e e e e e e e e e e good morning we're going to call this meeting to order it is 9:01 a.m. today is Wednesday May 8th we're at the Town Hall Chambers at 2731 Oak Street uh this is our regularly scheduled Fort Meers Beach management and planning session all Town C council members are present Town attorney Town manager if you town clerk yes thank you if I was trying to mute my phone or my uh my computer um if you please rise for the Pledge of Allegiance councelor Woodson is going to lead us to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liy and justice for all no public comment no all right items for discussion the first one is permitting Frankie good morning Council my name is Frankie kachik I'm the operations and compliance director for the town of Fort Meers Beach and uh I'd like to let you know that permitting is alive and well and we're doing a great job uh with the concept of the One Stop Shop at the front door uh as people come into the town hall the new town hall arrangement we have anyway um they're greeted by a peritech um that has gone over like gangbusters um the people that we have up there usually it's Ashley uh the young lady that sits up there or Brooke they do take turns um they have really taken hold of what the whole idea of white glove service means um we've answered all questions up front if we can't we get the professionals back um in our Our Community Development trailer I.E our planners zoners uh arrangers uh the building officials those type of things so we've gone from a system where you came into a triage trailer you had to sit and wait uh when you talked with somebody yes they they serviced you and got you going out the door to a system where you come into building and even if you have to wait momentarily we have a system in place where you're getting everything that you need before you walk out that door so we've made tremendous strides in in getting information to the public that way um what what is I know that we're looking at a planner what are some of the things that you're doing to even improve it more so we've got a couple of uh checks and balances so to speak uh in the past and as we know there's a few things that have snuck through the cracks as far as getting permitted in this town um it's going to happen it's going to happen in a perfect system but what we do now is we have a uh we've had on staff a pro permit man manager Andrew Gary um and we have a group of about seven permit techs themselves they interact on on a almost instantaneously every moment basis uh with questions going back and forth so Andrew a is that second set of eyes um and then if it goes beyond that then we get our our one of our planners uh involved whether it be Jason SMY Eli Kendra uh and that to kind of give it that that final perusal um we try to Andy and I try to stay engaged with them on a daily basis so we're we're staying ahead of not only the developments but also just the regular single family homes that are are going up currently uh we're we're also adding a lot to code enforcement so what we've done is we you all know um with Tom yazzo running that department now uh or overseeing I should say that department we've added uh Danny um as our uh code coordinator she came from pelis County uh she's currently face certified up to level four um and that's kind of what we wanted to do we wanted to set the tone right out of the gate that our code officers moving forward would all be State Certified that gives us a lot of provenance when you go in front of a magistrate or a judge uh that we know the rules of engagement we know how to properly preserve evidence those type of things in cases so they look at the officer just as much as they look at the material that's being presented uh so we've taken the guesswork out we've made sure that all of our officers are par none number one type candidates coming in so she's the overseer of the staff uh we brought in a gentleman uh out of Cape Coral Randy chel who's also a compliant code officer uh we just hired another lady who will be starting next week who's a certified code officer and uh with the help of our finance director and our town manager we were able to secure another full-time code officer filling out the rest of this fiscal year so we're going to have a lot of boots on the ground we're going to be doing things the right you've heard me from day one it's all about education so with more bodies out on the road doing the right thing we're able to educate the public more as far as how we build things from the ground up and how we take care of our properties seems to me that we were at one point talking about a software change is that corre still correct or where are we on that well currently we're still we're still using Eyeworks for a lot of it uh we had track it at one time which is a a a system that like Cape Coral larger communities have used track it has upgraded their systems to a point in we did not follow this goes back about a year and a half ago um and so what we'd like to do is as we get a little bit more settled in I'd like to revisit getting track it uh it just communicates a lot better with with Lepa and when a code officer is on a case you're able to pull up things like almost instantaneously and it would still work with Eyeworks as well okay thanks back in the back in the day when Steve papasi was here was before obviously you guys were here there was I was trying to talk to them you know going through when we first after the storm were going through some of the things the information within the permit port hole was very inadequate you would see a rejection letter and then you would all you would see is failed to comply with the boundaries of the permits or whatever it was there was really nothing specific and I had requested that we get more information if something is rejected it's a little bit easier to read as opposed to one line item and I and I've been looking through some permits lately and noticing we're still doing some of that on line item thing and and I think would be very helpful to the homeowners especially if they've hired contractors to do the work and they're remote living in you know their other Home up north to be able to follow along because I know all of us were probably getting a lot of calls and spent a lot of time checking on permits to try to help people get answers and I think if we could be more clear in the description of if it fails or what exactly we're looking for I know it takes a little bit more time uh there was talk about maybe gting someone that specifically that's all they do is you know but this was again back right after the storm but I think that's something that could be very beneficial through eyework system to be able to enter as much information as possible to save calls to staff emails to us and to you right um if they know clearly what it is that they're being rejected for and then they could call and obviously ask what do I need to I don't expect you to write a whole you know biography of of what the issue is and how to fix it but at least give more information than just it failed because one line you know yes sir we'll make sure that happens I think just to go off some things Frankie said one thing you you will see that we've done is we we've we''ve made a lot of changes in in the Code Compliance and even in the permitting with Staffing um that was important to me to be able to to just Elevate the level of um performance if you will in in those two areas of our organization and we have done that especially what we've done with the The Code Compliance because they they kind of they do work together because that's the extra set of eyes out there we even go to seven days a week with with Code Compliance so we've got those individuals as we fill those spots in actually we we have only one left over from the code department when I got here it's completely changed over so we we we do see and then of course we're requiring certifications and you know just as much as ordering Badges and doing the things that just changes the way that they feel and look at themselves about what they're doing and again Frankie talks about it a lot is compliance we're just looking for compliance we're not looking for f or I gotas this compliance I think another thing that could be beneficial you know right after the storm the vice mayor was doing some great videos and and sitting down and talking to people I think using our new Pio to her fullest extent to to help you know permitting seese the trends you know when you're building something you go through concrete then framing then you work your way through and as you start seeing an influx of those permits maybe having some sort of I don't want to say best practices but there's a lot of things that require a permit and some things that don't require permit and I think being able to get that messaging out so that people understand you know do I need a permit to replace one shingle do I need a permit to you know replace the latch on my gate do I you know there's going to be a lot of that I think coming forward and it has been coming but if you could just once a week or something get something out uh you know 30 second video of just a a good practice of you know what needs a permit what doesn't need a permit and why I think the public would would be would benefit from that yes sir I have a question um I'm I'm always driven by data I have you guys been able to capture and I know it's hard but I I think people always want to know how long is this going to take and before it used to take forever uh and now we're at the point where hey if I'm doing a new build I know it's if no variances it's going to take me x amount of weeks to get the permit through assuming it's done correctly do we yeah properly submitt it I know there's a lot of variables here but it it seemed like a year ago it it took what people said forever but what was that forever and what is it now and what is our goal so the Forever part was a lot of different things put into the mix one of the biggest things was having different eyes on a different Coast that did not live our life every day so a lot of the permit reviews a lot of the the building Plan reviews the the whole planning part of it was shipped over to the east coast prior to Andy and I getting here um we were able to not only along with the Jacobs group bring in a building official that's able to do reviews in house uh but also Andy's uh uh question a little while ago bringing in a planner for the town somebody that can actually do that and help with that inhouse we've been able to scool it down so a roundabout answer uh to your question we're kicking them out in two weeks Scott okay that's that's great if we can capture that data cuz you know a lot of the Realtors are trying to sell homes right the home buyers like how long is it going to take me to get uh if if I don't need a variance what can I expect and what what's what's your goal and then if they need a variance how long will that process take and depending on the variance okay so of course right and and and and again we through Council we've try of package that up we tried to change that a little bit to exped that part of the question as well so all these these factors combined will really help get the process moving in a lot faster generation we already see a lot of building starts I can tell um show the report that we put together for the town manager each month as a directorship you know our new building starts for just single family homes is up the last two months compared to where it was the last 6 months so we're starting to see a lot of shovels in the ground a lot more houses getting raised up built whatever the case may be and and and so we're turning those things the new ones that have come in in the last few months we're kicking those out the door complete explained to that homeowner or to that contractor in record time and Scott I think I can help you out a little because it was before they were there they were here it's when Chris and and Keith were here MH and just you know they were obviously like you guys were when you first started they were bombarded with just sure drinking yeah so I was trying to help on the back end of the permitting side and looking through some things our processes that we had back then were Antiquated to say the best and I'll give you a perfect example you know the first thing we saw were demo permits people wanted to come through with demo permits well when you go to the town website you would click on demo permit and there would be something that you would sign and you would think that you were done and you'd submit it and then it would come in it would take four or five days whatever it would go back and say well you need this then they would fill that out which is in a different part of the website and then they'd send it in and then four or five days and then like nope you need this so there were three documents and I'm like why wouldn't if I click on demo permit everything I need should be right there right and then what added to that on a bigger scale was to your point it was going across and if it was a flood review they would send it to flood they would review it deny it then they'd fix everything and then would go to environmental or whatever then they would review it and deny it and say so it was always back and forth and when Jacobs came in it was very important that they understood that it should be a one review and that's how they do it in Bonita and I think that's how they're doing it here now it goes through the entire review process if it fails environmental if it fails flood whatever it fails you get it all back in one rejection letter so you could fix it fix five things that dramatically changed how fast people were getting I don't know if you guys are getting but you get emails like I submitted my new house permit and I got a back in 12 days yeah I mean people are starting so I think they they've but to your point I think the data is important to see I'd like to see monthly where where we are what came through the average time it took to to get that submitt if if we can get that through the Eyeworks we can capture that and we can get that to you that's part of our our our monthly report to the town manager and I know he shares that as well so um yes we can specifically get you that as far as start to finish we call that a perfect packet so in in the grand scheme of things if you get a hand out of a handful of permits for new starts if you get one out of a handful is a perfect permit that's awesome the other ones aren't challenging at all even with a variance you can still walk the people through there's things that you can get moving right away that in the past they weren't even able to open that door until you came and got that variance right you know we're trying not to to penalize somebody for having an obscure lot uh size or or something like that um our job here is to not only get the house up but get it up safe and get it up so we have a safe Community moving forward and uh that's kind of what we've we've stried to do from day one Vice May so volume wise I'm sorry I just want where are we volume wise for like say for the new builds how many new builds redo remodels I think we're in in in the area of around uh I want to say last month it was close to 150 new starts wow just in that month what's our total now um I don't have that handy but I can definitely get that to yeah I think that'd be good information for you know to to let the town know hey there's 150 new homes being built or 350 new homes and that that will help in our planning too because you know as more people come back I I can tell you this much without giving you a number that from December till now um not even going back just to the first year from December till now we're we're kicking it in this town uh you know I I mentioned to all of you long time ago that when we get those complaints about pilings going in on a Sunday afternoon at 4:00 you know we kind of know that we made it well we're not there yet but you can go up and down every single Street and every single Street in this town is touched by new construction of some sort and fashion what you just said sparked something in my head I don't know if you guys got there was a there was a resident that complained about work being done on a Saturday and a Sunday yeah it's like seriously and that's in our code is that something that we need to look at to because if we're under the state of emergency do is that because technically they're right you know but in order to allow people that can or want to work on a Saturday is that something we should take a look at or a Sunday or a Sunday well yeah maybe not I don't know some people deserve so your your point councelor Safford in April there were 296 new permits 13 of those for new single family homes and over 1,950 inspections wow that's great yeah people don't have we if we keep driving that data I think it'll give people a lot of Hope and then it'll help us too as as we're planning we're going to know there's going to be you know 400 more people leaving here in x amount of time and do you have once they once shovels go on the ground I know it has a lot to do with with the uh with the builders and whatnot and you know money and everything else but um once that permit's done what's the average home build right now do we know what that is when when you do final final Co from the day you again we have we have various of properties being built back so we have everything from the the the very modest single family home um some of these ones that are coming in here I don't want to say prefab but the modular type that are being elevated up um they're very fine very solid construction uh to the more custom type home so it kind of does depend on the build somewhat but it it's it's it can be easily tracked and easily correlated and and put on a spreadsheet for you okay great so when does this planner start I know we are finalizing negotiations now so we s the letter to her yesterday waiting for a response I know what I wanted to ask I'm sorry that's okay go ahead um keep thinking of these things so I'm hearing and I think everybody hears um nightmare stories about Builders and construction people and people that are not getting it done fast enough or they just don't show up for 3 weeks or something like that is there any way to quantify or and I know we had a builder list out there that I think is so out of date right now is there any way we can give warnings to people or well what we do is if somebody does have a problem with a with a contractor or a builder we definitely want them to reach out to the town we will notify the the Florida Department right uh but we do not we cannot be in the business of recommending Builders we have a we used to have a list of I believe licensed contractors in the area that people could look at and and again you have to be a licensed contractor to work on a home right um and so that that's one thing that we did but we we're we're not in the business of recommending contractors and we we just can't no but as far as updating our list of licensed contractors you give us the information we'll make sure that that gets put in an updated list yeah I mean I'm more of on the side of not recommend amending and letting people know that where there's been issues right and I think we have a couple of places yeah we have a couple places on our web page in the community development that do let homeowners know it to be where um you know not