##VIDEO ID:GJbq-XHwTTw## I will call to order are we recording already yeah okay I will call to order the rate review committee meeting today is Tuesday October 15 2024 the meeting of the air rate Review Committee will be held in person at the location provided on this notice members of the public are welcome to attend this in-person meeting please note that while an option for remote attendance Andor participation via Zoom is being provided as a courtesy to the public the meeting hearing will not be suspended or terminated if technological problems interrupt the virtual broadcast unless otherwise required by law members of the public with particular interest in the specific item on this agenda should make plans for inperson versus virtual attendance accordingly this meeting will be live on Zoom the public May access the proceedings by joining Zoom meeting ID number 828 8571 8742 or by calling 92925 6099 for additional information about remote participation please contact Carly antonellis assistant Town manager at ATM a.m. us or 978 77282 to0 extension 100 prior to the meeting okay that I will call us to order are there any amendments to the agenda no okay all right somebody uh okay do we have never mind um has everyone had a chance to review the meeting minutes from October 1st yes anything motion minutes okay any second second right all those in favor M chair says I the meeting minutes from October 1st are approved okay so now we're on to the big stuff we're going to review discuss and recommend and vote for the 2025 calendar year transfer State station rate recommendations good I had I was trying to read something earlier and there was three p's and it took me three tries and it was like P cell she shells this morning great so um okay so where we last left off um we were trying to figure out as far as do we want to um raise rates keep the rates what are we doing what was what did we where we going Dan yeah okay so through you madam chair um I did prepare a memo and sent that to Robert and Barbara and I went over it with Barbara she couldn't be here this evening but in there you'll see um on the first page I I ran additional scenarios rate scenarios in the model and the ones I ran are the three bottom ones in the in the table which increase the senior permit five and the second permit five and it shows what that would generate and then increasing the senior permit 5 and the second permit 10 or increasing the regular five senior 10 and second 10 and showing kind of what those generate um so those are the additions um based on our last meeting of what we potentially wanted to look at U for scarios um and then on the second page of my memo I just put in there a little discussion of of um of my own for the for I guess direct Robert and barbar but for the committee um you know indicating about the bulk items but we're getting approximately $10,000 annually in revenue from those you know it's hard to quantify exact amount but that's that's where I'm landing in that vicinity um and then our recent rate increases regular sticker was in 2023 was increased $1 to $105 the senior sticker 2020 went up $5 from 55 to 60 the second sticker 2019 from 20 to 30 and then obviously the bag the bag prices in 2022 with the last change for those so I went over this with Barber and you know in my opinion we get that so you account for that $10,000 from the bulk items then you you need about $3,116 out of the rate out of out of the rates out of the uh permit stickers and the um pay bag um Revenue so you know we could consider the committee could consider looking at that scenario where we increase the senior permit five and second permit five and the reason I I like that it's been a while since that's been done and you know if we don't increase rates now are we going to end up in a scenario in the future where we have to do significant increases I know that's happened with like why watered one year years ago where we didn't increase the r i wasn't part of it then you know do you get hit by something like that but um so you know I think it should be possibly considered to do that um $3,000 that's you know not a lot of money so um you know I'm definitely open to to what what the committee would like to do um and then in my last paragraph It's kind of not really focused so much on the rates for the uh for the vote tonight but more on um in the future looking at the subsidy a little closer barbar and I doing that um as we prepare as the FY 26 budget's prepared um and in comparing to other towns seeing where we're at and what we might want to consider um and also noting that the the transfer station so the operating hours so the associated labor costs with that um the collective bargaining agreement as we mentioned the previous meeting is is expiring at the end of this fiscal year so a new one would be in effect in FY 26 and that's going to be part of the bargaining agreement there um as we're looking at changing potentially changing hours to the station and reducing costs so that would impact fway 26 but but that was a summary of what I put together in my initial thoughts um but I'm pretty open right now so if we do nothing based on this uh what you just said then we're only looking at having a $3,000 short fold yes um so right it's not much right and are we keeping an eye currently on the um the overtime as far as you know overtime is only when needed right so that that's also down cost right yeah so those are those line items pretty much fixed in the budget um the only thing that you know could be a CH like the hall the waste hauling should be similar the recycling you know the Commodities Market has been pretty even the last several years and that's what we budgeted for so assuming that stays the same we wouldn't get any surprise hits unless there was another surprise but but I think you know we should finish within budget we typically do um you know with a little bit of surplus so 3,000 that's probably something that could be absorbed in this year's budget there was no surprises right yeah just be fair how often do we have surprises when it regards regarding the transfer station not since I haven't had any really since I've been yeah so so what I'm saying is that you know the odds are in our favor yeah yeah do