##VIDEO ID:LJ_NiIbzSjo## e e e e e e e e e e good morning hi I'm uh Frank massina and this is the January 21st 2025 meeting of the chattam historical commission before we start we have a number of um notices we have to read please note this meeting is being recorded and will be available short Hereafter for a scheduled and On Demand viewing on any smartphone or tablet device if anyone else is recording the meeting please notify the chairman seeing none pursuant to Governor Hy's March 29 20123 signing of the acts of 2023 extending certain covid-19 measures adopted during the state of emergency suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law General law 30 a20 until March 31st 2025 this meeting of the chatam historical commission is being conducted in person and via remote participation March 31st coming soon every effort will be made to ensure the public can adequately access the proceedings provided for in the order a reminder that a person who would like to listen to this meeting while it is in progress may do so by calling the phone number 508 945 4410 conference ID 93779 573 hashtag or join the meeting online via Microsoft teams through the link on the posted agenda while this meeting is a live broadcast and Sim and and simulcast on channel on chadam TV despite our best efforts we may not be able to provide for Real Time access and we'll post a record of this meeting on the website as soon as possible excuse me you had the I read the wrong one yeah so you could just read the um number again please okay you know what I was doing on you were on the minutes I was reading it for the minutes so what's what's different the date you said January 21st just reiterate February 4th and call in okay starting off with a bang again folks good morning welcome to the February 4th 2025 meeting of the chatam historical commission okay uh unknown participant is now joining yeah the reference ID if you're interested is 903 779 573 right here oh it changed so this is a different meeting okay this is our Chang got it uh reference the reference ID 1114 32853 hashtag thank you what would I do without you okay let's proceed R call uh Bob Le here Nancy bar here Stephanie Hamilton here Sandy Porter here janon Tennyson here Robert Stevens here and Robert Wilson here Robert is a newly appointed uh member of the commission is an alternate position welcome Robert and the chair is here we have a uh full all the members all the full members of the commission are here and voting so Robert again welcome you will be participating in all the discussion except you just don't vote at this particular time uh again to remind the members of the public we do have an additional open alternate position if you are interested in joining the historical commission unknown participant is now joining I'm sorry it's just the online let you know what online participant for some reason someone had something to say or just just a comment okay all right here we go uh first thought of a business uh is the minutes of January 21st 2025 I thought that looked familiar any comments Corrections yes on page on page two the fifth word from the top should be flood zone not floor zone H got that any seventh word any of the comments Corrections additions deletions seeing none I move acceptance of the minutes second second thank you very much roll call on the minutes uh Bob yes Nancy yes Stephanie yes Sandy yes Janet yes Robert yes and the chair votes yes thank you very much got is somebody saying something you're hearing something but there it's not you don't need to is someone outside could members who are calling in could you please mute your microphones thank you very much okay uh we have uh actually two applications one is a continuation and the other was one new application so let's get to the new application which is uh 244 12 due drive this is an application to be heard in accordance with chapter 158 uh for a change this application uh I think it's worthy of my taking a minute or two to explain to the members of the commission and to the public uh this is a property that actually is just 75 years old recently I guess it's 77 years old and um it goes into the category of properties which were when we did the survey of most all historic properties in town and we're going to be talking more about that later on I guess the time we would the the cut off was 75 or or 5 75 when we did all the survey of everything I believe he looked at 50 years old 50 years y so when this was um the town was surveyed this this property was not surveyed and there was no Form B for the property so was questionable whether property was historically significant I just as worthy this the commission has in in initiated a few years ago A administrative review process so when an application comes before the commission and it's a relatively minor change minor alterations of repair uh we don't necessarily require a full hearing but in this case it was more than just a minor alteration so why don't you explain what it is you're doing and we can take it from there so good morning my name is John Cassel from whitcom building and remodeling um what we propose to do here is put a foundation under the house uh the cottage so very simple uh disconnect all the utilities septic um anything that's connected at the bottom of the house raise the house a little bit just enough for um the uh excavator to get underneath to dig out what we need to dig out and then pour foundation and then put the house right back down no change in elevation okay all right the the procedure that we use information it's your first time before us we first thing we do after we get a g gener sense of what you're proposing is well we look at it and well is this property historically significant if we determine it is historically significant then we get into the large discussion so I think very quickly I'd like to kind of walk around the room and ask the members of the Kion how you feel relative to the property which you feel although it's 77 years old if you feel it is historically significant it's not in a cottage Community per se but it is a typical Cottage in that part of CH so uh let me see how you feel I'll start down there Robert uh it's a it's a nice little cottage but I don't feel it's historically significant Okay sandy I did not excuse me I did not make the site visit but based on the pictures I don't see any historical significance although it is a cute Gage Stephanie I don't find it historically signit okay Janet no I agree it's lovely Cottage but it's great what you're doing but not historically significant Nancy um I think the age makes makes it significant but it is not historically significant in and of itself okay Robert Bob how do you feel Bob okay and here we go Mr Wilson you're going to be Mr Wilson that's how I'm going do turn got to turn it on I agree that property does not seem to be historically significant okay you joined the club of people who ref who forget to hit the button but don't worry about it you'll get reminded trust me Bob I I agree with the above it just doesn't meet any of the other criteria beond beond basically the age so I guess what would where it seem to be consensus that among anonymously that this property does not meet the criteria for historical significance as such I think Mr uh Bob if you could give us a motion I move the chadam historical commission finds that the building located at 12d drive is not historically significant because it does not meet any of the definitional criteria in section 158 D2 a b or c of the bylaw therefore the commission does not impose a de demolition delay a second okay got a second all right any the comments from the uh public or members of the commission okay having none we'll proceed Bob uh yes Nancy yes Stephanie yes Sandy yes Janet yes Robert yes and the chair vote yes thank you very much good Lu take care nice to see you likewise okay here we go uh the next application is a continuance of an application which I if it was continued from 11:19 I don't know when we first heard it August August so it was a summertime application uh later on in the agenda we're going to be addressing the issue of continuances and but we'll do that separately in the meantime we could proceed for members of the public this is uh application 2417 uh to be heard with both chapter 158 or demolition delay uh 75 hallway Street in addition as part of the application this property is a contributing structure in the National registered district and uh we're going to be hearing that also under discussions with the cape God commission whether or not it would be referred to the cape card commission for a substantial alteration to a to a contributing structure so uh this a bit confusing uh we have a number of pieces of Correspondence which we will get to shortly uh uh for members of the public Just for information What's Happening Here is the the applicant has presented another change to the property uh and uh we asked him to go back two TW twice I guess and work with Sarah Corf and the cape card commission to see if we could find a way to minimize the impact of the change to the historic structure uh I appreciate your cooperation and your working with Sarah KF we do have corresponden from Sarah Corf I can read that too you got that okay and and I appre appreciate the fact that you have uh provided a rather substantial package killed a lot of trees here it far exceeds what we really require but we do appreciate it uh so I guess at this particular Point might introduce yourself formally Bill and let's talk where we are and where we're going to go with this all right thank you U Bill Riley on behalf of uh Joanne baram and Rob barsamian Rob is here today uh since we last met uh we've had extensive conversations uh with Sarah Corf as we attempt to modify the building in a manner which uh she finds acceptable and so uh working with uh Mr aarn who's also here I think you should come up here uh you know I think I think we have a design that well you know difficult but I think it's a good design and something that as I say Sarah has indicated U she can live with so ready well