##VIDEO ID:PWUu528Ii7A## [Music] good afternoon ladies and gentlemen today is Tuesday September 10th 2024 it is 4 p.m. this is the board of selectman meeting is there a motion to call the meeting to order so move second all those in favor all right all this meeting will be audio and video recorded please rise for Pledge of Allegiance Pledge of Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liy and justice for all first order of business we have Lake Street notice tent and we have Mr Scott dagget here presenting Mr daget like to come to the podium introduce yourself a brief explanation I don't need the uh oh we've been over this many times correct uh okay my name is Scott daget I am uh one of the members of the Lake Street Improvement committee along with uh Gary Kaa and uh jamus kamash who couldn't be here today uh just to give you uh an update so we've been going on and on and on with this particular project uh last year we had Solitude Lake management looking into it want to use herbicides got a lot of push back on that so we decided Shel that and we're going to now go with uh the use of an Eco Harvester which is basically mechanically pulling the weeds uh we have a company out of Connecticut uh CND underwater uh Jeff who is one of the owners of the company had come down here taking a look at the ponds I believe was about year and a half ago uh I took a site visit with him uh walked him through uh he was considerably shocked as to how badly these ponds are you know the shape that they're in um so we went ahead and uh tried to organize something for this August uh which apparently didn't happen so I've got the notice of intent in uh tomorrow's meeting we'll see how that goes with the conserv commission and hopefully we can move forward and shoot for August of 2025 yeah Mr chairman I just want to Scott thank you um as you know we had a a larger Lake Street Improvement committee you know I was sort of the deao chair of that and I really took more along the lines of the safety you know the guard rails and some of the aesthetic improvements there but was able to uh with Scott's leadership create a a weed sub sub committee with Scott and Mr copper and Mr gamage and really they've done all you know just wind them up and go and they've really got this thing to where it's need needed to be and um you know look forward to the day when we can see that Harvester those wheels turning and um you know see if we can make an impact over there I know everybody I talk to um I you know my boys fish a lot down there and there's one person I talked to who says VI this place is awesome you know it's such a great resource and uh I'm really proud of the work that you guys have done Darry and and Scott so thank you for that and um you know it's I think now that we've got this relationship reestablished with the city um we've got anou but I think it's now time to uh step up our conversations with the city and try to get some more buyin from them U from a resource standpoint from a technical expertise standpoint um and because at the end of the day while we are the the caretaker they're still the owners and um I'd like to see that move forward but I felt it was important for us to sort of move the plan along our on our own rather than have to rely on somebody else and I think we've done that now we've got some good momentum there and uh look forward to to having those conversations with the city yeah to tomorrow uh hopefully chance perks will be here tomorrow great uh after the meeting I'll have some discussion with him because I've I've made contact with the city Bedford numerous times and heard nothing but crickets so I'm hoping that maybe with chances influence uh as the conservation agent there maybe you know he can establish some connections and yeah we've got you know I think all of us have relations with whether City councilors or the mayor directly I like to get it to that level but again as I mentioned felt is if we were asking for approval all along we wouldn't get happen so I felt we had to grab the steering wheel now we've done that now it's time to uh go in that other direction so great so thanks for your work Mr chairman yes Mr Scott why why you mentioned August deadline twice what's so spe specific about August so what's so specific about August is that's the prime time to go ahead and administer any kind of treatment to these weeds whether it's going to be uh through mechanical pulling or um the use of herbicides uh that's when the weed growth is that its greatest throughout the whole year uh your hotter months are in typically in August uh the weeds are at full growth so what you want to do is you want to impact these weeds when they're at their most potential growth and that's why I say Late July anywhere between you know really late July to Mid August is typically when you want to hit these weeds got it thank you I Scott I just I want to uh reflect on what Mr W asked said about your efforts and the committee's efforts um to staying on the weed abatement thing right it's pretty disgusting when you drive down Lake Street and see those weeds in full bloom in you know late June July they're flowering or whatever it's just it's it's massive it's taking over the pawns and I think as selectman want alluded to the board of Selectmen are fully committed to the project so we see what we can do and get some costs associated with it and see what we can do for funding and get this thing rolling and start the process anyway right so thank you for your and thank you for the committee memb work as well Mr copper I know I see him back there thank Youk you appreciate it Mr dag gentlemen next up we have Council on agent building use fee waiver um I spoke with Miss Golda this weekend and she also sent us a letter she had a couple groups reach out in regards to the new building use um policy based on fees and looks like both of these particular groups came to an agreement um that Miss Golder said she agreed with one was the Boy Scouts and one was Narcotics Anonymous um my personal opinion on this is if Miss gold is okay with it I'm okay with it um so I would just ask for a motion to approve a onetime yearly fee for these two organizations as agreed upon so move second all those in favor favor I hi next up we have local building inspector appointment uh we have Mr Jeffrey Fabian and Mr Fabian is here today um if you'd like to introduce yourself to the podium uh give us a brief history of uh your Acushnet life hi my name is Jeff Fabian um lifelong resident of a koset um actually went to uh elementary school and middle school with the chairman um and now I have a daughter that just started pre uh pre there this week so it's her first weeks um um that's pretty much the uh synopsis nice and we did get your letter um obviously growing up with you I I know the the history of your family business in town yeah and it was always well regarded um so gentlemen if there is a motion to appoint Mr Jeffrey faan as the local building inspector Mr chairman yes is it local building inspector or is it just for building for inspect inspections local building inspector which is different from Building Commissioner no I know it's different from a building commission but what is this gentleman's job going to be is he going to be a full-time inspector or is he just going to do inspections on behalf of the building department inspections on behalf of the building department you good with that Mr Fabian good with that I've read your resum it's quite impressive so thank you very much for having an interest in helping out the town of aush Y motion to yeah I'll second that but Mr chairman I just want to highlight the fact that like I think it's this is I think the first step in us really starting to build a bench for some of our critical Town departments um we've already got a couple people doing inspections right and but when you get somebody when you recognize talent and somebody's from town you want to get them on the team and um you know you may have one inspection today and nothing for three three months who knows but I think just getting somebody like Mr Fabian who's committed to the town into the rotation um I think is really important and I think we really going to start looking at that for other departments you know we talked about the the tree Warden you know if we can create a second there uh per DM I think we got to do that type of stuff because the more folks we have from town you know in our departments um then you know we're we'll be better sir so thank you for stepping up um and congratulations I'll second that motion we got a motion a second all those in favor I I motion passes board mran next we have joint Transportation Planning Group appointy and and Alternate and the planning board uh representative to Ser both we've had a uh Mr sure you correct yep Mr P is uh it's not Dr bue on the Sur Dr bu is on the finance committee Steve bu is on the planning board that's what I was going to say I didn't say doctor I said M Oh I thought you said Doctor no okay so often but uh he is no longer able to serve these positions and uh talking to the chairman of the planning board he asks that the town planner who's also a repres uh a resident of the town and as the representative and the conservation agent as the alternative I believe the planner has worked hand inand with sered and Joint Transportation Planning Group in our past capacity in our former job too so motion to app Point as presented second all those in favor next we have buzzer Bay Co I Watershed ride 2024 uh we do this every year gentlemen um this is going to imped a small portion of our town uh looks like long Plane Road and Perry ho Road they're expecting between 10:30 and 12:30 on October 6 2024 and they will have flaggers to make sure that the Riders um make it safely through the course there won't be any road closings for this is there a motion to approve so move second all those in favor [Music] I and we have a letter letter of resignation from Michelle Santos uh this letter is to notify you that I will be leaving my position as senior clerk in the building department my last day will be Friday August 30th 2024 thank you for this opportunity to serve the town of aush I wish you the very best in your future endeavors is there a motion to accept letter of res resignation with regret so move I all those in favor thank gentlemen if you don't mind I'm going to take this next one out of order um so Mr tibbles can speak on the golf the updated bunker because I have some questions for him so yeah Mr tibbles looks like you sent I know my glasses on I don't to jeez your eyes are worse than mine and I got a few years good evening how are you good thanks so um I believe you have in your packets there some of the information um that address the changes that we spoke of at is it two meetings ago I believe yeah two meetings ago the first item if you look is entitled page 39 there was a question about uh alternatives to using capillary concrete as a bunker liner under item v on page 39 it's the bunker liner it says shall be capillary concrete or approved equal as supplied by the manufacturer so that gives the contractor the opportunity to participate in bidding with capillary concrete or to submit and approved equal as an alternative to using that particular product um if you will look at next page it will look somewhat like this these are design specifications for the base of the bunker and you'll note there that it also indicates that capillary concrete can is uh suggested to be used or and approved equal so not only does it mention it in the actual verbiage but it also shows it on the construction detail for the line at the base of the bunker um the next item was taking the third hole or proposed work on the bunker on the third hole taking that out of the project as such and making it an alternate bid number one which means that the contractors will be bidding primarily on work on the sixth 7th and 10th holes and the third hole is an add alternate and that's specified here alternate one shall be the addition of the entire scope shown on detailed plan for hold number three detailed plan was provided also list that on the top of the deta detail plan um which includes provisions and installation of drainage gravel tops so na seed Etc and bunker say additional work includes side stripping shaping killing Etc and those I believe were the items we had in question as of the last [Music] meeting uh Mr tibl the only real question I have um the proved equal yes that goes back to I believe Mr Gasper mentioned the alternative to the concrete is when they when they listen approved equal does that leave anything vague too vague to really tell you not really because there are um within the business there are probably six possibly seven different bunker liners capillary concrete there's what's called Billy bunker different type of line there's three or four different excuse me probably six or seven different accepted liners that are standard throughout the industry that everybody knows about if someone were to come up with something else for instance years ago before they decided to come up with bunker liners what we used to do is take the bottom four to 6 in of the sand trap and pack it with Clay put the drainage tile in the clay sand on top unfortunately packing it with Clay doesn't necessarily work too well in this part of New England where the frost Hees and thaws and pushes the Rocks up through the base of the clay and into the bottom and unfortunately at times the clay seeps into your drainage pipes and thus clogs the pipes and then you have a problem with drainage in the bucker but yes the uh what they would do is they would present their approved equal or their suggestion for an equ and and the uh supporting documentation then that would uh that would suffice gentlemen any questions all right I think that covers what we asked you to do a couple weeks ago um Mr Kelly did we make a motion at that meeting for any reason to send this out I'm pretty sure Mr tius has to send this out as a request yeah I mean we would like to get it out is um simply because basically for this time of year I think we're running out of time not so much that the weather isn't what we'd like it to be but everybody wants their work done in the end of September October and November so I am sure that most of the contractors who will be bidding are probably booked um we could do some work in late November depending on their availability and how the weather holds out but I anticipate most of them possibly looking to the spring or early spring unless we have a very wet spring which would cause us to have some issues with moving equipment and uh grading and what have you so but once we get it out once we get the numbers back and then we can even see if we're going to do anything anyway sure [Music] if we uh need a motion to allow him to send out for our if we end up worst case scenario and it goes into the next fall will we will the biders give us that much time yeah I mean they're not going to uh they're not going to um not provide a bid I mean I don't know I don't know if there would be some iy in there about the possibility of prices changing but um again there a lot of the schedule of the contractors is based on when the active golf season is and how active the particular golf courses uh are are that are looking for um work to be done some golf courses for instance in private clubs are not significantly active after September because all the snowbirds take off and go down to uh to Florida so they have no significant golf schedule um you don't want to look at our golf schedule for September and uh you know and then once you get into beginning or the beginning of October is okay once you get to the end of October as long as we can still cut side then we're in good shape soon as the ground starts to freeze the side starts to freeze then all the cutting stops because you're not going to be able to roll it you're not going to be able to spread it you're going to basically have some dead grass on your hands so we get into the fall you're not going out for firm bids you're going out for uh the possibility of contingencies well I'm they're going to give you um they're going to give you a bid in in the time and they're going to give it within a time frame that we'd like to have it um the question is you know some people are going to be looking at their schedule and say okay I've got this job here I got this job there I'd like to bid on that one but I'm going to spread myself too thin Mr The best scenario is to get it out and see what we get back in the first place thanks Steve the U my question I guess would be more for Mr Kelly is if they put out an RFP can you put in the bid spec that the bid would need to be held for a certain amount of months I've seen that happen before in Paving um where we require a bid of to hold the bid for x amount of time I think that's an option we can do and if you say you put 6 months not saying that's the right number but that's just arbitarily speaking 6 months and then you put 6 months therea so it'll be a full year a maximum escalated could be 10% or 5% of the project original bid um project cost could we do something like that in a bid spec right out of the gate we can we could go firm bid and then a second bid with that type of contingency firm bid to be held for so long though right we can't just let somebody bid on it and then you get in a situation that Steve's talking about weather conditions everything's about Golf and weather conditions we only get a couple of months or a month or so by the time bids come back so you know expedite the bid thing got 30 days to bid on it whatever Steve thinks it's in