okay we're recording now okay I guess I should just start then um pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021 and renewed by Governor MOA hey this meeting of the Board of Health will be conducted via remote means members of the public who wish to access the meeting May do so by following the instructions on the board of health posted agenda via Zoom no in-person attendance of members of the public will be permitted but every effort will be made to ensure that the public can adequately access proceedings as soon as it is technologically possible after this meeting all approved Board of Health minutes are posted on our website once they are approved by the board I will now open the May 9th meeting of the Board of Health at 5:03 p.m. so I guess we're mostly here that's good um so I guess I need to take attendance right um Risha here Lauren here great uh Moren here and we know Tim is away and we're waiting um Prema do you want to text her just to be sure P um I just sent her an email I don't know that I have her well I guess I can text her I have her cell phone number I can try that I've never reached her that way before but yeah I don't know uh I know she does so okay I'll I'll do that okay um so our first task is to review and receive minutes um we have outstanding minutes from March but I don't think we have a quorum to vote on those minutes uh because the only attendees in that meeting where Tim Misha and I and Tim is away so I think we have to put that on hold unless you learn something different Kiko I did learn something different um I checked in with um Angela Mills the assistant uh you know to the town manager today and she said that even though people weren't at the meeting if they they were able to review the minutes look over them and see that they are reasonable um sort of summary of a discussion that would have happened in response to the agenda items that were scheduled for that meeting that they can approve the content even though they weren't at the meeting themselves okay and that it does need to be done in the context of a meeting and not over email which was the question I posed to you earlier today so so that can be done without a quum of folks who were in attendance okay so um I looked at those minutes and I didn't find any concerns does uh Risha did you have any any corrections or concerns on on that I did not let me just double check it's been a little while I didn't write any notes okay um Lauren I don't know if did you have a chance to look at the March um minutes uh no I didn't review the minutes I know I was there for um part of the meeting but um I'm sure the minutes are okay but I I didn't review them sorry feel comfortable voting to accept or sure sure um can I have a motion to accept the minutes of the March 14th meeting of the Board of Health I I will motion to accept I'll second that um Risha um what's the prop I think yes yes um Lauren yes Moren yes so the March minutes are are accepted and next we have the April minutes um that we need to review and I wasn't at that meeting I did watch it on uh YouTube and I didn't have any concerns about the minutes anyone else have any corrections or um oh can I just make a correction or a question at the last that April was the last meeting that I was at but I didn't I was I didn't stay for the whole meeting was I in attendance at the March meeting I don't it says no I think you weren't feeling well okay okay um if I remember well anyway well I voted yes already so I guess that's fine okay so now we're at April where there was um people who attended parts of the meeting but if we've had a chance to go over that and I wasn't there like I said but I did review the um the video and I reviewed the minutes and I feel like they are reflecting the meeting so so um I guess we need a motion to approve the April 11th 2024 minutes I can also motion to accept those okay and a second yes second okay and um the vote is Risha yes Lauren yes Moren yes all right so the minute of April 11 2024 are accepted all right um and now the question comes of public comment uh if there are any members of the public in attendance do you see anyone Kyle we have Maria but I think she's going to come in for the tobacco in a minute or so but I don't see anyone um that are that wants to make public comment Maria uh she's going to talk help us talk through the um I think the hemp the later in the meeting she's gonna come in later in the meeting as a panelist no that would be joined us yet yeah so Maria is a Community member and um Maria if you can hear this if you do want to make public comment at this point please do raise your hand so we can promote you to panelist I'm not seeing anything so I think she's just here to listen Okay um I had a public comment um well I wanted to make a uh announcement during public comment if that's okay I shared it with um Kiko about the safe frots to school um the the planning committee um so Lauren I sorry just sorry to interrupt you for a sec okay um I emailed you back but it was later the day um okay I I thought that it would be really good for you to make this public comment at Town council meeting has that happened yet um no but this this was um I don't see the reason why it wouldn't be made at this meeting where I'm a member of yeah I mean public comment is the time for people who aren't members of the board to make comments um so if you want to make this as a public comment so that it's enshrined as a comment from a member of the community than it would be at the Town council meeting where you're not a member it would be a great place to make the comment otherwise it could be sort of part of something we talk about under the director's update but technically since you're a board member then you're not a member of the public because you're part of the board does that make sense yes but I'm saying during public the public comment period if there's no public comment is it okay if I just make a a quick statement about the safe roots to school it's just going to take 30 seconds um so I guess Moren you're the chair of this meeting I'm just relaying what I know about protocol but I'll leave it to you to to make we want we can bring it up in within the director's update in in terms of okay okay okay just don't we won't forget I think the only problem with that if I remember correctly is you you have to get off early is that right Lauren yeah so can I just say it now then let's do it now then let's do it now as an early version of this is not a public comment okay it'll be quick they they sent me um some talking points but I can't open um my email at the same time but it was the um the safe roots to school they had about 130 participants from all the elementary schools um Fort River Crocker farm and wildwood uh 50 from Fort River Crocker Farm had about 50 um families and and Riders and Walkers and and um Wildwood had 30 and so they just wanted to um share that with the the board and with the public health department nice that's great thank you sounds like it was a great event when did they do this do you remember it was May 1 okay May 1 nice way to start the month I think that was a really nice day does does the Board of Health get to like push for sidewalks or uh to make biking easier is that a thing within our remit it's a part of a healthy Community to have accessible walking and bicycling paths um okay noted um all right so we're at Old business and that old business continues to be tobacco regulations um uh and we making progress but there's a lot to it um and I think what we the piece we decided to tackle this time has been just kind of the the violation it's how we how we um structure the violations both fines and suspension of sales um they basically there are two different structures that two different possibilities one is to do what's called the unified um structure for for violations and and just follow the pattern that the state set out for the violations of the state laws um and those those uh are fines for the first violation of $1,000 for the second of $5,000 uh $3,000 and for the third oops no that's wrong for the first it's $1,000 for the second it's $2,000 and for the third it's $5,000 and then for suspension it's zero for the first violation unless it sails to a minor and then for the second it's I seven consecutive business days and for the third it's 30 consecutive business days and some of those might be up to and those might be the max maximums um if I'll just jump in I think yeah if we decide to do it in this way that we align with the state we have to choose whether it's up to or a specific a certain date but yeah so those for the the state it has up to but we probably want to just have a a date a number in mind um right so it's for the first violation of I think they say 1 to 30 business days I think for their um sales to a minor for the second violation it's up to 7 and for the third violations it's up up to 30 7 from 7 to 30 between 7 and 30 and so that's I I I listened to the last meeting and it seemed like people felt that the violation fin seemed low for for at the 100 200 500 100 300 500 whatever it is but starting at $100 and capped at about $500 um our current ones are 100 200 300 300 yeah yeah here they are so um yeah I mean so I think we're really asking Lauren because yeah I know because we've kind of talked about this Lauren um and we'd love to hear Lauren if you have any thoughts on whether it makes sense to just keep our penalties the same as the states and so no matter what you've violated whether it's a state or a local ordinance that you would have the same sort of fine and suspension structure or if there should be separate ones for the ones that we have implemented locally um I'm looking for Myer I'm look for my paperwork um I cannot answer um right now without of me to go off of um yeah I mean I'm happy to try to explain it verbally I don't there's not actually that much text that you would need to read the it's really right now we have a completely different structure for anything that's a local violation and so we have a different much lower fines and then um lower suspension days um and so one option is to just align the two the other is to keep them separate and then we have to come up with what our uh fines suspensions are for local violations and just to give you a list the local violations are um exceeding the number of permits allowed in ammer the prohibition of smoke smoking bars the minimum pricing on sales of cigars the prohibition of sale of blunt wraps the prohibition of the sale of tobacco products and educational institutions vending machines sale within Health Care institutions self-service displays and then other and