##VIDEO ID:tCjUotyXxs4## ready go absolutely um welcome everyone today is Monday September 9th 2024 and this is a regular meeting of the city of Asbury Park planning board chair chairwoman kerac can you please call this meeting to order yes this meeting is being held in compliance with the open Public's meetings act chapter 231 Public Law 1975 adequate notice of this meeting has been provided to the coaster and Asbury Park Press by publication of the annual meeting notice and posted on the municipal bulletin board and Municipal website all notices are on file with the board secretary official action may be taken on the following matters before this board this meeting is being recorded by APV for your your viewing pleasure in the near future please join me to salute the flag I will now take roll call James Bano here councilwoman Clayton is not here at the moment um Eric galipo is absent this evening Jim Henry here Jeremy Hoffman is absent this evening Mayor John Moore is absent this evening Daniel shano here Jen saer here Vice chair gunan here chairwoman KAC here all right the first item on the agenda is the resolution for the 121 Memorial Avenue Redevelopment plan Amendment um can I get a motion to uh approve second um James bonano yes Ivon Clayton is not here at the moment Jennifer saer Yes Vice chair Mike gunan yes Jeremy Hoffman is not here Daniel sheno yes and chairwoman Barbara KAC yes um okay today we have our next item on the agenda is uh 1210 Springwood Avenue uh do we have our is this notice uh appropriate Jack or was we we just carried without notice right was carried was carried without notice okay um the other item that I have is that there was also um I believe Marie that everybody here on the board is eligible to vote J with the exception of Jen Jen and yvan are accused but y okay so we have one two three five so we have five so we have a corn we have a corn but it's up to the applicant yeah we only if they're okay with this we'll proceed okay okay I whether we go to a vote or not we'll make that decision later well well actually you can't make the decision later we proce okay right yeah you have to decide now because later is uh we're already the train left the station at that point okay yeah and I don't carry in order to get other people to listen to the record to vote that I wouldn't carry at the end if we only had five to get more people to listen to the vote listen to the record right no five you're working with five five and I need three that's correct that's all I okay would at least like to proceed we worked hard and at least it's up to you that's problem it's your call if if there's a vote there's a vote of five I understand okay um okay come on up who's who's coming up you're up John okay thank you very much Madam chair John marmura for the applicant Interfaith neighbors um we were last here in June as you recall uh our project was pretty fairly reviewed uh with a number of suggestions that um we rework certain aspects of it we did have informal meetings with your professionals we did resubmit plans and we made some what we consider significant um alterations that Mr mcky uh the executive director will take us through and hopefully uh you'll agree with us that we have come pretty far to the middle to meet with you right can I just uh just one thing uh who did you meet with um I know that it was like a DRC discussion who who specifically did you meet with but Paul before you testify let's get your sworn name please raise your you saw swear testify about giv this truth nothing I do please state your name again for the record and spell Paul mc mc e v as and Victor i l y thank you okay go all right the the DRC that that you had who we met with the vice chair okay with Joe and with Eric lippo all right Eric and me ah James okay great okay uh just so that we can put on the record that Eric is not here uh but the two people that were here James and uh and Mike are okay um from what I can see um one other thing that I'd like to bring up is that I see that the reports that we received from both engineering and planning uh I just want to make sure that uh I saw that additional information was provided after the reports were completed this raises concerns to me specifically mostly for the engineering report that was completed on August 21st and I see an a a report that came out for storm water management on the 30th of August which is beyond the date that it was already reviewed by the by Mr aak so I'm concerned about that so let's throw that on the table because um whatever is in his report is does not include whatever changes were made on storm waterer management that you provided or William Fitzgerald provided on August 30th I'm putting that on the record now we appreciate that Madam chair and I I believe that was mostly technical information I don't know that we we can certainly address it if need be but um for the most part I think the comments in both Miss Miller's and and Mr Vin's report um are what was mainly the issues before this board when we were last year but we can certainly get into stor because because I'm very I'm concerned when we have a a detailed report where my engineer can't have enough time to reply to it in writing I'm concerned okay I'm just putting that out there so let's see what this contains when we get there and see if Mr vakin is comfortable if he's not then we will have to come back have him reply to this your report and do that part again that's one piece of this presentation but go ahead okay well we'd like to start um giving you an overview of the changes that were made to the plan since this was last presented to you in June and for that I'll turn it over to Mr MC yes thank you for placing us on this evening's agenda and hearkening back to the June 3rd meeting our main takeaways from uh the board's concerns that evening and from that extended discussion centered on access and erress to and from the lobbies in the building vertical and horizontal circulation within the building access control and security throughout the building and the elevations and some aspects of the interior design in terms of uses um there were many questions and apparent concern over the inclusion of Early Childhood learning space for four and fiveyear olds including how we proposed to handle pickup and drop off of the children access to the second floor space and security for the children while they were in the building uh this all this use also garnered considerable discussion when we met with City officials informally before the June application heard by the board so after careful consideration we have decided to eliminate the Early Childhood learning use in this project in favor of commercial tenant space these tencies will be fully compliant with the Springwood Avenue Redevelopment plan uses approved uses in that plan uh for the neighborhood commercial Zone I expect that that use will be office use and we actually intend to offer it to other nonprofits that are working in the neighborhood or providing services to the neighborhood we have simplified the first and second floor floor plans in response to questions and concerns of the board growing out of the June 3D meeting we've eliminated one elevator remaining the remaining elevator will service all floors we've added a residential lobby with an entrance from Avenue a mailboxes and package deliver y will be to that Lobby for the residential units on the third floor the main lobby remains at the corner of Springwood Springwood Avenue and Avenue a there is still a rear entrance to the building from the parking lot at the rear of the site site circulation for the vehicles onsite uh vehicle access has also been simplified on-site pickup and drop off has been eliminated given the elimination of that use early childood Center use this actually enabled us to eliminate three curb cuts that showed in the prior site plan one on Avenue A and two on Atkins Avenue and in eliminating those curb Cuts we've effectively restored three to four parking spaces at the curb this also allowed us to increase on-site parking from 18 spaces to 20 spaces these and other changes to the building footprint the architectural changes to the architect tal design including materials and colors as well as the storm water retention and other site engineering issues uh the architect and the engineer will take us through that this evening um I believe we found a way to address those concerns that were raised at the June 3rd meeting of the board um I would like uh after my testimony concludes to invite Charlie Herer who was the vice president of the Asbury Park Museum to offer testimony as to the museum space we planned in the building and that particular use and how it will serve the community so that's an overview of the changes we've made in response to both the June 3D meeting as well as the review uh our meeting with the design review uh group um and I can answer any questions you may have from an overview standpoint before the architect engineer get into the more detailed aspects of the changes well the amount of changes that you've made seem to almost have made this I I almost say a different application because all the modifications that a lot of it had to do with the child care center that that we had a lot of concerns but um you have the time you have uh you have two hours how about it great we Char i' like to bring Mr hoer if you would absolutely thank you [Applause] okay thank you Mr hor would you identify yourself for the record and then we'll have you SW yes uh Charles John Herer Jr a vice president of the asber park museum h o r n r h o r n r yes sir please raise your right hand you swear affirm that the testimony about to given this matter with the truth the truth and nothing but the truth I do thank you okay Mr Herer would you please uh explain your role in this Pro proposed project well I am vice president of the asber park museum the asber park museum is a 501c3 nonprofit all volunteer organization was uh founded in uh 2018 by our president uh K Harris who was unable to be here today um we've had a lot of goals in trying to preserve the history of Asberry Park and I guess one of our main goals was to try to develop a permanent City Museum for Asbury Park um that's eluded us so far I guess but uh it's something that has always been in our minds we have since uh We've founded we've been doing a number of popup exhibits so we have one up now in the lobby of the Berkeley Ocean Front hotel we have one in the asberg Park Library um in the the 153 year history of asberg Park I don't think they've ever had a permanent Museum and it's something that has been uh as I said has been eluding us but uh recently uh Interfaith neighbors has offered us 1300 Square fet on the first floor of the memorial Center uh it's actually too small for a city mum but it's perhaps perfect and uh perfect size and perfect location for a museum dedicated to the history and culture of the city's West Side um since the 1870s uh the west side of Asbury Park has played in important role in the development of numerous genres of African-American popular music including rag time stride piano Jazz spirituals gospel Black fordville Blues Rhythm and Blues doop and Soul music and the Springwood Avenue entertainment scene has shaped the careers of everyone from Duke Ellington and count basy to Billy Brown uh if you look at some of the uh uh things that went on here that are not generally known the first black vocal group ever to record was from as Park uh the earliest banjo recording ever made in the 1890s was made by a a black Asbury musician and in fact the uh first vocal and guitar country blues record ever made was done by an asberg artist um over the past five years there's been a Resurgence of interest in Westside history and culture uh various projects by the Asbury Park Museum the Asbury Park star Society Springwood Avenue Rising vibrant places project the uh asber Park africanamerican music project the restoration of Turf Club these are all great projects and we support them all but they barely scratch the surface of what was here my wife Pam and I have uh been intensively researching Westside music history for the past 13 years we've collected hundreds of displayable artifacts photographs records posters uniforms musical instruments and other memorabilia um we have Museum experience not only with the Albury Park Museum but uh uh we've done actually done five uh major Museum exhibits uh on Westside music history including a six-month exhibit that was at the Monmouth County Historical Society Museum in Freehold so what would a Westside museum look like and what would go into it about a third of the space would be dedicated to the General history of the West Side uh General history portion would be uh documenting the beginnings of the West Side The Glory Days of Springwood Avenue the Westside businesses churches Westside Community Center Boys Club Etc 2third of our proposed Museum would uh be Westside music and entertainment Legacy um uh music tourism of course is very important to Asbury Park but the music tourism now is based Center entered mostly around East Side music in the past 50 years music tourists in town for different events would find an interest in Westside contributions to Jazz Blues Gospel rhythm and blues doop and Soul music um diversity and inclusion uh While most of the African most of the music on the west side was African-American in origin we were also cover indigenous brass bands Italian American doop groups Etc the exhib it will cover the music venues and socioeconomic conditions that produce the music on display will be hundreds of photographs rare posters musical instruments uniform sheet music Etc we're going to have some interactive kiosk which will allow visitors to dig deeper into the subjects there'll be monitors with slideshows and video clips who allow visitors to watch interviews listening boosts that will allow visitors to experience the music genres they were not familiar with and rotating exhibits um we realize this Museum will be costly we're confident we can raise a funding through corporate sponsorships grants and private donations and of course we can't believe we can't even begin fundraising until the uh planning board has approved all of this um an African-American Museum on Springwood Avenue would not only complement the other projects that are going on documenting Westside history um it could be Center piece and draw visitors to the West Side especially music tourists and could be a jumping off point for the vibrant places self tourist one cautionary note preserving history is time sensitive and we're running out of time we've interviewed scores of singers and musicians since we started this project 13 years ago since then 15 of the people we have interviewed or assisted in this research project are no longer with us um someone once said a people without the knowledge of its past history origin and culture is like a tree without roots thank you okay that's all we have any questions from the board of any does that the board member have any questions okay does public yeah I'd like to open it up to the public if the public has any questions specifically about what this gentleman just spoke about and and I emphasize questions not comments questions please come up to the to the uh microphone you will just just as a point of order just so that we realize if for some of you that may not have ever been here before and I see some familiar faces and some not so familiar faces so what happens is that ever after every witness I mean after every witness presents the the the public is allowed as well as the does as well as the board members the public is allowed to ask questions specific to what that person stated so that those questions can be answered at the end of the applic after everybody presents at the end of the application when the when the board is ready to consider a vote everyone in the public is allowed to speak for three minutes on whatever comment they might have about the application as a whole so this is the time to ask questions and I see we have someone come on up I'll be an example yes David Duncan Ocean New Jersey so just the planned hours of operation when the lights going to be on like who's going to be there what times of the day what how many days per week are you going to do other things beside like there going be specialty programs what's your other planning for the space aside from just a a place to show pictures and and instruments yes it's uh let me let me get to the mic we haven't really decided on hours yet it's a little bit early to uh decide on that but we also are planning a lot of other activities and all that would go along with this of course we will have a rotating exhibit in here which will keep people coming in to see new parts and and bring people back to the museum but even now when we're doing some things with the Asbury Park Museum and the popup exhibits and things that we have we have a lot of activities that go along with them anyone else any other questions all right your next Witness Miss oh go ahead uh Paul I we didn't open Paul up the cross pa okay I'm sorry yeah my error uh my apologies to everyone uh the first witness I did not give anyone an opportunity to ask questions of that witness based on the testimony that he gave if anyone would like to do that let's do that now so we do it correctly anyone would like to question Mr M okay okay all right you thank you all right next witness thank you so we'll call our project architect Steve carage he was previously sworn and