good afternoon um this is finance towns and finance committee um for uh July 30th um following the meeting to order at 6:03 pm. um as we have remote members a um call attendance voice please is here car H present Sam Grant here I heard both that was Sam and Andrea right yeah thank you and Don Hayes present so that will give us five we have a quum we are good to continue um this meeting is being recorded um on the zoom it will be played live on Channel 9 also play back on Channel 9 and available on YouTube um as [Music] available yeah this Point um I have no additions for deletions to the agenda moving into um the work session um last last week we we talked about the um um chair Vice chair and secretary position so I'm going to ask cam one more time it's kind of like sure until it's a second time um she has done the first the the July 23rd minutes they're in in review to be distributed for a final review for the whole so when I fix that one change do I just send it back to you or do I send it to everybody or what do you want to do um oh I don't have everybody's email address right so I I can give you everybody's email address but what I do is I send it to myself and blind CC everybody because we can't have discussions with it online is talk online we we can't talk no for for more too so we we just bu I send it to myself b c see everybody else and then we'll have a chance to read it before we come to the meeting okay so I'll just email it to you on the next meeting yeah okay yeah you know what email it to me I'll I'll do that same thing okay I can okay and so I'll ask you to do that today um we do have um assignments for other committees and the only one that's outstanding at this particular time is capital planning I am still assigned to properties and the audit committee the audit committee is December to December um and properties committee is now ongoing from being assigned I I did send my um request has to be reappointed to C okay so you're doing that as a whatever whatever whatever you like to do okay um we'll see and and if we if we get another member um Mary is thinking about the potential of rejoining the so that I know Capital planning there there something he may do too so we can we can hold off on that just knowing two people one one representing finance committee will be assign what what does the audit committee inail um we we are in we're Teresa moris and I are starting to Define it a little bit because there's nothing really Define what the audit committee did we were at contact when the audit came back um and last time when we had a contract we also set the set the um work requirements out for bid and then chose in this case uh braziliian Clark to be our Auditors so those were the two main things but what we've learned over the last two years is the audit committee probably should be on a review of the audit findings with the finance team in in town hall and have meetings and status updates to see where we are with the findings and the corrective actions that are being taken so um we're looking to define those um and and start taking a a more proactive role at making sure when when they say we have too many accounts what's what are the actions being taken to to correct them so so we're looking maybe to expand it a little bit but still within the audit realm of we're not going outside we're just asking statuses of the audits what is properties do um properties does is supposed to do two things um it is supposed to look at properties in town and make recommendations for purchases if possible and the other is to make recommendations to the bo to Selectmen to sell certain properties so it's managing all the different properties that are owned by different conservation Miss open space water uh Cemetery so we have listings of all those properties um but when we have properties like the 182 Warren that was on the the war special town meeting warrant I think it was last December to sell we make that recommendation to bothman to sell they discuss it and then put on one so it's not a lot of properties and and then the rest of them is they monitor properties that are being T taken for taxes um and going through that so that's that's the properties committee and how many people are on that I think I think it's it's a total of six and it may be one open position um Highway Department is has is supposed to provide and and that one's open so I think it's posted as is an open position that is on the other committee is like with the highway department can they just recommend somebody who isn't on the rec on the highway department to to keep them informed of what's going on yes they can y good Y and and so it doesn't have to be a highway department employee it could be anybody in town um representing the highway department and then keep keep them informed and that's how it's supposed to right now they're looking for anybody in town to be that Highway Department representative on properties committee yes can I ask the the volume get turned up on the big screen because I can't I can't hear anybody that's talking or anything just I can barely hear you guys you talk so softly but um I can't hear them at all I think it's only on your computer Andrea can you do me a Sound Check Yes I I can hear very well okay good and we can hear you better I think I just turned up little okay hit that okay so we turn that to volume up and we'll see if that sorry turned my microphone on and I'm trying to turn it off right now well sometimes in the past um if you had the microphone on on the computer it would echo or reverberate through the meeting and I can remember a couple times you were told to turn it off yeah yeah exactly so speaker okay so that turned my speakers off so that should stop I I'm not hearing the echoing now so I'm good about that okay so that that those were the standard memberships um that we had um we did have a request um that they're planning to put together a team to look at a trash fee process and they're asking for volunteer from committee I I'll volunteer as long as they have meetings I can attend okay they um I did I believe I copied everybody yeah it looked like it would be during the day yeah it's during the day Monday Monday Tuesday or Wednesday yeah because I'm retired um but sometimes I have doctor's appointments I got grandkids I'm Shuffling to dance and softball games and but if if if I can I'll be happy to to do that if not we can we can work out an attendee is but um but I don't I don't mind doing that [Music] sorry I I meant to be sharing this so that so um take that as a TR um Carol said she would attend the Tres fee process oh good like do you know when You' be meeting yeah um Monday Tuesday or Wednesday [Music] soon so w Wednesdays probably might be better because Mondays are going to be payroll on Tuesdays or opposite sorry and Wednesdays are bad days for me for you okay I was thinking Tuesdays were better for me if I Tuesday Tuesday would be better for me T Tuesday is the best for finance committee well since you the first ones I've asked you picked oh yeah person yeah and if need be we'll tag them and yeah just on unless I have Dr disappointment Tuesday are usually pretty gooda has made significant progress in finding a system that will handle all that having an estimate on her cost to do it so okay which is the adjustment that we see in yeah so okay next I had question yes Andrea where is this trash fee coming out of oh Sam uh sorry okay sorry I only read about it today in your notes from this afternoon yeah um so the the the idea is that um the funding for the trash line in the budget will be coming from an additional line item on your real estate tax bill and it'll be the real estate tax plus it's already there well yeah yes is I mean we have voted the trash thing started before I showed up in Townsend and I recall a discussion when we had a two and a half override in order to cover the trash not too many years ago uh and now we're all of a sudden bypassing a 2 and a half boat to override again and just putting a fee in right no that's what it sounds like oh well in a way it is but when we voted the um override for trash pickup it was an override for that one year and then the increase goes into the I know how the town