good evening uh this is a meeting of the titon falls BAU Council being held January 16th 2024 this meeting hereby called to order would the clerk please read the open public meeting statement pursuant to section five of the open public meetings act adequate notice of this meeting meeting has been provided by posting on the bulletin board at Burrow Hall and by notification to the Asbury Park Press the Newark Star Ledger and the new coaster at least 48 hours prior to the meeting and filing with the burough clerk all on December 19th 2023 thank you so much may I ask the clerk to call the role Miss Buckley here Dr Dolan here Mr menelli here Mr Nessie here Mrs clay here at this time I would like i' like to invite everyone to join me in reciting the Pledge of Allegiance IED to the FL of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible liberty and justice for all uh there are two sets of minute of meeting minutes for approval may I have a motion to approve the December 19th 2023 regular and the annual Board of Health meeting minutes so move may I have a second second may I have a roll call please miss Buckley yes Dr dolber yes Mr menelli yes Mr Nessie obain Mrs clay yes uh before we move on to our regular reports for this evening I would like to invite County Commissioner director Thomas arnone uh to come up to the front for an update on the mammoth County reclamation center um I'm actually going to turn the meeting over uh to director uh arnone and after the presentation he will field questions as well we have a mic if you'd like it don't think I'll need it but I think it's just the case thank you and and I want to thank uh the the officials here in in Titan Falls for allowing me to be here and knowing that um and constantly keeping in contact with me pretty regularly on on this issue and many other issues first of all I want to wish everybody Happy New Year here and obviously we know why we're here today and um it's very unfortunate why we're here today and it's not something that we take kindly uh and or lightly I should say and and that's why we're here and just to give a little history of of where we were at where we went and where we are today and where we will be in the future uh back and um and don't hold me to these dates somewhere around 2018 or so uh we had the issue of the landfill problem that we the county was controlling 100% with all of our staff County employees that was something that uh and I and I say this and I joke around with my fellow Commissioners I have commissioner U deputy director Ross Citra and Nick dco here with me tonight um you know we we kind of joke around when we first had it we we know how not to operate a Landfield we did it pretty well for a very long time there and you know I don't I don't hide that some things government does well and some things government does not so well and you know it's it's just a sign get out of the things that you don't do well and so we needed help there and we were having big big issues that and you know at the end of the day and I will not put out to you that I know absolutely anything about a landfill um there at the end of the day we rely on our professionals to give us the information to correct any problems and run the smooth operation and when we decided to make that move to privatize the management side of the landfill we looked at providers that could be able to manage it and have an experience with that with that being said from that period of time and the reason we picked that and and it went through a process there but the the company that came in which is Waste Management which there's many representatives here today from when we were having our difficult time they they came in and they assisted Us in in trying to remedy and make you know the quality of life there so that odor um issue would would diminish and and it and I have to say from from some of your neighbors and and I have the emails it it went well for a good period of time there you know not saying that it was 100% there you would still always get some sort of you know remnants of an odor there but at the end of the day in in the full-blown scheme it was going in the right direction something that we were comfortable with it was moving forward um there and all of a sudden um that stopped and during that period of time let me take a step back and I think it was and I know Senator Vin goel's here too tonight um Vin and myself held a public meeting in neptu I think a long time ago that was I don't even know what year that was um and we and I received numerous numerous email addresses of resid and to the to the amount of a thousand email address that I had from from titin Falls residents and probably some other surrounding areas too little in wall little in Neptune there and every Friday I I sent an email out to every resident with an update so as much as I I know there was a problem and we were trying to correct the problem I thought we did um I I would not personally stick my hand head in the sand there and we will continue to move forward and I won't accept anything but that I know a lot of you don't know me that well um these gentlemen do my count my County officials do my Administration do I don't you know I'm not no disrespect to the attorneys or anything like that I'm not one of them I'm a street guy a landscaper guy when I get mad I get mad when I'm angry I get angry and these gentlemen will tell you to the right um and and I have for the last few weeks been very angry very very angry and um and they saw the effect of it each and every one of them at the end of the day I own a business okay and I know the way you operate a business is you operate a business for success and you take nothing more but that and that's what I expect here that's what my Commissioners expect they know that's what we expect with the the good side of that or the uh positive side of that is they prove that it can be done there and and that odor can be diminished to that level I have the trust and faith to them they G they gave me a presentation they knew how upset I was um there on a regular basis I will tell you when I get an email and and on a stack of Bibles when I get an email during the day from a an a upset resident it gets forward right to them that response better go back to that resident there not from me listen I mastered how to not operate a landfill I did it very well for a very long time we did it and we got out of that business there okay but we put it in the hands that the people that can operate and I have the confidence that they can they have to give us a plan and they have to make you guys the people of Titan Falls because listen at the end of the day I live in this region too Neptune City okay but but majority of my family live in the Neptune area the wall area I have to listen to my relatives complain to me I mean I I don't want that um there whatsoever it doesn't quite go to Neptune City thank God it doesn't but at the end of the day it does go to my relative's house when I have my mother-in-law call me my father-in-law call me and tell me it's not something I that I want okay at the end of the day but I promise you this I stand here in front of you like I did in 2018 that I would make it better I didn't know how I was going to do it but it was going to not be acceptable I I'm I've been here 14 years okay the landfill was here well before me I I didn't I I inherited the landfill okay there but but the one thing I did inherit was to continue to make the quality of life here and falls into the surrounding areas acceptable for you guys to have that quality of life and with that being said you know we're going to take questions probably a lot that I won't be able to answer because I don't have the background to answer those questions but please listen to this presentation here of what the future is going to be here but let me also State here I also don't accept the future plan I want to know what it's going to be tomorrow and that's what I know each and every one of you want to know what it's going to be like tomorrow how's it going to get better immediately there so um with that being said I'm going to call representatives from Waste Management up to give a little bit of an explanation on what has changed over the period of time here there um and and how to remedy that period how to remedy the next phase and Stage there thank you commissioner Arno uh Council ladies and gentlemen good evening uh my name is Scott parin I am the area director of disposal operations for wm's greater midatlantic area um so our area includes uh eastern Pennsylvania Delaware New York and New Jersey and in that territory uh I oversee the landl operations across nine uh individual facilities uh Mammoth County being one that we don't own but we do operate under a contract with County uh with me this evening representing WM are John wrab our director of government Affairs uh Ian Moore who is our gas operations manager uh who has direct oversight over the wellfield at the lill itself uh Paul who is our uh senior district manager who has multi it the management responsibilities including Mammoth and Burlington County landfills and Fred Brown who's a district manager for both Mammoth and Burlington County landfills uh before we get into the presentation I just want to start by opening up with a sincere apology for the current odor situation from the mammoth County landfill uh we're very proud of the work we've done with this site over the last couple years and really since 2019 uh turned around the performance of that site and and really corrected some of the other issues that existed before we got involved um you know we're extremely frustrated with where the performance of the site is today and we just want everybody to know that we're working hard with the county to make sure we address those issues going forward and we have a good solid plan in place to make sure that that this is prevented in the in the future so um with that in mind I I uh one thing I wanted to sort of respond to in some of our direct conversations with residents is what's really changed since 2019 till today and why are you having the other issues all of a sudden so uh some some sight information here as you can see Over The Last 5 Years the Count's accepted about 400,000 tons a year or just about 2.1 million tons since 2019 uh that's relevant because the fuel source here the things that's generating the landfill gas which is the waste mass in the facility has grown pretty substantially uh since since the 2018 time frame I'm sure everyone here has been at some point dealing with this uh unreasonable weather pattern that settled in since November time frame where it's just been one R event after the other after the other with not a whole lot of drying time in between these events uh particularly rat it up here at this site in September as you can see that big spike in the trend where we got nearly 16 inches of rain that month so in our industry that we view that as sort of like a catalyst month because typically what happens when you get a rainfall like that uh rain is one of those contributors contributing factors that can help generate landfill gas it can help do it at a much quicker Pace uh than would normally occur we also thought it would be good to sort of give you a trend on the rainfall um over the last several years since 2014 till 2023 as you can see in 2018 there was a spike in rainfall uh which no doubt is a reason why it sort of coincides with some of the previous other issues in that time frame and you can see sort of that increasing Trend um over the last three years but a pretty good Spike jump up in the annual rainfall total in 2023 so uh and