to go by uh somebody stopping in the Walmart parking lot saying hey I got a bunch of Windows I can put in for you for $500 right you know it again we talk about being talking about it has to be a licensed contractor be aware of that n Nancy if I may is what's our liability of saying hey you know ABC contract don't use them buy beware I mean is that something that we would we would just basically be encouraging them to to use licensed contractors because unlicensed is right right um what I did want to add was um Paul Waters who's one of our attorneys with the firm am I on yeah okay um anyway he used to be um the deputy secretary at um the what is it Florida Department of Business regulation so he's very knowledgeable of contractor licensing he recently spoke at a seminar and there's little things that people could be aware of and one thing that really stuck in my mind was if you are licensed under state law you have to have your license on your truck on your vehicle and it's an easy way to spot an unlicensed contractor they may say hey I'm licensed and insured and you look at their vehicle if it's not there it should raise a red flag so there's a few things like that and I can work with Paul and send that information um and that would be kind of information just getting giving it out to the public right Y and that's very good and and and to answer uh or to a question that was asked earlier about how we can update our information on on the town web page our Pio and with the help of Andy have been going through and we are updating a lot of that stuff so on Community Development there was like a whole Litany of frequently asked questions most of which are out or didn't lead you anywhere except down another Rabbit Hole so we're going through those item by item and and looking at ones that are not only more relevant but more pertinent and they group things together like you said with the Demolition permit Mr Mayor uh making sure that it's all concise compact One Stop Shop if we can do it coming in the front door we can do it on our web page and our portal as well very good vice mayor yeah this is been an excellent discussion when I originally asked for this to be put on the M&P calendar what my Hope was is that we would have somebody from permitting team here is is Andrew available or I I can definitely get Andrew G up here could we do you mind because I just not that you guys have been doing great but you guys are he's he's on the front lines right yes are you comfortable having him more than I hate to use the word testify but you know yeah no no no I I think you'd get a good good discussion from him as well great I just have a few questions for him but in the interim uh just a couple additional sort of broader questions anecdotally and I think I think I think it's real uh the number of complaints about permitting has has dropped dramatically to to to the town's credit is there a way for us and I've talked to the Jacobs group folks about this and I know our system is not tailored as best as it can be in terms of how to do this but can we can we actually have a a dashboard that where we have some metrics that because there's still there's still rumors that there's backlogs you hear all this stuff is is there any way we could have a dashboard on our website that says hey we're we're turning these around in two weeks or less you know you know the ones that are submitted correctly Etc and uh uh is there a way we can sort of make that public so it's so it's data driven and not more nor not so much story driven or or anecdotal yes sir by all means we can definitely get that out whether it would be on the Community Development portal or or part of it or just on our town web page weekly um this is what we've got working this is what came into the office this week this is what we've turned out um and these are the categories that correlate to that I just want to I want to have a d a datadriven answer I mean the mayor makes he says this every week he says listen the number of and he gets a lot of them like we all get some of them but he gets a lot of them the uh the complaints about permitting and and he's declared and I I I certainly see it as well that the the complaints are almost non existant at this point not that there's not problems but they really it's been dramatic but that's anecdotal and and you still still hear folks out and about in the on the in the Coconut telegraphs it's re recanting these rumors that there's still months back logs and it's clearly it appears not to be the case but if we can show that on our dashboard you know because when you're measuring success I mean I I think that's that's important to have it be data driven so I think that would be great um and and and this concept of and you guys kind of came in Midstream but I think the turnaround really occurred under your Administration the the the the putting the premier team to assembling the premier team the bringing in the Jacobs group and bringing a lot of this inhouse addressing issues up front uh when people submit uh is there and I know there's not one Silver Bullet but is there one change that you all have made that has produced this this this this radical paradigm shift or has it been the combination and I guess that that's an easy you'll say It's a combination thing I get that but is there one more than others that has made the turnaround happen absolutely I think we've empowered some of our staff to make decisions and to do things where they didn't have to keep asking questions say hey what's going on Andrew is a perfect example of that here okay and you know just just we elevated him and we're like make decision you we have your support because he's knowledgeable he he's the front line he's not actually the front line but he's as close as you get you know we've empowered the the the the the planners and the department to to make decisions before we got here they were always coming to us asking the questions like why are you ask and it and it to us the answer was obvious they knew the answer cuz we'd say what's your answer and then they would get like okay tag you're it go go do it so we just empowered them I mean you can bring in a thousand people but if they're still asking the same questions FAQs the list gets long it's it's where they were I look we all know what was happening you know two days after the storm three days after the St three weeks after the storm that get it out there everybody's asking qu just dump knowledge to people and we and great and then the questions got this long and all add another question add another question so it's like pair that down empower the staff empower the whole staff I mean it's just you know Joe came not to get off subject but the but the budget and the finances and thing go tag your it we needed to do that and empowering staff all the staff and we alluded to it on Monday in in the review that that my style is to empower them I can't don't want to make all the decisions I don't have that much time you you guys were getting the emails it's like you don't have that much time you got lives as will so Andrew if you come forward and introduce yourself first of all thank you for all that you've done and continued to do Jim before you jump back to what you were saying about that dashboard you know I think I love I love that idea is there a possibility to break it out between residential and Commercial and the reason I say that is because when we many people don't understand or don't know that when it's commercial it also involves a fire review that's a good point so I think it's important to in that dashboard show it's approved by the town it's now in Waiting or whatever in for Fire review because sometimes when we get emails and you you find out it's a condo which falls under the the commercial permit and some of most of the time it's just waiting for a review it's not the town it's the fire sometimes it's the town holding it up but sometimes it's the fire district so I think it's important to make that distinction just so that we know who to give the information to to contact this is who you need to reach out to to get the answers to your question yes sir Andrew would you mind stating your name and title and how long you've been with the town and where you came from um I'm Andrew Gary Permitting Services manager I'm with the town coming up on 5 years in February and I'm originally from New Jersey and you've been with the town for five years yeah about four and 3/4 and you've been in permitting all this time yes so I'll ask you the question I just asked Andy and Frankie what do you see the is the main reason for the amazing turnaround in in the permitting process and from your perspective um me one of the biggest is having in-house plan review that really turned it around for us I I feel um it went from weeks to a matter of days uh to get it completed um so that's and also they're on site so they can come and talk to them it's not a person that's up north Florida or whatever so I think that's a big great let me ask you this Andrew uh you and your team and I know the questions today are probably different than they were 18 19 months ago what's the most common question questions you're getting from folks coming into this these trailers like the biggest thing is uh owner Builder so they're not familiar with the permitting process um so they come in they have a lot of questions um it's not so much the contractors although there is questions from them as well but it's the owner builders that like I said are inexperienced at it and they need to be taught on how to process a permit and how to go through applying for it is there one specific question that they have that's common or they it's just a l have questions it's a Litany of questions especially from the owner Builders um like I said because they don't know from the beginning how to even start what advice would you give someone who wants to do an owner Builder permit come on in um we have somebody always here always ready to help um normally they process things online all our permits go through our uh permitting portal but they come in we'll we'll scan the documents for them we'll do all that we'll process it for them so we have enough staff now to do that if somebody come if someone what did have some questions for your pering division what's your advice to them should they physically come here should they send an email should they call what's the best way for them to interact with your team um email is pretty quick we're fast on the turnarounds on email it's really whatever is more convenient to them um so we we have there was a time where you just don't you shouldn't call because that wasn't efficient but it sounds like you in your preference at a perfect world email or come in in person or or in a perfect world I emails okay because they're easy to process but um if they have a lot of questions it's probably better that they come in personally y if you if I could just jump in real quick because it goes right along what you're asking about owner bur Builder permits I've had some people reach out some who are trying to go through it now some who have been caught doing the work and now trying to go back to get the permit right if maybe it's a a Nancy answer just a quick brief overview of who qualifies for an owner permit you some talk about well it's a rental property and it's an NL LLC does that qualify that I could I own the property but I have it in an LLC it's a duplex Triplex whatever and I want to rebuild it myself under my owner Builder permit do they are they allowed to do that or not allowed I just think it's important for people to understand what who can get an order verment who can't yeah I don't Rec I don't know right off hand but I think didn't we go through whether a trust talk about a trust yeah as long as it's a a revocable trust they can do it right um the LLC can't they need to hire a contractor that's what I wanted to get at is they have they can't be an older Builder if it's if it's in an LLC they can't get an older Builder but in a trust it can and that depends on the trust so so if I could go back to what Andrew said about the email we are finding now that we're going through this FEMA process that we're going through that a narrative is what they're looking for so we prefer the emails then we respond and it creates that narrative with the property that goes becomes part of the feem of documents creates a record correct because if we just making phone calls obviously we can't it's not a public record and we have to re reinvent everything and we don't want to rely on our memories we want to make sure we have the documentation and email is always the best way when they ask our questions we respond and then it becomes part of the FEMA documents as we go through the this process not now but it'll come back later and since we're on that just basic question Andrew if someone was had a permanent question and and they wanted to email you what's the best way to email you is that is that email address on the website yes my email is as well as the building permits email do you prefer going to the general bir building permits email or you prefer going to your email how do you well I mean if it's something they have a specific question they want to speak to a manager or anything like that I prefer they send it to me but if it's a general question they could send it to building permits that's helpful um what what's the most common mistake you see in your shop uh incomplete applications um give an example of a common mistake in terms of what they leave out sure just something like uh the owner acknowledgement um they won't put a uh address job address or they'll forget to sign it um we just started uh incorporating notorized that in late terms getting our uh documents notorized you mean mean we didn't require it now we're requiring it again well we used to and then when after the storm we waved it yep just to process things quicker but now we're putting it back in because we found a few times that people are forging signatures so to stop that we that's good information because I think I don't think people realize that so now you now the documents have to be notorized when they when they previously didn't yes okay do we have a notary here in I'm a not almost everybody I know Jason's a notary yeah okay and uh the public should know that because they yeah you know right yeah they used to have to go to Fort Meers yeah I tell everybody you can come here and get it done free um another thing about the owner Builder U commercial properties they can do owner Builder but up to $75,000 in repair well that's good information MH so these condo unit owners we actually if we take them in I actually have the uh building official Joe he'll review it make sure everything's okay and then uh see Andy this is what I was referring to and Frankie that this kind of information as you're seeing things come in having those weekly video clips of this is what we're starting to see here's the data that you know we want to make sure you get out there because then all of us can push it out to everybody that we know and it spreads pretty quickly as we all know how the social media monster works and and to your point Mr Mayor this all came through through our meeting that we had with the um HOA presidents um and Joe was at that meeting Joe spec was at that meeting and we took all that information in and slowly by slowly as they started coming coming back online you know as you all know we're still a long way away from having our condos up and running but as they do start coming online more and more we're getting lack of a better term Bevy of uh unique situations one of which you have to be always be flexible you have to kind of think outside the box having a building official that that's right there that we can make those decisions having key staff like Andrew and his wealth of knowledge we're able to do that on the Fly we're able to get those people their answers immediately medely so they're not waiting weeks to put drywall back up into their unit or to put carpeting back in their unit those type of things we're able to to do that right away and to your point we will make a habit of putting that out there so to to kind of tie into the Strategic plan um once we set our goals um you will set that high level goals and then we'll we'll start breaking it down but all this reporting you know documenting it's it's all somebody's responsibility to make sure that we're working toward those goals but we we we will you know performance measures and tracking and all that is so important we do it now but but we don't capture it in a performance evaluation so we're we're we're continually improving in the area and things like that where somebody's assigned that task we're working more toward that and and I'm you know we started what a week two weeks ago uh and and now we will continue to build on that as as we continue and we've got a line item here you know um FMB priorities you know that's kind of ties into all that as well so Andrew last question sure please please know you're here just to we're trying to get information out great I'm happy to be here we're not here to we're very thankful for your service and you you've done an amazing job you and your team thanks so if since you have the microphone and there's actually quite a few people who watch these uh and I think it's also uh simoc cast on beach talk radio so we got a lot of people who watch this you're on the front lines your team on the front lines you see what's coming in every day is there any basic advice you'd like to give folks or anything you want to kind of help people understand about your process so they can better utilize your process um I think the first thing is if you're going to apply for a permit is to read the documentation read the application through um there's so much information on the permit applications uh we'll get calls with questions and those answers are on the the application themselves so I think a big part of it is educating yourself and and reading through those documents um the second part is just go online and and process it and again if you have questions you can call email come in um we're always here happy to help and um that's about it we we're pushing them out really quick right now so the turnaround time is probably one of the quickest in Southwest Florida um so I I don't think there's a problem you know with any of the permitting it's just getting it right and uh the first time that's awesome thank you for your your service okay thank you thanks Andrew thank you to to your question vice mayor this doesn't happen without people like Andrew just plain and simple so we can sit up here and we can pontificate all we want you have to have somebody carrying it out and have the knowledge to carry out everybody in that Community Development trailer works as a team from the moment they punch in till the moment they leave even when they leave going out to the parking lot I've heard many times of them still talking about dealing with a customer or how they could do it is through osmosis they share all the information um together and they work on stuff together uh one instance a little while back and I don't mean to take up your time uh we needed to have a title search the person that normally did that job one person wasn't here they took it upon themselves to find out how to do it and every single person in that department knows how to do it without us interacting or anything that's great