##VIDEO ID:oik5FsUDfxg## um all right my name is John ronals this is the August 21st Sewer Commission agenda and um I had open the meeting prior to recording so I'm going to just skip down to the uh required reading about the open meeting law in accordance with the requirements of the open meeting law please be advised this meeting of the Sewer Commission is being recorded and will be able be found on the lunberg access YouTube channel after the meeting the following information is also provided by members of the public that would like to participate in the meeting remotely to participate remotely from a computer please use the link to join the public webinar found on the posted agenda or a telephone dial the toll-free number 8884 7 54499 and enter the webinar ID number 8986 77 02504 no participant ID is needed just press pound when asked so we'll do a quick roll call here uh Mike Mackin H here Brett ramsten here I for myself and for staff uh um Bill Bernard here Jane rley hi Jane here thank you Jane I have to mute myself dogs barking as a guests tonight we have the um interim Town manager Carter Taran zini could I get that right Carter yes sir thank you much okay great um we have one item on the agenda tonight uh which has to do with a hiring of a new business manager and um you know I apologize because I may have called this meeting reatur to talk about the business manager that we'll we'll find that out in in just a minute um so I don't know Bill or Carter if one of you perhaps Bill want to give an update as to where we are with that what the status is and I I I would prefer not to use any candidates name if that's possible sure well I think we're all disappointed and um to find out that we were going to lose Paula and um certainly on the shorter time frame that we're we're losing or uh was most challenging we had a candidate from another selection process that appeared uh suitable but we did advertise the position uh immediately the following day as well uh we did not get any applications uh during that process to date uh the only application that we had uh was from the previous uh process that uh Julie thought might be a reasonable fit uh she was interviewed by Bill uh and Julie and recommended to me on the basis of that interview uh now I will say uh under the former Town manager user agencies were not involved um but going forward for my time with you user agencies will be involved they were you were not involved in this particular interview uh and that was based Bas on on precedent but should this appointment uh should you not ratify it and should it not work out uh user agencies one of you will be involved in observing that that process so you can give me input uh the person being brought in I know John you were concerned that um you know about the the scope of pay is not being brought in at any higher step than your current current business manager uh and um we will not I know that Paula has expressed some concerns that we not uh modify your current licensing Arrangement um so let me say that we will not be changing the Status Quo uh in any fashion in the near term other than unfortunately losing Paula I mean if if I could wave a magic one I I would do so and I think you probably all want to be the first person to grab it after I did but she is leaving us that's a reality now uh the good news in all this uh is we think we have a good qualified candidate um finding someone with a specific kind of munist knowledge sewer knowledge all those things is going to be relatively well the odds of it happening just it's just not there in this job market secondly this candidate may be able to on board as early as Monday morning which would give us um you know uh not a great lapse in time um I know that Paula's last day um I believe is is Saturday we'd hope to get someone in there faster but that's just not the process um however Paula to her credit uh has agreed uh to come back on her schedule of course um and uh bill I believe has has talked with her about a rate of pay and I thought that that rate of pay was was quite agreeable I think it was $50 an hour bill was that that's correct okay um so Paula has agreed to come back and and do training with this new hire so uh up against the wall with what um I think a set of circumstances none of us would want I I um have submitted this candidate to you for your ratification okay a couple things one Mike that answers your question we're not interviewing anybody now you're not but let me say that for my time with you would be involved in some fashion so for instance uh today we had final interviews for land use director I invited the planning board chair the Conservation Commission chair and the zba chair to uh observe um and uh you know I had them give me questions um I did ask the questions you know so to make sure they were posed in a manner that was legal if you will given today's uh statutes and also to be woven into other questions that perhaps it already been asked or maybe still were in my mind and you know we wanted to weave them together after that candidate left I then uh discussed with the chair um you know their their concerns their thoughts um I do definitely want to have those now at the end of the day uh it's my name that goes on the memo