good evening everyone welcome to the Hillsboro Township planning board meeting May 2nd 2024 please join me and salute to the flag I pledge alance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for [Music] all please be advised this meeting has been duly advertised according to section five of the open Public's meeting act chapter 231 Public Law 1975 otherwise known as Sunshine Law knows of 2024 annual meeting schedule has been provided to the officially designated newspapers Township Clerk post on the Township's website and available here at the Hillsboro Township municipal complex in addition application documents and plans have been made available on the township Civic clerk website at least 10 days in advance of this evening's meeting complete application files are available in the planning and zoning department for inspection in accordance with the public meeting notice with that may have a a roll call of board members and also board and Township professionals please uh Mr Vander Mr rwit and Mr scob are absent Mr Wagner here Smith here Mr Vitali here Mr de here the pon president May Chelli here Vice chair peas here chair saraji here SP presid berstein here I here here and myself and the videographer here okay welcome everyone moving along we do not have any meeting minutes for consideration we do have a resolution for consideration to Brothers Inc rbj back onclave file 21- pb-10 dsmp D backsp and this was a an extension for this year so with that we have a motion to approve remember is eligible to yourself the deputy mayor and the committee men so moved second okay that was easy any comments from the deas hearing none roll call please committee the P yes Deputy May Chelli yes car yes okay we do not have planning board business nor considerations of ordinances so I will now move to business from the floor from matters are not under this evening's agenda if you like to provide any comments to the board please come up state your name and address for the record please and again as I've say in the past please refering from any comments regarding PL regarding planing board that's what I was going to say regarding Warehouse warehouses whether directly or indirectly Maria Janus 720 East fck Avenue Manville New Jersey I'm also a Hillsboro Township property owner block 86 lot 3 2155 camplan Road uh I just want to State um I did not receive proper notice for this uh uh in regard to this application because I received via US certified mail a flyer a a regular flyer with no explanation of what it's for why it was sent to me and then within 3 weeks afterwards I got another flyer again in regard to block 86 lot 2.02 with no explanation as to why it was sent to me or why it was by sent via US certified mail with a return receipt requested and each of the the Flyers had different information in it so I don't know what that was all about and and as a property owner within 200 fet of this property I should have been given Pro uh uh proper proper notice in accordance with the municipal land use law in addition this meeting does not have documents that um are gerain to this application and that would be the settlement agreement that that um uh involves the Glen Gary property um the concept plan that was discussed last year these comments refer things not on tonight's agenda this this meeting is on tonight's agenda this is not the time to air this conversation that would be time when the application start you want to have a meeting when you you haven't provided the proper do there's no Loi for this either if some objecting to the fact that I as a property owner did not receive proper notice well when we get to the application we will ask the applicant's attorney you if they provided proper notice when we get to that part of the meeting okay I had sent a a a letter to the attorney I sent a letter to Mr Co I sent a letter to the mayor no one responded to me prior to this meeting and I had sent that out no one responded prior to this meeting um my questions uh the the makeup of the planning board um is everyone a volunteer yes okay except the professionals except for attorney Bernstein our engineer our stenographer videographer and our planner okay but the okay but the board members are uh do the board members have to be bonded no no no okay uh did each board member take an oath of office yes okay and did each board member uh take that course that's required within a certain amount of time each one I don't keep those records but um would be confident that if they if anyone was coming close to their due date Mr CO's office would be uh reaching out any new members have a certain period of time I believe it's within a year one year one year to be able to take it okay so is there a record of who has been on the board more than a year and if they have taken that that required um course training is there a record we have copies of of the we have documents that show who has taken taking the course if that's your question yes yes so you would have that we in the planning department we do okay all right um okay thank you thank you anyone else I got a headshake no so we are going to move on to this evening's uh public hearing on our one application just change a pace and it's not a warehouse so up Sherman track Phase 2 Eminem at camplan Road LLC file number 23- pb-8 dmsp time of decision of May 17th of this year block 86 l 2.02 formally block 86 L 21 camplan Road um it's also known as Estelle Street per the Hillsboro Township tax records the applicant is seeking pimary and final major site plan plan approval and waivers construct a residential development consisting of 88 affordable town home units with storm water roadways Landscaping lighting and Associated improvements for property governed by the Sherman Redevelopment plan which was adopted March 13th 2019 um also noted uh I guess kind of just for the record uh they were to be here or they were here March 7th of this year but that was adjourned April 11th that was adjourned there was a environmental commission review on February 26 of this year and then uh trying to think what else that's it so I am G to turn it over to the attorney thank you Arena elgart from wineart Law Firm on beh of sorry get closer to the mic and make sure it's on should be a green light on the base it doesn't help that my allergies are re acting up to Ira algard from o garden law firm on behalf of Eminem at camplan Road LLC um before I get started I just wanted to uh give you the just hand over some of the uh exhibits just you have it in the file and then also we have handouts if you want yeah to David yes I I okay thank um I don't know if anybody wants individual hand yeah take them yeah we can take them because they've already been [Music] provided can you please provide one for anybody in the public too if they might want [Music] one no we'll mark them during them okay it's okay I can start and we'll we'll get it connected oh yes I'm I'm coming C be [Music] great that's where the file that's where the file the horn C that's the electronic Cofe over there turned it off [Music] you you know what I'll I'll take one I'll take one I'm somewhat fine [Music] H more yeah want to try my computer thank are there enough out there for the public make sure everyone out there's got one you can give me another [Music] te question [Music] there it is looks like you got it not your [Music] back your backg [Music] that's I'm not going to tell Christine you said just a I know right [Music] I I think we're ready to start all right as um as you said we've here for plarium final site plan approval for the 88 affordable units um on parcel 2 uh which is part of the Town's Fair Share Plan as well as consistent with the uh Redevelopment plan um before I actually get started I would ask Mr Bernstein to take jurisdiction um with regard to the notices uh we've gone through them I believe we've complied with what the law provides so that's my review of it that there has been compliance on the notice issue other I know Others May disagree but that's our review okay thank you thank you um So the plan that we have before you um it's a it's a plan that's been vetted over and over again several times um we're here with what's relatively conforming with the Redevelopment plan as well as the concept plan that has been approved by the town Council um we are asking for a few waivers uh but as we all know that this has undergone pretty uh public process already uh before we've even gotten before the board at this point um we are the designated redeveloper of the site and uh it's it's been established as an area in need of Rehabilitation uh we did enter into a 2019 settlement agreement um and this is an inclusionary development and affiliated with the Glen Gary site um so tonight we have with us uh Bill Park Hill as well as Andrew V who's with uh Stonefield um he's our traffic engineer we have Christine cfone who's going to be doing our planning testimony and we have Ron alach who is the director of uh development for Eminem at camp Plane Road um without any further Ado um if I could have Mr Park Hill right here [Music] in I do sure uh William no initial J last name Park Hill p a r k h i l l I'm a professional engineer in the state of New Jersey thank you and um if you could go through your education background and as well as your licensing and qualifications sure um I'm a bachelor's in science and engineering from the College of New Jersey I graduated in 2003 I've been licensed in the state of New Jersey since 2008 um I've appeared in front of uh many of boards I have not went back and counted them over the years um throughout the state of New Jersey have been qualified in front of the spe cour New Jersey as well as a professional uh in the field of civil engineering um I've testified on residential including 100% affordable housing communities such as this one okay any gaps or suspensions no gaps no suspensions just completed all my continuing educations because they were due at the end of last month okay any objections hearing none we accept please continue thank you thank you um so since you prepared the site plan if you could go through a little bit about the development um and just walk the board through some of the specifics this is weird I'm usually standing pointing at a board so it might be a little rusty um so as as everyone's aware we're here uh with an application for preliminary and final major site plan uh for the um Redevelopment area known as the Sherman tract Phase 2 uh the subject application is seeking the approval to construct 88 um affordable residential units in 11 buildings each building Having Eight units the site is located um with primary uh access but you know as proposed on our plan along camplain Road uh directly to the west of phase one which has recently been constructed um on the screen you can see uh the aerial is a little outdated it's while phase one is under construction which is sort of the light brown area you see to the top of the rendering uh which would be east of our project uh North is to the left for everyone's um knowledge moving forward so as I stated this is you know phase two of a two-phase Redevelopment on land owned by the township at at one point I know the phase one is no longer owned by the township phase one my understanding is recently uh completed construction that is also 88 uh 100% affordable residential units um surrounding our area are various uses directly across the street um is a uh recycling um operation and a car um auction uh facility of some sort with um res some single family residential homes also a long camplain to the West there are several um streets sort of small residential neighborhood streets that have um single family residential houses on those as well to the rear of our property is uh which would be the south is the Royce Brook which is a um stream and directly to the east as I said is phase one of the Sherman [Music] tract um I keep saying phase one and phase two this property was subdivided during phase one to create two uh equal siiz lots the lot subject for this oblation is block 86 lot 2102 which is 31.3 Acres that's the area you see outlined um in the [Music] white I'm going to jump to our second exhibit if I can do this cleanly Eric should we be marking the A1 and this is a a one as the overall aerial exhibit Sherman track phase one front page from midatlantic engineering dated May 2nd [Music] 2024 pH two a one pH one pH phase two pardon me excuse [Music] me A2 will be the rendered site plan sh track Phase 2 Mid-Atlantic engineering Partners date last dat it appears correct me if I'm wrong April 10th 2024 that's correct thank [Music] you okay so um this uh rendered plan is basically a zoomed in view of what we saw on A1 to show the limits of the proposed Community um as I said you know the surrounding uses I went through but you know directly adjacent to this uh you know the limits of disturbance of this uh Community it's primarily wooded right the site is primarily wooded as it is and this area will be um cleared for the construction of these 88 affordable housing units um the project uh is request approval for singular um vehicular access coming off of camplan Road um our access does not actually uh there's a portion between camplan and our Frontage which is an existing 60 foot wide uh Township right away known as Buffalo uh Road I believe so our access will stretch from camplan uh into our development um down that small stretch of Buffalo to the private property of this project and into our community so that's the proposed vehicle access to the project um there's also secondary fire access proposed at the sort of bottom right of my image which would be directly off the end of Jackson Street the intent there is not that that's an improved pave access but that's a you know grass pavage stabilized access for emergency vehicles we would not Envision um that to be a primary um route of vehicular circulation for the residents of the community [Music] um internal circulation you know as I stated um 11 buildings sort of there's eight along a um you know sort of neighborhood Boulevard road that that bisects the center here the intention you know with that um it's a it's a very similar design as of what phase one was was approved as where you're providing on street parking out front of the units sort of to give it a little bit of a of a neighborhood or Community feel with um full circulation around the rear of these units where there's you know a little more substantial um parking you know parking areas which are perpendicular parking areas there are no dead ends on site um that exist so you know circulation for residents will be um [Music] convenient in addition you know sort of to the to the parking and buildings um in the bottom left corner of my screen here there's an area where there's a proposed gazebo and um Tot Lot Tot Lot is fenced in with a 4ot high fence and adjacent to that there's a you know small area that we're clearing to provide a little bit of um you know passive Recreation space in addition to there there's a little bit of additional clearing that's happening behind buildings I believe that's 10 10 and 11 sorry I can't quite read it on the screen um again provide for the same opportunity of you know just some cleared space that's not you know all wooded like the rest of the surrounding um area for some um you know passive wreck [Music] area um you know overall the the intent of the design of the site was to comply with you know both the Redevelopment plan and residential site Improvement standards residential site Improvement standards to um govern all uh residential development in the state of New Jersey and I think that ties to one of the waivers that we are requesting where the Redevelopment plan required or or or requested two points of access um to the site we are only proposing one point of access coming from campaign while that's a waiver from the Redevelopment plan we are confident that as proposed we are compliant with residential site Improvement standards for access to our site [Music] [Applause] um there's also pedestrian circulation provided um within our development on the along the internal roads and parking areas to each unit [Music] [Applause] I skipped over total parking spaces um as I said this is 88 um units total to a mixture of 16 one-bedroom units 52 two-bedroom units and 20 three-bedroom units um rsis requires 175 parking spaces uh the current