[Music] okay all right so start from the beginning um so being a little after 7 o' we're going to start the Halifax conservation meeting uh this is being recorded by area 58 and can be reviewed on YouTube the first thing on our agenda is on 266 Monet Street or 258 home street it's for strong water permit application okay you I'll through yeah yes play the tape again uh good evening my name is David ebridge with Thorn development uh we're here tonight for a storm water management permit for 266 mon ponset uh our proposal has a uh 30 unit building three stories going on the property uh the majority of the storm art management system will be underneath the parking area with some other smaller areas uh towards Mont ponson Street uh this project this proposal is uh consistent with a recent town meeting vote allowing this voting to be modified to allow such a project on this parcel as well as the municipal development agreement that just got uh recently signed so with that I'll turn it over to Greg trisal of jde civil to talk about the storm marer management okay thank you evening everyone great Dr JD civil here representing Thor development for 266 monasa Street um so uh go through the plantet here this is the Locust map you can see where the property is indicated here um site is located on the western side of Mona Street in Halifax it's located in resal zoning dist surrounded by residential uses and commercial use to the north uh this is a shopping plaza with a grow 58 Restaurant in it just north of the site buing the site um it's also within the newly created senior housing overlay District uh which allows multi family housing for people over 55 um to be developed on Lots located Tire within the district um so the the site is currently uh was previously a beach Farm um there was a SLE family home on the lot it's been since raised there's the remnants of the driveway located here a couple wed areas but it's mostly an open field um and there are no Wetland resource areas on the site so like we said we're here for St water permit um and F to the hosed layout plan just give you guys a note what we're proposing so this is a Clos 30 units um multi family um Farm building that we're proposing on the site uh four stores three three stores sorry um full access entrance on the southern side um an exit on Northern side um parking along the side on the back garage building along here the proposed um so this is the grading utility plan um the proposed drainage system is a trer system located underneath the parking lot uh the septic system will be located in the back are here um so it's going to be it's going to look like an open field of grass but there'll be a um perk right septic system under there uh we are collecting all our drainage and putting into the subsurface um chamber system for the most part uh there's a high point on either side of the driveways which e drain into fire retention areas uh to the South and the north of the driveways um to tra the runoff uh before it leaves the site uh we are the drainage design realizes reductions and Peak rates for all storm events and uh meets GSS remover U requirements and all the the standards of the the storm water management uh standards um I can flip to the post Development Area or drainage areas so there's a portion of the site to the north this was in the um drainage calculations um there's a portion of the commcial sites of the north that drains on to our property uh small portion that trins out towards Mont P Street majority of the site clows in this direction to the uh South and West and we have design point one the South and West property line and design point two is mon clet Street for proposed development the same design points about proper line and W Pon Street and this shows the cman areas that were that are draining either Overland this field area will drain Overland towards the golf course and the bik property the buildings the pavement all be treated into the uh chamber system and the portions of the driveways that are as it slopes down to the existing Street will be captured and sent into these bio retention areas next to the entrances uh so that's kind of the overview of what the drainage system is designed to do um any questions or I assume one one quick question for you though is you said that there's no Wetlands on the property was the pel delated recently yeah you no this when there's no map there is there's no map there is one our Woodland scientists went out there to uh to flag uh the parcel across the street he also inspected that and you know basically you know there's nothing to delineate so he didn't give us a plan of anything but he looked at that at that property for ws and found none okay all right and how large is the property is just something like an um yeah 1.52 Acres 1.53 something like that yeah 1 526 I don't know question being honest because this is not my specialty so the peer review process is is how we yeah yes abut understand if um if it's agreed upon right and and so that is what we would normally suggest but is this the one that is suggesting that we use a specific um peer reviewer or is that a different uh this is the one that they were asking for um Pat Brennan is that correct yeah I I called earlier today just because um usually the planning board I'm not sure of the exact jurisdictions between the concom and the planning board typically the planning board will look at the storm water management report hire a peer reviewer and that sort of thing so I was trying to um encourage the use of the same peer review person for each board so I didn't make any suggestions I was just hoping it would be the same person so it wouldn't have to go through the process you know twice for you know each board um do you have any questions yes is any of this obviously it's mostly going be contained on the property you said something about some of it going towards the golf course was it yep uh currently it flows in that direction now um the whole parking lot and everything that'll be captured and treated as it's supposed to be and then this portion of the um the site the offsite and then this area that'll be little be grass and it's going to be a park right uh septic system which is the the um drip tubing drip irrigation tubing uh will flow in the same direction that it is now on towards the GOL course property so this is the Overland area that's not being captured it's all regit there's no paved areas that need to be treated the paved areas that need to be treated are all contained and go into the catch basins and are treated with the strong system when it goes to the golf course is there any houses around that area or just heading towards the golf course is there a on that's heading toward us or just uh that's the way that it flows currently yeah this whole parcel just kind of grades in this direction right now there's a um there is a single family yeah there's a single family home basically right here so the this the right now there's it will actually reduce the amount of flow that goes to the single family home it'll reduce the amount of flow that goes to the design Point overall but more of it will go kind of this way uh toward that way won't go you said it's going to decrease it but would increase it on the