##VIDEO ID:UTE8NlU7iis## all right we are having our Highland Park planning board meeting for August 8th 2024 this meeting is called to order annual notice of the meeting was provided to the home News Tribune The Star Ledger and the Highland Park planet on January 23rd 2024 in addition notice of this meeting via Zoom was emailed to the home News Tribune The Star Ledger and the Highland Park planet on January 23rd 2024 and was posted on the burrow website at www.hpborrow.com and on the bulleon board at bur Hall at 2:21 South fth Avenue Highland Park New Jersey and has remained continuously posted as required by law fire exits are to the left and right of Chambers here and as a reminder to everyone to please speak into the microphone when you are talking so that the recordings can pick up on you so let's take roll call please miss an here Mr I dorfer here M here Mr Laris here Mr Malay here Mr Pearlman here Mr Stern Cardell here Mr Williams here Mr Lynch here Mr cenza here Mr C here that's thank you very much all right we have three items on our agenda tonight I'm going to switch up the order just a little bit and start with the two resolutions sent to us from Council the first one being a resolution from burrow Council of the burrow of Highland Park authorizing the planning board to conduct a preliminary investigation to determine if block 2201 blots 678 9 10 46 47 and 48 constitute an area in need of Redevelopment with powers of ident domain pursuant to local Redevelopment Housing law njsa 40a 12 A-1 Etc and authorizing Professional Services agreement with Looney Rick's kiss to conduct the area in need of Redevelopment study uh so this is a directive sent to us from Council to undertake this study right Matt yes so with this there isn't anything to have public comments on because we are simply undertaking the resolution that Council has directed us to undertake right correct all right so that I think we just need a motion to under take the resolution from Council right so move motion by pedri second seconded by KRA can we take a roll call V or Voice vote loc call can you take a roll call on the vote please yeser yes M yes Mr Laris yes Mr Malay yes Mr Perman yes Mr St Cardel yes Mr Williams yes m yes and that'll take us to the second resolution which is pretty much identical to the previous one with different blocks and lots it's a resolution from burrow Council of the burough Highland Park authorizing the planning board to conduct a preliminary investigation to determine if block 1704 Lots 43 46 and 49 constitute an area in need of Redevelopment with powers of eminent domain pursuant to local Redevelopment and Housing law and JSA 4A col 12 A-1 Etc and authorizing a Professional Services agreement with Rick's kiss to conduct the area need of Redevelopment study so can I get a motion to undertake the resolution from borrow Council moot motion by pedri second seconded by KRA can we take another roll call vote Please Mr eor yes Miss hadhazi yes Mr lenar yes Mr Malay yes Mr Perlman yes Mr St Cardel yes Mr Williams yes M yes all right that'll take us to the bulk of the rest of this evening's presentation which will be a consistency review on ordinance number 24-28 n an ordinance of the burough Council of Highland Park authorizing adoption of the quote upper raron Avenue Redevelopment plan pursuant to local Redevelopment and Housing law um and so forth uh our job tonight is to determine if the ordinance as presented to us us is not inconsistent with our Town's master plan for those of you following along at home our Town's master plan can always be found at www.hpborrow.com under the master plan Tab and with that I'm going to turn this over to Chris cassena our planner to give us an overview of what's in the ordinance thank you first I will share my screen good thank you um first of all for all thank you for taking action on the first items that mean it's two more projects do and then hopefully get one completed so that's good progress right so I will start with the the impedance for this project upper Gard Avenue plan so this actually started back in 2021 uh the bur was approached by a couple interested Property Owners developers what can they do with their properties within the upper area Corridor and had to be close together so the burrow decided to bur Cil decided to initiate a development plan first a concept plan study sort to see what really fits in then prepare a plan for those blocks I'll get into detail where they're located um normally doesn't take this put together a re plan uh I would say to be honest lot of pits and starts for this particular one because it wasn't a high priority soly because only because there's so much activity going on downtown other uh other studies being made other plans so we actually had to re up a new contract in 2023 to really get this plan in completion um but don't take that to think that this is a typical process to complete a plan in three years if you read through the report feels understand that it's not that complex and if you really did read the report you'll see that it's extremely consistent with the master plan which I'll get into in some detail so terms of the overview presentation I'll give you or the presentation I'll give you tonight uh getting an overview generally where we are with theel plan procedure uh some description about the property area project area so this condition just for background purposes really what the vision is for this uh re plan and then some plan requirements not with regards to exact all the components of the plan that's in the document but mainly the Zoning for the property how that's different than in the underlying zoning so generally speaking uh we are in the Northeast portion of the community on upper ran avenue Route 27 uh is bisected by South 11th Avenue with South 10th to the bottom of the slide there or to the west and Maryland Avenue to the east these are two full block faces facing on Route 27 and where we are in the procedure as you know B Council authorized the preparation of a plan and have directed the preparation of that plan to lrk once it was at a point of read for introduction refal Council introduced it within the past few weeks and and we are now at the stage of where the planning board is uh undertaking a consistency study or report to determine whether or not is consistent master plan then it goes back to council for second reading of adoption and that is when the zoning picks so generally speaking as I mentioned between South 10th bisect by South 11th and Maryland to the east the really the project area is dominated by uh open exposed parking lots uh you have the not the JY L but LOL property that is that's the property name of it you got the Central Veterinary Clinic next door a multi family building at the corner which is not a conforming use you have a single family home which is a conforming use but actually in a different Zone uh and then on the east side we have an office building with the rear apartment lot actually a lovely building good condition uh but there's a large wood lot on the Maryland portion there's no steep SLS there so that's for exist conditions in terms of the existing land use as I mentioned the Luol property is commercial Focus oriented you have the office uses in the center of the block between South 10th 11th multi family building at the corner by South 10 and sorry 11 and the um single family home L that's slot number seven on the other block to the east you have a commercial use and bacon land which really property