uh in terms of submitting nominations uh but you certainly would be uh with my time with you included in that process going forward I appreciate that yes that's that's great I think that's the most appropriate way to proceed I I agree so just just to clarify Carter the the candidate has been offered the position and she has accepted subject so the way we do it was we always say you know we make real clear this is an offer conditioned upon reference checks background checks and ratification in some cases it's the board of assessors it's the board of sewer Commissioners the select board but yes we we always make that very clear um and if this board chooses not to go forward then by all means we'll we'll keep advertising it and Bill talked with us about temporary you know stop Gap meas measures I'm not quite sure what kind of what kind of person we would found you know from whatever the local um I can't even remember the name of the agency over there in lemonster Fitchburg but um you know we would try to find some sort of stop Gap U but I will tell you that the job market today um and it's not just lunenberg uh you know you're feeling the pressure of it because perhaps you have a few more you haven't been able to fill and that's on the back of the munist thing and that's on the back of the two years of hoopla over the tax situation that certainly had some problems uh but um you know I was talking with my counterpart out in Spencer they have been through uh five planners in the last 10 years um I'm curious I know this is kind of off off the subject but just you know as as since the Topic's been raised are people just moving around for for you know better deals uh in some cases uh if you are actually running a sewer plant itself yes people are jumping like crazy because there's not as many licensed operators as as are needed um you know out in Templeton um when the the sewer superintendent's position was advertised there were three applicants only one was truly qualified and he jumped after two and a half years for a a state gig in a dramatically higher pay than we could give them um and they weren't able to recruit a new sewer superintendent um until they went to the foran and said look uh last time we asked you to take it we know you said no because the town had been kind of in itical turmoil but it's it's been calmed down you know it's we've had a a good four-year run here um without the kind of turmoil we used to have will you take it and the foreman did so they were able to find someone in house um but yes there's a lot of jumping around um particularly in the younger group you know I look at my my stepdaughter she's 43 and I don't think she's held a job more than three years anywhere and when I asked what was going on you know she was sort of like well car you're an old fogy nobody nobody goes to work for company one and stays there for 20 years that's just not the world anymore no I mean and if I may um conservation in our town um you're probably aware they went to four or five Liaisons um um managing their commission at least four in a matter of I believe it was two years or less and they they've got someone who's staying at the moment and she's she's great and um I applauded her for keeper Kudos in person that she's been sticking with it and so forth but you're right it's just it's incredibly hard out there right now especially with the younger people this is the worst recruiting Market I've been in this business now uh for a couple more years than I'd like to admit probably uh but this is the worst recruiting Market I've seen since I've been in business and um you're challenged in lunenberg because it's not easy to get there you know if you're trying to commute from let's say um along 495 or even route two you you got to work a little bit to get up into town hall and over to the DPW garage you know when I was when I was doing a stin as interim in in boxboro uh I got off 495 and I was a town hall in a mile and a half um and I drove past the public works yard to get there um it's it's a very challenging job market It is Well Carter you and I talked a bit about this day before yesterday um um given that it is a challenging jock Market I hope the town of lunenberg is looking at what they need to do to retain their existing Workforce um I I'm not going to spend a lot of time talking about this but certainly it's unfortunate that Paul is leaving and I I believe last May there had been an opportunity to change things with the pay scale and perhaps she wouldn't be leaving I mean just just the fact that the new person is being paid at the same uh grade in Step that Paula is and Paula truly had the qualifications for the position it's just very unfortunate very unfortunate and I I I hope this doesn't happen with any other Town employee and I Carter you're you're new I'm not putting any responsibility on you for that uh you you know that from our conversation but it's it's just a very unfortunate situation I think the town has to take a look you know as one for instance um if you come to work for the town of of lunenberg you get so many sick days a month uh but you can't use them for the first six months vacation of curs I mean I could go down the line with you um now I think that the select board