great thank you 7 o'clock and welcome everybody to Tuesday April 9th 2024 select board meeting 7 o'clock we have Community input at 7:05 appointments and resignations 7:15 we'll be discussing the fiscal 25 budget in town meeting 9:25 the town administrators report at 9:30 minutes and warrants 9:35 Le reports 9:45 Community input and then hopefully by 10: we'll have adjourned okay is there anybody in the room who would like to offer Community input I'm going to remind everybody you are um limited to one minute and if you have more than you that than what can fit in a minute you may write those remarks down and they would be um included and I they would be included in our next packet at this point and um we do ask people to identify themselves when speaking anybody in the room no anybody online no hands up John just joined so seeing none you have five minutes well I know but we can do other things okay John are you here to give any uh input tonight okay all right appointments and resignations you want me to move um the appointment yes please okay I move to appoint Alana Lynch to the position of Municipal assistant for the historical commission pending successful salary negotiations and required hiring Administration with an anti ipate to start day of April 10th 2024 that's tomorrow tomorrow okay is there a second okay go ahead so Nathan seconded that for the minutes Ryan you want to say a word or two uh sure so we had a shared position I don't need to lean forward anymore let's just have it we had a shared position with the CPC the MFC and the hcom hcom historical commission which we're appointing right now the difficulty with that was um the majority of that person's time was tied up in minutes in in other issues so we're we're trying to tease that position apart and assign it in a way that that makes sense so uh there's current discussions to bring before you a proposal to move the transfer station stickers back to a public a more a more public approach which is the police station through the dispatch and then um the m MFC we solved that as as you know through the budget process by creating a position inside the facilities department and then this position is the last piece so we would like to have a part-time employee 10 hours a week and we happen to have a very talented employee here Alana who is working 25 hours a week with the town clerk so she after many discussions agreed that it would be a good fit and we also worked with Peggy to make sure that the assistant town clerk position took priority so his scom work will not happen during um assistant town clerk hours happen on on Friday evenings nights and make sure there's meeting coverage and the like so we feel pretty comfortable with the arrangement and very thrilled that Alana agreed to do this excellent thank you any further questions comments all those in favor I he opposed that was unanimous what about you have to get David or we probably have to do a uh roll call vote sorry didn't even oh David lav is asking is the audio on we're muted can everyone online hear us Mark says yeah all right okay now okay um we'll take this vote um yes it should be a roll call vote so um David were you able to hear the discussion for the appointment of Alena Lynch to the position of Municipal assistant I'm not sure he's with us okay quick summary in the room we were talking about pointing Alana Lynch who's our current assistant town clerk very very talented I don't think he can still hear us is the problem well the rest of the folks can to the historical commission for 10 hours a week in order to fill fill that position okay so David are you with us yeah okay I hear you I'm driving I I couldn't uh okay so it's a roll call vote why don't you uh do you vote yay or nay yay okay um Nathan R Snell I Arnold I REI okay so that is unanimous great um if people could not hear us before I'm going to open it back up for five minutes for Community input did you all sorry yeah and I'm going to remind everybody is for um time uh limit is 1 minute per person is there anybody online who had something to offer Not Me Maybe at the end we got turn the volume up John can are you oh I just said no no I saw you looking at me so I just said no maybe oh no okay great okay all right so moving John yeah thought um moving along in that case uh gallagan letter of resignation we've had a letter of resignation for Katherine gallagan who has served long um On The Board of Health that's to be acknowledged thank her for her service I would like to thank her for her service I you know Katherine has been on the Board of Health for quite some time and it has been very actively involved in town she's going to be missed in in that role yeah absolutely okay can Madam chair yes uh could Ryan we there was some lack of clarity but just maybe Ryan can bring us up to speed um it's for the Board of Health to propose an appointment but for the remaining year but the two boards our board and their board need to agree on such is that accurate well we we make the appointment when it's yes okay so the position the vacancy should be Aver so this this resignation is for May 31st to fill a term that expires in 2025 so it doesn't expire till next town election so by uh statute this position is then advertised and a appointment is made by the remaining members of the the board in question the appointing board which is the Board of Health and the select board so it'll be a joint meeting with those two bodies with the full nine-person vote right isn't that kind of what I said yeah I don't know but anyway everybody now knows what the rules are not to you you said that they appoint and then or they recommend an appoint it's just an open who wants to do it okay all right um we're going to be going right to the budget in town meeting and we're starting with the police station renovation update and it's a joint meeting with says the um design police station building renovation committee thank you police station renovation building yes r c sprc okay would you like to open your meeting oh there you are do you understand what I'm saying yeah we did we got it we got it nobody elucidated yeah yes Ryan did ryar yeah he said it's a a Jo meeting advertised and then eventually both boards together vote on it in a joint meeting we Dave so that means we' got and should I make it should I summarize what we've been doing is yeah so the select board would like an update on where the building renovation is and specifically any additional I mean they can speak for themselves but any additional costs or project updates they should be aware of are recommending the article tonight we've been meeting since February um and with Justin Humphries from TV Architects and his team from blw Engineers there have been several there have been at least one meeting with the Board of Health uh I believe that Justin's team is on the agenda for historical commission um working on planning board and zoning and there's already been a extension of the order of conditions from the Conservation Commission so I'm guessing by the May town meeting we will not have all those approvals in place but I think that it will I I don't see that as as a major roadblock I think that's just an ongoing conversation and making sure people have the right amount of information but the the critical thing is scope and budget we um I know in December there was a cost estimate of 2.99 million I believe um since then meeting with Chief amandola um there've been there've been a few minor programmatic changes particularly with regards to security um and but any any of the cost implications really are related to looking at making at at the HVAC system and getting rid of fossil fuels so right now gas serves one of the um air handler units I believe and the hot water domestic hot water and that air handler unit was considered so basically Beyond life and so so the idea of moving the the gas meter just to have a gas domestic hot water heater um is is probably not financially the right thing to do and we're trying to keep the make the renovations as environmentally responsible as possible so when you saw on the um mosquito were going all electric um that that is that is the goal it would be more air source heat pumps on the exterior and um hot heat hot water heat pump um domestic hot water um that is a minor change but and we think there are some cost implications of that but not major because there were still a a lot of work in the building there was still new a track in the building there was there's just one air handler that's being replaced so but that had to be repaired anyway so there was some cost so um taking into consideration that and the electric service there was we will provide for two parking um you know electric electric charging stations and that that has a small cost implication too so we we think after talking to Justin we will not have a a final cost estimate for another two weeks two and a half weeks or so um however talking to Justin and his team we feel that a um a responsible estimate right now is 3.1 million for for the work to make the police station accredit safe um with the the new community room and and to you know repair and replace aging h back in Plumbing Systems Alan have I missed anything or Dave along with the master plan making it green yes yeah so it will be a Greener building I mean we um and I Know da particularly might be looking into rebates um rebates for both the um mechanical system and the town can then look into we'll just install some empty conduit from the panel the town can look into solar future solar and I know one question we were going to ask historical commission well they are we the team um is will they they've already we already talked to kby is it kby no I forget someone from hisorical commission whether they would have any comment on um south facing FAL T time so I don't think that's an issue for them I thought by State Statute they had no jurisdiction SAR okay well any case it's not something that's part of this thank you part of this project but it's something that the town can considered um but the the backbone should be there for it we think structurally the roof is not we'll be able to support it and the uh application coming up for the environmental sustainability committee for the new designation of the town as a community a sustainable Community will be enhanced by this renovation as well because will all um the so you would not move the Met gas meter because you wouldn't need a gas meter we get rid of it it would be what is the generator operating on not gas diesel gee diesel oh I wonder why they did that in in certain respects but okay I when they replace the diesel engine generator was because the cost to provide a larger pipe if you will to it from the street because it needed a lot more feet okay that's why went with diesel okay great all right so we really won't miss that gas in there okay anybody have questions other yes yeah um so looking at uh number seven here which is the uh I'm looking at the TBA report um Ryan would you mind putting that up on the screen if possible thank you um it's saying here that that we're not doing the light renovation um in some of the work uh some of the offices um I agree it's just discreet and everything are are there other things that were in the original proposal other than that that are not going to be happening in this that aren't going it's up on the screen if you want to see it Suzanne so you look you're talking about number seven yeah okay finish this that's that was just an example that was just the thing that I noticed is being that we being told this isn't going to be in there but you were told about it before I didn't see any others are there is there anything else that that we thought we were going to get that we're not going to get haven't discussed anything that's getting removed we have to reduce the number of loers but for 20 7 to 21 but apart from that I don't know if any there there was changes part of the original plan was to increase the number of lockers in the women's locker room turns out that because the capacity of the SE system flow rates are limited affected by the number of lockers turns out we reduce the number of lockers so we can meet that change the sing system it's either bedrooms or lockers exactly yeah so yes not related to the amount of people you have in the building at any one time so okay you can't just use hooks instead of lockers we did talk about that you you can double the size of the locker and they can sh and people can share them I mean it's just such a stupid rule it is so the the other question I had was um uh it says that you know windows on the second floor it says that's to go before the historical the historic commission um did the heat pumps already go to the historic if we're adding heat pumps is there no there's no cond exor condenser but there was going to be right they're all outside this four or five on the side of the building where the eastan is so it won't be that visible from the road I believe but I think it's a good point that we should make sure we mention that the stroke yeah because it it's visible from the road right they would have jurisdiction on that I just want to make sure we don't have a conflict in the future thank you I have a question um I just described seven so seven is um being discussed as an alternate to the vid so it's not necessarily being taken out so this is a sensitivity to the $3 million cap that the the select board talked about so 3.1 million is a conservative estimate uh because it hasn't been bid yet so this isn't a final cost estimate it's something to put on the warrant to say we think it'll be around 3.1 when it goes out to bid it could come in at 2.9 3.2 3.3 right it could change so uh identifying things that could be alternates are a way of Shaving cost if necessary in order to meet the select board's goals so it's not taking it out it's saying identifying ways to cut in case it's necessary I guess I did dis up one other thing since we have you know clearly there's there's a parking issue um there I I worry about taking two of those parking spots and kind of having charging stations there whether or not we're going to lose flexibility or compound the problem that we have um was it to charge police charge St be staff parking so and and I think by signage that that's a point that is a good point that by signage it might not be dedicated to I mean anyone there yeah anyone is in a non Department non Police Department person one I think one's supposed to be a staff space but I I or if they're both staff spaces I don't remember but I know one was definitely for someone work yeah they're not they're not intended to be public spaces it's not a great use of how you charge how you charge so it's for St staff and future police vehicles okay yeah and it's and it's um are they um do they have a place on the on the um schematic yet or is that still to be worked out I'm just responding to Nathan's comment about not wanting to have permanent structures that make it more challenging to manage the parking yeah we we did get a big set on Friday and I have not looked at the electrical site plan to see but I'll make I'll talk to Jus about it we'll make sure that that parking is not you know is worse yeah because there is a going to be garage yeah um I had a question just again I'm I'm going back to what I recall seeing in December so I I could be way out of date here but um at that meeting we discussed the um the the proposed new entrance you know that was in the in the plans that we saw then now and I at that time we were saying let's not do that because we want to keep the cost down and I but I couldn't tell looking at the new plants whether we're still there or not what is happening on the entrance no no new no new entrance there's there still a new door at that lower level but not the not that poro and so how will will there then still be a um Ada accessible I got it the ramp will still be used okay all right and then my other question was just about the third floor um again for my quick glance at the plans it looked like there is no toilet facility on the third floor and is that is that uh that was discussed and that's a it's too difficult to get it's not open to the public so I don't no I just thinking about it for the staff that are working up it's an inconvenience that's all yeah okay they shouldn't wait too long to go right and and when we talk when we talked to Chief amola you know people are not spending eight hours a day out there it's you know coming and going yeah okay saw the chief was on I yeah I saw that too but I want to wait so are there any other questions at the table David nothing do we want to invite the chief to weigh in I saw he was on the screen earlier Chief do you have any comments to make excuse me no sorry I couldn't be in person I just wanted to take a second actually to commend the committee and the work they've been doing they've been putting in a lot of good effort and trying to make this a successful project for the town so thank you very much for all your volunteer and help on that end um but they've hit pretty much all the target aspects that we were going to talk about tonight so I don't have much thank you thank you okay so the pressure for a number tonight is uh twofold first the warrant has to be posted this week so if you want to include a number on the warrant you have to make