morning Dave morning oh yeah great you look like a million bucks I don't me green wrink thank you feel okay um I'm okay I'm I saw the green grass this morning and the Blue Sky recoring in progress good morning and welcome today's meeting Thursday March 14 2024 with the cemetery commission we'd like to call this meeting to order we'd like to stand up first and do the Pledge of Allegiance I pled alance to flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty justice for all thank thank you so we are meeting here at Town Hall in the Bola meeting room and I need to read a few things to you in accordance with the requirement of the open meeting law please be advised that this meeting is being recorded and broadcasted live over the lunenberg public access channel on Facebook live on the public access Facebook page and will be uploaded to the lunenberg access YouTube after the meeting this meeting will be held in person at the location provided on this notice members of the public are welcome to attend the in-person meeting please note that while an option for remote access Andor participation is being provided as a courtesy to the public the meeting will be suspended or terminated if technology or technological sorry problems interrupt the virtual broadcasts unless otherwise required by law members of the public will with particular interest in any specific item on this agenda should make plans for an in-person versus virtual attendance accordingly a member of the public who wishes to record a meeting must first notify the chair and must comply with reasonable requirements regarding audio or video equipment established by the chair so as not to interfere with the meeting the chair is requested to inform other attendees of any such recording at the beginning of the meeting if someone arrives after the meeting has begun and wishes to record the meeting that person should attempt to notify the chair prior to beginning recording ideally in a matter that does not significantly disrupt the meeting in progress such as passing a note to the chair the chair should Endeavor to acknowledge such attempts at notification and announce the fact of any recording to those in attendance this agenda lists all the topics which may be discussed at the meeting and are those reasonably anticipated by the chair votes may be taken as a result of these discussions not all items listed May in fact be discussed and other items not listed may also be brought up for discussion to the extent permitted by the open meeting Law Public participation is encouraged and public comments may be welcomed during the Committee Member discussions at the discretion of the chair please note during public comment that you have 3 minutes to give you public comment thank you is there anyone here today that's taping please yes okay and your name oh sorry John okay David B thank you make sure you read please okay we're going to go a little out of key here um we're not going to go in order because I've got to get Mike out of here um he's got to get to a meeting so we're going to start off with number which is discuss the potential Cemetery commission candidate so Michael would you like to come up and and tell us about yourself and yes uh Mike Clark I live at uh 275 Crossroad Lunenburg down by uh Cherry Hill Farm uh we moved here in 1992 and uh I like to say people come here for the schools or other things I grew up in uh conquered just uphill from verls uh dairy farm so I like to say I came here for the hills and the and the dairy farms uh when you live uphill from a dairy farm you get a a nice odor uh and being right adjacent to Cher Hill Farm in the spring when they start to spread the it reminds me of my my youth so I uh we really love lunenberg and uh I um uh for for uh my interest in the sumary commission I'm I'm interested in getting back on a Town board uh I started out I I did under eight and 10 soccer coaching I did um the school's Health advisory Council uh that motivated me and uh my interest to getting on the school committee I served on the school committee for 3 years in 2004 to 2007 um I got into uh the Boy Scout program with my son I was a um Boy Scout adult leader for 12 years uh den leader for five through tiger to weblow 2 um so uh took the you know as an adult leader in the Boy Scouts um you do training youth protection Corey all that good stuff so that was a good exposure to um um adult leader training working with the scouts and even the Boy Scout program which is a a rank advancement method um so that that that was a very good exposure to a a good system working with the kids um I've been in industry for 40 years A lot of it in documentation everything I do goes out into the company many eyes looking at it it's very important to get the documentation right uh because you get feedback lots of it if it isn't so um you know the ISO 9000 training uh companies ethical ethics policies uh internet policies you know so I I I have all the background in training uh I'm the chair of the lunenberg Republican Town committee U that introduced me to Mass General law um I thought it was just a casual group of Republicans meeting our chair left and they uh asked me who was just the guy who kind of attended in the corner uh we we'd like you to be chair and so that was an introduction to oh no this isn't a casual thing this is all governed by Mass General law and uh you know there's rules and regulations and campaign financing reporting and and so um I I took over and got all that set for our committee and