all and was put in writing I looked real quickly I did it welcome everyone to the land use board meeting of June 34 We Begin by standing anding our flag I pled algi flag the United States of America the it stands one nation God andice for pursuant to the New Jersey open public meetings act adequate notice of this meeting has been provided by posting on the bulletin board in the entrance hall of the Beach Haven municipal building and mailing the same to the beach Haven times and Asbury Park Press this meeting is a Judicial proceeding any questions or comments must be limited to issues that are relevant to what the board May legally consider in reaching a decision for each individual application decorum appropriate to a Judicial hearing must be maintained at all times roll call Mrs edles here Mrs Leonard here Mr Balo here Mr tinquist here Mr Stevens Mr Jenna here mayor Davis here Mr medal Mrs ball Miller here Mr lafredo here Mr Wanger here miss King here Mr Halperin here all right old business we have a resolution 204 20244 applicant seeking Rel and preliminary final site plan approval proposed impious coverage coverage is 83.6% 60 is allow uh the can you hear is it working okay uh resolution 20244 gaml Ley the applicant is seeking bulk variance relief in preliminary and final site plan approval proposed impervious lot coverage is 83.6% where 60 is allowed the applicant is also seeking a variance from the loading zone requirement as per section 22-14 G1 of the burrow code did everybody get a chance to go over the resolution are there any questions can I have a motion to approve the resolution 20244 motion to approve can you can do me a favor at the board members until I know every name say your name please Jerry Jenna Jerry Jenna motion to approve second Mrs Davis yes Mrs B Miller yes Mrs edles yes Mr Jenna yes Mr tinquist yes Mr Balo yes and Mr lafredo yes wait a minute Mr lafredo didn't vote on this application so he's not eligible to vote on the resolution okay Mr Wanger yes that's it right no Mr Halperin was here oh Mr Halperin yes resolution approved moving right along in between two garage doors with driveways on a 50 foot wide lot any questions anybody right can I have a motion to approve 20 24-5 five no moved thank you Nancy second second rck and Jenna Jenna mayor Davis yes Mrs edles yes Mr Jenna yes Mr tinquist yes Mr valo yes that's it that's it Mr Stevens is in here so that's all okay resolution approved all right moving right along to our public hearing portion we have application 20246 uh the Ship Bottom Brewery applicant seeking to add food distribution with offsite preparation Jim you're the man yes good evening James Ren on behalf of the applicant Ship Bottom Brewery so the ship botom Brewery was previously before the board originally in 2015 where they received approval for the the brewery space that they have and then there was an expansion of that space in 2017 and just at the beginning of this year Governor Murphy enacted legislation passed legislation that allows uh that loosen the regulations a little bit on these breweries that you see popping up all over the state so that law allowed outside food vendors to be able to come into these breweries and serve food you're not allowed to have have your own food in these breweries you can't have serve your own food or prepare your own food but you're allowed to bring vendors in or have food trucks things of that nature and at the time of the original approval those types of services were not allowed so when the uh approval was granted in 2015 there was language within the approval that approval that said there shall be no service of food and at that time it wasn't permitted by law but now that those rules have been relaxed the applicant is seeking to be able to bring outside vendors in to serve food um Mr zaro who's going to be providing testimony on behalf of the applicant submitted with the application um a layout that just shows the bar area and where the outside vendor would be located and Mr zaro will provide further testimony but the idea is that the vendor would set up in the area designated on the plan and if it were a local restaurant they would bring in their own food heat it up on sternos within the the brewery and then the customers could be given a menu which is permitted under the legislation that was passed and the people that are enjoying the brewery could also order off the menu from the food that's being served within the brewery and if the applicant did want to use a food truck or something like that there's no parking that's proposed to be utilized from Bay Village so I don't know if he would be able to use of a food truck in a public parking spot or not but for the purpose of bringing in from an outside vendor the applicant is not pro proposing to utilize any of the Bay Village parking correct me if I'm wrong yeah um so there's no proposed parking to be utilized from Bay Village so any of the vendors that are utilized would have to use the public parking with respect to bringing in the food or bringing out any materials Mr Raven well I don't mean to interrupt but we swear your your Mr zaro in but that'll be a condition of approval if the board uh grants this application that none of the vendors that sh botom will use can use the parking at Bay Village yes that's acceptable and that that's the overview um I before I bring up Mr zaro I do have some photographs that I'll Mark um it's a series of three photographs uh I don't know if you want me to mark them as one exhibit A1 it's a series of three photographs or if you want me to mark each one individually I have them stapled as a you have them stapled yeah why don't we do um 1 a 1 b 1 c 2 a 2 b 2 C that works I'll just do A1 A2 A3 oh that's fine I'm going to distribute these to the board so I'll have Mr zaro authenticate these but basically the three photographs that we're marking is exhibit A1 A2 and A3 are three separate photographs showing the interior of the brewery and I'll have Mr zaro describe them in more detail but this is the layout of the brewery that that encompasses the area that was included with the plan that that Mr zaro submitted with the application so this seating layout is how it is currently that wouldn't change except there would be a vendor in the corner serving food on the dates where there was Food Service um at this time I'll call Robert zaro okay swear Mr Z can you raise your right hand please do you swear air the testimony give before this board this evening will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes thank you Mr zaro the application is submitted under ship botom Brewery and you're an owner of that applicant and you're authorized to speak on behalf of the applicant yes I am okay um why don't you start just by giving actually before we get into the testimony let's have you authenticate the photographs if you could describe first what we've marked as exhibit A1 which is the first photograph what does that photograph depict uh this is looking out from uh the left side of our bar area uh through our tasting room so it's not actually the brewery this is a separate tasting where people come and enjoy our beers and and seltzers okay and this um when do you know when this Photograph was taken uh last week okay so this accurately depicts the current condition of the the tasting area yes sir okay and if we flip to exhibit A2 what does that photograph depict uh that's showing the front uh Windows um from the bar area looking out so those windows face toward the the West toward the bay yes exactly okay and those that photo also accurately depicts the current condition of the room yes sir okay and flipping to exhibit A3 it appears this is just a a photograph of the same area from a different Vantage Point facing toward the bar is that correct yes this is where the food vendor would be set up if it was allowed okay so the photograph is taking from the vantage point of where the food vendor would be set up yes sir okay is is there a spot on A3 that you could point to Mr zarker that shows where the food vendor the screen yeah that' be fine wait a minute take take the mic go back if you go back get on the mic because you want to make sure you get picked up okay yeah I think if we go to the first photograph because the third one is actually taking from taken from the vantage point of the vendor but A1 will be he'll be able to point where the vendor will be so if we could show the first photo Gina okay so if you see the TV um to the right of that there's a little piece of wood that's a piece of the old shack that was the duck Shack on the causeway right in front of there there would be a six foot table um where the food vendor would serve right here and do you want to show that on the the screen as well if you would mind Mr zaro back over so you're so you're pointing near that high top table that's all the way in the corner yes sir [Music] okay and if if you could just explain to the board what your overall idea is with with the food service how this would work we're not trying to be a restaurant we don't want to be a restaurant we specialize in beer we just want to give a different avenue for people to enjoy and have food if they're drinking um alcohol we want to get food in their bellies to be responsible um it just you know all other businesses are allowed to do this Brewery wise um I don't know if you're aware but we own two other locations in the state of Pennsylvania uh we partner with food trucks and food vendors all the time uh people love it it actually helps out local restaurants uh whoever we're using uh for the service will be licensed by the Ocean County Health Department um we want to try to use local uh restaurants in Beach Haven um to do this too so we want to partner with people that partner with us and the law that was passed does permit both food vendors and food trucks is it your plan to have any food trucks or just vendors uh no food trucks okay so it would just be vendors that set up inside in that area that you just described in exactly okay and it was discussed by me previously if you could just confirm that any of the vendors that are utilized will not use any of the parking on site at Bay Village no they will not okay and uh do what are the current hours of The Tasting Room uh currently for the summer they are uh noon to 10 pm every day okay and how many employees do you have typically uh in the bar area probably about four or five okay and is working out a time are the hours or number of employees going to change as a now this is a service that we're going to Outsource to a a licensed vendor to provide okay okay and it it may change as far as the the times that vendors are in there it'll basically be whenever you determine you want to schedule things exactly okay we won't have them all the time it'll be more in special occasions and and times where we don't have food options okay and there will be no food at all prepared within your space no we don't have uh the facilities to do that okay sure sure maybe I'm a little thick tonight clarify the vendors who they are where they're coming from are they the local restaurants it could be local restaurants we have talked to um Tuckers we have talked to Murphy's um different places to do things um doing oysters too you know Barn get oyster Collective so anybody local that's licensed by the health department so will it only be the local restaurants or will it be an outside third party also no just local restaurants we're just looking to make this easy and have some options you know chicken or the Egger one we talk to also but you don't want to necessarily be restricted as far as who you can utilize correct no okay I have a question sure John has a question I have a question if you're using local restaurants operationally how how will they come in and deliver the food be parking go in yeah and discharge the food and then come back okay you know how is that all work so we have a back entrance and then we also have an ADA lift so they could come up the lift um use that facility to do that um we actually have a forklift and loading dock so we could put stuff on pallets um if they were parking they would have to find a parking spot close by to unload their vehicle and then bring stuff out and then then move their vehicle as a follow question is there will to be any changes I noticed inside the I be wrong there there were like 11 tables 12 you're you're pretty close Prett yeah is there is there any change to the oy by having this no it's the same yeah yeah we're not looking at increase occupancy at all yeah no problem thanks John um just curious in the back area there will they be just sternos or do you need electricity so far away sorry uh in the back area there where you're going to set them up do they need electricity there's electricity back there plus they could use Sternos have hot plates I guess exactly and Sterno things and then um this is crazy but paper plates I guess yeah I mean you're gonna you're not start a whole washing dishes no no no it's GNA be paper plates you know plasic nice fing food exactly yeah just easy y okay again we're not looking to be a restaurant we're just looking to do something you know to help out oh I have a question sure this table's very close to an exit is it going to obstruct people from of course not no way yeah we'll make sure that there's a clearance for Ada to get through there and the other question which is I'm curious about is who assumes the liability if some food is bad uh they would have a COI so Certificate of Insurance so we would require that for them coming in so they would if something is wrong does the health department have to come in and improve this food or coming in no mm now this is something that's common with all the breweries they basically just could do it I haven't heard of anybody going through Township or burrow approval on these things and my other locations we never had to so are there going to be waitresses in your business no to order the food no no people will come up to the table they'll be a POS system where they would take the order and then basically come back to get their food any more questions so if there was any I'm sorry would there any impact at all volume I one believe so I mean people are getting yeah problem yeah um uh people are getting food right now so we're managing that you know they're bringing it from other places I don't think there're being increas in volume how do you dispose of your trash currently uh on site up Bay Village there's recyclables in actually trash disposal okay is it a dumpster or is it cans uh it's a dumpster okay with two dumpsters did you say people are bringing food now yeah some are will that continue I'm sure it will yeah they'll be able to bring other food besides people can bring their own exactly yeah we're not going to restrict anything we're just looking to have different Alternatives or options for our consumers and the food that would be provided through your vendor would only be eaten non Prem it's not going to be potential to take out from you no nope no right John