call the meeting to order at 7:31 p.m. let's all stand honor America salute to the flag pledge allegiance to to the flag of the United States of America to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with li and justice for all we get a roll call Mr Z Mrs aelina here Mrs Cooper present Mr Cado here Mrs Martin Mrs P here Mrs Peterson here miss pin here Mr patus here Mr Garcia here M cor the New Jersey open public meeting law was enacted to ensure the right of the public to have advanced notice of and to attend the meetings of public bodies at which any business affecting their interest is discussed or acted upon in accordance with the provisions of this act the Westwood Regional Board of Education has caused notice of this meeting to be sent to the following announcing time and place thereof Westwood burrow Hall Westwood Public Library Township of Washington administration building Township of Washington free public library the record community life and pasak press can I get a motion for minute approval Miss peek can I get a second Miss aelina discussion roll call Mrs aelina yes Mrs Cooper yes Mr cassado yes Mr Garcia yes Mrs peek yes Mrs Peterson yes Miss pin yes Mr patus yes motion carried hey and we moving along to superintendent report Dr Mortimer welcome back thank you good evening everybody I don't have a formal report uh tonight Monday was my first day back in the office uh what I will say is I'm working on a parent letter that I started with some very important updates about facilities and air conditioning and all the uh topics that I know everyone is interested in and I'll be putting that out within the next few days thank you Dr mmer and for the board president's report I'm going to actually foro my president's report this evening um for the business administrative report Mr zado yes so um it's uh that time of year year in which we're working on the 2425 budget I know we've discussed uh multiple things with the finance committee and that will be discussed later um uh March 7th will be the board um budget work session in which we have a meeting uh public meeting and we will just be discussing strictly the budget um with the board um and getting a little more into the details uh the regular schedule meeting for March is on March 21st um in tonight's uh Finance section I just wanted to uh make mention uh we are I have on there for approval of the uh purchase of two Vans um these Vans will be replacing the current vans that are have are well one was put out of service last year another one will uh come to end of life this year uh the Vans we utilize for our transportation um uh primarily the special needs uh we were able to get larger vans that we may be able to utilize for for sports uh the smaller teams uh we'll be working with the coaches to see who can uh get the uh it's not a full CDL but it's a passenger endorsement so that they can drive those vans for those particular teams which would help with uh busing for uh um in the afternoon when it's scarce um and I will conclude my report with that this evening thank you Mr zado for my favorite report here can we move on to the student report please uh good evening to begin the report we start preschool in February the preschool students continue to work as cooks weers and customers and cashiers in the restaurant themed classroom the students are having a lot of fun making different crafts that go along with the restaurant themed centers for example students made pancakes pizzas and ice cream cone crafts these activities helped to build students fine motor skills by coloring and cutting um as for the elementary school the month of February was full of celebrations and activ activities at the elementary schools the national school counsel's week was kicked off with students creatively expressing their gratitude for the vital role played by the school counselors in their lives the theme for this year's celebration highlighted the importance of standard-based and student focused School counseling which ensures that students are guided towards brighter Futures in addition the 100th day of school was celebrated on February 12th with great enthusiasm and excitement the students and teachers were recognized for their achievements and it was an excellent opportunity to engage with the students in fun and interactive activities that allowed them to explore the concept of reaching 100 days of school throughout the month the elementary schools continue to spread love and kindness through various activities such as Spirit weeks School assemblies and motivating each School Community with the excitement of upcoming events in Spring concerts these events served as a reminder of the importance of community engagement and the power of positivity in creating a conducive learning environment moving on to the high school for academics um recently the AP art history Advanced art Art and Design and jewelry students at the high school visited the Metropolitan Museum of Art to look at current exhibitions and learn more about cont contemporary pieces Mr deblasio's honors design thinking class traveled to the American dream mall where they created social media content to upload on their Instagram and Tik Tok accounts to help improve the mall's population they separated into five groups and devised an itinerary and marketing plan to produce up to 15 pieces of content to edit and upload their main goal was to help increase the mall's population and to attract more people through social media all high school tend all high school students attended the assembly titled not my kid by stevenh Hill which was centered around addiction and Recovery Westwood Regional School counseling Quarter Two District newsletters available to view parents and students can access the newsletter either in their inbox or through the district counseling website um as for athletics congratulations to the indor track athlete Brooke Wickman uh the state sectional champion and berken County champion in the high jump Brooke will compete in the overall group two championships this Saturday in Tom's River the wrestling team finished their season very strongly 18-3 um bringing home the title of big North duels Champions and Patriot League champions the competition cheerleading squad also earned a patriot League champions title and will compete alongside the elite eight at American Dream mall tomorrow in hopes of being crowned as the overall big North Champion outlasting 30 other teams the boys B in defeated MAA on their first state match and they will square off against Indian Hills next ice hockey will play wine in their opening round of their state tournament and boys and girls basketball both begin their state tournaments next week and hope to make deep runs in their respective brackets good evening next up for Performing Arts the Woodington players are working hard to rehearse for their production Annie a highlight from this past week Brownie troop 98195 stopped by rehearsal the musical will will take place from March 14th through March 16th tickets are now available for purchase on showtix4u.com as for clubs the debate team hosted the last Varsity debate tournament on February 5th winning multiple Awards here at home wakaa recently had their Regional competition where they scored first place in Region 2 becoming Region 2 super quiz Champions and went home with 60 medals and five plaques congratulations to all waca members and their amazing coach Mr Thomas and good luck at your state competition the environmental Club is excited to announce that a greenhouse is set to be installed in the science Courtyard tomorrow once built the plan the club plans on expanding projects of planning flowers and other plants for everyone to enjoy the BSU is celebrating Black History Month by honoring important historical figures with quotes provided daily to students and has been having baked sales and ribbon sales to gather funds to to donate to black girls code and their senior scholarship they will also be hosting a movie night later this month they welcome the Westwood Community to join them on February 29th at 5:00 p.m. to watch a screening of Soul Westwood Regional High School recently went live at lunch with our version of Jeopardy called West Woody thank you to teacher Mrs petracelli and her crew for hosting such a fun event check out their YouTube channel Westwood HSV and film thank you to the West ww HSV and film for providing Daily News at Westwood to students and staff a few dates to keep in mind include the college fair on February 28th at Bergenfield High School from 7: to 9:00 p.m. parents and students will be able to meet College representatives and learn about programs and scholarships on February 29th at 5:00 p.m. the BSU will be holding a Black History Month celebration movie night and March 2nd Westwood is holding the Academic Decathlon state competition everyone is welcome to attend the super quiz at the end of the day come support wakaa and cheer them on as they work hard to hopefully make it to Nationals again finally attention Juniors West Point summer leaders experience SLE is a weeklong immersion into the academic military and social life of a West Point Cadet Cadet excuse me at SLE you will explore West Point from all angles including high- Tech educational facilities team building athletic activities and realistic military training SLE applications are accepted from February 1st through March 15th of your junior year in high school and that concludes our report thank you thank you Miss Mala and miss delion and now moving along to committee reports of policy and governance chairperson Miss aelina please thank you president Garcia uh the committee met virtually this Monday for the first meeting of the new year with Dr Mor M presant we welcomed you back um we had a short but very productive session we were able to finalize discussions about live streaming excuse me which we're glad to have back and we heard directly from Dr murer herself on policies 9244 and 5756 our next meeting is scheduled iners for March 11th 2024 thank you Miss Alina now moving on to finance and facility chairperson Mr pus please thank you Mr Garcia uh finance and Facilities committee met on February 7th uh an attendance for Mr gado Mrs Martin myself Mr Garcia Mr Rosado Mr Becker Mr ravanetti and Dr M um we got a an overview of the uh 2425 budget including uh many of the projects that are uh in in the pipeline right now uh I'll I won't go into detail there's really there's a lot of projects happening which is great um I believe Dr Mo said she will have an update soon on on the so I'll def further her uh those details uh this concludes my report next meeting is scheduled for April 18th with the 37 uh budget other meeting thanks thank you Mr P move along to curriculum and instruction chairperson Miss peek please [Laughter] okay anyway I don't want hopefully can hear me I don't want to time um curriculum and programs met on February 6th um in attendance was myself miss perin Mr Garcia Miss Calderon and uh Miss valz and Dr Mortimer was um virtual with us um we talk we changed the meeting time of our meetings going forward um to 5m which I think we're gonna have to change again they provided um some data about the math science and Ela um and we looked at the 5-year Trend and we looked at our qac data Trends um all of the links have been provided early right Dr Mor they're all um the administration is looking at what supports can be added to Middle School for Math um they're uh looking at academic support positions specifically um there was a review of the math special education and Ela three-year plan um and the Strategic plan and um they reviewed we reviewed the purpose and criteria needed to implement Ela and math classes for students in grades six through 10 um we the discussion of instruction at Middle School resulting in ideas that can support the extra classes recommendation was made to review the required highly qualified certification needed um staffing needs they have a wish list drafted that the district Fields will support academics and the Strategic math and Ela plans um there's a there's a review of um the lack of time provided for core subjects because of contract recess electives and other master schedule constraints um we will be piloting a new word study program in grade three and they cleaned up the K2 word study in C in the curriculum for small group instruction um there was also a list of books that were going to be ordered for the high school um we had a a brief discussion about one of the books uh breathe and count back from 10 and we're waiting for more information on that book um they we discussed the the high school teachers I believe it was discussed a um a need to create a chat GPT AI Integrity policy um and stme has not put forth a policy yet a draft policy to be brought to the policy committee summer planning the summer Ed the summer Adventure summer enrichment and extended school year use of federal Title One title three fund to support instruction the coordinator is going to be Christina Lamb and um there was a teacher interest meeting and the program will run from July 1st through July 26th um we discussed the fifth grade health curriculum that was removed from from the curriculum in September um and the three board members in attendance are in favor of following the recommendation of the superintendent to bring the district into compliance and the next um curriculum and instruction meeting will be March 12th thank you Miss peek and for negotiations chairperson Martin is not here tonight so miss P can you stand in the I can read thank you uh the negotiations committee met on February 8th along with the teachers union we reviewed the parts of the contract that created an impass during last year's discussions we came to an agreement on several points and are encouraged by the progress so far our next meeting is February 29th thank you Miss peek and following right up Miss pek show superintendent search chairperson Peck please um during the week of February 5th the board interviewed eight impressive candidates