that's the quality of employees at the town of Fort Myers Beach has you're never taking up our time when we're talking permitting so so this is all good thank you though and I will tell you and I and I know Vice may all and and probably councelor safford's been on the LPA too that this is the first time in as long as I've been involved that we haven't been spending the majority of our day answering permitting emails so it's nice to it's nice to be able to see constant you know we've seen both sides of the spectrum if you will and it just it just shows that if you work together that you can really make things much smoother for everyone so it is definitely a breath of fresh air so congratulations to your your your team like Andrew and all those guys and thank you for Jacobs and looking forward to the new planner mayor can I say something absolutely thank you um so um I just wanted to say too that I have really appreciated working with your staff um there has been a huge change a big difference um working with them from when we first got here to where we are today and it's always a pleasure to work with them and to be here so I just wanted to commend them as well from our perspective because we have a little different perspective than than others May so we're feeling the difference too good thanks anything else on this item John you good I'm good all right next we have impact fees I asked to have this put on here because I think we're at a key stage in our Evolution where this is something we really have to take a look at so I I know that there's a study in here I don't know if Andy or Frankie you want to or not a study but the proposal and the the the reason for impact these how they can be beneficial um your pizza's [Laughter] ready you know with all the new development that we've got going on um and if you can also touch on the fees I know that we got a fee schedule coming up we're going to be talking about and I think we can really address some of these issues but um just kind of explain a little bit about the impact fees how they work and and how we can Implement them through what's been proposed by access yeah so what we did is we asked the access group to put together uh Jason Green and Sarah Pro to to put together a a a packet so to speak of how we could one Implement better in the community not only on the commercial side residential side but also on the on the commercial side especially with new developments coming in the area um as we all know there's a lot of communities when you come in as a developer that's that's a given uh Fort Myers Beach was not that way uh Fort Mars Beach hooked up many big Resorts many big condo units just for the sake of hooking them up uh without really capturing what they needed to to help prolong life of their utility system their infrastructure things like that impact fees have to be looked at two different ways they have to be looked at as as a benefit to the town to keep the town in business so to speak to provide those services but also to keep everything Reliant and safe if if we're asking a contractor to hook up a huge Resort into our system we don't know what they're doing impact fees are are like that permit type thing if I can kind of cross or correlate the two it allows us to make sure that it's doing done done properly and by by putting those fees in place um I'd give a good example we had a a development here on the beach um it was a local establishment they had two rental units above the the new proposal as it went through was the commercial establishment below and a single family home above the square footage was the same so when you go to look at the impact fee for that building staff immediately said oh it's a commercial development we got to do this it's like no we're we're only looking at they had the commercial development below that's a given the space above didn't change all that was a common wall was taken out the same square footage relies on it so what we do is if you had that place before you get credited for those impact fees moving forward so after a disc discussion with staff and Sarah and whatnot we all came to the understanding of that's how we need to move forward impact fees to a new resort are totally different we go by square footage we go by size we go by density and and what they're impacting on to the town so with this study and what we asked access to do was to give us a basis look at other communities and how they approach it how we needed to update our system which for all intensive purposes either was non-existent or or very clasical at best and make it more uni form across the board so as we started looking on the commercial side or the residential side we know what we're doing there as far as impact fees go the commercial side was always a little bit more ambig ambiguous so so as as as we looked at this thing we we tried to develop a system that gave us the room to grow as we grow um you start out a baseline we're going to start in here and in year two or three as development really starts picking up you have the steps and the wherewithal within the system to start moving your your your system up so that was the the precipice or or whatever is the top of this thing that we were looking at as far as the plan itself I think um if you look on your packets they did break it down yes quite a bit um as as far as we go I I I honestly think it's something that's very well needed for the town to take us that next step and then just so people that don't understand how how do those how do those impa impact fees be how are they spent what is it what are some of the common things that they go into once you collect them from a Comm prop a good example like if we're a commercial property U if we're putting impact fees on for for water it stays in water it it grows our utility department it grows not only the infrastructure that we have within the utilities like our water portable water that we have on the island but it it gives us the wherewithal to enlarge our employee base and get better equipment get better services on the island as far as tanks those type of things so it it gives you the opp operating wherewithal to do those things impact fees usually stay within a set segment so they're not coming in and I guess I guess what I was just trying to get at is there are specific buckets you could put it in that is correctly that is correctly water just kind of a short answer of what they can be used for one one thing and and Nancy can probably speak better this but if you look in here one of one of the points that made that if our impact fee study is more than 5 years old it can be challenged in court which means they say it it's Antiquated I'm notay paying anything and now you're tied up in CT paying litigation fees and things of that nature so it's it's the study is a critical component of establishing a good in uh impact fee program right and again like we had talked about and you all know it it was hit or miss at best over the last few years even before Ian um and uh we need to have a bit more uh reliable way of of treating everyone that comes on this island whether it's just a little mom and pop retail spot or it's a huge Resort everybody has to pay their fair share and it's safe to say it commercial development expects it they they totally understand impact and and the County's been collecting them forever um so we're not doing anything that's outside the realm of what people no sir so my next question is is we've got a lot of developments coming Nancy how does it work as we go through this we approve something that they come back with how can you retroactive that to a certain or does it just start from the date of no it it start from the day of but again having that study completed and I don't know offhand what the timeline is it says yeah okay well does the when does the clock start when after we approve it or once they ordinance in place okay so if if a development comes in they and we approve it and we don't have impact fee today in place then then you can't assess it wow just wow I'd say we need to get going on ASAP that's why I wanted it I think at this point Y sorry of a question regarding the the the the study that we're having done will the study also include impact fees that are currently in place by other municipalities in other words other other governing districts because I understand the fire department has an impact fee I hear rumors that the county has various impact fees already that people on Fort Meers Beach pay can we get can we have that data included in the stud yes I know Jason Green who is really spearheading this it is in that report somewhat uh he does break it down a little bit and he talks about other municipalities but he's also captured everybody in this area when I say everybody I think he took that ring out almost uh 75 square miles from Fort Meers Beach and reached out to those and did a case study of what they charged coming in coming out and what they coreless to us yeah what I'm trying to understand is when when when either commercial residential develop uh developer builds project on Fort Meers Beach what are they currently paying now in other words what are they what's the fire department what's the county getting what are the various I think the county has a Litany of different ones potentially they do I'd like to see a breakdown of what those are and then what we would be adding to that with if we decide to put an impact fee in place we can get that information so we can have an aggregate picture of everything y I think you know the next step is to put this on the next agenda that's fine with that information as well so you see what happen you certainly have my consent to do that as long as we have I just have a question when you look at the fees and expenses that are proposed I mean is this something is are any parts of this negotiable do you see this as pretty normal fee structure or is it high is it below I where are we with that from my experience it looks pretty industry standard um you know you could always go out for bid and start asking those questions and then that then then there's cost involved that the intangible cost that waiting 30 to 45 to 60 more days to select and we're already could be two months into this process and it could be a cost savings that you really don't realize because you're not we don't usually track Joe and I talk about intangible cost all the time we don't track the cost of doing business sometime and that would be that was my next question is one do we we don't have to send this up for bid because we already have access as a professional service um yes they okay yeah they've already been um competitively bid and they're on um our our list so we can do a test okay the next question is I assume this would come out of the building fund the the payment for this would come from permitting fees things like that yes sir okay any other questions or comments okay I think you try to get on the next got it all right next is FMB priorities this you Randy this for council's request actually yeah I I'll I'll uh I'll I'll lead it off one thing I've done is i' I've looked at one other Beach Community and I think what we really want to do is is schedule and a followup to our strategic planning um for instance there's one Beach Community where um I used not where I used to be but before um and they what they what they identified for instance was quality of life Public Safety Local Economic Development sustainability you know those type things as the the high level things which then everything else will be derived from and I think that's where we've got to be probably sometime in this is what May 8th probably by the end of the month or the 1 of June to to get do this Strate strategize again to start establishing those goals maybe in our individual conversations that we have the next couple weeks we'll start bringing those together I'll I'll get more together for you and I think it's going to be more of a one-on-one here's what here's what I'm seeing around um with towns Beach communities I I don't think we compare ourselves to you know Arcadia I think we you obviously we we'll compare ourselves to beach communities fortunately or unfortunately I've I've managed three of them so I they're all a very similar Dynamic there's not a lot of difference between those so so not Reinventing the will drawing off what other other people have already done we will work from that and so I think it um starting next week as we have our individual meetings and and we we talk I I want to just have this as one of the subjects we talk about I know there's you know with July fast approach I'd like to have some of this zeroed in probably by the second meeting in June so then we can have that out there right here's here's the next stop and working with an an Angela yeah um you know talking to her a little bit um and and my staff that helps me start now formulating as we go through the budget process and we look at our next fiscal year obviously this is going to take a a couple of months we won't have it prepared probably as we prepare the budget now but we'll be able to implement some of it going into the fiscal year with our new reviews and our accountability our performance measures that type of thing so I just wanted to just bring you up to speed that I I continue to to drive this and continue to um and and and again let me just uh point out something they they did zero in Omission statement in a in core values a vision statement that type of thing we'll start doing some of that as well um and basically on all of theirs they they only had a couple of goals which is really good because then you you can get too um too spread out if you will and then things just dangle out there we want to be very focused on what we want to attack uh in a positive way infrastructure um Quality life I mean it's it's just a broad subject and then we can fill in the the blanks behind that so um I'll just be bringing this more it's really and staff and I have already talked about especially Joe and I we've talked a lot about that and I've explained the system that I'm familiar with is like it's it's it's like a Golden Threads system you know we want to be we want to be the The Benchmark we want to be the town that everybody from legal to to to sanitation you know Beach pickup cleanup everything the whole kit we want people to look at how we do it because you know that what I'm trying to accomplish as a lot of towns don't do you saw the last one it was more task oriented we need to be more goal oriented and that way we can get there faster and more people are held accountable it's the whole team there'll be 80 people working 80 plus people working to accomplish the four or five goals that you will set that's a big deal and the way that I've seen it is is it could be uh you know the quality of life when let's just use that I know that's a broad brush we we we paint with a lot but everybody sitting right there all those directors and they will all have something to do with that and their staff will there'll be some like infrastructure well actually you know your Finance director has something to do with infrastructure you know so so everybody will have something to do with these Golden Threads and the golden thread kind of weaves through and it just strengthens you know golden thread it's pretty strong by the way it's just you know I'm not using that just because never held one but it is it's very strong and we want to make sure that we we just weave everything together and everybody's accountable and it it really changes the way staff looks at it and and Frankie mentioned it and I've heard it too people staff talking about things after they're clocked out they're going out outside and stuff they still talk about what they did or what they're doing it's a mindset and we're trying to establish that and said Karen and I have talked about it since the first minute we looked at each other in the interviews about strategic planning and goal setting and mission and vision statements and things like that I just think we are going to set that bar pretty high I'm really excited I'm really it you know I'm getting old so this is like that one I really want to go out on a really high note and you know really set that bar where it's like wow you know let's get these staff members every time they talk about public works or they talk about Finance they're going to come our staff members and say can you come talk to us or you it that's real I think too much of it gets left behind and unfortunately it's happening on P post disaster something that got our attention right you know something that brings everything to the surface and now you've seen that strategic plan um the manager shouldn't be the name beside every every goal every um um action every task it shouldn't be me I mean that's some but a tier one would be this level but actually it could be a tier two or tier three could actually still be this level it doesn't necessarily mean it's the lowest per the lowest employ I use that term very L I don't mean that in a bad way but the entry level employ could be have a big part to play in a in a specific task one we just have to to formulate that and get the right goals in place and that to me it's pretty exciting I never thought I'd get that excited about this kind of thing but it's like we've we've got an opportunity you guys have given me an opportunity and I think we will continue to to grow and I think in the next 365 days um before my contract expires we will we will we will have this accomplished in a half that time and you'll see you'll start to see how we tie everything together and how big a part you play in that very good questions for John none none PR mayor no thank you Karen I'm good thanks got so do we want to set some goals right now or no I think we need to have individual conversations and in between now and next week just start thinking about things and I'll have some things we'll put out in front of you I mean you know it's it's it's pretty basic but again let's let's let's start I think you know vice mayor talks about you know the the 10,000 ft and not getting too granular let's get way up here and say okay if we could if we're and we are we are developing a a new town basically and how are we setting this new town up and I think we this gives us a great opportunity but do we need to look at dates for the whole group of us to meet again I think um or you want to do this other first yeah I want to do this other first and then we'll look at your calendars on those dates and see what when people are free and just kind of next week we'll zero in um you know you and I can talk I know you're we got some things planned soon so um we'll get it figured out get something done in June for sure okay very good next is the bicycle pedestrian plan so I think this was kind of a group yep thing um to talk about the bicycle ordinance and as well uh the inside the the package is a study an no study that was done from 2017 and I think if you've read through that there's really a lot of good information a lot of it is obviously no longer relevant but and you can see some of the things that have played out from the vision from that no study but there's still some gaps in there I think there's things that could be done so do we want to attack the the bicycle ordinance first and then look into the who who's comfortable with that well I'll I'll just start yeah I I'll just start and I you know there's been the discussion with you know