All right Good Evening Everyone Thank 
you all for being here It is 6:01 P.m. We are at Cape Canaveral City Council regular meeting at the City 
Hall Council chambers located at 100 Polk Avenue here in the beautiful city of Cape Canaveral Florida We are for 
a regular City council meeting Today is June 18th 2024 and I call this meeting to order Council member Davis would you 
please lead us in the pledge Of the United States of America into the republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice Thank you very much and thank 
you all for being here today City clerk Please call the Roll Council member Davis Council member Jackson mayor pro Tim Callum here Mayor Morrison Council member Willis All here Counsel Mayor Tim 
Thank you all for being here in City administration Appreciate you at this time It is the approval of the agenda as written or with amendments 
counsel any changes to the order or Any other Amendments needed for the agenda Um See none I'll make a motion 
that we approve the agenda as written a second Got a motion by mayor heard Tim 
Callum second by council member Willis any further discussion See non city Clerk Council member Davis Council member Jackson or Mayro Tim Callen or Mayor Morrison Council member Willis for Okay a T this time we're the public 
participation portion of the meeting I've got a couple of cards for those of you who 
took time out of your day to join us here And for those of you who are 
listening online and participating We Ask that you please raise 
your hand if you would like to speak after the folks here have a 
chance to speak We'll make sure that you heard will unmute you and uh Then we'll close the pub public 
participation portion of the meeting If It is your first time we have a light system once the light goes green 
you have three minutes and it yellow when it goes yellow 
right here in front of me Uh you have 30 seconds We do ask that 
you please wrap it up once it uh goes red at the end of three 
minutes And With that first card I have here Mr Bob Levine Mr Levine If You don't mind your 
name and address please Yes Bob Levine 111 Lincoln Avenue in Cape Canaveral Um thank you for the time to come up 
here and speak my real complaint Air BN BS Um got one next door to me Uh we've been there living a 13 years These folks moved in I should say bought 
the property made it into one I've done a good job with it but 
um we We're having tremendous difficulty from Well 50 50% of the time of disruption coming from next door I was in the other side of the world over the 
weekend and got a call from my wife at 230 in the morning Your time here about the uh 12 naked women in the yard Having a drunken fest out there just 
tearing it up all kinds of noise disruption and their 
Jacuzzi and didn't really give give a darn about Who else might be around him and my wife had motioned to them that 
it's past the ordinance time for a curfew and they just told her to go back inside And I'm not going to stand for this and 
tolerate it because that means I'm gonna have to square off with the neighbor and I shouldn't 
have to So what are ordinances do we have around here at night to keep 
this from happening And What kind of enforcement Is there gonna be 
because I would have called the police but I have to share some 
construction work with this neighbor next door So once I get that construction 
work done We're getting our roof redone Uh it's gonna be a 
different scene Uh I like to know what you're doing here because 
it seems that this the city here is is supporting the Airbnbs and 
the residence But We're just chopped liver and I like to know 
what's going on I know that uh revenue Uh you know the Airbnbs bring in revenue but uh a lot of us have been 
here for a number of years And Uh it seems that we We 
just don't get any uh any respect out of it so That's my major Think I wanna talk to 
you about about the curfew the laws when at night this 
is have to stop one They required uh to be quiet to turn it off And common walls I really think that 
you need to review when somebody's buying a piece of property here 
to do an Airbnb that there should not be home sharing a common 
wall to begin with because that that's just not fair and I mean 
we We have problems with them and his family's attitude 
as well You know we we have making money here and this 
is our business I know and I live here and we lived there 24 7 and my wife is home Um a while she You know 
she's home all the time and she's got uh health issues and all 
and it's a tremendous imposition And I Guess we're just gonna have to 
call the police and be a real pain in the behind So what are you going to do as city Council members Because I know you are 
elected and I'm Sure you like being in this position But you know 
if I don't get the support and a lot of us don't get to support we 
have as residents here we're gonna have to think about the next elections 
and maybe replace the members here who people who may care 
for the residents here and stop putting all the attention 
going for the Airbnbs Thank you for your time Thank you Mr Levine I've got your questions and 
I do intend to follow up with our city manager You as well Thank you OK next card is Mr John Benton I'm here for my code reduction 
hearing And I'd like to read an email that I got from Uh David Dickey And It concerns Kevin Mann spaceman storage and this is from you guys The City sent me this and I just showed it 
to the commander And It says Mr Green Please see the email chain below due to the discussion at Tuesday Night's council meeting regarding Spaceman storage city code enforcement staff contacted Kevin Mann owner of the property It was indicated that Christopher's man son Owner the son of the owner is 
providing nighttime security at that property Staff was told that no one was living at the 
property Sheriff's Department personnel has confirmed 
that there is no evidence of anyone living at that property based on routine nightly patrols Code enforcement staff reiterated 
to the property owner that the property cannot be used for residential purposes In addition staff recommended that Christopher register his actual address with the sheriff's office Sheriff's department personnel 
along with code enforcement South will continue to monitor the situation Please Let me know if you have any questions Then It goes down Brian I told I spoke Brian spoke with Agent Mulligan 
with the Sheriff's department He believes Christopher is 
living in Port Saint John with his wife I forwarded you the email to Agent Mulligan to further investigate Thanks Paul And Then It goes sir I contacted Kevin Mann in reference to his son Christopher man living at 85 88 50 Brown circle He informed me that he was working night security at Kevin Mann's property located at 8850 Brown Circle He also informed me that a security As a security office There is a security office at that location that he was utilizing I informed him He could not live there However He could work there as night security I also informed him he needed to register his actual address with the Florida Department of law enforcement because he was showing 8550 Brown court Cape Canaveral and he said he would His son is a sex offender and he was up there for security when I was being accused 
of living in the warehouse Must have been Kevin man's son calling you guys screaming that I lived in that warehouse And I told you guys at the very 
beginning I had a police officer in my unit next to me Coco Beach His name is easy and at the very first council meeting I came to John Mayor Randall's Said that he knows I did live in that 
warehouse I Thank you John We're gonna end it there Thank you Next card I have is miss Peg Scholler I'm sorry Peg I do notice that you 
selected 10 But if you choose to speak now That's fine too We'll have it You know if it's OK I'll I'll wait 
until the end Or Maybe I can have an opportunity to speak twice If I 
went for a minute and a half this time when we're going through item 10 which is the um recommendations after Todd 
and I worked through all of the issues I'm just asking that the City Council keep these main ideas 
in their mind when we're looking for a proper resolution and I'm 
taking Right off of the city of Cape Canaveral's organizational values and when we make recommendations I'm hoping that we're in lining the recommendation 
with what these values state one is commitment to 
excellence We believe our role is to make Cape Canaveral 
the ideal community for our residents businesses and visitors I hope that that's the goal 
still accountability We have a responsibility to one another These are 
not in order These are the ones that are most important for this particular situation That We ever Uh responsibility of one another the public to perform our jobs effectively 
and efficiently and we take that responsibility Seriously Integrity We strive to make decisions 
take actions based on what is right rather than what is expedient We are honest and we own up to our mistakes In communication We communicate 
openly clearly and directly in a timely manner with one another And with the community So when we get the um recommendations What We're we're aligning those with what Our core value state as a city also just briefly Wanna state the Role that code enforcement has as far as property maintenance is 
concerned and this is out of our code section 34-94 purpose Uh the intent of the City Council 
in adopting this article is to establish reasonable and uniform regulations on appearance of public areas Business establishments residential communities within the city mainly the big reason for this is good community appearance is the product of orderly and harmonious Relationships between existing manmade objects in nature appearance has a direct bearing on the economic value of property when appearance of public areas 
business establishments and residential communities is good business people homeowners and industrial 
developers tend to have a strong confidence in the community Poor parents lack a conjecture and lack of maintenance Bring about blight to care decay and decreased property values So these are the when we talk about the issues with code 
enforcement They don't affect pegs or Ellie Mae's Tiki bar They affect every resident because good enforcement brings value Important enforcement brings blight Thank you Thank you The mayor emeritus Rocky I noticed 
that you selected item number nine Did You want to speak now or wait or both Wow Wait until it's my work OK you got it Yes sir Yes sir Thank you Thank you and um Mr Levine I should have clarified you did select item number two as well 
Do You intend to speak on item number two Um I don't know if that was Agenda item number two which is To approve the minutes I That box is selected That's OK The um Consent items get voted through so I just wanted 
to make sure that you had a chance to speak on that if that was your 
intent I'll just make a note Thank you You had to there and I just marked it I think we're good I think I got Thank you That's all the cards I have 
if anyone intended to speak uh other than those who are waiting 
on the agenda items Uh please raise your hand or come forward And For those of you listening at home We ask that you 
please raise your hand if you'd like to speak We can unmute you I'm looking now to see if any hands are raised Seeing none We will go ahead and close public participation portion of the meeting 
Thank you again for your time to come Speak today and with that we are moving on to the consent agenda We have four items tonight Council Are there any items that we would like to remove from the consent agenda No I'm looking for emotion make 
a motion to approve the consent agenda Get a motion by council member Willis 
a second by council member Davis to approve the consent agendas Items 123 and four any further discussion The Non City Clerk Councilor Davis Council member Jackson For mayor Pete Callum Mayor Morrison for 
council member Willis for Ocean passes 50 I just want to comment I'm excited about Item number four the sandbagging 
machine and I wanna recognize that and thank staff and all that 
who are involved before hurricane season I think that that's 
excellent We think we can have it within the month Thank you Thank you Zack OK items for action Uh we have three items numbers 56 and seven The First one number five is to approve quote from Razorback LLC in the amount of 100 and $48,000 for the effluent transfer pump station structural 
rehabilitation and authorize the city manager to execute the same City manager Yes Sir Um Mayor back in August of last year City Council approved 
a proposal from rate to perform the design and the construction 
services for repairs to this uh platform at the water 
reclamation facility This is an elevated walkway that 
employees have to access at the plant that the main main building 
at the east side of the plant um and council approved that $50,635 that resulted in the creation of the 
design for the repair for the spawning concrete on this platform After we 
received the design We put it out to bid We did re receive three bids and the lowest bid was 100 and $48,000 and Tetra Tech recommended We Go with that one with Razorback LLC Um and Tim How quickly could that 
work get started And How long do we think it would take OK Thank you I know you weren't prepared 
for that I'm curious Thank you but mayor That's the item to repair the 
structural issue and the catwalk Um and it's a good thing that we 
have a healthy enterprise fund for this That's why we want to have a healthy 
enterprise fund that we can take care of this most important asset this 
plant out here and make sure it's gonna work well for everyone Thank you very much counsel Any questions for staff Okay S None and uh Double check the cards Make sure nobody had agenda Item Number five checked It tend to miss that 
from time to time OK seeing none I think Mister Russell 
said earlier He wanted to have a comment on this one Is that correct Mr Russell You did Look at there See I wouldn't have known Please come forward if you 
like Thank you very much city manager I left it up there when you brought it that was not intentional Thank you and I might not be 
right on point here When I looked at the agenda I saw a poop station and I didn't realize it was structural Only But I do have a question 
about pump stations in general When the storm rages and the 
water is falling and the water is building up and then floods are about to happen If The power goes off Or do the pump stations have lift stations lift stations Have backup power June Would you come up and address that or Tim Uh I'm concerned about it because our 
neighborhood floated out once and we had about Nearly less than half less than a dozen houses that were flooded and one of the reasons was left station failed during that episode and I'm just Keep an eye on it Lamar you're referring to um sanitary sewer or stormwater storm water Yeah one now Also known as junior T Okay The only stormwater pump that we do have is being installed as we speak Uh it will have a backup generator Uh so when the water does get 
high and the power does go off it will continue to work OK next question Where is it Is it in Harbor Heights No It is not in 
Harbor Heights It is in the Center Street Basin which is on center Street OK then the lift station that failed during the last Several years ago when we had the bad storm 
it stayed over top of us And We got a lot of water in 
in the neighborhood And in the houses One of the one of the culprits was the lift station over on moral OK right then that's for sewer 
so there's actually a storm water and their sewer Wait a minute I was told That the station Or storm water And failed Is there a lift station for stormwater on coral No there is not you don't have a lift station No sir Wonderful Uh Nevertheless Our neighborhood is flooded Bradley one time And I've told other councils and I'll tell this one We have a plan If our neighborhood floods again We will go down to the dune and we'll cut it with shovels And We will drain our neighborhood Now There are legal complications I understand But I Don't believe anybody 
will attack us from the Legislature nor the county or possibly even the city for doing what's necessary in an emergency to save our homes And I'd like to think that there's backup power 
or there's lift stations or something that's looking 
out for that low spot in the middle of our neighborhood 
down up between coral and uh Harbor So anyway that that's my say we will cut that dune if we have to Can I ask you 
What What you said y'all have flooded one time Do You 
know what year that was by any chance it was a tropical storm that I was a 2009 Storm bay and it stayed over us for several days and rained hard Plus We had a water main break 
which didn't help any either No And We had uh there was 11 other uh Cause But The main thing was the 
lift station failed or I was told that the the uh Outfall the drainage water There's a Let Me put it this way Would you please 
go and check to see if you have a legislation that you're not 
aware of because I've been told by more than City One city employees one over there so just I understand how that happens Although pump station is stormwater Lift station is 
sewer So When somebody says little station it normally 
refers to sewer if they say pump station that refers to 
stormwater Well that's all anybody has ever called it in our neighborhood 
or when I've talked to him It was a lift station OK Pump station 
Let's talk about it What it is Is there a pump station on 
coral There is not There is only a lift station for sewer There 
should be a pump station over there There's a There's a bad flooding area there and and I just assumed that it was being looked at and monitored And it's not Oh Well that's what I get for not following up What I'd like to ask Is 
the city follow up and look for The need for a pump station On that main drain Uh I don't know where to call it but it's up there by just just North east west west of my home 376 There was a big drain up there Goes across the street Another D Then It goes under the ground to the middle of the 
neighbor through the middle of the neighborhood It's only that big Not and then it goes over to another Uh uh drainage collection point I Assume from there it drains or is pumped or is helped onward It's a severe weak point And flood control in our town 
I thought it was being looked at It's not Let's Look at it I'll be back Thank you Mister Russell Pump station request Then I know exactly west of your home 
where you're talking about And I remember talking to you about this years back Thank you Tim Thank you OK So the item in front of us There's no other cards regarding that item Um Item number five Proven this amount Council any further discussion No City clerk We have a motion Oh I'm sorry Looking for a motion to allot I'll Thank you to approve the 
quote from Razorback LLC with the amount of $148,000 I'll second that Got a motion by council member 
Davis got a second by council member Jackson City Clerk Council member 
Davis Council member Jackson for mayor pro Tim Callum Mayor Morrison Council member Willis or Item number five passes 50 
moving to the next item for action which is resolution number 2024 02 amending the defined 
contribution retirement plan for the general employees of the 
city of Cape Canaveral City manager Thank you Mayor and I'd like to 
ask Natalie to come forward in case there's any questions Um this has been 
in front of the council a few times Now Last time It was 
in front of the council Uh There was discussion about moving 
the vesting period to immediately after employee finishes his 
or her six month probationary period as recommended um by our consultant Um and City Council was in favor of adding that to this amended resolution but they also want to 
know what the costs were to do that to move that forward And So 
Natalie's prepared this response And Now that we talk about the 
cost for moving it the vesting period and then also we're 
gonna talk about combining those Us with if we do make a change to 10 and 3% or some other uh number Thank you Natalie You see the screen Mm
Yeah that's good OK um I can't even see that OK we did um Go to Jeremy Button over at the FMIT and he came back to us with some numbers If We were to change that to the six months With those additional five staff members I'm sorry Um it would amount to the $12,478 to add those five staff members to the original amount of the 90,000 The number of the 90 Is it the 92 Yeah Sorry I can barely see that OK Yeah for the 9% plan and the 4% match Um it was the 90 Thou 
The budgetary impact of the 90,000 Um OK Sorry I can't even see my numbers OK Thank you Yeah adding that with the vegetarian impact of the 90,605 the second considered an 
increase of the 10% for the 401 and the status quo of the 3% with a corresponding budgetary impact of the 92,000 Um adding that in it was an additional 490,000 to add those five employees on So for The 94 plan to add those employees 
that came out to an additional 15,000 and he said for the 10 3 it would be a status quo on 
that It would just be less money from the employees Yeah And We did provide um combined with the previously proposed annual budget of 