manages to divert the tax increase to cover something and then take it for something else I'm well aware of that in every Community including this one um there are two kinds of overrides there's one for a specific purpose and one just for uh uh an override overall right and this one for a specific purpose but the ones for a specific purpose only lasts until that purpose is is accomplished one year one year and then it just goes to raise the total yeah but a lot of people feel that we actually I we have had two possibly three overrides for trash right overall and obviously that's something that people really want really want more than most things I don't know the conservationists complain about trash then appearing in in secluded places and on the roads and in you know at municipal buildings and things I don't know if that would still be a problem isn't the isn't trash is it more than a oneyear contract they signed a oneyear extension at the same rate as last year okay but in previous years was it a three-year contract they were threeyear contract so when you had an override wouldn't that covered the three years not just one year no well generally the the override increases the tax leing that we're charging and that says we're going to it's not necessarily one year you you bring you bring up your extra taxes let's say it's a million dollars and so if we're at 19 million right now we say an override for a million so we're up to 20 million next year our Levy limit starts at the 20 million and we go 2 and a half% over that okay but I was just thinking of trash if you have a three-year contract for trash you know what the dollars are for three years yes so so for three years you know what that expenditure is going to be so why would you have an override in that three years what what you're trying to do with the override is bring your tax levy up to a point where you can support the ongoing budget with with those continued dollars so so right now what we're saying yeah with the trash just assume that there'd be enough money there then to um afford trash without any other action yeah but if you enter into a contract for three years you're stuck with that money for three years you you are so let's let's say it was a two and a half perc raise or increase year-over-year so if you vote an increase one year it stays consistent for the second and third year of the contract you don't have to go back and charge ex you don't have to charge extra because you're a two and a half it built in it's it's not it's not built in but if if the money you money you owe for a three-year contract can be covered by a one time raise of the initial first year and then each follow each subsequent year is only 2 and a half% it also depends upon what the amount was of that override so I guess I'm so confused because I did Contracting so when I had a three-year contract and it was a million dollars the first year whatever a million2 billion three I had to have that money for that three-year contract and it had nothing to do with going back to the town and asking them for an override because I had to have that money the override amount for the trash basically paid for one year's trash collection okay you still have to come up with funding for years two and three but you have a contract written for the contract just says this is what our expenses will be okay so your contract's not for so he's not giving you a contract saying for this year I'm going to charge you a million bucks and next year it's going to be million and a half bucks and the third year it's that he's just paying you a base fee and then he just collects whatever trash he he does he agreed to a base fee but he level funded it from FY 24 to 25 okay that's fine and and that you know give the Board of Health Credit for negotiating yeah no you could do that y the question then is how do you pay for that and we bounced long ideas but the only the best way that we see unfortunately is an $822,000 line item for trash fees which we will then turn around and ask to collect that as a revenue with a fee collection system I mean if it was it could have been a second it could have been another override but didn't we vote at the last time meeting for that 824 to cover the trash you you agreed to that number to pay the charges to pay the EXP wasn't that a line item on the budget it it was a line item on the budget for that amount okay but so so so you're saying that that money really wasn't there no we did an unbalanced budget the money the money was there that we passed in April but we had level funded the schools so now that now the the assessments for the schools are changing so so you're robing Peter to pay Paul is that what you're doing yeah because because you can't it's against the law not to have a balance you have to have a balanced budget correct and I know working for the federal government we were it was a crime you could get fired for robbing Peter to pay pa and it should work in the federal government laws flow down so it should be the same with the state it should be wrong to to take Peter to pay Paul that's that's the way it is and right now the school but that doesn't mean it's right we're we're paying the school 112th of last year's budget and that's why it was level funded this budget is being presented and they're looking to increase the school budget line and so with the increase in the in two school budget lines we now come out of balance and so the work is to try to get us back in Balance okay so then you got to maybe start looking at cups maybe you need to start looking at where you going to cut I mean I mean I don't have a problem putting the trash feed God love you go go put whatever you want on the warrant I'm just saying you got all these warrants just say for the sake of argument worst case it doesn't pass you have to have a balanced budget so what are you GNA cut so you really need to think because about what you're GNA cut if that doesn't pass and you got to stop ha Robin Peter to pay Paul because that's wrong and I know federally it's against the law because we have Appropriations and we can never take one appro appropriation to pay for something else without going through all kinds of hoop and re reame that money by an almost an acted Congress and I'm almost 99% sure that works the same way the state level so no matter what you do fine put everything on there but worst case if it doesn't pass and I will tell you that you know one thing Town people get red up about is there TR and I'll tell you another thing I liveed in Chums for 30 40 years ago and they put the feif for trash in and it was a huge hover blob and guess what it the program lasted like a year and they went back to because they had so much craft given to them they went back to regular trash so you you need to start thinking seriously about Cuts right we we need to think seriously about Cuts number one number two is is the town going to vote for the appropriation for the school I mean we this this whole thing has being presented in that we we have to pay new tech that there's no there's no there's no going around that there's no going around that one because enough of the other towns voted I understand that we have to pay it's the North Middle sex budget that that's coming in y and that's also they've done quite a bit of yeah very fast and the part is is the state is screwing the schools by not paying their fair share and and I don't see anybody putting pressure on our legislators to start getting that money oh if I can just want talk about schools for a second we can because I think that's the it really to me that's the driver of the changes so based upon the number that was in the May warrant which is level fund from 24 and their current assessment M as they voted on July 10th that's a budget increase of $691,000 item that we have to find funding for great the town tried override and that didn't work I think they tried two or three times work were yeah two two different times we had so this 6 691 that's down from the what is the 1.3 million that they wanted the first yes so I mean the override was like for 1.3 million yes they took 600 they took 621,000 out of their last TK Okay so but they're still at a high number um I looked at