##VIDEO ID:F5l3avYnmII## e e e e pleas wa D nice to meet you yeah do you really started Ranger to if we're ready everyone I'd like to call B of the village of biscan Park Code Compliance Wednesday December 18th at 6 o'clock would Vanessa please call the B Janie [Music] Anderson I'm sorry here D Benton present Roda bantos Judy hammerberg Michael El Michael Lut here Ashlin Berne Green Village staff Dar C Grant Luciano nibs Rafael gutiz and Vanessa Cherry me present we do need to vote on Judy's absence if I could make a motion to approve Judy's absence as an excused absence a second all in favor I motion passes 4 Z Michael did you second good thank you once again good evening everyone this is a meeting of the village of biscane Park Cod compliance board the board is authorized pursuant to chapter 14 excuse me chapter 14 of The Village's Land Development code to ensure compliance with The Village's code of ordinances the members of The Bard are citizens and residents of the village of biscane Park we volunteer our time and we are not paid for our services purpose of each hearing is to give any alleged violators the opportunity to contest the decision of the code compliance officer which resulted in the issuance of a notice of violation and to determine whether a violation of The Village's code has occurred or is occurring we are not authorized to dismiss violations based on hardships ignorance or the fact that others may be guilty of the same violation these hearings are conducted on a quasy Judicial manner are respons responsibilities to act much like a judge in a court and that is to hear cases presented by The Village's Code Compliance officers and to hear contradictory arguments presented by the alleged violators we are not authorized to change the code The Village commission is solely authorized to enact or revise codes conversely neither the commission nor the village manager have the authority to overrule the findings of the board pursuant to chapter 162 of the Florida Statutes orders of the board can only be appealed to the Circuit Court of Miami Dade County we have the authority to assess and order the payment of civil penalties to issue orders having the force of law to command whatever steps are necessary to bring a violation into compliance and to assess administrative costs in order to make a finding upholding the code compliance officer decision we must find that there is substantial competent evidence that the name violator was responsible for a violation of the relevant section of the code as charged all documentary evidence presented by the parties must be submitted for placement in the hearing file no documentary evidence will be considered unless the alleged violator or code compliance officer submits a copy for the hearing filed each party shall have the right to call and examine witnesses to introduce exhibits to cross-examine opposing Witnesses on any matter relevant to the issues even though that matter was not covered in the direct examination to impeach any Witnesses regardless of which party first called them to testify and about the evidence against them if you intend to address our board tonight and have not signed in please do so anyone wishing to address the board please stand raise your right hand so that you may be sworn in you are reminded that this board is a causeing Judicial board and giving false testimony can be penalized please raise your right hand do you swear or affirm that a testimony you about to give would be the whole truth and nothing but the truth before we go any further commissioner Amsler is joining us tonight as well as Village manager alchris commissioner Amsler has asked for a few moments to speak to the to the audience and to us hello there good evening everyone um I just wanted to have a few minutes to um introduce myself to those that I haven't had the opportunity to meet my name is Veronica Amsler and I'm one of the five Commissioners in the city and The Village at any time if there is any question regarding our codes if there is any opportunity for us to engage about anything ideas that you might have things that been going on I just wanted to have this opportunity to introduce myself and um let you know my number is public you can go to the website look for the Commissioners and you'll see we all have cell phones so please do reach out for anything whatsoever and I just wanted to say thank you again for all that you do that's it thank you commissioner do we have any additions deletions or changes to the agenda changes first good evening my name is Dorian Grant Code Compliance Department changes we have a correction to make on 8.4 the case number should rate C EC 24- 0064 instead of 60 anything else on additions we have an update on 826 Northeast 21st Street case number e 22-3 A3 for Jan roots and wife Denise in care of council council's present we have two uh attorneys present tonight one uh representing the property owner and another Council representing the mortgage company we're here asking for an intentan on invoice number 0021 -05 dated 35224 in the amount of $10,000 this invoice was for services Professional Services provided by a contractor in preparation of the case for Miami to be heard before the Miami day County and safe structure for we're asking the board to issue an order to lean the property for $10,000 so members of the board do we have any questions at this point at this point I don't have any questions any questions comments sir if you would please introduce yourself and your relationship to the property sure uh my name is Matthew Kramer I'm an attorney for the property owner at 826 Northeast 121st Street um brief background there was an unsafe structures hearing on December 11th and um the unsafe structure board ruled that the property owner has uh eight months to submit permits an additional nine months to complete construction uh the invoice or what we saw the intent to lean because we have not actually seen an invoice um is for $110,000 for the building officials what it states is preparation for the hearing um typically as an attorney if I were to seek attorney's fees before a court I would have to submit backup I'd have to submit my time records I'd have to show the court what I did and to justify the amount being charged here um we don't know what the property manager did or why there was a $10,000 charge to prepare for a hearing um at the unsafe structures board we mentioned that we've never seen the invoice an invoice has never been provided um I will also say that um and I've met with Mr Martinez um I have utmost respect for Mr Martinez's building manager but frankly he was not prepared and he admitted to the unsafe structure board because he's not here so I would prefer that you didn't quote him as to what he okay well well it it's directly related to the preparation and I will say he he said that he never reviewed any of the plans submitted for this property so to me if you're going to spend $10,000 preparing for a hearing you probably should review the plans um the bottom line is there's a due process right here that's being violated if this lean were to occur because we haven't seen any backup we've asked for the backup the backup hasn't been provided and frankly um a $10,000 fee to prepare for a 30 minute hearing is grossly unreasonable I will I'm gonna stop you for a minute because you know what I want us to process what you've just said bear with me sure I do have same concerns the gentleman has expressed much as I want this to be handled in a timely manner I cannot disagree with him I mean a bill is that's fine but it doesn't say what went into all of that and that concerns me comments from everyone else please no I had this I have the same concerns you know I'd like to see something itemized bill or exactly I was hoping that would be presented or clarified once we got here um and just a point of clarification did you say that you didn't receive the invoice the onepage invoice that we have you said you didn't get that either we didn't get the backup we the backup the backup okay yeah yeah all right essentially this tells all of us nothing and I hate to say it but I've got a concern yeah while I do not testify on behalf of the building official but I would like to speak for the village these are private contractors that had asked for information from the village I provided them with a box full of paperwork as the board is aware this property has been through several violations this is for a period of over 20 years so for 20 years we've kept files and files and files and when this building official was getting ready to bring this case to the um and safe structure board he had to go through paperwork because this property was um declared and safe by two other building officials so he had to piece this puzzle together it was a big box like I say full of files and it took him quite a bit of time I can't say the exact time it took him quite a bit of time to go through this paperwork work and to put these cases together to answer to what the attorney just said he had reviewed the plans that were originally submitted for the fourplex the plans he hadn't looked at were the plans that were submitted to the building uh to the Planning and Zoning uh review board which looked at the plans that were submitted for the duplex the reason those plans did not get to the building official was because they were rejected and once those plans are rejected they don't get to him the Planning and Zoning review board sees those plans first and once they reject them they don't get to the building official right right so C can I just clarify something so basically what you're saying is that the the charges for the preparation for the hearing that Council said was only 30 minutes and should have been a you know walk in the park was really the consequence of several boxes of information over the course of 20 years and other unsafe structures and and all that stuff to get ready for that 30-minute hearing absolutely Mr and then in addition to that if I understand what you said was that the building official uh wasn't unprepared but rather he didn't receive those plans because it would have never have gotten to him because it was rejected before it would even cross his desk is that what you're saying that's correct okay no I totally get all of that there is no reason for him to look at PL were not part of the function and the time the hearing took is irrelevant to the time the preparation took but if I'm being asked to pay a $10,000 bill I want to see something that says research time was this uh getting documents from Storage was this you know break it out to come up with that total and also what the hourly rate is also what the hourly rate is there's no hourly rate there's an hourly rate for an assistant and there's a and there's a for a couple thousand bucks my objection is I don't disagree with you we we the backup should occur um I would absolutely get back with the contractor and ask for the backup if I may add my name is attorney Caleb hosing and I represent the uh the mortgage servicer and we did contact The Village itself and they did send us to their contractor and again after multiple times through email and in person we were not provided a breakdown of this $110,000 added lean that would affect our own lean so um I would again highly agree with what I'm hearing from the board and with Council that at least this lean should be objected right now or this hearing should be continued and until we have an actual breakdown my if if board members have no further questions my motion would be that we table this till January and it it comes back in the form of a properly detailed ordinance as Michael shared hourly rate exactly what went into coming up with this total what did each of them have to do not concerned about the length of the meeting that's not relevant it's everything that went into it the specifics basically Time Slips you needs Time Slips to say like you know I worked two hours four hours whatever it was for x and then I'd work this many hours for why and then same with the assistant in that case we would ask for a 30 day continuance in order for us to obtain its information from the do we think we can have it by January absolutely okay can I just add one thing before you I vote I I will just say one thing just for the board's consideration I understand the desire to continue this but the chairman of the unsafe structures board was very upset by the charge I will leave it at that if you want to proceed getting back up and doing this again obviously that's your prerogative but he thought it was a bit heavy-handed again we weren't there we didn't hear that we can only go by direct testimony and you were there as well if if you want to confirm that we can go by direct even at that it would be here say but it's for the board's consideration okay it's not a court of law so we we will table it I'm sorry my motion is that we table this until January staff comes back with full old detail hourly rates Etc that led to this total I'll second that all in favor I any opposed motion pass is 4 Z thank you thank you was very close need oh you need to close I can't see half the audience but yeah the camera wouldn't reach there was it reach right here gone right way it wasun yes yes right there thank you was old business which is section 7 of the agenda