##VIDEO ID:bEd30rHG2Gs## okay thank you and uh Kim I have the little Spiel if you want I can say it so um hi so good evening this is the transportation advisory committee meeting for October 3 and I'm just going to read a quick statement about uh remote meetings so it says pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021 and extended by chapter 22 of the acts of 2022 this meeting will be conducted via remote means members of the public who wish to access the meeting May do so via Zoom or telephone um no imperson attendance of members of the public will be permitted but every effort will be made to ensure that the public can access the meeting in real time via technological means so I don't know if we have anybody in our waiting room we do not and so okay we'll get started oh and I just um we'll just do a quick roll call everybody who's here so Guilford is here he started the meeting and everybody else tremble the CH and Tracy all right okay we're here great so um I'm gonna sign off and sign on my on my computer so I'll be right back okay um all right so I think we'll wait for Chris for the update on the iwalk because she's been in touch with the school people the most um but I'll just give you this quick update about the school zones so um so Chris and I had a meeting with a few counselors and um Anna Devin gothier and Lynn grimer and they're planning to bring forth a motion to the council for the council meeting later this month like asking the DPW to create uh school zones at the middle school and high school so that's still to be continued I don't know Gilford have you heard from them at all about it nothing so I mean I think what they what the proposal is is to um like defer to the DPW on where the signage would go and things to set up those school zones um and then there also at that discussion there was also consideration about the timing of the school zones um for the elementary schools which I know is something that Jeremy Anderson has brought up at a lot of meetings but um that won't be part of this initial motion this initial motion is just to make sure that we do create school zones for the middle school and the high school okay so Chris um are you here yeah great so could you just give us to the extent that you have one like an update about um the iok plans for next week and I think all the elementary schools I saw that they're all like listed as participating on the official website and yeah I mean um it has definitely been um harder this year because we don't have the constant weekly promotion from the superintendent's office um like we did last year for both events um you know for a month previous in the weekly Deb West Morland email there would be um the signup sheet and the kind of quick narrative about what the um the walk consist of sure so uh we don't have that this year I did make the request you know I just Dr shei is not going to be dealing with this for the whole year it it just I don't think you know between the budget Crunch and oh yeah's um you know there's just um I've also requested a meeting and haven't gotten it so you know I'm just going to do what I can with the Family Resource Center and I think that's going to have to be it for the year and so recruitment right now we're at about um 50 families last year at this time we probably had 75 we need the principles to do their Robo calls um this year we do have the gym teachers at the elementary schools also pushing out the sign up so I think it's going to be fine I don't think it's going to be a banner year um we are going to have even more police escorts this year um from the Echo Hill crew will have a police escort too um and there's one new Rally Point at Crocker and then we have one new school which is pelum um participating so they're going to have a little meet up on Harkness Road and then walk and ride their bikes down to pelum okay so um you know it's fine it's totally fine um and certainly compared to yeah we're we're doing it and not a lot of places are I mean yeah I was on the map just the other day like I was looking at the official safe reachs to school map on the state yeah website and like we're one of the only towns in in Hampshire County yeah yeah yeah basically I mean you see like a whole bunch of clusters around Springfield though of course in Springfield there are a lot of students who are walking or biking already right that they don't aren't getting buses because of their proximity to their schools but I did not see like hardly any and all of Hampshire County so Kudos do are continuing to do it other cool thing this fall is that Tori is going to be going to Crocker and wildwood oh great and and um cycling safety and then the um Fort River gym teacher did not want to have Tor come in but she's kind of doing it on her own and she's pretty into it um and in touch with Tori so I think that's a good kind of newer development um and then I think out of this I'm going to have to pull together the first um Bike Rodeo committee right but then I'm not here I actually leave on vacation um next Wednesday which is what is happening yeah yeah either need to eleate elevate you Tracy or Jeremy to be appointed well that's what I wanted to that's why I like had messaged you about just like connecting I didn't know if you were leaving this weekend or something um so I'm sorry could you just repeat for me um which schools are going to be doing the curriculum this year with Tori it was like Fort River or is it um it's no not Fort River not Fort River okay Fort River is supportive but not um so it's Wildwood and COC okay great yeah if you know when those are I mean I might be interested in like even like sitting in and just seeing what it is and if if that's an option for us yeah I don't I just want to kind of see it in action you know maybe I'll just reach out to Tori about it but and do we have any you know I just was asking before you got on I asked Guilford if he's going to be there do we have any you know VIPs or anything definitely not VIP so I definitely wouldn't be what people I don't um I again I didn't prioritize it and no no not at all but maybe we could um to um if you have the list of the different like locations and stuff like you know Paul bakaman or Lyn grimer they had both you know volunteered to be part of it or um or Mindy Dom right when she stopped by our table at the BL party she was super supportive the reality is I am not willing or capable to add it into my schedule no I I get it I get it and you're not here either so um I'm happy to reach out to them oh I don't want to put it on a rally point leader oh no not yeah I understand to like you know and not that Lynn grenberg needs handholding but no if we have a VIP show up we need a plan for that person to uh plug in and do the thing and it's yeah I don't um okay feel comfortable doing it just because there's not a lot of backup for the rally point leader got it or maybe at the schools like could show up at one of the schools no yes um again the production of be happening at each of the schools is um not a guarantee