on this project um and right now we're we're presenting excuse me we previously had presented um the petition to remove the left turn lane on Harvard Street northbound to School Street um this originally stemmed from our presentation to the transportation board about the removal of the parking spaces as part of that discussion uh the transportation board had asked us to evaluate eliminating the left turn lane and installing a a floating bus stop to uh improve The Pedestrian experience in this location um so we we looked into the analysis um we determined that the overall the elimination of the left turn lane would see a decrease in delays at the intersection um however there was not enough uh width to provide a proper floating bus stop um so with the elimination of the left turn lane we've opted to uh bump out the sidewalk to provide uh better pedestrian accommodations and waiting areas at the bus stop along with a uh Bufford bike lane um today the bike lane pulls in um is a concerning conflict with the existing bus stop um and when we presented the transportation board um it was determined that or they approved the removal of the left turn lane and the Restriction of left turns during uh peak hour so cars would still be able to make a a left turn um during off peak periods at the intersection ction um uh and ultimately we just we found that this um was a decrease overall in the delays for all the approaches um we also looked at the um the location of the proposed uh garage entrance um orig this is the location that was determined it impacts four parking spaces um while we did present to the transportation board um they did request that we evaluate Shifting the driveway uh to try to to fix the skew from Homer Street uh and maybe preserve more of those parking spaces um we were able to determine from that that uh it was feasible to shift at about 12T um we'd be able to to only have to eliminate three parking spaces however there was an impact to the uh pedestrian sight distances um there is a structural column that would where it's located in the has to it has to remain where it's currently located with the shifted driveway it would be uh directly in the middle of the aisle and cars exiting would have a difficult time seeing pedestrians approaching from the left in that situation um so we took a look at what the the shift if we um if we expanded the The Pedestrian area on um on the school side um the advantages that it would have you can see this this red line here if I zoom in what is the uh current alignment of the street um having that extra space just allows instead of just a a sidewalk immediately adjacent the street it allows us to have planting and seeding areas and an expanded area for spill out from um the entry to the harvestry entry to the school for after hours use of the multi-purpose room or gymnasium um and you can see that the previous iteration just had a very um you know just narrow sidewalk with some plantings against the building but not a very pleasant um pedestrian experience and we understand part of the zoning was to improve The Pedestrian experience on on Harvard Street and um and the the safety of those folks um so as you can see from the updated view um this expanded area has a lot more plantings and and ties it in with this the School Street Experience with the more plantings as Ted mentioned um you know improves the bike lane experience um and just allows a lot uh you know a lot um more gracious um and and safe uh pedestrian uh access along this Edge um terms of within the garage um I'll take a Clos look this is the sorry the um this is uh School Street and Harvard Street on the lower left North being down page here so this is the Washington Street entrance um current entrance it's only 22 uh feet between the two major retaining walls underneath the library garage um and because this is Town Hall Parking on the what is actually South um portion of the garage we need to maintain a pedestrian um with walkway um that already exists along this Edge so that they can walk within the garage to the entrances that are at this level uh of the Town Hall um so there isn't uh and and there's also existing piping and such which protrudes off of of this side the nature of which I'm not actually familiar with but it's it protrudes about a foot into it so the clear space between the um the required walk and and even this um this obstruction here is only 16' 6 so you cannot get two cars um passing each other not not meeting zoning it's 20 fet is what's required for for Zoning for a two-way they it is currently used for the town hall portion of the garage as basically inflow in the morning and then the gate is open and outflow at the end of the day um we have currently in the overall garage split the 80 one spaces on the town hall side from the school side um so that we do not increase the volume that has to use the existing very narrow throat to Harvard Street um so we are showing an entrance an exit on Harvard Street because the volume of the currently the the the garage is entered in this approximate location and there's a long driveway that that uh traverses the change in elevation the School Street rise is from 29 to 42 along this Edge um the existing driveway drops down so you can get under those two garages we had to build out the building in order to get the the uh expanded program we and get accessible entrances on all sides at three different levels um we had to build build out the building towards School Street so there's no longer it's no longer feasible to enter the garage from this side cuz you would hit the top of the car coming out that edge under the floor above and we can't couldn't raise that floor above and still get to it in an accessible manner from school street so the School Street um entrance is just not feasible so we were showing it on Harvard Street there's an additional 62 cars on this side we do not recommend worsening the existing non-compliant condition of this drive um by adding 62 cars to the other side um relative to the driveway shift just note that at that entrance um we have to provide accessible parking the the location that we're currently showing here allows for one parking space plus uh the three parking the uh handicap parking here right next to the vestibule because they are required to be the closest spots um so we can only eliminate uh this one spot and Shifting the driveway um otherwise that either it would go to I'll show back on this one either it would go to a compact spot here which would not be an equivalent spot or it would go to a farther spot which is not allowed to put the third spot in either of the the next locations so we could only shift it by that um that one spot um so we looked at that and as Ted mentioned when you shift it to make the um is three accessible spots um bring it in bring it goes 12 feet down and there is a structural column here that has to be maintained um and that's what Ted was referring to in terms of sorry we just zoom in there um the site distances you want to just note that Ted uh yes so this is the uh the structural column uh This Is The Pedestrian site distance um ideally in this situation you can see that if a pedestrian is further out on this sidewalk um that the structure ual column blocks the line of sight with the with the driveway in its original location um where it impacts the four spots there are no there's no real impact to the site distance uh from any columns um and we're providing some landscape areas and raised Planters to keep pedestrians away from any blind spots caused by the the building itself so that's what we have for our presentation tonight thank you right thank you so Mr Kane what's the say you sorry soccer last night uh thank you for for having me uh Mr Perlman congratulations or condolences as the case may be um let me start by thanking the heberts and Miss McBain for bringing this I think this shows that our our processes work and uh when citizens have uh very legitimate concerns we we have a way to deal with them and I think that's that's fantastic um I want to take up the two appeals simultaneously because they're they're absolutely linked uh the way that they're linked is well let me let me start at the beginning so the transportation board we had three different hearings on this topic we spent four hours deliberating over it it's really complicated as you can see uh there's no right answer I think is what it comes down to so we're being asked to sort of pick the less bad option um we as a board we we had a we talked about this last week it's not our preference to have cars going over Harvard Street sidewalks um that is suboptimal as far as we're concerned we've heard from the experts however that that is the least bad place to put the cars so we're sort of left having to to figure this out and and cut this Solomon's baby if we had to put a curb cut on Harvard Street to facilitate a garage we thought it made a lot more sense than to widen that sidewalk on Harvard Street as much as possible that led to the decision to get rid of the left turn lane at Harvard and school so that we could shrink the roadway and expand the sidewalks to make it as safe as possible again not our preference to have cars going across that that sidewalk um we also were told by several folks that what was on offer was a critical path decision