all right this meeting is being held on Tuesday July 16 2024 7 o'clock p.m. statement of adequate notice pursuant to the Sunshine Law adequate notice in accordance with the open public meeting Act njsa 10 col 4 hyen 6 was provided on February 1st 2024 of this meeting's date time and place the agenda was mailed to the cranbery press and Trenton Times posted on the township bulletin board and mailed to those requesting personal noes uh okay so roll call with your volunteer hours please pleas Miss sum uh present um three three Miss Ryan here uh one and a half Mr Guyer here one Mr H here two and a half Miss Marlo here one okay Mr Sabo advis us he was not attending M binari advises she was not attending and Miss kiram also advises she was not attending all right we do have a quorum though chair okay so I think we can begin with our application for Scott Avenue we are so happy to meet you please a little welcome I'm a little bit more to he so struggling here we are so happy you're here good and we are so happy to meet you um this structure is you know part of our historic inventory I so First Love First off my name is Rich bont my company's Equity Building Group I'm the contractor on this property nice Bez is the property owner oh yes welcome thank you so much for both of you to be here please come and sit down yeah well make yourself welcome this is notary in Langhorn Barrow Pennsylvania which is also a very historic town I own property there and I've been through this process so the first thing I did when when he called me on this was came here met Robin got a little feel for things because you know we want to do what what works um so anyway and and I would just say on behalf of the board I think we what to all agree we're just so happy that you are here and that you are you know taking ownership of this structure and you know doing doing work with the structure because it's got such a really fun you know history and you know we just think it's fantastic part of our town it's always something that's pointed out on walking tours um you know how it was moved and how it was you know a little bit naughty before so that's cool I just think that um we're just really happy that you are here and we're really optimistic about you know the future of the structure so thank you thank you so do you want me to talk you guys have copies of of of the architectural plans correct yes um and I also have some pictures some actual photographs just you remind yourself of anything I printed One S okay but but there are pictures that show the railings and show the existing and such um it's currently being used as a or well it looks like its last use was a as a three-unit residence and and that's what he would like to continue to do just kind of make the residences a little higher scale um but as far as the exterior for the most part um it's going to look the same um just function better now right now if you look at the pictures it does have old windows with Hideous storm windows over it um it it also has aluminum siding on the three sides the two sides in the back the front has the columns in the wood the front looks pretty much correct so I saw that face um so you know the interior the we're going to make nice nice units out it um but but for the outside I kind of went around both sets of plans from the demo one to the to the rebuilding one and I did things in order starting at the left rear corner um starting at the the left rear bump out there there's a door that will be eliminated it'll be framed in and and covered over with siding similar to what's there and the rear you said on the side we look at the picture pict there's a uh it would be this door right [Music] here yes that that that door is to be removed and we'll put siding to match what's there oh okay um the siding the side is staying and getting painted okay is the plan and all the wood will be straight to painting okay uh will not replace it any kind of siding other than where we remove something like that put a like siding and painted to match okay um um left side unit one Windows removed framed to new size um new windows installed siding to match EX existing so working our way around the building okay um if you go to the demo plan which is probably the second page I'm kind of working around the building um yeah back here so this becomes a kitchen here at the back corner there's two windows uh they will be removed and reframed just so they fit above the countertop of Theos Kitchen in that unit um again any siding that's removed will be replaced with L siding and painted um unit one which I'm I'm I'm calling unit one as you look at the building to the left side okay uh so that yeah that's what we're looking at here right this is unit one yes okay so it currently has a door entry door that is to be relocated we're going to take that door out frame in here make the entry there so you walk in and you're at the steps it's going to take the place of the window that side yes I have [Music] everything yes so that you walk in the proper place you walk in the steps are there the windows over where the door um the existing rear entry doors on units two and three will be re removed and reinstalled to open outward okay and the reason for that is so that there's room for the space inside yeah these doors will be removed and and um the chimney at the rear will be demolished uh the exposed areas will be covered with siding the same as existing and painted to match are they not used I'm sorry no they are not not correct they are not used uh the there so to address that question and it's a huge chimney to sh it in two units um each unit's going to get um modern 90% efficient gas fired units it's oil it's oil there which will v through a 4in PVC is so you won't need that chimy so you won't need the chimy but they'll be still firepl right and if you look at if you go to the demo plan it's it's huge um it it literally goes through no it's in the back here it's right here and and it's in both kitchens so so I'm going to get rid of that we're going to put siding over and paint to match the siding for the exterior that's Everything Exterior on the first floor anyone is that clear what's the uh I believe that's where that that say probe it says yeah probe yeah we're not sure probe for removal yeah yeah um something in there you can't tell what's there without getting in a little bit deeper okay um and and and I believe that everything from there over was an addition in this unit one there's a step up right here yeah so I I feel like this was was an addition um I don't really know what's going to be in there um is there is there a seller under unit one or just under the two other units cuz doors small cell there stairs to the cellers thees but is there a crawl space or a cell probably 10 foot by 10 foot just enough to get where you can see your utilities and then you can see all space I think a lot of that plays into the fact that the building was moved yeah you know what I mean if it was moved as a ho they must have done a foundation and and it's up on C spaces and and obviously they poured this whole front cement thing okay the one other addition um to the first floor is that on the porch on the first we're gonna add railings that divide because it's three units and and they're going to go from the column right back to the building and we're going to build them the exact construction to wooden to match the the rail on the