##VIDEO ID:3## one okay um so everyone is here uh I am opening at 6:35 PM uh August 5th this meeting of the ammer uh historical commission um I'm going to read our Preamble here uh pursuant to Governor Baker's March 12th 2020 order uh suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law uh extended by chapter 22 of the acts of 2022 and extended again on July 14th 22nd and signed into law on July 16 20 22nd 20 sorry 2022 this public meeting of the town of hammer historical commission is being connected via remote participation members of the public who wish to access the meeting May do so via Zoom or by telephone no in-person attendance of members of the public will be permitted but every effort will be made to ensure that the public can adequately access the proceedings in real time by a technological means a hyperlink to the hearing has been posted on the town's online calendar okay and so uh to start our meeting our first agenda item is announcements uh Nate Jinta any announcements from the town uh I don't think so no I don't have any okay um on September I believe it's September 27th is the um preservation Mass I think if they're by annual they have a meeting preservation meeting uh once every two years so if people wanted to Google that see if it's any interest to them it's happening in Worcester this year um next item uh unless anybody else has any announcements they want to share feel free to just speak up no okay uh next item uh number two is review and approve minutes this is a new thing for us uh I'm assuming that we're thanking Jinta for taking excellent minutes or proceedings um so what what Nate I'm just to what um how do you suggest we go about uh making suggest questions I mean I know that there are like um I mean the things that I noticed were mostly name issues um I had one small substitute comment on the the June June me meeting minutes but um I didn't get fully through them should we send our if they're small should we just send our updates to you guys within a day or so yeah I think if you want to send them out I think we sent in a Word document if anyone wants to track change it or make comments we could bring them back I mean in other boards and committees essentially once you know if people agree by consensus we just consider them complete and then you know but if you're willing to you know look at them we could bring them back on the 22nd just for a quick a quick uh vote but you know I different boards do different things I know the planning board really reviews them and votes them others just agree by consensus that when these changes are done they're ready to go to be made public so I'm okay with the lad okay um so what do meeting members think do want to um table them for the next meeting giving everybody an opportunity to mark them up yep I'm seeing two yeah that sounds good okay all right that's great so yeah just uh within the next couple of days track changes for anything on there and send them off to Nate and Jinta and then we'll reintroduce them at the next meeting and then we'll just get into habit of doing that when they I wasn't expecting them this meeting so I was a little un prepared um of making maybe making those track changes before we meet and then we can review them real quickly okay um agenda item number three is review and approve the preservation restriction agreement with the ammer Women's Club um Nate do you want to introduce us to that yeah I mean it's really similar to The Jones Library restriction the commission entered into although it's uh not being you know approved by the Massachusetts historical commission so you know we're writing it as if it's a um you know is kind of like a permanent restriction you know has all the um you know all the sections of a regular restriction it's not like we changed it it uses the same exhibit in terms of defining major or minor alterations uh and then you know it runs with the property and so as part of our CPA Grant with any with the Women's Club and well this is kind of a similar format we'll see with probably a number of other properties um it'll you know just it's a local restriction it'll be recorded at the registry against their deed uh and then um you know we withhold some amount of funding uh until it's recorded and approved so right now I think I don't know if it's like 5% we have right now 10% of the project and so they they're they're finished with the project I think they're actually anxious to uh to get their final payment out and um you know they completed it included the exhibits U mostly from uh inventory forms but you I emailed the town attorney the other week and just said you know one if there's any other issues I haven't heard back but you know they had reviewed it a while ago when we set up this template so I mean I think it's ready commission members have to come in and sign it and probably provide your license and then we could do it down with the clerk or upstairs but to get it not sign signatures notorized um and I mean that's I think that's about about it uh you know I mean if there's any questions about the you know the actual restriction it's you know the property has to be maintained as it is you know they can't do certain demolition to the property uh any changes have to be approved so if they're you know doing another addition that' be considered a major alter and so we'd review it similar to what we've done with the Jones library and hold the hearing um yeah yeah yeah so um the so the basic um the basic structure of it is that it is we don't have a regular year-to-year interaction with them um they know that they're supposed to notify us of any changes obviously in pretty public spot you probably noticed something pretty significant going on I did look at it but I mean it's a long legal document I don't remember if I saw is there a provision for and again just because this is going to be a