that decision now before the final cost estimate is done which is why the 3.1 is being recommended with some contingency in there if you don't want to put a number on the warrant and just keep it General that's also fine but the and they can speak for themselves but the committee discussed that a number would be better than no number on the warrant sign signifying that this is a consensus effort going out to the town uh that number can also change as you go into town meeting so it can go it can go up and it can also go down if you want in the motion book so the uh the pressure to get a decision done tonight is is not the final design or the final cost it's to get the warrant out to the public so that they know this vote is coming and then to adjust it as you go to town meeting on May 13th okay I'm comfortable moving ahead with a a number I'm a little less inclined even though I would kind of like the the committee thinks it's valuable so I'd like to hear a little bit more but I'm just because I'm concerned that if we go out and if if it comes in at higher than 3.1 million um I think we have to you know we may have to really s seriously evaluate this not that we wouldn't do it but and I just think we set ourselves up for a a problem and I if it's only two and A2 weeks why wouldn't we get the number and then you know be able to go into town meeting with the number well one thing is that's a estimated number it's not a bid number if we were I would agree with you if we were going out to bid and we were going to get a bid number but an estimated number is still an estimate um and and this will then commit the town if they at the town meeting to that number and we could raise it at meeting so if if for instance if we put the set the number tonight at 3.1 million or something and then it came in at 3.2 the town meeting we could amend it to 3.2 and vote on it at that time yeah and we might even do it a few days beforehand right so it's in the handbook the Motions handbook handout right if we if we knew it by the time we had that um May 7th meeting or whatever that date is week before well do do you all want to share with us your thoughts about um recommending we have a number it was it was more so people get a sense of this is the scope and you know we're not trying to not show you stuff but it as as Kate said it's even if when we have the cost estimate it's not a final bid it's not an actual bid so it's someone's best professional estimate about what the price might be we felt it was a step in the right direction toward transparency other than saying we don't want to tell you what it might cost yeah it's just just a way of saying who's our best guess at the moment can we can we put some language to that effect in the explanation in the warrant make in the summary don't we have to settle on a not to exceed number isn't the number voted the not to exceed number whatever the number is at the end and whenever we do it don't we have to vote a number if it's higher at when you're all done with all the bidding if it's higher you have to go back you have to go back so it is a not to exceed number I don't understand all the warrant language the Weasley language we should we may not want to do it now but we have to put a number down by the time it town meeting the time of town meeting why do we need to do it now we don't but we also don't need the Weasley language in the warrant right we going to have a number we don't need best effort in our best guest we don't need all that yes we do why because the motion might be for more or less than the number that's in the warrant the warrant about printed book we're talking about the printed book it goes out that everybody has access to so so clear the microphones pick up for yeah they're picking up okay um Wayne Davis Town moderator so in the warrant book you don't have to put a number if you don't want to you don't have a number for your budget right that's the biggest one in the in the entire warant um so you don't have to put a number in but it's good to let people know if you can once you put a number in then other than a small change if you went from 2 M9 to 2,950 you can do a small change upward and as far down as you want but once you put a number in um you you can't go substantiv substantively above it mean it mean a day or two or or the day of town meeting that that is right so if you put in 2.9 you can't 3.1 would would be considered I mean it's kind there's no hard and fast line it's a judgment call on on behalf of the on the part of the moderator um but generally it's the the the standard is expected to be di Minimus so you know maybe a couple of percent um but you don't want to have anything big so if there if there's a if you need a lot of wiggle room then don't put any number um if you think you've got or or either that or you put a high number in and then come in and your motion is lower um but then you know on the motion you still at the end of the day um whatever is actually voted if the bids then subsequently come in and they're higher then you have to go back or come back to the voters yeah is that clear as much so I think the question would be for the board would be is to um how much can the town from your tolerate a price for this renovation because that's that would be the key uh if if it's going to be I mean we can go down in any amount but going up higher um because it's a it a risk if you put in what we we're recommending right now so well in the in you guys have been talking with the fincom I haven't been involved with that recently so it's just what can the town forward and how high you can go if you want to put a number in them I think and that's only speaking for me because you know committee hasn't looked at this and discussed it or anything like that but that's just my thought from what Wayne just did so I thought 3.1 was a conservative member is it what you were just saying that might be a tight number this is a very interesting construction uh area time frame so you know when we first put this up a bid last time and we got the estimates from from TVA and there they they were W how much Kate you were on that committee they were up almost 40% or 50% so um it's very difficult to estimate refurbish I mean it's much more easy much EAS to estimate building from the ground up but you never know what you're going to without XA rision there's always something that's going to happen and and contractors tend to bid higher on rehabs than they built they bid on other things because they don't know what the heck they're going to run into and this is even more complicated because it's it's a it's a phase construction of an operating police station so it is possible that people will put in extra to make sure that because it's going to be actively running and systems going to have to be but we well when we met on Friday we talked about we know that the town has a lot of priorities at the $2.9 to3 million was was what worked within the General Financial capacity so we talked about well where do we think we are based on the 2.9 Million estimate from December and that's how we discussed and and talking to Justin and his team we came up with the 3.1 is as our a reasonable guate estimate and that um that's what it is and that's the concern I personally have is because if we say 3.1 we put that in the warrant and then all a sudden it comes in at 3.25 and we and the town wants to do this we can't we'll have to go back none of us is opposed to having a higher number we were just trying to come up with something that we felt that you guys would swallow and the town would swallow how does it um just back to Nathan's question um how much how tight is the 3.1 I mean you all have a much better sense of the numbers obviously and we do we don't know until we see the estim no but I mean the way you put it together um I I don't have that it's not in front of me but that listing of all the cost you know that we saw in the memo earlier um I I remember seeing their some contingency in there and there was a couple of other things near the end of that that uh budget that was the 2.9 number though that was right so what so I I I can add this because it's it's a guess I'm not a part but you know when we talk with uh TBA they were looking at um you know cutting some stuff down so that they can get into this 3.1 million area 3.3 million 3.1 and they we moved and redid some of the hbac to you know lower some of the condensing units outside to combining them instead of having separate ones so you know they're concerned too so I think I think they're cons I think they're confident they're round three but they're not estimators you know and and the bidding you know the bidding climate can change exact you know in 60 days and it just you know we still have an inflationary pressure so I just want to clarify that something Wayne that you were saying so let's sa just for the sake of the discussion we said the number tonight we were going to we decided we did want to put a number in the printed warrant book we put in 3.1 million the estimate that um Justin is going to get back if I remember his memo it's like in two and a half weeks or something right that estimate comes back and it's higher so that in the way to think about that estimate is that's a a better it's a little bit better than the current guesstimate is that is that the way to think about that it's it's a more um okay and so let's say we're faced then with an increase Wayan um that we want to consider uh and we may decide we want to have the town vote on it I think it'd be helpful if you could be a little more specific about how much larger no but I mean it because if it's your call I mean that's the other part of it here this is kind of an odd Dynamic right where it's well Wayne we really feel strongly that you know uh .5 million is is what we should have and you know that seem reasonable the other curve is too before Wayne answers is that if it comes in at say 3.2 and we have to go for another cycle the inflation of construction I know it's going to be more than that 3.2 yeah exactly that's why I'm asking how what's our ability to increase the if we decided we wanted to what's our ability what's the range um that would be acceptable this is why I get paid the big bucks you're on the warrant 50 bucks to get dou what you do infinitely more we're getting name image and get Cofe um yeah yeah so um I um okay I I will I will I will uh I'll put a stake in the ground at 5% okay so what 5% of 31,000 is from 31 it goes to 32 325 225 which is kind of when the is that if a voter were to come to town meeting and with the expectation that it was going to be 3.1 million and said well I'm comfortable at that number I'm not going to show up and then town meeting goes and it it goes to you know five million they say geez I thought it was something gon going to be in that three is that the rationale right that that is exactly the rationale uh unfortunately like many things in the law the it it's there it's impossible to draw a you sort of a bright line it's a judgment called where between a 50% increase versus a you know a 05% increase at what point would someone go ballistic and say if I had known I you know would have shown up right and so it um uh but my my sense I since we I've not had to confront this particular issue uh as as moderator just because it just hasn't hasn't come up as I've seen what's happened in other towns some other towns some moderators say you know they like they don't want to go a penny more I think that's ridiculous um but I think most probably get uncomfortable Beyond about 5% so that's why I'm I'm not picking it out of their but that seems to me that that's pretty defensible you know if you went you know if if you came in at 10% would I say no you can't have the vote no I I wouldn't um I I would say look you know just you know be be for warn some wants to challenge it they may have a case but you know who knows what a judgment said so I'm I'm hearing I mean there's kind of three gates right so there's a gate at the warrant book publishing where we could say we don't have an estimate that sounds kind of weak or we could say like what Allan said like or what Bill said you know we gave it our best shot this is what we think it may be slightly different by the time you come to the table right and then the second gate is at the meeting we'll have a fresh set of quotes but there's still estimates we'll pick a number now we you're hearing it can be 105% of the number we put in the book if we put a number in the book but then that's a number that gets voted and it gets voted at The Ballot Box too right the same number is what gets voted even if we dramatically learn something in the week the ball the ballot doesn't have a number it does not have a number so the budget is set at town meeting the authorization to exceed covers the cost of that borrow so the control is that town meeting the ballot is you don't put it you don't print it out the ballot I guess but people have to do their homework they know what're presumably know what they're voting for at that moment it is tied to the town meeting vot okay and then there's a process and then real real binding Quotes come in and if it's too much above that if it's even a penny over that and we can't cut the penny out then we got to go back to the voters right yeah we could find can't we find if if it was find some savings find or find some money an extra if it was came in $220,000 more and they said no this is it could the town we could probably find $20,000 but but it's of magnitude okay all right okay so right yeah so I'm fine putting but so we're back to the Optics of putting a number in the warrant right and you said it looks weak and I'm just not I think it looks weak to say I don't have a number I guess I kind of now I'm back now I'm actually on your side all right put some weasel words around it so so just just to be I mean just to be clear the the um the statute is um very minimalistic because the statute that really goes back a couple hundred years it hasn't been updated that much all you really need to have is the subject matter right right um the where it gets a little bit trickier is particularly where you're going to bond something your bond Council wants to more so the the more you can get in the warrant the better and um you know sort of I I think we're all everyone here is in favor of more transparency so as much as you can tell the voters in advance you want you want to do that um but hereas between a rock and a hard place all you really need to do is have the the legal requirement is the subject matter you could say you know we're going to vote on whether to appropriate money for a police station and that would be sufficient as a warrant article from a purely legal perspective um so you do have you do have some plan it's just a tradeoff on um uh how you know do you want to formally do it in the warrant um you know another thing you could do if you go I'll call it the budget roof because you never put a budget number in you know you can say okay look you know the but the warrant language just says we're going to vote on the police Poli station and you just don't have a number in the summary could say you know could include that that estimates are coming in um and you know a final number will be presented you know in a motion currently it is expected to be somewhere around $3 million whatever you could put that in the summary and people get some they know order of magnitude yeah and so if that's what you really care about um then that may be a solution that works for you and the order of magnitude that's in the summary uh therefore does not limit us to the 5% right change right so that number the actual number we want to present at town meeting could be any number we choose at that point that that's right correct unless we want to have some mechanism to limit ourselves no no I'm I'm not sugesting we we 3 million we well that's what I'm exactly that's what I'm saying I mean um so I guess if we can put in the summary that completely changes what I was going to say yeah um because if that if that if the people who want to put it in if that meets the goal then I think that's fine um because I absolutely don't think it should go in the part that we can't really move because this has gone on for so long really really don't want it to go over 3.1 million um but we can't do we can't have another do over and so if we're tying our hands because we want to put a number in I think that that's a really big mistake um and you because we can't even have the conversation about whether or not we we want to go higher um but I still really think 3.1 is is is the max the the other thing that I would just say is if you know we pulled out some of the finishings on some of the offices as an alternate are there other things I'm not picking on it but like charging stations are there other things that we could put in an alternate path just in case this comes in a lot higher than we thought and we could say okay we'll do those later and not lose the jewel of this project which which is accreditation for the the police department there probably are whether they're whether they're the C we just we don't have any cost at all at the moment knowing whether it's something that's insignificant that can be changed with both High Coler temperature low temperature lighting system uh versus you know the heat