um plan proposes 2011 parking spaces so we are in exceedance of the residential site Improvement Standard Parking requirement um as part of those 2011 parking spaces there are 11 um handicap accessible parking spaces provided as well as um proposed compliance with the uh New Jersey EV regulations uh 15% of the 201 um 31 spaces will be make ready with one3 happening a time of construction 1/3 after 3 years and 1/3 after six years so we will be compliant um with that regulation as [Music] well um the buildings are serviced um by private uh or by trash by internal um trash collection there are three separate trash enclosures sort of spread throughout the site for um equally convenient access for for all residents also you know put into place where hopefully not impactful to a resident's you know day-to-day quiet life enjoyment you don't want to put one of those right outside someone's window or something like that so um it's always tricky to locate those we try to do our best to get them in a spot where they're both convenient and uh and not a nuisance to Residents all buildings will be um serviced by public water and sewer uh public sewer uh exists to the rear of our property running along Royce Brook which was connected uh in a association with the construction of phase one I'm envisioning phase two um tying into that sanitary sewer system uh water service will be obtained off of camplan Road uh coming into the development and are you aware whether we pered or will serve letters oh we have we have received will serve letters for both Water and Sewer for this devel can you put the mic closer to you so sorry about that there you go thank you I just asked whether we had received our will serve letters for sewer and water yes we have received will serve letters for both Water and Sewer for this community thank you [Music] okay um I'm going to go to A3 and we're marking A3 if you can identify it for the record have to zoom in here see it A3 is a stream Corridor averaging plan with a date last revised February 13 2024 prepared by mid atlan [Music] um so what this plan illustrates are the environmental constraints that um you know impact the developability of this parcel um I think you you heard what I said earlier that Sherman uh phase one and phase two was one track that was subdivided into two equal size Parcels um think that would indicate sort of equal developability of both parcels and I think it's important to point out that while you know the overall parcel sizes are both 31 odd Acres the um area that is uh available for development or unencumbered by njd flood Hazard regulation njd freshwater wetlands areas um the townships stream Corridor ordinance and Delaware Aron Canal commissions um regulated areas um are greatly different so you know like I said phase one is also a 31 acre parcel and had uh just over 18 acres of developable land outside of those restrictions for phase two which is also the same number of units uh the same siiz lot has about half that I think we are about nine acres of unu constrained area on this site so you know while it face value 230 1 acre lots to be developed with the same number of residential units should be a you know a sort of a very simple um task the reason I go through that is the Rel you know the waivers we are seeking here are related to our impacts to the Township's um stream Corridor issue or issue I'm sorry it's not an issue stream Corridor ordinance um the township has an ordinance that uh well D um regulates um Waters of the of New Jersey and they place riparian buffers on Waters this uh water that is a you know drainage Swale stream ditch whatever you want to call it that sort of originates at the commercial properties across the street from us um does drain less than 50 acres so it does not have a flood Hazard area associated with it until it gets sort of to um the end of uh of our proposed development and above that does have a riparian buffer and that riparian buffer um from DP is 50 feet on each side of that stream um the township stream Corridor ordinance has an additional 100 ft for a total of 150 feet um buffer to that stream Corridor so the waivers we're requesting are related to proposed development um outside of the limits of the dp's jurisdiction but within the limits of the Township's stream Corridor ordinance jurisdiction um specifically um you know we are doing some amount of uh stream buffer averaging and requesting um waivers for construction of our entrance roadway which is um ordinance section 18864 D3 letter lowercase D which is a waiver requested for the construction of our entrance drop roadway within the stream Corridor um area and 18864 D3 C which is um way requested to construct conu our detention Basin and related outfall facilities within um the the stream Corridor those areas for clarification um the the second one I read which is the waiver for detention Basin related outfall is the light green area um on this screen and then the um red area is related to the entrance roadway the yellow area is related to um our proposed uh parking lot and building and is compensated for with buffer averaging both the red area and the um light orange area so you know you'll hear more from our planner as to justification of those waivers but you know this this project is a 100% affordable housing project which is an inherently beneficial use um you know deviating from this stream Corridor ordinance does provide you know a net benefit to this project that enables the the site to be developed with the um proposed 88 residential units and um does not uh create um any U negatives to you know the surrounding um residents or or Community right these areas that will be additionally cleared along the stream are all internal to this development adequate screening will exist surrounding the entire development so this is really you know only impacting um this proposed community [Music] um Mr chairman let the record reflect Mr scobo arrived at 7:38 thank you g to jump back to A2 and hit my favorite topic um stormw management so this site as I stated is encumbered by Delaware Ron Canal commission NJ DP Township and um soil soil Comm or Soil Conservation District so there will be four different agencies that will um review this storm water management our storm water has been designed to comply with the current storm water management regulations which include um providing green infrastructure um providing uh water quality and water quantity reductions water quantity reductions are now required not only to be provided on the latest rainfall data but also projected rainfall data for the year 2100 um so this is a robust uh storm management design our system that I'm sure the board has recently seen and will continue to see on on all applications we are uh addressing that through the construction of three small scale bio retention basins there the the darker green areas um to the top of the page and then one to the bottom right of the page um and that is how we are handling the stormm waterer Management on site um site lighting is provided via 27 pole mounted uh light fixtures at a height of 15 ft and 23 building mounted fixtures um so I I think that concludes um everything I was hoping to to convey to the board and um I don't think I have anything further okay um okay so why don't we move over to the review letter that we've received um today for the engineer um and why don't we go through what [Music] oh we're going to move over to the review letter that we received today from the engineer um it's dated May 2nd 2024 um and we'll go through the letter in terms of just the items that uh we're not going to comply with or we can't comply with or you know we'll have our discussions with regard to each item I'm going to turn to page two um under Planning and Zoning uh number one if you could take a look at that and um look at the feasibility and discuss whether there's it's feasible for um there to be a connection to Sunny me Road through Adams yeah so um you know as I testified our proposed access is um across camplan and I probably um glazed over it and should not have quite as much as I did um that access to campain does cross um that tributary to Royce Brook which ends up at the commercial properties across the street from us so there is a stream Crossing that is happening in order to obtain um access to Camp um that uh that stream Crossing is governed by njd it will be a general permit we are within the um requirements of that General permit and we'll obtain that permit from njd to permit that stream Crossing that access is a 24 foot wide uh two-way access and does comply with residential site Improvement standards um we have not made any substantial um review of what a access off of Adam Street um would look like at this time so you know I think uh our our current proposal is to comply is to connect to camplan Road [Music] okay all right we're going to move over to number two um which deals with sidewalks from the subject track along Jackson Street connecting to Sunny me elementary school I think that was the comment here so yeah I think there's um a few comments about sidewalks uh I testified to our internal sidewalk Network that exists but think there's this comment and another one about a about um connectivity to camplan um with a sidewalk as well this is an area of town that sidewalks don't exist in any measurable fashion um the request to put sidewalk out Jackson Road to Sunny me and my um my concern is that you're creating a dangerous condition Sunny me does not have sidewalks does not have walkable shoulders um while I know the school is just adjacent to where Jackson is the school does not have sidewalks in front of it the school does not have sidewalks leading off of Sunny me into the parking areas um our concern and our reason for not providing the sidewalks we're concerned that we're providing we're leading people to an unsafe condition right we're providing a sidewalk to a point where they get to Sunny meat and then they're on their own from there um and that does not seem um appropriate in this neighborhood okay um the next one is uh with regard to the center roadway uh with that's internal to the buildings um this was I think added as a recommendation um and the applicant will consider it um the only thing the only problem that we have is that we don't want to have it this application be delayed any you know in terms of consideration um if the board is willing to consider that we'll we're willing to look at it as well as long as it's something that could be done by the professionals um as resolution compliance um if the board uh is so inclined um as long as it doesn't you know trigger an an amendment to this [Music] application [Music] um okay and with regard to a pedestrian connection to phase one which is under uh number four yes so um as I indicated there's the tributary to Royce Brook that separates both Us in Phase One um we've uh spoken to the applicant and um such that we're able to permit a pedestrian cross a pedestrian walk between phase one and two um through that stream over a covert we're not you know I don't think this project can support the building of a bridge um but such that we're able to permit that through njde permitting the applicant is amendable to providing pedestrian connectivity between phase one and phase two and additionally we we would be willing to do that as long as it's also a resolution compliance item and something that the profession the board is comfortable having the professionals oversee yeah I'm I'm confident that I can work with Mr mayu's office um on a on a solution there and through res compliance okay [Music] that's G to be and [Music] okay okay if you can address on page five number 17 with regard to um the retaining walls Culver guard rails um shall be adjusted to accommodate a 4 foot wide sidewalk 4ot off uh curb line along one side of the proposed Entrance Drive um from Camp Lane and connecting to the internal walkway yeah I think similar to um our discussion about Jackson Road um you know camp l also does not have sidewalks on it there's not a safe condition to discharge pedestrians onto um in addition to that because we are crossing a regulated water there there are limitations to um the total square footage of impact to riparian buffer that that permitted um disturbance for a road crossing is 4,000 square ft we approximately 3800 square feet or so so we don't have a whole lot of of wiggle room there to provide additional width um for a sidewalk uh in addition to um my my opinion that you know we would be creating an unsafe condition at uh Camp Lane um fa you know for note you know phase one which is constructed and was approved by this board also did not provide a sidewalk out the camp plane I think likely I don't know for a fact but I would assume likely for the same for the same reasons okay and then um also on page five it's God bless you also on page five um under Redevelopment plan number three and it goes on to page six and I think you already touched on it as to the reason why we're seeking the waiver for um having one access as opposed to two access that's correct I did [Music] do you need me to go through that again um I think we're okay then the board has questions they can okay they'll ask you so um okay page six um number six also I if you could just testify with regard to whether you think that that's a waiver or not sure so um the Redevelopment plan speaks to required setbacks from streets and required setbacks from off street parking um in this uh Center Boulevard that sort of bcts the site we have a parallel parking located along the street our parallel parking located along the street is approximately 14 feet um from the proposed buildings I think the question here is sort of asking for you know deferring to the planner as to whether the 10- foot setback from all street parking or 20 foot setback from internal streets applies to the edge of that parking that parallel parking um from the cartway of the street we are greater than 20 ft from the edge of the parking we are greater than 10 feet our opinion is that um that there's not a waiver required okay goes away and and if um if my officer Mr mayu's office work together to eliminate that Boulevard if the board um desires and and and thinks that's an Improvement um that one item of relief would go away or if it is relief and we'll defer to um the planner and whatever he decides if that is a waiver we'll we're willing to you knowbody to testify as to the waiver request but uh we don't feel that it is a waiver because it's considered off street parking and we satisfy it then so [Music] [Music] um with regard to on page eight number four um we will provide additional testimony with regard to that item that's not for uh Mr Park Hill to testify to but I just want to put a placeholder there um [Music] um if you could just speak to the storm water management just so we're yeah so there are a handful of uh comments regarding storm water management as I said this project is uh will be compliant with the new storm manager regulations will be reviewed um by Mr mayu's office as well as njd and drcc we are um confident that we will comply with all applicable storm management regulations [Music] and with regard to page 16 with regard to the comments with water M um I believe we're going to comply with all those or sorry I'm not turning Pages fast enough [Music] okay if you want to go through each one and [Music] yes we are complying with all of those comments on page 16 okay um page 17 under stream quarter um you testified already to that so there's anything F okay um and with regards to the waivers we're going to have our planner address items number two and three there and I think that that should address everything in this that's correct letter um okay I have no further questions um if the board or the professionals have any further [Music] questions Goode thank you Mr chairman um I think I only need to touch upon the items that the applicant um has discussed I'm assuming the items that we didn't discuss they're going to be addressed that's correct um I'm not sure I'm not sure how much I need to add to under the Planning and Zoning comment number one is where we discussed the the option of accessing the site off Adam Street I think our comment stands on its own if any of the board members later had questions for us [Music] um under comment number two I I understand the