call to order the meeting of the mayor and Council of bur B Edge March 18th 2024 special meeting 6: pm. um I ask for a moment of solent reflection for all those towns that are and councils and uh all those professionals that are working with councils to create a budget that is fair and reasonable um and then we'll do the Pledge of Allegiance ready salute I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all all right statement of compliance with the open public meeting act this meeting complies with the open public meeting act by notification via March 1st 2024 um Sunshine notice containing the time date and access information in town to the town record and sorry my screen just got a popup Town news and the record and by posting of the same with the municipal bulletin board in the burough website and following notice of the same with the municipal clerk Madame clerk roll call please councilwoman calman here council president Montano Cohen here councilwoman canella here councilwoman Mal Larry here councilman Benson here councilman glass May Papo here very good and did we um I was distracted for a moment did we uh call Council canella we did didn't we okay so the full council is present uh Plus our professionals uh especially um our clerk our business administrator and a CFO okay well here we go so um our agenda is to uh is the only item on our agenda is the um budget and my agenda was up a moment ago but then uh my alternate computer died so just give me a moment while I make sure that I fulfilled all the obligations of opening the meeting I have okay uh public comments so let's could I have a motion and second to open to the public for any comments or suggestions or questions they might have so moved second all in favor please say I I I excellent okay are there any members of the public who would like to raise their hand in the queue and we would uh give you an opportunity to speak if you so wished I see two attendees Greg or Neil Greg or Neil I'm going to give you about 20 more seconds if you don't raise your hand I'm going to assume that that you're good and that we can proceed hey can I have have a motion and second to close to the public so moved second all those in favor please say I I any opposed any exstension hearing none that is complete okay so we begin uh the 2024 operation budget discussion Miss aella I will hand the um uh where will we begin uh the best part to begin is with our CFO to give a summary of where we stand in the budget we have um from when you received your budget books we did receive a couple of updated figures so um I use the floor to Mr Bag Chris you are recognized thank you okay um well we are uh beginning another budget cycle here um there's no question and this is going to be a general statement a lot of the statements that I make tonight are going to be General across municipalities it's not specific to Riveredge but there's uh certainly been a lot of headwind in Municipal budgets this year um we're finding that a lot of budgets are um just higher than expected as far as uh tax increases are concerned uh there were a lot of municipalities that had budget ha issues which actually um caused the local Finance board to adopt another uh um set of regulations that allow for cap exceptions this year similar to what they had to do last year um so there is no question that every municipality uh is facing budget headwinds um as of right now the version of our budget that everybody has in front of us uh is uh represents an increase of 5.55% um that number like um lazette just mentioned actually went down very slightly um just in the last week or two when we got uh updated state aid figures from the state um it's not really a material change we' we got an extra about $9,000 or so um so we're at about 5.1 even on the tax impact as of today um that is about $228 on the average uh household uh which is valued at $397,500 um just for reference as we're going through this uh the value of one tax point is 149 6456 and a tax Point represents $39.78 on the average resident um to make that a little bit easier we use $100,000 flat so every change in this Budget on the appropriation or Revenue side of $100,000 will change the T the average residence tax bill by $265 so that's a good way as we're going through it to see what the impact is um of of every change that we make while we go throughout this process Chris could you go back and just for the Public's benefit you said one uh to use a benchmark of $100,000 which would have an impact of can you give us that number again $265 all right keep going thank you um so you know as as with uh you know every year I usually start with the major drivers um you know the the 5.1% increase is a result of about $787,000 of additional amounts to be raised through taxation when I say amounts to be raised by taxation what that means is uh you take your total budget amount which in this case is uh 20, 500,000 about and you subtract all of your Revenue that you can generate without taxing uh for us that's about 4,280 and the difference between those two numbers is your amount to be raised by taxation uh that amount right now is6 milon 236 289 so that's $787,000 more than last year um we have about let's see the count here is we have 19 items when you add those 19 items alone together um you see an increase of $810,000 so it's uh it's very easy to you know find the major drivers of this budget um I can go down those those major drivers if you'd like or we can go through the Departments and we can kind of flag them as we go it's no no I would I would for the Public's benefit for the benefit for those department heads are here I'd like for you to go through the major drivers at least uh the top five or 10 okay sure uh well so number number one um and this is not on on your list I've got the Appropriations on your on your list uh in front of you but I also want to make a point of of there's uh there's one large Revenue item which we had discussed every year uh for the last two or three years as as we were um anticipating uh the arpa funds right this is the last year that we can anticipate the arpa funds we anticipated 500,000 in 2022 400,000 in 2023 and we knew that this would be the last year we're anticipating the balance which is 296,429 3,000 Less in Revenue uh on just that one item and Chris um for the benefit of the public um let's not use acronyms or if we do use acronyms let's explain them sure the the arpa funds were the American Rescue plan act um funds that came down from the the federal government through the state and then uh down to the municipalities it was awarded in two tranches uh three years ago and uh River Edge opted to um slowly utilize those funds rather than doing it all at once uh which allowed us to wean ourselves off of them right so as you can see we went from 500 to 400 to about 300 uh now keep in mind next year we will be at zero for this so we know that next year we will not have that $300,000 in Revenue but this year um we will have we have $100,000 less um now moving on to the Appropriations the the the 19 line items that I was talking about before um what I use as a flag here uh for your benefit is anything that was plus or minus $20,000 so that was the the Baseline that I used um and going down from from top to bottom uh just in in order of the budget document is uh we have Finance we had a new full-time hire in the in in in the past we've always had part-time employees we made the decision last year um to hire full-time that position is also floater yes so sorry um so I think you're going if I understood you correctly you're going down the list that we have not do that I'd prefer you go from the greatest driver to the least driver and um so um so it looks like the number one driver would be Police salary and wages would that be correct had a tax impact of 36.651021 so that's what I'd like for you to do I'd like for you to go from the greatest impact to the least impact okay um so the greatest imp pack would be police salaries and Wages that's uh contractual um there's not a whole lot of conversation there uh that's followed by employee Group Health also uh something that is outside of our hands that's $122,000 increase um Social Security is next at 59,000 that is just a a product of um and when I say social security that's all payroll taxes uh so that's just a product of higher salary and wages um you know higher Social Security number uh that's followed by the sanitation landfill line item uh it's a $58,500 increase we have a new line item in the budget this year so I want to stop you there I know I keep stopping you but uh it's really important that we educate the public educate ourselves and we educate all those present the landfill I know what it means but can you explain to the public what what that means because they'll understand so security they'll understand Group Health they'll understand Police Department salary and wages but the landfill the public may not understand uh that is the um Bergen County Utilities Authority is the bcua fees for uh taking away our garbage um and uh we have a new contract that's going going out to bid this year um I don't recall exactly what month it starts but it will be at 450,000 and that's the number that we have in there compared to the 3 91500 that we had last year okay good keep going you're doing a great job thank you um we have a new line item this year um there's an acronym I don't remember what it is but there are new reporting requirements related to storm water management uh that is a new line item in this year's budget um that is for $52,500 and that is to um to handle all of the requirements um that are now newly required of municipalities related to storm water reporting uh and like I said I believe there's a couple of acronyms with their reporting requirements um I don't I know know what they are off hand I'm sure Jason can give us a uh a long education on all of them we don't need that but um this is this is one of many non-funded obligations that we have yeah so so uh they the state awarded uh $25,000 Grant to uh every municipality um 50,000 to some of the larger ones we did receive the $25,000 Grant uh and that was to fund hundreds of thousand dollars worth of uh of requirements so so yes that is a a very partially funded mandate I think that's important when those um non-funded mandates come up that you mentioned them so the public understands that this is not optional this comes from the F uh state or federal government depending on where the Mandate comes from or the county but it's really mostly the state and that um we we have to we have to add this to our budget and if there's any grants as You' so correctly said you know what what if anything was given to us by the state to soften the blow and what was the what was the larger obligation so that's great please keep going uh the next uh line item that we have is liability insurance um and that is one of the line items that the local Finance board um addressed in their um in their cap exception allowances uh because the increases in liability insurance year-over-year have been uh astronomical ours is 45 it's about $46,000 uh of an increase year-over-year um go good uh the next next line item that we have is our salary adjustment account that account we've put together every year um that in in this year it uh reflects um 3% increases for non-union employees um there was already a uh resolution authorizing two% increases um per our salary ordinance so the Delta would be 1% that's still in in this salary adjustment account should the governing body approve it we would keep it in uh if they do not we would we would remove it okay the so um just for the Public's sake um we we must budget for All possibilities um so uh we may not spend that money but we have to put it aside or we can't spend that money and if we came to a resolution that was um more than we had budget then it can't happen at least not until late December when we can make transfers correct yeah November but yes yes okay keep going um we have the Recreation Commission uh salary and wages uh increased by $40,000 we do have an additional employee there uh the shade tree commission request came in at an additional $40,000 um we combined all of our DPW salary and wage accounts This was um to make this more transparent um with the exception of recycling they're all on line item now so no more buildings and grounds um uh repairs and maintenance vehicle maintenance maintenance of parks it's all just one uh CPW salary wage account the total increase in that account uh is is only 36,800 uh then we move into our bcua accounts which is that Bergen County Utility Authority uh we have an uh a um omm an operations and maintenance uh budget and a Debt Service budget with them the uh Debt Service is 33,000 and the onm uh is 27,000 combined we've got a $60,000 increase on our bcua bill so let's stop there and let's uh let's unpack that a little bit if you would Chris so that the public understands as well as the council um that is again um another another line item that is you know we we they handle all of our uh Wastewater and they do um I don't remember the exact number of municipalities that they have but it's it's basically a Consortium and we get charged our proportion of the flow that goes to the um to the bcua so at at the beginning of the year we get a summary of our flow relative to the total flow they take the total cost and they divide it between all of the users and uh and we get a number that number is broken down between our operation and maintenance and our debt service and um and that number for this year is uh 1,321 1707 so again let me stop let me stop you there so basically what we're talking about is every time somebody flushes a toilet this is the bill that we're paying because of it and that's what we mean by Wastewater yes okay and that that currently is 1 million what was it again 1 million 321,000 1707 is the exact amount of the invoice the amount of the budget appropriation uh between the two is 1,322 so it's just rounded up uh to the nearest thousand okay now for the Public's benefit this um it it's gone up 60,000 this year so it was approximately 1, 260,000 last year ballpark uh yeah 1,262 yes okay so U this part of the budget is um is Wastewater and Wastewater by that we mean anytime we flush the toilet this is what we have to include in the budget correct keep going and uh and as a disclaimer on that that is that is a the majority of of what we pay in in in Wastewater we also have a bill from uh Hack and Sack paramis for sewer charges that we have not received yet we don't know what that number is um so we do have a placeholder in there it's not the placeholder that we have is not over 20,000 so it's not on this list but it is something that over the next month while we uh are between introduction and adoption we may get the final bill and we may be able to adjust the budget to reflect it um but we do also have um a separate bill for for a separate portion of town uh that does not go to the bcua and that amount is about $277,000 in this year's budget so our total waste water is just about 1.6 million okay so let me stop there just so for the Public's benefit um so the hacken sack is essentially that portion of riverge which is on the other side of Route four correct I I don't quote me on where the where the location is I'm not I'm not completely sure so there there's portions of our sewage system that it was more efficient to connect to hackensac or paramis and that's why Those portions come out separate correct good keep going okay um we're moving on to Legal Services uh is a $225,000 increase uh recycling uh is a 20,000 a $23,000 increase uh where I started before Finance salary and wages so I want you go back to recycling first okay so recycling for the Public's benefit um has been uh gone from a revenue maker to from from in other words a positive to a negative and that's uh mainly because um if if I have this