city council special meeting today is Monday 
April 22nd 2024 I call this meeting to order   this time council member Willis 
would you please lead us in the pledge pledge allegiance to the flag of 
the United States of America and to the   Republic for which it stands one nation 
God indivisible withy justice for all thank you please call the role council member 
Davis here council member Jackson here mayor   protm Kellum here mayor Morrison here council 
member Willis here thank you all for being here   and again thank you all for joining us today 
here at Chambers and online participating with   that today is a special council meeting and 
we do have the approval of agenda as written   or with amendments uh we have one item for 
discussion Council any changes or keep it   as written if so looking for a motion to approve 
agenda as written I'll make a motion we approve   agenda as written I'll second got a motion by 
mayor Pro Tim Kellum second by council member   Jackson to approve the agenda as written any 
further discussion seeing none please call the ro oh I'm sorry four or we at at the public participation 
portion in the meeting if you did intend to fill   out a card please bring one forward I do 
have one here first one is from Peg schaer different perceptions thank you um but we've 
agreed on that so I just want to thank the   council and particularly Todd for working so 
diligently um with me to get this right we   last meeting reviewed the amphitheater and what 
a great space that's going to be with food trucks   and a place for Neighbors to gather and to walk 
their dogs and to play with their kids kids and   that is going to come at a big cost that's going 
to be a big cost of your time because that's going   to be a lot of reviewing that's going to be 
a big cost of taxpayers dollars because that   takes it and I am super excited about it but I 
also provide an amenity to the city that didn't   cost taxpayers a cent but it is costing your time 
and I just want you to know how valuable it is to   have your time I want to continue to be uh an 
idity in our city so when you go to a meeting   like this you think gosh we're still talking about 
this we're still doing this this is a pro this is   a fraction of what other amenities in the city 
are going to cost you so I appreciate your time   and I appreciate uh the council's willingness to 
make sure we get this right because it's super   important for our city that we are on the right 
track supporting not only businesses but my tax   help pay for the other amenities that I 
would like to see in the city so thank   you for your time and effort and I don't 
want you to think that gosh this this is   a waste of time we're beating a dead horse 
this is absolutely not a dead horse this is   vital to the success of our city thank you 
thank you that concludes any uh physical   cards if you did intend to speak please raise 
your hand okay seeing No Hands raised those   of you who are online we ask this same if 
you do intend to speak please raise your hand seeing No Hands raised we'll go ahead 
and close public participation portion of   the meeting bring it back to the one item for 
discussion which is to review of community and   economic development department roles respons 
responsibilities and discuss actions proposed   to resolve current issues for properties 
located on Filmore and Jackson Avenue um   today we have the opportunity to talk about 
this again when it was originally put on the   agenda back the broadcast is now starting 
all attendees are in listen only mode the   uh January 24th special meeting we brought an 
issue forward that really did have the intent   of improving the city uh making it uh better and 
learning uh really within the building department   in Code Enforcement to specific instances uh 
to get it right and we are tracking through   that process today um and my hope is to break this 
into two spend a little bit of time on Filmore and   then move to Jackson uh and so the as far as any 
agenda items I did pres uh reprint the um original   January 24th update that we received in March it's 
an identical copy of that I'd like to distribute   that to the council so this was the informational 
item number nine in the March uh council meeting I do have one more we need it and so the when we look at these two projects or these 
two properties um my hope today is that we can   start with number one spend his as as much time 
as as we need to try and and receive an update   and see anything that's changed from the last 
March meeting and then uh I certainly if Council   or uh City staff would like to to provide any 
comments that would be helpful as well and to   try and move through these as expeditiously as 
possible with an emphasis on item number two   when we get there of the engineering report 
um I if we could have um the opportunity to   ask questions and to do a review of that 
that would be where I think time uh spent   on that first one would be most impactful and 
then continue to item three four and five and so it's 108 now and so perhaps after an hour we do 
a we do a hard stop and then try and shift over to   Jackson so we can all get back to our days and uh 
work on making progress so with that I do want to   pause Council the goal to go through one through 
five on Filmore in the exact order provided work   with staff on any updates ask any questions 
and we'll move through them does that sound okay uh it said the emphasis on item 
number two I believe kimley horn was   going to be very um supportive to help with 
the engineering report they Pro provided and paired okay um before we start city 
manager thank you for being here   um I appreciate your time and and all those who 
who are with us on behalf of the City of Cape   Canaveral do you have any comments or concerns 
with starting number one through five and and   working off that last update thank you mayor and 
I wasn't sure I was going to be able to be here   I was quite ill yesterday I'm still a little bit 
wobbly today so if I bolt out that door that's why   I'm doing that and I apologize if that happens um 
I don't have the one through five in front of me   that you're looking at maybe if you have copies 
that could be distributed one more there you go thank you um and the only other thing I was 
going to add mayor was um I do appreciate Miss   schaer um for spending your time with me to 
go through this I know it is taking a lot of   your time away from your personal life and your 
business to go through these things but together   we are moving forward on a lot of important 
clarifications um and I feel very confident   as she does that we are getting to the bottom 
of things for the actual truth that they are   one of the things I've always said there's three 
sides of every story your side that side and then   there's the truth and getting to that truth 
that last part that we can all agree on yes   that's what happened that is where we begin to 
make corrective actions happen and we're very   close to that we are there on a couple of them 
actually I think there like six enumerated items   I think half of them were there the other ones 
when I met with her last time she threw additional   information at me that was very helpful that 
I hadn't focused on on prior I'm going to be   digging into that this week with staff um and 
I suspect that all of that will be ready for   um what I'm requesting is uh city council meet 
again on the reserve date of May 7th to review   the report of findings not only on Jackson Avenue 
but also on Filmore Avenue at that point I feel   very confident that I will be there that third 
side of the story on every item mayor thank you   the May 7th is the reserve date yes uh for 
city council meeting would it be helpful if   that date I think that's a great idea um to 
come back and and meet is that what you're   yes sir shooting for to to review the report of 
findings in detail Council does that work for   you because we could get that out of the way now 
and go ahead and schedule that next meeting I'll   make a motion we do schedule that meeting to allow 
the city manager to complete his findings and his investigation I'll second got a motion by 
council member Willis second by council member Davis any further discussion on the 
May 7th meeting what time um I'm fine   with u Kim is 4:30 too early for you 
that's fine 4:30 could work and and   mayor just to clarify that will cover 
both Phil Moore and Jackson findings 4:30 pm May 7th covering uh Phil Mor and 
Jackson with a report of findings now from   that report of findings I expect that we'll 
be very far along also on uh conclusions and   recommendations but a formal conclusions and 
recommendations would follow that at another   date thank you okay any other discussion 
Council city manager no sir please call the vote council member Davis four council 
member Jackson four council member Kellum   four mayor Morrison four council 
member Willis four thank you with   that um bringing it back here to this 
item I think that's going to speed up   uh obiously the findings is a part of this 
report but but starting with Filmore Avenue um the summary here is helpful which staff 
worked on and provided and to reemphasize   that the January 24th 2024 City count special 
meeting Council reviewed the community and   economic development roles and responsibilities 
and discussed actions proposed to resolve the   current issues for properties located at 304 to 36 
16 Filmore Avenue and 11610 Jackson Avenue this is   the status update uh of these items starting with 
304 to 316 Filmore Avenue item number one was to   obtain and distribute to the city council a 
building permit inspections report showing   date type of inspection and disposition and in 
the case of failed inspections cited codes and   any inspector notes this report applies 
to all codes applicable to all permitted   construction performed at 304 306 314 and 316 
Filmore Avenue including bu building official   statement that all necessary inspections were 
ultimately approved um so this first one here   I think this the update that we provided from 
staff was C attachment to attachment to uh was a bsna generated report that showed um 
property information permit information uh   inspections comments and I think that city 
manager is this one one that you're saying is   complete I I think that it's from my perspective 
from that date it was complete yes sir Dave is   any are there any changes this no changes to 
that so I recall this item included a request   for the building official to make a written 
statement I'm going off memory I don't have   benefit of what the council has in front of 
them um and last time we spoke about this the   the building of this this question was raised 
and I indicated that I was not going to speak   on behalf of the building official but that 
uh more than likely he would not be willing   to um make that written statement and what 
was being requested until the project was   completed and so I don't think that has 
changed either thank you okay thank you uh Council are there any comments 
after that update it's um if so   please no particular order for item number one Mr Mayor yes sir I would think any clarification 
that would be made would be made in the city   manager's report if there is any so I am I am 
satisfied with waiting for that report to clarify anything I think that for this one this is what 
was provided at the March meeting is the building   permit inspections report and I think it's 
complete other than the uh statement from   the building official is that that's my 
understanding as well so we've received   that report and I'm asking is I don't 
mean to speak for council member Willis   I perhaps he might clarify that if there 
is anything additional to be clarified   it will be clarified in that report coming 
forthcoming in the findings report yes sir okay um thank you very much any 
other comments Council on this one the next one is item number two uh obtain an 
engineering report of existing site conditions   and a review of all site related permit 
documents submitted by Allen engineering   and former city engineer John pakar for all 
site related permitted construction performed   at 304 306 314 and 316 Filmore Avenue approved 
plans letters and calculations the purpose and   scope of the report is the intend is intended to 
ensure that the original design as revised meets   or exceeds all applicable city codes related to 
site development including but not limited to the   onsite storm storm water drainage system and its 
connection to the municipal storm water drainage   system the report shall note any improvements 
which deviate from original plans and indicate   whether such deviation complies with city code or 
if not recommendations for modifications necessary   to comply with city code note particular attention 
shall be given to a revision related to the   municipal storm water inlet and the driveway of 
30 six Filmore a to which the on-site storm water   drainage system is connected in the original plan 
a new storm Inlet was to be located to the east of   the old original Inlet but the revision called for 
the Old Inlet to remain in its original location   a connecting pipe size was changed to accommodate 
the response uh at the March meeting we received   from city is kimley and Horn Associates Ka 
proposed proposal for Civil Engineering Services   was approved on February 20th 2024 uh C attachment 
3 which we did uh have and it was provided staff   walked the site with K engineer on February 
26th and the engineering report at the time   is forthcoming and the proposal was forwarded to 
Council on February 21st city manager any comments   or updates I think since then we've talked about 
this we've received the uh final report I believe   we were working on an executive summary yeah 
yeah that's correct and it might be helpful for   the council and the audience to know that we have 
created a spreadsheet we call it a tracking list   of all things related to Filmore that gets updated 
a couple times a week and distributed to council   that includes this item as well as all the steps 
through completion uh so that is a public record   it's available but everything that's happened to 
date as as the days progress we put new entries   in there uh and this one included entries for um 
the first draft interim report that came through   and then it was rvis to be clarified a couple 
things and the and the the final or that revision   to that interim report was finalized uh staff was 
preparing um I'm going to call it a layman's terms   summary of all that I don't believe that was 
distributed yet Dave no we were waiting to have   an opportunity to meet with you and go over the 
