##VIDEO ID:yWMMhzOjPsA## we're going to call this city council meeting order uh this is Monday August 26 2024 uh we expected our legal pretty quick I have not heard from about we'll uh we're not into anything with the first all five minutes anyway so all right uh ask counc mation followed Heavenly Father we thank you for this day Lord we thank you for all your many blessings thank you for allowing us to be here together Lord to do the will of the people Lord and what's in your best interest your will for us God pray dear Lord that you'll be with us throughout this time um that you'll help us get through this next political season help keep tensions down let everybody know that everyone's just doing what they feels best for our nation our country our counties and our cities lord it's in Jesus name we pray amen amen I pled Al to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible liy and justice for all thank you all right I had a couple of things here one I want to read the proclamation we just did with the senior citizens and uh I didn't know how many of you got to go over there the other day when they celebrated but well I tell you what I wish I I was one of them old folks so I could enjoy like they did man I'm telling you what but uh they had a uh they had a great time over there and man I'm tell you the old judge was swinging it and dancing in there I thought good gosh if I can move like that when I was 18 I wouldn't have done but anyway I had a great time but I want to read this Proclamation uh to the counsil and to our our our guest whereas throughout history older people have achieved much for our families and communities in our country that remains true today and gives an ample reason this year to reserve a special day in honor of senior citizens who mean so much to our land whereas with improved health care and more years of productivity older citizens are reinforcing their historical roles As Leaders as links with our p patrimony and sense of purpose as individuals and as a nation many older people are embarking on second careers giving younger Americans a fine example of responsibility resourcefulness confidence and determination and more than 4.5 million senior citizens serving as Volunteers in various programs and projects that benefit every sector of society whether the need exist older people are making their presence felt for their own good and that of others and whereas for all they have achieved throughout life and for all they continue to accomplish we owe older citizens our thanks heartfelt salute we can best demonstrate our gratitude and esteem by making sure that our communities are good places in which to mature and to grow older places in which older people can participate to the fullest and can find the encourage enouragement acceptance assistance and services they need to continue to lead lives of Independence and dignity and whereas a congress by house joint resolution 138 designated August 21st 1988 as National senior citizens day and authorized and requested President Ronald Reagan to issue a proclamation and observance of this event now her for I count by virtue of authority vested me as mayor of the city spring florid do hereby Proclaim August 21th 202 24 as National senior citizens day thank you very much and real thanks to our seniors um also uh what I would like to do is I have a a letter of appreciation and in particular I kind of snuck it up on the old gal but I did ask Mindy what she gonna be here tonight tell her why but uh but anyway um manyy like to uh first of all let me just say a few words um and I'll just say you know I've known Mindy we've got become personal friends for the last number of years almost 12 years over 12 years I guess but uh and um and of course Mindy was married to a former mayor um she is professionally is Dr Melinda Henderson uh she is um she's got a very impressive and extensive background her biography is incredible and both in education and in her life experience some of the jobs she's held um she's got a master's degree of Science and degree of nursing she has her master's degree in nursing she has her PhD in nursing Administration she's worked in hospitals colleges universities and numerous on numerous numerous levels and so when she moved back here uh she was loaded for bear and uh thank God she came to fiac Springs now Melinda was also the most recent recipient of the women of light uh to which we have several in our we got monuments all around our Lake we've been doing for the past I don't know 10 or 11 years and uh anyway she has been the last recipient of that uh very worthy of that honor and uh and so she is they they the women of uh Women's Club they they covered a great deal of her history and accolades but uh some specifics that uh have been extremely beneficial to the city def func I want to actually read off of some of the the material that wom light did but this is just a little glimpse of some of what she's done here in the city fiac she's got uh activities all over the place but here in the the Henderson moved to Trac Springs of course that's where her husband was born but in 1983 and both have worked to preserve our City's History Dr Henderson was written has written several successful grants that benefited our city from 2000 2007 she obtained two Mansion grants of one state historic grant for the preservation and restoration of St AG's Episcopal church and Parish house totaling $364,000 2015 she obtained a special category State historic preservation Grant to preserve restore and rehabilitate sh Shaka Hall of Brotherhood in the amount of $499,000 the city has since received two subsequent grants and work is almost complete we hope we'll see that happen real soon and uh and so in 2017 she partnered with the city to nominate uh the sh campus as a national historic land Mark has been reviewed by the National Park Service and been revised the effort is ongoing in 2022 she secured a special category State excuse me I'm reading over preserved and restored the Charles Eve Murray house on Circle Drive in the amount of $293,000 it is slated to be completed last month uh this brings her successful say again oh good yeah we we're accustomed to that around here yeah and so this brings her success uh application to Historic preservation grants award to over a million dollar and so and so in 2017 uh Dr hon founded became the executive director of Ford and FC Incorporated it's a 5013c and it is not for profit organization dedicated to preserving and enhancing the punc Springs unique history and both assets it is a Resource Bank for expertise volunteers with fundraising it supports efforts to improve the economic Vitality of the area encourages citizen engagement Advocates advocates for solutions to area concerns the organization sponsored the Flight of the Jackie Cochran presented by Nancy Hasty a Broadway actress to playright which tells the story of a famous a avri she was a pilot which ties to defunc proceedes benefit to the Char sta Hall of Brotherhood board defunc has organized four triathlons which promotee health and showcase our city proceed proceeds were used to for small grants to area nonprofits in both 2022 2023 for defunc has also hosted two veteran appreciation breakfast semi byway route for the highest point in the state tuana Valley being considered as a project that would Aid the area's economic vitality and under the office of for fiac Dr hon formed a collaborative Group which includes for func FC spring landmarks wal County historic Association and the University of West laida historic trust and it will soon include Main Street it is known as the historic preservation interest group and its goal is to work with the city's code review and land use committee to revise and strengthen the historic preservation ordinance for the city do presented several times at the assembly on topics such as covid and flu and comparison to Spanish flu and the co pandemic in 2024 her topics was the historic mysteries of two local Pioneers JD wolf and charlesy Murray and it just goes on and on and U but you know I can tell you this is this woman is got a incredible professional background but she got a heart to go and I told Mindy when I first met her I thought she's going to be a CO old fish you know I thought she going to be kind of hard work with and boy was I ever wrong you know and so with that the lesson don't don't get too big of a deep di with your first impressions because this is a very humble woman I have seen her lay her life out to do things for the city and I can tell you in years past where she was absolutely bash for it and I thought and she'll be right back she comes right back she doesn't need doesn't need to do this she just loves to do this and uh I I appreciate her character her professionalism um her smiling face and uh she has you know just a great asset so I wanted to present her a letter of appreciation and also I have a a little challenge coin wherever I put it I where can I get right here to present it to her you want to do it back here this is this came from uh yes anyway this uh I'm part of the board of directors for the league of Mayors across the state and we got a handful of in the board of directors and he gave each one of us four of these coins to pass out and which they what they say is uh well on the front it says Florida League of Mayors established in 2005 but here it says leadership vision and public service and I tell you what you qualify and shine in all all three areas and I just want to present this to you and uh and then also I want to give you let me just read this just a short letter and it's uh certificate of appreciation proudly presented to Dr Melinda C Henderson and grateful recognition of your dedication passion your valuable contributions to the C of experience thank you for your tireless efforts your unwavering support your dedication to our city and your hard work commitment has truly appreciated I slept one on you that time been a okay all right we're going to go right to the consern agenda uh you can approve as written or if you see something there you would like to move to the regular agenda Now's the Time to bring it up I do okay what you got uh D1 which one was it D1 D1 all right there we go all right I got good ratification anything else okay all in favor say AI we're starting with we need a motion second okay then then it's me yes sir I appreciate that almost got the formality here all right all favor say I I I I I hi kri thank you very much and uh we will move that where kby we'll put it on the 4 B1 there be our first item on the regular all right can do that okay so let's go ahead am you and you want to take that up uh we need a motion to approve the agenda yeah all right with the one addition motion to approve With The Changes second second all in favor to say I I I I I I I scary now and we'll go to uh 41 I guess it would be for V1 so about a year ago I had asked um to have the electronic transfers and those items that were paid electronically to be added to the report they've never been included uh to my knowledge and I know Tyler we had discussed back then Tyler has a feature where you can add these electronic payments as manual checks and that way when they run the report they would automatically appear uh any vendor that was paid electronically and transferred but that hasn't happened so I'm wondering can we please read that and have that for the future and at the next meeting can we get a list for this fiscal year 24 October 1 of 23 to current all the electronic payments that have been made as one big uh report so that we can look at it because we've never seen any of those payments that have gone through and I know they're a significant amount of money you make that form motion if if it need be yes yes all right that's your motion the motion also includes the actual ratification of those bills oh yes sir I'm sorry this this item is solely the ratification of bills so but this would be but what I'm asking for are also bills CL so they just were paid they were just paid electronically ratifying the bills we've already paid sorry okay I don't have a problem with the two ratifications I just want I want to be clear we're going to have our bill ratification but we're also going to be asking addition so we'll need thank you I I make a motion to approve the ratification for June and July so we're going to take up yes all right motion to ratify second okay second any questions all in fav I I I I I carry now your motion again the second motion would be could we just bring forward all the payments that were made electronic L and the transfers and a separate report from October one to current so that we can see all of those that would be would have been a part of this um ratifications and that's an a form motion yes a second I have motion second um any question all in favor I I hi Carri thank you very much all right we will go to our interim city manager Kobe Townson for the director position thank you mayor so uh it's really up kind of to the council about the order we go about these um because if some member of the council wishes to bring up positions you may not ever get to the description so we can start with the description um I know he had spoken to the last meeting about um the applicance that we had and there was discussion of maybe if council members seen some that they felt might worthy of interview that we we could go about that um so again we can go either way about it so I I would suggest let's start with the director position the individuals that have applied so far if there's any council member who has a list or seen applicants that they wish to bring for for potentially interview or discuss we prepared to have that conversation I can mention a couple um actual name of applicants uh Crystal Garcia possibly Megan Smith I think we need more information and possibly um Adam Thompson which one Adam Thompson and Paul Barrett anyone else to say about that I'm sorry any particular thing you want to say about well as I mentioned in I think in our last meeting I think some of these applicants might be closer than their paperwork might reveal to us um and they might just be worth looking into a little bit more um I think I think all four of these uh with exception of one I look back at my notes but I think they've all had City experience somewhere um possibly two of those in Florida uh one in Texas and the other one in Missouri I believe Montana yeah Montana um yeah yeah um and then Adam Thompson was Missouri and then Bowling Green Florida so they might be close as far as years of experience and in substitute of of the NBA and actually I think all all these with exception of Megan Smith has an a masters um and Paul Barrett I think does not either but um I think he has the eight years of experience with the city of Jacksonville so