actually I think the Su are similar they're not really different does the state have any regulations around those things self-service displays vending machines the one thing they do have is the state the state does have uh violation for self-service displays at the regular retail outlets but that's uh waved for uh adult only so if we decided to have um no self-service displays it it means it would apply to to all all all sellers of tobacco including the adult only doops um yeah I think I think what we talked about last time was whether it's kind of an interesting collection of local violations some of which align with the idea of a fine and some of which do not like the limited number of permits is not something that would be a fining issue because the town decides how to issue those permits so that maybe there would need to be some change in the language so that those kinds of things which are important for the town like limiting the number of permits um wouldn't really be wouldn't have an Associated fine with it so we'd have a collection of things I think we needed to decide you all needed to decide what are the things that we still want to say are in the local violations list and then how do we want to penalize them is it according to the state structure or is it according to a different local structure I felt like that was the only one that doesn't seem to fit into this and it's kind of included it's been included in these fine structures forever um it won't happen um but um I think the other one is the smoking bars because you couldn't open a smoking bar without going through some kind of a permitting process with the town well so you wouldn't ever be fined for having a smoking bar well do you have to go through it with the town or what if you just it's the same permit isn't it it's you just have a permit to sell but then you have a smoking bar I mean I guess they sell a little bit of food right and a little but not sort of all incidental things is that require that require a permit for the town for something else um so I'm not the expert here but I'm pretty sure that any kind of business yeah you're opening a new business you need to get permitted with the town is there I mean I don't see it in the state but I mean what is the penalty for doing something without a permit I guess there's a sales without a local permit for smoking bars and Retail tobacco stores only is in the state so that feels like it covers ours um we're just saying you can't have we won't permit You for Smoking bars so not allowing them but somebody like make one in the back room of their shop or something you know I I guess I I see it as impossible too but then I kind of wonder if if it could sneak in somewhere with a creative creative yeah I see it I mean as a harm of keeping it um the the ma number of permits is is not the fault of the person getting if we issued more than than we were supposed to right like that's right that that is a non- penalty to the person who received it right so that one seems different but the rest are things that you would penalize now if we want to penalize them at the same level or different than the state that's the next question or do we want to penalize them at the same level across the board as the other questions you get the same penalty for opening a clandestine smoking bar in the back room of your restaurant as for selling a cigar at the wrong price same penalty I think you know marine and I talked a bit about this the state has the same problem right they have a bunch here that are you didn't put a sign up in the right place and then also you sold without a permit right and those are the exact same level of fines and the exact same suspension rules so my sense it's because we're already working within something that is uh a little skewed it it doesn't it doesn't help to try to make our part you know super Equitable and and just like the I I I feel like if if the other one was more sort of logical in that way then I would say we should keep ours but um yeah but trying to make decisions based on what the perceived um harms are hasn't been probably why they didn't do it either right no it's it's it's a perfect perspective what you're saying Risha makes makes a lot of sense yeah so I'm probably overthinking it and my I'll just give my pers perspective is that um some of our local things are much worse than some of the state ones and some of them are not as bad and there's a huge Variety in both sides so on both lists there's a huge you know from a very minor thing that probably is not um having a huge health risk it's more procedural to a thing that is a clear you know violation um you know selling to someone who shouldn't have it or letting people into the shop that shouldn't be there um and so my I I fail to find a logic that allows me to say that should be lower or higher than the state which leads me to well then let's just have them all be the same because I don't I don't have a logic that tells me what else to do and so that's where I sort of land is if we keep the same for all of them that probably just is easy you know everyone what's going to happen no matter what they do and I think the enforcement seems to be how should I say a little flexible if someone goes in it sounds to me like if someone goes into a shop the inspector and they notice that the sign is missing they'll provide them with the sign or if it's in the wrong place they'll tell them where to put it um or if their prices on the cigars is is too low they'll tell them they need to make make it higher and kind of correct it in the moment and not find it um I suppose if someone kept doing that over and over then that would that would be different but if it's a if it's just oh yeah we move things around and now this sign is over here and not over there where it should be or um so I think there's some consideration in enforcement that reflects the severity of the yeah the infractions but right no you summarized that perfectly Moren yes and I I did confirm that with Meredith that when their tobacco compliance officers go out to do these educational sessions the majority of the violations about signage and whatnot are corrected onsite in the moment and so there isn't the feeling that you would then be levying a thousand fine because you fix it right there and then and if it but if it becomes a historic persistent or egregious kind of violation then the board of Health might want to consider finding that establishment so you're right about the flexibility with the enforcement I would also assume if if the person who's selling a cigar for you know 20 cents less than it should be sold is like oh apologies let me change that right now then there's not a a penalty if they were like no I insist that this is what I'm selling it for then you've given the person the option to penalize um andh Lauren how are you doing I'm here can you hear me yes yeah okay yeah um It's Kind like I said it's kind of hard to follow without something front of me but I do remember from um the last meeting that um Kiko mentioned when I guess some inspectors had out was like violation so if we don't have like the proper uh response to when there are infractions I just feel like um that is something that we need to take into account if we're asking people to pay for fines or we're trying to you know s would be a level of finds that would be appropriate if there's no you know one to um enfor whatever the to um what um we are retailers to like Lauren you're understand oh I'm sorry um I'm not holding the phone too close to my mouth um I I think I'm still trying to figure out what we what's the intention and what is you know what are we trying to enforce and if we don't have the proper um vehicles to um let retailers know what our expectations are and to follow up with that then whatever whatever penalties that we do put um in our regulations are in in the town's regulations it it kind of to me doesn't doesn't mean much if we don't have a way to enforce it and and it's not clear as to what we're actually expecting the retailers to do so I'm sorry if that is kind of vague but it's kind of like still don't really know what the intention is of of you know our our questioning you know our comparing the our our regulations to the state because I don't think we've clarified what Our intention would be and and what we need to do um yeah I think that's an interesting question I I think on this one unlike so we had talked about you know the the tobacco quiz and those things that are tough to send inspectors and oversee and that it didn't really feel like it was something that anyone was checking um and we didn't have the resources to do so the rest of the the violations there are people who go out is it twice a year Kiko uh um that go out and they take our they take the states which they know because that's for all of their um inspections in various towns and then they take our towns and so they are checking all of these things and have a way to enforce um and the question so that doesn't seem to be a problem on these sets of things we have not added any new violations to what used to be there uh the list I read off for local are the ones that were there previously and so I think what we're trying to determine is if if the states violations are 1,000 2,000 3,000 and ours are 100 200 300 those are quite different and is there a um is there a reason that they're that different I will just say I looked at neighboring municipalities to see what they were all doing um and and several of them were just they didn't make any differentiation if it was a local violation or a state violation you got the same fines you got the same suspensions uh a subset then did have a differentiation and the ones that had not been reviewed in the past like two years said 10000 300 like ours uh the ones that had been reviewed more recently had higher I I want to say like $500 kind of levels um and so I think there's a movement Statewide to sort of move towards um an alignment between the state fines and the local fines is is what I sort of I'm reading by looking at the neighboring municipalities does that does that help your question of intent I guess um but when you increase the finds um and um yeah I I I would have to be reminded what the the the fines are for you said signage and some other stuff and not selling the state ones are different signs you know selling without a permit um sorry I have to re tobacco products that's a big one that's a major one flavored tobacco products products um only low lower five micrograms per per uh Vape at at retail tobacco stores um there's there are a lot of different it's a it's a basket of different um things of