correct and correct me if I'm wrong um the idea of uh of plastic and metal um aluminum essentially was uh used to be a money maker for these companies and now it's not but I believe paper is still a bit of a money maker so we lose on one side and we gain on the other is is that correct or did I get that reversed yeah we're we're we're not gaining much on anything anymore they're all they're all um all the rates have gone down it's more expensive uh for the haulers to take it away and the other piece of that is also vegetation which is recycled um and that's actually the largest part of the increase in this particular account is the amount of vegetation that's being hauled away um has been substantially higher year-over-year for the last couple of years um and that's and and so you you have tipping fees and tonnage fees so that's just the amount that they charge per ton of um we'll call it waste but it's recycling that they're that they take away but now before we leave this topic Chris uh let that feel free to chime in on this um we we also have um I'm blanking hold on um the question might come from the public why don't we just put all this with our garbage but the Tipping fee for garbage is much higher if I'm not mistaken than it is for the recycling which would be um our our waste plant material which is the leaves and things like that the uh plastic and aluminum and the paper which we call cardboard is that essentially correct yes and by Statute we are required to recycle to collect recyclable goods excellent and that's a this is another unfunded mandate so we are obligated to get rid of them but getting rid of them or or removing them from the burrow via recycl recycling uh is a better rate than garbage correct is that Chris correct so the public might be wondering well why don't we just you know put everything in the garbage because it cost us vastly more so we don't want people to stop recycling their plastic or their aluminum or their cardboard because you're saving money by doing that um because if we had to put it into the regular garbage we would our rates would be going even higher than they currently are Chris great job keep going okay the uh the next account was uh Finance snw $21,800 increase uh that's just uh Staffing we have the library um has a salary and wage increase of about $21,000 2 uh 20,000 2392 and then workers compensation which um is just another part of that liability insurance bill you separated into liability and workers compensation that's got an increase of $1,640 I usually lump it together with the liability insurance so when you look at the two of them combined that bill increased by 6,639 um and then the only other item there that uh we did not mention is actually a reduction and that is a reduction in the construction official account um operating account of 37,500 okay all right and so the perent of total increase is 10.78 can you explain that for for the benefit of all at the the um so that just represents uh since the total amount to be raised by taxes is $787,000 higher than it was last year we just read off a list and again that list doesn't even include the the $103,000 in Revenue we just let read off off a list of 19,000 uh of 19 items that are a total of $810,000 so those 19 items alone represent $2.879 there it's it's just a testament to how how much uh those few items impact this budget good so this is essentially all of the all of the drivers for the increase tax increase and why we have that and and the fact that you you have many other accounts that in aggregate are negative right because we have $810,000 on just those 19 accounts that means the aggregate of all of the other accounts is actually a negative $20,000 so we we have pluses and minuses but these are the these are the real major drivers and we were able to make some changes to some other accounts to be able to accommodate the increases in these accounts okay good all right Chris keep going well that's the that's the end of the of the summary um I don't know if we want to look at Department by department or if we want to go into some um more General budget information um so it's I'm I'm I'm open to how we want to guide this conversation I know we have a capital discussion as well I know that we usually wait for uh maybe the Saturday morning meetings for those but there's a planning to go over we're going to wait on the capital now for the Public's benefit uh as well as your reminder for the council um 5% of the capital is required to be included in the operation budget would you talk to that so we could educate the public on where that how that works and and why that's important yes so the the the requirement for um authorizing debt uh is that you need to put a down payment on that debt that down payment requirement is 5% unless it is funded by a state Grant or another location such as maybe open space or um or trust fund that you have so um what that means is for every $50,000 that you put in your Capital Improvement fund which is the location of that 5% down payment uh you can authorize debt up to a million dollars um so uh in last year's budget we had $150,000 which allowed us to authorize up to $3 million in uh new authorizations uh this year the number is a little bit more complicated but I will try to make it um more transparent we have the hund the same $150,000 as last year in the capital Improvement fund but we also have the difference between the drop in debt service and that is a placeholder for future debt increases uh and what I mean by that is we have some old serial bonds that fully matured so we no longer have to make debt payments on them think about it as you've ma your fin mortgage payment last year and now you don't have to make a mortgage payment on that this year um but we don't want to see in this case it's a $300,000 principal reduction in debt and a $118,000 reduction in interest um in this year's budget but we don't want that to fall off of our um off out of the budget document because we are going to have to replace that with new debt we just haven't issued that new debt head so I have it in there in capital Improvement fund as a placeholder will be able to use that money to offset the cost of future debt but um we will have new Debt Service in the next year or two that will um fully replace the amount that we are uh that fully matured last year so um as far as what my expectation for that down payment is I still expect that it's that $150,000 um but we have we have some wiggle room because we have that placeholder in there good so would it be fair to describe this as Chris if you were a homeowner and um you just paid off a new refrigerator and a new kitchen and everything else and so that loan is done and it was always part of your budget for the last say 10 years but you know that the boiler is going and the air conditioning unit's going and that you're going to have to replace it later in the year so instead of stop instead of removing that from your own personal finance budget you leave your you leave that payment in so that you're not suddenly hit with um with with a lot of money that you um can't pay that's exactly right yes okay good uh keep going with uh general information um so that's the that's the capital Improvement fund um and that's where the down payment comes for from for the capital projects um the other item that you know we we always have a a long conversation about is the use of surplus um it is shows up on your budget document as Surplus anticipated you'll always hear me calling it fund balance um it is intended to balance our funds uh we have been uh maintaining a healthy fund balance year-over-year this year we are one of the things that we're doing to help offset the tax increase is we are using more of our fund balance last year we used 1, 15525 uh this year we are using 1,800,000 so that's an increase of $247,500 in uh fund balance that we're utilizing to help offset uh some of the uh some of the increases that we have in the rest of the budget um now to um hopefully give you some comfort we're doing that uh with the anticipation that we're going to be able to continue to replenish the amount that we're using right one of the things that we want to make sure that we do is uh not use more fund balance than what we think we can replenish in the following year um and I don't think that we're doing that uh one thing that I will note and I know that the question is going to be asked what was our fund balance before and what is it now um that is uh a there's there's a more explanation that has to go into it rather than just looking at the balance sheet um the balance as of January 1st of 2023 was $7.1 Million the balance at December 31st of 2023 is $5.8 million and it sounds like we lost uh 1.3 Mill million dollar in Surplus but that's not really uh the full story the full story is that um we've been utilizing the fund balance that we have to avoid having to issue short-term debt uh for some of the capital projects that we've had so on the balance sheet what it looks like is a loan to ourselves it's it's what's called an interfund if you're if you're looking at the balance sheet and we sent $3.5 million over to the general Capital fund to fund our projects rather than issuing notes and having to pay interest on uh on the debt associated with uh selling notes for these projects so while it looks like we went uh we had a reduction of $1.3 million we actually had an increase of 2 million because I do have a $ three5 million loan out there that as soon as we do issue the debt which Again full disclosure we do have to issue the debt this year this is the last year where we can get away with funding it with cash um but once we do issue that debt that loan goes away and the fund balance is restored so it's a simple balance sheet um it's some balance sheet movement but um rest assured our our fund balance is still very healthy and I do have full confidence that we'll replenish the amount that we're utilizing this year wonderful and um for the Public's benefit New Jersey has some of the most con conservative accounting policies of the 50 states is that correct my understanding is it's the most conservative yes and um and second uh River Edge has uh the council has uh imposed some stronger conservative that we sometimes have to um we sometimes have to by ordinance or by resolution suspend to some degree but we've gone a little bit further than the most conservative State need is that correct I would say so yes okay great so um we're doing everything in our power to make sure that uh the uh we maintain what do we have a double A+ rating as right now um we haven't had a rating in a couple of years um let me take a look at what that new number is I'll look that up right now um but for the Public's benefit this allows us to borrow at a better rate than other municipalities in the state and definitely better than other municipalities throughout the union throughout the other 49 states so it's uh it's a very responsible uh policy design yes we had a we had a bond sale in 2020 uh and we were double A Plus yes yeah okay keep going Chris so so speaking of that uh of the of the fund balance uh I think that we'll be able to replenish and be right back where we are so I don't think it should be alarming that we're utilizing more than we did previously uh and then the other big ticket item is is Debt Service um Debt Service you know I I I talked about it a little bit where we have that placeholder of the of the $365,000 I'm sorry $318,000 um but it's it's something that over the next couple of years depending on how rates um change um we will have large Debt Service payments and and we'll be looking at short-term financing uh for the first couple of years we'll look at long-term financing after that and um we'll be we'll be looking to fill in the gaps the same way you know uh we had a Serial bond mature last year we'll have serial Bonds mature in the next couple years uh further reducing the amount of debt that we have to pay in the budget and we will wait until it is at advantages for us to sell serial bonds and fill in um fill in those those placeholders that we've been that we've been holding here so um that is something that we'll continue to discuss uh we'll probably discuss it more during during Capital when we're talking about uh the impact of certain projects um but that's something to always keep on the uh in the Forefront of your head because um when you when you authorize a project so let's use a million dollars if you authorize a million project in year one you have to put that 5% down payment in the budget right so we've got a $50,000 appropriation for down payment we authorize debt on $950,000 now what I've been able to do in the last couple of years is I've been able to utilize some of the fund balance to fund those projects so after year one you weren't even seeing the impact of the debt in your budget because we've been able to absorb it and I've been able to move things around but maybe three years later maybe four years later all of a sudden you'll start to have to pay principal and interest on some of these projects and that's when you see it so you can make a decision three years ago that you don't actually see the budget impact for three years four years it could be longer in some cases so um it's just something to keep in mind that you will eventually have to pay back some of the debt uh now I I'm always trying to I'm looking as many years out as I can so I'm always trying to plan to try to keep things as steady as possible um so that we don't have any lumpy increases you know I don't want to see a you know a 2% increase in debt and then a 2% increase in debt and then a 25% increase in debt I'm trying to keep everything steady and that's the way that we're planning um but it is something to keep in mind because in the next year or two we might be talking about projects that we approved in 2021 that we have to start paying uh making Debt Service payments on that we might have might have forgotten about at this point or it might have even been a completely different uh Council approving those projects altogether and that's why uh we not only have you and Lizette our business administrator but we also have the finance committee constantly working throughout the year to anticipate not just what we're what we're doing this year but how it's going to impact in years to come keep going Chris yeah and to that point as well um we do have a debt policy and similar to the way that we have a fund balance policy that restricts us further than the restrictions that the state already imposes on us we have a debt policy that restricts us further than the than the uh what the state already um restricts us to so um and that's self-imposed it is self-imposed and it is something that also keeps us um keeps us making good decisions you know so um it's a it's it's a great thing to have and you know when we were talking about those rating agencies um that's something they look for they like to see policies that survive um change over in governing bodies year-over-year um and that's something that river river has had for for many years um so that's a a testament to our governing body um and the um and the consistency that that we've had um long before I even I even uh got on board here excellent um I want you to keep going with General general principles so that everyone present as well as those who will be watching this later but I'd like for you to in in a few moments or or weave into your your presentation um we're a 5.1 which is is is very jarring to me but we're a 5.1 um percent increase is in relationship or in in contrast to other municipalities throughout the state um well so you know we the the budget process um you know we've been starting to look at introductions we're right around the time uh the state deadline for introduction is is April so we've got a lot of municipalities that are that are starting to come up with uh those those