appro so you do the fir firm bid for the spring and contingency for the fall something like that right to hold it yep good roll sounds good thanks Steve yeah you need a motion to allow the golf course to go out for RFP subject to review subject to review I'll make that motion second all those in favor perfect see as soon as you get it we'll send it to council excuse me as soon as you get it we'll send it to councel RFP as far as firm versus Cony oh far okay so you want me to have the we'll change the uh that's all we have to change change of directions yeah all right we're going to jump back to town meeting warrant here gentlemen Steve I just wanted to ask you that question before I forgot it I appreciate it worse for me sooner the better I've been here since 4:00 this morning so all right uh gentlemen you should have an updated copy uh there's some grammatical errors that have been fixed and there's a couple more that we will be Mr Kelly will be fixing with some figures uh let's see uh Mr chairman first one is article one the verbiage will reflect the bottom line figure of the total uh thank you Mr Gaspar second uh major change is that we removed the recent uh previous Capital articles we're holding that to the spring we have uh Gone with the special act uh option for the charter change and uh I'd like some board input tomorrow if possible just on the explanation before we finish drafting it uh I talked to the town Clark about the bylaw committee on the amend the soil conservation where we take out why would about half about a dozen words so to make us in compliance with the state do rights uh We've added two articles I know we' discussed them individually one is to fund a fire department study uh and that will be uh from funds uh that are in the EMS Reserve account that that'll be reflected in the motion for 5,500 what article are we on here article [Music] n the other said no change other than grammatical [Music] article 10 in discussion with the fire chief we limited the scope to repair of uh replacement of Windows the scraping painting of the exterior and the replacing of the generator as far as the roof and other work we're waiting on that uh the this is not to exceed 49,999 the reason for it is we have no uh pricing for any of the other work that's come in yet and we wanted to make sure that that work would be priced right and in compliance with state law Mr chairman Mr gasman before we move on to the next one because we're that's the only two from fire correct I have a concern I know we got a list from the fire chief for a number of different articles but my concern uh most importantly is the ambulance request um as you know we did an appropriation for an ambulance request and a half ago um and it's taken roughly two years I think we don't probably looking at another 6 months to a year before we get delivery Chief uh delivery delivery on that ambulance that we already have on order uh we're looking it's still on time um that's December of 25 January of 26 was a 30-month contract that we signed in June of 23 so the chief does have a request in for another ambulance from the fund through um EMS Reserve receipt account and I know there's appropriate funds in there to do a borrow against that EMS Reserve receipt account from prior years we had a balance in fiscal year 20203 of roughly $760,000 that sound right Chief uh 670 670 sorry reverse the numbers so my concern is not being able to have another ambulance on Odyssey and now the time frame is 2 and A2 years roughly 2 2 and 1/2 years to get one in um we all know that our ambulances are the bread and butter we also know that we use $550,000 this year we use $550,000 to balance the general fund um if we have a problem with one of our ambulances and we're left with one ambulance you can basically take that Revenue that's generated every year and you have a shot fall and what we use it for the general fund so when I look at this ambulance I think it's most important that we get on the queue for another order of another ambulance and wait another eight or n months before the next town meeting comes and then that's three three and a half years out we're putting ourselves at risk we're putting our public at risk um and I'm not comfortable with that so I know it's not inside the warrant but I just figured I'd bring it up for discussion with the board cuz I think we need to be proactive instead of reactive when it comes to that the ambulances are our bread and butter um if we have a problem and we're down an ambulance as we have been in the past it's going to kill Revenue so my concern is not moving forward with article for an ambulance I know he's got other requests I've looked at him I've had that conversation the biggest one is the ambulance waiting waiting on it inflation costs if we can secure that and lock it in I think uh that's that's our job to decide that and I think that um we need to act on that ambulance sooner rather than later A couple conversations with the chief myself and he's had bad luck with his other ambulances and you also got to think of that too know we have some faulty maintenance before you took the helm that you walked right into a mess um when it came to engines and um I'm pretty sure you'd be confident in changing your own engines now but let's uh look look at it this way you know just got to not wear white the days I do it this is this is also something that is funded from his own accounts here and it's you know it's paid for and like you said Mr Gasper if we lose a source of Revenue like this town budget's gone it's just it's a real concern for the board of selectman not to at least have this discussion tonight on on this warrant and and I I just feel that with the weight period that we're seeing with this current ambulance that we're waiting for the problems that we have with the existing sh that we have right now um it could be detrimental to our community by not being proactive now so there's money in the account that's already been pre-certified from prior years as we said I look back at 2023 the funding is available we're not necessarily even going to take it from there because by the time we get to the Springtown meeting we're just getting a funding source in place so the chief could do what he did last time borrow up to x amount of money put it out there and then we can do something over the next year abandon something we might so if we're going to say we're going to borrow up to 600k we'll probably going to do a lot less than that because I think at that point if we get it on auto we take delivery we'll trade something in right yes a tra attach that value will bring the value will bring that cost down um substantially I think on the ambulance so it's a borrow up to 600k whatever we we say from EMS Reserve we go to the spring town meeting we can do a band on it um for permanent funding and excess Revenue that fire amass we could essentially probably just take 300 from the MS Surplus account for the first 50% band it for the next two years and use 150 each year after that it comes out to 600 and your ambul is bought and paid for agree yep Mr Kelly the language we used the last time that was vetted with Bond councel if we use that language this time then when to get in the queue then when we go forward which will be maybe in May but it could be after that depending on when the chief gets firm numbers it could be after June then uh just making sure the board's informed then you're going to have to reauthorize and go forward but I have no problem using the language we've used in the past to which has been vetted with Bond councel and then if you need to change the language sometime in the future after May whether it's Banning it or you partial borrowing then you just have to reauthorize it that's fine I think by the spring to meaning we'll know what we're doing as far as the price goes is that correct it didn't take you more than 6 months to secure price we just need the authorization to show that we have a payment methodology in place to put the order in other than that they won't give us anything is that correct correct that's all we're doing now spring comes we'll do what we need to do to authorize however we're going to pay for that sum of money whatever it may be but if you don't do it in the spring you don't have to reauthorize i' like to do it in the spring so it's all set for the future right just I should have firm numbers no later than January so they should be how does that work once we once we got the numbers from the last one she how did that work did we make payment already for that one nope we haven't paid anything we're still sitting on that on that funding source um how it works is they just want to know that you have a methodology of payment um secured whether that's bonding whether we enter into a lease agreement or a payment agreement with the company um and that gets us into the queue and the authorization from you guys and town meeting is mostly for our own peace of mind so that when we do figure out the company that we want to go with the contract that we want to sign that Mr Kelly uh can sign it knowing that we're not signing something that at some point was going to come to and we don't know how we're going to pay it we can do that same language yeah I don't know if we borrow up to 610 we call it 600 whatever the number may be right 6 the other if you do identical language then V Council can what whatever you want to do but I I I thank you chief for giving us a list and I thank you Mr chairman Sela for at least considering this additional article it's important for our community as well as our Fire EMS employees thank you thank you is there a motion to add an article about ambulance you can just put that in the end when you tell me to go forward with this if you want I'll make a motion to add an ambulance article to the warrant second all those in favor all right the fire station one I think I've explained yep uh the next articles from the school committee authorization for extend extended school transportation contract it's a three-year contract with two oneyear options to see if they can have savings uh versus uh just having to go out every 3 years gentlemen after my conversation with Mr McIntyre this is would indeed save money uh there's no increase in years four and five and BAS Bas on historical data the bus contracts have gone up every single year since the start of things so they act actually have two years where they stay at 0% increase it is automatically a savings in my book um I also spoke with Patrick on he has a we had asked a couple of questions in regards to buses and gas fees Etc uh he did write into the contract with the bus company there is an escalator de escalator so if the price ass does change um there's credits and Patrick correct me if wrong that's monthly so it's actually reviewed monthly um which also can bleit us if the price goes down and um speaking on the electric bus I actually read a big article on it um because I had Mr Kelly and I had asked him about it the cost savings don't outweigh the cost of the bus over time um in a small community like ours it would actually probably cost us way more yeah I I don't disagree with with I agree with that I just I've read you know Fall River got a fleet new vetre gets a fleet I don't know if it's because they're considered a Gateway City or whatever but um you know I trust Patrick and his good judgment if there's a deal out there he'll get it so but just at least ask the question Mr chairman yes Mr G Patrick when when when you uh do you want to come to the podium I think you got a couple articles coming up so instead of everybody trying to figure out who I'm speaking to no problem thanks Patrick so when you if the contract gets locked in what's what's the kind of agreement I appreciate the extended two years there's going to be no um movement in price it'll be locked in at the third year of the contract right so um ultimately we have a three-year contract we need to go to town meeting on anything over three years so we sent out an RFP for a three-year with two option years so in year three going into year four we can look at the market and decide we want to execute option year 4 or we can throw it out and say we're going back back out to bid you know who knows what happens at that point maybe any everything looks better and buses are cheaper and gas is cheaper and everybody's happy right um but that's funny but that's that's the opportunity for this and the same thing for four to five so we never lock ourselves in outside of the three we're locked into three and then we go year to year it's up to us okay so four can move no our our prices are locked in but we can choose to not execute option year 4 because the market looks better or there's competitors out there that are willing to bid against the company that we always get so you have the right to it's say like an option right to exercise year four and five if you feel that that three third year was a good deal but if you feel you can go out for another three-year deal you put it back out to bid you can beat the threeyear deal exactly then you just tell that company we're not going to exercise our option on four which obviously means you're out for five as well and then if we do exercise for four we can still do the same for five we can say year five Market looks better than what's written on our bid we're going back up to Market so the fuel search charge de escalator escalator Mr just talked about when does that get locked in when you lock in a contract will Define price then so that's locked in because it was required part of our bid so it was bid on and it's built in now um the strategy to that was you know they these companies from my understanding is they'll build they don't know the gas prices just like us so they tend to build that into their price over the years and it's it's usually overestimated to cover their butts versus you know being conservative so this way they were able to and technically bring their bid down knowing that if gas pric is skyrocketed we have an escalator if gas prices decreased we have a savings ourselves when we were going out to bid gas prices were pretty pretty high given the the timing of everything that it's already in our favor right now when you go out to bid again for a bus contract when will we go out again or when did yeah you so we're in a threee probably now we just B this out in February March of this past year so we're in year one we're in year one start is this company willing to do that if we get this article pass at T they have to again so we so the the caveat as school started right this was supposed to be on the Springtown meeting it for whatever reason got omitted um we needed to lock into a threeyear so we're locked into a threeyear now I'm asking for permission for those option years so we have a threeyear with the fuel escalator de escalator all other sorts of changes compared to our previous contracts um you know it used to be a set minimum on field trips while our field trips are around town that we did a live mile B so now we're paying them for the 10 miles back and forth rather than their formula that was ultimately built for 100 mile roundtrip so there's savings all over the place in this bid um and like I said we're we're in a three-year contract now we just want our option is because it's going to be at the end there's no cap on it on an escalator um no it's just you analyze it monthly based on the set price that was you pick a baseline for the bidding process if it's 10 cents over that Baseline there's a formula if it's 10 cents below that Baseline there's a formula and again that Baseline was pretty high so I'm I have my fingers crossed okay very we good thank you Mr chairman bre um might as well stay up for the next one article 12 transfer funds from the school special education Reserve fund um you explained this to me last week U which I appreciate um and I'm sure Mr Kelly shared some information with these gentlemen but if you'd like to explain to them the situation with this one yeah so long story short um this was discussed again while building the budget last spring um with the team school committee finance committee um budget subcommittee ultimately our circuit breaker funds that offset our special ed costs went from about $330,000 of an offset down to $117,000 so there there's a pretty good Gap um I carried the previous number in our budget unknowingly until we got too far in the process and I said uhoh there needs to be a correction here and in order to close the gap on the budget at that time I said let's use the stabilization fund to honor that mistake and bring it back up to what circuit break it was the year before um everyone deliberated discussed agreed and that's ultimately how we were balancing our budget for fy2 and again should have been on Springtown meeting but for whatever reason was omitted but that that's really it for whatever reason it was omitted I speak candidly Patrick no I submitted the articles by the deadline with these so we know what your budget was up right and you're saying so it was you know omitted from last town meeting the article for you I'm assuming that you were looking because you talked about circuit breaker money that came in last right and you were looking to to offset that or you would have never been able to reduce your budget to 335 is what you're telling me you would have came in at the 525 right this number plus the 335 right Y and that was that was candidly discussed at that time okay so now we're in a situation where we're building so the one-time Revenue source which we're using here the stabilization account now we're going to have to build that in to the