King day and on the back of our Tans group we have um a quote from him that just says a genuine leader is not a search of consensus but um a molder of consensus which basically means um if we want to be leaders we need to lead that is we need to develop ideas and convince others of their Merit so that's what tan um like believes in that we're hoping that we can um change the uh flight patterns of the private jets that are coming over our houses um so with that said on the 15th anniversary of a plane landing in the Hudson um I came here before to speak about private jets that fly over houses in the township that are low loud and very frequent um I belong to a group called Tans it's t uh taxpayers for aircraft noise Solutions we are a community organization tasks with finding workable solutions to the aircraft noise which adverse ly affects the quality of life of residents in the pasak valley um I'm working with um a couple different residents from other towns um a woman uh from Park Ridge a councilman uh Greg Hoffman from Park Ridge also um and another um very very um this Warren Feldman from Park Woodcliff Lake he's been researching it for years also um because they are highly affected by the planes coming very low and loud over their houses in those areas um thank you for the council people that have already signed the petition I really appreciate that um I know that Tom Sears also uh was posting it at the on the Green Team Booth um so I'm very thankful for that um long before uh Tans hackensac Deputy Mayor Kathy canisto uh Lobby for the FAA to create and utilize the 17 the Route 17 appr approach commonly known as the RNA gpsx Runway 19 approach um they were very successful and the only problem is that the approach isn't rarely used it's only used about 10% of the time um we're not saying to like ban all private jets we're just saying that there are solutions that can be done and that is one of the solutions they could just just move over to the routine Route 17 path and take that as opposed to coming in over our houses um our tan group is currently in dialogue with the FAA Eastern region administrator in Jamaica New York and we're asking questions and presenting solutions to them we're getting we're getting pretty far but I'm looking for Our Town Council support because the following towns have passed resolutions approving the petition to the FAA to reduce air traffic noise so Westwood has um done an adopted a resolution Hillsdale Parkridge Woodcliff Lake and hackin saac more towns will follow um I have brought resolutions from towns some of the towns in hopes that you can adopt a resolution um that the township of Washington can adopt um a resolution um if any of the council people want to get a little bit more involved um the next taburo airport noise abatement advisory committee it's called tanak is on Wednesday January 24th at 6 6PM they're always online and it's really good if you want to hear a lot of good information about what Teterboro um does and pretty much a lot of people we ask a lot of questions you can get um airplane routes like over your house so you could see how many flights are coming in over my house which I think you guys have seen me put that before um the the petition is now over 1100 um signed so that's good for the pasek valley I'm just hoping that we can as a Township adopt a resolution again it's not a matter of banning private jets it's just a matter of could they please stop coming in so frequently so low so loud and uh just move over to 17 or that we have more control over this now because I truly believe it's going to get worse and once I believe because I I grew up in Essex County and I know that little small airport too it's famous for because JFK flew out of it um that airport is going to start taking speed also and we've been lowered our flight path has been uh lowered to accommodate them above us so I think things are just going to get worse as they start attracting more private jets to their airport um but I just wanted to hand in uh three of the resolutions from from the other towns so you can get the verbage for it and thank you Mr I goe anything else no no that's it I just hope that you listen me this is a real issue and I know that everybody thinks I'm crazy but uh I'm not no no these airpl fly low every night and I hear them Switz was talking about this years ago and um I don't know what is why we have a perfect air flow over our town I don't know but it's just going to get worse Mrs Tickle do um you mentioned that there's this route 17 approach that's proving that it's effective but it's only used about 10% is there a reason why that or a reason that uh the FAA has given that it's not used more it's basically it's um it's a Pilot's Choice or it's uh also um what do they call the site uh Tron um it's uh a flight Tower um it's called Tron they follow the be yeah yeah once they make the corner and they know Tron will say okay you could shoot the beam directly to you know teur airport and so that's what they say they say okay we're going to shoot the beam and just directly in now the pilots can I guess also reprogram their plane to shoot a different beam yeah shoot a different beam and go down the Route 17 um I'm okay with Route 17 may start affecting other people they might start complaining but I just simply said can you even do that for Sunday alleviate some of the pressure because Sunday is blue laws they did consider that a little bit because I'm like there's not that many cars on 17 on Sunday right so so but just to alleviate some of our you know barbecue fund not okay if it's all right with the rest of the council I'd like to uh have Cornelia forward these to Mr par to prepare a sample resolution for our next meeting to review and hopefully adopt the meeting after once we review it and Mrs Tickle if we can get you a copy of that to make sure that we've included everything in that that you think is Val you know more valuable to make it a you know a better resolution if you don't mind thank you and if you're comfortable with it what's going on now is that um there the resolutions are now being sent to the FAA in letters we consistently we're on like our second response letter the FAA comes back to us and they say A B and C about why this is going on or not going on and then part two we send a response back to them so now our response is going back to them with the five resolutions that have been adopted from the other towns we want to for the next round of FAA uh correspondence and dialogue we'd like to to have that resolution included the Township's resolution when do you need what well we kind of needed that like tonight cuz they're they're sending the letter out um I don't think Mr Po they're not going to do it you have to yeah you need a couple you need a round or two more but I I mean I say we get the ball rolling yeah that's what I'm saying get we'll get you a resolution but unfortunately it won't be tonight okay all right now the Town Council so we have we have we have three resolutions here one from the uh city of hackin act one from the burrow of Park rdge and one from the burrow of Westwood I think the burrow of Westwood is our sister city you know we're we're we're joining cities or townships and and and U burrow so I'll read that one to the to the council really quick and see if you're okay with the verbage in there and it says basically resolution mayor and Council of the B of Westwood approving petition to FAA to reduce air traffic noise whereas a large volume of private jets flying into tear airport brings intolerable noise levels in the burough of Westwood significantly impact the quality of life of its residents and the entire pasak Valley region and whereas since 2019 the air route over Route 17 rnav gpsx was established as an alternate route and whereas voluntary noise abatement recommendations have failed to effectively achieve the necessary utilization of this R whereas the utilization of Route 17 Corridor will significantly mitigate the noise over Park Ridge and the entire pasak Valley region while having little to no impact on residential dwellings along the corridor and whereas the Govern body seeks to join in the petition to the FAA and traffic controller who mandate the airspace to prioritize the Route 17 alterate Route as a preferred route for arrivals to Runway 19 at tar airport now therefore be it resolved that the mayor and Council of the burough of Westwood County of Bergen in the state of New Jersey hereby support the petition requesting the FAA and traffic controller to prioritize the Route 17 alternate route as the preferred route for arrivals to Runway 19 at Tor airport and be it further resolved that the bur administrator B and is hereby authorized and directed to forward a copy of this resolution to the FAA the municipalities comprising the pasak valley region Tac and our state and federal Representatives I have no problem making a motion to introduce that tonight and if I can have a second um Mr President council president yes Mr paa all right so let me let me just make this suggestion if you're in favor of it maybe there's a better way of doing this so I would just take that res resolution and on the top I mean you could pass the resolution tonight I would take the top I just mark off instead of where it has I don't have in front of me but yeah instead of Westwood you know put down pat up of Washington done um and in the body of it if you just want to go through it or instruct uh when it's being R when do you need this resolution by tomorrow morning yeah yeah I mean as soon as possible yeah they're going to submit a letter this week so that's I'm trying to get that's what I'm trying to do do that so thinking is if you can uh mark it off with the West with the I'll do I'll do it after the meeting and we'll get you a copy of Mr PA for tomorrow morning okay but just just pass the resolution um what's our next resolution number so it's 2456 156 it looks like mik m i at least we cross off Westward and put was I did that I did that already okay all right okay and then end it hour the way we do ours okay okay so you have the normal resolution language so motion to approve um resolution number 24156 approving a petition to the FAA to reduce air traffic noise in the township of Washington I'll make the motion would somebody like to Second it second roll call councilman Cassio yes councilman Sears yes councilman Alman yes councilman valz yes council president the Senate yes thank you Mr par thank you very much it makes me happy thank you Mrs Tickle for your presentation and hopefully it'll help us um one last question U if will that be like retyped up and not look like a cross out for the FAA okay just you know all right thank you very much would anybody else in the audience yes Mr agell had his hand up first thank you uh Mike ello 667 Mason Street Township Washington um first off as everyone knows here I'm a fireman in town been been one for 47 years but I'm not up here speaking for the fire department I want to speak as a resident okay it's very important because I don't have the authority to say as a as a representative of the department some of the things I'll bring forward okay but anyway I'm here this evening to discuss an RSVP that I received from councilman man stating that he will not be attending our fire department Chief's testimonial dinner because he plans on cutting these types of spending and it would be hypocritical for him to attend our dinner so based on his beliefs not mine for this item to be cut he will need an additional two Hypocrites that will be attending the dinner to vote for The Cutting of this line item I would like to just explain to everybody that town does not pay for this entire dinner the fire department picks up roughly 75% of the cost of the dinner through the fundraising of Christmas tree sales each member of the fire department volunteers an average of 18 hours of their personal time to sell Christmas trees to the public for which we raise enough money to pay for most of this annual dinner the dinner that we organize for our outgoing Chief comes at the end of his officer serving career this equates to an amount of time that can take any any officer from 10 to 16 years to complete becoming a volunteer fireman and then increasing his or