recording in progress hi Alex Alex ready okay good evening everyone calling to order burough sville planning board meeting please stand for the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty Justice for okay okay Beth has this meeting been advertised in accordance with the open public meeting act yes chairman it has roll call please Mr algra here Mr blamar here Mr Bolton here Mr Buchanan here Council Minon [Music] NOA Council Mano NOA miss palowski here Mr spaz here chairman mhler here Mr Cornell here Mr Fowler here Mr Barlo pres we have a quorum thank you Beth there any res resolutions for memorialization tonight yes this evening we have two first one is Colonial Gardens buildings LLC minor subdivision 21 John Street block two lots 54 to 59 I'll entertain a motion to approve the resolution second okay roll call have uh Mr algra no this Colonial Gardens Mr blamar yes Mr Bolton yes councilman on NOA Mr spaz yes chairman Muller yes approved the second one is lot 15 Journey Mill LLC preliminary and final major site plan 18 Journey Mill Road Block 62 Lots 15 and 16 got a motion I have a motion to approve the resolution is there a second second roll call Mr blamar yes Mr Bolton yes councilman on NOA Miss palowski yes and chairman Muller yes approved we have minutes for SE the September 2023 meeting does anyone have any changes revisions etra none okay so um like a vote to accept the minutes all in favor I post okay anything on the communication agenda none this evening any site plan subdivisions hearings um one capital capital review deral Board of Education new bus transportation complex okay okay so uh I think most mostly everyone's here for that obviously um before we start the uh presentation I just want to set the stage of where we're at on this what this board has the ability and power to do uh so generally how this process is supposed to work when the Board of Education um plans to perform a capital Improvement or long range facilities project within the burrow and I'm talking generalities because again there's always U exceptions to to things so I I just want to be able to explain this to everyone so everyone has a full understanding of it but when the Board of Ed has a a capital Improvement project or longrange facilities project within the burough normally the the Board of Education uh would need to obtain approval from that from the Department of Education generally the local planning board does not have uh any jurisdiction over the Board of Education the Board of Education doesn't need approval from the local planning board um however under the New Jersey statutes and the administrative code uh the board of education is required to submit its plans for review and recommendation to the local local planning board uh and then the local planning board has generally 45 days to issue its findings and recommendations and then the planning board would provide those recommendations and findings to the Department of Education uh so the planning board could uh evaluate the project recommend against the project recommend conditions for the project recommend modifications to the project uh but the decision on the project rests with the Department of Education who has the final say Department of Education can consider our recommendations they can modify the approval give it a conditional approval the department of education does what it feels is best uh but what makes this project a little bit different is that the Board of Education wants to build its Transportation complex on property that is owned by the bureau in which it is leasing from the buau so the bureau like any other landowner could place stipulations and conditions on the lease of that property just like if any of you lease your house to a tenant you could mandate that the tenant cuts the grass or pays the utilities uh it's a matter of contract negotiation because it's land that The Bard vet is going to lease from the bureau so unlike a normal situation in which the Department of Education would have complete control over the process uh when the board of education is leasing the Burrow's land the burrow can exercise a certain degree of control by way of that lease so that's generally the background regarding this application uh so to address what we have now before us uh the planning board received a copy of the board of education's application for the transportation complex honor about October 10th 2023 um and we were asked to schedule a formal hearing on the project um upon our receipt of the materials we learned that the application had in fact already been submitted to the Department of Education on May 8th 2023 and in fact the Department of Education had already approved the plan on May 31 2023 so we had no opportunity to conduct a review of the plan issue our findings issue our recommendations as was our right under New Jersey statute and the administrative code we also learned uh that on April 26 of 2022 uh so last year the bureau had entered into a memorandum of understanding with the Board of Education in which it agreed to material terms for the lease of this property for the board of education's specific use uh to construct its Transportation complex the uh memorandum of understanding was unanimously approved at a public meeting of the bureau Council on May 9 2022 and it was resolution number 2022-23 uh the material terms of that memorandum of understanding are as follows uh the Board of Ed was going to lease a portion of its property to the burrow for the sum of and this is the property in Morgan next to the sover uh School uh the ball fields and the playground the burrow would lease a portion of its property to the board of education for $1 and that's the the land that we're talking about now for the transportation complex the lease was going to be 50 years with a 25-year renewal option the buau uh agreed to be responsible to clear the trees and and remove stumps from the burrow property as may be necessary for the Board of Ed to construct the school transportation facility not to exceed 5 Acres of trees stumps and the burrow was waving all tree replacement requirements Andor fees fines associated with the tree and stump removal School transportation facility excuse me okay please please save your comments for for the m i I understand I'm just reading the the agreement between the council and the board of vet when constructing the transportation facility the board ofed will construct an access road through the end of the least portion of the bur of the burrow property the Board of Ed was responsible for bringing all utilities necessary for the transportation facility onto the burrow property and to the end of the access road uh the burrow and the Board of Ed each agreed to cross indemnify each other and they each agreed to be responsible for their respective least premises so that was the memorandum of agreement that was approved unanimously uh by the mayor and Council uh on May 9th 2022 so to sum all of this up this plan comes before us with the Department of education's approval already in hand because we were never given that opportunity to weigh in and with the unanimous approval of the Board of Education the council and the mayor so all elected officials in the Bureau of sville have approved the the location of this Transportation complex so no one should be under the impression or misimpression that this board has the power to change anything that all of the elected officials have approved um all we can do is issue our findings and recommendations which considering everything that's occurred already is really after the fact uh and we're here to listen to the the board of Ed's presentation um and we're here to uh listen to everyone's comments and that's why we made it a point that everyone had full notice of this meeting and an opportunity to participate so um representative of the Board of Education you can proceed with your present Mr chairman before the the presentation begins if you don't mind councilman yep just wanted to clarify I wasn't sure if my audio was was mentioned earlier for the meeting minutes um for my presence hybrid thank you thank you councilman okay want to step up sir thank you calling this meeting soly to get this out in front of you um I'm Brian with arital group I'm sorry uh just thanking the board uh for holding this meeting uh this quickly to to let us present this to the board um and the public um my name is Brian EES I'm a project architect with the spel Architectural Group um we represent the sville uh Board of Education uh I've been with them for about three years although we have worked with them uh for about five or six years now um on many projects um this project um as you have stated already it's it's it has been in as a part of a discussion for for quite some time now um I'm G to take a quick flip through the drawings I'll kind of uh lay out the um the building uh the site planning um and some of the uh aspects of that um and then um you know we can go through a Q&A um if there's any concerns questions uh from the board um um some of the stuff I'm not going to spend too much time on but this just gives you an overall idea of of what the front of the building is going to look like it's very simple building block uh block veneer block backup uh steel frame building uh asphalt shingles um there's some other imagery uh later in the presentation but just to kind of orientate everybody um as part of the agreement uh the burrow had agreed to uh lease to the district an area of about seven acres out of uh the total 77 acre lot which I'll I have an image of uh later sorry if I'm not speaking into this uh as well as I should be um so General overall layout is we have about a 10,000 foot building here we have uh circulation around the building for the buses we have a four bay uh vehic we have four vehicle Bays three of which are drive-thru um one Bay which would be for a more long-term uh maintenance that has to be done we also have what we're calling it's the business section where the ad the administrators uh work daytoday uh the transportation folks uh dispatch uh there's a training room that's included there for the drivers there's a lot of training that goes on throughout the year especially for new drivers uh storage for parts and accessories um what we don't show here um is what we call when we bid this project out as an alternate bid there was discussion of a um a fueling facility uh right now I believe the burrow kind of co-ops with the district to fill buses um at a station offsite um with 72 buses which is the ultimate buildout for the property that's a lot of fuel to be dispensed in one location um so that is not a definite piece of the plan at this point I just want to make that clear um it's an expensive incurrence for the district um we take the alternate bid as part of the public bidding process to find out what that's worth and if it's something that could be afforded then the board would discuss that as to whether to accept that or not um so in the front area is parking for um both the maintenance staff and the bus drivers that's this larger lot the administrative portion and guests visitors um would have the smaller lot in the front uh we have several large uh retention basins for our storm runoff uh to beat all the applicable code s that we have to um we have two large ones in the front and then we have smaller rain Gardens uh in the back where the buses Park so this this larger area in the back is the bus parking this is the access road that is is mentioned in the agreement um for uh the potential for future uh burrow use to a property behind us so that that serves as a dual purpose um for this property and that the cost of that is being incurred by the by the district um as part of the project all right this is just some more imagery of the building um again you know what we call CMU or concrete block facade um asphalt shingles gutters all our rainwater comes down is collected that goes to the underground uh storage system so this is just a uh this is part of our documentation this just identifies uh the existing Site Area that we're working with right that's the um the it's just slightly over believe it's 7.02 just while I'm fumbling with the drawings here um right now currently the district has buses um park around District um and that's part of the reason for the the importance of this facility is it's uh a matter of efficiency and Fuel and having a place to do these repairs that they don't have right now so this is kind of an overall um some overall imagery of the site right this is if you can see this in your handout or on this board there's a blue line around here that is the 77 acre parcel um of which we were leased uh the seven acres in this bottom corner okay I I put some dimensions on here so you get a feel for how far we off are off of lot lines we are hugging uh the Western lot line um we have about 740 fet from our property line to the boundry of the 77 Acre Site right and from the area about where our buses are going to be parked we're at about 860 just to give you idea uh so three football fields about that uh to the proper property line you have the DuPont Parlin site you've got the center for Early Childhood learning and then in the very back of the site is the site of the high school so a couple of these drawings coming up are going to look very similar um this is our general construction plan this talks about um the different parts of the site what they're made of you know where we have Madam um we have the parking area that's also Madam here these shaded areas these are your retention basins along with the strips here in in between the parking we also have one around the side um and again those are used for collecting uh water runoff so that we're not uh discharging uh any more water runoff than we're allowed to into the the natural system the retention system actually holds the water under ground um until it reaches a point that it spills over only what it needs to to to evacuate that water um this is sort of a cleaner plan shows the parking layout a grading plan I'm going to skip over this this just talks about how we're going to grade the site so that we we drain properly this one here this actually shows the retention basins right so we have uh four large ones and then we have a couple of pipes on the site that collect water and again that's to retain the water so that we're not overcharging the existing storm system so I included a landscape plan um I know one of the concerns is trees um and we're all concerned about trees this is obviously um this type of site has to be cleared for the expansive parking that they need for the buses um based on our calculations we're looking at probably 350 to 400 trees that are coming out of our seven acres right as part of our new landscape plan we're putting back about 110 plus additional plantings uh around the building and on the site um these retention basins are actually green retention basins so they'll they'll have media in them that grows um and then this is just a layout of the building I'm not going to get into too much detail but there's pretty much a division a dividing line right here this is the the uh vehicle Baye for repairs um there are some uh public bathrooms if this hosts any public events in the future we've got the dispatch area the training area and in the back we have uh storage and a toilet strictly for the uh the vehicle workers uh there is a small mezzanine upstairs that contains a lot of our mechanical equipment we're not putting anything on the roof um we're not putting anything on the ground except for one unit in the back that's very small uh so everything will be contained within the building and lastly this is just some more imagery of the building to show massing so overhead doors at the at the Bays um a a modest rather modest entrance just to identify the building um we do have a couple of canopies that are again alternate bids that we're looking at um both for the fueling Island and a storage area in the back that's gated and can be secured yeah so um of Environmental concern um we have looked at the use of uh EV buses electric buses um we are planning the infrastructure for that right now to be able to run the cabling out to the parking area um how are we going to work asking the questions because is it just going to be random we shout out no no no each have a chance to come up and questions and make comments the thank you okay so yeah I just wanted to speak to that to briefly that um that was a consideration um EV buses electric buses are extremely expensive right now as well as the infrastructure to put that in but there is a interest in that in the future so we are putting the pathways underground to be able to put future charging stations in uh for a portion of those buses anything else or no I think I think that's that's the overall anyone on the board have any questions comments that's [Music] good hi thank you very much for for the presentation and for all of the materials um when the the buau sent out a survey about issues of Paramount importance to our community um over 70% of those respondents did respond that their their biggest issues were