budget next year right next year no not necessarily fcal year 2026 moving forward no it's not best practice I mean just as you guys wouldn't fund operations with stabilization funds it's not best practice to do so we were sort of honoring the cliff that was circuit for fy2 to balance that budget but next year we'll have to sharpen our pencils or go back to the drawing board but I don't want this to become common practice where we make this you know funds non-existent by taking all the funds out of it if you will right right I I I understand what you're saying better explain now that way you just put it um it's unfortunate but you know the concern is building an into the budget movement forward right because you we we know we have these circumstances especially with special ed that's why we built a stabilization account right but it's not the fully fund to call it a student right and that's dangerous because you're using onetime revenues which this was built from so now offset a budget right so it's not built from revenues as much as it is savings so for instance I think two Springtown meetings ago we had Savings in our operating budget that we had an article to say let's fund stabilization up to our limit with our savings before it closes out to free cash so however you want to shake it but that would be the methodology again this year our first priority anything that gets returned from the school department though in that instance that you're talking about that technically incumbent by free cash right it's un unexpended funds from the prior year that's how you derive to free cash the following year right it's unencumbered y right that's what you just said yep okay so it's still onetime Revenue yeah well I I I wasn't calling it Revenue cuz it's it's not from any earnings it's from it's not a revenue stream if you will okay so you're trying to say to the board and the town's people are going to do our best not to make sure we don't automatically start off with the next fiscal year with $190,000 deficit which we aren't because this was discussed and everyone had agreed upon it for fy2 and no it won't be built into our practice of submitting a budget okay thank you it's tough right it's not fun I mean it's a big it's a big number and I get it and I appreciate that that you're going to look at other ways to not put this as a permanent part of your budget right the anomaly was a circuit breaker it had tended to be in the 300,000 all of a sudden it came in at 114,000 or 117 don't quote me on it but hopefully based on our submissions of eligible expenses in FY 25 that number is back up and it closes the Gap itself but the only I think lesson that I learned from this conversation that we're finally having Patrick is when the school committee or School administration watches the board of select's meeting we reviewing the warrant and you see that something is being omitted somebody needs to run down here and talk to us right not um end of story so that this doesn't happen in the future right sounds good thank you moving forward anything like we discussed anybody who's sitting in the chair whether it's reaching out running down to a meeting anybody who's sitting in the chair if there's anything you notice that gets missed or slips through by all means Reach Out AB so we don't have to play catch up and run back and forth all right next to we got the energy management um did you want to start with your consultation um with your Consultants rather yeah so if we can pull them up up on teams um so you know this goes back almost a year now of what we've been battling at a Kush Elementary with our steering committee discussions to ultimately say hey let's procure this not through a capital means but a a performance contract but what is it is this deal with the mold issue yes um air quality so uh where where was I so we pursued the performance contract acting as the steering committee sort of agreed upon we've been working on it ever since train was selected as our Energy Service Company um to to help perform an investment grade audit to look at what's needed in these buildings to address them and more recently oh it is can somebody talk to those people yeah you can just talk they can hear you hi we're at the board of SEL meeting we just started the teams we just want to you know that um everyone can hear you oh okay never mind I guess they don't want to be with you right you jump back in if you want after Patrick explains what he was explaining sorry no it's all right you didn't drop the call we're muted it says we no we're we're good we're okay for now all right so long story short we've been working on this for a year we put the articles in as anticipated again you know we had conversations about this so that this would happen in the fall as planned we're hoping October November it got moved up to September because of the elections um you know we've been up against it all summer you know working Engineers Architects everything um through our buildings and then you know we got wind of maybe these articles weren't going to make it on Fall town meeting there's some clarity that needed to be provided we met with chairman hinley um and Town Administrator Mr Kelly just last week to say hey what's going on what do we need to clarify you know we thought everything thing was everybody was on the same page with at least getting these articles on the warrant um we had a pretty productive conversation that led to this presentation which we're going to try to keep brief but get you guys up to speed on what's going on what this entails um and and how you know this is ultimately the most fiscally responsible grout we can come up with for this hi is great can you hear us hello Okay computer I'm sorry sorry it worked last week so Gentlemen Just so you know this was going to be trained explaining questions about phases and all the other documents that Patrick has sent over that have been having Sydney forward to you as well in regards to this um while we're waiting for them to come in gentlemen if you have any questions uh for Patrick please speak I guess is there I've heard a lot I haven't been paying too much attention to like the ins and outs per se but I just kept hear like last year it was mold mold mold it was a big mold issue is there a mold issue or is there not a mold issue so last year we very much had an issue with surface molds throughout the aush elementary school um that I mean we closed school for two and a half days to deep clean the entire building I mean that was no secret um from there you know we we've had engineers in and out of the buildings to say what's causing this you know people were saying we have a sick building we have this or that ultimately these Engineers assessed and said three different companies said hey it's it's a humidity issue you know it's a building envelope issue so we you know step back and said okay how do we how do we pursue this further we need to know what's wrong with these buildings and how much we need to invest in these buildings to address the issue to get some longevity out of these issues out of these buildings so we're not talking about building $100 million schools because of surface mod um so that's where we went with this performance Contracting through the department of energy and resources um there's a lot of incentive which we'll go over this on going that route um but ultimately they do an investment grade audit of anything in your building that consumes or loses energy and tells you what's wrong with it so it checks all the boxes it looks at almost all our major Capital assets you know our boilers our generators our alarm systems our controls our heating our cooling whether it's existent or not it looks at our building envelope and it says here's everything that's wrong and this is what it's going to cost to fix that so that's just what they're going to give us we've kind of boiled it down to a phase to say we want to combat the air quality at AES so that we don't deal with this surface mold issue again once we cleaned once we plugged in the 50 plus individual classroom size dehumidifiers in all the rooms we've been able to manage it we have those running 24/7 we have fans running 24/7 circulate the air so there's no stagnant there and we've been successful thus far but this is very much a Band-Aid fix and you know as Mr Gasper said in some of the earlier conversations we want to be proactive rather than reactive to this before it is a bigger fix I mean we invested $ 300,000 plus dollars of Esser funds without asking the town for a single dollar during the school closure during this deep clean during the duct cleaning purchasing dehumidifiers replacing bulletin boards and carpets that couldn't be cleaned um and we can't we can't afford that to do that again neither can the town um so we're seeking a permanent fix which is ultimately why we're here hi everyone can you hear us did that answer your question Mr woman thanks think so I I guess so you're telling me we have a surface mold issue now it's not existing now because we're running around crazy emptying dehumidifiers every four or five hours circulating fans at all times um it it's it's there there's no evidence and no testing that is alluded that there's still a mold problem in our schools but obviously we can't operate we can't operate on these terms I got you again I'm trying to like separate fact from fiction and what thetion is versus what the reality is right because I'm so we sent all the testing results over again you know last year we can do it again but dece late December was the last time we physically tested the airspace and it was our you know s eighth round of testing where we tested samples of surfaces and we tested air and all levels were acceptable um and again since then we've kept it that way we haven't retested but we have had no Visual Evidence of mold because of the steps we've taken with these dehumidifiers and fans and open doors and closed windows and everything else yes I I do Max hi can you hear us or we can hear you now let's see can you hear me baseball team's going oh yes okay I fixed it sorry we got we're good so um we have theor lman here Patrick's on this side um so I'll step out of the way so you can see uh everyone for the most part you sdne me thank you jum thank you so much just keep an eye out for the fa Patrick I I'm not sure if we missed an introduction if you if you would like to introduce um what we're here to talk about or if you just want me to go ahead and kick it off yeah so I'll introduce you guys individually real quick um we've sort of talked about the current status of our elementary school and our our buildings otherwise and how we got here um but for everyone listening and for the board of Selectmen this is train Technologies they were the Esco that was selected to perform this uh Energy Management Service for us um I'll let them get into names as they proceed through the slides and then we also have um Beth greenblat from Beacon integrated Services who's our owner consultant um she works she's the expert of experts in this field she works with the Department of energy resources everyone knows her she's been a phenomenal asset for us um and working through this process so with that I'll let you guys take it away to the presentation thank you so much and thank you thank you for the introduction Patrick and also thank you to the board of selectman for having us today uh like Patrick mentioned we're here to talk about our engagement with the cushion in public schools to come together and really find a a solution uh for a comprehensive um project that really addresses all the needs of the school facilities while fitting within uh fiscal budgets and and getting a project that that fulfills the requirements of a comprehensive Energy Management Services solution um so the agenda today is like Patrick said hopefully we'll keep it brief um no promises but we'll first introduce the project team talk about the why of the project and why we're here and why we we first became engaged um a schedule update on where we are to date and what we have done done thus far with with the aush team um reviewing the the scope of what we're proposing for a phase one project uh budget review and then just discussing some financials of of what support think is out there and then closing with some Community benefits in Q&A feel free to ask questions throughout I I think that's better anyways if you if you ask a question and it um comes to mind just go ahead and stop me I can't always see questions come up but I've asked Beth and Max to be monitoring the chat in case any do do come up so feel free uh so this is the project team both the Acushnet team and the train team on the accuset side we obviously have superintendent Dr Paula Bailey uh Patrick McIntyre business manager Steve louette facilities director and Beth greenblat who's here with us who's the owner's route from Beacon Integrated Solutions um the entire equitment team has been so supportive of of really enabling train to do to do our job in coming up with solutions to um really pull together a comprehensive project so we really appreciate um the team working with us to make that happen and then on the train side you have myself Morgan Paris on the Energy Services account executive here with train which just means I'm the I'm the point person for this project uh from start to finish of developing it uh working with the team um helping to get it it financed and supported um however that may be and then um really long term to make sure over the years that this is a successful project from from a kushit perspective long term um and then we have Max ma here who's our professional engineer and project developer uh Max I don't know if you want to say anything to introduce yourself to absolutely good good evening gentlemen um ladies and gentlemen I'm my name is Max M I'm a project developer on this project I'm happy to clarify if you have any uh questions on the technical details of the developed Solutions and happy to uh point out some examples of our uh past Solutions developed to a similar project scope thank thanks Max uh so a little bit of what we're calling the why of this project is really to address some growing needs across the two schools um as it relates to physical plant equipment heating ventilation and air conditioning systems and building management controls um what we do is we come in and we really try and make buildings last um and that's that's what a lot of this project is it's it's ensuring that we have a building that's sustainable and provides really a comfortable and efficient learning space for teachers and also students as well um a lot of our projects include um improving the indoor Environmental Quality of these spaces um specifically at at the elementary school we know this is a high priority uh issue and then as a part of this legislation of chapter 25 a1i which we'll talk about in the next slide um reducing energy consumption and demand while we enhanced and upgrade to more energy efficient equipment is also key here um addressing some deferred maintenance naturally comes with upgrading infrastructure and then something we'll also talk about into more of the financing slide is optimizing green communities funding and really taking advantage of available funds not only at the state but local level um to to Really enhance this project um and make sure it's a a good one and that we're using these funds appropriately just one quick slide on performance Contracting that's the the theory behind this this legislation chapter 25 a1i which we've engaged under um it's regulated by the massachus Department of energy resources the TD and it's where one qualified firm provides both the design and Engineering the installation and then guaranteeing the Energy savings over the long term the life of these agreements uh can be up to 20 years um so they really are long-term engagements and agreements between two parties um and it's it's so that we really are both invested in the solution and the long-term operation of of whatever project you all to move forward with um these projects can be paid overtime entirely or in part by Energy savings that's where this Massachusetts legislation is actually unique from other states and then there's flexibility in how you were to go about um financing or or paying for a project of this nature and give you an update on where we are in the process um this is really a nine step of what are the the key steps of a performance Contracting or energy inment Services agreement process it starts off as Patrick mentioned with a request for qualifications um that was issued in February of 20124 train was selected in May of 2024 and we executed a detailed audit agreement uh which we call the IGA which is essentially a detailed audit of your buildings in July of 2024 so since July we have been walking throughout the two schools developing a detailed scope of improvements uh engaging the necessary stakeholders and really really narrowing down on a scope of work um that meets the school's uh really top priority issues um so right now we're I have my arrow pointed at step six which is really defining a project to be prepared for town meeting September of 2024 and then steps 7 through n are they're estimated right so best case scenario for installation of this schedule um is for summer 25 so that's really why this is priority um schedule for us is so that we can order receive equipment and have that in so that these Solutions are are ready to go come come cooling season next year I just wanted to give you a a quick snapshot of the different types of measures that we look at when we when we perform an investment grade