versions of their budgets that they're looking to introduce and 5% has been the lowest I've seen so far I haven't seen anything lower than that I was just in a budget meeting this morning where we were able to drop it from we started at 11 or 12 we were able to get it down as low as 8 to n um but getting below that is difficult um I want to stop you there and I want for emphasis a good teach teacher emphasizes great of how many municipalities do you do you service or or you aware of would you say I I work with about a dozen okay so uh out of 12 municipalities and what you might also hear through your professional associations the 5% that we're starting that we're hopefully going to reduce a little bit we'd like to reduce a little bit is the lowest that you know of at this point anywhere in State I I haven't I haven't had one that started lower than that no okay good thanks Chris keep going so yeah I mean to to to that point um you're you're in a good place relatively even though it's maybe not the place that we want to be in yeah um and and the other piece of that is um cap problems right so a lot of municipalities are having cap problems um what that means is um there are two caps that the state imposes on our budgets one is what's called a levy cap uh so when we talk about that amount to be raised by taxation they don't want to see the total tax levy um inside caps and I'll explain that in a second they don't want to see that going over 2% uh and they also have an appropriation cap where they don't want to see your spending go over a maximum of three and a half% as long as we adopt the cola ordinance that we that we do look to adopt every year um and because of the increases that are are are really outside of our control um for the most part um a lot of municipalities are having those cap problems and that was uh one of the things that I spoke about earlier where the local Finance board added exceptions that maybe historically weren't always included as an exception to uh to those caps to allow people to actually and when I say people to allow the the municipalities to introduce budgets otherwise we would be out of compliance um so you know we we do have um some opportunity to reduce our budget um in areas that would help our cap um we can we certainly shouldn't have an issue being in compliance with the cap once we get to the point where intro where we're introducing the budget which is also great news for us um because there are there are you know there are m IP alties that are going through these conversations um and you don't have a choice but to cut if you want to introduce your budget so we we are we are fairing a little bit better uh in that sense and that's because of our long-term conservative policies yeah we've been making we've been making decisions over the last couple of years that um have allowed us to whether it's Bank cap or increase the basis of where our cap is calculated from um that um allowed us to stay in compliance with with with that cap um so so that is that is the other other big piece that's affecting uh local government right now is uh just the inability to actually be able to introduce a compliant budget so regardless of what the tax impact is EXC all right um any other uh General announcements before we start looking um through the book um I think that's um that's everything on my end all right so uh councilwoman Kaufman who is the Finance chair and Miss appella who is our business administrator um where should we begin should we we're we're not going to do Capital um so should we begin at salary and wages or should we begin at Administration or do you think would you recommend we begin somewhere else I think we should start at revenue revenue yes okay um everyone uh uh and so both the council and the citizen Council um so our budget committee uh let's turn to uh the the third tab uh which is uh the revenue and uh Chris or uh Lizette is there any way we can put these sheets up on the screen I might have I might have different sheets I can I can share um is the 2024 General cap ordinance summary correct L Michelle yes and I was going to go to the interest cash management fund section um which is 40108 11133 so I can I can share I can share a document are we looking at the that fiveyear history document the worksheet exactly yes okay so I can share my version of the document it's just not in the same order so I'll just need to to navigate as we uh as we go through the book uh I don't have a copy of that physical book I have everything in PDF so as long as you let me know where we're going I will get there good go ahead Michelle so 401 8113 030 is is that helpful to you the number yes I'm just going to share my screen [Music] here Michelle this is under the revenue tab correct yes it's so it's if you guys are there it is the fifth page it is the fifth page I know the page numbers got chopped out by the whole puncher but um okay so ignore my page numbers it's page 99 on my screen um so there was an I think it's the one after where it's interest on cash management fund 030 here it is here there it yes okay so uh in speaking with Chris this morning I think we do have a little of a little bit of room to increase that um you can see that we made a lot more money last year than we had budgeted for and so far this year we've had 60,000 of interest earned um so I would recommend that we maybe take that out up to a 100 or 110,000 we're going to have less cash to earn interest shortly because we'll be selling notes in the summer probably or spring um but given I think that we've already earned 60,000 I think we could take that up to 100 or 110 Chris Chris uh what's your opinion yeah there's there's there's no there's no issue with doing that I will give you um my rationale um briefly on on why I chose a low number and you know every decision that I make is always going to be conservative sure um the the total that we earned in interest last year was $324,000 across all of our accounts um since we only anticipated 880,000 the extra 260 I'm sorry 240 or so uh went into the fund balance right that's it it helped to replenish the fund balance account um if we rewind back to 2022 you know we earned $88,000 an interest right so this is something that changes with rates um now what I what I am always concerned about is you know we we received the the 324,000 we can anticipate up to $324,000 in this budget but if rates change or if our cash position Falls because you know we we um uh spend more on on projects uh and and maybe we don't authorize debt on them then we won't earn that interest and then in the following year if the if the rate environment is different you'll be in a Hole by the amount that you were anticipating now the amount that uh councilwoman Kaufman is is recommending here is is still not close to that 324 so it's still being conservative um but that's the reason why I kept I kept the interest flat year-over-year uh figuring that at some point it's going to come back down and I don't want to be in a you know $200,000 hole in one year because um we had a couple of great years of high interest rate environments okay so Michelle would you again say what you're you're recommending that uh so this is the first line 4-01 d811 3-30 you're recommending that we change the anticipated from 80,000 to what either 100 or 110,000 uh We've earned 60 already so well I'm wondering Chris could we could we could we go as far as 150 or is that just too crazy it's it's a it's a it's a game of chance right it's um you know we we certainly can I I I I don't have any doubt that we will collect $150,000 in interest this year my expectation is that we'll probably be in the same ballpark as we were last year you know I don't I don't monitor the FED meetings too closely um but you know you have a you'll have a couple of rate hearings uh between now and the end of the year and no one knows what's going to happen in those rate hearings or how quickly it's going to trickle down to the local banks um I'm sure when the rate goes up it takes longer to trickle down and when it goes down it probably happens pretty quickly but um you know it's it's a question of do you think that or or are you confident that we will be at least at 50% of our current Fed rate next year at this time right and and that's where that's what we're making uh our our decision on um alternatively you can anticipate a little bit more in fund balance um knowing that it's it's a line item that you have to review each year I mean this this is also a line item you have to review each year but if you're not anticipating a lot of it it's less it's less important relative to uh maybe monitoring that fund balance number all right Michelle what about instead of 150 instead of 110 what about 125 would you as the finance shair find that acceptable or do you still feel that's too ambitious uh I think maybe 120 and lazette uh what what are your thoughts on this because we're we're earning 3% right now at PNC but we're going to be paying 4% at some point in the not super duper distant future on the notes that we sell so okay that's the offset Lizette what do you think about 120 personally I'm more comfortable at a flat 100 it's a volatile um election year and we don't know how the banks will um will respond and what rates are being cut what rates will be increased okay speaking more from a political scientist perspective than a finance perspective all right but we we were talking about a 5.1 budget I I know that we're one of the lowest in state but I still would like to do something for the public how about 110 how about a com how about we go with Michelle's 110 Council please uh un un and and budget committee members please feel free to unmute your mic if you are a budget Committee Member or council person and chime in on what you think about 100 or 110 I'm I'm thinking 110 might be better but uh anyone feel free to call out and I'll recognize you may go ahead David I sorry thank you yeah real quick I just want to um confirm U Michelle mentioned uh so far year to date 60,000 um I believe that's just through February though right correct thank you uh raise your hand either physically or uh in um I was just going to uh say that I agree with Michelle's original number of 110 okay uh any other member of council or um budget Committee Member citizen budget Committee Member hearing none uh Michelle can you make a motion to change that from 80 to 110 yes so I'm making a motion to change the cash management fund number 401 10811 1330 from 80,000 to 110,000 second it's been moved in seconded this is only for the council because the council is the only one who can vote on this all in favor please say I I I any member of council say nay or abstain hearing none it's so moved Michelle where else um I think the next thing I would recommend is going to the administration tab okay everybody unless anyone has something they want to bring up in that section any member of council or citizen budget Committee Member Mr uh councilman Benson thank you mayor I just had a quick question I I heard we're making 3% on our money um you know on I'm making more than 5% on my money in my money markets is there a way to boost the interest rate we're making on that money Chris if you could address that uh so so back to that uh that conservative uh State requirement issue um New Jersey any any banks that New Jersey puts their money in is required to uh have what's called governmental unit depository protection um and it's there's a it's it's GPA is the acronym uh for that um for that reason it costs Banks a little bit more to hold our money uh and they don't offer as high of interest rates what we do have and if that the name of the account that we had on there was the uh cash management fund we do have a separate account with the New Jersey state cash management fund um because we are not allowed to invest our own money uh with very few exceptions we can invest in uh government notes um but you have to have idle cash and you have to have it for long enough where you can um afford to put it in maybe a CD for a year uh or six months um through the cash management fund we can liquidate uh any time uh and we do get higher interest rates uh but as I mentioned before we've been transferring a lot of our money over to the general Capital fund to be able to support those projects uh which is why um one of the other reasons why my expectation for interest was a little bit lower this year because simply we're going to have fewer dollars in in that account um in short I'm I'm I'm with you because I use uh banks that don't have brick and mortar location and you get much higher rates with online banks um and you know I I just I just for another Bergen County municipality I went out for um proposals for banking services and the best return I got was actually 3% as well so our bank is already competitive with um with a bank uh with an a town that I had $40 million in cash to offer and we were still only getting three% um I know long-winded answer but it's a it's just a conservative banking practice and and frankly you don't want to give anybody the ability to be more um risky with government money right so I I'm I'm gonna 100% agree with New Jersey's policies on not allowing uh any of us to make decisions because I'll tell you I'm I'm certified financial officer and there are no classes on investing money right so it's not it's there's no there's no expectation that any CFO in the in the uh state has an education on investing public funds appropriately okay so um it's a good thing that we're not allowed to all right I appreciate the explanation excellent anybody else that was a good question I'm sure it educated the public as well as the council and the budget committee as well as department heads uh anyone else for a question in the revenue tab all right we're going to go to we're going to skip Capital we're going to skip salary and wages we're going to go to Administration uh Finance chair Council M cin where are we going on that in that section um so feel free to chime in anyone who wants to I was gonna move ahead to the historic commission um 40120 17587 okay for those of you who have books oh yeah it's so let me help you the it's it's in numerical order so she says 401 12017 so you look at the 1 two 3 the fourth group you and you'd see that on the first page fourth group says 100 and then on the second page it says 100 and then third page it says 100 and then you get into 155 I believe on the fifth page and then you go a little bit further to and you said 175 Michelle um 187 it's the second page from the back yeah 17 187 okay so after the 155 group then we go to the 165 group and then uh we would go a couple Pages there and then we go to the 175 group and I and so up so the four it means that we're in administration 012 is I don't know what that means but that's uh and then we get to the the SEC the group the fourth group and it says 17520 and 17587 Michelle which one are we referring um I mean it's the same thing they're they're asking for an increase and I was going to recommend that we hold them flat they didn't spend what they requested last year um so I I would recommend okay there anyone from the historic commission present baring B the lays on to the historic commission so um I could speak to that I was actually surprised that they asked for a raise I think it should stay flat in particular because we also found out that if we have any legal fees that would I think would be covered sort of by the um by the the burrow uh budget um so I agree I think keeping it flat makes sense excellent okay so any member of council or the citizen budget committee citizen budget members Ken or anybody else have a question or a comment all right Michelle would you make that motion so I make a motion that we leave historic commission at $4,750 for 2024 so we strike their a requested increase um second it's been seconded it's open for debate is there debate all in favor please