behind in in the p in the p is the food going to be extended the outside uh we we never we had a area out front a beer garden area but we were not allowed to be out front anymore or out back okay so yeah no that won't be everything will be inside and just in that tasting room area so can one of your patrons order food takeout from one of the local restaurants just have it delivered yeah yeah they do that now they do that yeah yeah we see stuff coming in all the time from the local places any other questions I just have a why would we restrict parking if they wanted to bring in a vender and use a parking spot in back of Bay Village why would we restrict that we're not restricting it he's bring to it but why why would we put that why would we do that because otherwise they could take up parking which is public parking I understand from discussions with Mr Raven that the landlord I don't think is totally agreeable or on board with that wait the parking lot in backa Bay Village is burrow is that bur proper tell you what what I know and the applicants agreed to this so I'm not yeah I just don't see why you would reach if he has Tuckers come in why can't they park at that's the burrow property not Bay Village no I'm talking about the the pay parking within Bay Village itself so adjacent to the Pavilion there where the Bay Village Pizza uh people eat a little square back there so there's parking spaces back that's what I was referring to but anything in the public that's not restrict that's all I meant too that's that's what Mr Raven conveyed me so okay yeah the issue with food trucks quite frankly that's where they were gonna Park them I think conceptually if that had happen right I think the concern was we didn't want to take up Bay Village parking on site for the for the food vendors to you know because they could potentially be customers for other businesses so we didn't want to intrude on their parking I'm actually going to ask them unload and and park out by the bay further out so my customers could get closer spots Frank I'm fine you're fine it's a permitted use so there's no no real issues other than we've heard the testimony so does anybody else have any other questions or comments I just have the one question just to confirm a it's only the one table yes that's it right so that's what the resolution will say that'll be a if you want if it turns out 6 foot table you're going to have to come back okay okay yeah I don't want to take up too much space because it's going to take up business for exactly yeah so not that the high top that shown six foot table as depicted on your okay any other questions so again sorry to be thick tonight there there's going to be food there's not going to be any food trucks no food trucks I didn't think the island allowed food trucks anyway and you know I don't want to bring in outside like food trucks town is there's going to be food food trucks well you should never listen to The Buzz around yeah there's no food trucks we're not asking for that actually application sorry no that's fine no I'm here to clarify everything any other questions Frank did they address with the testimony all the issues you I don't have any other issues with my review they responded to everything that I had questions about and Mr Raven your client agrees as a condition of approval to comply with uh the board Engineers comments in his review letter of May 20 2024 Mr zaru yes thank you thank you okay okay we don't have anything further thank you right thank you uh I'm gon to open it to the public now can I have a motion to open to the public so Penny second Jamie  is there anyone from the public and the audience that would like to come up and speak to this application Bon your mic on I need aaph he you the only thing that wasn't addressed was wait wait wait I need your name and address I'm sorry Deb witcraft your address please 528 doc Road Beach Haven Miss wecraft W your right hand please do you swear firm the Tes give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes thank you go ahead um on the application itself it says food vendors will be used in a parking space out back or in the lot next to the Bay the vehicle will not be bigger than a sprinter van so I think what nobody asked is Will food food be prepared in this Sprinter van no nobody there will be no food preparation Mr Mr zaro if you're gon to come back and test my response please no they will not be preparing in the van I'm sorry I mean because if they were that would be a food truck under the definition of a food truck it would all right but it says you know when you said you wouldn't be using Municipal parking you will in fact be using it and it sounds like it's going to be there all day will will that vehicle be there all day yes but I mean wouldn't it make better sense to just use like to spice it up or the Gazebo or holiday snack bar or but I mean it I'm I'm just trying to encourage you to use our local existing Merchants to provide food this is just my opinion that you know I there will be absolutely no food preparation in any V behind Bay Village it will simply be the delivery well if somebody orders off the menu a certain food how do you get that specific item to your Patron in your business Mr zaro come on up I'm sorry these are question that nobody has asked they are gonna pre-make the food so say it's a chicken or the egg and there's Wings they're going to make food and they're going to have it in tins and have it in sternos if it's chicken fingers it's the same way and'll have it ready to go so when they they Tak an order down they will actually ring it out in the POS and then just give them their food but where is this food going to be is it going to be in the Sprinter van in the parking lot no it's going to be inside our facility so you're gonna so everything on the menu is going to be stored in it's going to be stored by the table that they're working at yeah yeah so so everything will already be inside ship auttumn Brewery when they order from the menu nothing's going to be coming from a truck in the parking lot oh I'm just going by by what you put in your application yeah but you didn't you didn't look at the definition of food truck yeah all right I just hope that this applicant uses local businesses and restaurants and people who are already you know and and just so everyone's clear well that's certainly encourageable that's not something this land use board can require as a matter of law but it's been encouraged and I think the applicant has testified that he intends to use local local uh local establishments oh and I appreciate that I it was just in the application at itself when it said food vendors we've been yes will park a small Sprinter type van or car in a parking spot by the bay and I'm picturing people coming from a van down near the Bay Running over to this man's establishment to provide trays of food and that just doesn't seem to it wouldn't make sense I mean I could see delivery vehicles that currently serve restaurants all over Beach Haven in the island I understand that they deliver product but there would be no reason to occupy a parking space for any length of time at Bay Village if the food's already in the ship Autumn Brewery and the people order from the menu so it's just an observation that I wanted to make thank you you're welcome thank you Dad anybody on to I know I'm going to now take a wait wait wait a second I want to see it I alternate now okay go ahead someone else no I I thought there was somebody on Zoom but they're not your name and address please um Jackie F on bef saw your last name please F like Frank I Fe your address um with the Beach Haven taxpayer Association P box 1236 Beach Haven raise your right hand please do you swear for the testimon will give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth sure do thank you go ahead M so a couple questions here with the regards to the actual application the Affidavit of ownership was not completed by the actual owner of Bay Village it was completed by the applicant stating that he resides at Bay Village so the actual the actual owner of the building has not actually signed off on this application to be heard Mr Raven that may be accurate I the applicant submitted the application um I did see in the packet that it that he filled out the Affidavit of ownership personally uh Mr zaro I don't know if you want to speak to that um well we have to get this buttoned up right I well I know that the owner is is present um and then you I think you need to call him as a witness okay in light of the question that was just raised because it's a good question sure no I understand okay okay you can do you want me to address that first Jackie okay I'll call John Bell masal John Bell masal your last name please m c h a l m c h swe c h a Mr Mas raise your right hand do you swear or affirm the Tes before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes Mr Raven so M Mr mascal you're one of the owners of Bay Village is that correct yes okay so apparently it's come to light that the the application was submitted without you actually signing an affid AV of ownership typically the owner of the property would sign an Affidavit of ownership authorizing the application to be submitted um in this case did you sign an affidavit no okay are you do you authorize the application or do you have an issue with the application that's been presented I I have some issues okay so I me it's basically you know when when all of our food establishments are closed I think it's a great idea but once once we're all open we're all open 10 to 10 at night and I just don't see the reason for this Mr Raven let's if you don't mind let's cut through the chase it's masal is that you say yes Mr Mas as an owner of Bay Village you have to consent to this if you don't this board cannot approve this application so either you do or you don't for whatever the reason is because if Mr zaro can't get you to sign off on it he can't come before this board can we limit the the times it's not my applic I have no idea but this this issue has to addressed and buttoned up because I just I I don't see the reason for it in the summer I mean maybe a few events okay let me let me suggest this Mr Raven in light of Mr maskell's concern I think it might be worthwhile to agree to carry this and adjourn this to the next meeting so you can iron out these issues because if Mr mascal doesn't degrade if he can't come to some type of agreement with Mr zaro we can't we cannot hear this if he can that's fine and you can then Mr Mas will sign I would expect and I would ask that if he does if he reaches the agreement that the proper affidavit ownership be submitted in advance of our next meeting and then you can put on the testimony as to whatever the terms of the agreement are as far as the time when ship bot bre will be uh allowed to serve food there okay okay is that all right is that acceptable Mr zaro okay yes otherwise if he's he's not saying yes then we we're gonna have to deny this so yeah no I understand okay so the applicant agrees to carry this to the next meeting right which I believe is July 1 is that right okay and um you wave any action data to the extent that there's an action date issue right and no further notice would be re notice will be required and um again the Affidavit of ownership signed by the owner has to be completed and submitted before that next hearing okay understood yes thank you thank you motion to carry wait a minute I Jack Jackie did you some do you want to come up again before we actually yeah that's not a bad idea if the public has other concerns it might be beneficial to hear them tonight right if if the the board's open to that um again I just couple other things that they do actually have to go before the Long Beach Island Health Department not Ocean County Long Beach Island Health Department regulates everything on the island not Ocean County they would have to approve whatever they were doing um because they regulate Long Beach Island okay hold on hold on let's not have it back and forth and you're not on the mic understand it if this is approved and again no decisions being made made tonight it will be subject to all Outside Agency approval so if he doesn't get it he doesn't get it and then that'll be an issue but it will absolutely be subject to all appropriate Outside Agency approvals as is every application um the other thing is the floor plan that was provided in the application was not uh prepared by a licensed professional engineer or professional planner and they also do have prior slate plans and resolutions at least three that I could find um that were not provided with this resolution he also checked off that there was no prior site plans or resolutions to this and also um is there anything in his lease that says anything what he's allowed to do as far as food service because there are other vendors in Bay Village I have no idea just question them thrown out there okay you can ask Mr zaro later thank you Jackie we have one more your name please Regina Lotito spell your last name l t t o your address 205 Southwest Avenue Beach Haven New Jersey Miss latia raise your right hand do you swear airm the testimony you'll give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth absolutely thank you go ahead uh I am also the owner of spice it up which is a food establishment right underneath the Ship Bottom Brewery and I just want to say for 7 years we have worked very closely with ship botm Brewery and with his customers and our customers to have a mutual agreement of them with beer us with food also there's the pizza place around the corner we have chowder uh right now we don't have a restaurant at Bay Village but beer 14 or was also affected and did some business from the brewery and um when he says he wants to use local he use somebody in Manahawkin in the winter time so I'm not sure what he means by local um and there are local places that are very confused about this that why we are open as businesses who are paying rent in Bay Village paying taxes in Beach Haven that an outside vendor who doesn't pay rent can make money off of you know our customers and um you know it's hard enough in Beach Haven sometimes with a a very short season and we just want you know to make sure that our uh our opinions are heard and to know that there is food available for his Brewery customers thank you thank you is there anyone else out there anybody on somebody go ahead me again all right you've been sworn already y go ahead what was oh so yeah so basically we feel that it's a good idea when all our shops are closed because he's open all year round and he even stays open a little bit later at night sometimes the Chow shop closes at 5: he goes to 8 so we feel that he should be allowed during those times of the year but for the rest of the time of the year we don't really think it's a really good idea because we have pizza chower we we are in talks with restaurant right now and they're going to actually try and be open by July 1st so you guys should be getting the application for that