final draft for it's distributed but uh but Kim   leorn is here today and I'm sure they're capable 
of delivering that layman's terms draft verbally   and but we'll be glad to follow up with that other 
one as well sir thank you and thank you kimly horn   and your team for being here today uh Council any 
comments I would like to to have the opportunity   to talk through the engineering report and some of 
the major findings uh before doing so if willing   U thank you Lexi um I think that report was 
emailed by you to the council recently I don't   have five copies of that but so kimly horn is 
here today we have Kyle Cosby who authored the   report and Tucker Hunter who helps oversee 
the office that we work with for kimley horn   they did bring copies of both um so the report 
itself is about 100 pages so we didn't print   five copies of that today we did however print 
the memo so that was originally drafted by Kyle   as well as um the approved design plans the 
approved ads builts um and then uh and Kyle   also prepared a presentation just a few slides 
and that was printed as well so you'll have it   on your screen in front of you um you'll have it 
printed uh and then I know plans can be a little   bit hard to see on smaller screens um so just 
Kyle's going to do his best to kind of Click   through it and and you know if you have any 
questions feel free to reference either the   printed copy in front of you or the screen and he 
can he can kind of walk through that but he's here   to kind of give an overview talk about the report 
and answer any questions thank you that sounds   excellent Council and uh obviously between now 
and the February 7th meeting if any more questions   come up we can potentially work through them then 
thank you Lexi I think that's a great Next Step thank you good afternoon mayor council my 
name is kby I'm a professional new yor   Associates I prepared the uh stormill so just a brief project 
overview of the site site here   what's constructed two duplex buildings 
and in the middle of those two buildings is in the middle of the two buildings is going to 
be the outfall structure that we refering to in   this presentation and then as the mayor alluded 
to earlier that the inlet to the south of the   driveway that's the inlet question where have the 
connection of the the outfall structure into that existing so what I wanted to kind of go over 
just u a brief timeline uh we got so the project   was approved back in 2020 um construction Co 
certificate occupy was was released in 2022   uh City contacted uh in January um of this or 
this year and then we would prepar the task that   task was signed in February 20th uh I performed 
initial site visit of the site I'll get to that   later about what I was able to see um and then we 
prepared the initial report in March 15 and final   that you guys have in front of you was April so 
the scope of the task were just briefly was to   uh perform site visit to review existing Editions 
want to state that the existing site when I went   out there there was FPL that was performing work 
on the power pole was in the back there so kind   of disturbed some of the area in the back um 
I was to review the project documents upload   VMA which is the city's PR portal and then compare 
the as buils with the approved plans and identify   any deviations that that were notified and then 
prepare a storm water memo summarizing findings   recommendations based off the approv plans 
that were approved in 2020 and the city code so as you guys have in front of you guys have the 
approved plans I just want to uh just kind of go   over a couple design elements of those approved 
plans so as you can see in the approved plans uh   the retention area wraps around all sides of both 
buildings and then it that water will collect into   a yard drain which is the outfall structure a 
24 in outfall structure that then will convey   through a 12-in pipe to a proposed um Inlet That 
was supposed to suppos to be between the two   driveways and then that was going to connect in 
with an 18inch pipe into the existing Municipal uh Inlet now I'm showing the as builts and as 
you can see in the as builts um you can see   there is the pipe connection tying directly 
into the existing Inlet as opposed to having   the connection to the proposed Inlet and then 
connecting in um also note on the as builts is   that the retention area bottom is actually a 
foot higher than what the design plan's called   for so the design plans called for the bottom of 
the pond to be at elevation eight and it was at   elevation nine part the as builts uh there's 
also some some information just missing from   the as builts like you can't clearly tell where 
the um the top of the retention area is begins   to collect water so part of my site visit was to 
determine you know where the the retention area   extends because all that's picked up is just the 
kind of flow path of the retention area and then   you can see here the yard drain is is what that 
was constructed was a 12 in as opposed to the 24 in so just briefly during my finance 
investigations I have some photos I took   on site I just want to go over the approved 
plans um based on the approved plans that   I saw in the in the calculations prepared by 
Al engineering um they state in their report   that they're not meeting the water quantity 
requirement for the city and what that means   in layman's terms is that they're discharging 
more volume and runoff than the precondition so   when the site was undeveloped it had a certain 
amount of runoff and discharge that was it was   entitled to and in the proposed condition they're 
discharging more it is a minor increase but it's   still it's still an increase in discharge the 
runoff rates and the volumes um and then when   I went out to the site visit as you can see 
here on the first photo in the upper left hand   corner you can see that FPL power pole you can 
see the Disturbed soil kind of in the retention   area there and you'll see I'm actually kind 
of standing exactly where that yard drain is   located um but when I went and iness the site 
it appeared that the constructed retention the   retention system that was out there to date 
did not match the approved plans um the like   I mentioned earlier the bottom elevation per the 
as builts uh was as elevation nine as opposed to   eight which means there's less storage in that r 
rtion system um and then the retention area width   kind of varied um from section to section when I 
traveled back in the rears it wasn't a consistent   width the approved plans had a 12T top width 
of uh basically a retention area which is the   sale that we're talking about and there was just 
inconsistencies with the width there were some   sections where it was six some sections where 
it was eight so it didn't match the approved   plans also like I alluded to earlier the outfall 
structure was a 12-in that was constructed but per   the approved plan PL of 24 in outfall structure 
was supposed to be installed uh the also the   rim of that outfall structure was set lower to 
Elevation uh 9.12 instead of the 9.25 and what   that does is it allows water to get out faster 
right when you have a high when you have a higher   bottom and a lower weer elevation essentially 
you have less volume so that causes water to   kind of go out faster um and and then so on the 
as builts they didn't have enough information   they didn't provide information on the size of 
the pipe that was running to the existing inlet   at the driveway so I took a measure down photo 
that you can see on the lower right hand corner   to confirm it was actually a 12-in pipe per the 
design and then as I stated earlier that proposed   type-c structure was not installed instead 
that 12-in pipe just ties directly into the inlet so recommendations since this project was 
approved the plan was approved Kim Horn recommends   that the storm water management system should be 
reconstructed to be consistent with the approved   plans and that means the retention area and piping 
associated with it um and then new asil should be   provided once the storm water management system 
has been reconstructed with adequate de details so   that we can ensure that those plans are consistent 
with the approved plans the as bolts and then any   further modifications to the retention area should 
be reviewed by City staff to ensure that the peak   discharge rates and runoff volumes don't further 
increase and that the water the treatment volume   is still provided um and then remedies for the 
existing Inlet is to basically install that type-c   structure um and modify the existing structure 
per the approved plans and the approved plans   that existing structure was supposed to be raised 
up slightly and then and then covered so that it   was consistent with the driveway slope and then 
if that's not if that's not able to be if that's   not feasible um then there is some option to regr 
ra the driveways of lots two and one and two and   then raise the existing Inlet tad just making sure 
that that's still a low point in the road because   that collects the drainage from the road and then 
you can smooth out that slope transition from the driveway and that's basically it 
I just wanted to kind of go over   briefly and then I'm here to answer 
any questions be happy to all right   thank you very much I appreciate it I 
do have a question um the review of Mr   uh the former Engineers letters was that a part 
of the scope yes there was three letters that were   in the PSA that was I had access to one letter um 
he the previous engineer approved the design plan   back in 2020 and then there was another one where 
he reviewed the let me see here let me pull it up so yeah on December 2nd 2020 the the previous 
city engineer approved the uh site plan basically   reviewed the updated site plan and recorded 
plat for Filmore town homes and recommended   City approval for each and then on August 5th 2022 
um he reviewed the record drawinges uh that were   submitted by Allen engineering and he noted 
um kind of similar deviations that I've noted   in my report so he noted that there appeared 
that the cross-sections um were inconsistent   um he also um noticed that the bottom elevation 
was higher than the design and recommended that   the engineer should approve this construction 
Ure that does not impact the drainage storage   calculations so that make sure there's still 
enough volume per the design um he noted the   uh the that the plans indicated the 24 top the 
24 structure outfall structure as opposed to   the 12in and then on August let's see here 
and then August 17th is when the cosos were   issued for um the 316 and 314 Filmore AV 
sites and then um the cicpc was issued on   October 6 for 306 and 304 and then on December 
let's see no that's the same one on on let's see there's also a letter in there from 
the previous engineer where he went to the   site to look at the existing conditions 
and noticed that the construction the   constructed swell retention area didn't 
match of the approv plans yeah that was I think that was uh October the day 
before the cosos was issued October 5th okay   and that was the final one that was the final 
one I saw as well yeah and so was there any um I guess verification or any issues with the 
review of the prior City Engineers recommendations   uh was there any that was being recommended by 
the former city engineer that kimley horn today   would in their findings not align with or see 
the same way no so no I I agree with what John   M put together but I don't have information on if 
Allen engineer and responded back to those those   demands or those comments that the city engineer 
had and from your field observations some of those   did not yeah happen yes that's correct and the as 
builts the timing I assume you review obviously   the as built bus the timing of the as Bill uh 
that first letter from Mr uh parar that you   referenced on August 5th 2022 was that looking at 
the drawings of the as built um that's that's what   he appeared to reference I don't know if that 
was the exact copy of the record draw lines or   if he had a previous version but it said that he 
reviewed the Allen engineering record drawings   for the Villas at more and he noted similar 
deviations that I noted thank you very much um so the approved plans when you it references 
the approved plans vers the revised plans yes is the revised plans the as Bill or the 
revised plans would be once fpl's done with   removing the power pole that the retention area 
get reconstructed back to the original approved   plans so the in goal and recommendation of 
kimley and Horn is to do these things to to   get it back to the original plans because 
that was the major pain point for I think   the homeowners that I spoke with is that they 
want the uh home to match up with the original   engineered drawings and if those recommendations 
are followed from the scope of what you focused   on they will result in matching up y okay counts 
any other questions that's all I had at this time   I have one yes please when you went out and took 
a look at the back area the at I believe it's 306   okay and the one next to it the in between 
that has the drainage drain in there that's   12 in literally the swell doesn't line up yeah 
no and from what I'm seeing on the as built um   and then what it should the approved plan that 
should line up correct what you line up the uh   the actual there's a ditch yeah that actual ditch 
that's a swell for drainage yeah it should align   up with the asilt but the asilt doesn't have a 
lot of information on it doesn't show you the   profile of that sale it only gives you the flow 
path so um there was no way in determining what   that what that um cross-section looked like 
when the as was submitted but I can tell you   what the cross-section looked like when I 
was out there just doing my field review   there could have been a difference okay so if 
they go by the as built so would you re are   you recommending they go by the asilt or the 
original plan I'm taking it the original plan   origal approv Plans by all engineering y okay and 
um then also that 12in drain versus a 24 in drain   there's literally it's really the swell is really 
low compared to where the drain is so I'm taking   it it's that's for it to get to a certain 
elevation before it drains over into the storm   system yes that's the treat the water yep it's um 
St John's requires the first flush of runoff so   when runoff hits pavement or roof it collects um 
dust and debris and plant and so you need a area   for that first flush water runoff to generate go 