the 90,000 It takes it to 93,000 for the one year Plus impacts for future wage increases and so 
that's an impact mayor above the current retirement plan 
costs which are an attachment for and five of $302,795.88 so it's not quite a third something less than a third of an increase for this program if we wanted to move forward with The recommendations Thank you Council Seven Thank you
I um Want to make sure That summary increase What 
attachment was that we have Eight attachments It was Yeah The First three were the original resolutions And The resolution that 
Melinda had originally provided In four and five are the comparison of the seven Three existing move into a 94 and then attachment five is 10 3 the existing in 10 3 who is currently a 73 Um both of these will be increases and currently the 73 the um down at the bottom 
there the screen we're showing On the left It shows $216,000 That's our annual That was the original one that um was provided back in the march meeting That's what we pay as you said status quo today That's That was the um number as of March With the 7% with the 7% correct But The Left Left hand column is a 7% 216,000 right hand column is a 3% match 85,900 For a total of 302 which is at the top there Got it And then the the the one to the right showing the 395,000 at the top That's the Delta the difference 
all the way to the far right Thank you that makes perfect sense and four is just like this one just with the other scenario And Then we came back with a difference 
to take it to the six months and adding in those five employees What The Cost differential would be Thank you So I spoke with the city manager yesterday and it was the For the April 4th meeting That we held I think this was brought forward after we had requested a comparison or at least verifying the other cities Um I think This is not an attachment here today but it was provided at that meeting and I think 11 responses were provided Satellite Beach Port Orange Fells Mere Winter Park Daytona Beach Poncelet A Statu Rock Ledge Daytona Beach Shores Zoi village of Tasta and then the ones with the plan type There were 
four out of those that have uh plan type of direct contribution just like the city of Cape Canaveral And Only One of those four had the planned sponsor of FMIT just like city of Cape 
Canaveral and that's satellite beach With A very similar population of 11,295 Double The full time employees roughly with 100 and four They're vesting period is five years they have a 5% for the 401 A and a 5% match so higher than our match lower than our um I guess Nonelected uh Contribution but the reason I wanted to bring this up was that The other vesting periods for 
those four was so it was five years six years There's zero years for Fells mere very small community which I guess 
that means they immediately vested is that correct And then 100% upon higher vested Is that how it works They don't have a vesting period They allow them to go straight in and Vested right away And Then The Other one was five And I And when I heard I think we're at one year today 100% vested No It's a five year a tiered vesting period The resolution I think But we are It's like a two 
years or 25% and then it tears up after that over the five year period Yes So That's I guess Exhibit one Or attachment one Um Inside You Is on the original Yes Page five OK So Thank you very much page five What we're looking for I think it's a different page than on the screen Resolution 127 Most tears 25 and then 5075 Our Current One is a two years 
it's 25 And then it goes to 50 then 75 and then 100 You so year 10 It's Not until year two They get 25% year three They go to 50% and then year four they go to 75 And then you five They're fully vested at 100 correct Okay So That's current at that three or 7% 3 and so Comparing a public entity like 
us to other public entities makes sense But even with the private 
sector you know which sometimes try to be competitive with That to me seems a I Think one year today with the step up Makes sense And I think there's a lot of risk In investing Then that early in their And their process Or or their 
journey I guess with the city their career here um I think that the trade of time to become fully vested with taxpayer contributions to retire is an important one We do want employees for a long Time and I I Certainly Don't study this and I'm not in it 
But when I look at other cities I think out of the 11 responses We only got to see Well which made sense the four I don't know if What the other city's vesting period is and certainly fells Mere zero is very aggressive but 5653 out of the 45 years from satellite six years for Port Orange um In five years for Winter Park I would not II I Guess I'm I'm struggling to wanna move that forward six months 
when we're already I think very aggressive at one year Well We already We only had three days to get responses OK So That's just the respondents 
we had over a three day period So I mean we could reach out to Jeremy He just said I mean 
they have like a four page list Of people that we could technically maybe ask for responses But in the one article I had provided it did say 49% of defined contribution plan participants had immediate vesting 49% Yeah It did say that from the Vanguard study I mean I didn't say public or private sector it just said in overall OK so And and it would be I Guess It's hard to to know You know some folks To be 100% best that it takes five years But And year two There are 25% vested So if they were to retire at that point Mhm Whatever there would have they would take 25% Right But when you when you 
go on to When the FMIT they do publish Report every year so you can see How Many are actually in the defined contribution plan so I mean there's 100 like 100 Other Cities municipalities that have defined contributions 
So We could pull that information We just wouldn't know how What They vesting periods are Without I mean we only like I said We 
only had the three days to get responses I Appreciate that I think Yeah the three days I I never 
intended I think for it to come back that fast I think there was a meeting After and it actually caught me off 
guard that it was on the meeting which is fine And Then It was a again but it more time it was to me about 
getting to the budget before we approve an operating 
expense That's gonna affect us really For decades that You know we didn't want to approve this without seeing the whole 
picture I Think we You know this wouldn't even take effect until 
October anyway So There's certainly time on this we can go back 
out and get some more of that data for those other cities 
just to have that to compare to Yeah I think competitive the allowing the entry Over the right and and I think you know One thing to 
remember in all all really good points made by uh Council City manager Of course the um of course bringing it to six months It's that attractiveness of As We're trying to get new employees and uh get quality employees You know they'll look at us because 
they'll say Wow six months you know I'll be you know invested start to vesting period but also the retention of people wanting to stay knowing that they're on board and you know um They They'll be invested in six months and and and I like I like the six months because I mean 
we like in the mayor is concerned about that I could tell us is these 
people we want them to get through pro probation at least six months Because 
we wanna We wanna make sure we're getting the best bang for our buck 
So taking it from a year down to six months Six months we still get to see The quality of that employee and the contributions they can make 
And Um then it makes it more attractive for them and we attract uh better employees That's the whole the whole scheme Um I would say too like a place like Fells mere which is a very small probably you know they start zero You know uh there's no requirement because it's probably 
very hard to find employees for that particular Neck of the woods So to speak you know because you also 
gotta look at where these cities are and how attractive it is to be there and be an employee in that city That's very important I much rather work and Cape Canaveral than Fells Mere Thank you That was all I had counsel just I Think part I want to be as competitive 
as we can be in the way I would make that decision is just getting I think expanding Into that and even when I see five it may you know it It might be more similar to what we have today Even 
more aggressive than five So I'm not saying you know that's I think If it whatever is reasonably accessible and and I think 
it's been a good exercise to to ask these questions over the 
months because council has a good I kind of idea of what the 
budgetary impact might be as we're going into these budget months as 
we're making these decisions on the budget but I think we can certainly use 
this next month period to get that better day to get more data on 
what other cities are doing just to help quantify that decision for the vesting period And I think it was also to 
change when they can start participating taking it 
from the one year to the six months was more appealing as well So mayor if there's consensus 
to take no action on this other than the only one that spoke 
I think I'd like to hear Thank you though I would just 
like to um when I talked to the city manager about this um 
he was telling me that there are some cities that have 
are in the Florida retirement system And Then you know he we were discussing it it what The cost 
of that would be compared to what we have now And Are we too small of a city to is there a way we could 
get more information on that and how that would Affect our budget as well FRS You know I've actually looked Into that in the time that I've uh been here that that's a whole it's 
a whole other ball game It's a very Deep Probably more intense discussion Uh the process of converting from where we're at to where we would wanna go 
with the Florida retirement system I could get information 
on that but that that's not gonna be any type of quick turnaround 
We're count where I'm in a present An agenda item to council in two 
months and counsel is gonna say Let's flip it all over because 
probably ain't gonna happen because it's gonna be a lot to digest in Uh you bring up a good point with us as small as we Yeah There's There's a Um I 
actually was talking to uh Zach with our our auditors 
about this uh probably a year a year and a half ago and I think our size has a big You know we'll have a big impact on that and also the cost to the city too So there's a lot I 
could get a lot of information for you in the next few months or whatever But I I could tell you 
That's not something that uh council is gonna say Well Yeah Let's 
flip 1 October because there's a lot to consider there but 
I if you want me to I could get the information on that I 
Just think basic information would be good to have even if you 
don't do anything that I could do down the road for You know the 
future Maybe It's something we would Think about but I think you you hit the nail on the head too 
about the size of the city I think that's a major factor so we could get in the next month 
or so get a little bit more information about that along with the 
other information Let me Let me get highlights and at least could 
present you know bulls here to get the ball rolling So you 
you can say Wow That's you know I didn't realize that 
and whatever but yeah but we could start the process OK Council member Willis Oh yeah Um I have no objection to gathering some more information and getting some 
more data on other cities Uh but uh in my experience with owning businesses hiring employees and taking care of them with retirement plans and everything the six month Vesting Would be very attractive to the younger Professionals that I've dealt with Um I did one year vesting but uh young people tend to Switch jobs if they've don't 
feel like they're being able to put skin in the game and I 
think getting to a six month period they're going to 
participate and they're going to be a little more active with 
it and we'll put down roots here so that would be all in favor of reducing the vesting period So You Thank you Councilor Jackson Taking it That's great and I do agree 
on the F RSI mean really employee led I mean if it's 
not something but if it's a big undertaking just knowing what that looks like because how did you talk about 
that as well yesterday with you I think Coco Beach is on FRS 
in Natalie They Have they have their own pension plans 
They have three pension plans I Think Coco I believe Coco's under FRS I believe he was a much 
bigger Yeah and they're big Yeah Yeah So Uh I'll record consensus that we're 
gonna go out to more cities in our survey Um John you're gonna get some more understand what Processes and data and costs to go to FRS and what kind of effect 
that would have on a city our size Yeah I'll do that 
We'll take no action on this tonight but we'll come back with 
that additional information Thank you anything else Counsel CNN OK and no one from the public 
I did not see needed to speak on this one If so please 
raise your hand or come forward Seeing no hands raised We can go ahead 
and move on to the next agenda item Thank you all John Natalie I appreciate your help Item number six item for action I'm Sorry Uh item number seven 
We just finished item number six Number seven is to designate one city official to be the voting 
delegate at the Florida League of Cities 2024 annual conference scheduled for August 15th Through the 17th 2024 in Hollywood Florida Of this city manager Yes Um this is something we do each year Um last year I believe it was council member Davis Raymond I'm sorry OK So it's 
just a mayor I think it's just a matter of seeing if anybody's willing 
to serve or wants to be nominated to serve and we could just do a simple vote to see if that person's approved to serve 
in that role Thank you very much Is Anyone interested I would like to nominate Kim Davis and she's 
our space Coast Legal Cities rep I'd second that in you're willing Thank you very much anyone else Interested or opposed to that Nomination by council member Willis I'll second it OK As a motion I Take a vote Yes OK Got a motion by council member Willis the second by council member Jackson to nominate Council member Davis who is willing To be the voting delegate Uh for the Florida Liga cities Uh mayors Tim Kellum Any comments on this or no I 
agree I think Kim would do a great job any further discussion Thank you very much Council 
member Davis City clerk Council member Davis Council 
member Jackson or mayor pro Tim Callum Mayor Morrison for council member Willis for Motion passes 50 That concludes Items for action 
which now moves us to the discussion portion of the meeting It is 650 We are one minute ahead of schedule So I pause No Item Number eight is building code 
and flooding submitted by council member Jackson Council member 
Jackson the Florida Jurs Yes This is a discussion item that um has come to mind based on a lot of the reports and studies 
that I've been reading is I've been getting up to speed on the center Street Basin and the actions that we have to help alleviate the flooding and with the tidal valve Um as everyone's knows I've been really excited 
for that process to move forward However as I've gone through this Like a consistent theme that I've seen in the Kimberley Horn as well as the mead Hunt reports is the amount of concrete in those areas So I started wondering as far as our building code Have We looked at that to ensure that we're not just barreling forward doing things the exact same 
way that we may have in the past and creating situations where we could be enhancing flooding instead of alleviating it So in the Kimberley horn report on one way streets 
in the presidential Basin which floods on Page nine 
it said a majority of the city stormwater infrastructure was designed and implemented in the fifties 
Through the eighties when water levels were lower and let and development was less intense The Presidential streets neighborhood has a high impervious surface area ranging from 60 to 80% impervious coverage in many areas and so if you wouldn't mind uh Clark going to the map You'll see that we've got um 60 to 80% impervious coverage in many areas near those presidential streets So um and you're looking at figure four that 
was included in the report And it says the majority of the 
neighborhood is comprised of less less than 50% of pervious area The vulnerability assessment identified the need to expand 
the ability for surface infiltration capacity and to decrease impervious surface area with the continued impacts that were having with the water and flooding It also noted that by converting streets to one way they were talking in that proposal to make the streets one way 
and one half of the street would become graphs or some surface that allowed for The infiltration down at through the the ground and so and we did not go with that which I understand Why the that we had some traffic concerns so we did not vote for that However as you look at what Uh is being built We have things that are being built That are on vacant lots We have uh 50 style bungalows that are being taken down and rebuilt with much larger structures Um so Um this This discussion item is really to discuss Do We keep moving on with business as usual or should we be looking at the building code and moving in a different 
direction based on uh the situation with flooding And could we P potentially be negatively 
impacting the situation by allowing more concrete on how slabs or uh you know not looking at the top of him Um pervious Surface and you'll see 50% of the lot Is allowed um in commercial building in our commercial zones and in R one and R two it It's 35% of the lot size So as we discuss this and we being the city manager and I He said that some cities have put in a 
maximum impervious surface ratio so that we can absolutely maintain some of those natural ways to filter water And It's concerning as we're looking at trying to address making sure we're 
getting that flooding and all that water contained I don't want us to be end up being in a situation where we haven't addressed this or looked 
at it And I'm not sure if we have So That's what this um Agenda item for me was and so um do the meat hunt specifically mentioned too much concrete in those areas and so I wanted to bring it to council to discuss Should We Be looking at this 
Are there modifications for that area only that we may want to consider from where the tidal valve is being constructed all the way down to Ridgewood where we have flooding in these presidential streets Are we um We looked at this You know since I'm a new council 
person I don't wanna say that we haven't And would it Is it something that we might want staff to look at Because We've got a lot of impervious concrete town in that area Thank you Council member Jackson 
Council member Willis Um I think two months ago we had the workshop with The P and Z board and council and this was brought up About the concerns of flooding in our code and uh building codes and how we could alter all of that and correct me if I'm wrong But city manager isn't Uh departments looking at that already Yes There is an effort underway 
right now and if if the mayor would like I'd ask maybe Zach to come 
up and talk about what efforts we are making in this area I think that would be fantastic Uh Kyle While He's coming up I'm just I'm getting it wrong 
I'm guessing the wrong person Hey Carl Hello Good Evening everyone Um so yes I I did miss the the beginning 
of this I was walking some dogs Sorry for being a little late Um but we are we are beginning to draft some 
impervious surface codes Um some ratios to um cover basically right now the code will cover maximum lot coverage which really doesn't Factor in things like driveways or you know pool decks or anything like that So um We have been beginning to draft 
that and we're working with the regional Planning Council on that Um But Yeah I mean anything You 
guys Any questions You have um be happy to talk about your 
efforts with the comp plan and the dates for that Sure so the peril flood legislation was passed by 
the Florida Legislature a couple of years ago Now Um and and it it really is what it says Uh it's addressing concerns regarding flood flood insurance Um Basically bringing our comp plan up to date with new sections mostly to coastal 
management but also to future land use Um and a few other elements just regarding UM coastal high hazard areas Um Enhanced resiliency areas Um A few different Ways of identifying particularly 
vulnerable vulnerable areas and um Not Sort of limiting certain 
uses So for example like assisted living facilities um Can't be built in certain um enhanced 
resilience areas is what they're called And that's just the the mandated that so So We're working on those right 
now we actually have a meeting with Todd on Thursday to um go over some Comments that he had but um we should have 
those you guys pretty soon What's the um the due date for those 
amendments that we have to be done by so we will need to be 
done by this year in order to And then so the thinking is correct 
me If I get this wrong The Thinking is these types of initiatives 
for a maximum purpose service service ratio for example can 
