##VIDEO ID:0jwas-f6h_U## DET moving forward the referendum voted for is is all being put to good use um so that's good um the uh board ofed uh as a body will lose one member com January as as Robert Christopher joins the TC he's com to down um so they're going to have a um interim nom process um and they're going to select a a volunteer to serve for 10 months until the election um which will be held next November um so they will have a a 10- Monon member and then that'll be open up for uh for public election come fall um that's it thank you thank you Matt you may have mentioned this but how do they come up with that member do someone appoints them or yeah I mean it's similar to um when Dave down from the TC they will um put out an open call for volunteers and then uh the board will amongst themselves choose a interim member okay excellent thank you any other questions for B fabulous and it's nice to know that the construction on the school is moving as it yeah it's all great stuff for the kids of course s okay moving along to my report um I want to start with the way I normally start with greeting the community um we have a couple of holidays in November de deos muos is one of them and uh to wish the group of people that thought that celebrate the guru nanak's birthday as well so um congratulations to both these communi and we had a wonderful Veterans Day yesterday and so um every day today and every day yesterday we honor American veterans for their patriotism their love of this country and their willingness to serve and Si for the common good um as some of you alluded to we had election day and I wanted to thank uh the voters for their support for myself and I wanted to congratulate Christopher on joining the TC we um I wanted to give much thanks to Joe milant on running a very good race a very clean race and I really wanted to thank uh Debbie who walked out of the room Lally there you go yeah so as as our clerk she definitely does a lot of work to make sure that these elections run smoothly so thank you to her and thank you to all the staff that supported her in this um and our wonderful poll workers and all the voters that showed up like it's um everything was very well run so thank you to all of them and um Bonnie as uh Barbara gave you a nice shout out thank you so much for your your service and um you know you're what should I say Irreplaceable and I hope that at least we can benefit from your wisdom maybe not officially but you have time to share your wisdom with us so thank you um yes the planning board meeting I attended with Michael it was long but I enjoyed it was quite interesting um that an or that a business was putting a fence around their structure out of security for their merchandise and their employees like quite a hefty quite a hefty lift um I will be attending the league of municipalities Conference next week and I will be missing the municipal Alliance uh meeting as a result of that I attended a training Workshop that was another couple of hours but also very um interesting and that is all I have I did want to just share some some what should I say some thoughts as as from I have had a couple of discussions with residents about um very improper sort of online conversations uh people especially on social media just really being unpleasant to each other I you know you you kind of don't address it for a while and then you a point where people actually felt very uh attacked very vulnerable and I'm really just asking our community to do better than this there's no reason and I know that this TC has very strong values with regards to respect for people and property and um you've been very good all of you have been very good about um you know just reinforcing that message and I hope that that message moves out into the community that this is a community of us not you not not not just an individual and so let's just move forward with the the best of intentions online please um getting back to our agenda we don't have any subcommittees or department heads for this evening correct any followup items for tonight seeing none we will move on we have one vacancy to mention for this evening and that is a membership expiring 12 3124 on the environmental commission we have no up for first reading and none for second reading but we do have a few consent resolutions a through F if anybody would like to discuss any one of those individually please uh say that now if not would anybody like to make a motion I'm happy to move items 11 a through F on the consent resolution agenda second thank you we'll move on to roll call Mr fronte yes Mrs K yes Dr r yes Mr SC yes and may yes thank you very much that was pretty Swift uh we are up to our work set I wanted to U welcome our fire department um thank you for being today thank you for sharing the information that you will be sharing with us today it looks like there's two seats up here but if there's more than two of you that would like to speak we could score chair up forward how you guys doing very well very well thank you just turn on the okay perfect now because we are on this recording if you don't mind when you speak if you could just mention your name that would be very helpful I have Charlie Smith um president of the first aid Squad and chief of the fire department and Richard Zimmer president of cranberry Fire Company back about four or five years ago members of the fire company mainly trustees and uh officers of fire current B Fire Company noted you know a change in demographics of uh volunteerism and we down in Cranberry locally around CR within the state and nationally uh we formed a committee to look into the possibility of forming a fire district uh to help the volunteers that currently are members of the fire company um the biggest problem is time and train um and also a lot of our members are getting and we're not getting a lot of newer members and younger members in uh to you know get people spots um one other issue uh that we found was for our operating budget um they are limited through the state of New Jersey what they can provide the fire company uh I believe right now it's 161,000 five something um for our operating budget usually and this does vary year to year but we try and you know do fundraising raise usually about $30,000 to help offset some charges yeah on a good year um our expenses year to date at the end of October 2024 is $26,389 [Music] first state Squad the same situation um so as I said about 2021 you know we we met with attorneys accountants who specifically deal with fire districts got input in came up with a couple proposals that we provided to the Town Council uh over the course of the last few weeks of what we viewed as a possible uh you know resolution to uh you know helping the Emergency Services here in this town um I got Charlie do you want to talk about first aid yeah I just want to as people that we've met with previously for taking their time and listening to us and and I appreciate their input we're glad to have all that because of that we made some changes we'll see um but I just want to I guess you how many calls today we've had 356 fire calls uh 152 Mutual AIDS so we stayed in town 204 times Mutual AIDS can also count the turnpike which is really ours but we put that as um on that the first aid squad has answered 761 calls to date with 245 mutually um Rich went over the financials of the fire