good evening everyone and welcome to the high-speed internet subcommittee meeting for what is today the 18th of July time is six o'clock we're here in the select Board conference room and this meeting is being held in hybrid fashion is being recorded if anyone's uh recording the meeting that's great just let Mr keswell know uh why don't we do a quick roll call we'll go around the room and then we'll cover Zoom so that we can have it for the minutes Doug moglin present Jim Johnson present Marlin Clin present Robert Boyd present Chris Boyd present Ian Creswell present and on Zoom Jason Jager present Ryan P present awesome how about we dust off some minutes and get those kind of caught up as best we can uh December 7th 2023 six o'clock uh comments on the minutes you have them as well follow along in case there's any changes yes I do than Ryan do you know if you were here on December 7th I can look at my calendar get back to you in a second no worries I didn't see that you voted so I'm thinking not and I think where it says David that should have been Ryan for absent Ryan Ryan peace I don't believe that other gentleman was on the subcommittee at that time okay should I just cross him out yeah okay yeah I wasn't there I was away I I was on vacation I think it was a typo in the I move that we accept the minutes as amended as amended is there a second a second okay quick around the room Doug mowan yes yes Johnson Marin clinin yes Bob Boy Yes was absent so okay CR well yes I wasn't there for I accept yes uh Ryan P yes I wasn't present though okay December 19th I move to accept the minutes motion by Mr Creswell second by Mr Boyd roll call vote Doug Mogan I I was absent from the meeting okay can abstain there no problem I can abstain too okay Bob Boyd yes Chris Boyd yes Ian crell yes Bri P yes Jason Jer yes oh we we're killing it now Tuesday January 16th yeah motion to accept second roll call vote Doug moglin yes James Johnson yes CL yes Bob Boyd yes Chris boy yes yes Jason yes Brian P yes Tuesday February 20th no goes on the back I put him in that we already accept the minute sign jary the 16 because there's a note on here saying Amendment yeah we did yep you're right that's all right we'll fix the spelling of Mr Boyd on that one um on February 20th this way I I I lost track of which ones were accepted and not so if we accepted him again no harm no foul motion to accept second Doug moglin yes James Johnson yes yes boy yes Ryan yes I thought I was at this one Jason J yes I don't being I don't know if I was there or not crell yes and April 23rd sorry I thought was there all right well we'll fix it then than have to add him to the votes stent we can go back and look at the video tape too no big deal video recording I guess we don't call it video tape anymore gotta get with the lingo anybody a certain age April 23rd that's the no I thought that was February 20th I okay you accept as amended please there's one typo on the second page that I saw as amended so can I just have um a suggestion because in the minutes it says Jim wanted to mention that depending exactly we're permitted and there are two gyms on the committee good point so probably just to if it's a gym thing then maybe it just should have a last name why just we go first and last name since we have two gyms two boys okay on a small committee with the chances it's a split personality there you go two gy the only one that can go by their first name is Jason oh I'm good man you can go by my first name I'm one of the only I have a mental thing with with Jason's last name so I always call him Jason Jason it's like a yep J I know I know you could say it a hundred times I can't um is there a motion for the minutes as amended for the 23rd sove second Doug Mogan yes James Johnson yes Marlin yes Bob Boyd yes Chris Bo yes cwell yes Jason Jer yes Ryan peas yes thank you all right so we're caught up on well we're almost caught up on minutes then I think we have we might have one more left there no that was we didn't have meeting in March and this best two okay great so I have one update uh for you from that was then since our last meeting was that we didn't get the $500,000 um Grant on the Community compact we got $250,000 so so that'll be good um on the same Grant it's the same Grant we we applied along with the school district the South L toin Granville Regional School District to try to make it a multi- municipality Grant because they are effectively a an own governmental agency but the um Community compact did not award us that second 250 Grand so we got 2 50,000 which is kind of what the grant was supposed to be so we went we tried to go for the big money and we hit a double instead of hmer so but $250,000 still a good a good amount of change so that'll be very helpful and we I don't know if I talked about it back then because I don't remember what I had for lunch today but we included in that map um for the mun municiple fiber Network obviously that would ride on the same network as all of this other stuff was all the pump stations while Park the library the schools this complex uh DPW um Cemetery yeah cemet that got us PR far south so we'll have that money in hand shortly internet yeah well you know they have all that stuff on computers now of who's where so kind of important there's a cemetery near you what's that no no no no you got a family plot over there oh my wife and I got a couple of spots over it be good to have good at that point so when we did last meet we did talk about setting up um just kind of a a study group if you will to kind of look at some start looking at some of the numbers um who was on that group anybody recall was it yourself Ian and myself and Jim probably yeah thank you I was just gonna say okay and you had sent just was it yesterday the day before you had sent some information over yeah I sent it sent it to you yeah Bob put together a very nice spreadsheet mostly mostly commenting on it so review and comment one question for you Doug sure according to the minutes in the last meeting you mentioned well 900,00 Grant um that was never touched is that the