traffic um conditions of our our parks and recre facilities and Environmental Quality and protection um and two-thirds of those respondents have lived here in sville for at least 20 or more years um in the collateral provided to this planning board it stated that the proposed bus depot can accommodate 85 buses and may also in include a fueling station um of Paramount importance to our residents obviously as stated in our surveying was traffic can you please describe the scope of the traffic study that was conducted by either the Board of Education or the burough Council so that our residents can be given a deeper look at how that bus depot would impact traffic um I can't quote I can't quote from the traffic study at this point no is there someone who can um not with us tonight no that's unfortunate because we get this opportunity to talk and and review and make recommendations there's no one that can speak to the impact of traffic in our community with this project is that correct well I mean I can speak to the fact that um it's not going to be as bad as it is if the buses were at the high school hang on one second F please please you get your chance so could you repeat your answer please we feel that this site is remote enough right and Cheesequake Road is large enough to handle order order please let let him speak and you'll get your chance please please go ahead please we don't believe in our professional opinion that the traffic is going to be a major concern here is there is there okay okay is there a a traffic study specifically that was conducted in regards to this project no you folks I I am as big a fan of of commenting in the public portion for for hot button issues I promise you at the end of this meeting there is an open session for public portion and public comment everyone who would like to speak will have a chance to speak without interruption at the microphone as the chairman has stated I do not believe that a traffic study has been completed no okay so a traffic study was not completed for the project um okay can you please describe the scope of the environmental assessment that was generated by either the Board of Education or the burough Council in regards to the bus depot so the environmental assessment that was done by our uh our team consisted of um a grading survey um for to develop storm waterer management um do you want to can you speak that I we have um our site engineer is here as well tonight if you can speak to the study yeah um Derek Jordan with Colliers engineering and design um we did yeah it was it was a um really sort of a a basic uh environmental uh review of the existing site just to see if there were any constraints on the site either DP Wetlands or such that would prevent the construction of this site in terms of um analysis of what is going to be built or generated you know additional um air quality as a result of what's built we we didn't study that it was a study of the the existing conditions um the the prior uses and how those impact uh development on our site so am I correct in in understanding that there was no environmental study commission that would study the the result of 85 buses in that area producing exhaust and I know are are we did not do that no so the the answer to that is no was there was there any study Commission mentioned that would look at displacement of native animals in that area no I part of us was we looked at we look at threaten and endanger to see if those were and there's none listed on the site so when when did the buses go out when did they return what's the operating hours of the facility um so I don't have exact hours but I believe uh drivers usually are there between uh 5:30 and 6 um to start their day they have their initial runs in the morning um they're staggered based on you know where they're going how far they're going um some return uh most return during the lunch hour um where they'll have their lunch at the facility and then they off they're off for their uh afternoon runs for pickups and then any buses that may be out late for sports or extra for like extracurricular activities what direction down Cheesequake are they generally going are they going toward bording town or they going toward toward minin that I'm not I'm not sure Pat do you both because um you understand there's new warehouses that are going up down toward minin are you with that and there's going to be a lot more tractor trailer traffic down that road um the concerns we have um and anyone living within two miles of that Transportation complex and the schools is the traffic is unbearable in the afternoon in fact I was traveling I was trying to get on ernston road today erston Road around 320 was backed up all the way past Washington toward Warden toown Avenue toward the intersection are your buses are the buses going to be going down bord town for the most part to return to the complex or are they going to be going up Washington and sneaking through minin Pat do you can you respond to that [Music] one please everybody's gonna get a chance to talk it's not fair to them if you yell from the audience the same way when you're speaking I'm sure you don't want them yelling in the middle of your conversation so not only will this go more smooth but let's just show each other some common courtesy just let them answer the questions make a note in your head and when it's your turn to come up if you want to address that comment that's the better way to handle it if everybody just yells from the audience this is this is not going to be constructive please we're trying hard but we're angry I I'm not saying that you don't have a right to be or you can be but that's not the way to show it is again ma'am I don't want to have a dialogue from the Das I just asking if everybody could just save their comments I promise you the board wants to hear your comments as much as they want to hear the the board of Ed's uh presentation we're we're we're not going anywhere everybody will get a chance to talk we promise you but this is there's a better way to handle it than just yelling from the audience so please just keep keep a mental note and you'll get a chance to talk I know you're trying please thank you question asking where the traffic will be coming from returning back to the bus complex yes so in the mornings the buses will be returning to the complex from the various Four elementary schools throughout sville and then at the end of the day they will be returning to the busard from the last drop off of the students that attend the various uh elementary schools throughout cille are they taking ernston Road and making a right on bording town to get to Cheesequake or are they going up Washington Road and making a left on mining to get to Cheesequake depend on where they were coming from so for example if you're talking about coming from the Wilson school then they are going to come from um that side of cille and come down Cheesequake Road if they're coming from um isenhower they'll be coming from the other side sure I think excuse me ma'am a lot of people on here on public side not helping us speaking also quiet public concern is that the buses are going to sit in the traffic on road and want to take turn like I do I'm my car I we have I think the the total we talked about was 72 72 buses we gonna have 72 to 85 buses turning into Laural Park I would say for the most part no they're going to travel the main roads is there any impose restriction on neighborhood ma' ma'am please I I we'll have to clear the room for the public if we can't if we can't maintain theorum so please let everyone have a chance and no yelling out please Li yeah I I'm not aware if that's anything that you know we would be imposed on us I mean we could certainly and we do try to spread our buses out so we're not on the main roads um when I say main road is a main thoroughfare we try to spread them out so we're not all sitting in traffic we don't want to sit in traffic just as much as nobody else does you know it's erston road right now and Washington Road all of our buses are going there um you know they're all going right there that's all concentrated in that area um you know there not much I I don't see how anything's going to solve that issue over in uren Road I mean the the traffic is horrendous there I think the Public's worried about taking the bus are take the tertiary routes rather than main we don't transition through Laurel Park unless we have to um I can't speak for the other vehicles that attend the other school over there they have nothing to do with us um we do get complaints on those all the time they're not our buses we have no control over them just identify who you're speaking so the minutes would just reflect sure my name is Patrick slia on the director of transportation for seral Board of V thank so so I think one of my main concerns are is the buses that are going to be going down erston and the buses that are going to be going up Bown which I Envision is going to be a lot more that road can't handle anym load people are going to be snaking through you're going to Force the other traffic up through Laurel Park you're going to you're it's going to create a nightmare and that you know and that's you don't know the answer to that any more than I do well part of the problem with this is that um you know from a planning perspective and I know the people in front of me here from the board aren't to blame but from a planning perspective the school system doesn't wasn't planned out properly just look at where the high school and the middle school are it's a nightmare it's a traffic nightmare and all of those people within the two- mile radius they don't get buses unless you pay I think $600 so you're adding more cars on there because people aren't getting their busing um and if you look at that area it's a heavily populated heavily traveled area in the burough you've got the high school the Middle School you've got Kennedy Park you've got the only Supermarket you've got the intersection of bordon toown and ernston Road and the overpass then you've got all the traffic on Washington um it's a disproportionate load on that area of the town for the people who live in Laurel Park president Park uh Woodside everyone everyone Bears the brunt of that how come this Transportation complex wasn't located somewhere outside the epicenter I know you have buses in wa in the high school parking lot and you're going down Washington Road for the most part but those buses aren't going to be going down bording town and making the right up up uh going down ernston and making the right up Bown and trying to get through the the uh over under the overpass so what other sites did you have besides putting this right in an over congested area of the town and I guess I can answer that question for you and for the record I'm Richard Laban superintendent of schools we did have another location on school property you alluded to it in your introduction we had a public joint public meeting the first joint public meeting I believe in history with the burough Council and the Board of Education this was not our first choice nor was our second choice we came together the former burrow business administrator during the latter part of the meeting was the one that recommended this place in fact the former bur administrator went ahead and told us that if we selected if we agreed to this place they would agree to removing the trees which is why that is in the agreement there were several other locations and I'm sure your engineer will tell you that that we were given opportunities to select from some of which we were told no you can't have those places we were told to look at them but we couldn't have them so we decided on this particular place and we went ahead and signed a memorandum of agreement for this particular place with everything that you spoke about earlier that's in that promiser binding document with regard to the buses sville has always had the same number of buses on the roads period no they have but same the only difference is now our drivers are the ones driving them and we are the ones owning them and if you've been around for the past 10 years you know why we we did that I'll give you one example of a of a parent that assaulted one of our bus drivers because he claimed the bus driver wasn't going the right way because it was a it was a vendor pulled the bus over and attempted to board the bus that's how crazy it got so we as a school district five years ago very publicly made it our mission to begin to purchase more buses so that we could trans transport our students ourselves because we knew that our drivers who by the way are members of this community would take far better care of our children your children than the vendors that were transporting them but it did not change the number of buses on those roads it just changed where they were coming from initially and where they were going to in the end right now we are trans sporting 95% of our kids we are six buses short of that 72 we have our buses scattered over everywhere you've been to the high school there are a number of them there but they're only on one side of the high school because of an agreement that we have with a neighbor they're at our Middle School which is occupying space for our staff to park we can't park all of our staff at the middle school because we have buses there our children at the samso Upper Elementary School cannot have recess outside on their playground area because we have buses parked there this Transportation complex has been part of our long range facility plan for five years we have funded it ourselves and we are ready to go ahead and do this we have plans to do it on school property but because of the community resistance toward that we were agreeable to where the council asked us to build it I just need to set the record straight with that so when you ask if we did a you know a traffic study no we didn't we were told this was the place we could build it so we did not do a traffic study when you asked did we do a study on the environmental impact of all those buses there no we did not because this was the parcel of land that we were told we could have if even and they even sweetened the pot by saying we'll take down those trees for you if you take this parcel of land and again Mr Cornell's right there I was at the meeting making asking all these questions please please ma'am please please and one of the things we asked was would there be remediation to that land would we have to be remediate that land I believe Mr Cornell you said at that time no there would be no need to remediate the land we also took the time to contact the people that eventually gave the land to the burrow that's Dupont and we worked with Dupont to make sure that we were following all the environmental recommendations that they made that they had set forth in the giving of the land to the burrow so we've done everything we have been required to do to make this work we understood the place we wanted that first Transportation complex was a place that the community did not want us to put it at but we need a transportation complex our students deserve to be driven to school safely by our drivers the best people for that our transportation department workers our drivers our bus AIDS our mechanics deserve a a place to hang their hats to go to to park their car safely to be able to go into a bus that they know has been maintained appropriately we they deserve that and that's what this complex is doing but I'll go back to your initial question about the congestion the congestion is what it is on ernston Washington Road there have always been the same number of buses yes those buses now will be leaving at approximately 6:30 in the morning to go to their first routes for the high school and preschool they'll be returning sometime around 4:30 when they finish their Elementary runs and yes they will be taking some access point from Washington Road if they're on that side of town down Minn down to Cheesequake or they'll be taking bordon Town up Cheesequake if they're going in that direction Dr lby no one is questioning the need for the facility I think I think a lot of people were shocked at where where it was located and how little public notice there was of when the the Board of Ed approved the location and when the the council approved the memorandum of understanding we know that you know when there's things that are important there's a big announcements everywhere cool this all these different things this one no one really knew about I was actually taken about I didn't know there was a memorandum of understanding between the board of and the council but as I said before all of the elected officials have determined it's going there so it's going there we can't stop that an election is coming up people can consider that but this is what the elected officials want so then Mr Muller why was it that you or somebody on this board this is the only reason why I'm answering someone from this board just asked what was the decision why did you choose to build this complex here and that's why I'm responding to this I was under the impression that that's not