qualified St let's get you sworn again uh we don't need your credentials though we know who you are please raise your right hand solemnly swear affirm that the testimony about the giving this matter be the truth whole truth or nothing but the truth I do please State and spell your name for the record Steven carage c a r l d g shorepoint architecture Ocean Grove New Jersey thank you and can I also uh assume that because this project has changed so dramatically that you'll be going over where we are like we're not we're not skipping Parts yeah Paul gave an overview of the changes but now I'll walk you through all of those changes right and how they whatever to whatever level of detail you'd like I'll try and keep it as brief as possible Right but it has to be just whatever modifications were made to whatever what we have already seen so it's been a while also we just need to get the plans up and okay [Music] up there oh was it is it is connected to the laptop here we go here we go okay so we'll start we'll go through floor by floor just like we did the last time just make it uh significantly bigger this is your revised plans these are the revised plans correct refer to them since I don't have an exhibit list with me uh let's just make it aa1 today with today's date okay and is this from uh August 5th you see the date is that the date yeah okay a that's what the board has if we could go to the next sheet we'll go right to the plans this is just an image we'll come back to that when we get to the the design of the building as Paul mentioned the biggest change all of the changes in fact were triggered by the fact that we made a decision to eliminate the Early Childhood Center so now when you look at the first floor you'll notice that the drive-thru that used to provide drop off for the and pickup for the Early Childhood Center is no longer there the parking area is still in the same location under the building on the south side of the building and it is served by a single access point off of a Avenue a uh prior our prior plan showed 18 onsite spaces we currently show 20 on-site spaces and we'll talk more about the rest of the parking when we get there you'll notice if you look at the the building which obviously fronts on Springwood Avenue on the corner of Springwood and Avenue a the main lobby is located on the front on the uh northwest corner it's still there you enter the lobby through a vestibule off of Springwood Avenue you also have access to that Lobby from the parking lot which is under the second and third floor of the building on the south side of the building you in response to your concerns about the residential Lobby not having Street Frontage we have relocated the residential Lobby entry to Avenue a and you can see it there on the right hand side of the sheet that entrance provides a separate Lobby access uh access controlled via key cards or key fobs for the residents they will enter into a vestibule and then beyond that point into the lobby itself their mailboxes and their package pickup will be handled in that location if you move then to the front of the building facing Springwood you'll see the give or take, 1400 square foot of Museum space the museum is access directly off the front vestibule off adjacent to the main lobby and there is an egress door because of the occupancy load of the museum there is a second egress door onto the sidewalk at Springwood Avenue behind that you'll notice a new refu room and one of the other major changes that was made to the building that we had a lot of discussion about last time we have eliminated the dumpsters and the dumpster uh enclosure area which used to open onto Atkins Avenue we're no longer going to use dumpsters we're going to use Robo cans and Street and we're going to bring those cans to the street for pickup we haven't yet decided or we don't know for sure whether that'll be municipal or private but whatever it is it'll be done via rooc cans there is a trash Shute which feeds that refu room which is located immediately adjacent there to the lobby which is which can be accessed by the residents on the third floor and by the commercial uses interfa neighbors and the potential commercial tenants on the second floor refu will be handled with 11 65g rooc cans at that location and they'll be brought to the street on the appropriate Day by the building management Personnel can I ask who who's the fitness center for I'm going to get to the fitness center next I'm I'm getting there you by by also eliminating the Early Childhood Center drop off we were able to create a we freed up additional space and you'll notice that behind the residential Lobby on Avenue A there is a new fitness center which will be available to all building occupants that includes the residents and the staff of interfaith and the staff of the tenants it will not be open to um members of the uh neighborhood and they will not be selling memberships it will only be to serve the building occupants so how do the residents the questions I want to ask still we have we have the separate resident entrance right correct they don't go in through the main lobby they they well they can enter through the main lobby double door elevator is that door open both ways yes it opens on both sides and it'll be controlled by a by key card so that only the residents will have access to the third floor and only those people who work are employed on the second floor will have access to the second floor res can come in either way they can come in either way yes that separate but to get to your question I think where you're going they will have to enter through the lobby to get to the fitness center I guess they can come through the they come through the rear too right yes they could come straight in from the parking area to the rear entrance we've also have we have enough room now that we've added two restrooms one each for men and women and both of those restrooms include shower facilities so that enables us to get that missing lead point that we talked about last time at some length because we now have a fitness center with shower facilities if you remember without a shower you don't get the lead Point even though we are not seeking lead certification and I'm going to cycle back to lead in at the end of this presentation the rest of the first floor is consumed by Building Services you have a you know Water Service entry room an electrical room and a tad data room Building Services on the first floor the other thing you'll notice at the top of the sheet is now um on Adams Avenue we have added in addition to the stair number two which is the second egress stair we have added a recycling room there are 16 65g rooc cans that can be accommodated in that recycling room and both the residential tenants and the commercial tenants Interfaith than any of their four or however many they end up being tenants will put deposit all of their recycling manually into those rooc cans in the recycling room they also will be taken to the street on the appropriate Day by building management so Steve you mentioned so the garbage disposal you'll have a shoot yeah we'll have a shoot for the trash not for not for recycling completely separate and that'll be a building management issue to make sure everyone understands how that operates where does the shoot go to the same room the Shute runs vertically out of that refuse room that you see right there in the middle of the plan and when we get to the upper plans you'll see there's a refuse room on both the second and third floor where everyone else will be able to go to that refu room and use the trash sheo so the recycling storage at the top of the screen there that's a separate room for other recycling there two recycling areas I'm sorry I didn't there's a recycling room at the top of the picture as well so the top is the top is recycl just ref the lower room which is connected there behind the restrooms and next to Building Services is for trash only okay and we will have to that's a building management issue they'll have to make sure the residents understand that their recyclables are brought to the other room trash goes to the trash room so how did they bring that there well that stair that's just a the stair number two which previously had been simply for emergency erest purposes will now be available to the residents via key access so they can use that stair they may choose to come down the elevator and walk around and bring their recyclables in when they're coming and going from their you know going in their normal day of business day daily business but they can use stair number two so for the recycling for the recycling they have to go out to the sidewalk and come correct correct or they can enter it from both sides if you look there's a door on the inside as well facing the parking area so you'd have to take the El from the stair not from the stair you have to you have to exit the stair yes and then and then go to the recycling room it does lead to more steps I think many people would be doing obviously if you have a shoot for your trash and recycling you say hey you got to go outside potentially go down a set of stairs uh we could appreciate that but we also have 16 cans compared to 11 that got that's just my two senses that I don't think that'll be utilized well the 16 cans is there because we expect a less frequent pickup of recyclables and the other thing that when it comes the these sizes are are actually quite large as compared to the similar operation across the street don't mean to my say was wor so logistically if you're a tenant and I'm actually one of the bigger advocates for going green now I'm going to have to potentially go outside to bring a separate trash bag to recycling when you could just drop it down when you have refuge in one area it's just my two cents that's all it is uh logistically I think that's tough though why not put a door from the stairs into the recycling direct you wouldn't so because it's a fire rated egress St and you're not supposed to provide any direct access off a fire rated egress St by code they can go outside and come back in but you can't connect access to okay it's just code issue okay okay so that's that's the first floor the other thing I should mention is we have 36 bicycle racks half of which are at the top right corner um to the right uh to the west side of stair number two and the others that you don't see here but you'll see on the site plan are to the the lower left corner on the sidewalk and we'll we'll get to that when we get the site plan up but there are 36 bicycle racks where 35 are required so we have accommodation for all of the required bicycles here on the first floor on the ground level go to the second floor so the second floor which used to house the Early Childhood Center you can see on the west side of the building four tenant spaces um there can be four there may if depending on the the need for tency they may be red divided into three five it depends on uh what the market wants but we have space for the ten tenant spaces on the west side of the building and then the entire Eastern 2/3 of the building is interface neighbors new headquarters you enter via a second floor Lobby you can see the elevator opens into that Lobby there is a Monumental stair which I forgot to mention is also in the lobby on the first floor you can use that Monumental stair to come up the stairs into the second floor Lobby you then have a receptionist for Interfaith neighbors right there adjacent to it and you can enter Interfaith neighbors if you have business with them at that location if you don't you can circulate back down that Corridor to any of the potential tenant spaces and obviously you can see that there's there are three stairs in the building the commercial tenants will use stair number two and the and the Monumental stair as their egress points Interfaith neighbors folks will use stair number two and stair number one which is located in the lower leftand corner as their egress points all of interface neighbors oper ations are going to be Consolidated here all of their various departments and this plan accommodates all of their needs if you look right in the if you see the elevator just to the left of it as the caror starts you'll see there's a trash room there where the trash shoot exists so Interfaith neighbors folks and the commercial tenants can deposit their trash in that shoot at that location everyone on this floor has access to that Refuge room and the trash Sho if we go up to the third floor we still have the eight um residential units um as we discussed last time there are three one-bedroom four two-bedroom and one three-bedroom one of the two-bedroom has been designated uh for low income the three-bedroom unit has been designated for low to moderate income these are all responding to questions raised in Donna's letter um they are all uhak family units all eight of them the and I should have mentioned earlier the building is completely um handicapped accessible and all these residential units are type A adaptable as is required in the state of New Jersey and if you have any questions about that I can address it but they are they all are type A adaptable units um the other thing that you don't see here is that the second floor roof the projection to the South which is you can see here that L-shaped projection which on the left hand side of the the page is the roof of interfaith neighbors down below we plan to to install a solar array on that roof and we'll talk about some green initiatives later when we get to that point so that's where the solar array will go on the second floor roof Facing East and South I assume in stair one the tenants from the upper FL can't get the tenants from the upper neighborhood I gu doors are not entering on to each floor right no not not St one if you come down stair one you're going all the way to the ground and exiting the building correct and if you if you went back to the second floor we actually have a control Point go back you can see where we can control access both the Interfaith neighbor space because the residents will have access to Stair number two for use to going up and down if you so choose to use it we have a control Point there's a vestibule outside of it and that controls access to both the commercial spaces on the right hand side of the sheet and Interfaith Neighbors on the left so stair one is just to get out stair one is an emergency erress stair only yes if you're going to go walk up to interf neighbors you're going to use the stair in the lobby the Monumental you could if you you could yes if you parked in the garage and wanted to just walk up one flight you could if we go to the roof plan I don't know that there's we need to discuss the roof plan um obviously it's a not when I say a flat roof it's pitched at a/4 inch per foot but it will uh essentially appear as a flat roof and there is mechanical equipment which will all be screened on the roof we have a aluminum mechanical equipment screen which will surround all of the mechanical equipment um and there's one other note that came up in Donna's letter and that is that all of the venting of the residential units will be through the roof there'll be no venting through the facade of the building at all we go to the next Plage we can start to talk about some changes to the architecture on the top of the sheet you can see the Springwood Avenue elevation um the lobby is at the the right hand corner of that elevation the only place in the building where the storefront glazing is extends two stories because we have two public lobbies both on the first and second floor is at this southwest I'm sorry northwest corner of the building which is the main entry we have a big metal band a metal band that wraps around over that storefront that they'll contain pin mounted stainless steel lettering that lettering will spell out the mamora center which is the title to the building if you looked a little to the left of the lobby you'll see a small panel which appears to be I have samples of materials but it's a lighter color that is a metal accent panel and the address of the building will be mounted pin mounted letters on That Metal access panel the entire first floor of the building other than that one access panel is storefront glazing clear glass we want to invite everyone on the sidewalk to see what's happening in the building the glass that you see in the center there is opening into the museum the glass that you see on the right hand side is entering into the lobby if you go around the corner at the lower the lower elevation which is the Avenue a elevation the west elevation you can see that band wraps around and stops but in that clear glass area that you see that's two stories tall right inside of that will be the Monumental stair so any traffic that you have pedestrial you know people traffic moving up and down during the day will be visible from the street and we we like to do that that helps to activate the streetcape there by having the the vertical circulation visible on the exterior of the building there'll be one address there'll be there'll be a separate address now I'm going to move back if you go just behind that Lobby you'll see there is a inset um door that is the new residential Lobby that is also accented with some metal panel um that metal panel curves and creates a slight recess that'll be illuminated at night we'll get to the lighting in a bit but there will be a separate address for the residences there that'll be mounted pin mounted letters on those so when you separate