Robin statement sure statement of adequate notice under the Sunshine Law adequate notice in accordance with the open public meeting Act was provided on January 18th 2024 of this meeting's date time and location the agenda was mailed to the cranber press in Trenton Times posted on the township bulls and board mail to those requesting personal notice and file with the municipal clerk roll call Miss Anderson here miss alwi here fonte here Mr Giddings advis us he was not attending Miss Jones here Mr mil M advis us he was not attending Mr Stewart here Mr Whitman advis us he was not attending and Miss Bond here thank you we have a forum chair for sort of a business we'd like to approve the minutes from February 1st 2024 for all those eligible any comments any changes no we'll do that when we're um yeah I think that's a cleaner way to do that can I have a motion to approve second thanks Mike you all right roll call for approval of the February 1st 2024 minutes Miss Anderson Miss elwi yes Mr fante yes Miss Jones yes and Miss Bon yes thank you motion passed next item on the agenda PB 312- forber comments the resolution um all those that are eligible any comments Corrections or changes to the resolution good can I have a motion to approve I'll move second I'll second thank you roll call Miss Anderson yes Miss albadawi yes Mr fante yes Miss Jones yes and Miss Bon excellent yes thank you motion passed thank you next on the agenda consistency review Cranberry Township ordinance number 02244 an ordinance of the township of cranberry amending and supplementing the site plan and subdivision standards contained in Article 5 of chapter 150 entitled Land Development ordinance of cranbery Township of the code the township of cranberry relating to section 1561 storm water management happy to give some context for this if that's helpful actually we're going to let Sharon give very specific context to this as well rehearse but but you're you're welcome to but um we'll have Sharon give us a a um a statement all right there was a inconsistency found in the ordinance regarding um Redevelopment term of Redevelopment and calculating uh Co coefficients and groundwater um recharge so um the portion of the ordinance that's going to be amended is going to um take out the reference to um looking at existing conditions um as they were for a period of at least five years um without interruption so um the suggestion was that the ordinance be amended to remove the language which allows an exemption exception for for hydrologic conditions which have existed for at least 5 years without interruption and just to require that all preconstruction Sites be presumed to be in good hydrologic condition Mr fronte you were able to work on this with the zoning committee yeah exactly so um basically since our last meeting we um convene we identified members for a zoning committee um to work on this which was myself Miss span um advised by Sharon and member of the zoning board Mr Rob diamond and a member of the environmental commission Mr John cting so we got those people I volunteered on told volunteered and um they uh we got that approved at the 1 February Township committee meeting the the committee met reviewed this and approved this majority approved this proposed wording tonight thank you and we did first reading at the first the 2nd February Township committee meeting So the plan is this is consist rev you as the between session and the approval second reading and Adoption of this would be at Monday's Township committee meeting thank you and the uh purpose of the board reviewing this is to find that this ordinance is consistent with its master plan and we just provide a summary to the governing body if you find that it is consistent with the master plan and I think the wording is a little squirrly I think it is we are to find that it is not inconsistent with the master plan yes yep all right and how do we proceed just just take a make a motion okay second and a vote all right do I have a motion I'm happy to move as as chair of the subcommittee that we approve the that this is not inconsistent with the master plan thank you Mike I have a second second all right roll call Miss Anderson yes Miss elwi yes Mr fante yes Miss Jones yes Mr Stewart yes and Miss Bond yes thank you motion passed now having that housekeeping out of the way um we might get a little fatigued at the end of the night so I wanted to get that front loaded so we we have that uh done um our next um application is PB 312 whoop PB 378-2355 Acre Road uh and cranberry metal pampus uh block eight Lots 1.02 and 1.03 in the light industrial Zone all right so we're gonna have to swear in um professionals and before you do that yes um the uh notices were reviewed um at the last meeting and they all found to be uh in compliance with the uh notice Provisions so we have jurisdiction and that they were not required to notice again for this meeting they could carry it from the January 11th meeting so all is in order for that and um as far as swearing everyone in you're you know can have everybody sworn in at the same time including our board's professionals so if you want to raise your right hand um do you swear that the testimony that you are about to give before this board is the truth whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you God do okay thank you [Music] okay thank you madam chairwoman members of the planning board and professionals thank you for having us here tonight my name is Steve Millen I'm attorney at greenbound Rose Smith and Davis here representing the applicant Ary Associates LLC for the property identified as block eight Lots 1.02 and 1.03 at 326 and 322 Halfacre Road here for preliminary and final site plan approval with some both variances we do have five witnesses tonight uh we're going to start with the applicant representative Mr David Young Who will sit here to my right um and give an overview of why they're here who they are who he is uh and give a little context to the application you're G to hear this evening so Mr Young has been sworn in um pass the microphone to him and ask for him to introduce himself to the board well thank you Steve my name is David Young I'm the president of A&M industrial I don't know who's more nervous tonight me or President Biden we both have import important thing to accomplish but thank you for taking the time tonight to evaluate our our plan um A&M is a is a family business that my dad started back in 1954 he opened up he came out of the Marines after the Korean War and he opened up a small hardware store in Newark New Jersey and uh this year in June will be our 70th year in business so I worked with my dad um believe it or not in in June also I will be at A&M for 40 years so it's hard for me to say that you know it's uh it's like you look back on on your life and uh and it's a whirlwind it goes so quickly but um over that course of time the business has uh has grown and I'm really excited that a couple of years ago my son Josh who's right here joined the family business as well so we made it to we're one of the few companies that make it to a third generation um we sell all types sell and service all types of industrial equipment if uh if any of you guys are familiar with a Granger uh or fenol um some publicly traded companies in our in our space those would be our our national type competitors um we sell things like uh hose assemblies and pipe Valves and fittings and cutting tools and abrasives a lot of safety and personal protective equipment and we sell that to other businesses mostly um in uh essential Services um utilities uh Power Generation companies Transportation companies and then all different types of Manufacturers New Jersey um the manufacturing base is very important to us so uh companies that make medical device um food processing pharmaceutical flavors and fragrances cosmetics those are all the types of customers that uh that we have we have about a hundred Associates in the company today um spread out in four or five different locations in in New Jersey and now we're in some surrounding states we have branch locations up in New England and Pennsylvania um and uh if if I do look familiar um to any of you it's because I I was here once before we uh we purchased uh the uh the properties that uh that we have in Cranberry uh about 10 years ago um we purchased the 322 building which we occupy half of and uh and then a few years later we purchased the church and Dwight um R&D facility that that we're going to talk about tonight and at uh at that point we were going to just do some Renovations in that building um and I think it was a a minor site uh revision plan so um so I did come here and and you know and and we presented a plan which you approve for us to do renovations to that building um you know in in hindsight over the years especially you know getting through the pandemic um our needs as a company changed and um and we decided that renovating that building you know just to make office space wasn't a good use for for our company and and the way you know we have grown over the years uh and a multi-use building would be a lot more functional for the future the next generation of uh of our company so um so what we've designed you know that we're going to present tonight is a building that would house our uh headquarters so it looks a little nicer than a typical Warehouse type of uh of building uh right now our headquarters is in raway New Jersey um and we would look to bring corporate staff which is about 20 people um down to operate here um we would use the balance of the building for uh for warehousing for the inventories that we keep uh and then a portion of the building probably about uh the the total footprint I believe is around 80 or 85,000 square feet uh and um and we would look to lease uh about 30,000 square F feet to a tenant we have't identified who that is um but uh but I can only speak at this point you know to the 50 or 55,000 or so square feet that A&M would would occupy in terms of uh operations we basically operate you know on an 8 to5 Monday to Friday uh schedule um again we um you know over the course of uh of the pandemic we had a lot more office people that that are now working remote uh and I think even a beautiful building that I may build them is not going to encourage them to uh to come back I haven't quite figured out what the formula is to get people back into the office um you have to talk to your son about that yeah yeah it's a it's a tough one but um but so we'll probably have again as I as I mentioned about 20 to 25 uh people in the office and uh and then we also have about 20 or so people that uh that are are operating in our in our distribution Center um so that would be the total scope for uh for us um in terms of uh recycling I think that was one of the things that uh that um you want to I'm just gonna stop you for one second so operating the uh Warehouse 247 or is that operating 8 to5 8 to five yeah okay sorry yeah okay because um our biggest clients are um Power companies psng and Con Edison so we do have to be on call 247 if there's a storm or a major power outage we have a lot of the materials that they would need you know to function in in those types of emergencies um but but again that would be by exception thank you yeah could I just ask this is like a housekeeping question I don't want to throw you off in your testimony there but so what's the relationship to the um because in the application it says the applicants Ary Associates l LC and you just said you're a oh yes I I should have explained that thank you for the question yes so um so my dad's name was Arie Arie young and uh and he founded A&M um and our family the young family owns the commercial real estate so um so one one building that we own is um that we're going to talk about tonight is is Arie Associates which is the real estate entity okay um and then the adjacent building that we also own is ADM realy right so those are are both just family entities that they're their ownership they own the property yes but who what's A&M industrial then and A&M industrial is is the our family doing business as number name or something DBA doing no no A&M industrial is is just the name is the tenant okay yes the tenant that's yeahor okay um so so in terms of uh recycling um we we do recycle uh quite a bit of cardboard um and and we would do that uh we have a compactor inside the building that uh that we would use for that purpose and we do report I think to uh to Cranberry right now um the uh the data on the cardboard that we recycle um per your request um and the rest of the recycling would pretty much be just office uh related you know glass bottles I guess and and plastic and we'll do that inside as well and and bring that out you know to a company that uh that would take it anybody have any general questions for me or well David you did such a thorough job I don't have any questions left to ask you so what was the m the m so he had a partner Mike um so it was Arie and Mike and the reason why they picked that name was so that they would be first in the Yellow Pages which which obviously were very relevant back in the 1950s um he since bought out uh Mike over the years so the you know the real estate is owned by the young family and uh and the company is is owned 100% by by myself excellent um it's very nice to uh have a family business uh before us and and we're very excited that you're going to make cranberry your headquarters uh and your home so um we're ready to proceed with the application good thank you thank you all very much you're welcome okay we'll Now call the project civil engineer James Henry from Dynamic and I will ask him to provide the board benefit of his qualifications sure um I have a bachelor's of Science and civil engineering from Rucker University with the minor in public planning I also have Masters have a masters of Science and civil engineering from bucker University with a focus in hydrology um I've been I'm a licensed engineer in New Jersey Pennsylvania as well as New York uh I am also a licensed professional planner and I passed that via test I'm a senior principal at Dynamic engineering I've been employed there for over 18 years uh and I've testified as an expert in front of over a 100 municipalities for industrial commercial as well as residential your license is in good standing yes I'll present Mr Young Mr Henry as an expert in civil engineering we accept Mr Henry's qualifications thank you very much why don't you um explain to the board what you were asked to do and prepare in relation to this application sure I'm I'm just gonna Mark a couple of exhibits if we want to do that right now I don't know what the process is A1 first one yeah why don't you uh list them A1 and tell me you know the name of them date if they're a map I'll bring them up and Jim if you're going to speak from there just I was asked to just use that microphone and there's a button on the bottom to turn it on [Music] are fairly big here uh so the first so our first exhibit uh which will be A1 is just an aerial map exhibit it's very similar to sheet two of the plan set that you have it's just an exhibit showing the aerial of the property um where North is facing the top of the sheet and the property is indicated in yellow in the center of the page and then there's a dotted Ang um where there's a dotted line that outlines the property showing the 200 foot Property Owners list and then it just shows the adjacent roadways as well as the municipal boundary which is just adjacent to our site with to Cranberry and to rro the most recent date on that one is just for the record sure that one is 37 2024 okay thank you and then um we also have a copy of the survey which I'm going to be utilizing I believe that was submitted so that doesn't need to be marked correct okay that's fine I'm good with that so A2 is the boundary and topographic survey wased by Dynamic survey LLC and that is dated uh August 31st 2020 last Revis uh February 3rd 20121 so that'll be A2 then A3 is just a colorized version of the uh site plan uh rendering that was submitted to the board with the landscape plan overlaid over the top and then colorized and that's the overall site plan rendering dated March 7 2024 and that'll be A3 and there's also reduced copies which should pass did you say March 7 March 7 today today yeah and then the last exhibit it's just an existing site photo exhibit um and that's prepared by Dynamic engineering and the source of these images are from Google and that's dated September these pictures are from September 2023 so that'll be A4 and I believe there's also this Jim you said September that say July did I say yeah July 2023 right July we not September sorry I said September I apologize so we're just going to go back to the aerial exhibit A1 so the uh the property in question is block block 8 block 102 which is on the left hand side of the page and then there's a second lot block 8 lot 1.03 so there's two properties involved there's a dark line outlining the outside of the overall property as well as a dash line which outlines the 200 foot property owner uh 200 foot list or 200 foot setback off of the property line uh for the purposes of discussion North will be the top of the sheet and then West will be uh towards the New Jersey Turnpike so New Jersey Turnpike it's it's kind of an odd situation because New Jersey Turnpike is adjacent to the site whereas there's really no driveways on New Jersey Turnpike uh the access is provided by gav drive and there's also interior access out to Cranberry Halfacre Road uh through an internal driveway within the overall Industrial Development um the site is exist it's part of an existing Industrial Park it's zoned the LI Zone uh basically surrounding the property are Industrial uses and then there's uh a buffer area and then there's Monroe Township uh just off to the east just so everyone kind of gets understanding what the proper is now I'm going to be referring to A2 which is a [Music] survey so lot 1.02 again that's on the the westle side side uh is approximately 7 Acres lot 1.03 is approximately 14 acres uh overall the overall property is 21 Acres um existing uses Light indust Industry um warehousing with some offices within the existing Warehouse there's also an existing billboard along the turnpike located at the South Westerly corner of the site uh all these are permitted uses as far as lot 102 which is the Westerly driveway uh there's approximately a there's there's an existing Warehouse there approximately 35,000 square feet uh in area which is proposed to be removed um the existing setbacks from that existing um Warehouse are compliant with your zoning requirements there's a number there's two parking areas there's there's one area which is along New Jersey Turnpike which is similar to where we're proposing our our arcing under their proposed conditions and then there's a shared truck Court between lot 102 and U lot 103 which is going to be continue to be shared under the the future conditions there is also a wetland area which we did obtain an Loi on on the south side of the property uh basically just south of both of the the properties so we obtained an Loi which is a certification from the DP certifying where the wetlands line is and they've confirmed that what we've delineated is accurate uh from an access standpoint there's really two access points uh one as I mentioned at the along the E le property line and the other access point is you know the northwest ofly corner which then circulates through the uh overall Industrial Park believe there is um restriction as far as trucks all the trucks are supposed to be used in the northwesterly corner and I believe your traffic engineer indicated the review letter uh to add some appropriate signage and make sure that all the trucks are going to be using uh the northwesterly corner access point lot 103 is a little bit larger of a building uh that's approximately 159,000 square feet 99,9 square feet um and that comprises of approximately 5,000 squ feet of office I believe that was a comment from your board's professionals as far as indicating how much office was actually in that building uh so there is approximately 5,000 square F feet per our client um and we'll get into the the parking requirements for that use or for that building in a little bit um and again the access access points are very similar for that that building uh you can access the Northwest Le corner or then also access U the traffic signal for the passenger cars from a Tober graphic standpoint uh there were a few comments regarding the overall topography the topography kind of dropped down a little bit as you get towards the Wetland areas now this is a little bit