e e e e e e e e e e e e I'd like to call the meeting to order I'd ask everyone to please rise plge allegiance to the flag United States of America please be seated welcome everyone Township of alridge Zoning Board of adjustment meeting August 1 2024 adequate notice of this meeting of the alridge township Zoning Board of adjustment has been provided in accordance with the open public meeting act at least 48 Hours prii of the commencement of this meeting by prominently posting in the municipal complex uh giving the time the date the location and the agenda of this meeting also by mailing such announcements of the home new news and Tribune following a copy of such announcement with the municipal clerk and posting the agenda on the municipal website M pelli could we have a roll quote please certainly Miss Andrews is absent Miss Chevalier here Mr ISO here Mr scagno here Mr Stoner here miss tester absent Mr Victoria here Mr Singh absent M chairman Sullivan here all right we have six members sitting at present I'm not sure if Mr Mr Sing will be with us this evening uh a couple housekeeping matters if you have a cell phone on you which I'm can pretty much guarantee everybody does uh please silence it so it doesn't interrupt the testimony this evening uh also this meeting is being televised Live on YouTube TV uh that you can revisit this meeting at any time in afterwards to if you wish to review it uh also we're going to have to uh shut down probably at 10 should it go that long by our rules we now close at 10 for public meeting public to save the public for the last half hour so under no circumstances will the meeting go beyond 10:30 having said that we have a couple uh business items to handle before we have our application for this evening and I will in advance let you know that if you have an agenda the last uh item on the agenda was 542023 Z conserva irrigation uh that is 4 4291 Oldbridge Manan Road uh that matter has been adjourned uh the applicant proposes to operate a uh irrigation company out of a former dry cleaner public hearing for this matter will be adjourned to September 19 2024 with further notice if you're hear on that matter once again it will not be heard this evening we be on the calendar for September 19th having said that I'll move back to our agenda and we have resolutions uh sitting for uh Council this evening is Jeffrey uh Cheney Esquire we welcome him um and now you get to go to work uh 14-h 2024 Z Lisa Lynch there was a c variance revised Mr Cheney yes so our first uh resolution this evening is as chairman said it's a resolution granting bulk variance relief to Lisa Lynch for uh 202 Morganville Road in mwan New Jersey more commonly known as block 122 261 lot 22 public hearings were held for application on May 16th 2024 and June 20th 2024 uh applicant uh seeks to install a 40x 30 40t x 30 foot pole barn store cars and motorcycles on the property variance relief is required AS application proposes 1,200 square ft whereas 600 feet is permitted and the maximum height of 16 and A2 ft is proposed where 15 ft is permitted Pro structure applicant testified that the PO structure will allow for indoor storage of several vehicles and equipment and the current conditions uh sorry the conditions will uh allow for the outdoor storage of vehicles and reduce clutter in the rear yard uh the pro structure will promote a desirable visual environment allow for better use of the property uh applicant further testified as a condition of approval it will not be used for a living space nor clubbing be installed and will not be used for any commercial activity uh application was subject to public comment but no members of the public testified uh conditions to approval uh as already noted the applicant will demolish the existing shed on the property the structure shall not be used for living space structure shall not include any Plumbing structure shall not be used for any commercial activity and the proposed project will be completed within one year thank you Mr Cheney board members you've heard the uh resolution as written someone move move that for adoption please Cher move it second scog moved in second roll callot please M Chevalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Mr Victoria yes chairman svan yes 15-2 24z Salvatore tenser C variance once again Mr Cheney res resolution as chairman said resolution granting bulk variant relief to salvator treneri for 23 steinhart Avenue in Oldbridge New Jersey and prbly noce block 2 uh 26007 Lot 37 uh application was subject to a public hearing on July 18th 2024 the applicant testified uh in favor of his application to install a 5 foot by 26t front covered porch on his property the front yard setback proposed is 19 ft whereas 25 ft is required uh applicant testified that the front porch will allow for better enjoyment of the front yard provide a covered entrance for the family and guests and improve the curve Ral of his home uh applicant further testified there's a condition of approval the porch will not be closed in and there will be no Plumbing installed in structure uh the Improvement will be designed in a fashion that uh matches the home uh matter is open to public no members of the public testified as the conditions approval as previously noted the uh the structure will not be enclosed and no PL will be installed in the structure and further the proposed development will be completed within one year thank you Mr Cheney board members once again you've heard the resolution someone move for adoption please I'll move it is there a second second Stone roll quot please M chalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Mr Victoria yes chairman Sullivan yes uh the final one this evening of resolutions is 16-22 24z it's Clyde serim uh C Varian and design waiver once again Mr cheny thank you Mr chairman yes it's a bulk variance resolution granting bulk variance relief to Clyde's serum for 20 sorry 280 Bay View Drive in Lawrence Harbor New Jersey block 55 lot uh 280 uh the public hearing was held on July 18th 2024 applicant testified in favor of his application for variance for leap and design waivers to legitimize a driveway and paper project installed on this property between May 20124 sorry between March and may 2024 uh the work was done to replace an existing driveway and po repair and to add a paper walkway the rear of the driveway uh the applicant testified the Improvement uh sorry the Improvement requires bulk variance relief for the side patio setback where zero feet is proposed and three feet is required and for a landscape area ratio where 13.43 is proposed and 45% is required uh design waiver is further required as a0 foot setback is proposed where 5 ft is required uh applicant further testified that the installation of the pavers and driveways alleviated the drainage Problem by including curbing along the property line and Grading of the improvements which directs uh runoff to this Street uh applicant further provided two exhibits for the board's consideration uh A1 photo of property before improvements and A2 photo of property after improvements thank you Mr Cheney is that right uh just a couple conditions sorry had to cat my breath there for a second uh proposed develop uh as the conditions of approval propos proposed development will be completed within one year no vehicles will be parked on the pavers and applicant will address any runoff issues with neighboring properties that's all Mr chairman this is not a Sprint it's a marathon okay long night ahead of us all right uh board members you've heard the resolution someone move that for adoption please Cher I'll move it 7 second second Stoner Mr Stoner thank you roll call please M chalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Mr Victoria yes chairman Sullivan yes next up on the agenda I'm going to ask um Mr Cheney to do one more thing and that's going to be to swearing our professionals Venus Swant and Bernard tetrol your hand do youly swear to the truth of testimony for which you're about to provide do thank you state your name on the record just so uh if it's a blinded we don't have a TV to look at your name each of you yeah Vina S Planner y Bernard tetral professional engineer engineered thank you sir all right we have one application for this for the evening board members uh the matter is 44-h 2023 Z this is continuance it's MCB Landscaping it's uh the uh low medium density residential R 20 Zone block 11257 Lot 4 physical locations 4244 County Highway 516 this is for a homebased landscaping business applicant proposes to operate a landscaping business in the rear of the subject property the applicant owns set property and resides in the single family home on the property it's a bifurcated application requiring a d variance Michael Collins Esquire is representing the applicant Mr Collins please come forward all right sir when we when we last uh left off I believe the date was April 8th that sounds right thank you yes so hopefully everyone's summer is going well it has been a little bit of time I just as a housekeeping item are all the board members that are present this evening eligible to participate everyone's is every I think the only two and I think they've signed certifications correct Marine can you just right they both Mr Victoria was present to the last meeting and Mr ISO signed a certification that you notorized okay fantastic thank you just want to make sure that um voting purposes uh thank you Mr chairman and members of the board um again my name is Michael Collins I represent MCB Landscaping the applicant here uh The