first case is 7.1 for 750 Northeast 116 street this is case number c-24 d662 for Joan Thomson aate of and 750 Northeast LLC in care of their registered agent ISC urban homes LLC in fact I will go move to say 7.1 7.2 7.3 be heard together these cases um had several violations Property Maintenance violations however the property owner has obtained permits to demolish this building and I would like to enter onto the record permit number PB 23-46 um we are asking this board to dismiss these cases because um it it would not make sense for them to correct these violations when they're in the process of demolish can I get a motion sure on case number c-24 d662 c-24 d663 c-24 665 like to make a motion to dismiss a second all in favor I any opposed motion passes for zero next item is 7.4 we just did that that one I apologize that's what we had in the was 826 just heard moving on to 7.5 850 Northeast 121st Street case number Cen 23- 399 with ysf Yen this property is now in uh compliance they were in violation of um section 16.13 for exterior paint the paint permit I believe uh was not obtained before the wall was painted they have now come into compliance however the $500 remain and paid which was charged as a violation fee and administrative cost at a previous hearing i' would like to enter onto the record two affidavits an Affidavit of compliance for the violation and an Affidavit of non-compliance for the non-payment questions from the board if you would identify yourself in your relationship to the property before I get into that did you come in we were you hear when everybody got sworn in no okay yeah I thought so you have to get sworn in before you can talk please raise your right hand do you do you swear or affirm that the testimony you about to give would be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I Rocky Cohen um have an ownership interest in the property um so that is correct the uh the pain permit and all that they came out thinking that it it wasn't done I showed them the records that's been addressed I guess the the other outstanding issue is the $500 fine um my understanding when I was here in July was that I had until August 19th to bring it into compliance if I don't that's one a fine of I think was that's when the daily fine would kick in but we did assess a violation fine and an administrative fine the daily fine is avoided if you come into compliance in time not the violation or admin fine his that that was my that was my understanding is there a way for me to confirm that because I went online I was told to go to YouTube um but I I couldn't find the um video I I found that day's recording I couldn't find when I was here the order the order of enforcement that would have gone out that's it when when I left the meeting I was under the impression and perhaps you're you're quick to cut me off so perhaps I am wrong that's entirely possible but I'm just asking is there a way for me to verify that to make sure because I again I say when I walked out I thought that I had to pull a permit by a certain date fix the violation and and I'm okay there's no $250 fine running sir I do remember your um seemingly not quite understanding where we were headed that night so I remember us explaining clearly that there would be the 250 violation fine and the 250 admin fine only and if you came into compliance in time there would be no daily fine but there would still be the 500 total of the actual fines I remember feeling you were a little confused so we emphasized that that's what it was I don't remember but you know I think what he's asking is is there some way I mean I guess we are archives are they not working where he can't go back and look at it either that or aren't the minutes available for him to look at we can provide the minutes absolutely about the recording I believe on that date we had issues with the internet and that portion might have not been recorded I'll go back and verify I'm not sure but I'll I'll check that for you well which is why we have the minutes right we don't rely upon just a video that's correct okay so it maybe that'll s your concern you can look at the minutes and if that's what happened and and you know I misunderstood that's on me I I get it but yeah but you want to look I put on the record I didn't understand that that's why it hasn't been paid right um remember the order of enforcement is our legal document documenting what the decision made when the order of enforcement was received if there was any sort of confusion and this would have been back in July I think what she was talking about when you got the when you got the order of enforcement did did did that so C anything so when when I got that order of enforcement I came to the next agenda I was told that it's I was told that it's not on the the agenda so the board's not going to listen to me just leave my information with the code enforcement officer um and then you know reach out to him to try to understand if my if I was wrong about the 500 now and that's what I did I reached out um there there have been a couple of emails I've been in communication with them about the permit stuff um not that but I I never received a response about about the 500 so I did try to address it right away it's not like I just ignored you know what I received from the city cuz I I was surprised when I found it and that's why I came to the next agenda but I I was so I can't be heard on it so I don't think I have August minutes with me does anybody happen to have August minutes we don't have the minutes here I'm sorry not August Pardon Me July July yes but I think if the village can provide the minutes or yeah and'll and the village can provide those if he comes in within a week so it would be good to say within two weeks there can be some type of uh satisfaction the and we can move on with I know we I know we've got the minutes we'll provide him with a copy of the minutes okay that's fine I'm sorry you like to make a motion yeah there no other motions I'd like to um in case number c n -23 d339 um like to make a motion to request that the village move to lean total of $500 as of plus filing fees as of December the 18th given the resident until January the January the 8th uh to obtain the minutes and pay them be in full second wait wait so he's G till January the 8th to to get the minutes but then once so let's say he gets on the eth I mean I mean he's got to write a checked in or you going to give him a little bit of time to you know go back and talk to his wife and tell her that you know I got to pay this fine I think you should give him a little time after that deadline don't you think um well they've had plenty of time from Jan from the time the order of enforcement was there to actually go to the Village H to obtain them to speak to someone in person and this gives them more two weeks to go down there tomorrow obtain uh requested can I can I respond to to that comment I I just want to say um it it's not like I didn't do anything I did what I was instructed to do understand and you tried to go on YouTube and you tried to find it and you tried to satisfy your own you know confusion there was a 47 minute video kind of put it on you know fast forward very fair that's why we're saying yeah on in get the minutes I'm just saying I'm just saying give him like another week to to pay it once he gets you know once he gets that opportunity no but he is here at a meeting saying that he doesn't you know uh have the same understanding about what happened you just said that you remember him and thought that he was confused that's why we so so I'm just saying you were giving him two weeks to you know to go down there to look at the minutes which now is another Avenue that I don't think you knew about when he walked in give him another week or 10 days to De to pay it once he does he could have gotten the minutes before this okay well don't mind I'll amend it to um pull uh pull the minutes and review and pay the uh either contestor pay the fun uh by January the 13 I'll second yes M I'm sorry Michael did you second yeah oh I have a motion and a second to file the intent to lean for $500 plus any filing fees the resident will go into Village Hall as soon as possible P the minutes and pay and if he pays by the 18th there would be no intent to leave correct no not the 18th the 13th 13th I apologize my writing by the 13th then there would obviously be no intent to lean or contest all in favor um before you the clerk just realized that when we had the issues with the um internet she recorded it on her phone so if he would like to hear it we have it well I mean he's got I mean this is for this is for the residents you know if you want to provide it to him no we need to he if it's evidence we all need to hear it okay well tell you the recording and then we'll give you the minutes as well all right thank you I appreciate that all right great all right thank you thank you all right all in favor again opposed so motion passes 4 Z next [Music] item 7.6 for 931 Northeast 120th Street case number cn- 24- 289 property belongs to 931 Northeast 120th at LLC we are bringing this case for an intent toine um the violation was 16.13 exterior permit in um the wall on the left side of the duplex has a large mark on it and we issued a violation for that but there's been not there had been non-compliant compliance until the 16th they did go into uh Village Hall and apply for a permit on the 16th however the fines run from a comply by date on the order of enforcement which was 1125 24 so the amount I had in my calculation has changed the amount we're asking to lean is $5,750 instead of $6,250 5,750 it's less two days of the 250 daily fine oh a permit was P pulled two days ago but nothing's I mean they got how much time to paint it once the permit's pulled the permit is valid for six months they can paint it anytime during the six months I'm so sorry 60 days permits are two it's valid for 60 days so they have to paint with within 60 days however there is an order of enforcement in place fines did Run for the amount of days from 1125 and they have this outstanding Lane now fine now for 5,750 which we are asking for an order to lean he second questions from the board if you would introduce yourself in your relationship to the property hi good evening my name is Jennifer I'm one of the property owners my brother and I own the property um actually my brother and I we've been going through some rough situation my grandmother passed so we are currently out of the country most excuse me I'm so sorry you were not sworn in sorry please raise your right hand do you swear or affirm that the testimony you about to give will be the truth the whole truth but nothing but the truth I do okay um like I was saying my brother brother and I we lived out of the country we put the property to the property manager we highly believed that this was being taken care of by the property manager um we realized that all of this was happening uh two weeks ago because they called us I said you have a fine on your property and I said what do you mean we have a fine out property oh because you didn't do the paint uh parameter and job I was like but you're my property manager I highly believe you were taking care of this so we flew I flew back to the States took care of it like she mentioned we already pulled the paint peram um we are actually trying to get the paint done by the end of this week so we can have our inspections done on Monday and have this uh Co Clos and complied my question is is there any way we can um apply for some sort of um I don't know how call it yes reduction after this is done yes there is a process for find reduction okay and we'll be happy to give you that information I'll really appreciate it like I said I thought this was being taken care of my manage by the management company that takes care of collecting the rent and all this of course the buck stops with you it comes back to you and I was like wait a minute when I got the notice that said that I owed that I had a fine and I owe all this money I was like wait a minute give me a chance what do you mean by this I thought this was being taken care of by you we don't pull permits we just collect rent and take care of Maintenance so I flew back from the dominicare public and took care of it immediately So when you say you one of the owners that the the property is owned by 931 noreast 12th at LLC yeah that's my brother and I company okay then I would think we could table this till next month allow the property owner to come back with a fine reduction request and we'll rehear it okay I'll come back that would be I'm sorry yeah it's so that's your motion we just want to discuss I'll second it but your motion but uh I was thinking can't we rule on the lean and they don't have the have the property painted oh I'm sorry it has to final two mon then mon I meant to and that didn't yeah yes I'm so sorry let me rephrase my motion we get the property owner be given two months that would be 16 February 16 so Sunday no so what did you say February the 19th 16 Sunday well I'm it's just it's just for 60 days would be um February the 16th and then she should have the permit will expire by then so if it hasn't been painted yeah by then then it's not in compliance C and then we could just move that the Village um proceed with filing a lean anytime after