top of the building and paint the match so each person has more like their own little so people will have a balcony and they'll also have a front porch that's kind of that's kind of the plan that's an improvement okay I think the people will want that for sure yeah it's I mean this is a great area and and and it's worthless now on the second floor um units one and two um at the balcony doors and windows at the balcony to be reversed um relocated per the drawings um the one of the one of the um doors in the middle unit right because of where they are inside the one in the middle is literally in the bath you can't open it it's a it's a it's a saw and half like a Dutch door it opens in and you can't do it so we're we're relocating them so that there's Windows where the doors are and the doors are in proper places yeah and my plan is to use the existing doors and just frame for them okay um so units one and two balcony doors and windows the balcony to be removed relocated per drawings existing doors to be reused Windows per tear sheets siding to match existing and to be painted to match um question about the windows um like I see for example um there's actually different types of windows so here here here's here's where uh so I got you tear sheets the windows are are are hideous that's in there I got your tear sheets on replacement windows that I'd like to use um they're going to be an improvement on what's there um but they are they are vinyl what's there now what's there now is a mix match some are some are final Replacements the majority of them have storm windows over them um some are old wooden ones in in poor condition there there's nothing that's like a beautiful preserved thing and and in the reality of it wooden exterior windows are are it just makes the job almost possible to to you know it just puts it to not make sense I I got tear sheets that will have the you know the your grids they'll look good they'll be and you don't see a LP of window in this it's just and and what you're seeing windows are actually smaller than I I try to get pictures over here that a good example so I you know my my window manufacturer that they're very good they look good they're not wooden that's you can get plenty of options with wood on the inside and and still be reasonable but but I I think trying to make this work the best we can for for all parties there we go you said there were um grills on the Windows is that there in one window there's Grill there's a grill and then on the provas they were getting yeah I didn't see it in there oh not in the yeah this pictures they're not there oh yeah so he's planning to do 9 over n so so it changes on the window size sure know I did so it makes sense so right it's that that's the generalization yeah so these are six over sixes that's what fits the smaller Windows yeah they're smaller it looks like a 6x6 the one that does have a grill is a six by six it absolutely changes by your size of the window whether it's you yeah and and I have not measured them yet I there's storm windows on top of every have you been able to refer to any historic photos of what the windows used to look like on the building I looked real hard couldn't find anything okay there we have some online uh there's a map that we have of all the historic properties in town and if you click on this property it'll have two photos of uh one looks to be maybe in the 70s and one looks maybe 100 years ago uh the one in the 70s the windows looks similar to what it looks like today but the one from a century ago um has 6 over six with um black dividers and black shutters yes I know um did this list the available colors we don't color is outside our we not dict but yeah will you plan to use white that's what's there you know what I UL I believe that a question for you we want to make you guys happy and and and get something that that suits right um I have a a great window supplier I deal with and and um the different ones have different colors does look cool that it's the new thing I I need to get aop picture I literally when I when I came here in first wanted to find I want to find out the history on I like that stuff and I like to put that into what you do yeah um I struggle to find information on it that's why yeah that's why that's we're so happy you're here because we're here to U you guys the dicey P to this place what's that i g get fill in on it's dicey I mean theyve that's why they moved it after the after the meeting um yeah J so this is our website Cranberry Township website historic preservation commission so if you go to third from the bottom um interactive map right interactive map of Cranberry come on go there go there yeah it's not g to work but I did go to a website and then and then you can it's a map right um by this gentleman and um you can click on the the your building the address or the building either one right and and the information will come up so uh you can find the whole read the whole history uh on the site and the photographs are there as well that's awesome I will that's um is there any way somebody could email me a link of that yeah okay cool yeah we're emailing back and forth um let me just finish with my notes Here um so unit one which I'm calling the one to the left and unit two which I'm calling the center already have forc air heat in them so there's duct work so our plan is to put high efficiency you know 90% efficient PS units in there um in the basement or within the unit I'm going to keep them in their same location okay um because there's already the doctor work there and and and they just that with a PVC um you will have to have compressors outside side uh because we're adding AC and and the unit all the way to the right the only thing I can do there is Mini Splits so those are like three wall units has a condenser outside right and then it goes there's a head so you know your line set your line set goes there's a head in each room um they're actually really cool for these kind has they're about this big inside and and they're very and and and depending on on um you know the size of it one compressor one outside unit can do usually three you usually do I honestly forget how many we're putting in here but it would probably be two units outside do you know where the compressors will be located outside like I don't I was planning on in the in the rear probably um if you're looking yeah if you're looking at at the rear there's there's some little porches out there right um that's one of them my plan would probably be right here again like close to the building and then here oh you have you have the's on wall oh yeah oh yeah that's no problem at all but here and just for the you obviously for the look but as well for for the efficiency it's less L said I got to run and less electric but you're not going to nobody's going to rent a nice unit uh with no AC just it just doesn't happen and just something tells me here I'm supposed to turn the page Mr Bowman if you don't mind I'll include that in the application so you don't have to fill out another application once you apply for the condenser okay so I'll include that in this if you don't mind okay and I'll put it it's in it's in the rear um oh and then my last note to myself is railings to be constructed of wood and built to match existing um placed to divide units on first and second floor the plans only show that on the first floor but but they will be on the second