##VIDEO ID:l6FAg4DlqAs## father we again just thaning you thank you you bless name to serve our cons thank you very that being Loy and being a public service thank you now for what you're going to do bless you in Jesus name I pray amen flag of the United States of America and to the rep for it stands one nation God indivisible liy and justice for [Music] all welcome everyone to our Workshop this Tuesday July 30th 2024 6 pm. or there after we have a conference line set up number there is 1 1917 91022 access code 32347 PB this is not a toll-free number and you may be subject to Long District charges according to your long dist plan but the chair person open the meeting public comment please follow the below instructions if you wish to speak please dial Star five the moderator will unmute your line with your term speak and notify you by announcing the last four digits of your telephone number please announce your name and address you'll be allowed to speak for 3 minutes any person wishing to address the board regarding an agenda item be giving 3 minutes for comment a commenter may only speak one time for each agend item so with that this is a workshop so we will not will not be any voting just discussion so uh this time we'll move on to item four first we have to CL present so couple it take time it the bo discuss mobile home inspector position it should say yes I apologize for that I think that was the old title so really it is a land landfill or RB inspector and everyone should have a job description all right so um as we discussed in the budget meeting I want quite a bit about this um and I actually left the salary out of my budget for the current year so that we you guys did take it to have the money back it's a watch but what's going on what we don't know what's going on I guess is the better term um with Buckeye and things like that I think we can be a little bit more efficient by having the code enforcement officer and the landfill person is the same person um you I mean our calls are we're going to the same place that c for was going to it's a neighbor calling hey this guy getting charged with four RVs five RVs six RVs do he have garbage is pay garbage um so I just think with with what's going on right now um with the unknown that's coming um right now you have code enforcement going out you have our office going out you have Sha's office going out I think you eliminate one of those offices by doing that um we have a we don't need 6,283 mil believe what I reped this year um so we can transmit the truck over computer system's already set up um I just think it's a good idea to go ahead and start moving towards that way but we are here to discuss so any questions you have I have my expert can me some tax managers with me so I can't answer anything answer so when you were here before and you propose this and you know I jump right in and yeah that sounds like a good idea and I do think that that in a way it does sound like a good idea but I've had a chance to really give it a lot of thought and I've spent some time with our County Administrator discussing the pros and the cons I think we all got that I had asked for the pros and the cons and first of all when your inspector goes out say to inspect what you have them doing and I'm assuming that if they see a Code Enforcement issue I'll let you tell me what did they do we're not huh we're not so if you so if they see something do they report it or do they ignore it we don't report because we're not coding for we're there to look at landfill to make sure that the okay so if they see something they know it they leave it alone that's what you're saying we have pictures of everything that we do so you know okay so our code enforcement person works part-time right how many hours a week we have two code enforcement positions and they both work up 20 hours a week okay so if we took over U and and combined these then that ultimately would mean that that person then was working full-time right that would be a fulltime position then I yes ma'am okay so and I and if I think to next year or the next year after that if we decided that we were going to change anything with code enforc because we have had over time we've had a lot of people to ask us say why don't you have your code enforcement out every day looking for stuff instead of it being complaint driven only so if we ever did decide to do that then we would we would already have somebody doing full-time work we would either not be able to do that or we'd have to H someone else so that's a consideration for me but the biggest thing is is the mstu how it would affect our mstu it would have to be pulled out of there Lea you want to talk about that a little bit so and I and we briefly touched on this Mark during the workshop if if this person if whatever percentage of their duties was related to code enforcement we could not pay them out of the solid waste assessment so what is unknown is if you had if you had say we we still have our two halftime code enforcement offic and then we bring on this this third person who's the inspector and they start doing some code enforcement work whatever percentage of their job responsibilities was actually code enforcement we would have to charge to the mstu so the whole question is well how how it's so it's not NE I don't know that it's necessarily a wash unless all they do is a Lampo work okay right if they do some enfor yeah but I wasn't thinking the three people two part time P one of them full time and you have a part time code for that's just my mind looking at it from a citizen standpoint so I'm not thinking three people right so well it wouldn't be three ftes it would still be you know your two part-time first because one of those does boat ramp detail so that's totally separate right so they don't so so they don't answer code enforcement complaints and then you've got your part-time person who you see what I'm saying so there's not two parttime Code Enforcement Officers right well they have different duties is what I'll say they're they're both called code enforcement but one of them handles the boat ramp okay enforcement and issuing citations going going to boat ramps and and making sure all and they also are a flood plane administrator or work with flood plane board so so then really you have one person who works 20 hours a week who's dedicated to code enforcement and that's complaint driven so so I and it's just it's just hard to predict but no matter what the board wishes to do and I understand what you're saying as far as the duplication in effort so but if the inspector started um say they were on site and they they were checking for um if the person was paying their RV assessment and they noticed a code enforcement infraction they could deal with it then I mean they would be right there to deal with it but whatever percentage of that is we would have to char we would have to pay them out of the mstu and there we we just couldn't use Solid Waste assessment to pay for for their duties but I don't know if that's going to be 5% 10% 20% I mean that's just the whole unknown and I don't really know how to predict how that will all how that will all fall out I mean you're you'd have to come up with a percentage that was yeah I mean for you just have to say all right it's 30% 70% you just have to other than that I I I completely understand because we could work through any other issues as far as office space or or whatever we could I mean it would still be three people using one desk but they're out you know you basically have one person in the field the majority of the time absolutely right with with what's going on right now right absolutely and I mean it could be you can be in the beaches um SP Hatchy you can be on 221 you can be on Johnson stripping I mean you can be anywhere in the you can be anywhere in the county right now and and looking for the the RVs and and the hookups and I don't Know full time they're that busy how we could I just don't see how we could work this out and I think the want to said it I mean that person's there so if there's a Code Enforcement violation they can handle it right then um I've got to think that there's you know other counties doing this got to think that just trying to deci what percentage of their day would go towards here I mean right that that's the that's the only question I have is how to and just the realization that you know unless we if we go over budget of that 40 hours per week for the two positions if what we if we have enough in that in what's budgeted for next year to cover that or if that would increase the MST I I just I mean we've never done this before so I don't know how to predict it's hard it's I mean it be hard to tell but I think the the landfill budget right now is is doing as it should we're not we're not done $80,000 a year into it we're a little bit ahead yes yeah so I mean we we've done the J so I mean that's going to be um unless unless there was a drastic change and and decid not let RVs come into T County anymore you're you're still going to have that um so the ter I mean it's it's it's a job now what I will tell you I mean you're thinking that it's a you know a desk job or something I mean we have an Excel file that we'll send over that that has everything or map has everything it has already how many are assessed um just say on on Jamie parcel it says 178 um if he has an RV is going to have you know 356 so I mean it's it's it's pretty pretty detailed it's pretty detailed it's not you know it's not the greatest I mean something we just came up with it's not the greatest latest so would there be any reason this person could have a log that they log the hours each day they spend on either or I mean folks folks different differentiate all the time in different businesses I spend this much time on this or this much time on that it's kind of really no different transfer for several employees that we have budgeted so like we have purchasing is budgeted in the general fund and I transfer out of Road and Bridge and the same for our fire transfer and we have several transfers so you would just budget in one department whether it be M orid waste either and then I would doing there is it fair to say that that could be split in half I mean you could you could split the two yeah you you could split the twood given the work load that's there currently would that be excessive is that a fair balance tentatively to you're asking about the inspector position or if the if the inspector position would be 50/50 is that your question if well I mean if that's a reasonable percentage is my question or is it is that a failure you said hey that's not enough time well I mean you've got I mean my person when just say somebody's out in the office and we need lunch covers that person had to go out and me come back in around lunch time right but I mean here the last year I mean it's pretty much every single day they're out there now are you asking the the boat rent part time person no he's asking about the inspector position if you feel like it could be split 50/50 I got you I personally do um I think you could just have the one me I think Troy's doing sorry Mr ke's doing the and he sent us a bunch of stuff and we you know we've Ved it we actually had them all and so it was we did a good job um but it's still the fact that complaint driven ours is complaint driven to a C degree now we're out there looking we're looking for those like during scull up season or SC season hunting season um permits when permits are pulled um so I mean yeah I mean I think I honestly think one person can do enforcement well I think yeah have there have maybe so you're where are most of your code enforcement calls right now I mean they're I know they're all over but majority are so some of I mean it some of it is junk and debris some of it is um too many too many RVs on a parcel some of it is you know people didn't pull the appropriate