applicant's concern about creating an attractive nuisance I think is the term utilized so if sidewalk was begun but isn't completed are you leading pedestrians and especially children into a dangerous situation I think our author simply is suggesting that that's already being created um near the emergency access there is a proposed sidewalk that de ends at the end of Jackson and we just would like the board to consider will that attract pedestrians who then start going down Jackson and and there's no place to end up uh so we think the board should consider whether a complete safe pedestrian pathway is constructed to the school um item three I think speak on son i' I'd be happy to answer any questions from board as I understand the applicants agreeing to eliminate the center roadway um if it has no delay now I I don't know what's considered a delay but as an engineer it to me it's a very very simple revision I appreciate apprciate that yeah it's I can't speak for the actual design engineer um and Mr Park Hill may look for a large change order with your it was his client to redo that so I shouldn't undercut him but overall it's not impacting the layout of the site and if I can ask a question would you agree that eliminating the center roadway does not impact emergency access capabilities it would not impact emergency access capabilities um and and my look at the drawings it doesn't have a major impact on the way the site is serviced with electric gas sanitary water there would be no major changes to any of the service utilities as I understand it um so so to me and and and I'd be happy to answer questions from the board it's it's a huge savings in impervious cover which is a positive to storm waterer management it's a a huge savings in potential construction costs which would be a great benefit to the applicant and I think it'll be a huge benefit to the ultimate homeowners in this area creating a an attractive landscaped area instead of a very wide impervious it's not just a normal street because of the way it's designed it's actually 62 feet from Curb to curb and I think we're in a suburban area we're used to looking at a 30 foot let's say strip of roadway in sidewalk um [Music] consider that um as if as long as the board is comfortable doing it through resolution compliance and as long as you're comfortable having it done through resolution compliance as well um it sounds you know that that's something that we would certainly consider but again we don't want it to actually spur any thing that requires an amendment let's say to any of the um whether it's the Redevelopment plan as long as it's consistent with the Redevelopment plan as long as it's consistent with the town council's approval of the concept plan and you know as long as the board is comfortable with that then we're comfortable um doing it on resolution compliance well I I can't speak to the board I understand that I'm just I'm I'm I'm just and I can't speak for Mr K but we have had conversations and I believe without putting words in his mouth this would not violate any of the Redevelopment plan criteria um the last comment under Planning and Zoning was number four and I as I understand it you're agreeing to Connected phase one to phase two with a simple Culvert or something that's appropriate for storm water flow yes okay um with the condition that the D is on board with that as well um if we can as long as we can get our permitting in place and as well as if we could also um have it as part of resolution compliance so in other words we don't have to you know come back just for that purpose to redo the plans obviously we'll do it as resolution compliance again I and again I I leave it to the bo for how the board wants to handle it um in Mr Paro in your opinion do you see any potential denial of the general permit from the D no there's a general permit for pedestrian walkway across a water feature I think we could comply with the maximum disturbance areas and and Achieve that so such that um you know DP approves that under the you know conditions of that General permit we're willing to provide [Music] that um I didn't hear any discussion on page four about our suggested roadway improvements to camplan if the entrance is going to stay on camplan road we had concerns with the the intersection there currently are not any improvements proposed are you skipped over that are you leaving that for your traffic engineer to discuss yes I'll leave it till then as well okay um on page five you touched upon the item 17 where we suggested if the access is going to stay out to camplan road we think it's a positive to add sidewalks along the 24 foot um we understand the G the the D has General permits for stream Crossings and those General permits set square foot disturbance limits uh we would if it's the board's desire to have a sidewalk uh um we'd be I think we could work with the applicant on how to make that Crossing feasible uh sometimes in those situations the sidewalk has to be butt up to the curb um I understand there's only based on your current plan is like 200 square ft left y um but I would ask that we at least consider if that access maintained there we at least and it's up to the board again if they desire to have that pedestrian connectivity that we take a look at that Crossing um on page six item six we did you talked about the setbacks from um parking versus setbacks from streets um I also defer to Mr Co we've had conversations and I think he has some opinions on the appropriate setback so I will def defer to him but I agree that if the center roadways eliminated that's eliminating those setback issues along those buildings um skipping ahead to page nine on storm waterer management I think there's a lot of technical issues that our offices can work out I'm assuming you agree the one item I just wanted to get on the record is um it's possible that this site it's currently mapped as hydrologic sea soils and the few test pits that were performed indicate it may be doils uh our office at this time is not satisfied that enough testing has been performed nor has enough testing been distributed around the site the testing is currently been centered only on the lower areas where the basins are proposed uh what we want to make clear is that the applicant would agree to do additional testing distributed in other areas of the site as appropriate and let our office um witness some of the testing yeah so if we seek to reclassify the site as doils the BMP has prescriptive measures of number of um test pits and and locations um we will comply with the requirements of the BMP for the testing happy to have your office witness that and I'm work through that both with your office and you know through the DP and our permitting there as well and if it turns out that Center roadway is eliminated between the buildings opens up a very large landscape area it's one of the higher areas on site which may have less environmental restrictions would your office entertain some small firey retention or being MPS if it turns out that the testing is positive in those areas yes we would [Music] okay um we we we jumped across the Waterman do you know what size the W is on camplan Road in my preparation I meant to go back and look at that email and I did not so I do not know off hand okay um and I think it's your planner we'll address the township U has certain conditions to Grant waivers in stream Corridor and I I guess standard planer will address those yes okay that's that's all I have um for engineering issues but I'd be happy to I kind of skipped the whole the whole access area which could be discussed later at the end of all the testimony or at any time that anybody had any questions I just had a a question mark we could go back to to number three with the proposal of the center roadway so I guess that would eliminate what approximately what 30 parking spots and I see in here um that the they could be relocated to the ends of the Loop Road where is the Loop Road would all 30 go there or would there just be a small number so the the Loop Road is on the top of the drawing and the bottom of the drawing which is east and west of the site and it continues along the South so that's what I think Mr Park and I would and most people would call that's the Loop Road correct and this is the center yes if we close off the center on both ends you would be able to add some parallel parking on this end okay perpendicular all thank you perpendicular parking okay which already exist you would just add more okay end and you could do the same thing on the Northern side of the property it would mirror what looks like down here and see how it looks like on the south down it looks like a parking lot you don't need a full parking lot you could just put parking on one side of this Loop Road and you'd warn enough to make up uh because I think it's important to maintain the amount so you'd still maintain that you'd still have the same 30 just in different locations I guess okay that was my question okay thank you would you have the that you that's a fantastic question you would all all you'd have to do is extend the loop R before it makes this 90° turn here you'd have to extend it the length of a parking space which is 18 ft so that we can keep the park parking small here the 20 ft off of the building so you're adding about 18 ft of fading here and 18 ft of fading here you're eliminating [Music] 500t Street Park the parking could be 10 feet off the building instead of 20 so maybe we only move it 10 feet instead of 18 I stand correct if I could ask a question I'm assuming we uh agree to create the I'll say the Green Space Between the building I think it would make sense to add a uh a sidewalk in there so people could Traverse from one end to the other without walking through grass if a Meandering path of some sort and also Landscaping to prevent a large single Green Space maybe some some if we're going to put in some bmps and some different landscape features there to kind of create that uh a more park-like feel as opposed to it's just big open Green Space yes we would agree and comply with that request um and my second question I'm not sure if you mean Mark are you are you happy with the uh proposed water um retention detention plans as far as flow Etc that that is proposed well you know I'm saving comments until additional testing is performed at currently if if it continues down the path of claiming all the soils or do soils what that does is elim the need or the I'll say eliminates the requirement for the applicant to recharge any storm water which I think the board understands our offices concern with not recharging and so uh we've had discussions and in my opinion even if the soils are reclassified as do soils uh in order to get de permits and Delaware rtin and Canal commission permits I would like the board to support our office's request to do something above and beyond that to do some recharge on the site and in my opinion there are opportunities to do that um one area is in the buyer retention basins you could cap the under drain and allow the basins to infiltrate as now if five or 10 years from now it's not working you have the underd drain there and you simply take the cap off on the outlet structure if you find that it's not functioning properly and and I've discussed that uh with Mr Parker I don't know if he's had a chance to talk to his applicant but it's not it's not a significant cost difference to the project it's simply giving the ground an opportunity to recharge where it can oh my second question is let's assume the road goes to camplan road across the river or creek whatever you want to call it is it significantly high enough to create uh or eliminate a potential for a flooding area that would choke off the access to in case of a of a heavy rainstorm I I haven't seen calculations on the cul yet uh I I'm assuming that that'll that'll have to meet the D criteria so it would not be able to restrict the 100-year flow and I'm assuming all those would be shared with our office uh when that design is done that that's correct it would have the required free board above the future 100e storm that DP is now regulating so it would not Prov it would not um it would not expose the site to any um access issues for emergency vehicles during any flooding event okay so there would be no pooling of water in that area do you think I'm just thinking of just a good old winter freeze so you know the the road coming in would be elevated obviously above the stream there um the drainage area to that stream as I as I said is uh I think at the entrance of our site is about 20 acres it's not a huge drainage area um DP regulates that Crossing they would make sure that that covert was sized to adequately flow the 100-year storm so that we weren't impeding or blocking water so we would not see any icing issues as as a potential issue there as I said that it's going to go through the D for their General permit and as long as our office is copied I I don't have a concern at this point um we jumped past the part about the basins do infil I just want to get on record then the applicant will to go above and beyond and try to infiltrate where it's where there's opportunities exist yes I think I think we talked about maybe in that if if that Center Road's eliminated maybe you know one or two small bio retention basins in there or even if one of the currently proposed basins simply capping the under yes yep okay is again this is my landscaper talking now which way does the site pitch and drain naturally um to the RO Brook to the rear uh you know a little bit of drainage is going to um that tributary which comes from the commercial properties across the camp lane from us but for the most part the entire watered is going towards the Royce Brook which would be the south of us or the right on this screen so um with what the chair brought about ice freeze thaw melt Etc um in these developments they kind of designed to have a lot of parking spots but they don't have a lot of spots to push snow when it's when it's snows and then you have the freeze and thaw um it it hasn't been engineered in there but I don't I always like to see areas that have areas to pile snow to the the we were the lered side of of the drain so uh it doesn't melt across the and create a slip and fall situation um so wherever uh you might allow a cut out in a curb or something to allow them to push the snow out of the the pavement into a grass area so that it melts into the grass as opposed into the sidewalk I don't know if you've engineered any of that or thought about that in the past but uh when you have a especially if you're going to eliminate all that area and just have the the the walkway or the driveway around it where it's all parking they're going to have to put the snow somewhere yeah I mean you know we can work with Mr mayu's office and identify um some areas one of the fortunate uh situations is we are exceeding our parking requirements with 30 Extra Spaces even if you do have to utilize a parking space or or two here or there for snow I think there there will be sufficient room on site to accommodate snow plowing okay yeah I I feel confident we could work with Park Hill's office to identify appropriate Cuts in the in the loop roadway to allow plowing to push the snow off the paving okay I'm okay for I'm done for now yeah no cuz I I was I was just going to start to Echo what your cuz now I'm looking at the pitch and I'm just thinking and the when we have this melt thaw and people got to hold their trash to one of those three locations we don't have a continuous sidewalk for them to walk around they going be cutting you know they got to walk through the parking lot a bit so I'm not sure how how to ensure that wherever it's going to thaw that it thaws away and into the grassy area I don't know what type of pitch that we can do [Music] but yeah we we can look at that with Mr mayu's office um I had a question um on the access road how how wide is that is that just enough room for one car each way or is is there like a little buffer kind of a shoulder or I'm just concerned if somebody does decide to walk to camplain Road um that they're not walking in the middle of a street sure where a car may end or have you account it for maybe a future sidewalk right away comes a day whenever that maybe that road does become a complete Street yeah I I I think the answer is that