recognizes this um truthfully I think my tenure with you is is too short a time to try to start that whole review um especially when Believe It or Not budget Seasons almost Upon Us Capital planning is about to start um and frankly you've got issues in your fy2 budget uh we also have a considerable amount of arpa money to get um under contract if not fully expended uh so um I think people are recognizing it and uh know it needs to be addressed uh Mr Alonzo last evening asked for a state of the organization a report by which we'll look at the churn rate over the last couple of years we'll look at the exit interviews we'll make comments on things like this uh but you do have to remember also uh that the vast majority of the positions uh within lunenberg are unionized even your clerks y are unionized yep you just brought up one other one other thing I'm sorry you if I remember correctly at slack board meeting you said you were going to be conducting the exit interviews did I hear that correctly it's it it had been my intent to sit in on the exit interview that's correct okay um then I I I truly hope that is the case with uh Alla that that you are present for the exit interview uh that that is my intent I saw some emails today in which the date and time was being switched I really didn't get a chance to look at that I know that I think it was I think it was going to be today um so I I will do my very best to make sure I'm uh pres okay uh Mike you were gonna you were gonna say something yeah um so I think that you know obviously the one item on the agenda needs to be addressed and uh yes before we do that just for my peace of mind you know I'd like to hear more from from Bill and and Carter about their Impressions from the interview yes bill can you take this one I'm much better on Broad policy issues sure yeah so um the interview process we have a set of questions that it was the same set that we use when we when we hired Paula um you know it's it was my myself and Julie and the candidate uh the candidate she was very poised um I thought she gave gave great answers um she demonstrated that she has experience that I feel will work well in this position obviously she doesn't know sewer she's gonna have to learn our regulations she's gonna have to learn our internal processes and she's gonna have to learn munis so there's there's a lot to learn but I think she's proven in you know in her history from I could see that she can step into a role like this and and learn what needs to be done and then hopefully take it up a notch you know to to make it better or easier I think she demonstrated all that in the interview so I'm confident she'll do well just one question it doesn't appear from the resume that there's any municipal or public experience is that correct okay that is correct right right all private sector let me say this still have a probationary period she has to go through M um I was surprised the other day we had someone coming up on uh the expiration of the probationary time there were a couple of issues and I said to Julie well we'll take it up during the probationary review um and jul oh we don't we don't do reviews you will be going you will be once I get here you know as long as I'm here so what my my experience has been that you know probationary periods uh are the one time where you could say to somebody I'm sorry it's not you it's me and and I mean it's just if the fit isn't right if something just isn't working right um my view is that people need to earn a permanent appointment not looking at it and reverse it's not like well they you know n they weren't all that bad and we should just make them permanent so uh what I've told Julie is I want a one three and five month sitdown so Bill will have a you know sort of a a rating sheet and I think Bill you already do evaluations don't you I do for the union employees yes so you know we'll we'll do kind of a similar thing where we sit with the employee at the first month how's it going um three months and then five months so if it's just not working out we've got a one- month window we know what's going on and we would ask the sewer Commissioners based upon their interactions to contribute comments to bill for his consideration and inclusion um I for the period of time I'm with you I do dismiss employees um I'm told in templon that we separated from our service more people in the four years I was there than in the 14 before that uh I mean it's it's it's never pleasant but I want to assure you that if this candidate does not work out we will take action we they won't just be left there because we need a warm body that's why I'm most hopeful uh that we can in the not too distant future uh fill the assistant business manager I mean one of the problems in these smaller organizations for those who are sport fans I guess is we don't have a very deep bench you know when someone leaves the Conservation Commission they were the Conservation Commission so um I'd like to assure you that at least in my time with you we will separate from service someone who's not doing the job um and we will continue to work hard to try to fill the assistant position and I would assume that we'll do our best to provide whatever support is needed to help this candidate