address it will have to a address the other you know what I don't exactly know that we'll have to talk to the postmaster about how that's going to be set up and that always depends on what the postmaster tells us what did you me just having a separate place for if it's the same address just a separate signage at that yeah I I don't know how the postmaster is going to want to designate the units I assume the building will want to have one address usually the fire department requires one address but from the post office perspective we're going to have to deal with the postmaster and figure that out but this isn't the first multi-tenanted building that we've had so we'll be able to we'll be able to work that out so just for clarity I'm sorry the that that all of the glass that we're talking about on the first first floor is clear yes okay is there does that change as we go up the floors no we're talking clear glass okay in the whole building all right the only thing that I'm going to ask of you is that if you look at where your emergency exit is stair one as you go up you see that there's like what four panels of glass yeah I asked to for us to understand what kind of lighting is in there because what we have found is that in other buildings here if that glass is clear it's a bit offensive to the people that are across from it so like let's say if you have if your stairwell is lit and you have a clear glass on the stairwell at night that lights on if we could have something frosted tell you choice or some option we have no problem with that we we like to have the glass there because we like to be able to see vertical circulation it helps en liven the streetcape that you know and it invites people in but if that's a concern we would have no problem with with switching to a somewhat opaque or a fritted glass so that we can limit that the glare emanating from that obviously that stair is a required ER stair so it will have to be illuminated so no no so no no question about that we just have other buildings in this city we can have that discussion yeah and and maybe it's the level of Illumination problem yeah I mean a little more I'm I don't think it's it's only going to be lit to to the code required illumination I don't I don't argue with you about that I'm just saying that there are other buildings in this town where we have made this mistake where now you have a building that's across the street staring at a stairwell with lights not appealing if that you're sitting in your living room looking across the street just saying so that's why I'm going to ask you work with our planner our office can coord we will either Shield those lights so that there's nothing or we will work with some kind of fritted glass and we'll solve that problem to we need something very well aware of what my concerns are we can work that one so we can work something out that would be great we have no problem with that as a condition okay so then talking about the the arch the changes to the architecture if you remember last time we had a first floor which was essentially glass we had the second floor which was the Early Childhood Center which we were essentially cladding in metal with ribbon Windows to provide as much daylight into the Early Childhood learning spaces as possible and then we had the third floor which we had transitioned to a simulated wood and the fenestration varied because it it was representative of the floor plans on the third floor we have now changed that so that the entire building from the second and third floor will be a simulated wood panel we think this is more cohesive it works better we took your suggestions to heart we are going to Accent some of the the third floor level with some metal banding on there in order to give it a little bit of Life we've also align the fenestration on the second floor to correspond to the fenestration on the third floor the the the elevations are further enlivened by the fact that up on the third floor we have indented inset balconies which creat Shadow and Rhythm to the elevation so that in combination with the addition of glass railings the simulated wood panel some metal banding we think that we now have a building that's cohesive and yet it's not as harshly delineated in terms of the functions as it was previously um we're pleased with this we hope you're pleased with it as well we think it's a a vast Improvement I I happen to agree we like that I don't know if I don't know how the planning board members feel but are we okay with the glass railings those were an issue too on another project they were an issue on another project why go ahead because of glare because of glare sun and glare the deping neor depending on the street depending on where where you are and how the Sun is going there is glare would be West faing this is be West fa I think that this these are West and some of them would be some of them will be North North I some will be East the only place we don't have railings would be on the south elevation and then the only thing I was going to add here is if you look at the bottom right of the of the the lower elevation you you notice that the building is elevated obviously above the parking so if we go to the next sheet if if you we go back to GL railings if you'd like at the at the top we have the atams the atams Avenue elevation um there is one additional change here you notice on the first floor we have the metal cladding on the first floor at stair 2 and the refuse room we've done that to set it apart because everywhere else on the building the second and third floors are different than the first floor so we've used the metal panel here on the on the first floor to set that base set up that base and then let the rest of the building rise above that you'll notice on the right hand side of the upper elevation that the the building is only two stories there that's the projected wing of interfaith neighbors office and the solar array will be on that second floor roof so what color is that woman silver one what you're talking about the ground floor if you'd like I can show you if you if if it's okay I guess we have to enter these as exhibits aa2 the the yellowish panel that you see is is this color right here I'm sorry that's that's the metal the metal panel that's on the first floor and it's it's accents it's on the second floor here on the on the Interfaith projection where the building is only two stories tall and it's the first floor accents the body the body of the building is a simulated wood panel looks like this the trellises which are on top of the balconies on the third floor the open simulated wood trellises are a darker wood like this and the banding which signifies the entrance on which the the pin mounted you can't see it on these elevations only on the other side is this color here and the pin mounted lettering is stainless steel something like that with be mounted on that on the metal like that so there'll be contrast so you can see it these are A2 should I jack should I put over and I should mention that should I put them over there for the public if they want to see them sure thanks chairs here I should mention that all of this material will be installed as a rain screen on the building I don't know if everyone understands that but that means that there'll be a a waterproof membrane on the building and this will be installed but it will not keep the the moisture out of the building it'll drain Behind These pounds they'll be open jointed we have also done a few I I should have mentioned if we can get back to the second floor I did miss one other point that I wanted to make if you uh that's not going to show go to the first floor we also if you remember where right behind the Turf Club building when we were here the last time we had a 6-inch gap between our building and the Turf Club which exists obviously and we thought that might create an unworkable situation for our construction and then subsequently for their construction so we have backed our building up 5' 8 in from the property line that leaves 6'2 in of clear space so that both we and the Turf Club can build what we need to build when the time comes to get in there and build building is that also going to be a walkway or is that not it's it's well the walkway runs along there there is a walkway there and and as you can see to the left of that there you can see we have bicycle racks in that area oh I'm sorry I meant the walkway from uh spring Springwood up there is a 4ot gap the we're 6 in off the property line at that point the Turf Club is 3' 6 in off the property line at that point so there is a 4ot wide Alleyway there we're not using it for anything I don't know what their intentions are but it's there hang on it's not an Alleyway it's their property it's their property it's their from their property right right so this project can't do anything with it it is the turf clubs it it will appear as an Alleyway but and then describe the other you didn't you set back further on the other side well we're set on the rear we're set back 6'2 inches from their building but to the left of stair number one there's only 4 foot between our building and their existing building so you're providing a 6 in setback from that property correct so that summarizes the changes I wanted to touch on a few of the green items that we discussed last time can we can we just go back to the where we were on the rendering yeah yeah all right so that the the piece on the right where it says facing Atkins Avenue that's where the turf does the Turf Club completely cover that that's that area the gray the gray area they the gray area on the bottom it's only it's only one story but the gray is the Turf Club okay so what's above it is it's a it's a ground face masonry wall so we have a blank wall two two floors of a blank wall yes but obviously you have to be pretty far back from the building to see it if you're on the sidewalk there you'll never see it they've also agreed to meet with theart Council that is an opportunity for a graphic we I I think Mr mcy testified that we we're going to wait until the building is constructed and then find a way to include public art somewhere in the building that may be true but then then we have to make that request that it's done or else we cannot say that your resolution that you're complete we can't deem you complete until that mural is there well well there's we haven't tell you you guys tell me we have worked in the past to permit them to once they've got their formal application in right to okay you s enough for the Comm okay and then Michelle manages them all right so but resolution compliance but it's in resolution compliance that's resolution compliance final zoning compliance oh finally zoning compliance okay okay we could we could do it that way that's yeah we we haven't we haven't agreed to a mural there I know everyone thinks you have a blank wall you need to have a mural but we have other ideas about how we might incorporate public art um other than a mural so we'd like to reserve that until we get there okay that's that's yeah that's fair um the other thing that I wanted to find out is that the senior center is across the street how how many is that the equal amount of stories Senior Center Center the senior center is three stories and 35 ft the same as this building okay so they're both the same so one will not see above the other so so the senior center will not see the rooftop of the Mechanicals no they will not well first place if you notice there's an equipment screen so nobody will see nobody will be looking down on our roof right well that's what I'm saying is that if the if the senior center was four stories they would they would but but but if they're if they're just the same size we're good right okay thank you all right so there was some some that the the thing that's going to look like an Alleyway but it's actually the Turf Club property so we can't we can't ask for a fence there because we can't ask for anything because it's there it's the turf club's you can ask the Turf Club you can ask them but not part of this application we might have someone there yeah you might know somebody there I don't know so just as I talked about last time we are not seeking lead certification we're not going to go through the expense of trying to do that but we have looked at the lead checklist we believe we're in the 45 to 50 range for lead points yes um as you know that's certified but not silver certified but we're we're pretty close we actually got one more point now that we added these showers believe it or not but but some of the things we do have we do have a rainwater and storm water management system we are going to use a reflective roof coating probably a white TPO roof so that will reflect uh heat we are going to use uh our Landscaping that we're using after it's initially installed requires little or no irrigation we're um using all low water sense lowf flow Plumbing fixtures in the building we're using daylighting controls on all of our lighting we're using all LED fixtures in the building and they're all dimmable we are using um an we're going to design an HVAC system that will exceed ashray requirements ashray standards we're using um our material selections are based on life cycle cost impacts we're specifying M we will specify materials that are biobased if they're wood they're going to be FSC certified wood and and we're going to emphasize reused and recycled material we're going to uh develop a program to divert waste during construction we we are using operable Windows throughout the building so you will be able to open your windows for ventilation um we're using all we're going to specify all low vocc adhesives and sealants and paints um we every space in the building almost without exception except some of the meeting rooms that are in the center and some of the utility rooms have access to Natural light um all of the residential units are oriented towards the exterior and all the living rooms and and non-b spaces have Windows exterior windows we're using all energy star appliances we are going to exceed the STC ratings between the apartment units to make sure we have good acoustical performance and we're going to have a solar array producing some amount of electricity for the building on the second floor roof of interfaith neighbors um again that's that gets us certified IED on the lead checklist but not silver I know that we had discussed in the in our prior meeting that that uh you will provide a checklist summary of those items we have one now we're refining it but no that's that's fine as long as that's that's provided by the time of resolution compliance we're okay we need to add that to our resolution list that's all I had to say as a presentation but if Donna wants to go through her letter we can certainly do that um there were is somebody else going to do lighting yeah we're going to we're somebody else is going to do lighting is someone else doing parking or are you doing parking um I think Bill's handling the parking Mr that's fine um those would have been my questions okay all right do you want to go through your letter yeah I think I I mean if if we're in a in a position to go through the letter or do we want to wait until everybody's they pretty much hit you know aside from the things that we haven't talked about yet the lighting and the plan uh and the parking I I is there anything in there that in particular you want me to address so I just want to clarify so um the mail and package facilities for residences that's in the right in the first vesle it's in the vestibule so the mailman will have access to it without having to get through the second secure door which will be required you'll need a key fob or a card access to get through and then we still need the bicycle parking parking yeah I you know um for the most part the stuff in my letter is satisfying so so you're so you're okay yeah with the letter we'll talk more about lighting right whatever whatever is not has not been touched upon yet we'll we'll do so and I'll depend on Donna to give us in response to questions last time we we retained a lighting consultant and um so we're prepared to address the lighting issues as well so the thing from Donna's letter is variances for setbacks have those changed at all I'm sorry I didn't hear uh when we talked about this previously you needed some variances because of the setbacks oh you're right have those changed at all yeah we we need yeah we need some dimin well on Springwood Avenue and Avenue a we need really dominous setback and front setback variances because we are further setback than than is permitted the reason we are is we want to provide a vegetated buffer screen there from the sidewalk to the building that was specifically asked of us by mayor Moore so we provided that the Atkins Avenue setback is what it is because we're trying to preserve a portion of the site for use as a community garden so we're holding the building back in that area of the site and by the way because we've eliminated the trash dumpsters a lot more area opened up on that area that portion of the site which can be used for community garden space than previously but to your question they are the same dimensions okay they shifted the building building in the interior yeah we we didn't alter the setbacks by the way they're the same any other questions from any planning board members of this witness no any questions from the public of this witness of anything that he has testified of please uh stand up this is your time Dave Duncan