e e e even everyone I hope everyone has had a wonderful Fourth of July weekend and getting back to it it is 6:00 July 8th and I call this meeting to order up first is going to be the invocation by our one and only Steve Ferris from the First Baptist Church of dtin well father we come before you thanking you for this great nation thanking you Lord for all those people that made sacrifices as we finish up this Fourth of July Lord let us never remember or never forget all those who gave their lives and what this country stands for Lord I Thank you for these people that will work in government Lord as a part of this nation locally Lord it all starts here and and so father we thank you for those who giving their time and their energy here Lord I just pray that you will guide us and help us in all that we do and again we thank you for this city we thank you for the people here and Lord we just ask for your grace and blessings and thank you so much because youve blessed us more than any nation and we give you the praise in Jesus name amen amen all right thank you for that councilwoman abar with the pledge please and as right before we get going I'm just going to do a little housekeeping and if everyone could please turn off or silence your cell phones vibrate anything but noise that would be greatly appreciated thank you all right so up first I will entertain a motion for the approval of the agenda I'll make that motion I have a motion by councilwoman AAR second second by councilman Bagby I got to change if I can add it real quick come on in um I'd like to put under my name um Rua representation Rua representation all right first and second are you okay with that Amendment all right seeing no further discussions calling the vote Ray or Ray's calling the vote oh okay we're going to do a roll call while everyone gets it gets back the on their laptop I guess all right John down the roll yes yes yes yes yes yes yes all right sounds good motion approves unanimously with the one Amendment um if anyone's got it issues while I'm doing the proclamation Andy I think this is going to be your time to shine all right we have a few of us every Proclamation is a good one but the park foundation and the park and rec crew is uh is close to my heart so thank you guys going on in here all right city of Destin Proclamation Parks and Recreation month whereas parks and Recreation programs are an integral part of communities throughout the country including the city of dtin and whereas our Parks and Recreation are vital are vitally important to establishing and maintaining the quality of life in our communities ensuring the health of all citizens go figure and contributing to the economic and environmental well-being of a community and region and whereas Parks and Recreation programs build healthy active communities that Aid in the prevention of chronic diseases provide therapeutic recreation services for those who are mentally or physically disabled and improve the mental and emotional health of all citizens and whereas Parks and Recreation programs increase the community's economic Prosperity through increased property values expansion of the local tax base increased tourism and attraction and retention of businesses and crime reduction and whereas Parks and Recreation areas are fundamental to the environmental well-being of our community and whereas has parks and National Recreation natural n natural National Treasure National Recreation areas improve water quality protect groundwater prevent flooding improve quality of the air we breathe provide vegetation buffers to development and produce habitat for wildlife and whereas our parks and natural Recreations areas ensure the ecological Beauty to our community and provide a place for children and adults to connect with na nature and recreate outdoors and whereas the US House of Representatives have designated July 2024 as Parks and Recreation month and whereas the city of dtin recognizes the benefits derived from parks and recreation resources now therefore be it proclaimed that I Bobby mayor Bobby Wagner on behalf of the city of dtin and its council do hereby designate the month of July 2024 as Parks and Recreation month in the city of dtin we call upon Parks and Recreation supporters to join us in recognizing this important the importance of our nation and national parks as well as our local parks here as we recreate so you guys have something or would you have something all right two members of our par Recreation all right we take a photo first and then I'll awesome and thank you guys so much for volunteering in our committees these are both uh committee members of our parks and wreck Foundation or Foundation our parks and W committee uh so if you guys online anyone here in the audience have any good ideas things that we're missing in the Parks things that we might have forgotten or missed at our Parks it all starts with our committees they are the engine and then we just get to vote about it later up here at the Das so thank you guys for always volunteering and and putting our parks and people first I just want to say this is generational this isna say oh nice so why did you get on Parks and wreck I'm just kid all right well thank you guys so much all right at this time we're going to start the public comments anyone here has three minutes uh to talk about anything other than what is going to be on the public hearing which is 5 a and 5B there'll be an individual portion for public comments on those individual topics outside of those 5A and 5B the floor is yours for three minutes so I'm going to start on my right y'all's left and just kind of first come first serve give me a wave and step on up all right I got one all we need is your name and address and we will start the clock I will give you a 30 second warning and a 5sec cut off thank you mayor I need a shot clock Ken Wampler uh 4320 Commons Drive West um I'm here to talk about agenda item four b as in Bobby um and as you can imagine obviously one of the things that I want to talk about today is really twofold there's a lot of folds to the St registration and actually in the staff report it also refers to it as a public safety impact fee or something along the lines so it's a little misleading as to what the staff is proposing but I think fundamentally understand kind of where it's coming from uh condominium Owners Association unlike homeowners association actually provide all those services for the condominiums on the properties they do the security they do the beach service they do the trash they do the policing they do the noise they do the parking they do everything on the condom minim Owners Association so one of the things that I've heard is that some condo owners residents or or or whatever whatever they're referred to is overwhelming The Code Department with the number of phone calls and I will tell you as a business owner we get all kinds of calls we can't control who actually calls the number some to some extent kudos to the code enforcement department kudos to City Council in the city for actually promoting that as a service but there's nothing that the association won't do to instill the peaceful enjoyment of every condominium resident owner or tenant and so the fact that they're calling should justify a need to increase whatever fee or tax that you want to call it at the end of the day condomini Owners Association takes care of all those services so at the at the fundamental reason for 718 statute 718 which controls all condominium Owners Association they're responsible that Association is responsible for all of that stuff and so for the city to feel like it's your responsibility to interject yourselves or whatever services that you you feel like the city must provide is frustrating to say the least it really it really is and you know you know you have a tough job with the staff has a tough job as to balancing all the wants and needs of all the residents but at the end end of all the story there's 4700 owners that bought their condos at some point and I think we've all been here long enough to know that the real estate values have changed I know they've changed significantly since I've moved here ADV valorum tax ADV valorum tax the the basis reason for ADV valorum tax is for Public Safety and services provided by the municipality in the municipality if you go to condo X Y and Z that's in the city limits what does the city truly provide Destin Waters is this whole separate thing so they don't provide utility florid power or whatever they call themselves today sorry I apologize you know they they provide the utilities and as a matter of fact I think the city gets some sort of tax fee off that if it's tourism related they're occupied a 100 days out of the year so a third of the time that the rest of us that live here full-time are actually occupying our homes and they're paying more because property taxes obviously go up each year adum tax goes up each year so I just don't understand why you think there's a reason for the city to interject themselves into condominium Owners Association Management and services one of the things that I did here is well it's stress that it the occupants provide on this on the city businesses well that's a whole separate issue that's a whole separate issue kudos to us for being successful that the businesses are really busy that's a good thing right it's a bad thing when it comes to Highway 98 and all the other things but you're not providing services at the condominium so I struggle with why this even makes sense thank you for your time right thank you Ken yes sir name and address yes loo Maldonado 1040 Highway 98 East um been in the industry here hey Jim uh for over 30 plus years and uh the thing that's troubling for me about just another new tax levy on the ownership group vacation rentals this is a tourism area like it love it hate it but most of us got here via tourism seems like every time we we get a new invoice or a bill we just figure out a way to either charge the tourist or charge the owners who own the condos that are here or the homes that use them for tourism uh and I just think that's that's just fundamentally a mistake tourism in the State of Florida generates over 25% of the general fund we are all involved in tourism if you work at a gas station if you work at Walmart you work on the North End of the County south end of the county this is where our you know people actually work in our businesses live we are all covering the debt of of tourism in this area but it seems like the owners and the tourists get saddled with the biggest expense as Ken just pointed out the advalorium taxes that all of our owners in the condos already pay cover services that they don't even participate in like schools and Roads and other things that are that are already Associated that again they don't burden and for the 100 days that those units are occupied there's a bed tax that's collected this year almost $3 million that is an extra tax paid for by the tourists are actually getting the you know reaping the benefits here in the municipalities that's 10% of the tourism tax that's that's again so to me this seems like it's just another way to double tax owners who are absentee maybe it's because they don't vote I don't know but we have got to stop dipping in the pocket of tourists and the owners who provide you know the lodging for those tourists every time we got to figure out something else to fund I just don't think double taxation on these owners is a good idea thank you so much and we appreciate the the hard work and efforts that you guys put in on all of our behalfs appreciate you thank you sir all right middle Far Right Far yep go ahead yes good afternoon my name is Robert I live at Robert Marill living at 712 Harbor Lane here in dtin um been using the Joe's by you boat ramp for almost all my life um and obviously this past weekend was a bit troubling but the issues that I've seen that I kind of want to talk about tonight was expanding over a period of years not so much on Fourth of July weekend um mainly um it's the wild West down there essentially um my issues that I have you know as I was coming up I became a father have children um I've seen fights break out down there I've seen you know vulgar language I've seen crashes I've seen boat sinking I've seen fires I've seen it all down there U throughout my years um my trailer's been hit a couple times uh I've had to I've had the fuel stolen out of my truck parked in that adjacent lot um so really kind of what cultivated me to come in tonight was we had an incident this past weekend where you know you got two types of people that use the boat ramp you got the people that come in um like myself who I launch my own boat and I go park my truck and when I come back I have to pull the boat up to the dock go get my truck and then get my boat then you have the people that pull up in on a boat drop somebody off to go get a vehicle and then come back you got a big problem there right who's first How does it go there's no organization and for me as a you know as a resident I pull up in there there's a guy taking attendant taking money you know he'll take a fee U which I know both of them they're great guys love them to death um but then it's take the money and they're gone after that it's game over like it it's the wild west down there who's coming first you got people parking pulling up in cars uh and then in the afternoon there's nobody there to help them when they come back 70 80% of them are intoxicated uh and it's bad real bad to the point where my 9-year-old son and my 13-year-old daughter were getting cussed out by some other gentleman that felt like he had the right to be there before us um whether it was right or wrong it was just a matter of his perspective versus our perspective and if we had somebody that would stay there at least till a certain period of hours we have fireworks display going on at Thursday we know there's people bringing their boats back we need to have somebody down there either be a code enforcement or somebody down there say you know what you this is your turn you go in here go to slip three slip four slip five whatever it may be uh and then that way when somebody pulls their boat up and drops somebody off they can say hey I'm getting my boat and then the next guy that shows up the attendant can regulate things a little bit um you know this has been something that's been going on for years um and I feel like with the next evolution of of evolvement that we're pi fixing to do with that boat ramp we really need to seriously consider um having some sort of enforcement um going into that uh and to kind of back that up um I've messaged you before on Facebook and we've kind of talked briefly about you know some of the things that we could do differently um you know main like boat flushing stations for people to utilize because right now they're paying a fee and their fee is just dropping off and that's it so um I just want to bring that up to you guys and let you know that there's a big issue there um and I appreciate your public service all right thank you Robert thanks for being here y welome hello hey name and address and take away my name is Britney zerel and this is my husband Samson Thomas and we live at 61 Coco Mo row I'm going to read from here so um we are the owners of Thomas Island ice cream we have recently filed and was granted a restraining order against the owner employees of rainbow Frost ice cream the local ice cream truck company here in Destin we have been harassed stalked threatened followed filmed and almost ran over and forced out of our property they have filed multiple false reports and constantly call code on enforcement on us daily we do not feel safe and we cannot sleep at night over fears of what this family might do I am 5 months pregnant and the stress that rainbow Frost ice cream is causing has been unimaginable we feel extremely violated our privacy and life have been threatened I'm scared to even walk outside due to the death threats and stalking against me my family my co-workers and my business I've had to call law enforcement multiple times and now have a restraining order to protect my family from this extreme emotional distress and potential life-threatening situation last week they broke the restraining order in law enforcement was called once again this family's out to destroy and stop my business no matter what it takes they have made it clear that my business is preventing them from making money they have invaded my privacy and sense of security and I'm at fear for my life no one should have to live in fear in their own place of residence and work I started this business for my love of Destin in the beach my only intentions are to better Destin in the community I believe every business has the right to operate in peace and Harmony and I hope that you can see my business is only here to bring good to the community and those who visit thank you for listening to my concern and I hope you can understand exactly what I've been going through these last two months thank you so much for being here it's man good evening my name is Louisa Baldock at address is 3016 Scenic Highway 98 number 209 I just wanted to Second um what Ken and um owner of a vacation rental business as well um they've really covered a lot of things one thing I also wanted to reiterate something that owners are also facing now is the HOAs especially are seeing a much higher insurance cost everybody's HOA dues are nearly doubling right now so if you're looking at even purchasing units these are things that they're looking at I just don't want the city of dtin having enough fee attached to these owners when things are already down they're getting higher Insurance rents are about 5% Downer occupancy this year we're already looking at a bunch of different factors and things are changing you know our covid boom was was here now we have you know a lot more inventory so when owners are purchasing and real estate's down and changing I just want you to know that there's a lot going into these real estate sales and I just don't want another fee to be attached to these condominium purchases right now that's already struggling so thank you guys so for all you do thank you right anyone else right seeing none oh yep go ahead sorry hello Carrie harbarger rainbow Frost ice cream 307 Mountain Drive I want to do a rebuttal to what was just said about the company first I want to say that the company that just spoke out doesn't have a permit to work in Destin they were denied a permit and ever since they were denied a permit it's been attacking our company uh we my son does have an injunction on him and he can't come up here and speak for himself and it's unfortunate because our code compliant had gotten involved and apparently they don't understand the rules and allow told them verbally they could do it but when they come up to City Hall they can't get a permit there's a reason why we make people come to City Hall to get permitted if you can get permitted and you have the proper stuff you can get it permitted Code Compliance doesn't have the right to permit you verbally so when we complained numerous times we were asked to I have it in a in emails we were asked to take pictures and videos then Code Compliance goes over there and tells them that if they see us over there taking pictures and videos to call the law and put injunctions we have it all documented Code Compliance PL both sides of this fence and it's not right because they're not legitimately entitled to do business and furthermore last meeting Golf Stream Ice Cream came up here and they complained about us and furthermore nobody's ever been allowed to work the beach as a Destin guys I got a $500 fine because I pulled the buggy to prove a point I got the $500 fine and there was five carts on the beach that day they waved at him as a matter of fact the Thomas' ice cream is the one who called they're not permitted they've been told no and I also have you know GF stream wanted to talk about how they had want to be grandfathered you don't owe them anything they were never entitled to work any beaches and furthermore the pre-owner to them sued Walton County for the rights to keep their feet wet and lost in a federal court and I've forwarded that court case over to you this Department of Environmental Protection that was written in 2016 partnered with the city of dtin they can say keep your feet wet all they want but there's just no soliciting this document was designed to prevent that you know the state water and I'm in city water and I'm it's so ridiculous so if the council is going to decide that this is the Avenue that we want to do I'm all game because I would love to create more business but I really think it's not the look Destin wants because if they're going to do it on the beach then I'm going to be there with hot dogs and send suntan oil and I'll have you know I bought my luggage on the beach in Venezuela let's do it it's not what we want that's why we didn't permit them that's why we have rules and regulations they they're working out of their house at 61 cooko we've argued about that they're saying they can Warehouse there and run their total business carts and all that's what we documented for code complaints they show us we did we get the injunctions that's not okay so what I'm asking the council is to clarify what's going going to go on and and please I want to ask the City attorney if she knows if there's been any changes to any of the codes of ordinances maybe since 2010 if I can address the City attorney I mean do you know if there's been any change of ordin prob so we have it on on record well I will say no just to say I can answer that because I've final thought if if my reaches research is correct so while G stream steps up here wants a grandfather status it was never allowed anyway guys have been doing this for 30 years if it was allowed I would have done it Kelly Gates I tried it I bought Hawking bags Kelly Gates and David basac said you can't do it Carrie that was 20 years ago Kelly Gates will come up here and testify to that if I need her to we don't Hawk the beaches thank you right yes uh oh sorry I pointed up put you both good evening honor and privilege to be speaking in front of you guys uh Kyle Coleman the owner of Gulf Stream Ice Cream 669 St Lucia Cove for 25 years we've had the privilege of being on the beach selling ice cream to the tourist of Destin while selling ice cream may be a transactional on paper the true value is much more more much more to that of course at the end of the day I have my family to provide for and I thank God that Gulf Stream has allowed me the opportunity to do that but the best part of Gulf Stream is how we serve the visitors in the beaches what a joy it's been over the years to really have the opportunity to be the best part of some of our visitors vacation be just that extra touch that's made over a million visitors trips to have much more special it's awesome to see every age group from kids parents to grandparents enjoying the spectacle as they hear the ice cream music where's it at oh there's a boat oh ice cream everybody's excited it's a great thing we've also been able to develop some lifelong friendships relationships on the beach where people enjoy the ice cream year after year after year and they look forward to our boats every day every year I'm not here to talk about ice cream though prior my priority is that everyone is smiling from code enforcement business owners to the wonderful tourists of our beaches I believe as frustrating as the issue is is all the rising vendors of the beach and all the activity we have an opportunity to find a solution that's a win-win situation for everybody I propose the city takes into consideration expanding the current permit system not just for food and beverage but to also allow bonfires and other services that would enhance the experience of our tourists the system would in tell a regulation and dispersement of vendor permits along with guidelines to abide by Revenue would be generated for the city of dtin and with such funds other services would benefit from this influx whether it be lifeguards first responder training additional code officers whatever the city desires but the truth is the magic is not all in the numbers the perit allows you to build relationships with the business owners on the beach it allows you to be aware of all the business beach activities and to ensure when activities are conducted they're conducted to your standards no more arguing about the rules of the code with business owners instead agreed upon guidelines where the rules are clearly understood by both sides as well as the barrier of Entry to become a vendor will protect the city and vendors from unauthorized vendors jeopardizing the Integrity of the city through malpractice and harmful play like I said at the end of the day I want everybody to be smiling all right whether it be us business owners to the guest to the city all right uh by implementing this permit system it can reduce headaches and produce some revenue for the city uh as a vendor we are not your enemy are we your foe we have the same goal in mind and that is to enhance the experience of the people that are visiting Destin I encourage the city to consider updating or making changes to the current permit system to allow us to serve our guests thank you for your time thank you so much all right yes ma'am good evening I am Becky Pritchard 145 Timber Court and I am here to stir the helicopter pot um again I think um I I have been up here several times to discuss this I know that there's situa it's a situation that is difficult um I should not wish for anybody to not have a business but if I had my brothers I wish they did not have one here however I would be willing to compromise on something that is not what's happening right now it's just getting worse and worse every time you know we it es and flows there's an agreement and then it's okay for a while and then it's like right now it's like chaos out there to me I don't know if y'all are outside a lot or not but there's nowhere to go to get away from it now you know used to be you heard it at the beach or I live by the airport so I hear them very low over my house I think they're way too low um I have called them on the phone told them cut it out I have sent messages to y'all I've sent messages to the County Commissioners and I realize it's a FAA situation but I think there has to be something we can do because it's just not okay what they're doing right now um you can't go anywhere and get away from it it's at Calhoun Park go to shopping at Home Depot you can't talk to the person you're buying flowers with I mean it's just they're all over the place and I I think it honestly is a bad look to a degree for y'all because I think most people think that y'all are just ignoring it and letting them do whatever they want because most people don't know that Destin city council is not the ones that determine what they do so um and you can't tell everybody By Word of Mouth no it's not the council you know the commiss county owns the airport and try to tell the whole history so um anyway I am hoping that we can do some sort of I don't know what but I just know something has to happen and I'm asking y'all to help us uh I know Crystal Beach is crazy holiday aisle is crazy and us on the North End of Main Street are crazy also so I appreciate it right thank you so much for your time thanks for being here yes hi I'm Jan Lucas and I live at 707 Main Street I'm here for the same reason we built a house six years ago we knew we were building by there airport but we found a really nice little lot and we love it we knew there were going to be planes and the planes are no problem some of them are a little loud you know when they leave but the helicopters every four minutes sometimes sometimes five minutes when you're running a $59 special for a 8 minute ride and they got four helicopters and they're so low sometimes I got videos lots of videos I get tired of videoing it I'm sitting in my chair and I'm looking up and I'm looking down looking at people looking down at me it's ridiculous I mean we go to Fort Walton to go to the beach mainly because there's not much access here but there's no helicopters if they are they're the big ones that the guys are fighting for our country but you know I don't want to put anybody out of business but there's you can watch their flights you know you can watch them and they're just going around in circles and they're coming back and they're coming back and they're coming back my husband and I can't even talk outside you have to stop some for the Jets too but they're gone you know they leave and one comes in and another one comes in another one comes around and when they're coming down right below your house and I know you know you may not be home all day like I am but you oh me too you know and I have a big privacy fence for a reason if they see something they're not supposed to see I'm sorry but you know I got a privacy fence for a reason I like to water but anyway we need help and I know the council I've read all about it it's through the county and through its FAA but we're ready to do something and we're in Marino acres and we really weren't really prepared at this point but we're getting there and we need your help if we can get it but it's it's really annoying and like I said we don't want to put anybody out of business but they need to find better routes and and I saw something in the Dustin log a quote from the owner we never fly over residential homes this was a few years ago well you know what I got proof and so does a lot of other people people I'm tired of videoing my eyecloud is full anyway thank you thank you so much for being here all right anyone else yes sir my name is Ronnie Mapes I'm the owner of catch22 beat service U main location is 15,000 Emerald Coast Parkway silver shells Resort uh been in Industry 29 years been permanent Ed uh Bay County Walton County and Okaloosa chose to call Okaloosa my home for my business I've been here now nine years um I have no dog in this fight but I'm here to represent these ice cream vendors uh I've been watching I'm on the beach every day 12 hours a day and I've noticed a big change in that I'm all for regulation of Permitting I'm regulating myself um I currently like the permit process uh I think there needs to be a step in on that to kind of control it um I'm also here to mention the reinstatement of uh Beach bonfires uh a lot of money in that a lot of my friends make a living out of it it was shut down a couple of years ago uh it would generate quite a bit it can also be regulated uh open to all vendors um it's something that I've seen uh definitely disappoint some people I've had to turn down a lot I send it you know everybody back to Walton County we have factual numbers coming out of