##VIDEO ID:179zejAYr7k## we we live the chair notes the time is six o'clock I call this meeting of the ammer zoning board of appeals to order my name is Steve judge as evba chair I want to welcome everyone to the meeting we'll begin with the Roll Call of the zba members and paneled for this meeting uh Steve judge is present Mr Craig Meadows present Mr everal Henry present Mr Philip White present Mr David sler present the Quorum is present also attending the public hearing tonight is J jenta Williams a planner with the town and we have an attendance also attorney Carolyn Murray of KP law who provides us guidance and assistance in this matter pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021 and extended by chapter 2 of the acts of 2023 this meeting will be conducted via remote means members of the public who wish to observe the meeting May do so via Zoom or by telephone no inperson attendance of members of the public will be permitted but every effort will be made to ensure that the public can adequately access the proceedings in real time via technological means the zoning born of appeals is a quasi judicial body that operates under the authority of chapter 48 of the general laws of the Commonwealth with the purpose of promoting the health safety convenience and general welfare of the inhabitants of the town of ammer in accordance with provisions of Massachusetts general laws chapter 48 a and article 10 special permit granting authority of the Amorous zoning bylaw this public meeting has been duly advertised and notice thereof has been posted and mailed to parties at interest all hearings and meetings are open to the public and are recorded by Town staff and they may be viewed via the town of amherst's YouTube channel and the zba web page the procedure is as follows the petitioner presents the application to the board during the hearing after which the board will ask questions for clarification or for addition information after the board has completed its questions the board will seek public input the public speaks with the permission of the chair if a member of the public wishes to speak they should so indicate by using the raised hand function on their screen or by pressing star n on their phone the chair with the assistance of the staff will call upon people wishing to speak when you are recognized provide your name and address to the board for the record all questions and comments must be addressed to the board the board will normally hold public hearings where information about the project and input from the public is gathered followed by public meetings for each the public meeting portion is when the board deliberates and is generally not an opportunity for public comment if the board feels it has enough information and time it will decide upon the applications tonight each petition is heard by the board is distinct and evaluated on its own merits and the board is not ruled by precedent statutorily for a special permit the board board has 90 days from the close of the hearing to file a decision for a variance the board has 100 days from the date of filing to file its decision no decision is final until the written decision is signed by the sitting board members and is filed in the town clerk's office once the decision is filed with the town clerk there's a 20-day appeal period for an agreed party to contest the decision with the relevant judicial body in Superior Court after the appeal period the permit must be recorded at the registry of deeds to take effect tonight's agenda approval of minutes approval of meeting minutes from September 19th 2024 September 26th 2024 and October 10th 2024 a public hearing on zba FY 2023-24 of the zoning bylaw to construct a 9.35 megawatt DC 4.4 megawatt AC ground mounted solar volt AR array spanning 41 Acres on 102 Acres site with accompanying battery storage at three Parcels of land owned by WT WD CS Inc identified as map 9B Parcels 11 and 12 map 9d parcel 27 on shsb road Ro outlying residence zoning District Frontage and access to the subject Parcels of land are located between 187 and 2011 shutesbury Road this matter is continued from July 25th 2024 and and zba FY 202-401-3006 income Ral housing on a three in a three-story building with 46 proposed part I think it's supposed to be 47 but 46 proposed parking spots on the premises of 70 belter toown road Matt parcel 15c 50 58 15 c59 15 C60 in the RN and FPC neighborhood residence and flood prone Conservancy zoning districts this is continued from October 27th 24 following that we have a general public comment period to discuss any matters not before the board tonight and other business not anticipated within the last 48 hours and then adjournment so the first item on the agenda is consideration of minutes from uh September 19th 2024 I've reviewed the minutes of September 19th I had one note I think on this on yeah I had one note on this just sent it there was a uh on the the eth page under Plumbing there's a the second um item is Storm drainage Dash connecting two and then it ends and so I think there has to be a connecting to something um and I'm just not sure what that is okay so I'm assuming that it's got to be storm drainage connecting to um the the the U storm management plan um drainage site but I'm not sure so that has to be corrected um you know what that is but of chance no I wouldn't I'd have to go back to look at the uh meeting minutes or the transcription to verify what it what it is well I I um have enough confidence that you can um do that and accurately put accurately record for the minutes what that is is there are there any other um items on the September 19th minutes that people had concerns or Corrections about not I would entertain a motion to approve the minutes from September 19th with the and give the staff permission to make uh the technical change to reflect the discussion regarding storm Drainage Systems connection um do I have such a motion I I hear I see Craig nodded yes and Mr sler waved yes so that's a he didn't know he was muted so had he had he not been muted he would have said so moved this is the sign for so moved you're interpretation is right on okay right we got that we got sign language moved and seconded is there any discussion and I would take closed moue as a sign that there's no discussion so in that the vote occurs on the motion to approve the minutes as amended with u technical changes from the staff technical conformance changes from the staff the chair votes I Mr Meadows I Mr White I Mr sler I Mr Henry I motion carries five to nothing minutes are approved as amended sec set of minutes is from um September 26 2024 I review those minutes and I found nothing does anybody have any questions about the minutes from September 26 2024 if not I would entertain a motion to approve the minutes as submitted from September 26 2024 meeting so moved second it's been moved and seconded any discussion if not the vote occurs on the motion to approve the minutes from September 26 2024 the chair votes I Mr Meadows I Mr White hi Mr slober I and Mr Henry I all right the last set before us is the minutes from October 10th 2024 um there is one I think additional area um again this these are two that I think you um Miss Williams I think that there are two that that you want to uh finish the sentence on if we look at the page page seven um it asks the chair wants to make sure it's financially feasible for the town the chair asks what the risk is them taking on the project then there's HEC response and I see if you've noted the time when Mr Erick responded and it's the same thing for the next one uh about whether utilities are are are not included again we had the time for that response but it's just not listed or it's not described in these minutes and I can tell you I'm sure that that's what you intended to do so um again I think that if you would we could either wait and have this done later or give you the authority to U make those changes is um by describing what discussion took place in those time periods 14748 and 15610 there are also some other highlighted sections I had questions about as well sure what are they Mr H yeah um I think on on my it's page five at the top of page five there's some highlights all right see top of page five oh what I don't have any highlights but what what's the description of the or what's the language applicant needs to provide charge comparing inspections yep oh I see yep and then fourth line down Henry ask Miss Williams looking to whether or not they're in provision those are all highlighted on mine me too yours true okay they're highlighted in mine all right so we should so the highlights are for um that's these were some things that were taken during the meeting and that's just my way of keeping track of what we were asking for that's why they're highlighted I just didn't remove them okay all right so the highlights will be removed for the official official minutes um any other comments or questions or concerns if not I would entertain a motion to approve the minutes of removing the highlights and uh describing the conversation uh on page seven uh where we have the minutes notated and the time notated so moved Mr chair is there a second second all right it's been moved and seconded any discussion no discussion um chair votes I Mr Henry I Mr sler I Mr White I and Mr Meadows I motion carries the minutes are approved um next order of business is zba FY 20238 ASD shsb ma solar l LC um do I understand that the applicant wishes to continue this matter and that we have a communication to that effect from the applicant's representative we do but I'm looking for Tom and I'm not seeing him well if we have his letter yes we do and um the date that I think you mentioned to me was January 28th January 23rd jary 23rd all right that date works for me um but what I would like to do is give people a chance we also have another uh let's see it's myself Mr metos Mr sler and Mr Henry are all on this panel if I'm correct Mr White you're not on the ASD shsb that's right and we only have four members on this panel so so um are you can you guys commit to that date or do you want us to do you want some time to think about it and adjust your schedule and get back and pick a date at a later point in time I muted uh I'm right now I'm available on the 23rd I don't see any reason that I can't make it so I can I can commit to the 23rd for now as can I how about you Mr Meadows you're muted Mr Meadows I realized but I was looking in my calendar and I am free Okay so let's let's put that uh let's move to continue the shutesbury road till the 23rd of January at 6 o' okay all right so do I have a motion to that effect to continue this matter till the 23rd at six o'clock so moved with audio so it's moved and seconded to continue to the January 23rd any discussion if there's no discussion the vote occurs on the motion to continue the matter until January 23rd the chair votes I Mr Meadows I Mr White I Mr sler I Mr Henry I great U so continue till the 23rd um I want to note the presence of Nate Malloy on the call as well senior planner for the town all right the next order of business is um zba FY 202- 04 wayfinders Inc requesting a comprehensive permit under Massachusetts General Law chapter 40b to construct 31 mixed income rental units on the three story development with 14 the post parking spots on 31 Southeast Street and 47 units mixed income rental housing at 70 belr Town Road um so we had some questions and M requests for materials from the applicant and I'd like to go through those that first um what they submitted and then what I'd like to do is return to the to examine the waiver requests that they have I know there's been some further discussion with Town staff on waiver requests and what I'd like to do is work through the waiver requests as much as possible in a public hearing so that we can have back and forth from the applicant not move into the public meeting for that uh tentatively approve those waivers that we are comfortable with those that are we aren't will set aside for a later point in time see if can get that through that and then I'd like