##VIDEO ID:KDwkeqqtx2g## meetings are being H in person meeting at 166 Road public wish comment requ meetings in person changes also email news news by posting Bo fors March 1324 Bo matter 11 any regular special meeting the board M lat C time and same shall be [Music] announc questions comments as appropriate once invited to do so any he board is judicial proceed any questions issues that are relev what the board legally consider reaching decision to must be maintained at allies Mr deluso here Mr Green here M framer here M ler is absent Mr McDow here Mr Malo here Mr sard here Mr slum here and Mr trainer here you have a for Mr chairman thank okay so we have be minutes from August 5 are there any additions or correct I'll make a motion to approve minutes very second second all in favor it's our appr okay mations we have a plan good to read um and we have a letter from U attorney for liing Farm do passed through the resolution that we are Memorial so the applicant has requested us to um [Music] application appr we approved it meeting but the has deter that approv so I am going to read that in under old business here whereas the application for Hing appr approval has had previously been filed by Liberty Farm dogs LLC here and after designated the applicant of bur FAL Zing board judment here after the board for property located in 21 Liberty Road BN New Jersey more specifically known as block 113 lot 13 on the tax B of bur Burnville here in Bur New Jersey with said use being not permitted in the R5 Zone and whereas a public hearing was held before the board on December 4th and March 4th 2024 December 423 March 4.4 with regard to this application then whereas the board C the teson evidence presented by the applicant Witnesses consultants and with public having had a full opportunity to participate and where at the conclusion of the hearing the board voted to approve the application with conditions and whereas subsequent to approval the board through its administrative officer gardo received a correspondence dated June 3rd 2024 from the attorney for the applicant a copy of which has been attached here to and Incorporated here in and whereas the June 3rd letter indicated that the applicant was now precluded from proceeding with the approval for the property and therefore needed to abandon set approval also indicated the applicant understood that by abandoning the approval the approval will now become no void and that the applicate would not be legally able to proceed with the use of the property as previously approved now therefore being resolved New Jersey on on 16th day of September 2024 made the foll conclusion one based upon cash correspondence the attorney dat j3 2024 the board has determined that the prior approval granted to the applicant by the board shall hear terminated and no further force or effect the approval has been deem abandoned no en void and the property that had been the subject of this application shall no longer have the benefit of PR approval anybody have any questions on not not well they're not allowed to allow to have business daycare business running at the site I'll make a motion to approve second call please and I think it's probably up here okay so Mr deluso yes Mr greenan yes M Kramer yes Mr McDow yes Mr sier yes Mr slum yes and Mr Malo yes motion pares okay and on the on the agenda here um it's only krer yes I made a mistake more the board members brought it to my attention and I redid it and that's why I read from my she here okay good okay i' left two off there cool thank Youk you okay so now we go on to application state of birth of rushman Farm Road here to represent that application yes Mr chairman my name is Susan Rubright I'm an attorney with Brock Iker in Ros Jersey and I am here tonight on behalf of the estate of Bertha e rushman okay um so first I'd like to just give a little description about the property and I know we have to go through completeness um one thing I would like sure um I know we have to go through Mr Bright's report for completeness um I would like I do have an introduction which I think will help address some of the issues that Mr brightley cites in the completeness letter so I would like to um go ahead and do that if if um if the chair would permit that um think we need to go to complet first that's certainly your your choice um that's certainly your choice because without that we're not we can't do the application um well there's some C and I appreciate that um there are some certain items that we are asking for um waivers for completeness purposes only and um there are some factual issues that I want F factual items that I wanted to bring to the board's attention that would help support the um the request for the uh for the completeness waivers um for instance um if I might while the application is styled as a subdivision with variances um I want to repeat that there's there's nothing that's going to be developed here so a number of the waivers for completeness purposes that we're asking for will go then into more detail um with the testimony as to why we're asking for waivers for that I'm sorry let's discuss that with that's fine appreciate it okay so I will um I I do have um our site engineer Richard Scher from h2m who can discuss I guess some of the issues as well raise your right hand please with regard to this matter do you SAR the testimony you're about to give show you the truth I do could you state your name last name please sure Richard schmer last name SC h o m n e r and you've been in front of this board before and qualified as an engineer I I have uh spent a while ter tring remember the past application but it was over the past 40 years I've been record this sport a number of times I'm happy to you like watch Mr qualify himself that's fine it's been around the block your is still current and active yes okay thank you thank you so first one here checklist requirements the subdivision applications are required to provide the following information under the section location of all structures including buildings Etc within 300 ft of sub and this was yeah okay so let me I think if you can just go through and site the number of the of the of the comment and then the letter and then the number as well because I'm not sure that it's being picked up and this is being recorded so I would ask everybody to keep your voices up including rusu and and the professionals but yeah just just indicate what it is that you're that you're referring to and and responding to short so um and I did a response letter uh to the board uh dated August 27th 2024 and um and and basically reiterated the comments in Mr brightley uh review memo review letter dated June 19th and then I went through Mr zabo's uh review letter uh there he did Issue a subsequent review memo I think our kind of crossed in the mail almost but um so uh so the I think the first one you're really referring to and it's uh it's item six in Mr brightly's letter uh and this is under the review checklist for concept plan I'm actually referring to Mr Zoo's letter not Mr B okay Mr chairman you may um since R reviews kind of coincide I would I would suggest that we work off this they cover everything including check and need on some of the engineering aspects of this so I think it would be appropriate to do further his review even though we kind of share that responsibility and I covered much what he did he has certain issues and questions and this is important because there are two aspects in this application I frame there's a use variance aspect of this the applicant for board for use variant of the raspberry case uh where the courts had have issued determination that there's subdivision that reduces the size of a a non-conforming use that it requires to do use it's an intensification um however this is a V1 the reason it's a V1 which the higher medich standard simply because this was this use the gther factory is associated with the use F that was granted as far back as 1959 it doesn't meet the definition of pre-existing non-conforming use for a D2 kind of application uh I think the applicant will is aware of that will address that so there's a use aspect and whether or not the board feels that the reduction in the size of the property impacts that factory in such a way that it's no longer viable or can continue to operate as it did in the past that's one aspect the second aspect and responsibly the board is to review the subdivision against the major subdivision standards of the burs and the the main main issue is under Section 10.8 10- 8.1 the lots have to be viable that ties to uh Mr bright my review in terms of what information is required or should be presented to the board the board need to determine what you're comfortable with in order to make that determination viability of these profits people ask you want to create there still also plan is looking ahead you want to make sure that the lot are suitable to and that bur will be on the Afric I'm sure the engineering plan will address those issues as well but it ties to completeness and Mr brightley had issued a letter that expressed some concerns and my recommendation is always to Grant waivers but always with the conance of the fort engineer because there may be things that I don't do to you but he may so just wanted to provide that little context okay thank you [Music] okay we start on page four okay page four of your report Mr Bley or the [Music] response the same right also right so we're on the same page right okay um and let me just in terms of context I know everybody's trying to put some context the waivers we're seeking are uh for completeness only well if during the course of the discussion and hearing the board says we'd like more information on that that's fine we we'll seek to give you that information so it's not we're really hoping to be able to get past the check waivers so we can proceed with a discussion of the application um and and I think when you hear more you'll you'll understand better again the context of the application I know what Mrs rub was was going to say with respect to the application in terms of there's no development proposed with this subdivision now we're carving the property up into some New Lots but we're not proposing a typical we're here to seek a subdivision to build on each of these lots to build new homes that's not what the applicant is here for the applicant is here to satisfy the requirements of a will and settle the estate there are three and and M rubite can tell you this and I think probably where she wanted to go in her opening comments but there are there are three beneficiaries of the estate and the objective and the only reason this application has been filed is to settle that estate so we're simply trying to carve up the lots and I probably shouldn't use the word carve up but subdivide it to create Lots so that each of the beneficiaries can settle this estate and move on the uh there's I know that from the prior applications and uh and and approvals that were issued specifically for the Glitter Factory we'll talk more about the Glitter Factory but the the industrial use on the property that there were limitations imposed that you couldn't subdivide the property further you couldn't develop the property further so long as the Glitter Factory stayed there that's fine the applicant is fine with that we're fine with that we're not seeking to change any of that we're not seeking to build over here while keeping the Glitter Factory over there again no change is proposed we're not not seeking to have any development or build something on any of the Lots this is again the sole objective and the only reason this application was filed was to settle this estate so I think that context is important to to keep in mind along along those lines so because we're not seeking to build anything not seeking approval to construct anything now or for the foreseeable future uh the applicants willing to impose conditions so that the board and the burrow is comfortable in maintaining the status quo the objective is to maintain the status quo in terms of uses and activities on this site there's a Glitter Factory there's a farm there's some residential uses all of those are proposed to stay as is no change there's large large Farmland