unique because we're sharing a truck cord with the adjacent Warehouse so we're kind of dictated with the grading wise as far as that elevation this isn't like a brand new slate where we can determine whatever elevation we want to want to do we have to make sure that since this building is remaining there's proper drainage and also uh proper circulation from the existing truck Bo under the existing conditions and the proposed conditions so there is also one other thing to note on this there's also an existing wet Basin on the northwesterly corner of the site um as I get through the exhibits you'll see along the turnpike there's actually even though there is a billboard here the billboard is almost not visible it's it's very difficult to be Vis it's very difficult to see there's a very thick vegetation along the turnpike which makes the building hard to see and kind of buffers the whole overall industrial use from the turn does anyone have any questions about is existing conditions I do have a question is the um exhibit that you put up that's as of March 7th is that different than the uh one that was submitted with the plans that's from is that May 23 there's a a sheet to aerial map is that there is no real difference other than we just call it the aerial exhibit and just make it just blew it up today for the meeting okay all right thanks we on we printed on a more high res photo paper so it looks a little bit nicer just repeat what you said about the wetlands you said that we obtained I didn't hear what you said sure So we obtained a letter of interpretation from the DP and what that is it's a certification from the D certifying that this is the limit of the wetlands and we're not you know so we so that we know how close we can get the wetlands and and still meet the DP regulations I'll move on to the proposed development now and this is referring to A3 so as I mentioned the overall scope U is to demolish the building located on lot 1.02 and proposed uh A&M's headquarters on uh 1.02 uh that the construction of that includes approximately 85,000 square foot uh footprint where 81,000 would be Warehouse uh 3,000 approximately would be office space with 9,000 being second Second Story office space so overall including the overall GFA will be approximately 9 942 187 square feet because there is going to be a two story element where there's an office um the other items that are going to remain on the site we're going to remain the the existing Warehouse on lot 1.03 is to remain and then the billboard that's existing on site is also to remain one thing to note with the billboard the billboard does meet the conditional use PR the conditional criteria which is outline your ordinance so that is permitted and then the as far as from use perspective the use is really to be continued the use it's already out there there's just a modification to the size of the building and then modifications the parking and the loading areas uh surrounding the outside of the uh facility from a I'm sorry can you can you just repeat so what was the size of the the building that's being demolished 59,000 35 35,00 35,3 and and the proposed is 80 9,000 94,000 yeah 94 with the with the mezzanine for the office yes thank you the actual footprint is approximately 81,000 okay thank you and that's the building that you're going to lease out space right so it's going to be mostly occupied by A&M but there's going to be a portion I'm assuming we did the same thing with our building when we purchased it for for the engineering firm um we occupied most of it and I'm sure the idea is to have the ability to expand if they do get larger you know and rent out space in the inter I mean there's be a second office location somewhere addition office I'll let the architect get into the interior you don't mind uh so from bulk standpoint uh obviously there's requirements for the LI Zone uh we are compliant with all the bulk requirements so we're uh compliant with lot area lot width front yard setb back rear yard setback minimum side yard setback maximum impervious coverage um maximum building coverage maximum Building height and then FL air ratio so from a you know from a straight bulk analysis we're not you know overdeveloping this we're trying to develop within uh the me you know what's what's permitted by ordinance uh from a topography standpoint I think I'd mentioned there there is a little bit of a drop off so there is a little bit of fill that's going to be put where uh the southern side of the building is where it's going to be we're going to bring in fill I believe there was a comment from the engineer about where that fill is going to come from uh we did do some research as far as where it's likely to come from most likely we're based on our analysis it's going to come off of Cranberry Road you go down you hit 130 so it's not going to go on any private roads and it's going to use the cranberry driveway which I believe is an ordinance requirement not to use Municipal roads um so we're we anticipate that is likely going to be the the path of how how the fill is going to be brought onto the site from a parking perspective uh there is a waiver uh to put parking in the front yard as I mentioned earlier there is a parking area on the west side of the building under existing conditions and we're proposing that as well we're actually reducing the amount of parking that's out was out there previously um so that's going to be maintained the stall size is compliant with your ordinance requirement and then on lot 1.02 uh there's 67 spaces required when you include caling the office and the warehouse separately and we're proposing 73 spaces so we're compliant from a parking perspective unlock 1.03 when you consider the 5,000 foot of office there's approximately 51 total spaces required by ordinance and we're proposing 65 spaces uh which based on the the the usage now we find is appropriate uh for that building from an access standpoint really the AIS is going to remain very similar to what's out there today right now there's an existing parking area uh on the west side of the building which connects into kind of the Ring Road around the industrial center that that's going to remain the same so there's going to be a driveway at the Northwestern Corner which is going to be primarily for passenger cars there's going to be a shared truck Court in between the two buildings which is going to be for you know larger vehicles and trucks and then the loading zone for lot 1.03 is going to remain unchanged uh there was one comment I believe there's a waiver required for the size of the loading docks proposing because there's a um a loading zone requirement I think it's to have 15 ft wide whereas we're proposing 12 um we find it that 12 is adequate and you know pretty standard in the industry as far as the width of the loading dock so we are requesting a waiver for that from a trash enclosure perspective we are proposing uh two trash compactors on the site uh for each use there is uh trash compactor for the um future tenant which is the Northwestern corner and then there's another one for A&M uh as far as taking up two of those loading docks recycling will be handled inside the building there'll be a compactor for cardboard inside the building and then that'll be taken out one of the loading docks and then recycling will also be handled there's not much recycling generated by this type of use due to the size most of its Warehouse uh so that'll just be handled by you know a few garbage cans inside the building from a Wetlands perspective um we are we are staying out of the wetlands which is just to the south of the property there is a slight buffer averaging required in order to propose this building which is allowed by the DP and that permit is pending uh by the D that's a transitional area waiver which basically just allows you to take from one area and add and destrict a different area that's adjacent to the wetlands um so that's permitted by the D I can see where you're taking away where are you adding we're adding on the down by the billboard just south of the billboard can you just show where you're adding as well sure uh we're taking just south of the billboard or we're adding south of the billboard we're removing a small area just behind the building and then adding that small area just in front of the billboard so you're allowed when you have a 50ft buffer on a wetland you're allowed to reduce it down to 25 feet uh for a buffer and then you extend the buffer in other areas to 75 ft to basically mix and match and as long as the area increases as far as the buffer area that you're proposing the DP allows and that'll be blessed by the D by permitting correct we don't anticipate any issue uh from a storm water management perspective this site was fairly difficult because they you know we were obviously trying to balance not bringing in a ton of fill um we know we had spoken to the board professionals about not really changing the the grading too much on site uh we did have relatively high water table here so we we are proposing two bio retention or three bio retention basins in three different locations on the Southeast and it's they're smaller in nature where the DP is doing with the new rules with the nj7 colon8 they're trying to keep smaller bio retention basins and these are going to be landscaped basins so they're not going to be you know the those sand basins you see that are kind of ugly these are going be bio retention basins where they're going be landscaped with you lush land aping there a pretty elaborate landscape plan we're proposing so we have three different areas we're proposing fireo retention basins uh one is the Southeastern corner of the building the other one is just North of the building a lot on on the new new building and then the other is just on the southwest corner um and these are going to be visually Pleasant to look at and they're also going to help clean water and uh the bio retention basins do help meet the 80% TSS removal for the DP requirements they have an 80 80% TSS removal uh from a flow perspective uh we are significantly reducing flow even beyond what the DP requires um the total allowable Peak flow for the two-year is 4.0 CFS we're proposing 2.91 for the 10 year we're allowed to go up to 10.23 we're proposing 9.23 and for the 100 Year we're allowed to go up to 20.0 3 and we're proposing 18.9 for uh so there is a pretty significant impact by proposing all these different uh bio retention basins and one other thing that to note we didn't even model there's an existing wet Pond of the corner of the northwesterly corner which we didn't even consider as part of our design uh which was already designed as part of the overall uh industrial center so again we're probably we're likely taking water away from there and we're pushing it towards ours there'll be additional benefit to the uh neighboring properties could you explain sorry could you explain um how that benefits sure so right now the existing development most of that existing development sends their storm water man their storm order to that Basin and now under the proposed conditions they're going to be sending it to the the new basins so we're actually taking water away from that base that that existing wet Pond and surfacing it with other bases that are we're proposing through grading sorry through grading through grading and then yeah and then the water is after it's held back cleaned it's then discharged of the Wetland area to the south from a utility perspective utilities are going to remain very similar to what's out there today uh there's an existing sewer which Services the existing building and that sewer is from the industrial Aton that's located just up by the uh where the industrial driveway connects it to the Ring Road uh water actually comes off of near where the turnpike is uh one thing to note I know I spoke to the engineer earlier today about his review letter he told me that you've had a lot of discussions about hot boxes and we want to make sure that we are compliant with that uh we are going to propose a hot box and that'll be outside the front yard so we anticipate we will be compliant uh with your requirement as far as the utility setbacks uh for electric perspective we are going to continue we're going to connect to the electric which is again on the Ring Road we are proposing a Transformer at the northeastern corner of the new building and then one thing that wasn't on our plans uh which we' spoken to our our client about was adding a generator for the overall building so we are going to add a generator uh again near the north easterly corner and we will make sure that complies with the state noise requirements um and there's really no residential in the area to be concerned about and I think it'll be a good benefit to the overall use gas is very similar the gas line uh runs just south of the existing Warehouse building and that will Connect into the existing building very similar to what it does today uh there was a comment just in general regarding Community impact uh you know I did review this with our planner and overall we don't think there's much impact in community we think it's really overall a benefit uh we don't anticipate much impact to police we don't anticipate this to be really something that drives a lot of uh police activity uh there's minimal impact to the fire department the building is going to be sprinklered so there's really going to be minimal impact to the fire department really no impact to schools we're not proposing any sort of residential uh positive impacts at tax basis and really our traffic engineer will get into any impacts from a traffic perspective but we're not anticipating any really significant impacts any of the municipal Services uh based on this type of use there's one other thing to note um the community impact statement is required for uses that are over2 ,000 Square ft if you don't count that existing building that's on site we don't we don't meet that requirement to even provide a community impact saving but but I want to at least summarize that for the board so they did know the you know we don't anticipate any significant impacts uh for this use ask you a question sure uh just because I've heard of three different things at that Northeastern area on the map that you pointed you said a Transformer at the northeastern Corner yes a generator and isn't that also the location for one of the basins the retention basins so if if you can see on the reduced version there's a there's kind of a box that is the generator or sorry excuse me that's a Transformer the rectangular concrete area is the generator and then the Basin is this area which is the landscaped area just to the uh I guess to the west of that area so that that landscape Island that's over there is going to be fairly large heav Landscapes thank you for that clarification no problem sorry can I ask one more question yes and the three bio retention basins are all new and proposed as part of this design yes correct okay thank you uh just sking jumping to lighting uh we are adding some additional lighting uh really the goal of lighting an industrial facility like this is really to provide safe illumination for pedestrians safe illumination for the trucks and vular traffic uh we are cling 15 single uh mounted lights at approximately a mounting height of approximately 25 ft and that's going through the you know the new parking area in the back as well as uh through the truck circulation area uh we we will agree one of your engineers comments was as far we are proposing four building Mount of Lights as well two of them are on the bottom of the building your engineer asked that to be reduced down to one and I spoke to my client and they're agreeable to changing that uh one other suggestion by your engineer was possibly to add some additional Lighting near the intersection points uh near the top and Northerly side of the sheet to make sure that the intersections are properly illuminated and our client is also willing to add additional lights in that area if and work with your professional to do that those would all be conditions of approval from a landscaping perspective I kind of hinted in earlier there's a fairly significant amount of landscaping that we're adding here from a shade tree perspective we're adding 25 uh shade trees we're proposing 20 ornamental trees 11 evergreen trees 52 evergreen shrubs 352 deciduous shrubs 141 ground cover 68 perennials and 319 ornamental grasses uh in total we're adding 988 different variations of plants or trees which I think is a significant improvement over what's there today um and we're maintaining a good amount of that existing buffer as I mentioned along the turnpike um we do require a waiver however because your ordinance does require 10% of the parking area to be landscaped however what we did was we pre preserved the existing Landscaping on the perimeter so if if you do consider the perimeter landscaping and the bio retention basins I think we compensated for that minor minor uh waiver by adding Landscaping in those areas can I clarify for housekeeping is your number a net ad or a total ad but I mean because your building is bigger so presumably some Landscaping is getting disrupted for the building I just want to clarify whether that's the net additional inclusive of what is removed or just the additional so the 4% is we're Landscaping 4% of our our parking areas which is just 4% of the parking areas is is landscape your ordinance requires tenders yeah I was going back even to just the number you quoted of all the additional and then and as far as the number of trees I I don't I don't think I have a number on the number of trees are actually being removed as part of this application um so I don't have like I don't know if I can so your number isn't net it's just additional additional right but the the net might be a smaller number taking into account what was removed correct yes and I believe I believe there was a comment I think from your engineer or maybe your planner um about the number of trees that are required and I think based on that I think only 20 trees are required based on your tree removal ordinance and I I think i' mentioned we're proposing 20 ornamental plus 25 shade trees we're prop proposing in excess of what's required by the ordinance on that um do you happen to know how many mature trees you're removing I don't off the top my I can try and take a look at the survey if you want during the break and see if there's any uh you know I could try and find that information for you sorry that inspired in followup yeah is there has there been any consideration about whether the mature trees could be re relocated or if they're just going to be destroyed let me just show you ex so I'm G to skip over to A2 for this question just so I can talk to you through that area that area we're discussing where the building is being expanded really isn't heavily it's not a heavily wooded area so I you can see on the survey that area is mostly mostly grass right now um it's not like we're cutting down a ton of woods in order to expand this so you can see it on the on the aerial as well on A1 um you can see that so A2 has captured all the trees that are currently there near yes okay yes and you can see on A1 the area just south of the existing industrial it's it's it's really a large grass area not not a wooded area lost my spot [Music] here now as far as easements between the two properties there are going to be a number of easements uh again referring to A3 there are going to be a number of easements from a utility there's be a drainage basin easement between the two properties and then a cross access easement between the properties uh in order to make sure that you know the trucks are going to be sharing a truck court and everything moves smoothly under the proposed situation from Outside Agency standpoint we have are existing or will be there are existing easements I think there's um I might not be the best person to talk about it but there's an existing overall kind of mass Master Services agreement for the overall Industrial Park as far as easements maintenance of the Ring Road that sort of thing but then in addition to that we are proposing easements between the two properties because they're going to be sharing a truck boort under the future conditions uh so there is going to be an easement regarding that and then there's some utilities which run through each of the properties so that easement is also we're going to send that to your engineer to review to make sure all the utilities are covered between the two different properties good thank you there's a declaration recorded for an Owner's Association among all