despise wisdom and instruction Lord let us have um let us begin this meeting Lord with acknowledging God that you are God and that we live in a holy and righteous sphere of you um and we also know that we are truly and deeply loved by you so we trust your guidance and your wisdom um as we undertake this meeting this morning thank you for your presence here with us in your name we pray amen amen right at this time I will open these SCH board Workshop meeting for January 23rd 2024 uh I'm sorry let's start with the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge alance to the flag of the United States of America and toic for it stands one nation indivisible withy and justice for all all right so this morning our agenda is going to be a little bit out of order because we have some special guests here with us to make some presentations so um we will begin with the presentation for bonding from board and associ I we're going to start synergistics oh sorry another change so we'll begin with synergistics cost savings presentation which is number two on our agenda um so centerct is our energy um our energy partner that we've worked with since 2016 and just wanted them to come in and give a presentation update you um on what they do and what we've done over the past couple years so I'll turn it over to Mr Steve Jones says Joe Cobra up there and I just tell Bryce if this goes really bad remember I'm Joe cob I I like that thank you for later the year my name is Steve Jones uh I've been a synergistic about seven years um I was in the private or the public sector um public servant for 28 years in Alabama I live in momy Alabama uh how I got to synergistic is we hired synergistic uh before I retired looking to reduce our carbon foot PRM looking for ways to put money back into our budget which is a finite uh opportunity in the in the governmental world and we saw that energy reduction we could be better stewards of the energy we're using and uh when I retired um the company came to me and asked if I'd like to uh travel as an ambassador for the company and and that's what I've been doing so I've been with the Clay County program for um all but 6 months y'all had signed with sistic CTIC 6 months before I came on and then I took over this as part of my territory if you call it and I'm very proud to be here to uh to share some of the fruits of the labor of child of [Music] God am I supposed to point this [Music] okay I think it's' so I I um I see some faces I've seen before but I think there's some new board members that may not have had any um any any solid updates or any information about synergistic so I'm going to go at 10,000 ft kind of what we do uh as an organization we've been around for about 36 years about 1,600 clients throughout the country school districts is what uh we started at founder of our company Dr Spears who is still the uh acting uh Chief administrator was a school board member in witch falls back in the 80s um they got a grant Federal grant to get air conditionings put in the schools uh they didn't I can't imagine not having air conditioning in which t fall but they did not uh and that was a great gift but there is no such thing as a free lunch they did not have the funding in the budget to pay for the utility cost for the new Air Conditioning he put together a program of energy conservation and optimization and that's how the company got started and like I said 36 years later we are um in every state but Hawaii and I would love to get that territory I volunteer a couple times but I think it's kind out of my Ranch uh we have on uh on average throughout the country throughout all of our partners higher ed municipalities uh and K12 is about 24% reduction uh you'll see as we get through this I'm going to be very brief that uh Clay County is at 22% on the cusp of 23 so we have done some really good things here when I say we I mean the district we are just the conduit for yall success um a little bit about what we do that that makes a program successful I'm not going to touch on all of these uh one of the things that I do want to talk about is Comfort vents marking Clay County your District did an unbelievable job because we see it across the country coming out of Co there were so many districts and no so many school districts that weren't able to get back to where they were preco on how they ran their facilities and they're still struggling with that in a lot of districts and for FL Georgia Alabama the territories I'm in uh Clay County was your your maintenance and facility Department was very very very efficient in getting back to that one of the main things about our program is that the degradation of the comfort of the learning environment is non-negotiable we will not reduce the energy consumption by Heating and Cooling everybody to a level that they're not comfortable uh and that that is a a very big bench mark of bars fault Diagnostics we've been able to work with your BMS and EMS groups which is the controls for all of your facilities I have a very good organization here uh we are able to augment what they do to find better ways more efficient ways to find these savings and it's been a very very very strong partnership and we're proud of that um and then the final thing I'm going to talk about this and and Bryce can attest to this our program is 100% funded through the savings the line item that you have in your utility budget that number is already going out the door it is already going out the door our fees come out of what you're paying your utility companies we guarantee that and we will continue to guarantee that and then on top of that savings goes back into your general fund so you're taking a good portion of what you're paying currently utilities and putting that back into the district uh just a little bit more I want to talk about technology we have a very robust technology package here but the core mission of what we do although technology is fantastic uh the the basis of what we do is human behavior we have uh energy or energy specialist who are we call it boots on the ground I hate that cliche but I'm going to say it the people that are out in the field I am proud to say here in Clay County since the program started we have had three Contin jollies as our energy specialist that are all products of Clay County Schools I think Rosanne was a teacher is that correct uh her niece was the original energy specialist and her husband now is currently the energy specialist we do that and I and I emphasize that because our program is education over dictation and I wish I learned that with my two daughters growing up as a part of raising them uh we explain what we do and why we do it as opposed to coming in and saying this is what we're going to do and the leadership through the superintendent uh we have talked about that that is a much better fit for a program if you can explain what you're doing and having people that work on the ground here that know the culture know the people know the atmosphere really makes this a much better and successful program that's our group that's Mr Keller over here the aie are you from Australia no I'm Jo cber but uh this is a team we have the two energy specialist here of course Mar being the lead energy specialist but we look at it as an inverted pyramid the energy Specialists are on the bottom of the pyramid but they are supported by a pleora of of specialist boilers HVAC Irrigation in the district if you have a problem in a school with a boiler that you are having issues with our program at no extra cost we will send somebody in there to get a handle on that and help augment your team to get those working very dedicated to what we're doing here little some key facts here 22% total reduction on the cust of 23 I didn't put a decimal in there audits we've done over 16,600 audits an audit is when an energy specialist goes in to a facility at night on the weekends during holidays shutdowns to inspect what we expect we are in there to make sure that the building has recovered the way it should be it comes back on when it should be but making sure that that equipment is running the way it should be to get the Optimal Performance enery star certification everybody thinks of energy star is a little sticker on the refrigerator at lows it says it's energy STAR certified what means that our world is that you have 28 schools that are in the top 25 percentile of all the schools in the United States of America for Energy Efficiency and conservation that's a big thing um custic has been the Department of Education partner of the year which is not an application process it is chosen by the department of energy uh for 15 years 85% of all the schools in America that are energy star Serv if or our partners that's a big part of what we do and we're going to continue with that um it's a small process not a small process I'm going to make it small we bring in a professional engineer we study we put in the application to the Department of energy and then the certification comes in a second maybe even tertiary um part of that is federal grants applying for federal grants uh it is really good to be able to say that you have energy STAR certified buildings and you have a cified energy star program within your organization $1 million over1 million in total energy saved today what that means is since 2016 this number had we not been able to have the success within the organization and had the support from the organization that's $1 million that would have gone to the utility companies that stayed within the district I think those are good numbers the department of energy Florida is one of the few states in the nation that requires districts to report their energy usage cost per square foot throughout the uh throughout the state as we see here in 2016 Clay County was right at the state average and it was a dollar help me out Steve about a dollar 13 a square foot in 2016 today and 2022 was the last reporting period Clay County is almost is 19.2% below the state average the state puts it into four quadrants the lowest quadrant being 93 to a115 the highest being a137 to a164 Clay County is in the first quadrant you are in the best quadrant a better fact cu the department of energy uh the state only requires gas and electricity to be reported they don't require water Clay County in 2022 and it's going to be lower when 2023 comes out is spending 96 cents a square foot for electricity within the district State average is about a120 it it's it is and that trend has gone down exponentially um you have neighbors around here I will not call any names that are having the same providers that are not even in the ballpark so I think that is a very very uh admirable thing to talk about um electricity has been a very Vol volatile part of uh your budgeting process I'm sure that Clay County has seen that um I was reading last week that uh it's fpnl and Clay Electric are either too big clay Clay Electric and a little bit of um J in there so Clay Electric in January January 3rd the article came out U article out of Jacksonville that there will be another rate increase in 2024 January and I I'm probably telling you what you know but when a utility company says we've only raised our rates 3 or 4% which they will tell you that and they are not telling you an untruth there's three buckets in your utility when you get your bill at home the rate that the provider charges and then the cost of fuel and then the bill so yes I live in Alabama I live in Alabama Alabama Power we have two sources of Lights Alabama power or candles it is a monopoly we have to have Alabama power but for them to say that they've raised their rates 4% that is a true statement the rate has only gone up 4% the natural gas and fuel cost has G up 47% so with all of that Klay county has been able to actually reduce their energy spend even with the increases U kind of getting back to that a little bit more I'm getting off in the weeds here know I'm getting long winded but just to look at what the rates have done water and sewer and electricity we've had 16 and 133% increases that is just stct from the bills um had we not in cooperation with the district be able to get to where we're at we would spend another $1.8 million here in utilities so again the a lot of our partners say to us just please keep us even keep us where we were last year we're able to take this even further down in Klay County and again it is not a sistic program it is the district that is doing this we are just the guiding conduit for with this it's a cultural change um Joe cobber put this slide together I shall put it on him if we look at the amount of energy that you used the eui uh eui is is energy use intensity that is how much energy you use in a building uh it is therms for gas it is KBT used for electricity when we started this is where you were using Kow hours even through Co we had a dip and this is what I was talking about earlier we dip down in Co but then you were able to recover and maintain the ler than you were the year before covered which in in all of that a lot of districts their knee-jerk reaction was we're going to turn everything on and run it wide open all the time during Co because that's what somebody said do cold air doesn't call it Mo mold that's the mindset of everybody I challenge everybody that's got a late place to go down to your beer fridge open it up and there's mold all around the rim so that is not the best way to hand off mold Clay County saw that the facility team the maintenance team saw that and we were able to get it back to where it should be here's where we are as of October uh because our reporting periods lag again we're at 17 million kwh that should be month month four we made a typo there so if you extrapolate that out so that's July August September October which are the four at least three of the four toughest months in utility spend extrapolate this out we're going to be somewhere in the 55.5 num so again trending in the right direction now people think and it's just pragmatic to think this how much more juice can you get out of the program as As you move along we are constantly finding ways to get more efficient within the district you have 45 schools is that is that correct there's constantly ways that we can continue to find ways to to perform and with your help and your guidance we are doing that again that this is back on the eui numbers that that probably bore you to death I get excited about it I'm I'm weird 22.5% reduction again that is that is a very very strong number and we see the trend is going in the right direction obviously with the co dip audits again we talked about that earlier this is what we feel that the advantage of having energy Specialists that they're only job they are dedicated to the proposition of energy reduction these audits you can see that 60% of what we do in your facilities is after hours about in Alabama an employee 40.1 hours is overtime that's why we hire the energy specialist there on our payroll because when we say we need to do audits on a Saturday or a Sunday or over Christmas break to make sure that these schools are shut down we have control of that that's why most of our audits are in unoccupied time and it's also to get facilities back if you have an event um I don't know how much you rent out much of your facilities BR do yall do a lot of that is it in kind or do y all charge Char charge okay so a lot of times when you have events like that we are able to through our analytics be able to tell you exactly what the cost was for that facility for that event and that's good to know I came from the world from of an elected official we love the word in kind ink kind got a lot of boats we'll just give it to you and we'll call it in kind but we like to put a price tag on that and we're able to do that here what we do these are our latest we we meet regularly Steve and this team meet regularly and we talk about conservation measures so here's just a few of the things that we're working towards uh low use irrigation meters we want to be able to get a better handle on the BAS system so that we can see how the equipment's running look at what the protocol is for runtime we've got it we've got it take really good we always feel like we can do more we never stop studying we never stop learning but this is my favorite and I I was talking to to Steve this morning I don't think I've shared this with Bryce uh this morning as we're speaking we're meeting in pelis County uh with their staff and their team superintendent Hendricks and also in Sarasota we are putting together a student faculty advisory team that is something that we are really excited about I'll be coming to you it's it's an option it's it's not part of the program but what we like to do is we like to get the students involved with what they're doing everything from the elementary to the high school and it's our goal that in 6 months when we come back for a board report that we have a student from the student advisory program that's talking about the program and what you're doing and that's not just for the higher education kids the the the high school and middle school although we'll weave it into the stem and steam but I was talking to this young lady over here the elementary school kids we got little kids running around schools in in pelis county in lgo little white coats on with little checkbooks and then they're little Junior energy managers and to be honest with you a got a whole lot of effect on what your e is out in front of that but it's something that and this may sound cliche maybe they take that home with them maybe they learn a little bit about what they're doing and the fruits of their labor because again in a behavioral program it's buyin it is buyin it gets this and it becomes part of a uh part of a program um that's it that's what I've got I don't think I missed anything Steve did I oh I I got by this the culture across the country is very different on economic uh environmental impact some places it's really heavy some places it's not we let the we uh we let the district dictate the the level We rise to that but everything that we do dollarwise everything we do reduction wise we put into the environmental impact of what it's doing and these are the kind of things that we like to show the kids we like to talk about what you've done smartphones we just kind of changed and put I think that used to be miles driven car miles driven on the road changed it to smartphones because that relates more but we to talk about what you've done in Clay County is the equivalent to planting over a million trees for 10 years as what you put back into the environment and those are the kind of things that are part of the program that we like to talk about so I think I have gone through that fairly quickly Ry Outfield any questions or if uh if the board has anything they'd like to add any questions they do a great job um with our maintenance department um they work together very closely and it's it's a great so thank you we enjoy it we're we're proud to we're proud to be able to say we're partners with Clay County I'll be honest with you I mention Clay County very often when when I'm traveling around because it's a it's a shin star thank you all very much thank you so much did you guys have any questions at all I just have a comment and I was a teacher when you first started synergistics and I was one of those Behavior changes that you needed to make and I didn't like you because in a portable situation you like to have control of everything um but truly the savings that you have brought to the community and to the county and district schools has been remarkable so thank you no it's it's it's yall that are doing that and when people start looking at jobs teachers you know not everybody knows how the sausage is made and you start putting it into that perspective it makes a difference so thank you for coming hope to see yall soon thank you thank you we're going to SK out that's okay unless you want to stay for the rest of the meeting did it for 27 years is thank you they do they do a great job and and it is when you're an affordable a lot of the teachers are like well it's just one I'll turn my hair on while I'm working after hours well when they when they first started I would have to get out during planning out of my desk and do this because it was shut off during the hottest days and so it's much better now than it it's evolved and they're very good about accommodating you know we're like hey we have either this work day or whatever and and we try to accommodate that as best as possible um so they're they are they've been great Partners um so I'm sorry I didn't mean to no jump up here um I'm I'm on to the next one go right ahead bye there we go okay um going to discuss today classroom Wing cops and this is this is not another presentation on the police department participation I thought it was the little children La we can work on that we can work on that um so you might be wondering what a cops is um the presentation today will just kind of be the who what when where why how um there are several new board members that we have not done cops with you guys before um so we do have board Associates here our financial advisor to go over the technicalities of it um and then I will speak to kind of a why and Lance will give you an update on the growth um the cops um right now it's a vehicle basically just to give you high level view of what we will use to obtain the funding for these classroom me without crippling our existing schools so it it does become a cash FL issue um again Lance will talk about growth and then we will close with Ford and Associates talking about the process and the time a little bit about the timeline so I will hand it off to will Reed with board and Associates at this time and he will discuss what it is thank you very much I know that we're up here uh probably a year ago talking to talking to some of you about the borrowing options that are available broadly this is going to be much more specific and tailored to certificates of participation because that's really the Avenue that that we're going through and and working at basically uh what is a cop a cop and certificates of participation are shorted to to cop so if I say cop that's we're talking about stri those are Le leas purchased transactions they are not a pledge on the district's revenues it is a pledge on the rent that you're paying for those facilities you can think of it similar to uh to a mortgage where you're going through and and making that mortgage payment annually to go through and and continue using the facility uh they're paid from revenues that you already have so it does not go through and increase taxes it doesn't introduce a new sales tax it doesn't introduce new property taxes it's paid out of the the one and a half Mill that you're already l or PCH fees or or other dollars that the district already has currently projects that you can go through and finance with these are limited really to educational facilities and school plan uh it peels out things like administrative facilities Transportation Depots um that is a piece that they are currently reviewing in the legislature to go through and and broaden your ability to use these to to fund other things that you need throughout the district um but currently it's it's just focused on on schools um again as I said they're paid from any any revenues that you any legally available revenues that that you already different and have it doesn't introduce anything new they are issued under a master lease purchase agreement uh the idea here is that it is a broader program that you go through and andar I think yours has been in place since at least 2004 uh if not earlier uh the Master Lease encompasses all of the schools that you're going through and financing out of this currently you have uh three series of of that outstanding they Aller very shortly and we'll we'll show you that in a little bit uh but any subsequent issue would fall within that Master Lease uh the lease incorporation is the entity that that goes through and owns the facility that the school district will then go through and rent the facility from the leasing Corp the leasing Corp is you uh you go through and probably every November have to have a a reor meeting that you go through and and deal with that but it is made up of the school uh so it is a a legal requirement to go through and and do this and comply with state law um State makes it a little bit more complicated for you to go through and can't use the funds that you already have um The Master Lease concept so you go through we've got as I said you've got three series of of De outstanding each of those were used to to finance schools um the the rent that you go through and pay is secures the the school that you go through and Finance on that lease um investors going through looking at this were concerned because if you're going through and financing a school that is you know if you may maybe just have a wing under the under the lease the credit quality may not be that that strong so what has been introduced and and really what all school districts in in the state use is this idea of the master relase concept and that basically ties together all facilities that you've gone through and financ them so in essence you have to you can't pick and choose which facilities you're going to go through and pay your rent on you have to go through and either pay rent for all the facilities that you've you've borrowed or not um that goes through and allows you to to Really Finance schools throughout the district um in the event of non appropriation if you go through and say hey I don't want to go through and make my debt service payment I don't want to pay my mortgage you give up all the schools that are financed under the financed with cops and then the the person who lend you the money goes through and and relets those schools out out to try and make up what they do same thing with a home mortgage where if you go through an elect not to pay your mortgage you have to give up your home it's it's equivalent there um again the credit where this credit strength is is made up of the facilities that you have so it's not just the the wings that we're looking at here but it's looking at those facilities that the 2017s 14s and 2012's went through in financed as well um as I mentioned you've got three series of tops outstanding got the 2012's 2014 2017s uh for a total of 21 million outstanding uh those all mature you'll see that that the the longest matur that you have there is 2028 so the the average life is is very very low you you are in a very EMP B position um there are not many districts out there that can that can go through and say that they have this low level of Deb um both on an annual basis and and on a a term of the of the debt to show that a little B more graphically this is what it looks like it's it is it is Tim uh going through looking at the proposed issue that that we're going through and we'll be discussing discussing today we'll go through and lay out this is looking at a dollar issue uh Finance out I believe that's 25 years um so again The Debt Service going forward is going to be is still going to be incredibly low versus the the revenues that you go through to have and with that I'll hand it over to first okay so I'll talk a little bit about the funding strategy and why why we why we're recommending this um so it's no surprise to the board I hope the the significant growth that we're seeing out there in Oakleaf area Lake Asbury junor area um with that growth of course comes more kids we need more facilities right so I'm just I'm going to skip ahead actually to the Chart so you can look at that um these these are our our projects so what what we're trying to do with financial strategy is um strategically leverage our debt over time um and we do we that's we we work really well with students and important Associates um over the past few years to do this and we would like to continue the strategy moving forward this is our recommendation um so why can't we just use Ed first and LCI so I feel like I have the stigma of I'm the person that's always asking for money I showed up at a meeting and know like somebody came up to me and she said you again and I was like she's like what do you need now and I was like no so I think that's um an important uh point to make is that we're not going out to tax and we're not going out to the um taxpayers and asking for more money this is something that we can do inhouse while also taking care of of our current facilities um so what we're looking at right now on this chart we have three colors so there's red green yellow so what we want to show with that is the red is uh stop wait a minute we need to make sure we have these funds green is we've we're going to use our our inhouse fund our proposed funding that we have coming up for those years um to impact fees and CDs as you know a lot of our funding sources are restricted to certain things such as growth um and then the yellow are projects we need to do like to do but it's going to depend on funding as far as timing so we kind of have those as as near future projects but that might shift and you will see that in our reports and in our efp every year that we discuss and then we have the high school which is we're looking at about um 2930 as a build so it won't open till about um 3132 but right now the cost in in today's dollars we're looking at150 million $200 million so that's a lot of money right so um we also have 43 other schools right so we can't just take all of the funding now and say oh we'll just build it with the school debt build a new school debt free and then forget about the rest of the schools so we have to maintain that ability to support um Debt Service is paid out of capital dollars so that's what he was talking about we we borrow the money and we pay back with our um lcif and impact fees so that's current monies that we use now to fund our our maintenance projects to fund our reroofing to fund our adverse projects um and so we don't want to totally de that and remember so the more um the more debt the less we have to support our schools um so at the top of the chart I wanted to point out this is again this is the immediate growth um the 36 M25 year bond is what we are recommending at this time and this will cover the two classroom wings like Asbury Jr and Oak Jr which we have already started with the architect and Engineers are already we've already approved those contracts for them to start and they're out there surveying um and we're we're moving along with those we'll bring those those final plans to you um so so why these classroom Wings Over a some people just build a new school why don't you just build a new school on a on an available piece of property so a brand new school right now um if it was to be if we were to try to cover all um the grades of growth that are coming in here we would be maybe a K8 and we would be talking about $80 million so that's the cost just for construction when you talk about um the actual cost to operate so you're talking about a whole another school to operate a whole another administrative team a whole another cafeteria team Transportation more buses um so it comes with a lot more than just hey here's the construction cost we're talking about um a whole lot more in the following years so$ 36 million versus 80 million when you're talking about what we can um accomplish um the 36 million sounds a lot better um so the strategy here would be to bond these first two classrooms and then use the money that we have um save our impact fees and and Co and DS for um those other builds we're going to have to also do so we're going to also have to do um classroom wings at R out Elementary and Lake Asbury Elementary one of these is growth the other one is portable reduction right um right out is kind of in between Oakleaf area Lake Asbury area so they are going to be affected by this growth as well and as we shift districts around we'll we'll have to accommodate them at those schools so we will have to do ride out Elementary and Lake Asbury Elementary classroom editions we're able to fund those out with our with the strategy that we're using in the 24 25 school years with some of those time sensitive um funding sources so impact fees you have six years to spend it so if you don't spend that money um you actually have to return it we've had people write us letters saying hey I I want to see if if my money if I can get my money back and so we always spend olders first so we can say we've spent it um but so we don't want to just sit on it and save it the whole time because by the time we get to the high school they might have expired so we'll use those for a ride out in Lake Asbury and then we'll have those two years in between 25 26 27 to save further for the high school cuz we can use impact fees on the new high school New Growth and um we will certainly have to bond at that point in time um again the potential projects at the bottom also near future growth and portable reduction right so we're really focusing on that portable reduction and um again that'll that'll adjust uh one way or another depending on the funding sources at that time yes I have a question so and maybe I I'm getting ahead of myself but I just am curious to be able to compare compare it to the to the dollar amount how many classrooms will be in these wings 32 classrooms okay and then how many at the junior highs so the elementaries we're looking at a little bit smaller that's what I want to know how much there or how many there um right out right now we're looking at a 12 classroom Wing um and then Lake Asbury Elementary I think it's 24 so in that same ve um i a couple of questions how many more students will be um able to be accommodated at those schools with the classroom additions so junior high level we use 22 as um that's the class size reduction act so we're looking at about 700 kids in there it depends on what they're going to use those classrooms for so sometimes with ESC those classrooms hold small they have smaller student stations that are approved by the state so some of those might be five or 10 so might not be the entire 700 but we'll be able to reduce Portables at those schools Lake Asbury right now has um 24 Portables 24 or 36 and we'll be a to El or Junior what's that Elementary or junior junior junior has uh over 24 24 and we'll be able to reduce that we'll actually still have to leave some portabl there um they do have those ESC programs and we have a high ESC population in our district um we try to offer those spaces for them and then Oakleaf Jr would be um again in the 20s and we'll have to adjust that number at that time depending on the programs but we should be able to build 32 classrooms there and reduce almost 20 they have 20 Portables who's that Oak so you're looking at a potential addition of conservative maybe 500 students number would be 700 and how many students are there already um shot Oak junr we have those numers the where they're at enrollment right now oaklea is I believe at 1,4 and I want to say um I'm sorry reversed Lake Asbury is about 104 and Oakleaf is I can pull up my computer and give you exact numbers and locally I believe is about 982 somewhere around there so we're looking at capacity building to 15 to 1,700 students total that's correct yes right so then in that vein my next question would be as we grow schools larger that's going to sound like a paradox but how do we grow smaller as we grow larger because I know um when I think about costom management when I think about running a whole school um you don't want to feel like kids are getting lost in the numbers so is there a way that we could especially at the Elementary School I don't know if it's like you have a school within a school situation where you're keeping your K1 and two um and you have an administrator that's designated specifically for that group um I think there's lots of ways that we could think outside the box for how to grow smaller and be relational as we grow larger because I think that's part of what makes Clay County so attractive is that we are a HomeTown Community where people know each other so I don't want to lose that as we grow in size and I understand building efficiency um saving money you have to make use of the space that you have there there is no doubt in the board member m makes Point that's what makes play County Trade we do I will point out that we have several schools with a very low enrollment rate total overall enrollment to give you an idea uh our neighboring County uh east of us right cuz I'm not naming the county I'm just pointing Direct C right has the same roughly the same number of school sites but has uh 12,000 more students but that gives you an idea when you're talking about efficiency of course that district has very rapid even like astronomically rapid growth in that particular District but to your point you're right looking for ways to manage it in which we still have that small but there's also a little bit of efficiency that has to be factored into it well I know when I I was always secondary and my last three years I moved down to Elementary my most riveting years were the elementary years but every time you went to let's say that the monory wing small you know parents that that that like teaching in your own home um I know they're like if you go to Ty your first second and third grade wing feels the same way so I have an appreciation of and I also think academically when we put kids in bracketing age groups in that smaller Community your vertical articulation um is better than being scattered around so I have always and will always be excited about classroom wings for that reason of what you can do with u academics I and and neighboring I know they Havey and then they have wings or they have schools within neighborhoods um to keep it that small fill um and I could be wrong but I think adding These Wings um would do that but I like idea it could do that but I think we have to be intentional in the planning of