##VIDEO ID:wrI6fDqs2Tk## have the pledge St pledge aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible liberty and justice for [Music] all R uh Lenny Arnold he called he asked to be absent today Visa Colorado here Margaret SN Schneider Snider here uh Charles Mason he also called and said he wouldn't be here Alexandria boo here mat tusar sh yes here sh yes okay and Lori mckenley yep so the approv the minutes from last time I know you wanted to have him have um Lenny sign it since he we'll move that to our next meeting does anybody have any comments on that or anything yeah any anything that you guys we'll do you know what we can do the approval next time okay oh I'm sorry the approval of the agenda first there have a motion to approve the agenda so moved second second second a a motion in a second approved and I don't think we have any business to disclose a conflict today right nope we have no official business tonight we have any unfinished business from last time to cover all right new business none none and staff reports that's announcements all right um just kind of want to give you guys an update on the Vacation Rental process what's happening in the background just some informational information um to get us going um and get you guys up to speed so basically we have the definitions um if you guys all read that it's um what the state calls it what we call it um the BTR here let me we call it a BTR and that's the business license to do a vacation rental the rs1 is a registration for the residential area okay for the rs1 Zone they're the only ones right now that um apply for that application as well everybody that's doing a vacation rental has to do a BTR they have to have a license to do that um and then the other items on here open gov that's our software that we use um a platform that everybody applies for registrations applications um building permits that's the software that the city uses and Rental scape is a company a vendor that we use to find out who's um advertising vacation rentals because if they don't apply we have no way of knowing so there are key soures to find out people that are in the city that are out there on Airbnb and you know advertising for um vacation rentals but not licensed through the city okay I did some Google oh go ahead you want to have questions at the end or oh yeah well we could do it at the end because you you may get some of the answers through this process um I do have a spot at the end for questions um I just did a Google search search is some information on what they call it basically um so your vacation rentals um they're basically a 30-day or less rental three times a year and that's what we consider a vacation rental um if you rent it for 6 months or whatever it wouldn't be considered a vacation rental okay so here's some numbers um over the past 3 four years that I've compiled of btrs versus rs1 applications and you can see that um in 2023 the the city did a real good job of going out there and getting people to apply and get registered um so you can see the btrs the gray going across this year the um renewal process ends at the end of this month so if you go to the next screen so those 469 should move over into this group after next month the RS ons are renewable each year based on the date that they created it the BTR the license that's every year September 30th okay so every year it expires on September 30th rental scape looks at all of these sites out on the internet and I'm sure they're adding more as they go but these are some of the main ones that that they go out there and kind of scope out fine addresses in Coco Beach that are advertising that hey we've got a place that you can rent and that's where we find out the people that we have to go after to get licensed and registered and to be legal in the the city um so looking at rental Escape I've been tracking it for a couple months now um and there is actually a total of 1566 as of 87 that are out there being advertised for vacation rental so and this is based on btrs cuz everybody has to have a BTR not necessarily rs1 at this point these are all btrs so everybody has to have that license so what we're looking at is We have 483 that are licensed 1,049 that we have to go after these ones that say applied they're in the process of course of redoing their their license and the ones that are stopped are are normally something something's wrong where uh the fire department has said you need to put in um some kind of equipment that isn't there right now those are applied yeah those and those all add up into applied or licensed okay um these are just the rs1 Zone only and you see they're they're advertising 295 we have 17 two that we have licensed and we have 111 that we're going out to get that we have to make sure that these people get registered and it's the rs1 is pretty important too because they have to have the fire department come through and do an inspection so for safety purposes alone if you want to rent somebody's house you want it to be safe for that person that's in there um so they have to have the smoke alarms and been approved to ensure that they have egress um that's proper and so on and this is kind of a cross-section of all the different zones um 1566 total but as you look across them you can see that the ocean side ct1 and OC they make up over 600 um rs1 is 300 and what we're looking at now based on um the commission has asked us to look at rm1 and rm2 more of a single family type residence to