the properties that contains numerous cross easements that's on record I I think during the TRC Sharon and I discussed that but you will be doing a couple more and there'll be more and it'll of course be subject to to the board professionals review thank you so we're an outside agency review uh we did submit to the county uh we received a final approval letter uh we have a pending STD approval from the utility perspective uh we do have a number of P pending applications as well for electric order and Sewer from a drcc we have met with them several times and we I believe we' we've addressed their comments uh but we're going to be submitting back to them and we anticipate approval fairly soon uh and then as I mentioned we have the LOI which is the wetlands we pending transition area waiver permit which is pending and then just be 100% confident that this site is not any sort of flood zone and there's no streams nearby we also submitted to the the flood uh Department at the DP and we submitted applicability determination to confirm there's no streams or no stream buffers near this this use and they confirmed the writing and we can provide the board a copy of that where there's no streams or any stream buffers Associated uh near the wetlands or anywhere near this this development so um overall I think when you look at this I think our architect has a 3D running of what this will look like I think this is really a significant Improvement um one other thing I just want to show before I go uh we provide we prepared A4 is just um exhibit showing the visibility from the turnpike and speaking to your engineer today he had mentioned that the board is very concerned about properly buffering these type of uses from the turnpike uh you can see the building there there's a number of trees there is a pretty thick buffer uh that yellow sign in the center is really the only thing you can see there's a number of trees as you start looking back towards the existing use so um overall I think the site is already fairly well screened from the existing trees that are kind of located along the thermik which we're not touching so what is the height difference few times what is the height difference between the old building and the new proposed um saying it's relative to visibility sure the yeah it's so it's 28 and propose is 40 it's a little bit higher but I wouldn't call it significantly higher it's not like a we we've done a number of like Refrigeration warehouses which are very tall the that's not this case this is a fairly standard warehouse from a high perspective before you go can I ask you a question also um you mentioned earlier that there's a a reduction in parking spaces from what it is from what it is right now to what you're proposing where where is that being reduced sure where are those spaces being put [Music] into does one of your drawing drawings have an overlay of the of the current and the proposed on top of each other we don't have that unfor unfortunately we don't have that on any of the exhibits um but I I can kind of pan between the two different exhibits the exhibit and uh it's like a between A1 and A3 so you can see A1 the warehouse building itself is fairly small and there's a fairly large parking area it's almost like two rows of parking adjacent to it on the West Side so that parking area that's closest to the turnpike is approximately where we're proposing our parking area so we're really just kind of squaring off that that first row of parking and then just bringing it down a little bit further than what's what's there today so it's really it's sort of taking over that one row parking it's coming down a little bit and then it sounds like it's filling in that other corner of that top right okay so it's sort of making a larger rectangle in in three directions is that fair exactly so we're you know I would say you know my estimate would be you know 20 or 10 to 20% is probably over existing impervious areas we're reducing reducing that parking things to mention we did submit to your engineer we are not creating new motor vehicle surfaces so that's one of the things that's um you know from a storm water management perspective is is concerning to the D so we're not considering more motor vehicle services more motor vehicle areas which uh creates the need to clean the water more uh so even though we're proposing these three basins on site we technically don't need to provide any kind of cleaning for the for the water at all because we're not increasing the motor vehicle services so do you know the net impervious increase from from this I do I'm I'm just trying to get a magnitude because it sounds like the magnitude of the building size is about 50,000 feet more right but then it's taking over some of what was a parking lot I'm just trying to get a sense of it's hard without seeing them on top of each other sort of what we're so lot 1.02 is going from approximately 27% to 43% and then there's not much change on lot 1.03 it goes 54 to 55% to be clear that's impervious not building coverage right correct yes so it's going from 27 to 43 27 to 43 55 is allowed by ordinance okay mad chairperson could I make just a couple of comments I have an 18 Page Letter thank you because the engineer I think is GNA finish and when on um I do think now would be a good time for you to do that so yes yeah just a just a couple things that come from the um from his testimony and and he did talk about a lot of things in the letter that I did that's 18 pages long and we did have a conversation this afternoon but I'm not going to talk about that per se um one of the things about the Phil is that they have to raise uh the ground up to put this building there there so the truck courts are even next to each other from building to building and he he talked about that but there is going to be about 800 trucks by my calculation coming into the site to bring Phil in so it's going to be I asked him for a truck um uh uh staging plan so we know where you know how the Phil is going to come in that gets submitted to Tom Decker he knows how to handle it and there's no no damage to any of our roads because that's often the case you know if it goes on a County Road or a state road well we care less but if we if it's on a Township Road I would put something in the resolution that that they have to repair it and that's something that Mr Decker will have to deal with that's one thing U one by one so yeah that just referring to A1 uh we have no problem showing that as as a condition of approval showing just kind so just showing that we'll show a truck circulation exhibit just showing how the trucks will get get to the site and we'll for the fil for the fil and we'll and we'll provide it to our contractors to make sure they use that that access we uh but again we're coming from Route 130 is is off the screen but it's down this way and basically we could be coming from the the West Long cranberry Halfacre road then enter in the driveway come through here and then get to the site so we don't anticipate using any sort of Municipal roads uh and we can provide you with a a plan showing that and we'll provide it to our contractors when you're saying that route that passes through sorry that route passes through uh parking areas um for the warehouses it might be better to bring them up to gavit and come in the other way uh because that section of Road isn't supposed to have trucks and I I have some aerial pictures that show they actually Park on that road at times so you don't necessarily want to be driving trucks in that area right now there's signage that you can't go that way from a warehouse but coming in as well with the uh trucks and the soil is probably not a good idea either should come through gavit and gav it has a um traffic signal as well so the Turning would both intersections have signals okay but I I would definitely prefer suggest that you use the gavit drive we can do it whichever way the board professionals prefer we're willing to do whatever both myself and and Andy Andrew will will comment on that um as it goes along uh next thing is that uh yes they are reducing the wetlands buffer they're not touching Wetlands they're reducing it from 50 to 25 feet transitionary buffer then they're adding it somewhere else which is perfectly Allowed by both our ordinance and the and the state D um I also asked and I think I have two more I asked for um uh to buffer that there's no generator on the plan now it's it's on the exhibit I believe yes but it's not on the plan so I asked them to site the generator uh on a future plan and Landscape around it I also asked that if if they need a hot box for the water that comes into the site uh that they buffer that because we have a section of ordinance that now requires certain things so they'll have to look at that part of the ordinance we agree to both of those um one kind of funny thing is that um I asked them to remove a light uh at the south end of the of the new building because all it's doing is it's lighting up the wetlands the only the only reason we had there's like a a walkway I don't know if you can see on the aerial there's like a there's a walkway that runs through that back area that's the only reason we had those lights back there was because there's a walkway that kind of connects I think it connects from here to this walkway through the wetlands yeah it actually goes through the wetlands that's is it concrete it's I think it's as actually as how about that okay and then um in terms terms of the drainage this the last thing I have but Dave was there would there be any concern for safety if it's a a walking pack what is the one like Anyway the rest of the walking path as it goes through the woods that it's pretty far out it's not that close Okay I mean I don't think there signif I don't think the two lights or the one light will make any difference on the path yeah it's not be huge difference done yeah okay and then just the last comment on on um the drainage storm water Etc um there is an existing storm water Bas he talked about it up in the north west the DP now wants all the applicants to put together smaller basins that are closer to where the water is being generated so so the the water is being generated in the parking areas they've located in three areas around those parking areas the site is wet underneath the groundwater is close they can't recharge the soils are no good for recharging so there's no there's no recharge happening on this site um and and they're okay the DP will be okay with that and our ordance will be okay with it because of the because there's an exemption for that type of thing if there's if there's poor soils um what does that mean there's no recharge recharge is normally as part of any new development the DP requires that you send water back down into the ground so if you're if you have impervious that's on the ground right water can't get in it's a parking lot it's it's a rooftop so what you're doing is you're sending it out to some stream somewhere or to a detention Basin and then to a stream in this case um the water the the the soils are more clay and therefore the the requirement uh to recharge water into the ground like it was over the last thousands of years uh doesn't work because it didn't recharge anyway because it was Clay so they're exempt from that they don't have to recharge which is sort of unusual condition some some areas in Cranberry are clay and some some are Sandy this one happens to be clay um this application uh is also taking advantage of uh the ordinance section uh where if the imperious has existed for the last five years um uh and longer uh they can use um uh the existing uh runoff coefficients rather than Good Woods as in the definition for redevelopment so you introduce the ordinance tonight these guys are benefiting from that section of the ordinance that has to you know that's contradictory there's a lot more items in my in my letter I just wanted to point those things out uh I'll stop now we appreciate this being more of a conversation than um presenting and it's helpful when you layer on uh when the engineer presents so that's that's very helpful I wanted to interrupt them but I didn't I once just once and there there were a lot of great comments in was letter and the ones I tried to kind of weave them in so it wasn't you know we have to go through all yes you didk all of them um and we're agreeable to to you know any any of the ones I didn't mention here we're agreeable to address and with respect to the hot box and the generator what we would ask if this were so inclined to Grant this application that the resolution incorporate what's shown on on the exhibit since it was at Rich it's not on the original plan so noted but overall I think you're going to see the architectural plans you're going to see you know a lot of 3DS of what the building looks like I think it's a really great addition for for a warehouse that really if you've been out there uh it doesn't really look great um and I think this is a great uh addition to your community especially have a familyowned business uh you know having a headquarter in community overall I think it's a good plan for the to as well as as well as our there no other questions for the engineer move on to the AR oh okay yeah no you go go ahead um just a couple of clarifying things I had written this in my letter and I know you brought it up and Dave brought it up but with regard to the screening of the utility boxes we in addition to setbacks in addition to Landscaping we also have requirements for painting um and and I know that reflective hot boxes have been an issue so there are some cranberry it's the only I know of that actually gives you the panone color that they prefer um but I want you to just we think that makes it easier yeah I know well it does it does but the other um a couple other items very quickly uh and this is another thing that is relatively new to the books has to do with the um storage indoor storage of deicing because that is something that is a concern particularly in areas where there are environmental you know wetlands and so forth that during the winter time and especially year round because sometimes people leave the mountains of deicing materials out year round and then that's something if you would be amable or actually are required to store them indoors and want it to make you all aware of that I'm G to turn we actually supply all of the all of it inside perfect what happens in in the entire complex of the couple of buildings is there a storage place for salt for use on the parking areas or not what happens in the winter did somebody just come in with salt and spread it I think the landscaper just comes in with salt when they need to I don't believe salt is St I don't remember seeing any Salt St outside in that whole complex it'll probably be a condition to dis approval that you won't have any stort salt so storage anywhere on site because it does wind up in outdoor storage outdoor outo insid okay the the third question um and perhaps you may not know but um do you know how long the billboard has been there and who is in charge of managing it or operating it I I don't know that answer um I know I went back a few a number of years and it's been there for a while I just don't know when it actually was constructed does it have a current I can look at my phone does it current advertisement on it um the advertisement on it believe it or not is still from church when they were OCC the site just turn it off from the bottom you didn't need a microphone my understand planning is the Billboard's been there for uh for a very long time uh when when it goes back to Carter Wallace uh prior to uh church and Dwight um and uh and church and Dwight did advertise their products on the billboard as a matter of fact it was a famous billboard because they had their condoms um listed on it so a lot of people knew about that now they have the last few years they've had um something about one of the Armen hammer Arm and Hammer cleaners okay so so it it is still we own the billboard you do okay yes and uh and we maintain that U but we never really changed the the signage okay so I guess my question is you know if somebody were to come in and say we want to advertise on your billboard would they contact you or do they contact no they they would contact uh us okay yes okay all right thank you um those are my only questions for right now thank you thank you this can I clarify one of the testimonies coming up is a PL is a um parking is that right or and traffic we have a traffic expert but no it doesn't matter what order I just wanted to know because I had a couple questions that would be applicable but if there wasn't testimony then I would ask them yes traffic if I could just one additional comment uh this application is not proposing any Trash areas or trash bins or or fenced in areas for crash dumpsters they're going to have two two um compactors on the outside of the building and in my conversations with them uh all of the recycling including cardboard and bottles and Plastics will be uh and styrofoam I suppose will be in the inside the building in storage that's correct what about regular non-recyclable trash there's a compact which will be in the actual loading spaces how will that be removed from the Tak out by trash truck which will which will take the trash out of the out of the compactor but with the compactor it helps compress it so you don't have to as much because it's not as much volume that's smart I'm just trying to figure out if there's a holding area for that we're just trying to until they show with yeah it's pretty large it's it's probably like you probably half the size of this room with W it's fair oh we're good okay sorry okay Andrew just one point I'll wait till the traffic and parking testimony comes but just one point about the generators you're putting in I saw you have pads there there's also an existing bus shelter in that area is that going to be removed or is that going to be reused uh and are these pads uh anywhere close to um where that bus shelter is I know that's all up in that corner yeah I think we're calling we're calling for it to be REM we were I don't think it's a bu sheld I think it's a smoking uh maybe a smoking shelter smoking shelter so we we were going to keep it um I me I don't have a strong feeling about it one way or the other but it was already there so we were we were going to probably keep it okay and just make sure that it meets whatever requirements for access to that shelter um and you have the generators there make sure they can walk around have proper paths sidewalk whatever is necessary any other questions for the engineer Sharon did you have anything no well I I did have a question was is there any kind of monitoring Wells on the site on 102 I believe there are monitoring Wells but there's no um act based on I I reviewed a letter prepared by the lsrp of record for the property okay my understanding is there isn't any active remediation it's just monitoring Wells as far as are they on lot 102 or 103 I I just didn't see them marked on the plans there was a symbol for them but I didn't see the actual so I I do a lot of gas stations as well uh typically you hire the lsrp when you're doing like this to relocate them and they just refile it with the DP as far as a new monitoring location so it's not it's not shown in the pl probably because they're going to be removed and kind of relocated and our client will hire our Fe at at the time to make sure we meet the requirements okay all right thanks what would I what would you say if I asked you to have the wells removed as part of this application if they are no longer in use it could affect groundwater and the fact that if storm water with oils Etc wind up in one of these Wells uh you could wind up with pollution in the ground are you asking if the wells are not under active monitoring yeah under active monitoring it' be a good idea to at least techologically remove it under active monitoring I don't think the lsrp would even need to yeah I I think they they are currently under active monitoring church and Dwight is responsible for the um ongoing monitoring of the water so I think twice a year they are checked um and I I don't know how much longer that is because the um whatever groundwater contamination there was you know is being alleviated naturally over time um but but we do get a report every six months that uh then I withdraw my question Dave rarely withdraws so we should take that and uh I think that's your sign to go away all right thank you very much thank you we'll Now call the project architecton uh just one second are are you the author of the reports did you are you the one that