they might be close and and you know we're getting to the point you know how how long do we extend this out and and overload our department and um have to we have to we have to start moving in a direction I'm not I'm I'm open-minded to continuing the application process take a few more if we can and go but I think these might be worth taking a look at a little closer possibly go ahead uh Glenn would you please share with us what you saw because I have a couple of these same names on my list uh to start with Paul Barrett my my concern with him was if you look at years of experience he's he moves every 12 months or previous so he doesn't stay anywhere less than or more than 12 months before he moves to somewhere else so I kind of ruled him out now my other one I did like uh to see Crystal Garcia what I didn't see was what type of education she had all I saw was some some great kind of experience and talent and Longevity but I didn't see any like formal education so I'm not sure a bachelor's in accounting okay NBA she was the one from the city yeah Midland City and Megan I had her on on my list too her radar for mhm I didn't see Mr Thompson so I don't I skipped over him I saw his name but I skipped over is I'll start with Mr what would you like to see in general here would you ready to take close look at these guys or you want to I'm fine with with meeting and and interviewing people but a few of the things that kept coming up in the past was the um local experience and it was a CPA and those issues were both hammered on pretty heavily here for months now if not a year or more now at this point but if that's the case there's only one CPA denoted on there the local experience I can I can derive that from different things so I mean I'm I'm good with at least letting letting them come forward and and putting their their best show them you know and seip um one of my biggest concerns with the way we're doing this right now is if we're going to try change the job description I don't want to go backwards and that that to me is we're doing it backwards you know we're just doing ourselves a disfavor I think because I think we better solidify the job description first and then second that but if regardless of what we do if we do move forward one of the one things I think that we should ask in the applicant process or before we actually sit down to interview them is have them submit a set of financial statements that they have done for a government so that we can actually see there we could tell a lot by their work product I think and you know that is the ultimate goal the ultimate goal is they're going to take all these many pieces and parts the grants the AP the payroll the checks and they're going to roll it up into what the Auditors need in order to do their job so I think that would be a great thing if we could get them to submit those to us uh and I don't know that all of the candidates can do that or not and that's the bottom line I mean that's what we have to produce to give to the Auditors in order to get our financial Stone so Mr you kind of shared what you're looking for is there anything you want to say it in addition um how we move for no um I would say of those of those four there there's there's two that I think come very closely uh to what we're might be looking for um Crystal Garcia and and Megan Smith are are those two and I think some of the things that we might be asking for in the job description you're right we need to we have to get that nailed down um some of the accounting standards and that that's standard right but then there's some specific things uh mentioned in the job description that you kind of brought brought to us that since I don't know anything about accounting I'm wondering if some of these qualifications that we might look be looking for with the old job description not to mention the new one um might some of these things be acquired fairly easily fairly quickly once they're on the job uh and some of are some of those qual those um the the knowledge requirements that uh we're considering putting in this job description are are they attainable um you know once a person is is hired in because if they have all that other major knowledge and experience especially um they're probably pretty sharp to to to to get that knowledge pretty quickly I don't know what it takes to get some of that though you you're the expert in that and my assessment what I did to bring forward the recommendations that I had submitted I took our actual financial statements and all I did was look to say okay if I have to put This Together these are the rules that I have to follow so if you didn't have those I didn't bring forward anything that they didn't have to have or that was just generic um so those the skills that I brought forward were things why don't we tell people we need this because they're essential in my eyes because they are absolutely necessary or they couldn't produce that set of financial statements because what the Auditors audit is what we give them and what we give them is a set that whole entire booklet is produced by us except for their six-page letter and their two-page okay we grade you as uh here's your audit score basically but everything else in that booklet we have to produce with our staff so um you my tendency on things like that is if you're asking for a work product what why are we asking for the qualifications either you can do it or you can't as one way to look at it or you have the certifications and you have a track record of doing it and we just move forward so I'm not opposed to it but it just seems odd uh that we would dismiss experience and would dismiss a lot of uh other aspects you know with regard to having a work product versus certifications it just seems a little confusing based on some of the past conversations we have it just seems inconsistent but I'm okay either way uh there's certainly a lot to unpack based on the other the other comments here um just purely on the topic of bringing people forward to to conduct interviews um if other council members feel that that is warranted I will wholeheartedly support that I don't have a problem with setting up interviews with any of the people that were named um I tend to agree that that I didn't bring forth those people because when I looked at all of those resumés none of them stood out for their local government experience you know I agree that some of them hopped around from job to job uh there was one person that while they um were in finance they were in the investment side of things they were for the city of Jacksonville well the city of Jacksonville has a budget a 100 times larger than we do and of course they have Investments and they have all of that in house as someone that worked at a bank think the investment people are completely and wholeheartedly separate from everybody else it's a different certification you know etc etc um but I'm not opposed again I'm not opposed to interviewing people because I I understand what councilman Harrison is saying about maybe there's someone there that on paper doesn't quite have all the boxes checked but we can uh we can you know get them there um as it's scary to say but as probably one of the most senior council members on the council now um I have I have I have experienced firsthand what it's like to have a finance director that does not have Florida government accounting experience and what I heard over and over again was well that's not how we did it where I was from well that's not how we did it where I was from well I'm sorry you're not there anymore you're here and I mean just being completely Frank some of the reason why we're in the mess that we're in today is because of that I I I directly attribute it to that so um I have I have some heartburn with OJT but at the same time my personal career has been OJT I I have risen through the ranks through OJT and I you know there were certain things that I didn't do until someone said we're gonna take a chance on top and and gave me the opportunity to prove myself right so so I understand both sides of the coin um when it comes to uh the the the requirements uh asking them to do a work product versus not my commentary on that is in my my field in technology right Google Microsoft Apple all of them you know for years developed these elaborate tests for people you know code on the spot solve this equation on the on the Whiteboard you know they developed all these elaborate ideas to be able to prove are you capable of being you know a Google you know coder you capable of being an apple encoder or a Microsoft coder uh and what what happened within the industry was everybody practice for the test everybody can answer the common questions that that that showed up on the test um I don't disagree that making people produce a work product that would fall in line with the requirements they have to meet it's not a bad idea I've seen that done elsewhere and I think I think it's NE I think it's a good product the problem is even if you look at the people that are on this uh this list right now even some of the ones that were mentioned they didn't technically assemble a finance a budget or if they did they were part of a larger team so for them to say that's my budget that's my work product that's not true you probably did it with two three four 20 other people depending upon the size of the city um you know I I think we're going to have a discussion about the the job description and qualifications all that stuff so I think I'll I'll save the rest of my comments that that kind of trickled up I'll that for later okay and I just want one comment is that is that most you know we got some professional people in here but you know most Engineers can chew up another engineer in other words if if I had an engineer and he he produced a product and I bring another engineer in here if he wanted to he could probably nibble it all pieces one attorney can come in here behind another attorney and do the same thing he can nibble in all the pieces one CPA can come behind another CPA and nibble in all the pieces uh it's because there's there's a I wish it was just a clear standard that everybody abided by but everybody does things different you know when somebody builds a house or a big project of some sort they may do it totally different what I did but when they got done they had a fabulous product they their you know some some of the practices they did were what I would say odd but they did a fantastic job so it's you got to be careful that they don't match exactly the way you wanted it done personally and uh and just kind of see what they've done as results and their background the past but go ahead Amy I was just no I just had a concern with look we've tried it a variety of different ways and since 17 we've not really been successful in obtaining what we need um and I just I I'm hoping that we'll get there you know uh we we thought that we had someone that uh could do it gave her the opportunity and it never transpired uh you know we were disappointed in the end result so I'm just saying we need to be careful we've got to have a balance uh you know in 2017 you had five CP a uh and the city selected one um for that job but there was five of us that had interviews that had you know Florida government experience so I think we you know we don't have to settle for uh you know one or the other I think you can get I think we can get the entire package so additional comments I I think we have another agenda item on the other the other stuff so I'll hold my all right good okay then uh quick question mayor I mean do we we want to go to description and come back so I I get in that is the the current applicants are there certain one a motion to interview certain ones or a motion to deny all of them so we can move forward because these applicants applied on the current application if you change the application to make it more stringent then they're not going to meet that one either so that just kind of clar clarification we're looking for on the staff level I would say dismiss them I'll tell get this job description down and avoid any liability that may come from favors to one over the other based on One requirement versus the next within a matter of weeks months however short or long it was I agree and hearing some of the comments as we went around it it reminded me of some of the things that I look through like the job hopping um Miss Garcia I did like her at first looking through it and then I started looking at the different jobs that she held over time and the positions and it seemed like there was a gap where she went to education there for a while and and there was no work experience in that area it look like but um I agree I would say just turn dismiss them all and then get the job description down then then we'll go back to it again okay want put that phone motion you want make comments well I I think and and that's fine I I just and we need to take a look at how many of these folks are from Florida and what's the reality of us finding somebody from Florida with Florida experience and how long is this process going to take waiting for that uh we don't have that many applicants um considering when we to get 50 applicants for this job and they're not all they're not all from Florida by by by any stretch and the ones that are um might not be the ones I mentioned I'd have to look back to see um but I looked at more qualifications and and that kind of thing then the discussion came up after I spent all this time doing this about looking for somebody strictly with Florida experience so that's what we want to do and need to do and it might very well be I don't know I don't again I don't know what the process is for somebody gained that knowledge of Florida accounting uh practices so much um but um if if that is a big obstacle to getting the person we need then we need to stick strictly to look for someone with Florida experience I'm not an expert in that field so I can't say one way or the other really on that it's whatever this Council feels like we need to do that's what we'll do I'm I'm not strongly opinionated one way or the other on on these folks if we're looking for Florida experience I'll just leave it at that you know I I hear I hear you councilman Harrison about maybe looking at some of these people um for me personally whether we whether we change the job description now in 30 days in 180 days I think that that is the council's prerogative at any time right we we can come in especially with a position like this uh we can come in at any time and say we want to make sure that you can TW twirl you know 12 plates you know on a stick we we can we can make that call at any time so while I'm not a lawyer um I don't know that that that interviewing someone now and then changing the job description afterwards opens