vbridge planning board meeting for December 14th 2023 we all stand and salute the flag pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all call please adequate notice of the meeting of the Oldbridge Township planning board has been provided in accordance with the open public public meetings act at least 48 hours prior to the commencement of the meeting by prominently posting in the municipal complex an announcement given the time date location and agenda of this meeting mailing such announcement to the home News Tribune and filing such announcement with the municipal clerk Mr lenning is absent Mr mcus here Mr dama here Mr low here Mr Rena here Mr Petty here miss Mella here Mr MacIsaac here Mr Brennan here and chairwoman Ken here okay we have resolution 44-22 pboe Route 9 land LLC amended preliminary and final major site plan with Associated bulk variance and waiver relief so do I have a motion I'll move it okay move by Mr mimus is there a second second second my Mr law roll call Mr mcus yes Mr dama yes Mr lower yes Mr Rena yes Mr Petty yes Miss Mella yes Mr mcac yes Mr Brennan and Miss Canon yes okay consistency review and Nance of the township of Oldbridge amending chapter 250 of the code of the township of Oldbridge entitled Oldbridge Township Land Development ordinance by amending 250-1414 yeah it is it's not coming through it's on good evening good evening board members so I'll start with the easy one the the waivers section so what I have noticed is in the past there are many nonprofit organizations that are actually run by volunteers that apply to the planning board maybe for lighting for signage and and when I have to calculate their fees they're enormous enormous and um the uh work involved is not as much so one recommendation that I made the council is if it's a nonprofit organization that is run by volunteers then the council should have the ability to wave uh the fees my professional review time is always covered by escrow so they still have have to pay the escrow but at least we wave the application fees for such uh applicants and that's the first recommendation the um next recommendation is in terms of amended site plan and subdivision plan fees so in the past when I took over planning department that was the first thing I noticed because every other municipality that I have worked in they generally don't charge the entire fees so if you need a site plan Amendment there's a percentage it varies between 25 to 50% uh but here in Oldbridge we charge the entire fees again sometimes it's not just fair to the applicant because um when sometimes the amendment is also related to outside agencies so if DP gets back to them and says that you know you need to move the parking lot or me need to make subtle changes to the site circulation then they have to come back to the board but we've already charged them fees one time so it's not fair to ask them to pay the entire fees again and especially the way the application fees are structured um it is based on the lot area and then the square foot footage of the building that is proposed if the lot is huge it is a huge amount that we are talking about so um my professional review time or the engineers review time is covered by escrow we're not changing anything with the escrow these are the application fee if they have paid the fee one time I'm making a recommendation that as an administrative officer I should have the ability to reduce the fees to 25 uh% uh or 50,000 whichever is less and the reason the 50,000 is in there is because the recent applications that we saw um the amended Boe application it's 200 Acres of site their application fee itself was 200,000 so um for 25% of that I just had to cap it to 50 so that's the recommendation I think we are just making it easier um for uh applicants to apply we being more reasonable and so I think that's what the master plan is about to make things more functionable so I recommend that the uh count the planning board pass the resolution okay does anybody have so some of it is your disc I mean you'll have guidelines for your discretion and yes in terms of the amount right because like let's take an example because it's very recent uh the segme Boe application that came in front of us they came back they Shrunk the building but they came back only because DP got back to them and uh they requested those changes and nothing really had changed on the site as much the changes were subtle so in that case luckily because they were part of a Redevelopment plan there was an agreement in place but when it's not part of a Redevelopment agreement then the developer has to pay the entire fees and I find it sometimes uh silly that um when there is a change in use and there is you know a trash enclosure that has to be added and it's an amended site plan just for that trash enclosure I'm charging them entire the old application fees which is too much I feel okay does anybody have any questions or comments okay do we have a motion to approve the um change that's being move any any place that anything that makes it easy to do business in town is the right thing to do so I'll move it okay move my I'll second dioma second okay call please Mr mcus yes Mr dama