let's just make sure we're we're live okay meeting of the Somerville planning board for June 26 2024 will please come to order adequate notice of this meeting as required by the open public meeting act has been provided copy of a notice specifying the date time and location was one posted on the bulletin board outside burrow Hall two mailed facts or email to the current news and three given to the clerk administrator this meeting is a Judicial proceeding any questions or comments must be limited to the issues the board May legally consider in reaching a decision and that decorum appropriate to a Judicial hearing must be maintained at all times okay roll call chairman Nado here Mr rinsky here mayor Gallagher here councilman vroom Miss adir Miss Warner Mr crasa here Mr cresties here Mr Cleveland here Mr addx here Mr Ain here okay Pledge of Allegiance i al to the flag of the United States of America and to the republ for it stands one nation under God indivisible liy and justice for all okay approval of the minutes for June 12th so moved second any additions or Corrections okay chairman Nado yes Mr zinski yes Mr CA yes Mr crusties yes Mr Cleveland yes Mr ad y all right and we still have a pending resolution um and we've got topic on the agenda for so actually before we do that just for my edification uh that that resolution it can can I get a status on that where it's at what because I believe this was heard before January correct so can can I get an update on where that's at and why I think uh car is working with the applicant's attorney regarding the language regarding that what had happened mayor is they got approval from the planning board and subsequent they uh requested to change the front facade of of the facility and there was a couple months there and I do believe the a orb approved the front facade and now the resolution is going to incorporate both approvals the ARB made a Rec that approv ARB made a recommendation I think the planning right so I think that's where it is okay all right thank you okay good um fence ordinance and I'm not sure what the issue is here well I um and I'll give a little bit of brief background and I think the Genesis of it um the gentleman is sitting in the audience today um those of us that live on Corners face a challenge having uh front yards versus side yards versus back yards I and you're on a corner as well right so um uh you know what is it okay if I ask uh the gentleman to to talk this topic and then and then um you know as it affects him the challenge we have is we have an existing ordinance that talks about uh Corner Lots um but once again the one size fits all is very difficult in this town because not every property is the same and Mike and I had a chat so maybe we just understand the issue this individual issue um and then I can talk about you know Mike and I chat about perhaps a solution to the so sir sure just from here yeah sit and talk into the your leftand microphone um give us your name and address for the record sure um Bosco kadovic uh 476 East Main Street I'm on the corner of East Main and South Richards um uh I've been there for about 21 years now and uh when we first moved there there was about a 4ft fence along the back perimeter uh of the house um it was 4 foot it was a chain Ling fence um that we we took down um and for for years now we've had no fence there um so we didn't think really much of it um we thought about putting in a a 5-ft fence um um you know just a regular you know regular fence and um you know got the land survey and all of that um and went to the you know went to the board uh rather to the um the planning office or the zoning office and to my surprise I got uh denied I I didn't expect it um it caught us off guard um I mean I I hate getting into the reasons why we need a fence you know we have um personal it's personal privac yeah I mean we have we have a daughter with special needs you don't even have to go with it's just personal privacy um so yeah so we're we're looking for just like anybody else um just to have um the same level of privacy um that all of our neighbors down um East Maine and down south Richards Avenue have um we're not looking to put a fence in the front of our house um just what I guess is considered the the second front of our house on South Richards Avenue because you're on a corner you have two front yards correct um one of the things that was explained to me was the sight triangle sort of in the front of the house and the fence that we're looking to put up is is not in that sight triangle um there's no um obstruction of view um from a pedestrian or from a um vehicle standpoint um this is simply you know it simply obstructs The View looking into our yard um one foot may not seem like a lot but it actually you know from the inside looking out um it does make make a lot of difference so what was the basis of the denial because it was 5 feet correct it was five feet um and the fence has to be I can't recall if it's either it's either 40% transparent meaning when you're facing it when you're perping icular to the fence um it has to be 40% transparent or 60 one or the other I think it's 40 um I think it's 40 yeah I believe so yeah I think it's right um and so you know again what we're not looking to put up a you know a a monster fence just five foot fence with um zero transparency and not in the site triangle no not in the side triangle would that come off the back of your house is that where you're looking looking to bring it off of correct yeah so um the front of our house is on East Main Street yeah I know the house okay um so um if you're looking at up from South Richards Avenue it's from that back corner um it's it's about two feet you know out you know up from the back corner y um about two feet to 3 feet down and then sort of across you know on South riches across our property where we currently have Landscaping you know there's like tree there's a tree there's bushes and stuff like that so it would actually be behind that yeah um not you know um yeah so it's it's a few feet off of the um I believe it's called the ride of way um you know part of the sidewalk yeah so so here in here in lies the problem the intent of the ordinance that we have is a good intent and for some of the properties I think it works um and I didn't know it was