##VIDEO ID:F288zt2FfzQ## and we are now recording okay uh hello and welcome to the amoris meeting of the amoris energy and climate action committee which was organized to guide the town meeting and its climate mitigation and resilience goals um those goals and the plan for getting there are adopted from the climate action adaptation and resilience plan or the carp which was accepted by the Town Council in 2021 it takes 2016 as its base year and calls for 25% reduction in carbon emissions by 2025 50% by 2030 and carbon neutrality by 2050 so this committee has two primary functions one is to advise the Town Council and recommend or propose policies or actions that help us meet those goals and the other is to promote a just Equitable and Speedy climate response through Outreach and engagement of town and local stakeholders so welcome um the first thing on the agenda is always to find a note taker um so let's see where are we with Note takers um trying to look for Michael did it last time who's next on the list you have the um let's see I don't know if it's in order uh assuming this list order doesn't change if it does it shouldn't but I think it does sometimes then we have Don who's not here yet and then Tony Don Don and Tony will not be here this evening okay haven't heard from Caitlyn um Andrew you want to give it a try sure I will do my best it's only your second meeting so I feel like it's a little unfair but this is my third meeting so maybe it's fine I'll I'll do my best okay so Andrew you can just send me the draft when you're done uh the next thing we do is share the minutes to approve the minutes from the last meeting which I have here um so very nice to the point minutes and this is really all you need in minutes it's sort of a list of things we discussed it doesn't need to be a lot of detail I didn't find anything um that I think need changing but Lori I don't know if you can hear us but you froze froze you did oh dear am I you're back but good yeah my internet has been a little flaky lately um I hope I don't disappear if I disappear oh we need a we need an a um a vice chair we should put that on the agenda for next time or maybe talk about it at the end today if we have if we have time um laori you're breaking up um oh dear I don't know what to do about that do you want me to share the minutes maybe it'll be easier if I do that why don't you let me yeah okay yep I'll unshare you go share let me stop give me a second I have to get them up again try that I think we might not need to bring them up do we have a movement a move to um accept them to as they are oh I got plenty connection yeah I'll I'll move to accept and is there a second I'll I'll second that Steve roof all right okay and in no particular order ising yes Davis yes Cher upstate rof yes goldner yes L okay minutes are approved all right so the next thing on the list is uh always comments from participants from attendees so if you have a Martha has her hand raised so Martha you can go ahead and unmute okay hello everyone good evening and I just wanted to briefly call your attention to something that I just learned about recently and that is our town manager has sent to the Town Council a proposal to install four traffic circles in front of Fort River School in that one block of southeast Street uh and so so you know that's something that will be a big impediment to people walking to Children trying to cross to anyone with a bicycle and it's done to quote improve traffic flow and so I just wanted to bring it to your attention I sent the memo to lii because it seems to me that uh you know catering to our motor vehicles and encouraging them and discouraging people to walk or to Bicycle would uh not be consistent with our climate goals so just wanted to bring it to your attention it sure sounds like a um something little overzealous thank you thanks Martha point I I want to say that um you know in the years I've been here and I'm sure you I've seen an awful lot of traffic circles go in somebody clearly likes them quite a lot we just had three new ones put in in my neighbor Hood um and they're always contentious and I no longer know what the right answer is I have to say when the ones went in at UMass I lived in that neighborhood and I was very worried about them being a problem for pedestrians and bicyclists and I have to say it hasn't turned out that way um so I don't know what I think the ones that just went in in my neighborhood seem a little crazy too um but it's not as horrible as I originally thought and uh I don't really quite know what to think I do think we get a little overzealous with them and it's worth considering and thinking about so I will send that memo that you sent me around to the rest of eak and maybe we can chat about it next time and thank you for sending it four in that one short stretch does seem quite a lot yeah thank you I would be interested in seeing the plans or a link to the plans to um get a sense of that proposal I have to say I don't find traffic circles themselves dangerous it's just the cars using them that are a [Laughter] hazard yeah there's always that um all right so if there's time at the end I'll I'll maybe present that as a as an update I'll share that today but if not we'll definitely have it on the agenda next time so it for next time okay okay next um any other questions from the attendees okay in that case we go to the agenda and the first thing on the agenda are weight the waste related topics so I heard back on two things um I did hear back from uh let me get this right give me a moment uh we had a question somebody made a comment a couple weeks ago about black plastic not being recyclable at the transfer station and they wonder and they had heard that it was because um some machine at Springfield can't read black plastic and in fact that's exactly what Steve TGA the Solway supervisor for amoris wrote to me it's not collected uh it's not collected at ATS this is because the facility in Springfield that takes our material does not accept it he's told that their sorting process has difficult time sorting it as do many other facilities so the recycling guides there was no online recycling guide I asked him if there was one he didn't give me an answer he just said that the recycling guides at the transfer station list black plastic As non-recyclable and we have signage posted near the collection area so I think they only list this at the at the um transfer station which is why it wasn't easy to figure out without going there so it's it's a bit of an odd thing I don't know what to think of it um so many things that aren't recyclable seems a bit odd to not recycle something that should be because it's the wrong color but if that's as it is I don't quite know what to do about it um but that sort of brings up the other the other trash related thing uh which is the waste hauler proposal that we talked about last time and that I promised to write a letter which I think you all have a copy of now right uh of course I managed to have closed um they do I sent it earlier and um it is in the meeting packet as well right right so um I didn't I just had chance to finally Dash this off today and and you didn't make any changes right uh Stephanie oh sorry no I did not no I couldn't find my button um no I did not make any changes so in that case let me share this and do some in editing and I think this goes to the town manager and the Town Council and if I understand the situation correctly there is a request for proposals for a waste hauler for ammer that has specific requirements that has gone out and um and it was already sent out it's I believe that proposal was accepted RP was sent out and so I think the purpose of the letter was to thank them for that and then encourage them to follow up on it when the rfps in to find a way to make this happen and the particular things that we're interesting that they're trying to make happen are a pay as you throw fee structure so you're paid you pay more for more trash you know not for a bigger bin or for the a certain size bin but for more trash you pay more and and conversely you pay less for less trash and also to have curbside uh compost pickup which would be a boon for me I know I would really appreciate that um there is composting at the transfer station and also to figure out the future of the transfer station and how that figures into everything so with that in mind I will share my screen and it was a simple brief letter that was designed to go I think to the Town Council and town manager but if I have that wrong um