they the line painting is completed and delineated but the ballards and handicap signs are not yet installed but everything else other than the handicap signs um and Landscaping is complete so I would recommend that the board um give permission for Michael and I to endorse the temporary Co that Ralph issues can you call on the phone sure I don't know it's not connected oh however you can get them so uh I'd like a motion Mr chair I move to recommend the building inspector issue with temporary certificate of occupancy five star potion provided that the necessary work ident ified in s SW Call's progress report dated April 5th 2024 is completed second all those in favor I I I IEP I was thinking okay let's move on uh Pine rdge Estates 40b uh file number 24-15 d40b request for comment um if you look at the plans in your packet you'll see what looks pretty familiar um it looks like the independent living facility application we had some months ago from uh Brian Cory and this is a [Music] 40b uh proposing 38 single family houses uh on small Lots um with 10% or 10 affordable units as per 40b requirement um I don't know what kind of comment we're supposed to give but the town administrators has requested any general comments to be forwarded to um his office I've already sent him the staff review that was done for the previous site plan that was submitted with this which was somewhat different uh there were duplexes proposed in that um and this is all a single family I also supported the engineering review from the previous proposal and also the departmental comments so if there are any other comments that the board would specifically like to have addressed with the Town Administrator he's requested those comments to be part so I guess the the planning board can only give or opinion because this is going to go before the zoning board for approval um and I would hope that we could lend the services of the planning board to the zoning board to help them through this process um it is we need housing we need housing that's affordable um this is pretty tight um you know how many acres are in the total area should say on the cover sheet what it's on three different lots and that's looking at it on my small computer is very difficult looks like they us 25 AC score but then they have a 117 possible to the right of it right I mean and it looks like they're they're have a spur of the last after the last clde on the right that's going to go into that empty land they do so Westport Lakes Road is that now is that an accepted road is that a private way whose road is it I me go was down there it's still behind there it is it's narrow and it's not in good shap I I have no idea what the status is of it I think it was I think it wasn't supposed to be accepted I don't think it well I don't think it has been accepted I think when it was when they did it they keep it private so I think there's a lot of people living on it now I actually got a couple of not yeah but so I think it was before they had associations so I don't know what it's going to be I'm sure we'll have neighbors com could concern all us I am sure but we're not going to be hearing it so that's true um so I think the things to have the town look out for are on the the storm water issues uh based on all single family houses uh is there going to be a homeowners association to take care of the storm water and the roads um are they going to propose that the town accept this road these roads uh and the waste water uh it looks like they have a common leak field but their proposal before was to have individual septic tanks which then were piped into a leech a common two common leech fields and um I assume because it's new construction that they'd all have to be denitrifying but I don't know what 40b has to do with that requirement um it's a Board of Health requirement I it's not a it's not a requirement they'll request a wait I'm sure they will and I I would strongly suggest that they use a a community a community system like at lro Village which is similar size um it would be just I think just under 10,000 gallons a day oh no not if these are if these are not proposal before were to make them age restricted before they snuck under the 10,000 under the 10,000 these are uh two and three bedrooms yeah these these are two and three bedrooms 38 units So you you're up in the in the teens M this needs uh a groundwater this needs a treatment plant and a groundw disch department right so that's what I would [Music] suggest and um I assume that the Board of Health can no the Board of Health can't require that the I think the zoning board could try um well that that's a state law so they can actually apply the state law 40b doesn't over the state local right but the Board of Health we did not tooke asked the fing boards to have it a requirement of a special permit because they couldn't require it and that would be for the D but not for a commit that Bob's talking about the thing they're going need to comply withal commits so the question that I can't answer myself is if they're sharing the leak field does that put them in the category of being required to have a crime water history yes if if they're over if they're over the flow yeah then they're required to have a a treatment plant okay if you have a a treatment plant that's discharging into the groundwater and you need to get a groundwater discharge pref you have to do all the Ming analys all that so I I think they're they're stuck with that and then um you know the the existing homes down close to the road these wetlands are all in the some of the side Hill they're sloping down towards the uh uh existing West Westport Lakes Road and um you know that the whole stor water management needs to [Music] be and then having 38 that's okay we're going to Wells and so it doesn't show any well or it really doesn't show how they deal with water or with was water is this any different than what we saw however long ago the buildings are different there were some d duplexes and the building building configurations themselves are different I think it was the same number of of so I I one of the reasons I ask is we made a lot of comments when we first saw this and are those comments relevant to uh forward to the who's that for the board of Select yeah I believe so I think they're sending all those comments with our comments so our our earlier comments are relevant to for to the board of selection because this is largely the same I mean just just as a piece of planning this is a lousy piece of plant yeah that's the technical term right this this is not producing yes we need housing but this is not the type of housing we need produc some of these lots are less than 10,000 squ ft yeah but the 40 be process when you go to the zba that's all going to have to go through a peer review kind of like what it does for us and and I believe the town has a 40b attorney working for them and will have 40 them so all these things should be addressed that kind of similar the same process of what we do here but over there right and that's why i' like to our help to that because it's not so easy um you there's nothing shown on as to the water supply for these homes right and then where the was water and then um since this is not Aid restricted this would trigger a wastewater treatment plant under title that that's a whole separate process they have to describe how they're going to comply with that as they asked for the special permit I mean with brak's Landing they had uh an application for 40p and it was 200 and some odd units uh it went through a year or two of meetings and then the Zone board denied it it went to court then that took a couple of years but then it was approved for 89 units on 3 acre lots which is totally different than what this is already so um on 30,000 ft Lots you can probably find a place for a well on a septic maybe but it's it is what it is so so I think we need to forward the comments that we had before which I think are still relevant because it's basically the same yep uh but the bigger question is the waste water and the storm water uh CU if you look on the chart on the wall the two big squares on the bottom are the shared leak fields for everybody waste water and water Supply I think as well well there's a couple there's a retention Pond up there near the intersection of the road so the storm water and the waste water those were issues that were also similarly discussed at the um planning board hearing when they had brought it under the independent living facility bylaw that's all reflected in the the staff review so the Town Administrator has those comments but I'll make sure to underscore that when I write yeah and to make sure that we distinguish between when it was age restricted they snuck under the 10,000 now they're over my other thing too would be with the the Westport Lakes Road that we figure out who's going to own Westport Lakes Road it's going to stay Property Owners look to get it accepted and you know I think we have to point out that it's never been finished so we is there any shy left on there must be a history this this road was created under a subvision yes it was I don't know it was It was supposed to be a golf course right I remember the golf course was the the fairways were going to be on people's Lots um and it turned in that that wasn't allowed so but they still did the road and haven't finished it yeah we heard from uh a Butters who who live on Westport Lakes Road complaining about the condition of the road unfinished and potholes and was it adequate to support all this additional number of homes and and in fact the future expansion is there angling for because this is basically a dead end off of a dead end I think they if if they can do it the the zoning board should ask for traffic study does it come back here after zoning it does not okay uh do we need a motion to forward this stuff no are we ready for Phillip or he's not uh we're having some technical issues so I asked him we could reschedule he said he could come in person next time or try to do it virtually so I think we'll go go with the in person next time good idea okay um Pine Ridge Estates request for comments oh that's what we just did I'm sorry chapter 61 release file number 24-14 ch61 a select board is requesting comments and chapter 61 a release owned by Paul man located at 20 Kel's way may map 67 lot 7 c um and I don't believe it's in 61a I believe it's on 61 B or C but I don't know if this that means anything um this is a lot which is currently a small uh par 20 somewhat acre parcel that they have horses on uh it's just west of the metal recycling uh the big metal recycling place on sh White Road just off of Main Road yep and uh I've spoken with with Ross Moran to see if um he feels that there's any conservation uh benefit from this that the town uh could could exercise their option or give the option to a nonprofit and he felt after looking at it this afternoon uh with the price and the fact that it's next to the metal recycl uh and could be contaminated from that um there's probably little conservation value um and that uh because of that he he didn't think it was worth Pur so I I I agree with that