##VIDEO ID:tjOh68Kw4jg## hello and welcome to the Tuesday September 10th 2024 meeting of the air planning board this meeting hearing of the air planning board will be held in person at the location provided on this notice members of the public are welcome to attend this inperson meeting please note that while an option for remote attendance Andor participation V via Zoom is being provided as a courtesy to the public the meeting hearing will not be suspended or terminated if technological problems interrupt the virtual broadcast unless otherwise required by law members of the public with particular interest in a specific item on this agenda should make plans for in-person versus virtual attendance accordingly this meeting will be live on Zoom the public May access the proceedings by joining Zoom meeting ID number 833 6548 0732 or by calling 929-2599 for additional information about remote participation please contact Danny Ruiz Town planner at D a.m. us or 978 772 8220 extension 144 prior to the meeting um regarding the agenda I believe there's one proposed amendment and and Danny that's to include a dis uh remember we had the discussion to talk about oh yes the uh planning board member who will join the 71 Sandy Pond Road oh yes 71 p uh uh right the Planning Group for that so uh when do we want to put that in where where do you think that I think we can do it after Dan Dan's talk okay so uh I'd like to make a motion that we accept the agenda with the uh proposed amendment to include the discussion of of a planning board member at 7170 pond so moved second excellent K how do you vote I have discussion discussion I think it should be under administrative m is number four that's fine we're going to be so grouchy we don't want to join anything how badly do you want someone sure we'll put under I accept that Amendment do you the second yes but I will be too grouchy to join okay if we do that all right uh any further discussion he none Ken yes Julie yes um Nathan hi Jeff dson I chair votes on it uh first item on the agenda is presentation from Dan scal bringing us up to date on the storm water Enterprise fund hey thank you Dan hey good evening planning board um I do have handouts of the presentation about to give I don't know if any board members want them and there's plenty for the public as well take one and pass it if you want it um so Danny we'll need to pop that up on the screen when we yes I could do it if you're busy handing things out oops I can full [Applause] screen you already have yeah I could take one I don't don't have one on me oh they're big boys oh that's a PDF oops wrong one all right back to zoom Jonathan yes I didn't know if there were any members of the public here for Stratton Hill and they will be continuing should we tell the public May got may we for a moment it's kind so I do I thought Mr Collins is going to be here hold on let's see what Daddy we just got a letter yeah I know we did but my understanding is that there actually really Bob Collins is coming tonight he is talk so yes there is something so there is I thought that it meant that there he is going to talk for a few minutes about where we are was Strat in hill so okay all right um so I'll try to be brief I know you get the planning board has a big agenda tonight but um just an update on the storm water utility the consideration for that and where the work group has gone summary of findings and next steps um in brief the work group's objective was to consider the adoption of a storm water utility that is an Enterprise fund as an option to fund storm water management for the town goal of today's meeting is to present the work group efforts over the past year plus um the findings and next steps so if the board remembers we were back here on February 13th 2024 for an initial um hey here's what the work group's doing here's a few of the things we've done and what we're looking to do moving forward uh list of the work group members some of which are in attendance tonight and obviously the uh Mr chair Jonathan is on the work group and work group members feel free to chime in I know we're we got a busy agenda but um so one of the the key items the work group has is basically a I call it a repository the work group's web page has an abundance of information including all of the workg group meeting agendas and notes on materials as part of those as well as frequently asked questions educational videos um and um information from the June 24th public forum that was conducted so if there's ever more information that you uh the Board needs or anyone in the public needs I would encourage you to go here and you can always reach out to myself or a member of the work group um so the work group efforts to date so over the past year um the work groups accomplished the following uh determine storm Mar utility needs and funding and I'll go through that process and how we got to our our final recommendation drafted the rate structure regulations and credit policy as well as conducted public meetings and Outreach and the image down below is a an a timeline which the work group modified at each of its monthly meetings to address public Outreach in the future and what what the work group sought best to do uh for upcoming Outreach um which slide are we on it's tough to see the top with the zoom so storm water utility needs and funding I won't get too into it I think the planning board from our previous presentation would know that the need needs and the storm water um issues we have in air but um just on the bottom there where you see the the um pictures of the money bags the work group did evaluate different levels of service for storm water management so you know initially we looked at the idea the highest level of service let's implement the stormw asset management plan to the fullest version one that would cost $1.9 million a year and frankly probably probably not practical to implement Staffing wise or any finally either so we started there and worked our way to um to the version three which is recommended as a a proactive approach to managing storm water at about $700,000 a year um and this is all in accordance with our our storm waterer Asset Management plan if I may D yeah so I just want to assure people that what we did was try to find the best balance between meeting our responsibilities for storm water infrastructure and preparedness and minimizing the potential burden on the citizens of a so we're juggling those two things and I think that that third choice that we arrived at while it post what it does is it stretches out of a longer period of time the sequence of the major capital projects exactly and I think that in the Judgment of the engineers that that's acceptable you know we're still going to be in a good place and responsible place with that time scale but I also but I and I also feel that it's most fair for the people a because they're not suddenly burdened with something overwhelming we come down to something that's what 2375 uh every quarter or 95 I think it's $95 a year and we'll talk about the the unit price so just want to assure you that one a lot of thought went into it two it does meet our responsibilities and that three in in the pre in the presentations we've done and then towards the end of this presentation Dan will show us some of the other Outreach we've done pretty much the the response has been very favorable people think this is fair and reasonable and good so I I I think the public feedback has been positive thus far thanks Jonathan yeah that was you know very well said okay continue along um so more on utility needs and funding so as the work group looked at um the utility needs our current storm water program the reactive approach the town's really you know used toward storm water management funding of about $240,000 a year that includes any storm water upgrades pipe replacements catch basins drain manholes culverts Etc um as well as any soft costs are in there too an operation and maintenance cost it's really very low it's only going to give us a reactive approach as as Matt and I live at the DPW when we are basically just repairing things instead of um doing uh proactive Replacements so the pro proo storm Mar utility Enterprise fund so that would be 700,000 a year put it put the town in a proactive position um allow us to accomplish small mediumsized capital projects but also as as Jonathan mentioned spread out some of those larger Culver projects like the grotten School Road Culvert for example you know it's 8ot span really needs replacement that'll be you know multi-million dollar project that that the town needs to address and there's several of those around town which we should you know work to address um as time moves forward um so it's um you know a sustainable program and one thing that we've said a lot is equity as well and we'll kind of get into the rate structure and equity and and how the fee Works to be more Equitable toward um the way that storm water is impacted by a given property EXC Mr chair yes sir Dan can I ask a question we're moving so the total amount in the fund will be 700 will be Capital plus 700 um that's total including capital capital and everything thank you just be clear thank you I also want to clarify that the numbers that we see here include Debt Service for any of the capital projects that we would didn't would take on correct so it's not an extra thing this plus you're going to see something from drawn from the general fund that cover debt no it's all in the Enterprise fund calculations yeah thank you it has its own Debt Service and it's it's right and it's incorp and the numbers are already built in yes indeed yeah it's not an alicart number no no um key terms and the board's probably very familiar impervious area so hard surface which storm water flows off of and not into doesn't absorb um so impervious area is typically used in all the storm water utilities that have been done as the measuring um tool kind of like for a water bill you use a water meter to measure how much water passes through so for a storm water bill impervious area how much is on a property is generally used in in the industry for these Enterprise funds so that's the ter a term here and the measurement that the um the work group has has used um another important term equivalent residential unit so it's a storm water billing unit basically it's related to impervious area and one equivalent residential unit is equivalent to 3,200 square ft of impervious area and the way the work group came up with that number was looked at all the single family Residential Properties in town and found the the median impervious area on single family Residential Properties so that's kind of your base line equivalent residential unit and that's used to calculate um storm water fees and we'll get into that I just want to point out something for so for multiple units you would not simply say oh there's 10 10 apartment units you wouldn't take 10 times the eru is not the way that's going to work instead the eru you think of 3200 square ft is what's the amount of impervious surface on that multif family property or multi-unit property and then say div div that by 3,200 and you get the number of units and that's how that M that will be bu y got it exactly yeah so there is and I just clicked on the link um a property viewer that's available on the the stormw water group's website and basically you can see the calculated equivalent residential unit so um I think it's in a future slide but every single family any single family residential property is charged one equivalent residential unit doesn't matter how much impervious area is on that SF we call sfr single family residential property but then if you have a property that's not single family residential so for example there's a multifam here if it works mhm trying to click it you get there uh 73 West Main Street so it it calculates out to two equivalent residential units so one equivalent residential unit is a fee of 95 per year two would be two times that so $190 per year and so on so you know so on and so forth and um there are some examples in the presentation which we can get back to so that is available online and anyone can go look at it and you know we did go to the um head meetings with businesses as well and and made them aware of this tool so they could see what their costs would be Dan is it the same for commercial they is it impervious divided by 3200 correct Y and in fact our presentation to the representatives of the business in in industrial Community went extremely well and um there was no push back it was accepted as this is a reasonable approach and I think they the general consensus is this is this is the right way to prevent uh a bad thing for becoming a a catastrophe so for preparedness and and continuity felt this was a very fair Arrangement yeah um so this was just mentioned proposed annual fee $95 per equivalent residential unit all single family Residential Properties would be charged $95 per year regardless of impervious area and then all other properties non- single family residential so your commercial industrial multi it's based off of the impervious area so the impervious area of that property divided by 3200 equals your eru um example single family residential and I I did just show