to do the same beginning with the conditions now there's 100 almost 100 conditions that the staff has come up with and so I don't think we can do all of that we're not going to be able to do all of that tonight obviously so um but I'd like to do the same thing the notion is let's work through these waivers and conditions in a public hearing so we can have back and forth with the applicant and then we'll move into the public meeting portion when we decide to make the final de ision on those ideas and we can move expeditiously through them in the public hearing after having um back and forth with with the applicant does that work for everybody and is that an understandable process for the members of the board great does that work for the applicant as well Mr grber um we yes we we can we can work through the waivers this evening um we received the um the the the conditions um just earlier in the week and I mean I guess we can see where we get to with the waivers and and we have not we had not had a chance to review those on our end we can certainly start you know discussion on those um as far as a working but um so you're talking about you you just got the conditions earlier this week correct yes all right the waivers were you had before that yeah the waivers are yes okay so um then I guess we will first let's proceed with the submitted material uh from the last meeting and any questions that we had uh and I want to make sure that we have the people representing the applicant um introduce themselves Mr Gruber and um you're I I'm for I apologize I forgot I'm Ellen Fryman sorry attorney fman change the label on my box rename okay I'm doing that right now I'm sorry so no problem Mr gr give us your name and address for the record sure uh it's uh James Gruber uh a project manager in the real estate Development Department representing wayfinder 1780 Main Street Springfield Massachusetts and Miss Ryman address is 1441 Main Street Springfield Massachusetts I do want to go through the submissions that are provided by the um by the applicant as well as by the town we received presentation slides from October 17th hearing that was um there was a request to have the slides that were actually presented at the meeting and they did that there are a lighting plan revision for both 31 Southeast Street and the 70 belter toown road sites those are submitted 117 refrigerant piping Memo by AK engineering submitted um on the 7th of November a typical science detail was also submitted on 117 2024 um from the staff we received belter toown Road waiver request submitted 118 2024 31 House East Street waiver request submitted 11824 draft conditions with revisions from 118 2024 and just today we got a um uh I think a a marketing plan affirmative marketing plan from the applicant as well well um those are the materials that I have are there any other submissions Miss Williams that I should note no I think you you listed them all okay so the the first thing is the presentation slides um Mr Cherry if I may interrupt for a second absolutely I I did not see that marketing plan oh it just it just came in about an hour before an email that I I received about an hour ago there was an a mark an affirmative marketing plan is about 11 pages and it was attached to an email that I think Mr Malloy first sent and then Miss Williams resented okay I I I found it thank you got it okay yes so I mean I I think we can look at that but um it's come at the last minute so we can't make a decision authoritatively tonight but we can at least talk about it and they can describe it um so we we did have presentation slides did anybody have any questions regarding that I think that just wanted to it was just supposed to help us understand the proposal all right no question about the slides uh the lighting plan for both 31 and 70 beltron road did this involve I mean one of the pr questions that I had with the lighting plan the previous lighting plan it was just really hard to read what the and and even the printed version is still hard to read but it seems to me that um this was supposed to be in response for the questions about uh light trespass to other properties on um the Southeast Street uh site up to the I guess it would be to the left of the building um is that what is that what this reflects as a change to this to the area uh to the left of the building the neighboring property or did you make change Des describe if you made changes sure sure Mr chair um yes and and I'm happy to share my screen and I can and I maybe I can pan and and and show where some of those describe some of the um see here we go so um yeah and here is the uh here is the Southeast Street site um and we did we did make some changes at this site the um the the areas of concern were that there was some sort of some you know some very bright areas here with the you know with the with the numbers on them being you know in excess of of seven um foot candles and that um in in in higher than you know uh anticipated areas like this here where there were two lights um we had our lighting designer relook at everything to minimize um any light trespass you know along the property line and um provided these updated drawings that show um the you know the average the average areas in a in a more detailed manner as far as the entryway the parking um you know areas and the um in discussions with the lighting consultant and the uh design firm the architect um a 0.1 0.1 is on10th of uh the light that a a tealight would emit from about a foot away so that is considered generally as an it's my understanding that's considered um generally as an industry standard as you know um not it's is is sort of minimal um trespass like the my understanding that is like between 0.1 and .5 is anything above that would be considered light trespass but anything below that is is not so this site we didn't really there wasn't there wasn't a concern at this site there's a a fence along the property line here and um you know the lights are all downcast and they have um guards on them so when you look up at the lights you don't see the light you know the it the emitting light and it also um helps so that it can control where the um light is cast so the 31 Southeast Street was updated for that and it's a you know more more uniform um Lighting on the um driveway area and then at 70 beler Town Road the previous plan um showed the light trespass the this the property line here is in red and the concern was that the um there was there was light trespass onto the abing property here um our lighting designer did the same thing with the statistics that are shown here to um you know better delineate what the averages were and what the maximums and mins were in each section and was also able to to adjust the the lighting so that we're at a 0.1 um anywhere where it goes over the property line I had sent this um this plan to the neighbor as requested by the board I reached out to them um I I sent them a plan or an email and then I followed up you know a few days later with a phone call I have not heard anything back um from them on this okay so that was in response to the boards um that you to do that thank you yes um can I can we go back to 31 Southeast Street yes so the red area in front I guess that'd be East the red where all those red markers are here yeah no up right in front of the the stairs yes so all the way up um I you can't see my cursor but for the the the old building there's the stairs that go up and that area is all is that highly lit because that's um yeah it's my understanding these are dimmable lights and these are a um an an XZ which is the let's see if it's it's on here they did not put the um the can type light or the like a recess light in um so it's just a uh a recess light here in the ceiling that projects down okay and then in front on the ground where we have the plus seven plus five plus five down in front of the stairs so toward the street is that are those well lit or is that low light just it looks to me like that's well lit yes the stairs are are well lit stairs are well lit and the pad in front of it which is the um this area is yeah the patio patio and that's is that that won't be lit 24hour 247 right that is that something that be lit when in use or is that Lit all the time for it's it's lit um per the building code um per you know per egress requirements and then um it I it's I can get the exact numbers that it does go down to in a in a you know in a dimable state when it's not when it's not activated so like a motion activated to um you know reduce reduce the light when um you know in the evening when someone's not there got it okay uh well you please keep us informed if you get a response from the neighbor on um The belr toown Road Site okay are there any questions about the lighting plan all right um the next response was on the uh refrigerant piping Memo by AK engineering Mr Meadow I know you had some interest in this and some concern um you probably are better at describing this or analyzing the the U the document than than I am so does this satisfy your request it it does satisfy my request the the L pipe lengths look like they're in uh in line with what the the recommended piping is with mitubishi um I did have a couple of questions if if you could look further down in that memo um there were some areas that were well I can't it's too small now uh that were marked in with red highlights sorry but I can't see them now um if you could just ask the engineer what those uh those the meaning of those are um yeah see them right now uh let me see um would um Miss Miss Williams be able to see if there's a um the Anthony gray in the um audience and and promote them to a panelist yes he's coming into the meeting one moment okay thank you was it was it in this in this area here on it was like in this portion of it not these red areas I'm trying to see where it was my my engineer who looked at it just wanted to know what those indicated and uh and then if if you could just tell us what accommodations you've made in case there are leaks in the system at all there's a there's a great deal of refrigerate in those pipes and one of the concerns I've always got with uh this type of piping is that if you get a leak you've got a problem yeah so every circuit Mr Mr Gray just give us your name and address for the record then continue okay this Anthony gray with AEL engineering on the mechanical engineer on the project yep so all these systems have uh are valved at the branch box so if there if there is a leak it's only going to be like in a certain segment of of the piping system it's not like the whole refrigerant of the whole system is going to um leak out in that area so we do have have that um you know be beyond that the co the code based on this type of system the code doesn't require us to put any specific leak detection in in um in this system if that's something that you guys want us to look at we certainly can do that um but you know our our system right now is is going to be designed per code which doesn't require any refrigerant leak detection for this type of system all right I think it would be a good idea to take a look and see if you can determine if it you can manage to get leak detection in yeah sure we can we can look at it I will say that it's not it's not typical um but certainly we can look at it it's atypical thank you and were you able to locate where those um where those areas were that your engineer had a question on and and maybe we can um no I I'll I'll give her a call during the break and see if uh she can tell me where that is okay any other uh discussion or regarding the the memo on the um piping in the refrigerant to the HVAC system all right and Mr mow if you do get additional information um we can we obviously can return to this topic at later point Thank you and then we had you sent us a sign detail as well so um is is that the sign it has um there it is is that what you intend to use or is that just a you know a placeholder for what um what you may or may not use just a placeholder can you tell us yeah that's that's generally the sign um would would be you know