Walton County that are crazy there's a reason why the code enforcement officers get paid a lot more than these do um speaking with the code guys and seeing so much change over you know I've outlasted all your code people you know um you gota you got to have some regulation before stuff gets out of hand I can see it again I have no dog in the fight I think opening up categories of uh permitting you know everything from snow cones to you know county line to County Line I know you got the harbor and all that but uh you know I'm just here to think that you know going forward I wanted to plant the seed about the bonfires and uh permitting for all vendors you know if they follow the regulations and rules and you know control you know there's only five permits it's only five permits um you know you can't have aund vendors on one Beach just a GNA work um that's kind of all I wanted to say again I didn't have a dog in the fight but I wanted to show up here today to let y'all know that uh I'm paying attention to everything so I appreciate y'all hearing me out today and uh thank you all right question Mr Mayor can you talk to him after sure I want to keep this rolling anyone else all right seeing none we're going to close the public comments I need to make a public record with Ray if you don't mind before we go too far okay yep uh and I realized Ken Wampler is a pillar of this community but he used an address that Seaglass Apartments I checked okoa county uh property appraiser I don't show an address for Kim Wampler in okoa County Walton County shows uh him as a resident so just to verify Integrity um of of the the record I wanted to bring that point up okay all right moving on to the consent agenda all right do I have a motion for the consent agenda make a motion to approve as is motion is second you have for discussion button mayor if we could could we pull D just so we can discuss it D or D D D D is in dog dog all right motion second is that okay yes it is all right we're going to do consent agenda polling D for discussion do I Ray call the vote oh we can vote now I think yeah mine pulled up okay you guys the vote not pulled up your did you over here set this up us they set it up now screw it up open yeah mine's open I'm just trying okay well mayor unfortunately I have disabled myself here hang on all right now you can vote out you want to pH no going down I think we're good did we vote already no we got to lock in we're waiting on you to lock it in okay yeah want green double click it come on Mr dtin if you can tell me how you I can vote for you yeah I'm voting yes on the motion yes yes Andy you want to see what's going on there all right okay all right for the other six we'll keep rolling all right I have it for a everything but d uh ccil mtin do you want to start the discussion since you pulled yeah just just a brief discussion when when I went through my uh discussion with the Consultants that are doing the Town Center they had a whole section on anticipation of what we needed in the future how many more square feet for each thing and they had a section on recreational needs with a projection of square feet my question is are we paying two Consultants to do the same thing because it sounds like we're about to go out to bid again to do what it appears they're doing U you know I would be satisfied to have the city manager talk to talk to them and clarify what they're going to do and if it cost a little more but I hate to hire two Consultants to do the same thing good evening mayor and council members uh the two efforts are different um the effort that the SRS uh Team is doing uh as you know is to primarily select where we're going to put our city hall um over the years that we are planning on it uh the effort as far as the uh master plan is concerned is programming the activities of the um um Parks and Recreation looking at our population projections uh what their needs are and also what over time where the maintenance programs will be uh for the programs that they have and so those are two different uh elements uh that are being studied that explanation is partially good I will go forward to let you look at it but I still looks to me like we're paying two people and and even if they the second consultant would do more detail I don't know why we would go through the process and not contact them and maybe that will be part of the request for proposal that someone that's already working on it has already come up with projected how many more square feet we need in Recreation and all the lists that they went over uh wouldn't already be halfway through the job I think this motion is just directing the staff to go out for request correct and I would appreciate if you would contact the folks that are always doing already doing part of this to see if they could uh do economy of scales and not end up paying to to redo what they've already done okay we certainly look at uh if there's any similarities uh we look that that closely and see whether we can uh ensure that one group does that and does not get duplicated with the others point I will move that we approve Rd I'll second all right motion is second we'll continue to discussion councilman Schmidt thank you Mr Mayor I just wanted to share the similar comments and concerns I had today as well uh not just about SRS but we also had uh Matrix provide a very in-depth analysis of our facilities both these buildings as well as our Parks and Recreation so um I too was a little concerned about paying people to do the same job that we might already have the information uh but I also do think that there is an importance to separate because it's shocking that in the history of city of D we've never had a master parks recreation plan um so so I mean that was shocking to me to hear that but so I do think it's vitally important to get that plan but like you I asked city manager and others to be careful with the RFP because we already have 25% or 35% of this data let's make sure we're using that and not spending the max amount to have it redone again so um I agree right councilman Bagby yeah I think Lewis the Adon is on the office space that's where we're double tapping on these two things and the office space should be SRS and the fields and the parks and the lights and the playgrounds and stuff that ought to be this consultant and I need I think Mr Dustin and Kevin make a a good point we need to deconflict to make sure that in this RFP we're not asking them to relook at some of the same stuff we've already ask SRS to look at so I would just make sure uh and I'm sure we'll get a copy of a updated RFP because one of the things I asked for is I want included at least talking to some of the stakeholders specifically the recreation foundation in the RFB so I would expect to see that uh when they come brief us all right seeing no further discussion uh call the vote Ray he's got to open it all right there you guys go say please all right eyes Havey enly so moved all right consent agenda done all right city manager lisis szi 4 a uh thank you mayor uh the the first item we have for you is a presentation uh about the health care benefits uh for the city employees our HR Director will introduce the uh presenter and uh lead us to discussion good evening mayor and Council we have Mr Mike carway here and he is going to present to you some options that we have moving forward to control our health insurance cost so he's here to um give you some information and then answer any questions that you may have good evening mayor Wagner City Council Members um appreciate you all be letting me be here again tonight uh give you more of a full presentation on uh alternate funding options that you have for your health plan oh check check testing can you hear me can you hear me now I think these are broken too check no check no all right so I think I'm loud enough right okay good deal so anyway thank you again for letting me be here tonight I'm going to give you a quick um explanation on the options of funding your health plan uh right now as we talked about when I was here last time you guys are fully insured right so you're you're paying a premium to the carrier every month regardless of your claims um and that is a fixed cost you guys are spending roughly around $1.6 million annually for your uh health coverage that's total cont contributions not just the city's contributions but also um what the U team members cover for themselves and the dependence that they choose to cover on the plan so um if you could go to the next slide please test test test okay we're good okay so we can uh if you don't mind we can go to the next slide because I want to Breeze through the first few just be mindful of the time and cover really the important parts here um and so if you could hit slide please sorry there's some there's some there's some fluff there's some fluffing about who we are hopefully you guys know who we are but I do think that this slide's important this represents the locations that we're in the uh number of professionals that we have working for us so more importantly about the fourth or fifth uh bullet point down we represent about 500 groups that are self-funded so this is a um an option that we know very very well we have all the tools in place to guide our clients make sure that we have the guard rails up to protect them from any you know um surprises that could come with regards to high cost claims or even aggregate claims throughout the course of the year um so you go to the next slide these are our locations in Florida this will be important as we get to the um upcoming slides um regarding the clients that we represent so if you can move forward to the next one next please okay these are Florida public entity clients this is a mix of our commercial clients and our employee benefits clients which is what we're here to talk to you about today we have some of our clients are fully insured we have some of our clients that are what we call partially self-funded in employee benefit space um so you can see that again we're we're very well experienced with public entity groups next slide please and again next slide okay so healthc care Trend this is the inflation that we are faced with every year when we get through with our renewal September 1st we're immediately going to be 8 to n% behind the eightball when we start out our next year that's medical Trend that's Hospital inflation it's pharmaceutical inflation it's it's physician care inflation it's Imaging all of those things play a part in our health care cost so if we don't if we stay fully insured right we have to count on the insurance companies to help bend that Trend right so if it doesn't bend that Trend and we just play out how our expected claims are supposed to come in then we're going to be looking at8 nine 10% even increases year after year and that compounds over time and when it happens then you're forced to do make plan design changes you uh you're going to have to make a vote whether or not you can put more money money into the pot to cover the increase in cost or the last option which I don't think is the best option is you put more of the pressure on the employee on the team member with higher out-of-pocket expenses and higher premium contributions so by going and exploring an alternate funding option that I'm going to talk about in just a moment uh and again we're just exploring this is not something that we're recommending that you do because we won't have all the facts yet but we can bend that Trend and we can help control cost and we know what's going on within our our plan and I think that's what's important long term to controlling health care cost right so the next slide this is um an important slide because 2010 as you all know the Affordable Care Act passed so from 2010 to 20123 uh you can see how well the insurance companies have done right their stocks have gone up considerably and I've been doing this 37 years and I can tell you right now the fully insured rate the fully insured rates that we're seeing in our market and nationally since the Affordable Care Act passed is not sustainable you're going to have to continue to make plan changes or you're going to have to Pony up more money to keep up with medical inflation it's just going up at a very rapid pace and it's hitting price points where even a 5% increase is a a uh big big uh increase for a group of your size so next slide this is kind of gives you an idea of of companies that are self funded you can see it fluctuates you can see the trend is going up moving to a self-funded uh platform next please this gives you an idea you guys are the 50 to 199 about 20% of the groups are are partially self-funded in this space 200 as the groups get larger um sell funding become becomes more and more dominant for those accounts because they want to have more control over their care prior to the Affordable Care Act really prior to 2014 we wouldn't even be having this conversation with you about going to a partially self-funded or a level funded plan right it just a it wasn't an option and uh B most most companies didn't have an appetite for so now the carriers United Healthcare Blue Cross Etna which are the three players that we have in our Marketplace that's the only options we have guys is that they've even come out with a partially self-funded plan what's really called level funded so it walks and talks and feels like a partially self-funded plan but the risk to the group is still mitigated uh by the level funding concept behind it so I'll speak on that just a moment next slide please okay and again one uh slide please so right now you guys are renting right you're paying a fixed cost you can't make any changes to the plan design um it's maintenance free though that's kind of a theory behind it everybody thinks partially self funded requires a lot of man Manpower and human capital investment it really doesn't um and typically uh they're less expensive on the short end that's one of the reasons behind it because you don't have to put that human capital involved in it uh but again your team would have our full support with myself and our service platform and the typically um you know more expensive um uh on the longterm pricing usually goes away right because now we get control of the plan we're building up Surplus and what have you now if we go to a partially self-funded plan now we're going to own the house we can customize it we're going to take control of the plan the money that we're spending in our claims funds going to stay in our bank accounts and we're going to earn interest off of that instead of the insurance company making interest off of that we're not going to pay state taxes on the premiums that we on our claims fund that we pay in which right now we are it runs around 1 .75 to 2 and a half% of the premium that you pay in we're paying taxes on um typically it's it's more expensive in the short term but in the long term it's going to pay dividends for you I've seen this happen time and time again if the plan is managed well and if you'll go to the next slide please and again I'm just really high level one of the things I want to point on here that's never talked about when we when whether it's Blue Cross you not I'm not going to pick on one specific carrier but if you look over there on the self-funded piece and this is becoming a bigger bigger a larger and larger item when we talk about renewals and revenue back to the company but the fourth or fifth bullet down you talk about pbms Pharmacy benefit managers Pharmacy costs represent around 22% of your spend on your health care plan and that's only going to continue to it's going to continue to go up I think by probably 2030 it could outpace hospital and medical expenses Pharmacy cost so what happens is is every time specialy medication is is dispensed at the city of D on your plan Florida Blue gets a rebate by that manufacturer when you go sell funded partially sell funded those rebates come back to the city of Desta again we control the plan we control the claims um and then also we get to retain The Profit what we would call a surplus any claims that's left over that we didn't spend comes back to the city in the form of a surplus any if you go over your expected number or over your max number you're protected with guard rails to where there's no surprises so the next slide will give you a good um example of where we stand today where we stand today and these are rough numers so don't hold me exactly this so 1.6 million is what we're spending in fully insured premium we do our evaluation through a tool called claros analytics plugging in really just your demographics which is your census information gender compos composition and date of birth we plug and we have very limited information of Blue Cross just because they don't provide it to groups of your size um we're coming in with your expected total cost being 1.4 almost $1.5 million so best case scenario or or best case scenario expected cost we're going to save about 100,000 from where we are right now if we had a bad year the rails came off we we had high cting claims you have what's called a risk Corridor and that's where reinsurance comes in for aggregate claims that we have a very high utilized year and we could go to a Max liability of 1.75 that's 25% above your expected cost okay once you get to that number reinsurance comes in and they pay everything above that up to a million bucks right anything over the million dollars would be the responsibility of the city of death okay so I know that sounds scary as heck right but I can tell you that less than 2% of groups that go self-funded ever attach ever go over that 1.75 can it happen absolutely but it's a very small percentage so there is some risk that we will take so if you go to the next slide please how do you protect that how do you mitigate that risk you have two two types of coverage you have specific coverage which is the large water picture that you see on the side on the on the left and then you have the a uh the aggregate protection which is all of your belly buttons that you have insured on the plan so we put your specific uh claim large claim at 75,000 each cup represents 75 grand so if Mike Caraway is on your plan and I have $10,000 in expenses you're going to take that picture of claim water and you're going to pour it in my cup once that cup gets the 75 grand that cup comes off the table and you have no more exposure for that person okay so that's called specific deductible then you have what's called aggregate protection that's a combination accumulation of all your claims throughout the year and once that number gets there then you're done paying claims for the year you have reinsurance that picks up so those are the two guard rails that we put in to eliminate all the surprises that you could have at the city of Des now what we're going to do is we're going to try to gather as much information from Florida Blue that we can in Prior carriers to give to claros analytics we're going to plug that information in and they're going to come back and tell us if you guys are a good candidate to go to a partially self-funded plan that's the that's the goal and the intent behind the US exploring this option um so if you go to the next slide this just gives you a definition again of what those two represent you guys have it in front of you I'm not going to go through that again and then if you'll go to the next slide um again best candidates financially stable employer check you know steady population check you want to have more transparency I want to have more transparency for you all um and we can get that going to this type of a model um and desire to have better uh explain your healthc care delivery if we receive Surplus we bring that back into the city now we can start bringing enhancements into your plan we can really create a comprehensive benefit plan to compete with other cities that surround it or other municipalities and then the last slide I believe if you'll go to the next one we're going to also have the reporting dashboard that we're going to be able to tell you what's going on with preventative care um you know is er being uh over utilized do we need to have a focus on Pharmacy spend next slide additional tools next please and the last thing I want to share with you is just a couple of examples please so uh I represent okalo County School Board much larger group all agree with that $38 million spend been fully insured for 20 years until uh 2023 with United healthc Care um and we moved them to self-funding uh self-funded plan partially self-funded they're not truly self-funded all the things we just talked about are in place and uh their first year we just completed 2023 they had a 9 a. half million doll Surplus so for the last 20 years they've been fully insured they've had some bad years don't get me wrong but the insurance companies have been making a king's Ransom off ok County Schools that's changing and we're able to provide them with a lot of hard data to how we can continue to drive down that cost and every month it just gets better and better Swan count uh Swan County Schools another client of ours um they've been self-funded for about 10 years they're with uh Blue Cross they just moved to United Healthcare again having a a successful uh self-funded plan because it's managed properly and um and that's where you win at in this game it's the Long play we're not going to go to a partially self-funded plan for one year and out that's just not the that's not the appetite to make it work uh um but it's it's certainly something that I'm a huge fan of I've taken Santa Rosa County Schools they're self-funded Bay County Schools they're self-funded it's a great platform that I really think that you all should consider um over the fully insured plan if it's the right fit and our Analytics tool says you guys are a good candidate so there you go that's it questions I know we have some all right thank you so much I don't see any first I'll I'll started off and thank you so much I really enjoy one exploring options thinking outside the box I think my favorite part is that while there is risk the risk then becomes our responsibility to make sure all of us I mean we're one big family if we take care of our family and we become healthier we save money so I love that the responsibility and potential savings come and start and stop with us so I really I think that's excites me that we're not just locked in and it doesn't matter what we do or eat we're paying paying this much but if you know if we're all on the same boat and we're all going the same way we can all be better and get more out of it in in the end like to your point in the long run we could add more if we're all healthier together we can have even more coverage so that to me is amazing so thank you for the presentation got uh thank you for coming in I I think it's um it's it's amazing what you've been able to present to us my quick question is how long do you uh think it'll take for them to run the data go through it and then tell us whether or not we are a good C candidate and when you'd be able to come back and tell us if we should shift that direction do you have a timeline yes if you if you all give me the approval to do that we'll take that data we can have that back in you know the end of end of next week we can have it back in a couple of weeks at the latest and we have to you know and again this is a um an option that you know our renewal is 91 so we're pushing right now for Florida Blue uh to provide our renewal to us and give us their best and final number uh to be able to play that information in because that'll be important to see if this is a good option so we can definitely have it done timely enough to have a 91 change or definitely have enough data to see if this is something we go down in the future all right Council M Schmid yeah I'd like to make the motion that I have a couple of questions um but I'll move to direct staff and asentria to explore options for level funded and partially self-funded insurance plans to mitigate Rising insurance cost I'll second that thank you so what uh why why n now for Okaloosa for Swani is a centria I mean why why didn't okoa do that before you know like great question and and and a lot of the the the main reason why is um you know they're they're just they got burned in the past all the public enties around 20 25 years ago not to have a long story here uh they were all in a self-funded Consortium type plan where they all came together to go into one platform and it blew up on them and so there's uh you know their their memory on that is still with them uh but as the guard changes and and cost can spiral out of control um having the right consultant running that running the um program for you is a is a big piece of that not saying I'm the only guy that can do it because there's a lot of qualified Consultants out there but I have done this for a number of years but the biggest reason is just being uh concerned about the surprises and the potential unknown costs that are associated with it and then the last question is is are there to run these numbers anal tools that you're all talking about by end of next week is there a cost Associated to just run this part of it no there's not no that's all part of the service we provide thank you sir yep you bet councilman D thank you we're looking at your chart only 20% of the people who are in our number of workers use this I know you quoted mostly school districts in okusa I think has around 3,000 employees ver they do versus our 130 or 40 right so my question is do you have any other clients that are our size municipalities that are doing this so we have a city of nville city of Al parizo um and they are all fully insured but they are all exploring pars self oned options yes sir well so exploring is not a problem I I wonder why the smaller guys don't do it um and a cent makes money either with the insurance company fully insured or or with this plan is there a difference and and believe me as you well know centry is my insurance company and and I do what I think is a lot of business so I think you do a good job thank you but the motivation is always something I wonder about yeah no absolutely that's a fair question and answer it this way when it's fully insured right where you are right now then we get we get paid a percentage of Premium so every time that premium goes up our commission goes up right so with self-funded what you do is you have a PM cost which is per employee per month so it's per head and that cost is in your ASO in your administrative Services only fee so let's say we agree upon $30 PM that $30 is going to remain the same same under the contract now as employees come off that number goes down and as employees come on that number goes up but it doesn't go up based on your total cost and that's the difference with fully insured every time you're fully insured goes up we're getting a pay increase when you're self-funded you have more control over the compensation side of it so it's it's it's definitely it's definitely not about the the compensation piece with regards to fully insured versus partially self-funded well it's it's it's uh really more about having the relationship with a client long term I know that sounds you know but it it it just really solidifies and strengthens our our relationship well very good thanks yes sir all right councilman Bagby okay so um Jamie do we qualify for fmit for the league of cities we're members right so you all um this the league of cities plan um yes it's it's available to you all I mean you all have to be members I'm not I can't validate that you all are not but we are okay good so yes you would have access to that plan before I became your agent um it's my understanding that you all looked at the league of cities in the past and that it either was not competitive or they chose not to provide a proposal based off the experience of the group I'll have to get more history on it but that's my understanding of it but absolutely and that would be one of the options that we would look at yeah that's one I want to explore so absolutely I want those numbers in the spreadsheet okay uh the other thing is on the on the partially funded plan the per person per month per head is that just the people that are taking benefits or is that our head count it's the employees on the medical plan okay yes sir and just and just so just I want to go back to the league of cities plan just so you know that is a partially self-funded plan they're United okay yeah so it's the concept we're talking about here no the but it it goes back to the same reason the school districts and you know people with 3,400 or 3,800 or you know because you mitigate the risk when you spread it over that many people as opposed to 150 people or whatever right you don't spread the risk very far right and so it only takes three or four folks to have a really bad year for the whole organization to have a really bad year and so that's that's why I just want to I want that one of the numbers we look at sure absolutely agree just so I'm tracking with that to are we allowed to put those levers in place to that the the smaller cup versus the pitcher idea where you could leverage that risk by having individual caps is that kind of what that looks like oh absolutely that's how you do it that's how control the cost and when you look at the larger groups they're going to you know okalo County schools has a $300,000 specific deductible so they got a $300,000 exposure on every single covered person for here you would have a $75,000 so we do yeah adjust it adjusts for that for sure all right thank you seeing no further discussions we do have a motion in a second so uh Ray want to open the vote all right oh I have it unanimously so moved thank you appreciate it thank you so much thank you Mike all right leis uh yes the next item is about a discussion about the proposed incorporation of Condominiums into the city's um short-term rental program our Cod director will introduce the topic good evening uh if it please the council uh since I got here uh part of the short-term rental uh plan that the city had had we had talked about the Condominiums I know there's been a lot of discussion over the last few weeks uh some some rhetoric about it um it was never presented as a necessarily as a tax um we were just looking at potentially bringing it to the council to bring the short-term rental condions into the fold of the current short-term rental program uh right now we do the single and multif family residential um units and there are roughly 1,200 of those um in order uh to have some consistency and Synergy uh bringing those uh kind of miniums into the fold with the program it's currently the registration um cost is uh decided by square footage for 2499 square feet or less it's $500 for 2500 to 49.99 square foot is $600 anything over 5,000 square foot