the majority of that rainfall by the way actually about 50% of It Came within the last 100 days of the year so it was hard heavy fast since September all the way through to the end of the year and we're still dealing with some of that residual weather pattern here in January today just thought I would provide some facts on why landfill gas is generated at a facility uh so landl gas is just the natural um a byproduct of the natural decomposition of waste so the organic cont in the in the waste uh starts to degrade and in that process or in that chemistry or the biology in the landfill it releases a landfill gas rainfall is a catalyst for that event so if this were a dry landfill with no water being injected into it whatsoever no rainfall in a region it really wouldn't generate much landfall gas it just helps mix everything together in that waste Mass creates the environment where the microorganisms break down the waste and start generating the gas type and quantity waste are also important because you wouldn't typically expect landfill gas to be generated at a construction and demolition debris landfill so if you're tearing down your home renovating your kitchen those types of waste that that block brick concrete W really don't break down and generate of gas but M Sol waste the the Residential Waste that's collected at the curb and comes to to Mammoth certainly does it's got a lot of food waste in it a lot of organic material in it that would break down and start generating G gas under normal conditions which we would Tech expect to see Mammoth which is about 47 in of you know rainfall and the kind of volume and the annual tonnage we would expect to see gas generation start in this waste in 12 to 18 months so usually once it's placed comes across the scale put in place 12 to 18 months would pass by before the waste itself started generating gas we'd have to have act gas collection on it to be able to process it through the onsite flare at the facility we uh we have a pretty robust gas collection system at the site excuse me it is one of the things that we really uh focused on in 2018 when we got involved with the facility uh we came in and installed a bunch of vertical and horizontal gas Wells to pull the gas out of the landfill itself uh we also installed a whole new network of headers and laterals around that site so that we could actively collect the gas or pull more gas out of the waste mask and then we actually also installed I think a a new blare a new flower actually I'm sorry we rebuilt a a flare and a blower system so that we could process more volume of the gas through the flare and the equipment was updated and operating and consistently available to the site so uh so why now again the regional weather pattern is is created a lot of challenges for us operationally to be able to address some of these issues uh we've had some contractor delays just from the rain and the continual wet condition so uh it's been very difficult to get operators out on side slopes of the landfill uh hard to get the materials in place hard to do excavation work when you're getting two and three inch rain events and they're only a handful of days apart from each other as you can see the increased rainfall it just increases the gas production overall from all the inplace waste so all the waste that's already been there for the years before uh 2018 2019 really starts to start generating more gas as more rainfall moves through it but more importantly the inplace waste so that that waste coming in across the scale today is now generating gas in four to 6 months not 12 to 18 months uh so one of the things we're working on here is an accelerated gas uh collection system expansion so that we can capture that gas from waste that's not been in place very long at all as a result of it's rainfall uh the wet conditions are definitely impacting our ability to to make uh to do sight maintenance repairs and and place more cover across that facility so uh the other thing you see here is that uh and we have a couple pictures to show the audience uh with the heavy rains we've we've seen a lot of erosion in the uh intermediate cover or the cover on the side slopes of the site U so that's starts out being 12 in but after two or three of these rain events it may be something like 8 to 10 in but a lot of the fines end up washing out of that cover soil under heavy rain conditions and when that happens it sort of allows more gas to escape or water to infiltrate and it just becomes a tough situation to manage and repair now we've been trying to do this throughout but as you can imagine if you put a bulldozer on a side slope a 3 to1 side slope and the material is superly wet um we've had to stop work because the operators actually slid from the top of the slope to the bottom of the slope when they try to get on it with the machine so there is a little bit of a safety Factor here we don't want to get anybody hurt trying to do this either but uh sometimes it's hard to get that equipment out in the side slopes to make those repairs as I said earlier about 50% of the rainfall from last year came in that last 100 day period of the year so it was very much towards the end of September all the way through to December with December being another key month with about 10 in of rainfall uh which is not typical obviously in this area you would expect it to be between 3 and 5 in at most i al already mentioned about the waist and then and then the amount of open area so if we're filling the site and the additional volume's coming in we're constructing side slopes the the amount of actual open Acres of the site's grown with the volume growth so one of the things you're going to see here is a strategy about how to manage that going forward in a phased and a controlled manner so we'll get to that a little bit later in the presentation since I'm I don't know who all visited a land or t landfill or is familiar with some of our industry jargon or some of the features that we install but the picture on the left shows you a a drill rig so this is the rig that we use to actually come in and drill a vertical gas well within the waist mask and what that does is it drill down uh anywhere from 50 to 100 ft deep in the waist it's a 36 in wide B hole and we put an 8 in perforated PVC well casing inside that b hole and then we back fill around that with a very coarse aggregate Stone uh on the uh on the top of that there's a well that goes there's a second picture on the next page I'll show you uh so similar to a vertical well which is drilled down through the waste and we can pull the gas out of the waist MK uh there is what we call a horizontal um collector system so at prescribed Heights within the waist mask and the landfill as we fill we'll install a horizontal pipe which is basically a vertical pipe just laid horizontally it's perforated we put vacuum on it um but this allows us to collect gas pretty early out of the way Mass before we get to that 12 to 18 month time frame when we would expect it to start generating gas so on the top of a vertic well uh there is this well head configuration that gets placed on top of it so there's a blower at the flare station that applies negative vacuum or it just draws the gas out of the waste mask uh as it operates so there's vacuum headers and laterals throughout the entire site and it goes to each individual well location and that those Well locations we have ports on the well head so our gas technicians can can determine how much vacuum we're applying on the well what the gas quality that well looks like and whether or not they need to increase the vacuum to pull more gas out of the well casing itself took a picture of this well in particular because this one's also equipped with a what we call a dewatering pump so a lot of times with a lot of the rain uh and the infiltration water can back up in these gas Wells and that inhibits the Well's ability to to extract the landfall gas so we actually install a pump in that well and draw that liquid up through so we could bring that water table down in the well casing allow gas to get more into it uh easier and we can extract it quicker and more efficiently uh the picture on the right is actually a ultra low emission enclosed ground flare uh this one was a file photo from one of our other sites it's not from Mammoth but it does represent the same type of flare that they have at the site so basically the blower uh puts a negative vacuum draws a gas out of the waste mask and then it pushes it to the burner tips in in the flare stack itself and that gas is combusted and destructed within the flare and that's that's how we control the landfill gas uh here's another couple examples of a well head and a horizontal Loop uh this is one that we're actually actively installing at the site uh as of by about 2 or 3 weeks ago um one thing we did here is that because that new waste is really U generating gas pretty early on is we decided to develop across sort of horizontal loop around select vertical gas Wells where we could use the vacuum line from the well tie it into the into the cross and really control any gas that's escaping at the surface or or an emission at the surface as we would call it um so uh we we've been working on a pro this project for about 3 weeks most of the work should be wrapping up in about a week and a half to two weeks uh from today's meeting uh commissioner Arnon uh just mentioned about maybe a long range plan and how we can address some of the issues going forward so stub this the 30 60 90-day uh plan or program uh most of what you see in the immediate action has already been sort of implemented or is already in progress uh we do use an notor control product here called neutral so one of the things we did a couple weeks ago was uh deployed more of the units itself that can can miss the Odor Control uh particularly around those areas where we were having on trouble or challenges with increased odors we've been we've been working when we can to to replace and repair the uh intermediate and daily cover material from all the erosion and wash mentioned about the horizontal gas collector that's currently under construction at this site and we were able to adjust vacuum across the entire facility uh because there are three separate disposal units at this site uh two of them are pretty old and been closed for a while but we were able to to adjust the overall system vacuum or the the ability to pull gas G from the open landfill the active landfill and increase the overall gas collection efficiency from from that site uh we were having some issues with the storm water Pond just because of the frequency of the water was cycling and oddly enough I mean we had a quasi drought uh for two months dur in the summer so some of that was a result of it just being dry and the water not really moving through the Basin so we did Place air Raiders in those basins they were an identified source of odor but by chering that water and keeping it uh through turning and moving ite prevents it from going stagnant and creating that sort of musky odor smell and then uh on the next slide we're going to talk a little bit more about long range uh capping plans but uh we're working on a fill sequence plan so our operators can know exactly where to fill so that when we get to a point where we're going to do one of those long-term projects uh whether it's a final cap or a rain tarp uh we'll have enough area maximized to be able to do what we can in coordination with the county over the next 60 90 days you know we're going to work on the uh any additional expansion of the gas system possibly drill some new vertical Wells as we go around and monitor