um however it I think uh Kirby Brook goes through the property and Kirby Brook is I think one of the cold water streams we have uh that goes into the east branch so you'd have to have a willing nonprofit or the town would have to have the money to buy and it's $849,000 um so I don't know how much of Kirby Brook goes through the metal recycling place and through this property but I'd like some input the mapping I'm looking at our web map that the the headwaters of Kirby Brook start slightly to the north of this property and then flows northward and then goes around a band and goes down towards Main Road MH so the the the headwaters are not actually on this parcel okay okay so I would I would I would think that we sign off on the plan boards yeah there's there's not there's not a public interest in acquiring it at that price right so can this presum can Kelsey's way then be used as access for further subdivision of the lot it could and uh I don't know the status of Kelsey's way we have to figure out what that is Kelsey's way is a private road I don't know if there was ever a homeowners association established between the uh three property owners that yeah there actually is four four that use that road for Access so um they would have to negotiate something the owners of those properties in order to gain access to subdivide that parcel further so the the people buying it I think are the same people that bought Simmons store and and yep and so I don't know what they intend to do with it but I don't think the their primary residence I believe is in Florida and they have um a restaurant down there and a farm and it's a lot of farm to table so I would I would I would think that maybe um they're looking to do something similar on that property maybe provide the store with some fresh whatever they also have a house uh in where in Westport Harbor in Atlantic of on Atlantic Avenue right next to the beach club so so this I mean it doesn't affect us but it doesn't have anything to do with this hinga Holdings they're just the the bu is his business address I guess is care of the vice president of was Zinga Holdings mhm in West Palm Beach I think he's he's something to do with the Miami Dolphins yeah this this gentleman Hena well hosena is dead well whatever but uh he did this is his daughter yeah okay all right I'm just curious okay so i' entertain a motion to give our opinion as we should release it Mr chair I move that we forward to the select board that we have uh no objection to the release of land owned by Paul man um at 21 Kelsey way uh from chapter uh 61a second all those in favor I I uh R Lane extension file number 19-1 c Road acceptance endorse myar and plan this may have been included from an old agenda item this is out of the planning board's hands at this point the planning board had um given the select board comment on the acceptance of R Lane and R Lane was accepted as a Town Road at town meeting um so at which point it's up to the town to acquire any necessary easements as a part of that um as a part of that roadway acceptance and to actually acquire the property but that's for the select board to work out it's not something for the the planning board to address okay next is 6:15 public hearing for Corey Ridge Estates file number 2 23- 035c continued from November 14th 23 January 23rd 24 March 19th 24 request by the applicant to consider a definitive subdivision plan entitled definitive subdivision Cory R Estates located at 265 Cornell Road uh AP 81 Lot 4 proposing to divide the property of the four LS uh Char for Northeast Engineers for uh applican cor Rich estates this is a revised plan that was revised in March uh by per comments from the town consultant SW Cole at the time of the initial hearing uh we proposed to have a graveled road that goes up hammerheads and services three lots to the rear of the property there's an existing house on the front of the property we' asked for several waivers at a time reduce just about all the waivers except the ones that pertain to Gravel Road and so the first item that uh we have an existing dishes plan uh this is all pretty much open field up to here and it's very sparely wooded in here goes down to a wetland you can barely see a wetland slide over here that was one of the comments that was dressed this had the Wetland flag uh there was a comment fromter about regarding a large tree that's right is actually a split tree where half of it is on the applicant's property half is on their property just something we can do so we showed that tree as part of this uh new existing I conditions plan we've corrected there was an issue with the wall not being shown on the property line that's been correctly isue uh these are the lots that we're proposing we're proposing these Lots we did do test fits that are shown on the existing dig plan and on this one we deter water table for drainage uh we have provided an easement for the town and our interested parties to access the Corey Cemetery which is historic Cemetery obviously P Cory Ridge of States we sit right on the ridge here on Cornell Road uh so there are waivers we are asking for the waivers we are asking for there are three of them there are four of them total three of them regarding the gravel road one is a non-pa Surface obviously Gravel Road second is a reduction in the width from 20 ft required to 16 with twoot gravel shoulders on each side which gets the 20 foot width which satisfies the uh fire departments we also asked for standard nonc cross-section the standard cross-section would show 20 ft of width with 4T shoulders where going to 16 and 2T shoulders so all those waivers pertaining to lessening the giin structure to have a gravel roope final waiver is for uh waiver of a filet radius out here on Cornell Road it's not necessary to provide adequate drainage I mean adequate access as there's plenty of room for Philips out to Cornell Road which is a significant distance from the property line as shown on the plan so those are the only waivers we're asking for we have corrected the waivers that we were asking for for water quality uh reduction we increase the size of the ponds you can go to the next slide so we've reconfigured the ponds and added a level spreader we've also increased so there's infiltration of the bond and Comin coming producing that so what we've done is we reduce the peak flows off the site this particular site sits right on a ridge here so there's a split watered where most of the property goes to this section is a boggy Pond down on Cornell Road that's significant distance from about 100t strip that drains naturally across this to across to uh what is now the trusty the uh Land Trust land over here and a 50ft strip of the butter that the water naturally flows across so what we've done is we as requested by the consultant provide the water quality by infiltration provide the reduction to 20% from pre- to post development and uh provide a level spreader to spread the the the water out right now all the water is funneled into this little milk here if you look real closely here there's a little storm wall Basin here most of this water flow naturally across this property we've reduced that by 20% again here's the drainage and here's the layout of the road we've increased the Hammerhead size at request of the consultant and we've also uh paid or paid apron up front at the request and we've increased the size so uh what we've done basically is beat all the what was requested by the consultant and buy the plan for we've also I should point out again this tree which was a concern of the if you could save it so instead of coming down along here with the utilities this existing power hole here we decided to come across here so there will be no excavation down at the root level of the tree uh to save the tree so we're going to at greater expense the applicant run along this side Andross the road and then come down this side of the road so we don't have to interfere with the roof system of the existing large tree youjust the details so the the boggy pond so the West the West is up yeah that's that's um moer Pond yeah yes it's about 800 ft down the street but it this is a very Steep Hill going down to that and this is significant on East side this house the Cory House was built right on top of the ridge for obvious reasons because this is nice high dry land pasture in here Sean um you mentioned that the uh width of the drive first of all it's gravel it's in it's perious we it the difference between the gravel compacted gravel and a pavement is very negligible so we consider it to be a impervious but that um in discussions with the fire department uh they found it acceptable that it be 16 ft wide with 2T buffer on either side right the requirement uh fire lane requirement under the state code for fire is 20 ft of fire access and that's for between buildings but it's been adopted as a 20ft standard for all laneways what they want basically is be able if they have to pull off the road to have 20 ft and to have a car pass so youve had a car a fire truck and ambulance going in different directions they can do that so the 16t we proposed they wanted you know can you put an extra shoulder on there so had to pull off the road you're not falling into loone so it would you know basically for a giant rock so we've had we've added a 16t with twoot gravel shoulders lessen the impact of having a giant wide road to surface so uh so it's 16 ft of gravel and twoot gravel shoulders so why isn't that 20 ft of gravel well it is but it's not considered a travel way in other words it will have the standard width with the top dressing of the stone that you put on typically on a 16 put on a 20t gravel way will not extend to the shoulders okay the the reason I asked is there is massive destruction of the dunes at Horseneck and I'm just wondering whether the DCR is running an extension of root 88 and I was told no this is at the request of the fire department uh wanting 20 ft and I'm trying to figure out uh um what do they need and and what will they accept and and so on this is I believe that the problem there is the dunes creep very quickly onto the actual travel way so they're trying to keep as wide as they can because you never know when you're going to need an emergency you can't decide there's an emergency go down and clear the way then we'll something yeah yeah thank you we do have comments in it I think it would be in the best interest of everybody to go one at a time and have you mention the comment and me address my concerns and than reading them all and going back I think that would be the easiest way uh Sean is this gravel way going to be crowned or is it going to be sloped in One Direction it's going to be crowned most of the way there is a peak can really see it in here but it is crowned to go basically towards the pond towards the little pond that's over in here uh it's you know standard pitched cross-section right but if the if the road uh is on this side of the ridge if you Crown it so can you go back on so where's the ridge again the ridge the ridge runs right through here yeah so okay if you have the the road Crown to drain towards uphill doesn't it make more sense