is uh $700 so I don't think we're talking about a lot of uh money when it uh when you're really looking at it um as Mr wamper had uh said earlier yes they uh the condos probably have some of their you know their own oversight but there are far greater um impacts to the overall City the infrastructure and the resources so again having everybody operate on the same uh rent short-term rental program is something we were looking at wanted to bring to the council for their Direction and open to any question questions you might have all right I guess to start it off Crystal can you kind of get us how we got to this you know I'm not a fan of just bringing extra dollars in unless we have a reason and a need so where did the Gap come from of this being an idea to even need to raise anyone's fees okay there there are a few things um that I'd like to just clarify um first of all you know people talk a lot about how tourism brings a lot of funds into our city um but the fact of the matter is um sales tax is distributed uh on a population base not on the dollar amount generated within the city boundaries um so the fact that we have a lot of tourists greatly benefits larger cities like Crestview up in the north end of the County uh less so for dtin because our population is only 14,000 people um another one is there's a misunderstanding that bed tax that that same idea you would think that bed tax generated within uh dtin City Limits would come back to benefit the city of dtin but that's uh not the case at all um 12 and a half% of the bed taxes collected within the county of Okaloosa is distributed um amongst the municipalities um with 85% staying with the county for the county to invest uh where they feel is uh in the County's best interest um so there's not lot of either of the existing taxes coming back into the city um during the 100 days of summer we can have anywhere from 65,000 to 100,000 people in town um which is greatly enhanced by having all of these short-term rentals as well as our hotels um as um as Troy just mentioned currently we have 1,200 single family dwellings um in our short-term rental program and uh the fees that they pay the registration fees that they pay we uh work with them we educate them um we educate them on all of the laws and everything uh we make sure that they're up to date that they stay within the restrictions of you know number of people in a in a unit um with you know code and fire and all kinds of other regulations and I understand that the hoa's you know um they certainly have their own rules that they uh put upon the their uh condos that they're managing um but the fact of the matter is because we have all of these extra people in town um you know the Sheriff's Office kind of has a rule of thumb you need um maybe you need two deputies for a population of 14,000 but when we have 100,000 people in town as you know um then we require a lot more sheriff's deputies uh to help us manage that uh the bulk of the traffic um issues and traffic citations come within Destin from within Destin City Limits far more than in the rest of the county so there's uh because we need all of this extra service especially from uh the perspective of law enforcement and lifeguards I don't want to harp on that too much but the fact of the matter is it's a third of our annual budget right now um that we wouldn't necessarily have to pay if we didn't have the the extra 85 ,000 people in town uh so that's kind of where we're we're coming from We're just trying to find ways to equitably distribute the extra costs um there's also a lot of wear and tear on our on our infrastructure um that we're also trying to recoup so that's kind of the basis on where we're considering bringing the condos under the fold into our short-term rental program all right thank you so much all right then we'll got a couple up uh councilman Bagby up first I'm glad Crystal was listening when I when we had our discussion cuz she almost hit all all my points that I hit during my uh pre thing a couple that she didn't to me this is a fairness issue okay it it's plain and simple uh those that cause the issue help pay for the issue and I understand that they play pay their adval Orum tax but you know it was brought up school taxes we don't see a dime out of school taxes and our advalorium taxes tapped at 2% which is not extravagant now the county uh gets a lot of money off the ADM tax the school district gets the most money off the ad warum tax the Fire Control District gets money off the ad warum tax but we don't get that much and so but we ought to be fair to the condo owners too to me if you're going to have a short-term rental fee okay then you ought to have it on all all short-term rentals or you ought to have it on none of the short-term RS but the condos are a little bit different and having been in the tourism business and the condo management business and the HOA management business for a lot longer than I want to say uh they're different and so what I would support and what I shared with the staff is yeah let's do this but let's do an additional tier okay so if it's $4.99 or less because most condos are smaller you don't have any or very few 8,000 square foot condos where 50 people are camping out for the week you know they're used somewhere between 800 square ft and 12200 Square ft² are probably the majority of them uh a couple of the pen houses but those aren't shortterm most most of them are not short-term rentals so I would ask that we do this or we have staff bring it back but we have an additional tier for all short-term rentals make it fair I just want to make it fair whether you're you know a house a condo or whatever if it's less than 1499 Square ft then the fee is $300 per year so because we do spend more money for sheriff's deputies we do spend more money for lifeguards okay because of the short-term rentals if we didn't have any short-term rentals I'm not even sure we would have lifeguards we might have a few on on just you know specific set sections of the beach but you know and we wouldn't require 21 sheriff's deputies or whatever we have this year you know to to police 14,000 people so it ought to be fair it it's not a tax you know I I've been on both sides of this the people that are renting those houses and renting those condos they're they have the ability to make a lot of money and and $300 a year or $500 a year for a you know 2500 square foot house that it's just a sense of fairness this has nothing to do with code enforcement you know and I think we we learned our lesson in talking with uh Mr Wampler that that that got taken out of the equation this isn't a code enforcement yeah they administer the program for us but we can do that a little bit smarter working with the county so I'm going to uh make a motion that we and I saw Kevin's already pulled up but I want to move move to direct the city manager to bring back a proposal including short and long-term rental condominiums in the city's short and longterm rental program with an additional tier of, 1499 Square ft and less and a reduced price charged for that size okay I have a motion on the floor do I hear a second I'll second that all right and I got further discussions right up next Council meston thank you thank you mayor I I saw a projected income stream Crystal from this uh at 500 or whatever the the proposed was how much money was that a year I'm sorry could you repeat your question I I saw a project a projected income stream from this tax or fee or whatever we want to call it of how much was it uh so that would bring in uh between um it would be about $2.5 million do a year and we're assuming that uh the bulk of the uh the short-term rented condos are um the the smallest ones right so $25 million do a year pretty substantial amount of money isn't it that's correct and um the there's been a lot of discussion about trying to help the fire district expand their lifeguard services to expand the hours during the days uh and the number of days per year um so that would help us accommodate that as you know the TDC has a cap by the state so they're not able to contribute anymore um to help them expand their program um So currently we're looking at U 3.1 million next year for lifegarden um Sheriff's Office services how about let's separate that out of last time I recall we were given 100,000 the district for our contribution how much is that's correct we've been giving 100,000 000 a year to the fire district for lifeguard Services uh since the early 2000s we Haven and it is and what is it proposed for this budget uh this year uh they're proposing $200,000 But ultimately they they would like to increase it to $300,000 a year from the city of D to add a few more stations talking another 100,000 that's correct 200,000 okay so that's separate and and to tangle it in with the sheriff department is uh it's quite a bit less this looks to me like an occupational license issue I mean do do condominium people who rent their Condominiums do they buy an occupational license do um Lewis do you have the the details on the um the btrs paid by um shortterm and long-term rals yeah they they all get uh btrs I don't have the numbers right now so they are supposed to buy a BTR correct didn't show them R yes as you know the btrs are also regulated by the state we're not allowed to increase them and Kim cop can speak more to that well of course there is a way to do it we just haven't done it yet in any event they're going to pay a a BTR and they're going to pay another BTR of 300 or 500 or whatever we decide that sounds like so it's an additional fee because after all they're in the business of renting their their condo out and and they're if they're buying a BTR already which I probably feel many of them aren't then now we're double dipping the condominium associations do they pay a a BTR also we don't think so they wouldn't be paying a BTR as a short-term rental no yeah okay and we're very limited under the state law and how much we can raise the btrs very limited so we we definitely can't raise them very much anymore those days have passed yes i' I've seen what they passed um I don't know you know should they pay to be in business just like the rest of us who have btrs and are in business I I don't have a terrible heartache with that concept but if we're double dipping them I'm not I'm not so sure um I mean doesn't are we double dipping them no they would not be double dipping they'll just be paying a BTR just like anybody else who's doing a short-term rent so if you pay a BTR and you turn around and pay another one no no they pay a BTR to be a short-term rle then they pay the registration fee just like the short-term rental program people in the short-term rental program right now do so it's not that what they okay thanks I got Bunch up here get on all right T Tori I got all right Council m g i somewhat agree with Council Bagby but I don't believe it should be a different number um I think it should be the same across the board based off square footage regardless or however we're billing that number um we are looking at more than just an impact of uh the size of the the apartment Com or the condo or the the space it's how many people are packing in how many vehicles are wearing down our roadways I believe last I heard we're 18 years behind on roadway repairs um the impacts on our community uh if we're saying that locals are first you try to go into publ on a Saturday you try to get dinner reservation somewhere in this town there's another impact on on the locals that I think we need to be able to not subsidize their wear and tear and not subsidize the the uh negative impact they're putting in in this community and try to sugarcoat it with false numbers so I would support the full registration fee and not a partial Crystal and and just to put things in perspective I just want to mention the um the BTR the business tax receipt to register your business in the city of dtin for all hotels motels houses Cottages Condominiums and so forth is $31.25 a year $31.25 a year I'm I'm glad to hear that i' I've not been able to ascertain what my B BTR price is this year yet how do you come up with that figure so quickly chrystle I'm looking at the uh schedule of fees okay well you and I can get together and talk about how we can figure out where everybody can come to a number that quickly I've got I've got a seven point Direction on how I should work with the intergov to try to figure out what my BTR is is yeah I understand that and uh Kim cop and I have had numerous discussions over the last four years um because we all wish that we could highly simplify the BTR list get it down to maybe three fees instead of the five pages of you know five fivepoint font that we have currently with the city and and the state restrictions are just not allowing us to do that but certainly encourage that since I got a postcard about that big from the county telling me exactly what my BTR license fee was and when to send it in all right let's not talk about you let's talk about the short-term R all right then even if we were to go [Laughter] down all right I got I got Council M Schmid we got a Christmas tree over here thank you Mr Mayor um sorry Mr Wampler for uh missing your call Friday night and uh busy day workwise so haven't gotten back in touch with you guys and thank you all all for coming tonight um I'm I'm definitely uh interested to continue talking about this and the next steps obviously tonight we're not uh making anything permanent or putting any fees in place um I have I have received a few emails um none of them are from here which doesn't bother me as much as it might bother some people up here sometimes but um I've asked them all the same question though whenever they've sent me their concerns and I'll be happy to talk to Mr wamper and whoever else as well is um they talk about the increase in insurance and HOA fees and I get that um and when I ask them why well it's because the insurance Market in Florida is increasing and the inspections because of the state requirements on the buildings and we get all that um but when I asked them you know how can the city of Destin help to continue to contribute to the experience of your guests when they come visit us they don't have an answer for me yet and and maybe yall will have one of those answers um they do use our facilities um in case you haven't been to Morgan Sports Complex on any day during the during the summer I'm sure at least of them can tell you I think 99% % of the visitors are from out of town right Parks and Recreation is losing money every single year right now um I'm not saying that's that should be subsidized by the tourists but they are using them um and we want to be able to continue to use them and allow people to come use all these facilities and we need to fix them and that's a whole another discussion and a whole another battle and uh the part the master Park plan that we're talking about earlier these things should have been done years ago they haven't been so um you know the the tax for ad of vorum like everybody's already mentioned we we've already we've already hit that the gentleman on the beach I was going to ask him he he talked about our code officers so obviously code enforcement officers are down there on his Beach because he knows them by name almost and it doesn't sound like the condo Owners Association security is I I didn't get to ask them so I'm I'm not sure but all I'm trying to say is there there is usage by the visitors uh I don't agree with the same price as the homes it should be smaller should be less because there is less of an impact um but at the same time I've also asked staff my request is is you know I didn't like how this was portrayed in the agenda I I I don't I don't like how it was a code enforcement officer we need to add this staff person to our list of roster I want to know what are we going to do with this money what differently yeah sure we can make the budget I get that but I would would feel better at the next meeting when this comes hopefully soon to specify the things that we are going to earmark this increase for specifically to help offset certain things that we do provide to the tourists that way it's even better to show them our locals and everybody that we're not just trying to bring in more money um that would that would mean more to me to be able to express to the visitors and to the mainly number one the residents and then the businesses and the visitors because we do rely on them and all the restaurants rely on them I get that but at the end of the day for me personally I understand it'll require more management from these companies I think that's probably some of the painstaking Parts is because they now have to register x amount of hundreds or however many um short term rals with the city and we do need to make it easier for them that's all we all know that it's it's a pain to you know what to use our online system so the next item about using Okaloosa I think Mr Bagby talked about that too it'd be a great idea um but you know the county doesn't give us enough we already know that Sheriff's Department keeps increasing uh no no offense to this new new gentleman back here keeps increasing their contract every year and they say the reason why they're increasing is because it takes more and cost more to to to deal with everything around here so we have to find a way to help that too so um I don't agree with the same pricing but I do want to continue to see the next steps and having this come back to allow the public to have actual time to read it to soak it in have talks have conversations with these people in the back as well as others and maybe be educated more or less and um you know come with a come up with a good plan for everybody all right good stuff all right Council woman abar thanks mayor um I agree with a lot of what you said Kevin in fact a lot of that was what I was going to state but I also wanted to find out what was the BTR cost because I don't want to tack on a fee if we're already making several hundred dollars off of these condos but if their their license is $31 then I really don't have a whole lot of heartburn with okay the infrastructure overall the roads the parks everything that our tourists and visitors enjoy then it really should be not a big expectation of them having to pay a couple hundred dollars a year not a month but a year to help us with our infrastructure and I know it sounds like a great amount if we can add on and get over two $2 million but we have problems right now with the community center that needs to be completely redone and we don't have the money to do that and that's used by a lot of residents but tons of tourists we also have problems with our park that's over at Morgan's Park our children's park we haven't upgraded that in decades and it's finally been shut down we need to destroy it and just rebu build a kids park for all the people that use Morgans and they have little people they need to entertain whether it's a guest or if it's the resident so I feel like the money that we're asking in the big scheme of things ultimately will be spent very well that I think the tourists will enjoy as well as the residents but I like Kevin would like to see it more of a spell it out let's make sure what we're doing with it so that there's not this we're choking on another fee and it's not that we're trying to add another fee to the Condominiums we're just trying to make it fair that there's a smaller not necessarily a larger chunk I agree with Mr Bagby on that you know the square footage is a whole lot less people it shouldn't be a flat five or 700 a year if it's a small condominium which a lot of them are so I'd like to see what comes back from the city for us to help make this not only approvable by those in the Condominiums but also something that feels like it's reason because it is overall infrastructure lifeguards Sheriff our roads everything that we enjoy here in dtin needs to be upgraded and taken care of so I feel like this is the right direction we just need to do it and spell it out a little bit better on what it is all about that we're trying to do with this money good point all right Johnny councilman King thank you sir so my understanding is that right now single family short short-term rental homes are up to 2500 square ft pay $500 so all the single family short-term rental homes are paying this already is that right so that's what Mr Bagby was saying it's a matter of fairness correct you know it's a this one kind of this one kind of hits home I think a little bit I've got a client right now who lives in a high-rise condo that's fixed they're trying to figure out how they're going to come up with hundred plus thousand for an assessment that they had no control over because of the state you know the State of Florida is requiring that now so they don't have $100,000 they've got to sell their you know uh a stream of income that they have um so it's a I think it kind of stinks to throw another tax on top of people that are being having taxes start on top of them you know like crazy so I think it's as far as if it was a matter of fairness um you know they these a lot of these people stay I mean yeah they're using our Parks they're using the grocery stores are using all the amenities of town um but you know I would say I couldn't I mean I would say a a nominal or a minimal amount compared to what we're looking at right here um but if it's but if people are already paying these in in single family homes I think there's like it's a I'm I would agree with Mr Bagby um there's got to be some kind of something it just doesn't doesn't seem fair but I you know I would say a much smaller number in my opinion so yeah so um I don't know where else I was going with that but man I had a question that's all right um so yeah I'm curious to see what what y'all bring back um but I I mean I couldn't I wouldn't support numbers like what we're looking at right now all right back to Jim second bite yeah I just wanted to answer or respond to Tori's uh question the these condos and we can probably have them pull the information off the property of appraiser site but these the average square feet of these condos is probably less than 1400 square feet you're probably going to six or eight people Max uh going to sleep in there as opposed to the 24 you know my house is 2500 square ft and if I made one of those four bedrooms a bunk room I could probably get close to 16 uh people in that house so it's a it's a relative impact uh cost is is what is why I brought up the fourth tier because a 900 square ft or 800 92 is what they are at one SE Gro Place 892 squ foot condo is not going to have the same impact as a 2400 foot house so there's got to be some give in in this system to say your short-term rental as the cost of doing business is 500 for all of you I just don't think that's fair in in my personal opinion and I am more than willing to uh go along with uh Mr Schmid and Teresa and say yeah let's come back we want $200,000 of whatever $300 generates 200,000 going to go to lifeguards I want some money to go to Sheriff's Marine unit next year I want some money to go to the parks three do the kids park over at uh Morgan's I want and to for lack I don't like this word for a lot of reasons earmark or identify uh where some of these monies are going to go I don't have a problem doing that either but in the end it it's got to be fair and and to Johnny I I I get yours that to me that's a oneoff that's a condo association if they're having to do and I know condo owners that are having to pay $50,000 $100,000 because they deferred their maintenance for so long their boards deferred their maintenance that when the the state stepped in and said yeah no more deferral buddy you're going to have to put the money in the reserves and you're going to have to show it in here and you're going to have to pass this inspection th to me those are two separate issues I I feel for them uh but they probably benefited at least the ones that I know that I'm aware of they benefited from extra lower uh annual assessments quarterly assessments monthly assessments whatever they were paying and they just deferred that maintenance and then all of a sudden the bill came due and that's kind of the same way the city is and why we've gone to you know trying to get a a plan of our expenditures because eventually the bill comes do and so if we just spend 200,000 a year as opposed to waiting 15 years and trying to find $25 million uh that but I I feel for you and and I'm sorry for them but this to me this is a separate issue but I I it has to be fair you know I'm not saying 300 is the right amount but it can't be 450 because a 892 ft condo does not put the impact on our beaches on our sheriffs on our lifeguards on the Marine Patrol on our parks that a 2400t house does that right uh cman Stevens uh thank you um so when short-term rental registration started a while back um we had a working group so I almost feel like with the condos we should probably at least have a workshop to where they can at least discuss it and so I don't know if that's something we want to add to the motion of of modifying to where we're adding all the details of where the money's going to go and potentially have a workshop before we um everything's brought back to us right councilman gu um we keep talking about fairness but we're looking at a business that's similar to a hotel hotels are at to how many people can sit in a room um if we implemented a process where and with my business they can walk in and inspect my my office anytime they want as long as I have a BTR If if we implemented a system where we had limited occupancy on condos and the code enforcement was willing to or authorized to go inspect to verify there weren't a certain number of people or above that and then they could find per head I would support it but I've seen way too many incidences in in in the construction business when I'm doing remodels or Roofing scenarios where you've got six and eight cars piled into one condo a tiny condo um so the impact on the roadways don't change the impact on the grocery stores don't change uh and the impact on the residents don't change um the locals the the the quality of life of the locals is being affected drastically so in my opinion um I would support the the less lesser fund or the Lesser fee if we supported a uh an inspection process through btrs just like they do on my business and it's not fair to local hotels that have to compete with these these businesses good adjective all right councilman king that's a great point and I don't know I don't know how this where this question Falls but how does this you know if this is a matter of if it's a matter of people and you know infrastructure and wear and tear how does this apply to hotels that are in the city you know I mean those people are they're getting new they're getting new guests every week too so how does that I mean what do we what do we charge them $500 a room for you know what I mean I know you do I mean it's just is I wonder how does that you know no good deed goes unpunished so how you know where does that leave us with hotels all right I do have a motion in a second J that was a question how does that apply to so sorry I thought no no no I mean how does that how does that apply to the places that don't that aren't Chris got anything on that um yeah actually I'm gonna defer this one to Lewis just to speak to the impact fees and how they're different from a commercial entity like a hotel versus a residential unit like a condo yes so for all commercial activities in the city uh when a project comes through there's a process uh for determining their impact especially from a transportation standpoint and the calculation is made as to the number of trips that are generated by that entity and a fees paid so there is a contribution towards those aspects that we're talking about that hotels do you're saying they pay them up front during construction correct at the time of occupancy let me ask you this real quick what is the do we know what the maximum what what is the maximum uh amount of BTR for short-term rental do we have that number it's $31 right now whatever what's the what's the maximum that's it I believe yeah it's it it decreases depending upon the number of units for for example if you have 501 or more units in your building that you're using as a short-term rental or a rental unit um a 500 or more unit place would pay $625 for their BTR so the per unit amount decreases the more units you have in your business and then in in full transparency Lewis on on the impact fees that would go with the same building even if it's a single family resident regardless there's still also paying impact fees or is it a different scale from a hotel to a single family yeah it's a different scale because it's got different APS okay okay so there is at least notice there correct okay all right councilman dtin second bite just so I can clarify the motion on the floor is uh to have staff bring it back to us and I I wanted to support with a fourth tier right and I want to support the the uh the notion that we don't Tangled code enforcement into it correct and uh in the BTR you know I'm I'm going back to the same theme but I buy a BTR to have a seafood restaurant it sounds like then I can pay for another fee to serve shrimp at the seafood restaurant and that's essentially what we're doing here so uh I've got a long ways to go I don't I don't mind everybody paying the plastic basket fee the plastic basket I think I think we could probably nitpick and and and for me to say it's not dipping with a straight face is pretty hard so we'll see how it comes out but I've got a number of questions can I get a just wanted a clarification as we're talking about the um motion I heard no code enforcement involvement or and does that mean oversight because I think one of the things we were talking about was like what we were bring back is like do you want us to monitor internally or do you want us you know would have side agency be the the best but if you're eliminating code now I mean there's going to there's going to be a cost for either one and you know we're going to bring that back perhaps and I could be wrong I think the confusion was Council mcg's recommendation of putting more oversight if we were going to go with a higher fee but I think that was just a recommendation I don't think that got consensus in the motion yeah that's that's not part of my motion and I will tell you uh to me that is unmanageable you know I don't want us go just when I argued against uh that portion of the because that was originally part of the concept of the short-term rental was yeah we're going to have people go in and they're going to count people in the bedrooms no the hell you're not okay I'm not going to put a code enforcement officer knocking on a door you know and going code enforcement