audit so for both schools we've we've looked at lighting building envelope controls installation kitchen walk-in cooler freezer control um solar Renewable Energy Systems Transformer upgrades other HVAC system upgrades air purification measures and even water conservation measures so when we say comprehensive we really do mean everything from the the roof and the building envelope all the way down to lighting and any other um typical energy conservation measures you could think of um what we've narrowed down for a phase one scope of work will be four different Scopes four different slides I'll go through right now uh starting off with the hbac upgrades at a kushna elementary school um so the goal of this is to to improve the Indoor Comfort and humidity at the elementary school through upgrading the hvbc systems and controls um so we'll be repairing in some cases replacing in other cases obsolete equipment and components and adding in cooling so that we're able to better control humidity and comfort in those spaces it'll be improving into air quality and Environmental Quality um and that will be done through a variable refrigerant flow system called vrf heat pumps um for really efficient Heating and Cooling so in those swing season months when the heating load is is relatively small we'll be actually be utilizing um these Electric Systems to do that and then when it gets into the little bit of a cooler months we'll we'll ask for the the um typical boilage system to take over there because of the expensive uh needs of a of a new system like this we had to do some additional development work and um studies in order to understand what the impact on electrical structural of the building would be so we're including those as well to accommodate these types of um extensive upgrades but the total added cooling capacity of this new system would be over 300 tons which is it's a pretty big system um I think Max noted it's about 450 midsize window air conditioners uh so that's a lot but will be a great way to to Really comprehensively approach the hdac systems associated with the elementary school second scope of work included in in phase one would be the building management system this is the controls that we actually attach to both our new systems the brf in the previous slide but also the existing systems as well um so that would be coordinating when does that heating of the vrf system happen versus when does the heating of the boiler system happen it'll include the controls of ancillary equipment and also includes us repairing some of the the pieces that we'd imagine have have failed over the past couple of years um it'll include full integration visibility of all the buildings on one webbased system so Steve can actually pull up his phone and see when he wakes up in the morning you know what are the set points in each space do I have any alarms um so really improve visibility of of issues as they arise versus going on more of a fix on approach um we'll be replacing obsolete controllers and um this is actually to note it's a requirement of uh ever source and the Mass Save incentives to have controls um integrated what you do a VF system in order to get those incentives associated with the heat pumps um so this is also a requirement and also an operational benefit as well the third scope will be um um including in this phase one is building envelope improvements I've included a couple screenshots this is not by any means the full audit of of what was developed and identified through the walkthrough of build an envelope but these are a couple of the the highlights so really core to to building envelope improvements is to tighten the building envelope so that you're improving indoor air quality by decreasing the amount of infiltration and exfiltration that's happening between Gap and doors gaps between the roof and the wall um window ceiling Etc um so I have a couple you know for example there's door weather stripping um there's roof wall intersection air ceiling you can see in the top they've even arrowed towards some of the the holes between the two um and there's there's gaps as you can see in the roof in that middle picture um that's really creating this unwanted infiltration and exfiltration and that's what's allowing some of this more hot humid air to kind of come in and make it a little bit more more difficult to maintain comfort and then towards the right here I actually have a video that the um that we discovered during the audit um I will say I've never had an a video sent to me so this is an interesting one but I just wanted to show just briefly um because I think the visual is is interesting let me know if you can see this or not yeah we can see it do you hear it no okay so they're essentially saying that if you can see these cobwebs that are blowing just above the drop ceiling with those windows below you can see the cobwebs flowing actually because that means that the air is going through um the insulation is a bit discolored and that's because air is constantly coming through and and making that insulation discolored which is what they would work on ceiling in this specific area I was just essentially reading over what he was saying to make it easier and then last actually I don't think this is last I think we had five and I I was thinking in my had four so this is this is four I believe duck ceiling um max do you want to go ahead and take over for this one just give a quick breakdown of duck ceiling Morgan um duck ceiling is essentially as the even a new doctor right your typical rectangular sheep metal doctor has um just from the manufacturing uh and they install so do seing is essentially a new technology where uh they pressurize the do work they have to prep the doct work and pressurize it um so that they introduce a sealant that aderes to any uh essentially self detecting of the uh automat detecting of any cracks uh and it seals to itself much um kind of much like how um there um how chemicals in are qu coagulates so this is kind of like it finds the gaps and the coagulate so I thought it's uh useful to have a visual of that that took a couple pictures from uh when the company came out uh to demonstration so they put a typical screen uh just a window screen uh cut a hole in the doct took a window screen and then they started pressuring pressurizing the doctor with the ceiling and the SE as the ceiling came through that it formed the seal on that window screen and by the end of that as you can can see at the bottom picture uh that hole is completely sealed uh this this particular um measure also includes uh a component of coating of all existing coils and that's both interior and exterior the benefit of that being the coils um clean coils obviously is um clean and CED coils is more resistant to corrosion right so operationally you are extending the life of the coil and in addition uh um there's improved conduct ity right with um minimizing surface rust the surface deposits surface corrosion uh it it improves the heat transfer and thereby increasing the efficiency of the equipment if you call the outdoor Co you can imagine the um um the AC units of the outdoor coil will work more efficiently if you co the indoor uh hot water coil then is more effective you transfer thanks Morgan we can go to the next slide please uh here we have another measure which is air purification this is in response um to our observation at the school currently that in order to maintain um the quality of indoor air um indoor air conditions uh in each of the classrooms there is currently a in room type of air filter air air purifier right and that introduces number one energy use because now you have a plug in air purifier in every single r and number two um is is a maintenance U task right because now you got to examine each air purifier and replace as necessary um so we have proposed a solution of a centralized system where essentially this solution we uses the same space that currently has the air filter essentially we are replacing the air filter bank with one that is ionized uh with with electricity so it attracts particles to itself thereby achieving a equivalent of Mer 14 performance for those of us that um that have replace a filters we notice that their ner ratings the higher the rating essentially the more effective it is at capturing um particul right down to the smaller particul So currently the filters in the elementary school uh air handling units are are about more five equivalent so we are proposing a m 14 equivalent uh allowing the schol to remove the room by room air purifiers while achieving a better um um outcome in the air purification process so I put a couple of um pictures there so that people can see how that actually looks like from the training video of the of the installation so you can see the frame essentially is what is the bulk of the system right the frame includes a power feed includ the Transformer so that's all part of the work that's in fact um the more involved part of the work is to provide new feed and powering the system the uh filter media itself is a blue part where um the maintenance staff can take out and replace just as they do with any other regular filter uh I actually chatted with one of my colleagues recently that installed the filter uh about 8 years ago and they said the first change over uh that's a typical office building I should say the first change over occurred five years after the initial install because there is a u there is a measurement point which measures the pressure jop across the filter essentially um it's self-detecting if is monitoring if the filter is too full to cost too much of a pressure job that it's time to replace so even based on that monitor system the first filter lasted five years so I was very impressed with that but a manufacturer typically says Hey depending on usage you could be one change over a year or even up to um down to six months per change over um so for those that um are cons for those that are concerned with how how is the system maintained that's some of the info we [Music] have next um really we wanted to highlight um both our our phase one targeted budget and then also some additional funding opportunities that we've identified as well so between those five measures we've listed the hbac upgrades the building management system the building envelope improvements duck ceiling and air purification our total phase one budget is coming in around a not to exceed of 4.2 um which is really the total of all five of those now additional funding opportunities that we've identified um but are by no means guaranteed are are one to start the eversource incentives through Mass save those were estimating at about $525,000 right now that's based off of a prescriptive variable refrigerant flow which is the RF the system we installed ing rebate um with some some a safety Factor included essentially because um we're actually outside of the prescriptive uh constraint so we do have to go into a custom rebate which is why this is not a a firm and fixed number yet although we have applied for the incentive and and are waiting to hear back uh second is GRE green communities the grant cycle is upcoming the deadline to apply is early October uh and this grant opportunity could look anything close to 250,000 which is the standard all the way up to 500,000 if we were to uh be able to secure a decarbonization grant which is what this project um would be focused towards and then lastly is Green School Works implementation funding this is brand new uh early octo early August was when um this funding opportunity came out and a kushit has submitted interest forms uh for this electrification project uh that includes air source heat pumps and and then just to close with Community benefits we hope this project really strives for is is broken down into three different budget buckets it's fiscal social and environmental so fiscally we're we're upgrading the elementary school um for needed facility upgrades while also making sure that we do it in the most energy efficient and comfortable way um while utilizing those savings to help pay for our project the Energy savings are guaranteed by train and we're really utilizing as many local and um State funds as we possibly can to help reduce the capital costs where that comes from ever source and also bring communities grant opportunities um and this this new brainworks funding as well socially we hope to optimize Indo air quality in the elementary school and solve those humidity issues and that will in turn hopefully positively impact student and Educators Comfort uh and then lastly it's it's of course environmental with a measurable reduction in utility consumption and also reducing Greenhouse gas emissions by transitioning to this decarbonized solution um that also provides those incentives as well and that was all we had today to present and now I think we'll open it um up to the team for Q&A gentlemen have any questions Mr chairman I stepped out for a second but I'll I'll promise I'll view this on YouTube afterward did you do like a baseline air quality test did you that was that discussed at all was there a baseline air quality test as part of your service or you know is part of this process on your end so how do you you know what's your methodology in determining what's the uh the right level of um upgrade or you know system that you that's [Music] needed Max do you want to take that sure I I say uh from the perspective how did we design if I understand your question correctly how did we design the um the mechanical cooling system right um we we looked at your existing equipment number one um for a cost effective feable solution we want to be able to reuse as much of the existing infrastructure as possible so we maximize the size of the coils in your existing uh air handling unit so that we add appropriate equ to supply those coils so that's that's one um part of the method um and also we did low studies a low study in terms of heating cooling modes to make sure that each area will be sufficiently cooled with this solution um as far as so so from that pers and also with our controls right the controls make sure that uh the new equipment and the old uh and the existing equipment in terms of the um the boilers the air handler and hand units the exhaust fans will operate in in integrated fashion uh so that's what improves um by Heating and Cooling of the space and a lot of the space conditions a lot of the challenges as we understand uh from the school uh for example excessive humidity um is is a function of not is a function of several things that we're addressing right here right um it not having mechanical cooling means you cannot strip moisture from air uh having a um envelope that's uh aging um means that there's uncontrolled infiltration of air um and having leak a dark work that's leaking means that there is uncontrolled um exfiltration of air out of the duct where into spaces that might form condensation right so all these factors are considered um in terms of developing our solution is do we what's the status of our like of our um insulation and you know all that so that's the part you stepped out on unfortunately um they I actually sent along the entire building envelope report um last week that hopefully you guys can get up to speed on at some point but they highlighted you know the gaps in the you know the building envelope right so either whether it's at doors they looked at things as simple as that windows and then they look you did like an energy audit that the average customer would do for it's like uh yeah so M saving attic at home put they did this to a grand scale and we have a full you know 20 Page Report with all the findings on it with videos pictures so on so forth I mean the thing is with this you know Heating and Cooling is such a tricky I mean I've got Bob Brown who built my house right we we were one of the first houses on the Green community the new um specs for a green Community Home and sometimes these things are are too tight right and there's not enough ventilation and there's you know you need cross ventilation and things of that nature there's so many factors that contribute to air quality um you know I'm glad that you guys are looking at this and getting a third party professional to to look at that because it's a as much as we try to make it an exact science I I feel like sometimes it's not an exact science as so many extending circumstances that will uh contribute uh to a situation right and and you you're absolutely right that we do not want to uh solve the solution by starving the building of ventilation uh with a commercial building uh by commcial I mean any building that's not residential uh the difference is that there are dedicated ventilation systems right in this in this case there are Central uh what's called Heating and ventilation units or HV units uh that's not present in the in a residential setting um so we our controls will um our controls will include the control of outside air intake right the dampers uh we control the fans to make sure the adequate ventilation is always maintained and what we don't want is infiltration of air from sources that we cannot cool or heat or condition and go into spaces that we do not intend right that's a lot of the rationale for developing the building envelope work the DU ceiling and the uh uh the the air purification is to make sure that we treat every single um every single unit of a that comes into the building Mr chairman Mr Gasper so we you put up a screen with like four or five different punch points and I noticed that the added cooling is $3.1 million of the $4.2 million cost and the rest of the the building envelope and the