the purpose of this meeting I was under the impression the purpose of this meeting was for our architect and our engineer to answer any questions that you have about the actual facility or any questions that the public have but when you had and asked that question I felt like I had to give you a response to it Dr Dr Lobby I mean the the purpose of of the presentation here is not just to to physically remark on the architecture of the building or to learn the site plans it's also to talk about the work that each of the people on this day have done to recommit to our master plan moving forward and your complex and the way that it adheres to our long-term planning goals and land usage goals so yes absolutely the goal here is to understand the complex and give the public an opportunity to comment but it is also to see if you if if this project adheres to what we are trying to do in a longterm way and Mr I I I don't have a problem with that but I think that's a better question that you should be asking to the council we we don't have the council here Dr lbby but I could tell you that we are allowed to to to probe into whether your the transportation complex fits within the municipal master plan and our land use plan element and I'm saying that where you're going to put it is already an over congested overdeveloped area that's going to create more problems and I know it doesn't matter for a lot of other people in the burrow for the people who live within two miles it's going to be even worse uh traveling around there but I just want to be clear you're saying that Cheesequake Road was the only viable uh site that the the council was offering you what I'm telling you is this is and I'm not telling you anything that you can't just go on video and watch it's on our website it's on the burough Council website go ahead and watch the video if you want to learn more about when trans what transpired it's all on video what I'm telling you is this is we were given options and Mr Cornell can go ahead and confirm that we were given options all around the burrow and we selected several that were not the Burl was not in agreement with this is the one we this wasn't even one of those that were on the list and Mr the the former business administrator said well wait a minute I have an idea why don't I have a place where I think you can build this watch the video and I said first thing I said was that's all wooded that's all Woodland are you kidding me that's all Woodland we're going to we're going to cut all those trees down and that's going to cost far more than we budgeted we didn't budget to to take down trees and remove stumps and things like that that's not what we budgeted for we budgeted for the location that we were going to have it at and one of the things that we did look at was how much do we have to clear how much infrastructure do we have to work with in that particular place I want to add one more thing that I think is important to note we're putting that access road there and we are I would say onethird of the cost of the site development of this is just for bringing those Utilities in but not only bringing them in we're bringing them to the edge of that road do you know why we're bringing them to the edge of that road do you know Mr Muller you're you're going to be using it for the burrow the burrow wants is potentially going to use it for a new DPW plant that's why we agreed to bring the utilities to the end of that access road do you know how much it would cost C to raise five acres of forest do I know how much it would cost no I don't know I mean it's it's significant and the Burrows apparent listen you guys cut a deal with the burrow that's fine we're just trying to figure out so we can make a proper recommendation based upon our master plan and sort of you know just interject some common sense into where we put our development and say all right this is one area of the of the burrow that is a nightmare to begin with with everything there I think the mayor described Kennedy Park as Central Park it's the Hub why are we going to you know burden that system even more and I know you're telling me about the buses but it is going to be a major major it's going to be a safety and health issue when people can't get down ernston road because you have lines of buses that are trying to get to the intersection but that's never going to change sir you're always going to have our buses on ernston road and you're always going to have our buses on Washington Road and you're always going to have our buses on Main Street because those are the three main arteries and Mr C please please let him let him speak and again I I I'll answer that question Mr slia said that the only time there is another school district's buses that sometimes Traverse through Kendall Park because it's the parland area and we share that with that other school district our buses our drivers have been directed by our director to use the main arteries when getting to places now obviously if we're going into that neighborhood to pick up children we're going to have to dverse through it but we're not using small neighborhoods to cut through areas yes we'll we have to you they they know that they need to use those main arteries unless they're going into those neighborhoods to pick children up but you're always going to have our buses sir on those three main arteries of this town what about the cost of the project because I think we're all sort of shell shocked when we got our tax bill with the whole cool to school thing what is this going to go up also this 9 million 498 472 all this money has been generated in our capital reserve so again we have we're we're pretty lucky in saal to have a brilliant business administrator so over the past 10 years we have been putting money away in our capital reserve for this so this is not going to cost the taxpayer anything because the money is already there how long is it going to take to build you think this is now a question probably for our architect um I can I can try to give an answer we're hoping that we'll at least get the site developed by September of 2024 correct and so I'm I'm more aggressive than this so he's he's looking at me like yeah yeah and hopefully have the complex because we we're going to go out to bid for the complex pretty soon we're hoping to have that done maybe by January yeah we're actually looking at uh end of December as our 2025 we 24 24 December 24 then December of 24 is our projected completion for the building itself Yes again you know we need to get our buses right now out of our schools it breaks my heart that my fourth and fifth graders aren't able to go out on the blacktop and have their recess because I have our buses there it breaks my heart that my staff members at the middle school can't park their vehicles there because I have buses there so we're we're we're patiently waiting for the opportunity to do this and don't get me wrong we're very grateful to the council for affording us a place where we can put our transportation complex we're not we're not toned deaf Mr Mill we know that wherever we put this there are going to be people in that area they don't want it nobody wants to have a transportation complex next to their residents so we know that but I do need to mention that we are grateful that the council met with us and we were able to work out uh you know what we feel was a good agreement and now we finally have a place to have our buses stored safely and a place where we can repair them efficiently without sending them out to vender by the way which costs taxpayers money the more buses that we maintain in District the less money it costs us to maintain them so there are a lot of benefits to what we're doing and we are grateful to the council for that are are there going to be sidewalks um a budding Cheesequake adjacent to the the bus facility the the transportation complex and and do you envision any type of crosswalk I know you you're close to the um Aquatic Center pretty close right across the street from do you envision any spill over parking into the Aquatic Center from the the transportation complex no no it's actually the uh Center for uh lifelong learning is is closer to us across the street and then the swimming center is is beyond that c yes that's that's how I refer to it as the Aquatic Center um okay okay do anyone else have any questions for uh Dr lbby or any of the the board of just just to answer one of the the last question you had about sidewalks so we are not proposing sidewalks along Cheesequake Road um kind of the last thing that we want is to generate pedestrian traffic by our transportation complex uh was more of a safety concern we also needed that Frontage for our retention um and to also bring back plantings and trees along the on the ska uh roadscape my concern is that um the the Aquatic Center as I refer to it it's it's a gym people get memberships that if any of your drivers of you know go there during the lunch break to exercise people getting across Cheesequake Road that it's safe if they're going to be walking over and using the facilities and coming back yeah this facility you know the intent is to not be sharing parking for adjacent properties does anyone else have any questions comments from the board go ahead you know just wanted toh address a few comments councilman first sure sorry can you all hear me yes yeah you don't mind if I take a moment to say a few words if possible or is there someone else speaking go councilman thank you you know I I just wanted to add uh you know additional context maybe from the council perspective as well um as I had the privilege of being uh a part of the initial meeting where uh this deal was um brokered through our business administrator and um legal professionals and you know from the council perspective the the main pitch you know was uh primarily focusing on the physical feasibility of the site and you know I believe that it was our um hope and anticipation that moving forward um you know the uh the Board of Education would conduct a traffic assessment and to at least um you know bring forward you know to the planning board what their ideas were more information in regards to let's say the the peak traffic times and maybe ways in which they would be able to U manage you know traffic flows during the the peak tra traffic times um more information regarding to perhaps the the entrance and and and exit points and you know uh different ways in which um mitigation measures can be put in place whether it's uh turning Lanes or or traffic signals or um or or unique ideas in which um they would be coordinating with local authorities be it our Police Department I mean we you know um these were not things that the burough Council anticipated to really review um but our IDE a was to give them options that from from a physical feasibility standpoint Beyond you know beyond the the the the wetlands and you know uh spaces that that weren't possible to actually build upon you know so we didn't necessarily go into all the details as a counil on the community concerns and um more specifically to to the traffic and uh you know the different bus routes and the schedules and um you know our hope and even from from the public safety standpoint as well you know um the different walk ways as you just brought up um Mr chairman or you know th those perspectives um so that's why we're grateful for this conversation this this discourse and hopefully that can be put into context as well thank you councilman um I think you know part of the the issue here is that we probably should have had this conversation about a year and a half ago and we're having it now and um that that's part of the problem and uh you know I don't know the the memorandum of understanding it's not a lease but I'm not going to comment on what can be negotiated as part of that lease if there's any way to ameliorate any of these traffic issues or do a traffic study we're going to have a lot more tractor trailers coming on Cheesequake and again that that wasn't something that this planning board did that was a Redevelopment project that was approved by the the buau uh but that that area is going to be in my view and I hope I'm wrong it's going to be a nightmare and there's nothing that anyone can do about it here so we can talk about it we can talk about what may have been good or what we we maybe should have done before we entered into anou and different things but we're here now and there's nothing we can do Mr B you had a question yeah I I had some specific questions um we will be you know taking the time to put together a report with recommendations I have questions about the way that this project adheres to our master plan um the 2023 reexamination plan lists eight specific goals from the 2013 master plan that are being carried over um for those in attendance it is the the The Guiding Light that we all sort of adhere to in terms of planning our community um the goals that I that I have specific questions about um our our second goal which is to continue to encourage aesthetic and site improvements in the Burrow's major commercial and industrial areas um and then the third is is to encourage and promote an improved visual environment and the preservation of natural system and environmentally sensitive areas can someone from the board um Team here help this board and our residents understand how the proposed Transportation complex will either promote an improved visual environment or the preservation of natural systems and environmentally sensitive areas no okay um the fifth item is to encourage the provision for cost-effective expansion of educational and cultural facilities does the Board of Education consider a $9.5 million bus Depot to be a cost-effective expansion of an educational or cultural facility educational yes okay exactly yeah I I have a kid in that system so I am grateful um the sixth item is to plan and implement the expansion and Improvement of community facilities and programs that are consistent with a stable Revenue base does the Board of Education consider the bus depot to be a community facility it it certainly can act as that um you know this um training room that we have can support uh 70 to 80 people um so there's definitely that option there um that the board you know obviously under their God their uh discretion could open that up for uh you know public meeting space um our buses grou space our buses are often used for many things for the community I'll give you a great example if you weren't on the ghost tours we provided those buses at no cost to the burough for those we've done those things before we have we we like to practice shared services we have a great shared services program with the recreation department we share our facilities they share their facilities I mentioned earlier the reason why we're building an access road and the reason why we're paying all that money to to connect those utilities and bring them all the way down to the end of that property is because we were told that that could be the future home of a brand new DPW plane so again that would answer your question about Community well I I asked because I also know that that site was potentially listed as a community center um in conversation and I I I well I I don't want to correct you um board member but I believe that the last time we were told was the that Community Center that you're referencing is where the ballparks are right now across the street the the adult ballparks the adult softball fields we were told back then that that area right there was going going to be used potentially for that okay um so in terms of the um the expansion and Improvement of community facilities what stable revenue is the transportation complex providing to the burrow in that vein what stable Revenue are we providing well again one of the things that we do is not only do we provide a shared service but um we do utilize our buses for Revenue purposes as well and that generates Revenue maybe not for the burrow directly but it's for the school district and again um when it comes to Residents taxes they're all coming out of the same Pockets so whether you're paying the school tax or whether you're paying the burrow tax it's coming out of the same taxpayer eror so anything that we can do to generate Revenue we're doing and one of the ways that we do try to generate revenue is through our busing Services what's which was another reason why we decided at that point let's do our own busing also it is much less cost expensive to go ahead and provide our own transportation then use some of these vendors now who are downright PR uh price gate gouging school districts you've probably heard about it in various news reports on how these bus vendors are taking advantage of school districts especially after the pandemic we're not one of those bus we're not one of those districts you might have also heard how many districts have been wiped out because they can't bust kids for athletics they can't bust kids for this they can't bust kids for that I believe Edison this year couldn't bus close to a thousand kids at one point because of the these bus vendors we don't have