floor okay also so that each unit has their front porch they have their balcony and and that's the extent of of what will change outside what a one um question I would have is you know how like it's a little like it's settled like the the front porch is the the balcony is like settled a bit and it's like a little angled so is it is it structurally stable so you guys are keeping it the same yeah it's actually kind of built that way to some extent if you look at at yes I don't know what was above it before but it does have a little bit of a pitch when you're up there but if you look at where it's mounted where it's fac on these it's actually fitted for it there's a structure holding it right here okay it looks to me like it was it was built to be on that angle um it's heavy it's it's it's plaster and laughing there's a picture of looking at an area that's um I'm not sure I was going to I was going to replace what's damaged if any and and then paint a match um so if we were to adjust that angle and again it was after going back and looking at these pictures that this is Notch to go that way and and and up on the top it is um it's like 1X it's right that's what it's for and and and the only way I could see to change that which I don't think is a good idea would be take off all those boards sister everything next to it to change the angle and and I don't think that that's change where's the one I mean it's it's a healthy thing they built there here it is this this is this is on the first floor looking up an area that's damaged and it's definitely Laing Ander on the inside um but it's it's the way it was built um you have that picture handy from uh that old one yeah right here you can probably zoom in yeah that's what I'm thinking it's I'm like I'm like looking like it doesn't help a lot does it but that was what and again we haven't opened up any walls or anything we proved what we can and and and done the the architectural studies and and and come up with the best plan but that's that's kind of where we are and that's other than you guys have copies of the pl you have sheets on the Windows um that's kind of what I got I don't know if you need something else so um do we want to go through questions or or comments I'm sorry we want to start um going through with um questions and comments I guess whoever wants to get first and um um well I want to pose a question to the commission okay um talking about the windows um we do have it sounds like a few wood windows but we have a bunch of replacement windows so my understanding is if there's already replacement windows there we can't don't have to you okay I've played in bands for 35 years my mother always said Richard you your hearing if you don't wear heing protection and guess what she said right um so now sure of course um so I don't know that they're required to replace the windows with replace replacement windows with original windows so I wanted to kind of know what you guys think about that so um so it sounds like we have like a a variety of Windows and they're mostly replace probably all replacement windows at this point um so it sounds like there's wood ones there's vinyl ones might be metal ones um that we're not we don't require that the original Windows go back like like they don't have to be like wood double hung six over sixes so what do we feel about the windows because the proposed window is a vinyl window no no he he shared he shared those documents that show that it's multip you take it back oh here's this is right so we're talking about the six over six so they're all right I want the units to have be efficient you know what I mean nobody wants windows don't work the store windows are hideous awful and there there'll be screens on the bottom abolutely kind of the stuff people want these days are you are you Main mean this um front door here um looks like it's in unit one uh two the doors will will be the same I'm going to use the existing doors um but some get relocated so it looks saying to the committee it looks like this door is the original door and the other doors were removed because it has the side lights transom it's much more okay this is unit one that's the storm door that's on it right and then I have I there was method to what I did here that's an existing door what's that I did each one closed and then open the one this is the and with the encasement and everything this is like kind of this is rese this comes back to the original structure it's the most authentic yes this is like yeah what good looks like so let me just check but it looks like what happened was over like in between the 1910 and the 1970s they for whatever reason changed the door to just a simple well if piure you guys had over here was a double door it was a pretty neat looking double door and I got yeah that's gone and they put in this really yes ugly thing so and this is the one that we're going to relocate and put a window there so that this lines up with the staircase yeah um I gotta read my notes again let side unit one two windows unit one left side current entry door to be relocated um existing re entry doors yeah no so it's only unit one I believe um do do are you open to knowing seeing that this is kind of like the best this is what we we because so okay so in a historic the commission what we we always try to do is we always kind of look to how it had been right and that's sort of like okay that's what good looks like um so if you're if you're swapping these wind this door anyway would you be open to doing a door that's sort of like yeah a sideline light yeah it is almost like its own little vestibule so that door States yep existing exterior door to remain on the existing exterior doors remain on both units except the one far left that's it's best if you look at these two together so on this here is uh the demo plan shows existing okay this one stays me look at the new plan these two are in the same place it's only this one that we're moving oh one door the door on unit one yes okay and we're swapping the windows so that will appear the same there'll be a railing from that column back R from that column back this will look very similar okay so it'll still be that we have just all I was going to do to that was take the storm door off yeah okay um but the and the door itself is going to be um we're I'll reuse that door over here okay on this one here the door is C here yep I'm going to take it out and move it to here yep which would be right about there you're taking that door and basically swapping that door in that window you look at the plan that window is almost right in front of the stairway so I'm to walk in to the yes okay these are going to remain as rentals that's the plan okay so we have right now we have discussion going on about um the doors and I guess you know does does the committee think that we um are okay with swapping the door and the window and keeping everything exactly the same as it had been or do we think that we might want to suggests something to tie in some of the elements of the existing door that we know was original that has like you know these see these little boxy things down here I'll frame it out and make it look yeah I'm not I'm not going to do this and and slap something I mean we know you can't you won't have space to do something like this but see the the problem that there is a ledge there though this is where if you look at the house where I I told