they're talking to each other now tonight like to call this meeting of the prompton Lakes planning board to order following is the agenda for the regular meeting of the pompin Lakes planning board the meeting is to be held in the Municipal Building 25 lenux Avenue on Tuesday March 19 2024 beginning at 7:30 p.m. formal written advanced notice is required by njsa 10 10- excuse me 10 colon 4-1 at SEC has been provided of this meeting at least 48 hours in advance of today giving the time date location and to the extent known at the time the agenda of this meeting such notice stated that the formal action may or may not be taken the meeting will be video recorded and will be broadcast for later viewing for the public the notice was posted on the bulletin board outside of the offices of the municipal clerk reserved for this and other similar announcements provided to the Suburban Trends the newspaper designated by the council and the planning board to receive such notices and filed with the B clerk please stand for a pledge of allegiance I pledge of algian to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liy Justice for All okay there's um Regular meeting minute a roll call please okay uh Mr Simone here Mr F Cara here Mr tro here M Michael here Dr is abent Mr keing here Mr ular here Mr Balby here mik Sarah sorry and Council here thank you all first item is minutes I'm going to uh request that the minutes be postponed till next meeting I asked K to look into one section so um we'll just postpone them to the next meeting and then make a decision on then and it's for the application that's going to come next meeting anyway so it it'll be okay to do that uh under correspondence there are several items there's burrow Bloomingdale zoning Article 5 chapter 92 regulations governing certain uses section 9226 miscellaneous uses of the code of the buau of Bloomingdale these are all on file um in the office of Planning and Zoning legal notice ordinance number 11 2024 amending chapter 134 Land Development section 134-109 Environmental Protection review fees of the code of the township of Wayne another Wayne ordinance 12 2024 an ordinance to amend chapter 134 Land Development article 6 Environmental Protection of the code of Township of Wayne and there's a letter from Remington and Vernick Engineers regarding the freshwater wetlands and flood Hazard area permit application for hfield Park pedestrian bridge and for anyone that doesn't know about that that that is a project that the county will be undertaking to replace the bridge at herfield Park with a new type of um Arch or truss bridge and um to be followed at a later date for the bridge that's at the bottom of West Linux Avenue and we'll save this for [Music] later and that's the correspondence so the first item on the agenda tonight which is a carryover which was PB 2303 an application for 735 Hamburg Turnpike this is just notice to anyone that's paying attention here at the meeting was agreed to be carried over to April 16 2024 so anyone interested in the continuation of that hearing should tune in on the 16th of April there are no conceptual and we have a new business planning board 24-1 county of Pake Pompton Lakes recycling center 10 Ivy Street in the burrow and it's it's Capital review under section 31 of the land use law and I'm going to ask our attorney just to explain that for anyone who's not here that uh might be interested in the reason why this is being done and and what actually results from this meeting so Mr attorney if you could please do that thank you Mr chair yep um this is one of the the uh different functions that planning board has um called Capital review under section 31 when there is a governmental entity um that is going to be undertaking a essentially a land use project on the in the expenditure of funds in the municipality those have to get those get referred to uh the planning board for your your review um in conjunction with the master plan and typically any other topics um that you deem relevant this is not an application you do not give them approval but they uh are required to submit this uh you have a hearing on it and you uh can provide as I said provide comments on consistency or conjunction with the master plan and other land use concerns and they uh then they're then they go on their way so that's where we are as I said there's no vote uh it is a hearing but not an application um so Witnesses typically gets warn in MH gentlemen thank you for coming to our meeting and presenting tonight if you take the end chair just uncouples it or take this one right here and you can slide it over well s been is it okay uh good evening everybody my name is Kevin Bloom assistant County Council for p County I'm here with Ken Simpson supervisor roads for p County and nordon Murphy assisant County engineer both you gentem raise your hands please state your name and spell your last K Simpson s i m p s o n n Murphy it's n o r d n m u r p h y do you swear or affirm the testimony you'll give this evening before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth to help you got okay proceed yes you'll be impressed just by this that's progress that's progress just need to brighten these two up and we're golden I'm not touching it good job mayor good evening everyone U once again my name is kenth Simpson I'm the supervisor of roads i' like the day-to-day management of the road department and I'm also the lead project manager for this particular project uh we are very happy uh a county to present this project to you this evening uh we put a lot of thought into uh the design and layout um and we've worked very closely with your DPW director um Dan for whove been very instrumental and giving us guidance on on this particular plan so what we have on on the screen is our site plan I just like to go over a few uh key points of the of the layout uh what we're proposing is uh a new