for the position of the Westwood Regional School District superintendent of schools given the level of talent and enthusiasm of the sleep of candidates the board made the difficult but unanimous decision to advance four candidates forward for second interviews which we will be conducting during the last week of February our search process comprises three rounds of interviews and we intend to hold final interviews in early March thank you for all the committee reports and chairpersons appreciate it moving right along we have Awards and recognitions Mr pus can you please read motion Awards and recognitions motion that upon the recommendation of the superintendent the following resolution be adopted she's here you can go whereas staff members have been given have given unselfishly of their time and effort in the interest and Welfare of the students of our district and whereas during the many years in The District staff members support the achievement and educational needs of the students of the Westwood Regional School District and whereas staff members have influenced the lives of many students with their unwavering commitment and have earned the respect and admiration of their parents the community and their colleagues and whereas the Westwood Regional School District would like to recognize in honor the following staff members who have tendered their resignation for the purpose of retirement Frank D pasquali do I read him yeah are you what yeah read read him Frank Bali custodian 48 years uh and 48 years of service uh to the district is Frank here no Frank's not here oh Frank's not here all right okay uh Rosemary Fox teacher uh 22 years of service with with restwood regional total years of service and education 25 and Linda uh hope I'm pronouncing this right uh trcy secretary 20 years of service with Westwood Regional total years of service and education 20 now therefore be it resolved that the Westwood Regional Board of Education hereby recognizes the staff members contributions to their district and expresses its appreciation of their dedicated service and directs the board secretary to include this resolution in the official minutes of the Board of Education and directs the superintendent of schools to present the staff members with a copy as a token of its esteem second uh second second who was second u m Miss Beck all in favor I I congratulations I think Mrs Tracy is is here tonight you want to come down Mr Tracy and M spring can you please read can you please read motion a I'll try Okay um wait motion a motion B motion B motion B sorry um motion that upon the recommendation of the superintendent the following resolution be adopted whereas Eagle Scout represents the highest achievement or rank attainable in the scouts BSA program of the Boy Scouts of America and whereas the Westwood Regional School District would like to recognize kin bril 11th grade student for earning the rank of Eagle Scout and now therefore be it resolved that the Westwood Regional Board of Education hereby congratulates Caitlyn bril for this accomplishment directs the secretary to include this resolution ution and the official minutes of the Board of Education and directs the superintendent of schools to present the student with a suitable certificate of recognition can we get a second all in favor all in favor all right Kaitlin would you speaking using the mic yeah I guess so um so for my project I um I put together 15 music therapy kits for a Memory Care Facility in Emerson and in those kits I uh put percussion instruments and I also put together 30 music binders with different like song lyrics in them like recognizable songs and as the last part of my project I performed a concert with my friends uh with a couple of like patriotic songs because it happened to be during 9911 so I thought that that was just a perfect fit and it was just it was great I was like really happy with how it came out it was just it was awesome so yeah thank you again thank you so much congratulations okay moving right along we are up to the uh agenda item public forum during this first public forum District residents and staff are invited to address the board of education on agenda items specifically listed on this evening's agenda board policy 0167 requires that individuals sign the speaker's list giving name and Municipality of Resident and specific agenda item on which a member of the public plans to speak and ask that all remarks be directed to the board as a whole not individuals the board ask that members of the public be courteous and mindful of Rights of other individuals when speaking although the board may not respond to items raised during the public forum all public comments will be considered and may be discussed tonight under the appropriate agenda items or quote unquote new business at this meeting at subsequent meetings under quote unquote old business or during a board committee meeting if appropriate each speaker statement will be limited to 3 minutes in duration the first public forum will be limited to 30 minutes in duration we will now open public session at 7:55 p.m. Karina Fox I'm Karina Fox I live in the township of Washington and I'm speaking about um item a under policy the policy 5756 I I read some information on social media and I'm thinking it may be misinformation um I read it on a Facebook page um that uh a member of this board is an admin of and even though this post was not written by that trustee I would hope that as an admin the trustee would not be complicit in the spread of misinformation by uh having that post up the post spoke about female students and changing areas such as bathrooms and locker rooms with males present um they referenced 50 756 so I would imagine that this is about uh transgender students the author was unhappy with the oh the author said that he emailed the board and was referred to policy 5756 the author was unhappy with the responses and then went on to reference the unfair Advantage trans athletes will have in female sports once I was officially once I was finally able to get past the shock and awe and close-mindedness of this post and amazing ability of the author to sum somehow play the victim around a completely under represented and marginalized Community I came to a question which I'm hoping maybe you can answer my question is does the Board of Education have the authority to change the rules about bathrooms changing facilities and sports thank you would anybody else like to speak seeing no one we will close the public session at time is it 7:58 turn it over to Dr Mortimer if you want to answer that question and take your time I was going to say one word actually for to answer the question the question is no the board does not have that right thank you okay moving along to administrative governance Miss pek can you please move the Motions in administrative governance I'd like to make a motion to move um agenda item sorry administrative governments agenda item a can I have a second Mr pus second discussion see no discussion we have a roll call Mr Rado Mrs aelina yes Mrs Cooper yes Mr cassado yes Mrs P yes Mrs Peterson yes Miss greine yes Mr pus yes Mr Garcia yes motion carried thank you very much now moving along to policy Miss aseno can you please move the Motions in policy yes um motion to move items a through D can I have a second Miss PE second discussion Miss Cooper yeah yeah thank you thank you um one of the questions that I have is what were the other policies that were looked at or considered that might have served as a better model that did not exclude parents because I think the Crux of the issue is the parental exclusion not the protection of trans students so what did we look at because that's been the Crux of the issue around this very difficult policy I put this to any member of the policy committee that may answer Miss chairperson will you not answer Miss aelina um I would like to uh give a reminder to anyone on this dayis that uh policy 0155 which was amended by the former board prohibits anyone from speaking about committee meeting minutes in public without the board majority approval and since best practice dictates that we follow policy and refrain from speaking or answering questions that would violate this protocol I don't think you're going to receive the answers because I'm not allowed to discuss without if you want to take a vote I'm sure we can but I would never want to put you in a position of violating policy please let finish yes sorry um I think we just need to be mindful of this before we are voicing and I am also happy to answer any email that is sent to me I know I owe you one y anyone else discussion Miss Peterson so after the last meeting um we agreed to table 5756 so that the board could ask questions and discuss the policy with Vic who is our board attorney and that was supposed to occur tonight in executive session we got into executive session and there was a complete bait and switch by the president of this board and some other board members who took a vote in executive session to have the board attorney leave so this board has not been able to ask Vic our board attorney any questions related to 5756 actually I take that back there were some questions that were answered but following the last meeting I and several others had been compiling a list of of additional questions that we had for him so we were not able to ask any of those questions to him tonight the board has not done its due diligence uh behind this policy and I would like to understand why that happened is there anybody else before Miss Cooper speaks we're going to let everybody speak and then Mr Cado so if we could ask Dr morar I want to ask you a couple questions I was going to ask Vic though I I do want to caution you where as we've talked about many times to not put somebody on the spot also there should be no surprises but I will allow you continue I don't think these will be too bad but if you say that you want to answer privately I'd be okay with that I just I wanted to ask Vic that's why I had this question prepared I didn't get to do that and I did ask Mr Conley a similar question that was the rationale along with others why we were supposed to take this up with the attorney but so my specific question is related to the policy as it's written from what I understand does not require the staff to inform parents of when pretty large life decisions are being made by children minors let's say for this example gender identity so I'm trying to figure out how the school would decide whether or not to notify parent is that it I'd have a couple layers to it if I got an answer to that part first my answer to that question is we would consult with the district's attorney any else discussion Miss Peterson so Dr Mortimer um we tried to consult with the District's attorney and that was shut down tonight so any other suggestions anybody else Miss peek I I don't believe Mr cusat's question was about asking the attorney tonight I think it was to Dr mourer what would a how would the school handle it if a student came out and did the the school the student didn't want the teacher or the adult to tell the parent correct I think so so Dr mortimer's response was we would consult with the attorney on that individual situation also I believe we've had a lot of really lengthy conversations about this issue this is only a first reading there's 's a lot of time between now and the next meeting for questions to be emailed to the attorney and for the attorney to have a chance to respond to them Dr Mortimer if you'd like to answer I would like to add something I um I want to point out this has been a topic of discussion for a long time now we have a nine-page opinion letter from the attorney that was given to all of the board members on November it's dated November 30th 2023 um the fee for that letter from the attorney was $62.50 there were additional charges throughout November I only have the November in December bill here and the charges total $2,187 I feel as though this is my recommendation to the board that's why it's on the agenda this way I feel as though everybody every professional myself included has done uh due diligence to get answers to the board as to um what the attorney's recommendation is and what the guidance is so I really feel at this point the board should proceed with the first reading of this policy I think a lot of money has been spent on it I think the attorney has been extremely clear in his opinion and I really think that we need to put a period at the end of this we also have the transgender student guidance for school districts from the NJ dooe to help us and I think that there should be no additional delay in reinstating this policy thank you Dr Moor anybody else anybody else before following Robert's Rules i' like everybody to speak if they are willing to prior to anybody else speaking on their second third time no Miss Cooper thank you so I would never ask anyone to violate policy I did note that in January this was in committee and the minutes were also approved and released to the public based on then and there in that meeting were other alternative policies that did not exclude parents invest investigated reviewed was any illegal opinion and done about what other Alternatives would be and then my second question is why are the committee meetings minutes not available to the public tonight it sounds like it was you said a short but productive meeting so why aren't the meeting minutes available for approval tonight is that what you said did I misunderstand I may have misunderstood what are you saying about the meeting you're saying that you're you cannot talk about anything that's not approved and the meeting minutes for policy were not on the agenda for tonight for approval is that right maybe I misunderstand it's possible I don't I I misunderstand I thought I saw in in Rene's email to be to be submitted after after tonight which is unusual the policy committee Monday night so that's what she said pending the results of the policy committee meeting the minutes from that meeting are