let me just one one thing bill you know the term acceptable the process with the cape cot commission is very simple uh the cape cot commission would prefer that we try to resolve things locally and we go back to the Sarah Sarah CF for The public's information Sarah Corf is the preservation specialist uh staff to the cape cart commission and we try to find a way to proceed and uh we'll talk more about Sarah's final comments relative to acknowledging that the building uh you know alterations may be okay so but it's our decision the final not not Sarah cffs yes I understand that what I was saying was that uh she's not wild about it but she could live with it and that was that's all I was in she say had nothing to do with you guys she's not what she's not wild about it but she can live with it thank you very much go ahead okay is it son yeah Patrick is well to give some more clarity please introduce yourself for patri Hearn architect for the barsamian um to really put some more clarity to what we were trying to do with Sarah it's really important and um based on on the the last presentation that we had done uh we uh reached out to Sarah to get her opinion to share with you uh here today and what she said was uh while the applicant had included numerous photographs of the surrounding area to show the scale and style of architecture in the vicinity the review questioned before the chadam historical commission is as following is whether the proposed plans would impact the building's historic features and its listing on the national register of historic places so that's what you're being asked to judge now she went on to say that commission staff suggests that if additional changes are proposed to this building they should be made to non-historic portions of the structure which we've done such as the Gable roofed L on the east side of the building a modest expansion of this L that impacts a small portion of the original roof form might be accomplished as long as the majority of the original roof slopes in the North and South Gable end forms are maintained which we've done the proposed plans also include some changes to the first floor aiding a window on the north wall and an interior fireplace and extending the east side deck along much of the south side of the building these proposed first floor changes would not impact the character defining features of this historic structure so that was the mission that we were given yeah and we basically took her her lead on the design we shared it with her and that uh what's before you today she's commented on and she said uh back on January 23rd of 2025 based on the plans you shared dated January 16 2025 the latest proposed appears to re retain the original structures character defining features including the majority of the original roof slope the gabled end roof forms in the west facade roof configuration as such acknowledging that this building has already seen significant alterations many over time I do not believe that the proposed plans would threaten the building's National register listing and that she sent a forward letter a copy to you so um I think the process has worked well um we're talking about 460 some square feet of an addition the the zoning height is 30 fet in the area we're at 28 ft um is 28 ft the rich height of the new yes the Edition yes which was missing from the drawings I guess you got well it was on it was in the it it's in the packet it's in there we just couldn't find it it's there it's small letters okay thank you I had a find of myself with the magnifying all right thank you uh so so we're under the height restriction we are in mass and scale we're significantly smaller than than the abing houses around it which we have photographic documentation that we can talk to uh to you all about and that um the historic defining features of the house which is basically the long roof uh has being maintained whereas in the in a previous scheme we were modifying it and she was quite concerned that those elements that are left of this structure as it exist today that she determined our character defining features are now uh not being modified and So based on on that overall uh design direction that we did in in conjunction with Sarah's acknowledgement that we are not affecting the elements that she deems historic as it would relate to a national register building I think we've got a winning solution that satisfies what our client is trying to achieve to get a little more square footage the bedroom count doesn't change it's no more of an intensive use um the footprint doesn't change in the building uh and that the character defining historic elements are not being modified and and and certified by by Sarah as an advisory person to your board it's your decision but we all we all know that she is a an excellent resource for uh questions of of this type and that you strongly suggested that we reach out to to her which we did and um and I think the result of the design speaks for itself it accomplishes what the barians are trying to do to getting a a little bit better bedroom configuration not increasing the bedrooms not affecting the historic elements as Sarah defined it and um and not changing the footprint and the overall Mass scale of the building is significantly smaller than the abing house and many of the houses in the area so it's not volumetric it's it's not going to the maximum height it's 2 feet lower than than the zoning would allow and for all those reasons um I think we have an approvable project from at least our our point of view all right well thank you very much uh just a few comments before we open up for questions from my own perspective uh in in the years I've been with this commission which is I guess about almost 20 this this property has been before us at least four or five times and and we've allowed it to grow uh I don't want to be a wise a and say grow like Topsy but it has grown and we have allowed changes and I'll be honest with you every time my for my view we say okay well that's it you know okay that's it that's it and I I do even with Sarah's question that she feels the commission the cape card commission if we do refer it you know would say would give her report her staff report that yeah this this would not jeopardize the listing on the national register which is one of the criteria of uh of whether or not the cape cot commission would impose a uh whatever the I guess it's delay or or a stop work as a drri I think we as a commission are driven by that but also by you know you said in 75 you know the street hallway Street it's a beautiful Street and there are some really significant historic structures along that street which have been maintained which the def the architectural defining characters of the street have been maintained yes I agree with you when you twist and you go down along the beach you know there have been some really significant changes and that's what you're referring to you know when you say it and I I don't I don't disagree with you but this property is an isn't an anchor in some ways you know you know when I first saw it it was a small little cottage you know right on the end and and I can see why which we'll talk more about you know how the the community the neighbors are very concerned because we've gone from a single you know bu singing a little cottage to what's now almost you know two and a half story building and and and that drawing you know what you put up kind of says it all yes you've pushed it back Sarah and I know the way Sarah works she's you pushed it back you pushed it away from the original historic structure but I think in my view that um it just it just makes it I don't know what to do I I don't know if we can accommodate the applicant Mr bamian again to allow this property to to expand to a point where we've lost the the historical streetcape that we've had for most of hallway Street I grant you when you turn the corner you know you've got the beat shacks and and they were allowed to grow and I don't know I got I have trouble with this one and I I'm willing to to listen to what the rest of the I I may be wrong listen to what the rest of the commission how they feel about it on um on how to proceed so with that I guess the best thing to do is to just to go around the room and see how people feel start at this end Mr Wilson you're new but go ahead my mic on yes um when you look at the uh comparison of the uh original building on the historic register versus what it is now there's there's it's barely recognizable the chimney's gone clearly a building in the 1800s needed a chimney to get heat and uh so there's one big change but going from one story to two and a half stories was a big change and I guess my time's up the other thing I would say is that the proposed addition makes the building taller but not symmetric it's asymmetric it has a tower on one side and doesn't have a that might be impossible not to do because of some constraints on structure but uh to me a building should be more symmetric that's the only other comment I would make and clearly it's out of context with the surrounding buildings on that street thank you B um I I agree with what Mr Wilson had to say um more specific well particularly and we'll go through this a little bit but the picture on page three of what the building was uh in 1930 and I think Mr barsamian spoke to what it was like when he bought it which probably not much different and I've been going down to that beach for over well over 60 years so I can say that that's what it looked like and I know what it looks like now and I think what it looks like like now just takes it to another literal literally level of uh non-conformity with what it was to begin with um the regulations both the town and um Cape cot commission act talk about a substantial alteration being a redition addition removal alteration or substitution of defining architectural features such as the building is incapable yielding important historical information about its period including changes to the following exterior sighting roof pitch fenestration and the compatibility of of