ready to call the meeting to order this historic preservation Commission meeting is being held on May 21th 20224 at 7:00 p.m. statement ofate notice pursuant to the Sunshine Law adequate notice in accordance with the open public meeting Act njsa 10 colon 4 hyen 6 was provided on January 22nd 2024 of this meeting's date time and place the agenda was mailed to the cranber press and Trenton Times posted on the township Bolton board and mail to those requesting personal notice in followed with municipal clerk roll call and volunteer hour Miss sum um here and um one okay Miss Ryan here one as well Mr Guy Mr H here three hours that's it okay all right Mr Sabo advises he was not attending near on the township committee L on is not here all right we have a quan chair great okay so um we'll be able to begin with we've been hopefully probably pretty short meeting tonight um we'll begin with we have one application um which is HPC 20824 um the um the applicants are were not able to attend but I had an opportunity to speak with them about their project um will you guys might remember their project they came to us before to do a addition in the back um which we approved um and now they are in a place where they share a driveway with a nextdoor neighbor and they want to try to get their car in closer to the house so they can have an electric vehicle um so what they're looking to do is extend their driveway and keep it the same uh r Granite um and they are also looking to kind of make a p path that links the driveway to the home um and what they're looking to do is there's some older pavers there they're going to take those out and replace it with a um um what are they called canbridge armor Tech um um papers and they are more modern um but they are going to be matching the papers that are in the back of the house so they're looking to take what is done in the back and make the front match with it um and so I I I mean I know we we were originally thinking this might be an an auto approval but at the same time um I don't remember us ever approving like a new driveway at least in the five years I've been with you guys um I don't remember doing one I don't know about in the last five years but over the years we I figured we had but I just don't like I just wanted to make sure there's nothing um that I missed um in terms of looking at this um and also um if we've ever had feedback on pavers you know moving to a more like modern type of P Stone um to match the back of the house which is more like um contemporary um so I guess you know it I personally I I get what they're trying to do they think they need to do it they don't have much of a choice um with this day and age um but I just wanted to make sure there wasn't anything that we should be thinking about with their project I don't have any objections to the proposing I mean if they didn't have the existing papers in place already and they came and proposed these papers but so they're fine okay in fact they different than what's existing okay it's fine good I can one of you's been doing this longer um can you help me maybe understand why it may have been written that uh decorative concrete papers is a simulate brick and someone shall not be permitted like for that to be explicitly not permitted why does anyone know why that's no rules no no no what it this would be Chapter 93 SE section 7 um should not be yes um what subsection five walkways um the very last sentence of that paragraph is decorative concrete papers that simulate brick and stone shall not be permitted they don't want something that's artificial brick or stone look but I don't think this is really this is this is not made to look like brick or stone no it's much more contemporary like so maybe they just mean artificial brick should not replace real brick or artificial stone you think that's why they wrote it that way I can imagine I know that like brick thank you brick um brick look concrete papers you know they turn sure turn pink and look very artificial so I can see that objection um the other colors tend not to you know like fade and degrade like that so that would be my first thought is that it's those those pink pink bricks well it's kind of stone like kind of slate like but it's very organized so um I have no objections to it okay um and then in terms of the with with driveways um have we ever like they I I do know um they did I think they did want to originally maybe go like this and they had to deal with the yard set back um so they adjusted things I did ask a little bit about the weird sort of shape of of the new driveway um but um apparently it's it's sort of based on how you drive your car in and they're trying to make it too so that they can fit maybe a second car in there they're trying to be able to park the cars to charge them on on electric charger is that yeah and do you have any sense of where in the scheme of the site plan the electric Chargers are are they at probably probably at the end I would imagine yeah I don't think they have a choice because they can't put it up here um yeah I mean it'll probably be attached to the house unless it's freestanding shortest distance to power but I have no problem with the shape of the driveway okay and then we're okay with um the other thing I was looking at is like they are removing grass to put in papers are we okay with that too in terms of the historic um view of the house okay yes okay cool I mean the also the driveway is gravel so at least it's not a pervious cover you know so okay well I just I appreciate you guys looking at over again and new to this whole chair only thing I'll be curious if they come in next time with a proposal to put a garage at the end of that drive but we'll see maybe just maybe just kind of set you one step at a time I know because that was that was one of the questions I asked him I'm like