your property until you I went over and introduced myself to you um but but I know the property you're talking about I know the dimensions of it and and I mean you do have a backyard the way your house is situated it is it's not a typical corner at least I don't I don't perceive it as a typical corner so I caught Mike and burrow Hall and we're chatting about it and you know there may be some validity and we're not going to resolve it tonight I get that but there may be some validity to the idea of of the ordinance can stay as it is but let's add something the the challenge we have is when you hit a property like this um it generates going to the zoning board and then the numbers go up right the residents get angry and the time just stretches so how do we compress that how do we make it so that it's it's customer friendly so the thought is and Mike and I are just kicking around ideas the thought is can we leave the ordinance in place or modify it however the board sees fit or the council sees fit and put a caveat in there that says anything any corner lot has the ability to go to the ARB for a review Once the ARB reviews it it would come to this body could come to this body for a stamp of approval uh based upon the existing condition within that piece of property because every corner lot is different and Y at no cost to the taxpayer I don't even know if that's necessary I think we can we can craft language in here that redefines where the front yard ends on a corner lot and and you know the front yard should end on on the side side street front yard should end at at the edge of the house and I I think we can R Define it so that and and I agree with you but but does but does that work for and you could exclude the site triangle that uh but but does that work for every house I don't I don't know that there in lies the problem and I know we can't craft zoning ordinance to fit every what we can do is create a safety net I'm concerned that we're just not really solving the problem we're just creating another level of review and I don't think it's necessary in that case I think that that if we redefine and and front yard side yard backyard as in terms of putting up a fence redefine where the front yard ends and we've run into this a number of times not just in in the residential zones but also in Redevelopment areas we have run into this front yard front yard issues and I I think we we need to craft some language that redefines it I I'm all about that I I have no problem if if we can craft something I I still like the idea of a safety net because I'm looking I'm looking at my property so so the way my house sits on my property I face the 150 right and but I'm tucked all the way up to one end so now where does my backyard then begin at the end of my house for the remainder of the 100 feet I and I I'm yeah I don't know yeah and I'm I'm in the same position you know if I if I wanted to put a 5 foot fence in my backyard yeah I couldn't do it yeah um may I may I add one more thing yeah sure sorry so because I I know we've mentioned sidey yards here and I don't think in the in the ordinance there is such a thing as a side yard I think it's just front yard and backyard and so I I think that's part of the problem so um you know being our on my property Main Street is considered a front yard South Richards is considered a front yard not a side yard right and so you know where it it does doesn't make sense to not be able to put up a 5- foot fence outside of that sight triangle where it makes even less sense is on the side in between my house and my neighbor on South Richards and that driveway their driveway I can't put up excuse me I can't put up um more than a 4 foot fence and also 40% transparent from the uh right of way like 25 feet back right so it like like any semblance of privacy is completely gone it's not just what's on South Richards it goes back 25 feet you know and and and I think that's we we understand the problem yeah and we get it and we're going to try to fix it all right um you know the mayor lives on a corner lot I live on a corner lot um but that's not why we're fixing it no no it's not that's not why we're fixing it that we're fixing it because we understand the problem yeah we understand we understand the problem and and so we're going to we're going to work some language into the ordinance make that recommendation to the burrow counsel so that it gets fixed and you can get a permit to do it appreciate it thank you thank you for coming out thank you for having me yeah thank you okay so we going to test Mike with crafting some language or we want to do it under the whole no let's I let's do it sooner than later so Mike yeah I'll come up with some language for the next planning board meeting I'll get it out to the board the week before just ideas for spitball yep just something on paper something to chew to chew on yep different alternative just in writing and then you guys can bleed all over it but you have some different alternatives to address conversations here so so and just so you know how this wound up here um it appeared on my agenda initially uh because there was some that wanted to do a quick fix and I put the block on it and said absolutely not it has to come to this board because it has Ripple effects throughout the town so so we didn't have the uh the tail wagging the dog so to speak this need this type of thing needs to come from this this body that it needs to go up to the council right and it's the kind of thing that we need to do y okay so we have a number of other ordinances in the packet and I'm not quite sure why they're there they were the ordinances associated with fencing they were the background documentation so you could look at definitions and what it says right now it's all nothing but uh background information yes it's all fence all fence all fencing yes all Fen very yeah it is yeah all right I have no comments tonight um at this point I'll open the meeting up to the public seeing no public other other than Mr driver yes I have are you a member of the public no but I'm that's why I'm waiting everybody's reminding me okay we'll close the public session go ahead um in front of the new buildings at JSM they were supposed to put five trees in tree pits larger caliper trees and they were supposed to repace the