her dedication to become an officer on the department for a period of that many years volunteering all their time spending countless hours away from their family and becoming more administratively involved with each step that they climb the ladder ultimately managing the entire department as Chief yet still just a volunteer without these volunteers given their time and effort to the town you would have to at least duplicate the police salary budget for a paid fire department perks are needed to make volunteers fail appreciated and remain on board for many years these item these items are small Discretions that keep things positive we cannot run these dinners these well-deserved dinners without the continued support from the town and with the rising cost recently made aware aware to us today recently by our venue uh vendor roughly 40% over the next 2 years we are not looking for these to be cut but actually for you to possibly increase them this is a small token to pay to the comparison of salaries to the volunteers who give their time to this community so living in this town now for the past 60 some years I'm guessing and assuming that this is falling on DEA ears and that you will still plan to cut these types of line items which was promise which was a promise made by the independent uh party that ran for the recent office terms opened up this past November I would like to make a recommendation and even more so a request that if you feel so strongly about cutting such discretionary spending then the leaders that support such Cuts should become volunteers first lead by example become a volunteer give your time to the community for free show the community of Washington Township that you are willing to put skin in the game to meet your promises made to them for their votes make the first line item that you cut as a discretionary spending be your Council seat salaries be a volunteer to the community the same way the fire department and ambulance courus and expect nothing uh for what you do thank you thank you Mr egnell council president may I add to Mr ell's comments um sure full disclosure I am a fireman in town um I'm speaking as a citizen and a fireman so far this month we've had 30 fire calls 30 different hours of the day different times of nights and right now there are over 30 volunteer firemen that are out doing a drill in this weather and I find it utterly disgusting and that's all I can say that you're going to cut the fireman's budget whether it's discretionary or whatever the clue word that they want to use I've never heard this before in my 40 Years of firefighting service and I really think some people ought to maybe think about their position on the council thank you council president thank you Mr sear we're having an we're having a uh problem I don't I don't want anybody think I'll be disrespectful there's a problem on the internet with our volume it's going in and out so I'm on the I'm texting Ricky back and forth to get it fix so we're back on okay thank you may I yes Mrs won okay um it's a shame that we do not appreciate the volunteers that we do have in this town so Mr Agnello I apologize that this this is where we're at and our volunteer firefighters who put their lives on the line for our residents have to even deal with the idea of being cut so you have my absolute support our volunteers do not get the recognition that they deserve across departments thank you for your service thank you Mr Sears for your service that is all thank you thank you Mr Mr yeah I would just like like to say that uh the comment that I made uh to Mr agnelo uh just uh to be clear I wasn't stating specifically the uh Chief's dinner uh what I said is I'm declining the invite to Chief's dinner we're going to be asking for cuts to discretionary spending and it would be hypocritical to go to the dinner I feel that that if we are going to be cutting uh discretionary expenses that uh you know shouldn't be feeding off of that as well and that's my position I didn't say I was going to cut the uh fire department the chief's dinner but uh we did run or I ran on a reduction in uh taxes uh at the municipal level and that's how uh we would get there through discretionary spending so thank you uh you know Mr agell I'm sorry that uh you feel that way uh and it wasn't meant there a uh a personal attack on you or the fire department uh it simply uh how I feel about uh the event and in terms of it being uh a discretionary spend thank you anybody else in the audience like to come up yes Mr sh oh I wanted to make a comment if I may council president I I already asked Mr snide to come up on up so your answer is no not at this time Mr way okay may I make a suggestion that you ask the members of the day if they have any questions or things before you move to the next speaker I did you did come on up uh David snide 91 Windsor Circle uh Washington comment um understanding what some of the new council members have run on essential services such as the fire department without them we have nothing and I really think that we need to support that and not reduce it um I hear the fire department every time they go out of the garage because I'm right next door to them in washingt in Commons and um I'm just coming in tonight um to express that that's all I just would like to see you not look at a reduction of the fire department nor the police department I'm just saying to you that's an essential service that's all I'm saying to you and by you're we're in total agreement with you okay thank you very much and good luck in 2024 thank you everyone would anybody else on in the audience like to come up at this time oh so we can't comment on what he just said either would anybody like to comment on Mr schneid it is our meeting mayor oh we're starting that yes are we saying the mayor is not allowed to speak at the council meeting is not what I said Mr s what are you saying because I believe the mayor asked to speak we are we are we are moving on the subject's been discussed we are not the mayor asked to part of the discussion of Mr Snider we're moving on you don't have 30 seconds to give me so not at this time Mr Mayor so might I ask one what is your direction here we don't allow the mayor to speak is that what that is not what I said Mr Sears do do not put words mayor I'm trying to get an understanding did ask to come yes he did and I said not at this time may I ask when you'll you'll I'm sure you know you you made some false accusations last meeting against me I did yes what were they I I'm not going to I'm not going to get into a discussion about it so oh so you're just going to take it out on me without giving me a chance to defend myself you you you made comments like what the the $13 million comment got thrown at us again the 13 million con concept is totally misleading this the the people on this day spent we passed a $113 million bond for the firehouse and pass bands to remove them and and get interest under 1% that is the $13 million this that myself Mr Man Mr Casio and Mr Bruno spent and you keep throwing that $13 million out there that this Council spent $13 million we spent that $13 million for two things the brand new Firehouse for our firemen and to pay off 7 million in bands which was a interest only payment that was made for years and we financed that to a low interest 30-year Bond at under 1% and you've thrown it out you put it out in the newspaper and it's totally misleading we did spend 13 million you're absolutely right but 7 million of that $113 million was to pay off bands which was a credit card paying no just paying interest with no principle for all those years so when we stop putting out statements like that and then go put our articles in the paper and mislead people I will let you talk may I talk now no what a joke you can't take it Mike can you I can take it but I do not like to be disbar you you you made it you've said the same statement about us spending $13 million we did spend $13 million but it was for two things it was to build a new Firehouse Emergency Services building for the fireman and the ambulance Corps and to pay off banss that were getting kicked down the road someone would anybody in the audience like to come up yes Mr Mayor this is getting to be an unfortunate habit that I have to come off the day is to speak you know have we really deteriorated into this no we have not but when the well you shut me up so you leave no alter when the statements are made over and over when you when you start giving this is my 5 minutes go ahead I believe all the members of the council here voted for a new ladder truck for the fire department did they not I believe you are correct okay did the members also vote for a new engine for the fire company yes okay part of the bond yes there's 2 million in spending on top of the seven for the building but it was it was permanently bonded at under 1% no that's a ban no it was not a b you're not going to get a bond at 1% these days we did get a we did get bonds we bonded it with Mr binefeld that's why we got rid of the bans you're you're wrong no I'm not yes you are okay we bring in Mr binefeld and let him explain it to us cuz we were told we were going out for permanent financing for the $13 million right at under 1% no you're wrong okay that's your will I be able to speak during the conference agenda since I put items on there yes your name is on well you didn't say that just now you didn't say I could speak conference agenda that's not what I said you said I couldn't speak now I said when can I you said I you we're not in the conference agenda you you've asked for I will be able to speak in the confence Mr Mayor thank you you see what your council is doing this town is a laughing stop would anybody in the audience like to come up and address the council or anybody on Zoom like to address the coun council at this time anybody un zo I don't see anything motion to close the public comment period so moved second second all in favor I I resolutions consent agenda the following items have been determined to have unanimous consent of the council and will will be enacted in one motion should any required any item require independent consideration any council member may have such item removed from the consent agenda at this time does anybody have any resolutions to be removed from consent agenda for discussion uh 147 excuse me Mr Cass I'm sorry 148 148 I'd like to remove uh that's the one I would like to remove also can you remove uh 145 146 and 147 sure any Mr Sears anything Mrs no they're all self-explanatory okay yes sir resolution number 24-44 authorized the mayor to execute bcos Grant agreement contract for the land acquisition of 450 pasak Road $550,000 resolution number 24149 authorized refund the boys basketball registration fee to an to the total amount of not to exceed 155 resolution number 24150 authorized refund of girls basketball registration fee to the total amount of not to exceed 165 resolution number 24-11 authorized participation in the sustainability New Jersey municipal certification program resolution number 24152 authorize shared services for bcua certified recycling professional resolution number 22153 authorized renewal of interlocal agreement for street sweeping Services by and between the burough of pamis and the township resolution number 22154 authorize renewal of shared service agreement for vehicle maintenance by and between the burrow of pamis and the township resolution number 24155 authorize appointment of a municipal storm water coordinator motion to approve uh the agenda item is just read do I have a motion so moved second roll call councilman Casio yes councilman Sears yes councilman Alman yes councilwoman of ales yes council president to Senate yes resolution number 24145 authorized enacting standard policy for implementing the claimant certification I believe you had that removed Mr Alman yes I just um oh hold on I got to take a mo do I have a motion motion so moved do I have a second second discussion yeah I just um so uh I don't understand exactly what we're looking to achieve by this I mean I could read it but I don't know if you can explain what it's actually doing or I don't know if it's you Mr Mayor or Mr it uh it could be me Mr Dara would you Mr Mayor could you explain to us no I'm not going