areas those are proposed to stay as is no change so as we go through this and we and we talk about some of the waivers that we're seeking I think we want to keep that in mind the applicant's not saying well I want to build here while keeping this over here the applicant would like to keep everything just the way it is but there's a there's a mandate and Miss R can address it much better than I can a mandate with respect to settling this estate uh which has been um I'll say open for some period quite I think 2009 or something like that um so that's really the objective here and and we'll talk and you'll hear us tell you that several times probably but that's one of the driving forces behind why we didn't want to go through and why we're seeking waivers for doing some of the stuff that otherwise I'd be in Bob brightly's Camp if we were coming in to say we want to build lots on these I'd say yeah we should be doing these things I would tell the applicant we ought to be doing these things but because of the nature of this this application because of the purpose and the goals and the objectives the only reason why we're here we s let's seek waivers so that we can move on get the estate settled again we're not seeking to try to get away without doing something if during the course of this the board says I'd like more information on that we'll we'll seek to do that and before anything could get built on any of these Lots all of this work would have to be done but we don't know when that might take place and so one of the things we've said and and we can we'll go through each of the I'm happy to go through each of the each of the waivers individually but this reason I'm giving you this explanation is because I think it applies to many of them if we were to seek do a a a hard Wetlands delineation for example now well those have limited lifespans uh they're going to expire and wetlands have have a could change over time so doing that now having that locked in uh when nothing is going to happen and the LOI is likely to expire for example uh and wetlands may change in the future we don't really see the value in that uh you'll see that the lots are all way oversized compared to what the zoning requirement is and and that and that's again simply because we're trying to create specific Parcels to go to uh the beneficiaries of the estate that's again and that's why we're here um you know rules change over time so we could you know we could try to do something now that might say okay let's let's meet the current rules on demonstrating something um but those rules might change and again we're not seeking to build anything now whenever anybody might ever come to seek to build anything on the property those studies those investigations those proofs will have to be made so um that's kind of a a little bit of a uh again in context of the application and some of the reasoning why we're seeking many of these wavers and happy to go through them I mean we'll go we'll go through them but I think uh as we talk about uh many of these and you know this is uh you know starting with this first one that uh that we were just looking at um we're not there's going to be no impacts from developing this site because that's what is proposed you know usually with a subdivision I'm going to be up here talking about the roadway and the drainage and you know things like that none of that applies in this case because even though we're going to create a lot those lots can't be built so long as say the Glitter Factory stays in place again that was a restriction that was placed on the property we're not seeking to to take that away we're not seeking to change that so um um to the extent we can provide the board with some comfort as to that and so you're and and So you're satisfied that okay you're not trying to you know do something well without doing something else uh we want to try to do what we can to to make the board comfortable and to the extent we can work together towards appropriate conditions that the applicant is and I'll speak for SB uh but that the applicant is absolutely willing to to do that so I I'll leave it there Mr chairman and board members and happy to go through these individually and in more detail uh as much as you like well before you st away um okay my concern is that what this board does um has to do with lots and their future use and whatever this board does that sets B boundaries guidelines whatever for future use of P L and when you say nothing's going to be done so we don't need to do these bits I have great concern so my comment is the applicant be willing to accept a condition that says nothing can be done until these are until this no nothing can be done if you want if you want to be able to do something in the future you have to answer the board's questions today otherwise we can't act yeah Mr chairman if I I'd like a little clarification on um the question and then also just to to represent on behalf of the applicant which is the estate um and and I appreciate um Mr sher's summary um it is part of what I was going to discuss um so that's helpful to give the context um the lots are being the lots are very large and we fully accept and understand the condition that has been imposed on this property since since 1957 when Mr rushman appeared before the board at that time and was not able to and was looking to have the the the Glitter Factory use put Glitter Factory in in in quote marks um in order to help sustain supplement the income and sustain the the ability of the far of the farm to remain and that's all in the resolutions this isn't you know me saying so it's in the the prior resolutions the reason why the property has been able to remain the Pastoral scene that we all love is because of the Glitter Factory and that's why because it was it was a viable use and it remains a viable use so we are fully um willing and and advocating to accept the condition that if there was going to be any further development of the lots that have to be created in order to um complete and and finalize the the administration of the estate that condition would be that there could be no further subdivision of the lcks um that are being created um that were originally that were originally burdened by the condition that there could be no subdivision while the factory was operable we are perfectly willing to accept that condition we offer that condition um it's not an unreasonable condition so for instance some of these lots are 34 34 Acres this is three acres z um the reason why this is happening as as Mr Scher indicated is that Mrs rushman in her will set forth the general parameters for uh deeding or or or um providing um dis the Lots the the parcels for her three heirs her three children and the allocation was done such that um the the parcels were um divided based on where the family members were living at the time or near for instance um one of the me two of the two of the of the airs live on the property currently one lives adjacent to the to the to the property those are the three General um divisions and the Lots were created to um in an equal value as equal a value as possible so that the airs could be deeded that property the reason why there's eight Lots is because the railroad runs through the middle of this property and I went to high school and I took that the train and you know went on that rail on that that train line um as I'm sure you know most a lot of people know people that that did that as well um so yes and I'm really that old so you you you did it to you still rideing so you've been through the property um but that's the reason why there's eight lots and one lot um and we will talk about the factory why it's on that LW we wanted to keep as much of the pastor land available as POS as possible so it went from the entirety of Lot 2 which is 150 something Acres down to six and a half because we wanted to keep it it it um concise and have other the as much area as as possible still devoted to the pastor land um to continue the Pastoral views that we all enjoy um so when you say this is all getting to your qu to your condition when you say you can never develop this property I think that that's uh a little bit beyond the Ken of what the board can can can um dictate at this point but certainly we do not want to change anything um The Heirs to my understanding do not want to change anything that's going on on this property they love this property they grew up on this property and um to to require us to go into do a lot of invasive testing and expensive testing when there is no there's going to be a condition that the property cannot be further subdivided while the factory is in business um is is I think I mean I would submit to you is reasonable assurances that we're not going that nothing will happen to this property unless someone comes back to this board and does all of the tests that you're requesting Miss that Mr brightley has brought to your attention so when you say you divided the property up in relatively equal Valu how did you come up with those values if you don't know how the property can be developed forward good question and I think Mr Scher can can address a number can can address that because we did spend a lot of time um doing uh trying to achieve equal value and I would also um and indicate that there are pro other properties that are part of the whole equal District distribution um valuation but with regard to this specific property um I'll let Rusty discuss um how that was done sure so we did look at uh is it is it helpful to maybe look at a plan I think it would yeah um so these issues involving properties have been around for about 15 years died in 2009 yes okay yes she was pred uh her husband predeceased her and she she passed away I think 2009 20099 okay in that time has there been any keeping in mind this is land use book and we're not in Chancery where we're weighing weighing s siblings issu is there any litigation that we need to be aware of involving this family that impact what we do I not to my knowledge um no there no litigations okay and a lot question state is that our job our job is is to consider sub like any other subdivision application this happens to have answer issue invol uh we look at we need to look at this as stra subdivision we would hand and with with variances with a use variance and we handle it and consider like any other similar application I mean we're not here to to to make every body that's possible but but we're here to consider this and it has whatever we do has future implications and that's what I'm concerned about um Mr chairman and Mr Rego I just I would just like to supplement um the response to the board memb question the reason why we raise that is in support of the fact of why we need to subdivide which is technically is in violation of the ition with in connection with with the with the factory so what we're saying is that we need to do this it's it's like two different interests but we need to do this to wrap up the estate but then it violates the prior condition of having no further subdivision while the factory is in business so what we're agreeing to of course is that if the board grants the sub it's part of the rationale for why we need the subdivision basically is that we need to wrap up the estate and we are agreeing that we would condition any approval on no further subdivisions being required unless the factory goes away and we would have to come back here as well for further subdivision just another um I've not seen the will I don't know we need to but but is there a condition in the will that says there can be no subdivision I thought I read that some somewhere as long as be litter factors in operation if there is before we look at this do you need to get a court to allow that so I I understand the question there is nothing in the will I mean I'm not the I'm not the the estate attorney but um the the will sets forth the general parameters of where the just upon her passing that the distribution is to go to the three heirs and in the approximate location of where each of the three live or live near and and take care of by the way as well um there's certain um there's the one certain property uh that fronts where where a lot of the cattle are that front along