back end did the property reaches that back end without where the current wat is going now oh you U no it's um we're reducing the the peak out flows for all the design storms um out let's see I mean and the 100e storm is weing more than half um the twoyear storm is very little coming out and then we're showing zero coming out of the proposed and the two and the 10 are about half of what the existing and similar to what's going to this small area going to yeah it looks like everything going to be caught so there's nothing going to be heading towards the road or affec um there's there's a small amount that heads towards the road currently yeah um this area right here so that's why B Street is a design point but we are pretty much capturing all of it up to there's no upflow in this direction to Z point2 on P Street except for the 100 a storm and that's 01 um% yeah so it's imp perceptable really it's it's going to capture and handle what's going into these areas so unless in 100 CS storm is not going to go towards the road at all correct yeah so we're we're reducing what's going towards the road you're reducing you said what's going towards the road now okay well that's what the peer review process is for so do we want to take comments from the audience how does that usually oh abut yeah we have any more comments anything well I just we do this first then we get you obviously like to see it peer reviewed so and I'm also um a little weary about not using the person that we typically use as a Conservation Commission so um that's just something that I would like to share with the other members just because we usually do stick with the same one and I assume that's for a reason but I haven't been here very long to really know um did the yeah did the planning board pick that person who they using or did you pick the Pres for both boards um I called and just um was asking to have the same person so we didn't pick anybody and um I I got the comment that I think it's um is it Brendan F enough or Brendon from the planning board no that you usually use as theom he's more of a um Wetland scientist than a civil engineer so this is this is something that's really specific to kind of civil engineering so it it may or may not I don't know it may or may not be in his wheelhouse but it's typically not in the kind of the perview of wetland scientist that's you really want a civil engineer who looks at hydrology and designs rology to peerreview it so um I'm familiar with Amy Associates when Walter Amy used to um own the place until he passed and uh so they they do civil engineering so but that's I didn't pick them I that's who they told me that uh they want to use yeah that's who the planning board told you no it was um I honestly I'm not sure I think I spoke with the uh administrator um today for um the planning board but um I just called so you were notified that that's who was being used uh I called I was saying I was trying to get the same person for each board and they said um uh she put me on hold for a while ran over to conservation she said and then came back and said um we'll put a note on the file for you guys this evening for Pat Brenan okay that's interesting um sorry um do you have a comment somebody over here yeah you can okay state your name and yeah my name is NE TR um um 10 Hillside Avenue number one it sounds like steering just from my point of view that you're going to come in here and say that you call the Town Administrator and you're going to declare who you want as a engineer so I would steer clear of that if I were you um it has not been in front of the planning board and um there I would actually look have you look at the plans and see if the sidewalks are out in front of the the property on the plan if the sidewalk are the sidewalks that are planned for the future the sidewalks I don't know it is because it'll affect the storm water management because those are supposed to go in according to the plan that they will give us a senior center which is not going to happen um there's sidewalks and pickle wall courts and all this other stuff that are supposed to go along so it should be planned for now CU if it's not guess what folks we're a big problem yeah the peer review will definitely look sidew with the sidewalk the sidewalk should be on that plan are they do you want to we have we're showing a sidewalk out Along on boset and um a crosswalk are you putting those in so let me let me let me speak to that so one this is submitted just for 266 mon Pon um the pickle ball courts the Senior Center Street the other two buildings are all across the street we'll be making a separate submitt for for that parcel that parcel as you know does have Wetlands on it based on our process with um the or previously so that's kind of a separate subm um so absolutely all the all the sidewalks that are shown on the plan will be installed on 266 and when we come back to you for 265 those will be shown there we also submitted simultaneously to the planning board um this this same plan so we submitted really on the same day so we're on their agenda for next week which we haven't even started to discuss yet go ahead yes William 340 P Street now is it okay to uh your 100 gear storm dump towards the golf [Music] course um it's not dumping uh you going to dump water you said your 100 gear storm the access is going to go towards the golf course under the the way that storm warer management works and Storer design the way we have to design sites is we study the site as it exists currently that's what this plan shows where the water flows currently Y and then we have to design our proposed projects so that we can't exceed the amount of water coming off to those design points in the future develop but you have wall to wall lot line to lot line you have you have a building you got asphalt you got another building you got a septic system and we have a large this is a chamber system for the yeah but is it going to handle that much water yes and the axis is going to go where this is all going to infiltrate into the ground right this area right here isn't going into the system this is going Overland right and that's okay though to go towards the golf course so run towards the golf course it does today that's where it goes where does it come from the golf course I know a lot of people that have the houses along in there that have trouble with their basements as it is MHM okay and we're going to be reducing them onun that goes in that direction I don't know how that's going to happen but okay that's my job the um so that what maybe you could describe that chamber system a little bit more kind of like what um what that actually looks like cuz it's it's hard to picture just from a plan view so it's a little bit easier if you see the ground's only going to soak up some much water and then round he's going to show you the chamber system yeah so it has a lot of bind underneath the par lot so it doesn't have to go instantly store it time so these are the the rows of the chambers this is what the chambers look like they're all interconnected um the catch Bas they collect the water how many gallons the tank um You can call it a large tank but they're 4T 3 ft tall oh no it's it's far larger than that so yeah the uh I mean