how you execute that so it's um you know you have a first and second grade um I don't know community that has events that's just for them um you know just and I'm sure that the the schools are probably already doing that but that's just where my mind goes as a parent if I'm if I have a 5-year-old and I'm dropping them off at school with 2,000 kids I don't want my kid getting lost in the mix right so I just I think the more that we can put those plans out for the community of yes we're growing larger but we're also growing smaller and we're being intentional about it and here's how we're doing it um I think a good example was Spring Park Elementary and when we were there that first day of school and we saw the kids being dropped off and they were told okay if you were in kindergarten or first you come in this door but if you were in those grades go to the second door and that same thing happens Ridge View I know has added Wings in the in the past I mean we're talking years now ago but anytime they've added a wing at T even at Argy recently um teachers realize that oh you know I've grown into this classroom but frequently there will be changes and say okay we're growing more in that kindergarten area so we're going to add a classroom here and this Wing will be kindergarten that Wing will be second and third grade this Wing will be first grade and at Argy now the Portables are fourth and fifth and sixth um and that's sort of how it's always been however even within that they change so I think there's a a in management just in managing the population it helps to as you said keep them within those separate areas to help them get to know each other and to make the children feel safe about where they're going right and empower the children to know where they're going right that as when you have sixth graders within Elementary School some of those sixth graders and I hope and pray to God that my my kid still stays a little girl that wants to play with baby dolls and stuff like that in sixth grade but then you have the other sixth graders who have older siblings who um maybe are a little bit more mature for an elementary school setting so I think also realizing that separating those older grades I think separating them but I think there are creative ways where you can have a large at large school Community but still have smaller segments within there you know I think specifically about um schools that do like you get to fifth and sixth grade and you get to join one of the school houses and um you know there's different segments so you're within your community um of your house but um at the same time you're you're representing your house to the community at large so there's just there's ways to to develop that small feel within a large school um and I'm and I mean outside of just the building structure itself how are we facilitating those relationships and that Community within the school and I think just the more that we can be intentional about that and um really have a a solid message of here's what we're offering in our larger schools I think that would we do Al there is also a board policy on the maximum right of our school sizes so I don't want you to think we're just going to keep adding Wings adding wings wings at at some point you know we're going to build a new school um but we capacity is based on the cafeteria size and basically how many kids we can feed is is what it comes down to I have a quick question Junior High wings are going to be twostory is that correct correct the plan is to have them twostory including an elevator yes thank you and the elementary wings are going to be single story still at ride out um we're still looking at Lake Asberry we're still looking at ideas right now okay curious so we can't be alarmed learned when we add all these wings at the new roof cost yes we have understand correct but I I was very impressed with Oakleaf when it when it housed both Elementary and Junior I mean it worked well I thought being able to separate the two before the second Elementary was built and course high school was being built but it was managed well so and again we won't just again from an organ or operational standpoint and the Staffing there we won't go above anything that can be handled on the instructional side Mr did you have something I was just going to say when they see the why the why and they see the growth they'll see you'll see the plan here in a second correct um so at this point in time I'm going to hand it back over to Lance or hand it to Lance to go over that growth and and a little bit of the numbers for thank you missis Mr super board members good morning beautiful morning thank you um why do we do what we do so we look at this I basically look at this all year long I have to keep up with everything that goes on in the county as you know in the county we have hot spots and um Lake Asbury is one of those hot spots Terry is going to be upset that I don't have my Monopoly houses anymore this new program that I'm using does not haveen monop houses so I had to find another way however I wanted to incorporate the active construction AI into what you see um this is like Asberry this is what I have on the books okay as far as reservations or what is active what you see in pink is active construction what you see in blue is the name of the subdivision or the owner of the land and how many units they have applied for or how many units they are building it's a lot okay um and when I get into showing you the capacities and how many overall you'll see where we stand right now okay I'm going to UNC convolute this a little bit if that's a word so I'm going to go on to the next um so I just want to show you how many subdivisions are on the books in this area um I want to show you where the schools are so this is LA and laj and that's kind of without all of the subdivisions name that's the active construction now I want to point out that right in here this is Highland Trail there's about 1650 hes one here so all this will be pink all right all this down here will be pink and that's the that's the new that's correct that is the right that's the uh First Coast expressway so as you see all of that growth is kind of Cent around that First Coast Expressway um you don't have to drive through Lake Asbury right now don't it's it's pretty bad it really is you know there's a lot of construction going on over there um so down in the bottom right that neighborhood is Cross Creek um I wanted to I'm going to touch on Cross Creek a little bit and show you the impact that it has had and not saying that every other um development is not having an impact cuz all of them are having significant impact in the area um I just want just so you know bottom right that's cross street all the way to the right uh bottom yeah all the way to the right so basically right here it kind of starts right here and all of this Mr Addison where's the property that we purchas the property we purchase is right here thank you yes now it's just north of Annabelle Island got so if you see right here this is Annabelle this is the property I just got it an application in this week for this one Russell Retreat so um with that being said just to let you know that I probably get an application in weekly or every two weeks for new subdivision somewhere in the count whether it be middleberg oaklea like Asberry small parts of um not really Fleming there's not a whole lot going on in Fleming but um I I I get a lot of applications in okay um down near Saratoga there's more applications coming in over there are we seeing much in like the southern part of the county and the as far as Keystone no like uh the Southeastern Corner the Southeastern Corner not yet okay cuz I know we originally had a huge development not yet so that I can touch on that if you'd like okay we're going to have to put that in about 5 to 10 years down the road however I can touch on that Governor's partk 6,000 they're they're applying to the state okay they're they're applying for what they call transmission to the state that's getting them because it's such a large piece of property they can't just come in and build they have to ask the state if they can build so they have applied for transmission to the state okay just south of that it's called Agricola property I think it's 3,000 Acres down there another 4,000 homes down there they're applying for Trans they're applying for the BCC to allow them to transmit to the state if I'm not mistaken or I'm not real and how that process goes I am in on it a lot and I do give my comments but the actual process I'm not really I don't really know I all I know is they are applying for transmission to the state that's 4,000 uh what else 3 just same same area 2,000 that's kind of been Green Cove the city of Green Cove I believe they own that one so right there we're looking at 12,000 homes now are they all going to come out next year no we don't to go red light red light red light no it's it's a 5 to 10 year process yes ma'am I I wanted to add if you're still going on on this you can come back to it but I I was just thinking in my mind over by um shadon all that land yes 775 the Rin hole land that will basically it's going to it's going to encapsulate Shadow one Elementary and then you know that road going in right there in Shadow Elementary well the reason they're building that road and I had to turn that land over to the road it was in the contract but I had to turn that land over to the road so that Reinhold could build that so that they have the the infrastructure to build that 775 around there I believe they're going to apply a little bit down the road later on I don't know exactly I would have to talk to George exactly but I believe later on down the road just a little bit West of that they're going to apply there to put houses in there my speculation they have reservations they do so the 775 is reserved they will build those homes so they already have portable out there where at shadon no Shadow Zero Port no zero portable okay right so that's why we we want to address yeah grow without putting Portables at schools that don't have any Portables at all so that is part of the process and part of our plan is to address that growth without adding Portables if at all possible this off topic yes ma'am but in the beginning of the year when you gave us the percent occupany School junior high was over capacity I think it was like at 18 oh no is not at 118 I believe they're right now about 10 are they lower they're about 102 103 maybe somewhere around there Discovery yks Discovery o was up there Discovery Oaks is right now sitting that right at 110 and just something that but I guess what I'm trying to ask is Will some Reon occur um I guess we can discuss that um Wilkinson does have a large number of Portables they are on our plan that miss you to put I just didn't know when you're planning like wings with all of this you can't always just solve it with one solution correct absolutely and I'm going to show you a slide on something like that yes ma'am but you're absolutely correct yeah just just just to educate the board so something that that you brought up about transmittal so so really just for understanding so generally when a project comes up for development so that you have a developer that wants to to do one of these projects so the first the the first step it's really a six-step process the first step is going in front of your Planning and Zoning agency to get approval for transmittal so the pza will then make a recommendation to the board of County commission for transmittal so that's the first approval process it goes to the County Commission then they then they review it for transmittal they will take the recommendation from the PC they can either deny it or they can vote to transmit it this B is familiar with this from her husband is transmitted then to the State of Florida who does is really that's a third process the State of Florida reviews it for traffic concurrency they look at environmental impacts then it is sent back to the pza for adoption final approval the pza will make a recommendation at that point to the to the County Commission it'll go to the County Commission final approval what that does is that gives the developer entitlements that doesn't mean necessarily that all those hes are going to be built right away because they have a development order that extends for a period of time but there are number of different but transmitt in of itself you know we have to be Lean Forward planning because we know that developer is interested in putting that number of homes but once 10,000 homes or once they're approved because of the way impact fees and different things work generally they're never going to hit that threshold but still you know there's there's a lot of approval processes to go into that that's kind of how that process works there's a multi-step you know transmittal then there's approval then the state of qua reviews does that does that make sense right and in my opinion this is strictly my opinion I don't see anything holding them back that's just my opinion okay well there's a point though where you speak for the school district and say no we're not going to approve let say so that's that's a I do sit on I do sit I am appointed by you all to sit on the Planning Commission that's part of my job title I do sit on the Planning Commission the Planning Commission is a volunteer commission they make recommendations they do not say yes or no they make recommendations to the BCC when I sit on there and please understand that I am one of eight yeah okay he's not heard is what he's say yes exactly exactly Aon Skipper learned that real quick I now I will base my vote based on whether we have capacity if it's going to put a stress on the schools and please remember that per statute if I'm if I don't have capacity right in that zone I have to look at contiguous zones so let's say clay doesn't have any capacity and that development is in clay Zone well guess what island is continuous in fman has capacity I have to Grant capacity based on fman Island's capacity not Clays so those are little things that I have to look at and the nuances of how the vot goes I can't say no we don't have capacity when the state law says well you kind of do so that's kind of how I have to look at things um may I ask real quick um Sarah toga Springs was supposed to come in before great point so I don't so S springs so Saratoga Springs is kind of right here now I don't necessarily consider it part of Lake Asbury I consider more of a green code are and and you mentioned Governor's Park set since a park grp moved out I don't know we're said at 6,000 CU we keep hearing different numbers they are they are in the new the bti I believe owns it now they have come and we have had meetings with bti they want to start moving dirt almost immediately and I believe they're going to start trying to go vertical in 25 the word I have is that Saratoga Marines um that they've pretty much worked out everything with uh with the Water Management District so they want to start moving during the 25 so that's kind of where I was going to get with why I do some of the things that I do and kind of getting down in the needs and I'm going to do that when I get to um where I'm showing where the capacity is and what the percentages are how many houses in Saratoga Springs 5,000 5,000 well it doesn't look like we say no very often well we do so as a count so that's and that's another great point that you bring up is the way this works is if the land use is correct and the density is correct we can't say n that's right they can they can do whatever they want to their they can do what they want to with the land as long as the land use is correct and and the density is correct as far as residential when it's not correct they come to the Planning Commission and then that's where I have that one of eight vote um so that that's kind of how it works we really just can't say I don't want you here doesn't really work like that um so the Watkins property way over on the right that one um they're having a little bit of issue I still have them on the books they still have reservations but I think they're going to be in they're kind of going back and forth with the BCC right now so that's that one's kind of going back and forth other than that most of those are are pretty much set they're going they will build any other questions about around the county I love this stuff I this is what I do this is what I do glad you're you're saying this out loud though because like myself you know you don't realize that these statutes and laws are in place and everybody's like you can't stop them you can't just tell them to pause or tell you know all the things [Music] I mean that's why we live in America we can do what we want but at the same time that's correct TR to catch up so we have to so as as the school district we have to manage the growth keep up with the growth um try to reduce and eliminate Portables um make sure we're doing it in the right areas we have all of these things that we have to look at almost you know daily on a daily basis and that's where we come together as a team and as Dr K will say we will SC image a lot on hey what are we going to do how are we going to do this how are we going to tackle this so we go through this quite often aren't you glad you're just in charge of schools and not roads I I do not want to take that beat I I do not want to take that beating now that's that's another beating that U I think the BCC takes quite often all right so let's look at the lake gbury student generation and the capacities in the area so as far as the number of homes right now of all of those developments that I've shown you I've gone through and I've counted one by one they have appro approximately 1,550 cosos that means they've already issued they're living in something to that area of the new areas don't get me wrong we have other areas that obviously uh Legacy neighborhoods that have already been around that leaves us about 5,840 to build in the area that's ,500 Elementary you can you can see the numbers total 2,885 students let's not get a red light going we might want to put a yellow light say yeah we need to look at this not not tomorrow but we got to look at it in a year or two or something like that so that's kind of where we're at today um you see Lake a Elementary 91% when we started this year we were at 85 last year we were over 100 why is that the reason why is because I took Cross Creek and I took it out of Lake asbery because they were over capacity and I put them in ride out right out was at 707 something last year took Cross Creek and put them in ride out look at ride out why are they why did they go up so fast well I have to look at how fast they're building last year Cross Creek and I'm not saying the other neighborhoods are not building but last year Cross Creek did 200 all year this year they did 206 months so they're doubling their output I don't know if they're giving incentives I don't know if they're there it is we have the real estate Guru says yep they have to sell those homes so that's what's happening so right out got kicked up to 103% well Lance why didn't you put Cross Creek in a new school Saratoga Springs 2,25 5,000 homes I have to be able to have capacity there so I'm constantly having this juggling Act of how am I going to create capacity maintain capacity and also maintain our level of service in the schools and then we have to say well we we need stations we need Student stations and then we come to today with that also want you to look at the number of Portables or the non-permanent seats so those are how many we have in the schools um we will reduce Portables how many I have to look at that when we get to the point where we actually have the student stations that depends on how fast they're building or how slow they're building at the time but we will reduce portals I just don't have an exact number because that can fluctuate as you see out of those three schools we have 454 seats available we're not getting any more seats and I don't see the growth slowing down and we have approximately 200 I mean 2,885 students uh Clay High Is Up around the 87% so that kind of tells you where they're at all right so capacity capacity in oakle Oakleaf not as much as Lake Asbury as you know Oakleaf has been going on for a long time now Lake Asbury there everybody is jumping on the lake Asberry bandwagon now but that doesn't mean that there's not I don't still get applications in there I do still get applications and you can see we still have active construction going on in Lake Hasbury it's just I'm I saying is not hot it's just not as hot as Lake Asbury that tells you where the schools are over there and where the act of construction is in Oak well why are we looking at Oak Leaf that's a great question this is why we still have construction going on it's still it's still kind of hot but we and we still have construction going on but look at the capacities of the schools in the areas as the construction comes in and they have enrollment and and enrollment uh increases then those schools are going to get over the 100% threshold and and then and then you look at how many Portables we have well so we can take a look at if we have student stationed available permanent student stations available then maybe we can address our capacity issues and also address our portable issues that we have so many portable so we're trying to tackle many different obstacles here with with a one thought we have total of about 579 total seats available with 665 students on the books I get applications all the time so I'm not saying that that's not going to increase CU it probably will there is still land available out there I don't know if the Spencers are selling more land I don't know you never know I thought they weren't and all of a sudden I get I get a an application for 600 homes so you know yes now I have a question yes ma'am so oaklea junior high is at 65% yes uh I guess my question is and they have 34 Portables MH they're at a low enrollment why do we have that many portabl um so that's a great question and a lot of times and the way I want to address this is um and maybe DR Sanders can help me out with this a little bit is sometimes the capacity of what they show I have to go by fish I have to go by what the state has and the fish but sometimes we have programs in there and let's say we have for example 10 or 12 units in Lake Asbury Jr then the capacity is a little bit skewed because it might say that that classroom can hold 22 students or 25 students however we have a we have a unit in there and they only have five or 10 students so it kind of skews the capacity a little bit to where I think in Lake Asbury maybe we should really truly reduce the capacity by probably 144 students but I can't do it on the books because that's what fish says that's what we have in fish and I just can't go in and just change the classroom not allowed to do that so with your with your question yes we have capacity in Oakleaf and yes we want to reduce Portables and we still have capacity issues at the other schools also right yes and we want to use that capacity want to be able to use that capacity I just don't understand why you needed 34 Portables with low capacity is just what I was when was what I was getting when Oakleaf was first built as that K through 8 school it technically should have waited I think another year and there would have been more permanent buildings if I'm not mistaken well and we empti we just emptied Oakleaf out a few years ago not emptied it out but we moved um sixth grade right that was okay so we were literally dedicating ARG Elementary that day when we were told Oakleaf is going Oakleaf Jr K through 8 is going to open next year and we're all standing they're going really so they built the buildings the administration building the cafeteria the library and one of the CL the main classroom building that they have and put the Junior High there and then the rest of the school was built the K through six school was built with Portables okay that was the decision made at that time because they had just opened Argyle to relieve the four 1,400 students I think we had at w Cherry 12 or 1400 moved over to Oakleaf to build That Then followed up with Plantation Oaks and Oakleaf Village when at one point we did we had all of the six we had all of the students then move in the cave through six mov back to those schools but then that left oaklea Junior High Way low I mean that six that percentage was like so that's when they moved the sixth graders from our Plantation Oaks uh and Oakley Village into the junior high that's and then Oakleaf started growing by leaps and mounds and then they moved all of the sixth graders back to the elementary schools but that was just what that was not that long ago I guess question and that's when they also Discovery Oaks are we not building I know they're State statue but it's infuriating and maybe this is just me being being a citizen but it is infuriating knowing that there's all this growth going on and there's a state statute that says you can only build your schools to a certain capacity but in 5 years we're going to be full with that capacity and then try to bring in um different forms of structure to make up for that and I guess that that goes with it but at the same time is there not something around State statue or like a hey here's a permission slip to build the extra buildings because I know that um they've already broke ground and are going to start building 12,000 homes just south of you and you know instead of trying to accommodate in four years or 5 years to try to figure out what the heck you're going to do your school's already built to where it needs to be I don't think the state statutes prevent us from building I think that would be more of the money issue yeah that's more of a little no I thought when we talked about that remember right about cafeteria capacity oakle was um a unique situation because of the growth at that time it's like what St John's County is having to do they're building a school right now that's basically capacity for two schools they have an entire portable like more than we do at a school or the same and they function like that basically two schools in one for a year while they're building another one so they they're that's what happened up at Oakley was we weren't prepared for for the growth so we had to build this bring in all these Portables so now it becomes a logistic issue with moving those Portables um we have a little bit of space back there because we've taken out a lot of those Portables it's the perfect time to go in and and build so we're not moving building another portable City on their football field or whatever we have the ability to go and now build a new building but I'm not just talking about Oakleaf I'm just talking about in general especially with the large growth in like casbury and our new schools our new schools we built we stop yes that's what we've done all the way back to Oakley Village um Shadow lawn which has no Portables Discovery oats um Spring Park now Spring Park um we're not doing that anymore we're building what they call full facility list which is exactly that we're providing the number of classrooms that we can feed in the cafeteria and you have to keep in mind the history of Clay County and before Fleming Island and Oakley those were the two things that put us on the map as far as growth went before that we were a rural farm community I know that transition from being that rural County to then now we have large developments with lots of houses and a concentrated area I think the board and the facilities department at the time right just didn't have the capacity to the funding I mean so that's what we're trying to do now it's we are we are catching up that's what I want do better um at you know not building with Portables as part of the permanent design right so yes there might be some Portables at those schools if and that depends on um instructional programs but we're trying to totally eliminate those that's why the honestly that's why the facility plan has to remain so fluid if you remember right before I think the new board members came out we had we we had a Elementary plan for the two Creek property right we can no longer afford to build there was one thing when an elementary school was $19 million now that they're 45 man you can't go a mile down the road just build another little small school we we really need and I appreciate the smallness and the commitment to that but when you're talking about $40 million in elementary school um we need to look at building schools that will service us with the best with the money doubling Service as many as we can and that even includes larer capacity of the cafeteria cuz the public it's interesting get calls when they find out that the cafeteria size controls you know what what we can do why don't you just expand the cafeteria I mean we just did that at Keystone you know she saw what that was so it's a funding issue and I think it's important to note that we have to look at our own policies for school size and realize that we were blessed for a long time to be able to have really small schools 800 kids 900 most elementary schools today being built in other counties are, 1500 minimum for Elementary uh high schools are hitting 35004 just because you only have the money to build it once and we'll learn that with Saratoga Springs when we build the high school out there it's going to be it's going to be $200 million to build that school you won't be impressed but to your point I mean it's it's not something that can be done overnight no yeah I just want to make sure that we are are moving in that direction instead of having this around come back and I know we looked at that policy actually about just but I just I I want to make yeah I want to make sure that we're not going in circles and going backwards and and we're being proactive and moving in that direction is all I'm that's my whole point that I I want to address the the first question that you had we're at 65% why do we have so many Portables well another thing is it it it cost quite a bit of money to move a portable so if if we didn't need to move it and we know the growth is there there's no need to spend that money to move it at that time until we find out where we need to move it to because we don't just want to spend that money and like I said it is expensive to move it and we will we will pluck it from that area when I need it to when I need to put it somewhere else but we don't don't want to just randomly move it just because they're a little bit lower in capacity because they're low in capacity on fish at 65% but they're not low in permanent capacity they're just they're low in permanent and non-permanent capacity so we have to look at those issues also that does that kind of answer your question yeah I just again like I said I just want to make sure we're building bigger schools for a development that we know is going to have 12,000 and 6,000 that we're not just I know we're not wasting money but we're essentially wasting time and having to go back and be like oh wait and I get it like they cancel construction all the time but if we're breaking ground and we're doing that I mean eventually when the economy changes God will that things will go back to you know finishing those 6,000 homes or whatever and we've already we're done here we're moving on because you still have that that room right and remember that's a perfect was perfect transition you have school board policy that limits the school size that's something that you guys might have to take up as a team uh to start looking at those policies for school size because we limited ourselves over time when we could afford to do it to stay really small we're going to have to look at our own policy and change that I think we looked at that a couple well about last year um and any other questions Miss Skipper any other questions no i'me all right so let's look at very very near future of where we're at right now right now at this point in time what I look at in you know the next couple of months so fiscal year to date I'm um from July 1st until last Friday I went in and I looked at all everything's been paid and everything that has been issued so we've had 742 impact fees paid or credits I have to count those as as the same because I might have to credit a prop share but that's still basically an application for an impact fee so we have 742 that's an indicator of where we're at for near-term growth that means from the residential certificates of occupancy I've had 703 almost the same so we can see that the growth in the first in the first half of the fiscal year was at this point and the impact fees that means the growth in the second half of the fiscal part of the year is about the same or increases slightly as interest rates drop will that go up I suspect I don't know what percentage but I suspect it will go up a little bit um so that's my projection about 1340 and and uh impact fees and 1269 residential cosos where does that sit well over the past 3 or 4 years we average somewhere between 11 to 12 between 11 to 12 to 15 so that's right at the average of where we're at over the past years of all this substantial significant growth that we've experienced in the county are we in the remember we voted to increase impact fees was not a happy day for me but are we in the second year of that increase no July I'm sorry June 1st June 1st will be the second year for that addition I think it's about a million dollars or something but right that happens every June 1st every June 1st okay so um the previous June 1st we went up for the first increase 122% yeah 12 and half% so it goes up 12 12% every June 1st for four years years and then we'll have to get another impact fee study by Ma maxing it maxing it at 50% much you can change and then your still 50% what I want to show you here is that doesn't look like it's slowing down any I can't tell you what it's going to do in two years from now I can tell you what I have on the books I can't tell you how fast the the they're going to build but I can tell you right now it doesn't look like they're slowing down at all okay other options I'm telling you to spend money or we we as a as a section or say hey we we we want we want to get this this funding but Florida statute says there are other options to reduce the need for additional permanent stations as you can see some of them acceptable capacity redistricting for all of the growth that we had we would probably have to do a countywide redistrict I would have to break up neighborhoods I would have to break up transportation lines to be able to make that work I can make anything work but it will be a lot I'm just going to say that um you but those are some of the those are some of the um some of the options that the State of Florida gives you other than going through the route that we're going now and also the route that we're going is also an option and school policy our school board policy basically minutes what the state statute says it says we can redistrict or we can include in the capital uh plan to add more permanent student stations I believe that's all I have and I answer questions I love this I love looking at maps and numbers you are such a geek yes thank you than you um now will um we'll talk about the process um cop next step for the district as a district what we need to doing forward so this slide right here is the process for moving forward I do want to go through and highlight the fact your team has been working for years going through identifying funding sources identifying need as you can see here this is this is is just a small snapshot of of what they've been going through here um it really have been turning over every stone trying to find any available way to go through and meet the growth that you're facing um so as as far as what we're looking at here uh The Next Step here would really be to go through and create the the legal framework that will go through and and create this bond issue um that all will will go through it's it's occurring at some level now but uh we'll continue sort of going through the the step following that would be to bring those documents to you for approval uh we're currently looking at that being sometime in the in the March time frame um at that point the board would go through and look at it and and evaluate whether or not you want to move forward with with issuing CS um there would be within that a maximum par amount it's the maximum borrowing amount that you would go through have there a maximum interest rate um and those are the the primary parameters that you would go through and look at saying hey we're going to offer us the district to move forward as long as the transaction Falls Within These these parameters uh and you delegate authority to the board chair and superintendent to go through and and sign docents uh yes'am sorry I just cuz I'll forget in a second um you said this is just like a mortgage right so if if interest rates go back down are we able to refinance those interest rates just like a mortgage so it is it's similar to mortgage uh going through what we' be looking at doing here is is a public offer you'd be going through and offering bonds they are able to be refinanced traditionally that comes with a what they call a 10year call so the first 10 years you would not be able to go through and take those away from the investor but following that that 10th anniversary you would be able to go through and refinance and then it's periodically after that correct uh so when you go through and reach the public markets actually once you hit that that 10year time frame you can go through and at any point thereafter okay um but the process for doing that is in essence going through and issuing new debt and using proceeds from that new debt to pay off the existing holder so it becomes a new a new issue that would then have its own right the term is we