you a little bit of the um the Parcel Viewer but basically it's going to be flat fee of one eru $95 here's two pheasant Circle it actually owns almost right on the median and question this will be build on the quarterly water bill um yes that's what we anticipate we've looked at that and and it's seems pretty easy for us the most efficient model yeah just making sure people recognize which bill is going to come on thank you uh non- single family residential example I did just show a multif family but here's also a commercial property 11 Willow Road so 68,000 and change square footage calculates out to 22 erus so a fee of just over $2,000 a year so you look see kind of the equity here of you know having a lot of impervious area which is going to travel fast impact storm water quality water quality where it discharges they will pay higher fees now there are um they would pay higher fees now there are um chances for credit policy and we get into that a little right now um so item three uh draft regulations and credit policy so the work group did provide some draft regulations as well in there the select board would be the authority uh and would set the rates this is what's done now with the water and sewer Enterprises so kind of following the same format and process um we would expect the rate Review Committee would be involved to set the rates and recommend them to the select board uh there is a credit policy in the regulations and and the work group felt best to make that available to all properties and the maximum credit could be up to a 50% uh reduction of a storm water fee um so won't get into details of it but that is available billing and collection and we did just talk about the uh the water and sewer bill and adding the uh storm water fee could be added there and Dan I believe those details are available on the web page you uh you showed at the beginning of the presentation thank yes s yeah thank you um just a quick on work group meeting or public Outreach uh work group met monthly um several board and committee presentations we mentioned the ones in February that were given by the work group um we had a guest speaker in February also over at the library and there's a video of that on the website um June 2024 I know some of you were in attendance as well there was a public inform information and input Forum which um was well attended and we got some good input uh there as well as um we've updated the website since and and answered several questions that came up and we mentioned the um business property owner meeting August 2024 additional Outreach listed here as well was completed and I won't go through it all in interest of time and so most recently the select board was updated by the work group and thank you to Matt and and Jonathan I know you guys were there and they do recommend uh submission of Warrant articles for town meeting consideration and the work group did work with Town Council to develop these uh two articles as well as reviewing the uh regulations rate structure and credit policy that were presented to the select board so those have been reviewed by Council as well um so the next step is um there will be uh town meeting warrant article submitted for fall town meeting consideration so two articles one basically essentially creates the storm water utility Enterprise fund second article allows it to be funded through state law um there are no numbers put in at this point and you know everything the work group has done our recommendations but you know the time getting War our doesn't mean all of a sudden it's $95 it would have to go through the process like we said of the rate review um and the select board assigning the the rates um so that was it and I think I would end with if uh the planning board chooses to do so you you could provide a vote of support for recommendation for this at the town meeting for the two warrant articles um Finn fincom has to provide its recommendation um and the select board sponsors it so um I think leave it at that if there's any questions like my contact info and and yeah thank you thank you well I think that given that this is a significant land use issue I think it would be appropriate for the board to offer support um I I will make a motion that the planning board um recommend uh what What's the right Lang recommend recommend support adoption adoption of the storm water the storm water Enterprise Utility Fund as described by Dan here today as presented at our October 24th right uh September 24th September 24th meeting no I mean for for the town meeting on o October 28th yeah seconded further discussion I'm are we is this something that we typically would have done in the past whereas a fee based charge to the citizens that we as a planning board would get involved with that kind of a so we're we're just he's asking for our support it's not a um we're not uh it's basically how does the board feel does the board support this or not the board I mean you you don't it's kind of left up to you guys as to how you guys want to vote on that so if I may since we're in the discussion phase I think it's a prudent way to move forward I know it impacts me and impacts my wallet and I'm not necessarily excited about that now that I move into the years of U fixed income but uh the other side of the coin is um it's a problem that's not going to go away you know and I think it's a small step in the right direction be honest with you I think it's a prudent use uh so and another thing as as the board does deal with a lot of projects that come before in impervious surface is really one of the big things that this board handles I feel like the planning board does have a very big role in this as well thank you and I guess I would say I don't think it falls outside of our pry I think you argue it's on the edge it's on the edge oh no understandably any further discussion Jeff how do you vote hi Nathan um I I support it I Julie yes Kent I chair votes I thank you yeah thank you so much for all your work you've done on this and Matt too of course thank you yeah the work group has really done a lot a lot thanks John next item is a 30 Pine Ridge Drive are the applicants here anyone representing yes oh come on up good evening good evening if you would give your name and address sir uh Daniel leine 30 Pine Ridge Drive thank you Daniel so what I'm going to do is going to ask Danny just to give us the lowdown what's going on yes let me just and then you'll be free to contribute what you think is appropriate and we'll ask questions and we'll take it from there cool um so the proposed anr is for a oh he said he misunderstood translation the town plan will start the town sor and then we'll let you I would I'm impressed you just jumped for it let go for I heard him say that I was wondering if he heard me um so the what what this application is looking for is uh there is a as you see on the plan there's an approximate location of a septic system shown on the plan that was uh found to be on the on on the crossman's properties um so what they're going to be doing is uh creating this parcel that's going to be combined with Mr laine's uh property and uh so that he can have so that the SAT system is on his property um this meets all zoning requirements um and uh yeah I think that's that's really it for this one and I I would assume that the Crossman are on board with this yes yes Mike is on board with this okay okay he he doesn't want to do your septic field huh no um it's pretty straightforward but certainly if there are questions I would open up comments no any public comment or questions yes sir Matt I'm with the DW so um this the first time I saw this plan but I just want to make make it know that we do have Town sewer on the street so if that ever needs to happen um it's available I think the pipe is actually stuck to the property lineer yep yep make that clear okay good thank you any other heing now would someone like to make a motion I'll make a motion that the town of air planning board endorse the plan drawn by David E Ross Associates for Dan leine at lot one Pine Ridge Drive is there actual Street dress here yes 30 Pine Ridge 30 Pine Ridge Drive Excell thank you Ken do I have a second second further discussion hearing none Ken how do you vote I Julie yes Nathan I I congratulations sir thank you I'll contact you when I have the plan signed and everything and then it just needs to be recorded at the registry Mo yeah right there beautiful uh next item on the agenda is 14 to 16 Madigan Lane come on up oh thank you appreciate it I know we've seen you before but name address circumstances yes uh Kevin Horan 16 Madigan Lane Hannah Hut 14 Madigan Lane oh good we have both sides here perfect uh Danny would you let us know what's going on yes uh so this is uh the two properties 14 and 16 Madigan Lane uh there's going to be uh basically a land swap uh to accommodate the existing driveway that's um of 16 that's on 14 um 14's property and then they'll be switching in the back the parcel a uh for parcel B so it'll just be a land Swap and uh just to accommodate the existing driveway and as well as Landscaping I believe yes uh this also they these all meet the requirements uh all zoning requirements as well beautiful I I just have one question how did you how did it come to your attention the driveway overla what what happened well Hannah Hannah purchased this property what about a year or so ago and had a and had a survey done and discovered that my driveway is on her Lane wow okay well that's a good thing to discover excellent are there any questions or comments from the board any questions or comments from the public they look riveted uh hearing none do I have a motion move to approve the request the request for the parcel swap second for 14 and 16 Madan Lane seconded as proposed on the plan with the right date and time it's an anr you correct thank you excellent any further discussion hearing none Jeff hi Nathan hi Julie yes Ken hi chair vot's I congratulations I'll get that um once I have them all sign it and then I'll contact you guys about getting it rep thank you than we have a street acceptance for Shaker Pond Road is there anyone representing Shaker Pon Road here tonight or no um not okay so Danny I'll trust you'll take us through yes [Music] haven't seen Kevin in a while all right so uh Shaker Pond this is a osrd that the board had previously approved in I believe 2019 20 21 2019 I forget that's no that's buil I believe it's 2019 it was approved um the uh the applicant has requested for the acceptance of the road um there was a punch list that DPW did confirm was completed um so uh I think at this point uh if the board has any questions about like the the property as well I'd have Matt come up and speak on anything about that that me that means I have one question yes I just if I may I would direct it to Dan and Matt um that punch list part I heard that the most important things were done but there were still a few minor items or is it all done at this point um it's it's all done there was one item on there that I don't think was really um really relevant to this process it was more so a street permit process but everything in this sub division is it's done yes oh okay great so that's the reason I asked is that uh a week ago my understanding was different that there were a few things still open Etc but that's not the case anymore um they completed everything Believe last Friday perfect thank you so much um great so I I need a motion for the street acceptance for 30 Shaker Pond wrote one three pieces of History documents is that yeah so the the other ones which I can go through with this is the actual letter request that was um made by the applicant for the you know to actually start the street acceptance process which went to the select board they R then they uh may make it come to the planning board for recommendation and then on um and this is the uh PL um the dpw's uh memorandum on the uh uh Street acceptance um this is the property in which um uh Heather did raise at one of the meetings about uh conservation going out there looking at about the open space so this is that property that um oh yes that uh yes that was discussed y but the open space question has no impact upon no it does recommendation the acceptance of the street that is correct I just want to be clear yes we stay in our lane here no that is correct just wanted to make sure that everyone knew which um if I may Mr Shar yes I'd like to recommend that the planning I would like to move that the planning board recommend the acceptance of Sheron Road uh the street acceptance for Shon Road at the upcoming special falltime meeting thank you sir do I have a second second all right any further discussion do we need to contact the town of havit to verify that the project is within the town of air that's what I I I knew it's funny Charlie Charlie Did bring that up today actually sorry um it is my belief sir that it is not in no I don't believe not my Bel our purview it is not in Harvard not you had to do that didn't you I did I'm sorry I literally started Googling this I was like what aside from the joke we having you were having a here any further discussion I'm twitching hearing n Jeff I Nathan hi Julie yes can you zing eye I think that's and it's a big eye