your original PL everything is across the street all three story buildings were across the street the original buildings that's going to be a seate s yeah all three of those tall buildings three story buildings were across the street the first plan y so this this is the plan view of the chamber system so this is about 200 ft long and about 25 to 30 ft wide so that's the footprint of that and the whole system is about 4 ft deep it's got these basically if you've seen um ABS drain pipe kind of the black plastic stuff similar to that except it has just arches and then crushed filled all around it so again Crush Stone isn't completely uh it's again only has partial voids in you but under the Arches that's completely void you know for and has volume to store it and the footprint of the thing is quite extensive so that's going to handle all that roof and all the pocking lock yep just under just over 6,800 K Fe we're going to be putting this out to a per revie so we'll have somebody else check it all so question for you on the catch basins as far as maintenance of those will that be part of the submitt for um there's an operation manance plan included with the um water and I would proba have what does it recommend every year or every six months uh believe it's usually one of the other I probably want them to um maybe touch base with the Hala Conservation Commission when they do check them just to keep us in the loop that they're being maintained yeah we have some problems on projects and reinforce them all one one positive there resid here yeah one one positive about the scale of this is that there'll actually be a substantial budget associated with the Condominium Association and we have a group of Trustees that'll that'll run the show and this will be um these permits are made part of the condominium docks if they're required you know as part of their fiduciary responsibility as trustees to follow you're not tying you're not tying anything in with Grill 58 drainage correct we're actually taking some of their drainage or continuing to take some of their drainage onto our site well their drainage goes out back into the retention Pond not all yeah yeah they have a retention Pond back there but there's a portion of their comes we're not changing that and there's an inspection log that be filled out that's what could be submitted to you guys okay um and I know as far as the peer review I guess we could um look in to see if we can find anyone else since you guys wanted to look into Pat brenon I just want look to how the process is to find such a big project to find a proper pay review okay you know but so we could continue this into next meeting and then we can look into that in the meantime sure uh again whoever you want to use is fine um ter if you pick somebody I'm sure you for 53j yeah it would just be nice if it was the same for planning conom um the um uh yeah if we we can um I think previously we were able to kind of move that process forward um uh kind of offline if you will so if you choose the peer you know request a proposal you get the proposal let me know what it is and we can um you know fund the peerreview account um and then uh you know they can do their do their stuff and can schedule hearing accordingly so yeah if that can happen great um otherwise we'll be glad to you know attend just to discuss that m I personally don't mind having the same person do both but I just want to see the process how we picking that right sure did you want to um be put on the next agenda and then we can cancel it if it's all said prior to that yes that would be great uh there's another question oh go ahead I think that you should do a lot of due diligence here because the rest of the Town bylaws have been waved except for you guys okay so we're going to have to look at like different things to make sure that the turning radiuses and everything are all fine but we basically are hands tied you guys are the frontliner to make sure that this thre story building is and by the way I have a question um also how many bedrooms in this 30 apartment building uh to be determined so well your septic system should be designed for a certain amount of bedrooms how many sep it'll be less than that so we we kind of maxed out our our design of our leing field how many that's really a matter for the Board of Health and the planning board rather than but that's a very important part of this entire thing because how many bedrooms are going to be in that property is it going to be 30 * 3 cuz everything else is waved you guys are the only defense of this town do you understand this is a very serious undertaking that you have here if he puts in 33 bedroom apartments we have no say on that tell me now we have 90 bedrooms on a 1 and 1/2 acre prop property in the town of Halifax where you can only have what one house so think about this really long and hard I would have that flagged you can't just take the word for it you got to get it flagged for wet ons so you it don't spare them an expense have it flagged because you guys work for the town of Halifax residents you should pick a different peer review because more eyes on this project the better okay I would not go with the same one that they want no not what they want no it's just it's not for what they want he just said that he called the Town Administrator and the town he called the town the hell so he tried to he made the effort who else am I going to call good you're a Frontline defense for our town they put 33 bedrooms in there and you know what that's going to do to our schools what about all the F the fact that our four Wells are down right now we do we have enough water so you give them a cart launch un unless you really make them do you due diligence that's the only partt of the bylaw that we were able to save okay well we're not going to we're not going to give them a cop blunch well I want you to be a as a Halifax resident I'm asking you to make sure that you have it flagged okay for Wetlands please and I would don't take their word for it Kathy we can't get our town back after this all right and you should look into engineers and you should have another engineer on this because two eyes might see two different things and it should not be the same engineer for both especially if they called and asked for it it's called steering and that's a red flag please 100% you need to listen because this is a very important thing if there was a 40b it would have a thick 2 and 1/2 inch document that went through all of the boards okay all of them that would take them a long time and they were going to have to build a water filtration system they don't have to do that here all of our wells are down we're in really big trouble here you need to make sure that we do everything we possibly can another engineer and have it flagged no no expenses they are going to be able to make money off of this make them do the work before they ruin our town okay thank you um she did bring up one point I Des far as the wetlands it's like I would like to see it delineated unless it was already and I don't think it was um so there's nothing to delineate according to our Wetland scientist so so you scientist look at it yes yes so I can have them memo to that and you can have somebody do