please let me know anyone who was here last time I think that was the idea can you all see that so simple to the point anybody want to change anything add anything hey Lori um I think this is fine I I guess and I haven't been here so you can ignore these comments but I'm just not sure what the value is of us weighing in at this moment when I think what actually would be more use is to see what the rfps come back to say um because I don't know whether they're going you know anyway I'm I'll just leave it at that I don't mind sending this out um but if like pay as you throw comes back to be super expensive sure I think we're going to have to really think through whether and none of this shows up our climate inventory that doesn't mean it's not important stuff to do but well zero zero waste does right I no we do not in our ghg inventory we do not calculate no emissions of or or so I think I always think it's a little bit it does align closely with our mission like but it's not going to help us meet our climate goals as written because our climic gos are based on a baseline of emissions that don't include um organic waste but the zero waste is in the carp yes it does align closely with our mission it does not help us meet our climate goals goals that's true well it does I mean it does it does it just that we're not accounting for it right yeah but we're not going to be able to say like we received a % reduction in our goals because we are composting more that's true but I I still think I mean it's certainly something we want to support right um and I think I think I understand the concern about fee structure so maybe the thing to do is to add a sentence here saying you know we we hope you'll we look forward to continued efforts and we hope you will involve eak in in what in in yes I mean I think that could be that could be helpful I think we would love to weigh in on the RFP because yeah it may be that it is a little more expensive and we think that the benefits outweigh the expense right um so I think we would like to be you know serve an advisory role if possible I think that would would help make this letter a little bit more um meaningful in my opinion right okay so how about this uh we support your continued efforts and hope you will consult with ecac Once proposals come in because obviously if it's going to be insanely expensive nobody's G to want to do it and I wouldn't blame them I wouldn't want to do it either um but you would think that yeah you think that it shouldn't be I mean I think a lot of it depends on you know we're in a situation now where we used to have half a dozen at least different local waste collectors and they were all bought up by USA recycle so the fact that there's no competition might make things difficult go ahead Stephanie um I just I'm thinking about language here and I think I have a suggested language change go ahead instead of asking that you will consult with ecac I think that you will allow the ecac to ified comment on the proposals it's semantics but I think it matters yep I get it that seems that seems fine thank you but on waste taller proposals or on responses to the RFP um sure I don't I I don't know that we actually technically can do that um I think if yeah like they're not when we get proposals we're not allowed to just publicly share them um but I think um maybe I don't know if the RFP has been drafted yet but certainly that the things that we're looking for um are the things that you would potentially want to weigh in on I I think the RFP I think the RFP has gone out yeah I think so too that's why I'm saying I I I'm not sure like at this stage that that's really sort of the point at which you want to maybe have some influence you're not allowed to look at the the responses um but I think maybe to provide comment on any final Choice um you know just because you know it's like when we were doing some other initiatives you can sort of talk generally about you know um I think about some of the proposals but you can't say anything too specific so you know again just you know to provide comment I think is enough it's just indicating that you want to have some involvement in reviewing what the town is doing I think that's sufficient any how do you how's what's right with on any successful proposals on any sure um sure on your um I think on your on on the successful proposal on the successful proposal the one so that by then we don't have right you're so you're because at this point you're not going to be able to weigh in the if the RFP has been drafted and sent out you can't weigh in at on that development at this point and when the proposals come in you can't look at you know who get who we get you know that's going to be a very small group of reviewers that will be allowed to look at that um and then they uh and then they'll announce who gets selected so but I think but typically what happens though is that then there's a contract that gets developed so it will include stuff from the um from the RFP but sometimes there's a bit of negotiation so you may want to just say that before the final contract is drafted or or or you you know that maybe the ecac has a opportunity to weigh in but Stephanie I thought that for this in particular the only thing the Town Council has agreed to is pursue an RFP right there's another round of public input once the rfps come through before a contract is signed right um well not not usually I mean typically that's not how we do it when we when we put out for proposals and the proposals come in those are not Public public documents right so because sometimes there's proprietary information and so that's not a public process so I don't know though if they'll discuss generally I'm not really honestly I'm not sure I haven't been following it all that closely to be honest um so I don't I mean I just don't think when the rfps come in you're going to be able to sort of have there'll be public discussion about it all the all the council did was authorize the town manager to do that so it's not like the C proposals will go to the council yeah okay that was my understanding of it but I will I I don't think I'm wrong on this point because that's not typically when the town contracts with someone like a waste huler it's not going to be something that the council reviews it's something that the town manager does does yeah and the town manager can appoint a committee to review it and eak be on one on the committee well right but there may be other I mean I don't it's not likely if there's going to be a representative from a committee and he's going to maybe I don't know if he's going to have a counselor I have no idea the process that they're going through other than it's mostly As I believe in the town manager's hands so uh so that's my understanding yeah so the article I'm reading from the ammer current which may or may not be true is that the Tso and Council anticipate that public Outreach such as listening sessions about the proposed bylaw changes will be planned once responses to RFP have been received and reviewed I don't know what that means but say say that again Laura I'm sorry a little slower sorry he you but and it links to a TSO report so I can see if I can find the original language but what it says is the Tso and Council anticipate that public Outreach such as listening sessions about the proposed bylaw changes will be planned once responses to the RFP have been received and reviewed okay so that that just means that they're discussing the bylaw changes not the proposals themselves so they're not going to dis so the bylaw changes May reflect what the proposals are offering but that doesn't mean that they're reviewing the proposals themselves I I've been here a long time and we've it's never been a public process when we are going out to bid for something no I work the same way in the federal government there's a limited number of people who are allowed access to um yeah but what I'm saying is that I don't think the next step is the town manager accepts the bid right right I hear what you're saying yes yeah that's right yeah so yes I um but those are bylaw changes I do think though that there'll be some like there will be a Review Committee and they'll I think the bylaw changes would reflect who the ultimately the who the contract goes to and that would that would make sense but it doesn't mean that the town like the town won't choose the proposal first before the changes in the bylaw right I'm not that part of the process I'm not sure but it potentially they could the town manager could make