go after the same situation as rs1 where we look at expanding the um restrictions that we put on the residential area um right now on residential IAL restrictions basically are a maximum of eight for occupancy and four vehicles in off street parking situation so they have to be in the driveway or in the garage so we're looking at doing the same thing for rm1 and rm2 so we're starting to expand our restrictions I should say I guess um so basically some of the closing ideas are you know we're a little bit behind in the race but we're catching up we're going after these folks um we have some new software coming in um that will help us keep people on track our current software doesn't have a real um proactive way to alert people that they're coming up on expiration exp expect expired um but the new software does and it allow ow us to go out there 3 months in advance 2 months in advance one month in advance a week to keep these people alert that hey you you need to reup and go through your process again um yeah okay let's go to questions short and sweet yes is there a way to tell if these people that buy and invest in these homes if they're corporations versus individuals there the data is there it's not readily available but I see it come across my desk where one person may um have three or four houses that they're redoing the license for and then I see um people that come across that are managers of those facilities and they may have 10 and some in the condos you know maybe they do everybody in their condo so it's it's a little bit of everything what comes out go ahead um so my question is a little bit like that so there are a few vacation rental property businesses that I'm aware of locally and I know one of them has over a hundred um things like how do you go to them and say you need to provide me a list of all of your local um places or is it up to them to come to you it it's really up to them but the one the one Saving Grace if we find them and it goes through code enforcement or they finally come to us on their own they still pay everything that was P due okay so they're not getting away with anything it's just a matter of when you pay the pulper you know so we'll eventually catch up to them and the better our software gets the better we'll get sorry Margaret I have a few questions do we have an arrangement with a Realtors local Realtors uh to have them advise us if they have a property that is being listed with them as a vacation rental there's a lot of rental um rentals through that Realtors situation so do we have like you know with the coconut properties and and kogal banker and do we have any kind of arrangement with them where I mean I noticed I didn't see any any I saw companies that are basically in the vacation B rental business I didn't see a companies that I would suspect most people will register their house with yes they loc managing their their situation so do we have that can we do it I don't know if there's anything that will force them to tell us that they do but there are some uh realtor companies that come to us and make sure that they're following our guidelines so is there a process that maybe the city can send a letter to all of the local Realtors and and just remind them that that we're trying to get our arms around this vacation rental thing and we would appreciate it if they would advise very similar to other other realtor realtors in the area are doing um I I don't think that's a bad idea I think um that's very doable um and you mentioned that all vacation rentals must have a safety inspection by the fire department is there a fee for that or is it included in the registration fee there there is a fee um but it is included in that the onetime fee whenever they sign up is there a penalty if you catch up with someone after a year and they haven't had that safety inspection yes there is a penalty there is a penalty and it can get pretty steep um okay um we all know that there's tons tons and tons of properties that are running rental and Airbnb or or the like and not registering um is there an ordinance I think there's an ordinance against overnight parking on residential streets in the city am I right Randy am I wrong I I think yeah I think you're correct there is an ordinance but I don't think they um enforce it to the point that unless somebody calls and knows okay there's 15 cars out in the street for that one place well the thought occurs to me that we could make a whole bunch of money for lifeguards if we had the parking enforcement officer work one night a week or two nights a week different nights of the week on on an evening shift that ticketed cars I guess after I think usually it's 2 o'clock in the morning or 3:00 in the morning is considered overnight um and I I would think that in that kind of a situation we could have a graduated fine if that car is a continual um delinquent Parker so that might be something we I mean I know watch the budget meetings and I know we're kind of strapped for money and I think there's a lot of ways that we can make an awful lot of money here that we just need to think about it yep well it's out of the 1500 there's a thousand out there that haven't paid that's money in our pocket you know yes my question would be who is it or is there somebody dedicated to going out finding these thousand people and collecting that well code enforcement does a lot with that um and they do a lot with people that park in the street have too many cars have too many people