yes Mr low yes Mr Rena yes Mr Petty yes M Mella yes Mr mcac yes Mr Brandon yes and chairwoman Kon yes okay um all right the next is uh completeness waiver this is for 17-223 p Northwood Manor of Oldbridge C and uh so what does this involve M chair I can I can address this V and I had spoke earlier this week uh regarding this application uh this was a this is a a long historied application and property that's been going back and forth with the zoning boort uh they're now uh seeking um some additional relief however even though they had use variants approval it's still uh you know it was originally put before the planning board thinking it was a permitted use they're allowed to go forward with the application but it really the zoning board really retains jurisdiction over this because it was granted in connection with the use variants so uh we V and I spoke with their attorney their attorney was in agreement with it so this is uh going to be actually heard by the zoning board instead of the planning board moving forward okay so we don't have to do anything no nothing needs to be done on we have planning board the uh the vaver actually has been moved to um the um next zoning board's agenda and actually thank you Larry for uh your guidance too because Larry was um the zoning board attorney when Northwood Manor uh Was Heard uh went to the superior court was remanded back to the zoning board so he knows the entire history actually he knows it more than me okay so we're on to our one and only application 45-20 23p St Mary and Archangel Raphael Coptic Orthodox Church major preliminary and final site plan with d Varian yes uh good evening Madam chairwoman members of the board uh Lawrence Sachs on behalf of the applicant uh St Mary and Archangel Raphael Coptic Orthodox Church uh this property is located at 269 Route 34 4 uh it's block 4230 uh lot 1311 uh I'm sure many of you know this particular location it used to be the first friends uh daycare and summer camp uh back in 2022 the church actually bought this property and they presently operate the daycare and the summer camp uh that's there today um what we are seeking this evening is and it's really just a temporary fix uh we the church actually purchased a property on Old Road uh over over adjacent to Route 9 near hardle Lane uh it was the old Patel Cash and Carry uh that facility that was approved by your zoning board a number of years ago uh uh for the house of worship right it's under construction uh we anticipate however it's probably going to take another year year and a half to be completed um so with that said the church presently operates in seille their lease is up so they need to find a new location so what we are seeking tonight is preliminary and final major site plan approval I don't believe we require devarian that may have been being a carryover from the zoning board right I'll I'll explain it to the board so that they understand once I stop okay all right but anyway so we only require a preliminary and final major site plan approval uh it was a ter a determination uh that a house of worship is a conditional use in this Zone and we satisfy all of those conditions uh so it's a permitted use in essence and I know our engineer and planner will will discuss that uh but essentially what we're looking to do is occupy the gymnasium that is on site um and we're only looking to occupy it on Saturdays and Sundays uh for our ritual Services between the hours of 700 a.m. and 11: p.m. and on holidays uh those are times by the way when the daycare and the summer camp will not be operational so their uses will never conflict I know a question may come up but what if the holiday falls on a weekday well because of their religious affiliation the daycare or the summer camp would be closed well it would be closed on that day so the two uses will never be in Conflict um this site was approved many years ago uh we're only planning on using utilizing the gymnasium there's a basement that's here as well that's not that's not going to be used as a house of worship because it was a question about occupancy uh we're also willing to limit the occupancy uh in this particular site we'll talk about that that uh through our engineer um and uh that's really all I've got to say at least for now uh I think we can comply with all of the recommendations and conditions uh that were requested by Mr dargy uh and Vina and uh without that without further Ado Madame chairman we have Mr Liber sworn in and he'll just describe the site and the reason quite frankly why we're here for preliminary and final cying because you probably say to yourself well if you meet all the conditional use requirements it's a permitted use however under your ordinances anytime there's a change in use on a site or an additional use coming in it does require preliminary and final major site plan even though we're not changing one thing on the site but Mr Liber will discuss that would you raise your right hand do you swear or affirm the testimony you're going to give this evening is the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do can you just uh please State and spell your name for the record yes Mark where the C last name is Liber lb R