through the chair I'm sorry what is wrong with you because the year the year we didn't raise the water rates when P that's what we're now and I'm going to point to this meeting um yeah Madam chair and I appreciate the DPW uh director putting together all of the scenarios so thank you Dan and all of this work um my two cents is where we're at $3,116 it's been a year I think we could keep things the same um this would be it I believe that between the director and I on the operational and there'll be the savings as you alluded to whether it's the overtime and other part also the subsidy I mean at $3,116 could could absorb that I think without you know negligible impact if you would even see that and then um and is brought up um by others you know the town's historic trend on free cash each year which all things being equal that Trend looks to be consistent you know for this year moving forward I mean if there's been a year and I just want to stress this because we do it on a year-by-year basis it was a year I think that you could keep um everything stable this would be it I mean we already I think are in agreement that raising the bad is in nobody's interest at this point that was just done and there heartache on that and um we did the regular permit in 2023 um senior this last year yeah the senior in 2020 and the second sticker um so that's my two cents I think um we could if there was a year this would be it to just keep everything stable I mean I think we I would like to see especially you know the the regular sticker not be increased because we did just increase it last year and as I've said before we're recre increasing everything every year something's wrong you know it means we've looked at something wrong you know um that being said if we decide to make the recommendation to not raise any rate I do think it's important that we at least you know let people know that you know hey especially regarding like the senior sec senior sticker and second sticker I also bit my tongue today so it's hard to talk um that next year there could be an increase you know just to kind of give a heads up to people um I mean if if we're looking at just $3,000 you can't absorb $3,000 I think it does also goes to the argument C was making and and we got an email on it about you know if if um the hour change reduces the labor costs in FY 26 you know if we raise rates now then maybe we don't have to next year we can just get by this year and next year you know we were the you know budget's a little bit lower well I make the argument that we could even keep the hours uh way they currently are and just everybody working eight hour days that too yeah you know there there's your problem things around there's your problem that that overtime was never supposed to be yeah I get it every week um there there in lies the problem um if we just did that that's a big savings too and then you know we have a win-win on the hours with everybody too um so that's something to keep our eyes on and everything how does anybody else yes just one question through the chair the various um hauling contracts and so forth how long have they they good for we're in the second year of three years years so it would be good for the rest of this year and next year okay yeah so next year when we go to look at this stuff we'll we'll be looking at that negotiations and how it'll impact so that is real data as far as you know if we have to make any increases to say this is why we're making the increases because this calling cont contract changed and it impacted it in this way um I mean I think that if you're going to have a rate increase those are something that you know person can at least wrap their header in not just you know there was overtime um you know what I'm saying because that's substantial because then you're looking at a contract that you know somebody had to negotiate with somebody outside um and there's your real impact so that would be real data for us next year versus what we currently have at this particular minute you know yeah yeah so we've had I believe we've had a significant increase in the number of households over the last few years so I would think the volume's gone as far as what we no they don't want the transfer station maybe meaning new people that move into town and whatnot they're no they really don't it it's kind of a cultural thing okay and it it would appear that The Closer you live to the transfer station the more benefit there is to get into it you know if you're if you're living out towards Devin Crest nobody wants to drive that far especially if they have a car and they've got the trash in the car if they got a truck then it doesn't bother them so much okay um but you know so you know people don't necessarily see they're they're paying for the convenience ironic then they complain about how much it costs it's like you could save a little money if you use a transfer station so um yeah well I just wanted yeah so but yeah it would be nice to see kind of a cultural shift yeah you know well I think that would be a justification for pric is go up if your your volume's going up your costs go up right I mean right yeah that's the bottom line yeah okay thanks did you were you your hand earlier okay two comments um Robert youor Dan so um what's our retained earnings approximately for um transfer station meeting with Barbara the other day she mentioned around 128,000 okay so we have so let's use that as our that's again as as Barbara always has up audited which is 2023 yeah so and the 36 our retained earnings that we're going to use is going to come from that yep okay it would y right and um so the extra 3,000 is going to come either from the subsidy we would or from retained earnings so we've got two possible place places again with your idea of no increase we've got a fund 3,000 it can actually come from the subsidy and or from retained earnings it would it would just be a not spending as much in within our budget of the 4 25 at this time that's what it because we're already using all the subsidy all the retained earnings as we look at what to do for the rat for the bags and stickers oh cool so basically and we're in fy2 we're going to sell all the stickers and FY 25 they go to revenue for that gotta how do it go with