department and I think it's all F in here we spoke to to you people about made it pretty clear our expenses um as far as the first aid Squad Denise got a copy of our financial report for last year and we're just about breaking even right um back in 2009 we hired we got licensed by the state we hired a room people we started billing and right now we're doing 5:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m. 14 hour days um it's working out well but our people that are arriv at night are getting tired the numbers are dwindling and we're going to have to put on some people at night and and our finances doesn't there's not enough money in it to you know to supplement that through our buildings so and the town that this time gives us the maximum we can which is what 135 I think yeah 135,000 a year so um that you know it's both it's it's a two-fold problem in both organizations tourism and finan we spent a lot of time on this we I don't know how many hours we got in this but we met with experts who who deal with fire district who are currently attorneys for the fire district accountants for the fire districts um been a tremendous help to us and we came up with these are the answer basically all right um we hope to put um two firefighters on during the day to start for D no benefits no union dues no sit time or anything like that and then um as needed we supplement at night for the squad when they didn't want to ride they would pick the nights they want to ride be available and then we would fill in out of our pool of people so we'd be fire we be hiring fire empt okay so they could do both dual dual jobs and also we're going to want to bring in the um fire prevention Bureau all right because they they do bring in some money and all their all their revenue would go towards fire and EMS okay so it would help keep the cost of taxes down for just strictly fire an EMS and also we planned on um they would be doing some administrative work force as you see if you saw the budget we gave you the budget right guys we increased their salaries or their personnel budget um to compensate for that you might have to bring another person in or whatever all right um so that's where we stand with that right now I guess what that's kind of yeah in a nutshell it's not that complicated I think we figured it out for you but you know well that's also part of you know putting facts and figures together for eight uh we did a second budget for municipal firey which would mean fully paid 247 unions coming in uh you know and have the amounts of you know the estimation of what that would be and you know if you're looking at the budgets you can see there's a major difference because if it does go Municipal you know like I said it's going to be all paid people for both organizations correct well if you go Municipal it doesn't help the phas at all because you've already given the max you can unless you starts your own Municipal Department then the cost is going to go up we figured what 5 a half million for career compared to our just under two right around 2 million for for DS and bers um like we had saw we took a V at both meetings and if you were to go Municipal then the volunteers are done dissolve the department and you would just you know had to deal with it that way which was probably we were probably conservative on our numbers because you're going to have to hire another administrator or public safety director or something so there's 50,000 here so um you guys have any questions I mean I don't know what I can tell you other than what we've met with you already and told you so let's let's let's start from the T um if you don't mind can we can we just start with Barbara W The Rose okay with you Barbara um yeah Den would um I mean if you have any okay all right go ahead Barbara thank you so you have this great uh frequently asked questions uh liar and I really appreciate that that you put the time into this because it answers quite a lot of questions I think um since this is a uh you know a work session um just kind of if you do you think you answer like like if you look at these questions is is there anything that you might want to highlight for us in particular that might help the public since this is a public work session and we're working understand what bio district is ETC all right there would be five Commissioners that are elected by okay we get a budget that's voted on every year by the town so thees really get a say in their emergency services in these town okay um in addition to that um I should make uh oh there's a meeting once a month that the public can attend just this so if they have any concerns any problems like that um all Capital Equipment would be voted on by the taxpayers um they go to bond for you guys were asking about cost on that but we don't know what down R would be Denise could maybe you know it's really hard to project that you know and there's nothing projected for the next three years for sure um we're going to need a pumper but trucks are build time is five years at this point because of the the mess that this country in I guess I don't know if it's labor or parts but for some reason it used to be a year now it's five years so so we even have a committee together for that so that'll be that's out in the but regardless of what equipment we buy it's going to have to be bought either by the town or by the district so it really doesn't matter you need equipment wears out it gets to a certain age NFPA says get rid of it and you know so it doesn't matter who's right it's going to have to happen one way or the other so and you know turn it just leave um and you know like number five what will happen to very Volunteer Fire Company like what happens to the volunteers so the volun would be still part of absolutely firey and S yep okay there would be the big part of it I mean the more more volunteers we get the less people we have to that makes it whole different and um and you were saying how it's harder get volunteers and I see that all around and in particular how many hours does it take to train to become a volunteer 200 one is 200 hours just for just to put a pack on and go into a building um EMS EMT is 240 I think now it's like a College semester so it's kind of I just did a refresher that took three weekends just for the refresher for so that that's also part of it is on once you get all qualifications it's keeping up with your certification and along with what as a fire company already we expect our members to show up and do training so that everybody's familiar with each other plus we do a lot of our work is uh rescue work and that's on three more classes because we want the technician level if we can so you got awareness operations and Tech and we want everybody all our guys right now are technicians that are we working on din there so um and then there's training with that once a month we have to cut cars and this and that that's that's what we keep up on there's there's drill nights for firefighting we flow this and that use do lder drills or whatever so it's more than just the fire one once you get fire one you should do fire two if you want to be an officer then that's a whole another 100 hours so um it's just a lot of lot of time I'm glad that you're lightening the public how much time it takes to become you really could look at it the state wants paid 247 unions you know it's