a peer review on that yeah if you want to have um you know sidew yeah he can you can do a sidewalk to confirm and then we can just have somebody come out and just confirm it sure and then we will look into as far as the um who to do the peer review for the stor Water Management um then we'll continue this to the next meeting if that's okay with everybody before we move on can I just say I I did appreciate Amy's point with getting a second having a second peer reviewer and I think because of that it hasn't been red delineated having the one that we typically have who knows a lot about Wetlands might be a good one to start with so they're going to they're going to um present something to us actually probably have you come back to the next meeting so you can bring that with you for the delineation um and then we can definitely send that out to the pru to Brandon okay anything else anybody can we make sure that we don't make any decisions outside of the meeting this is a hearing and it's a public hearing so we cannot make any decision I don't want any decisions made on who's going to be the engineer outside of a hearing so when you guys we just we just ask them to come back so we will discuss it at the next meeting okay thank you y all right so we will continue this to the next meeting is March 26 um 7:00 I put a motion to continue this for 7:00 on the 26th I'll second that motion all in favor I I okay thank you very much we'll see you in a couple [Applause] weeks the next thing at 705 is the mononon Solitude Lake management uh they had an order of conditions extension request uh is anybody here for that yes Sol to Lake management um so yes we're Sly requesting extension of the current order conditions for um the management of invasive plants in both East and West mon ponsa um last we don't anticipate any management no management was done in 2023 the last time we managed invasive plant was 2022 uh but as a contingency to really kind of have the purpose and effect in the event that additional or maintenance management is required um for the town we're asking that they order be extended um did this come before Hansen also um it will yes it will yes y I would probably go for asking you to put a new application in I don't know if you have any thoughts if you have any thoughts um on it I don't have any thoughts on this okay would there be a reason for needing a an another application it's the exact same pram did you have any I'm curious how long you're you're asking for it to be extended an additional 3 years 3 years you said that that does seem excessive to as far as um the plan with invasive plants and how quick things can change and to extend that for 3 years does seem like quite a lot so I understand what Kathy's saying yeah um and if it's the same you can just come before us if it's going to be the same thing just bring that forward to us yeah it was certainly an additional expense to the town if we have to refile but that's fine that's the prerogative of the commission did anybody have any questions oh did you I'm sorry yeah I was going to say what if it's just um if you don't anticipate that it's a problem right now and that's why you're wanting to extend the order of conditions what if you just ask for shorter extension instead of you're willing to grant that I mean we take whatever exception that the commission was willing to Grant and so that's sort of a compromise if it's if it's being just let me help help me understand why you're you're asking for the order of conditions again is it because you do not anticipate well no we don't anticipate but we don't anticipate any change to the management program um so therefore rather keep it in place and the order valid in the event that the conditions require management then that would afford the town the ability to move forward with management without having to reperit so it it expedites the process in terms of implementation and two um it certainly avoids the EXP additional expense to the town of having to refile the same notice okay all right I understand is there anything new that's come up over the years as far as um managing no um so this was filed in 2021 so really it's all the same techniques that we anticipate would be that are available and would be used in this particular instance um are all incorporated into that filing from 2021 um interesting extending like a year a year and a half that's what I that that's my feeling on it months very new here as you know but I think that um just because of how quick things can change within these species that extending it 3 years um it might not cover what we need you know we might need a new plan if things yeah I say we do cut in half 18 months extension okay I'm so I feel better about that yeah a year would be even better okay yeah that's a year a year would be better okay how about we um extend it till April 20th 2025 very good okay make a motion did anybody have any questions in the audience no okay are you make the motion I'll make the motion to extend the order of conditions for for one year um to be it's 4 20 2025 is that correct yes I second motion all in favor I okay thank you good for you all right thank you and we just have some discussions uh 285 Home Street anybody here for that is it 288 homes 288 I guess it was well talk to Pig you said it was that they had the oh correct address it was 285 okay it does say 288 there though no I'm here for two and I apologize I'm not sure it was a complaint regarding storm water runoff yes on the complaint oh okay is the um owner of 285 home studio no clue I guess you guys sent the letter to him so clearly he didn't show yes I have to be honest I don't know is that the place near the real checks correct okay I'm somewhat familiar with it okay um yeah there's a lot of runoff water going towards the street um they cut down a bunch of trees which they got no permission to approximately 2 Acres yep um which is probably C most a lot of this yeah so basically what they did is they did a SL remov they didn't you know didn't put a store you know a perit in actually didn't even apply for our management plan our apartment U we removed almost 2 Acres a little bit over 2 acres of land trees graded it down brought recycled materials back into the property compacted it all so I mean it's all impervious that the water run off's crazy I mean it's it's constantly flowing over the street and also we cutting down these strees that it killed privacy for neighbor yes yeah so I mean just going by the swm Water Management plan I mean yeah defin more one put in on this yeah there's some issues here was this put in front of another Bard anything it's been front planning board has took well put you on the spot was this part in front of the planning board recently yes at our last meeting um was the landlord there any owner renter the uh appear to be like one of the owners that was with a lawyer the lawyer was there uh yeah they should definitely be a water management we should definitely enforce that have them do that also replace the trees yeah um so we'll have to um definitely get yeah they did what they want seems like so we'll send out another especially if it BL running down the street I think that's somewhat connected to the Watershed almost in that