almost the entirety of the project area is in a CA commercial Zone which does not permit residential uses anywhere of any type uh and then in the beige color you'll see the lot seven is in the single family ra Zone and has a per use this uh condition where the block fa is about 150 ft deep from Route 27 at least on the south side of 27 it's pretty consistent throughout the corridor up to Edison on the north side you'll see a lot of jaged blocks uh triangular shape and that's because it'll way the streets Converge on Route 27 from the north so what the master plan what does it say about the this particular quarter first of all the 2019 master plan examination desire was to really create a desirable living and work environment for really to respect unique T qualities of park with regards to this specific quar other RAR I have we had a Focus area of this Corridor among four others in the master plan and you'll note that uh in the survey results we asked the question how many of you would like to keep the quarter of the same only 5% did which means 95% of people want to change and the common issues raised in the master plan during the uh public engagement process through openhouse and online survey results was that there was a number of unsafe Crossings lack of safe pedestrian facilities B bicycle infrastructure business vacancy was rather High there's exposed parking lots there's absence of Street trees Planters benches public art other Street Furniture other concerns raised were really it's no sense of arrival which it's more of a Gateway feature but I think that it's prevalent throughout the corar were have we come into Holland Park and that condition extends down all the way to six Avenue uh and then there's little mix of businesses and activities and of course no ex use buildings with regard to this specific Corridor again uh one of the vision statements that was established was and I'll just read directly from the master plan to evolve to meet current conditions and ersing Trends by transforming outbe of commercial corridors into safer more attractive and little whole complete streets by enriching the mix of uses in enhancing the gateway to finally create that sense of arrival and with regard to how do we achieve that the strategies several of them were put into all four specific to the upper and na cordor uh number one well I'm read three of them there's several others one is uh transform a barari it's pretty simple number two activate the quar and number three which I like to say this I make sure why are we doing as well Custom Tailor infill and use Redevelopment to achieve that Vision utilizing site specific Redevelopment plans for uses Desire by res and to address varying property assemblages on a range of different block conditions and this is one example have different block conditions and this is sort of like the tested of sorts you could have done a r don't plan for the entire Corridor or just done a resoning effort but since there is interest after 2019 m is adopted to potentially develop some of these properties with zoning does not permit the something the community wants just appropriate process to consider Redevelopment to make that happen and as far the not through the master plan reexamination ever but the circle bicycle pedestrian plan noted this area High um incidents of traffic and pedestrian hotpots have couple fatalities recently yes uh one of the the street section that was proposed for the upper r Avenue Corridor is the introduction of light lanes and that believe that project is sort of moving forward on a different track uh but that does speak to what we're trying to do in terms of land use perspective which is to create that font condition which that buildings on the street activate the sidewalk with uses again perspective add Street trees add a attractive uh streetcape and ensure an active public real and going back to those photos that are in the plan I just want to highlight uh one of the properties that we did look at at the master plan as a not really a case study but like a what if and we've done the number of those you can see actually in the par slides there were four little sites just as an example these are the conditions of upper rare sort of Representative the conditions of upper r Avenue and one of the photos Ed is the top right photo we see brassa Jewelers on the left and you see look all property in the corner well during the master planning process we took a look at that and we did a sketch study what what would it look like with an infill building and this happened to be complete by coin coincidence it's not even two years later someone says I want to do that so what is the vision for the plan again Simple Plan um I'm hoping this won't be a long meeting so I'm already at the vision statement on this wait till we get to track see that we me so vision for this particular project area contemplates creating safer pedestrian environment and Shifting the corridor towards a mixed of uses rather than just solely Automotive Focus uh commercial uses investment promotes a mix limited ground floor commercial uses where appropriate and primarily Upper Floor residential uses and I say primarily because we also are considering well if there's no market for commercial on the ground floor at least we should give the flexibility of some residential on ground floor stay tuned uh and have primary Upper Floor residential uses and to keep the quarter activated by pedestrians throughout the day and appropriate uses that mix well with each other uh a mix use or multi family buildings are prioritized for infield development over story commercial uses which are prevalent throughout the corridor uh and then also try to preserve or at least put in place uh transition appropriate transitions between what would be potentially developed and the existing single family residential uses to the South uh traffic calming and OB public ground improvements are important to creating that livable Boulevard we're trying to create with that street section you saw with regards to Upper Avenue obviously we can't there's really no role from a langage perspective we can play in what happens with the street section B that that is the bike lanes and the road diet but any Redevelopment could include forming a street wall and activating the street that all plays a role in improving that pedestrian walk from at least the South 10 through mland so plan requirements I'm going to go through land use bul regulations standards and some public benefits uh quite simply um we put we includeed a diagram into the plan because we want to make it clear this is what the plan allows again very very simple keep the buildings up up front close to the street park it in the back that's we're trying to show that you can't build it in the back anymore uh if there's an opportunity for side street buildings the concept is that that may not be appropriate because we're trying to really improve that transition uh from the rear parking lot to the neighboring buildings because at this point it's in some cases it's already wooded and I think there's already concerns of if there's any development in future will the trees go away well the idea is that if the buildings are up front you have sufficient parking and back there would be more than sufficient space to reserve and add into bu in terms of the land uses multi family apartments are going to be permitted which is not permitted in underlying zoning uh this includes some apartments on the ground floor there will be uh