um you know I I I I I know you know on school committee and all uh your your roles and responsibilities um so you know we have our town Charter uh that seems like the guiding document we also have our bylaws um so you know I I I'm interested in getting into that um you know and Performing to the role and um with the Boy Scouts we did a lot of work on Eagle projects in the cemeteries so I'm familiar with the uh superintendent Todd Holman uh my son did his project there uh I think three other projects I can recall of compost bins uh some Granite post and stairs and straightening headstones so uh I'd like to I'd like to get back into a town level board this board scope and all seems to be a good fit right right now um and so uh that's that's my interest yeah that's wonderful I um you know we've had uh Dave and I have had this from the town they sent us a volunteer application and we're so happy to have another volunteer as as we all know unfortunately when Stan passed away suddenly and we were left with no one so we are very very happy to have you to you know come here and and give us what your thoughts are on this um one question I do have where you've been able to give us pretty much your one of the questions was your you know work and life experience what skills and knowledge um can you offer the cemetery commission obviously you've just answered that and the reason why you want to be on the cemetery commission um would you be interested in again seeing yourself running for the election in 2024 uh ballot uh yes okay cuz sometimes you know they you know they get on for a little while and then they just which would only be a month or so so I just wanted to make sure that that was possible for you and the other thing is is meeting on Thursdays at 9:00 a.m. so it would be one Thursday a month at 9:00 a.m. and it will probably still be here yeah I can I can do that I can I can work from home on one day a week and be on the board meeting and if that changes I mean for both of of you um you know we can we can work around that if that needed to change at nighttime um and Dave is there anything you would like to ask or go over I just appreciate you coming on and volunteering to be a member and your past experience um is fantastic of what you've done for the town and I thank you for your service oh thank you and we do definitely thank the Boy Scouts I can't thank you enough for what they've done so you know our younger generation um of miners that that like to come in and to help the cemetery is much appreciated I know the parents you know wanted them to be involved with that I know your son did your son get a special award and also some of the other ones on that well well they're they're working that that's their Eagle Scout uh project so they get their Eagle Scout uh rank if they're successful in completing the entire uh scope of requirements yeah right no we appreciate it so much and and as Dave I definitely thank you for stepping forward and and we'll look forward in the next steps thank you thank you thank you Michael thank you okay so we will go actually I'm going to just do one other thing before I go to the public comment and then I'll step right into that we're going to review and approve the minutes for February 22nd 2024 um Dave did you I have a chance to I have a chance okay I make a motion that we approve the minutes for February 22nd 2024 and I second that motion all in favor I all right approved okay we can now start off with public comment is there anybody that would like to give a public comment please John Bowen 162 Highland Street The Rake a program that's used by the DPW to enter data back to 2010 is a very uous process each grave will need to be individually viewed and the available records will need to be sorted verified then scanned this is cost prohibitive the rain maker Platinum program which the DPW managers can have Rainmaker into those information but that would be upwards an over to $110,000 this issue is not one of the ability of the DPW but of the cost my communications with the proprietor of Rainmaker software has been very forthcoming to me regarding this process and has the cemetery superintendent and DPW director as for costs we need to look into the capital plan request for headstone repair of $338,000 recommended by the town manager this is another project request of this commission that is outside the scope of what the Capital plan is four the only Improvement should be only done to headstones which the town has control that would be specifically stores uh Stones over 100 years old all other Stones by law fall in the Perpetual care fund Mass general laws chapter 114 section 15 states in the town shall from the proceeds of sales of lots be a portioned to reimburse the town for the cost of land to Care Improvement and embellishment on an enlargement of a cemetery or the enlargement of a cemetery when has the commission reimbursed this town they presently hold about $200,000 in coffers and the town has not seen a dime of reimbursement now they want more money from the taxpayer under section 16 the town May raise taxation however section 15 requires a reimbursement I will parot the select vot on this money request unless and until the DPW has provided a formal RFP for any work in the cemetery no money should be allowed for any work because we do not have a solid number in a formal proposal and in a process that the town is reimbursed as is written in the law they failed to bid properly particular the parking lot which was not put out