wrote the reports and then we've got a traffic report depends what report you're talking about but Pro most of them are mine okay uh but there are a few that are not mine okay so depends on what's your question on any particular report good job oh that's in that case they're all yours right [Music] okay oh lovely thank you Robin thank [Music] you all right so sitting to my right is Project architect Ben Horton who I'm going to ask to provide the board with his education qualifications yes my name is Ben Horton with Ben Horton architecture and design located at 312 State Route 10 Randolph New Jersey um I received my Bachelor of Fine Arts degree at Carnegie melon University and I've received my master of architecture at Yale University I've uh since graduating work for couple major companies um Canon design and genser they're two of the largest firm in the US and the world um I cut my teeth with them and then I opened my own firm in 2000 so I've been in business business for about 24 years I did testify before this uh uh Township Board before and numerous other boards I've have experience working with headquarters a lot of Warehouse buildings industrial buildings hotels um nursing homes Etc uh lot of projects over the years we accept your qualifications so Mr Horton you handed out uh sheets and I see you put some boards up on on the easel if you'd like to mark them and identify what they are if if I could uh if it's okay with the uh the board uh I think there are two sets of drawings I handed to you as a exhibit uh there are six sheets of renderings that are dated 89 2023 and then there are three sheets of uh renderings and sketches that are dated 9 25 23 uh so if I a uh can I just labeled that as all one exhibit of nine sheets [Music] or did you want to divide them A4 and A5 sure you know I'll mark A4 as the we already have an A4 I'll note that what was A4 because A4 was the color the site photos oh site photos that's right okay okay so A5 would be uh six sheets of rendering artistic rendering of the building uh data 89 2023 and then A6 would be uh three sheets uh including uh sketches and renderings of the sign study which I'll explain what that is about it's really related to the facade sign um i' like to go over first uh some of the questions about the building organization and layout and this is in the uh this is a set of drawings I don't think we need to label because it was part of the uh uh drawings that was submitted to the board these are architectural drawings dated okay I've been labeling them so go ahead okay you want me label these A7 A7 these are uh sub submission drawings that include all the architectural sheets there were one two three six sheets uh submitted that were all dated 42123 issue for Pb review uh these were architectural drawings that included the series of floor plans exterior elevations and detail for the signs uh for the building uh with with that said I'm going to quickly walk you through the floor plans and then show you what the uh the building looks like then I really want to get into the uh facade sign because we are asking for a variance for the facade sign the uh first sheet I'll go over is a201 that is the floor plan and the uh submission has it colorized so it's a little easier to read the uh sort of the purple side on the right side is the the the portion of the building that we want A&M to occupy and then the uh kind of the the peach color side is the side it's intended for future tenant now the exact line of that demising wall might vary depending on on the final lease agreement uh if we do get a future tenant uh but the intent is that uh we're going to have basically uh two major tenants A&M's going to occupy the right side of the building and of the plant and then future tenant will occupy the left side and we will have two entrances and I'll show you what those entrances would look like uh the the I think the uh the the site plan clearly showed that basically we took that front parking lot that faces the highway and kind of took the uh half of it away and uh put the building in place but the other half that faces the highway that's closest to the highway that's staying that's our really our front door so when you look at the bottom of the floor plan that's the side that faces the turnpike and we're kind of looking at that as our front elevation because uh in all reality this building is kind of located away from your main road uh you really can't see the building that well from your main road because it's so far away but you will see this it's a very prominent building where you're driving by the highway I think right now during the uh especially in the winter months when you drive by the highway you do see the old white building that two-story structure this one is going to be a little bit taller a little bit bigger it's very much in keeping with rest of the warehouse buildings that are in that neighborhood but I really do see for this property this is going to act like the front door for our neighborhood because everyone driving down the highway is going to see this building so we felt it was really important uh that we do take care of making that inovation look nice um just uh housekeeping wise um we do have uh at the front right corner of the building we are going to build a a second story or mezzanine inside the building that's where we're going to put the office spaces um we're thinking maybe below that mezzanine area we might put in things like cafeteria maybe some training training rooms for the uh the staff but in general the office area will be located on the Upper Floor we are asking for that uh sizewise we noted on the drawing that second floor area is noted to be 9234 square foot now that final size may get reduced but we're not going to exceed that amount that's the amount that we're asking for and in the final study um when we go through the detailing of the uh plans it might get reduced a little bit or maybe uh we'll use most of it for office and maybe a little bit for future growth or things like that but we do want to ask for that and the reason we want to show that to the board is we're making sure we we're thinking about the future we have enough space and we have enough parking that try to minimize having to come back to the board so that's really the intent of what we're showing with the floor plane now for the future tenant we're anticipating it's going to be mostly warehouse but they may have office space too so we we not noted that that colored area in the lower left corner about 3,174 square foot is account of for uh future tenant office space again when we uh when we do get a tenant they do have to file for building permit your zoning office is going to make sure they don't exceed the uh the allowances that it's going to exceed the parking uh that's being provided on site um right now the site Engineers show that they have more than adequate parking for this uh proposed use and the future tenant based on the fact that we're going to have that 3,000 foot of office space so we are planning for the future in that respect I think we do have a little bit of Elbow Room with the uh total number of parking but uh by a few parking counts so there is some Elbow Room there but we feel very comfortable the client feels very comfortable we have adequate parking um so we're in good shape where as that concerned uh the second page a202 is showing that in blue color the uh the footprint of the proposed uh mezanine which will be our office space uh the nice thing about being uh that having that tall warehouse space and you build a meing space you'll see in the rendering it creates it's a nice second floor area and we're building a little balcony out there to enhance the look but also make it a nice place because you know looking at the wetlands and looking at the highway it kind of looks nice so we're gonna take advantage of that is the is the box like an air shaft what is that going on there in the middle uh it's an uh open Atrium so when you first walk into the door I'm not talking about the one open to below I'm talking about sep that's a we're showing that we're going to have a handicap accessibility about building an elevator okay got it because a lot of times a board ask you know if you're going to have a second floor yeah that makes going to be accessible it's a we have to make the building 100% accessible so we're going to meet all the code requirement for the building um the the the building uh in terms of the next few pages a401 and 402 they're showing the uh the elevation of the building but I'm not going to get too heavy into these drawings because I think the renderings are going to show better what the building looks like but but uh just technically we're going to build similar type of structure as you see in that in our neighborhood in our warehouse neighborhood you see those wellb built concrete structures uh concrete is a great material for warehouse because it's durable you can insulate those to meet the new energy code requirement and they do last uh that's why um it it's it's considered more of a Class A Warehouse type building to use that construction type as opposed to metal skin not that I'm opposed to doing metal buildings but these type of buildings do last longer it's a good quality building obviously uh the young family they want something that's going to last because they expect to be here for a long time another 70 plus years right yes uh so that's what we're trying to do is make a good quality building presents a nice front for not just them but for but for the neighborhood that's what we're trying to do uh the next sheet that we're going to get into is uh a 7.01 uh they show some details uh uh shown the basic intent for the facade sign and then what we're going to do with the monument sign the monument sign it's an existing sign located if you're looking at the building the left side that would be the south side of the building that's an existing sign it's a really well-built uh concrete structure we're going to keep that structure but just replace the lettering instead of saying church and Dwight we're going to put our logo on uh language on there so we're not increasing the size I think it kind of made sense to reuse the structure that was there um I think again part of the Care was that we we did try to save what we can on that one um the the the other two sign details are just basically telling you uh these are letter cutout letter signs not the big rectangular boxes which I think looks a little bit nicer uh it's going to be internally illuminated uh so that's uh I seen I think you've seen a lot of cutout letters that have the uh uh lights built in so at night it gives it a nice glow um that's the type of sound we're proposing to do um this the the reason we need the variance I'll get into with this study but it's just a detail to show you the approximate size and dimensions that it will be a cutout letter internally eliminated that's what this sheet is showing with that said I'm going to go right into the rendering yeah this is uh A7 are you going to be talking about the other sign shown here separately later the other sign oh that sign is a study to show you what the the uh the implication of the variance you're approving is it's not a sign that we're actually going to build I that that box that we're showing I'll explain that because it's yeah if I don't explain it yeah we're not building that sign I understand where you're getting that I'll get there uh this this is the uh uh exhibit number A5 um I didn't print all six sheet I just printed a couple of the major sheets so you could flip through all six sheets but this is the the front facade that's going to face the highway and it's also the front right corner which is going to be our main entrance area and it kind of shows that we're trying to put a lot of glass in there we're building a little balcony around the second floor office area underneath that that balcon is also going to create an overhang and it's going to create a nice cover area and we're recessing the exterior wall in the lower area so during nice summer weathers we have a nice area to sit out and uh you know have an outdoor patio type of space I I think one of the things we learned with this pandemic is build nice outdoor spaces right so that's what we're doing with this uh building and uh and uh you know the the detention Basin is in front of the uh front entrance area and you know people were like oh is that going to be a problem frankly I think uh some DET country basins you could do a nice job you know put some nice natural grass in there we did that for Seaman's one of their medical Diagnostics building beautiful biod detention Basin because they they just put some nice grasses in there we are going to put a fence around it uh protect people from falling and put some nice landscaping around that area just to further clarify that because in the plan view it looked like a ton of little trees and they talked about this biodiversity thing and it looked almost like a a garden yeah this looks like a a vertical pit with so how much should I which is a more accurate representation well the the Landscaping they are going to put uh we're proposing to put some landscaping around the fenced area inside the biod detention Basin inside itself what's that going to be Jim again um there's G to be trees grasses it's going to be very thick Landscaping inside the won't look anything straight drop off right that that's not accurately depicted on the architecture on the 3D we did the uh we did this surrendering like months ago these guys caught up with their Landscaping but but obviously they did a really if you look at their plan they did a beautiful job putting in some nice Landscaping in there uh next so just your point it's going to look more like our one at the library than a straight retention we have a proper bio retention with slopes and grasses and it's no no no but I but I but I'm just I'm just trying to make the connection it's not it's not going to be hard sided just pure retention Bas it's going to be more a bio retention yeah inside of it is going to be much more Landscaping than this but there is a wall yeah there is a wall because you got to get that we're going to have depth there so we have to protect pedestrians with a fence for protection how how deep is it and how tall is the fence the sorry uh sure the the um I could tell you the depth give me one second I said look our gr plan but the fence is going to be like a pool fence so it's GNA be four foot high okay uh it's I think it's approximately four or five feet deep it's not like a 10 foot high wall it's just deep enough so we can hold the water volume but then I over time you would probably not even be able to see the walls because there's trees in there there's grasses is it's going to become a very Lush kind of area that's it's really not going to be it's going to be nice to look at in the in the interim first couple years before it fills in what is the nature of the fence what's the material and is it I mean just describe the fence a little bit more well the fence is going to be a a kind of looks like a rot iron black black fence that's a nice decorative fence not a chain link fence we want it to look nice okay yeah all right so uh as I go around the building this view is actually the front almost like a straight front view of the building seeing from the highway so you could see uh the right side for A&M left side we created a nice entrance peaceful future tenant so you know there's a two nice front doors there's additional exit doors uh that we provide for the building has to be planted to meet all the egress code requirement now the two sheets that we showed you um the same elevation but we want to show you uh this second one if you uh designed the uh the sign to meet the 100 square foot requirement it's it's noticeably smaller and it's still kind of hard to understand what that means and that's something I want to get into with the the sign study yeah yeah it it's it's like um here you could kind of notice it and then when you go to the uh ordinance size it's smaller but you you got to I want to explain that further because when you're actually on the highway you're it's going to seem even smaller if you go with 100 square foot and I'll explain why I really recommend that we uh we approve this uh variance request uh as I get into the sign study uh this is a closeup view of the entrance uh next to the visitor Ser the parking lot coming into A&M uh this is the uh the enlarged detail of the uh the future tenant entrance area which which version of the of the size of the signs are these representing these are all the sizes based on the uh the proposed size yeah the one that would require variance yes that's great thank you uh and this is the uh back side of the building again we're trying to carry that same language uh introduce some color to break up the facade a little bit uh but it is the back of the building and so this building would be facing the uh the existing Warehouse building that's behind us and they're kind of sharing the loading area um that that's uh for the rendering um and I'm going to quickly go to the signed portion of it um the this first diagram sk1 uh it's in your handout packet uh it it's showing kind of like more of the mathematical graphic view of the sign but generally when we do a a facade sign we try to do uh this rule of plumb idea is that on the top right corner we wrote recommended height of sign letter for Maximum Impact is one inch per 5 ft of sight distance so so if you have a one inch sign you're 5 ft away you could read that pretty good it has good impact if it gets smaller sometimes it's difficult so you use that kind of Ru thumb number so if you're 100 feet away let's say from a building or a sign generally you want that sign to be about 20 in tall or 1 fo8 now imagine a sign on a building that's only 1.8 about this tall right on a building well if you're 100 feet away you could read it so it does have impact if you get smaller not so much now this other distance I noted here is 390 ft away our sign size is 6 foot 6'6 is the height of the sign that we're proposing but we're effectively about 390 ft away from the highways uh this this diagram I'm showing 6'6 as a comparable size to 1 fo8 the actual sign I'm sorry um the actual sign is 6'3 so it's a little bit smaller actual sign is couple inches smaller than what I'm showing in this diagram so if you had a 1 fo8 in sign 100 ft away it would be equivalent in size to a sign that's 6'6 at 390 ft away which is the effective distance that we have from our faade to the highway some parts buildings in an angle so some parts a little bit further and also when you consider the uh the other side of the highway it's even further uh so we we do want to have some presence so uh we do think uh asking for design size would be good now the reason I showed this 12T sign height is that actually if you looked at the distance from our building from Cranberry Road where that overpasses uh that's about 720 ft so in order to have same sort of effective presence we would need a sign that's 12 foot tall but we're not asking for that we are asking for a 6 foot 3in sign because you know we're trying to get that impact from the highway okay now this uh this lower detail here again is showing the relationship this is actual scale diagram showing a car looking at a sign 100 feet away that's uh that's 1 fo 7 and A4 inch high 100 feet away on our building that's uh 390 ft from the highway is shown at 6'3 so a 6'3 sign would be similar to a impact of a 1 foot7 inch sign which is very close to the ideal size that we're going for that's why we came out with that size and what does that mean um this is all good from a a you know math or scientific perspective but these two renderings is actually I I pretended there's a building 100 feet away from the road from the highway and that sign is actually uh modeled at 1 fo8 in high this building is 390 fet away from the person who took this uh image like if you took a photo and that sign is actually 6' 3 in high if you look at it side by side they're very similar so the next image is just a blowup just so you could see that a little bit closer so if you look at the actual sign that's 1 fo8 in high you know if that building was 100 feet away from you this building is 390 feet away from you it has a 6' 3 in sign but it has the same looks like the same size sign so that's what all that graphic study is showing you and so in in our opinion uh because the building is going to be so far away from the highway if you get any smaller than that you really won't be able to notice it it won't have impact so no the big white block is pretending