##VIDEO ID:VgcC3GxNiqo## e e e e [Music] w [Music] [Music] [Music] this is a hearing of the cham Conservation Commission being held on August 14th 2024 in accordance with the Massachusetts Wetlands protection act and the town of chadam wetlands protection bylaw and regulations my name is Karen Lattin and I serve as the chair today's hearing is being broadcast live on exfinity channel 18 and is being recorded on the ond demand archives available on the town's website is being being conducted in person by phone and by video conference the agenda instructions on how to attend and copies of documents for review are posted on the town's website to all participants whether you're attending by phone or online please remain muted unless you've been recognized by the chair when recognized please identify yourself for the record if you're attending by phone you can mute and unmute by using star 6 if if you're online and you are not a commissioner please keep your camera turned off unless you've been recognized indicate that you wish to speak by using the raised hand feature so that we have a record of a quorum I will now ask each commissioner to indicate their presence Vice chair Elise Gord Gordon pres present unmute please no I am un there you go present Janet Williams is not here Cheryl missery present Eric Hilbert is not here Paul Johnson present and Associate member Bob dveo present and I am here we have established that we have a quorum before we begin the agenda are there any announcements about any requests for continuances today Paul is he muted we're not hearing you Paul are you there Paul Whitman maybe he's not on let me check I'm not seeing him Crystal do you know where Paul is I do not okay well I I do know that 97 toppy run had requested a continuance to August 28th right okay and that's the only one that I have as well okay thank you Crystal I can do it at this Paul at this point Paul Whiteman if he's here chams conservation agent will now lead us through the agenda you there Paul no okay I will The Following applicants have request in order of conditions 53 Marsh View Road alvarro and Laura Mastro B buono map HC parcel s38 SE e1- 3676 demolition of existing dwelling and construction of a new dwelling do we have anyone here here for 53 Marsh view David Clark are you here if not it must be okay because he did receive it this is interesting Karen it's Paul hi paen it's Paul hi uh my clock says one o'clock so did you start a little bit earlier ye no we it says 105 here oh my uh computer clock is off I apologize that's okay I read in the order of conditions sure I'm yeah you're in the first one I got you all right so but I don't do we have David Clark or anybody representing marshview doesn't look like it J Master this is Jim mastero the homeowner online hi uh have you read the order of conditions yes and is uh is it okay do you have any comments questions no none at all I'm surprised David isn't there um he was supposed to be there but um yeah no questions at all perfect thank you so much all right then we are ready for a motion Cheryl I move that we close the hearing and approve the order of conditions for 53 Marsh View Road Paul second all right roll call Paul abstain Cheryl I Elise I and I say I so that passes thank you okay Paul we've got the second one okay thank you madam chair good afternoon Commissioners uh the the next item on the agenda is a uh submitted field change request this was an after Thea uh field change request the address's 227 Vineyard Avenue and as an arrow is the owner map 11c parcel d131 D SC number 10 3471 the project was a garage addition and invasive species control this was an after Thea field change request for an extension of an existing low native New England Fieldstone wall for stabilization of the garage foundation to protect the from erosion by wind stream tides and storm water runoff I met with the building inspector y yest today as you know this has been continued several times um there are issues with the soil Conservancy District which we do not enforce that is their uh purview um after discussing this with him um uh I'd like to recommend we continue it to a date maybe in October there's going to be a hearing before uh the zba and the extension wall may or may not um have to come out um it it so we're we need to sort of wait to see what the uh what the issue is uh with them and let them make their decision with regard to the extension of the uh New England native Fieldstone wall so I'd recommend something in October and it looks like uh October 2nd October 2nd would be fine okay then we need a motion Cheryl please I move that we continue field change requests for 227 Vineyard AV to the meeting on October 2nd second all right Paul I Cheryl I Elise I and I say I so we'll uh continue that to this 2nd of October thank you okay Paul okay next on the agenda is a submitted request for determination of applicability the address is 434 cocko Road Christopher and Susan Wilson are the applicants map 5B parcel 15-17 R 24-22 the project was to install a new septic system in waterline and abandon the old existing cess pool okay and we do have a representative here so thank you Hi how are you good how are you doing good if you could identify yourself first sure I'm Eric Mitchell from jcls design company representing the Wilsons on the proposed uh SE septic upgrade uh the property was recently transferred which triggered uh septic inspection um which was not required because it uh is currently served by a cesspool which is an automatic failure so under uh Title 5 and the local regulations we're required to replace the septic system um so we' have proposed a leech area a septic tank and a