you you can only have 16 people here you know if they make noise if they leave their trash out if they got cars parked out you know all over the yard or whatever they violate some something else but we're we're not the you know Nazis that enforce that and I don't want code enforcement to be that I want you to enforce our rules our regulations our laws ordinances but I I don't want you going in and inspecting how many people because guess what we then we get in this argument of well they're not spending the night they're just here because we're having a Super Bowl party and you you know yeah I got 40 people and you going to come to my house when I'm having a party for you know my wife's birthday or something and say you you only got four bedrooms you got more than 16 people at this party I'm sorry here's your citation I will you will not be happy when you leave my house okay you don't have a BTR you don't have a BTR I was just asking for clarification I'm good however we still get those calls now and they're not at the condos I I did want to ask John ask answer John's question um we have a framework my understanding of when we had those workshops we didn't have a framework at all and we were trying to figure out you know is it just one size fits all are we going to teer this how are we going to cheer it where are we going to draw the lines and and do all these things we we've gone through all that I'm not sure we need a another Workshop because then that just kind of kicks the can down the road and I know we're good at that uh just look at those beautiful pickle ball ports out over there and I I would just I would prefer not to Kick the Can down the road I'll just be honest with you we we have a framework let's have the staff bring it back to us in two weeks I'm sure Ken and Leno who I've known for way too long will be back to tell us how that number's too high or it's not high enough or what no they'll say it's too high so I I that's why I don't want to include the workshop I mean it just I don't think it gets us anything if I thought it got us a new facet to the this program I I might reconsider all right I think we're on the same page we're going to figure out where we're going to spend this money I think that's going to come up with the dollar amount that we suggest and then we'll figure out with everyone in the back of the room on both sides of the room if we can all come up with that a compromise on that so that's kind of where I'm at all right no no screaming back at me sounds like a good idea so I will call the vote everyone understanding the motion all right good deal all right I have ously so move the discussions begin all right Mr zangu yes uh the next item is a discussion of the proposed improvements uh and Renovations at the uh Morgan Sports Center uh as well as at Dalton thread gold Park uh Park director will lead that discussion do do we got all need a break while they're shuffling out are we guys good good we're good all right it's a natural Shuffle sorry Lis good all right we're good than go take it Lisa you're good okay um okay so in um the first budget hearing we um I told you what I thought we needed and that was the playground um to be totally um replaced at Morgan Sports Center and the field lights at Morgan Sports Center changed over to LEDs and the Destin Community Center I gave you a price of uh seven almost 800,000 but um after we talked let's see the community center was 789 I'm sorry 717 um after we talked and SRS bringing their information to us I feel like we're not sure what we're going to be doing with the community center in the long run and maybe we save that money and just fix the windows at the community center and in-house do some of the patchwor and try to get it where it's not leaking um with that savings we could go ahead and do um the batting cage we could put up a batting cage at uh Morgan Sports Center that we need and also sun shades so that is what I would like for you all to decide if we could do that in this budget all right councilman Dustin well deferring maintenance at the community center for the last 10 or 15 years is why we are where we are today um and as far as not knowing what we're going to do with that Center we have no property that we would go forward to do anything different we have no money I don't see even if we go forward with some kind of a plan that SRS would give us that we're 5 years away from doing anything so the question is can we defer the uh domains it should have been done 10 years ago for another five years I would say that's not a wise thing to do uh the building is going to be um you know so far behind and so far down it's going to be almost impossible to uh go forward and I think the likelihood that we're going to abandon that completely to the recreational service that has served this community for 25 years is highly unlikely so if we are going to raise some money from this uh this condominium fee then that will give us a little cushion to do both but I don't I don't see deferring the uh maintenance on that building anymore we're already too far behind so if it if it takes a motion to direct staff to continue with the plan to to do the renovations I will make that motion with the caveat that we are looking at another resources to try to do both those because I think we should do both or all three and I'm hoping that while I'm not 100% in favor of the double dipping on the condos um they do need to pay some amount because the people that are renting houses out are paying for short term so so you know somewhere there's a compromise I hope that we can do something that will not totally um hurt them but will improve our situation on these recreational facilities so I'll make that motion and I'll second that all right further discussions councilman schit yeah before my discussion i' I'd really like to get clarity on what exactly that motion was the motion I just made Y is to go forward with the original plan which was to spend the money on the recreation on the uh community centers upgrade maintenance and to also see if we can't figure out how to do the improvements at Morgan and at the little league with the money we hope to generate later down the road so so basically then you're you're kind of saying to continue with the May 13th budget Workshop of $2.99 million which included the $717,000 to fix the community centers Windows Doors frames roof all that stuff yes that's gotcha okay um well I'd like to make a substitute motion if I could um and I would propose to um I would I would propose that the city council proceed with the uh proposed revised budget to include the items listed on our agenda to increase to 2351 million doll with an additional 50,000 to thread yill park for the renovations recommended and that basically does everything that you're were saying but it fixes the windows and frames at the community center windows and frames at the community center instead of the three4 of million dollars does do the other repairs and maintenance that are required does not do the other requ required uh maintenance that that was proposed in that other Workshop is that St and the the roof right so you're you're proposing not to fix the community center to it I mean I would I would uh I would like to hear maybe if councelor gu has a recommendation on is a $500,000 number a number that's good bad too high to resal roof to add to address water leaks well of course that would go out to bid anyway wouldn't it yeah yeah I'm just curious because what what you're saying is it's half a million dollars to do those one extra little thing what I'm saying is leave it in the budget and if we can done get it done cheaper of course we would yeah gotcha no I don't like where you're going at the end of the day we have to figure out and maybe we're putting the cart before the horse cuz SRS should be coming back soon to even see what is happening but my fear is I love the community center but I fear we are outgrowing it from a capacity and whether we keep it there and expand or we move it if the if the recommendations come back I just would hate to put money into something that we may or may not tear down and now we've left things in the rubble I mean I I really don't think the capacity at the community center is there now so are we added on and we're just going to do new wings are we going to do a new building I would just hate to put money in that we would need for a new building there to fit the need of our community now there's one there's one gym in there there was a little arcade when I was a kid there I don't think that's a thing anymore there's just not enough rooms activities or spaces or courts or anything there and I'm not a construction guy so I don't really know the process but that that's just my biggest fear with all the unknowns that we have out right now is is it big enough and are we putting money in the right building there and of course that is a concern but you have to understand that if we don't do the things to fix the roof over the next three years the whole building can no longer be usable so sounds like we need a new Community Center tomorrow soon as soon as we figure out how to pay for it it's a wonderful idea I'd be i' be happy Ken back so we can't do the SR we can't do the short-term rentals yeah well a substitute motion I'd be happy to more to that discussion but I'll I'll respect if there's a second if there's not no worries all right so I have a second on no substitute motion but without a second I'm not going to continue talking that's what I'm asking subtitute motion so my substitute motion is to continue with the revised budget that's in our agenda with one addition above these items of $50,000 for threadgill so that would include the Morgan sports center LED lights the noro park which we've already agreed to do the walkover Morgan Sports Center sun shades Morgan Sports Center two fields of turf Morgan Sports Center batting cage Community Center replace windows and frames at the community center right was the playground in there Kevin no it's not that's its own item because it's in such dire repair or un existent repair all right so I do have no we just want to clarify uh the list that um councilman Schmidt just proposed does not include uh putting in the playground at Morgan's it would exclude that so we would not um address that playground is there another line item for that no sorry the budget yeah that that would add um so he's proposing the uh Parks and Recreation budget be 2351 million um so if we were to add the the play round into that that would add an additional um I think it's close to so I'll tell you you know my if I can add my thoughts if that's all right Mr Mayor go for it and then people want to call me on the table that's fine um I I don't I don't disagree about there might be a need for a roof fix over at the community center but in nearly four years that I've been up here uh We've yet to see that report that that you know Bill that quote that whatever um I'm not saying it doesn't exist but that Community Center is still operating right now um it does need there need needs to be some things fixed there uh but the Band-Aids of $160,000 should allow us to continue to to do some things for at least another year or two the needs of some of these other items that we're talking about in regards to these fields are some of these fields and parks and lights and uh everything else these are the needs that we are having people visit our parks on a daily basis and experiencing for a need for fixes and changes and upgrades sooner than later Community Center is a is a nostalgic place for a lot of us I get that um I know you know obviously you spent more time than me but I I I was four years old as well growing up dribbling the basketball too I would invite you to come to an event there a recreational event in the community center to see how outgrown we are for that building so and and I I want to keep the discussion about a future Community Center to the side because that's not where I'm trying to go right now let's fix some of the window seals and the frames but we have a a deteriorating Sports Complex happening in front of our eyes because of unfortunately not taking care of it as well as a community center I agree with you but we have people that are leaving our Sports Complex to go to our neighboring cities to take business elsewhere We Are One Park away in sanes or Walton County to be built to almost losing even more business at this Sports facility the amount of sports Revenue tourism that will be generated at this sports complex doesn't matter about baseball could be any sport over there is astronomical right now and and we are losing slowly but surely that Revenue coming to the city or our parks recreation department and that's that's a fact we are losing that we need to do something and so I think this allows us to do something immediately for the community center but also for these for this Sports Complex so um that was my additional selling point but I still don't have a second so whatever you want to do Mr bar mayor I got I got Rose if you want as we're having a discussion on a motion that doesn't have a second I would I would like to answer those those questions the uh my my original motion included doing all the repairs at uh Morgan's it just simply said that we we anticipate we'll be able to raise some more money and I and I would point out the argument over the community center whether it's going to be there or not if all of you went to the same briefings that I did with our consultant they also proposed dramatic changes over here closing this city hall down dramatically changing Morgan so we're we're using we're having the same issue on both facilities the point is that we have deferred the maintenance at the community center as long as we can if either the roof needs a new roof or it doesn't our staff says it does we need to do both we don't need to push off the maintain maintenance of the community center and yes it is not adequate but you don't make it adequate by tearing it down and building another one you build another one and keep using the one you have so from that point of view we need to uh we need to fix the community center for sake of Robert's Rules do I have a second on the motion of the substitute motion of councilman Schmid all right seeing none motion dies and we're back to the original and we'll move on councilman Bagby welcome appreciate that so A couple of questions for the staff so what's on the screen there is budgeted for this year so repairs to Dalton thread Gill Park and some to the Morgan Sports Center correct and the motion on the floor as opposed to what was in the substitute motion was we're going to do the northern crossover Vice the southern crossover okay we're going to in both of them we're going to do the sports center LED field lights at Morgan's right uh in this motion that is currently on the table we're going to fix the playground whereas in the other motion we weren't going to fix the playground and then we're going to repair the community center now I heard I think Mr Smith mentioned $50,000 for something else and I I think it was threadgill but I I didn't quite catch what was the additional $50,000 for at thill well we could take a couple steps backwards to get clarity on what you're asking because I don't think I don't think we're all on the same page of what you just asked and said about those items are these budgeted are these items budgeted for 2024 why aren't we doing them then yes those well because doing them well some of them have been done um and the monies for the sun shades um I had a small amount for the field lights um anyway those amounts are going to be moved into the 2025 to cover what we're trying to do but they've already been funded they haven't been funded so what up here is not going to get done allow me to clarify Lisa so what Lisa that slide go back to that slide guys yes this slide that Lisa has up here um she's proposing that instead of doing the $717,000 fix to the community center to stop all of the water leaks um instead of doing that she would like to uh put some sun shades at the uh Morgan Center and she uh listed on there to artificially Turf two of the infields at Morgan Center I'm surprised to have that on there well wait now see this is what we had in 2024 okay okay guys y'all are y'all are getting ready to really make me sad and I'm getting really ready to make y'all sad too if you don't even know what the heck we have left in the budget for parks and rec to fix in 2024 it's listed in your on your agenda item that's exactly what was proposed for oh this is 2024 yes this is 2024 okay so yes what she has listed here was budgeted for 2024 but she did not budget enough for example um actually the sun shades were not in the 2024 budget the playground renovation that was 2020 that is budgeted in 2024 was only 200,000 but it's closer to $800,000 is what we need to actually renovate that playground um the LED field lights the same thing it's 1.3 million to address all of the LED lights at Morgan's but she budgeted only $200,000 in 2024 so these items she listed up here they are in the 2024 budget but there was not nearly enough to actually accomplish what needs to be accomplished for these items in the 2024 budget uh there's remaining right now $200,000 in the Parks and wreck um for any of these things up here uh yes let's see the windows at Morgan's have been replaced um sunshades no playgrounds no um the um shed has been encumbered the Morgan's maintenance shed uh the four dugouts at threadgill have been done the drainage problems need to be looked at artificial turf no uh convert to those are just things we were looking at to um talk about putting in the budget for Dalton thread guil um but we have also replaced all the sod yes at um at Morgan so the sod is completed so to reclaim the floor I I am the thing I like about the proposal on the on the floor is I I'm not sold on the turf AST Turf for the ball fields I mean we can have that discussion in a later point I want to know so of the $200,000 if we put 50,000 toward threadgill right where where would we put that in what has not been done is that finishing the LED lighting or what okay here here's what I want I want y'all come back at the next meeting and tell me where the heck we are and what you want to do with the $200,000 we have left this year and then I want you to bring back Mr uh Dustin's motion because I I'll support that and I'll support it tonight but I I just don't think we have no where the heck we are and where we want to go I want to fix the community center and we're going to be in that Community Center in three weeks voting okay or four weeks voting we're also going to have kids in there this fall when school comes back but I want to know where $50,000 for threadgill can go in and then this money that is in Mr Dustin's proposal because this is where you say it's going right that is correct and then I want want to know where you propose to spend the other $150,000 that is remaining in this year's budget that was going to be moved to 2025 is that not correct Crystal get me in all right counil M all right um I think one thing that you forgot to mention as well Lisa is that you guys did have to fix that roof for Clement Taylor park it was caving in it was structurally unsound uh you're either going to have to condemn it or put porta potties out there and you guys did renovate that roof system out there so that the citizens could actually use that part and that restroom out there effectively so that was more money that uh you probably didn't expect or have on budget because of the Clement Taylor Park remodel but um I do want to answer the $500,000 for repairs question so that bid went out several times and they were they did not get biders um people just refused to bid that project for some reason for several it was placed several times so I went over and I gave a a rough idea of what it it should cost and uh they enlisted a contractor at that point that was willing to give a bid but I think he possibly knew that it went out for several bids and nobody responded um I'm not going to speak to whether I think that that's a fair number or not I'll just leave leave it that um as far as the lights in Morgan Sports Complex I I do see the need for it but I'd like to see how this High School play plays out before I agree to anything like that because they are talking about ball fields and and the rental program there and in their uh inter local agreement I believe there's certain things they're responsible for so I'd really like to see how that plays out we have a meeting tomorrow at noon that we will have certain discussions with that as well um and I do have one question for uh Crystal if you don't mind Crystal are you are you over there yes sir I'm listening yes ma'am if um if we did raise the Str money where what fund would that go into uh Str Str funds go into the the general fund if we wanted to do these remodels and and uh take care of these lights and and everything else that everybody up here says is so important where would that money come from that's also the general fund okay thank you so much Crystal a lawyer walking us through that one councilman King councilwoman abor I'm good never mind all righty everyone good on the motion all right mayor yes may I ask for clarification before we vote yes please currently the motion is was listed under May 13 budget Workshop which uh U Mr Bagby just uh you know mentioned what's not part of the motion is that um Mr Bagby would like the uh the the $50,000 threadgill how to spend that next meeting right that's not they can bring that back Ying right that's not part of the motion no that's not part of his motion that's just I'm just trying to figure out right where we are in Parks and Rec's budget for this year and what we want to spend that $200,000 and you ask step to bring that back at the next meeting bring it back to the next meeting thank you I'm sorry all right with that and just for clarity this will be uh this is just a motion just to talk about a budget thing that we're actually going to have a budget workshop and then a budget vote and all that right so what we about to vote on doesn't necessarily even hold any Merit to what actually gets in the budget and finalizes we have to vote on that right I think the object this question but just the object of this being on the agenda tonight was some guidance to the recreational people I believe this is some guidance it's not the final guidance some guy okay yeah and um to councilman Schmidt's Point uh we were looking for guidance to help for the uh budget Workshop number two which happens next Monday all right so with that open the vote really I'm not yeah we're just we're we're we're blessing the next draft all right 61 I have it all right okay the next item is about a discussion about the options and costs as well as benefits for undertaking and implementing the C's annexation policy principal planner will leave the discussion good evening Council Mr Mayor uh um staff's brought forward um um a formal annexation policy uh before to council um requesting that um the actual policy and regulations and guidelines be incorporated into the Land Development code rewrite part of that discussion also focused on the areas um in this area that are not annexed in and are in in unincorporated Okaloosa County the map um that you see before you right now shows those areas um essentially there's the enclaves um which are kind of between uh Common Drive and Triumph all the way to airport and then you have most of the residential area um Kelly Plantation and then the commercial area that's directly AB buding Common Drive and a portion of Highway 98 or Emerald Coast Parkway and also the uh rata bay Emerald Bay um area as well so the need for an understanding of where Council stands and where to go forward from from here on the effort to Annex in um is the question at hand tonight there are benefits and drawbacks to everything um as you all know this and part of the objectives that were identified by Council previously were the elimination of the enclaves which is kind of the lwh hanging fruit um there's also the enhancement of uh the city tax base um which uh could help with uh funding some of the impacts of the infrastructure that we see from the areas that are not Incorporated in the city um there's also control over the development um of the areas that are unincorporated um so and also an increase in voter base um if you look at the or if you if you read the if you read the staff report um there are various costs associated um and based on the requirements from the state level uh for annexation um there is one of the bigger ones is the feasibility study that's required as part of that feasibility study there is a meets and Bounds survey that's required for all the areas that are um proposed to be annexed in um that number um we can get from the city surveyor once we identify the the path forward um and the areas uh that um are identified for annexation um the cost for educational efforts for any referendum that may be required should uh should that route be taken um and then uh the cost for any public uh maintenance of the roadways uh that we accept under the annexation of unincorporated areas um so there are two ways to Annex in um want to break down the pros and cons there's the voluntary where the property owner or Property Owners a group um a subdivision maybe requests to be annexed in and then there's the involuntary the voluntary is obviously less expensive to the city uh because the direct cost is borne by the applicants wanting to Annex in however whatever costs for maintenance um uh for acceptance of uh infrastructure ride of way and all that will be borne by the city if accepted um and then the the involuntary is the one that's going to cost more to the city immediately with that feasibility study with the meets and Bounds description um um and the educational uh portion for the referendum uh to meet all the state requirements so in conclusion staff's requesting direction from City Council on which direction to focus efforts regarding the annexation options um which are as discussed just a second ago involuntary annexation or in uh voluntary annexation or involuntary annexation um so that's it all right thank you so much T all right and then everyone out there watching and listening I I I just hate the vocab that the state uses on this so just a little bit of clarification voluntary is we would get 100% sign up sign the dotted line we get 100% of an enclave or a neighborhood and they come in involuntary is actually democracy vote and we go to ballot so it in involuntary sounds very government big brother but in reality that's the vote that's the democracy and I know that's not you that's that's definitions by the state but just that's always my biggest first asking question when I'm out there and people ask me about this is you're going to invol voluntarily bring me into the city no no no this is a vote so I just want first point of clarification on that but thank you so much yeah it's more just the initiation of the process was it voluntary by the property owners or is it being initiated by the city so yes that's yeah by the vo yes and then my only question to that the 2.8 cost for the roadways that's uh assuming the Gated Community roadways Ryan would you is that the 2.8 Mill ion for if we that's the uh the public roadway maintenance a yeah so we're um estimating that would be $114,000 a year or about yeah 2.8 million is assuming a 20-year life um we're not consider we would prefer not we would prefer to leave the private roadways their maintenance and their construction we would prefer to leave those with the the HOAs just because the uh the the 2.2 to $3 million a year that we would receive in additional taxes by annexing annexing them all in would not be adequate to cover um the maintenance of all the private roadways that would come in as well and I think it's a win-win because they they want to keep them for sure all right councilwoman abar thanks mayor um what I've been asked by those folks that live in some of these um areas what is the true cost per resident to Annex them in are they going to pay they're going to be charged every year more money on their um city taxes would be now $2 or $300 a year or $1,000 a year do we have something that we could let them understand this is not some chunk of money each person is going to be paying ultimately the benefit is that we'll get more people so the residents would pay less in in the overall scheme of things can you answer that information I'd imagine that might involve a little bit more number crunching rather than big picture just based on the sheer number of residents that are going to be brought in and they the the additional benefit or the additional uh tax revenue brought into that and then dividing that amongst what's currently out there um I don't know Crystal do you have any further guidance on that one no I there's some uh there's some details that I need from the property appraiser um that I don't have at this moment uh that would help answer that but you're generally correct all of these areas right now um they pay an an additional tax to the county of 0.29% uh Mills uh which goes to the county to help them pay for Parks and Recreation that would go away and in place of that um we would charge the city millage rate uh which is currently 1. 