Entity is owned by Mr Mark boo who lives with his wife at The Residence at 4244 County Route 516 block 11257 Lot 4 um as mentioned by the chairman this is a continuance of a bifurcated variance um seeking um the ability from a use standpoint to um have um Mr boyo's landscaping equipment uh for his small business stored in his um the rear of his property um at the last meeting we did have proofs placed on the record by both Mr Boo and uh Kate Keller uh Mr Boo's planner uh the board did request at that meeting and strongly suggested uh that Mr boo retain a traffic expert uh we did do that in the way of retaining John Ray of MCD and Ray Associates Incorporated and Mr Ray provided a report that was uh submitted to the board um and your uh board professionals did amend their letter to reflect same uh so uh if there aren't any objections Mr chairman I'd like to bring Mr Ray forward for some direct testimony absolutely and I'll just note for the record that you are not using a stenographer this evening so any record would only be available through uh either the TV cable TV here or an uh YouTube live that that's correct Mr chairman we don't have any objection to that and uh we are going to be relying upon the video from the former meeting and this meeting if there were the need for a transcript which we certainly don't hope to be the case but thank you Mr Collins okay Mr Ray is here I guess um if he could be sworn Mr Ray can you st as can you st your full name just the record raise your hand thank you do you s swear as the truth of the testimony for what you're about to provide I do thank you sir you would just put his his credentials on the record he's well known to this board however for the record AB absolutely I'm Mr State credentials uh very simp I'm a licensed professional engineer in the state of New Jersey my field of specialty is traffic engineering um I've appeared before many boards throughout the state including this board and the planning board Oldbridge and and I think 250 other towns now unfortunately I have 50 years experience in the traffic engineering field uh two engineering degrees and um I I have my own business uh McDon and Ray Associates we have offices in manisan and Westfield New Jersey thank you for doing that for those at home I've seen you for 18 years and yes Mr Sol and I think most of the board members are familiar with it but it does help those watching at home know uh correct who is speaking and what they're going to speak about I'm sorry Mr Collins continue no no need to apologize thank you Mr chairman uh Mr Ray you are obviously retained by Mr boyo um during the pendency of this uh zoning board application could you just provide the board an overview of um the work you performed um following your retainer sure I uh reviewed the application with respect to the intensity of the use from a traffic standpoint uh I obtained a statement of operations from Mr boo who operates the landscaping business uh because first of all I needed to see what the intensity of the uh use was from a traffic perspective as far as traffic generation is concerned I've been out to the site to establish existing roadway traffic conditions as everyone knows uh Oldbridge mwan Road is also middle sex County Route 516 and for those of you who may not know the the county road network is uh there are different designations the the 500 series County Roads of which County Route 516 is one are the most major County roads they are the most significant they are arterial roadways so all of the 500 series County Roads throughout the state of New Jersey including middle sex County are the busiest and the most uh heavily traveled uh County Roads I reviewed the statement of operations been out to the site to look at the uh alignment of Route 516 in the area of the site and um all I can tell the board is it's very unusual for me to be hired to do a traffic study for something that in my opinion is as insignificant as this application is from a traffic standpoint we are essentially talking about perhaps 10 driveway movements throughout the course of the day as far as vehicles uh uh employee Vehicles entering the site taking the Landscaping trucks off the site bringing them back in the afternoon and then picking up their personal Automobiles and leaving the site again at the end of the day the intensity of the use is comparable approximately to one single family home which under the it The Institute of Transportation Engineers rates generates 10 peak hour trips per day one single family home so as I've indicated before it's very unusual for me to be hired to do a a traffic study or to come testify and I prepared a traffic statement which is dated July 22nd 2024 uh in my opinion the use variants can be approved without having an adverse or detrimental impact on traffic conditions in the area due to the very low intensity of the use itself approximately 10 peak hour movements during the course of a day uh probably a lot fewer than that during the roadway peak hours which generally occur between 7: to 9 in the morning and 4: to 6: in the afternoon and so it's it's it's really a low intensity traffic use uh from that standpoint and that's why I believe the use variant as far as the negative criteria is concerned I do not think approval of this use will have a significant negative impact on traffic conditions along Route 516 okay um gu I I I do want to add one thing because it is a county road should the applicant be successful in obtaining a use variants from the uh zoning board we would have to come back with a site plan and we would have to go to the county to get a county approval and it is my expectation because the the current driveway is basically a residential driveway it is my expectation that should we get the use variants and go to the county for the county approval they will require us to build a more substantial driveway connection to Route 516 to accommodate the Landscaping vehicles that will be coming onto and off the site my client understands that and he's willing to do whatever is required by the county as far as widening and improving the driveway Mr Ray read my mind uh that was the one item that was in the review letter that we definitely did want to hit on um I don't have any further questions um certainly I think we'd be happy to hear anything from the board thank you Mr tetrol yes um I uh you know reviewed the original had an original review back in March and then uh Mr Ray prepared this letter which I reviewed uh and you know I think some of these issues pertain to the plan itself not necessarily to the traffic report but they were under traffic so uh some of the same comments still remain um you mentioned about submission to the county um and you as you said it's very possible a county is going to ask for changes to the driveway once they get involved in it uh you know my concern is that you know it doesn't appear you know haven't gone to the county yet I understand you know your position that this is um you know basically similar volumes to a residential development however it's not similar Vehicles it's trucks in and out coming at you know in and out at different hours of the day not a residential house would be passenger vehicles so the makeup of the the vehicles that are coming in and out is different uh if the driveway were not improved it's possible you know it's basically right now from what I remember the site plans wide enough for one vehicle so you know if there's a truck on site coming out or parked truck coming into the site is going to be sitting out on the County Route which is a problem um so I think right off the bat you know if this were to be approved you're going to be looking at widening that driveway wide enough for two-way driveway um but we don't know until go to the county um and this that was kind of my first observation the other one is that and and I dealt with some other landscaping business um a lot of times it seems as they grow they run out of room for parking and the employees begin to park on the major road and therefore I recommended no parking signs be erected to prevent this uh the other observation you mentioned about looking at the S trips and I you know I'm sure that's the way it operates you know you you've looked at that I appreciate it the concern here is that is there any is there any uh anticipation of the applicant adding employees in the future at would change those conditions increase the amount of traffic coming in and out increase the amount of employees parking wherever and I like I said I don't think there's really any provision for parking right now on the site um the other concern and this this would go along with the county uh submission is that the site distances uh would need to be looked at coming out of the the site uh I mentioned the width of the driveway and this is another site plan issue uh truck circulation needs to be ver rid and discussed it hasn't been This concerns with right turns from roadway into the existing Road it's impact on light on lot five due the location of driveway a at the southeast corner of the parcel and reconfiguration the driveway may be needed that was my concerns uh which were basically in you know a lot of these were in my March 6th letter so they still sitting there and need to be resolved at some point well I I I guess I can attempt to address uh some of the items there's quite a bit there but I'll try to go through the things that I I think I heard as far as the concerns are first of all again County Route 516 is a major County or material and there are other commercial