a union thing so um so they're really trying to for the last probably 10 15 years trying to Fig those out and done a pretty good job and um six will this result in higher taxes did you answer that okay okay I think it says right there we um yeah well right now it's cost I forget what it was on other that's okay uh that increased there okay go ahead I just see the line oh right the net increas of 9440 per 100,000 but when you take away what they're already paying down or support for the town and and that type of thing it's it comes down to $70 100,000 for a sess value not market value make sure people understand that too I me look at your tax bill that's what so okay I I appreciate that I think this you know just kind of rewing this is help and we're fortunate in this town to have the commercial warehouses that we have to keep that cost down you Hest if it wasn't for that it wouldn't be feasible I think or might be but you know twice that proba thank you thank you thanks for answering one of my first questions which was how like monthly quarterly you know so they you'd be meeting monthly and just like this public comment would be there and they'd be able to check in on all those operations right yeah even with the district we you know there has to be a website you have to have agenda is just like the town C agenda's posted minutes posted very transparent full transparency and and a say in get to vote for and anybody as long as you're a registered voter in Cranberry you could be on the Fire Commission you don't have to have fire fighting background but you it helps it helps yeah um question so there's in you know recent news obviously plain throw was the victim of that 2% cap right they went a little bit above that when they were asking for a budget um have you guys performed an audit on when like a town would go to district and it's been successful as well as going to district and it not being successful right some success stories you mentioned have been like a millstone or an apple GTH and they've all been successful for 30 years right and then the flip side of that is like a Hamilton and a pro so what can just down the line not for tonight but what what are some of the main reasons that a district has been successful and how why it's failed and to get a net in there and be proactive to make sure those things don't happen in this case right I tell you why Hamilton failed I think they had 13 fire districts yeah so one neighbor one guy is paying $200 or $600 a year the guy across the street is paying $800 they have duplicated equipment duplicated equipment all right um it was a lot of waste and I think that uh what brought it about I I don't know what what the politics of it was uh from what I'm some of a fireman that they're not happy and I'm hearing the town's not happy it's a lot of responsible for the town so um you know my Applegarth has worked very well they've had um actually only one firefighter on the board for the last four or five years they had some retired firefighters at a clear broke in this and um FDNY or whatever but they've done very well um they've worked with volunteers well their numbers are dwindling as well but for 30 years they've had you know good combination company you know and I think we can make that model workstone um their first aid Squad went out of business so they actually got license brought the EMS in and said we're going to subcontract to the squad rather than them really under you know what I'm saying um and I think that that that our mod would work better than theirs because I think they have some trouble getting enough help you really would we ANC I think the ease of which you just answered my question is going full for public opinion to know that you vetted out the problems that you could come across and you're going to make sure that you know as best you can that we don't face them as a Township we thought about this and talked to people we've talked to Plainsboro that was and it was um the union basically I don't want to go over yeah it's okay it was a strong arm you've done the research to know the positives and the negatives they didn't provide information that they should have to clearly they didn't get a budget for two years yeah so knowing that the fire department is still going to be heavily dependent on volunteers I've literally pass Plainsboro East Windsor West Windsor and who am I forgetting every of them has a sign up that they need volunteers right so no problem what can we do as residents of the town the tce how can do this differently like how can we keep volunteerism up or encourage it because it's still going to be so highly dependent on volunteers a district we've been working on this for 20 years program which you know and it's retain people I wouldn't say that it's brought a lot of new members in just because solely they get youate their points they get their money y uh we tried an incentive program just with percentages of number of calls and and that R didn't work too well it worked very well because the people that were already making the calls that got paid for but no new people yeah didn't bring anybody why waste the money if it's going to get the same thing done so the point is like again like you know the definition of insanity right so if you still have a volunteer problem the district's not going to solve that is a problem that we need to kind of collectively address or get creative with I'll tell you how to get creative you build some houses that uh firsttime house buyers can afford in this town that would be the answer or blue collar can afford this town look at the price of the houses in town the house on Main Street 900,000 I mean it's a it's a a split level from the 70s 60 there's not a lot of starter homes in Cranberry Township there are none yeah there are none yeah so you're not bringing in the younger we even talked about well we've had people move away because we had a lot of man we had a strong Junior program that turned into firefighters who went to college came back to town and then they ended up in vgin and Pennsylvania and North Carolina um yeah one's Coast Guard firefighter one's Rowan Oak City another one's um a fire a policeman in Arlington they don't stay in Jersey because they can't afford it and frankly you know it's just it's not a good environment for somebody trying to start out in life anywhere in this state um last question I think um like a long-term View and I appreciate you guys going out the three years CU that was one of the things that I had is just a little bit more long-term currency I get Bond rates I get interest rates I get all of that but when you think about C expenditures obviously equipment like a new fire truck I have no idea I'm not usually on the market for one but could you give me the average price of a fire truck so the average there's an an engine will be a million a half dollars okay so that's kind Squad just bought an ambulance for almost 300,000 I know in other states they have a mandatory retirement of equipment right well n FBA does cranber has far exceeded that okay I mean we're on the border for our engine right now yeah like New York 25 years your ambulance gets shut down if I'm not mistaken like you can't physically have that on the road because of equipment obsolesence the crazy thing about that is same standard holds for New York City as for cranber yeah so it