to clean up and then it can d Char out clean water   okay thank you Mr Mayor I have a quick question 
on the uh I visited the site but I don't remember   exactly if the pavers on the as built match up 
with the pavers on the preferred plan it looks as   though some pavers are going to have to be removed 
in order to fulfill the as uh the uh preferred plan on the on the side yes because of the 
because of the retention area coming more   it's it's actually going to be further south now 
I can see what you say yes looks like there might   be some modification papers okay how much of an 
impact would that have because I don't know if the   homeowners are happy with the paver or not I don't 
know the um impact it would be the pavers that   are north of the doors so it looks like it's just 
these papers here that would be going away on both   sides of the units for to be able to reconstruct 
the retention Pond to match the approve plans okay thank you mayor protim any question question 
council member Davis okay thank you very   much I appreciate your time and and all the hard 
work you put into helping us thank you City yes   I was city manager I just wanted to clarify 
because I don't think we'll be hitting this   in the steps document that you have here that 
the uh we did meet with a contractor and he   was instructed to um follow kimley Horn's 
interim draft report precisely including   there's two options there pick one of those 
options whichever option he chooses he needs   to comply with the conditions of that options 
but that requires a revised document uh that   plan is going to be the responsibility of the 
contractor to obtain that plan and he has been   striving to get that revised document from Allen 
engineering not quite sure what the status is of   that maybe Dave has an update but the purpose 
of getting that revised plan I want to make   very clear for the record that will be the 
document that accompanies the permit the city   issues to reconstruct the Swale and do all 
corrective actions that is forthcoming is that's   in the contractor the ball is in the contractor's 
court right now to get that revised document bring   it in get a permit application going we'll review 
it it'll be sent to kimley Horn for review if you   approve it then and there's no other comments we 
will issue that permit and the reconstructive work   can happen from that point mayor thank you and 
those were when we go to the kimley horn recommend ations the revision on is that mentioned guess where does that come from the   options listed there I don't have 
it yeah I'm on um page five the recommendations okay the last existing Inlet 
remediation options one and two really this   whole whole page they need to comply with mayor 
yeah it's it's basically all the recommendations   and the recommendations break it down into 
each kind of system so you got the retention   area you got the yard drain you've got the 
um Inlet those are kind of like the three um   things that make up that storm water system 
so we gave recommendations to mitigate each   but the long story short is just referring 
back to what was approved by the city back in   um 2020 and keeping as close to that design 
as possible so I wasn't involved during the   design and perming of the original um approved 
plan so I don't have the answer to why it was   constructed the way it was constructed opposed to 
you know aligning with the approved plan so there   might be some input from Allen engineering they 
say hey we couldn't we couldn't do that proposed   structure for XYZ so that's why that section 
that second option on the inlet remediations   there for you know possibly raising that Inlet 
up just slightly regrading the driveways so that   it's a better slope transition CU right now it's a 
pretty big um slope transition from that existing   Inlet to that driveway on that second option 
yep where is that gas line that would need to   be moved it as I'm looking at I'm looking at 
the proposed original plan yes so it's right   in between the Green Space when I was out there 
on the site I have a picture of it see if I can   pull that up but I had a picture of it it was 
basically right in the green area between the   two driveways there was a gas line flagged and 
there was a there was a waterline flag in that   area okay so um in between the driveways you 
said in between the driveways of um lot two   and lot three so between the two buildings 
perfect thank you that Y in that green space yep in in this report mayor just says either 
of those options are acceptable to meet the   city code and but one of them would conflict 
with the original design the one of them would   conflict with the original design that's if Alan 
engineer came back and said they couldn't they   had a tie structure right yeah and how would 
we approach that okay that that could be and   the the request of the owners is they want to 
uh get it back to the original design and so   if I understand in the event Allen engineering 
comes back and says they can't do that a new   design would have to be approved by the the way 
that this has been explained to the contractor   is that these are options available to the 
contractor to have the the plans revised to   show which option you're doing and then submit 
that for a building permit and review to kimley Horn okay and the owners will be involved in 
that um at this point i' I'd like to hear from   the owners on that um I don't know if the owners 
are here well I think if we're um the the request   to restore it to the original design if it can't 
happen I think if something else happens in their   yard they should have a say I think we're assuming 
that the the location of that box and that space   between the grass space is the preferred location 
and I would too I look at that and I say I think   that's the preferred location from a aesthetic 
perspective at least so I think um at this point   we should clarify mayor that it is our goal and 
intention that that be the preferred place for   it and if it cannot be then explain why it cannot 
be and then the other option is the second choice   can we all agree on that as the options yes I 
think it sounds like that's okay the two it in   both of them might be better than what exists 
today I don't yes know I think my my request   would be that the if the contractor says yes when 
we're on um other property where they may not have   uh a preference is appreciated and I think any 
other areas obviously they should be involved on   the findings and recommendations where it does 
fall within their property lines we'll be sure   to create correspondence to the contractor on 
that point Dave that there's a preferred option   A and if it's not available explain why and then 
option b is available Mr Mayor yes mayor per Tim   just have a question um maybe for Todd um how long 
will this take with the contractor to revise the   plan and and get this work done um permitting 
and all that kind of a crystal ball question   Dave I think you're closer to that industry 
than I am how long do these things typically take I are we talking years months no I 
wouldn't think years not years um again   that's a very difficult question to answer um 
it depends on the the contractor or excuse me   the engineer's workload um if if the contractor 
and the engineer are able to work out a mutually   agreeable business Arrangement um um you know 
we we cannot force the contractor to say you are   going to use Allen engineering it would it makes 
sense for them to use Allen's engineering because   they've got a lot of the work already done and 
it would you would think it would be expeditious   and and financially would be the way to go but 
um um so anyway saying all of that I mean I I I   would think that they could get something like 
this done within 30 days um well that's is as   a city we can't say okay this is what needs to 
be done and this is your timeline and I mean we   cannot say that no ask Anthony thatony can we do 
that tell them they have so much time to get this done um I think you can tell them that you would 
like a done byas certain time period but as David   indicated with respect to engineering and 
doing the necessary plans in order to get   the permit and then Kim Horn's permit review um 
you know that that that could take a little bit   I mean it's unpredictable um so I mean yeah 
certainly can try to get them to do it by a   certain time period but it's way has drove G 
forever yes we have and and I'll let uh the   mayor protm and the rest of the council know 
I've already been in communication with both   both the contractor and the engineer emphasizing 
to both parties the importance and the urgency   of these items um so and I believe that I've 
I believe I included that information in the   update in the in the task list that we sent 
out but I've I've stressed that item at least   several times to both parties on how important 
this is to come together um I you know I'm a   little hesitant to get too involved in the in 
the direct negotiations between the two parties   but I think from a city perspective I've I've 
uh I've certainly let him know how important   it is and how urgent it is and this all of this 
change and everything is on the contractors they   have to pay for all this not the a homeowner 
we we have not weighed in on that and talked   about who who's paying for what that's not 
really something we we typically asked for   we require a permit we require a contractor's 
number and we require this work to be done so it would be a negotiation 
between the contractor and the owners I think it's going to be well 
my understanding is that the uh the   the based on some comments I've heard 
from the contractor and the developer   that the the the financial obligations 
would lie somewhere between the two of them well I if the contractor didn't do 
the plan as planned why wouldn't he have   to pay to fix it but that's like a civil thing 
between private yeah parties which leads me to   a question of we've had this going on with 
Filmore and isn't this contractor working on   another project right now on Jefferson or 
one of the other streets which really now   makes me very nervous that we might end up in 
the exact same same situation we're in right now is is is he working on another one 
this contractor um yes and is that on   Jefferson yes multi-unit like this yes 
almost I'm not going to say the identical   project but very very similar have we 
been keeping an eye on that particular project yes in light of this one because 
it makes me it makes me want to leave here   right now and go out there and look at 
that one to see if we're gonna have the   same mess on our hands we share your concern 
and we're also looking into that okay thank you Council any more questions for Kyle kimley 
horn thank you again thank you so yeah my big   uh concern is just making sure that the property 
owners are involved in the decision making process   on which revision is really important um because 
I guess you're saying that's not needed in the   public right away where they are where the inlet 
is located that the homeowners I'm sorry I missed   the first part of the question what was that 
it's in the RightWay where the inlet is the   Sea on the southern end of the property yes that 
that would not require homeowners consent because   that's Municipal no I I think the homeowners 
if they're here tonight the message is clear   that option A the first choice is to relocate 
the storm Inlet to the Green Space Between the   where the mailboxes are and if it can't 
be for whatever reason explain what that   reason is and then option b is acceptable 
if they follow the recommendation of kimley horn okay yeah what I heard was that two 
options were recommended by the engineering   firm and the contractor will agree to do 
either option or is looking into that has   been clarified today as of today that's 
been clarified that they're going to be   directed to option A if not option A why 
not explain that we'll communicate that   to the homeowners and then they'll have 
no choice but option b okay um thank you any other questions Council on on this 
talking about item number two the engineering report okay let's move on unless any other comments from   our city manager staff none on 
this point no sir no sir thank you item number three was to request plans and 
confirmation on a date for FPL to remove overhead   lines and reinstall all lines underground 
consistent with the city code at the time   FPL did not due to security concerns FPL 
stated they generally do not provide El   El utility plans we learned that in in March n 
FPL has installed parallel underground service   lines which are energized Spectrum has begun 
removal of its overhead lines once they have   completed their portion of the removal FPL 
will remove its overhead lines I think this   has been this would be will be updated uh since 
the I think last tax task sheet showed this was complete city manager is this one that we could 
say is finished yeah I think we can check this   one off sir may I throw something in there yes 
please um I would not consider this Complete   because when they removed the pole they left 
around 2 and 1/2 ft of rusted rebar with the   broken in sticking up in the backyard which is 
a safety issue to me that should be definitely   handled it should not be sticking up where 
somebody could trip and fall on it FPL left it   or the I believe so I believe it was FPL when 
they came and took the poll out the owner can   uh verify that for us but so to me it is right 
by the poll and to me that absolutely needs to   be rectified are we familiar with this this 
the first time hearing about it sir Dave do   you know anything about it I'm familiar with 
it and I've already contacted FPL to rectify   the situation okay um and this is this may not 
even be our place but I'm going to make it a   ask anyway we need to put something foam uh tape 
something needs to go over that until FPL gets   out there and it may not be our responsibility 
but it needs to be um unless the City attorney   advisers otherwise I have no problem asking staff 
to put a couple cones and caution tape out there the attorney is less otherwise advised 
I mean it's a drainy public drainag for emergenc property owners don't like it they can 
all right thank you I'd also like to mention   something too on this item before we move on 
is that my understanding or my well my belief   is that fpnl worked outside of the public utility 
easement when they installed these parallel lines   I brought this to the attention of fpnl asked 
them to look into it um and that is not been   resolved to my satisfaction yet so that is a 
another item that is yet to be uh put to bed   and that was I observed over the weekend as 