ebikes on the sidewalks and and whether they should be or shouldn't be and and I tell you I get more emails and conversations from people that no longer can ride a a bike that doesn't have some sort of pedal assist they they need that whether it's surgery whether it's age whatever it is they need that assistance to be able to to get around and they would like to go from the south south end to the north end but they don't feel safe riding in the bike Lanes or they don't feel safe uh on the road so they they they choose to take the sidewalk but now we're afraid that they're going to get a ticket for doing it um and it just encourages more people to drive it it does incl you know and I think if we if if we truly want to follow what that study laid out if we truly want to be a bicycle uh uh walkable friendly Island and there are I'll bring it up in a little while there sort of that you can actually get to say that you are that I think it's a goal We should strive for but it starts with this ordinance and and I think to the vice mayor has always said this it's hard you know you're always going to have some bad actors out there and I think to create policy for a couple of Bad actors most people know what they're doing most people will be considerate most people will do the right thing so to punish them or to the mass versus the bad couple couple of actors to me has never really made sense I think there's a way that you can allow this to to be a multi-use path on the sidewalk maybe it's and that's the discussion we'll have maybe it's just one section of the island where there's no bike paths but um or the beach to me that why can't you ride a bike on the beach I just that that's to me where you would want to try to that's where I would ride that's where I ride I mean any that's ever written out there early in the morning and watch the dolphins swim right along it's beautiful so but now again not everyone can do that without some sort of assist they're not doing 25 mph down the you know down the sidewalk or down the beach for that matter so I would I'm certainly open to getting rid of that part of it and if it's in part of the air Island where there's no bike Lanes or that's a discussion we have but that's kind of my two cents on it then I think we have to make sure though with e with any motorized vehicle on the sidewalk that has they have to go through traffic because it's you know they if you're going to go north you got to be um you got to be heading north you can't be the flow of traffic I'm sorry because I I've seen it where you know you look this way and here comes a guy flying on his bike and boom and it's a safety thing but if if we can make it that they go with the flow of traffic and you know safety first as always but you know we're hearing countless people we've got them on the island they want to spend money on the island they don't want to cause traffic and they they choose to either drive and cause traffic or go somewhere else and and it's just doesn't seem to make sense to me we need to really visit this yeah I mean if people don't feel safe and I understand there's some Walkers that don't feel safe but there's more seems to me at least from the communications I've had there's been more bicyclists who don't feel safe especially in the area where there's no bike Lanes um that get up on the sidewalk and they don't care if they're going to get a ticket or not so but they're also consider it they're not going 25 M they're you know they have bikes that the only way you get any power is if you pedal and it's just that little bit of assistance they need to to to be able to get where they're going if you're right I mean it is flat Island but when that wind's blown in your face it's it can be difficult so let me go ahead John let me ask you this um because we've both been we've all been getting I'm sure uh both sides of the argument folks that are walking don't feel safe with these uh ebikes or things on is this something we could set as say a year get some data driven um and come back and revisit it and maybe that will help put some folks uh Minds at ease it's not a bad idea I I did at the public safety meeting uh ask the the fire chief for data and and they really didn't have any data right so I think to your point yeah if it's a change that we make you know keep the data on it for the next year and and revisit it and you know see see what see what we find thank you I mean can we Implement speed limits on the sidewalk according to the L lcso there that's not how the radar guns work I mean you can do it you just can't it's hard to enforce enfor yeah so I mean they can't the way the radar works it it can't pick up at least that's how it was explained to me so right it's a good great idea and concept but that it it wouldn't work if I could I I as both a walker on the sidewalks Runner and biker on the sidewalks I I wanted to ask ask the town attorney uh and to the Bayer's point it's you're always going to have a knucklehead that's going to to do bad things and and that's that's where that's where enforcement comes in um and but it has to be enforcable uh it has to be a reason I've talked to the Sheriff's office at length about this and some real Veterans of our Island who know what they can and can enforce um but Nancy if we put a Proviso in the ordinance chain that's required the biker to come to whenever they're passing a pedestrian again to Scott Point got to be flowing with the direction of traffic but to come to a stop before they pass the pedestrian is that something that can be done and have other communities tried it in your experience I have not really heard um of that being done um you know can you do it um I would have to look into it there's you know um some of the requirements that you have in your code are actually in Florida statute so we have to be very careful that we don't try to regulate an area that has already been preempted so any change that we make here I have to be very concerned with making sure we don't cross that line um I really hadn't heard of that do you have a community in mind where I don't I just to me uh again having spent a lot of time on the sidewalks the the particularly with the new sidewalks uh uh south of Coconut Point there's there is quite a bit of space on those sidewalks and and they're not terribly utilized particularly in the offseason I mean I've I can go from south to North of time and just maybe run into one or two pedestrians who are walking on the sidewalk but the critical piece to me is when you're Kipping along in your bike and somebody's trying to walk on that sidewalk and I know people could ring the bell or they can holler on your left and of course that startles the Walker and you've got pets you've got children but you know Common decent see to me and what I try to do is first of all I'll go into the if it's off season I'll just weave into the street and into the bike lane in the street and pass them on the street but if that's not practical we we'll just come to a stop and and and we'll say hey we're we're just going to try to get around we're on our bikes trying to get you around here just on your left and but we've come to a stop at that point so we're not startling people we're respecting their their if they're walking their pet or they've got kids and you just kind of even if you just kind of on your with one foot on one pedal and foot on the ground just kind of push your way around on your bike just scoot around them everybody's cool and and people are respected and people are respectful seems to me if we add that Proviso it isn't going to slow the biker down all that much because they've got it kind of slow down anyways to pass but to come to a stop versus zipping by at 10 miles an hour just you know ringing your bell or shouting on your left as you're zipping by I think it would alleviate a lot of the stress and create a a comedy between our citizenship and I our citizenry and I I think I mean just common decency and Common Sense comes into play here but I do think that's something that could be enforceable if somebody if a police officer or one of our enforcement team see somebody zipping by somebody and then they don't come to a stop when they're passing that's that's that's an opportunity for an enforcement there so uh that's just a that to me would really help me with this change and I I don't think it's a I don't think it's a a burden on the biker uh and I don't and I think it would be of great comfort to the Walker on the sidewalk just just a suggestion i i i would support that and and I think to your point we haven't fortunately had any accidents but if we did have one having that language in there would be an enforcable action that Lee County Sheriff's Office could do if there whever was an unfortunate incident someone got hit they could obviously tell that they weren't walking their bike by them so I I would support that language so Mr Mayor do do you feel it seems to me like you feel that there's two separate issues here with the ebikes there's the beach and then there's the sidewalk because I haven't heard anybody say oh G whiz the ebikes are are dangerous on the beach I mean we maybe have but there's how how do you capture in I mean John's got a good point you you can capture data on on a sidewalk in a street but where would one capture data from a beach well I think that the only way on both the sidewalk or the beach the only data you're going to be able to at least in my mind is if there wasn't an accident yeah then one you would have to the vice mayor's point you would have something that could be enforcable and is very easily seen um and again if there's an accident there's your I mean that's data that's data saying you know it happened on the beach or it happened on what happened on the sidewalk um I'm in favor of both allowing on both I I don't give me the beaches especially after the renourishment the beach is going to be beautiful and wide and to be able to get out there and enjoy it and and have a little bit of assistance to to you know again it's promoting getting people out and allowing them to enjoy the seven M on that they choose to live on and and I support that and I also support what what the vice mayor has is added as far as provis L yeah I I'll look into it I um you know I try to be out there and do some cycling myself um and um I have not seen that type of prohibition or a requirement that I stop when I approach others um on either bike path or on a sidewalk so this is just sidewalk just sidewalk not not in the street obviously okay because we have and I'm happy to look into it what I have seen is the flip side of encouraging good behavior rather than um prohibiting you know the bad behavior like share the road share the path um that kind of thing I'm sure you've seen signs like thank you for not smoking instead of don't smoke it's kind of the flip side I think it's got to be tougher because we did we did have a uh I am aware of an incident where a splash pad was located very near a multi-use trail and they did have accidents with children coming off the splash pad being hit by cyclists coming through that Community addressed it through signage um you know cyclists slow down you're coming into an area that's heavily congested share the road I mean that's the only thing that I have seen but I'm perfectly willing to to look to see if we can mandate something like a force stop I think too uh I'm really concerned about the beach piece because have having lived on the beach literally for the last six years and and trans and gone up and down that Beach Bike Run swim walk the the the kids on the beach you you have to when you when you're on the beach on a bike or running or even walking you have to work under the premise that that child will be definitely running in front of your path it's true there it's it's a it's a it's a open space it's a wild space and so I think we probably again not to micromanage all this but if the beach is what we we bike on the beach every Saturday we ride from the south end to the North End and back and we do it on we try to follow the tides and low tide and into the mayor's point after renourishment I mean it's even going to be probably more dramatic but you've got a significant space on that beach so when we pass somebody on the beach on traditional bikes we will pass at least 10 ft probably more like 20 ft away from the person we do the same for the birds we do the same with the kids we just slow down period because the kids you just never know what they're going to do um but so the beach piece is really something we really need to be careful with because well that's that's the relaxation piece for the for our people and that's when they when they're on that beach and they they feel safe and they can relax and you just let your mind roam I mean it's one thing on the sidewalk you just you're sort of more alert on the sidewalk that you know things are going to be happening but on that beach it's a different vibe different presence and I think we need to be very careful on the beach uh for for the the reasons which I stated so we I would like to see even probably stronger language on the beach I don't know if stopping on the beach makes as much sense but distance distance y significant distance well they do that when boating and jet skiing you can't go within so so far of the shore maybe that's language that could be added that you have to if you're passing you have to pass in a reasonable business whatever that is and if you can't then you stop then you stop but again I think 99% of the people out there have enough common sense to do that uh you know most people that live on this island either have kids or grandkids I would say so they're people are going to say you know the electric Sun there will be some electric bike folks who will Who will not not go by this ordinance well they're the same folks who are on the sidebox already they're doing it right so that's enforcement we we've got to step up our enforcement work with the shiff and and I think to your point if education encouragement those are two things but you have to be heavy-handed just like you have said before on the on the I don't want to bring up Turtle lighting but the turtle lighting you you educate you encourage and but the enforcement has to have some teeth and and I think making these changes or adding that would allow some teeth to the Lee County Sheriff's Department to be able to make sure that they don't do it again and this is to me is I I I used to be completely opposed to all this but I as I think about our traffic issues on this island it's the number one quality of life issue on this island is our traffic congestion and and to to give yeah this isn't going to solve all the world's problems but anything we could do to mitigate that uh to me is important but it it really is going to particularly from Coconut Point to Time Square it's going to involve uh uh Mr Town manager and and and Frankie overseas our enfor enforcement folks it's going to it's going to involve some triaging because those are very narrow sidewalks so people are going to have to really and I guess my other question is if we do that Nancy can we also require that of traditional bikes that that may be preempted by state law I don't know but worth checking into because I think everybody ought to have to go by those if we can make a distinction as to the the capacity of the of the bicycle because a ebike is going to be able to go faster than a regular bike right but my point is is that if we're going to have bikes on the sidewalk conduct this policy probably ought to have all bikes do that to to make the Walkers feel safe if we can the state may not allow us to do that but I do think Frankie and Andy with respect to and this is this we're I was going to get into this for our goals but we need to be I think we need as as a town need to think about this dovetails nicely what we're talking about but next tra it seems like this past traffic season we were all kind of caught off guard by the enormity of the problem and uh the Sheriff's Office was great to bring in some volunteers uh and they had their folks we had some folks out there but I think we need to develop a strategy for next season um to be more engaged we the Sheriff's Office could only do so much but maybe if the town some of our town staff can be more engaged and employed in that making sure folks cross at the crosswalks and making sure that you know bad behavior doesn't slow traffic and that the people that some somebody's managing those lights so that they're not they're not turning red every time somebody wants to cross row we let people gather just seems like we need a bigger presence and that bigger presence might be able to help enforce this Spike ordinance as well I think I got a quick just before you answer just light bulb kind of went off my head is this something that would make sense to give to the Public Safety Committee to look into some sort of program I've had retired police officers that live on the island that want to help that want to do something are willing to volunteer their time is there a program that maybe we could put in place during season where we could have volunteers that have the expertise that can be certified or trained to maybe work some of these crosswalks or to help educate people that are willing to stand out there and willing to do it and say you know just so you know you can't ride on the sidewalk or help direct traffic at the busy crosswalks that we know that we have especially on the North End of the island is that something that one you think would be a viable thing for the Public Safety Committee to work on and two is it something legally that we we could do because they're a volunteer basis or how how would that work well you can you can use volunteers for a variety of things they can't go into enforce issues but they can educate they can educate they cannot do traffic right so traffic is done by a law enforcement agency only or employees thereof so the volunteers that the Lee County Sheriff's provide are still considered employees of the Lee County Sheriff's Department um we thought by going through and getting training we have training but our training does not allow us to overtake an intersection because we're not Law Officers um so that in lies makes our employees basically moot at this point Point um sitting out at the crosswalks and Advising especially on busy situations closer to Margaritaville and up around the curve on north of sto or St Carlos area we can definitely have a buggy out there with our lights on and and just telling people please use the crosswalks as a group those type of things so the officer that is there or pedestrian encourage them to use The Pedestrian pedestrian overwalk yes yes we can we can we can get the sandwich boards and I'll just have staff walking up and down there you go with sandwich boards please use a pedestrian overpass but as far as actually getting out in and and working the switch for the lights and and working inters by law we cannot do that unless we're employees of a law or agency okay so one thing we're looking at um with our emergency preparedness is a is aert program citizen Emergency Response Team um we had it before this St you had it before and we want to get that off and go have have citizens go through the training through the state it's a whole thing with FEMA I mean it's it's a good thing there are certain things that they can do as well so that's kind of part of this process we're going