if you had a building there just for comparison purposes that's why we showed that I it's it looks if you don't see it it looks bizarre but uh I hope that made sense um what I was trying to explain is there any questions about that makes sense to this engineer yeah so so a lot of times like uh you know people kind of ask about the the the science of the math Behind these things that's why I showed those Graphics because the engineers appreciate it but then realistically when you look at the perspective views I think that really tells you you know what we're trying to do okay okay so that's my presentation I one question sure uh hbac uh what will happen where will the air handlers be where will the chillers or or um you know any of the air conditioning or Heating units be well we we're going to have package unit on the roof similar to the uh other building will there be any buffering of those so you can't see them well this board has often required some type of panels or on the roof to keep people from seeing ugly units yeah well if you're my my recommendation to the board and I make this recommendation not like uh uh to like save money for the CLI it's nothing like that because like it depends like if you put a building like in a like nice Main Street area and you put this big mechanical unit on the roof and people are going to see you're going to want to screen it to make it look nice in a warehouse building like this one uh you could do a Google Earth view right now from the highway looking at the building that's behind it you can't see those units barely you won't you won't even notice it uh from the Cranberry Road when you're that far away you really won't notice those units on the roof uh you start to put the scen on it you're going to Triple the size of that visual impact of the uh the the roof talk Unit A package unit may be the slightly bigger than the size of this uh roof and you might have a couple of the those unit for the office areas on the roof now if you take that unit which tends to be about y tall right and then you put a screen and you have to you can put air clearances around it it's going to be you know triple the width you know uh in the size of the unit so those if you make those screens look nice it's nice if you could see it but uh in all honestly there's no one's going to see this if you're on a parking lot there's sight distance with the height of the building with a parut you'll never see it uh when you're in the highway you may see it but you won't notice it because it's so far away and it's so small so my my strong recommendation for this type of situation is to not do rooftop screening otherwise you're just going to waste money you know create more of a maintenance head for the uh the client and it's not going to have the impact that uh where I think it's going to be detrimental to the neighborhood is there a parit on this building it has a small parit it it's only going to be uh minimal at the at the high point of the roof uh maybe about 10 inches high and can you set at least set back the hbac units away from the edge we'll definitely set it back Edge this board has previously required 10 feet 20 feet something like that from the Ed edge of the building uh even with screening yeah actually by code if you don't set it back more than 10 foot you have to put uh guard rails there for safety of the workers so we always set it back more than 10 foot uh we'll definitely set it back uh more than 10 foot to not have a visual impact from the Department we'd like to make that a condition a question about the lights for the sign um like how bright is how bright is the lighting of the letters and I I don't know the foot candles in it of the sign but uh they they're not as bright as the the sight lighting I think most of the signs you see these days they are backlit like Starbucks sign is something that uh we do a lot of Starbucks applications uh they're all backlit and if you drive by those at night they kind of have a nice glow to them but they're not they're not lighting up ground just concerned there's lighting and there's lighting yeah you know there's lighting that you just don't want in your town and there's lighting that's Pleasant I think again these signs are only going to face the highway and I I think uh you know if you were doing a Main Street uh we we will probably size is going to be much smaller you know more discreet uh but I think these days even on a Main Street those internally lit signs they just look better I think the industry has kind of shifted in that direction because actually we don't allow internally W signs um in our in our main on our Main Street on our historic stre right on the Main Street Yeah Yeah question for our professionals do we have um stipulations on the foot candles for these signs in our ordinances okay yeah we we generally the industry just doesn't make the sign bright enough where it's going to like uh create a a visual disturbance we had situations though where we did a building like we just did an application for Audi up on a mountain and there's a neighborhood downhill and they were concerned that they may be able to see the sign at night and we the board stipulated uh during off peak hours at at night time when you're not in business turn off the lights so we put a switch on it to automatically go off at night ultimately um after it was built uh they realized you can never see it so next time we expanded the uh the building a little bit towards the back uh the board took that stipulation off because they were concerned you know but then they said it doesn't make sense anymore it's a beautiful building thank you very much thank you it will be a nice addition um so thank you for the explanation uh all the bulk variances involve traffic signage uh so will'll hear from the traffic engineer or okay great but beautiful beautiful building it's going to be quite uh a uh nice addition to the neighborhood uh so I think you've invested properly in what's important to our board uh we do like to see outdoor space we like to see space for um you know Community to be outside um so you're doing all the right things so it's really really a lovely uh lovely building I just have one sure okay thank you is the um ground sign going to be lighted at all I think it has a I think it has a current like a externally lit signally lit there's a there's a light in front of it so it would be externally lit okay all right thank you um that's it bring up our traffic engineer all right batting cleanup here we go one more after this okay Craig bit swor can you give the board the benefit of your experience qualifications sure uh I have a bachelor's degree in civil engineering from Virginia Tech U I'm a licensed professional engineer in New Jersey I testify pretty much every night this is my third this week uh in front of boards and uh I think after this I'm one more town before my middle sex County Bingo cards filled up so good we accept your qualification and I'm sorry what was your last name Pary p r g y sorry p g y can you walk the board through the analysis you did to prepare the traffic um report submitted with this application sure um we started off as any traffic report would with uh taking traffic counts obviously it was pretty easy to figure out where we wanted to count here we have two signalized intersections the one at gavit drive and then the one that serves sort of the internal access road and we focus on uh the the weekday morning and weekday evening peak hours that's the busiest times of the day in terms of background traffic and also when you're going to see a business like this have its people coming in and out so we count from 7 to 9 in the morning and 4:30 to 6:30 in the evening on a weekday um and determine those busiest hourly volumes um at at those two intersections obviously that's a a static um traffic volume when this building is built we're going to be in the future a little bit more so I had to do a little bit to sort of project the future and the dot publishes for this area a 1% annual growth rate so I added that times two years to our traffic counted volumes and then we also consulted with the town and see what else is approved but not yet built and at the time that we did the traffic counts there were three additional Warehouse sites that were built that were close enough that I think their traffic would uh come through these intersections so we also added that on top of those grown volumes so then we have an idea of what the traffic is going to be like in the future in terms of what this specific uh property generates in terms of traffic we use the it The Institute of Transportation Engineers trip generation manual that's basically the traffic engineering Bible of how to uh project traffic volumes and uh for a warehouse of this size the it data tells me that it would generate 35 trips in the morning peak hour and 38 in the evening now a trip is a vehicle a car or truck either entering or exiting uh obviously in the morning most are coming in in the evening most are going out and going home but 35 and 38 are the numbers and to put that in a little perspective the New Jersey DOT considers a significant increase in traffic uh 100 or more trips so we're about a third of that a little more than a third of that and uh the It generally recommends that you do a traffic study like we've done when you're generating 50 or more trips so we're even under that and that's not accounting for the fact that there is a building on the site now that could be reoccupied without coming to this board in fact it seems like it was at one time contemplated I didn't take any credit for the fact that that building exists there just assume you know we're building this over vacant land but the fact that it's there and was generating traffic and could again even further diminishes those numbers but n nonetheless we distributed that traffic that's going to be generated by this project to the two intersections the trucks are all to use gavit drive that's the that's the intended circulation and you heard from the prior testimony we will provide that signage and the cars can use either they'll either use the internal Road or uh the Gava Drive intersection so we distribute that traffic added on top of those grown volumes and then I do an analysis of what are those intersections going to operate with and without this project being constructed and that analysis gives me a a delay per vehicle calculation which is then related to a level of service with a being the best or the lowest range of delay and F being the worst and what I really want to do here is compare comp the two what changes happen when we put this project in and the answer is is none that's why that do has that 100 trip increase because that's when you start to see those levels of service change but in this case going through that analysis both of those signalized intersections would operate at the same levels of service by adding this project and that's not even accounting for the fact that we're removing a building that once once and could in the future generate traffic uh so that's the sort of the reader digest summary of the traffic impact part of it um I happy to answer any questions and go into more detail but I know it can be we'll just go to Andrew and see what his responses to the traffic impact study sure fortunately for this site both access points have signals that helps to distribute the traffic and that's part of what made this study very easy you did your count you did your analysis and it shows in the charts that there was very little change just a couple of seconds here and there and that's only because the building but as you said if the building were to be reoccupied those signals were configured to handle the volume from that building so they're really just putting traffic back in that those signals were already designed to handle and accommodate and that's what was recognized in the report without any levels of service change there's a second here and there that go up actually some go down just based on the distribution of the traffic signal time in so U it works out and U what he has in his report all checks okay that's a a glowing report from Andre that rarely happens so I'm gonna I'm gonna encourage you to move on we have we have other hurdles to get through but um that's a glowing report I thought there was only the uh traffic signal at uh gav and then when I looked back um it yeah that makes a big difference so okay no no Andrew gave you the go ahead so I'm gonna I had questions yes sorry nope just a couple it wasn't related to the traffic study but more the parking area so in exhibit 3A which was this one um it visually shows a collection of uh Ada parking over by the tenant side but I don't see any which we don't even know yet is going to be occupied and it's the smaller space but I don't it doesn't show any Ada closer to the um to the primary owner tenant side is that just visually missing and is there Ada parking on the South Side as well um this planet shows it on sorry on this planet I see it only on the North side I mean it can be sort of allocated wher it needs to be yeah I mean I think generally the idea is it's supposed to be close to where people need to enter the building and it seems like the primary location is the south side yeah so one one of those should I think J Jason is right they should be redistributed yeah it's a good point it may be that you need a van accessible one on each end so go two in one and then the rest on the other side the one thing I might add a traffic engineer and I was going to say this when the architect was up there kudos to having the uh main entrance for the building to the South because that brings uh people into the southern part of the parking if if the main entrance were near the north of the building a lot of that south parking would go onuse they would get the first spots up at the North so I wasn't really sure when I saw the layout when I saw the handicap spaces near the north I was concerned that that would be the main entrance but now hearing that the main entrance is to the South that's a good good thing but your point is well taken it should be distributed if there's two tenants coming building there should be a handicap near both of those entrances great okay that was the easy one this one this one is just a little more convoluted bear with me um I heard in the earlier testimony that the office has approximately 20 people correct is that what I heard yes which for about 9,000 square feet is actually extraordinarily low density um and I don't think I heard testimony on how many people were working separately in the warehouse is there additional headcount associated with that okay so I guess my question is you you did parking based on um and what was the normal calculation but we actually have a very low density use here we've in the past sometimes um suggested banking parking and not having to build as much impervious uh coverage if you don't need it so I guess my first question is for Andrew is that something that would would be applicable here or is there something I'm misunderstanding because it seems like they're not going to need this much parking no that certainly could be applicable here we could U Bank parking spaces if they don't feel they need it uh again there's a large parking area out there now they're reducing that parking area to begin with uh and they're reducing uh you're providing 73 parking spaces where I believe 67 are required by ordinance but certainly we could ask those and you may have a reason why you don't want to and that's fine I'm happy to hear it I just wanted to start with whether it was viable yes so um we do have a a service team service teex and we have field salespeople and and they come in periodically for training because a lot of the products and services that we offer are very technical in nature there's constant training going on which is what we would use um the area underneath the um office space for for so so there will be times when there may be an additional 15 or 20 uh people from our field sales team uh maybe manufacturers technical people uh coming into the building so um so I think we would need you know the full amount that that we're requesting okay and to add to that the the other there's a part of the space that's going to be leased to a tenant and if they show up to look at it and it doesn't look like there's enough parking it could create an issue f look a lot of times the attendants are happy to bank parking because it means they have to build less parking but if you think you need it that's I understand yeah I actually did have one more question the trash compactor that's outside of the building um is it safe to be to have no screening around it or Gates or does it require it to trash compactor is a um it's like a dumpster with a cover nobody can get into it only somebody with a key um it's not pretty it's it's I mean I asked in my letter if it could be buffered in some way but it's surrounded by parking areas so no the answer is you can't buffer it really can't plan trees in in in pavement right it's on the interior side of the building right right yeah that's right it's away from the from the turnpike and away from the roadways okay I just didn't know I mean I in an old job of mine we had a a trash compa compactor and it it was was very dangerous um but this one is locked and yeah it's probably more dangerous inside the building than it is from outside okay I thought you were G to say a trash compactor accident I was no no no no no sound I remember being terrified by it and um and just seeing when they're out in the open is y sorry one more thing which probably isn't for you so it might be for either the architect or the engineer but it occurred to me now the south side of the building has an emergency what I'm guessing is mostly an emergency exit that looks like it just stops at the base of the stair and is grass it doesn't look like there's any kind of sidewalk path there given that that is all the way up to the edge there you know the the already encroached upon old wetlands and it might be a very soggy wet thing I mean was there any consideration of just building just a minimal sidewalk that connects to the to the already existing concrete just a little bit further away there there are two sets of stairs coming down this one stair and one pad the stair gun actually goes to that Wetland walkway that we were talking about before the other one goes out to the grass and maybe you can comment on that that's the one I was referring to right the other one is just just required per building code uh as far as a fire exit we weren't going to connect it because it's really not going to be a primary use it's just needed for and it's in the transition area it's not in the Wetland and we were really oh it's 50 feet away or more right exactly we we were trying to minimize the amount of development down there and then just Connect into the existing walkway so that you know uh employees could go out for a walk at break some kind of Walk Through the Wood area okay good questions um I'm not sure if it was in your report uh any requirement for electric vehicle charging stations or the um the prepping of those per NJ La they have uh two uh EV spaces and that's what's required for the uh 73 parking spaces okay so they are providing that okay all good Madam chairperson I am not quite done yet I have a couple of more items that are from my letter and I want to also kind of make make sure I understand what they're going to do in my letter and not do would take that long but when he's when he's done we have a plan one more witness you have one more okay I'm sorry okay I'll hold no I think Now's the Time now's it time well it's okay yeah it's not this person it's it's really to the site engineer as sort of a wrapup so I'd rather hold okay so should we just this this witness and call the next one we good okay let's do that call up our our Final witness to bring us home Chris Coley of topology hello can put his qualifications on the yes um good evening members of the board um members of the public uh my name is Chris collie I am a principal at topology olog we're a planning firm based in Newark I have a master's degree in urban planning I'm a member of the American Institute of certified planners I'm a licensed professional planner in the state of New Jersey my license is current uh I have not testified as in from as many boards as uh previous um witness but I have testified and been accepted as an expert in front of number of boards Westfield hon Elman Park Bernardsville Belleville South Brunswick um a couple others okay we accept your qualifications thank you thank you very much the spelling