the the surface emissions at the site there is a backup player at this facility that can only run for a few hours a quarter uh under the current permit but one thing that we're sort of planning for and we would expect to see that because we've had all this rainfall we're going to see an increase in the overall gas generation of the site it could be anywhere from 20 or 30% increase so we want to make sure we have enough flare capacity to control it when that happens somewhere out there in the future can't tell you exactly how far but we want to be prepared at of time to address that issue and then uh we also want to look at these basins because they are infiltration basins the way they're designed so uh if there's any heavy laden sediment at the bottom of the Basin from all this rain and erosion it it won't allow those basins to work as they're designed so one way you can address that is to go in there uh hopefully we get a dry period where we can get in there and clean out the basins and and reestablish just that infiltration design feature so the water doesn't get stagnant and create that odor source and this would be a long range plan over over anywhere 90 days and out uh because there's a little bit of design involved with with these projects so one option that you can do to landfill is what you we call an exposed rank tarp or temporary cap and that's just basically taking a geosynthetic plastic material placing it over the surface the landfill and anchoring it around select areas and what that allows us to do is keep the storm water out and actually extract more gas out of the landfill so we can draw harder on those Wells with that cap in place because one thing we don't want to do is pull in too much oxygen or atmosphere into the well because that could create a potential subsurface issue um but but when you have that cap in place you avoid poin air in at the surface when you pull harder on well and then um the site ultimately when it reaches its permanent grades and elevation will have to go through a final capping here it's very similar to the Rain tarp where it's a a geosynthetic plastic liner but on top of this you would typically place twoot of protective cover and then some sort of organic soil uh in order to close out the site um and CA so if you see two of the older disposal units at this facility those sites have been closed and capped and they're all grass and seated and they're maintained and cut um and that's final cap be a little hard to see on the picture on the left but you can see that side slope where those sort of RS and erosion occurred from all the Heavy Rain event and that that cover soil the 12-in cover material started to wash away the picture on the right is a dozer actually trying to recollect all that material that that washed to the bottom of the landfill push it back up slope and and reestablish that 12in cover material uh in the event that we uh we don't have enough material to recover from the rain event we'll we'll just supplement or add more cover uh to the outside slope so kind of what you see on the left there is the application of new additional cover material on top of fixing what was there and then to the right you actually see the Dozer and the excavator working collaboratively to try to cast some of that wet material back up the slope because on that day in particular it was so wet that the Dozer couldn't do it itself it just would sit there and spin or slide down the slope um so the the crew worked together to try to get more material back of the slope stage ready to to place it when it Dy it out uh this is an example of sort of phased capping as I mentioned on that long range plan Slide the material to the left is completely exposed geomembrane cap uh the material in the middle on this picture is actually the same geomembrane cap but it's got a product on it called wind Defender um and that's actually just like a little um grid plastic geog grid and what that does is it actually prevents the wind from tearing the cap or destroying it it works pretty effectively and in the far back of this picture you can see uh the the the vegetation that's where final cap was installed at the site um and you do this because you want to keep the amount of open area you have the landfill generally under control because the bigger it gets the harder it is to maintain uh the more susceptible it is to potentially generating uh gas loers in the area and then this is just another example that gives you idea about the phased capping approach so it's a little hard to see but in the back right hand corner of the picture out in the Horizon that's actually the active working pH for this facility but the exposed membrane cap on the top was installed because they're uh moving away from an area that they weren't going to fill in for a while and this was the right way to sort of approach the long range management of that open area install the cap prevent the storm water erosion and damage and also collect the gas more efficiently and then you can see below it uh anywhere where there's green grass growing that's uh that's where areas of final cap were installed so reaches permanent grades in elevation and they went ahead and installed the uh the cap increment um as they were filling the site over time so open up to any questions I know we went through quite a bit of technical items here but go ahead yeah I just want to grab just a little bit to that and I think it's important uh also say that you know we made we made a decision back um back in 2018 to either um sell the landfill and have the landfill owned by another entity or own the an landfill and have somebody manage the landfill this is a perfect example of why I'm glad we did what we did um and and there's and the reason for that is because then the accountability still is on the owner and we are the owner of that and quite fact not to shy away from it we're the ones that own it and take nothing away from Waste Management I don't mean that they would do that but if they did o own it it would just be going to them but at the end of the day um you know you're our constituents here and so we're going to hold them accountable to every phase that they do the one thing that we didn't touch and maybe you could touch a little bit about it is we are about to embark on a a project with New Jersey Natural Gas the num we'll be the only uh public I guess I say this right public um government entity to do this type of project which will be an enhancement environmentally for the whole region plus it should give some sort of benefit to the gas collection system I mean you're more of the expert in that but shouldn't it it it should it should and so we've already gone through the contract with them and that's a that's a county um initiative working with new Jersey natural gas there so that's just another project that we're working on there and and you know going back to when we had 60 employees County employees working there because they were all run by the County Employees um we had a we had a really balance it out well because um obviously I had a lot of things we had to look at we had to look at obviously making the quality of life better for the region plus the employee base that we had that they were going to continue to be employed so we worked through a process where literally um don't hold me to this but I think it was somewhere around 62 employees that we had there at that period of time 58 of them got relocated in other positions that we held while we were going through this process through attrition of retirement or or just for whatever reason leaving the county um two of them retired because they had the age to retire and one individual um I think came in work for you guys to be honest with there's something like that's what I heard I don't know if that's if where that individual went but so we had to balance that so there was a process that we had to go through but now we're at a point now where um all it all it's about his answers answers of just making this work here and and if I have to do what I did before um probably against the wishes of my assistant in my office send out a thousand emails every rety to give updates I'll do that I'll make sure that I request an update from Waste Management I will get it and I will disperse it to each and every resident in the county and because I mean at the end of the day I you know I sincerely apologize I mean that's all I can say to you is I apologize I don't run the landfill I wish I did I wish I could say I did something in there that I knew a little bit more about but at the end of the day I apologize for that but what I will tell you is I promise you that I will 100% like I did in 2018 stay focused on our management company and that's Waste Management which I have to commend each and every one of you on your respons to I'm sure you cringe when you get those messages from me um there the thing that's a little bit different than the last time is I'm getting those calls motion Township I'm getting them calls from Neptune okay shb yes Oceanport ocean I'm getting those calls the one thing I will tell you on on all of those towns that you just mentioned commending your Mayors because each and every one have called me on there so um there so there that's a problem and it and it needs to be corrected but it doesn't you know I know the long-term plan is is there but the immediate plan has to be there now and um I guess any questions to the part of the actual ual site itself um excuse me um commissioner if I may sure um I would just like to take a moment um to uh mention and introduce we have uh relle Worley here this evening uh she's the director of the division of air enforcement for the D and I wanted everybody to know that she is here and in addition we have our assembly members Peter Paul and donlin and also Senator bingo pal and yes I said donin I yes um and also when you ask a question if you could please come to the podium and you'll state your name and address for the record and try to limit it to three minutes uh so that everybody has a chance to talk thank you I'm G give you this because I have to believe you're going to be able to answer my name is Ryan MRA I live at 133 Cheyenne Street in senton Falls thanks for being here thank you I remember you back yeah you know I been involed here so I think I had my fact straight but you guys can check me okay no no so uh I appreciate you giving that presentation Scott I believe that's your name yes perfect so um just so I know the site was commissioned in 1970 right I I I think so yes getting some heads being sh it was open and it was it was slated to close in 2020 correct excuse me it was slated to close in 2020 supposed to close before it was supposed to close before 2020 CU we're in a situation now where titon Falls is not the same town that it was in 1970 there's a big influx of people especially since Co it's great commuter town it's a great town as the presentation said they're receiving a lot more waste than they were this is not we're trying to put 20 PBS in a 10 PB bag it's just not it's not working out so I think that do other counties in New Jersey or that you deal with send waste to rural places where it doesn't really affect people in this man yeah so one of the challenges I have in my region is a lot of these landfill facilities are actually near heavily uh densely populated areas um in many cases there weren't many folks that lived around these sites back in the 70s and 50s when they open but now they do so it's not uncommon to see a site like this with a lot of residential development right around right but other there's counties that send their trash to other places that