I'd like to start the meeting with everybody please rise for a salute to the flag pledge allegiance to the flag the United States of America to The Republic stands indivisible andice please be seated evening everyone welcome to the Zoning Board of adjustment regular meeting January 18 2020 four adequate notice of this meeting of the Oldbridge Township Zoning Board of adjustment has been provided in accordance with the open public meetings act at least 48 hours prior to the commencement of this meeting by prominently posting in the municipal complex an announcement giving the time the date the location the agenda of this meeting mailing such same announcement to the home news and Tribune filing a copy of such announcement with the municipal clerk and posting the agenda on the municipal website Vice secretary portelli could we have a roll call please absolutely Mr Cheney present Mr Holan here miss Andrews here miss Chevalier here Mr ISO here Mr scagno here Mr Stoner here miss testy here chairman Sullivan I am also here uh at this uh juncture we're going to swear in we were going to swear in three members tonight but uh we're only going to do one and that belongs to Mr ISO who moves from alternate one to full voting member so if you would step up Mr Cheney the attorney will swear you in I'll get out of all right uh you want to what your right hand I say say your full name hi Louis ISO do solemly swear do solemly swear that I will support that I will support the Constitution of the United States the Constitution of the United States and the constitution of New Jersey and the Constitution of New Jersey that all bear true faith that I'll bear true faith and allegiance to the same and allegiance to the same and to the governments and to the governments established in the United States established in the United States and in this state and in this state under the authority of the people under the authority of the people and that I will faithfully and that I will Faithfully partially and justly and partially and justly perform all duties of my position perform all duties of my position of zoning Board of adjustment member of zoning board adjustment member to the best of my ability to the best of my ability help me God if you help me God have you sign right yep is he here don't worry mine's G be just as bad sir all right thank you for that Interruption all those in the audience here we were supposed to have two others they may be delayed uh I think if they come we can do it right we because they can't sit unless we do swear them in yeah okay if they show we'll interrupt the meeting but as it's only going to take a minute or so we don't need alter correct we don't need any no we're good uh sir are you say yes do come on up Mr Sing the same applies [Music] attor of course of course all right step up a little closer yeah all right raise your right hand I State your full name i d Singh do solemnly swear or affirm do Solly swear and or affirm that I will support that I will support the Constitution of the United States Constitution of the United States and the constitution of New Jersey and the constitution of New Jersey that I will bear true faith that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same and allegiance to the same and to the governments established and to the government established in the United States IND the United States and in this state and in the state under the authority of the people under the authority of the people and that I will Faithfully that I will faithfully impartially and justly impartially and justly perform all the duties of my position perform all the duties of my position of Zoning Board of adjustment alternate to member of zoning board board of adjustment alternate member to the best of my ability to the best of my ability so congratulations Mr Sing actually sign sign right there I know man this is then three total thank you sir congratulations again thank you well I'll really be fooled if Mr Victoria Pops in so congratulations uh to the two uh for those uh we're all homeowners here the people on this board so I can explain quickly to you this is zing Board of adjustment it's comprised of nine members there's seven full members and there's two alternates the two alternates are there in the event that they would need uh be needed should one of the full-time members uh be absent for some reason or other voting for uh local what we would call local or a c variance bulk variance uh variances that you're here for require a plurality so it's a it's three of uh it's four of seven in the case of a use variance where it'll be more commercially oriented that requires a uh super majority so there has to be five of seven only seven members vote at one time again the two alternates uh uh would only be voting if they were if one of the me full-time members was absent so we're we're homeowners just like you are we're unpaid volunteers of the community this board is set in action by state law and that's what the state law requires it requires a uh panel of uh local residents in the in that Community not from any other community they have to live in the same Community the gentleman to my right uh sitting tonight is Jeff Cheney he's the the attorney he keeps the board out of trouble so uh he's here to advise us down to my right is uh Mr Hollman he's the zoning officer if you ever watched any of the meetings on TV when they're a little bit more complicated you'll see a lot of lawyers Engineers uh planners Architects but tonight is dealing with homeowner issues so I'll tell you in advance before I call anybody up uh it it it is this is a Judicial body in the sense that you need to put certain proofs on the record when we're going to ask you questions about what you did at your home or what you want to do at your home Mr Cheney will uh assist me and or the you he doesn't have to assist the home iner but we want want you we want to elicit the right comments from you about your properties uh this is for your benefit so he we cannot the board cannot act unless we have hear the right uh things from you so it's a relaxed atmosphere in in the sense that we're all here in this together we're not here to uh punish you to uh uh mock you we're here to help you so we're citizens of the community when we call you up I'm going to ask you a couple things first the board attorney will swear you in who's ever going to testify in behalf of your application uh any if there's more than one he'll swear both parties in or more we'll ask you a couple of questions what did you do or what do you want to do how did you do why did you do it and why are you here tonight Mr Hollman answers that question while you're here tonight because he knows what the applications are as far as the ordinances that may or may not be in in in question so we try to make it simple and easy for you please try and be relaxed I know it's it's probably a hard thing to sit there but nonetheless we're here to help and not really to hurt you so I hope that's calms you down a little bit uh we have one resolution on the agenda tonight uh we'll handle that administ atively I would also ask uh if you have a phone on you and I'm sure everybody does please silence it so that it's we don't interrupt the meeting we're we're being televised on obtv channel 15 right now and also on YouTube live you want to see the meeting it's uh also back up on the uh on YouTube website I guess after about a day or so having said that I'll move on to the resolution 60 dis 2022 Z ailio and Elizabeth tashera uh D varians Mr Cheney yeah just a little preface for a d variance so this is going to be a bit more longer than any of the variances that you uh are here tonight for uh so resolution of the Zoning Board of adjustment of the township of Oldbridge County of milc state of New Jersey granting D1 use variants relief to ailio and Elizabeth tashera for property known as block 24204 lot 26 also known as 2075 Englishtown Road Oldbridge New Jersey uh the board received an application uh for a bifur bifur at application for use variance relief uh pursuant to njsa 40 colon 55d uh 55 d-7 D1 uh seeking the use variance first and they will return for site plan site plan approval at a later date uh the applicants were represented by Peter clauser Esquire uh the matter is subject to two public hearings on December 7th and January 4th 2024 and in support of the application the following individuals testified Elizabeth toera the applicant Brett papy Jr the professional engineer Joseph Highland architect Michael Pano professional planner uh the property is approximately 14.82% uh it's second please uh they are proposing to demolish the existing 885t structure on the property and replace it with a 6550t building to store construction equipment and supplies uh they submitted uh five exhibits uh namely color concept plan architectural plan elevation plan rendering of the proposed building and planning exhibit uh they confir they confirmed they've received all approvals from the njd uh the property would be utilized uh to pick up equipment and no work of retail be occurring on the site and as a condition of approval the hours of operation would begin no earlier than 7:00 a.m. and would complete at 600 p.m. on weekdays and 8:00 a.m. to 1 p.m. on Saturdays uh as a additional condition approval there'd be no leasing on uh no leasing space on site no trailer parking uh there was no bulk variances and uh the applicant professional planner testified it was well suited for the particular use uh special reasons existed for granting the variance uh namely encouraging a municipal action to guide the appropriate use development uh to provide adequate open space to provide sufficient space uh to promote a visual a desirable visual environment and to encourage coordination of various public and private procedures and activities for Land Development uh further that the existing building is dilapitated and the new building be more visually appropriate uh the property is historically been used as commercial uh commercially and is non-residential nature and therefore is well suited uh there was no uh testimony uh when it was open to the public and uh so that's an overview of what we have here and testment that was provided thank you Mr chy uh board members you've heard the resolution and you've heard it explained uh by the board attorney someone moved for adoption T there a second is second is Andrews roll call please miss Andrews yes M Chevalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Miss tester yes chairman Sullivan yes we move forward board to uh minutes I'll call each one individually it's the minutes of December 7th 2023 meeting hopefully everyone has had a chance to review them absent any comments or suggestions for deletions or addition to the someone to move them for adoption Andrews is there a second second scog moved in second roll call please miss Andrews yes Miss Chevalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Miss tester yes chairman Sullivan yes yes the uh same applies minutes of January 4th 2024 meeting someone move it please I'll move it sh is there a second roll call please Miss Andrews yes Miss Chevalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Miss tester yes chairman Sullivan yes thank you board members we move on to our applications this evening if you're holding an agenda last one obviously not is not on we'll have four of the five last one hasn't been asked to adjourn if anyone here is here on the matter of uh Sarah Douglas location at 59 Alpha Road for sundex and uh for a sun room and deck that matter is not going