good the finance committee meeting of April 25th 2024 order this meeting is being recorded the listing of matters those reasonably anticipated by the chair which may be discussed at the meeting not all items listed May in fact be discussed and other items not listed may also be brought up for discussion to the extent permitted by law for the pledge of FL uned States Amica for stands one nation God indivisible liy and justice for [Music] all so kind of over some of some of the new changes and um getting an update on the solid waste committee's recent meetings and that's why Mr Perry joined us tonight as a member of the committee was information in the P that okay you want to take over well I don't know exactly what sort of Direction want to go in here so I will rely on M administrator mull to keep me on track but um basically uh if if you look at the documents the pie charts give you a brief overview of how they were derived um trash recycling in 2019 in 2023 are live actual hard numbers uh what I did was I broke it into three components the top third of each sheet will show you the curbside trash Revenue okay and that is from bag sales in 2019 large bags were $150 each small. 75 the curbside costs were as you see 291,000 in change so appropriate funds had to cover just over almost $91,000 of that program and that's reflected in the um the pie chart revenue from the bags covered almost 69% of that program appropriated funds had to cover the rest you go down to the center third recycling Revenue was Zero no recycling Revenue at all the costs were just over 196k so appropriated funds have to absorb at 196k then what I did was on the bottom third I combined the two programs again uh the revenue is just from bag sales curbside recycling costs at curbside and recycling costs were uh just over 487k uh so the revenues derived from the bags covered 41% of that program corated funds have to cover uh remainder okay uh if you have any questions please stop along way we go to 2023 uh basically the same format what changed is the price of the bags went from a do and a half to large bags to $2 small bags went from 75 cents to um dollar each uh the big difference is uh even though the price of the bag is increased the costs of the overall program increased so again even though the bag bags were increased the bag sales now only covered 67.6% of the uh of the program as opposed to dropped about a percent 1.2% because of riseing cost again recycling Revenue in the middle third zero again combining the two programs on the bottom curve of the sheet uh we we lost ground if you will they are also our uh 2019 Revenue was 41% uh in 2023 reue was 37.6% again because of rising cost over which we had no control we stop there for a minute do you have any questions about those two sheets because those are hard numbers those are actual or deriv from actual numbers I question are we um are costs continuing to rise at the rate we've seen that's well I would refer administrator M but I would say based upon what we've seen yes yeah yes the continuing um in terms of the um in terms of the Tipping fee yeah uh for for f425 we don't have a definitive number that's really based on volume we have seen we have seen a a volume and our Tage um over the last two years really stabiliz and decrease a little bit um level off from the um 20 and 21 and early 22 years uh but yeah like we are we are really like leveling off there um but there is still and and there was still a big jump um there was still a big jump per had mentioned from um in the aggregate from fy19 to 23 that like that jump is is still affecting us operationally even though that hasn't actually been increasing at the same type of PID sense okay um do we have a contract with them or tipping fees are set by the or we do have um we do have a contract with with CMS down in Rochester um FY 25 is the last year um and then everything um the risk there is this opportunity as um as uncomfortable as it might be um it allows us to really get in frun of changes in the Tipping fee uh because next year planning for f26 when the contract is up um there's been talked about the future of C as well and so we're not really sure what that means long to um if the and we don't think this will happen in uh oh this just happen in the shorter term but the question also is if anything were to ever change with our contract with gorgeous as well um we have even though our cost have have increased tremendously over the last four years we still have something really good in my opinion with Bess that has a huge value and the value added for the town um um I'd say we probably have the ability to have one L contract with boes um but we're not really sure where things may go after that and if we have to go up to the market um there's always a risk and we um also know with these conglomerates they do have a tendency a bit low um extremely low um basically for um the other B barrels barels on two folks and then after the end of that contract it's how to jack everything up as well so there's a big of deal um uh and look at this whole structure like in the very short term the medium term and the long term as well and how long has the contract the last 3 years three years do these contracts um do they uh combine both the trash and the recycling together yes okay how does the the recycling translate for us as far as um is this something and again I'm new to this is this something that is pushed within the state that it's mandatory is this a mandatory uh push that you have to recycle to I mean we're incurring a cost and I almost thought why not create a bag that for recycling that people can pay yeah I don't to be honest with I'm not actually sure the answer to that question and whether whether actually the Panton Rochester like except only trash I'm talking about dting itself I'm talking about the whole point of of us recycling I I almost am wondering why it's being done uh because we're not you know I mean it it just seems a little little off if anything if we if we really want it to be in um to where it's important and people are going to do it why not treat it the same thing as trash and create a recycling bag you know what I mean and that way you're not having you're you don't have to worry about incurring the cost afterwards you're curing it right then in there and if people are really into recycl they're going to throw it in there and do it if I may are you are you suggesting uh a recycling bag for sale yeah sure okay sure so that would be another Revenue stream yes and to to to cover because we're not making any money on this no not at all and what are they doing throwing it away they're not paying for it yeah they never did but cost used to be less because they it go to China China would buy it if I may um I want to ask a quick question to the Town Administrator has um OSD done anything to put um trash pick up up to bid to help curve these costs trash pickup is one of the I think about 15 exemptions from um one of the 15 or so exemptions from 30b the state procurement law um it's it's um that in some places can be a double sword here with what we do have with bges I have believe that that works very much more to our benefit um the fact that we don't have to put that out the fact that we can stick to what we know and we also as part of our efforts um part of our efforts with solid waste we've actually had a representative from DP come in and do a technical analysis of um of the contract that we have with bis um and she's working with us to um to really evaluate our whole structure and what and what we consistently keep going back and landing on and what she has validated is what we have with P just is is a real value and then just to such quick um I think the whole purpose it's kind of I I I would assume that disposal of trash costs more than disposal of recycling so like if you no it's about the same it's about the same then that's a little different you kind of you almost try to encourage recycling to cut down on the trash but yeah it's yeah that's then your point is it used to be more definitely more palid if this yeah there's so much more to recycle now than there ever was before as far as people being aware of what can be recycled and I still don't see um uh if you're if you want to do it if you want to push it that's fine and the paying for it um it's usually going to come down to people who are willing to to pay for it and why not do it up front so especially for a small town like if it was 20 I I well for the amount of what it's costing out of our budget exactly I mean for years I yelled at my kids you know put the recycling in the recycling we don't have to pay for it and the town gets paid and then I look at this surprise and why not so I can let them just go back to like throwing it in the trash bag yeah you know with the um how much Goods going in the trash bag anyway I know in my house a fair amount of it I'm the one picking it up well I mean if you look at um in my own case I mean you look at what you purchase online now through Amazon or something and the amount of cardboard you drive on is is just you know exploded yeah so I mean that's that's recyclable and that's tonnage and that's cost I mean if they came up with better ways to make it more equable for towns to do and I'm not talking about like again is there a place where individuals can take their um cardboard or their paper and get paid for it not that some scrap places do do accept it but it's on it's on such a like so me for work we do a lot of HS big boxes we sore them we cut them all up and we take them and it's like I'll bring a box truck load and it's like here's a dollar so there's the problem there's no money in it for the recycling people so if they used to pay us to do it we've got a we've got to collect money to collect and I think if people in dton knew about this they'd be like okay yeah well I think they probably the impression that I was under is that you know the recycling went over here because there was Revenue being made right I actually think some people thought because you hear about it oh you you know you make money off the side they think that you're going and popping in you know but you're not it's not safe now what about like monitors and TVs and exactly that's mattresses and but you have to pay and I'm not going to speak for Mr Ferry now he's he's part of our um our commit uh but he in particular was tried to focus in on um the actual cost to the town if you will to dispose of those items that go in to the transer station and just recently he's had to increase the fees on like air conditioners or refrigerators because now there's a there's a free on capture fee and you know it's it's unfortunate from the town's people perspective that look this is suddenly doubled but the fact of the matter is it it the cost doubled because it's just reflecting the cost to the town yeah Town's not making any money no not at all again it's a lot of these I honestly think the mandates you know capturing the you know imagine you know 20 30 years ago nobody ever thought about that so I mean if I've got to throw away an air conditioner you