template and I would assume this would be something that would be in a provision for you know what happens if you know they take something down like you know anybody with the preservation is there a um a penalty or like an enforcement clause for any any activity that goes on without proper notice that doesn't meet the standards there is um and then you know the town's been you know say working with a Building Commissioner we could enforce something I mean typically in terms of a remedy we would you know we'd have to send a letter could have to hold a hearing they'd have to respond within a certain time frame and then it you know gets to a point where we'd have to have some resolution I mean unlike other properties the Women's Club does have a covenant on it is my understanding that they have to maintain it almost as is when they acquired it in 19 like 26 and so you know some private entities a restriction might be really new or unique to them but I think they're familiar with how to maintain the property so I don't you know I don't see I mean not that they won't propose changes possibly in the future but you know I think they've been maintaining it you know pretty carefully for for a long time yeah again it was more a question less a question about them and more a question about like what the general um you know what the general structure is for a penalty if changes are made without as changes are made either without you know that go against the standards without notification right I mean that's really kind of the question I guess I'll say it for um you know we have we have we have a new pering software and maybe Justa we could look into we've talked about this for um affordable housing um restrictions but maybe for preservation restrictions we could try to get it on the permitting software so any kind of permit gets flagged uh so like local historic district acts that way any any any permit has to be reviewed by staff um and so we could try to set that up we don't have a lot of preservation restrictions if there's some way to catch that okay so you have to apply for a building permit or an electrical permit or plumbing permit it just gets right right um okay so yeah I mean I had to go back to this again but like were there a change outside of I mean you know there's there's a stop work order on the house around the corner for me where a change do happen outside the permitting process I guess that's my again and this is really just an academic question it doesn't have to do so much with this preservation restriction but because we're in the business of this and it was a long legal document you know let's say you know entity X removes their historic porch you you know it is does this restriction function to enforce that the uh historic apprach is um returned you know either a replica or if the materials are still there you know to return to its original condition I guess that was my question it it requires that okay okay does anybody else have questions about preservation restriction okay and we've been through the um reviewing the um changes for the Jones Library so everybody understands the role of the historical Commission in um in in Guess The Word Is enforcing or um um the Restriction itself when changes are up so um so do what do you need anything else from us do we need to have a vote yeah I mean we need to vote um you know I know for instance you know I would if we if we think it's good and we vote it you know I would try to get the last payment going for the Women's Club okay even before it's recorded just knowing that it's in process um they did print it double-sided the document okay we need it single-sided to go to the registry so there's right you know but um yeah like I said I mean I've I've worked with the town attorney on a few of these now and I sent them to a few different I think like South Church for instance has one and the jca has one y and they I mean you know a lot of this is going to be really similar language there may be a few conditions or you know some changes but this template is will be followed pretty closely okay so if there aren't any other questions um I'm going to use a trick I learned in another meaning which is to say the chair would entertain a motion to approve the preservation restriction agreement with the amers Women's Club at which point anyone in my commission here could say so moved if they chose to so moved d right so we have a motion do we have a second second second uh so we have a motion to and uh approve the preservation restriction with the amoris Women's Club we'll have a roll call vote uh I'll start with matal and Helmer yes Pat o uh yes Antonia brenberg yes py stard up yes Michaela Ras yes and I Robin forab also vote Yes so that is how many of us are here today it's all of us right six six to zero motion passes okay um next up next steps with uh Wildwood Cemetery I see Rebecca Frick is in the audience if we could uh I'm assuming she's here to present I don't know if she's here to present I you know I actually I put this on there just so we don't lose lose you know track of it I think that um you know after looking at what they um Rebecca what the commission looked at last time there's still you know documentation and other things that could happen there and I think at one point we had talked about you know would a commissioner or two volunteer I it could be a subcommittee it could be just like ad hoc where people are willing to go and maybe take some pictures um do we wantan to invite Rebecca in for a discussion yeah okay Becca you'll be asked to join as a uh Jinta could you do that ask her to rejoin as a panelist to bring her in yeah I just added her as a panelist she should be joining us shortly great and Rebecca you're muted so feel free to unmute yourself there we go now I can should be able to hear you okay see you hi Rebecca welcome hi and I just missed