say I I any opposed any exstension all right Michelle where are we going now okay so um burrow clerk all right but let's go to the next tab uh so this is 101110 and 120 bur cloak is 120 so and I was just going to go to the very first page and just for the Public's benefit um 40120 101028 uh Professional Services um if so leis said or Chris could you just explain to the public what that what that number is for so we know can you repeat that line 101 it's it's the Professional Services it's the second item on the first page it's 101-2 yeah um our B cler can clarify but this is for Our IT services okay okay so miss Dodd if you could just uh speak to it a little bit that's correct that's for our it consultant this is hit based on the contractual amount for their services okay uh so there's no increase there correct correct all right Michelle great and then um on the next page for everyone who's looking in the book U 4012 01011 132 um oh we just moved that over to a different section now is that correct the reverse 911 non-er okay so everybody uh so the 40120 are pretty much the same so we're looking at the last two groups we're looking at 101 130 and 101 132 correct Michelle yes and Michelle your question was uh just wondering why yeah why that went is going down from 2,000 to 1,000 L and I looked at this um you nothing has been charged to that line for a number of okay right oh I'm sorry go go ahead sorry okay yeah so we we decided to reduce that line um because we also have nixel as the next line which is what we use for our non-emergency notifications well if we've not used it for for years uh why don't we bring it down from to 500 why leave it at a th um we didn't want to reduce it too much or zero it out because um as if you go a few lines down the cable um for Burl Hall which is not for cable TV but all the wiring for the computer networks and the internet that is consistently going up so um so in leave a buffer somewhere else leave a buffer within the account because you could go over a line item what matters is you don't go over um the actual account and in case you do then that's when you have to wait until November for for transfers okay so for the Public's benefit um the rules surrounding uh transfers as the ba just mentioned says that we can't transfer unused funds from one account to another account but within accounts we can do it uh pretty much as needed so leaving the ,000 there uh respects the fact that we haven't used the reverse 911 but also leaves the option of uh uh just in case the cable burough Hall goes un expectedly up is that is that a fair uh summary yes and the reason why that line um went up even though the municipal building is not occupied we did have to put wiring in for um the office area that didn't have the wiring before where staff is currently located our building department has been relocated also to 10 River Edge Road and then on top of that it's just the the general increase to the rates okay Council monsana Cohen council president thank you Mr Mayor just a question on the uh line item about nixel non emergency as I understand that there are three types of Nixels right and we have uh as of recent authorized some departments to utilize nixel for non-emergency nixel so my question is is there another line item for the nixel that are non-emergency or is this 2500 covering a flat fee for all three types of Nix Souls that's uh the flat fee for the subscription that we have okay so is there another align item where where it is per so is there a cost per nixel I I guess my question is are we cover enough 2500 given that uh some of the different departments are utilizing Niel for non-emergency information to the public um no I'm looking at our account we have um our subscription period runs from May 22nd to May 21st so since May 22nd of last year we used they counted as credits 214,000 and we have a balance of 285,000 so we have plenty um the account that we have has enough credits for our messaging whether it's emergency advisory or Community okay thank you thank you yes thank you any other member of council or citizen budget committee and thanks mayor I can't find my um my electronic hand um on uh account uh 1110 it's in the same tab 11101 192 uh so we were in 101 so you want to go to uh 110 okay so that's two pages and 110 and then one 92 so I think three pages um and you are at uh G honors and badges correct okay go ahead I'm just wondering should we increase that amount to 2,000 since we almost spent that last year Michelle or Lizette or Chris so this this account and you know as we're as we're talking about it um this account fluctuates year over year um it's for honors that the town um give to various people uh things like that so depending on What's On Deck uh in any given year it might be plus or minus uh you know looking at the screen um you know going back to 2019 we had about 750 500 612 950 so last year was close to 2000 but I don't know um if like the the bulk of that there was a $1,400 expense for a crossing sign a pat Henry crossing sign if that sounds familiar I'm I'm I'm assuming that that's not an everyy year um dedication so it's uh it's probably okay where it is um it was just a one-off expense that that that brought that budget higher than typical got it thanks Chris uh clana Council and malari yes I have a question if we can go back to the same page where the nixel message was okay so just give us the 101 D14 101 D14 it says TV meetings uh we didn't use anything on 2022 nothing on 23 or will it be appropriate to reduce that 3,000 uh this line was uh in in the past was charged for the equipment for the council chambers for the cameras um and that's why we reduced it since we were not in council chambers um due to construction at burall I'm not sure if when we return if we'll have to um have that equipment re installed or if there's additional equipment if we're going to stay in a hybrid format so that's the reason why we left it at the 3,000 or if the equipment we have is outdated since technology changes annually so we'll probably need it later this year an outstanding catch a good catch uh I'm glad to see that we're doing that um anything else in administration the next thing I was just going to point out to everyone sorry cler B clerk 40120 one2 you don't have to read that one Michelle just give us the last six D numbers okay it's it's the second to last page in the section and it's 12-22 okay the last two grouping is 120 and Postage and I just wanted to point out to everyone the finance committee already discussed this with leet and our burough administrator and the CFO and we are just conservatively estimating that postage is going to keep going up we spent about 9,000 last year um and it's actually yeah we're we're assuming it's going to stay flat because we're concerned that prices might go up in the future so I just wanted to point that out [Music] I'm sorry um excellent good point yeah um is there anything else under burough clerk that any member of council or the citizens budget committee would like an explanation for or would like to make a recommendation for a reduction all right uh Council um councilwoman cman who is our finance chair please continue okay so next up is finance department okay let's go there everybody and just the first page 40120 13011 uh just hoping either um RBA or Chris could just explain for the public why we needed to add some staff in the finance area well I it was was actually um not technically adding staff it was it was the conversion from a part-time to to full-time position um and I bottom line answer is you just can't find part-time employees uh that are consistent um you know we did put ads out um you don't really get very many responses and then what happens is you train a part-time person then they go and they take a full-time job somewhere else and you start over the cycle um so we decided to to move to a full-time position uh which I think has been working out well um but it comes at a at a at a cost of uh increasing that budget line right so I just wanted to point that out I just wanted to add that position also provides um assistance to the burough clerk so instead of having two full-time employees the work is being performed by one okay uh anyone else for anything in fin finance that they either have a question for or they would like to make a suggestion of reduction I just I have another question on on that same page if I may uh if if I can get some clarity on why the overtime what is the overtime there and why is it been reduced to a th000 from 3,000 um I if anybody could explain that to me the the overtime go ahead sorry um well from what I know the overtime if our Deputy Treasurer stays extra during tax collection because she is now a deputy Treasurer under the fair labor standards act she cannot take overtime so she takes compensatory time so um and the other two staff members who would stay for overtime their their salary is significantly less so the overtime rate um overtime amount to be budgeted is less so a th should be sufficient that's what we're saying because of that okay Pana sorry um line item 130-11 168 Okay computer main Group 130 then group 68 the first one on that page good computer maintenance you're talking about CL yes yes so there was no expenses uh last year is that included on the um IT services they were budgeted for the Bor Clerk or that's separate no so this this would be um basically equipment for the for the finance office that's related to computers so computers printers uh scanners things like that um it's it's a lumpy by Nature right because you might get a computer it might last three years it might last five years um and this is this is to to replace them um same reason as as uh what we talked about with some of the other line items we know we're going to need it we don't know when um and that would be this the same would apply for some of our office supplies um even even with postage uh where you replenish the meter and you use it and you and you um you you you use it as you need it um we order check stock we order purchase order supplies in bulk and then uh so we might have a big expense this year and it might last us all the way through 25 and then in 26 so 25 we'd have no expense and then in 26 we have another large expense um so this is one of those scenarios where we've left it we've left it flat um because we we assume that we're going to need it at some point we're just not sure when the computers are going to uh to conch out on us thank you I see no other hands is there Michelle is there anyone else had one quick question on 40120 13028 professional Serv 13 and what was this last part 028 028 Michelle if you could leave off the first three yeah I will okay sorry about that 130 and give it to me again the last three 028 028 okay everybody and it's Professional Services and costs and it's right in the middle of the screen right now M and I was I saw requested was 14,750 and budgeted is 7,000 and I was just wondering why we we dropped that from the request just curious um well it's it's been it's been a larger number uh if you go backwards one one of the things that we we use that fors um financial advisors uh we used to use it maybe for fixed asset inventory professional as well as um official statements things like that that are are again lumpy expenses um I've been doing a lot of the analysis for for future Debt Service um that we would maybe use a financial adviser for I will not act as a financial adviser I'm not allowed to do that so when we do um permanently Finance anything we will have a a financial advisor um but once we get to the point where we're permanently financing things uh we can actually charge those expenses to those Capital ordinances that we're permanently financing so what I've got this in here for is um uh anytime the like if we need if we need um uh like the I think the the last time we used them was 2022 we we called our financial advisor and we had them do some analysis for us uh to help us to help give us up guidance that was charged to that account if we have Bond counsel handle something that's not Direct ly related to or one of our ordinances we would charge it to that account uh same thing we do have a separate line for the auditor for the audit but if I have him do something with like a supplemental debt statement or official statement which again we haven't needed um in since 2020 when when we sold debt um uh we would charge it to that line as well so it's again just one of those situations where um you know it's been 14750 for a long time I dropped it down because I think that we're getting to the point where the expenses that we're going to have are going to be more related to the capital projects than they're going to be to Opera in so I think that we're safe with that reduction okay great thank you all right uh anyone else uh Pana sorry one more thing uh 14512 uh group 145 group 012 it has a zero requested and then budgeted for 25 500 is that an error or no no all of the all of the salary and wage lines will have a zero requested I populate them based on uh particularly with the part-time I I populate it based on uh Trends and full-time it's based on our salary ordinances so there's really no requested line items um unless there's something special uh that would be outside of um uh something we adopted already or that salary adjustment account that uh that we talked about earlier thank I want to stop for a second I believe we no keep going go ahead Michelle okay or any else so oh um if we could just have a brief discussion on the salary adjustment account 425- 100 okay this would be a little bit further group 425 and it's the last it's one of the last pages in this section and I see the note that it includes 52,500 for storm water but I it looks like the number jumped a lot even without that and I was hoping to get a explanation for everybody I can uh I can talk about that for a minute so the the cover sheet that we went through originally the uh the 525 that was the number that I referenced uh for the new obligations for storm water management so on the summary page it's an account that doesn't exist in our current system so I have it in that salary adjustment account on this sheet but it will be a separate line item so if we subtract out that 525 that is that is on the that front page summary sheet uh for storm water we're down to 57,000 um what happened this year versus previous years is um I actually put together all these documents before we um before we adopted our salary ordinances uh for this year because last year we actually waited to adopt the salary ordinances um but I did I did these documents early so this salary adjustment account represents the full increase rather than the incremental increase so uh in previous years um if uh John Doe had a salary of $100,000 um his salary would be uh a 2% increase on that it would be 102,000 in that line item and the extra 1,000 if we were going to go to a 3% would be in the salary adjustment account this document was put together before we knew whether we were going to adopt a salary ordinance for the 2% or not so it it it covers the full 3% rather than just the 1% Delta so it looks higher than typical um if you'd like before the next meeting I can make revisions and move all all of it over into the individual accounts these uh this account encompasses all of the non-union employees so there's about a dozen or so uh accounts that that this uh would be distributed into uh every every Department that has a non-union employee in it basically okay it just seemed like a lot compared to the prior years the 57,000 because it's 3% instead of 1% that's that's the the difference the in in Prior years the 2% was in the respective salary and wage accounts gotcha okay now just for the benefit of the public and Chris uh clarification the um the idea of a 3% is not a requirement it is a funding option correct correct okay so we're not saying we're doing 3% we're