I mean is like for example Crocker doing something do we know what they're doing or just welcoming the students ever um the best place that does a good that does a reception is Fort River okay um and uh Wildwood the administration doesn't participate in the reception it's the pgo got it okay the pgo can be it can just be a little bit spotty depending on what they can pull together no I understand okay which was really cute but um so yeah yeah we'll see I mean you know it's happening it'll happen again in the spring I think people want a Bike Rodeo um but we do need to figure out a better promotional Outlet we were way too riant on Debbie yes and do you have a do you have an estimated datea when you'll be doing the bike rodo in the spring no is no okay Kim um as far as the um you know I appreciate that we used to get the whole like lots of information from the superintendent I'm kind of annoyed actually that the superintendent sent out their letter as a video chat because like I wasn't going to click on that link and I feel like I haven't heard from our super and that is something that I will follow up with rather than just complain about um but uh I mean I'm trying to think about the other ways that I get lot you know information about Community things that interest schoolage children from the schools and I guess it's from the pgo like the maybe I'm trying to think about PG's aren't sending that stuff out as much anymore so I remember T checking in with a bunch of the pgos last year the elementary school ones they all used to have blogs like I know that Crocker crocker shut theirs down um and I know the middle school doesn't have a Blog anymore Wildwood you know they had a defunct Facebook page they didn't have access to and I think they were hoping the superintendent would I mean the principal would send some stuff out but I get from the schools that I and the high school so the high school pgo is the only one I think that consistently is like and they and even though the last year's pgo for the high school that most of those people had seniors like they did find some people to continue to do news updates and they do them weekly they sent them out they send them out on Sunday and they used to send them out on Friday but yeah it's it's really too bad because there's a lot of community stuff that just I feel like is not getting to the right audiences but I do think that some of it like I mean maybe Chris knows a little I do think that some of the principles are sending out like the a Wildwood parent told me I think it was like the Wildwood principal was sending out like a weekly update or something we sent out I mean we asked the princi all the it seems like the principles do regular updates and so we asked them to obviously they had to send out the link right a robo call this week because they need to refer folks to specific Link in their email in order sure for the safe Roots so some principles s have been sending it out every week since they got it and you know I don't actually know what Derek has been doing or so so Chris so the names that were collected you know when we tabled at the um first day of school event and then at the BL party those got you know entered into in like a Google form or something is there have there been emails have been going out to that list or just been segmented by no but I didn't know if it was just segmented by schools or something or if there's just like like General email like I think like Lyn grimer and like other people and even um like you know Chief Ting had signed up on those lists so I didn't know if they' gotten any of the I didn't enter those people and okay I supplied them to header Sheldon got it okay and then she has sent out to the she has emailed out to the whole list globally sure okay great okay um it again it's just not the same as having the Debbie West Morland no absolutely I I agree with you there then I did ask um Seth is the Seth was recruited away from public television or something I don't know yeah he works in um Dr she's office to help her maintain and you know a brand so she's got some whole communication strategy that's like a newsletter every other week and a podcast every other week and she's been like naming people like you know Heroes and all that stuff yeah yeah so I made the request to him I made the request to Marta to ask her and you know it didn't happen so um again I just don't see what we are doing as being a um no something that she can deal with which is unfortunate I mean I think from the superintendent's office this past year Debbie's strategy was like throw it all in and just send it out and that you know that way we're just at least able to communicate to folks um right even if there was no other prioritization happening I think Dr shei is way more in the opposite direction yeah yeah okay so I get it well and also right I mean we heard last week I mean she's she's pretty new to the job and what did she propose after the like all towns meeting or at the old Town's meeting that the middle school and the high school merged to like save the budget so she I mean she's got a lot of big things on her plate yeah you know and she's brand new to the system and like that's that's pretty bold right so not that it's necessarily a bad idea but it's out there no but everyone else has been kicking the can down the road I mean she has to deal with us because she's in it for the long term I I I didn't want to I didn't want to Veer off into school politics no no I don't want it yeah I'm just trying to say I'm I'm just trying to be completely understanding about absolutely not going to get much from the superintendent's office so I just I am going to have to have a conversation with Marta about better communication for the spring events and how to do that in a way that's not so riant on the individual and and if Dwayne like has that capacity as well so so so who is the superintendent like like how how how is that there is there is this person death oh that's you probably have gotten like parent martyr is the director of The Family Center oh and she had put herself out there she's part of the district's leadership team and she had put herself out there and her office is like helping coordinate safe fruits to school okay and she had um somebody in her office Dwayne chamble who works a lot like with the family so you come to the family center and he also does stuff to support middle school and high school students like he runs that before school program and things um that he was kind kind of um tapped as a person who would be like their office's main coordinator the family center doesn't have a big staff but yeah okay anyway but thank you Chris so can you just um before we move on can you just tell me like how many um Meetup points are there about between all the schools I'm just curious take me a second like or just an estimate I was just you know um yeah I don't recall off the top two for Wildwood okay I just um let's see yeah um it'll take me a second I mean we don't worry yeah let's let's move on so um Christine