to be heard tonight uh it's going to be back on the schedule for February 15th so if you're here on that matter it will not be heard this evening we'll move forward to the first one it's 58- 2023 Z Ralph Edwards this is uh Zone R6 block 4.16 lot 40 physical locations 15 Jupiter court is requiring a SE variant to legitimize a p patio and fire a fire pit Mr Edwards please come forward good you going to be testifying alone the lady's g i I found that that if you have your wife here you better have her sworn in because she's gonna talk either way so you both can be seated oh no you don't have to promise anything you have to the board attorney will take it from here you just have to swear uh so if yeah starting with you Mr can you raise your right hand can you state your name do you Solly swear to as to the truth of the testimony for what you're about to provide thank you Miss Edwards can you raise your right hand can you state your full name do you st me swear as the truth of the testimony for which you're about to provide yes thank you I thank you both for being here tonight uh we understand that uh you seek to legitimize a paper patio and uh fire pit obviously that means it's already there so for some reason uh this was either caught or someone has brought it to our attention so as I told you before we're just going to need you to do the the the who what why where's uh tell the board that we may have some questions of you you may have some questions from us we're going to ask Mr halahan what the variants why is there a need for the relief okay the board uh might have some more matters amongst themselves they may want to talk about we'll go to a public portion finally then we're going to come back ask if you want us to take a vote if there's in Jeopardy of something that's not going right you'll always have the opportunity to say can I ask for a continuance okay and that would apply to all of the matters tonight basically the same thing all right so please take your time if you want to start if your wife wants to start it doesn't matter tell the board what it's all about well you want to start no you okay see I knew this I told you let her start no no no you well we we we we hired a contractor thinking that um he would take care of us he went out of businesses JD Landscaping the mic a little bit closer to you sir yes um so he started the work um we thought permits were in he was taking care of everything we lost contact with him trying to get everything everything coordinated with you know the injunction with court here um we weren't able to get anything we exceeded overall pavers uh requirement um we were told by the town um by Mr stord Stanford um that he looked over our our our uh pavers that we over we overshot our our allotment so um we had to do a a um a survey and come up with that and here we are um any questions for you I I can try to answer the best ability sure when did you do this what year did you do during Co period yes yes and it we' heard we've had a lot of them that have come in like that we had we had um issues with we signed the contract in 2019 but they didn't start till later I don't know like and it took took almost eight months to get it all done the pool had a permit and everything um there was tremendous amount of sand we were trying to get rid of it we couldn't get rid of it um then he was like let's build a retaining wall we had a pre-existing retaining wall in the back um behind the pool but then he rebuilt another retaining wall and extended patio close to the fence thought was I thought it wasn't a problem but um what was the officer's name Phil Dominic Phil no Dominic you don't have to name the contractor that's not that important uh this is common that that happened particularly when people were trying to improve their properties for usage during Co not knowing what the outcome was going to be people were staying within their own own homes and trying to recreate on their property basically was that what you were looking to do the same thing yeah we I'm not really familiar with this where basically from New York City we rented most of our Lives it's 36 years old when I bought the house um we got four children at home still at home um still raising family but um you know we did it for the family you know it's a big family back backyard you know it's I was very excited when it was completed but um it's it's really upsetting that I might have to part with or something I don't know I don't know what the out see what the board thinks about it okay did you want to add anything Mrs Andrew at this particular time basically we had the permit for the pavers and for the pool um but I guess the contractor didn't update I I don't I don't know I I didn't we didn't realize that you weren't allowed to put all those pavers you know um I mean had we known we would have just did what we were supposed to do but anyway okay that's where we're at all right let me ask Mr hollan what's uh what's going on over there yeah thank you chairman um yeah me and Damian had visited uh Mr and Mrs Edwards probably about a year and a half ago at this point uh because it was it was born of a complaint so um yeah I mean there's just a couple variances they're requesting one for the minimum landscape area ratio um and then one for the setback uh where they are proposed or it's existing at 7 feet uh where 3et minimum is required uh the landscape area ratio uh they are at uh 33% where 55% is required um so yeah I mean at this point a little bit straightforward um the improvements have already been done already completed uh so now the applicant is here just seeking to legitimize uh those improvements and variances uh can I ask you a question what's behind your home you have a fence yes there's two fences separating um well The Man Behind it's 22 Mercury okay yeah it's his fence and then my fence yeah it's all fence then um did did did it appear to be uh well done except the fact that they violated the setbacks yes yes um the only question I have and specifically Mr Edwards the garage is that made part of this application no variances okay because I know I had when I had reviewed the application and I noted it uh chairman in my denial letter um that there appeared to be a garage on the right side of the property that was installed sometime in 2015 um I'm not sure if you guys have purchased that was pre- purchase or postp purchase um but that garage did not have um a permit and also requires additional variance relief because it's one foot from the property line where 10 ft is required so um that was there was an existing shed there and then we just expanded it we just expanded it so it was the same distance that it was it's just the pad the pad is a little extended okay and we build up okay now did you guys extend that stone area or the garage itself um we did the you mean the pavement yeah the foundation was extended yes okay okay um so chairman I don't know if it's I would ask Mr try would uh and then obviously asked the applicant uh if they're here now it would be the time to probably seek that relief correct yeah I mean that they don't have to yeah I mean this is one of those situations that we alluded to uh that you alluded to said if there's something that comes up that might make it where uh you know you feel like your application there might be detriments that you might be able to fix or might be able to better uh you know come at a different point and kind of say here's our plan with this uh that you always have the opportunity to withdraw at any point prior to this going to a vote and coming back without any Prejudice essentially uh because obviously once a vote if something is you know denied I have a question of course do I need another variant for the for for for the I'm not understanding quite clearly do I need do I need to pose um pause this and put another variant for this this the garage we have the ability to handle it right now okay yes I believe we we have the ability to make that uh essentially a condition of the of this if this is approved to make it a condition of approval uh but it is certainly something if you know if there's something you would need to talk to uh with the zoning code and try to get it squared away uh you know that would be an alternative route it really just call multiple ways it can handle I think we would definitely need some test some good testimony I kind of ask you to probably you know go back and forth a bit more with them regarding uh regarding the garage so we can really get flush that on the record we're speaking of the garage on on on the survey D behind us is it is it what it's the top it's marked shed the frame garage shed the shed yes the one that's marked frame garage is the one I'm referencing on the right side J yes correct yeah it says frame garage so that was uh 1012 it became 1510 in foot 300 square feet is it yeah 1510 350 it was 10 x 12 and became 15 by 10 15 by 10 believe same electrical just just give me one second sorry 12 x 10 or 15 by 10 um it it became 10 by 15 okay okay 10 x 15 the the other one was 12 by 10 so it got bigger but the dimensions did change there yes the 12 the 12 it got smaller on one side larger on the other okay that's what I'm just making sure mhm that's why it got a little closer to the fence narrowed in closer oh because of the alignment yeah it was it wasn't actually squared to the fence so I the original wasn't really squared to the fence there would be building permits necessary for that correct correct yes and uh obviously an inspection I would guess correct right um and to date I don't think any building permits and Mr Ed definitely correct me if I'm wrong have been filed for that garage no okay uh Mr CH would if the could the board entertain that part of the uh issue tonight I mean would I don't know what questions they're going to have but you know on your side of things certainly would the you know not having the and obviously we know what was built here but in terms of uh you know can you provide a little bit input on your side of things at least to them so they need so they could know what would need to be done um we could conditionally improve it yeah we could certainly conditionally improve it uh but yeah because I I think it at this stage I think it's really just the applicant requesting an additional C variance for the garage setback yeah and just for the side setback correct correct yes yes uh particular point it's it's one foot where one foot where 10 is required Reed it's supposed to be off of the property line there foot off the property okay anything else Dan no that's it thanks uh I'm going to go to the board Mr Ed Edwards okay uh I'm going to start on my left any questions the applicant are you looking at there's two surveys by the way yeah no that's one said shed one is the garage so one yeah so do do everybody understand what we're talking about yes okay very good so the patio is uh 72 we're uh it's two foot where three three is required and the uh L is uh point 33 where 55 is required Dan is that right it is 33% where 55% is required okay um this was already here when you moved in this was already here well the the shed the shed was little bigger just expanded it expanded and made it bigger when did you guys purchase the property I think start there 2004 2004 okay so I know we kind of got you know a little the side there regarding the garage I kind of sorry I didn't want to oh that's okay hey welcome to New Jersey is it just New York too um so we were only concerned about his missing that that well be the landscape area ratio it's a setback and then a setback