pump chamber um a portion of it falls within uh the 100 foot buffer zone to uh the top of Coastal Bank associated with cck Cove Beach um it also lies partially within the riverfront area associated with Cove Creek um as you can see from the site plan uh there are a lot of constraints given the size the shape of the lot and the location of the dwelling uh however we were able to fit in in a conventional Title 5 system um and that was recently approved by the Board of Health uh all construction will be done from the existing driveway in the front of the house um with appropriate erosion control uh in place either staked uh silt fence or straw uh Bales uh Waddles rather uh to prevent any erosion from coming down into into the parking lot of uh of uh F CO Beach so it's pretty straightforward uh the existing cess pool will be filled with clean sand and compacted um and the area excavated in front of the house will be uh regraded and uh I believe Jason has proposed American Beach Grass to be planted in the uh in the front of the house there where there would be some disturbance um all components of the septic will be H20 uh so they will be able to take a vehicle load uh if necessary okay any questions do any Commissioners have any questions I got a couple car go ahead um so the uh there's a c I was out there this morning there's a a good siiz mature R Cedar where the septic tank is going yes um that's going to be removed correct yes yes and I was wondering if you could um in Li of that uh being removed wondering if you could plant some I talked to the owner the owner was out there this morning too and he was pretty receptive to uh planting some uh red Cedars uh to the north of the patio on that property line okay for privacy and wondering because that was a that that's a good mature red cedar if you could plant three on that corner there where the patio is yeah I I don't see an issue with that other than space yeah might be a little tight might be a little tight for three um maybe even even one yeah I think one set back in the far corner there give it give it some area to grow yeah so it's not growing into the back corner of the the dwelling and the and the uh the cess pool is going to be uh filled you said yes yeah filled and compacted and the patio will be re with the same block uh yes there's been no proposal for a new patio at this point so it will be covered up with the existing blocks um okay and uh he did he did ask about putting something on the south end of the patio for privacy as well um I know there are a lot of invasives on that property line yes uh he mentioned privet and I I said that privet wouldn't be allowed because it's invasive as well but uh uh if you could put some uh maybe inkberry on that South End just to again uh give us some compensation for the cedar that's taken out sure uh just for privacy yep I don't think we'd have a any issue with that yeah there is uh would have to be planted on the inside of the retaining wall between the patio where there is existing vegetation now uh but I don't think there's an issue with that yeah could you separate them from invasives on that end uh is there enough room to for them to yeah there's a there's maybe 3 feet between the edge of the p patio in that inside of that retaining wall yeah okay so there's a little room there to plant a couple small shrubs I think yeah maybe three odd numbers are better with uh you know Landscaping looks looks a little bit more natural you know yeah uh but yeah if you could do three ink berry there and the red cedar on the North End that would be good as far as I'm concerned I agree very good thank you anyone have anything else a lease no Bob just covered it I was concerned with the the plantings so thanks Bob okay um Paul can for the RDA can we add that they're planting a cedar and three ink berries to it yes that's perfect okay then I think we are Cheryl and Paul Paul Johnson do you have any thing to add okay then we're ready for a motion I move that we approve the request for determination for 434 COV road with a -2 determination second Paul I Cheryl I Elise I and I say I so that is all set thank you so much thank you very much okay Paul we're ready for the next one okay next on the agenda Madam chair is a uh notice of intent uh application the address is 177 Countryside Drive Robert P and Natalie Coleman D Fuller are the applicants map 6 L I think it is parcel n14 D number se10 3694 the project is construction of additions and Renovations of farmers porsch and Second Story expansion to a single family dwelling work will occur within the 100 foot of a Coastal Bank on monomo river with Riverfront area involved and within the Pleasant Bay AC EC that's the project great thank you and Stephanie's here hi Stephanie good afternoon Stephanie sein with Brer and Wilcox representing Natalie and Robert Fuller who are the owners of the property at 177 Countryside Drive um we have some subed since the last hearing a revised plan uh hopefully you're looking at the site plan dated August 2nd 2024 um so the project here is uh addition and renovation to an existing single family dwelling they're going because of the proximity to the resource area and the existing building already well within the uh no disturb Zone uh it's for the most part just a vertical expansion a new second floor over the uh main portion of the existing house with no change in footprint uh there are also um renovations to the rest of the building that are being proposed uh removing and replacing uh Windows siding uh roof Etc um two of the existing exterior doors are being eliminated along with the associated steps and ramps and um uh stairs going up to them and they are