[Music] [Music] [Music] a [Music] good evening everyone Welcome to our March 12th uh Town council meeting uh we have uh quite a few things to handle before 7 o'clock in the next 15 minutes so we're going to get right to it if that's okay Madam clerk this is to inform the general public that this meeting is being held in compliance with section of the open public meetings act chapter 231 Public Law 1975 the annual notice was emailed to The Star Ledger and filed in the township clerk's office on November 21st 2023 and published in the West Orange Chronicle on November 30th 2023 councilwoman castelino present councilwoman gber Michel present councilwoman Scarpa present councilwoman Williams present council president Rutherford here mayor McCartney we have a proclamation for from our mayor uh for our uh fire department's 130th anniversary Madame mayor thank you council president good evening Council colleagues let me start though with a thank you I wanted to thank everyone who came out despite that torrential on Saturday for our first Ramadan event and now we have a beautiful art sculpture uh symbolizing peace and unity um it really was a nice event despite the rain and really thank you to the St Patrick's Day Parade committee for the 71st annual St Patrick's Day Parade to highlight U Main Street and so many assets and things that we have here in town so thank you and I wanted to thank councilwoman's SCPA and council president uh retherford for a three-hour workshop last night um so we really are looking to get our tree ordinance strengthened and they uh they worked on it so thank you very much for that so this evening we have a proclamation recognizing 130y year anniversary of the West Orange fire department whereas on March 6 1891 West Orange fire department was organized by uh the appointment of Foreman Owen Kennedy driver John Higgins assistant director James shien hosan Charles Wagner John boner William scall Edward mcer fi Fitzpatrick and Edward Meyers and whereas Simeon Harrison rollinson a West Orange councilman at that time who was of significant allowed for the first Firehouse to be built on one of the tracks of land on Valley Road currently known as Main Street and whereas there was Personnel turnover due to a 24-hour shift sha shift cycle of two seven days with with the eighth day off those who served with the job were essentially appointed regular firemen after West Orange was incorporated into a town in 1900 and whereas through a series this why you have to explain this through a series of resignations and punishments um James Sheran Rose through the ranks within a year and became the first to hold the official title of Chief and the current fire headquarters on Valley Road was dedicated in 1971 and supported excuse me supported by so hard to read other fire stations positioned throughout the township this says four other fire stations throughout the township for drawn hose wagons transformed into state-of-the-art uh automatic automotive fire apparatus over 130 years the number of personnel making up the department has grown from nine original appointments to 89 firefighters and officers today now therefore be it resolved that I mayor Susan McCartney and the West Orange Town Council wishes to congratulate Chief Anthony veio and the West Orange fire department on the occasion of this 130th anniversary hey we get to take a picture too come on [Music] guys right this start I just wanted to say a couple things thank you to the council and the mayor for the proclamation as I said to the mayor 130 years is kind of a an odd number to celebrate but um uh it's quite a milestone so thank you again for for recognizing us most of the facts that we have the historical facts I can take credit for almost none thanks to our town historian Joe Fagan and John dandola who some of you may or may not know uh between the two of them they've really uh gotten a handle on on the history of the fire depart town and the fire department but there were a couple things that were in the proclamation that I thought were kind of interesting first of all the one of the reasons why the the fire department began was that the police department of course was founded before the fire department we're always that you know behind the police department uh and um and the reason that the fire department started was that there was a fire at the police department and at the time orange was the responding agency and it took I think seven other adjacent structures with it oh wow so of course when the police station burns down we better start a fire department so uh that's what they did um it was a suspicious fire so that's what what had them uh uh look into starting a full-time fire so uh the other thing I wanted to mention was um we have some legacies uh that have come decades and decades Uh current Captain Brian acre some of you may know is actually the great-grandson of fireman Charles Ryan who died on November 6th 1918 of influenza died of influenza I guess and Captain Daniel R shell not Daniel P shell who's sitting here Daniel R Shelly is the great grand nephew of former Chief Martin Kennedy who served from 1926 to 1942 when he suffered a line of duty death so it just keeps happening people I guess it's a it's a family business if you will um yeah so that's pretty much all I want to say but um I would be remiss if I didn't introduce Joe Fagan for a moment to uh highlight some kind of neat things that he found about the fire department so take it away thank you Chief uh I I'll I'll be brief uh just um a couple of pictures here this is a picture of the firehouse on Valley Road I'm sorry on Washington Street when it opened 1903 and that of course is the current day location it's the uh imoy Groves uh police substation on Washington Street and across Washington Street here's a picture from 1904 of the West Orange fire department um that's councilman waggle on the uh and that's a dedication of new fire equipment that he was instrumental in securing for the fire department uh here's a newspaper article from 1907 uh the original Firehouse uh which is seen in the lower left which was on the corner of Winningham and um Valley Road uh was replaced by a new brick Firehouse in 1907 and that's the plaque the original plaque there and that is currently in um uh headquarters interestingly the wooden Firehouse uh was moved to the corner of Valley Road and Dean Street in 1907 it's a private residence today but you can see the top facade uh is entirely recognizable as the firehouse in 19 um 66 the uh in in 1970 the firehouse uh had to be demolished uh because of um 280 and the firehouse was then m move to its current location you can see in the lower left hand corner I was able to secure some uh 8mm film of the actual demolition of the firehouse on the corner there and that corner uh is today uh in the lower right hand corner uh you can see the road is cleared there in the foreground and that's because that's where 280 came through so uh the firehouse had to be moved because of 280 and this is the uh current day location here um uh 280 of course is to the left and finally uh our West Orange fire headquarters currently opened in 1971 and there are two cornerstones there there's 1907 representing uh when the firehouse uh was built on the corner in 1893 when the wooden Firehouse uh was first erected and uh that's all I have thank you uh thank you Mr Fagan thank you Madame mayor thank you to West Orange's bravest uh congratulations on 130 years uh we're going to have Council liaison announcements in the next five minutes if we can can we do that uh councilwoman celino sure thank you council president and congratulations to the fire department I also want to add in that piece of history when uh 911 occurred uh our our department was one of the first first teams out there uh on that hor horrific day so there's a lot of history and a lot of heroic uh Feats uh throughout those 130 years and we thank you and our prayers are always with you to stay safe um this weekend was a great weekend in the township as the mayor started off uh we didn't let a little rain uh damper our good time congratulations to all the organizers of the Ramadan celebration um as miserable as the weather was the crowd was so joyous and so proud of the event and um yeah we stood there in the rain because it just was really really nice and uh great to uh have such great Community spirit and if you don't get a chance to look at the sculpture please do drive by because it's absolutely gorgeous at night um I I want to thank everyone who came down to the parade uh one of the the great celebrations in this Township for 71 years has been the St Patrick's Day Parade Where We showcase our fire department our Police Department uh our students all our Township organizations and we really appreciate uh the downtown Alliance Group for coming downtown and supporting our business owners before the parade and after the parade uh uh the restaurants and bars were were hopping uh right after the parade a lot of people stayed downtown and we are really really grateful and we hope that energy continues as we gear up towards restaurant week next month starting April 13th so go to go to West orang Restaurant week.com in a week or so uh we're signing up restaurants every day and uh we look forward to another great event we want to welcome Castle Rock Pub uh which was formerly the oak barrel uh they got opened in time for St Patrick's Day uh which was really great uh they had a off opening on Saturday night and so be patient as they continue to open up with full dinner within the uh next couple weeks but we're glad to have another uh great restaurant in the downtown Corridor uh to help build things up and want to thank Dan Cunningham and bunch of residents with Miss Brill and her team who were out and about on Saturday before the parade uh cleaning up and picking up litter uh to get ready for the parade so we appreciate all those efforts and we hope as the spring uh moves forward that everyone is mindful of their properties and do not litter in the township uh we want to keep it nice and clean and today I just want to give a shout out to our Girl Scout organizations in town they were marching proudly down Main Street uh it's National Girl Scout day as a former uh leader I I want to just uh thank all the leaders of not only of the Girl Scouts but also the boys gal tro for all that they do for our youth and making great citizens in our community thank you council president thank you councilwoman councilwoman gabri Michael good evening everyone um so first off it was a really amazing weekend I you know what's AR very diverse Community I grew up here and I love that we welcomed and hosted the very first Ramadan event um so thank you to those who organize this and you know it's it's beautiful way to showcase our diversity and you know and it makes that's what makes West Orange special um also the St Patty's Day event uh the parade was a lot of fun I truly enjoyed it um it was nice you know Reminiscing on memories growing up and being able to bring my son with me as he marched proudly in the parade and was able to pick out his friends and and neighbors there and um it's again why West aren't special it's our diversity so I love all of these events uh in terms of my Council on appointments um the open space board met this week we didn't have a quorum though um and the Renta house met today unfortunately couldn't be there because we had the Essex County Cherry Blossom Festival uh kickoff press conference and then The Pedestrian safety Advisory Board will meet tomorrow evening at 7:30 pm via Zoom you can get the link on uh the West Orange website on the calendar and that concludes my these on announcements thank you councilwoman and congrats to the our wonderful firefight years 130 years is a very long time beautiful history uh councilwoman Williams thank you council president um again just echoing the sentiments of my colleagues it was a superb weekend um thank you again to those who organized the Ramadan candle lighting ceremony um it was indeed a wonderful opportunity to showcase the diversity um of our community and of course St Patrick's Day is always a tremendous am of fun um you know I have to to say that this year felt like the Old West Orange um the St Patrick's Day in the years past since covid you know there've been certain areas where everyone lines up but um pretty consistently from town hall all the way to Our Lady of Lords um the streets were packed with residents and it's just a good feeling um to see everyone come out um for our community and I do have to um acknowledge the downtown community for just I have to say West Orange downtown sparkled on Sunday um it looked really good so thank you to everyone um who just comes out and and tries their best including our business owners um to just keep our downtown vibrant and clean thank you for all those things um for my um liaison announcements the West Orange Arts Council um we are looking to add some additional board members to the um Council so if you're interested in art in any capacity please um reach out to our board um and you know volunteer show up uh we definitely will be looking for a Treasurer um soon in the immediate F future um so positions are open and volunteers are always welcome um this uh month's exhibit uh for women's history month is the AP Arts exhibit and that students from the AP Arts at the West Orange High school um truly truly gifted another one of those areas in West Orange where truly our students are Stellar um you would not believe that the works that they have created are from uh kids teens youth um it's just that spectacular right now the um Arts Gallery is open on Saturdays um they H hope to start opening again very soon on Sundays as well so the hours are from 12: to for on Saturday and soon to be opening again on Sunday um but the students will host their um Gala opening next Saturday well this Saturday coming up so please uh feel free to come out to the art Arts Gallery um and visit and see the wonderful works from our students um the historic preservation commission meets tomorrow night and um really focused on St Mark's Cathedral um trying to make sure that the steeple restoration is done um based on historical records as well as the um hardware store on the corner of Main Street and making sure those are restored um if anyone has access and certainly we we appreciate our our grant writers for always making sure if there opportunities that those dollars come in but if there's anyone that knows about other opportunities please share that information um we do want to always be able to help our business owners um restore the properties and there are always different grants and opportunities out there so please share that knowledge um as a reminder the municipal Alliance only meets quarterly so we have not had another meeting as yet we should be meeting again in uh the end of April or May and then I also wanted to just acknowledge remind our seniors um to come out to the senior Cafe um the Grassroots foundation in combination with the Mountaineer mentors myself um we on a monthly basis to do an intergenerational reading program with our seniors uh in coordination and conjunction with the senior services department um it's an amazing opportunity to see the engagement and the interaction between our seniors and our students at the high school um the stories that they share and tell um is just absolutely encouraging and phenomenal and it is the um Bridge Gap that we've always talked about that we need for our seniors and and to have Community um and certainly just commending them for being Innovative and creative and listening to the um to the to the community and their call for opportunities for our seniors um to get together in N work and then I also have to acknowledge um my colleague to my right um who has been the biggest advocate for our seniors um this year and since her election um to the to the council um so I do I want to thank you because it is tremendously a great opportunity if you didn't know um before Co I was always at our senior um facilities as a member of the HRC and my colleague to the left joined me on those opportunities because we were always trying to do something with the seniors whether it be dance on a monthly basis just to continue to engage so again just great things happening in West Orange um you know Community Building um is it is is what we need and and what I'm I'm I look forward to continuing so thank you thank you um council president and and before I close out just again for those um just want to acknowledge that it is women's History Month um so for those who are striving to put women first I know in New York today there was the Equal Pay Day um so we know there are a tremendous amount of disparities um but we do want to highlight and acknowledge the accomplishments and the achievements of women um behind every good man there is always always a strong woman um so thank you and thank you council president uh thank you councilwoman councilwoman SC thank you um I want to congratulate uh Chief veio I think you know that the firefighters hold a very special place in my heart I saved the life of my dad met a number of years ago and we really just don't appreciate all they do until we need them so I want everybody to thank them when you see them and appreciate what they do um also I want to also talk to Laura van djk she has done a tremendous job with our winter Cafe with the seniors she is one of these people who juggles so many bowls and when we asked her to put this program together with us I knew it was a little bit of extra work for her and we all tried to do what we could to pitch in but she's made that winter Cafe such a nice event for our seniors they're all talking about it they're all so thrilled to have got had a place to go this winter and we're hoping to spring into spring as well and to continue our intergenerational activities with the Mountaineer mentors I know a lot of the seniors are looking for the teen techie program to come back as well as the other programs she's put in place some of the pro um some of the programs that the nursing department has has put in place um have really been wonderful too the seniors really want to learn about different um diseases and things that affect seniors and they have really been making Michelle Malik and uh Corey they've been making a wonderful effort to come so thank them too um the economic development is meeting again at the end of the month we are looking forward to brainstorming a lot of different um ways that we can support the downtown film development and help with the development of number of other properties that are also um going to be built up in West Orange the environmental commission this is our claim to fame today thank you mayor for helping us get it all together and for Joe Berwin for your incredible presentation he along with Mike brick helped us really get uh the right group in the room last night who were able to make the tree ordinance happen and it is just so important I think we've all talked about our tree canopy for so long we understand the incredible value not only it it leads to the beauty of our town but also our home values and it's a real education effort you know we have a lot of people moving from out of town and you know some don't understand the value of the trees and I'm looking forward to getting some support for a little education group who could go out and to explain to people why the root systems of those trees prevent the flooding in their basements so thank you Joe and um uh also the the uh weekend was wonderful as everyone said the Ramadan celebration even in the pouring rain was just wonderful those children did not even know it was raining and it was pouring and the parade too was a lot of fun I saw a lot of my friend my friends and also my students um as I got to ride in that model car so that was lot of fun that was a lot of fun it was a wonderful weekend and we should appreciate all we have here in West Orange thank you Council woman uh in the interest of time I'm going to abbreviate my um announcements uh the planning board uh has heard its first cannabis uh company uh yes first cannabis company well sorry second but first cultivator um and we're hoping uh to have cannabis businesses up and running uh very soon certainly uh this year uh so that's exciting um joint meeting is as usual uh and so are the others so in the interest of time I think I'm going to stop here I do want to say one thing about the tree ordinance I do want to thank uh the mayor obviously Michael brick Joe Berwin um my colleague Council mcara uh the representatives from our Green West Orange and the environmental commission uh as well as our town Forester Mr Kip uh all of us uh were able to go through um the ordinance uh and what I felt was a reasonable amount of time given the amount of ground that we covered and I I expect that tonight uh in new business we will be able to um vote to put it on for first reading at our next meeting um we do have some time frames that we're working up against uh but I'm excited to strengthen the tree ordinance and protect our canopy as well so thank you to everyone that's involved uh with that Madam clerk can we start our regular meeting this is to inform the general public that this meeting is being held in compliance with Section Five of the open public meetings act chapter 231 Public Law 1975 the annual notice was emailed to The Star Ledger and filed in the township clerk's office on November 21st 2023 and published in the West Orange Chronicle on November 30th 2023 councilwoman castelino present councilwoman gber Michael present councilwoman Scarpa present councilwoman Williams present council president Rutherford here mayor McCartney will everyone please rise for the Pledge of Allegiance stands Nation indivisible justice for all the council is now in their public meeting thank you madam clerk uh before we begin our public comment tonight I want to invite Mr berwind up for a brief presentation regarding um the work we did last night on the tree ordinance uh Mr Berwin the microphone is yours thank you council president thank you Council persons and thank you um going to talk very brief for no more than 10 minutes max on what we were able to achieve last night and I'm going to address each of these slides um in uh no particular order but to tell you that the tree ordinance has been um an ongoing effort for the past year um we brought a lot of data to the table we we brought a lot of differing opinions to the table and uh what we were able to understand through the data was that from 2015 through 20 22 we've gone from a little over 30% canopy coverage to uh just over 27% at the current rate M phone at the current rate so the people on Zoom can hello Zoomers trees are important um so we've lost um quite a bit and at this trajectory we're looking to be somewhere around 15% % um by 2050 so understanding the challenges and opportunities the canopy tree loss really puts things into perspective but over the last year while we've been working at this um the fees that we've foregone have been in excess of $480,000 that's $480,000 the calculus of which is 800 T trees permitted and lost mostly all viable and at an average um they represented about $600 per permit and that's how you get $480,000 so the time that we've spent um has resulted in opportunity and funds lost um but be that as it may the voices that have come together the efforts that were made most recently in order to understand their differences have led to a tree ordinance that is strong and its strength is really defined as having three essential facets which is Outreach education and replanting it is not a punitive um tree ordinance it's a supportive tree ordinance um the tree ordinance deals with bringing the benefits of a restoration of our tree canopy such that we have a resilient environment and that we get that resilience in the least cost most economical way which is Visa tree permitting fees and uh the tree ordinance itself so the tree Forester um really represents the professional opinion of um a credentialed uh person who will help us um essentially uh work that tree ordinance such that the town's people the homeowners the town leadership the citizenry benefit from his or her uh representation feet on the ground and uh what that means is Consulting with working together with and educating homeowners um and bring bringing that professional credential to bear with respect to what he or she is able to do in this case of course it's Walt so I'm just going to go with he from now on so the administration the enforcement the professional judgment um from a residential perspective cannot be overstated the data and the research show that a tree ordinance that focuses punitively fails a tree ordinance that exclusively focuses on replanting fails a tree ordinance that focuses exclusively on education or Outreach alone fails these essential facets have to come together and they have to come together with the guidance and the leadership of credential professionals or Forester so the goal of the tree ordinance um that you will be talking about and um God willing comes to a vote and passes um very shortly we'll begin to basic basically allow us to put together those three facets in a way that's funded um and that is prudent and that begins to do the two things mentioned on the slide the goals of the ordinance which are to align the homeowners as well as to strengthen the tree canopy our trust our transparency this professional discretion um what we bring together in this tree ordinance Visa v um all the stakeholders that are coming together to make this happen will be bringing together various benefits um there's a number of them up there on the screen um but the one that I really want to focus on is the concept of environmental justice environmental justice might be um something of you know an afterthought for most people but in the work that I've done in essentially assessing and anal anzing the tree canopy of West Orange Visa high resolution satellite imagery and the help of some pretty powerful computer power through the Google climate lab shows that we have an issue and that over the last 50 plus years we've denuded certain areas replanting and working with the Outreach and the education has to be you know spread throughout the town but it also has to amarate some of the issues that we have in certain areas where trees are maybe um an afterthought but trees are necessary in order to prevent storm water runoff in those neighborhoods and in those neighborhoods where there is less economic resources to bring to bear um this tree ordinance provides a means by which they can be reached out to educated they can enjoy replanting and they can enjoy the benefits of a growing tree canopy