gets a little ridiculous you have an engine with 500 hours or an engine with 5 50,000 hours in 25 years you know what I mean so we bend it we bend it a little bit we don't go too far that's why some of our expenses are up because we make sure everything's in tip top shape so you know something needs to be done we spend the money yeah this year I think it was 70,000 in repairs in maintenance these trucks are well the engines are 2,000 so they're all 24 25 you know yeah I was just trying to give like you know the average Joe just an idea of like the largest type of expenditure that would come down the line would be probably engines would be a million and a half a tower would be right now now two two two and a quarter okay um unfor it basically double The Last 5 Years to be quite honest with you yeah that's well the last truck we bought our W best our rescue was 700,000 in 2007 I'm going to pass a mic and share the mic but thank you very much thank you thank you Lis perfect um thank you thank you for coming out here I mean I I think I can only imagine this has to bur on you thinking about this and you talk about just for think 20 years about how to how to keep this going and I appreciate that so um I I appreciate how much thought you've given on this really and I do appreciate your service and what you guys have done um when when I joined this Township committee and we I learned with the township form of government like it I asked I started asked the question wait what what does everybody else do and I guess that's kind of my first natural question is like if you think the way I it sounds like um there's sort of four models for how this can be done right Municipal all Volunteer Fire District or like a share model between two townships or like we're we're Shar between two townships so um we where the the fire entity is different than single not the same as the township so I guess I'm just CU town has to have a fire no no I understand that but um so what do what do our like if we look at the sort of two towns around us all directions like what are the towns around us what models are they using so East Winds height town both East wi and he town are full volunteer right now they're looking for help went to their Council asking for help and they told them to take care of yourself um South Brunswick is all um U Commissioners they just hired what does that commission just sou District was they not going to be for long um Princeton is Municipal uh aarth all the Monroe is a district Millstone a district W West a district we're just kind of getting in on the end of the district thing most people that were going to do it did it 30 years ago South br's been a district since the 7 district one for no three for South BR we got Kingston and M Johnson all right um two for Monroe no three I'm sorry three for Monroe um you got Central you got alabar and you got Monroe B SP um East or West Wind One Two Fire comp one what they did me CH so you're saying District so a single Township can have one or more fire district perfect example of that they had 13 districts at one time with their three fire districts how do they is there coordination across the three fire districts or they're each districts it's a geographical area originally there was Apple guard fire company Central Monro fire company and Monroe fire company and they just turn each one of theirs into a district and your proposal is that the cranberry Municipal boundary would be the same one district one District okay shared services legally would be tough I mean if you went to S East winter you're not only cross towns you're Crossing counties really I think we've come up with the simplest most cost effective way how does how does Shar how do shared services work they don't I thought that's where you going mut a question oh Mutual Aid yeah we have box plans okay in other words certain areas certain people get called for certain things okay and ours and we're on theirs and we have an alarm or we have a it's usually over greater okay um C people in that geographical area will come in our first alarm is another set of people so we get a RI team and we get another Tower another engine so you know it depends on the degree of the fire or the incident all right um right now it's Turnpike is 41 and 48 Austin heightstown we go south they go north and we meet in the middle whever and we work together this is a f to see cross the township boundary oh yeah yeah they'll go of the district itself is always within same town abely one on the geographic size does the district ever stand the border of townships no then you're involved in two municipalities but but call wisewise I'm just kind I'm literally just I've been that way for you you this a lot of but we drive around and see these things to me start discussion that there's Municipal volunteer District so really there's no there there's no shared model that that's a governance model okay so everything everything is really one of those three districts everything is either volunteer or fire district right right full volunteer Municipal with no volunteers or combination District which is a fire district a fire district now you can have a fire district with full volunteers too right right right for some reason you start building some houses we have a busload of people that want to join then the next guess what we won't be hiring anybody because we have no volunteers but we still have the money to fix our equipment and you you did dial it up and dial it down under a fire district you can It Up and Under a volunteer you're C the state am what the state says and under a municipal there's no volunteer option at all you're all you're locked in there would be but we're not just not going to no I'm just trying to understand like it's helpful to sort of understand the three models and sort of the what lever are available each three models and and how um how how that and also with the District budget what is it 2% it can go up each year it goes above a 2% cap then it's got to go to a vote talking about the district you said it would go to you said it would go the budget would go to the the voters every year um but when if it's a 2% cap it's above the cap it goes every year every year they vote forers every they vote for and they vote for Capital Equipment okay all right and they would only vote on the budget if it went over a% correct and then over time the um Commissioners would be staggered I mean obviously in the beginning you got get your five Commissioners in but then you have a threee one that's what happened inbo speaking loud but that's what happened in Plainsboro they had to take it to a boat because the budget that they were asking was way it was like 53% let alone 2% so that's that's an example of that's an example of how it went wrong I said let's reel this in and get control of it now they shut down so so that was going back to a municipal went to fully Municipal no it was a district and they were held to the 2% cap and then they were asking for one .5 million or something like that which was way above the 2% uh budget so it had to go to a vote and then the reason they were asking for the money was so outrageous and now the state got involved and that's the article that I say that says now they're pulling back from the district so when they pull back from what did they pull back to Municipal oh they did pull back to