to sit here and let you tell me when I can and can't talk so then no Mr Al we cannot know I will allow the administrator to answer it thank you cuz I won't stoop to your level thank you thank you mayor uh council members what this is allowing uh our qpa asked for our support um with this procedure purchasing law requires um the township or any Township to pay an invoice within 30 days of receiving often times we'll have trouble with a claim it signature on a purchase order so with the purchasing law allows us to do in circum certain circumstances with expenses under 6600 that aren't a reimbursement for employees expenses are not Professional Services uh and are not a refund of Municipal fees or payments and any other payments deem necessary to the Chief Financial Officer so barring those exclusions anything under 6600 allow our purchasing department to pay the invoice without the signature on the purchase order Missing that 30-day window could be a blemish on our audit could be something that was picked up on an audit so um do we eventually get that signature Mr we could or we couldn't we generally see it with um how can I explain this without it shouldn't sound demeaning or insulting but you know the the expenses of that are usually under the 6600 might be a vendor that we don't use all the time or a vendor that might not have very many P much Personnel um so that way it gives us you know we have to have an invoice have to get the service have to get the merchandise has to be supported by an invoice but if we're having trouble with the vendor sending us the signed purchase order that allows us to make that 30-day deadline and pay it we certainly will attempt to get it but the law allows us to to pay without to sign the P yeah thank you any other question questions on this roll call councilman Casio yes councilman Sears yes councilman Elman yes councilwoman of alz yes council president to sener yes resolution number 24146 authorize Award of contract for administrative agent to community grants planning and housing LLC do I have a motion so move second I'll second discussion I pull it so I guess the same question so this administrative agent handles oura obligations yes uh it's an jump B maybe yes Mr P yeah yeah having an administrative agent is a requirement under the COA settlement uh you must have one uh and they're the agency that would be doing things like uh assisting in U selling uh U co- units uh pricing co- units um uh they they do a variety of services if you read their contract uh it's it's a variety of services and that's the COA related services so we have to have that um it's it's uh we don't have any you know particular would they run the lottery Mr P excuse me they would do like the lottery for the yeah what whatever whatever service is necessary uh they also help in the um uh reporting uh uh requirements when we report to the state they they're involved with that um and up now up till now they're they're uh I think their total number is like about $1,800 $1,900 that they they they spent last year so it's not a lot uh but it's a requirement um we had to do it and we have to maintain it and we did a lot of research about getting the best uh company that was price competitive and also didn't um have a lot of requirements of paying money irrespective of whether we were actually using you know active services so but that's that was my last question uh Mr paer is are there any fees that would be due to the firm uh if we have no COA activity that sort of they manage is there a retain fee black no I don't think there's no I think there's no retainer fee uh and but they do have some services that they do render they do bill for like the monitoring and and uh reporting and stuff like that uh but we stayed away from mandatory expenses if we weren't going to um you know incur a a specific C units okay thank you any other discussion on the guys roll call councilman Caso yes councilman Sears yes councilman Alman yes councilwoman alz yes council president to Sena yes resolution number 24147 authorized Award of contract for municipal advisor and continuing disclosure Services Phoenix advisor LLC do I have a motion so move second second discussion uh not sound like a broken record but um Phoenix advisors what advisory services are they providing I didn't um ask for this resolution but I'm imagining U maybe Miss mucowski just duplicated what we did last year um my understanding of what fenus advisor does is provides that advisement um and works with Bob binefeld when we go out to borrow money for whether it's a bond or a band and is there uh a retainer fee or do we know the fee structure um there is not a retainer and I'm just looking to see if the contract is I didn't see it yeah it's hard to explain it let me just uh the contract's not there there is a fee when they do the work but there's no retainer that I'm aware of okay all right thank you any other discussion rall just I'm just one this is not um they don't I know you just explained it but they're not involved with the Lowell no uh that's link fin okay right sorry about that thanks any other discussion roll call councilman Casio yes councilman Sears yes councilman Alman yes Council woman alz yes council president to yes resolution number 24-48 authorize Award of contract for municipal architect AR car iino architect PC do I have a motion so move have a second second discussion sure uh I asked for this to be uh discuss because you know the last time we had uh come up with this architect as a contract and on staff I don't know if it's really um containing costs to be quite honest with you and that's when it first came up four years ago I voted uh I believe no to hiring a on uh a architect by retainer so um I still feel that it's probably better when we have an award or we're looking to do something that we go out and get bids for architectural services for each project that we might have it Fosters a little bit of competition uh so that's my uh reason for pulling this any disc yeah I just again I just if there was the understanding that there was a retainer there is not there is no retainer um for uh Mr iino or that architectural firm so what is this contract for specifically again uh you know just assuming that Miss wowski duplicated what was last year it would be awarding under a Professional Services contract the services of uh Mr ien you know and there is currently two um projects that that firm is working on one being the DPW building and the other being the renovations to the library and and you know doing the study of the police department which I kind of just incorporate into the DBW building so does this prohibit us from going out to get prices from other Architects if we make him the Town architect that's a legal question Mr Pa thank you you're muted you're muted Mr P all right uh sorry um no it's not exclusive uh if there was a project that you decided to uh you know get a different architect I mean there could be things that this architect doesn't even do so you can go and find uh other Architects or other Services it's not a a a full-time exclusive award it would only be authorizing their use under their their agreement I I guess my question is the agreement is that a blanket agreement for doing all architectural services for the township or you don't have it in front of you I don't have it in front of me but I'm assume I don't have it in front of me but I'm assuming it's uh hourly rate type uh quotations uh you know of what they uh what they charge you know for whose time doing what um although as I said I don't have in front of me I guess at this point I just like the tabless one for next meeting so I'd like to see what the contract actually entails and you know go over that and then you know if it looks if it looks good I'd be happy to have uh these Architects come back because they are doing some work for us but again you know I like to go out to B for things to get the best possible price so that's my uh recommendation so I'm going to make a motion to table until next meeting sure go ahead yes please I think the council president should run the meeting not the vice president thank you Peter anytime yes Mr the this architect has done several Pres ations and renderings of the current DPW building so by tbling is this going to put us on halt for the DPW once again we these gentlemen been out of a building for far too long if we go out for bid then we're just starting from scratch all over again when we've already invested a lot I don't I I that was not into I didn't I didn't see that I just want I would like to see Mr um their contract with the town and what it actually States I I would not like to see it rebid at this time B I'm not I'm not suggesting that for these projects that are already in motion same for future for future projects exactly yes that's not yeah I'm not going to go back and start I'm not starting fresh we we've been done through that for a number of months they do deserve some type of structure so that's not my intent at all my intent is if we go out for other other projects whatever they may be major minor you know I think it's wise to go out and bid for those things understood okay thank you so anybody else on the days like any discussion so does this allow so by appointing a minicipal architect it allows the town to or the and specifically the administration to approach them with requests and there's no need to come before the council but it doesn't Prelude Iovine from doing work for the town or am I misunderstanding that meaning if we don't approve this tonight he could still work for town is that correct Mr Paul question no uh now we should have a contract to to get to be approved um well I don't know what his his price structure is in terms of him doing his work uh but normally you would have a a contract with the professional yeah but don't we have a contract for each project with the professional I don't think so um I'm not I I don't recall that we have a a specific uh in each individual contract for for each project I can answer that if you yes want to hear me yes um since he has been the town's Municipal architect he does not have an individual contact contract on each project he's he falls on under previous years when when the council has approved him as the township uh architect so does he submit a proposal to the administration for each project with a not to exceed amount or is it an open-ended uh budget like how does how does how does I guess like yeah like you I don't have the contract in front of me so I wouldn't be able to answer that council president can I ask Mr pauler clarifying question sure Mr Paul I know so right now obviously the DPW building still under discussion but Mr iino is like actively working on the renovations of the library if this isn't passed tonight can he continue working tomorrow and Wednesday and so on well um it's almost at his risk he doesn't really have a contract then to get paid right he had that risk yet he had that risk yesterday because the contract expired on the 31st yeah that's what I'm saying it's uh it's we're into 2024 so he needs some authorization to do work if he wants to do work and then there's a contract or resolution passed later on fine but if you said now you know um right now in 2024 he's not authorized to you know do work so if I could ask the administration was this not included last week not excuse me uh last meeting last meeting uh was it an oversight or was there a specific reason why it was held so tonight I honestly can't answer that I would ask um Miss wowski if she could you know she's honest she could provide that information she get technical difficulty she okay it was not an oversight I you know she she managed as you know manages things very well so you know there were some things that weren't on that night that are on tonight and you know without her I wouldn't want to answer for her okay there were definitely definitely was not an oversight you know there's a lot of things that start at the beginning of the year uh theoretically you could have uh you know uh 50 resolutions on uh reorganization day so some resolutions uh are pushed off just by a matter because of volume of the work and the the the documents that have to come in the pay for play the you know all of that stuff so uh