just simply saying we're leaving us some Le way when we make the decision correct correct all right good Michelle yes one second um DPW we're not doing tonight we're leaving that for Saturday right and ditto for wreck correct Le said correct and just for the Public's benefit um why are we doing that um these are Department of Public Works Recreation Fire Department police department are our um bigger departments in terms of operation as well as uh mainly capital and so we're we're joining them all together so the public understands we're not uh we're not trying to hide anything We're just trying to be more efficient in our time all so for today we're handling um the operating budgets of the much uh smaller in terms of financing the Departments all right right um okay Michelle where we going uh just a quick question I do see that Chief Walker is an attendee do we want to do the operating budget or is that not the time to do that right now for the police department was that and Chris that's to you I we can we can go through uh we can go through anything tonight as far as I'm concerned as long as uh ask the on board well hold on Michelle um so that was it was not originally part of the plan with the finance committee and the business administrator is that correct yes but so why don't we leave it to the end then um and to make sure we cover everything that was part of the plan and then time allowed we can introduce new parts so that we're we're uh because if the chief wasn't asked to be here for this he also may or may not be ready so we're putting them on notice that we may come to him or not um let's continue with the plan that was designed and then if there's time left over we can certainly come back okay he had raised his hand should I no let's go with the plan that we have because there were people were asked to be here tonight okay so Michelle what would be next in the plan we've already designed um do we go to the office of emergency management since we're keeping fire and police out I hate to interrupt can shatri go at soon uh that was part of the plan correct Michelle yes um so Lizette are do you have any objection to uh moving shade tree up in the discussion no objection is any member of the budget committee uh both elected and citizen have any objection to moving shade tree up hearing no objection it is so moved all right everybody let's uh let's move to shade tree which I think is the very last tab is it not yes all right um so uh Michelle uh what is it that you would recommend and then Shay tree can chime in based on your recommendations um did we get an answer about the donation line liset no uh okay um you guys could just give us an explanation of the 40,000 I know I think you wrote that it was for the extra 121 trees it was it all right so basically um a little history here on our tree planting few years ago um mayor and Council um decided they would recommend us doing it every other year planting correct so we didn't plant last year so this is our year to plant and we're requesting the 40,000 to plant 100 trees I think what uh councilwoman coffin's asking certainly what I'm asking is in two years ago in 2022 it was 20,000 that ended up being 29,000 so can you guys explain first of all what happened in 2022 and uh and that would give us some cont context for 2024 sure so in 2022 we had a $66,000 grant yeah so we we felt that you know we didn't need the full 40 in 2022 so we asked you know we're asking for 40,000 in 2021 we did not receive any funding in 2020 we received $50,000 uh 2019 we didn't receive anything and then in 2018 I received uh 9,720 okay but just for the council's benefit explain the difference in 2022 you asked for 20,000 and we ended up funding [Music] $29,99 if you could just explain that for the council's benefit in in 2022 um my record for tree planting we only received 20,000 and the other additional 66,000 came from a grant a ceive grant and then we use open space and trust and Trust money also I think right okay was that um um and am I reading this wrong uh we're we're currently on uh uh 4126 30267 and I see a appropriated in actual for 2022 20,000 appropriated 9,959 actual uh Lizette or Chris can you explain what was that difference why why do we have a difference there that's correct I just I just pulled up the detail on it um we ordered about $122,000 of uh for from shade trees Nursery um for planting of trees and another 17,39 from Aspen Landscaping um again for planning trees so the total is about 29,000 um and um 14359 was used for the tree planting out of capital in 2022 oh so if you so that extra additional money so if we're going to go if if you're going to look at it like that so the money that comes out of capital used to be how we're earmarking that is open space money so it th that specific planting is only goes into our parks so we used to ask um and we used to get funded from open space to plant in our three Parks but now we can only we have to request Capital to do that so that if you're incorporating that figure that's capital separate from Street trees okay so so now the 40,000 is that is that all in or is also money coming out of capital so the 40,000 is for 100 Street trees since we're not since we can't request open space any longer we we we're requesting um 19,000 from Capital within the 19,000 I did put in 5,000 for the watering person part-time I'm not sure this year how um that might get allocated because I did notice that there was another separate line that ends in um 302012 I don't know um if that's out of that's in this um line item or if we have to do capital for that so that's where we're you know asking the 19,000 out of capital since we don't have open space money anymore no you you can't pay salary and wages out of capital okay so whereever the 5,000 I I didn't know where to request it last year um I know DPW you know Jason takes care of that account but we have to fund it so I don't know where that money you know how to request that fund this year because I don't I don't have that line item on my budget the one that goes in the 302012 the part-timer so Jen just to go back to the mayor's question if we budgeted you 20,000 in 2022 why was 30,000 spent I'm not getting that the 20 the 20,000 back in 2022 the EXT extra funding would have been from capital I don't have that extra 30 for for trees a it was the 29 plus the 14 we we actually spent like um 43,000 42,000 that year yeah I had I had scann the sheets over to you I'm just looking at my tree plants I'm yeah all right um okay so let's put the mystery of 2022 to the back burner let's let's work on the budgeted 40,000 is that an actual 40,000 or not because now I'm hearing that some of the things that U Jen and Liz were going to put into Capital can't go into Capital well the only thing that that you're indicating that can't go into Capital would be the F the $5,000 every year comes up where are we going to you know where are we going to um get the funds from so the line last year again um the 302012 I don't know where that falls under because I don't see it on our main budget here um it used to come out of open space because the the watering person would was doing majority of the parks but then we put it under Jason so that they could do our um trees since we got a grant and we want to make sure you know all the plantings um had a higher survival rate since we need that for the grant so the just to to go over the just the tree planting in general um when you say 100 Street trees are we talking like a trees that would have to be planted annually or are they permanent because the requirement for capital is is a it's got to be a a permanent tree replacement program so if if we're talking a 100 trees that are permanent trees that are going to be there for the next 20 years plus then all of that can be in capital any operating expenses so uh watering the trees um pruning the trees doing anything like that maintenance would have to be in the operating budget correct so so right now we've got $40,000 request for trees in the operating budget which it sounds like that might be Capital but we and we've got a $199,000 request in capital where that part of it might be operating if I'm understanding that now so the all right so let me be clear in our in our operating budget this is our year to plant trees the $40,000 is to plant 100 Street trees now on typically are you saying Jen that it cost $40,000 to plant the trees not to buy the trees it's to buy the trees and to plant the trees okay but Chris has just made that clear buying the tree goes in capital planting the tree goes in operating we we weit we we've always this is this is something we've doesn't make a difference what we've always done we want to do it correct going forward is that correct Chris you we we can if if it's part of a a a tree planting program both those expenses can go into capital in the year that it's happening um it's just the maintenance of trees tree removal um stump grinding stump removal things like that are all operating but the actual purchase of of tree again and there's a difference between decorative trees that you know go in a a pod and and they they you know last for a season um versus ones that are there permanently uh as long as they're permanent trees they can they can go into the capital um budget so I I I don't want to speak for shade tree but Liz and Jen we don't do any potted trees we only do permanent trees correct correct okay so we need to uh maybe we need to uh Liz and gen you need to perhaps get together with Chris and lazette this week and then uh because it sounds like we need to make a change to this line and to the capital line because it sounds like all of this should be in capital and it sounds like we should be zeroing out the 40,000 uh is would that make sense to you Chris yeah so it sounds it sounds to me like we've got $59,000 requested 54 of that should stay in capital and five ,000 should go to operating to pay to water the plants that's that's what I'm gathering Jen Liz I mean as long as we get somebody you know allocate the funds let's let's answer the question asked regardless of what we've done in the past let's do it correct now okay do you need 5,000 in operating for watering yes or no yes is there any other operational requests that you need to make because I'm I'm going about to ask Council kman to make a motion to reduce the 40,000 to 5,000 and then we don't need to make a motion to increase the capital we can just Chris can make that correction because we're going to be dealing with that on Saturday so operationally you need 5,000 to water correct correct and that's the only thing you need oper a well I mean again we are we talking about our other lines like maintenance stump removal he all the other ones he's okay correct well we have 15,000 in stump removal so we're and we have 4,000 maintenance is that 4,000 in maintenance for watering or is that for something else maintenance is like if we have like big trees that are around like we had one behind one house and DP W can't get there um you know you need a crane okay um so that maintenance is basically a crane okay so we want to leave the maintenance we want leave the stump remover well is it the 5,000 the crane for emergency and the 5,000 was for the person to water the trees during the summer all right so we really need to redu this so for the 170 30 302 170 needs to be the 4,000 the uh the 167 needs to be 5,000 um the maintenance needs to go to zero because if the maintenance is the crane the crane is the emergency correct no emergency is emergency like if Jason Goes and does something without sha tree that we just took a tree down behind the library was $5,900 for one tree so you know we use that money we use both of them maintenance also we have um our inventory system our online inventory system that's 2500 a year um so that falls under okay we don't so the reason just just to be clear on the inventory systems through Davey's uh treekeeper we have a three-year contract and it expires um this year so next year we'll put in for um you know the software um update and the maintenance on it so you also use that on under there which is like 2500 a year we got a discounted rate for three years so that's why it's not in that budget line right now the emergency line has always been for Jason whenever he deems to use it so like last year the the no one used that um $5,000 we use the maintenance though as Liz mentioned to remove a tree we did use we used encumbered funds that's why it's showing up at zero we had encumbered funds at the end of the year so we used that so we did spend money on emergency um but I can tell you the cranes have gotten really expensive tree work has gotten expensive to contract out all right well we need to fix this so um so we're gonna we're gonna let's do this let's reduce the 40,000 to 5,000 we'll leave the rest alone Lizette can you and Michelle and Liz and Jen uh have a conversation either email or something get these items correct um and we'll deal with it on Saturday does that make sense to everybody okay Michelle could you make a motion to reduce um uh line um line 41-26 d321 167 from 40,000 to 5 and with the understanding that uh the amount would be put into capital and a motion that um the rest of the shade tree budget be corrected so that it is in keeping with what our CFO has described as um appropriate for uh operation okay so I move that we change you can just say so moved so moved good second second all right it is open for debate is there debate hearing none uh all in favor please say I uh any oppos any extensions all right Liz and Jen please uh you know try to find some time to talk to Michelle and or Lizette and uh and let's uh make sure that the the budget is correct according to the expectations of our CFO okay okay great thank you thank you Michelle what's next on the agenda that we had for tonight um assessor I guess all right everybody let's move to assessor if anyone has any questions regarding that tab I do [Laughter] not okay let's all take a moment to look at that and see if we have any questions or any recommendations all right uh is we always can go back but is there any uh or am I not giving enough time I don't want to rush anybody we skipped over o ah we can go back to that in a moment um is there any any uh anything in regards to assessment all right uh let's go now to OEM which is uh group F 252 252 and Michelle uh anything here um I do have a question part-time 40125 22-12 um I we used to think it was going to be a higher requirement and I know we haven't spent the 20,000 we allocated in 2022 and 2023 just wanted to make sure that that 13,400 was going to be enough a bill do you want to chime in on that uh that is the uh salary for the deputy OEM which is uh uh I believe a f 5,000 plus whatever increase he's gotten over over the past few years so that that basic that line has uh been steady over the past few years okay Chris or Lizette no if you don't have anything you just can be silent that's good any member uh either elected or a citizen in regards to OEM or that question Michelle anything else in regard to OEM um the mention you're I guess you're adding that in yeah that's the first time uh we're putting I put it in uh this is to cover convention expenses uh for the annual convention in Atlantic City which covers the C uh cus that are that are needed for uh to continue my employment for the burough so that's 252 d170 252 d170 okay great so ongoing education then yeah okay and why is it 1500 and not a TH or 2,000 uh Bill what's the justification for the 1500 uh I took actually 15 from uh the other some of the two other line items and just made that it's basically the same budget as I had last year I just reallocated reallocated so I paid Peter to for the fund P that's any member of council or the citiz and budget committee that has a question all right if not then Michelle where do we go next um construction code is that correct no