Municipal they're already fully paid and no volunteers because all their volunteers left so that's where they're at and they got one I appreciate I appreciate asking because it's like I I didn't really understand the sort of three models and how they work this is very helpful so thank you thank hello that better okay uh again thanks for for volunteering um I background time ago in EMS and FDNY so I know it's like to do what you guys do I've never been on a fire but I have some some understanding so I appreciate the sacrifice make um couple questions um what happened to loap we still have it still we still have okay for the volunteers for the volunteers and obviously for the for the PDM the professional PRM get got we talked about um the service being highly dependent on volunteers so what does that mean I mean so the the the majority of firefighters are still volunteers well like we said we want to hire two during the day absolutely yeah that's what we want to keep we want to encourage we want to keep the volunteers coming but during the day it's definitely a problem okay you know I'm because everybody's working and uh you know that's the problem so on on a given Wednesday how many guys are at the station nobody nobody's at the station I mean on on call depends where I'm working depends if if great town he's not out playing golf depends on if Diane and Rich are working in the office for the you know fire prevention so so it's hard it's it's a roll in a dice try to keep an ear to the ground as far as he you going to be around today you going to be around I know they're schedule so I know when they're in town rich and Dian when they're working um but that's four days a week or some it could be two days a week if they both work the same day it's really that thin it's that thin absolutely yeah during the day it always has been you talked about two two people on a day that mean two professional two yes so you're locked in always have two guys well to start with right we'd like the the optimum would be four but to get things started let's go with two and get our feet wet before we jump into deep Bend and drown okay um what happens to the first a one if if fire district comes into existence we supplement we will pay them what the town is paying them now all right and they're they're Bing all right they're not making money they're breaking even they're they're able to support what're doing but we would provide as needed 2mts for them at night firefighter em firefighter EMT right or during the day if they have a call out hey Char you got anybody available let me see what let me let me you know send it out there and it's available they could fill in during a day form too that would come out of our budget not theirs and would you envision them moving over to the Firehouse no still be separate the only thing I might envision somay would be to have an ambulance at the firehouse if we have four guys on duty to cover second calls if they have a call and then we get another call before they get back they're not available we would take that or you know sometimes you have accidents you need two ambulances so we we going cover that try to make as much use of the Manpower as we can got you and the fire is based purely on geography so if the population of cranberry jumps up by 2,000 would there ever be an need for a second district I don't think I don't think so with the size of what the township is it's not a big Township it's not a big Township unless you bring in 5,000 town homes and that affects EMS more than affects fire be quite you know that yeah yeah a lot more you got a better chance having absolutely um so when we talk about a% cap what's the Baseline I mean I'm trying to figure this out I'm not a finance guy so the 2% cap I mean you have a baseline budget you start yeah I think you have right around so first year budget at 2 million anything beyond 2% that got got you and when when you envision in the year election Happ would be in the fall first election could be anytime I'm not sure I could ask Rich has the law changed Rich can it still be can we still have elections in February or did that Chang to November only no you have the choice okay you can CH you can choose November and February but the first commissioner election could be anytime a new fire what what are the terms for the Commissioners three years three years but like I said we start out stagger so they don't all come up um it's really a small Township committee running Emergency Services what a lot of the same rules everything would have to be stacked or bid you know competitive you know bid so unless the fire department itself wants to buy something and they're they're excluded from that they can still buy things okay and um we talked about what happens to the actual assets of the fire nothing we're not every Volunteer Fire Company still would be around nothing's different we just added people and money to it that's and governed by five people right now we have trustees that overlooker thing but this would be the Commissioners would be up over and above them you know what I'm saying IOD um and as far as the actual property It's s right now it's Township owned correct our goal was to end up with the property and all the vehicles so we would we would take over your responsible for both firehouses the parking lot all of that would be given or be taken over by the district we would maintain it and um it's going to need pav and but that's not that's Ro save this we had we took that out of our budget that was in there originally for the next second one but um yeah we would take over all that so we have control with that gotcha got you um I think that for now the have points a lot I think in theory makes sense okay um but uh yeah the next step would be we were hoping to start getting petitions we need 5% of the voters register rurry to present to you at a formal meeting and then I guess it would be a vote by the committee to decide to move forward then it goes to financial board the DCA and they would review the budget make sure everything's in line I believe right Denise rich I guess yeah yeah it has to be approved by the local Finance board right an application has to be made to the local then we decide on our election date and we also we have one time sched here of an information session for the general public you know when that was the end of the month we trying to get one at Four Seasons they're not really reactive so we're going to go uh rattle some heads sorry what about uh Toll Brothers the new community have you thought about them too no I haven't because there's not a lot of people in there I don't think it would be worth the effort they're they're not um they're I don't know what to say like we went we not as ready as as you can I would assume they think we're paid already they're all coming from the city so it's very possible and you make some volunteers within that population as well there's some very young retired families that 55 yeah yeah um so yeah thank you all for coming and thank you we'll take whatever we get thank you for making this like known to us and the public and this is a real problem that you have been facing for a while um Everybody speak I just have very few questions because certainly everybody has asked what um what would what would have been on my uh list just in trying to get District model um you know