air purification and three two or three other things were roughly a million dollar so adding air condition to just the a kushna elementary school is $3.1 million is that what that say in that last slide you did with us we're correct in that that energy conservation measures Standalone would be yes the the 3.1 but we really see the HVAC upgrades in concert with all of the other ecms but really mostly in concert with the building management controls because controlling new and existing systems is really where you're going to see most of the benefits um and where you're going to get the additional incentives as well so than May so I may add some go ahead sorry if I may add some context to that um a large relatively large number for the hbsc calls and that's because uh working in a existing building uh we have to do the structural electrical engineering and there's a upgrade on each side right on the on the uh Structural Engineering part to make sure that we do structural reinforcement so that the units can be located out outside the unit uh units that provide the cooling right uh the refrigeration units can be located on top the roof and also electrically they can there is upgrade to to for new panels new electrical panels new fees to supply to the units in addition of the control so uh just some some consideration for why the scope is large it's not just purchasing the units and installing the units it's also a lot of the install work and a lot of the uh ground work uh in terms of Engineering in terms of does that that's that's a good that's a good point too Max because um I think that also reinforces the fact that um this is a not to exceed for a reason it's a not to exceed because we are still waiting for some of that information back as it relates to our our surveys and our studies regarding how much is needed in order for us to electrically power support a project of this nature so there there this is a budget this is a not to exceed um and the hope is that it comes in under that do we currently have a air condition in the ACC cushion Elementary School we have limited areas that are air conditioning as well as we have um window units in certain areas so we have some larger units that condition some spaces then we have window units you know in the libraries in the main office that's about it so you you talked about some some consist are being replaced but some are being repaired what is the sum that is being CN Al Patrick just said we only have very limited air conditioners um what is being repaired and what's being replaced for I guess $3.1 million so um to get a little bit into the wi there are uh 11 hea ventilation units um so those are the central units that Supply ventilation to the majority of the spaces those are getting um getting reconditioned will upgrade components as necessary and uh those are being uh reused um just that we are adding a coil in a refrigerant coil in each of the unit and the coils will be supplied with outside air unit outdoor air uh outdoor units that are on the roof right there are actually 27 modules Al together on the roof to supply that what when we we me uh that that Supply is roughly 280 tons worth of cooling if you recall we mentioned that we will be adding a nominal 304 tons right uh the other 24 tons come from three rooftop uh units uh that are currently supplying um some small smaller isolated areas of One Wing the blue wing of the school and that's uh that's being replaced so that will receive new unit most of the systems are new most of the systems are new cooling systems that were not in place and and on site beforehand that we are adding so unfortunately there's there's another concern of mine with air condition units on the roof right so we just put a brand new roof in the cost of I guess somewhere $2.5 million we'll call it right for the for this conversation piece in that warranty on that roof does it call out anything about any additional anything about additional units being added to a roof to avoid that roof warranty and if we did put additional units on the roof or stop pulling the existing ones off the roof to replace them with new ones does that void our warranty so I'm glad you asked that cuz the manufacturer of the roof and and owner of the warranty if you will has very much been involved in this project everything's going to be run by them so we do not Avid that warranty and then you know to get back to access point there will be structural needs you know to the roof to be able to support all these units which also will be factored into the equation to make sure not to avoid the warranty we would not want to do that to to add to Patrick's comment we have suppli we have in contact with the uh uh the roof installer and we have supplied them with our intended locations of the outdoor unit uh we are waiting to hear back from their comments but um is it's pretty common for us to work uh collaboratively with roof manufacturers roof installers um our operations team are very much aware that we need to maintain the roof warranty so that's typically not an issue uh in terms of the replacing the units the openings are already there what we do is essentially have a roof curve adapter on top of that so usually that uh does not uh that usually is not a structural change to the roof right that's just replacing unit it's the same footprint same top cour who's going to so who's going to warrantee the proof after you he just made a comment about the existing openings but we know we're going to put stuff in there that might not be the same size what happens if we start getting a leak through that it's it's under warranty because there from whom this company or the roofing company company they sign off on any changes that we're going to make before we make them so that we know we're not voiding the warranty in the process so the going to take responsibility for another companies again they sent them all the plans already where the units are going to be located where the new roof is where an old roof is and the the roofing company signs off on that to validate our warranty will still exist with these [Music] changes part of part of the project you said heat pumps so heat pumps are used in Europe a lot and they're very hot on energy with the rising cost of energy cost what is this really going to do to the school's energy bills the um vrf technology the heat pumps right um on at at least applied to auset is a energy costs saver the reason is because auset uses the the school uses number two oil right heating oil and heating oil is a relatively expensive source of heat uh versus electricity is expensive how however brfs are efficient right heat pumps are efficient to think about it with heating in roughly you have about 80% 80% efficiency meaning you know 80% of your input energy eventually gets into heting the air versus for the VF system you can think of it as R you know anywhere between 200 and 400% uh of course we don't call that efficiency we call that uh that that's essentially extracting uh heat from the air and uh moving it into the into the air stream that's why we call it heat pump so in terms of energy cost um it's a net saver because because when you look at per unit of heat provided to the Airstream it's cheaper to operate the brf versus um the oil heating now oil heating will remain as a full redundancy meaning we are not removing any of the existing heating coils um so uh in the in the future you still if for any reason um electricity really becomes expensive during a short period of time during the market conditions you have the you have the option to um continue to uh use oil for heating purposes um again another benefit I would say of the um as Morgan mentioned this is very much a decarbonization decarbonization strategy because oil will remain what it is for the next 100 years for the next 200 years oil's um carbon intensity will be there right emission Vector versus electricity grid is getting cleaner and cleaner as you know town of kushan has um purchased green energy uh or has agreement to for green energy similarly across the grid right the grid is getting cleaner and cleaner so if you heat with electricity uh even if the efficiency does not improve uh the grid itself gets cleaner so your carbon footprint gets cleaner which helps with some of the uh application of the green commes Grant other grants that are focus focus on decarbonization and just so that's a indirect uh Financial benefit just to add to that these numbers aren't pulled out of thin air obviously they've looked back at three plus years of our utilities cost and usage our oil cost and usage um they've been in touch with eversource where they did a Time study of our usage and then they put eventually we'll see the results in their reports but theyve put all that together to an analyze where there's going to be this energy positive energy savings versus negative energy savings so it's it's a lot of work it's not just we don't know what that positive energy savings is we CU we know what the cost of the project is but what do we know the cost of the project we don't we have the not to exceed figure and we also don't have the final report because again all this is anticipated so if we go back to the purpose of why we're here it's to get the articles on the warrant so that we have the opportunity similar to the ambulance and related but not right if we miss the boat here all of a sudden we're at Springtown meeting or the next fall town meeting and we don't have the opportunity to jump into these things anymore this isn't making anything official it's just giving the board of Selectmen the opport to enter into a contract agreement and secure debt once we get these reports and say wow this is a great project and while this isn't a great project okay so you just said a magic word debt okay I don't know if we need these folks do we need these folks on to talk about that Mr Kelly might want to ask them something because I don't think we need to talk about that we we can discuss that afterwards I just wanted to keep them on for any technical questions Mr Kelly you have a technical question yeah you're talking about using old equipment and new new equipment and kind of from what I understand combining the two can you discuss the lifespan of the new equipment the lifespan of the old equipment that you're using uh the number of years that you expect this to operate and is there warranty on the new equipment and is there an extended warranty or is it the old warranty on the old equipment Max do you want to start and then I'll I'll take over for warranties uh the rooftop units and the brf uh units are typically the lifespan is typically 15 to 20 years uh of course it depends a lot right it's it's like asking how long can the car last it depends a lot on how it's operated and what connections uh but that's the typical in terms of warranty it comes with we are the manufacturer uh it comes with the standard warranty on the new equipment um and then Moran I'll pass to you on the existing equipment P yeah so I mean I was I was going to add Max that so in in when we're really including and and adding new equipment to work in concert with existing equipment like Max said that's adding a simple coil to an existing Heating and ventilation unit um so the existing structure of the h&v unit will remain uh and US adding in the coil uh with the controls is really how this piece of equipment is going to operate efficiently and effectively over over the long term um we have a standard oneyear parts and labor warranty as it relates to workmanship of our construction project and then like Max said we we stand very firm with our warranties on new equipment so there will be a warranty on the coil there will also be warranties on the rooftop units typically standard um equipment warranties for rooftop equipment will be um first year parts and parts and labor similar to our construction and then also there's usually a 5year warranty on the compressor and sometimes a 10e 5 to 10 year warranty on on the heat exchanger um so it's based off of Parts though um that is not a labor warranty for an extended period of time we do offer extended warranties though and that that can absolutely be purchased as a part of this contract to get an extended warranty if that's of Interest what would really to ensure the the go ahead what would happen if the old you put new equipment into Old equipment and the old equipment failed so that's a little bit what I was mentioning in the building management systems um scope of work where we noted that we've included a additional funds and this not to exceed in order to cover when we find issues of that nature so when we install this building management system we'll be able to see um a lot as it relates to existing operation and where there are some small failures that that you wouldn't have been able to know of before for example dampers actuators that weren't working before um so we've included funds in order to cover the replac of those um but for the most part Air Handlers have a fan they have dampers they evacuators um and there's really not too too much in there aside from the coil that we'll be adding so we're pretty comfortable in the number that we've that we've included to cover those other repairs and based off of other school projects that we've done um usually we're able able to make all the repairs NE necessary in order to make these units um continue to run effectively I would also add that doing our initial walk through uh we did a comprehensive inspection of each unit so we we have determined that the current unit conditions are in good condition like Morgan mentioned um you know the housing is is in good condition it's uncorrupted right uh the fan motors are operating the fan um in terms of the blower condition we did look at that and of course down the road uh small components could fail and that's part of the uh continuous maintenance um that's that's part of the maintenance process but as far as the current condition uh of the the housing the the important parts they think of it as a frame of the car is in good condition so we did take that into consideration in this recommendation Mr couple question just two questions one have you is there any pro recent projects that you could point to that you've been involved in similar to this scenario where you know you've retrofitted and put new stuff in that we could you know talk to the people who've done that you know is there a recent school and then the second question I had is have you looked at or do you look at Mini Splits I know like there's a trend while it may not be the best trend what's that Mini Splits s heat right has that been part of this examination uh where hospitals are going in the direction of of of that is have you examined that a system like that those systems for this this project I can I can answer the example one um we do retrofits is essentially all we do uh in this team right here Max and I so we're constantly retrofitting existing systems and existing buildings um so I'm sure I can come up with with something to send to you that's an example um if you're interested in talking to someone probably not here on the phone right now um I would want to get the necessary approvals in order to give you that information but can absolutely send you an example of someone that we' worked with on a retrofit like that and obviously references were part of the vetting process we got full reports of what they've worked on in other towns and schools and similar projects and savings we have the whole package so to Morgan's Point she can she can get the approval to continue to share those and we can do so okay yeah I I'll answer the second question you do on my Morgan third question was um have we considered a split system um we have in fact the first step is to take um a comprehensive walk through of your building understand your systems and come up with a solution that tailed to the to your particular building in this case for a cush elementary school right the the system is built as a central ventilation unit um meaning all the ventilation era comes in through a central system rather than for example if you look at uh the middle school is comes into each room through a unit ventilator right that type of system might be more available uh to a split system I'll point out some of the differences uh if you have a central system then um most of the heating cooling capacity if you want to provide cooling comes through the ducted system uh so it's more cost effective to provide a coil in the central system uh second is that we minimize the refrigerant run into the occupied space because now the refrigerant stays in that um mechanical meing out onto the roof where where it connects to the roof roof um out door connection units on the roof so that's an advantage right because that avoids uh all the compliance and detection other necessary work that a split system might evolve and uh further uh we we maximize the use of existing equipment which is um expected to be good condition um so that we do not unnecessarily add uh indoor heads well mounted unit or cassette or otherwise other cooling delivery devices right terminal devices into the space and in general a split system will be even more expensive of course it depends on the particular um particular School set up but in general scho system requires more refrigerant run because now you're run your refrigerator into each room so those are all part of the consideration for Central uh ventilation system like the one in AC cush Elementary School uh adding a CO is the most cost effective uh way to do it no more technical questions so this is this so this is basically just an upgrade of