ocean so just a question so is there any part of the building as far as a vestibule or anything where people from the outside can get in after hour and there's like an like you said the VES where the mailin comes in that's going to be unlocked all the time or there's always going to be a t key fob entry yeah well typically the vestule is accessible so an open space 247 otherwise we'd have to give the mail carrier a key5 as well we normally wouldn't do that just a security issue we manage to Springwood Center building on behalf of interface neighbor in the city of Asbury Park and there is a residential Lobby there with the vestibule that outside door that vestibule is secure you do need a key fob and the mailman does have access through that vestibule into the lobby and I imagine we will handle this the same way many buildings have the same and just second question as far as the the um the lighting for the the stair I think that's a also a great thing that you have as far as that's clear glass and I think that fogging that off and so forth I think there should be a way is there a way that you can downlight or do something to keep that that stairwell remains with clear glass as opposed to uh switching that over to that that that we already have our our planners understand that where we're going it mention it was mentioned to fog those glasses I think that's a bad it is but when you when you're going there's a perfect example go down Kingsley you'll see a building where the stairwell has bright in it just needs to be managed properly but agre that's what we're looking for we're looking to manage it okay good evening um I just have I have two quick questions please identify um Jennifer saer you might address 14033 um I just have two questions one I just want to make sure I'm reading the plans and the elevations correctly the Springwood a elevation had um has that column that's shown and I think it's behind the Turf Club right that's supporting the Second Story yeah that the top so that column is behind the turf clob yes on the third floor it's exposed right which which column are we talk that uh the one that's shown like it visibly in the Turf Club but it's I believe showing be it's meant well actually that's behind the Turf Club the Turf Club sits in front of that yes that's why I just wanted to make sure that that was I was reading it correctly um and my second question is just knowing that we have very these very tight um obviously very tight construction um as we both move forward with the different projects what can be done to protect the Turf Club during construction when we have such a short a small little um window there actually when when you build adjacent to a property line the contractor will be required to construct netting or scaffolding to protect the adjacent structures so we'll have that requirement in this in our construction specifications as well okay thank you is is that just normal or is that something we have to add to our uh resolution that's standard okay okay anyone else okay next witness thank you the site engineer William Fitzgerald he was previously qualified and previously sworn uh no I just need a second to set up I can what that please Madam chair I can talk while I'm set no I can try I you know that's that's up to your that's up to your attorney we have a full board okay oh that's fine wait a minute we'll be back in a second [Music]  now that just in case okay um Jack do you want to again yeah just wait for okay finish with the mouse that's his right hand yeah on don't tell me this isn't going to work with this nothing [Music] you go that's not really doing it for me I can't get over this this 18 times today [Music] JN huh there we go okay thing there it is hi madam chair if I could I'll go right to the key issue I'm sorry so introduce yourself he my name is William E Fitzgerald I'm a licensed professional engineer and planner in the state of New Jersey and I'm the site engineer for this project and I was here right hand s from the testimony about the giving this matter the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do thank you for the record Mr Fitzgerald's previously sworn I'm sorry previously qualified and sworn and uh so what what are we going to be reviewing are we reviewing okay so to to address your opening comments yes okay we had submitted I believe on uh on April I'm sorry August 5th uh a false submission and then about 10 days not a little bit more than that 14 days before the hearing we received the engineers review on with storm water yes so there were any number of ways to handle that what we did was chose to try to take the recommendation and and comply with it to the letter okay and so that was ER Ras that week but we got it in 10 days before the hearing so that if you if you're satisfied with the presentation this evening you're authorized to vote on that well the thing is is that what we have to I have to understand if our engineer is satisfied that he had enough time to review the information and if he did we can go but if we he didn't have enough time we may have to come back and once he gets a chance to review it and create a new report or an addendum to the report I should say I'll jump on that so wait minut Raise Your Right hands I know confirm the testimony about giv this matter be the truth no truth and nothing but the truth please State your names for the record and your respective positions with the board Samuel aak and board engineer board plan thank you okay s sure so thank you mam CH so I how it had transpired and it's all right with you I'll kind of explain what my concerns were maybe that'll help a little bit uh so the second submission will through the revision on August 1st the plans were there's a subsurface infiltration Basin the water was going to be collected from the roof and the drainage from your parking lot even though it's covered go into the subsurface Basin from there it's going to be pumped out into an inlet that's okay that's acceptable it's not a problem where my hiccup was is that they had an infiltration Basin trench infiltration trench beneath the Basin that was pretty much at the season high water table so my concern was hey if you're at the season high water table I you build you mind going to uh I don't know if you have this PL I do it was sheet sheet 11 I think it's 12 they want to see revage plans Bill okay so if I might so I'll just I'll just finish up these are the Revis plans yes okay so let's make this aa3 aa3 please so if the board will look at the top where you see a little trench um what that is is a basin and the trench right there originally was designed to be be at the seasoned water I well my hiccup was my concern was that water would be coming into the Basin being pumped onto the city's infrastructure potentially inating the system yep so what bill and I Bill had read my letter had called he and I had talked about it I'm comfortable with what he has submitted to an extent I would say that finalize plans and think the details and uh you know any of the notes that come up should be submitted and I could submit a letter and condition of resolution stating that that was finalized if you're that the storm water management is to your yes if you're okay with that I I think that's fine you know storm water management is is Big Ticket near and dear to my heart 100% and that's why ear do you want to go to sleep tonight as long as if I the only way I can go to sleep at night was with storm water management taken care of I'll let Bill harp on what he redesigned but what he had done and he'll testify to it though is raise the bottom of that base to be 2T from the season High what that does is make me feel more comfortable there's going to be no water inundation into that Basin so the design stayed the same as a functionality logistically though it was just shrunk in depth but Bill will testify for that all right okay so if I what we just identified as exhibit A3 if I got it correctly A3 A3 I'm sorry is a combination of two things it's a combination of the eight sheet plan set that was filed on uh a August 5th and the five sheets three sheets I'm sorry uh that I filed on August 30th to address the storm waterer comment that in my mind was a Make It or Break It If you agreed with s's position which I didn't but not not an issue having said that you've already seen with the architectural plan this is the third sheet of the submission uh and that nothing changed on that relative to what the architect showed you uh we have only the one Ingress egress driveway on Avenue A we have now have 20 stalls we have 36 bicycle stall split between the would be the South I I'm so confused on this southeasterly corner rear corner of what would be the Turf Club and the uh southwesterly corner of of this particular site uh and I think uh the architect talked about the general issues in the circulation plant this is aa3 this is a combination okay oh yes so if you take the large plan that we gave you this came in today around midday it seems to have the same dates on but just be small I'm not sure what you're looking at what we've submitted uh is it's this one I don't know if it helps they use the big one and then he's just going to have a couple extra sles us about storm water right yeah yeah so there were images of exhibits that would be presented in tonight's testimony it was an email that came in at 3:24 p.m. okay so is that is that what that is I'm sorry justed is that correct though just a redu size I'm sorry I think I think you want to use the large sheets and then I can explain the difference between aa3 and M which is very minimal okay so right now I'm looking at the third sheet of of your large site plan which is the layout plan okay and as I as the architect went through you understand how the building works the one driveway from Avenue a the 20 parking stalls the bicycle storage behind the uh Turf Club and also at the southwesterly corner of of the underneath portion of this site okay what we've provided uh knowing how the building changed as to accessing refu and storage of refu and recyclables we relocated the barrier freestall from where I had it um in an earlier submission and put it at a spot where we could have a continuous sidewalk across the barrier free I'm sorry across the parking area that would have a barrier-free ramp at either end so someone could exit the uh southerly facade of the building proper uh walk across the parking lot with recyclables and deposit them in the storage room okay and the planner has asked for a a crosswalk to be striped across here we have no problem with that planner has also asked for depress curbs we have them asked for sign signage to keep people out of these places on the on the North side that's an access aisle for a barrier-free stall it is signed per state and federal requirements on the South Side I can put a No Parking anytime sign or I believe it's are 7-4 under the manual uniform traffic control devices there are curb cuts on both sides they only 5T wide so nobody can drive up on the sidewalks without mounting a curve now the next sheet on your 11 by 17 submission is my grading and utility plan and fundamentally it shows where the sanitary sewer where the water where the uh gas is coming in and we show the electric coming overhead from a nearby Pole to the souly building I guess it be a storage room right behind the stair the stairwell that can be depending on how it's worked out with the utility company it can be underground it's a short run either way but I just wanted to show where it would be coming from more than anything uh because that was one of the comments the main thing is that in the previous submission the sanitary store was all on under the building over overhang the next sheet is the sheet I submitted on August 30th you don't have that that I know of but it's the same previous sheet and the only real change to that is that I've taken the sanitary store is that going too many that is a she miss okay what's happened is I'm sorry somehow this got really screwed up bear with me so that's one sheets okay one of the three that came in is I took this sanitary store which is under the building I took the Westerly portion of it and I moved it just outside or just east of the overhang of the building and I did that because I needed to make the area I had to comply with Sam's comment regarding storm water I had to shrink the depth of the Basin to get the same storage volume I had to make the area bigger I was trying to keep the area under the building between the columns and not encroach on the community garden area which would would have been easy to do what we were on that so what we did is we simply took this sanitary sore pushed it out here that was the storm water basin that we originally had the new one simply extends a little farther Westerly a little farther easterly and it's a t-shaped it goes into these two bays between the columns that I'm outlining here by doing that I was able to get a larger surface area if you will so I was able to shrink the depth and and accommodate Sam's uh request for more space between the bottom of that Bas and and the uh and the seasonal high water table you should also know that the seasonal high water table doesn't raise very often above that because that is what it is it's the high it's not the normal having said that also this you're going to say that you should say it was also directly at the base of your Basin no it was half a foot almost it was like maybe two10 so let's right but I what I want to say is that regardless of the city storm water orance this the state now requires that I use something like 11.9 in for the future 100-year storm and we also have that in the same separation so it's never going to be a problem um as to the inundation the potential inundation that's eliminated by this design I don't believe it was ever an issue but there's no point in beating that to death at this point so just to to make it easy for you this is a section through long ways and Crossways that Basin which looks like this in plan and what we simply did was shrink this and extend the depth of the infiltration trans and the reason we have that samon made a comment why don't you consider wrapping it in like a landfill fabric so we're here at the shore and so you got two problems you go we got to deal with storm water management but you got salt water intrusion and part of the reason you have that is because the amount of impervious cover water is not getting into the ground down here so I didn't want to eliminate the in infiltration trench because in my professional opinion I think it's just as important to get water into the ground here so you don't have saltwater intrusion or you at least try to you know do what you can the rest of it uh is really just I'd like to address the planners and Engineers issue as expeditiously as I can because we really have no problems with it at all with them at all one of the things Sam had asked for and I believe it was submitted but to be sure we'll get sign sale copies in uh to the board secretary as soon as we can are you ref letter I'm referring to his letter of I had got quite there got there yet April 29th revised August 21st okay and his comment I believe it was the first comment uh the checklist is asking for a survey of utilities and structures and Etc within 200 ft and I thought we had submitted that we certainly have it I have it up here uh as an exhibit I sent to maruo just so she'd have a further record but we'll formalize it tomorrow uh the survey was done if it's not in the file we'll make sure you get sign seal copies in the file with regard to statement do you want me to go through every statement can I the ones that uh that concern about yeah really storm water um we talked about that I just wanted to double back the underground utilities the services are going to be underground yeah we I yeah we can try to get the jcpnl they have to be under yeah well and yeah so they don't have a choice and they know that I just didn't want to speak for them for sure okay I I just so the board knows uh tou on this there is a a pre-treatment that goes into an aspect we have it so they do have I just want to say also like could granted wa they don't need it just being the height of their building there's no trees around I just wanted to say that it wasn't quite necessary that was in my letter as well um as as long as the notes get put on the plan uh as far as storm water uh we're okay right so um there was a question about site triangle because I have a tree planted uh at the corner of uh of Atkins and and Adams Adams is one way west my tree is at the southeast corner of the site or near the southeast corner of the site if someone is heading south on Atkins and needs to look at oncoming traffic he's looking to the East and and let me get this yes he's looking to the East and he's looking to the South and the tree is not in a line of site that would affect anything uh item item 12 was looking for a planning spec and we have that and I'll try to add address one of Don's concerned at the same time I have a planning preparation spec for the street trees on the planting plant Donna said that I didn't address it she cited I think it's 30-56 12 there is none it's 30- 57 I not to be outdone on my plan I said it was 36- 57 having said that we'll get we're talking about the same thing and we have no problem putting the if you want we have to reference the correct spec but do we did we do we have that okay well planting here is what we have it's I'm telling you I have a mistake on