but it all comes down to the leadership and it all comes down to action so you know the thing about a strong tree um ordinance um often we focus on its Effectiveness in order to prevent the cutting down of trees which is absolutely essential um we do this essentially through a strict permitting process for tree removal um this ordinance values trees it values property rights it values education and it values replanting it brings everything together it is not perfect but it's good and acting upon it becomes a moral imperative and it becomes an economic and financial imperative given the fact that we've been losing as much money as we have by waiting around and not acting there is notification um being a good neighbor is having good open communication two-way Communications with your neighbors your neighbors that surround your property um are enjoying the trees that you're enjoying uphill downhill the benefits of those trees are widely felt um and there's essential elements within the tree ordinance that allow for notification that's reasonable it's not onerous to the homeowner and it promotes Community it doesn't promote division the Township's role in planting and maintenance is also codified and again this is an area where the professional Judgment of the tree Forester um is Paramount so creating this sustainable future together um as you can see from the pretty pictures um you know there are smoke sacks there there's plenty of trees there's clean air in the presence of airplanes and a modern lifestyle and that's only going to come because we effective we pass an effective and efficient tree ordinance that brings into alignment our homeowners collectively every generation every demographic every neighborhood through community outreach and education each of them will have an individual interest in talking with the Forester in meeting among themselves enjoying the benefits that they can drive together as they work as a community hyper locally as well as us and the council and the mayor leading the township forward um the cost of no action the catastrophic effects um there's plenty of really good movies out there all of which um have some degree of Truth to them but everybody in this room and everybody on the zoom and anybody whoever listens to this understands that rain's coming down at a greater velocity and volume that it has in the past and it's been changing dramatically especially over the last decade if we don't act not only are we not going to have the funds that we need to do something about this and reverse our situation we're going to be ensuring higher costs that are coming that will come out of your tax dollars as opposed to funding it alternatively in this way which is the most efficient and cost effective so I'll close out with a call to action um we are lucky to have the funds to have a professional Forester let's use it we uh are crafting and enforcing an effective tree ordinance um we need to pass it and uh lastly you know I call on you each of you individually um some of you have taken care of my children and some of you I've met uh and enjoyed having met or having known for quite some time um um this is a moral imperative okay don't let perfect be the enemy of the good get it past let's move forward thank you thank you thank you Mr Berwin and uh I do believe Mr bwin made all of those Graphics beautiful great job um we are going to open public comment um it says on the on the agenda agenda items only given the um sparsity of folks in in the room uh I'm going to uh allow any commentary any public comment so we can just have one session um so if someone comes later on and they feel that they've been left out we'll address that before we close but um I think we should have a good shot at getting out at a decent time tonight um Mr Fagan uh and then Mr P D and then we'll open it to public com well thank you council president um I'd like to start this evening with our um sorry council president there's a lot going on here I'd like to mention our West Orange fire department as specifically thank you to the West Orange Elks for rescue equipment donation the uh West Orange Elks are a great Community partner always have been a great Community partner their uh donation was uh in the center there it's referred to as a smart dummy I believe it costs around $4,000 and it's a essential tool in training our uh our firefighters um uh mayor McCartney would like to invite everyone to the uh opening of the West Orange dog park scheduled for Sunday May 5th uh I'm announcing this in advance because I believe believe there are sponsorship uh mayor is there sponsorship opportunities available for that so I wanted to get that that message out there uh as was mentioned before by uh councilwoman Williams the uh West Orange Arts Center is having a West Orange High School AP Art Gallery scheduled for Saturday uh March 23rd from 1: to 3M the West Orange Art Center is at 551 Valley Road in West Orange I also as a public service announcement I want to bring to the Public's attention a scam alert on Facebook I can't believe he's gone now maybe some of you have seen these posts and a variation of that is I think you're in this video and it's not real all it is is clickbait to get you to click on the link and it will download malware and uh potentially take your information so uh just uh I wanted the public to be aware of these things um uh you have to be so careful and some of them look so real uh also that picture of the jiny duncle pool looks so inviting uh but uh there is early bird special that's a sure sign of spring uh from March 1st of course this past but to May 10th there is a discount uh for memberships at the jinny dunal pool and you can contact our um our uh Recreation Department uh also I want to mention the first annual juneth Film Festival from June 21st to 23rd uh open call is now ongoing for film submissions and there are uh some fantastic sponsorship opportunities available at different levels and you can contact councilwoman Tammy Tammy Williams uh at t Williams at West orange.org I'm sure many of you already know how to get in touch with her so that shouldn't be a problem another sure sign of spring is the uh uh 2024 aspac season uh these are just a few of the events uh beginning in June 8th uh these are listed on our website and of course you can look for more information at Pleasant Valley productions. org uh as was mentioned the Ramadan celebration it was it was a pouring rain and this is not a very good picture I had the opportunity to go out and take a picture the other day from a reverse angle and really capture uh a uh a nice picture and that really is a well-crafted uh piece of art uh of the Crescent Moon there so uh if you have the opportunity to take a look at it in front of our town hall uh also as mentioned was the St Patrick's Day Parade uh another uh great event in our town uh backtack events um there is some work going on on Warren Road Nance Road King Road uh some repaving and Milling taking place and there are some parking restrictions depending on the uh schedule A&J contractors are the contractor please check on our website to see how that may may affect you and there is also ongoing work by American Water uh I usually get the notifications in the morning for what specific street they're going to be on and I try to get that information out uh as soon as I receive it um but uh the underlying message is to just be alert uh for many things going on in West Orange the uh Town Council of course there is no public Zoom comment but the Town Council can be reached at council at West dar.org or and you can email them all at once uh council president I believe that concludes my report and I with great pleasure introduce uh County representative Anthony pesi hi uh good evening Anthony pesi representing County Executive Joe de fenzo I just want everyone to thank spring uh today's weather is getting us in the mood and with that it uh means that the cherry blossom season is upon us I think as mentioned before we had our kickoff press conference to announce this year's events which begin on April 6 and continue to April 14th um the we have the the bike race the 10k run there's the the bloomfest to wrap things up um we anticipate uh Peak Bloom season to be the first week of J of January no sorry first week of April uh so the the festival kind of is in line with what Mother Nature is giving us this year um so we do invite you down to the park and we also do invite you to uh check out the new cherry blossom Welcome Center uh we open it in November so this is the first time it will be utilized during the festival um inside it uh has a a nice history of the of branchford Park but also of the importance and the introduction of cherry blossom trees uh within the park system so we do invite you to uh come down um this postcard was mailed out earlier this week and it information will be on the County website which is essexcounty nj.org along with all the other events that we will have in the coming weeks thank you if you have any questions just let me know thank you sir public count comment is now open for uh in-person attendees only uh please uh make your way to the microphone uh each commenter will have five minutes good evening everyone my name is Natasha kesa and I'm actually one of the HRC uh Commissioners um and a longtime resident of West Orange and a supporter of every single council person represented here and of course our lovely mayor so I understand and I have uh spoken to each and every one of you including the mayor have asked for a resolution to support uh a food for Hope program so uh food for Hope is a program that is run by um the Care Center of New Jersey and currently it's supported by Christ Church we serve over 3700 people um with within the food and security Realm and so the support of uh West Orange is significant because not only do I live here but it also um is uh very important so that we can seek funding to expand it so currently we serve about eight counties within the northern New Jersey um area and we seek to expand this so um I would very much like your support and supporting the expansion of food for Hope and of course it opens up opportunities for us to partner with food pantries within West Orange and um the food for Hope is this is is different because it has not only the food pantry but it also has mobile food pantry and it also will contain a uh kitchen a a teaching kitchen where we teach people how to what to eat how to eat you know and um you know alleviate things like diabetes and all the bad food habits uh things that are caused so I am asking for your support so hopefully the resolution can pass and we can utilize it to show support of this town and um we can uh move forward in in expanding not only for West Orange but for other counties as well thank you thank you good evening Todd Jovi Bernette terce um I'm here to speak about the resolution 998-2457 um in looking at the materials provided on the agenda what was missing was some critical information um that are part of the documents that were presented so the resolution and the agreement itself both called for uh or referred to exhibits A and B one of them being an analysis of the bids that were offered provided and neither of those were were present present uh in the agenda um I think this is essential to provide so that people residents in town can understand the decision making and the rationale behind the decision to go with one over another um and it speaks to transparency um or the lack of it um and I think that it doesn't it doesn't have to do with the legality of providing this information it has to do with providing the residents with the information they need to be able to assess what's going on and so uh my request is that the resolution is pulled until next next meeting so that people can reflect on the information and evaluate the analysis that was done I'm sure a lot of time was expended to prepare that and put it together and it probably doesn't take more than a couple seconds to attach it to the documents that were already provided since they are part of the document so um that's my request thank you very much have a good night thank you good evening Council Sean Gainer uh 74 rolds Avenue Han New Jersey um this is just bad timing no no disrespect to the fire department celebration I had no idea that was going on tonight just the only one I can make in a long time um so I just want to catch you up on the pension situation I think we're close um still no pensions were paid yet um to my knowledge um I called down there I found out that John Gro sent a payment last May so he sent a payment in May it takes a little time down there so they couldn't they couldn't accept that type of payment whatever he said so the township received it back they got the money back in August now I've been talking a lot and I guess nothing nobody knew anything about this I don't know how that could be but whatever um so that's where we're at so they got the money back in August um and nothing happened so they just sent a reminder I believe it was the first week of February there should have been email from the pension saying you're going to have to pay us I think it's via check going to have to pay us so that we could we can make these guys whole all right so that's catching you up on that so hopefully somebody can look into this and we could get that paid all right because I know uh mayor wanted us to get paid right she did the right thing she came in she did what she was you know the township was ordered a long time before she got in they didn't do it she came in she paid us now unfortunately we're still in litigation um the town is appealing that right so they want to get our back pay back all right so that's their right they could do that I get it but that cost a lot of money and then with the Civil Service as well I mean it's it's just it's costing a lot of money so let me just let me just go out there was a uh an Oprah request by somebody and this isn't perfect because there are carryover there's carryover uh bills and stuff so so since uh so money spent on the uh police and fire situ situation uh so far lawyers about $52,000 63761 now that could be off a little bit that's a rough um not sure and that was only till January 5th January 5th of this year now let me tell you what's happened since January 5th about 12 of us been deposed I've been deposed ch's been deposed a bunch of us been deposed that's long days so that's all getting built that people working on stuff all the time there's there's been a lot of discuss and situation and it's still going on every day I'm still looking for documents and stuff to give in so that's a lot and so there's been one appeal already because the township was found that they they did it wrong they could have fired us they could have did but here's the deal it was a small town it was a Township out of the whole country one of the few I mean there were some other ones that did it as well but one of the few townships that decided we're we're going to mandate the the vaccine we're not going to give them the option of shots and masking they decided that that's what they went with um the way they put us out they didn't use due process so they were found wrong and that's why we were able to win that case and get our back pay back um so it just um so besides that the way they did that they had I'm going to say it wasn't CR advice because they lost but then they appealed that and that's a lot of money still being spent but when they did that we were out so we were allotted our back pay so another rough estimate probably around 133 13 of us so like seven firemen uh six police officers it probably it went to about about that was about $500,000 somewhere around that so we got the back pay and then you what you're not really thinking about is we had to be replaced for all those months that's never coming back and if you had someone at overtime at R pay overtime is pay and a half so just saying probably another 800,000 on top of that so this decision and let me tell you this thing this thing's going it's going to be it's gon to be a long time and the township already appealed it once um you know I'm not saying that we wouldn't appeal and then maybe they we're got to see what's going on but this is an open checkbook and I feel bad for the taxpayers of West Orange because this is an open checkbook and the only one that's really winning who's winning on this who who got $500,000 we all know who's winning that's all I want to say h thank you for listening thank you for your time thank you Mr gainan hi Council um Jen hardell of Blue Violet grow um at 76 Ashlin I'm sorry I have my notes here um I'm looking forward to hearing about um your experience es on the site tour um what you saw is something um that I'm looking to replicate at my facility if given the opportunity my team's consisting of experience cannabis top-notch security detail engineers and Architects have put together designs that I'm looking forward to putting in place as my current day job um and over the last 28 years I've built out many different manufacturing facilities and plants including my current cosmetic facility which is located in Clifton New Jersey in that facility I've brought to over 50 jobs to that town um I'm looking to do um bring that a similar opportunity to the town of West Orange with the the Cannabis uh operation and Manufacturing I plan on creating jobs and generating up to 500,000 in tax revenues each year um I have a great desire to create this unique facility to ensure success which will translate into significant revenue for the town to pay for first responder equipments roads whatever the town deems to be a priority over the many years I plan on being here if granted this opportunity um but just a reminder to the council um and to council president Rutherford that you know for for the people who were granted this opportunity by the state um and I have the license for the cultivation and Manufacturing there is a time clock against us and it's um it's scary that it's fast approaching so I ask for uh your assistance and understanding to try and um have conversations maybe sooner than later if there may be an opportunity to lift the moratorium so thank you for your time thank you thank you anyone else on any issues whether on the agenda or not seeing none public comment is now [Music] closed with his Council probably with the last one too in the last four years 745 that might be a record um uh to my colleagues uh time to respond woman C okay so thank you Mr Berwin for a great presentation I look forward to a discussion uh later uh this evening and it's great we're getting done early because it won't be too late to talk about trees so uh we'll be able to hopefully get through this and but seriously I really appreciate all all the folks who gathered last evening obviously the five of us couldn't go so thank you to my two colleagues for spending three hours of your time um it's so important to get this uh the details drilled down it's important that we're able um to put it an ordinance not only to protect the canopy but it has to make sense and to make sure that it can be en enforced and also not put too much of a hardship on our residents so I look forward to hearing the details uh with that um Mr py thank thank you for coming down you know just a beautiful time of year to enjoy all of our County facilities uh the parks the zoo will be opening up soon again and uh always appreciative to the county for all their efforts and being a a great part of our Township so uh thank thank you for that Natasha I look forward to supporting the resolution tonight for um now that we're it had to be amended and I appreciate your patience uh working with me yesterday there was a c it was a generic just so my colleagues know I had requested it to be amended because there was um it was a generic resolution that didn't really fit in with um they had Madame clerk doing a host of responsibilities and I know so she appreciated that we amended that and I look forward to uh hopefully this is a great opportunity uh for Holy Trinity food pantry who's been really uh working hard the past 15 years providing food insecurity for the township and and this enable them to uh receive uh food as well from this entity so thank you for that Mr doovi um I too had a problem with actually getting the contract offline I think a few of us uh so I think that may be U you know obviously pulled tonight and discussed uh the analysis I didn't and I I saw it uh what I appreciated about the analysis it was very thorough so um hopefully the public will have access to it so you could see there was a lot of detail in there which was great um you know the it starts out with 12 companies uh that looked up the RFP online they had the capability to see who who actually went in to examine it uh six companies did a site walkth through on January 4th um which was great to hear and four put in and the four uh are uh is very well detailed and uh so I was very impressed with that U but of course the devil's in the detail with the contract itself and the the contract which is very thick and a lot of pages um again we're trying to cut down on paper save trees uh but sometimes the technology always doesn't work so uh you know we'll have to uh you know dig deep into that uh contract when we when uh we're able to open it I as Madam clerk as of this evening my colleague or council president showed us that we could get on there now so um appreciate that uh Mr Gainer You Know Chief I know what you could say and not say this evening this is very very disappointing yeah no no I know I know very you know very disappointing um to hear the stress from him and the frustration uh obviously we can't say much because of litigation but I'm going to request that Administration uh we have a closed session mayam next next meeting to get updated on what is happening or not happening and um I would you know would appreciate that I think as a group we should sit down and have that conversation uh so we know what is going on so thank you for that uh hopefully that'll be on the agenda council president and um you miss hardell thank you for coming in this evening again I know this has been a frustrating process if it could be as simple as just lifting them uh the ban and having just you submit because you are ready to go I'm not sure where my colleagues are with that I'm not ready to open up the the door to to have more than one other application however with those properties there is some question I'm Glad You Came tonight and stated you were number 76 but if that is the case we have a letter of support for 76 for another entity that I had questioned last week that we either have to revoke um I know there's questions with this address being 76-82 so again I I did didn't know if you were in building 882 if you were in building 76 so this needs to be ironed out I had requested Mr Moon uh to make some inquiries and I hope we can figure this out because if you are you have a lease for 76 we have an application ready2 no no no no no but before you came on the council uh uh um councilwoman there was peace of mind that took out an application for 7 that is still technically out there it's still technically out there so um until we revoke that letter of support for number 76 if that's where you are 76 I know there's two buildings one address one block and lot but technically I see it as building 76 building 82 we have already somebody for 76 and I think somebody for 82 so we we need to get that confusion iron out and uh see where we go for there I appreciate your offering and and my colleagues I know they had the opportunity I did not get opportunity to go down there yet it is five hours out of the day so really appreciate them all going because that is a a a long span of time if it was closer I would have been able to go I did not have the five hours on Saturday so I apologize for that um couldn't get away that long but I had done my research on on that facility and it it is state-ofthe-art and I appreciate that's what you want to bring to the township and that kind of investment but again we got to iron out these addresses and and see you know what is transpiring in that location and that's it thank you council president and thank you for all the speakers for coming in this evening thank you councilwoman councilwoman gabri Michael good evening thank you to those who spoke and those you here listening um in person and also on Zoom um I want to thank uh Mr Fagan and Mr PUK Ley for your comments and information as as well as Mr Berwin for the presentation um and I want to thank my colleagues and the administration and a Green West Orange and everyone who worked diligently on the treat ordinance um and Tasha uh you know you called me I 100% support this uh uh resolution and thank you for your commitment and advocacy um to helping those in need and um Mr doovi thank you for your advocacy and your Outreach uh I also agree with my Council colleague I couldn't access those documents so um hopefully we'll it will be pulled I was going to pull it tonight and I'm glad to know there support so that way the access can get so that way the public can have access to the information as well and that we're you know we're ready to talk about it and give people an opportunity to review those materials um Mr Gainer hi nice to see you in person and um so sorry I could hear the pain and trouble in your voice those numbers and figures are concerning it seems like a lot being spent um I echo my Council colleague sment about having cloth session in the next meeting to kind of get update and find out where we are and what's happening um especially with this penin situation um I notice Mr gross isn't here tonight so it's hoping he give us an update but I don't know Chief if you have an update after public comment I don't okay um and then U Miss hardell thank you for the site tour setting that up and and and uh council president I drove a councilman scarpet down on Saturday and it was a really great experience um we didn't even know it was a cultivation Workshop like a farm it looked like a barn um but it was a really great experience learning I we learned a lot um and I say in every meeting I am very Pro um cannabis coming to West Orange and us you know making money we get two % of the proceeds um I said it in previous meetings blomfield Township made $800,000 in Revenue off of uh one entity and that's money that we desperately need so I 100% support opening up uh you know lifting the moratorium especially for cultivation um and you know look forward to hearing from my colleagues later on in new business as we discuss this um and that's it I end my remarks thank you all thank you councilwoman councilwoman Williams thank you very much uh Mr Fagan Mr pesi thanks for your