similar to this we we do not have a sign um design but this is this would be um similar and along the lines that our marketing department would typically um design something generally like this at our other developments so this is a placeholder there is a um sort of a I guess a symbol or an icon you know for the development and then the development name would be located here with the um you know with the address okay so the design of the actual the lettering and logo on the on the board made vary but the sign the shape and the size is what you would like for a permanent sign correct correct okay so then when we so for your sign plan um I don't know this this would have to be included in your sign plan and then Miss Williams we'd want to say something to the effect that the sign uh comports with that in the sign plan and um allowing my minor changes to be approved minor changes including the you know the the actual words on the and name of the um development can be approved by the Building Commissioner um if he feels it's minimal or any changes to that can be approved by the Building Commissioner if you feel this minimal it's what I would how I would approach this not requiring you to come back to us with another sign design if this type of sign is what the board approves does that make sense Mr grber yes okay any concerns from board members about there'd be one sign like this for permanently in front of each on each site and then there are Provisions for temporary signs for during construction that's in the conditions but but this is your per your two permanent signs would be these right that that's correct yes all right Y and then lastly uh I think that's that is what lastly was the um the marketing plan that we received late today and do you want to run do you want to run through through that with us or is this something that we should you want us to and I'd like to see what the board thinks too as well it's 11 pages it's pretty detailed I haven't had a chance to to review it um is this something that you want to talk a little bit about and give us a an overview but I don't think we'd be prepared to approve it or discuss it discuss it in Great depth um today because we just having a chance to review it so Mr why don't why don't you give us an up you know an overview and then any uh questions that people have we can answer but knowing that we'll have to go back and look at it at a later Point um yeah so the the affirmative um Fair marketing you know housing plan that was submitted I was um is a sample and is something similar and was um submitted after you know the meeting where where we discussed that and um generally it's reviewed by the funding agencies then they all every you know they they they review that to make sure that it's in you know in conformance with with their their requirements so it is one of those things I'm happy to go over that with you um the if if there's any questions on it you know and but it's um so it's not something you're gonna have it's not something you're gonna have finalized when by the time we complete the comprehensive permit because it has to be approved by the funding is that what you're saying yes and there's a yes and there's a lot of back and forth that goes in in and that that gets tweaked and changed many many times in the course of the financial closing process leading up until the construction and that's not finalized typically until we we close on the on on on the development on the project the financial closing and you'd be required to submit the final approved marketing plan to the town if I'm correct if I read the conditions correctly is that right but Tom would have a copy of it we can give the town a copy yeah I think I think that's one of the conditions um I think that's one of the conditions that's at least been discussed okay Mr Henry I know that you were interested in this um do you want to take a look at this and a and have questions ready for the next meeting or are you prepared to ask some questions now no I think we should just um move on for now and we can talk about the next meeting okay that's the deal all right um I had a couple of things from uh the last meeting before we go into to waivers to follow up so um the first was was Staffing I would I went back to the management plan narrative that or went to your management plan and and the management plan says see management plan narrative and I think that's still the effective management plan is the one that's in the it says to see the management plan narrative and I was looking at Staffing and I and I remembered the conversation that the discussion that we had at the last meeting about how you staff um 30 hours a week approximately Wednesdays off you try to have some time during um during the weekend for people to make phone calls into the the staff and my concern at at the last meeting was we've got a lot of a lot of these units will be occupied by people working 9 to five jobs some of them will be working other hours but a lot of them will be 9 to five jobs and it may be very difficult for them to um to have access to people the residents assistance to have access um outside of you know normal business hours and your person that worked on that said well we'll we can be flexible we like to have about 30 hours of of time there and that's not reflected in the management plan narrative in any way that you intend to have a pro and I'm Noto I don't think it's our job to hold you to how many hours a week you got to have people on you know in on on site what their hours have to be what their level is but I think it would be really valuable if you would make an attempt to um to show aspir at least aspirationally what your intention is to try to accommodate those people that work nine to five jobs and can't deal with the resident assistance person um during the day because they they're at jobs and so some way I'd like to see the um the management plan for Staffing be changed to reflect what your intent is and how you might U deal with that because I think you're I think the description the representation that we had at the meeting last time was good and we'll what so I'm operating on that representation but I'd like to see that representation reflected in the management plan narrative yes and and and and and you know and I'm happy to uh send a revised management plan narrative that includes something more more along the lines of what our um you know our our staff had had mentioned at the at the at the last meeting because that's what the intent is so y That's the intent so that'd be good to have that management plan narrative i' like to have that follow through that's one thing thank you we look forward to that um on the parking plan again you just said we're going to manage it are you do you intend to have stickers do you have hangers are you going to have how it's for especially for the belter Town Road Site which you have you know 47 places and there's a possibility that people might decide that oh that's a big parking lot and there's a bus stop right over there and I don't have to go all the way downtown I'm going to throw my car in there even though he's not a resident and then um jump on the bus to to school or to work or whatever um and get free par quote unquote free parking so what have you how are you going to approach that are you just going to manage it by visual are you going to manage it by hangers are you going to manage it by a sticker on the car how are you going to do that um yeah it's my understanding that it would be some you know permitted parking with you know with a sticker or or some some way to identify the vehicles for the on-site staff to be able to um you know I guess monitor that area and and and just you did say 47 there there's 47 units and there's 52 spaces there two space that's right that's right thank you um those numbers have changed I can't keep them straight yeah so that's great and I think that should be put in the parking plan narrative then something that to the effect that we will have a system that identifies individual cars that are approved and you don't have to tell me if you're going to have a hanger or you're going to have a sticker that's up to you guys but some you you're going to have a um system to identify which cars belong there so put that in the parking plan narrative okay yes they have to be registered with h with our property management so something about that yep um another thing that came up in some discussions is people are going to take their in especially in belter town people will take their trash down to the big trash area and put it in the where there's the enclosure and there's the big dumpsters and they're going to have to walk through the whole building to get out downtown get out get out of the building walk to the dumpster if we if you can put a picture of the um if you have a picture of the the first floor of the belter Town yep hold on yep hold on one moment my concern is that that's a really long way to carry your garbage if you're just doing a couple of bags it's leaky you know garbage is not always easiest thing and and it maybe a long ways I'm wondering if you have an idea of putting a some type of carrier or um a bar kind of like a wheel not a wheelbarrow but some kind of a way for people to to move their their garbage and trash more easily than trying to carry it through that whole building then outside and drop it in the the trash area I'm trying to think about how what's the most efficient way to do that and where where would you store such a thing right so um and and yeah this came up I think in discussions at a at some point and um we looked into this and you know we discussed it with our our property management um team and their you know their their response is is that this this type of you know the trash and and and how you you know and how you you you take care of it is is just that the residents just need to be educated on how to do that um we do make special accommodations for some residents if they if they need that um but at our other properties such as um the building that I'm in um right now is is a similar property and it's you know it's about 377 feet from can you see my screen yep so so here's here's the this is a this is a four-story building on um on Pleasant Street in Northampton and this is this is pretty much the corridor path here along the way down the elevator out to the dumpster and it's about 377 ft um so it's it's similar we don't have any issues here there's on-site Property Management to clean up anything that um that you know that rips or that tears or if there's an issue and you know another one of our sites at um at Olympia Oaks in ammer granted um this is you know 550 or so feet to the dumpster from the the furthest unit and you know we're proposing the furthest the furthest distance here would be you know roughly 380 390 ft similar to the building that I'm in so we don't see this as an issue necessarily but if there it becomes an issue it's something that our management staff will um will address um you know based on the situation that they're that they're um you know faced with I guess okay so you've seen you have experience with these long runs in other properties and you figured out a way to deal with it if you need to is that that's yes yes and this is what yes this is typical and the way you deal with it is if you way you haven't had to deal with it is what you're telling me you right put in some kind of a a carrier so people can move their trash more easily all right um all right they had the same kind of question about laundry um you know they're going to be taking laundry down and some kind of a little laundry cart of some sort um could be stored in the laundry room that people could gather it have you thought do you do that is that something that's done or well number one I guess have you given any more thought to said whether there's more laundry facilities or not from the last meeting it seems to me that you were comfortable with the uh laundry facilities all being on the first floor all being in one space and that's what you your preference would be so yes