for bid and exceeded $10,000 at the North Cemetery while this board was uh was convened and that violated the law the chter for the cemetery commission is severable because the state law cited has been cherry-picked general laws 14 11423 specifically lists the control of this commission superintendent and management is the layout of grounds and to subdivide only then it states subject to the approval of the Town may make regulations consent with laws I know I didn't give approval of anything or regulations neither did any of the taxpayers in this town the use of volunteers and the historical studies with Mr McGrath and Mr Tyler are appropriate directions however they are misapplied the West Cemetery Fiasco comes to mind of the installation of headstones one was 100 feet away from a body this is illegal and is now being corrected by the town attorney the restoration of those stones which sit at the cemetery building as restore would not done sown in a historical contact by volunteers this is another problem grants for cemeteries and getting portions of the cemeter iies on the National Historical register have requirements I know this because personally I have done historical restoration Back Bay Beacon Hill uh Lexington conquered uh we manufactured with my glass company we manufactured historical windows and inserted them in all sorts of encasements this is a process that needs to be done slowly meticulously the money is there for Grants you have to follow the process and why should the taxpayer foot the Bell when this board is should be reimbursing this town in this community for its money that it gives to the DPW to care for the cemeteries thank you for your time thank you Mr Bowman is there any other public comments Mr Rogers good morning good morning my name is Dave Rogers I live at 82 Highland Street and I'm here uh just by happen stance I I took occasion to uh look at a couple of recordings of of your meetings and and very frankly I was I was really taken back my purpose in in uh coming today is to um arrange a time that I can uh be on your uh schedule on your agenda uh so that I may uh discuss uh in Greater detail which certainly will take more than three minutes which absolutely is the bane of my existence um so that we can discuss it so but in a nutshell um I I really took exception to uh the way the DPW director was was uh interrogated excuse me and uh the manner in which uh the flow of information uh went uh really really concerned me which is why I wanted to step forward um I I've been uh a resident along with my wife and children uh of lunenberg for over 50 years and I remember when there was one person that took care of the the cemetery and one person that took care of the Parx and Recreation and we got bye and we got bye handsomely and there just seems to be a a plethora of of discontent and uh I I can't help but tell you uh my considered opinion is that it it smacks of a a power play I mean it doesn't have to is as complicated as uh I I saw uh on the uh replay of the um Cemetery commissioner's uh meeting so um that and a nutshell is why I'm here uh and I'd like to arrange a schedule uh so that I can be on your uh agenda and and I can uh speak uh more than uh 3 minutes okay we can um definitely I'll take that under advisement we'll we take that underneath the advisement and we'll have to see when we can uh do that will probably be probably in April if that's amendable to you yeah I mean okay so we'll look at some dates and um if you can just you know kind of give me exactly what you'd like to what I need to put down as far as what you're coming to the cemetery commission for that would be wonderful okay I'll give it to you right now the U the reason I'm I'm coming uh would like to come before this uh commission is to go over um the uh issues at hand for the for the cemetery and also the um uh the the way um the DPW uh director was was uh uh treated uh when I looked at some of the the meetings okay all right sure so you'll let me know when I will I absolutely I still have your number so I will give you a call that' be fine thank you so much for your time thank you thank you is there any more public comments no okay thank you again both for your public comments okay okay so the next one is um the DPW director is not here today um and I'm been asked to read an attachment that he sent so I'm going to read through this and as I read through it there will be some discussions uh here with the cemetery commission um regarding it so the first one is um the DPW director update is the roadways in the North and South cemeteries remain open to the traffic to Vehicles going in there um the two there is um some information the two part-time seasonal Cemetary labor positions are advertised on 31224 and they've already had three applicants that have come forward DPW will be scheduling interviews in the next uh couple of weeks regarding that so we'll hear more I'm sure from from that is there anything you'd like to say about that Dave no um not about that particular one okay thank you the next one is the next steps for the 2024 season DPW maintenance plan rule AR Commissioners the gpw will provide a general maintenance plan in accordance with that rule so I suspect that we should have something next week regarding that where I believe tomorrow is the 15th good is there anything you'd like to state with that that's great okay now regarding the rain maker rain maker is a cemetery information management system um Sims the cims light is an easy way or an easy to use