shouldn't have to pay for it correct so agreement that fees are better than property taxes rightly well that's that's one of the things that we've uh discussed at length as pay as you throw and my Mantra is if you throw away 10 bags and I throw away one that playing field shouldn't be level right that should be paying for 10 exactly um the um there was some issues on on Facebook um the dayon page regarding and again I'm not going to speak Mr F I want to speak about part of the conversations that we've had on this matter um the sticker Fe okay they're going to go from 15 to 30 and I think you probably that increase was derived from the the operating fees oh excuse me the operating costs of the transfer station so it came to $28 90 some cents and we talked about it we said well we'll make it 30 it it's not to make a profit it's not to buil people out of their money it's simply that's what it costs for those people and there's always about 700 stickers that are that are out there and now I have one of them okay and I'm going to pay those of us that have stickers are going to pay an additional 15 so we can bring this into a fiscal year Etc but the point being uh that's that fee is what it costs to to operate transfer no no profits being yeah and then and that's fine you know again everything is based on what's needed to run the actual process and that's good that's good but the again the thing is that you were talking about how a fair that is it's just it's a Breer especially when you have older people who don't throw out a whole lot and that's part of the discussion regarding you know um break if you will a feed break for people the the number that's being floated around is about 7 years old okay yeah you know I never thought and there's nothing wrong with that U the thing is I never thought that it really equates well because um it's it's one where not everybody may be viable for it who should and it's not Equitable on the basis that you're throwing out 10 and you're thr that one and whatever your age is so um and it would just correlate a ically for the fact that if somebody was older usually they don't have much time but again just to emphasize in this meeting again it's not a matter of trying to make money it's covering the cost and again uh part of the Baseline philosophy here is that this is a service to the town's people which the town government put together people at the lowest possible price that we can pay and quite honestly uh what do you want it do you want to pay the fee that's reasonable in the town's program or do you want Tom Ferry picking it up on the side of the road you know because we we've seen we're very fortunate this town we don't see that very often but where I have family members that live in other towns you drive there there'll be three tires there there'll be four bags over there and it's not PR and you still pay for if Tom has to pick it up we still have to pay for it only it comes out of the Town budget I mean in essence the committee came up with a recommendation of basically charging a large bag and a small bag fee to every household under 70 year olds for recycling and curb side yes is that basically summary yeah just as a clarification so the current payers system would would remain in place as it is with the current bag prices to remain like in effect to for the current bag prices to remain in effect as they are right now oh like that program would pay the town um generally um the town the town cost the town cost that um we get from bers to dispose of everything we pick up so um it's basically user fee um that through the B program where we per bag um our residents find what they going out on the Flow side we have a gap especially with recycl and so what um what the solid Bas committee has proposed because all the imbalance and structure that currently exists um I give the implementation of a solid fee that would basically fund that would fund the Cubs the cost of the Cub side pick up of trash recycling by bges it would fund it would fund obligations of that contract which planing for f25 the cost of that alone the cost of that alone not including all the Tipping fees or all the disposal fees that cost of loan is 44 almost uh 4 $50,000 so that's what the proposed fee from the solid waste committee um would be based on is actually at true cost to um to provide for the curbside trash recycling through bores at the cost of $450,000 um and then we have um 29 about 2900 households who participate in that so based on those numbers um there have been a recommendation um to have to have a structured Solid Waste fee um based on based on that of $200 per for not senior and $100 um $100 per year um for for senior 70 and above um it's it's you know like it just like really reflected a lot of really like unsustainable things things that um that that we Face including cash including education in in our operating budget that are just becoming that are becoming unsustainable that are very non discretionary um and we have the service um it's really well regarded as a value and it's I a point now where everything is actually hitting ahead all at once and we're trying to be thoughtful about how we how we try to address all like all this very thoughtfully um in a way I I can aware that's as Fair as possible well that's fine I just wondering about um the whole idea of the the bags um specific for um recycling if that will cover it to be honest with you with our contract with Gorgeous because like all our recycle bin all our cycle bows just go into um go into a big contain it in the aggregate if I had to if I had to if I had to get the material of the plastic bags and having having having GES or having the recycling plan which is separate from where we take from where we take our trash inchest having having them to separate that L I'm I'm actually not sure whether that would cause problems with our current contract or like or with the acceptance of those recyclables right can't see them there one truck that picks up the recyclables and another truck that picks up the truck correct so the recyclables you're just going to have to pay to get rid of separate correct and taxes I would imagine sorry the fee would be included in your tax bill how would that be paid the fee be have to like issue we' have to we have to issue through the board of heal and the treasures of this like actually what would be viewed as a utility bill that would be build separately from taxes B anually um to to implement that fee and to would it go out with the taxes I'm only saying because now we got another mailing and more postage yeah oh yeah we wouldn't have an ability we only have an ability ability through the tax bills to to to to mail taxes and that's why so on that tax bills like it's only everything to do with the taxes um well that's why I think it should be the way it is now with trash you know you go you pay your fee to buy the bag you'll just be paying a fee to buy a bag for the recyclable right but it's easier for somebody to get rid of recyclables that don't belong in recycl recable paint cans whatever you can't see anything it's in a bag where it's not in the bin and if they don't if it's not recyclable they leave it in the bin what we've G about having our recyclables not curbside pickup but just in uh containers at the landfill no we haven't had that discussion pay in there that you have to pay but would do that they the trash well let me if if I meant um have to be cautious what I say here um it would require a great deal of discipline on the part of everyone to everyone in town to go and and take their recyclables to one Central Point now I've I I've seen that in other countries uh however I it would take a lot of discipline and um maybe not everybody has that level of discipline or the the ability the ability correct because I feel with this just paying the fee to everybody gets the same fee not everybody creates the same amount of trash some people are very conscious of their footprint whatever and work at that um so if Fe where the every town member pays the same it is a service I've got that but um I don't know well let me let me ask this question for a school would it be worth our our committee to examine what it would take to have um uh recycled bags and now I know there there would be a cost for the bag there may be a cost with gorgeous or somebody having to open up those bags they clear they should be able to you know but I mean can the can the bag be disposed of with the rec they it all yeah I think that is really the critical question I don't actually like um yeah the oh yeah the material bag the P I'm sorry I'm just blanking yeah if I had to guess that that material in with all the recyclables probably screw out the whole but is in plastic bottles part of recycling too but they different count cont point and we it doesn't cost to ask the question you know I want to just make a quick comment because one if say if we had excess Levy capacity we would be you know raising the tax rate and you wouldn't even know that that additional fee was there um I think you get into a slippery slope when you start arguing about who's using what because then you'd almost have to give everybody the option to opt out of anything well my kids aren't in school so I'm going to opt out of paying for school I don't you know I don't have a fire hent so I'm going opt out of pay for the that's you know you're opening up the window that you just you can opt out of anything that you don't feel you need and then two the other thing with the fees that kind of concerns me is how do you police who has paid their bill who has opted out you know so it's like is Bor just going to drive down the street with a list I could just be that's the board of H well you know to the tre's office oh yeah we'd be able to have there are many towns that have this program that's structured that like is all is all work through and coordinated with the disposal Company one of the things I mean we um we have over these last over these last over the last few months get um to to where we need to be to have a balanced budget um we thought that we as we know we thought we had the ability to to be there and get there um up until through the end of February um and that all changed when we found out um when we found out when we found out where School assessment was going uh which was all which is which is also arguably Beyond should Beyond be on the control um and so um right now we have we have and as we have shown in our towns proposed General operating budgets we have a we we have very modest increases that reflect that cost of living increase in cost in health insurance modest increases in our pension assessment we as a town in my opinion do a really good job of holding the line um what we're faced with because the non-discretionary because of the non-discretionary areas Beyond accable like trash like education just for the DI assessment alone we have an increase of $1.16 million in fy20 pling for FY 25 on new revenues um that we projected um and we've increased we've been very thoughtful and and strategic about how we have an ability to increase him those