pumps uh one will have small amount of benefit in terms of cost other have a large amounts we have no idea what those are right now but you will there be some trade-offs probably whether they're going to be an area that affect the total bottom line I know yes so I'm just wondering if we should put those out before the estimate so that when the estimate does come back if it's higher than what we thought we can still pull we can pull the trigger faster going to do a few but it programmatically this is a pretty tight program to meet accreditation and accessibility so we did talk about whether we could do OU alternates and there're just a few but I mean looking at drawings and and I don't see a ton of value engineering you don't see a ton of what uh um alternates that would make make this thing give you a a menu of things you could delete the term of art to cost cutting seem like even if it was like $100,000 or $150,000 that could be the game changer well there is a Furniture line item that's $75,000 and I think that different pressure that could be something else um that could be you could you could definitely take off 50 and just look around for stuff so that that was the line item I I was looking to cherry pick before you did anything construction works yeah we would just need to know what those are before meeting right before giving them real number so kind of so you need to know them before it goes on to bid so the number is the estimate it'll be it was estimated by a professional estimator in December it's being reestimated by professional estimator currently you'll have numbers tied to a construction document I know there's tons of caveats but that's as close as you can get without going out to bid before a town meeting and then when you go out to bid you can put a lot of the stuff in the alternate to make sure that you meet I'm worried about the estimates coming in you know I'm wondering if they should be cut before the estimate or if they should be put aside as another project like like the finishes so that in going to town meeting we're going with a number that we know is going to be absorbable that's not a word but um you know totally you know definitely we should do it at the the the bid documents as well but I'm I'm worried about that number for town meeting if they come back at 3.4 the detailed so we'll be on the look hit and then peel out some of that stuff I'm hoping we'll hopefully have by the 24th okay all right if the estimate's beenanas then you're back to square one so a good point what I am hearing though for the the original question is that um we would not put a number in the warrant but we would put a a very careful exp explanation in the summary about what the number might could be and that you know to to give people some heads up as to the scope and size of this project and and um let's just be a little precise and about what that is in the summary we're thinking it would say in the range of 3 million we're thinking it would say 3 to 3.1 what are we what are we thinking that actual language would look like in the summary 3.1 plus or minus 3.1 must yeah the current current best guess current best guess 3.1 a with yeah plus or minus and that you know to make it clear that it's an estimate yeah yeah is people comfortable with that yeah very much so I think this is we had a good discussion well no we've had a good discussion about this I just was concerned that if we got to town meeting and it you know exceeded it we would kind of have a real problem and so I think this alleviates that and you know I transparency is important and you know hopefully the mosquito covers this and talks about our discussion and you know voters are educated but we'll see what happens okay we need a motion or we this just can be the sense of the board I think we have the sense of the board unless you want you think is clearer in the minutes to have a motion we're going to we're going to write it tonight so we're good okay we going to write it and okay great excellent I also have a qu just to just I have a question into Bond Council if they answer to make sure that we don't need a number which I don't think we but I just wanted to make sure okay hopefully he thank you thank you for for yeah yeah I know this is not easy I haven't done it once before yeah yeah I I would say before you dismiss them logistically do you plan on recommending that article the police renovation when that comes up tonight or do you need to have more discussion about it I ready I'm ready to recomend it how about you and the memory that you put up there from TV I thought was very was very well written and and you know talked about you know the importance of accreditation you know accessibility I think that Justin if people need more language I mean Ryan's talk to them a lot it's they've very help okay thank you that's good thank you thanks we close our oh who wants to make a motion I the I'll second um Dave if you want to V hi so that was Dave thank you very much for coming than you thank you chief for coming all right all right got it all right so um obviously Wayne's here so yes there's things to do here's the to-do list I put it on the screen for you so we have to make you don't have to but you could consider recommendations of these articles that would be printed in the warrant if you don't do it you can make those a town meeting that's that's completely fine too the order of the Articles the uh summary language making sure you're comfortable with that we talk about taking Article Five away when we get to that um changing some uh I got to change the numbers if you make any decisions tonight there's a consideration of a CPA consent agenda I'm going to make the graphics visually appear feeling and then confirm the election war and then I know the town meeting study committee also has some recommendations that they wanted to be part of this so that's what we have to do tonight in the next hopefully hour and a half okay Wayne is limited time yes and so what what what do we need to do for that Wayne Wayne between one and seven what do we for you what do you need for um AR I should say uh I just had two things from the um come up here from the study study committee um and I I don't unless you need me for something on any of these which I'm not sure that you do maybe the CPA consent just gonna say just because you and I chatted about it and yeah be worth so I mean it's not even on your list but the the the things from the the U the the study committee um uh one is a very momentous one which is uh recommendation is that the select board get put back up on the stage but leave the fincom off all right U whatever I mean yeah I it's just uh we and and practice varies in different towns across the the the state and after we we let you guys sit in in the audience last time number of people um you know most people were fine with it some people commented back to me gee you know the select board um you know we we elect them we ought to see them and it's important for them to be accountable and feel accountable and you know I like to see them up there everyone knows their faces um we can take better aim at them uh perhaps yeah anyway and and the the the I think it's fair to say in obviously David's actually the chair of the the study committee but I think the feeling of the the study committee was that yeah they thought it is a good thing for people to know who their select board members are and they they felt fincom was you know somewhat different people can look up the names if they want to but they since select board was elected um and we have a you know it's the space is a little bit tighter since we have the electric electronic voting so I'd actually prefer not to have both groups back up there but one group is fine so I was fine with it and that's you know recommendation of the study committee is anybody on the select board have any objection to sitting back up on the stage okay so let's let's accept that recommendation from the right and and the the um the there are a couple of other things I'm just going to go ahead and Implement on on my own but but one that that actually it's actually your decision at the at the end of the day on the conent agenda um the consent agenda is um you know it's just a a procedural thing and the and there's not there not hard and fast rules um we have our practice in carile has been absolutely middle of the road as near as I can tell around the rest of the Commonwealth which is that um you put on things you think are routine non-controversial um and in general have avoided things that are just one-time votes or that it's the first time something comes up um so there have been a number of things over the years where we voted it separately and then the second or third year that came up we just put it in the consent agenda um in other towns um conquer and boxboro are are two that are you know are reasonably close uh and that uh I I would say personally I I respect their practice and their their moderators and the way they they do things uh they've tended to be a little bit more liberal so things that they again it's something that you think is going to be routine because it only takes one voter to say hold and then it's pulled out so it's something by the way right yeah and that could still happen and and if someone wants to throw a wrench in things they could say hold on everyone hope that doesn't happen um but you could um so it's really up to the select board if you want to be a little bit more liberal and so as I looked um and the the study committee's feeling is save time wherever you can so that we either have more time to talk about the meaty things that we're really there to talk about or that we get home earlier yeah um and so as I looked at the warrant and you know everyone can have their own views it struck me that the repeal of the opio thing it's like who's going to question that yeah um the wage table was unclear to me I thought that might be another candidate but you all know the politics in that a lot better than me so I I'm I'm I was offering those two as as candidates if you wanted to expand the consent agenda a little bit but let me let me put it over before you comment let me just say two things okay one is we have a Committee of nine which i' say is great first of all because it's more people to do stuff but also it's a broader swap of people it's some younger people who don't go or haven't yet gone deal with young kids I mean there's more demographic diversity so I respect the opinion so when Wayne says like should the select board sit up at the thing you're getting you're getting a sample size bigger than often we get like talking about the biggest single thing I think that's come out our current Focus which is to increase participation is that the meaning is too long and there's too much crap so we are thinking about ways and Wayne's been leading this that we can easily sort of declutter one of them is he's committed I'm going to tell say right now to make that Preamble section here's the fire exits and that's how you vote and to make it short like 15 minutes because have and we don't even get to the article one till 74 so there's like low hanging food so the second piece is put more stuff in the consent zip through that and then as I've mentioned to Kate and you and Ryan one thing that also came out is hey the police station's why it came like why is it buried after all these other things like fire trucks I don't care about those I want to talk about police station let you know so lead with your lead right so I think just the overarching philosophy of this is let's see if we can streamline it and this is a test bed for you know seeing if we can get people more engaged should say yeah that was a positive experience I got home by 9:30 or whatever and you know we got some stuff done yeah I'm I'm completely on board with that I support that and I was just going to add to this by saying that I did you know have some comments on these the consent agenda the items that had the two asteris only about just explaining the magnitude of it so for example Article 5 real estate tax exemption we didn't mention like the magnitude of that you know we said oh we're going to exempt certain people but and I asked Ryan I said you know these are and he said you know it's probably $1,500 well I think if you can 15 what thousand I'm sorry yeah I had that wrong but but I said well just another one a zero that's okay that was a that was a bad example anyway I was I was saying why don't we put a little bit more information in it so so that somebody like me doesn't raise their hand and say wellit wait a second how much is this I don't want to consent so I I made a list and I passed along to Ryan just of a couple of those things I thought could use a little more clarification as to the magnitude and I agree and I have my own list here for that so that would be a good thing yeah consent or not I like the philosophy of that let's the my only my only concern about I came for the police station and so why not put it before is what um our major job our major job is the budget at well I wasn't suggesting before the budget ah okay I was suggesting and I'll get to later after the budget people to get up and leave before we do the budget we don't have we would have consent agenda and budget those are typically pretty fast and then before MFC fire traff op had hopefully consent stabilization g b oh my God my head HTS already and like the biggest thing should be the first of the this is my whole life David [Laughter] okay so do we have an agreement that we could um massage the order of these articles and that we can have more in the consent agenda yeah which yeah I I agree with the the items for consent agenda that we brought up agreement totally including on the wage the the wage yeah the wage about CPC because I don't agree with that being well we have to talk we have to hear what the ideas are we haven't heard anything yet yeah the C you can't do as part of the normal consent agenda so talk se but the devil's in the details too like on the wage thing I had some questions on that and I think it's just getting the language of explaining it and so we'll do that tonight or we're going to yeah I think we have to we have to work on the summar we can do that ler okay great we'll do that on our time and not to you Ryan sort of the the order there's nothing that requires you to string all the consent agenda items together consecutively but if you want to you know it's probably easier for people I easier it's easier don't confuse people yeah so you want to put those up as numbers nine and 10 or 10 whatever all right may may I make a recommendation of course the I think you should go through each one and talk about them and approve them and do the language and then I think the um order and whether or not they could be consent agenda will reveal itself to you yeah okay okay because your level of question and debate will probably indicate everyone else's okay do you want to put it on the screen or we in that process would you suggest we do the um whether we're we whether we want to take a vote to approve it or not not uh so it goes in the warrant book as we're going as we're going through them first round time okay okay so now the question is though do we need to have a little more explanation about the CPC article now or is that later separate thing that's that's a separate proposal consent agenda for the CPA article consent agenda separ at the point where you so so you don't actually have to decide on the CPC whether to do it as a consent or not tonight that I mean with the last couple of years what I've been doing so CPC is similar to the budget so actually the way we do the budget is is a form of consent agenda we don't call it that way but you know way back when there used to be separate vote on each lineup and some towns still do that yeah so instead we go through this a similar exercise of saying you know do you want to hold on it so we've sort of moved the CPC is similar in that there's supposed to be a vote on each one and that's why we have it listed as separate motions what we've moved to in the last couple of years to set is that we've made a judgment call after the warrant but before the town meeting I've you know I talk with this the the committee with you and we sort of to figure out which ones look like they need to be voted separately and which can be bundled and I've kind of handled it at the meeting and so we can still do that you don't have to decide that tonight if it's not clear so we can do some of you can vote all of them together or say two together and two separately we can sort of figure that out a little bit later if you want okay right and if and if you don't mind I can actually call in and be be on the phone till like 9:00 if you want sure it's 810 great okay thanks a lot thank you thanks I will I will log in before I get okay all right all all right where are we on our list of things to do I'll moderate now that Wayne's leaving article one is the consent agenda itself having one yes and we're just decided we're adding to it we can recommend that right yes yes I have favor of the can I have a motion to um support article one so move to support article one second as amended tonight where we add the opioid and um we haven't gone through that yes but I thought we all just decided we're comfortable with adding those