area yeah so that's actually part of the m at Watershed their property is on the M watered and there actually a high yield water aquifer on the corner of their property they actually um installed leing basins that they provided their whatever they got their calculations or their plans for but Liddell themselves installed these leion basins and actually the leion Basin is installed in the high yield water arer and I provided photographs to you guys showing that that's clearly not working because it's still it's I mean I got 14 pages of used mass mapper and found out the impervious areas and what's what's considered Watershed I mean it goes on and on and on I mean they get away with it and it's just time of I think maybe another letter with um no certifi but they have to they have to come up with some type of plan to yeah if they doing anything with that property yeah so I know they brought a plan as far as their their the water runoff and stuff like that in front of the wood yeah but they FR this board or no in front of they haven't been in front of yeah know I've done my research still want management usually falls under the conservation so I mean not I mean you can go into EDS and we can go into ms4 regulations I mean they're violation left and right soil soil removal without permits is there anything we can do to well we can certified letter with fines that's what between one and 3 acres I mean it's $700 fine plus the $25 yeah so I mean they're they're adding up I don't want to get into the fines and adding all the stuff like that I just want to be a good neighbor but I'm trying to hold them accountable I mean we're all held accountable in the town by bylaws and take the peram stuff like that and that's what I've always done so I mean I just don't understand how they're getting away with it I mean they're working on vehicles on the property they got vehicle storage out there so what water is running off vehicles and Into the Storm running off into yeah I mean it's actually going above and beyond the the the drainage on on home street and crossing over into the wetlands across the street so I mean there's serious issues you know yeah definitely certified letters but it sounds like we're can we start implementing fines before the certified letter or do we have to wa until after that's proven that it's been received and then they didn't come before us okay so then I would just certifi that would ask them to come before us as soon as that's legally possible so that we can start implementing fines as soon as legally possible if they continue to ignore the requests of the board uh quick question who's going to be doing the letter because but we don't have a off I'll ask Our Town Administrator see if he can get somebody to write the letter all right okay thank you thank you thank you um see the next thing on here was 471 honet Street a complaint about regarding the trash Appliance junk buildup on the property was anybody here for 4711 pon so that was before us I think before so we have to what was do we know what was done before I don't think I don't know if anything was done um we could send own a letter out to the owner because if it's right on the water I believe okay you remember correctly fought on fire last year yes yes and there was something about people were going to come help the person but but anyways I think we got to yeah send a letter out to him to come for us cuz that needs to be cleaned up cuz I don't know what's going into the water since they've already been before us I don't know if they have I don't they I think other people follow them they going to help clean it up but but I don't think the owner ever been here no I don't think so either another letter yeah another certified letter I sounds like the situation they they don't have much income or something we don't know but we just got to cuz we set F we'll send out a letter see if they can come before us see if we can get this taken care of so they haven't come before us so I do not believe they have so there's implementing fin for what they've done on the property but then is there a smaller lesser fine for just not coming before us I think maybe just we'll send a letter up this time just to see if we can get them to come before us um and is what is the consequence to them ignoring that letter because it seems like that happens frequently so I'm just curious if there is what the consequences are for just not coming in front of the board has board help been there to check out the I believe so we can check with them but yeah is the Board of Health if for health reasons there's a lot of debris around the house or inside the home okay all right so I would request that we look into um what repercussions there are for not coming before the board when requested and um you know so that we can notify them of that with the LA yeah let it be fine so um and then let them know that if they don't come before us we will begin implementing those fines if there are fines involved with not for us if we're allowed to do that um to to speed up the process because it seems like people typically just ignore the the letters until the finds begin so right but next thing was 48 M Street and that was just a resident complaint work being done within 200 ft of a perennial dream and I did ask that this be put on for the discussion only because um I think was Jeremy you brought the brought this up when this um this was a single family um house being constructed and when it was brought before us on the plans it said it was a pond but it is I guess not a p a stream it depends so this is where things get a little confusing it's a river okay okay uh it's obviously there's a formal Mill site there called furnace Street uh enacted but then you have furnace street that creates a artificial creates a levy uh but it's when you look it up on USGS um it identifies it as a paral stream in the South River Basin if you look at the uh Watershed that it drains it's pretty massive I mean pretty much from fruit 36 in the what's that little town between south of Hansen there it's kind of plon the name of it brille so basically you know stun broke snaky River Sal River it's all the same thing whatever it's all the same water shed it's a it's a massive area so one thing they look at in determining what a stream or a pond is is what its drainage basin is it's a pretty big drainage Bas you're talking about from bryantville like little sandwich sh there bryantville pizza right there Route 36 just to the U west of there all of bur all of uh M Pon and Halifax North of uh 105 drains that way to Robins pant so it's a very big drainage area it's definitely a river because there's current flowing to it at all times uh and especially right now um and and you know the river protection act basically says that the 200 ft between the high water mark is a resource area area in itself it's not a buffer zone that's the resource area so therefore I think that project needs an noi an order of conditions and I think that uh there should be a permit a d permit out there there because that's not just a small little thing it's building what a four-bedroom house you know the thing is it's already been approved so I don't think there's anything no you no it hasn't been approved by