land use is there anything on fire prevention because that's what's after o okay let's look at that that's group 265 Michelle anything there any member of counc me any member of council or assistant budget committee I do have a question on the fulltime dust 44,000 is that the uh salaries and wages because zero 265 d011 265 d011 yeah the the 44,000 is is salaries and wages yes that's um your Fire official as well as the part-time employees and Fire Prevention okay thank you anybody else feel free to call out if I don't call on you um this seems like a small thing but I'm looking at six the 265-3390 I don't know why we're doing that 26533 is there any explanation for that I recommend that we reduce it to 200 does anyone object could I have a motion in second to reduce line 4- 01- 25-26 5-33 from 400 to 200 moved second it's been moved in second it's open for debate and discussion is there debate and discussion um I guess I would just point out the next line office supplies they've been overspending on so do we need to raise that one yeah I would rather the budget be more in keeping with what it is and let's let's amend that motion to include increasing office supplies um by let's see I reduced it by essentially 200 uh to 600 could I have a mo uh motion and second to amend to uh increase line 4- 01- 25-26 5- 036 from 400 to to 600 second okay this is on the amended motion all in favor please say I I hi now we're back to the main motion as amended is there debate hearing none could I have a uh could uh all in favor of the main motion as amended I I any opposed any extensions okay anything else in uh this budget sheet so essentially we we made it flat we just made a correction that I think is a good one because it more reflects we have uh we've already done tax assessor the next would be lanus um Finance chair councilwoman cman I do not have anything for that okay everybody just to take a look that's group 180 I guess sorry I guess I would just point out for the public um that the reason why that part-time number is higher than the prior year that accounts for some changes we made recently is that correct for 40121 18012 was that is that correct Chris is that correct scroll into that one 181 sorry what was that number 180 d012 correct the hourly um wage change okay um so why why did we make that early wage change is that a Chris that was approved um last year to take to effect this year based on um the amount of work that this part-time employee takes on for a very active board okay sounds good uh any question about that before I go to councilwoman marari councilwoman malari uh item line 180- 021 the legal advertising I don't see that it's been used $2,000 can we do that is there any objection what what would you recommend councilwoman a thousand a thousand yeah I mean that's still I mean the most we've ever spent was $525 and last year we spent $2 16 is uh Chris lazette Michelle what do you think about that idea great idea all right is there uh is there anybody who thinks that that's a bad idea all right so let's have a motion Michelle can you move uh 4-01 D I'm sorry myad councilwoman malari could do it okay councilwoman Mari would you move 4-01 d 21-18 0-21 from 2000 to 1000 some second is been moved in second is open debate is there debate hearing none all in favor please say I I any opposed any exstension okay mayor yes I'm looking at 18042 the act the very next page on training yeah which is a thousand but we they haven't spent the dime on it all the years so maybe just lower that to 500 in case Liz that Chris Michelle what what's what is our thinking on why we're keeping that at a thousand and what is your thinking on reducing it to 500 which seems to make sense to me the the land use board falls under the municipal land use law and if the state makes any changes and requires training there's several members that would have to go train so it's just a um a placeholder to have in the eventor any significant changes to the municipal land use law so are you saying that we need to keep it at a th000 or would 500 be too little I think 500 would be too little considering many ruers courses are at about6 700 Barry are you okay with that yes of course all right anything anything else I I do have another one on the same right under that in training the membership the item number 168 180 180 0444 memberships and dues and memberships and dues I see that none has been used consistently we decrease it to 400 but we're requesting now 500 yeah why are we doing that that's a good question is either zero because we don't need it or I mean what would be a reasonable amount but it seems like we don't use anything so that's 180 d168 168 180 d168 oh no no 04 044 the one above oh 180- Z1 044 my bad I apologize it's down at the bottom of the screen yeah I see it now okay um was that Chris do you know why that went up 100 when we never use it just looking I'm looking for notes on the request to see if they gave us any um any detail on it I just have a dollar amount I don't have a of an explanation what do you want to reduce it to what do you think is that a question for me Mr Mayor yeah 150 200 keep it open I well I I I will defer to the CFO or Mr portella to what they think is actually reasonable unless we need to zero it out because they haven't used anything even even as far back as 2019 when they had a 600 nothing has been used yeah I don't I don't I don't know if it's NE necessary I don't know if there are any um subscriptions or Publications that they would need in the future um but you're right they haven't they haven't used it in yeah I I was just looking through my emails when I received when we received the original budget request on November 21st I mentioned um to the land use clerk you requesting Professional Services to increase and memberships dues and subscriptions to increase by 100 and um I only received a a response on the Professional Services increase nothing on the reason why they increase the the membership um dues line the 044 well then I think maybe we should reduce it to 100 and if we need to revisit it on Saturday we can but I don't see any reason to increase it by 100 I would reduce it from 500 to 100 which would be a reduction um Lisa would you be good with that yeah yeah I like to understand a little better maybe between now and then then if they you know but uh it seems like there's something we can actually zero out but 100 would be fine for now Mr Mayor all right could I have a motion Lisa for 4-0 1-21-18 0-44 to be reduced to $100 yeah I make a motion second all in favor please say I I hi all right I didn't ask for debate because I didn't hear any prior so um just to be more efficient with time I'm going to move forward unless I hear discussion for debate anything else on this in this group okay construction enforcement I believe would be next correct okay that's group 195 two and 200 count uh councilwoman Kaufman who is our finance chair do you have any anything you want to raise in this group I guess either miss appella or Chris could you just give the public an explanation of why the wage costs are going up for this section um I'm just looking at the control total line on the first page sorry can you say that number one more time oh it's a four 0122 95- 011 and 012 um well the if you go further down the Professional Services line was reduced by 38,000 because we um for years had been Outsourcing the zoning officer role um through Professional Services and now it's brought back inh housee so that money was put back under salary and wages yes all of it was put in the salary and wages yes all 37,500 oh I think it's a little it's a little less than that okay okay was about 30 or 32 was put into salary and wages okay Council McMan uh anything else Michelle um no that's that's it for me anybody else any citizen member or elected member okay then we move on okay so Health Department okay go ahead Michelle um um for -1- 27-33 0-180 hoping again just for the public to get an explanation of the employee assistance program what that is that's a service provided by um Bergen County Department of Health for employees that are in need of counseling when there is um they an immediate trauma either experiened at work or if somebody's having um problems at home coping with death marital issues Financial issues it's a service provided to the county and um they charge us um not per person to not for individuals to attend each and every time it's annually they ask for our number of employees and they come up with this rate which is the service for the year should we choose to um we pay for it so that way it's on hand in case we have an employee in crisis that needs assistance okay so we just started doing that last year then right no it um it would prior years it would be lumped together in other line items this is just putting in its proper designation okay so this is a longstanding exp yeah going at I've been in local government 20 years it's been going at least at most okay all right I'm going to go to council malari CLA yeah I have two items uh 330- z36 office supply office supplies you're talking about yeah they had 600 last year spent 542 they're requesting 800 can we reduce that to maybe 650 Michelle is that Chris sounds good to me I mean they were for about $58 from reaching the 600 um I don't know what's generating the increase but as you see it's been increasing every year it's gone from 246 364 542 I recommend no less than 700 and could you also look into what's causing the U increase uh Claudia uh clana are you good with 700 yeah that's fine all right so could I have clana before I make a motion what else uh 33176 it says borrow share is at Street housing $3,000 I don't from 2019 nothing has been sent is that like a placeholder do we need that 3,000 reduce it which one was that I don't have the history on that line 330 176 yeah there's there's been nothing charged there since I've been the CFO here that's just been there every year so I don't I don't have any information about it either when don't we reduce it to 500 and ask and send an email to them uh telling them we reduce it to 500 unless they can justify where we're keeping it there that sound good Lizette all right anything else clana no that's okay so I'm going to need a motion a second let me read it out could I have a motion for 4- 01- 27-33 0 d176 from 3,00 to 500 and 4- 01- 27-33 0- 036 from 800 to 700 so almost second been moved and seconded uh because that's two different things is there any debate or question all right all in favor please say I I I anybody else yes mayor go ahead I have um 33093 33093 everyone medical supplies nothing's been spent is that supposed to stay at that amount and even during covid there was nothing spent I mean Co was really 2020 2021 it's Chris there are a few line items in here there's nothing has been spent like training meetings and seminars they're all zero all right how about we do this uh Lizette and Michelle can you please make a note that we're going to come back to this can you also please send an email to the health department that if there's not a justification for these unused items that we're going to either put a minimum amount in or zero it out okay is the council comfortable with that without objection is there objection hearing none it is so moved library is next we're skipping that skipping that okay Municipal Court is after that uh Finance chair councilwoman Kaufman anything um I just had a a question um so I see we're assuming that the salaries full-time and part-time are going to be basically flat vers last year but but last year we had allocated 113,114 in total and that's that's 4 0143 49-10 the salaries and wages for the municipal court and I was just wondering we we had budgeted in an increase for last year and then we came in lower than that do we know why that um the the increase was for the translator no not the translator on the salary and wages it was for hiring a deputy um court administrator or a court clerk um to provide coverage for our court administrator because under the new Judiciary um regulations you know the municipal court is supposed to be staffed 247 you know holidays six days and everything um so we did hire somebody later in the year plus um but the hours required hasn't been as much as anticipated so um you know this you know this amount that is budgeted would cover uh you know the judge the court administrator and the part-time court is there room to reduce it um no I don't believe so I don't think so no I don't think there's room to reduce this one okay are we good with that Michelle yes is there anything else Michelle um not for me I mean this section again has a bunch of items that haven't been used in a long time so guess I'm looking at Professional Services cost I'm looking at uniform cost and that's so much but it's just you know I'm looking at other General group I'm looking at um membership dues and stuff like that I you know given our current budget even though we might be the lowest in Bergen County for the situation we're currently in I would like to start cancelling out or reducing to a minimum amount a minimum amount to me would be $50 um any uh any um line uh that is not been used in the last three to four years um but this is the court so the court does have a uh you know special um it you know that's it's mandated um May can we can we can we reduce the court interpreter 4901 168 no it's based um a lot of the court costs fluctuate based on need and now that court is back in um in person one of the two sessions per month if some if you have a litigate that requires a translator it has to be a certified professional in that language um so it it all that number varies based on activity on cases same thing with Professional Services if we have to bring in any substitute Personnel if they're you know they could be a conflict where somebody is um can have a conflict that they serve as um an attorney a representative for um a litigant coworker family member or whatnot so to not have that conflict we do have to have um the ability to find sub substitute individuals um meetings and seminars that is U the training that the court administrator is required for her state license um travel could be reduced because that falls under the meetings and seminars cost uh transcripts on appeal if there's an appeal um there hasn't been in a few years but if there's an appeal you have to provide for it American Disability Act requirements um if the you know the court does get audited by the county court um the yes the county court uh I'm getting the the name incorrect but at the county level they get audited so if anything appears in in the audit the court has to um remediate any deficiencies you know in a very short time period you can't wait till like the next budget year so the Judiciary is very since it's technically separate from the municipality it's very tricky um even with with the budget there's there's not much latitude all right that stands for the um the expert W witnesses as well 490 171 correct it depends on the case especially if uh with DUI cases got it thanks so given uh uh rba's explanation of this group um I'm recommending the council moves on to uh insurance is there any objection so Michelle I think uh we're in Insurance correct is there anything you have here that you want to um um I I just want to point out to the public that our liability insurance is going up 18% this year as is everyone's that's a huge increase um which there's nothing we can do about that um so uh and it's more than $440,000 correct right and then workers comp is up 7% which is not quite as bad percentage wise but insurance costs are going up really significantly and that is driving our tax rate and uh employee Group Health uh which is 40123 d220 d09 um also mandatory um not as bad an increase as the prior year but still almost a 9% increase for that so we've had some very very significant increases and that 9% is about $70,000 correct yes very