from the chair as well it's unanimous that we were recommend that the acceptance for the town me so so should we U recommend that the chair write a welcome letter yes AB I got 10 bucks for a Welcome Wagon B here we go all right so we already have an open up public hearing for zero Scully Road right it's already open it's already open we're going to continue we have Representative no they're not here tonight they're not here tonight uh just for those of you wondering how can we have this discussion out there because basically all the discussion deliberation has been pretty much done and it was just a matter of finalizing the paperwork that Danny's brought before us today and so now is the appropriate time for us to take a vote it's been done at other previous Public public on yes on the sep at the September 10th and the uh August 27th meetings yes sorry September 11th so do you just want to bring us Danny to where we are 911 oh that's okay um I'm sorry what was that yeah just bring us to where we are today and what vote uh so uh everyone should have two documents before you we have a site plan approval uh document uh and a major storm water management permit uh for both uh for zero Scully uh and it's Ken did raise a a good point to me earlier about um I don't know if everyone knows but we do now have permit numbers that we're using uh for all of our um decisions it's it's a way that uh myself and Sam can now track how many applications we've been getting through the through uh throughout a year um so it's going to start with the 24 which is the year and then how many of that type of application nice um so uh I I'm not sure if I informed the board last time about that but that's that's what that number is uh and it also helps you know all the other departments so they have a number to reference as well um is the date June 13th correct here on this one yeah uh no so it is not so um the the latest date of that uh so that'll be amended on the final version will be yes okay great um that'll be amended on the final version when I uh uh after tonight so it'll have the correct date of let me just get that for you I believe it is uh September let just get the date for you thought I thought it was elsewhere in there September 2 uh you're right I do have it in here it is 2 no um no that's today no that's right it's September here we go 13th it's in the email I have it right here [Music] uh zero SC uh 916 2024 and I just want to remind everyone that we did the waiver request at the LA previous meeting yes and those were all uh approved um so yeah so uh so the waiver request which is under Section two those are all the waivers that were passed at the last um meeting on September 10th um uh section three is the materials I would like to read the findings into for the record you're very brief but I think that the third one is particularly significant so the findings so of course any decision has to be supported by findings and we find if we were to vote to approve the following one the site plan contains a design that has provided the foundation for the air planning board to determine that the requirements standards and guidelines of the town of air site plan regulations subsection 32035 of the aiz zoning bylaws have been met in a satisfactory satisfactory manner two I don't think we'll fix that later satisfactory the project site consists of the parcel parcel ID 33-3 and consisting of 92 97,2 194 ft 2.23 Acres located within the Air's light industrial district zoning the project site is located along Scully Road the lot is currently vacant and forested and and this the one that's particularly Germain is the property owner's caretaker quarters shall only be lived in by the business owner or an employee of the business the caretakers quarters is the necessary use and the industrial use that funding is important because it has burying on any F uh future disposition of that property uh in order for it to exist as it does by this approval someone either owning it the industrial use or working for the industrial use can live and no one else yes and that'll also be referenced further in the special condition that I have later on as well oh thank you sir um so the general conditions are our typical boiler plate uh yes sir got a tiny comment on on that Danny um on which finding no the language it used in the first paragraph So it refers to the section 3.5.4 which is the section of the decision but the whole San review is just section 3. 5 yes um so we should have just say in compliance with 3.5 that's my question not just that one section uh so 3.5.4 the reason I have it just reference is because uh number two uh number well a basically A1 and two uh those are what are uh what the site plans have to meet for our regulations that that's what the board is approving that it meets these all these requirements okay thanks you saying about the general conditions yes uh so the general conditions those are our typical conditions that we've been running with uh since we started our new decisions um so there's no uh change es to these conditions um the only change that we'll be doing is under six number 16 which will'll be changing that date to September 16th right and then other than that it would we would go down to the special condition which is on uh page eight section six and I'll read that into the record the property owners caretaker quarter shall only be lived in by the business owner or an employee of the business the Aker quarters is an necessory use of the industrial use if the applicant property owner is no longer the owner employee of the business they shall not be allowed to live in the cakers caretaker's quarters if the business is no longer active or exists the applicant property owner shall notify the Building Commissioner and planning department and shall not be allowed to live in the caretaker's quarters without the business use active and existing the accessory use of the caretaker's quarters does not conform with the aiz zoning bylaws um just one it's it's an accessory use have light industrial right it is what did we put what what did I just read industrial oh thank you for that oh right thank you sir I'll make that Amendment you got a tough job man all right um anything else English is my second language remember anything else do I have a motion to to uh accept the site plan approval uh so first thing uh CL public hearing close the public hearing first have a motion to close the public hearing wait do we do that before we do the storm water why did you pick up the fact that it's says that it's in the industrial Zone special conditions special conditions second line last word no it says the caraker cor is is an accessory use of an industrial use doesn't say industrial Zone it's correct the way it is industrial use yeah this is true it's correct the way it is all right light industrial use industrial use indust it's the same I guess okay maybe should maybe it should be capitalized which I I so do we want to leave it as as is or change it change it to the light industrial use okay change it lit t or l g so you can so you can close the public hearing now or you can go through the storm water first it doesn't matter because uh the discussion portion has already happened input though if we close the hearing no and typically I mean for for decisions there is there is no and that's why typically we close a public hearing before we do the decisions but okay doesn't I mean do I have a motion to close the public hearing for um zero Scully Road so moved seconded any further discussion earing none Jeff hi Nathan hi Julie yes Ken hi chair v i um so now the next thing is the uh what's the appropriate verb for the site plan approval uh do we uh so uh just be who made a motion I did that's why and then Jeff thank you I just okay um so it's right up here so section one so you can just read that right oh just oh okay uh motion for the approval of the site plan pursuant to subsection 32035 site plan review of air zoning bylaw subject to the standard conditions numbered 1 through 36 and special condition mentioned uh special condition numbered one in this decision and the following conditions present at the meeting uh the motion was presented by Julie Julie Julie no that was that was a closing this is this is the you're moving it I'm moving it sorry I'm rough day moving it everybody it's okay I'll second it move the C you thank you very much you're getting your name on everything tonight we're moving along the discussion um yes sir just for um dot in the eyes then the applicant does have so many days to appeal this right or question right so the applicant was given this they had no comments uh so they've already reviewed it and that's why they're not here okay but they do have time there's a filing time yes so the the way it works is once this once the board votes tonight the chair will sign it and then once I stamp in with the town clerk that's when the 20-day appeal period starts thanks and it's also po it's on page nine yes so at the end of the document it has the um the process on the appeal period should they find something to appeal here yes mhm seconded I did that sorry my best seconded do I have any further discussion hearing none Ken hi Julie yes hi jeck hi votes I it's approved need to talk about the storm War how we go to the storm [Applause] War uh so for this one um this is going to this has a lot of this similar um structure as it has as our other storm water management permits uh section one is the approval section two is the waivers that were already voted up that was V voted on at the last meeting uh section three is the materials section four has findings which uh do we want to read those in I don't know if you want to there are typical I wouldn't because they're typical the reason I did last night because it was something unusual the previous um and then section five is our general conditions which are a lot of them are similar to what we have for side plan approval but there are some additional ones in there which follow our storm water regulations but they are not unique to this project no they're not unique to this project just to be clear we'll get to the special conditions M uh I don't think this one has uh this one does not have this one has let me just double check there's just one after occupancy 34 and 35 are typical conditions I believe it's page seven yes yep okay thank you and in fact the special conditions very it simply says yeah the certificate of completion in accordance with the stor water manager permit and Stor water regulation shall be recorded the middle sex self Registry of Deeds by the owners and ACC copy the recorded decision be submitted electronically electronically to the plan yes so so our typical special conditions that we carry three of them the other two were not necessary on this project so I only kept that one um so uh the only other change would be on prior then on number 16 we'll change that to September 16th all the day trust yep I'll run through all those beautiful um and then yes the special condition which Jonathan already read so this one's pretty straight as well M no thanks I make a motion go for I'll make a motion that we approve the storm water management permit pursuant to section 245 5 and six storm water management of air General bylaws subject to standard conditions 1 through 35 and special condition one in this decision and the following conditions presented at the meeting which were none excellent thank you Nathan do I have a second seconded any any further discussion hearing none 10 yes Julie yes Nathan hi Jeff I chair votes I store mat permit is is approved have a hearing on that we have to close CL the the public hearing they were combined they were combined and that brings us to New England power zero Bop zero Park Street I believe we have some at least yeah we got some people here um so can we get another chair thank you um I missed this meeting in and I okay okay um no I don't believe she was there I believe she was at the meeting so okay can vote I'm not going to vote okay no offense guys I just wasn't here for I was I was wondering about you I didn't remember not many people wonder about me but thank you we do have for that reason just for attendance for that reason it's a simple majority vote Yes okay um so uh just uh so I'm sorry you just based on what you just said there is a special permit as well yes so Kathleen can vote on that one on the special per so it's not a simple majority vote well so the site plan is the special permit is a is a majority vote is a super majority vote but Kathleen can vote on that one got cuz she's our associate member all right I just want to make sure yep we're all so you'll have five members for the special permit excellent thank you where are we on this yes so uh the decision was sent over to Josh and to Brian um the uh the applicants did provide uh some comments um most of them were I I thought were acceptable I think there were a couple that I thought we should discuss okay um so the I left some of the um the commenting here for the board to look at um oh I don't know why show oh no they are they are I just could see okay so the first one you'll see that I left for the board is under number 12 um on page four oh yeah I know it's it's the coloring here Dan