informational acknowledgements um also just want to highlight and reiterate uh juneth is coming up and we do have a planning committee in place so if you have any short films please um get those submissions we look forward to uh highlighting black Excellence during juneth um also thank you for the food in security program um I am always available whenever the county has any food distribution programs I personally host um after Thanksgiving at um Saturday um at the food pantry so I am very excited that we are able to expand our food insecurity Outreach here in West Orange um if you do recall I brought to our attention just a few weeks ago when it was really really cold on a Tuesday morning that the line for uh the food pantry was around the corner um so I do appreciate any additional support um that we can receive to help those in need um agreed with the sentiments on the recycling center proposal so we will govern ourselves accordingly uh Mr Gainer again you have heard uh that we empathize with you and have requested that the administration um do follow up and provide us some additional information so we do hear you um Miss hardell absolutely supportive of stabilizing our Revenue uh res sources in West Orange and cannabis is certainly an opportunity for us to do that um and with cultivation and Manufacturing it's almost a silent Revenue generator um it is in a factory it is um non um intrusive into the community um the only concerns that I would have and I'm certain based on the um observations that I observed at the facility in Lambertville um would just be making sure that we are a residential Community um and that we want to make sure that there's no um odor infiltration um and and again seeing the um excellent um protocols at that facility I know that that is something that we will be able to um have implemented here in West Orange uh Mr bwin um thank you so much and everyone involved with the tree ordinance I look forward to strengthening our our tree ordinance we have said around this day is um often um that all of us are environmentalists um that we absolutely want to protect um our tree canopy canopy and continue um making sure that West Orange is one of the tree cities in New Jersey um I think that is the gamut of public comment I want to thank everyone for coming out this evening into town hall um and making sure that your voices are lifted and heard um and those who did not have an opportunity to come out um but that you are on the zoom audience please feel free to email and or call us um we do coffees we do teas we stop by whatever is necessary for for you to communicate with us um we make ourselves available so thank you very much thank you councilwoman councilwoman scar thanks uh thank you Mr P gley Mr Fagan for all the wonderful information you provide um Joe Berwin as I said before has done incredible work on the tree ordinance and the Beautiful presentation thank you thank you to him for all he's done um Natasha I think I'm looking forward to voting for The Resolution now that it's modified I um think what you're doing is very important and I want to thank you for bringing it here to our community TD deobi I completely agree we had I had spoken about tabling the um the uh resolution since we didn't have the contract and we didn't have a lot of the analysis but I think you know by next week we'll have all of that and I hope that it will all be made available to the public as well Sean Gainer I am so sorry I I can't even tell you how many times we sit here and listen to the difficulties you're having I I I I thank you for having the um the guts to come and continue to talk to us and to make your case and I'm looking forward to that closed session so that we could find out what is actually happening and help you resolve it um Jen um thank you so much for arranging the beautiful tour I was very impressed um the facility was beautiful and clean and new it was very large and obviously well financed um so there wasn't an odor which was a concern of mine um there was a little noise from the blowers but I think it's because it was so large and where we are looking on ashlon Avenue I I agree with councilwoman Celina we need to resolve you know what's there on what properties and how many we really need that's smack in the middle of a residential neighborhood so I would need to be assured that that was not going to have a negative impact on the residents there um and I'd like to actually see how the first one goes um but I think if we get a little bit more information on what the rest of the U people who have gotten the letters of support are doing it's important that we do that so we can move forward um and that's about it thank you councilwoman um as always Mr Fagan Mr pesi we thank you for your timely uh announcements um uh I think all of these have been addressed uh adequately I just want to add a couple of things one uh Mr Gainer I was not aware of any of what you said tonight um so I will be following up immediately with the administration uh to see where we are um to say the least I'm am disappointed that you still have to come and make your case um and just so you know we have certainly followed up um and much of what um I I I'll have to leave it there because it isn't ongoing um litigation I will say uh what you shared with us tonight was news to me um and I believe it's news to all of us um yeah all right um so I wanted to keep it short during the liaison announcements I did want to follow up saying I thoroughly enjoyed uh St Patrick's Day uh parade uh while it was a long day for me uh baptism at 8 Sunday school at 9ine two church services uh I still was able to get there and I marched with the unique performance arts center where my daughter dances uh they did a fabulous job uh the owner and director uh Lisa Bachelor she does a wonderful job creating a family community and you could see it um on display on Saturday uh and all of them did uh it was just a wonderful uh parade and as I said on my social social media this is the absolute best St Patrick's Day Parade uh with the possible exception of New York City uh but again they've got you know eight million people we have 50,000 um and we still are competing with them so uh kudos to all that were involved in organizing it to everyone that marched everyone that came out and for those of you that stuck around and patronized our downtown businesses uh we thank you as well um congressman has his women's History Month event I've been fortunate enough to um be able to attend it's uh this coming Friday and I'm excited to go celebrate some of uh the outstanding women in his District Two of whom are from uh nearby West Orange um we are working to schedule uh Town Halls uh using these schools um so that we can go through each community in West Orange and talk about the issues that are important to you in those communities but also some townwide issues um we have seven dates that have been proposed I think all of them have been approved but because I am not 100% sure I won't uh share that yet but as soon as all of them are approved I will send it out to my colleagues not all of us need to be present at each one certainly we will invite the administration the mayor as well uh but we um we certainly want to be able to share some exciting information with you about what's going on in town uh as well as hear from you about the issues that um folks have been raising to us uh sometimes in hours of public comment uh hopefully this will increase our engagement limit some of the public comment we've had uh and the time we have to spend here uh and also you know build some bridges uh between the elected officials the administration and the community um in new business I'm happy to discuss uh two things um one is scheduling the workshop to do the work on the ordinance uh with regard to our cannabis licenses um uh but I'd also like to know maybe now is an appropriate time and I guess U Mr Abbot or Mr Jenaro um would be able to answer um so we where do we stand with the Stag St licenses the stagnant letters of support rather that we've issued um do can we get an update on that so uh the administration put forward a resolution to put a deadline on the stagnant licenses Council failed to move that resolution so they're just kind of out there when was um sure just one second when when was the last communication to and from those letter holders um I could probably find it if I look at my emails Mark Moon gave Council a whole like uh breakdown of everybody where they were at in the whole process that was the last just a couple week so no update since then no we have to make a decision councilman yeah I think if I remember correctly we voted it down because we didn't think it was fair uh to give them a deadline on it until they heard from the township first I think you guys were going to send I think legal was going to send a letter to them to see where they were in in the process and if they were still interested before we went ahead and you know revoked those letters support the only thing I would caution with that is we're you know we're talking about legal fees we're paying our attorneys to do all this work if these people aren't interested in moving forward we've had no communication we have not heard from them have you reached out have you called The administ Mark had to reach out to to at least find it where they were in the process but you know I don't I don't even know what we valid addresses for some of these people but wouldn't it make sense to either call from the administration instead of legal ex the fees to find out to see if they're still interested if they they plan to continue with this business venture in West Orange because if not we can then pull their letters of support if they aren't going to be conducting business in town and then give opportunities if that's what you want I'll do it I I don't I don't think our responsibility to chase these people around to to see them that make sure they not open a business I think for legal reasons Su they us they've been inactive so if they're being inactive know that because why don't we know that if they haven't commun they haven't communicated with with the administration in a year or two M Mr Jenaro is there any is there any liability is there any liability um on the Township's part if we were to act without reaching out uh to these license holders or letter holders of letters of support it's something I I don't know the answer sorry I don't know the answer right now I can look into it in fact probably step out and see if Mr moon is the answer off the top of but as we sit here now I don't know I can look into it back here for sure so if you could get that to us before we get to new business if there's something we can do we have been holding them open now for quite some time um if there's something that we can do tonight in new business business then I'm happy to do it but we need to know from you what our legal obligation is understood uh thank you Mr Jenaro um Council woman Celina thank you council president so Mr jenera I just wanted to jump in because if you're it's contacting Mr Moon uh maybe Miss hardell she could let you know where she has her lease at because like I said there's little discrepancies we have uh an applicant that was still out there at number 76 and if you have not 7682 the building 76 so if that's one and the same if some if the landlord gave someone else a lease and we still have a letter from someone for someone else for that that space you know we need to to get clarification on that because this is frustrating for the person who may have a lease so whatever the case may maybe you could talk um to uh the person that came Mr ell that that's here and get a clarification and then follow up with Mr Moon um because we really it's not fair people come to us you know and we need to clarify what's going on um as far as the other two entities that were out there dog something dog something well well they they went to planning board so they were further along in the process oh they are okay they you know so and there was it was on that update I was that was the week I was sick and out of it a little bit so I remember seeing they were on there but also they had said they secured their location um I think they're in construction um is that the one on Valley that's the one on Valley right South Valley's moving right along um Central Avenue is moving along Washington Street crosp Avenue James Jackson down on ash the only two Prospect Aven chemistry chemistry the only two that are so we need yeah those are the two inactive ones and those are the two we need a clar by way of deductive reasoning I don't think the Law Department would have prepared that resolution for your consideration had there been legal issues yeah or implications so we we need to you know wrap this up for numerous reasons and would we have to would we have to capture our revocation in a resolution yes I would I defer to legal but I think that's if we voted tonight to do something we could capture that as soon as the first meeting in April yeah because we did that for the if you remember the library they were on Park Avenue voted and then we yes we and we had a someone same situation where there was actually think chemistry was there and then uh the library secured a lease for that spot and then they wound up having the same issue and then they were they moved to Washington Street so got so if we have a workshop for the next meeting to sorry to discuss cannabis could we vote on it then instead of waiting Ah that's a good question because that would be a public meeting yeah I wait two weeks if we're gonna you know how I don't know how we new business we want to schedule the workshop to deal with the entire ordinance um would we be able to vote then just wait till the next meeting yeah let's wait till the next there's a time constraint for one of the applicants or potential applicants theer to legal on that special why not we voted on resolutions before I don't think we need well you also need the public to be able to come they don't speak at Workshop hold on one second I'm sorry Mr jingar the vote that you're referring to be to pass the resolution or to introduce the No No Yeah so the there would be two votes one would be to revoke letters for stagnant applicants letters of support for the stagnant applicants and then um actually no we wouldn't be able to because we have that that's the only thing we could do we would still have to review the application before we could vote and wouldn't we have to change the ordinance we'd have to change our ordinance no we don't because we have room under there for if we revoke two we have two licenses that we could still issue without Ching the order now we still need to change the ordinance um but we wouldn't need to do it in this moment we could we could still go through the normal process it's going to have to be introduced on first reading assuming we can agree and then second reading and then it would be passed assuming it see here's the thing the ordinance right now reads four so yeah it reads four right now reads four oh that's right we grandfathered the seven no it's it's four toal four total and we were just honoring the seven right and we said that if anyone falls off then we wouldn't have we that they just fall off but I my recommendation is that we identify and and categorize it out that I I have the list here of those that um were considered but shouldn't we be talking about this under new business as opposed to well it was a question to um he was gonna make a call Mr Jenaro Mr abbit regarding the the logistics of this but yes in new business we are going to discuss uh both the workshop and potentially whatever else we can do okay thank you um so thank you Mr Jenaro we'll look forward to getting that info before we get to a new business if possible thank you sir um all right I think that's it for me uh Madam clerk okay going to review the consent agenda approval of minutes of previous meeting February 27th 2024 consent consent report of Township officers none reading of petitions and Communications and bids none bills none question on bills it's February 28th we still don't have bills is there an update Chief John found here tonight it's a CFO thing so is there is there reason is he okay he had surgery okay oh okay good now I hope he recovers well so do I um all right so we've not gotten bills yet we're now in first meet first meeting in March um if Mr gross is not able to do it I would encourage the administration to lean on Miss Santana or someone else in the department that can I'll speak with them I know that some of the vendors had reached out and we got uh Paul's been working diligently to get some of them paid and some of them are called to thank that they've been paid um there is a period of time the first couple months of the year where the books are being closed out and transitioned over to the new year I think that's all it is but I don't want to that does happen every Happ all right thank you Mr AB um okay M cler resolutions uh resolutions this evening 9624 is being pulled by the administration which one's that Woods um and are any other resolutions being pulled this evening colleagues anything councilwoman celino so I have a couple questions I don't have anything being pulled because we already discussed 97 um if you're oh 98 98 the yeah anyone else pulling anything you're gonna pull 98 yeah yeah okay pull 98 that yeah can we pull 93 and 90 is that a question or is that to U 94 is a question oh 93 I want to pull to so 94 is a question discussion 93 is a pull for the vote discussion yeah I have discussion on 87 n hold on a minute hold on a minute one at a time please so I said 93 and 94 okay 94 is being pulled or you have a question because I understood it as the question okay but 93 is pull gotcha yes please okay uh any someone else P 98 yes I got 98 pull yep uh 87 and 90 87 you want pulled yes please okay and 90 [Music] y okay anything else being pulled no no I've discussion on a couple things that FS do that before the vote or no you don't have to do that before the vot um no because my discussion are all ped items yeah I think that's oh actually except for 96 council president that's being pulled no I know but I wanted just to make a note to uh Administration for next week if they bring this back okay and councilwoman um GB Michael you had 9424 you had a question yes can I answer before can I my question before you vote okay because it might change I might call it right great um I noticed that we got two estimates versus going out to bed and I wanted to know why we didn't go out to bed 494 thank you that was part five said yeah the tree removal yeah $8,000 8,000 you wouldn't go out the bid on on that low for one thing like like $8,000 yeah was 175 okay and then so this bill because a notice was sent to the property owner right and there's a bench warn out because they failed to appear in Fort does the property owner pay the 8,000 place a lane on the property they sell it is they're those because they have to pay it because they're not are that's what I'm asking they'll have a lane placed on their property okay so if they ever sell it we get our money you okay I have a photograph as well for your edification you'd like to take a look at what the tree thank you so much is this for the tree yeah that's yeah thank you the homeowner is able to pay they sell really or also if they refinance refinance equipment in I think that's part of the problem already cut right I think it was a narrow place where they had to get their equipment in okay the township Forester has been there multiple times as well knocked and there's just no response from yeah okay thank you so much answer my questions any other questions before we vote so let's um be clear about what's been pulled sure uh 8724 9024 9324 uh 9624 is being from the administration removed uh for tonight and then 9824 perfect okay is there a motion to approve approve the consent agenda consent 9824 that's being pulled or removed 96 is being removed okay and then you said 98 98 is called is called yes okay uh all in favor any opposed the consent agenda is implemented okay the first resolution pulled this evening is 8724 resolution authorizing an award of contract with Regio construction for the 2021 Street improvements Phase 2 project in an amount not to exceed without authorization 2,828 to9 cents councilwoman Williams yes thank you madam clerk I pulled this um just out of curiosity I wanted to find out do we have any data on change order requests from Regio I see that they have um two contracts um that they've been awarded and then we also awarded um a new company uh Neal neglia engineering and Associates and it looks like they're they're still doing some of the similar Street Improvement works or at least have the capacity to um and then of course the the two bids for uh Regio were challenged um by the second bidder um they were close in price but just if we could get a little bit more clarity CM has has done a lot of this type of work for us we we yielded something to CME because they were still already doing something at the library so it made sense cost effective and then close proximity um I'm just trying to get an understanding and a handle on how we're divvying up the the work so this was bid work and they were the lowest responsive bidder Rego that's why they got to work what was the controversy about um the there's a a mechanism in place that's been in place since leny leapor was here where they signed for addendums over at the DPW which probably is not the best way to do it so now it's going to all be done through uh Paul Reynolds in the purchasing department which is a better way to do it we'll do that moving forward um I don't remember the exact specifics of it I think I think somebody acknowledged the addenda by email and somebody else showed up to sign it and that was the challenge and legal department felt that it was it was a very weak Challenge and thought was going to S over it so we moved ahead with it so I have a question regarding is that it for you councilman thank you um I have a question regarding this is a 21 uh award so what bucket of money is this coming out of so you and I had spoken earlier and I reached out to uh Miss carbal she said the the bond ordinances I think that's because there the 21 I think is that it's a a separate phase of a street Improvement program that dates back but the bonds are the bonds that this Council passed on not long ago December 5th of 2023 one Bond ordinance was 28 29-23 and the other one was 2830-20 right so so these are not from these are from prior year capital budget this is not something that we're doing ahead of doing the capital budget this year correct these are be you have already voted to bond this month thank you that was thank you for the answer that was my concern any other questions on 80s and that was my same question on 90 oh yes sir so not a question council president but to your point so the you know these streets have been uh you know residents have been patient for many many years uh especially my neighbors down the other side of alley way so I just wanted to let the public know that on this ordinance um Valley Way will be done Maple Street Hoover a Avenue Cleveland Avenue Lincoln Avenue Mount Pleasant Place Lancaster Terrace Normandy Terrace Manchester Road and Chestnut Road so um might as well read the other one too while yeah so number 90 um I know that one also was pulled but uh Ronald terce which had a lot of issues is on uh that one chevis Avenue coni avenue Carteret Street Hooper Avenue Dockery Drive Fint Terrace D'Or Drive Marcy Place Suburban Drive Crystal Avenue and we didn't pull 91 but 91 Morris Sussex and Hunton uh has some uh repairs as well so um lot of a lot of road work um you know which I'm glad we we're finally getting to but if I if I can one second so two of those streets people came in repeatedly last year yeah and Hooper uh so your streets are are being done to those that live on those streets councilwoman yes um just wanted to ask the administration if you will please especially with these Street improvements if there are any change orders um that they be provided to us in a timely manner and if we can just kind of keep some records because again these are some new companies that I had not seen um us utilize in the past and we just want to make sure um that they're giving us the fair price upfront and not coming back to us delayed billing I understand and I believe Miss carbal is on the I have her on the line now Chief yeah if you need her for anything but um I will discuss this with her tomorrow and make sure that if there's any change orders you know about in advance thank you uh La last thing from me um want to make sure that we are doing everything we can to maintain the street trees uh carb outs bump outs whatever we need to do not to take down health healthy trees that's something we discussed last year as well I think our uh our Forester Walter KS very in tune with that what I gather and what my experience has been even though he's not been here a long time so I I think we'll see some you know trees that may have otherwise been cut down in the past for Road improvements kept and maintained and saved I will tell you I was very impressed with u Mr Kip last night um he's been here before he's always been impressive but last night we had an in-depth conversation so uh I I certainly do have every confidence he will uh protect the trees good Madam can we uh do we have to do 87 and 90 separately because it were same questions I don't does anyone have any questions on I would do the vote separate okay yeah um but I mean I move we move it quickly yeah I move for the um acceptance of 8724 okay councilwoman celino yes councilwoman gber Michael councilwoman Scarpa yes councilwoman Williams yes council president rord yes okay motion passes the motion does pass thank you very and I I move for 90-24 I pull that one as well okay um I just I was just I was going to read the title just in case somebody in the audience didn't know what we were talking about resolution authorizing a contract with Regio construction for the 2022 Street improvements project in an amount not to exceed without authorization 2,375 5230 um it's been moved and properly seconded councilwoman celino yes councilwoman gber Michael councilwoman SCA councilwoman Williams yes council president Rutherford yes the motion carries 9324 resolution authorizing a Professional Services contract to CME Associates to provide professional Engineering Services for professional architectural and land surveying surveying services for landscape improvements and Rain Garden at 10 Rooney Circle for an amount not to exceed $15,000 and councilwoman gber Michael you pulled this yes uh because I noticed that the