on the agenda for tonight and we we're accepted and we're AC I'm sorry so so so I don't understand why we can't why we can't discuss were other were other um policies considered instead of this one that's causing so much angst and straight answer I don't think you need his approval answer I think you can just answer if you Laura U Miss Cooper please miss aen if you'd like to answer thank you um I'm going to read to you what I wrote and then just how we interpret it um this was revised on 20 July 2023 it says committee meetings shall not be open to the public except that a majority of the committee or the chair's person may open the meeting to the public or invite persons without whose knowledge know or expertise may be useful to the committee committee meetings and discussions are recognized as advisory consultative and deliberative and therefore all the verbal and written content discussed or shared in those meetings that is predecisional and meets the above criteria is confidential and shall not be made available to the public unless approved by the majority of the board this excludes written content provided by committee meetings agenda So within the parameters of that and how I'm reading that especially where it says predecisional and meets the ABR criteria is confidential and shall not be made available to the public unless approved by the majority of the board I therefore have a hard time answering these questions about what the committee considered what the committee came to and the delegations based on the policy that in all due respect was amended very recently y so that's my hangup and that's where I am in terms of what I am and I'm not going to answer as the chairperson of policy if I am reading that wrong I stand to be corrected and would be um but that's that's my answer to that so I'm going to say I forwent my president report really had to do with us controlling these debates and we've already en enacted Robert's Rules of Order so I will say you know I was being a little bit lenient here and going to show of good faith to see if we can kind of fix some of the issues we had last time where the conversations went round and round and round and round three-hour meeting last time should have been about an hour and a half if we follow Robert's Rules of Order you have two points you can discuss twice on each agenda item now I'm going to say right now we are going to start following that moving forward these discussions Miss Cooper I see your hand you can keep it up there if you'd like but um so we're really spending a lot of time as Dr mmer said saying the same thing now you guys have said certain people have stated that they're not getting answers and I unequivocally refute that and there's a huge difference between not receiving an answer and not accepting an answer so I'm going to read as you guys had made as a couple people had made this is from Vic and the following statement summarizes opinion their opinion we believe that having a clear policy outlining the rights of transgender students and the responsibilities of Staff staff members when dealing with these issues and staff following that policy best protects the district against potential claims of discrimination or lawsuits it's very clear but you continue to ask the question over and over again because you're not liking the answer and what I've said before and I'll say again it would be most productive in my opinion if we started to talk about the things that we agree with that could be amended or improved I'd like to move the vote a second Mr pus to question move to question that so you move you move the question he second so now so now we'll vote we'll vote to move the question so you're voting to end disc so we're not following Robert's Rules no the the motion on the floor was to call you call the question call the question got but discussion is being shut down without following Robert's Rules the the the motion on the floor is to call the question I'm that is Robert R I'm taking a roll call now so a motion was put on the floor to shut down discussion before discussion was complete to End discussion and and End discussion and then take a a roll call on the agenda items that were passed right so the president wants to shut down discussion without following Robert's rules that is Robert's Rules no it's not yes it is that's there's rul says that every member sitting on this Das can speak at least twice I don't want to speak has that occurred had that have you not spoken to no has Mr kusada two I did one I want two Robert's Rules Jay Robert rules fully under this isn't a discussion right now back and forth either so we'll go ahead and move forward if you want to finish your SE time Doug Mr cassado and then miss Peterson so just that I understand this right we're talking about getting information I asked a question last month very similar to the question I just asked I didn't get an answer fully I got a recommendation to speak to the attorney then the attorney was in the room based on originally having that we were told we couldn't speak to to the attorney about it I asked now the returning superintendent and I was told to go back to the attorney for some reason it founds like this is a big cyclic discussion when we could have just had it an hour ago Miss Peterson there's a massive game being played up on this Das right now where you Mr Garcia are preventing this board and the board members that want to obtain additional legal opinion on this very important topic that is going to allow little boys or grown men to use the restrooms the locker rooms the changing facilities play on the same sports with our daughters and you're allowing that to pass without us doing our due diligence and I understand that there is law in New Jersey that permits this but this policy is not required and I think we as a Bo board have a right and an obligation to not be Yes Men I said this before when someone says jump you do not say how high we need to stand up for what we believe is wrong and if you're voting yes on implementing this policy it basically says to me that you support allowing this happening in our schools and to our children why are we why are we marginalizing the majority of our students for the benefit of one or two kids how could anyone up here be okay with that are you done Miss Peterson so you said this over and over again I'll actually I don't need to respond right Mr cassado did you have your second time are we all have your second so I will say and I'll add this over and over again I repeat myself I may sound like a broken record this is not about what I believe this is about a policy we have teachers faculty that are out there we do not want to put our district in liabil way and have them interpret the laws policies and this district is not your sword to fight against Trenton Miss Cooper has said over and over again that she's gone to Trenton good that's what you're supposed to do furthermore last year it was the you talked about it as if it was the majority this year you talk about it like you're fighting for the minority one make up your minds two policy once again is to guide our faculty and staff it's not your job to do anything but that and these policies are in place to help protect the district and guide our teachers and faculty move to vote please second I actually have discussion on a different on a different policy Miss aelina second Mr Garcia we have not had discussion on every policy on this agenda we've talked about 5756 I have other discussion on 9244 you have a there's a motion on the floor to to vote so we need we have a motion on floor call the question and we have a second so again we're not going to follow Robert's Rules Mrs aelina yes Mrs Cooper no Mr cassado we didn't talk about all of them so no Mrs P yes Mrs Peterson no Miss pin yes Mr berus yes Mr Garcia yes 23 we don't have it so you need two3 vote on that so we can't close it I'm sorry continue discussion still open didn't think that one through keep talking M Peterson go ahead does anybody have further discussion Mr cassado so the changes to 9244 um could someone explain those to me where the logic for those changes came from anybody else Miss Peterson Mr kusada from what I understand the board actually isn't implementing changes to 9244 they want to abolish it completely so parental notification they want to abolish um so I do actually have a question for Dr Mortimer on 9244 so can you help me understand what policies exist to ensure parents are notified um of circumstances that are not covered by other policies and I'll use a couple examples here so if a student suddenly demonstrates anxiety like or depression like uh traits or behaviors What policies are in place to require the school district to notify parents of that the answer I have for you Mrs Peterson is my attorney wrote a letter to you and the other board members back in October or November that outlined all of the other policies that do cover parental notification so I would refer you to that letter I actually read through that letter before we came but there are no policies that uh require notification to occur for the two uh examples I just used so if I'm missing that I apologize could you refer me to those policies any other discussion is there any other discussion in favor we're going to alternate opposition to in favor this isn't opposition it's just discussion discussion Mr Cado Excuse Me Miss Pederson please be recognized you can't just speak Mr cassado I was just going to ask is someone going to answer her question is that it yes any other discussion Miss Cooper so we went through a very exhaustive effort when we implemented 9244 to point out all of the things that were not covered by the various other policies so I'm at a loss about why this policy needs to be rescinded at this time and what what are the concerns that the the that people on the board yourself Dr Mortimer have with keeping this policy in place what are the concerns that are escalated you you do you would you like to answer Dr Mortimer as I've been saying for months my answer is everything is covered by either practices or other policies that we have set forth this policy is unnecessary which is why it's on the agenda at the recommendation of at my recommendation that it be rescinded any other discussion for somebody that has not spoken yet miss aelina um I would actually just like to I know she's not present tonight but I would like to thank um Mrs ryel because in conjunction with this policy we had reached out to her to ask her to um give us a better idea of what some of the circumstances and parental notification expectations looked like we all received her notes back we all received her very well-written report back I think she went a long way to back up um Dr mortimer's assertion and I just wanted to put it out there that I think that she gave us a very comprehensive list of reasons that align with Dr Mortimer on why this policy should be abolished Miss Peterson so um last year when we implemented this policy we went through all of our existing policies and figured out exactly what was covered by other policy what wasn't subsequent to that meeting and this policy approval we identified where there were gaps um where things were not covered by policy we then updated regulation 5600 to require parental notification for certain things where it was not previously required but this policy 9244 still has things that are not covered by other policies two of which are the examples that I just gave and Mrs or Dr Mortimer I I appreciate that there may be practice past practice and current practice in place where most or maybe all teachers are notifying parents of instances where kids are demonstrating anxiety like or depression BL like uh Behavior but there is not a policy practice can be optional policy is mandatory so why would we remove a policy that makes that notification mandatory I think that's something that's very important for parents to be notified of and I'm actually wondering why you wouldn't want to ensure that parents are being notified of uh concerning Behavior like that anyone else why are my questions not being answered Miss peek I'm not sure who your question was directed at I said Dr Mortimer I have nothing new to add to what I already said earlier I mean I we've had this conversation so many many times I'm pretty sure it's been answered teachers cannot make medical diagnosises they if they are noticing behaviors that might have some anxiety like Tendencies they would refer them to a guidance counselor the guidance counselor then makes the decision about whether the child's parent should be notified but there are as we've been told many times before confidentiality rules that apply to guidance counselors guidance counselors will make that call based on what they hear that I mean I think that's like the fifth or the sixth or the seventh time or something that that conversation has come up and been answered anybody else who wasn't that oh you were last Miss Peterson so we're just going to keep going round and round you guys miss Cooper um you're welcome please don't marginalize my serious attempts to resolve issues and to get clarity because you don't like them um Miss aelina are you talking to me I think it was yes I was um uh I believe reaching out to miss Ridell was really great and having her come back to you with information to be reviewed in committee also lends some credibility to the points you're making about parental uh about p244 my question for you is why is it okay for you to talk about that research that you did but you won't talk about any other research that might have been done relating to 5756 because that seems to be contradictory I just want to remind everybody this Ian you can choose to respond Miss aelina you're not required to seems like we're going in circles again one last point I'm Sorry Miss Miss aelina was up thank you now you go ahead Miss Cooper sure uh thank you um so far none of my questions have been answered so I'm not going round and round I'm asking questions I asked questions last month