that had to be made to get the project to continue uh all of us uh live through uh the override last year we know what how important this is to our community into our town and we did not want to be standing in the way of what we were told was something that we that we that had to move forward uh it turns out that that might not have been 100% accurate or not that it was inaccurate but there might be other information um it has come to our attention uh that there is not a building code requirement to have a second egressed entrance on Harvard Street and that a lot of that is more for as you heard from from Miss Clark um to sort of separate the town hall and the School Employees um not a great reason as far as we're concerned to sort of go through all this and and and put cars going across a a school going across Harvard Street sidewalk so what we're asking what I'm on behalf of the board what I'm asking you to do tonight is send this back to the transportation board um let us keep working on it um I think what we should do is get the school design advisory team the school building committee to talk this through um uh Mr Carrie I'm afraid you might have to get involved because it seems like some employees that are parking underneath this building aren't always doing the right thing I've also heard that lots of School Employees also parking under this building are not doing the right thing they're tandem parking and blocking Lanes so there's a lot of Behavioral change that we need to do as well to sort of facilitate driving and and parking in these garages a little better but I think what we need is to get all of the Architects and the engineers and and and all the experts together um hear from the neighborhood hear from the people again and if it is absolutely critical and essential that we have to have a garage on Harvard Street a garage entrance on Harvard Street then that is the least bad option and I think that's something that we would then support however if we can get the building commission and all the parties involved to agree that it is not necessarily required and that we can somehow work with the Washington Street entrance and exit which you heard from Miss Clark is not ideal and also probably not up to code then that then then we can make that work and perhaps with some of the money we save from not doing this entrance we can do something on the Washington Street entrance I'm not sure that's above my pay grade um but the request is that you know you send this back to us let us keep working on it there are many questions that continue to to need answers and I for one would like the chance to uh to get them so thank you very much right um thank you okay what we're going to do is get questions from the board y uh and then open it up to the public right so uh I attended the transportation board meeting and I have to say uh um um I was in Brian's position for a few years uh and so I know that sometimes you you you come up against uh doing things that are at least bad but I would say that I think um a uh in sending traffic north on Harvard Street to turn turn left on Auburn and then down to Washington down to park and then to Washington is really that's a really terrible idea yeah one of the things that was discussed when Pierce was being designed was whether or not to close School Street and I thought that was a really terrible idea this is um pretty nearly as bad uh because in fact you would have had essentially the same situation you will have ex essentially the same situation as if you closed it off to half of the track traffic or something of that sort so um the elim to me the elimination of the left turn lane is really problematic uh I I think uh having just tonight driven down that relatively uh uh that not up to code driveway the one thing I'll say about it is timing you know in the morning traffic is flowing in in the afternoon it's flowing out there's not much uh much conflict between drivers and I recognize that we may have to come up to code um or or find another solution uh but uh if we can possibly think about how that driveway can be used as the sole entrance and exit uh in a safe way I mean you can put a warning lights up you know that are triggered when one car is coming in you can put a light at the other end to make sure that another car doesn't try to come out uh so there are some tech some relatively simple uh fixes to that but uh anything you can do to not have to send traffic left onto Harvard app is uh MH uh it's a really good idea you get no disagreement over here Y no oh yep um just a quick first I have a question what is a floating bus stop it's a bus stop that is not on the sidewalk itself it's sort of in there's a bike lane in between the sidewalk and the bus stop okay it floats in this middle of the street BAS I see it's FL okay I wish it was on water that's helpful um well I I have a similar view of the situation as as Mike um I on my way here I purposely drove uh down Harvard Street um imagined that you couldn't take a left turn onto school which I which is where I would go in order to come to the garage to get underneath um and I was going to take the left and then I realized oh the first left is a one way right and so I thought to myself do I want to go all the way down I might be late for the meeting so what did I do I banged a u-turn on Harvard Street so I could then turn right onto School Street that's now on the record yeah my wife must have been advising you allegedly allegedly it's now that's now on the record um so you know I and I appreciate the analysis of the the petitioners John your analysis of how many entrance and exits by the gas station by uh the car wash uh your road um the daycare um there is a lot of activity there um that that happens um throughout the day especially in the morning and the afternoon um I I can say pretty firmly that I'm opposed to an exit onto Harvard Street um for all the reasons have been listed um you know we're this is a a highly active pedestrian area um you know having I don't know how many cars it was 50 60 cars exiting there um with children with other folks uh walking um in the increase in in micromobility and bicycles um I I think we should do everything that we possibly can to use that Washington Street uh entrance uh as uh as the egress and if it's not required by lack the building code does not require us to put put an entrance on Harvard Street a second entrance um I would I would uh I really think we need to W use the Washington Street um entrance and so and I and I agree you know let's I think you said it Brian that we need to figure out it's a municipal parking lot let's figure out how to get the the employees to park properly and eliminate if there are conflicts um I think there might be a fence down there that tries to separate them or is that they make good neighbors I'm told we need to make good so anyway I I'm I'm uh in favor of of supporting um sending it back to the to the transportation board if that means approving the appeal I guess that's that that's what I would be oh no it means remanding okay yeah um I have no objection to remanding but I just don't see how you're going to come up with a solution for Washington Street I mean it's a narrow driveway talking about additional what 50 60 70 cars per day um you know good luck there's a lot smarter people than I am uh chairman so we're going to rely on them okay uh John uh I'm with Paul and with Mike on this and you know I I I with all respect to our chair I would say uh the the answer to that question is if they can't figure out how to do the entrance exit on Washington Street then they probably can't figure out how to do it onto Harvard Street because just as there are impediments that might have to be solved uh narrow passage that needs to be made wider um that there are uh impacts of this in andout from uh an entrance exit on Harvard Street that haven't really been fully explored and once they're fully explored I think people will just come to the conclusion that doesn't work either so something has to be made to work and there's going to be less than perfect um solution uh whether it is um to go forward with this which I oppose or to recognize that having M having cars at a busy time of day on Harvard Street um in large number trying to line up on Harvard Street make a left turn across a sidewalk where kids are walking back and forth as they arrive and to school um is a recipe for disaster and having um cars that used to be able to turn left on the School Street um be given the option of the only option of going left would be to proceed two blocks and turn left at a intersection on busy Harvard Street where there is no light to control traffic to stop traffic to allow for the left turning traffic there is no protection for kids crossing the crosswalk on Auburn um that's not a solution so I think we we we really have to recognize that of of all of the scenarios the worst one um is the one that involves a lot of in andout traffic crossing the sidewalk on Harvard Street where the school is and in addition to that a lot of Northbound traffic being forced to turn left on Auburn Street when there's a lot of kids coming back and forth mostly in the direction of Pier school to to walk to school that's the least you know desirable solution so if I haven't made it louder and clear I do hope