through is how we can use that team not only in in in a disaster post it pre and post but just day-to-day stuff because they need to maintain a training and they need to maintain uh visibility and that kind of stuff so we are I'll look and see what if that responsibility is something that possibly could could go out but I like the the idea you had the Safety Committee I remember when it kind of disbanded but I know it was around in 2018 because we were able to Irma was coming we were able to sign over our boat toer y to say you know we had it tied off and if you know after the storm they had the right to go on and use it if you know for search and rescue and things like that so I really like to hear that that program come back as you guys look at that at Public Safety doesn't santel have some kind of a volunteer core they do but they work for the they work for the santel police department is that right so they're they're paid they're not volunteers yes sir um and and even if they are volunteer they still are employed by or under their guys to that point though Mr Mayor in an emergency situation any Town employee is able to step up in an emergency situation and take control of an intersection sure um like during a hurricane dur during any kind of storm uh any type of disaster that would encounter this island any type of our T employee would be able to to to assume that role until the county sheriff was here as as you're doing your research Nancy if you could could you also research what the rights are for the town to require uh bike rental companies to make sure that their customers are sign off on that they understand what the basic rules of the road are because it seems like the rental bikes are going to be the biggest challenge because these just folks they just don't know our Island I I I think most have it in their waiver but but you know that waiver is a second maybe a separate section that has like the three bold got to stop when passing and then you got to initial it when you rented something like that so you acknowledge it okay there's a if you go just before we move on about the to what counc saffer was talking about if you go to pack of page 40 it's it's on the next agenda item but or it's in this agenda item markings like that I know we've talked in Public Safety Committee about if you go down a little bit you'll see there's two circles one has a a pedestrian in it with an arrow showing both directions and then there's another one to the left that shows a circle with a bike in it with only one Arrow going One Direction actually on the sidewalk it's not a line all the way down the center with something on each side I got to believe that that's something the county we could talk to to be on board with to help educate that you know bicycles go this way traffic can go both ways and it doesn't have to be every five feet but it's something I think that could be on each block for sure to in in areas where it's a shared use or even all the way up and down the island that would be I don't see that the county would have an issue with that but that's something I think that we could very easily Implement in I don't know that it has to be in an ordinance but Mr no I mean that's what I was going to go back to is why not in the areas that we don't have B Lanes to be able to divide the sidewalks that we do have into and I know there was discussion on that picture on the left there that that was talked about and the county was like we don't want to do a line all the way down the center but something's you know well most people don't look at the little signs you know we we used to put up the little tiny signs in the post nobody ever looked at yeah but the picture on the right though although the guy's riding in the where he's supposed to be walking um exactly that's not a good but there but there's nobody but there's nobody there but I think that that tells you that you know it's kind of like when you go to the airport and you got those move there's always somebody standing in the walk Lan you got I mean you can't you can't fix everybody's mentality but I think that that to me makes more sense having it there than up on a sign it's like you're going the wrong way nobody's looking up they're looking where they're at but that's that's Simple and Clean easy and inexpensive it's Universal nobody has to read anything they can just look at a picture and people are not used to looking up here they're used looking down looking and well it's a friendly reminder it's education and it's encouragement yeah it's it's to hey let's look over here you know so I keep thinking about what you said vice mayor about stopping and going around I mean I don't know how that would ever I mean I would just think stopping on the sidewalk people don't stop on their bikes very eloquently usually they're falling over they're tipping over they're I I just don't know how that piece of it would work I thought about that and it's a good question I I uh I think you have you can do one of two things and this is this would Nancy would really need to be a Wordsmith on this but I think you know if you as long as your foot bike comes to a complete stop and your foot touches the ground you can you can you can keep one foot on a pedal and then just kind of gently scoot around these folks or you could if you're uncomfortable with that or or if the person's uncomfortable they could literally get off their bike and just walk the bike around them I think again for those bikers who think oh that's going to impede my speed they can get back in the street and stay in the in the bike lane now obviously they don't have that luxury Between Coke and at point and Time Square but they're going to be a lot better off from a safety standpoint coming to a stop cu again there's going to be during season there'll be a lot of pedestrians well you just walk your bike for a few blocks if there's a lot of pedestrians on the sidewalk so I mean it just has to be sort of Common Sense practical but it is it's but again I'll just tell you during offseason you you'll rarely ever have to come to a stop there's just nobody on the side yeah that's true well it depends on the time of day I mean that's true this morning I'm every morning I come here I pass a lot of folks on out walking on the sidewalk in the morning joh you're absolutely right but boy when that heat comes out it's vacant out there but what about cuz we had talked about and I think Don um brought it up at when she was reporting on the safety about creating additional pass off of a sterile Boulevard while it's open right now being able to get permission and create those paths behind a sterile Boulevard not NE you know opposite the beach well if you go to I'm glad you brought that up so if you go to page 41 you can kind of see what with the Envision of the comp plan was and so if you kind of look in that that map there you'll see that pink area that's what's in the comp plan that was what was envisioned and if you look at some of those areas where that's going through to your point there's a possibility to be able to get easements or cuz there's a lot of that that's empty right now yeah so I mean now is the time if you're going to do it and you really want to be walkable and bikable to look outside the box there's a lot of if you read through that it's a lot of reading but if you read through it there's a lot of of state and federal grants that are available to be able to acquire things to be able to make this happen right I think the public did did I was watching your Public Safety Mee you guys were going to take that on as a as an agenda item right looking for those alternative paths yeah they were they were going to do that and I know that they were looking going to look specifically at this map because it relates to um you I think I think there'd be a lot of support for that and again just even just talking to the Sea Seagate folks for the Red Coconut they're they're openly saying we would love to facilitate a bike path behind our property and we we would be happy to that's a big piece of that puzzle because sure we can get people from Connecticut potentially all the way down to to Bay Oaks and po potentially down to Mango I mean if you look at some of these opportunities and some people aren't some people are riding their bike just to enjoy riding their bike and they're also trying to get from a A to B but they're also not in a super hurry so to get off a stero and have that more relaxing ride I I think that would be very popular well and in this no study it really relates to creating a destination essentially you could create stops along the way that's why we've we've talked about getting bike racks in areas and water stations and areas that Pro promote people to get out there and rideing along the way you could do history of things along the area and I think that now is the time to do it if if we have any chance at all now is the time to do it and it it connects up to the bigger plan that was out there Statewide to be able to create a a complete use path to be able to go all the way to Venice if you really wanted to on a bike so we have some of it already in place coming over the bridge and obviously going north but to to your point Mr Mayor um through the R2 P2 project uh they're going to be those folks are going to be back in town here later this month we had that preliminary discussion with them when they were here earlier in this in the spring and uh they're on it um we we looked at Lovers Lane we looked at areas like that where we can connect behind development potential development areas and you're right this is the time to strike while the iron is hot right and the iron is definitely hot on a lot of these projects so um they're on it they got the they got this plan they've got these Maps um they're trying to find a strategic Way Forward and when they give us the outline us as a community then can act on it when are they when are they actually coming back they'll be here I think about a week and a half two weeks three days it's a three- day it's going to be a three they're going to be on the ground three days yeah and end of the month I remember what exactly day but yeah there three days that they're going to be here there's also if you go to page 54 there's it's pretty interesting there's there's two w WFC and BFC they're they're two um programs if you will that you can really get certified in a walker friendly Island and biker friendly Island and once you have these certifications then you can actually promote that you can advertise it that we are a walk friendly island or we are a bike friendly Island and it refers to it heavily inside this Mo study I think that's something that we really should strive for and it all ties into what we've been talking about finding a continued use path to be able to allow you to go from North and and I think with some of the changes that we are making or potentially going to make to the bike ordinance would help get us to be able to getting those certifications to be able to put that on our website to be able to put that through the TDC be able to do that I don't know that anyone else maybe there is other communities in the around that in Lee County that have that I don't I don't know but that was something that really caught my eye that that could be a real beneficial thing to your point Andy to make us be that place were you know they're going to recognize that cuz people that bike they look for things like that people that walk they look for things like that can I can I ask just a clarification Mr Mayor certainly the uh that page 40 that has the line down the middle of the sidewalk if that's the path that we're forgive the pun but if that's the path we're going to take it kind of potentially then makes the the stopping issue a little bit of a different issue so so if if if that's is that what we're talking are we is that was we're just kind of no I was looking at this picture the one on the right not this one not this one this one this is just kind of that encouragement okay and you know uh education that you try to at least stay to one side you know as opposed to riding down the center like the guy in the pictures doing I think it's just a friendly reminder we've tried those signs in the past that you hang up on the you know the street and nobody you're not looking up you're looking in front of you so these would be ERS and it's not I know the county was not in favor of doing the picture on the left the line down with the bikes um but if we're able to create the ordinance that enforces the bike the sidewalk I got to believe they would be in favor of something that's you know every block if you do one or two of those on the Block to to let people know that you know there could potentially be bikers on the sidewalk so stay to the right again I I use the the I use the example of the motorized walk paths in airports that we've all used and it's very simple left and right you know and you just train yourself to do that and it goes along with everything we you're just trained now on I know I got to be on the left if I'm walking I know I got to be on the right if I'm touching it you've seen it R2 P2 June 11th to the 14th right within two weeks the only other thing I wanted to bring up I'm not trying to monopolize all but I just got a bunch of notes on pages of things that I think we could really do to to encourage biking if you go to page 57 I thought that thing caught my eye and I think that's something that we could do now with with the county to implement down in um down in in uh it's on page 57 and page 167 167 actually has a better picture of what I'm talking about or what they're talking about that caught my eye it's it's secured bike storage it's it's a covered open area if you look in there the guy's actually locking his bike up so you're he's stacking the bike something like that in in Crescent Park or linal park or Newton park or you know something along the lines that encourages again people I know can take my bike on the trolley if I'm coming to the island I could get on the trolley with my bike from Summerland come down to Newton park or come down to something take my bike off lock it up secure go to the beach enjoy my day and then bike home or take the trolley if I choose I think that's something that we could do both in areas that we own and I think the county could could I think that would that's that's a really neat idea to be able to yeah l lall park particular it's on 167 this would be a good this would be a good spot too right right I mean we're redoing some things here this is a great and maybe not to that scale that's in the picture but be able to provide a covered safe area to put your bike you could you could add the water station definitely set you apart I mean that if I'm if I'm in Fort or if I'm in Bonita or and I want to come to the beach and you've got a bike that can get you here that but you know you got a place to securely lock it up it's a glorified bike rack but I think it's a really cool idea that would set us apart to your point that's something we could do fairly quickly and fairly inexpensive who did those really cool bike racks that were they were at the library and they were metal and you know fish and all you can order those online they're they're kind of we still we still have some for our Lo our beach accesses but you you can I've ordered those in other towns sharks and turtles and stuff and people people just love that stuff yeah it promotes it does promote B sure I think I mean I think that's before the storm people were asking or even something you know a lot of people come to the island and they Park their bikes because there's no place to park them they lock them up on the other side of the bridge on the San Carlos Island side where our sign used to be twice you know and they tie it to the bridge now that that light's going to be put in there now that you know there's going to be a trolley stop there all that stuff again people can come they could lock their bikes up securely have a place to fill their water bottles get a drink of water uh I just think that that's a really cool idea that they came up with or showed a picture of uh the other thing that caught my eye was on page 63 and this is for future but as we go forward um it it refers to TDC funding and and it gives examples of the city of santell and the City of Cape Coral how they got money to create videos advertising videos to say this is you know you could have a video if we got those markings on the sidewalk these videos could show this video this is what you do on this side this structure is for where you can lock your bike up it's on this beach AIS so it's money an additional Revenue stream that we could get money back into the town through TDC funding um to to to help offset some of these costs I just thought that was something that to keep in the back of our mind next year when we go for TDC funding to to that point when I came down here 10 years ago I didn't know where Cape Coral was and um we googled and it was a town video that they put out through their ton development portion of the town and it was uh narrated by Terry Bradshaw of all people sure uh showing the highlights of Cape Coral Unfortunately they left out all the other spots once we got here but that's neither here nor there uh but yes it was really well put together and it does give people that aren't used to the area especially if you're moving to an area or not even moving but vacationing to an area to give you a really nice overview of what you have what you can get to and how you can get there and and and to your point I think that would be very well received and very easily done yeah and on this page it also refers to F do there's actual fot grants out there that you could use so maybe we could use some of that funding or go after some of that funding for the base of the bridge since the bridge is f Do's responsibility um startup grants that allow you to start up some of these projects so I think as we talk about being bik friendly and walk friendly now is the time to really go after a lot of these grants and a lot of these things that could help get us to those certifications that would be part of those videos that we could get TDC funding for to produce and and just really tell people leave your cars come by bike or or or you know take an Uber or take a shuttle whatever it is to get here and then once you're here there's so many things you could do but we're providing you the avenue to enjoy it once you're here uh the other thing is just another 65 it talks about the no funds and you go back and listen read this on your own but it it talks a lot about the no funds that you can go through to be able to get in transportation alternative funds that are available so when you read through this there is a plethora of of Grants and funding and things that could go out there to to you know we aren't giving to the taxpayers of the island we're we're getting funding to help promote exactly what we want to do that that goes in line with our comp plan so um and then the the last one and then I'll stop talking I promise the last one is uh that caught my eye is under the results it says employer-based encouragement business providing Financial incentives or bike parking and I think that's a as we start to see some of these developments come in or some of these smaller scales to to provote or to get them to promote financially an incentive for people to come by bike and that all again ties into if we can