an allowance for common spaces as we imagine for multi building which would be lobbies physical fitness uh active preparation space really to drive home to the point where just because they're apartment on a ground floor you can still have active spaces on the ground floor such as workout space and what not there's still an allowance for a business use and we encourage through a reel agreement to consider some limited commercial use if it's uh marketable and for example we were encouraged developer on the proper to perhaps a corner store the whole first floor doesn't have to be residential otherwise you're have as what you as many of our planners see throughout the country the four story mix use buildings it's everything's filled up on the three floors above it but the first floor is empty of commercial space so we're trying to avoid that situation happening just allow for flexibility and really respond to the market uh and again continue to allow for a range of non residential uses which obviously mix use building won have a oriented uses but may have some limited retail restaurant take out of what happen spes in other words we will allow what's what's currently allowed in see in the CBD Zone as a potential limited is terms of bul regulations we try to right size the setback regulations in terms of having really narrow front a of setbacks but more importantly build to lines in other words a maximum distance from the front lot line meaning you can't build a building too far back you have to bring it forward so that that's part of the goal of bringing building up front parking and a rear trying to eliminate curve Cuts uh minimum setback standards are put in place for lock 3801 7 that's the existing single family home the reason we put that in is because this is not a plan where we anticipate comination first of all it's done under rehab destination comination is not permitted if there are some assemblance of properties the property owner who owns a home in L 7 does not have to participate if they choose to do so and sell it it or even be a joint venture that's great and be part of another project next to the lall project but uh we the B Council and as a planner myself felt that was important to protect the existing home and provide some minimum setbacks I think it's 10et I'll have to check it might be 20 feet the idea is that if they do not want to participate and continue to live in that home there will be proper setbacks to protect that home except that the coverage requirements are reduced from what's allowed in C Zone that allows for a compact building form which conforts to that yellow uh rectangular box like if you keep it up there about 60 65 70 ft deep you're going to comply with your 40% that's appropriate and impious coverage has been reduced to really try to increase perious surfaces which will help storm trage maximum Building height this is not quite the downtown area near a train station although there are two bus stops nearby um so in this case the decision was let's generally maintained what's the appropriate height in terms of what can fit on the site based on the parking Department of the lot generally feel that three stories approprate want to add in the point where we could allow for a fourth story HP up so imagine a stairwell elevator housing unit to allow for a person or resident to get to the fourth floor to utilize a roof deck of some sort just want to give the flexibility in case there's interest for that but no living space some development standards in terms of parking again this is not quite the downtown area next to near a training station so one and a half parking space is pretty conservative with with an allowance of Tandem parking in cors minimum of one bicycle parking space per residential unit meaning they have to put a say building past 10 15 or 20 units they have to put 10 15 or 20 bike RS the idea is that if this building is going to contribute to that transformation to bicycle centri and pedestrian safe uh environment Street skate they have to put in bicycle infrastructure and that hopefully incur people who use bicycles to live iny um parking has to be located in rear buildings which is not that Inc consistent with underlying zoning requirements uh I think H Park does a good job in previous iterations of the zoning ordinance and master planning is to discourage the parking in front uh otherwise we try to encourage consistent architectural design of faades don't just design front of building design all four sides making a tra building and of course something we put in all of our plans is we require that the developer incorporates the same old design feature reality it's really not that hard to do any new building is going to be sustainable uh in a sense um so that includes Readiness for photo P systems passive design features single material use Etc ET we put that in all our plans and the good thing is we've gotten feedback from developers like oh yes we're going to do that but we make sure that's a minimum standard in terms of public benefits obviously we try to eliminate the curb Cuts along the front of you is a Avenue that's why build front parking the back you access the parking side streets the streetcap improvements are important uh with that building up front which me that creates an opportunity to create consistent building walls and ply add Street trees jar trees Street Furniture appropriate lighting u meaning no wall pack sping residence but residential scale lighting and uh and all of that supports the effort to you know put a br in for happening and of course design for accessibility again any new building is going to have Ada compliance through the fair housing app as well as proa that's public right wayil guidelines anything in right way and on the site will be new and be accessible so that really is to just in terms of the master PL I went through earlier in the presentation that this R plan is almost a carving copy of what we envisioned master plan so I'm not sure how much more information you need from me to say this is consistent the I will say through my report uh Incorporated by reference stat report the plan is notc consistent or doesn't conflict with the master plans of Edison and pway City projects because the re area plan area is gener in the center of the community uh M County does prioritize R 7 2027 Corridor as a area of need to focus for improvements and the state plan encourages obviously re investment into Suburban Town centers and and P Park is an NPA sorry pa1 uh that's the area fact toown is and this is appropriate consist that really concludes my presentation thank you very much all right now open this up to comments for members of the board collegia okay um so thank you so [Music] much I have two questions or two sort of considerations um the first first is uh first regarding land use so I know our Redevelopment plan um the master plan has a lot of plans for commercial and excuse businesses and uh the development of Life High schle AE and things like that um and I think one thing that isn't part of our master plan that maybe we should kind of consider is a sort of new development a new conern or challenge that has uh presented itself since the um primary school has started having fulltime prek 3 and prek4 students and we've had to have the addition of trailers that have taken up significant amount of space on the playground um as we continue building and developing the town and adding more mixed housing and bringing more residents into the town I wonder if we consider