wait I what is this did we see this already he's like oh yeah you've already been here yeah well yeah so all righty so we make a motion to approve y okay so moved second all so application to be approved as is Miss stme yes Miss Ryan yes Mr Guyer yes Mr Hull yes and Miss Marlo yes thank you motion passed okay so our next is uh Robin going through the approved minor ordinary maintenance and repair application we did there's something going on with the mic that only two mic Sue is not allowed to talk because [Laughter] ites okay so the minor and ordinary maintenance and repair approvals the first one is six North Main Street they had the driveway and pathway approved they are going to do that in the back of the home which cannot be seen at all from the street um so that was approved for minor 27 South Main Street for front porch columns and guard rails that was more ordinary maintenance and repair they're just repairing those things and then the gutters and downspouts will be new the down spouts I believe they were upgrading they were increasing in size they were going from 3 in to 4 in um that was approved and the last one is 11 North Main Street and it was approved for the new roof to match existing for the detached garage they're doing the same material same colors everything so it was approved that's or maintenance and repair is that garage visible from the street I was trying to find it yeah I know like no it's a really cool garage too I've never seen it before and saw the picture and I said wow um great okay so next we'll go into Old business and um for TR Cranberry Township signage um the main update is that you know I think everything's been installed um throughout Main Street it looks fantastic in my opinion um and um thank you for signing the card for DPW um so I think that um we're in a great place I am going to follow up and now at this point in with um M marabell and with DPW about removing the existing like rundown wayfinders that are there um to dig those out um but that is that's where we are for this for this month any other updates okay um and then for cranberry station Hamlet historic district I don't have any updates this month I did not get to work on anything with it neither do I yeah but this month hopefully will be the month I think what one of the first things I'm going to do is uh reach out to Monroe Township and you give me the names there and just see how far we can get with h at least information from them and kind of support yeah and I'm going to be taking the the application and breaking it up and trying to start repopulating it with what we have on hand already I did have an update on this I think at our last meeting it was said that the if I understood correctly it was said that the newest structure in the station Hamlet was constructed in 1861 however the phase three survey identifies 90 uh Housey Reed Road uh as a contributing property that was constructed Circa 1880 so if we're actually trying to extend the period of significance to when the latest structure was built then that actually would be 1880 possibly okay and the 1880 is also a contributing structure yes okay okay that sounds good and you know one thing that's a good point you mentioned because when we talk about that period significance I've been driving on Route 133 a lot lately and um on my way to Philadelphia and um the sign for the candidate amay railroad it says chartered um 1830 remember how we were going back and forth between 1831 1832 right it's actually it says chartered 1830 so we may just want to make it a clean 1830 to 1880 um that date though may be when the railroad started but not when it actually reached cranberry yeah says chartered yeah right so it it may have been established then but it didn't actually make it to Cranberry until then so that that's a question answer yep um good okay um identifying designating historic sites um I know Dave isn't here this week um did we have any Lu with figuring out that tax um that list of tax properties from the report so she stated that the tax assessor toen advised me that she is at a conference currently but when she gets back next week she'll speak with me further regarding it and she said that uh we don't have such available I want need to do more info to create such a report would it be more convenient if I gave you specific properties and she said yeah that would be good so she'll speak to me next week okay um I'll delve further because when she gave the other properties when we were designating the new properties she gave me all the dates for them yeah so I don't we just of all you know dates on the tax record and the address and that's all we need yeah um okay great Bobby any updates uh I know you were working a little bit with Dave on that no okay um okay designation for cranberry Village District properties Amendment to the historic preservation master plan um Robin I know you were going to follow up um so I spoke with Liz a few days ago no last week I'm sorry she's on vacation this week okay and she has a master plan she's doing for another Township so she's been very busy with that so she said possibly June okay she's GNA start working on it okay cool I'll just keep following up thank you um okay next is um public Outreach um so for mayor's communication um I drafted up um some language which I handed out to you guys um just a little blurb and what I was going to do is turn it into a little flyer in canva with like a picture of the new street signs um and so I'm wanted to get your take on the language um and then I'm going to share it with the um Miss marello probably to get her to weigh in on it too before it goes to you know publish and stuffff um if you guys do you want oral comments or us to mark them up and give them back to you if you want to do that that's fine whatever is most convenient I'm open to feedback