permits I mean there are just all over the place but there there are certain areas that we have habitual calls right yeah so that that's my thinking now you've already said it was a full-time job right absolutely okay so my another concern for us to think about leanda is already stretched far this is taken on another full-time position and I'm I would think it would be a lot of headaches to it now maybe it's not but um you know with all the complaints and everything are how is that going to affect your workload when you you already stretch far well so this I'm assuming this person would answer to the building official which is not you know have any1 and that we have a part-time person in that position now so therefore I have two I have a couple of direct reports that I didn't used to have Mara had to take one I you know so so we we both direct reports where those people would have would normally answer to the building official so until we get that position filled that it may be it would definitely would be a stretch until we get that position filled once that position is filled if we can get a fulltime building official that would be another position that could roll up under that department can can I suggest this that maybe for the board to think about this since we we really are we don't have a building official permanently right now we don't know where that's going to go what if we table this and looked at it next year you could get by for another year could you oh sure yeah and just see see where we are in a year and and and then consider it instead of right now you got change so you to do now change hey it's the pleasure of the board Ian this I think the idea of the T was trying to save some money for the C absolutely and your ordinance says that the board County Commissioners will do it and create the RO in the tax collector but it's something that the think we maybe right the timing might not be you know there so I mean any other com from the board on this item I'd like to say we there's a lot of things to get bu that need to be we need more ey looking you know a full kind a man can put his foot there if he's got a 40-hour job and he's going to be out there he's going he's going to fall up on every building permit go look at it and and watch people a little closer on the how many camper trailers is or if he building something had got a permit for you know he looking I just I hate to wait on anything like that CU we lose we we miss a lot of things is what I'm saying there's things that gets by that needs to be accounted for uh I've seen five and six campers that hooked up to one service several times around the county and it's not going to go away it's going to increase you got more and more people moving in here there's more and more more and more pole bars being built more more campers going to be put there and they going to end up with a 200 breaker and they going to have more campers there and it's just something I hate to wait on because it needs enforcement myself that's just my idea so so you feel like we should keep doing what he doing and managing his position I think you were saying to go ahead and move forward having need do now but we we missing a lot by not having somebody p time when you got two different people doing it you you know they all go both that's two people going on vacation and just having one would I feel like it accomplish more be less gas burn less everything marks managing one fulltime person now so commissioner Moody what what the um tax collector is saying is if is that person who's now the landfill inspector would come over to the county and when they go out and say they have you know they're inspecting a property and about you know if they if they're paying the landfill and they notice that there's you know junk and debris or some other type of infraction or there too many RVs there or whatever then they can this would give potentially the ability to address it right there right then and that would be the way I think was to do it right then so the but the whole issue is is if this if we take on this position and again you know right now we don't have a building official now eventually that will be resolved I'm not saying we won't resolve that but we're working through that process right now so what we have to do is whatever time they spent doing code enforcement we would have to pay them out of the mstu which is not for next year isn't budgeted potentially may not be budgeted for those additional hours so that's that's really the concern is is do we that it would be a a service increase which is I mean I understand people have asked for that type of eyes and ears you know for quite some time and someone out looking for things but that would potentially increase the mstu so it would not wash because we can't pay them that $50,000 out of the solid waste assessment for code enforcement so you know and we just don't know how much of an effect it would have because I I don't know if it will end up being 100% landfill and they don't have time to do anything else or and if or if we take away from that landfill job because they're doing so much code enforcement there we just we we've never done this before so right we we we just don't know how to predict the effect it will have yeah I'm not going to argue either way whatever the board decides but I'm just need somebody to help me understand you know if if your guy is a full-time person already so if he comes over on our side he's doing exactly what he's been doing for you but yet we expect him to also do code enforcement now help me understand the math how going to work out and that's I mean I don't see how it can work right well I mean if we have but it's not a true code enforcement officer the part time he's just doing bug RS collecting money and bringing it in um 20 hours a week so he he not only I mean he write he goes out and he enforces so he writes citations and then he also helps us with the the flood plane Administration which is oh yeah a lot yeah um yeah I mean it's it's you know we've never done it before understand that but I think we got to look outside the box and we got to start doing some things different not knowing what's coming on you know we just we got a year to kind of kind of work it out is there a way also have an inspector that they they also have the same type of person also they're out of and this is another thing so the County's got code enforcement you've got a full-time person the Property Appraiser's got a full-time person that goes out so if we're going to combine which I and we had this conversation today you know if it if it comes to where we think and hope that it doesn't where we know that there's a possibility where we going to be in a couple of years it may take everybody coming together to pull their resources to save money if we're going to keep the services we may have to still cut some of the services but so it's not just you know there's there's three inspectors down three but is there a way that you could tentatively set that to be FID as it is currently and then share those expenses through the you and if that needs to be adjusted because you say hey this is going to exceed the budgeted amount course we don't want break the budget but if you see that those things are working then and that there is that balance in a way to to keep those designated if you will as far as time and funds and doesn't balance yeah I mean I I would think so but so so let's look at landfill from from one other way full-time yes um but if you had a 20 hour week person doing it this RV hookups aren't going anywhere they're going to be there the ordinance says if you can hook up to that for one day you're charged so they're not going anywhere so you could you could possibly do a 20 hour weekend I'm sitting here trying to think you could possibly do that and just spread it out over a larger period of time um so that is a possibility CU like I said they're going to be there well you know when I stopped and think about the whole thing whether the money is going into your budget right or whether we transfer it back over to our budget it's still the same money spent absolutely so we're so my where are you coming from then that this is going to save money my my thought was on the Cod the side that's where my thought was so I mean we need eyes and ears on the ground for COD right sh I can't speak for but they're assessing the property okay they're not code enfor we're look at Landfield we're not code enforcement like you asked the very first question you asked so I thought that this would be a hybrid version of a code enforcement officer and a landfill person so it would reduce it could potentially reduce the cost on the solid waste side yes but it would increase it on the M to you side that's all so what essentially it would decrease your budget M but so your budget would be good it would be decreased Yes mine would be decreased but on your side once again we go back to basically a wash when you when you do it but except part comes out of solid waste and part comes out of MSU that's right and so right now how do it how do it structured I'm sorry to put you on a spot like that but how is it structured now that is I give it all to you out of solid waste out of solid waste because that's all we're doing right um so yes you would have to change your percentage 30% go more 70% land 30% land um like I said those things are going anywhere the permits are going to come in um so you're going to go and you're going to look at those you know those properties um you know speaking of the F Bar you get full bar and then you get a remodel permit and then you're You're Building in the B bar so I mean there's just so many variables out there and I understand what you're saying I just think that my thought was that this could be a set of eyes that has code enforcement ability on the ground yeah the only thing I'm saying is is this and I'm not to say anymore it's the same money spent whether it's in your part or our part but it alleviates you of a full-time employee but it puts it puts more work on our and if that's what we want to do that's fine as long as we see it for what it is yeah I but I think you're right but I think it also gives you more code enforcement ability maybe I'm just I think yeah um that's where I am you got a half day half time person we got a half time person no I have I have a full time and which one you want to C full it it would be the it would be the full time I would give you back landi just give us no no I think you probably need to I don't know you know whoever you have now they they want to take on that extra responsibility I just thought it you know code enforcement's an issue for us right I mean we all get calls right so I mean one of our would they be here full time I don't know that they would and and even if they did I don't think that would be sufficient because I don't I don't youd still want at least that part-time effort for landfill and then if you're increasing the code enforcement um Services then I don't I think we're still talking about you know one and a half FTE or whatever it's it would be increasing code enforcement the whole question is how much of the landfill role would you potentially decrease right right but it wouldn't be any more than you're already decreasing right it it wouldn't be the 48 uh 48934 you know it wouldn't be that it would be because you're going to offset some code enforcement right money it's just that it's paid out of two different funds that's all it's just it's the same it's the same one FTE it would be add code enforcement responsibilities and concurrently paying them whatever that percentage is out of the mstu so you'd be reducing the solid waste assessment and increasing the mstu but the number is the same it's a wash as far as the numbers the same it's it's just how you how you but is it the same I mean because you've got when you're taking