um in the land consideration for this Redevelopment area given its proximity to Irving School that some of this space may be used to build additional space for the school like satellite space for the school uh that's gener a good comment and I think we take that in advisement for future plans but I think that would require really looking at master plan again in cooperation with the school board where need and if not at least add public uses permitted use as to at least allow that to happen yeah I I mean I think it would be a good idea to kind of loop them in because I don't think that um you know we are not develop doing this Redevelopment in the vacuum it is kind of a holistic process we're all of the pieces all fit together and considering space for school and our growing Community I think that when we are doing we're having these conversations and creating this vision for the broader community in work future that is something that we should take into consideration when we have the opportunity to build close to pre-existing buildings like the school um the second question that I had was um you mentioned bik lanes and Street trees and all these wonderful things um for the traffic but you know as you mentioned that is a very high trffic area um it is also become kind of a little bit of a Speedway where there's quite a lot of distance between the light um at there's a light at South 11th North 11th Avenue and then du close lane um and we've had several fatalities over the last 10 years in that area if there is any consideration to maybe adding an additional traffic light in between that is that part of the plan that's not part of this plan but as far as I understand we're working with Terry to and and do to really Advance the planning of the road diet and I'm sure I'm sure Council you have any information to add but I know it's at least a concern of council and it's being expressed to but this to answer your question this plan does not address that other than encouraging bringing the building up front improving that street skate adding Street trees and really be consistent and compatible with the future road diet yeah I would just like to see um if there's any ideas like any ideas or any anything that uh would would be part of this development that would help to slow traffic in that area because we've had so many problems in that area in that that stret so let me let me just say that Matt H our regular council member slbo member is not here with us tonight but Jason is here from Council available to answer questions like that so please feel free to jump in and respond to col's comments oh sure I'd love to so on that point um I would just add that I specifically suggest that as part part of the conversations for the road diet actually happen to live pretty much in this neighborhood walk there to drop my youngest child off the firm Bing and walk back and it is not a very pleasant experience so pedestrian safety is just I think as a general matter a uh priority for Council and certainly one for myself especially with respect to this particular project because I think just by making this sort of transformation it's going to have um natural caling effects and you know I have grand Visions for uh this just being a really nice Gateway um and really become part of like the great walkable feature that this town has to offer and right now it is definitely not that when you're trying to walk your little kid across Route 27 it's pretty scary that there's a number of other families with little ones that are going back and forth I think there's more on the way soon just from some friends that we have um real close by and uh you know it's something that we take very seriously something that we're working on with do and we'd like to see this work in conjunction the the Upper Road diet um and I think that a an additional uh street light make sense I'm not sure if that's necessarily the kind of thing that you would tie into um this particular Redevelopment project that is definitely something that I think that we are exploring and in addition to it a whole variety of um pedestrian safety and traffic cing and road diet features answer okay uh just kind of peek back off of that exact point actually there's um as I was going through this there's kind of I think a very cable situation um kind of in the opposite direction for us but a few years ahead of us if you go up uh Hamilton out of New Brun as you head towards Franklin um you get kind of past the garden Point uh Apartments there and it's very similar to this that it's it's uh alternates there's parts that are two lanes and parts that are four lanes but it has that kind of some Speedway feeli to it um but just over the last five years or so there have been four maybe five buildings kind of similar to what's envisioned here three stories four stories kind of going up there and it really changes the whole feel of that Corridor uh and one of the effects of it is that because there's just more people around it has the effect of slow traffic um and so uh that's one of my big concerns too is just like we know from the accident that that Corridor is like the most dangerous part of town in terms of traffic yeah and this this kind of thing with the emphasis on buildings up front uh when you have that it does have that effect you put more people there do slower that uh one of the comments I was going to make is that that's one of the things I really like about this is that it's right on that front part of the lot and it that's a well documented effect that it has and we can see that playing out just kind of in that new BR like Franklin area there a few years ahead of us we're doing same kind of thing yeah talk about experience I've seen scale fatality but when my first meeting's here I got to I Got7 so I was like this not a good start my tenure here I take it personally as well I think so just I was wondering in your conversation did you uh did you talk to Property Owners is there interest in doing this type of projects let's say I believe the bo is is right I mean or yeah I think I mentioned earlier in the meeting too quick or passing too quickly U this was actually initiated by the property owner or redeveloper considering what can we do LS they use they looked at the master plan as this something you want well Z are in place good no just I'm just curious it's nice to have a plan but it's nice to have people that wanted do it in this case the plan is not completely driven by a developer but we're trying there's interest in the corre yes at least two I just wanted to um Echo KRA and and Dan's comments um about the this calming nature of buildings that are close to the street um like the Prof planning profession even non planners get this this is great to hear right so so that's really important and I want to just e that the other the other thing I think equally important is the goal of eliminating cuts on American Avenue um in the in the cross-section you you in in the plan you show you know potential cross-section for the Street Palm Raritan and you're showing ballards uh those ballards would not be would not be possible because of current curve Cuts removing those curve Cuts will allow do to put the ballers in which would protect the cyclist and the new residents who live along the street so it's really important to get rid of those curve PS and I think I would you know really if you're doing this and you're and you're assembling those Parcels getting rment project that removes those curve GS I think it's really