go into this submittal for this comp plan update this 
cycle this year And that's what that's the goal of the staff working 
with PNZ as I understand it and it this is this item coming before PNZ Yes it 
will be it will have to go before PNZ Do We have that scheduled 
currently Um we have a meeting in July that we Hopefully 
I mean depending on how the meeting goes on Thursday and obviously Anthony 
will need to look at it but we'll have to have to take it to PNZ at one of 
these next meetings Thank you Carl So the way I See it Mayor is the idea of an maximum per surface ratio is already moving forward with PNZ to be inserted into our comp 
plan updates which are required to be finished by the end of this year Once 
we get it in our comp plan then it's just a matter of making 
codes that come out of that Kyle Can You talk about how East Central 
Florida Regional Planning Council and I believe that gentleman from University 
of Florida Other tying in with that effort as well because they 
were part of that plan Yeah So the joint Um workshop that 
we had in March I think it was maybe April Um They are assisting us in the effort and and I think that joint workshop the 
idea was to kind of start that conversation and just get some ideas 
from you guys from the planning and zoning board and to take that and 
turn it into not only comp plan amendments but uh land development regulations Um And So So We're still working closely 
with them as we have been for the vulnerability assessment Um you know a few other A few other uh resilience related Are We looking I have a question If You don't mind Um are we looking at certain code for certain areas because there 
may be areas of the city that has newer storm Pipes under the street and things due to impact fees and 
building in the area like a buy hotels However the presidential 
streets are flooding We've heard about Harper heights flooding So Um I Hope We're not are well I I I would like to see if it was me my choice as looking at The vulnerability for certain 
areas and making sure we're not just trying to fit a one size fits all plan for the entire city because we may have some areas that are more vulnerable than others So How Are you handling our or are you handling that so that's sort of what the the enhanced 
resilience area that's part of the parallel flood legislation Um the idea and Lexie can describe it a little better than 
myself But The idea is to it's It's Taking areas of the city that 
are particularly vulnerable whether that's the flood zone or You know Sea level rise Just different different factors um and then overlaying economic importance And So we have this I can I'd 
be happy to send over We have a map Actually that drafts what we 
have as our proposed ER A Um we actually call it a AAA And Adaptation action area I think that's what it stands for Um so so in in that way and and 
there will be more stricter regulations there so and we can look at other areas that you 
know are particularly affected Um but there is there is certainly 
a geographical element OK and then so another question I have is that since this is all in the works Currently We're just going 
by the old code Correct Yes that's correct Yeah I might want to stay close 
rest the council any other comments at this time mortem I just I think that you know Has as we can expedite this because like um Counterman Jackson said There's a lot 
of old houses that are being knocked down in new houses 
There's one in our neighborhood that has taken up every inch of the of the property and and it's concerning to the neighbors that You know when we have a 
bad storm What's gonna happen So I mean whatever we can do to help get these codes going and changing to because it's going to happen a lot that 
these old houses are being destroyed in new houses are put there Absolutely Council member Davis or Willis My comments are um excited to see those things Come to fruition Um thank you for 
putting this on if anything is Mayor Forte says I think it's 
just a testament to we fully support the efforts that are 
already happening today and the sooner the better in the 
face of hurricane season I think We've heard tonight Uh the concerns around the hurricanes with pumps 
and storm water and um there's a lot happening around it but uh The code today really limited to the building Percentages that I think you said but it's Kyle was sharing does not include Parking lots pools or any 
other impervious surface And So Millis Massachusetts I Think I've said this in the 
past I mean they literally have a Impervious surface tax and so through Li lidar data some of the same 
technology that I think gave us this map You know they take your lot if you got a one acre lot and 50% of its impervious That is the formula the number that they use for taxing Which is very interesting Um I'm not suggesting that I'm sharing that as an example of what another comparative policy or community did Um and I don't know if it was successful I've never 
really followed up or looked into that or even allowed in the 
state of Florida But I think We are tackling it with being able to move the water is Chairman 
Russell was talking about the need in harbor Heights uh pump stations and there's low areas Um But this is working sort On The other end of of the issue and we did relax Also the green parking that we 
did uh in in relaxing the parking standards I think is 
a step in the right direction My whole position has been you know today we require impervious surface You can't build without paving 
We've relaxed some of that in some areas To go It would be a better step to say you know this much is required But if you want to pay right you can and I don't think a lot of folks when you factor the uses are going to expend that extra cost and uh the the the final would be you know your required right to to have so much that I think we need to be a 
little careful there but we are moving in a direction to de pave as much as we can And I think that uh folks will will naturally do that and strategically focusing on the problematic areas first uh which we're doing I know we've talked 
about expanding the funding for Fillmore And You know that the um the streets or that uh CR the expenditures to expand in the capital improvement to add fill 
more into the presidential streets Master plan um without a con plan And Even though required or any code changes I think We can still take action on public owned facilities I mean 
that's where we have the most control such as roads and sidewalks and maybe adopt some of the more innovative 
newer It would be a great street Uh to start on Those are my comments I'm supportive moving this forward and thank you anything else Council member 
Willis Well I Just wonder if there's some way that we can 
incentivize people as they repay for whatever to remove Some of that impervious surface Um you know you we have all these large parking lots I know in uh in North Carolina on the outer banks They have a lot of uh I Forget what exactly They Call it But It looks like uh concrete blocks turned 
sideways where the grass has grown up through it It 
supports traffic It supports parking but water just goes right on through if we can incentivize Anyone repaving or or paving a parking lot or or creating something to uh use materials such as that versus Any requirement to have a pervious An impervious surface Excuse me and I also 
just want to add that we are getting some more even 
better light our data from the NSF Grant They're doing drone flights 
They're getting even better data so we'll probably haven't even 
more accurate version of this map so we can know areas to target It's exciting I'm excited 
to see all the GIS and the mapping Give us Great information Thank you And Council member Jackson your item No Please wrap us up I love that idea as far as Because that would bring immediate relief to some With Some development Some developers would do that Um I wonder if there's a way that we as we're getting this work 
through the process since it's not in place yet Is there any way that we can identify um New permits when people apply for new permits um builds that might end up increasing the runoff because of the lot For example some of the presidential streets already have a big older complex with a huge parking lot if there's a lot next to that and 
someone wants to build it out as well then we could be even 
though they go by what our building code is at right 
now At this time we might end up More run off that way So is there a way that we can anything that we could put into place so that 
we could identify ones that might increase storm runoff until we get this in fully into place and handle those builds differently and I know that's not normal because 
of the building code but I think that looking at the flooding we have to do what we need to do but I mean is that even a possibility Well we have to enforce the 
regulations that we have If it is in there We will 
enforce it But if it's not in there we can't enforce it Should We put something temporarily in there 
until we get through with this whole process or how long do 
we think the process will take To Get all of this into place I mean it Probably Now that it's a 
It's a priority So you know within the next few months we can certainly get you guys something for a comp plan for this Yes for the complain but also I think we've 
started drafting the land development regulations and Some of the existing comp plan Requirement Elements sort of speak to impervious surface So I I think 
we can find something IN the comp plan that's already there that we 
can Use for the land development regulations So How long will it take us to get the building code updated Including these things that we've identified and updated via the comp plan Just A ballpark Yeah um so we'll have to get Obviously 
the ordinance drafted And once we once we have that I mean that'll be P and Z and then two council meetings Maybe 
Dave You can speak to this day's gonna bail me out minimum Um Yeah I I think Lamar is coming up too You're 
getting all the we're getting all the power here Um my Yeah I mean typically the way we do things is we get our 
comprehensive plan updated We want to get those policy statements 
in place in our comprehensive plan and then our land 
development regulations are follow and implement those large 
policy comments and statements I Think what I Hear you saying 
Kay is that in the interim while we're working on this Because 
it I mean tip Really Realistically it could be 6 to 9 months before comp plan and land development 
regulations are done and adopted and everything's going so it sounds 
like you'd like to do something in those intervening nine months Um I mean this is where Anthony can 
step in our city attorney Um I mean communities oftentimes will I don't want to call it a moratorium 
because we're not We're not shutting down development But 
I think what we we could do is is we could um we could put in place some some interim measures that the council could consider we could 
present to the council Some interim measures to address this issue Um we'd have to work very carefully with 
Anthony He's given me a frowny So like Don's idea that would give some incentive as well Um I just know a lot can be built in nine months Yeah thank you Well I just wanna C an idea in your mind There are things that we can do in rim As As Dave says We can do interim measures As far as paving is concerned We can we could This is an idea where the PNZ are gonna have 
to talk about it in flesh it out but we could Put in a recommendation before the council to have to require Pervious concrete You can buy that stuff It'll percolate water It's like concrete But It's a little more costly So I mean we can We can check that around and and we could require that immediately Pervious concrete And that way you'd increase dramatically immediately The ability to put water back 
in the soil and still have your paving In your development Another idea and you can think about this Is If pervy pervious concrete is expensive Then Fine Maybe we the city can look at a way to reimburse The builder for the extra cost Of pervious concrete not the entire cost But the extra over above Impervious Think about that We can do a lot of things very quickly 
to put water back in the ground We have stormwater funds too And you took the words out of my mouth to connect 
this Thank you uh Chairman Russell I know um The incentives I think flooding is blight When We see those photos of and we know our CR A is there we know that that doesn't 
cover the entire city But Yes If Uh it's double the price to do pervious Well We do have a matching grant 
program and kind of have a lot of like Attitude in there Maybe that fits in there I if it's not already in some capacity if we can find a 
way to take the extra cost out of it I don't see why 
anybody would object to using Concrete Thank you Kyle Yeah 
I was just gonna say the low impact development is is eligible for the property improvement 
grants Um And in fact I mean we could With you know in the scoring system give some priority to those types 
of projects we could look into doing something like that Anything else on this one No 
I Just appreciate You know everyone giving us the information it to me It's a big thing because this is 
four or five years later that we've been having those streets 
flood and so we've got to look at what we can do that will give us impact right now and these kinds of discussions I'm appreciative of because we don't want people losing 
property as far as vehicles and homes and we've got a busy 
storm season project For this year So it to me It's important to look at whatever alternatives we can 
look at to get water off the streets One more thing you mentioned Councilman Jackson Jackson the Trying not to use one size fits all in our discussions about drainage and all We've been thinking About special measures for special polices You know one size does not fit all in this drainage problem We ought to concentrate on the Most affected areas first And We will we will talk about those 
and try to get something Massaged and something we can all live with I look forward to that Thank 
you Mr Russell Thank you City The attorney I was just I was just gonna add Um you know the chairman of the PNZ brings 
up a good point about the paving But Also If You're looking at interim measures Perhaps you can look at lot coverage 
Lot coverage has a very um limited definition It only includes enclosed structures under the zoning 
code And while zoning district has a maximum lot coverage Let's say 40% for our one The City is only looking at the enclosed buildings And that does not include paved areas or any other hard surfaces that are impervious So that might be another Thing to look at Maybe the P and Z can kick around City manager and he comments or 
anything No These are all great ideas and I'm glad that the whole 
team is working on these Um it's good discussion Great Thank you all counsel any word council 
member Jackson This is your item Good to go I don't think any actions needed other than look forward 
to seeing the progress Thank you all OK That wraps up Item number eight Under item for discussion And We now have two more 
items Item number nine and 10 Do we want to proceed or would a break Be Good Now You 
can do one I would like to have a break before 10 if possible but we can do it now if if needed One City manager Good I'm I mean we can do now do nine Sure This is your item Are You OK 
with that OK mayor for Tim Callum This is a discussion 
on the role of mayor emeritus Floor is yours Thank you Um Yes back in Um 2019 We appointed Um Rocky as mayors and It I It was a motion I brought up and Um and it was seconded and we passed 
it Um and it's been five years and I appreciate Rocky I love Rocky and he has such a good relationship with the citizens He's done a lot for our city I just am wondering you know if if he's out there being 
the ambassador on this for the city and speaking to people We haven't gotten a report or 
anything that he's working on that would and his knowledge 
and his historic knowledge for the city and things 
that we are going through as far as flooding and this and that he has a lot of knowledge that he could share with us um and share with us what he's talking to in the city with us Um I would just you know when we have originally um did this It was you know for him to be the ambassador To Um and he has all the rights as a A to the city hall as a council person But If We Don't get a report or know what he is talking to people about or any help for us because we need help Um I Just don't know Uh you know if he needs to have access to all of what's happening in City Hall I Just think that um I would really like to um have his insights on different things we're working with And a report Maybe you know in the beginning 
of our meetings on what he's talking about or who he's 
talking to and and what he thinks we could do better Um I think that would be really important Um And Like I said I he he He is like a matriarch of our city and I just would like more of his input you know At a meeting in the beginning 
of a meeting and and just let us know what we can do to make our um council meetings Better our communication with the 
residents better what he thinks Um So That's what I'm looking for just some kind of feedback from Um Mr Randalls and um and his health He's You know like has a lot of history here in the city Excuse me and uh I just think that you know if he If He has access to the things in the city You know websites this that the emails Um it would be really really be nice to know what he's doing out there 
and how he's helping us and That's all I got Thank you Mayor Pro Tem Council if we don't have any more discussion 
that she's helped introduce the item I did have a card from me Mayorm Marit Uh Rocky Now the the item has arrived Thank you for being here As you have said many times Mira Thank you Uh I commend you first As the job looking at the 
clock and the time and saying Hey We're one minute ahead I 
don't think I ever got that far But Uh Mayor Mayor Pro Tem staff Uh Residents And Lamar Russell We kind of grew up together In the 19 eighties In fact that 
storm you're thinking about is a no name Storm Right I think so And Uh we did at that time we did put larger storm drains in there because I cut the bougainvillea on mayor Firkins House because he couldn't cut it To put it in I think it was between 
yours and his Were you next to mayor fins OK But there are I don't know if there's any records kept but 
they did have a bad flood That's when the rain for three days and three nights Rocky When that happened you were out in 
front of my house digging the leaves and everything out of the drain back then that was one of the things we 
we kept anything that would go down the drain did whether it was basketball or cats Whatever But In Any event 
That's true I worked there but but that may be something 
that probably there's no record of us putting in that eight inch over 
the little four inch line there But sir uh back to the question that you asked Uh Yes I try to stay out of the city business out of devoted It used to be 5050 was city Andres And Now I pretty much devote most of the time to the residents uh 
whether it's replacing fiber valves in toilets or cutting Bougainville as our mailboxes or yards or taking Christmas tree lights down things like 
that I've tried to stay away deliberately so as not to be an influence Uh I can bring you up on several 
things that we are working on We as men some other place One that I just spoke to Todd to Few times ago Very The Old Palms East which was our Uh single family Children very hair people Place to live The sold by uh Jeff I'm sorry I'm running out of time It was sold by Jeff Wells to a real estate investment corporation They come in with the idea and raise the rates to $1800 a month Are Single parents with Children cannot handle $60 a day for For rent and the anyhow the long and the short of it is I have 
been working with them their group they've come down with a new start of what it actually costs in our end of Sater I just like to count with Plate and we can pause the clock for now Um take your time Thank You OK Well there's several things that I have 
worked on But It's mostly uh unimportant things to the city 
if you're putting a new flat of Rs nobody's toilet because 
it's running all the time But to that person It saved 100 and $10 from the plumber It means a whole lot So Uh my efforts have been pretty much 
towards the resident individually Uh as they need help rather than uh Uh Stand out I'd be happy to 
report for every guy Uh I get a report occasionally from an invitation from uh Uh for instance come to the new display that got rained out up here for the For the library Uh I get invited out I attend everything I'm invited to if 
I could be some help I don't want to take away any of 
the authority or the wisdom The Council members of their chance 
because I had a chance of that The modern I did that in 1980 when he was my mentor on the planning and 
zoning board It's Richard Thm and Anne Long time ago So Uh he was my mentor and 
he still a mentor coming up with good ideas I may 
add one quick thought you've already got a mile ahead of 