everything Nate said because it was spinning to let me in so okay I think I was saying I I don't know if you NE have a presentation I said I put this on there I'd like to just keep this kind of you know in the Forefront of the commission's discussion and if there's you know at one point we said there could be more documentation of the cemetery it could just be you know volunteer hours to take pictures of monuments or certain things just to um I'm anticipating that mass historic would ask for some of that and would be nice to have so I mean that's all it wasn't you know necessarily like oh I'm not expecting a a big Pres presentation or anything but yeah just an update essentially and I know Rebecca I think last time I directed you to um send an inquiry to Ben Haley um at MHC and I was curious if you had done that and if you had heard anything back no I was I thought Nate was gonna introduce me to him but I can I can write to him directly okay all right I mean I can do that after the meeting tonight I can uh uh connect us by email and then you uh can can submit the Form B to him and they'll give you feedback and take it from there okay um it was my impression that they didn't want too many photos but I can certainly add more yeah I think the at this point um my understanding would be that the next thing uh to do would be to start the process with MHC to have them direct us to what they actually want um to for us to include in the it's not a Form B I can't remember what what form it is Cemetery form yeah right so um that's probably the best uh the best way to go but um also I know Rebecca when you and I met that um you know you have a a tremendous amount of um I think um plot documenting to do there and I just wanted to open up the opportunity for anybody here to connect with you if they were interested in doing some volunteer work uh or if you had that if you have the the capacity for that um we can just have a here yeah I'm now completely caught up on that I need what I haven't caught up on is documenting All The Monuments okay um so at during Co I had somebody who was interested in photography and they did a beautiful job for several of the sections so I'll always I'll always take help with that yeah okay okay so um if anybody is interested um Rebecca do you want to let's see can you put your uh trying to figure out how to use the chat here I was gonna say you could put your um you could put your email in the chat or I could actually just you want to just um why don't you give it to me right now and I'll send it to folks after the meeting and they can be in touch with you if they have any volunte it's amer. Cemetery Verizon net okay okay so I'm gonna wait for Robin for you to introduce me to this person and I'll send them what I have and I I was curious um Nate you this is going off topic a little bit but you were talking about giving the final payment to the Women's Club so uh our roof project is complete so you ask me for photos but I also need to do some sort of write up is there some example of what I need to do for that yeah I mean the uh Women's Club just used the description in the on the Form B and so I think for the um for The Farmhouse there i' have to look and see if it was inv may not have an inventory form which I think was some of it so you know we're looking for usually it's an architectural description just uh describing the style of the house house um you know the images will be really helpful I mean really it's to understand what it looks like and then you know so that way if there's any changes we would note it so um okay it just has to be a paragraph or two yeah um I don't want to um volunteer her uh let make her own decision but meline I don't I don't know if you could do a quick architectural description for them uh you're well trained in that regard yeah [Music] um yeah we can be in touch about that I think that something I can help with okay that would be great because I think there is a Form B and it has hardly anything written on it yeah I think yeah meline that would be great because I'm not used to writing in that style uh yeah yeah we can be in touch about right just I can kind of interpret what you what you okay great great all right well thank you for for joining us and um we'll probably just we'll be keeping this as I think as an agenda item going forward just for updates you know and if um you know for some reason the day before the meeting there's no update you know you don't need need to feel the need to you just shoot us an email let us know that there's nothing new to report but hopefully we'll have a little bit more information next month all right thank you okay thank you yeah sorry I thought I had emailed I know I looked up Ben after the meeting I thought I had an email going I guess I just never sent it um and then mine the inventory form right is from the 80s and it just has like a pretty short paragraph about the house but it has been inventory it just was never updated or you know but I think we could take from that yeah and that I mean if Mana can do the architectural description um I can work on the um updating the historical narrative or we both can or you know it's always I feel like it's would be good for us to commit to updating our form when we have outdated forms like that to committing them when projects come before us so I'll put that on our list too okay great yeah just follow up with me about that Robin yeah yeah I will email after the meeting okay um agenda item number five uh discuss possible CPA proposals due in September what do you the CPA process I mean last year I don't know Robin if any of the CPA committees met recently but I think it was just to discuss the track but last year CPA proposals were due at the end of September right I think they were due yeah I think they open in the beginning of September and close December y yeah and then the committee you