e May City Commissioner Smith you give us the prayer pledge and fact of the day please sir let's s the attitude of prayer oh gracious and almighty God The Giver of every good and perfect gift creator of all man can we come before your presence once again to say thank you thank you Heavenly Father for this opportunity to be Servants of this city we ask for Lord you continue to lead us and guide us at all that we shall do and say will pleasing and acceptable in thy sight in thy son Jesus name we pray amen amen algi to the flag flag of the United States of America and to the republ for which it stands one nation God indivisible with liy and justice for all the day on April 30th 1803 representatives of the United States and Napoleonic France concluded negotiations for the Louisiana purchase a massive land sale that doubles the size of the young American Republic what was known as Louisiana Territory comprise most of modern day United States between the Mississippi and the Rocky Mountains with the exception of Texas parts of the New Mexico and other pockets of land already controlled by the United States back to the that all right got a set of minutes I need adjustments to the minutes not look for a motion to approve yeah just the on the minute side of things we had gotten a draft of minutes and then it appeared that they were heavily edited so I don't know who instituted those changes to the minutes from the draft to what they were now I had some part in that okay well that needs to be direct from what was actually occurring in the meeting so we need to not change them to inaccuracies so there was some public comment that were adjusted some comments I made that were adjusted or or just completely removed so we want to make sure we're doing that so I don't know if we want to totally redraft these and then come back at the next meeting to get it accurate okay we'll do it so let me ask you what's the procedure with the minute I mean you you typee them and they go to review by who is is that the process they had been going out to to be and then if there's any changes from anybody then they but do we get the draft copy we don't get the draft copy it was it was available yeah it was available we we we haven't gotten him consistently we got it this last meeting or this last one as a draft but prior to that we weren't getting him as system the draft but are there major changes to it or omissions or things taken out of it I don't believe they're major Ian there was were a couple of additions okay so we'll bring it back next council meeting no problem okay all right next up agenda review yes sir mayor just just for the the public and not to tie their time up um and on consultation with the labor attorney we can take the labor negotiations and move them to after the meeting um and it will still be in accordance with Florida State Statute so I'm just recommending that we move that to after the meeting so we can keep the public moving through and we're not wasting their time okay awesome thank you chff appreciate okay next up Proclamation for international firefighters day we got a couple of our firefighters in the house appreciate y'all coming over and being a part of this so it's the international firefighters Proclamation and it reads as such whereas International firefighters day is observed each year on May 4th to honor and remember past firefighters who have lost their lives while serving their communities including Austin Duran a member of the Apopka fire department who gave the ultimate sacrifice in 2022 to Express gratitude to those that have served in the line of work and to show support and appreciation for those who resed who presently serve and whereas regardless of the language a firefighter speaks or the country in which he or she works and resides all firefighters fight against the same enemy fires and whereas firefighters follow a long line of tradition and honor that inspires them to help colleagues neighbors and strangers alike and whereas at a moment's notice firefighters are quick to respond to uncertain situations to mitigate danger and combat the threat of destru CED fire in order to protect individuals families and the economic being of our communities and whereas the demand of firefighting are Acom accompanied by both personal and physical tools that all firefighters knowingly accept while risking their lives to protect the lives of others and now therefore I Brian Nelson mayor of the city of Apopka Florida do herey Proclaim May 4th 2024 as International firefighters day so come on who you like to get a get a picture [Music] I don't need to be seen as much [Music] [Music] Chief you're recognized all right well first and foremost I want to thank uh the mayor and commissioner for the recognition we also uh I want to thank the men and women of the apoc fire department for their dedication day in and day out um there are certainly a lot of things stated in this uh in this document that that are true you know they face trials and tribulations um from 8:00 in the morning till 8:00 the next morning so I we really appreciate everything everything that you guys do um we were kind of joking the other day May May the 4th uh we're just happy we get to see our Star Wars day with uh with the the same the same dates thank you thank you very much thank you Chief all right we've got a presentation uh by Deo on the golden gem reclaim water storage Pond repair update Deo good good afternoon mayor and commissioner my name is De Budu public service director over the past few weeks we had several inquiries in numerous traffic and social media on the pawn liner bridge and vicinity depression at the golden gem Reclamation water storage Pond as you know we became aware of this issue back in January 24th 2024 and reported to the regulatory Agency on January the 30th 2024 today I'm pleased to introduce it to you our expert Dr dvo siram from dvo engineering who is a subc consultant to the city contracted engineering fir ingwood consultant engineering and has been working several month on this project D will provide an overview of his finding and and the remediation plan Dr D is a graduate of UF University of of Florida he has done his he's a honorary student there he did his first degree his Masters and his PhD from that that University he has been an expert in engineering practice for 40 years and is an expert in geot technical engineering geohydrology ground water among many facets of engineering and a well known in Florida the Caribbean and around many of United States he's also an expert witness on numerous complex engineering failures forensic evaluation so with no forther delay I will ask him to come to the podium and um provide his presentation uh thanks da uh yeah I've been doing this since 1986 move the mic up there go sorry okay so just remind me if it drops back down I've been doing this since 1986 which makes it 40 years in 2026 and uh I'll tell you something the technology we have today I wish I had that when I started in the practice what we have today is amazing compared to what we had in 1986 I was the first student at the University of Florida to be assigned a personal computer as to tell you how old I am now the what I'm going to describe to you is on the scale T complexity in what we do maybe a nine out of a 10 but I've tried to simplify it as much as possible the the first thing I'd like to for those of you who are not familiar with the uh project I'd like to get you oriented to where we are in the background is golden gem road to the left is pin and then the 429 is to the east and I'm going to use the mouse and cursor through this video This is actually Channel 99's video not mine but uh what you see let me use a pointer what what what I'm going to describe to you is actually like a movie because it's hard to imagine this would happen but what you see there is a volcano and what you see here is what we typically sorry I uh knew this was going to happen is uh what we would normally call a sinkhole but I hesitate to call it a sinkhole and what I'm calling that is equivalent of M shaft collapse it's very different from a sinkhole because it's does not look like one when you look into it what you see is a vertical cylinder 75 ft wide almost perfectly circular which you don't find in nature that goes down to a depth of over 30 ft so it looks like like a sinkhole it has a Genesis of a sinkhole but when I describe it and tell you how we fix it you have to think about it as fixing a mind shaft a vertical M shaft now the volcano on the side I'll show you an image of it underw what it looks like it actually is an impressive underwater lier that was done with underwater uh equipment used by the US Navy and you'll see what it looks like underwater it is I'm going to call the volcano innocuous I don't think we have to worry about it and I'll explain why the Mana we need to fix it is a to me not unexpected I think when this project was conceived there was not enough thought process on the soils and the nature of the land where we are but then again I'm an expert I've done over a 100 litigation cases in the State of Florida on subjects like this I don't expect every engineer practicing to have my experience I've also done the largest Reservoir in Florida the CW Bill Young when it failed I got involved now this here is I'm going to point now to this this is what I'm calling the Min shaft it was discovered by the city on January the 24th 2024 now I looked at the satellite imagery we we get satellite images now two times a month on infrared from all the mo modern sat satellite technology we use you have to get high security clearance to use their programs but I have it so I went on and I started looking at this reservoir on the satellite images twice a month to see how this developed and if it actually developed before January 24th 2024 and I'll show you some of the satellite images the satellite images are very appropriate for this because what they do is they detect infrared they're telling you where it's wet where it's dry where it's Upland and I can show you the water level in the reservoir two times a month where it is exactly and what I can also show you is that this thing actually failed on January the 5th 2024 not because somebody saw it because we have satellites that are actually pinging the ground I'm picking up that so this it was not there in December 2023 it definitely was not there in November 2023 I'll show you the reservoir levels but I see it in J on January the 5th 2024 the city sees it about 20 days later now this is what I call a m shaft when you look down this what you're seeing is actually I don't want to use the word impressive because it's going to cost you money so impressive and money don't really go together but it is a actually an amazing feature that's approximately 90 ft long oh my goodness I did it again I knew this was going to happen let me get back to it now the shape of this I called papaya but you may tell me that it has a different shape but it looks like a papaya it has a big lobe at the bottom and a small lobe at the top and inside of it when you look down you are seeing vertical sides all the way down it's like almost like concrete we we don't see that we don't see a shaft that's 75t diameter 30t deep with vertical sides that's not something we see but I'll explain to you why that happened and what we are looking at now I'm going to try and pull this forward now without messing up again so I'm going to take you into the hole and you could look down and now you can see what you see there that water level you see in there the ground on the floor of this particular part of the reservoir now this Reservoir is not tree cells it's one cell with three Terraces so it's basically one Pond terracing down at three different elevations it starts at 69 comes down to 67 and then goes down to 60 because there was a plan to keep this above the water T certainly that didn't work out exactly but the design concept originally if you look at the original plan it had a water table of 62 and a flat bottom of 67 and that's the way the borrow pit was permitted in 2016 with a flat bottom of 67 when the Bor pit contractor got out there and was told take as much as you want out of this pit he couldn't he had to stop he couldn't he can only get to 67 at certain parts of the pit and I'll show you where he could and where he couldn't as he got to the north side of the pit he had to go up in elevation because he couldn't control the water the water became a problem and this 67 that was conceived on the plans was not achievable in reality because forget about geotechnical engineers forget about B RS we have something more sure than that we have a contractor out there digging the ground trying to get the dirt out to take it out as much as he can and he's permitted to do it and he can't and I'll show you where he gets to and where he stops before the reservoir project starts and why that should have been considered in the final design because that is a proof of where you where you can actually control the water and have a successful project that I consider a big mess by the designers um now but I I also have a fix for you today so I'm not going to leave you with Doom and Gloom I have a fix but I'm going to suggest additional work that's out of my area of expertise to have a a specialist look at this from a holistic standpoint now the that's 35 ft deep the water you see in there is that light green water that is our aquifer that is the Floridan aquifer water level you're seeing in there it's not the water table that's the water we actually drink that's connected directly to the lamb Rock there is a uh connection going from here into the deep rock which is where that soil went that soil did not go horizontally because it's not there and the water some of it went horizontally but the majority of it went straight down because we we are calculating about 200 million gallons of water lost now 200 Millions gallons of water if you're familiar with pumps in 30 days that's about 6,000 Gall a minute over 30 days being lost a typical big pump you see out there the contractors are using is 1500 gallons a minute so this is like four pumps going in 30 days 24/7 that's being lost now if we had lost this water in one day it would have been catastrophic why 200 million gallons over 24 hours that's 150,000 gallons a minute that's not something we have ever heard of in Florida to get rid of that water and chunk it down into the aquifer so in a sense uh the liner helped us because when the liner when this m shaft broke out below the liner the liner only uh one of the seams gave way and the rest of it held and water just poured through a seam like a spout and I think that actually pre prevented a catastrophe and I'll show you that spot um now the liner we know is also very effective and the reason we know that is because what happened here with this volcano and I'll back out a little bit if I can see the volcano it's off on the side here the volcano actually is very unique in that where that volcano occurred is another phenomena that we don't see every day but we've seen it before and we've seen it especially in the Deep wells in Florida and we see it where parking garages rain down into a manhole and an air pocket hammers out what happened with that volcano is all of the soil airspace below the bottom liner suddenly got filled that volcano left us a clue of where our escape the last pieces of air remained and then it blew out like an air gun and busted out like an air gun because the water crowded it out filled all the air space up and the air started concentrating at this one point until the air pressure built up because it entirely filled with water and the air has nowhere to go but it sees a liner above it like a very thick balloon burst it and burst it and forms a volcano that's what that is that's not the point where all of this dirt ejected that's a different phenomena that occurred when it rapidly filled and all the air couldn't escape and that's a clue that was left for us by the volcano it tells us where the last man was standing that was the last point to get saturated under the 60ft liner that's the clue it left us now I'm going to give you a quick geology 101 because I'm going to try and get you a little bit educated on something that's very technical and not generally known geology 101 on a popka the first thing I did when I uh saw this when I got this project is I started looking at the residential wells around it I wanted to make sure that we were not affecting residents so I went there's one residential well that's actually quite close to the site and I point it out here that's a residential well and that aite the good thing about technology today that we didn't have in 86 is the geology of that well which was drilled in 1947 is documented by a geologist and entered onto the internet so I'm going to show you the pre precise geological profile of that