what a 6% increase would be versus the 7.4 that it came out to if we do six if we get a new assessment from them at roughly 6% that will relieve our budget by about 190,000 which takes care of our current deficits I'm sort of getting ahead of my story okay but so I talked to the businessman today and said first the governor signed the budget the state budget yes it the DLS Gateway website has not updated to see what the Final Chapter 70 funds to the school will be or the general cherry sheet funds to the town will be I'm hoping it's squeaked up a little bit but we don't know yet so I asked the business business manager if there is any increase in Chapter 70 funds will the school pass that on to the towns as lower assessments versus adding programs or whatever they cut back into it business manager thought that they would pass it on as a lower assessment school committee hasn't met to discuss that so I don't think it's fair but that was an ask I don't think that will be a huge amount of money I said so the amount our budget is out of balance today as of 3:30 if they could lower our assessment by that amount then would be done I said so I'm proposing we put in the warrant that the select will sign next Friday a assessment number that equals that 6% that would then allow us to get a balanced budget the town doesn't get to really dictate what their number is Town gets to say yes or no to their assessment but if they should come back with that number or less we're done we have a balanced budget we don't have to go back and forth if they come back or don't come back with a lower number we would have to decide whether to accept it or not probably not then call another town meeting a month and a half from now to make further adjustments so I'm hoping that they will help us end this cycle of back and forth and agree to a number that approximates that 6% number or less um that said I mean we don't know until we get there um but the number that I proposed to the selectman is they put in a new assessment number for the high school at approximately 6% that would allow us to get a balanced budget with everything else done and the selectman could decide to stick with a level funded and say they're going to reject anything other than that I'm open to what the finance committee would recommend as far as what we put in the budget next week 6% balances the budget or last year's number that just says we're not going to pay any increase it's kind of if if we do 6% this year what's the number going to be next year it's kind of like we can't we we can't we have to have that predictability we if we put 6% in this year and it comes in another 6% next year again they they we're over 60% % of our budget is going to the schools which is not the Chapter 70 numbers and as the state is trying to drive us to a 55% and the school has to try to get on on board with us trying to get the 55% of our budget goes to schools and the 40 remaining 45 is coming to time to support services for this time um so right now it's kind of like I I don't have a good good de for next year's numbers I was not proud of the negotiations I know they negotiated with our bargaining units this year I don't think that number is going to be at two and a half% higher than whatever we put no when I talked to M man I thought she said today that their overall budget increased 3.4 which sounds somewhat reasonable but I said personally all I'm interested is the the net assessment to towns yeah because that's if we have to live right um so AR we looking for them to how much more are we looking from them I well I'd like reduce a lot but if they can reduce a minimum of $190,000 then we could have a balanced budget um I talked to Ashby today they currently have a $245,000 deficit if the school budget passes they're looking at additional Cuts Plus 150,000 out of stabilization to meet that one um the school said in order for them to reduce thousands assessment by 190,000 they have to reduce their overall budget by uh 500,000 half a million and I'm Not Gon to go through the school budget if I wanted to do school budget I would have worked for the school not the town right my interest is the assessment no I I know they have the unfunded mandates and the number of people that they have to have for student if they get hit by a special ad plan they didn't know about and those something have they have they settled on [Music] to health care because their he care got shut out on last minute that that was something that they were trying to drive and and get some help with to uh to be able to drive or join a Cooperative to drive down the bu Town's already done the health insurance thing not it's the schools yes I know but we we addressed that a couple years ago when I was here by changing the percentage from the towns and then changing um increasing the deductible yeah yeah no no no I talking specifically the school that the school was part of a um Cooperative that was buying insurance and the Cooperative disolve and so they had to go out and and get a sing they didn't do them anymore yeah they didn't give any warning they just oh they just dissolved well that's kind like so yeah that's that's that's a piece and so they gave us an estimate on on what that is so I don't know what their current standing on on their insurance is if that is any place that they could expect some relief also why would the schools get insurance through the state with public schools they say State have [Music] insurance yeah I don't know schools yeah I mean the public schools why wouldn't they that would that would be something like a state insurance you know like if I work for the federal government you know they have the federal government has doesn't the state have something similar and since they're a public entity they would be part of that whole insurance thing I don't know but it makes it sounds like it should be but it it could yeah I mean that that could be something that that the State education would could could look at is maybe coming coming together with it and and coming up with the large yeah because if you talk about all the public schools you could probably get a con ofies a scale and get a cheaper insurance rate based on volume I would hope they're looking into that that they are I don't [Music] but that's something we can we can bring up I did go to the um SC de Orly we end up cutting of our own budgets thank you is is that listed for the I have a new warrant if you wanted to go through that left off War potentially potentially I left off article and then what I sent out today yes that's what I was working on the last few minutes okay put in the article that I skipped okay but any I mean Now's the Time to find my errors no I was just only because I saw one and I said where's the other one that goes with it so try to get back at me something yeah know we've we've not proposed cutting hours or Staffing or wages right because I think that those are crucial to running the town and every position I mean it those have all been sort of beat up right I know maybe it's the wrong term scrutinized by the selectman and Eric for me and and you guys one of the things that we don't consider when we talk about cutting back position and it was the thing that worried me right from the very beginning with the arpa people that we hired it's not so much the salar that are killer it's the benefit that are rising and rising and that that's where is particularly in healthc care um I I think if we're going to even vaguely consider cutting position we should work out somebody should work out I don't know how to work out the actual total cost of the employee because it varies with everyone well and then there the offset of unemployment insurance when you do lay off somebody right yes that's true that's true and but it's got to be less than it's probably the layoff insurance would probably be even less than the increase in the cost in of medical care for that individual well I I can tell you that the selectman and your interim Town Administrator are not considering cutting positions so those are not on the table we've got some other Cuts we put in um this warrant that I've got in front of you represents $114,000 in cuts from the original budget that's on the