new revenues only only total up to 885 ,000 so we have a structural imbalance that we tried that we tried over two months to uh to come up with options menu um that we have um that we have as opportuni to close to close the budg of G which right now stands at about $240,000 and we're only a few weeks out of having to have a warrant for the June 10 meeting um thankfully um the work of the solid based committee and looking at these costs looking at the trash recycling transfer station in general had had already been there so when we had this challenge when this challenge was identified that I mean the solid RTE challenges has been there for has been there for a few years now but we did have an A we did have a structure with the solid waste Committee in place to see if based on based on that structural Gap we had an ability to through through a fee to address budget issues that way we also have other we also have other we also have other options in terms of balance um um some more sustainable than others but uh but I just want to make you clear this is one of a few options that we have um but it's not the um it is it does I think it would help to place us in a more sustainable path going forward but this isn't the only option we have yeah I I actually was going to say that um the program whatever you guys are proposing is fine for the coming year but still think about the possibility of going to another option and and that would give you time to go ahead and say yeah this is good it's bad fully recognize every recognizes that we're not you know however if we can hit the outer ring of the target you know then determine where the shortfalls are uh we can make uh corrections as necessary I mean who says you can't mixture I me but you know we're trying to move forward in a fashion it's a pay as you throw it's a Serv Mr mull I have a quick question how many uh households do we have in D right now Ball Park um total it's 2911 right no those are the that currently participate in the program um TR program it's about 3200 30 um 3,255 households total what do the other 300 do if they don't participate they have five follows already what's the average cost of a private a lot a lot way more expensive than we have two people on the committee uh one person has lives in another town has a private Hall he's uh just just uh little over 500 a year you have another individual that's just under 900 a year and just very quickly if if I may the reason I asked the question about the households total uh if you look at the recycling costs in 2023 again actual numbers was 327,00 you divided that by the number of households indicted people paid within their taxes they paid $100 per household for that so you know whether it's a it's it's question of what pocket does it come out of right okay but based on those numbers it's was $100 61 so if we do a fee I can throw 10 bags with it why not and like said this has this was this is something that's been going on for a few years basically since since China St buying the cycles and something that so but something that's changed I mean there are things that we do right now hunting license fishing license uh Firearms permits um the individuals who do those things or or want those things pay a fee and it hasn't created this oh well if they you know get that for that fee then I'm not going to do this I so I think that that that can be an option where you you know you pay as you throw or pay as you but recycling is not something that we can say hey put your recycling over here because that's free to the town it's actually a revenue Source those days are gone right and that's everybody sees that so they're like we have to pay for it the same we pay for TR right or we need to buy an incinerator and let people bring all we just in problems one just a liability yeah from a logistics standpoint did the committee look at the fact that we're April 25th implementing it by the new year I would defer that question because this my understanding we started looking at this and then suddenly some time ago and then suddenly um all the budget issues came up so I I can't speak to the how I can speak from the the the trash persec how we got here not from the budgetary perspective imagine it would be a little difficult to implement in two months eight weeks I think the challenge we have is the timing of it actually being proposed right now um like it's a it is my opinion it's a it is a very sustainable way to balance um the just like everything the question I have um I just timing um we were um we were as Mr Perry said in t race we've been looking at this issue very carefully thoughtfully um the the budget challenge that we face has has expedited it um it's I in terms of answering that question I really think the answer to that question really I real really needs to Beed by by the SEL in the um it's there there are some things that that we have proposed and I believe move forward one is that increase to the sticker for the transfer station the other is um as Mr Ferry you know gets his bills in ETC or these particular items or whatever disposal costs um that fee is increased again as we stated earlier not to make money just to you know balance the books if you want okay I mean that's that's happening so money saved is about the same as Revenue rat yeah cost avoidance exactly yeah so if we're we're looking just to charge this fee we're not changing the program itself we're just charging a fee so why wouldn't why would there be any problem with the new fiscal year starting July 1 that we just put it into action I if that's what we agree to do I guess my thought is that we we agree that we would recommend it right or could decide that they recommend it but we wouldn't know until June 10th and if we get to June 10th and it gets voted down then we've got a unbalanced budget I have a thought so how many bags do we sell any year and and if you take that number of bags and you divide that by the cost of the recycling and just inflate the cost of the bag to cover the recycling you're done triple I would kind of agree with you on that point because my my trash output and recycling output is pretty relative you know so yeah if I need three bags of trash and they doubled in price to reflect my recycling output which is similar that's not the worst idea we started playing around with some if you want to look at the sheet that says 2024a um if you raise the price large tags to 270 the small ones to a17 based upon projection of existing data from 20193 we would actually uh realize in the top 30 I hate to use this word but I'm going to Pro it almost $144,000 but that would that increase would cover the cost of if you look down at recycling again no money from recycling but what I did was I took that 13 almost 14,000 and I included that little green slice that would cover 4.2% of recycle if you wanted to things you know that way uh Down Below in the bottom for curbside SL recycling Revenue again it's coming from the bags uh the revenue from those bags would cover 56% of both programs appropriated but still have to cover 42.7% so we haven't raised the price enough well yeah but I mean there is an upper limit too and the folks from I don't want to say Adam but they're very strong in there regarding go so high and people [Music] just whatever wipe out well if you go to the next page recycle I did a 2024 B again just projecting again with bags large 270 small $170 down in recycling if we would charge a fee of $101 per home again in conert with the um the uh increase in trash bags you could cover that recycling cost also and cover the cost so $101 per [Music] home along with the increased the increase in bags okay so you couldn't just increase the bags enough to cover that $100 home whole right here again based upon what we told from dp's experience out of contact here there there is a Tipping Point sorry I used that word there is a Tipping Point where uh people simply not do it and quite honestly I mean I don't know what my number is but I know that when you try to charge that number I'm going to opt out okay I mean I don't know what that is but there is an upper limit for everybody and I yeah you're just assuming that it's going to be that it's going to work that people are just going to go along everybody $100 divided by 52 weeks we're picking up once a week again that that's just with with everything $2 not for bad that's $2 per week bags do you use three at my house well the recyclables are generally bigger your plastic containers and so $2 a week we're charging it on the trash to cover the recycl which is trash recyclables are trash they're trash now and would be the proposed 200 to4 a week that that's a gallon of gas I understand that but it's still only $4 a week just put it out at your curve and just watch it disappear yeah so can charge it with the bags it's coming out to cents more for bag so where is that and in the woods I think that's based on every individual's what does the say they they just said there is a point out there they didn't want to say it was around could be I want to say $5 550 is um how one of one of the things we um T to sell way we looked at doing a high with increas in bags um and then around $100 feet the okay I'm sorry there was a GH um there um but just in terms of tracking I can be able to nationalize what the fees is actually covering in what the fees covering in terms of the cost though um because arguably the pay as you throw program but in ital comes fairly close to paying for all the Tipping all the disposal and so because that is is B basically matching itself on on what we're getting through pay you throw and those who throw more are actually paying um a virtually user fee to do that where we have an imbalance of what it actually costs to get the truck to do that and um so so rather than than a hybrid approach with those con is a split between having having a very Defined answer uh or being able to have a very Defined answer about what specifically the feet is covering is just it's a lot it could be as a lot as a lot cleaner explanation uh to rationalize what exactly the numbers are behind the feet right so how do we charge the feed we would um so the the fee um and the revenue could be booked as as a revenue within our budget um we with then the Board of Health um we wouldn't um um wouldn't um we wouldn't need a warrant article for to do this um the Board of Health would be able to commit um to based on that list based on who under the current model that's being proposed who seniors not seniors combined with who have opted out um the Board of Health B on that I information would commit um those bills on a biannual basis twice a year to the Treasure's office who would then would then send out those bills as as a utility bill um to to be remitted um back to the Treasure's office which would them be booked as Revenue am I correcting that um so it wouldn't be booked as Revenue until we like the residents actually come in to pay but we would book an estimated Revenue which can't be the complete amount because we know that people are going to opt out there are going to be exemptions and there are