so there's a couple things going on in the background right now code enforcement does something like 12 to 15 letters a month I know it doesn't sound like a lot but there's a lot of work that has to go into that you have to get a registered letter out to the people they have to sign for it if you don't get it back if it comes back it may be a month later before it comes back to us sure so there's a process ites that sort of money that's on the table there it seems like it might be worth getting somebody that's maybe not a full-time but a major part of their job description well we have some our new sofware has some opportunities for something similar to what you're talking about that may help us start that process um we're just in the beginning stages of changing out open go to this other um permitting software um hopefully that will autom give us a good Kickstart towards that direction any other questions does the new resource management software that you have uh have a spot for like right now when we go on there we can like complain as a resident like the so and so address is needs code does it have that as well be nice if we could like upload photos because when when I call or or not when I call when I I'm typing hey this place has 20 cars for the past two days I know it's Airbnb like I'd like to show proof so when they ever do make it out there those cars might not be there anymore maybe a new guest I don't know but it would be nice if we could prove it well and you have to you have to be thinking about this as well there's there's a scenario that came up you've got 10 cars out there they're only allowed four well the four that are in the driveway are the people that are spending the night the other people are just there for the birthday party and they'll be leaving so the police really can't just just like if you coming to your house and you had everybody over your house for birthday party but they're all not going to stay we have to be cognitive of that as well but we can still go back to the overnight thing the overnight thing will stick that sticks you're right and my other my last I promis last question kind of a question I read some where where in Spain it's um they're banned and I realize we can't mix apples and oranges here but I'm just wondering if anybody has seen anything about a community in the United States that has banned Airbnb because I think Site Beach doesn't have them who Satellite Beach does not have is it that because they ban them they have an ordinance I mean there has to be a reason pre the state making so you couldn't ban them I think they were like grandfather but they have it was already in I mean you might get cancer if you live there but I mean you don't get Airbnb neighbors the only thing I've heard only thing I've heard that there's attempts to do maybe you might know more about this but I've I have heard that there's people trying to establish HOAs in their Comm in their community and one law that's it one HOA law is you can't have a as long as everybody at that time agrees that they don't have any Airbnb rentals that it's residential you can get all of them I don't know if they're any been successful in doing that but trying to form an HOA for the very only purpose it might be one block if they all agree we did then then maybe you can you can change your bylaws with your proper vote of your a place that currently is not under an HOA but they want to warm one and have that one oh you mean like a a subdivision of houses yeah like a house like a block of houses okay like a a street block that's residential you could form for anything as long as everybody votes for I don't know yeah that's what I mean I've heard that's a thought I don't know that it's ever materialized or if they've been successful or not because you have to get everybody to agree and most of the time when people get to that point it's because somebody on the stre street has an Airbnb so you wait till they or has a bad lawn yeah or something you know or you got to wait till they sell it or you know no longer there or something that's the only at this at this point in time yeah I think the HOAs are one of the only elements that are as long as they have it in their CC their conditions covenants and restrictions that can restrict uh short-term rentals in other words they can specify a minimum amount of time a house can be rented six months plus a day uh the problem is like you were saying Mr Colorado you got to have 100% I believe you have to have 100% vote to try to get an HOA established at the current time and if you've got one short-term rental guess what you've just lost your 100% vote yeah so uh know if it's been success and we don't know how long that's going to last based upon case law and things like that but right now that's about the only thing standing between these other subdivisions and uh outlawing HOAs you also had there was a period of time and I don't recall the specific date but if you had a law place prior to that date you could uh uh prevent a short-term rentals in your city and I think that may be where Satellite Beach fell I'm not sure yeah it but I don't recall that that exact date it was a date that far preceded the the problem or the the realization of the problem that we currently have which is nice and convenient but uh it was 2011 2011 so yeah if you could if you could have foreseen this in 2011 and passed the law you would have been good not many people did did that so they were grandfathered