well drilled in 1947 and they have the samples and they went back in and reclassified them now when I talk about layers in a popka you have to think about the age of these layers because if you don't think about the age you start thinking well they join together actually they don't the first layer is the Okala Limestone which is our drinking water supply that was formed 33 to 34 38 million years ago by shells depositing Under the Sea be mind Florida was not connected to the the continent until 23 million years ago we had no connection to the continent there is not a single fossil there's not a single dinosaur in Florida because we were not connected to the continent there was a big trough sea Channel between Florida and the continent so that's there in the 33 to 34 million period now the second layer that's going to be important for today's discussion these are the layers that come into play today in my presentation is the hoton that layer in this area is 15 to 18 million years old that's what the man shaft fell into 15 to 18 million years old and it was deposited Under the Sea it was not coming off the Appalachians it's purely a c deposit and the thing about the hon is we never touch it when we doing engineering design in Florida we never try get to get close to it because of two reasons one is it protects our aquifer it acts as a natural confining layer above our drinking water supply nobody lets us penetrate that that we have known forever the second thing about the hoton layer is that it sits on top of Limestone that was exposed for millions of years to rain and that Limestone surface is Jagged and eroded and has cavities so the hoton now that's sitting on top of this cavernous Limestone has found ways to enter it and become loose not because of a sinkhole but just naturally loose because here is this layer sitting on top of the cavernous layer so that layer has pockets of looseness and we know that because we see it on the site next door to this the drilling that was done for the park development next door shows where the hoton was eroded and you probably have eroded hoton directly Bel below you right now but it doesn't really matter because once you have 60 70 foot of protection of hard soil above it who cares it's too deep to out a sight most of those Orlando buildings there's eroded hoton under the high-rises but too deep and they're piled nobody it doesn't make a difference now the layer above the hoton now to me is the most interesting layer in Florida it's called the Cypress Head and that layer does not occupy a large proportion of Florida it occupies actually a very narrow belt that includes all The Ridges the Lake Wales Ridge the Trail Ridge uh parts of uh SE County alamon Springs and all of Apopka within a certain area the Cyprus head was formed by erosion off the Appalachian Mountains deep erosion where it cut sand and it cut heavy minerals that are not found in any deposits anywhere the world the forces when the glaciers melted were so strong that they cut the heavy minerals that we're mining today in Clay County that came off in that same event sat in the sea and when the sea level went down it Formed dunes and it blew into Florida because the wind direction changed magnetic poles change wind direction changed and June started coming into Florida that's what the Cyprus head is now a lot of it came by currents offshore a lot of it came by water but a large proportion simply blew in to Florida when the wind changed and covered up the forest and if you go to the Trail Ridge you'll see it they have vertical trees under the the ridge standing up it covered it so fast that layer is the lay that we're dealing with and that's in a 2 to three million year range that's still old the Ice Age started 2.6 million years ago our new Ice Age was only 2.6 million years ago so this layer now geologically it's old compared to Orlando parts of Orlando is less than a million years old less than 800,000 years Cape canavero was not there 4,000 years ago simply was not there did not exist the um the thing about a PKA is this the all of the land drains into closed depressions there's no natural surface water outfall and this is what's happening under the ground you have surface uh flow coming into the surficial aquifer enters a closed depression and the only place you can go out is either straight down to the aquifer or straight up by evaporation nowhere else and 90% of a pop like that and we have several of these on our site now let's talk about what we have on our site the there were borings done on our site we have a distinct surficial aquafer which has a higher water elevation than the Floridan aquifer and to figure out how the sufficient aquer actually flows and gets to the Florida in these focal points of Entry is extremely complicated in a poka in fact I think it still defies a modern geotechnical engineer we haven't figured out a way to precisely map that surface of water in the surficial aqua d raining on the clay and getting to these depressions and then going down but on this site we have an advantage the advantage is that we have the landfill where they have been recording levels and groundwater elevations for many years so we took the landfill elevations and made Contours of uh the water flow Direction and what you will see is on top of this hill here you have an 5 Contour this is 79 and then this flows off this way but coming this way there's there high elevations of 85 and this particular Pond bottom is set at 81 under subdivision this Pond bottom is at 91 compare that to 69 here 67 and 60 so we are very deep compared to what uh what's normally done here now that's was a sufficient aquafer what's the other piece of information we need what is the water level in the Floridan aquifer it turns out we have that on this site here it is it's uh 53.5 at this location 59.5 and 56.3 in this sinkhole these are two natural depressions that that existed on the site that were known and investigated and on this end they are measuring 68.6 so we know that this area here is the most uh leaky natural depression this is the second most leaky natural depression the lakes around here are all in the uh 55 range and these were monitored over several months the design that was done for this Reservoir was based on this data not considering what was coming from uphill so this Bottom now was set at 69 this bottom was set at 67 this bottom at 60 and this one at 65 now this did not uh plot good I don't it came out very grainy but what I what I showed you here was the elevations that the Bor pit contractor was actually able to achieve when he was told to go For Broke and dig everything to 67 and take it this is what he was able to achieve the Shaded area you see here that was the only area he could get to 67 up here it's in the 80s up here some of them are in '90s that's all he could do so with this information now now this was completed and then the reservoir design was finalized when they saw this because they had gone in with 67 and 62 and then this happened this doesn't show clearly on your screen but I did shade the area that was 67 that's the only area that they could actually achieve elevation and if you were going to ask me today that's the only area you can actually do 67 what the contractor can dig and keeping the dry is what's shaded now that should be 67 today this is 67 and this is 60 and this is 69 when you look at what elevations he was able to achieve up here it's at least 10 15 foot higher now what we look at is when we have a collapse like this we start looking at the old Aerials that predates the Citrus and this is 1939 and you can see all the lake level shorelines in 1939 in 1939 if you overlay this on the modern on the modern topography you'll see that all the Lakes were 5 to six feet higher which is what happened in Orlando the water level has declined in the aquafer and that reflected in these Lakes so these Lakes used to be 5 to six feet higher than they are today but the most interesting thing about this which I don't think you can see is where we have the breach today that was a depression that was actually a visible depression on the 1939 uh aial just like the two sinkholes that are known are today this this is 1947 that one was 1939 this is 1947 this shows the breach and it shows what I interpreted as a direction of flow it also shows up on 194 7 as a depressional feature so we are not there's no big surprise that we are heading into this today now what happened at the golden gem by November 2023 so this is the new sinkhole these are the old sinkholes that pre-existed what I drew here was the 1958 Contours of the land and you'll see that all three sink holes the two old ones and the new one all fall on the 100 foot contour line and there's a reason for that which I don't want to get into but the sink holes occur at the 70t and the 100t these three are all under 100t exactly where we expect them now what happened is this by November 2023 let me go forward the slide and then I'll come back okay uh this is what I want to get to this is a satellite imagery from November the 5th 2023 and here you can see it's almost brim full on November the 5th 2023 it's about Plus 90 which will put make it uh more than 21t of water in the high spot uh more more than 30 foot of water in the low spot so that's the satellite and this is uh January the 5th 2024 and here you'll see A disruption already on the satellite imagery infrared is picking up something is going on here already in January the 5th the city finds out about it on January the 24th nobody uses this technology you know so don't think that the city should be checking satellite imagery so let me go back now a bit here what what happened and what caused this failure the uh by November 2023 the reservoir is reaching almost its peak stage it's above 90 based on the Satellite by early January 2024 I'm actually reading this text here if you want to follow me the sinkhole roof collapse when I say collapse if you want to imagine that there's a huge animal borrow underground that's covered with 8 to 15t of clay sand as a roof Bridge the water gets high enough to break that bridge and that happens in January 2024 and it falls in and the the bridge over this eroded area now is broke but the reservoir does not drain catastrophically because it it's own the liner holds over that distance which to me is incredible that it held and a little slip uh tear opened at one of the seams and Water started pouring in and it took uh until I I would think this started to drain in late December it took at least 30 days for them to realize the water is gone because it drained slowly enough where we prevented a catastrophe if that had drained all at once I think we would have had a bigger issue it did not so I'm still impressed by what that liner did now the coll laps is evident from January 5th 2024 it takes about 30 days to drain out 200 million gallons there was a rush towards the end how do we know that because of the volcano you don't get a volcano unless you have a rush of water squeezing out that air suddenly and fires off like an air gun that's the only way that happens so when the water rushes into the hole it runs under the liner and also likely saturates the soil below the liner which only has about 5 ft of soil that's dry and 5 ft of soil that's dry means there's one foot of air for every air is 20% of soil so for 5 foot of soil dry soil there's one foot of air so that one foot of air now explodes out at this point and forms let me get a picture what that looks like you'll see this is a now can you imagine this feature this is what our submarine uh Imaging did that little volcano is sitting under there at that spot that was the last man standing that's where the last piece of air remained and that was the Escape point it all accumulated there until the pressure got too high and it burst the liner and blew up like a volcano that's our sand volcano so we're going to fix that also that while it looks like it's intimidating it's innocuous it's just a we see them a lot in borrow bits okay so let me get back here um we were able to map the feature and this you know this is what it looks like it's big it's intimidating when you look at it at the surface it's a huge feature but I've been there and I've done that I've seen worse than this in my career far worse than this so it doesn't intimidate me but to the lay person it's going to be intimidating is that you in that photo no that's Henry Henry oh um oh oh okay okay so just one question will it continue to expand that that hole there no no the good thing about this is it's in clay clay is solid if it were in sand you would be eroding it will be forming a cone so I'm going to get along here I know I'm burning up a bunch of your time so uh it's actually a big feature and this is what it look like uh shortly after this is the explanation of it the uh roof collapse and this is the sand volcano so I'm going to try and get through this a little quicker I tend to get long winded sorry why did this collapse take place now the thing is if you have 60t of soil or 30t of soil above an underground borrow that's 75 ft in diameter that soil the weight of that soil is not exerted on that roof why because you have something we call Soil arching the full pressure of the soil never reaches the top of the roof but water is a different animal if you change 20 foot of soil above a roof to 20t of water the weight on top of that roof goes from 1 million pound to 6 million pounds water transmits the force fully it does not behave like soil so the weight acting on top this roof as a result of this Reservoir when it got up to the high stage broke it so we broke the roof because that roof never experienced that weight before soil hangs up itself it does not really push down and exert the weight at that depth and we did the calculations on it these are strictly theoretical calculations and we were able to calculate what diameter of eroded zone for this clay based on the strength of the clay to collapse it simple roof Cal now have you repaired these before yes I've seen more impressive than this here's one right up the road from you now one thing I want to tell you ahead of time a popka has two types of sinkholes it has what we call uh tickly mantle cast sinkholes which is what this area is where you have 100 ft of soil over the Limestone and then you have areas of a popka which what we call tinly mantle C where you have 25 to 30 foot of soil above the Limestone there's only one part of a Popa that has tinle mantle cars that's directly ahead of Rock Springs on the Kelly Park Road area that has Tinley mantle cars that resembles Okala during Hurricane Irma we had over 20 s hols there Wala had over a 100 I was on the TV all the time trying to calm people down on Kelly Park Road during Hurricane herma telling them this is going to pass and uh everybody was scared sinkhole after sinkhole I said you in tinle mantle cast this is going to happen after a hurricane but tickly mantle cast doesn't know know it's raining Tinley mantle cast knows it is I can show you a map all of the sink holes are clustered right on the top of Rock Springs where we have Tinley mantle cars that resembles Okala everybody calmed down when I told them Okala had over a 100 while you had less than 20 so what happens when you take that much to it off is you change the cars from tickly mantled to tinly mantled so the sinkhole that we are seeing here or the collapse we are see here is what you would find in tinle mantle cast it does not occur naturally in this area because naturally we did not remove so much soil we don't dig that deep so we converted tickly mantle C to tinly mantle C so we are seeing a sinkhole that resembles a Kelly Park Road Rock Springs sinkhole now here's one close to Rock Springs this one was 19 ft in diameter and 32 ft deep when I saw it I got scared it right after tropical storm Fay in August 2008 and you'll notice this was made out uh dad budo you know he had me fix this when he was at Orange County and this was a nightmare to fix because 19 ft 32 ft deep 19t and we tried to fix this every which way and it kept running away from us until we finally came up with a new plan which is a plan I'm offering today to fix this now this is not something we came up with originally we spent a lot of his money when he was at Orange County trying to figure out how to fix this one and it was trial and error but we finally found out the solution we have to go with broken concrete and rock first do not try to stabilize these features with soil it's going to run away and you'll never be able to to to seal it what you have to do is go in first and put big rocks in block it off and then grade the Rocks up in size so you're coming up you're lowering the rock size as you come up and then what we did at the top was very unique and we don't have to do it here we have other methods the reason we use these concrete blocks is because