us up any to any other additional liability that we wouldn't already be open to right I mean nowadays you know we can get sued for for just saying the sky's blue you know we can get sued for saying you know we having too many grains of sand in the parking lot like it you can get sued for anything nowadays so um I I don't know that changing the job description means if we're going to contemplate that that that means we need to necessarily reject everybody and not do interviews until we get that that hammered out right but I also want to emphasize two more things and I hear you clay um councilman he made a point that there were four or five CPAs that interviewed last time we hired a CPA so just because someone checks all the Box doesn't mean they're the right employee for us um we've gone through that with the city manager checked every box every single person on the council supported that person after the interview thought that was the person for us and in 18 months didn't have the votes to renew the contract and it was not just one it was many um so just because you're good on paper you have every degree and every threel acronym after your name you can possibly have doesn't mean you're the right person for the city in this time um so you know I I think we need to be careful just looking purely at you know do they check every single box well that's that's my point that's why I raised that's what I basically what I said uh with some of these they don't check box it doesn't appear to be but do they necessarily have to U but I think we need to possibly get the description IR can we just let this one die for lack of a motion and then move on to the next one and then I think we can iron a lot of that out some things I want to talk about that aren't here this today I'm okay with doing thetion coming back later yeah well that the job description the first item the agenda anyway yeah let's do it I'll say this I don't I just I don't know that you're going to subject yourself to any real liability but I don't know what the applicant or the job description changes would be I could well tell you there are scenarios where you would have very real liability based on rejection of an applicant at this stage and a change of job description that could appear to be a targeted effort or a suggestion of that but without knowing the applicant of that it's all hypothe so we'll defend whichever route the council goes and I feel confident we will be able to do we want to go back to the scripture yes I have a question I do I thought at the last time we discussed this description clay correct me if I'm wrong but it was the ordinance that governs it the two didn't match the job description didn't match the ordinance I brought forward my suggestions because I believed you I understood you to say we were going to change the ordinance it hadn't been updated since 1980 such and such that that that is really where I thought I was going so I brought forward these suggestions but they made it into the job description which duplicated a lot of things so you know K you want to talk about why it was incorporated that way but my whole goal just so y'all know my whole goal is to see us update the ordinance not the job description because we can refer the job description to I'll I'll let Kobe talk about I'll let Kobe talk about the job description the reason it's presented to you in this way is that frankly it is easier to present those changes in the scope of our job description then it is for me to present it to you in a red line strike through ordinance because of the way the ordinances written so you're seeing it here if this is approved this will be the ordinance we will make what you proposed into the ordinance but if IID have presented you a Redline strikethrough version of the ordinance it would have been a lot messier than presenting it the way Kobe did in the form of the job description so yes ma'am if this is approved we will update these to be the requirements of the ordinance itself it's just not being presented you're still going have to have two public hearings on the ordinance either way so this is the we tried to figure out what would be the EAS way for the council to read your comments and this is what we felt was going to be the easiest because of them falls under the individual categories so to be clear because I just I want myself to be clear because I can't speak for the other council members but as we have this discussion are we discussing then changing a job description or are we actually making the language what we decide here or will be changes to the ordinance both so what we need to know is and they'll both be in agreement then the one will be identical to the other then at the end of this process yes and that's why we're starting with the job description because there are certainly things here so Co Kobe's got open on his screen so I'm just GNA PE off of that he's at the knowledge skills and abilities section so what we would want to know is in the knowledge skills and ability are which of these are mandatory which of these are preferred those kind of things that's where I'll need your guidance for the ordinance whereas in a job description it's perfect as is or could be if you in terms out presting so that's what we need you to discuss and I'm going to take whatever the answer out of the day is and put it in ordinance form but yes you will have both a job description and ordinance they will be some ptic we'll be good all right we want to go through this again this a job descriptions this uh like what you had scheduling Workshop once a month this this been a perfect just a quick on on this uh if it's underlined it's new put in there this is from uh resource director myself going in and looking at a couple different ones underline that's new line language if there's no no underline or strike through that is existing language if it's strike through it's recommendation to remove that if it has ah in parentheses beside it those are the recommendations the councilwoman provided to us that we put in here the underlining recommendations come from a from looking at the Walton County Board of county commissioner CFO job description uh it looks at the finance director for the city of Mariana because it is a comparable size to us um and so again underline are we you can put in to it new strike through to be removed and then if it doesn't have been mess with that existing language in job description you'll see on the first page under the section city of code of ordinances chapter 2 Article 2 Division 4 section 2 through 60 duties that is the ordinance it was not in there that way human resource director copy and pasted that in there so it was clear in that job description what they require to do under sees code ordinances keby did anybody go and look through this to remove there's a lot of duplications there's four times where it says the exact same thing just different language so did anybody on your staff go through this and say hey we should probably eliminate this as is a duplication here here here and here Dr Henderson and I started to try to do that but we ran out of time we didn't have time to do it before now but I can tell you there is a lot of duplication in these in these documents yeah St put together I mean it's not word for not verbatim she wouldn't put it in there that type of duplicate but we can go through here and take it out it's it's one of those things that um we've asked to put language in here if we leave it out we're going to be asked why we left it out so again y'all can tell us what to take out or we can take it out and bring it back well my recommendation is somebody had and I don't think it's productive for us the council to sit here and take out all of these redundant uh issues I think someone on your staff with your help maybe you know or if you need to call us individually or something when y'all are working on it but there's there's a lot of redundancies in this document okay that's so you know I I've looked through this I I came prepared to to discuss this I think that if we're uh the the finance director is a is a critical function within the city so I I would much rather have the council conduct a workshop this has been on this has been on the agenda multiple times at this point um if we need to conduct an actual separate workshop for this so be it but we I think we should be the ones rolling up our sleeves and adjusting this and working on this collaborative collaboratively as a council because it is a it is a position that we're hiring and it is a critical function of the city with that being said I understand that the effort was made for a simple presentation however I think that we would be better served just simply referencing the code of ordinances in the job description instead of copy pasting it in its entirety over in here um certainly need to probably clean the code of ordinances up and that is as clay expressed that is the intent that was at least what I understood to be the intent the last couple times that's been on the agenda um I'm I'm okay with most everything that's in the ordinance my only comment is when we get down to the uh skills and abilities section um my first question is and and I go back to the example I gave with Google and Microsoft making people do on the-fly coding exams are we going to issue some sort of exam to these people to make sure that they meet every one of these requirements that's listed here like how how are we going to test their knowledge of of these various these various uh listed duties because to me if they're accepting the job I don't mind maybe some overarching bullet points here of what they need to cover but I think this list gets quite exhaustive in you know some of the things that should just be implied number one if they're a CPA number one if they if they've got a master's and or even a bachelor's degree some of this is is clearly implied it'd be like me when I when I applied for a new job them saying well can you type yes I can type you know do you understand Microsoft windows Yep been doing that since I was you know 1984 yes I understand that you're not going to see those type of requirements on a high Lev uh job application and and so to me I'm not sure that it helps us in locating somebody if anything this actually makes it potentially more restrictive when we're we're trying our best to find somebody that fits uh that fits the city and will do do good by the city because again we had a CPA as a as our finance director and I firmly believe this is my personal opinion but I firmly believe that CPA left us in the mess that in today no she didn't yes ma'am I did she she got us a a a unqualified opinion which is the best you can get so so she went from where we were to get us an unqualified opinion the the entire time she was here so I I disagree with that because okay I I don't because because it is very clear from my experience on this board that the way our system is configured both when it was under adg as well as when it was migrated and implemented in Tyler which she handled exclusively something is not set up correctly that migration was not set up correctly as an IT professional I can look at you and say wholeheartedly without a doubt that that migration was was wrong it was not handled correctly and I think so why didn't our Auditors bring that forward if that was the case the Auditors would have that would have been one of their very first comments to us last year I I think Council heavin you as a CPA understand that when someone comes in and does an audit from year to year they're not auditing every single transaction that's called a forensic audit they are normally only sampling various parts to make sure that we're doing the things that we say we're going to do they're not coming in and line by line matching Ledger by Ledger every single injury we we we could not afford to pay for that every single year and that that's that's actually not what happens in practice so to a certain extent they were provided information and I fundamentally believe that we set ourselves up at a disadvantage because we have a system that does not provide the information in a fast and accurate form from my understanding we have a system set up to that prebooks entries that they then have to go back and correct even though we haven't received the money for it and we haven't actually spended the money expended the money for it but the way the system system is set up because the way the budget is entered it automatically makes those those entries so then a lot of those accounts are sitting at a negative until the the money's booked well the money might may not be booked for 11 months depending upon when when that revenue for that particular account comes in so we fundamentally have problems with the way Tyler was implemented that we're trying to dig out of so you know I we're we're off on a tangent here but I just wonder if is some more generalized um knowledge and ability statements that we could obtain that would still allow us to obtain you know I'm not opposed to hiring a CPA it's not what I'm saying I'm not opposed to hiring someone that's qualified we need them but I think as a council we've got to be patient and not rush to just make put someone in the position to a certain extent that's what we did last time we got ansy because it had been like seven or eight months since we had since the previous Finance director resigned and we felt all felt this pressure that we need to get a finance director in there we did that and look at where it got us so I am here to make sure that we make the right decision not the the instant decision right I agree with u councilman beerbom I that that is a concern that I I have written on my notes here about these specific qualifications because they could be so specific that it could disqualify somebody uh that would be otherwise qualified applicants I mean they see these requirements and they get scared away uh because there it appears to be more stringent than maybe they have but maybe they're close you see and so I I don't I don't think from the number of applicants have especially from Florida I don't think we can afford to scare anybody away or discourage applicants um by being too specific with the knowledge and skills and abilities that they have to have uh but again I think some of this stuff um some of them might have and so they and they can they can get fairly fairly quickly I'm not in a big rush you know and I don't want anybody to think that but this is a really important thing you guys have been around doing this longer than I have and you understand the mess with the audit and what have you we we have to move forward I'm all in favor of having a workshop and was rolling our sleeves up and moving this thing uh at the pace we need to move it not too quickly