road is 24 ft wide um you're you know resident access roads range you know I think the smallest that rsis permits either 18 or 20 ft sort of onward from there um there is sufficient room I think the traffic engineer will testify to you know the the number of trips and the generation this is a small community not you know cut through traffic should be um very little um you know simultaneous traffic coming in and out of there so in the event someone is walking there I do think there's adequate adequate room to safely pass and is there a um I guess a school bus stop anywhere designated on there I maybe I missed it um where that comes under traffic yeah the tra the traffic engineer will testified of that okay thank you y s to go thank you good [Music] evening before I get into it were you planning on addressing my report as well [Music] if not I could just ask some questions based on Mr not yeah again I'm just the planner just the planner just the planner that's okay um could you just give further clarification um why the choice wasn't made to do the primary um connection to the Cross access easement that was Pro provided in phase one is that also what have required crossing crossing the stream so instead of connecting to uh camplan Road um can you clarify why the applicant didn't pursue uh the crossing over to the next you know phase one yeah I and you know I don't know that I'm the best to answer this but I'll I'll give it a shot I think through the process there was a an original overall Redevelopment that envisioned um you know both these sites connecting as well as you know another access out to Camp plane we had initially explored you know both Camp plane and the neighboring development and determined under um ngd flood haser regulations we could not accommodate both accesses and wanted to provide access out to the public right away on camplan and that's why that decision was made so so the camplan uh Road one was prioritized over the other connection uh yes that's okay would it be possible in terms of the rules for njd would it be possible instead of doing the crossing to camplan road to connect into phase one would that comply with the njd requirements the clearing limits um I don't know that I can uh answer you with a definite answer I would I would I would um venture to guess that it probably could but I have not explored that to be able to positively answer that for you okay uh you had also testified in terms of phase one uh not having a sidewalk to Camp Lane Road I I agree with you that that is a true statement uh but just to bring to the board's attention uh phase one does have a sidewalk that connects uh from Estelle Street to Roosevelt so it does have a sidewalk that connects to the external network uh which is compliant and consistent with the vision of the Redevelopment plan uh in terms of the agreement of the applicant to working to connect the pedestrians from phase two to phase one I know you're addressing Mr mayu's comments and perhaps you weren't able to look at where that might happen were you thinking that that could be accomplished through the cross access easement or some other location I think through the cross access easement okay thank you that's all I have Mr chairman great [Music] uh just to touch on your one um comment about the sidewalk out the camp plan I think in phase one of the peers that sort of preference was given to that connection um secondary not to Camp plane where there's a scattering of sidewalks throughout that neighborhood but but primarily sidewalks don't exist and um I think that was similar to um our thought process with you know providing a connection of phase two to Jackson where Jackson doesn't have sidewalks nor do you know there the majority of those streets there but priding providing some pedestrian connection outside without putting um people onto Camp plan where we where we saw sort of an unsafe um attractive nuisance as Mr Mayu called [Music] [Applause] it if I could add one thing I'm not sure it made it to our review letter but we were talking about the emergency access and The Pedestrian connection to Jackson Street um in fact the exhibit shows as Mr Park talked about can see on the plans it shows I believe it's like brass pavers so it looks green y the emergency ACC and the sidewalk what you can't tell is these won't actually connect to the the end of Jackson Street so if this is going to continue to be the plan I would suggest to the board that that the applicant should actually physically connect the emergency access to the end of Jackson Street otherwise you got a gap for the fire trucks to make sense yeah I I think that was our intention and the drafting didn't quite keep up with the intention so I apologize but yes we will connect to the to where the asphalt ends on Jackson Street there and you would connect the sidewalk that's a right alongside well at least to Paving yep to Paving that's that's all I had for now thank you and Deputy Mayor yeah um good evening uh can you elaborate on where The Pedestrian access is planned to go between Phase 1 and two and how will that be [Music] constructed um this that shows it the best because the uh C the there's an existing access easement on H phase one that is I don't know if you can see my cursor in this location and then it would cross at a 90° angle across the stream generally to you know this area you know between these two stormw basins okay and how will that will be a black top paved walkway any any plans for how it might be constructed just um I think it would be a perious surface walkway whether it's you know wood trip or um Stone chip or something like that that would allow water to continue to perk um and whatever Crossing was is required at the uh actual stream itself from d a covert and you know some fill but that would be the intention it would not be a concrete or pave sidewalk okay thank you and we and as as far as continuing on in into phase one I know that's not this application but would it be a continuous path you know would phase is Phase One going to marry up to uh this access um yeah if you want to address okay um if it's okay we'd like to I'd like to have run all in back be sworn in and he can address that question if that's acceptable do we have any more questions right now we switch there's no other questions I don't then maybe we what we want to do is open the public yeah I can wait okay thanks okay so may have a motion to open the public all in favor all right okay if there's anyone in public that would like to question this witness on his testimony please come up to the mic state your name and address for the record please and again questions on his testimony and his area of expertise okay uh my name is David Elliot 2191 Jackson Street um for reference on block 114 in the picture on the south side of Jackson adjacent to the property uh so these are just questions of what we just talked about correct just okay um let me see what I uh so we are I'm here with also block 115 uh which is the other property adjacent uh on the north side of Jackson uh so we are in agreement with the appli we would like no sidewalks on our street this would be a huge fiscal responsibility as well as snow removal Etc that we'd have to upkeep on Jackson Street uh my property alone I think is about 237 ft across the front of it which would be uh obviously a lot of upkeep I think my neighbors is over a th000 ft down Shon Street um we would request that there'd be no uh second access road on Adams or primary access on Adams or Jackson Street as in some other notes or mentioned by other people here uh primarily we have uh kids children um dogs uh pets that play in the area it would be a big change for us so we'd like ask that to be considered as just a primary access through camplan and emergency access through Jackson uh lastly uh in accordance with emergency access and talking about parking uh I would like to request that there would be a uh let's see uh no parking no street parking uh at night enforceable on Jackson Street so people from buildings I think six and seven don't park behind on our street and walk towards the property that's a Township committee issue sorry no it's okay now yeah the township committee would have to pass a no parking ordinance uh let me see if I have anything uh we did talk slightly about storm water management uh just one concern I have is off the back end of my property so I'm completely downgrade of Jackson Street itself uh we didn't talk about grading specifically or the grading map uh I'm not an engineer but I did try to read the map myself uh in the back side of my property I think there's a five six or 7 foot drop off uh within probably about 50 ft of my property uh directly onto my property uh so we'd request that maybe some type of burn where those plantings be uh at so that the property manager can manage though storm water on their own rather than having it discharge onto my property so I have thank you could you clarify what your either address or Lot number is uh it is block 114 2191 Jackson Street you don't know the lot number no not off that that's okay [Music] M minute resent brought up some grading issues I don't have that particular area memorized I have look at it and then I'm sure Mr Park Hill can address to be off yes that's correct yes one yes no 114 they're 115 so I have two those two lots right there so you can Lots one and two oh I'm Lots one and two sorry yeah so it's it's this home on the sort of right side of Jackson on this image correct correct yep uh I do have one more issue that we discussed I don't know if it's your area of expertise but it was access to water and um Waste Management uh the only utilities we have on our road is electricity uh being that we're so close to the proposed project we asked that somehow it be extended uh water gas sewer whatever is being offered to the apartment complex is somehow offered to Jackson Street as well thank you [Music] let you handle that one Mr Bernstein that's up to the applicant okay whether they're willing to extend either or both lines to Jackson and I wouldn't be surprised if there are others who might not make the same request on other streets in that neighborhood but I'll leave that to miss elgart her client I think for purposes of this hearing it's opening of a Pandora's Box I think for purposes of this hearing it's opening of a Pandora's Box as you said there's other residents um I'd have to talk to my client obviously to see if that's something we could even entertain I have no idea sitting here whether you know how close it really is so um I don't know that this is it could be part of this hearing we can certainly take a look at it but not part of the site plan application itself if I could follow up on that I've had conversations with New Jersey americ Mark and they New Jersey American wooder hinted that they may require a loop for this site I I would suggest that the applicant sooner rather than later discuss because it may turn out that New Jersey American wants a line to come down in order to provide a loop come down from this direction okay no I we would absolutely look at it it's just that at this point we can't say yes or no obviously that we would do that you could reach out to New Jersey American and start that kind I would hate to go through our whole printing process and then a year from now find out that New Jersey American wants a line coming down Jackson it would be helpful to this board if they knew that ahead of time I think understood okay anyone else from the public come on up state your name and address and feel free to ask the applicant or the witness any questions regarding excuse me my name is Leo Barry I live at 2161 campaign road which would be the bottom left corner um my question is about the tree removal which I got a letter in the mail that it was going to be a 20% removal and they wanted to remove 30 cent of the trees and that's what I thought this was all about tonight because all of a sudden I'm getting flooded in my basement 36 years I've had two floods in the last 3 months I've had about four and you don't know how the water is running you know it could it's running in any direction and you're building this thing around the stream you're sitting there right in the middle of a stream and I don't I don't get that why you couldn't put it adjacent to the to the the track number one number one because you want to get around that stream you know it just it just blows me away how you doing this whole thing the project is crazy and my second question is has to do with sewers which might be not on this agenda I take it what's your question which yes because they want to have a temporary easement going to my property and I've gotten letters in the mail about this and they give me some kind of offer to you know pay me and this and that and they want to go to my septic system which isn't feasible and these guys have these guys have put more markers on my property than you wouldn't believe over the years and it's just and everyone is different and I don't think they know they're doing circus your does your home show up on this plan could you point that out to where right right in the corner there right where that pool you see the pool there the swimming pool right in the bottom left corner of the image right here with B the road Y and now you're getting flooded since ever since they knock down all them trees up there I'm getting [Music] flooded I see people looking at me I I don't know how to answer that the first the first phase what they did when they started doing I've never got 36 years in this house so you're talking about the the phase one not phase two well okay not not the not the ex not this project but the first project but the second project I got a letter in the midle they were they were going to do 20% of the trees were going to be knocked down and they wanted to do 30 7% and there was never anything that was settled about that and that's what I thought this whole meeting was about and it says this is the final meeting I got a thing in the mail about the 17th or the 15th that there's another meeting for the final well this is what they call preliminary and final so it's basically one application all once but I don't it's it's they're going through the whole plan right now but this is on just this phase not the first phase but I I'm trying to understand so you had problems once the first phase started not this not with with yeah okay tree removal I mean you got a stream you're building this thing around a stream which is ridiculous it's totally crazy how you could do that how you getting away with it because I was told 25 years ago never ever build back there they will never build back there never be able to build back there well after Co nobody cares anymore it's like everything went out the window who is they the whole country I mean it's like crazy the whole country said they were never going to build I don't know who they was 25 years ago we can no and just just write the Bucks in and no you don't give a crap about nobody sure for the purpose can you point out on the screen where your home is because I think everybody's all CU phase one is on the other side of this project I okay Mr Mr par would you know if that site is draining towards the subject area or is your subject area draining towards the [Music] resident the the subject area is uh Upstream of both this development and phase one uh the elevations around that subject parcel um shown on our planet are about 64 and the water run off from there is draining toward our site ultimately you know getting to the tributary to the Roy Brook and to the Royce Brook so so your proposed improvements are down gradient from the homeowner that is correct Downstream so Downstream down gradient now when you get differential RS like we've had over you know the last couple of months I mean it just you don't know where the water's going well that's what the engineer is designing here and present don't know flow of water nobody could determine that okay do you have any other questions for the no just as far as the sewers go is that that's nothing to do with tonight's meeting well I'm not sure if it's on site sewers are you talking about or they want to run of line right through my property is that anything from I'm not sure that has to do with our application that's not no no no I'm yeah I don't know that whoever wants to run the sewers I