uses along the 516 caror that generate truck traffic that access the county road all up and down the 516 Carter including schools school buses uh from the high school middle school um it's a major County Road and so a lot of trucks enter and exit the county road from different land uses I concur with you 100% that the driveway has to be widen I've told my client that he understands that and again if we get the use variants it's has to be subject to a site plan and I think a lot of the items that you you mentioned in your report that need to be addressed and I agree with you they need to be addressed we need to provide for adequate on-site circulation for the uh Landscaping trucks that will use the site agree 100% And adequate parking for the employees I agree with you 100% we will agree I think we would need an ordinance from the elected officials to prohibit parking on 516 in the V of the site we would agree to that 100% we don't want anybody parking out on 516 we agree to parking restrictions should the uh elected officials decide that's that's appropriate for the site we agree 100% so I I think the issues that you raised are totally legitimate they have to be addressed but usually at the use variant stage U we we don't get involved into those details until site plan uh a lot of times if if an applicant is not successful in getting a use variant it's there's a lot of expense and time involved in making an application to the county and it's usually not done until the variance is granted and you come back in for site plan but I I take no issue with anything that you've raised appreciate I appreciate that and the reason I bring these up I understand these are issues that get resolved later on after uh use variance is approved I just wanted them out there to so the applicant was aware of the issues that they're going to face and getting you know that use variant wouldn't allow the site to be remain is approval is going to require reconfiguration on the site to address you know the the what it's being used as that that was my only concern and and I take no issue with anything you've said appreciate that and if I could just note um in terms of the parking on 516 I just spoke with my client if that were if the board wanted to make that a condition of approval about not having any parking out there he would have no objection to that as well as if the governing body wanted to do something by ordinance that wouldn't be objectionable either and also um much appreciated on the comments and I can assure you that uh the plans that were submitted by the um engineer that has been retained by Mr boo um a lot of the circulation issues have already been taken into account through those discussions um and we expect that if the board is willing to Grant this use variant we would be back um in due course and providing the appropriate proofs on those issues anything else Mr tet no that's it for now do you have anything at this point I don't have any questions but just a comment that I think in this particular case because it's a use variance it is a residential Zone and um the bringing of the business is going to change the character I think traffic is uh critical to the evaluation of the Ed variance I think the negative impacts associated with the use definitely changeed the character and especially knowing that there is um quite a lot of traffic on CR County Road 516 I thought it was important to have some sort of traffic testimony duly noted I guess just one thing for the record Mr Ray could you speak to um the immediate vicinity of Mr Boo's uh residents and the types of uses that are in that vicinity well there are other residential uses in the area that access the the County Road in that particular area and uh I you know the alignment of the road is such that and and Bernard mentioned this about you know adequate sight distance we would absolutely have to establish sight triangles at the driveway the county will make us do that in accordance with the uh American Association of State Highway and transportation officials ashto standards and we would have to do that and that that would all be part of site plan I do understand that uh it's a residential Zone uh but again the level of intensity based on the and I believe Mr boy has testified in front of the board before and he's laid the operation out with respect to the number of employees and the amount of traffic that's going to be being generated like I said at the outset um it's very unusual for me to be called to testify for something as insignificant as this it's okay there's no Yankee game tonight it's fine uh Mr Ray one last question um when you were studying the side did you notice any other non-residential use within in that residential Zone I did not when when I was out there thanks board members on my left questions of Mr Ray you have to put your mic on please I have I have other questions oh well just of this witness right [Music] now no okay not right now anyone else on my left I have a few and there is nobody on my right tonight I have a few questions ahead um I know this area obviously I live I'm not within the 200 foot Zone I think I'm way outside of that but I live on 516 I know this area very well um this is right next to boa and boa Accounting Office correct um no I I I I didn't notice that it's not as I'm looking at it it seems like further further south this is the open lot next to to look at on B is uh next to the would be on the uh West that eastbound side this is on the westbound side okay uh there are several uh residential neighborhoods on the south side of 516 that access the road that bracket this property on either side okay that I did notice okay then I recan because I was going to say the location I was looking at there was there's no driveway so I was questioning like the improvements to the driveway CU I didn't know of a driveway at that location but I was looking at the uh um the wrong location um the only thing I would like to comment on is you know the the traffic on 516 is astounding um it's significant so to say you know keep saying insignificant I mean any little change could make a big difference the 516 so I think it's something definitely should be really looked at um I mean it's bumper to bumper every day on 5 I'm not saying the traffic on 516 is insignificant I'm just saying that based on the statement of operations uh that appears to be insignificant I like I said I'm very rarely ever called upon to testify for something that generates 10 trips a day it's very rare yeah I agree with you a landscaping company generally doesn't create a ton of traffic but 516s a pretty uh sticky air when it comes to traffic um no I don't have any questions thank you anybody else uh for the record I know Mr Boer had put uh on the record that no signage would be uh put on the property and no customers would come to the property that is correct that still stands I would assume Absol yes okay you have any other Witnesses you're going to bring forward um I don't Mr chairman um so I believe there might be some other parties that wish to be heard so we're happy to allow that to move forward well uh there is an objector case yes uh which will take place when you rest so um happy to rest okay it's summer we want to make this uh is it Mr Gorski counselor I believe Alan Gorski representing the Commons at Oldbridge thank you sir okay I just have a couple of questions for Mr Rea if I can right ahead sir okay um now the testimony of Mr boo was that he had has uh four a maximum of four trucks on the site um and he indicated there were I think five or six employees so did you take into account that it would not only be the you keep saying it's insignificant it's the residents plus those additional correct it'd be like adding one additional single family home to the property from a traffic perspective and I I do understand and appreciate that there will be Landscaping trucks entering and exiting not just private automobiles I still believe based on the volume um we're talking about one traffic movement per hour over the course of a typical day if there are 10 traffic movements during a normal business day I don't see where that's significant yeah I I double that I say in in the morning and out in the morning and then in the evening and out in the evening still insignificant absolutely my my other concerns are not really with the traffic study I understand um from the witness's testimony that there would need to be improvements to the the uh to the apron so to speak and that would affect the water and I'm more concerned with the property in the back than the frontage on 518 so I have no more question understand he's going to be here you can reexamine him should you need to yeah I have no more questions for the witness uh do you have you're going to put on Witnesses yourself right no I am not I mean what happened was at the last hearing we put conditions on the record okay and um I don't have a transcript for the YouTube of that but I can read them into the record again just to refresh everybody recollection but I don't know if it's this is the appropriate time before um this is your case so uh I I can tell you what you said last time um well not all the same board members were here so I don't know oh you want to put them on go ahead I would appreciate that repated it okay um well I had discussions with Mr cins to address our concerns um limited the hours 8 to six Monday to Friday to be uh residential landscaping and not Commercial Landscaping maybe uh start a little uh end a little later in the summer and end a little