of your name I don't know if you need it Robin but my last name is spelled c l l y and my firm is topology t o p o l g y okay thank you cool all right um so uh I am the project Planner on this application uh it's really my job this evening to walk you through um the variances and the design waivers that are sought uh on this matter and and provide you with uh planning justifications for why you as a board should you choose could could appropriately Grant those um I have visited the site um I uh have reviewed each of the review letters that were provided uh and the application materials uh that were permitted so I'm last so I'm not going to walk you through the sort of what is the project overview I'm going to sort of go right into the variances uh and the variance discussion um in preparing my analysis uh of the variances I did review the town's master plan master plan reexamination your zoning ordinance other related documents and that played a part into um into my analysis uh so the variances that we're seeking there are uh six of them uh they are generally I'll I'll run you through them before I walk through the rationale uh one relating to the location of parking relative to a property line or street right uh Street line uh one related to parking between the front building line and the street line one relating to the location of a driveway way within 5T of a side property line one relating to the width of driveways for commercial and Industrial um and then two related to signage uh one for having two wall signs where one p per wall is propos is permitted and one um for the size of those signs exceeding the maximum permitted size uh there are a number of design waivers as well um I'm going to walk through each of those uh as well but but later on once I go through the Varian testimony okay uh so we will be seeking uh C2 variances for these this evening that's the benefits versus burden variance or the flexible C variant generally the the the obligation that I have as a planner uh is to one explain uh why in my opinion the the project um advances the purposes of zoning uh and then two to walk through the detriments that are associated with the variance or could be associated with the variance and determine whether or not the overall benefits outweigh the um the detriments I'm going to be putting on the the positive criteria or the purposes of Zoning for each variance uh in in collection um in total and then walking through the negative impacts of each one individually so how does this project Advance the purposes of zoning as as you know there's a number of purposes of Z right at the beginning of the land use law um in my opinion this project advances uh about a half dozen of them um purpose a to encourage Municipal action to guide the appropriate use of development of all lands in the state in a manner which will promote the public health safety morals and general welfare uh the key word there for me is really appropriate uh as I said I did review your master plan and preparing this testimony uh this site is located in a sub area that you call the area east of Route 130 sets forth goals for that area which include non-res non-residential development Industrial Development of the nature that you find uh this project is advancing that goal by promoting the appropriate use um of the site in that way purpose B to secure safety from fire flood panic and other natural and man-made disasters I think one key element of this project which has been touched on but maybe not emphasized by prior Witnesses is the removal of the previous structure and the condition of the dilapidated condition of that structure and the fact that it will be being replaced with a a new modern um and safer building and in that way I find it to advance purpose B um purpose C to provide adequate light air and open space uh open Spa light and air are really requirements that you would associate with setbacks you know setbacks exist to say this is where buildings should go and this is how they should interact in this case we're not seeking any bulk variances uh related to setbacks and in that way we're we're we're meeting that goal and we're advancing that purpose um skip those uh purpose I to promote a desirable visual environment through creative development techniques and good Civic design and arrangement I think this project actively promotes this purpose in addition to just it uh proposing a project that's in accordance with your bulk requirements um you also do have uh more sort of design qualitative standards for industrial buildings that were referenced in the in the planning report um I think the facade that you saw previously really addresses and advances many of your local design goals in that way uh some of them were use of subdued wall coloration patterning texture um extensive use of uh Landscaping to to shield and break up planes and then also um architectural treatment that in the opinion of the board provides uh reduction in the sort of visual ual impact of the buildings and I think that's that's reflected in the treatment of the U asss and then finally purpose H to encourage the location and design of Transportation routes which will promote the free flow of traffic uh while discouraging locations of such facilities which promote congestion the Traffic Engineers testimony was fairly straightforward in terms of the adequacy of this site to accommodate the the use as proposed so those are collectively the positive criteria which in my opinion apply to uh this project uh as I said for the negative I am going to walk through each variance individually um beginning with and I'm gonna pull up there it is perfect um going to begin with uh the first variants identified no parking shall be located nearer than 25 ft to any property line or Street RightWay line and the specific variances that we're requesting here is that five proposes are located adjacent to the proposed share loading area and located less than 25t from the common property line so so this only impacts five spaces yeah and I'm going toj so these [Music] are and for the record you're you're pointing to what has been marked as exhibit A3 A3 so these five spaces here are the five spaces in question [Music] the common property line runs generally through here um and these are the five properties five parking spaces that are closer to the line uh you know are those parking for automobiles and not trucks these are automobile parking spaces and are they necessary on the back side of the building um so uh I'm going to see if they want to answer whether or not the necessity of those parking spaces I'm going to talk about what what what the detriment of the existence of those parking spaces might be considering that you're asking for a variance for them I'm just asking if they're necessary on the back side of building yeah so they also need a variance for parking on the front side of the building so they're damned if they do they're damn down okay got it right so I think the previous testimony from Mr Young about the necessity of all parking spaces and how they got to the count um relates to I'm sorry hold on but I thought we had more parking spaces than we needed yes yes but the setbacks are the problem what Mr collie is addressing right now is is a setback issue another part of that segment in the ordinance um does not permit parking between the building and the roadway and that is where most of their parking is okay so the the issue that's causing the variance in this location is the proximity to the property line and you know typically you'd have a standard about proximity of parking to a property line to prohibit uh one property owner from crowding an adjacent property owner with parking to uh maybe discourage sort of uh visual impact on a site from parking the unique uh characteristic here on the site and the reason why I think there's no substantial detriment created by this variant is that we're on both sides of the property line and there was previous testimony about the easement that's being created here right so this variance we need to seek it it's real these are two lots but it's very much sort of like a paper condition that um any net detriment that could be associated with it is being addressed by other components of a project how did those five spots get into the building yeah there looks to be another kind of what looked similar to emergency exit right next to one of the uh loading do there STS off the loading do yeah so so we do have some customers that'll come and pick up material as opposed 95% of what we process gets shipped out by Trucking um but we do have some customers that'll come in and pick up material so we needed kind of a place to land them where they can temporarily park um we also have some customers that uh will send their workers down to be outfitted in personal protective equipment and so forth so uh rather than have them come into the main lobby we we set up that parking area in the back and they'd be using they'd be using the door right next to the first of the loading dots correct okay um so in my opinion the the detriment of the the the location of these adjacent to the property line um is is outweighed by the the overall benefit um associated with the project uh the second variance is the one that was just raised about front parking in the front yard and as was sort of explained by the the architect earlier um we have a unique condition here where the turnpike is our front yard um and we're seeking this variance uh the key points I think really that uh minimize the detriment associated with this are one the the unique um presence of the turnpike often times like you have no parking in the front yard because you're in a downtown location you're in other locations where you're trying to create um a street wall or an aesthetic that um promotes walkability this is an unconventional front yard and that it's the turnpike uh the other key uh thing to note here um is that we we this is an existing condition we've already had parking in the front yard and as was testified previously we're actually um reducing that the last point I'll make on parking in the front yard and and why I think the detriment that way by the positive is the alternative for us would really be to take this parking and rotate it down here and as has been previously discussed this is the environmentally sensitive area so we don't want to put the parking down there because it's environmentally sensitive and would be challenging to look there so in my opinion that that variant also the uh the benefits out detriment that be associated with it uh the another one which relates to the sort of shared property line has to deal with the um existing driveway uh located within 5T of the property line so this driveway which comes in and services the property ends up at and on the property line here this is a very similar condition to the one I discussed earlier with the location of parking uh in close proximity to property line it's a shared property line both properties are comprising the project the detriment that would be associated with that in normal conditions is not present here because of um because of the the nature of the project uh the fourth variance deals with the minimum width of driveways for commercial and Industrial purposes this is also an existing condition uh you know you have minimum widths for driveways to make sure that uh they are appropriately designed to accommodate traffic this WID is the 23.1 Ft coming in at this location uh this is also in existing condition um I think one key thing for the board to note in considering the detriment potential detriment associated with that is this is a driveway that's accessing the vehicular uh sorry the passenger parking areas and not the truck parking areas sorry Chris I'm sorry to interrupt but are you can you say which sections of the ordinance that you're oh I'm sorry just for those last two because I had them as design waivers and not variances so I just wanted to yeah I did notice that I think the application we had listed some things as variances that came up as design wavers in their 15044 yeah anything that's in the site plan and subdivision standards is a design waiver okay so those last two are design waivers they're not variances so I just for the board's edification that the proofs are substantially less okay so you can take mine as a rational that's fine you can yeah cool thank you and I will make sure to read the citation for the future yeah yeah okay so the last two I'm going to sit back down for the last two variances both deal with the signs um one with the size of the signs and one with the uh location or not location quantity of the signs so so I I think I'd like to stop you for a second and then um I'd like to just see if there are any questions from the board on the first four variances that um or design waivers that have been submitted does anyone have questions on those or any input or concerns about this board granting any of those one two three four um just because we're going to be talking about very different things and and once we get into the signage it's a it's a different equation of course um so I just like to just kind of pull this board to see if there are concerns on those from a safety standpoint from a design standpoint from our standard standpoint is there any does anyone have anything uh that we need to vet or request we need to make based on those uh requests or wavers so the the five parking spots I know it says they need to be no no nearer than 25t how close are they to that common line is it 15 feet is it 20 feet or like if if they reduce the amount of landscaping just judged them up oh you know five six 10 ft by reducing some of the Landscaping there with that right could we get to the 25 could get to the 25t and would I don't know what that be are you at 21 feet now is that am I is that no that was the width of driveway I don't have the no you are you're at 20 those five spaces you're 21 ft because I mean they they appear to be necessary to run business I don't have a problem with that but is there a way to maybe take out 10et of that landscaping or something sure good evening um again this is but we don't want to lose the shrubs and the bushes we put them somewhere else it's not that I was going to use that excuse but uh um the actually this area is the one area that we tested that actually had a pretty a lower than uh average season high water table so it's probably is the best area to really have water retainage so that's why we Tred to utilize most of this area as it's actually bio retention base and it's not the Landscaping so that whole area that's adjacent to those five spaces um really is essential to to meeting the storm water requirements to really creting The Beneficial from the storm water uh quality standpoint um one other thing to mention I mean these five spaces you know really are going to be utilized by the loading docks it's pretty common to have a few spaces in the loading docks uh you know if you have a worker or something that works back there as as was mentioned by the client um you know that have those five spaces and really that whole area there's going to be an easement so that it's maintained by the two properties together and there's going to be uh cross access and that whole area is going to be shared ownership between the two properties so given that there are five spaces behind you sorry I'm just yeah there's five five spaces behind you could you just do four spaces and not ask for the waiver well it's it's I think it's actually the distance it's the distance east east west so it's not if we got rid of one it wouldn't make a difference it's the back out I also not that you know it's a technicality as they've said because they control both ends of the site and the other site in this particular area is exceptionally deep because goes to so there's a a lot of room there to move yes yeah and I was gonna say it's less compelling to me that you own both sides of it and more it's more that it's a design thing it's basically a shared driveway that even if you transfer ownership with that other side this variance wouldn't cause a hardship for that other partner because the space is designed as a shared Drive be purchasing it's subject to the EAS discuss exactly yeah one thing to know that that area is exceptionally wide that driveway so that driveway is you know 70 feet wide whereas your typal driveway is 24 feet wide so it impacts Andrew you're you're f i I'm just asking to cover the basis you're F that these cars are driving past all the big trucks there's a couple of worker vehicles that go through there it's not it's the workers who would be going back there that was testified by the uh owner of the building so a minute ago he said it wouldn't just be workers it would be some of their clients some of the customers but I'm guessing that's occasional it's not going to be uh frequent uh event um certainly uh customers uh would park out front if they didn't need to pick up something or to get fitted out in whatever they need to and use these spaces so a couple of spaces is typical uh as mentioned by the engineer to have if there's truckers who are working back there and they have a car parked uh that sometimes happens um as well the other um I think it's a waiver and not a variance but the width of the driveway coming into the employee parking area is 23.1 where 24 is required I think that's di Minimus now I do note that there's a curvature in the driveway there but this is an existing condition that had functioned previously for the parking space that was there also they have some guide rail up against it so it's not like they can do a whole lot without impacting other things and I I think a couple of what did you say was required I thought 30 was re was required for two-way 30 for a commercial driveway espe when you have trucks entering and exiting but this is the passenger vehicle there's no trucks anticipated up that way so 25 so 24 is required and 23 is existing and I just want to point out that that a 23 is 24 is like the industry standard to have like a driveway with but that 24 is really dictated typically because you have 90 degree parking on that area in the area where it's 23 there's no parking so really if you were going to have traffic going two directions like most of the um you know lanes that you see on on highways they're they can go all the way down to 9 ft sometimes even um so you know typically for two-way traffic 20 feet for passenger cars 24 is ideal but 23 is acceptable it's within that with that range got it actually I have a question um do we have is there a signage or is there something that prohibits trucks from going there we can add signage if that's something more like I have comments in my letter and as we get to our letters there's a couple of things that we want to go over might be now I think that's now okay all right to the we'll go to the letters look at you Andrew turning on your mic so proud I just want to be clear mr's not finished with this testimony let him finish no we do not want to talk about signs we want to keep signs separate so my so my goal is let's let's put one through four together and get those situated and because I believe that the sign ordinates takes on a different um equation uses a different ordinance and we'll have a different conversation I'm sort of trying to help kind of put all of these in one box uh to see how we're feeling about can we pass the first of these and then let's move to the signage so I would like to for Andrew to proceed checking how much time you have no I I just wanted to see if Dave maybe wanted to go first but if it's traffic first okay um and some of this will be for the engineer maybe some for the traffic engineer uh access I had no comments again the signals are set up and we heard the traffic testimony on that before the uh striping uh because this is an industrial area that's heavily used for years uh there will be some maintenance requ re ired for previous striping that was out there uh I noted some areas uh in need and that would be the center lines yes we'll agree to do that and then there's pavement markings including uh crosswalk visibility because there's crosswalks throughout to do that as well as long just just along like the front edge of our property right within the property the whole Center correct uh I had noted earlier about the what I call the bus shelter but if that's a smoking shelter just to provide access to that um whether it be a concrete sidewalk or whatever else is necessary to get between the building and the shelter uh tractor trailers are prohibited from using the West circulation roadway and by West circulation I mean along the