don't know that that's us that's not that's not part of this application it's not part of our application it's not I don't know what notices you're getting but that's not from an attorney in I believe in Oakland I'm sorry say that again an attorney in Oakland New Jersey they wanted no that's that's a different project then our proposed sanitary sewers are limited to the internal of our development and connecting to uh the rear of our property different project you're probably getting the letters from about this I'm not sure they want a temporary easement on my property to run through it you happen to have a copy of the letter sir you happen have a copy the letter with you oh I don't I would suggest to bring it to the planning office only BET right but to bring a copy of the letter so Mr Co can take a look at it and determine which project it's related to I mean it's definitely related to this project where else would it be this is the attorney for the projects I would like to think she knows what letters are going out so there's a pump apparently there a pumping station back there somewhere well that's mua has a pumping station that's the MUA that has a pumping station run it from Camp right to my property well that could be the MUA not them that a could be a completely different thing to tie to tie into these guys no no oh they may be looking it could be an improvement improvement for just the existing area but not for this particular project I think did you testify that you your your tie in is in the back of the property is that correct what no I'm asking engineer that you're tying into the sewer in the back of the project the existing line that's correct on the screen it's sort of the light tan area which was the recently constructed sewer and we're connecting to that sewer okay so they're opposite of you're yeah check it out okay than you thank you no worries thank you sorry I keep coming up um say your name again David uh so he he just reminded me of one point um if I'm going to go point to the screen um so for the engineer Water Management um I've talked to the MUA there's a pipe on our road as I said my property is completely downgrade from the street the street is then uh slanted towards the house to the north here and then there's a pipe under the road which then discharges somewhere about right here and then there's a stream that travels and I don't think was documented on any the bring it up all the way down through this roads Road pipe uh and so on so it kind of stops the water from traveling onto my property and flooding my property uh I maintain the stream just so don't flood but my concern really wouldn't be with the building it' be just when they come in with f overs to level the land and grade it that the stream don't be destroyed or the pipes under the y we would agree to that yes and then I had um just to follow up on my note before because I didn't realized this was the final meeting well it doesn't mean we're going to get to a vote tonight and I don't know where we're going to end so just uh as I asked for the burn before I think everything I said before is more of a suggestion but the actual grading as I said is pretty significant off my property and I don't know if you care but I circled the uh where I'm proposing you were to put a burm there I don't know if that's your expertise or something your applicants or whatever um but when would I be able to get an answer on that or would it just kind of may or may not show up at some point um yeah we'll for for for those of you who keep seeing the man walking back and forth this is Mr alen back the board knows him the public may not he's associated with the developer I believe the designated person uh can we get a copy Mr alen Beck of that when you get a chance not tonight but when you get a chance yes um I can I'm assuming you want it so do you want me to I I have a I can can I make a suggestion Mr chairman that maybe yeah well I think it would be a good time because I haven't looked at Michael and I know this is where about the hour and a half mark that uh he needs a break well we all need a break um you know what are okay is there anyone else left from public let and then we will take a break once we're done with the public we'll make we'll make copies at the break thank you Maria Janus 720 East frck Avenue excuse me I'm also Hillsboro Township property owner my Hillsboro property uh fronts Camp Lane Road it's uh 2155 camplan Road that's block 86 lot three so I think that this is behind my property does this property have Frontage on an improved Street [Music] Road uh this parcel does not have Frontage on an improved road so how is this how is this project being allowed uh the project have front has Frontage on a Township um right away Buffalo Road um in addition to several other right of ways and the proposed project will uh improve that portion of Buffalo Road between camplan Road and the site limit what what is it Buffalo Road is that is that going to be the main access Buffalo Road Camp L bu Buffalo and camplan that's correct right now what what do what road do they have to go on to get on to camplan would be from camplan to Buffalo it's going to eventually be a Buffalo Road cre from that property right you see how is it going to it goes to the north slightly that's going to be Buffalo Road where you see right there leaving development towards camp that little strip right there that's going to be Buffalo Road so that right now has no Frontage it's just on a uh you're talking about a paper Street c uh Buffalo is is Buffalo a an improved road that I can't answer that I'm going to let you guys answer that it will be an improved Road it will be so right now this this prop doesn't have does not have Frontage on an improved Road we're going to improve the road we going to improve the road so so that prop that property belongs to Hillsboro right now yes yes Buffalo belongs to Hillsboro so right away the as a matter of fact the entire property in the back also belongs to Hillsboro that what we're talking about right now block 86 loot 2.02 belongs to Hillsboro correct all right so when when is the per when is that that when is that going to uh be purchased for this project that's subject to another agreement that's not the engineer is not in position to answer that question ask questions of the engineer okay um so um Mr Park Hill you're an engineer have you um have you been before Hillsboro's planning board before I have not had the pleasure this is my first time first time have you um uh done work for this developer before um this is our first project together we are working on other projects as well you have worked with them on other projects yes okay um so um Mr parkel you said that this area is primarily wooded that's correct would did you say that there's a lot of wetlands there um there are wetlands that exist on site yes would you say there's a lot of wetlands I think he just answered that there are wetlands on site there are there are wetlands okay so originally this had been um one um large property and it was subdivided um currently how many how many acres um this Pro not currently but once it was subdivided what is the acreage of this property now 31.3 Acres okay and how many acres um are um buildable um I think I testified that the total unencumbered uh area of this parcel is 9 Acres roughly so so nine acres unencumbered and what um what the other Acres what uh is on those Acres that causes them to be uh um not unencumbered sure a combination of um NDP regulated flood Hazard areas riparian buffers freshwater wetlands areas Associated freshwater Wetland buffers and um Hillsboro Township stream Corridor area wow as well as drcc um regulated area as well wow okay um once this property was uh subdivided it it was now two different two totally two two totally different different um Landscapes does this property have a uh letter of interpretation from uh the New Jersey Department of Environmental Protection yes the Lo the LOI obtained was for both Parcels it's what the LOI obtained covered both Parcels how did it cover both Parcels it's is a separate separate uh uh property not right now with a separate project going on it and it has all of these encumbrances how how is that not uh how is it not necessary to have a letter of interpretation for this property well we have a valid letter of interpretation from the D that applies to this property and and and um this developer applied for that um no so then how does this property have a valid uh letter of interpretation um the DP issues um Lois uh based on uh conditions in the field and that um approval gets filed and follows the land does not file the person DP does not issue an Loi um to a person they issue it based on um a land area and this project as I stated does have a valid Loi okay well but the original land area was was one large parcel that's correct all right so actually this particular site doesn't have its own Loi because there's so many question no commentary okay um let's see here so now um access to this property will be um require you're you're you're seeking a waiver because by law you require two accesses to the property and you have only one well according to the Redevelopment plan what Redevelopment plan there's a Redevelopment plan so that's it's not necessarily an ordinance it's it's an ordinance but it's a Redevelopment plan and what is the and what do you talking about as far as the Redevelopment plan what are you saying it's subject to a Redevelopment plan yes and so that's why that's where it is that's where what is you got to get close to the mic sorry that's where it says that there's two accesses and so we're looking for a waiver for that so the Redevelopment plan the Sherman Redevelopment plan requires two accesses and you're saying we want to waiver from that Redevelopment plan to have only one access correct so most of the things that that that uh are required are requirements of the development plan in addition to whatever else uh what whatever other ordinances there are besides the ordinances Hillsboro's ordinances you also have requirements specific to the Reg development plan that's it's considered an ordinance what is so yes the Redevelopment plan is considered an ordinance correct it's the equivalent of equivalent equivalent of but not an [Music] ordinance um are there any requirements in um for this for this property in the settlement agreement that's not a question for the engineer okay okay wasn't part of his testimony so uh what is the distance between the development that's on phase one the RPM uh development and uh this development what's the distance between the two do you understand I do understand the question I'm going to switch this one thing real fast other one Mr Park go A1 um at the closest point it's uh in excess of 200 fet and from the closest point grows uh more in both directions I'm sorry at Theo at the closest point it's how much 200 feet 200 feet at the closest point and is that going to going to be where the um um path or whichever uh connection is that is that where the the connection between the two is going to be uh the connection between the two will be um in close vicinity to that I don't as I said the connection is not designed yet so I don't know the exact sorry I'm sorry um the connection will be in close vicinity to that I don't exactly know where that uh connection will be it has not yet been designed okay and the connection between the two uh is going to require crossing the stream yes that's correct [Music] so do you have to do you have to get a waiver from the township for that no don't answer Mark I don't I mean I don't think that's a waiver um such such that the town professionals um would identify our waiver would be needed we are requesting that waiver in order to accom um a request um from the board's professionals uh where where did where did you say the um emergency vehicle access is going to be uh it will connect to the uh end of Jackson Street the end of Jackson Street so that's and will that road be improved are there no proposed improvements to Jackson Street no no proposed and will that be able to handle um uh heavy heavy Emergency Equipment uh that will provide uh emergency vehicle access to our site yes I'm sorry what yes that will provide emergency veh vehicle access to our site I I I understand that it's supposed to provide it but will it be able to handle the uh heavy Emergency Equipment that might be necessary um yes it's an improved street with existing um residential structures on it um my assumption is that it uh right now can provide emergency access to those existing structures and would continue to be able to comply and provide access to our site you said that's an improved Street Jackson Street yes it is improved okay um you were discussing earlier discussing a letter and different points what letter what was what what was that letter what you referring to uh that was a uh engineering review letter number two for the Sherman tract phase two with a date of May 2nd 2024 um authored by uh Mr Mayu of panonian Associates okay what was the the initially would you say what the what was the the letter engineering review number two Eng engineering review number two okay um in regard to the soil uh comments were made that that right now uh you're showing that it's the the so it's sea soil but it looks like it might be D soil what is the difference uh between a sea soil and a do soil sure um so sea soils provide um limited uh ability for permeability or the water to sort of perk through the soils D soils provide virtually no ability for um water to perk into the soils um based on you know the the initial investigation we have done out it there um it's an indicating that the existing soils on site um are not currently draining and would not accept um you know infiltration structures that's why um what Mr Mayu referred to as reclassifying the soils um to a dooil so that um you know you weren't creating an instance where you're trying to infiltrate soil into soils that will not accept that so right now if you're going to going to build there and you're going to be providing a lot of impervious surface and now if this soil doesn't drain what do you do uh the the storm Management Systems designed to collect the runoff and uh send it to three small scale bio retention Basin which ultimately will dis charge to uh the Royce Brook tributary to the Royce Brook okay so the Royce Brook um the Royce Brook is is is needing to handle quite a bit of no comment quite a bit of a lot of development which causes flooding M you're finished if you have no more questions go ahead uh comment was made something about off street parking what was that what was that about uh that there were the a waiver wasn't required for parking because it's considered off street parking is that what was said I didn't there was a discussion oh there was a discussion about internally whether it should be considered off Street or on street parking when you go when when there's parking along the uh the buildings and there's parking along what there's parking along the buildings and whether they should be considered on street or off street parking that was the discussion and so and so what is it considered to be uh the the parking is um located along that Center Boulevard uh parallel parking instead of perpendicular parking like the rest of the site and the discussion was around the setback of that parking to the building um that parking is proposed to be set back 14 ft from the building um where the Redevelopment plan requires a 20 foot set back to the street um we do provide 20 foot set back to the cartway but not 20 feet to the edge of the parking space um on street parking is sort of not addressed in the Redevelopment plan in in that particular instance so that's why there was a discussion about that and it's really up to the board to characterize whether it's off Street or on street and that's what we were talking about so we'll defer to the board as to whether they're going to consider it off Street or on street and whether a waiver is required or not oh so I just going to ask so you you don't know whether you require a waiver or not yet as far as parking is concerned correct okay um this property is identified as an area in need of Rehabilitation uh what what is the re Rehabilitation that this property requires not applicable not applicable okay even though it's