earlier in the winter um no weekends except for snow events um there was a limit to four trucks in the personal vehicle um they were going to have to back the trucks in we had that discussion and that may affect the traffic and the turnaround space um there would be three bins only for um Mulch and other dirt and rock material and there would be no freestanding piles it would also be a rear area remaining wooded we had discussions it was about 230 to 240 ft um my clients at the commons wanted the pole barn to be a neutral color they didn't have a problem with having it to be a barn red color um obviously there are issues with storm water management that we will have to um address at a later point in time if we ever get there um there were certainly concerns about the noise and uh the vehicles there and those were going to be addressed um probably not in connection with the um with the use variants um the Landscaping plans had a concern about an evergreen buffer and uh there were certainly some trees that had been removed May in the area maybe not from this property uh so there may need to be some tree management and replanting there um there was an agreement to you have a tree expert take a look at that um now there's only a six- foot fence allowed in the back and we had agreed to an 8-ft fence and I believe that was going to be an amendment to the uh to the use variants um I want to reserve my right to object to Future site plan applications because I do have many concerns that aren't really appropriate to address in connection with the use variants and uh I mean concerning water retention and the runoff we think there's a detention Basin that may be needed particularly when you start improving the apron and the access to the county road that creates even more water problems and um not that I'm that familiar with the site but the water usually runs off the road and heads to the back of the property and that's where my concern lies and the concern of my clients so I believe that's everything that I addressed the prior meeting and I believe that's everything that Mr Collins agreed to and placed on the record at the prior meeting I can just remove my notes one more second to make sure I have everything that's it for me okay if I were to put this in my own words uh from what I've heard from you you're not speaking against the use variants you're speaking about items that you want done should they move forward this is by obviously bated application yes at site plan if there if that reaches that am I getting that right so I don't know what the board is thinking yes and no I believe that when we get to site plan this will ultimately fail and I don't want him to go through the additional time and expense of trying to get a site plan through on this property and I know this witness isn't capable of testifying to that um but uh we have serious concerns about the property serious concerns about the water serious concerns about the smell and um I wanted to raise these all at the time I mean obviously the uh Township engineer and the township planner raised concerns also which um may be addressed at a zoning issue later but I just don't want this client to go through this cost and expense for what I believe is a futile exercise okay so so you do stand against the application yes okay thank you thank you and you're not presenting any other Witnesses correct um no I'm not not at this point Mr chairman can I be heard yeah absolutely um with all respect uh to to the council um I believe if the board reviews the previous transcript um it was made clear that we had worked cooperatively with the association um and reached all of the terms that uh were set forth by them and my client agreed to every single one which Council just outlined um and agreed to make those conditions of approval and I think the transcript at the last meeting reflected that um there that there was not opposition to the um application in light of my client's willingness to agree to all those terms that were set forth by the Association so um I do think it's a change in position slightly that was articul ated there uh but nevertheless I do think it's important for the board uh to be aware that these were all conditions that were put out there um which will come at expense and obviously restrict my client but he was very happy to agree to them in order to uh work with the association as a good neighbor okay so not he's taken a different position is what you're saying right that that and the fact that uh you know the conditions that were articulated were requests of the association that were agreed to by my client um I don't want want them to just be viewed as hypotheticals but as material concessions that were made in order to at that point in time um have them take the position that they did so this is new to me and I spoke with Council last week so I'm surprised to hear that but I think that the board should you know as it reviews this matter place the weight of uh its consideration on the fact that these conditions were requested and agreed to by my client it's a limited objection I just I don't know if they're going to pick you up on you got those are directionals it's a limited objection at this point in time I express my concerns regarding the futility of it um Bo the board will make a decision I well with all respect if the if the concern is about what you claim to be the futility of the site plan that's really not a position as to the use varience that's before the board tonight and if you're reserving the right to oppose that I respect that but that's you already did that okay so I think I I I just want to make it clear my my perception is that it's a no position because of these conditions which is what my understanding I'll certainly add by all means you have your right to you do have your right to oppose at that at that at that stage assuming it makes it to that stage You by all means you do have that right to oppose uh you would not be waving that or any just you like you or any other person of the public would well um just for the record my client would be here today had an emergency work for the Navy long story I don't want to go through it understood I would have further discussion with him today if necessary but he's not here thank you thank you for appearing uh you have no rebuttal any at this nothing further with respect to council I'm going to open the public portion seeing as this you have rested you've rested the case you the the objector case Mr Gorski you rest in full disclosure Mr chairman there may be a second objector case I know there were other parties who were looking to speak at the last meeting so I just want to make sure everyone's heard on the record so that we're not back here at another day well Council bringing an actual case I think other people may have complaints I don't know that they're bringing objectors case I haven't been notified of that okay okay uh but we'll find out uh I'm G to open the public portion on this matter it's 44- 2023 Z this is MCB Landscaping the location is 4244 County Highway 516 this is for homebased landscaping business I'm going to open the public portion and if anyone wants to speak I'm ask them either stand or raise their hand and we'll listen to everyone okay sir you'll be first I would ask you to come get comfortable sit in the chair there once you do the board attorney is going to swear you in okay sir make sure that light is green and again these microphones need to be fairly close to your mouth to pick up okay so you can move that thank you board attorney will swear you in sir sir can you uh State first can you state your name for the record record Robert Robert what's your last name sir vernachio V is in victor e r n a c h i o v e r a n n n a n a v r a n a no a oh ver oh do it again ver not veran not yeah I got you I had that yeah I had the same for the last minut Mr Mr veracha did speak at the last meeting uh we'll put you under oath again sir just so U there's no uh and can you just St your address as well for the record par I say your address 4252 Highway 516 all right raise your hand sir do you Solly swear it's the truth of the testimony for what you're about to provide I do thank you sir it's your time now so the board wants to hear you you are here to tell us something I don't know whether you're going to object or you're going to agree to it but tell us what you want us to hear if I'm out of line please shut me down you're not you're not going to be out of line you're a resident here you have every right to say what you want one of the last C comments his lawyer had made was good neighbor well good neighbors don't put no trespassing signs on their property and shine spotlights into at her neighbor's house okay this is it was stated a small business there's four trucks five plows a bobcat a a chipper a salt spreader a 200 gallon plastic tank to hold brine to spread on the roads plus three sheds plus piles of garbage broken down equipment uh I'm going to say uh a pickup liner smashed on a on a ground laying there three trailer frames stacked on one another uh and as far as coming in and out the traffic I don't know if the traffic man here knows 516 it's a Lane Road they use two lanes going in and out of school on my side of the road and they fly down those two rains that shoulder is used as a lane it's not used as the road it's a lane that they don't have to wait for the traffic light at the school so they use that as another Lane and I heard driveway withd mentioned could anybody tell me how much wider a driveway it that