soon so but 14 we beastro yes good so and then they're going to be wanting to you know send food over to the brewery too so well whether Mr zaro agrees with you or not we'll be seen and um to be continued as St go thank you I just there's nobody else okay uh could I have a motion to carry this application to July or close them close to the public first it was Nancy who's second Penny second all right yeah all right I need a motion to carry this application to the next meeting which is July the 1st motion to carry second Jamie El Mrs Davis yes Mrs B Miller yes Mrs edles yes Mrs Leonard yes Mr Jenna yes Mr tinquist yes Mr Balo yes Mr lefo yes get the N Mr Wanger yes application carried so for those who are here I said it earlier but the application will be heard at our meeting of what's the date in July I'm sorry July 1st there will be no further notice this is the notice thank you all right thank you so much thank you all right moving right along we have um application 202 24-8 for1 Center Street applicant is reapplying to the board for a minor site plan for outdoor seating and I am recusing myself from this application I wasn't involved the first time so I'm going to step down um in addition Miss Bal Miller um because this is a a de application we have to reconstitute as a zoning board so thank you um yourself and mayor Davis cannot participate either because under the municipal land use law the class one and class three members can't participate when an application involves a d variance so the members that will participate will be Mr Jenna Mr tinest Mr Balo Miss medal that's 1 two 3 four five six and will'll be a seven member zoning board so it'll be the first three alternates Mr lafredo Mr Winger and Miss King and we need somebody who's our voice chair we need somebody to run the meeting somebody has to chair somebody has to be our chairperson so who would like to do that I can't I'll run it I will help help you I promise Penny go ahead come on Penny all right jump in there [Music] now let's go side if the board's inclin if if we could just have a by the way James Raven on behalf of the applican 401 Center LLC um Kurt Dow who was the attorney that was representing the applicant in the litigation with the burrow is not present I believe he's on his way if I could just have a quick five minute recess to reach out to him the the applicant would prefer to have him present being that he was part of the litigation I did speak to him today so I know he's planning on coming but if I could just have a quick five minutes is the board amenable to that okay thank you very much yes everybody back in we'll begin the evening talk the order let's Mr Raven you're ready to proceed yes thank you and thank I'd like to thank the board for giving us some time there um so the applicant in is 401 Center Street LLC and the subject of the application is the holiday snack bar located at the corner of Center Street in Delaware Avenue and the applicant was previously before the board in 2023 there was a minor site plan application that was filed at that time the the applicant was seeking 78 total seats 48 seats outside and 30 seats inside the application was heard in a a series of two meetings and ultimately denied by the board and following the denial by the board a uh complaint in L of prerogative rits was filed with the Superior Court appealing the board decision and prior to the site plan application having been filed last year the buau had instituted litigation against the applicant relative to the outdoor seating so uh the the applicant entered into discussions with the buau H in conjunction with the appeal that was filed with the board and ultimately reached a settlement agreement with the burrow uh in an effort to resolve all of the issues that were in both the original litigation Institute in the burrow and the appeal that was filed by the applicant relative to the original minor site plan application so with the application I had submitted a settlement agreement that was executed on behalf of the buau and also by the applicant that has a number of conditions that are to be abided by by the applicant and the buau and the site plan that was submitted contains all those conditions So the plan was put together in an effort to comply with all the conditions set forth in that settlement agreement that agreement calls for 42 seats outside and 28 seats inside and there's a number of other conditions that are listed within the settlement agreement that was attached um the the hours of operation that are proposed are 8:00 am to 10 pm. which was a condition of the settlement agreement there there is a 10- foot buffer along the Westerly property line that's required and there are plantings proposed in accordance with the settlement agreement and there's also to be no activity within the the buffer area and I I don't want to recite all the conditions within the settlement agreement it speaks for itself but that's the overview of the application I am going to have Jim brazowski testify uh regarding the plan that was submitted and he will go through all the conditions that are proposed as set forth on the site plan but that's the overview of the application the intent was to have the plan comply with the settlement agreement the the applicant is going to testify the applicant would like to have trash cans on on the outside we can discuss that with the board they were not shown on the exhibit that was attached to the settlement agreement so we did not show any garbage cans but typically with the board's outdoor seating ordinance and when you have restaurants that are serving outside there are trash cans outside and if possible they would just like to have a busing area again that's outside of the scope of the settlement agreement but those were the only two items that I just wanted to bring to the board's attention the applicant will get into further detail about that so uh first I'll call James bzowski Mr brazowski before i s you in I just want the the board members of the public to understand this um Mr Raven's correct the there has been a tentative settlement of the litigated matters it it's what it's a conditional settlement because when a land use board is sued by an applicant after application is denied the parties do have the ability to try to resolve their differences the judges always encourage that but because we are a public board the settlement is conditional it's conditional on this board's approval so I don't want any board member to think that this is a for lack of a better phrase a done deal you will hear the testimony tonight um if you are satisfied with the testimony and you'll hear from Mr little as well our engineer if if you think that the applicant has met their burden because again this is a deep two variants and site plan application just like any other so while yes it's true there's been a conditional settlement please understand that the applicant has the burden just like they do in any other application that would come before us for approval and then each board member is entitled to vote however he Andor see She's Fit okay Mr Raven Mr braasi you want to raise your right hand do you swear for the testimon you get before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do right for the recommendation is James brazas a licensed professional engineer and professional planner in the state of New Jersey and an employee at horn Tyson in yod since 1997 and Mr brazowski you've testified previously before this board a number of times correct yes I have okay I'll use this one does the board accept Mr brow's qualifications as an expert in professional planning and Engineering yes okay thank you so Mr brazowski you were also present at the prior hearing that was previously before the board correct yes okay and then you had an opportunity to review the settlement agreement that was reached between the applicant and the buau prior to Preparing the site plan application the site plan that was submitted with this application yes okay and did you try to take into account everything within the settlement agreement and present it on your plan I did yes okay and if you could give a general overview to the board of what we're proposing here this evening uh certainly uh as you uh probably recall the property is located at Northwest the intersection of uh Central Avenue and uh Delaware Avenue it's currently developed with a one-story um restaurant the holiday snack bar um uh and what we're proposing is uh just to kind of solidify the outdoor seating at the holiday snack bar um so we've removed everything from the uh 10- foot area on the Westerly most side of the property other than the uh the existing shed at the rear of the property which has uh two existing non-conformities uh 02 feet to the north 1.1 feet to the East are the non-conformities on the existing Shed from the existing shed forward to the uh um sidewalk on um Center Street uh we're extending the existing uh planter so there's an existing uh raised planter bed with eight Ary we're adding uh additional 20 Arbor uh to provide an adequate buffer uh to the residential to the north uh there's no activities no restaurant activities will take place within that 10- foot uh buffer there will be a walkway um along the west side of the of the property and the east side of the buffer um there will be uh 10 t uh 10 seats with two tables a four top and a six toop on the west side of the building the North sorry the south side of the building there are four I think there's 18 I got I got uh I have 14 tables on the South Side I'm sorry 14 seats on the south side and um 14 uh seats on the east side of the building for a total of uh 42 outdoor seats there are 28 indoor seats for a total number of seats at the site of 70 seats um and basically just a uh the only other addition to the site would be the walkway that kind of wraps around the the ex exterior of the property um which does increase the impervious coverage to 60.9% which requires a variance from the 60% uh impervious the walkway is uh necessary to provide safe uh Ingress and egress to the tables uh for both the the staff and and the uh patrons just to clarify your plan had 60.8% is it 60.8 or 60.9 60.8 I'm sorry 6.8 okay I'm sorry just wanted to be clear for the record thank you sorry you can continue um uh additionally there's a proposed bike rack on the uh in the southwest corner of the property um the burrow has agreed to uh create a handicap parking space the the eastern most parking space on Central Avenue is going to be a handicap uh parking space and the burough also agreed to put additional bike racks in one of the parking spaces on the uh east side of Delaware Avenue um we believe that the outdoor seating is is a benefit to the community it's a um kind of enhances the general welfare of the the public um people like to be outside it's they feel healthier and safer outside um you know we do these applications for outdoor seating up and down Long Beach Island and and you know restaurant owners tell us all the time that people will wait to sit outside they versus immediate seating inside they'll prefer to wait to sit outside because this is what the general public wants uh so the holiday snack bar is providing um 42 seats outside uh to benefit the the general welfare the of the public public um we believe that the the number of seats at the property um can uh be justified uh based on the modes of transportation that are available uh on Long Beach Island today such as uh the pedestrians will walk there they'll bike there they'll take Ubers um we've got the LBI shuttle uh can transport people so the fact that there's no parking on site uh shouldn't be an an issue with this particular site there are um a lot of off street off-site parking available both on Central and Delaware Avenue um in fact there's a uh a kind of a cutout for diagonal parking on the east side of Delaware Avenue uh for additional public that's public parking not specifically for the snack bar and do you feel that the the seating as proposed um would have any detriment on the public good or the surrounding Property Owners uh no I don't I think it's uh we're adding the additional buffer adding the additional plants and the planter um should be shielded from the uh the adjacent Property Owners so it it I believe it uh will not be a detriment and when you were discussing the promotion of the general welfare with respect to outdoor seating in your opinion does that satisfy the positive criteria for the special reasons variance yes it does okay and um also with respect to the the parking variants uh there's never been any parking at this site is that correct uh no there has not okay and there there are areas uh particularly to the north of the property I know that this because we're in a residential Zone there's technically no buffer requirement within the residential Zone Mr little raised in his letter the fact that the business district requires a 10- foot buffer along resident if there is a uh within the business district if you have a commercial usage to a residential use so there are areas along the north side of the property and in the corner where the shed is that lacks to required buffer we are requesting a variance for that and um if you could just address as well the positive and negative criteria there I think the positive criteria has already been addressed but with respect to the the buffer issues any detriment you foresee to the surrounding Property Owners or the public good uh no there's a there's a solid uh fence along the north property line that area of the property um doesn't have any uh seating outdoor seating proposed so the uh it's just used for the employees to um take out the trash go to the to the storage shed to get whatever supplies are in the storage shed the storage shed has doors that open to the east um so that uh so the storage shed kind of acts as a buffer in itself in that um when employees go to the storage shed they're they're in there taking out uh whatever Goods they're in a contained area um not uh rattling around outside somewhere so I don't believe that there's a a detriment to the uh to the public by not providing a buffer to the north okay thank you and you don't have any concerns with respect to that the shed in the corner with the non-conforming setbacks no I don't I I the shed it kind of itself acts as a buffer okay and there are some pre-existing non-conformities with respect to the building itself and also the lot area but none of those are being exacerbated with this application correct that's correct and with respect to the impervious coverage variance we're requesting 60.8% where the maximum is 60% it's a DI Minimus request is that a result of some of the some of the uh proposed walkways that are proposed as part of the settlement agreement uh yes okay and as I mentioned uh the walkways are necessary to provide safe access to the outdoor seating areas for both patrons and the uh employees and there's just a it's a three or four foot wide walkway around the west side and uh around the south side of the building so