where you think you are but looking at that map was up on 
the board with the blocks of the red which says it's 90% Impervious impervious Look at those blocks like he said In 
finance because you got them already identified I don't know who did 
that But there's a year's worth of work in that What percentage I lot On That Block is either red orange yellow green or whatever So uh It over Uh thank you for the opportunity to be here And Uh thank you Mayor Pro 
Tem for bringing it up And Uh well we just I would like to 
see more of you Rocky at the meetings and you know come and 
tell us what you're doing and And I'm proud to asking me 
I'm not gonna intrude and say Look what I done OK but I'd be glad to come up Incidentally Uh is 
that the finance director over there Uh if you read down in this and I'm being let labors but I want 
my garage and picked up for 2019 25 Resolution which not that there And uh and some things that I read It can't frequently but some things 
that I haven't taken a veil of is uh duties and privileges upon your approval prior 
approval to the city manager at City Council in subject to budget appropriations direct payment or reimbursement 
for the city expenses A facial approved duties of mayorm to such as memberships events meetings meals mileage and I Don't believe I've ever hit 
you with anything have I And I Don't expect to this is a It's a fun thing I did have not asked for my retirement pay and I talked to the mayor and uh Todd re recently about this The retirement pay I have never asked for but I would 
be willing to ask for it and uh and give it to the Please have a lo whatever you have because uh I don't need it And don't want 
it I'm still able to mow the grass And Uh I Keep it If you Uh if you we mentioned it both of you together if you have an idea how we can use that I'll put in a retirement slip and Give you the monthly Check Whatever it is To that Uh yes well the mayor and I did 
speak Speak with you about that idea and I think it's very 
generous and very gracious of you Um we we talked about maybe 
doing a rocky Randalls uh fix up fund Um and just people wanted to apply for money from that fix up fund That's 
where this money could be drawn from and uh if if there's interest in 
pursuing that cos I'm happy to work on that But Uh it it Beard County quit with the recycled paint And I've probably painted more houses 
than most people in Cape Canaveral with recycled painted see light green dark green light brown dark brown light green dark blue rich Yeah No I didn't have any purple goo did that I didn't do it But uh is there if you wish to do 
that I'll simply have time to submit the Uh the paintwork and if you can find a place to put that money To help people that really need it We have a lot of Situations that they they'd be glad to have somebody to paint their house Or 
tear down the Bougainville bus So Thank you I've overstayed my well shout if I can be any help I won't come asking But if uh if you need anything I 
think I could probably supply it Thank me in the garage Thank you thank you for being here Thank you Thank you very much Mayor emeritus All the things that have been said Uh I echo your Dedication to the city and The item That you brought up as far as uh being able to redirect those funds for a cause that That is best I think I would love to invite you 
to the next meeting or two whenever I think our city 
manager maybe city attorney get their arms around something 
that would work Well when you're ready and have you at that meeting and uh I think we could do that in a 
special way and make that something memorable and uh if you could be a part of it that would be My request So or something Just He just goes 
to either las a library because I like fun F that I go to a week Whatever it takes I don't need any recognition
Radio section still mow yards so I'm OK And I see a little as a 
former postmaster and little partial to this thorny 
bougainvilleas around mailboxes Yes Thank you for all you've 
done and continued to do for our city Um as far as the the 
item and and the role as mayor MEREDITH I share the same Um That appointment uh with there was no better Your appointment literally created the position that did not exist 
and and we've even talked about you know Is there ever You know anyone else in my answer is no moving forward And So You are the testament of volunteerism and dedication and and If You counted all the hours It It's a significant amount of time and you continue to do but on the business of the city um that separation I just want you to know is that we feel that void I do at least and so coming back And if you want to if you're willing to get more involved into those things and I understand that you haven't taken 
those funds you know for for reimbursement or travel But Um we do I think Wanna use that Use that 
money out in the community to help Advocate and support and so uh thank you again And Uh maybe if it's not the next 
meeting But the following one we can Try to get together and and Understand today If You're more on the people side Uh those items in the resolute resolution Are they working out for you the way you'd hoped 
Uh is there ways that we can improve the resolution or 
the things we do not need to do Um we had a chance to chat about this And So Those are my comments I think we should keep this in front of us and Maybe the next meeting or 
two We can try to tackle that request that he made like to take as fast as possible on that and uh and then also get back to Morro tem Uh discussion item on uh How We can get more involved with 
with somebody as knowledgeable as rocky about the business of the city Um thank you And If It's again something that you want to do and are willing to do if 
it starts to take away from those passions Uh maybe we can talk about taking that pressure off or 
whatever makes sense But Thank you again Council member Jackson Mayor Randall's is being humble He is Um now you had you had told me that you were working with some of the 
service personnel on getting transportation to their jobs 
to the area because they couldn't afford to live here 
anymore It was after you had discussed the rent increase at Palms East And You didn't mention that that you were working with them So What I I wanted to mention that he's been He's been doing more than just the palms is part of it You have been working with some people with some of the service 
people being able to get over here Will You tell us about it Don't be humble Ah Yeah uh I'm kinda Working on a save our school program right now Uh It doesn't need any real publicity but uh as more and more of our single parents Move out and schools out and moving times 
up I over three or four a month to as a locations that are within their budget That Uh we no longer have Section eight If You're familiar with it And that Was really a savior of a lot of those people Uh military I run across a couple now that um military that was living 
over here one in wheelchair It moved to Titusville into a affordable housing situation Which proved not to be affordable Yeah I uh the rant that they were paying was to only go towards the rental of the apartment It's a condominium on the 
east side of Washington going north in the Titus And Lo and behold it's a 
condominium and now they've gotten their notice that uh for 
their maintenance and their pool and their supplies and that kind of stuff is an additional $428 They did and it was in the contracts Sad to say I It was disclosed but people don't read seven pages of contracts And The Two People are social 
security came to my porch with a neighbor and says You know what are 
we going to do Well I don't know Uh it's it's legal It was 
in the contract that they signed at the $500 goes to the Rant on the apartment The maintenance of a whole Another kettle of fish in condominiums Uh I don't know where that's going But Uh yeah we have a lot of military people Older people perhaps my age or even older that uh are Lebanon Are near nothing And you know you know probably 
your on the street more than I am I walked to the development over 
there I Don't call a project I walk a development Uh I've shared with Todd Uh we have a new manager that real estate investment company 
is just put in over there And There's going to be 
some adjustment in the rents But whether it's enough to help 
the people that need it I don't know But uh There's there's a bigger need than most of us realize Thank thank you for asking Thank you Council Thank you mayor for Tim Callum 
for for putting this on I look forward to Continuing to 
connect with you It's very good to see you Thank you for the 
update Just That Last story is very valuable Just understanding 
You know what real Cape Canaveral citizens or feel We're all out there but uh you are too and we can't be everywhere And So Uh your opinion is valued and we want to hear more of it Uh when you feel like it And if you feel like it and just hope you're not um Staying away from the business of 
city and the and the fear of any interference I don't think 
that resolution is pretty clear You're in at Goodwill Ambassador and uh I think We can Make some more progress 
from this So thank you again My privilege
Anything else Mayor Tim OK I don't think any action 
is needed here City manager anything you needed to say I know you were 
leaning forward earlier I hope I didn't miss you I understand Um I'll work 
with Anthony and staff who'll put together something for 
Rocky's Um retirement fund I Love that Thank you OK we can go ahead and move on to the next uh agenda item I did we're at 7:37 P.m. This is the last agenda item number 10 like to request that we take a 10 minute break And reconvene Let's actually let's just say back at 750 Uh About 13 minute break So with that we'll recess now and circle back then Thank you All right It's 750 We'll get 
started here in about a minute You Yeah Yeah Show you pictures Good
Alrighty Council member Jackson I Think Z We're waiting on uh just can't be last That's it I got   to like it Yeah 00 good All right OK You know the city attorney I 
think he'll be back soon Go ahead and call the meeting back to order It is 7:53 P.m. just took a recess Here We are at the end of the uh agenda items that we have scheduled to take action on We are on discussion item number 10 which is an update to the January 24th 2024 Specials Council meeting City manager if you want the city 
attorney here now or just OK Sounds good Thank you This is uh a monthly report We're 
keeping on the council agenda Uh this one like the other one starts with Fillmore and then moves 
on to Jackson and talks about other recommendations that 
Quickly on on the Themore project Um a lot of um the words were taken out and we didn't need to keep recreating Responses in the uh Laser Fish Public folder there so when you see on the right It's got all that information in 
there as far as this one This was building permit inspections 
report That's all in there Um then we've got the obtained 
the engineering report Obviously That's the The Kinley Horn 
report and that is available as well there um scrolling down Uh Next one was FP and their response there and then number four was utilizing engineering 
report exercise available remedies to gain compliance Uh so that's 
where staff remains in communication with the contractor Making sure that they know 
exactly what we're looking for Uh to get the uh site completed Um and there's a goes out at least 
once a week sometimes twice a week and updated task list to City 
Council about where our latest efforts have focused on 
that And um Will continue to produce that until that 
comes to completion and then finally a number five There is city 
manager and city attorney present any findings and opportunities in a 
report to be distributed councils in ways the city can improve our community 
Development department that will be forthcoming also um the effort tonight's effort more was on on Jackson then on Fillmore so mayor if I could just 
move forward through to that one like um the previous item number one also was recording requesting a Court of 
all actions that's been put in laser fish Uh then we've got number two is C and distribute administrative procedures 
Uh reviewed and approved by our city attorney complying with state law 
and city code to be followed by our city code enforcement officers that 
is currently in development It's an SOP document standard operating procedures that um we'll be talking more about 
that in the attachment here and that will be available 
probably within the next month or so Um then for Number three is for city Code enforcement employees The 
Required certifications and training Uh that's also in laser fish I'm a next to the third page Uh Problem with the microphone See You Are you able to hear 
me through this microphone Yeah OK all right Okay Um number four is distribute a monthly BS N a report of all open code enforcement cases 
that started last month We have another one coming out later this week Um and number five is where I really wanna 
focus tonight This is present any findings and our opportunities and 
to be distributed City Council on ways the city can improve our community 
development partner as relates to code enforcement So It's AC attachment 
to be presented tonight So with that I'd like to 
skip ahead to attachment to I see this as a companion document 
to the report of findings that was distributed on May 7th and 
I'll just read from this here during the January 24th special Counsel 
meeting Council reached consensus on a number of tasks one of 
which was to present the the findings and opportunities to be 
distributed on ways we can improve our community Development department to code 
enforcement Specifically code enforcement concerns related to the property at 1 1216 18 and 20 Jackson and also an involved 
in neighboring property located at 78 02 North Atlantic Avenue Resulting from that January meeting Uh review was 
undertaken to understand what code enforcement department actions may 
have contributed to the concerns The review involved interviews by 
the city manager with PEG Ser David Dickey Brian Palmer and Chris 
Robinson A report of findings was produced It was presented 
on May 7th 2024 Special City Council meeting The 
report of findings helped frame what happened in an unbiased 
objective manner The report did not include recommendations Recommendations are included in this 
document and they're built upon the findings of that previous effort Also Included are additional observations 
and analysis which supports the recommendations This document is broken into two sections We've got a section 
which is clarification and summarization of each finding with associated determinations of root causes And then Section two is recommended actions So Um mayor I'm gonna kind of hit on some of these on the higher level because we're probably 
all very familiar with a lot of the details that don't need to be repeated 
but we can certainly go back into those details if we want to Sounds good 
I Think what I really want to hit on is the root causes 
here The First item which was about applying different code enforcement 
milestone timeframes of different properties This is the one where um Missus Shawler indicated that 
Hey I got a hit with a notice of This quickly after I did this But 
this other person or this other property did not and the successive amount of time For that one There was also 
a building permit involved and so the first one talks and the root causes involved There was no established 
procedure for coordinating code enforcement matters between code 
enforcement officers and the building Official So That's Why The The the permit was able to come in Get reviewed get approved get final and code 
enforcement didn't even know about it and it was related to their code 
enforcement case There was no procedure in place for that The second was there was a no established target timeframe for a 
number of days from the initial site inspection to the date of the issuance of notice violation and we know that that 
that's a critical milestone date to track and we we've been looking 
at those now in the in the monthly reports um that having access to that data would have caught two years 
ago would have caught a lot of this and solved it But we didn't 
have access to that data we do now No established tool to identify and 
compare cases Well That's Obviously the monthly report That's the Tool 
that we're using and that that report can evolve and get 
better And then finally on this item there was a lack of co ordination between 
the Code Enforcement department building official and the fire official 
in general about knowing what was going on with this with this um Properties Um so those are the root causes and you'll see those talked about in the recommendations as we go 
below and we can come back and revisit any of these mayor if 
we want to Issue number two was about incorrect public information where Mr Dickey unintentionally asked Brian Palmer to 
respond to the City Council's request for information incorrectly Instead 
Mr Palmer was only asked to provide documents in the 
BS N a system other documents responsive to counsel's request 
also existed outside of the BS N system The response for the root cause 
there is staff did not verify the request for information which was 
stated in the minutes before responding to counsel's request Moving on to the next item number three This One is about maintaining 
case files Uh and the BS N a records Um this is where there were Links available to the public which had titles of documents that they couldn't open Um and when a public records request was made for them they were provided and 
they were they turned out to be working draft documents which had 
been saved over copied over and no longer reflected that original 
document that they were intended to be which created a 
lot of confusion in the record Well Why Why Are these out there so my findings there there was a lack of a full 
and accurate understanding that certain document Formats appear 
as an unopened link on the public BS N a portal There is no established policy regarding the types of documents 
which should and should not be publicly accessible via the public BS N a portal Of course any record can 
be up That's a public record But why promote these records that you can't 
even open that are confusing They shouldn't even be put out there A failure to differentiate between draft records and official 
records and properly label such records in response to a public 
records request That would have been very helpful if that was done 
properly And finally just general poor record keeping Item number four is a contention 
that Brian Palmer stated that code enforcement only sends notices to the 
property owner This was the YouTube video Um it was it was an incomplete statement at that 
time It wasn't clarified until later Uh the initial oral statement was open to misinterpretation because it 
was incomplete And the code enforcement employed This is another 
issue The code enforcement employee did not follow departmental practice to 
include property owner as a respondent and notice violation and that that's an 
employee performance issue because the directive of the department 
has always been when you have a liable property You 
you make sure you cite the the owner as respondent Um so that was not followed properly Item number five debris outside the garage in the garage door operation Um this one was the root cause was there was no uniform department 
practice to instruct the code enforcement officers are required 
to photo document compliance inspections They were required to photo document violation inspections when you 
see a violation take a photo date stamped But that when you 
not when you find something in compliance there was no procedure 
for taking the photos when they're in compliance Had that been 
there This would not be an issue there would be there would 
be proof or there would not be proof from the code enforcement perspective side Um all we have What we do have is proof from the other side that you know that 
doesn't appear to have been accurate But Um this is what we can do 
is put this policy in place Um Also there was um Uh the code enforcement officer relied on the statement of the of the 
owner about the operation the garage door rather than verifying 
it himself that it was opening and closing And and uh that's against the department policy as well You're 
supposed to verify that and not accept verbal statements So There's definitely some some 
personnel issues here coming to light on performance issues And issue Number six This was about cowboy 
and the chair um and having found that there was no violation 
of the code enforcement officer should have just ceased in efforts Don't You don't continue to press with code 
enforcement when there's no there's no violation so that was another issue Um issue number seven To me This 
is the most significant issue of the fire issue Securing 
the unsafe structure from trespass The the policy that the department had been 
using in this case is when you have a fire in the building 
official placards it unsafe um unfit for occupancy Then Caution tape is put over the entry to wherever that facility would be That was the training that they had so that's what they did Um also to notify the co the code enforcement to notify 