could you send me the um Meetup points for Wildwood um sure yeah I will and Kim do you think the high schoolers would be interested at all awesome awesome that' be great um okay so then the next item on the agenda was the tack vacancies membership meeting ideas and so on um so one reason I put this on the agenda is just that you know we have had a vacancy for over a year um and also just and so I have talked to the town manager Office about filling that vacancy and then also that Joe Fuso was also going to going to be stepping down once there is somebody appointed for him he's not going to his appointment was up in the spring in June and he wasn't going to continue with the new appointment in part because his family is leaving the country soon um and it just seems like sometimes you know I've been the chair for a while and you know Kim has been the assistant chair I have another year left on the committee assuming we're still here then um Chris and saon have been appointed out to 2026 and um you know if there ways we can run the meeting that it's like more involved and um one idea the town manager's office had given me as he said that some committees do occasionally meet in person like if we thought that that would be helpful like I did I have liked it when we've done like site visits and things like that but it's very convenient to hop on zoom and I know sometimes you have trouble getting Corum so would we even have Quorum if we met in person I'm not sure I mean maybe we want to talk about bigger changes you know once we bring in some new members we should hopefully be in the next couple months um but if people had ideas so at the DPW office at the DPW office with Gilford well is Gilford home now or is he still in the DPW office no I'm in my house I just have the I just have the DPW over my shoulder yeah that's that little building over there on my that's not from this year that's that's a pretty nice uh screen right that's not from this year yet it's a little like brighter then but yeah no it's it's one of Larry Kelly's Aerials he did nice he had good Aerials he got you know gra Park is behind it and then the DPW so I'm at the DPW but not at the DPW exactly yeah one day there'll be a different place for the DPW no there won't oh I hope so won't yeah we're gonna be right there that's the that's our location oh really has signed up sorry what's that what's that Chris I'm going back to Safe Roots I apologize oh what so I'm sorry what did you say about that sorry and is signed up wait I couldn't hear you you were feeding in and out who signed up Lynn oh Lynn signed up yeah right nice good y okay um so I mean do people have other ideas about it or have you have people you want to recruit for the committee um the town manager's office does have a list of people who have applied previously um including since the last time we filled vacancies and um Angela Mill showed me the list and I think there are some really good people on there if they're still interested so so why don't we recruit them I I would like to yeah she was going to follow up with everybody to see if they're still interested Co great um and I mean there is the idea of this Transportation Commission by listening to the TSO meetings um I think uh they're gonna they're kind of going through it sort of slowly they're looking for more from the council Maybe all the new work they need to do they might transition they might deide I think what they were planning on though is because they have so many other things on their plate that they would dedicate like a little bit of time you know every meeting or every other meeting but then it would be like extended out like for a while so in an Amor way this could be a long process so I do I am looking forward to filling the bacon SE and they they definitely have things they don't want to deal with and they want to move to another way of dealing with it so they they I imagine this committee may go faster than you think yeah I hope so because otherwise we're just twiddling our thumbs right although what they don't want to deal with Maybe not maybe not as much fun we want to do like parking may not be as fun oh but we're having such a good time right now okay um so are there any other thoughts uh Savana emailed me and he had a few ideas you know for items so we could Circle back to like including uh kushman and also um street lights which I think was def you know referred to the DPW about a year ago I do want to get back to the bike ped plan I know Chris and I have talked about that offline a little bit um if we have other things and I mean at some point you know some of these other projects could also come to us like the whole Southeast roundabout idea and things exciting or the four roundabouts apparently that are planed well the ones at South the Southeast Street yeah holy cow I love it but so might not be digestible by everyone at the moment until it was I mean so one thing about it is like I think it is really informative for people who are interested in it to have watched the meeting you know read a synopsis of the meeting because the documents that were put forth and included in the packet included in the memo it was like focused on you know speed like um and focused on making sure there's like not congestion and it didn't and it was really good to hear Guilford that um that you were thinking about a lot of other things too like even that there's no language in there in the memo and in the CD M Smith report about safety or anything that those were also like part of the discussion so it was good to see um yeah so somebody had actually sent me a transcript of that portion of the uh council meeting if anybody wants to see it oh yeah I'd love to see it I can send that around to people um and then okay so let's see other updates as available so let's see so the West Street redesign from pot wine to a long metal Drive was approved by the council a few meetings ago and Guilford um are you anticipating that that project is going to be done this fall like in October sometime I think they're getting ready to start okay um cool but wait is it the same who's the contractor who's doing some of the other work like on North Pleasant Street and so on it's Caracus Caracus and are they the ones doing this project too they will be so do they ever want to finish one project before they start new projects North Pleasant Street it's been like you know it's been since the summer oh North North Pleasant Street's not theirs oh okay who's doing North Pleasant Street uh well we figured we found out today why North Pleasant Street is going so slow but it's actually Warner Brothers who's doing North Pleasant Street okay that's part of the paving project not the sidewalk Improvement going on um but whenever whenever certain institution of Higher Learning calls them they go run over there because their prices are higher for that institution than we pay I see okay um all right and um so that's great so it sounds like Caracus is going to be starting that Long Meadow project soon but hopefully some of the