do you feel that the board could approve this application without impairing the intent and purpose of the Zone plan and the zoning ordinance I do okay and this this is a pre-existing use but the the special reasons variants we're seeking is uh the expansion of the of the use to the outdoor seating yes okay I don't know if the board wants us to get into all the conditions within the settlement agreement Mr re so they as I stated it does speak for itself but I guess if anything the board wants clarified we're happy to address it let me see if I can help and if the board has questions they can certainly ask so um the settlement agreement will be attached to the resolution marked as an exhibit and Incorporated by reference what I do need is your client to testify under oath that she agrees to comply with each and every term of that conditional settlement agreement I think that's what's going on here that's my understanding but we need to hear that testimony right and that'll be a condition of approval in a resolution as well okay so quick question on the lighting it says in the settlement agreement all lighting is going to be shut off at 10 p.m. correct um so what does the lighting consist of is it string lights is it I recall I think it's mostly string lights um why don't we swear in Eileen Boker to answer that question the only question I had that I was you know settlement can you raise your right hand man do you swear from the testimony give before this board be the truth of whole truth and nothing but the truth I do and your name and address please Eileen Boer 5404 South Long Beach Boulevard hogate New Jersey and Mrs Boer the applicant in this matter is 401 Center Street LLC and you're the sole member of that LLC correct correct so you're authorized to speak on behalf of the LLC I am okay Mr little just had a question about actually in just for the record 401 Center Street LLC is also the owner of the property correct correct okay so Mr little asked a question about the lighting and it appears you're showing a photograph why don't we Mark that as exhibit A1 and if you could describe Mrs Boker for the record what this Photograph depicts this is this is these are the string lights that we have on the west side of the property that were actually even there when we purchased and then we there is one flood um motion detector light that you do not see that you know would turn on during the night should anyone go into that sidey yard one of our concerns with extend ing the 10-ft buffer and then a a 12ft buffer in the front is at night when no one is there it creates an area where someone could duck into on the property so we we thought the motion detection light would help decrease any of that type of activity and where is the motion detection light located um it is on the northwest corner so I I don't even know if you can it's on the building oh okay well is it on the building or is it on the tree it's on the building on the rear corner yeah on the on the rear corner on the site plan yeah there's in the northwest corner there's uh something called canopy and she pointed M Boker pointed to the area near the near the canopy so that's where the motion detector light is located the string lights will be shut off at 10 p.m. but I guess the point of this is that there is a motion detector light that could possibly be tripped by somebody walking by after 10 p.m. and and for two reasons you know sometimes I Reasons I'm just saying so the board knows a possibility that that motion detector like could go off yes and turn on somebody walks by it after 10 p.m. yes okay the light is shown into the corner it's low it's not it's not the bat light no no and it really just as you round that North corner it would turn on because quite honestly too if we close at 10 and the string lights go off at 10: there is that chance where staff could or customers could need to use the restrooms so it is back on that corner where the restroom is and and the string lights don't actually really light that area by the bathroom while there so I think is a safety measure for anyone that's going that side of the property and did you take this Photograph I did okay when was that taken um approximately Saturday okay and so that's how the site currently looks with the lights the way they're shown there yes okay that's A1 Mr Raven yes okay and we will leave that for the board at the conclusion of the hearing so I'll Reserve more questioning for Mrs Boker but if the board has questions for Mr brazowski we'll still entertain those yeah U Mr little identified all the conditions of the uh of the agreement in his letter um that your client agrees a condition of approval to comply with all the comments contained in Mr Little's review letter of May 21 2024 what was the question as Mr Riso ju just asked so do you agree as a condition of approval in the event the board were to approve this application to abide by all the terms conditions contained within the settlement agreement yes okay thank you Frank do you have any issues no I think we heard from the applicant I you have my letter I reviewed the plan it complies with the settlement agreement the board still has to determine if they want to approve or deny anyone else on the board have any questions I have one question regarding the buffer um if I heard correctly the reason for the variance for the buffer was to get Grant access to and from the shed is that what was the reason for the for the buffer variance well on the north side of the property we're not providing any buffer and that well there's a fence there but we're not proposing a 10- foot buffer on the North side because that would restrict the ability to be bble to walk around the building so there is a residence to the north um but the the buffering at the prior hearing there were concerns from the neighbor to the west so the 10-ft buffer that we're providing is along that Westerly property line but but it's not complete across there are areas that are open it's not a vegetated buffer under the terms of the settlement agreement there can be no activity within that area um but there so that area will be occupied by the vegetation has shown on the plan the remainder of that buffer area will be clear and also the shed is within the buffer area as well anyone else on the board question so as I indicated previously the settlement agreement did not call for any garbage cans to be outside um Mrs Boer do you believe that outdoor garbage cans are going to be re uh necessary for you for the outdoor seating I I believe they're not only necessary I think they're required by the Burrow's ordinances how many do you need two we have one near and we they're there now we have just one next to each busing station and that's the other one the busing stations were not included within the settlement agreement how many busing stations do you have outside there currently just two one one on the east and one on the west okay are they are they both within the property line yes they are um if you could identify I might have a photo oh okay that helps yeah if you have a photograph that would be great so we're going to mark this as exhibit A2 and if you could describe to the board what this Photograph depicts this is the east side of the building on Delaware and so we have the the six top and the two four tops and you can't you really can't even see the busing station as it Nestles in next to where the ice machine is right next to the building and then the trash can I think it's a 32 gallon round trash can is right next to it and then this is the dumpster area that picture there are there going to be more tables no there no are you going to be putting in a sidewalk we are not thought there's a there's a walkway on they they are allowing us to put a 3-foot walkway around the building but not a sidewalk so the the the the and and it's tight so we are because of the telephone pole the the sidewalk became an issue so the the three-foot walkway would then be on that side once we are able to complete it correct the actual walkway yes by where the telephone po correct well it'll be by the telephone pole I don't know if it goes around it and and that was just something that we asked to be permitted to it wasn't necessarily a requirement or a condition of the settlement sement it is as a permit though like so that we can do it when we're ready to it's not that we has to be done immediately so where's the busing station on the west side on the west side if you look at the drawing and because I don't think I have that one in a picture um it falls see where the canopy is again and the furnace room just to the south of the first room all right so it's in that yeah on the side correct and what do the busing stations consist of um one is an old baker's rack uh kind of a metal rack and it just we have the one busing pan on top of it and the trash can sitting next to it and on the other side it was a gardening table that's made out of white PVC and we thought on that side of the building in particular it really blends with the building you you hardly notice it at all so do you fill the bus bin with dishes and then when it gets full it's brought inside I try to get them to bring it in before it's full but they are teenagers when do you plan on putting the papers in probably not until the fall I mean it would be I think really difficult and uh a conflict with our season to do it right now sure understand I just think in the resolution we should say that you know we'll be completed by the end of 2024 something like that or or how about prior to the start of next season just gives a a little bit more time because we we close in October and I'm thinking weatherwise um you know we'll probably start it some people are telling me it'll only take a couple of days but it's up to the board just please understand so that the the conditional stett agreement when when we're talking about this three-foot brick walkway how they stock permitted to install a three-foot brick walkway if it's the board's pleasure and you want that them to like think you're hearing the applicant say she will do that and what she's asking is that the resolution to be done before the before next season that correct that's reasonable whether or not the board wants to agree to that or not is up to the board but that the settlement agreement the conditional s doesn't require it it says she's permitted to do so if there a condition of approval the board wants that that's fine I think the board clear does the question is when and and our reason for wanting the three-foot walkway primarily is for handicap we're we're looking at ADA compliance you know had had all of this not happened we would have had Ada bathrooms by now um but you know there'll be a cost factor that we need to save for and you know that was even we had asked for the um handicapped parking spot there there'll be the area in the front where it's slightly larger for the brick we our vision is handicapped tables Mr little would you have any issue for an engineering standpoint with that walk Le uh being installed before the beginning of next season as opposed to some other time now the only thing I wanted to mention that that the walkway on the west side is only two foot wi according to the plan yeah the reason we did that was we we were trying to keep the buffer area clear we were originally providing a three-foot wide walkway along there but in order that the settlement agreement made clear that there should be no activity in the buffer area so we reduced the WID of it width of it to two feet there just to keep the buffer clear that was the only reason for that although if we go back to the ADA compliance the 3-foot is what is necessary for a wheelchair right which means you'd have to turn the six top a different way to get the three foot outside the buffer you could definitely well we we actually that that six top is already in a different position for that reason we we pulled it up to the corner of the building and the two six tops actually sit on the point of the building where the angle is and then the two round tops so that gave us the necessary inches to keep it out of that 10 put the three feet instead out of the buffer I think the plan should be amended to show how the how things are really going to be and you could definitely do three foot around the back on the North side that shows two foot also I don't see any reason why that can't be well we didn't know if wheelchairs were going to need to go around to the back well that's true but if you want the three foot walkway on the west side has to be out of the buffer yeah the the impious also the impervious is the is the impervious coverage calculated based on the twoot walkway or the three foot walkway two foot walkway which means you're going to need more impervious coverage correct about 40 sare feet all right so we need to know what that number is if that's getting approved my gut feeling on it would be I could probably eliminate that stretch on the east side of the building which kind of is almost a walkway to nowhere and uh just keep it on the west side of the building for the restroom access as long as we get testimony on what the coverage is g to beas I think it's cating doing the calculations at the moment I question just about the operation you're open from 8 a to 10m yes correct is the 10 p.m a hard close or that's the last we turn the grills off at 9:30 so the hot food gets turned off at 9:30 and so that folks that are eating food are pretty much complete by 10: and then from 9:30 till 10 o'clock is desserts and coffee only so you know we're we're pretty much most customers and and we did it over Memorial Day weekend and actually did well in that extra hour um and everybody was pretty much out by 10 and the staff is out by about 10:30 the final dishwashing and myself are probably by 11 is there any outside music there is no outside music as part of the settlement agreement right I have a a general question if the the settlement agreement says you have the right to do it if you want to does it make sense to have to lock into it now what you're going to do or leave it open-ended so in other words if you write something specifically there we are going to do this by a date I I was just trying to save money like I didn't want to have to keep feel I've seen y a whole bunch in the last year if would the intents comply with the settle agreement sett an agreement simp to do that just leave it that nothing is simple if they need a variance we need to approve the variance if they want to stay under 60% they don't need a variance and they can do it and stay under 60% if you want the variance we have to approve whatever that number is tonight that's up to you it's your application Mr R you want to speak of your client did well did you calculate that number Mr rowski yes I did what would that be if we increase some of that walkway on the West Side to 3 feet yeah 4 40 square foot of uh 3550 is 1.1% so it increases to 61.9% so yeah what I think we'd like to do is request the variance for the 61.9% that doesn't require the