that's correct right that that is correct yes and um so then we just have the question of are there a lot you know going back and forth at 36 not 360 feet but 200 and some feet from the farthest um apartment to the laundry facility do you think about how do you deal with that at your other properties do people just buy their own bags and carry it is that what they do or do you have like a laundry card or anything like that yeah I don't I don't believe we have a laundry cart I you know I think people are will take their own laundry to the you know to the laundry similar to someone at you know at another rental um building that would have to take their laundry to a laundry mat or somewhere else whereas this is on site okay um and the lastly on this again towards the management plan and our our uh I think our good meeting last week or last time you had um representations about how quickly you would get the snow snow off um and and how you know what it would take to move to move remove snow how many inches it would be U and there's not very much in the in the management narrative about snow removal except that you you put it in certain places and then you take it off if there's a lot and your guy talked about four and a half inches six inches and I think it'd be helpful to have more more fullsome disc discussion about when you are going to take the the snow off the property um than you than you have in the narrative plan in the management plan narrative excuse me it would it just would it would represent again what your guy talked about at the last meeting which made sense to me um and again it's not a hard and fast number I don't think if it's 10.1 Ines you're in violation of your comprehensive permit but it gives it shows it this is what your your your intention is about U removing snow when it gets to be so high and it shows that you've thought through yeah when it's we have that much snow we don't have very much room especially at the southeast side so I'd like to if you'd review that um and I think it would be helpful to uh you know give a more fullsome description of the snow removal process in your management narrative yeah I mean that's something that's something I can take a look at I am I am a little concerned though because it I believe that this the management plan says that when it you know when it becomes as you had mentioned when there becomes a stockpile of it being too much it would be trucked off site to describe how that happens is difficult because it's going to be it it's it's very dependent on the weather you might get a you know a 10-inch storm you plow up the snow Banks and it's you know it's very light snow so it's a small storm right and or it it it a small pile or you have a you know a warm spell for a number of days and it all melts and that sort of thing the the intent of wayfinders is to if if it you know if it's if it's an issue to to remove from site and um I I'm happy to I'm happy to revise that I just I just want to make be be clear that I I want to make sure you know what sort of detail you're looking for that to be revised too I would I I guess I looked at it and I thought it was less than fome so um when I'm looking at I'm trying to find it here it says uh we will contract with a third party we want to clear the walks compliance with local di rules dictate we have we clear the snow from the sidewalks um porous we have porous pinus pavement um we anticipate that onite onsite snow storage will suffice with snow storage areas depicted on the site exhibit six however if necessary excess snow will be transported off site um that's all it said we got we got one sentence on on that I just thought it made sense to do more what you what you've just talked about okay so that you know so it's there um all right that'd be great and lastly um we already talked about the signs that's everything that I had from uh last meeting do other people have other questions and followup from the last from our last meeting all right um if not I think we could go to um discussion of the waivers and so the way as I said the way I thought it made the most sense to discuss the waivers requests from the applicant is to run through them identify those that we think are not a problem um and then identify those that we may have a a problem with or we need more clarification or there have to be some work done on and do that in the public hearing section where we can have a conversation about it all right so let's start can we start with the waivers on um Southeast [Music] Street and Miss Williams and Mr Malloy um I know that you've ALS and Miss Murray you've ALS all worked on these so feel free to um to to add to our discussion if you think we're missing something here or there's a potential waiver problem that we did not not um identify so the the first waiver request is prohibited use you you want to wave the requirement that um currently under the bylaw that does not allow for the development of multif family units of containing 31 units on a single lot obviously I mean that's a waiver you need to get for this um second waiver really just kind of describes the um the type of units that are in the in the uh in the building and normally you have a limit on the um well what they have is a limit on the number of total number of units you can have under section 3.32 three and that has to be waved um and no more than 50% of the units can be of a certain dwelling size and again you're going to have more than that so you have to wave that in order to allow your um project to to continue I mean to be built I think and on this one at the end of that waiver request let's see it mentions a management plan as defined and form and contents I just want to make sure that it one of the your waiver request is to wave the requirements of 3323 and one of the things in 3.3 23 is that you have a management plan as defined in terms and form and context in the rules and regul ation adopted by the permit granting Authority that's us and that shall be included as an integral part other areas of the of the um the application have a reference to a management plan and I want to make sure and perhaps um attorney Murray can help me here I want to make sure that by waving this section we're not waving the requirement for a management plan you see that on the next page uh if you can go to one more page down um Miss Williams here it says in that that portion of the is it requires a a management plan and I want to make sure that we're not inadvertently waving the requirement for a management plan if I may um just add a comment thank you um so yeah so we would we wanted to be specific um in in as far as what we were uh um zeroing in on which was to um with as you mentioned regarding the number of units and also the permits that we would otherwise be required so waving it so we were specific in the section portion of that section that we were asking to um we have waivers from so so you're you really just want to be you want to wave um we don't have to allow the number of units that were proposing also to um proceed without the the requirement to have the site separate design review and special permit right separate design review right okay Miss Murray can you um work that out in the in the waiver I certainly can Mr chairman um and one thing I would just to to follow up on um attorney Fran's comment about uh the design review standards or waiver from the design review process where those fall under separate sections of the zoning bylaw uh where you see sections 3.20 40 and 32041 I think we should all they should be a separate waiver request from those sections explicitly okay all right so who's who's going to draft that I just want to make sure that gets done I think between myself and attorney FR and we can probably work out this language for uh the board's further review all right great the next is wait and please board members if you have a question or comment on any of this please um just interrupt cuz I'm looking at paper and not at the small little pictures representations of you on the on the screen um number three is a side yard setback for a shed uh we've seen that on the drawings it just means that it's going to be closer and it's going to be higher than it would normally be allowed in in the town I think they need that for um um materials and and and Equipment storage I don't have any problem with that waiver Mr can I just ask a question on that one because um they're they're asking to include um you know a shed of 10 feet um or they're saying that it'll be 10 and 12 feet high and it'll be 10 feet from the property line right if it's 10 feet high and 10 feet from the property line then it complies so I don't know whether they want to think about are they committing to a particular size of shed or at this point do they want to commit to it's going to be a 12T High shed located 10 ft off the property line you don't have a design for that a finalized design for that shed yet is that right those yeah those are those are like a pre-fabricated shed um typically that we would we would purchase and they range in height that's why the range was was placed in there to to allow for a little variation depending on um you know where that where that item was to be sourced from so it's we can we can adjust as needed but instead of saying single story we can put the specific height there well not specific but the range isn't that what you proposed 10 to 12 feet right but I'm just saying in the waiver we just referred to it as a single story if that was the issue well no I think the issue is that it might be 12T so um right so I'm saying we would say 10 to 12 feet as opposed to one story if that makes it clear that's what I see in the proposed language before me that gives him some flexibility doesn't it attorney Murray it it certainly does like I said if the board's inclined to Grant the waiver and It ultimately turns out that they um put a 10 foot high shed 10 feet off the property line and the waiver was not needed uh it's really no harm no foul right perfect I don't have a problem with three uh with number four um is fence height I think that's been indicated on the site plans I I am not troubled by the fence height waiver um I don't think the town the staff is and I haven't heard any concern from board members number waiver five is fences again um they they would need a building permit to install uh a a temporary fence and that's something that we're I think we don't need to have that done um as it can be done as part of the comprehensive permit um unless staff has a problem with that I've not heard it number six is additional lot I mean this number seven is basic minimum front okay we'll stay with six six is the additional lot area um it's more dense than it would other otherwise be allowed and we have to wave that require that uh requirement of the zoning bylaw in order to allow the building to be built as per the site design number seven is the um dimensional regulations minimum front yard setback they actually are going closer to the street um and the narrative says they're doing that because the town wants to create sort of a village feel as opposed to having it set that farther it also gives them more parking in the back um I think Mr Malloy you've had some discussion with them about this is that correct is naon Miss Williams do you know if that's the rationale behind this I don't we would have to have Mr Malloy confirm that I am on it is the question about the front setback yeah yeah the reason you're they're closer than 15 feet is because trying to create more of a village feel is that right right and in the program we had for the site try to fit a lot on there and so um yeah it it that's what it needs to be um and then there's the common you know there's a a wide RightWay in front of that uh property yep all right the same thing in the rear you got the minimum side set back you just needs to be closer to the to the U Y property line in order to allow the building to be built right right okay that's number eight so seven and eight number nine is again another dimensional regulation this is again on mean roof