Sal sword building uh the building had a capacity of about 2,000 tons and we will be sharing uh this building with the municipality uh we're also uh sharing the site with your recycling center uh We've uh made several uh visits to the recycling center watched it in operation um at different times of the day uh and we saw where there could be um some several improvements uh one of those improvements which you see on the screen is the the traffic flow so if I can I would like to just go over the access points and how we're going to flow and how we're going to share share the site uh so all vehicle traffic will come off of Ivy Street uh the recycling center would be the far right driveway uh that will that driveway will be for Public Access only uh the driveway to the left will be going into the salt storage property uh that will be restricted to uh the municipal and the county snow operation only when a motorist or a resident comes in to do their um do their recycling they would come down the driveway be met with the existing uh uh welcoming shed um and then they can easily just uh pull over to the side drop off their recyclables and work their way down towards the site uh we decided uh with Dan to reconfigure uh the concrete pad where the the waste of bins are uh so that we can create just one continuous movement for the residents where they would just drive down that driveway stop in front of a bin easily drop off their stuff and continue out onto Laurel Street we felt this plan would work uh work well for the municipality because it stops uh residents from returning and leaving Grove Street and going to an inter un signalized intersection uh now they can uh drive up to Laurel um and it's a better a traffic movement and flow for the entire area we also proposing a warming shelter on the site uh which is also going to be shared with um our staff and the municipality during the winter uh winter operation so that guys can you know take a break um we're going to have a porter John style uh bathroom in in war um and there also be some um HVAC uh wall Mountain units to keep it to keep it warm also on the site we're proposing four parking spaces those parking spaces are specifically for the snow plows um they also have um electric Outlets next to each one of the uh parking spaces with an engine block here so that we can store our vehicles um uh overnight in the coal in the coal elements we're also proposing some vegetation uh to try to screen some of the uh the waist bins away from the new uh veteran housing just so uh the the seniors and the veterans don't really have to look at uh bins they can look at some some some nice green vegetation and we're also proposing to add some uh some trees around our site just to kind of give it a warm welcom feeling there will be uh new curvs and sidewalks around the entire perimeter of the site we are proposing to put a a fence around the entire site also with privacy slacks so that uh our equipment this's equipment is kind of out of the view of of of of of the traffic that Str we are proposing some lighting on the site so that um it's the aage well lit during the winter operation especially at night um uh I don't believe the recycling hours is open uh after 5:00 so the lighting really be for the operation the the snow operation um as you can see on the site there is also a a a fence going across the site um this is a rolling gate and this gate will stay closed uh uh this go this gate will stay closed when we're not having a snow operation so that way the public can't in can't enter the site by the state um and all the keys and everything will all be shared with ipity on will where it's a county project but we know and anticipate that the municipality will use the site probably 90% of the time and Us in 10% so that's all oneway traffic starting up at Grove and going right through the site and coming back out on Laura and that applies to the Salt Vehicles as well yes they will come enter uh iy Street also uh they will Lo the Dome and then they continue their way out onto your own Flor and just for the record purposes the the development of the uh housing site is south of that on the piece of property that's below at the bottom of the drawing it's immediately adjac right just so anyone that's looking at this video can see that that's where the site is and our sidewalks will connect so you can take the sidewalk straight from the veteran housing all the way up to IV so we do have um we we received the engineering uh report uh I did want to go over a few of Cs hopefully I addressed it in my um explanation of the site uh we are proposing an A fense on that's for uh to provide privacy screening for this type of for this type of site we feel a uh a shorter a shorter fence might not not serve as per purposes for security reasons is the 8 foot because you're concerned about security or appearance uh both uh mainly security we want to make sure that uh people can't easily just jump and hop over the fence um but also we want to make sure that the site looks neat in uniform uh to our knowledge there are no existing agreements uh as far as uh the municipality um utilizing the County's uh um property uh but I think in the last several months we've rectified all the agreements now form as I mentioned um the the access driveways are are split uh it's the recycling uh driveway that interest is for the public and then the snow operation driveway and everything will be clearly labeled in signage um that will be restricted to uh just uh County Municipal Employees only one other question since the main reason for using the county side is salt accessibility those Gates I would assume normally will be closed on both ends yes during non and that typically they wouldn't need them during the day say on a spring day or a winter day that's not snowing or anything so the traffic through there if you will would be really dependent