615 Mills or you know it's it's less than a tenth of a percent so um you're correct the the average right now um for the rest of dtin it's uh each home pays between 300 and 500 a year if they're a homestead at home um so I just need the the taxable values and I need to know which ones are homesteaded in order to calculate uh what would be the median from each of these areas so because that to me speaks volumes if people are homesteaded and lots of folks in those big neighborhoods they are their Homestead so they wouldn't pay the county fee they would pay us the city fee which would be minimal more than what they're currently paying in the county but with a large increase of thousands of residents it would drop it whether we're incorporated or not Incorporated if we're you know part of City jurisdiction or not all of us pay that 3.8 Mills to the county regardless so that would not change and that's for the residents that are currently paying so they would not pay a county fee there is yeah there is one County fee that would disappear off of their tax bill that's correct and realistically it is more cost effective for them especially if they have any kids in any events or any um activities that they pay a non-resident fee on that would be cut in half immediately because they'd then be residents right their Parks and Recreation fees would be cut in half and they would no longer have to pay a fee to be part of the Destin Library so it is a very minimal increase they would lose a fee that would go to the county that would drop off they would have a fee that would come to the city but ultimately they would also benefit so it's not like they're going to be incorporating a, dollar or more every year to be part of the city correct yeah it depends on their taxable value yep yeah so the basic is their their their tax would increase 1.3% Little Numbers at the end but 1.3 more in general if they had a million dollar house they'd be paying $1300 more a year and then from there depending on the homestead and everything but we have about6 to $700 worth of values as a resident not to mention what we were talking about earlier about the things that are un forunate that we don't know which is um you know the sales tax is populationbased all these all these things them as a citizen gives us more money from the state from gas taxes from all these things so them just signing up we're gaining more money that's not even just theirs of course they're paying more because it's going into the city but we're also getting money from the state now that our population's increased so they're they're double dipping for us without us we're only getting one from them but we're getting multiple streams of additional Revenue since the population's higher and that's what I think the non-residents that live in Destin don't understand that that we as a city with what 14,000 taxpayers we double that the amount of money that the state would give us the amount of money we would get from at Lai our taxes the bed tax I mean there's such an increase based on our headcount that's why we give up so much of our monies every year to the other cities like cresy gets a big chunk because they have more residents not on the bedex yes butum the numbers and sales tax money there's just so much money we don't get because we are at a quarter of the true percentage of destined residents corre that's correct and all that information that you just discussed right there would be part of the educational aspect of of any referendum that we take forward um so yeah and and I've already vol you guys have elected me unless someone else wants to take the the poll but I'm I'm happy and have talked to HOA cams and boards and I plan on making a presentation at every HOA meeting and hosting some just forums for those who can make their times but I think a lot of the education is going to come internally we can't spend our own taxpayer dollars on vote Yes or vote no but we can give them the brass tax if this is a pro and the cons the the vote's yours yeah all right C Stevens you have anything else I'm sorry all right thank you um with the surveys or studies uh how long would it take to do those would it we have enough time with uh everything coming up soon it could be tight um the survey alone is going to be massive it it it really it depends on how much um because the the meats and Bounds is is really what's going to take the longest cuz they actually have to go out into the field and survey and the bearings and directions so so really it's it's based upon the amount of area U that that's um to be annexed in or uh proposed to be an we need to do it last meeting when we didn't have a right so if we don't if we run out of time then the involuntary options out then we're stuck with the other option is that right no no okay if you don't make it to this general election you can do it at a special election which the city would pay for or a subsequent General elction but he said it was tight not no I heard that c [Music] m this isn't a hill I'll die on but I'll make the comment I'm I'm more for the uh Commons Drive area the commercial properties uh the income there but um if it's better for the community I'll support the whole thing I I'd prefer just to stick with the Commons Drive but I I do truly understand what you're mentioning about the legis vote and the the restrictions so I will support what I need to support councilman Dustin convincing the folks out there that it's in their best interest to come into the city is really the only Avenue we have voluntary if you uh if you try to shove it down their throat so an involuntary annexation it the chances of that passing are pretty slim but the the the situation is not nearly as simp simple as comparing adval Orum taxes we have franchise fees on Power Water and Sewer on cable um those are not applied to the people in the unincorporate areas right now they will be should they come in and those fees usually are more than the avalum taxes are after all we have 3% on power now so convincing them to voluntarily is not going to come in will not be as simple I think that uh that's that's what we need to do though that if we could to show them that they are going to get a benefit then they will voluntarily want to be part of the city but the volunteer arily is 100% which is illogical we've had a number of voluntary annexations in the last 20 years I don't see why democracy is involuntary I'm sorry I don't see why democracy of a vote is involuntary uh because some folks will say no and and I'm just saying to make to shove it down their throats is more difficult maybe not impossible if it's a bad deal more difficult for it uh the survey cost meets in bounds I had surveys done I estimate that's going to be in the hundreds of thousands of dollars what do you guys think 1110 is the cost they have on briefing yes sir 110,000 mhm and you know that's a substantial cost and then we would have to do a substantial uh political campaign I got my boots on I'm walking I'm walking and knock knocking on doors unless they have a no soliciting sign well I'm just telling you it's a A Hard Road to ho I know I get it we had to pull them out for us to become a city back then but I think times have changed opinions have changed and I think the majority of people in there most a good chunk don't know that they're not in the city and when they find out they want to be yeah I I think there's a different mentality than 40 50 years ago when we had to take them out to become a city and I think we have capable council members staff and benefits that a lot of people want to join in on that we can create a better Destin together and if we're all together we can stop with the the mini hotel suite so we can stop with the car washes and all these things that are indesirable and that's the last few open pieces of land left and if we want to keep the community together it we got to grab it because the county isn't in the business of quality of life and and management growth as we've seen in those unincorporated areas and if we want to keep destined fully destined there's only a couple Parcels left and then when something's built it's built for the next 50 60 years so you know I think it's it is a nominal fee and I and I don't take that lightly but I think the community pulling together not just on their funds but on the emotional value of us being a community makes this worth it and that's kind of my emotional plead but counsman Bagby I support your effort 110% what what's the value proposition for them yeah all right um when you go outside the gates of uh Kelly Plantation to your left if you don't know there's going to be a new private school gonna be there I don't think they have the right infrastructure in place I think that's going to cause a bigger issue on Common's drive to the right you'll see a couple car washes that I don't think a lot of us need um over by fudpuckers is another um storage unit it it's not just there is a money proposition I think we we meet over halfway on the value that we're given the other half is about caring about your community and what it looks like and and living in a place that you love to be in and I understand and I would admit it to anyone to their face or online that dollar to dollar we don't offer enough we can't offer you what you're going to be paying us but do you love dtin and do you want to see this community grow in the right way and I I I would like to think that's at least 30 or 40% of the value okay so it's not a money proposition it's a value proposition I think the the dollar is half it yes so I don't think we can do it this year and I'll tell you why first of all we should do a survey uh of the people just in you know how much ever it costs and have you know we the last time we did something of this endeavor was the Blue Ribbon panel on the municipal Resort tax and so we had seven people volunteer they went and talked to all the groups I mean you I know you've been talking to all the groups and they got 80 something 80 3% of the people in this community to support a tax which in a deep red Community like this is is was very hard to do we don't know where we are with Kelly or rata or Emerald Bay um I think the gold you know we can do the little out Parcels there but we have to know where we're starting from uh because I I I don't share your uh I share your enthusiasm for incorporation I don't share your belief that you know 40 or 50% of these people actually want to come in and pay $1,300 more on a million doll house uh in advalorium taxes not counting all the fees and everything so that they can get a pass to uh the state park or they can launch their boat for free for right now or they can go to the library I just there there's not that value I think the kids is part of it but there aren't a lot of those houses in Kelly and rata those are older couples and they don't have you know 12y olds playing baseball or whatever so I I think we should kind of take a step back and say yes this is where we are and then figure out have focus groups in those neighborhoods and go what would it take for you to to vote yet how do we get you to yes because that's ultimately what we're trying to do is and you know if it if you come in yes it benefits us because our population goes up so we get a larger piece of the uh gas tax or the you know not the tdt but some of the other taxes sales taxes and things like this and boom that helps us and maybe we can lower our military rate from 1 Point uh 615 whatever but I'm just I don't feel I think if we go now we're just going to get blown out of the water we're going to put a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths because we really haven't developed a cohesive value proposition and a plan to execute and you know this is we talked about workshops earlier this would be one of those things where we get a group together of volunteers and says yeah they'll go knock on every door in Kelly and they'll knock on every door in rata Bay and they'll go hey we're just taking a survey and we're just and they bring back that information to us and say here's where you are you're at 38% and here's what they told us here's how you get to 60% or whatever but I just I don't see it in the blue and the green I would support uh what Tori said you know the gold I think we can get and I think the commercial along Common Drive uh and along 98 we can probably get that uh but that doesn't get us any more tax revenue because there's nobody that lives there and so you know that's what's based upon a lot of these taxes is the distribution is based upon the population so I just I want this I really want this it it's the right thing to do I just don't think we have a good plan to execute cute I don't think if if we have to think about what the value proposition is we're going to use to convince these people then we have we don't have a well formulated plan that's all right Council mmid thank you um you know Mr Mayor uh I think the annexation idea is fantastic uh there's a lot of I would love to do it um I think unfortunately um the delay the delay that has been created uh for whatever reason I agree um is is nothing that you or anybody else well I guess we can control because in some way or another was but um it is what it is right I think I think it's a hot I think it's like why this November right I mean I know I know you want to just get it we all would like to um um but like you know when I read very the very first line about the study it says that the requirement by Statute is to provide a study detailing how it can even serve or provide the urban services to the proposed properties just after the things that we talk about tonight and every other meeting I mean we can't even provide some of these services to our citizens already I mean be scared to see what the stud's going to show how can we support all these other people so like that's that's worrying right there um but I I just I I think we're putting the cart for the horse without a little bit more I don't doubt your boot effort and I I don't doubt some of us talking to a lot of our friends yeah I've talked to a a board member on the HOA at Emerald Lakes or whatever and they're all about they're all about it too but um I feel like we're rushing it for this November without you know we just started bringing up a few months ago yep and now we're here I get it but let's make a goal for the next general election with the actual plan to executed my selfish reason for the the statistical reason for having it in November is that it's a presidential year which means you're going to get a larger turnout which means you're going to get a more general population that would be a more fair an accurate statement of the voters who are in there so for me my fear is if we do a special election or if we wait to a non-electoral presidential year yeah you might get a lot of old guards Who come out and are are thinking about the next 5 10 years I'm I'm wanting to get people who are are wanting to be here for the next 10 20 30 years because it's not just the infrastructure without going on a tangent I think we need a EMS station here not one in North Fort Walton to come here when there's an issue like the these little things and these large things all happen and only are going to be able to happen if we're together so I guess the rush is we're here B we're here I should have pushed even harder than I did push with staff um but we're here and it is what it is I think we can still get it done I believe it's the right thing to do I think it's a pivotal point in changing the dynamic of what Destin will be because of what we can be when we're together with this and to the to the Blue Ribbon panel I I absolutely respect and get that if they're part of the city guess what they're voting too now if if they want something changed at that point and they were on the Nay side and then they became a city anyways which evidently happened 40 years ago I don't think everyone was 100% on the uh City becoming a city uh but here we are so now I think it's time to take another jump that doesn't require 100% to move destined towards the right way it go and that's us together making decisions together saying yes and no to the right development and and allowing everyone to have the services even if it doesn't equate to a dollar it's still our home you know so I get we're we're tied logistically to where where are at now councilman gu thank you sir one quick thing um one thing that uh councilman Bagby asked you is what do they get and and for some of them I I was here whenever be pre-council but when they were voting on the Morgan sport complex and I watched several Kelly Plantation and uh Emerald Bay people stand up and claim we are destined we are destined they claim they're so proud of destined but they they're not contributing in in that portion so I think maybe a sense of Integrity maybe when they claim their Destin they can they can be a Sense part of Destin um and I do have another question um councilman b or I I apologize councilman dwey dtin brought up um the the fees for the surveys and and everything that's going to partake in here what fund would that come out of um those fees are paid from the general fund from the general fund yes and if we incorporated the short-term rentals where would that money go from the general fund okay and I do have one other thing I do appreciate something that uh councilman dtin said a second ago about potentially forcing them into into this uh but it is a vote and unfortunately uh Joe Biden's my president there's nothing I can do about that I lost that vote all right I like that we're not voting on him tonight God all right I'm seeing no further discussions um I would entertain a a motion of substitute I I plead for it all i r respect logical motion to involuntary annexation as shown on tached area map covering gold blue and green second Motion in a second any further discussions motion is to on is it involuntary yeah the involuntary to start the involuntary process process which is uh referendum and started with the outcome Kevin talking about November as in this next election yes sir let see how fast speed the government is let's ask question yep where what is the last date Ray you may know August 11th at noon I think it's about August 15th to put something on the put something on the ballot and then it would have to be clarified I think that council is authorizing the 110,000 or whatever it is to get the legal descriptions necessary if we're doing does that 110 include the green yes that's that's to do everything yes okay so we're going to get surveys of green blue and gold in a month a month six weeks less than a month really because you got to take out I mean I'm talking 25 business days or 24 business things the owner has been made aware of this great opportunity you have to do two readings for the ordinance that'll go with that correct yeah yeah you would have two readings of the ordinance and then when it goes to um the supervisor of elections it would have to be translated in English and Spanish and there's a few Bobby I love you but that that no um I think we're dooming it to fail dooming it to failure yes pushing ahead like this and not offer a substitute motion that that we go forward with it but not for this November the following election cycle would you consider a special election which would only be $10,000 until we can do the surveys and the and the Outreach to the folks I just don't think it's going anywhere just disagree but we can disagree we can Absolutely I'll I'll second substitute motion and one comment I honestly think we get one bite at this apple and you know good faster cheap and if we try to take this bite between now and August 11th 20124 we are going to get shot down and we're going to burn this bridge for another 10 years so I would I would rather take some time and do it right and I and I agree with you on the uh you know you're going to get more people voting this November than we've probably ever had vote in the history of this city and we will get a fairer representation because if if it's a special election the nose will all show up absolutely I guarantee you but I I'm going to support the substitute motion because I just I think we got one shot and we're not going to hit anything before August 11 in my op and I'll add to that point about if if the referendum fails then you can't Annex for two years right that same property yeah and and and I would just point out that on these on sales tax that we did for the school district we pushed it ahead the first time uh and it failed and we have it was 10 years before we were able to put it back on the ballot did all the footwork that we needed to enlisted all kinds of people in the communities to to support our effort and the sales tax passed that time and if we don't do that on this it doesn't doesn't have a chance and and to that point and I know it's it it wasn't so as the legislative sponsor to the annexation I have been doing this for over 14 months now and I know that's just one person I know that only goes one so far but but just for everyone to understand I have been sitting down with the cams the HOAs every acronym someone can come up with to say I manage or am on a board of a neighborhood and I at least may not know every single person's percentage on this but I understand the talking points the pain points and the wish list for almost every Community the there's there's two I have not been to yet um and and truly have sat down with a majority of the board but while it's not real scientific statistic data I I have done a lot of face-to-face uh craft bar dinners for a lack of a better term all right all right well what are we voting on we're we're voting on all of it Sub sub first for what I'm sorry May for two years till the next legislative cycle not legislative next voting cycle is when we vote on it and I'd like to add to the motion we survey we didn't get any of that he any of that sorry I mean I did okay well tell me we we mayor right uh got it the first part of the motion was it area map covering blue and green or blue and gold or does it involve green we're covering all of the area that all the areas including green okay but what we're saying is we were we're not going for this on the ballot in November we're going to go for it on the following uh elections that will be two years distance and I would like to add to it that we uh at will have to come back and and talk about what we can spend but we need to do some Outreach to these communities to find out what it is that they need to make them be in favor of it yeah and I you know for the record we fought to include this area in the original incorporation understand that history real well it it was taken out by a legislative act yeah so this was supposed to all be part of the original and should have been but you know we're going to have to be very uh very concise and very good at what we do to get it in so that's the motion and and we'll Gove forward from there all right Ray you got that Y and then okay um I do have a a local pack personally ready to go and that's at least my my thought process on the funding uh since the city gets it gets dirty really quick in the waters of what we can and can't do as a city um I've already have a verbal committed donors uh the local pack is going to be one Destin um there's nothing out there yet but I was waiting for you know I can't act before the council acts uh but to that point of the funding that was at least my thought process all right and uh whatever is legal for us to do get money from outside sources would be wonderful yeah is it pretty well is it pretty well guaranteed that if we had a special election that I mean you're gonna you're gonna it would be much harder than this coming up in November so so the next the next election after in two years or two and a half years is not a it's not a presidential election yeah so I mean half yeah what we're going to get this year do do we I understand where we're going from I ordered a survey two weeks ago that's not been done yet on a on a small parcel what would you do so I mean that's a that seems real nice $110,000 for all this but like how hard would you work for the best project I don't it matters how hard you work I know surveyors you know all right we're getting tangent all right all right call the vote unless there's any further discussion on the substitute motion of councilman dtin all right eyes have it Kick the Can oh that hurt it's okay that's okay I'll be here a couple more years Mr zenu debt issuance uh the next item is an update uh regarding the debt issuance uh next steps as well as timing uh Finance director yes good evening again uh mayor and council members so at on the June 3 meeting um I brought forth uh a proposal uh that would take about three months to to issue debt uh we need to reimburse the city 9 million for the purchase of one Harbor Boulevard and we just uh signed the contract for undergrounding um which is a 10 million contract so I need to raise funds to meet that uh obligation um at the June 30 meeting uh Council requested that we request interest from local banks and that we do a a request for qualifications from the underwriters and that we bring to the next council meeting a revised timeline so this evening's agenda item shows the revised timelining uh timeline um so so I'm currently working with the city's financial advisor to uh write the request for qualifications and a request for letters of interest from the banks um I hope to have that ready for your review on July 22nd uh on August 7th we would like to release the RFQ and rli to the banks and the underwriters um and on September 4th we'll have the bid opening September 5th we have a bid committee uh Gathering so they will review the bid openings uh so that should be ready for us to present at the September 16th council meeting uh to present the results um so the results that we're going to U Supply to council uh will show the differences between um you know what the if we have letters of interest from Bankers what the potential rates could be and see if they can match the duration that I need to match my cash inflows um and the amount I need um so at that meeting Council will need to choose if we're going to go the bank loan route or if we should do the public issuance route um at that meeting if we choose the public issuance route it will still take approximately three months to complete our um ratings with the rating agencies and the uh preliminary official statement which is the document that will be taken around and marketed to all of the big investment firms like um on on Wall Street to uh to raise the funds so this is um so if we do do the bank loan route uh we could hope to close maybe in early October uh by mid October if we go the the bond route we would probably be closing in the November December time frame so that is the the revised uh timeline and I'm here if you have any questions all right seeing none do I have a motion have to ad the so there's there's no recommended motion listed this was just informing Council of the Revis timeline okay all right uh that I'm just I'm trying to be nice Ray you need a bathroom right all right Louis go ahead okay um this is the update for the linear Trail which is now at the 60% design uh stage oh no I'm good just getting death stairs by staff all right let's get a win let's get a d good good evening Council and mayor um so we brought 30% to yall uh we incorporated your comments the committee's comments and our back was 60s um the one thing that we wanted to bring back at 60s was easements in hand and there's eight properties that we need easements from did not quite hit that goal yet we have in the packet the EET template of the letter in the easement itself and the only thing missing was the surveys of each property's easement area that we need we do have the surveys in hand so um we are ready to put those out on the street this week um mail the packets to the eight property owner ERS um and get them to sign at the dated line uh the mayor has been out talking to his property owners along with dag and we got positive feedback from everyone yeah no negative yeah so we don't anticipate any problems getting those eight easements but uh the letter is going to give them a 3-we timeline to come in and get a notorized signed and we can get the easements recorded um anybody who doesn't come in within that three weeks then we'll send the mayor after him again with the notary yes so uh with that um we do have a recommended motion um that includes what parks and rec recommended um and one of those was take the palm trees out of the catalog and not have palm trees along the linear Trail the other was um to deal with the trees that were taking down um to replace trees around the city for the trees that are being lost as part of this project uh so we can come back at 90s with how many trees that would be kind of suggested areas around town where we can plant them and a cost associated with that obviously we can decide at 90s whether or not we want to move forward with that plan or stick to the actual Land Development code and replace the trees that are required for the land Land Development codes um language um we have the plans in the packet the landscape architecture plans are the nice pretty colorful ones so I don't know if you want to flip through each of those and go through them it's pretty much the same plan you've seen just moving along to a further stage um any questions I got the team behind me um and we can uh answer them for you Jim Mr Mayor I move that city council approve 60% construction documents with the revisions requested from The Parks and Recreation committee along with the additional revisions and to have the plans move forward to 90% construction document second oh boy oh boy motion in a second further discussions seeing none open the vote yeah all right all right eyes have it unanimously so moved well done guys thank you so much for your time thank you thank you for all your time thank you for staying now the library all right Ryan two for two come on yes the library improvements yeah all right good evening so um Library came to the engineering Division and said hey we need some more parking for employees in the back um it's too dark back there too um so what can you do to help us uh in this packet is we went and got our own development order um to increase the parking spaces for the employees which is gaining them four spaces back there adding two lights back there um while we're doing that project we said why not also add a light in the front by the Ada there because it's too dark at night there and then there's some storm water rework with the new impervious that we're adding with the parking spaces uh so with that this is basically 100% plans with the permit already in hand I'm looking for the blessing to move forward to get pricing and get this under contract and get the parking spaces added all right thank you so much cman Stevens all right I move to approve the construction plans as presented and to direct the city manager to work with staff to begin procurement of Construction Services second all right seeing no further discussion open the vote this a two for Ryan tonight thank you Ryan oh two and0 thank you done thank you thank you for your work Ryan information inform uh the next two items are informational TDC report uh and also draft minutes for the Committees and um boards got any questions answer them any announcements yes announcement I have a question right councilman and this is for Teresa at the next meeting can you ask Jennifer if we can have a year-over-year number of units because there was you know 2% is basically flat actually 2% is probably a decrease because the number of units has probably increased by 2% over last year plus people factor in inflation and charge more for their so if we're at 2% over we're probably uh less than what we were as far as occupancy uh last year and so I I would like to know the occupancy numbers because they are year-over-year because they are most likely going down and that is a trend that we you know everybody goes oh well we're still pulling in money everybody's still no we're pulling in money because people are maxing out what they're charging these folks and people are leaving us and if they are leaving us we need to know that before it becomes