and I'm with East Point engineering our office is at 11 South Main Street in Marboro Mr Labour if you can give the board the benefit of your professional background and qualifications hi good evening I received a Bachelor of Science degree from Drex University in 1999 um following graduation I returned to school in the evening and completed the part-time MBA program at Rucker's graduate school I was licensed as a engineer in 2003 and in 2005 I passed the planning exam and in 2006 I was um I finished the certified Municipal engineering certificate program okay we accept your uh thank you yeah you look familiar thank you I have been to this board and I've been to your zoning board as well okay all right so Mr Liber if you could just uh guide the board through uh description of this site and essentially what's being proposed and if you want to talk a little bit about the conditional use criteria yeah that we're satisfying we can do that as well so just some background this is block 4230 it's lot 13 um 13.11 which is 269k 34 it's approximately 7 Acres um it's got about 300 ft of Frontage on the highway and it's in the edo1 zone presently there's a um daycare center on the property uh they run a day camp as well there are some sports courts uh and various accessory structures including a pool on the property in the front there's 85 parking stalls in the lot and there's a single point a access which is directly off the highway as you heard already what the proposed use is to utilize the gym for worship services on the weekends so I just want to run through the zoning requirements um house of worship is a conditionally permitted use in this Zone uh there are some items that we have to satisfy first and foremost is the lot area has to be at least two acres having almost seven acres we're okay with that uh Total Building area should not exceed the floor area ratio of3 um we had calculated that we are about 06 so we comply there uh it says where schools and accessory use to house of worship um there is no school proposed as an accessory to the house of worship the um minimum lot area shall be increased one acre for each 2,000 s feet of school again there's no school so that's not applicable um next item is lot area shall be increased one acre for every 2,000 sare fet of any accessory use other than the prayer services there are no accessory uses so again we don't really feel that applies um accessory buildings shall be uh exclusively used for religious worship while there are accessory buildings on the property none of the existing conditions are affected by what's proposed because the house of worship is not using any of those structures um next one is about religious quarters on the property which are not proposed at all so that's not applicable and then traffic impact act um should not increase based upon the proposed use uh and there some discussion about level of service and Peak volumes which I'm going to discuss as we get into the uh traffic study that we had done now this property actually works out very well for this use because uh during the worship services on the weekends there's absolutely no activity on the property we had looked at the parking to figure out if we have enough spots on the property and we had started with with a number of 150 attendees which is a very high number which feels very conservative following the township ordinance uh we need one parking space per three attendees so at 150 we need 50 spaces there's 85 spaces on the property so it seems like we have more than enough parking the next thing is we want to look at the parking lot to see how it functions right now without this use on the property uh couple of Saturdays we looked at it there's nothing to report because there aren't any cars there on Saturday however we did attend there on a Sunday which was August 13th and we did find that at the peak time which was 10:45 a.m. there were eight cars in the parking lot and 77 available spaces so again even looking at what goes on in the property today there seems to be more than an adequate amount of parking to accommodate this use and Mr Liber those those eight Vehicles did we later discover that that those were uh ual performing maintenance related this was toward the end of the summer season uh possibly doing something with closing of the camp or something of that nature so you know it just so happens that on that day August 13th they were there now we also looked at trip Generation Um you know we looked at uh the it manual which is Institute of Transportation engineers and we found that the peak uh trips in was on a Sunday at 29 and out 30 and the total number of trips on a Sunday was 91 trips in and 90 trips out um and these are extremely low numbers and I have to suspect that these numbers are actually lower than the actual trips that occur with the use Monday to Friday uh there's a lot of pickup drop off of parents bring kids a daycare there's a lot of staff that work in the building so the peak hour trips of 29 on a Sunday are extremely minimal you're talking about you know one car every six or seven minutes which is not a lot other than that I did get a chance to review the report prepared on uh December uh 