here on the township when we have projects and things we do have access to Grants is that available to the fire district as well yes okay and and that would be something I'm assuming that you would be you know seeking oh fire prevention Bureau would have something to do when they're they're not busy excellent excellent now when we talk about the makeup of fire department how many volunteers do we have uh I was going to count that today about 20 on rolls and about 12 that are active wow 12 active so what does it mean if you're on the role active that means you may have moved out of town you're still a member you do come back to town occasionally we have one guy it's in the Coast Guard um um another kid that that uh Trevor just came back he was living in DC he just came back to his parents house so he's back and forth they keep up their certifications whatever they need and when they're in town they help us out is that simple okay it's not like an added expenditure for you is it no okay not at all no they already bought their gear they already excellent excellent um when you've got this volunteer model and then paid model do you foresee that maybe some of the volunteers might choose to take on those perdm roles that's uh a detail we have haven't worked out yet we had a squad and we felt it was probably a mistake so uh we may keep that from happening okay okay that's good to know um we haven't decided that yet be honest one thing with that there are some time Union firefighters out there that their Union won't let them come stay to like our district and work they they have they have those restrictions in place yeah well but they're yeah it's gray area yeah way around okay okay and the current model that we have of volunteerism how long do you think that can sustain 15 years the current moment without anybody well what what we have right now you know you you started off Mr Zimmer by talking about the lack of volunteerism and people aging out effectively operating as we should be it was three years ago okay okay getting by by the could be five which is where we're at now basically I'll be honest with you okay uh we will we will absolutely take comments and and questions here in a second um I'm with the fire company I just want to make comment then why come up please come up well what I want to say is you know I'm I'm 69 okay and I'm one of the guys that are like daytime you know so when you start talking about younger guys coming in you know and you're not seeing them you I don't know how much longer you me I'll be able to respond for those kind of things today and I'm one of the guys that they rely on during the day you're just a youngster I'm the youngster compared to Bob you know so when we're talking about aging out I mean it's signicant problem I'm 66 Bob 75 Mike's rich is you know that's the percentage of the people we just got one new recipe file but he's a teacher and he's very enthusiastic and he was a lifeguard background in EMS so you know he's a member just got a new kid was hello well I think it's bad time we Mo this Sor sorry that was really hard to any other questions um I I just out of logistics Cas of bar but just just before you um have your question here I would like we do open this up to the public is that correct after the work session no the public if they want to speak at public comments at public comments minutes three minutes okay all right so barara so um I so when the school passed their resolu their resolution um a referendum I meant um they had kind of an idea of how to go about tell the public more about this um so you were talking about the library you have on' been try get into four season I just in general and and the more information out there the oh yeah absolutely the fire companies going to be invol breakfast on have the pancake breakfast that we're helping the lines with here we'll have a petition there for people to sign Santa Claus so that we can put them on the on the we get the dates I'll give it you J took care unfortunately our treasur couldn't be here tonight J he's been a big part of this and he would have a lot of answers for you maybe I'm wondering if we could post that in the town absolutely window you do that we have some extra copies we'll gladly leave them and want to have them out by the clerk's window you know in the municipal building it's fine because it would be really great for the puing about CL talking being able to reach out to you I figure out how this works well it puts a little weight on your shoulders by having five boats to make it happen you know what I'm saying it's not a going to a public boot so yeah I can understand you want everybody behind you I and we're working on this together fire department and Township Council you can't one can't do it without the other so I'm glad I appreciate your enthusiasm and your patience well you've done such great work and uh I think that as you have just said this has to be a very collaborative effort uh for its success and we need for our residents Rescue Services that's the goal here 100% And so um I just thought of two questions one as far as rescue ter is there any revenue from that yes there's minimal minim minimum minim 150 for an engine or something got um totally forgot oh fire prevention Bureau um you know the devils in the details of a lot of this stuff but is that something that absolutely has to go to the fire district do we keep it what's from that I think it doesn't absolutely have to go to the fire district um I spoke with fire prevention and they're fine with either way going or staying um there is revenue that does come in but obviously there's expenses as well salar and um so you know that has to be offset that's something they would take on if they go under the fire district ially our fire prevention officers who are in the employee of the town right now would just simply shift over to the district all their cring licensing go over that's what it's all their own licenses it's nothing tied to the town or the district and they're going to work with us and do some of our work you can't have two bosses you know what I'm saying and I think that would be smart to use they do have some not a lot but you know what I'm saying they can make some um we're hoping they were going to do scheduling in that that type of thing so it saves us from hiring another person we're already employed we give them a little bump and less than what you could ever hire anybody to do it for it you know what I'm saying and then um I assume with the town the state they have pension benefits they get all that right now now they're not full they're not full they have DCR not pension so I don't know what that means but it's defined contribution retirements different stat okay what kind of Revenue just so know uh we get fire fees from them we get penalty fees from them we get um Lea which is uniform fire safety money um from them and then that helps offset their budget okay we're talking a million dollar and half of the no it's not million half the penalty fees go to fire department actually correct so we get it anyway yeah got okay that's Matt for that matter the uh the election also would be their responsibility if we have it other than November yes yes if you have it other than November and um if we have it November would save the taxpayers money you could be another line like like School Board another section