scoring sheet wasn't attached here um for the bids as to how I understand that there was a $400 difference but Greenman peton uh were the cheap for alternative and I thought generally with rfps you had to go with the lowest uh bidder that was only $400 different thought it was inconsequential not with the Professional Service you don't okay did you have a question I had residents ask me about that so I want you guys I I know why but I want response Administration services and CME has done all the other work site work for the for what we're looking to do for the improvements to the entire property so this was just an additional component because um because now that the library is open and there's a lot of concerns and people want certain other changes to our contract for the original drawings was exceeded so we needed to add this in there so we can complete the project to present it to you for future consideration okay so to clarify CME is already doing work on the property this is just an additional bid Y and because of because the fact that we you know we have thresholds we had to go through the proper procedures to make sure that we did this openly and transparently and provide you with the best um that we could provide for you thank you that's it I'm move for second Council celino yeah so I just want to share with my colleagues I and thank Mr smdo um for an in-depth conversation we had on Thursday when I received my packet um so I'm I had asked I'm advocating for uh one more Pathway to go next to the stairs I went over it with him uh test running uh the new facility with my uh adorable granddaughter and pushing up a hill a stroller uh God bless these parents uh so and walking to the end of the property so I've been uh utilizing the facility in that way and through the lens of our parents and watching other parents come to Story Time which by the way is awesome um uh they're doing such an awesome job it is jam-packed uh with little little toddlers it's it's really great to see that kind of energy and excitement from all the parents and the grandparents there but um I'm also hearing how hard it is to utilize the site and that's why we are doing this phase two not only for uh the young parents but also for our seniors and um so I just wanted to share that with you um in case there may be a change or possibility that we can get another pathway there just so you know I was there today for other business and I saw a father four-wheel his toddler up the side that Hill what I tell you they're gonna use it's it's something that I was going to speak to CME about but you know we have to in order to do that we need change order so I can't get anything added to this so yeah that is that I've heard that as well and I've also heard it with some of our seniors who are having a challenge then have to walk all the way around to come back up from the lower parking lot um so certainly you have some interest um from the members of the day and just so everybody knows with what we were looking at we're looking at better ele um um with the topography taken into account um the angles for people to walk in specifically the elderly the handicapped and those with young children um so we're looking at all that we're looking at all the different safety aspects we've had you know we're taking into account the street safety that everybody we know we have our street advisory boards um we're taking in account um all of our Landscaping we're trying to take in account everything that the council has we've heard from the past whether it be Energy Efficiency whether it be you know lighting and security cameras we're trying to to make this as best as possible and it's based on the input not only from what the council is not only with with Mr QB and the the board of the board the the library board but also members of the general public um and and honestly even today I stopped two people and asked them what do they think you know just just it looked at me like who is this guy but but I asked them what they thought and and we value their inlux because it's the everyday person who's visiting not just those who would just have another reason why they have to go in there I want to hear from other people also so we're taking that to an account and hopefully we'll be presenting you something that you'll think is amendable um and that we can make it a better place than it already is all right thank you Mr thank you appreciate it alling okay is there a motion to approve second second councilwoman celino yes councilwoman gber Michael yes councilwoman farpa councilwoman Williams yes council president Rutherford yes the motion is carried 90 uh yes 9824 resolution authorizing a contract for operation of the West Orange recycling center cwom celino you pulled that yes so I discussed a touch base earlier I'm not sure you I see that we have Mr defo thank you for all your efforts with this in the back there but um we have will is there is a time sensitive to get this done for I I mean unfortunately I didn't get a chance to read that contract so it's not going to be fatal if you don't vote on it tonight but we will need to do a um an extension of contract for Reliable right now um tonight but you know legal department will put that together um to extend it April 3 to take effect on May 1 okay it does take effect to May 1 believe so okay so you could get that on the next agenda I I think we can do that and we can get I feel more comfortable if I I saw the documents so I don't know this sent to me seems like some kind of an IT issue that some people can see them and some can't cuz it's all the same link we all got the same link and I was able to it opened tonight it did not open for me at least earlier it opened but I only had one page it could be the number of page like like and the public has to get it too so because the website's been unless some I believe some of it's not available to the public right some of it's internal draft documents I I want legal to Def on that but whatever they can have they will have yeah they're gonna have to tell me so is there can I move to table second well well before we do that U Mr defa is here is there anything you wanted to share with us or were you um we I was gonna say I question we haven't yet had a chance to to fully review so I think it's more appropriate to have questions next uh council meeting would you be a available to join us in two weeks I'm not sure what it is that you haven't reviewed so I don't know the actual the contract the contract is a one-page document that basically incorporates the request for proposal so the request for proposal is effectively the contract are the agreement the the pages yeah I got not Council I've seen the contract say the RFP is the contract oh yeah which is common and typical the things that I um that you and I have talked about was the landscaping around the outside to block the view from the neighborhood behind it um I didn't get a chance to I couldn't open the documents today oh so and I I think my colleagues had the same issue um so while it we did get the link uh and could actually click on the link we could not review what was inside the link until tonight and it's just too much to do before a council meeting so what I'm going to want to know and and I can speak with you in the next two weeks is that that is codified um that there's it's captured somehow I I know they're willing to I I just would like to make sure that it it gets done there is within the proposal that was submitted by the recommended company reliable Wood Products Nature's Choice there is a a section says they will improve Landscaping it doesn't give a landscape plan per se it leaves it open but they are willing to do that they did commit to them thank you uh councilwoman um I've had several residents Reach Out concerning about the recycling center especially the the current vendor so is there any way that we can have a presentation next week as to why they went with reliable and and what it's doing differently or you know are we going to make money off of this is there it's only the analysis right um I think a presentation would be I mean residents I've had people ask me so Wayne's our consultant he's will be the one that would be answering questions or giving the presentation but yes to answer your question we be will be making significant amount of money office if I can go I mean I know it's on the website as well the summary but I can give you the dollar number if that's what you're interested in uh over a five-year period the total value proposed to West Orange and this is in direct payments not in added value of the operation where you receive an estimate just having it there is worth about a quarter of a million to 350,000 to the township because you don't pay to have anything else done but in raw dollars the total value over five years to the township is 1,1 191,192 bags of mulch each year which has a value of 30,000 that's added into that number I'm giving you you would also receive a payment of $35,000 up to 35,000 to help with a new permit that is required for that site for storm water which no other proposer submitted to help us pay for that's great uh and you would also receive of course the raw payments the rent which start at 129 I'm sorry $120,000 a year rising to $129,200 there would be a flat Revenue proposal of $75,000 per year for each of the five years in other words rather than a percentage of sales per se because that would be very difficult and time consuming to try to calculate they're offering a flat $75,000 a year I compared that of course against some of the other offers which were in percentages but some of those percentages one was point I believe 0.02% I have to check the number but it was very low less and nobody came close to that kind of an offer to the township so again the more important number to you I think if I understood your question is your value over five years is 1,191 1869 significantly more than we're getting today thank you for explaining that counil um I just had a question because I haven't had an opportunity to really look through the entire contract or all the data um The Mulch that's generated at the facility this is still free to West Orange residents is that correct that's correct nothing is changing in that regard okay colleagues any anyone else have a question Council I I do so um all right so that one of my question was that's extra 75,000 so the rent is a 631 869 over five years the 75 is 375,000 over five years plus free mulch plus 30,000 towards oh oh plus uh money towards site testing and permit 35,000 permit one a cap that's not per year that's a one time a onetime fee okay that's perm pay payment that that they're paying they're going to help pay for that permit which we have to get it don't forget it is west oranges property so we technically hold the storm waterer permit would have to hold it they will help pay for it and engineer it with us now my question was and this is more for administration that's why I want to see the body of the contract you know we have to hopefully uh move Public Works uh out of where they are is there room where we was there room up this at that site for us to park any of our trucks up there and if so is that mentioned in the contract if we that's not in the contract there would it need to be put in the contract no because there's there's property up there that I mean all the property belongs the township but only a certain amount of it is leased to the operations so we have other property up there I'm not sure it's going to be conduced to putting our trucks up there I know it was mentioned that's why there we don't have a lot of other room yeah well I on piggy back and off of that I do think it's important that we have a plan for moving DPW sooner rather than later I know you guys have been working on it but you know we're going to have to get something concrete because in the coming months it'll be too late essentially so um I I'm not advocating for it to move to the recycling center but wherever it's going to be I think we need to to be clear about that as soon as possible um any other questions colleagues for Mr defo no thank you so much Mr defo and and right now we are getting what what were we getting in rent um on average uh from right now this year lower than that L less than I have to look I don't want to say anything wrong it's been changed over the years it's less than $100,000 a year I believe I want to say from what 7,000 this is a significant no I thought it was 3,000 a month we're going to about 185 in total value um not that the rent is 185 but we're going from three or four maybe 5,000 a month to roughly 185 that's a good that's a that's a nice bump but it also makes a question what was going on before but we're not going to address that right now because we want to get out of here tonight at a reasonable hour and just just to piggyback on that is um you know we we have to do a competitive process we just did not have the competition in years past so it's not that because I know people are GNA say that public why weren't you doing this years ago we did these These are this is what we did these are the you know these are the bids we got we I don't think anybody besides nature Choice even bid in the past uh once since 2005 we had one bit or one bread this time we had a handful so we yeah we capitalized we made out had four you did very well on this believe me thank you colle if we if we do have questions between now and the next council meeting please email them to Mr defao so they can be answered before we get to the meeting uh won't have to take up the Public's time do you want to back at the next meeting um do we need him back you want Mr def back at the next meeting well we don't know until we have there I would can you plan March 26 so Al at Tuesday it's two weeks from today so we approve I will do my best not today no no no no no no uh I'm sorry I cannot I I knew there was something on March 26 I have to be at another hearing of safe County I can't I physically can't be in two places at once well can we have you call in that rescheduled I will or can you call in perhaps on Zoom let me double check and see what I can do on for that date I know one of them has been moved and if the county if the commissioners of say County moved hearing date then I'll be able to make it and we'll do what we can to accommodate you uh should that be needed um so we we'll we'll communicate but to help that process let's get questions to him via email yes um between now and the 26th thank you Mr def have a good night you too it's already been uh to table right yeah a motion though well we have it yes yes and the next meeting okay until am I question is if we do approve at the next meeting then you don't need an extension because you have to May 1 well we still probably um want to look at an extension because technically it's expired now so you should you have the extension on for next meeting or we can do that I'll work I'm confus you're saying that the current contract is expired but the new one just starts till May 1 you approve it this but this one's also been renew it's been expired because these this is like the Garbage Contract these things take a long time to get all your bids together and you know score and everything else so February 28 okay all right so if we need to do an extension please have have it ready on 26 also we'll I'll work with Mr Jenaro and we'll we'll have both both things ready for the next meeting thank you sir there's a motion to table was it seconded yes it was okay okay councilwoman celino yes councilwoman gber Michael councilwoman barpa councilwoman Williams council president wford yes motion is carried ordinances on second and final reading 284-2476 for the regulation of Township dog parks dog park rules and regulations is the motion to introduce on second okay councilwoman celino councilwoman gber Michael Yes councilwoman corpa councilwoman Williams yes council president Rutherford yes um we now have public comment um if anyone would like to comment on ordinance now seeing none public comment is closed it's uh wait for councilwoman Williams to come back and then we'll U take the vote okay I have a you have a question yeah yeah I have a request on um on 2840 yeah on rules and regulations because I wasn't here last meeting um so I'm I'm under number 20 Chief no smoking allowed can we add to that vaping isn't vaping smoking it could be considered I know the other ordinances to separate activities I don't think we can add it that we have to do change it's on second sorry I think on second reading you can't you couldn't do it for other stuff remember sentence yeah right have to we' have to do an amendment for the next meeting you bring up a new business we'll vot on it and then to include that's come up before that and no alcohol aloh well we have we have Park regulations this is a park we'll post all the regulations which is no there's no smoking there's no drinking you know we can if we need to tweak an ordinance we can but I don't even think it's gonna be necessary yeah well if we do let's just tweak it for all of them if that's if bapes have been left out y Mr jaro yeah I think that to the extent that the ordinance reference smoking just any ordinance that references smoking I think now that it's kind of all Encompass but if we want to make it so that that's clear uh we certainly work because people do the pot Vapes and it smells like crap and and people are going to be at this dog park so you have to put that on there okay thank you hey can I just say something you know we talk about attorney fees and I feel like we're wasting my opinion it's just my opinion time on the attorneys going and adding and vaping when to me vaping is considered smoking and I think if someone sees it they're going to call no it's separate the school policies are separate needs to be made clear it's definitely separate I agree I think it has come the good news is our attorneys have to do the resol resolutions as part of the retainer so it's not Cy anymore but um great I I'll defer to coun what they want you know I I I I I don't want to do it peace meal so as long as we do it one time for all of our parks that that's that makes sense yeah and and I'll talk to Mike fono as well because there may be a state rule that stipulates that vaping is smoking yeah we'll find I I I don't believe that is the case because it's separate separate separate it's separate when it comes to purchasing and the materials it's not so we we will'll yield to Legal they were seate in the licensing aspect not in the smoking aspect in terms of actually enforcing smoking there I don't think that we would have a problem but if that's something you want me to address I'm happy to take a look and address yeah it needs to be on the sign thank yeah sign we look at it for all parks sure SM their uh this spring is springing and uh people are going to be calling people are going to be in parks with their kids and they should not be subjected to clear indication all right so we we've U any other questions councilwoman no thank you any other questions or comments on um 2840 2840 no no is there a motion to approve second okay councilwoman celino yes councilwoman gber Michael councilwoman thpa councilwoman Williams yes council president rord yes okay motion is carried council president I have Michael fonzo on line he has his hand raised he'd like to speak Mr fanino can you hear us yes hi council president High Council Members um I I'm looking at the definition of smoking being prohibited in our ordinance and it does mention the use of um electronic cigarettes lit cigarette lit tobacco and also any cannabis products so I think we're covered but I'll defer to legal to confirm that thank you thank you Mr fono director that's all right it looks like it's already in Parts as well if you look at um section 43 433 thank you all right let's keep zooming thank you okay all right no further questions are we ready for the vote oh do we have a we yeah the next one we did vote oh that's right I just voted over there you're right I'm sorry I was thinking yeah going so fast you can hardly believe it let keep going though keep going going 2843 2843 d24 an ordinance amending chapter 10 section 2.5 of the revised General ordinances to add a fee for a potentially dangerous dog license licensing of dog fees is there a motion to introduce on second and final reading so move second wait can I can I ask a question the numbers are throwing me off 2 2840 2843 where's 41 and 42 they were or were those other resolutions those are the ones that were tabled or vot I I don't remember exactly but they didn't come back yet obviously no they're not coming back because they were yeah voted down they were never there was no motion that's what it was two of them that were had no motion so then the number doesn't automatically change okay well you stick with the same need yes yeah otherwise it would get crazy but okay uh councilwoman celino um introduce on second finals councilwoman gabber Michael Yes councilwoman Scarpa councilwoman Williams yes council president retherford yes okay public hearing public comment is now open for uh anyone that wishes to uh comment on 2843 regarding uh the additional fee for potentially dangerous dog license seeing none public comment is closed any questions colleagues nope no I'm move for the adoption I just have a quick question because I wasn't here last week so so the licensing fees are we doing that by resolution like the actual amount so that's already that's separ by state law as well so it it'll be in a separate resolution and might already you got to go double check with John gross to see if it's already encompassed in the chart chart um but the number that's in the resolution is set by state law as well okay and so if somebody also and again this is maybe a little bit off topic if somebody comes to the dog park to utilize the dog park to get the pass they have they need a pass to be at the dog park they do okay and then if somebody's there like who's checking that like what how we enforcing this and how we advertising this to the public that's more for you guys not you well well the Health Department's been doing a um a lot of work with that and talking to other communities and see what they do but um you know as far as enforcement it's going to be a work in progress we're going to have to say there's no reason that the health department or the police department anybody else can't enforce it but you know we're we're really it's not about enforcement it's about having people be responsible and we believe that this is going to lead to more dogs being licensed um my head I want to say we have like a thousand dogs licensed in West Orange which is got to be by all counts pretty low you consider you just think about how many streets we have in West Orange I mean it's like two or three dogs a street you know it's that's that's pretty low so we're going to get more dogs licensed when they're licensed you're ensure that they have their RAB shots and so on it's it's it's good but just good Public Health practice so my recommendation is if you're going to because no one's going to carry their pass on them unless there's a little decal or something that will come on the dogs okay good okay so people could see it just for the record thank you councilwoman um definitely don't want the police to enforce that uh yeah you know I'm not I'm not looking for that but saying they can be yeah Parks or health uh Department um and we are coming into budget season so if there is an issue uh with regard to enforcement this is the time to to do it um you know I'm happy to engage in the conversation because of how our budget last year went um freezing everything no promotions no open positions so um certainly would like to to understand if there is a need Mr fono director fono if he's still paying attention there is a need or Mr kho um for resources for uh enforcement please let us know sooner than later bill K our rec director actually volunteered that his uh part-time security staff can perform this fun he said you know it's considered a park he said when you're done checking Colgate and stag he said go right over there perfect council president Mr fanino is on the line Mr fanino did you want to respond yeah I was just gonna add that um like like to the chief's Point um we're not going to have a person at the Gate of course we don't have those resources but um during you know business hours our Animal Control division um Can Patrol the park and and make sure do some spot checks make sure people are there have a tag on their dog and councilwoman calino we are purchasing um dog park pass tags similar to the dog license tags that are required to be fixed to the animal when they're in the park so we'll be able to you know not right away if if somebody doesn't have a pass or not great thank you director I hold on for just one second councilman thank you director fanino um I appreciate you and all the hard work that you do um I just I I do want to be transparent I know I mentioned it in the last meeting that I am opposed to charging residents to use the dog park and and have them pay for uh dog licenses you know other municipalities and counties don't do it I know some municipalities do charge but I think for you know the taxes and the fees that we pay and charge excuse me the residents I don't think they should be charged to use a dog park they don't charge to use the playground or other uh you know open spaces so that's just my sentiment that's it yeah so I totally understand um where you're coming from you know the thing is that the township acquired this this dog park we don't have any money in the budget to maintain it um so we're asking to collect you know a small fee for the maintenance and the upkeep of the you know of the park itself um you know we again there's there's we don't have those resources to you know to to fund those functions so that's why we're we're we've asked to to charge the residents a small fee $10 a year um to utilize the park thank you any other questions no are we ready for the vote I move for the adoption I second councilwoman celino yes councilwoman gber Michael Yes councilwoman Scara councilwoman Williams yes council president Rutherford yes the motion is carried okay ordinances on first reading 2844 uh 24 an ordinance amending and supplementing chapter 7 traffic subsection 7-23 one turn prohibitions of the revised General ordinance of the township West Orange Pleasant Valley Way and Greenwood Avenue I make a motion to well before do that can you just this is the where the bank is Right correct and and I'm assuming this is because of either accidents or near accidents so we had a uh a request from the residents of uh Greenwood that people were leaving the high school coming down