don't affect people as much is that there are counties that have transportations that send their waste to other locations and is that what the original rail system was built in the dump Forest to bail and rail that was it originally a transfer station or was it used as a transfer station yeah I don't know if it was a a railing operation but they would bail and take the waste up to the working face bailed at the site it was never an off-site um consideration as far as I know would that be would that system be eligible to to move that Wass to to a different era I don't know if I can answer I mean I I don't know if I can answer that now but that's why these are I mean you can again email me those if you that's good if we don't answer that's I have plenty questions so we can we can go on I'll email you that Ray um so I I think personally the land needs to be closed it needs to be reated and there needs to be a new Solid Waste plan implemented likely bail and rail I know that property taxes go up everybody that I talk to is okay with property taxes going up a couple hundred dollars maybe in order to make sure that the health of the constituents is sound so I have two kids I have two little kids many people here do we want to make sure that we're not going to be in like a CB gaggy situation in Tom rber where 20 years from now what's going on um questions about the the neutral that's a proprietary product correct yes do we know what's in that uh there is a material safety data sheet or SDS they call now MSDS I saw that and I saw two conflicting ones and one looked like it was pretty bad so I'm going to hope it's not that one that I saw but does that carry on the wind is does that get into the community uh system I mean it can carry in the wind because it's a sort of a particle that what it's supposed to do is capsulate the OIC particle in the air and drag it to the ground level so if you overuse it it can carry and you could detect it how far away um I mean if you're overusing it you could probably detect it out you know 150 200 ft beyond the per landfill but that's generally about as far as it would go but we try to run the system because it's primarily concentrated with water uh so that it's working effectively but not carrying all sight creting in it sounds like you're may be overusing it though because we've increased the things that spray the chemical around the site of the Dum correct no Cu uh so I only mention that because with the gas work that we did over the last four or five years we actually stopped using the product all together we didn't need it um we were controlling the ERS through the gas system nothing was getting off sight but we started implementing it again just because the Inc back gas production and that was an early way to try to to resolve the odor issue but it's not something that we try to rely on as an operator while turn the control ERS is the smell harmful um I mean look so the SO lill gas is a lot like natural gas I don't know who here has natural gas service through home but it lill gas actually has natural merap in it um similar to what a gas company would inject into a pipeline it's that one thing they put in there so that you can actually smell it but natural gas pipeline quality gas is like 99.5% methane to 99.8% methane that lasts a little bit to make it 100 is typically the merap so that if you have a leak in your home uh you'll be able to te it right away so it's a low concentrations but things like hydrogen sulfide can be very detectable at low levels concentration in the air and that's dangerous U not not at detectable levels there are definitely certainly Health standards but when you say detectable levels though so we wouldn't know if it was at a dangerous level well no you you'd be able to smell it plus it would would be at a dangerous level but uh just simply smelling it is not an indication that you're at a health impact LEL there's been talk about air quality monitors put around the site is that are you open to that is that a county thing I mean that's that's something that we would we would definitely entertain has have other landfills used those yes M and that I I think that would be prudent I think that would be a good idea I actually think the site does do some perimeter monitoring already I thought I thought we did and I just didn't want to say that before you know I just from reports that I received back so can we see those can the public see those if if we do I don't we do I I just thought I did I I don't know the terminology of of what the landfill is but it will definitely be something we check into that's for sure um a while ago years ago phase three failed right and there was a leate issue with the surrounding water system of Mom's count that was the problem right yeah that was short of shortly before we got asol but I do recall that being potential issue correct so that's I I believe that was the issue with with postponing pH phase four so phase four hasn't no no postponing phase four was was the the approval process the approval process because of the failure of the line no no no no it's just it that that so not to to uh defer that question that we're kicking the can down the road a little but that that 100% was because of being held up in the regulatory part there that that has already been approved the phase four components when was it approved um middle of the year last year I I say goes the middle of July August time frame how long does that extend the life of the dump to I I I couldn't ask that Jeff so so I didn't know that because I I didn't well I don't know I guess we could talk about that you know at a freeholders meeting what have you um C can I maybe address that just real quick sure just to help right because I had a feeling this is going to be something that comes up so again taking into consideration that rainfall is a big Catalyst for the creation of landfill gas so obviously the 5 years TR here is pretty um concerning right because we had two big years where we well exceeded the average of rainfall and you know I'll admit we got caught up and got behind a little bit with with uh some of the gas system installation work because the rain came hard and fast at the very end of the year it made it very challenging for us to try to recover and get it under control what we're trying to do with the county long term is that now that we see this has become more of the norm and not less of the the know untypical event or random event we're going to try to get this operation to the point that we treat every year like those Spike years where we do our phase gas installation more than once a year we try to break projects over to Spring and fall we try to keep the open area controlled so that there's not this big open site uh with no capping in place to help control ERS so there are ways to manage around that and we do that pretty effectively at other sites who have homes that are comparably short distance away from from the landf itself so it can be done and something that's part of the long range plan with the county face I I think that's great and I think that you you know you can do that but I personally is it possible to adopt a new Solid Waste plan for the county are you are you open to that idea yeah I mean that that goes to the solid waste um Advisory board that but ultimately you're in control of that you're in control of no no no no no no we're not in control of that they make goes toat when I appoint a board I'm not in control of the board I appoint the board members there but I don't interfere with with that there and I don't ever want to be uh accused of that because it's not not an accusation but you're the person that implements or signs off on the plan for the solid waste plan after it comes to the board from the professionals that are on the board what and the board is the solid waste action committee is that right Advisory Board Advisory Board and that's that's a tint and false thing or is that a count thing it's County thing and do they have open meetings as well yep okay and where can we find them I think they're on the website I'm sorry inter has January yeah no I know that and meeting was canell well first of all it's not my meeting so it's not my count okay no it's a solid advisory waste committee meeting so that's what it is I mean I'm not listen I'm going to be fair and and be honest with you guys but in the same thing I'm not going to stop listen to stuff that's not accurate I'm going to correct it if it's not no it's it's but it's it's recommended from the swack individuals and I think we have one one of the swack individuals here right now that lives in tit Falls you have to follow correct great hey what's up yes so do you have to follow those recommendations or is up to you to to adopt what you think is best no I don't have to take that recommendation I absolutely don't have to right I mean but to be honest with you and I I'm not in that world of business and I don't think none of my Commissioners are um there so obviously that's why you put people that are in that field on that board that kind of had a little bit of knowledge and know knowhow of how it operates so you would or would not be open to signing to looking at a new Solid Waste PL I would have to talk to them I really am not I I it's kind of early stages for me to think about you had six years so it's not exactly early I mean this has been an issue for a while you know no we so you and I spoke about this the last time yeah okay and we did everything that I told you that I was going to do at that point in time and you and I spoke to each other after that and we know it is this is a problem right here right now my immediate thing is I have to we have to fix this problem that's that's current right now that's our ultimate goal yeah exactly if there was if there was a new Solid Waste plan we can cap it and we can move on and we don't have to worry about the health potential Health implications for our constituents and so we talked about it but I have dump reports going back every year to 2018 so it's not like it was fixed there was it was still there and it was still an issue and I have the dump reports with me and it's every year it it got less but they were still there and I I appreciate your effort and I appreciate your attention this is great honestly I really do and I I no I know we spoke num times and I think that you're genuine and I think that you really want to resolve this problem but I but I also might think to get it off your plate to get it off everybody else's plate we Clos the land we reate it we adopt a new Solid Waste plan for the county and and we move on so it's out of your hair it's out of my hair and we can all move on and we can all go to the beach and hang out thank you that's all thank you very good seeing thank you Ryan um would it be possible um if um director Wormley would you be willing uh to comment on the health issue question that was raised um by this uh last individual he had asked about the gases and any health issues I mean I would have to turn that over to yeah I was asking oh oh oh I'm sorry I'm sorry unfortunately I'm with division of solid of excuse me of division of air enforcement um basically the air permits come to the department and the permitting group looks at the potential emissions that could be emitted from the facility and basically if they're deemed approvable then they approve the permit but I cannot specifically talk about the health component because again my area expertise is enforcement okay thank you to the podium good come on up good evening my name is Janet Porter and I manage the Jersey Shore Premium Outlets located at One Premium Outlet Boulevard