going to be people who don't pay so it would be committed at a certain dollar amount and then we would estimate a lower amount for actual Revenue received back back to Kevin's point though I mean if we were having a town fee should should you be able to op out so they didn't have pres um Provisions to opt out um there are residents that currently have private haulers um so the Board of Health would have to work out exactly that procedure um so we were thinking that they the residents would have to prove that they're actually properly disposing of the rubbish um and then if that would be on a renewal year annual to verify that they are still in contract with somebody else yeah um and then the age I think to Mr White's point though it's like if you if you're increase save you double the bag fee to four and it's now it's going to cover the recycling it's equitable and that's a lot easier pill for people to swallow than to say every single one of you unless you opt out is going to get a bill I think that's the biggest point is how do you sell this to town meetings you can put this in the budget all you want somebody's going to stand up at a yeah you going just stop getting those Amazon boxes this doesn't you know then then it is I'm the fee itself just really to be the fee itself does not have to go to town meeting what what you have to go to town meeting um what you have to go to town meeting is actually if if um if the town specifically the board of the board select wanted to implement a senior feet um that we have to have a bylaw um giving the board fman to have a senior fee that has to go to time meeting um what also has to go to time meeting is um if we have a fee we we need to be able to make sure we have an ability to collect the fee um and um we would have to adopt a provision of the mass G Law chapter 44 section 28 c um subsection F to give the ability to the treasures office just like they have just like they have the SE and other fees um to be able to to be able to to be ring like any uncollected Fe to properties without having to record them in the registry Feats because that's just Andre Poss process so there is a mechanism in the law that allows just just just like in SE the ability to lean without without reporting um but no I think it's again there are and to be clear there are a there are there are a few policy questions here that also need to that also need to be decided by the board SEL as well um so I think the um and I don't I don't know that the board of Selectmen has has weighed fully um on those policy questions as of yet um so I don't I just want to make sure as we're proceeding here um we in terms of sequencing there's a question of come what comes first at Tri and I just want to make sure we get that sequencing right to have a consensus of everybody involved um so the board of selectman have I'll also have the ability to weigh in on those two War um that would that would based on what has been proposed by the salt waste committee um give this program this structure um or to be backed up with the structure that the recommendations actually proposed with if it's not then the structure become could be viewed as becoming a whole other thing at this point so that sounds complicated yeah and and and and if we just raise the bag fees we don't need any of that stuff and if it works we keep doing it if it doesn't work we got another year to figure it out I get to his point though that for planning purposes you you got a variable so you're still dealing with you're looking at that deficit because you don't know how many bags people are going to buy so they're going to buy some right they're going to buy some but how do you project yeah are they going to buy less cuz now are they buy so you have to do that is what happened the last time we drew up data the last time the feed was raised less Fe was raised there was there was a um there was a decrease so we have to assume that and to plan that and and to rationalize that to do and some type of Revenue projection when we do our recap in November that's a tricky Wicket um and to try to plan and project any of that Revenue now um to make sure we have a balanced budget for now and going into our recap um I think would be even more of a challenge am I correct no yeah AB s if if we were going to project revenue on the assumption that people are going to opt out but that we'll be able to collect I mean and just to throw a number at it my guess is we'd say 80% of possible Revenue but if we don't get the ability to lean I would say 40% might be a high number yeah that's a good point right yeah that's what the policy questions have to intersect so I have a comment here you said when we raise the price people were buying less bags but did our trash output also go down so are people getting more conscious of the trash they're putting out being more conscientious about packaging and stuff like that and therefore need less bags just because the bag count goes down we don't know what our trash the recycl well we don't have the of trash now we're saying we're not paying for the recycling yeah well I can tell you from personal experience I learned that once we got new bags that are durable that you can use your person as a compactor to fit more K bags theight CH but the back part I didn't do it because it's all it goes in which brings us back to if we raise the price of the banks people get more conscious they see how much it's costing them for the amount of trash they producing and the thing is you're still giving them an out because you're giving the large and the small so you've got it out you know to where you don't large but you're you're uh allowing them to decide on how they want to do it now is this also going to mean that um with the raising of the uh price of the bag is that by itself or or is this also in tandem with this fee that's G to be happening well um in the in the projections let me start um 2024 a that was just increasing the B 20 24b was an increase with the bags and the feed um to look at 100% coverage of the program again these are just projections based upon 2023 uh 2019 through 2023 data okay so two things had to happen 24b to cover the whole program we're we're still tossing around um different strategies try to to uh cover these costs um and the $200 $100 of I don't know maybe if it was a one time thing that would be and then move on to um the bags for the recyc I you know again it's it's trying to be uh well what we're trying to do is again Implement pay as you're roll and that's an easy thing to do with the bags it's an easy thing to do with the transfer station what gets sticky is um the recyclable you know because you can't really quantify that per household and and that's why um at this point we're we're trying to I hate to best guess but we're trying to step back and we looked at a four years worth of data things that were happening with people were throwing Etc and it's still it's better than it was our idea of what's happened better than it was but it's still a little soft in terms of recyle you know over at Lopes they pulverize all that stuff doesn't matter what you throw in there metal wood and cardboard I think they send it off to get separated but other than that yeah but it just gets pulverized into like powder I mean what is there a deal that can be made between in the town and an organization like them that would be more cost effective I don't I can't answer question tell you that getting it there is I have a dumpster with company that was taken over [Music] by cost dumpster cost when I get a dumpster I know I know yeah my shop dumpster doubled yeah in the last yes the only thing that sort of gets everybody is when you talk about a new fee how long is a fee going to be is that you know again it's another fee and never going away and yes it ever I don't right rare do things go away areos to to emphasize again our our thrust in the whole program is not to make money but to you know the town writes a check uh for whatever uh that money is derived from or will be refilled by those fees that are collected and and it's a one for one we pay a dollar to dis we the town pay a dollar to disposal we expect you to pay the dollar for us to dispose of that item for you and if you look at it it's it's sort of a centrally operated thing where every resident can come in and instead of having for each individual programs you've got a program that's established by the town has oversight by you're protected by the town as opposed to having to go out on your own right and it's more reasonable than if you had to do it on your own yes and who if it was your own who are you going to ask on Facebook trash Pi up that's [Music] right large and small breakout from last we have the fi23 actuals um uh and FY 23 there were 487 cases of lad bag sold um 157 cases of small bags you roughly how many are in a case [Music] um don't know no they don't sorry trying to work up if we went to four and 2 and A4 how much how close would that get us to right I yeah you know I looked at these these numbers and projected basic fund the cost that are currently we have as well as a proposed increase in the bags 4 and two and a qu I think reasonable make might get you another qu 150,000 maybe depending on how many is in the case chasing $250,000 [Music] all want to do is cover the cost of the rubbish conservatively and it only hits those exactly because the thing is prices are going up because where is where are we going to put the trash that's what it's coming down to so if we don't start get getting responsible about how much trash we piling up um the the private HS did they pay a fee to be able to come into town not currently that do have the ability to do that um it's been advocated for by we could have a sure got to get a private holid license how many hes did you have I really [Music] really hi I'm going to reach out to you guys one thing I've been tossing around is a little like mock town meeting and I'd like you guys to just come introduce yourselves you know don't have to stick around for the whole thing but just so Community can get to know you that's a good idea right stage I'll send you guys all an email but I just stop say thank uh one quick I mean I think this is a very healthy discussion obviously because it's speaking to a need that we've had for a few years um my only thought is because this because of the policy choose intertwined in this um it could be helpful and we don't have a lot of time but we do have a little time maybe um we wanted to bring this back in the c um and we tried um a few weeks ago to try to have a um a joint meeting between the finom um I do think it could be helpful especially with regards of this to have to get back to having that joint meeting um just because those these policy issues are intertwining with financial issues now and it would be great and I think helpful um helpful and healthy in a uh for a variety of reasons to actually have that that uh if we do have the ability to do something make any adjustments uh to do that through a consensus um between both groups if that makes sense yes um just to give you the temperature