Orange County had these in their um Supply and they were free so we used articulating concrete blocks and we formed a new bridge above it so we're not going to try and seal up this m shaft because that's going to be a futile effort and we're going to spend millions of dollars on concrete and we don't know when it's going to end so we're going to rock it with big rocks rade it up and then Bridge it our repair plan then we have done this plan uh which follows that outline and this is the outline we've specified in addition to some other factors and uh we have sent this to the the city to get prices I do not recommend you put this out to bid per se it's too complicated the way this needs to be fixed is we need to work directly with a contractor because they are going to be changes so you need to select a contractor have us with them and we don't want them to be fighting us about this and this and this price we need to do what you're told and you charge the city left or more menual price we gave you a schedule to bid to prepare an estimate but we don't expect that to be exactly this is not quantifiable and I'm going to end there unless you need more uh I have a this is these are the Fantastical shapes we see and this is our site uh here uh let me get this working this is our site and you can see the groundwater flow coming in these are the shapes of the cast that we see but you know that's for nerds like me to look at this is what we see uh if you go in a satellite and you look down that's that's what you see uh this is a high ground these are all the closed cast basins in a popka this is a aquit level but it's not like Orlando it's actually very pronounced welldefined kind dragon shaped cast this is how the aquaa flows across the site from um Mount plet and from our site we know the aqua flows to W IA flows to the east that's a things we can do now what I wanted to show you here if you can see it on your screen you see all these little Pok that's tinle mantle C sink holes that's what we expect in Tinley mantle car and that's what we uh have in the Kelly Park area that's the city of aopa limits that's what the roads on that's with all the sink holes and the Springs so we are not in a high sinkhole area per se because we have tickly mantle cars but on the perimeter when you get to 25 and 35 ft we turn into Okala so I'm going to uh okay so I'm standing at the uh I can stop here if you'd like yes okay right so I have some videos if you're interested all right questions Council uh question I have is that you said 200 million gallons of water was lost so did this water contaminate any of the wells in the area not that we can tell you would have had people walking in here already we know we we've had this happen before in okoi in 1998 where we had drainage Wells that were putting in algae straight into the drinking water supply that didn't happen here as best as we can tell I looked at all the public Supply wells around here they are deep they case down to at least 150 ft so the flow in this uh Zone would be in the upper part of the Ocala Limestone not the deeper part which goes from 150 to about 400 ft okay anybody else questions what what does that mean when you say the upper part when it when the water flowed and you said it it would not have affected the wells because the wells are at 150 the the wells usually go down at least 25 to 40 fet below the Top of the Rock and then they case down to 300 ft this actual flow is on top of the hon and entering the aquafer right at the top so the wells are actually deeper I'm not saying that there could potentially be no impacts but there have been none reported and we check the uh most immediate well that starts at 150 ft I have the log for it and it goes down to uh almost 400 ft now they would be seeing flushing if they flushing their toilet they'll be seeing algae coming in because reclaimed water will have an algae nobody has reported any of that and the city is on mainly public Supply now and the city's Wells are all not in the upper Floridan they are all in the lower Florida all the modern designs since 1985 do not take big public Supply Wells into the upper Florida anymore we all go down to 800 to 1,000 ft and go deep there's an upper and a lower Floridan since we started using the upper Floridan in Orlando for drainage Wells we switch to the low Floridan for drinking water supply we are very lucky we have the tick occurrence of fresh water in the world any other questions so so how I mean it was a lot you gave us a lot how are you going to try and remediate this particular you said it's it's a sink hole or is it a volcano how are you identifying this oh we have a volcano on the side and that's just academic oh okay so let's forget about the volcano okay I just brought that up because it looked nice but the uh the the M shaft we need to fix and seal back now what I suggested is maybe we need to change the design for the upper cell from a liner to a clay and maybe raise it a bit but I'm always cognizant of the concept of economic waste here we have built a facility and paid a lot of money for it as a first step we need to prevent waste of money and we need to try and fix it now if we can't fix it then we we need to change it but I'm not going to suggest a tear down unless a national consultant comes in and says to do that because then we enter the doctrine of economic waste we're wasting public money because I feel that it's a bad design I think let's try and fix it let's try and get it back in order it's an excellent project because I worked on the alamont Springs design to bring that water here I did all of the cring roost modeling so we need to try and get it to work because remember all that water was going directly into the WIA River direct discharge a the weather's field could you provide a summary quick synopsis of exactly what is needed to fix it very clear excuse me um broken concrete broken rocks is yes could you kind of clarify that a little so we can kind of understand exactly what's needed to fix it the solution okay imagine we have a shaft that's 100t in diameter and 30 ft deep and somehow it's at the bottom it has little channels where it can connect and go deeper you know some channels that are unknown what we don't want to do is to go in there and try and pump grout or concrete because it's going to enter that channel and run away from us we could spend millions of dollars grouting Florida but I don't have any stock in any man company so I'm not going to suggest that the uh what we do is we go to the bottom and we put big rocks in for starters that way we know we've it's locked in we create a lock at the bottom with the big rocks maybe 18in size rip wrap and then we come up and we use 12in rep wrap and then we come up and we use 4in rep wrap and then we put Vis Queen then we put sand then we put uh two layers of reinforcement and and we seal it at the top so we're building a helmet over it but the inside we are not trying to seal that because it's not possible to seal it and we're sealing it what on top the seiling is is what yes on top we're going to seal it we're going to put a a really strong helmet and uh make sure no water leaks back through that helmet had a couple questions yeah Dr siram I really appreciate you taking a deep dive in this I know it was detailed but it really did help to kind of understand how and why and where we're at now are you able to go back to a few slides uh back to where there's a couple there we skipped over quickly that I thought had some good information um it's all the way back to where you were showing the imagery of kind of when it started to show signs of failure this this one yes no uh where it is it's right there you see the disruption mhm that's that's seen picked up on satellite imagery January 5th 2024 and there's a couple slides before this are you able to go back to that one too are those ones as well uh I don't have the full Suite of uh satellite imagery no that's okay your slides that you prepared is that what's that was the one right before okay this was uh this one was November this was a month before I actually have December but I didn't put it on here because the presentation was getting too long the reason I used November it was a clearance satellite imagery that showed the high water line so I used that and I put the elevation too on that to figure out how high we got on November the 5th 2023 okay but we I have December 2023 that does not show A disruption shows high water but the quality of the imagery is not for City presentation gotcha okay and then are you able to go back to well you don't need to go back to it it's where the air volcano came out is that on the same same contour line that the sink holes are on it turns out it is and uh don't ask me why so that was going be my question is that always consistent that way what we saw on the we looked at the borrow pit Contours and I can show you I have another image of the borrow pit and it turns out it's in the low spot that was left in the borrow pit now I have not uh attached significance to that but the vol volcano is at that low spot let me see I have another one the volcano is right here now these Contours are not as refined as what we have we do have these on points Point elevations but a volcano corresponds with the lowest point that was left in the borrow pit okay and and and this is a question I'd asked staff earlier as well and I appreciate staff meeting me out there too that was very helpful just to understand just put your eyes on it my concern was again if we fix this area and another breach happens somewhere else will a volcano breach our BMS on the side and potentially instead of water going straight down it goes out into neighboring properties well the interesting thing about the volcano why I'm not getting excited about it is that Reservoir is still holding water to 67 and did not leak out although the water is lower below it okay so it's not as much of a concern to us in that capacity it did not leak it blew up but it's not leaking today and it didn't leak since understood and then final question here not to would it make sense or would it be more uh cost effective if we were to kind of carve out the breached section and no longer use it make that the new burm I think we need to do a cost benefit I don't know what commitments the city have to Altamont and to St John's for storage but certainly I like that idea I would like to carve this out what I'd like to do ideally is carve out the 67 to this what you see here this is what the borrow this should be your 67 then that's an 85 up here that's a 92 up here so if there was a tering it should be done like this now I'm comfortable with this at 67 right now this is 67 but this is 60 uh because we have firsthand digging experience with a contract Factor was able to dig this comfortably and stay dry this is the part now that's a big part of the footprint so it's not like this is a complete waste of land but the 67 I think is big it is haven't been out there I mean it's a massive project and I guess my go ahead that that's the part that's what I would do if I was starting with a blank canvas but economic waste City public funds I'm cognizant of how we proceed as Engineers it's easy to be conservative and overconservative but we need to be pragmatic I've been in this business a long time I'd like to try absolutely my final question here too is just if we're going to add in that that um similar to what you guys did on Sleepy Hollow is it too much weight cuz you would said with sand and things like that the weight it it's not as focused on one specific spot that creates a failure with adding in the rip wrap and rocks and things like that is that too much weight in one specific section we're going have failures um lower or are you comfortable in that capacity okay the rock is inside the house the roof is above the house the this roof we're going to we're going to fill the house with rock so there's no uh erosion underneath there the rock also has the benefit in that it lets the facial aquifer and water flow continue gotta we don't want to be blocking flows because that creates other problems so the rock fills in the house where water is flowing naturally and then above that we're going to extend the reinforcement into the unfailed areas to provide uh some uh actual more reinforcing back embedment away from it so it becomes not just on top the roof we're going to go back and tied now we can do a stronger roof we can use some layers of geogrid but that's why I wanted I want it go with a contractor as we as we start this we need to start cleaning it up and I may change the design during construction so I need flexibility understood okay thank you appreciate your time any other questions okay thank you Mr dvo appreciate it okay public comment public comment I from I know you you can you can go next you're you're next you're next public comment I just have a couple of questions to ask I thank the doctor for a a very concise explanation it coincided with a lot of what I already had found out couple of questions I would like to ask him The Superficial aquer where it uh meets The Grand below it there's a transition it goes from water into some other substrate is there any guarantee when someone drills a well that there's a seal between the upper layers and the lower layers because my understanding is in lots of occasions when you drill a well you have to cap the well because the problem that you're facing is you don't want anything from the surface leaking down into the lower Waters so my first question is can we guarantee there was no contamination because the casings of the wells were secure bear in mind that we've had ground movement the casing that might have been put in originally could no long may no longer be in contact with what it was originally there second observation was the doctor mentioned a bridge but he didn't specify where it was I believe the bridge he was referring to is a bridge it's built on the 429 over ponkin and information that I had was when the city went to well well when when the for 29 was built there was details that it was a cavity found 250 ft deep and the cavity extended 800 ft along the line parallel to the 429 bear in mind in August of 2017 there was also uh sink holes discovered on the 429 which had to be repaired the liner that's currently in there because of what's happened in there although there's no there's no leakage in the other in the other tiers can we be certain the the of the Integrity of that liner should that liner be completely replaced I have photographic evidence that the Integrity of the liner as it was installed was not up to specification in places it there was damaged to and it was it was a botch job the city uh have an obligation to St John's River Management that they Supply water to the city of Apopka from timore Springs I want to know what contractual obligations we have if we're failing in them what penalties we might face this project was due to be completed over two years ago there were extensions granted by St John's on two occasions to continue the project one of the the reasons there was a continuation was that there was a Geological Survey which identified an area exactly where this sinkle occurred where there was sand and there was a granular uh medium below this is what I'm I'm allegedly told so if it's true that the city had to Grant an extension because they were aware of some anomaly there what did we actually do to to to research that were the engineers who were there given all the facts that that the they needed uh that's just about all I have to to say just now when it comes to public comment I'll discuss some other this that's this was it your for but but then there will be public comment for the for the main part will there not no this this is it this is your format okay thank you I haven't finished yet then uh why was the engineer in charge of this uh terminated why is there allegations that he was forced to make changes to things that he was unhappy about why is it that we have been denied access to information that's matter of public record we would ask the Commissioners today to uh insist that the city provide us with the emails that we request so that we can make a an an honest assessment of of why this happened thank you [Music] Rod Olson 31 156 Rolling Hills Lane here in Apopka uh mayor Commissioners um at Welcome to our newest member uh any rate I was uh couple things one unsung her Heroes this time are school crossing guards through various means and measures I substituted in for 13 shifts over this past over the month of April uh unbelievable number of kids coming up parents coming up where's Charles where's Jodie uh are they okay that type of thing is awesome the relationship they've established but also what struck me when you cover these areas as many as one in three parents coming in to pick up and drop their kids off are holding their cell