to have it graded so it all goes in One Direction because uh yes the answer to your question in my experience with gravel roads which I have two very long ones that's what we do yeah so so it is but it is Crown but in the drainage considerations you also have to look this is kind of a unique situation for most of the Visions you typically see in Westport where it's not it doesn't have a huge amount of weapons surround it it's very high and dry and it sits up very high so basically when you consider the drainage calculation everything you look at okay the bridge here and all this water here comes across this property now the regulations require the town regulations require a 20% at least a 20% reduction from pre to post and there's several ways of doing it capturing a lot up here and still letting a little bit come off one side or Capt it all and then attenuating 80% if we wanted to build a massive sail in here uh and remove the trees that I think the others want to keep uh you could and you could direct it to the pond and then did discharge what we proposed is we catching most of this and most of this Ridge into these ponds to get to the 20% reduction this naturally Flows In This Direction the Little Ridge here and there a little hole right here so this is going this way towards this Pond and these are going to that f is very little 150 ft of what I what you I think you're concerned about the crown pitching onto the next property no I'm concerned about the crown trying to pitch uphill oh no that's you know words losing the crown is that what you're concerned about no that you would if if the if the road is crowned like this and the ridge is up here the water that's on this side of the road goes down here but where does it go it goes where it goes now naturally but it's reduced it wants to go this way naturally right well no what it wants to see what happens is it want all this wants to go this way right all this is going this way but what's happening is we're catching it you have to have TSS removal and you have to have reduction so there's swes over here that catch that but direct it back to where it's supposed to flow because you don't want to send this this side of the ridge over to this side because it's like an in Basin and that's not a good engineer so I see that I mean I see on your cross-section there you've got the swell on the you said the west side right up hill side is West yes and so to answer I mean to Jim's point the crown going Westward from the midsection from midpoint drains into that Swale and then the Swale carries the water down or North and South yes it does so it's from here there's a high point here it's going this way this going that way this catching into these this little Ridge here catching into here and this Hammerhead going into this Basin here they're all coming here but it flows naturally this way but you're attenuating it using the ponds you're slowing it down the peak flows you're removing the sediment you're doing everything in the ponds by which is required under the regulation and then let it go where it naturally goes now yeah the ridge is is still flowing the same places from the same points it's just flowing slower right the only uh potential danger of that Swale is that you as you just described a minute ago there's a 16t wide Road bed and then a twoot shoulder on each side for emergency vehicles and that Swale on the west side starts right at that 2 feet so if a if a fire engine or something veers a little bit over shoulder it's down in the ditch yes yeah I mean if you go 3 feet instead of 2 feet you're going to be get a that's anticipating something that may or may not happen 16 ft is plenty of wide for two cars to pass they were just requesting the 20t the 20 foot is is basically so they're not taking the mirrors and and one of the things they asked for is that one of the wavers we asked for is the clearing this is an open field view there's no vegetation hanging into the roadway or the RightWay on either side and then as I recall at the last meeting there was a on the see would be the east side of the road there's a there was a uh something about a chain link fence that was along there it's a uh cattle fence what is it yeah what it's you know what I mean 4x4 Square mesh fence it's not like chain wi fence oh it's uh there's a picket fence that comes up here I don't know if that should be but this running along the property line here yeah is a typical like a 4x4 Square cattle steel cattle fence with post okay I don't know who put that in I don't know if it was this owner or the previous owner it's there there's a row of arbores just inside that fence as a screen yeah i' probably been there I would say six or seven years okay yeah I just I recall somebody saying I guess they thought it was chain link fence saying that that's not going to be very attractive but but as you just described it's it's not that exactly and it's hidden partially I don't think it's attractive but it's been there it's the way it's been since the applicant bought it so if they want to take it down I don't think the applicant would have a problem with that if that's the concern what is it what is it keeping out I think I don't know if it's keeping something out keeping something in I'm not sure you can speak to that the previous owner just put it it to separate their land from our land okay there no livestock no just neighbors I think they were concerned about um dogs coming from the land TR we own that 50t strip and then the land trust owns the the land of us thanks and that Land Trust land is the access to the H Place whatever it's called is actually Access Road in an easement that runs that and it runs right along right along right along the fence right right at the fence right along where where the drainage right here it's a dash line you can barely see it but so I guess the other question I have with the storm water uh Sean is now you're getting uh sheet flow from the ridge down to the bottom of the plane right and now when you're going to collect it in these two basins it's going to come out at at one place yeah there's there's 20 foot level spreader and then there's 20 concrete level spread it to dispersion but still that's 20 ft versus the whole thing thing it's one of the comments yet I understand the the issue is yes it's coming in one spot but it's kind of coming in one spot now it all comes in through this the scull up you see here it's all coming into there you have to also realize that there's 20% less CL Okay so so planners can you read the comments from the engineer one by one sure I I don't know if you all have the report but I'm going to read just the Bold comments because those are the ones pertaining to the revised plans um the applicant has proposed installing a 20 foot spreader to reduce the concentration of the flow considering the pre-construction surface flows were spread out over 7 700 feet the flows are still concentrated to 20 feet when considering the abing property downhill it is about 40 ft wide at that point approximate size of the access roadway opening to a larger area north of the property if that owner decided to develop that property by constructing an Access Road 2 feet higher than the existing surface it would block all flows from Cory Ridge Estates flowing to the West that owner or the association that will be maintaining the Cory Ridge estate's drainage system would be responsible to fixing this potential problem requiring the applicant to obtain a flow easement SL agreement currently eliminates this problem in the future uh comment number two test pit information has been provided these test pits know that the water table at the time of the test pits heard the information provided the following comments are provided a bottomup detention Basin number two is proposed for elevation of 72 yet tp1 located there shows the water table appr approximately at 72.4 this reduces the amount of storage in this Basin and eliminates any infiltration factor that may be considered this Basin should be redesigned accordingly the bottom of detention Basin number three is proposed for elevation 72.0 tp2 and tp3 show the water table approximately at elevations of 71.3 and 70.5 respectively any infiltration factor for this Basin should not be considered um the applicant has included an additional gravel base for about 1 foot past the 16 ft therefore 18 ft of Base the above comment required 20 ft and 2 ft beyond the 16t gravel road on either side see the last comment pertaining to roof runoff from the dwelling um add Lots three and four along with lot two and recommend that lot one also be included that's for comment number four um the right of way clearing reviewing the Google map satellite vegetation does does appear sparse in the area of the road but without a plan showing the road layout along with the vegetation they want to remain it is difficult at best to comment on this request B standard cross-section as noted in comment 3B as above above as a minimum note that Bas on the setup shown on page 40 cross-section there's only 20 ft of usable RightWay outside the 20 foot way there is a one on Three sloping toward the property line which then flows down slope in the abing and the abing property on the opposite side there's a sale which is part of the drainage system in the future if the town or the association wants to upgrade the road to the current standards it will be an expensive undertaking as this is proposed to be a private way recommend that the acceptance as presented must be conditioned on the road never becoming a public way under the town of Westport C A gravel way note two on page 40 allows the board to consider alternative surface materials provided it minimizes dust and provides for a durable drivable surface dense Pat gravel or use of Road Milling or combination would serve as a suitable alternative that the board could consider with this will be a private road serving only four lots a gravel road could be considered suitable for this purpose the board should also consider a note on the plans for approval of a plan for the roadway maintenance especially after the winter months D waiver for the is it fillet radius on the east side of the roadway entrance as this portion of the roadway will be within the town's right of way and the responsibility of the town to maintain this should be constructed per the town's requirements the board should consider denying this waiver request and those are the comments okay so I'm a little concerned uh I'll go to number two a little concerned is more like advocating a hypothetical than actually a regulatory comment uh so it was the concern I think that we just addressed but I'll go through it again uh we're installing the level spreader with the concrete level spreader to to St the road now he comes up with a hypothetical situation if they would have raised this road 2 ft it would cause a problem for the water coming off that's already coming off now well if we didn't construct this and they raised this road 2 feet they still have the same problem the water would be to be building a Dy basically causing water they would have to address in their development plan a way to