one all right beneath the plant materials schedule are two notes and one of them I'm trying to refer to the ordinance spec that she wants that's fine and I have it called out wrong I'll change it from a 36 to a 30 and we'll be set but so we have the what are the plantings so we have what two two trees uh well we have so to be to be correct we originally showed 10 trees then we had a technical review meeting with Donna and Sam and the suggestion was made why don't you make the trees linear along the streets and provide and easement for them which we did it that caused me to reduce the trees and in the storm waterer was a killer and I just both times I just missed a note that I'm calling out 10 trees in a table we only have uh eight on the site uh we need to provide two either by direct contribution or monetary contribution as required under the ordinance and allowed okay unless you want to see more this was the plan that we sort of talked about if our professionals are are happy with what your discussions were then I don't know if our our board uh so so Donna's report you said this requires a design exception for Street trees what is the exception just the exception is that we don't we don't have what the ordinance requires as a minimum and enough or is it I mean it seems like here it's specifically on Avenue A there's none but it it's so tight I mean yeah no room to put them so I have an overall view if you want if you want to see it of the entire neighborhood from Google uh there aren't many Street trees so we're not any Street trees we provide are in character with what's there by virtue of the fact we're providing more than are generally in a neighborhood well but just can can we just go one more time sorry one more time why is why are the street trees an exception because they not proposing the number required by the ordinance and it is 57 I was wrong okay right supposed to have 10 in the provid is that what the is that what the deal is exactly where the number is I I have six I'm sorry one two I have six on the plan so we need we need to make amends for four which the ordinance permits a contribution of money to the street refund which applicant would do so or again you know the C1 criteria basically your design exception criteria there's not enough room there's not enough room right if there isn't enough room but that's I will leave that to to you guys to to kind of work that out if there is enough room it has to go there has to be the contribution to the fund but if there is enough room I think that it would be nice for the neighbor neighborhood to have more trees we're okay with that the issue is that the only place you can really put a Madam chair is on Long Atkins uh and the short area of uh of Adams uh they'd be much closer than 30 ft I personally don't have any problem but they tend to struggle a little bit if they're too close especially in a city environment because they don't get as much much water and you know you want to want to have the uh the community garden along the Atkins uh area also so if I if I I can I can pop three more trees on there with no problem refer to the environmental shet tree commission for their preferences the number of trees and maybe smaller trees you can we have no PR if if you're planting a garden long a i you have that's the East exposure but you're getting you're getting the light from the East you don't want those trees because those trees will shade the garden which is self-defeating so those three trees on Atkins uh I suspect you don't want to put them there if you're going if you're going to or or we go with a small tree instead of a large shade tree if you take a look out here this community garden right outside the the wall here you'll see that you don't want to put those trees you'll impede the growth in the garden even small trees you'll see here on the uh on the front on the North edge of this you have a couple of fruit trees and they cast a lot of Shadow and behind that the the growth in those beds are much more than they are further to the South we're meable to work this out I chose European horn beams for these four trees along Adams and Atkins because they're very narrow very Calmar but we can work it out uh certainly don't want to do anything to hurt the garden once it's there that's self defeated I would I would suggest that those trees be eliminated to equ well that's really I think that that might be you want to go to the environmental shade tree let them do it out I'll I'll pass out I'm on I'm on the sh Tre commission oh there you go see yeah so maybe you know have a meeting with the folks who operate community garden and see if there's a spacing or you're perfect for it I also built a bed so there you go he's perfect for it but as far as like the design exception for not having enough trees that's it seems you know and what the plan you proposed it looks like there's a right number of trees on Atkins and spring wed and maybe the ones in Atkins will go away I mean we just can't get trees on Avenue A and so it's you do so so it is what it is the question I did have was on Springwood um Sam's report said something about the sidewalk end up being okay so you you can't have less than 5T of sidewalk in order to put the two trees on Springwood that we show and the proper planting bed we reduce that to something like 4 10 in instead of five which is for people walking it doesn't make a for a tree looking to get order in that environment I think in my opinion the uh pointer went to the trees it is di Minimus so it went to 4 feet eight is very di Minimus but it is under the five so we want okay okay a number of the next comments are either statements or compliance is there so it's not anything that we need to worry about uh number 18 Sam one had three notes added to the plan I didn't see the third one was on the top of another so I got two I'll add the third that was my mistake uh 19 20 21 again we will provide or 19 and 20 will'll provide anything by way of easements or operation and maintenance manuals if it's approved there's no point putting that in formality at this point it's not approved yet applicant I believe has provided the parking agreement uh for the the extra parking remember we talked about shortage of spaces there's 20 on the site I believe there's 43 required so there's a net shortage with all the credits there's a net shortage of 23 stalls they would be obtained via an access or parking agreement with an Mount pisca Church which is nearby cross Springwood Avenue a block to the uh I got to get this right block to the East and uh um it's within the whole parking areas within 400 ft of the front entrance which complies with the ordinance all right well so well that that has to be part of the resolution comp C that we see that agreement yes it would be a condition subsequent right it's a condition that we'll have uh is someone going to actually walk us through the parking or was that it the offsite parking no the the yes the offsite parking because we said that you know we gained a couple of spaces because of the uh the uh what do you call that we don't need as much driveway that we have EV and then your might your subtracting things so who's going to walk through that well the net short okay well I believe it's in Donna's letter pretty well okay let's go to I may I'm looking at uh page six of 21 okay of the most recent letter which was revised through August 29th and on page six uh off street parking is down the bottom item 42 and Donna outlines what's needed and tabulates it on the top of page seven uh and notes that with the 20 49 or totally required uh 20 are provided on site 29 is a deficiency however there's a uh a shared parking agreement and I believe some credits for uh EV type Chargers within we have five EV double Chargers within the parking area they're mounted to the columns and they can serve a car on they'll serve two cars Sim simultaneously Chargers yes they're dual Chargers so technically 10 yeah technically 10 EV charging stations within the parking area right so that leaves a net deficit of 23 okay so just one just for clarity are these Make Ready Eevee or are these real you're you're in day one and you're plugging it in I can't tell you that I just I just drew the I need to have one we need we need to plug them in day one then the credits then I feel better about the credits as opposed to make ready yeah no the E charging stations will be in day one but but the the net need offside 23 does not take into account the St it's just it's just the the credit for the residential unit sharing with the daytime us there's two things you get the credit for the sharing but the EV charging credit is based on how many spaces are provided or required I don't think that the EV credits to the extent that they're not needed and they're not included in the net need offsite if we were included the net need off site would be reduced by F understood you could we have amend your agreement so you don't need too many spaces but if you want to have those spaces that's fine it's no change yes for the record just so was clear that was Mr mcky speaking so so we're all all right we're good with the parking we need the agement we just need the letter right and I don't know how that letter works but it's kind of like add infinitum so it's like this letter is forever spaces that there are that many spaces forever CU it's not like what is it like you can't do like five years you can't do like 10 years be Perpetual has to be project exists for as long as the project for as long as that building exists right of the building is 40 years and what we've negotiated is a 40e okay lease agreement okay is that what we have to do in this situation oh I'll add something in that at the end of 40 years the building's still being used you got to still provide those spaces I don't think I'm going to have a problem with that CU I'm not going to be I can't call you on it I won't have a problem either all right so we need to have something in resolution compliance about that John knows what joh knows all right so we need some sort of a letter and resolution compliance that yeah there'll be a lease agreement that John will submit to me I'll review it and it'll be a condition of approval okay both professionals uh engineer and common 46 planner and 4.1 are looking for a lot consolidation recommending it we have no problem with it if it's approved if it's not approved there's no point doing that moving on to the planner uh we talked about mutcd signage uh for 42b uh parking setback 43 oh I'm sorry uh deficit where would we put a d we can handle signage to advise potential that there's parking off site we need that I think that should be worked out whether it's going to be building signage of an architectural nature or mucd signage which would be near the entrance driveway on uh on Avenue A would be a logical place right right right I have no preference is that something we need resolution compliance or to put it as long as you're happy with itally okay okay 4.3 G says there is a possible setback requirement for parking it's not they're 5.83 ft in the latest plan that's where they'll be so they're not parking along Avenue a is five is set back 5 ft as it's parking along Adams okay uh at least uh we looked at 4.38 has to do with loading areas and we've had them on the site we removed them to save the backing out and the driveway cuts and the dumpsters in the front yard and the whole thing uh and now we are simply reely this does not have an intensive loading drop off type use so we can rely on we feel we can rely on available curb space and not have to provide a dedicated loading area and a loading driveway Etc so if that's a waiver then we're looking for it for that reason oh as I said earlier 4.3 I we said we'd uh provide a crosswalk within the area under the parking area under the building uh 5.1a talks about streetscape and possibly benches and things like that we have no problem but there's no area between those RightWay lines on uh on Adams and on Atkins Avenue between the RightWay lines and the edge of the sidewalk there's no place now we did in compliance with some of the recommendations if the board wants it we have it as Street tree easement along both of those within which the street trees are are shown the easement is also shown as old dotted line we could put benches in there and change the nature of these men it's a question whether you want benches or not do we think that we might want them by the garden I mean that can be again worked out not you know not on the side yeah somewhere some there might be maybe instead of the trees by the by the garden we put we put benches sure when we work that out to get you guys whatever applicant has no problem with any of it yep is the garden fenced no right okay um Springwood Avenue I don't know if you want benches or not but again that can be part of whatever we agree I wouldn't think you'd want bicycle racks for the reason that the only way that you're going to be able to get them on there is the bicycles are going to be in approaching all over the sidewalk you're not going to be able to move I me we have we have 36 the ones particularly behind the uh the Turf Club building are actually very visible to the street and easily accessible and probably won't be totally utilized by occupants of the building at any given time so doesn't seem like there's no any reason they couldn't use them all right I'd like to I like to just announce now we have we you have 10 more minutes I'm going before our next application begins at 9:00 I'm going as fast as I can I'm just saying that that's going to it's okay you don't have to go fast it's all you're coming back it's okay okay 62 uh this one we we didn't like this one uh comment by the planter recommended that the planting along the southernly wall where we have the Refuge storage any uh ESS from the second stairway uh be planted similar to Springwood which is very very low not higher than 15 18 in I look at the so I'm showing you clips from the architect's elevations the Springwood the atoms the lower one being the atoms it's a three-story building with absolutely nothing of Interest back there and and we we really thought that something a little larger now what I've shown you there we we called out two kind of trees we called out a very tight ta Juniper which get to about 15 16t and no wider than 3 and 1 half 4 feet at the most within a 5 foot area and we called out uh skip laurel and I've shown you some I've had at Mammoth University for approaching 20 years none of them has gotten wider than 5T although admittedly the ones at bth are truned they're pruned however when I look at this I can show you another exhibit that comes from Missouri Botanical Garden that documents the maximum width of these why don't we just remove the uh skip laurel and put the these taor junipers all the way across because they they have some size to them so they'll break up that wall vertically a little bit that's what I would offer then you don't then you don't have to worry about maintenance or safety no so it's do you want it to just look like that um we're screening a wall or is it an entrance you want it to be complimentary foundation planting or do you want to just screen the wall it's you know subjective what do you guys well look why don't we look at this why don't we do something that gives you a little more vertical and a little variation so it's not like screen walls but not as short as as the Springwood Avenue mean the Springwood Avenue entrance you know the architect is not is not trying to give you exactly what it look like but they're all 15 18 in maximum plants so I can go 3 or 4 ft one or two sixes I can make it a little more interesting I just didn't want didn't think it was appropriate to screen that big 3story wall with 18inch plants as this doesn't have the glass facade what what is what is our our planter I would I would suspect that that solution would be better uh if you put uh nothing but trees that are going to grow 15 feet it it gets pretty monotonous pretty quickly so if you could vary that a bit and uh at the uh at the at the actual uh entrance to the stairway you have a lower planting you can ban that out lower to a higher uh well see I don't have any real room to do this kind of I can't do it I understand that what I'm saying is if you your low plantings and I'm saying low maybe two three feet four feet near the uh entrance to the stairway and then you uh move the in the middle the two panels I mean if you want to screen you deat the purpose of differentiating the color of the bottom of the building it all right I'm going to suggest that that you guys discuss because we're coming back so um if we're coming back we we brought a lighting expert tonight could I just call him it be very ABS you have literally you have five minutes but we still have not questioned right witness we don't have we don't have that time I'm sorry you know I I understand my since you want Mr fitzerald to come back well we we also have a that has to question to question him and we have literally 5 minutes because this other application is going on at 9 and we need a moment to set up so literally yeah five minutes not lighting we have to finish with Mr Fitzgerald or not he can come back yeah I'll come back because we're not we're not done okay all right um can I just ask does the board more agree with Mr suggestion about kind of modifying that back Landscaping to be complement the doorway a little bit more the rest is okay okay okay so we're coming back with Mr Fitzgerald