11th and and before we get into that Mr lber uh it's your understanding that the applicant has agreed based upon a recommendation from uh the township professional staff to limit the occupancy to no more than 100 50 worshippers yeah that's perfectly acceptable all right and based upon that we only require 50 parking spaces right the ordinance okay uh and secondly there's also a a reference in the report uh wanting to know the the nature of the construction that is going on at the old old road and hardle road facility uh I can offer a stipulation Madam chairwoman uh that once that facility is built and a CFO is issued then we will not be utilizing this facility for worship they 've invested a good deal of money into that site that's going to be their Crown Jewel uh with a very big parking lot uh but but certainly that's their Crown Jewel so this is really just a temporary fix and we we'll agree to that as a stipulation um I guess we can go over the report Mr Liber one other question uh we're not proposing any changes to this site uh this site receives some form of an approval from either the planning board or zoning board years ago is that correct yes and not only are we not changing anything we actually don't even need a sign so so okay no one driving by would even know that this exists okay all right so Madam chairman if you want I'll go through the report real quickly there just a couple comments and and then certainly if the board has any questions okay yeah there was some issue with the fire yes we're gonna let me let me get to that as well absolutely um all right so I think you covered the zoning analysis I think uh in my opening Madame chairwoman I covered the nature of what's going to occur here uh it's just worship ritual Services uh Saturday 7:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. Sunday 7:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. uh and whatever major holidays that are celebrated in the Coptic religion um maximum number of Staff we have one clergy who was actually in attendance uh father Raphael and that's him okay um we really don't have any other staff quite frankly it's anyone else who will be there on the weekend will be the parishioners uh and I'm told roughly they have about 107 worshippers now so maybe a little bit more but certainly well below the 150 uh so that should not be an issue and in terms of delivery truck access Mr Liber is it your understanding that if there's any deliveries it would be by maybe a a a passenger vehicle or a box truck that's correct okay um all right on paragraph two Mr Liber on the general comments uh there's a request that we label the gymnasium to be utilized for prayer liturgy I'm assuming you have no issue with that no issue okay and I think you addressed paragraph three and we've agreed to stipulate that there'll be no more than 150 worshippers uh I think paragraph four is just a general comment uh paragraph five I think I addressed there was a concern about what's going on with the other location and again this will be a temporary location for this house of worship uh comment number six I think we were talking about this before the meeting uh do we need to make any revision to that zoning chart yeah we can that Dimension okay uh I think paragraph seven you indicated uh no new signage is proposed correct paragraph 8 deals with an issue from the fire marshal my understanding Madam chairwoman and members of the board is that uh our our church has met with the Fire Marshall whatever outstanding issues need to be resolved we will resolve them they're having an ongoing dialogue with respect to that um paragraph nine well we've provided uh we' provided a variant site plan but yes we're asking for a waiver of site plan uh we're not doing any site improvements I think the comment was uh that everything appears to be in good condition you've been out there Mr Liber is the site in very good shape yeah there was a comment about existing Ada access which we could certainly uh check and review if necessary okay I think on traffic I believe you covered uh the traffic again to stipulate there's not going to be any use in paragraph 13 there's not going to be any use uh of the house of worship when the daycare or summer camp are in operation that's correct okay um all right now to addresses paragraph 14 um I'm sorry 13 yeah all right you maybe you can comment on 13 so the comment in 13 was that they wanted traffic counts for a typical weekday um and I understand the reason that they're asking that but I feel like it's not really necessary because it's not pertinent to what we're requesting whatever the traffic that occurs on this property during the weekday is whatever it is for the daycare or the camp in the summer uh and that doesn't affect the application because we're only asking to use it on the weekend so I would just ask the board to consider you know some relief that we don't have to do a traffic study during the week because again that application is not asking to occupy the building during the week okay uh 14 I think we just covered uh with with your testimony uh 15 well I I think 15 Mr Liber we couldn't we're not operating there at present so we can't we don't