have done that haven't we we have I don't know within the last year or two but I know that we've done it within like the last five I so interest rates are up and um when the interest rates yeah we took advantage of that traditionally gone through and and follow that closely to see whenever there's there and just for clarification at this stage of the game we're just going for the 30 technically we're just going for the 36 million corre correct and that we would obviously revisit this issue as the need arose for any building that we would need to do in 28 29 or a certain period right and at that time if the rates are lower for the high school it's something you know we can discuss about rolling those in together and getting a better interest rate I just want to make sure you can do that I just want to tell you I'm very appreciative when you look at when the current bonds expire is right I mean the amount of planning and thought that must go into something like this that the current bonds right now would be expired at the time we would need a new high school and I admire um the amount of effort that must go into your daily work a [Music] great and as far as discussing why we wouldn't go through and borrow from the high school now one is the as these new as these new houses come online that's going to go through and and presumably increase the tax base to go through and and provide the the additional Revenue to go through and pay that Debt Service there's also issues because you would be going through and barrowing on a tax exempt basis There Are Rules around how you can go through and use the the dollars that you borrow um because the the federal government views that as them subsidizing the debt because you're getting a lower rate than you would when you to go through and and look on a a taxable basis that they really want you to be able to go through and spend all the proceeds within 3 years so this is something that we've been working very closely with your team to go through and look at not just what projects do you have coming up where are the needs but also how quickly can you go through and and build the school that you need to go through and Bill to make sure that you're following the the applicable tax law that that comes with uh with any sort of a borrowing um but going through that would be that meeting in March would be the when we basically take this to the to the board for approval um once and if the the board elects to move forward we then look to go through and price the issue um which is when the the final break would be determined uh again fixed rate not looking to go for for available rate because you don't want to necessarily take that risk that that you could see rate Spike uh the locking in the certainty of what the costs are for those those facilities allow your team to go through and plan uh all the other expenditures around that um basically once that pricing occurs then there'll be a a the the documents get finalized and then they come to the the board and the chair for uh basically to sign off on on the document and then the the funds required I think that covers pretty much everything that that I have having answering questions on on what these are or process so so the timeline right now um it's we're working on the documents we'll bring those documents to you at the March meeting um and then closing would happen in April around April do we have any idea of what the interest rate might be uh we're still going through in and looking that I I'm always un comfortable to make any sort of prognostication because I really to go up down sideways uh I think what we've been looking at has been in the sort of the high three 4% range the the curve is is sort of the yield curve now is is a little weird because on the short end it's actually higher than it is out 10 years um any of the potential changes at the at the FED level are really going to drive the the short end of Feld curve the the near term one two three years um and it's uncertain what sort of impact that will have um you know out the the 10 or 20 years and what about um this would probably be a question for you what will it look like in your budget um to make the payments on these bonds what are you allocating or thinking that you will need to allocate for that right so um he had a chart early on that showed um right now um back to that um what we're paying on now the annual principal and interest requirement right so so the gray is is our current um Debt Service right um so we will have a couple of years that overlap with the new with the new debt service and we're looking at about 4 million um a year okay for that so um you can see right now we're at about five we're going to add that little bit on top then those will expire and will be below where we have been actually for the last couple years okay so it's going to be three four years of a little bit more and then drop off okay um when are you going to break ground that's soon I was going to say you know timing is everything in construction right so uh we're looking at an no later than cuz the superintendent has looked at us and said you know August 25 no matter what so these two classroom editions at Oakleaf Jr and uh Lake Hasbury Jr will open August 25 the funding for this what we're doing now in March is critical the urgency of it's critical to get funded because we cannot move forward can we go so far we're in design now you guys approved false dressing design classroom Edition we're in design now we're preparing for it the funding has to hit the line but or I can award a contract to a CM so we're looking at August 25 to open the the facility and we timed it out you know waited as long as we could with the interest rates and strategically leveraging our current debt expiring so we can minimize Debt Service and I know m boss ell said it but I can tell you Debt Service payments come out of capital my biggest concern is having too much debt especially when we take on a $200 million high school that's going to impact our ability to support the other 43 school so um we we're really conservative when it comes to taking on debt so we're only going to do what we have to do and timing is everything so August 25 is going to open it will start as soon as the funds get soon as you approve we're rolling and I don't want you to think we're trying to force your hand this this is this is our recommendation um this is part of the process if if you guys get the number and you say look we don't want to do this just because um we have started the process with the AR doesn't mean we have to move forward but I just want to make sure that the you and the public know we're not this is I can't tell you I was judging science fair projects at Lake Asbury Junior High when there was surveyors out there and The Talk The Buzz of what are they doing everyone where are they going to put it why are they all over so it's a pretty exciting thing I mean if you're at Lake asur junior high right now apparently so all right so if there's not any further questions than you thank you so much um will for being here with Associates and let me know if you guys have any questions thank you all right Mr Rosy yeah so just just to kind of wrap it up for associates great great Partners on the financial end Dr Le here texted me this morning and said hey apologies for being sick for the fact that she's also a part of the team that gave with the plan the reality is is that you only have so much money in which you have available in order to meet the needs and uh we believe this be the best plan moving forward so I realize that there's two additional uh presentations and topics I'll go quickly through the agenda items to see if there's any questions for that if there aren't any questions and the question develop you have n nine days for the board meeting my phone is is always on you can call and and and uh and ask a question then so uh a couple things I want to point out one we do have a presentation by CTE in beginning of CTE month okay um I guess he didn't want to stay for the presentation I no to him that he could go by so we've had some exciting news in the CTE world and they will brag you know about themselves but I'll kind of brag for you um they just get got a $1.7 million grant that was just awarded I don't know if you saw the news flash with 22 million Statewide so the 22 million awarded Statewide 1.7 coming right here to Clay and this is for um several programs but the exciting new is Advanced manufacturing which would be a new program added to the repertoire when you look at the number of programs that we have and the amount of school choice options within within the schools that we have there there there's literally something for everybody uh as far as options go so $1.7 million and of course the managing of that falls largely on Alice pul and and Kelly Mosley who who do a great job within within that department in addition we got a $1.2 million grant for Elementary music education uh young man that you're going to meet board meeting Chris Google is the district um um Fine Arts specialist which was uh a creation to kind of manage all of those Fine Arts and the celebration of Fine Arts it's so important to me and I know it is for the board also for students to have options within the school system of programs they can be involved with and certainly the Fine Arts is an area that we've always invested in as a board and I appreciate that because every student needs to feel connected to their school and whether it's the Fine Arts of band um chorus theater the Arts self or Athletics or anything else students you feel connected to the school which really goes beyond English math science and social studies it pains me to say that but all of the relationships and connections that I have from my own personal School experience I never talk about the guy that that was my friend in Alro one class it's always the person that I was that I played sports with or I did something else so there's a connectedness piece to being in school transcends just the normal uh academics let's put it that way so very very important very proud of the work of the board uh in relation to support the F Arts so thank you so much kind of going through the um the agenda uh I'm up to the minutes I didn't see anything there the employee work calendar is the second item um and it's a revision for 2425 to ensure the 180-day compliance is the revised calendar item that you see there then there's a another item related to uh it it's called better cloud and better cloud is a data loss prevention program for that yes yes what I would really appreciate when we're talking about um every time we go through these Pages it's mentioned in here it will cost a little bit more it looks like it is a better program for us when we get to I'm requesting from this day forth I guess uh Financial impact the purchase amount of 110 591731 to see how much more it's costing us um there's no reason I don't think we can we can add that there yeah we can add previous year yeah so every one can see that when we're approving something we're approving the cost increase as well so so in this particular case cost increase was it's about 100 bucks about 100 bucks yeah so that would look great that would look great it was in there fantastic so now we're on to the Personnel consent agenda and of course personel consent agenda will be updated just prior to to the board agenda on Tuesday there be one additional job description there for uh Central student education School side specialist so one of the things that we're looking to do in the 2425 school year provide more Folks at the actual School site itself and so this is an exciting opportunity and look for that to be added into the uh agenda Mr bosy how many students um you know when we're looking at expanding Junior High and elementary schools the capacity how many students generate another administrative position oh God go I think the number was I'd have to look at the allocation model document that would be worth highlighting when we look at allocations if we're adding those Wings by 2025 I just kind of like to see the overall impact on I think I think in this particular case there's a there's a shift using Behavior side coaches as well as Staffing Specialists to have one person from the ESC World dedicated to all the services of the school and and moving those folks from from uh from the district to the school level to provide those supports awesome we are seeing an influx in the number of students uh particularly in ASD and other programs out there in the schools that need to provide more support locally at the school level uh is and I think that's a beautiful example of growing smaller as we grow larger I think highlighting when we when we do that when we push more support into schools and um make our school communities individually stronger I think it's important to highlight that awesome and so so too when it comes to to allocations you know the allocation package comes out in March uh we've been working on that package for the last four months to get to that point to do that Howa we call each board member individually to have an individual meeting because it's it's a lot uh what I've heard from the board is they don't want all of it at one time because it's a massive amount of information so we want to give you the information a little ear there and have multiple meetings so that there's a full comprehension of that so we're looking for that to happen uh I think it was the week left up the 16th of February off the top of my head in that time range in the board workshop and then final approval in March all right so so next is complete Sal schedule so Florida statute requires us to have single document that highlights the things that you've already done so for example you've already approved uh through the approval of the contract for instructional and support we've already improved the both of those contracts in the case of the instructional contract uh there was an increase in pay depending on where you were from 3% to almost 9% depending on where you were on that scale how many years of experience you had uh I would say this that that majority of the money went towards teachers uh that were in veteran status for to 18 years experience or more with been there uh I will also point out that in the in the area of support folks uh it was about a 7.2% increase uh depending on what administrative class which classification you were uh bus drivers saw a percentage increase depending because we awarded experiences any it ranged anywhere from 3% to 24% in the bus driver in the bus driver realm depending on the individual so I think the board's done a great job of trying to prioritize because not every position has the same challenges and has the same needs or quite frankly has the same supply and demand and therefore we allowed for for different initiation for that in addition to that there's um a 3% increase in administration from 315 to 4275 as uh an increase for them as we discussed can I ask you a couple just a couple quick question during bargaining at some point someone said to me well we need to get this done so the teachers can get their money before Christmas right they haven't gotten it when will that happen so on the 31st paycheck instructural employees receive their their pay increase there'll be an email that'll be going out this week to them the the challenge is right when you differentiate then you have instructional employees roughly 2900 approximately are instructional employees so depending on who you are within that 2900 the pay increase is different for example School psychologists received uh you know compensation increase under that each person depending on the number of years experience would receive a different level the highest amount going towards our veteran teachers like this is one of the first years with the law allowed us to do that so you're going to see all of those we had to put a communication together that will explain to a variety of people how this impacts them and one of the biggest things on the email that'll come out and I'll forward it to the board is at the bottom it says if you have a question please contact Jeff shriber but people still had reply and it comes back to me forwarded to Jeff D right uh we all know that sometimes people don't um hone in on the details of an email they just quickly want to know like like what does this mean for me right so you'll see that email come out so uh and then there's the challenge of retro everybody because remember the the increase is from July 1st so that retro was and and uh sespo was the 15th correct and then CCA was the um the end of February the end of February because a lot of that has to be hand done in C in all that is in the is in the works so then I only have one question because you answered a couple of them right there um when we and I've had a quite a few emails about this you know I can't pick and choose what I get but my question is last year teachers not this year but in 2223 they received highly effective or effective pay correct correct so if they get it again that's not actually an increase that's just they get it again right no no once you get it it's your new base then if you get it again you increase to the base so this here is the increase to their base for everybody increase yes ma'am it's not just a continuance of what they had last year correct thank correct so so just I just wanted you to clarify that cuz there's a lot of question surrounding yeah so you're going to see I I'll for the email to you cuz I I've read it reread it and read it again and even every time I go through it I say okay someone might be confused with the sentence structure because everybody is going to read it differently what confusing but it tries to point out well I think it's important to know that we prioritize our veteran teachers and the salary schedule reflects the prioritization towards them right that means everybody is getting a different amount depending on the number of years experience they have which creates the confusion so uh so when it becomes part of their new base that's their base salary that cannot be taken away Oren it becomes part of the permanent base salary in which next year we would negotiate from that base salary okay yeah and and I'm just point out extremely proud of the board these last four years been the highest compensation proposal in the history of clay count schools right so say that we're not attempting now are we where we need to be the answer is no but if you're looking at the facts not Facebook on this issue it's the highest four years ever okay that's that's fact that's not baseball okay so I'm very proud of the board we're going to continue to do that as long as long as we can so with with that also in mind one of the things I heard from the board was uh they would like more more um input and um related to contract negotiations and all of that so so I'd like to check your calendar we're going to go ahead and put a uh a meeting notice out but our labor a labor attorney is with rumberger Kirk and cwell and they're based out of um Tallahassee okay we're going to set up a meeting with the board to be an all day meeting it's so important because what what tends to happen here uh we'll believe that everything is is good then all of a sudden at the end some going say hey what about this what about that the input has to happen at the beginning of the process otherwise you can't maneuver and negotiate with that so we we looked at a date uh and we'll send an email to you but because I know everybody's got their own stuff going we're looking at April 10th uh it will be basically a full day a full day meeting it's a large topic is April 10th before or after the allocations come out it would be [Music] after so the purpose the purpose of the of the of the meeting would be one to go ahead and and get the direction of the board as to our contract negotiations the actual number as far as salary increases like what can you do as far as the amount that wouldn't be determined until a budget is is proposed so that would that's not part of the process there would be a description and I can't speak for the attorney there would be a description as to the process and what the laws currently say related to that how that can work but the purpose of this is not to come up with an exact number per se it's not going to be a meeting in which you said yeah this is what we're proposing because Dr GCO the first one to tell you she wouldn't have an idea at that point because we wouldn't have a budet prepared in order to make those decisions so I went to the oh sorry oh that's okay just real quick question would that be a special meeting or an executive session be an executive session go ahead Miss so when I went to the fsba seminar on bargaining having frequent and more often executive sessions the trouble I I I appreciate April 10th actually putting aside it's more executive sessions than we had this year so that's one one good start of a whole day with a labor attorney but I also have a bit of angst about if the board wanted something waiting this long because honestly in my mind the goal for this County should be to ratify contracts before the school year starts many many counties do it I don't know if we need to call them and figure out how they do that but waiting until we're hard up on deadlines is not the best way to operate and it absolutely many counties get it done before then I don't know how their CFOs manag that um but I would like someone to look into how that time that time scale of events happens because I am firmly against this negotiating up to a hard date of like an October 1 and everybody's like we want this we want I it honestly should be a process and we should be able to move through that process before the school year starts yeah no no doubt the goal is and we have setal so April's kind of late to do that prior to the to the start uh of the school year and we've done that one of the challenges is is that the budgetary amount that doc would propose is based on the number of students that we that we have that generate funds at the start of this year it became apparent that the number of students weren't there to support So to give the maximum amount to our employees there was a delay in the process proc I understand so that we could provide the maximum amount of compensation well my understanding is every county has to go through that same process I mean every county is getting the same Financial reports the same amount of money at the same time and there's absolutely like I said I don't know if we need to start a little research team try to figure out how to maybe this year we move it up a little bit we get done by August and then maybe set a goal for two years from now we could ratify before the next school year but there are I mean probably half the counties ratify before the school year starts and I don't how you feel as a board but we just maybe should try to look into figuring that out and each of the counties is different so there there are a lot of counties in the state that are not experiencing growth for instance so students every year because of that if you've got that number of students and you're anticipating a very similar number of students yes it's much easier to it's much easier smaller we're growing too we assuming the money I agree but here again we don't have our First Financial meeting ever and it's not allowed by the state if I'm not mistaken until July the trim and that the trim meeting that very first Tri meeting now we can I don't know if that's the end date or the beginning date that's the beginning date and that is set by the state and so there are certain things that we have to wait so they must ratify right after that because they are ratifying before the school year begins like I think the Nuance is when you're in a season of growth and I have read an article that said Clay County is surpassing a lot of other counties in the state with our rate of growth and so we're we're making promises based on projections and then when those projections don't meet realization I understand the process yes so I think that's the Nuance that Mr ry's pointing out we have in years past we have how they do we can't was my question because their projections must have lined up and ours did not I don't know that cuz I have not researched how they got to that place I think I think can't make assumptions I think it's a goal that that's a good goal I'm just merely trying to offer I think it's a good goal as a district to not wait until if we don't get it done by this date we're in trouble I mean that I just don't like that so I want to say too I've talked to a couple of other districts uh board members across the state that they have a minimum a minimum of three executive sessions before they actually finalize or or um we have this year but that's what I'm saying a minimum sessions but what way we did our executive sessions where we're presented a topic you know is not the executive sessions that other districts are having prior to negotiating that that's what this that's what this this is it's it's by the guy that reads that 20 different school districts but I believe we should go in open-minded because if we always talk about oh absolutely um the difficulties of something without going outside of that box to to find a way to do something better then will'll just be a a stuck County saying the challenge is the challenges the challenges when I feel like we are a bright group of people who can actually attack a challenge and actually move forward with some of the concerns I don't disagree but I think it's also important to understand why we do it the way that we do it before we change well they do tell us that every year so I know the why for sure and just to clarify so the so the so the shade the executive session will be to talk strategy so general education we're not going to do the shade meeting per for statute so we'll we'll kind of break it up we'll notice it for shade meeting but general education you know I'll talk to the attorney as well make sure but I think he's also going to go over some some general guidelines and education we don't want to do that in the shade being so we we when youall are in a room behind closed doors talking about so we want to make sure that it's it's very so we'll Define that but we need to we need to notice the shade meeting which we'll work on and and and Define that should we have a dual meeting where we have a public meeting and then we go into a shade session and then close out the public meeting yes ma'am I and I think it depends on what he's going to cover so if he's going to talk about strategy which I think I believe he is we need to do that in a shade meeting but also believe that he was going to make himself available to talk about General kind of Labor negotiations and kind of um just some general thoughts on that so I think what would be helpful is I'll get with them before that let's kind of Define that a little bit maybe get an agenda together and I think we can just simply go roll right into a shade meeting maybe start you know maybe start with the educational component then roll into a shade meeting that way we don't get run a fou with anything we have we have a few months to prepare this but I think at this point we're just scheduling and ter to figure that out so and then between then and the type of meetings we had this year we could request another executive meeting with the superintendent about ideas or concerns bargaining right within yes within the confines of the ex so so the for is very narrow what what triggers a shade meeting and generally you what's helpful to me is you always want to think about is if there's a strategy that you have to discuss right you're not going to discuss a legal strategy in front of a team or you know fromont of the public or labor negotiation so it's a very unique carve out where we are allowed to have those discussions confidentially um you but we we have to make sure we really stay within those confines because the courts have been very hard on local governments to try to skirt around that and sometimes just simply by they're trying to do the right thing and made a mistake so part of my job is to make sure we stay within that can the board have or ask questions or have input about what the shade meeting could be notified as well is it yes ma'am well so technically the way a shade meeting is supposed to happen is the uh board attorney is supposed to notify the board at a public meeting that we we need to have a shade meeting um for labor negotiat just a little bit more Nuance I think it's fine that the superintendent just brought it up because this is a public meeting it's known as The public's here but generally what would happen is the legal team would would go to the superintendent or public would ask the board for a shade meeting that's way it's supposed per for statute is supposed to be scheduled so I know sometimes we've local government gets in a hurry and and we have a lot going on but we we want to make sure we we stay consistent with that and if we have questions about that procedure we can ask you please absolutely I want you to make sure we stay within the confined AB ABS absolutely and and I think the best way to do that if y'all believe that something's coming up or under some litigation that y'all would like some additional discussion on as a board then you can have that conversation with me you know let me help you all by making that Det termination that Waits on me and not on you all um and then we can kind of go go from there I think in the beginning there was some litigation I sat down with they individually went over we also can handle that way as well we don't necessarily have to have the Shaving is really for yall as a board to give direction to your legal team you know to how to how to move forward does that make sense is that does that clarify everything so we we looked at the at that meeting is being a kicked off to provide interu information about that because there's not only the process of of how negotiations go and what the statutes say related to that but this particular year also it's a full book year which means that all contract language itself is also uh going to be discussed and the process by which that's done back and forth would be described that's why the having the kickoff meeting is so important because the board would need to provide Direction up front you can't at the very last second say hey somebody told me this that that would interfere with the whole process as a whole to add it on that's why you're going to get everything up front reviewed thoroughly by the labor attorney your input will be garnered and then we're proceeding forward so when you're talking about redoing the entire the master contract this is the year to do that will there be like a special meeting it's so long do we do it in parts Part yeah part of it's going to be during that meeting okay how to do that some of it when you look at a contract itself some of it is very basic like there's a usually a page on manag of Rights there's usually a page on grievance procedures there's usually a page on this what we're looking for is the input of the things that you would like to either see in a contract or not see in a contract okay board Direction yes um I know when I was first on the board they used to give us every year a paper copy of the master contract can do could we get that as soon as possible sure and then that we have itl not and then when we get to that meeting we've all had two months to look it over and decide what we need to discuss does that make sense that makes a lot of sense I can have a Pap meeting perect I have a yeah I've been that's a good idea feel like you have to look at it for the first time we'll send you an email about the the April 10 God so on K12 uh academic out of out of state overnight travel no questions on that one if they need um chaperon for Puerto R contact me then we have proposed summer school programs is the next title Proclamation for uh Black History Month that's the next title the next one is a uh um a charter renewal contract of Florida Cyber Charter Academy so under under the statute this is a a routine process by which the statute provides that we would approve the contract if they met all of the requirements which they do based on the information provided the next is a proclamation for career and tech ed month uh next is the advertisement for the adoption of K12 social studies and science materials next is uh the proclamation for National School counseling week then you see proposed allocation changes I would note that the allocations uh that are proposed to our adult community head and one is one is uh to our ESC related federally funded programs next is the monthly Financial reports and the budget report deletion of certain items those are all routine reports and of course doc doc isn't here this morning next is the bid renewal for fire extinguisher and kitchen Hood inspection athletic field maintenance gym and stage 4 maintenance and ref finishing and you can see that information there next is the uh Safety and Security emergency communications cont contract for oakle junior high school is a safe program I got sorry this I just think about it and I have to ask when is our I know that's for the fil the filled renewal but when is it for um when does the contracts come up for grass cutting yeah when do the ABM contract upm um yeah oh I can find out pre-qualification of contractors plus we have the U theary final for Orange Park Elementary restroom renovation Lakeside Elementary School restroom renovation uh the disillusion for disposal of portable classrooms and Associate equipment from charlese Bennett we having a ceremony for that any comments go ribbon bur has a sense of humor at this purchase agreement for for portable to go out to J uh to Penny retirement community they wanted one of those and so I personally feel like when we go under 9900 we should have a celebration and then under 800 like can I have like a little schematic where you put a little we could have what I Callet can we put a thermometer behind you over there because I think it's a great idea Lance I think you need to work on that idea we have the purch agreement for that .16 acre for MCL Elementary remember the person that has the adjoining property of land showed you the map up on the screen and all of that next is the change order for Clay High Gym renovation um and you can see the change orders there and then the final for uh spj fire alarm system repair and AR Park high school media center Renovations and then the change order for middleb high school cafeteria expansion that's open and fully functioning beautiful pictures and then Fleming Island's uh batting cage and the erosion issue at Fleming Island and that completes all of those uh for the [Music] agenda do you want me to go into the next item chair yes are you wanting to do the supplemental math program first yes uh so so we do have one last presentations on supplemental math uh programs one of the things I heard from the board is you wanted information sooner then later as well as um being aized of that so really when it comes to being prepared for next year we started about 4 months ago starting to get ready for next year and all of the things you see now are the product of four months of work to get to this point CU we're constantly planning for the year ahead so one of the things that the board had brought to our attention was a couple of things you talked about allocations talked about contracts you also talked about uh computer AED instruction and wanting to see those programs ahead of time so each year we've always have but intensified our efforts for return on investment studies related to each one of those programs we've surveyed teachers as well as provide information to to board members related to uh how these programs are used what are the percentages what are the number of minutes Etc and why we do the things that we do related to that so this item that you're going to hear about for a couple minutes today is not on the February agenda that's on the March agenda right and so we kind of planned out a systematic step by which we survey teachers by which we analyze data and we make informed decisions about the programs that we use so this will be the first in a step process a lot of time a lot of effort by a lot of people to get to this to get to this point so that and I recommend you Mr Browski because everybody I know loves this program so it's probably a really really great one to start with there you go thank you um my name is goind po I am the elementary math specialist here in Clay County um this is my third year um as the elementary math specialist so our really main role is to work alongside teachers in all 28 of our elementary schools um we train teachers on the new best standards on our new curriculum and absolutely um we help Implement I into our classrooms um across all 28 of our elementary schools so I just want to give you some information I know that it's very important for the school board to have a complete understanding of I ready and how it is used in our classrooms so in our mathematics classrooms we have a daily 82 minute math Block in kindergarten through fifth grade so in in math we really just have two resources we have our adopted curriculum Eureka Math Square and that's 60 Minutes of teacher-led instruction then we have our supplemental curriculum I ready um and so that is 6 to 9 Minutes a a day and so kind of an odd range but the I ready range is 30 to 45 minutes a week which really lays out to 6 to 9 minutes a day and then I ready also has additional supplements of teacher um lesson plans that are fully aligned to our Florida vest standards that are also used for that addition 15 to 22 minutes of teacher-led small group instruction here I just wanted to give you a graphic um of how much time students are really spending in front of the computer we are very cognizant of that I know