uh proposing a new covered porch in front of the remaining front entrance um so I uh submitted revised coverage Cals based on the removal of the existing steps and then the construction of of the new porch within the 0 to 50 foot buffer we are uh proposing a 45t reduction in um coverage and then within the 5050 to 100 100 ft is a 25 square foot increase for a net reduction of 20 square fet on the property um we are showing on the site plan some proposed mitigation uh roughly 80 square feet of the um the top of that borrow pit next to the house that is uh bare and uh I think has some erosion uh they're proposing to first of all remove the invasive vines that in that area and then plant the bare areas with um Red Cedar Beach Plum little blue stem and Beach Grass to hopefully um hold that in place and and eliminate that erosion problem and they're also proposing to reace the existing Foundation plantings with Native shrubs and flowers and there was a a list of the species that they would use um included with the The Narrative um I did provide uh um project narrative construction protocol uh performance standards Alternatives analysis and variance request um hopefully you've had a chance to read that um and lastly uh this does require a special permit from the zoning board of appeals for expansion within the required set back to a Coastal Bank and within the required set back to the front property line I thought that it had been filed but I'm not sure if it has it hasn't the soonest that it would be heard would be September 26th right so I don't know how many people were able to read your narrative because we only received it yesterday morning M um and I just passed it out to the people here before the meeting okay and we have Elise who's not even well she probably saw it online but is not even in in this meeting so physically and I know you have mitigation listed on the back page but we don't have a mitigation plan you've shown where mitigation is going but you don't say how much of each uh plant is going to go in and where they're going and as you know we usually get that M so we need that okay um having said that you did give us the narrative the work protocol the Alternatives analysis the performance standards I have not had time to read all of it uh because I've been doing other things to prepare for this meeting and so I can't ask anything about it I'm hoping maybe some others have read it and I'm going to turn it over to the other Commissioners at this point so does anybody have any questions comments any of the Commissioners Bob do you uh I got one question um Stephanie on the on the foundation plants that are proposed uh Beach Plum is in there Beach Plum gets about 6 feet uh high and spread um up against the building it wouldn't be a a choice of mine uh for a foundation um so you know if it's away from the building fine that's probably why we need the plan too just just to see where these plants are yeah okay going to be planted so it's um Mrs Fuller who is um she is had I believe she's a a Master Gardener and she is involved with different um um activities um and has uh been spending I think the last 10 years um maintaining the the um plantings that were were previously done um and so she is she has chosen these species but I can try and get some more more specifics on what exactly and where and size and all that that we need that okay in order to do the order because when it comes time to issue a certificate of compliance there's no way just looking at this list that we know exactly where they're located did they you know to to figure out if they survived and and you know yes I know you have an overall reduction so um you may not even want to call this mitigation you might want to I mean I think it is mitigation you're not it's not a restoration but so we could leave that word but um we do need it on a plan and identifying size you know all the usual things that we ask for okay um and are usually provided at the time of the application so given that any other questions Elise anything no with the plan you know we'll be able to react more I was I think the list of plants is fine Bob's point on Beach Plum um is a is really a good one as usual um but without the plan it's really hard to react Cher I am I am curious wondering if there is a way they can use the word restoration instead of mitigation because you do tie your hands for ever when you call it mitigation um so I mean I don't know some you're going to if you're going to pull up all the foundation plans well then it is restoring I don't know if it's if there's a way to get away from just for your your client sake if we can we could simply call it a planting plan then yeah yes you can yeah okay yeah absolutely um obviously we need to continue this for I I think at this point we're as long as you can get us a plan a planting plan or whatever plan you want to call it um then I think we can go to an order um you're not even scheduled for zba yet right so what I'd like to do is put push this out to possibly October 2nd for an order but you'll get us as soon as possible uh a plan and so that we can incorporate that into the order and at that time if we still have questions I think we could go over those then because it isn't a a large you know area that you're doing so so are you do we need to continue to a certain date yes in advance of October 2nd if we would continue to October 2nd for an order of conditions okay which we will prepare and have ready but we need that planting plan as soon as possible so that when we're writing the order we have that and can include it in our findings our conditions and then at that time on October 2nd or if you want it later