it definitely was not an oversight um per perhaps oversight was the wrong word was there a was it is it presented tonight rather than last meeting for a specific reason and it sounds like there was no there no no there's no n no reason before you vote on tbling it may I make one other comment sure I'm sorry um if if I'm recalling correctly and maybe some others on the council will also um we we appointed a municipal architect if we needed a very small architectural opinion for something where it wasn't ready to go out as a full-blown project just yet and U I say we the mayor and Council because obviously the council approves all the major projects um so it was just to not have to lock architect architect into only certain projects that are being worked on that way if we needed a quick opinion on something we had one who was outside the scope of projects and was a municipal architect to just get quick architectural questions answered it was not meant to assign him another big project with without having a discussion on it first but haven't we but I I guess what I just heard was we did hire them for the two projects the without a proposal with a not to exceed amount for the ppw and the and police Renovations so we don't have like a like what I'm saying is we don't have like an individual contract that the council has approved the previous Council has approved for those two projects because he's been doing under a blanket agreement that basically he is the municipal architect as for the resolution right yeah um I I can't like I said without having the paperwork um I didn't you know I can't say yes or no to that whether he has a separate agreement on these projects or not and if you can Mark please council president we uh last year the council approved a $225,000 capital budget account for Mr R for the architect to review um possible you know restructuring or design so he did have a budget line but he didn't actually submit the like a proposal yeah I can't mayor is executed and with the the township is executed right so I wouldn't want you to think that there was an actual piece of paper that said it's not to exceed however he was well aware that that's what was you know approved by the council before that any other discussion roll call counc Casio no councilman Sears yes councilman Omen yes Council woman MZ yes council president to Senate yes adjournment to conference agenda do I have a motion so move second second all in favor all [Applause] right okay current business administration Mr Mayor you had ask for the DPW building as your first topic and the I guess you have four topics on here you have the DPW building first I guess we'll start with that um yes and as I've said in past meetings uh you know that one's going to stay on until we collectively make a decision on the DPW building so uh with that being said I don't know if the counil is waiting on the administration for anything to help guide that decision for the council to authorize uh you know spending on it moving forward so have we looked at the uh burrow of muni's brand new facility they built off of Route 17 across from the fiesta not that I'm aware of munaki munaki is that a bgen count it's a Burgen count Town yes um they just built a a beautiful building right off of Route 17 it's uh it's right across from the fiesta if anybody knows um so I just curious if we had done any we had reached out to them and seen the pros and cons of the building they put up uh it's a beautiful it's gorgeous building they put up so um the only you happy to do so the only thing is um and maybe you know if you've seen it um you know will it fit in our footprint um you know cuz we have a very relatively small footprint to fit in here um it's it's it would it's a lot bigger than what we need but it's just it's a it's a so you just mean conceptually maybe conceptually yeah just I think you know um we we can certainly ask uh the the uh architect if he knows about it since that's what he does um but uh as as far as any of the other options like option one two or three um would we be able to get a uh I I know I didn't receive options I see I saw him I was at the meeting when he presented uh but would we be able to get that in our can we get that email to us or sent to us Mr Mayor it's the link on the website I don't think works oh okay yes of course thank you and just as a as a point to start um option three I believe is the preferred uh option uh uh the and that includes a second story with a courtroom and I guess non DPW uh workspace option three um when the both departments were here they both preferred both departments police and fire yes I'm sorry police and DPW um was the option that they thought worked best for them individually and as a group um sorry I lost tra you a question with that I'm sorry it includes non DPW so I think room yes cuz the with option three it would be the architect's intent to give the police this room M and put council chambers and Court Chambers on the second floor of the DPW building okay so my only comment to that is it would seem that putting um the courts the council uh and having uh Transit uh traffic through uh or adjacent to the building through the parking lot so if there's a council meeting if there's courts uh if there's an event like this evening a snow event where there would be be a lot of activity uh I think that is a concern or that would be a concern of mine the other is uh the fact that there is uh storage of chemicals and the like within the DPW uh and that people who uh may not have an awareness uh or have the ability to not uh participate or visit uh the building uh don't have an option uh possible exposure as well as you know uh you know why introduce that uh potential risk so that would be you know my only comment for option three uh without reviewing the whole thing but sure that uh and so I would just make that comment okay bye if I may any other discussion yeah I remember when when the ladies were here that that was discussed in regards to um bad weather inclement weather it was suggested that we could make the the call to go remote for the entire meeting to go remote instead of a hybrid option so should there be a situation like that we we do have that option now with do we wouldn't have it for court would we you know for court date I'm no I'm saying just for for Council you have that option but for court you would not like like you know cuz Court would court is still remote from Co and there's really well court is still not in session correct there no anticipation of them going back at this time and and that's that's at the county level I think that decision is right one so that there is that option to to avoid that traffic concern and and if I may just address uh councilman alman's part about Hazmat um I fully agree with what you're saying however um let me say the DPW employees being in there and having a potential exposure um you know we would always make sure that those hazmats are controlled to the utmost extent possible but I see where you're coming from please don't get me wrong I'm not looking to be argumentative no it's uh and again I I also think that they go in there with knowing the risk meaning they know what's in there I don't know if again a transient person would sure and thank you miss fellis any other discussion on the DPW building at this time Mr Mayor the 2024 Road program or Mr Dar Carlo I'm sorry thank you council president it's probably safe to say that everybody uh left in the room is concerned at how long it takes us to get started with the world program every year so we're discussing and and kind of not even researching it's pretty pretty clear to figure it out um and talking with John yimi from bosw engineering that you know manages the capital Road programs it's really kind of because of two things so no no uh fault of anyone but last year as you can tell by the time the budget and the capital ordinance is approved it's like June matter of fact is June need two readings so we can't go out to bid on the road program Mr can you put your microphone yeah sorry we can't go out to bid on you know any project but specifically the road project until the CFO can certify that we actually have the funds in hands so and then uh Mr yimi also informed me that you know every year we have a New Jersey DOT grant that we combine with the road programs so he suggested very simply to just separate those bid process because when a New Jersey do grants involved there's an incredible amount of you know New Jersey state red tape you know uh you know for a lack of better term that prolongs it so separating them and going out um at separate times would help improve us for the actual Road program where there's say five or six streets or four or five six streets as opposed so this year we received uh a very nice grant for Calvin as an example so that you know I make a suggestion to the the council that would be twofold um perhaps you know you know suggesting to the council that perhaps uh considering approving just the capital expense for the road program sooner than later uh rather than waiting till till the end of the budget um and I know again you have to kind of try and look at the whole picture together but if we were capable of of deciding how much money we want to throw at the road program I'm just throwing this out Say by March 15th and we could get those ordinances passed sooner than later we can get the process of going out to bid sooner than later I think most of the road uh Road resurfacing companies probably don't try and pave in July and August so then our next you know safe as bet is that when it gets into the fo so as we can see last year or you know for 23 we didn't even go out to bid until like the latter part of September you know then by the time the bid's gone out and it's awarded and it's approved by Council and then we get a preconstruction meeting going then you know they always promise it's going to start yesterday um and then it doesn't then that's when we get towards November and then we're deciding is it too cold to get it done and it's not going to be done correctly so um you know again the one thing P December this year what's that yeah we PVE December so um the one recommendation Administration can take care of is is as far as you know separating the bids that that's noin um but making sure we have the money approved by the council sooner than later uh would be an excellent way to get that started so if it was something you guys consider you know I mean when when we turn over the budget to you guys you have the capital section in there anyway um you know with with your guidance and mayor's approval we can certainly get you just the road program sooner or you know at the same time with with the request that you guys look at the the money you want to spend um for the road program so that would be my pitch to you uh this year again not that it's awkward but PG is coming back to write all the all the uprooting they did on a lot of streets so some of the streets uh they have to pave because of the M moratorium like Hudson being one in um Robin Robinwood what's Robinwood so learn the street sorry um and then some they're only doing half cuz they only me affected half the road and then some they're doing whole because they did this half of the road then they crossed over and did this half of the road so we're going to have a lot going on um regardless of the 23 Road program so we're looking to kind of combine everything together so that would be my pitch if you can we uh can we ask Mr corham Mr Mayor to give us if we would have enough in the you know the existing Surplus cuz like I know the dot we were talking about this you get the 75% of the money as soon as we start to you know as soon as we go out the bid we get the bids back we get 75% of the money so that money would be returned very quickly the 25% yes Mr kimmi's always right it's the hardest 25% to get but you get the 75% so at least it's you get a lot of the money right back so if we could find out what you know if there's a way to you know while we're doing this in order to expedite it if we could you know if the Surplus could hold us until we got put back our Capital Surplus yeah okay if that I don't know if that could work or not but just to see if we can right is the