after so by February six my motion would be rephrased to be by February 16th the property is to be painted and final then come back with a fine reduction and that would be see have to be for our March meeting that may I do to yeah to come compliance and pay it and if and and file for a reduction if not to have because all that should be done by the by the February the 16th getting it fin painted finalized and then asking the village for a fine reduction so we would really be tabling this to the March meeting not self-executing progress report okay and giving the property owner to February 16th to come into compliance by having the property painted and the permit final then to apply for a fine reduction which I would figure we would pull forward at March's meeting because we'd be too late in February that's fine a second wait no no no you miss I'm sorry but you're missing the part about reing the village you proceed with toan intent to lean if the permit is not final and the fine reduction is not applied for well well personally if she applies for a fine reduction or doesn't is is up to her if if the permit is not final to proceed with the lean well to proceed with the lean if the permit's not final or the fine paid we understand the order they got it they're good I am so sorry for all the confusion yeah it would the property owner it's it's incum prerogatives to apply for reduction reduction okay okay so we have a motion I think we have a second I'll still second all in favor I any opposed no two motion passes or zero than you so much we would um um respectfully ask the board to allow us to call Item 8.12 um the police chief is here to testify and we would like to let him go back to his duties 8.12 this is for the address 11905 Northeast 12th Court the case number is cc24 0064 only call Jean Jack Jack that how I pronounce it J Jean and j i Smith Jean j that how they pronounce it we are asking for an order of enforcement on this case with a maximum penalty because this violation was a violation of section 16.3 1.1 building permits several structures were added to the property in the back and several people living in those prop uh um structures they were never inspected um there was electrical cables connected to this and creating a safety hazard this violation was referred to us by the police department and we have Chief still here to testify but GE yeah I don't think you were sworn in when you came in you would swear in the please raise your right hand do you swear or affirm the testimony you about to give will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth good evening board chairman Vice chairman uh Chief Mark steel with the bis G Park Police Department on on December 2nd 2024 approximately 8:07 p.m. the police department received a 911 call referen an individual that was knocking on the doors um possible suspicious person located at this address 11905 Northeast 12 Court we had four police uh units respond to the area due to the increase uh in crime uh in that area to address the issue the we spoke to the residents at the 911 call uh which was identified by her Florida driver's license as Miss Piera galel estor um she gave us permission to check the property to see if there's any individuals that were hiding on the property or uh they were worried about a burglary when we went to the rear of the property we started noticing uh numerous safety issues when we we approached the back property there was first a tent that was set up with the wires electrical everything kind of running out of it like a camping tent uh we checked the tent for if any individuals from the the 911 call and when when we open it was filled to the uh almost the top of the tent with just random items electrical wires it it was like a turned into like a storage uh area it was unsafe you couldn't like we couldn't even check to see if there's any individuals we continued around the property and there was two giant uh structures in the back like efficiencies that were clearly not up to code you could tell it was just looked like a uh outside board that was kind of up with u plastic covering on the top of the the facility with a bunch of electrical wires everything running up there was a cooking station that was on the outside another large tent back there filled to the top with other items um we spoke with some of the other people living it end up being about four additional efficiencies in the back of this place too onto the rear of the building and then two out into this other structure that was made so we were talking to the individuals there was uh even infants and small children that were back there and we were very concerned about the additional issues that were there the comments that were told from us from the individuals living in efficiencies it probably wasn't knocking we have these large rats because of the food and everything and they run and they hit the items and that that's what caused that the potential noise uh we also looked they showed us an area they were very concerned on with the fence that borders the railroad property from FEC which we we do all the policing for them through our mutual Aid um the the fence was very dilapitated and it was uh it was apparent that you could see people have normal foot traffic due to the the the way the grass was the next day checking that area also we noticed on the Miami Dade side that there is so much foot traffic in that area that all the vegetation is is smashed down so we have a lot of traffic entering the village through this residence through through the track area due to the the numerous concerns of both Public Safety uh uh sanitation issues uh the food being cooked outside the electrical wires the unsafe structures uh immediately contacted code enforcement we rote Report with our detective that night um and then I personally went out with the the code officer to show him the property from the rear on the rivo tracks and and he could clearly tell from uh what he was indicating to us the structures were not of sound Foundation that for building code what was in sound Foundation those little efficiencies or the actual structure the after structure in the rear of the facility do we have the option to have the building official go in in and condemn these and I don't know the legal procedure to make sure anyone living in there is removed I um particular case so on December Luciano nibs code compliance officer uh Village of bising Park Code Department on December 4th approximately about 11:32 a.m. uh myself and officer Alvarez went to the property and tried to meet with a property owner uh once we knocked on the door we couldn't um get anybody to let us get onto the property to do an inspection at that point I went with the chief onto the railroad side and did an inspection of the property I saw that they had at uh structure to the rear of the residence along with some type of tarp I couldn't get a clear visual of the exact contents what inside the yard so after that I did a uh an inspection on the property appraisers to see if they had any um permits or permissions to build such structure I reviewed some of the satellite imagery uh going back uh two years I didn't see any structure and I believe it's of this year that that structure appeared um completed on the property without any permits I would also like to submit to the board that we did um review our system and we did not see any permits for any additional structures on that property that was going to be my question I knew any other questions from the board or from staff is anybody else speaking on this subject or just the police chief U the property owners are here hello ma'am you you you were here when we swore everybody in but you didn't stand up so I don't think you've been sworn in so if you're GNA speak you got to get sworn in do you swear or affirm that the testimony you about to give will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do okay um hello my name is Kimberly Jean Jax this is the property owner my father Kimberly can you speak into the microphone please thank you your name and your relationship to the property this speak up this is my father Nicole Jean Jax I'm Kimberly Jean Jax he's the property owner um when all of this happened I was not here so I cannot say anything that actually happened on that day but from the name he gave I'm thinking that is our neighbor so my father was not here I was not here so we did not know that they were on the property we did not give them permission to go on the property cuz we live in a duplex he's the owner of both both houses it's a duplex so the backyards are connected but from what he is saying it sounds like there's like four six um other houses that is not the case there is one shed back there and there is also a tent the tent I'm thinking that that is allowed in your own backyard it's just a regular tent um since then and then we got the code violations we have removed the tent and back there it's clear the shed was just built as a shed just to keep things in but we did not know we need a permit to build a shed but ma'am on top of the fact that and yes sheds do need a permit on top of that there are people living in these structures there're that's an issue it's an unpermitted structure that there are people living in and yes even a shed requires a permit let check for safety to check for positioning on property um when you say sheda you talking about I'm looking at an aerial view are you talking about that thing in the backyard right here is a shed no that was already a shed that um that was already there there's a additional shed that shed I thinking already came with the house according to my father that was already back there but there's an additional shed um she steel was was this the uh the structure that you were talking about that structure right there that was the where people were living sir yes that is the the structure there was uh individuals living on this side and also uh here and there was the tent there and additional tents on that side yes ma'am that's the uh the structure that uh we just pointed out that's where there was individuals living in they had a side entrance on this side and one entrance on this side it was all from the side entrance when they answered it was a male female and a small infant so what what do you say about that you're saying that you just had a shed to put stuff in but the testimony under oath from the police chief is that there are people living there and people are identified as there is are you saying that this was just a shed for stuff no there's two sheds one shed is like a tool shed the other one yes there is people living in it okay but you didn't mention that when you said what was back there you didn't mention the shed where people were living Sorry and what about that shed was that shed built with a we have people living which kind of doesn't even go shed no and people living you know that not doesn't usually go together but my question is is did the the one that the people are living in was there a permit pulled for that one no and that was built by you all after you moved in yes and then you rented it out to people no but people are living there yes okay is is that is that allowed in in in biscane park to to live in sheds I don't think so right dorine sorry so so people living in sheds absolutely not that's a safety issue um if a fire broke out there um we can there's not telling what can happen electrical um connected to a shed without permits is not allowed okay that is um a health a safety hazard um there are other code um violations like the the fence that's a on going um my dad's already trying to fix that it's just him himself what we're dealing with tonight is these accessory structures yeah well my dad said he could tear down the shed that's fine and then the fence it's already being repaired with the permit no you need a permit to repair the fence yes any structural work you're doing on the property you need to come to the village and obtain a per I'm not sure what he saying no he's saying he's fixing it himself right but you you still need to get a permit okay even if you fix it yourself even if it's your own backyard that's now you don't want to end up here again dealing with that it has to be inspected for safety okay but the I don't think it says that on day but I I'd really like us to deal with the non-conforming structures because we're starting to mix apples and oranges here the non-con I'm sorry sir if you speak into the microphone sir sir if you would speak um he was saying that it's just like well three of the plines they just have holes so you need a permit just to fix repair the holes we're not dealing with the fence right now we've got to deal with what's in front of us and that's the accessory structure okay cuz I have three over here so or two one I think is the same yeah that's the only one on here you can get with the village the okay okay um any more questions any more input from staff then I believe we're ready for a motion I'll make a motion on Case C uh c-24 0064 that violation has occurred we asking for maximum panel to this is a safety issue violation has occurred due to a life safety issue assess the maximum fine of $1,000 and a administrative cost of $250 to have the property brought into compliance by pulling the necessary permits for removing the structures by I