the um transportation board and the transportation department will come back to us with a plan that does not um incorporate the entrance exit um on Harvard Street can I ask what has been the experience uh so far of going into the school garage off of school Street which is a very busy street with kids and you know micr Mobility uh Vehicles as and everything else I think it's it's been the status quo for over 50 years so I think folks are used to it um my experience is that teachers tend to get there on the earlier side than kids I know pierce my my daughter is still a pierce um my youngest um they they put a teacher at the at the driveway to make sure kids don't cross in front of turning cars um because they're concerned and and you're absolutely right so we do the same thing in Harvard Street if that's the theoretically but again that takes it's not the end of the world I guess is you no [Music] sir go well if I may I'd like to point out a little bit of a difference with School Street um is that uh for for one thing and if we're talking during the school day um the existing peer school has a pedestrian bridge overpass so that the kids can cross the street um if they're in school or if they're at the playground um they can cross the street that way but also I I think um a close look at how many kids arriving um at Pierce school um arrive um uh and walk up and down and across that intersection uh excuse me across that entrance exit which um is is you know a unique entrance exit with a rotary for cars to sort of come in circle and go out um uh we don't have that with this Harvard Street in out exit um uh and I I I don't think the two situations are exactly the same um and I think um in fact there are a lot of reasons to think that the Harvard Street situation would be would would create problems that the existing um School Street situation which isn't an ideal but I think there are less conflicts with the existing School Street situation and forgive me for going just one 10 seconds longer I also think we should take a look at the number of parking spaces that we're talking about in this new plan and I know that um Driscoll isn't Pierce and Pierce isn't Driscoll um but when when they did Driscoll one of the primary considerations for how many parking spaces to create for teacher parking um in a in in a garage um was that there was a lot of Transport public transportation to and from um the area of the Driscoll school and um there's a lot of public transportation to and from the area of the Pierce school and Driscoll ended up deciding on 25 spaces so um if if we need more than that at Piers I'm I can I can get that but how many more than that do we need at Driscoll and when was the last time we took a serious look at how many spaces we're planning for and are they perhaps in excess of what we need if we govern the the use of parking according to maximizing the use of public transportation right Mike oh one quick question um so at Driscoll and other schools the transation board has put in place uh a parking plan for teachers that U utilizes streets as well as um as well as the limited garages uh and uh that seems to work pretty well uh and um my question is is there a plan of that sort in place at Pierce yes well there is you would maintain perhaps have to expand that yeah we we disperse uh both after school teachers and and regular school teachers throughout the neighborhoods to ensure that no more than 40% of a street is parked up by permits we are hearing anecdotally however that folks that have permits a little bit further away don't like them and are trying to park in the garage so I think we need to work on this from a lot of different angles we need the town we need the principal we need the school department to all help us reduce the demand I completely agree with you Mr VG we need to reduce the demand as much as we can we we've tried over the years to do this um maybe maybe you know Mr per there's I hear there's uh there's a in their contract they get free parking or something I'm not sure but yes it's it's a challenge yeah and no this the parking on the street for teachers goes back a a long long way uh David is probably close to that from time to veteran of the school committee um but um there are some ways to control a parking when you you issue a a uh a card that admits you to the garage if you don't have the card you don't get in uh and uh so there are some really simple Technical Solutions to I think the things that we're talking about here uh David just going to say that I agree with John that the current School Street entrance is not analogous to what's being proposed for Harvard it sounds like the Harvard Street entrance would be about two car lengths and so that's very concerning to me from a safety perspective about how you're going to have cars coming in and out with just a two-car length space that sounds that it would be smaller than the current Washington Street entrance to uh Mike point and this is done in Europe all the time you can have that light system in place so that someone's not exiting at the same time that someone is entering right uh and so I would certainly be on board with a remand so that hopefully we can look at a Washington Street only uh entrance and exit plan as for the left turn I can't imagine ever being in support of eliminating the left turn onto School Street especially in light of what Mr Hebert raised that Auburn Street was wasn't even included in the study so that's sort of a procedural concern of mine oh just one more Point um have we heard it all from St Mary's which is right across the street Elementary School I assume they have uh teacher parking issues they certainly in the morning um the long time uh um you know crossing guard there is a master of of traffic control because it's very busy um and that would it looks like that would be essentially right across the street from the this entrance on on Harvard Street so you know there's much more going on uh educationwise and student wise because I don't know how many students are at St Mary's but there's quite a few um and they are elementary students so I don't know if we've heard from them if we talked with them if we've gotten any type of uh input from them on this plan but um that should be taken to consideration as well very good idea I'd like to ask Margaret um if they've thought about how they could make the Washington Street entrance workable um that has never been I'm sorry that um that has never been part of our scope of work to look at that um I would guess given that it's retaining walls under the library garage you know with columns supporting then the the roof of the garage above you'd be talking I don't know my my rough guess over a million dollars to widen that but that's just a rough guess we'd have to look at it structurally what would be entailed I think she confused that she confused I don't know why you know if we were gonna widen the Washington Street is that what you were asking the um entrance from Wasing the entrance from Washington Street that's what I'm saying the um it it would impact the spaces on the library the drive lane into the library the the I I'm guessing they put it in that location because it worked structurally before I don't know what's Underground behind it that placed it in its current location um there's a lot to investigate if you all wanted to look into the widening that do you think there's not lot to invest no I I I think it's the it's the wrong path all together I think that David pointed out and you and I pointed out it's very simple to put traffic control devices in that and and if you think about when cars go in and out as they say they come in in the morning they go out the in the evening uh and there's some traffic I'm sure that goes in and out during the day but to have a conflict at you know 11 o' in the morning coming out of that that is you could control for the conflict and there won't be very many of them that's a good point which I didn't I didn't get it right away and now I help everybody gets it yeah is there sagger interest 90% of the traffic in the morning is going to be coming in 90% of the traffic at night is going to be going out yeah that yeah and I just think it's important for us to be very COG is in and pulling all of the US on staff pulling all the Departments that use that space because pool cars do come in and out of there at OD hours right from the building department the health department not Health but building and and DPW come out and use that space and come out of there at odd hours so we just have to be mindful there the other thing the two two issues that I think are going to complicate this discussion that we just on staff need to flag for you so that we can try and get to the bottom of them one is I take your point that there's there's an easier way to do this that doesn't involve there's an easier there's theoretically an easier way to modify that entrance with lighting and so forth the question I have is that space is already non-compliant right it's already out of compliance my understanding is with the requirements to make sure it's wide enough to have passage for people to get up into town hall so my concern is if we touch it do we have to fix it and if so what's that dollar amount um so we just need to dig into that because if not then yes this may