upon the winter weather yes okay so during some winter event are the gates just going to be open somebody's going to go there and open them or is there going to be electronic tags or something like that that's going to open them as a vehicle comes in to access the site uh someone will be there uh to open them and just to give you some context uh the county anticipates no more than three vehicles coming out of your site for our entire operation um this will serve like our middle County region um so we won we we won't be more than three vehicles okay no I was just wondering like I know you guys try to get ahead of the storm but I just want to make sure that if we're going to be depending on that site for our salt it'll be open and accessible for the municipality you know it's not going to be like well Joe didn't show up with the key today so the gates locked and can't get in the municipality have their own set of keys and you come and go as you please we don't dictate the movements of when you go because you may order salt out all time that we not ordering salt so it would be clearly up to you the municipality how they operate and it's being addressed there is an easement agreement it's being generated and developed between the county and the town that will spell out the responsibilities and access for that as well okay so I hear we're going to have different color salt so we know who's the no we we've U we worked well U sharing the the previous salt don't yes we did it hasn't been any issues in the years i' I've been uh so moving along U with the uh some of the uh drainage comments [Music] um so we're proposing uh to connect our drainage system with the new Housing Development draining drainage system um so all we're basically doing is taking our water and tying it into their calculations and their um in their system however if the board does need to see our storm water calculations we can provide provide that to you they they will be providing with the pending site for the veterans housing project yes I just want to explain to everybody so they're doing what what the attorney mentioned now but the Housing Authority has to do a full presentation to uh the Redevelopment AGC because it's not a county project it's not going to get the same respect that's happening here for the county now because it's an independent owner so just everybody understand this is a CA project the other piece is not yes so that that will get a Redevelopment uh presentation that happening on Thursday and then they're also required to get planning board approval um for the site plan MH also we do we are proposing the lighting plan um that was one of the comments um and also the hours of operation um that would be up to the recycl Center uh and our snow operation um is basically from uh I would estimate December 1st to March 31st right as needed yeah as needed as needed during this project while it's being constructed will there be a time that the recycling center will not be available to the residents we do plan to work with Dan very closely uh right before we start the construction and during the construction so that we can try to minimize as much of the impact to the residents as possible um I do an ipate some minor inconveniences uh but we would have to kind of work through that maybe stage uh some of the B certain areas um but we hope that to create too much of a a disturbance for residents um even notifications we're going to make sure we working with Dan so we can get that out to the to the residents thank you I noticed there's grading changes being proposed some are on the substantial side um where the dump dumpsters are located for the various materials to be recycled is that at grade below grade or how was that set up because I've heard varying comments about having an elevated platform to a above ground unit versus a walk into a depressed unit and I was wondering if any discussion took place about that yes uh we tried to minimize any tripping hazards uh or any type of ada8 issues that might occur with the Curve so the concrete slab is flush ISP so the dumpsters are still going to be four feet high or whatever so will it be a platform to be able to some people can't lift over 4 feet that's not part of our project that's something that's required by the town maybe we can have a subsequent discussion with your with your department of public work I'd like to have that looked into maybe Dan and you could work that out because you know somebody's not you it's okay if it's a small amount of of material but cardboard gets heavy you know maybe they have a large container of of plastics even though it's Plastics they still can get heavy and by quite honestly some people just don't have that upper arm strength to dump it in so I want to make sure that people can take advantage of that is there any preferred alignment that would help that like is it better to with the grading to lower the inut put them in at an angle or something w't work with Gres because you have to remember you have to have the the trucks come in to drop them off and pick them up and it's already a significant slope coming down to the dumpsters if we were to drop them further it would be much steeper and much more difficult you don't have the topography to make it work so I've talked to Dan about it what we have now and you're all familiar with what we have it'll stay pretty similar to what we have we'll have some elevated areas on the heavier stuff and lighter stuff it would just be toss it like the card Ro would stay the same way it is right now beond pad just thr machine and more away we are going to have on the heavier stuff still go upstairs if you want okay does the board have any other question yeah you know I'm just looking at the uh you want to go back no I can see from here the containers so the way of containers what you got six or six or seven of them there yeah so just from