database that uh helps Cemetery managers track ownership interments and marker information the database contains information that is available to employees only um I'll finish reading this and then I'll have some comments regarding this this is considered day-to-day care and maintenance per the section uh 3-5 B and not a function of the cemetery commission passwords for the software are signed to staff only the sary superintendent updates rain maker during the winter month months data from this um has been put in from the past year any data found missing from previous internments is also added data from 622 2015 the higher date of the cemetery superintendent is up to date without an exclusive review of the data from uh January 1st 2010 to June 21st 2015 uh the DPW cannot confirm that the data is up to date at this point in time so this is an issue that is going to go um which we are going to look into behind the scenes because we are the ones that bought this software meaning the cemetery commission back in 2010 it was signed off by the cemetery commission before me um and in 2019 that particular commissioner which was uh also had we had signed off on it is to do the upgrade for it so unfortunately what we're looking at and what we need to understand a little bit better is under the job title for the superintendent of the cemetery is that it's his job to handle these particular things um what I would like to see again going forward is again um the software was bought in by us we pay for it every single year with the maintenance fees and also the cost of the license um so we will get through that next piece and that will be handled again with either having a meeting with Heather um Andor whatever place needs to take place at that point in time um but that is an ongoing one and this will be moved to our next probably meeting in April is there anything you would like to say regarding that I I'm just very concerned that um the cemeterian commission is paying for this we paid it for the the very beginning but yet um it says in here in DPW director that they're the only ones to get the password and that that shouldn't be um if we're paying for it we have access to the password also so I I go along with what you're saying to have the town manager involved and maybe even if that doesn't work out go to the um the select board I have concern Shar may I I'm sorry public comment you've already made your public comment public comment it's to the FL of this meeting the DPW director uh again I'm sorry [Music] that yes Dave pasio 56 weding Street this is a point of order I'd like to bring up the commission is presently in its deliberations based on the agenda under those conditions there is no back and forth between visitors in the public and the commission uh so I take exception to being the meeting being interrupted thank you thank you go ahead Dave well like I was saying I was just I I think we have to get this resolved quickly and um we'll go to the town manager and then if we have to go to the the select board but if we paid for it from the beginning it's okay for the superintendent to have the password but we should have it all so he shouldn't be blocking us out so um and I'm glad you let's go from there I'm I'm glad you brought that up the one last piece that I'm going to make on this comment and then we're going to move on from this is simply that the cemetery commission has always had that password and has always been allowed in um and that's where again why is it with this particular cemeter commission uh chair is that not allowed for uh these parties that are on the commission at this point in time but that will be looked into again either with Heather Andor above that so we will table that again for another time and I I do want to make sure that that the public knows that I was sent this information the DPW director it is his choice that he cannot make this meeting understandably I know he's busy I get that and that's why he gave this to me and he said to read it and to go over it so we're going to deliberate what we need to deliberate here um and we will again discuss this further if there needs to be discussion this next one um I am very concerned about which is a cemetery refund ongoing issues and I'm just going to read again this is is directly from the director in the DPW director in October of 2023 the K family we're just going to not use their names requested a refund on the burial lot they purchased in 1996 as they have moved out of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts and no longer wish to be um buried here the cost of the lot was $150 for burial rights and 200 for Perpetual care for a total of 350 the amount of 150 burial Rights was refunded the 200 for Perpetual care was not refunded as Perpetual care was performed for 27 years I'm going to read all of these first and then I'll go back and I'll I'll make my comment in November of 2023 the L family requested a refund on the burial lot they purchased in 2020 as they moved out of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts and no longer wish to be interred here the cost of the lot was 800 for burial rights and 400 for Perpetual care for the total of uh $1,200 the amount of $1,200 was refunded Perpetual care was refunded as Perpetual care was only performed for 3 years in March of 2024 the ca family requested a refund on the burial lot they purchased in 20 2002 as they have moved out of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts and no longer wish to be um buried