to okay yes yes I agree with that okay so it'll say 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 nine and 10 well that's why we should go through the whole thing because it's all going to change yes right so let's go to article two article two that's we have to vote are we voting each one no let's not vote article one yet because we don't know what's in it okay okay article two Town reports which now includes language based on the streamlining recommendation of my um Patriot Act report which is in there it it includes what Patriot Act report is in there now so you will not give it will not give it orally it's in writing excellent well every minutes count it'll be added to the summary it is in there now oh oh this is the most current version here yeah yeah yeah okay oh I see we oh yeah shoot okay uh sorry inqu s prop annual time report course Town Administrator report annually to the town meeting on any information of the town's possession about the way the p being implemented in the town Thomas D has reported the following there have been no investigations implemented by Town Department using the patriate ACT since the last annual town meeting town meeting voters are asked to accept these annual reports as a run matter okay we don't vote to approve that so you approve the whole cons agenda so then a non-binding vote is that we okay with that being in the consent agenda yes that sounds fine yes let's go on salaries of elected officials I have uh two comments yes one is I think again in the in the view of uh information transparency we ought to do the math on the town clerk's salary increase and the second question is when I did the math I got 3.3% why is she not at the 2.25% that we tell everybody else have to be so last year the select board approved a step increase for non-union employees based on a positive review okay so I think we should say all that stuff in explanation because otherwise people again make question well I have one other question before we answer which is we don't have we don't have anything here where we talk about that there will be a ballot question about making her an appointed position it really is no article to comment right here um oh yeah it says town clerk would be paid Pur to the T should the town the last sentence well it's right right it's pretty modestly written I would say we should say the amount I I believe we should explain why the increase is 3.3% because yeah you know people who do math will say well GE you know all the worker beasts are getting 2.25 what's up with that and we should strengthen then I'm sorry I missed that we should strengthen the sentence that uh you know reminds people that there is a vote the following week to move it to an appointed decision maybe just to follow up second the sentence after the one that starts page four right at the top where it says clerk is the only elected official get a salary would your suggestion be then there'd be another sentence that says um this the amount shown uh represent 2.25 as a cola and whatever the percentage is for the step increase per the wage yeah I scale right which I'm fine with that too yes something like you said don't yeah because we don't know what step she's at that's the other it says it grade 10 say 10 but there's the steps that's what gives her the extra percent because if she's getting a step increase I don't think it matters is like how much that is it's it's 2.25 and she's getting a step and that explains why it's more than 3.3 that's why it's than I think that's I think I agree that's offici are you good with that line I agree with that line and then but then another line step increase maybe a bold line reminding people at the end of this paragraph in its own little paragraph just a reminder that yeah well that's or maybe it's a new paragraph below it what stands out a little bit yeah I'd like to stand out because I mean you want to remind people that there is so I think they want you're saying you want a carriage return between expectations and should yeah okay carriage return there is that a typewriter reference yes I love it isn't it great yeah it's a car chinging chinging right right you never heard that before I'm just proud of myself for knowing that yeah you're the last generation to know that so I would yeah I would be more declarative and say as a reminder there uh at the town meeting held on such and such a date no the prior one town approved the ballot question to move the position from an elected to an appointed role and then you can say you know and we are voting it like next week you can fill in I don't know if you'd say reminder you could just say start with the town Town voted of 2023 yeah as a reminder you think it's too pedantic yeah yeah you do okay we're we're we're trying to good writing should shrink like bacon right cut all the fat out of it the town town meeting to make the to and pointed the sh [Music] election PA such will be held ballot question number three to be held on to be held this requires a town ballot question no requires the town yeah ballot to be held in ballot Vote or cot vote in May on May 2124 that's in the next sentence but we can do it yeah no I think it's good you're right it is in the next sentence yeah it's in the next sentence as you quote period yeah there you go C page y yeah I think that's I think that's good and are we are we we are not oh it's consent are we comfortable with this yeah you might want to say continue to be paid under the no I do think it's possible somebody will want to hold this because they're going to want to ask the procedural question right about okay so if at the Town election this passes to make it an appointed position what happens to the current town clerk right I I don't know if we want to anticipate it and put something in there but I do think that is could very likely come up and so this will get pulled out of the consent agenda that might be but it really has nothing to do with their salary no I know it doesn't but I'm just anticipating that that's the kind of thing as we know there are a few people that were very concerned about that last fall when it was going to be understand but the other thing is that's already a contestant but let's let's actually let's anticipate one thing which is as a unfortunately it's an eye chart but since you've identified that she would move to you stay where you she you've identified that she would move to grade 10 yeah is the band of grade 10 within the it's hourly rate so you you'd have to do a whole lot I'm not asking us to do I'm just saying it is so should we then say her salary would not change as a result her current salary the voted salary would not change as a result of that it does so it says you say continue to be paid but so is way continuing to be paid 50 bucks so this article does that it's not so we've tied it to the plan would continue to be paid it does it does require this vote to pay an elected official okay but I think you should understand I think what the you're missing the point what I think allow me to try todate say I'm not any um he wants to make it clear that the number that's up there is the same as if she it is calculated from the the chart that's down below so that the grade 10 position be the same amount of money as what's shown in the chart above approve her salary that's how much she'll get regardless of if the vote she would not be paid any differently it's it's basally to me this is what this says that's what I think you want me to do the math is that what you're saying no you don't have to do the math you just have to say the clerk would be continued to paid but that's what it says as it's exactly what it says yeah well what it doesn't say grade 10 position is equivalent to the money that's shown above I think you should say she would continue to be paid pursuant to approved AR this approved article 3 and okay so wait a second let's let's let's what if we put that at the top in the first paragraph clerk is the only uh official that's paid a salary the position was added to the wag and classification plan on 23 at 20 at grade 10 the amount shown includes the townwide 2.25 CA in addition to a step increase given to all employees well actually that's what it says that's exactly what it says okay I'm going to try let's try this the amount shown above just add the one word be spare yeah I mean people you you guys assume knowledge by people they don't know so line on this page four yeah enough bacon stripping for you Mr you're gonna be sorry Ryan not Theon the bacon not the fat so that ties the amount okay I love this all right it's good enough right let all right open Ah that's not ex oh oh yeah so we do this every two years we appropriate 3,000 per year it costs a little under 6,000 yeah okay okay so is yeah you I'm glad you put that number you're gonna cut out the select board Finance commit things right because it's all going to be consent uh each one is identified by who put it on there even if it's in the conern I'm sorry I didn't hear the question I got it this is identifying who who put it on it's not a I see gotcha okay um assuming you guys are okay that's good it's required so I don't think we should do it okay Article Five so Article Five I talked to the assessors today you have approved everything you can approve under the statute unless you want to go even further which is a whole another debate um so this isn't approved annually you've already approved it so it can be taken out okay great already passed this Clause to the extent that's shown here and it is valid I confirmed it with the assessors what we can talk about is increasing this next year to help senior taxpayers but right now you can strike it you can go okay but Travis is this where you wanted to include what the total cost is if it was in there but but I I was thinking it's more if my objective was to like what you're saying is cut down on objections that come up that then would delay this and someone would say the magnitude how much is that take this if you can get it out of here that's fine too because we've already discussed it even better so you're suggesting Travis that we should put in for what the magnitude is no we're going to remove article five oh we're removing it sorry I missed that sorry sorry sorry okay great all right that is onzo okay okay article six allows you to is now article well he'll you can well we should change him because or highlight it then okay okay chapter 90 this allows you to spend chapter 90 this is totally routine and I like that one because it puts approximately 250,000 so it uh tells us yeah tells us what's going on yeah so it's great okay article six Peg we all we know and love we have a special change no okay sorry I did add it doesn't what it doesn't say though there hold on second I'll go down this next page okay it's okay you did it because I was in the earlier version the reason I asked didn't say what you withdrew the funds for and you said it right okay one small uh thing you need to add an S to the word assist at the top of that next page on page five this fund also assists yeah okay this is seven now I asked but just you know I asked about that all these screens you know I didn't realize that all all of our stuff in town hall unaware sorry that's good including the mics new mics yay article seven department so if you wanted to add or subtract a fund it would be done here that's not being suggested this year this sets the spending limit for the Departments that have revolving funds so I have those if you want to see them Kelly has worked with each department and make sure that they have enough to cover their costs yeah more more importantly we need to have a different sort of a limit and that's how much they can sit on not how much for this meeting is and it's not generally been challenged so exactly so this um the actual amounts will be printed in the motion book we find it to be confusing by each revolving fund you mean okay that would be in the motion but not in the warrant right okay um do you want to say that say that in the summary say that the actual amounts that you know will be in the motion book of each f is is printed in the motion book yeah so is it capital M motion book sure I don't know the actual amounts Amounts is plural sorry but so mounts are printed R yeah r no that's a amounts yeah good job yes okay that's why we have Commit seven eight salary wage table okay so will this be going in the consent agenda I don't see why not be fine there yeah do you want to say though in the summary that we this was adopted um when did we do this last spring you have to do it every year I know but we've already considered it once right this is not a new no it's a new one it's new for this year it's new every year year year it was changed a lot last year yeah that's what I'm thinking okay all right my minor recommendation is to bold the last sentence of the summary just to make sure that they're clear that it's a 2.25% c because that's I I don't know about Bolding anything yeah W as much as you want you know what you don't bold I mean they got bold In Articles up there okay so don't um but I would I asked Ryan the question relative to the amounts there if it's not apparent or it wasn't clear to me that that was the wage per hour I don't know if you needed to say that because someone may say like I did what does that mean is that like the percentage I agre that month you should say um listing all positions byting the actual hourly wage just next line on the last after your title then your title centered um put uh all all numbers represent hourly wage rates what okay yeah okay perfect and then that's good that's right there expressed in hourly or yeah right expressed in hourly rates expressed as hour all right a lot help to see what I do all that yes all right and then of course we're gonna three Chiefs in one Indian Four Chiefs in one five Chiefs in one Indian yeah good and you'll do the spacing later Barney if you didn't notice the traffic safety member is a part-time police officer so I added the Asters gotcha thank you I was asking what that was so do we want to slot obil in here to keep the Numbers number nine it's actually number yeah 14 old 14 old 14 14 yes x what did we do before word I know well I can tell you I know no I know I tell my kids about the like the electric was like a big deal in my with a little correction tape yeah that was a big deal you correct the word like what maybe put it okay um these were shorter they didn't have to now you're back n oh yeah yeah yeah you're right typ typet they were like a sigma big Sigma you know or big you know what do you call it the symbols and they were on a plastic thing you stick it in there I didn't have it all right the consent agenda is complete sor and did you put your double asterisk next to item nine did so do you want to recommend all is it through nine yes yes okay because it was going to be through I move that the select board recommend approval of the consent agenda article one second any discussion all those in favor i y y just let's de9 double Asters yes no you didn't and you didn't put the de asri on it disagree he did by fund oh I see sorry at the end of it you just on the summary for that opioid um article um I guess that's fine I was thinking you might want to lead with that we've approved it but that's fine thought it was yeah yeah that's fine okay 10 10 your operating budget now this is where I'd like to pause here just to show you very minor changes that have happened since you last talk so the library we changed the wages so we decreased that's not showing that's not helpful so this is the total uh wages minus custo maintenance in custodial that was 510 it dropped to 57 the uh custodial was around 40 and it went up to almost 42 so this was a library that made that change this does equate to a 3% increase as was asked by the finance committee and the select board and is the exact numbers that are needed per the library and vetted by us so an appropriate change the second one God I got too many thoughts all right um one second please just give me one second next time I'm bring treats what's that I'm bring treats next time candy or every time we move through something and make a vote we could all get a you know kiss my dog is a button it can push and it says cookie please oh jeez we can give each of us a button does he push it constantly no just want largely after dinner he wants really mine would be I got it okay okay I was thinking all the remaining ones are with the Board of Health so the there was a transcription error that resulted in a $271 difference with the board of health1 so basically I just shifted the lines down it was $271 did we um sort out that where the lunch fund's going to pay for the lunch inspection the food ins where does that money go yeah so the Board of Health discussed with school committee's approval spending 475 out of the school lunch then they insisted with their unlimited Authority that it stay in so um we're here with the $475 know I think mostly for control so I'm no wait I'm confused St yeah this this 475 is in the Board of Health budget is that what you're saying yes and you could account for it in a revolving fund that could be used for nothing else we had proposed keep at the request of the Board of Health I sat on a board of health meeting and was talking to them about the budget and they actually came up with idea maybe