know the cbaa committee discusses it over um you know November December and tries to vote by the end of the year so the commission has any ideas for projects you know we've talked about um trying to get you know either a survey plan going but if there's anything else that's Project Specific um there might also be that outside entities come before the Commission in the next few months and ask you know ask for review or you know specifically we might recommend or review certain projects but I was just putting out there I feel like you know September is earlier than it had been I mean it was that way last year but previously proposals weren't due until December and so the schedule shifted and yeah a few years ago it shift shifted and now it's really um a big push to you know our our last meeting is scheduled for December 19th but we're hoping not to have it go that long yeah or you know even like in the um have you heard from anybody who's you know any ideas anybody who's interested anything no but you know the new preservation plan I wasn't sure if there's anything we'd want to work on there um you know for instance last year the local historic district commission put forward a proposal to study East amoris for a local historic district and the CPA funding is hopefully going to get you know 50 to 70 properties inventoried with new forms and so you know most of those forms are in the new word document with some you know some information completed about the idea is to hire a consultant to really generate those forms and look at a local historic district there um is that um G out to bid uh I it will this week okay yeah we're just seeking quotes for that and uh you know I mean you know if there's any studies that need to be done or if there's any physical projects I mean the town might come forward with something for some of the buildings but you know I haven't actually heard I feel like it's I think people are still in summer mode and not thinking that CPA proposals will be due in six weeks or eight weeks or whatever it is um so generally the historical commission puts forward things like survey plans or or you know or survey sorry surveys um I mean I I keep thinking of uh surveying um the surveying of midcentury or modern more amous modernist buildings or maybe some of the um uh housing developments that you know are kind of from from my youth or not earlier I guess earlier than my youth but you know um trying to figure out when uh the more kind of planned housing developments will start to come start we should start to think about um surveying them um but I don't know I don't nothing nothing Springs immediately to mind um yeah I mean someone did inquire with a town about the Frankl W house a few weeks ago and I said that's not really it's private you know and I said you know you could look it up you know we don't I mean whatever information is available in terms of contact I don't have you know a personal email address to give out but yeah made me it made me think about like mid-century modern and you know could we identify 30 Properties or something that um might be worth a proposal to get inventoried just because I don't think they ever were right so when the town did the bulk of inventory work in the late 80s through the 90s they just weren't of that age yet and I think they were overlooked and so yeah I mean um that's my project I'm sort of spearheading and I've started it I have a list going and I've been um yeah if that's something we're interested in I know it's on the agenda for later in this meeting to talk about but yeah I mean the question is whether it would go off so so we have kind of two options for getting inventory done one is volunteer through the commission and the other is um getting CPI funds to hire a consultant right those are essentially the two Avenues so right now meline uh and I think KY and I had kind of identified that as an area of Interest um for our volunteer work um that said yeah no I think it's like it's good to just assemble the list and yeah right and then right I think it might be good to right to have a consultant actually um right research them goad a really good um report that was done for cap C on modernist housing by my mentor um Virginia Adams who works for the PB pet archaeology lab or Pal and that's um extremely extensive and it covers most of the modernist Architects working at the GSD at Harvard or Yale um all building houses on the cape and um it's really readable and I think you know it would be very nice to be able to offer people who are interested in the be house on Chase Road something else that could sort of stand in for you know hey but you can't go visit the Frank L right house because it's private but here look at all of these other you know 50s and 60s modernist houses that were built in amist on Redgate lane or wherever you want to pick um I think that would be a really a really great contribution to our architectural significance in town actually so um if we wanted to pursue a CPA application um would that be something Nate that one of us would write the um like a CPA CPA application for yeah I think staff could help right I mean we it's an online form and you know we could just set up a Word document and and work on it but I think yeah I mean if we're you know if we think this is something worthwhile you know do we say it's you know 25,000 I'm not sure what a number is but you know Robin if you have a list or meline and say okay we're thinking about so many structures and here's you know I think an inventory form and then if we want like some other summary information the deliverables what they would be yeah I think that you know um the CPA committee likes to know you know why is it important to the community or this significant to the history of the town is it threatened you know and I think there's you know there's staff could help respond to some of