other projects will wrap up by then I mean just you know so that there's not detours and are there going to be detours and things for that um project no um for that one it's going to be more just moving moving traffic left and right and okay waiting a little bit and I mean will the counil I mean or will DPW look at changing some of the speed limits like once that's done will you wait and have the like do a speed study and then look at the um the only way to change the speeds is to um yeah do the speed study so we would probably wait and see where we go so a speed study doesn't necessarily have to be like a huge in-depth study like it kushman it could also couldn't it just be like looking like collecting the speed data and say and like telling the state that like hey we've done traffic calming speed management stuff in this area and that's and the speeds are lower and now we want to change the speed limit is that right or um I'm not stamping a speed study and Jason won't snap a speed study um we'll bring someone in and they will do it because there's too much pressure for us to do it like you just said and oh well I was just asking like how the process goes but so we would bring we would bring in CDM or well cdms who we use for those things we bring them in we have a a new engineer that works for us there she's really nice um we've been telling her we can get her up here to go skiing so you mean Vermont in Vermont not in am yeah in Vermont gilford's always skiing you're always skiing I instead of doing the walk bike and rolls days goil for is skiing usually okay um all right so then also so the ribbon cutting next on the agenda the ribbon cutting that's next uh Friday it is and yeah cool and so it sounds like um you said somebody from the Department of like housing will be there and yeah secretary that's okay well it's right here [Music] um stoble nice and it is looking good and as I said before we went live for the meeting I do appreciate that there's the um you know bikes can take the full Lane signs there which is awesome and we finally got we finally got the electric meter so the lights started working last week oh yeah cool oh they haven't been working no we didn't have a we didn't have a power meter yeah oh but the but the sound was going like the RFB ones or like are there other lights no the the overs oh okay the overhead lights oh okay because I've been down there and I hear like all the you know the messages about the RFB Crossings yes those do work so um so next on the agenda I had put um the chapter 90 like section 17 C and um you had mentioned that you were going to so that's the one where the town had passed something um that section of the mgl that says that you can lower the default like speed limit to 25 miles per hour in thickly settled areas and other you know areas that meet the criteria and um you had mentioned Gilford that you were starting to put up signs right at some of the yes roads where that at the town limit signs you know on those roads but then early in the summer you had said something about how um you know like for example like people asked about Heatherstone for example because some parts of Heatherstone actually have speed limit signs and some don't and whether all the speed limit signs were actually what was done before they were put in or whatever so is that like a and you had mentioned how Jason was going through them and just sort of looking you know a different Road about the history about which ones could be changed to this 25 M hour speed limit where it would apply and which didn't in things yeah there's still there still I mean people want to see a list of which ones are which and so we're cleaning up the but it doesn't it doesn't mean that we're actually gonna put a sign there it says 25 miles an hour if it doesn't have a speed limit no I understand that but is is that I mean do you anticipate that you would have a list at some point that you could share there will be a list at some point yes okay um because that is really helpful for people I think too because I even saw for example like Hadley right you live in Hadley and they said well we're gonna they were looking at um adopting it too chapter 90 17c and they say well we're going to change all the speed limits in town to 25 miles per hour or at least that's what the media says and so no it is helpful to like know which which roads are changing and which roads aren't and yeah the story said they want to change the rows that weren't posted oh okay to 25 but even so that's not all because not every where meets that like densely settled criteria or does it in Hadley um no even in ammer it doesn't know that's what I'm saying yeah I mean if if there's no speed limit on there's I don't think there's a speed limit on um high flat Hills I don't think there's a speed limit up there at all so that'll be 25 it's not at all no of course yeah so okay yeah I mean I think you know if you when you have more information that would be great to um just find out a little more I mean one thing I was at some training that was held by the bay state roads program and um Jim denila who's like the state traffic engineer was there and he was talking about there were some questions about once you have the default speed limit you know he a 25 miles hour under chapter 90 17c like if you can um because some neighborhoods were still saying that they still want to have like the signage that says 25 miles per hour and he and his opinion was that you shouldn't be doing that like once it's the default speed limit correct um so and I guess that's probably the case in amers too right where you would be removing like some of those or something no there's there well if we if we remove a sign is because there isn't really there wasn't an official speed liit sign for that street got it and because the way they voted it they could have voted and listed they could have said make a list of every street which doesn't have a speed limit on it and then they could have said all these streets in this list are now 25 right then we could have posted a speed limit sign on every street ah okay but they chose not to do that because Mass do doesn't recommend it although if you read the list of communities that have done done it many of them have done that's what they did they took all the list of streets that didn't have a speed limit and they said these all 25 got it so our council could always revisit that and go the route of like having a list they could they could yes yeah okay I mean that does seem like that could be helpful but okay well didn't you suggest that at one point and I did it didn't go very far it was not very well received it wasn't but I think otherwise right because if you're not posting which streets they are then I I mean I'm not even sure I mean I'd like to hear more and the training that training I went to there were a lot of law enforcement people there I'd like to hear more about like how enforceable it is if there's nothing posted I mean it seems like it would be a pretty big challenge it's not that the one