be an easier proposition to deal with the other concern that I have is something that's been raised by the building department that we just need to we're already trying to solve for but it will be more acute if there is only one entrance and exit to that space which is um fire suppression um now that we're moving to an all electric Fleet the potential for fire is significantly higher and the potential for damage you know elect electric car fires are catastrophic for a reason they don't go out um so we need to figure out fire prevention in that space bace if we're only going to have one entrance and exit um and that may add to the cost as well so I just want to be very clear that we if we're moving in that direction that we make sure that we cover those bases I wonder if uh the solution might be an emergency exit on the Harvard Street on that would you know you have a crash gate basically that so that somebody can Vehicles can get out if necessary so so you'd build the ex the entrance build the exit but do not use it on a regular basis EX worried about getting vehicles out or people well both um yeah I mean you know I want to figure out how to get if there's got to be a space big enough to get some sort of fire suppression equipment in there okay okay as I said there I think there are solutions to all of these things that just need to be I had thought that Bernard had asked the question about could you make the School Street entrance workable for the school no a complete redesign of the building okay my question was you know what is our experience at school Street to see whether you know that that could sort of inform us as to what the possible um experience on harvest stre would be yeah um okay it sounds like people want to remand this is a public hearing though if you want if members of the public want to be heard I think you should thank you oh and lap has his hand raised yes um thank you very much uh lapen building department um person who's ultimately responsible for this for the town of uh uh Brook line uh it sounds from a construction management standpoint from a from a builder standpoint any change is going to be uh any change is going to disrupt the the flow uh we have 60% construction documents right now uh and I I don't know if we're going to change anything uh for my own selfish reasons I hope we don't uh but if you do come to a design change it it could possibly mean that the project is delayed and I just want to keep that uh with uh whatever decision you guys make uh for the good of the town uh but selfishly from my standpoint if we have to go redesign it uh it's going to incur some cost from the designer standpoint it may incur costs from a budget standpoint and it may delay the project because we have to do an examination for example if we do the if we do try to look at the Washington Street exit that's going to probably cause a huge delay not uh and not just delay in time but also in in money uh and Market probably agree with me on that and I know Adams definitely agree with me on that so I just want to make that mindful for uh for the board and for the selectman on on this meeting thank you I think in that case we need to quantify that at the transportation board if this is to be remanded then that needs to be taken into consideration but I think the that obviously the the the sentiment of the board is that this needs to go back and need to have a second look taken at it can I just want to ask a question wait let me let me ask um would you sorry I know you I feel your pain I have this pain problem sorry about that I'll stay here now I mean do you what what would you do in order to address the issues that lap brought up as well as other issues in terms of you know what are the cost of making a change that would allow entrance and exit on Washington Street I mean what What's Your Capacity to even well that I mean my our our capacity is limited what I would do is ask the the design the building committee as well as the design committee that are already assembled and already working to take this on and expedite it and make a decision so I would ask them to speak with with lap and and and Margaret and all the Architects on that commission and and those are the experts and if they say the project cannot bear this additional cost or The Pledger cannot bear this additional time we have to do Harvard Street then that will probably be the transportation board's recommendation although unwittingly unwillingly but if they say they can make Washington Street work we'll make Washington Street work so I just I'm I'm gonna just pull the peers for a moment and just see it's sending it back it sounds like we're going to go back into this analysis and we're going to come back with well we got really got to do Harvard Street is there any appetite of three members of the board to say there is no Harvard Street solution make Washington Street work which would be an acceptance of the appeal so um I wouldn't mind going there right except that all the questions that are being raised get sort of pushed behind or push back and and they have to deal with them at a later time that's not how we should operate I I have to say I appreciate lack's comments but what I what I keep saying and I will say one more time because it gets obnoxious after a while is that there are some very simple solutions to the issue of fire suppression a crash gate and an exit that isn't used regularly on Harvard Street um the traffic conflict coming down the throat in uh on uh on the Washington Street entrance uh a set of Lights to guide people um and recognizing that the traffic flows are basically in your favor there are so many things we could think about that don't require any more design than sitting down and figuring out how to wire the lights uh and I I really think we should focus on or that I would hope that the transportation board when you ask your your experts ask them to look at that not at chopping away they they don't that they don't need to take concrete walls out to do any of that David I agree with Mike completely I'm a little concerned that if all we do is remand without narrower instructions that we're going to come back and have this exact same discussion whereas I think what I'm hearing from four of us at least is that we would like to look at more Simple Solutions that are not particularly costly to resolve these issues now I do hear what uh Chaz is saying about the legality of whether if just by installing the lights all of a sudden we have to bring everything up into code that's another story so I think that's a question worth getting an answer to so for that reason I wouldn't quite be prepared for what you were suggesting a moment ago about just saying let's approve the appeal but that's my lone hesitation if the answer to that question were no you would not have to bring it all up to code then I would be on board with your proposal Margaret Margaret yeah I just wanted to mention that the we've already uh submitted for Planning and Zoning for the turn down set um and we've already made the modifications to all the doc doents to eliminate the left turn lane um and obviously the the Harvard Street entrance has been on the documents for three years I believe um but I just want to note the um the time frame you know we're supposed to finalize within 30 days the the Planning and Zoning submission so if uh there's there's just a schedule pressure to have the answer that's all and and what what what is the timeline for having the answer of taking a remand and and we have a meeting scheduled in June but it's going to take a a whole lift from everybody here including the building commission and all those design commissions I mentioned I mean folks's GNA have to do this if if if that's the intent of the of the highest selected board in the town that's what we'll do so I guess I I'm thinking that um in terms of the design of the school you'd still design a a entrance and exit from Harvard Street the question is whether we use it uh isn't that the issue yeah yeah um so Margaret I don't think that there that that there would it doesn't seem that there would be a a a scheduling problem or a timing problem if that's the case um certainly on the if we are to uh leave the entrance there from a building design standpoint that would not have an you know there'd be but if you're going to eliminate the expanded sidewalk area you know we have to go uh back up and redraw um and resub resubmit and all that you know redesign and try to improve the what's already gone through planning and already been presented that you know there's just a lot of process that's already happened around it that that has to be now redone through planning um but but the redesign is only at the sidewalk right if that if the decision is to eliminate the left turn lane and keep the garage entrance but not the curb cut then yes it would just be a a landscape redesign well you need a curb cut wouldn't you well go drive over the drive over the Cur emergency yeah you don't actually want a curb cut right you don't want if I can interject I think that's where we're trying to get at what is the scope that we need to adjust to uh there's been mentioned of you know eliminating that curve cut there's been the talk about you know widening Washington Street you know uh if we just get some direction on how to