the a condition system not the heating system the controls I think are a huge component of this that I don't want to miss we you know everything will be able to alert control you know let you know of Maintenance coming up so that we can prevent it before it breaks right um there's no up my question is no upgrade of the heating system the boil is wherever we're using right the heat pumps so the heat pump going to kick on to get the heat of the building up to a certain extent where the heat pumps can effectively and efficiently turn on to shut off the oil and now use energy that we can conserve and and operate more efficiently than the oil so there is a heating component change to this as well there is the the very core actually of of these types of projects of of a heat pump to to decarbonize is really to take over some maybe not all but some of the heating that was done by oil before now in the swing Seasons when you're at you know 55° down to 30° outdoor air temperature the vrf system this this heat pump system will do be doing the heating instead of the traditional oil boiler system any more technical questions no sir good all right well thank you Morgan Max and Beth uh we're going to let you go uh to jump into our next part of this I appreciate all the info thank you so much everyone thank you for having us and and thank you for letting us do this virtually we appreciate the flexibility absolutely thank you thank you thank you so Patrick Mr chairman absolutely Mr yes Patrick you you you struck that nerve of debt right sure that everybody's curious about 4 million 4.2 million roughly up to $4.2 million and you said it would allow the bard of Selectmen to go out and and borrow that amount right well just 4.2 is the number without incentives without grants it's not going to be 4.2 we just can't guarantee the incentives at this point in time we haven't been awarded the grants at this point in time correct okay so it's again up to let's call it $4 million for the sake of this discussion doesn't matter it's 3.5 3 million 4 million whatever it is yes the debt okay $4 million I don't believe that this board can just say oh let's put a an article on Town meaning floor and we're going to it's going to authorize to borrow up to $4 million so if you're going to try to borrow that kind of money that's going to require a debt exclusion because the town doesn't have in its capacity to pay this down so you shaking your head no so why don't you tell me how we plan on paying down that debt yeah so I mean obviously not my Lane but based on conversations that I've had with your offices um Town Administrator Town accountant Bond your Town's Bond Council that they could draw down and ban SL Andor bond this debt so that there wouldn't be adjustment to the tax rate that's what I've been communicating really ridd will be that Mr Town Administrator please because I don't understand how that's ever going to happen no it would want some numbers no I want to know how we borrow $4 million so a band is interest only then how do we B once we end up borrowing because you can't just pay interest in for Infinity right we're doing that right now in the school room years right so your big deal so I'm paying interest for 10 years then I still got this whopping principle hello so let's not Kick the Can down the road why don't we just address the elephant in the room is how do we approach $4 million taking on $4 million worth of debt you either have to take it through the debt line on the operating budget or you do a debt exclusion the part that makes me nervous is we had Mr Kelly and I had um Town accountant and treasure collector runs some numbers various 20 year 30y year B into bonds no matter what $200,000 a year we walked in a town meeting last year with $980 in free cash the town doesn't have $200,000 a year guarantee that we can guarantee every single year so we really have to dive into this and look at it it's very hard to rely on free cash and hope there's an extra $200,000 so this would end up happen to be budgeted right off the rip if it's not a debt exclusion again that's for the respectively it's for the town to determine not myself I'm not going to tell the town where to spend the money yeah but like we we can't consciously move forward with an article for $4 million let's just call it $4 million I don't care if it's three whatever the number is going to come in at right we're not even prepared to talk to the people tonight on what this number is actually going to be right hard number exactly what's coming in and what we're paying for right so if you're going to do it via a debt exclusion which is a borrowing that's what you're asking us to do is borrow you keep saying no well if it was a debt exclusion one we would need to be on the ballot which we're not so you can't do anything until it's on the ballot and voted on the ballot can't be on a presidential ballot can't be on the presidential ballot so we're talking way out now so again we have time to discuss and figure out these things we're not asking to finance the debt September 30th when this is voted on and again this is I I chairman respectfully again we were in a meeting it was clearly stated that we can do this without that exclusion in that small conversation then you were left and then we read numbers and now I'm looking at the finances I didn't guarantee anything no I'm just saying what was communicating up until this point right now what I'm my response excuse me Mr my response was okay we'll have to look into it and I sat down with Jamie and that's all this information's transpired since I think what Mr Gasper is trying to say and it was very similar to what I said in our meeting mhm it is very hard to base things off of what could happen and I want to be very transparent to anybody here from the schools that I keep hearing that oh I thought we were aligned we are aligned in the fact that we need to do something about it it's the time frame that's not in alignment right now and it's very hard for us to present to the public that this is a necessity even though I think that there needs to be something done without that final report that is going to show up the day of town meeting that's the part that makes us nervous it's really hard for us to jump out there and tell the tax Bayers in this town how this is going to affect them if we don't even know yet M that's ultimately the it's it's a hard decision to make and it's not because we don't want to see something done and I need to stress that because I've been hearing that from different angles across the board all through town none of us on this board is against fixing problems what we already is presenting information that we don't have and I I just need to be absolutely clear about that point Mr chairman I appreciate that um you know laying out that process just to put things in perspective right a spending request of this magnitude the only parallels really is we had a a library that went to the that was roughly right in the same ballpark with a state match that got shot down by the voters we had a police station that got shot down by the voters and then we had a police station that was properly vetted and then did approve right right around that ballpark I think the police station was like 5 million so something any expenditure in the millions I think is going to require a great deal of vetting above and beyond just a stakeholder working group so a couple of comments if I can one again this is just opportunity we're not sealing any fate with this it's opportunity as you said the town towns members shut it down give them the opportunity two it's all about timeline you know to your point if these reports come back everything looks great you know it's less of a cost we we've received the incentives we've Acquired and been awarded these grants and now it's more affordable we have the opportunity to act if it's if it's garbage we don't get the grants the incentives are cut in half you know something else happens in town we can't afford it you have the power to proceed or not to proceed it's you know to draw a par line with all due respect Patrick you're putting a great deal of responsibility on us and this isn't fully baked right it it just just the Optics of it it's hey we've done our thing and blah we're asking you Board of selectman to use your credibility your political Capital with the residents to get behind something and I wish it was clear as clear-cut as explaining to people well you know what we don't have all the numbers here people going to say what the hell you doing Board of Select Y and so that's that's the issue so if the school committee wants to do all that leg work and and be the the the face of this and go out and get signatures and do all that stuff then knock yourself out but I think it's and I'm not Shing our responsibility because if all of these things were vetted we've always stepped up when we needed to be what I'm saying is wherever we are right now I don't feel like this is something that's ready for prime time at least with my signature on it um and that's a high standard I'm sorry that I've raised the bar but again it's process oriented and you know I I'm not going to speak for my my colleagues here but when I put my vote behind something it's because it's ready to roll I don't put stuff out there just to see where it lands to have I'm sorry no again I I can appreciate that we knew we were against a tight timeline you know we didn't want a September 30th town meeting we asked no November so we could have these reports and we could have more meetings and have more discussion I just I can't stress enough from my perspective not that it's a formality but it's a formality nothing changes with these articles being voted in and and if anything it gives us the opportunity that if we wanted toact sooner than later before these incentives disappear before we talked about the cost of everything continues to go up before this is kicked down the road and the cost doubles triples we don't know the future I'm not standing here because it's it's a want it's a need and I not I've put in a Year's worth of effort vetting this out going through all this effort not for fun because I'm trying to be fiscally responsible for the town people you know as well as the school so I'm afraid of the alternative is all of a sudden our Band-Aid fixes start failing we have humidity we have surface mold we're spending $300,000 plus again to clean which we again we can't afford and S funds are gone to do that and now you know everyone is kicking up a sick building again and we need a new school and now I'm standing here going well that's why I asked we have $100 million and what can msba do for us you know Patrick I think we vetted bunker replacement more than we've vetted this project at this level I respectfully disagree because we have an RFP out and it's vetted by the talking about this board and you're asking us to sign off on I'm talking about this board okay talking about this board so can I Mr chairman Mr G thank you Mr chairman I just I just I'm trying to get my arms around the debt right so we say no it doesn't need to and you've been told by certain individuals that we we're going to exorb this into the budget $200 $300,000 a year $4 million at 20-year borrowing roughly 3 3 and a. half% is $300,000 a year I can clearly sit here and tell you and everybody else at home and all the people in this room we do not have $300,000 a year to put into this debt which is a debt exclusion is the way it should be done which means higher taxes debt exclusion means higher taxes so you're asking us let me finish now because you've knocked down the debt thing so I'm just going to explain the debt thing so everybody at home can understand that I need somebody to stand up at that Podium and tell me how we're going to come up with $300,000 a year for 20 years right because we know a 30-year borrowing doesn't work because the damn system's not good for 30 years so why would I pay for something that's only going to last 15 or 20 years first and foremost so 20 years is the max cap that's why I went with 20 okay so that's roughly $300,000 a year I I don't know how we're coming up with $300,000 a year to pay for this we've been very creative on how we do things without that exclusions right I ran on a campaign quite honestly on it and how much we've done without de exclusions okay if you need I'll show you that Cod again but what I'm saying is is 300 Grand is a lot of money we just did a school roof and we didn't have to go for a debt exclusion for a rock share of like 1.2 1.3 million bucks right cuz we a solar Revenue fund right we've been very creative of how to do things without that exclusion when I sit and look at a $4 million number as creative as I can be with finances I have a tough time figuring out how we're going to pay for $300,000 a year for 20 years so the only way I think you can do it is a dead exclusion which would require a town meeting vote and then a town ballot vote right and I would say I would rather have the ballot question first before you do an article right so go to the ballot see if it passes if it fails you don't need UNT meaning article that's all I'm saying that's the only way you do Deb exclusion you can't have one when you out the other I don't know who's LED you down the path of believing that we can be authorized to borrow but then who told you so that's true we can with the board of Select responsible to borrow through the treasure right the problem is is where do the board of Selectmen now that this is going to be the board of selectman's problem is where do we come up with that financing that's that's what this article is basically asking the board of selectman to do is just figure it out so I'm just trying to figure out what everybody else is telling you so I'm getting I'm getting new information tonight as well so you just be honest and I want because you always are honest to me Patrick right but I get a little excited when people stand at that Podium and they start telling us that other people have told them that this is manageable I want to know who that is and I want to know what that plan was if if you were to say hey we've looked at our budget our operating budget and we scrubbed it and we think we can come up with $300,000 a year out of our operating budget for the next 20 years then maybe we have a conversation yeah I mean if it's self if you can if you can be self-sufficient in this process with your existing budget then you know maybe we can get this thing moving quicker than in anticipated yeah know many of these projects are built to be self-sufficient but because of the the magnitude of it and adding cooling we're going to have Energy savings but you know $4,000 a year in Energy savings isn't going to pay for any $300,000 like you said hey dude we're going to make no and then make budget cuts I understand I'm just saying performance this get rid of this get rid of that in performance Contracting these projects tend to pay for themselves with Energy savings over the years um the problem is is the town of the Kate doesn't have years and that's that's neither our SCH build correct correct you just said $44,000 in Energy savings so how do I come up with the other 296,000 well again that's I'm I'm I'm not shrugging my shoulders to say that's my decision I know you so you again Patrick you you're a great man you know what you're doing right and God bless you but I don't know who's telling you don't worry just do this article this way and let the board of Selectmen figure it out because here you are speaking to the board of Selectmen we we're all sitting there going I don't know I'm telling you maybe a percentage of that we could figure out right and we could help out with that yeah but for for us to guarantee the residents of the town of aush for 20 years we're never coming to you for this problem and my problem is is these folks in what I've read says phase one right so what is phase two phase three phase four what does that all calculate out to and now that's a major problem right all right so a couple of things there um The Phases that's the easy one it's whatever we choose it to be we could have Z no phases which could very well be the possibility after this meeting or we could have 2 3 4 five that's what they're going to report back to us in the investment great audit they're looking at generators boilers lighting water flow um building envelope which we're piling into phase one they're looking at solar on top of the roof which would pay for itself we're looking at all sorts of things so those would be future phases we've honed phase one down into controlling and improving the air quality environment in the Kush elementary school before things go AR r i I totally I totally get what we went through right and I wasn't part of it was a school right but I seen all those safety clean vehicles over there right I don't know what the final analysis of the scope of services whoever came in and said no it's not really mold it's surface whatever it is and everybody jumps out of their skin saying oh my God I'm getting sick right we have to do what we have to do you and the school committee and business administration acted on that but now now we're coming after that we're saying oh we're going to fix that problem by spending $ 4 million I don't not know if anybody's made that claim from those people right there that actually in the business are selling stuff said and this is what it's going to do and this is how we're going to we're going to guarantee to you you're not going to have that exposure to that whatever it is dust mold I don't know simply put I don't think an air conditioner can get