a real decrease in the bed tax revenue okay may I would like to uh before I turn it turn it over to uh to Tamra for all the announcements I'd like to express appreciation for to the parks department and the Sheriff's Office uh and for their collaboration in getting the firework sh down on the 4th of July there was tremendous collaboration on you know it was Flawless and everybody had a good time so uh kudos to great effort thank you good good evening mayor and Council we received a notice from piis Barrett from the Department of Environmental Protection regarding noro point they awarded the Construction contract to RJ Gorman Marine construction out of Panama City we came in second best for best Harbor in the nation after an intense crowdsource competition it was a lot of fun to see so many locals as well as visitors get behind that and share their love for our Harbor the city's Birthday Bash will take place on the evening of Saturday August 10th it's absolutely open to everybody and we're hoping that we've come up with something that all ages can be involved with so we'll be celebrating four Decades of the city and we'll gather at Harbor Walk Village there's going to be stilt Walkers lots of photo ops bouncy houses a drone show some craft areas for kids and Specialty drinks for adults and again just some hopefully something for everyone we have a lot of entertainment live music several different bands so it should be a lot of fun and again that is Saturday August 10th in the evening we were notified by the Florida Recreation development assistance program that we received a $50,000 Grant toward our pickle ball project so we had a lot of positivity from the community about that today thank you ready to go Jeff mayor ask a couple questions sure um first off um okay um awesome about the the harbor um um that we place second um just want to let everyone know I did little bit research in all those uh harbors and nine out of the 10 Harbors had Harbor Masters so just something to keep in mind um and then one other thing um with the uh uh 40th anniversary thing at HarborWalk is there any way we can possibly talk to them to see about waving fees for for Destin residents thank you for asking uh we obviously you all have waved the parking fees for the city lots and I've been meeting with them they have been wonderful to deal with we meet every week since it is going to be down there it's the best spot that the FAA approved for the Drone show and they have waved the fee as well for the parking lot that day good stuff the whole year right do not get me in trouble all right is that the end of report yeah that's that's all we have all right good deal all right Kim public hearings before that can uh Ray Bailey please have a break yes that's why I've been asking absolutely all right we'll take a f minute break and we will wrap this up he's got to legally be here he's got to legally be here sorry SC you over yeah talking later so we can do everything yeah we I mean he just he gave that for surve yeah that's where I'm my my frustration Learning lesson is all right begin with the end of mine even though I let them know exactly the legal of this I should have been a little bit more formal with it is what it is divine timing e e e e e e Al righty we have a quorum so I am going to start this meeting back up all right Kim public hearings so this is a 135 Bing Drive conditional use Tim nobl on half of Matthew Roberts Elite Enterprises LLC is requesting conditional use approval for a personal services medical spa with a full-time doctor on staff which offices services such as massage therapy light therapy an esthetician Services the subject property like I said is 135 Bening drive and the parcel ID number is in the staff report um if you have any questions on the staff report itself uh staff is here to answer questions and we also is the applicant here and do you wish to make a presentation okay so the applicant is here to answer questions as well if needed all right seeing that this is a public hearing anyone at this time who would wish to speak on this specific topic uh please do so all right seeing none okay and just for the record I'm going to enter in the staff report and all its attachments into the record of City's composite exhibit a that's it Oh I thought you were G to no no unless you have questions no no okay um so do we have a motion on the table or any discussions mayor I move that city council approve conditional use lu-1 49-20 24 subject to approval of the development order minor deviation and the project receiving all applicable city and state permits second all right Motion in a second any further discussions all right seeing none open the vote all right eyes have unanimously so moved welcome to the community awesome does our insurance cover this what he's got going on that's more importantly I'm G to go grab some coffee at each pass and then on the way back home stop by thanks thank you all right come all right the next item is interlight Engineering Corporation on behalf of Johnny Boswell requesting approval of a conditional use application a major development order application and a major subdivision application this project includes the construction of a 54 unit long-term multif family attached Town Home Development and the associated site infrastructure subject property is generally located within the 100 blocks of cyber and Calhoun Avenue totaling approximately 5 .2 Acres I know the applicant um is here and represented by Mr Tatum um I'm going to enter into the record the staff report and Exhibits unless you object Mr Tatum okay so that's City's composite exhibit a and then Mr Tatum did you want to make a presentation just need to SAR you in or the city clerk or your or your client if he's going to speak staff speaks I do all right good evening council members um Stephen Tatum from Matthews and Matthews here on behalf of the applicant uh Johnny Boswell um I'm used to staff giving a presentation in other jurisdictions staff giving a presentation to begin with but let me just kind of walk you through some of um where our background was before we get into the details of this particular project is before you um this project first came to the city um February of 2020 on a preapp meeting uh at that time it was a 37 lot single family residential subdivision um it was officially submitted on November 23rd 2021 as a PUD and the homes at that time were designed to be short-term rentals um pushed forward to April 28th of 22 um and we find out from staff that short-term RS are conditional use so we have to apply for conditional use uh went through that process and in September on September 22nd 22 uh went before the LPA and the LPA rejected it because they did not want the shortterm rals in that area um this was all before I was involved this was how I got involved um I got contacted at that point um and after having talk to staff and what happen the things that were said at LPA we decided to redesign the project um however because of the difference in price associated with short-term rental single family Lots as opposed to regular single family lots there was it wasn't a financially feasible project that way so we had to increase the density the only way to increase the density was to go to a multif family project so the new design is for 54 townhouse units they will be town homes they will not be duplexes triplexes they will be platted individual town home lots that can be sold off individually and will be and my client and to sell them off he's not intending to hold them and keep them and rent them um so um this project is located in the coun mixed juice Village zoning District it's directly across from well it's a little bit north of where the you know where the Cottages are on coun so north of that and then going back over to cybert U is it Clement Taylor Park is right there um so that's where this property's at it's all vacant land um we noticed that you know that area although the CMV is a mixed juice zoning District that area is primarily residential until you get over onto the the bay itself um so we wanted to design a project even though we were you know asking for increased or a larger density than the um single family product uh but we wanted a project that was kind of in keeping with that residential field the area um so in order to reduce some of those impacts we did several things with this project uh to begin with in the CMU zoning District you're allowed for multif family you're allowed up to 12 dwelling units per acre our project comes in at 10.4 dwelling units per acre that's a 133% reduction under what the Land Development code allows um and that's a significant decrease in the development Community giving up 13 dwelling units or 133% of your potential dwelling units that's a big deal uh we could have built six or we could have applied for 62 um and we came in at 54 um the CMV zoning District also allows for a height of up to 50 feet or four stories we're going to keep this at 35 feet and two stories again trying to stay with that residential fill of that area um the minimum open space requirement in CMV you know 25% which is pretty standard across the board in most of the zoning districts in in the city um we're providing 36% of our site as open space there is 2.13 Acres of open space out of the 5.2 um the project requires a minimum of 135 parking spaces we're providing 219 parking spaces it's 84 Extra Spaces um so we took this product this project designed to LPA in August of last year um we got unanimous support from the LPA on this uh members of the LPA recommended for approval based on the new design because it removed short-term rentals they liked that um and also they liked the fact that the individual units themselves would cost less than a single family product would just by nature of the Beast of creating a town home smaller footprint easier cheaper to build it's going to cost less so it's providing some some Workforce type housing in that area um and that's important because you know as y'all know housing prices in Destin are high okay um the coun mixed juice comp provision which is policy 1- 2.4.3 says the coun area is envisioned as a walkable medium scale Resort mixed juice area it provides a transition between the South Harbor mixed juice area and us98 to the South Old Destin area to the Northeast and limitor parts of the north um plan developments that increase pedestrian connectivity eastwest vehicular connectivity and Parks or open space shall be encouraged So to that end from your comp plan we're providing elements we have sidewalks within the project that connect to cyber that connect to coun and along our street frontages on both of those roads using uh providing that pedestrian connectivity we have east W vehicular connectivity in that area through our road that runs through our subdivision um and we're providing 36% open space and a pocket park um which is also things that are to be encouraged according to your comprehensive plan um the comp plan goes on to say the coun area has an excellent tree canopy and before major new development occurs it is important the tree preservation ordinance be enhanced to ensure the Lush character of the area continues even as new development occurs um I project more than complies with the tree ordinance we're saving several significant trees and we're providing 74 trees when all that's required for us to provide it's 54 um it goes on to say the area shall develop as a mixed juice area accommodating primarily medium to high density long-term and short-term residential uses now this is in your comprehensive plan that says this for this area it will primarily be medium to high density long-term and short-term residential uses primarily um but also says that commercial hotels Motel bed and breakfast establishments and other commercial transient living accommodations shall be allowed that means that we could go on this property and build a hotel however May room hotel that we could fit in there with on that 5.2 acres and it would be an allowed use not a conditional use but because we're wanting to provide multif family residential use we have to come and ask for a conditional use um so those are more intense uses that are allowed as a right um and of course that means more traffic those are bigger traffic generators than than our residential development um and we know traffic's a big concern especially in that area of the city um but our traffic study which was not included in your packet but I'm going to move it into evidence unless Miss cop has an objection no objection for all right so this traffic report shows that our 54 units during the PM peak hour of the city or um yeah and City's PM peak hour will create 30 trips that's 30 total trips within the PM peak hour to put that in perspective that's one trip every two minutes on average um so the amount of traffic that we'll be producing is relatively minor in fact it's less than what the 37 single family homes would produce and I have here a copy of the traffic report that was created for that project and it shows that the 37 single family detached houses would have produced seven more trips 37 trips in the PM peak hour um so we're actually by building the town homes creating less trips on the road now why is that doesn't really make sense right um the reason for the lower trip counts is because the um on average people that reside in town homes have fewer cars um the homes are smaller it's usually younger families young professionals or retirees that tend to live in them um but I think more importantly the location for Town Homes generally is intended to be anyway in walkable bikable communities and that's exactly what we're creating here um this Project's within one mile of new Marina existing Marina um vent V that's being created several restaurants Mr dtin um Harbor wal Village is right there there's water sports businesses there's Clement Taylor and Leonard dtin Park uh the library the community center uh the fire districts right there at us um not to mention all the other businesses located on Mountain ailia um stalman and on harb Boulevard all within a mile so not only are we creating a community that is walkable bikable to work for people but also to to get the things they need no there's not a grocery store out there but you know that we can't just create a grocery store that's going to be feasible in that area um aside from that everything that they would need within walking or biking distance in fact once the cross town connector gets completed there's a good chance a lot of those trips never even have to touch 98 you know once that happens if they're going to say to the new Publix or wind Dixie have a much better shot um so all of that said this creates the perfect opportunity for you guys to help us provide for Destin's Workforce something that is within walking distance of many businesses and many Civic uses um also you can't really ignore after all the discussion I've heard today this will at least bring the adalum up a little bit in that area um oh and finally back to the comp plan um um chapter three of your comp plan is your housing element and I'm just going to read a couple of Select Provisions from there I have to get my glasses out for this one and I have a copy for this field I'd like to see it but this is in your comp plan chapter 3 housing element introduction and this is in quotations quality residential choices with easy Mobility is part of the city's 2027 strategic Vision quality development and revitalization is a 2017 strategic goal goal it goes on to say the major topics of this element include allocation of adequate land for necessary housing this goal and related objectives and policies emphasize the need for adequate Quant quantities of housing for people employed within the city limits along with the need for housing for the city's permanent population to to assure a sustainable Civic Vitality for the city next bullet point making housing affordable for city workers this goal and ated objectives and policies provide the framework for significantly enhancing the affordability of housing for city workers recognizing the below average wages and above average market prices of Housing and rents in the City compared with those in the rest of the Metropolitan statistical area and finally assuring housing job AC uh job accessibility this goal and related objectives and policies promote practical multimodal access linkages between home and workplace within the city so your comp plan speaks to the creation of something that we have we we're asking to provide um I know this is a conditional use but we believe it's a use that is needed in that area it will be beneficial to to the residents of the city and to you know upand cominging new residents moving to the area younger people who need a place to live and by creating you know as as they get older get married have kids get a little bit better off they move up into another single family home that opens this back up so just in increasing that inventory of housing is good for the city um if you have any questions for me or for David Smith I'm sorry I didn't introduce him at all uh from interlight he is our engineer yall know David um if you have any questions about design he's here to answer those um otherwise thank you for listening to me at least all right councilwoman AAR just I'm sor yeah just for for um yep public comment yeah it is public comment but I'm also going to ask staff to just go through the criteria for a conditional use for you since this is a conditional use go through that um briefly and of course Mr Tatum if you have any questions or cross-examination for Mr Butler when he's done testifying you're welcome to ask any questions but Mr Butler could you please um explain to the council the conditional use criteria and staff's position on whether they're met I ask sure good evening mayor and Council so as you may be aware staff reviews conditional uses per the criteria outlined in Land Development code section 71210 um there's six criteria that we review accordingly it is land use compatibility uh and staff believes that this Criterion has been met by this project the scale and intensity um sufficient size sight specs and infrastructure staff feels that this Criterion has been met sorry three is proper use of mitigative techniques um this this project has met all of the Land Development code requirements for storm water man management buffers open space as stated earlier Etc so staff feels that this Criterion on has been met um hazardous waste there's no hazardous W waste that's anticipated to be generated as part of this development therefore meeting this Criterion um fifth is over proliferation of use um so currently in the staff report there's a breakdown of the properties within the zoning District um we've kind of I broke it down further so there's 27 Parcels existing in this zoning District today four of them contain multif family uses there's one parcel that has nine town homes on it and then the other's only other three properties that contain any other multif family use or multiple dwellings um so approving this project would just bring it to 12 of 27 Parcels in that zoning District would contain a multi family use um and so staff defers to you all on whether this constitutes an over proliferation of multif family attached dwellings within the stoning District so Mr Butler just to clarify on what you're saying in the staff report it gives a percentage of the total number of properties in CMV um that are multif family with and without this project so could you just read through that part also yeah and so that was part of my clarification so the staff report says 56% if you do the 12 out of 27 Parcels it's actually 4 4% and that's because the it says in the staff report there's 12 multif Family Properties that is inclusive of the nine town home properties because town homes are their own property so that's how that nine or that's how that 12 became because there's nine existing town homes and then only three other properties that contain the multif family use so if approved then is it 44% 44% would be multi Parcels of parcels within the zoning District would contain a multi family use okay thank you and then the last Criterion is compliance with all applicable laws and ordinances and as this project is before you tonight it has met the criteria and all and development code regulations as well as um gathered a LPA recommended approval at the August 3D 2023 LPA meeting unanimously and we are here to answer any questions Mr Tatum did you have any so not really cross- examination but did remind of something that that jumped out at me um Daniel did you pull these numbers off of the property presses website our GIS manager pulled these numbers and I assume he pulled them from the County's GIS database okay um do you have council members do you have this in your packet okay you'll notice on there there is one property that says five on it that's the Cottages um whether or not that even qualifies as multi family I don't know but if you go and you look at the breakdown on that property only one of those is a duplex the uh the other three items or three houses that are there listed as single family residential on the property appraisers website and the one that has four on it um only one of those there's there's one building there that's a duplex and then there's two single family on that parcel so there's even less multif family than I mean the parcel count is completely accurate but there's even less than what what this shows but um what Daniel put together on the parcels is completely accurate and that's all I got thank you Daniel on that map South of cyber where the new construction is almost complete of the Town Homes is that a different Zone it is a different zoning District okay all right all right so before we start seeing that this is a public hearing at this time if anyone would like to make a public comment on this specific topic this is is your time to do so all right Sandy hey Sandy traml Indian Trail Destin um I guess one of my biggest complaints here is that there's no guest parking I'm a grandmother if I want to go visit my grandkids in this place I have to hope that they don't have their garage full of their stuff and I can park my car there there's no place to park so what's going to happen is they're going to end up using the parks across the street to park cars so they can go visit which I think if you'll remember on holiday aisle we're already having some of those problems and our code may say that's okay but I think we need to change the code did you say your name and address I'm sorry yeah okay I'm I'm [Laughter] yep drove eight hours today all right anyway anyone else public comments seeing none I will close the public comments and change my window all right c yeah Stephen Tatum again yeah let me just rebut that um to say No guest parking is I don't know where she's getting that from um we we have 84 Extra Spaces above and beyond what's required by code um so I believe that with there being 54 town homes and we're providing 84 Extra Spaces above what is required by code that we're definitely providing some guest parking any questions are those additional spaces one per unit would someone own that space as these get sold out are you considering those there two car D Smith with inter light engineering civil engineer there's two car garages and then two spaces in the driveways okay so we got four back okay okay councilwoman AB my question is you um alluded to it being affordable what is the uh going rate for the uh purchase price of these vehic of these Town Homes well obviously the Market's going to dictate that um we're a long ways from breaking ground on this project if it gets approved and you prices could go up prices could go down right now we' be looking in the high three but we can't tie ourselves to any real number because we don't know when you know interest rates are going to allow and then the Market's going to allow if it's two years from now and everything is now $500,000 for us to build these same units you know so but the plan is to build a product that can be listed at a price that hopefully can be you know Workforce type housing we're not building a luxury it's going to be nice don't get me wrong it's going to be nice but it's it's not the a high-end gated community ones the ones Shane did up on Wildcat Mountain were in the high 3es which is yeah sorry the ones that Shane developed and sold uh these are toomes they're Town Homes yeah the I mean I would assume based on I I know the I know the contractor they're they're going to be nice uh councilman gu thank you sir I appreciate that thank you I do have a a certain comment that I want to make uh so one thing he did read is from the LDC but it states specifically in the same LDC additionally it is the intent of the uh Calhoun mixed use Village to encourage lower density residential developments and mixed use developments by specifically not allowing Standalone M multifam residential uses but rather to require multif family uses to include a appropriate non-residential uses and components is I'm sorry and components of the development um and in there it also talks about commercial uh retail um is there going to be any commercial retail in in this development or is it going to be a standalone multif family non uh is it going to be a standalone multif family residential use um so first of all so as you know I wasn't trying to mislead you I was reading from the comprehensive plan which does not include that language about the Standalone multif family uses um however we are not a standalone multif family use we are providing a public pocket part which is non-residential passive recreational use it doesn't have to be a commercial use where's the pocket park on the parcel it is um on the coun side which would be kind of to the on the north side of our entrance you have a depiction oh yeah oh the storm water how Deep's the storm water okay all right and can I get I still need staff clarification on on something that they mentioned um did you state or or because it seemed to go back and forth was there a case of over proliferation I I just want to be clear on that so staff provided the data on the housing um stock in this zoning District specifically and so we are um leaving that determination up to city council uh as to whether or not you all feel this is uh an over proliferation of this specific use thank you all right uh councilman Stevens thank you um so this is long-term not shortterm so how do we guarantee that it'll stay longterm even if it's sold later so in order for it to become a short-term rental it would have to come back up to you on a conditional use approval so whether it was the entire development or if it was just one of the single units you'd still it wouldn't be as simple as well I mean they could start renting it but code enforcement should should be on top of that and shut that down pretty quick um and while I've got the microphone lit up um the over proliferation question I mean what does that mean um it's it's it's vague at best um but I would point out that your comp plan and your Land Development code say that this area is intended primarily to be medium to high density residential development primarily so if we're looking at only 44% of the parcels containing multif family uses on them we're not primarily at that level yet um you know I think primarily definitely is more than 50% of the area being used for that purpose um so just thought that should be pointed out anything else Stephens all right uh Council mtin thank you mayor medium to high density what would medium be on this parcel uh let me take a look at the range real quick and I'll I can get that number to you I think it was 12 at top 12 at the top so mid-range if you want to go all the way to one dwelling unit an acre would be six then that's that's I think that's a correct calculation medium medium would be six this is 10 um the pocket park does it have any public parking so it's primarily going to be used by the residents that are in the in the development David Smith with inter yeah it it interconnects with uh there's pedestrian interconnections that connect to the 10ft sidewalks being proposed along cowon right so there's pedestrian opportunities for people to walk in and then walk around the park facility but it has no public bargain no sir so to uh to consider that a commercial use or or a mitigating is uh really unsupported in my opinion let me ask another question about mixed use mixed use districts such as this one of the other mixed use districts in the city is that per parcel or is it just in the district so how do you determine how do you make a mixed use if you if you uh approve all of one use in an area so unlike the Town Center mixed use district with which has specific language within the um District itself that requires the building or the development to be mixed use right there is no such provision in the CMV and therefore the mix of uses allowed within the district range from residential to commercial so there's the mix of uses not necessarily the parcel or development in and of itself so do so how do you determine an over proliferation then Eye of the Beholder what was that I'm sorry said is it the eye of the beholder how do you if there is no percentage how do you determine when it's an over proliferation well that's why we provided the numbers in the staff report about the percentage of use by parcel and then the number of of uh parcels and um that are multif family um to at least give a groundwork or Foundation upon which council could make that determination well I get that but there's no criteria it appears Eye of the Beholder as I said um 54 units on five acres it's high density it's this is high density and I and I really I'm having a hard time continuing to approve these high density developments in I mean to say that that is uh compatible with the neighborhoods that's there now is pretty much of a stretch and a conditional use tell me Define conditional does that mean we can approve it disapprove it or approve it with conditions so there's three um categories that you you look at when you have a use coming into the city or proposed in the city whether it's permitted prohibited or conditional if it's permitted the use itself won't come to councel if it's prohibited it also won't come to you because it's not allowed but if it's conditional then you look at the criteria that Daniel Butler our planner just read to you and determine if those criteria are met in staff's opinion um they found that the other criteria were met and they did not have a position on this particular criteria of the over proliferation they were leaving that to council so um further I can read the definition of conditional use per the LDC which is a use that would not be a apprpriate generally or without restriction throughout