and then I'll also when I put it into the canva I'll send it out to you guys too just so you can see how he made it but basically just try to make it a little bit Visual and exciting um so I was thinking what we could do is um do this as like a PDF it'll go into the mayor's um email and then I was also going to try to see about printing it out and putting it on that new board downstairs and that way then when we do another new communication we can just swap it out and that way we kind of have like maybe a you know historic update for folks that are standing down there um by that that KS because I see that some people are putting things in there so it's a way to just get the word out and we just do that or do we need special permissions I'm sure I'm going to need permission to do it but exactly so we'll see um so that's the idea that sounds like a good idea yeah feel free to make edits I'm not the best like writer yeah yeah and I'm going to run it through the computer to see if I have any like grammar and and spelling errors too I haven't even probably done that um do you already have images of I was gonna use the pictures um that I think that Iman I was going to ask her if I can use them um that she took when we had um preservation New Jersey here someone took some pictures of the signs during that tour and I was thinking I'm just using those because they look pretty professional um yeah this is guys oh my gosh thank you so much um okay great um and then for next month I'm going to work on a I'll work on one of these as well for doing for the library and I'll show it to you guys before about the little Library shelf we have and I just think we're going to have to when we draft it up we have to also get their them to weigh in on it as well since it's their shelf and what we say about it um and let's see um I realize I probably should have brought this up in our last uh point about the uh the village historic district properties but um I had a question which was that this isn't newly designated or not to be designated but they are newly designated the state historic reservation office has an online map that they show the boundaries of the historic districts and they show the national District they show the um the state district and Local District uh and their understanding of our local District doesn't reflect our current local district there are properties currently in our local District that aren't included inside that boundary um and in fact I think that led to some of the misunderstanding in part of the phase three survey is the state had given had exported from its database on the properties that were to be surveyed to the surveyor and that the reflection of whether or not they were in the district was based on that export from the state database and which is why I think the survey had I had thought there were more that needed to be or should be added to the district because the state didn't wasn't aware or didn't know that they were already in the district I can I can talk is there someone at the state I should speak with help them understand our current situation so um I had reported at one point that ly Lindsay was our liaison to the state that's correct and she's gone elsewhere so I believe Andrew tingi has been stepping in for that um so I can share her contact information or you can just go on to the website and they have they're all contacted there so she yes so and if she's not the person to talk to she certainly direct you so Andrea tingy so it's this it's the state's website um sorry the historic district is that Lucy indeed they call it Lucy Lucy okay I'm just making a note so we remember to that's a great catch I'm glad we figure this out because we don't want to end up going back backtracking with all of our the work that we been doing just because of like you know miscommunication between the two entities so yeah um okay um great so um I definitely think we should also do a mayor's communication on the interactive map um but U Brendan I don't know you know are you would you like us to do that or are you still I guess when we talk about that want to talk about like where we are with updates to it or what you're working on I'll take the you know the lead from you on when you want to start like massively promoting this too like I know we did a little bit um a cranberry day you know preservation day we could do so much more so yeah um right now I'm doing things like typography on Android devices so that should give you a sense that we're if if we wanted to share it I'm pretty comfortable sharing it okay in terms of you know things left to do the uh it's in my conversation with uh chips it's been very clear that these first set of historians notes is just the beginning these aren't this these notes will be living and they can provide updates and additional ones and so it's you know it's not so much like done so much as we we can definitely living and breathing yeah okay great um perfect um does anyone have any other updates regarding public Outreach anything regarding cranberry day um I had a thought recently um I had mentioned that we could do a scavenger hunt of um town maybe Township uh features so have to Sol solicit ideas but I I also uh based on some recent social media activity had a thought about like an FAQ kind of board where like you know does cranbery you know dictate the color of your house that kind of thing and and things like that right like frequently asked questions so I you know I don't know if you guys have any other ideas or things that you have been asked that maybe we can just throw up on a board to like answer we don't have an feq on our website nope yeah we I think that's like a no-brainer okay yeah um I I bet someone who's starting out on a project in their house would be interested to see how other uh property owners have approached