depends sir uh it's a standard driveway at at the present I don't know six or six feet maybe well I think they're bigger than that but uh the county would would probably require if it was approved yeah if if you're going to allow for two two-way passage and of course this is subject to any any rules that the the township has on required driveway with for what would be in effect a commercial driveway now no longer a residential driveway um you got to have enough room to let trucks pass bare minimum would be 20 feet I I would say probably more like 24 feet uh to allow enough room for two trucks to pass each other one coming in one coming out uh I would say bare minimum 20 ft I just had our property my neighbor had his property surveyed his driveway is three feet from my neighbor's property he would never be able to make the driveway if it's 20 ft you part of the submission I think part and this is part of what they will need to address if this is approved okay it's not only widening the a wider driveway but relocating the driveway the driveway would probably be moved away from the property line you'd run into the house well that would have to be resolved by them uh they'd have to make it work uh you know that's all things that their their engineer would need to make work uh whether it you know I don't know I guess in a worst case scenario there might be a partial demolition of the house to provide a driveway I don't know I I I'm I'm I'm you know I don't have the plan right in front of me but these are all things that would need to be worked out by their engineer okay do you live adjacent to the this property on the second house two away to the east or the west or is that the north south there East to the east okay on the same side of the street two homes I'm the third house from the question okay you can continue uh it was said they came to the association and talked to the association well we live next door they didn't come to us to talk they didn't ask us anything and as far as I'm concerned a pole barn is not a residential area it it's it's going to take up his whole lot basically he needs a turnaround to bring in tandem trucks for his Stone and his Mulch and to pull out on 516 with a trailer or a tandem coming in you have to go into the other lane I've been there for 60 years and I've been in a fire company for 30 and I can't tell you how many bodies I cut out of 516 in that area Jo I have okay just so you understand um to be fair to you as a resident this is what's called a bifurcated application bate application what it means is they're seeking the use and all they have to do is get approval for the use now that doesn't automatically mean that it continues on after that they have to provide a site plan and come back so there would be a lot of other issues should this board favor this application that may come up and it doesn't restrict you from of bringing that to the board's attention as well so we're not really dealing when when Mr tetrol who's professional engineer I understand that he's going to have to review plans as well should this get by the board this evening for the approval okay so this may or may not be the final night so you're not going to shut down I know you have a lot of issues I know that you have a lot of feeling and emotion over this and I can understand that and uh I appreciate all the time you've put in for the fire company as well and I'm sure that some bad memories and some good memories so I thank you for for that but don't feel don't feel that we're shutting you down if you want to say anything else at this point feel free there's not going to be any other Witnesses tonight that's all I'm telling you so the only thing that's probably going to happen is there may be other people here in the audience that want to speak tonight um and we'll obviously let them about this application and then I'm going to ask the uh finally I give the final word to the applica the applicants attorney and ask if they want to call for a vote this evening so that's how it proceeds just so you understand okay all right we thank you for coming up this evening and talking to the board Mr chairman I was hoping to ask a couple questions of the gentleman on Cross examination uh he's not an objector he's offered sworn testimony any witness who offer sworn testimony under the municipal law subject to cross examination I don't have a problem sir if I could just ask you um you had mentioned a series of trucks plows salt spreaders sheds and piles of equipment is your testimony that those are currently on Mr boyo's property they've been they've been told to remove everything from the property by the zoning board they've been addit there since March okay so but in two in a year and a half to two years he has accumulated enough stuff that he needs three dump truck loads to take all the junk out of there but sir just to clarify for the record none of that equipment is currently on the property no it's not he was told to remove it okay and also um in terms of um Outreach have you did you ever make any Outreach to Mr boyco to express any concern yes we did and can you outline that Outreach we talked he said he wanted a meeting with my neighbor and myself my neighbor basically is in Boston for a while she was home we stood in a driveway he rode Right By Us in his truck during the weekend and didn't stop to talk we're standing there waiting for him to talk he rode right by us okay so you did not ever have a conversation no I did I had a conversation and I told him what I didn't like there I don't have anything further thank you okay thank you sir okay now I'll ask anyone in the audience here this evening wants to be heard sir you would be next same would apply please come up take a seat board attorney will swear you in good evening sir can you set your name for the record uh Jonathan coslick j n a t h an kic K Oz is in zebra l i k thank you sir and can you just your your address please 4248 Highway 516 I'm directly next to applicant uh I I reside there my mother is the owner of the property all right M Kaza you you also spoke at the last meeting you were under oath then but I'm going to ask the board attorney to please put you under oath as well now okay thank you uh you tell Miss where the truth of the testimony for what your best provide I do thank you sir um again those microphones are directional so yeah keep it close to you thank you yeah I really just have uh a couple quick comments about the use variant I'll stick to that I think a lot of my concerns were enunciated by um the board Engineers [Music] um as to the traffic issue I know this gentleman here doesn't know where it is but right after the right after you pull out of the high school you go down that slope the property is right after that slope there's a deer crossing there's a municipal entrance where where trucks are parked all the time Vehicles going in and out for the water system um there's a school Cross School Board sign there I mean I don't know the exact distance but it's you know you look at that map it's like that to the high school and you know so I know they was said to be insignificant from a broad perspective but from a local perspective it is quite significant um in terms of some of the limitations that applicant proposes I would have to say that they're simply not feasible to build on the other opponent's uh oppositions U I'm not official opposition at this point but the other attorney's uh concerns um I've lived next door to I've the operation I've seen it in full swing for several years about 80% of it anyway I know some of his equipment is still located off site and um I simply don't see how it how it could possibly work in terms of vehicles coming in and out there's such a flow to Landscaping that the way it works is you know you have different employees coming in and out at different times of the day you have um different commercial trucks coming out at different times in the day I mean you have two to three small Caboto loading the materials on for the the trucks and then they go back out to the job it's a it's not 10 times a day it's a constant flow of traffic from employee vehicles to large trucks dumping off materials uh to repair washing maintenance of vehicles bro broken down lawn mowers I mean it's major commercial equipment and it's an all day long process and I live next to it it it really has no business in a residential Zone with retired elderly neighbors the use and you can't it's it's simply not feasible to do anything with that um a couple other points are if you just look at those properties I mean you can see for all intents and purposes they're fairly identical I mean I just don't see this property as being being ident as being unique enough to allow this use uh any one of the all those properties have natural buffers and some buffers that can be supplemented along the lines I mean the proper way to do this is just go ahead you can rewrite the home business section of the code or you could rezone the area but u a deuse application is not the appropriate means to deal with this particular case I mean what you're going to have essentially is a domino effect where people are going to have to essentially do what applicant dig and you know start small and then build big until I hope no one says anything and then apply for a deance you're going they're going to have to sell it I mean I'm going to if I inherit the property I'm know I'm going to have to sell it for a commercial use or at least the commercial use in the back half and that you know so just if you're going to if