we looking at the the site plan or the um uh we're looking at the oh I went to the storm water so yeah let's go to the storm water first storm water stor yeah I just happened to have it so that's page four yes uh page for um you'll see the uh number 12 so we stru so what was struck uh stricken from there was B submitted yearly we um so we would strike that and then um in October and then have it say and shall be subed upon uh request of the town so I didn't have an issue with this one because this property doesn't have actual bmps um okay it's it's all just Stone and so everything just filters in through the through the stone and that's how it um that's how it infiltrates so there's not like any detention basins there's no catch basins there's none of that so I didn't think it was necessary for them to have to uh do that so what about the head wall issue well yep we we'll get that to to that NOP that's okay we'll get to that as well um uh during construction so there is um what page we on now then uh so on page six and actually let me just give these two the appli as well see you guys so I did add in a comment in there from uh for the special condition uh for the condition on the construction just because I talked to Charlie about it um so he was he was fine with some with How It Was Written but the um he did want me to add an extra sentence to it uh so what I st um put on mine is uh it says not withstanding the foro due to the essential nature of the substation and operations and the electric grid from time to time construction work may need to occur outside of hours set forth here in in which case the applicant shall provide the Building Commissioner with at least 48 Hours advance for in notice which may include email and I struck of and then put in requesting the need for any such extended construction work hours and then added in the sentence the Building Commissioner shall determine if the request is approved when the applicant submiss the request just Charlie felt that you know he whenever the the submissions come in at the request at that point then he would make the uh determinations at those that's fine thank you uh they uh and then the other one that was added in by uh the applicant was um on number 26 so members or agents of the planning board shall have the right to enter the site at any time in parenthesis to the extent outside of the substation security fencing I was met boss I think that's reasonable the nature of the site y That's not a place for us to be wandering around exactly um the next one was after occupancy mhm so number 35 it says at a minimum twice we it was stricken and put in once per year for the first year and instead of annually after upon written request thereafter so again this is just kind of there's no bmps um and then the next section so I did also add another uh condition here uh so first let's go to number two so number two um the applicant has agreed to clean out the in in front of the head wall the the sediment that's built up there so I kind of want to just bring Matt in on this one as well um so the applicant did propose uh new language um and I'll read it uh so that everyone knows so the applicants stated that it would be uh there is an existing Culvert and head Wall located at the applicant's property near Bishop Road the applicant will remove any Associated sediment deposits residue and debris located outside of the Culver and head wall on the applicant's property in no event shall the applicant be responsible or allowable for any cleanout maintenance repair or replacement uh what I have replacement work no I know I'm reading you something new that we just got um oh this is proposed by yes this is proposed by the applicant um we haven't had really had a chance to talk about this that's why thank you um however the uh replacement work on the Culvert head wall Andor related facilities however the applicant will work cooperatively with the town to coordinate uh dates and times during which the town Andor its contractors May perform cleanout maintenance repair or Andor replacement work on the over head wall and related facilities so is that in just so so I'm I'm I'm amendable with this new language the only thing I would raise is that um Town Council did provide us with a document that states what we can and cannot take care of as a town um I think the the National Grid would have to give the town an easement to maintain it based on what Town Council has op um makes sense right you mean it's got to be one way the we're not we're not allowed to maintain anything on private property and um or so it has to be Town own land an easement or um I believe and I believe that's it so since it's private property and um there's no easement we would not be able to maintain it going forward but so if National good were to provide the um DP the town of air an easement along that area to maintain it then the town could maintain it okay I think that's acceptable we were actually looking for an easement of record and we couldn't find one in the title yeah we we couldn't find one either right yeah is that the only would you want that in the decision or is that outside of the decision so I think I would just put in the decision that the uh the applicant and the town would work on an ease uh for uh future maintenance of the uh head wall and the and the head wall and culber yeah okay and then I think you know Matt and Dan would just have to kind of get with you guys and figuring out and you know creating you you guys would have to create the easement plan for and and the documents that would have to go along with it yeah I think we just want to make sure that um the the there's obviously an essential service for the town so we just want to make sure that that does not delay oh no no no no no no I think I don't think no I don't think it would um delay anything I think it's just for future so that um in the future we can maintain it so it's not something that needs to be done you know before you can start work it's something that I would put as a special condition that and I would say probably like um if we can come up I can talk to I mean I would say like probably before the end of construction mhm I mean I don't I don't think that's uh too long of a period for I mean uh to be able to get that finished so is is the town council's position that that that um he or she would would recommend that the town not do any work with respect to that Culvert at all unless and until the easan actually is granted um yes so the Culver the town you we we own it we're responsible for it it's really a drainage ditch on the property it's a natural resource it's a stream we can't touch it can't go on the proper property till we get easements okay um in that event we can maintain it um going forward but in this instance for this project I think it's best that we work together to get this planning I think it's a mutual interest to have an easement in place so okay yeah we'll we'll do that okay just again just as long as the company can go forward with it sub project yes yeah I think I think so this shouldn't affect um that and I think what I'll do is um let I'll I'll work on the the I think what I'll do is Strike number two um this language that you email uh that you sent over to me and that I read would take over number two's um the special condition number two and then we'd add so we'd add another condition that would say that the applicant in the town would work on um getting a an easement for future maintenance of the um head wall to um the appli will provide need for maintenance of the for future maintenance of the head excuse me son of an attorney I just add culbert and headwall CT and headwall yeah in everyone's best interest I'll say okay is there anything else we need to do before we move to a vote on the St water perit um one second sorry y okay and then so the other condition that I did add in here after talking with Heather um so uh I put in here the applicant will not um start work until they' received the order conditions from the air Comm um conservation commission um as because you guys still have to get uh your noi through them um if the plans have any major changes the applicant shall submit for a site plan modification if the plan changes are minor the applicant shall submit the uh plans that are approved by the Conservation Commission the town planner shall determine if the changes are minor or major they already submitted for a notice of intent didn't they yes but they have to um on a discussion order yet yeah they haven't gotten the order yet and they have some modifications um uh proposed with the cleaning out of the of this area so that's why I want just and they haven't received D comments so there's a lot of things that are kind of still up in the air with that over there so that's why I put this condition in here to make sure I'm sorry I I'm sorry I I'm confused I thought you couldn't impose impose a condition that depended on another board's decision no you yeah kind of thinking the same thing I don't know if this is legal no I've seen this I've seen this in many projects I'm the agent I'm sitting right here bouncing around um so the condition strictly just says if because so we have to continue we're not hearing this at our meeting on Thursday because of the plans CH the plans are changing because of this W application area needs some modifications and the obviously cleaning of the drainage and I don't have any comments from d d could then require fire I don't know what they're going to have for comments may end up having some changes to the plans on that you're approving it tonight not based on mine that that condition only just says if the plans change based on what happens in conservation then you'd have to they'd have to go back to Danny to verify if it's my her major yep and that's typical I've seen I've seeny saying no just it changes I just want to be care all the conditions okay try to mention both boards on there because everybody takes both decisions with them everywhere they go the only one carries so it always makes refence to the other okay yeah and it's just to also make sure that we're both working everyone's working off the same plans as well okay just to um throw out a clarification in there I think the the Wetland replication and everything is not we're not planning to change it's a plant and it really is just a note about cleaning out the stream um just so that's included in the scope of work that's submitted to the kcom yeah um you know any and anything else would be the um you know calculations and whatnot that are on the EP form so yeah and that's we're not expecting any no obviously but you never know what de you may get a comment that you don't expect and that's that's just that's just I just wanted to clarify that you know we're not expecting any significant changes so okay all right I get I have a little problem with just the order of the sentence Danny it says okay the first s of course is all right it says if the plans have any major changes shouldn't it be shouldn't it be a reference at there as if the M if the plans of any major changes as a result of the ordered conditions refer to the conserv it kind of reads as though any major Chang meaning any major changes well any major changes they come back that would be a normal condition yeah it would be would be a special condition yeah no you're right on that but I can we can so work on the language so if the plans have any major changes as as a result of the order of conditions like okay yeah yeah so um if if the plans have any major changes as a result of the order condition the applicant shall submit for a sight plan modification if the plan changes are minor the applicant s just submit the plans that are approved by Conservation Commission the to plan will determine if the changes are minor or major thank you uh I would just delete the word just just I'm sorry I didn't hear you oh delete the word just yeah just diit piggy thing um did you have another another item on this one no can we just go back to the easement language can you read that off to me again so it's it'll say the the applicant and town of air will work on an easement for future maintenance and uh mut future maintenance of the Culvert and headwall um say e easement or other other required um other written access rights something like that um so that is it easement or eement or yes or equivalent EAS or equivalent I don't think we're allowed to I don't I don't I can't figure out an an equivalent situation in which we would be allowed to work on the property it would have to be an ease man well the company could just write an email saying you can access the property and perform yeah I I know but Town Council has up behind that we're not we can't so we will not um me that's just a comment this is the Reser of what National Grid does every day of the week Bal grid requests easement from all commercial property owners to get to their Transformers on locations and stuff like that I mean it's a common practice understood but this is the other way around I know but complicated than the other way around every time the company conveys title any property interest whether it's sale or or an easement it's not always the most standard straightforward thing because they've got U