height is 35 ft and they want to go up to um mean height of 36 but the penthouse is 39 ft um it's part of the design I think it has to be it has to be accommodated otherwise the the building doesn't work parking um we've had a lot of discussion about parking um but there's no way there is enough land to provide for two parking spaces and they're going to work on um Town's parking and one of the conditions is that the developer work with the town to try to find some way to um increase the amount of residential parking on public streets in that area but um this does allow 14 on-site parking spaces for 31 units which is substantially less than what would be normally allowed normally required I mean waiver 11 is again parking it's it's a setback uh issue again it's on the a small lot so it would allow them to be developed within 5T of the building uh which normally I think it's it's 8 feet um is the Restriction uh again it's just it's a case of the we got really tight space and number 12 is design standards and Landscape standards um compliant with the street and site work construction standard adopt by Town Council um wave compliance with the street and site work so how different I guess the question I have is how different is the project plans from what's required by the the site work construction standards adopted by the Town Council what are we waving here well there are no there are no standards as far as we understand um can staff confirm that or respond to that yeah we have not located uh those standards so there had been some there had been some older ones uh you know decades old but nothing that was more recent so you know they had a curb radi which I think is um maybe another waiver but other than that there really isn't any uh anything that we could tell but without knowing what those standards are then we have this request you're not concerned about that waiver okay no all right the then it goes to the curb radius question you just mentioned that that's the next waiver um oneway use would be 18 ft wide this is 12T curb radius at the driveway apron and allow a 12T curb radius uh and the curb ratus shall be a minimum of 15 ft normally and that's just because again the so the property is is um there's not a lot of property there and this is the traffic engineer doesn't think this is dangerous do you support this you guys support the wa Town yeah the town engineer had no problem with this okay especially because the the street in front of this is one way so it's One Way South so you turn right in turn right out and so that it it works with the you know the limited curb radius and the waiver the next Mr sler I I have a question about 13 so it calls for an 18 feet wide for two-way use but if you turn right to go in and you turn right when you come out that's that's a two-way use right you can you can both enter and leave the property in fact you have to enter leave the the property there so how is a 12T curb adequate for two cars is is there a site plan that could be shown yes and I just like to hop in here too and say we're not requesting a um a waiver from the 18 foot wide um travel access aisle we're we're talking about the curb radius that's the the kind of the corner um by the by where it you know meets the meets the street there's there's I believe that that's in excess of 18 feet at the at the entrance but let me pull up the site plan and we can but if if you're asking if 12 feet is an exception what is it an what is it an exception to an alter alternative too it's not an alternative to an 18 foot wide uh Traffic Way is it no it's 15 feet I think Mr SL it's a waiver to it's a waiver to the Arc of the curb on the driveway apron so usually if you have a bigger radius you have a more you know a longer curve section where the road and the driveway curve to meet each other and a shorter radius means it's a tighter turn so it's not as gradual of an apron opening it's a it's a shorter um you know curve and that's where I think a site plan would be helpful just so it illustrates what that wav is showing I am sharing that right now are you able to see my screen yep yes okay so let's see great so so can you see my cursor here this is this is a larger curb radius here this is the 12T radius so it's it's this this is from 12 foot circle right here and that's what the um that's what that that's what that waiver request is oh okay the the 18 feet for the travel Lane between the two that that that's still 18 ft right yes yes oh okay all right good thank you that answers it thank you thank you that clears that up thank you um the last W the next waiv waiver 14 dealing with parking screening the requirements under the bylaw um provide effective screening and parking areas to adjacent streets and properties um and if you pull the um site plan up again I think that would help us with your [Music] request so your the screening is um you you can't screen in the back parking lot because that's not I mean that's all going to be Fields And if you screen there then You' you've you've imposed upon the parking area back there is that correct that's one of the areas that you yes yes have additional screening because it goes into a a field of our Meadow and not into property is that correct yes and there's vegetation on the on the opposite side of you know where this existing fences here and where there's houses yeah the houses are yeah back up over here and there's a field over in this this area here and you don't have screening in the front where um there you just light trespass from the Cars would just go onto your own against the building here yes no not there I mean right in front of right in back of the um the Transformer the energy Square yeah right here y this is a landscape area here but yeah yes there's there's a there's a walkway here and then and this is the community room here there's no reason for screening so that's is that the reason you're looking for the waiver um yes because in this in this area here it's it's just we have a you know we we we provide a six foot high fence and some plan things along this you know this area here around in this area there's not additional plantings however there's existing VIs vegetation on the opposite you know on the opposite properties within the you know Wetland area got it any questions regarding that from the board waiver 15 is um allows you to to have bicycle racks indoors or yes to to allow the the the bicycle racks that are shown on the plans the outdoor racks are here and in inside um in the um lower level here that's there's a a bike room with storage for um for for 31 bikes all right and um the waiver 16 is sign regulations we've kind of talked about that you want to wave um signage on the project plans that do not comply with the bylaw for development form substance and dimensions showns in the project plans does that sign that you showed us not meet the um bylaw requirements on a permanent sign is it too large I don't believe it's too large it may be uh and and it may be more than 30 in or less than 30 Ines from the sidewalk so it's it's shown it's shown closer to the front here if I so it's to it's to allow for the sign is shown on the plants here well the waivers request is to wave all form substance Dimensions shown in the project plan [Music] um I don't you know I don't want to wave all that you just want to wave the the placement right you're not asking for a sign that is that VI the sign in and of itself violates the the zoning bylaw you're asking to be able to place the sign in a place where the zoning B would not otherwise allow you to place the sign am I make that more specific and yeah identify that yeah and then okay any other any questions regarding that I'll move to 17 if not um this would allow 17 would allow you to install a temporary project sign of a of a given size um and I I have no problem advertising that this thing is going up and who's building it and and and uh who's finding it I think that's a good thing and 18 is also signage so why do you not want Building Commissioner approval of additional signage you got one temporary project sign in 18 and one temporary project sign on 17 17 is where it wants to be placed it seems to me that if you want to have it would fine for additional signs but we didn't want to go through the process with regard to the signage that we're proposing now you don't want say that again we didn't want to have a separate approval process for the signage that we're proposing now if we as you mentioned earlier if we have additional signage or changes we will be happy to have go through the Building Commissioner to do that okay but the waiver request is you can do it without separate Building Commissioner approval right am I reading this wrong to install one temporary sign of a certain size constructed of plywood without separate Building Commissioner approval right that's what we're asking for and you don't want to have the Building Commissioner approve your temporary sign we want it as part of this process the comp permit and not have to go through a separate approval process it's it's but it's if this is minimal Mr Mr chair if I if I may I think one of the other reasons for this waiver is that the Building Commissioner can grant a temporary sign um provided uh a maximum a 3-we duration they actually want this temporary sign to be up for the duration of the construction but we don't have so you want us to approve a sign that we haven't seen and we don't want us and for a longer period than the town would allow and not to have the Building Commissioner look at it right that's kind of what it is I we can create the the um criteria on which we would have that sign it's a typical sign that has all the lenders on it and you know the finan all that kind of good stuff I I I think that should be there I mean believe me but you know I just I want to see what you this is this is a typical construction sign and this is what I think is what you would expect and what you had described and is that seem that's fine and Mr Malloy or Miss Williams what does the Building Commissioner think about this do they need to approve it yeah so typically we would even on our the Town Projects on fun with block ran or mass works we would have to have a project sign that size that could stay up for you know four months and so uh we know you know temporary might be the length of the project but it's not a permanent sign that remains after right you know the Project's complete so you don't we don't need to have it approval so you're not worried about it not being approved by the Building Commissioner no okay all right um 19 is site plan review we talked about there's no reason that you need site plan review with this should be done as part of the comprehensive permit actually Mr chair if I may on this one um in this particular zoning District apartments the use would be subject to site plan review so I I think it would be prudent to just wave the site review and just say that the this whole comprehensive permit process quite frankly is a more intense site plan review process so to Grant the waiver Grant waiver 19 yes yeah yes I agreed um create driveway access without many applicable fees is and zbx and place the permitting authorities on the comprehensive permit serves as Master permit so it's is this a curb cut issue is that what this number 20 is and would there normally be fees paid to the town for a curb cut is that what this is all about and is the curb cut regulated as to where it can be cut and all that and we waving all that and because it's because it's in the site plan the approved site plan is that the thinking here yes I guess right unless the town has a a problem with this um it seems to be facilitate the completion of the project do we lose fees how much are we losing in fees would Nate or M Williams or Mr Meo I don't know you know right now what that would be um you know in staff review this we don't we don't have a we don't have a problem with um this waiver you know there are some other ones where we didn't want to wave the fee yeah but this one it was acceptable too okay and then we have Wetlands waivers