succeed AB absolutely ABS absolutely um you know uh Paula will come back as she's available bill can speak to that I don't remember the the exact schedule we've let the candidate know they might have to work some some split shifts or some adjusted shifts um you know and um one of the challenges munis you know if it was Vadar I could send them over to a oh God where Clinton is it I think maybe um you know and and and buy a day it might cost 2,000 bucks but I could buy training onsite um training whether I sent them over to Clinton or the town where the weed AIX was made for a while um or I bring someone from Vadar in munus is is tough but we absolutely want to provide the kinds of support look 80% or more of our budget is people and the most expensive part of those people is you know turnover we need our employees to be successful and um you know I work with the young lady in our office who's still learning almost almost daily here's a hint how's it going you know as she's leaving tonight I said you know you might want to take a few minutes and tonight write your today list tomorrow so that it's there on the desk you know you got a little bit and and y'all know bill um and I know he's committed to trying to make anyone that works with him and for him successful that's because guess what if the employees working for us aren't successful bill doesn't look great and if Bill don't look great I don't look you know I mean it's it it's it's sort of the reverse of rolls downhill it's more like success bubbles up but you know again you know we're really in the service business and so when if if if the service don't work people are affected right yeah right okay absolutely the one thing that this candidate will be missing hopefully for not too long is a Sewer Commission yeah so yes and that's a separate discussion that's been R that's a separate discussion we need to have but John I spoke to you um about my plan the other day I'm leaving it I'm leaving it in your good hands for another week or two um and if that doesn't yield us you know at least a candidate um then I do have a an alternate plan that might bear some fruit we'll see well think if it's the plan we talked about I think you should just go ahead with that because U I don't think we should wait I don't think we should wait at all what one one person has that I spoke to has said no so I I would say go ahead with your uh mailing campaign if that's the one you're talking about it is and I will um run that by the remaining Commissioners and Bill for review and comment and that may be the task should you ratify tonight and we get them onboarded and you know Bill's had an experience where we offered somebody and then they went MIA fairly quickly um but this may be task one on their list okay card I'll I'll I mean I I do have one more meeting I'll I'll add the mailing to the agenda for next Tuesday's meeting that'll be great and um I'll I'll have it to you by Monday okay so I I think uh we're probably at the point where we need a motion um to ratify the appointment now um Mike and and Carter you're more experienced with this than I am uh when we do this ratification do we need to I assume we need to specifically mention her name it does I would think yeah okay so um Mike since you were the one who wanted to be more involved with the interview process um if you want to go ahead and make a motion to to ratify and you you have the the woman's name right I do okay so if you want to make a motion for the Sewer Commission to uh ratify the appointment of uh well lorrianne McCormick to the position of um sewer business manager go for it I do make a motion to ratify the appointment of laurianne mccor as the uh position of sewer manager and I would like to second that motion okay any further discussion seeing none let's take a roll call vote uh Mike I Brett I and I for myself it's unanimous the motion passes thank you gentlemen and John as you did the other day I want your fellow Commissioners to know just stop by the office and unless I'm buried in something else um hopefully no backups from a sewer pumping station I'll be I'll be happy to sit with you as quickly as I can for as long as I can and John hopefully you found that um productive the other day yes yeah thank you uh Mr chairman I just wanted to talk to Carter directly if that's all right um Carter um you know I hadn't had a chance to meet you it's great meeting you um I want to say that um having spent uh some minutes on this meeting with you um uh seeing how you do things and uh hearing your insights um I want to thank you for being on board uh and happy to have you as our interm town manager and hopefully that becomes a permanent thing um so I just wanted to say thank you for your your efforts and glad to have you here well that's very kind I hope you think as highly of me as I'm going out the door as when I came in the thank you gentlemen have a good evening thank you we need to officially Carter you can leave that's fine we need to uh have a motion to adjourn so moved I'll second that and any further discussion seeing none um all those in favor of adjournment say I I any opposed oppos the meeting is ended thank you all see you next Tuesday yeah see Tuesday than you guys good night everybody take care