their projects and so if if any property owner who completed a project is willing to share before and after photos or um kind of a story about their process that that could be nice okay well this sounds like a project a for a [Laughter] project okay great um so let's see uh Revolution New Jersey is next on our um last okay the only upcoming thing that I know of is that what they called Tavern trivia they're going to have in and that will be a night with some reactors and evening asking questions about cranberry I thought it was like the trivia game that they have at the cranberry in it it's not really so much a game it's just asking questions and getting answers about or or facts about cranberry that would be interesting especially around the Revolutionary War ER that sounds fun yeah is there a date set for that you know I just looking it's sometime in September okay yeah I remember it's in September too I just don't know when um okay um we have preserv the preservation New Jersey cranberry tour um on our agenda I think we we did debrief on that from last week last month right and oh no we didn't no I think we were it was to have it 72 people was I think certainly not who showed up so yeah I think it was still deemed you know I think it seemed like I was there it seemed like a pretty um good group of people who were like actively engaged I think chips did a great job of organizing it and um bring people around what was the comment that was overheard at the reception afterwards that uh that oh were the best preserved town or middle sex County yeah yes so I mean I think that was really great that we had that and I mean I almost feel like we I don't know these preservation New Jersey people are they're are they they tied to the government to the government or are they a nonprofit yeah because I mean it would be right if we could do this more often honestly like I feel like this would be something would be great as like an annual thing that we do in our town I can imagine a like revolutionary themed walking tour as well not quite positive we have enough sites to make a walking tour but if we do maybe that would be a good theme just before I forget night I think 21st okay okay well I mean I think it was U that was a great it was a great event and you know I think it was really great at preservation New Jersey to choose us and bring people there and yeah I think a great job from chips that did a wonderful job organizing that and we gave out the flyers I brought them over to the cranbery in they were it was set up beautifully I didn't get to be at this um the thing at the end but it was um I saw the setup and it was gorgeous so so yeah um okay next we have commission training um I'd like to talk about the upcoming state conference because uh after many meetings um we have our list of questions that are are prompts for our session so I wanted to run them by you guys because I kind of have in my mind what I'd like to say but I want to know what yall wanna want you know cranberry to come across that so number one what community community engagement programs or initiatives has your HPC developed how would you eval evaluate the outcomes of these efforts so um I was thinking I didn't know if you considered the signage effort as an an initiative or a program and I think we're very happy with how it came out and I think it was very important for us to define the boundaries of our district so so is that something I should share with them yes yes all right um any other initiative that we have done I mean we have we now have the interactive map which is an initiative lots of these things are brand new actually so um and uh so those are things I thought of anything else the library program you could do that too and then it's sort of a nice little you know but ump bump back to the uh um it was Lindsay right who suggested we do it remember she was the one that said you know have program you know where you share your your results with the town and so I think that would be nice that could be something to talk about okay um okay number two are there particular constituencies or groups within your community that you have engaged or would like to engage and if so have so they give some examples examples are Builders Realtors Community groups underrepresent resentative constituents business associations and I think we've we've interacted with them and students that's just you're invol in any local local events like cranberry day well this is our inaugural cranberry day right um um I think um maybe talk about the econom we could talk a little bit about our Economic Development Group right because I feel like those two historic preservation and economic development are sometimes um adversary and other municipalities and I think that um so far we've had a pretty good relationship and um and I think that you know we find good common ground with those two efforts um for a while there we were kind of attending each other's meetings and the group the group got disbanded but now it's getting Reb re rebed rebed yeah okay yeah so we'll probably we may reconnect with them okay I mean I think it's good I me because you think too about how we work with the business owners with the signage stuff right um yeah um I know we had talked in the past about Realtors and making them aware of um you know the the designation of a property and things like that okay you would know would Bey wary okay um and we had also talked I had mentioned when I first started this endeavor about students so um we had shro here um but uh I had mention that some of the commissions have a like student chair like membership um uh and I don't know how we would go about fulfilling that you know making that happen but that you work with local Scout groups or something I need to support their projects yeah you could mention how we we spoke with the