you that one part's an addition even inside there's a step up there so so to some degree I'll be limited but if you want it to be trimmed out to tie in that that's fine okay it's it's it's lower it's there's a step up in the house about this High Yeah Yeah so basically everyone's door is different yeah yeah yeah I know I know that's I'm just trying to think of is there a way yeah consistency what do you say to build on Susan's concern or question about the window materials um we we have standards that are set for us that we're supposed to apply that specifically says that it it shall be preserved that you wouldn't be able to substitute a vinyl where there's a wood window um and it also says the number size shape and location of existing Windows shall be retained Windows should not be blocked in to reduce the size of the opening or to fit stock size new window openings should not be added to any elevation visible from a public Street the same sort of rules for doors and so if we were [Music] to go against these standards that have been set for us I think we need to have an understanding about why doing so will improve the historic authenticity of the structure so our standard isn't going to be just does it look good but in order in order to to ignore these standards that are that are given to us in the code we have to justify it by it's becoming more historic By ignoring that standard okay yeah so so the old picture that you have there it's a giant double door yeah can I give you a mic I'm sorry okay yeah so in in that picture which which I'm seeing for the first time today um they're giant like double doors and and I I don't know how you would do that in a modern sense um as I said you're not really required to put back what's not there now um so we're kind of working with what the current situation is um but I don't have an answer which is why I was asking everyone I know I don't either I don't either um right but we typically do not approve full vinyl window no windows um so I understand you already said that there is a you know cost limitation you're not going to put wood windows back everywhere and I don't think that's really what we're saying um yeah that's the most important the front front well in this case though it's a corner right so it's it's both Scott Avenue and it's Maplewood Avenue those are the sides we really care about as far as the appearance of Windows um do we have elevations there AR a lot of other material choices so that's the problem either wood or final clad woodal clad wood or um we we have approved some composite windows in town as well recently within the last year so I think the main concern is if if there are you know dividers that they're dimensional they're not flat I'm sorry they're what on a window you you have oh yeah then they they not be flat pieces that they be dimensional like a I got to walk up here well I I I at least from the material that he getes I think that they are they're not like tape to [Music] the has to but they are mounted on the inside of the window they're not if we're trying to make it more historical the reveal in the window is very small but maybe we could put shutters and and that would make the windows on those doors on those walls look more appropriate it's just the mechanism itself because they have a small Ral that would have grids I think that could possibly work if you if you do consider shutters you have all the yeah I have a few of them here three that's on nice if if you do consider shutters they should at least look up they hung on the Windows not just not just put flat on the side of the building well you want functioning shutters not necessarily functioning but mounted as if they could they look as if they could function in other words they're not flat on the side of the building they're they're they're on it's going to be tough kind it's going to be tough with the location of the windows and the doors because there's so many of them and they're behind railing and and behind columns I think what makes this this building pop what looks good about is is it's it's distinct railing designs and the columns and I think that's really what I would just say if you're G you weren actually make the shutters look as if they were F then I wouldn't put them on at all because sometimes they just get mounted flat against the side of the building there's no Dimension at all there's no it's like the shutter the shutters on the new condos on it's like I would prefer I would prefer better Windows to adding shutters just leave the shuts since they're not there now or or the other thing that might help a lot would be to put a a wider trim board I was thinking that too we could window so so my first thought was we could do like a 1x4 wooden trim which could look cool but then when I thought that I thought it was actually the shutters that were more catching it it would it would actually be really cool to trim it out with a 1x4 and they had shutters before they had shutters before on but it looked like it was um in the picture it looked like maybe not every window had a shutter spacing was different too yeah yeah oh the spacing is all over the place I just think B like there's a lot of variation in the window trim around the building looks like pictures so if you want a wider I I like that and it helps me because we're changing the sizes and we're going to cut them out and I'm keeping the existing siding so that actually really helps yeah yeah it's important that it have a SE not what I call I agree yeah right we could box it out in 1x4 and and and that really helps with with the metal siding that I'm I'm trying to work around some of those things you actually have to be in it doing it to see what works but I understand what you guys are saying some consistency I'm I'm I like my work to look good not at alland you can get shutters you can get wood shutters you can get composite shutters you can get VY shut if you want to do shutters but I do the reason I mention it application that used composits the the the the one thing that's always stood out about this structure to me is that it's just so much white and um I like when I see what the with how it used to look with the shutters it adds a little more and it may make the building have more curb appeal if there were shutters and consistent windows with the the grills and the you know the the trim being consistent yeah there's the the window replacement window is really the mechanism you know it's your it's your double pane glass it's got your grids it it's got that we we can trim it or or whatever to to accomplish this and and and honestly if I had seen those before pictures it's okay before it would have helped but this thing's clearly been changed all kinds of ways yeah yeah yeah but it's still I still think it looks good I think it adds curve appeal um the shutters am I right or the storm doors are hideous the storm doors and the storm windows are absolutely hideous yeah and sometimes as you're doing it that takes shape a little bit you know what I mean we may pay maybe the doors are all look good black like I I don't know it's a little hard to visualize with the way it's it is right now I mean they they are the cheapest um storm doors you can get and and the same thing with the storm windows all right we need a resolution yeah what do we want to say about Windows I'd have an easier time even saying if we had a more specific plan about