additions in terms of General scale massing and materials and likewise um the cave Cod Commission guidelines from October 2019 mention those those elements also um Miss Cori well let let me go back to what the drawings show fortunate to get um some revised ones that actually have a proposed Ridge height on it that anybody could find um looking at let's say page 17 that's 17 of the new one uh I hope it's the new one yes if again if the pages were dated it wouldn't be such a problem Mr ahar what you know where the ridge height was it's shown on on page 177 it says 28 says oh there it is over on the right on the left on the left rather you see it Bob no way on the left well unless the Staples over it it says existing house to Ridge Top of Ridge proposed top of ridge ridge top of Ridge 7t 28 ft well I'm then I'm looking at the wrong one it's right here look at the new one so the new one was um emailed to you not printed out but Janet has a print out we just got another one just with the ridge height the proposed Ridge height everything else is the same okay I got nervous well I did I did see the email saying it was 28 ft okay fine and that actually is my next question looking at the drawings the one we were just talking about um page 17 um I'm I'm having trouble with that top difference the extension of the line of 267 and it's supposed to be two feet high higher I don't could you speak up Bob yeah I'm sorry we the proposed top of Ridge is now 26.7 ft email said 28t right hold on that's all right I if the public could just bear bear with us a second I rode in 28 feet I'm I'm all right I'm all right we don't have to get up uh Patrick could you point to that on the drawing for the public what we're talking about uh this was just received I didn't get it either well I had open my email well you have to stay here now they're saying it's 28 ft so so the proposed Ridge height of the new edition is 2 28 ft as shown in the all drawings and and that I I guess my question is I'm not seeing it quite well I see the numbers yeah this is 21 but bring it over to you yeah I know I right oh yeah you're right sorry so then we got two things one that space on the line going up between uh proposed top of Ridge and you're you're raising are you raising it a foot and a half is basically what I'm asking Patrick I think the confusion is on I can't hear you Patrick I think the confusion is on what you what you're showing there on the screen to the public and which you email this morning shows the the line not to the top of the ridge on the drawing we have I mean this is the drawing and it shows here's the proposed top of Ridge hit the bottom hit the bottom of the line that right from from That's from the existing grade is he got the wrong package come up here it comes across the is the top of the existing if you look at if you look at the Planos there's a a circle uh at the bottom where it says not elevation 1.6 basement from that Circle to the top of the ridge is 28 ft so both ridges are being measured from the same spot it just because they because they put in uh you know elevation 0 0 grade it's a little confusing so the I'm to believe the building is going to be 7 feet higher than it is now that's correct okay and I had a question about I guess now the old drawing the dotted line that showed the top of Ridge went through the the roof of the new additions but you've what he's referring to is the the package which we received on January 31st which was the the smaller the larger package if you go to 17 just Janice and the proposed to Ridge if you bring that line across it doesn't go to the top of the ridge goes through the roof it cuts through the roof that's right you know what we talking about I don't I don't have those drawings all I know is we were asked to uh to provide you know the top of Ridge elevation 2 one point I was asked if we would delay this again because of this issue and I'm getting can I ask you to come over here Patrick I apologize I apologize to the members of the public and to the members of staff let's resolve this if I if I can make a comment just this is you know the difference of an inch or two hold on Mr Riley just hold on this is this is the package we received but that height elevation was 26' 7 in okay unfortunately you got you have to talk let me so look at okay on on on on the set your your questioning on page 17 the height from the existing grade at at elevation 0.0 to um to the to to through through the roof was 26' 7 and then we were asked to comment well what is it to the top of the ridge right and that's 28 ft right and the drawings were provided to you that says it's 28 feet yest you got that Bob I didn't get it I I do I did not I did not get that in a okay format that I could read Sor about that computer okay all right so this this version undated is 28 ft and it goes actually to the top of the ridge of the proposed uh house all right wait are you and the allowable zoning is 30 feet just a reminder say again the allowable zoning is 30 ft yeah well so we're under that zoning is not our bellwick right your submissions keep referring to zoning and neighborhood look and all that that is not our business our business is whether you are substantially altering a building on the national register it doesn't matter about the neighborhood you know I I might I might take you up on that because uh it's not the whole building it's it's the elements that were deemed historic that that come into play here um what the other the other thing is you know this this as Frank mentioned this has been before you numerous times there been numerous additions and and Sarah's point of view is if you're taking addition that was done in the more recent times and you want to change it she didn't have an issue with that because that was not from the historical point of view so her take on it was and it was her direction that that this design was developed she said well if you want to modify the roof of that of that other addition that was more recently done I don't have an issue with that as long as you preserve the historic defining elements that were still left standing which was that long roof that was even shown in the original Cottage this house has been picked up as approved by by this board picked up elevated modified changed in a number of different ways uh which I think you acknowledged in the very beginning Frank so to make a change to a more modern element not expanding the footprint of the property well within the height that's allowed and not changing the historic defining element whatsoever seemed to be a reasonable approach to get a little more square footage only 400 and some square feet more not change the footprint and to be perfectly candid you know I think the architecture of the modified piece seems to give the house some more character and maybe helps Define in my opinion in my opinion sorry I didn't mean to raise my eyebrows when you said give it more character we all have opinions but yes that's an opinion you know I am a licensed architect practicing for 48 years I know I I I appreciate that U we're getting argumentative and I I don't want to be that particular point but you know we you know right it's an opinion but I had quick question just in a side because we mentioned a couple of times if this was a court of law i' say well he introduced the subject zoning do you required to go to zoning yes for what for what because we're increasing the living area of a non-conforming structure okay and not the height nope well and what about the what about the the footprint are you able to increase the footprint we're not changing the footprint we're not changing the footprint I know so I mean theoretically you could ask for permission to change the footprint could you could you change the footprint is it allowable only if only if the zoning board allowed it so you need to if you would increase the footprint you would need to go to zoning that's that's kind of question yes any any anything that increases the living area of the structure I just wanted to clarify that for my own has to go to the zoning board of appeals okay all right Rob I I guess to to simplify this I think it's sort of um I know it when I see it kind of thing I see the picture from 1930 that is a measure by which we're determining whether or not there's been a substantial alteration and I don't think you can look at that picture and look at the four proposed drawings on pages 14 to 17 18 and say that it does not substantially change it that's so I've got to think it's got to go to the conser to the Cap Cod Commission all right let me let me just clarify that one of the things that Mr leer is referring to technically a contributing structure in the National registered District and I for our new member and the members of the commission when the uh changes are uh changes are greater than 25% uh you know it's effectively a mandatory referral to the cape card commission so this building has changed a lot more than 25% and we you're right we at least two or three times we said okay we we think we can work with it all right let's go continue uh Robert we'll start down to that end work our way back well we're in kind of a tough spot Robert turn your microphone on and bring the microphone closer to sorry thank you so Cape Cod Commission has has said well okay if you do these things we we'll be okay and the Old Village Association has come back and U and some neighbors and have uh pushed back pretty hard on it um it it's a tough one because I understand what the applicants trying to do I mean he's trying to get some space for his family and uh um he's been before us several times it's determined and um so I'm kind of on the middle of the road here but I but I think if I have to uh say which way I'd vote on it I'd be against it I don't think it's aesthetically very attractive and I can see why the neighbors are giving you push back uh Christina were there any letters of support from any of the neighboring or a joining properties not that I'm aware of not support just the negative just of opposition yeah um I think everything's been said that we