but carefully and get the right person in place but it's going to be difficult to do it in in these Chambers uh during regular council meeting to go through all this I think I'd love to see each one of you do your own hand scratch all that list and description and uh and you know highlight whatever has been redundant or repeated or whatever and just anything and that way when we get here we're not doing it as we're here you've already ready present it and work with Kobe if you want to do it beforehand but um so we can quickly get down to the fluff that needs to be wiped off and let's get down to the fair bones what we're looking for and so not say it three or four times ahead I'd make a motion to go ahead and schedule the workshop so we can move ahead on this second I we have a motion second and 're gonna have Kobe coordinate that yes all right motion second any questions any questions from anybody yes ma'am perhaps I'm not familiar with how the government job descriptions are written and if I can help anyway I need to understand that um I too saw a lot of duplication and I wonder if you were writing a job description for a lawyer would it be that specific or could you have some overarching categories that would include a number of those things um that's the way I write them okay thank you Danny Cen could you please pull up the current um job description as it goes out so I could make reference to that please current one's not attached to this agenda item I saw it earlier um which the job description um just a few minutes ago it had the red in Red Letters the word r eight years of oh that's the we scroll up just LA to the top of that the Matrix I believe is what he's referencing is that what you're referencing yes it's not a job description itself so this or a years of experience in local government account that's pretty much based on recent history this is what opened the door to someone with six years of data entry operating with a high school degree and no professional training in finances so this four and everything below it for to try and raise the bar for our city this needs to be eliminated either they've got the training and the education or they don't not or I disagree with that that's this ideas that I'd like for you to consider and the other thing is is all these uh other degrees up here this is specifically like you have a degree in political science right you think that qualifies you to be uh in charge of the finance director could be the finance director with that degree it probably help you if you had an accounting it would probably you could probably do a little better if you had the right training we need to look for people that's got the training and if you want to raise the bar at a previous meeting we talked about put the CPA in charge uh or a CPA because the finance director that y'all make mention to that y'all could not agree on we haven't had a a clean passing audit since five six years I I disagree with that statement last time we we had a good clean AIT that year last and now this is a play on words I'm not using the right vocabul when I say a clean AIT I know there's another word there's a lot that can be done right here a lot be done right here that can raise the bar for our city thank you may remember the motion is to set the workshop so all this will be discussed at the worksh details of the job all right all right so have a motion second uh all in favor say I I I all right all all right okay so kobby will coming forward with the date time uh all right we ready to move on to the AIT yes mayor thank you so this is a question that I was asked by the Auditors and so the we our anticipation is to have the audit to the council by September 23rd I believe that is our second meeting in September the question was um you know if they finish that prior to quicker than they anticipate or prior to a council meeting does the council wish for Daniel and I to review that and to have them submit that to the state and bring it to the council's ratification or would y'all rather us hold on to that until this Council had had a chance to review and then approve before we submit again this is more so for expediency um you if there's stuff in it that can be addressed prior to submission obviously that may take additional time so again this is totally up to the city council um how you'd like us to handle it and if the council does want to see it as it's a timeliness issue um what we would ask is that you go ahead and provide Authority um to set a special meeting so that he can have y'all here for that special meeting to get it submitted as timely as possible I prefer it not to be submitted without us seeing it and without us discussing it I do not want someone to make a decision on behalf of us when we're not here so my preference would be a special meeting if that's what it takes so that we can all be together and discuss exactly what they say and what the problems might be yeah I I completely agree you know this this last year actually earlier this year you know we had a a draft of the of the audit that management hadn't even had a chance to respond to paraded around and written about and newspaper articles written about and no one had even had a chance to reply to it or even look at it and digest it so I I completely support having the Council look at the audit and make sure that we have ample opportunity to reply to the audit my experience with Auditors in general has been sometimes they will put things in there and you can provide the data to them and say this is what we're doing and then they remove remove that finding happens all the time and so I I want to make sure that we see that audit before it goes out want make a motion down I'll make that motion second motion second any questions anyone all in favor say I I I all right I I Carrie and so another okay uh we'll move on to C4 dire so uh following back up on the inquiry that a citizen has asked about purchasing a part a piece of our welin property that is the pond we just about cutting that out of the property uh we have required quotes on what the survey would cost to do that I know I mentioned it at the budget Workshop he was asked I kind of gave my response I think it would be best if legal provided his explanation of how he sees us moving forward this property um because if we do go a certain route that individual is willing to pay for a portion of the survey and so again that's another something else fact into city has the utmost flexibility we're not constrained by any Florida statute or specific ordinance regarding the disposition and sell of real property you simply have to determine it has no more use to the city and we can then sell it under any method that City Fe sees fit or deems fit with that being said given this property was sold to the city for the purpose of the wellsite by the family while there is not a reverter clause or a first right it is entirely consistent with that transaction ction if the city does wish to resell the remaining property at the value equivalent to what they sold at us for if we no longer have a need for it and I think that's something to be mindful of here is the property was conveyed to us under the assumption we would need this property without wellsite as it's turned out we do not need and do not utilize that whole property so it's up to you how you would want to go about doing it I definitely do believe I mean certainly your position is to go forward however you see but I do think a survey is necessary I think we need to make sure it's our people now to split that cost I think that's completely reasonable but I would highly recommend us getting a survey even if we did so at our own expense the reason being we need to know exactly where that well site sits and there not be a dispute I would not want to leave that up to someone else's surveyor that we are not in privity with so to the council's discretion I know I was contacted by uh someone other than the original family that was interested in the property so I think the best course of action would be that we put it out for bid seal bid reserve the right to reject all bids and go from there on it that would be my that would be my comment what you think we had to you sell it at that original price and either pay or help pay survey uh yes ma'am I have a similar um issue that like Todd does uh that councilman beerbom said because that's not the protocol that was used several years ago there was uh piece of property that uh was on 20th Street and there's several people that wanted it but it had to go out to bid and that's the exact process so I don't want to see us go outside of that well that's what the council chose to do it did not have to that's what the council chose to do I want be very clear just and if you want to that's fine but say that this would be outside prot I'm not looking for com I'm just saying I I agree with what Mr Beer Bram just said I I also have know someone else that might be interested in that particular property and I wanted to use that 2019 experience to say that's the protocol that the city used they went out to bid they took sealed bids and then they sold it wasn't just one piece of property I think it was five unused pieces of property that was around the city that they so I would like to see that us maintain that practice I don't want to see us setting some pres not maintain that practice right now City Hall is all I'm pointing out so if we want to say that the most recent piece we have up for sale is City Hall and we are not doing sealed BS so I I just don't I don't want this csil on the record saying something's true and it's not the city chose to dispense with certain properties that were determined by public works at the time to have no value to the city and therefore they surplused those properties upon Surplus those properties we are required in a surplus scenario to then receive bids for Surplus property nobody is declaring this Surplus to my knowledge now if we are that's going to change our entire Dynamic of what we do I wasn't finished so I I apologize um go ahead uh you know one of the differences what he's bringing up is we solicited for bids on the city hall that is completely different than citizens coming to City Hall saying I'd like to buy that vacant piece of property it's next door to me you haven't used it in multiple years they the answer was no and then it went out for a seal good so I would like to see that also I would make that proposal to go out for sealed bids on this property I would say this property is is really only of use to two people that border this property if someone else buys it if it is put out for bid they're going to request an easement across city property uh most likely so that's something to think about I think that's why we need to reserve the right to reject all bids because if it's the reality is if they need ammen I think we need to have the flexibility to either debate that or reject all bids and address that at that time so I'll make a motion that we yes come ahead m May point of order there there's no motion on the table yet all right St there'll be a motion just a minute so I make a motion that we put the well property 10 out as a sealed bid reserving the right to reject all bids yes reserving the right to reject all bids second second come on so what y'all just rejected and and I I really appreciate it my name is David Hall I'm one the original owners when Mr uh Holloway uh built that uh well 10 U he promised that land back to our family all right me and uh Mr barefield right now we were going to have the land I was going to take seven acres he's going to take seven acres this is what the plan is we've talked about it through several uh several uh council members and uh with that said we've worked uh numerous hours trying to make sure that this happened the easiest way for the city okay and that was the most easiest way to get it back into to the hall family Brad uh Brad barefield is not being cut out of that deal it's only like you said it's only possible to two people myself and Mr barefield I'm going to give him access to his Seven Acres where he can run his business off the back side of the property that's what you're just rejecting I thank y' for your time Mr Mayor yes C can you explain why the properties is of value and why you're wanting that back please so that everybody can hear it uh the uh the original 56 Acres of this land belong to my Granddad Ellison Hall when my when he passed away my dad he gave he split the land with my uh dad and his sister when she passed away he sold the land to the city with the pretense that didn't give the hall family a chance to buy that first portion of that land I've been steadily trying my best since 2009 documentation several Mayors I've I've had a meeting with you mayor back in 2015 when you first took in we said over in The Old City Hall and with the with an interim city manager at the time and uh and so it's not that I have not been trying to get this back since 2009 and it's no more it does the city no good the pond is going laying in Ruins right I would like for my grandkids maybe their grandkids to be able to fish out of that PP that's that's it nothing's going to be developed there I'm not going to turn it into what um family members did across the street to the pet C I know that's great for the city it's going to be bring us great Revenue right however if I can hand on to mine and the eight Acres nine acres that I have right now is not going to change that's what what it was about all right I just want as much of that back as I could possibly that I grew up and that's nothing any other questions from Mr is Mr barefield here he's not he's in Minnesota tonight on vacation and and uh I'm supposed to call him immediately after this and see where this went me and him has work I I we've had two emails with the city manager this past week talking and are we in agreements with what what am I in line what I'm saying Mr Townson yeah I'm completely in line with what I'm saying I I'm not talking for Mr Barfield if he was here and I was not here I believe wholeheartedly he would be saying the same thing if did go through with what you were proposing would you pay the Sur yeah I'll pay you I we've said that I I mean I offered up half to begin with and then I said if you can't pay for the survey I'll pay I'll pay the survey I mean it's I mean I would like to be included in the survey part process sure even if y'all you know if I pay and you do it i' and I know Mr barefield I mean that's one of the things he goes okay soon as you get on there see ask me tell him when it's going to be surveyed because he wants to be president also because we can do two extra pins to split the L right off the B that's why we wanted to pay half of it thank you very much I'm sorry for your run that's good