have any data to show what would happen on a normal Saturday or Sunday however based upon uh the it standards and based upon the township ordinance yes uh with 150 parishioners Township ordinance requires 50 parking spaces we have that yes we have an excess of 35 above that yes all right um and in fact I think in paragraph 16 I believe your professionals have confirmed that thought thought they've stated here that there are sufficient number available um number 17 regarding the NJ do can you comment on that um I don't believe we need a letter our no interest and the reason is is because this is almost analogous to a shopping center changing a tenant or adding a store to a shopping center the highway access is remaining as is there's not any change proposed to the driveway um and to be honest the peak traffic that's associated with this property is really the weekday use not the weekend use so you know I would offer that we don't need a letter of no interest uh in fact getting a letter of no interest is a very timec consuming task uh could be a series of months so again I don't feel that it's required uh and I would ask the board that we don't have to communicate with the dot okay U and I'll leave that up to your professionals um and in terms of a County planning board I don't believe there's any we're not on a County Road we're not draining into any County facilities is that correct that's correct okay o'd Township Fire Marshall I think we've indicated we'll work with them and I don't believe there's any other um any other approvals required none all right so uh Madame chairwoman members of the board with that said I don't have anything further certainly we can answer any questions okay um how about our professionals do you have first I'll go first only because of the youth this application uh has been lingering in the planning office for some time only because of the use in question um to give you a little background Child Care uh centers are permitted in any non-residential districts based on Municipal land use law uh a house of worship is permitted in any of the residential zones within the township as a conditionally and as a conditionally permitted use the issue was when uh Mr Sax filed the application he filed it with the zoning board assuming that Township's ordinance does not allow two principal uses on a property but that's not the case uh when I believe the change happened when we uh uh adopted the CR Zone and the commercial zones where it's not possible to limit it to one use so our Township's ordinance allows two principal us is uh on a property within a non-residential zone so that was one challenge when the application was filed because there is no new site work um that has been proposed um the request was for a vaver of site plan but when it's a conditional use Municipal land use Law requires uh the applicant to go back to the planning board for a site plan application so although there is no site work there's no technically it's not a vaver of the site plan you still have to come back in front of the board for a site plan approval so after a lot of discussion uh we came to conclusion that it lies with the the jurisdiction lies with the planning board and this is where we need to start so that's the background um there was also some concerns because apparently um the fire chief had gotten a complaint from the parent one of the parents of the child care center that there was some work going on within the basement and that was going to be used for a prayer Hall so the court Enforcement office myself I did visit the site uh to inspect but the basement is clearly going to be for classroom and lunch breaks is that correct and um the gymnasium is where uh they plan to temporarily conduct the prayer Hall I would recommend that should the the board act favorably on this application a the service be limited to weekends the uh patrons be limited to 150 because beyond that it will trigger a parking variance the site is tight uh as it is they don't have enough parking on weekdays for child care centers so uh with the church and we have had experience before with other churches when there are services on weekends um there are Street uh the streets there's a lot of on street parking in other areas here you're are talking about 34 which is a state highway so we cannot afford to be in a situation where uh there it's over parked so we want that limitation to be there um and that's that's on my end I know there are there are a few conditions but I need to talk to R about it okay yes thank you madam chair um the applicant did provide quite a bit of the testimony that we had requested um just two things that that I think we may have a little bit of discussion I won't say disagreement but just some discussion on uh one is the um the counts you know we did uh I agree as far as the weekday counts perhaps that's not necessary because you're not operating weekdays but weekends uh you are operating and and and I think the council would be appropriate because that's actually one of the conditions of the conditional use uh to to you know clearly uh demonstrate that so so I think weekend counts are necessary and then with regard to the letter of no