significant increases in non-n negotiable items that every town is facing and that's what's causing our tax rate to be much higher than it had been historically um Council and malari clana 21178 what's that yearly addition for $4,000 that nothing has been spent the last four years oh yearly additions yeah which one was that 210- 178 that's if we need to bind any additional coverage as um as needed whether we um like expand Recreation programs for example um or if the day camp goes from half day to full day or um like before we used to have um um a citizen Emergency Response Team we you know we haven't had it at least since I've been here but that's if that gets activated again that's additional coverage that would need to be uh Bound for these types of volunteers so this is just a placeholder in case throughout the year if there there's any new programs new activities new volunteer uh groups that come in that need to be covered then this line would address it so will we be able to reduce it maybe $ 25 $3,000 it has to stay for um it can it can be reduced to 2500 I don't recommend any less okay let's uh hold that just and we'll do all of them together uh is there any objection to 2500 when we have the motion seeing none uh clana anything else I have something else for the 21300 the library they requested 1300 with budgetting 1600 and it's l Del Insurance yeah it's uh they're they're seeing the same increase that that it's the same 18% increase uh that have in in the liability insurance so that 13,000 is just an allocation so they're they're realizing that same increase that the town is is uh realizing historically it's been 13,000 it's never been adjusted for any of the increases that the town has had um so now now there these increases are more material so they're sharing in that increase as well well you anything else um I personally would like I don't see any hands that's why I'm speaking um we have a flood insurance uh 210 d168 210 d168 uh every year we budget 25,000 last couple of years it was 5,000 8,000 9,000 um is that Chris um is there any reason we're keeping it up that High um well in 2020 we were charged 24996 I don't know if that had to deal with um uh TR tropical storm isas that may have been a factor because that that's the only thing that stands out from from 2020 but it does um it does fluctuate it it decreased to 5,000 then it went up 84 and then 95 and you know flood insurance it's based on the bill that we receive from our flood insurance provider and that's based on not New Jersey Market but a nationwide market so we probably can't reduce that it'd be nice to reduce it by five but if we can't we can't I I don't recommend um reducing it especially with a u bad summer forecasted by by Noah for the United States as a whole anybody else I had a question further on hold on um okay we're we're still going to go back for the yearly Edition uh but yeah go ahead um it's for 225-1100 unemployment insurance uh just wondering why the 2023 number is that a typo for 2023 no that's that's not a typo um all the employment claims that you had since covid were on hold with the state uh and they just started billing them out they did have some forgiveness built into them uh and rather than trying to budget for these claims retroactively I did transfer at the last uh at the last meeting to fund uh or the last transfer resolution not at the last meeting to fund last year's accounts so that I can put it into the unemployment reserve and pay those without having to increase the budget to do that um so it's not a typo it is payments that we do have to make to the state for unemployment claims that were made for our employees but they're they're not current unemployment claims they go back um I believe they 2021 uh and my expectation is that we'll receive more claims um from 22 and 23 but I do have the breakdown of those claims so that's built into that $70,000 number um the amount of the invoices that we received to date is about 35,000 so I I'm I'm expecting about double that over the next couple of months um and we're reserving that so that we can pay it when when those invoices come in can you just explain to everyone including me what that was for um it's it's any unemployment claim that's made by any employee that's no longer active um I they they they send uh since so government employees so uh non-governmental employees usually make a contribution out of their paycheck it goes right to the state and it's state um uh State Insurance that's funded directly to the state governmental entities are on what's called a reimbursement basis so the the contributions come out of an employees check but the but the town holds on to those contributions uh and as well as the employer share until we actually have to pay out actual claims so it's uh it's reimbursed um so uh while we're not sending anything to the state year-over-year uh we do get build anytime a claim is made uh the most common claims that are made uh would be um crossing guards every summer school is out there's no there's no uh work for them so they collect unemployment right so that's that's an example of one um but but yeah it's every every claim that's been made since 21 was on hold okay so was most of that crossing guards then uh we had a couple of employees that left also um not necessarily related to co um for various reasons they left but um so the 8,500 for this year is you're comfortable with that I'm comfortable with it we're going to continue to we're going to continue to fund that Reserve um and if we find that it's not enough we'll probably end up doing transfers towards the end of the year again to fund it to continue to fund that Reserve but um as of now I'm comfortable with that number um I have a question about the you're on it right at this page 22100 can you just explain what that is Chris uh sure so uh and this isn't this isn't for new hires but uh our burrow policy and and this is this is something that came out with the state the state uh had this program where they said you know let's let's try to reduce our employee uh employee healthcare costs across the board and let's offer an incentive for employees to do that so the state allowed um payments of 25% of the savings uh up to $5,000 whichever is uh less um to employees that op to wave their benefits uh the exception for that is if the employees spouse also has uh an SBP or SBP coverage they wouldn't be eligible uh so any employee that that we have uh from prior to uh when did we change it I think we changed it in 20 2021 21 yeah so 20 any any employee hired prior to 2021 that wave their benefit would be eligible for this $5,000 um Health waiver so uh we have budgeted for five employees and that could change at any time thank you are we good anybody else I have one more question sorry go ahead uh 47800 47800 towards the back what is that defined contribution retirement program uh that that is uh a retirement program again this is the state came out with this uh for employees that are not eligible for the pension system um so the requirement is there there's a couple of requirements but the primary requirement is that they earn $5,000 or more and uh this is more like a 401k than it is a pension it's just a Deferred Compensation Program where the employee and the employer would both contribute to an account and the employee would then have access to that upon retirement um so that's something that um is based on wages and eligibility it changes year-over-year um but but it's something that uh you know we have to we have to continue to fund every year and we don't know what that what those numbers are going to be uh sometimes we have part-time employees that are over the threshold but they're not eligible um maybe they're retired maybe they're in a position that doesn't make them eligible and we can very easily replace that same employee the following year and with somebody that is eligible that makes the same salary uh and then you're on the hook for it so I don't usually change that too much if anything I increase it because wages increase and it's a percentage of wages anything else okay I believe claudiana this was your recommendation yearly additions correct yes could I have a motion to alter yearly additions 4- 01-23-20 d178 from 4000 to 2500 all in favor please say I I iup utilities correct oh any extensions any knows no okay Michelle yes utilities um so I guess we could start at the beginning the first page in the handout and it's 303- 100 um and I just wanted to make sure we think that that number is a good high enough number I know Jason's not here right now to comment on that um I've seen a few different articles about this lately with very very different outcomes Mr appala do you have any comments well we're going out to bid um actually I've been working Jason and I have been working with our counterparts in New Milford and uh we have the specs ready to go they're going out to bid their advertising actually on Friday and garbage contracts you have to have um your bid notice out for 60 days so the bid opening at New Milford will be on May 29th and um even if it comes higher than anticipated the contract does not go into effect until mid October so um worst case scenario if the amount comes in higher will be in the time for right on the time for transfers but in reviewing this with Mr Meo in anticipation to prepare the budget we were comfortable with with this figure with this number all right anything else um yes 44-17 44-17 you said yes and that's tele service service exactly I guess I was just wondering why the big increase for that one well it looks like we budgeted 50,500 we paid 6 [Music] 3,792 so we went over on that is that correct and the year before 2022 was 72 yeah that was paid out so Chris and lazette is that is that the justification for the 72,000 yeah I'm sorry go ahead Chris yeah I think it's a it's a a trend situation it fluctuates a lot um you know went from 57 to 72 to 63 um honestly it's it's it's probably situation where we have to review all of our our telephone lines and see what um you know why why we're changing as much as we're changing um and see if we can do some kind of consolidation um but this was based on a just a trend line what about the line above that $6,000 and the AT&T Wireless too that's oh we're already doing zero for that one for this year yeah yeah so when I when I looked at when I looked at that I you know I took you take the SE the 215 the 6,000 and the 50,500 from last year and I just reallocated it to the 72 and the six so both of those when you combine those three it equals $78,000 um on both sides so I just it was I left those the same uh let me highlight on the screen these these accounts I left these three accounts that are funded the same year-over-year um I just moved them around a little bit to where it made sense more because it didn't you know we stopped using that AT&T Wireless account um but again it's you know we've gone over the last two years on on telephone and you know we don't need transfers because it's all within the same account so it made sense for me to move it um but again it's since these this is a it's a lumpy cost um you know I don't know that we're going to know exactly what our telephone costs are until everybody's um you know the building's done everything's re relined and um you know you hav't telephone system but can we do that 6,000 we haven't used even like $1,000 why keep at 6,000 168 one we can 168 Chris yep I'm just I'm looking to see uh if there's a specific thing that's charged there uh that's that's tells me something other than just uh uh Verizon and no it just it just tells me Verizon um so and in fact I don't think is there a separate cost for long distance anymore anywhere no surprised why two different items it say phone Verizon phone service well I I'll I'll again I'll be honest with you this is a situation where that's the name of the account that was there probably for the last 30 years and it's uh you know there there are a lot of accounts that that we've been trying to consolidate year-over-year year um you know that were that were separated out um you know you'll notice this year once we get to DPW there were probably 40 accounts that we turned into four uh and so we've been slowly slowly chipping away at it but um can we eliminate the 168 to be Consolidated with 170 yeah we probably should we probably should and and now and if you look at account 167 so what I've been waiting for to be able to consolidate accounts is that we have five years of no activity because if you have activity and I get rid of an account you're you're not going to see it anymore so 167 would be an example where I can actually now get rid of that account because it's not going to show up on your reports and you're not going to be missing anything because it's just all zeros so um we can we can make it zero but you'll see it for the next five years on this report as until until you have five years of zeros okay let's do do that do we need to move all 6,000 or can we move less to save money um I don't think anything has been charged there this year I'm just double-checking maybe it's best to hold off until um we have our DPW superintendent because some of the the majority of the utilities are paid um by his department so he has a little more historical information all right can Lizette can you and Michelle and Chris uh take note of 168 and um I'm clod I think what what you're suggesting I hope I understand what you're suggesting is that we move 1,000 of it to to 170 and we clean the other out yeah that's right okay the police department also handles the phone lines and they're also going to be reporting on uh Saturday good because we'll have both the chief and the superintendent with us um so that we we can have a productive conversation we're not Crossing Lines but if you can take a note on that that'd be great anything else uh anyone for this I I just have a question or more point of clarification on 44176 is the department WiFi it's Z z0 but then I have control total and the budgeted has been over 83,000 when they requested 5,900 I'm not following that line I think it includes all the phone yeah that's the that's the total of all the telephone lines the the requests are only the ones that have a department labeled there so the 5900 is you know the fire DPW um Library the request amounts for the telephone line the 78,000 that we were just talking is not included as a request so fire department Wii actually is actually broader than that it's not only fire department Wi-Fi that's what you're saying it's a sub account of of all of the telephone lines and that's an example of one of the ones that we can probably get rid of now because we've got five years of zeros there you okay Lisa anything else no thank you anybody else okay if there is no objection and we certainly can go back we're going to go to contingent see Michelle through the pages one second sure [Music] um okay um just the last the landfill number we know that's a def a definite number already is that right 465 d124 I mean that's a that's a number that that fluctuates but but yeah that's that's the that's where we're thinking it's going to land that's for the for for the um The Tipping fees on garbage pickup yeah the county either has or will be going out to bid very soon and the contract um doesn't run out a calendar year or fiscal year it starts around May and the last time they went out to bid the price increased over 20,000 I mean $20 per ton so um we're anticipating we're hoping it doesn't go up much higher and have enough of a of a cushion but um the trend like with anything involving solid waste collection or tipping is just increasing astronomically and this is something that we have to provide and we have no control over the market okay so the $450 is $20 a ton again is that or the 15% increase that you're assuming no I'm just saying last time they went out to bid it it increased $20 a ton we just put that