would have to go through anything would go through pnz and that would what but to take to take the accessory structures down they need a demo permit even though they weren't permitted in the first place I don't believe they'll need a demo permit but they need to come in and speak with building so we can confirm what kind of permits they need by uh January the what two hearings would be 6 21st right right um my concern though is while we have to give them time for permitting there are people in there that really need to not be there right so it's kind of a a two-prong thing that we've got got a deal with the structures can't come down until building tells them but we need the folks to be not there thank you jie amend it toe that a violation has occurred assess the maximum F of $1,000 administrative cost 250 and to allow the uh Village building inspector uh onto the property by how long do you you need to get the order of enforcement out uh they're usually done by Vanessa do you think we'll have them by Friday the orders okay so then they would have it by the end of the following week that' be December the 27th allowing for Christmas so probably should push it to the 30th to be safe um while access to the property by December the 30th if not a $250 per date find therea but what are we doing about the inhabitants the issue of the inhabitants well we had this before if you guys remember we had a property that had put up multiple trailers that was the The Log Cabin correct correct and we did make that as part of our order that it had to be uninhabited that's correct right um bear with me a second would the police have authority I'm sorry Chief would would your staff have authority to make sure they are uninhabited I I don't want us to put something in an order that's not doable got you once we declare this situation unsafe the building official or the code official can actually request that they do not haveit so we can leave that out for the moment and okay absolutely so requested from who I can request as a code official me or any code official or building official can request that that uh property is not not inhabited because of safety issues and we can post the property with a safety hazard you can't physically remove someone absolutely not we can't we can we can red tag them okay as part of my motion to direct The Village to have the building official inspect the property and post um if warranted I'll second all in favor I any opposed motion passes for zero so that would be $1,000 fine an admin fee of$ 250 a daily fine if it's not I'm sorry the building official to inspect determine safety or otherwise red tag if necessary if not done by December 30th 250 daily right I had not included the 250 daily but that is part of my motion I think we just got it maybe I should restate the motion uh violation occurred $1,000 fine administrative cost of 250 allow the bilding Fisher official access to the property by January the I December the 30th um and direct The Village to post as necessary the property uh if not $250 per day fine therea second again all in favor I opposed motion passes score zero so just so that the the homeowners understand that by December 30th they got to let Mr nibs or or the other uh code inspectors on the to go to the property uh to to do what to to inspect it and say this stuff's got to come down or do can they just go ahead and start they just go to they got to wait for this to be done from what um you heard um their testimony was we only have this and we only have that and we only have that if they're not sure what's safe and unsafe there they will need an inspector on the property to help them determine which where where does this property end according to the plans we have on file and what has been added without permits and those are the issues they will need to resolve but a building inspector or a code inspector allowed on the property would help determine that and they can say this stuff's got to come down right absolutely okay okay I understand yeah so I would get rid of the people and get rid of the stuff but deal with the code enforce uh the building inspector to coordinate that thank you thank you that's why I've got to make some confies to try to find that because thank you chief times that we there are times we can extend beyond the normal 250 and I wanted to be sure I've got to make more copies of that for everyone we will respectfully again Ask the board to allow us to call another case that the chief will testify on and this is 8.4 this is for the property located at 820 North is is the case we reading 820 Northeast 111 Street for case number c ec2 24- 66066 it's for Ray investment 820 LLC in care of the registered agent Raul Reyes we are asking for an order of enforcement with maximum penalty on this case they were in violation of section 18.4 permitted days and hours of construction um they started demolition of a property before they allowed time they had um a crane um the chief can testify to that because this um came through us it has been an issue we've received complaints through the commission this is a high ticket issue for us and we're asking for maxim penalty good evening board again U on December 3rd 2024 at 7:44 in the morning um due to the increased construction starting before the set period of time the commission has asked us to uh start patrolling in those areas So I myself was out patrolling once I turned onto 111th Street I observed a large excavator that was actually in the process of ripping down a structure at that point I uh stopped at the location and I stopped the excavator operator identifi identified him by his Florida driver's license as Kenny Perez dorte um date of birth 41 1986 I made contact with him and I asked him what he was doing who was the supervisor on the site he's he said he was the supervisor on the site and that he was a contractor for Rey's construction I told him that there were set times and they had to stop the demolition he said that uh usually he starts at 7 in the morning and he has his own times because he has to to get it done I told him he can't start he said that day specifically he had started just before 7:30 uh and again we told him that's you can't start till 8:00 and we gave him all the information at that point the uh patrol officer arrived and wrote up the report due to the ongoing issues with this uh immediately reach out the code and refer the case any comments except that I'm asking for maximum penalty Reyes construction it has a lot of projects going on they know better and this is unfair to our residents that they have to hear an excavator at 7:30 in the morning I know it's not relevant to this uh particular matter but I could tell you that and I know because I looked at my phone at 7:24 this morning they were working on the property because I was on my way you know home from the gym and I looked at my watch and I said oh I guess they got to they started a little early I thought they started at 7:30 but it's actually 8:00 yeah so they had a big truck out there this morning they've been ongoing issue we issued eight uh parking violations to them today also for parking in the median I mean these guys are all over the place I mean they obviously should know what the rules are right also I'd like to add to that every construction site once they got the permit for the temporary uh construction fence I issue them uh for the parking the times permitted so there's no really excuse for this and for the record we take that as a complaint and we will issue a violation okay problem is unless this is a repeat violation on this property will restrict it as to the fine we will do the history on that property I'll get the address and we'll check the history of the violations and if it's a repeat violation for that property we will be asking for double fines I I do believe that they are working on two side by-side properties right there same company yeah I mean the one this morning was at 8:20 which is I think the one further west than the the one is just rais is the one they ripped down and then the one right next to is the second site exactly are we ready for a motion on case number cn- 0064 fin of violation has occurred assess a fine of $250 plus the administrative fine uh fee of 250 um given the village an opportunity to bring it back for increased fines if it was a repeat offender I'll second all in favor I I any opposed motion passes 4 Z thank you Chief thank you thank you board members and chairman and chairman appreciate it thank you thank you Chief have good night next item is a new business and it's item number 7.7 for the property located at 960 Northeast 121st Street case number is cen2 24453 property owners are s and EV Ventures group in in care of their registered agent Sebastian Mara we we were coming for an intent to lean um on this property however the property owner came in and paid the fine this property is now in compliance we are glad to report and my motion would be that we close the case I'll second all in favor I oos motion passes SC zero we are moving on to case to item number 7.8 and I would like to let the board know that the property owner is coming on Zoom property address is 11331 Northeast 11th Place case number c n-24 d275 property owner 11331 Northeast 11th Place LLC in care of their register agent Maris estan we are asking for an intent 250 in fines a permit was issued for the driveway violation however they had allowed the Lans to run for a few days and that in addition with the viol fine and and the fee for administrative cost uh there's a total of 1,250 owing so so they got the new driveway in but they got it in after some fees went forward yes they have installed the driveway permit and everything but these fines are still outstanding and it was the driveway built in compliance I mean did it pass that's correct and did the property owner uh try to get like a fine reduction or anything like that [Music] Zoom any other questions from the board or from staff was he SW s sir if you would identify yourself and your relationship to the property you got to be swor and Janie oh yes hello my name is estan I am the owner of the proper me one a moment we need you to be sworn in can you raise your right hand do you swear or affirm the testimony you about to give would be the truth the whole truth but nothing but the truth I do okay okay good evening my name is estan mares I am the owner of the property um really u i I receive the the letter in order to moving forward with the driveway H in the middle time I we we was moving to to Europe I'm living now in Spain for the last six month and I tried to to run the permit by myself but unfortunately I I had a back and forth with the city because I submit the the permit but I need to modify some papers and after a couple of um ER try to to to finish with the process I decide to to hire um a contractor and he ran a new pit in order to move forward and to finish the the process uh at this time the driver is done the permit is the new permit is closed the old permit it's is not approv and well I Reed a a photo from one of my tenants about the the hearing tonight and well the idea is to try to explain to you that I did the work sorry if I confuse in order to submit two different permits but I try to do it the the best in order to to moveing forward with the requirements of the city the idea right now is to show to to to the city that the the work was done and try to understand if it's possible to apply for a reduction because really I try to to be in in order with with you so I appreciate very much that you've come into compliance as far as permitting what we're dealing with tonight is your fines still remain outstanding and they need to be paid would he have been told about the fine reduction process was he told about that we mailed all the notices to the address on the record and that information is in there that's correct sir did did did you receive that like what you're asking for tonight apparently is in the documentation that they sent to you that you know is something that you could have applied for ER okay well now I'm leaving I'm here in a Spain now it's one 1:15 a.m. uh really I don't have the the documentation that you sent me because uh I am not in USA for the last six month that is the reason that I didn't receive the the letter s makis we sent um all the information to your address at one 0101 e Bay Harbor apartment 602 in Bay Harbor Island here in Florida I'm not sure if your mail is being forwarded to Spain but this is where we can officially send your this information okay that property is not my property anymore I sold the property in July and I changed in the sun Beast the information to another property in bisc park that it's a property to a friend of me and she didn't send me that she didn't receive nothing apparently because she didn't send me nothing I don't know if that's the case please reach out to the Village to give them your proper mailing address because they can only go by what they have on record I I need to do the change in the city is not enough the county to change also with the village because the county records don't always change quickly any of the other websites don't always change quickly you need to deal directly with the village so that they have your correct current mailing address um I I really think we can move forward and