we can do it later we could if there are any questions about the planting plan we could ask them then and modify the order so no meeting in between now and the second I don't think we at this point I think you've provided all of the things that we've been asking for since July so I think at this point we're ready okay and October 2nd is a good date well it's the first one pretty much after right it gives us time yes okay and as long as zba doesn't change anything right if they change anything then we'll continue that to a later date after that okay is that okay that sounds perfect all right so we need a motion to go to October 2nd 201 24 I move that we 177 Countryside drive to the meeting on October 2nd 2024 for an order of conditions second Paul I Cheryl I Elise I and I say I so we'll see you on October 2nd and hopefully the sooner the better we will have a planting plan okay great thank you very much thank you okay Paul okay thank you madam chair next on the agenda is uh another notice of intent application that was submitted uh in accordance with the requirements for an emergency certification uh for 97 tipy run staging and access on 75 tipy run the applicant is tr97 nominee trust map 14 A3 parcels 2-b and 131 D number se10 3690 uh as I said the project is an emergency repair of an existing Coastal Engineering structure um the applicant has requested a continuance to uh August 28th and I received that yesterday from the project U manager so uh I recommend we continue it uh to that date perfect thank you which time I all right I move that we continue 97 tipy run to to the meeting on August 28th 2024 second Paul I Cheryl I Elise I and I say I okay thank you Paul next one okay now we're down to a request for a certificate of compliance the address is 24 and two sou pwn Road the applicant is Edward and Cheryl Acton map 17j Parcels 2 and 7-4 D number SC10 3845 the project was removal and reconstruction of a single family home construction of a detached garage Rock revetment uh repair and Associated site improvements um I went out to the site uh this morning talked with the owner who happened to be there I know some of the Commissioners have been there as well um I have a complete application a certification from the engineer that the project is in substantial compliance uh that was dated this month I also have after an inspection a uh letter from Wilkinson uh on the planting uh mitigation that was done and they are indicating that they believe the project is in substantial compliance with regard to the mitigation they've requested a uh a condition which allows them to maintain um and conduct three or four times a year the mitigation uh plants and condition uh for treatment of any state listed invasive species and non-native plants that are observed establishing in the mitigation areas and this would be an ongoing condition um uh the temporary irrigation still looks like it's up I did inspect the bank um it looks stable to me this jetting most of the plants uh in the grasses have have uh done well there are some plants in the mitigation area just before you get to the the uh staircase over the Coastal Bank to the dock um that are not doing well there were I I think I counted maybe 10 that were dead um the owner thinks there might be some saltwater intrusion coming into their um irrigation system having said that there was a substantial amount of mitigation done on the property um I think if the I obviously let the commission decide what they want to do um but my recommendation would be um if you decide that the mitigation in compliance because the house and the pool and everything else that was done looks beautiful it was done very well um and it's in substantial compliance I'm just talking about the mitigation and the Cal bank issue um if you decide that the mitigation is enough it's 90% you know uh survived they will be able to continue maintaining replacing those plants with this ongoing condition um maybe leave the mitigation excuse me the uh irrigation system in for a while um until some of those plants have been replaced so it's a question of do you fi the mitigation inadequate and has at least 90% survived I did not find excuse me the permanent marker um for the mitigation area I'm not sure where was supposed to be I looked at the plan um but there is a vegetated buffer strip on the top of the Coastal Bank which has done very well um so those are the issues and I'll just turn over to you at this point Madam chair I agree I I did go out today and it looked good to me I did see that there were some plants that were um had not looked like they had not survived um can we in the as an ongoing can we say that they can leave the temporary in until I don't know start of next summer or two years whatever you think um yeah I mean I I I think it's essential that in order you know for plants have to have water if you get into another Dr situation they're not going to make it um so the ongoing condition I would say a couple of years um at least two until they establish them s maybe Bob can chime in on this but um uh we leave it up for a period of time we can put that in the certificate compliance that has to come out uh at a future date couple years down the road once things are established where the mitigation isn't doing well um but yes we can do that and we will include this condition that they ask for to maintain uh and keep down the invasives um three to four times a year that would be an ongoing condition right um any other Commissioners go out and have any questions or comments Bob go ahead uh I had a I didn't go out physically to look at it again but I did look at the photos uh online and I I did see the mitigation