phones talking on the phone can't happen we have people that cross across the crosswalk so you and I might as adults walk around that vehicle as crossing guards you cannot allow a child to cross unless that section is clear here we need to work on it this picture is one the side of a vehicle that ironically I was walking through Northwest Rec recreational complex infrastructure jumped out at me all of we were doing marking areas but it jumped up to me for a number of reasons one I've talked to you about Northwest Recreational Complex Fields uh 16 18 years ago that park opened with the existing fields we have we've added 20,000 people and haven't added a field and our answer is we're going to add two Fields each year for the next 3 years doesn't get it we need 10 Fields now the condition of the fields slaps at infrastructure adequate Staffing to take care of it we look at our streets and our sidewalks our potholes have potholes our sidewalks have mold on them which is slip slip hazards just drive down uh Vic Road and you'll see what I mean along the way and it's not just one area of doing it we have to be better it's again infrastructure and Staffing flooding in a couple of our developments infrastructure Staffing C extension we had to get an extension because money that was given to us we didn't spend infrastructure Staffing homelessness failure to spend the money infrastructure Staffing 1200 1,200 homes going in and along golden gem Golden Gym is basically a golf cart with a middle medium line on it we've got to do a better job waste water restrictions now we've got all these new homes coming in using water to put their new s in and I have to restrict my water flow at this point infrastructure Staffing Kelly Park k through eight wonderful school open two years ago guess what's going to be on campus this fall Portables we've got to do a better job mayor thank you very much for doing it mayor leaving his seat for the Jazz Festival this weekend to flag Vehicles driving in and around on the walking paths for Northwest Recreational Complex why ad we don't have adequate Staffing we don't have adequate signage so that type of thing doesn't happen risking the lives of people walking or moving around uh I attended uh Orange County Vision 2050 uh this last Monday at zelwood didn't see any of you there neither here or there but they've got a wonderful outline plan look at 2050 they're at we're going to be adding 500,000 people how many of those are coming to aapka what's our 2025 plan our 2026 plan our 2050 plan plan we need to be thinking in advance we look for you to look out for us going forward we look for you to manage the growth we look for you to take care of us and right now it can be defined in two ways one if you always do what you always done you always get what you always got the rubber stamping and new development has got to stop the other is if you other is fair to plan is planning to fail and if we don't have the PE people and the tools we're get in trouble and one of my favorite movies happens to be music man we got trouble right here in AP Papa City and it starts with a T and it rindes with plea and it St spells for planning thank you n [Music] Nikki Maguire Naomi kids organization good evening mayor Commissioners and everyone in the rightful place we at Naomi kids do not discriminate against religion however after several people said no to us but God said yes I have to take time to say thank you God for making this event possible once again thank you to the Rotary Club of aapka John L trust and our City commissioners including our past commissioner ex vice mayor Becca for your financial contribution to this event commissioner Anderson welcome aboard and don't try to fit his shoes I encourage you to design your own shoes and wear them well as we will be looking forward to you supporting Naomi kids in the very near future thank you to Sergeant Wiggins Chief McKinley captain holderfield Chief WM Pepsi DJ Glenn Wolf Lake Middle School dance team Magic mson Singer elsmo all volunteers and last but certainly not least Naomi kids team for your contributions and participations thank you in advance to the general public for coming out as you see up there on May on Saturday May 11th 10:00 a.m. to 300 p.m. at Edwards field next to kler and Nelson park for a day to remember this year our freebies include we're going to have some priz drawings treat bags and toys for kids our kids zone with games bouns house and obstacle course all free limited supply of bicycles brand new bicycles and helmets on a first come basis solo performances by lismo music by DJ Glenn a surprise magic show by Matson entertainment and dance performances by Wolf Lake Middle School dance team then we're going to have you can also enjoy a big taste for a small price alsoo good food truck will be there with wings hamburgers Philly cheese steak french fries and pasta salad we're going to have refreshing Pepsi products and snowy shaved I've already earned my snowy pen hopefully you guys earn one fresh popcorn and cotton candy um now are you looking for the fine prints yes we do have fine prints we have three requests one you visit all the vendor boots to earn free raffle tickets for great prices and streets two show us your throwing skills by attempting to dunk our police chief McKinley and our fire chief WM the money raised from the dunk tank will go towards Shop with a cop a popka fire department and Naomi kids summer camp program three participate in our 50/50 raffle where you will get 50% of the money collected please visit Naomi kids on Facebook for k for this and upcoming events I encourage everyone to strive for perfection in everything we do as remember we are all imperfect people living in God's perfect world it's a it's all about what we do and not our expectations of others thank you for your time Leroy Bell M Helen mayor Commissioners my friend Ryan olon just said that you guys have to take care the citizens and that and I'm ask you guys to do that I'm ask you to do do some homework I'm ask you to go down to the papka police department and ask them to let you view a cam video of Saturday the 27th in the front of what that is hathorne and Michael Gren Boulevard where we seen one of their police officers followed parked behind the at the uh the funeral home walked across the parking lot got behind a young man the young man ran he pulled young man shirt off him now whatever this young man did if he was wrong he need to face what he done but this police officer taged this young man several times while he was on the ground he beat this young man while he was on the ground whatever the man did if he was wrong he need to pay for it but these police officers is not the judge the jury and the Executioner Apopka got a bad reputation of beating people people especially people of color apka you remember we had a power boy right here in apka and this young man whoever he is everybody know him by his police number by his car number and this is the third time that he whoop this boy now the reason I'm not bringing any video this time because what we're doing we're giving you guys the benefit of the doubt we're going to see if you're going to hold this Police Department accountable in the past M your friend up under the Joe killimer Rod love he said that he would pay for diversity training out his own pocket the only training that apka is getting down on this side of the track is the old cops beating on people of color so I'm asking either you guys go down there and do some about this or we going to make this a national [Music] thing thank you Charlie Chambers good afternoon mayor and Commissioners uh Charles Chambers with I'm actually with the chamber chamber Chambers there you go um so I'm actually the chairman of the board of directors over here at the Popin chamber um it's a 180 East Main Street in naakka the Chamber of Commerce is actually advocate for regional businesses jobs Workforce and economic opportunities the chamber itself represents an average of 500 businesses over different sectors uh these includes Cottage businesses entrepreneurs Consultants training nonprofits specialty retail nurses Nur nurseries restaurants coffee shops hotels Banks churches top name Hospital systems and more the POA Area Chamber was established 111 years ago um in 1913 the chamber has office the current location since the building was built in the late 70s and double it size in 1990 a chamber chamber includes award-winning uh manufacturers top recognized developers large scale commercials and residential construction previous leaders of the chambers chamber and its chamber board and directors have advanced their careers in larger business organizations run run and W Pol political seats across the state and also become and manner exper experts in their field we are proudly to serve aaka area for over 111 years and plan to do so for many more at the end of 2022 between hurricane Ian and Nicole the building actually was serly severely damaged we needed to replace the roof um once that's done we committed remediation and we are ready to plan a rebuild before committing to the next $200,000 to rebuild a city asset We call we call home for 50 years we are requesting the city council renew the chamber lease agre to 10 years with a reoccurring 10 years or allow us to vacate the building as is as our lease allows in case of un unavoidable casualties as such as hurricanes thank you noring hi good good afternoon Commissioners mayor my name is Nova Carrington I serve as the treasurer for the apapa area Chamber of Commerce I've been a member of the chamber since June of 2021 during the pandemic the chamber the chamber acted as a pilot light for local businesses to be aware of funding resources Health protocols and ideas for businesses to adapt and sustain their businesses we also wanted the annual membership we also waved the annual membership dues for nearly a at one year and a half for our small business members while increasing the number of gatherings in business in in businesses housing community hosting CommunityWide events cleanups meat and mingles mashups and so much more all of this to say in the last three years the chamber has spent a little over $1,241 in our utility bills over $31,900 in our insurance coverage over $114,000 in leasehold and building repairs and of that $114,000 we've spent $46,000 for to serve PE for the remediation of of the mold and the additional funds were used to repair the roof to do the Demolition and prep the building uh to get it ready for the rebuild in November after the Hurricanes the chamber board chair and president asked the past City administrator if the chamber is responsible for such extensive hurricane damage to the building and he said yes we are we being the chamber they did not review further but began to move forward with the flood damage test in and protocols as the chamber has now officed in this building for over 50 years without an issue having been in the chamber building for nearly uh for nearly half of our 111 years in existence paying our utilities doing repairs and Lease hold to the building expansions maintenance and upkeep we have not considered relocating from this facility the chamber and all relocating our services until April 17th I guess at the commission's meeting when someone started asking about uh the status of our lease and considering wanting to take the building back we're asking for the council to consider a new 10-year lease for the chamber with a recurring 10 years as we prepare to do over $250,000 of improvements to reestablish the building and its use thank you thank you good afternoon mayor Commissioners welcome commissioner Anderson um I'm here today to speak not only as a Apopka business owner but as a member of the board of directors of the Apopka chamber on behalf of some of the board of directors that could not be here today um mostly just to Echo what you just heard but also to um tell you how important the apapa chamber is uh not only to myself but to local businesses here in apapa when myself my family and my business partners decided to make the move from Orlando to Apopka to start a business it was the Apopka chamber who we first met um they were instrumental in assisting us with directing us where too as far as getting our licenses getting our permits in order um it was the chamber who set up a meeting with Chief McKinley um to discuss the homeless camp that was living behind propagate um it was the chamber who has helped us in so many ways to grow and develop our business so on behalf of myself and all of the other aapka chamber of business owners um we hope that the great members of this Council will continue to um support the Chamber of Commerce thank you good afternoon Sylvester Hall 391 Rolland Hills Lane another beautiful day Paradise commissioner neter congratulations on being reelected welcome back commissioner Anderson congratulations on your election one thing I notic attending the uh ceremony I listen to the oath and I listen to what commissioner Smith his prayer vice mayor commissioner Vasquez I listen to all the things that we say what we should do as we take the oath of office so I'm reminding you it's easy to give lip service and it all sounds so smoo and so pretty coming off your lips but when it come down to doing the job we make it very challenging and it's not challenging because if you look at everything as serving the people it become a very thankless job if you remember you're here to serve the people serve the public it become a very thankless job so remember your oath and please take that personally and if you think the job ever becomes too challenging for you please resign and let somebody else attempt to do the job or do the job because you truly have to love people to serve people you truly have to love people to serve people and that's all people so I'm just reminding you of that the uh popka police department I haven't seen the video that Mr Bill is referring to I'll wait to hold my comments but over the last two and a half years of me coming to City Council meetings I'll look over there see deputy chief Miller Chief McKinley is not there we have some issues in our Police Department that need to be addressed and they're not going to go away they're only going to come big they're only going to get bigger so I'm asking you not to address this situation but look at the whole Police Department as a whole and where there's changes that need to be made I'm asking that you make those changes and one thing I experienced getting out of this car and I don't mention it a couple times I love the guys in blue I'm a 20-year vet I love the guys in blue they have a very dangerous job when they go home they don't know whether they coming back they deserve the bu the very best saying that if you have a bad apple in the bunch that Bunch need to that bad apple need to be removed before he spoils the whole bunch and that that needs to take place and when I walk from my car to he the heat overwhelms me we should have a training facilities for our law enforcement yesterday you guys need to make that happen it don't need to be put down the road it need to be happening and need to happen like yesterday for the fire uh for the fire department mayor here again we give excellent lip service there is no reason our fire department shouldn't have a contract period the buck start with you Mr Mayor and it ends with you there's no reason our fire department should have a contract period we come up here we serenate them but they fighting for a contract they fighting you got a hostile environment that has been created by leadership that needs to change for the chamber I'm with you 100% we just need better leadership the Dei thank you Mr Hall appreciate it there's no Dei thank you thank you thank you okay next up Susan that's it okay oh former commiss Becker good afternoon sorry I was a little late so I didn't get a chance to now I want to Echo the comments uh congratulations for your re-election commissioner Nesta and welcome aboard commissioner Anderson um I I just wanted to speak directly and set the record straight this this afternoon in relation to a comment that was brought up during the mayor's report the last meeting uh there was reference to the business tax receipts of a number of organizations one of which was brpc Consulting LLC which if anybody wanted to do any research that's mine um I opened that LLC uh in late 20121 to do Consulting work for my current employer who I'm there full-time with um once I realized the BTR process um I closed that LLC out less than a year after I opened it so I'm not sure why it was referenced during the mayor's report as if there was something nefarious going on with that what I've entered into the record this afternoon is is an email correspondence I had with staff basically alluding to what I just described asking them if I owed anything um if I had any outstanding balances