that the board is very cognizant of that until I wanted to make it clear um our teachers are really what makes Clay County Thrive and so our 82 minute math BL here again we have 73% of that in our whole group instruction we have about 20% in that small group instruction teachers are really targeting um or enriching the skills that individual students need or small groups need and then we have that 7% where teachers um do have students on the computer really to spend some time on I ready and so obviously we know that 30 to 45 minute is a range and so lots of um you know different people can say well I spend less time on I ready or I more time on I ready I hear different things um so what we did is we actually wanted to go into the data we wanted to know what exactly um and how how much time students are spending on I ready so this is data from last school year so we have the complete year to go on and what you're looking at here is broken down by grade level exactly how many minutes students approximately spent on I ready per week so you can see in kindergarten a kindergarten student spend about 31 minutes a week that's about 6 minutes a day um when I say that typically in kindergarten they're not going to have the students logging in every single day because we know that takes a little more time to get the kids to log in um typically our primary teachers will break it um apart into two 15 minute sessions a day that's what we've seen in classrooms across the district um you can see that all of the grade levels K by were actually below that 30 to 45 or 49 minute range um and that they're using it as prescribed we're not walking in and and students aren't getting on the computer right away they really are using it as a supplement to their Core Curriculum that they are are teaching um in their classroom some additional data right here it says that with the use of I a typical year um of student growth is 100% um and for the last school year it says when students are using already between um 30 and 45 minutes with 70% or higher increased uh past lessons that they're having 127% um growth so ginda before you go on to the next slide just to be just to be clear this this is the actual data from the actual program not when people have told you about it absolutely and this is from Clay County and in our actual district with our students um here so this uh really made me realize teachers are using it as prescribed they're not sitting stud um students in front of the computer and we see this we see in our classrooms again I'm in classrooms across um the district and teachers are just using it as as a compliment to their instruction again when you look at all of this blue here this is teacher Le um instruction and just just that little bit of of green there is when you're in front of the computer during that math time so let's go into what is I ready just so you can kind of get a full understanding so I ready for kindergarten through fifth grade start students on a diagnostic assessment about 30 minutes minutes um and what that does is it provides teachers with a report and multiple reports that tell exactly where a students strengths are and where their areas of growth are so if you're a fifth grade teacher and you have three blocks of you know 20 students you have 60 students it's very hard to know where each individual student um has specific strength and specific areas to grow so that diagnostic assessment is going to give a report for every individual student that says this student is um you know accelerated in geometric reasoning but needs a little bit of a boost in number sense and operations based on that first diagnostic assessment it put students on an individualized learning path and that's going to provide them lessons that meet at their ability level so again do they need enrichment or do they need um a little bit of scaffolding there's also teacher assign lessons which what um me and my team have done is taken our Core Curriculum of Eureka Mas and aligned the lessons in IRA ready with our curriculum so that gives teachers the opportunity to go in and assign a lesson they teach a full 60-minute P lesson on a particular Benchmark and then the students are going to go onto their computer for that um computer time and then they get an additional amount of instruction on that same Benchmark and what we've really noticed is that has increased student achievement because they can see the math in multiple modalities some Learners May learn best from a teacher they may be paper pencil I know I I prefer paper pencil but in today's generation some Learners may get a lot from their teacher but it all clicks for them when they're able to see it in this digitized world and another addition to I ready is available in second through fifth grade is standards Mastery and one thing I really want to highlight with I ready um is that I ready really has worked to mirror some ways of our state testing with the fastest assessment and the star assessment we can't control how the state tells us to assess um but they have told us we're having three assessments and they're all going to be on the computer so standards Mastery is a benchmark aligned practice question uh questions there's five questions for every Benchmark that offers the same level of rigor that we see on that fast assessment and has the same type of questions it has the drop- down menus it has the drag um and dropped it has obviously the multiple choice um the grided uh different type of responses and so this has been a game Cher for allowing our students some more familiarity with what they're going to see in that online platform from the state if they're only seeing this online platform three times when they're in these kind of high stakes testing we know that they're not going to be as familiar and we really feel they're not going to be as prepared to answer those questions because they're going to be trying to figure out the program and I ready has really allowed for the students to gain some some familiarity with that we also have fluency flight which is a new edition this year to IR so this really came as a request from the teachers so they were constantly saying our students need more practice with fluency anyone who has School Aids children know that um and so teachers were trying to explore other avenues to get students more fluent um and explore other websites reflux and and gim kit and Prodigy um and we know with house I think 379 um that is no longer allowed because technology in K Public Schools is very regulated so we can't have um teachers registering their students for free absolutely free websites because of of data uh sharing and different selling websites so we went to IR ready and said what do you have to increase specific fluency and they said we have fluency flight I think it was like a Wednesday and they I went to them Thursday and then the administrator meeting the next week we said this is an option we're rolling it out let's do this instead of have having teachers search for websites that may not be vetted that may be selling children's data and that we know is is not um allowed based upon the state statutes so this was a great addition this school year does it add any extra time to that 30 to 45 minute range it doesn't we still stay within that 30 to 45 minute range per week hey good can I ask you a question yeah that's why did we do that to begin with fluency flight yes that's a great question so initially I already didn't provide fluency flight we've had I for quite a few years now and we are actually one of the few districts who are piloting this program and so when I came to them I said hey what do you have and they said well we haven't rolled this out Nationwide yet um but a few districts in Florida have it and a few other districts but if they had it when we started I'm sure we would have gotten it any other questions I just like the part about no speed anxiety yes absolutely so this is something else I I will um highlight with fluency flight in the best standards book it says in kindergarten through fifth grade um students should not have time test and we have teachers who have been teaching a long time um and that was a regular when we were all in school you have 40 minutes Ready set go um but now we know that you know there's a better practice and research has really showed that that increases anxiety and this in it's gamified mode um it's not going to increase that anxiety but it's going to teach the students their facts which you know how important that is so let's switch gears a little bit we talked about the digital aspect of I ready but what makes I ready different is um the actual lesson plans that are fully aligned to the best benchmarks so what I already toolbox provide is these resources right here um and it actually uses student data from that initial Diagnostic and it provides the resources to the teacher that says these this group of five students has this area to growth in print this lesson plan out do it in small group these few days um and hopefully we'll be able to close that Gap our goal is to close gaps in in any um weakness a student may have um and they may have it for one day just because maybe they were absent a day you know they may need a little bit of time um but the paper based resources are we think is really invaluable teachers have that 22-minute um intervention block but lots of teachers ask what should I be pulling what resources should I be using there's a lot of unvetted online websites that teachers are quick to to log into and pull things from um but we know that this is aligned to our qu of Benchmark specifically so here you can see we have a ready instruction book a practice and problem solving Book lesson quizzes and assessments there's teacher-led small group lessons and then student independent activities which we have a lot of teachers asking for can we get some Center activities they do provide those as well um in your packet that second pack of paper right there I gave you just one example of that practice and problem solving book um there's a lesson there it's fifth grade fractions fr12 um and adding and subtracting fractions with unlike denominators we know if you've ever been a fifth grade teacher or fifth grade student that's um a concept that may need some revisiting um so here's just an example of a lense plan that would be given would be giving to the teachers to work alongside the students um again I already does offer a multitude of resources that are for the teacher to still be that Master of the classroom um but also homeing into each individual student I just don't say the answer key to know whether oh it's on there I don't want to print out too big of a packet for that specific benchmark there's six or seven resources and I could have filled your your notebook today I do want to point out that I ready with these teacher love lessons is is one of our main sources here of tier 2 resources that we use to Target a specific area of need um obviously to ensure that our students are successful so we did survey our teachers as as Mr brosi um said and I did want to share some of this data um we got over 220 responses and this is just K5 Math teachers so our first question is do you utilize the reports which is going to tell the teachers exactly where those students are so obviously you can see here we got an overwhelming yes and then all these little slivers here are actually telling us what they use it for like Absolut like I use it for a small group I use it when I make IEPs um I haven't utilized it yet but after that second diagnostic then I'm really going to beef it up because then I can see these are the benchmarks I've already taught what needs a little bit of extra what about the know people that's kind of this was a small uh significant amount and I I did I looked at that and I was like H that's interesting now it could be because they use their classroom data from their assessments and their quizzes um is that going to give them the specific data Maybe not we did put this survey out before diagnostic too so it could be some that aren't going to use it at the very beginning of the year but use it after diagnostic too I was just surprised that the size of the no a portion of the no absolutely um but but yeah how often and maybe this we could for this particular program but just in general how often do we actually get feedback from our teachers with these programs so that we know if hey they're utilizing it correctly or hey we need to support this group trade a little bit more or hey you know maybe they need this or that I know you did it for for this particular presentation but how often are we doing it for our this was actually done before this presentation was even a figment of our imagination but how often so we do it every year and then how often are we doing it with other programs so we've done it every year I've been in this position three years so we've done it every year with I ready and we always say you know our stakeholder input is the most important thing we want to know is this working for you is it providing you with the materials the aligned materials that you need um and and you can see from some of the continued on um we did get great feedback from it we do it every year we also have open um responses we have the teachers actually put their information in it so we can group it by grade level um or even by school so I know some schools may be using it in different ways than others but we we do it yearly um and ask questions that are open-ended like what other supports do you need um what benefits or or what drawbacks do you see with this program um additional comments and I do have those I can provide them um to the board the next time you meet but I mean we have just pages and pages of additional comments well I follow up though to miss Skipper's question you were asking how often are those questions asked of teachers okay so formal evaluation let's say is done once a year but are there a lot of informal evaluations that are done for instance if teachers have I mean that no grp let's say I'm a new teacher and I don't know how to use groups yet what do I do those sorts of evaluations I think are just as critical is there a help desk is there who do they talk who do they talk to question so I I um math coach yes so I have three additional math coaches and we are in schools um more than 80% of the time actually this up to today we' spent over 700 hours in schools between the four of us just this school year working alongside teachers um working setting goals for student achievement in student mastery and I already is is obviously at the Forefront of that um to give those resources so we would probably ask you know how are you using I ready this again was also um given probably about a month or two ago so our newer teachers um maybe kind of sifting through some things um and I ready is something that we may visit after diagnostic too we're hosting a collaborative for our teachers we do a K2 collaborative and a 35 collaborative where we bring the teachers in and we always spend a portion of our time kind of refreshing on an I ready and sharing some new information so yeah good question yeah I tell you guys when I was at swimming pen and I had a whole bunch of fourth graders crammed in two classes if I ever wanted to be happy I went to watch or stood outside Miss Po's door oh I appreciate she is as dynamic as a teacher as she is as a presenter oh than you I love I love being in the classroom I I missed it all the time so I I find me back there before you know it where my heart is um but I loved it I appreciate I appreciate that and I loved teaching it um that's quick love in the classroom so coming back um this was our first question do you utilize those reports then we had this teachers rank how how they felt I ready use impacting their student achievement teachers are going to know best how their students are performing um so if a teacher felt I already had a low impact it would be a one um and a high impact was a five so you can see this is hugely over here on a high impact for um the teachers and and aiding in their instruction this was very eye opening to me here this was another uh question do you do you utilize those I already teacher toolbox lessons those are those principle lessons teachers are using to have that teacher Le small group uh nearly 70% say yes this 133% here wanted to tell us how they were using them so yeah I use it for a small group I use it for Teacher L instruction I'm like that's also yes but I appreciated them letting me know how they were using it we use it to plan IEPs I'm not yet um we did have some say we just adopted a brand new curriculum um so I'm really trying to get my feet under me with that but I'm going to come back to using it like I did regularly with the new curriculum we know that there's a little bit of a learning curve so we're their typical 60 Minute whole group lesson maybe taking 65 or 70 just until they get familiar with it it may not leave as much time for that I'd also say experience when I use I already reading you're in the red box for a while it is really hard to learn how to master and navigate all those resources so doesn't mean they may not be it just it's difficult in the beginning yep and you're kind of trying to figure out all your resources and every year it's going to be different with the needs of your students absolutely thank you for sharing that do you utilize those teacher assigned lessons so that's what we had talked about how um me and my team have aligned our Eureka MTH Square to the lessons in I ready because I ready um gives students lessons at their specific need but we also need to make sure that students are seeing their grade level content if they were getting lessons from my already that may have been above their um grade level that's wonderful but if they were getting ones that were a little bit below and kind of building them up we want to make sure they're seeing the same thing that um the teacher is teaching obviously for that various modality so 74% said yes and then again all these little slivers are telling us how how they did in the past I'm familiar with it I have in the past but with the New Year I'm kind of getting my feet under under you um this last question was just kind of a broad like what is your recommendation do you feel this is valuable for a mathematics computer assisted instruction program for next school year um a resounding 88% that absolutely continue with I ready influency flight um there was a small portion here that said don't offer a a a program but again it was very very small out of 223 teachers um I can look at the exact stats but I think it was only about five and we did have some teachers who did a little bit of research and said like maybe we should try a zern which isn't align to the best standard so I would not recommend that um or a con Academy there's Alex which we use in that secondary but a very small amount these these here are just one person maybe had said that overall um the familiarity the resources that I ready um offers absolutely teachers are saying yes and we have explore all of these other programs um Tito will tell you we've brought in a lot of vendors over the past two years just to say you know we're always trying to grow here in Clay County and make sure that we're giving our teachers the best um and none of them provide the aligned teacher lesson plans where teachers get to be the master of their classroom and provide learning to students all of the others are full online instruction programs you teach for your 30 or at 60 minutes then you get on the computer for 30 minutes and we really wanted to make sure the teachers um had that time in their classroom to get to know exactly what their students need here's just some data again it's from last school year because we have the whole picture of the entire school year um it's fall to spring so obviously we don't expect students coming in knowing content for the next school year so we had a significant amount of students one grade level below which would make sense they haven't learned any of that yet and then in the spring um here the majority of our students are on grade level um a much smaller amount that still need that that scaffolding up and then I just kind of wanted to give an overview of our I ready resources um so what I really want to highlight and this actually hit home for me last week I was at the Florida Association of math supervisors people in my position from all 67 districts in Florida come together at a conference and we were talking about assessments how are we getting our youngest students including kindergarteners ready for these online assessments um and many districts had shared they're even doing their weekly quizzes their um you know bi-weekly kind of unit tests on the computer or they have them available to the computer I said even in your primary grades and they said yes they're you know even if the kids have a paper and pencil they're expected to go back in on the computer and enter their answers and and I really felt like that's not what we need to do in Clay County what we have is I read and it's allowing students to have that familiarity and that format in function what they need to be prepared for the St and fast assessment so I was like going to draw the line right there but I think every already is giving us the um resources that we need obviously those aligned teacher-led instruction resources for small group for tier 2 instruction I list a whole bunch of resources here but it's again all of those things available in the teacher toolbox that are tools for the teacher to be teaching um we absolutely need those data um groupings and profiles that I already give that'll ows each teacher to know exactly where all potentially 60 of the plus of their students are um and then absolutely that fluency flight because we know teachers are always saying those KS need to know their wel back um so it it does provide that so we really see the value in I ready I really hope I'm emulating the word of of the teachers in Clay County not only with the survey but what we see out in classrooms every day um I think that's all I have for you so I'm here for all your questions you have the slide that shows the student growth I do um can that or is that already uh used for Progress monitoring within the district can that be used for that I believe so so we do take the data so were you asking in a way like what do you mean specifically for Progress monitoring like growth from one place to another yes like because I know we have the fast test that is state level yes historically we've also had a district level where we're monitoring so that we know what to expect so are we still doing that we are doing that with ready where I ready is at this moment is obviously we changed to the fast assessment last year and they are not willing to release um the alignment between what they think their projections are for I ready and their projections are for the past assessment because the test is so new so are we getting concrete like you have you know 82% of your students proficient so we think your fast assessment for efficiency will also be around 82% not yet but they've assured us that they're doing those anecdotal studies because they don't want to release something that's incorrect but we do we do track the data we have monthly meetings with I ready um and are very cognizant of where our students are and how they're progressing so at a district level that's what you guys would use I ready for I mean obviously it's beneficial in the classroom but at the district level it gives you as the math curriculum specialist an overview of how students are performing across the district in math yeah absolutely and the state is really come out and said that fast assessment data does not go granular enough to te Teach from so when we host our collaboratives they they give those reporting categories and that's large buckets of benchmarks within one category but I already does go a lot more granular so it can pinpoint specific areas of of weakness for a student and where we can remediate that so absolutely also say that the end of the year data you showed with the 71% of Mastery mirrored the um fast T the fast assessment it's pretty close it's pretty close it's pretty close they're unwilling to uh to share that yet obviously they want to make sure it's correct um but with the um previous assessment it was pretty close as well so yeah so in case you guys didn't know Kenda poor is an outstanding educator I didn't know so something else that I I'd like to point out to it's kind of a bigger picture of all of this because I think sometimes the information isn't given and I don't think we we've had uh not say the previous board we haven't had any interest in getting down into the granular we related to it but we've always done return on investment studies on all of our programs and always done what you saw today now you see it in a formalized presentation so if you're wondering like what does the district do behind the scenes related to these programs you now know the other thing I'd like to point out is theend 4 is a specialist she's the elementary math specialist so if you look at this as being one piece of the district how that works you have a specialist and coaches that do this work in order to support teachers you can't just leave teachers out there on their own and say here you go try to figure it out doesn't work that way instead you're talking about side by side instruction so her title is a specialist right so we have a secondary math specialist we have Ela specialist we have science and we also have um a social studies specialist and then you have coaches that help to support the work you know so I'd also like to point out that Klay county is ninth in the State of Florida in mathematics education there's there's 57 other districts or 58 my M other District love be where you are so so when I look at that I say I wonder if the board recognized that there's an organized approach strategically to leverage students in the way we're at so you can't you can't just look at one thing and say oh that program here or that book here or that there that book is one piece of a bigger plan to increase student achievement and if you're KNE in the State of Florida I would add it's pretty darn good can it be better of course if you're not number one it can be better but if you're knife that's pretty darn good okay so you can't just take a process or a program away from the whole strategic plan to develop what's been developed I think that's why like I said this is this is this program this is an ideal program I went to elementary school um I already reading was valuable to me I didn't never heard a math teacher complaint about already she's absolutely right but I will tell you that our contract for penda learning is coming and I I do have um data and information on that program that I would appreciate this type of presentation because we use it in third grade not everybody's UTI utilizing it the way it should be we're using it for homework it's not going to be this ideal um they're using it a lot more for computers than they should and I know that is for a fact so if I can request that for penda learning so we can have that discussion we already have a way to do that to bring that forward so the board can see each one of these programs how how it's integrated it's coming up I think next month pend learning andge and how it's part of the overall process so again one of the things I'd emphasized to the board is that there's a whole strategic plan for this it's not isolate it's not as simple as this book this program this person all of it's interconnected so I thought Kendo would be a good person to start with so you could see the interconnectedness right how it aligns to the curriculum how the people then are strategically utilized to improve teacher performance and thus improve student achievement is all part of a whole plan you can't look at every little thing in isolation and pluck that out cuz that you're taking away a piece of the overall program that's what I wanted to try to emphasize from it but some programs utilize technology a lot there kids spending a lot of time on technology this program as you know small group is the most valuable time that we have with our students so this program is designed around small group not the technology so that makes this the the the perfect and you heard me emphasize is this like did you get that data from the program itself yeah again facts not Facebook we'll give you the data from the actual programs in that analysis and I have a question when we do these moving forward can we um if there there is a specific grade like you did fifth grade these 223 were from fifth graders can we ask all stakeholders that utilize the program because if it's not the best fit for first grade why you know why would we use it if we're it's not and I I mean I get it with I ready but I'm talking about just any program moving forward and then also she showed us on um one of her slides how many minutes that they're actually utilizing a week I know before in the past biggest concern was kids being on um screen screen time and not you know being in front of the classroom Etc or whatever that was one of our concerns and I think Miss Gil was actually actually specifically asked this question I don't know if you remember but for some reason I do is there a way to figure out how much time our kids are on these screens and you showed us this for just I ready alone so each program moving forward or maybe before we move forward if we find out all of our programs that we're utilizing the time um pulling this data to give us as board members a total number of okay our kids are utilizing 3 to four hours a day or a week or whatever on screens right that's that's the plan to provide you with that data that's what I would like and then miss Skipper I did just want to clarify so our survey results were 223 teachers from kindergarten through fifth grade teachers just fifth grade no kindergarten through fifth grade so we sent it to all Math teachers kindergarten through fifth grade um and then we got 223 I think responses so it was open to all of them but obviously we know in a survey every teachers time is very valuable they're all not going to respond to the survey it was quite brief you can see it's probably a 5 minute survey um but 223 responses um out of the the 400k five teachers I thought was very represent I misunderstood you I thought it was just gr that you no absolutely thank you I was running that number in my head earlier I'm going that's that's a great turnout it is we yeah we really feel like they they want a voice we do this survey every year last year it was very similar even though we're always you know out meeting with with vendors to try to say you know what do you have that's going to better serve our students um this really is what we feel like is the best um for our teachers at this moment thank you so much love to sit and listen to you teach math one day oh my I would love it I would love it that would just make my day we do teach a lot of math with our new Eureka Mas we um go out and work alongside teachers because with new benchmarks two years ago even our most veteran teachers are our new teachers to the benchmarks and with a new curriculum this year our most veteran teachers are are brand new toour curriculum so we go out and model quite a few lessons soome I'll take you any time thank you so much yes of course thank you so much what all right so our next item is to discuss revisions to the procedures manual for library media Services let me stretch for like 2 minutes because it's almost I mean we save me till noon we've been listening in 3 hours of speaking so maybe just a short reconvene at I'm minut okay 5 minutes I just need on e yes ma'am no no no the teacher really hard on um before I start I wanted to give the board a little bit of a timeline I think it was the end of October I called for a meeting with Mr blocker Mr Daly and Mr um uh brosi when I called the meeting I had a packet similar to this but I had written on it in pen um and and the goal was at the time there was a couple other sheets but there is nothing new in this policy that was not given to somebody back in October it might have been on separate sheets to look at it might have been an ink but I have been working on this copy since October so in November the county asked me if I would present the Poli or parts of it to the secondary media Specialists and that's important because most of these book challenges affect the secondary media specialist yes some happened in elementary school and there's also angst with the media Specialists about this topic as you probably understand why um so I I did the meeting on December 12th um the district quite frankly has monopolized our board attorney so what you see in front of you is me for 3 weeks working trying to figure out how to strike things out looking up laws typing in red trying not to make a mistake I spent 12 hours in a seat yesterday providing this document to you Mr blocker has since looked at it and he will make his recommendations but it was painstaking in addition to creating a policy that is not no offensive bath policy it was a page right this policy is very very um intimidating to say the least if you're not involved in the inner workings of the policy another thing that I knew had to happen in state law many many times if you read the education law book state law says stakeholders over and over and over again I feel like as a ward we will never move forward out of our box and our normal way of thinking as a district unless we start to bring diverse personalities and diverse thought into meetings where we can expand on what we believe our current knowledge is so what you have in front of you is we had 39 I'd like to round it up to 40 participants from all walks of life at this forum Miss Kidwell can um vouch for that um she showed up um we had teacher show up we had librarian show up so we had people of all walks of life and what I learned instead of being afraid or leery of talking to stakeholders is that stakeholders all have something in common one we love our kids two our stakeholders believe that every single parent in this County had the same rights as another parent and three there wasn't a single person in there that wanted our kids to read pornography I'm just going to throw that out there all right where the groups of people divide is because challenges separate out books based on the Challenger's opinion right it's a pretty terrible concept because if you are challenging multiple books and you have a preconceived idea of what's right in and wrong for children that's how we get into this mess that we are in today so I started the meeting with saying one thing and then we'll get into it if you were here to talk about band books this meeting is not for you however if you are here to work towards the better of our students and the betterment of our schools then you are welcome to stay and say whatever you need to say 40 people is a lot of people the other thing that I think you guys need to know is that this group of people understood to different degrees that compromise is the bridge that leads to progress we really don't have any experts because if nobody wants to hear what you have to say you're not an expert anymore if nobody understands what you're trying to say you're not an expert anymore so it's really about communicating with the people in our community in the uh best way that we can to help people understand that the best compromise will be the best for our district because we cannot make 100% of the people happy all the time so on that note I made the PowerPoint if you notice anything misspelled this PowerPoint was put together at the end of my 12-hour day yesterday and I did the best I could to uncomplicate what I think as a school board member of one year and two months a terrible experience when it's coming to a policy all right um oh I'm not good at this is it just be this no it is had to wake up okay so I'm trying to do this like a business I used to have a business right so you're going to it's going to be hard to follow along in here but when we get to it I'm going to want you to flip through all those deleted pages so one when I first read the policy this policy was outdated we had 30 something pages of procedures talking about DVR tapes or whatever the district when they read through it realized that hey hey we need to really so what you see is the district lining out a whole bunch of pages that we no longer need in a board policy in addition there will be a procedures handbook created that will need board approval and my hopes is I will get with the district because I have met with the media Specialists some more than once I have met with parents I understand the system as well as they do when it goes into their libraries what they have to do and how we as a board can make their job easier for untangling this mess all right so number one what drives a policy change the rationale parents have the right to determine what they believe is and is not appropriate reading material for their students no parent guardian or resident has the right to determine the reading viewing or listening resources for students other than their own and the school district of Clay County I'm assuming supports the principles of freedom of speech and the right to redress of grievances inherited in the First Amendment of the United unit States issues with our current policy this is not to hurt anybody's feelings but it you would have to be from Mars not to understand what I'm about to say extensive backlog of challenge titles lack of solutions for books that do not violate chapter 847 but still may not be appropriate for students I.E mature content lack of informed parental consent parents are confused opt in opt out I can just tell you right now they're all confused and hardly anybody has the true story our current policy