rid of mold so again it combats the humidity that causes the mold humidity causes mold in tight confined spaces with dirt dust just I wanted to ask question what's the cooling season like seriously like what's the cooling SE season is there what's the data like okay when you have X amount of days above X deg that's so we get to control that we we can say we want the environment in our building to be 80° at the coolest and that system is not going to turn on until then we pick but that's just that's just a thermostat that's not make more but that but see you can't say that right that would be for these people if they have engineering degrees everything else to say the only way you're going to control humidity is if you're running the AC system at this degree it ain't just pick a random number you know hey 80 degrees is the number because quite honestly how many days out of the summer is that air condition actually going to C kick in if you put 80° right so that's that's just a magical number that somebody's pulling out of the Hat they should be able to tell you you need to run the system and this is the lowest you can put it at is 74° and based on that consumption based on this days this is what your eny points they're going to build that into the control system that's going to alert you all of a sudden something's exceeding the rate that we want to allow and you need to open or close a damper suck in more air exhaust more air that's all going to be engineered if you will well I'm by this is we're 20 days away from T media that's what aggravates me right is we're trying to vet this now this board it's the first time I'm seeing anything and seeing this kind of detail okay no disrespect to you but first time this board's ever vetted this stuff out 20 days before a town meeting and you expect the people at home to make an educated guess on whether they want to support a $4 million expenditure and us and again I'm going to go back to the article we don't we can't just borrow and say we don't know how we're going to pay for it and I don't want to mislead the public again timing is against us that that's really all I can say to that so let me ask you about timing if we were if we were to consider this moving forward and we talked about if it's going to be a debt exclusion if somebody else can magically tell me how we comeing up with $300,000 a year and I can magically come up with some money but it's not $300,000 a year okay for for a payment plan can we go to the ballot the last Tuesday I think the bylaw was changed the last Tuesday of April for a ballot question and then 30 days later you have a town meeting you're still locked and loaded before the end of the school year the problem is if we want to move forward we're looking at the summer of 2026 now we're hoping our Band-Aid fixes last that long without incurring absorbing the costs to school funds and town funds at that point so why why why that company's not going to unless even if this passes we haven't convinced anybody how this is going to be paid for so you're going to tell me that these Po Folks are going to keep moving forward just on us that's why I'm just saying best case scenario we have that opportunity if everything lined up and everything worked out we have the the ability to say go we we don't have that ability until if if we wait till the ballot if we wait for spring then at that point everything lines up and we vote it and it's all good now they're going to press okay we need to order this equipment now we need to wait for the supply chain we can't construct this project while students are in school Boom the two months of Summer pass school started now we're waiting till the next summer we and cost of inre so this is a problem for finan because we still haven't proved a financial plan on how to pay for this Patrick so even if this voted through it just says we have the ability to borrow but we're not going to go out and borrow be if if it's a dead exclusion that wipes that out it's going to go to a ballot question and if it fails you're screwed anyway quite honestly right I just would love to know that Finance plan as somebody threw it out to you and said we got this 4 million bucks covered because I know last year's deficit was a million dollars we have a a general a structural deficit and just the general budget itself and now we're sitting here saying don't worry about it we have room to exal $300,000 again the conversation's up until this point where you know we have the ability to ban and bonds because of our great rating at the town and there's debt coming off the books in future years right now you're carrying roughly $997,000 and it comes off in 81226 that's the debt school's responsible for right now and it's this part part of the problem right is every time we're going to get rid of debt and say you're going to Pro provide relief to the taxpayers bang we got another reason to go out and spend and put you in more debt and keep that debt on the taxpayers it's always sold to people that way right well when it comes off don't worry about it you're going to have your tax is going to go down the problem is we always have an excuse to keep going out for more debt and I'm not saying this is a leg I'm just explaining to everybody at home and whoever wants to listen that that's the process so your taxes are never going down even when we have all this debt right we have a police department we're funding right now responsible for a few hundred thousand bucks we're going to have an excuse then too to say nope we're not giving anybody back money on that dead even though the 20 years is gone we're going to find another reason to spend that money too I mean I'm just sitting here trying to say this is responsible to me to address future expens I I totally get it right I think I don't want to come sit here Ian I'm being fully honest I don't want to come up here and say we need $100 million for the school how's that going to be received $4 million looks like you be laughed at but we have aging buildings that were built in the 70s that have evidence of problems and issues that if we do not address them it is going to continue and it's going to cost more that's part of the other problem with the envelope right that should have been looked at years ago so whoever the facilities manager is and all these people that work for the for the maintenance department should have been looking at and addresses the envelope years ago right the mortar in the bricks right everything's cracking the SE bit we got water through a gymnasium wall I heard you referenc before what's being done about that found was reported in 2004 correct that's so now now it's our to continue to deal with yet no one wants to fund it or solve it so we're going to have water in our buildings and let kids go to school in that well I think all the other stuff that million bucks was sealing up the envelope and everything else it's just the 3 million bucks is add an air conditioned to the elementary school that's what I heard just the thing you have a school committee yes right yes it's it's incumbent upon the school committee to to solve these problems I don't know what Happ I mean I don't know me I'm not going to I'm not trying to cut him off Patrick you walked into a pile of mess I'm not going to lie okay I I know you haven't been here that long what are we talking two years just two years so keep in mind we are not blaming you no I'm not taking a person at all I need to be very clear about this this is not your responsibility to put out fires that you sat down in a little anecdote that I shared with you guys though right so we're we're trying to be as responsible as we can and not ask for Capital all the time right we've done a lot of projects glazing was supposed to be on the Spring Town article we didn't ask for it we we played a show game with funds to get it onto a grant to free up local to be able to afford it yes that's Town dollars but it's because we were strategic and what went to gr what was that Safety and Security measures that should talked about in the public space the reasoning the topic uh we have a cafeteria funds with a significant balance that we' we've purchased equipment to the tune of $150,000 to plug in this winter well as soon as we went to go order it get it in we had a site audit for that equipment can everything go nope your your electrical in infrastructure needs an upgrade your your plumbing infrastructure needs an upgrade we just dug up two pits the size of that table in both of our cafeteria floors to upgrade the floor drains by ourselves with mask we're doing the same with the electrical we're doing the same with the equipment these buildings are no longer plug and play any little thing that you want to do it's like trying to play a CD in an old car with a cassette play you just can't do it without an up update an upgrade and we're absorbing a lot of those without coming publicly and saying hey you know gold star for me Pat on my back because we're being fiscally responsible we're handling it because we know these projects are on the horizon and we commend you for that and I appreciate that and I said that to you the other day and I fully fully mean that the problem is is where do we come up with $4.2 million or less or $300,000 a year that's the real I I wish I I understand and I wish I had the answer I mean not my Lane but I'm maximizing the incentives we can get and the grants because I don't think you deserve it no I I understand I'm we're saying it's moving too fast and we have to figure out how to find it it's a big difference um I fear of the future what the cost will look like not never mind in November but you know December January February it means waiting six to 7 months to have a better plan and we have to spend a tiny bit more we lose a little bit but it's responsibly done that that's my issue I'm not saying this doesn't happen I want to know what that amount is though correct but what you say it's worth buying six months is it 10 grand is it 100 Grand is it a million dollars probably going to fa right now we can't find 300,000 so it's not really that much of a difference you know whether it's 10 grand 20 grand 3 million like we're all on board with fixing problems especially ones that affect the health and safety of our teachers our students our staff like we don't want to see any of these issues happen but we're being held to the F the fire right now if we don't do this like oh no to be fair I said no if you don't do it there's still opport or if you do there's opportunity still not do it and I want to just draw that line with the solar PPA agreement we thought we were going to have select in here voting the canopy and it went to town article and we got permission to enter into a contract and then those numbers became unfavorable and we said absolutely not this is fiscally responsible to sign that contract and we did not y s similar instance here Mr Kelly simply put Mr chairman and as you know if you asked some of the finance people a specific question they'll give you the specific answer simply put we have a great ability to borrow we don't have an ability to repay the money we borrow it's like having a credit limit of 50 Grand on your black card but you have no money to to to you know sounds good maybe we got to move town meeting and just you know I mean I don't know we're not having a town meeting I think we have all the business to conduct on Town me right so I don't know if that's a discussion that we're going to have is maybe to give this use some more time to to get this information out and let it be vetted a little more properly is maybe we go up to and then we continue town meeting to a date and time certain and that is a November date so that we have more right I think that would be a benefit I want to see the the 930 report before I even make any decision So What by you you understand what I'm trying to say to you because I don't want to so I'm trying to I'm trying to compromise right and I think that's really what you need to do because we need to understand first of all the debt better right and we need to understand that project better because that didn't work right so we need a better breakdown of where the costs are going to be it'll give them more time to figure that out right and come to us well to you and then you come to us and say okay it's not 4.2 it's you know 3.5 with this with all the other incentives and grants now we're down to 2.6 right and that brings down that debt number but I think the way I see this is the lack of better terms to use selectman us you're not ready for for game time right and I don't think this project is ready for game time but I I will say that if we did town meeting so we get all the prior year bills pass and everything else pass we go to town meeting September 30th we stop at a stop line and we make a motion to continue town meeting until the date and time certain which would be a November date once we figure that out whatever hell is going on with the primary you know the the presidential election to keep the town clerk head screwed on straight and navigate elections and everything else I know she usually needs a week 10 days to do all our certifying and everything else so we'll figure out what that date is and then maybe we come back and we have that you know we have the whole month of October for you to come back in and vet more with the board of Selectmen and expressing some concerns or maybe you come back and say you know what Project's junk um we don't even have to go back right I'm all for that November was what we were asking for maybe you know September 30th that this is just it it ain't going to work already and then we just motion to table the Articles and there's no continuance of town meeting right but I think that's to keep the option open for this year M for the school for the for the summer months right I think the only way to try to keep those articles alive is to do exactly what I just recommended right is go to town meeting and then we just continue to a date and time stream that we only take up a couple articles for the school that's fine it's basically a half an hour 45 minutes you're in it out so that's got to does that have to be a motion written in or I don't want to find out like in the spring all of a sudden two of my articles are missing because I didn't get a final copy we're not doing it in the spring I'm talking about in the fall last spring he's refering to the fact I'm saying two articles you're speaking publicly me to make a motion right now you're speaking to the board of selectman I can't make excuses for people that you've spoken with in the past cuz I wasn't part of the dialogue okay because if I was it probably wouldn't have happened okay so I'm going to leave it at that what I'm saying now is you are speaking directly to the board of selectman right we hear you loud and clear we heard the conversation loud and clear and all I'm trying to do is put a solution to the problem in front of everybody to say that might work and I think I'm asking you your opinion do you think that guaranteeing a November date for us to to continue with this I'm 100% for it uh Mr you can't guarantee a date because it's a town meeting that votes to continue to a date certain correct so we can pick a couple of handfuls of dates talk to Pam find dat I make a motion he makes a second so we'll we'll have the a lawyer and me talking I say make it safe like the first week of December after Thanksgiving somebody's going to make a motion to to continue to a date and time certain and certain and then all you do is get a second and then the moderator is going to say all those in favor of you know November 20th please raise your hand memb passes boom we're back on Sal floor November 20th find out but he asked for a guarantee from this board you can't give I don't know how that guarantee I the people decide to do is another story no right I didn't I don't understand if it was 2/3 Vote or what it meant that's that's what I was asking sure I mean I don't even know I think that's a good idea I think that's a great idea it'll alleviate a lot of our concerns my personal concerns from what I've heard only going to help my case we'll also have more information and and I think that's a big part of it and our job is to make the most educated decisions we can and present to Town the most responsible way to do things and I I think as that compromis Mr Mr gas brought up is a great idea and I would just suggest Mr Kelly speaks with the town clerk as soon as possible get a handful of dates she's watching yep either way speak with her follow up with her get a handful of dates and make sure we can do this AB go want you got a hand oh hi Sarah hi Sarah gome school committee hi Sarah I just wanted to just State a couple of things about this project that Patrick has been working on so diligently for the past year um I just want to make sure that I am on a clarified who we need to speak to regarding moving forward with this project is it Mr Kelly is it Mr Gaspar who is our direct point of contact everything goes to Mr Kelly put me on every email I told Patrick that the other day attach me to every email just in case if something gets in loued it's been busy month leading up to to meeting and every report just to state that every school committee meeting practically we have been discussing this project for a year and for you know selectman to say that maybe we you haven't heard anything about it or you haven't been seeing the details that's concerning to me as a school Committee Member so I just want to make sure moving forward that everybody is in the not and there's no surprises like there was right now to me