Boy Scouts about historic preservation that would be something okay turn I'm thank you I'm just wondering are we allowed to have ex officio members like could we work with the school or the high or Princeton High for a student from Cranbury that might be interested in historic preservation and have them join the commission but in a non- voting ex officio way that's exactly someone in mind no I don't have anybody in mind but if you want me to reach out to the Princeton High School I think it better as a high school student right and just yeah see if somebody that they know might be interested okay I'll do that I think I think it's nice because I remember you know shro was he he joined at a busy time for him because he was getting ready to graduate but even the few meetings he attended he was he brought up new like fresh ideas which was really good um and so I think it's nice um to have that opportunity and it's nice to be able to give them that um exposure to something like this so okay Beyond focused engagement programs or initiatives what can your HBC do on a daytoday basis to Foster Community engagement so I think the mayor's update is an obvious one because it's a regular thing um I I think I would put here here yeah I would put our um concept reviews because not everybody does that where it's an informal review what they can ask questions they're not bound by you know anything they've put into an application um so that's that's my vote um anything else we can do day today can you read a question one more time sure Beyond Beyond fol engagement programs or initiatives which was number one M what can your HPC do on a day-to-day basis to Foster Community engagement examples are websites social media technical assistance other so concept reviews kind of the technical yeah and I think our um our website has become more lively in the recent years even though it's challeng get changed but I would ask I would um and I'd be curious to know when you go to this like if you hear from other groups that they're doing like social media because um I know that's something that we are I think pretty sure we're forbidden from doing anything um through like a cranberry social media um there I don't think that exists like a cranberry mayor's social media um but it would be a great way to get updates you know know forward and share information um so be curious know if other towns are figured out how to do it in a nice way I don't think so from at least the two that I spoke with so I'll see what the broader audience has to has to share because I know we we have to tread carefully but definitely okay two more what steps can be taken to cultivate HP see membership and participation oh for me I had the greatest sense of what this commission does based on the YouTube streams so I think that was instrumental in at least gaining my awareness I know I I signed up because I received an email that had said there was an opening in the committee um and I it was at a point in time when I had a little interest in getting involved in something like that so that was helpful to know I think also let the Historic Society Know M got people there how did you join guy I uh I think the mayor's uh newsletter whatever one out and that they were looking for volunteers on various committees and they listed this one as one that they were looking and I thought that would be pretty interesting to do so that's where I first found out about it yeah my brother-in-law was on the commission he was looking to get off the [Laughter] commission so he recommended me and I was willing so thanks bro how about you Bobby what's your story I probably not my brother-in-law but one of my neighbors joh SW anybody remembers it he across the street from me and in asked me I was interested he wasn't just similar personal connection yeah yeah it seems like that's like probably the best way it's just like finding a job it's always about you know who you know you're hearing about it but then that sounds like those mayor's emails that to go out and say we need someone is what really like hits people at the right time yeah but we're five months in with with an empty chair but I don't think I've seen an email actually that said that have have there been emails that have said they need people like the mayor's update has it said I haven't seen any have have you seen any maybe we should follow up on that puppy yeah I just read like this afternoon like the latest one I didn't see actually any mentions of openings because um you had mentioned that Robin had sent out those two uh volunteer applications but that we were like second choice for both of them oh yeah those people were not yeah they were they were interested in other committees right yeah right and those other committees had openings as well so well maybe what I'll do is let let's bump the communication on the signage and let's get this it sounds seems to me like maybe this is something we should get communicated out sooner versus later it's pretty easy to say we have an opening please apply join us yeah all right well I'm not sure you want to bump the signage I mean it might be that they send out yeah or just do it one they send it every week that's fine yeah I send it every week yeah okay I will um I'll work on prioritizing this because it is something we haven't seen unless I've missed it you know I could have missed it yeah or is it just on the township website as opposed to going out to it's not get it out there what mayor okay so and what I write will may get edited but if we were to have full editorial control over what we say what is the best thing about being in this group that we want what type what what type of people you know are you a history buff and you want to join the historic preservation or is it something more to do you want to help preserve the charm the historic charm of