areas uh special condition number six uh reads that um there needs to be demarcation with either stone or low split split rail fence did you see that out there Paul the demarcation no I did not and I didn't and I actually asked Paul about that um I mean yeah I couldn't find it and I didn't know if I wasn't looking in the right spot so um I don't know can we do a partial and say that they need to demarcate I mean they have to put in the stone or this low split rail um there is somebody Ed Acton has his hands up if we want to let him speak first okay Mr you're I think muted we're not hearing you you turn up your volume yeah maybe turn up the volume maybe we absolutely cannot hear you well I just heard a little very very faint no do you want to try calling the phone number uh yes very faintly I can hear Paul why don't you speak while he's doing that um well as I said I didn't see the demarcation you know where it was supposed to be this you know the mitigation area is substantial it doesn't I looked on the plan I might have missed it but I didn't I couldn't find where that was supposed to be the mitigation runs a along all the edges around the property and you know on the Coastal Bank and I would imagine it would be somewhere on the on the east or west side of the property but I did not uh I didn't locate it I suppose we could require a small split rail fence you know 12 Ines off the ground along um the mitigation area once we can establish where that was and I can reach out to Sean Riley I did already but he's probably busy I'm on the I'm on the call right okay Sean how you doing okay good maybe Sean you can go because I'm think Mr Acton's still getting on yeah Ed's on the call as well we haven't been able to hear him he wanted to answer but um we asked him to call in because for some reason we can't hear him I'm sorry what was the question uh demarcation go ahead yes so yeah so there wasn't a steel Edge on that well it said Boulder well stones or um a low split rail fence Y and we couldn't find that all right let me let me talk to Ed about that uh Ed are you back on you're muted if you're on there you go Ed we can hear you I can't hear him yeah you're gonna have to speak up Ed uh I have the volume set as high as it can go it's getting a little better maybe get closer I can convey what you're saying Ed so I can hear you I got mine turned all the way up um okay I I just wanted to um address the markers there's a a couple of cobblestone markers on the uh on on that line that uh must be covered by vegetation but I can certainly clean those off and get those more noticeable all right so Ed saying there are some Cobblestone markers that are covered by vegetation he said he could clean those off yeah that would because they're supposed to Mark the area so we're supposed to be able to see them um we we've let the V vegetation grow into G area I'll I'll I can certainly unmark them and you want to clean just clean those up and and take some uh photos of that and we can get those to to Paul and the the commission also um he did go above and beyond the mitigation we did plant about 30 of the Native cedar trees on the property think we've lost four or five of them there is a substantial amount of no I I did see that there were plent I don't think we're necessarily questioning the mitigation except for near year um your uh stairway stairway and you know dock going out to the floating um area so we were going to put in that you could have um temporary mitigation for a period of time and Bob didn't I say irrigation yeah that's why I said temporary irrigation Oh I thought said mitigation no irrigation so Bob your opinion as far as the demarcation goes too uh we want more than a couple of cobblestones I mean usually every 8 ft or so we'll have a stone or some kind of fencing just to protect those areas uh from Mowing and uh people walking through and just to call them out you know because they're pretty important to the whole project I can how long do you think they should have the temporary uh temporary uh most of the plants have survived it's just a matter of a few even if you had the temporary in that area where the uh by the stairway with a plants have died uh otherwise from the photos it looks pretty good it looks like everything's established pretty well I went out and it it I was out there this morning so I thought it looked pretty good but that one area there was an issue so Paul how do you want to proceed well um I mean I think everything I I I was ready to recommend uh approval with with uh can you hear me okay yes we're hearing you fine yeah I was I mean we could continue it continue it for a couple of weeks give them a chance to put um the demarcation um markers in uh as Bob has requested um and you know I other than that I I think the castal bank looked really good to me they did go above and beyond with with the mitigation um with the cedar trees and 90% of it is is more than that it's probably U healthy so it's really just um a matter of getting those stones in and if you're comfortable with that we can put this on for you know a couple of weeks or a week whatever I mean our next hearing is the 28th we could do it that then and I everyone's seen it I've inspected it those who haven't can take a look and I think we could wrap it up at that point I agree uh how how does that sound Sean and and Mr Acton that's fine that sounds good okay so we'll continue this for the certificate of compliance to um no till the 28th August 28th can I ask one question Sean yep so uh it says Rock revent and repair um I know this I know the applicants are looking to have the uh the doc access stairs over the Coastal Bank wi and they've