and making like uh u-turns you know because they they cone it off they can't turn left when they come out of high school go down to Greenwood because I don't want to go all the way to the traffic and deal with traffic light in the intersection um at least one resident but I think was a couple petition to have like a culde saac made at the bottom but if you can just picture the exit on the bank the drive it just wouldn't work emergency vehicles things like that so we thought about maybe you know doing a uh hourly turn prohibition which you have around the corner on um igle rock and Oak I think it is yeah there Paris um so we're GNA give this a shot and see if it works as long as you're willing to adopt it well one of the challenges there for those of us that have had to drop children off at the high school is even making this change to Greenwood folks are just going to pull a few feet further pull into the bank drive around through the ATM and come out Greenwood I mean we're still going to get those left turns and you're still going to get traffic the only question is are they going in through Greenwood and then coming out through the bank or making a U-turn on Greenwood or do they go through the bank and uh come out of Greenwood water seeks its level so traffic yeah it just displaces it um and you can't stop the bank from having left-hand traffic you can't stop them around left-hand traffic but if if people get caught cutting across there is a title 39 statute for cutting course private property like that so I mean if we have to should be going theity Route and go on the path for theu yeah what this highlights for us though is is that there is an issue with drop off at the high school I mean there are other schools that have issues with drop off as well um but with the increased number of uh cars and uh you know over the course of time it's just gotten worse uh so you know I don't know what the long-term solution is I know this is not it um so we're GNA have to figure out what the long-term solution is is there something we can do uh councilwoman working with the Board of Ed or Administration working with the Board of Ed to figure out what the long-term solution is going to be so and and by the way you also have the issue on on the Kelly side uh so people will pull into to the little carve out for Kelly and so the traffic in the morning is uh probably it's one of the worst schools for drop off uh in town maybe Edison uh given how tough it is to get in and out might be worse but High School is probably the worst or second worst in town so just today we had a uh complaint from a couple residents I think San J bani might have been on it um with Roosevelt so I talked to zth and I said you know if you can pull together a meeting with definitely the principal but hopefully the superintendent available and so on and we can sit down and brainstorm this and see if we can do something there we talk the about the high school at the same time get Mr Guerrero involved I I just don't know if there's an answer to be honest with you but so this has been a longtime problem at the high school and that's why they made the trying to encourage parents to go through coni so I I'll talk to uh Mr Moore um and the principal I think the issue is and I made a note for for myself with this what once we pass this is they have to get it out there on school Messenger to let them know anytime there's a change every once in a while they'll send out like the map to the parents of where to drive and go but unfortunately not everybody always aderes to the recommendations of the school of where the entrance is and I'm not sure if they're utilizing Pen Valley way these days no they are they do for Dr off and you have to you can only go One Direction so yes it is utilized and it and it it alleviates some of the traffic a little bit well the issue with coni though is the only put to much the folks that are coming from the uh 280 side uh toward the high school if even if they go and make that right and then make the left they've got to turn around to drop the children off or pull up into those neighborhoods and drop them off and let them cross the street and so we're exchanging one challenge for another um it's you know there's a similar issue at Mount Pleasant there's a similar issue at St Cloud so you know and there's a lot of empty buses pulling into the parking lot too oh that's not even the way the buses complain it's been like that for years all right let's so I think we TR and councilwoman as the leaz on to the board can get a joint working session to figure out because it's going to cost some money they can't do it on their own they got to come through us anyway no no they don't they don't have to come through they don't bond on their own we bond No but but they've done their cutout at Gregory without coming to us I when I drop off my son at St Cloud there's always either uh crossing guard crossing guard someone or teachers the principal gym teachers out there they tell cars to keep moving they you know like oh yeah and that's a contractual thing that they have pre they do have everybody at the high school they have a whole team at the high school it's a it's a a machine yeah it's not and and you need the parents to keep it moving the staff out there to tell them to you know get out even with that and even with the signage West Orange PD will give you a ticket people still violate yeah um and it's only a matter of time we've had some near misses it's only a matter of time for something goes wrong so I do think we need to just deal with the the the drop off challenges at the schools that are are having the most significant challenges so my question to you then is you're not in favor of this or I mean it will it help uh Greenwood yes it's just G to Beck it's gon to make the problem go somewhere else or some so you know do I want to help the folks on Greenwood absolutely um I don't think this is actually going to alleviate their problem I think people will still cut through the bank and unless we put a police officer there or some school official in the bank to tell people they can't do that and then how do you know who's actually coming to the bank and who's not I I like I'll talk I had already made a note to for them to get a message through school messenger out about this upcoming change once a passes because without you know the parents knowing they're gonna go down Greenwood anyway so they have to be educated so I had a question councilwoman thank you as far as the you said there was a resident on Greenwood who requested this change did they go through the regular process where they have to petition the majority of residents or is it this just being spearheaded by one resident there there was multiple it may have been it may have been multiple but I'm not going to say it was the whole street no we didn't petition a whole street so maybe then do we just um put a pause on this and petition the whole street and make sure this is the workaround or do I mean is this a safety issue as well yeah oh so this is a safety issue okay all right then that satisfies me I'm I'm fine it even if it's not a workaround it I can imagine the residents not wanting this the residents on Greenwood want it what we're going to see though are other residents on other streets that now have to deal with the challenge or also the bank right what we're gonna Force by doing this so you know I've been dropping kids off at the high school now for quite a few years and I've seen it and I've done it myself I apologize to the Greenwood Avenue residents um but you're gonna see people drive to the bank and make that left into the bank now that they can't make the left on well the bank also has their own security um not at that time of morning I was going to say once they open at 9:00 but so that might not even and the security honestly what are they gonna do say don't you're already there like once people start making that turn it's they're gonna finish the turn like my my challenge with this and and this is I don't it's not that I don't want to help Greenwood I don't want to um um NE negate or minimize the safety issue I I recognize it I I was hit on that street in front of Fortis Mo myself right so I get it um I don't think taking it a piece at a time is actually gonna be helpful would a traffic engineer help like Mike daniller take a look at it Mike might volunteer some time for that but so you know I don't know what the right procedure is but but we need a we need a strategy right we need to understand how these cars are coming in and how they're going out um and what we can do to minimize the impact on the neighboring streets and it's this is being done primarily for the high school drop off but Kelly has its own challenges with drop off uh and then you know parents and students and teachers have an issue crossing the street uh yeah we lost a teacher one year so so let's I would prefer a holistic approach to the drop off that's on com on Pleasant Valley Way um and considering Kelly you know so that we're not just fixing one problem and creating another one so so what really is gonna solve the problem and I was just that same parent that you know my kids miss the bus would drive them is the kids have to get on the bus so you have less parents driving to the school um Kelly does a great job with doing um The Walk to school day to get encourage more families but unfortunately in today's world you know you know parents say these kids want their sleep more than not catching the bus on time it's that extra 15 ores every day up that hill they never took the bus and and watching all those empty buses make me crazy as when I was on the Schoolboard and all the money but you have to still give them the seat on the bus absolutely so so can we set schedule some time councilwoman with to meet with a couple of folks from the board so that we're not violating any rules and figure out if we can get a working group together have a Le well I don't think it's we gotta solve problem there's a real problem well I I'll put in my liais on meeting with them and they need to solve the problem because they have to reorganize their Staffing on how they're going to you know well it's our issue now like once once it comes to us so like if we decided not to move this forward and then something happened this is recorded and I've expressed my concerns but this is hard for me to vote against even though it doesn't fully addressed the problem it's our challenge too now right yeah and and we've got to kind of regulate with with regard to the streets and I'll set I'll set up a meeting I'll set up a meeting and see where they're at to see what complaints they have and maybe they're going to implement something on their own but we'll see council president if I could too if I this is a county road yeah so not only do we have to we vote on this but then it has to get approval from the county also so there is going to be a delay no matter how long you take in approving this um I would also suggest if we're going to get a committee together I've worked with sanj County engineer many times he has helped us out we recently with the traffic lights and everything for for the local congregation uh he's worked with us so you know if we're going to put something together I would think we should want to include them absolutely right away the GetGo because without we could say everything we want without their without their approval it's not going to make it on this year so I mean the same would be true for Gregory uh I know we got the cut out there but should there need to be something done there it's a county road so absolutely and another thing just in local history Greenwood a was the first Street West ARS to get speed HS or speed humps speed tables whatever you want to call them they were a very vocal group up there and I know someone personally was involved and it was a grassroot effort and I will leave him nameless here but he's probably listening tonight so you're welcome Tony yes uh so any other questions or comments before we move forward was motion and second it right was it it was no it just a motion it was not seconded no no you you made the motion second you second okay thank you uh councilwoman celino yes councilwoman gber Michael Yes councilwoman SCPA councilwoman Williams council president Breer yes the motion is carried and M clerk yeah if I could just get this electronically tomor on a separate PDF and I'll send it to Mr Moore sure okay will you CC me on that yeah thank you absolutely all right we are um pending matters new matters Council discussion um would like to uh follow up on the Free Speech hate speech uh training we uh there weren't enough votes it was a 2 two to have the uh training um colleagues any update on Chief there were a couple people they were going to talk to to see if we could get it done for free I'm not for spending any money on this I uh we've reached out to the our carrier the GIF have not heard back from them on if they have I I think they have somebody that does this training he's a retired police chief but he's um it's probably not going to be for free I think the gif's going to charge um how about the ad ADL the ACLU we have not heard back from yet okay so let's see if we can get somebody to do the legal department said they want to oversee this so I said should we'll we'll I have no issue with that but we'll why does the legal department want to oversee it I guess because if there's a contract they've got to um like if we have attorneys come in and we give them a Professional Services contract they're going to have to to grab that got it so um I think I just want to remind us it's $2,500 our budget is approximately 115 million and that does not include our capital budget which registers in the tens of millions some years um and I think part of the challenge we've had in addressing some of the issues in town is that we've not um address them soon enough um I'm glad we did the Ramadan event it is the first public acknowledgement this body has given to the Muslim Community Palestinian Community um who has been crying out for us to show any kind of acknowledgement to them at all so I'm glad we did it um but we've had multiple other opportunities to show support and we did not take those opportunities and we this town and I think all of us would agree no matter how long you've been here we've not seen this town this tense I've never seen this town this tense uh and I grew up in South Orange and and that's in the in the 80s um so it's important for us I think as Leaders to to act in a way that demonstrates our commitment to doing the work that's necessary to address these issues I think we need I mean a retired police officer he might be great but I think we need a constitutional scholar I think we need someone who is credentialed in that particular space who is recognized as an expert in that space um and you know with what Mr Gainer shared with us earlier today roughly I don't know if it's true or not I've not I'm just going what he said assuming what he said is true we've spent over a half million dollars on legal fees on one case that very few if any of us support So $2500 I think is is nomenal and the partner of the firm uh as you have all seen in the um email that went around offered uh a significant discount um and we are willing to put a not to exceed clause in it so rather than continue to wait and then God forbid something else happens and then we're behind the the issue again I would much rather go forward with it um give us the training we need get the public the uh presentation they need to better understand what our role and responsib possibility is what is Free Speech what's protected speech and what isn't um and we will have the tools that we need to deal with it directly uh yes Council M so um thank you council president and I definitely see where you know um that was a horrible meeting a very horrible night what was even more challenging was on Zoom with delays with with muting and it was just it was just crazy and hopefully you know we we'll never never have that situation again uh that being said I had taken uh other trainings through out my my time so um and I I just want to make this recommendation because I you know always go back to my prior experience when I was on the school board so whenever things got contentious or um I know our protocol has always been we leave it in the hands of the council president which isn't always fair so I think it should be the um Attorneys at any given time we don't you know give them Direction I Would like to give them Direction because it worked I saw this work well when I was on the school board that the attorney would jump in and if we didn't know like if if something went array and if we didn't um couldn't identify something the attorney would jump in because they are trained in the law knowing what goes over the line and and so I don't have a problem with the attorney to jump in that's what I had said at the last meeting but that's what we have them for so we jumped in not meeting but we don't give that okay so In fairness the way we've run a meeting and in In fairness to the administration is any time somebody tries to jump in you know the chair and this not this year this goes back couple years the chair is like you know I got it I got it so I think if we all tell the attorney tonight that you know something like this occurs you know I know if I was in that seat I would want you to to jump in I think it works well I think they're trained not to say it is $2500 so I think if anybody feels the need that they need training to do this job um I'm not opposed to it I personally you know don't want to spend the money for myself um but if if you feel the need or any our colleagues feel the need to want to get trained in something to make our job better then give them that option hold on one second Council so I I appreciate that um and we've had this conversation offline so um I I appreciate that I I've had other training that's why I'm saying that yeah so I think part of our challenge if if you recall from the meeting um I asked Mr Jenaro a question and um a lot of this stuff is is gray area right like he gave a an answer this is I I'm not challenging your answer at all I think he gave a good answer but um a lot of this stuff is is in the gray area you know um or you could let one of us jump in I mean not you particularly but if the other truthfully I really think if that meeting was held in person that night absolutely I think it would have been a you just you were bad spot being isolated on zoom and I I think that meeting in person it wouldn't have gone that far so I I don't disagree with even with the even with these people that so they have they have focused on on Zoom bomb but we also had a local group come in one night in our council meeting and several of them got up and made comments that that microphone this was before we had the microphone there um which many in the community felt was anti-semitic um we've so we've had the challenge before and and I don't want that's why we did that resolution to to Define anti-Semitism so that's what there was a push for that resolution this was long before that resolution got passed but the the the point I'm making is two things one it is possible and when it does happen I do think it's important that we understand where the line is but it's not just for us I I think what we should do is make it clear about the role what your role is as a council person what the council president's role is what the attorney's role is we don't have a parliamentarian but we do have a police officer um you know each of us have some role in this in this public meeting and while the council president does run the meeting um you have an opportunity to speak the public has an opportunity to speak and we all wait we all wait you know so we could change usually yeah usually so so we need to I I I I listen I'm not trying to to beat a dead horse I just think what we've how we've proceeded I think lacks um what exactly excuse me what exactly is is the training like what exactly occurs you pay 2500 what do you get for 2500 hour like public so the I'll send it around for half um [Music] that's I'm sure the groups that do it for free I think that should be explored I agree could use the 2500 they get nothing so so for a moment excuse me gentlemen excuse me gentlemen so what we're we're dealing with is not a joke it's not funny I it's not and and I think it is that is exactly why we need training right because this is a serious issue people are hurting it's still tense and our Behavior has not demonstrated the seriousness with which this issue deserve should be treated so the proposal that was sent around 90minut training to the West Orange Council regarding Free Speech hate speech harassment and dis discrimination on a date to be determined a 15 in addition a 15 to 20 minute training presentation to public meeting participants during our council meeting to summarize what we went through but to also help the public understand the difference between protected speech and hate speech and that's important if you've not read the Thousand emails in there many of them were not directed to you they were directed to me or councilwoman gber Michael people in this town hundreds of them are under a false impression that somehow I have allowed anti-semitic speech not even even after passing the resolution not even understanding what actually is and is not so I do think it's important that we do it now there's other things in here and I sent this email around on the 23rd I'm going to bump it to the top of your inbox uh right now with the full email chain um is500 a person or for one session for 90 minutes and whoever could go could go whoever doesn't go doesn't go correct I don't think we need anything more than the half hour here for the public and everybody together I the public would be a 15 to 20 minute presentation i' rather see a half hour during our everybody the the public would get a 15 to 20 minute presentation during our council meeting similar to to the um presentation Mr Berwin did tonight I don't feel we need a 9 the presentation I I just I so I I just want to state that there is no lack of seriousness about what occurred and there is not a lack of desire to get training what we indicated last week we and what I still think is being stated here and what the administration has indicated is that they're still in the process of seeing whether not somebody can do this training at a reduced cost or no cost that's what my our Council colleagues are suggesting is that can we explore the financial capacity a little bit more before we make a rush decision to spend $2500 and that and that's it's just that simple that's exactly what I excuse me did you check with the league of municipalities because that's the kind of trading that I think they would do well again last time out time out time out let one at a time councilwoman I tried to interrupt you before you continue um so there have been multiple times this issue has been discussed and multiple members of This Town Council have been laughing while it was being discussed not just tonight others in the public have remarked about it and have been hurt by so it's not just tonight that laughing occurred second the request that that you just reference councilwoman Williams about the administration following up um that was the only followup was from councilwoman Scara after I asked both of you had you done any work to find someone to do it for free and both of you had said no I said I called the leak I was waiting for him to get back to me you said you were gonna call the chief I did call the chief and I called the leak lawyer your response to me on Friday was you were gonna call the chief but the point I'm making is we we had an opportunity to get it done the opportunity was not taken two weeks go by I found someone at25 $100 we've wasted money even recently on things that are frivolous um this is not so look if you don't want to do it you don't want to do it um that's fine I I I do want to do it and I'm G to put forward a a motion tonight yes Council so in the last meeting and even tonight I will mention that I do support um training and I think it's important so thank you for your efforts to finding it looking into it I know the administration said that whoever they reached out to hasn't gone back to them yet so I personally don't think we should belabor I think we should this is just my opinion hopefully we'll be support from the majority of the council if not thank you for your efforts and and doing this for us one second councilwoman scarper councilwoman Williams you weren't here last week when we discussed um other opportunities there is a workshop that was distributed by the administration is the role and responsibilities of elected officials there's two dates it's $200 per person it's a virtual Workshop um I think it's about five hours and there are two dates where you can take it at a lesser cost each of us $200 per person by the Le yeah by the we from Ruckers but does that address supposed to take yeah we're we're actually supposed to take it but my question is does that address the questions that council president Rutherford mentioned regarding yes it will will because you could ask those questions there so here here's the thing with these courses and training and I and it's funny in in school board land you're mandated school board members have got to go take you have to go uh here they're offered and no one tracks that Madam clerk does get after us with some of them that the state makes you take so and I was isn't this one of them that every all of all of us first come on the council first last year I remember it's offered at Atlantic City and then it's offered in various sites now they might have got a little LAX for Co but at the end of the day you know that's where you get training now this was unique again this times are unique right now what's been going on has not happened in our community uh and I'll Echo council president senent you know I you know growing up in the township it's never been this tense and it it's it's been hard breaking as a lifelong resident of the community to to see this tension with that being said I mean I I'm if the administration looked into something if there's something that you should take maybe take the one for 200 and then you need to take it anyway and and then if that's not enough then again I'm not going to deny if for a little bit amount of money if my colleagues want to get trained I personally may not take it well if I'm available yeah I'll kill an hour and a half I mean I think it's well worth learning something new every time you go to seminar you walk away with something um with that being said I think it's we shouldn't fight like or you know we we're