titin FS um our Mall currently is doing quite well our traffic is strong we're 100% leased which is great for a shopping mall in 2024 almost unheard of one of the only headwinds I face is this odor issue I get questioned frequently by people not only at our mall but when I'm out and about in town or locally why my Mall smells so bad and you know to a shopper if you're living in southern tenton Falls you know what the issue is but 98% of my Shoppers do not live in southern tinon Falls so if I was a shopper I would assume it was a mall issue and people do assume it's a mall issue and at the end of the day who cares whose problem it is it affects my mall and my reputation and I can't afford to have folk shop elsewhere New Jersey as many of you may know has more malls per square mile than any other state in the United States people can go to a mall easily within a half an hour and I can't afford to have them choose another Mall versus my mall and I'm I fear that it will begin to affect us in terms of our traffic coming to the mall um I do appreciate everyone taking their time tonight and the time that you guys have spent since 2018 since the last time I think we all spoke about this um and I agree that everyone has good intentions I wonder or my question is when is the management agreement agement between the county and waste management up when does it expire and when it's up for renegotiation can we consider adding a clause with either a carrot or a stick can we incentivize whoever we partner with whether it's waste management or someone else to have uh an incentive to have fewer days where the odor exceeds an to an unac unacceptable level or conversely can we have a stick that penalizes that them if we have the problems that we've had at least the second half of 2023 half a million people roughly came to visit my Mall our Mall in uh fourth quarter mainly November and December and at least half of those half a million Shoppers think that my Mall stinks because half the days in November and December the smell was bad and definitely noticeable when I have tenant meetings I have 120 five tenants at the mall when I have tenant meetings with the mall management folks inevitably one of the first things people want to talk about is what am I doing about the smell because even my tenants don't realize it's not my sewer issue it's not my plumbing issue it's the town issue but it's incumbent upon me to try to help solve the problem so that carer stick idea you know being in business and I'm not a scientist I didn't follow half of what the the gentleman was sharing but I'm skeptical is it going to work um in business when something is failing you offer a carrot or a stick with your partner you want to be a good partner but we all want to be on the same page in that it's not only personally rewarding when we solve a problem but financially it's rewarding either from a pro positive standpoint or a negative standpoint thanks for your time thank you how you doing my name is Gina Gerard I live at 106 Frontier way um so my guy he was awesome had a lot of really good points I'm actually curious how many people in this room have noticed that they have more sinus issues Gast show issues and stomach issues recently okay so I'm not the only one so maybe we should Aaron Brockovich your asses because clearly something's going on I've lived in my condo for 10 years I can no longer drink my water I had a filter I had to buy a $600 system to be able to drink water because there's something wrong with my water you can't tell me there's not something wrong with my water cuz every time I drank it I had to go to the bathroom immediately does anybody else have an issue with their water because I can tell you that I do I have sinus issues I can't breathe the days that the stink is so bad I feel like I have a sinus infection every other day I own a gym I'm an extremely healthy human being I cook all my food I don't go out to eat I should not be having these issues I've lived here for 10 years they're just getting progressively worse this smell is ridiculous there's no way it's not hurting us absolutely no way it's not hurting us the dump was supposed to close there's no good reason that it's still open and I appreciate this beautiful thing that you put together but you know damn well none of us know what you said and it does not matter because we're not going to know if it's going to work this is ridiculous I'm tired I can't open my windows I have to walk my dog I have to go outside all the time and smell this I smell it in my car I smell it in my business in E toown I smell it in my house it's disgusting it's unacceptable something needs to be done I call every you guys probably know my name at the DP because I call you guys every other day it's ridiculous I call I'm like hey it's Gina again you might as well know who I am this is ridiculous absurd Christmas insane disgusting Christmas Day disgusting disgusting absolutely unacceptable one of the days I was driving from Farmingdale and I was getting a headache trying to get home a headache smelling the dump that should not be happening so don't tell me that it's not harming us don't try to pretend that there's no possible way it's not so I don't care about your presentation I do appreciate it but I do not care something needs to be done it needs to be [Applause] closed good evening ladies and gentlemen Rich Klein uh excuse me 13 horseshoe Court tinon Falls Fox Chase I was here the last meeting and these people heard my my song and dance I been here 21 years I bought my home in 2002 I knew that that Reclamation site existed I knew that every once a while you got a smell that's fine then it would go away now we had problems before Waste Management took over and I come to find out through my own little homework that our Reclamation site needed a lot of uh updating and repairs when those repairs were done things got better last year we go sideways again now we're now we're in the situation that we're in I can no longer enjoy my home okay here okay I am I am a a mile and an eighth away from this I sleep with my windows open because I like a cold house I can't do it now my house smells disgusting and in reference to what this young lady was saying about not feeling well yeah there are days you can't I no longer can have my family and I no longer have my friends coming over to my home I have a beautiful patio behind my house I used it only a handful of times this year my mother cannot come down anymore my mother's 80 years old she has a lung condition this gets it when she's here gets worse for her this is unacceptable ladies and gentlemen I'm telling you now this has got to stop and I do know through my own again investigations that I've done when um John Curley was a was a momth County Freeholder he used to work with his brother this this Reclamation site was supposed to be closed more than 10 years ago it was to be capped done finished it didn't happen still open I see the whale going going up the side of the mountain nice I see the dumpu I see the the garbage trucks nine eight or nine out of the clip going up the side of the mountain why are they going up there they just go up there to drop it that's what they do it's not what it used to be they used they it used to go in it used to get bailed and then it used to get put on an 18 wheeler and it used to get stacked in there to make a retaining wall that don't happen no more I know it doesn't happen anymore and one of the things I did bring up the last time I was here I have a family member that works in another state he's the town supervisor they have a landfill the landfill goes again 8 to 10 hours a day there is no smell up there none okay there is none they have an air scrubber it's constantly going the leech fluid is pumped is pumped into the main sewer line and goes to the treatment plant to be properly uh processed that was something that I was formed up in 2019 when the repairs were going to be made the Wastewater was going to be pumped into the main sewer line shipped to the other side of tit and Falls to be properly processed you're right with your rainfall you're absolutely correct but there's a way to control it because I I had the same kind of conversation with my family member I said you get a lot of rain he goes yeah we do and I said you guys got problems he goes no we don't he said CU every day it's getting pumped it gets pumped every single day and get shipped out I also did a little homework recently just before this meeting I went to I I went on to another website for another state that other state has sewer treatment facility 3 3.6 miles away they have they have a Reclamation site there are no problems with the Reclamation site their air scrub is constantly going all the waste water goes in there gets treated and shipped out granted when you have a lot of rain yeah that's that's filtering through but if it's filling up the back if it's filling up the tub you got to move it how are we not moving this it's it's disgusting you go you come down the parkway I come I come home I I go up north I come down before I even get to 10:5 I'm like holy here we go again this gets worse at night this gets worse at night after 5:00 295 it doesn't matter which way you're coming yeah but I come down from I go I go up North and I come down south okay I hit by 105 and there it is I don't smell that sometimes during the day after 5:00 there it is it's there it's there in full force clock like clockwork it's there okay oh yeah all I like to walk I like to I enjoy my walks I can't enjoy my walking anymore and I'm and I'm a healthy person okay for those who have health problems like the gentleman that's sitting over there that that's sitting with his oxgen on I hope you're okay but if you're living on the south side over here that ain't happening for you I've been to my own doctor for a physical recently I told him about this he goes I'm aware of it he goes I have a couple other patients that are having lung issues after having covid and this has has has in um affected their breathing capabilities that's part what's going on here what's going this is this is get this is so out of control I I'd like to curve my tongue I but I'm I'm a fres I'm a frustrated homeowner I wanted to sell my house in 22 I wanted to really just say I'm finish I'm out but no I didn't because the way things are right now aren isn't so good okay but I watch I have I have taken the time I come down shaft on my way home from work holy crow here we go sometimes I pull in by plating during the day if I come home for lunch and I park facing the hill I watch I watch the garbage trucks go up to the side of the mountain they're all lined up I'm like wait a minute why is this why are they just going up the side of the mountain to dump thought it's the stuff supposed to be uh dropped Cube and scent now it's not getting scent and the other day I saw something which is interesting it was an 18wheeler with um which was a tanker driving on chafta road went into the Reclamation and I saw I saw it two hours later I saw it going up the side of the mountain what's it doing going up the side of a mountain that's not where that supposed to go that's a that's a liquid is it not where is it going up there oh he might be actually pumping out from a location up top not discharging up top so again we don't know because I see the truck come in and then all of a sudden to other l i see it going up the side of the mountain tell you though on on the L col and management system and all that I mean this site's got a pretty robust legate collection system one of the items that we did help the county work through was the on-site wastewater