the B CSO if there's a trespass concern and the B CSO did 
get out that go out there and they were told by the owner that 
he did not want to file a trespass affidavit So months went by with Mrs Scholler continuing 
to say Hey These people are still getting up there They're they're 
walking on a fire damaged roof to access these apartments It's unsafe So code enforcement would do what their 
training was was to go and put some more caution tape up there well over time that it should have become evident 
that was not getting the job done So My findings here are there 
was no established practice to coordinate with the building 
Official and fire official to expeditiously and effectively 
restrict access to fire damaged properties commensurate with 
the public safety related concerns regarding securing the unsafe structure from trespass Second the officer should have affected 
the securing of the unsafe structure Sooner and third the code enforcement manager and community and economic 
development director should have intervened sooner to secure the unsafe 
structure believe it was some 15 months that went by before it was actually effectively secured Um Next on here We have 
information that was received after the May 7th distribution of 
the report of findings Mrs Siler was at that meeting and she um produced some evidence indicating that the rocks 
couldn't have been in the swale on May 24th Uh she subsequently provided that uh evidence 
to us and I'm thankful for that Certainly um cast doubt on the accuracy and 
reliability of the May 24th 2023 case notes and I've gone in um looking through the audit functions 
of the notes of that section of uh BS N A and I Don't see that that entry was in there Uh in January on January 24th I didn't Uh I See what was put in prior to that and that entry about cowboy Making This complaint was 
not there on January 24th that was added some time later Um this the department policy changed from using that field for 
actually typing data into to removing the data for that and just uploading documents like a PDF document And All I can surmise is that's when that 
came into being is when that PDF document came into being 
it It was never seen in the the Native notes section of 
BS N a to this day I don't think it ever appeared in 
the Native Notes section So I'm wondering where where did that information exist prior to being included in that P PDF document There was a number of PDF S that were uploaded Um Deleted uploaded deleted first in a row but that appears to be when this um entered into the BS N a record Um sometime after January 24th I don't know when Uh so Certainly the evidence that Ms Ser presented cast doubt on the accuracy and 
reliability of the May 24th cast note A case notes also code enforcement employee did 
not follow departmental practice to photo document The violation that 
was allegedly witnessed on May 24th 2023 again That was a that was a departmental procedure to photo document violations If There was this violation of rocks 
in the soil May 24th There should have been a photo documented piece of 
evidence in the code enforcement files for that so that was not followed Um again This underscores the need 
to document evidence of violations through the use of day and timestamped photos So That is um Section one and all of that leads me to Section 
two Mayor if I could move on to that about recommendations There are three Obviously There's a personnel issue which I'm going to be dealing with 
have been working with um staff on HR and and city attorney about how to proceed But Um I worked with the city attorney um on this document as well and 
and we believe these are the recommended actions first 
retain the services of an experienced code enforcement 
administrative consultant To assess the city's code enforcement procedures practices and the organizational structure of the department For purposes of recommending best practices to improve the 
department's organizational structure services and internal 
controls So that would be a a contract with an external 
agency that we would bring into Kind of provide that 
audit of the department and how it functions Second one is create a standard operating procedure manual 
and this will establish the additional important operational procedures and guidelines Um and we put in there several 
bullets These are taken right out of uh section one above 
but some other ones for instance you know guidelines for requesting 
search warrants There's a lot of good things that need to go into this written document uh will be used for training purposes as well And Then Finally the last recommended action is to retain the services 
of an experienced contract code enforcement officer to assist 
with the code enforcement case load That would be another contract or possibly the same contract 
with the the first item So My goal here is to be is as transparent as possible 
with how we want to go about fixing this by bringing in an 
independent third party or couple independent people third party To Not only do the audit from the operational perspective 
but actually have boots on the ground Also that way as as code enforcement and I think that way we can demonstrate 
that we are actually giving this the the best shake We can uh the best chance to fairly address and and correct the issues that led to this January 24th item Um and for acknowledgement that if if it happened here it could have happened elsewhere and it could happen 
again so we need to fix this And I think this is a straight on Direct approach to correcting this mayor Thank you very much I do have a public comment Uh card on this one council if 
you're OK with taking it to the public Miss Scholler I believe this is the one Did you intend to speak or you Prior You're good OK Uh if anyone else intended to speak now that I've Opened it Please raise your hand or 
come forward and anyone else home Uh listening online Please raise your hand and we unmute you Saying none Thank you Mr City manager I appreciate how you going through that Council any questions at this time Um Mr mayor Mayor Pro Tem Um on the Retain the services of an experienced code enforcement 
and administrative consultant Um do you have any ideas on how long that we would Um Retain the services I would think It It would probably be a matter of weekly visits for maybe a month Um for a few hours each time there's a visit 
and it's just an hourly charge for that I see that one as being a a shorter term Gig than the uh the the other 
one about a contract code enforcement officer I see 
that as being a longer term assignment And Um We had talked about hiring an extra code enforcement 
officer before all of this to help with the case load and the short term rentals Um So This The uh Of a code enforcement officer experienced he would report he would be an employee or 
just a contracted serves just a contracted service 
and he would report to the council and the city manager on a monthly basis Or How would that be I I see the first one definitely reporting 
to the manager and co Uh the code enforcement officer I think 
could have some value But I don't know if they would come with any reporting 
I would have to negotiate that Mhm And um as far as effects on the budget is this in the operating expenses for this year Have we We'll find a way to make it happen She's asking about the budget Yeah Oh
How It's on Oh Is being record Mayor Pro Tem Kelly Cullum is 
asking about the funds that would be used to pay for these contract 
services Where does it come from Well Obviously there would come from either 
professional services or the contract services line of that department within the General fund OK Um that's all the questions I have right now Mayor Thank you And I missed the first answer 
I apologize You your first question Mayor Tim was how long Yes for the experience code enforcement and administrative consultant How long would Do You think a month is long enough Todd Well II I would want the consultant to weigh 
in on that because they need to be comfortable that they can have enough time 
to assess exactly what they're going to be reporting on so I hesitate to answer but I I was thinking maybe a month or two Yes Please Councilor Jackson Um for this contractors that uh we have two different ones Um Uh these The administrative 
consultant And Of course the officer Would be involved with Those two people that will help this process The first one the administrative 
consultant will be tasked with um assessing our all of the procedures the evolving procedures of the 
standard operating procedures document Um the the historical practices that continue The looking at the organizational structure of the department Um and then with all of that making recommendations on best practices for improving based on all of those 
observations for organizational structure services and internal controls But would they help us 
implement those best practices then The recommendations We I would see that coming back as uh update to this item that 
this is what's recommended and we would like to pursue 
pursue this or you know if if something that's just for whatever 
reason we don't want to pursue We could choose that course too but I 
see that coming back to this council as Yeah And Then with the um code enforcement on officer That's contractor He would be literally just filling in for code enforcement to complete the tasks 
that need to be done for code enforcement Correct and 
ideally that would be both Both people would be from the same firm so That officer would report to that 
administrative consultant so that administrative consultant can 
stay plugged in on the day to day What's going on OK Mr Mayor Yes Council member will us so the contract code enforcement officer Would be able to give Active feedback on exactly what is What he observes on a day to day basis towards improving the processes Yes OK so that input would be Captured by the administrative That That's How I I would request that this contract be written Um The I'm Sorry Well No I No I just Recognize that somebody actually doing the work We'll see things somewhat differently than someone observing process so that I would I would really like to see in the contract that That person provides additional input Thank you Remember Davis Anything at this time This is a good idea because it will get uh an outsider view and I'm sure that they 
would come up with a lot of recommendations that could 
possibly help So I'm I'm for doing it Thank you And Thank you again City manager for putting this together So This is just backing up from where we began January 24th There were 10 tasks The attachment We received the update on all of those tasks today That's 
There's some new information in there compared to the last Yeah 
we're we're information is now stored in laser fish Now instead 
of being represented here OK and This specific attachment to opportunities to improve community development Department as it 
relates to code enforcement Um is related to Task number five of the second half Yeah yes which was Uh I'm gonna read it Present any findings and or opportunities to be distributed to the City Council on ways the city can improve our 
community Development department as it relates to code enforcement So these are Really that these aren't the F Oh Yeah These are the findings with root causes and then the recommendations Yes sir So item number five This is fulfilling that Yes sir The This Even the city attorney 
had a chance to go through this together And What I wanna just Back up and say is This was put on in January Because What was I Guess councils practice and citizen practice It wasn't working out well for the citizens the parties and uh I think Me as as mayor and formally 
as a council member in the council and so I just wanna remind that this was put on the agenda When We we weren't able to get traction after a couple of years Of of challenges and problems And since that meeting We are now in June I think it's Roughly 100 and 40 days But when you go back prior to that There's issues on Fillmore and Jackson that today still are not resolved And I think that putting this on in January Put a spotlight on these two But my concern was you know for Cape Canaveral as a whole is what's happening across the board and so I appreciate the comments today from um Ms Shaler Peg who uh talked about values because This council create or at least approved the values Um we went back a couple of years and did the revision We set those values They're up on our website And there's values are Some of them were I guess They come with explanation but one word values Um I just wanna read Read what those values are because I 
I think it's important We just took this up a couple of months ago 
and spent some time on them But first We We know our vision Um The city's mission Before going to the values is important The 
mission of the city of Cape Canaveral government is to provide excellence in municipal services by supporting a high quality of life Fiscal responsibility and environmental stewardship while celebrating diversity in fostering innovation The values Number one in the word We just heard commitment to excellence The Next value is our vision Commit Well let me just say commitment 
to excellence is we believe our role is to make the city of Cape 
Canaveral the ideal community for our residents businesses and visitors The vision Is the next value dedication that one says we are dedicated to performing our 
duties to the best of our abilities in going above and beyond to 
achieve high quality results Accountability We have a 
responsibility to one another and the public to perform our jobs effectively and efficiently and we take that responsibility seriously Innovation proactivity we actively seek to identify and plan for issues before they arise with the aim of averting problems rather than having to solve them after they occur Integrity We strive to make decisions and take actions based 
upon what is right rather than what is expedient We are honest and we own up to our mistakes Teamwork in recognition of the 
worth of each individual in their contributions to our mission 
we value and honor one another and are committed 
to working together as one team Civil communication We communicate openly clearly directly and in a timely manner with one another and the community And There's diversity inclusivity 
We even have fun as one but I read some of the explanations 
of some of those because We All Those values apply to me all of us every uh Uh Person a part of our team and administration and If We create those values We 
are the body that needs to uphold them And in a former meeting We talked about core values and separating aspirational values And I Think 
council member Willis had brought and said you know We treat them all important and I Stuck We did not change and I think that's a a good approach To it but the ones That I think Brought us here back in January was the Working as a team communicating It wasn't working well and I certainly was bringing my best And January was sort of that point for Fillmore and Jackson That That That was the only course 
of action we need to take and or uh that I need to take and 
I and I think the council for supporting to look into this The The alignment of what we've discovered here And What I'm Asking myself is from this And the counts and the demand 
there does not have to be an answer today But the question I 
want to raise is When we read through all of the laser fish All of the Findings and the recommendations that we have Is do we believe that we Not Forward looking yet did we align with our values Because we can Move forward and if we don't 
stop and check that what's the point of having them and so I appreciate the the information we've been provided But I am having a very hard time Seeing within as it relates to code enforcement And alignment with many of those values that I just read And So These recommendations are good And the root causes and those things are important But the In fairness The tasks were not to see if it aligned with with our values I don't think that needs 
to be tasked I think we bear that burden every day all of us and I've seen our values exceeded by city staff employees beyond my capacity even think what's possible We have knocked 
so many things out of the park We'll fall short from time to time but this became severe in this department And being proactive before issues arise 
When You talked about the code enforcement and the request and it was you know the response for was we have it under control and had we not put this on I think we we We did not have the control that I Felt we the the citizens deserved and needed and so The Second thing is beyond values is Code In State law and that's why it was important that our city attorney and city manager work together And When I read these Uh Root causes I highlighted some of them if we go to page Attachment to the first page of the What We just Receive from our city manager Over on the far right hand Cob COLUMN where it says root causes Scroll down one more page or yes up I'm sorry So Yeah the first line there 
where it says root causes in the table No the the first one is there's no established procedure And I highlighted just that and we go to the next one No established target time frame Are you following along with me Each one I went through and I tried to extract What the The route pro the route within 
the route I guess you could say so The third no established tool The fourth lack of co ordination The last on this page staff or just as it's more of a did not verify Um if we can go to the next page Lack of full and accurate understanding The Next one no established policy Failure to D differentiate Poor record keeping Response was incomplete and not clarified until later Incomplete Statement initial oral statement was open to 
misinterpretation because it was the word is incomplete The Next One did not follow departmental practice Next one at no Uniform department practice The last one on that page did not follow departmental practice Go to the next page Thank you very much The second when they're um Did not follow departmental practice No established practice The And then down towards the bottom Did not follow departmental practice And It's not about what it 
was not followed What I I I'm gonna make a point here and as 
we go down to the I think one more page the last page Oh I think that was it I'm 
uh underscores the need to do Um I think that's did not follow departmental practice and so Nowhere in there Does it talk about the code Nowhere Does it talk about state law and so We have our code Which is an established procedure We have our State Law I Think supplemental in there and that's where my head was was We have Section Of Our City code section 22 F 2-2 54 procedures and our code And when I read through that And then I Look at this case and I apply those procedures And I look at our values There's a serious disconnect And I I'll just pause there and and and say that those were The issues that I saw was did not follow Uh no established practice I'll comment a little bit more on that Um but I believe We will be approaching six months here I think in July from when we originally 
asked for this and in all honesty and transparency when 
this was brought in January I thought In my head The next meeting Or two And We've pressed to get what we've got I'm not sure we would be as far along as we were And so As far as the responses that we have today I think we have to draw a 
line in the sand to mortems Question of when This happens on 90 days would be kind of 
the longest that I had in my head We're gonna be essentially double that and I would like in July To Take this in as a council Look at our values Look at the code Look at state law And Give our city manager Provide a response to the entire thing and basically go down one through five for Fillmore one through five We have 
our responses and whatever is completed at that time I think we can certainly work off of but we have so much to do in the 
city and I know that the time and the resources that's went into this Has been significant to to two things One is to improve internally but also to effect that this property owners 
have problems and challenges today and you can make these changes but if it doesn't result in in those properties Uh Being addressed I think that's an issue and When I read through those going back to the the full circle Uh no established procedure No established target time frame No Established Tool Lack of co ordination did not verify requests for information and it keeps going today in our org chart Who is responsible not the the name 
but what is the position in the org chart that's responsible For Establishing procedures establishing target timeframes establishing tools lack of co ordination Or be coordinating Verifying information Because that department in the org chart as I understand it to day We have the people 
at the top the council and it goes everything bottlenecks and yours pretty much on the administration to our city manager And Then It goes there's a director a manager and then AAA code enforcement officer Very vertical 1 to 1 to 1 and I know we 