the one thing this rule does give you is that um the police have now have the right to run radar On Any Road in town so if it was unposted you had to use your judgment and observe the car and say it was proceeding at a um unsafe and an unsafe way and that's how you gave them the ticket so now they can actually just turn the radar on and clock you and then give you a ticket that's pretty that's cut and dry so but it's not but they're not posted not posted but that the rule is accepted and but what about the I mean that wouldn't be true in the areas that aren't like dentally settled or something then right no no the the this new rule lets the police run radar oh pretty much everywhere and use radar as their basis for riding you a ticket okay that's the that's the one really really what I see that's the one really good thing out of it maybe we can invite Chief Ching to one of our meetings and he can explain this to us a little too like how they would do it operationally or something it seems it seems I mean it's good it just seems complicated too like in that people would complain about the tickets and whatever I don't you could but if you're driving down a road at 45 miles no I understand that yeah yeah the I mean you have people but it would also be good to see like um you know as you were saying just the roads that are posted I mean there are a lot of places that have speed limits that are posted that are above 25 miles hour and like cuz you were saying that some of those might not have been like legitimately created or something and so it'd be good to know like which streets those are too and things most most of the ones that aren't created properly are the 20 the ones that are posted 25 and 30 oh okay none of the highp speed ones all the highp speed ones were went through a study okay okay right um thank you and um so other Road Improvement projects I just had asked you about North Pleasant Street which you said is a Warner Brothers project and it's coming along and it will and it's still I saw that like there was some town like social media post and they're um you know it's still supposed to have the backend parking and all the it's um the bike lane the counterflow bike lane and things like that it's supposedly they've finished they might be finished Paving today the paving looks pretty close yeah and are they are they doing the lines too or no we'll do those okay yeah it looks great I know it it looks great to me and are there raised crosswalks there too still are they not going to be raised anymore the raised crosswalk is at the intersection with mlen mlen there was one mlen yeah so that's on like crossing mlen right but I thought there we but we had also talked about that there was going to be a rais crosswalk like north of mlen is that not being included and there are some curb Cuts there still I think there's curb Cuts I don't actually I have to go back and look really okay I think that should be the most what the council approved was like including a a crosswalk North of mlen there's a crosswalk but I don't remember it's raised okay it should be it should be raised that would be a very good kind of deterrent because you know I've noticed recently like people just going both ways on that street so I have noticed that too actually a lot like um I've been noticing people turning off of like you you know coming from UMass and turning going south on it and and all the people who on the street just do it Go the wrong way all the time maybe we need to contact the police about that it's because it's a there's not any lines it's a big it's I mean it looks like a Runway right now yeah it does it does yeah I'm I am looking forward to like once the parking and the it's all striped again like I think that hopefully that will help do you think that there will be um signs on the I mean I think I think would be very useful is to have signs that say one way on the other side on the Kendrick park side of the road facing the students yes there will be some yes okay great thank you and the sidewalk is almost done like all around the both of them are done I think Kendrick Park that looks really nice yeah yeah there's only one more piece of sidewalk to do and then that that part of the Kendrick Park plan will be done that's nice that's nice um okay the bathroom that's I'm not doing the bathroom oh is that isn't your office involved in the bathroom like dpw's involved no no we we gave them connection points they told us where they're going to put it and they took it to all the people who had to approve it but now they have to buy one oh okay I thought I saw sewer lines going in there are sewer water sewer and Waters in um electricity is in fiber optic is in supposedly um cool yeah it looks great really looks great yeah awesome and then um so tell us about Heatherstone are there any updates on Heatherstone yeah it's going meaning what I haven't been down well I heard that there were some issues with the mini roundabouts well we were laying them out and adjusting them and doing some playing around with them and we've keep we keep kind of trying to adjust them Jason's been adjusting them in and in and out in and out what do you mean in and out what do you mean well we've been trying to make him fit in the area we're working in um some people are concerned a there's a lot of people who are have expressed uh a lot of negativity about this whole project on E in Echo Hill yeah they don't want the sidewalk they don't want the road narrow um they just want us to slap in speed humps and let it go [Music] and I wonder why that is I've driven down it a couple times and I thought that they were you know it's almost like I didn't notice them you know in like they are really small but at the same time they do do just enough um I I felt like okay this is just enough to slow me I mean not that I would speed down there anyway but it did cue me that I needed to be a better more cautious driver so I thought that that was I thought it was working on me but again I could could be biased and I mean the one the one drawback we have is we when you like when you look at these many roundabouts you look at communities where they do it they just throw in a circle in the middle of the road sometimes they put a signs in it sometimes they put a barrel in it and um the the intersection is much smaller than what we have um and they just tell people to live with it but they're not not on bus [Music] routes so we're having to accommodate the bus and then again so if you have a small car like a fit or maybe a a prism yeah yeah I mean you might be able to zip through and still not have to slow down very much but everybody else will unless you want to drive drive over you know so it's but I mean I guess so longer term like if it decides if the town decides to keep them like you it could actually be like an installation right like so like this afternoon I was driving on the one at University Drive South right at that little yeah and and I mean there the roundabout is pretty big but I mean it's not flat with the ground it's just