that choice and then because of that selection that's what gets reflected in the changes in the bylaw yeah so I think something like this covers it all right we support your continued efforts and hope you will allow eak the eak to provide comment or review as any contract is being negotiated or bylaws developed does that make sense just that we'd like to be you know we'd like to see what's going on and maybe have an opportunity the right addresses would be Paul and the Town Council does everyone agree Stephanie does that seem right sure that's fine um sure that's if that's who you want to address it too that's fine so I think for something like this I'd like to you know get a have a have the support of eak I don't want to send this as a individual although I might but it's you know I I um I think it's important if we're going to send it as the eak that we have a vote on it so is there a move to go ahead and use this as is or are there further changes or do we think it's not worth sending uh Lori I would just um I think I would remove or review comment okay comment is fine just yeah there you go I will go ahead and move that the ecac uh endorsed this letter and ask the chair of ecac to send it on to town manager and councel is there a second I second thanks Andrew so now I will stop sharing as I think we need to do a vote oh great the share thing is hiding there it is thanks Lori um okay so in no particular order roof yes missing yes L yes Davis yes Tucker yes and goldner yes all right so I will take it from there somebody of um Andrew in the notes just make sure there's something about Lori will send this on to the or goldner will send this on so I don't forget um all right and back to the agenda if I can find it ah yes solar bylaw review response um Steve yes um I'm not sure what to say here versus in agenda item number six except I guess if this item was about me preparing something for ecac review I have to say I have not done that yeah okay um part of the reason is is that the Massachusetts legislature is moving again on the solar oh what is it called an enact an act forget the f s 2967 um which is the solar sighting uh so renewable energy infrastructure sighting includes renewable energy infrastructure citing reforms as well as a host of other things to update Mass massachusetts's um efforts to get renewable energy that is um been brought back I guess the house and the Senate leaders have agreed and it was supposed to get voted on by the Senate earlier today but it is delayed it may get voted on by the Senate tomorrow is what I hear and I haven't yet seen a good analysis of what's in the bill I've read bits and pieces of it it's really hard to understand because basically the bill that they're voting on is just a bunch of excerpts that say such and such of Mass general laws will be changed this will be added so you don't get a complete picture you just get the bits and pieces of it um anyhow that has the potential if it passes the to change up quite a bit the way um ground Mount solar projects can be reviewed by the towns and cities um I understand that the state rules would supersede the local rules on the other hand the state may take another year or two to actually develop the rules the specific rules once this law is passed anyway so that's up in the air and that so I do not have a um anything specific for ecac to work on in terms of what could we potentially do to increase Solar Development vment in and around town of All Sorts um I will keep thinking about that and try to come up with some ideas to bring back to ecac for discussion thanks Steve and and yeah that was pulling out your topic for later to give it a little time if it needed it um at the top of the schedule um the uh interesting to me that that uh Andre your hand let me just make one quick comment that that this is a second there's also um s293 something I forget what the renewable the big climate bill that everyone's been talking about and the sighting one is separate and it's all happening in the informal session at the last possible minute before it pretty much needs to go back to the drawing board uh for the new legislature so um it's a little disturbing that all this stuff got put off but good that it's happening um all right go ahead Andrew um I'm just wondering what effect this will have on our solar bylaw uh draft because like is will it be all you know moot or do we should we wait to finalize the bylaw until we get you know a sense of of where this is going that that came up last night at the CRC the community resource committee which is a subset of the Town Council um it came up but the sort of the consensus was well we don't know a if it's going to pass and be how long it would take for actual regulations to come forth that would change what the town regulations might be so the sense among CRC was to continue with their work which is to continue refining the draft solar bylaw and bring it forward to Town Council at some point it's probably still a couple of months I'm guessing in CRC before it will come to Town Council so um I guess just just not enough information about the state um what's happening at the state level to cause a change in plans in at the ammer level at the moment right interesting um so anything else on solar bylaw response I guess not much this is sort of to be put off for another day to see where things go right all right um all right and that nothing else we're on to education and Outreach um Don is not here today uh Tony is not here today heat pumps I don't have a whole lot else to say I um I don't think there's anything new is there anything should I Stephanie go ahead hi sorry um I actually do have an update from Tony even though he couldn't attend the meeting today um so he said that the operations manager at Elevate is interested in hosting a joint energy transition meeting uh with the ecac um or some kind of a panel or a conference or something in the spring and Tony is happy to be the point person for that effort okay and who was the person he said was interested in doing this the operations manager at Elevate manager at Elevate okay did he give a name no okay I can figure out who that is good um that sounds like interesting fun stuff to do and and useful there is um concern interestingly this is sort of not directly related um but it's good to have a little more contact with the university because there's been quite a lot of concern among um groups on campus sustainability groups on campus that the campus sustainability plan has sort of stalled lately a lot of things have sort of stalled under our new fearless leader um but uh there's been quite a bit of concern I don't know how much we don't hear about it much anymore and we don't hear about any updates um so that's a little concerning so it would be interesting to have more contact with the university just to get some input and to get some and perhaps apply some pressure to stay on top of things because they're such a big user I mean this they're the they're the biggest problem in amorist right they're the biggest polluter in amorist in many ways um so all right uh so that's good um so next on the agenda then um did you uh Stephanie did you have anything you wanted to add about heat pumps or do you want to do that later I can just do it later okay climate resilient schools um I do think we mentioned this last time but didn't we get a ride roll we got a notice about an upcoming Ride walk what is it ride roll to school um did we have something on that I thought I had something on that I don't remember what it was all right I don't have it handy so I'm going to skip that then um unless there's anyone else who knows anything about climate resilience schools and what's going on there there there was a ride to school event is it last week or two weeks ago in the amoris public schools that I understand was fairly popular among the school kids good thanks Steve for letting us know I knew there was something either coming up or just it was it was close and I just spaced it for this week so good um okay on to advisory and support um rental building efficiency bylaw anything more on that Steve only a little I just got earlier today actually after I was in another meeting just before this one I got an email message from the Equitable rental electrification learning group planning that's the E lgp I guess um this is something that I think Stephanie has also signed up for it's um basically a group of people that want to start exploring ideas for electrification of rental housing and affordability issues and it's