for the garage would be three three different variances um I'm I'm I'm I'm okay for now okay long as you have no questions we can come back to this we still have a public portion to go through going down Mr Stoner anything no no nothing at all Leon no no sir you said you had a landscaper that was doing this and you said he filed for permit well he said he was yeah he was affiliated with the pool company and they they they filed I guess the permits for everything well obviously it was just for the pool no no no it had it had the map out of the papers and everything and then um and then he put like more papers whatever but I didn't realize that he didn't go back and like update the permit like they were in charge of that you you been in town for 16 years right yeah we've we never had any money to do anything we had one good year it's the only thing we did to the house you know that's it we needed to permit for your pool yeah all right yeah well cuz we hard the pool company and yeah right but knew you needed a permit for your pool you should have assumed when you're doing other you know improvements you would have needed more permits yeah okay let me check on my right Andrew anything uh no uh the pool was done according to what you said the pool was um you had a permit for the pool uhuh and so that and the pool and the on the pavers for pool at that time yeah so the problem was uh he left and left the job undone and you needed more pavers which he never put in a permit room no no he ex he put more pavers I guess that were on the permit but I mean I didn't even look at the permit like I didn't realize that he put was putting more pavers in like he ordered everything he was a headache it took him a year to do everything I was just like just finish it do whatever I couldn't even get him to come it was just a total disaster honestly I didn't realize we did anything wrong I mean if we have to pick it up we have I mean that's it there's nothing I can do about it this was done in 21 um 21 yeah 21 right yeah took almost a year that's is test anything no I'm I was my question actually was um if there were any uh because a lot of the ground is you know um accounted for is there any water problems like your neighbors we actually had water problems prior to this and because we had a deck and when um we got flooded like during what is it it's Sandy yeah um some guy came out cuz I was like do we need to waterproof so we don't get flooding again and he was like it's the ground water he was like you know in the future if you ever do anything in your backyard he said you should knock the whole deck down and just do a like have it flat so that the water do because it was on such a pitch right so the water we got flooded maybe twice you know we had water in the basement I'm I'm All For You Know improving your home who's not that so I guess my my concern is just actually better than water because areas yeah there's all like the great so now now there's like more the water just goes Cascades off to the side there is areas where we can put landscape and stuff like that side like your neighbors does it affect your neighbors at all no it doesn't actually we're fine with our our neighbors on the sides excuse me we're fine with them so you mentioned you had a deck what you know looking at that roughly what yeah is Concrete where the deck was absolutely okay that's the general de space yeah okay mhm all right uh absent any other questions now uh I'm going to go to a public portion all right we'll make sure that we don't have any complaints or we may have people speaking on behalf but I don't know this is matter 58- 2023 Z the location 15 Jupiter court is to legitimize payer patio and fire pit anyone here in the audience want to be heard on this matter please raise your hand or a stand and come forward no one has I'll close the public portion board members any final comments I'm not I'm going to ask the applicant to make any final comments we'll see if he wants to take he and she want to take a vote no I'm I'm I'm good okay I have one more question go ahead sir yes sir no not at all it's not even attached like it's just we can de attach it yeah it's like sand on the bot he never came back you never finished it it's just it's just so it's not like it's cemented together or anything it's cinder block no no no no no no it's just you put wood a wood yeah it's nothing like gas or anything like that it's just cinder blocks B no gas line out to it no gas that's what my question so thank you anything on this side Mr cheny anything yeah so I mean ju just kind of you know working through our you know kind of our statutory framework here so there's not I mean there's nothing and I'm kind of just going to ask these questions and you can just kind of say yes or no and that's that's okay so there's no no nothing about your property that's you know with regards to the variances you're seeking there's no uh narrowness shallowness of of the or shape of the of the property itself correct okay there's nothing that's preventing you from you know from a different uh it's forcing you into this specific layout no okay uh are you what is on are you uh what properties are right can you describe the properties around you which properties the describe the bordering property so to you on each so you know to looking at this to the left is it a house similar to yours oh it's a cape okay Cape yeah they're both capes actually both sides mhm okay and what about behind is that a cape too I think so that's a split level is it yeah it's similar to ours I believe yeah okay similar similar layout similar kind of lot sizes looking like kind of kind of narrow and then deep yes okay um uh any any inclines any declines any weird top topographical things no Hills it used to be like that okay I know you did mention the drainage issues okay um any other wonky situations uh preventing there's no you know giant trees there's nothing anything like that um okay uh so you mentioned 2015 uh sorry 2004 four you bought it right yes yeah uh and so you're installed this you said you mentioned for the family you want to enjoy the family uh you got kids you got uh two boys two girls yeah two boys two girls so you got a large you got a large family um and you trying to enjoy it do you have do you frequently do you have guys have parties there or you know or not do you guys just just for the enjoyment for relaxation we had parties there got in trouble we don't have party I wasn't trying to get you in trouble uh every everyone wants to have a great like us so you know yeah of course uh but you know it's for family enjoyment right yes absolutely okay and in neighborhood and you know you'd certainly say that you know something like a a a fire pit and you know whether it's a shed and uh you know uh all these things you're seeking for certainly you know character pavers with you know back in you know what someone want in their backyard right in your neighborhood backyard uh any any on anything else you want to incorporate in terms of on the record or anything like that uh no Mr jany uh what was the reason for the shed the alteration uh I have a homebased business okay yeah that's we also have like no room I have no room so we're small f um small house big family so we we try to make things happen okay with what we what's your business I'm a graphic installer um I wrap full I do all gra all types of Graphics okay um so you just you needed more room for the shed you just kind of need more room to deliveries have a garage have I don't have a workpace and I don't work there but I get my deliveries there and I use the storage I got busy at one point and I needed expansion so that was my goal to um yeah essentially we would want to buy a larger home but that my business collapsed a little bit you know and now we lost we lost 34 of our business so I'm so happy I didn't go and buy a larger home because we would be in big trouble right now that's for sure so you I'm sorry to hear that obviously and so you said so you had to expand the shed with no storage um is it are using it for you s mix things in there business and obviously I'm using for like you know Furniture outside furniture storage I do have a small little gym there I I use you know personal use personal use Ab but then it's also to store the boxes for work course the work doesn't take place there it's personal use correct yeah okay yeah anything sorry okay little nervous final question final time on my left nothing on my right would you like us to go for a take a vote here sure okay uh this is uh for three different C variants there one is the patio setback uh it's 7 7 foot we're 2ot required uh and then uh that's the property line left side and two feet were three foot required on the right side that would be the first one the second one is the landscape area ratio it's at uh 33% we're 55% required and of course the extension to the shed which be we're calling either a shed garage uh that's one foot because it's caned correct so it's in line with the home right okay so it's a bit of a hardship it would have been hard to do it any other way well you got to follow the lines of exactly yeah okay so that's one foot off uh where 10 is required am I correct Mr cheny it's correct based on this uh based on what we have on the denial of application y okay uh we could take them as a bulk right I mean all together yeah and for the purposes we'll say is a shed not a garage I think correct personally is shed yeah okay uh all under C1 correct yes okay so C1 variance board members someone interested in moving if for approval I will is there a second ISO roll call please miss Andrews yes Miss Chevalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Miss tester yes chairman Sullivan it's just a lesson that um that uh people don't realize they do things that are a miss so it's a lot easier to ask uh before you do things in your own homes I know you moved in from another state uh but you can find all this information through the township before you do any projects and it would have saved you the time having come here before us tonight I hope you didn't you uh find it too tough my vote is yes uh and I and I I know you want to do the best for your family and for your proper but please bear in mind when you affect your property sometimes it affects others okay sir there'll be a resolution prepared for this at our next meeting please meet with the building department or zoning officer and find out what you need for that personal shed first thing tomorrow thanks for being here tonight thank you Happy New Year thank you Happy New Year thank you sir thank you guys okay next matter uh 65- 2023 Z it's Marg jry I hope I said that right this is R six Zone block 15548 lot one point no 138 uh 34 xor Street is the physical location this requires a c variance the applicant proposes a 6x1 covered Portico porch 23.4 foot from the front yard where from the property line where 25 required folks good evening good evening even both of you going to be testifying I would assume sure board attorney of swear you in all right so sorry maie Marie Marie okay all right margorie uh can you raise your right hand do you solemly swear as to the truth of the testimony for which you're about to provide I do thank you and are you her husband or okay and uh what's your say your name my name is James schacker okay one second spell the last name sir s c h l a c h t e r thank you sir that's why I don't use it s c h l a c h t r correct okay thank you all right you raise your right hand thank you I do Solly swear as the truth of the testimony for which