penalties as related to my LLC and to the contrary they said I do not have anything I won't bring up the the staff member but it's on the public record that I just handed in to the clerk um the response was I hope you and your family are well and that the move went smoothly there is currently no balance for the business that you mentioned you may have received a letter some time ago stating that you needed to obtain one but since it was made inactive no further action was needed and no fees were assessed so I thought it was another pathetic attempt at a gacha moment by the mayor's report section of the agenda um there's another there's another component of those comments that was published um probably on your meeting minutes but also reported in the apopa voice as it as it was um I need to verify that the extra well let me uh and then number six I would like to know the excess spending on attorney fees since our inside Council was forced to resign so those are six items I would like to add and that was referencing the forensic audit I think the mayor forgets that he has the ability to appoint internal Council that was not done it was his agenda item that actually put on the agenda for this Council to approve the appointment of Mr Shepard as our outside Council to represent the city so to put that blame or to go inferens audit it is kind of pointless because we all know the background behind it and you have the authority to put in front of this Council for ratification and to that end I see on the agenda that was republished this week that there is a ratification business item for the new city administrator it's my understanding that not all of the city council members had a chance to meet this individual and you're being asked to ratify a position today of the person who's going to manage a staff of over 500 people I'll go back and and bring up precedent that the chair made several years ago as it related to settling a matter related to former city administrator uh Mr Anderson and he didn't vote on a topic of settlement because it wasn't part of the published packet that went on on that Friday and he voted no against that piece of business because he didn't give this Council proper opportunity to do to do due diligence and so for an agenda item to come out after it was published on Friday and for you to be asked to ratify such an important position within this city I think is irresponsible at best but again I'm just here to clear my name as it relates to the BTR I think it's ridiculous and not within a normal scope of work that that would be within a forensic audit when you're looking at the books within the city um but yeah what what else do you expect um I intend to quietly leave and and enjoy my time in Winter Springs um I was hoping to do so until the mayor's report happened this last meeting um hopefully there's no more gotchas because I've I've afforded respect to commissioner Eris Smith and commissioner bankson in both seats that I've I've sat and I've never disparaged their names after the fact thank you all right that it okay next up we got consent agenda we have five items anybody need to pull any the five items not look for a motion to approve so move got a motion by commissioner Smith second second by commission Nesta all those in favor I all oppose motion carries unanimously next up Joe come on down I'm not as tall as uh Mr Becker so I had to lower it a little bit uh I am here today uh I am Joe Patton Director of Human Resources uh mayor and commit City commissioners and uh ladies and gentlemen of the audience um I'm here to introduce and request an appointment for our next uh hopefully our next city administrator uh named Jacob Smith uh just a little background about how we got to here um when the position became available uh or vacant uh we did attempt to uh post this uh from our own site uh which only reaches those individuals that are looking for this position we did go out to several different job sites to try to find an individual uh we posted it twice however that ended it up with negative results we did not find anyone um or those that we we were vetting did not work work out uh we then went out for bid uh for a recruiter uh with more resources to go Nationwide in our search for uh a quality City administrator uh with that bid gov HR won that bid um the rec recruiter that was assigned to us was Jim Denine Jim has many years of Public Service uh experience uh through that process uh he interviewed or vetted 69 applicants out of those 69 he interviewed nine applicants out of those nine he referred four applicants to the city of Apopka for consideration once those applicants came we um formed a interview committee which consisted of myself Radley Williams and Mr vavrick through that we sent a recommendation to the mayor the mayor then uh interviewed all candidates and throughout that process we in turn recommend uh Jacob Smith Jacob I know his resume is a hash but I just wanted to bring a couple things to light uh Jacob hails from Farmington Utah he has over 18 years experience in public administration he has a master's degree in public administration from northern in Illinois University where he graduated first in his class with a GPA of 4.0 he has a ba degree from Brigham Young University and with that I will introduce uh Jacob Smith to uh take any of your questions all right Jak just you want to give us a little more if you got a little more background then we'll we'll open it up further yeah sure thing um it's nice to meet all of you I've met some of you yesterday uh I love Apopka I've had a chance to go around aapka quite a bit yesterday and today and the day before when I came in flew in here from Salt Lake City on Monday that was a long flight for some reason there was some weather going on in Arkansas had to go around it I you know I was I was kind of hoping you guys were in control the weather so I could get here a little sooner but anyways uh just to let you know uh yeah I'm I'm from farming that's where I'm living right now but I'm actually I grew up in uh a blue collar town south of Seattle my dad was uh he was an employee of Boeing that's where I grew up um I went to school in Utah like you said I also went to school and Chicago area Northern Illinois University and that was really my introduction to uh public work well I should say work before that I did do a lot of volunteer work I worked on committees as well and that was my introduction to uh working at the Grassroots level with cities and it was something that I loved at the time I was a marketing manager for an IT company and I just couldn't find the motivation to try to sell people something that I didn't feel like they really needed and it was at that time kind of a sou searching thing well what can I do I was at a banquet and one of my friends got up to speak and she talked about how she was going to get her Masters in public administration never heard of it you know but that that intrigued me and she was planning to go into the nonprofit sector so I decided to check it out as well and I noticed that you could actually work for a city at a professional level receed this training so that way you could help cities become more efficient more effective Ive uh you know smart growth that that intrigued me so I did some more research on that uh decided to go to an excellent school that emphasized Urban management uh for cities and that's Northern Illinois University now that's that's in the Chicagoland area and believe it or not um there's over a thousand different uh forms of government inside that Chicago area Special Districts cities Villages counties uh townships you name it so I thought it was a great place to go and be introduced to that um did an internship the whole time that I was there getting my masters and uh as a compromise with my wife at that time who was from Ido which is way too rural for me and not a whole lot there uh we decided to move to the Salt Lake area where I was able to get a position with uh the second fastest growing city in the nation at that time Saratoga Springs Utah and I worked there until the great re recession uh it was I'm sure you guys felt a little bit of the pain but uh it was hit pretty hard by that Great Recession we had quite a few developments that went bankrupt and uh there's still some empty space out there where uh they have some infrastructure the streets and the water lines with no homes so it's kind of a sad situation it's starting to recover now but I was fortunate enough at that time that Governor Huntsman was hiring for uh his his office somebody that could take over policy and budget for an area that became a huge need that was workb Services Commerce and labor so I was assigned over those agencies and uh managed a little bit over a billion dollar budget with them I was I was the spokesperson for the governor to the legislature and to these agencies kind of that middleman that that's what I did primarily when I was there uh but of course local government Grassroots is still that that's my thing that's what I always wanted to do uh because I really I really want to affect in a good way my neighbors the people that live around me the people I care about I want to see that I'm I'm making an impact some something for good so I went into my city manager that was there and let him know hey I'm here I have this degree in training I was going to go back into doing what I was doing before volunteer committees and uh he actually offered me a job instead as his assistant and that's where I worked for 12 years 11 almost 12 years uh I was promoted several times um I was made the finance director that was my primary areas of emphasis there was finance budget Economic Development and Human Resources I also worked on quite a few of other projects but I was always number two um as part of the executive team a lot of strategic planning it too the name of the town Centerville it too was going through a lot of growth and it was about 5050 between the commercial and the residential and I worked more primarily on the commercial uh development so I brought in some of the big boxes Walmart Home Depot Target uh help to help on the revenue side with with the sales tax instead of emphasizing the property tax as much I also was involved with the quite a few of the Public Works activities that were related to the residential impact uh so I did that for quite a while and then there was an opportunity to to work for Fruit Heights which is a town couple couple towns up is actually the next town up North from where I live in Farmington um their city manager two weeks notice retired they needed somebody quick I was there I actually worked both places at the same time an overlap for about four weeks which was brutal 80h hour weeks I'm sure you guys understand that you're your Commissioners but yeah I did that for a while um as the city manager and while I was there at Fruit Heights you know I I did discover some issues that by my opinion I'm not I'm not legal but some there were some legal issues there were some ethical issues uh there were some practices that were just just terrible in my eye they didn't I like to call it the sniff test there's a lot of things that were not passing the sniff test you know if press understood some of these things that were going on be headline news uh so uh it was difficult for me because I tried to implement some changes and I did but I ruffled some feathers and uh so I only worked there for about 6 months because um I did not give it all my ethics and I was honest and all that I did and and quite frankly I want to work for someplace where I can continue to be that way and and quite frankly where where it is expected because uh for all of you that are here to me a city is not the staff in this building to me the city is all of you and these Commissioners here in the mayor represent you your they are your voice so everyone decides to live within this geographical boundary you collectively have decided this is the way you want to govern and so when I come here I don't just see Commissioners in the mayor but I see all of you and I I'm a tender-hearted guy I love all people I love everybody I love my neighbors and so that's why I'm here I serve and that was one of the things when I came in here that I wanted to make sure was one if I like the people here that's the first thing and two if I can be honest and ethical and i' I've done that I I have actually been very impressed you you are people of great faith that I have noticed and and I have felt it um everybody has been very warm kind down to earth and straightforward and uh that's how I am too so so that's a little bit about me I I am married I have four of my own kids and three step kids uh luckily most of them are out of the house now so i' I've survived the most of the the teenage age so that's where these hairs came from really it didn't come from work that came from my teenagers so with that you know I could answer any questions that you guys might have okay commissioner Anderson you want to start us out right now I don't have any questions I actually met with you yesterday um we to talk for probably an hour and a half and um I was very impressed with your background and the things you've done in the past and um I actually don't have any questions I asked all the questions yesterday so I don't have any questions great thank you and welcome congratulations vquez well the same thing we kind of um initially I had sent out an email and uh I guess you responded I didn't send it to you I sent it to our our inum and uh he did call me and we made arrangements and I did come back it was a busy day yesterday but I think we spent some time in the in the lunchroom it was very informal um we did go over so much of what's the city is about and you know what are you bringing to the table and so I I have to say this because you know in social media it's been kind of running around and you said the same thing um you know they were uh discussions about you know you being out of state you know how does he you know how is he going to come into a popka he doesn't know a papka but I will have to say this um we hired a head hunter to go out and look for the best candidate and uh you Rose to the top I mean there were four I don't know what happened with the other three um but you Rose to the top and you came in and you sat down and you you spoke to each of us and I read your resume and one of the things that really hit me um is because of um that's what I was looking for myself was moreover my belief in honesty ethics and the Golden Rule shapes my decision part making process guiding me to always prioritize integrity and faith aess my Relentless drive as an achiever fuels my focus and dedication ensuring that I consistently de deliver excellence in all Endeavors and those are those are the uh what I was looking for integrity um fairness and that you are available not just to us here as the commission to the staff and to our regular public that if they want to come in and kind of discuss something with you something that they feel is of concern I want to be able to know that they have that accessibility and we did talk about that and I was very comfortable that and you even saying it right now that it's not you're not just serving us that you are actually serving the residents so yeah I thank you and uh the only thing was that you know we don't have we we haven't seen the contract but I understand that it's kind of similar to what uh at Bass had um there were some additions and they did tell me what the additions were I guess you know at some point our attorney will look it over but I was I was satisfied with the additions that will be added to that contract so thank you for spending as much time as you did with me yesterday um and certainly I was very impressed with your your resume thank you thank you appreciate it and we're not done you you have quite a history I I want to learn more I'm intrigued you're an interesting person Mr Smith well I don't have any questions either I met with him as well on yesterday and we do have some control over the weather that's why you stranded on Monday thanks um but uh yes I I was impressed with the interview I had with you on yesterday as well and the thing that struck me most just as commissioner basar said is your honesty and when you talked about the things that you saw that was um not done properly in your previous employment and you wouldn't the stand uh that made a difference with me and so I'm here thank you Mr Nesta yeah no so um this is obviously very rushed and I think we know that up front you know I IID came in to my meeting and and unfortunately you weren't there I know there was a travel issues but again anything that's rushed I always tend to take a step back and say why are we rushing this um with less than 48 hours on the agenda just leads me to question things not you by any means but just the process in general and I