get the drainage water down and around the same way that we're doing it doesn't make it so he's proposing a hypothetical situation that goes against his own argument about the concentrated flow and what's happening here with the existing flow uh he calls 700 ft of the roadway itself from here to here is only 450 ft so I'm not sure what he's talking about but most of this is a divide here where there's an old snow wall but this water comes down over here being captured so not all the 700 ft they mentioning is being captured by these two ponds it's only basically 350 ft of roadway and ridge just being captured in these Pond and attenuated so the hypothetical like said the twoot road higher I mean they could certainly do that but they would have to address the still more to drainage on their own development because you can't build a dam along your neighbor's property on naturally current water without having a c or something if we go to item two the tested information uh so if I could ask a question before you go forward I think what he's referring to is the whole length including the retention Basin on the right hand side which is if you if you combine everything down to Cornell Road is probably 700 ft but so that that retention Basin where's it getting the most of it water from flowing naturally off the Hammerhead and on the from the ridge cuz what happens is you know most of this road is coming out here to this existing Pond out here but what's Happening Here is to to attenuate the 20% reduction you have to capture some of this so there's a very shallow Pond we're trying to make it as shallow as possible so it doesn't look like a giant hole on the ground uh and this one is catching the inside of the roadway both of which are coming to a point that already where discharges but with what we're doing is attenuating the peak Flow by 20% over what's existing now okay so item two test spit information is there any chance Amy that you have that PL I sent it to Michael it's just one sheet correct yeah it's just one sheet I wanted to show so uh there's some funny Fuzzy Math going on here and I'll uh go through it because what happens we have test pits that we did prior to the development two of which fall inside these ponds here which are the guidance were the guidance for what the development plan was so give me one second you me I'm ping up there go you just the two ponds M okay that'd be great and we can revise these plans to show what we've had is spot shots at the test pit themselves but I don't know if he was interpolating it correctly or what was happening here so let's look at uh detention Basin number two uh which is mentioned in the first one uh we have a proposed bottom of on the 72 the test pit elevation is 73.1 it's inside the 74 Contour there's a little depression here is a 36 in water table here 73 - 3 ft 36 in is 70.1 he's telling us that it's 71.3 so we're at 70.1 we're quoting the bottom of the pond to be 72 we're 2 ft above the ground water which is acceptable under the storm water and the infiltration standards so I'm not sure where his numbers are coming from second Basin test bit number three had a 40in water table up here and the elevation there 73.4 it's between the 73 contour and the 74 Contour you do quick math 3.25 ft is 40 in subtracted from 73 down to 70 again and the bottom of the pond is at 72 so we're 2 ft above the groundw and this the seasonal High groundwater mod he's showing it to be 72.4 and I'm not sure where he's getting that I'm not sure where he's getting his numbers from I I I was doing the math and it didn't make a lot of sense to me and I don't know if he's Mis interpreting something or I'm not sure uh what the issue is there but they were designed to be 2 ft above the seasonal high water to Asos uh final one Phil it no I think it's the gravel base the gravel which is that um number three it's right after it's on top of the page oh okay right okay so the applicant has included a gravel base about 1T past to 16 we're proposing we 2 ft to get to the 20 ft is that acceptable to the board or because the question is do you want us to have a 20ft gravel traveled way or do we want to have 162 and two and we can revise the plans accordingly I'll leave it up to the discretion of the board I think I don't think this is a a huge deal uh obviously we asked for a waiver to 16 ft originally and this is uh uh probably a continued comment so describe the solution well the solution is 16t graveled way with a stickle Stone surface with 2 fet of shoulder on each side giving us 20 ft or 20t graveled way with no shoulder with no shoulder 16 ft of gravel with 2 ft of buffer made of gravel versus 6 20 ft of gravel I mean it's a distinction without a difference one it'll be a visual difference it it would be a visual difference it's an aesthetic as opposed to functional it is creating a hot shoulder instead of a soft shoulder yeah I I mean and even in gravel you're going to get vegetation that'll grow on that so you keep the which is the reason you do Hammerheads rather than cacks because gravel C sex don't work because you just grow into to where nobody drives on so when you have a hammerhead they get used and then then it stays over and it would be the same thing the gravel way what typically happens is where they're not being driven on you'll get weeds infiltrated I mean my preference is the 16 ft foot Focus also I can also agree with that with gravel underneath right with gravel underneath the two feet yeah of course so the question about the the retention or detention Bas detention detention um with the elevations um I don't know how to reconcile it between the two well I can I I got these comments today so I haven't had a chance to I I put these spot elevations on for this hearing like and I don't have problem sending it to the Consultants so they can also see I mean it's pretty easy math uh you know figure 40 in 3.25 ft tra 73 down to 70 but he's got 72.4 and I don't know where that comes from just going through this with you yeah separately it would seem to me that perhaps he's considering that the uphill which is uphill this is uphill I mean this is the high end of the pond right so that would if you had a 70 water table down here where it's lower it's not going to be 70 it's going to be 69 just say because it follows the slope M this would be the worst case scenario as with this so the worst case scenario is this is where you know at the upper end of the pond it's the higher end of the property I think you need to come to resolution I don't have a problem I I just didn't have a chance to send it out to him or uh even just to say is the spot shots tell me where you got your numbers I'm pretty confident we're 2 feet above the water table here uh if we we need to redesign it if it comes to that conclusion we'll redesign it okay so we have the gravel road we have the retention basins what was this the the fil at the end and I I think that's a known issue for Country Roads like this yeah if you you Dr over here so so Michael had requested a 25t pavement radius which is more than adequate for a road and this is shown here which is you know 16 F feet outside where the property line is to put a filet radius is a nonsensical I mean it we we could do it we ship the road over and put a fillet here then you have a strip of land that's going to be about 5 ft wide which is kind of nonsensical uh he he he's assuming that the highway department is going to maintain that PVE section well the reason in this it goes back a long time ago good luck with that yeah we do the pave difference is is just for that reason essentially the highway p is going to maintain Cornell Road the width of Cornell Road and this is a variable width there's no layout in this section of Cornell Road is very wide in this area from wall to wall um the traveled way which is only 23 ft wide front of the site Sean I'm just curious was there a u a utility pole somewhere in the vicinity of that there is an existing utility pole here typically s would make pay a lot of money to move the pole over another pole here to do a drop down and then run that's the way we proposed it on this side next to this tree uh there was concern about the tree so we said why don't we just drop in here run extra and then run it under the road to stay away from the tree and its branches to do any cutting or anything you would have to do and why you going to run the the utilities up the east side of the road instead of the West this whale on the other side was there anything else Amy I don't think so no that was it a lot of the stuff from the last report have been resolved in the revised plans right right lot there were a lot of comments we and most of it had to do with waivers and drainage issues and infiltration we had asked a waiver from the water quality initially uh we increased the size of the ponds to meet the water quality uh we didn't think it was absolutely necessary but rather than argu point so can we act tonight or do we need to wait till Sean talks to SW Co I I think that especially since it's storm water and it's kind of out of my wheelhouse um it would be good for Sean and SW Cole to rectify uh the comments that were made in this letter so also I'd like to open it to the anybody in the audience that would like if you if you would like to come up to the leor and this is my wife could you wait and say it I'm jacqu Brunswick and this is my wife louisan uh and we own this this property right here that's our border we own a 50t scrip we have a um Frontage on Cornell Road and a 50t strip and then we own the land behind this development this um these dotted lines here are an easement that we have granted the land trust on our property so that they can get back to their property and it will be a our way back to our property very concerned that this spill these spillways here will go right onto our proposed driveway um we don't have plans at this moment to develop our property who knows the uh Pro for all the sets of comments that we've receiv received from the towns engineer they request that the uh developer ask for us asked us for an easement regarding the storm water and also the land trust because it would flow over our property and then onto the land trust property no one has approached us uh nothing's been discussed we're very concerned about the water and we don't think and and per the engineer studies and per the comments on this um report and the earli report uh it's a major concern for us and I think um something that your engineer has pointed out in multiple multiple reports so uh we can't see this going forward as it currently is because it impacts our property significantly in terms of the Swarm work and as you can see here on the on most of the plans you can barely see these lines and I'm happy to see that they're emphasized here but that's this scrip here is the um I think it says somewhere here here it is easement uh very and that easement is for the land trust on our property we have an easement on their property reciprocal easement on portion of their property yes what happens now with heavy we've had huge heavy rains the last months we don't have a driveway there now yeah but you