what I'm I'm eyeballing it it doesn't look like there's room for stair the way it's set up now everyone right not everyone will have it you know but it doesn't even look close yeah it looks like you're going to have to take a container out of there to actually fit those steers in there I think you have two sets of them in there now and I'm going to say at least one container you're only going to be able to put five containers there if you're going to have the same one go right you know stairs can one of those containers I don't even know it doesn't even look like there's room for that to be honest with you really doesn't something have to can that be spread out where you move the eastern most container further to the right and then you SPAC them a little bit not at this time part of the reason that corner is no longer has options D is requiring that area has to be cleared right so where they're sitting now is is really going to be open well there might be steps in the front I don't know how D plans it it might be on the front of each uh no but what he saying is the containers can't go into that corner the far corner there not as part of this right where they're sitting now B basically um probably for the stream and cro and that'll be a concrete pad that they're all sitting on correct and the drainage from that it all gets directed down into the future detention system to be located within the Veteran's housing project just about where that cursor is and will be a surface detention basically okay Tim did you have something yeah so the way the dumpsters come in they come in you know top left to bottom right you know on that angle um is there going to be space in the back of the dumpsters that you could potentially have some sort of like a 4ft walkway or 3ot elevated walkway so if somebody climbed a set of stairs at either end could get to that third dumpster in the middle and dump something into it uh to answer your question I left that to the municipality I didn't want to control your operation or make adjustments so I just worked with Dan on basically figuring out how many of the waste bins you needed and how we could fit it within the the footprint that we were we were given um but I didn't want to make those decisions for the municipalities at all okay but I'm just saying that potentially there could be room for aot honestly we have six if he Dan Fields is in need only having five you can configure this to to your point there is a little bit of room between the property line and the dpst possibly provide some type of passageway if there's a desire for that we would ask the town to come up with what they would like to see we wouldn't necessarily construct it but we could adjust our plan to provide the space okay CU a set of stairs at either end and then the connecting walkway not ideal if you're going to be lugging stuff up the stairs but you're going to be climbing the stairs to put the stuff in the dumpster so the the um the cardboard compactor and all that's going to stay basically where it is yes that's all right right here this area right here and the tire sheds and everything stay stays the same Tire shed stays the same everything stays the same battery and electronics is everything stays the same only thing that we're moving is those existing uh waist bins on along the the metal and stuff in the corner okay is any you didn't mention Paving what's paved and not paved uh all the gray is the paved portions and there's going to be sidewalks and curves and a driveway uh we did not have room in our budget to continue this Paving uh down the full length of the the drive that the um residents will be driving on but that's something that we could look for look at in the future it'll be just like Stone like exactly what it is now but we will pay for the first 20 okay so the um pl's quite small on there if you can zoom in between the paved area where the salt trucks will go and the existing location of the um battery storage and cardboard storage that area in the middle this area right below your uh imunity building what what what's in there right there this is the cell the existing cell phone uh Tower and infrastructure right here and that will remain the same in place won't be right okay so I just want to first of all I want to thank the county for putting the time into doing this because this is just part of a project that they're building that's going to benefit us ined doing the the Cy recycling center um when we started this discussion initially you know this wasn't part they didn't have to do this to make their building work through discussion we were able to make this happen so it was a partnership at that point to make our area better and also help them do what they need to do so yeah I think it's an improvement for everybody right now it's uh I think it's still appreciated that the UPC count towns will have the salt ched closer to us um I mean it was nice having the salt shed or salt dome but it was just terribly maintained from from old old buildings that uh when they were taken down everybody went like so thank you for that too and sure it was not a place that the guys look forward to [Applause] working um anything else on the letter from cers that you wanted to address and then I'll ask you if there's anything that you want to add to it not I'm okay um I just have a few things and just I'm sure the board all knows but just for total Clarity this was always anticipated as part of the senior housing Redevelopment plan um there they're they're doing what we envisioned them doing so um this is right um On Target my my primary comment would be um understanding that the fence needs to be 8 ft for security purposes primarily um have you considered beeping up the Landscaping kind of between the fence and the street to kind of give some aesthetic Improvement um along along those corridors yes we did um however we had to stay