that charge could go I was talking to them about unused right revolving funds like School ons I think Patrick one of them came up with that idea which I thought was a good idea so I said great I'm going to put you in touch with Sarah which I did do yeah then I also sat in on the budget meeting of the school committee which I'm also liaison of and they approved that thing to transfer that money to to not transfer the money to use the school launch fun for it peanuts but yes okay it was simple it was symbolic of two things that I felt were important one is using revolving fun funds up for things that work and two is it was nice cooperation between the two boards as facilitated by me right to say hey you can save a little money right so I'm a little disappointed I have to so this 475 did not come out of peanuts I don't care but I am disapp I'm going to publicly say I'm disappointed that they didn't just do it like if we can't get along on those little things how we going to get along on the big things right that's that's all I want to say I most wholeheartedly agree well it's our budget it's your budget that's correct and I think it should be a vote of this board whether it stays in there or not sure you're the chair is this what you want to fight about no but I think it should be I think David is not the only one that's disappointed right but I mean I'm register and there should there should be a message sent not that I my opinion what happened is the Board of Health made a decision they have uh invested power in their department head and Treasurer position which they created in order to amend the budget and they were um so mad about the other things that they just ignore the fact that this was already discussed let's not hypothesize no I'm 100% sure okay but I mean I think again I'll say publicly I think there's a lot of fence mening to be done between our board and the Board of Health I don't want to get into it tonight but I reason to believe there's a lot of fence mending so picking this fight's probably not helpful we've said it I personally as a liaison I want to make it more of a priority in the coming year to do it better are they at the 3% are they at 3% with this number they're at 4.44% see that's what I'm that's why I'm not happy okay I mean not only are they not at 3% yep and they they the ones that are choosing to pick this fight not us okay that's fair enough and I've forgotten was was um were there some items on the table to get them down to 3% there was a proposal that they use their revolving account in order to defer the increase in costs right they added the 475 for food inspection because they don't have the ability to inspect a kitchen yeah so we need to add a position in order to inspect the kitchen no but I to one of the positions to train them up so that they could do this themselves I wonder how much that costs well yeah but I mean it's probably given it's a once a year inspection I'm guessing the make by decision is go outside pay 475 but that's what the lunch fund should be I I think it's $475 it's not going to move the needle and that we should have the discussion with them about the budget in the future I don't think we're going to be able to sit here and get them down to 3% FC right tonight so it's kind of like the water's g under the bridge I think we just as Ryan points out the bigger savings go and move on and rev use of rev address the relationship thing in the coming year I agree well say wellson I think we have to be very careful about who we app Point coming up all I don't think it's the Board of Health I think you have the department head making budget decisions that's what I think I think it's not helpful to be having this dial all right well I think we're ready to move on that's the it would not be tolerated in any other department you I mean I yeah I'm not happy at all I think and and frankly the budget is where we have the control all right we could for our goals discuss change their budget number at the bottom line we don't we wouldn't have to change any of the individual ones but we could I mean it's a little it's just a little late in the game bigger context of how we want to handle the Board of Health break down those silos okay all right stre all right so the operating budget so that does not change the high level numbers that were discussed the 3.1% average tax bill increase or the 3.06% overall operating budget increase so can I ask you if you pull up I presume as we normally do that the fincom chair will give a presentation about the budget or you will do it so the uh fincom is creating that now they will have a public budget hearing on the 17th and create the PowerPoint for town meeting and give the budget presentation 17th as in 4117 will be the hearing yes what day of the week is that to Wednesday next Wednesday okay and that's going to be publicized whose meeting is that that it's going to be done their public hearing their meeting okay great and and is it Lyn still she's the chairman yeah okay um so your the thing that's in the packet that's your explanation of the budget that's supplementary to whatever would be presented right yes okay so excellent yeah it was excellent but if what they're going to see in the where are we where are you right now I so I'm just showing uh finishing my sentence that the uh this is the total budget number that would be recommended you can change that number um and the increase is exactly the same so those changes which I want to be transparent about did not have any high level impact on bu yeah okay so there's no percentage in the back to the warrant book that's what I was there is no actual percentage what's our thinking on not putting the percentage change from 24 to 25 Trad just tradition so Kelly and I created the chart that's been created the last couple years yeah but it's a very I mean tradition because I was thinking it would be helpful to see because if you're a you know if you're somebody that's not really a numbers person you could just look at you could be sort of misled I suppose by some of the numbers that may look like they're where are you talking about putting it the bottom the bottom line bottom is it there add it's 3.06% so it ticks and ties it would be useful to put it maybe she'll do it in her presentation is it in the summary well there is no summary so we could put a summary all right so I understand what you're saying so this chart is what you need to actually vote right the um supplementary materials show all of the the data and we'll pass those out and have them available so this is how to get the budget voted okay but for those whose eyes GLA glaze over at you know the details and the mechanisms they're basically want to want to know how much should you increase the budget by and if you say three or three if we say like we kind of what we're saying with the police station like our goal was three and we got the 3.06 like okay you know and we recommend it you're an optimist does it make sense to put a little summary then below this chart it would just say that I would yeah is any of this in the budget book I I sorry I've been in great detail why why why do we not then just say uh see the budget book because most people will not go through all of that they'll look if they want to know what present well yes I think let me again say the objective of the town meeting committee is primarily to increase participation and the way to increase participation there are a lot of ideas that are floating around but one of the biggest ideas is make it E accessible make the information accessible make people interested in participating which has a lot of pieces to it I don't want to go into right now but one of them is when you do the QR code and you get this you're going to look quickly to see if there's things that interest you if you have to weigh through minua you're like ah it's too complicated I got to stay with the kids I mean we're trying I don't know that but we're trying to make it like hey this is like important stuff it's up front it's easy I I just feel like this is the good place to put those little summaries I think you're talking about adding percentages I think that's great for one line you're talking about adding one line here to the bottom of that and is a represents a 3.06% increase in our budget our that would be a key that's kind of what we've worked to all this whole six months of coming up with the budget no would you put it at the end of the summary or at the end of the right here at the end of the at the budget the above the above total represents an increase of 3.06% in line with the select board's financial goals for why is it estimated yeah the above the chal so the chart is to is to show transparency it's not required it's not in the actual warrant it's just a addition to be transparent you don't need it you can take it out but you're voting a budget you have to have numbers to in the motion book the warrant is just a an advertisement of what's coming yeah yeah I see that's why it's still antima okay fair enough fair enough so wait this is not going in the warrant yes it is going motion will have a real we reserve the right it's kind of like the way department yeah until the day which you see well this going to get up in my URL okay right where is the thing you wrote going to show up is that going to be in the URL and I forgotten did you capitalize budget book on your other ones is it a defined term or not I don't remember but you could check that you could check it I don't know if you wanted it Define or not a is that is that it's title Town budget book link because town normally isn't capital is capitalized okay that I'm sure yeah there you go State I don't think you need to say linked here if you put that that's fine we're cutting out fat watch out move us along Ryan move when will the airlines conclude that everybody knows how to put on I moved the select board Rec recommend approval of article 10 second any further discussion all those in favor I I that was unanimous okay Capital Equipment total of 650,000 yeah so and that one again in in your presentation you show there's two things that aren't here so one is the source of the money which is different sources which you had I guess this one's all free cash actually so it's not stated that this comes out of free cash and you have your thing about using free cash the and then the second thing is you have a really nice chart that shows kind of the multi-year capital Plan and there's no context here so is there you know it would be nice if we referred to it or something like that because again this is taken in isolation what is 650,000 mean compared with what the list of necessary items was vetted by both boards in consult with Town departments and compared the priorities identified in a 5year plan which can be found y so it would be compared with actually okay and do you are you suggesting that there also be an explanation in the summary about how this gets paid for well again now let me go back to a different question who is presenting is Lynn also presenting the capital plan as part of her presentation yes okay those those Mo that presentation precedes the two articles right obviously comes before it okay well wait um in the article it's always shows where the money is coming from it usually either says by bonding or other what you know or free cash in this case it is you guys are continuing to I'm sorry I don't mean to be perjorative but you're continuing to confuse the warrant with the motion book the motion book has a lot more detail yeah with the exact identification the warrant gives you with some so let me ask you a question when I get my postcard and I take a picture of the QR code what comes up the town meeting website with the warrant yes yes right yes just saying put the information well this doesn't come up it you to that so I'll show you what shows up is this page Y which will have the Warren and budget book here once approved right and then every article has linked documents and presentations so go to the budget article it's not done yet um we're still approving it okay well building the plane while flying it yeah um I don't know I don't think most people care about where it gets paid from okay it's all Town Money And as far as the people that are voting it's it's all their money the capital plan will also include a detailed explanation about unspent Bond proceeds so part of the money is is tied to the wastewater treatment facility plant with the unspent bond the rest of it would be free cash but if something happens between now and then you can't change it or you could change it but it would be more confusing Okay so taking Kate's Point under consideration I I guess my recommendation to Lynn through you to Lynn would be we should at least she should she should use some pieces of what you develop as a framework to walk people through just basically without not so much on a numbers basis but like theoretically what you said we're we're using unspent old money to pay for stuff and we happen to be relatively flush with free cash and we're rolling free cash into these one-time expenditures I mean if people who bother to go one level down from this at least see that or hear it in the presentation well they hear then they will definitely hear it in the motion because the motion will be different from this from the warrant so okay I move the select board recommends passage of article 11 second any further discussion all those in favor I is the um the hearing will cover capex as well then presume okay article 12 is Municipal facilities um can I just ask one thing here do we before we keep going through do we want to take the police station article and move it up to after the uh didn't we just we wanted to move it to right after the budet that would be the recommendation of the or because this this is this is for municipal facilities because Municipal facilities is like the um the rest of the long-term caps I think it's related not so after Municipal facilities after all the financial yeah items sure yeah I think that's right losing my ask so yes will the motion book then have go up just a smidge will the motion book break down the 520 into those buckets no it's a general amount isn't it yes it's not tied to specific it's not tied to a specific thing so me so a casual reader will say well why is police station there I thought we're building a new one or rebuilding because if there's a an emergency situation at the police station that just due to maintenance and the MFC does have the authority to fix it and rep prioritize this way is MFC giving a presentation this article they can I do we want them to or is it D Minimus I mean it's half a million bucks I don't know if that's worth somebody standing up and saying what they're working on or they have in the past Jer he's done it yeah this would be the first time when things aren't actually itemized correct they got right right it's always been itemized I don't know that you need to quite what so sometimes it is sometimes it is itemized the town not you have gone back and forth yes we have but you wouldn't necessarily have to itemize but uh somebody like whoever is leading the charge there could could say say Jerry or who who's the chair Jerry Jerry could say you know these are the PRI these are the priorities we we've considered we're working on you know it's also in the I think the summary covers it okay just fine but I don't feel strongl I would want TR if somebody get gets up and ask questions then Jerry could be prepared in the way maintenance you know okay I'm good I'm good I need a better title than what Municipal facilities going maintenance Municipal facilities maintenance or I mean yeah that's I like that well I don't know that's what we're trying to say that yeah we Municipal facilities I would use the word management but management it does also maintenance repairs management that could be people manag like well it's facilities management but uh I like maintenance maintenance I move the select board approve recommend approval of article 12 second any further discussion all those in favor I all right so 13 new is already the fire engine police in now or police station put the police in of course this is a big one too just not forget 950,000 but okay so we'll do it in order of of yes order of uh fine let's do the police station yes yes yes yes yes yes so police station five bosses in the Friday I I do want time to read these a little bit because I know you're buzzing through them quickly and they've changed a little bit since the version that I read yes the more the summaries than the article well I guess the article some Chang so this one we have decided we're taking out the dollar amount correct yes in the article itself I did talk to bound conso so vote to appropriate a sum of money oh yeah to pay the cost of Designing okay you don't need a comma yeah the comma it doesn't need good all right let's prove close um is it the warrant or is it the town warrant how what's your defined term it's all right this this warrant Town warrant yeah I don't know I don't know what whatever it is mean Wars printed I don't know what I just want to be consistent million the goals now why did we put in a small amount you just wanted to the last sentence add a small amount of space why wouldn't you just say well add a will add an additional community space on the first or is it a shared