municipal side that's not counting the increase on the schools but by the same token if you take all the money from their expenses and leave them then they're G getting a salary but unable to do their work well yes so that's we're not going through individual budgets because we believe that they reflect the reality of what needs to be done reducing head count in a department doesn't reduce the work just means whoever's left has to do more do more and yeah but some of those things can no I'm not saying that I I it was kicked around here as an option and so I just was putting in my opinion on that option I don't I I don't want to lay off employees either I um I I was totally dismayed when we hired people on um ARA funds I thought we would repair roads and bridges and things like that because we were funding we're funding salaries with onetime occurring funds and those occurring funds are about to end Andre I specifically remember you telling me that two and a half years ago yeah I know it's been it's been stuck in my craw for a long time so this well we're not talking Personnel but I will I just say the short answer to that is every one of those positions is one the select board and the Tas at the time family were needed to be done and that's part that's part of what's needed to run a town $1 million operation a town of the size but by the same token we were able to replace them because we um we couldn't afford to hire them we so we hired them with arpa what we never really looked at was could we substain them and we can't we don't have enough money coming in I believe we did and I think the answer was well we got a two and a half year head start with arper and that we'd hope that we could show the value and find the funding by that time but okay yeah you're right we did get a twoe ah Head Start but the budget we also have this huge debt because it's not the increases and you have some budgets that for example maintenance that is way underfunded way way underfunded and um if we couldn't afford them in the first place I don't know how we thought we could afford them for a longer period of time sustainably just make any sense but I know I know the Selectmen do not intend to do anything about that so we we need to see that in the forward looking plan to see how we're going to go from the $20,000 in the budget for fite 25 to the full salary in two years like those and that's just the lines under the board we also have and and I believe Council on Aging has the plan ready it um and I think that's that's the only remaining this year we did bring in the police and fire and stop funding with ARA and and have done that so we did bring in some of the ARA funded lines this year into the budget so that that's another stress on the budget this year oh by the way Ross did you look up the thing on the ambulance receipt yes so the warrant article will say so but I was going to say but it's is is a lot we're jumping around a little bit but if do we want to go to the look at and'll yeah you is it updated again okay updated 15 minutes before I came in here did you happen to mail me a copy I did not but I will okay just sh I mean it's reasonbly closed for discussion purposes for Sam and Andrea but yeah okay and get that I no I'm sorry I haven't sent it to you yet no no but the one you sent earlier I can follow up in at least um article one is just $656 to pay a bills from last year so that's sort of okay but that was last we we were looking at 10,000 if I remember right I had 10,000 as a placeholder yeah when we actually looked at the actual bills one some of them were able they were able to encumber and pay them for FY 24 yeah um 656 so that's down from 10,000 so we tried there article two is to increase the transfer from ambulance receipts from 700,000 to 800,000 or net increase 100,000 and Andrea the purpose of that is to operate EMS is exactly the wording that was in the May Town good um article three is to reduce the Town Administrator salary line item by $6,000 so that to now total 129,000 versus 135,000 article four is to reduce the automobile allowance for Town Administrator by 2800 so will'll be 2,000 instead of 4,800 and these are based upon negotiations so these are real numbers now Article Five is to reduce Mis Communications by 10 10,000 so that line item that be 5,000 and that's on reduce the individual Comcast charges to multiple buildings reducing the need for firewalls at those buildings that all be done on the central basis and this is the result of the fiber optic cable that's been installed buildings to buildings article six is to reduce the line item for police new equipment reducing it by 95,000 that's the big hitter that's the four police cruisers that they plan to um lease starting presumably July 1 the intention is to push that out to a December special town meeting and to fund that from other sources at that time and so it's four Cruisers yeah how much was that 95,000 so that was the line in the budget that we we passed how will they going to man are they going to continue to pay the old lease for a couple more months until that comes in and continue to lease existing vehicles or how does he fill the gap of those Vehicles they're walking said bikes bikes on the the ra electric bikes electric bikes just just a question it's kind of like we we're talking about kicking money down the road we're still not taking it out of the FY 25 budget so in my estimation or my understanding of this this is 95,000 that we don't have today we're going to try to do with onetime funds which means we're not able to pay for it with um tax taxes with with ongoing revenues it's it's again it's a one-time piece that we're in the hole where we get into TW FY 26 that we're going to have another $95,000 to try to find a top of everything else it's 95,000 you have to find this year well I understand that but it it's kind of like if we're just kicking a problem down the road for a year it's gonna be even worse with inflation when we when we kick in I I think the leas is fine because they have the agreement and the chief is probably spoken with who's leasing it from this was a significant increase okay but a lot of towns the police Cruisers are put in as a capital request and they're funded right as capital stabilization free cash maybe rais in appropriate usually as a capital item yeah um Town's position or the Chief's position when I talked to two and a half years ago is this is an ongoing expense he wants it to be operating yeah one way or the other we have to pay you know whether it's a lease or a capital purchase kind of purpose today is we are taking it out of what's been appropriated in August 20th and delaying it yeah and I think I think we just have to be honest and give the people these options we're just kicking it kicking it down now we do have the money this year I'm perfectly I know that we sold the three properties and there's extra money when when we when we get free cash certified I think it's going to be a a one-time large amount in there that we have we have to be cautious with will we use do we have a rainy day fun for unexpected expenses like a furnace crashing you have to replace a roof or a furnace or something and we we really don't yeah we really don't have one of them what we have is stabilization so if we had something that was really catastrophic and we had come up we'd be using stabilization but if you keep taking money out of the St to pay everything else without refresing it if you have a windstorm and it takes off a roof of I just want to be cous as we're adding these up I want to say look at the article that um we're taking an extra 100,000 for ambulance funds that's one time for this year are we going to guarantee that there's going to be 800,000 there next year for ambulance to fund their EMS and fire next year it's kind of like so all these monies were we're pricing in are cautionary tales for next year of if the money isn't there this onetime money isn't there we're going to be about 400,000 um in in the deficit budget going into next year which is three years of stabilization money and we're bankrupt it's kind of like we're running the town towards bankruptcy if we continue well I would submit that the ambulance receipts is not