can say so you can go around thank you Sandy I've been on here on this commission almost as long as Frank and I know that this has come before several times I'm sorry to say I can't support this thank you Steph I just have a question um this is boarded up because of safety now it's one of my papers said that it was boarded up because of safety I'm sorry said can you repeat that question one of the papers I read said this was boarded up now for safety reasons and I was just wondering how this was going to make it safer but if it's not no I don't think I think the 1930 picture was boarded up right it was the picture from 1930 it was boarded up oh no no yeah right exactly the original Cottage when it was there before Mr bamian bought it and when he bought it it was bought it up it was not inhabited at the time for many years there was a major disruption of that street when I think this property lost about half of its land man M when it fell into the sea also it lost the building was much larger right yeah and they lost about two-thirds of the building right Janet well it's a great location I can but I think the historical significance was lost a long time ago and but this really pushes it over that third story I think really is um this is a problem I I'm having a problem with that I it just well you bring up a good point there when you you mention that there is a process for removing something from the national register it's not an easy process but you can Nancy um first of all I think I would speak for all of us to say we appreciate you working with Sarah Corf and listening to feedback from um from Sarah and um her points are are you know important in terms of I think brought it up in in August that you know that roof line that's a that's how we can figure out where that original 1930 Cottage still is and I appreciate the efforts to retain that I think what I'm really struggling with and what is reflected from the comments of of my colleagues um you know as bob L said um the law isn't just solely about those key things that you discussed with Sarah but it's also about changes that overwhelm or obscure um the original structure and I think what's happened is in retaining going back to try to retain the roof line and all those important things you've now got an addition that completely overwhelms the original structure where it is so that you you know are doing one good thing but on the other hand that kind of you know very tall addition has an impact on the historical signific ific an of the structure in a different way I think I think that's what we're struggling with you know we aren't the board of appeals it is not our job to determine whether it's suitable for the neighborhood however it's a national register District so you're right like we do have to look at this building in context of the neighborhood and what it was in 1930 and what it was when it became a contributing structure is very very different now and I think that this these iterative changes you you know at a certain point which may be now another change a very tall addition even though it struggles to retain some historical um yeah significance and structural details of the property um I think it's kind of pushed it over the edge um that's my thinking um do you want me we'll we we'll read the yeah we'll get to that okay so okay uh so we have as Nancy was attempting to to segue we do have comments from the members of the public who have commented AIT we also see a l of people in the audience um I assume some of you folks who are calling in uh want an opportunity to say something am I correct well they all muted themselves yeah so what I'm going to do just so you know I'm going to read the correspondence that we received from members of the public and it may be you are the ones who submitted the correspondence so I would just ask you that if in fact we've read your letter you know if you can just say that's my letter and that's how I feel unless you have something different to contribute to the discussion I would appreciate it okay so at this point i' ask the clerk Nancy to uh read the correspondence um do you want me to go through Sarah's letter even though it's been part most of it paraphrase you want me to read it yes I I'll start with the the letter um it was in response to outreach um from Patrick aar's office that she responded um and it's dated Thursday January 23rd 2025 it's from Sarah Corf um her official titter is planner to Historic preservation specialist of the Cap Cod Commission uh thank you for sending me the updated proposal for 75 hallway Street in chatam my apologies for being slow to respond I was out of the office for over a week based on the plans you shared issue date 1116 2025 January 16th the latest proposal appears to retain the original structures character defining features including the majority of the original roof slope the Gable end roof forms and the West facade window configuration as such acknowledging that this building has already seen significant alteration I do not believe the proposed plans would threaten the building's National excuse me National register listing I am copying Town staff and we'll be happy to discuss I would just comment about this is this is Mrs CV's last correspondence we've been going through this for the last three or four months but we won't go back and read the previous car respondents go okay so this is um from Winnie leer president of the Old Village Association uh which is the association that is in the National register District dear Commissioners this is dated January 28th 2025 the board of directors of the Old Village Association represents property owners in chadam Old Village National register historic district and many who care deeply about the Old Village to preserve and protect the historic nature and Architectural Beauty and integrity of the Old Village area the board writes to express our concerns regarding the most recent application for alterations to the house at 75 hallway Street we believe that the changes proposed for this house are such that the historic character and integrity of the original structure would no longer be reflected in the site 75 hallway Street began as a single story Cottage the proposed third floor Edition Looms over the existing structure such that the house that existed when it was declared a contributing structure in the Old Village National Historic District cannot be identified other houses on hallway have been altered over the years however those Al alterations have allowed the original structure to remain discernible to the Street Viewer and have thus retained the historic appear appearance of the setting the west and south elevation of 75 hallway Street house can be viewed from the street the changes proposed substantially alter the profile of the house from the street and render it unrecognizable as the structure was originally built we encourage the applicants and the commission to work together to find a solution that maintains the historic appearance of the structure we further encourage the commission to consider either referring the application to the Cape Cod Commission or imposing a demolition DeLay So that Creative Solutions can be developed and evaluated thank you for giving us an opportunity to comment the next one uh we have a couple of messages which I'll um condense into a couple so we reflect all the comments from Chris whan um and he says in his first message to the members of the chadam historical commission I am the co-owner of a property on hallway street that is a direct abutter to 75 hallway Street I wish to convey that I am troubled by the renovation plans the barians are proposing the plan's disproportionate scale and lack of symmetry would disrupt the neighborhood's aesthetic Harmony in my opinion as you are likely aware there are five homes in a relatively close proximity at the Eastern end of hallway Street and I feel that a three-story house would be a towering presence that would impact all I don't have a firm understanding of the grounds on which you will consider this matter but I want to contribute a photograph of what existed on this site historically as you can see in the attached picture 75 hallway Street was a single story home this Photograph was taken about 2004 this is the photograph I don't know if that can be seen but uh then another message from Charles whan as a direct butter of 75 hallway Street and owner of 73 hallway Street I find the barsamian plans for further expansion of 75 hallway Street totally inappropriate The Proposal is to expand the house to three stories where traditionally a single story house stood a house with a silo stacked on top of the North End of the house is not in accord with the surrounding houses which have a more traditional chatam feel the stacking or add-on is attractive and has a significant negative impact is sorry is unattractive and has a significant negative impact I like the first version better sorry thank you for considering this objection when you evaluate the proposed plans these plans should be rejected since there is Charles A whan MD and that was very similar to one other message um there's a message from Meritt Weber good morning I write today with concered objection to the proposed third story edition of 75 hallway Street sorry this is dated February 3rd 2025 the baremans are neighbors and while I would like to be able to support I do object permitting this addition in the historic district my sense is that height is that the height of the third story is not in keeping with the historic nature of the Old Village I also respectfully request the town notify abutters to changes in submitted plans these plans and this hearing date were communicated to us third hand and I believe it is the OWN onus of the town and this onus of the town and this commission to notify abutters of such changes many thanks for your consideration Merit Weber just let me me comment you know uh there is a process for notifying a Butter's uh what does it we do it in 500 feet um it's 50 feet for historic 50 feet and so there was notification for the unfortunately just the 