our budget expenses okay because I'm I'm I'm leaning towards the no increase um and what I'm thinking is this would be a great opportunity for us to make a communication to uh the town and I made just a quick note um again somebody already said this is the let you know hey no raise this year favorable we had a consultant did a report it was a very good report um so we're doing a good job um throw a shout out to the staff in there you know Anthony Frank and whoever else is you know again we have couple bull points in this communication just to sort of pump up and um and then two things I would put in there is remember bulk stickers because we make sure people are getting the bulk sticker and not sneaking in a the microwave here or there and stuff I mean we should make I think they actually noticed that it's the reason I mentioned that standing up there I did take a microwave there the other and I asked and I have to still go buy the bulk sticker yeah so but again combin well there two I have to mess up so I didn't know you needed a b sticker for a lot of the things so I confessed it did all okay so we'll be writing you to a bill all right thank you very much that's that's uh it's not 36 but it's we're getting there I think we I think we might have counted for 16 29 we're gonna Whittle this down they're gonna Whittle this down yeah I gotta go get my bulk stickers I get that TV out of the house though I haven't gone yet to go get it so I again I'm just echoing someone mentioned earlier should definitely shout this out to the T this no increase well yeah so that would be our recom so it looks like that we're talking about our recommendation and of course the public hearing before the before the would be before the select board seriously I today really hurts um and then um you know we can put out like a one page of going hey we didn't raise any rates this is what you we feel your average you know monthly how much you're spending on the transfer station um and uh see you next year you know um and because next year I mean you know with the contracts and things like that that that'll even the Union contract uh you know will have some type of an impact um so you know we'll have more meat and you know so next year next year could be an increase you know but you know we mentioned the subsidy and we we don't tend to go over 1% in fact we're usually just under 1% of the Town budget not including the school okay because we don't count them okay um I don't think we need to go any higher than that but I do think that maybe for the sub for I'm not not the subsidy the um thank you very much thank you very much uh that we should maybe look at Di diing into that just a little bit more um especially for next year depending on how these other contracts how they lay out could impact um so as we're building the FY 26 budget we did what 36,000 for this year I'm just throwing out a number for an example what if we did 46 and how could that help impact them you know D question is there any guideline as to what routine earnings should be relative to the budget overall um not really for you know for our water and our sewer Enterprise there's pretty good industry practices but for the transfer station as an Enterprise fund no there's no there's no statutory Benchmark or guidance yeah no so I mean yeah right I mean you want to it's always good to have it for a rainy day or to less the impact of the rates that yeah but we don't really have a guideline no but I think that those are things that you know we should look at as far as before you know we go to spr toown meeting uh when we're looking at you know as far as retained earnings is to yeah you know maybe bumping that up a little bit because we don't tend to but maybe this time we should because we could just Playing devil's advocate here we could be looking at you know significant changes next year with these new contract you know um so that could help soften the blow yeah may I check I'm kind of ser as long as it's the negative I'm kind of thinking out loud um so if I'm understanding correctly rained earnings is already spent a subsidy is already spent in order to save this $3,000 $3,116 we need to cut spending in this FAL year that correct yeah okay yeah do we have an Avenue for even um cutting that amount other than I mean stopping the overtime or I I just don't necessarily see I think I feel like it's a pretty tight budget to begin with I hate being Devil's Advocate Advocate but I would I would like to see it being solvent for the year and having the the senior and the second permit increased by $5 just to really make up that cost and we didn't increase any of the rates last year because of the study that we did so we're coming back well we raised the the the regular permit last year no that was fiscal year 2023 we didn't raise anything last year okay we got you know when we're writing this stuff in a memo could we say FY or calendar year no you're right yeah I mean from the hand of two meetings ago yeah it's been I apologize okay years ago we we did nothing yeah I I think that um I don't know where this $3,000 would come from otherwise it basically be me deferring things y 26 oh just like my our the transer station Enterprise budget so right if there was a service that we we didn't need but we wanted to do they could wait stuff like that and I mean like last year I did some work on this looking at it but um we have come in under budget you know I have a little bit of a cushion so is it something we could absorb most likely okay if we run into an issue I guess we have to go to retainer if something were to happen we have to go back to town meeting in the spring or for Reserve fund transfer if that were happen more retain thank you for that I miss I may have missed the meeting but how much over time will we pay right um an extra four hours a week yeah yeah but I think it estimates to be about eight grand yeah okay because of the way the contract was written so you have paragraph two Y and then you have paragraph three paragraph two says the right of first refusal okay paragraph three says overtime is as needed paragraph two was worded just so slightly different so that it it kind of came across it like you know I can have the overtime which I'm on record like when