the zoning District but which if controlled as to number area location or relation to the neighborhood would promote public health safety morals order Comfort convenience appearance Prosperity or general welfare so meets all criteria if it doesn't meet one criteria in our opinion is that that's supposed to meet all of the criteria for a conditional use that's what supposed to do so the Land Development code said medium to high density this is definitely high density that if you read the Land Development code it says it's the intent of CMV to encourage lower density residential developments and mixed use developments by specifically not allowing Standalone multi family residential uses but rather to require multif family uses to include appropriate non-residential uses as components of the development therefore they uh put in the pocket park to meet that criteria um with no parking okay well they have how many is your total parking spaces we're 84 over how many is total 200 and but just to give Council the idea you've got 56 town homes and 29 parking SP and how many of those are open to the public well the ones I guess around the pool could a person could pull in there and park in them but I mean it's not gonna be advertised as being open to the public get it I get it but I do wanna I want to touch on something that that you've said a couple of times this is not a high density development in the planning world this is not high density and I I would hope the planners in the room would agree with me on this um I used to be a planner myself this isn't high density development this is medium density development even at 12 dwelling units an acre now I know 12 is the max allowed in this zoning District but how many is allowed in tcmu 22 24 something like that that's high density residential what how many is it allowed in HDR somewhere around that same number that's high density residentials on it so right now we're at a medium density zoning it's just at the upper end of what's allowed in this particular District but the density itself is a medium density well if we if we pick densities out of all the other districts in town and use that as an argument to justify what medium dity then then medium density has no meaning at all except for as a reflection of the highest density in town it actually it does have a meting um and medium density and and there's no textbook definition but from a planning standpoint medium density is in the range that we're talking about it's not the high densities that you get when you start looking at you condominium projects and that sort of thing where you can get 20 30 40 units per acre you know that's not that's high density um so that's that's typically the way it's perceived in the planning World um the other thing that I wanted to bring up is you know requiring a commercial retail office space to be part of this project is basically requiring the property owner to create something that probably is not going to be rented I what what would you like to see there if if that was the the key problem with this project an office building on one of the corners that is leased out for you know I 2,000 square feet of of real estate space or something like that I mean is that what you have in mind or are you thinking a true mixed use development where you've got commercial office space on bottom and then going up with residential above it because if that's what you're thinking well that's certainly not what the character of the neighborhood is of course that's not what I'm thinking we've already established that mixed use does not apply to the parcels in this District unlike where the new public is going so staff's trading that out for me and I don't suggest that at all okay all right so I can give you a little bit more insight on the density question that you were just talking about um so the code provides with respect to CMV that the intent of this zoning district is to preserve the character of the nearby old Destin area and to provide a mixed use transitional area between the higher intensity South Harbor mixed use zoning district and the less intense surrounding low density residential zoning areas and then it says the CMU is envisioned as a walkable medium scale Resort mixed use area and that plan developments that increase pedestrian connectivity East West vehicular connectivity and Parks or open space shall be encouraged so clearly the intent of the density is in comparison to what's higher in the South Harbor and lower in the calhon area if that gives you perspective and I I would you know I would say that the density around this project if it's supposed to be a transition area 10 per acre is too much all right councilman Schmidt thank you thank you for presentation everybody being here can you can you um it's been a long one so can you remind me the original plan before you were on board in 2020 was to bring individual home individual homes or how how many did you say that's right the original plan was was for 37 single family houses and all of them would be available at short-term rentals um the LPA did not yeah I mean would they be considered putting 37 or single family homes there again with if if the short if the short-term rental was on the table yes the problem is the you're going to sell the house or the town home based upon the market right so right but the value of a single family short-term rental is what we need or we need the increased density from the town homes one of the two if if the short-term rentals were on the table then absolutely we could go that route but since short-term rentals are off the table then we need the increased density to make it an economically viable project because the last thing you want is for us to get a development order and then not be able to get funding or you know we have to build a crappy product or turn around and is there interest in doing like partial uh short-term rentals and non-short term rentals single family homes from your client the the percentage of short-term rentals that it was going to have to be to make at work I was in the 90s percentile so it was basically an entire short-term rental project um we did we did run those numbers though right yeah you know it's it's every time we get one of these traffic studies are always make it look perfect the maps make things look perfect and da you know I mean uh yeah what happens when people put uh CRA stuff in their garage and don't use it for two vehicles what happens with those two vehicles where are they going to go well what happens all no I mean you're not wrong I've seen it happen um but the that's the additional parking putting two cars inside of a garage that's the additional parking in the driveway and you would you know right um you know because you so I've heard a lot of different presentations from you so I always always they're very intriguing uh you sold this multiple times as Workforce housing you know which that's let's be honest this is not Workforce housing the uh I think the median income in Destin's like $449,000 you know and so I don't think you're going to be selling these things for 300 something thousand dollars um so I just would like to you know if we're going to rethink what it's actually going to be used for we should also be look at you know potential changes to what you doing um if you want to build town homes or whatever they're calling them you know maybe we take three of them off the the corner lot and put uh parking for you overflow parking I think we did something similar to the aelia lot where we had where they had to put additional parking so would they be interested in removing some plots and putting parking overflow parking well that was actually the um we've already reduced the amount of of units we were trying to to put in there you know we're not staying at the the high end of the density um you know as high was there interest to remove some to put overflow parking I mean I don't know that there's a design El way to make that work um well I mean I'm not engineer but you have a park being used you have a retention Pond being used as a park let's be honest it's not a park and we've tried that before here at the city and we couldn't do that either um but I feel like you could remove some units and put overflow parking because to be honest you're going to create a massive issue with the neighboring properties and the parks leard Dustin and everyone around them whenever cars don't have anywhere to park and they're going to be in the street and this is a lot of units so thank you for the additional parking but you're you're you're assuming that you're going to put two cars in the garage which I don't think is going to happen so I just there's too many concerns I would like to see you know overflow parking added to the to the to the design I think there's a large assumption on on your part also though that we are going to have everybody fill up their garage I don't think that's going to be all it takes is um you said you had two extra you have two regular and one handicap by the pool so it takes two of your 30 something units to not have two cars in the garage and where they going to put those four cars well that's assuming everybody has four cars at the house which they w a lot of assumptions we all can have assumptions right so but ultimately you only have three extra parking spaces for people to park in in your in your neighborhood so it just doesn't look good uh to help the neighbor bring people around there so uh I like the idea of potentially having new options for people in Destin to go by but um there's a lot of this type of stuff and it's just uh maxing out around there in that area so so the med answers though the median income in the cres Fort Walton Beach Destin MSA is 98,6 a year um I'm not sure how that plays into to the uh scenario that you're you're throwing out there but but that includes Crestview and what else it's it's the entire MSA so it's cron for w crw be interested to know it just destines it basically the Oka County yeah unfortunately they don't run them by by cities or at least HUD doesn't that I've seen but I did pull that because I figured that was going to be something that came up hey Council Ming thank you sir yeah I think uh I'm excited I I'm excit excited about the possibility of this project I think it's a it's a great need that we have in this town um you know it is a I mean property values are still crazy um I think we could use some more products like this just based on what we saw every one of those and Wildcat mountain is gone not every one of them but I think I mean the majority of them are gone which tells me that we have a need for this so just based on that information I think it's something that we absolutely could use um yeah I I remember the project Mr Schmid Wasing talking about and there was uh we I think we had a conditional use of some extra parking is there you know that would be a question I had is is there any way to get some because inevitably you're gonna have you're going to have people over people are people are going to have people over they're going to have Super Bowl parties this and that I mean there's got I feel like there's got to be somewhere for people to to overflow too and it's not right for them to go to the city lot last question I have well the one question I have is is it is the developer planning on doing this build out on their own are they going to build these out can you tell me that with certainty yes Mr Boswell is a builder I know that and and I just was curious that you know we've seen some developments come around where people put a they they get a do and then they sell it to a de Horton or somebody like that and and I don't it's not up to me it doesn't matter what I think but you know I would I know the product and I would like to see that product in that neighborhood so that's all I got right C can yeah please yeah yeah I answered the question he's he's a builder and he's going to build it yes yeah yes I'm sorry I I'll say it I'll say the exact words yes sir he's going to he's going to build the project assuming everything works out and you know we can actually build the product um councilman Bagby thank you uh I like this discussion particularly since we're getting ready to start our LDC review so we'll go back just a little bit 25 years we've been talking in this city about Redevelopment we established a harbor CRA we established a town center CRA we changed our rules then we changed them again this is what Redevelopment looks like this is exactly you know it's it's not their fault that the code requires you know they could put single space driveways into those single space garages or double garages and they would meet their parking requirement by the rules that we and our predecessors wrote and so when we go into this LDC uh review we all need to be thinking like developers because we're going to go well is there excess parking is there going to be Community parking there can if we if we say there is but there can be exactly what you have here where they have excess parking by our code okay but not necessarily in our minds they followed the rules for conditional use you know they've got excess parking by our code so I and I understand exactly what everybody's saying about well where are the people going to park and they're going to park in the you know I have the same problem in my neighborhood you know we have two car garages we have two cars out in the driveway and of course everybody has their friends come over and half my garage is full of junk and stuff and I I'll be the first to admit that and I have a little car I could probably squeeze it in there if I tried but this is what Redevelopment looks like and what we what our goal our vision was when we started this Redevelopment process 25 years ago was we didn't want a bunch of high-rise condos we didn't want any more Emerald GRS we didn't want you know that we we identified the things we didn't want and we kind of wrote the codes to prevent that but this is allowable you know it's 30 ft it could be 50 ft you know know this is if you read you know the the the books on development of communities this is what it looks like if you take that Harbor as the center of our community you know and you go away from that Harbor this is what you're going to see and then you're going to see single family residents on bigger lots and then you're going to see some of those estate lots that are out on the bay like Miss Sandy lives in you know and that's that's what no one calling you out oh okay well but that that's how development go you know the further you get away from the Town Center the bigger your space becomes the more uh acreage that you have and things like that and that that's standard development so you know I'm I'm going to vote for it uh there are some things I'd like to see changed but you you followed the rules you've got it the sufficient amount of parking by our code and I just just want us to use this as an educational jump off point when we start reviewing the LDC and say hey wait a second that's if we allow that we're going to end up with this thing that we didn't a bunch of us didn't like because it didn't follow our you know our idea not that it didn't follow our code but it didn't follow our idea 30 feet or whatever I I am ecstatic about that people walking around in that part of town you know where they can walk to either Mr Dustin's restaurant or walk down to the Emerald Grand we used to live about two and a half blocks from there over office stalman on Ridgewood Circle and we walk down to the harbor weekly because we just walked by the cemetery and we are the veterinarian then the cemetery then you know the community center and boom we were there and so that's that's the vision when we start going through the LDC that we need to be thinking through uh what do we want that down by the harbor look like and then as we get away from that town center and the harbor CR what do we want the rest of the Destin to look like but you know you had me at 30 ft pretty much yeah I I'll I'll make the motion I'm not sure I'll get a second but I'll make it here uh oops got to do this and then I got to do this and it says right Adam report there I am yeah I'm pulling it up hang on I move that city council approve Calhoun Harbor a conditional use major development order and major subdivision as presented right I have a motion on the floor second the second anything else councilman Bagby for discussion no I'm sorry all right uh councilman gu I just wanted to answer uh councilman Schmidt's question I just looked at the US Census for Dustin Florida average income was 4696 as of 2022 so yeah you were talking about what the average income so according to uh United States Census Bureau $ 46,9 based off 2002's numbers person or per person family okay per person per person two person family would be 92 well I'm I'm a single father so we're not all two person people yeah um additionally I I I would disagree with you that this meets the the Land Development code because I don't consider a uh water retention pond with a bench around it is non-residential use um personally and uh so so I just have to disagree with you that and I'll pass all right Council meston just one one further comment and and I would agree with Mr agy's analysis were there not a conditional use conditional means we could put conditional if we want to say we approv this project with seven units per acre that is a conditional approval that is more close to the criteria of medium than high I I doubt that these folks would be real happy with that um but that certainly is an option and when you have conditional uses it does not meet the straight criteria that they have met the code conditional means we set conditions yeah can I say something again real fast I know this is probably completely out of order but just to to at least Mr SCH Smith and Mr King's Point with this current design to add any additional G have to be this area here that throws up be or there's two or three town homes that could be removed and then right there right that's a that's a that's a possibility though right okay I just want I mean you're pointing out empty space and that whole thing could be redone I'm just saying Mr Tatum that that's a possibility that's the last proposal that's what the last developer did too they took something off and they added it that's all I'm saying I guess what I'm trying to explain to you is that we've already done that we've already taken the off right yeah we've already trimmed the fat to try to get a palatable product and so that's why we're at this product the parking spots if they came in from that side the kind of northeast side yeah from there as opposed to coming in off Boswell's corner you see what I'm saying no sir follow you and you said additional parking spots you said here and you assume they would come in from here what off of cyber nove you wouldn't have driveways you'd have parking spots Ray can you Ray can you pick this up U Mr Tatum can you just just so that the record can get your comments understand but um the the problem with with that particular design would be if they came straight in then you would have to be parking through the rideway right there like that and I don't think engineering would ever approve that and I think they've already fallen asleep they're like yeah so the question was Ryan this area right here that's got we've got this distance because of the throat clearance if we were to try to use that for parking but you came in off of cyber into it like that but then still had your road connection there that would be problematic or no um so the new LDC is proposing to have the throat clearance measured from the edge of the travel Lane not from the RightWay line um so in this scenario from this far away it looks like if if You' use that criteria you can still have people come in off the road and go into a parking area okay how about that I under the new LDC is it still 40 feet for the throat distance from the travel Lane just for the record that new LDC has not been approved yet or reviewed by Council just while we're at it we're talking about the new LDC the CMU is going away in the new LDC if you approve it the zoning District won't even exist anymore any further discussions my only question uh just because my fiance is going to ask me are you saving any trees are you clear cutting for efficiencies I just couldn't find them on on the Landscaping of what they all look next there are a few trees being saved I think it's eight off the top of my head you know the diameter is I do not okay are they like I know that's like a small thing that we're not really going to vot it's not a small thing because the code says that this District should encourage an excellent tree canopy and before devel major development occurs it is important the tree preservation be enhanced to ensure the Lush character of this area continues yeah that's in the this is our last little calhon area of trees all right so they're saving eight trees that are 7 in to 12 in three trees that are 13 to 19 in in diameter and three trees that are 20 to 24 inches in diameter cool some big trees I got my talking points thank you yeah listen there there's compromise I will allow compromise but I just wanted to make sure it wasn't a clearcut okay that is all I had seeing anything else oh my bad all right there we go all right I have a motion in second uh does anyone need to rehear the motion yeah why not let's just call it midnight they take away uh oh so for the record city clerk the applicant has asked for a pause before the council makes a decision to confer with his client it's kind of like the car salesman like all right well I guess we're going to walk out and go to the next one okay so we're back um the idea that Mr Bagby floated um well not coming in your way but taking Ryan's advice even though it's not in the current Land Development code is something that's doable and we're willing to do to add some additional parking spaces um that said I think we're going to need y'all to make that a condition of an approval for us to be able to do it um Miss cop do you agree yeah if the if if you're going to require them to do additional parking then just modify the motion accordingly I modify my motion how many additional parking spots we're going to get I don't know the answer to that oh David come on you clarify theeast corner of yeah the northeast corner of the property especially right there on Cyber because then when I go 6 to 10 and if you make it a black and white condition that staff can look at and know that it's okay like saying a specific number like that it would not have to come back to you you know so if you said six to 10 and they come back with six spaces staff will approve it it won't come back to council if you said something more vague maximize your parking we'd probably take it back to you um I mean my only other suggestion is we bit the bullet to make our park a par and get rid of the storm water and we've paid for that if we're really going to call that a park and we're throwing possible conditions out I mean I think we've already led by example and our wallets if we're really going to meet the code and call that a pocket park I mean we've we've done it maybe they should I don't know if that's going to have teeth or not but all I got just for clarification M you talking about requiring them to put exfiltration tubes buried that this isn't a big enough development okay I was just throwing it out there it just kind of seemed similar I'm not an engineer so it seems similar in nature of that's a lot of cost as we have found out fair enough and for them to we're in the conditional mode going to bite the Apple while we're got it yeah okay so just to be clear what was the modification to the motion exactly you put additional parking in the Northeast quadrant and did you say 6 to 10 apologize if I complicate this but uh that area is 53 ft wide and there's a 10- foot landscape buffer so yes ma'am so I'm trying to process how what it would look like if you had a 20 if you had a 19t deep space with a 24ft drive out behind it unfortunately I'm so tired now I can't do that math but it's going to be about what 40 something feet I'm trying to make sure it'll fit in where we can do the number of spaces we're talking about does it have to be in the Northeast quadrant couldn't we just say add six to 10 spaces wherever we can do that yeah that's a good idea would that be acceptable Mr Bagby okay Johnny would you second that I agree with that thank you oh man wow I almost got to vote on that one all right eyes have it 43 thank you get your commission this time all right all right so that is the end of the public hearings uh going into Council presentations and comments uh going down the line councilman Stevens all right thank you I just got one thing um uh I seeing if uh if I can make a motion to appoint me to be the regional Utility Authority representative I'll make that no motion to appoint you second all right any further discussions calling the vote get him to put gas down here on okoa gas all right congratulations another free job for councilman Stevens councilman gu I've got one thing congratulations Dustin Little League 13year old division they won state they're going to the Southeast Conference July 18th yeah um and the word is special thanks to Tony Bailey who did an amazing job as a team manager without him uh several people told me they probably wouldn't have been successful obviously it's the kids who did all the work but his uh his support and his hard work helped them maintain and help the coaches do their jobs more effectively so congratulations guys and is is this Lisa you would know is this the first Little League Division that's ever won state yes yes so congratulation guys very good and good luck July 18th all right councilman Dustin councilman Bagby want to thank uh commissioner ketchel and Dale Marx and the folks at egund for finally working out a solution to get us a bioluminescent multi-purpose path 12et wide the entire length of Okaloosa Island connecting Fort Walton Beach and dtin and I look forward I was at the groundbreaking this morning and I am excited about what that's going to be uh Jimmy's not here tonight I don't I didn't see him any time so we're not going to play the clip but I will just say the same thing I said the other night no I don't want to waste three more minutes of y'all's time but I I don't think like that you know there is enough pie here for the fishing Fleet the luxury yacht Fleet and the pontoon boat fleet you know is it and we want all those people but we want them in manageable sections I guess particularly those the last one so that's all I have mayor right councilman abar thanks mayor I just want to commend uh our parks and recck department for pulling off a very successful Fourth of July weekend they had quite the Quagmire at Joe's Bayou with the broke down ice cream boat and went through all kinds of pains to to get it out of there I was part of the traffic on beach waiting to launch um and I think y'all handled it as well as you most possibly could and um the fireworks display everyone I've talked to said it was the best fireworks they've ever seen so kudos to you and your team and I know Tamara was helping part of that as well I just want to commend y'all for working so hard to make the Fourth of July just a really great event I think our code folks were working overtime I think I talked to Troy a couple of times Sheriff thank you for all you did keeping our people safe we had a lot a lot of uh situations that could have gone sideways and our Sheriff kept us a safe accident free pretty much and just an all all in all successful weekend for our family our visitors and our businesses so thank you to the city and the staff as well all right Gman King nothing tonight thank you councilor Schmidt I appreciate it um thank you all and uh thank you allbody for being here this entire time and staff for sitting through this this night uh we didn't have our last meeting as you all know so I do have a few things to cover I'll try to keep it very brief um I I do want to start with Trac miss a bear I also like I got notice about Joe's Bayou and there there's a lot of people that want to recommend and and um you know say how amazing the staff was from the docks over there so give the guys extra cookies and stuff like that with that said though uh I would like to touch on the gentleman that showed up here tonight and I would ask Mr city manager if you guys could bring us at the next meeting or to what is the schedule Staffing schedule at Joe's Bayou in the second half of the day so we can maybe see that and understand that because I have heard that before from other people as well so um I gotten um a lot of calls on the splash pad at Leonard Destin Park what's the status of the splash pad are we still yes ma'am U is the four more weeks gota is this the same um is this the same issue that we had like last year uh with the Sand Filtration food and things like that different okay is is there anything that we can do in the in the future to have an extra one on hand or are they not readily available okay so it's not like a part that we would have an extra it's okay all right good to know thank you very much um Mr guile you are our legislative sponsor or we we did something about the high school what do we make what did we make you was it the parks at the high school or I'm pretty sure it was the cheerleader Squad cheerleading squad no I'm I'm was it High School the baseball team I can't remember for the Dustin High School uh with the in in regards to Morgan Sports Complex so you were the liais on between the city and the high school for Morgan Sports Complex whatever is going on over there right okay and then you said earlier that there's a meeting scheduled tomorrow that you're having now their meeting uh I was under the impression that it was for the interlocal and that but it's actually for a storage scheduling and storage it has nothing to do with the interlocal okay but uh we've had two meetings in the past one with the uh Destin Elementary and several people and I I think I updated everybody on that right after that meeting um but we've met with them about the the opportunity to go over to Destin Elementary which was not viable then we met with them in the City Annex and had a discussion about the inter local which and at that point they stated they did not have a copy of it because the previous regime uh is the one who agreed to the inter local uh and then they misspoke on some of the uh requirements that they said were in in the interlocal that were not in the interlocal we provided them the interlocal um the next comment was they want to make changes to the inter local to fit their needs for a bigger expansion we explained to them if you want to do that you have to do it quick because it's got to