well it looks like they went too far toward   the house with the with the utility easement and 
did not actually came through the yard for other   ones when it should have been out in the easement 
itself yeah I agree the the work looks like it   came too far south now that is just a that's 
strictly me eyeballing it I can't sit here I don't   I don't have benefit of a survey uh versus where 
the lines actually are located um but I've brought   that to their attention and I I gree Dave from 
what I observed and took a look at and that puts   you know that that's needs to be rectified by FPL 
as well simply because that is one of those things   where somebody could dig into a power line since 
it's in the yard itself versus in the easement yeah okay so this one uh I think some concerns 
on it being completed correctly with FPL are   understood and we're we're working towards I think 
those solving that those issues as far as the the   depth of lines being buried underground uh is that 
something that we follow behind FPL and and check   or do um CU that issue was raised I guess for 
the I don't know if it's the portion that from   the pole to the to the home and then with the sale 
and all the digging back there where does the city   come in to ensure those all underground is the 
covered properly the burial depth of underground   conduits is covered in the fpl's electrical 
service standards manual and they did this   work by their own contractors as I recall and they 
have the authority to do that in their easement   and they are allowed to do it without benefit of 
a permit or inspections from the city as part of   the franchise agreement I think that's part of the 
problem is that's why it's things are sticking out   of the ground so we don't have any authority to 
go in and and say you bury the the rear the wire   and uh your 6 in oppos to whatever 2T and you're 
in the backyard instead of the easement and see   that's the thing that I see as a big issue because 
um the power companies as well as cable companies   and those types of vendors they Mark where lines 
are located and where they install them and if   they don't install them in in the eement they're 
not aware they're there and when you need to dig   in your yard you call them to find out where the 
Lin are but if they're not in the spot that they   said they were going to be in then you have an 
issue with someone hitting it with a shovel and   go you know that having a safety issue from 
it so because of the fact they brought these   the the literally brought the infrastructure into 
the backyard versus their easement you know we've   got an issue but yet from my understanding as 
well we were never able even and you know when   I was working in this environment with commercial 
buildings we they told us where the easement was   versus us being able to Define it and that kind 
of thing so how we would go about notifying them   it's in the wrong spot I I guess Dave do you have 
any input on that well not not any more than I've   already stated here today um you know as as Todd 
said they work without the requirement of permits   and inspections because they have design standards 
and the right to construct to those design   standards in their franchise agreement but can 
if they do not follow their own design standards   does the franchise agreement state that they will 
follow the design standards and I I think I think   what I'm hearing is that there's a dispute about 
whether or not they follow the design standards   just wires sticking out of the ground and the the 
the question from the homeowners about the depth   throughout this whole process and how it's changed 
and whether or not um you know when they come in   to dig or alter the the storm water the Swale 
in the back that's right where the lines go   and so um you know I didn't read through all the 
details but in general it's were the lines covered   properly since this was just redone uh it just 
came to mind and okay I I I wanted to understand   our role and if it's a franchise agreement that 
has the design standards and we both signed the   franchise agreement seems to me we signed up for 
them to honor those and we could that would be   leverage yes sir I I think that could be a a 
review of the of the um franchise agreement to   say how we might dispute um an inst a particular 
installation is not in compliance with the design   standards that would um I would ask for Anthony's 
help on that how we go about doing that what our   rights are there and mayor Morrison one one thing 
that may work with this is since the easement work   has to be done for the so um and the drainage 
retention and all of that maybe uh requiring   FP to come out and mark the current locations of 
the cable will tell us and show them if it's in   the wrong spot if they go marking along the 
back part of the fence which is the easement   um I'm going to tell you what I saw it 
appeared I'm actually in agreement with   you Dave it appeared it went through the 
backyard at 306 versus 306 and 314 yeah   the two the two outside units I think the lines 
were maintained in the RightWay or excuse me the   easement but I think the two internal units 
may may be may have a problem it appears that   way but if we ask them to Mark those for the 
worker if the developer does um as one of the   steps that we need completed by him that may 
help us in determining where FPL thinks it is I think it's uh clear we' like to figure out what we can 
do when these issues that no one I think is   disagreeing with or physically visible and um 
concerning so I know our City attorney talked   about the franchise agreement and encouraging to 
make that a part of urgency and I know we waited a   while for them to to do the work they did and now 
here and it's got issues I think we all wonder is   this now going to be get back in line essentially 
and wait another month I I I think um in hearing   about all this today I think trying to think of 
the most logical way to approach this and I I   think it's a two-fold process Dave contact the um 
governmental Affairs person with FPL let them know   that there's been uh concern about the placement 
of the U Utilities in terms of their location in   or out of the easement but also the burial depth 
we'd like them to confirm that all is kosher and   the other one is Anthony looking at the franchise 
agreement and how we might approach this if we   have if we find that something is not Kosher how 
do we how do we what are our rights as a city   um if we find something's not in 
the right place or at the right depth I mean as as I noted I mean they are 
subject to the Public Service Commission   and Public Service Commission rules so the city 
does have limited some limited jurisdiction to uh   enforce certain things but if if it's not in in 
compliance with their tariff obligations um you   know if it's in a right of way the city obviously 
has more of a direct stake if it's on private   property and it's a service line on private 
property you know the private property owner   you know has some responsibility too to notify the 
power company regarding um problems that they see   on there on their particular property um you know 
in this particular case I'd have to look through   the franchise agreement I'm scrolling through 
right now um because the city did not establish   certain rules U for for Florida Power because it 
the city can't because of the preemption under   the public service commission's jurisdiction 
so I'd have to look at it a little bit more   detail but in terms of location that I think is 
more of a straightforward issue you the private   property owners too can notify F fppl if they have 
installed improvements that are outside of an EAS   because FPL just like any other utility 
needs to install their their utilities   within easement areas and if it's outside of 
the easement area then you know they need to   they don't have the right to be elsewhere so that 
that's a correction and then I suspect when the   when they go when the developer goes through 
and red do the storm water facility that will   trigger an 811 requirement right with respect 
to uh flagging you utilities as well um so you   know that's that's going to that that's going 
to happen as well um and they will regardless   of whether the utilities are in the easement 
or not they have to flag the utility where   they where they think that they're located 
and um if they don't do anything at the very   least when they flag 811 you'll find out where 
those utilities are located and whether or not   they're in the easan area um but hopefully 
they can resolve that issue before then yeah   I I this was verbal conversations but pardon 
because that'll that could potentially delay   yes um the redoing of the drainage SW because 
the utilities need to be properly located in   the right location at the right depth yeah 
yeah I in my verbal conversations with them   they indicated that they were going to get a 
survey crew out there to identify exactly the   the location of the easement versus the lines so 
whether they've done that or not I don't know but   it's certainly on their radar screen and they're 
aware of the issue is there and is it on the task   list for you to do continued followup on it will 
be put on the task list as of today okay to look   into this location and depth issue make sure FPL 
is aware of it ask them to verify location and depth okay okay are you any other comments from anyone that uh item number three of the five 
and the other two uh are really I think what   were what will we discussed and scheduled for 
May the 7th if I understand is number four   is utilizing the engineering report above to 
exercise available remedies to gain compliance   and identified city code related deficiencies and 
Report status updates to the city council and then   item number five well number four the last status 
to stay consistent from our city staff was that   awaiting a receipt of the kha engineering report 
I think we have that now so we can but but we have   identified a city code related um item that will 
be in that report of findings thank you any other   comments on number four Council seeing none item 
number five is city manager and City attorney to   present any findings Andor opportunities in a 
report to be distributed to the city council   and ways the city can improve our Community 
Development Department this is to be presented   at a future Council update is this something for 
May 7th or something after that's something after   um there's going to be probably multiple code 
revisions that come out out of this that and City   attorney and Dave Dicky and I have been talking 
about we think that there's this is a good time   to take advantage of this lesson learned to fix 
other things that could be those other trip spots   because the codes have not kept up with practices 
and duties and responsibilities I can't say we're   going to catch them all but I sure hope we do I 
think we got maybe coule our best shot yeah there   there's a lot in there that's just outdated there 
a lot that needs to get tweaked not more just more   than tweak needs to get changed I look forward to 
that I think in the order uh to summarize um item   number one uh is partially complete and uh I think 
the building official statement is something that   we're working through um the engineering report 
item number two is complete and uh we had a   chance to have a nice overview of that and and I 
think any questions as we uh dig into it will be   helpful as we watch this project um changes happen 
uh which is ultimately I think what we want and   then item number three uh the big part is finished 
but there's some loose ends uh with the condition   of the wire rebar sticking out and also um how we 
can uh utilize the PSC rules and our tariff or uh   to expedite and also verify you know what our what 
we can inspect what we what standard we can hold   to um and then four is going to be May 7th and 
five will be ongoing something we're going to work   through Council are there any other comments on 
uh these five for Filmore Avenue I have a question   yes okay so if the homeowner has some issues that 
are building related um how how what is the proper   mechanism for the homeowner so for example some 
railings that are not securely attached to the   floors on balcony um vents that are out of code 
on the roof things of that nature what is the   situation with that because I don't know what we 
would do in a case like that where we've already   issued occupancy permits but there's notable 
multiple other things that the property owner has   that did not get built out to the site plans such 
as the reten the reclaim water they were supposed   to get four connections they got one that's in 
one of them's yard that feeds all four um some   of those things that were not swell related city 
manager I I'm a recovering building contractor I   I was in the business for probably about 15 years 
and I can tell you and I'm also in my years in   project management it's always in the contractor's 
best interest to solve those with the homeowners   by just calling them up and say hey the thing is 
loose or it's missing a connection come out and   fix it and that's typically what happens um in in 
any case where um we we see a deficiency that is   um addressed by our code um is a Code Enforcement 
thing if we're called attention to it and I'm not   necessarily referring to Filmore Avenue but any 
place we go if there's a problem something's loose   there's a loose railing that can become a Code 
Enforcement issue uh with with owners to address   that certainly we don't want that to happen here 
I'd encourage the owners to work with the first   route which is with the contractor directly so 
if the vents on the roof were not of to code   that would be you guys that would they need to 
contact I I would think of if I was the builder   if there was something WR I don't know what the 
problem is but if I was a builder I would be   out there taking care of it especially if with 
within a warranty period okay okay thank you m   Dave did you have anything to add to that no sir 
okay so we're at 2:15 p.m. we got through those   first five I think we should take a 10-minute 
break recess we'll reconvene back on Jackson   and at the end if we need to Circle back to 
anything Filmore and Jackson collectively I   think we can we can do that but no one oppose take 
a 10-minute break reconvene it uh just before 2:30   start back then okay take a recess thank you I I'll I'll scratch the rebar pled lot e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e okay need call the meeting back to order it is 2:33 p.m. 