do this the way we um it was a similar case earlier tonight and um if if we're all if there are no other questions I'd like to go ahead and make a motion please on case number c-24 d275 that the property is in compliance uh there's an outstanding lean of $1,250 uh and I'd like to request that the village move forward with filing the lean a uh giving the resident until January the 15th to apply for a fine reduction to be heard at the next hearing if not have the village commence with filing the lean plus the applicable filing fees after January the a second I have a motion and a second all in favor I oppos motion passes or Z you understand that sir so you're gonna get the chance to do what you just asked us to okay sorry by January 15th you need to either pay the fine or apply for a fine reduction if not then the village will institute the intent to leave okay okay I have I have time before January 15 okay perfect thank you so much all right thank you sir thank you have a good night we'll email you the order Mr Maris okay thank you welcome bye the next item is 7.9 this is for the address 11335 Northeast 11th Place Cas number Cen 24276 eido Gonzalez we are asking for we were going to ask for an intent to lean but I believe Mr Gonzalez is here to give testimony he has complied with the driveway however I'll leave that to the board to decide um regarding this compliance and we have uh received an application for a fine reduction for the driveway have received we have received the wait when you said that when you said that it's up to us to determine if it's in compliance is that really for us or is that for like the building he has pictures to submit we had brought this case if you recall the last time that um his driveway was we determined after review that it wasn't 50% uh deteriorated right so we asked him we asked him to replenish the board asked him to put the border around and I believe he has done that we submit um we would like to submit those pictures are the pictures attached onto the record for the board to review I believe he has more pictures that he wanted to submit do you have more pictures you didn't take any that's fine my phone and and it's dead yeah but uh uh inspector nibs he was there yes we've submitted and has the has the proper inspector been out to make sure that the border is the proper depth depth I would not confirm that but we as I said at the other hearing we reviewed this case and we I determined that it wasn't 50% deteriorated in that way he would just replenish the gravel and done fix the border and then we would bring him back for this um okay I got you request for reduction I if I may and my and my my mine is that we have an order of enforcement to replace the driveway or bring it into compliance with the village code that was the issue right and it still hasn't been brought the pictures doesn't don't do not reflect that it's been brought into compliance with the village code and I'm going by the order of enforcement and you know y until then I'm not because all all that was done it appears all that was done was that various stones or whatever we'd like to refer to them we're straightened up but that's not a border no and if we're if if we're requiring residents and property owners who live nearby to bring their properties into compliance ex if we have an order of enforcement that was here that was heard and entered then either the order enforcement needs to be vacated or whatever or because right now to me this Pro this I'm don't see where it's into standards and as a resident of the property of of this community I think the village and residents are do more than H H have a uh a driveway as it is Ian if you look at May May they're not even all lined up they're just sort of pushed back in place better street right exactly I mean because the point is there's got to be a border on that side no no border surrounding it may may I may I add oh please you will have your time I oh I absolutely just gotta discuss it and kind of go back and forth and then and then you kind of jump in after so I'm not seeing it as compliance at this point either would wouldn't a building official uh or or like somebody come and inspect that to find out whether it's in compliance I mean that's that's not really our role right I mean it's like if there's a violation there's a violation I think the last time you said it was not more than 50% throw some more rocks in there straighten things out do the Border but doesn't something have to be done like another inspection before it comes here and then it's either in violation or it's not well I respect the impartiality of this board we as a village could make a mistake and if the board determines that our inspection does not meet what the standards that you're looking for you are welcome to rule that way the the the property owner is here he can we can reverse um what we are presenting and and what what is your what is your uh inspection you know conclusion my inspector did go out there and issued a violation for them to install a new driveway however I did review the photographs and I reviewed the case and it was my opinion that this particular driveway was not 50% deteriorated which means which means that they are okay it's okay for them to replenish the gravel without getting a permit however there was an order which he rightfully says we either can vacate the order and issue it ask the the board to vacate the order and issue a different order or the the board can refuse to vacate the order and ask him to get a permit and install a your driveway well um I I'm looking at the picture that was one of the first ones uh July the 10th right and I understand it may be different color stone but I'm seeing that the walkway is a good 4 in above the driveway I'm seeing that there's no continuity of a of a board order around any of it I'm finding that their um uh parking stop I mean parking concrete stops and their round pillars on one side and on the other side is uh Other Bar border is other parking stops there's no continuity and part of a driveway 50% would be a border because if you if you have gravel and and it's somewhat deteriorated and you have a border that is completely out of out of compliance to me that comes into the 50% I think ruling with all due respect I think there was too much too much focusing on the gravel without remembering that all of those what are essentially parking stops used as a border are also part of that and they clearly are not in compliance and are a tripping Hazard as a matter of fact if anybody is walking in the front door the only other thing I would bring up is because what we heard to enter on the um uh order of enforcement was the pictures and all and the testimony from July 10th and part of that the roadway going into the driveway there gaps there so to me if it was fully Gra there wouldn't be a a a a lip between the driveway the parking space and the walkway there wouldn't be gaps between the roadway and the parking space but 50% deterioration means they are some issues but they are not 100% but again that was my humble opinion the is welcome to make a ruling according to how they see this that's just my hum this point I'm not Ling to oh we got the resid yeah I'm just saying my opinion right now but yeah and have you been sworn in sir no I haven't if you would please raise your right hand do you swear affirm that aest testimony you about to give would be the truth the whole truth but nothing but the truth folks I'm with s identify yourself in your Rel my name is ago Gonzalez and I'm the owner of the property um I'm I'm I'm taking a back quite a bit because as I'll share in an email that I sent to to Dorene uh following the last uh hearing that I was at uh where we discussed this uh this I it it was attached to a fine reduction request and that was uh dated uh Jan I'm sorry November 12th just the week following when when we last met and and I had an attachment to the reason why relief should be considered and and if I may um just share it's it's not too lengthy that really recap what we spoke about the last time and and quite frankly what Daren and I spoke about then and and and earlier today uh but in any event I I'll share if I may as shared last week at the November 6 Board hearing uh using pictures which I attached to the email supported by uh uh Mr linnett uh the initial violation was due to a visual misunderstanding due to the fact that I at greater cost to myself augmented the the existing white gravel with more durable and therefore more I I apologize but we have this we have it in front of us what and I guess I again and it's my humble opinion and and I wanted to if I may take up the board's time just to share this because I think it gives us a clear recap of of what occurred uh may I thank you and therefore more ecologically sound gray Granite on July July 17th 24 I spoke with vanisha Sherry and communicated that I would not be able to attend the evening's board meeting in person due to being at the hospital with my wife Vanessa kindly stated that I could participate via zoom and provided the zoom meeting information meeting IDs listed here as demonstrated via multiple phone screenshots which I attached as well to the email uh try as I may I was unable to log in the hearing from from the hospital upon receiving the notice to appear in toen um uh letter for for last week's that being the November 6 Board hearing I made arrangements to appear in person to avoid additional technical failures on November 5th I spoke with Daren Grant who kindly communicated that I could cure the violation by adding additional Granite the following morning November 6 I did just that by adding great Granite as demonstrated in the pictures that I provided and attached to this email um it at last uh hearing that we were at so in conclusion with all due respect the initial error misunderstanding was born by the visual difference in color from the existing white gravel versus a gray Granite that I added proactively in an effort to be more ecologically sound from day one I have done everything in good faith from attempting to attend the board meeting on July 17th seeking Guidance enacting the guidance uh uh to to attending the last last week's that being November 6 Board hearing therefore I respectfully requested the fine be eliminated or reduced so I'm taking a back by by today's um sharing by by darene when in fact my understanding was that I had followed your direction including earlier today's so without the respect to to the board I I've done everything that has been uh requested and um and uh as I just shared so you really haven't because we talked about the Border last month and and and the Order of enforcement that was existing was very clear right and earlier today I addressed it with both Daren and uh Mr nibs uh who was out at the property uh following my having taken care of it so I'm and I would I'm very surprised and disappointed well I I I I I can fully understand that because I'm a little disappointed also in that we as residents have to have this at a I believe this is a non-homesteaded property I would assume that it's a I believe it's a duplex and it's property um and to maintain a property with a driveway like that me who live as I live here I don't think I should have we trying to bring our village up and not to maintain status quo if you had a proper border I would be inclined to agree but you don't you still have round tiles I'm looking at a picture that's dated um round columns on one end and on the other are parking stops that are not in compliance with the village at all so that's part of a driveway I do see added things but it's spilling out into the um roadway even here Mr Blandon I the as you mentioned and and perhaps implied this is a a non-homesteaded home but they are homes that are as as many of you I'm sure have driven by very nicely manicured and maintained and certainly have been trying to resolve this and quite frankly thought that we had guidance and I had followed the guidance back on on in in uh November and again now so Mr Blandon the implication that the fact that I don't live here although I live in a sister city that being Miami Springs very very aware and I think and I hope it's evident that from from day one this whole thing was caused by the fact that I put gray Granite as opposed the to the the the white gravel no that was that was the Genesis of of the issue and now all of a sudden it's turned into something beyond that that I have tried to cure with the guidance from the compliance group something please please so Mr when Mr Gonzalez came this afternoon to see me I saw the same pictures that you're looking at I did send him back and I said this border will not be accepted by the board so he did change it and I would like to submit not that I'm asking for changing the order but I would just like for the board to review the last pictures we took I want is I want the property to late today the way that a resident living here would it and allowed to drive into a driveway absolutely appreciate that have this photo The Far Side still looks like it's uh round columns over here um Mr Mr nibs and I met there this this uh and evening I I don't mean to overp speak you but I was still just trying to point out that still at the front where you drive in there the parking lot stops this is not a proper border and