different significance from signage to actually what they're selling and who they're selling to and especially to people under the age of one that's sort of the main one of the major uh pushes of all of this of all of these regulations I think that's probably the most important of them and also the flavored tobacco because that is easier to get used to and for smokers who are starting to smoke and vape are more appealing if they're flavor so um yeah those are the state ones and then the local ones are similarly all over the place but there's you've opened the wrong kind of institution that you shouldn't have had there's the the vending machines the roll your own machines blunt wraps uh and then a minimum pricing on cigars yeah and like no coupons or discounts for cigarettes or that's on the state side yeah yeah that's the state side right I got my list mixed up um and and I guess we restrict selling tobacco in in healthcare institutions and in educational institutions [Music] um well um I I guess the the bottom line for me um is would the regulations be more protective of the public or are they you know being more lenient to the retailers and I think you know fines uh should um be preventative and and I I think I had asked before like where do the fines go like what where does that money go toward um so I those are just my remaining thoughts and questions I I don't have a specific answer um so Lauren thanks for reminding me about that I did ask about I did ask that question about what happens with those fines and they just go into the general coffers so they don't come to the health department any fines that are levied or any like permit fees that are levied by the town they go into the General Pool and so they're used to kind of balance the budget for the town in general so they don't come back to pay for public health related programs that's not how it works just so you know and I think do you when you say General do you mean like the capital budget or just the general budget for the town the sort of yeah not the not not DED not dedicated to a specific thing just general budget and then when we when the finance folks do the budgeting they're able to see how much money is in this fund and apply it to certain things that might be needed so it just doesn't come back to Public Health like in some in some there are some revenue streams that are dedicated for certain not here in the town but just generally speaking there are sometimes dedicated revenue streams that go towards Public Health activities but that's not the case with these sorts of fines right I could understand that but I know that as well the uh public health department has a minimal budget so again like What If Money it depends on what money is being used for and and what what is the message with the with the fine is is it is it to deter is it to prevent or is it just to remind you know I I'm sorry I'm speaking kind of generally but I I don't have all the details in my head or in front of me so that's that's kind of just how I'm just with what I I would think both the fines and the suspensions which might be even more costly in some ways than the fines themselves um are to deterrence you know how how you know I don't know if we have a measure of efficacy and how you know relative to the the the amount of the fine or the length of suspension but you know I'm sure businesses don't want to lose money and and that's uh thought to be a deterrent um and and a motivation to kind of follow the follow the rules um yeah and and and just to summarize um about I think Lauren had asked this question of why we're doing this and I think that you summarized it Rea which is that it's important to revisit these regulations every so often there's a movement to kind of align local find with State finds you know there's inflation so you might want to look to see whether your fees are still relevant these are all the reasons that we're looking at these tobacco regulations which are in place to provide some you know guidance and constraint uh or some you know monitoring of tobacco sales to limit it getting into the hands of miners in particular but also just to make sure that there are these structures in place that um you know regulate how tobacco is sold in our community so these regulations are in place we're updating them cu things change the landscape changes that's why we're doing it and then yes the fee structure does exist as a disincentive or as a way to kind of keep people to follow the rules and I underscore I mean I definitely think you're right Moren that in my experience of having had to find one tobacco retailer for underage sales um it would the the license suspension was a much bigger deterrent than a $1,000 line that that was what they were most upset about or concerned about so is an effective you know deterrent and helps to keep people remind them of why it's important to follow these regulations and I I think the the question of whether what are the fines supposed to do is is an important one to consider as we're setting them and I I guess as I think about that $100 does does feel like much of a deterrent anymore in this economy um and and so that yeah that somehow feels like it doesn't it might not do the trick it might not do the deterrent that we're trying to set it out to do yeah in a sense from watching the last meeting that that was Tim sense too that that that was too low too low you know that then then that there seemed almost to be a consensus about the fines being quite low compared in today's economy um my recollection is the fines were all that level you know back in 2017 or 18 or whatever when we when 2019 when the state uh revamped their rules and those fines seemed very high at the time with thousand uh starting at $1,000 but now it doesn't quite seem as as crazy um as it did then so we aren't trying to establish a vote on anything here or you know the the the way that we're moving through these tobacco regulations is to get a sense of where people are um and then we will put it all together in that way and then send it to everyone for review and vote um and so Lauren do you have are you leaning one way or the other in terms of the fine structure or keeping it different or keep doing it the same as the state um I think our local find sound kind of low so um I would be more to increase the fines and um yeah I think um this is including the the cigar pricing as well f for yeah not EX under cutting the minimum price of a cigar yeah um yeah I I just I think I would be for increasing as much as possible okay yeah we also don't have two people here so we're not making any decisions it's just a like where do we want to head with this and we'll put something out and then people can look at it as a whole and say yes or no the um the other question I guess that seems straightforward that we might want to just talk about what we have a few minutes before our next topic is whether we want to allow um selfservice um counters at adult only tobacco sales outlets and self-service means you can walk up like you're buying a candy bar and pick it up and take it to the to the cashier and pay for it as opposed to things being behind the counter um so I I and I you know understand that pretty clearly in the uh all ages you know non-age restricted retail outlets because you don't want them where they are easily accessed um in the adult only stores the you have to be 21 to get in and uh is there a reason to ban you know to say we don't allow that kind of sale I don't know I think the current store is so small that they probably don't have room for much uh much else but clearly other there there may be other other adult only retail retailers that would be have a different uh I I guess I don't feel like it would offer much public health benefit I mean you're you're in a store that is meant pretty exclusively for tobacco sales it it it I guess not having a self-service is a step towards not having someone you know Rob the store and run off they may not want that in themselves right that's something that they shouldn't have but they shouldn't have been allowed in anyway once they're in I'm not sure we're adding much protection to anyone so I yeah it doesn't feel that important to me as a a measure to protect right I I I started thinking about that way too when I realized there was already a state regulation for the non-ag restricted Outlets um and I you know I think it keeps helps to keep cigarettes and other tobacco products out of the hands of Youth who but I think I think the stores themselves probably would want them behind the counter too because they're expensive and and easy to pocket um so um but in inside of a an adult only store they they could decide what make sense for their particular um retail outlet to me I don't know if that's any thought if you have any thoughts about that idea Lauren I think re and I have immersed ourselves in these regulations lately and so it it's a little easier to think about them because we've been going through them regularly um but I didn't know if you had any concerns or thoughts about that well I I guess I just have a question when you said a vending machine but they but they can easily take it themselves can you hear me I'm sorry no it's self serve we didn't Self Serve self not vending okay okay like out on it be just like out on the shelves I think as opposed to behind the counter I think that's what that means okay it's yeah that it that they would have you it would be like like buying other things in a store where you pick it up in the aisle and take it to the cashier and clearly we don't want those and the state doesn't want those in the you know General um convenience stores but does that make a difference in an adult only retail outlet you know where you have to be over 21 to get in and they don't really sell anything but um tobacco products but I'm sorry I'm gonna sound ignorant go for it but where where where do they only sell tobaco products well there's only one store that's like that in this town right now and it's I forget what it's the name the name is it's called lazy lungs in that alley behind the CVS CVS that alley okay and it but Kiko hasn't and it's quite small so but there was a place it was an adult only store that gave up that tobacco license and that was one down on route nine is it um it's it's called wild side it's on um gosh I'm forgetting the street it's where there are several liquor stores on that Street actually um just sou a couple blocks south of where we are right now I can't remember nine out extension kind of yeah like you're right yeah yeah goes towards past dammer college and right down the flat part before you get to Southeast Street