basically just a collaborative group to try to um identify potential Solutions and have discussions so looks like they're going to try to have a meeting in schedule a meeting in November and December have monthly meetings through summer of 2025 so I will be looking forward to attending that next well in November and then reporting back to you all what sort of ideas I hear about that is fantastic and that was that group that I had also wanted to join but I got my my semester has gotten insane um I may still try to join if it's not too late because I will be quite free in the spring and next summer so um and so far as they're going to continue meeting by December I should have a lot of time to spend something like that um but that's great that you're doing that Steve so thank you and Stephanie too um so uh draft solar bioby cover Transportation Tony's not here but maybe this is the place where I should share the that Martha sent how about that what do you think good okay let me bring it up hang on a moment it will take me just a moment to get this um so uh we'll want to add this to the packet I guess um uh let's see hang on a minute there it is I think the important thing is this picture if I can find it it's either that one or this one I think it was this one traffic circles. PDF nope that's not it um somewhere there was a picture attempt plan that's probably it yes there it is okay so let me go ahead and share this uh let me let me open it in in something better than a browser give me a second uh de having a bit of trouble with my there we go yes okay good uh that will be easy to see sorry one more moment I'm getting there all right share come on okay so this is the plan I might as well just put this up because that makes it pretty clear and the traffic circles are where the stops I believe um wait does it show with the circles I'm pretty sure they're uh here here here and here but let me check the hang on a minute Main Street public entrance to the school school bus entrance to the school and college street so not this one this this traffic this this becomes a circle this can you guys see my pointer this becomes a circle yes that becomes a circle yeah and the this becomes a circle but not this one this is just a actually with the circle you don't need this one anymore so this goes away I suspect um you know right now the biggest problem is just that there's no place for bikes to go at all and it's a fairly there's just no no good place for bikes to ride and not so much on well on Southeast Street and also on Main Street and College Street um there's just no real access and the potholes uh and the pothole filling makes the margin of the road dangerous um I mean just repaving would be a big Improvement um I mean the problem that I had originally with circles was that you know where when do you stop so that people can can cross right especially as this is in elementary school when does the traffic stop right um but what seems to have happened on the UMass campus and those are fairly big relatively fast moving circles I think these might be a little slower um and smaller the smaller they are the slower people tend to go around them right um the way they put the crosswalks it's fairly easy to see somebody coming and to stop and it does stop traffic in the circle momentarily um but I haven't heard if there have been accidents or problems those those circles have been there now for maybe 10 years and I have not heard of accidents um so like I say it seems counterintuitive and I have ridden my bike through them many times and I don't find them particularly difficult to negotiate the one I find worse actually is the one on triangle Street um it's too crowded there's five five entrances I think one two oh yeah four at weird angles and uh it's it's uh I just about got killed there once when somebody just didn't I was in the circle on my bike and they didn't see me and kept going um and I slammed on the brakes and missed them by about an inch or they missed me by about an inch so it was uh you know it was a little hair raising but that's the only time I've ever had a problem and it wasn't with the ones that I think these are fairly square-ish this this one isn't but it's also a a bigger easier to negotiate Circle that one on triangle is really sort of crazy Lori I don't know if you can see but Laura has her hand up I'm sorry Laura go ahead no I didn't see that it's oh thanks Stephanie thanks Lori yeah I mean I think it is well within the role of eak to express support for making whatever traffic changes are made be as Walker and biker friendly as possible I don't know our new members very well but none of the rest of us are Traffic Engineers and this plan is made by Traffic Engineers and there's lots of data on roundabouts and they're if designed well can be quite supportive of pedestrian disability in bicycle traffic and also result in reduced emissions because um people driving slower there's less stopping and starting um and less traffic build up generally as a result of traffic circles so I wouldn't feel comfortable with eak making any com ments on the pros or cons of traffic circles I think we have a lot of status quo bias against them um just generally but I do think to your earlier Point Lori like anything we can do to support biking and walking we should and that may mean making sure that the roundabouts are designed in such a way that they do um right facilitate that as much as possible I mean you could imagine there being a a nice big wide bike path with a sidewalk next to it along this strip here right and that would bypass all the circles and and make it much easier and safer for everyone um except as you need to cross the street right and then that just has to be engineered correctly so I I don't I there should be a crosswalk person I mean not all the time but during school hours and anyway and yeah I do think we shouldn't waste this opportunity of dating this traffic pattern to improve bicycle and pedestrian safety and maybe writing a letter to that you know whatever they do there we understand this is the plan please make sure bicycles and pedestrians are front and center [Music] um yeah what what is the status this is you're showing the map and there was a memo associated with this is this something that has going out for a traffic analysis or is it come back and it's further along in the planning stage like how definite is the plan for these um traffic circles it hasn't been funded yet from what I can tell but this is this is the thing right here the Department of Public Works was asked to research options to address the impact of increased traffic flow on Southeast Street and neighboring roads because of the new school um because I think it's it's basically two it's double the traffic double the number of students right um the Department of Public Works with was asked let's see where is it blah blah blah is here to install four roundabouts at four intersections to allow for improved traffic flow along the corridor with a least impact to East common and adjacent properties so no bike path on the East common I guess the details of specific data used to reach this conclusion are included in the report inde dependencies titled Fort River Elementary School traffic Engineering Services final report by CDM Smith uh a little bit to the beginning of the letter is this from it's a recommendation from Paul to Town Council okay so he's asking Council to approve these changes as made by this CDM Smith traffic study Engineering Services report from July 202 okay in particular I think it's going to need funding yeah the concept design is approved I think he needs approval and then to contract them with uh with them they'll need funds funds will be needed to be appro pay for design well yeah I mean I find this very interesting um I want to be careful as part of ecac to figure out sort of whether and how ecac would might want to weigh in on it um and I'd want to probably do that in consultation with the transportation advisory committee sort of join help them it seems like it falls more squarely within that committee than within ours but we could help support it um but I'd love to learn more from them about it right I would agree um so do we have anybody who's attending Tac meetings these days thinking about it when are te meetings does anyone know off hand I don't off the top of my head but if you give me a minute I can find it okay thank wasn't Tony part of or intending to intersect with I think Transportation advisory committee yeah I think it might have been Tony