50 the butters within 50 feet uh I have to agree with you the process gets complicated because of a multiple continuances and not necessar the public having access to a complicated submission and we apologize for that but we try our best good okay and the final uh letter is from John whan 17 Lighthouse Lane also dated February 3rd 2025 I am no longer a property owner on Lower hallway street but my history there goes back to the 1950s I believe the plan submitted by the barsamian is not in keeping with the neighbor hood on hall hallway Street I specifically feel the height on the Northern side is too high I sympathize with the barians in their attempt to gain more living space but the elevation on the Northern side is simply too high okay um we're going to ask for the members of the public uh we have a number of people here and then in the audience who would speak uh for against the application Mr bosium if you would like I saw you got up if you wanted to speak sure you're certainly welcome sure just introduce yourself formally uh Rob barsamian um the owner of 75 hallway Street I just wanted to kind of clarify a couple things that were said along the way um first it's not a three-story house you know every the people specifically Merritt and um Chris and Charlie and John um their house is taller than my house um so it's not a three-story house it's under the code it's a 2 and 1 half story house so it looks like it has a peak to it but obviously we're we're lower than all the abing houses around us other than one there's 13 homes on hallway Street I didn't get all there's there's one person that's in a butter which I didn't see those letters I'm just hearing about them today um that they have one they have two homes out of the 13 I didn't get the other people to write letters in the motel because I didn't think it was appropriate at this level they would do that at the zoning level which you know we've done before um you I think Frank mentioned there's a process to take it off of the registry so originally after our last hearing I called Sarah and said Sarah what is that process and let's just talk about why my house was on that registry when it makes zero sense to me because usually a a historical house is a house and we've done this a lot in our other developments is a house that existed that you refurbished this this house that you see a picture of is is no longer there it didn't exist I kept the form of the roof as a compromise to to the cottage it wasn't like I took the house I remodeled the house and then added on to that there's no house there's six 2x4s in one of the rooms behind a wall so what I did is I reached out to a number of historical preservationists and said how do I get this off the registry it makes no sense even the person that put it on the registry here's their comment REM Rob it's remarkable to think anyone would consider this a contributive building structure in the National Registry District these are three they said virtually the same thing not the person that put it on he didn't want to write a letter because he felt like he had a conflict because he was the one that put this on the register could you tell us who it is you're talking about I I'm not going to tell you who the three well then you know kind of three you don't look at it's just it's just observation Goosey there you know read something I can remember let let me let me finish Bill excuse me I mean you know Mr Riley I was talking if you don't interrupt me I'd appreciate it thank you Mr bamian I appreciate it that's a very simple question you know when someone writes a letter to the commission they need to sign it when someone wants to stand up and give us a a discussion they sign it that's all I just a very simple question so you give me someone's opinion and you won't you don't know who is or you can't I'll tell you who it's Epson Associates they're historical preservationist they're in Massachusetts they do most of the historical pres okay so it's it's a preservationist not necessarily the preservationist who contributed not the one who put this on the r that's what I was trying to do because I I apologize because I in my listening to what you're saying and I am listening every word you're saying it sounded like you were talking about the person who was part of the decision to put this on the national register that that's why I was asking the question he he didn't want to go down that path because he had worked for the town so my only point to that is that um you know my only point to that is when I spoke you brought it up I was just kind of commenting to that point it takes a long time and Sarah said it's doable to do but it could take a couple years to do and she thought that there was a solution to getting what I needed without having to do that and when we heard from specifically Bob last time at the end of the hearing he said not going to make a decision until you talk to Sarah so we did that we did exactly what you asked us to do and I do appreciate that okay so just I wanted to be clear on on that point yes because that that was important to me that we followed what you asked us to do and I we came back we didn't want to put it um just in one area of the house because the circulation is very difficult we wanted to actually go over the existing structure and Sarah even thought we could probably touch a little bit of it but we felt the board especially Nancy the last time said look at you're touching that original structure and so Patrick and I talked about and said look at let's come up with a design that I could live with meaning quote unquote live with that doesn't touch it at all so anyways those are the the couple points I just wanted to kind of clarify and I do appreciate that okay and you know the one thing that you keep saying is it's a three it's not a three-story house and it's lower than most of the houses around me other than one um and and the Dormers even though there's been substantial changes on hallway Street almost to every single house on hallway Street yes the roof lines and Dormers and height have all changed also even John whan's house which is right next to me this whole roof line is completely different than it originally was he has a garage underneath it he has a basement floor the dorm is a completely different structure the Peaks are higher than the peak that we're showing so when we say it's not you know it doesn't fit in the neighborhood I just don't agree with that it does fit in the neighborhood and because when you look at it every house has a different look on on um hallway Street and that's what makes it interesting yes let me just say one thing Mr B sure you know and I appreciate it and you know when this came to before us in August my initial Incarnation then was no and we don't like to say no we don't like to put a demolition delay in we don't like to send it to the cape card Commission we work very hard to try to find some kind of a compromise and that's why we use Sarah she Sarah is as as as Mr uh you call Aaron indicated she's good at what she does okay and she has some interesting ways to to to try and help us preserve and maintain the general historic character you know she's got two two two jobs you know maintain the national register's historical significance and also help Us in finding some kind of a compromise and trust me in my 20 years here we've done at least you know 50 times and she's usually is successful and I think over the years maybe we've only referred two three homes to the Cape Cod Commission because we try to work it out okay and that's what we're trying to do unfortunately I just reading the sense of the commission is that the that structure you know that I won't call it three stories but that's structure sticking out there in that particular spot looking at the rest of the street not necessarily and I agree with you you turn the corner to the water and that's a different that's a different neighborhood I agree with you but your house is part of that other streetscape and I think that's what was is irking the people so yeah I I I well I appreciate that I think I was hearing something a little different though was that you've come back too many times you know we can't do you know that that point I guess come back what I've come here too many times and that's one of the reasons why that you're not um I guess in favor of uh you know what we're doing I didn't want to have to come back here I didn't you know this many times course right so this wasn't like a it's not I'm not happy doing this right so anyways I think we did what you asked us to do we figured out how to do it and to to to satisfy Sarah's issue and unfortunately it just hasn't satisfied us and right so you know I'm sorry for that but I I think that some of the uh points that I made um I I wanted to just Express because I think that there's a different point of view um on the street also about this this project and I've shown it just about to everyone on the street yeah thank you and you know I just just comment you know personally it's been a lot of years that we've allowed things to happen to your property to allow it to be more expansive for your family okay but this particular one the consensus now is not too good so look why I'm going to disp point we got people in the public who would like to speak and let me let me listen any members of the public there who are online who would like to speak so can you tell if they're raising hands there's no anwers okay so it sounds like none of the people who are calling in would like at this particular comment all right ladies and gentlemen I'm sorry Mr Ry go the uh in terms of whether the home should be removed I will remind you that uh don Freeman who was a member for many years and a very valuable asset to the town the last time we were here said you know I think this building should be removed from the historic register yeah but that's not our job right right I'm just saying no no I I I brought it up it's not our job okay and you got to remember when properties when National registered district is established it's kind of like a snapshot