got a an application they're thinking about filing or have already filed zba um but I went down on the bank I didn't notice maybe it's just grown over um can you just elaborate a little bit on that um I know the bank was in rough shape before this was done but um the a lot of the I didn't see a lot of the The Rock rment maybe because there been nourishment put and and things have grown over it but um am I wrong about that or am I yes so there wasn't anything done to the Rock retman itself so there's a rock retman out there and then there is a a granite cap that's there all we did was essentially um infill the grade behind the um behind the the granite uh the row of granite blocks uh and put Filter Fabric behind it we didn't um we didn't do any other modifications there is a a cut in stair that was already there uh and a small access path that was already there that's built into the re revetment other than that we didn't do anything to the revetment I know the neighboring property um is Before You Now with uh a portion of the revetment that has fallen uh into a sinkhole out there uh to the um northest M yeah okay that that that's great um as I said the Casta Bank looks really good compared to what it was a few years back so I think they did a terrific job with it and um let's just continue with the 28th if the commission so desires and we can get those other Market out there and then we can we can wrap this up very good we'll send you in the uh pictures of those okay thank you Sean thank you okay Cheryl thank you I move that we continue the certificate of compliance for 24 and2 saltpond Road to August 28th 2024 second okay Paul hi Cheryl hi Elise I and I say I okay thank you Paul next um can I before we get to the minutes of uh June 5th um David Clark sent me an email um on 53 excuse me on 443 Cal Cove um basically he said he was longed logged in and unmuted um I'm going to read the email it says this is a com com excuse me uh give me one second to pull up the email uh the Ellis plan that was submitted is not stamp by qualified professional no sever stamp sanitarians are not allowed by law to prepare plans that do not have a surveyor stamp I emailed him back and said is this a comcom issue or more of a board of health issue we approve the location the Board of Health does the sanitarian uh aspect of it and they may get a plan and uh we've already moved on it he he just was unmuted so I guess what I'll David are you there I don't even see that he's logged in uh he yeah well he says he was um so I guess what I you know given the issue that he's raised I'll talk to Judy um okay but you you've approved it if there's no issue we can just go forward they can take care of their engineering plan with the Board of Health when that permit issues but uh if it's not a concom issue then we're done if it is we'll we'll probably have to re advertise and fix it yeah um all right okay all right so now we're on to the minutes uh to be approved for June 5th 2024 were there any modifications to the minutes by any of the Commissioners I have June 12th on my agenda the agenda got changed oh that's probably why yes it was supposed to be June 5th and um originally said June 12th I I notified Crystal not understanding and so um that's that's why that's like that but let's see we don't have actually enough people to approve these minutes because Eric's not here and Janet's not here and Bob is no longer on it oh you can approve minutes right I think yes because you were in attendance so we're okay we have four people few otherwise we're going to have to table it to next time and then we might still not GNA play musical chairs all right so we're okay because Bob can approve minutes I move that we approve the minutes for the June 5th 2024 meeting second all right Paul I you have to abstain you weren't there abstain sorry Cheryl I uh Elise I and Bob I and I say I okay we're good and that's approved um and Crystal there were no changes so those can go every place that you need to put them okay Paul are there any unforeseen things uh uh just one um you you had raised the issue of um having uh associate members uh be allowed to vote I I alerted GRE Greg to that issue I think it would be great for um Bob doio to be able to vote it is you need a a a charter Town Charter change town meeting and an act of the legislature to do it five six 78 towns have done it in including Orleans um and what we should probably pursue that Karen at your uh Direction because I think it would be great to have and also think can be new members coming on would be more motivated if they could vote agree but um it'll take some time but we will go forward with it with our Council and what we we have to do do we as a commission need to vote to have that go move forward I don't know I don't I mean we could you know always do meeting if we yeah we could always do it next week and I I'll I'll have a discussion with Greg and um see where he wants to go with this and and maybe we can get it moving but it is a process yes um and it may it may very well require vote so but for now I think we just need to explore what do we have to do and how do we go about it right and I did forward to you the two emails Cheryl sent me from Orleans and thank you Cheryl for all your help because we I we definitely need to pursue this and Bob's been on longer than I have and you know he's he's going to the sites he's at the meetings he should be able to vote and we need it okay thank you anything else you're welcome no that's it anybody else have anything okay Cheryl I move that we adjourn second Paul I Cheryl I Elise I Bob I and I say I that's a wrap thank you thank you all yep [Music] [Music] [Music]