arpa funds that's not a grant that was arpa money yeah okay and that still that's in the spreadsheet yes so that has not been touched let me I'm going to join the zoom here have they started the poll survey just curious oh yeah yeah I saw some I saw some folks up in the up in my neck of the woods so I pretty sure that's what they were doing I've gotten a lot of phone calls and I've seen some pictures on social media the whip City guys zooming around looking at polls so what they're doing now is they're looking at a bunch of the polls that are as part of the application process so that'll help them if if eversource says hey you need to replace this poll they go back to and said dude you put this poll in in 1957 probably you should be replacing it anyway right um that's that sort of thing and have a good uh indication of what's what save us that 200 bucks anyway yeah right exactly well and or5 or $6,000 if they they want to charge you to replace the poll because they're saying okay we have to replace the poll because we have to move stuff for you do we know what percentage they've completed no I do not I haven't had a chance to catch up that's me I think so let me I'm G to try to bring up Mr e can you admit me to the meeting so that I can share the screen I did maybe it's me oh it's waiting okay there it goes thank sharing is not turned on you can request oh boy can you go down to the bottom and click on yeah or that's not the right one that's if I want to share my computer close that do it again click the arrow next to share no just to the just to the right of the sh that one yeah happen yeah click that one yeah see what happens hey what you know do you want to talk to this sure um so spreadsheets got a few tabs of inputs um and it's all tied based on the first day of the month so that things kind of trickle out from there um then the summary tab gives you a month by Monon balance of the ins and the outs and you know what your bank account balance is so to speak um so bit right now get the general inputs tab um you can see these are the inputs that were pulled from the uh contract that was circulated um that should be 224 not 223 but um Make Ready was twice as expensive as the initial numbers they had given us um so that's reflected here um the $32,000 is the design and Engineering um that's in the in the contract so that's taken out of um the make cost and that's an upfront cost not a as it's built out um Hu construction again another number pulled from earlier documentation with a 4% increase applied to it just for inflation and you got the total buildout costs total infrastructure maintenance cost per year um assumes a fiveyear life on the ons um over the full buildout so that come five years after it's fully built out we can start replacing those we have the funds for that um and there's also a $50,000 administrative fee per year for salary or you know other other expenses um or per recommendations um assume 120 day uh days from the time make ready starts to the time that buildout is ready to begin um and then 120 days from buildout date to activation date um those are just guesses so those are obviously subject to change um $100,000 was floated out there as an insurance cost on the total infrastructure subject to change um figure insurance companies always like money so the minimum of what they're going to charge is for that policy regardless of how smaller network is I figure 25,000 sounds about right no idea total dwellings pulled from their documentation 85 monthly fee we're going to char a customer activation fee of 100 and then um the original number of 25 month monthly cost per customer uh was written in his 28 in the most recent version of the contract um so that's what's reflected there um at the service areas tab I just went and said all right we're start building it out this month we're going to do five service areas per year um so that's what you see the 721 sorry 7 2024 25s 26s and 27s uh that covers all 19 service areas for their their most recent uh numbers that they sent out um bonds basically we have to take out one per year to cover the five service area build outs so that's what you see there um term of seven years didn't quite work out so I put in 10 and assumed a 2.5% uh rate and yeah that should be 2.5 not 025 so that could uh drastically alter the uh the result but um $3 million Bond on each one um and then based on that you have the coupon rates semiannual that that roll into the the summary grants I got the $900,000 arpa as you said it's not a grant uh but it is money that is not does not need to be paid back as you stated earlier we have the $250,000 to add to that now um again that one is a grant so it doesn't need to be paid back the ARP is a grant no it's it was a I don't know what you want to call it but we have that money in cash it was the American Rescue plan act covid money so the town allocated out of the the last tranch of money uh $900,000 of that money to this project so is there a drop date on that project yes uh I don't know the date but it's not in the very distant future within a year from now that it has to be committed doesn't have to be spent but it has to be committed I don't think we're going to if we proceed I don't believe we'll have a problem with that yeah the design and Engineering is $300,000 right there well committed means you got documentation for it it's not just you've got it in an account B correct correct okay very good thank onetime expenses here we've got the Hut Construction And The Upfront Make Ready which again is just the design engine ing um per the contract that has already been signed then of course you got the summary that gives you the the balance um we'll have to update the bond sheet to have the the correct interest rate of 2.5 it could go up to five based on what I was seeing online I think that's probably a healthier assumption to be honest with you but obviously there's a huge difference between 2.5% 300 a $3 million loan um so once we figure once we fix those numbers um adjust any numbers in there um you can see the summary um the service area