that's good good okay we have a motion a second on the floor uh any other discussion anyone question mayor yeah if uh to go out to bid we are we going to need to survey the property prior to to show potential biders what we are sell what we're looking to sell we could we don't have to I think what we would simply put is the personal ID number and tax the map and legal description city is offering this property for sealed bids okay question um if this if this passes what what kind of vote does it take to reject biders would be a motion to reject all biders so you're either going to reward to the highest bder or you're going to reject all I would note if the council's position ultimately should become that somebody bids higher than Mr Hall and $5,000 difference well we don't want to do that you're going to be subject to a lawsuit by that I better who says no your right to reject all just to give it to somebody else is not the same thing as reject all my implication of reject all is none of the bids met standard for the city's chosen to rain the property not well we like the high B we want to help somebody El we will find ourselves in hot water in that soon Mr Mayor I just I just want to emphasize that point uh if you if you're not in agreement that it should it could go to someone else then don't pass this motion and go into the bidding process if you feel strongly about it um unfortunately I still think it is in the city's best interest if there's no agreement prior agreement saying that we were going to revert it you know holding you know Council 20 some odd years or almost 20 years later to that you know I I got to look up for the interest of the city um and I I would love for it to be in that family and quite frankly if no one else can use it and it's not really of any value to anyone else I would expect that it would go back to them but um but again in terms of the interest of the City without having any kind of statement or anything I just don't see how you do that Mr Townsen do you recall Mr barefield giving an explanation as to why he was wanting the prop property to begin with had something to do with uh beavers and the dam and maintenance that cities having to perform on the property yeah so when I met with Mr barefield um it was partially about that yes there is a dam City maintains there's a little road or Levy that we do maintain for that water to drain he also came with two proposed two options one he would like to buy that piece that parcel so he has a piece of property um technically to the northwest of his existing property that he would like to access from the backside he's unable to do that because of the corners if anybody's ever heard of the the lawsuit out west Montana and public land you don't do that and so the only way to do it is either buy that piece of property and on the corner or get an easement from the city to move forward and so that's what I have presented to the council Council thought to ENT retain potentially selling so that's how we got to this point Mr Mayor yeah I would like to make a substitute motion that we that we proceed with legal's advice of investigating selling the property back to the original owner at the original amount that it was purchased for per acre second okay have a motion second question yeah I mean the Motions already made so the only thing I would say is I would have been willing on the other one to go through the actual public record and try to find any record of any statement we have as hard as we can nothing we have no record what soever that there's a written agreement to that effect no comments during Council when they sold purchased property originally does not appear to be the case I don't given the nature of how the city went about acquiring property for these well sites that would not at all have been uncommon that the city would have determined if we didn't need the whole property that we would needed some back or we'd sell it back that kind of thing is a very common discussion with developers we see that quite often but there was not anything in writing one way or the other if there was we wouldn't even be having this conversation correct so that's why we're unfortunately having this conversation for my time yeah and I don't let me say this I do not doubt that that could well have been what Mr H said when you look at the property we clearly did not need the entire property for the wellsite the problem I think and if you look it out here and this Wells sit's had a lot of work done and I think we could have some of our Engineers talk about everything they've done out there question was where could you locate it relative to the wetlands and the pond on the site and if you notice it is in the far Northern portion of that site it is about as far up to the north of that parcel as you can get it is far away from that you could not get any further away from that pond if you tried so I wonder how much space I don't I don't see the map of of the property but how how much room do we have if if somebody else bought the property do we have enough space to Grant an easement and would we grant that easement there is adequate spaceace uhuh okay all right so we have a substitute Motion in a second yes sir all say i i n i n i i car all right thank you very much we'll proceed okay thank you mayor 4 C5 this kind of plays perfectly into the finance director Lane so um this is something the council so wishes to do I believe it would be a help to me for scheduling and staff as as well as the council so I'm looking to see if there is a particular day of each month that we could designate as a workshop day for example as I just talked about Fin description I can clearly come to you and say okay our Workshop will be on that second Tuesday of the mon I'm not saying that's the day to do it but I have seen other cities do this spoke Mr ainson I believe the city used to do this in the past um in some form or fashion we had a stand Workshop before our Monday Council meetings and so I think it will be helpful for one for scheduling and two this is going to allow this Council to have more meaningful discussions on a more frequent basis for high high level topics goad Mr May for for Simplicity if it is going to be a recurring one I would recommend that we do it prior to another meeting a regular meeting um again it's going to create Simplicity otherwise we're if we do it on an off week in particular impossible for anyone to travel and do anything else so I I would suggest that we we do this prior to a regular meeting if possible and if we have an item that's going to require too much length and that would just require a special Workshop which we used to fight against this stuff all the time now that's all we have what's your availability most of you coming a little earlier I'm suggesting maybe yeah I think Workshop probably needs an hour and a half uh most of them we can get done an hour I was suggest maybe we start the regular meeting a little later then push it back half an hour3 do that I'm I'm good with four o'clock but I it'd be some days it could be cutting it cutting it close getting in earlier than that okay you could certainly just start your workshop at five and have c meeting follow it six once a month you just doign make whether it's your second or fourth yeah so we started thing at 4 like four and that way of time if it is going to be something we know going to take more than an hour hopefully few days in advance before we have to get notice that meeting well my goal would be to buy the second so whatever one y'all decide on um if it's let's say it's the second meeting of the month you do it for the second at that first meeting of the month that's when we would sit down and say okay this is what our workshop's going to be about we know the next one's Finance director we get to the next one say Okay code enforcement is going to be the next month and have a schedule and if we get to the point where the council doesn't need it then we'll cancel it we just won't schedule it at all um and again that could be we get to where we need a special meeting it'll be a special me it's a workshop would be a workshop I just think it's going to help everyone with scheduling and knowing when we'll have those things when y'all would like to have them what y think about that I'm good with it I like it before the meeting I'm good with four o'clock on the second second meeting of the month that's what we're talking about okay okay so that'll be the standing date so anytime we bring a work shop that's when I was sched a motion on that CL we do all right let's good I make that as a motion second motion second all in favor say I I I I I I I car thank you very much you K thank you mayor 4 C6 this is the loan application for the AC water main design through the srf loan this again was a 5050 we we been rewarded from D the amount of $766,000 uh we will be 50% Grant 50% loan this will be to approve the loan application and the subsequent legal opinion and resolution to follow so we're looking for approval of that and this amount this money has been budgeted in upom fiscal year so we can begin this design motion to approve second all right I have a motion second any questions anyone all in favor say I I I hi hi Carrie thank you very much all right now we're going to go to 4D Liberty Partners see Mr Tim back there with the LA of Commerce job growth rent fund good evening Council um we we keep this uh fairly brief because this is probably going to be more likely a recurring item uh with the Department of Commerce and the job growth Grant fund uh Grant agreement uh as you recall at your last meeting uh we were seeking feedback and the the direction that we were um that we received was to go to the engineers and get comments from them that is the packet that you have in front of you this evening uh are those comments and the feedback from barge engineering U on the draft agreement with Florida commerce uh with regards to the Florida job growth Grant fund award that you received in early July so a lot of those comments L straightforward um you kind of see there um those comments walking you know through the list of uh proposed feedback that we would like to U give Florida commerce U again just wanted to let you know this is a kind of a longer process of back and forth with with them um while while we move towards an executed agreement so um probably looking at probably 30 days on that so just for scheduling purposes it probably be your second meeting next month when we have that final Grant agreement ready to execute so if U if council's okay with of us providing these comments and feedback uh from barge back to florid of Commerce that's what we'd like to have tonight we need that in form of a motion so moveed second have a motion second any questions comments anyone um I I you're I think you're jumping ahead a little bit there I know we've got a we've got to get the grant agreement and the scope of work in place first and then all I Carri thank you very much all right sir okay have a public hearing ordinance our council member Harrison okay this was the tobacco free parks ordinance um that Mr Aon wrote up um for us uh a while back and it's unchanged uh from what you wrote up in the committee uh the uh yeah the committee meeting or board meeting rather um so I would like to make a motion to hold first reading and advertise a second read second I have motion second question anyone yeah so my my comments remain the same as they were originally on this that um it it was interesting to me at the last the last meeting when this was discussed we were told repeatedly that they don't want any enforcement they don't want any enforcement well what's the point of having an ordinance on the books if there's no desire for enforcement um quite frankly it's it's a park it's an open Open Air Park um and you know I I don't I don't see where this is an just an absolute urgent matter I in my in my five years on the council I've never had anyone approach me and say you need to outlaw smoking in in public parks um you know I was born in 82 and I can remember smoking being extremely common I can remember when they outlawed smoking in uh in restaurants um in my opinion smoking is on the way out and in probably 10 years this will be you know an afterthought so I don't understand why we're suddenly wanting an ordinance pass that we've been explicitly told is not going to be enforced um I think it creates enforcement actions as I've St previously or I think it create creates enforcement issues and as I've stated previously the legislature changed the law several years ago to where if we enact an ordinance and it's found to be unconstitutional we're on the hook for all the all the legal fees on that um so that that also factors into my uh my consideration on this so while I don't like to sit next to somebody that smokes um I think that Chipley park or any of our parks are more than open enough that if if there's someone smoking you can move around to a different area and solve it that way versus US writing an ordinance that we know we're not going to enforce um I don't recall anyone saying that this would not be enforced in fact that the ordinance covers enforcement um it it it is written as an ordinance that can be enforced when someone doesn't want to be reasonable um if they are approached by code enforcement or law enforcement um this is not intended to be uh something that um you know results in people's arrest uh this is not something that's not being done Statewide in many other cities in this state it's not something that's not supported by the Florida legislature and it's probably not something that would violate the US Constitution or the Florida Constitution um so I I'm not sure who said that it would not be enforced um but I agree there's no sense in passing ordinance that can't be enforced but we actually have one on the books and that's the one regarding profanity in our parts um and it is not enforced um unless you know you know someone ask if a law enforcement ask someone to leave because of their profanity chances are they're going to leave if they're bellig enough to to to resist an officer's request they're probably going to get the next level of enforcement and that is way this is intended to be uh people will be reasonable if given a chance to be reasonable um but they have to understand there's consequences if they're unreasonable about these these requests and this is about other people's rights and health too it's not majority of people uh that smoke there are people with legitimate health concerns uh children uh with asthma and other conditions we know secondhand smoke causes uh cancer and and other illnesses and and and complications with people's health so this is a matter of us taking a step to do something that indicates that we are in favor of