the whole thing that we try to bring into is our driveways into compliance and this was cited way back in July and then we have a notice of a order of enforcement uh that was signed August the 20th and now we're here in December well I I mean God so just so I understand when you were here before and I I remember this now because it was like the way the pictures were and it was white and gray and you know whether it was 50% or not it sounds like that you know with the addition of the the gravel that that part of it he is satisfied right but but satisfied and that was the subjective part for me because there was white stones and then there were gray stones right so I remember that he the resident came in and he explained that and and said that he'd take care of that and you did I did did and now but now the issue is the border and then but when we were here back then the the Border was addressed right it was addressed as something that we he had to do or just that or was he just supposed to add gravel that's where I'm confused right now I believe the the the board was very clear about correcting the border and when I looked at the pictures this afternoon I did tell Mr Gonzalez I don't believe the board will accept this order so he went back and he did some more Corrections and with that I I did explain to him the last say is going to be what the board says not what I say Daren and and and and I apolog may I I apologize because we we we have had great meetings of the minds till till a couple of minutes ago because on on November November 6 when you and I spoke in person you shared that this is a matter of er um adding more gray Granite versus gravel which I I so uh am disappointed that I that I did the gray Granite because I would not be here I would not have been here uh last meeting and and I did that I corrected that and I was told that that was that that was it that was the issue and now ER earlier today when I saw you and I men you suggested you said that by continuing with the the the the um parking stops that that would suffice and that's what I did so I I I apologize I don't mean to AB I hope it doesn't you know I understand danger our our relationship but that's what happened yet to resolve this we do have the reason the code officers bring these cases to this board is for our input we also have the responsibility to interpret our codes by the evidence they provide us and we feel that what we've seen which is a picture I believe taken today that border doesn't satisfy code M Anderson if I may and I and I understand the the process um unfortunately I'm caught up in this process but as part of the process it's communicating with code compliance and following their guidance absolutely I would like to point out just a couple things and then because what we're here for is just whether we're going to file a lean um is that there was a notice of violation that on April the 30th so we're talking about April the property was notified and it says your driveway does not meet the uh requirements of the above code upgrade your driveway to comply with the design standards set forward in section so and so so there was notice provided there was a notice of violation that was all cited then it comes uh pictures in July so we're going from April May June July then we get an order of enforcement and uh that's signed August the 20th and then we're up to last month and this month all I'm here saying is that there was plenty of opportunity to be sufficient opportunity from July when the notice of violation was filed till Mr Blandon if I may I understand but yeah sir um I'm just pointing out how I'm looking at it and as long as there's an order of enforcement here that's what I am looking at and what was put forth in the order of enforcement so unless there's something else that I just wanted to make those comments and and that's why wanted to read what I put together July 7th the board hearing that I was not able to attend but requested information to attend via Zoom I was unable to do so and I shared with you my attempts many attempts so on so forth so please do not um misunderstand or imply that I have disregarded uh those Communications that's not the case and I don't I mean I take you at your word all I was pointing out is from April thank you and there was May June July so I don't know what transpired here so far there's been no testimony from anything going on between April to July July understand you weren't here um and and you weren't able to access I fully understand that I'm willing but I'm only looking at from the date of the notice of violation um in April so where we are last month and this month I expressed my concerns last month that I did not think it meic right um uh uh brought the standard up to a proper driveway within the code and as of today I don't really I see where there's Improvement but I mean I isn't proper right just not a proper dri it's your it's your position Mr Gonzalez that you brought it into compliance by doing what you thought the board had indicated that it wanted which was to add more gravel yes right and that's what you did was there even a discussion back then about whether you need to get a permit to get a gravel and you said you don't need to get the permit for the gravel was that discussed last meeting we issue these um um violations and I will take responsibility for the mistake in this we should have made it clear to him I should have made it clear to him that once I was moving away from those design standards and asking him to follow the 50% deterioration rule that I should have come back and asked for that order to be vacated because it is under a different ordinance so I take responsibility for that thank you D what would be unfortunate was is to blame him for my mistake I like I say I take responsibility for that however it's up to the board at the end of the day how they see it they are the judge and they can disagree with me thank you and I'm amicable to hearing in the future a a fine reduction request but right now we're just hear whether it's fan or not there already is an order of enforcement however that that is addressed or handled is not before us a fine reduction is not before us the only thing before us is whether we move forward on a notice to Le and Sir for the future when you put forward a fine reduction you need to State there is the proper form there is a proper form and I would also like to add that if we are going to stick with the actual section that we violated him with he may have to remove the driveway that he has now and install in your driveway because the standards are different I think that when I was reviewing this case that's what I consider he will have to remove that entire driveway he has there get a survey go through Planning and Zoning do plans and install a new driveway Dar that's not that's not what this is not what we discussed and what I was here for at the last uh hearing and I corrected following your guidance I agree that's what the violation was issued at like I I testified to the board when I reviewed the case I looked at the totality of what would bring that case into compliance and what I just explained the section we violated you with you would have to install a brand new driveway there are new standards in the village of biscane park for driveways however in that section of the code there's a section that says if your driveway is not 50 % deteriorated you can just replenish it and that's what I was thinking would be easy compliance for you however it's up to the board to say it's okay or my my opinion um I mean everything that was brought before the board was regarding the the the uh the whether there was enough gravel or not I mean that's what was was originally that's correct brought it to the board so now I mean I mean I can understand Mr gonzal is saying it's kind of like you know a moving Target here because now you know we look at it and we say Hey you need a new border but you know I think that he's fixed one problem and there's another problem there that you know he he should be addressing it a new what was brought before the board was that the driveway did not meet the requirements of a code make a judgment % or not absolutely that that that is not for us it was that it didn't bring that was the notice of violation than when that was brought before the Bo it was that say that was notice of violation wasn't in compliance um and the testimonies that time here was the pictures in July there the July this is what we were um given and yeah that does not look anywhere near 50 I mean look like more than 50% high but because but we talked about that because it was white and gray rocks border but there wasn't but the the discussion that we had at the meeting the last time was about the replenishment it wasn't about the Border but that that was just a cursory discussion because there was already a notice of violation you know it's already a notice of violation but the testimony that supported that violation was the amount of the gravel that was in there nothing about borders from my understanding correct right there was that was the discussion there was a notice of violation it was told to either file for a fine reduction or bring it back in and what didn't we did we table this till this meeting it was to come back before us so and we still don't have it we don't have the Border were addressed at the last meeting were give us a proper border respect if I may so the for the proper border the board is asking for depth and size and this which we as Code Compliance officers cannot attest to now if we're going to go into asking for depth and other things like I say Mr Gonzalez is going to have to go back to pnz with plans of a brand new driveway that's the difference but Daren if I may and and and I think I'm I'm part of this process yes so please bear with me it as I shared and and and read which I attached to you back in November I I have followed Direction and as Miss Henderson mentioned it that's part of the process right we're on the outside you all are are the ones that decide and then we get to you through you and I followed what you said what you asked me to do from day one with adding additional granite because of the distinction in the color and then more recently with regards to forgive me corre Mr Gonzalez would have taken care of the borders day one was not the that was when we were're bringing the case to the board initially when he issued the violation he issued the violation for design standards which compliance would have been you installing a brand new driveway if there was no 50 absolutely you did inter that's now the second part I'm I'm sorry we do have we do have other cases to hear and I'd like to go ahead and make a motion I'd like to make a motion in case number c-24 d276 to um table this until the January meeting to have the village come back with the resident as um with some type of uh reconciliation as it stands right now um yeah my motion I'll second it ask you to you also want him to redo a proper fine reduction or at this point that's off moment until we get you can't do a fine reduction if if nothing isance or there isn't some some resolution to what we have right now but I would like to um direct The Village I mean oh and amend my if you don't mind Michael to amend the motion to stop the daily fine at this point in time so second folks it just as an FYI I submitted the gonzale I'll meet with you in the office I don't mean to interrupt you and I don't need to be rude I apologize I'll meet with you in the office we can have a meeting with the manager and go through your case and just review it from start to finish okay a fine reduction when we get to that point does need to contain an offer from you not just reduce my fine or eliminated it has to contain a monetary amount when I'm reading what you submitt it simply says reduce it or eliminate it there is a proper form which staff can furnish you and when we get to that point that's what you need to submit there would have to be compliance first before we even get to that so when we meet in the office we'll talk about how we can resolve the driver we that's my intruction form I was just following your directions at the last meeting on the bottom line is said you're not there yet it's it it hasn't occurred yet because nothing's resolved but we've tabled it so you can figure it out that's good news and your daily findes that have been going on have stopped as a result of the motion so we can try to figure this out I understand I'm just you know my position right now but I'm also looking at the fact of how what we had previous rulings and there is an order of enforcement and I appreciate you're listening to my position I have a motion in a second all in favor I I any opposed motion passes for thank you next item is 7.10 for the address 11401 Northeast 8th Court case number CN 24- 0708 property appraiser information protected we are bringing this case for an intent to lean for a large in the S of the Eastern side of the house there has been no correction or attempt to correct the violation the lean has run as of today at $6,250 and we are asking for the board to issue an order to lean this property if you all remember we had two uh violations on this same property last month and we did get the village to go ahead toile the intent to lean and it's all started with