is obviously not working for us and lack of stakeholder input so if you guys want to in here I made very few changes uh to most of the policy I did make a few changes in the policy see more parental input stakeholder input having parents involved on boards uh Community U school level curriculum conss things like that and you'll see those um when you flip through but for today I need your help flip two to you see a bunch of red uh there's no page numbers on this so like I want to look maybe Center management huh it's like five six pag in um it's actually halfway in just challenge materials you'll see it all of a sudden Mary it's just all red so can I ask for clarification real quick Miss hson sorry so the lined out items that I see on this were lined out by the district mostly okay but when it comes to the challenge part no we're not there that would be my I'm looking at the beginning the very beginning yes so then the red would be me on that first page yeah a couple little words on a couple pages to in parents and stakeholders that's what I wanted to the L out parts of the challenge part would be me but all the rest of these lined out pages are not me okay and just if I this corre Mr Dy and his staff went through and you know found a substantial amount of this policy probably was not policy per se so and they made their changes and send it back to the Mr blocker for further clarification we're talking this is a procedure manual and from this we're building the policy well I think it can't believe this is an issue with some of your policies and procedures there's a mixing of policy and procedures those are really two different things um I think a lot of this is inherited from decades ago it's kind of been added on to this is a problem the superintendent pointed out to me one of our first meetings so this has kind of been the policy SL procedure a lot of this proc cedural and outdated so I think we want to do is extract a policy from this right have the board adopt a policy then the procedural procedural aspect will will follow as far as the how book and I believe the district crossed out the procedural stuff so what's left in the policy um I believe is what right Mr B what they left is what they would think would be included in the policy not procedures right I got a not in the back okay yes but we do have a policy yes that's in here the policy is also in here yeah it's if you go about halfway the one so there you'll see anything left in Black so I just got a nod from the back um if you go like if you're looking let me explain to the board if you're looking through how to barcode something and stick it in a computer or copyright laws I'm not a media specialist everything in Black is what the district left okay okay everything they crossed off is everything that's crossed off so I'm skipping through these Pages because we we we can't sit here and talk about how to put a book on a shelf or whatever Librarians whatever they do they do but what we can talk about is the meat of the policy and the meat of the policy begins with challenge material procedure so I have a PowerPoint where I'm going to try to this this can I just make one more point just just also the board sets policy so yall's the board are the policy holders you all determine what the policy is the procedures for the most part really should be left to to the superintendent the district so to highlight what you're saying this is this discussion is more on the policy policy not not the actual procedures of and in this packet somewhere Miss Bola there is a line that says the district will create a procedures manual which the board will give approval and it's like it's a line somewhere in there in the pages but if we don't get to the part that's going to help solve our lives can I get just a clarification so when we voted on this policy because we passed the policy it went into the procedure manual yeah it's all together it did not go into the board policy not by itself correct I it was all everything's in there how to label a book how to by definition it it is a policy once you approve it well we did approve it but it's all together so we're hoping to separate the policy that's part of the issue she wants it separated with board policy policy and it's similar to what we did with the bathroom policy it was in the procedure manual and we moved that that statement into the policies as well but in this poting out proced there's not really a spot if you look at the chunks you know the chapters I guess of board policy there's not really a heading where this would fit so I guess that's why it would no no I I'm sorry I I I think you all as a board have identified this so policy management is critical for in government body and I think you all collectively each of you all individually this doesn't violate some try to say this you sitting here you all have all highlighted this as superintendent's pointed out we want to make sure that we improve our policy management so the policies are you can quickly find them procedures are a little bit different so there should be a policy and the company procedure how to to to carry out that policy so one is if using military terms is the order from the general then how to how the staff is going to carry out those orders and and and implement it and quite honestly we do not have first of all legislation drives a lot of changes the districts has been changing their procedures and their uh media centers a lot without changing it in this book they need to be separated for that reason the other reason is if the superintendent gets with somebody and they decide this is not the best way to do things they are the ones that can change that procedure and bring it up to date without a vote they can do the day-to-day operations and we are not experts in media policy I mean media procedures so that's that was the but we can become experts in our own policy I want everyone to understand it's not perfect it is a working fluid document yes Miss Skipper I was just going to say this is also something that Miss Hansen said um during board call comments at the last board meeting about being able to locate our policy and how our our website's a disaster when it comes to all of this and separating I'm just going to throw it out there again for your consideration I think Neola would help us format and streamline our policy and then we review it and adjust it to meet our needs and our preferences about you know what we want our policies to say but the formatting of them to have a template to start from and a searchable template yes I think it would quite honestly it's about $60,000 if we have a board attorney and when we have a dedicated board attorney I'm assuming part of that salary is supposed to be going to do this that we don't need to pay an outside niola would be like a it opportunity where they could put it on our website the way that we want it have you read have you read their current policies yes in fact I pulled like three of them from different counties but you had mentioned you had said there were new numerous counties and so I went in and picked three that I usually deal with and I was able to pull up their book policy like that I honestly think that I'm here to present not to talk about Neola but here to present whether we have Neola or enough nea's wording is similar to the old document that we have and we have specific problems that we need to address as a board if we want to address spending $60,000 on something when I believe once we have a dedicated board attorney um and I think Mr Block will agree that he is able to and will have the time to do whatever we need him to do with policy yes ma'am just U just just just one I don't want to interrupt your procedure I hav started yet so well and we haven't had a chance to talk about this I've worked with other school districts the the Neola I'm not suggesting yall do or don't go with neol I'm just the framework is y all still control your policy Neola does not write the policy for y'all Y all control your own policy they they handle the presentation organization of those policies so it separates so there are you know there are some good things about neol there's some bad things about Neola but yall would still now give an example puam County disagree with all the recommended policies we revise every single policy they have but they were organized a certain way where they were separate so you can go clearly to your policies and then clearly to the procedure so just a thought it's more it's more the uh the the uh presentation than the actual well it it is in my opinion and it's just my one5 opinion Neola Counties have what we should have when it comes to organization every single I gave you guys a copy at the last board meeting of of 12 different copies from 12 different counties say student in every single policy is listed there we should always be in a place where our policies are clearly listed and understood and searchable and be able to find by our constituents or anybody having a problem all agree on that yeah cuz right now so we can if you'd like maybe we can talk about that another time I just wanted to whether we get it or don't get it this part here has to be resolved because Clay County is special in this country and that we have some challenges that we need to move forward on no I don't disagree and I didn't mean to no no I'm just saying confused I don't want to keep you guys so long that we're just I agree with you I was just confused about the separation I thought there was a separation between this policy and the procedure actually the technology policy I think there's procedures in that and we adopted that already as well so I think what we have to do is streamline I once um asked at one of my fsba trainings how do you stop from getting sued and the lawyer I forget his name from penelo's County he said to me lock type policies right when we're looking at no policies listed for students on our web page that is a red alarm for me and as a board that will be our our challenge um is to recreate and put us in a place where our policies are locked tight and as if you look at how much jargon was in here honestly if we had to go find something we had challenge Pages the pages didn't match the the jargon some of it is from the 80s I mean honestly we really did need to and all the associations with the American Library Association all the Bill of Rights all of that stuff has been taken from this document and the county put in a a brief of their own so so huh they haven't taught in a long time kind of winded all right uh challenge M Ser procedures when you get home and when you look at this you will see these in red I kind of summarized them to take us through Point by point you need to understand that in legislation when it comes to Media collections the principal at every single single school is is responsible for every book in their collection the principal guides the media specialist problems in their Library are the principal's problem because of that is why the majority of counties and you can go home and just start clicking on County Schoolboard policies and try to find it I would I I want to call this decentralizing um the workload okay decentralizing ing the dis the district and us from the actual problem legislation clearly says that principles can handle this I am assuming that Mr superintendent when he picks someone to be a principal it is a fine outstanding leader with great communication skills that knows their school community and understands the parents in their school Community the principle is the number one number one place to start when we are trying to decipher what kind of book might be suitable for what kind of a community all right so on that note under this format which Neola format does put the principal in there miss baa um as the first line of defense I don't want mean to sound military but it's kind of what it is so the petition form which you do have in the very back of your packet shall be publicly available by visiting any school in person so the schools will have the forms easy to find easy to get to easy to fill out or by visiting any school in person or by accessing the link on the board's website most counties have that link on the front page not scrolling not anywhere it just they know it's a Hot Topic and they provide the link okay um the petition must be in writing on the prescribed form by the signed parent or resident and include the required contact information based on the criteria set forth in 10006 the principal will review the objection and should meet with the teacher or parents or both in an attempt to resolve the objection Mr braski was a principal for a long time he was the point at his school to resolve objections and I would not want to be the one to tell the principal I don't think you're qualified to talk to a parent about a book I mean that's where it belongs they might even know the parent all right School curriculum Council review if the objection is not resolved to the objector satisfaction the principal shall refer the matter to the school curriculum Council for review I need to stop there you know this is how it used to always happen Miss Tio knows that we used to meet monthly we have little Clips we had to watch books we had to read we all get excited we get copies of books this is we have challenges once in a while we' talk about it this is how we've always in most counties in the State of Florida have handled it this way so our challenge procedures prior to this unique time were effective for everybody right so what I'm going back to is what we used to do that was effective um so at the time if the a petitioner says hey I'm not happy and the principal said it's going to go to our curriculum Council the principal will upload a copy of the petition to the appropriate District I don't even know who that would be I was hoping that District would have some time to type on it um or tell me but they didn't have a lot of time but the District representative will notify the superintendent hey we got a problem over you know swimming pen with this book all right whatever however they do it up there I'm not delving into the business of the district and how they would notify so of the challenge in the case of an 84 violation or if the principal is unsure about a potential violation It's Our obligation to protect the kids the 847 title will be pulled immediately from the school and sent to the director of I don't know who that would be to make an immediate and I'm sure Mr um blocker can help us with these things to make an immediate countywide decision some counties say in 5 days they'll remove the book well if it's truly pornography we just need to take it off the shelf that's what we're talking about here truly pornograph iic books by Statute and they have like an a2m and anybody can read the a2m and go oh yeah no all right that that can't be in this Library so that part's pretty simple the challenge to any Library material applies only to the individual school where it's challenged because all schools have a different culture mind you it's not 847 right and so some schools their Community culture might want different kinds of books and I'm hoping they do right I'm hoping that the the kids and keyst are getting the kind of books they want to read right so that's the that's the intent of the libraries to build a collection for the culture of their school and that that's in their procedure manual so the challenge originated until the final decision is made during the pendency of a challenge Library material under petition will not be accessible to students in a normal situation maybe oakle High has one challenge they'll pull it off the shelf and they're going to go through the procedure all right we might not need to go off the shelf of every school but that parent has a concern at that school okay the principal calls a special meeting of the curriculum Cil unless it's scheduled already because they happen once a month like like third Tuesday of a month or whatever if it's scheduled already within five working days or a week the complaint to address the petition Mr bler said he's going to look at this and make changes he feels need to happen to make sure we're compliant and this is um sensible and everybody could follow because you don't get sued if you all follow the same procedures it's when you Veer from what we're supposed to be doing so the principal or Library me special will notify the director of about the school committee meeting the SEC School curriculum Council will meet and give their decision to the principal within 30 days the petitioner may be present to make a verbal or written statement to the secc committee we've always done this people have come and talk to us this was always the way it was so some considerations for the school curriculum Council the age of the children who normally could be expected to have access to the instructional Library material no one knows this better than the media specialist at every individual School the educational purpose to be served by the instructional Library material the degree to which the instructional Library material would be supplemented this all comes from legislation the legislation consideration of the broad racial ethic socio economic and cultural diversity of children so the principal notifies the petitioner of the recommendation once the council meets okay the principal of the library meia special will notify the director hey we met this book is cool this book is not good this book is going to go in a different section this book belongs better in high school that's what they're going to talk about in the curriculum Council um if the petitioner is not in agreement the district level curriculum will meet with the objector and attempt to resolve the objection at this time the district's not going to waste anybody's time yet they know exactly what needs to be done and I would suggest instead of going through the whole rig of rooll of everybody jumping hoops and meeting and reading books and doing all this kind of conversation that that someone at the director at the district office becomes an expert in not negotiating but having conversation with people if all El fails the school library media advisory committee activities review and make recommendations of challenged materials and resources is not currently in our policy it is ludicrous to me that that's missing because that's what the whole last almost two years has been about so the rationale School based teams tasked with reviewing challenges and making recommendations will help alleviate the backlog of challenges and ensure that each school media center meets the needs of their learning communities like I said the school knows their kids the best as they're going through the process in our policy it states we don't have a novel list well 10 years ago we had a quite extensive novel list if I wanted to read a book in 8th grade I could go look through the novel list sometimes The Outsiders would say needs parental permission because of this this and this um the people in this room might be shocked that 10 years ago Kite Runner was not allowed in Clay County it was right on the bottom do not teach so as we are going through the process I hope that we begin to create an approved list of novels because we can't get sued if we've pck the novels that are appropriate for children in Clay County and people have access to that list if you're a new teacher and you want to read a novel there are some that come with the the curriculum but I personally I don't know what happened to this list if we can unry this list from somewhere but it was an outstanding list and resource for teachers the rationals no school should need to duplicate the work of another Council that has all already read the novel approve the novel this is as simple as having a running Google sheet for principles to type a list on do I know you were Elementary but do you ever remember seeing this list yeah I wish I had a copy of it all right proposed change School library media committee parent of a student at the school and not a district employee rationale parents and students in the school should have a voice and have the opportunity to participate you could have 10 of them in there as far as I'm concerned all right only having a district employee participant limits diversity and Community input now there are some challenges I know right now especially in the district what about this what about that the challenges are the concerns are so I'm here to talk to the board today multiple challenges as you know we're not the only District in Florida to have have an onslaught of challenges for the most part originally we had 171 books in the docket for us to vote on I had a slew of about 12 teachers and myself read all 171 books of the 171 books I would have put back 165 right back on the Shelf okay there were some I poll because I thought they belonged in high school I didn't know the age right all the books would have went back on the Shelf this is what got me thinking I did pull five books to decide concern do I want to ban them that's what people say do I want to curate them I don't think so because there are parents in this County that don't mind if their child reads a book called heroin all right I might not want my kid during an opioid crisis to read heroin but we certainly cannot as I said treat one set of parents different than another set of parents as an English teacher that's unheard of unheard of what people do with their children is what they do with their children so what are we going to do about books that maybe should have never been bought to begin with we don't know how many are in there right we have a citizen working his way through I'm actually proud of our media specialist they're reading and going through their books and trying to make sure their collection is where it needs to be and I'm not here to hash over how it got there all right but I can tell you when you have this Onslaught it's not good for anybody no principal could handle I think we used to do one or two books maybe some curriculum items like videos to a couple books a month some months most months we had no novels we just had videos two a month to me when your readers like Librarians and English teachers and teachers are readers two a month is a limit and right now you should have an alarm going off and your head we got a lot more than two of mon I spoke with Mr blocker do you have thoughts about option b perhaps well can we talk about it after I get through this appell it phase yes okay so by law you have to have a plan right we need to come back to this as a board and have some conversation with Mr blocker CU he he's been thinking about this portion about what we can do in in our case okay but for now let's just think about before we were in this situation right what would happen normally at a school if you had a challenge all right we will have an appeals process mind you we haven't bothered very many people right just a council who volunteered to read books the appeal process now becomes the district curriculum appeal Council by law we have to have that right the appeal part the petitioner May appeal after speaking to the district against the recommendation of the school level curriculum Council in writing within 10 days of the receipt of the school recommendation the director of whoever that will be will organize a meeting of the district curriculum Council within 20 days no backlog of books no rush okay 20 days oversee of the petition unless the timeline is waved by the petitioner maybe the petitioner says I want to get at this next Tuesday it's important to me this book is important to me okay okay okay if we can convene we will all right and the district curriculum Council meetings the district curriculum Council for reconsideration shall send their recommendations to the supervisor of instructional resource once they meet so how are we going to meet I don't want to reinvent the wheel proposed change this is the pro proposed change for the district appeal curriculum Council for reconsideration shall be comprised of a team consisting of a lot of this is the same school based library media specialists a curriculum specialist a principal a teacher of the appropriate content area that's key we don't want a science teacher reading a literature book and trying to figure out what's right and what's wrong okay the other part is I stole from the half cent sales tax policy an excellent idea if we're talking about diversity and being inclusive of all the students personalities and values and Views and family views then the school should do like it does for the half cent sales tax each one of us belong to a district that is a much different culture than the other excuse me I say that the district school board each nominate one person to be on the council and they won't be going very often right because it's going to be handled somewhere else one person to be on the council and one alternate same as the have in sales tax it can be the same exact thing it makes it easy year 3 years 2 years whatever one year I don't know how you'd work it out but you don't have to reinvent the wheel on that one current District curriculum Council does not allow for Parental input from all districts in Clay County you just take a book off the shelf you could care less what the people over there say about that so right now that's what we're thinking about each district has a unique culture and there is value in diverse input and challenge materials we want to hear from people and we would have the right to assign someone that reflects the views and values of their District now moving on the appeal I took a lot of this probably the same but the petitioner May appeal against the recommendation of the school level with 10 days I already did this one right 20 days going backwards all right the superintendent design review the superintendent design shall review the instructural library library material considering recommendation of the challenge oversight committee they're still there they're going take a peek at it right the people of the district who've been reading these books for 2 years and the district curriculum Council for reconsideration the director will organize the meeting within 20 days unless the timeline is did I just do this one no the board will review the case after the council's done including all the evidence Pro offered by the complaint Pro offered by the complaint during a publicly notice board meeting we still do this we we try to do it one time with 171 books you guys remember that and then it was so we actually haven't done it but it was in our policy to do that whether the challenge material meets the requirements of this policy I see there be a statement by the board chair that would say that we did this right and we follow the policy um Mrs Hansen just just one if we can just go back one slide and and thank you for all I know you were doing this I think the one this this one column in the middle would go away I think that's duplicate it's duplicate but I was kind of tired thank you for sure for sure so that's so I so I think can you go one or two slides up just just we have Clarity it's right here yes ma'am so you would have the appeal the meeting and then go go down pleas two slides what's most important is you're following me Mr Block right now yes ma'am then I'm sorry can you go down can you go down two more slides please you mean like this way yes ma'am uh again then then it would pick up here the superintendent any review cross cross that off and go to the school review that makes sense sorry about that no no that's that's you put a lot of work into this um so anyway if we move on the petitioner and the District representative may make an opening statement at the district appeal curriculum Council this is very I think this is like almost the same thing as the district had I don't think I ex it out um the petitioner represented may present evidence including documents testimony um that instruction material does not meet this should be media Mr blocker it was hard to catch all the wrong words as I went through it does not meet the criteria closing statement can tell you how grateful I am that you guys are very bright women I'm just moving moving through this the petitioner and the District representative may make a closing statement right and they had some kind of a timeline but quite honestly I don't think most people show up so we could put a timeline in there or just you know let them speak for a while and say we're going to move to the next portion the district council will vote I five to four votes if you and this is because at the time there would be nine I'm saying you only need five all right everybody can't show up to everything if you get a four vote if you're a four to five vote that tells you something's gone wrong something's gone wrong that nearly 50% of the people think the book's not in the right place and 50% of the people think the book is in the right place when that happens the material will not be banned right the material being placed into the parental advisory section of the library ensuring we're airing on the side of caution it's pretty simple if it's a straight up 72 vote it's whatever the curriculum Council says but if it's a real close vote and everybody's bickering about it then we keep the book anyway and we put it somewhere will we get parent permission so this is the point you need to know what I had to say three times at this meeting you should applaud the fact that this board I hope wants to put every single challenge book back on the ship may I interject real quick I think our biggest mistake was with our petitioner and it's back to how do you prove it we know the book was not read and that was a requirement of our procedure yeah so we kind of it's hard you know that's our biggest mistake yeah you can't just go on the computer and take a list of books but in state law you can't limit how many times someone appeals or challenges a book so how they go about it is not actually our policy we can't there's nothing we can do about that so after this vote if it's too close to call it's still going back in the library we're not taking it anywhere carting it away and I have met with a media specialist who have a great procedure plan for this they want to everybody remember Blockbuster used to have little thing and you'd pull it up and then if you wanted to watch something really crazy you go over to the special section or if you were not 17 you went to this section if you were 18 you could rent these well their idea is is to actually put the front and back cover on a pul thing like a little plastic like we did with lockbuster I did have some as every we always say concerns about that because I said to them it's a great idea but now I can foresee every kid in the library running around searching for those books and they were like yes the ready to read so there's good and bad to everything but a lot of kids who can't read don't use Destiny to try to find a book and read through they look at the books to pick a book so we would want to make sure the book was right there and available and I do foresee that some kids will be telling each other hey go look for those Blockbuster type movies over there those books are real good but here's the thing the media Specialists will know the parents option and so the kid won't be able to check the book out unless they have sent we have a predescribed something they help me write to let the parent know the content of the book and if the parent says yes they let them check it out so it's it's pretty much I try to think how do we make most people happy do I wish we didn't have some of these books yes right but moving forward we cannot dictate what other parents want their children to read okay so we're almost to the end the district appeal proposed change participants will have access to notice Zoom meetings just like the house and sales tax so if I'm working all day and I have lunch at 11: and I want to participate as a parent I can watch or people who can't drive all the way out somewhere because from my count is for my home it's pretty far here it's like 40 minutes right so we will Zoom just like we do the half sales tax committee we will notice the meetings because by law we need to do that and virtual participation increase the ability of stakeholders to participate and decreases scheduling challenges okay I would also say we probably tape them right and so if you still want to participate and you're on the council you could read it after work so if you're working all day and you wanted to know what was going on you could do that so the district will notify the school board within 14 days once the curriculum Council has gotten there you know through the book or whatever the hearing office shall submit a Rec a recommended order to the board this is where I get a little har you need to help me on this okay the board will review the case including all evidence Pro um I just did this right no no school board riew the board shall announce during the meeting whether to challenge me or so you'll help me with that order right yes ma'am so it's gone through the whole process the district is the appell at court and we have put the power in the hands of the schools and the school media specialist to control the content in their libraries um so when we're speaking of challenges we do have a special challenge that we have to address and I called Mr blocker to be thinking about an option b that I hope would look a lot like our policy that we currently use with Mr DA's office have you put some thought into option b for when there's more than two challenges so so in in let me let me just say this is not refined legal analysis but I do think one of the challenges that Clay County has is that you'll have um you know multiple you individuals that make multiple challenges that creates challenges for your staff that creates challenges for um y'all's board members um so I think there's there's a way that we could maybe create um some type of expedited review when there are multiple challenges where you know maybe we could we could put in place a um you the key thing when you're developing this policy is you want to make sure that you have a you know a due process path so when you're removing books if someone you know disagrees with it you have a process where they can appeal It ultimately the board y'all as a board have ultimate Authority so if there's a disagreement the board is ultimately liable for the decision that's why yall are the policy makers you all make that decision so I think we could look at developing a a maybe a pathway where you have someone that's making two or 300 challenges a month and it it's just very taxing to staff Maybe uh multiple challenges would go into a different uh different category and the District staff is used to these multiple challenges coming Unfortunately they are that could be an option b where they do what they're doing now if it's pornography it's gone if it's controversial put it in the young adult section and if it's okay put it back cuz the majority of the books are okay to put back well AB absolutely and the ones that they don't know they can't make a decision on should probably go to the district advisory committee abs absolutely I think um you know just just you know state of law is very clear on on what what falls under you know what is you know pornography has to has to come out but even the Supreme Court has said you know we're not really sure how to define pornography but we know when we see it right so that's that's that's helpful from a legal perspect you do know when you see it right you do know when you see it so yeah so the challenge is is you know pornography is out but this this way if I understand this is a that deals with more specifically when there are non porn pornographic uh challenges which is everything else which which is every everything else so we would have to work and and kind of because I do believe some of the book challenges um are for things that are not pornography there there maybe more preferences and and you know so you know we would have to to work on this but where you see a lot of the school districts being challenged are because they're they're policy are either insufficient not in compliance with state state law or their application of the policy is not correct so as an example as can a count is being suited right now I I'm talking to their attorneys and try to understand that is generally um I think the application is what's being challenged they have a policy so a lot of times the course will look at and say okay you have a policy you have a procedure are you following those procedures if you're circumventing your own policies and procedure procedures you're violating the due process rights cuz you're government yall government y all so we have to make sure whatever policy procedures yall come up with are being followed sometimes the policy itself is challenged because it's discriminatory I don't think this policy I think that would survive that test again you know you shouldn't public or practice law publicly but right but we can we can you know I think what's built in here is is um there's a lot of built-in procedural protection so there's disagreement there's you know an appeals process ultimately the final decision r with the board at at at the end of the day um the superintendent you know his staff are obviously involved so I think these are some you know I had some thoughts for you about this backlog um so my board policy we should have already had them on a consent agenda looked at them pulled them pulled what books we wanted to we have not had any books come to us as a board okay which is the hold up at the media center level okay um one of the things they said is that it's very confusing to try to do the right things lists aren't updated sometimes something's there I don't know if I have it I don't know what to do with it so there was some confusion in the procedural part that made it really hard for the