D it's been approved by you which was incorrect it needs to go through the process and if you guys want to pick and choose you as to follow the bylaws that's that's your business but let me make my statement please everybody there's a process everybody has to go through okay and all I'm asking for is the person who bought that lot should have researched it beforehand so when Mr Grady came in here and called it upon and didn't want to go through with the noi why didn't he want to go through with the noi you know that's in a resource area it's even if it's consider it's a pond some 100 ft you need an noi you need to submit that and the Order of conditions to mass the EP that's how it works you guys areed supposed to be enforcing the weapons protection act okay so it's not that hard to go back and do your job I'm not saying tear it down I'm saying he needs the proper permits it's is not fair to give people special conditions you know take the cheap way out so nobody's notified just get the permits in place get some concessions on the buffer zone that's all that's where I'm trying to get the Haring back to M Pon has to come right past there I'm asking do the proper process and now you brought it to our attention I'm not saying with this project but at least in future projects if there's anything that's we can always send everything out for peer reviews because we you should have done this already you should we we did but we didn't we didn't well you should correct your mistakes that's all I'm asking can I just ask some questions here um so if it was if it came before us I wasn't here yet but if it came before this board incorrectly and it said it was a pond but it was that is not correct so what is the recourse there because if you approved it based on inaccurate information then that shouldn't be valid and and we should be able to have it delineated and have it come before us correctly if it was an administrative or clerical error or there was a problem when they came before us or before this board um there should there must be some recourse because it came before us incorrectly if it was saying it was a pond and it is not a pond which we would have to I think have have it delineated I assume to to know for sure um but if we if there was that error then there should be a way of correcting it um and and reaching out to them and saying we discovered there was an error and and you are here right you're here for yes so I apologize for not talking to you before Oh I apologize I didn't realize that you were the owner are you the owner sir so I am the permanent holder and Tom is the the owner of the property Tom sell my name is Nick rasher and I'm going to take some extreme exception to some implications you just made one of which is there were shortcuts taken or favors granted or anything like that that was not the case right we follow the procedure we hired registered Professional Engineers they submitted the documentation to this board all right you insinuate that we didn't do our due diligence we absolutely did all right and so to imply and insinuate what you did is really not appropriate I think Jeremy was implying that we didn't this board didn't do it I heard different way okay sorry I wasn't actually saying kind of both ways but the law is so complex I wouldn't expect you to know the law expect you to hire an engineer and that engineer to to know the wetlands laws so I'm not I'm not saying that you didn't do that I believe you did do that we did do that okay and money was spent and we have a letter that was in the record all right that talks about why it was a pawn so it wasn't on a USGS map scream according to people we hired and we have a map here that doesn't show it it listed as a pond so there could be conflicting information in the world I agree uh that's possible but nobody here did anything wrong we came before we did what we were expected to do we required to do receive the permit we've started construction all right so uh this is I wouldn't have known about this in any way we came to give an asilt of the foundation today to the building ctor and he said you know you have a problem I said well what he said there's a a conom problem I said what do you mean the house is exactly where it's supposed to be we we had the silt fence inspected we we followed the order of commission we did what we were supposed to do and he said oh no is there a question about whether it's a stream or a pawn well so here we are and uh I mean if you're going to go back and and and redo then you should look at every decision you've made for the past 15 years okay maybe you want to start there because certainly that's not unreasonable if you're going to do this this one time all right this goes back to 2020 four years ago and you say you know we get an noi what would change the location of the foundation I think that no I don't think you have to change that I think the the fact is you do not have a de D permit there was no order of conditions sent to D which is that anytime that you're doing work within a buffer zone or resource area everybody should have to go through the same process which is you bring it in front of the Conservation Commission either through an RDA or if you already know it's a resource area just go ahead with the noi I don't know why Grady did it as a an RDA you should know I a question what time did you know he did this what what is your well one thing I uh have been working with Brad Chas Department of marine fisheries on heing restoration through stump Brook that's going to come right up that River um so what I saw the house being you know everything being graded you you've referenced the history of how this came before so there re there was just a lot sitting there for a long time you see something change you started questioning things so one thing he came before us he didn't have to do the D the noi because the house was outside the 100 foot based on it based on I looked at the print based on it being the whole property it was outside the 100 foot that's why and the whole intention of me bringing this today was just to say how we could be more diligent in the future as far as getting peer reviews it wasn't to have you stopped doing anything that we've already approved of now if my other board members feel different then we can discuss it but this was already approved I I feel like we need to know if that's a Ponder stream so I'm just not sure how we find that out after the fact I think you should ask somebody m is this a or is this a stream and honestly it can change because with what we're hoping to do I mean that whole area May shink and the question is not whether it's a p stream now all right the question only was whether a Ponder stream when this was applied for that's a different question okay because understood and and that is is the question is it a p or a stream we was it a p or a stream we have a registered professional all right U who says Brad holes professional Wetland scientist number 1464 says it's a PA and we didn't have a peer reviewed so sorry I'd like to know now so that's why I'm saying in future we had put everything out for peer review so we can get the second opinion could it have been presented to you in an incorrect way on purpose excuse me I