within a certain uh budgetary confinement so we felt that the uh the area where the the the new uh veterans housing part we felt that that was a critical point there to to to uh screen but to screen the entire uh site would be would be a bit much that's why we decided to put trees to kind of give that warm yeah feel me okay um we can also work with the municipality on the specific color of the Privacy slacks also so that uh we aren't saying uh green when you prefer basically who work with next okay um and just oh can you speak to the and and this may be a question for the lawyer the that paper Street and the use of that Street and where we're at with all of that so there are two paper streets are you referring to Locust or okay so Locust Street the paper Street you know extends further along you know past the the edge of the site um and so the uh burrow vacated that portion of Locust Street um sometime last year okay uh under the law what if a if a paper street is vacated the uh portion uh one half of the portion belongs to the northern Parcels one half belongs to the southern parcels and so um this um this operation is using the northern half of uh the vacated Locust but it is event it is essentially under the ownership of it it's part of that lot now is it not yes okay I just wanted I that's what I thought but I wanted the official official um and let's Mo on gr uh Grove Street is still a paper Street um and um we don't really have any intentions of um of changing that at that point uh the U the operation I believe um exist going basically down the the halfway mark of of Grove of the paper Street um it it does not uh go over to the Eastern side of the paper Street I believe got it um and last but not least are there any operational um steps to prevent salt sort of seeping into the into the water system into the into the um sewer pipes or ground water ground thank you storm water yes um we we are proposing an asphalt uh base inside of the Dome prevent any of it'll create a barrier basically it'll create a barrier yes okay that's all I have thank you any other board members have any questions John did um Mr oror did he submit anything approving this or in favor of it or the only thing we got was one uh let's see from the yeah and that's those were both in favor with just the went to County so he's he's actually you know they're bouncing off each other so he's are we've relied on him to do what he thinks is best for his men to work and for us for the town so the answer is yes he's in favor of he's favor of this 100% okay we we've had meetings with him for the design okay and the MUA has no issue and police department was just concerned about during the construction safety there's no grass in the well who who's responsible for the grass we are uh there's only the grass area is up in this [Music] area any other members from the board um I'll entertain any any comments we don't need open the public yes yeah open it for the public meeting if uh anyone here from the public wishes to speak seeing that there are none but close the public session um okay so you've heard some comments I mean first of all let me thank you for coming and thank you to the board of no not the board anymore it's now the Commissioners uh thank you to the Commissioners on behalf of our board for letting you guys come up here and explain things and giving us the opportunity to comment um we certainly obviously have no issues um the recommendations are almost ins significant you guys have put a lot of work into it to get to this point and I'm glad to hear of the communication that you've all had between your people and the Burrows people the mayor says you know they're happy from his end so I think it's a win-win um any other comments by anyone gentlemen do you have any other no okay then uh we don't have to do anything else except right do anything I'll work with you on getting you a letter that you we heard satisfi your section 31 obervation and that satisfactory from your aspect sure yes thank you great okay thank you for coming gentlemen I'm [Music] sorry um I have two more things on the agenda tonight first is with regret that I read the following letter from Mr edel I have been a member of the planning board since 2018 during this time I have been pleased to volunteer my judgment and consideration to the board in the undertaking of its business my wife and I will be moving out of Pompton Lakes at the end of this month and will no longer be residents of the burrow and as a result I tender my resignation as a board member I've have enjoyed my time on the planning board and been grateful for the opportunity to serve my community I wish you good fortune for for the future on behalf of the board I want to thank you very much for all of your comments you've been a very active member your comments are well received I think you've done very well for the community and U I would certainly say that it's been an asset to the burrow so thank you for your efforts and the time you spent it's coming up on six years now right yes yes yes with um the um the online version during the co period which was a uh uh interesting yeah an interesting experience for for all but we've learned from that and we've moved on I'm glad we're back in uh in physical capacity uh I think it does the the applicants and the public uh significant favor to have discussion and the public and you and I think the um the opportunities that you give for the public for public comments are very deserved and very welcome public thank you very much it's been a pleasure wish best good luck wish you the best and your next move and where you're going is what town Princeton Princeton we moving to Princeton on Saturday uh this coming Saturday our house completes the following uh following Monday I think and I'm sure you had no problem selling your exist it went like that honestly it really did yes yes and unfortunately