um the Quarry Road and that that air that that child that child even though they're all adults um is being devised that because he takes care of that property he lives on that property um it's a general allocation that we then had but can we does the will say that the property as it is now which is bigest problem does it say that that it cannot be subdivided legally unless and until the glitter trory go out no it does not say that it's it's it's it's not in the not to my not to my knowledge and and I have reviewed those relevant sections correct I have a question uh it's a Bo I think um is there a way to essentially bate this application to hear what really is the CR of the matter which is the rationale for why there sub we're starting to talk about it already which is sort of what does the will say is that a legitimate reason you know to support you know could be variances that they're requesting and deal with that issue first before we spend a ton of time dealing with a lot of engineering issues and I think the engine makes a good point about weapons you know do we need to consider it or not it almost seems like that would be like once we deal with the issue of whether this should even move forward from a from a legal standpoint around whether there's legi rationality what is what is complete that's where I'm trying to get to yeah there a way you could sort of say we're going to like hold on completeness from the from the subdivision standard standpoint and and deal ESS the use Vari first and then which is why I was asking about further development because we don't have enough we don't have enough information to really talk to Locks yeah so because all this stuff is missing so how do we handle that with conditions or restrictions on the property and if there's a decent way to do that then we can grant waivers for the missing elements and that's where I that's the path I was trying to go down certain rich I asked John to chime in too the elanes law allows an applicant I don't know if we can for it but it allows an applicant to say I'm going to split this let's deal with the use First and the subdivision all that second but I mean they're not developing anything here so I'm wondering what the second part would be other than here the lines that we're that we're proposing what I don't want to do and I you mention the will but I don't think this board wants and even care about will no my my point is I don't want to know what the will says I'm told it's this property just to be uh dived up three ways uh we we can't deal with who's how much one's worth as opposed to the other we're looking at this in when here here it is and I can understand if nothing's being this was a lot being developed I think we we'd probably be here for a year to you know hearing this thing but it's not so I think um and I understand the chairman here we want to know what what is there going to be another card being turned over here we don't know that whatever's turned over here act like I'm back here anyway I mean if we we need to make sure that the resolution states that and the applicant accepts that condition in the resolution there's a subdivision here three three lots and then you're talking about eight Lots it's a lot of moving part to it if the board ultimately decides to Grant the relief um we're not going to do it based on who's happy and who's not happy and who wants another rer who doesn't want another rer this is the plan if the plan gets survis wonderful if all the siblings get together and do whatever they have to do to be happy and you revise the plan and come back and everybody Happ we're looking at the the lines on the on the plan and we're looking on our experts reports and what we don't need to know as Ed said the will is not our concern this is a straight maybe not so straight subdivision application without development at this point without any changing on this point other than putting lines on the lots and lines on the plan and as long as everybody knows as the chairman said other than that we're not going any further I mean if if anyone wants to develop this or build on it you have to approach it like any other like any other Z applicant in Burnsville that's what we can say we're not you just can't get a subdivision and go up and build something you got follow the you know that sus years yeah and the chairman wanted to make sure that that that was clear that we're here to again I don't personally care about a will I just want to know if there's any litigation that involved us which I've not heard of so um other than that how I'll the best way to proceed without wasting you know uh right now on Contour and all this and just what do we what we focus on to get it moving I just ask one question I've heard this a couple times that if the Glitter Factory was to go away that they have to come back to the board and for what reason no I I let me let me try to to clarify the condition of the approval and the condition in the the several resolutions of approval um that were drafted by this by older iterations of this board state that the property cannot be subdivided any further or could not be subdivided if and if it were then the Glitter Factory could not operate any longer that's the connection and you're looking at me I don't think question I understood you to say that if the the L fact use it's abandoned then you have to return to the board to do any other devel no no that's not what I said if I said further subdivision right further meaning okay no good question okay so let me clarify that so what we're seeking to do and we can we put this up because I think this would really help if we could put this up visually we are seeking to subdivide lot two which was the Prohibition in all of the prior res Solutions we're seeking to do that because we need to subdivide in order to divise the property according to the will so what we're saying is that we would agree that we would not so there's one lot I think it's 34 Acres if if someone came in and wanted to subdivide that property into three AC Lots 10 Lots 10 Lots then they they would have to obviously come back to this board but the Glitter Factory would cease to exist so that's you know that that's what that's what the connection is that's not this application is that's not this application so the way the way I see it what I'm hearing is that we divide this up into eight Lots conceivably somebody could put up a single house on each one of those lots because it is residential corre and they would not need to come before this board to do that they just go get their building permit because obviously they have an adequate size lot Circle whatever and that's and that we do show that on the plan but you know obviously they would need to get all of the other if you want to subdivide then the only time the sub subdivision could occur the subdivision application could occur is once the Glitter Factory ceases to exist right I don't think the subdivision application causes that the the Glitter Factory to cease to exist I think the Glitter Factory has to cease to exist before a subdivision application could be made and once that once the Glitter Factory ceases to exist there are six eight Lots whatever the number is and those would go before the planning board not the board of adjustment in order to be sub I think that's what I'm hearing paration from kind going to go through they use variance and there's convential variances no well not building anything but there's existing structures that require certain set go through setbacks because we're creating new laot lines yeah as an example there's nothing this R it was my uh yes I without without without confirming that it's quantification ah this is great okay this this I think will be really helpful don't want to go through evid right now okay understood no but I think this would be helpful to show and do you have the other one that shows it so onek yes two questions one is when um there saying that the Glitter Factory goes away does that mean cease to exist and or does the building go to the dirt and it becomes you know a buildable lot without uh without industrial structures on it anymore or does it become a warehouse or Amazon or something that's my question that's first question second question is um I Heard and plus what I've read many times it's this thing is basically based on the will of course but that equal value equal value to said twice tonight in the T workor it's equal value but I'm having I'm struggling with how could you mine happen to be on the floor but how could you how can a appraiser appr those blue lines for equal value if in fact he doesn't know where the wetlands are he doesn't know where the slopes are he does that one is is not AR concern equal value is something for the estate lawyer to take care of I don't want to talk about equal value okay we already land use for it and again we EST the they put the line they can put the line where they want the U but you bring up a really good point with the Glitter Factory and the Glitter Factory the glitter 2% the ability was operating in just 2% we read the rest Amazon that's the same concept the the the resolution from 1950 whatever was written to the Glitter Factory but oh by the way at this point it really ought to be any commercial concern on that piece of property not just the glitter tractor I I think it was very interesting as as a land use attorney for low these many years on a planner prior to that to see the um conciseness and short I don't know if this is the correct way to say but the shortness of the resolutions compared to what a lot of resolutions and the way boards think today the resolutions were not that long um recommendations they were actually recommendations that went to before we got ml in 1975 um those are conditions that the board could posit um you know because it's not stated it just says the voter Factory but I think there simplicity work if you look at the overall picture where is this is a farm I need to supplement my income I'll keep this pastorial as long as I can operate this commercial as I guess you to that'll supplement but again once that goes away then it becomes a minimum of Eight houses could be 50 houses you know that's a whole different I think Mark what I think is important is that the glitter Factor becomes in definition commercial concern so I don't want to tie to just the Glitter Factory I would like any any commercial concern that there's no subdivision as long as the commercial concern still exists but Mr chairman I don't believe that the use variance that was granted by the burrow to the Glitter Factory would extend to any other back yeah that's that's true you're right John you're right absolutely because it's a residential zone so change the use of that property still have ask what they're doing but we can we can clean we can make very clear by saying any commercial concern we're basically starting scrap right the subdivision voids the original variance void it well it does it that's a part of their application as a full new variance for existing Factory on six ACR exactly so then we can we can Define commercial property or we need to we needed to clarify these issues rather than them coming up two months from now we need to get them on the table so we all know are those the kinds of things that would be acceptable the applicant so that we could move forward um yes yes they would be okay so let's go through the rest of the items here that Bob noted most of them are sorry pardon no I was just going to looking at the labors Mr chairman so you want to go through those like take a look at those yeah I'm looking at the other Checker which which are the things that are site work which would all have to be satisfied in order to do subdivision as long as there's no subdivision that's allowed we don't need to do the site work at this point which is what I think the applicants posture it and given the size of the Lots we did we did supplement the plans with some additional information we showed for example the soil's information uh I mean I can give you information about the slopes and and what those slopes are uh so that you if that helps the Board understand understand the property a little better um so I don't if you want to go through