an area in need of Rehabilitation all right comments were made about something that this this project can't comply with and then this proposed access is AC cross camplain so you have to cross uh tributary of the stream to get to camplain is is that correct that's correct well it's correct that we're crossing a tributary with our access road to camplan so the access road is is what road that we're referring to right now um I believe it's the main entry I I I've been referring to the main entry connecting our site to camp l as the access road and so what is that main entry what is that road the name of it uh it does not currently have a name it does connect to the uh Terminus of Buffalo Street right away so so this what you're talking about this proposed access to camplan that's not Buffalo that's not Buffalo Road no I think I just said that it connected to the Terminus of the right of way of Buffalo Street so this on this is this is the only access that we're talking about the one axis and this has to cross the stream the the tributary of the stream that's correct [Music] so is that comment was made about crossing a regulated water are you were you referring to that stream when that was when that comment was made about a regulated water yes I was who regulates that the New Jersey Department of Environmental Protection yes they do [Music] so comment was made that this this site is encumbered by the Delaware and riton Canal uh uh Comm commission easement or by the by the Delaware and Rison Canal commission and three other agencies uh I didn't write them down what are the other three agencies um would that be the New Jersey Department of envir En enironmental protection that's correct and what else uh the township of Hillsboro and The Soil Conservation District okay um there's going to be three smallscale bio retention basins uh built for storm water management where those uh bio retention basins going to be located a point to my screen for clarification there's uh two um to the top of sheet A2 as displayed and then there is one on the bottom right corner of sheet A2 as well okay now what about what about uh properties that have um septic systems existing properties that have septic systems how does all of this impact those uh uh those those septic systems the the the ground um um for the septic systems is what what what's the impact going to be with this I think that wasn't part of his testimony excuse me that wasn't part of Mr parel's testimony okay so that's that that that's not an issue [Music] um as far as that that access road there won't be any any sidewalks anywhere on that road that's correct uh school buses will be going school buses will be going to the development or or that's not for the engineer to answer we've already established it'll be the traffic engineer okay um what what um what is what is the size of that uh uh Boulevard that's that's possibly going to be eliminated um I think Mr Mayu indicated 62 feet the how much 62 ft is the width 72 62t 62t [Music] um have have uh permits been been uh issued already or have permits been applied for For What from the New Jersey Department of Environmental Protection and DNR Canal commission and wherever else they need to be uh obtained from we've applied for some Outside Agency approvals but we have not applied for all we have applied for some Outside Agency approvals but have not applied for all outside outside agency approvals okay and have you gotten a response to the will serve letters for water and sanitary sewer yes I believe I testified that we do have will serve letters for both Water and Sewer okay so okay thank you okay thank you I'm going to let him get his chance no cuz I saw you wiing it's so quick I don't want to delay this anymore gr colmer 144 Taylor Avenue uh it's about just the uh the the emergency access um that that could provide access to cars if so one wanted to go through there is there any going is there going to be engine you know designed to have maybe posters or like some chain elements so then is that part of the design yeah so part of the the intention is that it would be it would appear to be grass so like a grass paper where it would you know grow through so it would not look like a roadway and then um you know typically a chain like a breakway chain would be put there so just to discourage vehicles from driving through there okay thank you yep sorry I just wanted to clarify one thing that I believe Mr Park Hill said just name David Elliot Block 14 I believe um it was about the is Jackson Street an improved Road and I'm quoting Tom Bellinger from uh the Hillsboro engineering director he's going to start reading things going to have to be sworn in and testify because Mr Bellinger is not here no one has seen any of this information and I'm assuming he's about to discuss whether or not Jackson is an improved or unimproved Road yes uh I don't have to quote him I would suggest unless you want to testify and you have direct knowledge that it's an unimproved orov Pro Road and not relying on Mr Bellinger who's the engineering director for the township then you might want to provide it to Mr Co otherwise so that he can provide it to everyone otherwise it's unsubstantiated and I'm not saying it doesn't have value it's just unsubstantiated okay can I just say that I've the I don't I don't want to say the wrong thing here um it's an email and writing just a quote like what the road made of we known is hearsay testimony it's testimony being proven for the truth of the matter asserted that you are not personally aware of you're relying on the recommendation or comments of a third party if you'd like to provide Mr K with that email okay the man during during the break during the break we we can attempt to circulate it but it's not necessarily binding at this moment but I agree with the I suspect will be back can I just bring up the point without quoting him or mentioning his name at all uh or is it too late what's the issue it's just that it's uh not a paved Road it's a chip sealed Road that's all I was going to say is that correct Mr Park Hill as far as you're aware Jackson Street is a chip seal road if you're aware if you're not if you have knowledge I'm not aware thank you okay thank you thank you okay I have a question Mr chairman all right you're standing between us on a break so uh other people were standing between you and a break 20 minutes ago so leaving that Mr Park Hill what's the status of the application the D for the crossing over the Culvert we have not made that application to the D yet and therefore obviously a condition of any approval would be that the D approves the over the Culvert if they don't we're back here at square one with another application correct that's correct thank you okay now Mr chairman you can have all right so we are going to take a 10-minute recess we don't have the big clock so I got to use 920 we'll say 920 on the clock that's back there but that may not be synced to your phone so we're back in session on long is thank you um i' like to this was I'd like to call Ron all back um he's the director of planning and Engineering on half of Eminem at camplain Road um he just I'm just going to bring him up to explain some of the things that uh we had oh here we go Miss Elgar before we swear swear at Mr or swear in Mr alen Beck uh for the purposes of the record Mr chairman the board has been provided a copy as I believe Council for the applicant as well as the board professionals Mr Co Mr Mayu myself of the document that was provided by a member of the public earlier I apologize for not mentioning gentleman's name where he circles a series of plan things burms Etc out by what I believe is between Jackson Street and Grant uh which is what he was alluding to I believe the testimon or the request he was making was that the applicant provide sufficient birming Landscaping Etc in order to deal with the issue of runoff related to the application and um this the it's uh David Elliot I have and he's at 21 Jackson Street just to just for the record mark this is uh any problem marking this as A4 rather than 01 um we can mark it as A4 it's fine thank you 2191 2191 219 we were all corrected we all got a little bit of some of the numbers here and there all good thank you Mr thank you Miss elart now you can Mr lomber doy if you'd swear Mr alen back inuth truth truth I do sure Ronald Allen back a l n b a um Mr chairman it's appropriate um listening to some of the questions from the public and from also from the board I just want to put some clarification back for purpos of the record I know you've been before the board more times than most of the professionals have been over the years State your position with the applicant and your qualifications related there too sure I apologize again as indicated I'm the director of engineering planning and development for Edgewood Properties power company of Eminem at camplain Road uh I've been with uh Edgewood Properties for 25 years appeared before this board uh as a fact witness for the developer and that's what I'm here for tonight okay um Mr chairman a couple things um related to um Mr Elliot and his request and uh A4 I apologize the screen is not cooperating with us but as indicated and what he circled on here was on our Landscaping plan and what is referred to as A4 on sheet 9 of 17 he had encircled some supplemental plantings that we're doing along his property line there there's an existing tree line that we were not except for these supplemental plannings we're not planning on going in our grading stops outside the existing tree Laine it's not Our intention to go up to his property um again we'd be happy to work with the resident on those supplemental plannings in INR concurrence with the township but it wasn't our plan to go in there and do grading um so therefore uh a burm is really not possible because I'd have to do additional clearing of those trees existing trees that are in there and again as I stand here today it's difficult when you look at a site plan or a survey and they show that proverbial tree line um doesn't always necessarily mean it's fully wooded thick trees in there could be just sparse trees which which is why we're supplementing some Landscaping in there but again I put on a record for the purpose of the record can you point out on the screen this is 82 the tree line you're talking about I think it's obviously again as indicated it's in in the southwest corner of the property along here again as indicated what's shown on here in the different colors is the supplemental Landscaping but our grading really only ex oh only extends by the parking lot anything else you can do apparently you're able to put things up that aren't there and move the screen the man the man is amazing and so and I'd be happy to work with the applicant in conjunction I mean sorry with the resident as well as conjunction with the township engineer and David's office uh for that supplementing planning whether during construction or whatever to ensure again we're not intending to go near his property line so that drainage ditch or whatever he's referring to will continue and obviously um this is a we're long-term holders here this is going to be our project obviously will be around if there's any issues out there we could make sure we get out there to uh fix any potential issues that were caused by our construction there um as it relates to the bus stop uh and again in working in conjunction with the township and the school board It's Our intention to have this the bus come into the site work with the school board as to exact location of the bus stop I will point out that uh based on uh the board's professionals and you know our concurrence about this elimination of the boulevard it does give us uh an opportunity uh if you will to locate the bus stop in and around those those areas on the Ring Road in close proximity that would be more centrally located for a bus to come into the site uh either Circle it and then pick up the children and leave or pick up the children and circle it and leave but again that's something we would work with both the township and the Board of Education uh for that location at a bus stop uh as far as a sidewalk connection to phase one uh the only thing I put out there and again we agreed to to work with the township and njd for that connection the one thing I will point out there's several comments came off about location and obviously we don't know the full design of it and I know Mr parkel talked about a potential location in between the two basins that connect at its closest proximity um I will suggest and again working with the professionals you know if you look at the the static uh exhibit that's on the screen um where you see the the tan line or the existing cleared line with a sanatary sewer that sanatary sewer extends into phase one one suggestion for the board professionals to consider is putting the so and again if the htmua will allow it to put the sidewalk in that location the trees are already cleared uh the path is there already it may be a longer sidewalk as far as walking distance but it may be something that exits behind that building that's on the the 45 degree angle wraps around the detention Basin to get to that easan area and then cross the stream in that area it still would involve a culvert but again the trees are already cleared the stream Carter uh disturbance is already there from the sanitary sewer and we could simply again if the htmua will allow this temporary walk or not temporary this walkway on top of their sanitary sewer easement I just put that out there for the board and the professionals to consider that it might be a better location ultimately and that's all I have Mr chairman okay thank [Music] you any I don't know you might get questioned oh oh no no you guys sit just want to make sure any questions any questions sorry I do thank Mr chairman do you have the ability I I noticed we have three exhibits up on the screen do you have the ability to pull up any of the submitted documents on the screen we can't get rid of that's actually not even from our computer right now um that's just static literally static from before um we unplugged the computer so that we don't even know why it's still exhibiting A3 so that's really all we have access to right now else that's that's somebody else's computer El's computer that is clearly um Ron's computer because it has the uh the battery computer is taken over yeah [Applause] [Music] and I even tried doing the when you do the control saying to mirror it yeah I'm [Music] doing sending the picture through the USB is not working [Music] turn Mr May so well we'll try this without exhibits I'm referring to [Music] um School Bus circulation plan and I don't know if you're the right person but you were talking about school buses um this is sheet one of3 by midatlantic engineering um last revised April 19th 2024 and my concern is it shows the bus turning movements um around the site and then out onto camplan Road and when the bus it appears when the bus is making the turn on Camp camplain Road it's crossing over the center line and when it's making a turn from camplain into the site it would be interdicting if there was a car waiting to pull out um and I don't know how to show this to anybody but is this something that we can agree there will be additional engineering effort to eliminate these conflicts yeah I mean the question is probably more for Mr Park Hill but I know that it's It's Our intention not to have that conflict so if that means uh wider radiuses to allow for the school buses to make that turn without going into oncoming traffic um certainly we something we' be willing to work with you on okay um on sheet 20 or three there's um a fire truck circulation plan it's uh the Hillsboro ladder truck and it's also it appears to have a conflict when the truck's trying to enter the site it would hit a car if there was a car waiting to pull out now it also crosses the C line I think we're all familiar with if there was an emergency vehicle there's going to be lights on other vehicles will yield away so I think there can be some flexibility on crossing the center line for emergency vehicles unlike say for a school bus that's mov moving but I would ask that your engineers take a close look at the emergency vehicle entering it's conflicting with if there was a car trying to exit it's a significant conflict um it's