and while we're we're Fort River and yeah everything but but they don't have a tobacco license so they're not selling but it used to be a a larger store that sold tobacco and other paraphernalia right now they just do the other stuff so so yeah there's currently just in this in town and I already forgot the question are we are we are we saying that I'm sorry are we saying that we could not allow them to have these single served tobacco products or we would say they be behind the counter even though we we're saying that we we can have a regulation that says they should be behind the counter or they will be behind the counter and and I think we already did in the past and the question is do we want to keep it the state has one that it can't be for an all ages place anywhere but behind the counter but we had viously also in adult stores and I think some of us have thought about it we're wondering if that's a value ad or just getting a little bit to nitpicky with how they're business well seeing that there's only one um I I I don't uh I I don't know I don't know um that's that's where we have to think of like what would the trend be what would what would the trend be would there be more um stores like that or that would come into the town I'm sorry for the noise um and I don't think we should be relying on the retailers to necessarily make the decision for us so I I think we should make the decision and not the retailer so you keep keep this this the uh no sell service like we have already for everybody is your thought I would say yes okay yeah well as you said we only have three people here so um so we have a couple different opinions on this one but but yeah and we need to yeah and just so you all know just so I've been into so the way lazy lungs is set up because there won't be another one right we're not going to open new tobacco stores to to Lawrence right unless somebody else switches over to true but it's not like a new retailer can come into town um because the tobacco permits are limited so um and we don't do new ones but anyway when you walk into lazy lungs it has this side is the all ages side and then this side is the adult side and it's very small it actually does not have much product in it and all the tobacco is behind is in a glass case you know but when you walk in so it's not freely accessible and they don't sell tobacco in the other side right they tell um that's right yes so yeah um yeah it's possible that another retailer or somebody buys one and decides to make it into a adult only tobacco outlet but it most of the others are convenience stores or liquor stores so it seems unlikely that that's the boot that that would take without a new owner or a totally new yeah I mean I think rea put it really well is like there's questionable public health benefit to this particular piece like I it's just seems like not not the thing to get put a lot of energy into because of all the things that are out there is this probably going to have the least public health benefit or less public health benefit than some other things so all right um I guess that wraps up what we can talk about today um can we outline Moren can you outline what's still remaining to decide just so we can sort of think about the process and how much longer this is going to take um yeah go ahead I I'm trying to remember now we decided not to talk about it that I forgot about it um I think I can remember the couple of yeah oh yeah we want to talk about um I thought we did we decided we didn't need to talk about it which is why we didn't trying to make the wording I think yeah I don't think there there are any changes that we're trying to trying to um discuss that we're going to keep you know the number we have right now a limit of 14 is it uh tobacco retail correct yeah but if someone should give up uh a permit and there isn't a buyer for their for their store that permit will Ex will be taken back by the town and then there will only be 13 possible tobacco sales sale retailers so I think that's called a reducing cap so we if if they go out of business if they they aren't transferred to a new owner of the business then it's gone so gradually the number will likely go down they already have gone down in the last four years and I think probably the pandemic had somewhat of a hit on that but it went from 18 four years ago to 14 now so there was a loss of some permits um so we weren't planning on changing that and the other thing with just some rules about uh not being within 500 feet of a school and I think that's a state regulation um but also how close they can be together and we have some regulations about that and we're not planning to change that either the idea is we didn't want to have an adult only store and a regular outlet be really the same business basically right in the same space so that I think there's not a lot it's just been wording that that we wanted to clarify better we wanted to make it more clear it it's quite conf it's a little bit confusing uh uh so we wanted to clarify that so that and I don't think I mean I think there's I don't think there's anything else we're changing right we no I mean I think Kiko I think this was it these were the last discussions to have and then it's you know we will draft what we think we've understood from people we'll flag where there's you know these were decisions that we think we understood but people can change their mind if they've thought about it more or we haven't taken any votes or made any decisions and revise you know work on the wording that Marina is talking about make sure it's as clear as possible and then send it around to the group for a final review discussion vote um so it still takes a while but it there's no more discussions on their own okay so in terms of timing is that something that you think the two of you would be able to do before the next meeting or like how do you envision this going from here possibly yeah I think it's possible I think you know I wouldn't expect it to pass through a vote on the first showing of it right that that next meeting I would i' I'd be very surprised if everyone got a chance to read all of the things and had thought it all through and it was very clear and no further discussion needed um but it's possible okay it's always good to be optimistic um so then the plan would be for you to at least put together some sort of a draft for people to react to in the next meeting in June and and to see how that looks and whether there's a need to further edit or what from there yeah Moren and I haven't compared schedules for the next month but that would be ideal if we can make that happen yeah yeah that would be great um and we had talk to Cheryl helped us earlier and we would love it if we could get her view on some of the things that we wording that we' added to it so if that we can do all those things in the next month that would be fantastic okay that's great and then hopefully um she'll be joining us in the next 10 minutes so maybe we can sort of as long as we'll have her with us we can ask her what her month looks like and whether she'll be available to sort of assist with some of these last when it things okay good um I don't know what happened to Prema I didn't hear back from her and I thought she would jump on at 5:30 but she's not here so I hope she's okay me too I hope haven't heard anything so um much this today and I just make sure I didn't have anything from earlier but I think she would have sent it to you too Kiko yeah and I checked with Kyle and he didn't hear from her either so I'm not sure what happened I from this month so well go ahead 10 minutes maybe right until Cheryl's planning to join us yeah I mean I I she did accept the invite so I'm and I sent her the agenda so I think she knows that it starts at 6:10 I mean we could start the discussion based on what we've heard um Meen you and I were in a presentation and we have some materials that we could sort of review with people or we could I guess take a break until 610 I'm not sure how you want to handle it um you could give us a little of the co uh the director's update or skip ahead like likees or something we actually have Cheryl in here right now I can terrific thank you Kyle timing oh there she is raising her hand okay um so should we go ahead and promote Cheryl to a panelist there she is great she's coming on thank thank you and maren if you want to give a summary of what we've learned and what we're trying to do in with this agenda item that would be great I don't know I can try it's a it's a little complicated um welcome Cheryl hi hi I'm on Just for people who don't know Cheryl is the executive director of the Massachusetts Association of Health boards and she's a lawyer and she's really knows about all these difficult questions about tobacco regulations and and the uh complications of this hemp derived products that's emerging um basically I think we might have spoken about it before but it's complicated I guess a few years ago hemp was legalized to grow for non uh non drug use if it had a very low percentage of THC in it um and it's theoretically could be used for rope and fabric and all kinds of things and um and also CBD was allowed in products that weren't to be consumed it's my understanding um however since then um the hemp has been used in different ways that people didn't really anticipate when they made this regulation and that there is CBD now in many things that are consumed gummies drinks or whatever um and also there are cannabinoids which are natur occurring in hemp but in the tiny amounts especially like the Delta a THC and Delta 10 THD are examples the Delta and although they occur in hemp they're in such small amounts that they really aren't um couldn't be commercially used so the way that those products are have developed is they synthesized from CBD and so the Delta 8 and Delta 10 and several other canabo are in many products and they're called synthetic can canabo um and they're appearing in our our store shelves in like convenience stores and smoke shops and wherever um without any kind of Regulation and without um any known concent ations or contaminants or anything and they're in Edibles chewables uh drinkables they're in all kinds of products and and it is something that youth have access to and and and they they are um hallucinogen I mean they're they are similar they similar kind of uh neurological changes as uh Delta THC so so it's con considered to be an access for people under the age of 21 and in local stores uh across the country basically and across the state and there not many clear law there are laws that say they are not legal but the enforcement is um um you're basically