you're about to provide yes I do thank you same's going to apply uh whoever wants to take the lead please inform the board what's going on there what you want to do or what you did uh we didn't we didn't do it yet okay uh what you want to do what we why you want to do okay all of the above okay yes go ahead ma'am um so we want to build a a portical over the front entrance of our house and increase the like you know the cement slab step as you like the walkway yeah yeah I don't know what you call it yeah the Step Up um just so we can put a couple of chairs there just like a little porch kind of thing okay just we're a little bit confused I think at one point about the terminology of portico it's not designed for a car or anything like that it's just essentially a covered it's a little porch but it's not yeah it's not a full porch which I would really love but um it's for enhancing the look of the home right yeah I could show you it's and it's for sitting outside yeah and functions the cover while you want to sit there in the rain yeah okay exactly very nice Mr Hollin thank you chairman um yes so the applicant is here today requesting um a single C variance um where they propose a 6t by 11t covered front porch 23.4 ft from the front yard property line uh where they do require 25 ft minimum um so pretty straightforward I think um just one single C variance [Music] um that's about all I got for you that's one yard setback right yes yes sir all right board has dealt with uh I was just looking at your home here in a picture and I see exactly what you want to do um would it would it be just a little bit wider than the uh which is not our concern by the way problem I have a Photoshop picture if you want to see no that's okay I don't think the board does either but but it's not necessary in this case you're coming up just this short I mean in many ways 1 fo 6 in and I guess that's probably because of the way it has to be built yeah in other words they couldn't trim it back because it wouldn't be functional right okay I got questions on my left basically just the step that's what it is we got we've had this and a matter of fact it's one of the issues that we on the yearly report have tried to change for the homeowners so that they wouldn't the problem is if you don't Define a stop point there would never be a stop point so 25 is not arbitrary it's set for a reason uh but then if we just left it up to the home owner they might go all the way out to Cur right somewhere it has to end and I like I said you're just a little bit little bit over questions on my left I'm good nothing Elric you electrical lamp out there or Outlet no okay you have you have a light over your door now don't you yes I'm sure you will we have two sconces already on the side of the house would be the P I figured if youve reading a newspaper or something you might want a little lamp out there there's nothing wrong if you want to do that by the way yeah no I didn't I just would that be covered under this variance as well yeah you can you can put a light out there and it'll probably be if you're if there's one over your door right now you do the same thing yeah you don't have to I'm merely saying it's just suggesting like Mr Sullivan wants to put a light there Vice chairman no I'm good all right on I right no L's good okay Mr chair you have any questions how long have you on the property for um 1998 26 years or 25 1998 okay um uh in terms of just you know obviously it's a Dem Minimus in the grand scheme of things in terms of uh with looking for a setback um anything else in terms of you said it's it's uh kind of required for installation that that specific length is required that's 6 by 11 correct yes okay and I think that's really you know I'm looking at it Sor I'm just going off the top of my top my head yeah Mr you had no plans on closing it corre correct and you're not going to enclose it I'm not going to enclose it that would be a whole another issue yes okay you you can come in and uh there's no Plumbing going out there just the electric to the to the top no right now there's no plan for that yeah okay there's existing electric I got it yeah okay anything else you want to tell the board it's going to look really nice it's what it's going to look really nice I'm I'm positive you're going to make it nice you even brought something I have a photo let me see the picture okay this is from I think it would be rude of me not to look at the picture I think so so the top is the existing house and then I you [Laughter] kidding you should become a designer very nice show the board we're going to find out yeah thank you well I am going to have you uh go to once you get out to the mic just to say something uh for the mic what you just said there you did say uh that you photosho that from house around the block correct so that it fits the nature had a permit but so it fits them with the nature of the community right excuse me fits it's uh in it's in character with the nature of the community have most of my model in saywood South a lot of houses have this sometimes it's smaller and just like almost decorative and sometimes it's larger like I want for the chairs but it's because my model is the only one that doesn't have a small sitting area it's a good thing it fits in nature keeps in in in uniform uniform yeah thank you uniformity of the area very much right right you going to let your husband have have anything to say or no um he doesn't have to wait do you have anything to say up they're Whispering no he does not hey all right you wouldn't mind if I go to a public portion would you not at all the matter this is matter 65-20 23z the location is 34 exer Street they want to put a covered Portico on the front of their house which I've been assured is going to look very nice anyone have any comments if you do please raise your hand and come forward seeing none I'm going to close the public portion we'll go back to you final comments ma'am none none board members on my left any problems you want to discuss board members on I right no comes down to voting time would you like me to call for a vote please I will someone interested this is a hold on this is a front yard setback 234 from the front yard property line where 25 is the minimum so we're at uh foot and a half anyone interested in moving this for approval Andrew's move it is there a second ISO ISO is a second roll call please is there a second he is okay Miss Andrews yes Miss Chevalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Miss tester yes chairman Sullivan yes nice choice on your project good luck you'll have a resolution available at the next meeting you can't do it until you get your resolution okay you're all invited to come sit on the porch and also I just want to tell you that I worked with um Millie denro for the planning board I don't want you putting things on the record that really aren't applicable to the application okay I'm I'm just doing that for a good reason all right ma'am thank you thank you both you happy New Year next application 69223 z candido carasco uh I probably didn't say that right and I apologize it's R six Zone block 15584 lot 600 214 Cindy Street for an extended driveway sir I hope I didn't say your name too bad you did all right there you okay all right happy New Year everyone Happy New Year to you sir you've already been through too so it's it's going to be your turn uh the applicant seeks to legitimize a 12T by 5 by 24 driveway expansion that was previously done without zoning approval the driveway was installed at Zero from the front side yard property line where five is required okay once again you can go at your own pace before we let you do that you're going to be sworn in I guess you're both going to talk because I know you're going to have something to say all right who wants to raise the right hand first go first you let me go first all right uh raise your right hand do Sol do you s me swear to as to the truth the testimony for which you're about to provide thank you and uh just it's uh Grace right Grace okay and uh Mr carasco yes raise your right hand dopes the truth of the testimony for which you're about to provide I do it's a candido right yes candido all right all right sir uh whoever can go first and proceed and tell us uh why that driveway is there now okay all right so my wife and I um moved in in 2002 um uh we decided it was the original driveway um and the sidewalk um so being there so long the sidewalk was pretty pretty bad uh the driveway was in pretty bad condition so we decided to um invest in the the front of the home um so before we did that we actually drove around the neighborhood and looked at other driveways cuz we had no idea what we really wanted and a lot of the homes that are in the neighborhood the guy took few houses to my right neighbor across the street to my right they all have pretty much the same driveway um then realizing that after we got the work done I believe after 2019 they changed the variants where you needed to have like four or five feet um so it became an issue when we discussed this with the contractor they told they told us that we didn't need a permit um so and and taking their advice and you know not really doing our research and you know understanding that we did need one we went ahead and did the work um so now that's why we're here um you know we think uh we think that uh it definitely improved what we had um you know my neighbor that lives right next door that if it would affect anyone is here he gave up his night for us tonight so just to go show how how good my neighbors are so um you know being there so long we really didn't realize we were doing something wrong um so so that's what we go ahead my turn sure sure by by all means uh so the work was done September 2023 um and we actually used the same contract or the same company that uh the a neighbor a few d homes down from us used and we literally said we want what they did because they did such a nice job on their driveway um so the work was done while we weren't at home um so like and we did ask in advance if we needed her permit he goes no I've done six homes on this street you don't need a permit I said okay no problem um but once the work was done it did look it looks beautiful so I have no complaints but when we found out there was an issue with um the size of I guess we were supposed to leave uh some grass there um but we have a whole lot of grass in the back and on the other side like there's a lot um but you know we want to do what what we have to do um but we haven't really gotten any complaints of anything the neighbors that have seen the work they they have complimented us they they love how it looks so um hopefully it's it's not an issue here okay anything else you want to tell me right now you'll get another chance I'm going to go I'll go to the zoning off officer sir thank you chairman um yeah so the applicant is here tonight seeking a a single C variance for driveway setback uh where they are um they have completed the work already and the driveway is installed 0t from the side yard property line where 5T is required um yes uh Miss carasco was correct in saying there were a couple properties along this stretch of road that seemed to be all same work done by the same contractor with the same issues um but yes just single C variants for driveway setback thank you uh I toured there just the other day and um it's interesting you brought that up and you you're you're correct there uh your neighbor to the your looking at your front door to the left has it two doors down has it the diagonal has it and