and lighting and is there anything else that we're I was going to ask since Mr brel is coming back anyway the public can question him next time could I just they can come cuz we don't have the time at this point we have to lighting will be very we have to end I'm sorry I'm sorry all right I'm sorry it's not fair to the other application I hear you I'm sorry well can we carry this on the record at least oh yes absolutely what the other thing we needed was a staging plan all right we need a staging plan also that usually is done between James and the post okay post approval lot they provided here too but if we're coming back we're coming back staging plan I have it in here as a condition but yeah you need a staging plan to work out with James construction station all right all right so what's our date that's available so is that October are we talking Donna revisions are all right actually that's true are there revisions that have to be made to your letters no yes yes okay so if there are divisions that have to be made then we have to give Mr vakin enough time so the next meeting is not good enough it has to be the following do we have time do I could I can with the review I've already done I can get a letter to you by the next meeting if that's where you well it has to be with enough time for the planning board to look at it so if we want to do it our next available at this point is October 28th no but but um Mr vachan was saying that he could get it done early enough so he doesn't need the full span of time just can't drop the so we could do it the next meeting I don't think we have to do September 23rd yes anything there and Donna you won't need anything's okay upda the letter my letter Bas on what they so far so far yeah okay so this Let's do let's do it on the 23rd 23rd if Mr is comfortable with the timeline of the report okay hang on 23rd of September y as Monday night over is not available but Allison is okay all I like get a motion to carry this application to September 23rd without further notice [Music] second sorry motion was by Daniel second mik okay um James Bano yes Jim Henry yes Daniel shano yes Vice chair goonan yes chairwoman KAC yes okay thank you very much appreciate your time thank you thank you for making those changes they were very helpful okay we we have a five minute recess okay so we're going to start up actually we're going to start up at 9: okay so everybody ready get gy up um I will now take roll call James Bano here councilwoman Clayton here Eric alipo is absent Jim Henry here Jerry Hoffman Jeremy Hoffman absent mayor Moore absent Daniel shano Jen saer Vice chair goonan here chairwoman Barbara C here all right okay mad chair when I review the notices for this application that are iner form we have jurisdiction proceed okay um just so that we're clear for everyone here and the public that 10:00 is our deadline we we tend to leave a 10 so have at it understood we appreciate you taking us on this evening for the record my name is Jennifer Phillips Smith I'm an attorney with gibons PC and I'm here tonight on behalf of APW redeveloper and asber partners as co- applicants we are here this evening for a proposed project for Block 4306 Lot 1 through 8 it's proposed to be 45 Town Homes uh currently the lot is vacant we're seeking preliminary and final major site plan approval minor subdivision and certain design exceptions from the Waterfront Redevelopment plan we're going to try and be as efficient as possible this evening we will overall have four Witnesses uh we'll start with architecture then we'll move to landscape architecture then engineering then end with our planner as I said we'll get through as much as we can this evening this has been a long road for this project we applied to the TRC in August of 2023 and appeared before the TRC almost a year ago today on September 12th of 2023 uh taking into account the trc's comments we significantly revised the plans particularly the exterior elevations and worked with the city's professionals to present those plans to the city council and then continued to refine them until finally it was approved by the city council in June of this year uh we are here with those plans this evening there are some questions that came up in the review letters about whether we did comply with the TRC comments and whether we complied with the subsequent developer agreement I will say that we have testimony this evening that we believe we have and we'll explain why and while there may be some discrepancies between the plans we can explain what the intent was and how we believe we have complied with the intent uh so without anything further I'd like to start with our architecture testimony okay sir please swear firm testimony about giv this matter the truth truth and nothing but the truth yes I do you state your for spell first name Adrian a d r i a n last name media m e l i a Mr milia if you could for the board uh discuss your education experience and lure certainly um so I'm a partner at mvmk architecture we based in Hoboken uh I graduated from Trinity College Dublin uh Ireland in 2002 uh I've been licensed in New Jersey since 2011 and I've appeared in front of of numerous planning and zoning boards throughout the state I was also um presented for the TRC for this project in Ur I'd like to um introduce Mr milia as an expert in the field of Architecture is are all your licenses up to date yes they at they current okay in New Jersey yes okay while we're doing that why don't we get our staff morning in case there's any colloquy going back and forth to your right hand solidly swear or affirm the testimony of giv this matter be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do I do please State your names for the record and your affiliation with the board Samuel lakian board engineer thank you was yours wonderful so just one housekeeping matter we're going to be talking about this map up on the screen briefly we did submit this more than 10 days prior and I guess we should probably mark it yes whatever you're going to testify from I needed perect exhibit this is a three-page PDF the map is the first page the photo exhibits which we'll get to you later the second and third page will Mark the packet together as a11 got that Mar okay excellent can you please Orient the board to the site in question certainly so um block 4306 is bounded by um four streets Kingsley Kingsley web uh 7th and E Avenues and our site takes up the entire block um it's currently V vacant as was previously he stated and um I'll just describe the surrounding conditions so you get a sense of what the context is um directly to the north we have a five-story multif family and slightly further north we have another uh sstory multif family building um slightly to the West there's another two-story development of of Condominiums working our way around to the Northeast we've got the Asbury Tower which is a 27 story highrise and then directly across Kingsley we have a water treatment plant um parking and the remainder of the lot is vacant then as we move further south we have the NorthShore which is an eight-story condominium development and directly to the South um across 7th Avenue and we've got some three-story multif family structures and right here it looks like a vacant lot in this area but you'll see we do actually have um a photo of what is there currently which is a newly constructed five-story building just going back to the map everything to the west of web street is uh one in two family um predominantly one and two family three-story structures so you can see there's a a variety of different scales around the site one one thing before before you continue can you just go back please sure on the um on the site that is on the North side uh that is vacant right now there is something going up there do we recall what it is I I can speak briefly to that so we have applied to the TRC and we'll be appearing for the city council this week okay so it's not it's okay so do we know how high that's we actually it doesn't really matter that is a site that's going to be developed so that has to come into play when this part of your presentation I at least for me okay I like to see what's all around to make sure that you know how's everybody being impacted M so we'll keep that in mind so that that building will be a condominium style building not a town home style building actually it's two buildings cuz on that particular lot one in that's the one that okay I got you I was going to say you were yes I remember I remember now there too many of them okay I I remember them okay thank you all right so as was stated the site's vacant it's currently mostly grass there's a a small area where there is a paved surface and it's accessed off web where cars park at some point excellent and then here's just some photos we can have Mr Barry go through them in Greater detail uh kind of at the end but if you'd like to start describing what our proposal is for the 45 Town Homes sure so I'm going to refer to the architectural submission which dated August 5th 2024 do you want us to mark that entire package that is A2 yes okay so this is the submitted architectural plans so the first Sheet's just the list of drawings what was the date again on that AG it's August 5th thank you 2024 so the second sheet um it's a side plan it gives an overall view of what we're planning to do here it's 45 town homes there will be 114 spaces provided where only 68 are required um each of these garages will have an EV capability and uh one more note to make that's important is that all of the on street parking there's 45 spaces currently that number will not change it will stay 45 so you can see here that the 45 um town homes are divided into six buildings um what is permitted is between four and eight stories across the entire site with the exception of web which is only permitted to be three stories and so we're proposing three stories on web to to satisfy that and four stories everywhere else just so I got that correctly parts of this slot could be developed up to eight stories correct correct but we are not going above four correct no we're staying at four well do so it does say so you mean there's three stories that are I guess parallel the we correct but the ones that go sth Avenue that 8th Avenue that do go to that also front on WE yes the massing in the Redevelopment plan shows that the the the ones that are front onto 7th and eth can be four stories but ones that front onto web can only be three stories so that's allowed or is that a way this is permitted the development control plan shows the corners at higher elevations and then the middle of the block is three stories so with the exception of this five unit um cluster all of the the town houses um there's two types there's one the the one at the ends and then the ones in the center the one at the ends are slightly larger they're about 2400 ft each and then the ones in the center of each cluster are around 2,000 square ft um just to talk a little bit about the evolution of this project it was mentioned earlier that we were here a year ago and we've gone to Great Lengths to evolve the most um prominent of the elevations and those are the ones that um are on the intersections of Kingsley and 7 and eth Avenue you can see this rendering here it's Kingsley in eth and what was of most concern to the TRC was the treatment of how the the side of the town home um because it's very prominent from the corner view so we went through a multitude of design iterations and finally arrived at this one um which is what the city council finally approved um this is obviously taken into account not just the TRC the council but also City Planning staff and Consultants comments as well um one other note to make um just a general note is that the overall architectural static here um it advances the design principles set for it in section 2.2 which is the Redevelopment objectives of the Asbury Park Waterfront Redevelopment plan by developing new residential buildings that extend Asbury Park's Oceanside character in a contemporary way so that box is checked by doing this um the proposed shingle style lap Style on board and Baton cladding references are you may have heard a traditional Shore aesthetic um but in this context we've um presented a curbside appearance that is emblematic of a newer Coastal architecture um by providing clean lines and larger Windows cuz what we're trying to get that open and Airy feel into the architecture you can see from the color palette um the color variation that by varying the shade colors as well as the heights of these Bays all along Kingsley and uh 7th and eth Avenue um that the prop proposed facade design becomes Dynamic um and also gains dimensionality well entailing a balanced overall composition so it's busy enough to break up the scale to a human scale but uh not overly so M I don't mean to tr because I know you're going through your Spiel but on the end Corner Lots they're all have front porches is that correct correct the end ones have so just want to throw so the grading plans I know we're getting to the engine are that doesn't drive the there's a discrepancy there so if we could just add it that's what's going to happen we just want to see yes it we will as we go along we know there about there at least four discrepancies and we are going to tell you which one where the architecture was right verus take your time no it's okay on this one though the architecture plans are correct the Stoops belong there and the Civil plans will be just updated to show the stop so the materials being proposed um they're all durable requiring no maintenance especially in like a coastal climate we're proposing Hardy panel uh shingle siding LP siding and board and Boton sighting um we're also proposing metal railings that the style been has been selected based on the s's architectural environment Dental context so all building frontages will have substantial Landscaping um acting as a buffer and that will be native planting and Street trees um landscape architect can talk more to that um the relationship to the street so going back to the site plan You' see that each of the clusters of town homes um is oriented directly to their respective streets and uh the improvements in the right away and the the setback and and buffer Stoops and frontages um are going to improve the walkable urbanism of the area um especially with front doors in from each of these Town Homes oriented toward the street um again I I'd mentioned the the main concern at the TRC was addressing the corners um specifically the treatments of the side um and how prominent those facades are and what we did was we added these um pergola features to the top um just to kind of accentuate the corner presence along Kingsley U we also added more windows a lot of these windows weren't necessary but to avoid gaps blank facades um they were put onto the elevations um as far as color pette goes we went to Great Lengths to change this there was a lot of gray and darker blues and Grays um we replace those and increased the prevalence of white and beige siding um so the end result was a much brighter palette that I think is better suited to this coastal location so these are blues and it appears green we replaced Blues with with greens Y and and are we on the setback on the it varies cuz the buildings are staggered but they're approximately between five and 10 feet I believe in in addressing the trc's comments the the Center building was reoriented correct yeah so again on the site plan this Center cluster it was facing the opposite direction so this is where the front doors are and there's a passage which I'll have a rendering to show between the two buildings fronting on to Kingsley so it was reoriented so that from Kingsley you could see the front of those buildings and not the rear and I know that there were comments that came up in uh CC's reports concerning the retaining walls the crosswalks walkways and lighting we're going to have Mr Le and Mr Curley address those specific because they relate more to the site plan than the architecture but I don't want you to think we forgot but one of the just just for clarity there that where we see that the person in the bicycle I'm assuming that that does not exist the parking like that does not exist here that's the propos parking sorry that's the proposed parking 7 oh I don't don't see protected bik no no no no I'm talking about where that bicycle person is there it looks like there's parallel parking there those those are angle spaces for what cuz I don't see that on here on the on so on 8th Avenue as part and so stre we have a we have a civil site plan that's more just to orient you to where the buildings are the civil engineer has a full set of site plans that go into proper on that okay all right well we'll talk later I guess go ahead yeah so beyond this next uh slide there's a couple of different renderings just so that um you understand that what every building fronting onto the streets looks like this is a d a dusk shot of that same view on the last slide um again we added lights to further accentuate this facade so you can see that in the day going to be on the lighting yes so I know a lot of up up and down lighting how shown here yes they're they're shown as up and down lighting here as always we're going to need a lighting plan to find out what the spillages and all that kind of thing Mr there are residents that live around here Mr Curley has a lighting plan continue so this next one this is um Kingsley Street um so th this uh particular