still have lots of slope but it's a large large area and it and it's not that steep in that section so there hasn't been any wash out there on our property the ridge is high you know and you and if you the house uh that's at the at the front there you know is at the highest point and then the ridge our property is on that Ridge as well behind yeah this property this is not I mean my understanding this is not going to be a public we would not have any access to this road we would not have any access to the utilities or could we right so those are those are but you have a huge slope of land uh that's draining down across your driveway and easement not not that much land now because it's it's spread out I mean it's it's not a point I I think that's the main thing that they're pointing out is that this is this is here overflow right here and it we go and this is our this is the proposed these two dash lines are the proposed uh is the EAS so the pre pre-development with Northeast Engineers is doing is is reducing by 20% that's what we're talking about the drainage so the after the road's built you're getting it's 20% less those Bas per your per your engineer study it's maybe 20% less but it's con in a very small area I'm not an engineer I'm just going by what well your I mean I have your engineer study which says that is recommended that they ask for an easement from us peer review of of but isn't that what your account by your own engineer study originally he came forward with a reduction to not have a reten upon as big as that and then we told him that he had to make the attention p b his that so he was trying to keep it was kind of like I'm I'm I guess I'm I'm confused by the fact that your engineer in two reports is asked that they request you talk to us about an easement or and and the land trust because the land trust is it's all goes across the airand as well and and nothing's what the engineer has done for the applicant is reduced the actual flow Now by 20% in his design but if you read here the study that just came out and that again considering the preconstruction surface flows who spread out over 700 ft the flows are still concentrated to 20 ft this is what you report when considering the abing property downhill it is about 40 ft wide at this point approximate size of the AIS Road opening to a larger area in the North and then it says if we decided to develop that property by constructing an axis Road 2 ft higher which we could then it would it would block all flows from Corey ridg States flowing to the West that owner us or the association that will be maintaining cor V State's drainage system would be responsible for fixing this potential problem requiring the applicant to obtain a flow easement SL agreement currently eliminates this problem in the future I'm just reading from your report so so but I think one of the things that we I don't get who who pointed it out but I mean is if you raise if you put in a driveway 2 feet higher than your land now you'd be creating a dam as well no because it would FL we could have it flow on the other side of our property our property slows down his property slops in other words our property is on our you know we can we could drain our property along our land or we could get an easement from the land trust he has not asked us for anything no what I'm saying whether or not the the water is coming from the the 20 foot area or the 700 ft area if you rais your property by 2 feet it's going to get trapped behind there that's going to be flooded between the 2 ft up and what's to your West correct whe whether it's coming whether it's coming in from 20 ft or 700 ft well well let me let me put another way our easement has been here all right it's on the property it's been I don't care about the easement I mean if you if you raise theel this is not a plan that I I'm you're not listening to me I'm sorry go ahead if you raise the level of the road where where you could put a road on your easement or or on your property you raise it up 2 feet that's going to cause a damning of the water that's coming over the whole thing or the 20 foot thing it would think seem to be it would be the same you'd have to deal with the drainage right you'd have to deal with the drainage either way it would be different I think it'd be different but you still have to deal with the drainage in either case except in one case it's a long strip of land that can absorb some water as opposed to a point well the applicant was was proposed that in the first time he was here to lessen what he just did and and now after after that meeting he agreed to not go for a w waiver to reduce the storm water containment and and he's followed all the I'm just going by your report no I understand and and I believe the the the engineering consultant supposed to verify the the little bit you know he didn't he didn't have a chance to get back to them and it's supposed to address some some issues on I guess an error in that engineer report and elevation but that but that doesn't have any to do with this one paragraph no it all has to do with all of it they're reducing the storm water runoff onto your property by 20% so well they're creating storm water oh the existing storm water flow that exists is being reduced by 20% by this but where the road is where the new road is is impermeable right so there's more drainage from that new Surface no they're they're reducing as far as I understand they're reducing the total water coming off their property onto your property by 20% but the 80% that's remaining is coming out of 100% existed today they're reducing it by 20 like the regulation requies I guess I guess we're not happy with this well I understand but I think we're talking it across cross idea so I would like to ask Sean uh when those uh retention basins fill up at what type of storm do they overflow well they they trickle out you know on any but on a 100-year storm it's maintained within the pond and that flow from 100e Storm which is 8 and2 Ines which is twice over an 8 hour period that we had last Thursday which is an assessment we Ed the Cornell University right uh uh rainstorms that basically the same flow coming off from that 8 and 1/2 in rainstorm off that Ridge would be this 20% reduce coming out of this particular thing I don't know if you have this the uh water shed map as part it's part of the set but I don't know if you have it as what's the outlet size the office on the outlet control how big is it it's a 12 in there isn't there isn't a tremendous amount of water that's being captured and I hope we get to the I don't know if there's a wed map somewhere may be the last one well this there's such a little area here now and I'll just generalize it as 150 ft strip of land along here that's part of the ridge that we're not talking 40 acres of rain water here we're talking 150 ft strip of grass strip so when we're talking flows and I'm I I uh appreciate the concern the butter uh you know no one wants the develop next to them flooding them because you hear it all the time you the phone call always comes into the planning board why is this happening the amount of flow and and I don't have the calculation in front of me me not bringing them it's very little I think it's like 3 CFS it's very very little and 1 half in storm because of such a little water these ponds I mean you're talk in a pond that's you know 200 ft long and 40 ft wide to catch 150 ft of we had asked to reduce it before it was kind of a large infrastructure and it was concerned from the abutters about I don't want to see all this infrastructure so we tried to make it as big and shallow as possible so it looks more like a depression than a a pond that most people deem unsightly uh so in a in a storm like we had last Thursday that's about that's about a uh well it's about let's say it's 4.2 in that's basically a 10e storm right so could I they would fill up it would not fill up as a relative ter would there would be water in the pond and it would slowly triple out over time yes could I say something uh to uh the couple who has concerns um I think that um I understand your concerns and I I think what there's a couple of things that have caused your concerns one is someone has asked you for an easement over your property no one has no one has no one has approached us well you came up here and said mentioned uh an easement home that's in the plan that's in your engineer report says that they should request okay so if someone mentioned an easement across your property correct mentioned written in in an engineer okay so if someone talk if I found someone mentioning an easement across my property all kinds of alarm Bells would go my alarm bells are more about a beautiful area yeah with big properties and what you're creating here is a Suburban very tightly kind of as much property as you get out of that uh my wife's mother lived in that house and it's the Cornell house by the way it's not the Cory house it's the Cornell house from the Cornell Road and this is very this area is beautiful right Cornell Road beautiful properties large tracks of land uh this is being shoehorned in here very very tight and the reality is that it's going to have an impact it's going to Deval having this this road on our next to our property um with three houses there so it's it's a it's a it's a hard thing and I and and the fact that um I go back to the the case that there is a concern obviously an engineer has a concern that the storm weather is going to affect our property and it's been written in two of your reports you know and and I would assume that the town would abide by what the engineers their Engineers have said and so the town is not asked um the developer to approach us to talk to us at all about enement um um and and the developer has not has not ever approached us about anything so so I asked you if uh there had ever been an issue with water across uh your Eastman and you said there hadn't been correct and uh and so you know we uh certainly consider what's in uh s SW Cole's report we're not making a decision tonight we have asked uh uh uh Mr Lee to go back and forth with uhw Cole to reconcile numbers I but what we're talking about here is not you know a mall parking lot that's going to dramatically increase the amount of impervious surface um and and so um I I think that yes you should read the report but you should also look at what's in the plan in terms of what's going to create more flow uh this shows a driveway and it also shows retention basins that are collecting uh water and as Mr Sor said it's uh designed to reduce the amount of Flow by uh 20% and uh what about the fact that they're going to be lots of vehicles going back and forth on this road every day and all kinds of pollutants will be tra traversing the water I mean through the water right as when the storms come and there's going to be Roes on houses and there might even be paid driveways off of that Hammerhead I'm going to wager if someone will want to pay their driveway and that water has not been factored in the water that's going to come from those driveways well that water will be on the development of the houses and the Board of Health and they