what these openings were going to look like what the framing was going to look like what the windows are going to look like I right now it's all kind of still it's still still yet to be defined I think meaning if if you had an elevation to look at I feel the same I feel the same I think we're GNA get there to a place where it will work for everyone like and but um what I'm thinking is like if if it would be possible to to sketch out what what it it would look like do you just want a front elevation yeah I think the front elevation would be enough for me I mean the other way I'd like the front and the Maplewood Avenue because it is cor and just the front we're not too worried about that other side on the other Corner front and Maplewood front and the right side okay the two that you want elevation drawing of of of each side that I think that I understand I understand now is that something we can put together and send to the board or do we have to come back um yeah the I don't know I mean I think we would I think we need to hear I think everybody would like to just see it one more time but we do meet we meet once a month um so you know if you make you know put this together we can meet a month from now and and finalize everything is that gonna be okay with your schedule okay I I I I would like to at least be able to to email it prior and and have you guys review it um and get get get a feel we're on the right page yeah yeah yeah yeah yes definitely that's fine we can do that yes okay is that going to hold the U plan review on this so we can start construction maybe Demolition and and start doing some like framing on the inside you can do inside work now you can do you can start that yeah anything on the inside you can so long as you have approval from the other departments yeah you can start on the inside so but depending on how the permit is issued if the permit is for the exterior and interior together then they won't be able to get an exterior permit until after we approve it yeah do do I understand okay maybe we can't get like partial approval on the I gotta look at everything and and and try to I understand what you need yeah I got what you guys need okay so so elevation of those two sides that'd be great yeah and and it would be great because then we will'll see we'll have a better understanding how to visualize it you know we' you will have time to take in the picture of what it used to look like um you you you've taken in our requests especially about the shape the the the frames of or the um the grills of the windows seeing what that's going to look like that's going to make us feel much better versus like these U two one and just just for my own you you you think having them framed out with like a 1x4 is preferable to to to um shutters personally like personally I personally I think so I just think the shutters because of the spacing of the windows it's going to be difficult to get them to really work with the door placements and the windows so but we'll really be able to tell that with the elevation so I I'll start there I'll get you the elevation drawings and and if I get an email back it's awful we hate it we we'll take another crack at right away I'm sure it's not yeah exactly everything else I do have one more concern about rules we're supposed to apply um chimneys shall be preserved according to our the standards yeah I I didn't get to that I I also agree um with member pole because the chimney it's it's not a chimney for a fireplace or anything and it would have had to been added when they moved the building there's no way they moved the chimney with it it it's it uh I thought it was I saw it in the picture of from 19 uh 10 10 was the chimney in the picture I don't know where did my computer go oh there it is um there is a there is a chimney I'm not I can't I would think originally this had fireplaces at some point but but that chimney is is for HVAC and and it had to have been added when the building was moved yeah the historic picture has the we can't see anything h no right here that's the 70s one right so that that's I'm sorry oh we can't see it in the in the old picture I was looking at the 1970s picture with the with with the TV antenna on it how anybody mov that chimney May there may be additional photos Beyond just this one because this was a business um that long ago there there there might be other historic photos that we can that you might be able to find yeah I I've looked but I will continue to look um if you one if you called the cranberry History Center they are open on Thursday afternoons and ask them if they have any pictures of William Carson's Tavern yeah or they'll know it as the old American Hotel yeah yeah they'll know yeah okay so it's the cranberry cranberry History Center um it's right here on 6 South Main Street uh this is the phone number and you can email them 609 86889 8689 yeah and there's an email History Center comcast.net I'll be able to find that tell me the name of the building again it's the the history and you just want to ask them they're only open on Thursday afternoons old American Hotel Old American hotel or also known as William M Carson's Tavern William M Carson Tavern do you know the original address of it um it was originally at 14 North Main it was at 14 North Main Street and now and then it was called the American Hotel they changed when it went from Tavern to Hotel yeah now you catch my drift about how it was a little yeah so they said basically okay they're uh let's let's move it away from Main Street during the temperance movement yeah the I'd say that the more uh evidence we're able to see of you bringing things back the way it used to be a restoration to say I think that gives more flexibility in approving changes from the way it is today if it's a change towards the past that gives us more flexibility so for example a photo from um uh a historic photo without that chimney would help us understand more about is that chimney really significant to the history of the building or not probably moved in yeah I think 1830 around that that's was built 1910 Wall probably the same thing on the other side and there actually is one inside on the other that's the one that spot you saw on the the area you need to probe right no my guess is the chimney that you want to remove was an added chimney when they removed it and they put the furnaces in the basement they had yeah okay you didn't yeah okay so if we could let let's just double check and research make sure and then yeah I appreciate you um yeah the ladies at the History Center are very knowledge about this information and if they don't have you know pictures then I mean we'll figure out a way to to make make some assumptions about what based on what you's been seeing in looking at the building I I understand um then I will do that and what I'll do is I will email everything I find prior so that we see if we're on the right page yeah um Al continue to work the building department maybe there's things that these don't affect the chimney affects a lots the labs the kitchens it affects the H systems a lot of okay loc so I'll try to work just let everybody know we're trying to work out yeah yeah no we yeah thank you so much for working with us so happy you're here that's it thank you thank you so much for coming all right I'll see you guys thank you thank you sir thank you thanks very much okay great well that was exciting okay so