slide shows you the the gap between the two buildings to front onto kingy Street and you can see here they'll be screened better than is shown in this ring but just for the purpose of showing you where the meters are um they're mounted to the side on the inter interior side of the building so they're not on the outsides where they would be seen from the streets and I will just say we realized today that the rendering show a midblock crosswalk that is not part of the site plan so that midblock crosswalk is not there I'm sorry go back to that sort of C because did you say the gray is what the parking the garage the back of the house that's the back this here is the backley so so this is the front these are where the Stoops and the front doors are facing Kingsley the gray is the driveways the gray is the driveway the dark gray is the driveways right so the the second row behind the ones that front on so the back of the house will be visible from King the bike vo that's the front of the house that's the front that's the front no the ones in the so the second row the ones that are parallel to King the second row this gray is the driveway right that's the back of the house yes correct so from Kingsley so for since page 18 thatal somebody standing there can see that's web that's web sorry the web uh yeah I said web they could see it's not not the front of the house instead of facing right that one is facing that's the front this is the front of the house that's the back that's the back that's the back that's the back that's the back right here I'm saying the two back I understand that that's so from here you see the back of the house not the front of what you can see it I'll give you that okay going to continue through the elevations just moving through some of the other renderings so with the dusk shot this is a front on view again it's more clear than the rendering to get a sense of the building articulation with the Stager Bays another dust shot and this is the Eighth Avenue facade so again it's virtually the same the ones fronting on to Kingsley and all the stairs are theing house that's correct on to sheet 11 and I won't dwell too long on this but these are the the floor plans um so the the all of the four story town homes have rooftop balconies uh it's on the next slide see here there's a large balcony in the back and one in the front they're all four bedroom units all of the end units have two car garages with two parking spaces in the driveway and all of the Interior units have only one car in the garage on space for one car [Applause] outside um can I um I I seem to be missing I don't I don't know if we have it but these depictions on web what does a web look like it the I don't think I see that here unless I'm missing that wa what page would that be on it is page right here oh it's further it's further this is web I thought that it would be with all the rest okay we can wait I don't I don't need to move ahead I just thought we were missing it correct so for the ones on the end that have a two-car garage you can park two cars right outside for all of the other exactly so a total of four for the end units and a total of two one inside and one outside for the interior units okay you on the floor plans so that's just a quick depiction of the roof plan see we've got a a air conditioning unit on top here but it is screened by the powerp put wall you can see that in the renderings that we've elevated that power to hide that air conditioning unit moving on so the sheets 15 and 16 are colored elevations of the four-story town homes and on sheet 16 we do have the materials listed we also have physical samples anybody needs to see them this is the the light type we've got the building signage it's going to be outside the doors and we've got all the materials listed with their colors um just a note um one of the comments was that on on the the concrete wall at the base we were going to use a a Parx finish and that's not stoko it's a an acrylic coating with a texture to it so there's no stoko proposed on the project and all that will be hidden by vegetation of some sort for the most part yes so here's the rendering of web Street and this is the three-story um um cluster of Five Town Homes again everything else is four Stories the building in the middle is four stories but web is three right can um do we have anything that shows I see what you're showing the middle is there something that shows me the corners of web I just like to see where that is no okay so because because we want to see what people that live on web not web but what is that web what are they what are they going to see that's what that's I'm guessing that many people want to see that so one of the yes one of the earlier uh renderings this one on 8th Avenue yes that gives you an indication of what's on the corner that's so when this turns around it will drop down to we want to see from the side I understand okay so when you come back yeah if we could see all of web that would be great just going back to the other the elevations you were on though towards the end where were you left off I'm sorry so the end of that building which building is that so so this is the rear elevation of the Web building okay but you're standing in the middle of the development so I understand you want to see the corner from web on seventh and eight you want to see it from the perspective of the west side of web looking across the street that's right that's what we want to see we want to see the whole thing you want to see the whole picture yeah but we we have shown all of seventh a e AV and Kingsley understood It's just sometimes it's perspective that I get it I mean [Music] that's it not look like what you have on page it's similar without the pergola this is what that corner looks like and then you're stepping down and this would be where the three building is we do have a rendering for that so so this this here is the side uh directly right behind here it looks like a mirror of this so you're going to see this and then you're going to see a step down and then you're going to see the three-story building on web right when you come back easily done with when you come back you'll bring it it's okay I'm just going to the three-story buildings uh there was a question about whether they have rooftop decks the the three-story building single building has never been proposed with a with a rooftop balcony right never right so um in the subsequent developer agreement under building program it does say with the exception of the single three-story townhouse building comprised of five town homes and then it goes on to describe the rest of the town homes so while there's references to the roof rooftop balconies the three-story building was never proposed to the TRC or the council with a rooftop balcony okay there's an exception within the plan for that that you just quoted this is from the subsequent developer agreement from that subsequent developers itar three St three story from having under building program where it was described in exhibit it says with the exception of a single three-story town home townhouse building comprised of five tow houses located along the center line of the city block adjacent to web Street the remaining 40 Town town homes are all proposed to be four stories in H with rooftop balconies and then there are two paragraphs after that that describe I wanted to get it in proper context that's all yeah no it's just two paragraphs or a paragraph after that yeah the next two paragraphs though describe the parameters for the continue to describe the four-story town homes they're not describing the three-story town home so for example it goes on to say it's 2400 ft with some with two car garages and continues to go down so that that whole section is describing what the four story Town Homes look like and they all have rooftop decks the three-story building was never never proposed or presented to the TRC or the council with a three-story with a rooftop deck okay two quick things with regard to operations just bicycle parking came up and how it would be accommodated in the garages and there's a multitude of ways to accommodate bikes here um I do have an exhibit if you need to see it where they can be mounted to the wall and they can swivel out of the way or they can be mounted to the roof but there's countless products on the market now for um garages especially ones that don't have a lot of ceiling height to took bikes away to the side so and will they be incorporated in these garages or it's going to be up to the unit to purchase them um we could certainly incorporate wall hooks I don't was it my comment I don't know if both of us had it I put a comment in the garage uh about bicycle parking I believe that that's what we're talking about I was just that if you look at the any of the renderings for the garages it's just tight uh when you have your your garbage cans your you know your cycling so I brought up the comment of saying hey could there be some more space provided or an area for bicycle Park the architect is claiming that there and and there is I 100% agree uh apparatus is out there to put your bicycles on and then it's just whether it's going to be incorporated in these units and that's for the the two car garage units for the one car garage unit there's more space is that correct yeah there there's a a Nook and we um we show it the we show the the 95 gon container in in both ponds but here it is but there's ample room to put one of those wall Meed bikes vertically up above the trash can there's countless ways to accommodate bike parking in these garages so the one car garage has an extra Nook the two-car garage is already a two-car garage but bicycles can be accommodated on host yes all right um mailboxes was another comment believe that s that is on the Civil plans um let's run through then the design exceptions quickly so to do this I think the most efficient way is actually to refer to the report we received from CCH dated September 6th so I think the board will probably be able to follow along a little easier if we go to section 3.6 B which is on page nine so let's run through each of the design exceptions and these are exceptions requested from the Waterfront Redevelopment plan that they're not variances they're architectural design exceptions so if you could start with a B1 for building articulation let's go ahead and Mark this so this is a design ex 96 but we're going to Mark another exhibit here so we'll mark this as exhibit A3 can you tell us what this is so this it it was recommended that we show examples um from elsewhere in the Redevelopment plan that also received these design waivers so I just collated a bunch of images of different projects that have been constructed or under construction that have the exact same features or waivers that we're proposing here excellent all right continue then to describe the design waivers that are requested okay so there's a short list here um let's start with first one fixed windows so it's not that the windows don't operate it's that we're trying to do larger windows and when you're limited by how much of an opening you can have so if you take this example here you can see in either the Vive or the Cove that there's fixed windows underneath the operable windows so it's not that we have Windows that just don't open it's just that there's much larger windows that have Windows mold together and some of those window windows don't operate um we also have one or two windows at grade level in a garage that for security reasons they're fixed but we've plenty of operable Windows we're just not all of them are operable because it doesn't make sense to do so they're part of a a larger window unit let's before we get into that list I'd like to follow along in 3.6 the first one had to do with building articulation uh and there's a question about which page you referring to this is page nine of 16 of the CCH report okay sorry which report C I'm sorry C's report okay page N9 of 16 okay and it says b conflicts with architectural guidelines all right okay all right there you go building articulation so for building articulation there's a question about whether these buildings were designed with adequate articulation so articulation meaning you know playing with the the shape so that you don't have a blank wall somewhere and you can see from the rendering that we pushed and pulled the facade with bays and setbacks at the fourth floor um so there is an abundance of articulation here um actually with the design guidelines are talking about articulation it's a little like counterintuitive but the plan actually describes articulation as a relationship to the urban condition set not that it has set back offsets the building definitely has offsets and you know what we would conventionally think of as articulation right and plan calls for is that again gives prominence to visual access or um acknowledges a corner um has that relationship to the urban condition okay so with regard to that um the the six different buildings all of the ones that are on the street face the street the door faces the street um they're all oriented towards that street to Define give a sense of um like a a frontage um with regard to material um you know it's very eclectic around the area you can pick or choose which buildings that you're referencing but predominantly the ones to the west of Webb have these cladding materials so from a materiality standpoint um it fits in to the context um then there's also you know we have it's referencing here Mediterranean Revival style um quasi Victorian residences like it's there there's six or seven different styles in the area so um you know you kind of have to pick and choose which one you want to match so on building articulation been suggested we need a waiver we don't necessarily agree but to the extent the board believes we do we've described all the ways that we believe that the buildings meet the spirit of the Waterfront Redevelopment plan then continuing on to number two there's a question about the the ends of the townhouse buildings on the side elevations lack detail now those elevations were specifically revised to the council's satisfaction is that correct I believe so yes and over the course of the Year numerous side elevations were proposed until the council approved this one is that correct yep all right then going to number three building Parts um this is the void toolid ratio and we recognize that the calculations were not on the plans uh this is for both three and four but have you had a chance to look at the calculations for the void to solid ratio and ministration we do have it um we do comply in a nutshell the requirement is a maximum of 45% so we're below that number on each elevation and we can provide a drawing that shows up in more detail if needed great so we don't believe we need We believe We Meet the void to solid ratio and the fenestration requirements which are both mathematical calculations yes okay number five facade colors but but going to provide we'll provide the calculations all right the item five the facade colors we need a waiver here the requirement is that uh there be something in the yellow to Red quadrant for the buildings is that correct we clearly don't need it we need the waiver okay and you've described before how these colors are appropriate number six building elements and attachments um yard equipment I'll have Mr Curley point out more specifically where all of the individual utility meters are uh so we'll skip that one for this moment u i I'm sorry but I think that we skipped four three and four we indicated three and four were together we compli okay with those uh number seven can you describe the Decks that are proposed and that are proposed to be made out of wood sorry not out of I'm I'm sorry just item number six you were talking about that how was that resol we're going to have Mr Curley testify to that so he can show you on the site plans y okay thank you okay so the pro projecting decks they're they're meant to be limited to 3 ft of a projection and these are 6 ft and they will be framed out of wood but they'll be um clouded with a a vinyl surface on top and uh they'll have metal railings um so we just don't meet the the requirement for the the depth and the the fact that we um don't have a uh a bracket and also they're meant to be continuous and these ones are broken up so there's a couple of different um design waivers required for these well and then they're only supposed to be in rear yards but because of the orientation of the buildings Street they end up in yes thank you well the they all face towards the rear but on some angles you can see them from the side correct yes none are built toward on the front of the building for example correct so so from from the corner view you could see the back on the street the side angle of the deck yes okay T can you tell us what the rationale was for want requiring brackets and requiring a well the design guidelines for the plan or you know the vision was to sort of reinvent the classical architecture that was ever behind you which is actually depicted behind you um you know uh for example right behind Miss Clayton um see has little short balconies on the front of the building yeah um and it's sort of a Mediterranean Revival sort of style with the playay RO playay tiles things like that um the developers that have come in have you know decided they want Mo modern type cont type of architecture and and and you know this project and um the few before it with the similar design