that uh policy was silent on I'm asking questions now that policy is silent on please do not suggest that I'm going round and round I don't have answers for these questions that I'm asking I'm sorry if you find it tiresome I'm sorry if you feel it's uncomfortable all I am trying to do is to get answers to legitimate questions about why we're doing this and what is the benefit in the case of the policy 5756 I'm very open to implementing an alternative policy we're talking about 9244 now I I get it but this is this is a tie-in point it is impossible to represent members of the Community without all the information and you lose um the benefit of having an open dialogue in public which is what we are supposed to do the dialogue was shut down in executive session and now the dialogue is being shut down now because this is a subject that makes people uncomfortable that to me is not a credible reason to shut down people talking about something that they feel strongly about have it your way but I still don't have the answers to the questions from policy last month as well as this month Mr cassado thank you so just so I understood that you're getting the runaround and no answers just like I feel like I'm getting the runaround and no answers even though I'm asking the questions repeatedly on the de in text message everywhere and I just keep getting this circle and it sounds like she's getting the same thing so if we're trying if we're trying to like you know bring this to a close why wouldn't we move discussions forward instead of keep making them circular Miss aelina I really want to uh not be rude or dismissive when I say this however I think that it is strongly evident to everyone that you are in fact getting the anwers to the questions you're asking and you just don't like them you want them to be different so when you continue to phrase questions differently in an attempt to get a different answer at a certain point you've exhausted all possible answers and that's where we are now it has been said vic has weighed in our superintendent has weighed in these are the people that we take our directives from the reason the questions aren't being answered anymore is because there's nothing else to say that's it if there's no new discussion we're going to move to a vote these are upon the recommendation of the superintendent your power is in your vote you can vote no again first readings roll call there's still discussions Mrs aelina yes Mrs Cooper no Mr cassado can you shut down discussion we roll call we're I we're in roll call vote now Mr what's the roll call then the roll call is voting on The Motions I believe so uh I know uh Roberts rules does State you know the same topic twice two people and you went around um the board president has stated if there was no more he was going to he want recommended to the vote and if no new discussion on any additional topics we we're going to move on so that's but but that's not that's not a c is it a correct statement Keith because it's hard for me to vote unless I know what's right here right now we're on on roll call vote is it done correctly I believe we it it it's followed it follows the Roberts rules with the amount of time I mean we it's it's something that what what's the rule the I'd like the disc you can have the discussion each person can have speak twice at a meeting 10 minutes hey excuse me discussion over here please don't you got sorry each person is allowed to speak twice on an item um no more than 10 minutes and then that's that's the whole subject no more than 10 minutes or each person speaks for 10 minutes up to 10 minutes per time so you if you you have one discussion that's your that goes that's your time we're in roll call now Mr cassado what are we roll call for again uh policy motions a through D I think is it a through D A and B and addenda item C and C and D A through D um excuse me Keith can I just change my vote please sure so um no to a yes to b no to C or yes to C and no to D so A and D you vote no B and C you vote yes yes okay Mr cassado no to a yes to b yes to C no to D okay Mrs Peck yes Mrs Peterson no to a yes to b yes to C no to D Miss pin yes Mr CH yes Mr Garcia yes motion carried personel moving on to Personnel Miss peek can you please move the Motions for personnel under Personnel I'd like to move Personnel agenda items a through q and addendum R can I have a second m b a second discussion can we have a roll call Mr Rado Mrs aelina yes Mrs Cooper yes Mr Cado yes Mrs Mar Oh Martin Mrs P yes Mrs Peterson yes Miss pin yes Mr pus yes Mr Garcia yes motion carried moving on the finance and facility Mr pus can you please move the Motions in finance and Facilities thank you Mr President yes I'd like to uh move Finance of facilities motions a through i h a through H sorry there's no no addendum item with the addend I'm sorry can I get a second Miss peek second discussion uh I just want to make note in there um uh Andre chevier uh the Boy Scout who uh made the donation it was mentioned earlier by our student reps the uh Greenhouse which actually was installed today uh he did a project in there he also is making a donation on his unused uh funds that he collected for the Eagle Scouts to be used in the court in in the greenhouse as well so just wanted to point that out I want to say awesome okay so are we in dis that was discussion roll call Mr Rosado Mrs aelina yes Mrs Cooper yes Mr cassado yes Mrs peek yes Mrs Peterson yes Miss pin yes Mr patus yes Mr Garcia yes motion carried moving on to curriculums and programs Miss peek can you please move the Motions currently I mean curriculum and programs yes I'd like to move agenda items A and B under curriculum and programs can I get a second can I get a second Miss aelina second discussion Miss Peterson so on tonight's agenda item a has us adding additional help Health lessons for fifth grade uh the agenda conveniently does not specify what those Health lessons are so for the Public's benefit I'd like to put on the record that those lessons include the following explain the relationship between sexual intercourse and human reproduction explain the ranges of ways that pregnancy can occur so last year's board voted no against adding these standards because I believe majority at the time did not feel it was age appropriate for 9 or 10 years old um and it didn't align with the scope and sequence of the other health lessons we have always claimed to take the conser conservative approach in rolling out these lessons and we do not teach sexual intercourse until middle school now we're teaching it in elementary school I assume this board uh knowing what I know and the short month we've worked together uh we'll pass it especially after hearing last meeting where you all feel that porn is appropriate in our Middle School libraries but I would like to understand how parents will be notified that we are adding sexual education lessons for our fifth graders in the middle of the school year since most parents have already completed the opt out process for the year my question Miss Peterson is can you please go back to the minutes and show us where we approved porn um we did have a little story time last meeting should I continue it because you know what Jay you actually you remind me I did not get to read the full passage um of what I started to read last meeting and it even gets better finish it my question was when did we say we approve porn I mean you can call it what you want exactly so don't call it porn because it's not declared porn what would you call it what would you call it anybody else I agree with is porn what would you call it I agree with porn so you have any other discussion the passion the P the passage talked about having below we stay we're talking about agenda is the curriculum right now so we'll stay focused on the uh well I'm agenda item at hand which is the why are you continuing to shut her down don't ask a question if you don't want the answer what I to do going to call the order and take a five minute break not doing that the item that's on hand um de Mortimer do you want to answer the question I'll make a comment thank you so I I believe I I heard some misinformation a minute or two ago because we're not teaching sexual intercourse in grade five um regarding that standard the district practice and this was in the cover memo for tonight's agenda will be to instruct students that human reproduction happens when a male's sperm and a female's egg come in contact we are not teaching intercourse we are not saying the word intercourse we're providing a factual explanation to students about that standard thank you Dr mmore Miss peek um Dr murer you can correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that this standard was in the opt out lessons that parents saw in August because it was not removed until September so it was there for parents to opt out of in August am I correct that I'm I don't know off the top of my head but I know that there will be measures in place to make sure that parents are aware of these two additional standards we will remind them in case they didn't see them or know about them so the parents will get an additional reminder and they can opt out of it correct Miss anybody else that has not spoken yet miss Cooper um I'm sure there are more but I only know of two districts that did not implement the health standards by the state and that is Lafayette and Fort Le so it's not unprecedented that districts might take an independent point of view about what should be taught to Children um what should be shown and what should be educated so what I'm wondering is uh I believe that the compulsion for putting this back into the curriculum was to to comply with the state even though we had decided not to do it last year and it just seems to me that everything that will so so why are we doing this now is it just to comply with the state why is this of relevance today and uh I'd love some further context on that I can answer anybody else for the discussion Miss peek I believe she'd like to answer that so it's on now because the health lessons are going to be taught in March and this was the first opportunity we had as a board to bring it back onto the agenda to make sure that it was in place so that we are in compliance thank youc Dr M Dr morer sure I want to point out two things yes in addition to the fact that March is coming up very quickly as superintendent I'm required to quote according to board policy ensure all aspect ects of District operation complied with board policy state law and District contracts moreover the board is a quote agency of the state of New Jersey it needs to ensure that the schools are maintained as provided by the laws of the state of New Jersey the written policies adopted by the Board of Education pursuant to New Jersey state law which are consistent with the instructions of the commissioner of education and the rules and regulations of the State Department of educ for per board policy so in my interpretation is there is no flexibility on my end and there's no flexibility on the board's end either thank you Dr mare any further discussion anybody that has not spoken Doug Doug uh Mr Cado so that I got that straight Dr Mortimer you're not sure if we need to ask them ask parents about or notify parents about opting out again sorry I was trying to the director of Elementary education I have full faith in her in that everything that parents need to know will be done and handled appropriately okay so we're voting on something before we know if we have to notify or we don't have to notify that's all I'm trying to figure out it doesn't matter because that's the job of the administration so your vote should be independent of how we're going to handle the notification to the parents but it is a legal requirement that we handle that we provide opt out options I'm just sticking with it you need to have faith in your superintendent and administrators that everything will be handled properly any further discussion Miss Peterson thank you so I think that I was just accused of spreading misinformation by our superintendent correct me if I'm wrong um certainly want to make sure please be cautious of evaluating the superintendent in public I'm not evalu I'm stating be cautious please done it before I was just accused of spreading misinformation that's not evaluative um so going back to the scope and sequence so we we have claimed to the public and the community that we do not teach sexual intercourse until middle school so I heard what you said we're going to teach that uh pregnancy occurs when a sperm comes in contact with an egg but how how can we possibly explain that to nine and 10 nine and 10 D stop how can we possibly explain that to nine and 10 year olds in fifth grade without explaining where a sperm comes from or where an egg comes from like you kind of have to explain the act of sexual intercourse I would think to make that make sense so Dr Mortimer just help me like understand is that scope and sequence is that normal does that sound like the right thing is that going to be confu is that going to be confusing all I would say is the teachers will be able to handle it just fine thank you Dr Mo any further discussion so we just to clarify it sounds like we are maybe teaching sexual intercourse before Middle School I I just want to say that scientifically it pregnancy occurs when an egg meets a sperm not intercourse just letting you know is that how anybody else any further discussion thank you for clarifying [Applause] that Miss Cooper um just a reminder Mr Garcia that at the beginning of your presidency you said You' do every effort to make sure that everybody was respectful and some members of our audience are not being respectful at all thank you for my I didn't even hear the Clapping Please Don't Clap thank you please don't I understand that they're laughing up here at each other and giggling but please follow suit and or don't follow suit and remain calm professional please any other discussion up here thank you for the reminder Miss Cooper and I want to apologize