interest from the dot the process for that um is that the applicant or the you know the owner's engineer actually submits a letter to do saying hey this is why you're not interested right and and the the criteria is uh no no greater than 100 uh trips created during the day and no more than a 10% increase in the peak hour uh and that's sort of raises an interesting um uh issue I guess because we're talking about uh a weekend operation where currently there aren't very many trips I imagine on the weekends for this facility so it very well may be that you increase the peak by more than 10% but certainly you may not be increasing the total by 100 so it's something the do the do certainly should have an opportunity to to raise flag if they need to so I think a letter of no interest is something that we would uh want the applicant to submit to the dot okay and those are the only two issues I had Miss Madam chair the one other thing I apologize um along with the conditions that that the ven had enumerated um I know that this is this is intended to be a temporary use is that correct yeah they they actually they own another facility uh uh on hardle Road and Old Road it was the old uh shopping center the Patel uh shopping center uh that's under construction now so that's going to be their permanent house of worship uh so yes if I mean I think what you're alluding to is you want to condition perhaps look at you read my mind Larry yes that when when we open that facility yes we will no longer need this so yeah would Sor go ahead V I was just going to say that then there should be a condition that this uh use will be discontinued and um actually uh it is a recommendation that came from Mr dioma that probably um 12 months or the issuance of a CO whichever comes first um should be a condition or you should come back or else you would have to come back to the board I think 12 months no knowing knowing the construction industry 12 months may be a little little too tight um I mean if we can stretch that out to maybe 24 months but I you obviously they've got a lot of money invested in the other site uh and certainly once we get the C ofo you know we would we would discontinue the use so would it so coming back so if it's 12 months you come back just for an extension right so not that it's 12 months and then you're out right my my major concern and what V and I were talking about is the traffic Route 34 is one of the most heavily traveled roads in this Township right it is a it goes from CTS neck right into right into route n so it's very heavily traveled on the weekends in the summer it's a parking lot at certain points it just is right so the the traffic flow adding additional traffic onto there could be would be a problem um which is why I think that if we just do we could do 12 months and then come back and then it's just for an extension not to go through the full review because we've already done it so it's just to come back 12 months we can see where the construction is because who knows what what could happen with construction ruction and then we could reassess in 12 months to say is it another 12 months 6 months whatever that might be all right not to hinder anything but I think from especially from a residents perspective because I actually have gotten a couple calls from our constituents uh just concerned about the the level of traffic because folks do drive up and down 516 where there's another church coming out there's no traffic light at that church it does cause an excess amount of traffic where we actually have to have at times uh police there to direct that traffic I think we can we can live with that so 12 months and obviously if if if we're delayed we'll come back and request come back that's fine then we it's not the whole RMA rule that we're doing now it's just kind of the extension of what we're doing today all right and in terms of the uh the weekend traffic study that I mean the only thought that went through my mind now is obviously there's no activity there now for us to do any traffic counts however uh Mr darg if you're comfortable with this uh once we open once we open you know we can certainly do a traffic study for for you we can submit that and at least I think you know you would have some assurance that we're not going to have a parking issue there yeah I I think that might actually provide better data so I would be agreeable to that all right okay after let's say after three months of operation that's fine perfect okay did you have anything else I do not Madam chair okay thank you is any um body on the board have any questions yes uh it's stated that you have uh the it's from 700 a.m. to 11:00 p.m. MH what is the height when are the people coming going are they all coming at certain times is it an all day prayer thing excuse me is it 7 A.M to 11: a.m. 7 to 11: p.m. thought it was read differently yeah it's it's 7:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. okay yeah that makes sense 7: a.m. to 11: a.m. not everyone comes at the same time like many houses of worship I'm I'm told the peak time is probably between 8:30 and and 9:30 or so um but at 7:00 a.m. to to 11:00 a.m. 4 noon it's all wrapped up they're all they're