provide a safe place for them to lock their bikes up um you know and then they could bike home it promotes all kinds of things but it ties it all together with the employers that we have on the island to help promote through incentive based things and with their employees to bring bikes and not Cars goes a long way to offsetting the quality of life that the vice mayor has referred to many times one thing that I I I've mentioned um as we start to transition to our our new town hall and and that that possibly uh the concern of some of the employees about you know the traffic is possibly having a and it would goes in line with what you just what's in here is the the storage area for bicycles the town would have some bicycles for employees or you could come Park here and bike down there you you would beat traffic some uh because you could sit in traffic for an hour and you can bike probably in 15 minutes so we could eliminate some of that so just some things a healthy lifestyle you know that type of thing we're we'll probably try to promote that a little bit too and and try to generate that type of thing not bike rentals but just employ bikes they can bring their own or we would provide a few bikes well Dual Purpose then visitors and and and residents could also use a structure like that to be able to lock their bikes up that is correct if they don't have a safe place to do it where I was saying or something but all right that's all I had on my list of pages it's actually a pretty interesting reading it is it's a great read you know 50% of it doesn't exist anymore you see some of actually going through it seeing some of the pictures of pre-storm you're like oh and it shows pictures of what a stereo Boulevard look like before the widening of it it's like you almost forget what it looked like before in front of the Gypsy it was grapple you couldn't even there was no way to walk around only on one side of the road so if you have time if you're out there listening and watching it's it's actually a pretty good it's a pretty good read and and to see how some of it has come to fruition but there's still a long way to go and now is a time to take advantage of it but before we move on um out in social media and I think on beach radio folks had been talking about uh this issue um and brought up a boardwalk on the beach so I reached out to fep and um that's going to be a tall ask I mean um I was just specifically asking for between Red Coconut and Times Square and um I had you all sent the long packet just for generically she wanted more specifics and I couldn't give her that but um you know they're they want the specifics uh they you'd have to bring FWC involved in that we'd have to get we'd have to as a town paid to have the area surveyed and have the results of that so it's while sounds like it's easy and wonderful it's not as easy as it thinks well because there's so many it's the beach so you have so many government agencies involved well one of one of the things going to tie into what you just brought up I'm going to bring up for agenda management that you have in front of you I think that that could alleviate some of the questions and some of the answers that you have but we'll talk about that when we get to agenda management anything else on this item you have the director that you need Nancy or any specific yes and I'll go back and listen to the tape a couple more times okay I'm good thank you all right sorry all right we'll move on next is the CRA that is also something that I was working with staff to try to get on here to to see if now is the time well I believe now is the time to to try to put forward with the CRA and I'm not sure if it was Nancy or Becky that Becky that we were talking to about this and their suggestion which to me makes sense is to not have one CRA but have three that way funds that are raised in one section of the island stay can you define your acronym for folks so I'll actually I've got it up here so that way I don't butcher it um so essentially a CRA is a community redevelopment agency and what that does is it it takes blighted areas that allow you to take the increase in the taxes so when a c is set up whatever increase in that tax base is comes back to the town specifically to the town to work in areas that are within this CRA and and what I said earlier about Nancy and Becky both saying it makes sense for us because we certainly qualify for a blighted area it's something that we would have to put together a plan and we'd have to do things to get it and then it has to be approved through the county but there's no time like the presentent to do it and and it would allow us as we develop back to be able to take the funding from that tax increase to be able to put it in three sections of the island that would allow us to help improve the island for specific things within that section so I thought the three C versus one Island Wide makes sense because then that eliminates why are you building something down at Santini with that that Tiff funding versus you know up here it just allows that money to stay in that bucket so it was something that I wanted to have on here to see if there was an interest to pursue going down the Avenue of having Nancy and Becky get this brought forward so that we could get it presented to the to the county um I I I would hope it would get approved um because we certainly meet the blight requirement and there are more requirements in it but and maybe Nancy you can go a little further than what when you do Nancy could you explain the difference between a CRA and a tiff a tax tax increment financing District okay so um yeah so let me just back up and give you a little bit of a framework um so the CRA from a legal perspective is is designated as a um dependent special district so it is basically another local governmental entity so there is a board um that is created for the agency um and there's a lot of requirements that you need to satisfy but the first being whether or not um the area is viewed as being a blighted area and a blighted or a slum area and there is a statutory definition of that um the blighted area has uh a variety of of um conditions which I I I think I agree with the mayor as far as the current state of of the um the beach area but also um recently there was a determination that the lack of affordable housing could also be an indication of of an area that's blighted um in in defining if the area is blighted or not you do have to get concurrence from the county so before we go further down the road um there needs to be discussion and kind of see where the county is on this if they agree to it or not because that incremental um amount that's coming off is coming off of the adorm taxes which is then requiring them to reinvest it in the Redevelopment area as opposed to someplace else in the county so it is a somewhat of a partnership making sure that they're on the same page with with the town so once they um there's conversation um they we need to have some type of a resolution or an inter local agreement with the county to say that yes these areas the three areas you can do three um are uh in a state of blight um consistent with what the statute says in 163 so once you get through that first hurdle then you need to um basically have um a study done to show that um from a planning perspective from a data perspective that yes there is information and conditions that support the idea that there is a blighted area of course there's a cost associated with that so you want to make sure that the county is on board with you before you move through that process and Nancy would that be that in the statute it refers to as a finding of necessity yes is that the finding that the finding of necessity is what we youd have to prepare to take to the county to get them on board with this before you moved on to the study I would have informal conversations with them first um before you expend the money to do the study because if they think it's not blighted in their opinion you're spending money for a study that yeah that they may not agree with so you're correct though the the finding of necessity then is passed by resolution by this board um showing that it's a slum or blighted area or there's a shortage of affordable housing but again it has to be based on a study um and then at that point once you've overcome that hurdle with the resolution then you move forward and you have to create an entity um the CRA board or agency um which generally are local government um councils it's you so it it would be you but you are functioning as a separate local government um and that happens quite frequently the statute also provides that you can add I think two additional members um to the CRA board to function sometimes um a county will add their person because again there is kind of a little partnership um in that regard so once the CRA is formed and the the body is created they have to begin developing a plan and the plan basically has to be very I would say pretty specific um because that increment that you acquire down the road can only be spent on if it's uh projects that are in your plan if it's not in the plan it doesn't work when your plan is very specific it's easy because okay we have this much money we're going to use it for this purpose sometimes you put some vague language in there and then it becomes debatable can you actually use that to accomplish that goal the plan has to be approved by the county or the taxing Authority as well so again they're giving up that increment but they want to know what it's going to be spent for so it kind of goes in that regard once you've overcome those hurdles then you need to um basically create a trust fund and that trust fund is where the money is gathered and it could be spent on an annual basis um for things that are uh your plan or you can allow it to build up a little bit and then use it for a larger uh project or you could use part of it for a larger project with grants or other funding sources as well um to try to move forward in that direction so your um CRA plan has to be consistent with your comprehensive plan that you all just reviewed um some changes for on Monday and you know it it ties together together with with everything your bicycle plan that you're just talking about that could be part of it and rolled into it and then on the financial side um you know we would create the fund and uh determining how much money you actually get um that's a little bit above my pay pay grade um I did a little bit of research and there's more research that needs to be done but it does look like Lee County did have um a CRA they created back in 1990 M and part of their CRA included um the Estero Island as well as St Carlos Island which I thought was rather interesting um however they rescinded and abolished those um CRA back in 20 uh 2006 MH um stating that there was no money available for for the projects so moving forward we would kind of like to see what was in that initial plan for Estero Island and see if we can't maybe build upon that um just like in your bicycle plan from 2017 there's things that are good but there's things that are outdated um so that's uh that's kind of what what I can contribute today I'll tell you four just real quick SC would you just comment on the difference between the CRA and the Tiff concept the tax tax Finance Tiff is is part of the CRA so um the CRA is developed is created the boundary lines are established and there is a baseline of what the ADV valorum um revenue is from that particular area and then over time as properties are redeveloped it begins to increase and then that increment is what goes into the trust fund that can then be spent specifically in that area so you can't have a tiff without a c CU in our in my home state of Indiana we would have a tiff and not have a CRA but in Florida I just I just try to understand the difference than y and also they're typically they Sunset and usually no more than 30 years they don't go on forever yes but there's all kinds of things you can do within your CRA plan um a lot of flexibility um but it for instance you can have additional Code Enforcement Officers but that code enforcement officer the salary that's paid has to be specific for code enforcement work within that CRA area um it can't be for you know in general in the town yeah I mean um city of for Meers has just an incredible CRA plan um I think they have four different zoning districts they MLK they have Cleveland Avenue downtown um there's there's a guy named Lee Ford who he's not on the commission there but he knows the ins and outs of of cras and maybe we next M&P we get him to give some insight there is a um a community redevelopment um Association associated with the Florida League of cities and they have highlighted Fort Meyers as being an example for other communities to follow um cor Cape Coral also has a CRA um but the other communities within Lee County I'm not aware of them having I mean and Teresa uh Brown I think is the the chair of the CR CRA there and she presented leadership Le um when we did Fort Meers day and it was it was and you know it was brought up gosh Fort Meers Beach would be you know given this the hurricane be a perfect place for a successful CRA yeah I I and we have neighbors right you know just north of us that work with the county all the time and I I think we could get a lot of a lot of help from them yeah I well Nancy's point I think the first step is getting informal conversations with our County Commissioners to and I would certainly support doing that whether it's the staff or a designated person from the council to do it to be able at least have those initial concept that they're if they all say no then we're kind of going nowhere fast but uh I don't believe that that would be an answer I would think that dealing with what we've had to deal with they would be certainly receptive to the idea of doing I agree with you and they have assets here they have a stero Boulevard they have Pier um and which would benefit from this area or certain nodes being identified as um CRA and having money diverted there okay is there a consensus to start the initial talks at least mhm absolutely okay all right okay and who doing that mayor I'd be happy to facilitate but I think it would be incumbent upon one of you because the elected official level of discussion to designate one of you to participate with me how do you feel about that mayor I i' certainly be happy to do it I talk to them all the time anyway so I know we all do if if if everyone's okay with it I'd be happy to at least get the initial initial talking going and see what they say yeah I'll try to get get you with the leaf for as well recommend you contact him sure he's that guy he knows his stuff inside now yeah I agree and all the help we can get that getting the five on board first is the important part and then right and no and we to your point we did have a CRA before yes I know in 99 there was there was one but they since have gotten rid of it but now is the time to bring it back I think so we'll continue our research and we'll also try to start working on perhaps some documents so if you get a positive uh response we can try to move quickly sounds good anything else okay we'll move on to the next thing a stero Boulevard Landscaping who wants to start this one anyone okay I I'll do it I guess go ahead I was gonna ask the town manager and again you guys have had your hands full but what is the plan whatever we planted prior of the storm was not overwhelmingly impressive and uh so do we do we have a plan and and do I mean what do you guys you're you're the professionals and we've got Mark over here or is I'm gonna ask Jason if he doesn't he's been part of the whole and he's he educated me on where we were at this point when I got here so do you mind Jason just kind of we probably need to go to the if you remember vice mayor it came before us and there was a discussion about letting the homeowners on a stero Boulevard do what they want to do you know obviously within the guidance of whatever the town put out and at the time there wasn't an interest in allowing each homeowner to do basically to make it an extension of their lawn you know I was walking North too Boulevard yesterday and I can't remember what her name is but she sweet lady that lives there if you haven't seen what she's done in her little section it's very cool it's very there a lot of work and effort that had gone into that and I think that's something we should relook at I know we had voted no against it in the past but something like that would be really really cool to be able to well even going to down Bonita Beach Road I mean I know there's all this hype about Bonita Beach Road but those yards and that Landscaping that they have done and sometimes three or four homes go together and they provide the same kind of buffer and everything it's beautiful I mean it's absolutely beautiful well it's Pride ownership too then it's part of their it's an extension of their their front yard so some of the work had been done at Lazy way right looks like there's 36 $34,000 that of the original 820 was spent there uh that one will RCL fund alues and CHR Teo yeah that was uh from what I know um that was right about probably last summer right before Ian uh the town I believe completed the first segment uh which was from Red Coconut to about Newton Park Publix area it was just all perennial pis sunsh peral peanut um so that was a project we kind of took over you know um afterwards so I we completed that part and then in came so yeah we were working our way South yeah and I believe Joe has the actual numbers of how much we've spent on that but I believe it was only a small portion of it compared to the total amount that we got um the town executed that in our local I believe with the county where we got that money um from then to basically install and maintain the Landscaping along the St Boulevard for the county are are you the the point person on this Jason uh I was and I have the information but I'm happy to help guess are you are you are you interfacing with the the the Garden Club I have not recently but I know um we're kind of all working together on that so okay Mark will be Mark will actually take the lead as as we move forward since he's been here a couple months Mark you've got about a couple years of experience in life do do you have a do you have a vision for land W that was kind well you know I I think we all you guys didn't get a chance to see it but before the storm north of sto Boulevard was beautiful it had palm trees it had was gorgeous vegetation it was a true separation that people didn't just walk through to get out onto the road because it was it was beautiful to me I kept arguing oh okay before the storm the previously administrated we've got a road map it's right in front of us just extended down I mean it was beautiful and and it you know ran into Rick Walls with it but we ended up with perennial peanut but I I think you know to your point recommendations what that we had there I thought was beautiful and if you actually look at the comprehensive plan it refers to a St Boulevard as the aisle of palms and and it ref having R Palms down there which is kind of what northo had I'm not saying that it has to be just palm trees but I mean if we had some pictures of what North Estero definitely do it I think that could be something to build off of because I I don't know anyone that thought it was horrendous and ugly what it looked like