of the board last night there was no excitement about a 100 or 200 Fe um I'm sorry we've done this workb and I hate to think that it can just get thrown out the window but there was no appetite to increase the feet um however there was an appetite to increase the bags which I would think would probably be the way to go the only thing is well not the only thing one of the things and my phone blew up today um is just don't call it a trash fee increase the tax um people just don't want I mean these are different people just don't want another bill um be willing to pay a higher higher bag cost I don't think they were talking about $4 which I don't know if that's what was thrown around here today um for the LOD for the lodge bag they um think if we're going to have a fee it should go now be a new bill they think it should go to town as a as a vote not just a s deciding I'm just telling you from different people saying different things the [Music] um what else was there no appetite for from the either uh other members of the board uh now I'm on the solid waste committee I knew what was coming and I um expressed what the the Sol waste committee had said and neither one of them wanted to do that so I think it would be H pressed to walk out of this meeting tonight thinking that you made up your mind that the uh fee is is a way to go because I don't think you'll get pass the board select now when it comes to trash bags I I think that's a more likely in a less cumbersome option you're not worried about billing and who's opting out and change uh that so that certainly is an aspect um $ sounds a little steep but it is what it is just in terms of just in term just in terms of when you look at the 2024a like our bag's right now priced um a price um $2 per bag and $1 per bag like if just just based on this hypothetic hypothetical scenar Alone um if they were the banks were increased to um 270 each for a large 170 each for a small just with that hypothetical loan that would generate a total annual revenue of $44,000 right now they don't reduce the number of yes y but but just based on just as a hypothetical um that would produce a total annual re projected Revenue with those uh with those conditions uh produce a estimated re conditional revenue of $44,000 in FY 20 20 I know 24 I believe 25 no um um um that revenue is projected at $190,000 so when you net out the 44us 190 that is $214,000 in addition conditional additional Revenue that I think that type of discussion based on the discussion that's happening now it could be maybe right for some additional discussion um it brings us it I mean obviously we can't project right to that level because it is get a whole host of contingencies but if we have some mechanism to increase that Revenue um also combine it with additional cuts um and then um and then we do have other options like free cash as well those those could be that type of package could get us the balance um but it's I think we do need that is one time only going to run out just like Essa ran out should you know the thing is we we're in this bind because SRA ran out and oh I don't and the school committee needs you know that extra money y so if we're going to do this with the bags we already print the Seal of the town on there can it say you know Dr ctax right on the B yeah one of the other things that was tring about for I mean is over to a dollar now. 70 DRS sh tax one of the things I was mentioned more than once was July wasn't enough time to get the bo out that there was going to be this right twisting this so hard well I if I may um Karen made a very good point about Bo not having an appetite for for feet I I think part of the education process for for community members is where advocating pay as you throw as we've had a discussion already the more you throw more you want to pay number one number two we have to cover the costs of I'm going to focus on specifically on curb side and if people that are throwing away don't cover that cost and everybody across the town is going to cover that cost through appropriated funds and as such the bag fees are going up so again those who throw more will pay more and will'll cover the cost of what they're throwing away plain and simple but I think this the the education component you know if if we don't educate people to what's happening and why it's happening right they're going to go on Facebook and there going to be 12,000 different ideas and they're all going to be negative when this first started I guess I mean I've been here for 20 years how long has the bags been going on for a while right 35 40 years okay so in the beginning when this all started I wonder how everybody got themselves acclimated when it was like 30 cents a bag or whatever it was so I think there's always that learning curve MH and then it kicks in and people once they realize they're on board because they understand so I agree but would you be to to update your to do a 2024 SE with even say $3 and $2 yes true and can we throw this into the mix what how many gallons of the small bags and how many gallons of big the large is supposed to be 33 small I don't know so structure maybe we try to encourage people to buy the volume bag by not having such a low cost on the smaller bag so that you you you don't really have to go up as high on the price because you're encouraging people to buy a larger bag by not having it's like when you go on you buy a coffee right you you don't pay a whole lot more from small to large it's not double M you know you so if you use that same type of philosophy on you know the smaller bag saying okay well maybe that one's uh a190 or or $2 but then the larger bag stays under four so you're still getting that Revenue right well looking for two and three right now you're forcing them to buy the well you're not forcing them but you're encouraging them to be more frugal to buy the bigger bag and then we get more Revenue out of it what do you want Char just throw a number out right for what would you why I was asking the gallons because then you can kind of arrive at that number we're looking at at projection 24 B was 270 what what would you want to charge $3 okay so you go $3 for that one and $2 for the small and the small go now now they're going might as well buy big ones there's that but the thing is the small bag especially for a senior population or whatever you need the smaller bag can't pick up a bigger bag they askor discs you know one of the other things to uh realize is the it's the Board of Health that's going to decide the price of these bags they're very fragmented right now and I don't see it um happening in time for this coming thisal year well the BS would be quick you do that approves oh you were to charge $3 bag um and you took that 2024b that I did your Revenue would be$ 44,7 77 $3 a bag it would be sorry again be approximately 400 449,000 okay that that's quick going to bag okay and some still buy little bags at to the challenge I mean just that's real quick Andy that's even more you bump this right people bu the one thing I the one thing that I think uh I would certainly like to see not only as a finance Committee Member but as someone who's paying for the shortfall um Hall fee private Haller yeah 300 that somebody's coming yeah a sticker like get from the right you do yeah yeah I I don't disagree um but I think that um especially with what chairman kind of just mentioned with where we are with what health right now we do I think we're definitely running into a timing issue of um how we balance how we go to time meeting with a balanc budget um I just think that's a yeah that's a critical consideration right now I think everything we're talking about is great and healthy um we've had to uh really just and we've been working previously in the past few months to jack up this conversation um it does you it could sound like more conversation might be needed and I'm just really questioning at this point whether to get everything done you know we have a balanced budget meeting two time meeting is just I I am yeah like I do have that I do have that concern at this point Thank you am I done or done me it was very good day you pull a lot of work thank you so much it was great information fory and thrown if I may as as a party statement um I I think uh we really need to emphasize the whatever we do all boards together need to emphasize the education because I I truly believe that people our residents understand um why this has to be done and the fact the more you're going to have to pay and the fact that the the town has put together this um this function that you we individually don't have to do we don't have to take the risks we don't have to take responsibility all we have to do is take a bag out to the end the driveway and that's service emphasize that ucation thank you just in terms and this is just a thought but just in terms just in I mean we we do have other options not the best options by far but like I do actually think it would be helpful if so oh oh yeah the committee just so we could hopefully come to like like a better landing spot to know um I there any addition Cuts what additional Cuts Theos to make um whether they um whether the FR agrees Al with any other Town Administrator other Town Administrator recommendations uh the additional recommendations we have tried to make and work to make U to bring the deficit more um $100,000 every so far um and then if the F has any more then we could take that the the um the the value of those cuts and then really see where we're truly landing and in terms of what we really need to close from there we could be talking about all these options uh until probably like 11: tonight but I think it could be helpful to have an updated number of what what are any Target Cuts any like additional Cuts along those lines the FR CL um might want to see so then we might be able to actually get to and updated to a deficit number does that make sense y do we have any indication if the school's going to come back with a new number at all no not at all so mean like whether they'll get the the increase in the public people spending is still a question in the first place the house the house um is in the process of solidifying its budget with the 104 over the 30 in there whether that stays true in the Senate um is a question and whether that if there's any difference what happen in conference the conference committee um is a whole other question we might not even know that answer um till mid July um so that doesn't unfortunately do anything for our budget now I have one question have we spoken with Mr Rooney uh concerning if the per pupil allocation does go up and that the um they are not going to use the additional funding by increasing the budget are we going can we yeah as a town mentioned this with you tell them we've got to stick by this number whether per pupil um funding is raised uh we can only stick with the numbers we've got now and any of that would I don't know if you remember this but we were meeting Mr Rooney at the high school it was the or was the CH meeting between Finance he wasn't willing to commit to that leny asked him