all done okay thank you may may ask question so you don't have evening service on Saturdays or or on Sundays or even what about on on holidays well holidays they would and I think I indicated um you know a holiday could fall during the day when the school might be in session because of their affiliation the school's closed so as a Catholic I know you have these dividual you have you know question for instance I know Christmas Coptic Orthodox Christmas is the first week of January yes so yes okay so so it wouldn't be limited to 78 to 11 11:30 it be holidays as well holiday but holidays that timing would be different right because it could be enough we would be we would be approving based off 7:00 a.m. to 11: :30 a.m. but then you wouldn't be able you wouldn't be approved to do uh evening liturgy right we certainly want to do it on Christmas which we're not obviously that's not happen so then we have so that has to that has to be then that has to be put into the the conditions of approval right so if we're saying 7A to 11:30 a.m. then you cannot if if that's what we're going to be putting into right right so yeah let's just let's just be clear to understand we need to understand make sure that this is right right so I don't want to you know Lo in do you know the days let's just be let's just be clear what the request that hours operation are from what I understand it's uh hours operation week uh weekend Saturday and Sunday 700 am. to 11: a.m. and they want to be open to the holidays what's the hours of operation and being requested for the holidays if they're if they're not on the weekend or if they are well unless if it's extended that's really any any holiday right holiday I think he's saying the same Joe I think what we can do for you is we'll get you a list of the holiday services and you can incorporate that into the resolution some of them are most of them are during the day but there're there may I think Christmas Eve for instance you know would be I mean I think just to I don't think putting the the actual dates of the of the holidays is probably the right thing to do that just doesn't feel right and it doesn't feel right to me like especially for like religious organizations I think we just need to figure out what is the right time frame on a weekend or a holiday of when their their services will be and that'll be right if they only do services from 7: am. to 12: noon on on a weekend great but if they then if if we're also going to have um Services up till 10:00 at night holiday do the approval from 7 to 10 just to give them that because I I don't we want to make sure that it's that it's a correct thing for for the religious community as well as our community and everyone understands what we're doing okay and we're approving it correctly okay so I don't want to I don't want to pigeon hole anybody so someone to say well based off of the approvals they shouldn't be doing this because that holiday isn't put into the ordinance that's not right for that's not right for your religious community and I think we just need to make sure that we have this correctly stated in the ordinance that it doesn't hinder them from from worshiping at the times that we're doing understood so do you still want me to get you at least well I I don't I think the question is we don't need the list of when those holidays are it's just when those holidays are whether they're on the weekend on the weekday are there different hours of operation that you want let's because what I'm thinking is we'll do we can put in the resolution while you're speaking just my thoughts so the board understands is that we'll set forth Saturday and Sunday it's 11:00 a.m. to uh 7:00 am to 11 uh am on any holiday whether it's on a Monday or it's on a Saturday you'll have a different hours of operation and that hours are what they'll propose if it's approval yeah I mean I think that that that would make sense Mr sa okay right if the holiday falls on a weekend it will still be the 7 to 11 okay all right if it falls on a weekday it would be an evening generally and it would be usually 7 700 p.m. till midnight okay all right 700 p.m. to midnight on holidays on holiday week non non- weekend holidays correct okay I I I think we understand and then we can work well so actually I would I would like to just make sure it's seven even so if it's a Monday you're only going to want approvals from 700 p.m. to midnight you wouldn't want you're not going to have um any Services uh during the day are they ear no I'm getting getting I just want I just want to make sure I said I don't want a pigeon I don't want I want to make sure that you will not pigeon hold to a specific time frame right so okay that if you guys are okay with that then 7 P to yeah as long as you have you know reasonable framework so some ability okay okay anybody did you have a question no no questions on there did you have I thought you had a question no I do have a question okay the the engineer appeared to be reading from a community the engineer appeared to be reading from a community impact statement or a traffic study was that distributed is that part of the submission package oh yeah that is something we've received thank you