the right way um of these 1566 units that are being advertised currently that we know about do you know what the breakdown is is condominium versus um versus single family home yeah it's about 300 would be rs1 and the rest fall into other you know whether it's condo whether it's tlex and such so then that that that question it becomes difficult yeah and those are like self I had I had a couple questions too yes the um the data does it the data that mines all the different sites does it account for when they advertise on several sites like yes so it only counts them once or does it on there like those are real like I I do it oh you so I get it and it may have three or four different sites it's adverti on and I condense it into a single I tabulate it into a single so those numbers so they could be multiple sites but I'm only looking at it for one license even if it's on their five different sites counting one okay corre and how do you set the um fees so I think the way it was you said the registration like the BTR fee is for everybody and then is it an additional fee for rs1 corre how do you come up with the number like what the fee is I'm just well a lot of that has to do with like how does it change does it change you know after couple of years as it get escalated or anything involved in this a lot of brain work and a lot of math you can't make a profit you have to be able to justify the fees so back when this started I'm I'm sitting down trying to calculate okay how much does it cost to operate a fir Tru with firemen for an hour how much does it cost to operate a police car per hour you have to have a basis for charging those fees if you recall the commission really wanted to charge outrageous fees in my mind not outrageous but more than we could justify and so we have those fees have to be based upon an actual accounting of your cost the fire fee is $95 that's what it cost for for a truck and and a person for an hour the uh police department's a little bit cheaper it's $85 an hour uh the registration of 525 is what we could justify in terms of everything that staff has to do uh to get it registered and so forth so those fees uh were derived from a lot of math and a lot of looking at what the task were to to register these rs1 properties uh we'll do the same thing when we get into rm1 rm2 I assume the fees will be the same because it's the same inspections and so forth so but we can't just charge whatever we want to yeah so I wondered what the Boe the basis of the the estimates were and if they change I don't know when they were established but you know a lot of that has gone up pretty pretty dramatically the good thing about that is all of our fees are in a resolution so we can change that with one meeting yeah uh we can we can recalculate those fees because things do go up apply a CIP or something and we can change it with one meeting before the commission uh and uh and do before this board and then the commission as a resolution I happen to think they're kind of low too I don't know when they were established but they seem I think they were established in 2021 or 22 I can't one of those dates I can't recall exactly the cost of everything else has gone up so much so I was just wondering how does it get I don't know maybe look into the old Boe and see if it needs to be updated based on today's but Cory we have been looking at them yeah and Cory's right if you come in and you have been operating we go back three years in other words we can collect fees up to 3 years prior is our kind of been our standard uh we have some that have been operating longer than that under the under the wire to be perfectly honest with you under the radar but we do go back at least three years that's on the business tax receipt as well as the rs1 registration and soon to be the rm1 rm2 registrations and again just just so you'll know the great majority of these six or 700 of them are Condominiums Condominiums are almost self-regulating because they have a condo association and and it's not it has less likelihood of ruining the neighborhood if you will than in the rs1 where you've got you know it's some in some cases you never know they're there in some cases it's like living next to Animal House every week so that's why we've the commission has instructed staff to go after the rs1 first and just recently we're writing a new section of code with the city attorney's office to include rm1 rm2 in that and the I think the original intent was to it was like residence meaning the whole house the whole home is rented correct but are we looking at think we talked about this last time too was people renting half of their house or two rooms in the bath or you know things like that or is that not there are two options in the rs1 you either rent the whole house or you rent one bedroom now we've had situations where you show up and and your rental is the red door your rental is the Green Door rentals The Blue Door we've had three or four vacation rentals within one single family residence matter of fact we still have a case going on with that and so it is supposed to apply to these pardon it is supposed to apply to that those situations yes okay because because that we're we're operating a vacation rental not a mini motel in the residential zoning District it just doesn't read that way but we have photos of three or four different units if and you look at them online and they advertise them by name and they're all in the same building even some of the