for us and great for you well yeah yeah yeah I wish you the best in Princeton and if you decide to participate in any Municipal uh boards or anything there if you need a recommendation please let me know and thank you again for what you've done thank you very much oh business now H okay so the Redevelopment hearing from last month was interesting uh they heard a new proposal from Mr catrien regarding his properties which go back towards solar um products and they also um uh heard the initial and I it wasn't an application yet I guess from the county it was more of an introduction of what's going to happen with this property one of the things that came up at the Redevelopment hearing last month was there was concern about how the Redevelopment is improving is approving plans that may or may not be in agreement with the master plan and the Redevelopment and I'm going to ask Andy because Andy was at the meeting if you could just relate the two the ma the master plan is a is a document that provides a vision and the visiones it does not have any enforcement ability like the zoning ordinance does so the master plan which is the committee that we again approved for this year to move forward and a little more involvement now it's going to be tasked with looking at how the burrow of pump moves forward and in how it sees development taking place in a number of ways but the Redevelopment agency is is kind of a separate entity that doesn't necessarily have to abide by the master plan if I remember correctly no like to chop bite that take that a few bites okay um go ahead the Redevelopment plan which is the essentially the Zoning for redevelopment areas is a zoning is a zoning ordinance and it has to go to uh it gets passed as uh any other zoning ordinance first reading by the governing body comes to the planning board and there's there is a review on whether or not it's consistent with the master plan um there are two separate entities the zoning ordinance comes after the master plan the master plan and I'm I'm talking about the Redevelopment plan master plan we'll get on that separate so um the Redevelopment plan which is the Zoning for redevelopment area has to be consistent with the master plan if it is not consistent with the master plan and this board if this board ever found to be inconsistent with the master plan governing body could still adopt it but they'd have to put their reasons on the record and a few few other hurdles they could do it but that's I don't believe that's ever happened here where you found it to be inconsistent so the Redevelopment plans which is the Zoning for the Redevelopment areas have all been found to be consistent with the master plan the the application that is be the presentation actually just a presentation by uh for the conf Plaza that thir po project is is only that it is a presentation and at all of those meetings it has been specifically referenced that no matter what the Redevelopment agency does on designating them and and if you want to say approving that project it cannot go forward and it would have to be contingent on the governing body changing the Redevelopment plan it would have to change the height uh if that project was ever to go forward um because it it is significantly over the height they're not allowed to get a use they're not allowed to get a height variance more than 10% they can't go to the board adjustment it has to come to the planning board so there's but it couldn't do it so the any any belief that the Redevelopment agency is doing things that are inconsistent with the master plan I haven't seen that and that hasn't happened um because there are limits on what they can do they look at they review projects and determine on whether they are consistent and would be beneficial to the municipality consistent with the master plan consistent with the Redevelopment plan consistent with the other Redevelopment that's going on downtown and then designate them to allow them to come to this board to the planning board and again if it was something that was very high like was being discussed then there was a two- layer approval even the Redevelopment agency any approval and designation would come with a contingency before you could ever go to the planning board you'd have to go to the governing body and have a change so I hope that answers I think so and the reason I'm bringing it up a question oh go ahead I was watching it on channel 77 and what um one of the um Representatives said was that the master plan maybe Heights should be look at looked at and changed you know but um what I got from the contractor is that in their mind if this doesn't go forward with the height that they were going to build like three buildings they going to go back to the idea of the original plan I don't know if that's true I can answer that yeah so if you are correct if for some reason the governing body decides they don't want to do this motion they can still build with lower than five stories on the property they have now and not need any tools because they're within except the variances that they would need they they would need the Redevelopment agency yes to give approval because the the site plan application you go before this this board in order to go to the planning board you have to fill a checklist and in order to be complete and item number 19 is that if it's in a Redevelopment area they've been designated by the Redevelopment agency so they couldn't just go do it they still need approval from the Redevelopment agency to to do what you as you said whether you want to call that A Veiled Threat or hey we're going to do this we don't get they still need approvals several different appr and then from there they come here yep and they wouldn't need the council in between on that one you remember at Iron Forge when it was first built 100 years ago you know that needed a height requirement right that's