you're basically doing the presentation that I have to give you so um I'll stop no well you you've you've hit the nail on the head um so so the reason in the olden days we had hemp old-fashioned hemp plants and old-fashioned drug plants and the hemp plants looked very different than the drug plants and the purpose of the hemp plants was as you said it was grown for fiber and seed oil and rope and material and cloth and clothes and things like that and then the drug plants had the THC in them and they were dried trimmed cured and you could tell the difference between the two plants clearly that is no longer the case now you a a hemp flower looks just like uh cannabis a THC flower which is why hemp flowers are still prohibited because you can't tell the difference between the two now what's what's happened and no I'm okay so in 2018 in 2018 Congress passed the Farm Act and in that act that law it removed hemp from the definition of marijuana so it took hemp out of the con controlled substance act the problem or the challenge that we have now is that they defined Congress defined hemp as the cannabis plant including seeds isomer salts um with a Delta 9 concentration of not more than. 3% so in plain language what that definition means is that all products that are sourced from the cannabis plant that contain not more than 3% of Delta 9 thhc UM are hemp Okay so the plain meaning of that definition is that you are hemp as long as you do not have more than 3% of Delta 9 THC so as soon as the Farm Act was passed we started seeing I mean it's a clever industry we started seeing um products that that said that they were hemp products hemp derived products and that they did not contain Delta 9 they contained either Delta 8 or Delta 10 and now we're up to um THC 0 THC 8 I mean we have lots and lots of different um synthetic products out there now that allegedly don't contain more than 3% of Delta 9 and they're on the market and you're right we're seeing them everywhere now when we look we're in a better position that other states are because at least the flavored vaping products like cake and the other you see a lot of flavored Delta 8 Delta 10 and other synthetic intoxicating hemp products out there but if they're flavored our um tobacco sales law captures them because our tobacco sales law prohibits all flavored vaping products regardless of nicotine content so Meredith um O's program your Tobacco Control collaborative can capture those canine on those products and can capture those products which a a lot of the products are flavored vaping products so those aren't a concern in Massachusetts now because all flavored vaping products are covered by the Massachusetts law the challenge is the other ones as you said the edible products that are everywhere um I've got one on my screen now nerdy Bears delta8 gummies and it's it's advertised as compliant with the Farm Act the 2018 Farm Act um it has Delta 8 THC and CBD in it and it comes in assorted flavors and right on the advertising it says it's extremely potent right on the advertising it says it's extremely potent and the packaging looks like gummy bears it looks and and the products out there now they look like Doritos goldfish um gummy bears and and then also we have the beverages out there now um the seltzers that comp that contain these products so and you you explained it nicely I mean what is delta8 and Delta 10 and these other products they are an isomer of Delta 9 so they're the same atoms but they're arranged differently and you're right they are found naturally in a cannabis plant but in minuscule amounts um one of the scientists that's looked at this has said that to produce delta8 naturally with the necessary isolation purification required you would need to produce about 122 100,000 lounds of hemp to get 2.2 pounds of natural Delta 8 at a cost of $22 million so the claims that these are natural hemp derived products is not true these claims are not true and he basically said calling delta8 THC a derived or natural product is the equivalent of calling Codine a poppy derived natural herbal supplement so we're seeing these now in candy cookies gummies drinks um lots of infused beverages so that that's the that's the problem um that we have and we know that these products are getting they're intoxicating products that's how they're advertised as and and if you just look at some of the ads out there you know you'll see a lot of them or I see a lot of them on Facebook that say you know you'll never get a hangover again um meaning that you know you're going to get high but you're going to get high not from alcohol you're going to get high from these hemp infused beverages so I I think we all know the public health concern concerns with this and also the fact that you know they're not age restricted um and you can find them anywhere um and and there was there was actually a lawsuit in California where um the nerdy bear manufacturers um were being sued by another company because that company said that they violated their trademark um and and they're trying to copy what the other company looks like we don't care about the trademark issue but the question before the court was are these legal products are these actually um legal products or are they prohibited products if they're prohibit if they're illegal products then the trademark doesn't matter because you can't trademark an illegal product so that was the decision um for the court whether federal law prohibited the sale of Delta 8 so I'm not going to tell you the decision of that case right now um I'm going to give you um so that you stay awake for the rest of this but I'm gonna give you what the governmental side both the federal and the state both Federal and Massachusetts have said about these products and the drug enforcement agency claims that Delta 8 and every other synthetic product are still covered by the controlled substance act they claim that all synthetically derived products are schedule one Controlled Substances um because they're synthetic and they have to be extracted from the plant and then refined through a manufacturing process and they say that it was clearly the Congressional intent was to legalize only industrial hemp and not psychoactive substances like Delta eight so that's what the federal government says um the mdar the Massachusetts Department of agricultural resources finally issued a policy statement in writing in 2021 I asked them for that that in writing in 2020 yeah yeah in yeah right right before covid I asked them for that statement and I got it about 18 months later because this was really becoming a challenge for Boards of health and what they say is that any food product that contains hemp or CBD um any animal feed containing these products um are are not approved for sale and they also said in this written guidance that failure to comply may result in enforcement action from either mdar the Department of Public Health or the local Board of Health or law enforcement so they say it may and then when people started seeing these products and calling mdar they were told to contact their local Board of Health and that's what they have been doing since 2018 um we started seeing it because our Tobacco Control programs started getting complaints from folks in their in their cities and towns and they came to mahb and said what do we do you know we we we're not getting any help with enforcement from anybody and we want to enforce on these products so we create we drafted a sample template um on these products that has been updated since we initially drafted it in 2018 so what have other state agencies said about these products dph did Issue a guidance document in 2019 that basically said the products that contain um hemp CBD synthetic cannabis they are adulterated food products that CBD has never been approved as a um ingredient that can be put into food and because these products are not approved ingredients they the the products that contain them are adulterated and therefore they're a violation of the food code so who enforces the food code local Boards of Health enforce the food code and we also Reed got a statement um from the abcc the Alcohol Beverage Control Commission saying that alcoholic beverages cannot contain THC or CBD however they've cannabis Control Commission has a different approach to that now that we'll talk about in a minute so everyone started getting um this this started to become pretty public and recently the globe did a feature article on the front page about these products and they talked about the loopholes that you know okay so they're illegal because they violate the food food code the DEA says they're illegal mdar says they're illegal um but nobody is doing enforcing unless it's a local Board of Health that's doing the enforcing so and and and different products are cropping up you know you may get rid of one of them and then there's a brand new one so we've got that whack-a-mole situation like we have with tobacco but we don't have any one that's actually funded to do this enforcement so um the mdar mdar actually finally has a hemp program coordinator and she sent an email I I emailed her and she emailed me back and said to me and to the health director that that I was providing to to that both food and beverage products containing hemp derived cannabinoids including THC and CBD are prohibited in Massachusetts so we have written and we also have something in writing from the Cannabis Control Commission um because liquor stores started seeing um drinks with actual Delta 9 in them which is the marijuana the the the natural THC but it's Delta 9 they started seeing Delta 9 drinks um being brought in by their Distributors their Selsa their their cannabis infused drinks and they called they didn't this was a store redston Liquors in ring and the owner of the store called the Cannabis Control Commission and said you know I'm being told by the Department that these products are not legal but my distributor is telling me that they are legal and the CCC finally got back to this store owner and said they're legal if they're sold in marijuana establishments you have to have a license to sell these and and they have to have a license from the Cannabis Control Commission so now the true Delta nine cannabis infused products can be sold but only in marijuana establishments they can't be sold in convenience stores or grocery stores or anywhere else and what the Distributors are saying is Well marijuana is legal in Massachusetts so now you can sell these products well marijuana is legal in Massachusetts but it can only be sold in marijuana establishments so um what what I've done is I've put together um all of the documents