media specialist to figure out what to do with the book but I can tell you I'm not sure what the current number is 300 and something I would suggest as a board we go back to the original 171 books I still have that copy maybe we tackle that since I had all my teachers friends reading it and if you guys wanted to read whatever there's a list that I sent to the chair about which books I wanted to talk about we could do that at the board meeting I would also suggest that then we tackle a hundred a month until they're done and I say 100 because a lot of the challenge forms are literally you if it is porography you can turn to the page and go wayy okay I I use the word spicy at the workshop and everybody's using now whoa that's a little spicy right so um yeah not to your thought just just think how to no well and just as a reminder to the board your current policy I think one of the challenges as talking to your staff um is you know books that are pornographic are already now I think what was what was brought to you all was a list of books that were not pornographic but then may had objectionable material so the law does allow yall as a board to put in place a policy a community standard that that that that can fet that out to some degree not ban the books but essentially fit that out a little bit to to that a more young adult content area correct we're not going to get rid of correct and Mrs Hansen did send me a number of policies I reviewed that that this was drawn from I think this came from about you know 10 different counties been the old policy that I started take pieces of I don't know and some of the war theol policies of well where there is kind of a built-in procedural process process where other objectionable potentially objectionable content can be reviewed and and invented through this process and you could run into a scenario where you have different parts of the county that have different viewpoints on some of this I'm again you know because there's a lot of mixing of this we're not talking about pornographic content again this is I think heroin is example that that comes up frequently there's some parts of the community may find that not objectionable Others May find it objectionable and heroin wasn't in every high school so like what you're talking about maybe two out of six you know so it would be those two schools that need to decide whether that book's good for their you know regular shelf or sure you know adult SE I'm Mrs H if it's possible just just for my clarity and it's not thr off I I'd be curious if if we could take a tactical pause for just a moment because I want to hear kind of feedback from the rest of the and then I'll go over theend please yes ma'am but if we just just because I know this is aot who would like to start well I want to thank you for putting all this effort out it's amazing it was for you guys and for us literally unless we want to sit like this at every board meeting forever right no I mean we started the process in October and here we are going into February so we've got to get something done actually we started this process two years ago actually more like three when we found the first well it's a revolving living document yep times have changed I think that um this needs to be fixed and it needs to be fixed ASAP and I think that um I I do want to thank you for this cuz this was a lot of time effort and um energy and I know and I guess I want to clarify and be very um just to to make sure I get this right you met in October and nothing has changed from what you presented to the district so they've seen this document well they should have because there was other pieces of paper like the principal po portion right was in separate papers but yes it's always been the same okay um you met with media Specialists who are actually going to endure this and who we should have kind of went to to begin with to hear them out in their entirey and lots of feedback from them to miser right which was a little different than what the district brought us or was it the same the media specialist would be happy with a change going forward something like this but they have something go ahead I'm sorry and then I just answer her question yeah I'm sorry I'm on a train cuz I just want to make sure we hadit all the steps and then we had a town hall and had stakeholder input mhm and then um there was one other question and I forgot it um and then it was put together and this would be the policy moving forward and the red right with refinements yes with yes with legal refinements um and then you do you think that what you kind of said to us that this would be would stand or hold because all these books are going back um it's just a matter of what it looks like you know whether it's back on the shelf or back in a in a secluded area with parent permission um from a legal standpoint do you think that we would be legally secure is this a secure document yes man so so let me let me give you um let me give you the non-legal answer first and the legal answer not legal answer straightforward we can work with whatever this board puts together I'm confident whatever y'all arrive on will be legal and defensible we can't stop people from challenging it um this Mrs Hansen has been work on this for some time I do think we need to tune up one or two things I think the concepts are defensible really what you want to look at is are there procedures in place what you can't do is you cannot have a procedure where you're just pulling a policy where you're pulling books off the shelf and then just there's nothing there's no appeal process there's no and then also you can't have a system where y'all are removed from the ultimate the final say state law and trust you all you are an elected board yall have the final say as as as ultimately the end of this the superintendent has a role as well so y'all we can't have a policy where yall are not involved to a point now y'all can to some extent delegate that down which I think this policy does um there Arguments for and against that um it's different from what you all have now because essentially it's pushing what you have now is is set up a little bit differently this does push it down to the principal level so I'm confident if the board approves this that we can legalize this we do need to get some input from you know the superintendent I don't know if he's only because under state law we can't we can't eliminate his his view yall are the fin deciders well when also it's kind of like again the military analogy yall give the y'all are the generals yall give the order it's his job to carry out with this with this team so that's my question too I just remembered it sorry um should we do these procedures before this policy is passed because there has to be procedures in place and the board has to approve it but at the same time I want to make sure that these procedures um have our media specialist input yes so I well I guess what I'm saying is is if we submit this for ad over this with them huh they I went over this with the secondary media specialist okay but not the Elementary media specialist so will could these procedures follow after advertisement is what I'm saying or do they have to go now no man so the way I understand it and I was going to go over with yall kind of y'all's timeline there is a there is a timeline what stage we're in right now with all these books I have no idea yes ma'am absolutely as as far as as far as just the as far as the policy um y'all can y'all can adopt a policy um but the superintendent would have to develop the procedures and that would be brought to you all for final approval but again and I'm sorry Healy it's kind of like y all give the orders he's got to carry it out so his so I would recommend you know yall y'all decide what policy yall want to decide you youall have a policy now so this would be a revision to the current policy um and there's a timeline that we we have to follow with that so I want youall to be aware of that just we're on the same page then the uh superintendent would you know develop the proced procedures after then we present those to you all okay that's what I and I would think there would be some training for you can't just like have people read the document and go with it so so if I could too the procedures also have to be in mind when we're forming the policy right so got a policy that couldn't procedurally be implemented that's a challenge right so I mean I I would kind of say the board that one I'm so thankful for all the work and and the effort put into it and I think that this is a great uh framework for moving forward a great direction to move forward in but I'd also encourage that we we perhaps have a meeting so we can talk about procedurally how to get this done uh so the policy matches what the board wants and can actually be implemented also at the same time I did have um from this Workshop people ask me what would happen with this what would happen with that and I had to explain it depends on the policy because that's where you right at your guiding your Guiding Light so yeah I think it's just important to realize that um that you also have to consider the procedures that are going to be used in order to implement the policy as you're developing the policy so so the the most radical example I give is if your policy can't actually be implemented and that's that's not a good policy right so we want to make sure I'm not saying that's the case I'm just kind of saying those things kind of work in conjunction with I did think a lot about that to make sure it something that we used to have done before so I would I would encourage uh you know more discussion to ensure the finer reps are brought the directions clear and it looks looks good all that kind of stuff so so just going off that one thing to consider also I don't want to also I only have one more slide so no no absolutely I'm sorry to get no I'm good Mrs Hansen did put a lot of work obviously I can't share this with yall because the sunshine what I can he now is we we're here Mrs Hansen put a lot of work into this and I think that's great y as a board have really leaned forward y'all collectively are not just here to rubber samp y'all really care about this issue care about me the needier your constituents I appreciate Mrs Hansen because I know no one wants to you know play lawyer and go through this but she put a lot of work and Research into this they're a great board and we get along I think we govern very well and I I could sit back and say I wonder what Miss Bowler would think I wonder what Miss gilhousen would think because they a great group of people to work with well 100% but one thing just going off just I just want to make sure I acknowledge that because you know y'all have not had the opportunity to see all the work and actually all of you I know Mrs Skippers put a lot of work into it Mr Clark M Gil house but all of you all have collectively um the one thing the one potential challenge this is not a challenge that can't be overcome but we need to be thinking about this is because this is being pushed down to the to the principal level the challenge Mr BR I'm going to going to have to direct this to you the challenge you're going to have is what if the board adopts this policy we have to make sure that the policy is being followed this is where legally you're going to run into some challenges if we if you all adopt this policy but you have superintendents that are not following this policy correctly it will create a legal challenge so there's going to have to be some training there's absolutely going to have to be some procedural development in that because that that to me right now is the biggest like you know you can't create a policy and say okay this is the law for our district but then you have staff well do we we currently have curriculum councils still at each school right I think I think I mean we we should so miss Hansen sorry not miss H Miss baa hasn't had a chance I know I was trying to make I thank you and I just I'm I'm going to defer to Mr Daly for just a quick question currently when we get a list of books with challenges attached to them if they are pornographic they break the law for 847 they're automatically pulled is that pretty much the statement yes by law that has to correct and I know that there have been a couple that have been put back on the shelf that have been pulled since then because of clarification of 847 I understand the law changed effective July 1 of3 which so so prior to that there had to those types of challenges had to go to a committee as you might imagine people have different lenses and different capacities of of understanding of the law and how it was applicable and that type of thing so the Committees in a couple of cases um have your elastic views relative to the 847 uh statuto language subsequent to July first upon revision those those those uh books contained material that did violate the law and so even though the Committees had ruled to retain them after July 1 per the state they had to come out correct so how have you had a number of committee meetings recently uh well so this whole thing seems to operate I think I could you come on just for I need I need clarification person the premise that um there are a number of books being restricted that aren't a 47 that's not accurate what's happened only the only books that have been taken off are the ones that were required to come by law so what occurs is those books that aren't that don't violate 847 but have you know give people pause for concern like they have animal cruelty or excessive profanity or drug use or those types of things those have been sent to committee those have there isn't a backlog we're not we're not we are 100% caught up remember the board brought forward after much discussion a policy in April that in my view has been extraordinarily effective uh and I salute the board for that and for for your wisdom and and for your leadership in that because I know we have many many discussions about you guys probably don't know I actually do things other than work in books um and so we I've never had a chance to come before you and say hey you know we're ahead of 60 other districts in the state and instruct my stuff as the academic officer because we're we're talking about this issue uh but the the changes from the policy that you brought forward in prove that we implemented last April has allowed us to not only completely catch up on the backlog but has essentially made this a dormant issue other than we have one or two uh community members that like to come forward and speak about it the board members the emails have stopped the phone calls and stuff those those books that are in the appell process I think there had been not I'm speculating here I'm not I'm not trying to to read your minds it seems like I felt like some of you were hey if I if I approve the appeals process I'm I'm sanctioning the content in that book and that's not what that is it just the attestation that we have followed the law and the procedure to the best of your knowledge uh and those were the books that that we didn't have language to address because the state had not come forward with that language if you recall thank you because I had questions I was able to attend the meeting the other last week I guess um and the questions that I had were wait I've gone through the training why aren't there being used on this committee but we are caught up so that that ends that and now the appeals process and then when you go on our website and you see the list of books that have been appealed they were challenged originally but now they're appealed and in that list it says many of them are returned to the shelves many of them have been dismissed we're not using them anymore the problem is the board has a final approval I'm not sure why they're going back without us and and the I I think that the concern that we had when that first list came up was and it was pulled because there was some question about community and what what reflects community and that was part of that 847 law that is is confusing to a lot of people myself to if you recall Mrs B that's we had that disc I know you have you you ladies are faced with so much information each and every month it's impossible to remember all the the Gory details of what's presented to you we had this discussion last spring to that effect one of the reasons that the policy that you Ladi structured centralized that process with us to ensure that there was calibration in my opinion it's very difficult for let's say principles and media specialist to Aid the experts in statutory language right that that's something that I hope most people don't spend their time reading chapter 847 um and then the calibration process what we were seeing prior to that was in the Committees there were there were wild inconsistencies in the interpretation of that so we brought it so that our committee would rule consistently so we would avoid uh the the the litigation that might come forward and we've been able to navigate that with that in mind and despite the sort of historic number of challenges at this point so far not we haven't we haven't seen any litigation because there's been consistency so to decentral ize that and push that back down to the schools with a principal and media specialist assuming those would be the only two you'd be have 86 different people interpreting those books that's the point what would happen if you had let's say a book at five different schools and you had five different interpretations and that well we're not going to have it at school a but we will have it at school B and the various questions scrutiny and problems that that might censored Mr daily so that's like a it's and I have to interject here because every school can keep what books they want to keep pornography is gone it is not the district's job to censor what a school should have on their shelves or not it is that hasn't been done Mrs hand but the media specialist is making decisions about their collection there hasn't been a book that the district has taken off that didn't violate well you just said something about I'm I'm saying that the interpretation of what constitut 47 would be incon as long as it's not pornography it's okay but yeah you're basically saying the same thing but he's saying pornography as well correct I mean you know you know you're you see it so and I would be prepared as a board to to understand that you're going to have complications from that that will occur there will be and I know that for a fact because it happened prior to you making the adjustments to the previous policy in April that is exactly what was occurring which is one of the reasons that we that we made those adjustments and quite honestly we weren't really following any procedure and the the procedure we passed in April I was unhappy with we tried to have conversation and it was kind of like pushed on our throat so I am not sure when we had discussion about April other than the fact that the district said it would make it easier for them so I don't I don't understand why we're having this conversation when half of the State of Florida is doing it right I no I mean feel that we're doing it right at this stage because we're getting pornography off the shelf which was the ultim of 847 initially now going to the community having attended this meeting I I arrived late so I didn't get I arrived while while the citizens were building these posters or these um lists and it felt that and I was just sitting there as an observer and it was very interesting to hear and see and I don't know about you guys but I felt like the truly it was almost a split it was like there was a group of people who said no we need to make certain that books like heroin Etc are not on the shelves we need to protect our children we don't want this that not the split but then the split was opt in op out just this is I'm just telling you the facts are up here I want to make sure we're I understand but then you see let parents rule you see all books should be return to the shelves and that's why I'm saying the other half was wait a second you know you've got if we We are following 847 it's imperative that we follow 847 That's the Law bottom line that's the law but then beyond that a comment was made my responsibility as a parent for my child ends where your responsibility as a parent Begins for your child and yes there are going to be books that are on the shelves that perhaps I don't want my child to be to read but then you were there minutes I could not have gotten the gist of the whole 2hour meeting in the in the short period of Time how these were presented well what you should have heard was everybody's happy about putting all the books back on the Shelf that's what you should have heard which I'm glad about that's what I everybody is similar in that but a lot of the challenges are coming to us that have nothing to do with 847 now they go back on the shelf and if they go back on the shelf that would make me incredibly happy I don't know if if it's I this is the first time I've seen this I preciate all the work you put into this m please don't misunderstand what I'm trying to say I just want I I'm I apologize if that's how I sound but I I hear I still hear a lot of the concerns though is what I'm trying to say about putting them all back on the shelves yes there were parents who were concerned about that well they said the parental advisory would be great their didn't have ACC which is great I'm just saying this is the first that I've seen this document and when I when I got it from Miss um Anora yesterday and I started seeing all the line outs and everything I was not aware of how this was all put together and I appreciate all of the work that you've done in putting together and this is where I'm I'm still trying to dig you know I think maybe what what it takes is for us to uh to take to to take making this more when you're done can I finish the last slide yeah I'm just saying that it will answer some of the questions I've listen intently to people I think I think it's going to take people a little time to digest it at all I wanted to to point out the process Mr bucker still needs to review and give the one thing you're sitting back there like it's hard to I don't have my glasses on but I think one of the things to keep in mind too is that kind of what Mr Daly has done effectively I think he praised yall as a board you all have yall have effectively addressed a47 I think what I'm just trying to to listening I think what Mrs Hansen is trying to address is something a little bit different it's where you have citizens and parents that have concerns about non 847 issues that are in books so those are really two different two different things so the board under under the law can develop a community standard and a process to address that so Mr D what you what you're addressing is really the 847 and and that's that's a good system to get those books off but right now and use example of you know abusing animals or whatever that's not that doesn't fall in r47 no you know abusing a dog as horrible as that is and a book describing in great detail or dmer or whatever some those are not 847 so they're not going to fall under that so those are going to be returned to the Shell so I think as hen as addressing is a community standard that's a decision for yall as a board to decide you all can adopt a community standard on the next link I have I understand I'm not suggesting you do that I'm saying these These are really two different Frank crial Minds does that make sense is everyone so would it be possible to keep for my so I you know my ears are blown out my eyesight's bad I'm getting old can you come over here so we can see you so well again thank you to Mrs Hansen for her passion no one knows better than I the complications of this particular topic for all kinds of reasons and she's put a lot of work into it which which we all appreciate and I recognize it's not an easy issue right and there's no there's there's no way to come at it and and have everyone be happy with it that's simply just not realistic because the subjective nature of books and people's personal attachments to if if the so what has what we've done from the beginning is to navigate this in such a way that we're following the law that's all we've ever done I've enveloped up Us in that because I was concerned about litigation not knowing more than I did when we embarked on this as I've gone through it and learned more I I agree with Mrs Hansen that those types of books fall into the purview of parents rights most of those books I look at I would never have my own sons look at and I don't know how I would feel about it as a coordinate but if you were to put them in a in a special section none of those books have been taken off they're sitting in the appell so if you said we vote to retain them but to put them in this thing that would be a simple adjustment to this I don't know that we'd have to do anything different than you've already brought forward knowing that what you've brought forward already is already working from my view we're missing the ma'am we're missing the point it's called diversity and stakeholder input this problem belongs to everybody all the books belong back on the Shelf except for the pornography it is so simple sometimes I I get frustrated because it's that simple I think they we're saying the same thing however having a very very small group of people decide on every single book they're only deciding 847 no he's talking about all of them what goes to the appell court what goes back on the Shelf I think we're saying the exact same thing you and I are in a court is that the books that are 847 by law have to come out the only thing is who gets to determine that because if you have too many people my concern is if you have too many people determining that you get inconsistency and then one gets returned that is an 847 violation which invites problematic issues for the board so I can I can I finish my slide so we can address what he's talking about because what he's talking about is a community standard I understand and I have I have something to show you guys that deals with that I just haven't gotten there yet okay can I because I've given everybody else a turn I'd like to I just feel like you don't have all the information so it's hard we can come back let me just get my while it's fresh in my mind so um from hearing from Mr Dy from hearing from you from hearing from Mr blocker I don't see why we can't um keep the current system that we have for the chapter 847 books so that initially that's we have a a committee is interpreting 847 and and vetting the books and then immediately discarding those this policy does say send every 847 right to him who this one does okay yeah so see I think we're seeing the same thing and then for those books that um become appealed based on the district committee's decision or those books that are challenged based on something that has nothing to do with 847 that's where I could see this process that you've outlined where it's a school-based decision um so I think the two could coexist man so I I totally I totally agree I think that would be very simple to do and Implement no one would rather decentralize this more than me because I'm the one that has to do off the work so I'd be highly incentivized to to to unpack it and give it away however I know for sure that's going to invite problems for us as a district why would it give Pro are we not as smart as the other counties that do this I'm I'm just Pro I'm so so how are we going to have problems and we can't handle it and we're weak and we are this and we are that when half the State of Florida handles it at this where the state law says handle it at the principal level I don't appreciate the fact that we're going to this doom and doom it happened at the library media center meeting too doom and lawsuit and Gloom this is what's going to happen we are better according to Mr brosi than the majority of counties in Florida and we're saying our principles aren't good enough to hand handle a book that's not what I'm saying what I'm saying is that you have different viewpoints and they have a lot of things on their plate to to become experts in this is another thing I also like offering a layer of protection for our principles and our media specialist because the statute doesn't say that they have to do it it says they're responsible if I'm providing the guidance for them from from the district level then then that gives them a layer of protection that they were given direction from us rather than than the pressure being well the policy is the district guide the policy is the district guide we have finish I I think it's going to make a lot more sense if I just show you one more thing can you guys flip says Library access form towards the back if you go to the back there's a red page I also have something to show you but which this came from the state of Florida it was a template on how to do challenges it was just a suggested template I kept page one which is um section one and two it looks like this this is the criteria this is the criteria for everyone if you're going to buy a book you're going to look at this list if your eyebrow goes up I suggest don't buy the book If you challenge a book you're going to go through this list if there's nothing on the list then the book's probably not challengeable if you're going to talk to a parent the principal brings this out and goes through the list this is the rubric developed from the community standards which I've had to talk to people who are actually in the room because we didn't put all of them in Klay County's Community standards ours is the same as du ball so I had to talk to some people that were in the room from different sides of this right to figure out most people agree this is the list of goes back on the Shelf but might need parental advisory and so if you look at it the first two sections say the materials pornographic and prohibited under Section 847 in that case the principal sends it up to Mr daily the material di depicts or describe sexual conduct as defined predominantly appeals to The Prudent prudent shameful and morbid interest the principal is not sure sends it up to Mr daily they never have to deal with an 847 the 847 expert is the only one dealing with an 8 47 even if a principal is unsure he can send it to Mr daily pull it off his shelf send him an email and let him go look at it if you stop there there's no need to go further because of it's pornographic it's gone we it's just gone right what do we do with Part B and C B and C of 847 addresses the age appropriate material um ability to comprehend um grade level things like that right we say the state's going to Def find it one day and we can Coller behind it but it's not true I talked to two Representatives that said we left it that way because Miami Dave county is different than Clay County we will never tell you what to put on it he basically told me have the kahunas to figure out what your county wants to do with the books that aren't 847 Mr daily they will never tell us what to keep and what not to keep we are one of 67 counties what we can do is if you're looking at this checklist and we use this as a rubric these are the topics that the majority of people around the country and you can research this all you want as they come to complain about a book there's boxes this should be an online form like everybody else is doing where they just check it and then the Google form records the record and the timing of it and it says excessive profanity obscene language that cannot be said on broadcast TV or radio heroin has 63 f-words in it maybe that's okay some schools maybe it's not okay at other schools you would check that for heroin poor description of pervasive gruesome Behavior arousing feelings of extreme fear shock or disgust there is a little bit of that Jeffrey dmer was that violence intense Behavior morbid Behavior involving physical Force intended to hurt abuse damage torture or kill someone these are things parents agree on I don't want my child to read about a child who was RA by their father okay but if another parent thinks that's helpful for their child then that's the what they're right but they're going to check that box so they know what's bothered glorification of weapons glorification of suicide self harm and mental illness we can talk about it and we're not talking about removing the books we're talking about just putting them somewhere and it's so simple in my mind that we tell the parent I just wanted you to know this girl goes into detail about cutting herself in the blood dripping on the bathroom floor like this is a very graphic book unsolicited theories or strategies are bias racist sexist or could lead to student indoctrination I'm not the one to tell somebody what that is it goes in the young adult section if that's what the school decides gender Theory medical transitioning sexual explicit content Beyond lgbtq relationships I'm fine with lgbtq relationships I had books on my shelf that had that the relationships in a are acceptable but some parents don't want their kids to read about how to mentally uh medically transition this is putting the power and if our roadblock is our principles I'm going to go on record to say I know a lot of principles and our principles can read this list and decide if it needs to be in an adult section we can also refer to the movie rating which by the way Miss B was the common theme and I have it in my backpack yeah if your kid can't can't go into an R-rated movie and it's explicit what's in an R-rated movie why Would we let them check it out if they're 15 I'm only frustrated I don't care about how much work I did because it's not perfect and I know we're going to change it that's not what I'm upset about what I'm upset about is convoluting ideas convoluting ideas that are actually not that complicated if you have procedures and you follow your procedures you cannot lose you cannot lose and we always hang that fear fear in the media specialist meeting fear about being sued it's really and I wouldn't want to be a board member to tell a principal I don't think you can handle looking at this book with your curriculum counsel because that's how we used to do it and Mary knows we used to do it that way nobody was up the district telling us you know what we should or shouldn't do but you're right most of it was videos and things at that and novels at high school very very few books from you were Elementary that's correct and most of it was videos and I guess and here's where I here's where I'm confused Miss Hansen we're saying all books should be returned to the shelves yeah all books should be returned to that that are not pornographic okay so all of these the excessive profanity the horror the violence the glorification as a parent I know my child is well versed in Reading I know my child is mature and they are whatever age but they may be more mature than what their age indicates I know that my child I trust I don't know I trust that my child will read a book perhaps run into something that offends them I didn't read that book at beforehand and I trust that that child will probably question something that to me opens all sorts of avenues for discussion no but that's fine because you are a parent what we don't want is a parent I'm going to use myself mhm I don't want my kids reading garbage they can get enough of that watching a movie I don't want my kids reading garbage it is not our Public School Systems jurisdiction to provide dmer to my child my kids read way above grade level it has nothing to do with whe the content of the book is appropriate or not for my family values this is giving every parent in the county a choice if the book is like this call them give permission let them read away this has nothing to do with your child your child my child this has nothing to do with you as a parent me as a parent it's giving informed consent it's giving parents a choice if Miss Skipper doesn't want her little girls to read these type of books that is her right and we cannot provide them in the Library without telling parents that some of this is in there we cannot so where do those books go that's my question well you the Librarians have a policy for that first of all I want to let you guys know there's 200 something books at the media specialist meeting it was said to them you're going to have hundred hundreds of books behind your desk no you're not heroin's in two schools the book Choke we removed was in one school none of the high schools have every single one of these books and that's where most of the books are the Librarians decided we are going to share all these documents you found these 10 books I find these 10 books and we're going to start making these little things and share how to do it and create a list the media Specialists are brilliant they already know how they're going to implement it where they're going to go how to tell kids how to tell parents what I do want to tell you on the last slide Miss Nora is we have a communication problem from the district to school level and District to the community um what we need to do is quit talking among ourselves and educate people that's what we need to do so at the school level is the best place to do that the next I you have [Music] some it's just this thing is [Music] not it all right where we want wrong with our opin policy the reason parents are and there's a lot of confusion about opt-in opt out at the meeting okay opt out nobody reads any letters everybody just doesn't return the form right but we do have a problem we've remove 300 books our parents need to know that that kind of smut is in our libraries they just need to know the truth and then they need to make a decision that decision is my kid will have unlimited access they can go look at everything in the library my kid has no access or my kid has limited access the limited access is the place where the kids just can't