tab right now it's set at 50% take rate um and as more and more time goes on and Comcast gets their speed faster and faster that take rate is going to be less and less unfortunately which dims the picture a little bit so at 0.25% it looks very good but that's obviously not realistic does this math if you change it right here y so you can see that goes to a $75,000 payment per Bond every six months and then to go over to the last column and that's where you'll you'll see your uh your balance summary so you can see that uh as the money goes out the balance up see goes down and it eventually starts to look good but it starts to look good in 2040 to yeah but obviously if the goal is to have this self-sufficient you can't really ever go negative um so at the end of the 10 years when that $3 million bond is due you either take out another one to to cover the the spread or something needs to change the numbers in order to to be Revenue uh non negative so what's the significance of the change in colors on that let call uh the deeper the red or yellow the more negative it is okay subtle gotcha so as you get this number back to so here we are in 2024 as we approach is zero we shading towards Escape yeah I know think I messed it up escap key yes no yeah I hit it 60 times I messed up here undo there we go there you go I I was trying to run the calculator you get failing so you need an it's an 18e out projection to get to zero and I don't know what the projected life of the uh the network is but I'm figuring somewhere around 20 years before you have to start really replacing and upgrading infrastructure um not just the LTS so not sugar coating it it's not a pretty picture the extra $2 million of Make Ready definitely did not help no no doubt however any additional money we get in Grants does oh a lot yeah quite a bit and we've been talking to a couple different folks about that too but I think the um I haven't had much time to be honest with you to to sit with this and we probably should just schedule another meeting to get together and kind of go through this in a little bit more detail and and play with some of the the numbers because I think you have to there's some assumptions on expense timing take rate and service area construction that some may be way longer some may be way shorter and think the take rate is going to be higher but we have to take oh yeah oh yeah and we were talking on our subcommittee and figuring it could be closer to 30% because 50% is what Westfield Gas and Electric was selling us and that's their Baseline assumption they actually ran a lot higher so like that's the beauty of excel is that you can play with this to see what that does and see if it has a market impact um so I have a question um in the spreadsheet does it like is it showing you what you have to pay in the beginning of like all this process like what are we going to have to pay back every month yeah we've got the 302,000 the design and Engineering um and then the total Make Ready is divided by the 19 service areas um due with the time that the Make Ready begins on that service area um Hut is another upfront cost well I guess my question is is like how much money do you need initially coming in every month to cover things like how is that going to happen in the beginning I guess is that because we would have like money left over from the process to cover like a fee or I I just I'm just wondering where the money is coming from to payback everything uh the only the only money in is the revenue from um monthly activation fees and monthly customer uh customer service fees $85 or whatever that gets adjusted to that's we know from the spreadsheet like what the minimum initial Buy in has to be you mean uh the the take R take rate yeah like so say say we we build this out the first section and you only get 30% uh take rate in that area will that cover the the cost or is that not going to cover the cost like what is the minimum amount you need to cover the cost yeah fair question um this is based on a inputs going forward as opposed to a result going backward so that would be a different analysis but definitely worth considering we'll get this sheet sent out to everybody so we can all chew on it a little bit and and come back and discuss it again in in as a as a group because this is is really kind of a go no go type of decision really to go back to the select board with and say look do we think that this can become sort of a selfcontain you know self-sustaining entity at some point um and at least as we said was to pay down the bond pay down our debts and even at the end of the day we say okay at the end of at the end of 2042 we go okay we're done but taxpayers are whole bonds are paid and then we we're done with the service if that's you know the ultimate outcome or do we look at this and go okay that's too far in the future to get to to satisfy the bonds because what's not here also is there's not as as Mr Boyd noted is you may have to borrow to to retire other debt you may have to borrow additional money um and we'll have to see and we're only authorized right now was it3 million one $3 million we have a $3 million bonding authorization that we have not touched plus we have 900 plus 250 so we have 1 point you know 1.1 on hand and we the ability to borrow three and that basically gets you you know close to the some of the Make Ready um but not the buildout you have to start borrowing to do the buildout and that's when you start to you have to look at some of these numbers to see where we can what how that's going to work and I you know and this by the way this is yman work thank you very much to all of you for for that that worked on this is to take a look at this and say okay not all this and I'll coming right back to you Ryan I didn't forget is you know not all the service areas it's not equal cost there's there's going to be some that are fairly inexpensive or I call it more bang for the buck like you go over to Fernwood Birchwood right you build that out and you're passing homes every 50 ft right and hopefully you get a good take rate over there