our town I think that's very you think that's good okay preserve historic charm term and character and character okay perfect I'll use those words sounds good say Township since we're Cranberry Township Township Township okay I'll move on to number six uh last one what are your experiences with participating in the certified local government program and what recommendations do you have for the CLG curious so CLG gives us grants we like grants um it's given us some training which I think is valuable as well um and uh I I think especially in this situation so I was in a previous historic commission and we we had a secretary so like Robin is our secretary but this person was like this was our staff person who um I'm sorry they were a hired consultant and so they were a an architect or a historic preservationist that like went they went through like you know RFP was sent out and they were hired and um and so they would take our applications and review them for us and do a synopsis with recommendations and hand them to us and say based on X this is what I recommend to you we're like looking through it ourselves and we would you know agree or disagree with what they say and have conversations based on that but they would really guide us to intelligently think of um what uh you know how how to interpret the applications and respond is that a volunte position paid paid by the township and it's the other members of this um panel they also have paid it it's a pretty common thing and because I work in historic preservation I know a lot of the people who like sit they're like oh yeah I'm in you know Burlington City such such so um and so we're unique in that sense that we do not have that assistance um uh and so the CLG in my mind can like answer the questions that we would have occasion for particular projects like for example when we were we started out it's just an advisory committee and we wanted to become a reservation commission we we actually hired an attorney who was specialized in that we completely IGN that right something specific but I think the the CLG they may not answer all the questions that we have but I think they are a source for us that if we were not a certified local government we might kind of be floating you know Alone um so we I mean we don't have that many applications and that many complicated applications to need somebody like an attorney or or a land use or a historic preservationist to advise us on a regular bases so last we should probably be thankful for that maybe the last time I was at was was it was larger but it wasn't wasn't that much more complicated but I imagine you know if you're in like city of Newark right you certainly that professional assistance um so those are my thoughts about certified local government I don't think there are any negatives that I can think of of being a CLG it sounds like it's quite a process to become one um and you know I think that was 2009 or something when that happened so I think um you know they want to give incentive to have all the commissions you know try to join the certified local government um nice all right that's it thank you very much well that was fun because it was nice little brainstorming too for us thank you for bringing those questions um okay great so um last we have a new homeowner letters yes so I did send a letter to that 21 Maplewood Avenue on May 14th okay and just rewind the Historical Society did ask for someone to do an article for the interactive map just to remind you not sure if anyone wanted to volunteer I sent you and Susan the email they want us to do for their newsletter yes oh yes and they were looking for a volunteer a volunteer to write the article about it it's du by July 31st she said 165 um I sent that one yeah I mentioned last meeting I sent that one for that yes um so Brandon I mean I it's your baby do you have bandwidth to write a little blurb I have a I could send you a copy of what the newsletter looks like yeah that take do by July 31st yeah I honestly think it you would be the best person to do it because it's much easier to write about your own Pro like for me writing the signs I did that like in 2 minutes whereas like I know if it was someone else they'd be like you know how do we go about writing it you know um but if you don't have bandwidth we can ask someone else in the committee yes that send me I'll I'll show you a newsletter yeah okay all right okay perfect um great okay so lastly we have the minutes from April 16th Dave is not here to make comments so the counting on anyone do we need to table it until Dave comes back I did not have any comments or changes okay all right perfect so what do we need to I'll make a motion to accept the minutes I'll second okay great for the April 16th 2024 minutes with amendments Miss sum yes Miss Ryan yes Mr Guyer yes Mr H yes and Miss Marlo yes thank you motion passed great discussion um I just wanted to mention I saw I think when I was reading the mayor's update I don't know what's going with the mics but you might turn off your mic I'm sorry Jennifer they're just getting worse and worse um okay really thank you Susan sorry go and so um I read in the mayor's update that there is a presentation Thursday at the library so I thought I'd mention it because it's kind of topical it's about cemeteries and I thought it was kind of interesting um it looks like I believe the authors who are presenting are part of the middle sex County um historic preservation office and um it sounded interesting talking kind of about patterns and histories of cemeteries and you know learning how to read them I think so thought I mentioned it Thursday at 6:30 I think at this point we'll open it up for public comments and we'll close it for public comment um and so next we make a motion to adjourn motion yeah motion to adjourn okay great in favor say hi hi you