so on the plan it's taking up the full exit Lane to make this movement and I think that's more than what a typical you know sometimes you have to back up to let a vehicle in and I could appreciate a little bit of movement but this is a significant conflict that I would ask that your engineers take a look at yeah yeah Mr Mayor between you Mr Park Hill and and the Traffic Engineers um we'll take a close look at that and uh provide some options or alternatives to you so that uh you can take a look at it until you're you know satisfied there's not going to be that again like you said there may be a potential smaller conflict like you said but obviously to minimize whatever conflicts are at that intersection and while we're talking about that intersection I don't know if you're the right person there's currently looks like Street trees proposed on both sides of the cartway within the Buffalo Street right away one of our comments was to add some screening some I would prefer Evergreen screening in addition to these Street trees to provide screening to the existing residents on each side we didn't touch upon that in our review letter is that something that is agreeable yeah it is I think that's why we skipped over because we would agree to comply with that yeah it it was in the in the review letter actually so thank you I I think that's all I have then for for this witness Mr you Mr Coy anything no Mr chairman thank you okay board members okay we're still open to public yep yep anyone from the public that would like to question this witness on his testimony please state your name and address for the [Music] record Maria Janus 6 720 East FR Avenue and owner of uh block 86 slot 3 in Hillsboro 2155 camplan Road uh in regard to the school bus going into the site comments were just made that there's not enough room to properly turn in and out that that bus would have to cross the center lane is that correct yeah we agreed to work with the engineer to avoid that conflict why is that even um an issue right now I mean how what kind of plans have been made Mr said they they've already answered the question they're going to work with the engineer to that's my next question is is how how how were these plans made that bus can't turn without going and and so if there's another vehicle coming then there would be there would be an accident correct and you got children and you got children on a school next question all right so what what would be a uh proposal uh to remedy the situation are you going to be able to widen that access uh uh Road uh again as indicated we'd work with the township professionals uh it could be Simply Having larger radi on the curves to allow for a larger vehicle to make those turns without having a conflict there I'm sorry what what what does that mean have larger radi wear at the curves at the curves coming into the site the curves that come in would have a larger radi to pull the curve back to give more room for the vehicles to maneuver and that would be would that be the only solution I don't know I have to I have to we have the engineer has to look at it to the truck turning and see what the conflicts are it may be a combination of things I can't say that as I'm sitting here today okay in regard to that sidewalk connection um you say that there are are there sanitary sewers already uh extending into the the the subject site now where you have to con you have to uh put the sewers in to connect them to phase one they're existing they what they're existing they're existing and So you you're you're proposing doing what like a a a um walkway over that over that area over the area where this where the uh seers that was just one of my suggestions to the board and the board's professionals to one of the options to look at and where where is that uh Culver that is that the The Proposal right now is to have that connection going over um over a culvert what connection the sidewalk the the con the connection between the the two uh developments right as I indicated and as Mr parkel indicated any Crossing from of a sidewalk or pedestrian path from our site to the phase one would require a njd permit which requires us to cross the tributary or that stream that runs north to south that's what I refer to as a pipe or Culvert that has to be there so the water can continue to pass through while we build a sidewalk over the top of it and and why is there not another location so that you're not going over or that stream is go right AC is going the whole distance the whole length of the property wow and we're proposing it merely um because the board has asked us for the there to be pedestrian access to phase one so you don't see it now because we're considering doing it we're going to see if we can do it and that's what we're trying to accommodate with the board and the board's professionals what they had suggested and asked for so there are still a number of revisions that are going to have to be made uh to these to these plans correct all right thank [Music] you uh Grant colmer 144 Taylor would you be able to answer why the priority was given to exit out onto camplain are you the person that could give some clarity rather than going through phase one uh well I could talk to you as as a developer and why we decided to go that the Redevelopment plan uh always contemplated access at the camplain uh camplan is an existing uh roadway Network system um that we'd be tying into as opposed to going through another private development even though the the private development adjacent to us was set up for a potential connection uh it was determined by us that it was better for us and for the development to use the primary connection out to a public right away and not go through a private development budgetary reasons not at all uh engineering reasons not at all it's the same stream Crossing you'd have to do um better for you why better for you better access better access for the community for my residents don't have to go through a private development to get to their homes okay thank you you're [Music] welcome okay I don't see anyone else thank you thank you thank [Music] you okay if we can uh swear in uh Mr Andrew vishio he testim tonight G be the truth the truth nothing the truth yes I do uh first name Andrew last name V o v as in Victor I S as in Sam c h i o and could you say for the uh for the board what your educational background is and qualifications and licenser absolutely um I'm a professional engineer with Stonefield engineering and design located at 92 Park Avenue Rutherford New Jersey uh I'm a licensed professional engineer as I said in the state of New Jersey my license is uh in good standing um I received my bachelor's and master's degrees both in civil engineering from the Georgia Institute of Technology I have been practicing engineering for approximately 13 years now both in the private and public sectors and I have been accepted as an expert in traffic engineering before planning and zoning boards throughout the state of New Jersey thank you um if the board would accept Mr vishio as a traffic as a traffic expert yes any objections okay we accept please proceed thank you um so you had submitted two traffic impact studies correct uh June 15 2023 and revised April 19th 2024 um if you could go through some parts of it with regard to describing the the project and the circulation around the project itself within the project um the location and if you can go through some of the traffic issues if any that you've encountered absolutely so beginning with our site location and context uh the site is located on the south side of camplan road uh as was previously testified to uh we are approximately 750 ft east of Sunny me Road um the nearby land uses are generally residential and uh Industrial in nature camplain road is uh approximately 24 ft wide it is under Municipal jurisdiction the posted speed limit is 35 mph it carries approximately 6,000 vehicles per day um and it is classified as an urban major collector um I think that's an important important Point um uh to expand on uh given the the discussion about access directly to Camp camplan Road versus access through phase one um so collector roads are uh major and minor roads that connect local roads and streets with arterials um collector roads provide less Mobility than arterials do uh at at lower speeds uh and for short distances the reason being is that they balance Mobility with land access so um land access direct access to to properties is uh contemplated um with the class ification of this roadway as a collector um roadway uh access uh camplan Road provides access to Route 206 uh less than a mile to the West um and uh as I uh if I forgot to mention it is approximately 750 ft east of I should have clarified that it is an unsignalized intersection with sunny me uh Road um so uh in addition to investigating ating uh and assessing the surrounding roadway and adjacent land uses existing uh traffic volumes also serve as the basis um for our traffic uh analysis uh turning movement counts uh in the report submitted uh and last revised April 19th 2024 were collected in 2019 um and they were grown to a existing year uh of 2024 subsequent to the submission of the latest traffic report we did collect supplemental traffic counts um those traffic counts were collected on Thursday April 18th uh 2024 one day prior to the resubmission of our traffic study um those traffic counts were collected from 7: to 9:00 a.m. and from 2: to 6:00 p.m. uh very important to note Sunny meet Elementary School was in session um um comparing the traffic counts that were recently collect collected to the ones that were used uh from 2019 and grown to the 2024 condition uh the new uh am weekday morning Peak period traffic counts were approximately 15% lower than the uh accounts that were grown from 2019 however uh the evening peak hour counts were approximately 2% higher um than the 2019 traffic volumes that were grown to 2024 um so with the existing counts serving as a basis for our analysis uh we then take a look at what the traffic uh may be generated by the proposed development and we do that by looking to Industry standard uh resources uh in this case um we sought out the Institute of Transportation Engineers trip generation manual for this development which is 88 total uh lowrise multif Family Apartments um based on that information uh we are projecting that there would be less than one vehicle entering and exiting the site every minute um during the busiest peak hour uh which is the weekday evening peak hour so 45 trips uh in and out combined total so less than uh one vehicle every minute um that uh that number being less than 50 total trips is important because the Institute of Transportation Engineers establishes 50 trips as a general guideline or threshold um for the scale of a development that could potentially impact uh the operations of the surrounding um land use uh surrounding roadway Network um so right off the the bat we know before we even analyze uh any nearby intersections it's highly unlikely that a development of this scale would uh appreciably impact the surrounding roadway Network nevertheless we did conduct a a uh a quantitative um uh analysis of the unsignalized intersection of camplan Road and sunny me Road um and our findings are that uh with the addition of uh the traffic that would be generated by this development uh the the operations uh at all approaches to that intersection um uh would continue to operate generally consistent with a future condition where this development is not constructed um uh more specifically um only one new vehicle would travel through that unsignalized intersection um every two minutes and our NES our new site traffic only represents approximately 3% of the total volume through that unsignalized intersection um taking uh a look now uh at the site access uh one full movement driveway is proposed along camplan Road um and gated emergency access is also provided to Jackson Street I understand that we are requesting a waiver for um not providing a second access point but my interpretation is that we really are meeting the intent of that section uh of the Redevelopment plan um the Redevelopment plan reads that uh the redeveloper of parcel B will provide at least two Street connections to the surrounding Street Network that will that will allow for free flow of traffic within and through the rehabilitation area including emergency vehicles and school buses so it is my opinion that by providing emergency access uh to Jackson Street we are uh meeting the intent uh of that uh of that requirement um um having access on camplan road is uh uh a single point of access on camplan road is appropriate um because the the capacity at the single driveway um is adequate for the load traffic generation of the site um going back to the discussion about potentially connecting with phase one uh the the downside to that would be not just uh the impact to the frontage roads for that private development and the residents that may live there but also a busier single intersection um that uh that might incur more delay as vehicles are entering and exiting that one Consolidated uh entrance and exit Point um uh I understand that uh we currently as submitted meet the uh proposed parking requirement of 2011 spaces uh I understand that we are uh making an effort to uh make some minor changes to the design of the site uh to eliminate uh the Center Drive aisle uh we will strive to make uh to to meet that require M uh that parking requirement with the redesign um we will continue to provide uh adequate adequately sized parking spaces um both 90° and parallel parking spaces if there are parallel parking spaces on the future site plan and um in conclusion um I would just like to say that the uh based on our uh our Capacity Analysis that we prepared and submitted within our traffic impact study and based on uh industry standards uh and guidelines the proposed development would not have a significant impact on the traffic operations of the adjacent roadway Network um a single full full movement access point on camplan road is sufficient to accommodate the vehicular demand of the proposed development uh again based on our qualitative um I apologize quantitative analysis of that of that driveway um the emergency access road provides a convenient connection to the surrounding radway Network um and it would require a limited disturbance to connect to Jackson Street and we will continue to make an effort to provide a parking Supply that is sufficient to support this project um that concludes my direct testimony I'm I'm I made an effort to address some of the questions in the review letters but I'm sure there's some cleaning up that we have to do yes um and I do have a just a followup question with regard to the by providing um the full access from camplain Road and the emergency access through Jackson do we comply with rsis we do so [Music] um rsis would um categorize this type of development uh as a multifam access culdesac um specifically uh they state that streets serving multif family developments with a single me means of Ingress and egress shall be classified as multif family access culde acts now that is an appropriate orientation of access where average daily traffic does not exceed 1,000 vehicles in our case uh again citing the residential site Improvement standards RS is um the uh rsis provides a trip generation rate a daily trip generation rate of 7.2 uh vehicles per unit which equals I'm losing my notes but it's Pro approximately 600 trips well well uh well fewer than um uh 1,000 in a day okay thank you um I'm going to refer you to the to Pen's letter dated May 2nd 2024 um and I'm just going to ask you to turn to page three it's and I just have a question with regard to the second um comment with regard to the suggestion that um there should be or suggest considering um pedestrian access from Jackson down to Sunny me elementary school if you could just touch on the safety aspects of it um and your your opinion with regard to that yeah I think I understand um the the intent uh uh of the comment um however the the geometry of the surrounding uh roadway network uh makes pedestrian accommodations uh along Jackson um or Adams to Sunny me extremely challenging um uh specifically Sunny me uh road is uh only 22 feet wide um from edge of pavement to edge of pavement um so providing a safe Ada accessible