come through Council it has to have two readings before your your uh Practice season starts in August this was back in uh April is that correct Lea or was that March March March I think it was March and um they still haven't gotten back we've had communication with them but they still haven't gotten back with us on EX specifically what they're looking for um so the balls in their Court we're just waiting for them to tell us what changes they want to make or if they just want to agree to to comply with the original interlocal agreement so do do you see any um I think that was specifically about a baseball field if I recall but Morgans as a whole there's lots of fields there do you see an opportunity to work with the high school with Morgan Sports Complex more than that one interlocal agreement which is about one baseball field so what what we've talked about is um and and what Lisa said to me specifically is that she wants to work very closely with the high school and try to work something out but my perception is they need to learn to communicate um there's somebody over there dropping the ball with communication uh we've reached out a couple times and we still aren't getting answers is this something that you've reached out on I'm just clarifying Le has actually reached out on but uh I've been at the meetings and and I I could reach out and make a phone call if if that's what youd like well if you need any like sub liaison not sure if that's loud if we do sunshine to help with reaching out I'd be happy to help in any way possible yeah we can't do that because of sunshine law but I've also spoken with several parents that have kids and the program that are concerned and I've brought that to their attention as well okay um I appreciate the update yeah so we just got to get them to move forward sure Expedition I got your email but I just wanted to make sure that I wanted to hear you know discuss it so thank you so much thing new president oh there's new principal and everything yeah there is a new principal Mr G in case you haven't seen the announcement she was aware of that she used to be a principal at Dustin Elementary she's currently a middle school M SCH gotcha all right she was also a school board member she was also Destin Elementary School for anybody wants but she was also a school board member School Board member as well um but anyways new opportunity to maybe do have new discussions with certain people over there she just started voluntarily July 1 I think contractually she starts August so yeah we would appreciate and and love to have that communication but I don't feel it's my job to babysit and chase people down so um I would just hope as on between the two entities you would help no no we're absolutely helping we gave the the list of what needs to happen and and ask directed them in the right direction but we are also not b sitters that that say Hey every week you and let me call you and check on why you're not doing your job I got you I appreciate you letting me know you're very welcome sir um the food truck ordinance update I asked um in the previous meeting I think we had a workshop and then previous meeting we asked for staff to bring back an update on the food truck ordinance and the sign ordinance and Mr zugu do you want to give the update on what you told me yes uh so since we last spoke uh I reminded you that we have a workshop with the city council on the 29th uh chapter 4 is the Bark uh it's matter of fact is a spine of the LBC ordin that contains all those um uh elements that you speaking about so they'll be covered then and uh you'll have a robust discussion about that so we'll have that discussion at the workshop on July 29 instead of separately having it brought to council can I provide a little bit of clarity on that so signs are not going to be included in the July 29th Workshop because that's article 8 and that's that'll be provided at a at at a different um Workshop but the mobile vending stuff absolutely will be thank you yep for the clarification um I have an item on I've gotten some questions about operating a business out of and from a home in Destin and I just want to get some clarification uh the questions I was received from some citizens were um inside their garage if they store supplies um and items to operate their business and they have employees picking those up leaving coming back to restock is that allowed in the Crystal Beach area of Destin so state law talks about home occupations and what's allowed and what's not right generally the the home occupation is protected by state law as long as the residential character of the home um is still the primary um character and use of the home and then there are specific details that have to be met under the state law and if they're violated they lose some of those protections employees is one of the issues addressed by the state law specifically so on the employee employees it talks about they can have a total well it says the employees of the business who work at the residential dwelling must also reside in the dwelling except that up to a total of two employees or independent contractors who don't reside there may work at the business and then they can also have employees that are remote so to answer these general questions we really have to look at the specifics of what's going on and so how would you recommend the person um should call Tak The Next Step should call planning and ask if a specific question is allowed or not but that's what the state law says on employees then there's also requirements dealing with parking and there's general rules that you can't have more noise than what's customary for a residential so there's other factors that come into it so it's hard to answer yes this is allowed or not because if they are impacting the residential neighborhood in a very negative way they may not be allowed to do what they're doing but if they comply so it's not it's maybe not black and white the employees I think is is more black and white but some of the other things aren't what about license have a BTR oh I mean anybody that operates a business in the city has to have a BTR okay so if they've got a brick and mortar in for Walton Beach but they're working out of their house that's not a BTR in D that's not a BTR for D okay yeah actually businesses in destined get a BTR in the county and the City St St we do you can it's um it's section anybody can pull up state laws but it's section 559 n55 and it's entitled homebased businesses local government restrictions the intent was to that the local government cannot treat them differently than other businesses but then they put in some parameters to protect to try to balance the rights of the residents right so like having a an accounting uh work from home business and accounting firm people can come every day to transact with that accountant in his house because that's his place of business as long as nobody complains I mean it do we need to is it allowed is it only if it's a complaint driven no it's not complaint driven I mean it's not allowed if the statute is violated so there's going to be rules about employees there there are rules about parking but generally an accountant that doesn't have an abusive amount of employees for violating the parking and isn't creating noise and fumes and all those things they're probably going to be allowed to operate from their home just like a lawyer would be you know but but ultimately if there's a question from a citizen they should reach out to planning give the address give the scenario and then they'll either direct them to code or somewhere like that right for a realtor for example realter okay thank you uh The Code Compliance I've had a few calls emails um I try not to take too long Mr Troy but what I heard you're bringing something to us at next meeting or in August a presentation uh August 5th and what will be what will that contain sorry the code Department Staffing their direction or I mean there's specific things that you're looking for the call volume their proactive calls so one of the the questions I've been getting is um they're trying to understand when they drive down the streets destined on the north side of 98 the main streets the Kelly streets the Bings the the main thorough areas um they see violations with um dilapidated truck uh Vehicles boats and trailers debris trash whatever and they're wondering why it doesn't get as much attention as Crystal Beach holiday aisle or whatever and I I'm assuming stuff like that will be presented to understand that I've got a map that clear clearly shows the proactive cases that code is involved in would that be part of the presentation absolutely all right I will tell to August 5th fantastic thank you um last item on my agenda here then I have one other item location of transient slips under the previous um leadership I think it was under web and Mr Lance Johnson we as a council made a direct motion to provide the a list of Transit slips on the Harbor um and to provide that on our website so people in the harbor know where they could park um I think it was started but I don't think it was ever uh finished if you currently go to the website and this is not a knock on uh anybody does a website but it says it's in process um and so I would like for the next uh hopefully the next meeting the end of July can y'all bring us those and show us where they are at uh work has started on that um the three sources we're looking at what the Army C Engineers did uh also we got development orders that uh we approved and making sure that uh the information is consistent and also we're going to do field visits so what's the timeline that we can have that since it's been I know you're just taking this office recently but it's the staff has been working on it for probably a year so well I I I I cannot say that stuff is working over a year when do you think we can have that list be provided to the residents of where they can pull a boat on a transient slip which is allowed to go come and go in the harbor I would need to verify with staff with the you know uh workload and so on but I would say at least within the next three weeks next three weeks okay that would be great because I know if we were potentially going to do the uh annexation thing in four weeks I hope we could do that because I would I know a lot of people are really appreciating it so I know we're not but it's been it's been an item that a lot of of people have been asking about uh needing to park at so uh and the last item I know there's um a lot of uh it's this time of the year and helicopters are flying you know we've heard about it I think it was about a year ago um I kicked off trying to do some work with the helicopters with the county and everything else um and you know we maybe maybe made some efforts or maybe we didn't who knows but um one of the things that I took very importantly from Mr Johnson I think is his name the business owner uh back then was um to to be involved in discussions and communication about his business his operations and Etc um and so uh I spoken to some citizens I also reached out to Mr Johnson as well because what I would like to do um and in in motion form is ask staff to bring us options for a public Workshop to have him and the public and County and potentially FAA all together just to discuss this um in a proactive efficient way to how we can have a business in dtin or County but also uh not run them off but how we can all work together so I'm asking if we can uh have staff bring us some options for a public Workshop to hold a helicopter uh discussion well you're going to probably have an issue with having the county participate in that because they're in $110 million litigation with oh still yes the trial is set for this fall okay um so I've spoken with the county and I don't think they're going to be willing to do that during the litigation and also we did have a workshop that you just described already what year was that Ry was that two years ago a couple years ago I think yeah 2022 we did that exact thing so we had uh the FAA lawyer come tell us I think that nothing can be done and to you follow this link and and and then now we're following the link and the Link's broken that was the one where they brought the helicopter to our parking lot and they they did a show of if the the difference in the noise at different altitudes and it was attended by the county the city public and I think a representative of the FP anyway I'm I'm just saying it's not that we haven't done it already but that was prior to the county getting into the $10 million litigation and so I think that's why we haven't done that again since that time just for whoever wasn't here so uh I guess what I will ask then is if I could be a liaison to reach out and have discussion with the owner of Timberview helicopters to bring back potential ideas to the council and see if there's something additional that we could all work together rather than just arguing on Facebook with each other I think that' be great because if somebody can go to him he may not even realize that he's got guys doing those 8 Minute loops in there right above people's houses I'll do that then all right appreciate it oh uh sorry yeah I don't want to get sued by anybody I'm just trying to is that a consensus of the council yeah it doesn't matter to me I I reached out to the county today uh and last week and they exactly what you said Tracy said look we're in we're in a lawsuit and we're not going to tell you what to do or what you know what we're going to do we're not going to comment on any of this I'll also reached out to the FAA cuz I know some of the folks up there uh they haven't gotten back to me yet so but last week was July 4th weekend you know and so they may have taken vacation or something but I would assume I'll hear back from them this week but I I if he's not aware that his Pilots are doing 8 Minute Loops over people's houses then he's got a bigger problem than anything we're going to resolve but I can you knock yourself out no you can and if it's voluntary you know allowances or conversations with him we can do that it's just that we don't just for the record and for the public to know and I think they do know we do not have jurisdiction once a helicopter is in the air the FAA does so there is nothing the city can do County's litigating and that is what it is but we can always have conversations with a business owner and ask them to voluntarily do something okay thanks Kevin yeah sure no problem uh last question do we know if the um rainbow Frost business has a BTR in the city of D rainbow Co rainbow and cooko road do we know if they have a BTR I'm sorry the cooko the cooko is there a BTR with the city of Dustin say that again I'm drawing a blank right now I'd have to go okay could you could y'all let us know um in the coming week if there's a BTR for that business tomorrow in Destin okay again thank you all for allowing me to go through these I know we had the meeting that we missed and I know it's late but um I appreciate it they important absolutely I love going through your staff briefing together all right IES that mean we got to do the staff briefing together yeah that was good not all the staff are in the staff brief briefing Mr Mayor but thank you oh well you should invite them all right email I got an email for something I guess we do annually does anyone want to throw in what I'm having to sign this 51 letter 51% letter of support I don't know whatever it's under my name motion to approve thank you all right all right call the vote y whatever this annual thing is do that thing take care of we're going to get money from someone I guess Johnny's voting yes can't make it work all right can you pull it or did we need him are you voting uh he's voting King just put on the record you can say it he's already logged out he's on way out the door the computer logged itself out for lack of use for lack of use I'm going to vote Yes for this all right votes have it unanimously with a vocal yes of King there we go all right public comments we can listen to those the City attorney all right Bobby minutes cut you skipped me oh I'm sorry and I have one thing even though it's not on there and it's just really quick but on code on Code Compliance matters I'm just giving councel a little bit of advice that if there is a pending active Code Compliance case we should not go outside of the special magistrate and we didn't do that here so this isn't about anything but we should not go out of that process and start talking about Active cases at Council meetings there's a process with magistrate everybody gets their quasa judicial hearing and their due process and we can do it that way you all as residents of the city can make a complaint like anybody else but when we're talking about ongoing cases leave it to the process please is my request that's all perfect people stay three minutes yeah all right same as all right three minutes committee Members First this will take about 30 seconds um I've known Diane Kelly the new principal at the high school for years I'll be glad to work with anybody I'll take you over there if I need to uh and help out with that um and I think she'll get it straightened out once we explain what the issues are just give her time all right this ma'am y'all I came here today cuz I thought we were going to resolve something I've sat here for 5 hours we got nowhere what happened to all the carts on the beach and all we were going to talk about what everybody could do we had no discussion we've sat here for five hours but I've got a ticket for pulling a cart down the beach and all we got was well we'll see if we can run a business out of a residential what happened to what was supposed to be what was going on here can we or can we not pull carts down the destined Beach it's a yes or no let's take a vote because I'm going to get on with my business I mean can we pull carts on the beach and sell product it's a yes or no is it no there's not no there is not the D in the city of dtin have already resolved that issue do you not have the D form that I gave you that I sent the D partnered with the city of dtin pardon me it was it was resolved in June of 2016 that's why there's no btrs issued to them that's why we don't do it like that y'all if we start letting people start Hawking stuff on the beach we're going to have suntan oil listen I bought luggage on the beach of Venezuela is that really what we want we're going to we didn't we didn't solve nothing here I've waited for two weeks to come to get my Council to resolve a problem for me and all I got was thank you for trying but asked if I had a BTR I mean are we doing it or not my understanding we're going to know tomorrow and I would assume with our code compliance director and our staff that we have back there if there's a business in the city of dtin illegally doing business without a BTR it'll be handled appropriately I believe and I will it be because I'm their job bring to ATT thank you for bringing this up but I want the council to know that I have sent in Co I have sent in complaint after complaint after complaint and now what has happened is my complaints have been turned over to the people are complaining about it's it's I'm going to wait to see how this plays out but like I said so tomorrow everybody's going to get up and just drag 11 more carts down the beach but I got a ticket for for it how do we explain this I said okay and I went and bought me to carts but I got told immediately do not stop go do not waste any time no so we're going to continue is this a yes we can continue there please as of right now nobody is supposed to be doing business on the beach there's no thank you in the dry sand without a permit even in the wet sand even in the wet I have a d may get my D would we like to you got 15 seconds you bring it to the city tomorrow well I I have 15 seconds to decide my whole career and my livelihood I've worked 30 years for but that's I ask a question Jim what what do you allege that DP resolved in 2016 you can just tell me I don't need to see your doc it was was because of the wet sand and the uh the problems that they were having with the vending what they did was they partnered with the uh for about the wet sand they partnered with the city saying that they would back the city with no soliciting I've got the D form that's who owns the state owns that they're the D they they went and made the rule up to the sand to meet with the city because of this very reason of this very reason what we've done at the city is enforce city codes within our jurisdiction when things are beyond our jurisdiction we no longer enforce it and I think that's why when things are out further into the water than the city limits goes the city is not you know code enforcement is not chasing that down however if it's in areas that are clearly within our jurisdiction then the city is enforcing it or should be enforcing it I took a hundred pictures and sent them to code with them on the dry sand doing exactly what was illegal what did code do they turned around and went to them and showed them the pictures and we got in trouble for it for stalking but with respect to active code enforcement matters we don't want to talk about it at the city council no I'm not I'm just asking yeah do we have an agreement with DP or did we make an agreement with d that said we would because normally we wouldn't enforce anything in the state jurisdiction we I don't even think we're able to enforce anything in the state jurisdiction so I'm yeah I'm just going to add just just what we currently do is if they're unless they're in the water and we find them we will site them but they have to be in the water because that's outside our jurisdiction if they're not in the water they're going to get sighted okay y'all have been doing this for 30 years don't you think I'd be toen carts and and stuff down the beach if I thought I could could all right just forward this to us tomorrow can you forward that to all the council members tomorrow can we have that one uh I think there might be something attached to it I need though we'll make copies and return it to you yeah but I think I have some personal information attached to that that make copies of just the first page right now taking a picture on hey thank you for hearing me and I'm sorry to be a burden and Kevin thank you for helping and doing what you can to bring it up and um it's a problem and and I don't want to complicate this anymore but in Crystal Beach some part of that dry sand is actually the state's property is what some part of that dry sand is the state's property based on the erosion control line yeah and that was another thing I think a lot of people have an issue with is the mean tide line or understanding it yes water is definitely St okay thank you Carrie I'm waiting on my stuff yeah yeah right next um sure yep my as well Becky Becky Pritchard 145 Timber Court and with all due respect I believe when we had the little helicopter demonstration out here a couple years ago there were not five helicopter Timberview helicopters in the air at all times doing this around Destin and whatever height that they say that they are flying at and are not flying over residential that's not true y'all all know it because you can't drive around Des anymore without seeing them everywhere could you hear him in here tonight I hear him in my sleep now I mean I am not not kidding but um so just to say that yes that did happen in 2022 or 2021 and then they were kicked out of the airport and things were good for us over there for a while not for Crystal Beach but um a noise study of some sort y'all been shopping at Home Depot I mean it's like it's Insanity so if there's some there's got to be something besides just asking Mr Johnson again to be the nice neighbor that he says he's going to be because he does it for a minute and then he stops again so there's a lot of helicopters in the air right now and um we I hope are G to all right thank you so much thanks for being here so as for your BTR there is no business bus being run out of 61 Koka road that business is ran in a completely different County um can you give us your name and address Britney zerel 61 cooko Road our business is out of a different County after the harassment and stalking we completely moved counties there's nothing there you can go look um and also as for the permits there is no permit she is right and we pull our carts after speaking to code enforcement multiple times and clarifying it started in the wet sand it went to our ankles and now Knee Deep me and my husband pull a cart together other knee deep in the water which is out of Destin jur jurisdiction code enforcement did not contact us everything we pulled was public records um for the restraining order that has passed against her family she has sat outside of her house all night with ski mask um threatening to stab us so it's been it's been awful um and we have followed code every time it's changed we have pushed back into the water to now me and my husband are pulling a cart knee deep in the water which is as far as as I know legal um we have our license we are insured we pay our County taxes um we have the permits in P wall we are legal we are doing everything legal and there is no business at Cookoo Road it we had carts there but after being harassed and stalked every day all night every night code enforcement did not tell them to stalk us at our house all day every night every you know and follow us to work for hours that's not okay I almost got ran over by her son pregnant so um this is not acceptable We are following the rules we have our permits we are licensed we are insured and we are following code to the tea we have a really good relationship everything we pulled has been public records so I don't really know what the concern is it the first thing they said was we were making $10,000 we're making $2,000 it's obviously about money with them not Harmony um and it is what it is when they have a I love Jesus sticker on the back of their truck and they're not loving their neighbor I think that shows you the characteristic of the people we are talking about so and I'm Samson Thomas um code came over to our house and they searched their they looked all around our house they're like you know we can clearly see they have it on record reporting they're like we can see that you're not running a business out of our house and they they came they made a report about it and everything they came over multiple times and there was nothing for them to report they said the case is closed you guys are good and they're like if I were you guys I would you and we chose to leave counties and store our stuff at other places because we don't feel we feel like we're we're going to get sabotaged with what's going on it's been a nightmare with there is no BTR need because we're not even there anymore we live there but our business is not even stored there and we are pulling our carts kneed deep in the water together and not we we multiple times ask code we want to obey the law we want the rules I don't care if it's Neck Deep just tell me what it to do and if you yeah it's okay they like ice cream and it's it's it's it's it's all forestin like if you guys didn't want us out there walk everyone loves it like like golf stream said everyone is loving what we're doing we're not selling luggage we're not selling jewry we're selling ice cream to children that are dehydrated out it's Hershey's Ice Cream I mean come on like thank you guys for being here all right Ken yell at us oh ken oh my God 1100 I want to know what you're I'm come 4320 Commons Drive West thanks for asking that's where I live and utility bills driver's license anything you want to know CU it's irrelevant to topic by the way and tacking so there were a couple things that were brought up that I think that you all need to head on and Miss cop will agree that BTR is near and dear to me spent nine months in the BTR and at that point uh in 1996 I think was the last time the rates were adjusted and so we spent a lot of time right John on coming up with something that the city could use I would strongly encourage you to go back and look at that as far as impact fees every new development whether it's hotel or condo they pay an impact fee but that's not paid on an annual basis I believe that if if I'm not misspeaking hotels motels don't pay an Str Str fee do they pay BTR absolutely as do all vacation rental homes now I'm not I'm sitting here just said the rates need to go up that's that's not the issue but if we're going to compare it to hotels of motels let's let's compare it um the other thing I I'll leave you with is every year tourist development tax increases $28 million 2020 42 m ion dollar is what we're projecting for 20242 and the 10% for Public Safety goes up every time we raise a dollar the municipalities including the city of Destin got together and agreed that 12 a half% was going to get split amongst the municipalities TDC didn't do that the county didn't do that the municipalities did that so if you as part of that M municipality feels like you need to review that or revisit that well within your right to do that and property taxes you know well at least we say you know the property taxes increase as the value increases and so yes the city does get more every year on those things that driven based on percentages and those three items are percentages so I still think it's a bad way to do it I support having discussion on it but the condo shouldn't have to pay an additional fee and I'm going to call it a tax when there's already enough going on with condas all right thank you for being here I get more time oh yeah yes you did Kyle Coleman uh 669 St L Cove I don't get involved in the drama but uh um but what I said earlier as far as proposal for the permit system sitting here tonight seems like the city seems needs a little bit of money seems like you guys are always trying to pull some funding from somewhere implementing some type of permit system not only for these vendors on the beach but for the bonfires I mean they were here last meeting that got cancelled but somebody from W County was come over I think a million dollars is what they do in fire permits maybe changing that and bringing something back on would maybe bring some more Revenue to the city I know our permit system whatever it may be is not going to produce a ton of Revenue but it still would be a little bit to go towards code or to whatever needs the lifeguards so just considerate you know um I'm here I want to be on the same page with everybody I want to get along with everybody uh I'm a happy person right so thank you guys for your time it's been a long day appreciate it thanks for being here all right anyone else nope no just here for the pure value and entertainment all right wait wait it's so close to 11 it's 11:01 really