important absolutely so yeah it's what and then I thinker mentioned um the daycare or preschool um you know I think the ground floor does it does allow Nursery schools and daycare centers and there's a daycare center couple blocks no AR no's Arc so I think there could be really even even the ground floor could there could be a relationship with the school district even whereever buildings go on there even with this plan amend this plan to incorporate that that could be really interesting so two things one you're right uh so the Private Preschool could potentially do that uh but I think to your point perhaps it would be better if it was amended in the future for a public use otherwise there's certainly nothing stopping the private from collaborating does dayare centers prohibit public dayare centers or the town run No in fact there's there State policy ided in statute of mixed delivery for preschool which is a school district is supposed to actively cooperate with private providers microphone please sorry the school dist supposed to uh actively cooperate do due diligence to exhaust the resources of private providers before doing it through through public facilities so there's an active mandate ignored in many places but nonetheless renewed in this year's budget budget uh uh statute um so yes school districts can cooperate with private uh providers can must actually that's really interesting thank you I had a question um the plan provides for three stories with a possible roof deck type forth area that isn't residential we've done a lot of Redevelopment plans in town over the last few years that had four stories with a fifth step back what is the thought process on the difference with this development plan um two things one I think from a massing Urban Design perspective three stories is probably more appropriate in this particular Corridor and size the lot potential areas probably do not allude to a lot of assemblage to really permit a large development like you would see in core downtown area that being said it could accommodate four stories but I think the driving fact is park I think we're trying to balance parking and massing especially since in these areas in terms of of a rarity the commercial areas are directly next to single family homes whereas in core you have deeper blocks you have Office Buildings conversion typically and even multif family uses in between the residential homes spel like Magnolia and the core of downtown of course those bigger blocks mean bigger parking lots which allows for greater height so it's a balancing act of determining what realistically can fit I think we felt that one parking space per unit probably would make sense here to allow for a to jam what they want in this town so we try to just strike a balance Urban Design and few questions um so the redeveloper comes in property owner comes in and says okay I've looked at the development standards I want to build in accordance with the development standards I want to build perfectly in Conformity with the development standards where do they go and I think it's section seven they have to submit a Conant plan to a re director and enter into a re except for lot seven single family home they can do whatever they want just performance and so it's not governed by section 42 of the municipal land use law dealing with uh contributions to uh utilities and stuff I'm sorry not governed by the municipal land use law by process for site plan approval but this concept plan is submitted for review for ensure it's consist the master plan entry redel then they submit for completen this review and go to the planning board for so um so the the ordinance you talked about the ordin at first floor residential as being something permissible discretionary only if they can't fill the fill the commercial spaces I look at the ordinance and it doesn't seem to me to say that seems to to say that multif family including first floor is a use as of right yes so and is that true is that is that how we we are to understand it yeah for this particular re plan multi family apartments are allowed including on the ground Flor I want to be clear I'm in favor of that okay you know my view is we ought to be shrinking the commercial area to conform to the size of to the market uh of the down and I'm happy to see upper rtin redeveloped for residential because I think in the long run that's more economically viable than having commercial out to the out to the Edison border um so I think this is a good thing um the other than the rezoning what does this plan do other than resoning I think there's some consistent building wall architecture design features that require the curve cuts to be removed I think the build two lines and setback to reduce standards help really bring the scale of the potential building in line better in line to what could be permitted but that could all be done with with Zing it could and and uh site plan corre okay um I will say just in in comment comment that we spent three years at this doing what could have been done through resoning in six months uh don't disagree uh this is this seems to me laboring using the municipal manul law to labor at something that which resoning which which All We've Ended up with is resoning um so other than that this is something I basically approve of and to your point I agree completely in fact I'm sure we get this done in three months um it was a laborous process because there was discussion for potential developers about having buildings and side streets and then before you know it we're focusing on downtown a twoe stuff let re up the contract let's just get this done that's the point we're at but in the future in reality is I think we talked about this with Terry is this is like a case study it works well this could be a resoning strategy for the entire without I would love to see I would love love to see these development standards apply to the entire Corridor I don't know where I don't know where you begin whether 10 or some place farther west but I would like to SK all the way out to the Edison border anyone else from the board have comments I just have a um a couple of very small things I don't know if it's appropriate to just there were a couple places for the wordings either um are not quite or I think there's a couple places where there might be typos AB it's amendable to uh know amending a little um on page uh 15 is so in the PDF document resolution number 7-24 d196 it's page 24 in the PDF but it's if you look at the page number on the bottom it's page 15 development plan um there's the at the top uh right under Section 3.2 property ownership it says all eight properties are owned by different entities um but it's a handful of entities that own multiple property so that's just little ambiguous in wording um and then jumping down to page uh sorry scr to it it's page um 36 in the Redevelopment plan which is page 45 of the PDF uh right at the top of section A under the 5.2 State go objective setting it says um eliminate those conditions that cause the project area to be considered an area need of Rehabilitation and we're applicable an area in need of Rehabilitation I think the second one should be the second one should be Redevelopment which paragraph uh it's uh right under that 5.2 heading um point a so not page 45 page 456 development plan page 45 the right under 5.2 The second subse so there should be Redevelopment instead of Rehabilitation yes the last word for the quote should be I put that there on purpose make sure see who's