that issue here because we're doing it ourselves so yes we are trying to re generate revenue for the school district which in essence is indirectly generating revenue for the burrow but we're also saving money by doing this as well understood the the seventh 10et of our our master plan uh is to plan and implement the Improvement of circulation and transportation facilities and other infrastructure elements consistent with a stable Revenue base does the Board of Education consider the bus depot to be a transportation facility and if so what stable revenue is that Depot providing well I mean I feel like that's a trick question just looking at our Master facility of course it's a transportation facility is it a public transportation facility is that your question or is it you're just asking me is is it a transportation facility I'm just doing my due diligence as a member of the planning board to make sure that the recommendations that we issue are consistent with that asking if it's a public transportation facility no but if it's a a transportation facility obviously it is okay two more questions uh administrative offices how many uh administrated folks are you going to have there not bus drivers too okay the um buses that are going to be vacating the high school um is that going to open up for student parking yes so right now they Park in Kennedy Park I mean I I think they Park in Kennedy Park there's there's a couple of things you know I want to I want to in in in the spirit of full disclosure part of the reason why some of our kids are are not parking at the high school right now first of all we've only ever allowed 100 kids to park in the parking lot at the high school but the greater issue is we are currently at a standstill with a solar power purchase agreement with our financer who basically has shut down all work at the high school and they have supplies in one area of that parking lot that we are trying to once that area is vacated by them and that's a legal proceeding we'll be able to open up parking again for our students what it's going to alleviate us is all those buses because of a settlement agreement with a neighbor over there none of those buses can be on the east side of the high school they have to be on the west side of the high school but that's the athletic side of the high school school so once those buses vacate that area then we'll be able to put more parking in that place especially during athletic events graduations um athletic activities and so forth people will be able to park over there again they can't right now because our buses are there any other questions or issues before I take a motion to open to the public I don't want to take the the public time been patient yeah I I just have to say as a resident of Sarah as a member of the environmental commission as a member of our planning board should this application have come before us should the planning board have had the authority to approve or deny the application um on the grounds that the answers provided here are inconsistent with our master plan um that is the Touchstone against which we base all of our forward- facing gaze for our Burrow's future um my my vote would be no um I love my son I love his classmates I love Miss Laura his bus driver I love all of those kids and I know every person on this day and every person here in the gallery feels the same way that isn't the issue of contention here um I I will add that while I'm grateful that the board of education has has finally acquiesced and followed the statute regarding its required presentation to this planning board I am discouraged by the lack of transparency and Community interaction with which the specific location of this project was selected um you know I think that the sville residents whose voices all play a part in in the future that our children know I think those folks deserved a little bit better than they got here so just I'll just add to that that I understand what happened with the first location I understand there was a huge public uproar about it I'm not convinced that this is the best place for it maybe it is I just don't know we haven't had our professionals review you know review the entire set of plans we don't you know this isn't a site plan application where we can do a tech technical review of everything and figure out if this is really the best place for it we need the transportation complex there's no doubt about it and I don't you know I think it's it's commendable that the Board of Ed is moving forward with it I just don't I just don't know that this is the best place it doesn't seem like it is but I don't know and I think you know entering into a lease I mean if this was Board of Ed property you could say hey you might disagree chairman meller but there's nothing you can do the fact that we had we on the land and we can lease it and that gives us some amount of control we should have had a determination of whether this was the best place for it before we entered into a a potential binding lease so with that unless any anyone else has any comments I'll entertain a motion to open to the public okay so why don't we start um Mr Robinson you want to come up identifi address wouldn't mind I we're not swearing in anyone under oath but if you could just give us your name and address I'm certainly going to do that uh first I want to I want to thank you uh Mr chairman for your excellent questions you Mr spado for your excellent questions my name is Jim Robinson I'm a former member of the seral Board of Education former planning board chairman former um president of New Jersey planning officials and I I just have to comment on some things before I get into details because I want to set the record straight you said the time that you should have come before us was a year and a half ago well I'll tell you I couldn't agree more and the statute says the same thing and I first got involved in this project it's not in my neighborhood either on Cheesequake Road or in Morgan I first got involved when residents in Morgan called me and asked me for some help and one of the first things I did was send Dr Labby and the Board of Education a copy of 4055 d-31 and you read the second part of that statute on Capital review and I and let me just say this I've sent it three more times since then okay certainly to doctor Labby and perhaps to members of the board of education but let me just read the first part of that statute okay whenever the planning board shall have adopted any portion of the master plan the governing body or any other public agency having jurisdiction over the matter before taking any action necessitating the expenditure of public funds incidental to the location character incidental to the location character or extent of such project shall refer the action involving such specific project to the planning board for review and recommendation in conjunction with such master plan and shall not act thereon without such recommendation or until 45 days have elapsed blah blah blah blah blah that's the first part okay the second part I want to say is this while I appreciate your comments I'm going to disagree with you a little bit about whether they had to come before the board if it wasn't burough property according to this part they do and I will tell you this when I was the chairman of the planning board the Board of Education came before the planning board the burrow came before the planning board the Housing Authority came before the planning board with projects for review and I will tell you this why that's so important and it's it's kind of Germaine actually the council years ago in the 80s wanted to put the first aid squad over here where the Public's Works garage was and I said whoa that's not a good idea you're going to have people speeding in and speeding out kids in the playground over here playing ambulances racing out let's come before the planning board and they came before the planning board on location to talk about location before they had drawn up any plans before they had spent any money and the planning board said I remember saying this you know over here you're actually closer to most of South River than you are to so much of servil you ought to go back and take a look at location and they did the council did we talked about the area by Dupont and mayor McCormick called Dupont said you know you have some property over there next to the post office you think we can make an arrangement here and I I think it's a lease agreement but they came before the planning board with that and that saved taxpayers money and it's a better location okay so that's that's the first thing I want to say four times four times S I sent the statute to Dr Labby I had a conversation with the school board attorney a couple weeks ago where I said you got to do that the the form that they are required to fill out the project schedule form from the state doe Department of Education item number five submission to the planning board and the date filled in here is March of 2023 now you know I don't want to indicate how old I am but when I was in high school I was in Dr parnell's philosophy class if I was seven months late with an assignment there there'd be hell to pay there'd be a penalty and so you know I Mr Robinson just just I'm gonna try and get to this no no can I can I just respond to one thing you said and just for full disclosure there was a a letter that was included which was purportedly sent to the planning board on in March of 2023 we've checked our records we didn't get it I don't know what happened so I just want to let and I know can I speak to that well uh when I'm done yeah but I just wanted to set the record because I don't want you not only did I tell Dr Lobby it was required and cite the statute he responded to me that it wasn't a I had a conversation with a board of education member who said to me no we don't have to do that and I'll tell you I'll tell you something else M I get a few emails from folks folks saying why are you against the kids why are you against the school board I want to tell you what I did for the last year and a half for the last year and a half I fought a pilot for a mega Warehouse on Cheesequake Road because if that pilot had gone through it would have deprived the Board of Education of a million dollars a year in taxes so I have a concern for the education in this school system so I don't want to hear that but that being said I'm glad they finally agreed they're here before us so that we can talk about this five this 9.5 uh million dollar project and the other thing I heard was Dr lbby talk about the five-year Capital plan second part of that statute 459 d-31 talks about that educational facilities construct the uh educational facilities and financing act says they should be coming before the planning board if they have a fiveyear plan they should be before the planning board to talk about that Five-Year Plan so that they get your input so that these folks are here and can give their input and so we don't waste money okay now having having said that I just want to give you a very little history it took me a while to do some research here and I I sent some of you and I posted on Facebook a story that I saw back in I think it was in the newspaper in 2005 Dupont donated this property it was finally effectuated in 2008 and the stated purpose in the release was for conservation and the term Nature Preserve was used throughout that report now while that was done and mayor and said I happily accept this on behalf of the burrow it was never put on the open space inventory the zoning was never changed from industrial and the master plan that was done in 2013 never took that into account and changed it and um I understand a lot of the things from the 2013 master plan were never incorporated into the zoning uh uh to the zoning ordinance during uh mayor O'Brien's uh term here so that is adding to the problem here that's adding to the confusion that way back then the burrow never said this land is preserved that was the intent that's what everybody thought that's what the press release that the mayor put out said that ain't the case okay and that's unfortunate um Now understand the question before the board you know there's the piso Manon case you know about that you know that you're supposed to look at this with res respect to the master plan and how it meshes with the master plan um and I know you have to do that and I would say this please use this as an example I know Susan GRL a wonderful planning firm is doing a new master plan please use this as a lesson and make sure that no property anywhere that is supposed to be in intended to be open space and is given to us for the purpose of being open space is ever allowed to be developed because right now right now that is zoned industrial the master plan says it should be special economic development but the zoning ordinance I think says it's industrial so God knows uh what could happen um I'm glad we could see where on the property this would go and I think it's it's 575 ft from the nearest home is that correct nearest property line um yeah so if you go from the property line out we're talking about it's uh just under 750 740 plus or minus how far is it from the Walter Faith Ballfield property line I'm not familiar with with the field this here it's the uh yeah it's in the corner it's the prime piece right so just kind of scaling off of here it's probably about 300 feet so 300 feet from the 300 to 350 okay all right and I I I would expect that when the planning board makes their review and I think people here will ask questions that we'll talk about lights sound noise vibration fumes drainage um traffic environmental concerns the impact of tree removal as well as the hours of operation now in October Dr lab I sent Dr Labby we've had a number of emails going back and forth because this is a con has been a concern to me since that ill-advised proposal to put this at slow School i' I've had a concern about this in October Dr Lobby didn't tell me the number of trees that were going to be removed did you say 400 we're estimating about 400 yes 400 now one of the school board members told me the cost of removing trees is between $750,000 and a million do just for tree removal is that accurate um I can't speak to that specifically but yes it's it's probably in that range it's in that range that's that's what we estimated that's what we thought when we had that joint meeting I don't believe the total cost of the tree removal and the stump removal I believe that was somewhere around $200,000 two $300,000 so the 750 that was what during that joint meeting that's where you're getting that from in the joint meeting I was estimating when I was talking to the former business administrator and he was trying to convince us on the location I'm saying I basically said this is going to cost probably an around $750,000 to a million dollars to do are you sure this is what you want to do a board member gave me that figure not too long ago and she said that did you had spoken about that I think in the June 24th meeting I don't know who you spoke to and I don't want to get involved in the conversation that you had but that was yes that was a conversation that we had during that joint meeting okay the actual cost is something around $2 to $300,000 okay I will I will tell you this um I've talked to members of the governing body and one of the first questions I I'm sorry I should address you Mr chair uh one of the first questions I asked Dr Lobby is if there would be a fuel um dispensing system on site and at that time the answer was no I asked that question at a burrow council meeting and the council said they didn't think that they could continue to use uh the burrow facilities um especially if they're going to be expanding so I think I think we have to know that and that should be part of the plan and that should be part of your recommendation and of course you know when you're talking about underground storage tanks the proximity to the well Fields I think is important so I think we have to take that into consideration and Mr spado you talked about the wildlife on the property so I won't I won't go into that I would ask how often um will the conference room be used or the training room I'm sorry you're asking us I'm sorry am I allowed to answer chairman uh the it's going to be used quite often for our drivers however we will be allowing other school districts that don't have a training facility to go ahead for Revenue purposes and utilize it if they need it in fact again back to the question about Community um that's something again that I'm sure that we could enter into our shared Ser our shared services agreement if that space needed to be used by the buau for any type of training or any type of meeting purposes that is something that we've always done done we will continue to do okay did I understand you say other one more thing you said um I'm sorry Mr Robinson with Mr Robinson we're we're bucking up on 15 minutes and and I I yeah and you can sit down I just want to let other people and then you can come back up certainly but I've been asking for this meeting for a year and a