protecting Public Health um in public places and yes Chipley Park is wide open it's 200 acres and I've mentioned before if we wanted to uh reduce Chipley Park to 100 feet of of the playground or something that's a step the rest of our parks are relatively small and um some some people are very sensitive to cigarette smoke and vaping and and those those sort of things so this is this is not intended to discriminate against someone but it's discriminated to do the greater good uh for the majority of people people and and follow our sheriff's department and City police and their efforts to prevent tobacco uh use and drug abuse and alcohol abuse with our our children we can set that example by by doing this thing thank you Mr Harrison can we can we accomplish the same goal just by putting up signs like this is a a designated no smoking area or this is the designated without having to adopt that ordin well there there I don't see re enforcement there if if if it becomes necessary um and again we're not talking about the police having to patrol the parks and look for people smoking cigarettes and lighting up that's not what we're looking for um it's just if there is a complaint and someone has a legitimate concern that there is something that gives an officer or code enforcement some something to stand on to request that they leave or the request they walk up to the curb to smoke or whatever these are simple common courtesy requests but if someone really wants to be difficult it can be enforced to whatever level they would like to take it to according to our codes we're waiting on a motion a second y'all can come up oh we do have a second all right come ahead go ahead Mr I was going to say that U Okaloosa apparently has recently passed well I think it was in January passed a no smoking on the beach it's pretty windy on the beach lots of sand on the beach I mean part of it is the litter which also our staff have to go around cleaning up uh when things do get thrown out but uh again I don't think that we're uh we're an island on this certainly they also banded in their Parks I believe uh I'm not sure but are customary use isn't there some kind of prohibition on tobacco use on the dry sand portion thought we had something as well but I could be wrong cations so I mean again we're not on an island we're not we're not coming out of this uh you know out of thin air this is uh this is something that is you know actively uh being sought by a lot of communities come come yeah want to share something with us ah you're all right don't be scared good I'm uh I'm uh Ali hooks you you can feel free to talk you're okay I'm Ali Hicks i' support tobacco free parks because tobacco free parks promote Healthy Lifestyles and help to assure that everyone can enjoy themselves in a clean healthy environment tobacco free parks can help keep kids safe from The increased risks risk of developing upper respiratory disease es asthma ear infection and the various forms of deadly cancers caused by secondhand smoke thank you thank you thank you um I'm AIA Whitehead a student at won High School a sophomore and I wanted to say I support the tobacco free barks and secondhand smoke contains over 7,000 chemicals including at least 69 of those chemicals that cause cancer no amount of secondhand smoke is safe every year in the United States secondhand smoke is responsible for approximately 50,000 deaths of nonsmokers because of lung cancer and heart disease if secondhand smoke does not kill you it can trigger respiratory irritation and Asthma first smoke first spoke isus second hand smoke is a toxic cloud release for my breing cigar cigar pipe cigarette or a VAP device and the smoke Exhale by a tobacco user thank you thank you my name is Austin St and I support I'm sorry my name is Austin Strong I am a sophomore in high school I got a Walt in high school and uh I support tobacco free parks tobacco free parks can provide positive R modeling for children children off often IM IM imitate what they see their role models do tobacco free parks help reduce youth initiation of using tobacco products including electronical Vapor Products EVP cigarettes spit and Chew Tobacco free parks provide encouragement to people who want to quit and those who recently quit us using tobacco products environmental effects of tobacco products tobacco free parks policies can reduce cigarette bud and other litter products from EVP and other tobacco products cigarette buds continue to be the number one littering item in Parts beaches and roadways in the United States filters are not biod digable and can POS Hazard hazards to marine life and pets we thank you for your time and patience but most most of all we we thank you for helping we thank you for your help to ensure a healthier future for Walton County with the adoption of tobacco free park policies thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you we appreciate all three of you guys uh I know it's a little bit intimidating sometimes stand up here and speak to this Council but uh and in front of this crowd but thank you very much and uh hope to here hope you guys continue to be active in your community all right so we have a motion in a second is there any other last com okay all in favor say I I I'd like to see this get accomplished but I'm going to say no I'd like to see it in a different manner all i n okay all right the I of Carrie that is an ordinance to be numbered in ordinance to the city of K Springs Florida amending chapter 16 parks and regulations article two parts and regulations by creating a new section 16-2 to be entitled smoking and vaping prohibited in Parks providing for the repeal of conflicting ordinances severability inclusion and code and an effective date we will advertise and bring that back for second reading adoption thank you very much all right we'll go to 6A and that's a CRA executive director John good evening Council mayor yeah I will have to say I'm the last person between you and dinner so I make this short so I'm I'm pleased to bring a project forward to the council tonight on behalf of the community redevelopment agency as you may recall back in January you all adopted our Redevelopment Plan update and within that Plan update were a number of capital Improvement projects that we had included as a result of public engagement uh and numerous um feedback sessions that we had the project that I'm here to ask for mission to move forward with tonight is the Veterans Memorial that is conceptually planned to be placed in Chipley park near the intersection of East Main Avenue and Circle Drive included in your packet is a lengthy presentation that I'm sure many of you have already seen that Dr Henderson has been working on for a number of years so essentially what I'm asking tonight is just permission from the council to move forward with the design so long as the CRA board approves us going forward with that design I will tell you based on the task order that I put together there will be a number of percentages Milestones that will be brought back before the council we're going to start with conceptual plans where we'll Workshop that out get some public input put together a couple conceptual renderings bring those back to the council and then at 30 60 and 90% those will also be be brought back to the council so that's essentially what I'm here tonight to ask is to allow us the opportunity to to start this project I'd like to make a motion to approve second I have a motion second questions yeah so I I I have seen the presentation uh and it is exciting but my only concern is about location I mean we're going forward design but again there's several issues with with the location although the shape is fantastic and the shading is fantastic the accessibility to that particular part of the of the park is not it's not only not good it's non-existent sure um so accessibility is a major concern for that location and I and I question if there's not other locations that could be not only more prominent but better accessible to our handicap Community uh and by extension you know veterans that might be disabled um again the quiet is a part of the reflection and so having it in a more remote location makes sense but you know we have a lot of activities there through the year uh we have Christmas Reflections for you know month and a half almost two months of wires and everything all over the place so I have some have some reservations about the location but I am excited about moving forward in terms of uh one uh Design Concepts and pricing so we can actually get a real number on this thing sure but again I I think that we need some kind of um guard rail in terms of being able to finalize the location um you know before it gets too far along I'm not so uh I'm not so sure this would have been a great conversation as part of our Workshop that I've been kind of pitching for the CRA to have with the council uh whereas we can all have a joint meeting and really have a more broad discussion in terms of the goals and priorities of the council for the CR and vice versa goals that the CRA thinks that are important uh that they would like to push you know ahead with the council so I think it'd be a great opportunity to talk because again we're we're United but separate uh and so you you all have autonomy to a great extent uh you know unless you need our conversion specifically for something uh but I think again the location is a is a concern making sure that we have access to the concern and the design component might be a great way to guide us in terms of whether or not we can uh overcome some of those limitations uh and how how costly is it going to become to overcome some of those limitations can I respond to that sure so as part of that design accessibility would would obviously have to be factored as well as storm water management um so I would agree that as that site sits today it certainly is not accessible and I think this particular location is one that's been planned for a many of years because of its remoteness if you will I think that it's a great opportunity to to move something forward now whether that ends up being the ultimate location I think it's to be determined uh conceptually I think that's where we stand but I certainly would not want to move forward any Project without making sure it's fully accessible in providing people of all abilities access to that to that veterans remoral you on to yeah my name is Melinda Henderson I'm a resident of the city tonight I'm representing forward defunc Incorporated the Veterans Memorial is an ongoing project of this organization and I personally have been working on it for 15 years um repeatedly we've shown the slides to individuals and groups and when they made suggestions we incorporated those especially the suggestions that the veterans have made how many veterans do we have here tonight thank you for your service many of them have had opportunities to make suggestions and the way that um CRA has planned the task order um there will be many other opportunities for people to come to a public meeting and uh make a suggestions the concepts that you see here may not be the way it turns out they're just what we have so far um we'll try to keep the veterans informed of all the meetings when they take place so that they can participate more fully and again thank you for your service I can take any questions you might have so he spoke about location so that is still kind in absolutely okay it's the one that's been suggested over and over and over and confirmed sure um Landscaping needs to be a part of it to make it a little bit more calm and private and um I don't one person suggested it be over where the other activities are but there's no parking over there we need to expand it I do have um support letters from the people who live right around there they're not opposed and I have support letters going back to uh 20110 so if you want to look at them I got a whole folder is going be any kind of bathroom or anything as part of this or some kind of support facilities again once we're dealing with it accessibility issues yes we want to be sensitive to people that can't get out I it's pretty far away from so getting out of there and getting somewhere can be difficult um there between the Presbyterian church and there there's already a walkway that gradually slopes but we would have to have the engineering touch to that to make sure that it's perfect and as a matter of fact if we do have to go forward for um additional granting from fap to implement it part of my argument is going to be that it's a trail for people with disabilities that can't hike our existing Trails um one gentleman approached me one time when we had a canvas Labyrinth down there and he said this is perfect for my father who has Alzheimer's because I can sort of hemp him in and and he tends to follow a path whereas if it was anywhere else he'd be in the lake could you repeat the motion please that Mr Mayor that's what I was actually gonna ask about was the fact that it I I mean I I assume we're all in support of a Veterans Memorial within the city that's that's no big deal and that we want to see one done and that the CRA is looking at this and that they want to fund it and that they're just asking us to say hey will you support us in moving forward with it but I would think that it would need we would need to have the conceptual design the budget that well the budget still sits with the c and everything else so it's like you're gonna have to approve the actual location but for them to begin the design and work on this with it being on city property is able to be done because in their plan they do need your blessing so we're just saying we're going to allow you somewhere in the city property to do this with is really what you're asking for you're gonna have to approve the actual design construction and the location yeah that would be location and and if I may so we're simply just allowing the council the opportunity to provide approval to start this project I think it's already been included in the Redevelopment plan that was adopted by the council we're just simply saying hey we're ready to move this forward does the council still desire us to move forward with the project once we have that approval once the board makes the decision to award the task order to an engineering consultant that's when we will bring that back to you through those Milestones that conceptual 30 60 90% for the city council to formally approve before we move forward with that H how do you see yourself handling and I apologize coun how do you see yourself handling you get a group of vets that are for you get a group of vets that that's not the design I want I want Simplicity because I don't want it to look look ratty because someone wasn't able to maintain it those are some of the