debating over this but um you know we should always we should always enhance our skills here but also I I do want us to utilize our attorney as well because when it comes to the law and crossing the line um you know the attorney's got to be the one to jump in so I I have no problem if you you know something occurs again um that the attorney could just jump in and instead of feeling they have to lay back all the time m g so the first thing that I want to say is that in circumstance just using the last I guess it's now about three or four meetings ago as an example there were certain comments that were made during that meeting where you did not immediately shut it down you did it would have been immediately shut down by that would have unmuted and spoke over and shut it all down that being said there were other comments that were closer to that gray area the gray area in the medium line if there are comments like the ones that I'm talking about and I don't think I think we're all well aware of the ones that I'm thinking of um I would obviously St Mr Jen we just got an email someone asked you to please speak into the microphone yeah just bring it closer sorry yeah thank you so there were comment the point of what I was saying was that there were certain comments made at the last meeting where if you did not immediately ask Mr Fagan to mute the people I would have jumped in within milliseconds to do so uh that being said there were other comments that were closer to the gray area that I can make suggestions if that's what you would like yes but I'll caution that they're closer to the grayer right and that that so that is actually the challenge that that it is better understanding what is protected and what isn't right for all of us or each of us and you know listen I I know you know the law I'm not challenging you on your understanding or Mastery of the law um I'm not challenging any attorney on their knowledge and Mastery of the law but there are different specialties different Focus or fosy and Free Speech hate speech is one of them and there are folks that spend considerable amount of their time understanding that from a constitutional perspective and and what we've seen in other spaces and some of us have looked at some of these other Council meetings that have had similar issues maybe not the same one um there are people that will that know it very well and will go right up to the line and be offensive and still be you using what would be protected speech and if we shut them down then we Face uh you know potential lawsuit or whatever the the followup is from that individual and that's what we don't want to do too I don't want to subject us to folks that have ill intentions that know the law as well or better than us and will then be in in here being offensive and we don't have the tools we need to shut it down that that's it without having to then go through a legal process and settle a lawsuit for you know 50,000 or whatever the number is because we don't want to spend the money on the legal fees and still take the risk of losing right like if we can avoid that I think that's what we should do and what we owe the people if we can find somebody to do it for free let's do it for free it's 2500 bucks I'm not going to cry about that but I've taken the I took that um training my first year um or either my first I think it was my first year um um I just went in into the class I don't I don't even know if I was registered or not but it's not dealing I mean at least as far as I I can recall it's not dealing with the particulars of what we dealt with for example um my to my colleagues and and Mr Jenaro I'm gonna ask that you not answer this just yet is usage of the nword um hate speech yeah you say yes does anybody say no does anybody else say yes I I I I'm not debating whether or not we need additional training I am debating whether or not we can find an additional trainer for less or for free and I don't believe that two weeks is adequate time for the administration to have the capacity to respond or any of us well you didn't respond at all and that was three days ago your email I did respond to your email so please sir you did do not call me out when you are inaccurate can you send it to me because I didn't see it wasn't an email first of all it was a text message told you that I did not respond because you had not asked me to I just made a statement and said that we can try and get the training for lesser cost okay that's it so we're we're quibbling over over what I think are pennies um and I think it's an important issue uh I want did you want to say something Madam CL okay um anyone else Mr smdo say he reached out to the league I I did Council I spoke to them actually today um they advised me one we should talk talk to the ACLU um and the um and the state also for the CI um Civil Rights Commission they may have training for that U they also did said they I told them what happened and explained it to them they actually are going to develop a course for the League this November it's an idea for a league just so you understand they so they would like to have that as as a topic of discussion um and that that was basically where it was at with that regarding the the elected officials program and I looked that up also um I have it here on the phone that is uh right now there's only one class available the April third class is sold out the April 13 or April 6th uh the April 13th class is still available it's 200 bucks it is from 9: to 4 it is virtual you can do it at home in your in your you know on a Saturday it's a Saturday you're just doing the comfort of your sweatpants or anything like that it's not a formal meeting but it's it's the value training so you can you can do it that way so that's that's as far as we were able to find to date but we and I have reached out to the GIF I sent them an email asking them for that specific training I looked through the Vault we have a vault of different videos and training and unfortunately there is nothing in the vault that I found and we have access to like 680 different videos and training sessions but I couldn't find anything there yet is someone looking at out for the ACLU so somebody we're gonna have to reach out to them yeah EDD that worked for me was doing that for me he anything back yet them again tomorrow right so we're in the process we'll wrap this up and by the next me what Mr SM mentioned was the U New Jersey Division of civil rights that might be an excellent resource because the state does not charge you to do things whereas even these other may may offer something are probably going to train you you charge you rather well let's look for somebody that won't charge us and I think the public does let's look who is going to do the looking the administration Administration okay that's that's what that's not what we understood at the last I need a 90 minute but what I do think would be valuable is a half hour for here at at conference agenda for the public and for us can I make another comment um so and just so the public knows also that that evening and sitting at home and listening to these outside agitators that uh busted into our meeting you know you're you're hearing right off the bat you know you're you're hearing the the uh first person that came on that was suspect and the address was 10 guest on street they said they were speaking for the uh the school and right away I know that address I'm thinking to myself that is um the Renta house where all the seniors live so you know this is somebody supposed from the high school so I I knew that was a red flag and then you know so we might have been a little preoccupied another address that came up was a $5 million house for sale in thewell and park because as these people are coming on I'm Googling addresses saying what's going on here this these it just doesn't sound right so I apologize for not jumping in sooner on some of these because I was you know Googling and doing some due diligence when these odd statements uh started and then all a sudden it was like boom it came out of their mouths and uh and it was just crazy so I hopefully this was a fluke it will not happen again because we've all learned from this lesson but my recommendation uh would be for the council president you don't mind me making a recommendation but I would recommend that uh let's give the administration two more weeks to see what they could come up with and if nothing transpires uh at the next meeting if you feel the need if my co few of my colleagues feel the need for training then get just get the training done I just whispered that to him give two weeks yeah so I'm fine with that I I do I just but if it's any more than that that a I'm gonna tell you I think that's expensive I think it's something at like 200 a person right is more reasonable um um but again we you know I'm not going to I'm going to pick and choose my battles here but I because I'm never going to deny if you feel the need that you need training on something so um I'm not well it's not just me I I think what we went through is a a an opportunity for us to learn and grow um as difficult as it was I think it's an opportunity for us to learn and grow clearly um others don't share that they or at least the urgency I'm not talking about you councilwoman I haven't been more effective in um asserting leadership or getting folks to understand um the nuances of this issue and having us uh conduct ourselves differently uh um you know honestly we're in this spot it's these are self-inflicted wounds in many cases um and the way we're conducting ourselves in this chamber uh I really hope it doesn't come back to bite us uh and I mean that sincerely so um Mr abbit um Mr smeraldo uh please continue um the work that began I I saw the email I think it was today or maybe yesterday um uh to to find someone that can do it for free or less um but we do need we do need some better tools and understanding this some of us couldn't even answer a basic question about whether the n-word is Free Speech or hate speech uh so we clearly need some training all right um we we do need to get a cannabis workshop on our calendar um I spoken with some of my colleagues clearly it's going to need to be on a Saturday are there any suggestions or I'm available next Saturday the 16th or I mean this Saturday I'm not I can't do this Saturday I'm not I'm gonna be tire pressed for any Saturday yeah me too I'm gonna be down the shore a lot on Saturdays um what is the purpose of the Cannabis Workshop I don't understand so that we can so that we can address the ordinance right well I'm not for changing the ordinance I I believe I fought hard to get that ordinance the way it was and so did a lot of the other people who want that ordinance and I'm not for changing it so I think the four is enough are there recommendations on amendments for the ordinance because you know I'm I'm in order to I'm fine with the ordinance as is as well so if there's recommendation that right just come up with the recommendation yes I mean is there a lot of recommendations or is there so how are we going to so here's what we've discussed so far we have a blanket number of licenses across all categories there are pensies there are cultivators there are manufacturers there are delivery consumption uh wholesalers not in West Orange we didn't those are the categories didn't approve all those categories those are the it does councilwoman can we just one night can we not fight can we just one night be one night there are multiple types of licenses and instead of having four across all the categories what we've discussed and agreed all of us agree we should be clear about how many licenses we have per category even if the number is zero can I give you history on because from sitting on a task force okay so let I just want to go back to my just some my new Co my the newer colleagues realize so I was the only one that was on the task force so when the task force started and we started trying to Define what what we were going to do with um the number of uh of retail versus cultivation we were strategic knowing that we didn't want to take too many retail in because we want to save room for the cultivator because obviously that would be produce more revenue for the township and that's why we approved the two cultivators what H but the one issue was at the time the information was the state isn't going to approve all these applicants so we started approving more letters thinking they were going to get denied and what started happening was the state was approving everyone and at that point in time that's when I believe Council woman uh garpa and garper Michael came on to the council and we started saying whoa like the Count's getting high and even you know that's why we limited at the four because if we were to lose any so now we're in a position where at four if all four retail wind up opening and you do get the one cultivator because because there's one in planning board now you're at five so you're still over the four and that was the reason why we had the limit and we were trying to be strategic at the time saying okay because there was a lot more retailers that could have came in but we didn't want to do that because we wanted to leave space for the ma the cultivator one one second one second one second so no so so with that now we are at five four well we're at four we're at five we have two floating out there that we get to get a handle on so technically we're we still have seven possibilities but one is a and one is a cultivator and we have a new business looking to come in as a cultivator only one one second councilwoman councilwoman govern Michael so my issue is and I've mentioned this in the past I never support it limiting it to four I supported us putting a number to each C category um again cultivation I don't understand why we would want to limit cultivation to begin with where it's zoned where people could play you know rent or buy to place the cultivation a cannabis farm or entity it's limited and where it can go in town so why would we limit free money I mean that's exactly what my Council colleague Council Williams spoke about what only one one second one second cancel one second one at a time so for me it's really important that I would support lifting the moratorium for a cultivation so we can go ahead and get other entities to apply and again it's saying I don't know why we'd say no to free money which we so desperately need that we could use for enforcement for Zoning for whatever police or whatever it is equipment so I just want to remind us that there was a process to each of the lenses types were opening up so the reason why we didn't do everything at once is because there was dispensaries opening then it was cultivation that came online so it wasn't like we had a freefor all for anyone who wanted to do cultivation and dispensary coming to us at the same time we approved those entities on the first go round because they were only dispensaries then cultivation opened up and we got more appliations that you all considered and then some of those happened to be cultivators but it wasn't that the cultivation came online at the same time as the dispensary um it was staggered one at a time so so um where we where what I what we talked about this is prior to uh councilwoman Scarpa and gbra Michael joining the council when we put the moratorium in which was at the end of the year right before they joined the council um the public discussion at that time at least from me was we need to be clear about you know one how many we want what's the right number two how many we want by category cultivators and manufacturers have a different impact on the quality of life than dispensaries or consumption lounges and clearly we don't have we haven't done the work to to say we don't want consumption lounges at all we've just limited the number of licenses and I I think the township at least all of the folks that have spoken with me about it are let other people let other towns have consumption lounges if that's the sentiment we should have it in the ordinance we want zero consumption licenses if if well we did that we did identify that the task force we didn't want consumption but it's not an ordinance but it's not in the ordinance we don't so that's yes so we have to put that so and and and it's it's to amend the ordinance so and I and so it's very interesting I mean I think last year we had more meetings and got less done than any other time and now we have an opportunity to actually deal deal with a problem that is right before us um and we're coming into budget season what the administration is aware of and what we should be aware of is this is probably going to be a tough budget year so to not deal with the problem and then potentially especially given the situation that we're facing with one who is so prepared um to forego that Revenue to foro that opportunity that which could provide some relief to our budget as we're coming into the budget season and Mr gross true to his word is so far says we're going to be on on target we need to have some clarity we're going to have to do that work now going to the Shore Council is not more important than getting this ordinance done no I didn't I said I don't feel that I want to see or any other thing on Saturday got I did not say I could not do a meeting I said I am not it's gonna be hard for me to do a Saturday so another of changing the ordinance to more than four you have amend propose them but I I think we should see the one that goes in and see the effect it has on the neighborhood before we start putting another one it's it's there's zero impact on cultivation to the neighborhood if it's done properly well we don't know that we don't know if it's going to be done properly well that's why we have a planning process that's what the ORD is yes that's what each it it's a cycle that every stage of the way has to be vetted and the planning department is the one who will Implement all those conditions to make sure that they are a good neighbor to the community that is not something that is not something that this body has the the ability to do a staged process so something else we talked about at the task force at the time in in Council meetings is you know you you don't want to limit numbers but then you know like it's just like anything else you have so many hair and nail salons on Main Street yet they kind of take away from each other's businesses so you don't want to have too many retail because there so we're good manufacturing we're good with the for retail then I think should that let's put it in the ordinance that's not four licenses it's we have no more than four dispensaries okay right and then we we were talking about if we're talk about CHS well we have two cultivators right now one that is in the wind and one that is a dispute on the actual address so if we have if we have and and so one we're going to revoke are we going to revoke that one we can't say we're going to we have to give them opportunity so if if Mr James Aro is going to give us a let's just focus on this are we I I think we need a um a because it has to be done in public I've gotten pushed back think people have requested that we just do it by email or send in these amendments when I when that was said before people were like oh you we can't do it that way so either we're going to do this work in public and have a a public meeting where we actually debate these issues and then codify it give the administration give the legal department something that they can write up for us that we can vote on um or we're not and and then we'll just leave it as it is th those are our our two options um Mr jengar I'm going to come to you in a moment with the the the question councilwoman Cina well the reason why I'm pushing to revoke that is is and won't know after this meeting when this young lady talks to uh uh Mr Jenaro that you know if there's a lease somebody has a lease on 76 we have to revoke that address if somebody else has a signed lease of support for 76 I just looked it up I I saw the applications when the planning board meeting happened last week and someone called me and ask me a question and um and they've had it since April 26 of 2022 so it will be coming on two years that we' given them yeah but if somebody else has a link support but if somebody else has a a a Bonafide lease and is paying a lease on 76 that nuli not only should it nullify but hold on one second hold on one second councilwoman that that is a separate issue though whether or not we revoke uh a letter of support that's a separate issue from address no but it frees up an ENT a new entity and then we can make the decision I don't agree with that so yeah that's not because there are only four right even if we revoke those two oh we'd have to change the historically there historically because I was on a task force along with councilman calino there were four full what I like to call full scale licenses yes and there was unlimited micro and that's how you ended up at seven so and we were told at the time that we couldn't limit micro which was we found out later was not accurate I I didn't tell you that I know you didn't tell me that I know we told us that I won't say told Mis information we could limit it and that's why put in the ordinance I thought it was for social Equity piece that we didn't want to limit it that was well that's the information that we got but it ended up not being accurate now to to the person who gave it uh the information to us to that person's credit a lot of those rules were fluid at the time so maybe that's what was communicated and it changed subsequently who knows but we ended up in that position so now we've got to figure out how to get out of it right and that's going to require a change to the ordinance now if if you if we present the ordinance as it is on there's nothing there's nothing to present because we're not making a change so we have to give them the the changes to then represent and introduce on first reading yes and then Mr Jenaro what you may do if you want is to do a virtual Workshop so you can do it from the com from your own home you could limit your time you could limit your time to two hours and you could have multiple sessions you know instead of saying this is going to take eight hours to do do two hours every Wednesday for three or four week I totally agree and this could be virtual for sure no public comment because it's a workshop but they have they have to be able to watch it right they join Mr Fagan right but there has to be one second before we do that Mr jengar just to answer all the previous questions from earlier in the meeting and I did have the opportunity to speak to Mr ell outside Miss Ardell sorry um and so I spoke with Mr Moon as well even if we we can do the revocation of the two and I believe the two that we're all referring to are chemistry is one of them that spend quot in the wind and the other one is blue peace peace of mind thank you peace of mind and so uh with regard they're two separate processes in order to revoke them just because of where we're at with both so for chemistry we gave them an opportunity to cure their application but it's been the time so with that one we can do a resolution to revoke it with um Peace of Mind it would just be a separate resolution doing the same thing but there's no um requirement from what I'm told to get not one one second are you done Mr Jingo yeah that's all okay and the same uh echoing of the problem even if you were to revoke the two the four it still listen in the ordinance is four so be stuck regardless thank you Council um just looking at the the chart and I wanted to just push this out here and see if there's any consent Peace of Mind construction was a cultivation manufacturing we have not heard from them since April 26 of 2022 would anybody be absolutely and adamantly opposed to not necessarily lifting the moratorium but allowing another cultivator to come in as a substitution we can't the ordinance yeah we can't your ORD your current ordinance prudes that so we would absolutely have to lift the moratorium and then if we lifted the moratorium is there any requirement that we have to do an open process since we already know that there is someone who will have to be open um okay but can I have the legal department respond is there any way we can do this without having to do completely I'll defer to legal on that I don't know the answer to that I'd have to double check but I would have I think that it has to be open but I I have to go double check that I don't want to say for sure sure we we cannot be in the business of picking winners and losers so and it would I would expect the law will require us to have an open process that doesn't mean that Miss hardell or whoever who is prepared and ready once that window opens because again just like we did the last time whoever when they submit their applications that's going to dictate when they get their review and potentially their letter or get rejected and and cultivators have to be in the eyes zone right yes very very limited inventory Miss hardell has she has a space in an eyesone so I don't think she would have a lot of competition and that was one of the things that the task force that you both were on valuable was site control at the time and that was actually one of the issues that was used against one of the applicants who claimed to have site control but really didn't they had a letter of interest so Council and and speaking to that point and and what happens with these applications and chief chief you know this because we've gone through few of them a secured lease so I my question illegal is if we were to open it up could it be for anyone who has a secured a secured property we secured location couldn't that be something that we could actually put as a requirement and not in our ordinance but even if we were to lift the moratorium for cultivation we could put as a restriction that you have to be um licensed by the state before before we would come back and give you a letter of support it would limit the people who are new and just wanting to enter into the game and the process if we have people who are already ready to go hold on one second because councilwoman GB Michael yeah I know she got jumped in so councilwoman okay so with regarding to peace of mind my understanding is they never had a lease it was a letter of tent and a termination was sent I think from the landlord and my understanding is that Miss hardell has assigned lease at 76 so historically the reason everybody had letters of intent was we did not on the task force want to make potential cannabis whether they're regardless of cultivation or what especially the micros commit to getting a lease and then maybe not getting license and have to pay all that rent got to