also for the giggling that's going on up here too on behalf of the board um now roll call Mrs aelina yes Mrs Cooper no to a yes to b Mr cassado absolutely not to a yes to b Mrs PE yes Mrs Peterson no to a yes to b Miss Pine yes Mr pus yes Mr Garcia yes motion carried moving right along to the second open public forum during this second public forum on any topic specifically addressed in this agenda is that a typo Keith Mr Rosado on any topic specifically addressed in this agenda or any other questions comments or concerns that may be in respect to the operation of their Schools board policy 0167 requires that individuals sign the speaker list giving name and Municipality of residents and as that all remarks be directed to the board as a whole not to individuals the board asks that members of the public be courteous and mindful of the rights of other individuals when speaking the board asked that during the second Forum opportunity public speakers adhere to the same guidelines follow the same practices and extend the same courtesies and decencies as with the first public forum each speaker statement will be limited to three minutes in duration this second public forum will be limited to 30 minutes in duration we will now open the public session at 8:52 p.m. Carol Mountain Westwood New Jersey just some food for thought number one one a lot of kids already know how babies are made by the time they get to fifth grade a lot of children's parents talk to them about these things it may be a surprise to some and it'll be up to the teachers to take care of that or for the parents but many many children at that age already know how babies are born how babies are made where they come from enough the other thing is as board members we don't represent you you're here to represent the school district and the policies and the laws You're Not Elected for individual interests and you're not on the board for individual interests you're to work as a group to understand how a district works it's a public school it considers many many ways of thinking many points of view and it cannot be so limited that people on the board can dictate or say what can happen What cannot be happened and the other thing is that lovely passage that uh was read last time I read the book that was in the first five pages of the book but it doesn't seem like the rest of the book was read because it was really quite a good book and you can ask many many grown-ups who read it in school it wasn't ass signed reading at school but they did read it as kids and it would be sad to deprive kids of that opportunity thank you thank you um Americo high school student so I first want to talk about the policy that I think it was removed I don't really know um but I know we said before that there was a little confusion about what's in existing policies and then what's not covered by policies I know I was confused about it and then I looked so some of the things that are covered in 9244 are also covered in other policies I could be missing things and I could have added things that have nothing to do with that but I could be wrong just don't take my word for anything 5350 student suicide prevention 5512 harassment intimidation and bullying 5519 Dating Violence at school 5520 disorder and demonstration 5530 substance abuse 5533 student smoking 5751 sexual harassment of students 5410 promotion and retention 5411 promotion from 8th grade 5420 reporting student progress 9240 rights of parents 7610 vandalism and 9260 parental liability for vandalism I think that covers B basically everything that is under 9244 again I could be wrong but those might be some policies you want to take a look at if there was any confusion about what is covered and what's not covered um and then on the topic of policy 5756 cuz I know that's kind of my thing up here but um I just want to say there is nothing that prevents staff from telling parents about a student's gender identity if there is concern concern about mental well-being physical well-being I'm pretty sure it word for word says in the policy that if there is concern about a student or a Minor's mental well-being physical mental emotional or social safety they are required by law to inform the parents in the best way possible to protect the student I'm pretty sure that if a student is in danger regardless of this policy staff members would be telling the parents in the appropriate way to make sure that the student is safe both at home and in school um I know from personal experience that all my teachers have done a great job of keeping me safe when I wasn't doing well um so I can vouch for them that the school does have policies in place to keep students safe for this exact reason that even though there are some things we don't want to tell our parents they still make sure that our parents are able to protect us and keep us safe in these circumstances so just to let you all know of that thanks thank you Amara anybody else I'm Karina Fox from Township um I wish I'd go right after Mrs Mountain because that would have been a perfect segue but I thought maybe I would have a little story time of myself this is and I'm sorry if I'm spoiling it for anybody but it is the last page of perks of the wall of being W flower um it's really an amazing book and I would hate for something taken out of context to uh prevent children from reading this book you're part of an infinite family the people who have been through terrible things and survived them if you are reading these words you won today you are here you are alive you are you have options you can wait out a bad situation move on fight back get up break up call ask her or him out write that book write that song listen to music take the drive take the chance and live whatever strategy you choose you win there are so many more of us than there will ever be of them and we can find each other and we can help each other and we can talk to each other and we can build great lives happiness is not this thing for other people it is for you it is for me it is for all of us we all get an ending and whether it or not it's happy is up to us that is my long way of saying thank you dear friend 20 years ago a young man wrote some letters you wrote him back and a grown man was inspired to write again so just in case this ends up being my last letter I want to answer one question the question I have been asked the most since your letters found their way to me whatever happened to Charlie and I can tell you what happened to Charlie in three words he made it and so will you thank you Miss Fox anyone else uh Kelly oconor Township uh when I started speaking last year was because there were lies being told to our community by individuals sitting up on this deis and so I'm still here because lies are still being told from up on the de um in regards to something I heard tonight grade five unit 6 lesson one of the health curriculum which covers the standard that was discussed I pulled it up while I sat there on my laptop and um not only can all parents read the entire lesson plan but it gives the exact sentence a script that the health teachers read and the sentence is human reproduction happens when a male's sperm and a female's egg come in contact this can happen with with or without medical intervention that's not intercourse it's just not that's wrong um in regards to the ongoing question about your questions not being answered tonight I just can't help but point out some of the questions that we asked repeatedly last year and never got answered few of them that I just pulled up from my emails to you in which I didn't get answers uh who determines what a controversial issue is um when you challenge the health curriculum you never gave one example of something in the health curriculum that you found to be age inappropriate not one you were asked hundreds of times by myself by other people up there and by people in the community when you passed 9244 you never answered what is covered in 922 9244 that is not already covered you didn't so enough with the fake outrage about your questions not being answered now thank you thank you anyone else Andrea gers Westwood New Jersey I just want to clarify that what was set up on the day is tonight that that fifth grade is not N9 and 10 year olds the majority of fifth grade fifth graders are 10 and 11 year olds just to clarify that point because I have a current fifth grader in the school district and I have to tell you she talks to me about the health curriculum and what's being taught and they're very inan um and appropriate for it's it's not you shouldn't be outraged about this because you have't opt out if if you want to but they pretty anain they're not they're just about respecting your body and um and just knowing good health hygiene um so I don't know what all this outrage is because I'm still waiting because I think what's important to teach girls is some of these girls are developing and I'm waiting to see if she gets taught um menstration cuz I'm ready to have the talk with her about that but that hasn't been covered CED by this health curriculum but I have to tell you that um thank you Dr Mortimer for what you've been saying um and I have every Faith In My Daughter's health teacher for being appropriate and being respectful when these lessons are taught and I know I have every faith in that that staff member that they will handle these lessons appropriately so if you don't have faith in this in our staff and our district then maybe you shouldn't be on the de seriously like you are here to administer and as my husband has been saying who's a former Boe member stay in your lane know you're appropriate stay in your lane that is your job to not administer the district so please know how your role is if you don't start going and and going to I can't even think about it Go the school board Administration lessons whatever it is know it know your job do your job appropriately because this is I don't know why we even have people who are applying for the superintendent job the way they're seeing these the these Boe meetings know your job stay in your lane please and thank you Dr Mortimer thank [Applause] you anybody else would anybody else like to speak going once going twice at this time we're going to close public session seeing nobody else Dr M would you like to answer any questions or make any statements I don't think there was any to coms okay so we're going to move to Old business okay any old business Miss Peterson thank you so over the past month I've become pretty concerned with the behind the scenes operations of this board uh especially the board president there have been numerous instances of action taken outside of board meetings and decisions made without the required majority approval of the board additionally we have received legal opinions and guidance from our board attorney that are not grounded in law case law statute or SBA guidance they are simply opinions that conveniently align with the questionable actions of the board president these opinions at times have gone against legally binding contracts I believe that there have been actions taken by this board's leadership that are unethical District policy 0174 authorizes the board to seek Legal Services as long as the request is supported by onethird or more of the board members I would like to ask if there are any other board members here tonight that would support us seeking alternate Council to review the questionable actions of the board president and VP as well as the questionable opinions we have recently received from our board attorney Miss Peterson I want to uh answer that in when you just cited 0174 every time without question without hesitation a question is posed to me for legal what do I do M Miss Peterson I I'll answer that actually I take it I immediately forward it to Vic I take his response Vic is our attorney for anybody watching and I return it back to you no interpretation none of my discussion I give you his answer and you asked another question on top of that you just don't like getting the answers again I'm going to say you receive the answers you don't accept the answers not once have i hidden your question for you to even accuse me of that it's manipulative it's deceptive and it's intentional Mr Garcia I don't know what you're talking talking about I have not accused you of not forwarding questions to the board what I am saying is that some of your actions you have made decisions unilaterally that require board majority approval and you have not gone through the proper process to do that I am happy to give specific examples a lot of them are Personnel related so I cannot talk about it in public but if you would like to break and go out there to Executive session let's go miss aelina apolog the actions of this board are very they are not ethical they are not following poer poer protocol or policy they are not following njsba guidelines and statutes and your the advice that you're collecting from Vic conveniently just happened to align with the agenda and the goals that you want to achieve by not following poer policy I I I am very concerned with what is going on there's it it is not right and it needs to come out and I would like to get a second opinion on what is going on once again I'm going to reiterate I've said this over and over again I'm not here with any agenda you don't even know how I feel about anything because what I do is I seek the advice now in my in my opinion and you've actually stated it you believe you're above and no more than legal than the superintendent of 30 years of education then the curriculum you come up here and apparently it seems that you have chosen to drive your agenda and that your advice or thoughts supersede any of those experts I continue to say and what I will emphasize with this board this year is we will weigh heavily the experts that we pay I don't give my interpretation or opinion once again I say that I go to Vic I go to our Council and I return that back to you and the the entire board Mr Garcia I don't have an agenda um and it's clear you have