need to unmute the mics there we go thank you   and for those of you listening at home uh thank 
you again for tuning in we are in our uh special   meeting today uh going over the items information 
was provided back at the March 19th informational   only item regarding the January 24 2024 special 
council meeting uh we just got through uh on the   building side regarding uh Filmore Avenue and now 
moving over towards uh code enforcement side uh   regarding Jackson Avenue similar to Filmore 
we provided uh five tasks and uh I'd like   to go through the same and before doing so just 
emphasize uh the goal here is to uh become better   and to tackle an issue that has been a major 
challenge in this city for for years dating back   to the 2012 visioning and uh code enforcement has 
been a challenge and so um this has been I think   so far since January uh very informative and I 
appreciate the entire council's uh effort to to   stay on uh these tasks and try to see that they're 
through and so with 11618 and 120 Jackson Avenue   if you're yes council member Davis I just have 
a quick question earlier we voted that we were   going to wait for the findings from the city 
manager so why is there anything that we need   to go over today that he would not be able 
to find be have finalized on the 7th or are   I just want to know why we're discussing 
it when he's we're waiting for the report   from the uh city manager well the findings as 
the last time was item number four uh or item number yeah it talks about remedies and also 
findings in items four and five um but again   that's one to two items really related to five 
we have not received as a council and been in   the same room uh an intentionally placed agenda 
item to discuss the progress of all five and so   uh items one through five my goal was 
to get an update and then to continue   to provide these uh ongoing and with that 
we've scheduled a May 7th uh meeting to   tackle one of the five and so items were 
stated to be completed um but we have not   discussed I did express my my concerns 
with what we are considering complete   and some additional concerns on the uh the 
data that was provided and since then we've   had meetings that I've had the opportunity to 
be a part of and I know this Council has not   but we really haven't sat and went through and 
received uh uh an update since March or have   we really discussed it and so that's the goal um 
but I agree with you council member Davis that on   the findings portion of it uh I think city manager 
made it clear that it it was his intent to do both   Filmore and Jackson and I think we can move right 
through that one um which is get number five the last so with that item number one I'd like to 
go through is um to provide a report showing   all actions and correspondence related to code 
enforcement at 114 11618 and 120 Jackson Avenue   for the period from January 1st 2016 through 
January 24th 2024 the report shall include all   records available whether generated by the city's 
bsna Software System or any other record storage   method employed by the city's code enforcement 
department the city staff provided a response   to this item was split into two documents 
attach attachment 4 which was provided at the   March meeting includes an update for the requested 
enforcement activity report and it also says that   the following folder was created for us in laser 
fish that contains all of the responsive email   correspondant with the link on how to access that 
folder uh in laser fish uh my I think the comments   here is that we are I believe still waiting 
on what I would say is is a report showing all   actions because when I went in to see the these 
particular instances I think we've discussed the   issues and I think we heard today from miss schaer 
that she is optimistically working through them   and trying to overcome uh any concerns and 
questions and our city manager but the the   public records folder um if you've had a chance 
to go in and look at that it is very difficult   to understand what those items are uh and there 
are some limitations if you do not have Microsoft   Office email when you click on them I think 
you have to have some third party to be able to   actually view those records um and so that is what 
I would say is data that is to support the time   frame um and certainly requested but my hope is 
they take that in combination of the field notes   and the goal was to be able to see 114 16 18 and 
120 over that period in a report style format that   shows uh history and all actions taken and so I 
think that this is still very important um I also   think that this was the most attainable easiest 
win and what I'm saying is is what was provided   in March we are working to to revise and I want 
to make sure the council still believes this is   important this is not a matter of findings this 
is simply showing uh what the city's actions have   been on those addresses over that period of time 
and I hope we have uh a time where we can produce   this report quickly and I think by implementing 
uh these measures we'll be able to do that so   with that number one city manager if there are 
any changes in updates since then I don't think   this one is complete as of today but I believe 
is it fair to say you're working towards that with mic is locked and I can't 
unlock it I don't know why it's again yes we we will be providing a 
report and it will be a better report   than you received last time and um I will take 
responsibility for the failure to properly communicate thank you very much um Council has 
any other comments on on this particular task item on number one on item number one for the 
Jackson Avenue properties okay um I know that   our city manager will give an update but I 
think that is this one in regards to bsna   this this one is in regards to bsna and all 
records available for this this property the   report was meant to be a single location 
in report style format as clarified by the   mayor and it got bifurcated and it wasn't 
labeled as a report and I think that was   uh not well done and that's what I'm taking 
responsibility for we're going to get that correct all right the other thing um is on 
in and I discussed this with city manager   before but I think with any record that we 
have um that we're working a draft on we   need to Watermark those things so that we know 
what is a draft that's in currently in process   and what would be a final document mayor that 
is one of the points uh in my findings thank   you Miss Jackson um she and I had opportunity to 
discuss that and that actually will be one of the recommendations any other comments 
council member Jackson this time well I wasn't able to find the zipped files 
that we discussed I was trying to look through   and see what we see from a public standpoint 
as far as going through bsna and it's difficult   when you don't know some of the things some 
of the projects and that kind of thing that   the group's been working on but I would I think 
it would be having implement government systems   at state federal and local level um I want to 
continue digging through the system to see if   there's anything that I can find that I can add 
um input on as far as um what it looks like public   facing because typically government systems are 
very difficult to shift through find information   um and know what all is happening so I'm that's 
kind of an ongoing project for me to try to get   my hands around that I haven't seen any of the zip 
files but that's what resulted in the conversation   that city manager and I had about be having things 
Watermark is draft or final so that we know a   document is in process even for Council that may 
be looking in there in regards to a project that's ongoing yes and I think um in my time working 
through this the bsna software that we use is   downloaded on the computers but I think we 
have unlimited license uh which means we own   the software and put it on as many devices uh 
approved and it would be my request that city   council and our computers have access maybe 
it's there I clicked around could not find   it and have the same functionality so that we 
can quickly search uh the what I've been using   is the public facing side and uh it does not 
allow us to run our own reports uh view only   not suggesting to make any edits uh or anything 
like that simply a view only capability with some   um reporting functionality that we could we 
could utilize and see because that's I think   going to make us better and more responsive to 
the public um also mayor yes um when we go in in   the tech world and Implement systems into these 
environments uh and I'm not sure when we got BSN okay thank you I'm fairly new at this so 
um I'm not sure when that implementation   occurred but it certainly could have occurred 
with a contractor in place and so a lot of   times when implementations occur with technology 
into the government especially into government   environments the person that is on the vendor 
side implementing will go in with basic things   to make it as easy as possible because of 
the amount of records that are out there into   in the system the amount of database that they 
have to convert over to make it go live and   things like that it may be we may be at a point 
where we need to look at the functionality of   this and see if there are ways we can make it 
better because like I said usually with any   system implementer you're going in with basic 
things and it may be the right time to do an   evaluation of that and especially now that we 
have someone in it that's with us permanently   that gives us good resource of our own to get 
our arms wrapped around what functionalities are   we using are there any that we aren't that 
would make it easier for our public facing   interface on the web as well as the licensed 
copies that we have in place and also for all recordkeeping mayor if I could I think that's a 
good point um that kind of review of how we use   and want to use the sna we've learned through this 
investigation there were things on there that were   not helpful at all in fact there were things that 
were confusing that was on there um but we should   talk about what the purpose of having that as a 
public facing portal is to be helpful for people   and it should only contain information that is 
accurate and helpful in every regard we don't have   to see how the sausage is made nobody needs to see 
that but those actual official record documents   those field notes about I went out and visited 
the property on January 20th you know I I wrote   an email to the homeowner whatever those field 
notes and actual official documents are really   all we need to see on there that's what we care 
about that's how people can go in and look and   see what's there and I I think if we if we look 
at it through that lens let's just clean this   up and just move forward this way only thank you 
I am looking forward to that and I think it's uh   it it's going to be really helpful as we all adopt 
and and become users and more involved and so and   I'd welcome a training with the whole Council if 
if that would be appropriate so that we can learn   the basic functionality I've been selftaught but 
I'm talking about really on the even the reporting   side and and being able to look Beyond just a 
case you can look deep within one property or you   can look Citywide and if we can do that that's 
really helpful this would have been I think a   report in itself that would say you know on these 
addresses go back this part in time and you know   export all all actions and uh related files and 
so um I think the issue here was we we did not   receive what we asked for and the reasoning did 
not make sense but again and I'm happy we are   trying to overcome that and so thank you city 
council any other comments for this particular request okay with that we can move to item number two 
which is to create and distribute administrative   procedures reviewed and approved by our City 
attorney complying with with Florida state law   and city code to be followed by our city code 
enforcement officers this is to be presented in   a future city council meeting update This was 
um really about the procedures we follow today   obviously we have chapter you know 162 we've got 
our city code um administratively what are we what   are we doing uh internally to ensure that those 
are being followed understanding those and if they   need to be changed or improved um certainly making 
those uh so that we can move forward if there's   any update on this that would be appreciated 
sure I'm happy to report that there has been   a draft presented to me I have purposefully not 
begun my review of it and the reason is because   once I finished this investigation and my findings 
I'm going to be zero inning zeroing in on certain   specific things that I want to see addressed 
in that document and I'm going to read it with   with that lens on to make sure we're covering 
all those things and then I'll learn what other   things are in there so I see this kind of 
a as a next step after the findings report   for moving forward but as far as today do we have 
any administrative procedures that we follow Dave I think Brian and I C can answer that question yes sir as of uh today we have 
a flowchart that we utilize it tells each   code officer how to start a case how to 
run through a case and how to finish a   case we also reference as you said earlier uh 
Florida statute 162 governs everything that   we do and it references our city code 
and then our city code um adds to that 162 yeah I will add though that you know we've 
especially during this last month or two we've   been dealing in particular with the Filmore item 
I think there are gaps or at least gray areas in   those current Sops that we have procedural 
processes that need to be illuminated and uh   we will be doing that as as Mr Morley indicated 
we're going to be uh kind of focusing in on those   areas that perhaps are a little gray and uh that 
we may not run into every day so we're going to   be uh we're going to be addressing that to augment 
what we do have in place already mayor yes mayor   protim um is it can we get a copy of the flowchart 