a long time but Chief feel very confident that we're getting more and more traction in our angance runs we have a very Advanced ALS system and we're getting a lot of support I realize a good thing mean somebody s it right and that's the thing if if if we get to that point with is a low year of cols is the money going to be there to be I that what I think was impacted if if all the surrounding towns invested heavily and put in an advanced life system service they wouldn't need the towns and force as much as they do but I would venture that's a fiveyear window for towns to build up to that but that could be yeah that could be something I hearda was going to close so does that affect the ulet runs because I know be longer so is that going to cost more money to the [Music] ambulance yeah okay they charge by the M own the charges goore okay so I mean IDE they're working they're trying to work on that I don't right now that's that's but again just we have to be cautious and we have to see um you know we sort of the at the end will be the upper money how much is that you know that's going to be about another 80,000 100,000 that we're talking about adding to this that over the next two and a half years we have to get into a budget it's kind of like we have it's got to be that vision of where we're going because if you're talking worst case say you have a $400,000 deficit next year then you're going to have to look at layoffs potentially well one I hope not but two if we do it's better next year than this year yeah I mean so those are the choices were coming down but I mean you just got to keep that in the back of your mind you know right yeah half a dozen or another but you're looking at a lot of money that you're falling behind on okay sorry okay so there article s was article six was reducing the current Poli expenses by 95,000 by delay in the Cruisers article seven is actually increase that's showing the increase from what was in the the warrant which was the FY 24 number reflecting their July 10th assessment which cut like 621,000 out of the previous so I all the school today I appreciate that cut but we still need more um article 8 is similar for theber Valley that's an increase of 334,000 on one line item and an increase of 38,000 on the ex debt one those are sort of the numbers you've been talking about relative override article n I'm adding a line item on the solid waste it's now 25,000 when we met last week I suggested I thought it was 50 but that's my estimate and I find some help from Melissa and coming upward what makes up that number the cost of staff for the the Fe colle on the trash but where's the waren article actually establishing the fees there isn't because one's not needed one's not needed okay so oh so you don't have to vote on the trash fees then trash collection correct the selectman add it's their perview to make that decision and okay okay so they just make the decision and it doesn't have to go to the town vote okay okay I don't think you me okay I think you that's situation well yeah that me and those if that's the way it is that's the way it is there's been some checking with the lawyer and and with the state to see it's I I have a similar situation in another that the bo of Selectmen have the ability and the right to say what is included and what is not included in the town budget and if they're needs to be a fee they well I mean I'm not saying all services in this particular case it's it's specific to track no I that's fine because I know the planning board we set fees and we don't go before the town and ask them their permission so I get so I mean I get that I I don't get it I I it seems to me that you would have to well maybe you do you'd have to cancel you have an article to um cancel the amount to be raised by funds you know appropriated and replace it with a feis or else people are going to think they're doing both I think when they get this up and run running and established they could possibly create an Enterprise fund which would then be the fees go in as collected and and the expenses go out of that fund to pay the the huler I was G to say very similar to real estate taxes real estate water is it is they go into a fund and when there's there's complications to that and I think since this is a startup Year we're just going to do feed collection processess so anyway that's article 9 is to realize there will be some expenses to collect those um that Revenue article 10 is to raise an appropriate $13,200 this turns out to have been something that is a um capital item that was in the timeing warrant from um 2021 and it was an ongoing lease payment for this loader that that initially cost the town 18,000 and then should have been an article in the Maytown meeting as a capital request to pay this this lease paper somehow that got overlooked and it wasn't in the but we still have to pay it is this the last one or there I believe it is the last one so that was had catch um article article 11 is I've gone through and talked to everybody and we have um five old warrant articles that the project is complete and there's still money left over so we're proposing to get that money back first close the accounts which helps simplify the accounting a little bit and then return $ 22,527 back into the Chanel's budget now we can put it into um stabilization or I can count that as a revenue there's a line item on a revenue for um transfer from other funds which will lower the deficit are these the same five five um articles that the auditor mentioned in in the in his report that that we could vote back I I would say it's some of it would be some well he mentioned there are some and and so there's a list of probably 25 and I've gone from every one of them with the person the department that's responsible for and I've gotten the okay on these five oh okay still out there but you know if they're active they should they should stay there that's the purpose of doing a warrant Artic that's right but the auditor felt that they were inactive and I I I had thought there were a great many more than the five but you and answered my question just fine thank you and just out our the double checking the amount in the text doesn't match the amount my my ma is still off it well I it under the total it says 22580 and up above it says 21507 yeah so it's just getting um it's going to and again this is this is the warrant it's going to be the motion that actually yes and I frankly didn't have a chance to proove for you it before I gave that's F It's Kind like just8 it's 22,000 and something okay okay I mean I I hate to be vague but you'll have specific we can get a calculator your preference I'm putting directly to stabilization if I we the art the motion that way or to put it in as local receipts and as aign item either way well what's the advantage or disadvantage of putting it one way or the other way you put it in the stabilization it then becomes a two-thirds to come out of there it's kind of like if we move it into the revenues it is just a a revenue vote to it's in Revenue if we don't use it all and it's in general no this will be FY 25 money now so it's GNA like sort of yeah it it goes against the the list of revenues that we have to support the budget so you're I'm gonna answer the rest of your question when I get to the end of the war I don't want okay no that's fine ahead that's fine um then you can tell tell me I'm G to ask the select me the same question whether I think the simplest thing to do is actually to put it into other funds receipts and then just trip immediately goes to the bottom line and redu the deficit by the that amount um but this took a fair amount of digging to to one get the account to pull these articles out and then go circulate and find the owners of them yeah and then get them to yeah I would I would think that some of the AR the same anymore well depart yeah like yeah it's it's $22,000 that town of prop we're putting it back in the belongs article 12 is to allow um to pay the treasur collector $1,000 a year if if and when she is receives her treasure collector certifications so this is right now just to authorize this to happen she is still in training so it's not going to be an expense until FY 26 so it does nothing