you're going to Grant it just go ahead and reone those there's there's two more properties that are virtually identical just just reone them all so that way the neighborhood can redeem their the value of their properties um see was there um there is there are some issues of you know it's not really feasible but it you know given would we really be here for a zoning board violation if if you could entrust applicant to keep to those hours that he's saying he's going to keep to to keep to the number employees that he's going to keep to I mean I know he struggled in the last session to name how many employees he really has so you know the obviously the past behavior of applicant and credibility come come into question before the board if you think any of those things can be even if somehow this could be mitigated there's the question of what go what's what's he going to do in the future [Music] um let's see yeah I think I'll just end on yeah just uh the idea that this this is an all day long operation when it's in full swing with commercial vehicles and employees on site it's not anything that you want in the residential neighborhood thank you thank you I I have some questions Mr Klick um did you engage uh in filing complaints with the township with respect to Mr Boo that is correct and can you give an estimate of how many times you attempted to complain about Mr boo I officially complained and then they opened the case or that was and do you have any estimate for how many how many times you U contacted the township regarding Mr boo uh probably half a dozen times through email maybe more probably similar number in in person did you ever knock on the door or attempt to speak to Mr boyo directly about these issues no um I would like to provide the board with um an exhibit that I'd asked to be labeled as A2 which is an email that I obtained under the open public records act from Mr Klick that was sent to Dam uh to Daniel hollahan and Damen Gil um provide this Mr cosck are you familiar does this email look like an email that you had sent to the township looks familiar it looks like a bullet point okay that's how I write yeah okay would you be able to read for the board what you listed as the third bullet point uh back of back of property SL business resembles a commercial junkyard filling filling up with discarded equipment and supplies so it's your belief that Mr Boo's backyard resembled a commercial junkyard is that correct at the time of the complaint commercial Jun yeah it looked like a commercial business was storing its junk there not in this not like an auto body type thing but yeah it looked like a commercial junkyard okay I'd like to now provide the board with an exhibit i' introduce as A3 Mr Plick uh do you uh recognize the area that's depicted in the picture here yes that's my backyard and can you describe what's in the picture uh that's my garage that's an old van and the water saw and do you believe that these conditions at all uh might also resemble a junkyard with discarded equipment and supplies not your testimony no I mean that's that's a van we use for storage uh does the van have license plates on it not that I'm aware of that's an old van so it's not registered or have proper license WS I have no idea I've been looking to sell it for a long time if anybody wants it okay I'll admit this is A4 uh do you recognize that photo yes that's an old shed on the side of my house that's a shed lack a door and uh has uh equipment SP about would that be a fair description yeah that would be a fair yeah my father's old junk once again if anyone wants some okay so you filed get of so just to be clear you complained about Mr boyo alleging junk but but you're testifying that you have junk of your own in your backyard I have some junk I got to get rid of but it's not connected with a business and it's not a commercial business I mean yeah I've gotten rid of a lot of junk I could definitely take it out of the shed and get put it in a dumpster that's my next uh goal to clean up the house in a residential way okay and I'd also like to provide the board with a now yeah do you recognize in this photo that's applicant's property okay um and do you see any um conditions of any junk or any um extraneous items that are on applicant's property no there are no current concerns as to junk on his property as was testified earlier he was forced to remove it okay and the shed is uh closed in proper form yes and do you have any uh issues with Mr Boo's current property his current property no I have do not have issues with his current property only the use and I apologize I meant totr this earlier but this is A6 Mr Klick do you recognize this photo yeah that's my shed next to the van and can you describe what's in front of the shed that's my water tub that I used to to take ice bets in before a commercial business moved next door and that's an old tractor once again if anyone wants the old tractor they can have it okay so it's acceptable in your mind for there to be an exposed tractor in your backyard is that correct yeah for residential purposes yeah it should be gotten rid of but I'm getting around to it okay uh see you believe that it appears that you're getting around to discarding of that truck based upon those conditions is that your testimony yeah that's the next one in line there was some other there was a lot of other stuff I had to get rid of before I got rid of that but that's the next mission okay uh final exhibit uh for the board I'm going to ask to admit is A6 seven A7 I'm this is another email that was obtained under the open public records act from Mr Klick to Mr hollahan Dr eolic and Damien gild do you recognize this email which is dated May 22nd 2023 Mr Klick I do and could you please read for the board uh what you wrote in the second paragraph that I've highlighted the display of decrepitude cowardice and kindergarten level gaslighting is nothing short of legendary and surely Tales of such Legend are already spreading throughout the community uh do you believe that this level of hyperbole is properly fixed to the neighbor lead dispute that you've had with Mr Boo this was a general reference to his refusal his continual refusal to meet with my elderly neighbors who stood right in front of him and he drove right past them I mean it's just like and then to come here and say you're a good neighbor I just don't I don't get it I I I don't want I I don't want to get personal about it I I just don't so this was uh something yeah I I'll just I don't have any problem with marker his family I just okay so yeah it just get these FR these things these frustrations build so okay I'd rather be on good terms with them whatever the outcome is here and just lastly to sum up um besides this purported drive by uh that occurred was there any other attempt on your part to speak with Mr boo about this situation no I felt he should speak to the my mother and the elderly neighbor as they're the relevant stakeholders here and it affects them most it doesn't affect me as much I'm a young guy if there's noise I can go outside but these people are elderly residents if there's commercial vehicles operating nonstop they can't live their lives did they make any attempt to Mr speak with Mr boyo yeah they made yeah they walked over to speak with them he right besides that reported uh incident were there any other attempts I know my neighbor talked to him that's not responsive to the question did your parents make any other attempts well my father is deceased um if he made an attempt then there's something going on that I don't know about um my mother other than that attempt I'm not I don't believe so I maybe one other time I I he may she may have I'm not sure thank you Mr Kik I don't have anything further thank you very much apprciate thank you [Music] Mr let me just see if there's anybody else there before if you you have something else you want to show us anybody else here in the room wish to be heard please uh raise your hand or stand okay I have a quick question none hold on have these pictures taken um I could ask my client he'd be happy to authenticate them and provide a datee frame it's to be pretty Cent okay okay yeah that's is that okay that's current Mr Vach you you want to say something else or you there's pictures you have here you want us to see well I you're G have to give them the attorney to see if we can see them I don't know what they are and who took them so they'd have to be just so I could be clear I know that these two individuals had an opportunity and seemed like they rested can can you kind of logistically tell us where we are I would imagine that it would be the opportunity for other members of the public to comment now there is no others that's what I just asked okay that's why I said I'd let him I'd let him have the list word because no one else wants to speak you want to understand no oh okay no no I I didn't I don't understand that Mr kuk is on trial here he's not but they're they're they're they're showing them everything's on its own merits sir so the board takes note of issues doesn't necessarily but if you want I don't know what you have there do you want us to see that yes oh okay you don't have to put them away if you would yeah you have to let the attorneys see them first before the board see okay well our attorney our attorney right here this gentleman right here yes yes sir just watch there's no being admitted I guess I do need why not do you have multiple copies of them or is just one copy of each do I gu just go back and so we can hear you on the record before