this out of plan fill now as it is you're taking your money that you're paying your code enforcement outu MST mstu so now your landfill is actually going to have more money in it because some of it's being paid from DMS that's what I I tried to say that I don't know maybe I so you're reducing you would be reducing what's paid out of the solid waste fund right but in but that offset would be what you pay out of heard R we looking to take on the employee that's already doing the work on our that'd be me right now no I'm still I haven't open there's a vacancy yeah yeah so I'm going out I don't think he must work for me I mean if you want to put me on I mean 20% I guess the idea to hire a fulltime person or the idea would be to hire a full-time person who would primarily be the landfill inspector but would be a part-time code enforcement officer as well oh yeah see that was my whole thought was we taking a part-time code enforcement and do 50/50 and and roll with it but I don't know your I don't know your code enforcement you know they stay pretty busy I don't I don't know that they would have time to do all of it it just seem to be they're going the same spots we going to so I mean it's it's I mean y'all know y'all get the calls yeah but when he has another call that's not concerning that that we get a lot of how are we going to handle that lwanda with all the other code enforcement issues how they going to do that full-time job that he's us and and still as are all the other calls that do all that yeah and I'll take it back and I mean we need a full-time code enforcement officer we but we we are not we haven't decided to take that step yet because we're watching our budget right yeah it would be nice but we have to look at what's going to happen next year and the year after potentially sure absolutely so and I'm not saying code enforcement should be a money maker but I think that codee enforcement um should you should not have a net loss in C I don't believe what we get if you make people and you enforce finds or what have I don't know what's on the books as far as that goes but you know I'm just I'm trying to I'm trying to process it too we get a truck inck computer IP all kind and, 48934 but I mean I mean it's it's we're moving we're moving but I think it's something that the county really y'all know we need Cod I don't need to say that y'all know we need it um so I mean that's that's the way I was looking at idea MoneyWise you're not going to get anything on financially but you're going to idea would be to put more eyes but I understand what you're trying what what you're trying to do is I hear the will of the board of it continue doing what we're doing and not go down this path or what is the you got too big going out in two different directions I mean this would be one vehicle and one set insurance and one set everything and I just feel like U something we could I mean it's not going to be in concrete we could always change it if it didn't work I mean what I'm getting at you know you have to try something know if it's going to work or not I mean he's he's thought about this a lot to bring it to us you know and we can't make a a decision on it right now anyway but we can I he brought it to us to put it in the make yeah we we need to disc we need to have those discussions you're saying in in perspective that if you're there currently and you see an inra so you're gaining a savings on cost in the sense that you're sending one vehicle not three and you you gain a perspective that at this point you can't report on at all right they just let it go over the head they say something that's not right you know but that's not their job we need somebody can handle the whole problem and you gain that perspective in in an effort that's going to split the cost from two different departments basically funding yeah ABS all these vehicles we've got we're still going to be paying insurance on it it's not going to go away one still it's still going to be all that so that's not going to cut a cost there but two vehicles lot more expensive than one so again two vehicles would be a lot more expensive for two people going back they have to go to the same place why different people go there that's why proba going to be using that second one because this again this person that's going to be doing it's been his full time so you still got to use that other vehicle for that part-time person to pick up all the calls because this person's got yeah they may see something when they're out there but I don't understand why your people can't just get on the phone and say Hey you wonder we saw something y'all may want to check it out but I mean yeah we don't we don't know the code so I mean you we don't know what what the code is so I'll call you some of my neighbors kid I love my [Music] neighbors so the maybe if I could make a suggestion if you could hold on and and if if the board wishes to discuss this anymore or if you don't if you have to vote on it anyway do you want to at least wait and let us make sure that we can hire a building official yeah so so for me and and I'm waiting I'm waiting on this meeting just kind of T the temperature to see before i s my budget to which is do August 1 um I'll be sending it tomorrow so you I can always make an amendment to it I don't want to um but uh but I can been amend to you count budget um so I mean it's the pleasure of the board and I mean we can you know these folks are waiting on the next item and so could you leave it as is if it needs to go back to you then amend that oh absolutely yeah yeah I mean I think you I think you give it a year to see how how it goes and if it work you know um but then we can always add it in the next honestly I've never understood why tax collector's office did I I'm I'm not I mean you I think we were doing it doing it before I came before you came so yeah so I really don't understand exactly just generous I guess he said he was going to do and elen said I'm not I'm already I'm doing other things so um so it it's never really fitting in our wheelhouse anyway for what we do but we but we've done it um but the whole thought was is to get more more code enforcement out there for the county um because if we are missing money on you know a Code Enforcement issue you know that's good for the county bring I'm not sure what permits are we know we permits this year anding okay um so and I mean we work with we work with ch we work with with dny we work Le um as far as getting those permits I don't know I won't say permits are going down issued permits are going down I won't say that I don't know but um I just thought it was a way that would you know streamline some things and not have quite so much could what other count you don't know no they're not they're tax are not and I'll be more than happy to call around but they're not doing which I mean I don't mind but you know it's just that I again the whole thought process was we can get more B code enforcement land inspector that was that was the whole idea we about we can make it work for do mov forward in this direction if we can make it work yeah I mean it I mean mr's correct I mean it's going to put the liability official it's going to put it on I mean we're right there so he's got to submit his budg we he's already submitted his budget without that position correct to you guys my budget is to do is without position also but I mean it's as easy as changing the number on the Exel spreadsheet and until tomorrow so but that can all be changed absolutely if you know it comes to it it can be change oh yeah it can be whatever the plure of the board is I just thought that was I think we needed to discuss it and like I said pros and cons you know I'd like to get a copy of that Frozen I Haven seen it I mean all I had was Pros so I I don't so youve heard so the only the only conart is that it would potentially increase the the cost of the mstu and we have you know we have limited office space so you know but I think this person is I mean I it's not anything astronomical right um and it would you know it would give more responsibility back to the county so and and and I mentioned it earlier the ordinance does the ordinance that Miss Heather in NOA did says that the board of County Commissioners creates a rooll and delivers it to the tax collector right um for the solid waste it does um I we went over that when it was going through we we sat on the phone with her and and so I mean it's just we just need to will you say say that um in the ordinance the study that we did to change the price in the ordinance that was written Heather um yeah it is they do a lot they do a lot Green Eggs and everything so yeah they they had that in the ordinance and and at the time and I were like this kind of and I can't it's kind of strange and and we never could really get a answer hey we spent quite a bit of time with this head on some things it was interesting so we want to leave his budget as is you don't hire for a position as it is anyway that's right that's right so I mean and I'll do all I can myself out there is that what we do leave it submitted as is and then he going to be [Laughter] doing does this come he doesn't four year we won be 40 next that's you're right I think everybody needs to take into consideration ultimately ask yourself if you're going to be leing would you do some you know half of the code enforcement yourself if not if you get one person to do 50% yall 50% then your budget may need to increase nobody wants to work today so that'll make it wor you got it you got it all right so we're leaving the budget as is so right now I have an unfunded position and we're going to talk about it like in the near future and uh we'll need to talk about it pretty soon but um let me get through the next couple of weeks and and then we can bring it back to the board as far as what the what the final plan is is that what I'm yeah I mean that's I think I mean if you'all have any questions please call me you know what call me email me whatever and let's I let's work through I mean we're all working to do what's best for the county anyway so let's let's let's do whatever we need to do to make that happen all right thank you thanks thanks for let me go first and I do apologize to all you first on theenda thank you guys all right go to it three theard to discuss the video and ordinance 2006-4 so we have two public hearings um for y'all to to view the the sound quality is not perfect but we just have to we've done the best we can with it so the first one is the public hearing that was held on September what's the On That September sorry September 19th 2006 and this is regarding um ordinance 2006 -14 when there were changes made to the Land Development code it just a minute and um is that around um i' like to sa myself some time and all the tonight on the agenda I had some problems with except for two on signs and [Music] theway our ldr and I use this quite often it is book and and you got one section here that say something and you changed this and you changed the meaning somewhere else um one of the major concerns I have these that talk about reason mention all three I'm not going to get back up here I hope that you remember talk about the other on I don't get back up and but on all three of them there in our L comprehensive plan there is an exemption foring position property that relates only to divisions only to density you have to meet all the other requirements of the ldr if I want to give my daughter one acre in sh I can't haveone at all I want to give a one requ a lot of there we still got make all the other requirements um one of the things that yall need to be considering tonight is the fact the effect that it has on econom Val I know that Urban spr is a bad word but then again when you look at what Urban SC is in development there's not too much difference Urban SC to me is uncontrolled development where development good