west side of the larger buildings to the secondary traffic signal trucks are currently um by signage prohibited but I think that should be enhanced there's a little sign that says no trucks but I think that should be enhanced to make sure that trucks in the loading area uh head towards gavit use the appropriate uh path and roadway to the traffic signal we have no issue increasing the size of the sun okay uh circulation aisle for two-way access shall be uh shown that's shown on the plans I see that now uh guide rail is proposed along the west side of the parking area just wanted a detail for that um I don't know that I found a detail detail on the plans but uh if there's new guide rail just include that uh the parking we've gone through the parking and where's the griel Andrew uh it's on the west side of the parking area because there's a drop off to the there's some existing there but then on that side yes there's some proposed there um we talked about the parking requirements uh the handicap parking spaces again it would be good to have the parking spaces separated for the two entrances that's a good comment uh EV parking spaces I'm not sure where they're shown on the plan now but again it might be good to provide EV spaces for both um entrances but the one thing I I don't agree with is separating those because it does it does additional costs and then also usually EV equipment have to be immediately adjacent to it so we want to keep those kind of in one and I believe all you have to do is put in the uh ground yeah yeah if maybe you could put that somewhere centrally located between the entrances in the middle is that way yep okay uh there are no trailer spaces trailer storage spaces provided on the plans typically with warehouses you get the trailer storage um for the trailers to park or stay overnight operationally how will that be handled because you don't have those uh spaces right we're anticipating if there is trailer storage required it's just going to stay within one of the loading docks there's not it's not going to be a separate space required I anticipated that's what you were going to say but I just wanted to make sure it's on the record and then the traffic we went through the traffic uh the one point I had was just make sure that the path for the tractor trailers uses gavit drive and out towards we'll update that Andrew just for the record was um your item number two did you mean to say in that last line proposed requirements for the warehouse that's slot 102 are satisfied says 103 but have 103 above that was for the parking yeah it's uh for the new Warehouse on the last line you have lot 103 so I thought uh that one was 102 correct because the one above was for 103 okay I just want to make sure I'm sorry that was a typo yep thanks thank you and that's it thank you Andrew you want me to go through the my final items Dave I do okay so okay sorry and a cough drop my apologies um the is gavit Road a cranber Township Road or a county road I think it's private isn't it I believe it's a private I think it's part of the development I think I'm not sure I ask I'm just going way back to the 800 trucks full of Phill that are going to go back and forth and if anything happens to gav it and who is then responsible for repairing it and paying for those repairs the on the the tax map is shown in the first sheet of our site plan set and it shows it as being private so it's part of the collective part of the association okay there should be something in any res resolution if this happens to be approved that uh this that the applicant or the association will pay for any damage to either uh private or public roads okay so just a couple of things um I'm going to leave out the things I believe that the applicant is consenting to do in my letter uh and just talk about a couple different little things uh there was no testimony on the recommended plantings that um that the ordinance has in section 150 56d um the applicant does need a waiver from some of those plantings um but I did ask if you could get closer to what the requirements are that are at the clerk's office and then you know in the ordinance we can have our landscape architect work with your office and uh select as many as we can Dave would you hit like which numbers they are on your on your through here that's uh a number uh p on page eight oh okay we're all up to P Dave is your concern species or is your concern uh quantity species yeah I mean cranberry is unusual and they have they have a listed a list of of plantings that the Shader commission and others want most landscape architecture design stuff don't use that some of them are in here but not many and I'm just saying please try to increase it yeah so so they so they will have the need for a waiver but I'd like to get them closer yeah our shade tree commission does have a full list and caliper size that sort of thing so I mean it's it's helpful yeah um yeah they're okay on the caliper size and Robin can send that to you if that's helpful sure next item um I'm not sure if we decided on any any need for screening in any of the areas either adjacent to the turnpike or adjacent to the residential that's not in this town but in Monroe uh so it was one of the items in my letter that that maybe the um buffering should be increased I'm probably more worried about the residential than the turnpike Turnpike views that they showed us on the exhibits looked like they were uh a good filtered view the the residential look referring to A3 uh is on the other side of gavit Drive um really that side of the site is is really remaining as is and really most of the proposed improvements are actually buffered by the existing building so they really not even be visible to the residential uh one thing we are going to buffer uh you know better that we had spoken about um I think we had mentioned the hot box buffer that properly make sure the generators buffered properly as well as the uh Transformer I think that was a few comments that I think I believe heard from the board okay I'm I'm satisfied with that the other building sorry so he's they're doing nothing neither the term Fike no neither of those items right okay okay and so the new building is about but there's enough distance that you won't be able to perceive that and we talked about the possibility of the need for a community impact statement um I think the applicant provided adequate testimony where it's not needed because of the type and nature of this this particular building good and uh that's it uh otherwise the the the normal approvals that are required outside of this town are are uh obviously required and as I see it all the other items in my letter you're going to take care of yeah Will to [Music] [Music] AC oh the screening and buffering thank you thanks that's all I have thanks save Li the bulk of my letter is relates to the variances in the design waiver so I think that's being addressed currently everything else has already been addressed by other Witnesses um Township are you satisfied with the information that you've been provided for uh the waivers that have been discussed yes if you're yes from my perspective absolutely and actually like how I just like the way it all looks it's very linear you know we talk about moving things it just it looks really nice way this yeah I think the four the four proposed design waivers and variances are very common sense thank you okay got to the side of the table any comments on the design waiver so far that have been recommended the ones that we've just just gone through now I always say you know ask all my questions in real time I like that whether I want you to or [Laughter] not de yeah no I I feel like the the questions I had going into this have been answered okay thank you Dominique answered and and want to um reiterate Em's um compliments on the look the style and um fast Improvement thank you something this St did I miss you I think I did I I'm just looking through all these um reports and uh did you folks get the letter from the Volunteer Fire Company are is everybody okay with everything we did and we'll we'll address that as part of our uh resolution compliance submission and uh work with your fire department to address all those comments all the comments regarding like knock boxes and some standard things regarding uh you know warehouses and we'll address that as part of the approval okay thank you Robin how does that Circle back process work if there does the fire company do an inspection like how does that how does that work because normally what what generally happens is that is that the fire company does a letter and then you hear nothing so I wind up picking it up and and putting making sure things are on the plans and then it goes to construction and um Tom Decker believes that everything on the plans is correct then the fire company comes out again in the field and makes sometimes minor adjustments hopefully minor so there is a field so I I guess that was my question there is a field um check by the fire company correct okay more question sorry okay is there any additional need for sewer capacity or anything I put in my letter that uh that they have to provide calculation and or have discussions with Tom Decker uh because I think van CLE are the people that are handling the executive part of the sanitary sewer system in this town uh in terms of capacities and uh need for improvements if something like that happens so there would be a i sawry letter had a requirement for a developers agreement right does that does that um is there a separate sewer agreement in Cranberry that is the developers developers agement because how about handling performance guarantees is that in developers agreement or is that just uh no that well it can be but in it's not it's just the the performance guarantees are just part of uh what you have to provide prior to pulling a building permit okay right thank you that's it so we've heard the Architects report about signage and distance um who was the author of the report that had the formul ations for the signage size is that you no that was the architect that was the I thought it came from Dynamic no that was the architect the exibit they presented or yeah okay um we're ready for you to present for the signage okay um so have had it all right thank you very much um I won't be presenting any additional exhibits beyond what the architect already presented this evening um so just to put some clarity and and context on exactly the two signage or uh variances that we're seeking the first one is 150- 37 l 3D which relates to the total area of a single wall sign which may not exceed 2% of the area of the facade to which is affixed or 100 square feet whichever is less and also states that the height of the sign itself shall not exceed 2 feet sorry 10t um r two proposed building signs which are on the um Turnpike side of the building both exceed the minimum 100 maximum 100 squ ft requirement one of those signs is 306 square feet proposed and the other sign is 172 square feet proposed how can you know the other sign when you don't know the tenant we've provided a sort of template of the anticipated size okay you also need the third variance for the signage right for the number right two on this you're putting you're asking to put two signs on the same facade correct so that's the other variance that we need for signage which is 17037 l3b 150 150 37 l3b um where in multi-tenant buildings a maximum of one wall sign shall be permitted for each tenant uh with a maximum of four wall signs in total and no more than wall one wall sign per faade uh so in this case we are only proposing one wall sign per tenant and we're proposing two wall signs where up to four are permitted but we require a variance because we are requesting to have the same the two on the same facade so as it relates to the negative impacts associated with signage and and why we feel that the board can appropriately Grant this variance um sort of thinking about signage and also looking at the purposes that are in your local signage ordinance um for me negative impacts associated with signage are generally in one of three buckets uh one does it create clutter on the building in a way that detracts from the Aesthetics of the building uh two does it create a negative visual impact um on the surrounding area and three uh does it detract from the overall composition of the building facade on which uh the signage is located I think the architect provided uh pretty detailed and extensive testimony uh as it relates to the first matter of like does the signage clutter this building facade and when we're talking about size of the of the individual signs that are proposed um clutter relates to scale are the signs oversized for the size of the facade which is being considered I think the Alternatives that were shown by the architect um reflecting what a compliant sign would be versus what a uh what the sign is proposed uh showed that the the uh proportionality of the signs as proposed uh didn't actually clutter the site at all but actually enhanced the overall composition of the facade and I think when when the board considers uh some of the architectural treatments that uh go on industrial buildings of this nature uh the signage that's being proposed is not actually detracting from the composition of the building but actually can be considered sort of an architectural enhancement um which which adds visual interest uh in a way that is difficult to come by um frankly for for these types of buildings I think it's important for the board to know that uh while we are exceeding the overall square footage we are below the 2% um for each of these individual signs and we're also not exceeding the maximum 10 feet in height for each one the other point I want to make sure that the board is aware of and considering the potential negative impacts of this um is the uh General uh distance from the turnpike to the building this um the minimum front yard setback for this area is 100 feet this building is set back more than 100 feet from the bu uh from the the turnpike which as the architect described earlier is really our front door because of that sort of increase in proximity our proposed signage allows us to uh one maintain legibility but to maintain a sense of of appropriate scale along the building facade um for me in my opinion there's no substantial detriment to the public good that is created by granting this increase in um size uh the analysis from Halfacre Road sort of showed the DI Minimus difference or the lack of visibility from Halfacre Road um of these signs for uh at the increased size um and I believe that any potential impact granted associated with that variance um is outweighed by the overall benefit of the project as it relates to and I'm sure we'll have more on that as it relates to the number of signs uh the key point I really want the board to keep in mind here numbers of signs that standard is about signage clutter right not having too many signs on an overall building while we are requesting a variance for the number of signs on the one wall um it's a sort of specific uh decision that's being made it's a design decision that's being made to place those on what we're seeing as our front door um we're not also coming and asking for uh W signs on each of the other walls right because that wall um for the overall design of the building is the um is the primary vantage point and and the sort of uh key um elevation of the structure I do also want to say as it relates to having two signs on one wall especially given the size of industrial buildings generally uh it does create an element of Sy symmetry in the building elevation um and sort of creates nice bookends upon uh either Corner uh except that you don't know who the tenant's going to be and the long-term plan for the building is for A&M to have the entire building correct I don't think that was testim I that was the testimony that may be a possibility but right now the prop okay then I'll I'll go back to my first question you don't know who the tenant's going to be so you can't really speak to symmetry if you don't know what their sign looks like but I do think you're very wise to get a sign approval for a tenant that you don't have so they don't have to come to us and get that approval so go ahead okay um not withstanding any uncertainty about the future tenant and the um precise symmetry between the two I think on a building facade of this this size what we're talking about is like an anchor element on either corner right um the given the size of the building the really the negative impact associated with having an extra sign on one side I think is is is di Minimus as I said we could have had one sign on each side of the building we're we're not choosing to do that we're choosing to concentrate them on one location um in what we're what we're envisioning as our front door um I think the size of the building also adequately accommodates the proposed signage um that's the extent of really the negative criteria that I can identify that would be associated with signage um and that's uh the extent of my discussion on the matter all right thank you so um we've learned with our sign ordinance that warehouses are getting bigger uh some of our signs on some of the larger warehouses as you drive around do look uh a bit small we did go back and revamp our sign ordinance to have a consideration from a proportion standpoint um Dynamic engineering did put together uh a great um outline of uh an equation that compensates for speed and distance not just distance but speed at 65 miles an hour the sign could be 190 feet but at 80 miles an hour it should be 288 square feet you've asked for 306 so you sort of went beyond the calculation that you gave us so and that's three times what we accept on the other end you're going with 17 2 square feet which um you know is is well within uh well within the range of the equation that you gave us um my question is why go beyond it if you made a great case for the definition why go beyond that why not stay within the 288 but 300 is three times what we accept however precedent for this board for this side size of a warehouse is 200 Liz am I correct we go about twice the size for the last warehouses that we've been doing because warehouses are larger so that's typical I'm getting the Architects I'm just like eyeing around the corner so we want to make sure that this is visually um appealing um but we also don't want to set precedent um we've had other warehouses ask us for times three and we've denied that uh and they're on the highway however we do understand that being on the turnpike you're in a different uh advertising position you want to put your headquarters there we want to support that um my top you know my struggle is that we're setting precedent with the um you know with asking for three times what we what we accept your various stuent you read our master plan you read the reexamination report you know you're asking for three times what we have if I look at this at 80 miles an hour you don't need three times you need somewhere between 190 and 250 but you're going to 300 so it just seems like you've you've just a you know you're just pushing the envelope on the whole site it's going to look great it's going to be better but you're pushing the envelope on the signage I get why you're doing it it's your headquarters you want it out there it's for me I'll let the rest of the board respond for me it's a it's a it's a little bit Big M if I can respond to a couple of the absolutely yeah so the analysis that you're referring to from Dynamic and of course Mr Henry's here who can comment on it did touch on two different components as you mentioned it was distance and speed as you point out so the calculations that you were referencing were with respect to the speed but as was testified with the Architects to today if you were to visualize it from a distance that rule of thumb as the architect said from 100t that would put it at 6'6 and the application is for six foot six in terms of height obviously you're talking square footage and we're talking height in that regard and I see The Architects preparing to respond to a couple comments I also don't want to belabor but obviously you're you've made reference to the fact that precedent is important to this board um I'm sure you're aware but obviously within the municipal landus precedence is not a legal standard by which any future application can come before you and understand the real world that implications of that but I'd be remiss if I didn't put that on the record if I may yes um I think you are making a a good point in terms of uh when you look at the study that Dynamic provided I'd like