to the budget this year other than putting that provision in there I know when I was here before we did this for town clerk because she had received her certification and I think it's it's a good way to encourage people to get extra training which benefits the town but this has no dollar impact for the town clerk though it was uh uh the law um said that you could do it that upon certification is is that true for the treaser too I mean that the law says yes says per M Law chapter 41 section 108 P but I think you should take this off because I think there's already too much to address and something that won't take an effect later I don't believe should be add [Music] now well I would submit that since it's non Financial this year um I think we could cover this yeah but it's made a commitment to spend more money when we haven't obviously made a commitment to get more money yes I also think we need to make a commitment for employees she's undergoing this I mean she undergoing she's doing this training now yeah I expect to complete it in 26 so right and again like it it's it's it becomes a if we it's going to it's a it's a quick article puts it in there the money's not going in year however when she does get certified we have a consultant fee that we're paying right now it goes away and so if you have that whatever the number is 40,000 or 35,000 that that's going to go away and this $1,000 is the incentive for the person that's assist Treasurer becomes the treasurer with a raise because she's fully certified um and then that does it but the the other in in the long run is a savings because we're we're going to be having an accountant with certification and and getting rid of this is situation I thought you said account okay I thought it said it come somewhere in here too but whatever treasure collect treasure flex training I think for someone to get certified yeah okay yeah sorry it's that's fine we'll go back it I had a question on the person okay um Article 13 is to acquire an easement in the property um 94 fitzburg Road still this is not the final language the attorney representing the developer needs to provide us with this language but this is a vage pipe that one was plugged up so the road was was flooding when they unplugged it they realized it's discharging on private property and the owner or the developer agreed to let us bring the pipe across their property but they actually paid for the installation we have to obtain the instent and compensate him somewhat for his efforts so that's $4,000 one time payment one one time pleas up Advantage it's will be in or out of the warrant based upon whether Mel attorney gets us the paperwork time they seem hot to trot on a month and a half ago on this article 14 last but not least is to balance the budget transfer from stabilization right now that's 143 ,000 minus the 22 that we transfer from the old AR so there abouts $121,000 for stabilization my suggestion will be to agree amongst ourselves to put that back into stabilization out of free cash this December um because as Don had mentioned the town has the onetime sale of some properties that will them to take care of the Cruisers replenish the stabilization by this amount and still have sort of their normal annual free cash funds that we have to pay for snow and hope it's not a bad year well yes that's sort of the normal free cash use is um snow and ice and a few capital or something you right but that the motion will probably be adjusted at town meeting when we know exactly what passed and didn't [Music] pass most of the requests other than the school are decreases just had one question this here it shows like um and the resource that town manager or town meeting approved was 10,000 each but yet the board has SEL like been budgeted twice as much are these the two positions yeah those are the oper funds those are oper funds so the community outreach and human resources are those okay so why the twice as much because we're trying to ease in oh into and take over yeah take get them into the budget so now if one of I don't and and that's why we need to know that real salaries because as we because now you just double what was approved we we we double what well we didn't double what was approved we put 20,000 in this year it's kind of like so last year we we said there's a little bit of room let's put so in 23 you can see it was Zero they were on the payroll but all of it was oper funded last year they were mostly oper funded and we put 10,000 each in there for FY 25 we said let's go to 20 but is that really their real salary no it is not their real salary op so what is their real salary going to be and that's what we have to get to that's why I say the Opera funds need we need to see all of it it it's kind of like this this is a snapshot of this year and we don't know where we're going it's it's it's a blind Corner we're going to go around this corner and we're not going to know um because I have to think if we look at the fire chief salary are we continuing how long are we going to continue to pay roughly a half a half a half a chief salary we're going to get zonked over their head with another with a full Chief and be looking to pay 130,000 salary at that time it's kind of like there there are pitfalls in here that we really need to see you need to know what the real budget what what the real salaries are right and and so we have the real salaries for this year but we have these things hiding in the background that you know the whack them all it's kind of like but but I mean obviously we're talking about them so we know where where these are we don't know where some of the real hidden ones are but these fire chief now and a deputy chief full time isn't he only taking half celery the chief I thought he went on to full I no if we look at this salary he still at about 65,000 that's what I thought he was he was the chief was getting like 65,000 that's roughly half of what the market rate I thought I thought he did that he volunteered to do that or something I know it is but when his contract is up is he gonna sign on again or or is are you gonna be paying a real fire chief a real salary right or is a position going and we're going to promote somebody and not have a chap yeah I see the plan this doesn't tell you this tells you but you really need to know what what the I understand that he graciously took a thing but you also have to plan for the real world of what the real salaries are and what these things are and going into like you set into the next year because otherwise you're not only going to be $400,000 in the hole you're going to be a million bucks in the hole and then what are you going to do right and that's and and then you're going to be declaring bankruptcy I mean it's like you got to start having a real budget I guess I like the federal government because the money whatever bucket of money I had for my contract I could spend that line on this thing and this line on that thing and it was very clear and you didn't mess them up I I will submit that that's exactly the way this works there's a line item in the budget what it is what what what has been discussed or hasn't been really looked at is where does the revenue come to offset it initially there was a request for million six because there were more expenses than there were re Revenue okay that plan didn't work so now we're looking at other ways and the largest single item that could be cut fortunately alternately addressed alter alternately addressed it's GNA because so by taking that eight now okay you got so now you got 800,000 plus right so now we have a smaller now we have a smaller amount that we're trying to build the rest of the holes and that's why the 100,000 here kicking out 95,000 bringing 22,000 you but kicking the 95,000 is really kicking the bucket it's not really it's well yeah we're just we're just moving it and addressing it for FY we have the longer term structural issues of okay it's only $22,000 we we bring it in that's $22,000 we don't have to come up with but we don't have that $22,000 In Articles next year so all these little pieces of what we're moving and bringing in the revenue we have to make sure it's going to be Revenue again in 26 27 28 no wa better I