that you hadn't heard details as a chairman noted right we we know there's been some a communication breakdown this going so as the chairman just noted um so well if if it needs to be if any communication comes to the board of selectman's office it should go directly to the Town Administrator and CC the chairman of the board of Selectmen and it'll be shared with you because and they'll make sure that it's Mr hinley as a chairman right now we'll make sure that the board of Selectmen are notified he can just simply print it out ask the Town Administrator to print it out and our administrative assistants will leave it on our desk for our review as well and I'm sure it's going to come up as a upcoming Board of Select agenda item and we can have you folks in to discuss that and keep and keep the process moving so that everybody in TV Land knows what the hell is going on cuz quite honestly not everybody watches selectman's meeting quite honestly not many people not a lot of people are watching school school committee meetings right absolutely I don't have time to sit around and watch channel 18 to be honest with you so there's a lot of people that are in that same boat right so between the two you would hope that did nobody really did can say well you know we didn't see it but at least the newspaper's covering things a select understood but again I just want to reiterate how important it is for our committee to be speaking with you and having you all in the know as we thought we were doing in the past which again did not happen so I appreciate I think there's various degrees of like getting things over the Finish Line right so you've got you know a behind the scenes stakeholder group that does the work but then once it's ready to be publicly faced I mean it's probably going to be one two three meetings before the board of Selectmen to finally get us to a point right so it's just like just think of that as I want something from the from the school committee Y no I I just want to set expectations and you set my expectations of what you expect for us to do moving forward and again C seeing Mr Hanley on the emails is fantastic and maybe we have maybe a weekly or bi-weekly meeting with whoever is needed about this project before the potential November meeting yep just to make sure we're all on oh we would definitely expect you folks to come back in once you get all your relevant information come back and that's that communication is going to happen with the chairman he'll put an agenda item on and say we're going to discuss this and maybe it's two or three times probi depending on what information we haven't got haven't have gotten Patrick will be the supplier of that information if we're we're happy after one meeting and we're ready to roll the board of selectman are comfortable with it we'll move forward right we we're cool with that but fair enough he's been in here three or four times over bunkers yeah right yeah and I would come here as many times as you need me to I just wasn't aware that the communication wasn't getting to the last Mr K I wasn't either I would uh like to as far as communication goes like to remind the board that you Mr chairman and I went to one or two meetings but the rest of the meetings of that steering committee were scheduled at the same time as Board of selectman meetings and so we were not able to attend but information was given to you huh the information was emailed to you information stopped canting emailed to me once again we're not going to go do okay I just want to make sure again let's set my expectations here since I'm part of the budget I'm the budget subcommittee member so I I really need to know I started reaching out to Patrick Patrick's been really really Paramount at supplying the information um but initial phases I'm talking make sure that we're not talking about what happened 6 months I spoke spoke with Patrick the other day and I've gotten more emails from Patrick in the last week than I've gotten probably since he's been in town which is a good thing I'm not saying that as a negative thing I'm saying it's great giving me the attachments I'm asking for all the information I forward it back to Sydney if I'm on the road and I have her forward it to the guy these guys so the communication's already at the point where I like it it needs to be appreciate fair enough all right well thank you for your time thank you thank you thank you CH thank you for your time I didn't get to say that Patrick take a nap I guess there a couple of ways to skin the cat right so we could probably just set two two fall to things right if we want to we we could just keep these off well yeah keep these off well actually no leave them on as they are no motion on them continue the town meeting to the date and time E I think so to you got vote to close and authorize the publication of the warrant subject to the change is that the board is TR is there a motion you want a motion to close the warrant close and publish and publish the town warrant subject to the changes subject to all the changes that we need to the number one article and I told you about the numbers and all that the changes and also add in the ambulance article y second all those in favor could I have a motion to go forward with the warant process just to make sure we cover every base including posting zero motion so many second all those in favor I gentlemen I want to jump a little make sure you want make sure the warrant's right before you post it right you want me to come in tomorrow gentlemen I'm going to uh hop out of order real quick out of respect for the people that have been sitting here for appointments um want to jump down to staff appointments uh first one maintenance Foreman Mr Matthew trip motion to appoint so move all those in favor second uh custodian Brady Baldwin motion to appoint second all those in favor I I and for the senior clerk for the assessors Department who have actually asked to be here uh Miss Renee langlo um Renee if you'd like to get up and just introduce yourself um we know we know Brady and we know Matt but hi Renee Lang um I'm joining the team and thank you very much for this opportunity you're welcome welcome AB boy is there a motion no point Miss Renee langlo is a senior clerk for the assess department so move second all those in favor I Mr Mr chair Mr the chairman hi Bob Brown I I just like to thank you guys for the the whole way we went through the process and hi Renee thank you for your help you're and your board's uh efforts to allow our you know senior staff to do the interviews and get who we think's uh best for this job so I appreciate the way we handled everything and want to thank you in your board you're very welcome thank you thank you thank you Mr chairman you're welcome I was talking to that chairman 6:30 uh slum Street update all right the shair yeah you want yeah all right I got to find the right tab here where we go I thought I I have jumped forward so I'm going back to Old business number [Music] three Street update Mr chairman yes uh there is do there are documents instead of the uh contract documents for the board sign that are on a conference room table because they're voluminous and then there's this notice to proceed for the project this is the next step after this we are uh meeting hopefully uh next week with the engineer and uh a land owner to talk about a e other than that uh it's all up to uh this board to sign these documents Mr Alan bisco of bisco Contracting has already signed the documents and then I have to attest to them as procurement officer and we're ready to go good excellent so you just need a motion to proceed for the base work only that's all you need right yep we'll make a motion to proceed for the base work only second all those in favor all all all right September 23rd what's that that's the same notice to proceed for the base work I like it uh yeah the contractors should be coming in Jamie as well right yeah well after after that meeting yeah we're going to have meeting after meeting a preliminary hearing me and you allows to to filling out the schedule right well yeah but they wanted to see if we could do take care of the uh a Butter's meeting with us so we could meet with the contractor once about and be able to discuss the two options okay did you get that in your book just so you know and uh the engineer is back in country he successfully made it through customs all right we're going to jump over to DPW road paving quick passing over for a minute um [Music] temporarily all right road paving DPW uh Mr Gasper I believe you g me stuff to read now I got to so few things have come up we put out Helen Joseph and Earl to bid we put out n Lane Randall and Kendrick out to bid as well um we got the bids in um the unfortunate part on Helen Joseph and Earl can't be um mil and needs to be reclaimed um so after that inspection um we we're getting some prices for Reclamation it should it it will definitely come in a bit under Milling so I would just like to award the winning bids for Road pavement on Joseph heling and Earl hot mix awarded to Pucket hot mix for winning the bid of $118.6 per ton no Co plane and then award the bids for NIS Lane Randall and Kendrick yeah hot mix awarded to pck at hot mix for winning the bid of $18.60 a ton and C plane awarded to PJ keing for winning the bid of $3.80 per square yard for coal planning ever Source will be the funding for for part of these um projects as replac of the gas lines on the streets the additional funding not paid by urce will be funded by the first share would be the fair share funding from the state the second would be amounts not covered by either urce or fair share fun funding will be paid by road paving line item within the DPW budget after looking at where the bid specs came in gentlemen I've reviewed that with DPW staff and we talked yesterday with um Anthony from EV source to let him know that he shot funded his 50% of the project so I'm asking them to go back um and try to get a reallocation from ever source and the sh funding is roughly $53,000 so he's going back to his company to see if of what he can do about that making up that 50% sounds good so I'll make that motion second all those in favor oh yeah um Dana if you don't mind I got a question can I have those papers back yes sure I had a question about the appointee for here yes is this a straight replacement yes uh we had a a college student that was working in the Pro Shop with us uh she has gone since going back to college and that is a local college student I would like to have appointed to replace those hours in the Pro Shop answering phones uh booking tea times doing transactions and then supplement um some of that uh parttime work with doing the beverage card as well so this is just for the remainder of the seat yes this well it could be I mean I want to keep her on so that maybe next season we split hours and Riley Works a few days she works a few days and we have because it's been a um a question with a a concern of with the golf Committee of having Pro Shop staff answering phones booking tea times doing transactions we've had that discussion uh several times so this is a basically a replacement for the current person that has gone back to college basically but to give that Pro Shop Staffing concern this this not the position that we would discuss no but it's not the person it's not someone who's going to work through the win no no no no it's pot pot time it's it's basically a beverage cot girl that on she's going to do Pro Shop I was answering phones and doing transactions and basically what Ry and if you need her to be a beverage C person on an outing or something like that you'll ship them outo and fill up the cotton yep try to increase sales for food and beverage right absolutely yeah that's not a full-time spot that's not a secretarial spot it's basically a Hands-On Clerk and filling gaps for opportunities for additional revenues at different points as you know we operate with a lot of potas And when everybody goes back to school everybody goes back to school so it's back to the he just he just whipped that little letter at me you seen it two minutes ago right but I didn't have that in my book so I don't know who these people are I don't know what kind of background people have and I'm just flying by the seat of my pants going yeah Mo to a point well she inquired earlier in the spring but I had um I had Riley working sted yeah I was fully staffed I had hours and then Ry went back to school so I started emailing her seeing cuz like she's going to go to UMass dth I said are you still available and are you interested still she said very much so I'm like all right so she's contact me several times I'm like it's in it's going through the process I'll get back to you as soon as I get back from the select so you fine one I'm fine Z motion Point Pon second the motion oh I'm sorry so moved second all those in favor see what happens when a meeting goes too long all those in favor Mr chairman yes Mr can I can I ask a question yes so we appointed Matt trip as a maintenance for for the for Town buildings yep effective what day it's effective tomorrow all righty [Music] then clean pants I will all right uh selectman's announcements just want to make sure I just say this we're all at Apple Peach this weekend um great job I think this is probably I don't know if it was the weather but it was the best parade the vibe was there everybody's in a great mood I was there both days and um it was just really great great for the town to officially usher in the fall season and uh you know nothing we' better get people out on the golf course to experience the foliage and the green grass over there too so spend some time in cush agree yeah I just uh you know Kudos I Matt Andrew Chopper Tuesday night last week prior to the Apple Peach parade right it was unfortunate I wasn't able to attend I had family matters I had to deal with on Sunday morning but I spoke with Andrew Chopper great young man um and from what I understand I've talked to a lot of people that were watching the pray I are in in the parade and again I know Mr inkley you spoke very favorable of Andrew lashier for the job that he did with that parade so I just want to commend Andrew for the great job with the parade because I've heard a lot of good things and I was um fortunate enough to meet up with him and have a discussion good guy um did a killer job again this year Andrew so keep up the great work um congratulations to everybody at the so this year the feast was live streamed Paul Santos did it maybe next year we can live stream the Apple Peach Festival on Facebook live or something you know we'll figure that out I have to wear a hat and sunglasses next year then can I do a select's announcement sure so I just want to thank everybody um that attended the cruise night two Thursdays ago um was an incredible night as well um thank you to Matt Lopes for helping me um get that thing and he's out there coordinating the efforts um most importantly I want to thank Fire EMS and EMA for volunteering Fire EMS for their incredible work out there plus their the cooking of the burgers Lisa hot dog so congratulations to our Fire EMS Association a volunteers can't thank you enough for all what all you folks do for the town of a kushit kushit Police Association as well thank you very much to the kushit police department for being out here on details and everybody who attended it was a great time it was a packed show um we had a 120 or so cars that were there that night it seemed like we had 300 for CR all out it was Mr Hinkley help me P some cars with Mr Paul Mark Francois from the planning board so thank you Mr inkley for your help and M Fran the chairman planning board it was just an incredible time um black Thai cookies cushion at creamy Matt Los for doing clam cakes and Fries every all the little vendors um the DJ I forgot who he was but anyways I'll get back to you on that but congratulations it was just a hell of a bang up time and everybody enjoyed themselves and it was extremely peaceful so thank you to everybody that participated in that as well we we've come a long way yep it was a great time and I am good I think I I'll just agree with both of you tonight uh Next Step executive sessions we got a couple of them executive session under Mass General Law chapter 38 subsection 21 A1 to discuss the reputation character physical condition or mental health rather than professional competence of an individual discuss discipline or dismissal of or complaints or charges against a public officer employee staff member or individual Personnel DPW if the chair declares that an open meeting will may have a detrimental effect on the governing body and the board will not return to public session at the conclusion of the executive session executive session under Mass General Law chapter 30A subsection 21 A3 to discuss strategy with respect to collective bargaining Personnel golf if the chair declares that an open meeting may have a detrimental effect on the bargaining position of the governmental body and the board will not return to public session at the conclusion of the executive session an executive session under master General Law chapter 30A subsection 21 A3 to discuss strategy with respect to collective bargaining DPW Union Local 1249 if the chair declares that an open meeting may have a detrimental effect on the bargaining position of the governmental body and the board will not return the public session at the conclusion of the executive session is there a motion to go into executive sessions so move second all those in favor roll call vote Mr Warner yes Mr Gasper yes n May yes we are in executive session [Music]