them briefly item by item or um I'm just I'm just looking through the checklist myself and everything in section six if I'm reading it correctly Bob item six is all really site work that would have to be done for a subdivision this is sub yeah I know it's subdivision but if it were to further sub provided in order to put houses on it you really need to do good stuff well um the board's going to have to make that decision the property contain flood Hazard areas Wetland baring buffers both 300 and 150 and probably lot you know some Ste SPS I think those are the issue those go to and then whether you can get on where the Wells are how how are these Lots going to be service are I think there's seven Wellings on the property right now based on prior applications where are those sep systems how are they getting their water cross property l so there's issues I think but what I'm thinking is that if you wanted to put one house on that lot if it didn't have a house on it already okay you would have to pass through Board of Health you'd have to pass through where setic going to be where well going to be you couldn't do if if you were violating the steep slope Thord we be back here um just to put a house on an empty lot if the lot already has a house on it you can't put a second one without coming here so there's enough um barrier to further develop where all of the things that you're mentioning are terribly important but would have to be satisfied either by the building inspector by the health department by engineering somebody and it would get reviewed when you're trying to put a house on piece of property that's that's true that's going to be decision the board has today yeah you know whether some of these Lots you're limited to developing in one quarter and that's going to require 5 yard VAR but but we can discuss that when we're looking at the locks right now we're looking at checklist waers yeah in the past the way we've done it was um we' asked John we asked Bob here's the checklist what what do you think and they either said we need to know it that or we can go ahead and hear the application but we always like to ask more information when issue comes up if we're if we two hearings in we have issues as to flood planes or or SE SL certainly ask but it's just going get over the the additional fle of complete this move ahead so that's where we should be so I think that's what IEM six we started discussing um and I think that we might have enough checks and balance in other areas of land where we could hear it without specifying all of this stuff front Ator well we we Grant the wa D so we go through we certainly welcome to go through the waiv um and it sounds like the African is okay with us granting waivers and and sort of reserving the later application risk we agree with that and I just wanted to get a feel for the board's ability to hear this application given all the items that are missing in the application that Bob and John have noted and I think that they're all important I really do but I just want to make sure that we've got the protection we need so that anything we do will um make sense will be legally binding it's not going to get overthrown by the suor court and that's where I'm was coming yeah want to make sure that we keep up everything we do um strictly legal that's not this board is about that probably [Music] do you know there is is it I don't know if it's in the sewer surface area that's when you that's when you come up with plan for subdivision [Music] then so know just pass my house here we never protect the slopes we never protect the streams we don't have to protect the slopes and we don't have to protect streams because oh by the way in order to put a house up you got to get all the other approval so when the building inspector looks at plant and sees what slopes are if you disturbing more than 250 ft of 30% it's here so all those all of those protections are already in the zoning work confirmed by the tax assess yep subdivision PL should be revised to reflect the anticipated Lot number which uh just did that we did that we did that um rest of the the rest of the report really isn't dealing with waivers to go through report and identify the variances yeah typically what we do there's not a lot of technical comments because development this time okay but the M the main the variances the Wagers are mainly about things that will be required for environmental constraints is focus of our completeness okay and as long as the applicant is comfortable with no further subdivision as long as the Comm concern exists and any further subdivision would then have to go to either the planning board here depending upon what it looks like then all of those questions would get answered at that time well I'm not looking at Future subdivision I'm looking at this subdivision whether these Lots at some point down the road can fit a single family house about 2011 it's got flood planes Wetlands buff it's going to have an accessory BN on where's the access to that lot coming from okay so does it make sense then to have those items identified during the hearing process it's continue to be my recommendation that at least being environmental constraint you never you never stated that they need to go get an L but they could get a w expert to approxim the other information is really they already you they show the buers are not correct they have I missed that could you repeat that question Le on the first wasn't really question and it show they show buffers but they weren't correct on the original plans maybe they corrected them now yeah yeah no we did that was that's in my response letter plans okay okay so during the course of the hearing if you find that the information that's being presented is remains incorrect is it acceptable to have it be corrected before yeah I mean it's it's it's on the plans I think the board has a better understanding that these large Lots can easily accommodate a cont home okay you know not a little accessory apartment above so question to the board um are you comfortable with granting the waivers that the applican has requested feel we've covered the issues enough that during the course of the hearing if there's something you're uncomfortable with we can ask for more information that's the question of the board what did you say if we grant waers for any application we always Reserve write the applicants agree to ask questions down the road if we didn't think something in front and something ver said we can ask for something traffic environmental that maybe wasn't was obvious in the beginning but it pops up now certainly so if you grant wavers and move ahead know we get suck on something we can get the information from that and I'm Susan yes absolutely we agree it's a a standard it's a standard condition I'm that this is not a standard welcome do put lock lines on on a map y and we're not gring any approval to do anything corre L if there problems down the road and Grant approvement one of the Lots doesn't have access if they want to do something with it they got to get access somewhere somehow well whatever I'll make a motion to Grant the requested reimbursement subject to our um receiving information it need be down the road what okay that we're just going to put lines down well they're going to make a case and their case ultimately is going to be we want to have this property subdivided into three total of eight and and yeah I mean we're not dealing with any construction any sewage any whereever Wells going to be swimming pools anything like that um in fact if you read the environmental commission it's they want a lot of this to stay open but uh that's down the road yeah so we're basically dealing with just dividing this property into eight Lots as they've requested and we can certainly question uh you know if there's no access I don't know if at this point we would they're not developing anything you know they're not asking for any changes other than putting lines that aren't there now and uh for purposes of resolving and L and have you years on this Bo have you ever seen any application come in to subdivide a lot at least some of the bare minimum information being that we just have lines on a piece of paper basically well what's been the experience here and other other boards I represent there are there are applicants that can in they don't want to build anything they just want subdivide subdivide piece of property maybe down the road the normal situation not here would be to sell now I get a subdivision I sell it to a developer and I'm happy and he's happy um yes I've seen people come in with they just want to diving up lots and usually they're building Lots this is this is different and the way this is easier in that sense because we don't have to worry about Road Connections uh driveways Landscaping trees they're not doing any of that so yeah this is not runof-the-mill but it's within our within our bail and Mark I know that people have come in specifically when the P zoning was in before actually was in forc people were dividing their property yeah into so I know that that happened if they never did those 5 Parcels essentially abandoned so the lines are based on what lines are based on what people want put they want they're going to tell us what they want to do how they want to do it show these um if it makes sense and it doesn't uh involve anything that's going to hurt Bernardsville which I can't see but but so it's basically it's it's their Bing they're going to tell us what they want to do we listen we ask questions and when all is said and done the land's going to look St now or uh the way it looks now is going to look the same way if we Grant the because they can't develop they don't want to develop it so it's going to look the same it's just going to be up legally family members and we are going to put controls in there so that it cannot be developed until the commcial conc goes in which case then the stuff goes to the planning board but it still has to go to a board in order to be in order to any further sub and that's what's important I I don't want to just Grant something and have it be acceptable and and nobody ever has to come back to any board and do they want wrong answer yeah or if someone wants to build a nonresidential structure down here they have to which is not permitted they have to come here might be the point is can't do anything with them without coming back to a board if for granted you may haven't heard of and so without the subdivision information that Bob is recommending and I understand why it's terribly important but if you can't subdivide it if you can't do things then we're relatively protected in just dropping L and that's what I'm hearing so we Grant these wavers and it's been moved and seconded okay um all in favor of granting the w [Music] okay so the application is complete now here Susan what are your G PL and I turns Witnesses um I have Mr Scher um and I also have um environmental Consultants here if we need them but I think uh no planner no planner no ton Sean morsky is our planner he's not here tonight he is not here he's not available this evening okay so Rusty and and if we need um which I'm hoping we don't for their sakes and mine and yours um but they I have um Francy Stella from my office who's the environmental attorney and Jo sori um for ver from verdantis who um are uh available to testify that any of the um issues concerning any environmental questions that may be raised and um with with regard to the factory if there's any questions about that and the normal rules apply your witness test advised the board asked questions the public can ask questions of the witness regarding his testimony regarding his testimony and move on okay see you're still under Ro yes sir okay so um we did did we qualify yes I thought you did okay great my goodness yeah so um what I what I'd like to have Mr Sher do is um just describe using some of the plans and the the very nice aerial photo that is up on the screen now um go through some of the existing conditions and then or or the relevant existing conditions and then discuss um the um existing physical characteristics and then what we're proposing to do in terms of the law ones and if you use and if you have any