the neighbor that was next door that had an issue with the property okay does anyone have any questions comments the resident here property owner okay um if nothing then I'd like to make a motion in case number cn24 d708 file the violation has occurred they are not yet in compliance file the intent to lean for the amount of $6,250 which will continue to grow as long as they're out of compliance and any applicable filing fees I'll second okay in favor I any opposed next item is 7.11 for the same address and same property owner this is for case number number cn24 d709 this case is another property maintenance case um for unsightly trash and objects on the front porch we are asking for an order to lean this property for the amount of $6,250 and the $250 continued daily fine we are also asking for a second order on this particular case on behalf of the village manager to ask to Abate this violation uh ask the village to Abate this violation um if they board can give the order the village can go on this property and clean up the property the reason being it has been a health hazard for their neighbors you saw them testify they're still experiencing animal things going on to their property because their neighbor does not maintain their property at all and you in contact with those neighbors and that's it continues it it continues we're not not only have been in touch with the neighbors we've been in touch with other residents who have come and complained about this property no is it our understanding that somebody's living there or we don't know we haven't seen anyone on the property but the inspector can testify to that so I've speaking to the neighbors and actually other residents uh in proximity to that property uh several times I have been into that property I go to the front door I knock hello anyone I get no response I've seen that the front of the yard is wellmaintained I've passed by in that area several times there is a landscaper that comes but I have not seen anyone I've asked the neighbors if they have they said they uh seen the guy a couple of times but not recently interesting I would like to add I discussed this case with the village manager and he actually himself did some research on the property we have not been able to find this gentleman that lives here I do see he signed the uh certified yes he did Watson he did but no answer at the door and did does the trash go out like you know to the side of the street have you noticed that I I haven't noticed any Trash being removed or taken um ready for a motion sure I'd like to make the motion on case number c-24 d709 U that the property is still in VI remains in a violation and direct The Village to follow lean in the amount of $6,250 as of 1218 2024 plus the app filing fees and the fines to continue to run also direct The Village to um to request uh an abatement of the property to have the village M Property Maintenance staff to go in and the property right terminology yes I'll second all in favor I motion pass let me just just just for a point of clarification when we do this abatement I mean we going to make or take any measures to make sure that the safety of our Public Works people that are going over there because I mean you you know just because you know we don't know if a guy even lives there or not he's signing for stuff but he's not answering the door he's got holes and trees growing through his house and that kind of thing yes and that is why we brought uh this case to get an order once we have an order we can always ask uh for PD assistance to go into property I I would suggest that we do that yes we will I'm moving to item 8.6 and 8.7 this is a very unique case for 860 Northeast 12th Street cases number oh case numbers Cen 24- 71 and 702 for Katherine browell trust we receive this these violations one is for a driveway and the other one is that does not have an approved uh surface it's a duplex so there's um two sides to this uh particular property there has been a missing person report fil on this uh property owner she had been from what we understand um going to the West Coast when we experienced the hurricanes and they haven't heard from her since um as soon as I received the information uh from the neighbor who has been trying to get in touch with her I reached out to the maner reach reached out to uh the police department and they have put in a call for her search I am asking the board to continue this these two cases for at least 90 days a resolution for at least 90 days um just to see where this case um goes if we hear from PD um or if this lady shows up then we can come back bring these cases back to the board uh for an order I would I would move if it's all right with every one that we table this case until should we say March or April March March okay so March of next year I'm sorry table cases Cen 2471 and 24702 until March of 2025 and then code St back and let us know what the resolution is I'll second all in favor I I any opposed motion passes 40 next item 7.12 for the property located at 11820 North East 12th Court CN 24607 this property is now in compliance they have paid the fine in full motion to close MO in Cen 24- 607 there was a violation property is now in compliance including paying the fine I move to close the case second all in favor I I oppos motion passes 4 Z next item 8.1 for the address 739 Northeast 111 Street case number Cen 24739 Brett Anthony Frey we're asking the uh the board um to issue a continuance on this case um the property owner has experienced a medical hardship he's an elderly gentleman and uh he has been unable to comply with these uh cases he had several cases we filed several leans on this property but uh he has experienced a severe medical hardship and we asking the board to continue this case for 90 days just a quick question when when it does come back to us could we have the backup from whatever you know initiated the permit that was expired just so we'd have more information we don't need it now but if we're going to table it that's I I understand I understand you know when we do have a case that's actually the second version it helps to have the first version so correct unfortunately with these cases we had uh proactively looked at all the permits that had expired okay so they were not based on a violation per se they were based on permits that had expired so would you say March March then I would make a motion in case cn24 d739 that we continue this case until March due to the owner's medical situation a second all in favor I motion carries 4 Z I would like to add to the record that we are working with PD to perform checks on this General man just to make sure he's okay next item is 8.2 for 740 Northeast 116th Street CC 24- 0060 um the property owner is not present by the contractor is here in this particular case we issued a violation for construction that had started um before the permit was issued after reviewing this case and the contractor visited um The Village we found out that the contractor was looking in the system and the permits were approved in the system once he saw the approval he went ahead and installed the windows however the building clerk had not processed the ISS the permit to read status issued so when the code inspector did his research he he did not see the permit issued just so there was a permit application he saw the installation and concluded that they installed the windows without first getting the permit it was a technical error so the permit was pulled permit was pulled so do you want you going to make a mo I would ask request I would ask the board to dismiss this case I'll make a motion to dismiss uh case number uh hold on a second cc2 24- 0060 it's 8 cc2 24-6 make a motion to dismiss it I'll second all in favor any opposed motion passes 4 Z happy holidays to you all thank you so much thank you next item 8.3 4741 Northeast 111 street it's case number c-24 d740 sis evangelist um we were going to ask for an order of enforcement in this case however he has complied the property owner is here he got the permit and the house is painted and the wall the wall is painted yes looks good it does look good that was my one question I said what about the wall yeah he did a good job very good thank you very much I have more pictures for you you I'm sure your neighbors are yeah thank you very much okay happy hold this to all of you thank you you too you have a motion yeah motion c274 that the property is inance and a second I'll second all in favor I any opposed motion passes 40 thank thank you very much Happy Holidays all the best to you all and your families next case is 8.5 it's for the address 830 NorthEast 120th Street for case number c-24 d452 property owners at 8:30 Northeast 12th Street LLC in care of their registered agent Christopher P Kelly PA this property was violated for a driveway surface showing signs of deterioration it's a property maintenance violation I would like to report to the board that this property has been sold it has a new owner and we are asking on behalf of the owner for a continuance so they have time to adjust to um take care of this violation and I I just have one very quick question I promise I wish the code officer was here that wrote this up he says um repaired or install well is he saying it's more than 50% deteriorated or I would love to have had clarification yes I I saw that myself um I guess I I I'm not speaking but trying to make sense of what he he issued how long would you suggest we do we allow it Contin would 30 days be okay for you to adjust and I mean if we do a repair 30 days will be okay okay but you know if you would I'm sorry well first of all this more than um 50% so again I want to make this clear to the board the section he used to violate the driveway is not the design standards this is a property maintenance violation meaning they can throw Asphalt in those holes and the driver will yeah well still I mean you can throw you can throw Asphalt in those holes and it's still more than 50% I understand but they can I'm just pointing out that the village can go back to site accordingly right because putting putting Asphalt in these holes that was just an example no no I know but I'm just looking at the the borders the barrier there's nothing nothing there so with the 50% rule it's sort of grandfathering in a property they don't have to do Borders or anything it's 50% I understand but if you look over here where the tree is ask fall going all up in it right that is not even that is can't be in compliance with any of The Village's standards even at a at a grandfathered in to me that would be more than 50% whenever how are you going to pave over the the the the tree roots Tre Roots I mean you've got all of that and then over the side there is Grandfather means you have to have a defined you still need to have a defined driveway just putting gravel and throwing I mean continuing to throw it into the grass does does not make a driveway this is really concerning first of all the Cod officer used the wrong ordinance to site use property M use Property Maintenance rather than the driver and design standards an issue what the board could do is throw out this case dismiss the case and we can reissue using the right section motion is about to be that we dismiss this case and that the property be properly cited absolutely we can do that well wait wait so so the motion is so it can be properly cited I think are we just dismissing this case and they do whatever their job is okay okay if it they so see fit they canite it okay right so I'm sorry I have just to dismiss will you the I SEC all in favor I any oppos comply before I issue thank you sir all right thank you welcome to the neighborhood next item is 8.8 is Mary here 868 Northeast 119th Street case number Cen 24202 for maril Larson we were going to ask for an order of enforcement on this case he had painted her property without first obtaining a permit however she was um she communicated back and forth we had some email with us she was on the website trying to apply for the um permit but she had issues with going through with the application I would ask that I would ask the board to give her some lenience and give her some time to be able to apply for the permit 30-day continuance um what's already done that's a discussion the manager just had with with me if the the if it's done the paint color was right why are we even asking for a permit now that where the ordinance is written right now it doesn't matter if they're using an approved color they still have to go through the process of filling out that and that's what Mary needed to do but she had a lot of a little bit of issues and she did communicate with me I spoke with her we emailed back and forth so I'm asking for so you're getting of time even two weeks you're getting cooperation absolutely yeah just table it till we just till January sure want to make that motion case number c-202 i' make a motion to table this to January to have the resident obtain a permit second all in favor I any opposed motion passes 4 Z next item is 8.9 for the address 915 Northeast 100 and 18th Street case number is c-24 d697 Property Owners name is Kean Zan Gregory cbell white we are asking for an order of enforcement to be issued on this property they were found to be in violation of section 16.14 for installing a construction fence in the rear