have they have infiltration for the for the same thing they have the same thing when they go develop each of these three lots they'll have toing in the other direction if if I could to the chair uh the houses are all going to be sided on the westly side of the ridge so none of that water will be heading in this direction short of having the building about 50 ft to do that do you have building envelopes anticipated to it will memorialize that no we don't we don't show one but they're on the they're on the other side of the ridge that's all that can happen it has the ridge line runs right through the ham yeah yeah do you have the existing condition this is a very steep slope it's 8% that's fairly steep same here it's fairly steep so the house is be sided on along this slope here basically on the other side of the wall the hammer comes in here I don't imagine anybody sighting the house here or sight but that would still be on the westly side of the ridge so everything will be on and that's in one of the comments actually about addressing the storm war on the westly side of the bridge which is addressed to the Board of Health St water regulations so the ridge is about where that North South Stone Wall is the ridge is like right in here a little bit okay yeah I see the content yeah so Mr chairman is it uh appropriate that the neighbors uh attend the meeting with M Mr leech and our consultant and can ask to discuss well just CU I can understand you know what sometimes I mean these plans can be bewildering if you're not a uh we used to own this property I I mean I understand the concern I understand and I appreciate the the thought process here I mean if they were to develop this a roadway in here they're basically doing the same thing we're doing here so they would have more of a problem because they're very limited as what they do drainage being 50 ft wide completely so if they were wanting to Grant an easement which would beho them to have that that would be fine I don't know if they're willing to do such a thing but it's not necessary in regards to our development yeah but we could definitely take care of the elevation issues with the consultant which I fully expected we were going to they only got these today I'm just trying to find a way for them to to put their minds at ease that what you're I want them to be comfortable I mean again we run into the problem and as we always do is we just don't want anything to happen here now uh and that's not a regulation uh what we try to do and what Mr gigin who is the applicant has tried to do was do as best he can and to hide the houses down slope so it's not everybody sitting on top of each other in other words you'll never see these from the road from Cornell Road and it's very unlikely you'd be able to see them from anywhere down here CU there such a steep drop off it's 8% each this is like a 10% slope it's very steep on either side extremely steep Sean if the land trust was to develop that driveway to access the land in the back um what would they what would they be required to do for storm water well again it you know the requirement of the storm water R there are exemptions for uh some kind of should their exemptions for accessing your Upland and everything like that but you still have to dress the storm water on the water Health you just go over 5,000 square feet you have to do something to Stone water so like I said if you have a 50ft strip of land here you try to put a let's say 14t driveway here you have very little room to do anything with the storm water at that point without the next guy I mean right now everything flows very quickly as this plan exists without any new hous here across this and down this slope the web to the East and nothing's going to change nothing's going to change that it's just it's one of these situations where this is un unique to Westport where very little Wetlands on this side of the property nothing within basically 200 ft the rest of the property far as Weapons typically you would discharge the weapons and weapons would attenuate that so A lot of times we come inter waivers because it's just going into the China weapon system and it's very little impact this particular case on the first go around we didn't ask we asked for a waiver for the 20% and the and the water quality it was not being acceptable by the board so we came back redesigned plans you have very large ponds like I said you got a ridge that this wide and the pond is taking half of that it's kind of like self-defeating system but it meets the regulations and I think when you guys came in the last time that was because of the concern of the neighbors and and what the development would look like and and I I believe you you you're you're not asking for any storm waterer waivers at whatsoever and the waivers that you are asking for are going to keep the quality of the neighborhood we ask for as little infrastructure as POS because you could build a full-blown Road in there and and have to do I believe M J's brother was concerned about the tree we we Tred to address that the walls as much as they're not walls they much there rows of stones even around the cemetery I've all been dismantled for years but the plan is to maintain as many as possible because it is part of the character people people you know buying these lots are going to want to keep the same character instead that's why you buy them okay is there anybody else yes my name is Warren Barker I live at 254 Cornell Road and I live on that Ridge it continues uh Southwest and um my home burned down in 2008 and Skip Potter showed up put a new septic system in and he said the drainage here is fabulous and so I thought well that's great and I have to admit I as a little suin when I learned that drainage is so great that I my home contributes the nitrogen floating of the West Branch and so um that was disappointing one of these Hammerhead developments uh put in my uh not in my backyard uh on the kinach property which is just down the road a little bit um I was amazed how what kind of access it can provide and um but having been involved with the West Branch Association we had deed restrictions on the ca BL property the last generation signed up and so the land closest to the river couldn't be developed which seemed to be a win but when I look at this I just think think that it's not in keeping with the whole movement to make the two acors MOA Brook and Angeline Brook safe that all that trustees land and trying to tie it up those aqua and protect them and then I see this which I know that the drainage is going to be great and I'm sort of it's more question John than anything if you put the houses over in this area it it's precipitous I mean it falls off and and why doesn't just the septic systems I'm not talking runoff anymore the septic systems just feed um the Moa book and pond and angelines off to the East and they'd have to be a little bit this way to drain down there it seems that our major concern is always about the road that's your ball game um but in terms of the whole shooting match as my mother would say with the houses je by Ja um I would think it'd be quite quite a contribution to nitrogen loading whatever you want I only run this by you because that's what's on my mind yeah and I'd love I tried to figure out how we could get the owners to donate the center to and get it contigous with the trustees land and somehow make it from a tax point of view sort of appealing so only two houses went into to protect it but I I just thought i' voice a concern thanks okay so with the nitrogen load with the nitrogen load uh the Board of Health for new development like this requires denitrifying septic systems they do they do all right well sto stole my thunder yeah I mean all these will haveit obviously because that's what the regulation requires the next regulation I express the concern and with the vegetated buffer the we large weapon system that's actually starts in here but actually goes over here there actually travel driveway that comes through here and forus the motor Pond uh you know the nitron loading yeah there will be a slight increase but they're all they're all going to be required deification and they're all going to require move drains as Mr bark said the drainage here is good it's C type soils it's very grav it's underneath it's that's what I mean you talk about you didn't have it's rain fall over 150 ft you don't get a lot of run off there is no large flow I don't want to think that there's a fire or out ponds or anything like that got salmon upam nature movie or something anybody else you I just need to get um Mr br's address road with no number what's your number there is no house so I don't think it has a number okay I need our home is 73 Avenue p y n New York new york3 thank so is is Clen or Clen and Richard your brother yes my sister so should we be continuing this uh I think we should continue it I think the only issue is is the elevation of these parts the resolution of the groundw levels I think it's fair easy I mean the the plan complies with our subdivision rules and regulations the road complies with our subdivision rules and regulation yes there'll be three homes there but we don't get to decide that we decide whether or not plans comply or don't comply um so I'm assuming so for the purpose of my discussion with s SW Co that the 16t gravel twoot shoulders is adequate yes that's where we ended up okay and in your description of the r ridg line I was sketching as you spoke and it's uh U having it be 150 ft wide is generous in some places it's probably 40 ft wide yeah that's why I was hoping to have the water shed map and yeah I mean I was just generalizing I guess is a good word so how much time do you need Sean to work out differences with if I can contact if I can get in touch with him this week I don't know I'm assuming two four weeks maybe I mean I don't I I know you have two weeks I'm back in front of you on another issue uh that I've inherited but uh if it's four weeks that's fine I mean if you want to get a clean letter I don't know you know the tone of his letter I'm not sure he's ever going to agree on a lot of things but this thing should be very simple this so I just one caveat about scheduling yeah and you're one of the people who schedule schedule us is that when we schedule something it takes a slot it's your slot okay and if you say well we didn't get to it so we're going to continue without any hearing it means that somebody else couldn't be there understood so I mean I just don't I mean I can't see kicking it down the road for two months for a very simple thing um so Sean do you think it's just a ver verification of the groundwater elevation and you have test pits already yeah we have test pits and I submitted soil valuation forms to that's why I don't understand what so I I mean do you think that we could approve it subject to S Cole's review of the reports that Sean submitted to him to I don't know if you want to dis close the public part of the hearing and just uh if they're right and you're wrong right you're going to have to come back to us with something else anybody correct so why don't we just schedule it out for the