number as a placehold I don't know how um we don't get notification until sometime either May or June of what the new rates are okay um I have a question on one of the account um 87100 emergency authorizations okay we're in now the contingency uh 87100 okay it was in 2022 is 14 and now zero is said I just want to ask what that is yeah so that's that's only if we adopt an emergency authorization um an emergency authorization is something that comes up after the budgets already adopted and we need to move forward with it uh and uh what happens is you you raise it in the following year so for example uh we in September October this year something comes up and we need to do an emergency authorization we would do so and then would we would have to fund that emergency authorization in the 20125 budget so it's not a it's not an everye situation it's just uh on as needed okay thank you Chris you're welcome anybody else a moment more Michelle is it okay to go to debt Services um yes I do you guys want to cover that tonight we can is that part of the plan that we had set up for today um I believe we're we're concluding at nine o'clock so we have about 17 minutes left so was that a part of the original plan that you that you we were going to discuss Deb and Chris you have that spreadsheet right Chris are you ready with that or do we leave it Saturday I we can talk about it I I did talk talk about most of the things in this budget already we can talk about the debt I it was a high level uh introduction in the beginning of this conversation um but I I can talk about anything that we that we're uh okay to talk about all right is any me uh if any member of council or uh citizen budget committee would like to ask a question uh about groups uh 901 950 920 925 930 935 944 945 or 891 which all is uh bred as debt Services take a moment go through it see if you have a question for the Public's benefit and Chris correct me debt Services is essentially what we owe on capital projects yes yeah and we can think of it for the public as if this these are loans we pay exactly or or or in in some cases we're actually funding things ahead of borrowing the money yeah if I if I may mayor just ask a question sure sure go ahead Barry yes so Chris I have I had a question about the capital Improvement fund it's really more for me just to see if I conceptually get this so uh last year it was 150 and we have to put up 5% of whatever it is that we're going to go out for so that 468 in theory that's we're anticipating going out for a lot more debt so we're raising the capital Improvement fund do I have that right uh in the way that it appears uh that would be right but that's that's not what we're doing here we we we're leaving that same 150 in there the difference of the 318 350 so there's three lines that represent the Deb The Debt Service here you've got the bond principal which is going from 1,290 down to 990 and you've got interest on bonds which is going from 148,50 down to 13500 so the difference between those two that's that was that uh the debt that matured that I was talking about earlier on in our in our meeting the difference is 318,000 350 so I added that 318,000 to the capital Improvement fund so that we our budget doesn't drop by the $318,000 in this year because we're going to have to pay debt in the future and I don't want to have a $300,000 increase or 300 or more thousand increase in future years so that's leaving it flat we do not necessarily need to and we should not need uh be putting using that as a 5% down payment so if uh just for the Public's benefit basically what we're doing is using an accounting uh technique to make sure that our budget doesn't become volatile yes and it'll probably end up in a reserve for payment of debt service on the final budget document uh it's not something that we've had so you don't see it on any of your sheets because it's not an account that exists um but but it would be reserved for future Debt Service um and we would and we're using that to uh just to keep our budget flat okay we have uh about 15 minutes left um Michelle you are the finance chair I believe you said that the chief or his designate had his hand up I think he said he's not ready and I think he dropped off but but Chris um did you want to pop up that spreadsheet that we had talked about the debt one uh sure second okay okay so so this is just to kind of show everyone what Chris was explaining previously um and this is a spreadsheet that goes out through 2036 and obviously we don't know how much debt is going to be authorized in the very far future um but we just took the numbers that were in the capital budgets from everyone and used them for the years 2024 through 2028 I just want to interrupt for a moment I want the public to understand that just because those were the requests that doesn't necessarily mean those will be the approved right but you're but you're again using accounting procedure to um to to forecast this is our best guess at this moment in time um in terms of what will happen to the debt going forward so you see um there are notes that are going to start to get added this year and the payments for interest would start next year and the no principal payments would start this year and Chris maybe you're better at explaining this than I am so I'll I'll go through I'll go through actually I'm gonna start on on the second page um and then I'll come back to this one so the second page is just a it's just a list of all the debt authorizations that we've had since we sold Bonds in 2020 right so 2020 is when we were talking about was the last time we sold bonds since then we've authorized a little over $17 million of U of capital projects um of debt on capital projects and some of this is is going to be funded by um grants but that's the total amount that's authorized right now now eventually we need to pay that back right um we've paid the vendors for the projects and um you know we don't have $17 million cash on hand so as we've been paying the vendors down I talked about how I was using some of that money from fund balance but we're at the point now where we're going to be borrowing money um so coming back over sorry coming back over to page one here this First Column shows you our existing debt right and you can see between 23 and 24 over here we have that $300,000 drop right so that's where what you saw in the budget we're not going to see another drop like that until 2030 so between now and 2030 we're looking to probably stay in short-term notes what short-term notes are is um you're you're paying for it's mostly just interest on the project you're not paying any principle down um think of it as a a temporary financing solution before you go out for a mortgage maybe like a construction loan type of deal um so what we're doing here is because we've got this this big drop between 23 and 24 you can see I'm filling in the capital Improvement fund so that when we come all the way over to the end here our grand total is keeping our budget flat in our debt service now if you look over the next of the course of the next you know 10 years you're going to see increases of between $150 to $200,000 again depending on interest rates um in your debt service to be able to pay interest principal and interest back um and you know so this this is operating under the assumption now that we need to borrow I think I have uh $9 million this year and our first interest payment you see is $359,000 which would come a year from when we borrow it so that would be next year and it and it carries on based on what the requests are right so the requests for um for 20204 through 2028 would be about $14 million in additional debt authorized that's all included in here and then I have placeholders for um at $2 million a year moving on from that um which again my crystal ball is not any better than anybody else's so we'll see where we land 10 years from now um but what this is doing is this is slowly bringing slowly introducing uh additional principal payments and additional interest payments until we get to the point where we sell Bonds in 2030 or we'll actually sell them in 2029 and the first payment would be in 2030 and at that point uh we'll start to use some of the the fund balance and that Capital Improvement fund that we're that we're storing now to help bring the payments down and then we'll hit a a peak in 203 4 of $3.3 million in uh in debt service annually and then it'll it'll continue to come down from there again depending on what your future projects look like you know if anything more than $2 million a year those numbers will go up anything more than 4% in interest those numbers will go up uh anything less those numbers will go down and um and obviously this is something that you know we did this projection um for the last two or three years and it's changed a lot in the last two or three years and there's no reason for us to believe that it's not going to continue to change moving forward but we're using it as a guideline to do three things really uh one is we have a debt policy that we have to stay compliant with right so we're monitoring that and that debt policy actually has two components one is our total net debt uh and the other is our debt as a percentage of our total budget so we're monitoring interrupt here for a second yes this again is a more conservative debt policy that this Council has placed upon itself to assure our overall stability correct yes and to to the tune of uh a three and a half perc State mandate versus a one and a half% local mandate right so we're substantially lower than what the state requirement is um in from a net debt ratio and then we have a maximum of 11% allowed in our budget of our you know of our total Appropriations so um and there's no requirement uh in this from the state end on that so just having that is is very conservative as well so and then the the third thing of course is to to try to get a handle on what our budget's going to look like moving forward right so um you know the the list that I just showed you there doesn't contemplate that $17 million doesn't contemplate any of the future stuff that's just what's authorized today right and we've got another $14 million of of requests for the next five years so um by the time we go to sell bonds between paying off debt and and and uh and grants that we receive we're probably looking at a bond sale of about $26 million uh in 2029 you know and we'll see what the interest rates look like and if we have opportunities before that or if we have to wait a little bit to depending on what that environment looks like we'll certainly do that but um you know that's when you're going to start seeing some some uh larger impact in your in your budget for these projects and so you can kind of uh appreciate the delay that happens between authorizing the project actually moving forward with it paying the vendors and then having to ultimately pay the debt on it excellent well said and I should just mention all these numbers are inet liance still with the debt policy right yes okay any member of council or any member of the citizen budget committee who' like to ask a question or make a comment in regards to uh this presentation or anything else we've done tonight okay we got about uh six minutes left um Michelle is there anything more we need to do uh not that I know of okay is there any older new oh no I'm sorry Chris is there anything more we need to do we C it is that is there anything more you think we need to do council president is there anything more we need to do not tonight Mr Mayor all right then is there any member of council who would like to bring up any old or new business at this point is there any member of council who would like to make a comment just a huge thanks to Chris lazette and Michelle for everything they've done over the past few months great effort thank you you're here you're here and all of our department heads too and everybody yes all the employees okay now Chris lazette Michelle correct me if I am incorrect if I make a mistake but our next budget meeting is Saturday morning I believe it's 9:00 am is it 9:00 am yes and we will then take up the operation budget of the groups that we had skipped which includes the police department the fire department DPW and um I don't know if there was anybody else recre library library they operating capital and then we will be doing the capital for the uh the entire budget which includes all those departments um and then with luck uh that meeting will run from 9 to 1 but with luck we will finish before the 1:00 close if not then we might have to schedule another meeting uh and then but if we are able to come to a consensus then we would need to um I believe move a budget was that is the correct terminology what would be done is um all the approvals that the governing body had authorized FIS would give it to our auditor to prepare um the budget documents for introduction on April 8th April 8th that's it introduction of the budget and then lazette from there what would be the next step um the governing body has to wait 28 days before they can um hold the hearing to adopt the budget um Chris I don't remember Are We self- examined this year or do we have to wait for the State uh let me take a look at that um you will no matter what 28 days after introduction you will have your public hearing um it's just a matter of whether you'll be allowed to adopt on that same night I'm just pulling up the sheet that tells us whether we have to wait for State approval or not if we don't have to wait there will be a resolution authorizing us to move forward with self- review uh which we're allowed to do one every out of every three years uh there's a cycle that the state runs through um let me just check where where we are uh in that cycle just give me one moment we are not eligible so we are State review so let talk about those dates the dates won't the dates won't change um there's just a possibility that the state will have questions um 99% of the time actually there's never been a time that I I've been involved in a budget that we weren't able to resolve the questions before adoption um it would have to be something major uh for them to hold up our adoption so um it is an extra step but um it won't it should not impact the timeline at all okay so that means Lizette that we would um have the hearing and the adoption on what date again um our next meeting after the 28 day allotment I believe is May 13th okay for the Public's benefit and once we finish that then uh any expenditures uh could then move forward capital as well as uh we're currently operating um on a temporary budget so um we've been able to pay our bills until the final budget is adopted but with capital we have to adopt the bond ordinance and wait for the 20-day stapple period And once that stle period has ended then we could move forward with um with purchasing and preparing bid specs and going out to bid for anything over $44,000 unless it's under State contract okay and that would be what the dates for the council and the Public's benefit um usually the B following our traditional timeline we are able to expend against Capital um like right after Memorial Day okay all right any more questions or comments from the council I'd like to thank everyone for doing a phenomenal job really really appreciate it uh thank you Michelle especially and Chris and lazette as well as the other members of the finance committee uh the citizen budget committee which we'll see again on Saturday the department heads um everyone uh really well done am I leaving anyone out the whole Council thank you Council and the whole Council for doing a great job tonight looking at the details and seeing wherever we can do better J job for the people of River Edge all right could I have a motion in a second to close uh to adjourn the meeting so move second second all in favor please say I I I all right well done everybody good night thank you