council okay with that certainly find out all right thank you anything else on the discussion for the 2024 Road program now is is the road program being handled by Mr yukimi or Mr beon you want me um since it was a 23 program um that you know we didn't finish um it will probably stay with uh with bwell because they've already done the 24 program oh the 24 program yeah well this is oh I'm on here is the 24 I'm sorry I thought since we didn't finish the 23 I so you refer yeah um since that's new uh that will be going to uh Mr pman thank you yes any other discussion on the next one Mr Mayor budget and taxes yes thank you um now that the administration and I you know it's January so we're working on our part of the budget uh but based on the last meeting it seems like perhaps the majority of the council um have a plan um that they want to try and get to so I didn't know if uh anyone of them would share the plan so we could maybe work in harmony uh since we're preparing the budget um to not you know just spin our wheels on things that don't align with what may happen during the council's part of the budget process can we get some dates where we could all meet without having a quorum I guess Mr par we can two of us can meet with the administration or or yeah two two so Mr Mayor if you can get us some dates and and count I mean might I ask is there a problem with stating it in public or you're just not ready to or no no I'm just say I thought you just said you wanted to meet to to hash out or you want to do it in public I thought you wanted to meet beforeand to hash out I mean during this meeting um you know is there anything that you know can be said about your plan so we try and align I I don't have the marked up budget in front of me from last year but you know we could sit down either at at a meeting or at a different time whatever you'd like okay so I mean I would like to hear what that is you know it could be beneficial to our residents to hear what's coming so that we can all be aware okay right so here here's my plan you know we talked about doing a 10% budget decrease um again the scretary budget 10% uh pretty much across the board except for NE Neary items I mean there's some things you can't cut like things from the fire department you need Scot packs you have to have them it would be not prudent to have those so if that costs you know x amount of dollars it cost x amount of dollars but there's other places we can gleam out of this budget 10% there's no doubt in my mind you know it's not a specific thing that we're going to only do 10 here we're going to work together and we're going to find somewhere to take this budget down 10% and there's places we can do that there's some places we can't do it I mean we're realistic about that but we know we have to work together we got to get it done that's what the taxpayers want okay they feel overburdened over taxed and we can do it we're all smart people up here we put our heads together we can come up with a budget that's reduced there's no doubt in my mind we can do that never was you know things we need things that we'd like to have things that we can have because they're just you know too expensive get what we need not what we want you know that's how we work our most of our households and I think we can do it if we work together and I think we can work together together is a is a is a word that we have to start using and we have to do it and we can do it I'm confident everyone up up here on this stas has a commitment to this town and this is what the town's people want and that's that's my plan I can't say specifically we're going to cut 10% from here and 10% from there if we need to take Zero from one line but we can whack 20% somewhere else that we don't really need I'm okay with that and that's my plan but you know you have to get into the specifics of it you can't come up here and make a blanket statement that we're going to do away with the fire department cuz we don't need them right 10% we need there's stuff we need there's stuff that are luxuries okay Mr sers you have your hand up yes uh CC question for uh Mr dalala my last meeting with the tax sucessor uh she told us that we are probably one step away being forced to do a complete reevaluation by the county and we should maybe um start figuring out I think she mentioned 260,000 230,000 to start the evaluation will that be placed in the budget this year for us to start it it will unfortun Mr let me just so Mr Sears Mr Dar Carlo um we we had a we had a request to have the tax assessor come tonight and I I asked Mr deal to defer to the next meeting myself and Mr Alman were not uh we didn't have the information that you were given in the packet no problem so I wanted to be able to have a you know an informed discussion with her so I asked him to defer to the next meeting she will be here correct Mr Dar car the next meeting sir Mr Dar Carlo Mr Mayor said he would provide us the information that she provided the former Council um so we could all make informed decisions with that information cuz we don't myself and Mr Alman didn't get that packet so I don't have that information that you're talking about cost and all that so but just to follow up we are about one step away being forced by the county to do 100% yeah truthfully it's probably less than than one step away we are on the list to be mandated it just hasn't happened yet so it's in our best you know just to give you a little insight in the next meeting it's definitely in the Township's best interest to do it ourselves um our T my tax accessor our tax assessor explained that if the county mandates it it's the one-year tax revaluation which would have a significant higher cost than that than that yearly revolving and they also mandate you that you revise the tax maps which is also was significant so us getting a jump start on it and doing it the recommended way that uh she's recommending could save us several hundred thousands of dollars and and nobody is against we we just didn't have that information tonight but Mr did ask for her to come tonight and I just asked her I asked him if it was if it was if it was mandatory she had to come tonight we were going to be in trouble or something he said we could hold off right I mean yes by doing the reval we also drop off school taxes also that's a huge yeah that is that a guarant I don't think that's a guarantee is it yeah but listen you don't you don't know what I don't think that's a guarante but we won't pay as much as you know yeah you're right you never know you don't know and you know here's here's the thing we talked about it numerous times when she was here and she likes to compare people like to compare us to Westwood we are not Westwood in some ways we don't have the businesses that westw does exactly so to say that it's definitely going to help with that aspect I think is a false premise because we just unfortunate we're the same in many ways and different in many ways and that's one of the ways that we don't have that you know that just I'm just going by what so I I mean so just so everybody know right Mr D she will be here the next so we'll have a presentation at the February 5th meeting um she'll be Zoom via Zoom yes correct she all right and this week Kowski has all the documentation she plans on sending to you in the near future any other discussion on on the tax Ral or taxes Mr May anything else Mike did you want to say something it looked like before you wanted to jump in so if you do before I continue no okay um so again U I'm sorry that I'm confused um our our budget last year allocated was 15.8 Million um are you saying as 10% you want to cut 1.58 million off of 24s appropriated budget I want to get started on reducing it yes i' like to do it I'd like to do it in one shot but let's be realistic you know it built up over time it's going to take a while to build down over time you know if I can get uh steady or I can get some type of reduction I'd be happy with it as long as we start going in the right direction so I I mean I feel that we have employees that are covered by cbas we have Debt Service we have required statutory payments such as the library I mean we could go on and on that what's required so there are certainly items that we can't cut even if we all want them to uh I don't know what that number exactly is of of the 158 the residual of that is where I I personally would like to start looking with an eye towards flattening or reducing okay um I mean I have a few quick things to recap um out of the out of that 15.8 million um 6 million is just in salaries both CBA and non CBA um should we budget for those uh non CBA people to be getting a raise this year you can budget for it mayor do you mind if I no no this a discussion um councilman Alman I just if I if you don't mind me just clarifying something you said because it is the second time I've heard it and I I want to let everyone on the day know that most likely 99 or 100% of our employees watch these meetings if it's not live that will watch it tomorrow or the next day and I'm concerned what they're hearing is that the salaries of the employees that are protected by a conect collective bargaining agreement are safe however those that are not are not necessarily safe because I've I've heard twice now that you say discretionary statutory salaries that are protected by CNA so if if you wouldn't mind I'd appre appreciate it cuz it might relieve some anxiety that may have just been caused or it might um justify some that might be caused I respectfully uh just ask you to clarify that thank you certainly Mr Dar Carlo uh I would not be looking I personally am not looking to cut salaries for any employee okay uh at this point in time okay and uh I mean I'll take that one step further and I hope that the council will uh Entertain You Know reasonable increases um CU I I believe at least from my knowledge three of the council people are paid by tax dollars if not directly indirectly and as far as I know um you know you will all be getting raises this year at your jobs so I would hope that we treat our staff the same um as far as you know that goes um and I did highlight some of the uh statutory things the major ones uh liability insurance 225,000 workers comp 219,000 um Health dental Life and Accident just over a million doar fire hydrant service $1 149,000 loap 95,000 uh our recycling paper and plastic fees 145,000 Leaf disposal fees 56,000 Library contribution last year 697 th000 and I believe it will cross 700,000 this year sanitary sewers uh 900,000 uh pension obligations um it's a few line items uh so 1 Point close to 1.3 million milon that's pension obligations Mr Mayor correct um f and Medicare 264,000 Debt Service on the uh bonds uh principal 995,000 interest on debt service 618,000 um so those are just some of the highlights the total um in in my quick opinion um of of statutory things comes to $9 million so just named a lot of them uh but you know how you know we we can't do with less postage uh you know we can't cut back our telones um you know there's a lot of things on here that will not stand a cut um in in my opinion other than those that I just mentioned um and so that leaves um things in the budget that come to $822,000 um so again when since at the last meeting it was referenced 10% you know it would help us to operate as a team if we knew 10% of what okay and uh I'm I'm not sure what uh what metrics um anyone uses to determine that uh the taxes are too high in Washington Township so might I ask WCTV can can you put up the tax rate comparison slide please wrong one I can't see I was saying I can't see that thank you so um I recapped all the municipal tax rates in the pasak valley uh we are number six out of 10 so we're right in the middle so I don't understand how anyone can say that we are that high that we require a 10% cut um you know we're we're right in the middle if you almost divided into thirds um so again we're we're not we're not lowest we're not who prepared this Mr Mayor I'm sorry who prepared this slide I did I I I just can't read it from here that's what I'm just saying what's that I mean I can read it quick or no just if we if you could send that to us oh you can that the TV to no it's fine okay I mean the tax rates go from 0.354 per on the lowest