I read it because I signed it you know I approved it when I read it I I didn't read it that way because I read paragraph three and where I used to work that that's the way it lined up but not everybody you know sees it that way so it it caused inadvertent problem so we're we're fixing them um Jen um one other sort of pig backing off on your really good comments and um the other thing would be either cutting cost or I just made a note or we realize more Revenue too correct prob true right there's always the I mean I got a lot of stuff in my garage so I'm just going to use myself the bulk sort of half joking but mentioning permit the possibility right at it and two like the the recycling Commodities do they get good worse they get better they stable like that could fluctuate but you know the last couple years we're about 30 grand under budget each year and I think that was a result of the recycling Commodities being much lesser than anticipated in the years see2 actual you most years we do have a surplus at the end of The Year 3,000 there is a possibility that we will add to retain dur I me possibility that you know if we do have to do a reserve fund transfer it's $1,500 you know that it might not be the 3,000 of course tomorrow something could happen thank you we got to do a bigger [Laughter] amount I mean I mean you're right as far as you know we always got to think of those scenarios and everything like that um and that's why through the chair I mentioned earlier and as have others the average and this is not a given every year but the trend has been between one 1 million to two million on the high side um of free cash each year so for example if the shortfall were to occur of say 1,500 or the maximum of what we look what $3,000 um it could be transferred by an active town meeting um we' done before I mean it could be transferred from there so just so people understand that wouldn't be scrambling for $3,000 at the at the last minute we're very lucky we always have a very nice uh free cash cushion yeah um so and that's I mean it would ultimately be up to when I say the select board on the warrant and town meeting to decide I mean the sources whether it's a free cash stabilization we have a healthy Reserve so my takeaway is that if and that's assuming we even have the the shortfall this year it would be negligible could be correct no pressure robt watching that budget with a funny dud God it's GNA be 37 so how's everybody feel what what do you want to make as your recommendation to the board this official no we have to do a motion well we're not ready for a motion we are motion we leave the Raves the same as they are right now okay I second that all right any further discussion all those in favor of leaving all the rates the same hi hi hi chair says I all right rates will remain the same um that okay so now the scheduling of the public hearing the next meet not tonight the next meeting uh for the board will be Monday November 4th at 6:00 p.m. we cannot do that Tuesday du the election so we chose that Monday at 6m why are you SC no I'm trying to think if the election is fourth and the 5th the fifth yeah um so uh that's when the public hearing will be and the presentation will be made to the board and they'll G or name it they'll probably it never need it but I have to say that just case somebody's in [Laughter] move okay um all right so when shall we schedule our next meeting for because that's when we're going to start talking about water and sewer and depending on uh fall town meeting um oh yeah water thank you so through through the chair in terms of scheduling the next meeting where you where are you folks at in terms of water and sewer rates um not that I'm not putting you on the spot but I'm saying we obvious yeah we want to schedule the meeting to have a meaningful initial discussion um I haven't looked at the I'm still in the process of doing budgets so I'm haven't really looked at the water insur rates at this point um but what is reasonable amount of time yeah usually connect with Barber right yeah to connect with Barber when forgive me for not having this memorized but when do we start um operating budget so the directive will go out December 1st would everything do back um by December 29th I think this year okay yeah did you want to meet in December have at the next meeting in December I we usually kind of start doing it in December an initial um how about Tuesday December 3rd 4 o' I unfortunately am not available I'm sorry okay did you guys want to stick with Tuesdays did you want to pick another day Tuesdays all right you how about Tuesday December 10th that work for everybody December 10th okay and then I'm just going to inform you guys I will not be at Bown meeting I messed up my schedule won't be there sorry but hey I'm honest um May I bring up an additional uh something that I I noticed this past week um just on the on the website that um the rates for the water and sewer still link to fy4 okay okay let um I I came up in a conversation with somebody and they said what are the rates I said well I'll show you can go here and download them they were still at White more okay okay that it's I can send you but we didn't raise the rates on sh so would an FY 24 rate still be good he's talking about water and sewer though water sewer yeah Sor Sor sorry I missing GE okay could you send me the link when you get a chance and we'll get that fixed y thank you for bringing that out I'm wondering if the rates are correct but the heading is incorrect and saying 20 just 24 it could be the document is titled FY 24 and that the header says 24 but it's possible actually no it says effective July 1st 2023 okay changes voted 32723 okay I'll figure that all right yeah we'll clean that up this FY 2 yes plus I still I still want to go with the fedal year so it messes me up I'm the same way yeah okay then they are wrong yeah we'll fix that because they should be dated the document should be dated 24 because we would have approved Water and Sewer in like like March 24 so yeah it is it would still be yeah let's look at that yeah I'm just gonna send it to everybody all right anything else I'll take a motion to adjourn I will make a motion to Second all in favor CH says I we areour thank you very much