next um these applications for Parkplace and Sims are they just for me yes okay very right good okay so next we have a new business um do we have any new business this was a lot of business today okay all right so next old business uh Cranberry Township signage I have some updates I'm very excited so the first update is I wanted to tell you guys that I got curious about those signs that are over by the park the old ones um that look really old and and dilapidated and I actually took a magic sponge to it and started figuring out that it's just really really dirty so I started cleaning it so you might notice the one by the park is a little cleaner but I have to bring in like a bucket of soapy water and some kids and it's been too damn hot to go and do it but um I think that's really great that we don't have to like replace it right yeah and then I went over and checked the one at Michelle vul's house and that one is also really dirty so yeah so that's a project um and if anyone knows anyone who's looking for like a volunteer project I mean it could be a good boy scout project to clean off a sign what couple hours yeah yeah um okay so we have that going on we also um I think Miss Marbell is working with um the the wayfinder that got hit by the truck I think she's working on doing some stuff with that um we did um bring cookies and a our thank you note over to DPW finally um and I apologize if it took me a while my mother dying I got behind with things but um we brought it over I think they were happy um the flyer is live um and we sent um I sent a thing in for the announcement people actually get like a little Link in the mayor's email but already it's in the kiosk so that's good on the street signs um the wayfinder and the wayfinders in front of town hall and the church are still there um including the one that says the library is over there CH if you don't mind I'm sorry but I spoke with Jerry I finally saw him he's gonna remove it he said there's something an issue with the back ho yeah so they're working on it so that's he's definitely gonna work it yeah that's awesome um and then I still have an action item to grab a sample from Jerry for cranberry day um so maybe we can you might maybe we can coordinate that even asking just to grab an example of the old green street sign to bring over for cranberry day I can even send him a note and ask him um yeah um and so that is all the stuff with signage um okay next we have can I ask a question yes any questions about signage is there any word about the whatever the monument signs the like pH gateways no word I have not heard any thing I was I can follow up maybe a month from now or so with M with the traffic committee I haven't heard anything so um okay any other about signage okay uh next we have the cranberry station Hamlet historic district and the Certificate of Eligibility um and I had sent you a note about that and I know you're working on stuff um so one of the issues I found so I went through I did some research on Monroe Township's historic commission and there the our website is very nice by the way and um they focus very much on uh their um the die Road die Farm site um and so I I went on to Lucy to see um where historic districts were and um so what's nice about going on to Lucy and seeing the historic districts is that our cranberry station Hamlet now shows up on Lucy which is very nice but it also shows that the Monroe side has no designation whatsoever not eligibility nothing no level of of of recognition and I'm like how do we get there when we need the state is telling us we need the Monro yeah resources and there's no surveys there's nothing that has been done and we can't do my understanding is we cannot survey another Town's resources and you know um we can't say hey Monroe you do it we'll pay you for it you know and I that is a hurdle that I don't understand how to right yeah I think it's a lack of resources probably or yeah their focus is on the DI or interest but I I don't know how we overcome that so um do we have to have that though like um in the that's what to that's what our our friends from the state said is that it was an incomplete you know submission without the entire Hamlet being being there survey so I had two ideas one I'm G to call Andrea tingi back and say how do we do this you're telling us to do us you know give us you know a funded mandate explain how we do it and the other is that I know that middle sex county has like a big survey of some sort of resources not necessarily you know already registered resources and I had reached to them about the you may have heard about the barn that burned down the Rucker own last week yeah I was very sad that was um last week and uh it was a timber frame frame barn and it was on one of our agricultural farms and yeah yeah but I had reached out to the county previously I'm like do you have a survey of This Barn they did so um I was going to do that again again and uh reach out to them and see if perhaps they felt that that area was significant in the past and have any kind of documentation on it so those are the two ideas I had so far regarding the Monroe side of our Hamlet what about the um the bordon town application like didn't you say that the gentleman yeah Pier lome I you know I went through uh the certificates of eligib that you can find you know at the state site and stuff and he must have there are about four or five different certificates of eligibility for board and Town Township and City that are related to the railroads yeah and so I don't know which one it is so I I'm GNA try to I'm gonna try to track him down himself and see if I can um uh pick his brain on that piece so all right well um sounds like we have some options some PA it's this is a big challenge we we will prevail okay great um okay next we have um identifying um designating historic sites um and Amy who wasn't able to be here today she did look through the list did we um is this the updated list that that's Amy's that's Amy's list okay I think we can table this until Dave and Amy come back I think because this is yeah I think it's better that way um okay this is important um public Outreach so mayor's communication that's that's going forward um I drafted out a couple new things wa wait wait wait I'm sorry designation of Cranbury Village historic district property oh my God I'm so sorry yes oh my God I'm so sorry I forgot I skipped do that um Liz the latest update is that Liz is now going to be able to work on it by September and we're following up with her regularly is that enough time to get it in front of PC and all that it is okay okay I'm sorry okay so public Outreach um we have the um we drafted up um a couple of communications that we can do for um like for the mayor's emails and for the kiosk and then a little brochure that we could give out at cranberry day um and so I saw your feedback Brendan such a great idea about putting in that QR code um I could work with you to try to figure out how to put it into the actually M say was a question about if it was going to be digitally distributed then I don't know that a QR code makes sense uh if it's it's really only if it's printed out that we should be putting a QR code on it uh we're g to put it um I think we're going to put it um in the um kiosk a version of it in the kiosk so we could do a version with the QR code for the kiosk okay and then one that we do for the mayor's email just