here a cost of the lot was 800 for burial rights 200 for Perpetual care for a total of a th the amount of $800 $800 burial Rights was refunded the 200 for Perpetual care was not refunded as Perpetual care was performed for 22 years the next paragraph reads the selling and refunding of burial Lots is a day-to-day operation performed by the cemetery superintendent the refunds came out of the funds under the care of the cemetery commission these are the first refunds since I became DPW director um it was an oversight on my part for not informing the cemetery Commission of the funds going forward I will inform the cemetery Commission of any funds at the next meeting okay so we are going to discuss this whole piece this whole piece is wrong and I'll tell you why it's wrong is because under the rules and regulations of the cemetery commission no one is to give back money to anyone regarding uh sale of lots unless it's the cemetery commission votes on it and decides that we're going to go forward with giving back the funds to the parties number one um I would say that under this this guideline that this was gone basically taken behind our backs without us knowing that this was happening both in October and November and now I just found out today quite by surprise that someone tried to um go on March and try to get another refund that has been stopped at this point in time until I get through and the cemetery commission gets through this issue no one is to DPW is not allow to do this their signature means nothing on here it is the cemetery commissions it always has been and it always will be that is our discretion on going forward with allowing refunds to be done now do think that there's a reason that we would say no to this probably not I can't imagine that there would be any situation why we would say no but it's a fact of the matter that is not protocol these are the rules and regulations of the cemetery commission and this is what we are going to fix again this is going to be tabled for the next meeting Dave is there anything you would like to say i' just like to make a note that prior to the current uh um DPW director coming on we've had people need wanting refunds and under the former commissioner of the cemetery commission he brought that up and we put it into our minutes and everything was notorized and we gave back the money um I I don't understand why the change now under the new DPW director and the new Cemetery Commission why it's changed that they would give the money back the money came to us the money is the cemetery commission's money and I just feel that we should go back to the way it was and again this is another thing we're going to have to discuss with the DPW director and if that doesn't work go to the town manager and if that doesn't work we'll have to go to the select board again um it's just that things are changing under the new DPW director and the new commissioner and I just don't understand why the change has to be so those are my thoughts right now I thank you for those thoughts um and we will again I think the best thing is to table that to find out what the issues are uh that we were not communicated against and especially this one that I just found out today which was here we are how many weeks into March and I just found out after being told in February that they were not supposed to be doing this and it has to come to us for a vote and we sign off of it so they've known since February that the DPW that this does not happen and it was also uh the cemetery superintendent is well aware of this because this process has started from the first day I walked on to this commission um I was not chair at that point but we never had an issue until today now now open discussions for Cemetery updates so pretty much we've done the maintenance plan we know when that's going to be coming um the rain maker issue we know where that is the cemetery refund we've just discussed that um the one piece is Richard McGrath unfortunately um had already scheduled a vacation so unfortunately when we couldn't go forward last week because uh we didn't have enough members on that we had to move it to today's dat and he was unable to make it but he will be in a future discussion and that will be in our April meeting um and that looks like again I'll have to make sure that this date is going to be okay for everyone but April 18th um and I will make sure that that is still going to go forward the only last thing that I have um is that I was given information that there is a party that would like to have a 4-foot bench brought into the north CET um I'm trying to work with Bill schedule to have him come down we'll look at it we'll look at it with the party and again we have four foot benches we have three- foot benches um in the North Cemetery in the South I'm not sure we're on the south Cemetery because I haven't gone to measure all of those over there but definitely in the North Cemetery there are 4ot and 3-ft benches so we will see if we can go forward with this or not the resident understands that again the DPW will be looking at at this too with me um or with us the Comm commission to make sure that this is okay for the location that it's going to be in is there anything else Dave that you would like to State no none this time okay you ready to I wish to adjourn the meeting motion to adour meetion meeting yes I I no I'm sorry try that again motion to adjourn the meeting and then all parties all I all right we have adjourned the meeting and thank you all for coming