so we can better understand how you guys work   absolutely that was um actually provided I think 
in the March meeting can you email it separately   to the council and copy me of course thank you 
thank you mayor proam and anybody on the council   if you have any questions once you get that and 
you have a chance to look at it just guess you   can give give Brian orai a call we'd be happy 
to talk with you or meet with you and help you out thank you so the administrative procedures 
I have a copy I don't recall if it was the last   meeting or if it was one uh back but this 
hasn't been anything that we have used as   a tool for the public to see what our process 
is so it's online and you can say here's how we   we operate to set some expectations for the folks 
who are the respondents on what's expected I think   this has been an internal document that as an 
idea would be good to not just email to us but   to make a public document and even duplicate it 
as something on the website in the appropriate   place that says here's here's how we follow here's 
what we do here and they can figure out where they   are in the process yes are you speaking are you 
speaking of the flowchart is that the flowchart   you're looking at yes this if that's theow chart 
that's um that that I believe that's already on   our website um okay I think it may be an updated 
version I'm not sure that's on our website it   updates every so often because of uh code changes 
and and stuff to that effect but um for the most   part it's there I do believe it is on the website 
I'll double check that and if it's not it'll be up   today yeah I'd also like to I'd also like to 
add that once Mr Morley finishes uh with the   standard operating procedures the the updated sop 
manual that will definitely be on the web page too   so we all understand we're all we all understand 
the process and the rules of the game so there's   no well I assumed this or I thought that or what 
are you guys doing um it's going to be right there   so everybody can see exactly what the processes 
are and time frames and expectations and to that   Point um this is something the mayor and I 
have talked about extensively for the last   two years actually is and more than that is about 
establishing metrics and I think that's where a   lot of this is going to come from those time 
frames if we establish a time frame from the   time that you know a complaint is made to the 
first visit from the time the first visit is   made to the time the notice of violation from 
the time the notice of violation to the time   goes to special magistrate if we establish um 
ideal time frames for those understanding that   you know you're going to have days people are sick 
believe me I know that you can't get out there on   that day but if you have the idea that hey we're 
aiming for a onewe turnaround for this and then   we have that capability and the reporting that 
the mayor's talking about in bsna to hey let's   look at that report did we hit that was it close 
or was it way out we didn't touch a case for a   year but this person we touched within 4 days 
you know that's the kind of stuff I want this   to be able to to hit on yeah totally agree 
I think I think that'll be really helpful   information for staff for me for Brian for the 
council for the city manager and for the public   yeah that's the kind of information that we want 
to see totally agree and we're doing that I mean   we're jumping into that now we've we've done 
a lot to um repair I guess the system and the   way we were using it um however we also have to 
keep in mind at all times that case each case is   completely different each case has a completely 
different time frame where one case could go a   year and those kind of explanation things should 
be able to be understood with a deeper dive into   the field notes about why this was this or why 
this was that understanding nothing goes like   clockwork ever there's always situations but it 
should be able to if if you if you run a report   and something comes up that should have been done 
in in two weeks and it was six months you should   be able to look at the field notes and say well 
here's why all these things happened and then a   reasonable person would say that makes sense I 
get that maybe it's about how we we trigger the   the clock each time and U I'm not sure how we're 
going to build that box but but we need to build   something that removes any perception that anybody 
could possibly be targeted or felt differently in   code enforcement and that's been the mayor's 
goal all along here and that's my goal as well   does this this flow chart this was something 
we created internally as a tool to to use but I   assume it has not got to our City attorney yet 
uh yes sir that was actually created by Todd   Morley back in a long time was the attorney then 
and she reviewed it and approved it and um since   then since then I've what what years she work 
for us was 0708 the original one when Kate Lor   was here yes that was one of my associates I mean 
that document it's old I but it's a basic flowart   process and I've updated it since like to include 
the magistrate for example to include the the   changes of it I mean it lays out a basic process I 
mean but every Brian said every case is different   also the complaint priority of a code enforcement 
case all those variables that go into valuating [Music] and man yeah I mean as an example that we 
have to allow for officer discretion if we   have a widower who has an issue with a IP 
a property maintenance issue and she does   she's living on a very fixed income um 
it's difficult for us to you know well   I'm just saying that everybody there's 
different circumstances and situations   that we have to work with um and if we always 
keep in mind that compliance is our goal then   that will play out I found it I mean you can 
read 162 in our code and uh or you can take five   minutes and read this you know and it visualize it 
and makes sense I think it's a very helpful tool   I think getting this updated and using it as our 
standardized procedure is really going to help and ultimately when we item number one 
was to request all the actions uh   for those properties and code 
enforcement that happened and   item number two is then to put it next 
to our administrative procedures and that's what I think will help provide findings 
and opportunities number five yeah in layman's   terms with what I think the mayor's referring 
to is there's there's some history out there   um what goes way back eight years maybe about 
things that it doesn't show that these things   were corrected we don't know why they weren't 
corrected or it doesn't tell the whole story   so when we have these documents together 
we can we can piece together that whole story okay Council we are on item 
number two uh create and distribute   administrative procedures reviewed 
and approved by our City attorney   complying with Florida law and City code 
to be followed by our Code Enforcement Officers procedure is pretty much what we're looking 
for City attorney no I mean I'll be I think   as Todd said I he's going to look at the draft 
and then I I'll help staff best I can with the   administrative procedures I also wanted to note 
that you you may recall that um in 2019 the   city code was substantially revised to amend the 
city's code to be very cons consistent with the   state law into um remove inconsistencies to try 
to streamline the code so you know that that was   done as well um and that's how you also went the 
special magistrate route as well so I just wanted   to just note that because there's been some work 
done in the code already and I don't think like   administrative procedure wise I'm I'm not aware of 
any code revisions that need to be uh made at this   point it's it's all more like administrative 
and operational right yes and that's why I   submitted the SOP because it's more of how we do 
it from A to Z yeah strictly administrative not I mean maybe that becomes a recommendation I think 
we're hearing early on not needed but thank you   anything else Council on this one if not we can 
move on okay so item number three for a city code   enforcement employees provide a listing required 
certifications training and ongoing continuing   education and Achieve certifications training and 
ongoing continuing education so again number one   we want wanted to get the facts on what happened 
over a period of time number two we wanted to see   what is our process or procedures and number 
three who are the the people um representing   the city going out uh as far as credentials 
goes that was uh I think provided senior uh   enforcement officer Palmer provided a a list 
for him and um officer Robinson uh my my only   uh question is is is there any required and this 
might have been answered ongoing education that   that is required um to maintain your credentials 
yes that's uh we have to maintain every two years   16 uh cus which is continuing education units 
and we have to obtain those every 2 years and   that's through there's different courses 
that you can take to obtain those um 16   cus in the two years uh Florida itself um there 
is no requirement to be certified to be a code   officer in the State of Florida okay however there 
is a requirement with the city to at least have   level one from our Florida Association of Code 
Enforcement which is uh abbreviated as face as   I spoke of um on the first meeting and um every 
um myself two of the code officers currently have   level one we have a new code officer who will 
be going to level one hopefully in the next   couple months uh we'll get him through uh so 
I currently have all four levels and the other   officer has three levels hopefully we'll get 
him his uh last one and um then we'll work on   the uh our newest and mayor I might add that 
I routinely see these performance evaluations   coming in with recommended proceed proceed 
with f uh face two or pH three as a goal for employees and so when you say level one is what 
our code requires but you're level four for a   lack of better words is that appropriate yes 
sir the different on the different levels um   like level one is um it's ad I think it's 
a code enforcement like basically 101 and   then you have an administrative section and then 
you have a field operations section C and then   um legal section I think there is uh so each uh 
level is your basically it's just your standard   and what you need to know when you get to the 
code enforcement at that point in time in your   in your career if you want to call it MH then 
after that it's all just keeping up with that   it's once you get to that point um it's keeping 
up with that um those those different things   so every time that you go through a class 
or you go through a course or we go to a   um uh conference sorry you you'll get that you can 
get that those those classes the same classes that   you got in your level one two three and four you 
can get those at the at the conferences or you   can the the officers can go online and they can do 
those classes online and they get recertified on   all of those classes the the the best part of that 
is they actually add more classes than what we   normally get in a standard level one or standard 
level to so now we can you know they can Branch   out they can get more involved with other stuff a 
little bit better education on um on your uh going   out and actually doing your um U investigations 
and stuff to that effect and I think at the bottom   of the agenda we it was talked about working 
towards uh our willingness to provide resources   for code enforcement and to to increase the staff 
or repurpose and I think that's something we're   going to be looking at in the budget we are and 
and just another sneak peek that I'm looking into   is um I intend to produce a uh an agenda item for 
the May council meeting that will be a proposal   from a company to provide thirdparty services 
in the code enforcement department uh this is   a company that does that they provide building 
inspection but also code enforcement um and we   would piggy back uh their hourly rate off of 
another Bard County City but my thought here   and when I shape this up and present it to council 
it will be um an opportunity for Council to meet   this individual or this rep individuals from this 
company ask them questions about who they are what   they do what Their experience is and and have them 
appointed a person in the code enforcement depart   Department who's there really to help us have an 
objective thirdparty view of how how we do things   in code enforcement in other areas and then learn 
sitting with the staff learning what operations   from the administrative perspective taking those 
notes and then talking with staff and say oh have   you thought about this have you thought about 
that what do you do for here and at the end   of that period coming and reporting to me here's 
what I see as best practices in the industry and   I would of course share that with Council and then 
want to take that document that would be worked on   collaboratively with code enforcement department 
and this company so now we've got a third-party   objective review of how we do things in the code 
enforcement Department that's a service that we   paid for it and I think that'd be depending 
on what it costs I think it'd be well worth   the money thank you I think that yes the ongoing 
education it I assume the city pays for that for   every two years to get your six sounds like about 
eight hours a year on average and there's a annual   conference and um I think as far as resources 
go there we are I am the at least thumbs up to   continue to support and it's a changing world out 
there new codes new ways of doing things and I   would say that this one um is complete uh it would 
be helpful and I think and still something to   Showcase is uh if willing and appropriate to put 
those credentials up on the website um because you   know when you read through these I believe they're 
continuing education certifications that you got   to meet the overall these are all uh things that I 