if we want to do things like this tighten up devel one thing you're doing you're taking away the building of me I don't 85 and I have a private road that goes into you can't drive down [Music] everybody but before you CH this I can go there break this up and if I want to sell my land I'm going to go and pave that road because of this I have a 7t rway gun in the but based upon just your the value of my land if we don't have devel what we going to end up going apartment and town we keep looking at South Florida we don't want to be like Miami County where everybody Liv we're on top of each other and when you when you do this when you pass this approve this the requirments you're going to restrict anybody own any property the ability to go in and sub it break it up in the city want to sell need time for retirement that's what it is most people retir you prevent them what happen is somebody going come in and buy your prop a wholesale price help get a big price out you know and it's property subed Mor there are other requirements of our insisting rules that we require pay build roach if you get in there get outside the 16 acre exemption and it's on if if you don't have an existing Road or go you can't do way bu have build Ro you have that's I like that but anyway it's not good for the public it's not goodal we have a different opinion on what good the f is and what that aniv preserves has been received by this board as a bad example of what what's going on their process included coming to the tech committee me with the tech committee taking the county manager count Eng Department manag I look at it this looks like a road and you're me requirements I only thing that and then they took it for we took it for the plan and th board I yeah you me all our requirements the only thing that I see is that they didn't do is get an Erp permit Water Management District and they're working on r that today a similar a project very similar that what I call a Yellow project is on L area and we brought that up into tracks in District district they didn't have a problem with it didn't have to do nothing and so you know you look I did this yesterday and I can do this today and I can do the same thing today and that's the B of what happened with res I think some of the things that we could do to uh present that in the future we we talked about a few times before the board and you don't like the disclosure statemented I understand that but then again everybody that the piece of property should know what they're buy they should know if the county road or whatever and if I do a disclosure statement I come this road is maintained by this Home Association or this road maintained by the count MB tax attached to it I think we should do that this is in a flood you know I like that the district the district is computer that you can gol and look they said but anyway I think it's a good idea when go building department you can look and see where get and that's a good check onment 15 now you can't build we don't want build don't want build into in a FL plane we want that high enough above the FL pled not f um some of these pieces of property are 20 M from existing fire line somebody got pay for that fire can get put in there they need to know that you don't have to pay $3,000 the cost is to get your house and you have to pay large bill each month to pay for that that's where the disclosure statement would get for uh another the CLA in every Homeowner asso Association or property own association should be that it's en sales in the county has the right to impose ND tax on the property with only public he and notification of owners so a lot oferty Association just don't do what they're supposed to do know TI street we have problem but anyway but anyway if we can on all home associations and basically what I'm going ask you to do let's approve these tonight let's go back to the drawing board hold some workshops and I got a lot inut this is just some of it that i' like to bring I to he sit here and talk to you a long time but and I'm not going to speak on the other of the other three the flat box and the road issue is all related to the same issues any questions but I understand your head and to impose new regulation that's what we're doing tonight doing tonight you're tightening up the SC and try to and I understand that I understand thank you for listen my name is m plumy I live in St um first of all I have toe Mr R that I think that all of these Clauses that we currently have that have been continually modified through the years probably need to be looked at in whole so that each Clause is in conjunction and working properly with all others as a contract writer I would do that myself I can't imagine that I would allow a contract change to occur without a full um review so I do agree that that needs to be done however um unlike Mr Ral I disagree that the property values would be decreased if they were required to put in infrastructure to support this type of uh division of property and the reason I think that is because obviously if you have a piece of property that has full access for fire power sewer water Emergency Medical Services versus a hopefully maintained no offense to the county but they're not always done maintained road that is typically at least in SK hatching number of times covered with large bers or have Rats on them or just or Pock holes it just makes it that much more difficult to take care of the people that are Mo with there my biggest concern about this is that as a taxpayer I listen for the last 38 days all of you in conjunction at different meetings talk about the fact that we don't have enough money for the infrastructure if we possibly allow people now to go down this route without requiring them to put in infrastructure then I have to pay for it 15 years down the road when they continue to sell out property and you put the roads in I'm the one that has to pay everybody has to pay here but they' already re the benefit of this and so I have a problem with any development getting done without the full infrastructure being put in that's what I that's my name's Trey how I'm here for two reasons tonight first selfish uh hopefully one day when my father passes on he leave me land I don't want to pass on but hopefully when he does when he [Applause] does I'm the only child of an only J so maybe I'll get what littleit that sorry sorry I do not want my brother to pass away he been trying to build a house and he's my only savior in the house building a house a pregnant wife and starting a new job if that don't make you drink I don't know do but the first thing is I'm being stingy and I do also represent several developers that all Developers but this will affect them as well so I'm here for two reasons um first off I understand when I looked at what was s planning own this was done in an effort to maintain roads and create infrastructure um I truthfully believe that there are less restricted means as darl point out go to CU um Mr B came up with some good ideas and I think there are a lot of people in the count that could come up with this I do think we need a way to maintain these Mr Excuse me that home owner associations don't work homeowner associations in the past haven't worked here but that doesn't mean that we can't work with the county attorney people in the community to make a homeown saluation that has some teeth to they are out there um actually the one that uh I did up in north in the county has some pretty big teeth uh has a way of collecting fees I don't know if you seen M but it's there's money in there to collect if somebody doesn't pay which I don't think was in the on that you saw earlier there are ways other ways to collect money to maintain roads then imposing this um you're looking at at 15 Acres of what we got now in this exemption on existing Road basically in my mind wrong we're up 40 but only 24 years which you know there's a magic number in there I don't know what that is but to me it's already 15 that's worked in the past that's a pretty big chunk land it's not some of us in this room but to brother lived in St P AC 15 acres is a big place and he doesn't want to move up here to P he does have want to move here to a nice one he wants to move here where he can come and go around traffic hand can get to his house fire truck get to his house and I believe there is a less restricted means other than this excuse me am respect am and we do have a workshop [Applause] well Mr pointed out a coule he pointed out homeone association with backup msbu it may be it's mspu I just I don't have the solution right now but I think it requires us to sit down when I say the community as a whole with the Commissioners and a public workshop and come up with yes that and that's a very Val point there have been in the past and I agree with you much we've talked before and and I think msbu is a wonderful thing some some of the folks I work for don't think it's a wonder but I in my heart of hearts I believe that is a way you know the money gets collected you know the money is there there's 100% private private and on that yes and I I agree with you 100% um but if if we in there if y'all act this tonight then it's going to jump me up to 40 acres of my house and that's that's your I just request that we we do if it if it takes something of an mspu from private roads then you to me it's about confidence you want to way yall want way to take care of these roads I understand that I don't want my Grandad to have to pay for somebody else I want him to pay for his Road his car the taxes but I don't want him coming up here and having pay his part of the taxes to build a road for some fell coming up here buy much land and and I agree with Mr but by the same I also don't want this to be taken away from him he would never sell but if he did this is a less restrictive option for him if that's what he wants to do and I just hate to see that before he AC just because we want to get I would prer that yes r have me hour was through this basically [Music] andot a lot of things one of that work it and I think I'm just going to summarize for the bo what I read in both the comprensive plan and the comens plan contain mandatory language that require building permit be El property Cony between family members that's in a comprehensive plan they treat such transfers non conforming Parcels that shall continue to be El resal buing permit subject to setb and concurrency Land Development code specifically exemp division of land among family members from s and Report aent requirements for law splits the definition of minor development landed on code in my opinion is ENT super the authority of the provision of the com plan in short family M do not the development re okay now well the comp plan says that family members can divide property and they will be eligible for building the land code can't suped that hang out am a app first I can't hear what they saying do you want go to the second public hearing and see if you Canan anything from probably discuss but through watch videos it's it's up to the board if you want to try to watch the second public hearing [Music] what's what's the difference I think I think the intent of our engineer was for everyone to understand why these changes were made originally and from um and Conrad do you recall um any more of the public hearings than I mean that was a long time ago I remember portions of it now well I sitting there my hands like that I'm prepared to uh to explain some things uh right now with regard to uh what needs to be done if you decide you want to determine an amendment to what's in the um in in the ldrs I'm going to call them ldr Land Development reg regulations U tonight if you all so desire and I can do it rather swiftly I won't be too for both youall want to go through that yeah my question is going to be can we just do an ordinance change and get this thing done with or do we have to go through