it just a question I don't think we need to to get angry about that I think it's a valid question if it could have been well the but if it could have been because okay but not to you personally not specifically what if that was to happen right and we didn't send it out for peer review so Kathy has a very good point and Amy has a good point here which is if that did happen not saying it did in your case and not did happen not and it was not peer-reviewed how would we know so Kathy has a very good point here that the process moving forward should we should just make sure it goes to peerreview just be just in case like somebody in theory not personally here in theory somebody could come with before this board they could be friends with somebody who who makes it say something that they would like it to say if we don't have a peer reviewed we wouldn't know sure well let's stay on the case of this one because this yeah they went through the proper procedur and I'm not implying that you didn't I I took Jeremy's question as this board didn't and and I kind of concur with Jeremy that we need to make sure not that it was intentional of course but that we need to make sure that things like what Amy just said the what if these guys are Professional Engineers okay if they do something like what's being implied they could be sued they could be sued they they lose your license they don't they can't work anymore it happens all the time we've had people PVE into the lake so cont go to a governing body and get on this specific property go to mass and say I need somebody to tell me for a fact is this not a stream or is it a pond and then once that's determined then I mean like I said I'm not opposed to the house but once you get that determined then you move forward with what the resolutions are maybe an increased buffer zone maybe it goes into a deed that you're going to allow this much extreme Bank to remain untouched he still getes his house he still gets a driveway whatever else man everybody everybody's happy but it's just unfair that things seem to happen and they're not consistent that's all I'm saying 4 years ago okay does anybody else have anything else to say on this discussion about this specific property I would just say that I do like the idea of finding out if it is currently a stream or a pond and then back to that date if it was in fact a stream or pond because if the decision was based on incorrect information there might be some recourse it should be Revisited if there if it's wrong should be Revisited I believe yeah it should be Revisited to see what it is if it is a river we probably try to put some stipulations what you can like the D EP what land you can't do anything on this part or that part like there should be some and and so that's my suggestion but they did go to the proper steps this individual property um I don't I would like to know so that we can just discuss it with that new information and just just as a board discuss it I mean of course you're welcome to come to public hearing but discuss with the new information what recourse could be taken you know what options there are how how it happened that it was brought to us incorrectly or brought to this board incorrectly that I would just like to know that and I and we can't really go further without understanding if it's a stream or a pond and and was it a stream or a pond at the time so that's my suggestion is that that I don't know if it's you Kathy or if it's that we don't have a secretary at the moment who who would be reaching out to M EP but I would like that to be determined yeah yeah see what it is and obviously if someone wants to build something similar to that area obviously we have to correct information right okay but as far as and P reviews off so yeah as far as this property here that's already been approved I just don't know yeah leg I would like future agenda once we have the information I we can ask Town Council we should just stop working I I'm not the process of sure no I don't I don't think so we we need to find out quickly um if it's a a ponderous stream and if it's um a stream we need to at our next meeting you know discuss it again again so that's what I suggest I personally we have a another go ahead coordinators I would suggest that um Miss Martin plant reach out to D get the answer and then schedule another meeting for you guys as soon as you can that way they're not held up you get an answer back they're going to move forward they've got plans they got money they got contract is lined up so you can get an answer and schedule a special meeting okay are we allowed to discuss this administratively between me and you about that and um and scheduling a meeting is that allowed between two people it's not Cur not is not three yeah okay okay so yes I I don't see any problem with that what is your opinion no yeah find out it's obviously if it's a stream upon think we probably have to T the C too cuz they did get approval from the they get approval I don't see yeah I honestly don't see how we can tell you not to go forward with something that you came forward that you went through the right channels so so there are a number of universes now this channel being opened up that you've open the door to okay with this decision about this particular property that involve the DP stepping in saying well it's this and therefore you have to abide by the rules which are have very strong implications about what what can be built on that right is that correct yes yeah okay so you don't that hasn't been stated but let's state it all right right out there that implies that the job stops we're not suggesting that at this point we need to rediscussed with the new information so so you're not making a decision all right right without information you're saying continue at your own Peril is that my understanding for you to continue what you imp perel he's noing said yes I think that's the case yeah that's the implication continue your own Peril our own Peril after having it approved going through the correct jails just need to be clear about this I would not be recommending any kind of penalties or fines based on well I say I say our own Peril in that the job may have to stop may have to be moved there could be a number of other consequences here all right that you're opening the door to that have serious Financial consequences you need to be aware of that and what that implies for to but if the if the information is if the information that it is a river then and you're doing the work now not 4 years ago cuz you got your approval four years ago so if you did the information all I'm saying is if the information changing now that you're doing the work yeah then the implication would be on the developer it it would be it wouldn't be on the town if the information that was presented wasn't I'm not saying you guys did I'm not I'm not saying La no you shouldn't have an opinion about this because I don't think that's the case when you uh get a permit all right the conditions of the permit they change the building code for example yeah the time of what you got the permit is how the building code is applied going forward show something that somebody is challenging that's there you're saying that it says X somebody else is