have the copy is better not break there should be ATM articles that can be recovered next year I mean if not next year it's a the second year I mean that concept I mean I've always tried to look through every ATM article doing bud see what I can we cover yeah if it hadn't been done the last couple years okay but that's that option is there next year and projects will finish up um right but are we are we gonna have guest wrong all that all that many times so it we need to we need to look at it then maybe that's something that we we need to count on the department heads when they're done with it and it's in their budget and they and they see it that they they bring it up to the count administrator that says we don't need the rest of this we done department heads should do that should do that yeah and I will submit as a guy won't be here a Town Administrator should say so what can we recover it's been my budgeting process for as long as I've been doing it that's just good accounting to clean up all R items you don't want you don't want that kind of money hanging around if that money was hanging around you P it in you know well yeah you need you need to close out your contracts or close out whatever whatever you you the voters provided that money through taxes last year the year before the before and I like since you've done that put that money to work so yeah it it's kind of like I'm okay with that but but again it's kind of like do we think it's G going to be the same numbers for the foreseeable future there's going to be some there but it's kind of like don't don't know how much of it's going to be I mean some of the revenue I know we don't see in some of its Minal um you know the the settlement numbers for It's Kind like that money's coming in B of Health gets a it's it's not really part of the budget that we're we're looking at but but you pretty much know that you know next year's budget is going to increase by two and a half percent I mean that's given that's what our tax levy is and then there's a tiny bit more for growth so that average is two to 300,000 grow so your your tax revenue is going to be 25% of where we are Plus another say 200,000 ex tax and ex tax yeah ex tax and again the more the more we buy new cars the higher our exp taxes are GNA be yeah is the Bo is the plans Committee in a need to vote their recommendations for or against these articles um I don't be against I won't ask um I mean I can put a recommendation in in the warrant is the Bo select going to meet Monday next week specifically on the warrant articles that's on their agenda is to vote the are they doing more they I'm wondering if that makes sense to do I I had it originally scheduled the joint for the six but if we do it the day early we could vote the recommendations the day before um and that way you can post the article it's kind of like gives gives us more time to finalize them and really discuss them it's kind of like we have it well let me go ask the question on the phone Andrea and Sam do you feel that you'd be able to vote on the Articles or do we need more discussion time for for the articles I think we need more discussion time plus I think I just need and I I don't know about y all but I need to think about these articles more and I was going to ask to go back up to the reserve um The Reserve receipt account article because even now I have thought of things that I didn't ask about that I need to know about so I think everybody could use some more time to think to think on it um I my question it and it goes back to the the line that's 25,000 for The Treasure of collector and collecting are we adding ours to an existing position or is it going to trigger somebody to go over and become a a benefited position or is it all absor within uh we're not it's anticipating additional hours no additional people and no change in health um health benefit benefit $500 more than what the town clerk got sorry it's kind of like you yeah I I was going with the fee the the fee line your question is on yeah that's okay it's kind of like um that that did have a m General law article in section chapter in section with it I believe talking about article 12 why treasure collector would get $1,000 for certific is that where you are Anda um we don't see that one I don't well this is the one he just handed up yeah right Andrea doesn't have it and I don't have it earlier in the discussion it was said that she was going to get 2,500 I yeah okay yeah yeah so it was probably the 25,000 for the for the fee yeah yeah [Music] okay yeah and and again that probably makes sense that um Sam and Andrea haven't seen the latest and greatest so okay we work on something and figure out a time we can have a meeting could we go back up to the article about the ambulance Reserve fund so I can get it out of my mind oh we don't um hang on I think I do find it it was really early on yeah yeah it's article um two dra so um I have it on the screen yeah um we voting to raise and so is it going back down to 700,000 no no it's kind of like so the May amount was 700,000 right and we're making it 800,000 right and so this is an additional $1,000 okay that's that's the additional 100,000 you talked about last week now is that 100,000 going to reduce the fire department budget and that 100,000 then and go to balancing the budget it goes to the general fund essentially because the the fire department's budget will not need as much from the general fund because they'll be getting this from and okay I I just the first time we discussed it I didn't get that that was going to happen that's the way it should be I'm glad thank you yeah so we're getting 100,000 b y it it's we're gonna get a total of 800,000 payments receipts okay which will go against the money that the fire department has asked for for their budget okay which means there's 800,000 less coming out of the general fund okay make there as of Monday There's $95,000 in the ambulance receipt account just enough to cover the special town or is the special town meeting article already subtracted from that balance oh I wish so okay so where where we're gonna take 800,000 out of what now is 95,000 and with that other 100,000 so would have leave the 5,000 so so that yep they got something to grow on for next year I resisted the temptation to take out more money because we could use more Revenue yeah you you can't unless it's in there it's gonna it's like you can't anticipate you may have bills out but you don't know they're gonna so yeah is it's amess receipts is based on how quickly insurance companies pay and then how quickly we get it you know and then receive it deposit it and get it available on the F yeah y if you're not ready to vote tonight is there any else I can do for you on budgets or question answer I I don't I don't have anything else any questions Sam or Andrea no I have no more than a yet so again these These are still draft versions of the warrant so we'll um will get me his most recent and mail it to me I'll get it out to everybody and'll be working at least with the most current version of it okay um no other questions for Ross from the room say good night thank you Ross you can enjoy the rest of your evening thank you back to back to the agenda wherever it may be okay so what's what's a discussion with the Town Administrator regarding the budget and warrant articles so there lots lots of moving pieces still on that um [Music] in and just as Russ came in I was going to going back up to um the work session item item 2.1.3 the other membership items um I discussed and mentioned that Mark hussy has been having discussions with John Barrett about being reappointed um and we do have one member that is he was appointed scor in but we haven't seen him so um two years two years um when we go to our a 13th meeting um we we have that on the schedule and that agenda was posted um the first item in the work session will will be um to have a meeting and a vote regarding the the person that we kep um it is it is there um the bylaws required that um a certified return receipt requested mail be sent it was sent it was signed bought and so we meet the 10-day requirement uh for him coming in so we just um I want to make sure we're going to have a quorum on the 