where we got that height from is that that was the highest building at the time so anything below that height can theoretically get built in town by just going to your boards except if it's in a Redevelopment s like the attorney saying then the Redevelopment board would have to okay that but if if you take it as a threat or take it as a fallback or however you look at it um the the council does have the final say on the height to say yes or no to that he if they say no that doesn't mean the project goes away he just means he changes it to what fits within his realm that's what Happ everything's a balance now when you say five stories and and I don't know if if you know or if if Andy will answer this is it five stories from street level or five stories from the parking lot in the back which is conceivably a floor and a half to two floors lower talking about the back it's it's the height is a long monu I don't have in front of me but it's not it is not um measured from the parking lot back there it's from that walk from the street I I guess that the whole back of the place would be parking underneath anyway there's been different proposals their prop their current proposals they would you know the car propos there's been several different ones have several levels of garage parking in the back but but the things have changed so there's nothing set in stone or anything like that I think you know my take having heard this what come is that the height would be a huge change to the skyline of Pon Lakes it is of interest to a lot of people in pton Lakes it's being aired but it's something that has to go to the governing body I mean that that's just it's not going anywhere and and that's it's it may be a great change and that's up to the citizens of H Lake that's it's going nowhere until you know the current proposal until the governing body and the public say yes I guess the question that I was getting at like am Mar had comment that they said they'll build multiple buildings on the property so you know if they're going to build a building in the back where does that five stories count from now because it's a physically detached building that's not touching W qav is it five stories from the parking lot level building in the back would be a whole lot of I think there'd be a lot of difficulty because of the close close sh to the water that's going to be a big issue well the issue in the back would be remember every prop property owner owns the property individually to the back right so they if they build the cross property lines have to get to that property somehow and to do that you'd have to cross property lines theoretically somebody could put up a fence and say you're not crossing my property line that's why his project that he's presenting and I'm not saying it's good or bad but he has his own entrance and exit on his property to get into those properties if he has to rely on the outside coming in that's not going to work no one's going to give approval there's nothing here he did lower the height there's nothing here to deal with the only reason I'm bringing it up is because it was discussed at the Redevelopment and we're dealing with Master Plan update or actually redoing the master plan and so I'm going to ask the committee to when they do the master plan work yeah you'll be working with the planner and you'll our planner and you'll be working with um whatever other you well I don't know well Debbie or youan that me you okay so we'll we'll work with the planners and we will work with the town and try to come up with something that makes sense to present and have it asab has got to be approved by the burrow so um it's just a matter of when we're when we're looking at the master plan there's not so much we can change about the residential areas I mean they're pretty much set in stone we're really talking the the big corridors of Hamburg Turnpike possibly Ringwood Avenue and um and wav so um we've seen development so far of um one building that's built and uh that's the one on Lakeside 21 Lakeside and we've seen uh the one going up now from Meridian and so to give you guys a chance to review you know what those do to the town and what they don't I'm sorry mayor go ahead and and I think you just brought up a good point here we're all learning from this too right we're not experts on any of this and we've learned going back to your master plan question I had a meeting today the conceptual of developer and we learned that we have to put dog space into these buildings you know places for animals to to go because for I'll use Lakeside for an example uh there we didn't build that into the master plan or into that project so a lot of people are walking the dogs at the high school okay so now we spoke to that we spoke to that developer and he's going to build an area within his own property to to put some space for a dog area but I think that's something that would go into a master plan that as we move forward that would be as we as we go because you know everyone people have pets and we just didn't take that into account so we learn that that's something we learn yeah as long as they allow pets then you're absolutely right but see that's why it's going to take a long time to develop things have changed so much in the last 15 or 20 years that you know there's a lot that's going to be thought about and changed because you know you have the EV parking now EV parking has it's good and it's bad from the fire aspect it can be terrible uh having EV parking under the building would be a real I mean there was just a a recent fire where um the EV was under the in a garage right in uh Burton County was it mhm and they had a hell of a time putting it out because you just got to basically continuously pump water on it so you know having that under a building is not the best thing in the world concrete can fail so um you know but that's required now so