exhibits that we don't have let us know something otherwise you're assume we have yeah I think you should have everything except what's up actually you have this you have that oh that's the one okay that's the one without the proposal lines I see blue lines and I think yeah okay so we will we will have that shown I think we did see it briefly and so we will submit that to miss valo okay all right um so Rusty just go through as I noted the existing conditions the location the lock sizes and layout The Zone the accessways which the property does front on um mbrook road which is also known as 2 202 and um what's theik and Pad okay and all right just kind of take take the board through this then um with with all those okay queries in mind so what I have on the screen is a plan that was submitted so you should have this um and it's an aerial photograph it's it's entitled aerial map with Photo locations dated February 21 2024 it was submitted with the subdivision plans and uh so using this and I'm going to zoom in because is so who prepared I can't I can't see this that well this is an aerial photograph that it's an aerial photograph that we that we obtained and then we overlaid uh uh information from the survey of the property um to show the properties so um so let me just kind of go through a description of the properties and um I'll kind of start bigger scale and then I'll zoom in as we go along so just for orientation and and and before I do that this contains also a number of photographs which are keyed into uh numbers of the yellow circles here we can look at any of those but if you have the map and you've had an opportunity to look at it it does give you a pretty good sense of what the property looks like today um and that is a lot of open space Open Fields Farmland um is what you see largely from the exterior number of the photographs are keyed in into where the the Glitter Factory is and we can look at those as we go along if we like so uh in big picture this property is 215 Acres just over 215 Acres uh as you can see here and just for orientation um North is now just scroll down you can see the the north arrow is up here so North is up the page North is going up the page I would and Route 202 or Minebrook Road runs along the top of the page if you will if you could follow kind of where I'm where I'm showing with the with the cursor um I always think of 202 running North and South it actually kind of runs a little more East West here um so uh Route 202 is at the top of the page as Susan said the property is bisected by railroad uh new NJ do Department trans Transportation railroad formerly the Eerie lacana Railroad runs through the property uh in this uh sort of circuitous manner if you will um through the middle of the property and then the rest of the property is to the south of that so we really have two Parcels that make up the total 215 Acres this Northern parcel which fronts on Minebrook road and it also Al fronts fronts on ner Road over here on the left or sort of the the west west side uh that property is 124.5 Acres it is block 96 lot two and that is the entirety of this uh Northern parcel bounded by the railroad and Route 202 and ni road to the left actually goes up to Cory road to the very very top there so that that is one parcel on the north side of the railroad tracks 124.5 Acres on the south side of railroad tracks is a separate block and lot it is block 100 lot one and that is the entirety of this portion here on the southern side of the railroad all of this and that is 90.6 7 Acres uh so that's in total that's where we get the 215 Acres of between 1245 and the 90.7 Acres on on the South Side here so let's look a little Clos and I'm sorry yes so um and pill Hill Road uh it has Frontage on pill Hill Road down here on the South Side so that runs along the southernly border so we have Frontage on Phill Hill Road down here so as you can see it has significant Frontage on a number of streets pill Hill on the south ner on the west Minebrook on the on the northwest and a little bit on quy up to the north Northeast um so let's take a little closer look at um these lots and see what's going on here so looking at this block 96 lot two with 1245 acre parcel okay what we see is and where the pictures are we can look at those if you like but in the center basically in the center of the property is what's going to referred to as the Glitter Factory uh there is a factory building there are some other accessory structures there is a and we can zoom in and look at these so the main the main Factory building uh there are uh um there's an office garage over here with an apartment uh there's a building called the creary building one called The Greenery building there is a main cow barn and a smaller cow bar and a horse barn um so those are the other accessory structures uh those are on in right in the vicinity of the factory uh and those so we have the factory operations and there's also the farming operations so some of these uh structures are associated with the me meow Brook Farm activities if we look a little bit to the west of uh the gler factory which is kind of in the center we have a more residential use so this is a dwelling for Roberto rushman uh and clustered in this area uh are three other accessory residential structures there is a there's a guest Cottage uh there is a what's called a farmer Cottage over here and then there is a a garden Cottage so and we've identified these on the subdivision plans uh but there are got the main house uh three other accessory residential structures which are existing and a number of other accessory structures there's a greenhouse uh there's a couple of chcken houses um there's a Goose house there's three garages on the property and a pool and a pool house toward the back of the property so those are really again clustered in the area of this particular residential use sorted to the west side of the brother Factory if we move a little bit to the east side of the Glitter Factory over here then uh we're looking at where there's another main dwelling and this is the residence of of Peter rushman uh and Associated and around there is a pool and a deck uh there is another one other accessory residence on the property and that's actually called the pond Cottage uh which is up uh further to the uh to the north than and East um and then around the dwelling uh is a is a workshop uh nearby is a workshop um a tool fed a feed house a calf Barn up up a little bit above it um there are a number of small sheds uh and a barn in the back and a roofed area which which is which is over here so again that is really the activities that are taking place on um around that residential uh structure surrounding uh all of these improvements and again you've got the Glitter Factory in the middle and a couple of residential uses on either side surrounding all of these and just to back out again so those are kind of in the center surrounding all of that is active Farmland with mostly Open Fields and some wooded areas so you look at the uh look at the aial you could see all of this area to the to the West uh is largely Open Fields you can see where some of the wooded areas are at the perimeter along along a driveway along some tree roads which you typically see with farming activities certainly some trees are in the house areas uh some other areas where there's some trees but a lot of open space and a lot of open Farmland um so that's what you see on on this 124 and a half acre parcel the north of R track looking at block 100 lot one uh it contains uh basically Open Fields associated with the farm use and some areas of Woodlands there's no structures no homes uh no buildings and I should have mentioned actually going back to the north side there's a barn on the west side over there is a barn uh commonly called the white barn and then there is a small shed over uh near one of the fields it's it's called the field tool house but it's a shed but the uh there on going back to the South side though on on block 100 lot one there's no structures on this side of the railroad tracks this is all Open Fields um again Associated largely with the farm use um to the to the West um as Susan pointed out uh I mentioned Roberta Rush's house and Peter rushman house to the west and just offsite but adjacent to this lot on a separate lot which is lot 1.01 is the residence of the of the third sibling Henry rushman so his house is over here uh this track is is already subdivided out it's not part of this application but just kind of pointing out where the the siblings dwellings are that Susan indicated that are on or near the near the property um but the the lot that is part of this subdivision is this lot you can see some wooded areas but most of it is being open field um so that's the that's the entirety of the property the 215 Acres uh the entire property is in the r1a residential Zone uh which is largely intended for single family residential use uh minimum lot size of just over 3 acres 137,00 foot is the minimum lot size in the r1a zone uh so basically we call it a 3 Acre Zone uh is of course these lots are are very large um the property is really kind of a a valley the mine Brook runs through the property from north to south so starting at the North End mine Brook enters the property runs through the site uh kind of through the middle of the property and then exits the property on the south end uh and that's obviously flowing along through the lowest elevations of the property uh and similar to where the railroad is so the railroad and and the mine Brook follow something of a of the same pattern in terms of where they're located through the center of the property so then if we uh go from this low point in the valley and the property slopes up towards Minebrook Road 202 and then it slopes up toward pill Hill Road and to the to the east um towards adjacent properties on the east side of the property so it's high on the sort of on on the bottom of the page higher on the top of the page near Route 202 and as I said really sort of Valley running with mine Brook running through the center uh of this of this property uh we do show on the subdivision plans that were submitted plans I didn't put them on here because I was concerned about too many lines but we do show a reparan Zone associated with the mine Brook um so D would would assign a a repairing Zone to the stream um and uh we show that at 50 ft and 300 feet depending on where you are um one of Mr brightley comments in his review m talked about uh making some adjustments to that and we did make those adjustments on the plans that were that we submitting so we show that on the subdivision plans that hopefully all of you have uh so there is a repairing Zone along there and the site does contain areas along the stream primarily does contain areas of fresh water wetlands and we we've shown on the plans and assumed 150 ft Wetland transition area that's the maximum Wetland transition area that the DP would assign uh the reparan zone and the freshwater wetlands that we show on the plans are what we've taken that have been mapped by the njd under the NJ goo web uh information so we've shown that consistent uh with what's mapped on the NJ goo web uh we also show on the plans a flood plane associated with mine Brook and that is based on the FEMA of flood mapping uh in for the burrow off of Mind we've looked at those we've taken those into consideration that's been part of what's gone into study of this property over that we've been working on literally for the past couple years uh to look at how this property might be might might be used and developed not that that's not what the application was proposing to develop it but we've looked at it for what might happen and and that went to the purpose of how does this get divided to meet the requirements of the estate and was used for valuation purposes I know that's not an issue that the board would get involved with but I'm just explaining that we've looked at these environmental constraints looking at the impacts on the on the property as to as to how um that would impact the further use and development um we have we've visited the site a number of occasions looked at uh where many of these constraints are and the mapping that we show