that and he wasn't willing to commit well as a town I remember when I was on school committee and we'd be coming up to town meeting and at that point the selectman would give the school committee a number right this is what we can afford and uh we're not going to go above that can't goove we tried that was try yeah yeah yeah unfortunately it comes from the school committee and and also it has to do as well with what the T of has the to handle as well and if they um and if they don't have any issue as you know with their with their assessment and we don't approve app question then we get into then we get into the possibility of attent meeting and going through that have you spoken with their select or whatever and asked them what their opinion may be on this point on whether they would be willing to uh or in a financial position where they could allocate anymore I don't have that AFF policy um question I don't have the ability to do that they would not I know they would right they wouldn't meet with us no they wouldn't increase their increase the funding why should we well the the thing is that's where the school committee is kind of left in a bumble neither town can really afford any additional fund pay for VP and agricultural okay I I didn't know what you know yeah that question I mean like if the school does at the end of the day well at the end of July um know that they're going to get that Revenue yeah the in I don't it's it's their mistake was when they had that extra funding because of Co that they used it on continuing employees that they put on the payroll when they could have used it to take care of some of the kids get them out of those um portable temporary units and maybe made something permanent spent that money one time and then when it was taken away they wouldn't have to chase this bigger budget yeah it's still that's why you know one of the things you know just in the DI budget as we know they have they they rely they rely on an end 10 back the you turn back to fund $750,000 of the operational budget um what budget um it ex deficiency turn back free cash equivalent um so their operational budget relies on $750,000 the equivalent of free cash that is not guaranteed to re so conceivably that 1.1 increase this year just that could be 1.5 next year because because we're going to use that seven that's going to be gone and then they're going to come back with another budet a little bigger than a gift that keeps on get yeah so in terms of our departmental budgets um mention like we did we have um um and and we um try to come up with additional Target in um to be clear these um the um the the updated recommendations still to be considered byin but that un likee the policy un like the policy questions and the other the board I mean the F Club does have the ability to make its own recommendations here as well so everybody get a chance to go through the updated recommendations [Music] [Music] that has a salary individual that's looking for a raise any departments that are looking for arise other than the um sens for education I think hold the line for a year sens are all Frozen so all the Sal increases are all contra okay so that not that idea do you want to go over these individually now Mike or you you want to hold up until we until the boys had a chance to go through I I went through every one of these I I I made my own lists uh and and then I went back and had to cut off half of them because half of them were adjustments that you guys had made already so I I know from my standpoint you've hit you've hit every where you fit I I was where I was looking and then there's just some more thoughts but yeah I think we be find with entertaining those taking the direction from then them like then we can see how low how much low of those that get us down to yeah um and then and I mean then as we continue on and finish up the process we can if there's any there's an appetite to propose more or updated we can do that too just keep everything going do um we do you want to go over these now or do you want to give them the opportunity to go through and let the board go through I'm just concerned about the time constraint so I would say to go because you guys are meeting today to go through them today okay mhm yeah we we have like two two and half so we're just going to go down line by line and take the big one because the big one is easier to [Music] read start all right so really first page no no changes the um and Mike you have to forgive me I don't have your picture yeah know so the um yeah you asked about uh you asked about any potential changes in the board s budget with uh with the comingo communications um just because that increase it's um that has increased that that 65,000 is is a true cost um we do and know working on the ability to reduce that um as we talked about through fiber in the next it's just it's just so high like even with the Comcast rates I mean the current rates they keep increasing I just like we know just closing out FY before where we are is going to be extremely tight I just think we've been tight there every year for the Last 5 Years um and yeah like so I just would recommend hold it's not IDE about holding the line there U so that brings us to if if it's okay are we going to do finance committee recommendations for each budget or are you thinking to just do discussions uh I'm just doing discussions because we don't make a recommendation until after yeah okay okay okay which is going to be Monday Monday okay um then the um 132 sorry um had the reserve fund so last year we increased that to 50 based on issues with the U developments and my thought is where we are we can't afford over the five so over so that back to [Music] 50 then 124 changed and subscriptions down 7165 down down $480 I'm sorry what budg your your budget lowered your subscriptions yes [Applause] 141 I I had a note that she she thought that with the map update update we could cut 1,800 off but you would said probably not you know that's a one it's a one year only uh increase to be because we're going through the revaluation um and we have to update our maps from what I understand from the colored pencil Maps um into GIS layers um so we yeah that is needed for one year um uh 145 professional and Technical with 2400 in unknown I thought was everything that had unknown in it should be cut so I cut I put in a proposal for half of that cut to 12200 is that uh 5300 under 145 uh 145 yes so that would cut by 1200 C by 1200 yeah so it's going down to 4800 it would cut it from the 168 down to 156 line item 5300 145 M uh professional technical also is over the past few years has generated about roughly $10,000 in free cash so just from that St Point could we cut another 3,000 out of that the um I my answer is the treasure collector has been extremely extremely diligent on um actually moving anything he's able to do to tax title um and um it does take additional resources to do that um addressing those issues has been brought up um in a few repeated management letters um he's been on it he's addressing it and that does take a little bit of resources to do so that speaks to that that funding actually this fiscal year is actually is actually being used I think um I think that I might be already expended uh to be honest with you 146 professional techic just said $1,000 cut it down to from two to one 85 to that point right might confuse both those lines and what I was just actually talking about was with the grads to the line you just mentioned Peter okay 146 professional and Technical 145 was what Prof might have been spent um they spent through the end of March 145 professional and Technical yeah they've spent 45% 8,700 so that's actually trending pretty low this current year yes so would rationalize here even more 14 46 they've already spent the two yes okay y okay sorry I confused that okay through the end of March they've only spent $85 on 146 is a tax title tax title depart 158 yeah I'm sorry okay shut up maybe so back at one uh account Department 145 the 5300 professional can we cut more off that yes I think so they' only used 87 so far 87 now5 is the treasur yeah they're budgeted at 16 okay oh oh okay like so cut an additional 3,000 from that as well addition to yeah that would bring it down to yeah 12 now I'm sorry okay and then 146 yeah per thank you I do think this is where just in ter of his treasure zero base budget backup I just want to pull it up because yeah yeah I tried to go through all their back sheets right yeah no okay yeah than bigest mik M get a recommendation change in 155 $5,000 for building permit software user Fe no other no other changes on this page [Music] no changes on the page six Templar [Applause] elections page seven a change in Conservation Commission and other supplies of dues and subscriptions cut 500 off of De and 400 off of other other supplies uh 175 and 176 so I I looked at at these two kind of at the same time and the same thing professional and Technical M it cut 2500 off of a board of appeals I been looking at the two both 175 and 176 at the possibility of doing the 25 each 176 what uh 5,300 for each so 15,000 down to 125 in planning in planning and then board of appeals and then board of appeals might dropped it from 10 to 7500 yeah really oh yeah really in my the fincom really does have does has a of to make it recommendation it's own recommendation and the only hesitation I I want we um had had they reducing is we know like in the we we very we very realistically expect um applications um um definitely one maybe two applications for battery storage um projects and that um that whole element is really the really new frontier in pering uh which if that were if those applications do come to fruition we would be I think only about the fourth community in the Comm to um have those applications come forward and just I just um the legal resources that it might uh it may take the planning board to be able to to Really structure up to be dealing to be able to deal with those applications that's why I left it alone but um it's it is an unknown so the legal fees that are associated with both the planning and the board of appeals they're paid from pnt oh okay they're not paid out of Fe okay so do they ever re with these legal fees do they ever recoup any money from these legal fees no well they do Bill the applicant when they're able to when they're able to okay but whether they and those monies would go right back into the legal feed account I yeah yeah no just to be like I totally I I totally get how that would be a glaring number um and a number for opportunity um so okay keep it open for discussion uh the next one that I had I I just wasn't sure based on their conversations uh last time it sounded like the utility bills were running roughly 10 grand a month I forget the exact number but then there also like a month behind as well yeah really increases that again with really trying to be Bend that's Bend from one side of the pendulum to another since that proc was creating trying to get that right and final for once and and just again just the same with the othering gold I am hesitant on um