community training space is that what it is well add Community yeah yeah because when you say small amount I know count Community programming increasing the amount of community space available to Residents all right and then there will be obviously a presentation this yes by whom we are thinking that it would be the police chief followed by someone to talk Financial followed by the police station renovation committee chair Financial in terms of cost break down cost and impact so cost impact to the taxpayer as well yeah why it's needed the impact and then the process and how you feel comfortable with the numbers Etc do you want to put a sentence after the very first one where you say 3.1 million to say um a a um a new estimate may be provided at town meeting or something like that or an updated an updated yeah I don't know because we're going to do that anyway and and I think there I don't know just seems back to the problem of not being very strong about what we're doing but I don't know I guess transparency it just explains that the number may change based on the recommendations of profession provided at Town yeah okay well fact it's estimated at this point an updated number looks good as well yeah okay never mind because this was already this number is also based on a Prof on a professional estimate but it's okay but leave it Les this I don't want to be it to death sir um I move the select board recommend uh passage of article uh 13 second any further discussion all those in favor I okay article 14 is the fire engine so we did reach out to get the most current estimate the most current estimate based off a stripped down fire engine from what it could be more than just like the chassis but less than you know what the fire department would ask for if given unlimited money is 975,000 to be delivered between now and three years so we are estimating this cost when did they like if you reach a purchase agreement with the provider they freeze the money at that point you pay them some down payment and they get to work that's our understanding but that was the same understanding we had with the DBW truck and they told us to sue them so they raised it Midstream yeah so like if they said 975 least put 400,000 down we send him 400,000 they could say later oops sorry it's we need another 200,000 so we wouldn't give him a deposit I mean we'd get much smaller deposit but um we would get that back so the answer is it's not Frozen so if it's more than our borrowing we can make it up like the earlier discussion we don't necessarily have to go back to the town we just got to scr around the seat cushions and find the money right is that what that means or any other amount no I don't think that means it that means we appropriate what we appropriate but if if they came back with a bigger Bill we don't have to go to town for vote if we have extra money yeah as long as you have enough extra money just gives you the borrowing any other amount is the motion of the time right how much you vote that so we could adjust to the time meeting this one won't adjust okay so are we in the rules of nine like you don't want to say are you understanding what that um explanation was about the yeah it allows the town to pay more if we need to but it has to come out of the Town budget or somewhere else to do it but the town's only appropriate in 975 of borrowing of borrowing you only borrow that much yeah yeah so what that or any other amount allows you to do is change the motion at town meeting yeah that's all that does yeah I I didn't think that had been understood it does not allow you to look for more money later this that's not what that or any other amount is in there for it just means you can change it just means that the motion might not say 975 It also says it can't say shall be raised by borrowing or otherwise so in the motion it say but okay maybe I don't follow this and I thought the 975 to Wayne's point if it comes in and the Fire Department fire truck is million five we're out of luck we can only borrow 975 yeah cash unless we know it before town meeting okay in which case that number can be adjusted at town meeting and that's why that's in there right that's why that's in there but we won't know a three years from that price in three weeks okay so we well do we want to use that in the other motion the fire the chief police department motion or any says or I think we have okay actually it's even better it says we took it out we took it out so here's an well all right so I wish Wayne was here but Council disagrees you can change the number to anything moderator says it needs to be within original tolerance and it's probably true somewhere in between right so the or any other amount allows you to adjust this so if the police chief came running in a town meeting and said it's actually going to be 980,000 we could change that number once you vote it though with the motion that's it you can't then You' have to use the other budget so a lot of towns with their warrant language keep it very Bland like we're going to raise money from somewhere for this thing some total and then at the motion book it's very specific well so that's that's why the right I think dvis what you're saying is well maybe we should take the 975 out of this actual article it just says we'll vote to appro rate you know a sum to pay the cost of and then the 975 is in the summary as the current estimate is that this will cost 975,000 I I don't I don't have an opinion one way or the other but Su I'm fine with it like this one's not going to change not okay so let's leave this like this all right all right yep go for it Nathan I I moved select for uh recommend approval of article 14 second any further discussion all those in favor I you say I I okay that was okay so this one is um a transfer to Capital stabilization it just says a sum of money from somewhere it'll likely be recommended at 300,000 from free cash just keeping some flexibility yeah right but so it you have to capitalize town if you're the start can move available funds not approv specific reason to town savings account called the capitalization where shall seek to increase I don't see it I don't see the town under summary the oh town savings account yeah if you're going to Capital I'm not sure the ow and officials needs to be capitalized see increases sa so are you're going to make reference to the actual amount of we don't have to say it is in the Motions book you don't have to refer to that okay okay is there now this is a new thing is it going to need any kind of presentation or we just going to assume if people have questions you will speak to it it be in the budget presentation and it is in the budget book okay why don't we point to the budget book in the summary y I agree that I hope that book's right I move the select board recommend passage of article 14 second 15 15 second all those well any more discussion all those in favor I I it's unanimous okay the gis presentation Julie gave you tied to the gis strategic plan with three years worth of costs did you have I just want to read it okay I wonder when you say publish GIS strategic plan do you want to reference how to find that yes the next Sunday oh on the town website maybe actually put the link sorry I haven't read the lessons it's okay I had that same comment earlier yesterday I I like that we say it's Spearhead headed by the town planner but I would like to say on behalf of the you know whatever other departments are going to be using this for instance assessors uh DPW because it by the town Planner on on behalf of town many Town departments that will be will uh benefit or be using using and benefit from this you know or something because just feel like I don't want it to look like it's only her project it's her project well it's the planning board is saying but well planning board is looking to do this and they they've delegated it to the town planner I'm not sure that they were looking to do it I think a lot of departments were looking to do it okay all right fair enough fair enough and I so I just want to make sure that that's uh but what would you ask would you stay spearheaded by the town Planner on behalf of all Town departments yeah or many of the Town departments who will be uh whose work will be uh much more efficient as a result or whatever I don't know how you want to put it but I think it's important for people to understand that it's not just a planning board tool it's a tool for everybody and it's going to you know including the residents will be able get information on behalf of multiple Town should should uh Julie she's a pretty effective presenter should she give a presentation yeah okay great yeah but I again I want her I want it understood in the summary that that this is not just planning board it is or do you want to say for use by all Town departments and residents yeah it does say that little layer accessible to staff and the public okay okay right so do we uh this is you already changed the number okay good want to make a motion Nathan's motion just a second I move the select board I recommend passage of article 16 second any further discussion all all those in favor I I okay cranberry bog maintenance this was the um removal of this from the operating budget from the uh Conservation Commission in consultation with the Conservation Commission to not only address deferred maintenance at the bog but to develop a longer term plan and budget for that activity my only comment on this was it didn't wasn't very clear as to what the The Improv proving and maintaining but I mentioned it to Ryan and he said that they're going to do a presentation and I think that's there is there'll be a presentation by the consan or by the B comme my understanding is the conson they're bringing it yeah no really they want me to just want say what um um the officials you can don't have to capitalize the O so this is not is is the B house 10K in this no this is that's a different this is just to my understanding is just to get for them to study so that kind of for the next year what what we're going to do what we're going to do with the cranberry bog they didn't like that this is the dam though this isn't the study for the dam this is longterm didn't we have a committee doing that for the past this is just $16,000 to to delay another year this that's not what this says though this no it isn't this is this is actual work yeah it's not a this isn't a St they they had more maintenance expenses than they were able to cover in their budget request 3% budget request I had that wrong so yeah so this is is so you know when they came to us and said and we had the discussion about moving the maintenance of all our town land into a general maintenance budget for FY 26 this is a stop gap between now and 26 and so it's to allow them to catch up on the maintenance that had and you this would not be under the purview of the municipal facilities because not a facility right right it's a thing that the cons count control it's so that we didn't have to increase their budget 100 you know 50% or whatever more than the 3% but if this gets voted down they're stuck with I guess whatever current money they got yeah yeah or they'll have to come back I think it makes sense to do exactly what we're doing here yeah no it's it's it's deferred maintenance and we yeah I agree you do good all right so then let's uh make our motion I move the select board recommend pass of Articles 17 second any further discussion all those in favor I I I okay so now we're at 18 how many are there that's it this is the last one this is the last one y but it's five and one so that's a trick five for the fres of one okayy so the difference between do you want to do this or you can go for it sure the difference between article 18 and the CPA consent agenda so explain is as detailed Below in numerals one through five so this allows the town meeting to vote the entire recommendation slate so all five CPA recommendations but like a consent agenda someone wants to hold one of them they can and Wayne's going to give them a chance to do that so it's like the consent agenda and that if there's there's no holds you can vote it all at once but if people want to talk about each one or hold each one then they can and there will be a presentation about all of them prior to that vote right good everybody will know what they're voting and and the reason it came up was um Wayne gave me a call actually last week and said you know and I think coming out of the uh study committee you know with the idea of trying to um speed up Town Meeting um to think about whether we wanted to try this approach to the CPA recommendations this time around we talked about it at the CPC meeting last night and people thought it was a a good idea and the there are four um CPA grants being recommended by the CPC and as Ryan said they'll be presented you know there' be a presentation on each of the four and then Wayne would go through if anybody wants to hold it out to have more discussion on it great and if not whatever stays in this consent group would get voted on as a in a bundle yeah okay Mak sense sounds good to me yeah is that sound okay Nathan because you were the one that had asked had a question about it before um so that would me mean that we would need to make our vote of recommendation of supporting at the consent agenda line no like we did with the others you would be recommended or not dis slate right so basically you're recommending all four or none of them right you vote for it you're voting for all four if you vote against you're right the consent agenda it votes against all four so not to to be more transparent the five things are the annual Appropriations and a couple of things here this 30,000 includes a um administrative amount to conduct some study at the U the bog house for affordable housing so that's increased from most years just so everyone's aware e which is normally we're going to put this much in the undesignated reserve is not legal Al necessary nor recommended because it goes there anyway so all it does is caus Kelly to make a journal entry and then move it so we vetted it and vetted it at her recommendation we just not voting that it does not mean that money is not available or not appropriated and then you have two hydrological studies one at the cranberry bog which is part of the Great Compromise as I'm calling it the uh Greeno Pond study is for um for that area the residence and the impact of that water flow through through the Greeno ponds and to assess water levels for infrastructure decisions and other things remember the kcom came and ask about boards and that type of thing that would help with that rental assistance for seniors you got a good presentation from Carol on this and then the Ada accessible doors just to update I've been working with Stephen and our facilities department and benfields maintenance director mall we are going to try and fix this as it is which would be much cheaper using Steven's expertise and working together with with Maul at worst it's a $60,000 brand new system that needs to be installed but but Stephen is pretty confident that he might be able to do it for much less maybe a third of that if we can uh dig into the system but that's going to be really worked on and decided in the next month or two so the CPC voted to put the higher amount in here for now and then the unspent funds if there are any roll that the yes no back into the community housing the housing the housing reserve the housing Reserve yeah because that's where it come from you always have to put it back to where you ever came from I guess you know just to to touch that third rail who owns Benfield Farms does to carile own it or does Benfield Noah does Noah own it why are we continuing to spend so much money on Ben I don't town does not really the build we we own the land we lease the land to Noah why are we doing this yeah well it's yeah it's a good question I don't understand why we continue particularly with the relationship we have I don't I don't know why we continue to do these Onie TWC things um it yeah I mean it seems like it's a failed project right in long term this is costing us a whole lot of money what is their what is the out right like what what is their plan to make it so that they're not dependent upon us anymore it seems like there's no incentive for them it seems like they just keep coming to us and we just keep throwing money their way exactly right you know I mean it's obviously we need to worry about the tenants who are there but there's something really really broken here yeah and this is just going to bleed us dry I don't there I've touched it I well agree we talked about this last night at the CPC meeting because this is the one article that we have held off you know deciding whether or not to recommend till last night and this question came up um I mean I think there are a number of things to think about here one is that um Noah is a nonprofit uh organization that builds affordable housing and when they did this project for us um their expectation was that it would it would come in at a certain cost and they would not lose money on the on the U building and you could who knows who exactly is at at fault around the whole issues with the septic system but that has been a huge money sync for them um and they um you know again I haven't been in the conversations for quite a while but