on the U three Wetland waiver requirements and my question is I just want to make sure that com is okay with all of this and if they are then these waivers don't bother me but they are waivers that the wetlands and the comcom have to decide on and have to bless so are you have com does comcom agree with this do we know yeah the Conservation Commission approved the Southeast Street site already and I think they were ready to move on the belter Town Road with they had a quorum issue at the recent meeting so they're the Conservation Commission is comfortable approving both site plans all right so then waivers 21 22 and 23 are without objection from comcon right okay um 24 um wave compliance and separate approvals permits and fees with the town storm water management bylaw that is not something I'm familiar with is a storm water management bylaw so is this is number 24 of concern to the town uh no not at this time they they have to have you know they're meeing D best management practices they have you know they'll have have to comply with what they've provided to the Conservation Commission and the notice of intent and so um you know they have as part of the review was you know like the the TSS removal um storage and release of storm water so the town's satisfied with all of that okay any concerns from the members all right if not number 12 I mean number 25 deals with demolition of of potentially historic significant buildings I I don't know what that is um on this site that is being demolished but um some so Mr chair if I may I had a similar question because I didn't realize we were demolishing a building but um attorney Fryman that brought to my attention um how demolition is actually defined and the definition includes the act of pulling down destroying removing or raising 25% or more of the front back or side elevations of a building and I um it appears that at least with respect to the existing School building one facade is going to have to be taken down for connection purposes so it's not your typical demolition delay of a historic building got it ENT that has to be done for the project to go forward has currently drafted yep correct the next one deals with um sewer use regulation approval this one I'm a little more concerned with uh what you're really saying is you you just want to have in put into the permit process as opposed to getting the Department of Public Works to approve your sewer connection um and I don't know why we wouldn't require I don't know why we wave the requirement that the public works department approve the sewer and water connection our our reest is just related to the that the comp permit by definition incorporates all local permits so we're just asking that this also be part of incorporated as part of the you know that that permit local permit be granted as part of the comp permit so that we're not going and seeking separate permits but how do I make sure that you're complying with the requirements of the town if we wave the requirement for the town to approve the sewer connection well originally I believe plans were furnished to the different departments to review um I believe there's been input or at least opportunity for them to have input into the plans this is the same this is kind of the same question I have on 27 does it is it a long delay is it expensive to get the approval I mean again just by the nature of this permit by calling it a comprehensive permit eliminates the need to have to go get separate permits we can just hit the ground running with a building permit once we're finished um with the comp permit process other than state permits sure that's you know but Mr chair yeah um so clear for me how we're gonna make sure that that the town is comfortable with the connections to the town sewer and town water system so if if I may with respect to those two waivers I mean obviously the board it's within your discretion as to whether or not you want to Grant these waivers so if you were uh inclined to reject those waivers they would have to go through um the the normal process for permitting and payment of fees Etc another thought is if you're inclined to Grant these specific waivers and yes the comprehensive permit acts as the master permit including for sewer and water connections we could still require however as a condition of the comprehensive permit that they still need to submit an application to the Department of Public public works and that the Department of Public Works still has to uh either that they have to meet DPW standards um or um you know something to the effect that DPW shall review and approve which approval shall not be unreasonably withheld you know so that there's an understanding that yes DPW has the technical expertise to make sure you've got the right size pipe for example um but DPW cannot deny the water sewer connection permit itself so either way we can handle it depending upon the will of the board do that as a as a condition yes it makes sense to I I I just think we have to have DPW review over this it's it's I mean it's a it's a town service it's Town water and town sewer and I don't I don't think you are trying to to to get away with something here it's just that normally every you know every town should require that all right so trying to streamline the processes what this the goal is yep the goal I I like streamlining that's why we have a comprehensive permit that's the whole idea here but um we don't want to wave something that I think is in public interest we ask just a question and what about um a review now before the comp permit's issued to have them sign off on it if you can get that done before that would be great then we'll include it as then it becomes part of the record okay I don't know what they've already seen maybe they've already um have reviewed I'm not sure but we can explore that okay explore that if not um then we'll have we'll look for a condition to require the approval without um unreasonable delay and then the last two are um Planning Development guidelines U for separate tree wared approval to W compliance with the Amorous landscape guidelines um removal and planning shown on project plans I you know you as far as I'm concerned you've shown which trees are going to be removed on the site plans there weren't any concern about that I don't know why I would have a further review of the of the trees on the site all right and the last one is development plans to allow waivers to requirements and local bylaws and regulations relating to dimensional use requirements to the extent necessary to build a project project as presented on this project plans and any subsequent amendments that may be subject to permitting Authority and are so approved that that just I read that and it looks like just a a big blanket waiver of almost anything is what's the what's the purpose of this waiver request we have seen it in other decisions that have been issued by this CBA um and I I think you know it's a catch all yeah it's um you've reviewed the plans and you're basically saying yes we've approved the plans if we've missed something or have something incorrect we're granting it because we've approved the the by virtue of approving the plans it incorporates the waiver but does this bypass any review by The Building Commissioner if we say yes to this provision we're not going to CH we're not changing anything we're not changing any of the pl any anything that has been submitted and approved by this board we're not changing anything that would have another process we're just saying you've signed off on everything that we've sub Ed and we've um identified all the waivers that we believe are appropriate if something is was is just inaccurate but not not changing the plans is again just a cut off and and what if you have to do something with the plans what if you have to change the plans during we come back we have a there's a process for that okay W can't change anything without coming back to you and asking it it could be a minor and you have to determine if it's a minor change or a major change so I we have seen this we picked we didn't create this this was in another at least one other um decision that was issued by the zba Mr Malloy you have your hands up yeah staff would not recommend waving or granting this waiver so that's we've communicated that uh it is a blanket waiver and you know in the decision we enumerate a number of the things that are considered insubstantial and don't need um to be reviewed by the zoning board and then like attorney Fryman said there are things that need to be reviewed but we would not you know have this waiver um you know we we try to identify everything that is needed and so to have this blanket waiver meaning any other local bylaw if we miss it here is just waved without uh review that's something that the Building Commissioner and staff wouldn't recommend okay so well you kind of confirmed my my initial concern about this is over the broad waiver um so we've gone through the W are there any additional waiver requests this is it for the time being right for 31 all right so let's just that's correct so the ones that we most all of these you know can be approved but just run through the ones that either were going having more work coming back to us or we we aren't um that we have some ones that we have concern about like the last one um attorney Murray do you have you kept a list of these which ones I I have do you do you want me to go through them just give us the numbers the ones that um um I have I have number two needing some language about the management plan yep yep yep uh number three as to the the actual height of the shed all right okay he my pages bear with me yeah I'm going through um would would if we set a shed now to exceed 12 feet in height would that be sufficient that just solve the yeah yep I think that's fine okay I think most of the other ones were explained 16 I think with respect to the sign um we just needed a little more detail as to where that you know where the sign would be placed yep that's 16 Y and then uh com and the rest of them I think are okay aren't they until well we'll come back to you with regard to to um 26 and 27 yep yep 26 and 27 all right and that is it and then the last one 29 we're concerned about that that waiver is the catchall waiver all right so um I think we've gone through these waivers um we've got some work on that it'll come back next week but I think when we go through the waivers the next time we' pretty much eliminated a lot of the discussion that we need to have and just we'll focus on coming back for the ones we had identified as having concerns about at our next meeting any comments from board members before we go to break and then come back and do the waivers for U belter Tom Road I if I may ask ask um the applicant one question on number 29 um what is the impediment or downside if we deny this request number 29 I think uh we'd just have to come back if there was something that we saw that was inaccurate um did wasn't reflected correctly in the decision that was was part of what was already what was approved again it's not change we're not changing anything as far as what's been submitted or what um been approved it's just how how it's characterized in in the um decision itself I I don't know that this that it will be a problem but it's just kind of a protection provision saving time and avoiding us having to come back but there's also I'm going to look at the I'm gonna where we you know what other decisions where this was granted and see if it was a you know we can talk about it I think it was sorry I think it was the valley CDC decision for ballan that had a similar waiver but there also is Provisions saying that um you can Building Commissioner can allow for movement of buildings and based upon um ledge or if if it's 2 feet this way or 2 feet that way there's some flexibility already that the Building Commissioner can approve um construction even though it is not um exactly what's in the site the approved site plan yeah no this is more if there was um a portion of a a waiver portion of a provision that should have been