as a matter of fact I think the community was probably put up post Korea War I'm thinking they're probably 60s of late 50s and early 60s and they're all kind of not cookie cutter but by levels that uh were on kind of narrow properties and not necessarily narrow properties but the house seems to be offset on either side corre if I could if I saying that correctly where you have a space that your property line goes to but your driveway doesn't because they built single car driveways correct in fact I think that probably more than 50% of the homes on that road have all done the same thing at some time or another and I might be underestimating at 50% so I don't know what happened with you while you're here but uh I can tell you that running the whole length and through the community everybody's done the same thing only because families got bigger when those were built there was one car and one car only in the home and that was probably used by dad when he went to work yeah and there was no need now you have children and you have four cars four cars now having said that there's still an ordinance and and it says 5 foot so it's not about the it's not about the the gentleman who the contractor who told you you don't need a permit the problem is he built it too big you can't encroach on a property line now when you're at zero that's kind of a magical number because you're either on the other person's line or you're on your line it's almost impossible to be on the line so I know that somebody's going to come up because you already said that and say it's not a problem but that's what the the variance means you can't get five foot close to the property lens not about grass it's about encroaching on other people's property so while I understand your position and I'm sure that I'm sure I'm going to hear that he doesn't have a problem with it um that's that's the reason you're here not because of a permit there may be a permit but that that has nothing to do with why you're here let me see if what the other board members think okay and they might have some questions I'll start on my left hand side no you said it perfect Mr Stoner um I have a question for the zoning board they want exactly what the neighbors had so with the neighbors in compliance too um I think this board has already seen one of the other applications along the stretch of Cindy um I think there's a third one Morin correct me if I'm wrong yeah I think there were three homes that were done that were all in violation um they were all kind of the complaint was filed at the same time for all three homes um I think this board has already approved one this is a second I believe there's another third one in the works okay anything else Mr no no I was just no I was just a little confused how they want exactly to say what the neighbors's had but I'm trying to remember the the first one that came in that got approved I guess it's been one believe there was one but yeah okay it's not that uncommon but the one that was really tricky is the neighbor across the street that's had it for quite some time yeah this wasn't done anytime soon so Mr scog see that's the situation we have you're right on the line you're not only on your line you're on your neighbor's line and whether we approve this or not we we're going to be subject to another one coming up and you you you said that all the neighbors are in favor and they loved it but why are you here somebody didn't love it I think it has to do with with the company itself that did the work and so because the so what is it forget about let me will let me finish all right I think it has to do with the company that did the work and maybe there was a disgruntled customer because they're not the best people to work with as a matter of fact when they finished the work by the time we got home they were gone um I don't want to disparage any contractors so I but they didn't return to reach out to them they weren't the easiest to work with so I'm just thinking that maybe someone they worked with had an issue and is maybe no I I I get that but I I don't want to bring personal uh contractors in to put their name on a record anywhere okay so we can just we can leave it at that will it may very well be that they weren't uh reading the survey correctly so I don't know why they do it and the one of the problems you wind up going now is if we want to sell that house that's right you're not going to get a clear title so that's something to think about in the future you have to be off of your line because the approval of the variance stays with the property that you sell that house that that variant stays with the property line so the next person if the your neighbor sells and he come so it's it's a little problem there yeah but my question is he's mentioning the three folk the three families that are dealing with were they on the property line but what I'm saying is obviously that something's wrong but what I'm saying is the the the families that have that property already done the same way did they have that issue are they going to have that issue when they s that's what I'm saying it's going to keep coming up I know that when someone just when we decide to sell our home the way we take care of our home the way my neighbors take care of their homes not going to have a problem selling my house it's the title company sir the title no I understand but what I'm saying is that we didn't decide to just do this on our own literally drove around and looked and was like wow okay we see what people have so we decided we wanted as a matter of fact you pulled over when the he saw the guys the working and he goes can you come to our house when you're done and all we said was we want what you did there that's what we want done to our I I think the the board understands that and it's just I think the board's you know kind having an internal question you know I don't want to say internal crisis but internal question of okay if we you know if we Grant 10 of these applications have we changed the fun fundamental you know character and lot lines of the neighborhood in doing so because each you know each time it shifts it just a little bit right um sorry just put went out up there don't uh yeah so that's I think the you know the questions that are being asked here are not of you it's just of you know hey when the Snowballs then what happens because you know yes it's one of those things maybe not one but you know if 10 properties have this done and then do what happen with all these titles when it's two ab buding ones and you know everything becomes shifted and you can't tell who where one driveway begins and when where one starts um you know I'll end it with that on there um I'm want to go back to the board questions yet I wasn't finished I I noticed that did you go for a permit for the shed in the back um I believe we yeah we have because that's right on the property line also so no that's 3T away from the fence we're not here on that matter I know we're not here on that matter I just want to see if they're incline of going for permits sper no that that space saver is that's that's okay I'm talking it's three feet away from the fence because we have our pool pump uh all the all the electrical outlets that's been there all of that was there before we even bought the house yeah was already I just want to emphasize that a permit is to protect you no I understand that so don't be afraid to go for permits I've been there for over 20 years 20 years we've been we've been grinding to keep this house up two new roofs new windows new kitchen all of that stuff we did everything had to get done the right way so we understand we just got a new water heater we called the service they got the permit for us we also tend to lean on the contractor to help us as well we shouldn't do that's besides the point that that's irrelevant it's it's about what's what's at hand now so in doing the driveway we really truly believe that we weren't doing anything wrong and the way it's set up where my fence is and where my neighbor's fence is that's sort of like where the line is you know there's still a little there's a couple of there's about 5 Ines but it's not directly on the line because it's a differentiate between the you can see from where mine starts and and ends and his starts and end so let me just see if any of the other board members I didn't finish yet yeah first of all it's wonderful that you know you say you wanted to do what everybody else did as the attorney just stated though now you're you're changing our ordinances and our variances of what's required whether you thought there was a permit or everybody else had a permit it's snowballing it's snowballing to this board all the time whether it looks great fine so and my point is when you mentioned your fence being five five Ines off the property line obviously you got to permit for that because that's what Oldbridge requires so you knew that much so how did you not know it for your driveway no well no I'm saying that that's what's left right now from the driveway to lose property that's what's left five inches from your fence you said your driveway goes right to the property line yeah so I'm saying you knew that you needed five inches for your fence when you put it up so you would have had to assume the fence I'm not sure what you're talking about yeah the fence that we had there was existing and we rep right you replaced with a new fence at 5 Ines my point is that was a permit you need a permit for a fence you needed to know how the you know fence was going to be put up and what was required I think you mean shed he mentioned shed no one said I'm not talking about a sh I'm talking about you mentioned that there's 5 Ines between your property for your fences that's what's required here in oldd to be off your property line you took your driveway straight to the property line so if you knew your fence had to be 5 in off the property line you would have had to I would assume think I should get a permit and see what I didn't say that I knew that I needed 5 in for my fence the fence that I have was removed and was replaced exactly so what I'm saying is that from where my driveway ends to where L house starts there's about 5 Ines and then his driveway starts I put gravel little white rocks to make it look nice I'm not saying it doesn't look good no what I'm saying is that that's what's left it's not directly on it to where you can you can differentiate between us from where my property ends in his okay but my point being the fence was done right the driveway wasn't correct and now we understand that's why we're here okay okay name is on this side ladies M Andrews yeah I just want to know the one that was sorry the one that was done in the same neighborhood were they also at zero on on the property line uh I don't have those applications in front of me so I cannot confirm but I I I do not know at this time okay and the one that's coming up are they are zeroed would you know that I don't know at this time no I don't have those applications in front of me change okay I have another question to ask yes sir before this was done what you have there before what was there on the joint uh so we had like like the chairman mentioned that it's an older home so we had a a single drive a onear driveway so when we first B we had T right yeah it's a it's asphalt like the black top so then we had uh all grass on the left side just grass so did you know the measurements that t the actual because I would think that when they decide to change it they do exactly what you have laid out the same way yeah