the banter going back and forth says oh yeah we rented this it was great there were four units and you know we didn't have to worry about anybody else and then outside you got four or five cars parked in the yard facing the street you know those it it gets a little ridiculous to be honest with you but they're going to do that until forced not to and I'm just wondering is there any speci like anything that can just knock down the big back back log cuz if you can only go back 3 years and get the money from the last three years and maybe this year whatever but well it seems like at the rate that they're growing and you're trying to catch them they're way ahead yes like is there a way to just like just spend six months or something and just knock out like a whole bunch of them or well I ask you to let us get our new software in cuz that allow us to start a a case on them right that day and if we have to put a sticker on their door or whatever it'll least be in the system and it starts the clock and that's that's what we're hoping the new system will do for us um when it comes to the software aspects and when do you expect that to be viable well our current software ends November 11th okay so by then somewhere prior to that hopefully October 15th or so it' be a nice start okay yes well I just want to say thank you this is a tremendous uphill battle it is I think you're you're you're going in the right direction to try to um try to amarate some of the problems that we're having you're always we're always going to have people we're always going to have people that want to fly under the radar and don't want to play by the rules it's going to happen all the time and you're never going to get everybody but I think that you know you're doing a lot of good things and thank you half the battle is tracking it to know that you have a problem and how big a problem and and that's what we're doing and we are attacking it with code enforcement um and phone calls um I can tell you um back in May I grabbed everything that was old there was about a hundred that were fairly old in our system and within two months I pulled in about 20 grand and um got it down to about 15 that weren't licensed yet so sometimes it's a phone call sometimes it's just awareness um to get people on board so we're we're moving in the right direction it's just I think we also have other jobs where where's the call place to I like if I had a list of people my neighborhood I knew oration Reynolds who would I send it to so they code enforcement if you if you don't think that they're registered or um you know they're not registered you send it to code enforcement but I would would necessarily know I just know that there's people coming and going different different cars several times a week just all you have to do is if you call code enforcement that would be the the first stop if they're not registered they can send out a letter and get them going so what are you asking is there a way on the site to know which ones have been registered is that what you so you could just say hey this is already register too if there was a checklist is there a place that shows which ones are registered or is that not I don't know if you guys can see that or not um we can tell at the city we can bring it up and see if they have a license um I don't know if you can look at their um address to find out what b btrs or whatever they have it is accessible through the city clerk if you want to ask about it but I don't think that you can see other people's online the only thing I wouldn't like about that is and someone could say H I wonder what you know was a vacation rental and they could go on a site and see the addresses and figure out which one they want to yeah I'll tell you what if you guys want to send me a list email it to me I'll be more than happy to take a look and ease your mind yes or no then we can go from there okay any other comments no oh I was uh back to the real estate question since they you said a lot of it was like lack of a awareness maybe that would be a good way to start that conversation with the local real estate like agencies like hey you know when you're selling and they're going to do a vacation rental like this area has XYZ and you know I have to inform the city or something like that like just hey by the way this is going to be a vacation rental you need to follow we'll follow up with you I can tell you this they're out there pushing the real know and most of them are probably trying to say come with us yeah probably and there are some good real estate agents don't get me wrong they make sure that they follow you got Max occupancy of eight you know you got a Max occupancy of four you've got to get your fire inspection done you know there's some out there that are forcing people to do the right things as well CU they want to have a good reputation as well but then there's always other [Music] people anything else folks no thanks for listening if you have any other questions whatever don't be afraid to email me or whatever right this will be good to see occasionally I guess you're going to start bringing it like I will probably every meeting or something yeah about every three years I'll bring it in some the Chang I'm kidding all right thank you very much thanks I assume we have no public comment because nobody's here any um board member reports or announcements no no I have nothing anybody okay and I think that's adjourned for today right good thank you thank you all