next meeting and the meeting after that and Mr chair I I have a motion on that if you want talk to Amy about a date uh I move we uh continue the Cory Ridge uh States uh public hearing for June 18th at 6:15 second all those in favor I okay thank you good night thank you next up uh is the 435 old Harbor Road file number 23-37 sbaa public hearing this is continued from January 9th and January 23rd 24 and March 19th 24 request by the applicant to consider converting the existing residents into an adolescent education and housing facility applicant is requesting a continuance until July 16th 24 want a motion please uh Mr chair at the applicant's request I move to continue the public hearing for 4:30 5 old Harbor Road to July 16th 2024 at 6:30 second just question I the assistant planner said last last meeting I think that uh this applicant had not paid was in re on payment of the on the consultant review they were but they have they they have paid fine we wouldn't be continuing all right just good question all those in favor I I uh next is the 645 public hearing for 720 and 725 Old County Road S file number f24 003 sp- CD continued from April 2nd 2024 the applicant is requesting a modification to the special permit common driveway the applicant is also requesting a continuance to June 18th 24 want a motion please uh Mr chair at the applicant's request I move to continue the public hearing for 7:20 and 726 Old County Road to June 8 uh 18th 2024 at 6:30 second all those in favor I I uh assistant planner report my report was mostly the review for Cory Ridge so I will hand it off to okay planner report town meeting update um for those of you who were in at town meeting the the motion to rezone the unrestricted District to the rural Agri or the uh agricultural residential district that carried so that's been rezoned and um working on getting our web map updated to reflect that the also the definition for congregate living that carried so that's now been incorporated into the zoning bylaws the Motions for short-term rentals and changing the way the the planning board looks at minimum lot width those both failed um and so as a followup to that the short-term rental committee um I think they will end up meeting as a as a follow-up meeting to town meeting and I discussed with the chair Roger Menard and it sounds like that's something he would like to do but I think as this is a subcommittee of the planning board I think at this time that the planning board could provide them a recommendation as to what the board's um and what the board's opinion is on that committee moving forward on the committee or on the shortterm rental situation about the this particular committee continuing to exist um the same sort of staff and so I I believe that the short-term rental issue uh is not going away and is going to be even more pronounced than it was before town meeting vote um um and if the short-term rental committee doesn't come up with another bylaw suggestion I think somebody by petition will come with a request and town meeting the town will be forced to have another town meeting to consider that because there so many people that have already accepted deposits on rentals uh they continue to to do it um I think a town meeting gave it really terrible idea of what to do I think Roger Berard Menard made it clear that there was two choices one to approve it so that and if you wanted to amend the days amend the days but to have it still as not allowed use when we have probably hundreds of people that do this um is really a disservice to the town um I mean isn't the state collecting the state is collecting taxes and we get a portion of that and you know should the town send out a blanket letter to everybody in town to ceas and positionist you can't do short-term rentals I mean um I'm not sure how the town would be able to go about doing that just because the Department of Revenue doesn't provide the addresses of short-term rentals and typically on a short-term rental website you're not going to be able to see the address until you actually fill out you know right a say so the town could send a letter to everybody quit yeah I guess it could be to literally everyone but Mr chair um I have a question I sorry I missed the meeting I was in the hospital but um is it your impression that I mean this is an industry uh in a sense uh did the industry support this or did the industry opposed this at time I think the industry oined uh we had the people that came to our hearings yeah did they oppose it or did they uh well so at at the meeting uh there was a lot of discussion as you can imagine and there was an amendment a proposed amendment to change it from 7day minimum to two-day minimum yeah and then there was a lot of discussion about that and then I think somebody called the question on the amendment and then the amendment failed yeah so then we're back to seven days yeah then there was a lot of discussion I can't remember if somebody called the question or not but there were people lined up all over the place to talk about it and I think there was a feeling that that the town was pushing uh this use on the town when it is just an anomaly of our zoning bylaw that you can't rent out a dwelling or room or anything for less than 31 days because that is by the State's definition a short-term rental in a lot of it's a business it's a business and so it's not allowed per Town Council uh and we use that against one of the ones that was uh really just a business somebody bought a house just to do this on San piperline so it's spin Town me town meeting was town meeting was populated with people who didn't want sewer and didn't want uh the planning board zoning articles so there were 600 people and at least half or more were against all that so they voted against all these things especially this one and um the the problem I have with the way town meeting works is that I make a presentation of a zoning article then everybody else gets up and talks and you get multiple people standing behind microphones and start saying things that are just not true and I as the proposer have no ability to get up and say that's not true and so what people have in their heads when they go to vote is all this other stuff yeah and we really need to pass some kind of article that allows rentals that are shortterm not just airbnbs but people who rent out their house people have a family Cottage that's been in their their their family for years and years and they rented out to Jo blow and they've done it for 25 years and that guy Rents It for 3 days or 3 weeks in the in June you can't do that anymore well do you need a motion to continue the uh uh to work with the zoning board and uh others uh on this issue uh for the future presentation the town meeting or you want a motion yeah I don't think you need a motion to continue the the short-term rental committee but I think we need a motion to I think to say that we should continue it right because in order for you know if the short-term rental committee were to start meeting again and the planning board said no you know what we don't want to take up this issue again then you know they would need to wrap up and approve some minutes and then dissolve the committee well I I'm getting different things that chair says we should and oh no I I'm I think we're saying the same thing we need to continue the commit okay so you don't need a motion we need a motion to do that all right I would move can I just say one thing yeah respect it before you make your motion that uh I I mean this is just having been on the committee and seen all sides and heard all the arguments pro and con and it's such a convoluted and very contentious issue and uh I can see us spending another almost 12 months on this and going back to town meeting and becoming another man Tucket I mean they've turned down short-term rental proposals several times and including what a couple weeks ago yes yeah and it's happened in many other towns just because it is so difficult there's so many points of view and people are so um adamant about their their point their side so and it's sort of a you can't please any you know you'll never please everybody obviously so I don't know I I'm willing I guess I'm saying I'm willing to serve on the committee again but I can see it ending up being another feudal attempt just just the the difficulty is it is such a longstanding accepted tradition you know that virtually everyone that I know has rented a cottage you know I mean that's not much oh well this is this is a strange thing everyone does this and and then we have the legal determination saying th those that activity L than 31 days is essentially your business and businesses are not allowed in the residential district so now we have this legal opinion and what we try to do is to say well let's make it permitted which is what we did and then say then we had to Define what what a short-term rental is and there a lot of debate about that is it is it 2 days is it 3 days is it is it 5 days is is it you know that you know we get people say well you know we had a funeral in my brother flew in he had to stay just one night you know you know and then and then we said said well it won't we the town won't regulate it because it's it's an allowed use what we'll do is but but it ought to be responsive to the the questions of like where is this going on and what you know who's doing it and who's renting it um we said just to a self registration with the uh with the building department so that if something happens we know who to contact and and I don't know if if if the the will of the Town people is well yeah you can make it a loud use but you can't do anything about it you know if that's is that is that where it is you know you can say well why don't we leave it like it is that but you can't I mean we did mention in in the in the select board last night and and I think that the committee's going to continue to move on with it but you know one of the one of the problems that I see is um these historical families that that did this and this new business that's coming on the scene and I think that's kind of what shot it down the new business coming on the scene so one of the things I did mention in there is is you know cuz now they're saying well how are we going to it's illegal so legal says it's illegal we're going to en force it we're going there it's only en Force offic is going to be real busy shutting all these things down but I'm like well these these these historical Cottages that were in these families I mean wouldn't that be pre-existing non-conforming if they've done it if they've done it forever right I mean it's not a new era at B&B it's you know cuz you have some of these people that are just that income is how they're surviving and that's how they're keeping this Cottage in the family and all this other stuff and some of them have done it for 100 years I mean what happens you you going to say oh you can't do that now no the whole point of it was to say you can do it now right but that's what I'm saying these people are afraid that that's getting they weren't educated on what's going to happen here and they're just going to lose the re