go to the 50 books behind the librarian's desk but they can check out anything else they want where we went wrong is we don't communicate to our constituents or to our parents we just don't we make decisions and we just go about our business without considering the impact it has on parents this video from mambia County they made a video let me tell you real quick why this is important here's what our Librarians have to do to opt in they have to take every single piece of paper and I'd love for you to make sure you pay attention to this because you're going to be the key for this problem every paper you at a school with 2,000 high school students and they got to bring back this paper to go into the library right they have to enter every single student by hand 2,000 of them then they have to send it to the record secretary who has to put them in 2,000 of them into Synergy are you kidding me why don't we just load them all up and then as they get the forms the librarian just checks the ones who can't have the books right they spent countless weeks countless hours when a parent does challenge a book it doesn't want their kid to read a book you know what they have to do they have to go into Destiny they have to print it out they have to put it in a folder they have to send it to the record secretary and the record secretary is the one that makes it the parent call this our system is so broken it's like we didn't even think about it oh we're just going to make them do this opt in and then oh what are we going to do with these 2,000 sheets literally one of the Librarians told me in Destiny there's a box that we could change to parent opt out they don't use the Box anymore I forget what box it is it could easily be limited unlimited or no access nobody and attached to that could be an email with the description of the book where I show The Librarians where to get it as a board I am passionate about making sure our parents have rights over their children we have to do better and I'm as a board we usually do we do think about the kids we think about the teachers we always have those deep intellectual conversations about that but we can't allow access of Miss Skipper's little girls to Jeffrey dmer just because she doesn't know it's there and here's the thing kids talk about good books right the covers are worn off of the books that we were getting rid of when they find it they're all going to read it that's a fact but this is what a scambia county did create a parent health guide video to locate the library media access form which is online they click a box it goes right into their parent portal and it says for the world to see they're still using focus cergy is different but we need to simplify it all this we need to collect all these papers if you can't get these papers back from these kids or whatever it's ridiculous we use the program we paid millions of dollars for to make sure our parents are educated they can go in they can look in their parent portal they can make a decision they can click what box is there as a matter of fact they can unclick the box if they decide they don't want your kids and click it over to limited this is ridiculous our media Specialists have access to all of our kids we have to fix this these people made a video to show the parents exactly where to go and how to do it and what it all meant could you just play it for one second for me talking about parpal work man nobody has to do any work you make a video County parents and welcome to the focus this is a howto series they do it for everything for parents you may have heard of the county school Bo and they're going to explain the policy to the parents that states parents have the right have the right that's what I got it not appropiate read material for their student takes them into Parent Portal explains the board policy to them this is the problem we are overheated because we didn't do it right parent middle school students grade 6 through shall also have the opportunity you know how to play the whole thing I can send it to you if you guys would like to see the professional that went into this how to video on the next link it is frustrating because we're some people are just looking through our lens like it's like a normal lens and we're right here all the time if you go back out to yeah to your screen I just want to show you something [Music] so let's say people are confused principles are confused maybe I don't know I don't think they'll be confused but if you click right not yeah right here the green we need to get ahead to our training we need to start using our technology for what it's worth okay hold one second here's a flowchart Miss Gil has a kid going to school she's not sure what's going to happen with this Library Thing here's the full Library collection click on District challenge books I want to know if this book is being challenged I'm a media specialist and don't know what to do with this book could you click on that for me please this interactive flowchart is am amazing I talked to two board members down there they don't have any problems at all with parent communication and and outrage they just don't because everything is on here they even have a box at the end where the parent can do input on the book everything is here challenge document form you don't have to search through everything to find the form if you want to challenge it the form is there the form they turn in is uploaded it's there reviews state law says we should use periodicals and reviews there it is this is state law 100% 100% can you go back out of it one more time we just I implore us to do better and Miss uh Hansen this is from go back to this one more to scambia one okay Miss Hansen I just want to say thank you for bringing this to so if you're a parent you if you're a Schoolboard member you want to learn what the district's doing and he makes the the procedures all I have to do is here book store for review based on community standards every single one of these boxes a hyperlink to information people are not confused in ex scambia County they're just not and that's all I have to say I'm sorry just if I so it's going to be just to clarify so it's going to be there is a lawsuit with County I am talking to their attorneys um you know it I believe it's more the application of their policy I mean when you have a policy you got to follow your policy your staff has to follow it so we we'll clarify I wouldn't discount this just because it's a scambia county I think I think there's some good stuff here um and I'll clarify for the board so you know we would not whatever else which is our this just a flowchart we have one in our if you open your policy you'll see our flowchart in there we have one you know how many almost as many as us but their principl their principles are used to it Miss they've been doing it for a year they've had training they had the the standards they just anyway I apologize I get really emotional about this and I'm sorry no you you put so many hours into this and so it's really not about that it's just frustrating into it as an English teacher too Miss hansome so also say this is kind of off of what you were saying but I know for like the last three four meetings I beat my head up against a wall because we are not utilizing what we the capacity of our technology at all period are I mean we we should be I I'm not joking when I say we are like in the '90s when it comes to technology we might have great programs and and whatnot but we are not utilizing them like we should go look and and pointing that out that is a a fault that we need to address and fix pretty quickly along with other things because this is just an example um it's it's affected or yeah it's affected in every policy every um issue I know even with the police department um because there is I know I know the whole room laughed but there is programs where you can go file print and within 2 seconds that it prints that information should be there and so when I asked that sarcastically I also mean that seriously we everything should be in a digital world with a click of a button and we need to do better um as a board as a district implementing that stuff we shouldn't have papers upon papers upon papers when I found out about the the media specialist and how they had to upload stuff I mean I couldn't I I I laughed a little bit because I said what in the world everything should be digital everything period will be everything everything should be digital as much as we use use things it it should be accessible it should be on our main page um you should be able to type in in the search bar what you want and it should pop up it's a problem you can't find anything from our search bar people told us and I tried it and they're right it goes to other counties it's like well and that's why I I'm I'm very involved I'm very very very interested in theola for that reason and it may not be the content of the of the policies as much as the function of the it dep why can't our okay so to that to that extra people I will tell you I talked with my husband who runs the IT department for jfrd and while it seems simple to install a search function it comes with a price tag even though you have people who are skilled to do it there's software development that goes into that and hours of work right so but at the same time you you you spend more and pay less later and when we're talking about or consider that when we're talking about being organized and we're talking about being efficient and effective those things matter because again you we crippled a whole District by asking for three things or two things I think mine was like just two things I crippled a whole district and I didn't get it for almost three months so my suggestion would be Mr brasy this is an issue can we research tools or systems process whatever that you need address that issue and then we would need a recommendation from the IT department as to how to cuz none of us are it experts I would need to hear from his department on you know how can we install this function how could is there a system out there that provides this that I would like to have immediately available so you know I think it's we need a a direct wish list and then we need you know I mean but it's simple fixes that people from the outside world are like you don't have this y'all don't have that and my my husband too is an it and he probably will kill me for going on record to say this but he's one of the ones that look at our website and is like what is happening here and it's no offense to whoever's created it it's just this poor man wanted to sign for my office hours so he couldn't find it right and so then I sent him a link and it didn't work he know his have Google thing whatever Google forms or whatever so then I said go to the County website oneclay.net there's a scrolling bar this big at the top I need you to go down to the bottom I need you to click it to move seven frames to the right this is how I had to explain to him to find my office hours then he text then he emailed me back again and said I can't find it I mean it's we do have a problem and I didn't mean to get on a tangent it's just it really infuriates me and in this is just an example I know a we go to alter well I I know uh Miss Hansen has went to um a few but alternate trainings than fsba and we're able to communicate with other districts across the state and it It's just sometimes infuriating when it's like they're not any bigger they're not I mean some of them are smaller and and we're sitting here looking and I'm like why is it that we can't do that and I would say if you have a suggestion run it through the superintendent's office and then ask to put it on the agenda so that we can look at it as a board if you come up across a product that you think we should consider times pages but that's fine I just want I just want us to be hyper aware because I think that that's what I'm going to do I'm going to dive into the IT world that I don't even CFO in another County they went digital they got rid of all these papers you sent them all the time they did it all through the portal $1.3 million that's how much paper cost they saved in one year and so I we're in a digital world everything should be out our fingers and we should make it work for us yes if I if I could I know the IT thing passionate about but to provide some structure this and where to go here would be my suggest if if you wouldn't mind meeting with a small group just as a Next Step because like when I look at this meeting and I reflect on want to see I've seen passion I've seen a lot of work you know going into a lot of people passion everybody wants the same thing right pretty much and so I I think we're close and there's Nuance differences and I'm just listening to people speak with passion and I'm thinking they're kind of saying the same thing and they're really close but they're not quite connecting and when when I see that happen it always means there needs to be more communication between those groups so if you would I'm assuming the board would want Miss Hansen to to be the leader of that and meet with other other staff related to the topic and Mr Blocker of course I mean if we go in with an open mind but if we in with everything we're doing is fine except maybe one thing I think I think actually I think we're I think we're right there actually just in listening to everybody that voice their their thoughts I mean I think there'll be little nuances that will have to change what's the timeline here Mr Block I didn't I don't can we have a special meeting is there something we can do that we don't have to wait all the way till April to approve something that's been such a hot topic for me it's two years April that I start I went into Mr Del's office two years ago April yes ma'am I I completely completely understand so I did I I want to make sure that that um I gave you the best possible answer so y'all yall in your board policies do require a 28 day vetting that really does tie back to Florida statute and and you did and and full I was very busy yesterday you had a lot lot going on in the district um so I didn't have a chance to to relate back to cuz I want to read the statute again there is a Florida statute that does when you have a current policy and a current rule and there's a Amendment or revision to that rule there is this kind of extra notice requirement to the public that way people the public has an opportunity so unfortunately I don't think we can get around that now what what I think what might be helpful and Mr Browski I think this may be what your sugges is maybe we should you know look at scheduling a followup uh Workshop exclusively for this subject so the board you know we can refine this product that's time to look at it bring it back to youall the board you meet here you know this could be a special Workshop notice uh we'll you know we'll do some more legal work on this we'll get some input from Mr brosy you know we'll refine this a little bit I'll talk to a scambia county again to be clear we're not copying count not scambia Count's policy to communicate right the only reason I highlight that is because there were some things from scambia County but I would like to understand some of the school districts who have more of a kind of a diffused you know for the for the community standards which is I think the difference here so that way we can get everyone's input and really refin this is y'all's policy this is this is y'all's policy we want each board member to feel they've had had a hand in this that's been Mrs Hansen's Direction you we want input from Mr Dy and superintendent so Madam Cher If it's appropriate could we could we explore having a a follow-up workshop and evening maybe I'm sorry in the evening so miss gilhousen doesn't have to whatever the pleasures of the board how soon would you like to schedule it I think there should been another meeting before that just to make sure that the communication we're going to have to we're going to have to have like separate from the board we're going to have to talk but we're going to have to work work through so how about this how about you guys set your meeting and then miss Hansen if you'll communicate with the board that you'd like to go ahead and schedule the workshop we can communicate via email should schedule a workshop but I really want to know what you guys think after you have time to yeah that's everybody gets time to dig you go ahead andet think more about the how to implement it does that make sense so you would meet with Mr braski and Mr blocker and I don't know who else but whoever needs to be a part of that meeting and then once you guys have ironed out what you feel like is a good product and we've had time to read it and get our own ideas around it um once you've completed that meeting let us know and then we'll look at our calendars and schedule the workshop for us to talk about it as soon as possible after as possible after that and then the next school board meeting you can you can you vote when you make a special meeting no it has to be advertised it has to be advertised I mean vote to advertise I guess whatever well so you can't vote at a workshop so we would meet at a workshop meeting to discuss what we would like to see on the agenda so then it would go from the workshop to the the next regular board meeting agenda which would be February maybe then not this one but the next one be March February Workshop March meeting March so then we would vote march to advertise and then it would be finalized in April well that's great he really hasn't had a chance to look at it either Madam chair if I could I don't believe the 28 days are in the march to we have to work on the timing from March to April march to April corre there well I mean there's nothing preventing us from having a special meeting if we needed to just to but I think that right the board could decide to have a special meeting to to do the only the only legal constraint that we we're going to run into is we have to because we're taking a current policy and revising and amending it and there is a due process component we do have to and Miss S I apologize when you called me yesterday I did not have an immediate answer car accident so we we um but but what I think what I'd like I'll give the superintendent so we don't have to include the board all that we will schedule a meeting properly then if we had to have a special Workshop to address this apart from our our work workshop what I'm hearing from the board is there's interest in taking this model refining it and is that is that and the sooner the better sure so what I'm understanding is there's not 28 days between our March April right correct there's not because March is late okay so we could potentially set the end of February Workshop meeting to be a special meeting also yes just to vote on this ad trust you that would be on the 27th and that would give us an additional 10 days which would give us the 28 days we need so let's tentatively plan on that yes just one more thought you can still have the workshop in the workshop they go into a board a special board meeting just to vote on that okay well let's tentatively plan on that pending you guys meeting and I think we struggled a lot with the policy thing I'm going to send these two pieces of paper to you guys when I went to the policy governance training they handed this out and it is a policy about drafting a policy I think I talked to Mr brosi about this we have something in our policy but it's not what I'm talking about Counties have a policy that dictate how to draft policy so you don't have timeline confusions the district knows when it's coming um the policy writer's responsibility the district needs to know the desired components widely circul circulate drafts for analysis feedback reaction and review that has been a problem the entire 14 months we have been presented policies that part we we never get to present the school board's position not the districts and so I think there just needs to be a change of of thinking maybe a little bit and then um School Board responsib ility evaluate and amend the drafts when they come to us we do have opportunity sometimes to do that sometimes we don't but the thing the question they asked us was does your District have a policy giving structure for policy creation does it clearly Define the school board's role in the creation of that policy does the policy include an advocacy and Community involvement component does the policy require the district to be accountable for meetings and mandates and communication to the board I had no on all of them and I think we will struggle like maybe we should take up coming up with a policy for our policy making so the confusion like we already said what we would do at certain times but honestly if we had a policy about how to make a policy and we had the steps clearly written and we knew something was coming there's no more well maybe we get have a meeting or do the you know what I mean um I'll send this to you guys if you don't mind my writing on it I'll scan it in but the fsba is right they said it's like sheep wandering around Ireland with no fences if you don't know where to go and that's kind of how I feel about our policy I feel like we don't know where to go with it you know where it started when it's coming so that was that was my board comment sorry I'm done forever today I promise well I will add to that I thought this this meeting even though I could not attend last minute U the feedback that we got was wonderful yeah and I think the fact that they felt included in the conversation was the most important thing and I hope that we'll continue um but I remember when we found our first book back in 21 and we even had discrepancy within the staff as to whether it was porn and and 90% of us felt like it was definitely born but we had others that felt otherwise so you know there's always going to be everybody's own opinion but you know we had that issue with Scholastic of the fair that we need to possibly warn the parents you know not every page has been read and you know you need to to make sure so I think we're all like we said we're all on the same page we just need to get this moving quickly and I don't know we discuss the timelines but it sounds like we can move there pretty quick so that'll be great all right so before actually we move into Schoolboard member comments I did have a question from the audience um uh I haven't seen y'all in a while hello I haden't seen y'all since April when we first started talking about this this this p and the reason I came back because I saw one of you all uh media specialist who are former media specialist in Clay County cuz she was removed back to the classroom go fig and all because she didn't viiew how y'all that's wrong I'm going tell you that now to punish somebody for having a different View and put a person back in the classroom that's wrong but the question is I don't know what you're well well you don't need to know people in the room know it's wrong don't do don't do people like that when they have a different view it's not fair my problem is it seems like policy and procedure right polic procedure polic Mr Dy presented to you all a new policy whether it was pushed down your throat or not you accepted it that's true the brother said when you make a policy Mr Browski and staff has to follow the policy well not just the staff and Mr bras but y'all got to follow the policy shame on you shame shame shame on you the question is where they're presented to you all on the consent agenda to move those books that will appeal back to the ship the ma'am it's my understanding that that was taken off the agenda it was taken off the agenda off you had opportunity to do what was right and you didn't that's wrong well we tried to do what was right it was removed from the agenda and I had no power over that who moved it I don't know sir oh I'm sure yeah no I really don't I read I read all 171 books who's in charge of the agenda that would be me that would be you and Mr I'm telling you y'all it's wrong the policy the and I don't agree everything with da God knows I don't but I think the policy that he had was pretty good MH that just mean do I agree yeah there should be more Community input but don't go and put the on it it seem like you put an indictment on daily and Brasi about an old policy that they suggested y'all have something if if anybody has to be responsible for this kabo uh we're leading the United States and and and books that are not on the Shelf it's y'all thank you Mr D this is a time for question well let me the question is again it was why was it taken off the consented gent I think at the time the thought was it required more thought as to what to do with those books that were objectionable that were there that were still on that agenda and how to do that now why it took so much time is a whole another question for us to get to this point but that's that's still this section is not really a debate Pastor dub but I do understand what you're saying but I clarify something that you said though like when you say we're leaving the United States we've had 171 if the number is correct removed from the Shelf other districts far surpass that in the number that move removed from the Shelf than clay Clay County does not leave in removing books that's a fact it's not Facebook you like to say that though I do people love to just go out there then they create their own storyy it the focus on a lot of other counties bold they started using our books and taking them off the shelf and then they went past us a lot past us may I also interject like I told somebody a doctor at an incubate debate uh discussion that at least we have kept our doors open you cannot say that about other counties yeah they've locked the doors and do other so I think we've done superb in trying to trying to listen and meet everybody's needs there will never be another policy that's hard that can't be there will never be another one careful what you saying one one more question now you she said a lot in her presentation about diversity in stakeholders you Klay kind of won't ever get that I'm sorry to tell you why because you don't have first of all you don't have nobody in uh his administration that's african-amer that I've seen the the number of uh I'm coming with question the number of principles I can count them on one hand that are african-amer on one hand so you far from diversity it's not until we start hiring some people who look like me so the question is is that a conversation Mr bras not a conversation Pastor D but an action if you really take a look at the number and I'll be glad to go over the data the number of African-Americans H in administration I'd love to have that chat that that's that's the question so I would like to meet with you with the minister of Alliance that we can have that conversation yes sir facts the fact supported so I'll be glad to have the listen I love y'all and I won't be there Thursday God bless here whole time for them question yeah yeah you know I told my wife I was going to stick it out and she better not have me no sandwiches when I get home I want some real food listen I love y'all y'all pushing at thank you and and and be okay be okay with push back absolutely yeah it's cool thank you thank you all right so superintendent com School Board attorney comment uh yes I'll be very brief just um I'll be updating the board on well the superintendent at some point we'll be updating the board on negotiations with the sheriff's department running to a little bit of a uh you know trying to Nuance some things with between the county and the sheriff department I guess it's no surprise we have three different government entities that are coming together but um you know we have some ongoing challenges I'll come to youall individually as board members and let are up update the board but um just as we were starting our Workshop the County Attorney was calling me with a whole series of question so we will strive to we had a great meeting with the sheriff's department outstanding meeting and then I talked with the county attorney and they had a completely different now I'm not calling up a county attorney she's doing her job but completely different perspective so I think the county and the sheriff's department are working through some things you know as far as kind of jurisdictional and I think we're kind of working through some things too so I only highlight that because I you know I'd rather not raise that and even this is a public meeting and a board meeting well everyone's working hard to do this but it is a a lot of work and um we'll we'll hopefully get there so thank you um thank you before we leave did you want to publicly request the shade meeting for absolutely if I can formally request Madam chair a shade meeting to discuss um labor negotiations and strategy for April 10th yep is that correct if the board will approve that then we will move forward so this please consider this a formal request 9 so April 10th 9:00 a.m. 9:00 a.m. okay is it going to be an all day uh yes' we are going to have educational component but I think we can front load the strategy and the legal strategy so we'll have that discussion and go into some a broader kind of discussion so time frame wise what are we thinking 9 till 3 9 to 3 we'll provide 9 3 okay yes and I'm sorry for interrupting again I was referencing the shade meeting yes so the shade I'll I'll confirm with the uh the attorney but um you know it should be more than an hour hopefully we'll I think we'll talk further dat as the other one so two shade meetings on the time no just the one no just just one shade meeting then there'll be just just a general meeting that can be out on the public just and so and maybe I'm not in the loop any longer the shade meeting that Miss Isaiah was talking about oh I'm sorry yes discussion yes that that is correct so um there there will be um two there'll be two shade meetings that that day we'll have one that that will address um so so let me think how to do this let me just notify the board now let me work with you on how we're going to notice I think we have to notice this a little differently but we will uh I'm requesting two shade meetings from the board one to discuss a litigation matter and the second to to discuss uh our labor negotiation strategy okay all on April 10th April 10th yes ma'am if we can if we can make some adjustments cuz we are very early in planning this I I I'll get back to we may be able to move the at least of litigation once in March so so I I will I will I should if that was time sensitive like you need to talk to us before it has to be before May so so we have to the request is made for April but now that we we kind of so let me let me make the form more request we'll enshrine that in the minutes and I will work with our our team to to try to you have some exciting things going on right now so all that so all right thank you Mr blocker uh any school board member comments I just I handed this out to everybody if you're available J January 30th for dinner at Panera it is to support financially support the dolly part and acation library but should do have Dolly coming in her place so here you come again you say name yes I um I just want to talk about um I know the last Town Hall that we had was about um the book challenges I know and it was successful so um Miss Sanson and I would like to continue to do that on various topics um I think Miss Hansen uh what did you state at the meeting um dress code and yeah do you mind I know no go ahead I just don't remember what it was something else so it's a series of forums beginning on February 18th the disciplinary task force hold on one second can I dissecting the student code of conduct to start with cell phone use and dress codes on the 18th okay so February 18 February 18th I hope it can be in the same place February 18th is a Sunday no no Tuesday I think it's the 13th 13th 13th it's the 13th you're you and what time is it it's the 13th 6:00 and I hope we can do it at that Orange Park Place cuz you can record it we can record our conversation by law you have to record it so we would need to 7day notice that right the first week in February yes we want to have it allow about 10 days notice so I think that should give us I thought we start the task force with the cell phone and dress code cuz it's easier than starting with bullying Baker County had great success with these disciplinary task force sometimes 100 people would show up so I would like to continue to do that CU it's getting our our stakeholders input it's getting our community input um so for right now it's just the one that you got scheduled right yeah yeah yeah I fig well I I don't know about her we haven't discussed it cuz we don't have time at the meeting but I would I would like to do one a month yeah um especially like with whatever is going to come up on our agenda the second Tuesday of each month maybe we could plan around that may I just interject very very briefly so we wanted so so so the exciting thing about what y'all are doing these are board member workshops which we want to differentiate a little bit between from the board workshop with the board Workshop there has to be some type of for this is y'all as individual board members saying hey I'm going to have a workshop with my fellow board member everyone else come we'll notice some their notice the same way and you know you still record we have a recording here and and all that so y'all y'all as individual board members can do you know you obviously please coordinate with the staff because we have to you know make sure the security and and stuff there but y'all can do y'all can have a reoccurring one you know once a month you know individually collectively um as long as they're noticed they're open to the public we have some and we have a topic right an agenda which would be just the technically you don't have to have an A would you call it a community Forum kind of absolutely you can call current topics current topics you know um you know U Future agenda topics I mean you can frame it however there is actually no requirement to have a pre pre-issued um agenda so I think it's a great place to start dissecting out our individual student policies would be in a forum with us we could sit at different tables talk with people but I think it also brings the community out it brings teach teach out at BR and I also would like to invite our teachers because a lot of them get I don't know why they're they fear the district for some their jobs an annual contract they fear for their jobs and that's been that has been Perpetual for since it became an annual contract yeah so I just uh I i' encourage them I'd like to hear their perspective except especially since they're living it um that would be my most frustrating part is when people created policy that they did didn't come and see how it was impacting um the ER or hey because you decided to cut on supplies I now have no supplies on Sunday night when I work um so those things are are kind of important um and so getting feedback from people I mean I I do my due diligence and and individually when I'm at random schools or in the community and and there my handful of people I I go to I I get their feedback but it's it is nice to get all walks of life and it is so true that we all agree for the most part we're in the middle it's just how we're getting there and what it looks like so I would like to do that and wanted to talk about that your support was great when I couldn't get focused on the group she just stepped right in and took it so that was perfect um I also want to talk to uh the the board since we're all here um about our lawyer situation I know Mr Bitner has left um and our new board attorney has and the firm has taken over his workload um there is a lot of things that need to be caught up on um I know things that have been out in the docket for over a year um for some things so um also there's a lot of work that has to be done from a board perspective from our policies from um whether whatever direction we go um with creating those and just trying to get everything fixed procedures out um setting our our side up how how we want all the things um that I feel like we could keep Mr blocker pretty busy doing um but there are times where which it's no big deal I'm not saying you should me me me that's all what I'm saying but there are times where I've tried to you know reach Mr blocker and his tied up or he's had to call me back because um it's the district's on fire or something you know what I mean so my my thought process is we have publicly stated all of us together that we have funds for two attorneys we cannot expect Mr blocker and and JP and and the firm to function on I I would I I think they're under what M we paid Mr less than what we paid Mr Right and there the workload is unreasonable um I know that and wish and I've expressed my concern to Mr blocker I would like him to come and let us know you know how he's feeling if he's happy I I want to know that you know I I would have Lov for my boss to tell me or ask me hey are you happy that we have no supplies on Sunday night you know what I mean when I'm trying to save a life right so knowing that but I I also wanted to stay out loud um that I personally have seen and the little bit of time that we've had Mr blocker and the firm not only has he performed he has overperformed he has done everything um that has been asked of him and he does it with a smile um and not only that but that maybe within even within the district that we give him some Grace because he is catching up from a dumpster fire he is um having to do some complicated things and not only that but he's having to fix a culture where he where we were given bad legal advice we were given um misdirection and that depends on on what perspective you know or your Viewpoint from it but I I truly believe it um so I think we as a board should discuss because I want the I personally 105 want this fixed