to a maximum of 0.950 on the highest town ours is 0.656 which Falls number six thank you can can you read what Westwood is Westwood is just underneath us they are 0.671 671 but their denominator is a lot larger than ours right because they have a lot more radars so I'd like to see what that denominator is for all those 10 Towns CU when you divide that by they have $185 million more in ratables MH the number is is skewed I don't know if everybody's understanding what I'm saying the total rables determine what that tax rate is so you know it's very can you send that to us Mr maror I can send you this the slide yeah I yeah MH yeah would the tax assessor be able to give us the the total ratables of all 10 of those towns Mr Mayor um I don't know this is something that U that I worked on oh okay I'm sorry no that's okay it just I I didn't know if if she could just figure out what the total ratables were for all 10 of those towns you know what their total uh rateable pool is for all 10bs MH okay and um the one other thing I'd like to point out and uh WCTV if you can bring up that other slide now thank you um this is spending that was authorized by the three newest council members while they were on Council in the past four or five years um the top one is1 million in capital spending since 2017 followed by almost 17 million by the next one and 9.3 Million by the next and so I want to keep this civil um now you want a tax decrease even though you collectively added to our tax burden by this um you know I don't recall when you voted for these things that you're saying that the operating budget would have to take a 10% hit uh um and so I think it's uh can we could we get that slide also Mr Mayor of course thank you yep um it it has the ordinance numbers and the ordinance amounts that were voted on thank you and uh so to to vote for all these improvements and now say we have to do a 10% tax cut just doesn't ring well in my opinion may I ask a question council president um yes M if we budget to and should we need more money I imagine it has to be pulled from a different account how does that how does that fair for us um I I asked the CFO almost that same question I said what happens if come September October we're running out of money in quite a few line items and he said uh the state will not look very kindly on that uh because they'll say what you know what was your basis to lower these so far and you know because you have to go to the state when that happens um because they as you know once the budget is approved we send it to them and so they have a say in this also and so one or two line items they're okay with uh but if we start cutting a volume of line items and then we run out of money uh that's going to cause issues at the state level also that was was his answer to me have we ever been in that position all I can say is not under my six years so far and I imagine that's going to affect our standing it could affect our bond rating plus we a plus plus yeah it could affect our bond rating so anything anything else on discussion on that the difference card Mr Mayor Mr I can uh this just can be very quick um can you I I was I'm sorry if if you could just but could you I I was here for the the presentation of the difference card and i' I've I've started to research this and it kind of has anybody has any other municipality given a difference card loaded with that amount of money and how did that amount get determined so are you talking about which number are you talking about the 16,000 well it was it was 14,000 something now it again I don't like throwing numbers out that I'll be held to but I because I don't have the resol you know we ultimately we want to pass a resolution past you guys on February 5th and three of the council members voted for the difference difference card I think back in November the reason why it's coming back in in front of the councils because the New Jersey state health benefits plan required a language change that's the best and simplest way I can um explain it so it's just coming back to the council for a formality it'll have different wording but that's I want to explain to the three uh returning council members why they're going to see it again and and for you uh new members to understand um that as well so that number is supplied by the health benefits so it's not I'm trying to explain this so it doesn't sound like we where you do that anyway so whether there's a difference card introduced into the equation we have to provide the township has to provide I think it's like 15,120 or something like that like I said don't don't hold me to the numbers that's that's the state health benefits has nothing to do with the difference car so you will see that number on the new resolution and I can I can try and come up the better way to explain it on the 5th um if need be so so we're leaving state health benefits plan no absolutely not so so we're staying right now there's Blue Shield Horizon yes so we have 35 members that take advantage of our of having our Healthcare okay 30 members are on Direct 10 five members are on Direct 15 obviously there's a premium associated with with with each plan the 15 being a little less expensive than the 10 but not that much what the difference card allows us to do is pay so we're not going to leave the State Health Benefit Plan of Blue Cross Blue Shield what we're going to do is is pay premiums as if the members have well actually they are they're going to enroll into direct 2035 which has less expensive um premium so therefore right off the bat the Township's going to save money and so is the employee because they're elting 15 and 20 not eliminating it not eliminating it so just f it sound like when I it took me a couple times to understand this and it's the simplest um formula on once it clicked right now members are in direct 10 or direct 15 they're then all going to be enrolled into direct 20/35 it's the same plan then we're going to introduce a different score which the township pays the fee for um again don't hold me to numbers it's somewhere around low 50s maybe 50 $51 per employee per month having the difference card restores every employees benefits back to direct 10 and direct 15 so obviously you know co-pays are different uh out of pocket deductibles are different we're we're buying into a a a less expensive plan so that's where the savings is so even though we're going to introduce a fee to the township for the difference card we're still anticipating to save again don't hold me the numbers around $160,000 by doing so that's even even um after paying for the difference card I can tell the questions coming but it's what is what is mandating us to make them whole like like the mayor just talked about this three of us on the day is that are public employees and I just January 1st I got hit with a 12% medical increase on top of the 35% I already paid due to my salary right so what is where where is it that like we need to provide this difference car like what is what is the langage we don't have to provide the difference card what what the mayor and I were tasked with last year was to try and find an alternative to that incredible increase in State Health benefits plan so 22 into 23 I think it was like a 27% hike and that was anticipated it was only anticipated to be half that and that's what it turned out to be then in 24 everyone was saying you know what I'm sorry in 23 they were saying watch out there's going to be another price increase um so again they were telling us a number that we're all anticipating being double so it wasn't quite as high I think it may have only been like 7 or 8% so that was the anticipation for 24 and that's what happened so we you know again I I don't have all the information in front of me but I can tell you um with certainty we exhausted every other alternative um other plans most of the plans would would um uh it's not deny the quote what was it's um I I forget the term it was but essentially they said you know you have two Health to good a health benefits we're not going to even quote you oh um it wasn't declin to quote some something like that I forget the terms but that's what would would happen and then the collective bargaining agreements with the police and the DPW call for an equal to or better than right so if we were saying none of this happen with the difference card we we decide you know what we're going to go into another plan uh because it's $500,000 cheaper we have to prove that that plan is better to or equal to what they are already um already have with their with the state health benefits plan so through that process we came down to the difference C and that's where we spent most of our time probably from like early spring last year it's taken us a long time um because we really wanted to try and find something wrong with it to make sure that we're directing the Township in the right direction um and and this is where it came to and we worked with our our union members you know we were very transparent with them we brought them into our Circle to try and find problems with it to try and see how it was going to work um and and now believe it or not you know the PBA has like a two-page advertisement for the difference card in their monthly um New Jersey cops magazine so you know the biggest Union probably in New Jersey is now supporting uh the use of difference cards like I said it's anticipated savings right now um based on their proposal so the premiums of that line item you're saying if we introduce this difference car are going to be a savings of $160,000 that's what it's anticipated you know it could be a little bit more it could be a little bit less based on on the usage but they give us those numbers based on the history of uses I think they call it an experient report so we've given them to all that information so they can make a proposal to us they they don't you know they choose they chose to do business with us because of that you know if we didn't you know have a very favorable report they could decline even wanting to do business with us now what happens with the money on the difference card if we have very healthy employees and they don't use the difference card does that go back into the cers of the town or who gets that money um that's a that's a very good question so I don't want to give the I don't know how I can give the impression that the money's not there like there's not $15,100 on this card that an employee can go can go and spend um but is it an HSA card or is it like a no it's not an HSA no FSA is what you're think not a flexible in account no um but what the state health benefits came along and said is that you know it it will take care of now there's an increased benefit for the employee now so that it will it will pay for the employees co-pays but it's not necessarily uh at a greater expense to the township I I'm having trouble explaining how that how that 15,100 what I'm saying is you go 2024 you go to the doctors once you have one co-pay I it's a very there are people in the world that can get away with that but there's people that go every month or every twice a month so that healthy person what happens to all his yeah that's what I mean it's it's not there it doesn't carry over um it's basically insurance it's it's the same concept so we still have to pay the premium the employee will still have to pay the contribution now we still useing title 78 contributions or we have different still based on yes it's it's the same contributions um that is in their Collective negotiation agreement which is based on chapter 78 but if you remember it's a percentage it's not a set absolutely right so if the premium is $100 and the employee has to pay 35% of it or 30 or 25 or 20 based on their count their current salary level but um you know there it's it's it's a benefit to employee because they're paying a contribution on a less expensive plan than the direct direct 10 or direct 15 having the difference card though restores that employees benefits to the equivalent of direct 10 direct 15 so an example would be you go to the off you go to the doctor's office and you have direct 10 you're paying a $10 copack correct you now have 20/35 you're going to the doctor's office and you're paying a $20 copack you have the difference card