of the property without a permit they have since applied for a permit and i' would like to enter onto the record permit number Fe e-24 d52 I did call him and leave him a message are you the property owner yes I I left a message on your phone I wanted to get an update there are notes in your permit that you haven't um responded to What notes um I don't have the actual not yeah I I I was told yeah the after Thea permit I and I went to I would like my name's Greg White I'm the property owner and have you been sworn in yes I was here 8 at 6 6:00 um I have a question right off the top what is the status of the permit because one of the things that jumps out at me is the fence is incorrectly installed that's correct this permit has not been issued yet it's being reviewed the side has to be in yeah it's inw for so once it goes to pnz they will be able to tell him exactly what's wrong with the way he installed the property and how he should do it he's in the process with PNC he's in the process of the permit review and it will be did you go to pnz for discussion to the planning no I uh I I did the aftera permit I I submitted it and I didn't hear anything back so they will they will days before the planning and uh design review board they will review your permit application and let you know how you can comply but he said what am I doing here tonight I'm sorry what am I doing here tonight yeah the violation violation because this um um particular fence was installed improperly all right well that's the first thing I I've never heard that it was installed incorrectly we did send the violation is it was installed without a permit right we you for an after the fact permit which I was I was violation okay we need to deal with right any other questions you shouldn't have started the job without first getting permits that's one I just purchased the house a couple months ago right the the fence in the back was was decomposing it was uh yeah I mean it was it was completely dilapidated it was an eyesore I I understand that however you need and the fence is only about 12 ft like my the perimeter of my entire backyard is we can see that we pictures is m is it's mainly a cement wall on both sides so you said you said you did the after the fact 90 days ago I did it in October September yes September applied September I mean is that okay I mean is that seems kind of a long time what did you didn't hear from anybody well it depends um on what's going on in the building department once he submits a permit we have no control it goes through different stages of review they will schedule him before the board he has to go before the board and they may ask him for plans and all that and the survey because it's offense okay that process we don't have control over got it yeah the notice of violation was September he did apply for the permit the end of September but we still have to address what the violation is if does anyone have any other question there if you would whatever you'd like to say questions I mean I guess I'm requesting a continuance right if I haven't heard from any I I got your voice message yesterday and I got this on my on my house I was out of town from Thanksgiving until a like a late last week do I just need to call you to kind of figure out what's left to what other information you need yeah you need to read the comments so you know what the building department is asking you online or or just this comments here the same way you applied for the permit you log back into the portal there will be comments from one of the reviewers what we're here to address tonight though is the actual violation the work done fence installation without the perit and if you have any issues please contact building because we've switched uh we've changed uh programs you may not be able to log into the old system but they may have transferred your permit into the new system contact building Department please oh okay yeah I didn't know I needed a permit to to make the uh the improvements or take it down the old fence if not I'd entertain a motion well I mean I just I just want to make sure I understand is that he moved in here dilapidated fence you put a new one in you got hit for it you applied for the after the fact it's been 90 days if he'd heard from them before now we wouldn't even be here right because he would have take that's true but it would be but okay be here this yeah had a okay all right and then what he's asked for is a motion to continue so he could get that information dealt with I see it's just a if there was a violation or not okay and before that before you moved before you moved here did you live in uh to your new house did you live in biscane Park before okay number c24 d697 that a violation has occurred in assess a fine of $250 F the wave the $250 administrative F fee wave it given the resident uh property owner is working with the village and it's taking a good F I'll second that all in favor I oppos motion pass is for I oh you're opposed I'm opposed I say no motion passes 31 thank you sir thank you we'll send you an order in ma next item 8.1 we did one z 8.10 address 11440 Griffin Boulevard Cas number by Cen 24721 property owner mandarini LLC in care of their registered agent lum LLC we were going to ask for an order of enforcement in this case however there is a driveway permit in the system that has been applied for and I would like to enter onto the record driveway permit number dws-2 4-60 they applied on December 10th 2024 and this driveway permit is in process but the not oh um no the question is they were to comply by when October 25th October and they just applied in December December the 10th so all right all right anything else uh any other comments no motion yeah on case number c-24 d721 that a violation had occurred is now uh in process of being complied assess a fine of $250 and an administrative I'll second all in favor I any opposed motion passes 4 Zer next item 8.11 for the address located at 11625 Griffin Boulevard the case number is cc24 0041 for Carol Ron we were going to ask for an order of enforcement for an permitted signs that were installed at the property it was a real estate um sign that was posted at the property however they have removed the sign and they're now in compliance well the property sold they did yeah wow what was wrong with the sign just because it was hanging like that it was non-conforming it was too big oh okay um never mind I I'll wait till we're finished but I'd like make a motion case number Cen D c-24 d004 that uh to properties in compliance and to close the case second all in favor I any motion passes 40 last item on the agenda is 8.13 property located at 1955 Northeast 12th cour case number Cen no CC 24-50 belonging to LSP homes LLC in care of their registered agents Kenny perie we were going to ask for an order of enforcement on this property they were found to be in violation of section 7.3.1 for a trailer that's always parked at the prop facing Northeast 9th Court I'm happy to report to the board that they are now in compliance well which is a good thing because if the property is on 12th Court the trailer can't be facing ninth court so we would have had to drop it oh I'm very happy they're in compliance I don't understand what you're saying but that's at the back of the property well can't possibly be nth grade oh it was just miss cited and it's not just on the cover sheet which is what I was hoping it's on the um notice of violation well I make the motion since they're in compliance my motion would be that we in case number c-24 d050 the property owner there was a violation they are now in compliance we dismiss we close the case second all in favor all any opposed motion passes for for and those were all the cases we brought before the board tonight thank you no thank you um we have a moment for discussion oh minutes Vanessa do me a favor write yourself a big note to always put the minutes at the end because remember we came to consens that in order not have everybody having those few minutes we would do those at the end okay did everybody have a chance to read the minutes did I thought they were very good me too did you have any no CH I'd like to make a motion that there's no other comments on comments uh that to approve the minutes I'll second all in favor opposed motion passes 4 zero Vanessa you are doing an outstanding job on this you really are and that's got to be a challenge and I thank you and he's been getting the orders done like by Friday yes so much much appreciate it thank you um yeah I just want if if we have a moment for discussion when it comes to these driveways and the grandfathered in the grandfathered in ones maybe the code and we will get together with regards to what it what classifies a we would definitely sit with the manager and review the actual code because we did have issues with some of the violations we issued with driveways because once again not any specific case but most of the ones we relying on the testimony at the time and the pictures presented and to me gravel is is one part of a grandfather in property um if it's not have some grandfather in properties that their driveways are just gravel thrown on and it's been like that for since I've lived here for 30 years correct I agree with you we will definitely get some clarity I I will definitely engage the manager he has more experience in this and it was a new ordinance for us to enforce so definitely we'll review the ordinance and if there are things very helpful because oh yeah it's subject to interpretation but if we have it from the building folks we're going to have a lot clearer in attitude and and in a perspective and that because it is it can so easily be subjective we need subjective and the other thing and I know this is code isn't written but we might want to entertain at some point in time I don't know if we differentiate homesteaded properties for non-homesteaded property for very important for bringing up to date I don't see why a non-homesteaded property that's rental and Money Maker grandfathered in without being brought up the Cod person yeah I'm I'm curious legally I agree with you in principle but I'd be curious legally if we could do that legally yes it's worth pursuing it's worth finding out absolutely and I'd really like to thank both manager Childress and commissioner am thank you for not only coming tonight but sitting through it and hanging in there I very much improve I'm sure we all do appreciate you know you you guys being here and seeing firsthand what goes on thank you thank you commissioner AMS she's always putting us on the edge but thank you for coming with us in the field and coming here to be with us and all of and to rapael who isn't here great jobs much appreciated it can be thankless at times but know that we appreciate absolutely rapael couldn't be here tonight he has a bereavement in the family thank you good point thank you for putting this together but I'd like everybody to feel free to meetings ahead of time if you know you're going to be on vacation at some point let's know it in advance and we can sometimes switch meetings because you remember like October you think with my it wouldn't matter if you remember like October we had to cancel and double it up in November because you do it beforehand right that's what I mean which is wonderful because you don't want to take that chance with the time and effort and money that goes into serving these cases you don't want to take a chance of not having a forum I agree we got here whoa I'm sorry Ashlin I apologize your last name Ashlin our alternate has joined us tonight thank you pleasure to have you here more now that I got please that helps doesn't it we're good yeah yeah well nice to meet you Ashley Ashley do I have a motion to dis well are we going are we do we have any questions with regards to January 15 I'm available I'm I'm good that's Wednesday Wednesday yeah everything is on the second week Wednesday we tried very hard to keep them on the second Wednesday of the month I'm good fine I have aition on the 15 good night thank you both good night on the 15th you're not available not available on the 15th it's the 14th or 16th available I I I will be in South Carolina from 17th and I'll be in South Carolina the 25th on so let's see 14 and 16 let's go to the Village I 16th I'm okay let me change Ash how you look I just wanted I just want the board members to be mindful that when we move away from the Wednesday there are other boards that have their meetings Mondays Tuesdays Thursdays Fridays that's why she I'm trying to get to the calendar and my phone is not cooperating I get to January's calendar maybe the village can send us out a couple dates okay I apologize you guys it's just not I'm not getting the calendar to move to January so would you folks mind would you take a look at the 14th and 16th 14th and 16th are the suggested Mission meetings the 14th they have them on Monday but we'll take the dates and then we'll wouldn't the commission meeting be the seventh usually the first Tuesday right except if it's like bumping up a Hol that isn't this is on for now 14th is good avilable Tuesday is everybody okay with that I'm okay with that ashy okay all right then January will be the 14th motion motion to adjourn second all in favor I so on the on January 14th you'll discuss the other dates go here