your opinion pleas please hold on please everyone show proper respect can have whatever opinion and you can think whatever you want of me it does not bother me I am going to ask you to keep it to yourself I did share an email with you earlier uh it might have been last week actually where I've had members of the public come to me saying that you are out there smearing my name calling me things calling me vindictive that's a separate issue but it is not me with the agenda it is not me accusing you of things uh of of like having your own agenda what I am accusing you is not following proper protocol and policy and following the law and I would like to Simply ask if there are any other board members we need onethird that would support us getting an additional opinion to review some of what has gone on you can get your opinion you have Miss Peterson can can we let someone else talk you've talked twice miss everyone please come Miss Cooper I would support an alternative opinion from a separate attorney selected by uh well we can we can do a I think we have to do an RFP Keith if we wanted to do something like that so just reading policy 174 that's what you're referencing Mrs Peterson correct yes it says our contracted lawyer um yes it says contracted lawyer right which is Vic we also have other contracted lawyers we're currently working with one on this uh you know ethics complaint that I think Mr Pinto filed against us so we we do have other contracted uh lawyers we we only contract with two attorneys that would be the office of fty andh Herer and the office of Machado Law Group the other attorneys are assigned by the legal um by insurance and not direct councils or contracted with the board directly so what process should the board take when we need to seek uh a legal opinion to review the legal opinions that we were getting well we we have the designated attorney that is board approved which is in Hara and those are the attorneys that we're allowed to go so the the the way the policy reads is onethird of the one-third vote ask question to the contracted uh legal counsel which would be either fi in Hera or Machado group okay so we get someone from Machado to look at it and help us there I mean we can't it's I'll read I'll read I'll read the policy and we can determine how that is I'm going to read this open this up sorry uh where we Board of Education authorizes superintendent school super um superintendent of schools design school business administrator board secretary director of Special Services Board presid president and other members of the board as authorized by one-third of the board members president as designated contact persons to request services and advice from legal counsel so it's just the designation of the people that can speak to the attorneys okay so a third of us can reach out to Mad Law Group that's the it's it's the design so it's either superintendent right superintendent designate the school business administrator slbo secretary director Special Services Board president board president and other members of the board as authorized by onethird right so onethird of us can authorize an individual on the board to reach out to the attorney yes I think so yes yes our attorney or uh yes it has to be put on to a vote okay Miss p the other attorneys are they are special education attorneys uh the group is our uh special uh attorney they're special education attorneys so not the board's attorneys they're they they serve the board but they are approved and I believe they are approved on the the reorg as the special ed Council yes have we used them for negotiations before we have and we so we've used them for things other than special ed topics we have okay yeah Miss aelina I just want to make sure that I'm exceedingly clear on this right now what is being proposed is that we shop for new attorneys that we can get to agree with us how long is this going to go on for how many attorneys are we going to talk to how much money is going to be wasted Consulting other legal opinions when it has been made extremely clear that those opinions will be disregarded if they are not agreed with I think this is an absolutely dangerous and unheard of RI to set the bar at this level where we're just shopping for attorneys for our District to find which ones agree with certain trustees is unbelievably anti- ethical and absolutely not what we are here for we have an attorney we get his advice we abide by his advice we abide by the recommendations of the superintendent it doesn't matter how many times we ask the same question different ways we're going to keep coming with the answer we're getting now I just want to make sure that the recommendation is that we waste time and money shopping for attorneys so that you guys can hear that you're right and we're wrong it's unfortunate that we have to do that I'd like to make a motion we don't have to do that actually I'd like to make a motion to see if I have one-third uh support to do this do I have a second second roll call did we name you the president I'm sorry you're it's your meeting you tell me this is unheard of and unpress that there's a motion she makes a motion that's fine you call for the second oh I'll uh second wait Mo then you open up the discussion you control would you like a second or would you like second you can second thank we have a motion on the floor and what exactly is the motion Miss Peterson I'd like to make a motion to see if there's onethird of the board that would support moving forward with getting a second opinion on some of the activity and unilateral decisions made by President Garcia so so the under policy it's one authorizing another member of the board to speak to the attorney that's the only motion that can be made with the one-third vote under Legal Services okay which is unnecessary because anytime you ask me for legal advice I forward it to Vic to Mr leira and send it back to you that's objective that's precisely the problem now what is precisely the problem Mr there's a motion on the floor we're trying to determine what that motion will actually do so we can vote on it but what from my understanding Mr Rosado just said all that does is bring it back to the design to get legal advice it doesn't say anything about shopping around to get the answer you want shopping around was not my words that was no was porn I I think Jay Mr Garcia Miss pin sorry this is just my thoughts on this subject so um I would kind of like to Echo something Miss aelina said that I've in general been thinking about this issue and I've spoken about this publicly when I was over there um this is costing our district money okay lawyers are expensive they're worth it but when you keep getting the same answer and you keep paying to get the same answer I don't think that's a good use of our district funds so thank you Miss pin Miss Cooper so I don't think I just want to address a couple things I don't think that seeking a second opinion is an unethical thing I don't think it's unethical I think that that you seek second opinions when you have doubt in the opinion that you have received so it's and you really only do this for serious matters right if you were um contemplating anything whether and it's not about shopping around I I think that is the wrong word to utilize it's getting another opinion and I guarantee and fully commit that if that opinion comes back and it is exactly the same as Vicks you will never hear me say word about it again that will be it please so so the the and I don't think it's unethical I'm not sure why it's unethical to seek an alternative opinion and the thing is I I I just heard Miss perin say Hey listen you you you you're asking the same question and you're going to go and you're going to get the same answer that I'm sorry that's all right that's all right all right it's totally good um it's totally good it's fine I didn't think I was saying anything you never really ding people literally ding people Keith so I think there is uh also I think there is uh there is concerns about legal fees which I always have concerns about legal fees and you've heard me say it before but I think that the it is money well spent to ensure that we are um compliant with what Mrs Peterson's concerns are I see no harm in getting a second opinion if that second opinion comes back and is it identical to what Vic says I won't say another thing but I fully support Miss Peterson's efforts to get a second opin you miss asina just out of an abundance of caution before we go ahead and you know hire another attorney is their language I don't know also please stop me if I'm out of bounds and asking anything I'm not supposed to but is there language in our contract with Vic that would counter that Mr leir I I'm sorry I'm sorry Mr is there do we have within with in our contract with his firm Are there safeguards that would prevent us from doing this can we have a motion to review can we like put the table this and review his contract before we start voting on on if we're going to because I don't know what's within his contract I don't know if we're allowed to do this I don't know if we're going to have legal repercussions if we do this I think all of those are worth answering Miss peek Mr Rado help me um understand maybe make sure I'm correct on this where it says other members of the board as authorized by onethird of board members present as designated contact persons to request Services um who gets to make the decision about who is the designated person because it's only one person right it's the board is voting for one person to be able to contact the attorney that's not listed here correct uh reading the policy it's it has the list of designated people um the board may also uh designate another member by oneir uh however it is still to as a designated contact person uh I guess in Li of one of the members or the board president not being president pres but it's it's silent on it on the policy then there's no regulation oh excuse me I'm going to say this is actually your bylaws Miss peck so does that mean that Mr Garcia gets to decide who the designated person would be I I can't I don't I don't have an answer to that definitive answer on that Mr pus thank you Mr Garcia I mean I guess if we follow the logic through um we could propose another vote right after that and more than 2third can designate somebody else and then we could do this all night long no we can't do that all right no the the I mean to be clear the policy just clearly states designating a person as a point person to communicate with the attorney it's not designated a person to seek attorney advice of another Council or of of someone else it's just designating who the contact person would be uh to that attorney for a question so right now the only one that's really authorized to speak from the board's perspective would be the board president um and at at yeah the board president was the only one that's as per the bylaws the bylaws that were approved is the board president to speak to the attorney the board May designate someone else and I think and traditionally that language is in there set in there in in the chance I guess the board member the board president is unavailable or cannot speak or and I think in the past I mean I know uh last year I believe Mrs Peterson was uh in touch with the board uh attorney in the absence of the board president as uh vice president would anybody else like to speak Mr Cado you had your hand up so what are we going to vote for are we going to vote to go speak or do we vote for the person there was a motion on the floor yeah I I don't think the motion was in compliant with the the bylaw though the motion was the motion on the floor that was posed was the uh to to seek additional uh a second opinion which is not covered under the bylaw under the bylaw it's covering the design okay anybody else before Miss Peterson is there anybody that hasn't spoken that would like to speak or hasn't spoken twice Miss Peterson so there is a motion on the floor bylaw policy whatever you want to call it 0174 the language is very clear in here it says the Board of Education authorizes and I'm going to skip some of the designes that it mentions before it gets to the part that says other members of the board as authorized by onethird of the board members present so what that says is that oneir of this board can authorize another member of this board to be the design to seek out legal services or advice from our contracted legal council so I am asking again and maybe a motion isn't the right way to do it but I will just say put up your hand if you agree with us designating one other member of this board to seek services or advice from our contracted legal counsel that is one third if you have if you have a motion it has to be second but does it need to be a motion we this is a policy need a motion to implement our policy well you if you want I mean for the record we should take a vote on it okay so are we done with discussion can we vote no I we haven't had a second on it so I mean it's there's a motion on the floor we have a second second discussion now or yes we can have a discussion discussion Miss aelena thank you I would like to read the [Laughter] last I would like to read the last paragraph of the policy in question [Music] 0174 was it me no okay um contracts for legal services will be issued by the Board of Education in a deliberative and efficient manner we're already not doing that that ensures the district receives the highest quality services at a fair competitive price or through a shared service Arrangement none of that includes getting another lawyer because you don't like what Mr leera has said this may include what is not limited to issuance of such contracts through a request from proposals based on cost and other specified factors or other comparable prices contracts for Legal Services shall be limited to nonrecurring or specialized work for which the district does not possess adequate in-house resources or in-house expertise to conduct with all due respect it is nobody's business to say that