have two code enforcement So 1112 And The the response of if I was to look at that uh certainly not an expert on organizations But when I 
see those lines I think to myself Well The Upside of that is wow Look at the layers that it would have to go to And When would you need to go up the flag pole to figure something out First is when a resident or a business Owner or any member of this community brings an issue forward And working and that does not get resolved And 
then that issue is brought to the council It does not get resolved 
and then the council puts it on the agenda And today I think we can all agree there not resolved and we're looking forward 
about how we're going to establish these procedures Our code in state law Provides a path when I look at these on exactly what we're supposed to do Section 2254 and the procedures And your D as in dog and E as in elephant D talks about Repeat violators And So When I looked at the Jackson Avenue story Repeat violation for maintenance of the building We had 2018 and we had 2019 notices of violations that went out 2020 came They were supposed to be taken up Those were never resolved Or They were compliance in the 
field What not but our code tells us that if those issues come back again The way I understand it is 
that's a repeat violator You can't And that gives our city Our code enforcement officer Really where all their power is 
in our city attorney and correct me is the word initiate that they have the ability to initiate a proceeding as an officer Mayor pro I None of us up here can do that And you are code enforcement officer can initiate and it gets on that path to resolve to the code 
enforcement board at the time or in the special magistrate today who has a different set of power Hours And so when this These issues whether it be Fillmore C tried to work It did not get resolved It escalated to council He I'm talking It went by years before it ever came Or Uh excuse me Months at least one or two years Before it ever came to the count Uh the the January 24th meeting But The the Particular property on Jackson had issues And we had a tool in our belt to shorten the time allowed That's that's the point 
I wanted to make is when you have a repeat violator We do not have to afford them as much time But even if we disagreed 
that no they that would not qualify as a repeat violator So We had to give the time time to wait to it just From initiation to resolving it The Next one E talks about If There's a serious threat To the safety welfare health of the community Then we have to to treat 
it like an emergency We do whatever we can to notify 
them but they can initiate an immediate proceeding They can initiate it and get it right away And and resolve and you go well This isn't somebody because their house 
is a color you don't like or some maybe aesthetic or issue that's not a life safety issue This was a life safety issue That are trained and we would solve the training of of of our code enforcement officers Went out And they never Initiate They never took that Even the first step let alone pick one of the paths Until years after But where they did take quick action Was on issues that were not Serious life safety issues proving the expediency And so That's where my stomach turned and I and I had a serious hard time With With this because All of those things No procedures no timeframes no tools To me There's a director There's 
a manager and there is an officer The officer is initiating The manager is ensuring that those cases are being followed and things are happening and the director is there uh directing uh coordinating D Uh make supporting the manager And So when we talk about bringing a consultant in to do In my opinion humbly the job of what That very vertical Team should be tackling I think a consultant's great But When I read through these I see nothing about The code What is an established or what is a departmental practice Is that a written document No It's instruction from the manager Verbal Yes Training provided by the manager And today and face certification as well The standard operating procedures for That department during this 
period We did not have this any standard operating procedures to my knowledge To The Only thing we had 
that we in writing was the code in state law And the decision tree which I think was a written Guide And so if that's all we have With the power I guess to to provide departmental practices That's all we can apply and so I Would like to request in July A dedicated meeting before the regular council meeting to to to close this entire And action items out I think I've seen enough To begin to work towards Either adopting these recommendations that we have And or adding and amending them to a to a path that that we can take action on So My hope was to express Uh And continued Concern and frustration through Through these efforts because If An officer makes a mistake 
or does not do something OK Where are the other layers to help ensure And The The issue is the entire Well I guess the parties that have 
been involved The positions in the org chart involved That Whole department functioning certainly needs all of the recommendations That That our city manager talked about and and and SOPS and and making sure we have those things in place but I I did not think it it would 
take as long as it has I would like to to to push towards The council looking at the 10 items looking at the responses give the city manager Um the opportunity obviously between then and and whenever that meeting would 
be to continue to add or to fulfill But at some point 
we have to say Do We have it all And We haven't really had a chance to have it all because new things have popped 
up and there's I'm not gonna go into the specifics of this item or that item as it As It relates to this But the There's a major major gaps that I Do not It's the It's the entire department Not Where I've seen employee Employee tells me one And I and I just want to express that Procedures Timeframes tools coordinations Yeah I I Don't I don't think that's the role of the The The officers and today full disclosure I did ask for 
the job description of the community development economic director The Council is aware I would 
encourage you to look at it as well Because I don't want to miss a line With The title of the January 24th was community Development as it relates to code 
enforcement the building department and so I stood back and said it be good to know what job description is in there absent 
because that would be the third thing we'd have in writing 
That we can actually lean on and use the departmental practices Verbal Is Is a Not a good practice in itself The practice of verbal practice which I know I'm That's stated in here We've discovered some really good things And I'm ready to to put this 
behind and the time and the delay as far as these issues go on Jackson is really no different with Fillmore because those issues started back I was bringing those forward after 
they were not getting anywhere and I think some questions were sent out And they would not get answered 
And so that's when they would reach out to to one of us or me And then They would get a reply but questions would not get answered And we we we escalated it in today I There's I think we're looking at 600 days Where These questions have been posed And They 
they're not They have not been answered within Fillmore Avenue specifically from the Hearst family and some documents 
And if you go in those color coded responses I think we've all 
seen if you go through and you read the responses there They deserve a A Inaccurate response because the response they were given was not accurate And I think we can 
all read that and agree it I don't want to go down that 
path but I think they deserve that Like I said It's been 100 40 something days since The the meeting Um the January 24th meeting And We've noticed some new issues that's come out since then Council member Jackson This is one 
issue I will specific as an example brought up in a meeting about rebar Sticking up in The backyard of 306 Fillmore That was I Guess a couple of months ago I think we Got through a meeting Immediately excuse me immediately in that meeting city staff went out I believe 
it was one of our team members went out and put a cone up handled the issue of communicated with the property owner Then Another meeting came and went And I think we asked for another update on it at a at a at a following meeting And Information was provided to the property owners Where accuracy Was then brought into question And I went to that property I 
didn't see that rebar or at least I didn't it Didn't 
register in my head There's a lot But you had saw it and I'm 
thankful and it was evidently there Uh when When I was there and I believe that And The way that I took that meeting It was sort of those was the first time 
I understood it in and heard it And I appreciated the quick timely response But are but our team received it as if it was the first time And I think What I learned after was that There was knowledge that rebar was initiated and brought up by our team here at the city We had full 
knowledge of that And This is just an example of being forthcoming to work as a team to represent those values And It was as if they were 
the first time they were hearing it A meeting went and then email communication went out after we 
brought it up Has This got anywhere The cone was still on it It was not resolved And Their citizens who receive communication I forward this correspondence to our city manager Were provided once again Information that did not make any sense in represent what I would say proficiency and competency from from Team member who was fully aware because this issue on rebar was brought up By Us the city To the Citizen back in January So when you had brought it up It could be off It was early in the year it was already brought 
up and and they were fully aware And While It's actually not even a significant issue right It's just rebar That's an example of Go down the line and this continues To happen And so I don't know how a consultant Can fix values I don't think we can legislate that I don't think we 
can code our way or procedure our way into that And I'm tired on this issue I think 
we all are ready to move on and see the improvements made But When they when citizens wait so long By following work directly with city staff and and it's not always gonna work There's always 
gonna be conflicts There's always going to be citizens who I disagree with and and and support city staff But In this case it became a head scratcher To Finally getting some traction 
but the level it took and so then six months in after the council got behind it sort of looking maybe a couple more months and My hope is that We can in July try to wrap AAA bow around this and say we learned a lot This is what we need to do 
Take what our city manager has provided and and and pulled together my concerns with the consultant is that if they're if if we're paying a consultant that 
have to be careful with how independent it is especially if they are also providing services for code enforcement So the same one who's going to give an 
independent Of course they're gonna wanna You know Expand their services and and add 
on and use it It has nothing to do with If It doesn't have to be that way It would be better The 
company who does it could do an excellent job I Don't I don't know but I've said this to Todd It would be 
very difficult to tide and even us to be to be unbiased in an investigation because we we 
are the city of Cape Canal This is the administration And So I think that this council Um Should consider that As is um As a concern for bringing in a consultant and we use the word Um Audit I think that there are Some different paths that that we could consider as far as As Far as that goes Mr Mayor Yes ma'am you don't think bringing in 
a consultant and that is a good idea What is your idea to fix this On that instead of a consultant If the goal of the consultant I was To retain services and experience administrative 
consultant to assess the city's code enforcement procedures practices and organizational structure for purposes Of recommending best practices 
to improve the department's organizational structure services in internal controls Um And I'm not asking the description of 
you know bringing in a consultant I'm saying What do you think is the proper way to fix this I'm Defining what you're saying fix This is Well apparently you don't 
think a consultant is a good idea which I do because it's an 
outsider that can see things that we may not or the city may not but I'm asking if we don't do something like 
that What are you suggesting we do I think that there Things under the org chart today Should be led within our team And They should have been in place And that is the role of a of a director And managers and employees is that That's And I didn't say I 
was against it I said I was concerned however Uh Outside Who we pay is an outside Um There is Targeted and focused audits through the state of Florida Auditor General That's as unbiased as you get This Council could decide on I think when I logged into BS N a for the first time and got access and I looked 
at some of these things I didn't get to spend a lot of time in there But specifically And This is sort of what a consultant 
or I guess an audit would do The item number Eight and the rocks in the swale May 24th case notes So on May 7th the city manager presented the findings in that meeting The question was brought Where did this come from said it was in 
the field notes I held up my field notes and I said I have the 
field notes from March They were not in there City manager explained today that some time after it was put in that night I was told Mr mayor We'll show you right now if 
you want to see it it's in there I went in there and I said this in the last meeting First meeting It wasn't Addressed this It Then It was brought up again It still was not addressed And 
then when I went to BS N the date that it was submitted was 59 The meeting was on five Seven And so I was told that they were in there They were submitted on 59 because I guess 
that's when they were added But This Our city manager From My understanding is 
has not been able to verify When that was a polluted into BS N a well we We do know how to verify that What Was It uploaded the date into BS N a And that next level of well 
where did that document come from And so is is getting back to the computers But when we asked for all files I Don't think we received all files We received BS N a And My question would be if we did have a consultant What are the filing storage systems today that the city code Enforcement department uses BS N is one They obviously have their hard drives and their computers where they 
can create documents and Laser fish I guess would be 
a place where they can save directly and store And then there's A shared user shares Yeah What is that Um employees are encouraged not to 
save things on the on the local hard drive because of computer crashes You don't you don't have access to 
that so each employee has a share on the city's server where they directed to save their 
information So that they can be backed up Those are the user shares So That's so anything that exists should be saved there Of course it could be on a hard drive but Is there 
Anything else other than the shared I just like Red folder or 
something that was set in one of our meetings Yeah they they There was a an historical practice to have Printed documents Um actually in a you know in a in a folder that was colored red and um stored in a file cabinet drawer and the employee's office But if I was a code enforcement officer and I said 116 Jackson Avenue give me all the files on it Is there one place that that that could enforcement 
officer could go and see all their files Working documents final documents Just sort of that organization of Where They're stored and managed We We already know that they save some things in BS A 
They say some things in the user shares They save some things 
in the red folders Uh possibly also some things in laser fish 
as well in red folders are physical But Those are printed after they're already saved It can't live in the correct me if I'm 
wrong unless it's handwrit notes What was the role Why did we spend $300,000 on BS N A What What's that that cause that's we use tool That's a I thought was a tool What was the That used the intent for that John You were part of that purchase Do You know what the intent was 
there stated I'm just asking you as you understand it as our city manager I think a tool for efficiency Right To communicate with residents Cause it's there's a there's a 
part of a public portal Yeah But There was no place that the 
residents could go and see all official documents They could see whatever documents were toggled on But that wasn't a complete and accurate storage to go 116 Jackson Avenue Where are all the official documents There was no place that a resident could go and I Don't I don't think anybody will and code enforcement was directed to put all until recently all notice of violations Official records N BS N a I don't think there was 
any direction given on that initially And So that's it Is that 
do we need to consultant to give us direction for that 
I Don't Think so right now I think consultants could be very 
beneficial again I'm not completely against it But There's the time This is taken on both Fillmore and Jackson within this department does range at concern today I believe we've learned to building officials Have resigned And We are using services over there Talked about some practices 
here that are really verbal Which is just bad practice Uh For for me I know and and for for anyone and it's I think that Mr Mayor Yes ma'am Also of concern for me as someone new Um Whereas a consultant might end up Being able to look at these cases and Takes steps to repair or put Recommended best practices in there It's obvious to me as someone knew that 
just stepped in you know within the last well since November that we have had problems with this not just at these To group addresses because the very first thing that I got exposed to was portside villas and they issue had gone on for 2.5 years So to me as someone if I you know I would think that we would 
want to look at anything that is out there and pending and has been pending for quite some time to try to identify or do we have other issues than other issues In addition to what we're seeing Here are some of these same ones Or it or you know are they procedure issues Um and then address those back to the code Um simply because I don't know if a consultant will come in 
and look at every single one of these Um I have no idea what the price would be for that Um but we definitely have a bunch of cases that we have been told in council as we've asked questions during the processes that are out there pending And Um so I would look you know I would be interested in seeing what 
do we have How Many do we have out there Pending M BS and F How Long is the the the oldest Pending Code enforcement case so that we can see If We Bring a consultant in Rectify this if there are other issues on other cases that are not addressed 
We're still not going to have this addressed This could be a 
lot bigger than what we're just seeing here from lack of procedures And I think that the cases 
out there where you have AAA building That's not being 
maintained that's not being initiated with any action has 
sat there for two years at the risk Of the public And that's why at the time 
it wasn't to get answers It's I think we found that there was No established practice Uh all all these things that were going through Um that to me is a That's a function A is Function higher in the org 
chart to put it straight And so You and I have spent a lot of time on this That's a department They did not get rid direction is what you said Council member Davis I See it totally opposite Um I mean I'm concerned about this 
too There was mistakes made uh that that we can't deny 
But Nobody's perfect I make mistakes Everybody on this This 
council makes mistakes Everybody in the audience I don't know anybody that 
doesn't the thing that is important to me is that we don't go back 
and keep harping on these mistakes We know what they were or 
we know the majority of them I'm not saying we know everything and we correct them We Don't you know we understand So we 
have to find a way to move forward not go keep harping on all the 
bad stuff in the bad in in the past So if we sit there and we say OK That's why I'm asking How Did 
you want to correct it Do You Want city manager to correct it Do you want um Director Dickie to to correct it Who Did You 
want to correct it Because if you have an outside person nobody on this bench and I'm not saying we would 
or anybody else can say that person is biased They haven't done 
anything They've done this or what So We have an outside thing 
They don't know us from anybody so they'll sit there and say 
so And so did this And It was wrong We can have This outside consultant Do Anything we want if we want them 
to look in other cases we can have them Look at other cases I 
don't know what the limit is but doesn't mean he has to just focus on 
these two We can have them do anything we want That's something we 