would ask any of my Commissioners how much is he getting paid well the contract is I'm asking I'm asking you guys I'm asking how much is he getting paid one St how do you know that I asked to who I asked the city administrator when I asked you guys said there was no numbers this is not um nothing's been negotiated was though what was so there's new information that I didn't get that other people got Mr Smith this is in yeah I know I get it Ju Just my input there was there was a range that was put on the job ad and I'm assuming that you guys all saw that job ad and approve that that went out sure but nobody saw the a contract nobody knows what's actually in it you said there is um commissioner Velasquez said there's added additions no CL what those are well they Joe I I would let um okay what was changed from from Edwards eval or contract to this one and it's got to have the approval of the labor attorney was when Mr Smith's evaluation comes up that it would be a combination of all five of y'all evaluating his performance to get to the score and that was to allow you all to have some input as to how he was being and performing on his um in his office so but none of this is in writing right now it we have a contract but it's got to be reviewed and approved by the labor attorney has anybody have you guys seen this contract have you reviewed it in any capacity well contct that it's the it's the same contract as Ed bass so I I I have seen that with addition haven't seen this contract the only addition is the one the addition was to allow you all to have some input into the evaluation on his annual performance so you haven't seen this contract but we're approving a contract we haven't seen we don't know the exact number we've talked about it but we don't see it on writing my point is fiscally if we're going to be budgeting and creating a line item for our budget for this we need to know exactly what it is fiscally for us we need to have our residents be confident in what we are making decisions on and if we haven't seen [Music] if we don't know exactly what the terms are of a contract then how can we approve that right now or ratify in any capacity I'm not saying no I'm just saying not this week that would be my ask I'm happy to Listen to If the Public's comfortable with it I'm their voice if they're comfortable with it great let's keep moving but uh if if they're not I would once public comments done I will move to um table this until the next meeting so that we can officially meet and we can do Zoom we can do a call I got lots of questions and and by no means I want to do it online offline for us and have some just deep Dives is the contract available now foreview bew byne okay so once reviewed by the labor attorney and approved then that will receive that same contract so a draft is available for us to review now a draft is available now to review has but we have to before we can actually physically okay okay so I'd like to hear from the uh our residents okay I just I just for the record so the only commissioner you have not sat with is commissioner Nester yes okay so in all fairness what he's asking is to have the same uh opportunity as it was given to each of us correct please yes yes okay I think that's fair because we're working together let make sure we're all on the same page it's again this is not a you I just want to make sure we're all on the same page on multiple factors similar to what every other commissioner was granted M Okay let's listen to the public and then we'll bring it back to the council anybody want to speak first of all I'd like to uh thank commissioner Nester for doing this due diligent because this Administration have a track Rec record of setting its term to get its results it's been several times over and over again not speaking against this gentleman because I don't even know it but this Administration even his salary he snuck it in on a vote even the money that was moved over to the bank was sneaked in on a con a consent agenda we need to do the due diligent if we had to did this with the chief with the fire chief and everything we wouldn't be having the problem we have and this way if we can do our due diligence and we need to get rid of the sism and do our due diligence Sylvester Hall in echoing what I said up here earlier by oath what I always say about ethics matters principles matters Integrity matter Character Matters law laws matters rules matters all these things matters and I'm looking at the process right here when I just say Hey look it's time for us to stop giving lip service Mr Smith I can't hold you accountable because I don't know how much you know but I'm going to hold you accountable for this episode right here I'm GNA see how you deal with the situation because if you are a man or Integrity honesty what just happened shouldn't happen that's chaos and you're going to lead the organiz ation of so many employees they have to know that you have integrity you have character and you're not bought and sold and I'm G to say it loud and clear we got too many people are bought and sold thank you too many people that serve on this Administration is bought and sold and they being rewarded for their loyalty which put the community in danger I'm going to say it again so all y'all are understand it too many people on this Administration are are bought and sold theyve been rewarded for their loyalty which put the community at danger and at risk you have history of running an organization you know exactly the impacts of my word I just said because those words create a hostile environment and I tell you things are brewing and incidents will occur I just pray that no nobody else lose their life this should never happen we're ready to just sign seal deliver and nobody has seen the contract that's one- on-one it's not a rocket scientist nobody has seen the contract and then Commissioners Nester haven't had the opportunity to really sit down one on-one with the young man I said young cust I'm 60 too this shouldn't happen this shouldn't happen mayor every day you get up you have a choice to do better you have the choice to do the same that choice is yours Mr Mayor I pray to God that he touch your soul and your heart and let you understand you're here to serve people I said before which we get the minutes mixed up I said God tells me to love you therefore I love you but I said you also have a wicked heart that God says you need to change that was left out of the minutes it was only said that Sylvester said he loved the May and see how we changed the whole situation with just leaving a few words out we're in the 21st century the technology to record minutes from everybody who come up here that should be Elementary and if if we can't do the job we need to get somebody else to do the job if she's being told to put that in there we need to find out and it needs to stop it's just as simple as that it's not rocket science to get the minutes right we have the technology to do that so I say to you again take your oath seriously because everything that's done in the dark eventually one day is going to rise to the light and you're going to have to answer for that thank you Albert McKim 3603 golden Jam Road this city is built on protocols and policies if we invite Jacob here to join us now without observing those protocols and policies what are we actually instilling into that they don't matter this week we have a situation with a sinkhole we had an uh one of our commissioners Commissioners Nesta reported that the sinkhole hadn't been secured and that people's Liv were in danger they could walk into the the facility because there was a gate unlocked commissioner Nesta on Sunday sent that information to the city this is Wednesday I give you photographs in there today that shows the gate is still open and lives are still being putting at risk because this city refuses to follow protocol and policies that they themselves wrote R Olson 3156 orling Hills Lane the popka two things we talked about earlier today I talked about infrastructure and proper protocols with regard to that the other thing is when uh we were doing the charter review I'd indicated that whether or not we have a strong manager or have a strong uh mayor type of government made no difference that I think that this position as well as the other positions identified before the Chief Financial Officer uh should all be approved by this group as a whole not any one individual uh thank you anybody else okay we'll close the public hearing so I just I just have to say this um I was unaware that Nick Nester had not been interviewed or you had spend time with him and one of the things I really want to kind of make clear to our uh audiences um until we come up here we don't know who has conversed with whom um because I can't go to him and say oh did you get to speak to the uh the new uh applicant just like I can't just don't ask I spoke with you I happen to know that the newly elect commissioner was in the building because after after me you had to go speak with her so I knew that you would see her but I was unaware about Nick Nester so in out of respect that he has not had that opportunity as each of us have then I agree that maybe we should table this until he has the same opportunity that was given to each of us as far as the contract um I've been here a while so I did I have seen Edward bass's contract so when they said it was the same with the addition um it's not my place to say the additions were and uh Mr varic did say what the additions were and I was in agreeance with that that evaluations should be done with each of us having the opportunity to evaluate our our chief administrator it should not be just one person um past experiences of what we had encountered with our former attorney has really brought to light some changes that we need to do so that our commission um because we're equally all elected by the people um no one person up here um has more power than the other one our mayor and the chair runs the daytoday operations he deals with the staff and that's rightfully so but I feel anything else that has to do with the business of the city we should all have some kind of say into the input and how things run in the city so that's what I have to say so out of respect that you have not had that opportunity I agree that we should table this so that you get the opportunity and you get to ask the questions to make you feel comfortable if he is the right candidate I appreciate that let me let me go back I just just just to kind of clear the air on how we got to here so I was waiting was hoping I've had all I was doing the background on Mr Smith and one of the things as we talked about you know he he freely admitted he left the job for reasons of of what he saw as ethics issues and so I needed some confirmation from somebody other than him that that was really the case and so I didn't get that call until Sunday evening so Sunday evening I I called Mr Smith Hey listen uh there is a flight a Spirit flight 6: am flight that would get him here at noon uh that would make both commissioner nesta's meeting and who was who's on Monday's Smith's meeting which obviously he didn't get that flight he had to get a Delta flight got caught up on the tarmac and didn't get here until five o'clock right at five o'clock so I will take full blame for his not getting here you know like I guess I should have booked didn't know there was that short on on flights or or seats on that that spirit flight but anyway so I will take complete credit and and but but you know I want you guys to to feel comfortable that this is he's the right guy but I do I want to go back to a couple things that you know Joe as he brought up you know we had 64 when 64 candidates 69 69 candidates that that actually applied for it and so that was a process that Jim Denine without any I don't think did even um get with you either you Chuck or or Radley is the pairing it down to the eight or nine Mr okay so he paired it down and then the he paired it to the four which at that point he alone not I had nothing to do with that so then we got to the to the four is then when the three of y'all were were interviewed all four of those the candidates so is that just just to you know to just for the record so okay so that being said I mean I don't I think that you know I think if we if if if commissioner Nest I know that he will be here until flights 5 four five o'clock tomorrow um so jaob GNA leave till tomorrow afternoon but I completely understand I know that he probably couldn't get here you know school year is about to come up so I don't know that that's a big issue that we wait till next commission meeting I I would just I would just ask if if that's the case that he could if he needs to do it do it by Zoom that we don't need to fly him back down um but I'm I'm happy I'm H more than happy to do that but I just wanted to kind of give you the timeline as to how we got to here um it's uh it's been a process been you know uh we put a lot of effort Jim has put a lot of effort into getting us candidates um and um so three of the four were not even in the state so so it was a yeah it was a it was a it was a a wide reach of of candidates so anyway if that's hopefully he can he can maybe after this meeting get with commissioner Nesta and set up sometime between now and when he leaves to go back to the airport and then if you'd like look for a motion into table till the next commission meeting yeah so moved got a motion by commissioner Nesta second second by commissioner Smith all those in favor I all oppos motion carries namly okay business item uh Crossroad at Kelly pork plat good afternoon Jean Sanchez with the Community Development dep Department this is a request to approve the crossroads at Kelly Park faces 1-2 1-3 and two plat the subject property is located at 4510 on the road on the Southeast east corner of onich and Round Lake Road approximately 150 acres in size the plat proposes to create storm water tracks roads and other infrastructure to support the previously approved projected expansion of the crossroads at Kelly Park development in the Kelly Park interchange form based code area the plat is consistent with all Crossroads at Kelly Park faces approved by the city council and the corresponding master plan Master infrastructure ructure construction site plan approved by the development Review Committee on September 6 2023 the DRC recommends approval at its meeting on April 9th 2024 the Planning Commission unanimously recommended approval of this plat the recommended motion is to approve the crossroads at Kelly Park phases 1-2 1-3 and two plat staff and applicant are available for questions any questions for Jean anybody from the public wish to speak yeah is that part of of the uh kpi this yes ma'am this is the one north of uh Kelly Park Road um it's one of the first ones that came into the kpi it used to be called um it was part of the drri previously okay the entrance Road in there commissioner you probably see it it's just west of gold gy on the North side okay it's the big development on the North side I think yeah it's the big development on the north side of of uh Kelly Park just west of Golden Gym yeah this is the one that touches onich Road on yeah it starts from Kelly Park and goes all the way nor North to andage okay there it is okay any other questions anybody from the public wish to speak on this one not we'll close the public hearing for motion to approve the for the crossroads at Kelly Park phase 1-2 1-3 and two so moved got a motion by commissioner Nesta okay second second by commissioner Velasquez all those in favor I all oppos motion carries unanimously next up land purchase South the Boy Scout Road for the 429 access ramp project I community development director hit uh this is a it's land purchase for uh area south of Boy Scout Road for the State Road 429 access uh ramp project um this is an an additional access ramp that has been planned and designed for the 429 uh by the central Florida Expressway which is cfx um at the intersection of the 429 South Bion Road and also Boy Scout Road this is uh directly north or west of the ridge product or Ridge uh development in order to complete this project the city of Apopka uh does need to require acquire the uh 2.79 acre parcel uh to the north to the southeast corner of Boy Scout Road uh to align Boy Scout Road a little bit further to the north with the culdesac um that'll provide access to the property owners uh along that Northern portion of boycot Road itself the new section of Road will be owned by the city of a pokin will also include roundabout at the intersection that will also improve uh traffic circulation similar to that at the 441 uh or 451 ramp at Martin Road uh the ramps uh going on to State Road 429 will be a Northbound uh onramp and a southbound offramp um access um and utility easements will also be provided to the two Parcels to the South which