questions I've been asking different not me specifically but that's the feedback I'm getting and asking some of this it's like hey we we've spoken about it we we like the designs but is it too much or is it too little is it is it going to to provide a place of a solid where they could just sit down and relax and and think about things or is it something that's going to be so so big to where it's got to be maintained and if it starts looking like crap then then it takes away that meaning from the BET and it just getes them one more thing to to maintain I think that's where that public Workshop plays an important role along with all of the council meetings uh where we have the the varing Milestones that you all would would approve but you know we have a general concept that an engineering consultant could put in a civil design that could then be presented through that public Workshop to get additional input or get support um or criticism for for lack of a better word so I think it's that public input that's important that we have an opportunity to gain as much involvement from the public as we can and I'm for it I'm not against it it's just I know there's a lot a picnic designed like um not like the ones you see in Parks is also part of the plan where the bathro and of they have and we have no bathro go ahead M any other questions I I I wanted to State I guess first and foremost so that it's not misconstrued as as someone that has fathers grandfathers Brothers Aunts Uncles that are in the military our our veterans deserve honor and respect every single day for laying their lives down on the line for us as a nation so that we can be free I'm in support of honoring our veterans I want to be very very clear about that but much like councilman scers who's also a veteran I have questions about the technicalities of this I think first and foremost I'm still trying to understand you know we as a council don't approve all of your various projects for example you there there's grants that you're handing out there's you know various activities that c does that you as Council M Valley pointed out you're you're autonomous you you have the ability to go off and do so I don't quite understand the technicality of this however I do understand that you're asking to use city property and I think what's been brought up and mentioned here just a minute ago is important there doesn't seem to be consensus on where we're going to place this and then on top of that um there seems to even be lack of consensus on the design the the massing of the facil facilities that may be included with it um I I have some technicalities that I that I think need to be addressed so I'm I'm for it I'm for honoring our veterans I'm for supporting our veterans and quite frankly as someone that again has a father a brother uncles um and great great-grandfathers that are all involved in in military service if we're going to do this it needs to be honoring and respectful of the veterans I the last thing I want to have happen is for us to build this and then it become tanned and worn down because we we overbuilt it and then we can't maintain it whether it's Flags whether it's Landscaping whether it's facilities I think we need to we need to approach this carefully Josh if I may I think we've pretty much hammered down the location as being proposed at East Main Avenue and Circle Drive I think what I'm here tonight to ask and I apologize if I weren't clear is simply approval from the count IL to move forward with City propert making improvements on city property in my opinion and this is Josh's opinion I think you've already given us that approval when you adopted our Redevelopment plan on January the 8th but at this point I'm just simply out of kind of a cesy my board wanted me to come to the council and say hey does the city want us to move forward with making the improvements to this property here at Circle Drive in East Maine well go ahead and and this just sets the stage for us to actually go out and hire an engineer to to further Define what this is going to look like into what parameters is it going to have a bathroom to what degree will it have a bathroom you know all of the ins and outs would have to be engineered because as it sits today it's unimproved and we really don't know until we start doing you know some actual engineering on it I mean I've I've heard from citizens that are also veterans in the last week about their concerns about about its location its accessibility what it's going to look like um I've heard from citizens that that live in the area that don't agree with it being there so while the previous owner of of said property may have signed a letter of support in 2000 you know the currently I've heard from at least a couple of land owners that are in that close vicinity that don't necessarily agree with it in that location um you know I'm I'm here to hear all sides and represent all people even if it might not necessarily be the most popular opinion again not that myself or these people don't want to support our veterans I don't want that to be the sound bite I want to honor and support our veterans but is this is this the right location is it's the right design and and a lot of those issues seem to not be necessarily nailed down um I heard from citizens that participated in the public Outreach for the plan that said I was there I didn't ever hear this being brought up so where did this come from that that attended multiple CRA meetings for when the plan was being developed so I think that there needs to be I think that there needs to be more public input on this as to its location as to its design and so forth before we just give a a cart Blan you know approval to to stick something down there I'm going to let these two go next okay um questions real quick about the then I'll get to location but in the issue overview on the agenda form uh Josh you have um if the site is approved the city would provide oversight maintenance and sustainability however the CRA would take the lead on the Improvement so my question mob you probably uh answer this between you and Josh I guess maintenance I get right you're going to pay the cost of of doing C that that sustainability thing is kind of a wide open thing to me I don't I don't know what is involved with sustainability if that includes replacing bricks that get broken or or papers or whatever with the engraving or so what would that look like sustainability that you have in your mind um of this Memorial yes I just and had spoke about this um as representative of the city and how we're going to maintain this yes we we brought those those concerns up questions up um it seems to me that CRA is going to put it down and pay for it and then that's going to be handed over to the city to maintain and operate um I mean if the CRA wants to maintain operate for the life of its existence and then turn it over that's totally up to that board I would assume um but yeah those are considerations I'm taking into account is maintenance of the facilities the maintenance of the part the Labyrinth itself we put polls flag poles who takes them up and down who Landscapes and so um I think the public input is going to be crucial Josh just doing it to come back to us because what they recommend and what you approve or don't approve is going to alter how we maintain that what it cost to the city to do that was just just a question about that sustainability I just wasn't sure what that was and for the record I I am in favor of the Veterans Memorial 100% as well um we just need to take a look at the location I just want to push back on one comment that was made there um coming to the council and and saying that it's a courtesy to come to us because we're going to put it at that corner I have a problem with that you basically just said it was a courtesy call I support the CRA I support the project but I have a problem when just because it's in your plan you think you can come to us and say it's a courtesy that you're here I think this needs to stop it's happened at the VCC it's happened here it's happened with your own committee so please let's focus on the memorial and don't say that you're here is a courtesy do uh please Dan so the motion is are we going to go forward with a workshop considering plans moving forward um looking at all aspects it sounds like to me we're getting kind of caught up in the weeds this is the kind of stuff you talk about at a workshop uh when you iron all this out and all all we're doing is asking you to approve going forward with the planning architectural bathrooms parking everything that goes with it they just want the green light to go forward and get the ball rolling right that's all they want understand so Mr Mayor go ahead it it says right here in the brief summary the CRA is requesting permission from the council to move forward with the design development for this pro project at the proposed location and I don't know that there's unanimous consent on where the proposed location would be right now I mean I mean just speaking to other people understand Dr Henderson I I've sat there and watched the CRA meeting that day and I'm all forward but and speaking to a couple of people I don't know that everyone's on the same sheet of music I and all of the letters and sign up the cards and everything I have received no objection to that I have received suggestions related to that that I Incorporated the site um sustainability was considered in terms of the design I presented there's another one like it in Napierville Illinois that's been flooded nine times and it's still there and it's they just hose it off and it goes one of the primary things you have to differentiate is it is in keeping with the sense of the park it is a quiet activity it's walking there's hardly nothing for adults in that Park um I don't know um could I answer any specific question that you have about the location it is that the design that you see is suitable for other kinds of activities like weddings plays you know it can be used universally one one of the things you have to consider when you're thinking about um honoring veterans is whether you want to have something you can look at and pass on or something that the public can utilize and remember the veterans that they want to honor they is an opportunity for them to provide or or to purchase bricks which would be on the periphery um and to charge a little bit more for the bricks than they cost so that that would go to the city for any maintenance they had to do and if you glance through the slides every opportunity was taken to say this would probably not be good because it would be too much maintenance for the city you and not fair so you know I'm I'm going to keep saying it because I don't want it to be the sound bite that goes into the newspaper tomorrow but I'm in favor of honoring our veterans I'm in favor of finding and developing them a memorial that they can be proud of that we can be proud of I'm in favor of that but as I stated earlier I've heard from local land owners right there around it that are saying no I didn't sign anything I'm I'm concerned about it in the park in that location uh I have concerns about the sustainability of it I have concerns you it just got brought up that now we're gonna now the city is going to be in charge of selling bricks and maintaining bricks and you know dealing with with ordering bricks as as someone that runs a nonprofit that deals with those kind of bricks that that's got overhead in it too uh when you go to buy bricks five years from now that the person the same person that did it not available you got to match fonts you got to match all this other stuff I think that there's a lot of the more we talk about it the more this thing seems to just kind of steadily grow again I'm in favor of honoring our veterans in with with some sort of Memorial but is it in this location and what does it look like that doesn't seem to be set in stone and locked in at this point B so I'd like to figure out a way to move this forward I'd like to go ahead and let's get it moving I I want to see the design and Analysis and site study happened um because we don't know and we haven't had the public input yet uh I mean we had input for 15 years yeah and I I found in in the in the notes from a previous council meeting about 10 years ago where the council found that the the use for this particular uh suggested location was not in keeping with with the uh with the use of Chipley Park and that was in the minutes that I found online so like I said it was the the minutes were dated roughly about 10 years ago was it was it was a reference I think sometime around 2014 maybe even before Oh with all due respect I was there and the reason they turned it down was because one of the councilmen said that there was an endangered plant in the middle of that Circle there was also a tree which they agreed at the time could be in the center of the Labyrinth and it wouldn't have to be taken down now there's no tree and there never was an endangered plant because I went home and looked it up so um I don't know I all I can do is is present a concept I don't know how it's going to turn out at the end um but it's been around for 15 years and people have been coming to the meetings and and saying that they approved and signing the papers and giving some suggestions that have been Incorporated I was surprised when I went to the veterans and they said they didn't want a section for Navy in a section for Air Force they said we serve together we just want all the bricks in there and I said well how will people who come there to honor you uh know where your brick is and they said it it doesn't matter they think of us they may see it as they walk our children will enjoy it our adults will enjoy it and it won't be just a static Monument for people to look at and pass by but it will be something that will be useful for all the citizens go Miss Mandy did anybody propose any alternate locations that just just hear me out just briefly that that would meet a lot of the topics like um restrooms or facilities ADA compliance and somewhere more importantly that somebody can take that flag down when it's storming really bad or it's going to get damaged I was surprised too that the veterans themselves said that they would like to have removable flags and they would put them up or someone the city would put them up when they had ceremonies or festivals and that the rest of the time they could be stored and the city wouldn't have to put them up and down every day um I was surprised at that I didn't have any Flags in there at all but then I went home and found some pictures of flags and I'm sure that somebody can design a way to for them to be taken up and down um I thought that was very magnanimous of them to think of the uses for the space for other