proceed and and whether it's no no alterations to the to the footprint of the building where where we keep the curve cut if if we have to investigate Washington Street that's going to be a long tedious thing where you know we're going to have to give probes we're going to have to do other things to it you know that's a total redesign um that's that's our fear right now from the design team standpoint is that we may have to go back to the drawing board so um I'm confused uh if we say well essentially leave Washington Street as it is and the sidewalk as it is and and go ahead with the um uh with the exit uh even if the exit isn't going to be used except in an emergency there's already a street there what kind of redesign and and you know you don't have to do a boring to leave to leave a street in place yeah that's fine and we I think Margaret I'm not I don't want to speak for you but I think uh we can live with that well I would just want clear Direction so we can proceed for our deadline on June 12th to get this revised if it if you're asking us to revise the documents for the final submission to Planning and Zoning that it be clear where the edge of the curb cut is going to be and where and and whether not the Cur sorry the curb the are we at the existing curve line or are we at the is that what you're saying and then do we provide a curb cut or not I guess we joh thank you um uh I think actually the the best decision we could make for Margaret and the design team is to say uh that we we we find it unacceptable to eliminate the left turn lane off of um Harvard Street and to make a you know major entrance exit um via a curb cut um on on Harvard Street um everybody's heard what we're discussing here we're discussing a sort of emergency ENT exit um without a curb cut uh and that would not necessitate eliminating um the left turn lane on Harvard Street um that to me is the right decision to make and if we make it now they can proceed accordingly right away they don't have to be in doubt um I will say that um it the lesson of this experience which I'm going to say just goes back to two meetings ago of the transportation board is that being told it has to be this way because we've already designed it this way um is not a good process for for good decision making and and the first meeting that the transportation board had on this where it was voted to eliminate that left turn on Harvard Street and to accept all of these other changes as it happens there hadn't even been a traffic study of the uh Auburn Street intersection so decisions were being made that were going to have huge impacts Elsewhere on Harvard street without any data without any study in hand that showed how you would deal with all of the left turning traffic onto Auburn Street as a consequence of this decision and the major reason it was done was people who expressed doubt from the Transportation board about this plan swallowed their doubts because they were being told we can't afford any delay in this project and um a bad in my opinion a bad decision was made many of those same Transportation board people and and Brian included um when they got a chance to sort of see this um a second time in light of all of the presentations Express their own doubts about whether they had made the right decision so I I think our decision should be that um that that plan for a major entrance exit curb cut on Harvard Street and elimination of the left turn that just won't fly yeah uh Paul yeah I and I appreciate what John just said I just he summarized at the beginning and then he went through that and I lost what what what I think we're asking to be done so one we're saying um keep the design of a Harvard Street emergency it's going to be an emergency exit there'll be no curb cut uh there will be no left uh we will allow a left-and turn as it currently exists from Harvard Street onto School Street um and then three uh the Washington Street entrance exit uh we'd like you to explore technology signaling in order to facilitate that uh that uh to make that a workable solution is that what I'm hearing we're we're doing okay yeah if I can add one of the wrinkle to it I appreciate the comment was made way back at the beginning that um widening the sidewalk makes a more pleasant experience for pedestrians I will say right now um although the new school is going to have even more of a wall uh facade there uh it's not particularly Pleasant to walk by a concrete building to begin with so I don't think we're losing an awful lot however if there is a way to retain the left turn uh on Harvard Street and make a smaller uh uh increase in the width of the sidewalk that would be great and I don't see that that is going to delay the construction of the school I agree with that it's my understanding that the left turn lane is already um not a full width of a left turn line um so we could not take more um from the street then then that's the answer yeah that's an easy answer actually unfortunate but easy are there any other guidance that we're giving the transportation board on remand do it quick do it quickly well well excuse me now are we remanding or are we saying no no we're remand to what let remanding with guidance let's let them do their job okay yeah okay okay you got your instructions Bri need to vote on this is there there is a the still public hearing if members of the public want to be heard uh Regina and if members of the public who are attending virtually want to use the hand raise feature we can call Ryan you can borrow my cane if you need it uh hi Regina fry from South bookine and without fear of a single contradiction I'm the only person here who was at the opening of the original Pier School in 1972 pretty sure I'm the only one having said that as a certified and experienced teacher at the time I took one look and said oh this is bad design bad Design Within two months they'll be back in for walls and within two months they were back for walls but that didn't solve the whole problem that was a minor fix having said that it was all about let's be original let's do something original the teachers were excited about doing something different none of these things were experienced none of it and I'm really concerned tonight to hear well G we got a hurry I couldn't agree more with John vanak about how bad decisions are made when you have that kind of thing why didn't they anticipate that why weren't they here sooner it's do it right do it right and it's it is a bad decision to have that curb cut for a left on Harvard I go there all the time probably also more than you guys do in a car cuz I'm from South Brooklyn I can only get here in a car having said that there's one other thing that I know back in the 70s and 80s the when the PE school open they only entered from Washington Street and the school is still basically roughly the same number of cars it's all going to be comp commu computer excuse me commuters who are teachers and staff um it is a highly walkable pedestrian school always has been uh which is one beautiful the 81% I I used to think it was higher than that having said that there's no good reason why they can't used to drive into the parking garage and if you were going to town hall you took a right and it was split and if you wanted to go to the school you or were required to be a Parker at the school you went to the left was that simple it really was that simple and somewhere along the line in the last 20 years I noticed they had closed that off so it was done it was done successfully um this all the reasons that were objected here are real reasons so I do hope that you will um not be intimidated by some artificial deadline that can probably be expanded Etc and I agree with Brian he needs to get a an Emergency meeting together of all the relevant departments thank you so as I understanded we're really not imposing or or uh creating problems with respect to the deadline because it's we're not making any changes U to the design uh of the building um just a question of whether we can figure a way of working with that design and not use Harvard Street I think that's the big the big question is the one thing that David raised which is if we make modifications even superficial ones to the Washington Street entrance do we then own the non-conforming issue and then do we have to do something with it and if that's if the answer that question is yes then I think we need to come back to you quickly and make that clear and try and brainstorm Solutions um so that's just to avoid delays but also make sure that we have you know we can we can make decisions the the will of the board is clear to staff there's not a desire for an accident on Harvard Street or for the lination at left turn lane so we're going to think as creatively as we can to find a solution to that Jos that's a that's a good point I'm glad David brought that up as well I just want to make sure my understanding of what we're proposing for the Washington Street no structural changes right right literally a beam that flashes when a car goes by it the stoplight says don't go right go stop yeah if that's that's feasible if if it's feasible and if it's feasible in two does that trigger right code issues yeah we're GNA try and do the minimum amount of of alteration necessary to avoid triggering code issues that's the AIM you have folks with