waved and it wasn't included in something you know that that situation okay does that answer your question Mr Henry it does thank you Mr chair all right well let's take a it's 7:41 let's take a f minute break Mr Meadows you get chance to call your engineer um I'm G to get a drink of water and we'll all be back and go through the waivers for The belr toown Road Site at in at 7:46 sh e e e e e e e e e e for all right uh it's 7:47 good timing so I think the next thing we should do is go through the U requested waivers to the 70 beler toown road a lot of these are similar there are some differences but a lot of these are similar um so Mr grber um yes I would ask just if um before we start um was um Mr Meadow is able to um discuss with his engineer just our my engineer um is here and um if Meadow he was on the phone so I'm yes okay I'm on the phone with him now oh so Mr Meadow when you do uh get an answer we we can break into the waiver request so that they're um engineer and you can speak about um that issue okay all right um so let's start with waiver number one prohibited uses this this allows for multif family development that would not otherwise be allowed on this single lot so I mean that has to be done in order to build this project number two is um construction within 100 fet of a FEMA flood zone in a flood prone Conservancy area again this is I think this is a comcom issue um and Mr Malloy or Miss Williams where's what's the stat comcom approval they're they're inclined to approve that they just didn't have enough uh didn't have a quum at the last meeting is that what you is that the case that's essentially it Mr chair okay so if there is a problem we'll know about it before we have final approval that is correct yes so two doesn't seem to be a problem um three I think is the same thing we had with uh number two in the last one whereas I want to make sure that we we're not waving them the management plan it's the same issue I don't think we have to go any more detail of that um four is filling of land which is all I I don't think that's done on on the at all on the other site so I'm assuming that you've worked with the to down and they're comfortable with the the site plan the grading and all that kind of stuff that the the normal that the requirement and the limitation on on Phil uh which we we have in the bylaw has been will be exceeded by this and the town and has looked at that and is not is not concerned about it is that correct Mr Malloy correct so as part of the project you they are bringing up Phil so that that that's all fine yep got to do it okay uh we've got this uh five and oh Mr Meadows I see you're back I'm back yeps if we could have the piping plan put back up again please y I'll just share my screen here okay can you see my screen yeah I don't know that this is in the upper leftand corner there were some indicators there what after the temperature Mr Gray do you know oh yeah that basically tells us that it it can operate at low temperatures that's the uh the catalog data shows that it can go down um -4 to -13 degrees that's what that indicates there so that's the low temperature limit yes okay so if we get down below -3 does the system uh have a diminishing amount of output or does it stop the system actually will continue operating down to -8 uh it will be at at a diminished output below 0 degrees you have a graph as to what that output might be below zero I can get that for you that's in the engineering manual I don't have that available right now but I can get that for you okay thank you okay anything else Mr Meadows on this issue I think that's it thank you okay all right so we've um no problem with number four number five this is the same issue on um a shed language that says up to 12 feet I think solve my problem I don't know we need to do anything more than that number six is temporary construction fencing um is shown on the W perit requirements for all fence is shown on the project plan and include this part of the comprehensive permit I think I don't think that's an issue dimensional regulations um for I mean it's it's more dense and is allowed by the zoning bylaw but that's the nature of the property and the nature of the project number eight is um minimum setback this I misspoke earlier um this is the place where you're trying to bring them a little bit closer to the the street so that it feels less like a it feels more like a village I think that's what you wanted to accomplish here Nate I think right one of the things that's trying to bring it a little bit closer um so it feels like it's um all part of a village down there that part of ammer part of the reason for this correct correct yeah so the original site design was uh maybe the building was set back a bit more and the town wanted to have a yeah Village Escape there a streetcape um lot coverage is what you need for the you need for parking and for the building um it exceeds that it exceeds it on dimensional regulations for height this one is more significant it's as opposed to 35 a roof height of 41 um but that's what you need to get for the three the three stories as well as the um the additional um mechanical things on the top of the building I think right uh parking here we have um practically one to one one parking place for each proposed dwelling unit close to it 52 to 47 um we've discussed that a lot I don't know if people have problems with the um the waiver gruning a waiver for the number of parking spices design standards parking dimensions number 12 this really if if I'm correct this mostly deals with the need for the number of compact spaces that's that's really what we're looking at here because this we don't have any site work construction standards to deal with so can you explain that waiver for us there are um there are compact spaces on the on the property um and I can pull up a let me see if I can pull up my site plan here so what's the waiver that you need there um to allow to allow 12 compact spaces as part of the otherwise we would need another permit to or you know come to the zba and the plany board to allow for compact spes which is a instead of 9 by 18 they're 8 by 16 so we really waving the approval process to do that got it and that's what you so that's included in the project plan and in the site work right got it okay I don't have any problem with that um design standards and landscape standards this deals with indoor bike storage for residents and you have 48 indoor bicycle racks correct yes and by waving this we in effect have granted the design location number of bike rack shall be approved by the special permit granting board as part of the approval of a permit okay number 14 is landscape standards dealing with parking areas screening of parking areas can you bring up the just bring up the um site plan for belter toown Road yes let me just blow that up I think most the only place we have to worry about this is the neighbors budding neighbors to one side behind it is conservation land so I don't think this is a big issue can you all see my screen yep yep so here's um the driveway aisle and then there were some uh plan things that were added uh by the dumpster area here and and we've provide um the plantings here that are I I confirmed with our landscape architect this this planting row would be roughly 6 to8 feet tall when they're planted um initially and the area over here is the Wetland area that's wooded and and there's a um there's some plantings that create a buffer between the Wetland area but it's there's um and then this is just seated down into the um bio retention area here so we do provide we do provide this here on this side it's it's you know as you mentioned it's the conservation area so all right I'm not I'm not concerned with that waiver number 15 is sign regulations we should we should just be consistent with this the same thing we're doing with 31 the Southeast Street and again with 16 I think it's the same issue 17 we want to be consistent with what we just discussed on on the Southeast Street site site plan review again speak up if you're you have a question about any of those site plan review number 18 um we have a more robust process and site plan review so that could be waved uh curb Cuts we had the same issue on Southeast we approve that Wetlands protection again this all comes down to what the comcom says when they finally meet so we'll deal with that um if if there is a need for something yes we're not meeting until December 4th and we'll be um so we'll be back here next week so I guess then we this would not be finalized until the 12th is that the idea well not yeah these won't 20 and 21 wouldn't be finalized until then okay but that's I mean it all we have to wait for the comcom whenever they right right I just wanted to tell you that we wouldn't be we're not going back till the fourth so com yeah okay so that's 20 21 and 22 23 uh so the the build the house that they're de demolishing is a historic house that's the need that must be the need for this yeah and we have the sign off from the um Mass historical commission great um and then we've got the with 23 and 24 it's the same issue that we had with uh with with the Southeast Street I want to make sure that the approval you get the approval without undue delay but the approval from the DPW um water connect 25 is the same issue 26 is consultation with the tree Warden you know I I don't feel that we need the tree Warden to to look at all the the trees you've identified the ones you want to put on the um that you're removing on the site plans and we have some conditions that will deal with replacing trees that that die because of the construction work so I think this is fine and and a lot of the the trees are are on the U will be pointed will be taken down but the um screening is only to the con to the conservation land uh development per plans the same issue we had in the last one that we've got to get some more information on so I I think we kind of went through a lot of this already um on the waivers attorney Murray so just again what I think we should probably do for the next meeting is highlight those that we have either a question about and then the ones that we're that I'm concerned about which and I think the board is uh which we're concerned about and don't want to not inclined to Grant and then have that prepared for the next meeting and there's some information that we're going to get from um I on a couple of these and we can build that for the next um the next time we deal with conditions but I don't unless people feel differently I don't think we need to go over conditions again until we're prepared to do the final approval of conditions and that could be uh that could be in know you know a couple of meetings from now all right okay so it's it's 803 seems to me Mr grber I yes thank you I would just like to check to see if uh uh Mr Gray was able to find the um find that graph that he could um show Mr Meadows yeah sure I can pull that up one second can you all see my screen yep yeah so at five degrees you get 100% of the expected capacity out at at zero you get around 92% at -5 you get just over 80% and this is this is the graph for for heating it looks like actually it goes down to -20 and then at that point the operation and ranges it's not recommended operating beyond that what do you do in that case if if you get a well if we get -2 that's probably not as likely as what happens it shuts down yeah it will shut down at that point yeah we you know we designed the design for the design conditions on the on the project as required um so obviously we're we're not designing forga -20 I know some of the the HVAC um I guess it's it's they have an additional um gas or electric heater that comes in for some of the uh the more efficient Air Handlers at um air exchangers I guess it is they have you have to get a a a you can buy a supplemental system but that's not something you're thinking about when you get you just built this for 20 below and if it is 20 below people are going to be cold going to be in blankets and yeah I mean that that's almost a doomsday scenario but we do have