and well that's what sort of we did except we sort of we doubled it so basically what we wanted to do uh since we have so many cars and having all of them in the street at least this way my wife and I both get to park in the driveway um and then at least the girls can just park in the street cuz already um one of my daughter's cars got hit um someone hit it ran off and we figured it out but so there's always a chance of that stuff so we just wanted to make it uh a little more comfortable for us and of course make it look nicer so um we didn't we didn't realize that we were going to have these issues so uh yeah by doubling the driveway it's the same too it's black top yeah we just did ask for what happened to the storm drain that used to be out there along the curb line is yeah so it doesn't interfere no sir no we didn't do anything to the to the to the curb or the apron or anything like that all right um I have to go to a public portion and I know you have someone that's going to speak on your behalf thanks uh this is uh locations 214 Cindy Street 69- 2023 Z someone want to speak on this matter you come forward sir you can bring him with you hi uh neighbor at 2116 hold on one second sure yeah sorry uh Sor can you say your name sorry uh L G qualia it's q u a g l i a q u e a g l i a a g okay and Louie you said Luigi yes Luigi sorry uh neighbor uh what's your address 216 the direct neighbor okay okay do Pon sare the truth of the testimony you brought provide yes sir thank you sir what does you want to tell us Mr uh uh well uh it was um like they said uh if I looked at his house you're to the left to the left yeah actually the only house that you see against his um U many of our neighbors have the exact same driveway um he and uh Miss Grace are saying the exact right things um tonight is the perfect case of why they needed to do the work I mean they can take their cars off the street put it in the driveway they don't have to worry about the plows or anything coming around and you know keep safe keep everybody off the roads everything um I'm right there they asked me made sure we were okay everything was fine um we've had stuff done we always clear everything with each other make sure stuff is up to par uh we want to make sure that everybody in the community is happy with everything that anybody does all the time um we all talk about our Lawns our bushes every every every little thing that we have uh trees things I mean at one point uh we had the council clear a little free library for my wife everybody in the neighborhood was for it everybody's together so if anything everybody backs this I don't know who would complain about it but um it's clearly happened and it's a shame yeah and it is a nice neighborhood and uh people do care for their homes and it makes the community stronger when you do uh interact with each other the problem is it sits right on the lot line there's no differentiate from one to the other so that's where the problem comes in had it been another foot over he'd be here for a variance relief for 4 foot but it wouldn't be on it would still be on his property this is the issue that we're faced zero so it's your lot and his lot correct would he have a problem selling his home I guess it's depends on how you look at that but it's it's the good point you see but I mean I would I would argue that whoever comes in to um see the house would obviously see that this work is already done and it's already there so I know I know you don't want it to snowball and I I completely understand but at the same time I mean somebody somebody would see that this is already pre-existing most people wouldn't read the survey title company will understood does it provide any is there any uh drainage or any issues uh on your side uh do they is it topographically is it flat does it I know notice obviously there was a storm drain there's no issues with the storm drain there whatsoever um is there uh when it borers your side it borers a grass on your side correct it's not asphalt it's not a joining asphalt it's actually yeah it's driveway um down to the driveway meets driveway so to speak um actually driveway meets uh rock wall because um the the same company did not do a great job many many years ago but uh uh we preted it up for for them so is there any other border between obviously there's no setback is there any other border between your properties any demarcation behind it no yeah I mean there's a there's a small strip of uh like um I guess it's paperstone at this point you have paperstone a little higher than his so there wouldn't be any water going ours is a little bit higher yeah if anything they they were the ones that yeah but um that's your paper so it's not like an inter it's not like a you know demarcating yeah no it's not and honestly that's just because it was a slope and uh we just wanted to Prett it up for them okay any questions on your end that you might have for uh no I'm good chairman thank you question go ahead um Daniel just a quick question um so I just lost my train of thought great um with the setback was it changed in 2019 so prior to what me and the old Damian Gil used to use was anything prior to 2016 um when Damien had started working for orridge in 2016 and there was never a requirement for a permit for a driveway um so he implemented that when he had started here and we've always used the date January 1st 2016 anything that to present requires a permit for a driveway anything prior to 2016 there was no require for a permit for a driveway okay thank you I want that on the record okay there is basically there is now though there is now yeah post 16 correct yes all right uh anything else you want to tell us sir nope all right thank you for uh your appearance Mr cheny we just come to the the problem is is the zero and um I'm trying to think the last one we had and we made a move at a foot if I'm not mistaken um it was on the lot y y and we asked them to cut a foot off so it's not on the property line that might be your easiest remedy I don't what's the base did you do a whole base with it like a cinder and or stone P outline so like with pavers I mean the P could be removed that line of pavers well well it so I don't know that the board would agree to one foot but I we've done that before where somebody had encroached to the point where it was creating a water problem now in this case that's not you I'm just talking about a case that had come before us where they were literally on the lot line and the water was going on to the other person's property that's where the complaint came from that's not the situation here the neighbor was would agreed that if it was at least a foot off it would and we call it we caned it where the they had it caned so no water went on the other person's uh yeah over here they've kind of raised the potential of something is as like a curbing or something like that on a one foot curbing with this if you look at this picture you can see that this is actually better uh this uh for those watching on TV we're looking at actual photo from uh from the property you see have the yeah so there's a what if they were to build up where it was almost like I won't say a retaining wall not quite that high but what if that was does the end of the property line over here yes okay it's over here so if they built that up they would then be within they move the pavers in if they move the pavers in right on top what are they the Sixers or twelves um think that Sixers six I think they six by six words this way they wouldn't have to cut but they would no they wouldn't have to cut but they would R they would be they could put it over and then just put soil back in they' be within the survey so that wouldn't be a problem it's as right yeah it's as so the papers the papers could be papers could be moved right and the asol could actually be cut because my brother-in-law gets it I don't think he's even have he wouldn't he could probably put the papers on top of the as every two right right but that's not for us to decide no I'm making a suggestion no I to make it uniform I know they probably want it uniform flat you could actually if it was concrete different story you R as's very easy yeah but asphal you could cut right through it with that they use a hot tool my brother-in-law did it the line if the if the board were to conditionally approve it if you move the pavers over so you're not you're no longer on the lot line would you would you be would you considered doing that I mean no no yeah it's going to wind up being you at a foot line what about ordinance the ordinance is the ordinance is five I know that trying to I'm trying to get them some relief they get a a variant try not to beat them up I mean it's it's it's properly done it looks beautiful but unfortunately you're on zero you're on you're zero so you're you're sharing a lot line and do need to keep in mind if one has been granted before and similar similarly situated and for similar construction that you know that is certainly something that favors granting it just because you have already set that precedent and does open you know the board to certain the ordinance is that something we should consider then if we're going to be approving these for a foot now I don't think we're approving them for a foot that's what you're doing it's still five and I'm I'm thinking that is it Leon's that's Leon can you turn your mic on go ahead you can repeat it go ahead you can repeat it it didn't go yeah what I'm saying is the ordinance is for five I understand that but as these applicants come are we going to then go okay well we'll do it for a foot if you can come back I mean is that something we're going to be faced with as we all know each and every application is based on its own Merit this neighborhood is filled with this same type of environment and whoever suggested this applicant that come here tonight might do the same for another that might happen but again each a is decided and judged on its own uh I just want to know because um Daniel said that there are quite a few in this particular neighborhood how did it come about that they were I don't know that there are many many many homes in there have doubled the size of their driveways I don't know that they're on the lot line that's what that's what I'm saying right and I don't know the property I don't know what what year it was done that's our issue if it was done before 201 yeah that's what the incomes but now it's not and certainly we don't expect you to provide that testimony wether you know we're not as answer asking you to answer those questions Daniel one more question with him being right on the property line and everything else where's this sore Line run I'm sorry ask where s line runs yeah I'm I'm not sure and I don't think it's Marc on the survey I'm kind of curious is the driveway on the seore line too I'm not I'm not sure I I would I would assume if there was a sewer line there there would be a sewer line easement um which I don't see on his survey but um I I'm I I'm not sure if there's a sewer line under there or not I'm sorry it's just a fair question it would probably be not well it wouldn't be that far over the house ends where the single Drive was so the sewer line wouldn't be out that far it probably runs somewhere probably runs that side of the house is a concrete slab yeah it probably runs your other side slab on that side I just want to know no no I'm just I'm just letting you it wouldn't it wouldn't be out here cut um that wouldn't be good we're at we're at a a point here where what I suspect sir is that there's mixed