have to find out and you know and and look into but I 
think the way to solve this where nobody is accused of anything and everything gets solved in a proper manner 
is to have an outside person an outsider that looks has a whole different view Then we do then the public does then staff does and I think that's the only 
way we're going to get a proper solution That's member Willis Well I'm concerned that if we start looking at every open 
case which could be open for a multitude of reasons I mean it It doesn't necessarily have to be any 
of these types of reasons It could be multitude of But if we are going to go back and start looking at those to add into this It's not gonna solve this any quicker It's just gonna drag it out even more So Let's Solve this and by solving this we solve other things As well Um And Acknowledging UM Council member Willis's statement However the one of the common 
things I'm Seeing Here is we have no operating procedures And so operating procedures 
will cast out over all of these and I really feel like we need to We may not want to go in and Analyze each one the way that we've done with this case but we're obviously missing 
operating procedures that are coinciding with code and state statute By doing so we may have multitudes of one sitting out there that are aging that Should be closed out should Have operating procedures applied 
to them so that they can be CLO closed out So where I agree We need to fix these I don't think we can ignore 
this because if there's no operating procedures that's 
gonna be out there with just about anything that we may have touched Not gonna make them all Miraculously um fix themselves But I think we need those 
to those procedures defined First and foremost back to code and back to state statute because without the procedures no 
one's going to follow them Just lacking an employee handbook 
You know if you don't know what you're doing and you're 
not relating it to the different sections You're not gonna be able to conduct your job the way that you need to In my view There's no better person 
than an outside person to work with staff to up the standard procedures and correct me if I'm wrong Todd but the outside consultant could help us and 
will help us set up these procedures Correct Yes We can frame the request to be whatever we 
want it to be So that would be an outsider again establishing 
procedures that they see from their point of view that 
were wrong and working with our staff so that we can get a complete Group a set of procedures so I still think I don't want to sit up here 
and not get a consultant and then have anybody on this dais or public or staff Whatever start accusing 
someone of not doing this and doing that and you know it was their 
fault It's their fault It was a you know it's mistakes I've ever made So We need I I just see an outside Consultant And I Think we have procedures That's my point It's literally says code enforcement procedures Quite quoted earlier Um Why You can always you know further define clarify strength and make it better But When I look at the 
procedures and I look at what's happened Here and across is that There's a big There's a big problem Here and I do not know how a consultant is going To fix some of the information in the in the lack of response that citizens have received and I have received Regarding These issues and frankly at times serious disrespect To the to the to the office And My Hope is in July if you want 
to go through these after my In-depth is that a consultant Sounds great But not before We Take who we have and walk down the procedures we have today We have to be able to follow our own procedures today and if we did not and that's as much time as I'd spent either We like you said Councilor 
Davis identify the problems First thing is Do We agree on these being the problems and the roots That's 
what I hope our response and what I will be prepared 
to to work on in and talk on is that If we take our code And we Apply it We Don't need another word We have enough And I think Well If We have a a code that Was not in my opinion Lacking clarity under life safety issues And It It's beyond this and I don't 
need to to look at other cases We all have experienced cases and seeing them throughout the 
years and this issue has been long standing that the IP MC was gonna resolve a magistrate was gonna resolve and today we still have them 
Neither one of them has has resolved these issues And I've went through Meeting after meeting Trying to be patient but at some point It becomes it's on us It's on this council at this point and I'd like to to request in July before the council meeting I'd like to knock this out and not have this Course City manager and can can bring it whatever Um they wanted any time for any meeting But I don't wanna go all the way 
to the to the next regular meeting with this in front of us when we can double down I've seen enough To know That We have enough We Just walk and apply the steps and you look at it from that view N No No No practices no procedures City manager I think has the Authority To see How to improve this without a consultant And Then If you wanna move to a consultant to add That's fine But today The The information Has been very difficult to rely on And it's created this You know Verify verify and and and to date When Somebody says that something's in 
there and it's not on multiple occasions I have to question and I was asked to think it one of 
the meetings Do you not trust us well after three or four instances Where The parties In These cases have provided a lot of evidence and shown us evidence who've never given me any reason But yet on our side Unfortunately the answer is Yes I have to verify this Because of these instances that's happened and I have a responsibility to do that And This is not comfortable I'm saying after July I hope to never talk about this again and we 
start working on implementing the solutions But if this is 
gonna be bringing a consultant 2 to 3 more months and work through why can't we just say here's our code Years Our decision tree Here's our org chart Here's the cases Did we follow these steps If not why let's figure out how to follow the steps we have today And earn that next step to make it better But if to me is We did not need Procedure When when it says if it's a life safety issue you 
don't even need to notice That was a life safety issue well documented with people going in and out Why Was it condemned by or or inhabitable by the building official because 
it was an inhabitable Why open wires electrical issues that our city we were we we had been in that 
building our officers they saw no violations Unbelievable Can I and then they Yes Absolutely and I'm wrap up 
and then they come back and then the person Who called in the request gets a violation Are you kidding me Now if that violation exists 
by 100% agree with it pursue it then that citizen reaches out to our city manager attorney all of us and they get ignored That's unacceptable I am not gonna say Consultant or no That's the problem in my opinion Is Why did that happen So this changes within No-one's gonna fix us and say Well you should have went Here's nine more steps to clarify 
Yes that would be excellent But There's This has been uh this has been haunting the city for a long time and I think we've learned there there were no practice procedures Well Then what is the job descriptions of these people and 
who is responsible for putting these procedures into place And Why was there not Why Was this not taken seriously I've seen enough I don't need to To hear anything from a 
consultant to go Was that a life safety issue Why did Why did our existing code not get applied And I haven't heard a good answer 
on why are existing good The word code Is its practice Procedure Where's the code Our job is to follow the code That's not right Said enough I could go on And Y'all all know that But I'm I'm I'm getting tired of hearing 
myself Talk about this and I want to see this resolved so we can use our strengths as a counsel 
as an administration to go and make this city better 
This can't loom over our heads anymore The way I see it Yes Mistakes have been made Apparently you know we all have our view on what happened 
and what didn't happen and what mistakes were The mistakes were You know you're sitting here and what 
I hear is that you are not happy that the code the city uh procedures and all that were not followed OK So Now you're saying they didn't The staff didn't follow all these procedures 
and code enforcement officers didn't do what they were supposed to 
do But I want them to set it all up so they can fix it and get it right I then that sets them up for just more more Complaining or or about them saying you didn't you 
didn't correct it correct You know right Or whatever When I think 
we need to do it right We need a consultant And just because we have a consultant We can go on our 
business doesn't mean we have to talk about this every 
week or excuse me every month We can have a consultant when they 
get done We can have a report whether it's Uh four weeks two months Whatever down the road I Am not um I'm I'm just Coming to the conclusion that maybe this council does not want to hear what the the the consultant may have to say That's all that I that I can see Other than 
that I cannot see any other reason not to have a third person 
come in Help correct The problem help A ST you know do the this uh procedures make sure everybody understands and follows the 
codes The for the you know the statues and make sure 
everything is set up that way It's not blamed on anyone here 
It's the consultant that's putting it on cause I'm tired of 
putting the blame on whoever for this stuff everybody It was a mistake It happens so I mean I'm I Just think we can move forward away from this I hope it does get you know resolved I hope 
we do get Procedures and gear I hope everything will We've learned from this but I will not have us 
continue to sit there and put blame on everybody And then 
we won't take the advice of a consultant that has an outside opinion I I have a problem with that 
where I would think that you would want it cause you you 
everybody I'm not saying you I'm just you know I'm 
not pinpointing that you know council seems to think that 
the staff was did all this stuff wrong And then you want him to On their own Don't set them up like that 
Find out consultant that can help them do it and we can do it properly and has experience in what we're doing So I You know I'm I'm not for and I'll say it right now I'm not for firing anybody I Just want to put that on the 
record I am not for firing anybody Mistakes were made unfortunately and you know things suffer and but that's how policies and procedures are made You 
make mistakes You move forward and you make policy and you make 
procedures so hopefully you don't make the same mistakes I I'm not I mean I'm not perfect So I'm not gonna sit up here and say 
that I am and blame everybody else for making mistakes when I make 
them myself and as far as timely stuff I mean I agree Some of it took A little while and everything else but we ask staff to do things for our for us and we expect them to be done as soon as possible When this dais this people Excuse me This council doesn't even do the 
same for them Doesn't we don't get things in on time 
all the time So I Just think I'm I Just think to avoid any more blaming any more issues Do a third council I mean out a consultant Morte Go ahead Go ahead Sorry No Go ahead I just think I don't think we're deciding on a um Why I think that um Are responsible for this Do everything we can to resolve this Um I I I'm not opposed to it Um an outside consultant But I like the idea of having a meeting before the other The regular meeting and just go through 
the code and go through our values and and make sure we 
have it right And Then if we need a consultant ID uh you know it's not that I'm against it but Like You said There There are procedures Um in our code already that is we're going to pay a consultant 
to tell us You guys already have these procedures What 
are you asking me for You know um I just think it if we and I'm I'm sure Peg and everyone else is tired of of this and it's taken a long time but I think the responsibility 
for this comes back to the council and um If we do everything we can I don't see 
where I'm meeting That would just be this purpose for to look at the code and compare to what happened and you know just see what we can do Our our 
input to the city manager Um And and move on from there Um but it has to be resolved Um You know we have to give them an answer that and they have to know 
that we have exhausted every angle everything that we can to get it right So That's My opinion Thank you Mr mayor Um Staff will have their own bias For whatever we ask them to do we will have 
our own bias for whatever we're going to do Um And This is a discussion item So Are We going to walk out of here Somebody's either going to uh try to schedule a another meeting For a purpose Is that is that what's going to happen II I would like to Have this sort of like it was initiated by itself in January What I'm saying is is It was introduced in a a conclusive special meeting Uh And to say you know if all these items 
are not complete and maybe they should That That's So That's not 
something that What I'm saying is is what we do have Has raised enough red flags that I don't need a consultant to tell me your code says this Whether They followed in it or not Is Is one thing but If if they didn't follow it What did they follow And if they did not you know 
if they did follow it Well I I understand your point But You know I Just Wanna raise this Um If We go that route and we have a 
special meeting before the next council meeting and we're 
looking at this and we still find you know we really should get 
somebody else in here to look at it Well we have now Wasted another not wasted per SE but we have extended the whole period Of non resolution If We don't arrive at that point So We've just added another month to what this problem has been Mhmm Micky Or Jackson No I Think I was first mayor FT I'm Not Sure If I quite understand 
you're saying in the meeting we should give our suggestions on this the procedures or how to I think we should go through the code We were Um Or moving forward Where I was going I don't 
understand because we can read the code on our own without a special 
meeting And if we have any suggestions concerns we can 
approach the city manager Um II I just I don't see why there would 
be a special meeting Well That's the only time we get 
to talk to each other so that's why I would You know Like to have a meeting But yes agree OK and I have a question Uh for the city manager just because I haven't really read Any of the job descriptions and 
all that But I would think that with the code enforcement officer the ability to interpret code would be Within The job description is that correct I I can't speak for what the job description says 
I haven't read the current ones Yeah I I haven't either So Um but I think that we need to I mean truly I just pulled up what we 
were talking about and I mean the procedures are in there so I'm not as I'm not as knowledgeable so I 
just literally pulled it up Um so I just was curious if if if it's not in the job description as we look at additional resources I would 
high Recommend we add that in there because interpretation 
of code is ported in that position I just want to throw in there 
I can say working as a an a deputy There's civil law You Gotta know criminal law I mean there's so 
many different things that you know and sometimes there's different Laws or codes or whatever that you're not 
familiar with as familiar with and you either don't know it or you 
interpret it different or whatever So That's not that uncommon Yes it was 
a mistake I'm not taking away that But it's not that uncommon 
because there is so much to know Well Thank you Yes I think A consultant telling us like you said Councilor Davis We can read the code I agree I don't need to that Now interpreting We lean on our city I do At 
least I think we all have the resource and knowledge of our 
city attorney who can help guide and and provide um His opinion and and Been doing this a long time And our our that department This is not This is Trained I think that experience is there I mean Been here for for a while and institutional knowledge and this and so That code For whatever reason I think if if if we were to survey The in the community and say Please share your experience With code enforcement in the 
city of Cape Canaveral Florida I Don't wanna do that But I Don't think it would I think it would Be just as valuable as a consultant I'm not diminishing the value of a consultant Absolutely but I really value our city attorney too It The When I have technical questions He helps He understands um And leans on the the The 
knowledge of the doesn't know the circumstances that I could 
enforcements in But in this case I think we've had enough time to study 
it and to know it All I'm saying is is before jumping to a consultant The original Ask Fillmore specifically said the 
city manager and city attorney present any findings or opportunities 
in a report to be distributed and for whatever reason it should 
have been the same And I think our city manager said Well We can 
change that or whatnot But whatever it sounds like they've met Either way And talked about it is The code Is what it is And it we would be foolish to go and try to improve it to go trade create procedures When I'm I'm questioning The the the nature of this 
and the circumstance and the multiple issues This is an impatient I've We've never put a deadline on this I I've I I know that these things take time But My Confidence In The issues in that department being resolved Has diminished over time And I wanna see I think Taking what we have And in making sure Before We Bring a consultant in you say the code says this We can read the code This is what happened To me It's pretty Clear That There's Some issues in perfection is a word 
that I think you've used council member Davis That's not one of our values mission is for excellence and excellence 
comes is not perfected but it I've ever used the word Not a religious test now Well You said Everyone makes mistakes 
I believe and you said We're not perfect No One's perfect that that's what I was taking And and I I agree with that and I don't We all we all make them But 
These are these are beyond mistakes And That's Why I say I've seen enough And but I deserve I think We deserve the opportunity To Respond To these 10 items to go through And to say Number one Provide a report showing all actions in correspondence First Did We receive a report Did it provide all actions Did it provide all correspondence To these properties 1 14 116 18 and 20 For this period of time Did it include all records available Whether from BS N a system a record 
storage method employed by the city's department We asked for this if we do not verify that we were provided this I've had a hard time Verifying that each one of these had been provided Full From the very beginning 
They missed time period and then I And Then there was items 
that started coming up into to to make meeting And Then I was told that Oh that was because it was 
prior to 2022 And It was a 2023 record and then it becomes a he said She said the other party provides evidence And then that issue is happening In other areas of bad information And I think I think that the consultant is a step Far at this time but I would be in favor of moving towards uh consultant Uh the council has the ability to request independent 
investigation that's been requested of us by citizens on our code enforcement department That 
we have been employed to say I would like an independent investigation of this of this and talk about patients We've never taken action on that We We 
brought this forward and we said All right Can can we make sense of it Like I said I agree Third 
party consultant would be great But You know when we're 
hiring them and things like that We Just Wanna Make Sure 
we choose I think a A really good Uh company that I think council should Should decide on on you know who we would be interested in and and work with city staff to 
to go through that process But the most unbiased would be in a 
through the auditor general in the state of Florida Mhm We Wanna Look at this exact request because These questions Can be triple verified When they get into The silos of information There's information here There There's not one place 
There's unofficial records There are official records And that's not That's to me the consultant is gonna say Well You need one record keeping system We know that You need to Right Not God is saying our city manager is saying things that I agree with In these in these recommendations but we can do this We can do this right now with the team In front of us here Instead of bringing in this 
perspective there's enough here to take action on So that's that's where I hope we can We can start to move is Trying to to wrap this up Um if you if we could meet in July um and and and sort of have this as a As a meeting to where it's Hopefully the the end of this And I I know it'll take time to to 