there's going to be a lot of changes that are going to be adapted to our current Technologies and so you know I'm going to ask that you guys when you meet sit down and really give it a uh you know good thorough looking that you'll have guidance from Colliers as to what should and shouldn't be looked at and it's going to take a good year to year and a half just to get to the point where we can have a draft so and we rely on our boards we have excellent boards you know this being one of them we rely on on the recommendations that boards made you know you guys can say yes you can say no we want this change we want that change and and the council does look at that I mean we're not really the experts in that it's why we have boards is so you guys can do the Lend work on all this stuff um and so your your recommendations do goire any questions you guys have any um yes John so do we know the status of that project which one so it was a presentation to the Redevelopment but was it Con I think that they are reconsidering once again no application yeah there's no application pending I think that they got feedback my understanding is that they there's a general understanding that the ultimately in order to do what they currently like in the 10 or 11 or 12 stores whatever it is they would need governing body approval so I think there's been some discussion go there and see if they can get that and then still still come back to Redevelopment agency I don't know if that's been done yet I think there's been discussions but there it's all been conceptual they've changed it about three times they've come down in height there so I think they're just getting a feel from all the decision makers in town on how do what they want to do okay very good anyone else yeah it's conceptual you know and I just remind everybody with Meridian when they built that we probably saw 10 different conceptual plans before that actually became a plan so you know and this group is very anxious to go right away but it doesn't always work that they yes and you learn something from everyone you do you know that's another thing is you know the first one we did on Lakeside we found some things that we would change and Meridia had that plus do we have any update on cjm building yeah I actually got good updates so the reason I know what's going on at lak like the the building was sold to a new owner who made it his point to come and meet with the c May the administrator police chief the fire chief um all the department to say look whatever we need need to do to make things better you let me know we'll do it so it's a very active uh person you know because of Co there were some situations where we couldn't remove people out of that building because of uh rent control ideas he saw you removing some of the people that were causing some trouble the building is is working better he's going to make some big improvements to it he's already telling he's going to redo the whole lobby with tile and things like that so that's a new owner cjm building met with s two weeks ago to go over their plans they theyve gotten they're just about there for their final plan once they get their final plan they have 60 days to start building oh so that 60-day clock hasn't started it doesn't start till they get their plans but their plans are done so I he wants to build he's a rush to build he's he's not going to the door everything I thought the plans were approved for the previous owner you want to make some V changes right there were Chang some minor changes made that does that those minor changes don't trigger the having to go back to the Redevelopment agency what he needed to do know and in order that I think the technicality whether or not they're ready the C he get you get permits when you pay for them so sou can say yes they're ready but it doesn't start that day because he doesn't have permit that day when he comes in and pays pays the fees for it that's when the cost starts down he's telling me he hopes to have it finished by October finish you hopefully we all know it's an iour sooner we get it done the better okay I'm just getting concerned because it was like oh two more weeks two more weeks two more weeks and here we are people are asking well time to get he said got to do what he got to do okay you know look at the you know CGM was quiet and everybody was yelling me look they're not doing anything they're already built two two stories on that in like a month and a half so you know and just you mean I'm Meridian I'm Meridian I'm sorry um they did put a we asked them again this is good news this is breaking news actually uh the Civic Center you know we've been in talks with them they're going to build us pretty much a new Civic Center with a second story for storage up top um which is a good deal they're going to build us a women's locker room for our officers in there uh so there's some good things coming out of that that project then we hope we have to have that building will be started soon so we can get the Civic Center back open you know it's been closed for two years um so we'll get that building back open and it'll be brand new Amen to that yeah that's a big one we're g get rid of the trailer in the back there that's part of it too that little trailer right here uh they're going to build that into the new building and the trailer will be gone also very nice anyone else question Mike I heard rumor that there's going to be some area in the new Civic Center for display of historical documents yeah that we'll we'll going to take care of that ourselves as a town but yes we're going to try to put some on the walls some thinner Cabinetry that we can keep historic stuff good okay lockable lockable okay um no one else have anything I'll entertain a motion to adjourn so move second it and all in favor any opposed good night gentlemen ladies I have to sign a few bills here thank you well in the