they they don't run much of a profit and on on Benfield they don't make a profit they're losing money on Benfield and so a lot of the maintenance issues that have come up since the septic I mean just general maintenance of the building they basically you know they don't they don't um they aren't taking care of the building so so the question is right so then what do we just take the ownership it there has to be a long-term plan I don't know whether legally uh and I know we've had this conversation what are what our options are because I know you've talked about the Housing Trust are there legal options for us to do anything on we have very little leverage yet we still keep giving them money well what I I the way I'm looking at it is I I'm taking care of the Town residents that are living in it but only blind right it's just blindly right we don't have anything from them that's telling them that I've seen anyway that's telling them what are their expenses what are their plans what is their maintenance plan like we we don't have anything from them that I can tell you that has been requested well but we still give them money right you know we gave them money what 100,000 last year what whatever it was to repair the septic we gave them um we just rode off several ,000 of a loan that we we did when we first started this I think it was actually 4 50,000 that's in addition to the land um you know we we've given them so much and I think that it's fair for us to say if we're going to keep bailing you out we need to we we need to know what the plan is we need to know how how are you going to start making money otherwise we shouldn't be doing it this way otherwise we should be putting aside money and just saying look every year we're going to have to give $50,000 to Benfield in order for them to keep it going I'm not actually suggesting that we do that um but you know it's a little bit more transparent it just it seems to me and I've had people mention to me or ask me who owns Benfield do we own it and that's why we're spending the money on it or does another organization and it is another organization that is just very poorly managing it right yes it maybe they messed up in septic right or you know it's their septic it's not ours um and that cost them a lot of money but they need that they need a plan to bail it out I think yeah I agree with you actually everything you said the the septic though since it's on the land we own and can you could make an argument that we should pitch in on the septic age with you at all why because it could contaminate the land yeah no kidding I don't think that's I'm not saying you have to agree with it I'm saying you can make an argument for that yeah I think it's very hard to say why do we got to fix the building that you want and by the way didn't it meet 88 doesn't everything have to didn't it meet 88 is the rules change why why do they need new doors they don't need no doors so don't say we don't need doors like if you want to F upgrade doors go upgrade doors they won't okay they won't but so what and the well the problem is then in the short run you have a whole group of elderly people that live in the building yeah that that uh the doors don't work the doors don't work well one of the doors works but it works works so well that it knocks them over because the the key fob part does not work so you have to put your key in and turn it and then the door opens and if you can't scramble out of the way fast enough because the button that used to work it so let me ask you a different question you sent around something right today maybe about the air con and the eating right it sounded like they're trying to fix that was that came from Noah right it was very cheery you know fix by the way we're giving you space heaters is that them finally bailing up to some issue or not well have to heat the building well they have to do a lot of things but you did they're they're not here so we did discuss capital and maintenance with Benfield and and they claimed that they could not afford to maintain the building at that level of Maintenance so the the options is it felt like the options were we could either go along with this as it is or you could take the building back and I'm definitely speaking we're really trying not to take the building back because that's their default so I don't think the keys right this this is wildly speculative but I don't think there's another organization out there that's going to take this building off no's so we're trying to work with Noah in order to solve what is a widely known problem um this particular issue is to me is is an accessibility issue the residents cannot sounds simple but they're supposed to be able to understand what you're saying the same thing their own apartment they can't get into so this 60 would also do their own doors apartment doors and the entrance I I actually got the state to come out and the architectural board and um they tested the doors the outside doors and they that they're not too heavy to pull so they've got the right pressures but they're not required you know they they've met the requirements of the architectural board but the the state couldn't make them do anything other than that than what they did it's it's a tough issue it's a tough issue because this is what we're elected to do is you know I think about it in our master plan we've got our five categories and this is part of caring Community you know and the question is you know how much are we going to allocate to that and really my my aside from us our board figuring that out it's also think figuring out the equity of you know we have a Council on Aging that in theory has a great handle on the needs of the community and are we giving disproportionately to this particular thing just because they are in a you know living in there whereas there may be other seniors or other people in need houses that that really need help too and and I just don't have a handle on that in village Court comes to us and asks us for money are we going to right exactly this is giving money to a another organization another organization it is should we have them in and I mean we've talked them before but like you say they they don't really have seem to have any motivation that to either they don't have the wherewithal or they don't have the motivation on both I I think we as a board have to even if we do a stop Gap with this we have to prioritize this as something we're going to have to figure out what to do how to solve this problem have to have the difficult conversation right but you have that you put a hold on this and go revisit it next year and they get a limp along with whatever they got can I just have a quick variable so that the the funding source for this can only be used for affordable housing so yeah I would I would much have much more agreement with the argument if there was another Target for affordable housing in town that this money would be taking the place of so it can only be used for this it can't be used for the other priorities because normally this would be like an arper request You' be using this for arpa but arpa is dedicated to the larger Town priorities so if there's not another affordable housing Target which there should there should be based off the master plan this is the only thing type of thing you can spend this on right and so and the and the equity argument small the equity Travis and was articulated is we went ahead in Benfield with large we went ahead and made affordable senior housing people moved in with an understanding so before you add new affordable housing you got to at least make sure the affordable housing that you now created yeah and and in terms of helping other people who are not living in that building uh we are as helping them as well because if there are people that need um Mortgage Assistance that comes under that rental assistance thing so they are and they're well they're there was another program actually for people owning their homes for that because uh we haven't gotten AG um stuff on the tax thing but so that's why we are so we gave heating assistance to people who have mortgages you know so we're we're trying is it's not just the people at Benfield who are getting the help I just put it try to put it that way yeah they're not the only ones but they they do need this um if we care about our elderly residents about I don't think that's fair I don't think that's a fair statement that just because questioning this it means that one does not care about toally citizens I'm not saying that it's not that's not what I was saying no she's saying the opposite that that we are providing care to other um seniors in town as well if you don't support this you don't care about theity no no that's not what I said that's not at all so I think e Lees what do you think we should do Nathan you brought it up I mean do you have a opinion as to you feel strongly that we should you know take a position on this that and not support it I mean I guess I guess I feel like we should support this that something has to change right I mean I would very much oppose another one any anything else unless there's a different relationship and a better plan and a way that either as a partnership or them alone we figure out how this building is going to be managed to the benefit of the residents who are there moving forward rather than waiting for things to break where it gets to this point right I think we we either need them to step up and say this is how we're going to do it or we need them to step up and work with us about you know it maybe it is partnership I'm not really suggesting that but I mean there has to be it's a partnership now so we should either be part of what the plan is and so that you know we we we know that everything is working well and people aren't struggling there with a bad situation and having to raise it to our level and then get it through CPA in order to get something fixed right I think we need to it's broken it's it's broken this is not going to fix the problem this is only going to fix the doors but last year you got involved Ryan on I was washing machines and trash collection there was a bunch of little operational issues that you kind of stepped in on right and what was the outcome of that did Noah step up to it or we band-aided it or what there's more problems there that they can fix yeah but the stuff that we have highlighted they have they have worked to address they being no one not to not to everyone's liking in that building but to to have mitigated the complaints is there a manager up there there is and is that person on fulltime there no got other things to do he's got too small that's too small and they have a rotate a roaming staff of people that I mean it's people like custodians whatever that come and do things yes and they plow they plow their own dryway and all that does that all get done yeah they do plow they plow yes and are these people paying below Market rent yeah yeah yes and yes not all of them though right not all of them it's only and it's not fully affordable housing it's unfortunate that it's a lousy program because it's not like Village Court where you only pay 30% of whatever your income is it's and it's based on the income qualification is based on the income you're making when you get in there and then if your income goes down the rent continues to go up have any you know people left over time saying I just I don't can't for it yes I don't like it yes which they can do and then they ran it to other people who have to qualified yeah and we are giving we are giving rental subsidies to a majority of the tenants we the town the town through the rental assistance through the rental assistance program none none to Village Court because the way the the price structure is but I was Village Court able afforded them and these guys can't who manages village C it's completely it was because the way it was financed to be built that it got a different kind of program subsidy yeah okay so it's getting other money these guys just yes I mean I mean how much of this is Noah incompetence versus the poorly structured economic well a lot of it a lot of it is the poorly structured economic so we got because they have uh they have affordable housing in the Boston area that is working well that you they can managing well yeah this was this was an unusual project for them to take on out here so here's a question maybe a compromise if Steph be thinks he can do it for 30k or whatever want the appropriate 30k because he hasn't touched it yet so we don't know that that's true okay but then they can't they come back they try right yeah for me it's not the amount for me it's more the the plan it's the plan and I agree with you but it sounds wrestle it out of them well I would get it in the meantime we have residents that are really struggling with these and there's there's a lot of other things that need to get done but we're not we're not proposing this the Housing Trust is not proposing to address them because it's not at the same level as being able to get into your own GD apartment right and that's and that's the problem right right the problem is is we need a plan something right and I think that the statement is we're not going to give you anymore unless we get plan you you need to partner with us let's sit down okay so what are we going to do here guys just the just the the staff e effort in the ADV because I I do agree with you the staff effort in the advocacy so we have requested state level arpo we have met with all of the elected officials in the area we have met with Noah maybe a dozen times we we have tried to the office of disability came and reviewed whether or not there were an ADA compliance like there has been a lot of pressure and no no result so it's not can't believe I'm not sure it's all blood from the stomach but anyway a lot of efforts the point is a lot of effort has gone into trying to make we can try to do it again success for now it seems like we should just swallow hard vot it in and as Nathan suggests making an objective maybe for next year work harder maybe this goes on our one of our goals in community I think it does I would Advocate that so I have a question about the Greeno greo Dam greo greo Pond Pond didn't we just spend a ton of money redoing the dam and everything what's the what's the benefit of doing this study don't people say they there's too much or too little water going through yeah it's the water level question try to understand yeah what what is that all designed at the time Bri I'll give you this yes but there there's a disagreement over how it's impacting the surrounding areas to include the the Maple Street Bridge area and where that's coming from so the worry is is setting the pawn levels and how that impacts people upstream and downstream and I'm not sure that it's solvable just what we've been using which is measuring sticks Etc so the study would give us answers do you know that Paul Simonson one man's ceiling is another man's floor okay and then the the cranberry vog one I'm sorry I wasn't here that night the the same uh same question there except it also includes um a review of the dam of the proposed Dam uh repair design which was the issue that um created the conflict between the neighbors and the kcom so their hydrologic study which is why it's a higher cost includes um looking at the dam number one and then the FIS Creek Street Dyke Dam and also looking at the design the proposed repair for Dam number one which was the big sticking point for the residents so the consom has agreed not to move ahead with the current plan and instead have this third study done by yeah and what did you say was included in the administrative expenses of D oh 30,000 so 10,000 for um typical ad is personel assistance there's a um Association membership fee that's included in that and then a about 20,000 for a study of the Bas so why is that not a an article because you don't you don't the CPC can investigate its own future so it's looking at whether or not further investments in the black house in terms of affordable housing is appropriate or not so you don't you can't do a um you can't do a um community housing Grant and for uh a a study like this you need to the administ you can use administrative funds to figure out whether there is a project that is feasible to do on the bog house to create housing and then once you know that if there is a project then that project be um considered for CPA funds as a regular Grant request is that going to be called out as part of that presentation presentation at the request of the CPC chair so the the point of this is the select board is looking for Solutions at the blog house so is the concom because of the the way it could go back and forth and Julie and I do believe that this is the first gate so completing the study will give you a path forward or not and it's specifically Al just affordable housing or is it are their projects uses for the grand the only one we're investigating as a hous at this point couldn't be an income generator to then use the the income from that to pay for Ben yeah we're so good at portable housing yeah I agree yeah the um it may be a meeting that you weren't here Nathan did you I don't know if you had a chance to see the presentation that Julie made about the B house with the different um elements that were going to be um what would you call