on the ballot more work for da right just just a just a quick question how would Mutual Aid work then since we're going to be having someone during the day they nothing would change they would be available nothing would change right right now Monroe comes into cranbery at times going tobor same with Plainsboro same West there Greg but I mean we're there those towns have paid people and we would have this paid person that might be able to them if they need they need well it's no different than it is now same as it is now thank you okay now I think that there's you've had a lot of questions from us I think this this was good this is the first time we've all sort of been able to speak about this in public and let all of this information sort of sit and marinate with us and come up with anything else that I think ultimately these questions are going to be helpful with how we choose to move forward is created so it is um you know very robust and I expect that at the public comment you will also get some questions from the public which um there is no answer for today it will just be good for you to research and process U moving forward take note of their question yeah that's that's fabulous thank you thank you for being agreeable for all of that so if we don't have any more questions then I'd like to close this work session I will you know thank you very yes sir we just want to move ahead with a petition I just want to make you aware of that we're going to be going around town and trying to get signatures is that something that we should move ahead right now I'm just worried that we haven't taken but we we haven't taken into consideration the um you just the any of the questions that the click sort of pass well the thing is Aman we could have we could have blindsided you and come into a a meeting with 250 signatures and say we want to do this we gave you the courtesy of meeting with you we gave you the courtesy of meeting with that of course we gave you this courtesy before we did the petition um so we would never do that to you but we do have the right to gr your petitions okay and and will your information session sort of come before or after you know like looking at our audience it's not as as it could be we could go knock on doors tomorrow anybody well we probably but um anybody we see I'm going to have one of my truck for my customers and we're going to have these information sessions with not only the information but the petitions want to sign and just uh just to be clear we're at that point I mean we've done all the re what what's the actual number 5% 5% of it is that right it's 160 something I think I don't know the top of my head I'm s to pleas make sure that every person sign is a registered voter have to check that get 600 Show everybody's the total outside of this we'll talk yeah thank you we'll make sure it's right before we submit okay that's it yeah thank you thank you very much so um we will close our public session at this point and we will continue on with our agenda which is really public comment guys thank you yeah thank you very very much thank you for listening you all been very busy lately with the forest fires and the dry conditions and yeah really God bless you all thank you yeah it's been a busy uh so I'd like to open public comment for this evening you can comment you can share your conerns about anything not just the work session that we just uh received if you would like to come up to speak please understand that this is your time to speak our time to listen will not NE answer to your question or your concern at this point but we invite you for your public comment minutes per person please and make sure that you sign your name and I guess on the form that's right there welcome hi uh so thank you to the mayor of the township and my fellow residents um my name is elizab gones and I am a resident of cranberry uh today I'm here in my capacity as a Cranberry Public Library employee representing the youth services department my colleague Laura bonds and I are spearheading in partnership with cranberry School Community initiative entitled one book one cranberry this is an expansion of a program the library and School part partnered on last year where we encouraged students and patrons to read the same book engage in dialogue and activity and attend an author visit that was hosted at the library we felt that last year was a great success for our first foray into an initiative of this kind this year we would like to expand our scope and invite the entire Township to take part this year we have chosen the Phantom toll booth by Norton Guster as our title initiated the book is about a young boy named Milo who bored with the countless toys and Gadgets in his room and with nothing better to do do decides to drive through a toll booth when it mysteriously appears in his room one day on his journey he passes over the mountains of ignorance the island of conclusions and along the way meets a watchdog named talk uh on Friday December 20th we will be hosting a readout kickoff event in front of town hall where luminaries and students from the community will be reading short passages alloud from to generate interest and initiate the community Spirit we hope to achieve with this program we were inspired by nton jer's Passion for knowledge exporation and the notion that learning is a world we enter and it is worth traveling there as often as possible our goal is to bring our community Closer by Bridging the Gap between Generations our hope is that the adults who have read the book be able to welcome our younger residents into a new world of learning and get them excited about the bound boundless possibilities that exist when we engage our curiosity and keep an open mind now more than ever we all want to promote Community curiosity and compassion among one another we're hosting this event at Town Hall as we plan to inter the clock tower into a discussion about the Watchdog talk who adorns the cover of the book we'll also be sharing information citing upcoming events that we have planned through the spring for one book one cranber the readout begins at 4:30 p.m. and will last an hour before we encourage all in attendance to join the community in lighting the luminaries on Main Street on behalf of the Cranberry Public Library I invite the mayor cranbery committee and my fellow cranbery residents to join us on this journey to take part as a reader as well as to lend your commanding voices to the kickoff event anyone who is interested in Reading meeting at the kickoff event or helping to further coordinate on the program May reach me or Laura at the library with the information listed below thank you for your audience that as wellers we have for the that was well rehearsed you had the last three seconds were done oh no it was not reversed just speakly thank [Music] leave one here as well thank youate it absolutely thank you and anybody public comment this evening please how are you very well thank you welcome welcome I glasses good um Richard better 10 South Main Street um I don't even know where to start so so I found out about this by someone just who told me about it like so I just think the first thing would be better communication to people I I don't know how many people get that email I had then I looked at it just when I was here like I had to dig like five paragraphs below to find