reason I think we should continue I I lost my first election for mayor then I won just because you lose doesn't mean you give up because losing can be part of the educational process and and I think that's what I consider this is this is all part of the educational process about about this so I I would move that um considering that uh air the short-term rentals are part of westport's history but the trend in what they are turning into is a threat to the character of Westport and uh despite the uh defeat at town meeting this problem is not going away it is in fact getting worse and there are legal issues in that short-term rentals are technically illegal we do have a problem that needs to be solved and so I recommend that uh the committee uh continue to work with the zoning board members of uh the industry and it is an industry uh to find a way uh to uh uh improve the suggested answer to this problem for submission to uh the select board and town meeting is that a motion that was a motion second all those in favor I I okay uh continue I second did that B did you get the whole motion yeah that motion was like eight paragraphs we we have contracted with par engineering to draft a it's basically drafting a whole new Hazard mitigation plan the plan is 20 years old so they're going to be rebuilding it from the ground up and um Bob Jim you'll both be on there I'm recruiting number of different folks from the Police Department fire department Harbor Master the whole works um so I met with par last last week and hoping to get started up sometime next month how about somebody from the Board of Health oh yeah some I that wasn't an exclusive list Board of Health uh re reaching out to different nonprofits they like some representation from businesses as well so if you have any actually I was going to ask you all if you have any businesses that are uh or you have any contacts for people who own businesses in vulnerable locations you think they might want to participate in this trips okay trips back well but do you have contact information yeah C trip at trips yep and um probably the oyster here yeah the oysters I do have I have kst you have Kon yeah you know and you know all those fishing uh boats are their own you know individual businesses you could get that from the barber Mas yeah MH yeah Chris emailed me today he said keep me updated so harbard Master will be be at those meetings I was going to have an update on our online permitting because I thought we were going to have a vendor by this meeting but we haven't contracted with anyone yet um so that'll hopefully be wrapped up at our by the time for our next meeting regarding the coastal zone management Grant application I've been talking to I'm gonna lank on the name of the firm's name Courtney was on the doorstep when we came in this morning or this she was we had earlier today we had um an MVP meeting so it's a GZA I I been in contact with GZA to see if they'll help us out with um a grand application so post Zone management Grant they said that they were interested so hopefully um Chris Capone and I can we're going to try to connect with them sometime this week or next week talk about P pulling together an application for coastal zone management Grant to develop a beach management plan so that' be for East Beach and other barrier beaches and then last weekend or last weekend last week I met with um the town of Dartmouth and the City of New Bedford I was over in Dartmouth for this meeting we're working on coordinating a bike way from um from Fall River to New Bedford we've already started with applying to the mass Trails Grant to create the stub from Fall River into Westport the route from from that meeting we kind of coales on having a um joint application through the transportation Improvement program to improve Route Six that seems to be the mo would have the most utility as a transportation Network there was a route considered um and what so from Westport it would go up to Old Bedford Road and then continue off um to New Bedford that way there's significantly fewer um points of access on that that route to roadways and businesses and Residences so the um kind of the the route that would bring the most benefit would be on on Route Six and then also we can it's easier to tap the state to get those funds as well so um this is apparently a of a higher priority um Statewide bike way Network so um hoping we can continue getting some keeping some momentum going with this project and um I think they're trying to get from Providence to the C right all yeah from Providence all the way to to the cape yeah what what are people doing I mean you're going to have people biking to work on one W 6 it's not to view I because if you're a bike the these weekend people they want to go through these country roads they don't want to go along with six right so the the the point of that this would be more of a transportation Network so the the actually I learned in this meeting that the SRTA route that goes from Fall River to New Bedford is the most heavily used route in their system and so if you're thinking about trying to create connections to that you know non-motorized connections to that route a bike path could be helpful to help you know give that last mile um connection for people trying to access from different parts of town and new and dark yeah I mean maybe it would support one of these bike rental companies you know where you pick up your bike in Fall River and you go to New Bedford and and that's not to say that we shouldn't pursue both bike routes I I think there's there's value in having both the more Scenic the more recreational path um through a more rural area and then having the one that is a little bit more oriented towards getting people from point A to point B so and I think our colleagues at in Dartmouth and New Bedford also see value in having the more recreational one but for now prioritizing the type of network that would trans transport people from point A to point B especially because when you're going in applying for different state funds they're going to look at access to environmental justice neighborhoods and you know the concentration population concentrations um that you're going to get along Route Six um and access to businesses that you'll get along Route Six than you would from a recreational trail so that's why that's prioritized but I think everyone there agreed the recreational one would be an ass to to the Greater Community it's just when you're trying to go get those funds it's going to be a little bit more challenging yeah I mean I'm not promoting the the recreational route because it does create a lot of issues with very narrow roads and blockage of you know it's dangerous frankly because well the bikers go off in they're in groups and they don't hug the shoulder they two two or three across sometimes then they so I watch car is trying to get around them just another car is coming the other direction we have that problem in the harbor during some of the big bike things so the the goal can't get out so it's ack it's a two-edged sword I mean it's nice to have that Recreation the the intent for this would be for it to all be a separated Trail so a shared use Trail that's separate from the roadway now with the route six option there are some locations where it might have to be just due to um due to limited right of way width um particularly they called out some locations in Dartmouth where they actually need to maintain the capacity of two lanes in in both Direction um it's going to restrict the ability to have a a uh separate bike lane from from the road Network so what they're what we're thinking is is you know Road Network and then having a buffer strip in the center and then the shared used trail and parts of Dartmouth uh sured think thinks that there's not going to be the width available to do something like that but for a recreational trail the thought was um for that Northern route to also have it completely separate from from the RO Network as well so you know I was originally uh thinking Route 6 is a crazy place to to encourage bike traffic but now that you mention it as part of the transportation system I I think in New Bedford you know the most bicycle traffic is uh Seafood workers going uh Central American Seafood workers going from the North End y along mathur drive down to the processing plants in the south end and it's not Recreation it's how to get to work when you don't own a car so you're absolutely right about that one that's one thing uh the planner from New Bedford had said is that they get substantial amount of use from that community particularly for that that purpose they do the same in Newport my nephew has a restaurant there and they all the people that work in all the stores and restaurants and everything they mostly bicycle mhm so but that's it okay zoning boort of appeals notices I haven't looked at so notice of decision to convert an existing single family structure into a detached one bedroom accessory structure and they granted that special permit and a butter notification at 795 Pine Hill Road application for a special permit to convert a portion of an existing structure into a detached one-bedroom accessory apartment of 866 Square ft a notice of decision for the Bayside Restaurant to expand the outdoor seating area to include a non deck shelf area approximately 1800 square ft front of the existing wooden deck area and they granted that request a butter notification for 17 Franklin Avenue to separate they're looking for a variance to separate two dwellings onto their own individual Lots such drawings let's see about notifications a little confusing don't they have to come to the planning board to get a Sit go if they're going to split their Lots they did that already they did that already so why do they need to they they separated the Lots last year so they made two lots out of one so what do they need from the zoning board to make him buildable for us I'll follow up on that and see what that's about butter notification at 672 River Road request for special parent to construct a two-story garage that will include a detached one bedroom access apartment no larger than 900 ft and that brings us to meeting minutes I guess accessory apartments are getting to be a hot thing Mr chair there three sets of minutes um which I've read I I cannot uh move the April 16th because I was absent but I I can move a approval of April 2nd and uh um May 7 May uh 23rd yes uh so I move approval of those two sets of minutes and I will move the minutes of April 16th I was there second okay do we have a second to John second okay do you mean April 23rd so let's let's vote them individually all right I move April 2nd second all those in favor I I April 16th um I move the adoption of the of April 16th second April 23rd 16th or 23rd 16th 16 okay call a vote all those in favor I I I move April 23rd second all those in favor I I invoices WB Mason stylus pen for iPads $26 .98 I move we approve the WB Mason invoice for $26.98 second all those in favor I [Applause] I matters not reasonably anticipated within 48 Hours hearing none hopefully J second all those in favor I I those just said 20 minutes