like raised the littlest bit and so it seems like any larger Vehicles could still easily go on it around it or whatever and they can't actually it does have like an impact do they not they can't go up there I mean it's not it's not very high no they can drive over it too yeah I figure but uh you'll you'll see every once a while you'll see the the pbta bus that has to go down University Drive they'll make the right on the University South goes through the roundabout L and they actually don't track across the roundabout they just go straight well no they just they go around this outside but they don't have to drive over the middle right so you're saying it's wide enough yeah it's more than wide enough the people we have going across it or if you have a a delivery truck that's going yeah I'm not I mean not not a semi truck goes in there that's the ones who actually have to drive over and track over the island of course they got to go under the bridge anyway well they're usually they're either usually going into the new doctor's office now they yeah so it's it's kind of interesting now the dynamic there has changed a little bit yeah I mean so is a sidewalk on Heatherstone is that also going to be put in this fall or is that going to be sidewalks in oh it's in already okay interesting I have gone by it or gone through it twice and I have seen people using the sidewalk times like one time it was like I don't know two o'clock in the after you know some kind of randomish time so I don't know I was excited about that yeah that's great that's great and then um well the other one I was thinking of too is Southeast Street so um Andy Steinberg just sent me an email today and it sounds like there's some timeline for the TSO to be talking about the Southeast Street really soon um like by they were looking for comments by like October 10th or something but that seems like a pretty quick time frame but considering that there's no funding for it and they're probably wouldn't be funding for a few years do you have a sense of that Gilford um Southeast Street or so the bids came the bids came in like four or five million under estimate right yeah for the school itself for the school itself so there's a contingency built into the project which is four or5 million um so Tech if you think about it I mean there's there's four or five million dollars that's available to based on the appropriation from the town that you could use to help do this work or do something different oh okay I yeah it sounds like there had been like some questions about that so you think that it could move I mean my impression after watching the council was that it didn't sound like much would be done until like after the project the school project is pretty far along just in we're saying in case you do need to use the money right like if you use some of this extra contingency and then the Project's over budget then what do you do so they it sounded like they wanted to wait and the project the school right is supposed to be opened by the fall of 20126 yes but if they they do that then what happens is the school opens you fund you fund the in the changes on Southeast Street and then you end up going into construction for another year or two so you just just have more construction so some people want the some people want the some of the improvements whatever we need improvements we truly need to do done when the school opens no I understand that yeah yeah it should be it should be done because it's going to be a disaster for so many I mean for traffic in the morning for kids trying parents trying to get into school buses trying to get into school out of school like it needs to get done I mean to me I mean parents like Fort River parents including some of whom are Transportation faculty at UMass have described to me like going in and out of Fort River with their kids you know they have to pick up their kids for some reason and that it's been hard to like turn left out I mean I can see like having those around roundabouts right near the driveways and that's the way that roundabouts are used a lot at schools right I do think it can be more complicated at some of the inter like the bigger intersections including at route nine but can you just um I'm having a hard time understanding what criteria would push the construction after the new school it has been built versus you know concurrent with like what what would why would one scenario occur versus the other there's no money for this work so it's so it's waiting to make sure that we come in under budget for building the school in order to then somehow SLO the money off on the construction outside the school yeah so sort of like that I mean yeah someone has to say this money someone either has to say here's here's this much money to keep going and build these things outside the school project or someone has to say well we think we have enough money left in the appropriation for the school that we can use this for the intersections right so practically speaking there's no scenario right now that's viable where the work could be done concurrently I'm not not really at Liberty to say okay is it is it possible to have like a partial project to prioritize which of those roundabouts are the most important there is a proposal the town manager has that he's discussing that can move something forward faster okay that's good but someone has to decide you can use this 5 million extra from the B budget from the bid under for some of this work got it and you're saying you're not at Liberty to say because that's also part of the discussion that that Paul is just having with what the council or is there some other separate proposal for funding yeah I'm not sure I'm allowed to talk about it as why okay that's fine so with the new school can you just remind us about once it's open will families be going in and out of like both um driveways or one so the the when we were talking to the when we when this was being discussed during the design of the school they said the money there's no money for anything but the school right and we can't do anything but we can't do anything else so what we what we kind of said well if you want different if you want to have different circulation patterns for buses and and then parents right split make the North driveway the parents and teacher driveway and make the South driveway the buses bus driveway okay and that's how they set it up is okay right so the South driveway is the bus driveway is that what you're saying okay yeah but then and then we were told we were kind of said you can't go into the common either so that that was another and one idea you talked about at the meeting um at the council meeting is the idea of like making a wider sidewalk on the on the school side right like um more of like a multi-use path potentially where kids who are biking or whatever would also be able to be on sidewalk and that sidewalk is not well I don't know exactly how Nar wide or narrow it is right now but it also is overgrown a lot so it seems narrower like from belr toown