three original trees in front of the first tall building they call that two or three whatever but in front of both gangs to Starbucks they were supposed to replace those trees because they were undersized and in the last time they came in with ar back and wolson were all here resolutions they were supposed to put five trees in with tree pits they did not there's gravel in there they stuck the trees in and they're way too small this just happened in the last week it cannot stand so I'm going to interject here because I'm I'm a little uh uh agitated by this entire discussion I hear you but no no no hang hang on I have the floor now there hang on I have the floor right now yes sir number one this is an administrative issue it's not a policy issue you're bringing it to a policymaking board that should be handled administratively number two I had a council member send an email out to a quorum of the planning board and the environmental commission oh sorry no the uh the burough count Council and the environmental commission I got a big problem with that um it's illegal you cannot do that and then I had people beginning to answer I cannot have that it's illegal I also had people representing that they were from the environmental commission go to the developer say they put up a survey they drafted a survey posted it and then approached the developer and said we want you to put in additional trees well guess what so so no there's a problem here what they did was asked the the applicant to do something illegal there's an approved site plan so now I've got people the public representing that they're from the environmental commission this will not stand this is not an issue for this body this is an issue for burrow Hall it's an issue for the planner and the engineer who are monitoring this project why it's become an issue in a quorum conversation breaking the sunshine laws is being Beyond me and it's not going to stand and if it happens again I'm going to ask for people's resignations it's not going to happen it's illegal and I can't tell you how many times I've had this conversation with people I'm done with it it's over so if it happens again I will ask for resignations just so everybody knows is that understood I understand so it cannot happen I will tell you that will be handled administratively that's an administrative process why is it coming to this body do do we do that for somebody who's putting in a deck and they they don't put their foundations in correctly do we handle that no it's the same thing it cannot be done we don't do what we don't do it that way we do it by the book and what's happening is we have people trying to go outside the book and what they're doing is breaking the law and I'm not going to let that happen I'm done okay and I will add to that that they JSM got an approval from this board they have to adhere to that approval oh I certainly understand that I'm I I go to Every environment commission meeting I am your liais on there I go there and I tell them what the things are supposed to be and I told them before the survey I got a copy of the survey also they don't understand the process but nobody told me they would do survey all they said was oh we did a survey that's nice but they have approval for five or six trees I'm not exactly sure if it was five or in pain or or six whatever it was but the tree pits were supposed to go in that didn't happen one of the council people had asked questions about it and they said oh we're going to trust the process and let it go and now we got trees lar the issue is not supposed to be planted in once again you are bringing you're addressing something with this body and this body has to go to this body has no jurisdiction it goes to burrow Hall it's a site plan issue all right why why it's coming to this body that's not the role of this body what are we supposed to be doing then exactly what we just did fixing people's problems all right I I I don't understand we're here we're here to plan not in understand well then who is watching what the developers do ultimately when when the engineer when when that that project comes for site plan review compliance that's when it's appropriate as with every other project every other project Larry I I hear you and I completely understand what you're saying I'm talking about they prematurely put trees in the ground that should have been known not to be you're going right back at it going right back how do we stop this how do we stop doing so then number three you f you send it into burrow Hall okay so then so we got to make a formal issue so tomorrow I go ring the doorbell and go hey oh everybody knows because it was notified to every council person illegally that was the council person well that it doesn't matter but but others engaged in it yes and that can't happen we know better we all know better so this discussion is over but it doesn't dismiss the fact that this is a serious issue that needs to be addressed you're just saying not address it here address it at it has to be addressed administratively but it's not going to be dismissed is what I'm asking Larry do I ever dismiss anything you said no of course not I'm just want to get it on the record that we're taking it seriously we're not just going oh you you made a wrong step we're not listening to it but but we're also not going to sit there and and stone by Stone review and and I Larry I treat a developer the same as a resident putting in a deck they deserve the same autonomy the same Authority and the same enforcement and I'm not going to have people standing over and watching and doing that it can't happen because if you're going to do that are you going to start to do it to Residents yes slow it's impossible exactly and that that is the problem yes if if if I have government officials or people representing that their government officials and they are monitoring a project and now they are becoming the enforcers where does it stop are they going to come and look at my electrical inspection are they going to come and look at my deck are they going to come and look at my fence it can't happen right it's illegal I'm not going to let it happen so I'm done again okay discussion over um at this point I will entertain a motion to adjourn second all those in favor I all those opposed thank you