immediately um because who wants to work for Pennies on the dollar or not have help or um whatever the case may be but um pulling a new attorney or another attorney from The Firm to assist and or take over District work and we have you as our designated board attorney m i respond are only higher right first of all I just want to thank you all it's a pleasure to work with each of you all yall are a great board I appreciate the the kind comments you guys got great staff and and um all that so I I think it's I think it's helpful um you know I kind of learned this you know running a legal office in the Air Force you know you you you really yall are large enough where you really need a legal office you need really a team of to to do that we you got some great staff here but I think we will be helpful and I can you know work with the super intendent on this but I think what I would like to do is is you the the attorneys work for y'all so just like you have an elected superintendent that works with y'all our job is to really serve yall as a board and meet the needs of of your staff so what I would like to do is set up a legal office that that works on that where you know you all have a a line item budget y'all turn that over to us we know what those needs are we'll run it like a department where you have a team of lawyers that that do that way y'all don't have to get into the the weeds of of that the superintendent doesn't have to get into the weeds your staff doesn't we can field all these different legal issues that come up and address them appropriately that way the burdens on me and the responsibilities on me and and Charlie Mr Douglas to to operate that so y all can this is how other districts that have you outside firms that do it you know example St John's County where I'm a resent you have the UP Church firm they handle it they run a legal office they handle it you know they report to the board they handled the legal issues they helped the superintendent with that so I think we can we can do that when we first came on board obviously you have Mr bner still working here he had you know a lot that you know he was he been here for a long time so he had a lot of work uh that he was still handling it it's hard to kind of Disconnect from that I know as an attorney we take great pride in that so I would like to develop and and run a legal office for yall that can address all y'all's issues obviously we have to Resource that correctly so you know it's with y'all's permission you know I'll work with um Mr uh broy because I think you currently way we came in we kind of were transitioning into this but we're definitely at a point now where we need to to to to make that change so is that can we do that um sooner rather than later can we get this done and have when I sat with you it was supposed to be 1 hour of dedicated time for this policy he had 12 text messages two people come in three phone calls I'm telling you if I had to operate in those conditions I personally would quit what I believe my husband was the Commanding General of the Army's aid and there's protocols right the legal office should have protocols they have a secretary who has a book nothing's an emergency anymore and no one could see that General unless it was written down so if you need to see someone you see if there's an appointment tomorrow because I'm telling you as board members you do not want to go over there and sit in that office because you're going to be so frazzled and his apologizing is profuse but it still was very upsetting that a board member can't have a dedicated hour with their board attorney so you're right it needs to happen sooner than later and before we go into this policymaking attempt that we're well and this I mean I'll just tell you all just as we've been sitting here I've gotten two of your staff members have called me since we're in this Workshop that it's urgent we had another urgent issue that came off I've been responding to emails as we're sitting here JP's responding to emails I I don't know what I don't know what happened when Mr bner was here by himself I have no idea what was going on but it can't could not have been this busy so it it it's a lot of work and this is not a criticism you guys are a busy District we want to handle that appropriately but this is chaotic and for lawyers I can't hand I don't like the chaos so we we will try I will work with uh Mr brosky to to manage that a little bit better but again we're in a board Workshop right now and your staff they have emergencies and they need to they need to reach out to us we want to hear it but no one interrupted the general unless a war broke up somewhere the General's not a you make an appointment General's not a principal with a parent in their face asking for their kid my child I'm sorry principal St is usually but but Mr Walker makes a point yeah I know for a fact I know for a fact Mr vickner was not treated in this urgent abused manner I know for a fact I don't think you would know that fact I do know that fact he couldn't have been they got two lawyers working crazy and there was one of him he would have it's not for us to it's not for if I could let me let me just say this I'll work with Mr blocker Mr blocker has done a great job we've got a great relationship him and I and we'll work on the details of how to do that I think we just had a a I'm going to call it a structure meeting on January 11th where in this room we had all of these very people at Mr Block or mjp all in the same room to work on that I think I think some of that that you're talking about like never contacting the general I've got several comments on that but I'll keep put it to myself I I think that the issue is that um the structures need to be in place for him also yes right so that he can manage his own work and that's what that first meeting was keep in mind January 11th was that meeting yeah so whatever we're at now so we're working on it iure you that see it's working well absolutely so we we'll we'll work and report back to the board so I I appreciate y'all move forward on the protocols well absolutely and we appreciate you know y'all as a board and and I speak for Charlie and and and the team we JP we appreciate you all so so I on that note um were you here when you were on the board when Mr Daga was our attorney no okay do you remember remember the report that he gave us on his recommendation for Legal Services yes um is that a document that we can I don't know it was not officially provided to us uh as a board as I recall okay I believe he shared that with us individually right um and it was a recommendation right and it involved a board attorney right and a separate School District attorney right what the I recall Junior attorney that we that that sort of segwayed into there was there was further disc I do have a copy pelis county has a board dedicated attorney and then a district attorney and they sent both job descriptions my understanding is we don't have a second job description we only have the one job description correct that we would need to vote on it to separate those out I sent them to Mr blocker he might have more like finding them but it's a complete division about what a board attorney is responsible for in a district and what a district attorney is responsible for in a district and maybe that will help well and if if I if I may just kind of weigh in on this I I mapped out for the the the superintendent kind of kind of a kind of how we run a legal office because I I think you do need you need an attorney that can focus on District level issues that come off cuz they're going to come off when you have a principal like this morning you have a an angry parent in the hallway you have the state attorney's office and you investigator showing up at another school you know demanding to see a child these are these need immediate attention right so I think you can build it where you have you know just like you would run a legal office you would have an attorney that would address that um but I think some of that structure um you know y'all can just like you know the superintendent runs operations you know you can entrust the legal team to kind of craft that so we may have to adjust these different structures based on the needs of of the district and the board um and I think you know just like we would manage hiring outside you know Council for for litigation um I think what what I would like to work and I'm just speaking openly what I would like like to work towards is that you all kind of entrust us with those resources that we can kind of build the team around where there's continuity where maybe you know you need two or three other attorneys you know we're built as a firm or we can address that we can address that need but we have to structure same way using St John's as example they have a firm that's on call to handle the different issues that that come up they don't really separate the board attorney from the district attorney they try to keep it so that way there's continuity I would prefer that mode where we they're in the same office right I mean right well and and I have authority over the attorneys that we're bringing in here so I can I can make sure that we we there's continuity in how we're we're handling John and I are not going to have a on the division of labor because he he reports to me within the firm yeah and works with me same with Marcus and the other attorneys we' car as well so you know as a partner of the firm I direct you know their operations and sign their paychecks so we you know if we need to to focus our energy on helping you on a particular area writing policy or whatever we can do that um as opposed to having different firms involved or different different whatever I had no authority over Mr bner so when Mr bner in his final months here he was working on what he needed to to work on that he felt was important you know I I don't I don't manage them what I'm suggesting is we set this up like what I've seen working other you where you have a a you know a legal office that's run as a legal office the attorney's report we answer to the board we have your your you know we're evaluating our performance and that way we can address y's legal needs and it's not maybe as as um Sil siloed and also somewhat somewhat cuz youall growing as a district yall have you know large number of schools large large number of Staff you have we've seen dramatic educational changes I mean the legislature even now is consider even more changes just getting up on the law is a challenge at times and board certified attorneys in educational law six seven years ago are having to get recertified because the law has changed and their certification is different now so we want to set yall up for success and we want to do it and that's how we came into this contract we did not come into this you know to to to nitpick this one way or the other but you know the unique conditions that we came in on you all have an existing attorney who've been here for a number of years he was leaving and we had to have a transition period I think now we've gone through this this is what I brought but I I presented to the superintendent his staff kind of somewhat of a a a plan and I use that term loosely because I think we have to kind of you know put in place we have to be flexible we have to be flexible with the needs of the board I think some of these issues once they're settled will be settled issues but then other issues will bubble up so again I think what's easier for y'all potentially is is it let's identify kind of you know create a department just like yall would or another but where this is unique is we report directly to the board we're direct we are y'all's employer y'all our employer so to speak not the district you know Mr Bros is in a difficult position where he has to work with us he has to work with with all this but you know we don't I don't direct his staff I don't tell his staff what to do I can't tell his staff what to do he under statute directs his staff so I want to have that level of understanding with the legal team so we can respond to youall does that make sense it makes sense my when we first contracted with you we also understood that there were going to be other legal you would be representing other legal entities cases whatever that you would be working on at the same time as you're representing us and I'm assuming that that's continuing as well and I guess my concern is that we are also getting used to the fact and I when I say we I'm referring to the District staff because we did have an attorney that was here from 8 until whenever and during that time yeah he was always available well y yall are not paying cand y'all are not paying Mark Ray to to to have that right now you're paying 12,000 which is not enough to even pay the salary of an associate so market rate today that's n that's that's not even like I can't hire an associate for that much money and that's but that was the the contract that we initially started right so that's where I'm coming in and I mean me personally I'm saying you're the one who's supposed to is going to be contracting or working with them to determine what the coverage is going to be what the cost would end up being and then ultimately you would come back to us with contract with a contract call Mr so basically we're re we're redoing the contract that we well my understand that was cont I did not negotiate this contract my understanding was because you had a fulltime attorney here we were going to have to see how this this played out which we're open to and we we have other government contracts with other school districts they work very well but part of is you have to Resource them the right way and all all parties in a contract have to understand how they do it yall are unique in that youall have for a long period of time had one attorney in place forever um and I think that's great in but it seems like yall reaching a Tempo where we're I'm surprised that one attorney was able to handle it I mean you have a major negotiation with the sheriff's department going on right now which candly has a for from a legal perspective there's a lot of stress there's a lot of stress on my bar license to make sure we get that right because you get that wrong that impacts yall politically and and legally long term so youall have a lot going on right now I would not be comfortable Staffing that with one attorney I think you have to have the right team in place to do that so coming into this obviously we didn't know when we came into this contract some of the issues that were going to come up um so you know that's that's part of part of doing this we did vote on a second attorney so well and I I think I said I'm pretty sure I said during the time I I always felt like hiring a firm would be our best interest just because you have a deeper bench so um I'm more than open to looking at a different structure um but I do think it's important that Mr braski Express his needs we express our needs and Mr blocker come up with a plan for how can I meet all the needs and what's the bottom line exactly you needs to work it out yeah well I mean we all need to work it out together but um nobody knows his workflow ability to manage better than Mr flocker absolutely I appreciate that um is there anything further no ma no mail Skipper's done I was going to say basically everything I was talk about has already been discussed um I'm going to say conver the brief conversation on the Self insurance update for the board meeting um because it's really for more of the citizens to hear and a lot of people don't listen to the workshops um I was going to bring up about where we're at with police negotiations so I appreciate knowing that we're almost to the gold post um that as far as far as the legal I just want to add that obviously they're being taxed districts being taxed regarding the legal side and I know the Douglas Law Firm can't afford to continue this way so if we can wrap this up as quickly as possible with negotiations this month preferably you know as far as procedures if there's Interruption we should have a secretary that secretary should stop people from exactly coming into the office and phone calls can wait Miss Robinson is still there correct so if we can just wrap thisly as possible so that everybody is happy we all lose the off firm so that's all I have to say Okay do everybody had an opportunity do we know when we're going to have the list of responsibilities for us yes I will have that at the regular meeting I don't have it with me today but I will have it at the regular meeting and just the only change that I'm aware of is that Miss Skipper wants to be on the um Education Foundation also can we discuss like um other possible committees because sure what what ideas did you guys have I have uh I know do we have apparently aison within the district yes for ESC for only for ESC could we created a job for it we voted on okay cuz I feel like [Music] um I don't know what that would look like but I feel like [Music] um but Mr brasy holds student meetings and he holds teacher meetings yeah right what do you call your little student thing advis coun advisory we don't do anything with parents he well I would I would strongly disagree no I mean like what she's talking about in this in her kind an individual person that lay as on position is more for uh ESC services but each each group has a niche of people to reach out to parents um so I don't know how you would create a position and each school has are you asking about a position or commit no she's talking about committee committee so like a parent advisory committee ADV um well like right they a PFA so a lot of the pfas want to join together and become one big PFA I don't know what that'll look like I don't know where they're at in the process so I was just saying if that occurs I will get an update on that I think that it would be wise to have like a board representative Lea on for the so it's not something that we are organizing they are going to organize they would organize it and we would be like we kind of like tobacco for um you'd be part of it You' bring it back to the board all of that I don't see any reason why not I mean we've appointed board members to be on all kinds of community committees so if we want to do that I think that's fine do you want to we obviously I don't think we should bring it forward until that committee is now we have to see if it's got sure okay yeah once it fles out then but I mean like I just meant like in general I don't know I mean we could talk about it today I don't know if anybody else has any ideas um but so you're think you don't want to decide this by the February meeting no we don't have to okay so I guess what Miss Skipper is saying is do you have the Committees in front of you I don't have them in front of me now but I can send them out would that be helpful yeah all right cuz I had an idea on something I just want to see what we have right now I'll email out the current list um the only feedback I got when I emailed that last time was Miss Skipper wanted to do the um education committee so or Education Foundation so I was going to make that change I didn't hear anything about anybody else wanting to change anything so I was planning to keep everything else status quo but if there is something that you want changed let me know and we'll finalize that by the February board meeting okay okay sound good and then that way we can also be brainstorming and having just future conversations about potential future committees if you guys have thank you for bringing it back up and remembering oh that wasn't me that was was it you was it Miss I just make sure we don't have a sunshine violation would be possible to maybe have Miss noris s send out the committee that way there's not a response directly to you I thought that the committee assignments are not something we vote on so it's not final it's just information never being such a lawyer no I appreciate you please protect yes please do no we don't vote on that it's just kind of you do this you do that understood um did you have anything else no Miss Hansen okay the only thing I wanted to talk about um we talked about adjusting the time of our Workshop meeting and just to be perfectly candid with you I burnt all my PTO on our workshops so if we could move them um to the afternoon it would give me the opportunity to flex my time um so I was thinking if we set a time frame of we meet from 1: to 3:00 on our Tuesday Workshop meetings in the afternoon or 12: to 3: um and then L like late afternoon well so my thoughts were if we need an additional meeting after that we can schedule another meeting there's nothing stopping us from having as many workshops as we need to but um just with family schedules and work schedules um for everybody who attends these I think if we keep it within that afternoon time period when kids are at school everybody's at working anyway um it hopefully respects everybody's schedule that needs to be here um and then we have a time stamp so we're not meeting for 8 hours yeah we're meeting for two or three and then if we need to address that way we're not stacking our agenda with five things that we need to discuss or if we do then we say each item has 20 minutes to present or 30 minutes to present and hard stop we should be doing it anyway but yeah I think it's it these are so it's right at the time you would pick up your kids yeah that that would be my only conflict is I have to get from here it's about 30 or so minutes away so um if it did run 23 I would have to leave the meeting early is the only downfall so um I would have to let let everybody know that that I wasn't leaving to uh we let you go first on board member comments do what we'd let you go first on board member comments that's all you missed as but I would I mean if that's the case if we're limiting it because I mean we're we're working and working through things and getting you know things and and moving in the direction that I think board majority would want to move in that sometimes it does take a long time if that's the case then there are going to have to be some things that um maybe revisit the reading through the agenda maybe not do that maybe we read through it at home and if we have a question we'll ask you about it um cuz that sometimes can take a long time and we just get straight into presentations I love that it's only my thought just to save on time if we're going to do it that way um and then the presentations be which I've always been like this I don't need 75 slides for you to tell me the point the point is there a way we can limit the amount of time this is it this is what's happening the the data on data on it and this is why it's great like not I'm not dissing what was done today that's not what I'm saying I just mean in general I y'all know I've always complained about a slideshow I'm just saying I I'm a direct person so um to me 15 20 minutes I mean anything over that I feel like I agree with you miss Skipper on this I I've had constituent input on this I believe I've talked about this probably three or four times since I started but the a lot of counties don't go through that part of the consent agenda today was fast some days aren't fast right and I really think we need to have a limit I once when I was getting my masters Dr hail said to me you have 250 words to say what you mean mean what you say there is no way presentations need to be longer than 5 minutes so even if you had three of them when I called and asked about if my this policy was on on the agenda it was full already I mean it was clearly full well to their defense we ask a lot of questions and we have a lot of discussion about what's being presented so I think that's something to consider when you're limiting their time you can't count our time against their presentation no that's 100% but also we could we could find ways to utilize our time more effectively and what I mean by that is hey can you give me that presentation before so I have time to look over it so if I do have additional questions I can either reach out to you or there's less chatter you know what I mean um so I'm more prepared or like I said just not reading it I'm just giving I don't really care we can stay here8 hours all day I I don't care we can do that I'm fine with that restructuring the amount of time the district consumes out of a workshop would have given us a much fresher start earlier on board business like usually it's all board business this is all board business I'm not no you no no what I mean is a presentation is different than us trying to work out of policy board Workshop its title is workshop and when the majority I don't mind the presentations but I honestly believe five minute limit it's like our celebrations on board night we should have a 30 minute limit there are people waiting for that to finish who come to do business with the board who have to wait through the entire thing some counties do that 20 or 30 minute limit and then they scroll all the great stuff the county does on the screens behind the board I just wish when it's like Miss Skipper said I clearly could have read through the whole agenda asked one question about how much more the the the policy costs and I could have done that ahead of time but it was great for us to know I really think we can condense I think we're smart enough to get it in 5 minutes she's right there are ways to get to the business so that if she had to leave it would be done quicker mhm you know but I mean at the same time I can sit here from 9:00 till 4:00 3:00 I don't care you know what I mean like I don't I don't care but if we're going to um limit it to every meeting only being those 3 hours and then we have a Hot Topic item or or whatever then I'm just trying to say to utilize to best serve you to to accommodate for your schedule and your PTO and then accommodate for me having to go get my kids or or whatever um cuz I put my kid in in school/ daycare so that I could be present from 9: till till she gets out at 3:15 so I just am saying that I I could do whatever I mean I could do what we have now I could do it after hours or if those 3 hours we utilize them effectively and efficiently by limiting either I'm just trying to find ways so that we better serves our time if not I mean I'm for keeping it at 9:00 I think we're all saying the same thing that we we want to S make the meetings more succinct um put time stamps on what's on the agenda and know that we have a hard stop at we could say 2:45 if that helps so that you get there on time and you don't feel like you're missing part of the meeting so 12: to 2:45 is our Workshop agenda um time and will break out the times on the agenda imagine when we go into policies we need more of that work I'm going to tell you in past practice we had we had lots of workshops we did not have just one Workshop that's we had Community forums before as well this is not something new we've done that no I'm just talking about workshops well I'm talking about workshops as well I mean there L of this is a regularly occurring Workshop so that's why I'd like to keep it in the daytime when all the staff had to be here but when we have an item that we as a want to work on we can so and there's nothing tying us to but these regularly occurring every we also say that and then the time comes to like do it and then we've never done it we've never done it yeah we've never done it so as long as we follow up on this I'm fine with that but at the same time I I mean and it should be maybe evening so that neither one of you are on if we have a special Workshop I mean yeah the regularly occurring ones cuz I also have kids and they all play sports and I don't want to miss their games if I don't have to so if we can keep it in the afternoon that gives me the opportunity to flex my time at work and be with my family in the evening um but then if we need to schedule additional I don't have any of those concerns and so I mean there's three of us that that don't so to answer to answer your question about we talked about it but we're not doing it we're starting right now with the reading work the reading the book the book challenge I know what you mean there's a meeting and we're going to have a workshop following that and it's not necessarily going to be paired up with our next board Workshop that's going to be a separate Workshop right there and if we have any time I mean when I when I had brought up the idea that we need to review policies truly I keep going back to Neola but when we when we do start doing a challenged policy that to me is a policy Workshop that should be a separate Workshop from an agenda Workshop cuz the agenda Workshop is regarding the agenda and anything that has to do with the operation of the school district we need to have those presentations from as well um they can go quicker they can always go quicker but but what I'm talking about is the fact that the information that we got today was terribly valuable I mean we're not saying that it's not but but not every presentation is is is like that sometimes we've added Seven 8 10 slides that were kind of like repetitive or unnecessary I mean I know that when you come from an outside world this you kind of just like you know your little your mind works a little differently but what I'm saying is or what I think is is being heard is that the Workshop agenda is super important to the district and to certain board members so it should be important to all board no I know but not all counties read through the workshop they the worksh you're not understanding my point my point being is they still want to keep the same time still keep everything else so outside of that meeting if we want to do policy if we want to do board business if we want to talk about things that we can't talk in sunshine we need to have our separate meeting which need to be at least once a month understand is you they didn't use to read through the agenda that was started with um Mr Davis that's when it switched they they didn't even have a workshop yeah they didn't read work like they didn't do this before this is a newer format also up to to board members as well but I like I think that we were voted and putting these seats and these chairs to do a job and our job is to do policy um and and to vote on what you have presented I'm not saying I don't want to hear presentations that is not what I'm saying I know that's what you're hearing but that's not what I'm saying what I'm saying is I don't need 75 slides to get to the point that's all I'm saying and maybe that's not efficient maybe I'm too Direct in saying that and I'm I'm hurting feelings but I'm just saying let's let's say what we mean mean what we say and move on I think it would and I'm trying to accommodate with your schedule to to make that work but if we don't want to do that then we'll leave the 3 hours allow the district to do what they want to do and we'll have a separate meeting but then I don't know how that's going to look for you with your PTO and whatnot so we can do separate meetings but my but I think we're saying the same thing in that condensing we need to condense it I want to put time stamps on things and then if Mr bras say we're not saying the same thing cuz she's disagreeing no no I did not no I didn't with the time stamps cuz now you're no I the time stamp and I was just trying to say that we do have extra workshops I was agreeing with it and then if there's an item that we don't feel like we've explored enough and we need another presentation on we'll schedule another meeting so I think just putting and then Mr brosi can say if you know cogistics is going to make a presentation you guys will have five minutes to present it's it's just a change of process we haven't done it that way I mean is it possible that you know he doesn't go through the agenda but if we have a question you go through that section of the agenda like if we email tried to what I tried to do and what you saw today was holding in on the two or three that I think would be of interest to the board because of the ones that are routine yes I could skip the ones that are routine which are ones there never questions that are involved there I kind of point out if I could is when we talked about the the student data and the program of of ir ready math it's so important that the board understands that information right and that was a great presentation in my opinion time appropriate for that presentation and nobody is saying that I'm not saying that I'm not even talking about today's presentation no that one that one challeng is if you're going to vote on something you should be informed about what it is you're V we have question we could ask like if you put the presentation online and I read through it they could do a brief of the presentation they wouldn't have to go through every single slide I mean best practice for teaching you wouldn't sit up there and talk for 20 minutes about something in a power did you feel like the presenter today Miss cind cour did that or do you feel like her her presentation was appropriate it was 100% appro 20 minutes long but and nothing longer than that cuz after that you you're looking at butterflies but what I'm saying is is I've sat here through an hour presentation almost before an hour you would like us to refine the presentations to make sure they're streamlined no get to the no that's Hur streamlines I love stream give me data but get to the point just say hey I'm here for this streamline it'll be more condensed like you were saying right so I feel like we're tip toing into some I don't want to be disrespectful of anybody who attends our board meetings and presents at our board meetings so I think just sticking to the fact that we all agree that having a set time is a good idea and limiting um time that we spend on each item is a good idea um and I think you know if we get to a situation where we need more time on on a specific item we'll schedule another workshop for that item does that make everybody agree with that or but you're saying the same thing but they're getting upset that we're saying this close conversation can we start at noon as I could with you or do you need to go to 1:00 and you're saying we have board business we could and we will schedule yes if there's more worksh anytime miss Hansen Miss Skipper Miss Clark Miss Vol we just haven't done that since we started so we we weren't anytime there's an item that you want us to have a workshop on shoot me an email send me a text call me and say I need a workshop on this item and I will get it handled but you actually don't even have to go through me you can talk to Miss onora Miss onora can contact the board members and make sure there's availability so we all have to figure out a time when we do that right is that the hardest part and we can do that through email we can do that through phone call we're not voting on a time for a meeting so that's a conversation that you can have with the board anytime you can request a meeting anytime the only problem is that we have to make certain that M has plenty of time advance notice yes has noticed cause chaos so say what I just think doing that sometimes will cause chaos requesting a meeting just the inconsistency inconsistency of what cuz everybody's going to be like I can't do this I can't do that I can't well it is hard to schedule a meeting I'm not saying it's not difficult to coordinate we have tried to hold meetings sometimes special meetings or whatever I I forget right now cuz I'm kind of tired about the two times I tried and we didn't do it so what I think the chair is madam chair is saying is that we can make an effort now if we know there's going to be something that's going to take a great deal of time scheduling a second meeting so that the one meeting doesn't become all right yeah and then we all agree that we should set if we have something really important to discuss maybe like the book policy it could be separated out am I right yes going be separated out and we should make a commitment to make sure that we do that right is that what we're saying absolutely accomodate as we go for each one them okay I think historically we've just tacked everything onto the one Workshop that we already had scheduled that's what we've done since we've all been here so like anytime like I I think about the policies that you've brought forward the policy that you've brought forward I can't think of everything that's been brought forward but I know specifically we've added policies to this Workshop for consideration so we may not have called a separate meeting but we didn't take not did add this to the meeting today and so on on the district's behalf they had these five things ready probably and somehow I got left off but he did make it put it on there so partially that's the reason why we were here so late no and I'm not saying that I'm just saying I'm hearing from you guys that you feel like I have not scheduled meetings or taken up items that were important to you and I that was not my understanding oh no I I just think it's a great idea that moving forward if we need it we'll do it okay I think that's a great idea okay especially with policies coming up yeah yeah like you said policy meetings yeah okay so we're in agreement for the February Workshop that we will meet at from 12: to would you like us to make it till 2:45 Miss Skipper whatever accommodates y'all I'll I'll do whatever so she has to leave as as a chairwoman you can look at the schedule maybe and decide how to frontload things or you know how you change the agenda meeting sometimes what time you want to say 2 12: to two you just schedule it and I will I will make it then you can always go back if it didn't work out you can always readjust your time frames true we never put an ending time on the I have nothing to do we're starting at noon that would be I'm the old lady in the group we have nothing to do we whatever you need is there anything furthered so after I made the district that I e e e e e e e e e e e e e