this whole long process well that's what I'm going to tell you about the process um Miss p if y'all want me toe okay well everybody got a copy soon of the uh notice that this was a July 8 2024 meeting that we had that's the first thing that we had talked about ordinance number 201614 it really is what it was why it was adopted and uh you the part of that says the proposed amendment provides regulation of lot design that will provide greater Assurance of proper roadway access and internal traffic circulation and developments the minimum 60ft Road Frontage requirement ensures that future developments of flag lot Parcels will be equipped with sufficient Ingress in other words getting into it to allow improvements conforming to the adopted road construction standards now the flag lot is the flag it's really not necessarily a flag I call it the pole because it's the this 10 10 foot pole that gets access to a piece of property everybody understand that because when they say flag lot a lot of people get misunderstanding that and the pros the proposed amendment will help to increase development um compatibility within the uses now what they did was the whole part of it was for orderly and logical development pattern uh is achieved uh in part through regulating design and traffic circulation thing back then you heard the urban sprawl uh argument and this proposed amendment address both of these issues uh the assurance that the proposed developments do not hinder iCal future development is increased through the requirement for minimum Road frontages in other words that's why they had the 60 ft that you had to front on that uh that way you know you could get to your lot because you'd be on the public or private road in other words you didn't have to have the uh flag pole to get to the property you understand what we're talking about now so how do you do this well you look through what um was given you the standards for review you remember looking at the standards for review in your packet and there's certain things that that have that should go before your planning board first and then they make a recommendation to the board of County Commissioners and y'all do an application to amend the uh the ordinance that's the first step is to file an application to the plan board and then the plan board hears it and then the plan board makes a recommendation to you and they list what they have to look at and you look at it later if if you decide to um to to review what the plan board did does the proposed amendment conflict conflict with any appal provisions of the Land Development code are is it going to conflict you look at that is the proposed amendment consistent with the elements of the compreh plan is the proposed amendment inconsistent with existing and proposed land uses you know I think probably what y'all are wanting to do does not do that it does not it's not inconsistent has there been any change conditions that require an amendment well you got some changes because folks want different things now right I mean that's what you that's why we're here um to what extent is the propos Amendment results in demands on public facilities and that's what I talked about last meeting that I was here when I told you about that and to what extent would the proposed amendment exceed the capacity of public facilities in other words are you going to have more Parcels out there with more uh buildings or more uh structures and more people is it going to um are have you got the capacity to take care of that uh that increase you mean infrastructure right right if you can if you can take including but not limiting roads sewage facility water supply drainage Solid Waste parks recreation school and emergency medical facilities again that's things getting out there and being able to get to them does the proposed amendment result in significant adverse impacts on the natural envir you know that was that was a big thing back then to what extent does the proposed amendment adversely affect the property values in the area that's another does it increase it does it does it make them go down you know in our particular situation we don't have any way of knowing because of what the situation is economically in our County at this particular point in time will the proposed amendment result in an orderly and logical development pattern specifically identify any negative effects on such pattern is the proposed amendment in harmony with the public interest and the propos the interest of the Land Development code any other matters deed appropriate by the board so those are the things that's the U that they should look at and then report to y'all when you determine whether you want to do an amendment to change this uh um this part of the ordinance and remember what the ordinance says lastly you know you got all the stuff here but then you get to the to the real meat of it on the um second page of the ordinance which is attached to what y'all have to review pursuant to an application that's LBC 6-2 the board of County Commissioners to amend the text of the Land Development codee that's 42720 entitled the lot standards and restrictions is hereby added to read as follows L lot standards the length width ratio in all anage categories the length of the residential lots which are less than 10 acres we're talking about less than 10 acres right shall not exceed three times the width you got to think about that put it in your head um it it the um the what it means is the text is that the lot the lot of with less than 10 acres shall not exceed three times the width okay so what width of what the width of three times the the width of the law so you know you got yeah okay roadway Frontage Lots which are less than Acres shall AB a public or private Street for the required current minimum lot dimensions for the land use District where the lots are located again that's so it can be accessed very easily with 10 with 60 ft of Frontage where you won't have to have the um the pole you know the flag pole remember what I said about the flag pole then it says now they're talking about what a flag lot means number three flag lot means an interior lot which is 10 acres or more in size and located to the rear of another lot okay so it's it's got this hole to it and it's behind another lot right okay but with a narrower portion of the lot extending to the street it's 10 ft wide it's it's very narrow you can see where it would cause some problems the narrow portion of the lot that extends to the street shall be suitable for angress and egis and shall not be included in the calculation of the minimum lot area no part of the narrow portion of the lot shall be less than 60 ft in width okay so that's why they're saying you got to have in so and then they go with the density of like four and one two and one then they've got the chart there so what they were trying to do uh at this time was to obey the um the requirements of the comprehensive plan but also satisfy folks who wanted to put property on a 10 acre plot I don't understand what I'm saying so in answer to your question um Miss Pam is that the first thing to do would be to do an application the second thing to do would be that the U uh the planning board would review that and make a recommendation now that doesn't mean you have to go along with the recommendation but that you understand what I'm saying you do what you you want to do with to that um and don't understand that I'm trying to put both sides of it I'm not trying to it's y'all's decision y'all the ones that were elected by the people not me question it seems that there's much to do about the 60 foot basically that was important back then so for these residents that have a 60 foot easement isn't that accomplishing the same thing say that again say that again so this requirement on um letter C gets down to the lot size it's talking about the flag lot and the requirements of that and it it has to have a 60t width so my question is doesn't a 60ft easement accomplish the same thing you have it's no less than 60 ft and it gives you that access to these Parcels I would think so that's a really really fine question um but then of course you got to look and see you know what are the requirements of uh you know is it going to be a private road I would think yes sir but it it it's a private road that meets the whd requirement and that would allow for the access of all the the emergency service Serv fire service all things that were mentioned as to why we need this if you're if you're if it's 60 ft wide then it's the same thing as 60 ft wide Road Frontage that was my thinking 60 ft is 60 ft and that most folks say currently I may not have a 60t access point I can add to the 30 I have I can I can get to the 60 if that's the requirement but it's accomplishing the same thing that's stipulated here yeah it's it's access it's access how many folks are going to give up a 6ot EAS just to get 60 foot's pretty big 60 foot's pretty big well the whole highway and then the 20 foot RightWay on each side and they've got the access I think what's happened is too many people only got 15 access on that's the problem with a lot of issues that the surveyors when they surveyed their property when they bought it or you got it given to them the surveyor give a 15t ement nobody questioned it nobody knew so that's what we've ended up with there a lot of pieces of property in the county that's been given to the grandchildren or the brothers or sisters or the grandma give it the you know grandchildren all they got when they got a 15t e call it the pole yeah the pole pole yeah 15ot I that's question so just in in this case that the one of the cases that we have here tonight where you've got a a piece of property that virtually is kind of landlock back there back of the T I'm talking about fies like their their property for instance is kind of smushed in there between other properties and it doesn't have a an Eastman or or anything else it doesn't have Road Frontage now why why couldn't these people work with some of their neighboring properties that do have um Frontage and if they can work out an easement agreement with those Property Owners then why can't they do that what's wrong with that do that huh do that now piece of property the problem is though is that the way the property it's a nonconforming lot at this point that's the problem 60 don't Road that's right that's the part that we're here to address what we've seen here recently one gentleman had a piece property he had a 15t eat and his two at K folks on both sides of him they had to go through their property and neither one of them would work with him to get a 6ot e because when you get a Ed he can question tell me if I'm wrong when you get a e Ed they can't build anything on that even so I mean that was there their issue they didn't want to be able to lose that extra footage on their property and I I can see that that happening sometimes but you know my other question is what's Magic about 60 ft and I think about when I think about an eement I know that the the the Duke power they don't put in 60 foot East listen they take those big trucks down these and so I know that if their truck can get in an amulet or a far truck could get in so 60 ft seems bous to you don't have 60t to turn into McDonald's I think the 60 ft was to allow for all the utilities as well as access it's in totals I'm not for certain about that but it it's you know mentioned in in each of these classifications as to a minimum and it seems like you would it's designated for um Electric water sewer so that you have and even fiber optics so seems in the event that came in the future the what the thought process you have a tra a traversable path or roadway plus room for electric and utility as it seems like is that excessive and if I'm not mistaken in our current ldrs easements aren't accepted um it the access would need to be an actual deeded real property so