yeah his name is next to the transportation update so okay yes that's a good clue so it might be worth I mean I could also reach out to the chair of teac and see what their thoughts on this are maybe I'll do that I can just I can do that right uh that doesn't that doesn't uh violate any that's totally fine okay good so let me write myself a note to do that and maybe maybe put in the minute somewhere that Lori will reach out to chair of TAC or goldner will reach out to chair of TAC regarding um supporting pedestrian and uh and bike traffic on Southeast Street by the new school is is that memo on the town website someplace I'm guessing not because I think it's from Paul to the Town Council so why should it be right um this this memo will be in the town council meeting packet oh right okay and do you happen to know if this report from the CDM Smith engineers is that Al is that some place on yeah it looks like we have to be well it says it's attached so it would be part of the packet as well okay thank you yeah you're welcome interesting to see all right I'll stop sharing now okay so um all right we have a plan there to do just to do some reach Outreach around that I am very glad that something is happening I just wish they would extend it around the corner on to pelum Road and put in something any rate um all right what else uh next anything else on Transportation Regional and state policy updates we've already heard a little bit I have a little bit more the climate bill as I sent I forwarded the announcement from Mass zero carbon I think zero carbon Mass um that the climate bill is not dead and might even be voted on sometime soon uh it has some interesting things in it that I didn't know about uh I didn't read a very extensive I didn't look at it yet but according to reports I've seen one thing that that struck me as interesting if nothing else is that you know Massachusetts has on the books we we are nuclear free we are a nuclear free zone there there will be no development of any nuclear plants in massachusett it's it's not apparently some years ago after they shut down um Pilgrim they just decided they weren't going to develop anymore or allow development anymore um however the new climate Bill allows us to buy nuclear energy from I think it's Seabrook is it in New Hampshire from New Hampshire and other places in New England which I thought was interesting so um we will have some nuclear in our portfolio again sometime soon I think I read something sorry laor to jump in but I think I also read something recently that there was another uh proposal um around Love Canal which I thought was kind of interesting for another nuclear facility so it's weird I just I think I was reading an article about how there seems to be like a new renewed interest in nuclear development so well there's a reason for that that I can explain um the the specific interest is in what are called small module reactors um which okay so so the the you know I can see both sides of this with with visceral feelings on both sides it's sort of interesting um on one side small modular reactors are sort of a cool idea they're they're small they're assembled in the factory there there are all sorts of improvements in passive safety so that they don't melt down quite as easily as Vermont Yankee might have um uh you know there are lots of improvements on the other hand um on the other hand the cynic and and anti-nuclear activist in me says that um they are just the latest attempt to uh you know big big nuclear plants didn't work so let's try small ones and and they are you know they can be as small as 5 megawatts whereas a normal nuclear reactor is about a gigawatt um and uh and you can use them locally for small Pro you know to run a small Factory you know to run a factory to run a they I think they were originally developed for uh things like submarines and have been now redeveloped and redeveloped and redeveloped and there there's nothing really Innovative about them except that they're small and uh there is a group at and the reason there're suddenly so much interest in these this is what I should have said first is that last summer the Biden Administration announced they were going to spend $900 million on the development of these things small modular reactors and the grants the call for Grants just opened last week so so there is renewed interest in small modular reactors all of a sudden and everybody wants in and there are a lot of startup companies including at least one at MIT that is trying to put them somewhere outside of the state and this is how I knew they weren't allowed in the state because they can't put them in the state um so that's why there is renewed interest in small modu reactors I've also read there was an article in the New York Times a few days ago um tech companies including Google and Microsoft and Amazon are also looking to I guess they're funding the development of these small nuclear potential power plants so they use them alongside their data centers um to help power artificial intelligence it's much worse than that um they're actually going to reopen Three Mile Island right Microsoft bought Three Mile Island right and will reopen it because of AI so this is why uh you know in my mind we we talk about AI at at UMass like it's some amazing thing that's going to change the world and every time somebody brings it up I remind them that every time you're using AI you are contributing to The Climate crisis in a really bad way because it's completely derailing our ability to do the energy transition you know um and I think I mentioned here once before that that Costa Rica uh which has a completely green grid had to open up an oil plant a couple years ago because of data because of a combination of new data centers that are drawing enormous amounts of power off their grid which are popping up all over Latin America uh because of cheap labor and cheap land and uh a drought so their Hydro wasn't at full capacity and the thing about nuclear is and this also folds nuclear in because the thing about nuclear is that it is the highest capacity you know you get the average nuclear plant works at 93% capacity all the time right the average gas plant I think is only 60% or something like that 0 maybe because because it has to go down for maintenance and the average solar and wind of course they're only 25 or 30 so one nuclear plant is like four of the others so if you need a lot of energy yeah there's going to be a lot of interest all of a sudden in nuclear go ahead Stephanie this is just a correction I had said love canel because I'm stuck in my you know 1970s environmental disastrous you know projects um I meant Three Mile Island so um so I just wanted to correct that but also I think I might have read the same article that Steve was referencing as well yeah it's not just that one they're talking about building new large reactors too yes which is you know you know it's it's a real it it it it turn it it it twists my my guts and Knots right because the physicist me knows that nuclear reactors the quickest way to get to get carbon out of I mean if we're if we're serious about trying to reduce carbon and and that's the overriding thing nuclear would help it would help fast but it's it's become it is it is terribly terribly dangerous in too many ways and it creates its own problems and we don't need it we don't need it so I don't know Stephanie your hands still up and then Andrew okay Andrew uh yeah I just uh wanted to bring up other countries uh approach to nuclear I think uh recent example I've seen is the approach that Germany and the approach that France took to nuclear power very Divergent approaches and France is maybe the most has the most reliability on nuclear and their carbon emissions are are much much less than Germany's which completely did away with their nuclear energy system um and you know when you this day and age we don't have enough capacity or anything we don't have enough renewable capacity to replace nuclear energy when we shut it down um I think more regionally uh New York shut down its nuclear energy uh the Indian Point Energy plant and uh they had to open up a lot new natural gas plants to replace that um so it's it's it's a difficult uh it's a difficult tradeoff um you're you're either going to build nuclear or you're going to build you know some amount of of fossil fuel plants because it's it's not easy to to switch on renewable energy um as we've seen in town it's hard to site solar arrays um it's probably easier to create well I don't know if it's easier to