sidewalk along Sun me Road would be extremely challenging um and uh the uh Jackson Street itself is approximately um it varies from 15 feet wide to 18 ft wide uh in uh cartway width so again that narrow width makes it extremely challenging to uh construct a sidewalk um uh beyond the geometric challenges uh that these roadways uh uh pose um is the the the challenge of establishing a safe uh crosswalk um across sunme Road for pedestrians who uh would desire to um uh take their children to uh or um to Sun meat Elementary School um so the combination of uh that challenging pedestrian Crossing uh the narrow roadway widths uh make it um uh an unsafe environment um to uh and in a challenging environment to construct pedestrian improvements to to uh meet meet this request okay [Music] um and if you can turn to page four um number five if you could address um the widening that's being suggested there absolutely so the the widening um uh if I uh my understanding of the combat is that the the widening would uh facilitate turns um uh in and out of the site um now uh we do not feel that that is necessary or uh warranted uh for a few reasons um referring back to our traffic impact study um [Music] the the site driveway um the left turn into the site driveway is calculated to take no more than uh 8.1 seconds uh during the weekday evening peak hour um the so uh the left turn in um uh does not require any room for uh a vehicle to pass someone uh Desiring to make the left turn into the site uh for the uh for the right turn in um the ashto greenbook um uh which is uh a policy on the geometric design of Highways and streets uh does not provide a warrant for um uh auxiliary Lanes or or uh widening tapers however we did uh research um uh the nchrp report 279 um which provides some guidance there as far as warrants for when a deceleration Lane uh is necessary for um for right turns um looking at that report um the the approach volume of 321 vehicles um would require 35 turning movements right turn movements um to meet that warrant whereas we are only proposing or projecting 18 so um we do not meet the warrants that uh we researched for the deceleration Lane um and in addition to that our Capacity Analysis doesn't justify uh the need for any uh shoulders or widening to facilitate turns uh in and out of the site okay thank you um and then I almost done just want to direct you to page 16 where um under traffic impact statement just with regard to one and two there um the board professionals had asked that we grow the volumes to 2024 levels and that's what you were talking about that you submitted an updated plan is that right that is correct exhibit that thank you okay um I don't have any further questions um I think we've covered everything we need from the letter but we're open to start to my left to Mr [Music] Mayhew thank you Mr chairman I think I would just like to focus on one item um and that is uh page four of our report item number five um which Andrew had discussed that the left hand or right hand turns um in his opinion are not warranted um we're not proposing a a dedicated left-and turn lane and and our and our notes not proposing a dedicated desel Lane what we're proposing proposing is providing safe paved cartway for when Vehicles do stop and pause to make a left um if you look at the roadway today there's areas along that roadway where cars have been running off the edge of pavement um and that introduces a very significant safety issue if tires and wheels are going off the side of pavement so what we're proposing is a very modest um 12ft travel Lane each way with an 8ft paved shoulder and we're only asking it for the length of the right way that they're coming in frontting on which is 60 feet so if I could we're just asking for the roadway to be improved for 60 ft which is mirroring the amount of Frontage they have along this road and then when you widen it so if you have a 12T travelway with an 8ft page that's 20 feet from Center Line and then we're simply asking for tapers a taper going eastbound and a taper going westbound so that there's the proper uh taper based on speed So within 10 and some feet those tapers would disappear it's a very modest and I think it greatly increases the safety for when Vehicles do slow down to turn right in it increases the SA safety for when vehicles are parked there to turn left and as we've pointed out the current intersection is not accommodating the school bus without conflicts it's not ACC coming the emergency vehicles without conflicts and I think introducing these can help the applicant adjust address those conflicts so I would continue office would continue to reiterate that this should be given serious [Music] consideration um if Mr Al back could respond to it I apprciate it so chairman is that okay yeah um L again we appreciate it and it wasn't necessarily the the widening uh that we had an issue with because it is as Mr Mayu limited to to that Frontage right away the issue comes in with the taper um because we have that covert that's to the west of us um that may or may not be impacted you know we have some limited survey information out there and our concern with that taper as you extend it further down the road is the need to now take a wall That's existing and now push it further down away from the road which would impact njd require additional permitting uh and that's where our concern is if there was a way to work it out where that taper fit within the existing edge of pavement and the existing head wall we have no issue with guard rails to protect the head wall um we just didn't want to get into a perming I don't want to say nightmare but another permanent issue with the widening of that Culvert on either side specifically more our side but the other side and then also existing utility poles uh on the other side we would have to just take that into consideration to see where they land um with that widening and if it's a seven foot shoulder instead of an 8ft shoulder or 11 foot Lane instead of a 12ft lane to accommodate you know that we're not moving five different poles or we're not moving a head wall we'd be happy to work with the engineer on that I can't speak to the impact potential to utility polls our office did look at the Culvert based on as you said there might need to be some more detailed survey but based on the survey provided uh and based on our math of a 40 mph taper for the 8ot widening it looks like the taper would be completed and stay within the head wall that exists on the eastbound Lane which is west of your of your intersection so we're talking about the taper for the right hand turn in correct so we did look ahead to see if that would impact the the head wall for that stream it appears that it it would not it may need to adjust the inlets that are there uh whether they if they're be inlets they move over a little bit or if they're just convert to e correct I think there's something simple can be done there but I did hear and gu rail would definitely even today I think the guide reil is warranted based on the distance to the headwall but jobs I understand you'll be willing to put the guide rail in correct so Mr chairman and if the appli I think the taper can work uh I just can't speak to the utility poll situation uh yeah and again Mr chair without additional survey workout there and obviously I think we mentioned it earlier I think you might have mentioned it um obviously we're not going to finish tonight we could take a look at that between tonight and next meeting and just get some idea if they're 10 feet off the edge of pavement or 12 feet and see what works and what doesn't work and come back with an answer on that but we're willing to you know work with the engineer in the township to provide that that safe accommodation for our Frontage okay if we can little bit the the widening to our side of the frontage uh would that I I the shoulder on the opposite side of the road um would my interpretation is facilitate someone driving around someone waiting to make a turn into the site correct okay so um I think that if that's the intent the the volume that's going into the site and the volume on camplan road are both extremely um minor and I think the occurrence of someone waiting um for multiple cars to pass to enter the site uh would be um very uncommon so um just some just some numbers to back that up the the critical Headway for a left turn from a major Street into a driveway is 4.1 seconds um meaning that there needs to be a 4.1 second Gap in traffic um for for that that vehicle on campling road to enter the site um now there's uh 321 opposing Vehicles during the busiest peak hour um of the day uh so that's one car every approximately 11.2 seconds um so that's just some raw numbers to back up that it's there essentially will be very few if any occurrences of of any queuing building up for someone waiting to enter the site um due to the low traffic generation of the site and the low traffic volume on camplan road obviously the you know in our traffic study we do acknowledge that it's you know level of surface a but um I wanted to expand on that and just put some raw numbers to that I I greatly appreciate your numbers I mean I if I have to I could have our traffic department take a harder look at this and and but one of the things that's important to note and I think we all experien is that is life isn't just averages so even though it may average out that there's 11 seconds or whatever you're reporting there are going to be occurrences when that doesn't Pro isn't provided we're looking at the long-term safety of the residents going past this and entering the site and we think this minor little bit of cartway adjustments is more than Justified for the ultimate safety of the the roadway understood I think I think we' previously indicated that you know we'll work together on that so um we'll we'll strive to do that thank you okay all right we we we've entered into the overtime realm so I let it go past as I call it we had stoppage time for any soccer fans out there we only have one more witness actually miss phone is used to spending the night with us and going home and coming back so this this is this not Uncharted Territory for you for her but but we'd have to open up to the public for questions before we would even get there um can we open up to the public and finish with well we we it's going to wind up coming back I think for some of the followup right so Mr chairman yes sir I appreciate it thank you related to the next hearing MH I'd like to make a suggestion it's rather unique for the township but miss elgart and her clients have to be agreeable as well though we have a semi full schedule next Thursday in terms of the number of applications I don't think there any of them going to take all night so if she's willing to come and intersperse herself in between the two Homestead 303 Amwell the g&j steel tubing and the County's appearance at 9: uh she can come back next Tuesday next Thursday without notice she probably won't get the rest of the testimony in or the public but will at least move the process along if Miss cfone who is only spending half her life here not come back next th okay so I I thought well well you could finish your your Traffic Engineers testimony at least um right but will you have a chance to analyze the discussion that we just had the survey work yeah absolutely okay so is your traffic engineer available next Thursday I am we can continue at least to finish that up and then the next question is when on our schedule more importantly when on Mone schedule are we available now we now you have the right idea because she you know she's coming here for other people at other times am not well she has and the last time we asked her to accomodate she refused to allow us to join her on her trip to Europe so therefore we're gonna you know have to deal with it here um Mr Co correct me if I'm wrong going forward since we are our calendars are somewhat booked is it June June 6 I think is the next one and then the next one after that is June 13th so I don't know what the availability is walk over phone so I'm due to land at 350 on June 13th so assuming my plane's on time I can be here I'm not sure my client wants to take that risk so an international flight and if it does not come on time I'm not sure if Jack wants to send jet to get me if my plan running late so I don't yeah but the question is he you promised that whole night I am okay yeah just you want you want you want to roll the dice we'll take yeah I mean if if as long as the boards can appreciate the that we might have to carry we have sure absolutely we have two well here what we have two applications on for the night of the 13th oh okay one let me one is basically a request for an Extinction on a minor the the other one is coming in for their first we could probably I'm not I'll speak on behalf give you the last hour so starting at 9ine starting at 9ine we would notice for seven and by that point hopefully misone jet lagged and all but still the best Still Still Still In top shape of course well this is have all right and you know we'll talk for June 13th then we'll see where we are at that point okay fair enough and then I'm sorry May 9th you said at what time between two applications or after we got application my point is I I would suggest being here I would suggest be here at 7 because the first application doesn't take long we can squeeze you in at that point get you in and out and move on or at least after the okay one one last item we need an Extinction on time of decision um well okay well or or we or we can turn you down tonight you can add that to the ongoing other stuff going on we're good I'm assuming you're going to be attending the meetings going forward we'll have to see I would blessed I suggest I would suggest to Mr allenbach and his and and the client that having changing attorneys in Midstream as Charming as your boss is um it might make sense I'm sure he'd be thrilled too not to have to come well we'll we'll play it by ear how's that we it's gonna be a surprise keep everybody on their toes one question for Eric in the event that our jet Setter um has complications what would be the next date after June 13 just out of curiosity well strangely enough the next application after that she's here for somebody else oh Homestead you're here for Homestead she can make that one well I don't know how long she's going to be on with that one that's our favorite Warehouse application when's that in July that's in July because we're we were accommodating your your schedule wasn't here yeah July July 11th understand that the next application there in is currently scheduled with one applicant and there's witness number one okay so we'll work it out we'll see where we are thank you all right appreciate it thank you so much uh time of decision my dear it's already signed till when for the purpose of the record uh June 13th that's certain you're gonna get it done okay um all right I think I think we'll have that conversation June 13th because you're also asking for waiver issues that I think need to be addressed and Mr Co and Mr May I think have been holding off some of their comments until the end of the testimony from my gathering correct my report also hasn't been addressed so but I'm just the plan I'm assuming that's Miss Kone um correct all right chairman this is a motion to carry this application to May 9th 2024 at 700 p.m. or as soon thereafter as the matter may be heard as well as Thursday June 13th 2024 at 7 p.m or as soon thereafter as the matter may be heard without further notice and an extension of the time of decision to June 13th okay so just for the residents that are here you're not getting another notice so hopefully you made note of the dates it'll also be on the website well it'll be on the website right but okay so may have a motion for the extension okay Mr sco sneaks in last and thank you jump in all right is there a second second okay roll call please Mr Wagner yes Mr Smith yes Mr belli yes Mr Dev yes m in the pon yes Deputy Mayor Chelli yes Vice chair PE yes chair yes okay and as everybody knows on the planning board we have a meeting next week with multiple applications that's right [Music] [Laughter] very very funny so with that I will entertain a motion of adjournment thank you thank you thank you so much so move is there a second second all in favor I so that you know