have already gone through approvals uh the western side is looking for the pointer here western side is already uh this portion here that's a a commercial node and then this is a multif family node and then of course the rest of this is single family and town homes over here an appraisal report has been completed uh This was done by the Barfield group it was provided as Exhibit C in your packet the appraisal came in at 7 $111,000 uh which is the proposed acquisition price um in addition uh we are requesting an additional $14,000 uh to be required uh to cover costs such as Title Insurance recording uh Courier document stamps and warranty deed uh the uh Transportation impact fees are to be used for uh act for the purchase of this uh new roadway acquisition um and the realignment of boycot Road uh the roundabout and the cfx ramp itself project will increase the capacity to the road system and the total so the total requested uh purchase price is $725,000 a budget amendment will be following up at the next meeting uh to assign the funds for this actual project itself so the request is to um approve a vacant land contract for $725,000 for the acquisition of the 2.79 acres for the reignment of Boy Scout Road and the State Road 429 access ramp project any questions for Jim it's two is the two partials 79 2.79 yes it's in the packet yeah I saw that yeah these are the sketches I I don't believe they could put the two portions on one piece of proper one piece of paper so they uh they divided it into the two different sketches but that's the overall project itself any other questions for Jim anybody from the public wish to speak on this matter okay um let's just hold it just for a sec we'll wait for commissioner Ness to get back in case you were wondering when these uh when the two developments came in on the on the South Side they did take into account the this access ramp the design was already done by uh by C so they uh they're okay with the with the project itself they they were offered a lot of assistance with the actually putting this together I tell you it's it's a you know it's a testament the team we were able to you know we asked you know cfx about this access and uh so they've agreed to do the whole the whole interchange and it probably a i we'll say a 15 to2 million investment by cfx that will benefit us so it's a pretty pretty amazing you know return on on investment it helps quite a bit with the traffic circulation off the 429 451 intersection area so this is this is a huge one this connection will go from where this connect to the the the on well I'm going to I'm going to point here so this is the new alignment for Boy Scout Road itself right and then of course this is uh Bion road so there's going to be it round about here this will be an on-ramp going north and then this is an off-ramp coming south and then it'll connect to just right here that connects right into the 429 so you can go all the way up to Kelly park and go shopping at the new Publix at uh at the kpi or you can go south uh to wherever that may go Disney yeah okay all right okay look for a motion to approve the land purchase for the property south of Boy Scout Road for the 429 access ramp project so got a motion by Commission Velasquez second second by commissioner Smith all those in favor I all oppose motion carries unanimously next up joint use agreement city of a Popkin School Board rad the Williams Parkson Recreation director good afternoon uh mayor and Commissioners uh before you today we have for consideration and approval uh joint use agreement between the city of a papa and Orange County School Board city of AA has a strong standard relationship with Orange County public school system and Views the schools located in and surrounding papka as a vital piece of the community uh this joint use agreement is to allow uh for City Recreation programming to run on Schoolboard property and in return to continue to allow Schoolboard uh Athletics to utilize some of our Park facilities uh as part of the agreement the city and Orange County School Board commit to ensure no charges or additional fees will be charged to either party for this use uh as identified IED to the locations in exhibit a and one thing that we we worked with the school board on for this agreement was to um not be as specific with the actual facilities that were in the agreement but rather highlight the parks that they'd have available access to and they highlight the schools that we'd have available access to so in exhibit a it highlights uh that we uh would have access to facilities at apka high school apka Memorial Middle School Kelly Park School Waka High School Wolf Lake Elementary and Wolf Lake Middle School uh the school board for the athletic programs would have access to our apka Amphitheater Apopka Athletic Complex camp weah and Northwest Rec Recreation Complex uh that gives us the flexibility to work with the principes and with the athletic directors to determine the needs that we have at at the varying seasons of the year um we've worked uh many many months with the school board through this process and uh we're excited to have this agreement ready for your consideration and approval and I'm here to take any questions I know that we spoke yesterday and then when I went home I said oh you know I have to asking this um because every year Mr poka we use the high school and it was done with this agreement it will that continue to include the Miss papka correct so it'll be for any City function or program that we have in our department so it would cover that yes okay y any other questions for Radley anybody from the public wish to speak on this not close the public hearing just want to say real quick that we really appreciate uh Schoolboard member bird really working hard to get this thing over the finish line so we got another couple projects coming up that we hope to be bringing forward to uh city council here uh that will also include ocps so it's great to have a a good relationship with our school board and so we look forward to to continuing that that relationship so that I look for a motion to just one question what was the term of that it's an initial fiveyear term with three available fiveyear renewals uh those would be automatic renewals unless unless either side came back with any adjustments to propose okay five years and that need so a total of 20 years maximum turn oh okay five year initial and then three additional five-year renewals and three additional okay okay look for a motion to approve the joint use agreement between the city of Apopka and the school board of Orange County so got a motion by commissioner Vasquez second second by commissioner Anderson all those in favor I all oppos motion carries unanimously thank you next up ordinance number 3,49 ordinance number 349 an ordinance of the city of Republic of Florida to extend its Territorial and Municipal limits to Annex pursuant to Florida statute 17144 the here and after described land situated being in Orange County Florida owned by James H page L life estate and the Annette H page trust located north of West Kean Road and West of East West and East of Martin Road comprising 32 Acres more or less providing for directions to the city clerk severability conflicts in an effective date good afternoon Bobby H planning manager request is to Annex Parcels totaling 32 acres into the city of Apopka properties are located north of West Keen Road and West West and East of Martin Road Parcels are contiguous to the city limits and therefore eligible for annexation pursuant in Florida Chapter 17144 assignment of a city future land use and Zoning designation will occur at a later date through the action of the city council the development Review Committee recommends approval recommended motion this afternoon is to accept first reading of ordinance number 3049 hold it over for second reading and adoption on May 15th uh myself and the applicant are available for questions okay any questions for Bob right anybody from the public wish to speak on this matter not we'll close the public hearing look for motion to approve ordinance number 3,49 at first reading and hold over for a second reading and adoption okay so moved got a motion by commissioner Nesta second second by commissioner Smith all those in favor I I'll oppose motion carries unanimously next up city council reports let's what do we go after this do we get to go for the executive session no we're we're going to close out about the council meeting and then we'll go into yeah it's because it's it's a labor agreement it's different than if it were a settlement agreement oh okay so okay so why don't we start out with a for apple or a for Anderson our newest elected member of the council so first and foremost I just want to say thank you all for to the community for um believing me and actually um electing me as your um commissioner uh it was a journey um I look forward to serving you all with Integrity honesty um just understand every decision and choice I make it is definitely going to be for the best interest of everyone in the community um I'm new so take every mistake with love but just understand that everything I do and every decision I make and every vote I make is based off of whatever facts that are given to me and all the research I do and um I'm just excited to be here I'm I look forward to bringing all my experience um serving the community I will continue to serve um now on different capacity um but I look forward to meeting everyone um there's a lot of things that I want to you know Implement and do in the community um the next few meetings you'll probably hear more about uh my vision um I look forward to um serving and thank you all for believing in me and I look forward to um representing you all um one thing I want to bring up is that I have been receiving a lot of reports from different um firefighters um that actually uh resigned from the Department um I hear you um I'm reading your reports um I'm here your concerns um I will uh have a meeting um with the chief and kind of figure out what that looks like um I am new but understand I do hear your concerns um in regards to some of the comments regarding um a video uh I guess that is circulating regarding some uh I guess some excessive use um from an officer um I will be reviewing that video um uh next meeting I will address um in regards to kind of uh my concerns or if there were any concerns in regards to that um I have served in that capacity as a probation officer in social services so I have seen firsthand um just different things so I have a perspective in regards to that so I look forward to uh looking at that video and addressing some of the public concerns in regards to that uh some other thing is in regards to and I know we already talked about um the uh potential a new city administrator um I was not aware as well that uh Nick commissioner Nester did not meet with him so I do think it's it's extremely fair that he is given an opportunity to actually um meet as well so uh that is all for my short report but once again um I look forward to um serving you all thank you glad to have you on board all right Mr Velasquez okay um well first I mean this is the executive meeting uh we did have the national firefighters uh fire Invasion um this weekend they'll be hosting the 43rd National Fallen Memorial uh which is this weekend Saturday May 4th and May 5th and that'll be in it ensberg Maryland and uh there sadly there's a more than I think 200 names that are going but seven of the firefighters are from here in Florida and of course the one firefighter from Apopka Austin Duran who was an EMT firefighter 25 years old um as we know that he was tragically injured on June 30th 2022 and he died from his injuries on July 15th and uh just want to make mention since he is one of our firefighters and um it is something that we are still um dealing with and trying to get some resolvement for the family and of course um it's been a lot of changes in our fire department during procedures and training because of this line of duty death um the only thing is that this weekend uh it is the President Biden has asked for the flags to be flown at half staff to honor all the Fallen firefighters so I'm hoping that we can do that this weekend in honor of our firefighter Austin Duran and his family um Mr um Sylvester Hall did make mention of the Dei and I will have to say this it was on my commissioner's report from the last council meeting but we didn't get a chance to do so um we've had this Dei committee and it really has not been functioning as a committee uh you know the the last few events you know it it said we had the Dei hosting but there was only two people hosting from uh the Dei group and that of course is you know Mr Mark Wright who is the resident and he has done so much for us and Stephen KP and I I I have to apologize because I don't think any of us I still don't know what is his title Stephen C I think we're Joe's already left it it they changed the yeah they changed it yeah I don't know what it's yeah I I don't know what it's what was it previously I I don't special projects or special project well the only thing I'm going to ask is that we do disband the Dei group and start over again um now that we have a uh you know newly elected commissioner only because uh of course the the the resident that I had appointed um her her concerns have been over the last few events that have taken place and that have been announced that the Dei group was involved she personally has not been involved and I believe um I see Mr Hall has left but he also has expressed that he has not been involved so um I think it would be only fair that we disband the current group that's in place because they have not met um I think they met once or twice um and since then we've only had two active members and one of them has been our the employee and and Mr Mark W who has been very um involved but not the rest of the Dei group and I think we need to start again and I'll have to defer to the mayor that the mayor is a CEO makes that final choice but if that's the wishes of the mayor and and how we proceed um we can we can also go back and and look at it maybe draft a resolution as to right to do some procedural um I I believe I think that would be appropriate because even I reached out to another member of the Dei group who doesn't even he's no longer in apka and he left and he said he has not been involved at all I'll consult with the mayor we'll come up with something okay well no if I can just add real quick to that if we I don't want to dismantle it but if we can just formalize the process a little bit more similar to what you're saying saying let's come up with the resolution and a formal way of operating it and how the members are selected and so forth and put it into solidify yeah it's going to be my same request because I was the one that requested to the committee so I don't want to see it disbanded but just restructure so that they're functioning okay maybe I'm using we will bring any resolution to be adopted and accepted back to the council absolutely and it would be fair for our new commissioner to be able to select someone um within the community that she feels would contribute to I'll work with the mayor and we'll come up with something um let me see they was well of course we you know since the last council meeting till now we've had all kinds of events um I certainly sitting on the Kanas board we just had the recent banquet at the apaka community center so it was very well attended very successful of course we had the swearing in yesterday which was super intend well intended by the family's friends and everybody who was involved with uh commissioner Anderson's uh uh election and um let me see what else we have here uh and I apologize because I kind of wrote everything really quick oh we have uh the annual Armando boras golf tournament that's coming up May 11th and uh and of course May 12 which is Mother's day so let me just kind of extend to all the moms and uh all the ladies uh in the city in our city hall our city staff and um a happy Happ Mother's Day because the next time we come it'll be after Mother's Day so I'm wishing all the women out there uh who are moms to to actually pause uh cats and everything and children and uh just a Happy Mother's Day so thank you and that's pretty much it uh for now so thank you okay Mr Smith all right I just want to uh congratulate uh commissioner Anderson in her first meeting and uh commissioner Nester his return on to the Das also that today is the first day of Asian-American Pacific hour of the month for that celebration and um looking forward to the mayor's prayer breakfast on tomorrow and at noon time for the day of prayer uh here on the steps of City Hall um it was my first time hearing about the video as well uh that's something that we will uh look into also and I think uh it was very well received the