mandates with the dpu uh so I I guess if I I'm thinking if if we have some alternative to an easement in there and your and your Town Council said well it's either or well we're picking the the easement then then so be it um the problem is I think based on what I have from Town Council it has to be an EAS there's no equivalent for what the Town Council has a pine that DPW can work on okay okay all right and I mean is there something that you can come up that other than an easement well there's a license there's a lease there's just verbal oral authority to say yeah you can come on our land just give us an insurance certificate I I I would turn over Ian I'm going to ask Dan the DPW director on that one yeah I'm in agreement with you Danny that you know we can't access without a proper eement of legal rights through that to perpetually maintain that fight you know anything else that okay all right we're good yeah all right um so we can move to the site plan approval and special permit do we want to vote on the major STM perit first oh we can vote on that is amended how do we do it's amended it's amended I make a motion for approval of the stor M management permit as amended pursuant to subsection 2455 and six Stone water mat of the air General bylaws subject to the standard conditions 135 and special condition number one this decision one through 1 through three 1 through four 1 two 3 four 1 through four in this decision um and and and the conditions we just talked about that's 1 through yep I'll just leave it there got a second second any further discussion is this about the store Mor manager permit or about the site approval sir it's about when if this town is uh informed that there's an extra construction outside of ours could we be also notified as the neighbors better so yeah the very first point that you were discussing I didn't want up until now I felt like this is the only time that I can speak but it's it's the very first point you said that when the um Mo power informs you of construction out regular hours can The Butters be also informed when decision made I mean I I sure yeah I can I mean so if you can give me I have your contact information so once I I'll know once the building once this comes into the building commissioner I can let you know thanks so much yeah so we modifying it or keeping it the way it is I'll I'll deal with that okay all right thank you all right we we s on that yep good any other discussion hearing none Jeff no I do not participate oh I'm sorry I'm sorry Nathan hi Julie oh wait I'm sorry Kathleen no no special Julie yes uh Ken I chair votes I it's tough so with the S plan of approving a special permit do we take them separately do the speci so there's two there's two um votes in this you'll see the plan approval and then there's the special perment approval um so a lot of the comments that came from this one from the storm water management were also put into this one as well um uh so under number 12 on page five that was also what we previously talked about and then page seven about the uh hours the hours and then the um the extent of staying outside the the security fencing and then special condition and then so the special conditions will match the storm water ones so number one through four will have four of the C Storm water so the same special conditions we just discussed otherwise the general conditions are boiler plate yep okay so I think you may want to just open it up to the public for any comments let me ask first I want to ask the board if they have any questions or comments about the site plan approved or special permit I'm good good so the public have questions or comments regarding the site plan approval and special permit the update from last time do you have yeah do you anything you want to say before we come to a vote was there anything so last time we discussed some points y but I I'm not aware of any resolution to any of them uh the resolution was we would we would that the applicant agreed to take it consideration the um plantings yeah but they said that given they can't put in full grown trees and that the plantings are limited to what one what they can negotiate with the bank and two what actually is appropriate for that specific ground there isn't that what we isn't that what we came to so that that that's the sidewalk that I didn't attend um so I was not there for that discussion but I I believe you uh Julie was there Kathleen was there and were there there so can you speak to that is the question with respect to the planting of trees for the butter across the street yes right yes so um you're right Mr chair uh we we did walk a site and there are there are limitations there with respect to the the wetlands the topography um and we just the the property along the property long line along the bank uh property the credit union property uh we ALS we we feel that the the vegetative screening there is already pretty robust um and it would actually require uh more clearing of that area which we would feel would be unnecessary in order to plant trees that really would have not much more benefit at all they would take time to grow and um again they're they're close proximity to the Wellings the last item is that the there are overhead lines all through that site uh including that property line near the bank side and along the front side along uh Park Street and so um there's a real limitation there too the company just simply does not uh install certain types of plantings uh in under uh utility lines okay any further questions or comments I want to verify that that is what I remember from the conversation that day in the field that we did a look around we looked across the street at your home up on the hill um we walked the edge of the property line and pretty much determined just exactly way it was reported by the applicant that we did not see a a big advantage to be able to put anything there it was just not not enough room basically who did go on the other side of the job as well and look along um Bishop Road B Ro yeah and we determined over there that there was some additional planning maybe going to happen on that side you showed us some plantings it should be reflected in the landscape plan yes that were approved there yep um but it didn't work to add foliage there was pretty dense foliage there at the moment okay it's the way I remember so are we looking do uh uh a special permit first we take a vote is that Let's do let's do the first one s plan approval K's not going to vote and then she'll vote on the second one what page you looking at uh page two this one does say 3.5 all right uh I make a motion for approval of the site plan pursuant to subsection 320 -35 site plan review of aiz zoning bylaw subject to the standard condition it sorry it should say 3.54 I'm sorry subsection 32035 4 site plan review of aiz zoning bylaw subject to the standard conditions number 1 through 36 and special conditions numbered 1 through 4 correct in the decision have a second seconded any further discussion caring none Ken I Julie yes Nathan hi and the chair votes I uh I'm going to moot make a motion for the approval of the special permit for the height of the light poles pursuant to subsection 320-3369 Nathan I Kathleen k at this Kathleen yes Julie yes Ken I and that your votes I conratulations motion to close the hearing we have a motion to close the hearing seconded second any further discussion hearing none I need vote Ken I Julie yes Nathan I and then and chair votes I uh I'm going to call a 5 minute us and we'll regroup at 7:35 thank okay I'm returning the meeting to order welcome back everyone the next item is uh Stratton Hill Danny will you tell us where we are with this and what can and cannot happen this evening yes so um attorney Collins is not here um so we will not have any discussion or deliberating um I will give I will provide an update to everybody so that everyone knows where we are and then um uh attorney Collins's letter will be read into the record and continued uh will be continuing the public hearing so um uh just to provide an update at the end of August there was a um meeting at the DPW with uh uh Matt Dan um attorney Collins and uh Frank uh uh from uh Dillis and Roy um uh so um the engineers sorry but yeah James was that too from oh and and yes yep and Jim Thorne from Green International the peer reviewer um there was a meeting uh out of that uh the applicant had said that they would be revising plans um based on the discussion based on the review comments which have been um that the peer review provided in I'm not exactly sure when that date was but it's been a it's been quite a couple months now um so the applicant did submit revised uh plans on Friday um we have not had a chance to even look at them um we haven't had a chance to review or anything so what we're going to be doing cuz tonight we were supposed to have green International here as well to have a discussion about the plans and the comments and go through a big review discussion on that did you clarify exactly the position of green International for people in the audience so uh green nation is the peer reviewer they're going to they're um they're hired by the applicant through the 53g account and paid for by the applicant um the town uh chose uh I'm not sure who uh I believe it was Mark uh the previous planner chose green International and what they are doing as a board the board chose them the board chose them okay I I wasn't here at that point so that's why I wasn't sure um so the board made the choice to go with green inter naal um I believe in it was like May or way back way back um and they are doing basically a peer review of the full project making sure it meets all of our zoning requirements osrd requirements and they've already provided uh comments this is their second round of of comments that they've provided but um we have not really had a chance to have any discussion on it other than the a couple of meetings that we've had here uh we've had maybe to meetings where we've had some substantive discussion and then the new plans were proposed the whole redesign is there report on the website as well under our documents which one the green International stuff no so peer review comments are not on the website if you request them I can send them to you I have already sent them to some to some some uh some residents that have requested it okay thanks I believe I did send them I don't think I got okay I'll send them along those lines the most recent submission of plans are they on the website so they're not yet because we have not had a chance to review them so I will have those up on the website um this week uh so that everyone can start getting to can start looking at them um as well as uh every all the other documents that they've submitted um so uh attorney Collins was going to be here to just give us an update and see as to where they are timing and uh what they saw for um uh what they thought would going to be the process going forward um he seems to not be so he's not here so we're not going to have any any deliberation or any discussion uh we're just going to uh read the the letter into the record and uh continue the project so the letter we have a letter from uh the applicants attorney Robert Collins stated September 23rd 20 2024 regarding Fox Mealy Metal realy Corporation mol Construction Corporation Locust Stratton Hill def definitive subdivision right Road dear board members kindly continue the hearing to the meeting on October 22nd this will provide sufficient time for green and review the responses submitted today and Dillis androy to provide whatever further revisions may be needed kindly also consider this letter as request at the time by which the board must complete its hearings and file a decision this on this matter be extended until November 30th 2024 thanking the board for its time and consideration I remain very truly yours Robert L Collins this has been stamped in by the Town Clerk and is up on the wall um on the town clerk's uh bulletin board for everyone to know for the extension of the uh time to act uh move to continue the hearing to October 22 second for the Strat H defend subdivision right roog thank you and thank you Nathan any any uh discussion hearing none Jeff hi Nathan hi Julie yes Ken I chair votes I we'll continue to October second me October um this will be our third meeting discussing the proposed zoning Amendment no we we actually it is the third because we had a long discussion then a short thing and yeah this is the actual Public public the second public hearing third discussion second public off Dan thank you Dan thank you Matt so uh Dan we have two proposed zoning amendments uh for our recommend or not I read it's to fall town meeting and we're going to take and what we're going to start with the inclusionary housing if okay or do you want to start with the definitions so the definitions didn't change um uh I was told to keep the those um the way they were written perfect um based on um uh town clerk so is there anything for us to vote on regarding the definitions coun you mean Town Council no you say town clerk yeah town clerk on on the fall town meeting versus Springtown meeting writing um uh so what let's just kind of go through uh the changes so section uh 10.32 