think uh short shed a positive light on the types   of Education our officers are going through um and 
with that I'm done with my comments but I would   say that this one is complete other than you know 
the dates that was the only thing but now knowing   every two years uh that makes sense and the third 
officer who will be pursuing level one is um it's   good so any other comments I just have one quick 
question for Mr Palmer is there anything else we   can provide is there any additional education 
any other tools that you need or you feel you   need we're afforded all we can technically go 
to any um class or anything that's offered uh   it doesn't have to be just in the realm of Code 
Enforcement it could be in an inspecting it could   be anything I mean we have that opportunity 
the city provides us that opportunity to go   to um basically any course that we really you know 
that that would benefit code enforcement of course   we don't want to go to you know something else 
but um yeah that's we we we the city gives us   the tools to do everything um sometimes we're 
a little low on man power but we may do okay   all right thank you thank you any final comments 
City Manager on this one thank you we can say that   one's complete which is excellent um number four 
uh distribute a monthly bsna report of all open   Code Enforcement cases and an annual report of 
closed Enforcement cases include other important   data provided by bsna such as date created 
status Andor any other information necessary   to monitor uh this the update we received was 
that a monthly report will be distributed via   memo beginning April 1st 2024 to provide the 
requested data city manager status update on that yes I I did a uh went into bsna did a deep 
dive on bsna so we could clean it up get that   information in there put pertinent information in 
there instead of what we had in the past so um I'm   I'm actually I mean I have there's there's 1,900 
cases in there um I'm working on the open ones   now so we can get that information I do have that 
report ready I can run that report today I cannot   guarantee you all the dates are in there at this 
point in time I'm still running through that we   have 80 I I think it's something like that 70 to 
80 case open cases that I I have to get dates in   there for um but I wanted to give a good enough 
you know the the the proper information I didn't   want to give erroneous information or information 
that wasn't you know that you know that we maybe   care about but you probably well why am I getting 
this information so um I can run that report today   and I'll be more than happy to send that to the 
council today and even watermarking it is draft   a or some sort of indication that I think it 
sounds like you were able to generate produce   the report but when it runs you see you that's not 
the correct date that field might be blank and you   want to have it consistent so it shows up well and 
it's actually usable I totally understand that and   I think we are everything I heard this is just 
the beginning uh but we can get something that   that I think we we like and makes sense uh and 
this is going to be extremely helpful but like   you and I have said I think the data is only as 
good as what people put in and um that's a natural   thing it's really all about the ability to run a 
report I think from our level and certainly our   city manager's level and so I appreciate you uh 
paying attention to the details so that that it   can be right and I do look forward to that um 
and I think one thing just keep in mind that   when a report like this is run it's in when when 
you see the report you see it in a in a snapshot   of time okay cases are ever evolving ever moving 
ever um until the very end um and then so a lot   of times when you look at this report you'll see 
things like oh this date and this date don't match   or this States there's no date after this date 
why is that these these cases are moving forward   at all times you know and and and being I guess 
you could say massaged a little bit um so so if   I just I put it out there if you see some date 
or missing or it's inaccurate or you think it's   inaccurate or something to that effect you could 
always reach out to me I can explain the dates to   you or explain why there isn't a date there or why 
there is a date there but I'll be more than happy   to put a water mark on it and I'll be more than 
happy to send that to the council yes Mr Mayor   I'd like to ask the council's Indulgence if if if 
you will to give us a day or two to get with the   city manager I'm not sure Todd has actually seen 
the final version of the report and he may have   a little better feel for exactly what the council 
wants um so uh we can commit to getting that out   in the next several days but I would like to have 
Todd look at it before it goes out the door I had   a couple yes council member Jackson so I wanted to 
address you Mr Palmer um 1 1900 open items right   no ma'am there's 1,00 total cases total okay about 
7 goodness I heard that and that sounded way high   so the so it gives closed cases in the report 
as well as the open ones I run two different I   would not I run I would run two different reports 
I'd run an open one and then I'd run a closed one   the closed one's going to have a lot less dates 
because we didn't do that in the past and we're   actually um focusing on the open cases right 
now um and populating that information first   and then once that information is accurate and 
populated then we'll go move on to the closed   cases and see if we can get because some of those 
dates may not still be available for closed cases   um we got this this program back in early 2019 
is when we actually started using it so there's   probably some cases in there that just don't have 
certain dates that that um that we're tracking Now   understand um so when we implemented this in 2019 
how did we merge the data into the new system from   whatever old system we use so I'm specifically 
trying to get an understanding of gaps you know   from previously did y'all have to do some manual 
entry to get some of these things things changed   over and did we pick up a certain period of time 
that we converted into the system or did we start   from scratch we took the old system they were able 
to run reports out of the old system we sent them   to bsna and bsna was able to upload them into 
the system itself it um kind of it it tried to   keep the old case numbers to a certain extent it 
tried to keep all the information a lot of the   information didn't correspond with the information 
in the new so we lost you know we lost a lot of   information in there if you look at a report and 
it says and it only gives you a port a partial   um case number that right there is one of the 
uh hiccups that it had when it came over didn't   give us a full case number sometimes so there was 
information lost there was information that was   put into um into like a paragraph form so you had 
to search through the whole paragraph through the   uh computer jargon to find the actual information 
it also created um a lot of inspections that we   never that weren't ever put into the system so 
once it was converted over it looked like we had   like on one case that I just cleaned up it had 
like 20 inspections on it the case was solved in   the field it didn't have 20 inspections on it so 
I had to go through and I had to get rid of all   those inspections so there was a there's a lot of 
there was a lot of work to go with that okay and   and I appreciate you giving me this info because 
new systems when you convert it doesn't always   do it cleanly number one number two sometimes it 
doesn't gather all the data so us understanding   gaps as a council is important because data is as 
good as what's in your database and so it created   extra work for do you think think that from 2019 
to now you've gotten the things that were pending   from the conversion like you said you had all 
those inspections have those all been cleaned   up you know for those that converted over that 
were not needed or do you think there's any data   out there that's sitting there that still needs 
clean up from the transition from the old system   to the new I'm sure there is some data out there 
that still needs to be taken out of the system   so a lot of the old cases that were there in that 
in the previous system that got moved over a lot   of those cases were in compliance at that point in 
time so we didn't do we didn't we didn't deal with   those cases because we were ever moving forward 
we weren't going back to try to collect data or   to change stuff in the that that got moved over 
in the past because we had a large case load   we've always had a large case load here even back 
when I was on the only code officer I mean it was   a large case load and so so so it's difficult to 
manage that case load and then go back and try to   fix things that were already closed right so if 
you look at it for in the standpoint right now I   don't think there's any case that came out of the 
that we started in the old system that we still   have now except for maybe a lean that that that is 
hung out there somewhere okay so we may still have   database Integrity issues from this conversion to 
the state right because you moved forward based   on what you were working on um so Mr Mayor this 
is something we may need to look at is because if   our if our public are going out looking in bsaf 
or bsnf and it's not giving data with Integrity   how are they going to know what they're looking 
at is it's more it's more of a lack of data than   is an in inaccurate data okay it's so I mean 
you could possibly go out and look for a case   that was back in that was transferred from one 
the one system to the other system you're not   going to I mean it's not going to show you like 
well this this was done on this date this on this   date it's going to be more of a you're looking at 
it going okay nothing ever happened on this case   and why not back in the you know back in 2016 2015 
whatever you know why why didn't anything happen   well it did it just didn't transfer from the old 
system to the new system because there the the   fields were different the the way they the way we 
put stuff in was completely different so it's not   a it's not like you have erroneous information 
it's just you have a lack of information okay   and in knowing that do we have what information 
that is not there that we have a lack of from   the old system that didn't convert over do we 
have that defined with procedures of how to   obtain those documents out there for the public 
we are putting every one of the files every one   of the cases that we had in the old system um 
are being scanned into laser fish so if there's   any case out there that's that's that you look 
at and you're like well this case was created   in 2016 but it doesn't show anything it would be 
in laser fish you should reach out and look at it   and or you could reach out and look at and laser 
fish we do have some files that still are being   scanned as we speak I mean we had a lot of of of 
f files that we needed to get scanned and this   was back before we were really into a more of a 
computer-based system so right but yes you could   you could find that information okay so knowing 
y'all are working on that which I'm happy to hear   CU none of system transitions are never fun um 
no knowing that it how many open code or open   cases do we have right now I would say off top 
of my head probably around 70 to 75 if not more okay I'd have to double check though 
I think it was 75 the last time I looked okay that sounds a lot better 
than when you hear big numbers doesn't it   and knowing that you're doing things to address 
the the old database you know ensuring that it's   getting into the system is is big thing then my 
last question was possibly for you city manager   is um when we implemented the system I know Brian 
knows this he work he works on it all the time but   did you have were did the vendor provide training 
classes for people that interact with the system   yeah Brian can talk more specifically and did we 
have an implementation a a technician that helped   implement the features of the system with the city 
yes we had numerous technicians here okay um they   stayed here for I think it was a couple weeks with 
us and went through everything um you can only I   think go through so much um when with the system 
everybody knows that A system that that deals with   as much as this system does is pretty much built 
kind of generic to meet everybody's needs so we   go in after they show us this this this is how it 
works then we would go in and we can tweak some   things to help us out or what have you but they're 
always available I reach out to them on a weekly   if not daily basis and ask them how to do this 
and how to do that there is a in the system itself   there's actually training videos and there's 
actually walkth through where they can walk you   through anything that you need to know or anything 
that you need to do you click on it it gives you a   l literally an itemized how to do um thing so we 
have the the resources are there um we have been   trained on it I've trained people on it it's it's 
a so for Council those are those tutorials that   you pointed me to right yes and those tutorials 
I actually went into those and looked at them   and they they walk you right through how to do 
everything so okay so those are available for   us as a counsil to go through and I just wanted 
to make sure everyone knew because I re Brian   recently pointed me to them but I had questions on 
the conversion because as as um Mr prommer says a   lot of times when you convert from an old system 
to a new not everything moves over we were looking   at older systems and records from 60 years ago 
that we've had you know over time so I was curious   about those things and wanted to get clarification 
so I understood when I'm looking at reports that   he'll provide in the future that it is going to be 
to back to a certain time frame and not all things   may have converted over the way that you would 
think even though they converted so thank you   thank you Mr Mr Mayor I'd like to make one oh I'm 