remember a lot of this was micro social Equity so imagine if we said to these people you got to go get a lease and you got to pay rent and a year from now when we tell you you know you got a license sometimes nobody want to do that sometimes did that they did but we did councilwoman celino so because here here's my situation I really don't want to I'm nervous to reopen this up I feel for Miss uh Cardell I I I would consider just opening up for that one site IL legally I don't know if we can or cannot do that that's fair um because once because I've been there done this once we open it up then we're gonna have all this pressure of five more applicants coming to us and we're going to expand and becomes and it's a political year this year well that's why we should do the workshop that way it it absolves us of all of that this is what the LA political year and there's more local people in town looking to open up these sites and and everybody you know so so I I I just like to take revisit it next year after the uh the election uh that's number one number you you say that but again we haven't we don't know what we don't know we still don't have one location open yet not one of these have opened yet uh cultivation you went down then you saw that's a big operation that's a really big operation well financed we don't know and and you went on the DAT that they knew you were coming I'm going unannounced when I pop down there because that that's why well I could go outside and smell it because I've heard they smell yeah so they so that's another thing so we got to make sure we have mechanisms in place that and and I know that the investor is going to do everything they can not to make sure it smells but we need mechanis in place because you have an apartment there with a lot of children living across the street you have a playground right there on that corner right and we and that's why on the task force and I'm glad I appreciate at the time where you have to the delivery trucks have to go in the Park Avenue entrance so it doesn't interfere with the school bus drops offs and all the activity that goes in the park you know this isn't a very you know this neighborhood you know these kids you know they're outside all hours they're it it's it's not fair to even though they're in industrial Zone there's still many families living in that neighborhood and we should treat them as if they were in any one of our neighborhoods councilwoman Williams so uh to your point councilwoman that's something that um when mistress moraldo and I went down that we that was our takeaway um is that the landscape of where we were in Lambertville is absolutely not the same as West Orange um and that's what I stated earlier on the record is that mechanism of control is a planning board mechanism of control and the planning board will issue conditions because this is a new industry that will regulate the Oder and it is within their purview and control um that they can say if there is a complaint from a neighbor that I mean they can they can create whatever mechanisms they want want but they can also Implement something that says if there's a complaint that the uh entity has 30 days to remediate and if that means they have to go out and get another unit um HVAC unit so that that smell is not imminent in the air they have to do whatever they have to be good neighbors and I think we're utilizing our discussion here from a premise that we don't own the control and we do every step of this minp has the mechanism of control for this industry so again I think it's just the understanding of who can dictate what or who can order what so again this body what we should be really focused on is not necessarily saying because even when we look at the isone and cultivation and Manufacturing it's self-contained it's limited because we only have so much space I almost think it's kind of being too um egregious to say well we only want three more uh uh cultivators we may not even have space for three more cultivators so even if we open it back up I think also what has to be done at the same time is an inventory assessment we don't want to open it up and then there's nowhere for anyone else to go so there's so many pieces of why this is important I do agree you know we were we're on task and Mission to get out early we're going ahead with our discussion tonight and what we're realizing is that there're too many missing pieces so I support a workshop I can't do a workshop on a Saturday um but I would love for us to be able to do a two-hour virtual Workshop um so that we can identify what we're willing to allow yeah so the only request I had is that we put one on those that I spoke to said they would prefer a set so we can do it at any time please make a recommendation that is next Wednesday week night no um on next Wednesday and there is I have I have my downtown meeting what time do that starts so next week is really tough for me yeah I if we could go into maybe the um the 27th that's the Saturday I mean we our next meeting is on the 26th our next council meeting so want to see is there any possibility we can get even a 90 minute if we can reduce it down to 90 minute on the 21st is everybody available on the 21st for 90 minutes if we do it during the middle of the day I can't do it that night okay can we do it we reduce it maybe to an hour with a specific agenda I could do 5 to 6:30 um and do 90 minutes that way or can you do five I can do 5:15 to 6 45 2 to I have a seven that's so I can do it at noon I can do it you know we can do 12 to1 on um I can do that on Thursday the 21st can we do 12 12 to one can you do 12 to one no well one to two yeah one to two can you do one to two on the 21 she's in school April we're going back to March March we in March oh it's a Thursday yeah oh yeah that works okay so she yes can you do one to two uh are you school I'm in school I hate to do that for my school computer I don't think it's no it's not you can't you should I have no I don't want to do no she a laptop with you no she cannot no no her no I I'd like to do after can we go back to 5 to 6:30 I can do 5 to 6:30 4:30 want to do 4:30 can you do 4:30 I 430 40 4:30 to 6 can you do 4:30 to 6 on the 2 first five's better for me on because you have the baby yeah I got the baby let's an hour and do five six six I could put we don't need that more I'm just all right so put Miss Rachel so we're looking at five to six on the 21st um Madam clerk is that that's enough time for us to notice can we um identify Mr Fagan can you [Music] um thank you can we identify the parts of the ordinance yeah that we want to address at this meeting so that we can already have it okay thank you trying to get us organized thank you zero I have here zero consumption uh licenses um putting in right now so LIC categories license categories two cultivation I think it should be more than two we can we can that's let's let's start with the what may pass and then yeah we're gonna do it on that four I would put four retail well let's let's let's yeah we can do that part there let's just go over the things in the ordinance that we want to address so the the different uh CL yeah so the license categories categories the moratorium has to be lifted for cultivation and how yeah cultivation um Mr Jenaro can you circulate the Cannabis ordinance to us please yes ready second no I was about say my computer's not working yeah so those the only issues that we want to address is the moratorium on cultivation the license categories um cultivation and Manufacturing is it cultivation and Manufacturing okay is that the same no it's not the same manufacturing where they package everything and it gets shipped out cultivation is where they just grow it and yes and and Manufacturing is where they harvest it they may turn it into a vape they may turn it into a gummy we should have um some language regarding I'm not these stagnant licenses I mean stagnant letters um Mr Jenaro Mr rabbit um are we able to capture or to put into this ordinance some language that requires a response from uh uh an entity that gets a letter of support um if they don't respond by a certain time or don't you know meet whatever those requirements are by a certain time that see why not okay I think you may also be able to govern the number of the different licenses by resolution so you could have an ordinance and then you could just have a resolution you ever want to add want double check that brilliant idea then you may be able to do that it that's the only thing we're dealing with is the moratorium lifted on cultivation and Manufacturing discussion and the license categories discussion I'm cultivation or manufacturer I thought it was either or it's two different license categories all right all right are we going to deal with um any of the um consumption issues in Parks I know we have no smoking ordinance but we don't have enforcement on it um I've had you know some conversation with folks about you know they're dropping their kids off at the school and people are smoking or walking around that's a budgetary how would we address that school property should really be enforced by they have no resources do there so but I I do have a question and something scar uh Council Scar and I spoke about on our Drive uh back from tour on Saturday um how is money going to be used to I think we should dictate that also by ordinance um because that's what other municipalities are doing right like what is that money going towards is it our budget well can we do that at a different time I know I'm just I'm just mentioning it because you want to bring it into the ordinance I mean this is that's the appropriate time to to do it mention how so so to that point to that point be coming in well hopefully again but it shouldn't be going to managing this that should be the extra money that the chief was talking about that the the uh businesses get charged for with with maintaining this no we're talking no no she's talking about how many fire trucks are we gonna buy yes that's what she's or using some of that money to help zoning who's desperate for personnel CPW your budget you know you can't yes I know but other municipalities the council have decided how that money is going to be allocated instead of just giving so can we find out Madam Clerk um if there are other municipalities that have mandated how the funds come in in Essex County or any of our surrounding areas can that that are approved cation cultivation or dispensary if we can just find out how they may have thank you there's pros and cons to it because if you stipulate that it's used strictly for Capital zoning you know for um enforcement efforts and hiring inspectors like that's the only thing you can use it for so you know the next requ you'd have to change it every time okay you know now we have enough there we want to hire more cops whereas if it's in your budget Council controls the per string so you get to spend anyway you want anyway yeah I mean it looks it looks you know sexy for us that well look oh look we brought cannabis in and we bought you a new fire truck I mean that looks great for us but the reality is it's it's Revenue it's Revenue just as you like you know we have you know you could use a broad term like public like I'm just public saf which is police Fire EMS uh radios this B I mean you know there's there's big expenses there and that covers a broad spectrum so you're not saying it will only be used to hire more firefighters or only be used to buy a fire truck Adam clerk will you be able to get that information for us before we have the try I'm going to reach out to my CL so we're we're committed 5 o'clock 21st via Zoom hour also gonna ask Mark a piece I sent him AAR inv with ADD asking but I will find out the declines thank you fast is there anything else on the agenda tonight Tre ordinance council president on that day yes yes we need there's um would you speak the council members and perhaps Mr Moon uh no public participation no public participation they can view no comment in person or public meeting be public okay thank you I I have a I have something El on the 21st no no no for pending matters all right so the last thing for me is the tree ordinance um councilwoman Scarpa uh and I worked on that with the environmental Commission Now Green West Orange and um our Forester um and Council mber Michael worked on it earlier all of us have had it look at it at at least at one time or another and we believe uh we have it in a form that um can pass and that the mayor will support so I would like to uh introduce Mr Jenaro was there last night he captured all of the agreed upon points I would like to have that uh introduced uh on first reading at our next meeting and I make that motion a second well before we we jump ahead so my my question is I think it should be you know that you have it together it gets P to our different enforcement like I I assume all stakeholders were involved in this meeting last night but for the ones that weren't I just want to make sure whatever passed in regards to enforcement how Administration is going to you know monitor this all those questions be hashed and and what not or when it comes to us next week because you know the questions I'll be asking I'll turn Administration ask how you enforcing this what is the process so if all those everything was answered that is really awesome but just make sure it's all all was addressed um even if it wasn't though we're going into budget so we would be able to back fill but yeah I I think think all of those and so Mr Jenaro will you um circulate the draft of the tree ordinance that we agreed upon last night uh as soon as it's captured I know it's not I don't expect it to be done by now U but as as soon as it's done is there a a motion to okay I just wanted covered all our well my question my question was because I wanted to make sure staff received it that is um that it affects so want to make sure because next when we get this I always ask the question how is going to be enforced what is the procedure for this ordinance so if somebody takes out a permit who's in charge what's the procedure so all those administrative questions need to be answered you know uh for when we do the passing of it sure so what and what I'll do first is I'll embody what we talked about at the meeting the other day um I'll circulate it to everybody for the first reading but before I do that I'll send it to all the administration members I think everybody's already seen at least the prior versions of it so I'll make sure I Redline it so that everybody can see the difference between what we talked about at the meeting the other night and the current version so I got a question for you with with with what you discussed last night I know the for me not just for me but for you know the the residents you the there was an issue about the property line if you have to notify you want to take down a a tree on your property you have to let all your neighbors know so like we're where're where's that hold on we did you get rid of that we worked on that with the mayor's recommendation theous properties yeah on all sides across the streets if I'm taking down a tree on my property I got my neighbor across the street can I ask why that that's not continuous yeah continuous what what it was before was 200 feet from the property line which would include the people across the street 200 feet on either direction 200 feet behind you right so what the mayor suggested was and I believe it was the mayor's suggestion um wasn't it the mayor suggestion I think so I that's May has spoken positively think you're about to say in P so that would not surprise me so what what the mayor recommended and we modified slightly but not in a significant way what what we ended up with is you have to notify your neighbor on your right and your left the Neighbors in front of you up to three across the street should there be three if you're on a corner the three on the two streets up to if there are three to take one tree down and the people that are on behind you and on your right if you're on the corner okay I'm going to have an issue with I can't well listen you guys no one is going to get everything they want right at this point we've been 200 we've been negotiating now for months we had a very productive meeting we have the tree ordinance in a framework format that the mayor will approve we have at least three votes for it we need to get this part done because we're also dealing with some time constraints if we don't get this done with a a tree replacement chart in the ordinance by some date in April we Lo we forego any potential grants that are related to these trees this is a requirement for us to even apply for those grants so so if we don't do it okay so let me ask you a question I I I want to put a pool in my backyard I want to make make a d I got to take one tree down the guy Street I don't get along with he's gonna say no what happen there's no notification it's just notifying there's noal so the first line let me let me answer the question no no I'm trying to understand it I'm not giv you a hard time let me question this is a situation that you're GNA get an email in two months from a resident all right there's an answer to the question here's hold on here's the answer when the person wants to put in a pool okay they're going to make an application to the Forester to take that down the tree so that they can put in that pool the Forester is going to come out and inspect the tree if it's a healthy tree depending on the size of the lot will determine whether or not what the next step is if they want to take that tree down no matter what size the lot is they're going to have to notify up to six or eight neighbors right all around the property those neighbors have the right within seven days of being notified of of that tree wait I'm sorry they'll be notified immediately those neighbors will be notified immediately the Forester will then make a determination by home are they notified they're notified at the at the Homeowner's uh uh effort and expense yeah that's the big deal the Forester is going to make when he receives that application he's going to make his determination yes you can take it down or no you can't um if they want to take it down for a pool he's not going to tell them no they're going to be able to take that that tree down right if it's a healthy tree they're going to have to replace it with eight small trees they may not be able to put eight trees on their property eight trees for one tree little small so small yes do you know where I live how small it doesn't have to be on their property they can pay the fun listen to the rest of it that's the tree fund though right they don't have to put all eight on their can we see this before can we need to see this they're going to like why what is the heart listen read it then just read it right so so here's I make a motion I'm enough let's get this on for the if you don't like it vote against it can I just jump in there council president maybe diffuse this so I have not seen this and I've have not discussed it with the mayor the way this works if you remember the mayor's got to put this on where you need four votes put it on yourselves so I can talk to her tomorrow and see where that's at but but well if we don't get four votes tonight then we'll have to talk to the mayor here here's the thing yes it's eight trees if and it's if you take down a tree that's 30 inches or greater right so if you take down a giant tree that's soaking up 200 plus gallons of water a day you have to plant eight two and a half inch trees now they're going to grow they're not going to stay two and a half inches you may not have the space on your property took place eight trees what you do that's what the tree fund is for you can place them wherever the Forester agrees you put the tree fund back in it the tree fund is in there okay because I thought well last time it was out was in the treun was in last time and what we did was we modified it so it's no longer for one acre or smaller it's three4 of an acre or smaller uh Lots can take advantage of the tree funds so I I can't I can't fit the eight trees how much is that GNA cost me the if you can't it won't you won't even have to pay into the tree fund if you pay for those eight trees the Forester will then place them in someone else's someone else's C again not giving you a hard time when I'm online in shock right someone's going to ask me these questions the process though time out for a second time out for a second the we're not we're not solving God bless you we're not solving that tonight we're not changing it tonight we're not debating it tonight what we're deciding is if we're going to do any of that at all the the question on the floor is do we introduce this or not that's it if we want to introduce it and have these conversations and further negotiate then we can if we don't want to introduce it then we don't well we just heard that the mayor has to introduce it or it takes four votes or has four votes all right so I got to look at it so I need to look at it because I I I'm objecting we have a motion in a second so I need to do a roll call so just before all right we're going to take the vote sure um Mr Mr rabbit um are you aware of the time frames that we're dealing with I am not Mr Jenaro are you aware of the time frames that we're dealing with I am more okay there and so if we don't get this done by the uh second by the second meeting in April what is the implication this so I have to look into the exact implications of it but the state strongly recommended that the ordinance be passed by may I believe it's May one I can look into and send you over where that language is coming from so you can see what the implications are so that way we're all on the same page here and hopefully that means we push this through a little bit quicker but so it's my understanding that we we will not be able to apply for any of these green type grants if we don't have our tree replacement chart in that ordinance by May 1 which means unless we're gonna have a special meeting it has to be done by the second meeting in April I believe that's correct but I just want to double check but I believe that that's happening right so so listen if we don't put it on tonight right and there any challenges between now and our next meeting and we don't get it put on again if anyone raises their hand and says hey we want to change this we want to change that if we don't do it we're going to run out of time and then the money that we could get to replant and replace trees we won't get we won't even be able to apply for there are multiple different grants it's not just one Grant you can't apply for any of those in that category no I get I just curious how much the grants are why why is it ult for us to again if even though there are changes you're asking for us to agree to put something on that we haven't seen I'm already have some objections to some of the things that you all have just preliminarily discussed so again part of this for me is and my challenge is it's notification period contiguous does not mean across the street and quite frankly if I'm across the street from someone and I take a tree off my yard we got a whole street in between where water run off and the rest of that stuff it's in my yard It's contained on my property so I am not supporting having to notify someone who does not directly impact my property across the street has nothing to do with me T taking a tree down I just no no we're gonna be in decency and in order we're going to be in decency in order I will call on you next so the science absolutely contradicts what you're saying councilwoman the science contradicts that Council councilwoman G Michael has the the microphone I was just going to say that if if you're not in suppor then why not just remove notifying the neighbors across the street and just notifying to the left to the right and behind us and then we can but can I see can I see you're asking me to support something that I already have objections to and the problem is that when we put things on like this that's all supposed to already be circulated so what is what is work last night work and again Mr jengar hold on excuse me for a second excuse me no I I have the microphone I'm I'm listen to interrupt me just because woman you have decided that you want to make these as disruptive counterproductive process it's not disruptive give me an opportunity continue continue thank you you're welcome please please my point is simply that this is not the policy and or the procedure that we utilize we're putting something on the agenda that I haven't had a chance to review and you're asking me to agree to it I don't agree okay you don't agree are you done now yes okay so your mayor which you have supported wholeheartedly enthusiastically every step of the way is the one who asked us to do it okay so and she did that I think she's your May too she did that not because of her own political or any other reasons she did it because there are requirements from the state of New Jersey with regard to this particular ordinance and if we don't meet them then we just forego the opportunity to apply for Grants I'm not done what we're what I'm asking us to do if Mr J we we had the meeting on Monday night that was as quickly as we could get people together from the environmental commission I think there were five people from the environmental commission there uh our West Orange Our Town Forester and two Council people so we coordinated calendars to make sure that we could all be present at the same time and deal with this in real time and we did and I will say and I think Mr Jenaro will agree and I think councilwoman Scara will agree it was a very productive meeting it went three hours we handled every single issue and we found a way to compromise unfortunately or fortunately no one left getting everything they wanted we all had to give something in order to come to an agreement and we did that because that was the request and the requirement based on the state of New Jersey so if you don't want to vote for it don't vote for it I I just want to be clear what what we're trying to do what I'm trying to do is get the work done and it seems like every step of the way if there's something that I suggest there are certain members of this Council that are going to push back against it I find that objectionable in and of itself and I think we need to get to the work and actually be productive and not not deal with any of the foolishness councilwoman so um I do agree that we it is important to get this to vote on this tonight to get it on for the next meeting as Mr jenero mentioned he's going to try and circulate it to us within the next couple of days to review if we have any issues we can always you know talk about it and and