there even if folks have an easement that's that's not considered by staff to be acceptable and correct can be done by E this question if I could because the former building officials stated directly that family Parcels had an exemption did this supersede all of that did did I miss something there the exemption is is as far as density correct Conrad and but has to meet the other conditions so if one of the conditions is roadway Frontage then that that part would not change but I don't think that's what he stated I think he stated that it was actually eligible for permit it is but again even in as far I think the comp plan speaks to density not to other requirements so what you what it what you disregard for lack of a better word is is density not roadway Frontage what's the density though acreage wise it depends on which land use category you're in so so we only the family provision is only allowed in agricultural agricultural land use categories and so that density may be different but then the roadway Frontage requirement is is different in those categories as well but that does have the provision for for family lot splits okay well so that's what this Char a question that's what his CH is for so we have family own property that's been in our family for over a hundred years and we recently tried to get a permit for him to build a house and he's got like trees that he's got to put out there he's already got a well he's got a greenhouse started and we do have a 60 foot EAS there is a 60 foot EAS but then they wouldn't let us get a permit so can you tell me you so you have a secet I can't hear them so either they need to come up here or use a come up I heard youbody okay so we do have family property that's been in our family for over 100 years and we do have East that um that's a front proper by the property I don't know if you know where Golf Course road is but right there um R the flame that's right beside Jack Ted's house and there's a 60ft East there and we had that too but for some reason they wouldn't let us get a a um a a permit to build for building a house and so I'm just wondering why they didn't let us get a permit well and I don't know Miss I it could be a couple of different issues but something that we're seeing more and more of is that is property divisions that did not go through the subdivision process and and people unknowingly buy these parcels and and there was no and they there was no subdivision process which means that roads were not built you know all the requirements that we have and then you know people get caught in that now as far as have Lane and it is a hard little road it's a private road and it's right in front of of my my property my son's property I give it to my son and he was trying to get a he got approved for a loan he's trying to get an address he's trying to get electricity so we can start everything so we can get he wants to plant his 100 plus fruit trees out there and we can't get electricity out there I believe that line right there going down l oh there's there's a line going across our property there's a line that's on our property but we just we got to have permit yeah going to my dad's house so we got to have a permit to get the to get the um get the power I believe the language in our ldrs does not specifically include easements as far as access and and I know that we've gone back and forth on this but I believe that's part of the issue is that we that that's not that easements are not allowed but they just said easement on that plan and they just talk about so could the language be amended to include 60 foot easements well that's what you need to do an application for remember when I said the process on of that on other end of that lane you talking about there a house down there already was it permitted yeah can we pull it up on the map so we can all see it can we put it up on the screen the map I have a different personal I don't I don't know what person there's a house on the end and there's a tra on the right hand side and Mr lives on the left side right ACR from Cal oneys on the theg one of the bought it from Mr Mr Buster the application process and it's um I think the land is in [Music] mycer is that where we want to be is to require 60 foot easements if someone wants to give their one of their kids or siblings or a family member if they want to give them three acres behind their property are we that where we are we do want to require a 60ft easement I mean is a 15t easement not sufficient me person I mean at the end of the day I just say this anybody ever been down to Peterson's Landing that I put a on it we just put a brand new Road in there that's not 16t wide that we actually people put pass on and we did that to state code me personally I don't think that you should have a 60 e but we do have one but I don't I understand you do have one but I'm just trying to figure out what is that it's just going to be a you asking someone to give us a bunch of property if they go if we go to requiring the 60t in order to get to this initiative that that we're trying that they're trying to do so I mean I think we've got other folks probably in the room that I believe at the time the concern was that um developers would not unless these these changes were made that developers would not um build sufficient roads within subdivisions and so I I believe that's what I heard and that was the biggest um the biggest concern at the time from what I recall after remembering after watching the video there was ex Road already back there and all you got to do to get on your property is take a quick ride he's there well may at that particular time in 2006 uh there was a lot of U people wanting to build subdivisions right okay and they were trying to get around the paving that they had to do and they wanted to uh make sure that the roads in there were given to the county and the county would have to maintain them and it was you know and and it got to the point where the board was tired of that because uh if they built a subdivision and the roads weren't paved and we had rains like we've had lately and they flooded and you got to go in um gr M and that sort of thing that's what was going on and that's why they put that amount now again if you listen to what I said and I know y'all did is if times have changed I'm calling it times have changed then maybe you want to put in there that that it's not 60 ft that's required Road Frontage maybe it's 40 maybe it's 30 you know because our subdivision ordinance say 60 you see and you're supposed to pay them well the developers don't want to spend that money they and then we end up with the MST use you know that's how we get some RADS so all of those things are are things that need to be considered by the planning board when they in fact uh take your application and that you want to change it you got to decide what you want the application to say change you want made and then it's kind of silly because then they do that and then it comes back to you you pass the ordinance or not if you if you're following what I'm saying what I would like to what I want is for these people to be able to build the house on the lot that they bought the same thing with other people that's here that's got seven acres that that that they can't do anything with they can't even build their own house on it and that's want is whatever we have to do to help these people to be able to use that property that they bought in respect to the application could that be designated to family parcel I mean I understand I believe the the concern is that it not be manipulated by quote unquote developers but these folks are trying to use family Parcels yeah and and we're in some ways and those less usable let's just say it that way so two questions can we can we customize that to reach out to these folks with with family parsels and is there a requirement when it comes down to financial institutions for a length or or access point does do they require 15 20 30t 60t easement or access point and if that varies by financial institution maybe that's some moreid it's not to I understand the intent of Le was to be prepared for sprawl or growth in the sense that you've got to come in with all the utilities but I don't think we've got that same concept in this consideration where folks are going to be putting um agriculture now they need utility but they're probably not going to be running sewer and all those things in the next shortterm yall have got the um the regional planning Council as your planner you know you pay every year for that and with regard they should they should be the ones to assist and uh help with the application to the planning board and tell them what you want they look at that and look at the and compare it to the ensive plan and determine whether in fact that was be something that that is comparable not comparable but able to get through the comprehensive plan such that uh you can do what what you want to do and and of course that's what You' got hired for is to do an answer to your question about whether what the um the the bank or the the finance folks you know they always say that you know if you're going to borrow money you got to get a title policy well you know the at it and see well did you in fact obey your lvrs did you obey your comprehensive plan and are we safe in recommending to the bank that you have got the simple ownership of the property and also there access to it so uh it's worth what you're borrowing or it's worth probably in simple terms if we issue them an add dress the bank's going to give them money I mean all that's all that verification just for a minute if you got 60 foot ement or you honoring that to go in there or it got to be something else like if you got a landlock and finally got then people St didn't give you 60 ft orever how much yall come up with and they give that to them and it goes out to the road it's no good just because it's a easement I think that's what we're trying to work through is in the current in the current in the current situation is a 60t eement is not included as 60t Ro so I think that's what we're trying to work through now so just to clarify as far as the the family exemption that that you're discussing or that ability for families that would only be in the agricultural land classification categories so that's the only time that's allowed no other land classification is that allowed how is your land I culture but if someone's in mixed juuse Urban or another land use classification then they they're not entitled to that same benefit it's only an add use classification all it's 3.96 it's almost it's right behind my my dad has 30 he had give it to all of us that had 30 something Acres There Was 80 acres in the water are you saying that's the way the ordinance is written right now yes sir so it has to be zoned a yes for that family for that for that allowance for family to benefit from that allow there's actually on our land seems like you're inside the zoning but you may not have enough acreage for the consideration cuz you have the you have the 60 and right next to 6 evening with about 20 there's there's a p but it's it's a private I believe Mr R back in day well it's been there for years yeah so we're trying to accomplish folks being able to give property to a family member put an easement on even on the back of their property may not have 60t of Road fridge and make it where these folks can obtain an address and build a home if they want you is that what that's where I'm at yes but only for for family just for family so you're only considering those who are in the agricultural zon land use categories I think have to expand that because some of these folks Parcels aren't zone for that well that's why I'm bringing it up to make sure everyone understands that's yeah that's the only land use classification that allows for that right now it's what 10 or more is that what it is for what um it it