on the plans I think is generally representative of where they are we haven't done a specific on-site Wetland delineation but we have looked at areas in such this area is would certainly be classified as a wetland but having said that there are areas outside of those uh environmentally constrained areas where um looking at the lots that we'll look at in a second you could put a house on each of the individual lots that we've shown here and I know that's what Bob was concerned about looking at the subdivision as is could you could you support our house in here and in my opinion you can um and we'll look at lots more in a minute uh we added to the plans uh Bob's suggestion information about the soils um and and the soils mapping um and in doing that you can what what the soil's mapping also indicates is the topography um what I can tell you is I'm sure everybody's familiar with the site been buy it 100 or a thousand times but on the uh uh in the in the lower reaches closer to the stream and this this Northern parcel um is flatter uh through that area uh so that the topography in this area is generally mild to somewhat moderate slopes um and the and those slopes are actually closer a little closer to Route 202 um through the center where the stream is it's pretty flat when we look at the um when we look at look at lot 100 lot one the the southern parcel um that has uh that Topography is moderate to somewhat steeply sloping the soil's classifications which is a shaman Mount lucus silt Ro of 6 to 12% and then in some areas it indicates it goes up to 18% so there are areas of some steep slopes but nothing that we think is prohibitive in terms of use or development so when we look at the Lots again which we think are very oversized and not intended for development but certainly they could they could support a dwelling and I think to to Bob's comments we can be comfortable that we could provide that each each of the lots that we show can support a dwelling um not that that's what's proposed but that that it is a suitability question and and and a valid one um the property is I mentioned does have significant Frontage on Route 202 in pill Hill Road as well as on maer road a primary access into this site uh and again really the uses are clustered in the center here which is a primary access coming in off of Minebrook Road a driveway that comes in and provides access uh leading to the Glitter Factory and leading to the other uses to the to the dwelling uh to the to the west and the dwelling to the East and the other structures um no changes proposed to the access um we're not proposing anything uh there there are I should point out that because of the presence of the railroad there are actually two permitted legitimate uh Crossings of the railroad uh one is sort of on the on the right side or or more Northerly side and then one is further uh to the to the South and and West so there are to legitimate and permitted Crossings of of the railroad there and that's really to access the Farmland that's on the south side of the railroad because the the facilities structures are on the North side and the and there are simply as I mentioned just fields on the southern side um and then there are internal driveways of course to get access throughout the site um in terms of uh sewer and water came up as a question the properties are currently served by on-site septic systems and Wells um and we've shown those on the plans uh to the greatest extent that we know where all of them are but we do know that the the existing dwelling U Roberto's property Peter's property are served by individual Wells and septic systems which are in place uh so those are those are functioning uh the the factory use has its own uh septic system which we're planning to retain on its own lot that we'll look at more in a minute but the uh but all all of those are in place and I think it goes to demonstrate the suitability of the property to be able to support Wells and septic systems for single family residential use for for the Zone um there was a a question that came up and Bob you had raised it um about in ities permit and there actually is a current um permit New Jersey pollutant discharge elimination system permit for the factory oh there's two okay there's two sorry I'm correctly okay all right so those are in place and no changes proposed to those that's simply because you have a commercial type use going through a seic system but those are in they're functioning and and those are no no change Peres to that but I know Bob had raised that question question um as as we've said and continue to say that the goal is to keep all of this as is uh keep it in its current condition but really just to just to create some different Parcels uh so that we can um take care of the requirements of the Willing the estate what I'm going to go to next is another I picked the right one yes so okay another exhibit so you're going to talk about the proposed the proposed the proposed layout um and a little bit more about the Lots as we've shown them this exhibit you don't have l so and I will be happy to for it okay this is and I'll tell you this exhibit is entitled aerial map with proposed subdivision and it's dated September 133 2024 okay we prepared this one more recently for for this presentation what was the date 13th 13th yes we can provide copies we will yes I'll email to please yeah and okay let me know how many copies um it's really the same aial that we were just looking at um but we've superimposed on here in blue are the proposed lot lines so same orientation same layout Route 202 at the top the railroad through the middle so you can see the factory the Glitter Factory use here so let me just kind of briefly go through the various slots um so lot and and these proposed lot numbers uh We've assigned uh with I think they makes sense we did make a correction to them or an adjustment to them for for Bob's memo he suggested changing plot numbers and so we've done that on this exhibit and on the plans that you have and what just what were those are you going to go through yeah I'll talk about those yes so um kind of starting from the left hand side the West bu side here proposed lot 2.01 is this lot uh with Frontage on Minebrook Road and Frontage on merer road um so uh this lot is 34.95 Acres uh there's it's open space uh it does contain uh the white barn that I mentioned earlier so that's down in in this corner and the there's a shed that I mentioned uh on the property as well but basically it's Farmland uh 30 3 35 Acres basically uh the m work runs through here uh if we look at the subdivision map which I have if we want to look at individual sheets but uh if we look at that you know we do see um the areas in the low part by the Brook which contain the bulk of the environmental constraints um there is there is an area to the west and an area uh to the north uh which is uh not really encumbered uh and in my view there's sufficient space in there to put a single family home uh compliant with the requirements um particularly closer to Minebrook Road uh you're you're well uphill you'd be outside of flood Plaines and away from those areas of the greatest constraints which are which are frankly Associated right next to to the mine work itself um moving to the right proposed lot 2.02 35.6 Acres uh this is the one that I mentioned contains the single family dwelling robberto Rush's house and the other structures that I me mentioned here also contains Farmland there's a farm pond over there uh so that would that would uh be a 35 Plus acre lot again Frontage on uh on Route 202 U and um and would and would cause those structures and really really things to happen uh lot two 2.03 and 2.04 were the ones actually we s we had them numbered the other way around but her Bob's suggest we changed them so lot 2.03 would be where the Glitter Factory is it's a 6.5 acre lot we show it with a staff leading to mine Brook Road so it has Frontage and access onto Minebrook Road and that would be where the existing driveway is um we wanted to put the factory on a separate lot so that that use that fact GL Factory use would be separated and be on its own lot and so that's uh that was how this was done um the shape of these if we were doing a normal subdivision for you know single family homes of developments you wouldn't see these kinds of lot lines it was really uh constructed to accommodate the existing features on the site so for example uh the Factory there's an area which has a parking area which is used where trucks come in um we want to have access and we wanted to retain that use and activity on that lot where the Glitter Factory currently exists so that's why you see some you know different shaped lot lines in this area um and then we went up between some of the buildings again to try to separate those activities which are more associated with the glitter Factory use to stay on that um at 6 and 12 acres it's more than twice the size of minimum lot size required in the zone um and and and well when we talk about variances what you will here is that variances are not being requested because we're building anything new the variances are associated with the existing buildings and structures uh and because we're creating a new lot line so when we put a lot line for example on this West left side or the Westerly side of the of the factory building or we put one down to uh keep the factory use on one lot and try to create the other uses on the other lot the lot line ends up being close to uh some buildings so we're seeking setback variances to allow those existing structures to remain uh and it's really a setback to the new to the new lot line uh so that's that's going to be the driver and the reasons for what when you hear variances and you'll hear sounds like a lot of variances well there because there's a number of structures and again it's simply because of the proximity of existing structures to to new lot lines being created not to build any new buildings close to a lot line all of this is is you can see here and of course we zoom out you can see it's very internal uh so this is nothing that is is apparent um I know I'm sure for all of you and for me as well you drive by this property and You See Fields you don't see a factory you don't you don't see really much activity um you see Open Fields and a lot of open space um and and that your goal is to keep that um not change that um but with the activity really being centered in the middle when we do create a lot line that that will you will hear about variances for those uh so that's lot that's lot 2.03 lot 2.04 was a a separate uh primarily vac really a vacant lot um six acres so it's almost twice the size of minimum lot size required for the zone as front to John Minebrook Road when we when we looked at these we certainly had to make sure that every lot had Frontage and access to a public Street in order to meet the statutory requirement um for subdivisions and under the municipal land use law um so but this is really Farmland today lot 2.05 is the rest of this Northern parcel which was all the way up uh and contains 41.4 Acres uh and this is where Peter Ron's house is located that I pointed out in the other exhibit and Facilities right and instru structures and activities right there um and those far Farm related there Farm related structures um it had the other one other Cottage and other Farm farming activities on that lot but that's a 41 Acre parcel um that would be created so then and that's so those are the lots on the Northern side of the railroad and then if we go to the southern side of the railroad there are three lots that are created lot 1.03 which has Frontage a little bit of Frontage on Meer Road and Frontage joh pill Hill Road uh lot 1.03 is just over 24 acres and as you can see it is farmland and wooded Woodland in the center portion moving to the uh to the little bit to the north and east um the next lot is lot proposed lot 1.0 four uh that's 24 and a half I'm sorry 262 Acres uh again open field Farmland with some woodlands and then proposed lot 1.05 which is just over 40 acres and that's the balance of the property on this southern side of the railroad and that is as you can see from the picture it is really uh farmland for the