and great then you go to service area 19 which is you know say the West end of town where you got to go half a mile between you know potential subscribers I'm exaggerating greatly but you know what I mean right and so the cost may be high and the return is low but that's that's the deal we made with the the towns people is we're going to get everybody yeah thiss every Serv area this kind of it it kind of you take the average and it it it'll all work out but it's not going to be as linear as that depending on how you do the service areas so they've already determined the service areas so on a map yes I can I thought I had shared that map in a previous meeting it's part of the oh I think it was part of the Grant application actually it's again without the final design being done it's kind of a swag but they took the density of houses and Residences and businesses and kind of boiled that down um I don't know that's one thing we're not account for either and the number versus uh business rates okay yeah business rates you know what do we uh yeah we we this is no businesses in there so far right so huh it's all just residential yeah absolutely absolutely but yeah I as we' agreed when Bob shared the work he had done was basically it's a a good framework um for us to be able to start working with because now we've got something we can play with numbers yeah and uh make additions and tractions and as uh some numbers come in a little bit more Focus uh maybe they adjust up or down and ideally down that'd be awesome yeah I I I'm sorry I left Ryan hanging Ryan you add something no I'm good I you guys are good I just I just was saying like this is a great wealth of information like you know it's definitely good well it's awesome I'm GNA send this out so everybody has it as a draft and then maybe we can meet in a couple of weeks again as a group and kind of come back with some thoughts on this you know I just off the top of my had of couple thanks for noticing or or calling attention that there's no business Revenue in here to be honest I think we got to look at the monthly customer rate I think it might be your take rate might this this is like price elasticity of demand type of question like what's the Comcast rate for gigabit 12ish right I think is all if get your bill for 120 bucks at $85 do will you get a good take rate for symmetrical one gig or will people get that or they're like I'm good with where I am at and not move if that was something less $75 $65 I don't know obviously that's going to dramatically impact the other side of this so you have to be very careful but that's where we have to kind of have a discussion and then model this out so that we can make a um a good decision and I said I think they you know we take the number of businesses and say okay who would take this and I think quite a few I age so thank everybody no thank you thank you very much safe travels thank you don't speed um you know I think that this is it's a lot Tak I haven't had a chance to look at it you guys of us have had the pleasure of seeing this so I will distribute this to everyone so that we can have it factored into all these numbers is the cost of our administrator and has have salary increases for that individual been been uh factored in there probably not and it's probably just a swag right now and what kind of clerical support is that individual going to have none right now and so so that could change some of those numbers is well the other thing is is he's taking best guess at insurance and right right um different things like that they're best guest well you know what have other towns in western Mass done for a budget for their I'll have to get that I don't have it I I'll talk to the whip City guys too as well and say hey what are other towns looking at for this obviously they have invested interest in having this go forward but that this is uh the other one to reach out to is um well the town escapes may have my notes I I'll dig it up to get that from them because I think that Hut might be light I don't think the town can do anything for less than $100,000 these days causes that yeah are we building a Hut we were talking about oh you do so we can't okay so uh the Hut needs to be we talked about having it maybe in this building or in the police station or something like that but they they need to have access to it direct unist and unassisted right so and and the reason that um it's suggested that it be you know like shipping container size type thing on a pad is versus say in someplace where we may have room like maybe the fire department or something like that is when they're going to need access to it high probability that it's also at a time and period in that your FD or PD are busy sure right trees down this you know weather right yada yada they may be busy and so calling somebody back to give access to whip City fiber may not be feasible or prudent so giving them a build a small structure very near on this campus somewhere whether it's on Town Hall property or more than likely within the power uh Public Safety complex on the other side of the that drive is to is probably the best way and it's pre-constructed pre advocated so we poor pad bring it in and there is there is a couple of pads over there now and we're looking at can we utilize what's there but even that that's not the big expense and these things you order it's a lot of times it's the I don't think we're going to be doing construction because you've seen probably right reading some of the select board minutes or discussion Municipal construction is just to be honest absurd $1.5 million doar plus to do the roof and HVAC in this building was over $2 million actually crazy that was a great it's a great roof it's an expensive roof but Municipal bidding and and the clerk of the works etc etc drives the cost so the less you you know I'm I'm looking at that number with you know a scance but really but Frankly Speaking if even if that number's double right it's not going to move the needle on this cuz the numbers are so big on the other side the right and the same thing to your