people um any other questions I just want to be respectful of the flag and and the location that like other uses for the location this just my personal opinion if it's a Veterans Memorial it's Veterans Memorial and that's what it's used for and and it it holds a special meaning and it when you sit there in that quiet moment then you feel it but that flag above all here recently I took one down and it was shredded and why is it staying up there how many people have come through who have the responsibility to maintain it for so long they've done nothing but but I took it down get eat up by bees and everything else that didn't bother me as much as seeing that flag Rift and um it goes back to self-pride discipline um pride in our country and what this country stands for so my argument my ask is not derogatory by no means it's not to say no is to say why don't we look at these things much like what council beer bomb saying because I don't want see that's what the additional public meetings are for um I apologize there are things that I know that we didn't think about that the people seeing it didn't think about and it's kind of like um a committee designing the camel you know you don't know exactly how it's going to turn out but um I don't know exactly how the memorial might turn out but this is the appropriate place for it uh one person you asked me did suggest that we put it at we park nobody would ever use it nobody um another person suggested that we put it behind the chiapa building well that's where I want to write a grant for restoring the auditorium and it's in the bright sunlight there are no trees those are the only two suggestions for alternate places that I've had and that I've heard the Wii Park was 10 years ago so anything El I I didn't make the motion in a second but I would ask that there seems to be a consensus among Council here that we we do want to move it forward we do want to honor our veterans but the specific motion as it relates to the specific ask doesn't seem to line up at least with the conversation that that has occurred here at the Das so I would ask those that made the motion in a second to maybe revise the motion in a second to maybe authorize the design study but not lock in the location and to hold additional public workshops to to gain input on this because I've heard from people that have suggested that it go uh in front of the courthouse where the other memorials are existing that that's been suggested to me this week when I when I've been contacted by citizens that are concerned about it Josh would that suit you I'll do whatever the council asked me to do and whatever my board ultimately approves me to do I will say that you know spending money on conceptual design for particular location kind of locks you in to some degree with money as far as making those future improvements or furthering that design so you know I I think that this location was selected based on you know the the many years of input it's remoteness um if the council desires for that Memorial to be relocated somewhere else we can certainly do that um you know we essentially just took this concept included it in our Redevelopment plan as a conceptual plan plan as part of our Capital Improvement projects so it can be moved um but this has kind of been the general consensus as I understand as far as where it would be preferred uh or or where the prefer preference would be for it to be located so it's it's entirely up to council if you guys want to make another recommendation we can we can study that too but each location you know ultimately is going to have different challenges with accessibility and all that so you know I think for me where I was on this ask is to try to narrow it down get a very rough conceptual design and workshop it get get some input from the folks that maybe are are approaching councilman beer bomb or approaching other council members and let them have some input and you know if they show up and understand that you know well I didn't think about that or I didn't know that and they changed their mind great if not then you know so be that and I can bring all that back with the general consensus of what you know that Workshop resulted in but you know at the end of the day this is what was put in our plan can it be changed of course but that how kind of got there so I actually saw the presentation uh by Dr Henderson and I'm the one that made the motion so respectfully I'm just going to leave my motion as is I'm not gonna ma' I was approached by U members of the black community telling me that they had some money for a Veterans Memorial that's what they wanted they had no land and they didn't have enough money and I said if you let me think about it maybe I can come up with something this was presented to Reverend brus it was presented to Doris um Johnson uh it's been presented to several other people I don't think they would be comfortable going to the courthouse where there's a Confederate Memorial right there in their face I'm sorry yeah that be a point yes so councilwoman Hein so as part of the you beginning of a design process and Analysis of the site is is the first thing you do and that's actually what you do is you you evaluate whether it's a good site or not um or if there's a better site and you know my concerns are access are long-term maintenance uh you know there's concerns so and I think it's legitimate and I don't think that this has really gone to people who aren't aware of it I mean there's a lot of people me rephrase it I think there's a lot of people that aren't aware of it they've had no input on this at all they don't know anything about it and they're finding out about it for the first time so I I would just say if we could just limit it uh just to you know again it's not just a feasibility study that's a lowc cost ask maybe the concern might be at that point that it's too low cost that they won't be able to get people to actually you know want to do it or bid on it you know that might be a concern but um but I think I think we're going to hear about it if we don't uh do a little bit of study here and all I'm asking for is a little bit of guardrail to help with that so we can move this forward because I want to move this forward I want this to go forward and and I do too and I appreciate what you're saying I'm just saying 15 years is a long time that this has been talked about it's you know I don't agree with everything that was in that CRA booklet but I know that was in there and I've you know read about it and and you know that location has always been in that book so I'm saying I'm okay with whatever we decide I wanted to go for it I'd like to see it right there in that particular location myself personally um but um if you want to withdraw your second I understand I'm not I'm not against that Mr Mayor you know maybe the uh I I love the Labyrinth idea it's it's a it's a flat Memorial uh doesn't obstruct the view of the lake or any of those sorts of things you know I have concerns about additional buildings uh in in the lakeyard and and the maintenance with with that but some some things are necessary if we decide this particular location but and that's maybe where the public input would come in what people think about additional buildings a shelter restrooms am I correct in that you're looking at a shelter and rest that will be proposed as part of the conceptual plant two separate uh structures yes ma'am if the bo yeah if the board approves it then yes we to pay for it in the construction perhaps the city gives the c a million doll okay we have a motion to second on floor any last questions have a question yeah so clay so what is you know the courtesy aside of the C showing up um what is the actual process are we actually going to get another round at this and approving a location or not because I've heard from Mr irvan that uh it's in their plan so they they can not just do it but that's where it's going to go right that's based on what you've heard my understanding was the design would come back it seemed like council's discussion was they wanted to consider alternative locations they're telling you this is the location if approved as it is now this is where it's going that's the legal effect of the motion I will withdraw my motion I Willer probably it's your second I'll withdraw my second sorry all right so mayor at this time you have to ask is there any other second yes all right any other motions here for any other second second the motion I'd like to offer a substitute motion well that motion dies for like a second i' like to make a motion Mr Mayor go ahead I like to make a motion that that we move forward but not with the location that's there I think we need to go back to that public Workshop just like what councilman Val's saying to where it's a joint session and I think you need to have more people's input on the location given the concerns because the people that were talking to me the past few weeks they're not here right now and I give credit to the ones who are but I'm one of those too and so is the mayor and I would just like to have some more concern other than people just saying that it's got to be this way or it can't be at all I don't think that's right I think it's a lot like this Finance director position and different stances we've had on other things let's get it right I'll second the motion all have motion second and and the motion so that we'll hold a joint workshop and then we'll move forward with move forward but to hold a joint Workshop regarding location yes sir we will that the city will have the the workshop or the with the coun with the c okay okay any other questions all in favor to say i i n all right I all Carrie and got another one to work in there all right okay we'll take yeah that Memorial well you know you got to realize this a lot of people have U you know put their heart and soul in this thing for a long long time and U so I'm hoping that the council's going to take the lead role on this they better put their heart and soul into it and Mr Mayor I just want to be clear so everyone understands we've blessed moving ahead all we're saying is there might be another location we're not not saying there definitely will be in different location all we've said is we we've heard from several people already and we like everyone to be heard yeah well I understand that that works you know there's a lot of things that we move forward on that we don't include everybody but this one we I guess we're going to you know what I'm saying we do a lot of things that we don't really bring up to say well a lot of people don't really know about this don't like them we move on stuff every month on stuff that people don't know about and may not like uh this is something that's not new but either way you you made a motion uh did we vote Yes sir sir so so we we'll take it off at a later date and U and so we'll move on to Citizen comments which most of them just W left the room but we'll open the floor for citizen comments uh you come please state your name have three minutes and uh you're welcome you're welcome okay all right we'll close the floor for comments and we will uh play you got any yes sir okay and um KOB just want a quick comment mayor uh staff transportation department has paved the uh two parking lots in Florence Park um the one on the I guess should be the north side and repay the one along elsur they did a very good job we appreciate them doing that and so that I believe brought four they made four Ada parking spots between those two and the number of regular parking spots so that has been completed and uh we're moving forward with other projects the solar bench we're waiting staff is getting a a truck of concrete together so we're getting a number of projects to the city and that'll be done as well to be cost effective so moving forward with the park any questions for the rer all right then we will go to Mr okay sure no none sir n sir all right well we I just want to give you heads up since we're all jumping on Military I'm so excited uh I did go to the Ranger camp today uh which is way out probably Clos to Milton his CH but anyway um on Veterans Day we had talked about doing something really exciting we had the the VFW and amet Dav the whole game they said you know you guys are treating my Veterans Day way too much like my mother day now we're come be playing Taps the whole time we're there and really best day is more of a celebratory time and so we're going to pretty good links to change that and U and so one of the guys that has been a ranger he suggested we go there and see if they might come and conduct something on site which I have to come back you guys for permission to do but uh but when we went over there uh he was kind of like giving excuses why they couldn't come and then we I sort of shared with him about you know the town here and how we have a great appreciation for the military and some of the things that are coming up that are going to be very advantageous veterans and that type of thing and so the time we got done this lieutenant colonel was ready to he said we might be able to do a ground operation and then uh then by the time he got done he said but I think we can bring some of our oer team over here we might even be able to drop some people in PE sh in the middle of that Lake you know so anyway he is going to get all those questions answered over the next week or two and I'll bring it back to you guys see but we may have a very involved Veterans Day this year and uh and so hopefully I'll have some good news bring back maybe I doubt it be the next meeting but certainly in the next month so anyway with that um like say we had a great senior citizen day y'all be sure and I tell you what I did share with them and some of you might have been there to hear it but I said you know one of the things that I really am sad that I did not ask a lot of questions my parents and they were still with me you know and and many others uh about history you know when I came in City Pac as a mayor in 2013 you know I I told everybody I loved our history but I didn't know L about our history and uh but it didn't take about six months for man just this love this community just enveloped me and uh and I have been you know and I've got a lot of Ken folks that have been in government both city government state government all around you know and I'm learning a lot about them but there's not anybody to ask so I'm just telling you if your parents are still around you know get the information from them friends whatever you can because it just gets buried with them you know and it's gone uh take advantage of our senior citizens and those that have information that could be a blessing to you and to your children grandchildren whatever and so that's my admonition and so we'll call this meeting the dur thank you