to kind of respond to that with a couple comments uh first of all the ordinance does aot for a 10 foot height and I think I I try to test IFI saying that uh if you go with a height that's much smaller than 6'3 that we show it it it doesn't have impact but the word if you look at the whole sign it says A&M that's our logo and then next to it it says industrial product Services solution um I took the conservative view of measuring the sign with a big rectangle around the signs if you took the A&M sign build a rectangle around it measure that and then you took the where it says industrial product solution measure that the actual height of the sign where it says industrial product Services Solution that's that's an important part of their branding to have those words together now you're not going to see that from the highway that part is actually only 4 foot high so that there's a blank two foot high section above that so it's it's shorter so if you subtract that out that that equates to about like 60 70 square feet that you would subtract from that 300 square feet so we're going to be more in that uh realistically if you measure that uh in that 240 square foot if you I I don't know like from the professionals perspective how you would allow the measurement of it but I took that conservative View and took took a big rectangle around all the letters instead of saying that here's a big rectangle for A&M and a smaller rectangle for industrial but effectively there's a blank area above that industrial because it's only 4 foot high you account for that it's really 200 that's a good point okay we'll see what the rest of the board says we'll get their opinions and uh we'll listen to our professionals and see how they feel about that um I also struggle with having two signs on the same side of the building but again the building is broken up it has great length to it but we'll see what the we'll see what the board advis one other point that I do want to bring up is that the last uh uh time we talked about signage when we did the PRI application one thing important to know is we have two tenants right from a business perspective we don't have a big Monument sign like in a supermarket by the main road that says we have these tenants here the only signs that we have is the front facade and from a business perspec the other you have the other sign that you're going to use the uh uplet sign the church and Dwight that's inside then no one's going to see that until they come down the driveway you can't really see that from the road because it's h so far away um that aren't there way fairing signs to get back to your place throughout that development there way fairing signs right yeah but but the from what like this isn't like a superar uh shopping center where you have a big Monument sign advertising these things the only sign for these tenants are going to be on the building no there are way fairing signs in the industrial complex yeah directional signs right yes right so this isn't the only sign and the people that are seeing that sign are not driving up to your front door they're going 80 miles an hour on the turnpike so this is clearly for advertising but again your headquarters we want to support you um but it's it it's clearly for advertising not for directional yeah I think because by the time you get to that parking lot you're making a very good point because from my advertising perspective I think it's important to uh remember uh when we try to get good tenants they want the ability to be seen and I think that's an important way to get getting that approval before you have a tenant huge yeah thank you questions by the board yeah before you sit down um you had mentioned that you originally used the big giant rectangle to cover the whole space but that the industrial section of the wording was actually a smaller rectangle right if you look at the rectangle on this sign detail right I showed that overall height was 6 fo three which is the height of the A&M and the overall width from the the left corner of the a to the right corner of the S that's uh 48 fo7 in so I took that big rectangle and calculated the square footage and that's what's getting you that 300 square foot now you had said that it's not it's not a typical sign we have a placard with letters on them it's just the letters yeah and so there is no actual like rectangle angle with empty space yeah there's actually no space it's just there right above the above the word industrial right it's just Blank Space here that's white space because these are all cutout letter but uh when we do these uh measurements you know we could get cued and try to do small rectangle big rectangle and then reduce the square footage but we want it to be up front and say this is the overall impression and if you look at it you're going to get a push back because I you don't want I don't think you want all these uh uh applicants to do all these cute measurements to get their numbers to look good but we wanted to be realistic that we're also required in our ordinance yeah yeah you have you have to do the big rectangle oh okay so that's the way we're measuring it but realistically but the ordinance requires you do it that way yeah but here here's the thing if if you but here's the thing the orance requires that that we do it that way I do want to talk about the that's the number that we need to have yeah absolutely and and the Nuance is if you have for example Starbucks always has their big circle and then they have the Starbucks word always separate they don't they never put it together and you know most ordinances most towns understand that and they approve that and they that's why they have limit on number of signs on the facade because you don't want to have a facade with more than four signs all over the place now if you took the A&M and Industrial and we split it I think uh the the town professional agree that we would to use two smaller r angles right um yeah we could call it two signs yeah put us over the edge yeah right right but but I think effectively from a ssiz perspective I just want that to be aware that we if we took that blank area subtracted it we'll be in that 260 foot so what is what is um actually there is it is it a giant like white rectangle with the letters or is it just the letters the way the ordinance asks us to measure the overall size in reality you have the rendering right yeah I think Channel cut letters it's not like a box with with letters on it is just the letters okay my question yeah so it's surface mounted there is actually no sign above that area right but the way the ordinance asks us to calculate we have to consider it we have to can you clarify when you did the measurement for the Turn Pipe distance where in the turnpike exactly was that uh well if you take it from the turnpike to the the to the no I know but I'm saying the turnpike is this thing that's like 150 feet wide so like what is the I'm probably underestimating is probably more I believe yeah I think that you had testified 390 feet that that seemed excessive to me actually it seemed more like it was more like 250 to the to the central line the center line between the two between going north and going south okay so after two sets of lanes and before the others you're going the other way between 250 and that's right yeah well so that's actually a pretty big difference 250 and then what did you say it was 3 I I measured 390 feet um to the I I don't remember exactly off the hand like but I think it was uh to the midpoint of the the lane how far what is the distance to the start of the turn we have that measurement it's like a little bit more than 150 ft to the edge to the absolute Edge okay L should I stand up might tell you how many attorneys it takes 80 feet and then well the the sign is on the South Side so do it from that so that's substantially different than the measurement that you guys that's the closest point it looks like that could be the 390 the we took it from the I think the midpoint of the highway if you took it from the mid point of Highway div in the middle of the ter that would make sense actual is about 330 worst case 20 approxim 220 330 so but for the sign of the person the applicant here today it's about 220 instead of 390 yeah I I I think I was trying to like maybe find another more realistic way for it to visualize how big that sign would be is if that actually you do a Google Earth view of the existing building right now and you look at the uh the window the second floor window the window height of the windows very similar to the height of the sign that we're going to have so you get a a better sense of that but well I mean that's that may be the case but what we have is a whole bunch of testimony based on like the math of 390 and we don't really know what it is for 220 but presumably it would be much it would be smaller than what it is at 390 can can I just say one thing and maybe Dynamic should testify because in their report they actually don't take into consideration the distance from the turnpike they take into consideration how faster traveling and they take into consideration um certain go ahead well the the letter height calculation takes into the distance of terik we use 250 for the southern side and 325 to the northern so right there the sign is based on the speed there's another component to that formula that involves how how many lanes you have to change when you see a sign oh look McDonald's I need to get over three lanes we ignored that because like you said this isn't really directional it's more advertising and that's how we got to the 288 this was all done after the signs were designed so it's not like we said 288 and he went to 306 but the dimensions of the South sign the bigger sign are 48 ft 7 in by 6' 3 in that's the 306 if you took seven in off and 3 in off so if you went 48 by6 that's 288 that's the number so we're talking about three inches and seven inches from 250 ft away it's I know the number itself goes from less than three times to more than three times but it's a very small difference from he's looking different that was just that was for visual reference actually application applications I Madam chairman I spoke to the client and I think based on Dynamics recommendation we we'll be willing to reduce the height of the sign by that seven inches so that we come in proportional to that 200 88 square foot because uh when we were talking about those little nuances it I don't think it's going to have that impact uh we'll still be able to see it but I think to your point you got this really good study there's some math behind it so we should stick to it and I think could stick to it and notal I would make it exactly hit 288 foot or [Laughter] L yeah I I'll reduce it so that so so that it's under within that number I think it's a great precedence that's set because if you're gonna allow that you don't want that ordinance to get out of hand and I think understand your point wait do does precence count or does it not count which let I I think I think Madame chairman is saying that if we set a precedence here we need some control and I do agree with he's being a wise guy it's 10 o'clock he's not I mean real world implication I'm also looking at an application we did a couple years ago with a sign which also it's sort of the other Dynamic where it was a it was a big logo with smaller wording on it and one of the implications for that was that you want it to you need it to look good for the big part of the logo and you also need to make sure it doesn't look too bad on the small part of the logo and I think you have kind of the same Dynamic here where the A&M is big and then the wording gets progressively industrial is much smaller and then the three words under underneath it are much smaller so I just want to make sure we don't go so small that you you lose the ability for that other those other bits and the other the other option could be you just put A&M and Industrial on there and you you skip the the three words underneath it or you just A&M because you just want to think about the scale so that that it actually you can read what's on there and it the point is what do you want it to read on there you want the exact logo and the with the other applicant they were Bound by a parent company in France that they could not change the logo at all you guys have the luxury that you are the you are so I mean just think about that and think about whether you need the entire logo in its entirety in its current form or whether the scale of it might be that those lower line of text might not be what you want I I don't know that I would have change that based on based on say but saying but if you come to a square footage then you may play Within that square footage and get I don't think we're at a point where we're gonna like not approve them and make them change the no no no but I'm just saying if we're sticking to a square footage then you you might think about playing with that the square footage yeah I think one of the bigger uh variances here is allowing signs on the same side of the building um I I don't I'm not sure how the board feels about that I mean the parking I don't I'm personally okay with it that's just my opinion I mean it is in the front yard it's right there on the turnpike di it's it's on the turnpike and in the interest of them developing a strong or continu a strong business I think it's important for them to be able to get a good tenant in there and a good tenant is going to look at that sign as one of the reasons to pay all the rent they're going to pay that's a good point so to me I would I would tailor my approval of it um to the unique circumstances of the location um the distance it is from the turnpike the fact that the turnpike is the front yard the fact that it's not impacting the streetcape as you spoke about earlier um all the little things that make it extremely unique wouldn't necessarily apply to another application I would still like it to go back to the 28 8 and not stay at the 306 just so that it so that there is justification uh problem did would you agree to that on Mike anything I was just to say I'm supportive of the two on one face I think the circumstances here because it's only two and there's nothing on the other three and because it's a very long View and I I really appreciate the elevation view because that does not look cluttered to me that looks very clean and I like the symmetry of the two entrances on either side of the sign over it so okay it looks it looks very good and I just I think that um I I I appreciate you all working with this board and the requirements that they put on you and um looks good yeah I think what you've heard from the applicant today a long family business they've been here about 10 years but they hope to have their head ofunity I would have to cont uh complement Dynamic engineering I was so impressed with uh you know who you've Affiliated yourself with they did such a thorough job you made those guys happy you put formulas in I was so excited um but I I really do think it was uh you know very well done it's really what we like to see um and I think we're ready to call a question we have a lot of not contingencies but a agement so are you guys do you either of you have any questions for them before we call the question but there are other design that were brought up in her letter there were I'm just curious if if we could go through if there are any that haven't been already addressed by the engineers because I think most of them have sure um sorry we can and Chris if sure and and Chris and tell me if there's something that you feel needs to be said that hasn't already been said but one okay Development Area should not include Wetlands buffer transition areas and flood plane areas and flood planes I think that was testified to by the first witness the engineer the necess the uh you know about it okay the next one is essentially um a repeat of a variance um we also have it in the design standards and this has to do with the parking the five spots being within 25 F feet of the um property line um then we talked about parking spaces being in the front yard that was already testified to this is again a design waiver um and then we talked about whether um parking because it's in excess of the requirement did you want to ask them to bank or or or refrain from over parking and I think they we discussed that I hope to the boards that satisfaction um then there was the parking areas with a capacity of 40 spaces requiring Landscaping that was testified too um by the engineer um and then okay all parking lots with a capacity of 40 more Vehicles should be designed to include pedestrian walkways throughout the lot constructed with pervious Paving systems I'm not sure if we did talk about that did you I don't I actually don't recall no I was not talking okay okay yeah I don't think that was testified too I think the rationale there is that civil engineers have designed for the storm water capacity of the site without including the prvious papers and that the purpose of a design standard like that is to ensure that storm water can be properly managed and we're doing it so in other ways fine by me fine by me fine by you and the uh site uh does not lend itself to uh pavers that would run water into the ground because it's more clay than it is sand so that one is H there's a need for a waiver there um the next one has to do with the size of the loading birth which I know is testified to and Andrew you're you're you're satisfied that it's okay they testified to the industry standards so yes um the loading areas loading docks are industry standard okay and then the other was the driveway located within five feet of the side property line and I believe that uh Chris you already testified to that um it's a design waiver it's not a variance and then um then we also talked about that the driveways for commercial or Industrial uses she'll be 30t wide for a 2-way operation they're have 23.1 but they testified to and Andrew concurred that this is really for ve uh motor vehicles and that that was just pretty di Minimus to the 24 feet requirement and so that that you were satisfied that that was okay correct okay that's it the first design waiver uh having to do with wetlands and transition areas it should be noted that they're only going into the transition areas not into the wetlands right which is again allowable by D using certain techniques and standards I have one more question and I just I'm sorry because I don't know that I understood it when it came came up kind of briefly about um Church Dwight and old they're taking care of old cleanup or something and what was it about water and possible how long do you know how long is church and Dwight going to help do that or like do you guys have to maintain testing things down the road so typically typically how it works and correct me if I'm wrong um so there's a a thing called natural natural attenuation where the contaminantes break down over time and each of the contaminantes have like a halflife depending on which type of contaminant is so slowly over time the contaminants get less and less contaminated and they monitor it over a period of time so that once it gets below the D threshold then they issue basically a permit that says hey this isn't contaminated anymore but it's still above the DP threshold so they're just waiting for the time so that it gets lower and lower and lower and then once it's below the DP threshold then they'll issue basically a a letter saying that's it's not contend anymore yeah from a legal point of view the property owner is not necessarily always responsible the responsible party in this case is is church and they are responsible and the lsrp is responsible to check every year that there's an appropriate funding source which can be a number of other things in case they disappear go bankrupt whatever that there's something in place to continue the monitoring as necessary for the duration of that uh period good question I move that we approve the application subject to all of the conditions and you know uh things that were accepted in the record you have a second I'll second there we go all right roll call Miss Anderson I agree approved Miss elwi yes Mr fronte yes Miss Jones yes Mr Stewart yes and Miss Bon yes thank you motion passed thank you all just for the purposes of the record I just want to make clear that since it wasn't part of the plan our requests that the generator pad and and um all that be included that is as listed on A3 and and who needs the panone color number thank you all for your time tonight thank you just uh just to Public Service when when you guys are leaving today Station Road is blocked don't go