okay does the board have any other questions or comments yes will the um New operation require CFO in it will yes it will so it will require inspections from the and you will come up to the current codes yeah I mean it uh obviously it's really going to be we're not making any changes to the interior I mean you're just we're just going to have chairs that are going to be folded up and and put in there um but certainly we've got to deal with your fire Marshall's comments and we'll do that but yes it would require a c ofo upgrade to the fire system if required yeah whatever whatever your Fire Marshall is indicated we're going to have to provide thank you okay anybody else from the board have any questions or comments okay anybody from the public seeing No Hands we'll close the public portion um okay do you want to yes Madam chair I can provide a a summary of um what a motion to approve would include it would be a motion a motion to approve would be granting the the preliminary and FAL site plan application as requested uh just to clarify as it was clarified at the beginning there's no variances required or requested in connection with this application uh you heard testimony that it does meet the conditional use requirements so it would be confirming a vote in favor will be confirming that it does uh meet all of the core requirements for the conditional use uh there were a number of conditional uh conditions that were discussed that the applicant agreed to uh one being uh just to start out which we left just left off was be the hours of operation it would be on the weekend Saturday and Sunday from 7:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. and it holidays if they fall on the week nights it would be from 700 p.m. to midnight uh there was a condition of approval that the um applicant would not have more than 150 uh worshippers at any time um that would be the limit of occupancy they agreed that they will uh work with the uh Township Fire Marshal to comply uh recently comply with the request and items set forth in his uh report uh there was um oh yes sorry I did understand my own notes Here a second the applicant will agree to provide a traffic count for the weekends uh uh approximately three months after it it opens up and uh starts operation uh and there was the condition that they this is any approval would be a temporary approval it would be granted for a period of 12 months or when in a CO is issued for for their alternative site that they've obtained approval for on Old Road and that they are currently uh constructing uh if they do not uh if they if uh they cannot get a CO issued prior to the experation of the 12 months they can return to this board to request an extension of that and will not require a full site plan applic it will be a application just for extension of the temporary relief being granted Joe yes did I miss maybe I missed it the um requirement for letter of no interest to do oh I I I I did miss that thank you uh and that the the applicant will uh apply for an uh uh an apply for to the NJ do for a letter of no interest with regard to its use uh being granted I do have one thing to to question they are you're going for you're going for an amended C ofo so the the 150 count for the public assembly space is based on that permit right that being granted so it is a maximum of 150 but it's based on what's permitted as a result of the permit application no no yes no no the 150 the way we came up with the 150 is based on the parking the existing parking count is 85 so there are 85 parking spaces so when you back calculate based on the daycare and the church use you come up with 150 as a capacitor is there a public assembly inspection as part of the use for the gym for the updated CFO that would dictate the quantity that the gymnasium is actually utilized by the uh summer camp and by the daycare and actually I think the occupancy is 400 occupancy is 400 and actually that was one of the question the fire marshal had raised because the occupancy load for the gymnasium is 400 but does that mean you will have 400 patrons the answer is no because you don't have parking to support that 400 patrons and that's why we limit it to 150 okay thank you you okay yes anybody else have any questions or comments okay and you don't have anything more to add right all right um I'll ask for a motion I'll move it move by Mr mcus second second advis roll call please who was second uh mrus yes Mr dama yes Mr low yes Mr Rena yes Mr Petty yes Miss Mella yes Mr mcac yes Mr Brennan yes chairwoman kenon yes okay good luck than thank you madam chair women and members of the board I know they're very appreciative thank you very much okay um um I'll just open up to the public if anybody has any general public comments seeing No Hands we'll close the public portion and then we we have an executive session yes yes we need a motion to to go into toour or to to move into executive session can I have a motion to go into executive session good luck I'll make that motion I'll move it okay move by Mr M the second second seconded and R call Mr mcus yes Mr dmer yes Mr low yes Mr Rena yes Mr Petty yes Miss Mella yes Mr mcac yes Mr Brennan yes chairman Ken yes