in writing that I could find from the state agencies um and supporting documentation from the state agencies that refer to the documents that have been mentioned in the emails and most of the documents most of the the statements are in writing their emails their public documents from these state agencies to me or to to a colleague of mine but it's in writing and it's from all of the state agencies and they all agree that these products are should not be sold because they violate the food code right now they just violate the food code because they're not approved ingredients now we'll go back to the case in California so the case in California what the court did and this is the ninth Circuit Court of Appeal which is a very usually a very liberal um circuit court of appeals but what they found their holding was that because Delta 8 does not have less than does not have more than 3% of Delta 9 in it that it's legal that the plane me meaning of the Farm Act can't help but lead you to the conclusion that delta8 products or any synthetically derived product is legal if it has less than 3% of Delta 9 because it's hemp derived um the the law the the Farm Act doesn't make any mention of synthetic at all um and they basically say in the decision and I'm quoting now regardless of the wisdom of legalizing Delta a THC products this court will not substitute its own policy judgment for that of Congress if the defendant is correct and Congress inadvertently created a loople legalizing vaping products containing Delta 8 then it is for Congress to fix its mistake now we are not covered the the decision in the n9th circuit quarter of appeals is not binding on us we're in the First Circuit Court of Appeals so that decision does not present a problem um for us in moving forward Congress should really fix this but we don't really need Congress to fix it to be able to enforce on these products because they violate our food code right now um the question is who is going to do the enforcing so what some municipalities have done is that they have enacted regulations that prohibit these products even though you don't have to enact a regulation to prohibit them because they're illegal so you know Banning heroin you know you you you don't have to pass a regulation to ban heroin it's it's a class it's it's an illegal drug so you don't have to pass a regulation to enforce the food code on these products because Boards of Health have the legal authority to pass the food code so that's the pickle that we're in I will say that Senator Joe Comerford contacted me she will be holding a hearing I believe it's June 11th it's very preliminary but the legislature is getting complaints which they should from folks they've heard that these state agencies are not you know they they've said that they're illegal but they haven't um you know they haven't enforced it so the legislature is looking at regulating these products further regulating these products and they're just getting some preliminary information from scientists from the Cannabis Control Commission um you know it's it's it's interesting now because now the Cannabis lobbyists are on the same side as the public health lobbyists because it's interfering with their business because they're regulated from door to dumpster whereas these other products these synthetic intoxicating products aren't so you know you know it it's I've never gone to bed with the tobacco industry and I I don't want to do it with this industry either but you know we're on the same side for different reasons but you know they they're they're illegal they shouldn't be sold in Massachusetts but they are being sold in Massachusetts so that's my story it's a long one it's it's a long one um do you know what people around us are doing we know that Northampton this actually sent a letter was really focused on Creative but included some of the synthetic can canabo yeah um I was with Meredith yesterday at another meeting and yeah they sent out a letter and they've had pretty good success in getting some of these products out they also have their um inspectors look for these products when they go in to Stores um where has prohibited um these products and they've included katom in the products that are prohibited katum has has a following they they've got an U membership Association and um they're opposing some of these regulations because in where they are Banning katum and the association is saying we should be regulating it not Banning it um so we have Beverly has done it Fall River has done it um wear has done it and there are others that have done it but they haven't done it to the a lot of them had done the first regulation that we we did was which was to age restrict these products put them behind the counters require um certain testing but now that it's clear that they're illegal you know those regulations really don't make they should be banned you know we shouldn't be regulating an illegal product so we have some old ones so we do have some new NM is looking at it right now I drafted one for them um so people are now looking at um at at what to do you know ideally I would love it if you know if if if dph wants local Boards of Health to to enforce using the food code then they need to give us some resources to do that I mean is because this is huge you know this is this is huge and it's dangerous and kids can get these they can get them online they could get them in any store and it's it's right now the only ones doing anything our health directors and Health Inspectors that are going in and saying take these things off the shelf they're illegal and giving them you know the the guidance documents that we have and some are giving them the packet that um I will send you that that you can give they're just giving the packet to the retailers and hoping that that's going to be enough to let them to get them off the shelves and it is in some cases and it isn't in others so Cheryl when you said in where that they've banned katum is that did they is there a regulation Banning it or how do they do that yes um it's Andrea cre right you know Andrea yeah and we we heard from her I think at the pbtc meeting right Mar yes you did I was there were there you were there and we have that I drafted that regulation for them and yeah they banned it and they used the fining structure for the tobacco regulations so 1,000 for the First Defense 2,000 then 5,000 and suspensions and you can't suspend I mean you can't permit these products because they're illegal but you could pull if they have one a tobacco permit or you could pull a milk permit or whatever permits you issue you could pull right so katum isn't currently illegal in the way that these synthetic can o it's a world yeah um it's it's I think it's in a different category than synthetic products um yeah it's it's it's a plant a Southeast Asian plant right that is also hallucinatory um but it also has been used by people who are um trying to get off of heroin um it's a product that they use to help with the withdrawals right from heroin it's controversial it's controversial that's why the harm reduction Community is not in favor of bans reason but but what's problematic is there's no quality control this product nobody knows how much of it it needs to be regulated yeah you know I mean it does I I you know in full transparency my son was addicted to heroin he's been clean for over 10 years now but he was addicted and he used katum to deal with the withdrawals but he was getting in I mean this was well this was over 10 years ago going into Harvard Square and getting it you know my daughter would drive him in um and who knows I mean he was lucky it didn't kill him um but yeah there's no regulation which is which is need it I mean we need regulation and even the industry will say that the katum folks will say that um so it is it is I just wanted to say it's super complicated and and this was a very thorough summary which I really appreciate um Cheryl but I did want to say that I can send you the slides I'll send you the slides that would be great so then I think obviously the concern you know products with delta8 in them are more concerning than say other products that might have CBD in them you know that are in so but but what I heard from you is that any product any product that you ingest that has CBD in it whether or not it has psychoactive properties Delta eight is still technically illegal it's technically illegal and and and here's the this just blows my mind um T edible THC products are legal whereas edible CBD products even ones that are not intoxicating are not legal and that doesn't make any sense except that when the Cannabis Control Commission wrote their regulations they um Exempted edible cannabis products from the definition of food so that they're not violating the food code because they're not food it it it makes no sense but I mean if we had regulations on CBD we could do the same thing if if if you're not talking about intoxicated synthetic products you're talking about real CBD that farmers grow you know we could have a regulation that does that but we don't have any CBD regulations and if you talk to um the Cannabis Control Commission I mean here's all the the bureaucratic frustration that just makes your head want to explode because if a liquor store if if a health director or inspector goes into a liquor store and finds a Delta 9 infused beverage in the liquor store and they call the Cannabis Control Commission and say this store is selling a marijuana infused product the Cannabis Control Commission will say we don't regulate we only regulate in marijuana establishments you're going to have to call your local Board of Health so they're they don't care I mean I shouldn't say they don't care but they do not intend to regulate these places that are illegally selling cannabis products I mean so it's it's and and the C and mdar says they don't enforce either it's the local Boards of Health they will say they're illegal but they will say they don't have an enforcement mechanism so again we're back to local Boards of Health enforcing the food code wow so I will be testifying um at the hearing and I will be testifying on behalf of boards of health and the you know the frustration that we feel and the position that we're being put in and that we need you know that that if someone could take this off our shoulders or give us resources um to add it to our plate then we'd feel better about this so is are any Boards of Health sending letters to alcohol retailers saying that these Delta 9 products should be pulled off the shelves as well yes okay and who's looking at that you know that's the other well I mean the only people who are