it the the things that would be studied the scope basically looking at at three different um aspects of uh what you might be able to do with the blog house anyway it's it's a very thorough presentation that um I'm sure you can get a copy from her if you want to take a closer look at it will'll be on the website yeah was I I must have not been it was the same night of was a CPC I actually think she did that at a different time she did it earlier yeah a prior me the consum is here I don't remember you read that so do we want to take these one at a time or take them as a group as if they were part of of a consent agenda in terms of our own recommendation well right now I guess just put it this way if we don't if we don't approve them as a cons this whole thing should have go on as we should have Pro right you know you have typos in all your parenthetic thousand yeah extra zero sorry I was going to suggest that maybe Barney you being our local grammar expert maybe have read through of this for clerical and oh yeah I think you did okay you did that might have been my fault though when maybe I cut and paste after eached okay so yeah do we want this to go as a consent agenda or do we want to take them one at a time I think we should try to consent I do too I hear two consent agendas your small I think that we've had enough discussion on each one and this is coming at the end of the meeting and I guess you're right you're trying to speed things up but maybe you know people people have more questions on this yeah indidual things well maybe maybe not but there will be a presentation up front that will address each of each of the items okay and then Wayne will ask if anybody wants to hold one out of the consent agenda for further dis I guess can do okay I'm trying to I mean I think it's worthwhile yeah this is just me speaking but it's worth about pushing the mope a little bit to see what where people's appetite I know there are people who love to come to town meeting and ask what course1 there's another group of people that doesn't go to town meeting because those be ask but me we got to kind of nut that out if we're going to get meaningful change to our composition okay so then I would support that Nathan I think that's mightbe that's fine I you the the the recommendation from the so board would be that we approve her that that not but we don't approve it's not I say you us right because because I don't I don't well then we should take if that's true then I think it deserves s pleas if we're not no I'm fine I'm fine with it just being one because I don't know that I there's only one there that I'm really wholeheartedly support and that's the senior right if we were voting on that individually you would yeah not to no I would vote to you would that that one I would vote to support is there another way you would vote not to you would that vote to SEC not to yes but I'm I'm I'm a little bit caught here right I'm trying to be really super Fair where I was not here for the presentation yes and so on the surface of it I don't support them but I I wasn't here so I think it's better if I just accuse myself um because I don't I don't want this to go up or down based upon what I know which is not I don't think sufficient for me to make the right decision so it's not that you're against the specific thing said you don't I have information my my gut is against it but I don't have the information to really know and I wasn't here as so that's not fair to Pro the Greeno one it's the green the two bug ones and the um the pond Bond yeah the Benfield and the Benfield those three I just had so many questions out but I don't want to slow the whole thing down that's my vote isn't going to I understand I make or break it but I don't feel like I know it well enough I can say yes town we should do this but but I probably will after the presentations town meeting night oh yeah we can't guarantee that I mean at least you can always vote your conscience as a president I will be voting at that's right so you know so that's why I'm saying if you want to do it as a cons if we before the election you're still a br till one yeah but as individual we all as individuals to not a citizen I mean has yes all right well so uh okay how about should we try this out then a motion that we um offer these CPA um recommendations as a consent agenda yes and and with with the with the recommendation of Passage by the select board but why don't you split it you want to do the consent agenda first yeah that it is consent agenda I would move that we um handle Article 19 the CPA recommendations as a consent agenda it's 18 now 18 18 article 18 sorry article 18 second okay any further discussion all those favor I okay that was I think you said I that's unanimous then I would just wanted to double check I don't want to misrepresent it's hard to see sometimes on the video so okay so then the um I would recommend uh passage I would recommend that the select board I move that the select board recommend passage of uh article 18 is that what it is the consens for article is it 18 yes article 18 that they we recommend they approve the consent ready cover then now you recommend that now we just recommend passage I have to say it's a consented you just recommends passage yeah okay I move that the select board recommend passage up Artic second so it's approving all of those yes yeah because you already said it's consent we we've we already said bundle them first we say we bundling them we approved them bundled them now we have to recommend whatever we want the bundle the bundle as a l okay so uh are we finish with questions any further discussion all those in favor right all those opposed it's like any exensions I'm going to abstain okay one exstension so that was we done the well we do in our vote in our in the in the minutes we in of course yes I um consulted with our accountant in um with your approval I'm going to remove effective immediately after town meeting vote from all of these articles yeah so the reason being consistency but also there are um there's at least one bucket with there wouldn't be enough to appropriate after so the difference is you would not be able to spend this from May 13th to July 1st I do not think that any would would be spent in that time frame the only real Rush one is Russia's relative um the hydrological study but we could have it out to bid and ready to go for July your author the B okay sounds good okay and with that language shows up faster than that in the CPA it's only in the CPA Lang see yeah so then you have to approve the I'll go to the election sub to but improve the warrant as a whole but I would recommend that you do so with allowing me to make yes well for there's a little bit of formatting done I moveed that the select board approved the uh warrant for the annual town meeting on May 13 2024 um allowing for uh minor uh changes um by the Town Administrator as necessary second okay any further discussion all those in favor I any opposed good so that includes the election warrant that vote no I think we have to do a separate one right no you should I mean just for Clear yeah I mean in the in our packet there's a separate one show you the election war and it's just the time it names the where the election is 7 to 8:00 the full the full Gambit and I know you put the date in the verbi but should not also be both section yeah where say section yeah before the yeah or make it some May 21st it's okay yeah okay great um and then the three yeah the three W language the three election ballot questions are uh exemption from prop 2 and A2 for the fire engine exemption from prop 2 and a half for the police department and shall car vote to have its elect town clerk become appointed town clerk so those are the three ballot questions yeah so should the proposition two and a half will be capital on this comes directly from bong I don't I don't want to touch this one okay these are from Bond Council he under to pay how you just talk when talk to bond counsil give give him the him or her the baking story because in order to bake could just it could be y Old English too um so this just allows you to tax more if you need to in order to accomplish these products does not mean that you will just means that you can formatting question in Wise question three and offset it is to as high it's not willing to touch that good year who the you all right so um do I have a you want to make this motion yes I move to approve the annual Town election warrant with ballot questions the annual Town election scheduled for May 21st 2024 in the Clark room of town hall 66 Westford Street Car Mass 01741 second uh any discussion all those in favor I any opposed right one thing I want to mention on that is that the turn around moving from a elected town clerk to an appointed town clerk I had taken kind of the lead on that the last time with the presentation or whatever um I was thinking that probably makes sense to write an article for the mosquito but I wanted to have it comes from the vice chair of the select board or something is that okay I okay that no just use you know the old P com not old word it can but we probably need to have a meeting so that you can review it because we can't all unless could I could I write it and then receive comments and then just take the comments that I decide and then no we can't do that or you can can't you April 23rd meeting so I could draft it for April 23rd and then circulate it yeah you guys you can all look at it you can circulate in the packet it's okay I better get on and I I'm way next week I oh 23rd it seems be good we got it hey rip through the rest of us and quick yeah 117 is the town ta report right but is this from before looks like it's AER just I spent much more time on the the budget the warrant so the the only thing in the TA report is previously reported items that are coming up in the draft agenda for agenda which includes uh following so uh reserve 15 minutes in case we have to do town meeting budget stuff we will have one more meeting before town meeting so that's just administrative Julie is prepared and I are prepared to discuss the fire station RFQ invited uh the fire chief and we'll invite anyone else who think relevant Jim and I have finalized the two-year road maintenance plan we will present that to you as well I think that's pretty good we have cool pictures and then 14 Estee Road just so you know this is um hooking the B Raa it's been approved by Council they did address Travis's question which was does this create further implications and it does not so each one has to be dealt with individually to include a 40b fing I want to go back for a second on the fire station designed proposal um is the chief going to be part of the that conversation okay because I think some questions have come up right about plans for the fire station so that'd be good that is my report okay thank you and pants for the first time in a month so you're better say it again yeah feeling better feeling better mostly um you won't have any more flareups and just on the calendar for our future meetings um I just a reminder to all of us right that we're not meeting on the 14th of May after town meeting we are going to meet the previous Tuesday May 7th did you get that Nathan word okay oh my goodness what a great timing you how did that Happ we have to do the minutes yeah yeah okay March pretty close March 26th get I move to approve the March 26 2024 select board meeting minutes as presented were amended second were there any amendments that people want to yeah I put a comment in I just want to talk about it quickly is is when we have letters that come in or emails um the John lavry was the specific one there was a comment above it about you know these are asteris or whatever and it was unclear to me what was in there so asked that that they put the two from like so that it looks like an email so I mean so you you are publishing what the person you sent so that was a change oh it's that it's and that's reflecting and that's now reflec there but I okay so it is a yeah okay yeah because I just think that's yeah yeah Gretchen so I have I have a couple questions on in the packet on page 133 but it's okay which page it was actually it's in the select R up packet yeah we're page on the draft on the minutes the minute five page five of 12 page five thank you I well you said page 133 and I yeah that's how I should say that okay so it it's AR you find S right the there's page numbers just P five of okay so um it says in Ben he talks about being app I think it's down okay it's about where the a of draft is the board and com discuss the impact of Waring article of 3.1% average bill and he said play clarifi that all war articles except police station R are included but should be the police station R and by truckly fire trucks excluded debt is it not so yes but the fire truck is assumed based off the fincom analysis and our discussions to be rolled into the operating budget based off the held debt capacity what I was saying is the police station would is up at top not included in that but the fire truck is paid for is if we hold the Deb clarification yeah and then at the top of the next page uh re move the meeting to nextend unspent bond proceeds citing the desire incomes comments um sorry no I'm sorry the next one unspent B bonds proceeds appropriation it not clear from this that the unspent stuff has to be spent on kind of it's not clear where it goes I know we talked about it and you have to spend it on something similar right we we kind of went through that right in other words it doesn't dump out to free cash right so you authorize the payment of indebtedness specifically the long-term debt line of the town's operating budget here am I looking so okay yep so authorizes the payment of indebtedness so other words in is that language that says the unspent money goes back into the so we're paying for long-term debt in the line item yeah so that would create a overage in that line item which would then turn to free Cas is the payment have been geted so which mean payment so there's a line item in the budget called long-term debt payment okay that's what we pay for our debt okay so in other words what this little paragraph is saying is you take the access and you pay down other Den that's kind of what that means yes I have I Barney this is highlighted because I guess Gretchen didn't know what who it was that seconded it in I I honestly don't remember that's what I told her I said I he said unless somebody else says hey why'd you put her as the seconder because I seconded it that we should just leave it as it was because I didn't think anybody would remember and one other tiny little thing you know under the unspent bonds uh headline yes third sentence down third line down first word says statue instead statute put a t in there statute yeah I missed that I got it sorry all right all right yes as amended so um and we have a second right uh any further amendments or comments all those in favor I any opposed okay great job pring yeah because this was these were tough minutes so tough minutes y okay we you good MH okay done so um any Le on reports I kind of gave mine you gave yours anybody else any Community input there's nobody in the room anybody have mine good sorry I had to unmute my computer I do but somebody else thought I heard somebody else's voice say John no can you guys hear me y yes you are freezing okay sorry um yeah I'm tired just listening so I don't know how you guys feel uh I wanted to focus on that last piece from Ryan about the fire station RFQ I have written a couple of notes to people and uh looking at the minutes from that you guys just approved from the last meeting a lot of my comments and thoughts are in there basically I think it's too soon for an RFQ because we don't have a goal for the fire department a mission statement for the fire department and kind of what we want our fire department to be uh that sounds kind of silly because you want the fire department to put out fires but there's a lot of room to maneuver within that description and I think if we if we ask Ryan and Julie to go get um some Architects to design and uh potentially build a fire station they're going to bring you back Architects and Spades they're going to architect heck out of this thing but you are not asking them the right question we're not tasking them appropriately uh because we don't have a long-term plan for what we want the fire department to be and if it heads in the long direct wrong direction it's going to cost us a boatload of money and we probably won't ever get to where we want it be but we'll still spend all the money and we'll have all the equipment and we'll have all the infrastructure and it won't be that useful so I'd really like you guys to think about um uh coming up with a long range plan for the fire department before you toas Ryan and jewelie to go uh H an RFQ uh for architectural support I think there's a lot of questions a lot of ground to cever before you do that okay thank you that's excellent I don't see anybody else uh online well wait I have can you get me the screen so I can see if there's anybody else online who wants to make Anya is still online all right anybody else want to offer Community input seeing none I would um entertain a motion to a Jour and moved as I need seconds second good all those in favor great thank you thank you