you're now paying a $0 co-pay as the employee excuse me take a little set um I I know you're not I know you're trying to give an example yeah but we went from an employee who had a $10 co-pay to now has no copay so to me it sounds like they're even getting more from yeah so so that it didn't start out that way in 23 so in 23 the example would be $10 co-pay then it would be a $20 co-pay $1 the difference card you swipe the difference card it now brings you you know now this software you know recognizes it as $10 and the employee only has to do $10 the state health benefits plan now came along and said it has it can't be equal to or better than it has to be better than so now the um employe does not have a co-pay there's no out- of pocket expense for the employee this is this is dictated by the St help medical or prescription or both uh medical medical co-pay and again I don't have it in front of me I can certainly send it out so you can see in front of you you'll see a bunch of numbers and the columns and how it it explains it it's it's incredibly um once it just clicks is a incredibly easy um concept to understand so now the the employee will not have a co-pay at all but it's not I don't know how to to you know um I don't know how to make it sink in that it's not at a higher expense to the township so it's still you know the the the amount we paid the difference card is still the same amount so really the only thing that could to change is their estimate that the Township's going to save 160,000 which is based off the historical usage from our employees you know I don't even want to say an example of God forbid what could happen but if another pandemic happens um and you know there's more usage we might save a little bit less than that 160 if everybody's healthy and doesn't go to the doctor then we're going to have a greater savings uh than the 160 but the proposal right now based on the historical information is a proposal of around 160 again don't so so if you do have you said there's 35 people on it if we have 20 healthy people that don't use the 14 whatever M that money then comes back to us as a savings I don't know if I can give you that impression well what happen like I I that's where that's where I'm losing it what happens with that money somebody's got to expend that money right because when you swipe that card somebody's got to pay $20 or $30 if $35 if it's a $35 Cay where does that money come from like are we setting up an account for 35 times 14,000 I don't know I not that I don't know I don't know how to explain it I don't know how to explain it so it it makes sense to you are we paying a premium to the difference card or are we funding like we're not funding a card we're paying the difference card so it's again it's like 50 or $51 per employee per month to have the difference card having the difference card gets the employee restores the employee back to the um the benefit they were getting if they were paying for direct 10 or direct 15 I don't want to that's okay I'm just trying to do the best I can answer to one question it's the second time you mentioned $50 per person per month so when I you know that's $600 for an employee how do we how do we reconcile $600 and 14,000 because that's an investment I want to make yeah you know so I I'm I can't I can't think of the words to explain the 15,120 but I can give it an example like this and again don't hold me these numbers I'm just throwing numbers out there for our 35 members if we didn't do it this and we just continue paying direct 10 direct 15 it's a million dollar right we get all 35 employees into direct 20 direct 35 it's now $700,000 but now we have to pay the difference card right to restore those benefits and that so that's a savings of 300,000 but now we pay for the difference card again these are just numbers for an example it's going to cost $150,000 to have the difference card now the expense is $850 compared to a million it would be there's a savings of 150 but again I'm just using these numbers for example but they're they're pretty close the difference card is not going to cost that money that much I mean you know again we could do it just roughly you know 50 * 35 * 12 um and and I think Mark we have some uh some of their promotional materials that maybe it's like Mark said once you get to the end it's easy but to to explain it properly to the employees at all levels it took quite a few meetings we had a number yeah um and so you know we we've delved into this very deeply with the employees cuz we wanted them to understand where we were going also that it wouldn't deprive them of any of their benefits because obviously that was a concern of theirs uh to say hey you you want to make this switch to save the town money but you know what does that do for us and uh you know they even had their Union reps come in to some of the meetings right want to make sure uh that you know they were they were coming out whole in this uh but yeah why don't we send you the stuff you send the 15,120 is the max out of pocket for a family plan so that's the now we all 35 of our uh members family no no they're not no so not everybody will have a 15120 no no and you know again I hate to throw out information as if it's you know it's guaranteed but you know even for an employee to reach that there's got to be some significant you know health health concerns there but the 15,120 that number represents the max out of pocket for a family plan family plan and again that has nothing to do with the difference card if you went to the state health benefits plan plan and like we're just comparing the columns a direct 10 direct 20 direct a million whatever it is you're going to see that Max out- of pocket number is that 15,120 and it changed from the 14, 640 I think it was just a couple months ago but I will send it out anybody feel free to call me and we can we can go over it um but it really is an incredibly easy concept what's it what's it clicks and it it was the best thing we could find so far to uh to benefit everybody and and certainly was that the only thing yeah it really was any other discussion on the difference card we heard so much but I will say there is an informative tutorial I think it yes I mean it's it's really like a three-page slide but it it the first page explains exactly what you asked what it would cost if we didn't do it how much the cost of that 2035 plan how much is it costed to introduce the difference card and then it gives you the estimated you know savings it was like 160 or 167 you know it was helpful so yeah all right if we can get that CU ab rman and myself have not seen it so uh Mr par you had asked for council meeting times to be put on the agenda for ordinances and legislation under Council uh no you we had talked about changing the time to seven and member at the reorganization meeting I did the ordinance and I sent it to sue okay we huh we're all good then to keep continue on at 7 o'cl right so that'll be on for introduction the next meeting thank you Financial non- miscellaneous you had zoning board appointment procedure yes thank you so after our meeting last uh two weeks ago last week um to say I walked away disappointed is an understatement um I was thinking about how that meeting went with the zoning board and how two candidates were sprung on us last minute um and there's a a lot of reasons why that bothered me but mostly for the lack of transparency that we so try to strive for as elected officials so I looked on our website and it's still up there under the resource employment volunteers and it was very clear that the town ship Council of the township of Washington is hereby solicit soliciting resume Andor letters of interest to be appointed yada yada yada all interested parties are asked to submit documents by midnight and those documents would be the resume or letters of Interest so instead of getting upset I think we need to take this as a learning opportunity and to do better so my recommendation is that we put together an application form so that we have a proper clear transparent procedure so that all members of council are specifically aware of who the candidates are and what their class their qualifications are right in addition to a resume and a letter of interest um it's really important I find it really important that we are all aware of who is out there representing our interests as Council because those members while they are volunteers and and I admire volunteers on a grand scale they are hearing applications for development and we should have the knowledge of where these candidates stand as it relates to development in our town are they for it are they against it frankly the two candidates that were sprung on us I could not in good conscious vote in the affirmative even if I wanted to because I didn't know anything about them and I don't think that that is is fair to any member of council to have somebody sprung on you so and and you know once again I'll State like I did at the last meeting one of the applicants who I spoke to I verbally I said you got to submit it let's you know make sure you send in the documents as needed so that everybody on Council is aware of your interest and I don't feel that that courtesy was offered to councilman Sears and myself that evening but again I we need to learn and to do better so it is my recommendation that we put an ordinance together and with Mr Po's help and application form that way we can be all on the same page and aware of who is interested and why right because as as much as I love volunteers and I've worked with volunteers for a greater portion of my life you know people have agendas so we need to know who is representing our town and what their plans are for the development development or non-development of this community so if we can that would be my recommendation we ask forms application forms for a lot lot of other departments this should not if we just make one up for that department that for that position that's fine I think and that'll be transparent for all of us so so just to just to you know go back on your points um for the last six for the last three meetings of the year I had asked the existing members whose appointment were up as the chairman of the zoning board if they had any interest of coming back and most of them said they were too busy and didn't not get back to me at any of those meetings so for the last three meetings of the year every member that was up for Renewal ter excuse me term was expiring was asked by myself and the board secretary if they wanted to submit a letter of interest or you know to get reappointed uh one of them did do that on on New Year's Eve unfortunately I had I would have no objection putting that person back but we did not receive it until the day of the council meeting and on New Year's Eve when I looked at our packet and we had one I I knew we had one and we had the same gentleman that contacted you and myself who I know very well um asked to be and he did submit but it was on New Year's Eve also I asked a former member who was on the board before and represented us well as one of my you know to say hey are you interested in coming back cuz we need a full zoning board cuz we have a lot of applications coming up that's what I did on my own and yes you did not have the opportunity to review that person but the person I did put up was a former member of the zoning board MH so so I I understand that but I think I think I think your idea of of putting together an application form that this way it it gets done electronically and it just goes out it's not a letter of interest it's just to check the box and what your experience like a little wader about everybody and why do you want to be on the board right we do that for our volunteers you know I think that's a great idea so if if Mr PA if you would be so gracious to assist me sure I don't think it should be an ordinance but I think it could be an application uh you know some documentation like a volunteer application yeah yeah exactly I mean I would just like to add that um you know I served on board uh prior to being on the council and um when there was when my term expired uh you know the council at the time decided to go in a different direction uh you know they certainly had that within their wherewithal