create small nuclear reactors um but uh it's you know you're you're increasing the chance of of fossil fuels if you completely ban nuclear energy um I agree we don't need it in an ideal world but I think um it's there's a lot of nuance I think to this discussion there is we do have I mean I want to be clear we have the capacity in Renewables we can do this right it's I mean Texas has virtually done it just by just by virtue of the fact that when there was a lot of money in putting in Wind plants um you know it's possible it just takes a lot of effort and and it takes a lot of desire and political will and uh the problem you know and there are and like I say I can speak passionately on either side of the nuclear uh question but I do think that uh you know theyve become such a a target for Terror and War um if that Indian Point you know if Fukushima happened at Indian Point Manhattan would be would be gone you know it's like it's I think if I remember right how far is Indian Point from Manhattan it's fairly close to the city isn't it think it's under a 100 miles under 100 so maybe not but it's usually a 30 mile a 20 mile 20 mile exclusion zone is what is going on at both Fukushima and and Chernobyl right now and it was larger at Fukushima to start with and smaller at Chernobyl interesting like um so you know it's it's right it's not good and depending on which ways the wind blows and and everything else it's it's just too close and then there's also the problem of more people will K were killed in the in the um evacuation of Japan around Fukushima than in the disaster itself many more um so it's you know if you could imagine when they when I was growing up they had shorum on Long Island if you could imagine trying to evacuate people you know from Long Island ain't gonna happen so it's just it's very problematic in many ways um but it's also something that you know could have saved the world 50 years ago maybe all right you might remember Lori there was a nuclear power plant um proposed for monague back in the 70s do you remember that no I wasn't here in the 70s yeah it was um actually it was one of the proposals and the opposition to it was one of the events that kind of kicked off The Big um Nationwide anti-nuclear movement you can look it up on Wikipedia or someplace but yeah up on the sand planes of monu there was some proposals I don't think they got very far but there were some proposals for uh oh wouldn't that be a great location for a nuclear power plant yeah uh Stephanie you have something yes I was going to say that I'm I'm going to digress a little bit I actually live not far from Vermont Yankee um so when we first moved to our house we used to get calendars annually and radiation pills so great when my kids were little we had a little stash of radiation pills kept very handy just in the event that we needed them which was kind of terrifying but um so but I was going to say you know there's one thing about developing these plants but the fact that we are allowing content for nuclear in our electricity Supply mix is also driving that development so I think if the state were really to take a stand then the state would not allow that content and it exists now I know for sure you know it exists in our um utility um package so okay I just think that's you know the the you know to me part of that is you know getting the advocacy could be really to sort of getting the state to also not include that as part of our energy Supply yeah if we were going to go down that for a while the state was including biomass is part of renewable energy and after protests that was eliminated yeah it's a good one Stephanie if people are opposed to nuclear that we should tell the state we don't want it in our Energy Mix whether if it comes out of state yeah oh sorry go ahead yeah there is a difference there right biomass really is not a CO2 sa at all it's it's just a lie and and nuclear is but it has other issues that that many people consider just overriding and um and I understand that and I you know I I don't know what to think these days honestly there are places that really want nuclear in the South there are lots of nuclear plants and they're putting in new ones if they want it and that's how they're going to clean up their grid I'm not going to tell them to stop you know just um but I I you know it's not something we need to do it's absolutely not something we need to do any rate um just to just I mean I don't think eak is gonna solve this problem but um so we can move on but I to Stephanie's point I mean I do think it's hypocritical for us to buy nuclear and have it be produced in other people's backyards if we're not willing to put it in our own backyard exactly um I also think to Andrew's point that if we are going to be fighting tooth and nail against solar and transmission line increases and other things that we need it's very difficult to see how we get there without without things like Nuclear So it's there you know we as humans have impacts on the environment and I think we have to figure out how we're minimizing those as much as possible um yeah in the most to istic way possible so I don't have a good answer to this one other than AI just building nuclear for AI is definitely not the answer and that's what's that that is really horrible um okay so the only other Regional and state thing I had was that the first light I I really haven't quite I haven't gone to any of these meetings but I really would like to at some point there appears to be quite a lot of from the note that I got from Joe comford and sent to everyone on eak um I can I can post it but I think we're I I don't know if I bring it up I can just summarize she's been sending updates on what's going on with the first light relicensing um this is involving the the giant hydroelectric battery that lives on top of Northfield mountain and the Turner Falls hydroelectric plant um and there has from her notes I infer that there has been quite a lot of um of uh of push back on relicensing which is astounding to me because you know yes these things both have environmental impacts everything has an environmental impact but I don't think you can do better than hydroelectric with a water battery storage system right I mean they they literally pump water up the mountain and let let it come down to fill in you know when they need when when the solar isn't working or the wind isn't working we have this giant hydroelectric battery um or storage system uh so now it seems that from her last note the issues have come down to water um Clean Water Act clean water issues um which is fine I mean I'm not if there are rules that should be followed they should be followed we should do the least damage we possibly can um but I hope this thing isn't a danger of being not relicensed so I really would like to show up at one of the upcoming meetings and if any of you can if you hear of one of these meetings and you can go please go and let your voice be heard or if there's a call for input on some website let's let's make sure we all do it um because this is what we need you know it's unfortunate that we had to take a mountain and turn it into a storage facility but as as environmental impacts go that's that's one of the better options um so I don't know I don't know what else to say about that uh if there's nothing else Regional and state we can go to anyone else have any other Regional or State updates all right staff updates you're on Stephanie sure um very quick ones tonight um so I've been working on the Energy Efficiency Community block grant funding that the that I think I've been talking to you about for quite some time we got $76,500 uh allocated to the town we didn't have to apply for it we were just basically I mean I have to apply only through a voucher but I we don't have to actually apply to get funds we're kind of allocated the funds so we're going to be using it to purchase um an electric truck for the facilities department and I think the facilities now is all I don't know how many vehicles they have I'm sorry I don't know off the top of my head it's not a lot but um they're going to be all electric so that's kind of exciting um and also uh the police department is looking to install um charging EV charging so that they can transition vehicles to all electric which I cannot tell you how happy this makes me when department heads call me and want to talk about this stuff um so we're probably going to try to use some of the funds because we are the cost of the vehicle itself doesn't utilize all the funds so I'm going to