eventually resolve it But this perpetual coming up at every 
meeting and talking about it and we get through an hour and a half 
on nine Gen agenda items And then we spend uh the two hours on this Nobody wants to do this anymore 
and and I think we've got to take swift action and and start Implementing Taking the strides to fix what the problems are but 
we have to agree on what the problems are And while this may not have been stated when I read this I am not reading What I believe the root problems are and in July it a special meeting I am happy to write what I believe the root problems are 
but I really don't want to do that I don't I want to say Well we have this Let's Let's Let's get Let's get Let's get this done because we should not have administrative tasks Uh that's that's not We're 
we're policy Anthony's told just that we know that and and I Our policy makes sense today Can it be improved Always Where Was that remotely Compare I mean just like Where was Here's The All actions BS N A Here's what Our policy is I felt like I've said this multiple 
times but the practices in put the policy put them side by 
side Go miss that one miss that one OK whatever When We go through those exercises I think it's We have enough information to see That this problem Is I think gonna stay in front of us much longer and take 
us further than we wanna go and then it becomes deteriorating 
to things that it should not So And Those are internal Those 
issues are still not resolved today So our values our code I'm requesting a deadline if we 
want to continue to go longer we can but I hope uh that we can go into the July meeting regular meeting with this sort of In the in the rear view with a plan and that's gonna move forward and if that's 
a consultant council member Davis said Sure We'll do it But I Think like you said Mayor Pro Tem That wasn't tonight My Hope was to share as we started heading down The recommendations The the the problems Around following policy laws procedures And or the lack of is all a function of the department From We're a small city And I think that that there's These things We should be Excited about Simply following I Think what we have in going You can't follow this It doesn't work right Like art it in and I Haven't heard 
that right If You apply this that that's when we get involved OK We Gotta fix this But the whole conversation kind of got away from that and it and it went down these credibility and things of trust and this evidence was presented And I Think Todd our city manager Compiled facts He collected evidence he is Gave his Hi his best Uh judgment of You Know what this party said what that party 
said And if there is the third story as our city manager 
have said I think we are the third story We are the third part is that we've heard the city Position on it We've heard the private Side the property owner side July I'm ready to take this up and go through all five and and and Agree to the recommendations a agree to the problems further define the problems But Find myself going off on a 
new item or that and more time and and I and I don't 
think that's helping anybody at this point and I know the 
property owners are beyond uh ready to to move forward And Um unfortunately uh II I have I have lost Um My ability to blindly trust or just When I trust and ver When I verify I I keep running into to issues too frequently when I verify Um that's simple as I can put it So This item is a discussion item We do not have to take any 
action tonight My request is that we find a date if we 
wanna leave that up to our um And decided that in between now and and the next week our city clerk might be able to help in city 
manager to help coordinate that as they've done in the past 
The procedure I think is very helpful so we're not Looking at her calendars tonight but that's all I have Um Thank you Anything I have a report Anything else on this and then 
we go to reports We don't have clear consensus Mayor What do you need Is there Consensus to have a meeting in July And What preparation can I do for that meeting I say no But We're already meeting in July Was the intent to bring this at the 
regular council meeting continue to bring it forward until last 
to take it off When Do you foresee this I guess Being resolved How many more meetings would you My recommendation is that we hire the consultant As I said Um so 
the process of getting that person on board it all depends 
on the purchasing policy If We're fortunate enough that we can 
find another contract to piggyback off of that has similar services If we can't then we would have to write 
an RFP specifically for these services Two Very different scenarios one shorter and one's longer We 
Don't know until we ask what's out there OK but but the SOP document we're already doing that The Only The only question really is about the consultant aspect of it and the whole idea of putting the consultant into it is to keep it as impartial as third party as possible just to show that it's It's as pure and accountable and as we can possibly make it Um But we certainly don't have 
to go that route If There's enough Council wants to go 
another route and we can make the recommendations on the 
organizational structure And Um obviously we're going to move forward 
with the standard operating procedures document And uh that whatever the consultant 
would do You know we could do that Then There's also the other piece about 
the the code enforcement officer having that person on board also 
would still have to be um answered as well So if we want 
to have another meeting in July just I need consensus on that And Then what I can do to provide Assistance 
for that What additional information can I bring for that 
Just so I'm clear on what My marching orders are I would say that uh You have fulfilled To the best of your ability A Lot of these 
items already What I'm saying is is continue to move forward on those items And if you need direction 
on what to move forward with on resolving the film more issues resolving the Jackson Avenue issues I Think What We certainly can get involved but Mhm It to me would be more about taking what you've already provided And Giving you And our team some feedback On what we want to do because Well a consultant Yeah I I think that that's it It's Um To me the the logical next step is we've January 27th We pushed out the document Since Then We've been receiving responses fulfilling it We have and we've been kind of 
giving you know Live feedback A as we get it Um And We're now getting to that findings and recommendations which on the code enforcement side I think was sort of the end I mean that is That's item 
Number five So It's It's Our time I would say if if Confirm that In that meeting that all five are are is ready to go Um that we're we are looking at the status column and the supporting documents the best and most accurate documents that you you would say and I'm looking to say it is complete Um I think that's That's it I So we just need to be clear Then 
if we're having the meeting then Consensus I would like to have a 
meeting and before the regular meeting in July council 
member Davis would not like to Um
AM Maybe I missed it along the Line somewhere but the report of findings for Fillmore Are We Gonna get a report on You know how how that happened and Oh You know we lost a building 
official and an assistant building Official What happened there And Why 
They got an occupancy and when they shouldn't have Yeah 
that was that was in the report of findings but what's not been delivered is Item Five for Fillmore That's That's like this is for code enforcement There's that 
still to come forward for Fillmore Will that be in the July meeting Well we are still Evolving that I mean there's 
there's codes in place that And their air employee issues too Codes that weren't 
followed employee issues But As you noted Employees are no longer with us Um I'm I'm ready to turn my 
attention towards finishing that item Down you know pushing where are we And you know we're We're still waiting to get that finalized and I I don't 
know what else we can do to Quicken that private issue Um but that Largely outside of our control Um whatever recommendations we make recommendations to document the 
city attorney and I can work on the I can turn my attention to that Now 
If we're ready to put this one to bed But Um mayor I did record record 
consensus I thought saw three at least that want to have a a July meeting Um if I understand it it's basically to 
just kind of take over where we stop tonight and say How do we want to proceed Well yes I think In a perfect 
world you would be able to finish item number five on Fillmore Avenue I think it But if you if you're you're not What I'm saying is is you did finish that on the Jackson side And We can we can move In that direction but it at some point I think We have to draw the line in time 
right like it's It's whether it's done or not It's we've 
given all I think we can afford to give as far as adding it 
on meetings and moving it forward and stressing everyone out It's uh It's not enjoyable by anyone but As long as the property owners are in Ah in the circumstance they 
are You know I'm not gonna put it to the side and I think Their confidence in the path forward is gonna be a big indicator Of whether or not I think we've got a a good decision but Yep We have a reserved date for council already of July 2nd That's the date We want to have this That is only two weeks from today Um I I am concerned about having 
that fifth document for Fillmore Dunn in that short of time That gives me one week to get it out Yeah that's not Well I Don't I mean I I Think we received the Findings and stuff the day 
before I mean and I under I would rather wait and it be done 
right then and I know the one week definitely applies for 
regular City Council meetings Special City Council meetings even if it was similar to that to where you 
know you use the full two weeks to get what you could done Um assuming that that would be OK and allowed uh Then We could do it again that just Double the time but it's still Anderson two weeks by itself Is is Near um Yeah I think July 9th wouldn't be available I don't know if 
there's anything else on your Yeah I think this would be The Council agenda is released 
on the ninth So That's the week before I think if we can Email and confirm some dates But just the will to try in July before the meeting Uh OK So We'll work to schedule that meeting for probably the week 
before the regular council meeting So the the regular Council meeting is on the 16th It's true That is two days But It doesn't I never sticking with the 
Tuesdays because that was the reserved and but as city clerk said At Tuesday is a I mean it could be I assume There's a little exhale in the tent or Yeah And and I am trying to 
protect that July meeting to be a regular council meeting where 
we don't have to address this issue where we separate it and and and have a So Why don't we We Look at our 
calendars and try to find a date a settle a date if we 
can't do it we can't do it But I do feel strongly about the the Stand alone Um Mayor What if the Stand-alone date dealt only with Jackson Um Because we We can't expect the 
contractor to have finished everything at Fillmore by then anyways I mean 
it Fillmore is not gonna be resolved and by then As far as the work in the field that has to be 
done so they're there could be a compromise Perhaps there if we 
just made the special meeting only on the code enforcement Well None of them Pass though Ask for it I don't think to be resolved No the the final step on um Of course we want it resolved 
We hope that these efforts end up resulting in it being resolved But On film or item one I believe is And provided to Is and it's really just number five Uh number five and number four Yeah And as far as the the whole uh There's updates I I'd really I think I'd like to take them together and and at least deem three of the five as as complete right to give you closure on that and to lead four and five open and I just I don't understand That We're not be able to get in touch with that contractor Oh no we are We are 
because I think the reports were saying that Reached out to contractor and was not 
getting anywhere I thought the last one And that's definitely the feeling I get from it but I'm sure there was a 
response from the contractor I Don't Maybe Dave would recall what the response was Uh I think My concern is is this contractor is building a couple of 
streets down the road and I just kept seeing reached out did not hear 
back reached out Didn't hear back reached out on an issue And They're you know few streets down the road 
building another cookie cutter project almost the exact Very similar Um That that is That's all we're waiting on I think We Gotta figure out a way to Connect with him Anything Um Or the parties the company whoever's in involved um but I'm not so sure that we I guess why do we need the contractor Um if we're OK with moving forward 
without number four being completed in July Mhm Um I can make it my very best attempt to have number five done Hero is an important exercise to gain compliance Okay So yeah Actually you're saying number 
four is asking for it to be resolved Yes Yeah Good point I understand Um Yes I I think that's that's understandable OK so at the special meeting 
Um I'll do my very best to present Um uh The deliverable requested an 
item five for Fillmore Mhm and um I would consider at this point My work done on the Jackson And Council will discuss how 
they want to proceed with that Exactly Consultant whether no matter 
what it is but we've heard recommendations I shared some initial thoughts on that today My mind could change Um And it has in the past Maybe It does 
but I look forward to talking through it with everyone so OK so all that's left is the date Can we I don't think we It's hard for me to do that 
Uh because because I'll commit to something and and and up Overlooking uh but if we wanna give it a shot we can OK well we'll we'll fix for the 10th Um Forte said The ninth city clerk said Good point That was The 10th or the 11th I I know that 
that's when I start having my my council member readings for the next week Um so we gotta balance that as well Um but the 10th or 11th might be the 
best candidates I think we have So Um Mayor if it's OK with you Um we'll go ahead and uh reach out to the 
council and suggest those and counsel can get back with us through 
that method that we've been using recently That sounds good OK So It's like consensus clear Okay Thank you We're at 10 o'clock Um if we want to do reports 
we will need a motion to extend Excuse me Mayor I'd like to just make light of one thing on the July council meeting Let us extend and then you can 
have the floor one second OK I need a motion to extend Oh 
OK I'll make a motion We extend I second the motion got a motion by mayor Pete second by Councilor Jackson The Clerk Council member Davis Council member Jackson or mayor pro Tim Callum Mayor Morrison or council member Willis against John Uh my apologies Mary I 
thought you were ending the meeting That's why I said that 
Um no just don't wanna bring light to July council meeting has two major things that could be time consuming the budget and the city manager's 
evaluation It's all I want to say Make a conscious of that OK Yeah Reports Yeah I'd like to I'm sure I think most of you got an email 
from League of cities if not from the city clerk that 
you do not have to do a form six There was an injunction 
form but your form one is due July 1st Thank you There's There's a correction that July for ones due July 15th they they extended that to the 15th because they could not get the portal readjusted perform One The League of cities I think Thank you Councilor Jackson Willis Any reports Councilman Um yeah I Last month I attended the uh Central Florida safety strategic planning meeting and um was a Panelist for the F DOT on uh safety Uh with five other district five people and um I discovered that Cape Canaveral Take safety far more serious Than other communities between the sheriff's Department and city staff Uh And their response to the public It's way above the other people who represented on that board So I I was very proud of the city and the things that we've done Um Also attended the uh Disaster 101 for senior officials and that was very informative And if 
they ever do that again I would suggest it um for a council members because they dealt with FDEP and FA and how to go about navigating that and they also handed uh gave out Some checklists or quick reference sheets for uh Public officials about hand everybody one on how we can help And How we can get in the way So Uh it was it was very informative And uh I also graduated from Florida League of city's advocacy course so Congrats Yeah Yeah well yeah so that was uh That was informative as well So uh we can do a lot more So 
Thank you thank you Council member Jackson Completed the Florida League of Cities I AM E a course for elected officials So I went to um down south and took that That was interesting I also went through a symposium with the state uh Florida Department of Emergency management For disasters and of some of the credible threats in today's world I have some materials that I would like 
to share with council I'm Also I discussed with Zach that I wanted to share with him as well Um one of it one of the courses that I took that was really helpful with continuity of government and I did get our loss Mitigation plan from Lexi So I'm going through simultaneous To identify any gaps that we may have So that um staff is aware of it and also trying to identify anything new from Florida State for emergency management planning So It was very interesting a lot of information And uh It was it was a very interesting uh conference to be at so I'm looking forward to sharing 
that I'll have some manuals for everyone Thank you Mortem Um yes I attended a community outreach of Cape View Elementary um at the rec center Um and they talked about their losing their funding for title one and the things that they need Um they 
are getting some extra money from Brevard County for 
certain things but You know the affordable housing Uh problem in our city and um is really gonna affect that school Um you know working people can't afford those apartments that Rocky was talking about which really affects KPU Elementary So Um but they are looking for mentors um to come to the city or or to the school and um speak to the Children and um be part of their 
launch Have lunch with Kids and things like that But Um in the future We really need to think about How we can keep keep you open So It was very interesting And um as as far as the VFW is is uh doing a Christmas in July benefit for Cape view where we bring in um food supply at school supplies and other things 
they need but it was a very interesting um Outreach That's it You The City manager Uh coffee with the city manager 
this Friday at 10 at Vanity Sanctuary Park Thank you and thank you for continuing to do that Have you ever missed one Um I think we didn't do one in after Christmas Remarkable Yeah Thank you for that Consistent I know that's not easy Uh city Attorney City clerk Anything I'm good Commander crack any reports from Precinct anything we should know Thank you very much and thank you for all you do I have uh one report Or two Cocoa Beach high school graduation this year I I had a Calendar in a communication mix up Take responsibility for this Um I've went to that the last two years It is by far one of the coolest things uh to have the opportunity to do and to see those kids and uh I wasn't able to make it this year And So Um I should have sooner Uh notified another council member but unfortunately we were all in a 
council meeting that night And so my hope is that next year 
I catch that we can catch that Uh that's such an important date and uh I really really regret that But I just wanted to to use this as an opportunity to to to apologize Um Those are cape View Uh graduates taken life to that milestone It's such A huge event and you know council meetings are so important but If you you can You could figure out a way to make 
that work There's only one night to graduate and uh should have 
at least um if I couldn't have made it Mayor Pro Tem I know or any 
other council members could have been able to support and be there and so That's that but most importantly 
congratulations to the graduates Um keep you in and Cocoa beach heading off wishing in the absolute best Um And The Last thing is a big thanks Uh to city staff and all who are involved to get the state of the city 
out Um thank you for your patience with me and uh I very proud of it It looks awesome Um And social media All Those things look really good And I know that that is not easy Um And So hats off Uh getting 
that out And so for those of you who are listening in or 
watching this meeting afterwards Go check out the state of 
the city It's a lot of cool accomplishments that we've been 
able to do as a council and and as a team here at the city and and uh That's it So with that There's no other reports Let's do a motion to adjourn 
I make a motion we adjourn I All right And Right there 
Anthony I can end it right Meeting at Turnour You told me that thank you