treatment plant those upgrades were completed uh early part of last year we did activate the uh permit discharge per tnsa so there is liquid going to them every day there are permanent requirements that don't allow you to keep the leate on the liner system underneath the bottom of the landf below the waist so it has to cycle every day you're not allowed to let that waste or that that waste water build up so um so that is being processed and managed every day uh and it's not getting built up to the point where it would necessarily inhibit issues with the gas collection system now will rainwater filter through the waste and into a vertical gas well and create issues with the collection yes that's why we have those dewatering pumps which I showed in that one picture to be able to draw liquid up so that the we keep functioning as it was designed this is why I'm saying I'm I'm coming here like I say I I I come here I'm coming to do this okay because I'm watching my tax money my taxes go up every year and I'm living with this and your property value go down oh I won't get what I I listen what what I could have gotten a year ago from my home I I would have gotten double from my home is the same am okay you go down to Ocean you go on 35 Holy Moly here we go okay this is excuse me one second just one second so Scott can you answer why Mr Klein has uh these this information from other towns where they've uh handled that situation and stopped the odors um do you have the answer to that I I don't because every site's run differently I mean the size of that site could be a main contributor I mean if it's a small site that's only doing two 300 pounds a day they're much easier to manage and you'll generally typically have issues like this this is a pretty medium to large scale facility just based on the annual volume from the area so without some additional details about those other sites specifically it's really hard to say what they might be doing differently we have comparable sites like I said earlier uh in community settings like this where you know we're phasing our environmental controls to prevent the other issues U that we're going through right now and that's what one of the things we're working with the county to develop that plan strateg well maybe Mr Klein can provide you with those individual places I can try can TR do specific site information or I can I can work on doing that for you the other thing is too one of those sites the site that I'm talking about where my family member works okay the Mohan sun is four miles away the Indian Reservation will not allow it to continue this is one of the reasons why there are no issues up there I visit up there I go to the place I go to I go to his I go to his area and I go I smell he goes he goes you won't so there's something very wrong here as I I explained to these people last time we had it when we first M I first moved in here I knew it existed I knew it opened in 1974 I know what goes what what goes comes we started having issues they got taken over by you guys great and we're told that certain things had to be fixed so on and so forth yep that's great it got fixed things started to really diminish well like now in the last last year it's gone sideways it's like you never touched it Mr K excuse me I would just like to ask you if uh you could um finish and this way um we can allow others and that's fine I came back because I'm I'm I work very hard I work very hard for anybody I do anything for you I was asked to come back I came back we appreciate it again but I'm just saying you got to do something gentlemen ladies and gentlemen okay because you know what you're going to get a mass exitus and like at certain point I'll take a loss on my house I'm out okay so thank you my business card information so if you want to Circle back give me a ring definitely touch so thank you Mr CL thank you just speak it real quick if if you don't mind just addressing one other comment that was made there so so yeah um so the aerodynamics at night are definitely much different than they are during the day and you will typically smell gas ERS from L if there's some challenges at night and early morning because what happens is the air gets heavier because the the air gets heavy it keeps flow to the ground and it makes it more detectable one of the reasons why it's not as as frequently detected during the day is that the sun comes up it pulls that that the cooler air up with it and it and it brings everything up and doesn't allow this to settle at low-lying areas or ground level so that's one of the reasons why it's a nighttime Dynamic when we're when a site like this one's having some issues but again when properly managed we get the issues fixed uh you shouldn't have that that that uh discernable change between weather conditions weather patterns it's probably also one of the reasons why you detect more frequently during Heavy Rain events because the relative humidity goes up the low sealing comes in and it and it prevents the the or actually captures the landfill gas it's submitting at the servers at and around the site how long what we're we're uh we're working on repairs so so I guess to go back to that plan so uh we're through most of the the immediate action item plans that that we had identified including the expansion to the gas system we're working with the County engineer to potentially install more vertical gas Wells that'll take maybe a little longer to cordinate because we have to find a contractor to come in and do that work so maybe in the next 45 to to um 60 days uh the capping projects are a little bit more involved and there's a lot of material that has to be order to do those project so those are probably more of a uh early summer type project as far as planning and coordination but uh we're working as quickly as we can uh in partnering with the county with the recommendations and the work and and trying to get this work schedule accelerated so we can get this problem back to it was before this issue crept up at the end of last year thank you so I guess I'll take the podium I my name is Andrew lutnick I'm here from Ocean Township on behalf of my neighbors and that town to let you know that the odor is not limited to tint and falls and it's problematic in other towns neighboring the area um I love my neighborhood I love my neighbors I love that I'm in walking distance of my daughter's elementary school but I hate that I can wake up in the morning and it smells like landfill outside and that walk to the school with my little girl going to first grade is spoiled by your landfill and I don't want her to grow up thinking that there are multiple types of weather including rain and snow and sleet and wind and stink that's not appropriate for the children in our community so that's kind of the point of Rage I want to get off my chest initially but I had also composed something pretty eloquent to read to you upon coming here most of it you already know and it'll probably be a waste of time and there's so much more to unpack from what we've heard here from others they've already said it and learned more about the approval for phase four and other details that I think we need to explore some of that you mentioned that that was the recommendation of the solid waste advisory committee and I want to ask you Tom Mr Arno call me Tom is there any screening for the members of the solid waste advisory committee to see if they have Financial interests in conflict with their participation in that committee well they and and I'm going to actually leave that up to my attorney there on who we how how we picked there Mike could you assist with that sure um you can and you can look it up look up the I'm Michael P service County Council County um and I can you speak in the microphone please I hope you're not sorry for that um Michael fitzerald County Council and I was also with some of you for the 2018 meeting you can look online the swack members are statutorily uh dictated to the county in terms of what the what their background has to be including some folks from the industry so that is that is something that's publicly available you can certainly look that up and see that there are limitations on who can be who can be put into that to that swack slot uh for the Commissioners hope that addressed the I'm not sure I understood all but I'll review it in the video later um I also want to speak a little bit ask a little bit about the complaint process I came here to find immediately upon arriving that there was a odor fact cheet that described the uh investigation and violation process and that all complaints don't lead to violations but my question is how many complaints DP lead to actually completed investigations there were 140 complaints in the 2023 calendar year how many investigations were completed be right thank you for the question can everybody hear me okay uh Chris Markle I'm the county health officer thanks for the question um so we our agency is the one that uh you guys reach out to uh you contact War DP and then we get the call either night morning we get a lot at night so thank you for those who are calling we want to know if you're getting other complaints um I have our environmental health court coordinator that can talk specifically to your question about the amount of complaints we have sir ask for number how many investigations were completed yeah so Nelson okay in January 2024 which just started we have uh 125 odor complaints called in to Mammoth County um not all the those are landfill ERS but the mammoth County Health Department has completed 77 investigations of those 125 is that 77 complaints you've responded to January excuse me 77 complaints that the muhamed county health department has received from citizens from the DP that we have investigated I think it's more likely that you failed to initiate the investigation because the uh investigator arrived at the resident's home and couldn't smell it and it was closed at that point with no further investigation no 360 investigation no site visit to the landfill so to tell us you're going to control the odors in this landfill in phase four is preposterous you don't even know if you have perimeter odor detection systems and you're telling us it's going to get better the complaint process isn't working and you need to do better you need a perimeter system that can detect and parts per billion because that's the threshold that humans can smell hydrogen sulfide and similar landfill gases thank you sir uh that would be Waste Management we we don't do the detection system so thank you um sir before you approach the podium um at 9:00 we're going to resume the regular Council agenda but what we would like to do is um since you've mentioned mentioned um that uh you expect to be through most of your action items in 45 to 60 days that we will revisit this in 45 days and have you come to us with an update of where those action items are in addition we'll keep the communication open with our presidents so that we can also have a handle on what's happening with the process but 45 rather than 60 if that would be acceptable that's fair yes yes sir good evening uh bill keor I live at 71 Edge Court I've been a resident for almost 41 years here in in ton Falls um I've got a question kind of for the county and kind of for Waste Management but does the current contract for the operate the landfill um Does it include any um ongoing monitoring if you will of hydrogen sulfide escapes at the B boundary of the uh at the boundary of the landfill Jeff I know you you know a lot of details contract there so so so Jeff the njd has got this requirement that landfills have to keep hypen sulfide