ventilation units that have electric resistance heating so the building is not going to be freezing um in that case the those units are are to operate as long as the building is occupied and they will provide heating um for the building and in a measure it's not uh going to be the the full design but it will not let the build inrease Mr Meadow do you um just give you all the information you wanted yeah and are you saying Mr Gray that that these mbishi units have got supplemental electric resistance we have we have separate separate heaters throughout the building um that are supplemental and electrical heaters um that are electric resistance they're not on a heat pump and then we also have ventilation units Erv units that are providing ventilation air that is heated um so that that Air does not rely on a heat pump it relies on electric resistance heating which can operate under any condition as long as the unit is still operable um so that will provide heating to the building and to offset the low temperature condition it won't allow the building to freeze all right hopefully we're not getting 20 below yeah def we I remember the last time we had 20 below for more than five days in a row it's about 40 years ago I was cold yeah well you couldn't do this in Minnesota you'd have to have more electrical resistance heating as a backup but we're not in Minnesota we're in western Mass all right any other questions regarding um the waivers or anything else I guess what I would like what I thought of doing Mr guber um yes I just had one one question uh regarding uh the timing of um I guess maybe like supplemental or revised sheets um you know drawings such as at belr toown road we had you know the the parking had adjusted as you had you know were was presented to the board just a timing of when those sheets would be um you know provided to the the board and and how those would be referenced in the um in the decision well um before we take I the standard answer I think is before we proceed to the final approval all the documents need to be uh need to be um submitted to the board I anticipate that we're going to meet um next week on the we'll meet on the 21st then we next time meet on this on is it the 12 12th it's December 12th so I anticipate that on the next week we'll go through the conditions um in kind of do the same thing we did today go through first cut on submissions on on conditions um and then we'll start the process of of um and I don't know that we'll get all that done and then we'll we'll have the meeting in in December where we can try to get as much we can work through the final finalization and I would you know I think it's possibility that we could finish this up in the December meeting I think that's a possibility um I'm not seeing a lot of there's not a lot of controversy here we just have a lot of process to go through and I think that's the it's it's that's a real possibility so if I were you I would try to have everything ready for us on the for the that first December meeting um and to the extent that you can get it for next week some of the even the waiver stuff to us for next week we can try to resolve out of the way um does that seem reasonable uh Nate Mr Malai yeah sure I was goingon to say that um you know there's other unresolved things besides waivers the local preference hasn't been determined um you know the marketing plan was there so if not at the next meeting the following meeting you know we could have a list of things that the board could consider so I know local preference is something that may take time to discuss in terms of what's the right percentage right but that's part of conditions right that's part of a condition it is it is yes yeah oh okay I thought I thought we discussed that in and uh the wayfinders um was that we would we would work with the town to request the maximum allowable at the 70% um you know per the per the the funding agency and that's what's in the the draft conditions is the 70% but you know somebody may want to want to um amend that change that number a board member may have a issue on that but that is on we did discuss it we may want to discuss it again but it's part of a it's one of the conditions one of the 100 conditions that we have if that it's at 70% of the draft conditions and you know so optimistically can we get done in December that would be great that would be great it gives us all holiday present um if we don't get it done on the 20 on the first meeting in December where we have H what's the next meeting in December M Williams so the next meeting we only have the 19th um is what we have for December mber and then you would be into January 9th and 16th all right so just to clarify we have the 12th and the 19th and then the nth correct well we have the the 12th for sure the 19th don't we have a lot of no so here's here's what happened um just so we're all clear and I think I sent a couple emails but maybe they were not um it was n communicated or maybe it didn't resonate essentially because this meeting today which was supposed to be a half wayfinders meeting became a full wayfinders meeting um we needed to reserve the 12th for regular zba business which means the 12th is now full CBA business only like for the town it is not a wayfinders meeting because essentially the rest of the year would have just been wayfinders and the town would not accomplish anything on our end so that is what happened you essentially kind of got a Bonus meeting today by having this meeting to yourself on the 14th um so the next full wayfinders meeting is the 21st the 28th is Thanksgiving so that is obviously we're not meeting and then the 12th we as the town need that to process our own applications so that is no wayfinders at all um next we have four we have four special permit uh very request for the 12th right yes and so the 19th is your next full wayfinders meeting the 21st and then to the 19th yeah okay still we have a shot at getting this done before before Christmas so and if not we we'll be going into the next we'll be yeah going in on the 16th okay all right are there question you know I don't know that it makes sense to start going through the conditions the applicant said they hadn't seen it until recently and had a chance to go through them so I don't want to do this without um them being having the opportunity to review it prior to the the meeting I mean a lot of these are are standard and um boilerplate but you know I think you need to you need to have the time to go through it so my feeling is that it doesn't make sense to go down go through the conditions at this point we'll be prepared for next week okay so I would encourage uh board members take a look at the conditions um I've done that there's a lot of them um if you've got questions about them uh just general questions don't hesitate to call staff and get clarification um if not we'll try to run through the conditions next week and make some decisions about you know preliminary decisions about those before we Final on the um meeting after all right okay so are there other questions regarding this from the board regarding this um application speci comprehensive permit Mr chair do you wanted to see I don't know if there's anyone in the public that was going to be next before that before I leave this I was going to ask about public comment I know we have 15 people we have three attendees that's they dropped off we yeah they were here for shoot spy but um I think they're a little disappointed so I may just take you up Mr chair and ask one question sure um with the parking situation where there's potentially only 14 Lots um and looking at the neighborhood with street parking I mean it is a busy street um to actually have Town resident Park in there is is there any contingency are you guys looking at anywhere else for possible offside parking um to maybe your adjacent building would that be would you allow residents to park over there um what is is there any conversation around that um well currently the the street does have on-site parking and in conversation with the town it was to be a more formalized sort of you know parking scenario on the street um I would let you know as far as so there is there is street parking there now um and you know we felt with the onsite parking and on the on street parking that there was you know an acceptable level of of of parking would be provided for the for the residents at that building sorry do I have it backwards Bel is so the issue is not belg toown Road okay yeah we're talking about Southeast Street correct okay then yes 14 yeah with the 14 spots and then the additional um like right in front of the building I believe there's roughly could be as much as 10 you know 10 parking spaces directly in front of the building on the street is that and then there's additional additional parking along the road there as well and you know there was some discussion with the town or there's there there's been discussion at our meetings that there is some consideration of the town about doing some residential parking restrictions or and I don't know the nature of those discussions if that's gone on with um Town Council because they would have to make the decision to do that but that I think Mr Henry was was one of the things that people were talking about is perhaps putting in a residential parking area up in front of the the building to provide additional parking for the residents of that building but thank you I'm not sure what the Town Council is if they've looked that at all Mr M do you know if there's been any discussion about that any further discussion uh there's been no discussion at the council level but um between the Departments that would look at that Public Works police uh treasure and planning uh everyone supports it it's just it's a little early to bring it to council the the town has plans to you know repave that road and do utility work there and so at that time probably next summer that'll move forward um with getting you know a residential permit in place for at least you know 10 to 15 parking spaces along that section of road because I think you're right Mr Henry every time I drive past that area those there are people parked in front of that the old school um it's it's not like that's an unused General parking area right now okay great all right um we have no nobody from the general public wishes to speak if you do it's the time to do that I don't see any hands no I see no hands all right then uh the next order of business is public comment on any matter not before the board tonight oh before we do that um we want to continue this public hearing uh until next week so continue this public hearing until the 21st at 6 o'clock nope 7 PM oh that's right thank you you saved my you saved me for that 7 PM next week thank you very much I have I cannot be here before 7 o'clock next week so I'm asking all you guys to give me that courtesy uh to start the meeting at 7 um do I have a motion to continue this to 7 o'clock on the 21st so moved second seconded any discussion if not the vote occurs on the motion to continue this meeting till 7 o'clock on the 21st the chair votes I Mr Henry I Mr sler I Mr White iow I motion carries um we'll continue this to the 21st the next order of business is public comment on any matter not before the board tonight we have no one in the attendees room the last attendee just disappeared they are all gone we are a riveting Bunch we've really captured everybody's attention tonight that's for darn sure all right uh um then there's the last order of business is anything not anticipated and we've already gone in the last 48 hours we've already gone through the schedule so I think we've got everything on that um all done all right uh next order of business is a motion to adjourn so moved it's been moved is there a second so seconded all right it's been moved and seconded motion is not debatable the chair votes iess thank you was that a vote Yes all right Mr sler I Mr Henry I Mr White hi and Mr Meadows hi all right we are all adjourned thank you very much and we'll see you next week at 7 o'clock good night everyone bye