depends it's not necessarily um the lot we just amend the easement for less than 60 if it's not a sub Vision sorry we do for the easement part we amend it less than 60 if it's not part of the subdivision that's the next part the subdivision term goes to a different level if you split it twice it's considered sub so there's a number of of complications I guess if you will in the process and you know some folks may may have divided that into a 20 and then split it to a 10 and that may take them to the place of considered sub so to me there's there has to be a way in the application process to watch out division that you don't where you have to have a subis well no we don't want to make it worse I know that's oh thank you thank and if I may that's what's gotten some folks in the situation they're in so um there may have been a parent parcel that was split too many times didn't follow the subdivision process and now you have someone who has they don't they have a non-conforming lot they're not in an a zoned area it has nothing to do with their family but they have purchased a parcel that they do not have access to in order to be issued building I have right now spring Warrior Road he's done cleared 4 Acres down there with Highway Frontage all the way across 4 acres and he can't get a because it's the property had been divided in so many different lots and took the man had sold his place his him his place and his several other people there he had he got about six or seven different people there that that's uh nonconform so what I'm not saying it's right or wrong but ultimately that's what I'm here for tonight as well a piece of property that I sold to my customers back here so ultimately we can't fix what happened 20 years ago right so what do we do moving forward with nonperforming lots if you have a lot that you can't do anything with you can't hunt it you can't build a pull building permit what do we do with it does the county buy like and that's that's the position that we're in so we can't if the county can't buy it what do we allow the people that want to build on it well that's what we're trying to work through that's that's what we're talking about is is easements versus you know deed roadway Frontage are actually being on on the road and I think that's that's the biggest issue that we're having I'm fixing to lose a cell because of it and I've got seven acres off Johnson strippin and I'd say 3/4 of it is on Johnson stri and it was just given to me by my granddad and when he passed away and now I'm trying to sell it and I've got buyers that want to buy it but when they try to get a permit they say they can't you know because it's been spit multiple times that's right cuz he he did the same thing for my cousin so it's been split three times commissioner boy should talk about how do we we need to have put in an application with the planning board for that to fix this but it's not just that too my question is as a realtor I've shown your piece of property as a realtor how do we move forward and best represent our future customers or the people that want to come here and make a home without making this mistake again it's not listed in property appra non-conform and cannot build you know non-buildable lot their lot is right around corner from y'all's in the middle of can we bring that up on the screen do you mind if I if I bring okay I could understand if I was trying to sell the seven acres and break it down into half acre lots that would be a subdivision but they want to build one house on Seven Acres glad your parents don't have 20 acres you got 10 young and S need to be to reach each of these because you're cross over from was me easement this that's it if I may this right here is the F property B yes bosi I'm sorry that's so an easy way to tell um is if you can if you look this is 07420 056 so that's not a parent parcel that that is obviously a parcel that has been split so 07420 0 was the I'll call it the original that's the parent parcel so anything that begins with 07420 07420 it goes all the way2 07420 074 okay so that is already beyond the two allowable splits so what happened was when these when these Parcels were split when these Lots were split the subdivision process was not followed or you would have interior roads and there wouldn't be an issue correct I mean all of that would have been followed there would have been interior roads so these folks right here don't have the needed Frontage and I don't know how you would have a flag lot we have a legal easement that's 20 20t 20t off Morgan wh straight off Morgan if you look at the parcel just to the left of their that also uses the flag pole zoom out a little bit so that shows six acres but it's not six so that is attached to the parcel that fronts johnon strippin on the corner and those are two those two Parcels are owned by the same family that originally split the original 58 acre parcel 20 30 years ago right so my question is is now not only do we have one which is theirs that they have purchased from the from the original family but the family not knowingly they're not in this meating today has two pieces of land totaling six acres that they can't do anything with I was also told John Cruz cannot build on that 10 acres just north of the F's property and then y'all have seven acres you can't do anything like this right right down from there but ours has plenty of well it was just a splitting though ours is just a split just a split yeah if you want to pull ours up it's under David Owens I think the you okay I would like to build a house well nice to meet you I'm trying I'm build a subdivision the proper still no it's Owens David Owens David right yeah David David Owens that's right it's the one but who else's name is there who's the other name on the property Chris Matt Brown and Christina Brown Turn it's it's right on the corner of Sam 024 02430 it's actually up top screen kind of over to the right over to the right one no the next one next one no to the right we pulled it up to it's go up no one up next one up next one up right there that's it yes next one next one all right so again if you look at the parcel number 02430 d130 it's obviously been divided yeah that was my granddad's original land so that I mean that's really the only way I can tell when I look at our paral map if it's if it doesn't end in 00 then it's not the original parcel and it's been divided but it takes quite a bit of homework for I mean for me to figure out I just yeah I just learned that 3 weeks ago with the whole parel but how so the the little square there is my granddad's old house and an investor from Orlando bought that house you know cuz at first we were trying to combine all these Parcels to make it work cuz I talked to my cousin which is just south of there attached to that land and they were willing to combine their two and I combined my two cuz I had one acre and I had like almost six acres so I combined them made it one but there's nothing I can do with my granddad's old house you know what I mean and we didn't we have no clue of this when we were trying to sell the land understand and and that's what people are running into well another thing I want to bring up I confirmed for the third time today their parcel is actually Zone mixed use Urban Development yeah I think I saw that how does that get put in the the mix of that I'm not sure I um I was may have been just on the corner but but that mere fact would mean that if if this was a family split if it was in most use Urban Development it would not be eligible for that family exemption because it's not an agricultural zone property and that's in our comp plan I believe there's a state statute that allows for that and it's to preserve if I'm not mistaken family you know family Agriculture and farming and to preserve that tradition so it allows for it encourages I think some cluster development to leave as much as the property open for agricultural uses as possible which doesn't help any of well yeah their situation none of in family anymore right so so um I think so what we're running at into at our you know as far as staff is multiple folks have these Parcels you know the property was split or not split um the deed was recorded and they either want to sell or they want to build and then they come to us for a building permit either either who they've sold it to or who wishes to build and that's when it it all stops if you got 12 family members and you got 20 acres and you want your family to move with you and they want to build a house they fix and get married and have young and all that and you got three or four young and there only the one there you can't have the other I'm just saying there's got to be something besides that understand I want my young to be by me I understand I certainly do I got one off from me I don't like her away me I understand and I I think that um you know what we're running into is more people may be moving here and or there were family splits made years and years and years ago without understanding our our Cod ordinances our comp plan and our land develop regulations so now people are just caught and and I I understand they're asking for help but I do think that we do have to consider is the question is is there a way to help these folks without opening a can of worms well I mean it sounds like when the land was split the rules wasn't being followed anyway correct but that's not something we would enforce at the time so that's not anything we would have knowledge of or that could be enforced at the time they're not going to go give it back to who they sold it to or who they give it to so no now they're stuck I understand got to help them do what they want to do what they need to do shouldn't it just be an acreage thing I mean like he's saying if they got a 100 acres and they want to have they got 10 kids and they want to break it up you know five acres at a piece it ought to be okay you know what I mean but then if you're trying to break it down into quarter acre lots and make a subdivision then that wouldn't be right you know and I can I can speak to that if it's okay Mr chairperson I think the um part of the realization or part of the facts is even with these family lot splits there's nothing to stop if if someone wishes to do that on their family property in aone you know an aone parcel they can do that and multiple homes can be built and then they can turn around and sell it and so the provision you've given them is not serving the same purpose so that's not something that's in perpetuity um that that allowance for family La splits and family Land Development it's not in perpetuity and it's something that can change rapidly so what do we want what do we want to ask then that I guess it boils down to this application that we have to do we have to put in there what we want Conrad is that what you're saying so what do we want to what do we want them to consider I know I know you want to open UPS but I mean I'm sufficient for these folks here that just in the folks that we're even referring to now that they have to have a easement of x amount of footage I didn't hear anything you said you P talking about talking about the folks that were you here now that I'm okay if we got to help these I want open the can of worms that's if they could buy us later but I mean the folks we're talking now to them to have X amount of footage of for for an eement going to their property and us give them an address where they can do what they want to do with their property um I know there's a bigger picture to this but now we've got all land that's already broken up it's just sitting there yeah they say this we keep talking about that can of war that can of war look like start from South Florida somewhere where you got a 50ft lock 30 foot house three stor High you know and you got 5 ft on each side whatever the neighbor do on his porch all he got to do is put a a two four out there