presentation in reference to the uh the sinkhole or the the Mind Chef uh whatever they want to call it uh so to give us a better understanding as to what took place and how we need to uh move forward in order to get that resolved um there was one other thing I can't find it all all right that's it commission Nesta absolutely uh I want to welcome commissioner Anderson great first meeting um welcome aboard and I look forward to working with you and and hearing about your goals and aspirations look forward to that so um bring them on I just want to reiterate definitely not dismantling Dei want to just if anything add more people to it again formalize the process but not dismantle add to it I think the bigger the better on that one um Mr hit this one was for you on accident I should have asked it Monday in reference to Surplus property is there I know that we were going through that process at one point are we have we made any strides there or what does that look like moving forward for us one of one of the issues that uh that we had was getting a uh we have to get three property appraisers online um I'm actually in the process we did find out that Duke Energy has a piece of property that's available uh to purchase so we're getting a um an appraisal put on that prop property I've got two other properties uh that I've sent over to the appraiser to see the one that I've got that we're kind of limited at $5,000 so the Duke Energy property is uh $22,000 so I got $3,000 to try to get at least one of those properties done and he hasn't gotten back to me yet in regards to the uh how much it'll cost to get that I've already let him know we've got $2,999 to work with and uh so I'm hoping that he comes through with at least one of those at the $3,000 or that $299 uh $9.99 you know price uh to to be able to get the you know that uh that apprais those appraisals add more funds to something or or help in that regards to because there's a couple Surplus properties that have been discussed and things like that and would that be helpful or well I've got I've got two other uh properties that we were authorized uh through the city council and the CRA to uh consider for disposal um so those are the properties that we were looking at to uh to to see about getting the appraisal the appraisal price the one of the issues that came up with um we used to do this as a um oh boy I'm trying to remember the the term um but we were allowed to be in the past we were allowed to use utilize one firm to Soul Source Soul Source thank you um and that process changed um about a year ago where we can't just do Source we actually have to get three prices the hard part with appraising is that um it's not just hourly but it's also the type of um research that has to be done to get that property so you can't it it it's virtually impossible to get a unless you got out to bid for every single property for three different properties um I did contact Orange County to see what they do of course they have their own on on site appraisal or on staff appraisal uh people but they also have a couple other contracts but they aren't piggyback so the question was can or can Orange County uh grant that piggyback and I was told at this stage that uh they can't at this stage they have to get another contract that's piggyback and they didn't want to bring that to the County Commission to do so I've got to contact a couple other cities and see you know that are local and see who they use and if they're if they if I can do a piggyback contract one of the other other isues that came up with the uh appraisal appraisers themselves is that the one that we had been using Danny dolger had been extremely responsive we could get an appraiser an appraisal done probably two to three weeks the majority of the appraisers that are out there right now are taking two three months at least to get the appraisals because they're so busy um so that that that that was one of the other issues that came up okay so there's a there's a handful of issues that uh you in order to get the appraisal is done but I'm hoping that I can get at least so one more at this point if you were to put that out to bid and the appraiser that we do use bids for it when you sit with the committee I mean that's how you determine the time that they at least cement their appraisals right the if if we go out to bid for a this is each piece of property would almost have to be bid at that stage so and that that's that's cumbersome I mean you you're out for a 30-day B they changed the process here yes under what ordinance was that change or resolution it wasn't an ordinance it was uh purchasing policy yeah oh it was and and blanch is working on making some changes to that that was the one we talked about up and from the 5,000 and upping that level if you remember and also um going from the 50 and moving that 50 up to 100,000 so she's working on that and we will be coming back to you all to make those modifications it's just everything's costing so much now we we're going to have to change policy so we can be more flexible okay that in itself will help last year U year before last we did probably about eight or nine appraisals and they raged any anywhere from 2000 up to I think the most expensive one was around 5200 so if we get that raised like okay Chuck mentioned that that'll that in itself will help okay okay that's definitely something to look into there thank you okay appreciate it um you a question done you can ask if we're going to stay on this topic go ahead oh no no I was done no okay no I got a couple more things sorry um we I assume everyone got the email for the RFP that went out for the forensic audit did everyone get that yes review it um if you didn't review it that's okay it it I did review it and it's it's very messy very sloppy and and I just want to know I mean it's unfortunate that um Mrs Sherman is not here but who I guess authorized that to go out in the capacity that it was it goes through Miss Sherman's office and she's responsible for purchasing and allows it to go out so she was the final say on that that decided that goes out she consulted with me and as we were trying to get you actively involved for a clear understanding of what you wanted it went back and forth so for clarity she put exactly what she wanted plus what the other Commissioners asked for so everybody had a bite at the Apple and it went out that way okay because it's very sloppy and and things that were in there and um former commissioner Becker as well referenced it that there was items in there that are more public records requests than actual forensic audit requests and a lot of it also went into um investigations into campaigns and accuracies and things like that so what I think would be valuable if we want to go this route May is we can BCT this and have one that's specifically focused on finances and the one we can have an investigation to all of our campaigns the accuracies of our promises and things like that I think that would be valuable for all the current members that are elected as well as any past ones that you choose to add to that um if we want to investigate campaigns and I think that's the route we should be going then and uh attorney Shepard who would be I guess the governing agency to initiate an investigation is that a third party is at the state level uh State Attorney is at a federal level that would investigate campaigns it's not federal because it's not a federal office unless there's some uh other allegations involved that are far beyond just election such as honest Services fraud um in terms of who would instigate it that's going to be an an individual complaintant uh somebody has to bring a complaint in order for somebody to start investigating unless there's been a report that involves you know at a certain high level FDLE worried about corruption and that sort of thing so the typical election complaint is alleged to the Florida uh elections Commission or Commission on elections or I forget how they they name their agency but there's also another agency I can't remember the name of it but it's um election crimes it was one of the things that was instigated uh after the 2020 election to look at voter fraud and so forth and so on so depending on what the allegations are there's two different organizations that look at it and obviously at certain level if it was you know significant criminal activity you could even see it go to FD but it doesn't happen automatically it's not like they're all here you know poking around trying to find a crime somebody's got to report something first credible evidence to initiate an investigation so that's how that goes okay so mayor do you want to uh go down that route on all of our would you like to issue those is this all part of that um it the list that he Pro uh that the mayor had provided well he provided six audibly and then he added a seventh one somehow got added in yeah but I did respond to it yeah um that's yours in there your questions were also included Stu was included well the one question was in all of them was um okay uh I I what I said was what does the individual candidate donations and expenditures have to do with forensic audit it's not for us to determine what it's not staff's decision to make and determine what your question is there I well I you know cuz when the mayor gave that as the last thing for his mayor's report it was this had more to do with election again issues staff does not need to be in the middle of a political battle we asked what yall wanted in there we put it in there and we pushed it out but we're not going to be bickering amongst y'all we're here to serve the citizens and do our best for the citizens yeah but that wasn't asked by the citizens list that the mayor reported wasn't asked by the citizens no I'm just saying so we put everything that you all asked as each of that came in we put it in there and said okay we'll let it wash out that way yeah but I you know it doesn't make sense again staff shouldn't be in the middle of this well who who put you guys in the middle of it you all do when you bicker and everybody wants something in in the bid everybody no I asked questions I didn't ask for an AUD I think that's the point it was all get input and then it's refined and then put out it was never refined it was sloppy there was in accur commissioner I'm I'm not here to argue with you it it even when staff was working hard and the purchasing staff worked very hard trying to get this in on on a Thursday you sent your comments back at 2 minutes before it had to be put in the Sentinel 2 minutes before supposed to be and then you said well I'll send it to you tomorrow on Friday blanch was doing her very best to try to meet your needs and she she felt that you were pushing it off and we ask what do you want she got up here and told you at at one of the commission meetings she needed Clarity and you said it was clearly given to you in the paper that you sent her the email you sent her okay and that's how she directed it sure so mayor again would you like to biex this and and have a separate investigation into the campaigns no so do you want to remove yours out of the forensic audit no so you're just trying to derail a forensic audit that we all voted for no I'm not trying to derail just adding a few things to it well most of that's a public record anyway so I don't know if we need to do an education course on public records versus our uh forensic audits I mean maybe that'll be beneficial as well it seems like there's some confusion there um so again once that comes back from if anybody bids on this and probably won't uh we'll clean that up at that point then then um because this was clearly meant to derail uh versus actually and attack versus actually trying to clean up our finances and move forward with it so uh with that that's all I have all right I have my other item oh I'm sorry um found yes I found it uh I I would like for us to uh consider renewing the lease for the chamber for the building with other item that I had we will we can put that that needs a lot of discussion though be a business item for next you want to put bu okay before you do hit the the gavl and I omitted to ask this question because I don't get to really ask you direct but there's been uh uh the Vietnam the V uh the businessman yes we're putting it together okay yeah cuz he called me this morning he not been very forthcoming with the information so we had to yeah we fin he he called me this morning I just I told them I would follow up on it I appreciate it thank you and is the June 19th date the is that I don't remember which date St got it yeah it was the June 19th okay okay gotcha okay from me um I I'll beginning with each of y'all the impact Fe studies for the police fire and Recreation are wrapping up we met with them uh Ralph Tillis uh your favorite consultant last week and they're about um um complete with that they just needed to fine tune and double check the request out of the police the fire and the the recreation department so those numbers are coming in based on those numbers just so you know it'll be a probably a lengthy process because it has to meet the extenuating circumstances requirements under State Statute requiring to public hearings and and some other processes um but I wanted to make you aware that and the reason those numbers are coming in high is we're seeing inflation hit us on everything when it deals with construction or equipment um fired trucks are up construction's up those costs are just gone through the roof so I didn't want yall cut off guard they're coming and I'll sit with y'all I need to get a feel for what direction y'all want to go so I just want to let you know and then the other thing is I know there was some social media uh stuff going out there that we were kicking the VFW out that is incorrect you all have uh you all were the ones that reviewed and approved the final contract they're there um all that's happened is that we'll take over the day-to-day operations of the VFW versus them doing it and we'll continue forward and to add to that too we just got the signed fully executed contract back as well so we we had the it previous executed before y'all saw it the last time it made a change so we had to go and make the change and re-execute I just wanted to State it's yeah we have it it does we have it Oh My Love is Here hi I just saw you I'm sorry he's making sure you're here working I know I'm so sorry I didn't see him here oh you surprised me you dinner anything else Chuck no sir okay all right Cliff anything from you well I can do public records it'll take about 45 minutes or I can tell you I have no report awesome thank you all right uh under the mayor's report yes great art and Fage one of the best we've had in gosh a decade uh it it was so good that I bought a hat early on in Saturday morning and by 10 o'clock when we went to get go get my my hat they' already sold it twice so they they promised me they'd make me a hat like the one they had for me uh just great uh swearing in you know what support uh on the reelection of commissioner Nesta and um newly elected uh commissioner Anderson that was just great turnout it was just great to see a lot of people energized about the the election so um this Saturday May 4th 5: PM the Zack Brown tribute band will be at the amphitheater um should be a great show so y'all that like 80s music they are a great band should be a great band to listen to and yeah and commissioner Smith brought it up the prayer breakfast will be tomorrow morning uh doors open 6:30 a.m. um we I am so so excited uh when I served in the legislature a few years ago we had um David Barton from wallbuilders was our our keynote speaker for the legislative prayer breakfast and an amazing individual uh talks about the the 50 signers of the Declaration and how they impacted not only government but how they impacted um our religious beliefs and and they talk about that that our government was founded on secular principles and uh they go through this the proc showing how all these members of the that 50 members that signed it and what they did to um to to make a religion a part of our our government so regardless of what people tell you we are not a secular government so if you get a chance if you hadn't signed up I think they've got a few more seats available uh very well worth the effort so we don't have David Barton but we have his son Tim and so we're really excited about that and then as you you know also brought up we'll have at 12:00 noon we'll have on the steps of City Hall we'll have a noon Service as well so with that mayor hold on just one moment I just want to make it very clear that we are going into a closed door okay uh labor negotiations persu to chapter 7 uh Florida state statute 44765 for labor negotiations and this meeting will be concluded and then we'll finish it up there with that we'll take a take about 10 minutes break your