our attorney is not qualified he was hired by our school we hire him to give legal advice when we don't agree with what he's saying we don't all of the sudden then decide we need a new lawyer we listen to the lawyer's advice that's why he's a lawyer and we are not Miss Cooper so it is our business to um nobody is saying that Mr laira is not qualified what is being said is that there is a disagreement in his interpretation of the contract and information that some people on the board feel is a misinterpretation to the advantage of other people I'm not sure how to describe it Chris but is that where you falling out right that's what I'm hearing nobody is attacking Mr leira Nobody is saying that he's not qualified nobody is saying I'm saying that his interpretation is one that does not make sense in reading the contract and understanding the applicable law when that happens which again I commit to never saying another word about it it is worth getting a second opinion I don't don't see the harm in a second opinion so that we can assure ourselves that that his that we are aligned because I I think there is I want to question you because I realiz what is hold on what contract because if you're talking about what I think you are you can't no she's talking about his contract maybe I maybe I misunderstood but she was she mentioned his contct is that is that acceptable that's acceptable thank you thank you uh I appreciate that very much um and I'm glad glad we clarified that so what I'm talking about is that nobody is discrediting our board attorney that's true that's true not please don't interrupt I'm not discrediting him and I do that all the time too I don't take it personally um there's nothing wrong nothing unethical and nothing inappropriate in seeking a second opinion when there is a belief and a reasonable belief that there is a misinterpretation and I don't think his contract says that we can't do that but I don't know I've never seen it but it it's unusual that uh any organization is not able to seek a second opinion but I I don't know somebody Keith would have to look that up yeah I I would I I don't know the contract off hand I would have to read the the contract whether or not you can see other but they yeah I mean the the policy that's the end of the matter if the contract says you can't you can't the the yeah but the the policy or the the the bylaw in question right now is just strictly uh appointing an alternative design to uh uh seek legal opinion if the legal opinion it's not or to speak sorry not legal opinions to speak to the attorney and and the premise behind that is it obviously to it's onethird because if a minority in the boat in the book in the board exist it allows those members to seek the legal advice it's not about seeking an additional legal opinion on a matter it's about seeking legal advice and the attorney the general counsel for the board is fog and her I I understand what you're saying but I'm just I'm struggling to understand so the the the purpose of the the the bylaw is to seek the advice of council if the board members feel that the questions are not going to council not because they don't agree with council's advice Mr pus if I could rephrase that we would just be appointing another person to ask the same attorney the same question to get the same answer answer to then talk about this again next month correct thank you anybody else Miss pin um I'll take that a step further um we've already established that everybody can ask their questions of Vic Mr Lea Miss Peterson thank you so there's still a motion on the floor um this policy has been interpretated in a variety of different ways um tonight I would like to move forward with uh continuing this motion and seeing if there is onethird support to allow a designated contact person to request services or advice from our contracted legal coun this is supported by policy there's a motion on the floor uh and again this has nothing this is this is no offense to Mr leira there's uh valid and very serious concern with some of the actions that you have taken over the past month unilaterally Mr Garcia um that is not upheld by our code of ethics or the NJ SBA guidelines and I do think that it needs to be reviewed um by someone that you by someone else other than Mr laira what are you talking about what do you what do you mean what are you talking about what's the your actions that I'm concerned about yes is that what you're asking about so a lot of them are Personnel related so I don't again if you want to break into executive session let's let's go and we can have that conversation that's not appropriate for out here um but you have made unilateral decisions that by law require a board approval uh of the majority and require those decisions to be made in a public meeting not in emails uh in between meetings Mr Garcia but you know that I don't or else I wouldn't have asked anybody else we can play games all night long and you are Miss pek Miss aelina sorry that's fine so I mean I've been on all of the emails with the attorney there were no nothing was everything was very straightforward it was a question can this be done should we do it this way and Vic or Mr dapa answered with very clear details about how and why things could be done Mr Garcia did not make any unilateral decisions he just sought guidance from the attorney and it was given and we followed it anybody not has anybody not spoken twice Miss aelina she you spoke twice did you did you say twice definitely I talk twice did you say we've all talk twice Mr cassado I'm fully ready to vote okay vote for what's Miss Cooper people get second opinions all the time all the time you've never gotten a second opinion is nobody at this day has ever gotten a second opinion what is the harm in proceeding with a second opinion no offense to any intended what's the harm Miss asina did anybody get a second opinion from Vic on a matter that he agreed with you upon Mr leira Mr leira I apologize do we ask that's a question since OB since the theme of the night is answer asking questions when you get an opinion from him that you agree with do you then ask for a second opinion you only ask for a second opinion when you you don't agree with what's being said and what's being said is not for us to disseminate this is above our pay grade this is for the New Jersey Department of Education and I think that we have to be very careful when we're in old or new discussion to still be speaking only about our agenda items we're not going to vacillate between Jay's a horrible person and we need to call a lawyer about it and oh we need to talk about 5756 one of those things has no business on this stage and continues to get brought up and I think it's an ethical problem that it's continuing to happen and we're trying to mix that with real policy and real questions I think if we're going to talk about games and agendas being run we're not going to let that slip by I'm GNA just politely ask everybody think we're bordering on the personal issues can we just please let's stay professional I apologize if I overstepped or got a little bit snarky I'm doing my best I want to hear everybody's opinion I think we do owe it to the community as I'll State um let's keep the communications flowing I think there's a value in it but I do also think we go round and round and I think that's what we're doing with Mr leir as well but I'm not the problem with this and there seems like a little bit to be out of order here because generally speaking we go to the professionals that know how these things work and in this situation we're not listening to them so miss Cooper you did have something else to say but please let's keep not personal no problem um miss aelen you asked the questions do you ever get second opinions when you get an opinion that you agree with uh I have have not done that here as a board of education member but I have done that personally multiple times um you do that for reasons where you still might be doubtful or the risks might be really great and it does bring you a sense of reassurance in the decision so it is and I'm I'm sure you have done the same you know a doctor will tell you to do one thing and you'll check with two other doctors to make sure that's the right thing to do um so especially when there's risk associated with it and I do think there is a lot of risk associated with um some of the decisions that we're making we're we sort of like between a rock and a hard place or the sword and and the Warhammer so I don't again I go back to I don't see the harm I think no professional is perfect nobody's perfect um and um you know regarding Mr Garcia you know I know you say that you want to hear everybody's opinion I know you say that and I I don't understand when you do say that and yet you encourage people not it seems to me I speak for no one else you you uh encourage people that they don't have to answer questions at the day there's a lot of Silence I you told you said that all of my questions were answered none of the questions that I asked tonight were answered none of the questions that I asked last time were answered I mean no disrespect that's just the reality I will put them all down in an email and I will uh I will send them out to the entire board within the next day or so and then hopefully then we can get answers I mean I I definitely have sent you now Mr Garcia about seven questions which I won't read here and now but I've sent you seven questions now 10 questions that you have not answered via email so my expectation is low that I'll get a response from you and I don't any offense it's just the reality of of please don't tell me that my questions were answered when they were not we are in Old business right and we've brought up a topic we're going to do a lot better I want to apologize to the community kind of off the rails here we're going to get more focused because the motion now if we want to move to vote still unclear of exactly what we're doing so what is the motion and if it's to get a second opinion specifically on what I I have here as the motion from Mrs Peterson seconded by Mr cassado to designate a contact person on an alternative contact person from the board I don't have for what you know the the purpose of the the assignment or the contact I don't I would recommend that we state that I mean normally it's the board president only just to keep it on track so that it's just not an open book if you if this motion does pass um but you know it's it just States uh designate contact person as per policy or excuse me bylaw other members of the board authorize onethird board members as a designated contact person to request services or advice from contracted legal counsel again that should be the that should be the motion okay should we move to vote and we're in discussion period only on that so let's I just trying to just to keep with the business we should only be talking about designated person additional de designated person so is any I guess Mr Garcia it should be so the discussion is on the designated person we had a motion and Miss pin so is the interpretation that that motion can carry with a vote of three uh a third of the board uh present board so we have eight tonight so it's 2.66 so yes three so the vote is three the three and the affirmative can to designate the person to speak to the attorney yes per the bylaws I've never heard of a motion that could be voted on by three so the the premise and and the reasoning behind this bylaw is really uh for uh boards that have a the allow the minority an opportunity to seek uh uh advice from Council that would could otherwise potentially be blocked by the majority so the the question and and and Mrs Peterson and and from the dialogue that's been going on it seems like you requesting a second opinion for the same question that has already been asked to the attorneys but the that you would like to designate a a person to speak to the attorney about about the question that has been shared so it's like I said the premise and the the the reasoning behind this is to allow the minority to to ask the question to the attorney that otherwise would have been blocked correct I'm just I'm just saying this isn't a motion then this is just enacting the policy because we're not going to have a roll call well we would have to take a roll call to at least have a third I got to confirm I got to confirm there's at least a third uh that are in favor of designating someone else yes Mr pus actually hold on Miss Peterson we are going to alternate thank you and and just to clarify it's not only to get a second opinion on certain things it is to get a first opinion on some other things as well and I think the concern uh at least from my perspective I won't speak for anyone else is that um maybe there's um I don't know I'll use the word Cahoots maybe there's a little bit of uh Cahoots going on between the board president and our current um our current legal council which is provoking the the need to uh seek an alternate opinion cahoot is a silly word does anybody have anything else to uh say we're going to go Miss peek so Keith can you clarify again for me we are vote we are voting to allow a designated person but we're not designating who designates the person the third the third would designate a person so I I guess we should des and and designate the contact person of that third we should probably state it in the motion okay can can we just can we spell this out so let's say three F three people they vote then they say Mr Cat those three say Mr cada you're the design what does he then do he goes to Mr lairo or he gets to go speak to legal counsel and I have to confirm with whether or not it's strictly general counsel or a special ed counsel but one of the legal councils that are authorized by the district that represent the district to get a second opinion well it's not to get a second opinion so we can't the discussion of second opinion keeps getting thrown out here is not discussion of second opinion it is to ask the attorney a question without essentially interference