most part that's some perimeter areas look some W and some and some free lines does that lot also have access on Phill Hill and it is thank you it has Frontage on Phill Hill Road just that in this portion here correct so um so those are the lots that we're proposing the areas and some of the features that are situated on those um the environmental constraints we took into consideration um on the southern side of the railroad you don't really have much of a concern flood plane um or other significant environmental features steep slopes are not prohibitively steep um as I mentioned earlier and if you look at the soils classifications they're that's generally 6 to 12% with some uh some up to 18% the at the border is how they're classified and there may be some areas of of steeper slopes but not slopes that would be prohibitive wherein you could not place a single family dwelling on any these Lots all of these Lots in my opinion are suitable for construction of a of a single family dwelling which goes to to Bob's concern which which is valid that you want to make sure the Lots you're grading are suitable for for the Zone purpose and again not that not that we're proposing that but you as the board want to want to have that Comfort um we do show on the um subdivision plan and I didn't plot it on here but I can tell you that we do show on the plans a number of easement because we have current existing activities on these different properties and we want to maintain those activities we want to we want the owners to be able to cross one property to over another property to get to properties on the other side of the railroad for example um so U there are easements to allow Crossing for example of say lot one point I'm sorry 2.05 um to get cross remember I mentioned that there are a couple of railroad crossings we can't cross a railroad anywhere we're limited to two spots so one of them is is in this location here uh and there's a driveway that leads across there in order to cross there to get to Farmland on the other side we would need an easement across lot 2.05 uh similarly um uh we want to have access along an existing Farm Road here to get to other parts of say 2.02 so there's an easement to allow that to occur uh the easements are to really needed and necessary and desirable to maintain the existing activities on the site to maintain the farming activities we need to get to the field that's uh on the other side of the railroad for example but we need to cross somebody else's property this is again is once they're divided up and they in different owners um so that's the reasons for for the easements uh that we show on the subdiv plans and I have the subdiv plans if we want to look at those in more detail um and and we recognize that there are uh utilities that cross properties and and the plan is that there would be some common cross access and utility easements that would have to be put into place um for for the lot configuration and that's understood again to maintain the existing conditions on the site as you see here today and as as I've described um when it since there's no you know normally do subdivisions up talk about you know what we're g what we're going to build and and and you know storm water management and things like that but that doesn't apply here not we're not doing anything we're not building anything so so that makes that part a little simpler um I think it's really most of what I had to go through questions that I missed or certainly covered everything I was going to ask you utility eement but you just covered that um access you covered yeah I think we're good so so we would open it up to the board for questions question you ended onor a um good question how do we out Ian any development here it's going to be how are you going to allocate The Improv surface the distance the first property that gets built probably start an acre and maybe less anything else is going to be major development so how anticipate outa all going to be considered Majors any hous help on here we don't we have no as we've say we have no we have no plans for doing anything and I know you have to think about what's going to happen in the future we we have we have no plans for for doing anything so I I can't predict yeah two years from now comes in they want to build a house on lot 105 they can't build the house on lot 105 until the if I can interrupt that you I mean I think once it's subdivided it's subdivided so I think I mean corre but it's no long it's no longer one parcel it's no no longer one property it's a separate lot so and if they have to go through if there's either a subdivision where it would come before the board or if it's just one house it would be going to just let me finish um if it would go be one house and it would go for all the building permit and all of those all of those reviews and I would assume that you would be reviewing it as well so that's you know that's a decision in the future because I want to talk about what's going to the future board my question is this property is it's one property you have three lots on on one side if someone builds a house on lot 105 they could conceivably stay under the threshold for a major development the other two lots coming are also going be kicked into major developments because it's cumulative over the whole property I'm asking the question if there's any thoughts on how it's going to be allocated or just first come first serve you know I think it depends on how you property well it's not it's not combined anymore management purposes so there's no plan for how it gets allocated somebody comes in to build on lot 1.05 they'll have to conform regulations in effect at that time which could be different a different standard that's right than the house on and and standards May well be different then than they are today so they'll be subject to the standards in effect at the time and and if then if future development requires some other some additional requirement that'll have they'll have to deal with that you understand that it's human yeah this is where my questions to start with were and I think we need to build something into the resolution that controls I have one question they'll have to will the property once it's subdivided say in who name will each one of the three airs get so lot say two three how will how will TI to the property ownership will change because they'll go to the three airs so there'll be the Lots will be in different names so Russy just to clarify that then um we will be recording the plat correct and then we will also be issuing separate Deeds for each of the Lots we're not going to each each lot will have its own deed and it will also be recorded um as a as a Subdivision plat as a major sub as a major subdivision we will have to have a fin final major subdivision map it gets recorded but uh the ownership will change because there'll be a new lot and some may go to one person and some may go to another but that's some the ownership of those individual Lots is that answer your question sir I could it would stay in the met up correct that's correct um so couple of things come to mind the railroad crossings that are currently permitted by New Jersey Transit does New Jersey Transit have to be informed of all of this subdivision activity we did notice them for the hearing but you're asking if there's something separate yeah so Crossing un unsecured Crossing whatever the term is they're open Crossing there are no Gates there right um it's certainly something that we would look we can look into we can confirm or you know confirm with them yeah I I think we need to confirm with them what needs to happen if anything with those clings I think that's an important this subdivision will require NJ yeah but I I think we need to ask the question before Transit look to approve things stand by I don't trust them they money they will comment on access yeah I'm sorry they do or they don't I anticipate that they will yes second thing um comes to mind the driveway the existing driveway off of 202 that you're showing whatever Glitter Factory lck is that driveway completely contained within the Glitter Factory L yes and there would be an easement over that driveway for access to the other that's and that's indicated on the subdivision plans okay next question um if was any of was the prior resolution that permitted modification to Peter Russian's house did that have any effect on this subdivis work you do now I know there was an an addition to the house um and that was completed there was some septic work that was done that's completed um but did not doesn't affect this subdivision okay next question there's a whole bunch of what looked like Trail um up from the Peter rushman house yeah up in that area yeah what is that use uh to my knowledge It's associated with the farm activities um but specifically I I'd have to find out further about that to to that and it's probably within the raran buffer uh there are existing activities in there's no question there are existing activities occurr in the repairing buffer um which existing activities are permitted I mean DP recognizes that you have a reparan Zone and there's activities currently going on there but if you want to build something new or something like that that would required permits but existing activities um are are ongoing there no change to any could soil contamination from those existing activities uh I can't answer that I don't I don't know it's not my my get that okay I I noted that and we'll we'll look into that those are my initial questions ask one sure Rusty given given the size of the property the entire property was I'm assuming that there would be ways to to modify the lot lines to avoid a lot several of dimensional bearings that happen so so there's not side setbacks what you find is most of them are associated in that area I mentioned where there's clusters of buildings around the factory and so we want to separate the factory on its own lot um right those lines be adjusted did not require we' we've looked at that we've tried to minimize it as much as possible and try to be consistent and where it's going between buildings to try to at least some minimum some minimum setbacks right all right any other questions from board MERS yeah could you explain the rationale um you spoke of all large Lots which they are they all you know 35 Acres whatever then spoke specifically of the 6 Acre Wood lot but why then is that additional lot why that to minimize I'm assuming more safe land yes it really had to go with again we we looked at how they get divided up and kind of what goes where it just wasn't consistent because that was smaller I understand yes but it's also on the other side of the of the um the factory lot so there's the factory lot has has the staff that goes up to 202 and then there's we needed to create another parcel so that ended up having to be a separate and the other question is when you said that there's going to be if as a continu Shar so the farm can continue itself I don't know is there any um shared water right that can be built in other words and also when Shar use of the P I'm not sure how to back have your farm functions but let's say someone up on the North here it's fing need access to I don't right so is that something that's also be disc that would be have to be into any easement documents between the properties right just go back to the fut Transit Crossings are those could be set soon or there the possibility you know if needed there be extra one say between 205 and5 further north there no there's no way to J Transit all the lawyers if that were possible none of us no me to people no it's very difficult to get those the fact that we have these two and to retain be able to retain these two is we don't see the ability to gain any new ones and and just that to supplement that most of the time if they do give an access it's a license for a year or two revokable so so to that point then so the lot 105 the intended access could only be p and a long driveway yes that's correct it's only frontages on pill all right is there anything in that license that causes those to terminate these are not licenses these are these are permitted Crossings she thing saying if you got a new one when when new