really following along at home okay page just this one be so um as you mentioned earlier this is this property currently is area need Rehabilitation yes based on the ordin that put the rehabilitation so um you talk a little bit about um I think we're familiar with the Redevelopment designations and the um the incentives that municipality May provide to developer you talk about the rehabilitation incentives here a little different than the revelop ones and then um how what's the thought of the burrow in terms of offering those and and and then what what elements of the project would meet you know I guess encourage the town to to do that I guess so that's really a policy decision between the burrow not insing Terry but really the mayor and Council to consider as we consider what benefits we offer whether it's pay taxes some sort of believe partial partial vacation of certain improvements in terms of tax assessment to all the programs same ones are offered under reel statute the only difference between Rehabilitation Redevelopment is you can only do five years pay loot taxes under the rehab designation you go up to 30 years Redevelopment and of course development you can use combination so long as the authorizing uh study decare as combination it's the same type of programs I wish I had more information I'm certainly bring that to you a primer of what benefits could be offered my sense is in a project of this size none would be considered but that's not our call to make that's not the planning Bo or my take all recommendations uh I think there have some compelling interests to consider that such as additional public benefits which it could be for example repair all the sidewalks up to the school perhaps those are things that could be considered um but has to be something that the redeveloper interest in doing in return for some sort of financial so just just so clear and I know that this is something that is decided not by anybody in this room and something in the future it's just hypothetical so hypothe saying someone can get a tax batement in in exchange for a part or any type of tax uh abatement in exchange for fixing sidewalks uh in exchange for some other public B improvements all site that's generally the rule but I I think in this town well not this I say from my experience I've seen that communities are reluctant to use that especially when there's market rate unit school children children generation here other towns is not like candy one in Middle sex County in particular but I'm not name them but it's really a policy decision I'm not an expert okay I'm sorry is there in in making that decision um is it our practice to do like a cost benefit analysis for offering something like that to a developer my understanding is that part of the cost analysis cost really look at is it worth doing it the financial agreement entered between is part of that with the reell I'm sure I'm not really part of that process but my understanding that some sort of as As a matter of law if they give a sorry I hear you sorry as a matter of law if they give a tax batment um there has to be a cost benit thank you in terms of affordable housing has that page 54 5 so that's standard language I'm not saying the issue but it's whatever is required underlying ordinance or element sorry the hous fair share plan it's whatever triggers portal housing will be required in this case any building with from my understanding so so that we don't have a project yet but um obviously ning most likely be more than five unit for sure so would do some affordable housing is part of any project absolutely I think just to be honest everybody here anyone calls about this we tell expect to put in 50% and be careful when you ask for a tax that's really any St okay good to know all right with that then I will open up the meeting to public comment on this proposal if you could please State and spell your name and uh your address and then please begin I was loving l e VB i n g knows how to spell it 10 North Second Avenue um so we're hearing about upper gron similar to what we heard about tracks a b and c a is on for eminent domain tonight and it was promised on page 29 that it was excluded from condemnation a slight difference but not much so I'm saying I warn the residents that this is a possibility since we see happening in track A and B now even though there's a residential aspect to the cleaners who have two apartments of work but this sounds wonderful except when you drive into Carterette or Hamilton Street there in summer that where I grew up it feels like a wall and if you don't want any green trees or but this is this is progress Lego blocks apparently Architects grew up with Lego blocks so that's what we see and that's it's not Stone it's not a castle we don't have lot cabins like Lincoln long some of us remember but okay so it's Lego block time but where's the rain going to go people we just had Ida after Cleveland Avenue was developed 999 or 100% of this town flooded some part of somebody's basement got water or and or seage so I know that the municipal land law says something about there must be sufficient drainage water supply Electric Supply what have you and I keep asking did we put the town put in new storm gutters no we can't how can they put in storm gutters it would be in everybody's backyard so where's the rain going to go when we have these wonderful new structures okay so the front building is going to be maybe the same as is there now except higher but if you're putting something in the back that isn't there now and if you're not really thinking about schooling or Parks or what are they called retention Pond detention ponds where are they gonna go I don't know if that's an engineering question or a planning question um just I think from a general perspective uh detention basins are last year Sol be a series of reinstruction wait is the last solution what oh uh I would say retention basins as a single solution is last year twoo this new small water regulation that must be applied forli but the this particular project each project unique um part of the plan OB compliance with the site plan would be reducing the coverage that mean removal of pavement so that helps in terms of su in terms of the building footprint which will be larger than the that creates an opportunity for slow release so there's multiple components that are actually not even green it's just really from massing and simple Common Sense perspective that helps slow down and allow for some but generally speaking that's how I respond but Bruce and I willly work together do receive a they have to be okay um yeah L all needs Improvement also this might be off course for this group but the uh the veterinarian I heard the Widow gold smith is looking for someone to BU the business has Main Street our Chamber of Commerce reached out to to help out some of these as UB is supposed to be moving at the end of the year into pnk on Wood Avenue a comparable three day location but nothing has started yet on that clean up that has to be be all totally renovated roofed down to the tanks in the ground so this is wonderful pie in the sky but something is prevent the aid from going forward and it's got to be a lot more than the cleaners the problem there um if if UB is going to be moving in January I want to see that and sidewalks or maybe I'll say sidewalk walks for the end of the meeting thank you thank you very much all right I don't see any other M of the public here with us tonight so I'll close the public portion on