looking at it is US yeah like to go in unless you get a complaint from someone or unless we get a complaint yeah oops I hav see I'm busy I have a visitor we can't we can't see your visitor they're behind the backdrop yeah that's okay my background a naked baby you know oh morning's on am [Music] meeting so and then one other question Cheryl when you said that this letter that has like some boards of Health including Northampton have sent out a letter requesting for you know here's the list of all the stuff please pull it up and you said they've had some success so how is what do you know about that success just that when the inspectors go in to the stores in Northampton they're not finding them on the shelves anymore wow okay and are they sending is Northampton also regulating alcohol establishments with the delta or talking I'm pretty sure if they are um don't know how frequently they go into alcohol establishments but they do because they give them permits as well right you know most people don't want to break the law so you know and again we're about compliance not about punishment so you know if we can go into a store and say these are illegal take them off the shelves that's great you know and that works probably and most of the time it'll work but it won't work always especially when they're getting mixed messages from their Distributors right and this also includes things that Whole Foods like doesn't Whole Foods sell cannabis infused things you know like they sell CBD C they sell CBD but not edible CBD they sell lotion and tinctures and some other things yeah but they don't sell edible and hemp hearts are hemp derived but that's a food that's not considered an adulterated food right is that a food that's is that also a legal Technic what's a hemp I don't know what a hemp heart is you they're like you know you can get hemp seeds or hemp hearts that are oh yeah those those are not there's a list of products if you go to the MD mdar website there's there's like hemp oil and there are some other hemp products that are not illegal they are gsas I forget what that means good there's evidence supporting that they're safe so yeah there are some products that are fine okay and they're listed out got it so I guess it's you know we wanted to bring this up to have everyone informed unfortunately we don't have a great um attendance at our meeting today which is too bad but um you know the eventual goal I think Meen was for the board to try to figure out do we want to do something like what Northampton is doing or what wear is doing or Fall River other places yeah if you know certainly asking isn't hard but then no um then the question is if if there's a regulation it probably doesn't hurt to have it even if you can't uh thoroughly enforce it you know because then if it is noted by uh by a food inspector or or other other people that then you can enforce it it it just it just would be nice if there was like like Cheryl was saying some sort of support for enforcement and some and it would be even nicer if there was a Statewide kind of uh uh program um so is that all you need from me question no go not just yet go ahead Risha I um I just want to make sure I'm clear on it was a to digest even though I did actually watch some of the stuff beforehand and read some of the stuff beforeand um the the options in you're breaking up you're breaking up regulation I'm in San Francisco I don't know if oh I didn't catch the question did anyone no maybe turn your camera off Risha see if that helps with your band so good what are the options can you hear me yes no oh um I'm just trying okay I will I will ask the question at another time we so Risha if you can turn your camera off that might help she did oh there there it is okay try again no um trying to understand what the options in front of us are it sounds like regulations letters that was the part I wasn't entirely clear on yeah um the options are um you could just go into the stores um with the guidance documents from um dph with the written documentation from mdar and from the Cannabis Control Commission and tell them that these are a VI having these products violate the food code um and need to be taken off the shelf you could um mail you could send letters or emails whatever to all of the stores saying the same thing um or you could enact a regulation that would prohibit all of these products and you could find them um you know a th000 2,000 5,000 if you find them on the shelves okay and is there any role for us in supporting the work that Joe cord or others are doing at a yes yes um if she she really appreciates hearing from her constituents um and you should let your reps and Senators know um that this is a real concern because that's why she's holding a hearing is because she's heard from so many um Municipal officials about this especially Health directors and Board of Health members yeah maybe we should write a letter from the board yeah that would be great she gets it I mean she gets the problem but it helps to Yeah Yeah the more the more support she gets the better off she is obviously anything else Risha nope thank you that was it okay okay um Kiko I will send you the slides I will also send you the packet that I put together um probably tomorrow morning perfect this was so helpful thank you Cheryl oh you're entirely welcome and before before we let go we did want to ask you so we're we spent the first part of this meeting talking about our tobacco regulations and we've had lots of good conversations and I think we're ready I'll say Risha and maren are ready to do a draft so Meen did you w to ask Cheryl about her availability yeah I don't I just wondered um if you could you you were really helpful in getting us started on this sure and I I added a lot of the wording from the the state uh sample there and then we changed some things about our reg and I just wondered if you could take another look at it absolutely before we bring it back to the full board and sure ready to vote okay R and I will work on it and try to get several weeks it sounds yeah I'm happy to take another look at it I'm writing Grant applications for the next 10 days so I'm a little hearing on the coming up so I understand um that you've got a lot on your plate but we'll get this as together as we can and then great send it to you for one one happy to look at it I appreciate that okay and I will say goodbye all right have a good rest of your meeting thank you so much bye bye very helpful yeah that would be a meeting worth reviewing yeah definitely it's recorded a lot of information um it really helped me though at first I thought oh no I'm more confused when she was talking but by the end of it all I feel like I finally got Clarity on everything so yeah that's good right um and the it sounds like having those documents too will be really helpful um all right where are we I don't know if there's I don't think I have anything to add at this point on this subject I think it's something to digest and and bring forward um Lauren any do you have any thoughts are you still with us I know you had to leave early yeah I don't know she say yeah I'm traveling I'm still here I'm traveling and listening so I'll share my thoughts at at another the next meeting great thanks thank you um Risha did you have anything you wanted to share I know a lot to digest no I I think yeah digesting and I I would support a letter although I'm not sure entirely what I would put as a Content so I leave that to you I just say this is needs to be looked at on the state level you know and and the boards of Health need support to help curb these sales of these products that are illegal I don't know maybe maybe Kiko you can help me write something yeah we can we can definitely do that and the other thing I'm also curious about is just how much of the stuff is on the shelves in amoris because I just don't know I haven't gone out I know I don't go to convenience stores much go I don't know where else that would be I mean maybe uh wild Whatever It Is Wild Side yeah yeah definitely um or other kind of like funky little stores I don't know yeah yep okay um okay so I guess the next um item on the agenda is the director's update yep so I have just a few items um you know certainly we think of ourselves as being out of the respiratory illness season right now with covid Wastewater levels being pretty low and you know flu levels flu hospitalization being pretty low but we're already thinking about gearing up for the fall um so working with Northampton through the public health Excellence Grant to be scheduling some flu and covid Clinics and really trying to get more out into the community we were in a couple of um housing complexes last year which was really successful so you know it's good to have the clinics here at the bank center but it's also good to go to people so it's going to be a combination so we're starting that already to plan for that great yeah um uh I just wanted to say in terms of the kindness campaign you know I've talked about that a couple of times here it did wrap up at the end of April technically um we're keeping the spirit of the campaign alive through a couple of mental Wellness workshops that um Lauren has been really instrumental in helping us set up um working with the youth mental health Coalition in Springfield and those are happening next week and the week after there are two different ones so um youth are required to register ahead of time and um one of them is a poetry Workshop just encouraging young people to um get in touch with their emotions be able to express them as a way of having optimal mental Wellness so that's exciting that that will happen hopefully we'll get a good turnout um in general the workshops that we held on mental health and suicide were not well attended and we really understand that these are difficult topics for people to talk about and there wasn't I guess enough Community concern around them for people to show up for workshops so that wasn't as successful but we did get a lot of people Thanking us for doing the kindness campaign and understanding the connection between being kind and mental wellness and Community Health so it was a good first start uh first step and I think we'll try to do it again the community cleanup which C you know the culmination of the kindness campaign was a community cleanup on the 27th of April we got a bunch of people out including some of town counselors and collected a lot of garbage and recycling and that was a fun Community event a lot of people just came together and made friends and so that was a good Community kind of devel building every one of those events I was somewhere else so I get to connect