Road to the school driveway yeah that's the segment that you're talking about right yes and that and do you see that if there was such a multi-use path type installer do you see that it could also extend like down route nine like going out towards where there's new housing or anything like that no well I mean already as it is there it's very n the street is very narrow so if you extended the sidewalk I mean the street there there's no BM essentially there on Earth on Route n no you're talking about Southeast Street on Southeast Street if we extended That Sidewalk I thought that's what you were talking about I'm sorry yeah it was so we were there's hardly I mean the sidewalk is like you know whatever five or whatever five foot wide sidewalk and if we were to actually put them and and the burn there is I mean it's a it's a proper curb and then there's hardly any room between the line the white line and the I hear what you're saying on both sides so so Northbound and Southbound on Southeast Street there and if you can't go into the common I mean right that's very guess still to be decided I mean so the council is like looking at it more and okay and then TR truly you got to decide where the cars are going first and how the cars are going to be accommodated before you can do pedestrians and cycl sure yeah yeah yeah although everyone wants us to do it backwards doesn't no that does not make sense safe no no but I was curious though like for example like uh cdm's analysis of the you know when they were raiding in terms of traffic flow and looking at the four roundabout like they were doing it like not looking at if you had crosswalks at the roundabouts as well at the and the on no like for example they were doing like part of the analysis was to improve traffic flow and the recommendations for the roundabouts was about focus on improving traffic flow like according to the report right but so one of the ways that they were looking at is right with the roundabouts you have constant flow like it can be slower I mean it does calm the traffic and because you can't speed through all those roundabouts but it's like constantly moving so you have like good flow but then my comment was just about like for example if at like the Main Street you know Southeast Street intersection if if you all us if you had crosswalks there with the roundabout you know for example at like the beginning of school and the end of school like that could impact the traffic flow so the their analysis really didn't look at that but Mo most of the analysis roundabouts don't look at that because they assume that oh yeah the model assumes that if a pedestrian shows up they have the right away most of the time and they just everybody has to yield because the people in the circle are I mean people coming into the circle have to yield and that's where most so they just assume that's how it'll function um it's kind of weird but I I do think though I mean this is just you know it's not on the agenda per se but I do think maybe we could do some education about that too like I've noticed that some of the roundabouts around town like when I'm trying to enter the roundabout that the other vehicles like to the left of me aren't nobody's yielding at all like some people they no I mean they just assume like they have the right to go right through and just like when you know when you have a four-way stop like a four-way intersection and you know you have like who has a right away I mean you still have the same thing at a roundabout and and so I feel like there might need to be like some education about it um and then there was a letter in the paper the other day about like how this person was saying how they put their life in their hands like every time they go in a roundabout or a rotary and a lot of people use them interchangeably and they're totally not the same but I feel like you know there could be some Outreach yeah based on the things people based on the things people are seeing throughout the country about drivers and how they're driving and the different things it might be wise to make us all to get our driver's license again it's true actually well some states like recertified people but nobody there's no states that make people take a road test again but some people could definitely use that I did have a question if if I mean to me if you have four roundabouts right because that was what I read in the paper anyway right on that street which are I assume they're both at the main intersections on either side of the school and then the two um entrances and exits correct um yeah like what would happen during um School in I mean mostly it's the morning right because that's when people are trying to get T Mas and using you know um route n becomes pretty busy at that point as does I guess pelm Road um and people so if you have four right in a row for like um roundabouts like I was thinking oh my gosh you know there's a potential for there to be this massive like backup which I've never seen at a roundabout but I've never also been at a roundabout with four closely spaced and like lots of traffic and potentially a lot of pedestrians and whatever like a massive kind of change in use of the road for you know 30 minutes every day maybe you know go to the TR Street around about next Friday about 3 or 4:00 yeah and you get a backup no and there's backup in the morning too yeah I mean there's a backup but my point my point is you all is it's not just at the one but now there are four like what happens when there's just a long line of traffic like I don't does that I don't I can't my brain can't understand how that would work it goes slower goes much slower well it has to go a lot slower but I'm just thinking like could there be impossible movement at some point like you know I I and I have to say I mean in that point I hadn't really thought about it but like I have thought about this sometimes like with some of like the like the really large speed bumps that you mass or things like that like if if people feel and like one people don't always feel comfortable with roundabouts like that letter in the paper um and I've heard many complaints about roundabouts um but then also if people feel like I mean does like putting this in will that encourage some people to like take a different route you know like what could be the consequences on other roads nearby yeah I mean and if you're saying like if you're you're saying Kim like wow this is really super slow through here I think all cut over on another Street or or some of I have to say like one Fort River parent I know and then they said well I've been trying to you know the route n construction I've been trying to cut over on Heatherstone but then Heatherstone is like backed up and closed there and you know when there's been all these road projects all at the same time people are like where can I go and but I am curious about yeah no I mean and really in the end it's about the safety of the and the roundabout will I mean it's safer and it does allow for the flow right but I think there