on the north north end of the island County's already blessed this because they gave us the money obviously so it's not like we got to go back to them to do but if we have to cut into the sidewalk and things like that I imagine we'd have to get their blessing to to do that because you'd have to cut into some of places to put palm trees and as you move down I would imagine or whatever we did I'm not saying palm trees I'm just saying whatever we was determined to go in I imagine the Garden Club has had input with that in the past or how did that I believe it went to council just for a recommendation from what understand of of the sunshine mimosa and the peral peanut just for that first segment and that's really as far as we got before end from from my recollection is got basically two Publix and then it was kind of you know next phase was going to be and it was it was it was a maintenance nightmare you saw poor public works out there every day on their hands and knees bik Lane which is safe trimming The Perennial P that's grown over the sidewalk and grown over didn't even look nice well a lot of those native plants don't look nice I mean we got to be really specific about what we want this to look like they turn into we and like the mayor said you know the the maintenance aspect of it too you know making sure that it's uh able to be maintained with our staff to to your point we have already reached out with Chad um our environmental manager and looked at Tree City USA to try to get tree grants for North Estero um he has gotten the preliminary kickoff so to speak as far as getting the paperwork in doing that and that would have been replacing all that North Estero with Royal Palms that were were there yeah I I think if we can get at least my personal opinion if we can get pictures of what northo look like so that staff can look at it and make recommendations it was beautiful and I think be able to again why reinvent the wheel it to your point you had a road map it was multi-purpose to the vice mayor's point it's it's you know to keep without physical hard barrier guard rails to keep people from getting it really worked it created that separation and as you got to the south end of the island it's even more of an area so and some shade and and some shade absolutely be able to provide some palm trees for some shade to be able to to walk down the sidewalk and and help block some of that wind and the sand that we're seeing blowing out on the boulevard but I think now is the time to really you know get going on this so that we can you know it's your first impression when you're driving down a St Boulevard well and rainy season too yeah but there's going to be some maintenance involved if we're not doing just the native plants that which are beautiful but I think we can yeah that in the watering I mean those were the two issues we had before just you know making sure everything's getting water when everything's newly planted and then just maintain with the weeds and you know trimming and all that too so okay did you have a thought Mark you were nodding your head are you just listening I know that's a really long sprinkler system and I can do it I can do it no I I do remember northo was beautiful and the issue is is that we need a little bit of a a grass area between the sidewalk and the road cuz that's where it is but I think to get the Garden Club involved I have been in um in touch with kathana a few projects so we have a good rapport with each other I think to get them involved and try to really promote the homeowners to take a grasp of it be proud of what they are I want somebody walking by my house me at night walking by my house like you say I know that one on north of stero it's beautiful but it's only maybe 10 10 15 ft we need everybody to jump on board and I think if we can promote that and I think um The Garden Club will help promote that too with the people so that's really where my vision is going but checking Google Maps Google Maps have Maps going back to 2017 and you can look up and down the Boulevard and see what it looks like so I think that'll give us some good direction but yeah but I think the point was to to councilor Woodson is is native plants are are beautiful and they're great but I think not all of those were native plants that required some watering but yes staff was obviously watering because they stayed beautiful all the time they were never overgrown they were never you know I don't I just keep thinking it's it was right in front of us it's right there what we don't have but we have seen like the county has a big water truck and they go once a week and they you know they water their they water their plant so once a week with a water truck you know boom boom boom should be shouldn't be too big of an issue we'll start working on plan because obviously we have to have RFP out for um you know that volume of trees and that type of thing and who's going to in so we'll start that process and be working to bring something back to you as soon as we can and now is the time to start on with the the traffic is light any other input it's a complete coincidence but perennial penut is going to be my next honor name when I get back into the business oh don't even start there's so many jokes there John come on anything else for that there it is look at that right in front of you yeah it gives you yeah you can see up there television oh that's one section think they're looking at who's doing can you move it down Jacob as you kind of go down the boulevard give him an idea of don't go too fast they get Jim you're right Jim look how it controls the tra the foot pedestrian would help on foot traffic and the trees are just I mean it's beautiful it ties into McGregor you know McGregor is like that and those were not coconut PS I rest in the case yeah there's some already out there but you you know what I'm saying wow look at man really the water tower is that yeah that's what the water tower look like yeah why put it back there take a you know it I know it see but I mean that's something that's very easy to do it's it's it's already there yeah it was beautiful and it wasn't all the same it was different everywhere it was a little right each little pad was different but I love the idea of having the palm trees down the boulevard for shade and some of them AR those high growth and protection yeah a lot of people feel threatened by the proximity of the cars and the trees help give you a layer safy too you know right now there's really no safety barrier between other than Cur we don't like M we definely we definitely can go def FR drain system all the way up and down see like those Hedges there too people just didn't walk through you know that natural buffer and they're cut low enough so that they don't impede your view when you come up to a stop sign to be able to turn yeah there's going to be some maintenance involved but you know I think that that's fine everyone I think you'll find homeowners will will help maintain it too just because they want it is that your printing peanut yeah everyone there's one taking a trip down memory lane isn't it I know you just look at it and think God I'll change next week Gumbo Limbo right there never seen it you know it's very good I love Gumbo Limbo do you especially with little sausage and how green everything was I know what the proper pronunciation you guys think you got it under control thanks Jacob for pulling that it's a great idea wait a minute wasn't that you driv I know Was it crazy or what it was on the sidewalk could be all right next agenda agenda management uh Concor Safford we'll start with you I'm good con Woodson um I wanted to bring up one thing and more of it's from historical because I don't understand the whole history of the rentals being weekly and monthly and monthly is so few and far between and I guess some education on how that all came about and is that what we want to continue or just where we sit on that well it's it's my recollection on the the streets that are designated we talked about this way before the storm I thought about looking at the monthly Street specifically just changing I think there was like something in there that we were going to change to specifically not go from a month could be from July 7th to August 7th or you know whatever instead of being the first till the end so April is April J you know so if you rent in there in a month the question was can we change it to if I don't have a rental in July and they come in on July 28th can my month be till August 28th and it was sent up to the Attorney General's office and I believe they came back saying no if you change one word within your ordinance that is in place you'll lose your grandfather's status right but what's what's even crazier is that ordinance that's still on the books still says you cannot rent to anybody that's not blood related yeah and that is so wrong on so many levels um you know four guys can't come down and play golf uh five ladies can't come down for a bachelor app party then but I think talked about that too though and I think the the word there was the rent you can't charge rent to blood relatives wasn't it no it's no it's they only wanted families coming down here and that's that I mean we I to Karen's point I think we we just need to revisit it um but you know I you can't have an ordinance on the book books that's so Antiquated like that right um or one side of and you're and you're and you're just you're enforcing portions of it but you're ignoring other portions I mean an ordinance should be written where it's you can't pick and choose what you're what you're going to enforce so I I think we couldn't change it because we'd lose our grandfather clause but you know again to councelor Woodson's point I think we need to re revisit this and and after the storm you know do we still need monthly streets well I think if you ask people that live on those monthly streets the answer would be yes because that's why they bought there well but I think we should have the conversation but the people trying to sell their the it's almost the point now where where if people looking at houses for investment properties the monthly the weekly streets are worth more well yeah and they were before the storm but I think people that were looking to invest were buying specifically for we can have this discussion absolutely yeah yeah I mean I think we we need to have the the conversation um I I totally agree well and the other the the other portion about this ccer Woodson is is that you know there's a a bill on um the governor's desk that may may change how short-term rentals are are governed by the state and we need to have a serious discussion about what what the impacts on the town will be and you know I'm I'm All About You Know protecting people's property rights and everything else but it this is a this going to be a very interesting issue I think we need to you know at least in M&P meeting talk about it yeah I I think what's on the governor's desk because of the year that our ordinance was in intact we wouldn't affect us if I remember reading it I think you're grandfathered yeah I think we're grandfather I mean there's been a push in Tallahassee for years to try to take over a home rule and this every year it's something and it changes and it changes and it changes and that's why the Florida League cities pushes so hard to not allow that to go away so I'm completely open to having discussion and if there's words that can be changed and doesn't affect our grandfather status then let's have those but I know that that one specific thing was sent up to the AG's office and changing the the wording and their response was very specific if you change one word in your ordinance you lose your grandfather's status at least that's what our council at the time told us yeah so I would beg to have that relooked at please okay yep because I think maybe Jim you can remember I think there was a willingness at the time to look at if if it's still a month does a month is a month whether it's the 15th to the 15th or so I think there was a willingness to do that and that's how it ended up going up to the ages to get a ruling on it uh but again we were informed that they said no don't you can't change one word so certainly take a look at it again I I I think new council with new fresh eyes looking at something like this is not a bad it it's a discussion to have um because again every year there's a push to try to take away a little bit more but we have to constantly monitor that but I think we also have to be very careful that we're not we don't lose anything we're not giving away we're not helping the Cause right anything else nope that was it you guys got that okay VI may I I think it's still on the list but it just just at some point whenever the appropriate time is the the the contractor who's installing the street lights just to have them come in and just give a little presentation show a little bit about it's a Herculean effort i' I've reached out to Chris Powell and asked him he's checking his schedule when he can get in here and we'll coordinate and get next that's great thank you that's that that's all I have vice mayor or I'm going the wrong way councelor king or perennial penut if choose whatever you want I'm trying to go by my memory so this is going to hurt but um we brought on policies and procedures up to date as as far as committees but as I recall it's still in conflict with the town ordinance that says you have to be either a voter or a property owner to serve on a committee and I think we need either we can continue to ignore it or at least address it in the ordinance because we do have folks that are not either serving on various committees okay just need y I agree with that one all right two people to get it put on there to take a look at y Jim or that's it for me peanut that's it for me it's calling peanut PP short PP out squ I I squ I just have two things that you have in front of you that I wanted to bring to see if it's something we want to put on agenda management or not the first one is is kind of some just brief renderings I met with someone that specializes in Workforce housing to look at areas and discuss things and with the cdbd gr funding that's out there there's an opportunity to get some money it's a very short window but there's an opportunity to be able to get a large sum of money from that towards Workforce housing you know we we talk a lot about Now's the Time to do some things is now the time to do some things and what you have in front of you is the Old Town Hall property and and it's just kind of a basic rendering and and in talking with him trying to understand how this works and what doesn't work and what the town needs what you kind of see in front of you is is is something that could be 80 units with some parking and then commercial in the front and then the back which is not on there cuz he ran out of time to do it but it would be it could be green space it could be park it could be usable so it was it would be something that the entire Community could benefit from obviously they come in it would be some sort I guess what I'm trying to get at I don't want to get too much into it but in these drawings it kind of shows you that there's a Workforce housing there's commercial there's Green Space all of it within that town hall property and is it is there willingness to at least have the discussion have him come in present to the council this is how it works this is how the town would be involved this is what we pay for all of that and kind of explain it because he would do it much better than I could um to at least look at it because the window is very very short to be able to get these CD or at least apply to get the funding which could offset a lot of costs of this um and it is a property that we already own so that eliminates a lot of that cost um we and there was talk when I was talking with them about there's never been anything done that that I can find or anyone or he can find Workforce housing that is it doesn't promote cars it doesn't promote the parking it it stays open so it's bicycle only or and can that be done through cdbg so there's a lot of things in there that could potentially benefit the town um there was discussions about underneath you know everything has has to be elevated obviously but underneath could be an open area park where you could use it for rain events or you could use it for there's all kinds of opportunities that you could do there but if there's not not a willingness to to have the discussion or at least have him make a presentation then we won't go any further with it but I wanted to bring it before Council to see if there was at least one other person willing to to have him come in and and I believe it's the end of June when you have to is that right Frankie to be able to to have some paperwork in we're going to have to have it in quite a bit before that but June 29th is the final so if there's a will I mean I don't know that we'd have time to get in on the next MMP if there's a willingness to go forward with it maybe it's something he could come in and do a presentation on you know at the beginning of the next meeting or meeting after that just in the in the presentation part of it it would be very brief it's not a it's not a sales pitch it's not anything but if we if we're serious about trying to to keep some of the you know I look it as a benefit of having you could really direct quality people to the island there are one two three bedroom units and kind of this design that would help promote some kids back to the school to help maybe get some of that enrollment number up on the island I think there's a lot of potential benefits to at least have the discussion and if it works it works if it doesn't it doesn't but uh if there's if someone else who then who manages this though like so that that's it would the town would have really nothing to do with it other than we'd have to oversee it is my understanding but they we would hire them or they would be hired as a firm to do it the town would be essentially just a long-term lease of the property anything that was to happen with the property the town would still it's all how you write it into the agreement yeah public private partnership exactly so be so the town would still have stake and every if it was ever to be sold 20 30 years from now the town would would be involved in getting money so it would be something but I thought it was important when I initially talked to him he had just kind of Workforce housing and I thought you know we're talking about trying to spread out some of this walkability and commercial use for small still essential businesses that we're talking about you know Dennis office haircut place something like that that could be a good spot for things like that so I just thought it would be interesting to at least talk about especially with the funding that's available through cdbg potentially available um so that's kind of my my pitch to see if anyone else thinks it's a worthwhile just a question Mr Mayor when you when you had that conversation uh with this person did you have a comfort level that that that this would actually be distinguished as Workforce housing versus low-income housing yes work it was Workforce housing and again I don't know the agries of how that works as far as getting the funding through HUD but it it's set up where there was so much information that's why I said it'd be interesting he'd be able but it was how in the