commentary on this resolution um last opportunity for any board members who want to make comments all right oh okay we let we'll let Jason make comments and then we'll go to Creer sorry I just wanted to make a couple of just like comments on a few of the items that the board memb point out so first I just want needed to give a shout out to Dan those technical catches were pretty amazing so thank you for that um stepen I I don't think we've met before but I love your idea about rezoning all the way up through Edison on 27 so that's Tak under advisement um and then just to piggyback on the comments about like how this is going to be H Street facing developments we're getting rid of the curve cuts that all going be like traffic measures but there's also the trees and like the street Furniture whatnot that this PL Visions which will also further reinforce the traffic measures which will be a real do to a me safety and also I just wanted to take a point like um so's original point about the school district is really well advised um I would just note I'm you know just off the cuff like I don't know that this project is of the scale that would really be able to provide something meaningful to the school districts but as Stephen also Steely pointed out like you know there may be opportunities for um private child care providers to expand or to new ones to come to help fulfill the the prek needs but I just wanted to emphasize that um uh and I've been a part of this just really talking closely with school board members and working together and we are definitely um in a really good place right now A Cooperative uh place so I you know certainly we're going to be doing what we can to help them get to where they need So based on some of I don't want to speak to them I think some of their they may have some of the space issues there are some ideas for that um so you know that is already being considered and looked at U but that's definitely a good point I promise to keep working with them to help make sure that their needs are considered and fed and I think that cover all the points that I had so thank you again for speak great Point thank you my thank you so much for that Jason um I would love to see moving forward in the plans that come before the planning board with regard to Redevelopment that we do take the needs of the schools and not just earing school but ble middle school and high school just kind of uh into consideration holistically while you're planning the town we just don't leave them out okay so just to recap I think on where the board has landed with the comments we have the affirmative comment that page 15 the first word of all should be change to the to be more accurate that the eight properties are owned by different entities not all eight property are owned by different entities page 36 the first paragraph a the last word in that paragraph should read Redevelopment instead of Rehabilitation and then advisory suggestions to back to council that future Redevelopment have additional considerations for public uses specifically expanded School needs and that area specifically in the upper Marin portion has become a bit of a traffic incident location and to consider putting in additional traffic lights with as we explore future Road diets and traffic safety um and I I think that's where we've landed on this so with that I will solicit a motion on oh sorry any comments online we don't participate with online commentary at this Mee yes our online presence is advisory only do come down if you want to make comments to us at the board we're happy and would very much welcome the town's participation so again with that you want to also mention what the counil potentially into resoning Z as well as an advisory opinion to consider looking at rezoning the area in Li of additional Redevelopment plans or not in Li of but as an alternative to additional Redevelopment plans all right good all right with that I'll solicit a motion to see if the board finds this planned with these suggestions and amendments not inconsistent with our master plan this has not been consistent with the master plan second second byra we'll take a roll call vote Please Mr yes yes Mr L yes Mr mle yes Mr Pearlman yes stering Cardel yes Mr Williams yes Miss H yes thank you very much everybody for input and consideration on that uh with that I'm going to open up the meeting once again to public comments on any items not on the agenda tonight if anyone wants to be heard on anything else not on the agenda tonight okay Lois leing North Avenue I had a question for decades for Mr Cot for the current engineer who I never get to see a count meetings would you please define what is in the right of way in residential and a commercial session if there's a difference do you need this microphone does someone need the No I'm trying to understand the question I mean we are fortunate this evening that we don't have a large member public here joining us so we have some flexibility in answer your question but I'm not sure I understood the question the question is right away row that we see on site plans is often mistaken for something larger than I believe that it really is so I'm asking an expert who I don't see in council meeting to ask that question there so is the question what is the definition of the restrictions in a right waya not restrictions what is contained how about that in a right of way area I'm not an engineer I I I admit I'm still a little confused but I'm not an engineer first do you need clarification on the question think I do I uh we don't have multiple traveling mics unfortunately the right of away generally is not from curve face to curve face it extends beyond that see the with of it you'll either look at a survey of site or first anybody preparing one would look at the tax mat and that gives the rights to the general public to access that area which is why I I could park in front of your house or you could park in front of my house and neither of us would ever have anything to say about it legally but within that can be sidewalks curvs roadways Public Utilities trees not sure what you mean or exactly what you mean by what's there well you miss fire hydrants but that's good sidewalks are mentioned okay on the sidewalk subject do you happen to know maybe this is a legal question the difference between residential sidewalks perimeter sidewalks not on the property in the residential sidewalks in the RightWay versus sidewalks in the right way in the commercial District what I mean is the question is there a difference in accessible uses for commercial sidewalks versus residential sidewalks actually maintenance and repair for the mainten and repair of those sidewalks that seems like a question that would change based on the property right like are you asking like who's responsible for maintenance of those sidewalks let's say who's responsible for repair and snow removal yes commercial Steward decision 1981 versus current today versus residential well I I'm I'm going to step in for a moment because like you said I do think that borders on a legal question and definitely a question that I think is outside our board's perview or expertise so I appreciate the the conversation I think it's interesting and I can see it's going somewhere but I don't I think it is somewhere that's beyond what this board is able to answer for you this evening or cover in general so is there ever a time that Mr cotch or someone from CME is scheduled to join a mayor and council meeting they used to years ago