below 35 billion at the boundary of the landfill and I just want to know if if there's any part of the contract that includes monitoring that for compliance well it's a state regulation so we do monitor um the smells on a on a weekly basis as we're required to do by perm so I want to be a little more go ahead a little more specific so when uh Alberto Santos up in Carney successfully closed the Keegan landfill part of the consent order was to have the Keegan landfill install I'll say a fence of monitors that were run 47 to uh to verify compliance now I think NP imposed that on Keegan I'm asking if our contract with with wmi includes any sort of a fence of 247 hydrogen sulfide monitors either on the westbound side that on West Eastern side that I'm interested in or the western side that folks in col NE interested in so how how do you measure compliance with 34 billion at the boundary of landfill we have a Jerome machine sensor a Jerome okay all right and that is used on a weekly basis to measure at the perimeter going around the perimeter uh and taking measurements so so once a week someone walks or bicycles or or moves around on the perimeter right how does that handle the transient nature of weather and wind and whatever is going on with the day-to-day operation of the landfill well that seems to me to be a a guaranteed a guaranteed way to not measure what's important to the residents I no I understand what you're saying uh but all of the results that we have had from all of the monitoring that's been done for the number of weeks that we've done it have registered zero not not on as as far as far as as far as hydrogen as far as hydrogen sulfide is concerned those measurements have been zero so um I want to be so you're you're going to the boundary of the landfill once a month once a week once a week you're you've got a Drome meter it's measuring resolution maybe five parts per billion one parts per billion but you're measuring zero yes sir and these aren't ocean measurements these are the instrument is accurate to to read to it's recalibrated all the time okay and so then from your perspective there's no correlation between the odor complaints and hydrogen sulfide emissions we've not seen any evidence of that now okay so far um why did why did why did Santos inist that hean install a fence of 247 Hy Sufi monitors I have no idea you know why well I you you know why well they can I they wanted they wanted to know that that there was no hydrogen suem missions right and the Keegan landfill was full of construction materials that's that's right and this landfill is not D and water good recipe for hyd suide emissions I understand and we don't have that problem so it's your it's the position of wmi and and the county that there's no hydrogen sulfide problem at the uh at the landfill by getting by the results that I'm getting back from that but so I I've did I not say in 30 years I've been here 40 years 40 years working engineering I'm not a licensed engineer in the state of New Jersey but I've got Advanced degrees in engineering from what I would think is one of the best college in the country um I think your measurement protocol would not stand a peer review at at any engineering company ever work with thank and I would I would I would request that that in a future contract with wi you include um a monitoring protocol that's robust and one that um that is acceptable if you will from the mayors of the the towns that that border the the the landfill or or or an amendment to the C and part of part of my my experience has been if you it's easy to measure something and and get no result but if you don't measure it um okay so I got I I know where you're get I I do want to add one thing to the conversation because um obviously as a as a large company with many employees out these tough environmental conditions you know we're very focused on safety so our gas technicians the folks that actually measure and adjust the the vacuum to the Wells and the well field many instances they're working in very remote locations of the site and there may not anybody be anybody else around them working so you know if they pass out fall get injured uh we actually require those gas technicians to where it's called a black line lone worker meter and what that does is it signifies us Via mobile data if an employee passes out or Falls and doesn't respond to the alert and if they don't respond we go out to locate them based on their GPS location what's integrated in that FL Line loone work or GPS unit is what they call for gas meter so we're actually monitoring for four separate gas conditions in the atmosphere hydrogen sulfide being one of them and we do that because if an employee passes out we don't want to send rescue workers in under a um a bad air EnV enironment where hydrogen sulfide gas or methane gas may be high so it's a good early indication of why that employee may be passed out but I would tell you that those alarms don't monitor or they don't alarm due to hydrogen selfi conditions so and and my exposure to this is basic College chemistry the ld50 ld50 for hyon sulfide is far far far far far larger concentration than 30 parts per billion so the ocean standard for hydrogen sulfide are very different than the the the 30 parts per billon required at the boundary Edge and the half part per bilon that we detect isn't an oosha problem it's it's you can smell it and so my push back is that your your safety monitoring sulfide will record zero for for 35 billion I believe it also won't won't detect what what your nose detects if correct it would not level out L it would if it got to a health level threshold that's preset in the system then yes it would the gas Tech to so they get out of the area Comm area make sure that they don't get overcome or overwhelmed by gas I'll let someone else talk than you thank you thank you thank [Applause] you hi good evening Michelle Simon 71 Madison Court um I have a couple questions to kind of follow follow up with uh commissioner Arnon and I want to thank everyone for doing their presentation this evening it was very informative I too I'm not a scientist my focus is really going to be on communication and I've spoken to commissioner Arnon on a number of occasions over the past several years since 2017 and even Leo lanino going to the solid waste advisory committee uh and I appreciate all your help and information you've shared with me um so to get to my point it's about communication you say that you are you know may have to write a thousand emails every Friday well the problem is there's a lack of communication we're all here we're all frustrated we're all online and we're not able to communicate so my first question is why is the county in breach of the host agreement someone had asked earlier what was the term of the current host agreement and it was from January 1st 2010 to December 31st 2017 now you know we had had these meetings and we discussed oh okay you're getting a tax benefit etc etc and one of the questions not only that I asked but other people asked why is the county in breach of the host agreement specifically for the advisory committee portion of the agreement right there's supposed to be three members of the county and three members of the community that reside within the area of the landfill I have come before this Council I've had conversations with Mr Taran finko he assured me that the committee was going to be developed I've spoken to several people I've spoken to you and you know what I get crickets and you know what that tells me it tells me and this is my interpretation is that you don't want the community to be a part uh of an advisory committee to get information right there okay because you and I have had disagreements for for the one thing I will tell you is I will sit there and I will take fault for for many things but listen you have been you come up with here and come with with acces first of all we are no breach of contract with t Falls okay T Falls and and we are work we will work with tit and Pauls and I will not discredit my relationship with ti FS by conveying the information to you there but we are not in breach but have you once filled out an application to go on to that committee do you think there's 600,000 people okay in in mmed county that that I could just randomly pick people out of there if you want to go on that committee you fill that application out tomorrow you'll be on there on the 25th meeting okay I'll I'll I'll do that but you know what I've had that I've had that very conversation with you before yes I have wee everybody here I appreciate everything you did there is no way okay there is no way that there's going to be any positive dialogue coming and you know that that's a personal thing there's nothing personal I've been come on you you and I don't make insinuations sir I'm here I'm here because I care about chint and falls right and I come here for the council so don't disparage me when concern when they call me and they ask me to be here okay I could very easily shut but I would never do that because I as much as I take fall for it not physically because I'm not running the landfill okay but I when you run when you're in my position you have to take the responsibility I okay so to you to your point respectfully right uh there's supposed to be an advisory committee as a part of that uh host agreement that has has not happened so you know you've extended for me to fill out that application I will be happy to fill out that application can you send me that application or tell me where I get it yes and I I will say had a fair okay I'll I'll I'll accept that I'll accept I'll AC okay but it was you do have to admit from that last time we well let's let's uh I haven't heard about request being you know to be on that board and and I take fall for that at the end we're going to through at the end of the day we'll work through that you're going to fill that and guess what okay councilman Marinelli can do you mind if councilman Marinelli says something I have two other questions too go ahead sir you know uh 2024 marks my 10th year on the council I've been here a number of times I've heard the same rhetoric from the political folks trying to get reelected I've heard all the technical stuff but these people are living in a stink that's all that counts that's all that count and then they follow what they're supposed to follow based upon this instruction seat they sent an inspector recently who said the solution was get the rail system working again and we'll ship it to Pennsylvania what I mean that's like that's like a screen door on a submarine what are you what are you doing and then he says Neptune has solved their problem because they spent money and Titan Falls has done nothing and you're really kicking Us in the crotch over here they've got nothing to do with this I have his name but I don't want to make it public come on we've been listening to this horse for a a long time no wonder they're frustrated get rid of the stink that's all don't give us the stuff we don't care about that we don't care about all the guarantees the political people are making get rid of the stink that's what you want to do it's all I have to say tonight folks and it's an ity this has got nothing to do with the dump okay so i' just like to continue on to my second question and third question quickly so that I can you know meet the time frame set by uh Council President Clay and my uh second uh question which I did bring up earlier had to do with the uh swack the solid waste advisory committee um and so basically as I mentioned the last um notice was January 21st 20121 it was cancelled and certainly uh as uh as