workforce part at least what I remember what I got out of it was it's protected so when you have to have I think it was $52,000 or something like that is the threshold for a family of two or something um could qualify technically to be but you'd have to be employed but you have to be employed require You' have to be employed you can't specifically at least the way I remember I'm you can't specifically say it has to be only for Fort Myers Beach residents but what prevent somebody that lives way out man I got a cheap place to live on the beach now and they're not work I mean well he he explained that and it there's ways that you can do it that it it it allows people that live on the island work on the island first the the idea is to get quality people here to work well yeah that's that's I mean the goal is to get quality people but if you got to have that protection where it's just hey man you can you can get a sheap place on the beach now well that's that's well that's that's protected that's protected by the cost I guess my other question um mayor Mr Mayor is who who actually does the the screen the screening of the applicants do it's all reg again this is why I wanted to have because these are all questions he could answer better than I could but I asked a lot of the similar questions and the answers that I mean this was only about he did this literally after an hour meeting with him just standing at the site looking at it he kind of sent this out and that's why I talked about is now a time to try to do something that doesn't have any parking so if if you're living there you don't have a place to park your car you you know so you're going to want to be working within biking distance of the you mean you're not going to bike to Leigh acres and live here right so is there ways to do it where you really kind of entice people that live and work around not just Fort Myers Beach but you know San Carlos Island Santa Bel it's something that is is it we have the opportunity to do it does it make sense to look at it and and see if it's viable and he would be again be able to answer your questions way better than I would and certainly be I'd be willing to listen to that that sure I mean the proximity to the school is really interesting as well that was one of the main things I I looked at is you know we're kind of running out of time to to try to build up that enrollment this could be a potential way to you know developers I I I agree I mean if if our goal is to increase enrollment in the school and provide work Workforce housing we we definitely should you know open up that conversation yeah I just don't in in any way shape or form want to see us being the lease negotiator the you know the that kind of thing place if it's going to cost the town money yeah I don't want the town I don't want the town to be in the housing business that's not we don't want them in the housing that was one of the first questions I said would the town have to manage this and he's like no absolutely not and and another thing and he explained to me that I thought was very interesting is you know your qualifications is say 52,000 or whatever that number was through HUD you can go up to 150% of whatever that number is and the reason that's there Workforce housing I think it is versus affordable housing is because people what happens is I don't want to use the word squatter but that's the best word I can use of they don't want to take promotions they don't want to increase because they lose where they live then so this allows up to 50% over that number to be able to allow you to get more more money to be able to take promotions to be able to to incentivize you to to get better to to you know better raise more money for your family however you want to put it to be able to move on I don't if this has anything to do with just having people come to live here just to have a cheap place on the beach it it's not that's not what it's that's not what it's for so and he there's so much that goes into it's not something that you could cover in the 10 minutes we've been talking about it but I think he this is what he does so I think having him come in and and have the conversation and say here's how that gets paid for here's how the town's involvement in it here here's how you have some of the backdrops or back stops that we're talking about or and here's what you cannot do this you can't do this because of Hud you can't do this but so it kind of came up pretty quick and I didn't know anything at the time when I met with him that there was this funding out there through the Dr funding to be able to um to be able to get some and going forward if I'm not mistaken frankly just through the cdbg part of it which we're now going to go back into um there there's funding through that program to be able to do you are correct sir and and also this would fit into the cdbg under affordable housing uh that's how they group it that's the grouping uh that they designate um but they have pretty stringent on federal level because it is federal project money that you're using uh for RFP putting the the proper procurement uh process in place sure and and that is pretty lengthy and and pretty technical um I know that the conversation PR briefly this person has done this for other communities um so they're pretty well versed in that but uh that that's something that we would have to take into consideration that it's not something that can happen overnight even if we were awarded a bucket uh for this project that it would have to really go through some lengthy uh procurement process and and to your answer um Karen um yes you can have this out to another entity but the town at the end of the day still has to oversee that entity we are the people that are getting the money not this person the there are there are stipulations in the cdbg where a contractor can go on behalf of a community and ask for funds these person um these individuals none none of these individuals were vetted when we originally went to the cdbg so that is off the off the the table for right now so anything that would happen would have to go through the town and the town would have to award a contractor or a management company and then oversee that management company that is the that is just the absolute guidelines that everyone has to follow so you you you know you'd have to look at their books you'd have to look at the at the end of the day we're responsible for how that's run um not so much the the day-to-day the over theh shoulder stuff but making sure again any funds used under cdbg they have the right to come back 25 years and ask for proof of how it was done each and every year uh to make sure that you're on the up and up um and and and then not saying that this would happen or anything like that but that's just the way way the HUD works so they're they're more than willing to provide Workforce housing and especially to the mayor's point you know a subjugated group um where you can say here is your income threshold and you can be within this threshold down the road taking into consideration raises things like that and still having that core of people in that in that structure not just being a you know a Turn Style for for people to come and go is there a way to partner with the bigger Resorts and have them commit to X number of units or you can't do that if you go through at this point it it's all off the table we this would have been a discussion to have maybe a year and a half ago when the cdbg just got devel as they develop right and coming forward yes no as these units develop down correct correct we yes you can can we encourage them to put Workforce housing in there not not with the cdbg okay yeah this would be a government run or overs sought unfortunately at this stage of the game it would beone yeah yeah which means we'd have to have staff dedicated to the oversight of this correct yes sir some at at some point some way yes well and that's what I wanted to get answers on that's you know but I mean I'm just that that's just we would had to do that regardless of just the way the document sits on the table today with the county so yeah my my focus of of wanting to get a consensus to bring this forward for the a presentation or not not was either we're going to have Workforce housing or potentially or we're not and this this was something that the town already owns there's funding out there to help be able to do it the management all that other stuff are all questions I think that need to be asked and then determined this this something we want to be involved in or not but it just to me seemed like something was worthwhile having a discussion on and let the expert tell us answer every question that we have and and from that point decide yeah no you know what I mean but I if we have to have all the I mean let's just say we did go forward with this and we have to have everything in by June 29th or before I mean I don't think we have time to wait until the next M&P well that's what I was asking if if if we if we had a we can do we can draft a scope of work um and and get that into the pipeline that that's the most important thing is to give them the scope of work and at least a rough outline of what we're asking uh for that initial bucket and put that in place and I think we still have time to I think for me I don't I don't want the staff to waste any time or energy or money on this until he has a time to to spend 15 minutes or 20 minutes up here to say here's what it is here's how the program works answer the questions and then if he's like you need to get going or you're not going to get this funding or we don't need the funding or if we don't make the window it really doesn't matter I mean obviously money is helpful but so I just think having him be able to explain it and understand you know the thresholds what I found interesting about the the financial thresholds is it it seemed to me like it really promoted the the teachers the firefighters the policemen those type of because it wasn't you know you only make $20,000 to qualify it was it was a decent amount of money that I think some you know teachers will fall into I think you know obviously servers things like that that emplo our employees yeah the town employees would would qualify for for stuff like that based on the income thresholds in there so I just thought that's that's what really got me interested in is is the thresholds that apply to something like this town employ the Dr package expanded that threshold so if it would have just been a regular cdbg program you wouldn't be we wouldn't have this discussion at all but the Dr actually expanded those thresholds and allowed for a higher ceiling to get more middle inome people back to Middle inome work in a devastated area because those apartment complex they're you know a typical apartment complex has a life of 30 to 40 years but if you bring in that HUD component it's obvious that that sh life is going to be lower so what you know long-term planning yeah it'd be great but what in 20 years if the place is it's not you know not maintained and everything else and you know but who does the maintenance too I mean who does they that's all them they do all of that so there's you know there's a lot of questions so for me it was important to see if there was a possibility to one have the commercial in front of it because then there's an Avenue for the town to actually that's great and then you know in talking with some of the people in the county and some other There's an opportunity to have a a hardened structure at the top level of that that could be used or rented for you know I can never remember the name of them more you can go and you can rent the space to have you know your computers and you can have your own little office space type of thing that could be used for that for for you know the places that are but also during time of a storm it has a place the staff can go to that has backup generators on the roof that has a hardened air area that the town can get back to right away and be able to work in the area where they're used to working and so and he said absolutely that can be done so those are the kind of the benefits that I thought would go along with with and then that's why I wanted to see if he you guys wanted to come in and talk because he answered yes to a lot of those questions and so it's not just a housing unit it's something the town uses it's something the community gets to use and it's something that we could potentially generate some income off of so well mayor you've already got your consensus um and I'm always willing to listen to any thing but with the federal strings involved I I have some concerns and I hope he can address those certainly I think as soon as you mentioned the word Federal everybody has concerns but so if it's possible to get him I I'll reach out to him to see if he could come in June 3 at June 3D meeting and and do a brief presentation and answer some questions thank you is that okay all right and then the other thing I have kind of ties in John to what you were talking about earlier this is I reached out to TPI to for their Coastal protection system and and and this was probably a few months ago that I reached out to ask for and there were some things in here that really caught my attention you know we started talking about boardwalks we started talking about things like that and how you can do it and this was actually gone through permitting it I mean there's all kinds of documentation that's already laid out there that that the D looked at that everybody's already looked at and approved and some of the things that really that really connect with me if you look at the very first page reduce Insurance costs it allows for building at grade level without the 50% rule by having this castal protection system it protects from erosion destructive scouring during storms provides exess accessible pedestrian circulation and Community beautification along beachfront I.E a boardwalk creates 11 beach access points this was just for the small section so I guess I wanted to see if it was possible to bring it up on a future M&P to have a discussion because one does it help us get some Dr funding for infrastructure two is it something that the island to help protect us the dunes or not the dunes but the the BMS will do so much but we we learned in idalia is those BMS wash away right this would be something that wouldn't wash away that would protect the storms is something that we can get mitigation funds for is this something that we can now get and maybe potentially expand it beyond the small little SWA because if this was in place before the storm we we may still have a Time Square they may have been flooded but they would have been at least allowed to build back which is what really caught my attention um so is this something we want to look at does this then allow us it's something that's below low ground it's not something that's obtrusive that you see but it allows you that ability to be able to to your point John earlier when they were asking all the questions you know the bike pass and all that kind of thing is this something that we could use and is now the opportunity to to really take a hard look at it and 99% of the work has already been done what about seaw walls don't we have things in our ordinances about seaw walls and it's but this is I don't know I mean that we have to look at is this considered to sea wall going to ask Chad do I think this yeah I think this is very interesting Mr Mayor and I think it's worth discussing further did you say this was TPI this was Grand Resorts this is this is in my opin it became more yeah so this was one of the things that they were going to do as a benefit to the town for free and we didn't and it wasn't and it wasn't accepted so but they were nice enough to at least share this detailed information with us to be able to start potentially the conversation to make this happen seaw walls have come up at the the murf committee again and um I'm just going to ask Chad to weigh in on what those ordinances are and it's something that you as the Town Council can variance okay so it's it's not encouraged but um if there's a resilience uh benefit for that I think it's a good justification I think the challenge will be uh easements um sure you know especially when you were talking about going all the way to Red Coconut um I know there's some challenges in there with with easan um but that's just a hurdle and I have no I have no doubts that there's hurdles in it and that's why what i' like to have the discussion maybe get some but you know you see expanded Dune systems I mean so it's something that could potentially I think we you know walking down the beach or going on the beach now it's even going by boat the this weekend seeing you could see that burm goes pretty much the entire there's it's a long so people understand the need to have this especially because Adalia to me now it seems just smart to have this discussion especially if there's a lot of funding out there to be able to get this done and the uh the attenuation walls even at some of the other accesses where it seems like the accesses are just kind of avenues or channels we could have attenuation walls um not necessarily with the boardwalk but just the attenuation walls to dissipate wave energy sure do you do you I guess you're you're the you're our environmental engineer do you think this is something that not an engineer no sir sorry expert let's do that expert how about that do you I don't know if you've ever have youve seen this or had any chance to review it or not when it was I did I I I looked at that and saw it and thought it was very interesting and a lot of potential okay so I won't belabor it too much but I I wanted to and I can bring in all the other documentation if you want it's it's mostly boring permits that had gone through have been applied for and all I mean literally all the documentation right there to to to make this happen um and try to get some of that infrastructure money some of that mitigation funding the money is available there there's a lot of money on the table that goes unused for projects like this because you don't have a good plan in place this is a plan that's already been developed something that we could easily get going um and it shouldn't be a challenge to get people to come to the table and talk whether it's a property owner or a commercial property owner um this benefits them right just as much as it benefits the rest of the Town yeah I think now now is a time to expand and if in my understanding is they had approval from Edison house down to uh Shuckers before when this was a VI going through to do it so is there an opportunity to expand it the entire length of the island if it's something that could could work as a you could have a boardwalk but you also get that increased vegetation Dune for protection and it's not you know some big Glass Wall or some big concrete wall going down I think it's something that we should look at especially with the funding and the grants Avil y thanks for bringing it Forward okay so we want to add it to the next M&P meeting pleas and that's all I have I appreciate you being patient with my long-winded agenda management but with that if there's nothing else John I'm good thank you oh peanut was asleep uh move to a journ motion by councelor King second by councilor Safford all those in favor signify by saying I I we we are adjourned at 11:35 I'm hungry I have nothing why didn't you wake me up