decades ago have either the water department DBW come and address the public when the public showed up or I think the engineering showed up once or twice to answer questions from the public so I've been dealing with cybox issues for some 20 years now both on Council and on the board and I think one of the fundamental misunderstandings that people have is the sidewalk is not their property it is their property and that's what makes their responsibility am I correct in this statement I think again it depends on the properties right it'll vary by zoning I mean but they are responsible for the maintenance is and that's determined by the bur ordinance we actually have ordinances par me we have ordinates with the government that's what I was saying it's governed by and every town treats it differently um I shouldn't say every town treats it differently but every town will indicate in their ordinance or should indicate in their ordinance who is responsible for maintenance in in a sense then it is you know even though it's a a term that people don't like to use but it is a case of in a sense eminent domain saying that this Pro this section of sidewalk in front of your property will be maintained by the property owner that's the exist laws as they stand on part wouldn't it be more accurate to say that the property belongs to the property owner but it's subject to the right that's what I'm saying so I think there's a misunderstanding that some somehow don't right away is the wrong term but it is is is subject to the restrictions imposed upon it through the ordinances that overlay it maintain sign to do whatever is necessary so then another question is does the state law supersede or the New Jersey Supreme Court supersede local we're way beyond our yeah that is absolutely discourse question that's beyond what we can answer here um but I I appreciate your faith in us that we could answer that uh but I think that is a very multi layered kind of question and my favorite lawyer answer is it depends it depend okay so then are getting back to flooding is there any answer from the planning board on what we were promised well it was what Steve Nolan and cluber was here and some Kim Hammond and I said hey I called in and said before they left 100 years of experience between them we count on this board to keep us safe from flooding so is there something you have done or seen that has been done or heard that has been done that will prevent more additional flooding I I will comment having been on the board at the same time of all all three of those persons and I had the opportunity to OB observe their knowledge over time and from seeing the plans that have come before the board many plans if not every one of them have great concern for storm water drainage and management it's something that we are hyperfocused on as a board in general because we are very aware of the water manage agement needs within the town we actually get mandatory training on storm water management requirements at the state level I'm sure we all remember that that super fun training on the regulations on storm water management and I'm always looking at these development projects going where's the water going to go so when I look at the Redevelopment plan we looked at tonight and see that the pervious coverage was reduced that is a positive flag towards proper storm water maintenance and management now we can't speak further on that because storm water management is a multi-step multi- influence concept and it will depend on the building and sight plan that comes for us at the time but it is something that we are very much focused on it's something we're aware of when we look at these applications that come before us impervious coverage is always at the Forefront of our thoughts and considerations because where is the water going to go as we build up these developments so I hope that that helps answer some of the questions yes we we think about this a lot but what is the town doing but that's not you're doing okay last subject South Third Avenue I think you guys had some part of of maybe agreeing that it could be a closed project Plaza or not I South Third don't recall if we part of the Redevelopment plan yes but I don't know whether it has been approved by the state it is the and the I'm speaking for the council now out but not for all of us out there for a certain section close to the the Avenue that is to be the ideas to create a plaza but none of these plans have been finalized nor has the state given approval one of the things you have always have to remember rout 27 being a state highway we are often at the mercy of the State Department of Transportation I knew it took years to get our street skap approved so it's always something but I I do believe that it is something that the council desires yes but we would have nothing to do with implementing it only to you know our job is to review things that come before us to see if they follow the law essentially that's they follow the law they that they don't conflict with the master plan not inconsistent with the master plan that's the statute so dictates it to us those of you who live on the North side my question has been to the council as J and those and hasn't been answered and maybe there's a reason why it hasn't been when the fire or let's say something happens along the train tra the north side now you get third closed I I'm told that when it was closed a few seasons ago for the temporary uh weeks the fire truck started going that way went through there and actually on Fourth I think maybe was on 14 people had to get out of the way they the the fired truck forget the driver forget that that whichever one third or fourth was closed so where would you like a substation on don't you think a safety substation on the North side a little Branch a little something in in in the garad building in somewhere over there so that and now we have a beautiful new girl school we have Targets on the North side and we have train tracks and we have no instant police first aid or fire that's what I hope you remember when you get asked maybe to close four third to close second whatever Happ those are people there I'm glad this is here I'm glad that this is place across the street and fire but can't we have a little substation on the North side and the triangle thank you very much thank you all right any last comments from the board this evening not oh I'm so sorry let me let me just formalize have seeing no one else no other members of the public I'm GNA close the public portion commentary for this evening go ahead I just want to confirm since it came up Jason you just confirm I think the state did give approval for it right yes thank you but there's no plan yet right just the go ahead and make a plan plan right not to put you on the spot okay this for a minute um there is no formal plan just yet there is just sort of a general concept and you know that will be part of a a process where we'll solicit public input um and you know but we're not even at the stage where we're have any of those pieces um ready just yet but hopefully coming soon because this is definitely something that I'm looking for again having that mindset of trying to um improve walkability in this town and create more public spaces so something I'm eagerly looking for you but there is nothing really in place just yet but we do have the D which was a major First Step okay anyone else all right with that I will solicit a motion to adjourn to all in favor thank you very much everybody okay