was stricken M um you know it's removed out of this it's in the definitions um so everything all the numbers did change with that strike for um the. 34d were there they all have changing yeah they're all changing got it so see no but I'm looking for the next changes in the document would be in 10.34 oh yes so 10 um 34d um so three let's go four so I struck all of the zoning board of appeals wording um in this section and in the earlier sections the zoning board of appeals is still referred to but we just restruck it from those sections so that uh there was no confusion as to who that uh permit gring Authority is during this uh process um the um D this was originally in the my first revision I don't know why it wasn't carried over when I sent it over with Town Council and our the public hearing but this is what we carried over from the past uh from what we just approved at at the last town meeting so this is the exact same wording that's in our zoning bylaw currently it just carried it over to here under General provision for the board M right so this was in the uh this is under changed at the spring spring time meeting correct yep the one that was approved the design guidelines had to be changed to be Massachusetts not no I I agree got it yep so that's I that's just the added in um and then on the next section under the on-site units so I struck on-site affordable rental units shall be required and changed it to any development made up of rental units the affordable units shall be required on site M right pretty simple um B struck the Andor zoning board of appeals again fix the numbers again fix the numbers to coincide with the correct sections when you fix the numbers you're basically seeing the underly three is the new number rather than the there's a strike line through it but it doesn't show very well when you look at it got it and and blue is very difficult color yeah I don't know why I I couldn't figure out how to change as we age blue is one of those colors we can't see anymore I couldn't figure out how to change it that's okay it's a lighter gray but the lines help a lot yeah um tough crowd see1 no it's C1 is the correction yes so C so C is the correction that we talked about at the last meeting um striking two and three and just leaving the payment and L shall be paid upon the recording of the transfer of D for each market rate unit um the numbers were changed for seven and 8 and then uh density bonus again striking the zone of appeal section in there and then adjusting the numbers to from 10.34 to 10.33 MH um the next is striking two and making that one affordable unit striking the S the applicant who who strikes agree and then it says uh the applicant who applies for the special apartment under this section to provide two more additional affordable units than than is required on site May request any addition an additional six market rate units parentheses three per additional uh affordable unit bringing the total development to 18 units and then in parenthesis 15 market rate three affordable mhm the applicant waves the payment and lose if if you choose to provide if they y thank you for catching they choose to provide the additional affordable units to receive the density bonus you sent us the link on this or whatever on the email we yep I sent it to everyone completely it was done on now yes yeah and there's a clean version that I also sent along to you as well I got that um but I just figured for this just Sprint out see yeah so that everyone can see between the last exactly um this was already to Town Council uh last Tuesday or Wednesday um they've they've uh the town warrant article has been sent out to me to review I reviewed it and it matches what we have Town council's also on on all set with this um so I think um there's any comments do I move to recommend the adoption at the fall special time meeting the chapter 320 zoning inclusion inclusionary housing requirements as provided have a second second discussion I'll say one comment please do um you know I don't like being uh in descent with the board on um anything really and uh I think that the town sits on a gold mine of affordable homes uh there's a lot of affordable homes here and uh I just I just think that this um bylaw is not ready yet um because I think it doesn't encourage both the subsidized housing and the small a affordable and my concern is that small a affordable housing over time will be diminished in the town of air so um I'm sorry that I don't support this uh bylaw change at this time make a brief comment uh I appreciate that you're willing to descent and I think it would be a great tragedy if we all felt thought the same way so thank you any further any other discussion I guess I just would comment that uh this has been about what been almost a Year's work of work between the working group and well fall last fall town meeting I guess you and and the working group was made up of members of the affordable housing committee uh members of the community The Building Commissioner members of this board and there was there was a lot of discussion on each of these points of the ones we're going to discuss and Nathan was part of that as well so I thought it was a good uh conclusion that we bring it to this to the planning board at this point in time there was a lot of work put into it yes before and may I add something I appreciate your comment and one of the things I know about planning is it's constantly changing when you never get it right honestly but to be perfect would not get us where we need to go Commonwealth is breathing down our necks to get inclusionary zoning that people will take advantage of and we're kind of in a lock and we're kind of locked in a little bit right now and I hate to bend with the Wind but I think bending with the wind and getting inclusion area that looks better and more attractive to Developers for the short period of time gives us the opportunity to work on making a better making something that would work better for you honestly and that's just it's a step along the way I I hate the fact that there's 3,000 pages of zoning in Boston I don't want to get there for air but it's the way our system works yeah you're go go ahead no you go and then I want to open up for public comment but go ahead so Jeff reminded me of something and that I did want to mention so the proof is in the pudding the one of the problems we faced here was that the former section got no results we' never had an application for it I think that was brought up to us you know well in the past by the affordable housing committee and other people of the E office of Economic Development and whatnot so this is an attempt to at least get a St I'm hopeful that when we get that start that we can then get back to discussion that includes your thoughts as well but having no chance to get to the discussion I think this is a benefit getting us there So eventually we will always have a good discussion if we get a a proposal in front of us to talk about you know what the town's needs are and what we're going to do but having none in the past this at least may give us a chance to get started that's my thought on it and I'd like to open this up for public comment if any questions or comments from the public please do do you want to come on up thank you very much name address please I'm the Troublemaker Janet provus I'm at one Brena Court in air I'm also on the air affordable housing committee as uh Ken had mentioned before um one thing that I I do appreciate you know um Nathan's comments as well as everybody else's work um on this can did mention the inclusionary housing uh bylaw that was created I gather it started even before 7 years ago but 7 years ago after the master plan you know you got the first rendition no one jumped at it so with this gives us a stepping stone to get to something that I want to see I mean I think being on the affordable housing committee we want to get more affordable housing in the town for sure but one thing I did want to bring up is that in this past seven years there's been a lot accomplished for affordable housing and amazingly so even with all the houses that have been built that are the you know extreme uh limits but the housing affordable housing committee was created in that we created a housing production plan with that we also created and um started the Housing Trust the um affordable housing trust that trust gets funding from the CPA fund and with that there are limitations to that fund because it has to go through the CPA guidelines in those guidelines um I can say they're there're is more restricted with this new update to the inclusionary housing there is a in lie of building those on-site or off-site you know um um dwelling units a certain percentage of what those new houses which are people you know I mean developers are are building that we're going to be able to take advantage of what they are building and take a piece of that pie and they're going to be able to give back to the town if they don't want to give an affordable house you know affordable unit that those funds and L funds are going to go into that trust that trust now has the ability to quickly act on any type of property that they'll be able to purchase to keep it as being affordable so if you can't beat them join them you know that's the way I'm looking at it of you can't control the market you know the market price if we don't have enough houses in here it's going to say okay hey we can get whatever we want because we've got the only house that's available this way here if that is the case we're going to be able to get a certain percentage of that and I think that that's what is good about this inclusionary housing bylaw changes other than the other changes that allow more um density bonuses and everything else so with that um I want to say that the affordable housing committee definitely um agrees with you know what's going on here and such and I want to say thank you too to the working group that working group again we've got a lot of volunteers working on these you know these um options and listening to everybody you know of what they're going ahead and saying and as Ken mentioned we are starting to look once this one moves forward we are going to start looking at something called smaller homes all right I'm not going to use the word tiny it's it's going to be a smaller home and possibly C Cottage cottage style homes um and you know with that um to to open up other opportunities for just a smaller you know Cottage tile so that they have a development that new homeowners could be able to come in and as well as people who want a downsize so I think we're going in the right direction so I wanted to let you know that I do appreciate it and thank you you know very much for the feedbacks all right thank you Janet okay you're welcome thank you would say one more thing While Janet is here um back in The Spectator in March of 2024 there was this comic there that says um an alien lands on Earth and says forget your leader just take me to your civil servants so I want to say I appreciate the work you're doing well guess say got good team members to go ahead and and help do everything you know that we're trying to get accomplished and like I said in seven years I don't think the any government you know has moved forward as much as we have so I think that that's awesome so so thank you for all your work great I do believe we have a motion in a second yeah I can I just I'm going to add a comment to what Janet has to say on October 7th at 6:15 p.m. there'll be a presentation to the affordable housing trust affordable housing committee about Cotter style housing that is similar to what's being built in devans right now I just ask you all it's hybrid tune in that was on my list to talk to everyone as well you can say it again you can say it again no good okay all right sorry can you repeat the details October October 7 6:15 and and where is here in this room it'll also be on Zoom it'll be zoomed all right and and the discussion just so that everyone knows it's it it'll be about um small homes and a bylaw like that and how it works okay yeah all right anything else thank you Mr chair for your Indulgence you got it Ken how do you vote hi trully yes Nathan no Jeff hi and the chair votes I thank you everybody thank you appreciate all your work o I meant to hit delete never mind I sent you an email you'll see what it is and then next one is the mod right yep and will you set us up on that as well yes I will send it in our packet here somewhere nope it was not I more papers that's it's okay I'm actually enjoying doing this to Hon oh thank you want she's got right I just sent you probably don't take action thank you J it's been me for years all right so where are we with this so the next one is MBTA multif family overlay District so on this one I I just provided a clean version cuz there were only really a couple of things that uh came out of our last meeting and there were just Town Council comments um so uh under page oh this one doesn't have pages so on page two uh g off street parking um so originally we had um there was that weird uh break up in the words oh yes that's right so um that was so I said uh we're out part practical practicable is that the right word practicable yeah