13th um for that meeting it's kind of like so a August 13 a 13 so we we and Jerry I know you said you're out that week I'm out Monday and Tuesday yeah and then yeah right I'll be there to the 16th any chance you could godamn just call in my birthday that's I wouldn't be calling in either but I that I can be here I'll be here okay thank you and Sam can you make sure you're available on the 13th looking at the calendar right now yes I know that's date that we had discussed um long ago and so I had booked um the zoom call so it's Tuesday the 13th are we having one next week the the whatever um we we may I I get it um we we have to vote on it and they'd like to know our opinions before they close the warrant so okay we may we may try to do a Monday because the select having a special meeting on Monday next week I think I have my board meeting I have b six I think they meeting on that that's the regular day but they're going to close the warrant and Par on the okay I'm not sure I have to go look at my other calendar I'm not sure if I have a planning board meeting on F no I don't think I do I think it's the 12th but yeah so Monday the 5th should be okay pretty sure there's nothing on the calendar at this point Tuesday the 6 is what I'm talking about yeah no um that was the sixth was going to be but um because it's going to be closed they want to see if we we have any questions or or what our recommendations are going to be for the F for the fifth yeah so so the one that we had scheduled for the sixth with the board of Selectmen we're going to move to Monday the 5th and okay if practicable I make the the fifth but the 13th what is the 13th is that an in person that um it can be in person or or we can do remote there is a zoom oh okay the zoom fine I'm not okay when is the town meeting set for um they're trying to close the warrant for the six so they're trying to do it for August 20th okay fine yeah we'll see what happens keep that in the air yeah yeah that's the that's the next that's the next states in the air they haven't closed it because the one it's not closed and signed and posted so they won't have that until the 6 to know for sure 10th of September that was the first date or one of the first dates that show 20th 20th of a 20th of August okay well I'm I can't get an August thing up here because won't go into August oh okay D Calendar's got a little arrow go left or right and it won't go any oh they finally gave me August thank you okay 13 I'm good for finance committee finance committee fifth instead of the sixth on the fifth and then okay and then and I apologize my battery just ran down I was going to say your battery is very low yeah so and and we're about near the end so it might better be getting so um and and again it's you know trying to trying to follow the the rules that that gave the dates that said 10 days so that y not the only one my brain is that's kind of weird though why would you volunte gets one in and never show up for a meeting that's kind of that that gives us the opportunity if we oh so his term hasn't ended then his term has not ended it goes till June uh 2025 which is the end of oh okay year it's GNA like end town meeting so okay um so that's there um I only had one other item on the agenda under old business which you can't see anymore um it was the MMA Financial Training and reference document [Music] um I have spoken to the town accountant and we worked on the form so we're we're good with that um I reached out to my the contact on MMA and I haven't heard back so my assumption is she's on vacation right now and so as soon as we have that um we we'll have a second another vote because we voted on it in fy4 budget and so and what is what is it that you vote on um we're going to vote to spend money on our dues and subscriptions line and so this would be a subscription to to get that the reference documentation um and what kind of reference is financial Rush um this it's about financial or Finance committees what the finance the roles of Finance committees are in in the town so in terms and all all good stuff yeah to the town is it um they were not talking about training here there's going to be an online manual that we can get but I'm also and that is a free link um but I'm talking about buying two hard copy references that we can have and and reference if we need to yeah you can sit here rather than going through links after Links of links trying to find anything trying to find things it's kind like you know upstairs in the lunchroom oh yeah there there's um a series of uh PL cabinet one of oh no of course not nobody ever uses you'll never find but when you get the references that's a place where you can keep it okay okay yep good it's kind of like I think it was just a short time ago I the lunch room so it's there is oh they have an act they hide it on you yeah they don't want us to know about it um but while we're on there with MMA um I do have one other item under um they they sent their dues letter in so it's time for us to pay I don't know um to for the FY 25 dues FY 25 dues yeah for this MMA M yeah MMA so it's kind of like um so it's an invoice that came in uh should we have a motion to pay pay the bill and put it on the warrant and get it paid how much is it uh 150 than oh you have to put that on the warrant to ask no no no not not the special town meeting warrant the bill paying warrant so there's a weekly there's a bi-weekly warrant that they pay bills off okay yeah we have money in a uh in account for okay the reserve fund and for our dues and training and and that's right do and membership so you need to make a motion make a motion to pay pay the yeah to pay the m i I just want to make sure I mean we're we're approving spending the money so yeah it's I'll make motion to approve paying the FY 25 dues for $150 okay I'll second second it okay we have a motion in a second to pay our dues bill just so and any other questions roll call vote JN bik is yes Carol H yes Andre wood yes Dam Grant yes Don Hayes yes so we'll be dues paying member for another year okay Y and if we it one of the other benefits is we get a reduced price on the manuals it's kind of like so there would be more than double the price if if didn't so yeah there's always that little intent to PID du you get yeah you know so and then if there's anything additional that we find we want to purchase from them um because there are other other reference documents that they have um and they do have meetings and um we can go out and meet other finance committee members from other towns and and have an interaction and make contacts and see how other towns are doing I think that might be a good idea I know you know once you year we get to go to show check with all the other town but yeah I think that might be a good idea okay think I'll the following should be coming up probably September we can make it it's a usually a Saturday morning and Sharon I believe so whereever sharar iide I have no idea okay then um our next meeting date is going to be August 5th fth so I'll update and August 13 and we are meeting here next uh Tuesday on the 6th oh no it's the fifth yep oh the fist that's right we did that already and my brain already forgot it thank you I I will I will send out the updates for the meeting dates and with the zoom links like I did last time so thank you we'll get that information and get it out to everybody okay um do we have any other questions or any other questions on what we covered today on can I just go back so we're meeting on the fifth of the board SEL there also on the six correct okay yeah right and and that was one of those temporary things I had put on here with a potential but because they're they want to sign off the warrant and close it and then post it on the sixth that's why that's why the meeting on the fifth okay so we have if we have anything we want to change and discuss with them that's a good time to to get there and hit it so um nothing else being say goodbye any no other question I get i'll entertain the motion to adjourn at 7:40 7:40 okay anything as long as it's dinner um no sorry kidding um okay roll call roll call on Jour is yes Carl Hof say yes Andrew Wood yes D Grant yes Don hay yes and I thank you for your time