point is even if the admin cost of a person plus another it it will be expensive and it'll show up in here but it's not going to move the needle from 2042 to 2045 or something like that I think that's where we got to figure out I think the number to figure is the take rate and the price and see if you can find the balance in there if I could throw an idea out please we are part of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts and there's a Foya type rule for both state and local government that freedom of of of Information Act and and the the budgets for these towns that have done this with Westfield this information is part of their public record and can we get a copy of that sure and see what that looks like and then we don't have to reinvent the wheel in some cases 100% And and I I don't think it's a matter of you're right it is I think it you can actually go in uh sorry you could ask for it versus you could go to town hall and do a foyer request but I think if you you call a whip City town and ask for this the Town Administrator or whomever they'll give you the information and um you know I can ask um the select board's office to make those calls yeah and say hey can you contact and know the whip City cities are on the list so it's not that hard to find the is you know some of them are the you know the Hilltown ones that they did their own thing that's going to be a tougher one to figure because their cost were heavily subsidized so I don't know how much of it they've got where but we'll ask them yeah yeah no absolutely no it's a great Point yeah it's great point because here we shooting blind totally and and other people have already done stuffff like this 100% And you know and we're at kind of it's either a blessing or a curse is that we're a mix of Hilltown and Valley is that we got we got people on the sticks and we've got people cheap by jwel and well and I think Westfield is actually you know they they'll be forthcoming with this information they have no reason not to Westfield by geography is much larger I think is Westfield like the second largest city by area in the Commonwealth it's one of yeah you know but they also have a good mix of underground above ground dense rural so they're they they have a lot more service areas but their the buckets should should line up because you know we have it in the preliminary cost for the Make Ready um and I'm sorry the buildout you know the underground is expensive compared to overhead and but all of the newer subdivision by by regulation are underground so there's going to be a significant amount of underground work that needs to get done couple of subdivisions they already have the conduit I understand so it really won't be that bad others that are somewhat older but not that old so in the grand scheme of things newer but older so they don't have the conduit for this under there that you're going to have to dig um but I also anticipate that in certain areas you'll have a very good take rate in those same subdivisions so right total balance course looking at the spreadsheet up there the the numbers in parentheses are negative numbers they are so okay and so those without so those without parentheses are positive num yes sir or they're or they're a yeah they may not be in dollars so they he just he's just using this as a general input tab so it's going to be $4.4 million expected Make Ready cost and then there's going to be 120 incremental Make Ready start to build out days and then uh there's 3,685 total dwellings we didn't even put businesses on there we have to put businesses in there and you know kind of guess what that is um or get it from EDC yeah try determine what take rate from that right some will some won't right there's there's probably places that that need the TV side of things so they may stay with Comcast and what they have is what they have and then there's other places that be like oh yeah we're we're all in go on on this yeah because that's I know I'm on now no longer available business class um with Comcast God where they hitting me they're hitting my company it's 160 a month I've got terrible yeah I mean it's not bad but it's it's like 54 down 11 and a half up um the uh um that's 160 bucks a month now they keep bugging me to move to another thing I'm like you telling me I can't stay on this one because the boss doesn't want to pay more money I said if you're telling me I can stay you know great I'll move up to the next one but uh or even to the next one down that should be higher than what I'm getting now but uh yeah no there's there's no way for me to move off of the the business one I'm on now and save money under the 160 it's 158 change a month that we're paying for mine um and the only reason we went that route was because I required at the time a fixed IP address and they would not issue that for a residential although I know other people in town work ISS well yeah things have changed um further discussion for this evening we're going to try to get together in a couple of weeks and see who's around yeah yeah so what what's today today's the 18th so plus 14 would be 32 that's like the 1 of August somewhere around there I think am I right I I just is a Friday Friday so this would be the 31st of July which is a Wednesday I'm sorry actually the first is a Thursday my bad I thought we were starting to question my sanity there buddy I thought I have I have some I thought I I thought I I thought I I have something on thought I Ed 148 and got 32 which would be the first of August so okay so let's let's temporarily say the same place first August Thursday hopefully Mr Crowley and um and others will be and Mr kic will be able to attend Jason Ryan you guys around yeah I'm good for that day great so we only ran 20 minutes past 6:30 I uh any other business before us tonight or a motion to adjourn please that was all in favor I I I thank you very much have a great one you two bye now it was funny I was waiting to hear waiting to hear from Bob and J Bob wanted to take the first stab at it sorry the computer's glitching there you so our appointment's up