those but yeah I mean I think that's a worthwhile project actually too um mine do you w to work on prepping that it's a pretty straightforward form it's not a ton of work um for and deadline at the end of September is that right yep so basically like a draft by the time we get to next meeting yeah sure I think it it is interesting to think about whether we want to pursue this as individual um right I mean it just yeah I guess it it's worthwhile to enhance our sort of what our knowledge of Emmer's sort of architecture by adding these 20th century buildings to macis um individually I think it it is also kind of interesting also to maybe consider right this sort of the history of the housing and I think it part of this could be um like a a historic context that really um in detail documents the movements of sort of housing development in town um and that would just contextualize all these what we're actually looking at yeah that could be um and I see Pat you have your hand up but that could be part I mean that could you could throw that into the draft and as you know as part of the proposal to ask but it it is funny yeah it's I don't know if these buildings are threatened or if there's this yeah I think well I mean one of the things that I understood for my my summer internship was that one of our responsibilities is to basically build our inventory so just inventorying these houses which are historically relevant is um sort of a charge of the commission so that alone yeah is exactly yeah yeah say they could be threaten just the way we changed our bylaw and just you know if building techniques have changed you know say flat roofs like what's happening I mean CPA is really about right the historic preservation piece and I think we can make make the case there and then if we if we would like to get a little bit more out of it we can include that in the proposal and then if we ever want to make this say part of like another you know like modern house tour or something that lives online I mean that may be you know staff in the commission not necessarily funded by CPA kind of like the writers walk but you know I'm envisioning that this could become other things uh good for economic stuff tourism but you know for CPA purposes it's historic uh preservation uh you know there's that's well I there's language in there about you know and I'm sorry Pat still has your hand language in there about uh you know that that uh CPA funds can be used for plans that um that help the it basically help the T Town manage its historic inventory like that that's an okay allowable use so like you know in order to be able to deal with a house that comes before you in demolition delay really helps to have an inventory form that's right we have to know what's here and sort of how rare each yeah yeah each building is you know where it fits within in the sort of context okay Pat go ahead well I I actually was going to introduce the the concept that meline introduced about the historic context because I I have some awareness that many of the modernist housing was built as UMass grew and neighborhoods grew to accommodate the growth of of the staff and faculty there and I think that's that's a historical context as well as the who the developers were um because I think certain neighborhoods had the same developers and consistent architect uh uh you know designing the houses so mine thank you that that was kind of where I was coming from and I I know the Frank White W house is of interest but I also think that the house that's adjacent I think it's somewhat adjacent to it is a series of robot caps and so I'm wondering if there are any other Curiosities I don't mean to call them Curiosities but they have unique status um in Amorous that we need to identify yeah right like something like this would allow us to just better evaluate um a 20th century house that comes before us um right and just know what's what are the significant aspects and H you had mentioned right it's the Cap Cod modern house trust Housing Trust right is that um yes I can I can hopefully I can send you and jenta the link to the actual report because it ended up being a national register nomination for you know an a quite a large group covering well Fleet Truro um maybe Province Town I can't remember off hand it's probably about 50 houses alog together um Let me let me find that for you afterwards sorry I don't have it to hand re I think yeah I think you and I had emailed a while ago and I think I was I'm online right now it looks like the Cap Cod modern house trust and so that's a a pretty you know it's a really nice website I me it's a it's not it's different from a town you know website but it has some great information and contextualizes a lot well they've also been trying to save Marcel breer's house um on the cape as well and they now have raised enough money to do that and it will be a a study center and a place to stay but a very expensive place to stay because they're obviously trying to you know use that money to fund work on the on the building um doam Momo is also involved in this and Robin and I had sort of picked up on all of this about a year ago um so I think there's I think there would be very similar interest in in amest for our our contribution to this era you know yep and I think it um a survey would allow for um uh identifying any potential National register nomination um opportunities we wanted to go that Direction with some something in particular so um okay so we're agreeed on that yeah I think so yep okay um and met and will get a work with Nate to get us a draft to review next meeting okay right got it okay uh any other CPA news proposals snate no no I mean we're still I'm still trying to get the fy2 the things that started in July kind of under contract and moving some people are you know started already some are getting ready um so I have those to do but no I