half I know okay and have been ignored I came to the planning board I came to the council I have just a couple more questions um and I won't go into the traffic study that uh but I did send that traffic study to Dr Labby um the traffic study that was done for the Arsenal warehouses so and he thanked me for that he's always very gracious and responding but he has that traffic study I sent it him quite a while ago I'll be very happy to share it with anybody who wants to see it I think I posted it online as a matter of fact um and my last question is this is other sites I think I had suggested some other sites I I took about two or three days to go around and physically look at sites I sent an email to at least to Dr lbby maybe to the board and one of the sites that and I specifically looked at SP sites that would not require the denuding of trees um and I asked Dr Labby what the specs were what the requirements he told me what size the size of the building the size of the acreage everything like that so I spent a lot of t i put a lot of time effort and energy into doing this and I looked at some sites on the Main Street Extension which aren't near homes and wouldn't require trees to be taken down I'm not so sure that a community center uh should be over at that other ball field on Cheesequake Road that's something that ought to be looked at that I you know there there trees are already gone there that wouldn't impact the neighborhood quite as much I mean it's not the not the best location U but it's certainly better than this location and the site that I asked Dr I had a few conversations with Dr lbby about was coincidentally next to the first day squat on Dupont owned property there's a big building there in the front that building uh that building has b r red red x on it it's to be demolished it's unsafe it's from the 19 something 1900s um and dupon has always been very cooperative and generous with the town we got the first aid Squad from them if you drive back there walk that property as I did a lot of it is paved there are no trees there the only thing that would have to be taken down is the building it is the only other thing I would disagree with you on location of the schools that is the center of town now maybe that creates traffic there but the high school and Junior High were placed there because they're equidistant that is the the geographic center of town if you look at a map um you will see that so I I would I would just ask if uh the DuPont uh site was uh how much consideration was the other Dupont site given Dr lby consideration in fact I contacted Dupont and they said no that's not what you reported to me hold on you advised me of this I looked into it we didn't have any correspondents after that okay they said no okay in fact I met with them and had lunch with them and they said no okay with regard to the fueling sure initially I did say Mr Robinson during that public meeting that we had no intention of putting a fueling tank in however after the discussion came up about the fact that the burrow wasn't sure if they were going to be able to fuel our buses that's when as Mr Eve said earlier we created an alternate for that just in case thank you I appreciate that and I I just Mr Robinson what would you have this board do given the state of affairs with the fact that Department of Education already issued the approval and there's an on this side and not on that side anymore because and when I sat there the piso man case hadn't come down and those people who or board members know what piso Manon says piso Manon says that you have to judge Things based on the law and only the law and not your and standards that are that are written and not on your feelings um that's one of the reasons that's one of the reasons that they should have been in here a year and a half ago so that then you could have said look this is my feeling on this I think you should go back to the drawing board this is just a a little bit better than the Slover school um and Mr chairman well Mr yeah I mean you want to address the the letter I want to clarify something here on on scheduling and and why today and not a year ago um when we first started this projects and began drafting all the documents that go to Doe um our standard our procedure in our office is that when we send that to doe we simultaneously send those same documents to the planning board that did not happen okay I've I've spoken with Beth a number of times we both did due diligence to go back and look for such documents it does not appear that we sent that and for that I am gratefully you know I'm greatly sorry um that we are here now and not back then it was a it was a slip up wasn't anything intentional um I we I I appreciate that I listen mistakes happen we we understand um so go ahead we understand it was a mistake I know my time is up chairman but I want to just respond to that response I don't know I don't know how much that forgetting to send the plans cost the taxpayers um but what has been spent to date on this project I I couldn't tell you total total value who can say what has been are you talking about professional fees and and everything what has been spent to date everything that has been spent to date on this project I don't have that number available at this at this time whatever that is whatever that is before that was spent you should have been here for the input from the board and the public and to to quite simply answer your question what do I think you should do I should think I think you should do the best you can for the people I think you should do the best you can for the people thank you very much sorry I took so much time that's okay I know you've been waiting hello hi ma'am could you just state your name and address for the record please joyn Ryan you want the address too please 129 Kendall Drive so I am directly affected by this project because it will be literally in my backyard refer to as Laural park where you live right correct okay so right off Cheesequake is Kendall Drive and we have a lot of people here who have backyards that this project will back right up to especially if you put a Public Works building as was suggested might happen later on or tanks underground that's extremely concerning um to you sir we love children so when you I'm a former teacher so when you sit there repeatedly and say I want my third graders to have lunch or recess I'm sorry and and you're pulling sorry and well I'm I'm referring as to him and you're pulling the heartstrings we want our community to know that we love all the children in our community that doesn't make this the right spot for this okay this is land that was owned by Dupont okay Dupont gave this land that it not be built on for a reason it's polluted so if you want to talk about cost Effectiveness you might want to consider future litigation you're putting a bus deer for children on land that is contaminated here can we all see that is there a video I called Governor Murphy's today his office I called the EAP uh they will be opening a case on this very possibly uh the EPA I'm sorry because this is not land that is supposed to be built on whoever authorized that completely jumped this jumped the rule that this L there's still copper if you go back there there's still copper flooring that jupon put there and copper dust is that something you'll feel safe with with your children really you want a place to put a bus because you're tired of trying to find a place a bus depot you want the business that doesn't make it the ethical thing to do for the children or for this community okay you know a long time ago dupon tried to make up for what they did all right but you're repeating that mistake because you don't have enough of an environmental guidance going on here that you know that it's even safe you don't and there's signs back there there's signs back there in that in those woods that says Environmental Protection it's not supposed to be touched that was part of the deal with Dupont so I would say to Governor Murphy who I called today to the EPA I called Frank palone our representative and I beg them to get involved in this because a it might not be safe for the children which is future litigation two this is a residential neighborhood you could have chosen or who whoever whomever was in charge I'm not blaming you you could have chosen an industrial area along joury Mill Road this is residential so that means we're going to be exposed to the carbon monoxide possible uh tanks underneath your your your trucks and and buses how many of them I'm sorry how many we're planning for 72 72 buses in our backyards starting up at 5:30 in the morning and the carbon monoxide well that's another future litigation possibly it is a bad place to put it no matter who said it was a good place and it's time for people to be ethical you need to be ethical about this thank you for your time thank you Mr chairman anyone else in person please St yep come on up miss Mr chairman can I address two sure one come on up and we'll have him address it too go ahead um let me just clarify on on the fuel tanks fuel tanks are not going to be buried in the ground these are above ground fuel tanks um that's the that's the proposal if it were to move forward um secondly I can't speak in a lot of detail to the DuPont property and the contamination okay I I'm not gonna come over and read your I'm not gonna come read your phone I'll make a cop no that that's okay we we have the board and us we have spoken about the DuPont property um and I'm not going to speak for Dr Labby right but I believe there were conversations about that concern there are monitoring Wells out in that 77 acre area they are not on our site okay that was one of the first things we looked at was if they were there do they still contain C contamination can we get rid of them there's there's no there's no building on that there's no building on that site ma'am ma'am please please let him respond I can't speak to the Copper there's no building on this site that we're looking at okay as as far as I understand the ground Wells have been monitored after Dupont put those in 25 years ago I believe it was and I believe please don't quote me on this that they have been monitored and have found to have levels below any cause for concern just so we're clear right now the buses are at the high school right so that that pollution is generating by our schools right correct at at MD school sam for elementary that's right and samel in the back okay okay well Evelyn pleas state your name and and address Evelyn Smith 124 Kendall Drive my house is in the middle of kendle and pine tree if anybody knows about the traffic in Laurel Park it's me okay I've had several uh vehicles have been hit in front of my house because of people speeding we call it Kendall Raceway because it's not just a a drive it's a Raceway people are it's unbelievable they they're doing 50 miles an hour down this street okay um and you know I don't care how much Mr Ley says um the bus drivers are going to go through and you have no right to tell them that the buses can't go through just like we can't tell the tractor trailers that they can't go through because that has been discussed because we don't want them coming through our neighborhood okay but it's not it's not within the law to be able to do that we can't do it um I believe we can set a um a weight limit but that's that's a about it we can't just blanket say no tractor trailers did you have children that attended this local school I attended the local school did get that house okay do you get a bus in that area when I was in Elementary School uh I was busted okay uh at the time it was a junior high once it went to a junior high then I did not get busted so I drove from the end of Laurel Park all the way up up Kendall and down the black path and then up a hill behind the middle school to get to the junior high at the time we we understand the traffic issues in Laurel Park without the the transportation complex we understand that fully and that's a lot of our concern we don't want to generate any more traffic into your area um no one wants additional traffic in their area um I we understand you're talking that that you know we have the the buses at the uh high school and at the middle school and at uh Slover and all the a you know you're not solving the problem you're moving it and you're moving it closer to our development okay that that's not a solution however you do have a solution okay because you said that you have to go by you know this the standards of what uh you know this is supposed to to have well you can say no because the rules were not followed that in immediately stops everything you can say it was not followed properly and so therefore it is not allowed and we're not going to do it go back and start all over again and do it someplace that's not going to impact a neighborhood like ours like the Main Street Extension there's plenty of room there okay Journey Mill Road plenty of room there okay there are places where you're not going to be impacting the housing now how how far away did you say that the uh the road going in was going to be from the houses on Kendall Drive the access road yeah we're at about uh 1,200 square feet to the west side of the property from the back of the the houses on Kendall Drive well no we're taking it based on the property line the houses are set back even further from that right because once before uh someone wanted to build houses behind the houses on Kendall Drive and and uh we fought them and one of the reasons was because there was no way to get a road in there that wasn't going to um be in uh you know the ESS of the houses that are already there so um but the the idea of and where where is is the park still there I mean have you taken out the park no there's no Park that we're taking out there's there's there's two ballparks there's one here and that remains as well as the one across the street on the corner oh okay I didn't realize that that was yeah there's a there's a cutout here in that site specifically for the the Laur Park Park which spent a lot of time in the last 60 some odd years uh since I've lived in uh you know at that house right in the corner of Kendall and pine tree and so uh I have a good view of most things that have gone on in my neighborhood um I just wanted to address one thing you said just so that the public is aware and the bo members are aware this board doesn't have the right to say no to anything in the same way it doesn't have the right to say yes to anything this is in the parland of land use this is a courtesy review they come before us in order to let us know what they're planning on doing the board's function is to figure out if it's consistent with the master plan and make recommendations in this case to the Department of Education the Department of Education can agree with those recommendations say we don't care about your recommendations there not binding on anyone okay but before they can bring it to you they have to do certain steps right no they have to come here and just tell us what they plan to do they have to it's a courtesy a year and a half after they started planning it the the deadlines has has been have been spoken to um we we still believe the planning board is still within their 45 days period to comment because we only got this eight days ago but again it's a comment it literally gets sent as a recommendation to the Department of Education right now practically speaking if the Department of Education has already approved it I don't know what result any potential recommendation would have but they could the Department of Education could certainly revisit it based on whatever the recommendations might be but I just want to be clear nobody on this board can say no you can't do it nobody on this board can say yes you can do it um and the same way when the DP to the Board of Education I mean to the Department of Education and tell them that we object to this what you can do with the Department of Education I don't know I'm not an education lawyer I don't know I I think your your time would be better spent perhaps addressing your concerns directly with the Board of Education or going to I I sent an email to and he never answered me so I know what kind of response I'm going to get there the other way is the council still has to negotiate the lease with the Board of Education now there's a memorandum of understanding that's been signed okay I'm not going to comment as to the legality in terms of what can be added or not but they are still negotiating terms for a lease so for instance if you say hey could you put in a term in there that says that this complex will be vetted by the board's Professionals for you know issues that Mr Robinson said about lighting and different things that maybe the the the the council can negotiate that in the lease it's it's a give and take between the Board of Ed and the council so that that is the real power that we have when I say power it's it's burrow property that is being leased now they're leasing us they're Leasing Property back to us and remember the board of ed for whoever you want to think they did