their hands raised online Okay um Kate could you promote uh whoever has their hands raised Bob Allen Bob Allen okay start with Bob Allen's being promoted and then we have Richard tuck okay thank you all for the opportunity um I won't take up a lot first of all my name is Robert Allen at the lot prac 300 Washington Street in Brook line Village and uh I'm here representing initially I was here representing the owner of 68 Harvard Street who had some concerns about the uh he he has a loading zone which would be about 1015 feet away from this the the proposed uh exit on Harvard Street and uh he already had some concerns about his loading zone and how it impact safety but subsequent to that I was approached by a number of businesses in Brookline Village and I think the biggest concern is is really um you know are we doing this in a vacuum or we we looking at things at a ho for instance I'm glad I'm glad uh select board member Warren brought up St Mary's School St Mary's School is not only a school but there's a there's a uh former High School in the back that's going uh through an adjustment period that would perhaps perhaps increase the traffic on Homer Street which could impact the part which could impact traffic on Harvard Street which would impact traic on School Street and have an ripple effect also I'm concerned you know there's a proposal to stop all or prevent all parking spaces in Brooklin Village particularly in the area where all these bus businesses are like in front of my office and in front and and are you know we take away those spots we take away four spots and I would suggest to you that Brookline Village is um different than all our other commercial areas in town we're really struggling there's a lot of empty storefronts um so so taking away any parking spaces would be tough on businesses and just from listen a practical standpoint um many of you know I've sat in your seats before I was there when we did a huge renovation to the library added some parking underneath I was there when we did I chaired doing the whole town hall over we made some significant adjustments to the basement never touched the garage and it's worked so I I'm I'm a lot of cons I have a lot of concern saying oh my God once we touch this we own it we've owned it for a long time and it's worked for a very long time I'll also say this I do a little bit of zoning in this town I've I've come across these situations uh Mike is absolutely right there's plenty of Technology available I've done things I've done done a lot of projects with more cars than this we can make this work we don't need to have new exits we don't need to create new problems let's just make it work we we're spending a ton of money here as a taxpayer we're paying a ton of money here let's do it right and let's not create more problems I appreciate you remanding it back and I have the utmost faith in uh Brian Kane to come through with the solution thank you all uh the next person signed up is uh Richard tuck we'll promote Richard Richard has been proponed uh Richard you can unmute your microphone and turn on your video if you're comfortable and your three minutes will begin Sor sorry about that um Richard Richard tuck uh we're the owners of 68 Harbor Street happen to be the building that Bob just referenced uh and I wasn't really going to speak tonight but I'm not quite sure why you would allow or to continue to leave an entrance on Harvard Street without a curb cut sounds like you're still going to require taking away of the parking spaces because you're going to be leaving it as an emergency exit and you're not going to be able to leave a car there but but more more than that as a bad idea it seems like you're allowing what appears to be a bad idea and that many people are opposed to to remain and that is the facade on Harvard Street with an exit it's um in in the to not direct The Architects to at least look at what the possibilities are for that space in a month or two month or however long it is seems to be a bit fool hearty I won't take any more of your time thank you for all of your work anyone else it's interesting comment oh I'm sorry yeah no it is interesting it it I would say that there are ways to screen an exit so that it's clearly not an active exit uh and I think it's still taking away a parking space it's still it's still you might lose a parking space you might need two I don't think you need three because you don't have a site quite the sight line issue when in emergency there are many things that you can do uh that you wouldn't otherwise do so uh it's a consideration uh it's also um uh it's again something for the transportation board to to think about do they want to you know we we we rely on them to come back with something that that makes sense any other hands raised at this time there are 13 attendees and approximately six in person no one is using the hand rais feature or indicating they'd like to make further comment okay uh let's close the hearing and um move on to making a decision um I think that the uh the idea or or the um board wants to remand to the uh Transportation board uh to rethink this uh within you certain guidelines that have been laid out by Paul um which are the keep the design uh of the building as is with the Harvard Street exit uh no curb cut uh no um uh no wider sidewalk on Harvard Street and figuring out how to U bring in technology to make Washington Street uh a workable entrance and exit um location and Brian Kane wants to add to that or no no I just want to clarify so um I thought we wanted to make the wide walks as wide as possible without modifying the street width yeah I think we were told by the by Margaret though that that's as wide as we get uh so I think the the answer to that question may be an easy no on mood Point okay or or what we have now is as wide as it gets right thank you want to make sure I got it just ask the question that's all and also we will we will continue to allow the left turn from Harvard Street onto School Street y okay um okay all in favor of remanding with those conditions please indicate by saying I John Van scet hi um Mike Sandman hi Paul Warren hi uh David fman I shair votes I thank you okay thanks very much hey next uh we have uh we we've left a placeholder in our agenda for a um discussion of a warrant article that may come up it turns out that we have a budget amendment that has been submitted um with respect to the school Department's budget may I just say thanks to the petitioners before they leave the room Barbara yeah um yeah I mean it's because of the petitioners that we had this discussion tonight and I think we may owe them some thanks for catching some things that needed to be caught okay uh how are we going to do this um have the petitioner the petitioner is actually the uh the proponent of this uh amendment is in the uh virtual audience uh Mr Miller uh Bob if you wanted to speak on this I think the board would welcome hearing from you but you don't have to this is article 10 let me give a brief description uh this is uh an amendment was submitted this morning at around 11:30 or so uh proposing an amendment to article 10 the budget uh the proposed amendment would add 1, 79,2 to the school Department's budget with no offsets elsewhere are you looking to approach the board are you talking to me oh yeah no sorry Bob there was someone in someone in the in the room um but yes you're the uh you're the proponent of this proposed amendment if you wanted to speak on it the board the board usually allows what 10 minutes uh um on something like this 10 minutes um and then we'll you have a discussion and take action okay I don't think I'm gonna need nearly 10 minutes I want to start with a couple I intend not to thank you Bernard um so I'm Bob Miller I'm a town meeting member in precin and I want to start with a couple of apologies I apologize that I'm on my phone and I hope uh uh the audio is coming through okay um and I also want to apologize that this is uh something reaching you uh at such a last minute in such a last minute way um it's not good for me totally not good for you so couple of uh quick apologies um you know I'll be brief I I think that this is something that we need to um preserve a foundation of uh as best we can of World Language we have Educators who have been committed to the um to the town to the community to the schools for many years are you know excellent Educators and um and I think that due to the fact that this is something that was pass in an this being the K 5 World language program was passed in an override in 2009 and so for 15 years the community has been paying for this program and if it completely goes away it's going to be really hard to build something back and if we can retain some experts and perhaps um have a u a fifth grade program in addition to the 6 through eight um maybe a fourth grade program depending on you know how how things play out that we're not going to be able to retain everybody we're not going to be able to continue forward with the program K to five the way it's been but I think it's really important to retain some of the core that we can then build on and you know I think that that's you know I think that we need to give the community that's been paying for this an opportunity to um recommit to supporting this and to doing it in a way that the school