applicant to build it to 61.9% but it gives the applicant that flexibility that's that's without eliminating the East correct well the the um the portion of the walkway that's outside the property line is not calculated this piece here so it's it's only the portion within the property line but that's outside of the property actually the this three-foot portion that's in the burrow right away it is yeah and all this is too I I don't really think the variance for 61.9 is an issue because you're providing Ada access thank you so just for the boards you know we're talking aous amount to create a walkway that could be Ada accessible in my opinion I don't think it's an issue yeah Frank I have a question it's that's what's causing them to come before for a Varian for impervious coverage is there other alternatives to a brick walkway that would make it less impervious not really and not you really wanted Ada accessible so if you start fooling around with you know for paper spaces in between and things like that me this is the minimist amount and it's it's for a good cause which is Ada access so I don't think there's really an issue at all okay thank you so let's button up by when that's I don't know that's prior to the starting next season I mean it's not a requirement of a settlement agreement so no but the board wants to make it a condition of approval since applicant is testifying she wants to put it in as per the so what's what's the beginning of the next season May May 1 so have to be end before May one I think before May one of 2025 yeah I think that's we'll be selling Memorial bricks sure the landies Ford would like one get them all crint it up $100 a shot a little company out of Missouri or something I know Kurt D's gonna buy a few oh at least he told me you'd come and help put it down e is there any changes to the signage being proposed no any other Mr Raven anything else um I don't think so is there anything I think that covers any everything any any further questions from the board of the applicant before we open to the public any other questions to the board or engineer I'd like to see a motion to open to the public thank you thank you is now open to the public is there anyone out there tonight that would like to come up and speak how are you H please my name is Jacqueline deletto I live at 329 do Road Beach Haven 329 do Road 329 uh uh D apostrophe capital e l e t t o let raise your right hand please do you swear for the Tes you give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do okay please um I have lived um cadd Quinter to the holiday snack bar for the last 26 and a half years um I have uh never had a problem really with anything from over there there and I have very much um appreciated all of the efforts that fers have put into improving it since they bought it um between paint and rocks and you know uh new exhaust system for safety inside and plenty of other things I have never had any problem whatsoever I live C or two them um Al so uh I don't know who else is going to get up to speak but I I was here at the meetings a year ago and I also know that the people who live right next door to them um right next to that building have gotten up and spoken and said they had no problem the people who live directly across the street have said that they have no problem Etc um besides that I I do just want to say that their lighting is very minimal I love when it goes on in the winter time for about two hours it's like my happiest time of the day I can see them their building right outside my window um and last uh fall I guess after they had closed up um somehow probably on Facebook honestly um I had seen that they had to bring in all their Planters and things like that there was even a letter from the I think it was from the town somewhere that was posted on Facebook about exactly what was asked for that they had to bring their flag and things like that and I just want to note that I did happen to walk um just a few months ago um you know I remember that happening but I did walk a few months ago right from my house which is on Doc Road I walked up past gabos I was going over to Murphy's so I walked around the corner and I did happen to notice right in front of a store that's there um and that's been there it happens to be I have nothing against them I don't know them at all so I feel bad to even say but it was a Coffey shop and they had two large Planters outside were not attached to the building in any way um and they had dead plants in there and it was their store was not open yet again for the season so it was again on the public walkway right on Bay Avenue so I couldn't understand as to why they were allowed to have plants that were left there dying from the season before through the entire winter and in big planters that were not attached to the wall and it was such a big thing for the um holiday snack bar bring absolutely everything in that they that was on the property I couldn't understand that because this was a public walkway well it's not necessarily if they were allowed number one number two please and so for the benefit of everyone here at this meeting know that this board is not a board of enforcement we just grant we hear Grant consider Grant Andor deny applications like this one with respect to specific uh pieces of property sure so sure we're not consider we're not here to consider any other proper I understand I just don't want anybody to think that somehow this board allowed that to happen yeah no no no I understand I just feel that everybody again I my husband's family did own the Gazebo Restaurant for um 28 years so um you know as uh somebody who was kind of a business owner I um you know I know how hard it is and all and I just feel like they've been very they're very good people they're very community-minded Etc and I think that um a lot of money has been spent by the town um you know trying to straighten this all out as to what's allowed and what's not allowed and a lot of money has been spent by them and I think that at this point they should be given a break thank you thank you zoom there's someone on Zoom okay let's go with someone on Zoom please if you don't mind iPhone 2 sorry I don't have a name your hand is raised hello yes hello hi can you please turn your camera can you please turn your camera on yeah hold on a second is it on the host disabled the camera says the host disabled the camera hold on a second okay we can see you can you uh state your name and address for the record please yes uh Carl perner 407 Center Street on the property to the left yes excuse me we''ve not met can you please that's okay3 I in fact in the property property but I just wanted toow okay that's fine thank you Mr Ley okay anyone else from your name please and address Chris cap CA 114th Street Cedar Bonnet Island which is actually Mana Hawkin I'm a 73y old is it right you swear affirm the testimony you give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do thank you go ahead Mr C I'm a 73-year-old third generation Islander my uncle was Angel an Eddie who was killed in the 62 nor Easter saving people from the trailer park in Holgate uh most of the major changes in my life took place on this island I lost my virginity on the beach on 98th Street I got drafted from drafted into the army from my parents home on being Beach Haven Crest and Miss King is probably aware of how much I complain about that I know change is inevitable no matter where you are and I accept that to some degree but I think the change that bothers me the most is the way the island has changed from a colorful place with character and quaint and the in my opinion and I'm not I don't even frequent the holiday snack bar that much but it's one of the very few remaining places on this entire Island let alone in the burrow that has any color character and right from where I'm standing now I can walk and witness atrocities all over the burrow and the fact that they're being dragged through this to such an extent just frightens me really it's a a shame in my opinion uh I sometimes I drive by the place just because I Delight in seeing the kids I mean it's a family or oriented operation I like to see the kids examining all the toy not toys but the yard ornaments or whatever you want to call them out on the property and it's it brings joy to my heart because it reminds me of when I was a kid and I just find the whole situation sad and I hope the board will approve this thank you thank you Mr C go ahead up name and address please uh Leo Ginsburg 5511 West Avenue poate 5511 West Avenue yeah poate your last name is Ginsburg yes with or without NH h no h I've actually never been asked that one before raise your right hand please you swear front the test get before this Bo would be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do good hi um so I am uh very very good friends with the bers probably my best family friends um so if there's anybody more tired about hearing about this than you guys is probably me it's like every day trust me um I've been to all of these meetings since this started and I would say that out of all of them this has probably been the calest one everybody seems to be getting along so just good on everybody on that um and I think everybody's starting to move forward but I think I speak for everybody and like we are really tired with this um it seems to me that you know going by the snack bar since this started they seem to have more customers which as a friend of the bers I'm very happy with um but like I I don't know what direction this is heading necessarily obviously it's up to you guys um it's just like it's it's very tiring I think on the town especially um you know this is we've been on this specific case now here for I guess an hour hour and a half so far um we're using taxpayer dollars to keep the lights lit keep the air conditioning on in here we've been doing this now for a year and a half so I'm hoping it seems like we're moving towards a resolution and I I'm just this is me like not begging but just really hoping you guys uh can reach that resolution because I think as a town like we're all just really tired um the only thing that really makes me feel better about it is eating a cheeseburger at the snack bar but they're closed right now because of this so uh yeah I just I really hope we resolve this um not just for for my sake and your sake but for the town's sake so thank you thank you Mr Ginsburg anyone else from the public your name and address please Lois uos y u h s z y y h s is in Sam Z is in zebra 414 Midland Avenue Pine Beach 414 Midland a yes Pine Beach Pine raise your right hand please you swear from the testimony you give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do go ahead please first I want to just agree with all the people who have spoken your patience is incredible and I I want to recognize what the bers have done when they bought the place I think you all know it was looking slightly derel it looks great now they probably have on the west side due to the hkers the best looking Garden of any restaurant in town by far and it occurred to me today it never had before and I've been to all these meetings also is that when the building was sold the herkner never raised the issue of why should it stay commercial maybe that would have been a better time to deal with this but the bogers have done so much and when people talk about the business being iconic I thought it was interesting with the brewery application that when Deb spoke and she mentioned local restaurants they could contact and use holiday came up it's what everyone thinks of I was uh walking out of a class at Ocean County College in May early in May speaking with someone and a man a few feet from us was talking on his telephone and when I mentioned holiday he turned around and he started talking about all the issues he lives in Beach Haven but he said last time he was in Holiday he was sitting next to people from Connecticut who drove down for the day because they love to go to Holiday it is a traditional special part of the island and I think the bers deserve so much credit for what they've done and if the money hadn't been spent on legal issues they probably would have done a lot more so I hope that this is coming to a close I'm sure you're tired of dealing with it and I will um go to eat instead of coming to meetings thank you thank you anyone else yeah hi my name is Bill Hudson 23 West Washington Avenue Beach hav Inlet Holgate want to S man yes hold on thank you sir Hudson you said H is in Tom s o n you swear the testimony to give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do Sir goe Mr Hudson thank you sir um the first thing I want to just bring back a little history about the Bookers the uh their holiday snack bar and next door with the herkner some people here will remember that the herkner house used to be a smaller house further away from the property that house has since been rebuilt over the years closer to the property that's part of the problem it used to be further away and they rebuilt it closer to the property the second thing is you know this is an iconic place this been going on for 75 years and the customer base you've heard 90% of the audience here talking about how much they like it neighbors across the street around the corner everywhere but the hkers like it so reason I'm here I own Lor's Island and motel we send a lot of guests at a holiday snack bar and this past Memorial Day Weekend everybody here knows how big the tourism was it was I see thank you for shaking your head the tourism was the biggest I'm being told by Beach Haven people that they've ever seen I was a matter of fact testified to in in a council meeting last week and with that all the restaurants were full I have a number of complaints telling me I can't get in restaurants my waiting time is so long you know we can't have this you know uh the the snack bar across the street which uh I'm trying to remember the name of it first of all the one that's now candy store I don't know why for Freds Fred's 200 and some seats then you've got kubel's 200 seats you Dom's Dom snack bar you've got probably 500 seats missing I think at the least we can bring this place back online give them what they need thank you for your time thank you name and address please Sue shy 10 North Delaware Avenue for your last name please sh a r k e y thanks M sh raise your right hand you swear affirm the tester give before this board will be the truth I whole truth and nothing but the truth I do thank you go ahead my husband and I are the north neighbors we're the ones that we don't have a buffer we just have a fence we're not complaining we're very happy um so I'm really looking looking forward to some closure I hope from this whole issue since it started both as a neighbor and as a taxpayer um and also I think securing the operations of a Beach Haven icon um so we're Paul and I are both certainly in favor and encourage a settlement whatever that may be what you've proposed and what they've agreed to um for the holiday snack bar and for the Bookers but