saying that's why we have we have a professional engineer stamp this I think right now we're just going to close this we're not stopping you from doing anything we're going to for our own information we'll look into this as far as the river but I don't see how we can stop you from going through with something that you have already gone through the proper channels and got the approval um we though as a board we can call the to get their information you know a future reference we can always talk with Town Council to see if there's anything we can do if something like this happens again or if there's something they feel that they can do with this particular property then we'll contact you but I and I'm not an attorney I don't know but I can't see us asking you to stop because you went through the correct channels does anyone else have any yet no I agree okay so we'll um so this discussion is um then have a question go ahead jimy from M Street I I don't know anything about this project I don't know what he's building but it sounds to me like what you're saying is you're going to let him continue to build and you're not you don't intend to stop them but down the road if you find out otherwise than what you know now you're going to stop them then no we're planning on doing this as soon as humanly possible and finding out the information and then having possibly a special meeting if it does turn out that it's different than what we believed it was at the time because like Jeremy said it can change so if at the time when he came before this board it was something different than what was brought to this board then we need to have a meeting as soon as possible and so we will reach out and do that but that's we're talking about days hopefully we're we're not talking about you know weeks or months we're going to do it as soon as possible it's our it's I think the responsible thing to do and our only option at this point so you're not going to let them continue to build and then 3 months from now find out something different to stop if we no we're not it's not going to take that long if we find out that it at the time when they applied it was something different than what they said then or what they were told then we have to reconvene and discuss what to do from there that's all that's all we're doing so can you tell him now that he will be able to continue to she just did yeah I I I don't know him I don't know but I I can see his position right now got here the way I I was hearing it it looked like you know okay go ahead and build and then 3 months from now you know you had to tear no and You' already got the foundation in so right yes yeah so yeah I I believe that uh in my email that I sent I said we don't want somebody building a house not knowing or buying a house not knowing that they actually violated a state law you know or fed law or whatever and then getting find because you guys as a board don't know the law or didn't know the law and the law is complicated regarding wetlands and River protection all that stuff I mean my only suggestion was usually when you're uh doing a new construction project within the 100ft bucker upon River stream anything wetlands needs to be a permit on file from D all I'm asking uh you guys as a board is to to get the facts if it is in fact a river then all you're asking for and all the state would probably ask for is a little bit of concessions with the buffers that's all just talking about tearing down houses or anything that we'll talk about it do have to be the all right thank you for coming thank you thank you yeah um going to go the next one is do you wait quick we have contact information for oh yeah because um if we needed to get a hold of you so uh yeah write it down for you how yeah you write it down dude you don't want to speak over there I can write [Music] it this is the we [Music] that thank you and thank you for coming thank you very much you're welcome thank you for explaining you want this right here want to keep this you have a copy yeah we have copies okay yeah we'll take it with us also a just thank you very much thanks thank okay next thing on our discussion with Stock and Shop at Basin uh they were cleaned and cleared on February 9th uh 2024 by cam partners and um they are going to now do them yearly and they'll let us know when they are doing them they'll keep us informed okay that's good to good and then um see on the inter office fos just the board of Selectmen uh the aif restoration Committee Member is sit at its meeting held on February 27th the board unan unanimously voted to resurrect the existing Al wife committee Al wife committee's primary function will be to restore the AL wife hering to the mon Pon pans and then for does Jeremy want to say anything to that or it's just me right now yeah it's just you okay uh yeah we'll get a committee together um and uh anything that need to do we go through the proper process okay thank you uh bills to be approved the Express Newspaper uh for 265 Monon Street anybody motion approve the bills I'll second that motion all in favor BS over there are they in here somewhere let me see if I have [Music] them okay so the signature for the solitude management is if approved the extension we need to signor still doing I you got it I don't see him found him we can approve them in silent okay have sign this one and so to the conditions say thank you just signed that one and then the um yeah then the mon solitud leg management let's see I was going to say Kathy I don't think we should be signing it because we didn't approve it as written well I didn't see it is it been do you know how it was written oh no I just assumed it was for the three years so maybe it isn't maybe we can fill in that date or cross it out I'm not sure I haven't found it okay let's see uh that's the sign that's 48 that information signatures required yes so this is for the extension um you can just put a topic up one authorization um just can we just exit out initially well it says his issue date was yeah just extended one year on it but I don't know what the this is just the signature page so it's if approved so I guess I could write um uh yeah yeah extended to 29 25 we extended it to uh we extended it one year no that was up here it was on April it's 420 according to this we did so it's going to be 420 2025 okay so all right extended to 420 2025 one year okay sign that one here's that guy's information for full thank you and I make a motion to adjourn can I bring up one more thing first um the rues talking about policies and procedures keeps seems like it gets bumped when we have a busy meeting but then it doesn't get put back on when we don't have a bus so how do we do that how do we make sure we can put it on the next meeting okay all right yeah then we need a full board we need a full board um so we just need full board as far as who's on it so we just have to make sure that Kim is coming to the next meeting do we absolutely need a full board because what good idea to have the full board if we're going to be doing policy and procedures okay yeah okay all right anything else nope make a motion to adjourn I have I motion have aour for the evening I'll second that motion all in favor thank you guys thank [Music] you [Music]