from a another party to be able to make framework the the question directly to the attorney without misinterpretation now I I've and I I'll I'll interject here and I because I've seen the communications that's been going back and forward and I see that Mr Garcia does forward the email and the correspondence do come back based on the correspondence he received so as far as the attorney not receiving the question and I don't think that's up well I I don't know if that's I'm assuming everyone is saying this what we were I know we were talking about the one issue but the questions are getting to the attorney we are getting responses I I I'm seeing that I'm obviously uh Dr morer showed the uh mentioned the bills earlier I'm seeing the bills so I know the communications going out there about the one policy in question but that's just being intered I'd like to call a question I mean I guess I'm asking I we're going around and we're saying the same thing over and over should we just vote on it yes okay I mean is everyone okay with just voting on it no I would like to table this vote I would not like to vote on this tonight I don't even understand what we're I'm sorry Keith I don't understand what I am voting on I have a lot of trouble voting on anything when no offense to you because you're wonderful and I know this but you're having trouble explaining all of the layers to this there's multiple multiple legal layers that we are considering on this vote I brought up the contract that we have I don't know if we are violating anything if we do this vote I don't think it's a good idea without having a recess or having putting this on the table not having a recess I'm sorry we're not recessing for this putting this on the table until all of our answers can be comprehensively answered in a way that makes sense instead of going around like this where it seems like you keep trying to explain and then three more questions pop up I don't think that it is the right thing to do to be voting in terms of what we're going to do legally with our District's money when everyone sitting here does not have a comprehensive understanding of what we're voting on so um unfortunately this motion cannot be taed because of the one-third requirement so I mean obviously it it's the motion is set in place or designated in bylaws so that the uh minority have an opportunity to speak to the attorney without getting blocked with the question so and the qu I stated the question I I know this the whole second opinion is outside that that's not in this policy it's not talking about a second opinion it is talking about allowing access to an attorney to ask a question that would not be that has not been released because it's being blocked by the majority of it correct are we voting on if it's not if it's not being blocked what are we voting on we're voting on three people who want another attorney's opinion because they don't like the one that we have well they can't they can't seek another attorney's opinion Ian I know like I'm five so stop excuse me this is got you so you know so again I I I State I I do is did I misrepresent any of that I mean sorry like I wouldn't suggest and recommend that we just move to the vote and I guess we'll find out from the attorney if this is where we should go right then we'll just keep bouncing around so I would like to oh we got a couple more hands though so miss peek Mr Rosado the questions that will be posed to the attorney that has been answering all of our questions the entire board should be able to see those questions and the responses correct yes they should be sent to the they they the response should be sent to the full board and the attorney will we can uh just notify let the attorney respond to the full board uh blind copy obviously okay and did you have your hand up Miss pin that was the same question I had so what you guys think let's move this along so the only thing I I I would ask so that we can just do this in one motion is maybe do you want would you would you mind uh designating a person now so we can at least know who's the person Mr Peterson I guess would that or do you want to take the vote and then we can talk about passing a designation after okay we can do that um okay so we'll take a vote uh academic Excellence let's um Mrs aelen well can I take the vote let's take the vote roll call excuse me I don't know what Yes means I don't know what no means I don't I don't want tostain I want to understand what I'm voting for I'm not abstaining because I don't have an opinion I don't have information I don't know what to say do I say yes what does that mean what does it mean when I say no so I I'll I'll explain um so the vote on the table is to allow the board to choose a design to speak to the attorney just miss PE there's a vote on the table actually I'm sorry uh I mean if you can ask for clarification when we get to I had end up before she voted sorry um Mrs I Mrs Cooper yes and I nominate Mrs Peterson no we're not doing nominations now we'll do that later okay M Mr I know I I Mr cassado yes please um M here Mrs P no Mrs Peterson yes Miss pin no miss Mr pus no Mr Garcia no okay so we do have onethird so we did pass so I think we need to designate those that have voted in the affirmative we can designate a person um I do state that I I do recommend as the board secretary uh have to you know to being held accountable for the legal bills that we should kind of limit and restrict what we we're we're talking or what we're talking about at this point um so uh those that voted in the affirmative if you would like to State Your Design I guess I I I'm I'm running from the hip here CU I don't know how to run this but M Miss Mrs uh Cooper yes who would you uh I would nominate Mrs Peterson okay Mr cassado Mrs Peterson okay and Mrs Peterson okay I I think we we still need to we should designate what the topic and and and the limit and the authority of the person uh just so that we can kind of control cost here um yes so the public should uh be assured that this is not being done uh without significant and serious concern and I know I'll get Chuckles in the room that's fine my fan club is not here and I'm good with that but um the purpose of this is to get legal guidance on Personnel decisions that have been made by the board president unilaterally um from the the time frame of I will go actually I since I know that there was communication before he was board president I will say from December 15th through the current day um actions that have occurred during that time frame um so you're okay did we stray off topic again I don't know what the I yeah I I I thought that it was hard to keep up I'm sorry how did we go from talking about a a another attorney for 5756 speak I'm speaking to now going and and speaking that we're going to talk to a lawyer because this is not what I voted for again this is not what I voted for for where I did not vote to to hire another lawyer to investigate our President we were talking about 575 that's it that's what we're doing excuse hold on okay that's let's please calm down relaxed stay focused now so we the motion was passed designated was Miss Peterson now we're trying to clarify what specifically Miss Peterson is going to go to Mr laira Right is now or is it the designate because that's where the discussion is now is it another attorney or is this one it's it's um one of the attorneys that are have been board approved but I mean I believe I got to look into the contract state if it's legal council vers uh special ed counsel those are the two attorneys that we have but I I I'm I'm sorry I didn't get to get get all that information on you proposed legal guidance for personnel yeah so miss aelina uh I think you're you're a little bit confused so I'm just going to read the paragraph that I read when I started this discussion because because this clarifies exactly what the concern is and what will be discussed with the attorney so I said over the past month I have become extremely concerned with the behind the-scenes operations of this board especially the board president there have been numerous instances of action taken outside of board meetings and decisions made without the required majority approval of the board additionally we have received legal opinions and guidance from our board attorney that are not grounded in law case law statute or njsba guidance they are simply opinions that conveniently align with the questionable actions of the board president so it was never about 5756 it is about actions and I have said multiple times most of them are Personnel related so I cannot specify what they are here in public if we want to go into exec I am happy to get into details nobody has been rised so that can't be done in exec tonight exactly um but you just said you I have I I I and and forgive me because I I I'm not familiar I have the the I I think we're going to need clarification on this bylaw uh because I don't believe it's it's just an open and like that I I I assumed and I and I know I spoke early and I was stated what I assumed you were alluding to getting because the topic at hand we were discussing um I don't know if this policy I mean what you're requesting is not seeking a legal opinion it's legal guidance and it is not it's not open-ended is it's actually very specific items I just can't in public say what they are so all members are designated contact person to request services and advice from legal counsel so you're seeking legal advice to as to what the board president's role is then or certain actions that have been taken that I believe are unethical okay so the actions that are taken by the board are here in public and voted on they they should be that's exactly my concern there have been actions taken in private and unilateral decisions made um all right I I I I'm I guess I'm still little confused on on on this and I don't I I I I don't know how to proceed here I would have to uh I would like to know if this is an ethical issue why we're not going to the department sorry are we even miss miss peek I don't know we're in discussion what we're doing this seems a lot of lot of wasted time and money in here when we want to go academic Excellence but you know that's off topic too so I guess we'll talk keep talking about this Miss peek so Keith can sorry Mr rosado in our next board meeting in exec session can we outline specifically what should be discussed with the board attorney so that we all understand what's going to be discussed um I I I think as as as I I've stated before this bylaw is really to get seek the legal opinion uh when the concern is that we're not getting the opinion of uh or some the opinion the questions are not getting to the attorney because of the majority um the and Miss Peterson if I'm out of the line I I don't I I'm from what you're looking or what you're requesting is is almost outside of that I think it's something else it's not really um that and that's what I would have to I I think I I definitely know I need to consult uh and get uh a true a better understanding yeah I'm just going by what the policy says yeah so I I I I know we designated Mrs Peterson but I don't know what we the the purpose is I'm that I I I need further uh advice from Council i i i obvious honestly I don't know what how the board would like to proceed I'll leave that there I think we're at a standstill I think that we shouldn't be voting on something or the board should not be voting on something that's not clear to everybody and I think for the benefit of everybody who has to you know sit in the room and has been very patient and everybody who has to get up and go to work in the morning I think we need to move on and Mr Rosado will find uh consult with Mr leira and get a better feel for exactly what this policy says but I'm not comfortable sitting here and having the board vote on something where it we don't even know what it what the implications of it may be I would agree and I think certain problem here is that certain individuals just want to keep asking the question when they're not getting the answer they want that's just my opinion but I think we have uh you know because now what do we do right so now we have to get a legal opinion on getting a legal opinion who do we go to get the legal opinion on if we can get the legal opinion on what you're talking about do we go to another vote to see if we the third legal opinion on that I mean we can keep going round and round we're chasing our Tails here it's a lot of uh I appreciate that you're trying to make this look like uh we're wasting a lot of time but Jay the reality is that you know exactly what the concern is Garcia please and you're just trying to deflect I'm we have reached 10 o'clock so we will need a motion to uh to extend can I motion to adjourn can I do that we haven't got we have not got in there yet I did have uh two things to state so I do want to we'll make a motion to there is a motion to adjourn I hate to say but well you made a motion you made a motion to extend first so we should do that one or you seek a motion to extend okay motion was to adjourn then we'll stick with the first motion because I can't supersede that then right I mean technically the motion is to adjourn right now motion to adjourn second get a second um who who was the second I'm Sorry Miss peek was the second all right um we should do roll call roll call moot roll call motion to adjourn there's no no discussion Mrs aelina motion to adjourn yes Mrs Cooper is there a discussion no I'm not asking the audience I'm asking Kei is there discussion about it okay uh no I I don't move to a journ I think we need to solve this but Mr cassado no Mrs PE yes Mrs Peterson why isn't there a discussion what just so for my own understanding why did every other motion have discussion but not this well um the other motion doesn't have discussion to when the uh motion to call the question um I the aderman is usually just uh Hey or nay uh nay um M Pine sorry I know I was Mr pus yes Mr Garcia yes okay so we are adjourned at 10:05 J close the meeting at 10:05