you indicated all the members are on here right listed uh so the issue is that there's there's nothing on there about any meetings and with regards to it not coming under your jurisdiction I didn't say did come on I appoint the board oh okay okay so well then maybe you can help us figure out what the what the schedule is for swap right and when when the meetings are going to be because in the last time you were here respectfully I think it was councilwoman Buckley who had a question about the solid waste advisory committee asking about the schedule and uh the minutes and whatnot and you said and I I don't want to quote but to the best of my ability right you said that you were going to check into it and again in 2018 year no no no that this was just recently I think you were here I I think she's referring to the February 17th 2023 I think she's referring to this February 17th 2023 meeting where yourself and the administrator and some of the Commissioners announced Ed the the new proposal to collect glass glass new transfer at the end of that I had just asked you know just because you were here I was curious when the I don't remember that swack meeting was and um you just indic you indicated that oh it's still happening the meetings are still happening it's probably just an IT issue that the that this particular page wasn't updated Mike Mike could you please stand up a second that's sure that John so I not to seal any of John Thunder I suspect that the part of the response is that the solid was advisory Council uh committee rathers when they have business to to to attend to and candidly that has uh there have not been applications before the before the swack board before of late uh and uh so that that will be corrected at at the director's attention this is not new today I will tell you that the that the uh the director and the County Commissioners uh have given us uh a direction to attend to that including uh filling out the full compliment of those of that order and and thank you for that but you know again to the to the point of what the website says the last meeting which was canceled was 2021 so I mean I can ask Mr Liam Leo Roman J when was the Mr do you want to go to the mic and well thank you and I'm just going to let me just finish this last part right uh which again goes to uh commissioner unnown uh and I have been kind of monitoring this because I did ask you back in uh I think it was November of 2017 um and I I asked you about the scheduling of the meetings of the board of freeholders back then now Board of Commissioners right so as I've been you know I'm interested in attending the meetings but again I see this year uh the board has elected to schedule the county meetings during the business day between 1: and 2: p.m. and so the county is in in the business of conducting the people's business why would you schedule in the middle of the day when residents can't attend or as I mentioned to you scheduling the meeting at 5:00 people are rushing home from work picking up their children taking them to after school activities why not schedule it at 7:00 or 7:30 like tinon FS does so I just want to put that out there to you maybe there can be some consideration for a a change in the schedule and that will help with communication and allow people to come forward and ask their questions and you don't have to spend your time doing a thousand emails so thank you um we can um recognize Mr Roman J for the last question thank you Miss thanks Leo first of all I'd like to thank you all for being here and uh I got to tell you after 30 years in this community and a lifetime in the solid waste industry everybody's telling the truth you know it's a moving Target the landfill changes the weather changes the volume changes it everything you all said tonight was basically as far as I'm concerned very very true so here's my suggestion swack is that the answer uh swack had so many other issues every municipality in the County of Mammoth every one of their garbage trucks every one of their garbage Pals the amount of time we spent on the landfill was minimal compared to the other problems involved with solid waste in the county it's our Town's problem we should have our own committee we should get the support from waste management and our town hall to bring our message forward I'll make that volunteer to be available to anybody that would like to join me in continuing to gather the data Ryan Meck Michelle thank you you guys have been here forever Bill KLA has more science on it than most people I've ever met in my life um Mr Unknown God forbid the day he's not here to pick up the phone and try and make himself available and his team to us but at the end of the day it's our problem guys it's our property it's our land it's our town it's our children so let's get together and do it ourselves thank you very much for your time thank you thank you um at at this time I would like to thank um Deputy Commissioner unnown um and the um other officials that are here this evening our residents uh we hear you your Council hears you we plan to follow up in 45 days with this issue um but we're going to now uh pivot back to council business thank you everyone thank you thank you thank you thank you Tom thank get rid of this thing I know I know but needed but needed today thank you thank you yeah let's just calculate it now thank you thank you thank you thank him 45 days all right good to see thank you take care thank I'm not a politi could you give it to Michelle I like Tom too to the okay next part of our meeting okay uh continuing with reports byebye okay love you bye bye uh I'd like to uh call on Mr nef our Mar engineer uh just in case anyone from the south end of town is still listening uh we are aware there's been some complaints about the water pressure um so we were just made aware of that last week um I think most people are aware but some who aren't uh the burrow does not own or maintain the water system any uh issues with the water pressure should be directed to New Jersey American water but we are trying to work on behalf of the residents we have reached out to the water company ourselves uh they are aware of the issues some of it has to do with some of the power outages we've had but they are following up as well and trying to resolve any outstanding pressure issues that arise thank you Mr Mr Fallen thank you council president not much to report we are working through the uh 2024 Municipal budget expect to uh have the mayor's budget to councel sometime in February to uh introduce in March that's all I have thank you thank you um Mr terao thank you council president the only thing I wanted to address is make everyone aware that we are in communication with one of the uh concerns that was raised and sent into uh the borrow clerk for Mrs D Martino we've been in contact with her on several occasions and provided her with some outlets for her uh her concerns that's it thank you uh thank you I'm Mr starky uh I have no report for tonight thank you thank you Miss Hutchinson I have no report this evening thank you thank you moving on to council reports Miss pucky thank you council president clay um and they've all left but just for the record I want to thank everybody for attending from the D in the county and it's great to see uh so many residents that were here although they've they've now left so all right um I just have the environmental commission um their first meeting of the year will be Thursday January 25th at 7:30 um we're still looking for some members of the Green Team and uh the shade tree commission also needs members so if anyone is interested in any of those things the volunteer application form is on the homepage of our website or you can I'm sure reach out to any one of us and uh we can let you know where that is that's all for my report thank you thank you thank you uh Deputy president Dr doin uh yes um this past week we had a walkth through at the library with our town engineer Mr nef and our business administrator uh Charles tereno and we had Brian Perry there Rosemary kman and Ruth sentinelli um so um things look good everything's progressing well and uh we we foresee uh the situation advancing and we're looking forward to eventually having an opening of the library this year thank you Dr doin uh Mr Manelli after my swan song You More yes I nothing to say thank you m Mr Nessie thank you council president um I have no report this evening but I do want to congratulate the three newest members for the planning board and our new chairman uh Mr Clinton so thanks and that's it thank you uh for myself um I would just like to thank our um public works department for the storm prep that happened the past couple of days um and also I wanted to um give a quick shout out uh to Carrie morganthaler of our the person that coordinates our TNR program uh she sends US Reports constantly about the work that she's doing um and I just wanted to give her a shout out even though she isn't here this evening um and finally um I'd like to thank um our board administrator for um bringing in the county officials for this evening um I think it was good that that finally happened uh we will be setting up a date as the gentleman from Waste Management said 45 days we'll coordinate the calendar and we'll have an update um and that's it for my report okay uh moving on to ordinances for introduction there's one ordinance on for introduction this evening I'd like to remind the public that when an ordinance is introduced there is no public discussion the public discussion for the ordinance will take place when it's up for final consideration with that may I ask the clerk to read the title of the ordinance 20241 159 an ordinance setting salaries for department heads statutory employees mayor and councel the public hearing will be held on February 6 2024 or as soon thereafter as the matter can be reached on the agenda may I have a motion to approve the ordinance the introduction and the ordinance so move and may I have a second second and may I have a roll call Miss Buckley yes Dr durn yes Mr menelli yes Mr Nessie yes Mrs clay yes uh there are no ordinances for final consideration this evening uh moving on to public discussion may I have a motion to open the public discussion motion may I have a second second all in favor I this is the time the public May comment on any topic of their choice please state your name and address for the record and limit your comments to 3 minutes at this time I would like to ask the clerk if any public comments were submitted prior to the meeting via email there was one EMA email submitted um and as Mr Tera feno um explained there it has been addressed but it was from Susan de Martino and basically the two questions were they she'd like to have the noap on rent increases in tent and Falls addressed and also um her constant water pressure issue thank you uh thank you um other comments from the public okay why is everybody looking at you okay well seeing none uh hearing no further comments may I have a motion to close the public discussion motion and may I have a second second second all in favor hi uh does any member of the council have anything to add I think it's proven if you just let everybody know the uh presentation we saw tonight is going to be posted tomorrow awesome thank you okay uh now we'll move on to consent agenda before we do are there any items that any member of council would like removed to be voted on separately okay hearing none may I have a motion to approve the consent agenda motion second thank you may I have a roll call Miss Buckley yes Dr dolber yes Mr menelli yes Mr Nessie yes Mrs clay yes this concludes today's business may I have a