on any additional cut at least until we see a full year like with the updated rates then hopefully we'll have the ability to um to have an updated base and Comm make Corrections from that but again that's just my thought and we did take out 5,000 for the building repairs yes yeah have we heard from the agricultural commission not yet they St existed I thought you fell [Music] apart people here from that I'll follow upjo just to confirm yeah saw a week or two ago he said he's going to reach out to you okay I'll follow with him just as we to finalize all this uh 210 one of the lines that I was about is the over time timeline last year we gone up to 273 thought was last year's big event was going to be a significant generator of overtime and it was 12 12,000 so I was wondering my thought was if we could go down closer to the 250ish Again by cutting my cut five off I was looking at whether we could do another 15 even MH 5 yes a 253 44% so far3 the only thing with that like the are are spring months are the over time VI months um yeah and and also just the only question I would have there like is we in a year with the Union so any yeah like so um like any increases in rate um just on a base do compound into overtime rates as well so it will but it's it's oh yeah oh yeah oh I can I I do and I do know that the department is also dealing with um it's also dealing with additional mandated training as well that um they've actually had to um of additional training this year based on the state so it's the down offes yeah like oh yeah they have two offices one that's right now too so um if just my thought like if you wanted to bring it down 265 um yeah I get again I get how a burger number like that generates attention about 250 255,000 258 yeah I like 260 I'm cautious with that I feel like we never know what's going to happen over there they get entered this Randomness so 26 uh they we're going to look into they have j j JG PR and two separate lines 44700 yeah so we can take it out of the higher line um is that in we can take it out of p&t as long as we leave it in communication and we did the math earlier and the math does add up to having any Communications okay and the last one that I had in police was uh vehicle supplies and maintenance he had a large unknown for five five grand I think the Unown might have been 10 right and unnown was [Music] right no that's vehicle supp uh supp and halfway through the year they were at 22% yeah there a specific maintenance item that coming up or is that just what was it threw in for unknown unforeseen C right but it was 16429 before it was proposed to go to 29 yes well 16429 that's what they actually expensed in FY 23 well the total of the cost that they of the things they listed is 4545 so and they're asking for 2 2,100,000 I mean yes thank you so that seems like a a lot of unknown that I would say [Music] looking simar to last last two years right 16 commun 25 Communications my cut 14 to oper part time and 2600 out of replacement equipment yeah just to rec the $20,000 we do uh we do have grants um dedicated grants to fundr Staffing so that um that cost will be uh funded by the grant the operation budget for what communication just time where is that uh 25 thank you no it is actually dedicated Grant Revenue that we um we get every year I mean they they have to go apply every year there was one year that they didn't apply before chroming was Che so as long as they apply every year it seems like we have been granted that money every year so is there a consensus with the vehicle supplies of Maintenance and police to cut 5,000 I don't think right now there's any consensus it's just we're discussing discussing opinions for 220 I change the gas and Diesel Down by 2500 231 reduced equiv repair maintenance by 3,000 to 18,000 the only other let reduceing their requested increases yes the only other question that I had on fire with the 5050 rescue equipment whether we could cut that from 26,000 he has been spending it just get spent in gu probably all this time year so you don't have what that is through March I do um so we're talking about Department 220 50 uh 231 5850 231 5850 through the end of March they've spent 60% 15,000 [Music] [Applause] change 241 building inspection removed the increase of 1,800 from professional and Technical back then put put the account back to 24 budget 1,200 and then cut 241 cut 5,000 out of the [Music] yeah just just to be there is like a little bit of cut but if it does happen if it does need it that's also why we have to right and that's also why we do have a three catch full back as well so so in years when there have been multiple buildings that need to be demolished it'll run through the full3 and then come Reserve fund transfer us no changes I don't think on any of the other [Music] inspector an control just take a th off of professional technical education education um I don't do we is is the out of out of district is that a senior this year yes be the last okay so we pay for one student to go so this would be the last year for that I I take the job is that based on if she graduates I don't think that they allow you to stay for a fifth year if you didn't if you're not doing well they would just kick you out right I believe yeah I want to speculate that's a good point but yeah right now we expect the um student to enter the senior year and graduate okay that will save us $100,000 Highway Public Works Public Works supplies from 50 to 48 the only other question only other question that I had on it was uh vehicle supplies whether we could cut that to 20 he spent 24 last year 233 so the vehicle supplies are trending right on target but this current fiscal year they are slightly trending over budget as a whole the highway itself the highway as a whole for FY 24 is trending over budget at this point yeah so I would be a little cautious cutting too much from there the same Highway would be if we could move police details to Mo to the historic but also um the highway superintendent planning because we're um things are hopefully really starting to hit the payement pun intended on the Main Street project so details will need to be funded out of that I those will be split between the highway the highway and I'm sorry the highway in the street cleaning and storm water budget for that project when we I guess just as an example um Article 19 matri reconstruction 300,000 does he not include detail in that no uh right uh right now we have a um an unofficial cost projection of that project at $2.5 million um one of the things that b did last night I can say engage an engineering firm who um the town and the board procured um in the fall to provide us with an independent cost estimate um that also will help us leverage out Opa funding um but um the $300,000 is just um re balance um funded with funds we leveraging for that project of that 2.5 as long as that $2.5 million is a good number we have $1.15 million of that fund now so we're still trying to fund that incrementally so we do have the ability to um have a cash flow uh for that project when we're ready to go 432 D the police officers from 20 to 16 and Public Work supplies from 30 to 25 42 Peter Y and in details as well is that the question no Noor okay 433 I will admit I didn't spend too much time on because I knew we would be talking about wa tonight so um that we'll just need to fur the discussion and that is another department that um the board just bills does run like a month behind mhm too yeah transfers 435 like cut the bulky 2895 down to 65 MH 510 or 541 543 [Music] 549 um can off topic is it going to be the I saw the memo if there's no one on the meeting do we need to worry about microphones going back and forth I'm sorry just yes for the um went out about uh transcripts for uh hearing impaired into plus that anyone speaking have a microphone in front of them so since there's no one online we're we're okay right we don't need to worry about that oh we are actually oh we are oh yeah we are recording the meeting but but that microphone but that microphone is the only microphone that serves that purpose okay so we're good good yeah in this building they can hear everything but at Old Town Hall people do need to be at the and not speaking from the audience for 610 the only question Recreation on the lower end of that if we can cut that um I just have one question uh this was uh number 600 the sewer Enterprise fund so I noticed the office manager is currently working 30 hours she's cut down to 25 hours granted we have the 2.5% increase in Pays this uh year but she also got another 2% on top of that so um the office Works 32 hours it might if the description says 25 that's old it said she works 30 is going down to 25 where so I the office manager 5110 5110 yeah so this says 30 that should actually say 32 hours and then she has a part-timer um oh are you looking at their zero based budget document maybe that's for right that honestly I don't remember I went through a lot of papers but anyway so that was it was like another 2% she's got yes so um yeah uh oh going from FY that's a 23 FY 24 that employees hours was increased actually and then um and then in in the like in the most recent Collective buing Agreement um that is that is a ual benefit um based on the employee seniority I did verify the clerical salaries and she's ACC cut her hours aren being cut yeah I think that's just a typo on the Zero Bas budget from a couple years ago but she at 32 hours a week oh okay because it looked like she went from in the explanation said she went from 30 to 25 she's still making the same pay yeah that was just thank you no worries the only other two lines that I had questions on was uh 15 gr life insurance we typically spend under 700 even if we cut that to, 1500 and um 914 we've got contingencies in for five or six new family plans and we don't want to but maybe anyes yeah like I think um like I think it would be appropriate like I mean we never know who's going to join an open en but but if we I think we can very responsibly reduce that by 15,000 and worst thing that can happen is we got to go to reserves yeah you back [Music] I really the next in the the next two weeks we'll be meeting with the board of Select and see what their recommendations are as well any changes I might might have and um then we'll be voting on our recommend so so with that is our discussion right here just cut 42,000 okay which all these feel like two right so that bring 11 to yeah so um in the last two weeks there also been upd based on the house cherry sheet um with lway Governor proposed to increase Lo by 3% the host even though they went up on Chapter 70 they offset that with um a 1% loc rate increase so that brought um a projected budget um actually like increase our deficit by another $20,000 when that happened then um then also the bo assessors have been working on they been catching up on our exemptions um on our senior exemptions and how that has um happened historically over the years um in the other day as well um they voted to actually bring um bring the age for exemptions down from 70 years of age to 65 um so we that does have an