and it says whoops this is it there are some buildings in the National register District this National register District the South chatam National register District which people say I don't understand why this isn't but but it is it's part of the character the the architectural defining character of The District okay and individually the building may not be you know 1700 house where Bill Nicholson lived but it still is a structure which is in a national registered district and it adds to the general historical architecture tenor of the town and and this particular one I I'm reading the commission is just we can't go we can't go so now we have a decision I'm sorry yes back yeah I just wanted to uh just to get some clarification on uh next steps assuming that this board you know votes this this designed down yeah we have two we have two decisions to make here uh we're hearing this V under chapter 158 Thea the uh demolition delay and Thea and referral to the cape card commission assuming we have a consensus and the consensus is to refer this to the Cape Cod Commission it would be a motion in which we will prepare documentation for the uh uh J what's his TI Briggs uh Building Commissioner The Building Commissioner Mr Briggs would then make the formal presentation to the cape card commission at our at our uh request right that happens once it's done then you would be informed and generally what happens after a couple of months or so they have a hearing and the hearing usually is here and we go through the whole thing you know you're allowed to present to the cape card commission your position you know we give our report of whatever we felt why we felt it was referred to the Cape Cod Commission uh they'll make a decision I have to tell you you know turn my microphone off nine out of 10 times the commissioner say yeah go ahead right so let's let's just let's just follow this out forward just so I understand uh the process so uh if all of you refer this to the Cape Cod Commission the same design that Sarah has already written a letter of support from and let's assume for the moment take the high road that the Cape Cod Commission Mission comes back and saying that for all the reasons that Sarah said that that that they want to see the project happen the way it's been designed so it comes back as a referral from the Cape Cod Commission to this board no no what happens no once the Cape Cod Commission whatever the cape cot commission decides right that's it that's it that's so it overrides your decision and effect that's correct it's an override decision but there's two decisions for us to make not to give you a catch 22 M but we also are going to be hearing hearing this or have heard this and we're going to go around the room whether or not we should impose a demolition delay right and that's 18 months that's no that's up to whatever we decide oh I see and that's going to be a discussion that we're going to have here and I'll tell you very simply I'll tell you what the discussion is okay we're going to refer it to the Cape Cod Commission that's going to take three months it could take a year okay and the Cape Cod Commission is going to make a decision the second decision is even though this has been dragging on since August do we want to give Mr bamian another chance to think about it and maybe hire a different architect that's a joke I thought I was the last one standing on this one okay and to find another way to meet his requirements okay to increase the living space without going up as quick as high as he could he could do that but we're going to give him time and then he would come back to the commission so if he comes if he changes if you change the design you're you're this is not like a zoning board where you got to wait two years if you change the design and come back with a new application pay 150 bucks we could hear that and then we could eliminate we could do two things we can eliminate the uh demolition delay and B we could go back to the Cape Cod Commission and say that's off or you you would you would withdraw your application to the cape card commission and then say we're we're now working again we're working again with the with the so if if if under the demolition delay if if we come up with a plan that you ultimately don't like either uh and wait wait out the 18 if it's 18 months or whatever it may be uh would then he be able to go forward as as a right AB so he could so it's a timing thing yes it's the 18mon delay or the let me phrase it another way we have a demolition delay by bylaw it happens to be maximum 18 months and the purpose of that is to work with the to see if we could find another so so we've been working with the board we worked with Sarah Corf we we we we followed her direction to a te we've done all that and we still now find oursel in a situation where the board is not happy yes so the alternative could be to wait out 18 months and then go to the building department for a building permit is that that's correct or what I would quite honestly to give you my opinion yeah we've been doing this since August so we've been doing this for six months already right and and I think in my opinion if we put were to impose a demolition delay 18 months on top of the six months we've already working is punitive and you know I think that's a bit much and I think it if we do impose a demolition delay I would recommend it's up to the commission we impose maybe a year or 9 months or something like that something more reasonable but but in terms of process in terms of process just so I'm clear yes um we've been the good listener we've done multiple designs we've worked with Sarah and and we haven't come up to something that the board accepts yes so uh do we go back at that one more time possibly or do we just say you know pencil's down whatever delay is is is been imposed on the project wait out the delay and then just file for the building permit with the plans is that is that a viable option it's a viable option but I certainly personally would hope you wouldn't do that I would hope that you find a way as I said where you could accommodate the owner in some way maybe not 100% in terms of living in space with a design that doesn't is not in the face right me the the issue that I gathered from everyone is is is the volume increase the change in in in in in increas in height so that seems to be the the the neighbors that's what their concern is absolutely and that and that's what you this board's concern is that it went from a just a simple little Hut Cottage then it got elevated and it's had all these other things done to it and that making it taller is problematical for the board that's correct and I would one second I would point out very simply you know a story I tell people in 1700 when somebody came here and built a half Cape okay and then they had more kids they put an L on it then they put another L on it the way buildings tend to grow historically right on the cape is right this way there's the house there's the barn they grew into the barn then they grew into the Livery stable yeah I my house in eger toown 1790 something and I get the drill so okay so that's that's I think that's my own opinion yes I wanted to ask a question say again yes I wanted to ask a question surely so Mr Hearn was asking about the process yes you know so I'm I'm asking about the process too what if um so what if they choose to go to Cape Cod Commission and Sarah says comes back and says do it yes and then and then yes that's it well let me finish so then they go to zoning and zoning says forget it that yeah right that's there's a long process that third story what if they do what if they put them through what we've already have the cap let me answer another excuse me for interrupting the Cape Cod Commission doesn't override zoning she they still have to they still have to meet the local zoning requirements but but um okay right so in other words we're we're still not out of the box yet absolutely we would we would then have to even if we either got approval from the Cape Cod Commission that over your decision you still have to go back you still have to go to the zoning board of appeals and the zoning board of appeals will be very concerned about what a Butters have to say and and volume and scale even though you know our position would be that we meet we're underneath the zoning and height we we're we're you know we're not increasing the footprint on a building they're going to look at the building as it is today not as it was in 1930 yes so they're going to look at this building and we're asking for 400 squ ft addition on the same footprint under the height restriction so from a zoning envelope point of view I think you'd be it's a reasonable you probably you probably have a reasonable to have it approved because they're not looking at the architecture they're not looking at historical they're looking at mass and scale do you meet the the zoning envelope we're not increasing the footprint they're going to look at the building the way it is so the neighbors will have another opportunity to voice their concerns at that board yes all right look ladies and gentlemen we're taking a long time quick question yeah I I just really I'm sorry it's about the process again we are hearing this under two different laws right we can both yes send it to the Cape Cod Commission and impose a delay and the Cape Cod commission's decision does not end our delay that's correct okay okay let's ladies and gentlemen we need to wrap this up because we do have other things to do and I can see them getting nervous in the control room all right I Mr leer I think first let's refer let's let's put the cap card commission thing out of the way if if that's what you're going to do okay um let me just ask a question about that though um because I don't remember the details and I think Mr Riley probably does about a dual referral and the timing of that we can't string them out or do it consecutively no no but there's a fraction we have to do it within yeah 60 days or whatever we're entitled to decisions under both bylaws today yes right okay