try to get an Associated charging station but we would install that at the police department which is where the police department is wanting it um and then we're going to I reached out to the fire department we might be able to get a dual head um charging unit for there as well I don't know for sure that I'll have the information I need to to get theirs but I think we'll be successful at least with the vehicle and the charging station behind APD so that's kind of exciting um because I'm realizing you know we have a lot of a fair I won't say a lot but we have a fair amount of EV charging infrastructure in ammer I've been to other communities and I have to say for a smaller town we're doing pretty well um we have 14 ports and we're about to have um 16 soon with the two EV charging stations that'll go in um the fast charging stations that are going in in a CVS lot that is moving forward we have till December 31st I think if we need an extension we can ask for it but we're really trying very hard not to have to request that so that we can get those in um I'd really love to get that off my plate uh and then the other thing that I was working on is um I'm trying to think of the other thing that was timely uh the um the uh electric bikes the Valley bikes um so part of the problem with the station that we had um in front of town hall was that it was uh kind of rusty and old the equipment wasn't in great shape and drop Mobility has new equipment that going to be rolling out but we can't roll out a drop Mobility station when all the other equipment in town is Ban equipment it won't really work so um it turns out that they do have some Bean equipment that they may be able to pull together a station um that we can install at least until we start that transition to Olive drop Mobility bikes so that's kind of exciting I don't know exactly when that's going to happen but hopefully sooner than later so um at least I'm hoping by the spring we should have the station in front of town hall again um so I think that's it I don't know if I had another update any more any more updates on the heat pump RFB just it's um they're just developing some the Outreach uh as I said we are looking for one to three households to be pilot cases so again if folks know of people I don't know if we'll actually be putting something out um and but I mean I'm just starting with this group because you all are pretty connected to folks in the community especially those that are maybe interested in installing heat pumps if they haven't already so if people are willing to be a test case uh we need one to three households so you could just let me know send them my way and I can connect them with c yeah and I found that note this morning and I totally forgot to follow up on it so I'm going to follow up on it as soon as we're done today I want to ask um what um do they need to have no heat pumps currently in the house are there any other requirements do they need to be low income is there anything else it's just pilot program doesn't matter um I I think pilot program it doesn't really matter I mean ideally we would would love to have low-income households to start with that would be great um but it's not I don't think it's an absolute necessity if there is someone a household that's willing to do this because you know basically they're going to be the test case right so they have to know that it's going to be slow it might be clunky and how this all moves you know through the process so they just we're going to need folks that are going to be patient so I don't think it absolutely has to be a low-income household but that is preferable okay I definitely have a couple groups I can write to so I will make sure I do that uh today and if anyone else has a neighborhood association or you know anyone you can reach out to um or if you don't have any heat pumps yourself and you you want to put heat pumps in um that would be great could I ask um or maybe not it's a question but it's a um something I hadn't thought about but before I was talking to the um ammer College sustainability director a while back and he mentioned kind of like some of the CH they're they're having a bit of a challenge where they don't have any EV Chargers in the student parking lots and there's a couple students that have EVS that can't charge their cars and I just think it's an interesting unique problem in Amherst with three universities and as more EVS become available on the resale market and you know there are you know I think we're going to see more students with EVS hopefully like we want to see that um but how to organize charger charging that aligns with student behavior and needs I don't know just throwing that out there is something that may be worth seeing if the colleges are talking about it or what we would do if anything about that I can I can say at Hampshire College there's been some talk of assigning on or working with some companies that would provide EV Chargers essentially free of charge for the installation funded by state grants I believe I'm not entirely clear um and then they would be operated um the software to control them would come from a company and they would take a slight charge per kwh that goes through the Chargers um so people would would have to pay that plus whatever Hampshire College wanted to charge for it but it was surprising that that seemingly the the this company would come in and do all the logistics and planning and installation for almost no cost to the college um if other institutions want to know more about that I can go look up the details and Laura I could chat with Wes about that at am College if he was interested sounds good thanks Steve I see Laura nodding her head all right um anything else staff updates uh no I think that's pretty much all I had at the top of my head okay eak member updates actually I was just sorry I was curious Stephanie the Chargers that the town sort of has management over is there statistics on their usage uh you know I I've asked but I have not gotten that information so I so I had gotten the funding secured the funding got it all set up originally things were in my name and then I handed it all over because the financial management of that was sort of out of my hands and I didn't want it either so so all of that um you know so others have more of the access to the data now and I've asked several times and I've been told oh yes we'll make sure you have access but I haven't yet so I will ask again it's all I can do yeah I'm not sure what it would tell us or what would be looking for in the data I'm just sort of curious you know what sort what capacity however you measure capacity of use what capacity they're seeing yeah I can tell you just I mean my own observation of behind Town Hall here since they've been installed I mean for years there was you know for a while and definitely a few years very little usage you know other than that you know the town had a vehicle that we you know we purchased the unit with an association with an electric vehicle um and there was very little usage and now the unit in back of town hall almost there's almost always two vehicles there on most days you know I I'm one of them I will I will admit that I'm one of them but um I can tell you that more staff has electric vehicles or or plug-in hybrid so there's definitely you know there's starting to show up more like there have been days where I've gone to I've had to go to two or three locations to find an available Port so doesn't happen often but it has happened is um parking time limited there are you supposed to only park for a few hours or half a day four hours four hours limited to four hours yep okay yeah and that's part of a charging um system you you you pay for the charge yes is that one of the commercial ones like charge Point charge point right so you yeah we all of our units in town uh the commercial ones are charge point so the ones that I was just talking about that I'm trying to secure for the municipal Vehicles obviously would not be commercial units they'd be only for municipal vehicle use right um but the ones that are the charge for a commercial and there's a fee associated with using the power but also you pay for the parking spot as well yeah but it's still pretty low right now our um rate I think is 20 cents per kwh so it's pretty low and that is likely to change unfortunately I hate to be the bearer of bad news but I think the rates are going to increase well it's getting to be winter they always increase in the winter and and that rate is that decided by the town is