committee um and experts and and the World Language Department the World Language Educators um can help to to put together to present to the community um we and and you know I want to point out that I this is in no way um a critique of the school committee or um you know anybody in the school department I I think that you know people have done their best to um to make things work and I think that this is an important conversation to have a town meeting I think that we in Brookline struggle with the budget year after year and I think we owe it to the community we owe it to ourselves as town meeting to recognize when we have an issue especially something that's going to go away that's been funded for so long um to to allow that to have more of a conversation with more people able to weigh in so I promise not to use uh 10 minutes and I think I've used way less than that although my experience is that I start talking and I lose track of time so so um I want to thank you for taking this up and again I want to apologize that uh this is coming at a at a late hour but but I think it's important that it get addressed and I think it's important that the community get to um to preserve a program that was really exciting for a lot of people in this community so thank you for hearing me thank you um do you want me to stay on for questions or or I would like you to stay on qu for a few questions from the select board um absolutely I'd like to start off by you know asking you for the record because I think the select board already knows um how are we going to pay for this 1 Point uh 079 million dollar expenditure yeah no that's a great question I we you know we I spend time we there were a bunch of us working on this and at various times we talked about where to take the money from and you know I have to say that while I feel like my knowledge is much deeper with the schools having been you know an educator in the Brookline schools for 20 years um with the fact that over that time we've given up a lot of programs um a lot of things that we had that we no longer have in an effort to keep what was essential and make the budget work and I do not think that um taking the money from anybody else would have been fair and so the the plan is that our and I understand why we are conservative with our estimates on revenue and I'm not um criticizing that practice but I think that it's reasonable for us to assume that that conservative estimate will yield the money that we need for this and um you know that's that's my proposal for how that will will be rectified in the falltime meeting so so I guess I'm not understanding so you're just saying that we should change our projections to be less conservative so that uh there's a source of Revenue that uh we create by making that change in our projections that would pay for this well um the moderator Neil Linsky has said that that's not um an option we don't have the ability to make that change we can make change to the allotment of funds but not to the projected revenue of uh that's coming in and so it's something that is not formally part of The Proposal but it's expectation John um hi Bob John Van John uh are are you um sort of a solo act in this um I I mean I I know you as a union official um is this something that the union is is requesting I'm I'm acting alone I mean I've been working with a bunch of other people and I guess I should have said at the uh front when I I retired from uh being a teacher two years ago so I I'm no longer employed by the town or part of the Union um and my next question is um have you brought this before the school committee to ask them if they could have an additional million plus dollars um is this how they would use it because I seem to recall that the um reasons that uh were given for the vote to terminate the programs that you want to to essentially save and bring back went beyond you know a simple we don't have the money and we have to make a very tough decision but they made that decision on the basis of how they wanted to spend the money they have and with some consideration given to you know pedagogical issues and so on um and not just because we're desperate we don't have money we got to you know cut something um I I have no reason to beli that this is how they would want to spend the money if if we could come up with an extra million plus dollars for them yeah so the um I don't want to speak for I've I've had conversations with many of the school committee members there all of the school Comm committee members have had individual conversations um they have not to best of my know I don't think there's been a meeting of the school committee to discuss this I do think that you're correct that there's um some real concern I'm but based on the conversation that they had at the time that they voted five to four not to go forward with World language program there was a lot of discussion about you know that maybe they could do a fifth grade or a fourth grade or whatever um so you know I um you know I would hope that this you know can pass and that I truly believe that there's a way to um to um to go forward with this and um I can't speak to the school committee and and I don't feel like I should relate individual conversations um I don't think that's my place but I have so so no I can't I can't give you assurances on that David uh John is correct that there were considerations Beyond finances for eliminating the world language program for the lower grades but to me we don't even we shouldn't even get to that question about what the school committee would do anytime that there's a proposal to make such a significant budget cut without identifying where the funds would come from and I think the implication is that it would come from the so-called rainy day fund for a recurring expense that's not a sound fiscal practice and that would adver L impact our AAA Moody's rating as well and so I I think that to be Frank this is Dead on Arrival just on those philosophical grounds that this is not how a responsible municipality passes a budget you don't say let's add a million to something without identifying where it's going to come from right and thank you uh David I agree Bob you said uh you weren't criticizing uh the um practice of being conservative uh with regard to local receipts with regard to revenue I kind of Imagine where else money would come from except local receipts parking meters and things of that sort but um uh you've just You Dropped a Bomb on it by suggesting uh that that's where that all we need to do is well we're raise the revenue estimate and we have a balanced budget that is honestly I'm stunned uh that at the audacity that anybody would think that okay we need to you know I want to do something else so I'm just going to raise the amount of money that I think is going to come in that that makes it's it's really amazingly irresponsible well you know I do I there are you know it's been um we've underestimated by a large amount for the last number of years and you know there there's you know there's evidence to support that it's not the crazy uh thinking that you're presenting it as CH and I believe that I believe that some of that is in the is in the document that I submitted right it's really interesting actually um because in opposition to The Cutting of the world language program I watched that school committee meeting and the president of the beu came and spoke in favor of retaining the RO languages program and he said that he reached out to Union leadership in all other AAA rated communities in Massachusetts and discovered they followed the exact same practices with regards to how they budget their revenue and how they deal with free cash he described it as quote the same story with startling consistency so if all 15 AAA Bond rated communities in Massachusetts are doing something wrong I think we would know yeah I don't think we're doing something wrong I think revenues are correctly and conservatively rejected and I do think though that Bob's point about us on staff needing to educate folks about how Revenue works the issues that are raised there so that people understand that there's not a money pit somewhere that we can just dig into um is really important because I don't I don't think it's fair for folks to you know then be told this sort of story that the the money is there you just have to spend it um I think people should understand where the money goes and how it's used and what free cash is all about and so we're really eager to present to you as part of that retreat in June the workshop in June you know a discussion about how we project Revenue where that comes from how it's used and how we can diversify our sources of revenue to avoid long-term issues like this but I think the argument that's being Advanced is sort of a music man argument um you know I'm here to build the River City boys band um sett down um David Ju Just a follow-up question I have Chaz has there ever been a year that you're aware of where the uh receipts the revenue receipts were underestimated by over a million dollars yes oh yes yes and I want to be clear those not the the underestimations are can be let me put it back the conservative budgeting can be quite conservative can be large you know and it varies from year to year the partitioners are absolutely right last year we had a banner