this way with the link to it okay um and we could have the QR code version at cranberry day some format yeah yeah we can do like a little um yeah standup sign things um and then this is um I know we wanted this is you know do a communic about doing a you know a concept review so I use I think I use language from the website to do this I didn't write any of this um but it's if you guys have any edits or um suggestions on how to make it better I have a suggest that I don't want the per Stone picture oh that if we could find found stock picture yes or something that looks historic or looks I just was trying to show I didn't even notice that it was so small the picture and it's not until you blow it up you see I'll try to find a picture of a cran I want do one where it showed someone working on a roof right um but I'll try to find a more of a historic home with people working on the roof siding yeah Stone good suggestion design wise the very top of that is the historic homeowners is maybe one of the most important parts of this page and the white kind of gets lost on the gray so probably want to make it pop more yeah yeah that's a good idea too I'm just gonna make a quick note if it's okay make it pop um I was also I don't know like the stock picture has colors like should we maybe not have the colors in it like do you think people are going to take it literally right I mean it was just a stock picture I could try to figure out a way to sniff it where it doesn't have the paint swabs um actually I'm going to just do that because I don't want to get in trouble with people you know since we're not supposed to talk about paint um okay since we're yeah exactly um okay cool um the other thing is this brochure do hickey um so it didn't print out the right way I have to flip it around but um it's gonna be I promise you I promise you guy once I once we get it fixed yeah okay so my question for you guys is like okay if you look at each of these panels that we have what is number one what is number two what is number three like what is the order um and then I can um set it up so that so like yeah this is one this would be the cover right then do we want to go to our history next or our mission next um like I think the accomplishments should be last maybe um we have our history first um our history and our mission our history and our mission okay history okay history and learning more okay responsibil Y and then okay last okay cool um two things one I think our history should also include the cranberry station hamlet in our history oh wait okay I had it in accomplishments wait uh because the crry if you use the same language then you say like the cranberry station Hamlet was added to the you know local register in 2021 or whatever it was okay added to the regist was locally designated I think we probably be the best way to phras that that's a good way to say it was locally designated yeah what was the year 2021 all right um in 2021 and the other thing I'll bring up is that our I think our mission statement is still the same mission statement that Lindsay came in our audit and said needed to be upgraded and sharog wrote some language oh my God I about that never yeah that was that's totally my fault because Robin kept sending it to me and then I'm like then I'm like I can't find it and such but remember let's try one more time and everyone look at it put it on the website yeah finalize our mission language um I think it was almost there and then we can we okay we can update the website as well as put and we just enough time because we have one more meeting before cranberry day so yeah I know okay all right awesome love that um any other feedback make it all one line one I can try I will try I may have to yeah make it easier to read or maybe I break it at youtube.com and then slash yeah I I'll try to figure out um yeah good call a URL wise uh this one in the U concept review flyer has cranber h.org historic-preservation DC commmission so long I'm wondering this may be a question for Robin I don't know is the township website able to support like a shortcut where we could do SL HPC and then it would redirect to Historic Das [Music] preservation it's a good point because yeah every nobody wants to write long thing long um long URLs sorry a question what is can we set up a redirect I guess potentially change it but even if not change it just have a redirect so you can if you were to type inhbc you would be taken to his Das that'd be awesome and they might want to do that with the with the you might they might want to ask want to do it with their YouTube as well because this is like I don't know if they really thought this through about doing it as Township of cranberry 1110 there any significance probably just the first one they gave them um if we want to promote that the YouTube channel that we have for the town I just found it because I went to YouTube I typed in cranberry and then I found the channel and I clicked on the URL and that's how I got this is there is there a link through the our website to get to the YouTube videos it is yeah I put it on I believe the column oh it's in the to our live meetings oh to the live meetings no I put it on um I put on every agenda yeah I'm sorry I thought you were talking about the the state presentation since this URL actually leads to the live meetings for every board and commission and committee I don't know that we need to take responsibility for putting the full URL on our brochure think it's a problem for us to use the towns youo I didn't realize that's what you were talking about yeah we can't change I don't think that could be changed because that's the settings for every maybe the language in the brochure could be you know you can you can join the live meeting you know through through the agenda on the on the website or something to that effect because the agenda are are listed right and just click on those and you click on the link y so another thing we may even be even easier for the end user is just say meetings are streamed on the Cranberry Township YouTube channel yeah and that way then people will go to YouTube Cranberry Township and find it yeah AB let's just do that okay um I have a question about the list of appointees so you know our Vol like the membership and I don't I think it's fine to put it there but say by the time this is printed in September by 2025 in theory you are no longer chair I'm no longer Vice chair oh yeah we can update it every year I think okay Rob was saying she can print some of these out at a town hall um I'm just we'll just do on my regular paper um yeah up okay cool love it all right I'm trying to keep us on task because I got a 8:30 soccer pickup um okay left the intera um okay any other communication thing oh I know this is the most important Chach keys for CR yes okay but we need to make the decision like now because we have to order it well do we have any financial information to go with these yes Nifty so depend which you my thought is we do that which oneor I think we should just do that which one get the small one like keep it as low cost as possible sure see how many we give out on cranberry day and how people feel about them if people are like this sucks then we know not to do this again yes yeah can are they able to Brand you know the small ones okay cool you wanted the cranberry seal correct are we yeah we allow F oh niceas so that's fine of course yeah I'll send