uh but it it didn't seem to be a very public type of discussion it was uh you know we have new people I and they were in uh when I became a coun IL person uh and a pres the president uh I actually solicited uh interest and we interviewed them as a council here in chamber as part of a meeting uh I mean I felt that was the most transparent however uh once I left uh the council uh that also was done away with and we moved to uh not so much a non transparent but sort of uh give me a name yes and so you know there were there were attempts to make it transparent and you know I think for whatever reason maybe people don't want it transparent so you know well that behavor I mean with all due respect but a text message lacks a lot of transparency so and I understand there was a timeline issue so let's just you know what let's move forward let's let learn from this but I think part of the application process should be to like my first uh realm at the zoning board years ago mayor swiit appointed me and she had me come up and like I guess I think Mr Alman was also appointed by mayor sck we had to come up and actually you know tell the the de why we wanted to be on the zoning board and I think that should be part of the application process is that we invite who we're going to our nominees here for that first meeting and have them present to us and then we make an informed discussion and we start that sooner and instead of right at the end of December no I think it should be part of the application process that you're expected to come here and give a little idea about yourself of why you wanted to be on the zoning board and then we approve them or deny them at that point okay right you agree with that I think that's yeah I mean I I just know there's a lot of room for improvement on this so we want to make sure that whoever is on the zoning board is interpreting the land use and is in the direction absolutely of the of the lack of development or development in town you know there's we're approaching 2025 with a lot of changes coming so let's make sure we have the right people on there any other discussion motion to uh adjourn oh I'm sorry Mr Po do you have something yeah you're not on the agenda I'm sorry was not a not a subject but I I did want to say Sue just sent me the ordinance that I sent to her was in your packet so it it's not a big change it's just basically changing the time so if you want to take a look at that not for tonight but be you know for the next uh meeting when it'll be introduced it was already in your packet this week right behind the it's unnumbered but it's there okay oh yes okay thank you Mr Mr P motion to adjourn so second second all in favor I I thank you everyone --------- welcome to the regular schedule public meeting of January 15 2024 of the township of Washington Township Council adequate notice of the meeting was given in accordance with the open public meetings act by the Township Clerk to two at least two newspapers in January and this meeting has been posted on the township bulletin board electronic Message Board WCTV and the township website please notify the municipal clerk for any disability requirements necessary for attendance at mayor and Council meetings the fire exits are located through the double doors to your right and through the door on your left please silence all cell phones can everyone please stand for a salute to the flag I pled aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liy and justice for all roll call councilman Casio here councilman Sears here councilman Elman here councilwoman of alz here council president to Senate here let the record reflect also in attendance mayor calamari Township administrator D Carlo Township attorney par and Township Clerk Susan wowski on zoom and assistant clerk Cornelia Lisa here thank you PSA for January 15 2024 2024 Town calendar if you would like to advertise your local business in the township of Washington annual Calendar please visit our website www.wp of washington. us to fill out a form and submit your artwork our calendar runs February 2024 through January 2025 Christmas tree pickup began on January 2nd and will last about 2 weeks there was there's no set schedule for pickup also the next council meeting will be held on Monday February 5th at 700 p.m. thank you we'll have a grant presentation for buron County open space land acquisition 450 pasak Road by Mr buo Grant [Applause] Rider good evening council members new council members mayor Mr Carlo U you resolution that is on the agenda is for the from Bergen County open space it is for the acquisition Grant to purchase 450 cascat road which I know has been important to many members of the municipality um it is a grant in the amount of $550,000 uh to go towards the purchase price the um it does two things it authorizes the mayor to sign the grand contract and thereafter it authorizes either the mayor or the business administrator to sign any and all vouchers with regards to submission of invoices or bills for reimbursement it's a reimbursement Grant which means we advance the money submit proof of payment and then we get reimbursed it's also my pleasure to announce that why this was uh passed about a week and a half ago received notice and got it on the agenda for tonight on Friday I received notice that the other part of this application which was for the phase one construction of the swim club in the amount of $60,100 just um so the 550 uh you mentioned it's a reimbursable it's a re it's run as reimbursement yes councilman most of your grants are reimbursement grants where you spend the money you prove that you spent it and then you submit that documentation to the funding agency whether it's the county or the state federal government then they send you money back that you spent okay and from a a Township perspective do we set this up on our books as a we did a capital ordinance for it I believe we didn't so for the for the entire um I think it was 825 if I'm correct Mr par it was 750 for the anticipated purchase price and then 75 in the uh soft costs yeah [Music] 825 and what are we going I'm assuming since we've already outlaid this funds we're going to claim it immediately no no we haven't outl anything we haven't purchased this piece of property yet no we're still in the contract phase and if it falls through does the grant revoke back or revert back to the county I don't have any of the reason why know why the seller would not go through with it but if if there was no contract the grant would well wouldn't be returned because the money hasn't been Advanced we don't get the money to actually purchase the property but uh would we decline I mean is there any action if it doesn't close for some reason if you intentionally decline to accept the grant for no reason is that what you're asking me or based upon the failure of the seller to sign the contract it's two separate issues the the failure to close the transaction to purchase it based upon the seller not going through the contract yes the grant will be basically null and void by the county because it's contingent upon the sale of the property to the town as opposed to the town saying no we don't want the grant okay thank you any other questions on the Das no it's quite self-explanatory thank you David you're welcome thank you like to have a motion to open up the meeting to the public comment period second all in favor I would anybody in the audience like to come up and address the council at this time for things that are not on the agenda yes you can Mr SLE good evening hi uh Mary alen stickle Township of Washington resident um I just wanted to recognize that it's Martin Luther King day and on the back of our Tans group we have um a quote from him that just says a genuine leader is not a Searcher of consensus but um a molder of consensus which basically means um if we want to be leaders we need to lead that is we need to develop ideas and convince others of their Merit so that's what Tans um like believes in that we're hoping that we can um change the uh flight patterns of the private jets that are coming over our houses um so with that said on the 15th anniversary of a plane landing in the Hudson um I came here before to speak about private jets that fly over houses in the township that are low loud and very frequent um I belong to a group called Tans it's uh taxpayers for aircraft noise Solutions we are a community organization tasks with finding workable solutions to the aircraft noise which adversely affects the quality of life of residents in the pasak valley um I'm working with um a couple different residents from other towns um a woman uh from Park Ridge a councilman uh Greg Hoffman from Parkridge also um and another um very very um this Warren Feldman from Park Woodcliff Lake he's been researching it for years also um because they are highly affected by the planes coming very low and loud over their houses in those areas um thank you for the council people that have already signed the petition I really appreciate that um I know that Tom Sears also uh was posting it at the on the Green Team Booth um so I'm very thankful for that um long before uh Tans hackensac Deputy Mayor Kathy canisto uh Lobby for the FAA to create and utilize the 17 the Route 17 approach commonly known as the RNA gpsx Runway 19 approach um they were very successful and the only problem is that the approach isn't rarely used it's only used about 10% of the time um we're not saying to like ban all private jets we're just saying that are solutions that can be done and that is one of the solutions they could just just move over to the routine rout 17 path and take that as opposed to coming in over our houses um our tan group is currently in dialogue with the FAA Eastern region administrator in Jamaica New York and we're asking questions and presenting solutions to them we're getting we're getting pretty far but I'm looking look for Our Town Council support because the following towns have passed resolutions approving the petition to the FAA to reduce air traffic noise so Westwood has um done a adopted a resolution Hillsdale Parkridge Woodcliff Lake and hackin Sack more towns will follow um I have brought resolutions from towns some of the towns in hopes that you can adopt a resolution um that the township of Washington can adopt um a resolution um if any of the council people want to get a little bit more involved um the next Teterboro Airport noise abatement advisory committee it's called tanak is on Wednesday January 24th at 6 6 PM they're always online and it's really good if you want to hear a lot of good information about what teerb um does and pretty much a lot of people we ask a lot of questions you can get um airplane routes like over your house so you could see how many flights are coming in over my house which I think you guys have seen me put that up before um the the petition is now over 1100 um signed so that's good for the pasek valley I'm just hoping that we can as a Township adopt a resolution again it's not a matter of banning private jets it's just a matter of could they please stop coming in so frequently so low so loud and uh just move over to 17 or that we have more control over this now because I truly believe it's going to get worse and once I believe because I I grew up in Essex County and I know that little small airport too it's famous for because JFK flew out of it um that airport is going to start taking speed also and we've been lowered our flight path has been uh lowered to accommodate them above us so so I think things are just going to get worse as they start attracting more private jets to their airport um but I just wanted to hand in uh three of the resolutions from the other towns so you can get the verbiage for it and thank you I go anything else no no that's it I just hope that you listen me this is a real issue and I know that everybody thinks I'm crazy but uh I'm not no no these airpl fly low every night and I hear sawitz was talking about this years ago and um I don't know what is why we have a perfect air flow over our town I don't know but it's just going to get worse Mrs Tickle um you mentioned that there's this route 17 approach that's proving that it's effective but it's only used about 10% is there a reason why that or a reason that