and get to the administration but you know Mr burwin even mentioned that it is important while it may not be a perfect or it's a good one and I don't think we should miss out the opportunity on grants um we can always make amendments like we are doing now with cannabis right so any ordinance any pce legislation is has the opportunity to have it revised so um in the sake of time and the constraints and you know listening to what Mr Berwin said and and this is a compromise this ordinance was drafted with compromise from many different parties I think it's important that we do vote for for it tonight and we always have an opportunity to vote Yes or no when it comes before us um and and my my comment on TR or is there I just want to explain that one of the reasons for that contiguous for uh telling more neighbors what's happening is because many of the people who are moving in don't understand the flooding problems we have in West Orange they don't understand the value of the root systems of those trees so we wanted it to be an educational opportunity for the Forester to go there and to explain to all of the neighbors why it's important and hopefully one of them would take some of those trees if the person couldn't fit it all on their property so that that I think is an important education piece and why it needs to be like that so and and so I if we can get it on understanding that and then if you feel there's too many too many steps we can reach out to Mr J Jenaro and maybe modify but that's the thinking behind are joh question about notifying the neighbors um why is it that that cost falls on the resident if they're paying for the permit fee I'm just asking if this is just cuur curiosity if they paying a permit fee which isn't cheap I mean what's postage 75 cents dollar whatever it is has register return return register okay so then why wouldn't the administration as part of that cost be able to send it out we don't have the so so the the the answer though that is a that's a question that was asked not last night but it was asked before um there's a $100 fee for the permit for residents it's $1,000 for developers excuse me it the the $100 fee is for the permit they're going to have to notify up to8 neighbors it could be as many as eight based on and it's not contiguous that was the the language that was used before what we're doing now are the people across the street one on the right or or the left and who's behind you behind you within a sorry to cut you off I just wondering is it behind you within a certain distance because if someone's like someone's house is further away would you no it's only who's touching and the only reason we're not using contiguous is because if if you're you're going to have an across the street neighbor no matter where you live so um the folks across the street are not contiguous the road blocks it they they're going to be notified as well it's up to eight if it's even $5 it's 40 bucks if we're taking down trees we have a canopy according to Mr Berwin that we've already just decimated right we' we're at 27% now and we were at 30% about five years ago which means we've lost three percentage points or 10% of our canopy in five years and we're headed down to 15% based on the the the trend that we're on so the storms are bigger they're dropping more water the winds are more violent without the trees those root systems soaking up the water holding the ground in these Hills we're going to continue to have really difficult challenges with water so and we've got to replace it we've got to replant that's that's why it was done that way Cil so so I totally respect the urgency and and all all the issues with it because it it makes me sad like when the you know Public Service comes in and does Edward S Scissor Hands down down your street so but it but what my fear is and the reason why I'm challenging it to make not to give you a hard time councilman but to to make sure that it's done in a way where people are going to respect the process and do the process because the few instances we had where people came in and just abused the system is because they don't want to be bothered going through all these steps so then they're going to go in and they're going to take down 10 trees and it's going to be too late so so that's what I'm trying to prevent because I've you know been around a while I've seen that happen multiple times and those are the situations where you know it's not the guy putting in the pool and taking down one tree it's it's the person that totally comes in and abuses everything and it's also education as councilwoman said big piece you know we could have this really really strong ordinance but if we don't put what the final copy is in that July 1 tax bill and get it out there so everybody sees it because we all read our tax bills so whenever we have something really really important mayor should do a letter Dear Community guess what we have the strongest tree ordinance around and we changed it and you're going to get fined and that has to be out there because you know new residents come in we get a lot of new residents lately they they don't they don't know about the tree ordinance and they're gonna and they're going to get Fin and they're going to be freaking out uh then there's going to be some folks that will just ignore the process and and take the fine so that's why I'm just trying to make it a little more I get what you're trying to do and why but at the same time I don't want it to work against us where we get people that are just going to come down because they're not going to want to be bothered with this crazy process all of that were all of that was addressed last night okay um for for from a residential stand standpoint from a developer standpoint um and also with regard to the education um one of the things Mr burwind uh has agreed to do is uh put uh similar to the graphics he did today help create one for new residents we can certainly drop it in with their welcome packets from our Realtors um but also posted on the website um there's this was there is it is not it it is a very robust ordinance um and it all of those kinds of considerations at least the ones that have been addressed in here tonight were addressed last night and or prior iterations of the ordinance someone else want to add something I just thought maybe we can give in the public relations group in that's not that's they could do some work on that you know not well we we talked about social media should be we talked about social media um Realtors uh town website um and and some other spaces that the town has control over yeah we can make recommendations on the public relations commission for that that's not an issue but again I'm just I'm just a realist um so yeah so if we look at this the I would I would say you want to Hash it out next meeting however I like we could always take a straw vote on that during the week I rather know that administration's going to be ready for all of these questions otherwise we're going to sit here put on first reading and ask questions and it's going to go out the window so I had this conversation with um Mr brick the um I guess he's the chair of the environmental commission en uh earlier today uh this afternoon he and I spoke for about 30 40 minutes um and and this was after he had um spoken with the administration um particularly the mayor so um and I think Mr Abbott has gotten some conversation had some conversation with her or I haven't seen this draft that you worked on last night and I and I have not had any conversations at all well the mayor came and stood right here um and and thanked me for the work last night I think she thank I think the mayor is going to have a is going to be willing to have a tree ordinance for you on at the next if that helps you move tonight past whether or not you have three or four votes I think she'll have an ordinance now you probably know better than I do whether it will be this ordinance that you're trying to move forward right now I haven't seen it I haven't talked to her about it so I can't speak for her but if she if you're telling me she's in favor of it I don't see why she wouldn't want it on mayor definitely understands that we need a stronger trade ordinance there's no doubt about that right she made public comment about it tonight when she addressed this so it's been uh properly moved and second it so I think we should vote again if it's a if if the majority of the count super majority says yes and read the ordinance and decide it's a no then you can votee now I think we're wasting a Ely way too much time back and forth on this to be honest so you can offer an a minut please take vote Madam clerk thank you councilwoman celino I'm gonna abstain because i' rather strug vote it and see what's what in the next couple days and get a pair of eyes on it I don't want to commit now to say not to say that I wouldn't but and then we table it and then we get the public up said I just want to make sure we're ready and if the mayor told me tonight oh yeah it's going to be on she didn't say that oh it's going to be on the next agenda it may very well be but I don't want I want Administration to be ready to be able to answer all these questions and make a full presentation on it councilwoman gber Michael yes I'm not hearing that from the chief councilwoman Scarpa yes councilwoman Williams no council president Rutherford yes okay now in a couple days I could St I could support straw voting if they're all ready well the mayor's just going to put it on herself I mean maybe she won't maybe she'll change her mind based on what happened here tonight who knows uh those are the things that I wanted to address in new business uh pinning matters um anything else before we yes uh so for the chief Mr smdo um Garbage Contract where we at with that the uh Wayne you know Wayne's are Consulting on that to Wayne to fail and we're just waiting for the uh the bids they not wait to do back quite yet I think it was April 16th April 16th okay uh council president asked that question uh by email and he's given that date so we'll once we get them you'll you'll know we'll put everything together and give you what the options are um one of the things we do have to I have to ask to consider is is picking a date for an ABC hearing um there's a a notice period for that so you may not be able to just colleages please pull out your cance period um 60 days 60 days I think it's 60 days so we would be looking at May picking a date in May okay and and and we have to make sure the our ABC special counsel who prosecutes this is available but not only that push Witnesses got well that's why you have the 60-day notice right so that you can get people can gives us some time is everybody usually good on a Monday night no Mondays don't work for me at all or Tuesdays um how about Wednesday the 22nd that's right before Memorial Day weekend or after on Wednesday the 29th um can we just motive oh no I'm I'm in March May 22nd or the 29th can you go back to the uh parties and find out which date is better well the problem is I don't know who the parties are because it's it's attorneys it's Witnesses it's the people themselves that are being charged it's we just need to give them a date one date I don't know how it works I don't know well let's give them if is everybody available on the 22nd I am not oh on the 29th are you available um I think I am I'm not how about Wednesday the 30th th I'm sorry Thursday the 30th um that evening so I'm not available uh that week do we have a council meeting that week counc meeting 21st the 21st yeah so I yeah um yeah I'm not a I mean I could do and the problem is f the spring no never mind I need a five minute recess bio break you guys can continue to deliberate on how about uh Wednesday June 5th I was GNA say you could go to June I mean it's just it's more about getting it scheduled than anything else okay um how about um we need to go later in the month how about June 19th on Wednesday June 19th yeah that works for me that's June that's Jun no it's I mean it is but it's not a holiday it it might be for the it's not for the state the date is the 21st no I'm saying for the township the state of New Jersey is celebrating on the 21st but the town the state the town is follow the state the count is off so I need to ask Madam carus these these do these Town Hall meetings that Council president's talking about they have to be noticed if more than three of us are there yeah yeah how you gonna get people there well not what are you talking about well no because I mean we also have to schedule uh budget meetings like how are we gonna have all these meetings when we love no no it's our schedule it's our schedules is you know saying we don't follow State we just yeah all right so we're not here the 19th I mean Town Hall Clos yeah you might have people complain that celebrate that day that might mean something important to them and say that why are you doing that I stick away from June 19th okay so about it's actually contractual for our employees so if we were to change St the day off we would need to negotiate that no we don't need Thursday the 20th the 20th of June is it Thursday yeah I'm available um so wait when is graduation the 21st no it may be the 20th it might be the 20th I was getting ready to say I think graduation is the 20th yeah prior to that June 6 six or 13 what to 13 uh June I can do June 6 I have an open space commission but they'll understand okay let's do June six yeah check so when are we going to need to do a budget meeting too I don't know that yet we have to well that's what I mean like you well we were these meeting we need them for Budget meetings no we just have to add stuff I mean we're I mean we got to do what we got to do yeah yeah you're gonna get all five of us at all we have to do this ABC hearing it's been we've been putting this ABC hearing off for two years yeah no that we have to do so budget hearing we have to do yeah that's these other meetings so so what was the date you June 6 Thursday Thursday June 6 councilman are you AV does that work for you is there aoun at 500m then I can get to open space because it's Monday the 10 he said this was gonna be long yeah I was say it can't be on the 10th the 10th of June is a Monday so it might be on the 11th no it's a Monday there are some Monday meetings here because of everything going on with a bunch of different oh that's not even on June 6 all right for the special ABC hearing what timee Monday well no actually it's a Thursday um how much time do we need to allocate a lot yeah we might not even get like five hours six hours yeah it's a trial like an eight hour council meeting it's a trial so th Thursday's a tough for Mee day Monday June 3 I cannot do Mondays at all especially because we have a counseling that following Monday and we said Wednesday June 5th wasn't available it's and we can't do a Saturday right not for this well who do you need who do you need attorneys come in well they don't mean here they said yeah I'm on oh oh so so is mral so June 12th Wednesday June 12th I am willing that's two days after the council meeting on Monday is everybody available on June 12 yeah that works for me all right let's do June 12th book it cook it put it in the dock what time in the evening or do you guys want to do during the day no we have to do no you have to do it have you have people coming in people coming in okay so five o'clock on June 12 thank you no I can't do five 5:30 um just one second I I should yeah I'm okay by then yeah I can I can do 5:30 5:30 on June 12 the sooner you get started the better explain to me why the six didn't work he's not available okay sorry sorry my bad I didn't yeah to him is that it do we have any more business coordinate get Witnesses yeah so I was asking about these Town Halls you want to have do you have the dates because now we have all these other meetings scheduled budget meetings um so how many you plan on having so there are multiple you don't have to go to all of them no but here's the thing so you're gonna have them we're all gonna want to go to them we all should either we all divy them up and or we should all be entitled to hear what our residents are saying so so the proposed dates are four they're all third mostly they're Wednesdays and Thursdays 411 4:18 wa wait a second so so you know the dates already they just I'm not sure that they've been informed okay 411 418 425 59 that's once a month okay 5:15 522 and 65 can I ask question wait 65 is a planning board you 5:15 and what's the date after 5:15 522 so what's staff members are going to be there so where because that's not fair to do to to the to to the staff to make them their their presence is up to them there's no the only reason I'm going to I'm doing it this way so that we don't we can have more than three council members present uh or three or more council members present uh that's it uh if if you want to come come if you don't want to come don't come if if the chief wants to come come if you want to come to this one come to this one you don't want go to that one don't go to that yeah but but see you do this and these are a lot of meetings in a short period of time we all have are other board meetings and stuff that can conflict and let's let's call this what this is It's election year for so so this great opportunity for for all involved but again it's like forget that aspect like to have staff come out to all these meetings I don't think is fair I'm not asking staff to come out here here's here's what was when it was brought to to me when it was asked of me it was asked in a specific way the question that was presented at that microphone was can we do this again we did one we stopped rest of the Town didn't get a chance to to to weigh in so I want you guys to do it again and I want you to plan it so that it's not just done once and then dropped that it's done so that every part of town can come out without having to have one place for gazillion folks to do once a month then yeah I support yeah just so I've had conversations with some folks I I didn't even want to do seven to be honest with you um yeah we talking about but um so one at the high school listen this is location this is ridiculous this I don't think this is very is it ridiculous is that the word we want to use we have the we have all these other things we have the budget if we didn't have the budget to do I wouldn't be concerned but we have the budget that's going to come out in April we're going to have to do all the to leave ourselves open for Budget meetings so we absolutely do and I I fully expect folks to want to talk about the budget I expect folks to want to talk about the Ral I expected want to talk about flooding there there are other public safety issues and there are some local issues depending on the neighborhoods that you're in so here here's the challenge satisfying everybody that is chall possible right so if if we do one at the high school somebody's going to be upset if we do one a month someone's going to be upset if we do two or three some why don't we do two or three that's a little more reasonable we have budget reasonable and and you cleared your schedule to set this up council president and I'm not being set it up but you you set this up and it's not fair to the rest of us we're committed we have two Council meetings a month we have all their other committee meetings plus now we have all these other meetings we have to do budg and now I I mean the last time this exercise was done 10 10 people showed up at these meetings other than the staff that we had more staff members there than we did resident so well a couple people come out that that's great I hope we do get good turnouts but to be realistic it's you know once a week for the next six weeks yeah I that's unrealistic do like one at the high school one down in Washington and one at Gregory so you've got three with different parts covered that's a little bit more I don't think people aren't gonna come out because you can't AR in their neighborhood so that was suggested and the push back that I received directly when that was suggested was you're going to have people feel like they're being left out you're not going to have an opportunity to cover um if you do three you and because we're time boxing an hour and a half uh if you do three you're not going to have enough time to cover all of the questions and answers that people are going to need and you're not going to be able to reach the folks why are we boxed in for time why don't we just have get let a little longer time frame so people have plenty of time to ask questions so I honestly I feel like you hit diminishing returns once you get past an hour an hour and a half yeah yeah you is is a lot to begin with I think and then there's setup and cleanup time and and there's a group of volunteers that are going to do the setup and the cleanup so that you know don't have to pay what what group of volunteers Darren nurse being the one that asked for it number one and others I mean what so we shouldn't be in the schools utilize schools to do campaigning that's number one we're not really this so you know what you know what councilwoman you're right let's cancel the whole thing let's just cancel it we don't need to talk to the residents we don't let's just not do it I will send in the email tomorrow and we'll cancel them how about that and then the residents that requested it those that wanted it they won't have it that's fine see yeah I don't wait hold on let's have some order so I don't think it's fair Council C say it's campaigning because it's not there was a resident who came and asked us to do it Council last year when councilman Williams council president she organized this and did this and 10 people show right but it doesn't matter if it's 10 people we're still reaching people who don't get to come to meetings the whole purpose is that a resident asked for it I don't think it's fair say campaigning I get that it's 10:59 now it's about to be 11: so let's be respectful but he is literally doing what a resident asked and I was under the impression honestly I thought it was a month when we had talked about this I was like this is a great idea I'm glad the resident mentioned it we should be reaching residents out there in various communities I honestly thought it was once a month I thought it was like you're picking a random like last third day of the month or whatever I am totally in support of going to the schools and meeting with residents in the neighborhoods but I think once a week yeah once a week I hear you so so let me just say this uh excuse me for a second so uh councilwoman to your once month like the last so so last year when it was done in the school it wasn't campaigning right using the schools wasn't an issue last you it's an issu issue I didn't book it so so well I didn't book it either and I and it was booked for moment please for a moment councilwoman please it was booked without any input from me I couldn't go that night I had another obligation I wasn't considered what what I did I'm gonna to for saying that to you but again this is so so trying to have folks be involved in the planning process backfires talking about things in the planning stage backfires it's this is not politics to me right we have real issues in town the folks on Main Street want to talk about the why we had the issue at the towing company a month ago they want to talk about Main Street Redevelopment I know I've talked to a lot they want to talk about flooding on Main Street and and in almost every other neighborhood in town so these are opportunities we and we just had the most destructive vile public comment in the 22 years that I've been here maybe ever and folks want to have an opportunity to talk about some things and they're not all going to come here they and and when they do all come here we stay here till 23 in the morning okay so so I get where you're going I guess I would have appreciated it if it would have been like we got got an email we're looking to plan this you know put mentioned maybe you weren't here but and you weren't here last week but it has been mentioned it was brought up two Council meetings ago um I I didn't send an email because the dates I I think I think they're confirmed I saw an email for one of the dates so I don't know if they're all confirmed or not um and once they were confirmed I was going to send them to you if you guys couldn't do those dates then we would modify right if we if but the the point is what we're trying to do you asked me a question right about something being planned I tell you about it and now we want to attack what's being planned instead of just saying hey when those dates are approved or whatever those dates are if they end up holding send that out and then we can modify it from there hey I can't make it this day I think this is too many let's do three instead of seven all of that could be handled in an email versus trying to make it a personal thing right now and and I took that personally because I'm not try to do work I apologize but we don't meet once a week period okay so so so this this is a lot this is this is a lot and we have a lot of other meetings we have to do I I hear you I think definitely we should have one at Edison so so so we're not let's let's get what we have and then once it's sent out you can say hey let's do this or let's not do that and then whatever the consensus is is what what we hold and then whoever from the administration wants to come on those days can come and who doesn't want to come doesn't have to come and we're probably going to invite some folks to some of them from the county and we'll probably invite Congressman pay our congressman and our State Assembly and our Senate uh uh our Senator to one or two and and they may come and they may not come but let's at least figure out without having it be because we can't do it right now like we don't even have those dates at least as far as I'm aware confirmed with the exception of one something I just I'll put it in email but I think that to make it easier and I think that's what I'm hearing from my colleagues maybe once a month towards the end of the month where we don't have so many board and commission meetings maybe like the last Thursday or Wednesday of each month we do it in a different school right yeah the last week of the month seems to be the quietest the quiet yeah because the beginning is very busy um right so let's let's um I'll I'll once I hear back from the schools I'll cell I'll circulate that and and then we will take the feedback into consideration thank you I Tak the initiative to these community events you say can I make a motion to adourn the meeting is there anything else before we go okay okay all in favor I any post no good night West Orange good night West orang thank you