practicable practicable prac um that was that was added in from Town Council mhm uh surface parking shall be located to the rear or side of the uh principal building I don't know that's keep going of the principal building and sh not be located this is where it was somehow it entered to another line and we weren't sure what was going on so it was just that they had to get recombined located within the minimum setback between building and um any lot line adjacent to the street or internal access Drive no surface parking shall be located between the front building line of a residential building or and the front lot line um and then the next can't park in front of the building yeah no we don't allow that under our bylaw anyways whether or not we do it in practice is something totally different yeah our bylaw doesn't allow that I just um and so that's why uh so under Section 9.1 though that's where that also falls in MH um where and then the added we practicable structured parking in a separate parking garage shall be located at least 20 ft behind the front building line of the multif family dwell on lot on lot if you don't mind it's the line of the front of the building at least 20 ft back from there not the line of the rear of the building plus 20 ft correct okay and may I ask another question please excuse me Mr chair is it the purview of the planning board to I don't know if it's a waiver or if it's an acceptance of no parking in the project on the property no So based on how our um the calculations are right now um we are at at least one one parking space per unit thank you per residential unit yes thank you yeah yeah cuz commercial and res and those will have its own calculation based on right of note though the eohc guidelines says that the um you can't require any commercial so this is um for residential yeah so this is a mixed use if it's mixed that also eliminates our ability to have any commercial parking I would have to ask Town Council that's why I don't I don't refer to any commercial parking in here I know I know but in the eohc guidelines it does say that you can't have you can't require parking for commercial commercial we don't know yeah we're not requiring them on here not in the not in the residential but we don't require it now don't yeah we um now we have no what's the flip in town if you're in if you're in downtown if this District if you're in downtown there's no required par there's no required parking yeah correct but there is for residential but not there is for residential but not for parking we kind of have that now yeah in form based code in the form based code correct okay I thought we were requiring some parking for the DMG application it's a res residential that's a residential but the the commercial side didn't require any technically not I don't no Tech U well it did because of the restaurant use they did because of the restaurant put a restaurant in that requir because you can't there was no way they would have been able to based So based on calculations of how under the form based code if you have a restaurant there's no way you're going to provide you're not you're not going to have on street parking so that's why they hading for it yeah I would just check with the eohc guidelines yeah so this has to we have to follow the guidelines that's what it that's what um number one says uh on the purposes we have to follow the guidelines that's set set forth in the the zoning act um Town Council has reviewed this so we're good that's why um and we're not requiring any commercial so remember this will also fall under an modd not under the form based code so it'll have its own set of rules and these are the rules so in this section if you apply under the mod you would not be required to for the commercial right yeah was there I'm an agreement with you is there an edit under I yes so under I sorry um no special permits required if I remember yes um we had to remove language about special permits because perm just want to so the uses subject may not be denied or no and no special permit is required for us zoning doesn't want special permits anywhere in it I got it thank you the other one was uh number seven we struck there was some additional wording that was in the lighting outdoor it was uh must would comply with site plan regulations that was stricken um the under number 10 storm water this is where we added in where um to the extent practicable um uh no it says under a so to the maximum extent practicable by the way just back on I lowercase D on developments yes it hasn't developed yet yes lowercase D I'm sorry um and that was the only other com the next I'm sorry if you don't turn the page top of the page there looks to be a line next to storm water management the air yes that was a question from her um but that one so that was basically like um she just wanted to make sure that these these ones are the ones that complied with whether it complied with with our regulations and stuff and so those were the ones that I put in so um section 9.6 is the land clearing section 9.7 is Earth removal so those are some uh so Earth removal is typically a special permit but it's not under this it's just that they have to meet the requirements may may I ask a question about that because Earth removal is something that's actually overseen by the board of Selectmen in our town it's under their purview it's if you're of a certain size isn't it yeah yeah just you you may not be aware of that Danny but that's one of those weird Tweaky things that still exists if you take it out of town and stuff yeah it's you can't you can't strip a property and take the top soil away is what they're making sure they can't they that's what they're making General bylaws yeah it's not in the zoning bylaw oh it's not 9 no it's a general bylaw have that too but they another section of and I don't I'll pull it up I'll pull it up for us because under the Earth removal it doesn't that's where I guess you're right it doesn't say on that no and this is a strin this is a I would say this is an Antiquated way that towns were handling many years ago we used to have a um Straton Hill used to be a pit okay all right so you couldn't remove you couldn't remove without permission of the town okay um I don't know it would be applicable at this point I yeah I don't I mean I mean it really has to be a large project technically it doesn't matter if it's a special permit through the board of the select board cuz it's a special permit so it doesn't matter what I want is them to make sure they just meet the 9 section 9.7 section which has what the requirements are for 9. for Earth removal so it's not a special permit they don't have to go to the select board the planning board would would be the Authority Under This section but would review all the same information it just they're not issuing a special permit okay go what I don't think it's in cont it's not it's not it's just so you know yep okay sorry but what was that are we in this second to the last page where are yes yeah yeah yeah um so it says that this is section 8.7 I can't believe I knew that yes this will be 8.7 so our the um overlay distri our other overlay districts which is section8 it's all of our overlay District that's seventh overlay District yes this will be our seven thank you y and it's okay to approve this even though we haven't written the multif family overlay District rules and regulations yet yes so I did ask if so the rules and regulations are something that we don't have to have but we will have so we will have that the board will have a public hearing on when this is approved we will then write them yes correct okay correct you probably get the rules after you get the bylaw okay yes so it's it'll be similar to our site plan rules and regulations a lot of the same things that are in there I'm going to just transfer over and it's basically the process the application and all that stuff beautiful this is the foundation upon which the structure is built um and then that was really it for comments yeah and that's it all right and this has been two Town Council y great all of the documents that were revised were sent over to Town Council last Tuesday no two Tuesdays ago are you going to ask for discussion and stuff or to make a motion yeah let's move that the air planning board recommend for approval at the special fall time meeting the MBTA multif family overlay district has presented beautiful got it motion any second seconded thank you Julie discussion yes sir go ahead um again I don't like to dissent um however I did some research on this and I just have a couple 80 Seconds of your time um I'm sympathetic as I talked with um some of you that with the State's aim to increase housing especially affordable housing and to reduce regulatory obstacles to development and I desire to support those goals however um the proposed mobd bylaw reaches outside the half mile radius to include the West Air Village form base code um I think this unnecessarily erodes air self-government over local matters C masters's Constitution but also disproportionately places compliance on just the form based code districts um there are 200 developable Acres within the half mile radius of the air MBTA station this is four times the minimum 50 acre uh requirement uh that stretches from the West Main um railroad overpass uh North on Park Street to the to the power station we just talked about to the bend and Washington Street um all of Highland Avenue uh actually all the way to the edge of the new Fields project uh 2/3 of Central Avenue down down the mut uh East including the 41 East Main Street Taff property and then South BL Street and prony Park this is this is a large large area that uh the MBTA Community uh encompasses um in there the districts included are gr GB A2 and mut um but West a village is not in that half mile um radius the eohc guidelines 5.d permits two or more districts to accumulatively meet section 3a's requirements uh in 4A so I'm I'm puzzled uh why is the burden of compliance placed only on the form-based code districts um and not on the included gr GBA A2 and mut um this this inequality is my concern uh I don't think that air should give up restrictions on the West Air Village um when there is room inside the half mile radius to uh to put this overlay I think that all multif family districts in the half mile radius should share in the MBTA Community requirements um and because I live I live in that half mile I live in the general residence District um I don't think it's right for my neighborhood to escape the um MBTA Community requirements so can I just uh explain why uh so um the form based code um meets the uh the requirements of what the MBTA overl the MBTA district has to be which is 15 units per acre so the other zoning districts don't meet those so for us to meet to to be to allow it within those other zones we'd have to make very large zoning changes to our bylaw to every one of those zones to allow it to meet that 15 units per acre um and there's hold on and um that's really the biggest hurdle is to try to meet the 15 units per acre for base code already meets that so what we the way we intended it was we would have um and the reason that the West era Village is in it is like you said you're allowed to have two more than multiple districts so the down 40 % at a minimum of 40% which is our downtown air um the form base code you're under the 250 yep and then uh the West Air is the additional that we need um those already meet it everything that is required within it so the easiest process for us to do it is to have those two as the the subd districts where these overlay would just would be on top of so it really doesn't change those districts at all it just adds an additional layer over it which allows the applicant to submit either under the form base code or the mod so it's not removing anything or adding additional to the form base code it's just an overlay District I know it's it's so it's kind of it's a little bit confusing in in how you um explain it but the form based code is the underlying District it'll still exist people can still apply under that the mod will be an overlay District that is separate process separate application um and separate requirements that people will apply to only for multifam and mixed use so if you have um so if you have just a commercial project you're only going to apply under the form based code you're not going to apply under the MOG so so or a mixed use or a mixed use prescribe a mixed prescribe use so that was our reason ings behind why and uh we went through mrpc had them check you know there's a very large template that they go through checking which zones meet it which ones don't yeah I think what you're doing is legal I just think that it's um there's inequality in how it's being applied and so and I I I don't understand the difficulty of applying it to gr GB H so that's the difficulty is we so we have to buy yeah so by the end of this year you can't get the density the 15 the 15 units per acre yeah yeah so there'd be multiple things we'd have to change is is within our bylaw we have density under sight plan review for certain uh uh you know calculations under the form based code that's the only one outside of all of our other zones where it doesn't have