you some kind of file what file is best does it matter what file is best does it matter PDF word I don't yeah if if there was a if there was a vector version of the seal Vector yeah so that that could be AI for example that's exciting okay cool and then I'm gonna try to make a little um I was thinking maybe we make like some sort of a back Banner thing and I was going to use my now that I become a graphic designer I was going to use canva to try to make something for us um for our next meeting to look at and then we can have it printed out at Staples for the back background and we can you know finalize be mounted at like would be on the like tent Poes a pie or figure out what we do like um I have a table obviously and chairs we have a popup tent thing that but ours is kind of broken but I can fix it um so yeah I might have one as well yeah and then I think when I when we design something I can see the Staples and put those little circle things on it so we kind of hang it at gr yeah grommets and we have electrical ties too yeah we need that um one more question about our tape measures do we need to choose a color and if so we choose red well like I'm Red's not specific enough cranberry is uh the town website well cranberry red no see this maroon color that we have on the website and it's in the Insignia I'm keeping that color like well it's an option it might just be primaries right yeah try to match something close yeahp black yellow's good then you can find it so cute I'm so excited you guys Robin this Ste might be handdrawn so there might not even be a vector version of it um I in order to make the interactive map I took a version and upscaled it and made it as high resolution as I can I could compare that to whatever versions you have and we'll figure out which version is best and then I can I can help you make that determination do you have a sense of lead time like ASAP is yeah and let us know if run into any troubles with him saying how he can deliver it you know like it's going to be on a boat for three months yeah okay cool all right and then okay the last thing was um the student ex aicio volunteer for commission um I was shared with guy that I did some quick research did you want to do updates or do you want me to share what I found in my research no no no so I didn't have a chance follow up on okay all right so I'll share with everyone what I found okay so I found language from Princeton High they don't call their um their board the kids that are on the board they call them like student Representatives but there is a little language in the description that I sent to you that we might be able to use if we were to write up like a description but more importantly when I started Googling it started getting into legalities about having someone under the age of 18 on a board and it's actually legally not allowed for anyone in the state of New Jersey to be on a board if you're under 18 but you can be like a non voting like representative and so I got that confirmed and then the big lead that I found was that the town of iGo Illinois is in the process right now of adding student Representatives or youth representatives to their historic preservation commission so I asked if guy if you could call them and find out what they're going through like and if they have language that describes it and what their ordinance language looks like and what types of like process they've been going through and anything that they want to give to us like town to town you know maybe we can use that as like a guide for us yeah I was pretty excited to find that and they oh they also referenced that Ville is doing the same thing neille Illinois um so yeah okay so that's will follow thank you um so any any updates on Revolution New Jersey um I think they're just focusing on the next event coming up I would like to suggest they that I hope it's a big success and they want to do it again because I'll be out of town oh no could you pass this down I tried to answer Susan's question about which buildings are still existing from American Revolution uh and the only thing I can point to this is this list here um yeah grab grab one pass it down this list here is anything um 1800 or earlier on our tax role or based on the surveys or based on the historic sites in the master plan so I tried this is my best list of the oldest buildings and the only one I can point to confidently is the 1713 East Jersey college nothing that we Ser have that has been surveyed has been dated that old um and so given the inconsistency and the dates determined through the surveys and the dates on the tax roll I don't think we can have much confidence in the dates on the tax roll you can see some examples where that's some of these dates were given by the Historic Society for example 11 the only part of the building yeah that makes sense that that a por that old but even though so so it might be disappointing to that possibly 1713 East Jersey Cottage is the only one we can point to but that's actually a really great building if we're going to celebrate because it's in a public park and it's being restored and exactly it's the only one the only one it's a great building to celebrate W um okay do you want to go to minutes so you can oh yes minutes your so do we make um uh do we have any edits to the minutes I'm sorry Bron do you have I apologize I didn't check I have one um just um I'm sorry page three starts with um let's see M uh Vice chair Ryan feels HBC should secure a booth near the historical preservation Society so the public is aware of the differences in the boards believe that was actually miss Marlo's idea so I'd like to give her proper credit you definitely said that no it was said like months and months ago that oh okay you said the last at the last meeting I did say it we out the paperwork yet for cranberry day for the booth yeah no really okay get yeah let me we need to do one I'm just realizing oh my God we never uh yeah we don't have a spot I'm not they might all be taken okay um is it the same woman that does it every year I don't know why she didn't send one okay let me make a big followup and and you be able to do um because we have to put payment in on that um payment on for the booth um to pay for the booth for cranberry um Bobby said she was going through the Business Association is that correct yeah we have to have to we'll fill out a form and then we have to like pay them um I'm just I'm just sorry we're gonna I'm making a followup we need to do fill out the form and pay and to secure our spot somehow okay fill out form for spot at cranber a does anyone have a spin our trivia I figure you answer a question you get a tape measure you don't have to be correct answer okay um any other comments to the minutes okay so we make a motion to approve the minutes I make a motion to approve the minutes second it I got it roll call for the June 18 minutes missm yes Miss Ryan yes Mr Guyer yes Mr H yes yes and Miss Marlo yes thank you motion pass um next we have motion to adjourn my agenda I motion we had no public comment so discussion second great all right all paper say so much yeah right now the problem is I'm so too tired to look at this but I will approve them um I think at my open my eyes oh Back Fence okay there we go thunderstorm right man that's what it says exactly rain rain starting in 29 minutes all right see you guys next time [Applause] [Music] [Music] ask used when the