haven't heard anything about the next round I mean I think you know the high school track was a big discussion recently for the CPA committee not not you know not related to Historic preservation but yep yep um okay oh um that reminds me uh is my status as CPA rep Uh current or do I need to be reappointed I've forgotten yeah actually that's a good point I think the the town staff likes to have a vote of the commission every year just to confirm or ratify who would be the rep so you know the CPA Committee in town is made up of representatives from other boards and committees historical commission Conservation Commission the Housing Authority has one planning board uh so Robin served for a while now and it is extra meetings you know it's pretty busy in the fall and winter and then you know the CPA processes they make recommendations to council to vote as part of the budget process uh so you know Robin if you're willing to serve again someone could make a motion or someone else could but I'm happy to serve again I make a motion that Robin for and be our representative to CPA do I have a second I'll second okay Michel a second have a motion before the commission uh to appoint Robin forom to the historical commission representative the CPA committee I will take a roll call vote mine Helmer yes okay Pat off yes pedy startup hi Antonia brinberg yes Michaela rasnik yes okay uh we are 60 in favor and I accept uh the nomination so that is now I just need my to get my paperwork done I think our next meeting um and then uh for members of the commission I think who maybe who weren't here last year um ideally what will happen is that um we'll structure our meeting so that in September um potential applicants or people who are starting to apply can come before us with any questions about their project um generally the town vets projects to make sure that um uh applications for historic preservation that aren't actually eligible don't go go forward um so we shouldn't see anything before us that uh isn't really applicable and then um I believe in October maybe they have an opportunity to present to the committee and we make um a general recommendation that I kind of bring with me to the CPA meeting so we have a discussion about the projects that are submitted once they're done so I guess that happens in October and then um I take the recommendations uh from the committee in the past um um we have ranked projects uh I think we we stepped out of that but I would say that in the commissions it's act in the um CPA meeting it's actually really helpful to have a sense of what our higher priorities are um because a in in recent years uh we've had more applicants that we've had funding for and so that makes uh it important to be able to advocate for which product projects we think are most important so that'll come hopefully come before us uh next month okay any other CPA questions hearing and seeing nothing uh now we have updates um an update on downtown design standards yeah I was G to mention the town's been working with dots and flinker to you know assess the downtown and come up with recommendations for the right of way and then also for architectural design standards and you know starting uh probably in August and then into September in this fall they're going to be holding a lot more uh public meetings they might hold like a three-day workshop at the high school in mid-september and then have you know like office hours downtown at certain locations uh but just um you know we're trying to get a web page set up on the town's um site I just want you know commission let Commissioners know you know they'll be open to the public I'm not sure if any of you had been asked to be part of a working grp but um I've been on it l okay um but I'm particularly anxious to invite anonia and Michaela to join in the fun um because it would be really great to have more representation from students in town yeah so you know I can update the commission we can always I we plan on email I'll email it out once the schedule gets finalized but you know I plan on you know I think it's like September 13th through the 15th we're targeting having like a Friday evening all day Saturday Sunday and other you know meetings throughout um September October November uh and you know this will be go on for like about another year where there'll be multiple chances but I think you know just to let everyone know that that is happening and I think it'll be a chance to weigh in on what you know what we think about downtown and the future development great thank you so H you'll be in touch with Antonia and Michaela yes Michaela you student I didn't think you were I wasn't sure but I um I'll I'll get I'll contact you both it's possible that you'll just be able to network a little bit and it would be really wonderful um that's definitely been a um a a category of our population that is underrepresented in the in the design standards also I mean above Beyond students uh you know relatively recent graduates too younger younger residents of amers said I think Michaela represents that cohort yeah great great um Item B inventory form updates for recent demolitions right before the meeting started I sent uh everybody uh I don't know if they had a chance to review just a draft um form for uh I finally got to 140 Southeast Main Street um I don't know if you want to just pull that up Nate um and the building has not come down and I did have a question what is the status on their demolition are they going to need to come back before us again yeah so um it was a while ago that uh the owner came for three properties on Southeast Street and yeah their their uh demolition any any permit has expired so they'll have to to come back again before the commission okay yep and so yeah here's here's um here's and farms and so you know they came for these three properties here yeah and then yeah so you