sorry Todd I just wanted to tag on to something   council member Jackson brought up I think you've 
underscored that there's there's this Gap and   Brian clarified it and that we're in a per period 
of of closing that Gap I think it's important we   put some guard rails and safeguards in place in 
terms of disclaimers so people understand where   things are and that they're in transition so for 
instance one would be hey bsna doesn't have any   records here for anything before this day another 
one would be hey if you're going into laser fish   and you're looking at these files keep in mind 
that you're getting part of the story here the   other part of the story may be here so people's 
expectations are managed that what they're   going through we're trying to fix this we're we 
acknowledged there was this data transition Gap   we're trying to get through this and you may find 
some things that don't just perfectly sync up if   that's the case please call code enforcement send 
them an email they meet with you and go through it   and get you your records yes and that's one thing 
I just wanted to mention um last thing I guess um   is public records requests they're still live 
and well and they work really well if you get   a hold of us um I'm more than happy to give all 
the information that I have that's not located   or can't be located on the in in bsna cuz some 
information just isn't in bsna okay we didn't   have it until um 209 early 2019 I think you said 
I mean that's when it really started we started   working in it so there's a lot of information that 
we don't have in bsna so public records requests   if you if you ask us we're more than happy 
to give you all the information that we have   thank you council member Willis yeah I think it's 
critical for us to understand that the previous   system was built as a least common denominator 
for multiple municipalities and what we do what   the city staff does might be more involved but 
when you do the data mapping over to bsna it's if   it may not come over it may not have been there 
and so bsna is going to show a a vac data point   and if and I know that bsna would have mapped any 
data that was possible to a notation section so   if it's not there it's not there and I think uh 
we need to commend uh code enforcement for trying   to rectify the issue it's going to take a lot of 
manual process and I appreciate your efforts on   that thank you council member Davis or May may 
prend tell him I just had a question on the um   monthly report distributed by a memo um April 
1 I did not remember getting that did we get a memo no I think that's I think that's what we've 
been discussing is we Brian is prepared to push   that out um he could do it today but I'm hoping 
to get with Mr Morley and show and get him to   basically approve the format so the information 
that we get to the council is usable um it's   comprehensive enough to give you a give the 
council a sense of what's going on um but no   that that did not occur on April 1st so are we 
going to once you would get it approved in all   every month the first of the month we'll get 
it definitely once once we get the parameters   of this report it'll be as simple as uh I'd 
like to say is hitting the button and it pop   popping it out but yes it'll definitely be once 
a month um it's about building the template is   it's about building the template Mr Mayor yes 
could I could I ask could we not um generate   these reports electronically and disperse them 
to council rather than printed yeah I don't think   printing yes I think and in the perfect world we'd 
be go able to go on and just click our own report   and just view it at any time and if they're 
providing them for us I think that's totally   fine electronically in fact I would rather I would 
rather have my copy electronically than a printed   piece I've got a filing cabinet full of paper I'm 
trying to get rid of now so would you prefer your   agenda packets that way too uh yes but I I need 
special reading material from time to time so okay council member Davis any comments no I have 
questions but I'll ask later my my uh concluding   comments are I appreciate uh I think it was IMS 
that was the last system that we used yeah any   fields that that provided I remember the I'm 
sorry it was Spring Brook that we used before   that IMS was our first one yeah sorry IMS was 
our two back there was reports being provided   at a spring bck up up till the end um and then 
when we moved over to bsna this was going to be   a better system and so the reports from uh 
Springbrook I think were a little bit more   comprehensive uh whatever that final export 
was of all that um data account wide or or   whatever those were uh my hope would be that 
any missed opportunities to match up Fields And   even create new fields in BSA maybe Spring 
Brook had a field that was really valuable   but my understanding is you can create the 
new field and and map it up sounds like we're   moving towards that but I think we can always 
go back and maybe even clean up and merge data   um and because the reason that's important is 
I would like to see beyond 2016 on one account   and scanned is great just to have the record 
but it's really difficult and cumbersome when   we have to um access a records by public records 
request and working towards not only all the data   that's important per case but going back in 
time um that file wherever that's living that   original export from Spring Book perhaps there 
are some opportunities for fields that even if   it was a third party integrator or someone who 
has skill sets Beyond us that could come in and   give us the ability to essentially merge the two 
systems so we don't lose everything prior to 2016   and for the benefit of our city staff I think it 
would be extremely valuable if you had the ability   to go back in time specifically on this property 
alone that was a big point and the things that   were occurring during that period of time today 
we can't see and I think that's that's to that's   an opportunity to to improve so we need to keep 
in mind that Springbrook was a small snapshot in   time we didn't have it very long we had IMS 
longer IMS and Springbrook no longer as far   as I know we no longer have access to those we 
stopped paying stopped utilizing them um I know   IMS we did I don't think I have anything except 
for a spreadsheet from IMS was a something that   I did for the permitting Department um other than 
that it's our our records retention is 10 years   if it goes back prior you know further back than 
10 years if it wasn't put in you in laser fish   which it should have been it would probably be 
difficult to find anything back prior to 10 years   ago so that's just kind of a you know they do you 
know we do get rid of records every now and again   and for our records are attention and stuff so 
okay yeah I mayor I think I hear what you're   saying and the goal is just to get as much of this 
information into the public realm as possible so   the council and the and the and the residents 
can run their own reports as needed um and so   yeah I think with that with that as a goal I think 
we'll uh we we're we're we'll try to we'll try to   provide that thank you Mr Mayor yes sir so just 
for Brian and Dave we do not have the original   import exports from those previous two systems 
see BV file yeah well in whatever format they   had it I don't know how bsna or what they did with 
the input on that bsna did that for us they took   all that those files and everything and they ran 
that they put that in the system and it all came   into the system IMs I don't have anything from IMS 
for code enforcement I do for building because I   pulled it I don't know what Springbrook did with 
it we give when when when you get a new system as   you know when you get a new system you they ask 
for certain things you give them that information   and then they do what they do with it that's 
their system they know how to put it in there   I know what I did back in when we went from IMS 
to Springbrook I wanted to capture the permitting   because there was a gap in time so I wanted to 
make sure that we captured that I I don't know   about the others I the the like you said the 
CSV I don't know where the files are I was just   just curious because as Technologies change you 
can adapt some of that older data of structure and exactly looking for a workaround So yeah thank 
you thank you yes if bsna migrated the data from   Springbrook or um IMs I think that they had 
to get our file that we owned that raw data   and if bsna has it and they export reported it so 
that they could import it into their system maybe   that's a path but to be determined it is I think 
a good first step to uh work towards everything   we discussed with the ability to create a report 
and I have nothing else on this um did you want   to go through point five mayor yeah I think 
that's uh number four is complete or we are   finished discussing item number four and yes 
Point number five Point number five is present   any findings or opportunities to be distributed 
City Council on ways the city can improve our   Community Development Department as it relates 
to code enforcement and the more I go through   this mayor I see the process of that being after 
the findings report is distributed to council and   discussed I think the best way to do that is for 
me to produce a conclusions and recommendations   report coming out of that and and I think the 
conclusions and recommendations report it needs   to kind of follow the same iterative process that 
the findings report has in other words me meeting   with staff what's a great recommendation what 
works the things I've already talked about that   I'm talking to council about and sometimes we 
some things we're talking about um one-on-one   we'll continue those discussions but also talking 
with community members like Peg about you know   what are your thoughts on this the conclusions and 
recommendations document is going to be um a first   stab at here's what we learned and here's what 
we're going to fix here's how we're going to fix   that but there may be other things that come out 
of that but this one is about everything related   to the experiences at Jackson so I would I would 
I would retitle item number five conclusions and   recommendations I would say let's look for a 
deliverable on that probably in the June time   frame mayor June that's what I'm hoping for yeah 
well it was really helpful I think when you put   the the updates in the right hand column as we're 
reading for March if that's something you want   yeah I would May 7th if we can get an 
update with those revisions or proposed   um that that's really all or need to do is 
go down the line with the latest update and   I don't think we need I mean these can 
be deleted out and the new ones can be   put in the you know the update but as far 
as changing uh findings and opportunities to leave the left hand column 
just update the right hand   column okay yeah I think this is the 
one we're um we'll be waiting on and um any comments on number five Council I think 
May um so with with that going through taking a   step back and looking at at both of these um again 
thank you all for taking the time to come together   I hope we never have to uh do this again um and 
I think at the last meeting we talked about uh   keeping it in front of us and the big picture 
here is yes there's two straight names but we're   talking and towards the end I think about making 
our our city better and I auditing uh where our   resources and time go and and certainly the and 
strain it's around these areas naturally due to   the nature of the work but I have learned a lot 
since January 27th and I've and I've heard I   think our city Administration has as well and 
I look forward to uh being able to respond to   these quicker and I think while this one might 
take a while um I think moving forward they're   going to come much quicker and we can be much 
more responsive so that we can uh provide the   citizens I think what they they deserve and 
um there is I guess two weeks between now and   May 7th and and and my hope is to be supportive 
of any way that I can and to continue to sit in   on on meetings if that's helpful if it's not I 
certainly need to get out of the way and thank   you for the opportunities to do so far um and I 
I really just want to emphasize that I am I know   that there's been pain in this process but I I 
am optimistic that on the other side if we can   stick with it it'll be well worth it and I want to 
thank Council for your deliberateness in all this   I especially want to thank Peg and members of the 
community and the Filmore Town Homes owners who   have been patient through all this for your help 
and patience I also would be remiss if I didn't   thank staff because they've been going through 
this pain with me and we've been uncovering things   and discovering things ourselves and I have every 
confidence that the staff will get us through that   thank you mayor ptim yeah I I wanted to Circle 
back for a minute um looking through these papers   and um on the filmm project you know we talked 
about the contractor and meeting with them have   we established who exactly the contractor is 
for Filmore we're talking with ABC um Inc LLC   BC LLC is that the name of it yeah I believe 
they're LLC are they insured and all that yeah   as the contractor for that yeah they're a 
licensed contractor in the State of Florida   general contractor yes GC yes so that's the 
people that you'll be dealing with or yes yes   specifically and frankly that's one of the things 
that we learned is we need to be discussing and   dealing with the right person on the these 
projects and and we're tightening that up   that would be Point number one let's get it'll be 
right up there that's going to be in the findings report that's all I had thank you any 
other questions comments concluding any reports I just com oh John it can 
it can probably you could probably wait Thank you Lisa thank you Lisa thank 
you that was nice manager sir comments okay   good good to go with that meeting adjourned