will be points as you're saying himim you know when it's gonna be slow going through there yeah which is fine I mean everyone has to slow down and there are kids going to school and that's okay you know like that's kind of the entire Point yeah yeah yeah I do worry about like if everything down oh I can't hear you nope whoa I didn't do it we can't hear you Tracy yeah Tracy maybe you should should we all right are you going to come back in okay we we'll wait or are you okay um what has feedback from the council been on the um roundabout plans Guilford and just they referred it to that they they wanted uh they want us to talk more about pedestrians in the plan and then they wanted uh they referred it to TSO right thank you you can hear me now right yeah yeah this happened in a work meeting this morning too I don't know what happened all right okay so let's move on because um we're already at 6:35 so I did talk to Amber you know the last minutes that we had reviewed we're back in for November and we're already in October so we do have some minutes to catch up on um so if we have if we can go through the minutes uh the two minutes she gave us I would would be great yeah and uh Stefan her too you can like weigh in on the minutes and then we can get through them so um I did take a look at them both I mean there were a few things it's a little unfortunately right when we get so far behind on the minutes it's hard to remember exactly what we said where there were a few places um I thought we could maybe do some clarifications but overall I thought the minutes were fine did anybody have any other comments on the minutes I I'll just pull them up okay this is a okay so you can see my minutes so this was when we talked about um the traffic calming at kushman right I think this may have been a meeting one maybe the meeting where we had so much public comment um and then uh and North Pleasant Street Pine to Eastman and um the street light policy that now went to DPW um and so yeah Gilford it would be great if at a future meeting we could talk about that and then so I highlighted this thing here just about Mass General law about speed control within municipalities because uh and I would just send Amber note about just clarifying it so right there's a couple different things that were happening like one is in regards to kushman that there's the speed zones or the safety zone sorry and that's actually defined in Mass General law as opposed to like school zones and also the 25 M hour so the right so Mass General law you can set up safety zones which then they have speed limits of 20 miles an hour and that was the thing that the council agreed to create a a safety zone near kushman like subject to the study so I didn't remember Gilford did they actually create the safety zone before the study or do they create the safety zone after the study after the study okay ah but what they did right is that they didn't what they did is they the council approved the section of the mgl that says like in 18b or something chapter 908b I think perhaps that it says that you can that once you adopt it just like with 17 C then with 18b it allows you to create safety zones in the future yes that's I think I think that's what Amber was trying to get at but I would just like clarify that um you know just because it's a record and uh and then just the road projects and we talked about the Transportation Commission which we're still talking about and and so on and I didn't really know oh this was a topic I think that you had brought up Kim about the new crosswalk sidewalks that were in um on the south end of Krick Park yep about the placement yep Y and then um you know we also just talked about the snow and ice bylaw which again here um the online form is the form and maybe I would just ask am to clarify that too that the online form is the one that's like done through the inspection department not other online forms like it's not done through like C click fix or anything like that so um because that all make sense but I thought the minutes were fine so do we want to go ahead do we want to just look through the second set of minutes and then adopt them both yes okay all right I'm going to stop sharing this one and then I'm going to share the other [Music] one so let's see actually so just going back to the LA so the meeting on the January 7th I mean 11th one we are all here we are all at the meeting all six of us remember and then the meeting on the in March we didn't have a meeting in February it was a short month and then yeah um so let me show that one too so this was about um uh TSO uh North Pleasant Street to Pine from Pine to Eastman so that was one of those things remember we had done those site visits and then I never submitted the memo because it got dropped but then it kept coming up at TSO so I finally submitted something to them and that there had been a Community Development block grant funding to uh to do some of the work on the north end of that on the near Pine Street um and I'm assuming here this review of the TSO memo I'm assuming this is the memo from tac to TSO just sort of summarizing our feedback from earlier and then also just you know safe reachs the school and and the citizens for a Palmer rail stop um which we didn't meet with them at that time but they had reached out to me and then they came to a future meeting and um the jcpc and I think that was it right pretty much do that all look good yes looks good okay all right so I what's the word so you say uh we have we approved the minute like T approves has reviewed and approves the minutes right yes like with the Chang motion yeah you make a motion what I want that we approve the um minutes from March and January of 2024 I second yeah and I would just say as I said I'll just like make a couple tweaks and send them to Amber so we were yeah as amended right okay so everyone can say I so I'll just do a roll call so Chris I and Kim I Stefan hope hi okay and me hi so that we we approve them four to zero excellent thanks Amber thanks Amber and then okay and uh for our next meeting I had um I'm gonna stop sharing so I I do have things next week well any of the high school parents Kim Chris and the the High School open house this next week and then I have an obligation on the 17th um we could plan to meet on the 24th sure if we have updates I think also I do believe probably the TSO May refer some stuff to us I know does that sound right to you Gilford there was some things yes they wanted feedback on and um okay so I will send that out to the members I mean Marcus had said he was having trouble coming to some of the meetings I don't know if changing the time helps at all or maybe we could reach out to him about that and then also just I I mean I would be interested maybe in like trying a um inperson meeting again sometime or something um yes him what else there was something but I I totally forgot I just had something too okay thanks guys thank you thank you Guilford thank you am thanks thank you Stefan all right bye everyone by thanks bye bye Stefan