listen to the public they could have said no we're not we're going to build it by C cover and gone to the Department of Education and of Education any meeting that was well it was a big it was a big to-do to their to their credit they did they did move it they did relocate it to try to be good neighbors so I don't want this to be like a bashing the Board of Ed type meeting that's not what it's for we're just looking to see if there's anything that can be added like I said all the elected officials in this in this burrow have approved this so we can't do anything I will have to have a word with them all um the other thing you said uh the tanks the gas tanks are not going to be in the ground they're going to be above that doesn't um take into account spillage all right I mean you know you you have a tank there and you take the hose and you go to put and you know you're going to have spillage between you know when the the uh guy with the the tanker comes to refill it there's going to be spillage so you are cre there's always there's always that possibility there are safety measures in place there's Leak Detection things like that but the physical transfer of fuel from one vehicle to the other I can't speak to and now you're telling me that besides this they're going to put the Department of Public Works there too so we're going to have to deal with all of the work trucks going in and out and through our neighborhood as well that's that's nothing that I can speak to so and and that should be another meeting because there'll be a courtesy review for that if that plan ever comes yeah as long as we're informed I mean you know I would have been here a year and a half ago if IID known that this was happening that's why we broadcast this meeting on the board we made sure everyone I know it was after the fact but we made sure everyone had notice of it so they had an opportunity to say their peace because that's the worst thing that could happen you don't have an opportunity to say your peace right but we're it's it's kind of like putting the cart before the horse because there's nothing we can do about it except you know to you and uh you know and say and you say oh I understand but I can't do a damn thing about it it's like the opinion that you have on that side of the microphone is the same opinion that some of us on this day have as well at at this point the ship has sailed we can advise we can comment We can question but can we do okay well because again this as we had stated as the chairman mentioned this is a capital review versus a normal land usage application so in a in a normal and and listen as a member of the STS I will tell you I have had to bite my tongue on other projects I'm I'm here because I'm also on I'm also on the environmental commission here in town and so there have been lots of developments that I have had to say yes to because as Mr Robinson suggested the case law the precedent there is that it's facts not feelings we can't vote for things that we want or don't want we can only say applications check the following boxes was was included in these discussions Dupont didn't say anything about the fact that they gave the property to us with these stipulations I mean I realized it was not put on the deed and it should have been and I know who to blame for that too um but you know I can't see dupon having made those stipulations and then you come to them and say this is we're going to do with the property that you said we have to leave as you know and I understand and look the value of tonight is that people who are here from the Board of Ed are listening and hearing the concerns the people from the council are hearing the concerns those are the two parties on both sides of the negotiating table who are doing this so maybe if they hear your concerns they will address them I don't know all I know is that we don't have the power to relocate this it it might be the best location I I don't know I mean I I'm I'm taking Dr labby's word that this was the only real location that was offered so if that's the only option they had realistically then how is it their fault if they you know if they put it the only place we we they we will allow them to do it so there is Val and that people will hear you and people who are negotiating can take into consideration your concerns and that's what we're trying to do okay well just to the uh did my kids get a bus to school um my house has been a bus stop for uh arith school and uh sover school and Roosevelt and the middle school at one point or another it is still a bus stop for arith all the kids are on my lawn in the morning and they get off the bus in the afternoon and get in their parents' cars so I do understand I I love kids I want everything for you know the kids but um it just you know like I said I haven't been in that house for 60 years because you know I didn't want to you know go somewhere else I love my my house and my neighborhood and now in my town and you know just want to do the best for everyone thank you for coming out we're GNA let some are you done man' we can let someone else come sure okay thank you you want to step up though please yeah drive I'm just behind the can sir sir come but I think she was in front of you oh I'm sorry you don't have to go directly if you're concerned about um so I have a quick question um I understand uh J brush my um address is 35 H Drive I just have a quick question I understand that there's nothing you guys can do I understand that who can where can we go to change this because there's a lot of fish things going here what I said there's a lot of things that I know right what I said before is that they're negotiating the lease for this property and you know the Board of Ed Dr Labby they're here right now um the the council is going to be negotiating if you have and something you want in that lease I would go to a council meeting and address it to see if they can negotiate something I don't think they're at a like I said they've decided that it's going to go there it's I don't believe there's going to be any way to move it now whether they can add things to the lease that can address concerns that's another thing we can also make recommendations to the Department of Education but change anything it's not going to probably my my my question is they didn't do any en mental study traffic study uh and they get approved to build everything just like because it's the listen if you do something behind closed doors and without the the whole you know housing the people that is the owner of the houses and the whole Community is because something's going on behind closed doors it wasn't it wasn't behind closed doors well no one you guys notifi it was okay let's just be clear I'm not I'm not saying that you guys did something by the way mros thank you because you're everything that is good with this board thank you for for everything and that's all that I wanted to ask so thank you very much thank you very much I also I can if I can just say the the the relationship between the planning board and the board of education is not an adversarial one I have no doubt that Dr Labby cares deeply for our children I have seen it I have attended Board of education meetings I I have no doubts no one on this de or in this Gallery should have any doubt that Dr lbby and the Board of Education care deeply about our children so I I want to make sure that that's very clear um thank you for the kind words but you know again we want to make sure that we're also thanking our teachers and our Educators and our and our Board of Education that are here so my turn my name is Carol Angley my maid name is Chase my parents moved to the house at 27 Ash terce in March 1954 I'm still in that house except for two years when I first got married I went to arith I was bust I went to Roosevelt I was bust I went to Wilson as a junior high I was busted I had a walk to the high school um I don't know that I can add much to anything in my mind if the procedures were not followed correctly why aren't we starting over I don't understand all of this stuff they didn't do what they were supposed to do sorry let's start over as far as the kids I care about the kids I went to the schools my kids went to the schools they moved the buses at the high school away from erston Estates because people complained what difference does it make having the buses behind candle there are kids that live in those houses well I mean it doesn't that matter we have children you know I mean I don't have any kids in the area anymore or grandkids but there's other kids in the area something has to be done is there not an area in an industrial commercial area that can fit this where we don't have to cut down more trees it's bad enough how many were cut down on Cheesequake as it is I mean years every time I drive past there lately we can't even use Minn so then the traffic on ernston is ridiculous it took me 10 15 minutes just to go to shop right to get out on erston today um it was about 10:30 in the morning yeah it was about 10:30 in the morning I mean it's ridiculous um people are going to start cutting through the development I mean something has got to be done here I think Dr lbby has said though that this is the only area that was realistically offered by the burrow and and that's and that is not you know if that's true and I believe them then it's something that that needs to be addressed with the council I I still SAR here you don't know how much what the hell is wrong with the burrow then I mean come on yep Mr there so many areas in town that could fit something like this that's not going to have an effect on the citizens I think the councilman who's a member of our planning board he wanted to make a comment in response go ahead councilman thank thank you Mr chairman and you know I want to uh thank the resident so far for taking the timeout this evening to express uh their their concerns regarding this uh project and I just wanted to express that you know the reason why the burough is involved um you know in this discourse is simply because the Board of Education initially proposed to place this Transportation complex on the fields over in in in the Morgan part of town of our burrow and this faced you know significant opposition right from our residents many of you who are in the burough hall now and it was and we as a council were urged to take action to prevent this from from happening for where the transportation complex was to initially be built and developed and the only thing as at that time was to propose what we believed we could offer um as you know available land that that we owned and as we mentioned um this is land that techn on technical terms um was not really what it was designed for so uh from the council perspective I believe that this is worth um going back to the drawing board and to you know reinvestigate and and Rec Converse so I just want to express that from my opinion and hopefully if it's necessary you know the mayor and the rest of our Council can begin to look into this and hopefully come to a a better conclusion with our our board of education but ultimately speaking um the only reason why the council was even brought in was because uh you know the Board of Education was willing to negotiate with us um to even do a land swap if not they could have easily uh conducted their initial plans to build their facilities in the the Morgan section of town all right so hopefully we can factor that that context as well I don't understand why thank you Council more commercial more commercial industrial area where it's not going to affect people obviously it was going to affect people in Morgan it's GNA affect people in Laurel Park I just I don't understand they didn't do it right in the first place why can't we start over that's basically what I wanted to say thank you very much yep good evening sir good evening hi my name is John McGee I live on 161 Kendall Drive right on the corner right on the corner of chees house on the corner Cheesequake and Kendall Drive got it the flags got it right I I understand they need a bus depot which I get it you know my daughter went to the school she graduated my grandson goes there now he gets a bus but eventually too he's going to have to walk from my house they live with us he's going to have to walk to the high school now which for me I recently retired so I'm glad but in a way I'm not because I have nothing but track the trail is all day long now going past my house and as far as only say those buses no there's another bus company that parks by the pools over there the minivans mini buses and anybody that thinks like if they think you think a tractor Trail it don't go up Kendall Drive no I see I'm home all day long my cameras catching so when the warehouses going into effect and the school buses going to effect not to mention I hate to say this but not everybody my quality of life my wife is handicapped when they built that thing down there anyway 2:30 in the morning tra the trailers concrete trucks all night long and my neighbor who lives right across from me sitting in the back pitches falling off the wall cracks in the walls all night and I understand it has nothing to do with the bus depot but you don't want to put it at cell over because people got involved there and because a couple of them were my friends and they got it moved so now they want to move it here but that's like saying for us our quality of life is no good like we don't we we we'll take care of the people in the Morgan section but we'll just stick it here and I understand I understand you guys I I know you have you don't have a say I know that you do have but once those buses go in and now you're saying too if anybody else is listen besides the buses that they're going to put a cultural center in the other ball field that get used every Sunday so let's take some more land away there's only one way out of the ball field there's only one way out of this new bus depot there's only one way in for the track the trailers before my job that I just retired from my drove tractor trailer I wouldn't take a chance coming down man the syn got old train trestle there so every track tractor trailer besides the school bus and one and I'm going off but the other day I timed it 25 minutes to get out of my driveway there's no school but that's what the mini buses I had to drive my I had to drive my grandson Olive because we missed the bus so what am I supposed to leave an hour early to get them up to the bus now they're also widening they're going to widen the road on bording town by the new gas station that never should have went there because you got one right across the street so the track the trails that will be the only way in so when the morning track the trailers buses cars you got the train tracks right there and I worked through New York City transit for 35 years anybody here ever see a car get hit with a train anybody here ever see a person get hit by a train I've seen numerous it's G to happen the light's going to turn red everybody's going to be backed up and nobody is going to be able to move you cannot stop a train like that so something has to be done just because it wouldn't wasn't done at sell over you just can't take this and dump it on us and I understand I don't want it to get dumped on somebody else either but it has to go somewhere than there it can't go there somebody's going to get killed I wish somebody would have said that somebody is going to get killed those buses every day and when you say they don't cut through come sit in my yard sit on my sit in my backyard and see what comes through there every day and that that's all I really want to say thank you for the opportunity good evening hi are you name and address Jo Martino formerly a Weber Avenue 41 Hemlock Drive I've been a seral resident 55 years this is a very sad day this is a big deal when my neighbor put in a shed two houses down he had to go to all the neighbors and send a certified letter and get our permission none of us here got any notice of this meeting today and this is a pretty big deal and I know I mean I'm I'm a taxpayer I pay rent I feel like the council the transportation the Board of Ed you're all part of Sero our taxes pay for all of this how does this hand not know this hand when I'm at my job and I give a presentation I have to have all the facts when I go to my BS and I go to my clients how these are people you hired we're paying for you how do you not know traffic how do you not know EPA how do you not know what our T what our streets are like and okay this is going to happen that's fine I'm resilient I lived on Weber Avenue I lost my home Hurricane Sandy we moved to this part of town what's going to happen when the transportation building comes in and you take all these trees and knock them down and the water table changes Kendall Drive I don't know if any of you are familiar it is so jacked up I twisted my my ankle I walk my dog twice a day you can't walk on sidewalks because we don't have them the dog's pads are all ripped up you go down menn and then you need new tires and new wheel alignments because that Road's all jacked up what's going to happen