that's fine yeah the technically I'm not trying to string it out I'm just wanting to make sure we're all right this has been a good education let's go guys please all right um all right I move that the chadam historical commission reconfirm that the home building is a at 75 hallway street is contributing structure on National register National Historic register District okay the second please second okay we're just reaffirming the historical significance and a contributing structal National register District we're going to do a roll call Bob yes Nancy yes Stephanie yes Sandy yes Janet yes Robert yes chair vote Yes okay Bob all right second piece I move the chadam historical commission finds of the materials presented to this state showing that the proposed alderations addition Renovations do constitute a substantial alteration to a contributing structure located in the National register historic district and there for a referral to the Cape Cod for commission for review is necessary okay second please second second thank you comments Bob yes Nancy yes Steph Yes Sandy yes Janet yes Robert yes CH vote Yes now so we have reaffirmed the historical ific and we referred it to the Cape Cod Commission Now what the question is at this particular point in addition to that which is completely independent and the clock will start today are we going to further encourage the applicant to do something even though you're right we've done six months I would say a demolition delay in my opinion is appropriate my maybe not the full 18 months but I'll leave that to you Mr leer um I questioning we did we find this historically significant one of the first sessions yes we we did reaffirming confirmed it on you can just reaffirm again all right um I move the chat Mr oral commission finds that the building located at 75 hallway street is historically significant because it is whole or in part 75 years old or more and it is listed on an area with a national register of historic places uh and it's that's enough to confirm the historical significance we have a second second second thank you all right Bob yes Nancy yes Stephanie yes Sandy yes Janet yes Robert yes and the chair votes yes okay second piece chat historical commission also finds the proposed work to be done dated I guess it's the last one is January 3 January 29th oh that's okay January 31st no that's the that's the date the time stamp February plan is January 29th Mr I have a drawing dated February 4th for today's presentation I don't know okay we'll make it I'm sorry could you say that again I have the set of drawings for today's presentation date on it of February 4th 2025 okay oh wait a second the on we were email let me ask a question Trust in the what you presented there you presented just the difference in the height that's it there's no other change it was just a clarification of the type so why don't you say both Bob January January 29th and February what's the date February 4th okay all right thank you let me just start from the beginning chadam historical commission also finds that the proposed work to be done dated January 29th and February 4th 2025 will materially diminish the historic significance of the structure therefore the commission imposes a demolition delay in the amount of 365 days one year yes second second okay any other discussion on the motion or the time I think it's appropriate one year and we'll leave it at that okay Bob yes Nancy yes Steph Yes Sandy yes Janet yes Robert yes chair vote yes thank you very much for your time really appreciate all you no thank you very much I I really really feel that hopefully we would have find a way to do this but uh okay not going not going up I know that say again not going up no thank you uh and I really thank the commission for your patience and diligence on this uh we don't do it often but I think this was appropriate okay we have a couple of things that I really would have liked to done U is everybody gonna hang out here for another half hour okay uh where where you go all right very simply I'm G to have a lot of pages to sign on the agenda there's there's two things which I think appropriate um that we should talk about uh the on the new bu business was the rules and regulations you have before you your rules and regulations in this book which the staff Christina has over the time improved it it has two things in it the first tab by the way now we feel like a teacher the first tab in your assignment here is the Cape Cod Commission act if you go look I'm not telling you to read the whole thing but if you go through the back of it there's a section called refer refer historic properties to the Cape Cod Commission you might want to take a look at that and and it it's is what we did today which was a mandatory referral and you know just to be more familiar with it um you don't have yours yet do you uh do he does Bob Robert you have it so you might take a look at that all right the second thing is the is the uh the chapter 158 which I assume we're all very familiar with uh two issues have come up in recent time which I think we want to have a discussion um and that is this discussion of who determines a property is historically significant because as part of our our process we often say well if the building's not historically significant then you could proceed so the way the bylaw is currently written and I think it's my interpretation I'm not an lawyer is that the historical commission as a commission determines one thing is historically significant so the question that I've asked uh uh Christina and Katie Donovan our uh director of uh Community Development is to ask Town Council for a an opinion uh of how a national registered designation occurs why am I doing that I'm doing that because in the process of of what just happened here today with 12d Street where Nancy excuse me Christina wanted just to make this an administrative approval and I said well you know our our our rules and regulation talk about that's the third thing talk about a effectively a minor change or a uh maintenance and I just felt because rightfully so Christina and I consult or Christin consults with the chair whoever's going to be sitting in this chair you know whether or not the alteration is minor and I just felt that the a New Foundation that's not minor you know that's a significant change and we should hear it but by the same token it was pretty obvious to me and the commission that it really wasn't historically significant but yet we forced these people to come here and have it this you know and paid 150 bucks and luckily were they were nice folks trust me cuz sea gets some people who are not so nice and they give her a hard time why am I before you know and so we established the administrative review process to try and help the town help the people in the town help Christina and and I want to go back to see if there's another way that we could determine historical significance let me tell you I did a little research good old Sarah KF her name is taken in vain a 100 times today uh as a resource what do the other commissions do well guess what a lot of commissions their bylaw doesn't impose the the uh the person who does the historical to the commission it could be the commission or could be a a preservation consultant and a lot of towns have a preservation consultant on the staff well we don't have that okay we do have a preservation consultant Eric Dre we if we would to ask him for a decision he would he would ask to be paid and I'm sure the town is not going to go for that so we need to look at something and think about it how could we do that a third way they do it some towns which don't have a preservation consultant on staff or hire him as a subcontractor is that the the commission uses the form V so just as we do in we put a lot of credence to our form B's and and what the commission does is well there's no Form B let not historic so it doesn't even come before the commission so the only homes that come before the Commission in those towns are those homes in which there's a Form B and I see Nancy shaking the head no because guess what Nancy and I both were involved in generating form BS some of those Forbes says Frank seen his name on it I didn't know I didn't know a three4 cape from a anente okay so well I do now right but so there in lies the problem now we as a community and as a commission have spent a lot of money over the last 15 20 years improving our formb and we're going to do that even further in another item so it's just something to think about so what the first step is I've asked for the town attorney give me the opinion what the law says and what can we can can or cannot do and then this after we do that then we're going to talk again I see Nancy is reaching for the button I feel like a game show you know go ahead press the button um I since we first brought this up last meeting I've just had this question in my head is it not possible under the way we currently have the administrative review written for an administrative review for the two members to come with a recommendation regarding historical significance to the board isn't so couldn't it be well it's just over the date we don't have a form you know can you please so couldn't that be an administrative review even the way it's currently written it seems like that might fit like that theie review is either to come with a recommendation regarding significance or a recommendation regarding application okay two things have to happen one is that I really would like the the the attorney to to tell me what we can or can't do and secondly then we should modify our rules and regulations our rules and regulations are not done arbitrarily we technically agree amongst ourselves then we have a public hearing we let the public know we're changing our rules and regulations and then we vote on it so there's a process and effectively like we have nothing to do uh Christina is helping us begin the that process okay yes step may we take these notes notebooks home yes okay cuz before I was told no sure if you'd like to and then just come with them at the next