emotion on the board and you may or may not get a favorable vote so I'll give you a couple choices one you could reconfigure this thing and come back uh two you could agree to something conditional if the board wants to agree to have you move off the lot line uh where we have granted that hardship before uh to move it back size of the paper I guess is six it's probably probably should be cut at one foot where I think we could come to an agreement I think but I'm not Prosecuting this application you're Prosecuting you're telling us what it is so I don't get to make that decision I'm merely throwing it out there it's something you might want to think about and you don't have to think about it tonight if you don't want to if you want to go and seek some advice you could do that and I'll give you a continuance we'll take no vote but if you take a vote now um and you lose you're going to wind up have going to comply with 5 foot so again I don't know that the board would agree they have before we have done it um and it's in recent history it's only within the last couple years so why don't you I don't want to force you to make a decision you could get back on the calendar again so you don't have to you're not pushed into a corner I mean we'd like to keep it the way it is I don't think that's going to happen understand that's a problem so so um if if we take a vote now and so what are my options moving it 5 in from where it is now well one foot just one whole foot one foot off the property line I mean I I don't have a choice well you do doesn't feel like I'm being left with a choice so we well you're remove the papers I mean it's already down I mean I I really don't I so I mean this is the first project we've done to the outside of the house since we've moved into the neighborhood um and it was you know a labor of love like it was money set aside that we specifically wanted to get this work done so you know it's cost me almost 850 just to do this whole process and it's very financially taxing so completely understood man but what I'm trying to say is the board's here to try to help I understand and and I can't we cannot do what we can't do no I get it but whatever option we have it's still money that we don't have so we will do whatever we need to do but it's disheartening that we have to go through this when all I wanted to do was make the house look beautiful and make the gar like it makes no sense zero sense I understand your frustration but the point is we can't Grant something that we're not allowed to Grant you're on the lot line I um um we just had a similar situation not with a driveway but people did improvements to their home probably a few hundred, worth they were on somebody else's line and they put a fence over on their property we can't Grant relief from that we didn't do it and we can't tell somebody it's now legal when it's not legal the board attorney will will will back me to We Can't approve something that is not yeah yeah you said it precisely like that it's and it's you know I don't want to rehash things because I know we we've got into you know a cycle kind of rehashing things and it's there's kind of the options and you might find it best serve to have this carried and maybe in the meantime you are able to uh maybe figure out what it might cost have that done maybe you can do it yourself I don't know I don't know how handy you are I rather let's just yeah let's just we'll take the vote now and then we'll just deal what what I what I'm suggesting what I'm suggesting here is that you probably have a dissenting vote and you may have a dissenting vote at one foot why don't you come back get a plan together think about what you're going to do find out I don't want to want you to make a hastily decision if you make me call for a vote now I fear that that you're not going to get an approval I'm telling you from my experience sitting in the board I appreciate it so that would be my suggestion I don't think I'm overstepping my my boundaries uh no I I think there you know I think you can feel the temperature in the room there's hesitation with ramifications of you know of granting several ones and so I trying to set you best up for Success potential success without pinning yourselves into a you know a a quick m potentially rash decision that might undo uh you know something that you have spent your hard earned money on okay and we understand that a you know a contractor you know so told you certain things and you know by all means you have your own recourse against that contractor uh by by no means you know certainly I think we hear this all the time that you know contractor came in and someone comes in says contractor didn't tell me this or contractor said the permit were all good and they they weren't or you know so on so forth uh you certainly have your own recourse against that contractor as potentially might uh several of your neighbors uh but that's going off topic so I'll let you yeah uh again I I don't want to back you into a corner and uh but I'm I'm trying to look out for your best interest and I think everybody uh shares that sentiment or at least I would think all the board members share that sentiment uh and it's getting emotional right now for you so my suggestion was we we reschedule for for another meeting okay it'll give you time to to think take pause and uh rationally work this out one way or another okay problem Moren could we have a a date February 15th I understand but why we're coming so it's not gonna cost it's not goingon to cost you anything more to come back ma'am we're gonna take a break and then we're going to come back and do what is the driveway going to look different are you going to take the p this is the things that you can decide upon in privacy on your own this this month gives you the time to decide whether you're going to do that or not or you know you come come back next month and we can go from there but this gives you the time to you know take a breath and a step back and figure out what works best for you knowing what you have heard and seen here tonight is H the other homes that had the driveways done with the same company I mean I'm just curious because I haven't from the driveways all look the same it doesn't appear like they're changing anything and their driveways are look like they're at this the same as ours so I'm just curious like no one's no one's picking on you no no no no it's not a matter of us being picked on but I don't know that I don't know the surveys I don't know whether those are on the lot line yours is on the lot line okay I can't approve something that's there gotcha okay probably if you were six foot off the L plot line you'd be a lot in a lot better shape but because we can't approve something like that it's just we can't do it um so the next steps are what do we reschedule or what do have you'll have some time to figure out figure out a plan of what you may want to do okay okay and it's only February 15th so it's not that far off got and if we move move the pavers there that are um why don't you why don't you why don't you make a plan my suggestion would be this you can do anything you want it's your application my suggestion would be go home think about this rationally take some measurements do what you think you can probably do least expensive don't do anything come back don't spend a dime come back doesn't cost you anything except coming out for a couple hours on another night talk to the board tell them what your your plan is we you may have a completely a different uh attitude and say okay you're off the lot line maybe people say okay fine it looks nice you did a nice job uh you got misinformation but we can't do something that's not legal we get it we get it because we'd be wrong right we didn't know no I understand sir and most people don't that's what you should do is set up a meeting with the zoning board officer to say this is what we want to do so make sure you he could definitely definitely going to need some help because we really that's the guy you can talk to him in that one mon the guy to I'm here Monday through Friday 7: to3 come see me anytime right so do that come you know y think about it and then talk to him and can help you you with a game plan that's G to work okay sounds and the board would be favorable to give you extended time it's not like okay we want it done in two months you know right okay all right all right we think we think that might be the best for you okay so we're going to continue this matter uh this is 69- 2023 Z the locations 214 Cindy Street this matter is been going to be continued to February 15th no further notice thank you for appearing all right board members final uh application for the evening 74223 z uh Mel uh libben I believe Zone r21 Winchester Court see variance for deck applicant proposes 24 by9 by 16 by 9 by4 composite deck 18 feet approximately from the property line we're 23 is required sir please come up and I hope I pron uh livon you could say easily Mike and Le livon libon okay once again the board board attorney will SAR both of you in yes all right uh Mr libben uh sorry Mr livon I can raise your right hand do you somly swear as to the truth of the testimony that you're about to provide thank you and Miss Lian can you raise your right hand thank you do you solemnly swear as to the truth of the testimony about for which you're about to provide I do thank you uh you're the last ones you've heard the the uh routine before so uh yeah actually gave me a chance to observe and actually I learned a lot it's an interesting process it's uh it is it is uh and you obviously a quick learner but uh in your own words sir please tell us uh what's going on at your house and what you want to do so the whole project started about roughly 11 months to 12 months ago all of a sudden we found out we our family uh become a little bigger not my wife uh she become a grand grandmother uh so two we understood that two months ago uh we have granddaughter so what's interesting my mom who's still alive 92 years old she says to me are you planning to move anywhere I said no she says why don't you fix a house build a pool and kids and grandchildren come to you and that's exactly what we start uh start doing um so probably say about nine months ago we did completely um we fix our house uh the outside of the house sightings and uh yeah so liting and everything right so everything come we hired I heard some high high story before they were all large and very wellknown companies so sighting was done pool is on the way in also by a very reputable company uh the paper Stones also will be done by a pretty large uh uh pretty large um rapable company and the deck which we are trying to build will be reconfigured so you could go down directly towards the pool and the deck will be done uh composite instead of wood which is about 27 years old we we've been living in this house for 27 years so we're not moving and um family is getting larger so the deck right now that we have it's a deck but it's more like a balcony you can't really put a decent size table there so was manufacturing was basically creating the excuse me I don't mean it kind of more but I don't think we sworn them in I did oh you did sworn in yep oh okay I'm sorry I just missed that okay sorry yeah so so basically that's what our goal okay building okay deck anything you want to say now ma'am not yet well it's admirable that you want to take care of your family and and it's a great thing as you age in your you're able to do that so you want to do it on your own property Mr Holland uh looks like an irregular