year for receipts and that number went up significantly so our projections went up significantly um for for the projected increase from FY 24 to FY 25 is 10% and the amendment the explanation says well that's lower than the actuals from fy19 which is pre- pandemic but that's true but the reason why that number local receipts in particular is so conservatively projected is because that's our back stop guarant guantee for free cash that's what makes us confident that we will have the money necessary to fund the reserves to fund the uh the stability fund to fund the affordable housing trust um and Brook line has until the last two years been pretty much dead on with where its free cash needs to be at around 5% uh of the prior Year's local revenues the budget amendment makes the point that these last two years have been out of whack that's right it's true we've gotten more free cash than we expected but two years doesn't a trend make um you know it's if you look back at five years 10 years um you see a remarkably consistent 5% number um and it is just that in 23 and 24 um they we we encountered um one-time events that drove sort of banner years of free cash for the same reasons that happened in other municipalities across Massachusetts um yeah mik I think it might be useful to say what were two events in particular uh that one was we uh had um a very large building permit fee for uh sort of a once in a decade uh building project on fiser hill and the other is that we have reached a settlement uh with utility companies on the um the value of their assets uh that are taxable as um uh as real property uh and th neither one of those things is going to repeat so to suggest that oh well you know this is going to happen again there's no absolutely no basis for that um the other thing is John alluded to pedagogical issues and David commented as well I I I think it's important to say and will say at uh at town meeting that the my understanding was that the uh K through um uh the K through 5 World languages program was not demonstrating uh success in the sense that kids who didn't participate in it and did take a language in high school ended up with the same competency at the end of high school as the kids who did take that program and so therefore it calls into question the value of the program and if that's if I'm mistaken about that I certainly do want to know because I don't want to repeat it uh I don't want just my own sake but if that's the case then John is absolutely right the school committee might not choose to spend that money uh in way and by the way if you give money additional money to school committee you can't encumber it in that way it has to be the school committee can spend it the way they want yeah okay um okay I think Paul I haven't had a chance to speak I did want to speak for a minute yet okay just to quickly point out one other thing I know that the school committee was very mindful of the fact that they've had an ongoing problem of of finding um world language teachers to hire so there were many things on their mind as to in that vote uh did you I um I haven't had a chance to speak yet so uh you know it is the right of any town meeting member to bring an amendment such as this um uh you know it it's it's part of our system of governance that allows it um but it doesn't mean that it should be done you know this issue of and I'm going to characterize as funding the reserves uh you know was was was raised by a field representative organizer that's his official title of the mass Teachers Association at a meeting of the school committee and that's where this narrative started that we were sandbagging revenues and uh pumping up reserves and you know that was raised quite some time ago that individual or Bob or anybody else could have come to the select board ask for a budget amendment they could have went to the advisory committee during the budget hearings ask for a budget amendment that was not done Bob um and you know waiting till the last minute essentially the last minute uh is is not really a great idea we we the last time we had a defunding effort of the budget was a defunding the police you know that was going after the police budget now we're defunding the reserves which will go after our triaa bond rating um I I I don't think it's a a good idea um I'm I'm opposed to it um you know if if there was an extra million dollars fly floating around um I'd want to give other advocacy groups opportunities seniors get a fraction teeny fraction of our budget they're grossly underfunded if there was an ex million voting run I'd want to have a debate about how to use them um so I I think this just is unfortunate that um that this is being done but I actually don't you know this I know you're bringing it but I don't think you created it um you know this came is coming from uh you know the field representative organizer from the mass Teachers Association that's the Genesis of this and he couldn't bring it to town meeting because he's not a town meeting member he couldn't make the amendment so I I I respect that you're doing it uh but I think it's just a bad idea uh to be to be uh I'm not being up I'm no that's what I'm saying I understand that he's not he's not doing it he's carrying it um but I just I don't think this is a good idea to be doing it at this uh late stage um I would certainly want to be able to have a broader discussion about if there was an extra million lying around how that would be used um and for all the reasons mentioned you know we have zero control over what the school committee does with money um and they've already made the case to say that uh you know World Language is not effective in the lower grades and they made the decision as our elect officials uh for for the school committee uh in the budget they've allocated the funds the way that they saw most fit so okay I'm oppos this okay um I get the sense of the board that we we would would not uh um wait a minut I'll let you speak Regina because we are early early in the evening um are we well compared to previous meetings thank you I think it's been a good discussion um one thing I said earlier I was the only one here in 72 but everybody here was here last year when 126,000 was taken at the last minute to be proposed for the budget and I remember the bruhaha that caused this is over a million so it doesn't seem like it's the right process and I agree with all of you having said that I remember that the world language program was an override what happens to that money have we spent it all so far uh what happens to an override that is a program for a specific earmark program that suddenly is no more I think I'd like to know the answer so when an override passes the town commits to um only to increasing the levy the town historically has said that as a matter of practice that it will maintain the operations for which it has allocated those funds for the duration of the override term so usually our override stretch for a three-year period phased in over a three-year period but the only text of the override is we are here approving the an increase in the tax levy um that's what the voters vote on so as a matter of practice what's usually happened is that if programs are unsuccessful then the money goes back into the general Levy for general purposes um and it's allocated according to our regular Revenue policies but it doesn't go back to the taxpayers by reduction no okay thank you oh my thank you okay um I just I wanted to add one thing because I wanted I I had a conversation with Bob the the petitioner on this right before and I just wanted to emphasize something because you said you know we shouldn't beat up on the petition I think that's right I think this is brought in perfectly good faith as part of yeah yeah and and I don't want to disparage him in any way you know the I think the argument and the process are are are flawed but I want it to make should be very clear yeah I there's there's there's nothing I see nothing but good faith in the the amendment I just think the process and the and the narrative behind some some of the as Paul pointed out some of the the the procedural entanglements here are are more complicated and they just need to be addressed yeah thank you U Bob's an important and valuable member of our community and has for many many decades and uh I don't want anyone to think that we think any different about him so yeah um but no I think um I'd like to we we do have to vote on this we have to treat it like we treat Warren articles and so I'd like to move uh no action on the budget amendment uh presented to us um all in favor please indicate by saying I John bco hi Michael Sand hi Paul Warren hi David Perman hi and chair vsai thank you Bob for bringing this um thank you for all your service to the town over many many years um yeah but we we sometimes disagree we disagree sometimes and I'll still love you absolutely and I I I do appreciate you know the kind words and and the depersonalization of um of your arguments so thank you for that thank you okay um unless there is anyone who would like to speak u in public comment at the end of our meeting I don't believe there are is there anyone um you there there are four members uh on on line uh one in person no one using the feature okay so that ends tonight's meeting thank you everyone all right e