meeting um one more thing about um what you were just discussing I think we're talking to Town Council about that process that you just explained Nancy and for you to come back to the commission there's we would have to notify so we're just kind of getting the you know we can't talk about something somebody's property and not notify them so we were kind of just going through the whole uh scenario of things no I think they would still that the admin review application yes you know and we would have to come back and make a recommendation that the board would then consider formally which we do yes for the admin review so yeah we're discussing I guess what we called it a preliminary hearing or something along those lines preliminary hearing exactly sounds good um also I didn't have that section on from page 36 on in the which you just may want check I will email it to both of you and then I'll get she has hers and she gave me a copy of the one she didn't need cuz she had double but I'm just saying you may want to check and make sure everybody has it okay I'll email it to you and have a copy for you or we can go upstairs I can print one out for you too for the if you're taking it home okay I'm going to move as quickly as I can administrative uh we have no administrative approvals R ratifications okay so none uh thirdly we have we have a piece of Correspondence oh uh I don't know if we have to read it but there's a piece of Correspondence in your packet which is a followup of my no I have it in other words I'm trying to decide how to proceed here uh we have it under old business which is the preparation of the the DOE and I have a comment there that we continue towait the conservation foundation and ni and Nickerson Family Association comments everything is done I'm waiting for the the two organizations to come I guess the word is a approach want between them uh as part of that your truly is staying out of it as much as I can but trying to encourage the commissions the Conservation Commission and the Association to come to some understanding uh you have a piece of Correspondence and for The public's information it's available public I won't read it completely but uh the Nickerson Family Association has responded to the conservation foundation and very simply folks the Nickerson Family Association would prefer the title of the national register dig being the William and an Nicholson and Homestead at mont mont is the name of the larger area the conservation foundation's position is just the opposite they want the monok or monomat ancestral homelands and the William Nicholson Homestead so it's chicken in the egg here and it's got to get resolved and quite honestly if it doesn't get resolved soon I may just ask the commission to allow us to submit it to the cape C I mean to the National to mass historic just the way it is because it's going to change this is just the first step in a long process is going to take a year or two and and we're just wasting a lot of time hopefully not wasting it's the wrong word I would hopefully that we move it along so that's that's that okay unless somebody has any comments Coast Guard boat house is hopefully going to happen very shortly we'll see last but not least that we need to talk about is uh an item on your old business the third item down I'm going to ask Christina to give us a quick summary of where we are we've had meetings with Eric Dre I'm trying to proceed with the update of the form B's as we just discussed and Christina I asked Christina to take a quick look at what have we done and what's left to be done go ahead kid yep so um we're in the process of scheduling a meeting with um Eric our our planner Christine and our director Katie Donovan to and Frank and whoever I think I'm not sure who else but um we spoke to Eric Frank and I the other day um and we kind of just went by what he did in 2015 which was I believe a a inventory of the whole town um houses that were 50 years old were looked at and kind of put on a list high low uh excuse me high medium low or no um and out of that list I think he went to the 75 years old um homes and did form bees for the this very sensitive ones the high ones um and I believe the medium I believe the low and the no were not done maybe some lows were done with form bees since then 10 years later numerous houses have been become 75 years old um I think we've had a couple you know that maybe should have had form BS that you know just weren't were on the we're on the low low list so moving forward he's going to look at the newly 75y old homes and maybe take a look at some of the other homes that don't have form bees that were on the low list and um and I think that's how we're going to move forward we're going to do the new form bees first the commission had discussed it last year possibly maybe the year before um how to proceed and then he's going to kind of beef up the older ones um there are some that were done in the 70s in the '90s and then in the early 2000s um and you know the ones from the 70s do need to be updated things have happened you know maybe new additions or new owners or something like that but I think the the process moving forward or the new form be so we can capture you know maybe these little maybe there is an a very significant little cottage somewhere you know um so um and we're in the talks of moving forward with that process can I can I ask you to to kind of summarize that in an email sure and share it sure you know there's a lot of form BS and there's high low yes no what what does it mean and and uh it gets a little complicated uh and I that we're going to spend some more money to to update it uh and I think it' be important that we understand what it is uh but let me trust me the the documents we have which is the form B's and the index of form bees and Eric's rating is important I mean we've done a lot of a lot of work as's Commission in the last 20 years and knowing other commissions we're in pretty good shape in the town and chadam has really been you know in the Forefront you know I find you know very simply when I meet with other Commissioners different accents we we tend to look at the whole town some towns look at you know one or two buildings at seven that's it you know they and I think the fact that it's very helpful from my point of view you know we may have have two or three historic districts but it's a large town with a lot of homes you know which are which are pretty pretty old so I think with I'm padding ourselves on the back not me trust me okay I had a quick I had a quick question yes sir talking about the whole town I was looking at this list which appears to be just the Old Village or is that is there is there another is there another District or another yes that so that is just the Old Village um there is another District in South chadam that we we do have I haven't up updated it since probably since it's kind of a newer district and then there is a quite a substantial book that goes through what I was just talking about the high medium low and no list for the whole town for the whole town I got you yes that was done in confus just to see yeah that was done in 2015 so that list has grown thanks very much I sorry can can you add the South chadam District to our book yes I can do that yeah my mistake okay yes Christina I was just talking to Robert he does not have have the spiral bound book do we have another spiral bound book he came on afterwards we not not everyone gets the spiral bound book we only have one copy upstairs oh okay so we don't have any extras I know the commission I have mine we don't but you're more than welcome to come take a look anytime okay yeah we did you talking about the spiral bound which was the index yeah you have it because you you were on the commission at the time we did it and at that time we shared the the index with everybody what we've done since then rather than S what we've done rather than giving everybody you know that big book is we Christina provides that summary tell you what it says which is probably easier than everybody having an index and turning pages and okay is it available digitally though that you could um isn't it available to download there is a copy digitally I think there are some issues with formatting that's why I haven't done it but I think he was going to work on that with us but moving forward I'm wondering if we're going to get another spiral bound with our next you know um reiteration with him or something like that and we could kind of tag that on and have everybody maybe get a copy well I in my opinion rather than everybody getting a copy I mean I don't know about your office but mine is filled with stuff I don't need more stuff I would prefer that you have the spiral down and share the information with us on a summary basis and then also as nany's coming from is just make it available online that we could we could go online and get it yes y so back in 2015 again I think the formatting issues maybe it was a newer process um but moving forward we should have very good digital um things coming through okay last but not least before we leave here for lunch is uh I I wrote a a summary of the annual report uh not a summary I wrote an update the annual report what this is by the way just for information uh every commission board and committee uh is required to provide an annual report to the town and when if you ever get that book which they publish the town annual report it has the list of all of the and uh and I put something together and hopefully you like what I wrote If not you you can do it next year okay and I think you know one of the thing that I was really sad when I had to write the fact that we lost Don and and Steve buring game and uh so anyway been around too long okay anybody want to make a motion to adjourn I'll make a motion that we adjourn this meeting thank you very much a second second thank you very much okay roll call Bob yes Nancy yes Stephanie yes Sandy yes Janet yes Robert yes missina the chair votes yes Bob Hope you enjoyed yourself I did with my note my microphone on there it is that's a privilege really