out about the fire department that they're the most important people in this room and I got to paragraph find out that there's a meeting about the disbandment of a fir Community disb not dispan but but but changes or whatever I'm all for you guys I I appreciate everything you guys I I not notan not but but that there's something going on and you guys are struggling this much and and having these hardships right like that this town doesn't know about this is is beyond it's insane and um second thing uh someone you're talking about planning like like chest tables where does that come from like like like like we're talking about chest tables like there's not other things in this town to plan about like on Old Trenton there's a new development put in and you ever go to a nice town and the signs in the development are all the same type of sign to match the neighborhood and the environment and the field and you put up neon signs one sign's yellow one sign's black one sign's orange like it looks disgusting like how do you let that happen on your watch and you're talking about chest tables like that would planet to me is doing something about that now another piece got me up here I've also want this on the record that I've called the town numerous times the day almost fixed my flood my backyard floods every it rains hard and it just it it happens all the time and it's because of the town and no do anything about it and so I need someone to take to do look into it and figure out why my backyard is flooding it's hard after we put all this millions of dollars into a day like that we looked at fire guys I whatever we can do to help you we're like I think you guys should do more fundraising I don't even know about any fundraising you guys do there's got to be ways in town where you guys to do more stuff to get people behind you get 10% return mailings 2,000 mailings 200 checks yeah you don't get I give you a check every time you you don't get thank you but way to to be but like you guys people should know about this this should be talked about in town this is a huge thing and you guys are here to help us and I literally find out about this it's embarrassing that there's no one even here to so that's all I got to say thank thank you thank you very very oh the volleyball uh Nets too I don't know whoever's idea that was just a waste of money like a complete waste the money putting in town all right anybody else for comment this evening please going on public comment no just had a question regarding the the future events you know talk about revisit the Fire Department issues and would you like to say that on record or anything just a question okay I just like to know will you will you uh post it thank you hello my name is Jo F2 South Main Street um my question is what what is the sequence of events for future meetings regarding the uh fire department uh regist District planning fire district but I like to know is what's what's the next step when's the next meeting or consist and so on like a timeline between we until the time that we vote on this you don't vote we don't answer questions like this just goes on public why you no no no it's I I I like your public comment thank you for the public comment we will get you com just a question yes valid thank you okay public comment this evening anybody else for public comment excellent going once twice okay public comment Clos for this evening um thank you all this has been very spirited very um thank you for the library information I think that luminaries was a very exciting evening for all of us and to think that we may have some reading sessions like that might be a fun thing to do right so um let's let's sort of pay attention to how we can participate in that hopefully um you know with regards to some of the information that's out there I think sometimes what happens is when you're looking for something find it and you may not always hear all the elements of information that was shared before and so I do appreciate I think this tcing the fire department come to us before with regards to issues about volunteerism and some of the you know some of the pains that they've been going through and I think this is the point where they said we now have to do something about it and honestly um on my last mayor the bottom of the mayor's update where we put our events and we don't typically share works but I did that sort of knowing that as a courtesy this might be good for residents to know know so um I'm all for more information than less and moving forward we see how better to to do that um and um the idea of uh when we see things I think in our communities that are not conforming to what we believe is actually uh right or pretty uh it's not wrong for for residents to sort of sh that complaint through the channels that that are appropriate so whether it's a zoning issue I think that's not inappropriate for people to share that as a zoning complaint um with regard some of these signs and things like that and uh with regards to the timeline I think the fire department is best to answer that so a communication afterwards would probably be great and um any other thoughts here from the TC I was just going to I think this was a productive meeting and glad we move this to the library um this is exactly as you go out you'll notice the library doors F doors have closed this is exactly kind of the model a meeting that the library design had been anticipated where the meeting could go on in this public space even after the public library has closed so it's just nice to see him in practice um and evident we overlapped him with janitor so um but uh no I just I I I just appreciate the Civil discussion I took the action item to um get an aerial shot and lay out on M what the chest table as uh make a sort of larger SI of it as far as with your letter and his complaints I I completely agree getting information out to the public has been a recurring issue when I was mayor it was difficult we started the mayor um I don't know if any of you noticed but a few weeks back um the start Ledger um I believe the bur record and one other paper in New Jersey stopped printing in Trend times sto printing a a paper Edition and that is just a recurrent problem we've had we don't have local press um the ability to get this information out historically would have been through local press we used to have a reporter come to every one of these meetings we don't have that anymore because he covers he covers six townships and he probably paid $40,000 a year so it's not worth for him to come out so it's a recurring problem and I agree and I I wish there was a better solution we came up with a mayor's update we try and send out as many emails as we can but there's just no easy for us to get this information out I wish there was a better way I I completely uh commiserate with with your comments and I agree it is difficult I I don't have an easy solution I think it's a larger societal problem um and as far as your questions about zoning and planning send a letter maybe you should join the planning or zoning board I mean sounds like you'd be a good candidate always looking um sounds like you got a lot of opinions and I I think they're valid and we' love to voice so that's all thank you excellent anybody else on the T before we end this evening excellent I'd like to entertain a motion to adjourn move to adjourn