not indefinitely and I don't really know how this works so I just need to go on and say you know our endorsement does not convey with any sale or any change of use I I would assume that's true so we're not saying yes you know we agree to all variances um if there's a change of sale or to change of use um couple other comments that came up you guys were asking about the bus stations and I maybe there's concern I don't know if there is or it's just a point I would like to commend any restaurant that is using washable plates in this disposable world so I appreciate that there's bus stations and and that we're not just using disposable things um and as far as the string lights I I would hate to see it written somewhere that you have to turn them off at 10 o'clock just for safety I hope your timer can be set for 10:20 10:30 there's still people out there you know cleaning the tabl so the seagulls don't bombard them um there's you know it last thing I'll say is think the property looks great we're very happy to be neighbors um we have no complaints you know anything like that um I know there's talk about noise or lights or whatever I have always thought on the West Side would be a perfect place I'm sorry to mention I know you you're out of money and all that but I would love to see an awning over there that would kind of just contain a lot and look great and I'm not against umbrellas I'm just suggesting it as if great shade option so thank you thank you m shy we have someone on Zoom hold on hold on please we have someone on Zoom if you don't mind um Kitty Snider uh thank you um trying to un wait wait I just wanted to say misser yes M ner I know everybody knows you just for finality please name and address for the record Kitty Snider T berley Beach Haven raise your right hand please you swear airm the testimony you give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do go ahead um I also am very much looking forward to closure on this it's been a very long road um I wish the Bookers all the best and the herkner all the best I um we've worked really hard on this and I would encourage the board tonight to please other than the 1.9 um additional impervious variants for ADA compliance so please please approve this site plan and as is other than that thank you very much and good luck thank you Miss Snider next name and address my name is Douglas Tate my address is 402 Center Street Tate t t t AIT t t t Mr Tate raise your right hand please do you swear from the Tes give for or be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do go ahead um just to affirm what James was talking about and I'm the uh neighbor to directly to the South so the Sharkies are directly to the north I'm directly to the South across the street from the holiday snack bar been a patron of the holiday stack bar since 1971 as a kid going there and even bought the house across the street from it the um as mentioned about parking uh well I I am up early I walk the dog every morning and every night so I see what's going on I trigger their lights at night so I know they're the safety light is actually a good thing and it's having the lights on at night is very safe but I also see the parking that's going on and what needs to be parking because they Park all around my house but the um most of the parking that on Delaware A is for the holiday snack bar the ones that are on Center Street are really going to the black whale about usually more than half are parking way down the street for the black whale most of the traffic coming into a holiday snack whereas foot traffic or bike traffic with occasional cars um seating I know this has always been the big issue but it seems gating way back I bought that premises in 1994 and um seen I've seen all the various owners when they didn't have as many outdoor seating or as much outdoor seating there's a lot of milling and standing on the sidewalk waiting to be seated so it seems like once they get the seating up that Milling around and Ling waiting for a seat certainly dropped down dramatically and so the CD I'm I'm all for it again affirming what James said earlier this is a good proposal lightning is very good uh the new sign they put up uh advertising the holiday snack again good safety and also very iconic for the neighborhood and the 10 p.m. closing is ideal um we hear more noise from the yacht club than we actually hear holiday snack and that the yacht club is well over half mile away you hear the bands and playing that night they do shut down at 10 o'clock so we don't have to worry about enforcement there but everyone seems to shut down nicely at 10 p.m. but no problem from holiday snack bar and and I agree with uh Su shy the um awnings are a great idea I took pictures of folks standing out in the rain Under the Umbrella having their hamburgers and an awning would have been perfect for them and of course I I've enjoyed what they've done to the place as far as the color coordination of red you know my recommendation not only add the awning but also do something in red as well it's my comments thank you Mr anyone else from the public to be heard I'm sorry I just want to point out one more thing that's possible yes Ro uh so again my name is Jack loletto um and I'm sure everybody here knows this uh but um again there are two municipal Lots within about a block a block and a half from the holiday snack bar there's the one next to barries and there's the one next to the Triton they're both considered Municipal parking Lots so I just wanted to point that out thank you thank you anyone else from the public wishing to be heard Mr Ley and ladies and gentlemen Richard s Jr New Jersey on behalf of the Mr Mrs PA herner who own theous property who own the contiguous proper property directly west to the applicant's property um I do have a couple questions of um the applicants expert but before I get to that I I just want to make one statement that uh I think the board and I'm sure the board is aware the hkers are not seeking to close holiday snack bar they're not even seeking to limit all expansion they just want reasonable expansion this isn't if the herkner win the holiday snack bar goes away it's not going to go away and the hkers realize that but they're the ones who are most and directly affected by it with that I just have a few questions mrki could you come to the mic please maybe you can use Mr Ravens I need your both to speak the mic uh Mr B her Kowski um the application actually had two site plans attached to it one was called a color rendering I believe and the other one uh is black and white is that accurate my plan is this is this on I don't know is it my plan yeah my plan's the black and white with my title Block Horn Tyson and Yoder okay so you're not aware of any other plan may have been attached to the application the only other I mean the only other plan that I've seen was the plan that was attached to the um agreement between the uh the burrow and the uh the litigation agreement you're referring to yes and there was a site plan attached to that as far as you there was just a uh eight and a half by 11 sheet without a title block but you had nothing to do with that rendering I did not prepare that very good thank you um referring to the rendering that you prepared um well let me back up are you aware of the current conditions under which holiday snack bar is currently allowed to operate and I'm specifically referring to what its current seating capacity is are you Weare what its current seating capacity without any approvals that they're seeking I not okay so when you're asking for an expansion you don't know how much of an expansion they're actually seeking is that accurate well there was a discussion at the prior application about how many seats there there may have been historically o you know at the property um where we range from anywhere from 50 to 85 okay but you don't you're not tonight you're not aware of any restrictions on on the seating or what the fire marshal may have placed upon uh the uh the property as far as uh indoor seating or things like that uh we we did have a fire marshal letter I I'd have to refer to by file to see what the Fire Marshall said about uh his capacity inside but even the Fire Marshall doesn't deal with seating he's dealing with capacity I understand um you've broken down your uh uh seating uh um anticipated seating proposal to indoor seating and outdoor seating is that true yeah I've indicated on our site plan indoor seating and outdoor seating is there any provisions for what happens if it begins to rain or something like that and everyone outside comes inside uh not to my knowledge you you if I I don't mic rendered on your plan location of outdoor seating tables is that true yes and are those taes permanently situated there in other words once those tables are set as they're picted on your rendering are they going to be able to be moved yeah they're not they're not anchored down so that's the question okay the the uh I know the board and especially the board engineer tonight uh Mrs Boker indicated that she had moved some tables on the West Side around to make room for a wider walkway um and the board engineer wanted to see a revised site plan indicating where those tables were because once the site plan gets approved that's where those tables need to stay in order for the applicant to be in compliance with the site plan approval okay so your testifying that that the tables will stay and let me back up a second are you saying those tables are there now yeah well for the most part there there's a little bit of a a shuffling on the West Side okay so prior to receiving any approvals the applicant has placed tables as they appear on that site plan is that accurate yes I'm going to show you again what's been marked A1 in evidence and this is a picture of the to your knowledge the current lighting around the premises yeah that's along the west uh yeah the Westerly lot line property line yeah and do you know if that lighting currently exists within the buffer zone uh it appears that it does yes uh is it your understanding both pursuant to the settlement agreement and the site plan has submitted that there's to be nothing in the buffer zone other than a planter that is my understanding yes if that's the case where would these where would these lights be secured if they weren't allowed to be in the buffer zone uh they would have to be uh on Post 10 foot west of the Westerly lot line uh 10 foot east of the Westerly lot line so you would have to actually amend the site plan to show posts that hold up the lighting is that accurate well the the current site plan doesn't show the existing lighting referencing again is that you're understanding both the S order and the submission that there's to be nothing in the buffer other than the planter that's depicted on your site plan is that accurate I believe that's correct does your current site plan show a bicycle rack inside the buffer zone no it does not does not so your is it your testimony that the buff Zone ends at the Southern Line dark line that's indicated on the bottom of the yes and and and it's your understanding that both the site plan and the settlement agreement allows for that bike rack and that other planter that's depicted on your plan is that true [Music] yes the taable that you've indicated on your site plan application does that rendering make any provision for uh egress in and around the tables yes and what is your understanding of what's appropriate egress for outdoor table seating uh in such a situation such as the walkway that's Prov such as uh uh uh wait waiter or waitress Service uh safely and appropriately bringing orders to tables for persons to appropriately and comfortably approach a table and sit down isn't there some according to good planning some minimum space that should exist between the tables to allow that activity to occur uh if there is I'm not aware of it okay so you can jam the tables as close as you as you want together your testimony the my testimony is the the tables are going to be positioned as they are on the site plan which is provides adequate spacing they they are not jammed together on that site plan well the site plan has a scale doesn't it yes it does and you could measure based on that scale how close those tables are together could you not yes you could okay um f hold on one second folks everybody had their chance to speak this is just is Mr Le's opportunity I need to hear the Board needs to hear so if you could all just please um keep your comments I understand you may all not agree but this is Mr Le's opportunity he represents a resident who's an objector and he has the right to cross-examine uh the applicant's witness so please let him do that you're welcome um your plan doesn't depict the uh busing stations that are being now asked at the last moment to be approved no they do not are you aware of um any ordinances of the burrow that affect or deal with outdoor seating on an existing uh use more specifically on an existing non-conforming use outdoor seating on an existing non-conforming use are you aware of any borrow ordinances that exist that deal with outdoor seating regarding an existing non-conforming use uh no okay so you're unaware of bur ordinates section 22-7 yeah that's correct okay are you also una aware of binance 1373 and what does that ordinance deal with deals with outdoor seating on an an existing non-conforming use no Mr he's not a lawyer and respectfully respectfully that's not the ordinance does not deal with outdoor seating I'm looking at it I have 22-7 and I also have the Burrow's outdoor dining ordinance now that talks about some outdoor seating yes but two 127 is not limited to outdoor seating not solely but it deals with it that wasn't your question to the witness I'm just asking to be fair to Mr RI that's I understand I don't believe it does Mr Ley deal with outdoor seating 212 board can take the testimony as it seems fit I want the board I don't want the board to be confused you're a lawyer I'm a lawyer Mr Ravens a lawyer Mr brazas is not 2127 if you want to show me where it says outdoor seating I'd be happy to look at it but it's doesn't Okay and Mr so you understand I'm making a right yeah and you understand I have a job to do on board and you specifically asked the applicants professional if he was aware of an ordinance that deal with outdooring for pre-existing non-conform uses and you reference 22-7 okay for the record 22-7 does not make any reference to outdoor seating that's all I'm saying okay all right thank you you're welcome um are you aware of any other activities other than the requested busing stations that may be occurring on the site as of today other than food service and and whatnot now what's what's on the site plan uh and the only thing that the applicant wants to add to the site plan because the uh the agreement said The only things permitted on the site plan are what was in the res uh the agreement we had trash cans and uh uh busing stations on a prior site plan but we removed them because the uh the uh agreement specifically