know here's the inventory form and so um this was I need to go over this again to make sure I have all my information right but um I was able to trace the deed back to um a Jonathan Edwards who is the stepson of go back up there uh of Hannah and neemia strong um and he's not the Jonathan Edwards who was a um a reverend from from Northampton but um if you scroll down to the maps just so everybody knows the process that I go through so I look at the deeds and I get the names for all the deeds and then I compare them to the maps this map of 17 72 I guess which was what when did uh ammer um incorporate separate from Hadley Nate do you know uh not at the top of my head I do you know auti anybody I should I should know that um but uh this is one of the earliest Maps uh that we have and you it's very hard to make out there but it says Deacon DEC Edwards um and so there's information on Jonathan uh he was a deacon of the first church and then if you scroll down again you get to the uh 1830 map and you can see that um that extension of rout n that points down uh you can see the three buildings that um they've come for us of presumably for demolition this one doesn't have the um owners identified but then if you scroll down one more time to the next historic map which is from 1860 I don't have it circled but just at the corner you can see s Edwards and that's Jonathan Edwards um grandson Simeon Edwards so that's kind of the process is um uh identifying the names on the Deeds um Deeds always almost always reference the deed before and so you can make a title chain going back and then you can compare it to Historic maps and then you dig around in the secondary uh resources and census and stuff to build a a narrative around there so I just wanted to at least show you guys that and by next meeting I'll have that one finalized and then we can work on um submit it to uh to the MHC for inclusion of the inventory which brings me to a question which I've has popped into my mind on and off so Nate my understanding is that there's macas and then there's the town's inventory so macas is the system where these uh building forms that saw get approved by the Massachusetts historic commission get loaded into their system and you can locate them uh via map or address but your the town itself is supposed to have its own inventory or maybe keeps its own inventory I mean I have heard in a number of places like Maas is not the town's inventory that's what I've heard right so the town could have its own inventory that has information that isn't included in MA do we have any records in the town hall or is our essentially what's in Maas yeah no we we do um the previous Town engineer or you know now a while ago probably a few decades ago um created a an inventory for every property in town or street address you know it wasn't every property but I mean so ideally most of the forms the in the work on the properties are the inventory forms um that are in macis and then occasionally there's additional information whether it be like a newspaper article or a photograph or something and so um you know I can't say you know it's it's very um inconsistent in terms of what's done on a property and so you know we call it we call it an inventory it hasn't been updated NE it's not you know periodically updated or frequently updated it's like whenever is it just like files or is it just paper files it's in a few file doors so for instance like on um um what 1164 North Pleasant up in North ammer you know uh for instance there was a project where they said oh there's always been this in-law apartment in this in the back of the Farmhouse and the inspector was you know questioning because it's listed as a single family and so um the inspector asked the owner and then we did some deed research and found information from uh you know the current owner has done research and said oh yeah actually there was when it was built he found you he knew the family when he moved in he talked to the family who the you know his family bought it from from and he has a written record of what they said and then he's done his own research and so he you know wrote like a three-page paper about the property and um just just like just in the last few weeks emailed at the town and so yeah I put that in the file and so you for instance they think that um yeah and yeah so it's just like you know it's like kind of anecdotal stuff like oh it was like you know so and so lived here and we think it was a you know maybe they made brooms in the back in the back of the place which was the apartment and you nothing's been totally verified but you know that just went in the street address file so some sometimes things like that if they come through U but typically it's just the inventory form and photos from like you know 60s or 70s okay okay so if there was something that somebody found you know an interesting clipping or something that we didn't want to go for a full you know building form on we could forward that to you to be added to the local inventory right I mean typically we Tred to you know I was thinking it'd be great to get it all in macas but you know some of this information isn't really relevant for mackas um right right yeah or it's just the beginning piece like I'm just thinking about like uh the the place called the poor farm not that it was a poor farm but um that there was when I uh did just some um newspaper research for it like the history of that property was really fascinating there's this guy who is like a swan breeder um and you know so I have all those articles and written so okay so that's something to to keep in mind okay um I don't think we have any other uh inventory forms uh but maybe by our next uh meeting we can have that one finalized and maybe another one come before um so one in five your goals I don't really have an update there this meeting if anybody has anything to