we discuss them let Mr Collins see them let me ask you a question did you take these yes okay yes and do you know about when you did it two months ago okay beginning of the summer like late spring well yeah well you summer probably see but a green I'm not sure okay I mean all of this stuff has been removed the zoning board told them to get out okay and what so at this time would you like these to be moved you're going to admit them in evence it's all been removed would you like for these are you offering these to yes you provide but I just want to confirm that you are offering these yes is that correct sir um we're going to go one at a time with them I'm sorry I mean we're going to go one at a time with them do you have any objection um I have no if if the gentleman just wants to have them entered into evidence I wouldn't have an objection to him generally authenticating them subject to my client's right to rebuttal on the authentication of course yeah of course I going I want to time I don't think we need group of you want to go a group of them I'm fine getting the group as one for the board sake otherwise and I have no no objection I'm just count them and we'll make it one exhibit this is going to be o I guess right one Bakers doesn't 13 be marked 01 uh briefly could you did you explain either I'm going to come down there or you got to come up here you stay over there I got a better idea I'm going to come over there we have 13 pictures here right I'm not sure well we counted them yeah okay there is 13 and what is this first one this is this is the his backyard this iso's backyard yes okay viewing from your yard or where's that my neighbor's yard your neighbor's yard okay what about the next one same thing from my neighbor's yard from your neighbor's yard same backyard equipment stored there's a tandem load of mulch there okay these vehicles belong to they belong to boo okay right and they're not all there at that time no I understand I just want to clarify right picture of his backyard yes here's one of his sheds that we look at every day okay this is obviously we're at a different angle of view the property basically the same angle from shooting from the side I was not on the property there's some of the stuff that's been stored so this is just a little view yeah of that yes okay and that one the backyard same thing yep these are all Backyard pictures this is what's stored there and this was however early this is before he was told to leave okay to clear everything now everything is clear now there's a pickup liner there okay we hear hard door 12 tires ladders okay y yep yeah and I'm numbering on them on the back just for our references that's equipment sword okay three trailer frames stacked on one another so this looks like it was at least Springtime because there's growth yeah yeah okay and that would be a similar picture right right did you want to see these yeah Mr cheny you want these first yes please I'm going to go back up there uh Mr Collins just as a question that just came up uh for your A1 all right is do you have an A1 for it was from the previous from the previous from the previous okay okay yeah it was from the previous they just okay so words this would be this this three I actually don't see in my notes what A1 was but I was looking back to we did that I'm sure you have it sir chairman if you're waiting on me on A1 I didn't see it when I was revie today but perhaps I can correspond with the board secretary thank you okay just as long as we have it we don't need to reordering very good yep okay so we have the 13 photos so we're going to keep these okay um obviously do you want to Gentle speak to the photos okay we'll have we this is what you wanted to show us just the pictures right and to show us what it looked like you took them and we've come to agree that it's probably early summer or late May uh late uh spring looking at the growth anyway so late May and they generally they are photographs from your property looking on to the applicant's property from the neighbor's property looking onto the applicant's property from the side this is 2024 yes okay thank you could I say one more thing yeah go ahead we have 600 feet from let's say our house to the back of our properties M my wife walks our dogs four or five times a day people that he's had there will stand on a property line like this and look at her she's afraid to go out no fening there in between no fences everything's clear grass that's all I have all right thank you sir appreciate you coming back up Mr call you want these for Mr buo did uh testify at the last hearing he was under oath I'll put him under oath again just for the record please Mr obviously do state your name for the record thank you sir and uh do you Sly swear it's the truth of the testimony for what you're about to provide thank you sir thank you Mr boo just very briefly Mr chairman um Mr boo in front of you photos that are provided by the objector um can you um I believe you feel there's a discrepancy in the tiag that he mentioned that these photos possibly been taken can you speak to that this first photo looks like it was taken you're going to have to look at you move the mic Mone in front of you sir that way you would't have to turn your head there you go th this first photo was taken looks like in the fall time there's no leaves on the trees and since then the entire property has been cleaned up and all the equipment has been removed back there so um the fact that the trees are in that condition the testimony earlier that these photos were from two months ago you believe cannot possibly be accurate is that right that is true okay and could you again um I know you previously testified to this uh speak to the current conditions of the property it's a long narrow lot with a wooded area and um that's about it and so the all all the conditions and the photos provided by the applicant were remedied um Following last fall yes and can you describe can you confirm that everything was removed as you said everything was removed from the property and we had the zoning board come out and take photos and tell us that everything was okay sorry not the zoning board the zoning officer zoning zoning officer yes and I previously offered this photo into evidence I believe it was a four or five um can you confirm that Mr Boo this is the current condition of your property it is you described this photo the Lots cleaned up there's this a shed there all the equipment has been removed and if you were granted this really from the board um it's your intention to have a full sight plan perfected that would all for the property to be hidden is that correct if we were granted this we'd be able to put our pole barn and put all this stuff in the barn and nothing would be outside and the site plan also includes a fence between the properties yes it does and also and a uh and a a two row planted tree line Thank you Mr boy thank you Mr boyo all right I'll officially close CL the public portion at this point back to you thank you Mr chairman I'll make a quick summation if that's okay with the board I realize it's the summer so hopefully we can make this quick um a as you heard from the testimony this issue obviously arose from a neighborly dispute regarding uh the backs of the property um in response to that um the town obviously was involved rather than conversation directly with my client but in response he um removed all the equipment that he had in the property pending disposition by this board which is exactly the direction that he received from the zoning officer um and he did As Told by having everything removed um and coming to this board and spending a you know a significant amount of money for a small Landscaping Company in order to get the necessary um engineering planning traffic engineering due diligence done in order to present to this board uh the the goal of his application is really to allow for the minor storage of uh landscaping equipment to allow his small business to operate uh with a site plan that would need to come back before this board and would have the appropriate improvements so that the entire uh storage would be inside a pole barn uh apart from the neighbors with a fence up that would entirely uh prevent any view of the operation and done so to the satisfaction of the obors that reached out to us from the HOA as you heard from testimony earlier I just want to correct a few things as part of the summation I there was some discussion about a two-way Road um um my client has absolutely no expectation of a two-way Road and if one were required by the county I happen to think that it could be fatal to the application but I don't think one would be necessary because if you take a close look at the traffic impact that my client placed in the record and that Mr Ray had in his report um the trucks are all uh going out in the morning to do their landscaping for the day and returning that evening there's um it all occurs at once in one shift because there's only one one crew that Mr boo uses it's a very small operation um so as a result uh there isn't that concern of ongoing traffic as has been surmised and kind of uh conjectured in testimony so I do believe that if there were anything of that sort it would be picked up by this board at the site plan phase and that any testimony to the effect that would be a necessary consequence of the use variance I think is just not correct we would be back here in a few months if you were to Grant this use variant and you certainly would have your opportunity as a board to review that