that a decision the town makes what the rate is yes okay okay any other any any member updates oh I know I I I had a question Stephanie I'm trying to remember exactly what I wanted to ask but it had to do with the Valley Green energy and whether you knew if the town for the electrical accounts that the town has control over do you know if they are opting for the 100% renewable option we are not um the town I know the town is using uh Constellation Energy I think is our okay yeah for provider um they there's a special rate through the mass Municipal Association so a lot of municipalities actually have been using constellation um however I I will say that I we didn't go for the 100% green content because of the price but I was able to advocate for us going for more Greener content which we did oh through constellation yes yeah so I'm sorry to say it's not 100% but it is more than we were doing so I was just happy for that little victory yeah that's that's the same at Hampshire College we have two big accounts with with um independent suppliers for the main campus but then the college owns various smaller accounts residents um those should be should have been transitioned to the Valley Green energy program and I'm advocating to see if we can up to the 100% renewable cuz it's a pretty good deal you're not paying a whole lot more and you're getting 100% renewable in Massachusetts class one Rex um and I think for us we calculated it would cost like the college $7,000 more but then on the other hand we're spending about 7,000 bucks to buy Rex for the electricity that's not covered that's not considered renewable and those are just cheap wind reck from the Midwest so it would be much better overall if we went with a 100% Valley Green energy but we'll see haven't haven't heard back from the finance people yet Y and then I guess another part of my question is is the town working or is Valley Green energy working with some of the other larger um businesses and energy users to encourage them to consider the 100% is that part of the Outreach of the valy green energy program it probably will be it's not right now I'm you know we're we definitely want to encourage businesses to you know to sign on if they haven't um but you know right now it's anyone that's on basic service anybody that's on basic service was automatically opted in yeah y good good good thank you any other updates okay one cute thing that that I had happened this month I got Berkshire gas called me and emailed me I think they texted me and emailed me because they were concerned that my gas usage had changed dramatically because it was zero this month for the first time I think in my life I've in a house that used absolutely no fossil fuels for a month so heat pump hot water solar assisted heat pump water heater went in a month ago and I had to call gas and assure them that this was exactly as expected I had the same thing happen to me when I installed my heat pump hot water heater it was a nice conversation to have exactly so anyway um all right let's see back to the not to back to the thing I think we have items for the agenda items for the next meeting there are no other updates um I think we had a couple along the way we definitely want to follow up on the transportation um what to do about I'll I'll try reaching out to the chair and get back people on that so that should be on there somewhere um can have my name next to it as as well as um Tony's um and then the uh solar bylaw response of course stays on and there was one other thing wasn't there we talked about traffic circles so I don't know if we want to follow up on that with a what were we going to do on that we were going to do something following up with uh letter of support perhaps oh that's right I'm going to do Tac and then we'll follow up with it never mind um I'll reach out to tack um follow up on the well that can be part of the uh member updates or or uh group coordination if Tony's here to talk about the um plans for the spring with Elevate and was there anything else anyone can think of that's off the usual different from the usual solar efficiency uh solar bylaw should certainly be on there again keep track of what's going on there see if we need to write something yeah you got that you mentioned that so it's on here okay all right so if there's nothing else that folks can think about the next thing we do is go back to public comment right I'm gonna let Martha in Martha you can go ahead and unmute hello again I have a little more information about the review process for the traffic circles District 5 had a district meeting last evening and that was one of the subjects they talked about so it's gone to the TSO Committee of the council for review and they are also then going to be seeking alternative uh proposals or suggestions etc etc uh and you know for example instead of four traffic circles maybe two or um something or uh look looking at alternate things too so that's going to go on for a while I expect before that gets uh resolved and I would say that one of the biggest concerns about traffic circles is the impact on people with disabilities either mobility issues or visual impairment I mean I really don't think that guide dogs are too good at uh you know navigating all the uh pieces of a traic a circle and so on and so the our Town's disability committee has been quite concerned and there's a memo that I've uh received that Lau Al forward to you that they wrote concerning that the uh traffic circle at triangle they say is just a barrier for people with disabilities to come from from the north ammer uh you know walking uh to down town and so they're quite concerned U and that may really I think is one of the biggest objections uh to the traffic circles and I also would be concerned about children I mean it's one thing for a mobile adult or an adult on a bicycle to be able to you know understand the different directions that traffic is coming and and so on but for children coming to school um I mean I would have a big concern if I had a young kid going to the the elementary school so that's a concern um but let's see and and I would like to I gave some thought the intersection of Route nine there and Southeast Street I go through there every day and I consider that to be a very safe intersection for both vehicles and um pedestrians because it has left turn lanes and left turn arrows goes for every one of the four directions as it goes through the cycle and then it has a pedestrian um setup where you know if you push the pedestrian light all traffic in all four directions stops and so it's very safe for anybody children people with Mobility or visual uh disabilities and so on so I consider that sort of the ideal design of a intersection and very hopeful that they don't try to destroy that with a traffic circle because I I feel that one is a very safe uh you know if it's not broke don't fix it or something whereas maybe the others I think the one the Main Street uh and and East Street intersection is is a real concern and so uh I would encourage anybody who has thoughts like on how to make it safer for bicycles or anything else uh to uh chat either with your representative or send uh letters to the TSO Committee of the council so that's my thoughts on that one and Al then I I could say that it was my understanding from last night's uh District 5 meeting that the waste huler um RFP has not yet gone out that they were planning to hire a consultant to prepare the RFP um that was what I understood so don't know if it's correct but if if so you know then you know the ecac could consider whether you have any specific points that really ought to be considered any any things that re that you feel really honestly ought to be in the contract or um you know if if so or or certain questions that you feel would be important for the review you know General things like that it might be appropriate to um prepare those now so okay thank you thanks Martha as always any other comments I was just looking back at the draft letter and we could Wordsmith it a bit but I think it probably says what it needs to say and they'll get the idea if the RFP has not gone out yet you might be right about that Martha was not completely clear from Liz's uh presentation um Lynn's presentation rather to District whatever District I'm in District Two I forget um any other comments if not I think we can adjourn this meeting should probably make a motion oh yeah is there a motion to adjourn motion Andrew second seconded all right I'll see you next two weeks bye all thank you by