add girl um can we just discuss the the 140 Southeast Street um for I just I was just I I'm surprised it's 1770 that house uming that's my research yeah I mean I think we had we had determined that maybe that some of it was from the maybe late 1800s early 1900s uh and then you know the neighboring property to the South you know based on the Block Foundation was probably the 30s I mean my my guess is that area was really wet you know it's it's it's I I have a feeling that there probably were structures there you know as the maps in and I actually don't think the structures that are there now are those structures but it's really hard to and so when this came through demolition review Rob and I had emailed a little bit and we lost kind of the title chain but just based on some of the maps and some of the other things it was unclear if those are I mean it doesn't look like yeah if you look at right if you look at the um so the foundation inside is Fieldstone brick and then ranit facing um the their whyde PL I don't know enough about dating a house but and and and this is actually why I was asking about the demol because they said that they would allow us to come and we could probably you know we can get access to the um Timber framing it would be a really exciting fun thing for us to do to see if we could date date the building by its frame um um so yeah my skills are not that strong there I mean I've you know so when I pulled that map I mean I can see the um I can see the titles going all the way back but it's true when you look at the deacon the 1772 Deacon Edwards map it does look like that house is much further back from the road so that's you're probably the the foundation is interesting because it's that mound so that does I don't know exact I mean it reminded me of the 68 um mlen [Music] um uh that you I was not here for that but the Ma I'm just looking at the Macos form for that is it does it did have that little front porch um before previously when it was surveyed earlier and that one was dated is dated to 1861 in the um in macis yep so I just yeah it's hard so it might be that yeah yeah and I I think I have a um I need to do a trip to the registry to to go one deed back because it gets a little bit more complicated when you go back that far um but yeah we could get together and um work on refining that I think that Nathaniel Edwards I mean it's clearly his son Simeon who inherits the land like the land is definitely owned by him the house might come later so it's still part of the um being part of the historic record but you're probably right I don't have I don't know I'm just wondering yeah no it's a good question yeah I thought question and I should have put it as more of a question and a while ago we had I thought CPA Money Paid For You Know certain record to be scamed and available I don't know if that's through special collections like tax records to see you know if there was any improvements listed I don't know how far back it would go but um I thought those records were available publicly now without having to physically come into town hall but oh that's a that's how would how okay how would we do that yeah I you know I know yeah I don't know actually um for some reason I thought we had certain things scanned and they were going to be then U you know this is like 10 years a ago and then link through special collections but I don't know how if that ever happened or um all right can I email you that and we'll try to follow up because that would be a great piece to add to like our checklist of resources to check right right yeah actually I'm gonna jump on that too in a minute okay but um yeah I would love to I'm I mean I'm I'm pleased that the demolition has been delayed because um I want to make sure to get the date the calendar so that we can they they said they were happy to have us come over there and they would um we're going to try to get some of those wide uh plank flooring salvaged and um see what we find any other comments mine no no okay good thank you for that okay um I think we went over kind of went over our modern structures list I'm assuming that's uh that's what we were talking about uh when we were talking about CPA so we've covered that item uh so item number seven uh is general public comment uh I see we have uh four attendees in the audience if anyone wishes to make a brief comment of a couple minutes uh they can raise their hand when they're introduced to the when you're introduced to the meeting um introduce yourself by name and uh if you're a resident of am um but if I'm not seeing any sometimes that takes a minute so uh one more time if any members of the public who are attending the meeting would like to make public comment at this time raise your hand ument ornate do you know how to uh do the raised hand function if someone is on just a phone call or yes sorry Nate go ahead I don't see any I don't see any hands raised and it just looks like everyone's here okay computer or device not so all right seeing no raised hands uh we will move on to unanticipated items any unanticipated items for this particular meeting okay seeing none uh we should schedule our next meeting for September although I'm technically our next meeting is for the Jones Library I will not be attending that um so we're looking for a September meeting and we've been meeting Mondays Labor Day is the holiday so uh September 9th or 16th and I may be away this 16th is the ninth available for everyone it's fine for me okay Pat AA September 9th I'm checking real quick okay sure yes yes okay mine that work for you I I maybe I think so I can't say at this point but let's book it Antonia does that work for you okay so is that Quorum yet Michaela did you say you were available I'm sorry okay great okay so uh September 9th Monday September 9th at 6:30 p.m all right that's it thanks everybody thank you see you in a okay thank