with our infrastructure cille is an Old Town we're not made for tractor trailers we're not made for 72 buses four times a day over these little tiny roads so what what plan do you have when this goes in effect for us homeowners when we start to get flooded when our foundations start to get cracked when the sewage drains don't hold the water what's going to happen then who are we going to go to because you're G to say it was a done deal sorry we don't know we didn't plan for it no one took it into consideration what do we do as residents of Laurel Park who do we go to because I understand your hands are tied right now you can make recommendations but where in that process can these factors be considered like what do we do I mean this is a great plan and yeah we need place to go but it's hard to afford to live here and like you have all these grandiose plans sarif was Blue Collar we don't have highlevel people yes our houses are selling for a whole lot of money it's all the you know the new people moving in but how do we pay to live here and then all this stuff is going to get broken and no one's going to help us what do we do who do we go to for that anyone have any ideas I mean question not and I'm not blaming I'm just asking I can tell you is you you elect people as the and just so everybody understands the theory behind all this is that public entities are immune from their own laws and I I work in a I I get it that that's not my concern I'm GNA get there I promise give me a minute I'll get there all right and and the same way people's concerns were who looks at things like traffic and environmental the idea is the Department of Education does so it's Cally located they standard set of guidelines they submit the plans and the Department of Education is disposa to consider all the items that everyone has concerned about traffic environmental is it the right location all that what they do once it get S threaten nobody up here is going to tell you they do or they do it um in terms of what can you do all you can do is go to a council meeting and go to a board of meeting and voice your concerns and then if you're not happy that's why there are elections that's that right but you missed the first part of my story like how who's why weren't we given like like a little newsletter varing when you get a varing your neighbor put shed they have to send a notice every La says they have to tell everybody within 200 feet of the property line that they need so that you have an opportunity to go it's but it's a notice it's not a request for permission it's a not notifying you to come to here it it tells you about it that's what you're saying we we I knew about the shed why didn't I know about a transportation Cent yeah it's because the law doesn't require them to do it but that doesn't always make it right when when we're supposed to be a warm and fuzzy little town I mean 55 years I've lived here I mean I know I don't look that old but do you know what I mean I understand that but all I can say is no public entity anywhere in the state of New Jersey when they want to do something has to send a notice saying this what we're going to do I have to do a courtesy review and there are public meetings whether the board of Ed's public meetings or the council's public meetings where I'm sure this was discussed and engineers and and Architects were hired and memorandums with understandings were approved and the response from the public enti would be we have agendas our meetings are open to the public they're broadcast you have an opportunity to always be informed short of what you're asking for which is if something's going in my backyard i' like a letter that tells me hey it's going in my backyard but the short answer is it's not required right I guess I just really want it to put on record somewhere so someone can hear that when this transportation department comes in and everyone is happy and then when the residents start to have all these problems that we can't hear that oh we didn't no one ever said that or we didn't think of that because it's it's going to happen and that's where that's why the plan well and that's why we're here and trust me like I said I lived on Weber Avenue I was very loud and I was an activist because we tried to get a wall Before the Flood came and like we fought and we fought and then the flood came and we lost everything we had so like I get the process and I have one last comment to Dr lbby while I understand what he's trying to say and do I take personal offense of him keep talking about that the bus drivers and the workers need a place to park their car because there's buses I live here every single day 365 days a year I'm not M I'm not minimizing our workers that they need a place to go but I think like your town residence should probably go a little bit higher than your hired health anyone else in person hold on just what was your name again just oh you got thank you I want to share the the resident's concern um up up here I think a lot of the times we um a lot of the times up here the the struggle that I personally will feel on this days is um the disconnect between what is right and what is required and so a lot of times again as the environmental commission designate I will hear applicants say well we're removing X number of trees and we're putting in you know we're taking out 100 we're putting back 75 I can't reject that application because I don't like it you can leverage you can say well don't you think you can do a little bit better than that but I can't make that a condition of approval right so it is it is frustrating that more people don't feel the way that you do um and I am sorry about that but please understand that we we get that disconnect between what is right and what is required what's right is you probably should have been a phone call someone should have stopped by someone should have sent you a letter but yeah all right sorry I I don't want to take too much the public that's okay my name's Jeff Smith I'm a resident of the Morgan I live at 185 Grove Street I'm also an elected Board of Ed member but I'm speaking here as a member of res of Morgan not as a member of the Board of Education um I understand all of the Laurel Parks frustrations here because we went through it over in Morgan we didn't know that there was a proposal to put a transportation complex at Slover Until Somebody went around our neighborhood who paid attention to a Board of Education meeting and put a flyer in our mailboxes we didn't rely on the board of ed to do it we didn't rely on the burough of councel to do it we didn't rely on the planning board to do it we didn't rely on Sarah to do it we didn't rely on Mr Robinson to do it it was because somebody in our community paid attention Laurel Park residents are here tonight because obviously somebody in your community paid attention that's how things get done in this town things get posted on cille's website meetings there's a meetings tab you can see every Sarah planning board council meeting everything that happens you can go to the Sarahville Board of Education website it posts every meeting we have it posts our agendas it post our minutes it let you know everything that happens we stream our meetings we invite you in person they're at the Upper Elementary School the planning board invites you they stream their meetings the council members invite you they stream their meetings if you don't exercise your civic responsibility nothing happens in this town so exercise no they scre up they they didn't they didn't have the so that's not anything I had to do with I'm just letting you know if you want things to change in this town do what you're doing if you're not going to speak up like everybody up here has told you come to our Board of Education meetings it's boring to sit and listen to an empty audience because nobody shows up to them nobody Council meetings it's the same 15 people that are there every council meeting and if you expect anything to change and you're not willing to do something about it nothing's going to change that's it n out of 10 times it don't change need to tr Mr Mr anybody else in the I me administrator wants we have people online and we wanted to finish the people Jim did you want to come back up thank you again I'll be very brief Mr chairman I promise I won't sing like the person on line um I try and make when they're difficult situations I hope Dr Lobby would appreciate them this I try and make a learning experience out of them and I think there are a few things that we can learn here and I'm going to pick up on one council president an NOA said because I've heard so many times this was the only site that was offered it was never the council's responsibility to offer a site this is a Schoolboard site and as councilman of NOA said the council the mayor and Council stepped in because they saw a crisis because it had been well we all know what happened in Morgan so they stepped in to help so to say this is not the only choice no this was not not the only choice this was the only choice on the list that the burrow engineer came up with and that list was a list of properties that had been zoned or wasn't prime or wasn't declared open space if this had been declared open space back in 2013 or 26 when it should have been this never would have been on the list they wouldn't have had it they never would have considered it but back then the mayor and the planning board didn't do what they should have done they took it they the mayor issued a press release and that was it but it's not on the open space list it wasn't zoned it wasn't put in the master plan so I think that's important okay um the and just like you know I tried to help wasn't my job wasn't my responsibility certainly I did it only because residents in Morgan came to me and said can you help and I helped do those design and pass out those flyers because I thought that was wrong to do to the people in Morgan like I think it's wrong to do to the people in Laurel Park um and I did in trying to help submit a list of properties I did submit the traffic report for the Arsenal so the Board of Education would know exactly what they were getting into and when the gentleman said their professionals think this is a good spot which professionals were they was that an attorney's traffic opinion or an engineer traffic opinion or an Architects or the superintendent's traffic opinion I'd like to know the answer uh to that question if I might and with respect to with respect to notice you know the plan I I commend the planning board for putting a notice on the Burrow's website I could have could have been there could have been a little bit more detail but that's not their job I understand that that's why I took it upon myself to put out notices but you know when the Board of Education wants the people to know something like a referendum they have no problem communicating that should have been done here and you know and I don't I hate to take this personally but four times at least I contacted the board and said you gotta do this and I didn't do it to be exous or cause a problem I did it to avoid a problem I did it so that they would have been here a year and a half ago or two years we would have heard all of these comments then they wouldn't have spent the money that they spent that's why I did that so I hope I hope we can learn from that um another thing I've talked to members of the council I'd be very surprised if a DPW garage is ever going on Cheesequake Road I in this site I don't think it's going to happen especially just like I hope the board of educ learned from what they try to do at Slover school I hope the council will learn from this and they will not try and sight a b a DPW Garage on property that ought to be preserved open space and I talked to members of the council said that's not a done deal they don't have plans it was an idea in somebody's head they're they're not firm plans they never came before the planning board so you know I understand that Dr labby's relying on what he was told but that's what somebody said that's not necessarily going to happen so I hope these are all things that we can learn from most importantly I hope we can go back to the drawing board look at this from a whole new perspective have an environmental sensitivity understand I mean you know the other day there was a big announcement the mayor wants to buy 40 acres of open space which I fully support and I helped her with and I worked on I think it's great but here we're going to give away open space to make it a bus depot just doesn't make sense there are other spots the county had spots on uh the Main Street Extension the MCI or mcua maybe even the mcia there are other spots but when we're told this was the only spot we were given that's the only one that was on one list with one set of criteria from the burrow so you know when you you go looking for something Jim I have a question one question yes sir you're I've seen you you're at every council meeting that I've seen were you aware of the memorandum of understanding that was I asked about it in fact what I did is I asked about a lease I asked if there was a lease and I was told there was no lease um that had been agreed to because I didn't see you at the council meeting when the resolution in 2022 was granted approving the MU mou and I thought it was odd that you weren't there I'm but but I'm just asking were you surprised that sometimes I go have fun I don't do this all the time okay um you know sometimes I have grandchildren I like to play with uh I always have grandchildren I like to play with sometimes I do get to play with them um but I I wasn't here I didn't know it was done but I did ask about it at subsequent meetings and I did ask the the councel to communicate with the board and with the planning board to say the law njsa for 55 d-31 requires that they come in required that they come in a long time ago so that all of this could have been avoided could had a spot selected by now probably and I I hope that too will be a learning experience for Dr lbby and the Board of Education okay thank you you know but Mr Mr Mr chairman if possible if I can just build upon that that point made by Mr Robinson you know uh from the perspective after this um you know this deal was negotiated initially in 2022 uh in as far as as early as January perhaps um you know not far after the invitation was sent um you know as as a councilman for this for this board as lead onto this board for the board ofet to to take a step forward to have this have this meeting so again um you know and also to build upon the the point of uh one of the other board of V officials although he was wasn't speaking in that capacity you know he did kind of Express a call to action right for our residents to to uh take out the time to really be more involved and um but ultimately if you don't have the time to do it ideally you should be able to trust on your elected officials to make decisions that are in your best interest so I just want to Echo the fact that um you know as one of your elected officials as we're hearing more details of your concerns um you know feel free to continue to Echo this in our next council meeting if you're not available to to join in person or online feel free to send us emails um hopefully Mr Robinson and other um residents will attest we do bring up your concerns in these meetings and and I I believe that we will be able to push your concerns forward in whatever capacity that that we can thank you councilman U does anyone from the board of please that's fine sure come on I actually live in morg and initially I name and address my name is e Pabon and my address is 155 Norton Street South Amboy I'm I live in Morgan and when we initially were looking for the bus depot we need the the bus depot there's no way for us to just keep moving the buses all around getting sued by everybody and so we had to do it Dr Labby thought the best thing was uh they originally what happened was they said they were giving up the fields that the fields were going to the se you know the new seille site on Journey Mill Road that where the uh horses are okay that's what they were going to do with the ball field so when Dr lbby learned of that that they were going to move out he said hey we own this property it's it's flat there's no trees this would be a good spot for us to evaluate so when we um had the meeting we didn't say oh yeah we're g to build the thing we were looking at it as a uh as a possibility to put the transportation s of there I voted yes and I live a couple of blocks away the difference between this transport Transportation location and sell sell over slow I always mess it up SL you know what I'm talking about that that spot is in the neighborhood I mean literally in the neighborhood there is no Industrial Area it's totally residential and that's why it was not a good spot and I did think about it after I thought about it said well yeah that wouldn't be a good spot because we'd be going through you know neighborhood the transportation center on um Cheesequake Road even though people don't like it every single time and the the president of the council