that so that's why our 15 units per acre we were met if we had to do it in the other zones we would have to change our bylaw under s plan review we'd have to change the zones uh our zoning map under that we'd have to change more under site plan um regulations there's there's a there's a cascading effect of changes that would be that would have to happen before the end of this year and I'm not and and just and I'm not in a um it's good in a position well good we're good we're it if I can remind you when the NBTA zoning came out two communities were perceived to have already passed and made the grave right there was a court case that happened with a town east of us and that court case changed brought about another wrinkle yeah so we went from being um provisionally provisionally approved to he ain't going to make that's yeah which is unfortunate that is frustrating it is frustrating so the and if you flip the coin over and look at what the impact on us is and I really do believe this is an important piece to have in the presentation is the amount of grant funding we would not get West Main Street we wouldn't get it okay yeah serous so that's important to people I just wanted yeah well that grant money is huge and and believe it or not all right I'm going to take the medicine and move on like I said earlier it's an iterative process is there someone on Zoom no they they left they left yeah Alicia was on okay no never mind Janet did you have any comments to make no I'm Trine is there any further discussion no hearing none Jeff how you vote I Nathan no uh Julie yes Ken yes chair votes I thank you everybody that was a lot of work on us to um Z map Z so that fast yeah so um nothing changed on those two so we can vote on those separately all right let's do it um which one do you want to do first let's do with the Z let's go with the the definitions all right um I make a motion that we recommend the definitions as described uh in our in our agenda uh for affordable housing and air affordable housing Trust uh okay any further discussion I have a question if you look in section if um let me pull let me pull this up I'll point it right to you since we're being this is what I just sent to you Jonathan I'm really sorry but I need to let my dogs out and you don't need me so I really have to go good night Kathleen it was good to see you sorry no hey good night cine um now we know who let the dogs out that musical question's been answered um number two the paragraph two the trust approved at approved at we we have duplicate wording again last night so you're right I did make a change that was sent over to Town Council removing that the appr I just wanted to make sure I just sent that to you high that would that was actually removed in the revision to sent to be happy okay great I I just was specifically talking about the fall and spring one y uh any further discussion hearing none Ken yes Julie yes Nathan hi Jeff I your votes I and then the final thing zoning map what what what is what does that look like just it shows the um I can pull it up right here it just shows the uh overlay the overlay District so we just need to to motion to recommend the uh Amendment yeah go ahead move to recommend the move to recommend the amended zoning map that illustrates the overlay District should the bylaw be approved be approved great we have a motion do we have a second second any further discussion hearing none Ken so that's not the revised map that's the map that's up there now right this is the m overlay District yeah yeah it's not shown in the overlay districts yes it do my era so there's six overlay districts but we only need to highlight four of them seven yeah uh uh flood plane overlay district is not showing on there um because it's it's it's a it's a FEMA map okay um and um Aqua for protection we added that I think that's up there um all right cool thank you yeah yeah it's getting to the point where we can't see the map underneath that cross matching all right that's further discussions no Ken I Julie yes Nathan no Jeff I chair votes I thank you right we're now to close the public hearing oh I need a motion to close the public hearing so moved second any discussion hearing none Ken I Julie yes Nathan I Jeff I the chair votes all project ass updates um if if it um if anyone knows but there is going to be a ribbon cutting for the Newton Street project behind us I know it's not a real a project that planning board has been involved in but there's going to be a ribbon cutting Friday at 11: I believe it is um also I've had discussions with Jonathan um for October 8th we will be having um uh what are their names Pat and oh Pat and Ron yes Pat and Ron from New England real EST to talk about give us I asked them to give give us their perspective on residential real estate where it is in air and where it's going what date again uh that is October 8th at our Tuesday meeting so I'm very excited they're both it's on our meeting they're both enthusiastic about it and if you know Ron and Pat as we many of us do they're well informed they often have interesting things to say so I'm looking forward to that very much yep um as and then did mention at octo on October 7th they uh there will be a joint meeting of the affordable housing trust and the affordable housing committee um for with a presentation on the um uh small cottage um bylaw and uh wanted to open this up to have the board attend as well um if if we're going to have because we will already have two members if we have one more additional I will need to have a uh post an agenda for that so I just need to know if if anyone else will be attending and if I may give you a little more information and I'll send an email out about it I have it you have the information on yes okay it's a good program I have it too I haven't a chance to look at it I was doing my best today to get the word out if you can send that to me and I'll send it out to everyone else who may not have it you already got it D you earlier oh okay J exactly okay that okay okay great okay um so yes and so we will have and I just need to know if so if you'll be there okay so I'll post an agenda it'll be agenda it'll be a way that those two days actually okay so you're not going to be at any of October meetings the first one's up the second one will be at but not oh okay okay the seventh or the eth okay won't be there on the eth okay won't be there on the seventh we won't be there on the seventh okay so we don't so we'll have not Straton Hill which is no until 2 22nd I just want are you going to attend this let me know I think so I just need to know by um cuz I have in person can I tend by Zoom just post it anyway yeah you can attend by Zoom yep I just need to know the latest by THS Thursday October 3rd yeah I think I will so y it'll be on Zoom so you don't have to actually be there in person okay great um then the other item I wanted to bring up was on October 22nd the uh Fields will be coming in for an informal meeting to give you guys a quick presentation we had a meeting um when was it Thursday yes Thursday Thursday um we had a meeting with them they showed us a preliminary plan looks very nice I think the board will be very happy with it especially with what they're proposing how much open space possible Trails uh connections so there's just and just remind us where that property is so this is I can show you on the plan um it is right in this right here right it's the old um it's it's right behind the MOBA um U south of south of the original Hospital in town the first hospital that the assistant living the assistant living parit the first hospital closed in town yep so it'll be it's um that it's about I forget how many acres it is but it's it's a big big parcel um and if I may this came this was in front of the planning board when I first joined oh my God yes Emily's way right yeah emre that's what it was called it was Emily's way but they bought the HUD properties and they're combining it that was the they they were bringing it to us without being without actually being in control talk about it then yeah talk about so that's coming on October 2 second for an informal meeting it'll just be under the first item is under General dis uh General business great so uh we don't have any meeting minutes to discuss tonight but we do have to discuss a volunteer to represent the planning board on a special working group or subcommittee regarding the select board um designated a working group for 71 Sandy Pawn Road um I am on it and I need a planning board member on it um I'm vocally upset at the amount of times the planning board is asked to serve on many many many boards and I think at some point the town and I'm voicing my descent often but I I would like it said back that I understand why it's important but I think at some point it's getting ridiculous yes thank you I understand that I appreciate the projects I appreciate what we're doing but we need to stop saying a board member here needs to be in but anyone's welcome to step up I'm not saying that but so I take it you're not interested I'm interested I'm very interested but I'm also on we're not judging you if the town would stop asking us to represent all other boards I love this one cuz it's close to my house and I would love Yeah cuz it's close to your house yeah but unfortunately they've already asked me too many times and it's interesting without the emotion I will say the similar thing the planning board is often tagged similarly the select board is also tagged to take on multiple responsibilities in their terms and it's often done um without realizing what it is we all do I mean I can so so I'm going to make this simple uh my the storm War utility group is is about is going to is going to come to an end so I'm going to have the time I'll do it period we're done thank you you well I nominate the Jonathan CR as the representative of the planning board to the 71 c p Road building committee third any further discussion hearing none I all in favor thank you John was my way of saying thank you can I volunteer to be on a trial of the new technology version of this or is that going to mess you up on Counting do we just want to have a quick conversation so here's way I feel about this wait a minute okay this wasn't on the agenda right on the agenda we discussed it at the agenda no actual business here I have no problem with uh the applicate anything that's an ordinarily an 8 by10 fine memos Etc descriptions not acceptable for the site plans I I need to see those on paper so when it comes to site plans that is not an issue for me it's all the other stuff I came down with my hands full on like this and so what but could I just try how how you going to all those documents just so that you understand once I'm done passing these out where does this go in the trash exactly so what I no it's not it doesn't just because it used to be the process doesn't mean it is I just want to volunteer to trial the process myself me just me I am asking that I remove myself on a trial basis to try it out of my Conservation Commission only three members get actual packets the other two use their tablets they don't get anything in chelsford I also only have a iPad I'm going to make a comment I religiously print everything out me too I opened up the zero Scully and it was 89 pages long and you know what I didn't I took that do that long one of them popped up as 89 Pages that's tell you what do we want to do the the the no I know the national grd the national National gr response letter yeah yeah I'm not printing it out so I took the time to go through it and I actually found myself able to do a good job on it and so I do this I mean I look at all the stuff before the meeting electronically that's up on the board and you send you send us yeah but when I get to the meeting it's I find it handy to look at the stuff like we did because we're scratching and changing right there so I understand that yep there's a physical part to it yeah but I can also I read everything before I get here yeah I just I really want to reduce how much paper I'm printing out and how much uh is being cuz it well I think we have for those of us none of us have seen have you got a set of Straton Hill plans yet I'm saying for those of us that are comfortable Friday if you got a set of the original the the revised Straton Hill plans oh from the meaning from like in December any of us got so there you go you have PDF ones I know that but we never even got a set of plans yet for that I have we got the electronic version I'm not asking for a discussion I'm just asking that I say yes and I would like to tral it I it's open to each person's needs but when we get to the per online permitting it's going to be no paper unless you request it just so everyone know except for the plans except for the plans yes yeah because I can't read those yeah yeah no no that that I understand the plans but everything else is going to be online once we get to that thank you and we're in the process of starting I actually found myself using a headlight on fullsize plans the other day I had left do we need anything else tonight yeah I think you think we're good motion to ajour so mov good night everyone you did a great job thank you Nathan thank you and U thank you Barry thank you Barry yes