you know they're from one Builder so they kind of all the same thing we'll have our planner address that comment in particular because while there are certain projects done by one Builder there's actually multiple builders that are building in the water FR right now and building different projects our planner will address that comment um I just would like to touch on one other aspect of the CCH report and that's uh 4.11 there were a few plan discrepancies I'll just run through them very quickly 411 this is what I promised before that we'd indicate which one was correct so 4.11a this was the question about the porches that they're shown on the architectural plans but not on the Civil in this case the architectural is correct right there are porches there are porches on the ends I'm sorry I don't know where you are we don't have 4.11 page 14 oh 14 I'm behind oh 4.11 there you go one thank you so the porch areas are shown on the architectural plans the Civil plans will be updated to reflect of the porches uh for B the site plan indicates small additions to buildings that appear to be external sprinkler rooms those are accurately reflected on the Civil site plans correct yes and we'll have Mr Curley testify as to those C the site plan does not so I just want to understand because this came up also with this tolls project um where they had um problems with the elevations for those um spr rooms um in order to be accessible outside be accessible from the outside I will have Mr curly building they're building element but Mr curle can address the grading um but but they are accessible to the outside but only accessible from the outside not from the unit unit correct correct they're shown on the and then um so it's our recommendation that they be represented in the elevation drawing so that we can make sure we're not having complexed windows whatever faced on where they end up with the great and I'll have Mr Curley specifically show where those are but as a that can be updated kind of in resolution compliance making sure that they line up correctly from the elevation stpoint um C the site plan does not indicate extensive steps leading to the stoop at the front of each unit instead depicting a ramp in this case the architecture is correct they are steps correct yes they're steps okay is related to Common a have those porches and how those again steps lead up to the porches or they don't just so the architecture there is is correct uh and then we've already addressed the number 4.1 4.11 d uh concerning the rooftop decks in that that sentence and I agree with you that sentence is in the SDA but it's after the carve out so let me just also get some clarification on it so for the three story unit is it still um end units are 20 ft wide and then the interior units are like so all the all of this those two paragraphs are paragraphs I mean it seems to me it's exactly the same whether it's a three story or four story except for the overall height obviously do they have have four and a half baths four bedrooms or they have different uh interior elements like it's not a four story building bedrooms it uh it it does yes yep so think you want to put the Flor floor plans up sorry one second there you go so bedroom two oh so there's there's a a bedroom down here one two three sorry three bedrooms and so those Square footages are obviously smaller than the four story units overall so you have a description in the building program only of the four story units not any description three story oh but perhaps you can run through really quickly the three story program so this is called the so same with the other clusters the end ones are slightly wider so this one this the end one that's 20 ft wide is a four bedroom but the one on the inside so the three units on the inside of the cluster are a little bit um uh more narrow they're only 16 ft wide so those only have three bedrooms okay so those were all the questions I had for one more just SW one that might be for Mr curle but on the easterly ends of 8th and 7th we show a retaining wall we're going to have yeah we're going to have our landscape architect and Mr curly address all the retaining walls and what the treatment of the retaining walls will be and where they're located and the Heights and we'll be talking about all the setbacks of all the different of all the different units so that we understand that what's a setback on web what's a setback on on 7eventh on usle we'll see all that'll be presenting that I can have Mr curle talk about set yeah that's fine but we could next time that would be great um do you guys questions because I have a few things well anyone I just had one um You' mentioned there's GNA be screening of the utility meters is that going to be architectural or Landscaping Landscaping okay um anyone any other other questions from the planning board members of this witness okay go ahead Donna floor is yours okay so um the three story buildings so there's some I'm just I got to try and get my head around have the three story buildings are different from the four I'm sorry um okay so the end units are uh Che our garage basically the same footprint as the other two part garages um the interior units same fo print as 16 live um it's just uh reduc number of bedrooms okay um for the parot wall for the screening of the AC units or the meical equipment so um how how high is the it's uh approximately 4T it needs to be high enough to to screen that condenser and we're only planning on one unit for each building yes one one should be adequate for the square footage one for each building or one for each Town one for each unit okay and then um are they going to be just directly mounted to the to the roof or you going to do a platform for them to minimize vibration oress pels or things like that there's going to be like a Dage like a curb that they sit on with vibration isolation but it won't be like 18 in tall uh okay and then um I'm sorry I'm just reliving some of the recent um unintended consequences set shall we say of other recent development exactly um and those units are actually located sort of in the in the in line of the front wall of the building uh correct yeah it's the front of the Town Hall okay go back the for sure okay this is the front so that was even like the street side yeah and so we have the paret wall coming up about 4T and so it's the one condensing unit and it's going to be not higher than the power correct and effectively the same condition in the three story building it's just one story lower so it's in that space like on that n unit one to the left it's in that space over the window it's right here yeah over there so see to some exent and as happens things but they'll only be slightly above right because they're much taller right M that's me yeah we we can't screen from an eight-story building yeah no you're right but it's like but but I appreciate that that our board members are looking at our neighbors we want to be good neighbors so I appreciate develop too because like at as Co you know I don't know if they just um add additional condensing units on the roofs and some of them were because of the way they're arranged they're closer to the balconies of their neighbors yes they did so it's again something else as we start to see these things come online just like lighting effects that are inside the building things that are on the outside of the building we're trying to you know make sure we're not to have struggles down yep um okay I think that's it all right for the architecture for now could you go to page five sure so on this end unit here what are these gas meters yeah Gas and Electric for like all the units SO gas electric and this is the water sprinkler room it'll be a question for Mr Curley but that was brought up too functionality of Maintenance yeah there's no Landing uh 3 to one slope in my opinion is too steep uh if you're going to have a maintenance Parker Jason pnl or there J anyone that's out there servicing um somehow there should be some type of Landing for maintenance doesn't have to be like concrete it could be landscape you know somehow something should be incorporated there just for safety I'll Mr Curley address address the grading and Landscape grading in that location so did the utilities [Music] dictate I will have Mr Curley go through that because he's actually going to point out where all of the individual utilities are and I'll let him do that and that'll answer your question more thoroughly all right all right members of the public yep okay please all right so one thing that I would would want to mention to the public that there there is a lot that has not been shown yet so forgive me or if anyone else says that's coming so I know I know there's a lot going on so I'm just trying to manage our expectations here so go ahead we're opening it up to the public questions of only what was presented or question Ela Rosa 301 7th Avenue so the corner of sth and web so to re reiterate the requests for the design of that uh aspect I'd love to see that um just a question in terms of we're talking uh in stories how high is each story for the four and the three frankly because I have no concept of like I've looked at the plans and I see like the different numbers and again I'm not an architect so that's why I'm asking the question so we we have a dimension approximately from grade on these plans the three-story up to the peak of the roof is shown as 39 ft okay the cuz I'm lot nine if you're looking at your like I'm across right across the street on the corner of 7th and web so I'm just trying to get a yep the four story we have a dimension of 49 ft um again to to the peak of the roof from the first floor level which the it varies a little bit on how much higher than grade that is but you could add about 4T onto that number street level okay so is the street level like is it livable space or is part of that like what you consider the first story like below ground I'm just trying to get a sense livable space the well the dimensions are here they're they're approximately 10t floor to floor 10 Okay so it it shows like the ceiling height 9 F1 so it's 40 ft plus the height of the roof and then you got to add on a few feet for the base of the building as tou is great okay um I have other questions but I'll wait till we get to that part of the story thank you okay hi Katherine Healey 305 8th Avenue so other end of web um right now as aav um intersects with Kingsley it widens and it's hard to tell on those plans whether that WID is staying or if um we're we're this developer is taking part of the road there no we haven't gotten there yet okay but I will just say but go ahead no part of the road is being used for the design of the project okay the roads will be constructed sep separately by the master developer okay thank you um it was also hard to see in the plans how how vehicles are going to access the those town homes that are in the center more to come okay sounds good um and then the town homes that have a roof deck so it's four living floors and then the deck will be on top of the fourth floor no the the deck it's not a full fourth floor so on the fourth floor it's like half of a floor and then the decks are off of that access room okay so it's not a fifth floor okay all right thank you next um Karen May uh owner and HOA board member for 301 8th Avenue so just um on the north side of 301 um you said one of the questions earlier from the board that the setback is 5 to 10 feet depending on not being an architect um is that the same for all all four sides a second question is um is that from the curb when you guys say setback is that from the curb or from the sidewalk that that's that's also to come that's to come that's also to come we want those details to see okay question was answered before that's why I was bringing that one up um the 114 spaces so if I do my math correctly which that is my life um I come to that is the spaces inside the garage and then one parking space directly outside the garage correct the math Works in some cases two in two yeah for either the two car at the two ends and that gives you a total of 48 spaces and then the other 66 are coming from the one car that means there's no traditional visitor parking spaces in the inside and all of us who live at the shore know you have a lot of friends especially in the summer time in your visitors no comments no no comments any questions okay so the question would be are there any other visitor spots within the development beyond the onear garage or two-car garage and the direct space right outside of it no okay make friends like the rest of us do on all other developments that's just that's a comment all right and then that was your question already answer my other question thank you but but there will be more you will be able to see the layouts later also yeah okay good um my my question I live at John Frederickson I live at uh 302 8th Avenue a second second house up from 8th Avenue um I have no driveway and parking is a big issue um now away from uh um comment your comment you get into a question what's your question I'm sorry that's okay I apologize no it's all right it's all right we all learned so all the all the parking spaces that are in front of the house on web 8 and 7th are they going to be public parking spaces the that's to come because what we have to also understand is where the curb Cuts right that exist today versus where the curb cuts are going to be tomorrow so that will tell us are we losing spaces are we gaining spaces that's to come okay we will have Mr Curley address that I I will say though that uh Mr milia testified that th those 114 spaces that we're talking about are all in the property that does not include any of the street parking but but normally we do get to see that on one of the layouts what are all the spaces that this and how that's going to work so that will be seen in the future um trash pickup we haven't gone there yet okay um and the other the other question I have is snow when snow hav't gotten there yet you haven't gotten there yet okay sorry no it's okay it's all right anybody else okay now you wanted some additional documentation from yes we want we want to get Jennifer the uh the view of web corners and back because a lot of these folks are interested as well as the board is interested um obviously we want to see the setbacks on all on everything like you you normally do you always show the setbacks of everything so that we can explain what's sidewalk what's not we want um was that it the calculations for the void toolid ratio that's correct I think that void a solid calculations void solid Administration right so everyone's coming back I know you're all happy about that um what's our next all right uh I'd have to ask Miss Smith we have two choices for you MH half a meeting on October 3rd or a whole meeting I'm seventh half a meeting hour and a half or a full meeting on what the 28th is it the 28th yes is is there not a half a meeting available on the 2 September meeting there's on when this the next September meeting there is right yes there there is a half a meeting if you're interested I will not be here but uh if you're interested in having that one you're it's it's an hour and a half you get an hour and a half are there any revisions that are going to yes that's that's a factor are there resion by staff you won't have enough time unfor to meet the next no they're not they're not plan changes there it's just an an elev a r a picture of what's already been submitted a prettier picture there's nothing that would hold either of you up that's should come after correct get that all right so like I said do you want half a meeting or you want a whole meeting I mean if possible if we could have half the meeting on September and half the meeting October 7th if needed if we don't finish I think um Mr Milo is the most of all the four Witnesses he had the most testimony the other three have much shorter presentations so we may finish in half the meeting in September but if we could take half the meeting in October 7th too I can say that is not my personal preference okay because I will not be here okay so October If October 7th there's half there's a there's a half a meeting available so unless I mean it's really up to you yeah we're it's up to you guys do you want to take the September meeting where I am not here Mr goonan will be running the show or you want to wait till the 7th or the 28th for a full meeting it's up to you we're under some tight time constraints so we would appreciate moving forward in September okay then the other half of so you have an hour and a half M on the 27 was it 27th and the 3rd 23rd on the 23rd September 23rd you want you want that okay yes all right so let's carry it carry it further notice you'll wave any time constraints under the ml I will wave until not sure we're up against it yet but I will wave until September 24th yes all right so uh can I get a motion to carry this application to September 23rd no further notice so second okay what time 7 p.m. 7 p.m. thank you oh but you but you'll be you'll be second up so maybe 8:30 depending on how long the first application but definitely 8:30 for sure yeah but it could but the could be soon date time place and date time and place assume 7 o' and enjoy the first application yeah all right thank you uh can I get a motion to dang it sry sorry you that happens to me councilwoman Clayton yes Jim Henry yeah Daniel Shan Jen saer Vice chair goon chairwoman Barbara KAC yes all right can I get a motion to adjourn move second all in favor