said don't add anything other than what's specifically in the agreement okay so we we remove those items from the site plan that's before the board tonight figuring you know we could talk to the board and see if they thought that trash and busing stations would be a good idea to [Music] add okay that's all the questions I have Mr you have anything else Mr Ley yes um if I may I'd like to ask that a witness be sworn who appears on Zoom sure Mr call herner Mr herner can you hear me yes I can hear you uh M Mr herner um state your name and address for the record please just so we have it formally for the record sure Carl herkner 407 Center Street Beach Haven raise your right hand please do you swear airm the testimony give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes okay please keep your voice up so that the people that are here in person can hear you okay okay thank you thank you Mr Mr herkner um you're currently familiar with the uh current state of usage of Holiday City snack bar is that fair to say yes the holiday snack barar yes um are you aware of any activities that are occurring in or about the site uh other than food service in the outdoor area um I mean there is a ring toss on the back of the property uh that unattended kids run around and play um there's a bench back there um along the shed where kids jump off and you know you know throw some rocks and make some noise back there um there's a lot of you know again the buffer zone there's um lights um various things in there like there's a whales tail there's some signage there's some um an old door and I guess it's my understanding that there shouldn't be anything uh in there but Planters Mr I'm going to try and show you what's been marked A1 for identification can you see that picture uh I'm having trouble seeing it but there okay yes yeah I canting onare it um yes it hold on hold on wait a minute the connection not just wait a minute addition lighting Mr you broke up you yes um there is Lighting in the 10- foot buffer zone um there was also added some additional lighting which is solar lighting that um stays on all night um and uh they have not been turning it off on on occasion um till around 11 o'clock in some instances so but yes there the lighting is in the buffer zone um as depicted in that picture are you aware if uh uh there are patrons on the premises after the 10 pm closing time if I'm sorry if there are what after the are you aware if there are any customers there after the 10m closing well um I mean I they close at 10 I mean I I believe you know people finish up and move off the property at 10 but you know the lighting does stay on and the and the employees you know are there cleaning up um you know the bus station um they do have plates and knives and things that are clanking around so they are making noise bringing those in uh at all hours after 10 um I don't have any more questions on my you have any questions I don't thank you uh Mr that's all the questions I have of you thank you sir um I I had one question um the tables as they're depicted on the plan like a six top a four top is that the maximum amount of patrons are allowed at one of those tables a good question another word you're asking whether you can fit more than six people at any one given table well right like on Memorial Day Weekend there were nine people on a six toop and there are chairs pulled from another one to another table is that allowable I guess is my question uh you have anyone you propose to answer that or I believe the settlement agreement bear with me a moment laser removal the uh this is page eight of the settlement agreement paragraph 8 States 401 Center Street shall be permitted a maximum of 42 total outdoor seats the seating shall consist of six four person tables and three six person tables as shown on exhibit a any encroachments on burrow property shall not exceed that shown on exhibit a at no time shall more than 42 individuals be seated outside so I think that's the the primary concern is that at no time more than 42 persons shall be seated outside obviously there's going to be groups of people that don't divide equally among the four and six tables so there may be times where maybe you have a chair pulled from one table to another but there can't be more than 42 people outside what members of the board is there anything else Mr hering you'd like to ask or ADD no I was just curious about that um and about the protecting the buffer zone okay um and I guess is there anything in the agreement um about having a bench on the back which is clearly seating and uh games and toys and you know kids running around okay so I wasn't sure about that either ladies and gentlemen of the board at the prior hearing um the uh applicant uh had um submitted a report of I'm sorry the applicant I'm sorry the objector had submitted the report of Andrew Thomas uh who this board had previously accepted as an expert planner and um had testified at that prior hearing uh unfortunately uh Mr Thomas was unable to appear this evening uh as he's in front of another board and I'm asking that the board accept his amended report Mr Ley I'm just for the record I'm going to object to the introduction of any supplemental reports from Mr Thomas as I'm not given the opportunity to cross-examine him with respect to that report I want to sustain the objection Mr Ley this is a quasi judicial board and I'm sure you well know he needs to be here to testify Mr Raven has the absolute right to cross him just like you asked Mr Mr brazowski questions this evening I understand um the only uh comment I would make is that the if the board accepts the uh settlement agreement which uh I would emphasize it's under no obligation to do and I I do query whether or not anyone on this board was involved in uh coming to the final terms and conditions of that settlement agreement um I understand it's perfectly legal to render uh uh to uh resolve a zoning issue uh that is subject to litigation by way of settlement agreement um but whether or not its legality is appropriate um I would simply uh say to the board uh is it right you're you're the you're the body that makes these decisions not not a uh a lawyer and a uh uh in a back room uh with the applicant um I don't know if you guys had any input to it I don't know if you guys uh um know its terms um I would suggest that you not seed your authority to uh um the expedience of resolving litigation that's that results in zoning by litigation um you guys make the determination so um I hope you uh um read the terms of that settlement agreement very closely before you vote to approve it um you know it could set a precedence that any time somebody doesn't like a decision you make they get into a lawsuit and uh get what they want outside of your Pres with that said um the um you know the uh applicant uh my my my client's concern is that the applicant um seems to be acting outside of borrow approvals that exist um she's already got tables there that that AR that that that she's applying for now he's putting lighting up that that no one approved uh again we're not asking for holiday snack bar to go away we're just seeking that the uh applicant comply with whatever you decide and kind of based on not just past but current experience the applicant is going to unfortunately take advantage of any uh um non-specific or any interpretative Clauses uh that aren't specifically laid out um when you if you guys Grant an approval and that's my client's fear that unless you specifically say this and not that she's going to assume it's okay to do and uh this isn't just you know some uh Theory this is past practice so I'm just asking the board to consider urgently and deeply uh not just the terms of the settlement agreement but any other restrictions you think are appropriate to impose this is a residential era and and non-conforming uses uh are to be treated when given the opportunity restrictively not expansively whenever an application comes up there's law to the effect that you try and restrict the non-conforming use not expand it so with that said uh we'll submit and uh that's all I have thank you Mr lady may I please add something um one more since you have spoken but and this we've been here for a while yes come on back up I'm not going to shut you down as long as it's okay with our with our standin chair one see and the board go ahead thank you uh this is a residential area but the this neighbor who is the sole complaintant of the of the entire neighborhood the entire town really uh is within a quarter mile four a establishment that serve liquor till 2 and 3 in the morning and he has a problem with children playing with toys or or lights being in a buffer zone I find this absolutely absurd he's entitled to his opinion as are you and I understand and I appreciate your comment thank you you're welcome I have a zoom we have someone from Zoom folks we're we can't We're Not Gonna redo everybody come back up again everybody's been heard trust me the border and I will have comments for the board in response to some of the things Mr Ley said but please everybody spoken if there's someone new from Zoom okay let's have the new person who hasn't spoken yet please b t hi uh hold on just hold on hold on you there yeah sir can you state your name and address for the record please hi my name is Bill torlot and I'm at your last name please t o Ur t l l o t t e and we're at 47 Nelson Avenue raise your right hand please do you swear affirm the testimony you'll give before this boort will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes it is go ahead please speak up so everyone can hear you okay let me know if you can't um my thoughts are really fairly concise um I love the snack bar I am not the enemy of the snack bar um I've been going there since about 1963 64 65 my grandmother used to take me there really fond memories it's never occurred to me to eat outside of those walls to me all the character and history of it is within the inside um this seems fairly simple to me I I'm in in real estate commercial real estate and and to me this looks sort of like a classic attempt to try to create more intensity of use and get every last little bit out of this small site that is possible I'm all for what the snack bar has always been but trying to turn it into a big time outdoor establishment which is what's happening just doesn't seem appropriate so that I'm not for I I'm not against the snack bar I hope it's there for another 50 60 70 hundred years I just think it needs to stick to what it's about and not try to Max it out um folks nearby may think that it's not a big deal but the the the person complaining about it and having a problem with it is absolutely the most effective neighbor and I understand it's pretty clear what they're trying to do is increase the number of seats which is what the valuation of uh restaurants is governed by is number of seats they're trying to make their business more valuable uh but the other folks it's not a zero it's a zero sum game it comes out of the enjoyment of their property and it comes out of the value of their property to them and any future user if the intensity gets out of out of control I just think uh the zoning board it's you know you want to say yes to people you want to try to be flexible and give them what they want they haven't shown a history of sticking to the rules or doing things without permission uh as Mr Ley has pointed out everybody around town seems to know that and I really think you need to just rein this thing in stop trying to make 20 you know put 20 pounds in a 10 pound bag and I I just uh I support the the board in in restricting this and saying no you really got to keep this in the spirit of what it's historically been that's what they bought that's what they had and I in my view this is just um they're they're going too far and that's the spirit of my thoughts okay any that's it thank you thank you anyone else from the public who has not been heard your name and address Brian Boer 5447 South Long Beach Boulevard hogate give me your address again please 5404 South Long Beach Boulevard hogate I'm Eileen's husband hold on raise your right hand do you swear for the testimony you give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing bucket I do I I listened to the gentleman that just spoke and he's talking about pushing the limits and pushing the limits we are asking for 70 seats right now since 2013 the holiday snack bar has had at least 7 2 seats the only thing we asked to do was take 16 seats I believe from the inside and move them outside they've already had outside seating for 24 people we've already been approved by the burrow um administrator for 36 to 45 outside seats we're asking for 42 now you know another one of the problems that I have that I I feel like I need to mention is we were taking the superior court on this by by a certified letter from my neighbor that was taken back a year later and a new certified a new truth was put out a year later so we're standing here now three years two and a half years later on a certified statement that was false that was refixed a year later and we're still addressing the same conern hold on hold on hold on hold on that's that's it but okay hold on let let me me stop all right I'm going to stop hold on I'm going to stop it now the litigation was filed by the burrow against the holiday snack bar your client Mr Ley we've not met it's pleasure to meeting you Mr D also file a lawsuit against this board that's what brings us here that lawsuit was filed by lawyers any arguments about the propriety of that lawsuit based on some letter that was sent and then another letter sent that's not before this board tonight the matters have been litigated there's been a conditional Global resolution of both pieces of litigation that bring us here today on that note let me say this Mr Le with all due respect there's nothing been done in the back room what's happening here tonight and you said it and you know this land use board matters in situations like this where an application is denied and there is an appeal to the Superior Court like in this case can be resolved pursuant to a case called Whispering Woods this is a Whispering Woods hearing this is the way it gets done it's not like lawyers crafted this in behind closed doors and this settlement isn't being vetted out this evening it's exactly what's happened in in conjunction with the conditional the conditional settlement agreement and I made this speech in the beginning but I'll reiterate it so the board and everyone in the public understands the conditional settlement agreement said that the applicant had to come back before the board for a public hearing which is what we're doing tonight and submit a plan an amended site plan that complied with the terms and conditions of the settlement agreement the conditional set agreement that have been entered into anre agreed to by the lawyers for the burrow for the applicant and for the land use board that was my predecessor that was in 2023 we're here we've heard testimony this evening on behalf