um here this you're gon to have opposition no matter where you say you're G to put it because everybody says not in my backyard okay we said it in Morgan Jeff was the ring leader um Jim helped okay that's what was said and that's going to be said time and time again we cannot keep putting it off the transportation center has to be built so again that is considered an industrial neighborhood you and and what really makes me with Anthony um how you doing I know you ran for the board um before but what cracks me up about you is you're asking all these questions and you just allowed and now I know you didn't allow it because I just found out you had no choice with that big Warehouse thing going in there did you ask all these questions did these people show up to fight that because let me tell you something that is a that is a major problem so I'm not I'm not a victim a victim everyone let her let her speak and everyone have listen to all of you go ahead I listen to all of you and the haters on the phone but my bottom line is this those things that you know you're asking questions you already know what they are because you just let an $80 million company take a prime space that could have been a park it could have been purchased by I don't even know we sold it I guess but the bottom line is you allowed that and the school these kids have to go to school the only reason that they bought these buses is because kids were getting not picked up the bus drivers didn't speak English they didn't even know the town but people weren't getting to school I'm sorry but kids got to get educated they have to arrive and they have to arrive safely so to say that oh we don't want it here oh we don't want it there oh we don't want it here that just affects the kids in the end and I know people say oh don't pull heartstrings but the bottom line is those kids need to get to school no matter what neighborhood they live in saille and whether we own those buses or not they're going to be on the road Dr lbby wasn't making it up our kids are going to school whether we drive them in our own buses or we pay exorbitant prices for somebody else's so and the only only reason the buses were even purchased is because the kids and the parents were in uproar over the poor quality of the bus drivers the bus schedule everything is your mother's name Carol hello remember me from Sacred Heart so anyway um that's my what I want to say so when you consider oh all this stuff and even the councilman going back to the drawing board that's really not possible at this point and you know we got people suing us we can't park here it's a terrible situation and yes it is terrible but the bottom line is the benefit and the best interest is for the children to get to school safely that's the whole idea behind this it's not because we want to have a bus depot we need it because we're doing something good and this board has been very accommodating to the community and I don't think that Dr Labby is going to let buses run up Kendall Drive there's nothing that could that the board could say hey we could tell people not to do that we could force the drivers not to to do it it's not that it's impossible but there's other people abusing it and we're kind of getting some of it is our blame y Mr on Mr Mr well your the buses are going to still come through the buses are going to come to your neighborhood unless you ban all the kids and start putting birth control in the water more kids are going to come in that neighborhood that need to go to school and that's the bottom line and I want you all to consider the reality of why this is being done no we M we we understand 100% the only our job excuse me let me let me talk excuse me our job is to make sure this goes in a location that makes sense yep I know I don't know if anyone ever made that decision that this made sense for the better of the whole Community by by congesting by converging everything in a two square mile radius of the schools and making those people suffer so the people in Morgan don't suffer so those people have to suffer that doesn't seem very fair so that's what we're trying to figure out hard press to say that the $80 million company and their warehouse and all those fleets of trucks that are going past his house right your house he said the but the the trucks are going P house the K the council can do a weight limit like you suggested they can do things to to not have that be a problem and that's what the council president should start working on next but the bottom line is no matter what happens nobody's going to want that bus depot near their house and that is so to me you're saying that private company $80 million guys please please let her let her talk8 million uh business is is has more you know was conceived to be a better place for that company to have it but the bus depot not so I just think hence the problems about the Redevelopment agency and proper planning and we can only control so much we weren't the devel something that we should do now that it's been brought out in the open for all of us here in this room is to make sure that our Council respects the citizen and involves Us in more of their decisions and when Jim does open record requests he actually gets something and just to clarify I am the board member that Jim keeps referring to like it's a secret I told him that it's 750,000 to a million because that's what Dr Labby said publicly I gave him a link to the video and you all can watch the video and see how it all went down and there were like a whole bunch of properties some of them were sou that tip of South am which is really Saville that's underwater or flood zones where you're G to park buses and flood zones so you listen to the video and and please do because it'll show you how that whole thing went down and and the president of the council was not the president at the time but he was a party to the vote and he voted yes I want I want to just respond to what you said because did you take the floor and then I'll take people from the you did ask me questions specifically um I don't know if you've had an opportunity to go back and watch the the planning board meetings I haven't I'm gonna be honest with you I have not watched the planning board meeting okay I'm talking about watching the Boe meeting where all of this was decided upon and it was promoted throughout the public uh what's her name the mayor mayor vickick yes she was promoting it this is the first time ever the board and the uh Council all together was like it was something like it was like you know Monumental meeting so it was and and if you don't pay attention to what's going on in the city then you're not going to pay attention to it but it was publicized and you know that's what I gotta say just what I what I wanted to actually speak to is is that you asked me if I had asked questions on prior applications simar prior applications one application in particularare the trawell warehouse how many how many warehouses are in there Your Arsenal Warehouse yeah and and from what I know though I think somebody else on the committee the council said that you weren't even you didn't even that wasn't brought before you so that's really my I shouldn't have asked you because I kind of knew the answer I I wasn't on the planning board when that application came up but what I will it was brought before us but it it gets brought To Us by as a Redevelopment that has been approved by the Redevelopment agency and the council so it's essentially a permitted use right Tom and we don't have any say to say you can't do it all we can do is put conditions and whatnot on it that's well I think as Citizens regardless of what side of the fence we're on tonight okay as a group we need to demand that the council and the president of the council is listening to me say this we need to demand that there is more transparency that things are readed to the public and that we're not in a position where somebody like you who has a thousand questions and all we good okay I'm not saying anything was B your questions but you could have drilled them them people the difference the difference Miss bone is that I can't bring my personal opinions into a vote if a warehouse comes before this planning board and they check all of the boxes it doesn't mean anything what I think or feel it only matters that I look at a list and say they have done a through z and therefore I am bound to vote to approve that project I don't want warehouses here right but if I express a personal opinion about a project that can be appealed that decision can be appealed and reversed I know because I can't do the same thing but I also want our residents to know because when we have residents who come up and maybe Mis understand why we ask questions and what we can and cannot do I think it is to your point more transparency is important what we cannot do is vote our feelings on this but I think as Citizens we need to take it up with the burough Council because a lot of times all this Redevelopment everybody getting mad and and all this stuff going in is because they allow it so we need to as a group fight that because that's what we need to be fighting we don't want to pit residents of Morgan against Laurel Park or any residence against anyone else because you were right or we don't want to put anyone against the the Board of Ed we just want to we our job here is to say does this make sense and all we can do is make a recommendation the the bo the the Board of Ed and the council have already determined it's going there unless something changes it's going there is there something we can put in there to address any concerns I I don't know the answer to that question I would like our professionals have an opportunity to take a look at your plans and meet with your professionals and make suggestions and recommend ation from a planning aspect to see if we can take care of some of these issues if that could be one of the conditions of the the lease maybe I mean I'm just thinking of ways we can work together yeah and that all sounds good and I hope that it does turn out that way that you do make recommendations and you know like I said the board is accommodating do the lbby it's not his way or the highway it's Community Way and that's what everybody has to understand here is the Border B is not trying to shove anything down anybody's throat we just need to house these buses and to say that the workers don't deserve right now they're they're working in a shack have you seen that blue Shack by the football field that's the Transportation Hub so you they they do deserve better you wouldn't work in those conditions you wouldn't want to so you know I do not think that um Dr Labby is um being demanding or anything but it's just like what are we gonna do so you know but that's it but thank you sure thank you possible go ahead go ahead councilman then Step Up sir just W to you know um focus on I just want to focus on the main essence of of our discourse so far is that again um I know that some folks from the Board of Ed believe that nothing else can be done it's too late or it's just uh impossible um for me I'm just I just want to Echo the fact that I'm coming from the perspective of the fact that as a burough Council we do rely on our planning board now that uh you know we've gotten additional feedback it's my it's my responsibility as a liaison to the to the to the board to the Bur Council to bring this information back up and again um I want to Echo to the residents right that if you believe that you have a better idea and you know uh a better alternative you know with Solutions as your elected officials I believe that it's our job to also reflect that as well so I just want to Echo that um and I want to let you know that that we are encouraged toward it towards it I don't want you to leave this meeting believing that um we hold that sentiment that it's too late if you do have a better idea you believe that maybe there's some locations maybe from a more industrial portion of the town or of our buau or anything else please feel free to shoot it up uh I'd love to hear it i' love to see what we can do with it thank you thank you councilman sir you've been waiting patiently so come back up y did we have to take I just want I just so John M g61 Kendall Drive thank you for your patience yeah I just wanted to say also too I I understand what she's saying and I understand what they're saying but once again it's it's it's more really of a traffic issue and ain't trying to pit Morgan against sa and stuff like that but to be honest with you Morgan's happy right now because it ain't going there let's be honest you're happy it ain't going by your house you may say no and I'm not what I'm saying because to be honest with you when I find out it ain't going by my house if that happens I'm going to be happy and so are all these people everybody knows that you know the Boe needs a bus depot like I said but getting back to that thing when the bo wants you to know something if there's a half day of school or something when they have a fundraiser or something I don't know because my daughter went to sville my grandson goes to sville I get a robo call a robo call only goes out in this town when the township wants somebody to know what's going on other than that and like once again I only found out about this through Word of Mouth this has been in the works for two years now three years you just saying either way but either way it's been about a year and a half we almost all of us that here in Laur Park had no idea just like well you work for the board Boe so you probably knew I don't know what I'm saying but the people in Morgan probably didn't know either right so what I'm saying transparency yes but also too I just wanted to say one more thing on the traffic when that thing opens because like I said I drove a track the trailer before I worked on the trains you cannot stop a track the trailer in 10 feet so when those buses are pulling out at 5:30 6:00 in the morning when it's dark in the winter and those tractor trailers are flying thank God there's no kids on the bus that morning in early that morning but not even that thank hopefully the driver lives I'm telling you I really you need to do a traffic study honestly it's going to come down to a traffic study because if anybody's sitting here thinking that nothing is going to get hit you got the pool those warehouses people leaving dupon every day to it's it's it's insane how many cars go by my house you would think honestly you would think like say maybe from 10 to like two it slows down it still don't slow down and like I said the cars the trucks Bob tail without a without a trailer that's called bobtailing they all cut through Laurel Park the buses listen can't blame the driver they want to go home it's the end of the day so they're coming up AR the road they're turning right on Locust and they're line right down Kendall know and half the time nobody's if there's a little break in a car they go right through that stop sign and make it right and I guarantee everybody in this room has done it because I do it I've done it go back to the police studies look how many accidents are right on my corner I've had a car on my front lawn thank God thank God I wasn't sitting in a driveway my wife my grandson waiting to go so you know nobody's trying to pit anybody against each other but honestly it's it's more of a traffic thing if that thing goes there there's going to be a lot of problems which is going to turn into litigation for the township because if there's a school bus involved who's getting sued not the Boe the township and it's going to happen it's G to happen thank you thank you not entertaining anyone online but do we are we able to trace these people who are online that we making those comments no okay real quick yes come on Smith 124 Kindle Drive Mr pado um you said it comes to you you look at it there's a to z every A to Z is there so you have to approve it a to to Z did not happen they admitted that it did not happen there you go okay there's your there's your little window okay they didn't do what they were supposed to do by law oh she didn't okay okay does anyone from Bard Ed want to say anything before we close the hearing or no Dr Abby no okay um anyone from the board have any other questions issues move the all in favor I okay so um we have 45 days is your recommendation technically yes from when we received it not from today my my meeting November my suggestion is that we all digest what we've heard tonight and then on November 1 we can vote on potential recommendations does that make sense do everyone rather than burn the Midnight Oil here okay think about it okay um so is there a motion to open up to the public for General business to open second second all in favor I post okay um we're anyone here for General business that wants to be heard for the planning board I don't see anyone in person move to close okay our next meeting is uh November 1st yes and uh we'll defer this will table this uh discussion about the recommendation and vote until that day um motion to adjourn all in favor thank you everyone sit through a meeting like how