Transit issues them today they just issue like temporary LIC lies but these these [Music] are I have to read the E language but they've been in place for many years and are permitted to stay so my question is that one of the Lots becomes now a residential lot it's no longer F Crossing I'm not sure we yeah yeah I I think that's something what we'll have to look at I my understanding is that the those Crossings have been there for 81 years probably but as soon as you change the land yes yeah they may no longer be allowed no I understand that Transit on that one yeah got it understood the easement that's sh on your map that provides access to cross the one Crossing to 105 is that Even's for farming activities yes not for future resident to come and drive to the intent to we weren't thinking of you know yeah for Access for residential uses or anything like that it was to maintain the existing access to get across to be able to farm that other so any future development on Phil Hills properties would have access for Phil Hill correct correct and my guess once New Jersey Transit here's about what's going on they would say okay so in the future it would have to be secured you can't use it anymore I would expect yes that's why that's why they need to ask the question now I one more question will it maintain the F that was the subject that's the intent yes let me let me follow up on on on chick's point I'm assuming both of these properties farmland and I know in the old days you needed at least five acres of active Farm two of those lots are six six and a half acres are they going to be are they going to be qualified for Farmland um the with the factory is that g to have five active Acres of farm otherwi might get hold back on that on that LW hold back sort but I just wanted to give I would expect already assessed for commercial yeah but you know back looks at things says okay this much is resal and the rest is Farm my guess is there's probably already a commercial component but that's a tax problem what's the depy because know you describe lot is it similar to that Land by the subdivision there that you know they just took away see that land there what is that land like is SL is it is it a beautiful flat field it's sloping it's sloping the high point the high point is to the right side here so the high point is over on the on the right side as we look at the plan or sort of the the Eastern side and then it slopes down toward the railroad so that's all down it's yeah and it's it's a it's beautiful in fact I could I have picture of it if like to see it you have is there no we don't have topography on the plans uh but the one the earlier exhibit that I mentioned that has the photographs if you look at that there was a photograph near that standing near the crossing looking up towards that area I don't know the number of it but it's on that exhibit that you have there [Music] I'm sorry do elevations at the corners I'm not sure what you mean by desate El oh uh I'd have to get that information but I I could try to get that so you have some so you have some try get recess break hours and then we'll come back with follow question okay cool Bob you said you right yes I wanted to ask a question regarding various structures if they know which ones have Plum facilities and where the ples do show some sing system3 now is an office garage it looks like they show a line coming out of there with an s on it and it goes through setic system that's on 205 so I don't know how many other systems are like that how many the other structures that se systems I guess the question is are all structures that have the requirement of Wastewater disposal identif that's number one and number two have you identified where the septic systems are for each one of those structures so we've shown and and the latest PL have been updated excuse me with some additional information that we' received on on septics so we do show septic systems uh on the lots and and really there's we're really looking at three areas uh so for uh um my my question was really a yes or no question okay oh sorry well we show we show the septic systems on the properties um we show sewer lines and tanks uh on the properties uh I don't have a uh an inventory of which which one each you know has a a sink or a bathroom but we know that for example the factory goes to a septic system uh which consists of tanks and then it's pumped up to okay so solve that one okay so you're looking for all structures that have the requirement for Wastewater disposal okay and where septic systems are for each one of those structures okay right you're going to need if they cross property right which I indicated earlier we expect there are going to be some cross access e cross access and utility we we'll look into that okay yeah you asked the question perfectly okay any other questions from the board or professions do we have questions from the public for question please come up and identify I'd like to swear myself I'll S no testimony this is questions on testimony for Mr SCH only we're not doing testimony now just questions only of this witness of this witness at the end of the hearing which is not going to be tonight you members of the public can comment for against give some testimony but not now it's too early [Music] okay I would just ask you you gave a description of hold on please identify yourself oh Henry rman neighbor of and owner of probably onethird of what's left of the estate and uh okay I live at 261 pill Hill Road little corner up on the lower right ler left hand and that description that they gave is totally wrong also question where did you get the information from most of your testimony here um have review look several several areas um our study of the property if you have a specific question yes the compass headings you gave are totally wrong okay you we mentioned South and West and confuse most of them for example the mine Brook Road the M Brook doesn't go north and south or does it well I was if you recall earlier what you said was wrong let okay my question is that I don't think you looked at the real facts when you gave this demonstration and I'll give my testimony later I guess thank you would you like to finish answering the question that's okay okay um are there any other questions for this okay did I stand on the X stupid C sure K Hazelton 397 Minebrook Road I'm sorry I'm looking through my notes trying desperately to find the uh name of the particular type of permit to that had to do with some kind of discharge of Wastewater that was associated with and it was nides the nides exactly and I had trouble spelling it and now I can't find so yes so I just wanted to ask for a little more detail on that and you know is that what that's associated with it is is it part of the factory or yes it New Jersey pollutant discharge elimination system mjp Nies ities there's a permit issued by the EP for uh discharge of waste to in this case it's considered groundw because it goes into the ground the septic e goes into the ground um so it's a permit issued by DP and in this case deals with non-residential uses so that's what it's about with the factory so it's going into the septic system for the factory yes not directly into the M correct I'm sure they wouldn't allow it all right thank you very much can I ask question sure is this possible um we could we could estimate that because I guess you have a T1 approval is that going to go away um once you break this track up I guess you're not going to be over 2,000 gallons in anyone correct you we haven't heard any PS from health department on this we have has it been sent to them for review I assume okay they might be a to clarify L question okay okay anything else okay we are at 10 o' now I would like to continue this at the next meeting rather than continuing this application we have other business inter that's that's fine that's EXA so um given that I'm s already spoken for right yes [Music] yeah we have sign say um 21st October 21st October 21st yeah yeah yes um you know generally in these instances I ask because applicants can have issues where they can't get to a meeting so generally what I like to do is adjourn it to October 7th without need for further notice and then at the October 7th meeting if we can't get reached I mean I will know ahead of time then you would just make an announcement at the October 7 meeting that it's being adjourned without need for further notice to the 21st but we're not going to hear it on the 7 you're not okay then that answers the question so if no one come I mean if if the two applications that you have on don't proceed then you just won't have a meeting it's unlikely because they've already noticed so okay okay understood been doing this a really long time as we all and it does happen we I said for for many of us um and it does happened where but I I respect your your comment so we'll adjourn without need for further notice to the 21st AUST yes if that okay [Music] [Music] okay well [Music] Mr chairman it's in addition to an existing yeah okay all right so we could get to you oh wonderful wonderful okay so we're gonna journ without need for further notice to October 7 again would be the second application that's that's fine as long as we we'd like to try to keep moving I we appreciate it okay thank you very much all right Carri this application Carri to October 7th no it will be the second application they what okay all right should be okay than thank you thank you on the see you on the thank you everybody thank you I'd like to say good night to the board and thank you for looking into this so thoroughly we owe our F to the first four Boards of adjustment and I personally would that to get the variance the way it is which has protected us for 80 well for all our lot and God bless you all okay how you pay the bills second okay roll call please Mr deluso yes Mr greenbound yes M Kramer yes Mr mcow yes Mr saler yes Mr trainer yes Mr slum yes and Mr Milo yes don't put that on the record okay so pending applications we have Pally pending fines which has been pending for what two years what they do um talk to me about application they're going to vull it yes so I um I spoke with the property owner and she was upset with her professionals because apparently she had told them that she was withdrawing the application and nobody notified me so I said to her well we need something in writing so I'm waiting for that okay she said it was becoming uh too complicated so I think what they're going to do is um instead of constructing a new dwelling they're going to make modification to the existence D welcome to wait wait wait wait that one we want to see cuz you want a chair put me in oh darn it you know what they still made need variances okay you never know they may change their mind again you're irreplaceable by the way no just just pinch heading that's it not irre nobody is irreplaceable nobody's irre okay so Steinberg we hearing on the seven [Music] and this is and and this one is is this any relation to um former speaker oh jeez to construct addition existing got any comments on that one John which which one is that Fon and yes we have a reports okay I would rather not comment on the record until they appear yeah well and that one sad yeah the last one is still incomplete yeah I mean the incompleteness items for the seeds are not usually big issues and I generally would say let's Pro see with these subject concurrence of board engineer you know they usually minor things but that's up to the board schedu yes so just an FYI all as soon as applications commend as soon as they send me the application it's supposed to come with the digital okay if it doesn't it's usually within a couple of days they're on the website so this application's been on the website since it was received in July and then as reports are received they're loaded into them okay so yes whatever I so far yes can supports are there too it's a great feature a lot of times are doing that yeah okay yeah so you can always kind of you know it's on here but then you can also take a peek online and see what's good deal in the application anybody have anything else I like to say something when we're off the Record that bad just know I make that motion to one all in favor