additional $20,000 increase to our overlay as well so um when we reached out two weeks ago um with the uh with the targeted Cuts then uh we were at a deficit of 201,000 um those wait okay sorry um that brought it up to 240 and um with the reductions that have been identified tonight the additional ones it brings us down back down by by 42,000 so about we still defit 200,000 two weeks ago yeah basically and then we don't want you know the ly limit to be zero we want a you know a little cushion into the positive cuz so that was a point I made with the um overlay when I met with the board of assessors when I did the recap for closing FY 23 we had estimated 125,000 for overlay and then based on what we had outstanding fire accounts receivables the recap automatically recalculated and had me put in 127,500 so I'm just wary that that was beyond my control once I put in all of the numbers they said no you need need more so we want to make sure we have a decent Levy limit positive number in case um any of that happens when the government itself do does the calculation we need some room to in my opinion if we get to at least um we have to break even but then at least 20,000 positive that's very minimum I'll 50 40 something yeah well that makes sense but I just you know so just just getting to zero wasn't good enough right no so B are going to start on Monday through the recommendations yes we did um so we have res this from a lot just to have placeholders so we have so we don't have to fight for space um so we we do um have the space Reserve next Thursday evening as well um are you hoping to do joint I think joint this point Bas on tonight would be helpful um Thursday May 2nd yeah everybody mhm sure next Thursday yes and um and just in terms of all the other moving Parts in this process um we do I did we did the list of the prop one articles as well um we fe uh the cap committee meeting Monday afternoon um to um to review Frank and prioritize um those priorities that is all dependent on our ability to P I mean I mean they could um have high rankings um but how that how that reconciles with our ability to pay especially um how Bas how we're balancing operational budget that in my op the opal budget comes first needs to come first um so um we we'll be at least as we work to wrap up this process we'll be informed by that as well um we'll be talking with the about the warant articles for warant articles as well on Monday night so um and so that way we keep the process moving forward if there if there are War articles that we identifi by that point that we that may be great but we just simply don't have the ability to pay um we make recommendations of what ones of those we that are on the warrant and not on the warrant and um and then we'll keep everything moving forward that way any questions about the I mean like the next two weeks two and a half weeks we'll be busy but um you have the free cash now y so I free cash at um after everything at special I believe is 980,000 um and I just remember from the special how we wanted to put 250 to um I think we wanted to reduce the tax rate and a lot of residents stood up and ended up you know a lot of them were suggesting to put that money into a stabilization so I do have that noted that the 250 the residents were saying you know a lot of them were suggesting to put that to 250 so I know all the boards and committees are here for the residents so I just wanted to remind everybody that that was a strong point with the residents at the last town meeting um but we do already have some priority our bills that typically do come out of free cash um and then there are onetime things that are currently in the operating budget for example that the student out of District student so things and we do have a lot of people retiring that's another Point there's like $85,000 in the operating budget for upcoming retirees so things that are onetime expenses you know someone retires one time the student District payment is one time so those are things that I would be okay using free cash to supplement because we know that that's not going to be an expense next year even though I really don't like using free cash to balance um the solid waste discussion is not really going the way I wanted so we might be forced into other options and even though we do have a healthy amount right now I do um would like to leave available as well and it can just stay undesignated and if there's some catastrophe we do have still some available so I am hoping that we don't use up all of the 980 what do you mean by a little bit um I would like at least 200 left over in the end um after articles and whatever else the boards decide to use with the cash mhm um ideally more but you know at least 200 I would suggest what's our Reserve balance and the your finance committee it's about 32 yeah 30 as of today um I think Highway was the only one recently that has dipped into it 18ish or um so we have 35 you have oh he took 197 so you have 35,000 and your finance committee Reserves at this point um but as we do know there is at least one Department that's running negative so they'll be um you know in the our year end departmental transfers um that we can take from operating budgets that are um that have extra money at the end of the year right but you know in 25 if we're cutting budgets cutting budgets the end of the year transfer dollar amount is not necessarily going to be a lot you know in FY 25 so those departments are really going to have to stay within their budget because there's going to be nowhere else to transfer money from right so we're cutting budgets and they're going to have to stay within that budget y um but voting that the budget as we did last year as a bottom line is helpful that you know if you leave some money available in another line it'll cover one that's negative so that has made it a little bit easier for each department to balance as a whole and as a town above our free cash what else do we have um there's the stabilization fund Capital stabilization for capital projects um we do take like 6,000 out of tax title typically every year um and then we're taking money I'm sorry what the amount on those other two two stabilizations oh I have that it's like 1.9 1.9 and 1.5 yep that should be in the packets from last time maybe um and then we do take money from the ambulance revenues which we did hike up a lot this year in additional 75,000 um you know the ambulance is pretty busy people are paying insurance is are paying um right now we are able to take that money um and I mean the cable is self funded from the peg access so that's one that automatically is self funded um and then the sewer Enterprise is basically self-funding um and that's it with the cable you say it's self-funded so why is 48,000 requested in the budget so we request it in the budget as an expense and then that same amount is counted as a revenue so they wash within the lby limit okay I did have one more question uh elections we rent the School what's the fee I I don't know that we can follow up with the p CL oh I'm not sure yeah I guess I don't know why we have to rent the building we own it I know do we rent it cuz I it was listed as renting the building rental so I'm just curious as to what that fee is and why we're paying yeah I haven't seen a bill yet how much was it from the April vation it didn't list an amount it was just listed in one well I think we paid for custodians oh that was listed as a separate thing was it yeah the rental fee was listed in there and um on the stabilization and what's the other one capital capital stabilization that 3.4 million um what does that sit in right now a checking account yeah it's invested by the treasure it's invested by the treasury okay well I know that within you know the the Federal Reserve rate having gone up that some CD rates have gone up have we been able to get any like four or 5% we're limited to what Municipal funds can be deposited into so that'd be more of a treasury question on what he's getting for the interest rates yeah because I mean if you got four that's $140,000 to the treasures credit he's been um he's been he been very attentive and actually part of the revenues that we've been able to update have included our interest Reven as well um and he's been a great help in in doing that so with our limits what are we able to [Music] get right now the shorterm ones are so $120,000 $110,000 a month oh 120 okay I came up with like4 yeah he's he's been very diligent on that and that's been helping I take advantage all we can because we haven't seen RAC this in a long time yes and we probably won't again like the balance also like we don't we don't want to overextend that Revenue either when they do go back down budget right just be glad it's oh yeah feel like we've a very modest opportunity to increase the projection a little bit while not getting into a structural Revenue issue as well and uh just just to be clear to follow up on what what Sina had mentioned with the one time only the one time only operational cost so those uh that are funded by free cash those um in the Cent deficit those costs already funded and projected to be funded with free cash as a revenue to fund them so if they were changed to come out of the uh out the ly it would drive our deficit even more well so we' already accounted for that yeah yeah so those are the things in structuring out this budget to to continually work to try to balance those are the things that we've tried to be creative at looking at um just because those those areas are truly um truly one time the other thing we're doing this year um actually right at the beginning um with the free cash we have right now we know f524 has deficit typically we we carry that deficit until the recap and then at the special time meeting we decide like if we're going to fund that then before the recap or we're just actually going to carry it through the recap we need we need room under our Levy so like automatically now we know what that number is we want we have the ability to fund that with free cash we get we get out we get up from now and that um that does free up um an additional $85,000 actually 88,000 for 24 Serena do you know what the total was for those onetime payments we're finishing 2 7,216 it's the 10,216 for the student okay 88,000 for snow and then 85,000 for retirements okay what was snow again I'm sorry 88 thank you welcome which is lower than last year last year was yeah 123 I think the before that was 226 we haven't had a lot of we been getting killed by the cing events because no other questions May 2 6:00 right here do we anticipate how many more meetings we need in May I mean there's only one it would only be one more week that be AV [Music] Tech may not be able to be for that then that would we' still have a corner okay three of us make it five just as a just as a placeholder if I could we have we've already Reserve this one for uh both the second and the N okay just so we wanted to have a plan to bring this uh yeah I I will not be here will be motion I make a motion second all in favor I if um we don't have a forum and I from [Music]