and you can walk to it now look like all this land they got out here look like they got enough to uh put a house put 100 trees and uh uh put a uh raise a hog or two and I don't think they asking for too much look like two or three acres is enough to put a house on you know we got CI around here we got you take AC down Camp S P worth a million doll the people here got three don't worth nothing because they can't do nothing with it now I don't know how we got ourselves in this situation and I wasn't here when we got it there but there's a way out and it don't have to be they putting a million dollar R of Road and and $2 million of sewer there you know if you go elsewhere and you see people building all time people doing the things they need to do and I I I I do understand what some people say they done you know the UR we talk about that but we not in the UR for right now we in a economic disadvantage count we need some tax money and people want to build 50,000 $200,000 house and I understand that's that's R ni it's about $400 $500,000 house coming so we need to do something about that we got an attorney over there that says we need you say we need to see Mr Bishop well I wanted to say something I was waiting for you to finish okay I'm going to finish but anyway I think we need to help they they got enough land out to do what they need to do when I looked at that property and it was close to a 60t easement and they got more than a 60t frontage and 3 and 1/2 acres or 3 acres and a pole running across St own prop their property and one running down in the front of it and they can't join it and because they can't get a 911 address is that right that's right see I'm chomping at the bed go ahead because Mr DS yeah the changes that have happened in the 18 years okay is one of the things that you put in the application such that you can amend the ldr okay you see what I'm saying yes sir and I'll fight for that until the cows come home paron the pun cuz you got to watch out if you have too many cows on your three AC L it's for your neighbor I wasn't looking exactly I was looking at folks I was looking at that Realtor out there so and one of the things I think you ought to do is when somebody comes to you and wants to purchase a piece of property or that you have a piece of property to sell you need to bring them here first before you start telling them what they can do and what they can't do that that would be don't don't just close up the Gap okay I'm not being ugly about it I'm just saying no I I'll stay or would did stay in contact with Danny at least once anyway so that that is one of the things that again that's what you've got the um Regional planning Council and you you didn't get an answer today from did you they did call me and explain the process and I spoke with them directly about some of the issues that we're having and um they said that if we would send them what it was that we want they would of course help us with the application and give us some I think some guidance um as far as the application yes sir Guidance with the application yes one of the things um now this board can't make a decision tonight because it's a workshop and that's um that's the law and we got to follow it yeah so what we need to do for our client is um put in what we've heard tonight and various things for the next meeting to say what we think needs to be in the application to it for lack of a better term a narrowing of that 40 foot or 60 foot 60 foot I got 40 foot on the brain because of another case Okay a naring of the 60 fot um that will help a lot of folks and also uh uh some way that we can uh make nonconforming laws that have been mistakenly put back in in the mix so to speak you follow what I'm saying now whether we can do that or not we're going to try Okay so an answer to your question again ham if you're looking at me um Isa and I will get together and put variables that y'all could pick to get uh with the application and I think she's heard she's wrote it down I've heard what yall you're not voting tonight but you can tell us the next regular meeting what which is next week yeah to do it is it Monday night or Tuesday Monday so so so if we at the next meeting then we uh get the application together to submit to the planning board now when would be the next planning board meeting and then when would it come back then when would it go to the regional planning Council and then it get back to us they've got buyers that's the reason I'm asking do we have an estimate of the timeline the only thing I can tell you with regard to that it's just we are using the regional planning Council as a help we're not asking them to okay anything we're just asking them to give us some help with regard to what we put in the application okay and so then the here's the application they make a recommendation on what to to y'all and then we have a um and then y'all tell us to prepare an ordinance that amends it and then you know goes to the ordinance um process which you know takes a couple of months right so three months is a minimum probably we try to do it as fast as we can can we just be grandfathered in and get him a permit on our side yeah can we do that too so they can start building he's got a lot of kids out here kids at all there's no way to get it expedited has be aded I'll check but you have to go through the adver and just to understand something if someone was to have a parcel and they was going to div divide it up and make a subdivision out of it they would have to go to front of the B of Zone in Planet anyway wouldn't they well they so it would be voted by staff first and then go through Tech Review Committee then it would go to the planning board and then it would come to the board yeah there's several people we have to go through to either get to that stage so you can kind of tell these people aren't you know they're not going to subdivide this property to do that because they s stages you got to go through so and I understand that but if there's any way to be mixing mixing apples and oranges maybe um subdivision we have a subdivision ordinance there's a subdivision statute there has to be a plat done it has to uh be okay by uh you know our staff I look at it also because put my name I'm not going to sign my name on it unless unless it's a you know a plat that meets our vision with all the uh little nuances that that have to be done yeah and what's happened in our county is like I said back in 2006 and so forth a little bit before that there was a lot of folks that were wanting to do subdivisions and of course then we had the downturn in 2008 you know and so it's been a long time I it's been a long time since I've signed the subdivision class oh yeah it's been a long long time long time since you sign one as the clerk you know um so this is a different process which is Believe Me is speedier than subdivision right if you understand what I'm saying sir okay so there should be a way they could just there could be a clause in there to where it divides the two if you're going to do subdivision this that you know this that other it go one way if you're just someone gives you the land or family giv to you there could be something wrot to where it could be it does it does I think the the biggest issue is the required Road Frontage like shanes he's got that road Frontage all on his he should be easy than that theirs there only three Parcels now it's already been subed people land different spots and you can't build on they bed up and one and didn't follow the process so now they're left basically you know they're left in alert because somebody you know and I'm sure it wasn't on purpose but somebody didn't follow the process but the subdivision process is different than amending the the RS which is both they they don't know that they just going give that piece of land to your young both of these instances really the process don't sir what happens when the livs were joined back together I mean is it still an issue with the three Liv and so if they're joined together then then it's then you kind of start from scratch and that is an option with some folks this what some folks done is join their property back together and remove those subdivision requirements which is but like the F don't have that option yeah because of my grandad's house and because of my cousin's property there because that was my granddad owned it all to start with and they're saying it was divided three times now can only be divided meeting Monday we'll bring so will we be able to get a perm right now not until not until the process is done so Monday we are going to uh bring options to um submit an application to make changes in order to help you all out to do what you're trying to do and then of course we got to have hearings and such we got to have two hearings to changing the ordinances so uh couple months process two couple months process so Monday night 6m we'll be discussing uh changes and submit an application Jamie Jamie we're we're out of town uh we just came into town for this meeting tonight so do we need to travel back for the meeting on Monday night you tell us that we'll be here you're welcome uh get that number from us if you want to just call in and then you punch star five and then we'll open up the line if you want to speak as she would see whenever you if you you punch star five it'll show that you want to speak so uh we can get that number to you so you don't have to tr all right we'll move on to the last item the board to discuss Capital Improvement plan so J the um budget workshops we presented the um Capital Improvement plan for next fiscal year and that is um given the priorities were given and the justification it's all listed out and then we also have a draft fiveyear Capital Improvement plan um for your review and I I know you've probably not even had time to look at it um so we can wait until there's sufficient for for y'all to review before we put it on the agenda um and we understand this is a wish list we we certainly I I believe the the provisions in which the fiveyear capital Improvement plan was approved in the past is that you know the the plan was approved as a wish list but every year we will bring you a separate Capital Improvement plan list just for the next fiscal year for your consideration and I'm I'm sure everyone understands that under the financial conditions we're in and you know any questions about the on that sales tax funding that um that it can change every year um we have listed the project name project manager local funding whether it's local funding or outside funding so so everyone understands if it's funded by a grant and um so so you can look at those options separately because we want to make it clear what we're asking from as far as as um what's out of our budget so we will take time to review and then back in meeting and then I guess I would say um if there's something that you wish to remove from next year's budget that that you know we have until September to make those changes um so we we would need that feedback pretty quickly so we can take it out of the budget and something I would like to point out is that as the Sheriff's Office retires their Pursuit Vehicles they they usually will call me or or one of the Constitutional officers and ask if we have the need for that if we are able to fulfill the need from a retired vehicle from the sheriff's office fleet we w we won't do both I mean we will rep that vehicle um with a retired fleet vehicle um sometimes that depends on the mileage though if it's a high mileage it needs a lot of repairs we may choose to purchase a new vehicle instead to avoid the maintenance cost so we normally just take that on a Case by case basis a lot of these out of fund and so that correct oh no just as whenever we're Rie so anything else on the capital improv plan all right no one on the line there's we don't try you want to last party in the conference [Music]