siiz lot huh or shaped you should say uh yeah chairman so yes the uh the app's here tonight seeking one C variants for a uh 24t 9 in by 16t uh by 9t 4 in in height composite deck uh which is proposed 18 ft from the rear yard property line uh where 23 ft minimum is required um although this uh property is located in the R20 Zone uh which for decks required just a 10-ft setback uh this development was was built under alternate design standards so R9 standards are used um and then anything in the R9 um to setback all depends on the height of the deck so uh this is one of those where if we if it wasn't built under an alternate design standard the appan wouldn't be here tonight um but because of the standards that are used for for this particular development um they do require some setback relief due to the um the rear yard set back of the deck you did you work on other ones with uh with Mr gil on these where the this is is this an HOA in there I don't believe so no uh right behind me it's always there's an there's an asement and wood right uh where we had the same situation wouldn't apply if it was in it was the The Zone was treated different than the the requirements are treated then correct this is one of those private Court developments yep right okay uh I don't know if most of you remember we had someone overfilled pavers uh on on that and it would have been fine except it was in a different uh the the requirements are different for that area and they and they wouldn't be he wouldn't be here tonight if it was different right now this is not my L right no no no no we have yours up here I'm looking at I'm looking at it on a computer over here yeah I'll go to I'll go to my left and uh for questions on this because we're in a GAC and it's like aie anything on my left no do do you see the survey okay the tech is behind the house if you're looking from the street yeah you don't see it at all behind the house so because it's a k can we right and smack in the middle of it uh the neighbor on the right you can't really see them from the back and there's a slope because we have a walk out basement so the deck is on actually on the second floor so that requires a really um steep stairc to go down a little curvature into the backyard um no I don't not really okay anything else on my left Jack is on the second floor that's the thing yeah so so the pool company also will uh they already they in the process of doing it they got all permits they're doing uh what is it water um uh drainage water drainage in the in the back of the property unfortunately as you probably know most of the bridge is uh clay and it's always created a problem we never had any flooding in our area so in 27 years we never had any flood at all the only issue you're in front of us for is the fact that you because the decet and because you wouldn't be here but the way they judge the setback is different so you're 5 foot short of what it should be but it would be if it were I I don't understand it sounds a little confusing but uh I'll go on my right questions oh I'm sorry no problem Daniel you said because of the height of the deck Craig yes so in this the standards that we use for this property specifically the setback depends on the height so he higher the deck goes the more the setback increases how much height is it over where it would have qualified I I want to say three feet cannot be any lower is the height the same as the existing one yes it's about 3 feet 3 and A2 ft thank you basically reconfiguration of this uh steps instead of going stair staircase it's going to go down directly towards the pool yeah okay thank that's yeah that's right M Cher No M Andrew basically you're just redoing the deck it's going to be all the same oh I got you um you're you're just replacing the deck that you have now it's all everything is the same so the wood will be replaced with the composed material and then you're moving to how you're going down it's going to be a different configuration configuration of the steps going to go that way but the deck will be slightly larger by I would say maybe 3 ft but it's like a width it's a width not but not a height correct not the height the height is the same yes height is the same the Height's the same because it has to be at the level of the door of the door so the Height's the same you cannot change it right okay there's a door here and the door on the bottom Miss test already anything no good okay chairman if I if you don't mind um I I did the applean actually came into my office today um I think I'd like to for him to tfy record there's a frame shed if you look at the survey on the bottom left that's located about 11 1/2 ft off of the property um is that yours correct yeah Mr liin if you just want to testify and what your plans are with that shed to the board yes so uh so that shed originally the question was arised arised with that company and with the Hardscape company um they both agreed to either relocate the shed shed towards my property but up up the inspection of that shed which is about 20 years old they said you better off just completely remove that shed from the property and that's exactly what we intend to do okay so you go on the record that that's going to be gone that's correct okay and if you're going to replace it make sure you're checking with the zoning officer as to where you can put it so just for my notes here it is located technically off the property it's 15t or 15t is that uh it's 11 and2 ft okay yep yeah that shut will be completely removed okay one more thing uh chairman mentioned ho HOA what was it you're not under an HOA you don't live in an HOA do you yes oh you do so don't we have to have Owners Association yes okay they receive they receive the notice as well they have no objection uh otherwise okay if you could get something from them in writing that you can file with the record that they have no objection because did you get permission for the pool yes everything is filed correct no from the oh from the HOA no what development are you in uh y minor okay so is there an HOA in there yes still it cost me $200 a year that's what I'm paying okay yeah it's an HOA y um but I hope you're paying less do you do uh do they maintain the property no not my property no only no removals private roadway right and and a park a little Park okay all right uh for the record sir if you would uh when you however you address them uh would you please uh inform them have have them right write a letter of no interest meaning they don't care the fact that you're demolishing that shed and the the fact that you're putting changing your deck over even though it was already there we just like to have that for the record so even though uh the the certified letter was sent to them that's you sent a certified letter to them it's part of the noticing and there was no response no response I'd have to ask a legal uh I mean it's a legal decision I can't there a 22 letters were sent out it's on record I mean the board is certainly within the power to obviously request a a letter uh C certainly within their power I can't speak as to what the hoa's regulations might be I just I don't know the hoa's they you get a copy back that they received the letter uh I believe we have them in the office I don't have them with me yeah yeah I was made yes an attempt was made and okay certainly if the board wanted more on an approval they would be you know entitled to but I'm okay with it if the board is as long as the attempt was made yeah I don't have an issue with that all right and yeah just to clarify that letter for was for this application for the the deck okay uh just doesn't matter practice I would uh you know notify them regarding the pool or at least verify your regulations just to make sure you don't get any heat with them no no I mean I follow the instruction from the office and uh okay uh they walk me through the pro through through the whole project okay all right I have to go to a public portion on this matter fortunately for you you're the last application so you can turn around yeah there is no public very observant very good this is a matter at 11 Winchester Court at 74- 2023 Z this is uh for a deck uh that's going to require a c variance uh for setback anyone here have any concern that they wish to express to the board come come forward no one has entered the room no one's in the room I'll close the public portion any final comments sir no I better I already I spoke with love enough already uh you I assume you're going to ask me to uh take a vote yes please yes she's right my way uh board members this is a again this is a 5 foot difference here it's 23 foot it's 18 we're 23 required but because of the height uh it's judged differently so uh I think we've all been down this road with a few others few other applications in the same vein someone interested in moving this for approval for the C variant for the setback test Chevalier and test verie roll call please miss Andrews yes Miss Chevalier yes and thank you for doing it the correct way Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Mr tester yes chairman Sullivan yes you get a resolution by the next meeting make sure you have that before you do anything please check with the building department on all matters uh just so you don't run a foul you've heard other issues tonight I'm not here to uh no preach I'm merely just to advise no I learned my lesson a while ago back I don't do anything without the permit it's it's not worth it I wish you the best of luck and I wish you the best of luck having your family moov so just to make clear so I can't do anything see at list at least a month correct have you filed building permits for the deck yet yes you have okay when you get a copy the resolution from Marine's office bring one copy of that resolution back to the building department um as an update to your permit so that that gives me now authorization to approve it as a z officer okay is it going is it going to happen next month or how is it going to work the the resolution is going to be by the next meeting yeah right which is next month yes yes so we cannot do anything correct right February 15th I should have the resolution Mr scogna will sign but probably by the 16th I'll email it to you okay okay it might even be before sometimes they do come in early you don't want to use the pool in February anyway yeah it's a little cold all right thank you both for being here tonight thank you so much right St appreciate it Happy New Year Happy New Year to you my board members that was the last application the other one was moved uh general public comments there's no one else in the room so I think we can foro that anything from Council nothing on my end thank you and from the township nope thank you chairman well thank you for being here we welcome you uh look forward to doing business with you as it were thank you it gets tougher from here don't worry any comments on my left welcome sir uh Mr sing um I know you have to attend a class and Morin is that going to be scheduled for this month or next month I have a list to set sent him yeah this 27th of this month 29th I don't know if you can get him in on that early yeah February 29th and March 30th of the next three coming up so we'll we'll get that accomplished I think Mr Victoria has to go in so they can vote the better quicker the better and anything on my left board members we're still alive we're still live okay anything on my right no no sir okay a call for an adjournment test the ver test already all in favor I all right we stand a journ we'll see you next month everybody