fur um with respect to the location um obviously trucks are um a negative externality to many people but if you were to have um a location for such a thing and the point of the board and having the ability to Grant D1 and D2 use variances is because of peculiar Natures of a property um and I would submit that if a landscaping business obviously they're Landscaping businesses are part of our community we all need to have our homes kept up at the appropriate time if we don't wish to do it ourselves and I think the ideal location for the proper sighting of one would be along a major County roadway like County Route 516 as compared to perhaps a residential roadway and I would also submit as we discussed at the last meeting with respect to the D variance proofs uh this is a uniquely situated property uh with a very narrow but long lot and which would allow with the proposed construction hundreds I believe between two and 300 ft of buffer to the rear um and obviously fencing to the side and also uh the property on one side adjoins a large Municipal property which makes it unique compared to the other properties and it's and its situation such that if the site plan comes forward and with the proper proofs placed on the record um the positive criteria would outweigh the negative criteria and my client would simply be able to store his Landscaping uh equipment and continue um to his um desire to benefit the community with that and lastly I would just note that um you know you obviously saw several pictures at the end here and you know I think the photos depict that my client has gone out of his way um during this uh dispute to make his property look appropriate um and that uh compared to other properties that are in his immediate vicinity including next door to him um there are properties that are not in a proper state of repair and that my client is simply trying to do the right thing here by in light of the objection proposing to spend a significant amount of money money to uh have this equipment hidden and stored in a way where it wouldn't impact the neighbors and to acceed to their concerns so uh with that we very much thank the board for its uh consideration of this and we would ask that uh it Grant the use variant and give us an opportunity to do the engineering and to come back to this board for further discussion about a site plan thank you Mr Collins uh I would say to all the people involved uh as as we all know homes are precious there are kingdoms they're you know something we struggle to keep up all of our life so our individual properties are very important to us and personal so I feel for the people and I feel for Mr buo too at the same time um you know the pictures going back and forth I don't really think the board is weighing that one way or the other uh he say it that he cleaned it up I think we know from uh Mr hollahan I think it was Dan at that time um that it was cleaned up so we give him credit for that I and I know he did actually move all of his uh equipment off there obviously he's operating out of somewhere else I guess the inconvenience is that it's not on his own property having said that you're asking for a D1 use variance here this is an R20 Zone 2017 master plan exemption I'll read from page three of the memo dated on July 31st the latest one it's uh from uh Mr Dari Mr Swant Mr tetral and I highlight on page three of seven the bottom under F master plan reexamination report list revised does not specifically include any recommendation for the site the subject property in our2 zone it's interesting that Mr Klick uh said you know maybe the government the governance here uh should change it and then we can all sell them for commercial well the government hasn't changed it and it's not likely that they're going to do so it is an R20 Zone I heard from the U planner uh Miss Keller and uh she spoke to the pole barn uh you know the the issue we have in the pole barn too the the pole barn is like twice the size of the house so we have a second primary use on on the property so uh I have a problem with that uh she she spoke to uh obviously the positive and the negative criteria but I have to say one I don't think it's a benef the it's the use is inherently beneficial whatsoever he can he's operating his business fine he's parking his equipment somewhere else so I don't think by him parking it there is going to make it any more beneficial to the community uh and I don't think that the purposes of the land use law are Advanced by this why would we change Zone by variance I don't I don't I don't think that that's necessary nor do I think it's proper here demonstrating that the site is part particularly suited to the proposed use I don't think so I think these are long train car lots that ABD each other we've heard from people uh that of under oath that say there's constant In-N-Out traffic I think it uh is improper in a in a in a residential Zone that other people would have to suffer the indignity of listening to noise and commutation uh the man has a business to run I understand uh he'll be out doing snow in the winter and he's cutting Lawns and doing landscaping and probably other U masonry work with for uh pavers for whatever he does but I can't stand behind this I really can't I don't feel that it meets the criteria and I certainly am not going to support a D1 use Varian having said that I'll invite any of the other board members to make any comments yes hi um as far as the accessory building that you want to put up the pole barn it's actually four times what's permitted that's the non-conforming major issue other than that there's no positive criteria to fellow neighbors the noise the smell and the constant traffic and there's no guarantee that this business wouldn't grow in the future to have more than five employees which means there'd be more traffic um and this leaving a business here we Chang the whole concept of R20 and oldge is a residential area and we'd like to keep it that way second of all the applicant assumed for years he could operate his business on his property and he did so now he's at a lot he's still operating his business and there's no hardship for him because he still can run his business in a different area so I can't support it anybody else want to be heard um would like to be um I concur with the commissioner it's just not appropriate from everything I've heard um I commend Mr Klick for his well-written email or emails um I think it's commendable that you didn't cause a conflict by approaching the neighbor you tried to handle it in a diplomatic manner but I I concur with the commissioner um just out of place anyone else okay uh sorry sir this will just change the characteristics of the neighborhood approving something like this right counselor we've heard from the board uh I'm gonna ask Mr Collins if he wants to take a vote no objection Mr chairman okay this would be for D1 use variants for operation of a uh landscaping business out of the home in the r120 Z the R20 Zone excuse me someone in favor of moving it or move it for denial Chevalier move it for denial second it's googal you're second for what denying denial okay denial when you take the roll call yes is to deny no would be not to deny okay thank you m ch yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner no Mr Victoria yes chairman Sullivan yes motion uh has the for the application has been denied thank you for your time I thank you and all your professionals as well let's see we have just left on here we have no other business except uh any other uh one from the public that would like to be heard this evening on zoning matters if you are raise your hand actually just extremely quickly sir there I didn't want to interrupt just in the middle the hearing there were some other photographs in here um I that were in this when it was provided to me and I just they I I mean at this point well I just want to sure they're not part of this they're they're not part of this because they were not but did you intend for these to also be these same okay okay I just wanted to just clarification I just wanted to clarify okay sorry all right any uh no one else I see in the public wants to be heard this evening uh so I'll close that uh anything from the township that we need to know missan for a special meeting that has come up um and it's for a business that on like in the OG Zone that particular business is not permitted it's more it is a use that may have been permitted in the Edo Zone but we have the OG zones and uh they need to come back for to the board there is no site plan they're asking for a site plan vaver and they have put in a request should be circulating an email shortly so please let me know if okay uh the board is available and would entertain a special meeting okay I think the board has tried to be as Cooperative as we can and we'll certainly try to accommodate sure the uh the date if uh if most of us can make make it uh from legal end anything uh you want to pass on Mr Cheney nothing to pass on thanks for having me here tonight well no thank you for being of councel to us uh we we do appreciate that we didn't know we were going to keep this late don't worry uh board members on my left anything you want to say no no nothing okay uh our next meeting is August 15th August 15th I hope everyone can make that uh our prayers and wishes are with uh Miss Andrew's husband who is aling severely so keep him in your thoughts please all right someone move from the German please move it is there a second second scogna all in favor I any opposed We Stand adjourned e for