with it myself I did find that when I was thinking about it and looking for the dates though on like the town website it was a little hard to find but not that that um limit I mean I don't think that's the way these things get um advertised or promoted anyway but i w i remember finding it a little difficult so that's sort of that how to get get it to people's attention is is the tricky part I think that's a really good point and something that we did struggle with a little bit we had um a website which is part of this engage platform where people were supposed to be able to go and upload stories about random acts of kindness or photographs or what have you and that was not successful and I think the website is one tool but for this kind of really Community engaged type of work you just have to get the information out in a more individual way personal way and we didn't do that kind of Outreach so those are all things to think about for for next time um yeah so we'll see oh the other thing I was going to mention is that we we are hiring a Communications manager so the town has been without a Communications manager for some time and I've been fortunate enough to be on that interview panel so we have a couple of candidates and that would have been helpful to have someone in that role to help promote the kindness campaign we did not have someone we did our best with scarce resources so I understand and I but it's good feedback I appreciate it um so the pyer valley mosquito control control district we have this contract with them they're wonderful they're starting their surveillance efforts they're going to start treatment efforts in early June in a part of North amoris where a West Nile positive mosquito was found at the end of the season last year so proactive treatment in an area that we know had West Nile last year um and I wanted to ask board members whether I whether you would like to see the report that they send out um every season they just sent out a spring report it's very well done and it has great photographs and it's very kind of informative about mosquito surveillance and treatment so I can send that out to people if you'd like to see it sure okay yes please okay great and the other thing that we want to work on and Risha thank you for sending us some references is a one-pager about spraying because I think a lot of people wonder about whether that's something they should do on their own properties I reached out to John Briggs who is the director of Pioneer Valley mosquito control district I haven't heard from him yet but Kyle has a draft going or starting to work on a draft of an educational handout something or or rather to put on the website to have in the office about um you know we have lots of things about how to protect yourself from mosquito bites long sleeves insect repellent all that kind of stuff that we know well but spraying we don't have any good educational material about the pros and cons of that so we're going to work on that um based on with some of the stuff that you sent our way so thanks for that and we'll keep you posted um the opioid abatement funds there was a really nice article in sorry go ahead go ahead um when because I know that the um some folks on the ammer parents L serve had asked about it is there um is there a time where I could let them know to be looking for something or um so Kyle do you want to chime in about how long you think think you might take to work on that what's a reasonable time frame for you yeah I started a draft um to be quite honest I haven't been able to work on it that closely today um I'll definitely work on it tomorrow so probably early next week I'll get that out yeah I think we can get something and Kyle's in the middle of graduating from school so he has a lot on his PL is that taking some of your time um but yeah I think we can get you something um you know get something a draft maybe to share with you Risha I would love your input if you're interested or if you don't want to give input that's fine we can just send you a final copy um by the end of the month or early next month okay yeah I I just want to make sure because I think this is the time that people are starting to think about it and so making sure we get it out to people before they've made decisions that they would have changed had they known more exactly yeah that makes total sense I mean we'll definitely prioritize it Kyle Kyle we'll work on it together getting mailings with process of spraying in your yard yeah right now okay um so just two other things should I move on to the next yeah um I just wanted to mention the opioid abatement funds so um there was an article in the paper about how the local community Hampshire County and then ammer in particular are approaching this whole issue um we're still in the needs assessment phase um but we are beginning to buy some supplies like harm reduction supplies and working closely with Craig Stores um to make sure that their guests who are who are using drugs are supported and that they have the infrastructure at the shelter to be able to respond to an overdose so we're doing that right now but still working on a plan for further spending of this money which comes in you know in a steady stream for the next 18 years so um more to come on that but just wanted to let you know that we're sort of gearing up on that topic at this point um and then the last thing is just the future of the board that sounds ominous it's not meant to sound ominous it's mostly just drawing attention to the fact that three members are rolling off at the end of June so Meen and Tim's terms end at the end of June and Lauren is she was on for three years and then sort of renewed and is now making the decision to end her term a little early so will also be rolling off at the end of June so that leaves us with three vacancies um and Paul now that the town budget is finished is turning his attention from those budgetary conversations to thinking about um uh you know having appointing new people to the Board of Health and he does have strong some strong applicants already people in mind so that's a process that's it's happening and unfolding and we should have some updates when we by when we meet next month okay um yeah and I think in terms of next month one thing that Moren and I talked about just briefly today was whether we wanted to try to have an in-person meeting especially in light of the fact that several board members are leaving us be nice to see people in person so I kind of wanted to put that out there as an idea is that possible for you Risha is that yeah I'm just looking at the calendar that's June 13th MH uh right now it's possible okay just wondered just in a gen generic way you know but whether I think it sounds like a good idea and it it's a little bit worrying to realize there's only two of us left is that is that am I have I counted correctly have it's a little unusual it's usually one or two at a time and this is a little different it is a little different um yes so wondering if we need to ramp up do we have enough people who are in the queue or do we need to be doing more heavy recruitment um my understanding from Paul is that he has um some candidates in the queue that he's very excited about so I think we're pretty we're in good shape and so um the idea is that there it would be seamless so that that by July we would have a full complement of board members again so back up to five yeah from the two that it will be just briefly ones hard to believe it's almost six years actually but it's another dear another question um well that's good that that that there are folks stepping forward yeah um and I so no any topics an not anticipated by the chair no all right um then could I think could we have a motion to adjourn oh sorry before you do that I don't know if Lauren if you're still listening in and if you had a thought about the in-person meeting idea if you're still hearing us um yeah that's fine and can ask wait what I didn't hear that oh I said um yes that is a good idea the inperson meeting and would it be possible for you uh to read what I sent you because when I open my email I can't speak I don't think I did the the the bike um event Justice the um the rooll walking bike the bike Walk and Roll is it possible for you to read that yeah let me see if I can find it so this can be an agenda item that we didn't anticipate if that's okay um so just that it was um another successful walk bike and roll to school day uh the community came together for a fantastic walk bike and roll to school day on on Wednesday I guess May 1 um while Community Partners school-based administrators teachers and staff played a vital role in ensuring a successful and fun event for students the vast majority of credit and thanks once again goes to our amazing Arps parents and Guardians we're so grateful for the passion and dedication not to mention the sheer volume of work they put in to make sure these safe walk to school events not only happen but continue to grow year after year um some details while we're still working to figure out an engaging event for the middle school and high school students walking riding to those schools were well aware that they were participating in today's event regardless all Walkers and cyclists on Chestnut Street heading toward the middle and high schools affirmed they were part of the Walk ride day and at elementary schools they had great events as well there were I think Lauren had mentioned 30 families participating at Wildwood um they had a banana stand reception at the school um and then Dr KU was also on hand to pass out swag um and police escorted the crew from Pine and East Pleasant so it was kind of a big deal all hands on deck Fort River had a huge event with 50 families maybe more there were bike rally points at Stanley Street kuanana field and various other places um and police escorts helped out at both locations with Comfort dog Auggie and officer laramy in attendance so well known those two and then in Crocker Farm they had 50 families and the principal and principal's assistants were very pleased that they found places for all of those bikes um for the first time they had a walking bus Group come from Mount Holio and bike rally points at various places around South amorist so all in all it was a nice event and a big success so thanks Lauren for sharing that thank you thank you that's great all right I have to run so I motion to close the meeting or I just am gonna hang up thanks R uh luren yes I I I uh agreed to um end the meeting okay and Ting is eared okay thank you thank you for hanging in there Lauren Anda thanks everybody all right good night have a good night night