of the applicant not only from Miss balker but also the applicants professional Mr bazasi we've heard testimony from members of the public we've heard your arguments and your cross-examination we've heard from our burrow engineer now it's for the board to decide based on the evidence and testimony presented tonight whether or not they want to Grant this application there's nothing backdoor about it people are in favor of it people are against it and the board has heard them and the board will do its job rest assured the board knows what their task to do they will consider the testimony and evidence and they will make a decision based on the testimony and evidence that was presented and please know this I said it before I'll say it again we are not a board of enforcement so whether or not there are things going on right now the holiday snack bar that may or may not be in violation of a barrow ordinance or anything else is not for this board to adjudicate this board does not enforce burrow ordinances or the burrow code or state law they decide land use applications that's it if this is approved there will be a resolution it will be very specific I will prepare it the board will adopt it we've heard the testimony the applicant will comply with all the conditions in the settlement agreement that's been testified to under it will be in the resolution if it's approved if there's a violation of the resolution of approval that's an Enforcement issue somebody can raise that if it happens nobody has a crystal ball by the way I understand Mr Ley you know that there's whether you want to call it president there's things in the past you know history repeats itself nobody knows um the applicant has by my count three very good lawyers Mr Dal Mr Raven and then there was Mr Herbert who handled the prerogative rid appeal against this land use board so I'm sure that she will be well advised as to what her duties and obligations are in the event it is approved if it's denied it's denied and I'm sure one or all of her lawyers will tell her what her options are but the board will be as Fair uh we had our chair um abstain the class one and class three members are not here because this application is for what's known as a D2 variance it's an expansion of a pre-existing non-conforming use and Mr Ley with all due respect the municipal use law in the state of New Jersey allows zoning boards were reconstituted as a zoning board to Grant if the evidence and testimony is sufficient expansions of pre-existing non-conforming uses that's state law New Jersey it applies here in Beach Haven it applies to every other municipality in the state of New Jersey so I just want everyone to be clear about that nothing's back door at all this was a full public hearing we've been going on for at least over an hour I don't even remember when Ship Bottom ended um but that's what's going going on so at that I'm going to ask one more time now folks I know it's a public it's a public meeting we're still open to the public lots of you have already spoken um the board has heard all this if anybody really has anything else to say that's fine but let's try to wrap this up two people on Zoom okay let's do the zoom people please if they've not already been heard Michael Ward yes thank you Michael J 408 Center Street I rais my right hand and I solemnly swear or affirm tonight that testimony I'll give this board shall be the truth and the whole truth so help me God thank you Mr Ward uh I put up my hand before I listen to your excellent rendition Mr Riso uh I fly agree that this is a opportunity for the board to take a position on on what has been really and truly a a gem a business for many for the many years I've owned property in in Beach Haven I've owned my house at 408 Center Street caddy corner to the holiday snack bar for 25 years I know that Mr and Mrs Baler haven't owned for that length of time but I can say quite honestly that for the t period of time that they have been owners the last several years any time that there's been an issue a question or anything else regarding their operation that I've needed to have answered uh they've answered it they've been forthright and I'm not going to embellish anything you said but I certainly think that you know my experiences over the years with the Beach Haven L use board they'll listen very carefully to the testimony tonight and I'll tell you I think that this is an application that really and truly is beneficial not only to the neighborhood but to the community and I'm very very happy that the lawyers that have been involved in this both on the you know for the objectors and the applicants and even yourself Mr re so I know you weren't exactly involved in litigation but those lawyers have crafted a settlement which I think is consistent with the historic use of the property since since superstorm uh Sandy in 2012 and also is something that really and truly will be a very very moderate moderate imposition to the community someone during the Ship Bottom testimony talked about the fact that we have these wonderful establishments but they're only Avail they're only available to do any real business for sometimes three four months the Holly snack bar has been a credit to our community in Beach Haven since 1949 or whatever and I really hope that the board uh grants this settlement approves the settlement tonight that's all I have to say Thank you Mr Riso thank you Mr Ward Kaylee hi uh Kaylee Boker Jenkins spell that second part of your second of your last name bo ER b o w k r that one I know the other one Jenkins j n k i ns that I get your address please 5404 South Long Beach Boulevard Holgate raise your right hand please do you swear affirm the testimony you give before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do go ahead please speak up so I'm sorry I did miss a portion of this I'm actually at work um on the ambulance so if I'm interrupted by the pager I do apologize um but I just wanted to say to the board um to thank you for considering all of this and I do ask that you guys approve the application just for the sense that after growing up in Beach Haven and experiencing the holiday snack bar as both a patron and the owner's daughter um being able to interact with all of the customers on both those different levels I was a server at the chicken or the egg for 13 years and having the access to other restaurants and the ability to sit outside and enjoy what is a beautiful place in Long Beach Island and people come to Beach Haven and Long Beach Island just for the sense of community that we all have and being able to sit together outside and wave at friends as they walk up to the beach is just one of those really amazing aspects to Beach Haven and so I just want to thank you all again for listening and hope that you approve this for the betterment of the town thank you anyone else from the public your name again for the record yes sir my name is Bill Hudson 23 West Washington Avenue H Hudson you you've been sworn already you're still under Earth you understand that yes sir I do go ahead uh testimony tonight at this board at this hearing by Mr brazinski a certified planning expert has stated that there has been in the past 50 to 85 seats there we're talking half of that now we're talking 50 to 85 seats with his testimony to the attorney that pushed him to give him an answer he gave him an answer 50 to 85 the next thing is that he said incorrectly the attorney that Mr herkner has the most uh issues with the problem other than anybody else that's not true herkner have a 10- foot buffer zone Sue shy and chief Sharky have no buffer zone they're right behind them with a fence they said there's zero problems here's a guy next door that's picking at little minuscule things where's the bench where's this where's that and then he said to try to influence the board and the knives and forks and spoons and plates are at all hours that's not true sir they're done at 11 the place closes at 10: then they're done at 11 so he's trying to influence that there's even more problems are after 11 which there's zero testimony to that already at all the next thing is four neighbors around the whole rest of the area testified that this is a great place they go there and they want to see it continue now we spent $150,000 of taxpayer money in Beach Haven on this already M Boker is into 50,000 there is as this St gentleman uh lanus board attorney said there's a settlement and it's been not a back door as you said this has been negotiated for like two months okay we have a settlement it's a good settlement 42 seats is a lot less than what used to be there to a property that's been there for 75 years I think this is time to end all of this and I ask you to do that and improve this thank you so much thank you anyone else from the public name and address please my name is Joseph uasa y u h a s z 414 Midland Avenue Pine Beach New TR raise your right hand yes just minute Mr do you swear affirm the testim G before this board will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do just one second yes Mr Le go ahead I don't envy you people I know you got rules and regulations and laws there's something is missing here that I have not heard anybody say Common Sense please when you make your decisions use some common sense and I thank you very much for all your effort thank you anyone else from the public I'd like to make a motion that we close the public so it's up to the board we need we need a motion do we need question sorry I was just gonna ask could very high level summary exactly what we're approving the settlement the trash cans let see my notes so you yeah exactly what we're approving that's so the application before you is to Grant a D2 variance which is the expansion of appr non-conforming use to allow holiday snack bar to operate with outdoor seating consistent with the terms and conditions of the conditional settlement agreement that will be attached to the resolution which is on file with the board which Mr little has reviewed and based on his review has testified before this board the applicant has agreed to the additional variances that were requested because it the agreement was sign it were to allow holiday s to have two bus stations and two trash stands for each bus station and an impervious coverage variance what was the number up to 61.9 the 61.9 where 60 is permitted that's what otherwise is the Minimus but yes it's another variance that there asking so it would be the D2 variance with the both variances for impervious coverage the conditions of approval were that um the applicant will agree with the terms and conditions of the S agreement Mr little comments umad Mr little so the only thing I wanted to flush out like you mentioned the two garbage cans the bus stations have to be shown on the plan revised plans is a is one of the conditions with the the changing of the two foot to the three foot which results in the increase in imper coverage and there was some table some table shifting on the West Side some of the six tops aren't where they're are shown on this plant so we need accurate location of tables the other thing I want to point out the settlement agreement talks about the buffer it says there can't be anything in it except Landscaping that means there can't be lighting so if they have to put posts up for the string lights the post will have to be outside the buffer the string lights will have to be outside the buffer but based on the photos I saw the lights are hanging in the trees and they're in the buffer so they can't be in the buffer that will be Mr that's got to be a condition to S we talked about this just want to bring that up so there's no surprises here none of those things are in the buffer they're all been removed based on the plan so even though the buffer isn't fully vegetated nothing can be in the 10 foot buffer and that'll be again enforcement corre if you approve the application correct and then we do have the one motion detector light in the back corner near the bathroom oh that's that's right that doesn't go off at 10:00 the agreement says scho off at 10:00 the other variance would be to allow the applicant to keep the motion detector for the reasons testified to for safety and we can have them note that on the plan as to location those are on my comments other than that they're in full compliance with the uh settlement agreement per my review letter so that's what you would be approving if there's a motion in that regard or so it's either a motion to approve approve or motion to deny we'll go from there please understand that the D2 variance requires five affirmative votes and Mr REO my client just asked if she could make a comment is that acceptable I don't think it's appropriate Mr you rested and we closed the public okay I'm sorry Mr Ley we're done the board's deliberating so do we have a motion and what is it please be specific yes what is it motion to approve Mr Winger hold on it's motion to approve based on what Mr little and I have just discussed subject to the testimony and all the conditions of approval for the D2 variants the bulk variances the busing stations the trash cans the removing of the lights from the buffer and swiching of the table the switching of the tables which will be noted on the plan and um the lighting yes revised plans revised plans have to be submitted by Mr baski as a condition of approval acceptable to the burrow the bur the bur and our our board engineer right second second pquest no no Jen I'm sorry I'm getting to know of you guys by name just okay all right so we have a motion in a second I'll I'll do the roll call it's okay all right just because I have it here because we're gonna count seven Mr Jenna yes Mr tinquist no Mr Balo yes Miss edles yes Mr lafredo yes Mr Winger yes Miss King so you're staining then you're abstaining then yes okay motion carries and you have five affir 1 two three you have five affirmative votes [Applause] to thank you anything further tonight if not I have a motion no wait wait wait let's let's let let's let Miss Leonard are you finish okay you want to finish that's fine all right hold on let me go back okay in the minutes oh wait we're not doing the minutes correct the minutes we're GNA wait is there approval for the bills to approve the bills a motion you just do yes yeah we need a motion to second with a Voice vote motion to approve the bills somebody make a motion motion want go second second all in favor we have new business there are two three person Review Committee applications that were approved one is for 2807 Long Beach Boulevard women's clothing and accessory Boutique there was no previous use there and the other one is the I'm saying it right gabian realy group 118 North by Avenue um going from a from retail to a real estate office they were they were both approved by the three person committee per ordinance I'm just reading that into the record that being said go ahead Miss meeting adjourn motion motion to motion to adjourn motion to adjourn is your a second real fast all in favor all oppos thank you everyone oning up